Excellent. Good to see you, Arie. >> Yes, same here. >> Um, I think we still have a minute. I'm going to turn off my camera. I feel like a little bit of my dinner is in my teeth. Hang on. Hopefully I'm okay. Uh, all right. We'll get just a little
bit longer so we can start at seven. >> Hey Ted, can I uh bring something up uh before we start? Um uh at the last board of appeals hearing there was a you know there was a little bit of a discussion
and John Cino who's the chair of the board of appeals and used to be the chair of uh Zach >> Mhm. >> uh you know suggested he he'd like to meet with the committee at some future meeting to discuss
possible zoning change. >> Sure. Um what I I can try to reach out to John um or you can let him know why why don't you have him email me ahead of time but sure of course anybody can come to any meeting. >> Yeah. >> Um certainly it'd be great to see John
back at the zoning advisory committee meeting. >> Yeah. I mean the issue has to do with uh I don't know if this is time to bring it up or want to wait later in the meeting. I I think if you don't go deep into it and just say what the issue has to do then >> just that the um
in various districts the permitted uses um >> to the chair you are live on hcam. >> Yeah it can wait. >> Okay. All right. Here we go with the script. Uh welcome to the February 18th
2026 meeting of the zoning advisory committee. Pursuant to chapter two of the acts of 2025, this meeting will be conducted via remote means in accordance with applicable law. This means that members of the public body as well as members of
the public may access the meeting via virtual means. Participants may access this meeting through the remote meeting link as posted on the meeting agenda and through the town's online calendar. When required by law or allowed by the chair,
persons wishing to provide public comment or otherwise participate in the meeting may do so by raising their hand or otherwise signaling their intent to speak. This meeting will be recorded. Please take care to mute your microphone
unless and until you have been recognized by the chair. We will now confirm attendance of members. Please respond with present if you are on this call. Matthew Vona >> present.
>> Ron Foy >> present. >> Arie Cohen >> present. >> Uh Quadan Quadra I think you're muted. I just would love to hear a >> sorry present.
>> There we go. Thank you. Uh I am Ted Barker Hook, chair of the zoning advisory committee and I am present. And then let's just run through some names that I don't think we're going to hear. Stephven Ki, Sravan Krishna,
Sudep mighty. I don't think I've ever pronounced Sudep's last name correctly and I'm sorry. Sudep Adams, Jacqueline Crowe, Hervy of Lani. It looks like those folks are absent and
staff Aneri Patel Hopkins principal planner. Great. >> Present. Thank you. >> Great. Great. Great. Okay. Uh we got a short agenda tonight. The first is to approve the minutes of What's the date on those minutes? >> December 2nd.
>> December 2nd. Thank you. Um I was able to read them ahead of time. Was everyone else uh everyone else have >> January 2nd. Sorry. >> January. I thought that sounded more correct. one month or another >> uh of January 2nd, 2026. Um did everyone
get a chance to read them? Does anybody have any edits or corrections? >> Then if I'd like to make a a motion to approve the minutes as submitted >> and a second. >> Second. >> Great. Still a roll call vote to approve the minutes. Matthew Vona,
>> yes. Ron Foy, >> yes. >> Arnold Cohen, >> yes. >> Quad Assan, >> yes. >> And Ted Barker Hook is a yes to make it a perfect five nothing. Okay. The main reason we're here tonight
is to continue our discussion of ADUs. Um, I have failed the committee in not being able to find the notebook I wrote our last minutes on, but it seems to me where we left off was there there. I was
certainly of the mindset, but I got a feeling a lot of the committee members were were feeling the same way that if there was to be talk of some amendments, it might be through special permitting process more than by right process. I think we were exploring ideas. Um, right
now the ADU is allowed to be 50% of the footprint. We were exploring ideas to maybe expand that. Um, I feel like we were landing maybe at 75% as a max expansion. Um, again I think by
special perm it was the feel of what I remember the majority of the members. Um, and there was also not just the size. Oh. Oh, the um right now it's allowed up
to is it 900 square f feet? There was talk of expanding that again maybe by special permit. Um, do is my memory correct? Does anyone remember any other significant where we left off? >> That seems right. And Ron, I think
you're you're invested in this one, so I'm trusting your memory on this. Um, maybe I shouldn't after that minutes thing, December, January, but I am going to trust you nonetheless. Um, so I had a couple questions as I was
driving home today and maybe Aneri, I should have written to you ahead of time, but hopefully you can feel these questions. I know that when we met last time, one of my questions was, "How do we do the wording for special permitting?" Um
what if it is is anything allowed by special permit or do you have to list what's allowed by special permit? Um or can anyone say hey I just want to go ask if you'll let me do this. But the other question I had today was when and how do
things go to ZBA? If they if there's a denial from planning board, is that automatically a ticket to take your case to the ZBA? Is there a different process to go to the board of appeals? How does that work? And if we were thinking of a
bylaw change, whether by special permit or by right, um how does ZPA factor into the writing of that bylaw? Okay. So usually I will suggest to clarify in the details if we are going to amend our current bylaw like specify
that if you need uh for example if you need 1,000 square ft ADU and we can like mention the size frontage and everything just to make sure what is going to be allowed by a special permit and that
will help that to clarify certain stuff for the planning board to review and usually um what happen if ZBA denied something then it goes to planning board for petition and if I'm not wrong it's the same case
for planning board if planning board deny the special permit then it goes to CPA for petition that I need to take a look that what's our mass general law because we don't have any specific mention in our current zoning like
Hawington zoning dialogue we have a section for any denial on CBA decision they can go to planning for petition so I don't know we have vice versa >> so to help me understand let's say that
nothing changed let's say we have the current ADU law which is max 900 square feet um let's take out the percentage of size let's say that doesn't factor If it were right now today, could I go
to the planning board and say, "I really want to build an ADU, but it doesn't make sense unless it's,00 square ft. My current home is 4,000 square feet, so it's well within that 50%. Could I go to the planning board right now or do I
have to wait until the bylaw says by special permit you could do this?" So I think you need to wait till um you I mean mentioned on your bylaw. I think somebody went to zoning board for
approval as a variance for a larger ADU but to go to planning board we need to have some kind of wording in our zoning bylaw. So in the past our old ADU bylaw as per that you allowed to go to planning board or zoning board for a
special per I mean special permit for larger ADU because we allowed 800 square ft since we adopted as by ride if you want larger we need some kind of stuff in our bylaw to go in front of planning board. So then to continue to help me
make it clear in my head, if I wanted to do my hypothetical example, I have right now no route to go to the planning board, but I could go to ZPA to ask for variance. >> Variance. Yes. >> And that doesn't have to be written into bylaws at all.
>> So it's not mentioned, but um yeah, you can go for variance, not a special permit. >> And a variance generally is is a longer, more difficult process than a special permit. Yeah. >> Okay. Um
Okay. So, that helps me kind of get straight in my head if I if I went let's say we did have language for a special permit. Um if you wanted to go above 900 square f feet. If I went to the planning board and asked for my
1100 square foot in the yard of my 4,000 ft house um and the planning board said no, we do not grant the special permit. Could I then go to ZBA for an appeal or is that a different thing because it's no longer a variance and I I got denied
something within the bylaws? >> I can check but I think uh for that I need to check our Massachusetts general law. I don't think we have that specific mention on our Border. Just give me a second.
>> Okay. And maybe I don't know if if Arie or uh Matthew as members of ZBA and planning board have an answer to that last question. Um if not we can wait for Aneri. >> Mind repeating it the question.
>> Sure. My question was if our bylaws, there's a lot of ifs, there's a lot of hypothetical in this, but I'm trying to understand the processes that a applicant might be able to go through. If we changed our bylaws to allow by
special permit larger than a 900 square foot ADU, and if I excuse me, I'm sorry. If I went to the planning board asking for my 1100 foot ADU by special permit and they denied it, could I then go to
ZBA and say planning board denied this request, but I'd like to go to you guys. Will you approve it? Does that now become a variance issue? Is it still is an appeal on a special permit? How does that work? Well,
I I don't think I can answer >> that question off the top of my head. Uh um you know, I'm wondering why I know in the on the board of appeals it seems like we've heard those >> types of things. I I'm not aware that
they went to the planning board first, but I I know Ron went I think went through the process. She might know it better than I do. Uh, is that what >> if nothing else, we're buying a nearer time. So, Ron, can you share your
experience as someone who's talked about these things? >> Um, when I was starting the process of of going above and beyond the by right, the building department told me I had to go to the board of appeals to require a
variance for a size change. So, that was that was the direction. And then all of the paperwork that I had to fill out to go through that process indicated that this is the only way that you can get a change in square footage based on the current zoning
>> currently. But that does that doesn't necessarily answer my question. If we had special permit language that was then denied by the planning board, what happens? Is there another route? >> Yeah, but >> yeah, I don't know. Yeah, >> the board of appeals
believe has, you know, we grant special permits. I didn't know. Is that Do you think it's something within the domain of the planning board? >> I I don't know. That's why I'm asking the question. >> I don't I I don't as far as I know. Uh
and and I think it generally is uh special permits are a board of appeals, but every t town is different. And uh even though I'm on the board of appeals, I uh can't uh say uh
I I think the answer is probably is that you just go to the board of appeals for a special permit, but you'd have to look at the bylaw itself. >> And Mary, have you come any closer to figuring out? >> No.
Wait a sec. Okay. It's just if we are considering suggesting a rewrite and special permit and stuff, it's helpful for me to understand the different routes that may or may not be available depending on what we write up. So it may be we have to define who
grants the special permit because I think different boards may be able to grant different permit like based on who what the bylaw says >> depending on the bylaw. Okay. >> Yeah. >> So um I just check on the state um I
mean Mass General law. Um so if planning board denied special permit for larger ADU then they cannot go to ZBA >> then that's the end of the discussion. Yeah, ZBA cannot act as a appeal code or like they cannot go for a variance and
in that sense >> they cannot. >> Yes, once like if we add uh specification in our ADU bylaw saying that if you want larger ADU you need special permit and you need to go in
front of planning board. Usually planning board uh issue special permit in this case but if some for some reason PB board decide to deny the application so applicant cannot go to ZBA board and appeal that.
>> Okay it's not like working your way up the court system until you get >> so so m Mr. chairman. Um the question for an are you are you saying that the Mass General laws say that if somebody wants to get uh a
special permit to make a larger ADU, the statute actually says that that's that's something to go to the planning board about. So usually it uh in other towns it's like that that usually for um special
like larger ADU you go to planning board for special permit even uh just like how we have um in current bylaw that if you have one ADU on your property and if you need second one you go to canning board for special permit
that's in the statute or the reg some regulations. It's not mentioned in our Massachusetts ADU one which we adopted but usually that's the process other towns and everyone adopt if you need more than one ADU you go to planning
board for special permit >> if you need larger ADU then unless until as Matthew said if we want spec we can specify that you need to go in front of >> I think it is what it is but I I'm
know that generally speaking, special permits go to the board of appeals. Not not the pling boards, but there might be variations. Uh um I'm not sure whether there's any variation in Hington. I'm not aware of
it, but generally speaking, special permits are to the uh uh board of appeals just like variances are. I'm fairly confident we have plenty of special permits that go through planning board, not >> Yeah, we definitely grant some as part of um site plans. Uh for example, we
just granted one uh so that uh >> it was a storm water thing would be would be within the the buffer zone. Um so chapter 48 section 9 though is the general answer. Zoning ordinances or bail bylaws may provide that certain classes. Special permits may be issued by one special permit granting authority
and others but by another special permit granting authority, etc., etc. So, that's >> okay. All right. So, um I wish that we had a larger committee tonight. Um but you got to be on the field to play. So, we're on
the field. Um I'm If you're comfortable, I wonder if we can go around the circle and hear what people's thoughts are. Um, if the ball were only yours to play with, what would you do with this discussion? Would you say, "I think right now I don't want to make any
changes. Let's have some more time to figure out how the state's laws will play out in Massachusetts." Would you say, "I am open for changing things by right, and here are some numbers that I would throw out to kick around." Are you in a middle ground where you're open to
maybe allowing some special permitting? what might be framework around that and then I guess would you like the special permitting to go through planning board or ZBA? So if you're comfortable offering thoughts, I think that that might be a
way to move us to a next step. Um Ron, I'm going to save you for near the end. Um because I I think you presented um and and I certainly want to hear what you have to say, but I think I also kind of have a guess at some of it. Okay. Um
maybe Matthew because your picture is biggest on my screen right now. If you're comfortable, um I'd love to hear your thoughts and we'll just work around the circle. >> That's what I get for talking last. Um I'm leaning towards the special permit.
Um in part because I don't know that we've completely worked out the plan and what its impact like the the formula and what its impact would be. The concern that we've raised in the past has been making trying to, you know, fit the context of the neighborhood, making sure
that there's a dominant uh primary uh residence versus an accessory and and that sizing. And I don't know that in my head I've got the right formula to really make this buy right right now. In
terms of who grants that, I ZBA is fine. I don't have a strong opinion right now on that. thinks is fine. >> And if we were to write up some uh without asking you for numbers, would you be open to changing the square
footage, would you also be open to or instead open to changing the percentage of the ADU compared to size of the primary residents? Would you be open to Right now I I think a second ADU is not
allowed by right. Um, would you be open to allowing that by permit? Where where are the places you'd be open to playing with numbers? >> Uh, I'm less comfortable with a secondary ADU. Um, but I I'm trying to just trying to find
the notes that we had last time we talked about this for the numbers we were throwing around. Um, the square footage I think I was find kind of increasing. Um I'm a little bit more based on the the
need to separate a primary from a accessory unit. I'm I what was the what was the proposed number that we had for the percentage? I think we had suggested increasing it. Um I I I think I'm fine increasing it. I think it was fine increasing it slightly
with what we were discussing with still capping the maximum square or increasing the square footage, still having a cap on the um percentage of the total uh total size. Um but I think I'm flexible
on both both sides as long as we can find the right numbers to make sure that we're still instilling uh a a dominant and an accessory >> uh unit. >> Okay. Thanks, Quatcha. Do you have thoughts? Do you have where would you land if this was your decision to make?
Or at least how far have you gone if it was your decision to make? I haven't gone very far but I I would I don't know enough to make a
um comment but I probably go going through that uh your first proposal like going through a special permit kind of stuff probably will make more sense to me. >> Okay. So you're you're feeling at a minimum that changing by right
allowances might be a step too far for you. >> Yeah. >> But changing with some special permitting feels better, >> right? Yeah. >> Um do you have thoughts at all on allowing a second ADU or would you want to keep that as a single ADU?
>> A single second ADU is I don't feel very comfortable. >> Okay. And I it doesn't make sense to me. I mean, at least. >> Okay. Uh Arie, what are your thoughts? >> Yeah, I probably have more questions
than answers. Um under under the statute, uh what what does the statute say? Uh does it say that the town has to bylaw and increase the amount?
We certainly can go above what the state says. That that's the whole discussion. >> Feel comfortable about that. Um >> the question is if we want to do that, would you want that to be expanded by right or would you want it to be through a special permitting process?
>> Well, I I just have a higher number that they could get to just increase the square footage that they can do it as of right. Is that what you're >> I'm asking if you are comfortable with changing the current law. The current
law as we sit here tonight is a resident may assuming setbacks work out. Um a resident may currently without asking any permission you got to get I assume building permits and stuff. You may build up to a 900 square foot residence,
no bigger. Um, or 50% of your current residence, whichever is less. So, if you had a 1,000 square foot house, you could build a 500 ft ADU. If you had a 2,000 ft house, you could build a 900 square
foot ADU by right. At the beginning of our discussion, I think the proposal was expand the square footage by right and expand the percent of the ground floor area by right.
That's where I think the initial proposal and I don't remember what the numbers were, but that was our initial proposal. What Matthew has said and what Quad has said is they might be comfortable expanding both of those numbers, but through a special permitting process, not by right.
>> Yeah. I mean I think uh passing uh you know regulations are like passing statutes or they have the effect of statutes and I think when the legislators pass statutes they have they really examine them pretty closely and have a lot of
expertise. Um uh but just in general though I think um you know having having it by a special permit if it's above uh what's allowed
by right makes the most sense. >> Okay. >> I know our board of appeals is uh I've observed is very liberal as far as uh granting people these things. >> Yeah. I would I would note. >> Yeah.
>> But we don't generally give a hard time. Except for Ron, I guess. I don't know. >> Um, awesome. Uh, Ron, where where are you landing right now? I know you proposed you gave the original proposal. Are you
sticking with it or have you adjusted? Well, I what what I would like, Ted, would be 1,200 square feet or 75% by right. >> Okay. >> But I I wouldn't really like to recommend that to the planning board
because I don't think by is is going to have a shot at being advanced by the planning board or the town. So, okay. Um, I I think if if we look at the Affordable Homes Act, the whole goal was to make more attainable housing and the
the more we restrict things, the less housing is going to get built. So, it kind of goes against the thrust of of the thing there. And if we go back to our last meeting when we talked about the average sale price of you know 1.1
million in Hopington right now and 900 square feet is the total square foot allowed by right if you take a 500 or a $400 per square foot building cost that $900 square foot ADU would be worth
$360,000 which is nowhere near half of what the average house is selling for today. So I I think in increasing by special permit allows the town to make sure that this thing fits in with the character of the
neighborhood as opposed to saying by right you know you can build whatever you want as long as it fits within the square footage. >> Okay. And is it you're in what about the second ADU on a property? Do you have a thought there? I think the current process of a second one needing a
special permit um is is already sufficient. >> Okay. >> I mean that that can all be granted and and in in this case I think the special permit through the board of appeals is the right place for it to go. >> Okay. Um and my apologies to everybody
for not knowing this off the top of my head. Is that what we currently have is a second ADU. We currently have a special permit process for that. >> Yes. >> Okay. >> So, as for our current bylaw, if you need second ADU, you need special permit
from board of um appeal and I just >> Yes. So, I just wanted to correct myself. I thought that's through planning board just like for other special permit but no it's through board of app uphill and I just cross check on
Mass General law if we mention that on our bylaw that they need special permit for larger ADU from board of appeal that we can do but we just need to clarify >> but we could make it through the planning board as well. Yes, but again
you need to mention that as well on the bylaw, >> right? Um is there a chance you can tell me where >> um in our bylaws that second ADU is? I I think I'm looking at the right pages but
>> so uh it's let me tell you it option um option D under draft article ADU it's a setback dimensional that paragraph and I number I special
pyramid I can share my screen if >> that would be great that would be helpful probably would save time for over >> I don't know if other people are scampering through their phone copy. >> Can you see my screen? >> I see it's getting ready. Whoops. It
disappeared. >> Just a Okay. Okay. Can you see now? >> Now it disappeared again. I get that screen that shows it's about to pop up and then it goes away. >> Please restart screen sharing. It's all
>> Yeah, somehow I'm okay. >> It's not allowing. >> That's okay. I I trust what you're saying. So a second ADU is allowed through special permit through ZBA right now. >> Okay. >> We about to
>> so bullet number I mentioned that >> is this under is this under maybe I'm looking at the state law CMR71 >> that's state that's state >> I don't have I don't have our darn it.
All right. That's why I can't find it or I couldn't find I I couldn't find any of it. Okay. Um so here are my thoughts. My thoughts are these. Um as I said at the beginning of this discussion some months ago, my original conception of ADUs was
to help with family. Um, my conception has shifted partly because the state's conception has shifted and partly because I am interested in expanding our more affordable attainable housing in town. So, in those respects, I am sympathetic of allowing
more use of ADUs. Um, I am certainly not in a place where I want to change anything by right. I think that we haven't tested this law long enough yet. Um, among other things, while we do have a year of not very much
use of it, we also have a year where interest rates have stayed fairly high and it might not be the time to do those kind of investing yet. Um, but I am open to cautious adjustments by special permit and I would certainly
favor going through the planning board on the special permits, not ZBA. Um, I would I don't know what those numbers are. Um, I'd have to think a little bit more and and listen to you guys a little bit more, but I think what I would be in
favor of is what? I'm sorry. No. Uh, I think what I'd be in favor of is us moving the discussion forward by putting together a draft of a bylaw amendment that would indicate exactly
the things we're talking about. Um, and and maybe I don't know, we could start with Ron's numbers just because he's the only one who's thrown out numbers. Um, and say let's have a special permit. Let's see what a draft bylaw would look like so
that we have some some hard words to discuss if we allowed by special permit through the planning board um up to I think you said 1,200 square ft or 75% of the primary house lot whichever is
smaller. My initial feeling is that might be a little bit too big for me to accept, but I'm willing to start there and and say, "Let's see how that feels and maybe let's do a little looking around the town, see what that might be." Um, and Ner, is that something that you
could kind of draft for us before the next meeting or is that something that we should be drafting? I have not done a lot of bylaw drafting myself. >> I can do the drafting. Okay. Um, does that feel folks like maybe what we could
then chew on next time if we actually looked at what that draft might be? >> Well, Mr. Chair, I >> Yeah, Ernie. >> Not that I want the added power or anything being on the board of appeals, but I think it
ought to be the board of appeals. Uh, I heard the the planning board on site plans gives uh permits, but uh that's that's different than a special permit
under a zoning bylaw. And I think it should be the uh uh it's just the way it's done. And I don't I don't think it's I don't like it when you have all these one board does it one, you know, you divide it up between different boards. I don't see any reason why it shouldn't be the uh
normal situation. Uh you know, you look at if you look at the zoning statute and you look up uh you know, the town can have whatever permit granting authority. You know, it can be different. It can be either one, I guess. But so that's just my um
the way I look at it. >> Okay. Um, I guess my response is I think it's already divided up and that's just the way we do it in Hopkins that some special permits are granted through ZBA and others are granted through planning board. Um, >> I don't see that's the way Ryan the way
Ron did it. He went to the ZBA which presumably was the right way to do it. >> But he went to them for a variance. True. >> What's that? >> He went to the ZBA for a variance which is different from his special permit. >> Well, they're the same thing. I mean it's uh you know I don't understand the
way it is that spe special permits and variances are along the same exact you know they're they're part of the a zoning law. They're not part of uh you know the planning board generally speaking doesn't administer the zoning laws. I was on the planning board and uh
for I was elected three times three fiveyear terms in town of Sharon. uh you know we didn't do any special permits and uh you know it's a small thing. I mean maybe it doesn't make any difference but I don't I don't see any rationale that uh you know that you
should well if you're one of the areas you go to one board but you go to a special permit you go to the other. There's no uh you know just there's no real rationale and it's normally uh uh um you know that's that's just um
>> my prejudice I guess being a lawyer and just how I understand how the the law is set up you know and having an experience at it. >> Yeah. And I'm not a lawyer, so maybe I'm I'm in the wrong place, but Sharon's way of doing business isn't necessarily the same as ours. And we have
>> I I've read I've read loads of cases about special permits, you know, almost virtually always, you know, uh special permits, variances, it's board of appeals. So >> in Hopkin, the planning board has plenty
of power for special permits. But only example I gave were were site plans and site plans are a different category. I think it's not I think it's more typical that planning boards would might have jurisdiction over a site plan. So um
>> okay we could go back and forth. Do do other folks have thoughts because if a ner is to write up a draft proposal it might be helpful if we're delineating which board it goes through. So the other ADU related special permits like the second unit etc. those also go
through um board of appeals right now is that right? I'm trying to find the >> Is that the only other special permit right now? And you say the other permits isn't there just one? >> I'm not sure. That's why I'm trying to look it up. >> I'm not I'm not aware that we since I've been on the board that we've ever had
somebody asking to have a second ADU. >> So >> yeah, please help out. Let me just summarize. Um, so since I joined and I think we discussed this few months back regarding ADU, we did not receive that
many applications or none application for more than one ADU on the property. There are few inquiries but they never made it to building department for permits or like that. We only have one bigger ADU, the Ron one, which went to
port of appeal for variance because as per our current adopted ADU bylaw, which clearly says only allow 9,000 900 square ft or 50%, not 9,000. >> Think on that, Ron. 9,000 square feet.
>> Yes. Everybody be like, "Oh." Um, and our current ADU by mentioned that if you need more than one ADU, you go in front of board of appeal for special permit. >> That's mentioned and that's our current
adopted ADU bylaw. So I will let board decide. >> Uh, planning board issues special permit but not um for lot of other reasons. It's also depends upon what's the zoning of the property. For example, if it's
under open space zoning district or neighborhood mixuse district, then their rules and regulations are different. So then in that terms, we need to review the special permit or master plan rules and rack. So planning board issue site plan as well as other special permit
related to that. on a zoning side if I'm not wrong they usually issue the expectations and basic special permits and variances. So we can do both. We need to mention in
our zoning bylaw but I will just suggest we don't want to create more confusion for applicant. Sure. >> That saying that but and also if even if we do two authorities that for larger ADUs you need to go in front of planning
board for a special permit and for more than one ADU you go to board of appeal for special permit but we need to make sure that if planning board denied larger ADU you cannot go to ZBA for
approval or ZBA will not review or authorize anything. Okay. >> Yeah. >> Okay. >> So, Ted, um, special permit may be granted by board of appeals for conversion of existing single family to accommodate. This is all under ADU. So, there's there's a couple other instances
under the ADU that already go through through board of appeals parking. Um, so I I I think I tend to agree that CBA just fits better here. >> Okay. Okay,
I'm just letting you skim more to see if you see anything else or if you have anything to add. >> I mean, skimming through, you know, as as um I mentioned, I think a lot of the other cases about zoning, uh special permits related to go through
ZBA. So, >> Okay. Okay. Um, okay. So, there's that. Um, the last bit then, um, so it sounds like Aneri,
maybe we ought to be drafting wording that says special permit through ZBA, even though that's not my preferred route, but it sounds like that's where it fits. Um, so the last thing I want to make sure if we're going to draft this this wording
to discuss is the thing I kept saying, we got to come back to that. We got to come back to that. Um, since now I know I'm looking at the state regs. Um, short-term rentals. Municipalities may establish restrictions and prohibitions on the short-term rental of protected
use ADUs. I think that we I feel pretty solid about this. We absolutely ought to have wording for bidding ADUs for the Airbnbs. If our goal is to try to create more affordable housing so that Hopkin
is more available for full-time residents, that has nothing to do with an Airbnb. And I don't think what we're trying to do is create potential profits for a landowner to be able to rent out a place on a weekly basis. Um,
uh, I think that we could probably look at models of other towns that have the, uh, short-term rental restrictions. Going back to my notes, um, I think Southboro, Ashlin, Westboro all have language against short-term
rentals. Um, I think Upton, Grafton, Shrewsbury have the Sherburn because I only wrote notes where they had no language on short-term rentals and that was only true of Hollist Do and Do of the towns I looked
at. So, I would certainly be in favor of adding uh language and we can look at what those other towns how they're presenting it to restrict short-term rentals of properties. And in my mind, we're talking about
Airbnb stays. I I don't know about what is a short-term and what is a long-term. A six-month rental to me feels very different from an Airbnb situation. Um, so I think maybe looking to other towns for their language and then deciding
what we like may be the route to go. Do you guys have thoughts on that? Is anyone completely in disagreement with me on Airbnb? >> It it's certainly something that I think we we may want to consider it townwide
rather than just addressing the ADU thing. is, you know, are other towns doing more restriction on on short-term rentals? I I mean, I don't know what goes on at the lake, but I I've got to believe that there are some properties there that are verbboed or >> Yeah.
>> Airbnbed, and I don't Is that good or bad? I don't know. >> And, you know, I don't know either. And maybe that's a different sandwich to bite into another time. Um, I could also see, um, you know, there's some talk about Hopkin in tourism.
We got the park and people come swimming for the day. I don't know if that that's tourism in in a grander way, but we do have the marathon and I could see Airbnbs for marathon use for for people who are flying in and want to settle into town rather than being bust out of
the city. And and I'm not sure that I want to close the door to that opportunity. Um, but for now, we can talk about that as a grander thing another time, but for now, as long as we're potentially proposing changing our ADU law, I think it makes sense to put
in here at least some short-term rental language. Um, because I I as much as I've shifted on ADUs for affordable housing, I certainly haven't shifted on people just slapping up some sheds to make a quick buck.
So, um, is that something I think in Erie you could look at for other towns and see what their language is? Is that within your bandwidth? >> We're not giving you too big a homework assignment. >> I can take a look what other towns have.
>> Uh, are there any other thoughts on this issue? This is our only agenda item and um at least for me until I see it written up so that we can kind of have a further discussion and maybe think about what those numbers mean. But is there anything else for us to consider or for
Aneri to consider before we call it an evening? I don't see anything. And Neri, do you have a pretty good sense of what we're hoping to see? Yes. >> Okay, good. Uh, shall we talk about
another meeting? You guys up for that? You guys have been pretty steady um attendance folks, so we can cross our fingers that some of the other ones will be able to make it. Um, let me think. Two weeks from now puts us
in the first week of March. Is that true, >> Chair? >> Yes. Can we do um next sack after March 9 planning board meeting? We have MBTA on planning board agenda. So I'm
guessing that next couple of weeks going to be a little bit busy after the >> and we could go since what we're talking about now obviously is not going to be in any town meeting this year. >> I just don't want to lose momentum. But I will tell you this, I will be out of
the country the week of March 15th through 21st. Uh that's during my two week spring break. And I'm going to actually I almost never travel during spring break, but I'm going to be traveling
um visiting a friend in the Dominican Republic. So if we go past what did you say a March 9th planning board >> we can do March um 11 like on >> we can go all the way to the 23rd 25th
>> that's f that's >> I don't have a strong preference for either and maybe if we we gave it further then maybe it gives an a little more time uh with busy planning board work and and town meeting prep. >> Well the 23rd is a planning board also. >> Okay. Um,
>> so it's one of those Wednesdays would be the >> And you had planning board on Monday this week, Matthew? >> Yes. >> No, it was President's Day. This past week was president coming. >> Um, I don't want to over I wonder when my next conccom is in
you don't by any chance at all have the Kong Cam. >> Yes. So the nextcom going to be >> for calcom >> March 10th going to be the calmcom then March 11 board of appeal then it's going to be
March 24th going to be com and March 25th going to be board of appeal as well as of now. >> What about March 30th? Is that free for the planning board? >> Yeah, it's free. >> Okay. So, as much as I don't want to lose momentum, are you guys comfortable
putting our next meeting on March 30th? >> I have a conflict with that unless it's after my kids are in bed. >> Okay. Would you please? >> I won't be able to. I'll be traveling. >> You will be Are you traveling on the Wednesday as well or will we be back by Wednesday of that?
>> No, no. I'll I'll be traveling starting on the 26th and I won't be back until like April 5th. >> April 5th. So, anytime that week's going to be rough for you? >> No, before 26 is fine. >> All right, let me pull up my
>> I'm leaving on the 2 night of 26. So, >> even Oh, I see. Oh, you're leaving the 26th. So, you could do but 25th is a board of appeals meeting. >> Yes. >> And 23rd is a planning board meeting
>> and 24 com. >> So, that week is out. Um because nobody wants to meet on Friday. So >> is March 2nd not a not a viable option? >> March's just going to be
>> That's really hard for a neri. It sounded like >> yes, >> that was our if if we did an every other week schedule that would have been our next regularly scheduled. >> It's just that's really taxing for a nearer. Um >> all right. So we we'll be out in April
sometime. So, it sounds like we got to look at I assume April 6th is a planning board. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> I assume April 7th is a concom >> as of as of now it's not on a calendar
but I'm guessing it's going to be because usually planning board and coms are >> and is April 8th a ZBA? >> April 8th. Yes. We we can we can do Thursday. I mean Thursday S.
>> I can't do Thursday. My voice is on committees that alternate every other Thursday. >> So here's what else is true. We do have a vice chair and it is true that the vice chair could lead a meeting while I'm in the
Dominican >> if but I my biggest worry with that is not Ron leading the meeting. It's the five people I see in the room seem to be the reliable ones. And if any of the five of us can't make it, I get nervous about whether we're going to
reach a quorum. >> Okay. Um I can try to do March. >> How about that? March 16th, 17th week. Is that Did we actually >> That's when I'm out of the country. >> Oh, okay. Okay. Sorry, I forgot that part. I missed that part.
So, I mean, we could roll all the way into April. >> April 13th is a Monday. >> I guess I don't see any other choice as of now.
>> I'm looking at >> I can How about chair? I can try to um do draft and if it's done next week, we can do March 4th.
I mean, we can I mean, you uh can >> I'm team make the executive decision to not put that on you. Uh you asked very nicely to see if we could give you some time for the planning board and I think the work of the planning board is much more pressing right now than putting
together a bylaw proposal that may or may not show up on town meeting 2027. So I don't want to do that to you. >> It's just going to have a very big agenda for March 9th meeting and >> yeah. So I don't want to do that public
hearing. >> So let's just look at what did I just say? Monday the 13th. >> Yeah, >> that's fine. >> Looking at folks's calendars. Does that seem good? >> I don't have that far out. So, yeah. >> Okay. So, why don't we just do that and
we'll take a we'll take a breath. Um I I feel good. It's not that we're sherking our duty. We're truly looking at the calendar and we're judging our attendance for this year and who we've come to rely on to be here. And it simply only seems to work that way if we
put it off that long. Um yeser >> and also uh on the topic which Arnold mentioned starting of the meeting I'm not going to discuss that in the details but John informed me briefly this
morning that board of appel is thinking about some changes on the bylaw I don't know in the detail it's just he briefed me out that >> and as a matter of fact as I was thinking about the 13th just before you
said that. That also gives us some time to see what John is thinking about and maybe adding that as in a second agenda item because we'll have plenty of time to kind of flesh that out. >> And I'll try to touch base with John to see what he has in mind um as well.
>> Yep. >> Does everyone feel comfortable with that? It looks like not a super excited Yeah, but it looks like a Yeah. Okay, with that it is time to look for
our final motion of the evening at 7:53. >> Motion to adjourn. >> Second. >> And there's a second. Let's Where's my attendance sheet? I probably don't need it. You're all right in front of me, but I like having it. There it is. Motion to
adjurnn and a second is on the table. No discussion, so let's vote. Matthew, >> yes. >> Ron, >> yes. Arnold, >> yes. >> Quadra, >> yes. >> And Ted Barker Hook is a yes for a unanimous vote. Um, thank you guys. Um,
Aneri, there's no rush to get that out, but if you can get it out, say a week before our next meeting, that'll give us time to look at the language or something like that. Um, >> but that still gives you, I think, over a month or >> Yeah, like almost two months. >> So hopefully that works for you.
>> Oh, yes. >> All right. Thank you everybody. >> Good night. Thank you.