This meeting is called to order in accordance with the open public meeting act. Notice of this meeting was provided to the home needs to view the star ledger the high park planet on January 8, 2025 and was posted on borrow website at www.hpbar.
hpbar.com and on the bulletin board of borrow 221 South Fifth Avenue on Highland Park, New Jersey and has remained continuously posted as required by law. Fire exit are to my right and left of council chambers. Can you pledge
to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. Welcome, >> Mayor Foster. >> Yes. >> Council member George >> here.
>> Council member Hail, >> yes. >> Council member Hirs >> here. >> Council President Kim Johan >> here. >> Council member Pone >> here. Council member Vargas >> here. Burough attorney Rena here. B administrator here. Bro. >> Okay. Tonight is a work session and
discussion items is going to be 332 Ritton Avenue, the former right aid. It's 4 420 to 424 redevelopment plan amendment. And I'm going to ask to take it away.
>> Thank you, mayor. Hi, everybody. It's a redevelopmentesque themed uh meeting tonight. So, sorry in advance if I do too much. Uh, but I the first item on the agenda is 332 Ren Avenue, the former RAID, although it
looks like a RAID still. Um, and what I wanted to try to discuss is because we know this is a really important site in town for us. Um, and that's a large vacancy to have in town. So, I want to kind of go over where we are and and a
recommendation that we have in terms of kind of things we can do to try to address the site. So, uh just to kind of baseline as much for anybody who's listening at home, we're dealing with a 15,000 square foot former Wraid. 15,000 square foot is a large space uh in this
day and age, especially in a downtown location like this. And this type of use, they're not really returning to spaces like this. Um, and so I've done a little research on what's been happening because Wright writes have been closing
since these chapter 11 bankruptcies started a couple years back. If you recall, we thought we were fortunate that we we didn't get closed down in that first wave. Um, and so they are kind of uh sitting out there um on the
market both in New Jersey and elsewhere. So, we want to be as proactive as we can about what we can do uh to try to kind of move things forward and not have a vacancy downtown any longer than is
necessary. Um so, I also took a kind of an assessment of our what tools we have just to be clear, you know, looking at putting the redevelopment hat on for a minute. Um just this is a little different than for example with the superfresh or what was this stop and
shop situation. We decided to use the redevelopment law. We studied the site to see if it deter was determined to be an area need redevelopment. It met the criteria. Chris Cassenza our planner did the study. It went to the planning board. We did declared it an area in
need and then we kind of laid out some options for the property with the goal of getting a grocery store back. And fortunately we were successful. Um we don't have the full redevelopment tool available on the Wraid site. There's a unique history here. Um it was in our
2005 redevelopment area and redevelopment plan. There is a downtown redevelopment plan that dates back to 2005. Um but at some point I I don't have the exact date. There were some negotiations between the burrow and the write aid and it was agreed upon and
settled that write aid would be removed from the redevelopment area and the redevelopment plan. So the full suite of redevelopment tools are not available to bring to bear like for example at the outmost you know financial
incentives like pilot agreements things like that not on the table at this time for this site and Chris not to put words in your mouth you know but you might want to suggest we did look at would it meet the criteria right now and I mean what was your assessment of that?
>> Yes. So to answer your question, yes. So back in 2005, it was declared an area need along with many other properties. It was in 2010. So only a few years later that through litigation settlement, it was removed. So we lost that ability. But in 2016, we did the area wide um area in need of
rehabilitation designation applies to all parcels in town including. So under that rehabilitation u uh route, we can still do a redevelopment plan. >> Right. But you're jumping ahead of me a little bit. I wanted to just
>> We don't know that the site as currently >> now that right aid's out of the picture. I'm assuming the settlement agreement, >> but in a perfect world, we would go back to studying a property and just quick look at it. We don't think we have to wait several years before that could be possible. They wait two years for
vacancy to use criteria B. Completely vacant land for 10 years to determine under criteria C. And then the issues of dilapitation, unh wholesome working conditions is unlikely for a recently renovated building. So I think we're
we're stuck not being able to use the redevelopment full suite of powers. >> Right. So just wanted to make that clear. It kind of differentiates it a little bit from what our past experience was with with the loss of the grocery
store. Um so just in terms of some of the research that I did looking at what what is happening to these write aids the types of uses that we're seeing uh and I got this out of like some articles from CoStar which is a big commercial
brokerage like Dollar Generals Dollar Trees Planet Fitness type businesses um and healthc care urgent care uses and actually in talking this over with Chris recently We were even discussing Matuchen had that exact same thing.
There was a CVS that closed in their downtown and it got converted to an urgent care. So those are and if you could probably think and and I should mention daycare uses is somewhat a trend. Um and there is an example of one actually in u I always want to call it
Hamilton. It's on Hamilton Street in Franklin. Uh is a right aid converted to a grocery store. Um, so grocery store into into a daycare, excuse me. Um, so what I the reason I even bring all that up is I wanted to look at, okay, what is
permitted now under the underlying zoning for the site, our central business district zoning, which is what this site is in currently. Thinking about some of those other types of uses, doesn't permit medical office use, does
not permit um, daycare use. um amongst others also doesn't permit some kinds of entertainment uses which might be something we'd like to see downtown and as it happens Chris and me and Rua have been kind of looking at the CBD zoning kind of on a parallel track when this
happened. Uh so we kind of knew what was in what wasn't what wasn't. So right now our underlying zoning doesn't really um allow for those types of uses that we are seeing more commonly kind of come to
term with uh with with write aid conversions. The one of the other challenges I wanted to make sure everybody was aware of is the cost to retrofit write aids is sizable uh because they're very unique layouts. If especially if you want to divide it up,
you have to put utilities on both side of the building. So, one of the challenges for the property owner is finding an end user that's valuable enough to warrant and and want to make those kind of upgrades to the building. So, just trying to give you a sense for
kind of the the issues that we're facing trying to think about what could happen here. And I should mention that the underlying central business district zoning does allow for a mixeduse building on this site as of right, but in my conversations with the property owner, which had been very frequent, um
they looked at that a while back, even before the closure, and um they told me they needed uh financial, you know, a pilot, some kind of thing to make the project pen out for them. true or not, we didn't vet vet that in any kind of
serious way, but that so right now the the sense I'm getting is that's not on the table in terms of a kind of a a total kind of tear down and start over from scratch on the site, at least as far as the property owner is concerned. Um, so I just wanted to kind of cover some
of those things. So, in looking at what the tools we do have, we still can, as Chris said, do a redevelopment plan for the site whereby we could think about some of these additional uses that we might want to allow in
order to encourage a reoccupancy of the building sooner than later. Um, and so the other advantage of a the the way I look at this site, this is kind of an abnormal situation for our downtown, a
15,000 square foot site. And I think it's worthy of kind of study and this plan and and consideration of plan, but it would also allow us to weave in if we go the the to a redevelopment plan approach the easement that we would like
to connect the back of our parking area on South Third to South 4th so that we could encourage that negotiation by creating additional valuable uses that the property owner would have access to.
So there's a lot of kind of pieces on the board, but I guess where I've come to, and I think in talking with Chris, it's fair to say where we've come to is we'd like to consider the potential of a redevelopment plan for the rated par
parcels, which I should tell you includes the building that fronts Ritan, but also all of the parking basically in the rear. Um, in fact, parts of the parking that you might even think are burrow parking lot are actually the right parking lot. So, um where we would
focus more on permitted uses and the creation of the easement. With that, I want to kind of talk to have Chris talk a little bit about some of what we're thinking in terms of the zoning um that we think might make sense
for the types of uses, but also some of the provisions that we wanted to build in to make sure it maintains the frontage on Ritton and things like that. So we this will be a redevelopment plan that would provide for as the base zoning a lot of the uses that we were talking used in the downtown tracks the
kind of modern updating uses for downtown but to use overlay zoning to allow for really expanding the uses going beyond that for uses that are more likely and practical for a building of
this type building 15,000 square foot white what it is that the terminology use it's hard to release that unless it's a high-end mixer again. Uh so that would be medical which would be an urgent care or surgical facility which is a need uh in town especially if you
have closures along the river due storm. So that's a a good need to have locally uh a daycare facility which is not permitted downtown technically there's several of them downtown pre-existing not but this is a perfect size. My son goes to a Kitty Academy. That's the size
of building that they use has good parking. Although they would need to create outdoor uh play area that's inside the side that's something that they deal with at the site. Other uses include uh retail which is already permitted. Uh in a perfect world you will find three uses to divide that
store into three different spaces. That's unlikely but it could still happen. We're not preventing that from happening. Um some and I think it's really come down to those additional uses that are not permitted in DBD uh CBD zone which is primarily daycare and
a range of medical uses uh along with um healthcare uh supportive uses gym types of uses and so on so forth. So the idea is that to use the overlay zoning but in order to use overlay zoning you have to enter in freedom and that's when you
kind of kind of grab the ability to use the easement access and we can also set design standard that we thought about what's to primarily make sure the building still has a front door undeness and that's we got the best that we could get from about 15 years ago. It's a
decent looking building for a ride aid in downtown. Um, but the idea since the parking's in the back. The fear that we have is they're going to turn their backs better than so the idea of putting design standards to require that front door access as well as visibility and to
not require but encourage the ability of taking the wings maybe the first few feet of it to put some smaller stores if there's appetite for it. not going to require it because they may that might kill the project, but encourage them to maybe put smaller stores in front of the
uh the larger format. That's really basically comes down to it's a it's really a zoning strategy. So, this would be a very inexpensive plan to put together. It's sort of like a reszoning strategy to open it up to uses that are practical for this building type. uh as well as for the ability for the burrow
to maintain a streetscape vibe along the Barrett uh Avenue streetscape as well as to get access from South Fourth to South Third just like we did at the Super Fresh site require continuous access from South Fifth and South which is great because you're not relying on
Meridan Avenue frontage or driveways. So getting that secondary access without using Maran Avenue has been an important part of our redevelopment planning. Only other thing I'd mention because I know it's come up as important and to all of us here and I'm sure those in
town, the art windows that are there, we'll also make sure those are protected and we make sure that that gets woven into any final plans for the site because I know those are important. Um, and the community bulletin board there as well. Um, so the thing I should have
mentioned earlier that as Chris was talking I realized I hadn't was I had mentioned I've been talking with the property owner and they've reiterated the uses that I said were kind of predominantly seeking out stores of this
size the Dollar General, Dollar Tree um, type options. and he has been approached by uh a couple of uh child care uses as well as medical specifically kind of a
surgery center type use. So there is some traction there at least from the broker and his perspective that they think there's there would actually facilitate um leasing up uh of the property. Um, so I just thought I should
mention that as well. So that's pretty much and I know some of this open, but yeah, I thought I thought maybe it would be an opportunity to ask questions and talk to a little bit. >> Question, Jason. And just to confirm, you say earlier that um the way it's
zoned right now in terms of the likely uses of a property of this size, the options, the more realistic options would be something like a gym, a daycare, entertainment possibly, um a medical use, or like a Dollar Tree or Dollar General.
>> Um but the >> unfortunately get to pick the >> type of that type of business. And you'd also said that um you know the zoning wouldn't allow for most of those, but as of right now like Dollar Tree, >> the zoning allows for dollars. That's
what I was trying to confirm like that all retail to use retail. >> If a Walgreens wanted to come in and fill that spot, they could do it as of right. >> Just in terms of the more realistic ones that are likely to open up like so that's the one that they could do that as of right. So if we were to fail the
act tonight, that's there's nothing that we could do to stop them from like just moving forward with that. they'd have no other option. So, >> well, that would be or they could just let it sit there and do nothing. That's, you know, that's another fear I do have. >> But the tools,
>> I'm certainly in favor of opening it up to these other options. >> No, >> I agree with Jason. I am too. I mean, I think this this seems like a situation that is could be right for a redevelopment plan. Um particularly because you have an existing op you have
existing property owner who holds the liquor license. >> I don't that is more of a clerk question. They do not the property owner. I can tell you that I know that um I believe that that's in proc right aid owned it and may still own it and
it's in the process of being potentially bought and transferred but I don't believe the property owner is in the mix. Um the idea I'm not crazy about pilots in general abstractly, but since there's no alternative um and and I think we've all looked, uh this does seem like a really good opportunity for
an existing property holder. Uh oh, I have one more thing. Oh, what happened? I'm sorry. >> No, no, no. Go ahead. I have the gap, but I'm holding on to it just in case. >> No, no, no. I I No. I think this is a really great opportunity for an existing property owner in town to re to to reinvest in in in a in a in a prized
corner property. Um, you know, something that's really meaningful to to downtown in the future. I mean, this this corner is an anchor and I think, you know, I think if we have an opportunity to make something really wonderful out of it, um, and that benefits the square, then that's really good. And I just have one
more question. um what is the um what are some of the per what are some of the uses that we would like to see there that are not allowed? So the main ones I would suggest if based on my research if we're comfortable with medical like urgent care or any other kind of medical
office daycare type uses um and then things we've been talking about in the CBD discussion where kind of for example the idea of a yes cadeesque business is not currently permitted. So when I say entertainment use that's kind of what I
was referring to. There's probably a more precise way to refer to those uses. Chris, was that >> I use indoor recreation? >> Indoor recreation facilities. I believe gyms are permitted. >> I'll double check, but we'll make sure it's in there. >> Yeah. Yeah. So, so there but it was it
was those primarily like for a use this size like our CBD zoning is targeted at smaller because most of our downtown is smaller storefronts. So, a lot of those uses that are permitted probably wouldn't naturally lend themselves to
the 15,000 square foot footprint. Um, restaurants are currently permitted throughout the zone, so that wouldn't be, but that hasn't emerged as a big opportunity. I think in part because of the conversion costs to to doing so and the upsides or downsides and the lack of
a liquor license, right? >> Gyms are noted. >> Oh, they're not. but we've been putting them in into our downtown plans as a a modern update use. >> Thanks. >> So that would be some that would be an example of something that we would suggest including in in the plan terms of permitting that's consistent with the
other downtown plans we've done. We have them downtown very successfully and it is one of the types of uses that I will tell you that they did not mention that as a potential use having been they haven't been approached but for all I know they did. Yeah,
>> we're being proactive. >> But I think I think we should more is better. Options are better than more options is better than >> in my opinion. >> I think there's interest, you know, and I think I think there probably solicited interest at various points for you might be right.
>> Yeah. >> And and and this site is unusual for our town, as you know, because it does have probably more parking than it needs uh for almost any conceivable use if it's in that building. So, it makes it attractive in that way. Uh, I hate to
say that the parking is attractive, but it does for the end users. It is an attractive feature. >> It snows and you live there. Yeah. >> No. >> Um, uh, just a couple clarifications. The designation that we're thinking about doing this, we're not
contemplating a pilot necessarily for this. Correct. >> No, we cannot use >> That's what I thought. I thought that we were prevented from using a pilot. So, just to clarify that. And then the other thing is um I know you guys have been talking about um uh uh expanding it
throughout this CBD um in terms of of expanding the the potential uses. Would this be just for this area or would the expanded uses be in other areas? Is it just going to be in this particular
>> So, this we don't plan. It's only for a right aid site which is good because we don't want to expand medical office ground floor everywhere >> right >> but on that token we are talking about that type of situation generally to the CBD expanding uses generally all over CBD to a certain extent C zone which is
more upper RA >> we talking about medical office too like is there an issue with them on the ground floor no but not on the main drag right those type so we're having those conversations >> I only mentioned it because it was actually fortunate we had already started kind
analyzing the permitted uses and and so when this issue came up about, you know, trying to find an end user that would fit a 15,000 foot platform that, you know, we already kind of knew where we had some gaps. Um, and so, sorry if I confuse things by
mentioning that analysis. We'll be coming back to you and the public with a more fleshed out proposal for the CBD zoning soon. I'll just wrap up and say I favor this. I think it's a really good option for us to do. I think it helps us
work with this landlord and then shows others that we're ready to work with you and try and find the best solution. So, I'm in favor of it as well. >> Phil, >> just um couple of brief observations.
Um, one the plan clear would clearly include a as a benefit to the burrow that we uh uh get the easement that would connect our lot with the other one. In connection with that, is it possible especially if the new users
because the the scene is the the site is basically overparked. Um, and anybody who's been going there for many many many years uh knows some of the issues with the back parts of the parking lot where people uh roll their you know 1975
Lincoln Continental Apartments uh long term. Uh there's a lot of other uses and if you look at I drove through it a couple of times in the last couple of weeks. Um and there's probably good 15 or 20 cars that are parked there on a regular basis. Could we
use perhaps our easement in connection with that side of the parking lot which would be adjacent to the municipal lot where we do own the additional properties now as well. uh to broaden up public parking or perhaps include a
public parking uh piece to that and as well as get the easement so that we can move forward with the south third. I will talk with Joe about how that could potentially work, but I would say in my
conversations that was not something that would be very well like I have been thinking about if you're talking about that one section kind of that backs into our properties >> potentially at least on Fridays having
use of it so that it can support vendor parking for example for the farmers market and talking about that they're very cautious ious about protecting future users of the property or their own redevelopment potential. And so to
totally give over to public I think might be a deal breakaker, but we can certainly have that conversation. Um, and I think there's a certain amount of reality like it's going to happen anyway. Like I mean to your point, one thing we did start looking at with arterial were if we're going to connect
through when we connect through how would we potentially lay out and we actually would add additional spots by reconfiguring the parking in that not our property area if we can come to an agreement on that. So they would actually end up with more spots
potentially with with the improvements that we're proposing on these. In relation to that, I would have I would really need to see what a plan for through traffic would be there >> because especially depending on the uses you put there, >> right?
>> Like a daycare with an express lane from third to fourth doesn't seem to be extremely practical. >> Well, but let me just say we're with you on that and we're trying to design it in a way that discourages the cut through
feeling. It's it's got a jog. It's got a jog so that it's not just a straight shot to >> like it is now like it would >> so that it's so that's one of the ways. But those are all the things like you're right and why Chris mentioned when we look at the >> what whatever use comes up if they're
going to be making changes especially to the exterior and if it was a daycare they probably would have to because they're going to have to provide recreational space then that goes to site plan. We're going to it's going to have to be a much more detailed proposal and we'll all have to be convinced that it's safety to your point.
>> Well, I I think that there are a lot of different ways to negotiate something that allows us to use the parking uh on in that particular section there. Um unless and until redevelopment comes along where you vacate don't necessarily
have to take it in perpetuity. It's very easy to do. >> Fair point. Um, so I I I would like to see that included in the planning. >> Um, because certainly reference it in the plan recommend you encourage it. >> Yes. >> And reduce parking requirements so that
if there is a shared parking, it doesn't trigger the need for the user to go back to board to benefit the burrow. >> Just more flexibility, be proactive. >> Yeah. Because gi given the the floor space on the on the prior usage that there was always overpart. So, um, I
think there's room to to do that. >> Totally agree. If we're talking about the existing building, yeah, I I think that's fair point. >> Okay, that was my concern. I do I do support it. Um, I I I think we um we have enough of vacancies and we don't
need this one uh this big. And the opportunity to actually bring something in that's of service to residents um not just in a retail setting, uh I think is a real benefit. Uh
>> I just have a quick just quick followup. Um so no pilots. So we're not discussing pilots. >> We can't because we don't have a redevelopment area. >> So what so to like for our economic development team? What other incentives I guess what other development developer incentives? Uh are there >> the zoning
>> the zoning and then so could are we able to are we thinking along the lines of potentially pairing them up with a developer >> so they could because it sounds like that the it sounds like that you know the burden would be on I mean if the zoning is just the thing
how does that how does that incentivize them financially I guess >> by by the the types of the daycare uses the the uh medical uses are higher rent paying uses in general, like they just pay their rent. So, that's part of the
incentive to get them to participate and enter into our easement agreement. What I was trying to say before, which maybe got muddied by the way I delivered it, was they've explored the redevelopment potential for the site previously, and
they by their back of the envelope with the taxes, they were saying they would need a pilot in order to do a mixeduse type of redevelopment with or without a development partner. Um, and so, so without the redevelopment area designation, that makes that's not even
on the table. So, how does that work then though? If they're going to enter, if if they decide to redevelop the site based on this these potential parameters, um wouldn't they have to have an operator in mind uh uh in order to be incentivized in order in order
just to break ground on redevelopment in the first place? How does that work? >> I guess in this case, it's I would think of it as like what happened with Superfresh. It ended up being we did a redevelopment plan. We did have the financial tools to incentivize the operator, but it was a rehab of the
existing building. This one >> they would need the in order to enter into a let's just assume it's going to be a rehab of the existing building for this part of my answer to your question. Then they would to take advantage of the additional zoning overlay of these
additional uses, we'd have to enter into it. They'd have to have an operator. They wouldn't bother to get into an redevelopment agreement with us unless they had an operator, right? And then we would execute that redevelopment uh agreement >> with the easement
>> with the easement part attached to it. And then they can move forward with their negotiations with their, you know, lease lease agreement if they're going to make improvements to the inside of the building. And this is actually something that Chris was contemplating
with Joe. Do they have to go to the plane board if it's just a renovation of the building on the inside >> or not? And we're we haven't answered that question right now. We're thinking no. But if it was a daycare where they're going to be putting a playground or doing something that would trigger
some additional review by the planning board, but that's those are things we're trying to sort through with Joe to figure out. But basically, it's a zoning strategy using the redevelopment rehab area tool. >> Sure. The other part of it is that to be
able to have the high value use that they're looking for that we're providing through the redundant plan as basically a zoning strategy right now. If they were to do it, they would need a use fair and site plan. I mean that alone is soft cost 50 to $100,000 just money to go
>> and you're just hoping that the zoning board sees it your way. I mean >> in this case we're being proactive. We'll all allow it and if you need to change your parking lot then go for a typical site plan. But if you don't, it's just change of occupancy to just get your building permits. But we still got to use that.
>> It's adding flexibility, putting more money into building improvements. >> That makes a lot of sense. I'm somehow I can't say I'm surprised that Highland Park's static zoning was would have commanded lower income users. That's that's not
surprising. Um, however, uh, um, uh, so how would that work then though if they if we change the zone? What I'm getting at is that if we have our fingerprints on this, you know, we're going to want to make it better than what we started with, right? So, and that and to me that
means a better use, you know, than a dollar store or or or or Sergy. So, that's the incentive for me is is that does this will this get a better operator in there for a long-term lease, something like a day, the things that we think will bring more life to the
downtown rather than just an office. >> And that's and that's kind of where I'm at. >> Well, I guess, you know, the discussion we're having is I guess the types of uses the ones that seem to be a higher value are a lot of some are medical. Um,
and I don't think we can be so parse the zoning. So specifically to say this kind of medical office, not just like I can't pay this dollar tree versus this dollar. >> But then why what's the incentive for us to to do this even further? Then now if
they can get their own operator in there, >> they can't because they don't have the zone. >> But if they can get a but they can get but they can so >> medical is not allowed under the >> Okay. The only thing that's currently allowed is stuff like retail like say
the Dollar Tree or something like that. >> All the other the dayare medical facilities and planet fitness or fitness center is not allowed currently. >> So >> So these are the exceptions that would be made. >> These are the kinds of things that we're we've been looking at that if we think
that they make sense for our downtown. It sounds like you're not in love with the medical system. I get that. but that these are things that we could bring to the table to incentivize a the the refilling and the rehab of the building for that use securing those windows more
in perpetuity because I think that's actually linked to the writing not necessarily to the structure. So these are things that we can build into this plan so that if they want the benefit of those uses then
we make sure these things get negotiated in. Um, and so it kind of lays this is a much more refined tool than trying to figure out a zone, especially because we don't we really think these additional uses are kind of that we're proposing with the exception of maybe indoor
recreational usage, which I think could be probably throughout the downtown potentially. But I would specifically say the medical and the daycare uses, I wouldn't suggest we just permit them all over the place. A, there's not a really good spot, and B, that's not something
we want to see over and over again downtown. Um, and it also the the plan allows us to make sure we reaffirm the importance of that front entrance and some other things that just really drive home that this is regardless of whatever
is in that building, the front is the front and it feels like the front. Um, >> so you can't rule out a movie theater then, right? >> No, it would be a permitted use. I would throw that indoor entertainment right there. Um, so for sure, but again, they
don't tend to make money for operators. >> Just saying great uses for >> Yeah, I I totally hear you. But yes, so really the zoning is the tool we have to hopefully leverage a a new use of the building more quickly
and to get our easement addressed in a more expedited way. We have explored other options for the easement and we are going to be considering those as well. But this to us was the most collaborative and probably win-win approach to the easement as well as to
um you know while you know do I think that building's perfect? No. Would I love to see redevelopment there one day? This doesn't preclude that redevelopment in 15 years but it would be nice to have a stable tenant on the anchoring that corner for us. And and just to share
with you a few maybe about a year ago when we were talking to the property owner, they were talking about that they're interested in doing some redevelopment, but it's not now. >> Yeah. >> It's in the future. >> Gotcha. Um my only and last last thought is the the liquor license. I don't know if there's a there there, but I'm not
sure if that's something that can whatever wherever that lands. I mean, somebody's going going to appreciate, you know, having that. And I don't know how I don't know who's going to acquire it or if right aid is going to sell it or how what what happens there. >> I haven't what I've gathered the liquor license is is it's a package license.
It's not a poor license. >> Right. Okay. >> It doesn't help a restaurant. It's it's another it's a liquor store, right? >> Um so um >> unless you know one another liquor store, >> right, which you know we had one, we could have another one. You know, the right a
presumably successful one in the back there. So yes, and I have been trying to track but it's hard. It's all done in ABC land which is uh not not easy to get your hands on but I have been in touch with the property owner who has not expressed that they been in the mix on
that mainly because I think the end users been looking at don't need one. >> Thank you. Nothing had a question. >> Yeah. What um since we're exploring urgent care, what will be well I guess I would say what are the permitted hours
that's allowed there now for urgent care? Would that be normal operating hours or I'm not as familiar with how specific we are with >> pre- pandemic? What was the hours of this the writing? >> 24. >> Well, they were they've been 24
sometimes. Most urgent cares, I'll just say, tend to be till 8ish, you know, to 8 or something. 7 to 8, 7 a.m. to 8 p.m., which I would imagine. Do we typically, Chris, put I know some uses we do have kind of hours of operation. I
just don't know. Downtown >> um plenary beverage sales >> but that's a lot largely, you know, we've had that conversation. Let's not do that one now. >> Right. That's why it's in your ordinance only. that I don't think we have been restricting hours.
>> No, it's it's just we I think personally the reason I like an urgent care over a medical center is I think they would have later hours and add a little more dynamism to the downtown people coming and going, you know, at later at night versus a typical medical office which might close around 6. That's a good
point. You know, um and similarly why I would prefer an urgent care over a daycare because again we know they don't stay open super late either. um and they tend to be by necessity a little more walled off because they're protecting children and they have to have a lot more security and things like that. So
there are things we have to manage. But I think the reason I'm pretty comfortable with the right aid building being repurposing these the right aid building reads like it's closed off to me anyway. Like even though it has a front door, it's not a particularly welcoming inviting building. You know,
it is what it is. And I do agree it is a better writing than many I've been in. But um you know, so I don't think we're losing anything. You know, could it be way better? 100%. But I think you know those uses can work in that frame. Um and I think the hours of operation for a
downtown perspective more is always better. Having lights on activity things like that is a is a plus just for everybody who is open at night downtown. >> Agree with that. Safety too. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Let's go back to Stephanie. Yeah,
>> I mean they I guess they can have their I guess security lights or so that they would leave on in case there's an intruder or whatever. Police have to look in. So I would prefer to see a daycare there than a medical use. Um we
have almost every field of health care in town right now from pediatrician to eye doctor to dentist to chiropractor. Um, and and then the way like we just heard, you know, our I guess on the federal level with all the vaccine
mandates, where we're going with that. I just think, yeah, where we're not going. And then with us, the burrow purchasing Yellow Brick Road, um, you know, if any business operator that's here, if they, you know, study the town and just call
around a few daycarees, they would know there's three to six month waiting list. So, um I think that a daycare is uh the lifespan of a daycare here in town is I
see it going much further than a urgent care. And that's why I asked about the hours because doctor's office normally will have a few um late hours um throughout the week where they will stay to almost 7:00 at night where we have a
urgent care that's only open to additional hour. That's you know most people come in urgent cares need some kind of medical form filled out or so. Oh you broke a leg. Um >> well I'm going to rob a wood for that. >> Very extreme.
>> Um and Uh I I I guess can I just cut you off for one second? I'm sorry. But like we're trying to present kind of a suite of options just like we do with zoning in general. You know, we all have things
that we would prefer >> over others. Um you know, so I guess are you saying you're not supportive of >> advocating for daycare? Yeah, that that's good to >> but we're saying that we're looking at all options. We're saying we're looking
at all options, not just a pinhole pigeon hole oursel into one. So it could be medical, it could be fitness, it could be retail use, and it could be daycare. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I know. But I'm I'm versus that we we no longer have yellow brick road over here. So we never had an
urgent care. So what I'm saying all of those parents and families were displaced also with the families we're trying to attract here. We're not trying to attract empty nesters. We're we're trying to attract attract people that
are trying to expand their family and we want them to stay here or they're inherited a home. The this is the service that we're trying here. I get urgent care as well too in the in the square mile radius. how many I mean Robert Wood Johnson we can walk to at
this point but um I mean urgent care is on the list but it's not in my top top 10 at 10. >> So if I hear you correctly you're saying that you would your priority at this moment would be from a list of one to four that we have
>> a daycare would be your priority and then but you're not excluding all the other options. I'm not excluding it because I don't want it empty haunted house themed spirit spirit Halloween one of those I want that to come >> for a temporary spirit just
>> temporary spirit would have been nice but >> just want everyone to >> yeah yeah yeah but yeah so I just wanted to say that >> got understand >> so your answer is yes to the four options that we have on the table >> yes >> but your highest priority is take care
>> yes >> just want to make Um, uh, I was just going to say that I think that the best thing is the biggest suite of options. >> And I would just make an argument that that, and it's not an argument because we daycare is great, but I also think
there's a real value of having an urgent care um, over a surgeon center, but urgent care, and I know we can't pick and choose, and I know we're we're going with the broadest option as possible. I do think an urgent care, especially one that even if it is over late, that's where, you know, your kid wakes up with 103 fever, you take them to the urgent
care and and I think that there's a there's a interaction that could be really valuable to to folks with an urgent care. I just wanted to throw that up. >> Okay. >> Hi. Yeah, I mean I I understand what um
council president um saying um regarding the priorities of the neighborhood. That's a very good point. Um that if we are going to be doing redevelopment, families are going to be moving. There are going to be a lot of kids. But I also understand that it's not really necessarily our choice as to what
business is actually going to open up. We're just expanding the options the owner of the property has. >> Um but I was thinking in terms of the urgent care center. Um which again I don't have a particular preference. Um, but I would like to just have a business
and something going in there that's going to benefit as many people in town as possible, whatever that may be. But if we do have an urgent care center, we do have twoies in town that will actually benefit um from having an urgent care center. You know, somebody's going into the doctor, they're coming
out with that prescription. There's literally a pharmacy that's going to be opening up across the street. >> Um so something like that can possibly piggyback, you know, >> you get multiple uses. you get multiple uses because people are going to come out and they're going to need something, right? They're going to need something
from the pharmacy and they may have a pharmacy of choice, but it's across the street, it's down the block, maybe on the way home, pick it up at Unite, pick it up pharmacy. >> Um, that's that's what I was thinking about that that maybe it might expand
uh the academy. Yeah, exactly. Expand opportunities. So with that in mind, what's your >> I am in support of of uh all four options. >> Yeah. >> Taking notes. Okay. >> Is there any
>> if if I may just a simple question only because everyone's kind of dance around it in different fashions. So like with the medical for example, we've talked about wanting an urgent care maybe not so much like a surgical center. So as we talk about like all four options on the table expanding to medical, you know, within those you can have some
restrictions. So, it's something and I'm not making any suggestions now. It's just something to kind of consider before you actually move forward. So, if your thought was I like medical in the sense of I like a doctor's office, I like an urgent care. I do not want a surgical center because I think that that's too specific. That's something that we may want to look at to see if
it's something that we can maybe expand it a little bit but not so much if that's this the direction council wants to go. But in doing so, the first thing that you're trying to resolve is trying to cast as wide a net as possible to get as many applicants. So just and I'm just and that's the only reason I'm just throwing it out there is that you do
have an ability to kind of get a little bit more micro on this but the more micro you get the >> the less ability you're going to have to have the owner fill the building >> is I guess my point you will have to control in some way through the red agreement because in order to get those expanded uses if it's under the umbrella
medical office you have to the redeveloper or landlord or property owner has to enter a redevelop agreement with the burrow so you have that last moment of going we like that medical office But I discussed internally don't want surgical. You still have that last line of defense in a way um before they
enter an agreement. Yeah. >> Otherwise the plan should be more broad. >> I have a quick question. I will why I'll get to you in a minute too. Why is there um not why is there not an opening for
surgical centers? I'm just asking my colleagues. Oh yeah, >> I I I think a surgical center is a is a fine use. If we're talking about preferences and little preferences, I think that the urgent care
would probably have a broader reach within the community because everybody gets cuts and scrapes. Not everybody goes to surgery. And then in terms of hours, it seems to me that urgent care, all the ones I go to are open till 9 or 10. So there's a little bit more churn. So that's my my preference. It's not that I'm against a surgical center. It's
not that I think it's better. >> I just wanted us to throw it out and hear what you were thinking. >> May I mention one thing about surgery because there was a surgery center that was interested in the spot. So I asked for a little more flavor. One of the things that attracted me to that that you may like to know is that they have
probably about 70 employees, not all at the same time on the same day. >> Right. and they're a highle staff going. >> No, no, no. But like, but that wasn't clear. I didn't >> She said that. She said that. >> Yeah, I probably wasn't. I'm not saying
I'm not saying you didn't say it. >> No, no, no, no, no. I did not say it tonight. So that to be fair, so there's, as you can see, you can go back, you know, there's there's pros and cons. And I guess I get my personal bias is very much like sometime and then some of it
is going to be what brings the best market, you know, to bear, you know, like some of it we don't you you don't want to control too much because you don't you don't know what you're going to be giving up as a result like to Erin's point narrowing the field too far. Oh well, we want something that's
open this late. Wow. I never thought about the fact that at peak midday they're gonna have 40 employees in that building or, you know, 30 or whatever it is uh eating in town going on their lunch breaks. >> And that's
not so there's there's there's there's just >> you're in the queue. >> Yeah. I'm sorry. >> Okay. Stephanie, >> you're on hold for five minutes. Um >> what forgot my thought. >> Yes. Okay. So, I like what Erin said
obviously, but um I think also if we're just trying like you said casting a wide net, we're opening the floodgates as well too and at that point, but I didn't know that we still have a final say to kind of what really I mean to some.
>> Okay. So, >> but I don't want to have I don't think we >> right if we said no at that point. I don't think I could go like, "No, I don't like that store. I like this store." But when you say medical, medical has so many subcategories. >> Well, I guess it'd be helpful to know
which ones concern you, >> right? Yeah. I think if there's stuff that we don't want, we should probably say it, right? You know, I think we don't personally think that that would be helpful to know. Like I don't I can't think of >> one off the top of my head that I'm like
>> cosmetic surgery center >> like go for it. Like I don't see a distinction between that versus something else. So if there was like a noxious kind of medical use that we were concerned about. I don't know. I can't think of it. But I think >> to me that's where you know you could
get into dangerous territory trying to overly parse things out. You know you can control for concerns that you might have about to me it's more like how the building functions and feels and fits in. Those are the zoning parameters I'm more interested in. and the uses as long
as they fit within the general envelope we set, >> you know, that's fair. You know, that was going to be our approach. But if there was a use that comes to mind that I didn't think about that I I would I would love to know. I didn't occur to us. I'll be honest.
You're going in there. You're getting some sort of a medical attention or procedure. You know, those are the general kind of what we were thinking. >> Yeah. don't want medical offices like traditional pediatrician's office or whatever then we could just clarify specialized medical office care such as
then we can list urgent care surgical facilities stuff like that but if you have a preference of certain types of use we need to know now otherwise I recommend keeping it broad >> no no matt >> you're done Jason >> okay just to your question
>> no you went you jumped And just to your question earlier, I just wanted to say out on the record that I am perfectly comfortable and fine with the surgical center. I may have different preferences of let you go there. I'm sure my preferences are great and really cool, but I just I'm in favor
of keeping it broad. >> I am also >> I am too. And less of a question, more of a comment. my um uh like write aids, you know, all over the state. We're going to have like, you know, dozens of of of of new stores that look like
Wraids still because that's what the buildings look like. I know it's ridiculous. Um and so I I think I think we would probably all be interested in like whatever happens there if it can look like something that belongs in the downtown for the long term, you know, no matter what. I mean even I mean even if
it obviously it has to have a certain functional design depending on what it is but if it doesn't if it's doesn't have to be if it can just fit into the streetscape you know because it's a redevelopment plan if it can kind of look >> so because eventually there's going to be something else in there and
>> agree and we were talking about you know not that we we have we don't have too much to incentivize it but let's say the doctor's office didn't need the full 15,000 well wouldn't it be nice if but it was permitted they could maybe carve one piece out and do a smaller retail footprint, you know,
those would be all permitted in this plan, you know, and frankly called out as desirable. Um because again, more activation on that front, I think, would be to your point, I think the reason it doesn't fit is it doesn't quite breathe like the rest of the the frontage
downtown. Uh but you know there's going to be a limit to what we can make them do with the tools we've got to bring to bear on the situation. Um but we can certainly you know especially as they design they're going to have to put this new
sign they're going to have to do some modification to the front you know as what you know unless >> encourage them to carve out small spaces. We did that in the touch room where store is literally 8 ft deep >> and it's like a maker space. They call it spark for the >> special improvement.
>> So we created that because the office space behind it couldn't be on main street. >> So I was thinking bringing that here. So we're allowed to do it. It doesn't need to be that big >> to tell the landlord. >> Think about it. Like if they don't need the full frontage, maybe you want to
think of a like this. Um, so we're gonna try to be creative about it, but recognizing that the odds are the end user is going to utilize most of the the space and convert and and
>> any additional questions on this. >> So f uh final so the categories is healthcare, daycare that we're making an exception for. Those are the two that were indoor medical use, medical use, fitness centers, >> um entertainment, indoor entertainment, right?
>> And and uh gyms, >> fitness centers. >> Yeah. So, yeah, they they all three I mean even daycare like is that also adult daycare? Is that also >> like what is like that's why when we're
opening this up and something comes there that we don't >> I was considering child care but >> I was thinking child care myself because we pretty much have adult >> when you don't but when you don't put it in written down on it's it's up left to
the mind to wonder and oh I thought that that was permitted. Oh, I think we've been talking about child daycare, but do you just so we're clear, do you not want adult daycare? >> No, I I'm just saying that we're we're just putting open. It's it's so open
that it's it's any anything we have to define these three categories. Even before you said indoor like indoor entertainment, I guess. Okay, that's different. But these three categories like defining them a little just a
little parameters around it. I don't know if Aaron I know you had suggested that. >> I saw Phil had his hand up too. I don't know if you have a genius. >> I I don't think we want to from from what I'm I would suggest that we don't lock oursel into any particular thing
because when we were talking about daycare, we're talking about Yellow Brick Road being closing. I think we're talking about child daycare and the medical use could be expanded out to see what the person who's coming in. The permitted use currently is retail. So like a Donald tree or any one of those
could be in there. And um we're looking at a fitness center looking at fitness centers as a possible that we would include into this. >> Okay. So that is actually child daycare. >> Child daycare because I I strongly believe we have an adult daycare right in back of us. >> Yeah.
>> Yeah. But we we have to >> and people come from all over and use it >> and that's big enough. >> Yeah. But we have to remember the landlord is just going he's going to essentially he's going to go with the highest bidder. So that's >> generally speaking the medical are the higher
>> users of value uh end users. I daycarees depends on which one. >> Yes. >> It depends on you know the the >> the clientele that they're going to get >> of that. So I don't think a yellow brick road price point is gonna go there. >> No.
>> Just because like I afforded yellow brick road so I know what that was and that is much more val of a value the lower price point than some of these uh other kinds of centers. So some of that is going to be dictated by >> the cost of renovation and the and the
lease terms. you know, this gonna be a limit. So, >> but okay. I mean, I do I could be, but I know in I guess in my world when I close loans, if it's not if it's not in there,
then it's it just isn't happening. You just leave it. So, so open. Zoning is a zone art form. It really is. It is what And you ne you can be as specific as you want, Stephanie. And the flip side of that is you were so specific.
>> You've excluded something you want. >> We will be here again to say, "Hey, >> then we have to amend it." Goes to the planning board. It's like three >> and time is always and that's our loss. >> There you go. >> So I imagine though like any anything
it's anything that they any interest that they have is going to be vetted by the EA. >> They're going to come to they're going to want to know it fits like we haven't. What do you think about this? >> Yeah, and that has been the case. >> Yeah, there has been. Yeah, that's
>> so that gives me a little more. >> The question was asked about the liquor license. Although I know it's a poor license. It's would go to a liquor. >> It's not a poor license. >> It's It's not a poor license. It would It's a package license. >> And the question was asked, are we interested in a package license? I was
like, I don't think so because we have enough liquor store in town. >> Huh? >> The question, >> it's out there. >> It is a package license. package life. It is on the market. >> Yes, >> it's on the market for sale. >> The question is is are we >> the borrow
>> can the borrow the borrow? >> Why would we want to pay a lot of money to >> Yeah. >> I don't really want to go down the road of why I want to know the use of it >> technically. Yeah. Um I I think more you also by the way have some ability to
approve transfers of those licenses too. Um, so but it does get a little wonky because of the bureau that they want to they can go to ABC it or whatever. So it becomes very difficult if it's you want to purchase. The problem is that you're not going by the rate that you sold the license to them. You'd be going by the
market rate to take it back and then secondarily then it becomes an asset that you've spent money on. I mean, you would be effectively be taking it in to either reissue it to someone else at a complete loss >> or you'd be taking it in to just not allow it back out into the market.
>> So, and some of you can do it, but I just there's there's pros and cons to doing >> and and remember, Governor Murphy two years ago was looking at this universal um liquor licenses for smaller business and stuff like that. So it might be a loss to
>> there was an expansion on some liquor licenses and then but then there were restrictions put on pocket licenses. So they expanded but now if >> if the municipality has issued more licenses than what it's technically supposed to have issued and one of them is a pocket license. When that pocket license expires it just disappears
forever. So that's the the other caveat to that is that if it expires and it goes away and it's beyond that it does it's like it wasn't there anymore. It's just gone. Is that a is that is that an asset to the burrow or >> no? So if if let's say the burrow has
allocated 15 licenses but you have 20 out there right now. >> It's called you have six. >> Yeah. So I'm just right. So >> so the public is aware. >> You take those the licenses that are over your allocated limit. If those become pocket licenses, they'll expire after certain amount of point. So if if
you're over the limit when they expire, they just take you back down to your maximum. But you can't ever go back above your max. If you're below your maximum and the pocket license expires, it then transfers back to the municipality and now that it becomes yours to then reissue to another person. >> So that we're trying to amend the ABC
laws, but as you can imagine, there are a lot of liquor licenses that people spend >> Yes. >> multi-millions of dollars to procure >> and that's why they were so >> Yeah. So it's hard to unwind. >> Any additional questions?
>> We're all good. Okay. Now it's time for public comments. >> Oh no, we have >> Oh, this is a quick one. I >> Oh, I'm sorry. Oh, it's all in. Okay. 420 to 424 redevelopment plan amendment. Just real quick, I'll turn it to Chris in a minute, but just to remind
everybody because Chris reminded me, we you authorized an amendment to 420 424 redevelopment plan, which was the what is now the super fresh plan as I would call it uh a number of years ago to basically take the zoning that we
developed, >> the kind of the the alternatives for Ritton Avenue and bring that across the frontage because when we did the area need study We actually did study the entire basically block from the super fresh forward.
>> Um, so we just want to pick that and it was mainly because Chris was here >> anyway. I wanted him just to kind of remind you guys what that project is and what he's been working on. So with that, >> it's really a matter of efficiency since I'm working on this red plan for writing. Well, looks like it's
permission to do so that prior read plan for the now super fresh site. extend the zoning using efficiency the workload I'm doing to prepare the zoning standards for that for that project zone but in terms of the ash read on plan so yes as Terry mentioned we did the area need
study non-combination I believe uh for the four buildings on the 400 block of avenue which includes wells what was Wells Fargo the parktown center with all the businesses there six of them the stop and shop site and the corner
landmark building but But we only did the red on plan because we were in a rush to try to get the story. >> Then we thought about well we should think about expanding the zoning which was basically allow for fourtory maybe a fifth story step back um that sort of strategy with infield building along the
street and sort of extend that to the rest of the block. But at that time Wells Fargo was I think going through a a new tenant. So we didn't really lose the opportunity but the idea of finishing that plan is less unfortunate. It went back burner just because the property was >> track C happened. Track A
and since we're touching right A he's like well you know I saw the other plan might as well finish it. >> We literally he's I looked at the how much we spent. He's he's literally halfway through doing it. So I figure might as well bring it back to everybody's attention. We do think it's good because we don't want to wait till
the next change in teny and then we're scrambling to establish the zoning parameters for that. Um and you know but basically it's a similar approach to how kind of >> more expansive lane uses with more generous bulk standards but within reason
>> but we will not be including these additional use the at least the medical and the day aare uses >> that discussion only for writing because that's suitable for writing >> for that for that site that big. >> So two birds at one stone. >> So you'll get a chance to look at that plan when he's done drafting it. But I just wanted to remind everybody we were
working on it. That's awesome. Um, no, that that that's awesome. Totally support. Um, but since we're talking about it, I don't know if there's a chance to revisit um the um the owners to see if there is something we can do along the frontage of the
>> I have been talking with them. >> Y ongoing conversation. It's a little bit of a haggle between the property owner and the super fresh and but I know they reached out I had talked to them and they had reached out to the property owner >> because the property owner called me. So I was like, "Oh, good. They actually
followed up." So it may take a little time and it may come in phases, but we are still working. >> Just for those keeping score at home, we don't like the cars facing right at the sidewalk. We want to create >> It may not be the whole frontage, but at least if we can carve out some of that to make it a little more beautiful, maybe even get them a sign closer to the
street. That was something we talked about in the plan. So these are all things we're talking about. >> Yeah. Awesome. Are you talking about specifically like improvements along there or like actual building? the plan allows right now for actual buildings. So that's now what we had also if if you
remember there were like three options. Option one was fix up the existing building. That's the option that ended up happening. And in that option there was a dream I should say of a potential like rain garden along the frontage. I don't think that's practical at this point. But we did talk to them about
other ways we could screen the parking or add additional planters. Yeah. Talking about things. I mean, I will say their landscaping isn't is a little underwhelming, so I don't want to overpromise, but I think we can definitely get some additional things and they were willing to talk
about it. >> Did they express interest in landmark signage? >> I want to talk to you about that separately, but potentially. Yeah. And since we're looking at the plan, it would make sense to because I think it would be nice for them >> to have a little more presence at the street because they are so set back. Um,
and I think it would also encourage them to do the improvements we want in the front if as part of that they were getting a sign >> if people can see them. Yeah. >> You know, and they get a little more of a a monument sign that has their brand on it, but then we get a little more of a >> a strip. I think there will still be
some spots. I don't think they're going to go all the way. And also closing the >> out >> was something we really wanted. Even if we just do it in planters was something that we're talking to them about. They were bucking up. >> It's an ongo It's an ongoing conversation.
I never I barely see anybody use it, you know. I don't know why it's that big a deal, but anyway. >> This is very exciting. >> Exactly. So, but we should weave that into since we're amending the plan anyway. We could we have to figure out how to, you know, design that those
parameters for the sign >> like a 1960s sign we saw decades ago. >> Yeah, we're going to go back to it. >> Mid-century throwback, but then you have to call it Edwards. But it has to be on a big stick and it says food town. >> It was a food time. Food time. Food
town. >> But there was a something >> before that. Was it plate time? >> No, it was food time. It was something before. >> It was food time. I saw the old picture. That's why I >> um so uh yeah has a quite a history. And actually the writing site there was a grocery store at one point as well. They
were right next to each other. >> All right. >> Any additional questions? >> That's all we had. Oh, we do have >> public questions. N >> I was about to pack up >> anyone. >> There are and I do have a hands up mayor. So, do you want to say
>> Okay, now it's time for public comment. >> 21 minutes, three minutes for speaker personal line. Please go ahead and speak. >> Hold on. Uh, it looks >> identify yourself. >> I have to uh Abby Stern Cardell, I'm going to Hold on. >> I thought it worked as we didn't get
comments from the public. >> We do. We always have to have open comment. Yeah. Abby, can you just say something? Make sure you're there. >> Hi. >> Hi. Hi. >> Um, so I have been listening to the meeting. Very interesting. Um, I wanted
to give a little bit of feedback um before you make your final decision about moving forward. Um, I don't know when that's coming, but I wanted to make sure that you uh were able to hear a little bit. Um, so I understand that the best thing is a full suite of options and I I think you should give definitely
some more options. I would um like to make some comments about the daycare. Um I I think my understanding was that Yellow Brick Road partially closed due to the expansion of the prek at the schools and um you know we have a a
market for everything and the market for daycarees should be taken into effect or taken into account. Um because daycarees are struggling. Uh I don't know that a daycare would be a long-term even if one did come would be a long-term tenant.
The goal is for the prek expansion to continue at um in the school and I you know I hope that there's still conversations happening with that um with the with the board of education. So, I really think that, you know, if
you're giving the full suite of options, I would I would ask you just not to include the daycare. I really don't think that it would be good um for that reason. I also think that um something that can serve the entire community and people can walk into daycarees have a
lot of high security and you know, it's really important to keep them locked down. So when you're talking about, you know, keeping it open, keeping the door to on Riden kind of open to the public in a way, that's not going to be the case with a daycare. I just I think that
spot is really does not serve the purpose of a daycare, let alone having to make an outdoor space. Um, so if we're talking about kind of higher value people participating in the downtown, again, I don't think a daycare is bringing in as many um people working.
Um, let me see if I had other points. Um, I would really like to see something that the entire community can use um and walk into. I think there are some great options. You discussed a fitness center definitely. Um, urgent care, entertainment. I mean, that sounds
amazing. Um, for all of those reasons, I would ask that when you're putting the suite of options out there that you don't include a daycare. I think it could be a big problem in terms of supply and demand in the town and also having something that is sustainable
long term. >> Okay. Thank you. Anyone else? >> Uh hold on one sec. There are three people on including Abby, but no other hands up. >> Okay. U may I have a motion to close public participation?
>> Mayor, somebody just popped their hand up. >> Shall I? Okay. Sorry. Um, Ellen Wit, if you could just uh identify yourself for us, please. >> Hi, Ellen Wit, Highland Park. I I'm just
asking a quick question. I just want to confirm that the Immigrant Trust Act resolution could be on the agenda at the next meeting for a vote. Is that the plan? >> Okay, that's a question. Do you have another question, Ellen?
>> Nope, that's the only one. >> Okay. Any additional questions for member of the public? >> I don't see any other uh hands up, mayor. >> Okay. May I have a motion to close public participation? >> So, move. >> Second.
>> Roll call. >> Council member George. >> Yes. >> Council member Hail. >> Yes. >> Council member Hirs. >> Yes. >> Council President Kim Johan. >> Yes. >> Council member Ponic. >> Yes. Council member Vargas. >> Yes. >> Just want to acknowledge that I heard both questions from the questions from
Abby with her recommendation. As we move forward, we'll make we'll try to make the best decisions for the town and seeing who comes before us. As it pertains to Ellen's question, that will be on the agenda for October. Jason and his team um human relations commission
will be working on that and I believe that's going to be on the 21st agenda. >> Okay. >> Okay. Um, any other questions from members of my group? >> No. Seeing none, may I have a motion to adjurnn?
>> Second. >> Great. >> Okay. All right. Good night. >> Good night. >> Sorry. My pen ran out. >> That's it was like I wanted to get
>> That was awesome.