No, no, no. That's why Yeah, he's like It's a lot easier than it was. years ago. about >> I would like to advise all those present that notice of this meeting has been provided to the public in accordance with the provisions of the open public
meeting act that notice was published in the city website copies provided bergen record Ellis special nostar ledger jury journal also placed on a bulletin board in the lobby of city hall written objection ictions if any shall be made
to the city clerk. >> United States of America to the republic for which it stands. One nation under God indivisible for all >> Mr. Con here. >> Miss Fischer >> here. >> Mrs. Imus
>> here. >> Mrs. Jabore >> here. President Dano >> pres Mr. Cano >> present. >> Mr. Ramos >> Mr. Russo >> present. >> President Doyle >> present. >> Um
we are not going to be doing the um uh the proclamation. It's gone. Okay. I'm sorry. Thank you. Um, so we're starting with a presentation by STV with regard to the 13th 15th Street
light rail feasibility study. Director Brown, >> you don't want to say anything about first >> uh >> the election result. >> You're you're Would you like to say something? >> No, I just congrat of course.
Congratulations to Emily. We had an election yesterday. Okay, we have a new upcoming mayor. Like I think it's, you know, amazing >> work here. Okay, >> it >> all right. >> Listen, it >> congratulations. >> I think we should all take a moment to
congratulate. We have a new mayor elect. It's been a long year and of course we need to start this meeting with that. So congratulations to you. and Councilman Council Cano. >> Councilman Quantero, sorry, Councilman Quantero. >> Congratulations, Councilman Cano.
>> As well as Council Elect Firestone and Caitlyn Le, who are I don't know if they're here. >> They're not. >> Okay. Congratulations. >> Director Brown, do you want to >> Yes. >> Congratulate >> Congratulations, Mayor Electra. Um C and good evening,
council president, members of the city council. Uh, so my name is for the purposes of record, we all know each other. My name is Chris Brown. I'm the director of community development here with the city of Hoboken. Um, tonight we have a presentation for the 15th Street light rail feasibility study. As you all
are well aware, in 2021 the city adopted the north end redevelopment plan and one of the central tenants of that redevelopment plan was the inclusion of a light rail station. There were two light rail stations anticipated in the redevelopment plan. one on 15th Street, one on 17th Street, and that is the
focus of this feasibility study tonight. They're going to go over their findings um for a light rail station in that area. So, in uh July 2024, last July, um you all adopt you all um approved a contract with STV to conduct this
feasibility study. Um that feasibility study was funded through a community benefit payment from a development in the north end. Uh so all of this is connected through the north end and to further the mission of that redevelopment plan. So that said, I will
turn the mic over to Will Sherman from STV who will present the findings of the feasibility study. >> Thank you. >> Thank you, director. >> Can you hear me? Okay. Um my name is Will Sherman. I'm with STV. I was the project manager for this study and uh
we'll be presenting our findings here tonight. here. >> Sorry. Let me >> know that it's working. >> I can hold it up. All right. My name is Will Sherman with STV. I was the project manager for this study and I'll present be presenting our findings uh from this
study tonight. As you know, the Hoboken's north end is planned for major uh significant transformation um 2 and a half million square feet of new mixeduse development which would be anticipated to add over
5,800 residents and 900 employees by 2045. But at the same time, the north end doesn't have an adequate level of transit access to support this development. the existing Hudsonburg and light rail stations are beyond a half mile walking distance which is generally
accepted as the the comfortable limit for people walking to transit. Uh the city initiated this study as Chris mentioned in consultation with New Jersey Transit to investigate two potential station locations. 15th Street which is located at Madison Street and
the 17th Street site at the north end of Clinton Street on uh close to the Weihawken border. Our study uh investigated both uh both locations and options and recommends the
15th Street station location as the preferred site for a new Hudsonburg and light rail station. The most significant factor is that the 15th Street site avoids uh some of the significant implementation challenges at 17th Street, including track issues, utility
conflicts, as well as the need for coordination with the Hudson Tunnel project. Within this, there are two access configurations we explored with significantly different costs. One is a station that is accessed only via Hoboken um with an entrance on Madison
Street which would come to an estimated project cost um allin of $28 million. The second option is the addition of access to Union City which would be an elevator and stairs connecting to Manhattan Avenue. Um this would bring
the project cost to $59 million um if that option were pursued. At this point, the station funding strategy is to be determined and needs to be but that may include of uh city, state, federal or private funding sources. Um the diagram
on the right shows the um 15th Street site and you can see the horizontal line to the pink dot is approximately where the 15th the Union City access would connect on Manhattan Avenue. Uh our evaluation looked at a number of
factors across five categories. Um existing land use and development context, planning and redevelopment potential, connectivity and access, construction considerations, and uh the transit operations all designed to select an option that has the um best
benefit for the north end um as 15th Street does. Um and it you know we selected this site because it avoids these significant implementation challenges. Notably both station op options would rank among the busiest stations on the
Hoboken Tunnel Avenue line based on 2045 ridership estimates with Hoboken only access. The 15th Street station would be the third busiest station on the line with up to 2400 daily riders. With the addition of Union City Access, this
would increase, making it the busiest station on the on the line with up to 4,100 daily riders. That's approximately 1,600 additional daily riders accessing the station from Union City, a 67% increase.
We advanced the 15th Street site to conceptual design and produced renderings. Some of the notable design features are side platform lengths which are uh long enough to provide flexibility for longer train configurations in the future. The area
between the station and Madison Street is an opportunity for a station plaza or transit oriented development which could include residential, commercial or other uses. And the optional Union City access structure uh could be constructed
initially with the station or added at a later phase. It's uh completely optional. Um implementation considerations include that property acquisition is required uh for um parcels between the track alignment and
Madison Street. And you can see that here. Um the area in yellow shows property parcels owned by New Jersey Transit. The station and platforms are uh located would be located both in Hoboken and in Union
City. The dash red line shows the municipal boundary. New Jersey Transit owns the right of way, the tracks, the adjacent parcels. Um but the area in blue is a privatelyowned parcel which would require acquisition. um currently
uh used by a bus company. I >> think so. >> Go into a little bit more detail about the op the Union City access option. Um I mentioned this could be built um with a station or at a later phase. This would provide an ADA accessible elevator
and stairs connection to Union Manhattan app. Sorry. uh direct Hudsonburg and light rail access for northern Union City residents who are more than a half mile from Harris station and avoid allow them to avoid a significant detour to the 15th Street site going along the
14th Street vioaduct. However, the trade-offs are the significant additional project costs and maintenance as well as there are existing stairs between Palisad A and Manhattan Avenue which may limit some potential ridership uh for pedestrians with mobility issues
unless they were addressed. These this shows uh the design. You can see the elevator and stairs structure um kind of in a in a faded outline on the left image. Um, and again on the right,
the uh the pink dot shows where this would connect to Manhattan Avenue. At that location is a traffic signal and a signalized pedestrian crosswalk which connects to the stairs up to Palisade Avenue as well as uh would provide access to the Manhattan Avenue sidewalk
traveling north and south. So in summary, uh you know we our study recommends the 15th Street station site and there are two options. one, you know, providing hobok and only access would come to a project cost of $28
million. Adding the Union City access option would uh generate uh would support greater ridership and reach but increase the project cost to $59 million. Um we've included soft costs in this estimate that would take the um
take the concept through um preparation for construction investigating alternatives analysis conceptual design um to a further degree as well as final design um and you know at this time I'm happy to answer any questions. Thank
you. Can I ask um how do you how do you get writership estimates for a place that has no buildings currently? And you know, I'm just curious the methodology for that.
>> So in in this case, we used what's known as a pivot point model, which is a a tool for which is a great tool for evaluating station alternatives like this. Um we used New Jersey Transit's um demand estimates and projections. We
also updated which uh incorporate census data. We also updated those to reflect uh the projected growth in the north end based on the development um known at this time and anticipated and from those um you know we are able to generate the
estimates. The um the idea of the piv pivot of the model is that these stations would be expected to perform in a similar relative way to other stations along uh this section of the Hudson and light
rail. And in this case, we focused on the uh Hobok and Tunnelly line because there are more similarities here than there are to the rest of the system. And you're I believe I heard you say this is based on a 2045 ridership estimate.
>> Yes, that's our um forecast year. >> And why why 2045? Why 20 years from now? >> Uh it's uh because we would anticipate that the north end uh takes a period of time to fully develop. It's also um
anticipating that growth will happen over time. So we're trying to plan the station um when it reaches you know that that point in demand >> just to piggy back off of uh Councilman Doyle's question with the the number I know we're not looking at a 17th Street
station but what a number discrepancy between the two of over,200 riders potentially at 17th Street as opposed to 15th Street. >> So the the 17th Street >> and they're still the same neighborhood. >> So sorry just to clarify you're asking the difference between 17th and 15th.
>> Yeah. Why why that big discrepancy of 1200? It's still the same neighborhood. I know different locations but same neighborhood but why >> right so um it's a little hard to see here actually I'll go back to the >> so the the methodology you know the
focus without providing access to Union City um the Manhattan Avenue the Palisade cliff is a barrier so people can't access um the 17th street site would draw some ridership from we hawken to the north Um and you know that area
uh reflected in you know north of the 15th street site here um there's existing development in that area. So that's um you know it's just able to kind of uh provide ri provide access to the north end as well as people in we
hawken as well. And did did your study the feasibility study look to the economic? Do we you know I'm thinking if it's the most active station in the whole system do we derive any re more or less or any
revenue from the wrership. you know, if if we're being asked to foot a good portion of the bill, I I hoping you'll say that the New Jersey Transit will give us some of the proceeds. >> Huh.
>> I I don't I don't think that we're anywhere near that. I mean, we're we're having a conversation, kind of a one-sided conversation where New Jersey Transit um just started talking to us about it, but demonstrating the demand um and doing revenue projections against
it and looking at it from a regional standpoint, helping Union City, potentially helping Wehawen, like that. That's a conversation that hasn't happened. We're doing this kind of myopically in a corner. Also like the these estimates don't include paying
what 20 plus million dollars for the piece of property. Like we should have a conversation with the developer that owns it about building around it similar to MetroP. So it's it's just still early. These are just these these are
you know the only way to move forward is in partnership with New Jersey Transit. And if we're going to do anything for Union City, Union City is going to pay up. Senator Stack will be a part of it. Like this is just super preliminary. >> I was just asking Will whether in the study there was any economics and
>> we we did not um investigate the the return on investment to Hoboken >> even if it's feas. Yeah. >> Okay. >> Did we I'm sorry, Council President. Go ahead. Did we investigate cost analysis between the two >> between the two
>> between 15th and 17th Street? Would there be a significant cost difference to build one versus the other? >> The um we didn't develop cost estimates for 17th Street um because it's essenti effectively uh
>> not feasible to build because you can kind of see here the track curvature um between Hoboken and we hawken is significant and so there's very um little there's a short straight run between those two curves. it doesn't
provide a lot of room to build that and in addition you know the complications with working around utilities and Hudson Tunnel um >> you know make the uh just make it not pan out as the >> the right choice. >> The 15th Street site does have as you
noted without Union City Hack access has uh slightly lower ridership but it's still very significant ridership. It would serve the north end so given all these um factors it's the right choice. Do we do anything any analysis of the cost of the property that would have to
be acquired? >> No, I um I don't think I I may not have noted, but uh acquisition costs aren't included in this estimate. That would need to be determined. >> And do we know whose property that is now?
>> It's owned by TD's Associates, which is >> that's Tedesco. That's the academy. So, I mean the acquis I wouldn't necessarily um think of it as there's an acquisition cost. There's a cost of paying for property. Yes. But um as Councilwoman
Fischer mentioned, we're very early on in the planning process for this station. It could be something where um we're partnering with Academy for a development project on one of their lots and there's some sort of a land swap. It could, you know, there's there's a
there's a wide range of possibilities. Um, so you the land cost wasn't factored into into the analysis. >> Thank you. >> Uh, Councilman Cohen. >> Yeah. Just I wanted to respond to some of Councilwoman Fischer's comments. Uh,
first, this was a study that the council >> authorized, approved the funding for, and we're reporting back to the community on this feasibility study. So, you know, I think that's a point I want to make. Number two, uh the suggestion that we're doing it myopically or in
some kind of vacuum without New Jersey Transit involvement is not accurate. I didn't say that. >> Well, you said myopic. That was definitely one of the words you used to describe the >> I did. >> Okay. Thank you. Anyway, I didn't interrupt you, so I'd appreciate the same courtesy. >> You could have though if I was saying something.
>> I don't want to interrupt you, Councilwoman. So, if I could proceed. Is that okay? >> Thank you. So what I was going to say is that the reason why we did the feasibility study is because we want to get funding from New Jersey Transit and other organizations to defer the expense
and unless we can demonstrate that this is a feasible location to have this we can't get that funding. So that is why the council approved this process. And furthermore, uh I don't know if my optic was a reference to the fact that it was not including consultation with New New
Jersey Transit, but to the extent that was your suggestion, Councilwoman, that is not true. >> New Jersey Transit was in consultation with STV with respect to this process. That was reported to our committee and they were engaged in the process. So the the fact that New Jersey Transit is aware of the fact that we've had this
feasibility study, they've worked with us on this. This is a logical beginning point. It is not we have a long way to go, but it's an important beginning point because, as you know, Councilwoman, the entire North End plan centers on having a transit hub at the
light rail station at 15th Street. And that's something I know you were it was important to you as well. So as it is to me in the fifth ward. So, I just want to stress the importance of getting to the point where we have this uh facility uh to to have uh the people who work and
live in the northwest in this new neighborhood to be able to access uh public transportation uh to minimize the number of additional cars that are coming into this neighborhood. This is a critical aspect of the Northwest redevelopment plan and
I appreciate the presentation. Thank you, >> Council President. just so I can correct what he said. >> Councilwoman, >> so what I said was this was a this was a process that was done myopically and only recently did we interact with um
New Jersey Transit. This is something that I raised and other people here have raised with this administration. I've been on the council for 10 years. It was one of the first things I raised under Mayor Zimmer who that administration did nothing. We always knew we needed this in the north end because we always knew
we were going to have a north end plan. And we always knew we were going to have thousands of more residents in the northwest corner of Hoboken that would be underserved by public transportation if we didn't have this. So what has happened over the years is instead of sitting down and looking at it and
bringing in all the stakeholders and really understanding that this is a regional transit um station, this isn't a Hobokenf funded, we would never run this project. This is a New Jersey transit station. The point of the feasibility study is exactly what
Councilman Cohen said, which is to demonstrate at least a major framework for us to have those conversations with New Jersey Transit. And Chris, uh, Director Brown can attest, they they didn't want to talk about it for a long time until recently, right? And now
they're having they're more engaged. And we always said that if we show this to them, like what it could look like, they'll be engaged. But this isn't this isn't something the city is going to build. this isn't something that the city is going to pay for. I don't think anyone here would support bonding for this with knowing full well that it
would have um that it has an opportunity to serve the surrounding cities. We need to bring everyone in. So, >> so to your point, thank you Councilwoman Councilman Cole. Appreciate your comments. Appreciate all your questions and comments. Um but just will I don't know if you want to just um talk through
next steps and before you talk through next steps um that the city region NJ NJ transit and the city other partnering municipalities would have to take to affectuate this um the we engage we've engaged with New Jersey Transit you know
more than a handful of times over the last uh I've been in this position about seven years. um one one of my first couple months we went down to Newark and we had a conversation with New Jersey Transit. We've we've known that the feasibility study is been sort of step
number one. >> Yeah. >> And you know obviously uh getting to the feasibility study we had to pay for the feasibility study which is why we um ex we use community benefit dollars from from a development project. But that's how we are here today. Um you know it is
step number one. We are at step one. This is absolutely that. Uh but Will, do you want to just talk through what the next steps typically are for uh get getting a light rail station to fruition? Yeah, the the typical next step from this point would be um working
with key partners such as New Jersey Transit, such as municipalities like Union City, uh gauging their in interest and uh discussing next steps, working out a funding strategy, what combination of um funding sources could be utilized.
Um and that would then proceed to um conducting an al alternatives analysis which would look more in depth at this station in particular as well as alternatives to building that station. And you might think that that sounds counterintuitive um you know after a study about building
a light rail station. But the point is also to ensure this this is the best station and identify um strategies that might be more that could be phased in or short-term and so that this could be properly implemented. It could be coordinated with the entire system and
could advance. After that's complete, uh this would uh go to final design at which point it's really about finalizing doing um finalizing plans so that this can be bid out and constructed and then
you know construction could proceed. >> Thank you. >> You're welcome. >> Thank you. Any other questions? >> All right. Thanks very much for the pres. >> Thank you very much. Great job, Will. Thank you very much. And John Manzone from STV as well. Thank you. Thank you
guys for all your support. >> Okay, so we're going to move on to the second readings for a hearing for ordinances. Number one is carried pending a planning board review I believe. Uh so the second
which is B833. Mr. Uh hearing on an ordinance amending chapter 192 for persons disabilities to add a reserve parking spaces. Uh no members of the public have signed the
>> motion to close public portion. >> All those in favor? >> I I >> Mr. I Oh, sorry. >> Have a question? No. >> Please call the vote. >> Mr. Con. Hi. >> Fisher. >> Yes. Mrs. Imus, >> yes.
>> Mr. Jabor, >> yes. >> Mr. President, I >> Mr. Cano, >> I >> Mr. Ramos, >> I >> Mr. Russo, >> I >> President Doyle, >> I hearing on an ordinance amending article
14, miscellaneous fees for online transactions. Uh, Manuel Rivera Solair. >> Good evening, Council President. Good evening, council, members of the public, and uh, good evening, Madame
Hoboken Mayor Elect. I know that uh, I'm going to find a better way to uh, say that in the future, but no worries. But congratulations anyway. I'll have more words later. Uh, Council President, um, just a brief, uh, questions. I just have to um, could members of the public
understand the reasoning why these fees or these operation costs have to be um, amended at this point? How high, what is the amount um, that they're going to be changed? I looked at the meeting from uh pardon me the last meeting and I didn't
uh see any any full conversation that explained that to the people again in the consent I mean pardon me in the u packet agenda. It is explained but not not as clearly as I would hope but some members of the public would like to understand a little further if you could
give an example or two as to the reasoning. Is it because there are higher costs there more elevation uh of people um using the system where we need to implement um more employees and such. So if if an example or two or an
explanation uh around that could be given um would be uh it's very appreciative. >> It's from $2 to $2.50. We're changing the provider. the the $2
fee was circa maybe a decade ago. So, it's not I think it's just the passage of time and a new provider. It's 50 cents to answer your question. >> I appreciate the answer, Council President. Uh, you know, I could actually fill a buster because I see
that I have a minute and 20 seconds, but I will not. I'll wait for my next question. Thank you, Council President. We're turning over a new leaf, Council President. All righty. Thank you. Thank you. Good evening. Um, >> okay. Mr. Fina, number
>> Oh, wait. Can I close public portion? >> Public. >> Okay. >> Motion to close public portion. >> Second. >> Second. >> All those in favor? >> I. >> So, >> uh, Councilwoman Fischer. >> Yeah. So,
I guess following on some of what Manny said because I'm not maybe it's the same question, but um so there's two parts of this. The first one is we're adding on a 250 convenience fee for any online processing
period for permitting and licensing. Right. So, just any permit that's done online or like uh licensing. Yes. And why wouldn't we just increase the rate by 250 instead of like separate fee? Is there a reason >> you speaking to the mic?
>> Yeah. Why wouldn't we just increase whatever the permitting and licensing fees are instead of adding a convenience fee? Is it is it effectively the same thing? We're just increasing the rate. Um, so if we were to do that, we would go
through and have to ordain every single one of those different fees, which is significantly more, I guess I would just say, labor intensive to go through every single ordinance and amend every single one of them rather than doing a convenience
fee, which we're already charging. So, we're already charging $2 per transaction and we're proposing an increase of of 50 cents is so the change is only to 250, not the
whole entire addition. So, everything right now that's underlined is not a new full sentence. You're just changing the number from 2 to 250. So right now we are currently charging $2 for every transaction through HPU online. The
difference is now that we're using a different vendor. So we're looking at all online transactions instead of just HPU online. So as we discussed previously, we're moving to like an enterprise system that will process all transactions through the same vendor instead of multiple different vendors,
right? So through that process, we are we are consolidating the fees. >> This is this is more of a technical question. This is Does it before you've made this change, does it say somewhere in our ordinance somewhere that we're charging $2 per transaction?
>> I don't believe so. >> Okay. And are we allowed to charge if it's not in our ordinance? >> I don't know the question to that, but but online transactions, we've had a $2 online transaction fee through for HBO online since 2012, I believe.
>> Okay. >> All right. So this is really then just a 50 it's codifying something that we may or may not should have already codified and it's a 50 50 cent increase >> expanded to not only HPU but also to
other types of like dog licenses or whatever other online >> Exactly. Anything that would be processed online moving forward. Yes. >> Okay. And then the the second one is um the credit card processing one. Mhm.
>> What what do we do right now? And like does this does this impact like um me like parking meters and you know our online app. >> Um so this is not related to park
mobile. So it does not impact parking meters but I do not um I would have to get back to you as to how we currently do park mobile. I'm I'm not sure about that. But right now yeah the credit card fees are passed on to the consumer. Okay. By the vendor. Okay. >> Yeah. By the variety of vendors that we
use. Yeah. Councilman Russo. >> Thank you, Mr. President. So, if we're charging $2, but we don't have that in our code, what is the legal ramifications associated with that? Why
are we I mean, how are we even doing that? We don't have a specific fee in our code and it's spelled out in our code. How are we charging that fee currently and how long have we been charging that fee
without any authorization by the city council? >> 2012 she said. >> Yeah. So, as far as this is the council's um time to either affirm the fee or stop the fee.
>> Okay. So we've been doing it since 2012. Is that correct? >> My understanding. Yes. >> So we're doing it since 2012 and we have never affirmed that as as a body. Is that correct? >> Has been ordained. That's correct.
>> Right. So now we're we're being asked to do that here tonight and at the same time increasing that from $2 to2 $2.50. >> Just want to make sure we're correct. >> Correct. What
what is the implication if in fact we do not >> corporate cash? Do we need to go into close session for this? >> Why? >> Well, the implication would be the fee would stop if you don't ordain it. >> I'm just wondering if there's like if there's a legal liability >> there could be a greater conversation,
but I can answer I can answer the question out loud that the fee would stop. >> That's why I said this is your your time to either affirm the fee or deny the fee. How you I'm sorry. Was there a question there? >> Well, I'm trying to avoid us going into a close session right the second. Um
I'd like to have a deeper conversation about that or I mean I'd ask my colleagues just to vote no on this and then stop the fee >> or carry it. >> Carry it. >> Fine. >> But also my understanding is that this doesn't cover the entire cost of this
application. So, if we stop the fee, it's a significant budget hit. So, >> well, I don't again, I don't know if that's the case. >> Well, do we want to wait till the end of the meeting and go into close session? And and >> I'm fine with that,
>> director. If we were to not if we were to carry this till the 17th, would there be other than fees will continue to be charged? I suspect if if >> Well, I have a problem with that, too. But >> two weeks. I mean, I don't want to go down that rabbit hole and I think the
close session will probably will be able to hash some of that stuff out, but >> yeah. Did you >> No objection to carrying? >> Yeah, you there's no reason why tonight is the night. Okay. >> So, why don't we move on to uh whoever the sponsors are.
>> Can I ask that question? >> One quick question. >> Oh, I'm sorry. Yep. >> Um how many transactions a year does the city do? Would you say again I'm not pegging you >> through? My understand is through HPU online we do approximately 30,000 ballpark.
>> I could get you specific. >> That's HPU but that now we're going to do every everybody. >> Right now we're moving to an enterprise. >> What would you guess? >> I don't have a guess for the others. >> 10 another 10 or 40. >> Again I I'm not going to give you a wrong answer.
>> Yeah. I think carrying the best carrying would be I have a motion to carry. >> There is a motion. Second. I'll second it. >> Mr. Fina a motion to carry this. I don't know that we uh >> we agree. >> Mr. Con? >> I think we all agree.
>> M Fischer. >> Uh yes. >> Mrs. Irish. >> Yes. >> Mrs. Jabore. >> Yes. >> President President Xano. >> Hi. >> Cano. >> Hi. >> Mr. Ramos. >> Hi Russo. >> Hi.
>> President D. >> Hi. >> All right. >> That is carried. Next ordinance. Hearing on a bond ordinance authorizing the completion of various water system capital improvements, including public art acquisition,
installation, and capital facility improvements allocations related there to and therefore the city of Hobok and county of Hudson, New Jersey, appropriating a sum of $5,50,000. Therefore authorizing the issuance of
general obligation bonds and bond anticipation notes of the city of Hobok and county of Hudson, New Jersey and the aggregate principal amount of up to 5,47,500 making certain determinations and covenants and authorizing certain
related actions in connection with the foregoing. >> Thank you, Mr. Fina. Um uh Mary Andrea want to number five which is 86. Okay. >> Uh no other members of the public discussion >> to close public portion.
>> Thank you. >> All those in favor. >> Mr. Fina call the vote. >> Mr. Con. >> Hi. >> Fisher. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Mr. Jabore. >> Yes. >> PresidentO. >> Hi. >> Mr. Cano.
>> Hi. >> Mr. Ramos. >> Hi. >> Mr. Russo. >> No. >> President Doyle. >> I. Hearing on an ordinance amending chapter 145 peace and good order section 145-25
imagebased automated traffic light and stop sign enforcement technology prohibited to establish a holiday season moratorum to January 15 on unmanned camerabased parking enforcement.
Uh, Andrew Wilson. >> Hello, council. My name is Andrew Wilson. I'm a Hoboken resident. Um, and I'm incredibly proud of what the Clear Pilot has achieved in just a few months. Um, it's been an overwhelming success, not by creating new ordinances for
people to follow. It's always been illegal to double park. It's always been illegal to block a bus stop. It's always been illegal to overstay a loading zone. We just now have an effective enforcement mechanism that allows us to enforce our city ordinances and the
results have been phenomenal. Really, the bike lanes are finally usable. I talk to cyclists every day. Um, we would typically avoid Washington Street because the bike lanes just couldn't be used safely. Um, and now Washington Street's a pleasant place to be. It's
it's incredibly how quickly this program has worked. Um, but not just talking about bus uh uh cyclists, let's talk about bus riders. Um, I had a conversation with a senior director at NJ Transit and they are incredibly
supportive of this program. The 126 bus is a strategically important bus route for the state. It's one of the top five ridership bus routes in the entire state and it is mired by delays because the bus is stuck behind double parked cars. In addition to that, riders, whenever
you get on and off the bus, you have to navigate through this row of illegally parked cars that are blocking the bus stop. This is dangerous. It slows down people's commutes. And we're talking about thousands of Hoboken residents, thousands of your constituents who use
this bus every single day. I know that there have been concerns from some business owners about how this has impacted their business. I've looked at the data. I don't think that this program shows a negative impact. In fact, um, freight use of the loading
zones has basically doubled. Loading zone turnover has increased by, I think, 9%. Parking transactions on Washington Street. So, the number of people who are going to Washington Street and parking has increased this year from year-over-year. Right? So, the traffic
the the consumer traffic on Washington Street is up, not down. everyone's, you know, perspective is going to be different. There's hundreds of of business owners on Washington Street. Um, but the data shows that this is working really well. Um, if there are
any additional concerns about this program, this program can solve those those concerns. Um, if we need more loading zones, you guys can ordain a new loading zone anytime you want. Um, if you want to have a conversation about the length of the bus stops, let's have a conversation about the length of the
bus stops, that's totally fine. Um, but if we want smart loading zones, right, this technology allows that to happen. If we want to give people 15 minutes of free parking on Washington Street, this program allows for that. If you get rid
of this program, we no longer have that capability, right? We go back to how things were. If we go back to how things were and we end this program, this doesn't that doesn't solve the problem. We just go back to how things were in an unfunctioning state. We remove the
ability to effectively enforce our city ordinances, which is really bad. And we're not replacing with anything. This this ordinance tonight, it actually talks about how we need to enforce these laws less, right? It doesn't hire more
parking enforcement officers to manually walk up and down Washington Street. Simply removes the enforcement mechanism and leaves a vacuum. Um, I think that'd be a disgrace to our community, be really bad, um, and disappointing. It would negatively impact our lives. And
so, I really hope uh that you vote no on this ordinance tonight. Um, and let's work together to make this program even better than it already is. Thank you. >> Thank you, Mr. Wilson. Uh, Jim Vance.
Uh, yeah. 8:36. >> Good evening, council. Thank you so much for allowing me to speak on this subject that is near and dear to my heart. Um, if I might, a little background. um this
council years ago when there was a plan presented on rebuilding Washington Street and redesigning it in the process. This council uh took what was a wellthoughtout,
well-designed um plan that met all of the state, city, county, national regulations and rules with regard to how to make a main street
work with a bicycle lane component. And at the last minute, there were merchants, well-intentioned, concerned merchants who came to the city council and said, "Oh, this will ruin our business. We have to continue to operate
as we always have." Um, and so the city council in their infinite wisdom decided to change the plan. The original plan had the curb, the protected bicycle lane, the parked cars, travel lane, and
on the other side, the same thing. It works. Uh, among other things, it draws bicycle riders who are now afraid to ride on on the um that street to participate as shoppers on that street.
At any rate, the change was made and the merchant said, "Oh, great. we'll just keep doing what we always did. And the bicycle lanes, which provide safety, provide access, um became basically
places you could abandon your car for five or 10 minutes and walk into a store or get a piece of pizza or chat with your friends, whatever. Uh and so the issue of making that street work
for everybody was just put off because now the merchants had their spots. The parking enforcement people have an extremely tough time. I know that under the old circumstances they were yelled at, spit upon, treated
terribly for doing their jobs. Um and I don't want to go back. I want to use this system to make sure Washington Street works properly and to this system is forcing the merchants and the rest of
us to start to deal with the real problem. And that's what's happening tonight. So what I really think in the long run we need to do is do what we were supposed to do in the first place, implement an appropriate design. But right now, this
concept of throwing the baby out with the bathwater is going to fix all of the problems on Main Street is on the avenue is not feasible and we need to we need to vote it down, please. Thank you.
>> Thank you, Mr. Vance. Mary Andrea, >> this down or not? Don't touch. >> Don't touch it. Mary agitated. >> I want >> Mary Andre on 159 Street.
I have to follow them. My understanding from this it was um it's a moratorum to January 15th. It does not say get rid of it
permanently. It a moratorum means stop it until this date to this date. Um I don't think that's egregious. I think it's being decent for the
holiday season. Uh uh if you notice the uh shops uh are disappearing. I noticed it bluntly the other day and I was speaking to a few people and they said, "Yeah,
there's 30 there's 30 uh empty storefronts." And I go I said, "Really?" And the other guy said, "No, there are 49." And I said, "49." He counted them.
I can't prove or disprove that, but I did see downtown here when you're on the east side, empty after empty after empty after empty after empty. You know, maybe we don't need shops on
Washington Street. Maybe we just need the restaurants that can last a few months or a year. the people walk to them. You don't need a car and uh that will solve that problem.
I a morator give them a gosh this was just one little break. Uh it's not going to go away. I I do have concerns about sick animals at my vet. The people that have asked me the time frame, they've
got they have a sick animal dying. They've got to stop and run in. I've done it myself, but I've walked it and they take the animal, but um I'm my understanding you're only allowed 15 minutes or 20 minutes, if that much,
before you're ticketed. And then I understand they will only ticket you once a week. Is this true? I need to know this because I have to tell people who ask me this. Uh, nobody wants uh I believe the ticket's $150. I could be
wrong. Am I right or wrong? But um the main street that was spent so much money on benches are gone. It's not friendly for people. uh you're going to get just your delivery people and then your maybe your
dereliks that supposedly the reason the benches are gone because they're urinated on. Um it's not a very friendly town anymore. It's not a friendly main street anymore.
And that's sad because I don't have a car and I use that main street. I I I I need it. I I can't go to many of the restaurants. They're too expensive and they give me migraines. So, that's
my personal issue. But main streets usually have hardware stores and beauty shops and vets and and you know, lock shops and stuff like that. I I don't think main streets were made for
purposely just bicycles. I'm not telling anybody not to ride a bicycle, but I don't see the bicycle except for maybe Mr. Vance carrying stuff in his little cart or his little basket. You know, the trouble with this town has always been they always make it for
certain people and they certainly I don't fall in any of the categories. It doesn't matter how long I've been here. I don't fall in here. But it's just a moratorum. Give them an effing break.
Thank you. >> Thank you, Mary. You you might speak with director Francesi in the back who to get the questions to >> about the bench >> the questions that you just asked. No, not about the benches. About
>> you. You just asked is it $150? Is it 15 minutes? You asked a series of questions and he can answer those. >> Okay. I apologize for answering him. Um,
Manny Rivera Soler Manuel, excuse me. Thank you, Council President. Once again, Manuel Ria Soler, six word. Thank you, Council President. Um, yes, the definition moratorum, a temporary prohibition of an activity. That is all
that's being asked of this amendment, pardon me, ordinance. I believe that it is important to explain to members of the public exactly what is going on when we have
ordinances such as this. When I tell you sometimes they are complicated to to read with their ases and the what has I'm just using that terminology right now. But it is important for people to understand that we understand what some members of the public are
saying. Of course, illegal parking is always been illegal, right? Or double parking, but we don't need, as they say, to throw the baby out with the bathwater. We need a cohesive implement of this plan. This was done wrong
from the beginning and is wrong now. There is no reason that people, members of the public could not have more input on this. I understand the safety reasons and I understand everything. And as Mayo said, sometimes it does feel like it's one-sided city. It should be for
everyone, for everyone. I am a pedestrian. Of course, I'm gungho with there not being uh double parked cars so I can see where I'm crossing, but I'm also afraid, right, if I'm going to cross that very same intersection or that very lane, that a ebike or a bike
scooter, a person who's not following the rules, not the ones that are, but I am the bad actors that we could get run over. And it has happened before by a sliver. I haven't been impacted and I'm sure other people haven't but that is that is
one of the concerns but the main concern here is in regards to this ordinance when you say a moratorum are you saying again to the 15th are the cameras going to be completely shut down are the cameras going to continue to take
pictures and not affect the people who are in those pictures will you retain those pictures for educational purpose for the future future or for statistics. Will those pictures on that camera, if
they're going to be left on, going to be reviewed and who is going to continue to review them? And are they going to be again kept on record for some unforeseen reason? And again this is this is you know safety of course but again there's
there's this element of of privacy of people's uh not having their images uh in in in these uh photos all the time even if they're a split second or whatever. But again that is that is the the importance of of explaining I again
I I I watched the meeting when I spoke before I watched the meetings again sadly the one the past meeting less than 100 people and and it's sad so I exert people to watch the meetings if they can't come here but at least give their input because they could always uh email
each and every one of you separately or email the city clerk's office and he will let you let the uh council members uh have that information. But to to sum it up and to wrap it up, council president, to not vote for this today to pass, to at least give a a a chance for
people who are visiting in Christmas who do not have all of the details that they cannot stop there a second or two and have that chance to to purchase something in our local stores or or grab something to take out. So, I urge you to please vote for it to the 15th. Let's
hope that then we can at least speak more upon it and and address it even further in the future just like the uh uh Grand Street. That is another thing that is another eyesore. But anyway, that's what I have council president and I yield back and I thank you for your
attention and I respect everybody's opinion but this is mine. Thank you. >> Thank you Mr. Manwell's Rivera Solar Hymed Thank you, Council President. Um, I want to thank all of those that uh had the
courage to put their name on a ballot. Um, it's tough. It's a tough thing to do to put your name out there and I'm sure your families have to deal with it also for the last several months and uh we're thankful that you all did that and uh put the time in. Thank you. um about
this issue with the parking. There are bike riders that follow the law like like Jim Vance, like Council President Jim Doyle, and then there are those that are just reckless. Um no helmets, go up one ways and and do all the things we don't want to see them do.
There are drivers that do the same, but we have license plates. We have driver's licenses. So, we could track those people. People that continually drink and drive or continue red lights or or reckless driving. We don't have the same system for bikers. So, we're left to the
deise of just either cursing each other out or you see fist fights all the time in New York City and other places where where biker meets pedestrian and or biker meets mom with a stroller and finds out, you know, how she's going to respond when she almost gets hit with a bike.
The system that you have here with the cameras, I think, is not comprehensive enough. It a system doesn't work unless you have all the parts to it. And there's there's a very important part that's missing here. Drivers don't want to break the law. We don't wake up every day and say, you know, how could I be
reckless today, but you have a kid that has a fever. You you have to go out and get medicine. So, someone's going to sit in the car and you're going to run to CVS and and get your medicine and run out. And yeah, you have a car. You know, not many two-year-olds do well in a on a 10 speed in in the month of December. So
the re the realistic part of it is that cars are here and people are going to drive cars and we don't want people to break laws. But you have to design a system that can accommodate. And part of that is maybe just taking a midblock. We paint two red spots and you make it 15 minutes. Maybe you put the camera there
to say, "Hey, this is a or a 10-minute spot. This is a drop off spot. This is the spot where you know your your husband or wife, they have an injured ankle and they're going to physical therapy. They're not going to walk up the block. you're going to drop them off the close as you can to the to the location that they're going to go to. And the businesses are the heart and
soul of the city. We don't want to see, you know, uh, a chiropractor or a foot doctor or a pizza shop or anything. We don't want to see them go out of business. It's not the intent here. And this council is well-intentioned because you hear it every day from your constituents. You all live here. So,
what I'm asking is this pause also helps you to give you time to reflect and say, how do we make the system better? How do we design the system so that people they're not bad people? They they could function in the city and not, you know, feel bad. And I know it's changing really because I've changed my own behavior. I I shop less south of 7th.
It's a fact. When I'm driving home from work or and I'm coming back into town and I know those cameras there on 7th, I say if I can't get it north of 7th, then I'll just go home and figure it out. Maybe I order from somewhere else or maybe I stop somewhere else for a cup of coffee in the morning. And that's not good. That's a bad behavior changing.
I'm not saying you should double park, but you know, even those loading zones on a corner, if there was something to give us a chance just to pull up, do what we have to do, get back in the car and go. And then the other part is that we have Uber drivers throughout the city, but we know where they are in the weekends. They're going by the by the
PAT train, picking people up, and that's awesome. We don't want people to drink and drive. Please take an Uber. If you're listening, take an Uber. But these Uber drivers stop right along, you know, in front of Dunkin Donuts over there on Hudson Place. and uh um can't even think on River Street and they clog
up the whole system, but there's nowhere for them to drop. We do it for shuttle buses. We do a good job of that all week. So, I think that we have to realize on the weekends that people are going to come out to drink and they're going to do things and there should be areas whereas where the Uber driver waits. You shouldn't just sit double parked and nailing your whole system for
someone else wants to come and drop someone off by the PAT train. So, I think there should be a comprehensive look at that. The other one I want to mention is the ballards. The ballers don't have to be on every corner. And if they're going to be on a corner, let's let's try to look at the blind spot. A blind spot's when you're driving down a
oneway and there's a UPS truck blocked in front of the stop sign. That causes the blind spot. We know where the blind spot is. You have some of the smartest traffic engineers that work for you guys with your contracts. There should be ballers there so you don't block the blind spot. But on the non-blind spot side, there shouldn't be ballards there.
Let someone drop the kid off. Let someone pick someone up for soccer practice. let them use the city the way the city's designed. It's not just designed for bikers. It's not just designed for cars. It's designed for all of you and all your friends and family that live here. So, this is a good
opportunity to take a, you know, a month or so and think about it and ask tough questions of your professionals and let's try to design the system a little bit better so that it gives the businesses a chance, it gives the constituents a chance, it gives you guys a chance too to function. Thanks.
>> Thank you, Mr. Omed. No other members of the public are signed up to speak. >> Motion to close public portion. Second. >> All those in favor? >> I >> I would like to start and I um you know, Councilwoman Fischer, I I
mentioned on the 5th be when this first was on and then it was carried, >> I emailed you and then I emailed you on the 17th as well. Um, and I'm I I'm with Mr. Wilson, so I I'm not I'm not saying
this just because I'm hostile to this moratorum, but this is not a moratorum. The if you look at the whereas clauses in the ordinance, the eth whereas clause talks about a a moratorum for till
through January 15th. Mhm. >> The whereas clauses are not the law. The law that we're passing is paragraph B. >> The whereas clauses are aspirational
paragraphs that say we are in favor of doing something good or bad or so. The law is B and in B there is no word January 15th. There's no word moratorum. So if this passes, we are banning the
use of these until we were if and when we would amend it back in January 15th apparently. So if if your intention is to do it permanently, then this will do it regardless of the aspirational nature
of the whereas clause that says, you know, we want it to be a moratorum and yet it is not. and corporation council. You can tell me if I'm wrong, but >> there there's a a second it should be at the bottom and I don't have it in front
of me, but there should be now there should be the third page where it says actually let me have that back. >> The third page or the automatic like >> there's no substance beyond that page. It says that the
Yeah, there's it's missing a page, but um it does say in the section two the when it's effective, it says it's effective through January um >> shall be in effect until January 15, 2026
>> under section 4, effective date. The ordinance shall take effect immediately upon passage and publication as provided by law and shall be in effect until January 15, 2026. >> I think they covered. >> Okay. >> Although it Well, let me just say that
sounds more like it's not an effective date. An effective date is when an ordinance goes into effect. This is like an end date. It's like the opposite of an effective date. both. It's a no longer I mean is that >> it's I say that it's both because it
says the order shall take effect immediately which means once you pass it and then it it has a an end date. So it's beginning and end. >> Yeah. >> But >> the sunset. >> Okay. >> Yeah. >> Uh Council Councilman Cano.
>> Uh question for Director Gonzalez. Uh this is under the original uh camera system enforcement is under a pilot, right? >> Yep. >> When's that pilot supposed to expire? end of this year. >> End of this year. So if we do nothing, >> the car camels will be turned off on
January 1st. And for Mr. Ahmed's point, we can reevaluate and think about how more comprehensively we want to do this. Uh for Mr. Wilson and Mr. Vance, we can, you know, make sure that we keep uh any future plans uh thinking about
bicyclists, uh uh pedestrians and drivers. um the city is not for cars, the city's not for bikes, the city is for human beings and how Yes, really. And that's what we need to think about when we're making these plans, right?
So, we we get frustrated that we don't enforce our laws and then we put in tools to enforce our laws and then we get frustrated with the things that we put in place. So, it was a pilot. It was always intended to be a pilot. pilot expires in January 3 on on December
31st. I'd rather see that pilot complete, collect all the data, re-evaluate, and then make smart decisions moving forward. >> Council President, >> Councilman Cohen. >> Yeah, just to follow on Councilman Cano's point, it makes no sense to say
that the that there's a suspension until January 15th when the cameras are turned off on January 1st. Well, it it just that's illogical. The program ends December 31st. The point of the pilot program is to collect the data to
determine how it's working, which is what Mr. Ahmed and Mr. Vanza, we should assess this. That's what the point of the pilot program is, to collect the data for this 90-day period, see what we find at the end. Did it work? Did it not work? Could it be done better? Should it
be discarded altogether? I know some people in the campaign suggested that. Well, that's what we've collected the data for. That's why we put in the technology to learn this. I can tell you that tonight from my non-scientific personal observation, I rode a city bike
from 11th Street to City Hall and never had to go into Washington Street. The bike lane was clear from 11th Street all the way to here, which is something that we all want. I mean, I think there's nobody on this council who believes that cars should be double parked in the bike
lane and that that should not be enforced, which is exactly what the situation was until before this program went into effect. So, my it appears to me to be working from the perspective of having clear bike lanes as Mr. Wilson testified and the users of uh New Jersey
uh the the members of uh bike hoboken. But I can tell you another experience that was very common that I've had and I'm sure others have had it is getting off of a bus when you're coming home from work when I commute home from New York City and having the bus drop me in the middle of Washington Street because
there's a driver who's parked in the bus stop and the bus cannot get to the curb. It is impossible for the bus to get to the curb. And recently I came to a council meeting on a bus and when I entered the bus the I I mentioned to the driver who was parked in the bus stop and I had to board in the middle of
Washington Street, you know, this is a bus stop and here's my bus and he lowered his window and started barking at me and the driver of the New Jersey Transit bus opened his door and started talking to the driver who was sitting in the because he there's a sense of entitlement because they've always done
that. In fact, we all got a letter uh an email from a a from a business in Hoboken who sent us two electronic tickets with pictures of their drivers in a bus stop unloading complaining about the fact they're being ticketed because they'd always parked in the bus stop before and they've gotten two
tickets and this has never happened and they're and they're outraged and guess what? They're not parking in that bus stop when they're loading and loading anymore. So the point here is that we're we're I believe we're improving the business climate because people are going to get from one end of Washington Street quicker because buses are not
having to load and unload in the middle of the street. They're loading and unloading in the bus stop where they should be. And it's better for bikers who want to come and patronize businesses because they can get from point A to point B and not be scared to go use those bike lanes. And again, this is only we're talking about just another
20some days. So, you know, we're we would be truncating the data collection. We've made the investment in getting these cameras to get this data. I think we should just go to December 31st, complete the process, assess the data,
have it report back to the council, and then decide, did it work? Did it not work? What What should we do? I think by cutting this program off immediately, which is what would happen if this that's what the effective date would be immediately, we're we're depriving the
community of the data which is being collected and for the people who want to assess how things are going, we're going to be losing that data and we're never going to get it. >> Thank you, Council President. >> It can't be immediate. >> Council President, >> well, that's the >> mayor doesn't sign. >> Well, right. if assume well
>> council president >> upon a significant >> as uh as one of the co-sponsors um first of all none of us I don't think there's anyone on this day that wants to see um illegal parking in the bike lanes I
don't think anyone wants to see illegal parking in the bus stops at all we've had it for a long time it's been a big complaint by um a lot of people and no one's questioning at a year and a half ago when Ryan Sharp, our former um
director, came to this body and presented to this body the potential for these cameras, the entire conversation was about how do we address the double parking um but in a way that we
accommodate the need that it effectively is double parking and parking um in illegal spots. So, it was it was a comprehensive conversation, borrowing the phrase that Haney said. It wasn't just a one-sided conversation about whether or not bikes could ride in a in
a bike lane. It was talking about all the stakeholders and all of the changes that we could make to deliver um short-term parking, a 10-minute spot. Um, we had a robust, it was almost a halfhour conversation on the topic and
it was a great conversation and Councilman Jabbor, myself, what Jen Guatino, we all were like this could be like good for the community, right? Like if we had the ability to allow people to stop legally for 10 minutes whether we charge them or not, if we had the ability to have smart loading zones and
Ryan Sharp came and said, "I'm going to come back. We're going to collect data and then I'm going to come back and we're going to have this whole conversation about how to um make changes uh update our ordinances to have a comprehensive change to our commercial
district. But that isn't what h and ask the city council to approve it. So we are going to have this partnership between our parking director on a really important topic involving all stakeholders including our businesses, residents, everyone. and we were going to have a continuous conversation. But
that's not what happened. What happened was the mayor rolled out a pilot on his own in a way that intentionally circumvented any feedback from the city council. intentionally with one goal and
one goal in mind um which is of course a headline. Um, but it was very specifically to say that he had cleared double parking for the bike community and that's a great goal and that's one that we would I ride my bike, Diane
rides her bike, we all ride our bike. I don't know if everyone does but a lot of us on the day ride bikes and that's a great goal but it didn't at all factor in any feedback from the businesses and we've heard from the businesses. Not only in this room have several businesses come saying that their
businesses are down 10 and 20% and their seasonal sales this is the busiest time of year for them and their seasonal sales are down because of exactly what Mr. Amed said, "People just are not coming. Not only are they not coming,
but delivery deliveries are not happening." As a result of that, the mayor came and he put a statement out, didn't come and change the law, and he said, "Even though we have a law on our books that says double parking is illegal, I'm letting the public know
that I am actually going to allow a violation of that law in certain circumstances. we are going to turn our head for commercial delivery um vehicles for a certain period of time. We are going to turn our head for residents doing drop offs. So now we have
subjective rules that aren't even in writing just to accommodate people that were frustrated with this and all we're saying is let's just allow the businesses breathing room through the end of this season so we're not negatively impacting them and let's
bring back a comprehensive set of ordinances right do it for the right reasons you know this is th parking in hoboken is a zero sum game right I when we had I've I've had two conversations with OTMs. We had it originally when
they first mentioned this to us before it came to the full city council or before it was uh was put out. Um and you know I said to them, did you talk to the businesses? No, this is about double clearing double parking and safety. Did you talk to the residents? No, this is
about clearing double parking for bikes and safety. That's it. They kept saying it over and over again. I'm like, well, what about all the other stakeholders? Tiffany, you don't understand. we're going to clear the double parking. And I said, "Well, do we do we want to learn why they're double parking, what
businesses they're supporting, what we're about to disrupt, Tiffany, this is just about clearing it for the bikes." That's what they said at that time and it was super frustrating. We had another conversation just a few days ago and it was a very constructive conversation. They went through some of the statistics
that Andrew Wilson from Bike Hoboken just mentioned. I'm not exactly sure where he gets all his statistics when none of us are given them. But we went through we went through just some of the statistics on ver as measured by
you know reduction in double parking but is that the measure? Should we be measuring the amount of sales that our businesses in this area have declined? Like you know we're going to get data. What is that data? Are we measuring sales decline? Are we measuring the number of tickets given to people? the
disruption to residents that can't do drop offs, you know, are we doing any of that? That's not part of this pilot. This pilot is very specifically measuring coming out and saying we have reduced double parking by X without identifying a alternative place for
those people that need to park. The um you know, all this does is say let's pause it. Let's take the opportunity to we have a new mayor coming in. We'll have a new opport I'm happy to hear that this pilot's coming to an end. No matter what, we have a new opportunity to do
all of this, right? And all we're saying is we heard the businesses. We understand the safety improvements. But if we just pause, let the businesses be able to generate their sales through the holiday, we can get to January and actually implement something that makes sense for all of the stakeholders. One
last thing, and this is to Jim Vance. So the one thing that has been missing from the conversation since we did the redo of Washington Street is there has never been a conversation with the businesses. The reason why we started the Hoboken
Business Alliance was because of how disruptive the construction of Washington Street was and how the businesses felt dejected and not considered in anything that happens. That was why we tried to put an advocacy group together for our businesses and
commercial property owners when that was buil at that time. There was no discussion with the businesses. We could have had a better outcome had we just taken a more comprehensive view instead of a single sole goal which is to accommodate bikes on Washington Street.
We need to think about all the stakeholders. I hope everyone supports this tonight. >> Um can I mention one thing? The only other thing I would add to all this is that, you know, from December 22nd to December 31st, you could probably land
at 747 on Washington Street. There's there's not a lot of activity poking clears out. Um, so I guess if we're all concerned about collecting data, we're really only looking at a few weeks here um of the moratorum where you would miss
collecting. And I think, you know, Tiffany, you and I were privileged enough to see some of the preliminary stats from automotives and I was very impressed with some of the things they said they can do and improvements that could be made with loading zones and
smart loading zones and using the curve in a way that increases turnover that allows people to, you know, run into the to the pet store and pick up a 40 lb bag of dog food, which I can't put on my
bike and ride home. So, um, you know, I guess I'm just saying that I don't feel that the moratorum is in any way going to change the outcome of what we would be doing with this system because I
think it it's generally agreed that a lot of positive things can come out of it. >> Yeah, exactly. >> Thank you. >> Councilman President Zano, did you ask? Yeah. I So, Councilman Cohen said that uh he was talking about in the middle of the street getting in a bus. Well, I can
tell you every day I pick my son up at school and get off on Second in Washington or get off on fourth in Washington. And I have to go out of the bus first because I have to protect my son from getting hit from a bike. And this goes into the conversation about
responsibility and accountability. And so you as an adult getting out of a car in the middle of the street, the bus has stopped all the traffic around you. But >> for me, I have to walk outside and protect my son from getting hit on a bike cuz he's not looking for a bike
coming down the way. So I just wanted to address that one. Uh it's pretty simple. I think Councilwoman Fischer said it pretty clear. We lied to. I called up director Sharp in his private career now and asked him the questions and he told
me I was going to make a presentation to you. We told you that we were going to give you the data. We didn't get the data. If we would have got the data, we'd be having a better conversation right now. It's pretty simple. It's accountability. It's transparency. That's all we asked for. Instead, we've
had some things where people have double down on doubled down on it. I got pieces of information. and I asked about 20 questions and I think they're still getting me a lot of the answers um to see this data, but I I guess um Andrew might see data that we don't uh even
though I've asked the administration to see it. >> So um again, if you believe what's always on a nixel, I saw some different data when I looked at the data that they gave me. So it's all subjective. So at the end of the
day, what we were asking for, none of us has said because we all voted for it because we listened to them and we said it was a good idea. And I remember when I sat on the transportation committee, let's look at it. But we were told it was loading zones. And right now things
have changed for businesses. >> Tariffs have hit them substantially. Delivery costs have hit them substantially. Box trucks are not being used anymore. 18-wheelers are being used because it's more efficient because the cost of tires, gas, insurance, you name
it. So now you see more 18 wheelers on Washington Street. Our loading zones can't even put them in there. We had a deal with Amazon that Amazon was clogging up a loading zone all day long, creating double parking. So we've looked at several things that
happened. Things have changed. I mean, if we're really talking about that there's not enough parking in Washington Street, then let's clear the parklets out. Get them all out. We'll fix the We'll fix that. We'll fix a couple problems there. But if we're going to do that, we should have looked at things like that. We should have looked at
expanding the size of the loading zones or decreasing the bus stops. The buses do not pull into the bus stops. The buses do not pull into the bus stops. I don't know how many times I have to say this. They do not pull in. Period. Car
or no car. And they are actually a traffic calming obstacle. So guess what? They stop and the traffic is calmed. And if you want to get to Washington Street down to 8th Street in 8 minutes in in in 2 minutes, then speed up the light speed, the cycle of the lights. But at
the end of the day, in the beginning of this, there was no economic study done as a part of this. There was nothing done for the businesses. And I trust the business's bottom line over I do what the administration says is while I don't agree with them all the time, I was
willing to work on this. But when I have a business come and saying and anybody that says, "Oh, that's garbage." That's their bottom line. If you walk up and down the first ward, it's a ghost town. All on the west side of the street, it's empty from second down. Traffic is not
existent. So, everybody can enjoy riding on Washington Street. I'm happy and it's safe and all that other fun stuff, but I don't have traffic. If there's no traffic, these businesses are not making money. And I don't see bikers pulling over and jumping in and spending money
in those businesses because they're down. One one the general store said she makes 18% of her business of the year in December. In December she has a balloon business that she picked up cuz she could subsidize things and people run in
and run out. Try to get 60 balloons in the car. She said, "Now all we're doing is asking for that. We we're the one town that doesn't in Hudson County that actually doesn't give a holiday season parking pass. We give
four hours. Our parking garages are packed. I live across from one. It's full at 9:30 in the morning. So, where can people go park? They can't. To to Haney's comment about the Ballard, same thing. I mean, I'm not we're not asking for every single one be removed,
but we got to do something. We can't just institute laws like this or ideas like this or pilots like this when we don't solve for all the other things. The first ward is very different from every other ward. We are a war zone for
all the quality of life issues and everybody seems to forget that. Not once did somebody come and talk to me, hey, we're going to do this. I've got all the fast food up from first to third, right? All the delivery drivers, by the way, all our immigrant delivery
drivers, majority of them are picking up food. So, we're hurting their ability to make money. My businesses have said they cannot get delivery drivers to come in and pick up food. I've got Imperion who struggled because
we took away their ability for their drivers to pick up their orders because the majority of their orders were going out of town. and Uber drivers and lift drivers would come in and pick it up on a side gig and they had nowhere to park their car to pick it up. So when Imperion was struggling with
50%. That's right out of the the business owner's mouth. That's why he tried to go look and he's opened up in the old bird spot. So he's trying to make ends meet. He's going to be stuck with no parking and no delivery up here at the path station for construction. So there is an
aspect of parking that keeps these businesses alive. We were asking and simply asking and I'm still asking for the information that I've seen already. It it I don't know where you're looking at the numbers that what the what the mayor's putting out, but the numbers that I saw were very
different. And the numbers were put out that maybe that the number of uh in the first month there was a bunch of tickets and then there was like a little bit of tickets. And by the way, the number of tickets in the loading zone of over 15 minutes was
very it was 100 in the data that I got. So I was still asking for more data. I asked for if these cameras can do everything, tell me the number of bikes that are going in an hour. I can tell you delivery bikes are up 50% since 2022. The
recreational bike or the user of the city bike is flat per hour. So listen, I'm going help everybody. But at the end of the day, when my businesses are crying or they're screaming or they're complaining, I got to listen to them because I don't
need all of Washington Street ghost like a ghost town. So, I'm asking just till January to the new administration when when council uh or when uh mayor elect Jabbor comes in that we can have a conversation on how
we can make sure that the businesses in the first ward are included in this conversation and not just forcefed that we're going to do this because it's not only about cars, it's about deliveries, too. It's very difficult to get deliveries in Hoboken.
you get charged extra and any fines that that delivery truck has to drop things off, it gets passed right on to the the business owner. So, this is about businesses as well. And we didn't do any part of an economic study in this. So, we're just asking in the busiest part of the season, take a pause. That's it.
It's about the businesses. It's about my Washington Street. It's about your Washington Street. And we need to think about how we keep those businesses open. >> Mr. Fina, call the vote. >> Mr. Con? >> No. >> I got it. >> M. Fisher.
>> Yes. >> Mrs. >> Yes. >> Mrs. Jabor. >> No. >> President. >> Yes. >> Excuse me? >> Yes. >> Mr. Cano. >> No. >> Mr. Ramos.
>> Hi. >> Mr. Russo. >> Hi. >> President Doyle. >> No. Okay. Yeah. >> So, hearing on an ordinance of the city of Hoboken and the county of Hudson, state of New Jersey, amending and
supplementing the city code chapter 65A entitled affordable housing. Uh, Manuel Rivera Solair. >> All right, Manny. Okay. No other members of the public. >> Motion to close public portion. Second.
>> All those in favor? I >> I >> Mr. Fina, please call the vote. >> Mr. Con. >> Hi. >> Fisher. >> Yes. >> Mrs. Imus. >> Yes. >> Mr. Jabore. >> Yes. >> President Zano. >> Hi. >> Mr. Canero. >> Hi. >> Mr. Ramos.
>> Hi. >> Mr. Russo. >> Hi. >> President Doyle. >> I. Ordinance hearing on an ordinance chapter 190-11 entitled loading zones to add loading zone to Jackson Street between Observer Highway and North
Street. >> No members of the public or second public portion. >> Second. >> All those in favor? >> I. >> Mr. Fina, please call the vote. >> Mr. Con. >> Hi. >> Fisher. >> Yes. >> Mrs.
>> Yes. >> Mr. Jabore. >> Yes. President. >> Hi, >> Mr. Cano. Hi, >> Mr. Ramos. Hi, >> Mr. Russo. >> Hi, >> President Doyle. >> I >> resolutions. >> Public comments on resolutions.
Uh, Manuel Rivera Soler. Thank you, Council President. Uh, Council President, I'm going to say some expressions first before uh I give you the agenda, consent agenda. If I don't have time, it'll be okay. Um, but I
would like to um mention I feel like I'm too high. I would like to mention um the petition and proclamation that was done uh for >> a beloved member of the community. So I
would just like to um say these words in case I don't have enough time but this is for the proclamation which is in the agenda. So I don't think I'm breaking any rules but anyway >> but this this is not a resolution. >> I know it's not a resolution but it's in the agenda. This is beneath the consent
agenda. Is that correct? That's incorrect. >> Pardon? Well, >> either way, >> go ahead, Manny. Merry Christmas. >> I appreciate that. Oh, wow. Christmas came early. >> Established a merry Christmas tonight, man. >> Thank you, sir. Uh, council president, it it's just brief. I don't think it'll
take anything away from any member of the public if I am the last member and the only member of the public there. So, I do appreciate the Christmas gift. Thank you, sir, for your generosity and thank the council. So, I would like to say my words here tonight are heartfelt. I would like to add myself to the
petition or to the proclamation because it wasn't done here or I didn't see it or else I would have said something, but I appreciate it. I would like to say to the Reverend Monsenior, Father Michael A. Andreano, I could never say his name correctly, that's why I call him father.
Um, I would like to wish father the most kindest person you could ever have in our community. His faith, the way he shares his faith with us with with the Catholic community and Hoboken in general. He is a blessing and a
treasure for the community of Hoboken, a son of Hoboken. uh know him and I just want to say to him that we will never forget all of the memories and all of the uh help he's given to the
public and he's given to the community especially I as a Catholic and him being uh a father who I I speak to. I would like to say thank you to him and I would like to say thank you to those of you who uh gave him this proclamation, the
honorable mayor and everyone else. Thank you, Council President. Now, Council President, again, I appreciate uh you giving me the time now since I do have the extra time uh to say consent agenda. You know, Cresident, in all due faith, since you uh gave me a Christmas gift, I
will give you a return Christmas gift. I will not speak any further on the consent agenda because I know that you will do your due diligence and you will vote appropriately for uh the community. Thank you, Council President. Now, you're back. >> Okay. Thank you. Thank you, Manny.
>> No other members of the public have signed a close portion. >> Second. >> All those in favor? >> I >> I. >> So, polling from the consent agenda. >> A1, >> excuse me. >> A1
>> claims. Uh, >> A2. Okay. >> Wait, I'm not done yet. Sorry. >> CC1. Sorry. CC1. >> CC1.
>> Okay. >> Wait. Did you say wait or >> just one second? Sorry, I thought there was one more. >> All right. >> Uh T1. Did we already say T1? Sorry. >> And T3.
>> Excuse me. >> T3. >> T3. Okay. Mr. Fina. Everything other than A1, A2, CC1, T1, and T3. >> Mr. Con. >> Hi,
>> Miss Fiser. >> Yes, >> Mrs. >> Yes. >> Mr. Jabor, >> yes, >> President Zano. >> Hi, >> Mr. Cano. >> Hi, >> Mr. Ramos. >> Hi, >> Mr. Russo. >> Hi, >> President Doyle. I
so on to A1 which was uh >> a resolution approving the noise waiver request for Saturday construction at 301 Washington Street in Hoboken. Council President >> I believe >> got we can do a first but we got claims
right I pulled >> you want to okay I will do it after this >> yeah that's fine yeah just a a brief explanation for the public >> on anyone why we're doing it >> so we received a request from the
architect on behalf of the um owner and uh contractor to add the ability to do Saturday construction um at this property. Um their rationale was allowing Saturday work would potentially save approximately 3 months from the
total construction duration. Um which would revise their anticipated project completion from May of 2027 to March of 2027. >> Um and that was their rationale. So >> what what what what's the rationale for the added benefit to the community or
>> how how does this >> benefit the community by increasing the >> because it would shorten the construction duration and the associated noise with you know the project in general >> normally >> but it would add Saturday construction
so I'm not it would add Saturday construction which is a trade-off for the duration of the project >> right and and normally when we do these I mean it's usually for like a public project or it's this is a private project. This is nothing to do with ACNG, water replacement lines, sewage
lines, nothing like that. Right. >> This solely their request. We are simply passing their requests along to you for your review and consideration. >> I would ask my council colleagues to vote this down today. >> You going to talk about >> Okay. Council President.
>> Yes, please. Um, while the developer has been very re uh uh responsive when we've had complaints, I will say that. So, I can't say anything bad. I've had massive issues with my residents on
Court Street with this. Uh, one, I think the administration should have reached out to the councilman so I could go ask those neighbors that are directly impacted by this because they've had their buildings shaking. They've had stuff fall off their shelves. I've sent you guys that stuff. They have again
that a graphic email I sent you the other day, which I'm sorry I sent it, but they sent it to me that they don't have lighting in the back now cuz they used to have the light in the parking lot that helped keep that area lit and it's being used as a bathroom now. Um hopefully the developer and maybe that
this is if you communicated with me, I could say, "Hey, they're going to put lights in if we can maybe work on maybe Saturdays." So, so I think before we do anything, especially for a private project where my neighbors have already been dealing with issues that one, the administration should have reached out
to me. >> You have the right to pull it >> and then uh go from that. I mean, I'm I'm asking that I mean, >> you have the right to pull it because it's in your ward. >> Okay, we're council rules allow the word uh to pull it >> that the one time just speak and let me
go let me speak to the neighbors over there. I know the answer is going to come back and it's going to be no. they're not going to be happy. But I will go and talk to everybody on Court Street um and send them emails to let them know that this is what the city would like to do or the the the builder would like to do so I can get you some information back.
>> For what it's worth, I mean I'm comfortable voting no if you know I mean based on what Councilman Russo said. I mean if you want to go and talk to the neighbors you could do that but >> I mean if you guys are willing to join me in voting no. I would actually rather have fall but talk to the neighbors. >> No, I'm serious. >> I mean, the neighbors might say, "We
don't want this all summer." >> Yeah, they might want it. This will shave off three months. They might want >> Listen, I just went through it on Madison Street. It was like disastrous. Every waking moment they had construction. >> You know, our our weekends are precious, especially if you have little kids. So,
>> I I don't think it's something we should do, but by all means, go speak to whoever you need. Yeah. And I think we often um defer to the council person anyway um on the noise waiverss or things like this. >> I'm going to tell you they're going to probably come back upset. I'm just But I mean I'd be willing if you guys give me
the time the next meeting I will go and speak >> take it on. This is an instance where obviously someone who lives the other side of town will not be impacted. So it is >> if if they want it. >> Yeah. Okay. Uh and and I will reach out to you and you can give me the details
of how much is cut down, what they would >> All right. >> Yes. And just an update, um they did reach out to PSNG to install temporary lighting in Court Street. >> They're going to put that this afternoon. Thank you very much. >> But it's in the warehouse. It says how many months it's reduced if if they went to >> Yeah. I just want to make sure that I've
got before I go to that door and they ask a question. I don't know. But I'll take that offline. Thank you. Thank you, Councilman. >> Okay. Uh A2. Oh, claims I'm sorry. Yes, you had a question. >> So, uh 2401513,
the clear cameras, the automotus one. I don't know. It's like 13,000. So, I have a quick question on that. And again, maybe it's procedure. Maybe I don't know. Has that check already been cut or is it cut after we approve the claims?
>> Are we talking to the director? >> Uh, sorry. to I guess I I don't know BA or or to uh uh director Frank. >> Well, I mean they don't get paid until after claims >> if that's your question. >> So it doesn't have Okay. So if we voted no on this, what happens?
>> We'll be in breach of contract. >> Well, I'm sorry. >> This is what we pay them. >> I think we've determined in the past that >> is require council. >> Oh, no. Claims don't require just for your knowledge. >> Your knowledge. >> Just for our knowledge. Yeah. >> Okay. Kind of.
>> You've already approved them through all the other resolutions and contracts and whatnot. >> So, we don't vote on we don't vote on claims. >> If I could just interject, if I if I understand it correctly, I think they're paid already and I think the claims come
before us after a PO has been issued and paid. >> The PO has been issued but not paid. We actually send out the payment following the claims list. But, but regardless, it's for >> services have been >> presentation not for >> Yeah. But we don't we don't our vote means nothing. It's already
>> Well, we could it would be a breach of contract if they do something and we don't pay them after we've signed a contract for them to do. >> That's my one question. >> A lot a lot of times we've we've held a claim we don't know and held a claim and then it usually comes back in in another form or something like that. But
>> CC1 or Taylor stuff might bring up that conversation coming up. >> Um okay. Are you satisfied? Yeah, I'm counciloman I miss. Did you have any questions on claims? >> Okay. >> All right. >> So,
>> A2 got a vote on A1. >> Oh, no. We're not. We We weren't carrying it. >> All right. Sorry. >> I'm sorry. And I thought we Did we vote on claims? I thought we Oh, you took it out of consent. Okay. Well, >> call a vote on claims. Mr.
>> On the claims, Mr. Con. I >> Fiser. >> Yes. Council >> Dus. Yes, >> Mrs. Jabore. >> Yes, >> President Zano. >> Hi, >> He said I >> I >> Mr. Cano, >> I >> Mr. Ramos, >> Mr. Russo.
>> I, >> President Doyle. >> I A2 resolution approving a community host agreement with Karma Dispensary LLC. I believe this was >> me.
>> Councilman Fischer. Has anything changed since the last meeting? >> No. >> So, it just got >> We should carry it. >> We should carry it again. Yeah. All right. We'll carry it again if that's okay with you. >> So, yeah, I'm the sponsor. I'm fine with carrying it again. >> Okay. A2 is carried. Mr. Fina, >> Mr. Con?
>> No, no, it's carried. >> Carried. Okay. >> Yeah, we don't. By the way, I'm not >> uh CC1, which is a resolution >> agreement with Stevens hyphen reciprocal
facilities usage agreement. >> Yeah, >> that's me. >> Uh, Councilwoman Fischer. >> Yeah. The uh I read through the agreement. I guess the the only question I have is is it
the same as what we have or has it changed somehow with um what we had previously? >> No, it's the same. >> Okay, thanks. That's it. It was a lot of words. >> Okay, Mr. Fina, can you call the vote
for CC1? >> Mr. Con? >> I. >> Miss Fischer, >> yes. >> Mrs. Imus, >> yes. >> Mrs. Yabore, >> yes. President Xano. >> Hi, >> Mr. Cano. >> Hi, >> Mr. Ramos. >> Hi, >> Mr. Russo.
>> Hi, >> President Doyle. >> Hi. T1, which is uh a resolution to award no cost nonfair and open contract to Walker Construction
for completion of 916 garden rehabilitation support. Councilman Fischer. Yeah, this is one I just think it's worth having a description for the public. If you could describe like what this is and timing
and etc. It's a it's such an important topic that I think it's helpful. >> 916 garden. It's the elev. >> That's what we're asking. >> He's going to tell us if we let him speak.
>> Okay, great. So 916. >> This is for Mary, not the rest of the public. just for Mary. >> Of course. Of course. I'm going to face the the council though. Um so 916 Garden is a very specialized garage and so Walker Consultants has been brought on to help um with some of that specialty
um engineering costbenefit analysis work and um they their contract has expired. They still have money left in their contract and um we're looking to finalize the RFP by the end of the year, early next year for this. And so this contract extension would get us through
that process and and help with some of the the more technical work that's going on. >> Awesome. Thank you. I get asked about this all the time. So I appreciate it. >> Okay. Mr. Fina T1, please call the vote. >> Mr. Con.
>> Hi. >> Miss Fischer. >> Yes. >> Mrs. Imus. >> Yes. >> Mrs. Jabore. >> Yes. >> President. >> Hi. >> Mr. Cano. >> Hi. >> Mr. Mr. Ramos. >> Hi, >> Mr. Russo. >> Hi, >> President Doyle. >> I
T3 is a resolution authorizing the city of Hoboken to submit an application to the New Jersey Transportation Planning Authorities FY Fiscal year 2026 complete streets technical assistance program.
>> It's me, >> Councilwoman Fischer. Uh, I I guess um I just want to have a better sense of I I I think I know what this is, which is just being able to get resources from the state. Um it looks like it's to update our bike master plan
and green circuit which I'm generally in agreement um of but I I guess I I want to understand like what's happening and how how this uh is going to filter through the community like what does that
actually look like and um and what's the plan around doing a new plan? Yes. So, the new the North Jersey Transportation Planning Authority, which is our local NO, um offers a technical assistance program. So, this wouldn't be any
funding that the city would receive. It would be uh the grant would be in extra capacity technical support. Uh and then the scope of that project would if we're awarded would be written as part of the the award for that. So, there's currently no we we we planning to do obviously we would do community
engagement. Um we would look at you know certain number of community meetings surveys um to better learn you know where residents think that the bikeway network should go and the green circuit which has you know multiple development projects are underway but then there's some gaps in the green circuit. So this
plan would help address that and potentially um other deficiencies in the in the bikeway network that we have since the plan was last updated in 2010. >> Okay. >> Can you tell us what an MDO is? >> MO metropolitan planning organization. Okay. MP.
>> Yeah, I think it >> Thank you. >> I one other question, director. Um, >> I'm always skeptical in the transportation department because of what your predecessor has told us. And so, you said there's a couple meetings, you're going to tell us things, we're
going to do all this. I I just what I heard you say was you're going to come to once there's meetings, you're going to come to us, talk to us, give us the feedback, tell us what's going on before we make any type of decisions. Is that correct? >> Yeah. I think I was talking more about public meetings, but before >> but not the city council. So, you're
saying you don't want to talk to the city council, only the public? No. >> Which has been the way it's been for 8 years? >> That's my question because >> I think if the council wants to hear from us, we'll we'll we'll present to the council. Well, I would request that when you get whenever we get the data in the public meetings before we make any
moves that it comes back to the council and we can talk here >> and you actually get the council feedback as opposed to excluding the council from the process which has always been the case. >> Okay. All right. Thank you. back to 1835 always >> that for I've been on for 10 years and
when Mayor Zimmer said that the city council cannot be part of the master plan process. >> Okay, Mr. >> It's been since then. >> Mr. Lore, please call the vote >> on T3. >> Councilman Cohen, >> I. >> Councilwoman Fischer, >> yes.
>> Councilwoman Imus, >> yes. >> Councilwoman Jabor, >> yes. >> Councilman Preszano, >> I. >> Councilman Cano, >> I. Councilman Ramos. >> Hi. >> Councilman Russo. >> Hi. >> Council President Doyle. >> I public portion. >> Public portion.
>> Uh Jeremy Mola. >> Did you know that? >> Not this time. It's my daughter's >> that your timer. >> Okay. All right. Uh, I debated wearing white today. The darker colors take the pounds off camera, but it's the week after
Thanksgiving. I ate a lot and let's be honest, I'm not hiding anything. Um, three things I want to talk about here. Uh, I'll start by acknowledging uh, everybody here. Um, J MCola from the third ward. I'm going to talk about the Grand Street protected bike lane, the impact of
polling stations in public schools, and some straightforward time permitting budget revenue ideas. Uh so, first, the protected bike lanes. I've been out there with Pat Waiters uh for an hour last week talking to all the neighbors uh in my vicinity of Grand. Uh so, I got a couple of neighbors that live in two
four-unit buildings. They have tandem parking and they used to rely on the double wide street in order to shuffle their cars around to get in and out. Uh, and so they lost that with the pilot and they were kind of stuck in their garages for a while, but they were exchanging emails. I sent them over to Greg Franchesy, which I'm not pronouncing his
name right. Um, and they got a space outside these two properties, uh, and they got some yellow striping in recently this week, uh, which is now allowing them to use their garage. Uh, so kudos to the city for working something out for the benefit of those eight units. Um, additionally, I think this that spot can probably now double
as a temporary parking or loading zone. There's not a sign. Um, but there could be uh Amazon is still using Grand Street. There was an October email thread with the city that said they were going to be restricted from parking outside 15 church towers. Um, my neighbor, she's going to speak in a little bit, Megan, uh, saw them outside
and noticed they were still down there a few weeks. So, we followed up with the city on that. Uh, and I think Greg got back to me. I did not have time to read his response. Um, and lastly, uh, this upset some people on Twitter, but America is a car dependent. Uh, sorry. America's car
dependency is an epidemic and so that's why I think we're struggling. Oh, these are out of order. That's why. Safety imperative. Okay. I've been teaching the kids to look both ways when crossing and now we look an extra way for the bike lane. So, that's we've been adjusting to that. But, a recap on the head-on bike collision. That's why I was out there at Pat Waiters last week. Uh, so I don't
think that was the bike lane's fault. I read the Nix alert. I know Paul doesn't trust all the Nixl data. So, I got down there and I interviewed some people. Uh, one guy who said the lights, the only lights he saw were the lobby lights. So, the bike lights presumably did not have their lights on. This happened at night, so that was a problem. Uh, but one bike
came up Fifth Street and then salmoned uh made a left. So, they disregarded the painted lines that are supposed to go to the right in that little uh area that you're supposed to merge into. Uh, and then ended up, I guess, coming across. So, it was a perpendicular crash, which I think not a lot of people uh I originally didn't uh realize that. Uh,
and then the EMTs, they rode right down the sidewalk. And that's the photo everybody saw. So, everybody thought maybe the streets were blocked. Why are the MTs on the sidewalk? Sometimes they like to ride on the sidewalk. Um, but that was the quickest way where the accident was, uh, having spoke to an EMT off the record there. Um, so I don't
think that the bike lane had anything to do with that. I am concerned about the painting and the markings are still not done. Um, so people are still um, there's arrows that are half painted. I don't know when they're going to come back. I talked to the striping company. Uh, and I think Greg told me like they're going to have to wait till spring to do the textured cover. Uh, so
maybe that's why the ribbon cutting was postponed. Uh but I don't think these streets uh width is really a problem here. If we consider Willow A, that is actually a critical point for the hospital public transport and that's super narrow. Uh so when people ask me why Grand Street um well it's not used by the HOP uh it's cut off by Columbus
Park. So the only other street that kind of gets that treatment in Midtown is Park A. Uh so I don't know if that was also considered as a test bed. I think the difference there is you'd actually have to eliminate parking. Uh that sounds pretty cool. I'm not saying we should do it, but I'd be lying if I said I wasn't curious what the data would be if we did eliminate parking on one whole
side of the park after that. Uh impact of polling stations, public schools, uh runoff election required, voting machines in schools about the usual day off, challenges with security and space for student programs. So, Demerest I saw had trailers outside. Uh this seems like it would sprung on brand. I didn't get a response from the school staff I spoke to. I was curious how much heads up they
had. Uh they said this is basically from the clerk's uh either the city or the county clerk decided uh when to use schools with this. So, it is a security issue for them. It affected some of the school programming for the the kids had to be uh sequestered somewhere else. Um,
and so hopefully I'll follow up with them and uh maybe that's something I talked to Jerry about over coffee. Uh, simple revenue ideas for the city budget. Uh, I realize the budget is looming. Uh, overheard this at the Zeno. The idea of a gas tax, I don't think that's really viable. And consumption taxes. Is this the real timer? No, I still got 30 seconds. That's a bonus.
Okay. Consumption taxes disproportionately hurt the working class. Uh, so let's not do gas taxes. But these no parking signs. So I'm looking on Grand Street. Paving already done. They haven't been out in in weeks. Um, and I see these signs are up. It is a $45 per sign. We could be collecting if we don't take these things down
within 2 hours. That is section 190 12.1H. I did my homework there. Uh, maybe we're overlooking that revenue. In New York, you can report an idling vehicle and share 25% of the fine. A lot of people make $87 a pop doing that. Uh, lastly, I wanted to talk about Tyler Technologies. Uh, but if Fischer, if you
can check your DMs. Um, I wanted to comment on that. Um, proposal. We can do that offline. Uh, 8 seconds over. I yield. Back to you, Jim. >> Thank you, Jeremy.
Um, Reena Gian Casporo. Close. >> Hi, everyone. Hello. >> I um made a copy of this. >> Sure. Thank you. >> Hi, my name is Reena Jan Caspro. I live
in Hoboken 75 years. I love Hoboken. I do not love all the different things that have occurred here with regard to overdevelopment and the way the streets are being handled and the bicyclist. I know it's a
major issue. However, they do not they're not in obeyance of any bike lanes. They come out of nowhere. They come down careening around corners the opposite direction. You have to be I don't know what I like to read
this petition. I went door to door two days. Unfortunately, it was a holiday week and I couldn't get out anymore to get more signatures. I did go over the weekend. I have over 300 signatures here. It's not just Church Towers that signed it. I went up and down Grand
Street. And by the way, while I was walking along Grand Street from 8th to 3, six people on bicycles with a that new bike lane already established were in the middle of the
street. Now they serpentine and they do whatever the heck they want to do. So here's the statement. The implementation of this pilot program is a disgrace. It's sadly typical of this administration. No notice to the
residents, no community input, no thought to how this affects our neighborhood. Our safety and quality of life have been neg negatively affected. This current program makes it impossible for residents to be dropped off or picked up
safely in front of their homes. Over the years, progress has made it harder to live in Hoboken. Cities continues to build up increasingly our population while parking spots continue to be actively eliminated. Well, we understand and
respect that change is both inevitable and important. And I agree with that. Respect that change is uh we do not accept the burden being placed on the citizens and families that pay considerable taxes in this town, especially when the benefits safety are
dubious at best. The new bike lane that is now in effect present or prevents anyone from being able to stop a car to allow for dropping off an elderly loved one, packing up the family in car seats or just running basic errands. Like
Mayor Ballup clearly demonstrated when he was caught illegally parked just to get a cup of coffee. I have a picture of that also. And while more concessions are made to those on bikes who rarely have ever observed the rules of the road, those of us who still live or rely
on cars are made to suffer. What is worse is this pile program may only be the beginning of making a bad situation into an untenable one. Progress requires some sacrifice, but it does not require complete submission. We will not
tolerate the overreach any longer. If this is to be >> carried through, >> carried through to the rest of Hobok and our fellow citizens should know what is in store. We implore you to listen to the concerns of the residents and to
stop this pilot program. I myself I'm not against change. You can't change is inevitable and there's been wonderful different changes made to Hobok and the waterfront for one. I walk that dent daily. I love
it. Uh there are a lot of things, but this is so upsetting on Grand Street. My the the uh bread store across the street, the owner, I went in there with this. She was nearly in tears. She said, "I can't get my flower delivered. My
customers have stopped coming in because they always come and just drop to pick something up real quick and scoot off." Last week, uh, a Penske, a big Penske truck, had to come down Fifth Street,
make the right, and then they backed up into the post office loading zone area. So, it's just impossible. On top of which, the the beeps, the horns beeping because the traffic gets backed up down to the Acme
parking lot. It's absurd. It's absolutely absurd. Who designed this? Somebody in a computer designed this thing and they have no understanding of what it's like to live in Hoboken. This town was the most highly populated town in the world to in
World War II. And it's berserk now what's going on. And a lot of it more common sense has to be put into things in my opinion. And that's really all I have to say. >> Thank you for listening. >> Thank you very much.
Thank you for the petition signatures. Um Jim Vance. Good evening again, council. I'm Jim Vance. I'm Hoboken resident. First of all, I want to congratulate those who won and thank very much those who ran.
um things don't work in a democracy if we don't have elections and and it was a lot of really hard work and a lot of money people spent and putting yourself on the land offers the opportunity to be
rejected and that's not easy for any of us. So thank all of you very much. U second of all um there's a lot of anger in this town. Um there's a lot of love in this town.
There's a a lot of friends in this town. But I think there's a residual anger uh that is caused some poison in this council on elsewhere and it's a a guy named Robbie
Baba. Um I appreciate the anger. I'm angrier than most people, but this guy is gone. And it's time for all of us to let him go because there's so much that needs to
be done together now. And we just can't let that sty us. We can't load it on well you were volley or you did that or just forget about it guys. Life's too short. Um
with regard to that issue participating involving the city council feels left out. Well, let me tell you, there are a lot of us out there that feel left out. You guys have committee meetings and make all sorts of decisions and none of us have any idea
what's happening. So, let's get more people engaged, but let's do it a lot quicker. You know, don't operate on hobo from time. Operate like you're a business and get things done. Now, with regard to Grand Street, I know it's
difficult. Change is difficult. Um, oh, it's not safe. Oh, the ambulance can't get down Australia. This design was sought out and is done and is done all over the country and it works. There are there lots of garages on both sides of
the street that when the ambulance comes down the street, car can pull over. I got some pictures of it. Uh the other thing about Cran Street is that it's a pilot project and hopefully I hope under Mayor Jabbor that a lot of
information comes back and and is worked through so that we have a clear understanding what it does and doesn't do. And I've also got a video that somebody took of a of a kid riding a bicycle, probably eight, seven years
old, riding a bicycle down that lane, comfortable, happy, free range. His mom or dad's behind him with the camera. That's how you they got the picture. But this kid's going to get comfortable on the street. He wouldn't have been out
there if this street still was what it was with a bike lane on the side. It just won't happen. Everybody is scared. Whole lot of people tell me they're scared to ride bikes. Well, this this bike protected bike lane will help
people not be scared and it will get more people on bikes, which means less congestion. Everybody loves the car. Well, watch them sit around for hours trying to go anywhere. This bike lane doesn't stop that. So, thanks very much. Good luck to everybody.
>> Thank you, Mr. Mr. Vance. Uh, Mary Andrea. >> Am I the last speaker? >> No, you're not, Miss Andrea. Mary and Dreco 159 Street. First of all,
congratulations to the winners, to our new mayor. Hopefully, you got what you wanted. Um, I'm actually here because I probably I will not be here on the next one and I'm going to devote a little bit of this
time to you, Mr. Doyle. um you will be exiting and I wanted to say a few words. I've had a lot of contentious problems with this council through the years and
I've been here too many times. Um I personally think you've made the best council president. You are >> you have another speak. You have been
decent to me. We haven't always agreed, but you have never faulted me for that. You've kept your emotions in check. You've behaved like a grown man, a grown
person, >> and that has been really appreciated by me. I wish more of this council through the years had been like you. I think you've been the smartest guy on here because
you hold your own and you know what you're talking about. But that doesn't mean people agree with you. But I always gave you the benefit of the doubt and I appreciate the fact that I was
experiencing you. I know I'm embarrassing you, but that's what people can do up here. I want to thank you for your service. I would have never done it. I know Leah's in seventh heaven now and I'm happy for
her. >> I'm happy for her. I've heard many of times I never see him. I never see him. Well, she can see you now. I hope that and you have been partaking in this city all the years I've been here. I think I've been here one year longer than you.
Okay. The next thing is, and I'm very grateful. You have always been good to me. You've said hello to me on your bike, even though I have this contentious war with bikers. But I am grateful for your friendship. All right. The other thing I want to say is this is
very important. We have a 19 give or take million dollar debt. Taxes will have to go up. There's just no way around it. It's going to be massive. Everyone's going to have to
pay. It's going to happen. 10%, 12%, whatever. Get over it, folks. Anybody listening out here, get over it. Renters, everybody but children, you're going to pay. I get it. I can't fight
it. But I want to say this. I did not ask for million-dollar parks. I did not ask for ballards or the bumpouts or the Washington Street crap. I didn't ask for a lot of stuff. And how
many times I've heard people in politics say, "You want all these things, but you got to pay for it." You know what I want? and I'm never going to get it. And half a town laundromat.
And I'm saying this publicly because as of 2017, I lost the Bloomfield lundererette. So I went to Willow and then it closed on June 11th, 2021 or 21 or 22.
And it has been hard for me because I don't have a freaking car. And I'll tell you, Sudsy Laundromat or whatever that's had this sign on there for a long time on Willow and Seventh, I just found out
they were wanting to open a laundromat for HOAs, homeowner associations. The class system is finally complete. Tenants need to do laundry, too.
If anything, I've learned in this town. There is a definite class system. But I thank you for treating me as an equal. Thank you. >> Thank you, Mary.
>> You went over 10 seconds, Mary. Um, Manuel Rivera Soler. Thank you, Council President Manuel Rivera Soler. Uh I as well was going to uh uh like they say in espanol give you
your lauros your uh you know laurels uh because I I'm not sure again as well I don't know if you have one more meeting or two more meetings but perhaps the next meeting might be a little difficult but again as um MaryO said you at least
my opinion are one of the top uh tier um council presidents. I have to I can't give you the the the number one spot because that in my heart belongs to uh Jenjiino but you are very close sir and you are a gentleman when you are um in
your role and you do listen to members of the public uh you are stern sometimes but that is what some uh some of the qualities that it takes to do the job. You can't be uh always uh uh letting everything uh slide by. So with that I
say thank you so much sir for your service. Uh it is appreciated even though sometimes uh people don't show it all the time but thank you and everyone who serves. Uh you are all public servants and again people not all the time are going to see eye to eye but uh
respect and uh is always important to have between uh human beings and fellow residents. So thank you. Um I'm going to proceed with um uh a few things. Um again, Council President, um it's very important for everyone to know that uh
elections always uh bring out the best or the worst of us. Sometimes it is a a battlefield almost and it it it hurts when people um neighbors and others and sometimes say harsh things to each other in in the heat of the moment. And you
know, I don't want to use in the heat of of war because it isn't it shouldn't be a war. It should just be a a contest. who presents um the best um to the people their their their concerns that is the person who's going to win or at
least the person who convinced the uh greater number of people. So, with that, I'm going to uh say the congratulations. Of course, as everyone has said this evening, um to as they could say, we can use I looked it up. We can use Madame
Mayor Elect Emily Jabbor or Mayor Elect Emily Jabor. We would like to thank you. Thank you for running. Thank you for um being of service to the people. Again, I wish you and your family all the best in this new beginnings, in this chapter
that you are taking uh pretty soon. I am also hopeful that you bring unity and fresh beginnings to our city. The promises that were made in the campaign uh trail should be given serious
consideration to fulfill. We here constituents now put our eyes to you as our new leader as a person would who we hope is a uniter and a person who is accessible as all great leaders should.
So thank you once again and congratulations. Congratulations to the other winners uh in the council at large and again a great thank you to the everyone who ran who ran in the runoff who ran before that. Uh it again it's democracy. It's not pretty. Sometimes
it's rough, but it's the best we have and we should preserve it at all cost. So, also, Council President, I would like to say, of course, you all know today is December 3rd, 2025.
And on December 3rd, 1925, Maria Dolores Soler Lopez was born in Puerto Rico. That is my mother. She is now residing
in heaven and I wish her a happy heavenly birthday. I know that that is a personal thing. Members of the public don't need to concern themselves with what I am saying, but I think it's a beautiful thing to have her name forever engraved in the uh history of Hoboken.
So again, I thank you for you all for listening. and thank members of the public for their patience and their their interest in being here tonight as well, their participation. Just being here is important and I thank them as well. So with that, council president, I'm going to say as I always do, Sava
Ukraine. And by the way, council president, before I say the other part, I want to say to you, sir, I didn't mean to be disrespectful when I told you you could uh take vacation at Marop Marotop. I said it wrong, but it is pro.
Obviously, I did twofas because the city is occupied by uh hostile forces. So, don't go there. And um again, we still pray for the for the residents there. And again, I'm going to say it again,
Slava Ukrainy. Glory to Ukraine. Heram Slava, glory to the heroes. Thank you, Council President. God bless you. God bless you all. and God bless. I yield back. >> Thank you, Manny. Uh, Megan Lynn or
>> Lou, I'm sorry. Could be an N, it could be a U, could be an H. >> Yes. Hello. Thank you so much. I wanted to talk about the Grand Street pilot. I live at 501 Adam Street. I'm a board member, owner, resident, and did not get a chance to sign the petition, so
apologies. Add my name to that. I want the main concern I have is that Willow Street goes downtown one lane and so now does Grand Street. The hospital has only two one-way streets downtown and this past Saturday
there were three fire trucks blocking between Sixth and Fifth Street because obviously they needed to take care of an emergency in 15 church towers. I am highly concerned about what will happen to those who may not have access to get
to the hospital on time. There's a reason why cars pull over when there's an emergency. And right now, it was something that I brought up the second I found out about Grand Street Pilot. We didn't have any community outreach um to discuss these matters. But the second
that email came out from the from city hall, I sent a message specifically asking about the emergency services, I commented that 15 church towers frequently, if not once, twice a week, has emergency vehicles there. That is
cops, that is a fire truck. We have a loading zone, but we allow overnight parking. There is no access for if an emergency happens. And forgive me, we can't plan emergencies. I see it from my window. My window overlooks the parking
that 15 church tower. So, I'm concerned about residents. The whole spirit of this pilot was to maintain safety. And what about those that actually didn't plan and may have gotten into an accident elsewhere and need to get to the hospital? What is the city's plan
for that? Quick win. Get rid of the lo or make sure that the loading zone does not have overnight parking. That's just a quick win. But I really urge you to look at that. I recognize we want bikers to have safety. I am a biker. I did also ask the city about this about a year or
two ago. I love the fact that we are prioritizing that. But bikers are not wear required to wear helmets here in the city. They are not getting tickets for salmoning or doing anything else. Um not stopping at the stop signs. We're
not monitoring that, but we prioritized this pilot. And again, it's two streets, main busy streets with only one way down the street. I'm really concerned about those who really need access to the hospital. So, I would love to have some
answers on that at the next meeting. And that is all I have today. Thank you. >> Okay. Thank you. Uh, no other members of the public are signed up to public portion. >> Second. >> All those in favor? I >> I
>> uh on to first readings. >> Ordinance for introduction. Ordinance adopting a non distribution agreement between the city of Hoboken Heritage Village at Hoboken LLC and New
Jersey Housing and Mortgage Finance Agency. >> Mr. Fina, please call the vote. >> Mr. Con. >> Hi. >> Fisher. >> Yes. >> Immus. >> Yes. Mrs. Yabore. >> Yes. >> President Jano. >> Hi.
>> M. Cano. >> Hi. >> Mr. Ramos. >> Hi. >> Mr. Russo. >> I. >> President Doyle. >> I. >> Ordinance for introduction amending chapter 192 title parking for persons with disabilities to add general parking spaces on Adam Street between 12th
Street and 13th Street. >> Mr. Fina, please call the vote. >> Mr. Con. >> Hi. >> Mr. Fischer. >> Yes. >> M. >> Mrs. Mrs. >> Jabor, >> yes. >> President, >> I >> Mr. Cano, >> I >> Mr. Ramos, >> hi.
>> Mr. Russo >> I >> President Doyle >> I >> introduction amending chapter 190-9 entitled stop streets designated to add multi-way stop controls at the
intersection of Adam Street 11 street and Jefferson Street and 9inth street >> Mr. referenda. Please call the vote. >> Mr. Con, >> hi. >> Miss Fischer, >> Mrs. >> Yes. >> Mrs. Jabore, >> yes. >> President,
>> I >> Mr. Gero, >> I >> Mr. Ramos, >> hi. >> Mr. Russo, >> I >> President Doyle, >> I. >> Mr. Fina, please read number six now. Out of order. If >> number six. >> Number six. We'll do four and five.
>> Number six. Okay. If and if you want I can even help. Number six is a an ordinance introduced uh an ordinance to amend and supplement an ordinance establishing a schedule of classifications and allocations
of title for the herein mentioned positions in the city of Hoboken. This is number six. All right. Please call the vote. >> Mr. Con? I >> Miss Fiser. >> Yes. >> Mrs. >> Yes.
Mrs. Jabore. >> Yes. >> President Zano. >> Hi. >> Mr. Cano. >> Hi. >> Mr. Ramos. Hi. >> Mr. Russo. >> Hi. >> President Doyle. >> I. If you would just pause a moment. I Mr. uh Councilman Ramos is going to step
out. >> Ruben, I'll call you. There's a couple things, you know, in your business, but just to check with you. >> Back on number four. >> We're back to number four. >> Okay. or for inance reduction of the city of Hobok and approving the
application for a long-term tax exemption authorizing the execution of a financial agreement between the city of Hoboken and JB112 North Urban Renewal LLC.
>> Mr. Fina, please call the vote. >> Mr. Con, >> I. >> Miss Fiser, >> present. >> Mrs. >> abstain. >> Mrs. Jabore, >> yes. President Dano. >> Hi, >> Mr. Cano. >> Hi, >> Mr. Ramos. Absent. >> Mr. Russo.
>> Hi, >> President Doyle. >> I uh Mr. Fina, I believe Counciloman Fischer was present. Yeah, she said she Sorry about that. >> She did not every time. >> Okay. >> Okay. An ordinance for introduction of
the city of Hoboken approving the application for a long-term tax exemption and authorizing the execution of a financial agreement between the city of Hoboken and HWE urban renewal LLC.
>> Mr. Fina, please call the vote. >> Mr. Con? >> I. >> M. Fischer, >> present. Mrs. Imus >> abstain. >> Mr. Jabore. >> Yes. >> President >> I
>> Mr. Cano. >> Hi. >> I >> Mr. Ramos. >> Mr. Russo. >> Hi. >> President Doyle. >> Hi. >> Okay. >> Reuben back. >> Uh, he's I think Ruben was leaving. Well,
>> no, he's coming back. >> He's still >> okay. M. >> Director Brown. Yes. Thank you. >> You get Reuben. >> Let Reuben know that if he was because he was brought under litigation. >> Oh. Oh. Oh. Okay. >> Oh, he just >> There are uh three three items for new
business. Uh one of which Councilman Fischer has requested. Are you >> Yeah, we um >> to wave the estopple period. >> Yes. And we have I know we have to do it in order. One an emergency and two the actual waving of it. Um, I think Brian,
>> do we we normally combine the resolution? Whereas the city council wishes uh for an ordinance amending chapter 145 section 145-25 to come into effect immediately. And whereas in accordance with NJSA469A-181B, the council wishes to declare an emergency so that the reg regulations
contained in the ordinance may come into effect immediately now therefore be resolved by not less than 2/3 of the whole council voting affirmately in accordance with NJSA469A-181b. The city council declares an emergency in order to allow the ordinance to come to effect immediately and be further resolved in accordance with
NJSA4069A-181B. The ordinance shall be considered to have become effect immediately upon passage. Be further resolved that the city clerk and all other municipal officers are hereby authorized and directed to take all steps necessary to effectuate the purpose of this resolution. >> For Dian's purpose and maybe anyone
watching, um the esttopple period is 20 days from when the mayor signs it. basically goes into effect 20 days later. It gives the public the ability to challenge it. We don't often do that unless we feel it's an emergency, it's timesensitive, etc. We've already heard
a lot of feedback. We take it fairly seriously. You don't we don't do it. >> An opportunity to file a lawsuit to challenge. >> Right. Exactly. Right. Exactly. But since it's our own pilot, um we and since we've gotten a lot of feedback from businesses, that's why we want to
wave it. And so the mayor still has 10 days to sign it. So it still wouldn't be effective, but when he signs it to make it to start the estoppel, it it would be effective that day as opposed to 20 days later. >> Okay. Mr. Lore, would you call it?
>> Are we going to do both? Emergency resolution >> together. I think he's he put it in one resolution as is. >> You got it. All right. All together for the emergency resolution and the waving the stop period for B836. Councilman Cohen, >> no. >> Counciloman Fischer,
>> yes. >> Councilwoman Immus, >> yes. >> Councilwoman Jabbor, >> no. >> Councilman Preszano, >> hi. >> Councilman Cano, >> no. >> Councilman Ramos, >> hi. >> Councilman Russo, >> hi. >> Council President Doyle, >> no.
>> Passes. We need two/3. You need six. >> 2/3 for the W. >> And we did it. >> We need six. >> Got it. Got it. >> We need six of fails. Okay. Thank you. Um, >> what's the third item?
>> That's the first item. >> Uh, okay. >> Number two, um, >> we are going to have to have a special meeting for um the the uh >> appropriate temporary appropriation come
January 1st since the swearing in for the new council members and the mayor is the 15th. So, uh, we're proposing the 5th. It'll be virtual. It'll be 10 minutes. You know, I mean, all we're going to have is the temporary appropriation. >> January 5th
>> January 5th. The C corporation council. We c we can't do it on the 17th, which is what I was suggesting, but there will probably be some of the like the newspaper designations and things that we can do on the 17th. >> Um, or they could even go to
>> if they have to be done before the 15th. So, time >> would it be 7 p.m. on the on I mean I'm you know >> is is that going to be >> 2:00 >> is that going to be every year? I mean I thought the whole point of changing >> so the whole point of the state law
change was I don't even know why but they change it to the 15th but now we have to have a January 5th meeting anyway every year. >> I I suspect we will. Yes. So, I mean it it should just be pretty peruncter
unless unless people don't want to >> and we don't have the ability to approve in December. >> We That's what I just said. We We couldn't I suggested we do it on the 17th, >> but you have to be in the new year to to
do it. So we we we could we can't even >> we need to talk to our new assembly person to put up a new rule because that makes no sense then for us to start in January 15th if we have to have a meeting anyway. I'm I'm just saying >> it's state law. So >> no it was I know it was a recent it's a
one of those crazy state laws where they don't really think it through for >> Okay. So the time >> uh 7 o'clock is that fine with everybody on a Monday night? >> Yeah. >> Okay. Um the other thing is as we've all should have received there's been an
appeal of a zoning board approval. >> Uh Mr. Evers for it's irrelevant who it is. Um, so it's a an appeal which there's 95 days to have a hearing on it and um the the
clock starts started the 26th of November which gets you to essentially May 1st, excuse me, March 1st. >> Um, I may be off by a day or if I don't think it's leap year. Um, so, so we just
need to think about I mean under the statute and our code and the state law if we don't meet I mean if we choose consciously not to have a hearing it'll it'll be affirmed. So, not that I'm suggesting or
recommending that, but or we can have the hearing and it since it can go to March, it could be the next council body. It can be we can do it in before the 15th of January as this entity.
Um, so I may be polling people as to when they want to do it. Uh, you know, before or after. If it's after January 15th, I guess I'll miss out. You don't want to miss that. >> No, I mean I I actually, you know,
>> would would the next meeting at 6 have an hour before the regular meeting be a week? >> I think we should probably do it just a separate one, you know. I mean, well, it >> was Steve one of the >> Why don't we do this offline? >> Was Steve on?
>> Why don't we do it offline? >> Yeah, just do it. Just Why don't we just email figure out what we want to do? >> We'll we'll figure it out. Okay. But is Steve >> is was Steve voting >> all the information? >> Uh did Steve vote on whatever the appeal
is? Firestone. >> That's that's his problem. Yeah. You're asking whether he he will be he might. Yeah. No, >> I don't think I don't think C corporation council he can you know the new the uh the council elect is the chair of the >> I'm aware. I don't know the answer to
the question. It's something we'd have to research. But it but I it's more of let's assume he did because he was part of it. Then do we want to do it with a full council of nine including you or in the new year it may risk of eight or whatever.
>> Frankly it will just the only chance will be us too >> but um I'm inclined to do it before the 15th. Let's do it >> just to get it, you know, unless we decide that we've looked at the substance and we don't want to have a
hearing which will be this the same, you know, >> but again, I'm not recommending that >> the quick those notes that we got, right? You're talking about the the transpage document which was mostly there was about five or six pages of his
argument and there were resolutions from the zoning. transcripts you I asked for. They're not as tedious as the other hearing one hearing. >> Yeah, it's not that bad. I I was scrolling through it. >> Yeah, you can. Yeah, you can get through it pretty quick. So, that's that's why I
was like it's not that bad. >> Yeah. So, I I'll I'll email you all and we'll >> and see what the consensus is. Okay. Um I have nothing else. >> Close session, right? >> Uh excuse me. >> Are we supposed to do close session for the
>> Yes. Well, Counciloman Russo is >> Yeah, please. Um, as I did last night privately, I I'd like to take uh just a moment to publicly congratulate uh Councilwoman Jabbor on her victory. Um it's really important that we all
continue to try to unify the city. Uh so I'm looking forward to working with her, her administration, and the newly elected council members. I think it's really important that we we all kind of go into the new year understanding that we all love the city and I think it's
important that we make sure our residents know that we feel that way. So, I wanted to make sure I said that tonight and I really do appreciate everybody who's come out during this election, whether they voted for Councilwoman Jabbor or myself. It's time that we all really try to unite so that
we can move this city forward because I think it's time that those that felt unheard now have a voice and those who have felt that they were not seen are seen by all of us. So I appreciate that and again Councilwoman congratulations.
>> Thank you. Now back to your close session. Do you >> We could do it now. We could do it. >> Do we want to >> We could do this offline. I I don't >> We could do it before the next meeting. I don't care. We've carried it anyway. So, it's >> next meeting worked. >> Next meeting. >> Motion to close. >> So, we'll do it. >> I
>> Thank you. >> So, before next meeting, we'll have, you know, a close session for whatever. >> We Yes. Oh, sorry. >> Hi.