Heat. Heat. Okay. Good evening. Welcome to the Township of How Planning Board meeting for Thursday, October 16th, 2025. Eileen, opening statement, please. >> I hereby declare this meeting of the Howell Township Planning Board to be open. Adequate notice having been given pursuant to the New Jersey Public
Meeting Act in the following manner. First, on January 3rd, 2025, a copy of said notice was emailed to the Asbury Park Press and the Star Ledger. Second, on January 3rd, 2025, a copy of said notice was hand delivered to the clerk of the township of Howell. Third, on
January 3rd, 2025, said notice was posted in the office of the planning board and on the bulletin board in the Howell Township Municipal Building 4567 Route 9, Howell Township, New Jersey. In accordance with the fire prevention code and for your safety, please be advised that this facility is designed with two
emergency exits at the front and rear of the meeting rooms. Furthermore, smoking is not permitted in the municipal building. Please take note that this meeting is being videotaped for possible future broadcast on Howell Township TV77. Thank you. >> Thank you. Roll call, please.
>> Mr. Bado, >> here. >> Mr. Greenfield is excused tonight. Mr. Carbonic >> here. >> Mr. McNicholas >> here. >> Mr. Mercer >> here. >> Mr. Tannen House is absent tonight. Councilman Nadell >> here.
>> Mayor Leio >> here. >> Mr. Freriedman >> here, >> Mr. WCO >> here, >> and Chairman Huster >> here. >> You have a quorum. >> Thank you. Uh, at this time, would everybody rise for the pledge of allegiance and afterwards a moment of silence for our men and women who have
served both here and abroad to the flag of the United States of America to the stands nation for all. Okay. Thank you, Eileen. Any correspondence this evening?
>> I have no correspondence tonight. >> Okay. On to resolutions. We have quite quite a lot. First one is a resolution review of proposed ordinance for O-25-41. Uh eligible voters, Mr. Beto, Mr.
Carbonic, Mr. McNicholas, Mr. Mercer, Councilman Nadell, Mr. Freriedman, Mr. Wetco, and myself. Do I have a motion? >> I'll make a motion. >> Mr. Mercer, do I have a second? >> I'll second it. >> Thank you.
>> Mr. Bal, >> yes. >> Mr. Carbonic, >> yes. >> Mr. McNicholas, >> yes. >> Mr. Mercer, >> yes. >> Council Madell, >> yes. >> Mr. Freriedman, >> yes. >> Mr. WCO, >> yes. >> And Chairman Hasser, >> yes.
>> Thank you. Next is case number SP-1138 JNS Flex Center LLC. Resolution granting submission waiverss. Eligible voters, Mr. Bato, Mr. Mercer, Mayor Leio, Mr. Freriedman, and myself. Do I have a motion? >> Motion. >> Mr. Bato.
>> Mayor Leio. Thank you. >> Mr. B. >> Yes. >> Mr. Mercer. >> Yes. >> Mayor Leio. >> Yes. >> Mr. Freriedman. >> Yes. >> And Chairman Huster. >> Yes. >> Approved. Next is case number SD-3018, Carmine Caruso. Resolution granting
minor subdivision approval. Eligible voters, Mr. Bato, Mr. Mercer, Mayor Leio, Mr. Freriedman, and myself. Do I have a motion? >> Motion. >> Mayor Leio. >> Second. >> Mr. Mercer. >> Mr. Bada. >> Yes. >> Mr. Mercer, >> yes.
>> Mayor Leio, >> yes. >> Mr. Freriedman, >> yes. >> And Chairman Huster, >> yes. >> Approved. Case number SD-3013, Bessador LLC, resolution granting preliminary major subdivision approval. Eligible voters, Mr. Mercer, Mayor Leio,
Mr. McNicholas, Mr. Freriedman, and myself. Do I have a motion? >> I'll make a motion. >> Mr. Mercer, >> you mayor Leio for the second. Thank you. >> Mr. Mercer, >> yes. >> Mr. McNicholas, >> yes. >> Mayor Leio, >> yes. >> Mr. Freriedman,
>> yes. >> And Chairman Hasser, >> yes. >> Approved. Case number SP-1143 Richard Shibble a resolution granting submission waiverss eligible voters Mr. Bato Mr. Garbonic Mr. McNicholas Mr.
Mercer Councilman Nadell Mr. Freriedman Mr. Wetco and myself do I have a motion >> motion >> Mr. Carbonic do I have a second >> second Councilman Adele >> Mr. Ball >> yes
>> Mr. Carbonic >> yes >> Mr. Mr. McNicholas, >> yes. >> Mr. Mercer, >> yes. >> Councilman Nadell, >> yes. >> Mr. Freriedman, >> yes. >> Mr. WCO, >> yes. >> And Chairman Hasser, >> yes. >> Approved. >> Okay. The next is case number
SD-30241120 Farmingdale Road LLC. Resolution granting submission waiverss. Eligible voters, Mr. Bato, Mr. Carbonic, Mr. McNicholas, Mr. Mercer, Councilman Adele, Mr. Freriedman, Mr. Wetco, and myself. Do I have a motion? >> Motion. >> Mr. Mr. Carbonic. Do I have a second?
>> Second. >> Uh, Mr. Mercer. >> Mr. Badel. >> Yes. >> Mr. Carbonic. >> Yes. >> Mr. McNicholas? >> Yes. >> Mr. Mercer? >> Yes. >> Councilman Nadell? >> Yes. >> Mr. Freriedman? >> Yes. >> Mr. WCO? >> Yes. >> And Chairman Huster? >> Yes.
>> Approved. >> And the last for this evening, case number SP-1144, Tulsi Restaurant LLC. Resolution granting submission waivers. Eligible voters, Mr. Bato, Mr. Carbonic, Mr. McNicholas, Mr. Mercer, Councilman Adele, Mr. Freriedman, Mr. Wetco, and
myself. Do we have a motion? >> Motion. >> Mr. Garbanic. Do I have a second? >> Second. >> Councilman Adele. >> Mr. Badel? >> Yes. >> Mr. Carbonic? >> Yes. >> Mr. McNicholas? >> Yes. >> Mr. Mercer? >> Yes. >> Councilman Nadell? >> Yes.
>> Mr. Freriedman? >> Yes. >> Mr. WCO? >> Yes. >> And Chairman Husser? >> Yes. >> Approved. I think we just forgot the minutes in the beginning. Okay. >> Sorry about that. >> Yeah, we got to approve those. >> Yeah, that's my fault. I apologize.
>> Uh, approval of minutes for the regular meeting of June 19th, 2025. Eligible voters, Mr. Bato, Mr. Mercer, Councilman Adele, Mr. Freriedman, and myself. Do I have a motion? >> Motion. >> Mr. B. Do I have a second? >> Second. >> Mr. Mercer.
>> Mr. Badel? >> Yes. >> Mr. Mercer? >> Yes. >> Councilman Nadell? >> Yes. >> Mr. Freriedman? >> Yes. and Chairman Huster. >> Yes. >> Approve. >> And the regular meeting of August 7th, 2025, eligible voters, Mr. Bato, Mr.
Mercer, Mayor Leio, Mr. McNicholas, Mr. Freriedman, and myself. Do I have a motion? >> Mayor Legio, do I have a second? >> Second, >> Mr. Bato. >> Yes. >> Okay. >> Mr. Ball, >> yes. >> Mr. McNicholas, >> yes. >> Mr. Mercer, >> yes.
>> Mayor Leio, >> yes. >> Mr. Freriedman, >> yes. >> And Chairman Huster, >> yes. approved. Thank you. >> Thank you. Okay, on to submission waiverss this evening. Uh the first being case number SD-3026, Edward and Dorothy Morgan.
Okay, I see you all the way back there. Good evening. >> Good evening. John Jackson for the Morgans. Do you swear or the testimony about concerning this matter should be the truth or truth? >> I do. Um, Mr. Chairman, members of the
board, we have a September 11th, 2025 review letter. The submission waiverss are specifically outlined on page four. Um, item three. Um, I had the opportunity to provide some feedback to the applicant. Um, there's a couple
items I recommend be provided to be deemed complete and then a couple items on a subsequent submission and then the balance I take no exception to. So, I'm going to go through those. The items I recommend be provided at this time are the natural resource inventory checklist
item number 14, checklist item number 60, all overland and underr underground drainage conveyances within 2,000 ft. and checklist item number 85, the woodlands management plan. I also recommend that checklist item 11,
submission to freehold soils. Um, checklist item number 27, keymap, uh, showing a 2,000 ft radius. Checklist item number 29, the state planning area. Checklist it, which is the same as 42. Checklist item number 52, names of all
property owners and use designation of all lots. Um I recommend that be provided on a subsequent submission prior to the board be uh application being heard by this board and the balance of the items. I take no exception to waving for the purposes of deeming complete. >> John acceptable.
>> Yes. Um I had spoke to Miss Newman about the freehold soils that we could do that uh as we go through the >> I said on the subsequent >> Thank you. I misunderstood that. I have no thank you. >> Okay. Any questions from members? No. Seeing none, I will entertain a
motion. I'll entertain a motion. >> Are you making a motion? >> Yes. >> Mr. Mercer, do I have a second? >> Second. >> Mr. Carbonic. Roll call, please. >> Mr. Bada. >> Yes. >> Mr. Carbonic. >> Yes. >> Mr. McNicholas? >> Yes. >> Mr. Mercer? >> Yes.
>> Mr. T? Uh, Councilman Adele. >> Yes. >> Mayor Leio. >> Actually, I'm going to have to abstain from this application. I believe this is my uh one of my friends parents
Edward Morgan is his daughter I believe was on street. >> Yes. >> Is she here? >> Yes. >> There's a couple. >> Yeah. But I know I know the respect. >> Thank you.
>> Mr. Freriedman. >> Yes. >> Mr. WCO. >> Yes. >> And Chairman Hasser. >> Yes. >> Approved. Thank you very much. Have a good evening. >> Have a good night. >> Okay. The next is case number SD-3025, Judah Burkowitz.
>> Good evening. >> Good evening. >> Donna Bolock um for for the applicant. Um I'm from Oregon Engineering. I prepared the uh uh minor subdivision plan. Good evening, Donna. Um, >> swear the testimony you're about to send
to the board concerning this application. Shall we retrieve all truth? >> I do. >> I do. >> Uh, Mr. Chairman, uh, similarly, we have a September 11th, 2025 review letter submission uh, waivers are specifically outlined in item three. And because this
is a minor subdivision with no improvements proposed at this time, I take no exception to the granting of these waivers for the purposes of deeming complete. >> Okay. Gentlemen, any questions? >> Seeing none, I'll entertain a motion.
>> Motion. >> Mr. Bato. Do I have a second? >> Mayor Leio. >> Mr. Badel. >> Yes. >> Mr. Carbonic. >> Yes. >> Mr. McNicholas? >> Yes. >> Mr. Mercer? >> Yes. >> Councilman Madell? >> Yes.
>> Mayor Leio? >> Yes. >> Mr. Freriedman? >> Yes. >> Mr. WCO? >> Yes. >> And Chairman Husser? >> Yes. >> Approved. Thank you. Thanks, Donna. Have a good night. Okay, the last submission weaver this evening is case number SD-3027
RCH Newton's Corner Road LLC. >> Uh, good evening. Keep going. Donald Howard and Cece for the applicant. >> Considering this matter should be the truth. >> I do. >> Uh, so Mr. Chairman, members of the board, we have a September 25th, 2025
review letter. Similarly, submission waiverss are outlined in item three. Uh we actually had the opportunity to meet with the professionals and I had requested that item 60 be provided that has since been submitted and reviewed by my office. Um as it relates to the
balance of the items, there's some items that I think should be provided on a subsequent submission. Specifically 39, North Arrow with reference meridian. Uh 42, State Planning Area Designation. Um, checklist item 52, use designation
of all lots within 200 ft of the site. Uh, checklist item 47, location and description of monuments to be set. Um, and then I recommend the balance be waved for the purposes of deeming the application complete. >> And no objection. >> Easy enough. I curate where where is
this on Newton's Corner Road? >> That's what I thought. Okay, >> got it. Okay, gentlemen, any questions? Seeing none, I entertain a motion. >> I'll make a motion. >> Mr. Mercer, do I have a second? >> Second.
>> Councilman Adele. >> Mr. Badel. >> Yes. >> Mr. Carbonic? >> Yes. >> Mr. McNicholas? >> Yes. >> Mr. Mercer? >> Yes. >> Councilman Nadell? >> Yes. >> Mayor Legio? >> Yes. >> Mr. Freriedman? >> Yes. >> Mr. WCO?
>> Yes. >> And Chairman Huster? >> Yes. >> Approved. >> Thank you. >> Good evening. Okay, this on to applications this evening. Um, we're going to change things around a little bit on the agenda. Um, we are going to start with
item number uh well let letter B then move on to A and then keep the redevelopment hearing last. So the first application this evening uh is case number SP-11416249US9 LLC. So for a preliminary and final
major site plan. Good evening again, Ken. >> Good evening, Mr. Chair and board members. Mr. Chair, Kenneth Paple, on behalf of the applicant, this is a continued public hearing. We began the
presentation of this to the board at the September 18th meeting. That the September 18th meeting, I think we had a very meaningful exchange with the board and the board's professionals. We made a present Dr. Cohen who's your applicant um shared with the board his his goals
for this building, moving his his practice to the building uh and to have general offices, non-medical offices on the second floor. And during that hearing, there were comments from the board members and there were comments from your staff and it came a point where we asked if we could recess so
that our professionals could revise the plans to be responsive to those comments. The opportunity that was given was adequate. The plans were revised and submitted and your staff has issued new reports. U I won't speak for your staff, but it appears that we have addressed
most if not all of the concerns. And what I'd like to do with your permission in a succinct presentation recall Yseph Portoy who is the engineer and have him take us through the bullet point revisions. Similarly um Shiman Greenbound is the architect ask him to
take us through the revisions. There were no open issues with regard to the traffic testimony although Scott Kennel is here if the board has any. And then lastly, we do need to have the planner put on the necessary proof for the bulk variance. Have the so it would be Yseph
Portoy bullet points Shimon Greenbound bullet points and new testimony on planning. >> Perfect. >> Acceptable outline. >> Absolutely. >> Thank you very much. >> Thank you. >> Then Mr. Portoy, if you could join us. >> I'll remind Mr. Fortnite that he's under
oath and that his credentials were previously shared and the board accepted him as an expert in his field as a professional engineer. >> Mr. Fortnite. >> Mr. Fortnite, if you could share with the board the presentation that you'll be making and if you could alert Eileen as to the
exhibits that you would like up for the board as you're going through your the bullet points. >> Oh, good evening everyone. >> Good evening. >> Thank you. So we appreciate the feedback we received and we we did submit revised plans. Um this exhibit that's up this is
832. This is an updated version of the you know the color site plan exhibit. So this will be I think this will probably will be sufficient to demonstrate the changes. Um per per our last hearing um we we
revised the the architectural plans were revised to relocate the erous door that was previously on the rear of the building on the east side of the building um to the south side of the building um by the exterior staircase.
Um along that with that we we revise a trash enclosure and lands and landscape to make sure that we um that there's a clear path for emergency egress from that know south exit to be able to get to the parking lot. Um we have also
revised the lighting to comply with the IEES standards. Um we were able to achieve that with complying with the maximum 24 foot um lighting height. Um and there were some additional no um
revisions made based on the technical comments from the board engineer planner and and the fire marshall. >> Is that a complete summary of the revisions that were required to address the open concerns of the board and the board professionals?
>> Yes. Mr. Chair, as the plan that's before you reflects those revisions, I have no further examination of Mr. Fortnite. He is available to you and your professionals. >> Gentlemen, any questions? Laura Jen, were you okay? >> I have no questions at this time, Mr.
Chairman. >> No questions, Mr. Chair. >> Okay, great. >> Okay. Thank you very much, Mr. Fortnite. Thank you. >> If you could join us, >> Similarly, I remind you that you're under oath. And similarly, I remind the board that Chimman Greenbomb's
credentials as an architect were placed before the board and he was accepted as an expert. Again, revised plans were submitted and your staff in responsive to um issues that were identified on the record by board members and board professionals. Mr. Green, I'm going to
ask if you could take us through the revisions that were made. And what exhibit would you like? >> It was uh A1, I believe. >> The AR the new >> A1. going. >> I think we would start with the third
page of >> Is it not going? >> How about that? >> I think it would be page They wanted to see page uh second the second to last page, which is page seven. >> That's That's not the right drawing.
That's not the right >> Oh, yeah. Those are the older ones before those older ones. >> Hey, you said A1. Those are A1. >> Oh. >> Um, >> was it was a new >> a new exhibit number assigned to >> Don't go to exhibits. Go to
>> this one. >> We do have handouts. It's oldfashioned, old school, but we have 11 by 17 handouts. >> There we go. >> Oh, that's the correct one. >> There you go. There you go. So uh there was a concern brought up uh about the
side elevations side and rear elevations on the building that there should be a base or water table and that we should have we should introduce verticality and breaking up the facade that as you can see in this drawing we've we've introduced those elements and the coping
carries through the entire building on both the north and south facads and equally uh if we look at the page the page before that we can see we did the same thing on the rear of the building. >> So, Mr. Chair, I I mean, I don't mean to
cut you short at all, but your office worked very hard with my office to revise your design and come up with this very attractive building. So, I take no exception to the proposed architecture if the board is inclined to to act in the affirmative. >> It's good-look building.
>> Yeah, I agree. >> I like the sign, too. >> You know, I I like to say this. It's a process and the proc with your professionals. It's a process and that's what you got. It is a good looking building. >> Oh, any questions? >> I can be very efficient. I don't have
any further questions of Mr. Green after hearing Jennifer Beam say that she likes the building. >> So, >> gentlemen, nothing. >> Okay. >> Okay. Thank you. Thank you. >> Thank you. All right. And then uh I it's necessary for the planner to present the
planning testimony that supports these plans that you've just examined. I'll he will be sharing his credentials with you. We'll put him under oath and then we'll see if we can put them on speed dial. >> Perfect. >> Mr. Mr. John Barry, if you could be sworn. >> Mr. Barry, do you swear or affirm that
the testimony you're about to present to the board shall be the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth? >> I do. For the record, please state your name, spell your last name, provide your business affiliation. Sure. >> John Barry, B A R E. I am the excuse me,
I'm the managing partner of MJ Planning LLP. >> And if you could take a moment to share with the board and the public your education and professional background. >> Sure. I have a master of city and regional planning degree from Ruckers
University. I'm a licensed professional planner, member of the American Institute of Certified Planners uh both in good standing and have been since 2014 and I have uh regularly represented boards like yours and appeared before them. In fact, this is my
>> We will accept your credentials. Thank you. >> Thanks. I think that um if you could give us a sense of what it is that you examined to be prepared this evening and then take us through the necessary proofs for the the remaining bulk variance relief that's part of the plan.
>> Sure. >> Thank you. >> So um as typical I had an opportunity to visit the property and see the existing conditions surrounding context the neighboring properties. Had a call with the development team here and discussed the purpose of the application. reviewed
the plans, reviewed the the township's planning documents, the various professional reports. So, I had a a sense of uh everything that's going on and has transpired up to this point. So, you you know what the application's all about. I won't won't belabor that point. Um it's a unique interesting piece of
property. It's got uh somewhat narrow frontage that exists along Route 9 along the uh the northbound side of Route 9. The property goes back and then bows out. It almost kind of looks like a hammer if you if you rotate it. And it's got a quite a quite a lot of
environmental uh constraints that limit the developable area of the property, push the development up toward the highway, which is frankly where where we want it to be. The um relief that's being sought this evening is several I
would classify them as relatively innocuous bulk variances and several design exceptions. The um first of the variances is a sideyard setback. The uh required setback is uh equal to the building height which I believe is 27
1/2 ft to the proposed parapit wall. The building itself is set back 25 ft which is the the baseline setback. And then we have that exterior stair tower that's partially open that you saw in the architectural plans. It's set back 15.65 ft to the southern property line. This
image gives us a really good context for how it relates to the neighboring property. You can see that the building itself is essentially behind the development that that neighbors it to the south and the area where the the setback encroaches the most at the stair tower toward the back of the building.
There's a substantial vegetated area on the neighboring property and the neighboring there's no use going on in that back part of the property. So there's really no uh no direct impact or detriment that I would see associated with that. I mentioned the the frontage
which is an existing nonconformity. We have developed sites both north and south really not a a practical way to cure that deficiency. It's 193.3 ft where 200 feet is required and that's going to remain as it is and has been.
Um, next we have um two items of relief related to the riparian buffer and stream corridor preservation ordinance here in the township. The setbacks are required to be measured from the edge of the buffer area. Doing so on this
property would essentially render it non-developable. there's that would be left with a a triangle that's kind of dashed in red if you could see toward the middle of the parking lot that wouldn't be large enough for a building for parking for anything at that point um if if we were to comply fully with
with those requirements. So there's an element of of hardship associated with that situation and the ordinance requirement um certainly to to enable some development of this property and then there's also a restriction on clearing cutting grading construction
within the riparian buffer area and some of the development will be the back part of the building and portion of the parking lot and the the storm water management basin will be partially located within that riparian zone. Again, it's um pretty much impossible to
develop this property without some encroachment there. The design exceptions quickly, the drive aisle width is required to be 30 ft. We've got 25 ft. Um don't anticipate larger vehicles, trucks, or the type of thing you'd have come to Walmart or to the
BJ's at this property. So I think that the slightly narrower width has a benefit of uh both practicality for the site because it's not needed to be wider and also keeping in mind the environmental constraints and minimizing the impervious service on the site. So there's probably it's probably a better
alternative frankly to have a little bit narrower pavement going on with the property. The illumination levels um you heard um the testimony that the lighting plan was revised to be in um compliance with general standards. We are a little bit outside of what the the township
requires which is a minimum of.3 anywhere on site and an average of 0.5 foot candles across the whole area. Um minimum is about 0.5 and the average is >> John I don't mean to interrupt but when yousef complies with IEES that's pretty much all we need to hear.
>> Okay I'll keep it moving. Um next next one there's a there was identified in the report a uh waiver for the landscape strip um between the building and parking lot. There's a landscape strip. You can see the little green strip along the front side which is the most functional part. The waiver I assume is
adjacent to the concrete pad which is for loading and unloading with the dumpster. Um probably not practical to maintain a landscape strip in that area. So we'd be better off without. And then lastly, the there's pedestrian walkways are required to be um minimum of four
feet except they could be eight feet when um located in front of commercial storefronts. We've got a 5-ft wide walkway um in front of the building that is sufficient for the relatively low foot traffic here. Um as far as the proofs um for the variances, as I
mentioned, there's an element of hardship associated with the site in general. I think that both the uh riparian buffer encroachments and development areas and the width of the property could be looked at as C1 hardship variances because we've got conditions that are existing that can't
can't be done uh can't be cured and no nothing can be done with the property as a result if they were to be fully complied with and then the remaining variances could be looked at as C2 where we look at the benefits advancing purposes of zoning as part of the overall project outweighing paying any
detriments associated with the relief. Um the use the medical uses permitted in the zone. Um providing a a medical user here advances the general welfare certainly promotes the public health as purpose A. And the development of this
parcel is beneficial to the Route 9 corridor as a whole. And I know you've got a redevelopment study later on this evening, but um certainly um promoting the general health, public health, safety, and welfare and enhancing the Route 9 corridor um goes along with this
project. And then I'll say purpose G provides sufficient space for a variety of commercial uses. Um again, fits in with the with the highway corridor and certainly advances that goal. And then as to the negative criteria, I like with
looking at the context of the property, we've got a vast majority of the site is going to be undeveloped protecting those environmentally sensitive areas. The slight encroachments where they exist are adjacent to other commercial properties. The nearest residences are quite a ways back. So there's not going
to be any appreciable detriment to any of the neighboring properties or the public right of way. And the overall project is certainly consistent with the ordinance as permitted uses and consistent with the master plan um including one of the goals added to the
2018 re-examination report of encouraging new business and industries along the township's highway corridors. So with that, I'd say we've got a good application work with the uh professionals here to get it to where it is today. And let's submit that the board has justification to grant the
relief. I'd like to add something ju just the driveway width of 25 ft. Um I met with the fire I met with the fire chief to go over that and you'll in in the packet is his he had no issues with the design. He found it to be an
acceptable driveway design and also the asking for relief for some of the landscaping. The what we have said to Miss Spiro is uh and and I'll place it on the record. We're not looking to avoid land planting and we're not
looking to save money on landscaping. We'll gladly find other places on the property, but putting landscaping in the parking lot in those islands. The it just isn't not productive. >> I'm not super supportive of the landscape islands in the parking lots either. The plows hit them, they become
a tripping hazard, the landscaping doesn't survive, and they wind up becoming an ashtray. So, I would prefer the landscaping along the perimeter of the site and remove the islands from the inside. It's not really functional. >> Mr. Chair, those were the clarifications. I very much appreciate
Miss Miss Beam's sharing. That is the applicant's direct presentation to the board and we're prepared to rest uh if there's any questions of any of the witnesses. Okay. >> The only thing I'd ask is a very brief opportunity to >> Sure. Uh gentlemen, is there any questions? >> The only question I have
>> Sure. The only question I have is um two circles in the lower be behind the um underneath the parking pad where the garbage is going to be. So there's that's changed where there's not going to be any landscaping there because that's the only direct route from the emergency exit out towards the parking
lot or from the >> uh responders trying to get from the parking lot to the emergency exit. What? >> I I would just recommend removing those two trees next to the loading because he's right. If someone has to go out
those stairs, you have a masonry trash enclosure and then you have the two trees. So, it would be cause an impediment to people getting out safely, I would recommend just removing them. >> Well, we we'll find another place for >> Perfect. Okay. >> Thank you.
>> Anything else, gentlemen? gentleman over there. No. Okay. Um Ken, at this time I'll open it up to the public if anybody has any questions on this application, comments. Seeing none, close the public portion.
>> Mr. Chair, members of the board, it has been an absolute pleasure for us to represent Dr. Klein Cohen. He's most anxious to bring his practice here to Howell and he has worked with us and he has authorized us to work with your staff. I'm very proud of the work product that was created by this team. I
think that the presentation that was made to the board this evening makes clear that the requests that were made by the board, the board's professionals have been honored. We respectfully ask the board to consider favorably granting this preliminary and final site plan approval with all the conditions that were placed on the record this evening
and previously. >> Great. >> Thank you. Just remember this. This is what I wear. I wanted to give you a heads up. Um, all right, gentlemen. I will entertain a motion. Uh, just uh I guess for Eileen
and everyone. Um, Mayor Leio will not be voting on this application, right? I guess he is abstaining. Or are you just not voting? >> Uh, he >> he didn't he didn't watch the video. >> He was absent that. >> Okay. Yep. I'll make a motion.
>> Okay. Mr. Mercer, do I have a second? >> I'll second. >> Mr. McNicholas. >> Mr. Bad? >> Yes. >> Mr. Carbonic? >> Yes. >> Mr. McNicholas? >> Yes. >> Mr. Mercer? >> Yes. >> Council Minnadelle?
>> Yes. >> Mr. Freriedman? >> Yes. >> Mr. Wetco? >> Yes. >> And Chairman Huster? >> Uh, yes. >> Approved. >> Mr. Chairman, all board members and board professionals. Thank you. >> Thank you. >> May I have just five minutes to
>> Absolutely. Okay. >> Yes. We'll we'll take a recess for 5 minutes as Mr. Pap has the next application. >> The board will now take a recess and reconvene at 7:43 p.m. Thank you. I saved them from last time.
>> I've heard about it. You're out of time. They're not fixed. They're not granting the extension. their prior lawyer consenting. You don't just get to unconsent after the fact. when you head south. >> Yeah,
we don't know for how much longer, >> right? It's bumper to bumper walking again just to get out of bed and move. We really don't get off. Great idea. >> I haven't really heard from him. Like
this is >> He hasn't responded to my >> pri prior times that he's been in the hospital. Like I have I've talked to him twice. He calls me from >> He called me from ICU. >> Yeah, me too. To schedule a meeting. I'm like click. >> It was easy.
>> But you spoke to him last week. >> Yeah. He didn't sound good. >> And it was very brief. It was like for like a minute or two and like got very out of breath very quickly and >> 3:00. in a fair amount of pain. >> Yeah, that's what he said.
>> It's terrible. >> We have all his meetings. >> Is the only bits >> only one odd night next Wednesday and I'm not here in Florida. We got We got nine meetings in one night. >> Sheets. >> Yeah, sheets. >> We've got it covered. Thankfully, we
have a attorney up in Pipany uh when she was in the governing body in Edison sat as the class three member so she actually knows how a board function. So, we're going to pinch it up there for us and we're able to juggle.
>> Usually at the most we have five in a given night. I think the schedules got pushed >> with the holidays and stuff like that >> cuz my whole my whole October, November, and December calendars are adjusted for holiday.
>> You always have to >> and the Jewish holidays seem to have affected October. >> They're early this year. >> Yep. >> I always know because there's a synagogue into the street from my house and they always got sign up at their
signage out in front as to which holiday is when you know >> no like Wendy from your office emailed the court because we had mediation scheduled and said you know it's can we
get another date and they said no they said send >> apparently they did that to a lot of people and got a lot of lawyers and other people >> pretty po there there's no need for that >> but we're not going to schedule it during the league because you know that
makes sense. >> Unless you move all the carings down to Atlantic City. >> I mean they're all like Zoom >> crazy still probably not the same like you're wasting my time. like this
this song and dance and this little tap dance that you got going on here is like wasting everyone's time. >> I'm not supporting you like the blue screen but has this big message. >> Well, we're really good players in this forum. I go Are you though? >> Did you not sue the last time?
>> Like you were one of two towns in the whole state that litigated. So I don't know that that would be considered a good player. >> What town is >> Weston? I'm like, >> I'm just thinking. I said, you've gotten over the finish line kicking and screaming and being jerked every time.
>> It's not their faith. I said, "So, I've told you what to do. I know what's going to happen." They took a vacant land adjustment at like six units to the acre. They're not entitled to it. When they told them to put realistic acreages or densities in there, they went over their number. So, like, you're not entitled to a
vacant land adjustment. And he just >> uh David Novak works for Joe B. >> We used to take >> and he knows like, >> you know what I mean? >> Not really. >> He's just represent. >> He's not really in control of the situation. >> And uh >> is this one where they need to be able to say we can blame the judge or this is
just out of pure angst. >> This is a mayor that goes on. >> This is that crazy. >> No, that's East Windsor. But this is a mayor that goes on social media congratulating the planning board for approving warehouses to prevent when I when I get it.
>> Well, that's brilliant. >> And Judge Jacobson saw it. >> It really is. Had a lot of cars in my >> or someone would have made sure she saw it. >> She saw it. >> Even though I used to drive Corvettes. >> She was a She's the author of the road map.
>> You get >> I didn't get the name of the lawyer. Submit your invoice. I don't know where they get the money, >> but it's like >> and then I know it's V I N >> every >> O L L O C.
>> They let you test drive when I bought mine. Where is she from? >> That's fine. >> Okay. >> Did you talk to Peggy? >> I did. >> She said they got to the point. She
showed me where Sher said, "Okay, >> I keep thinking I had a hard time talking about it. >> Oh, that's great. had four years. >> We're ready, sir. >> Good times. >> Ready when you are, Eileen.
>> The meeting will now reconvene. Okay, we are now on to case number SP-1135 StarCap Holdings LLC. This is a preliminary and final major site plan. Mr. Pap again.
>> Thank you, Mr. Chairman, members of the board. Kenneth Bape of the firm Hyover Pape. on behalf of your applicant. This is a request for site plan approval for an existing daycare center that was built as a Goddard school 20 plus years
ago and has been part of the community for 20 plus years. Our clients acquired it more than three years ago and have been operating the daycare center there with considerable success. The request is to add a second floor to add additional
capacity to for the students that are looking to use this facility. The presentation it we're in zone we're in zone the it's an existing building that we're looking to put a second floor on and the presentation will be to identify
taking a building I would not say a tired building but a building that was built decades ago to give it a very fresh reef facing and to embellish substantially embellish the landscaping and to create the necessary improvements
to support the second floor of the building. The presentation will be made through Lewis Zuggnner, the professional engineer responsible for the plans that are before the board. Steve Rodosti, who is the architect who did the reddraft of the redesign of the building, Scott
Kennel is our traffic expert. We have Mrs. Rabinowitz who is the director of the school. I asked that she join us this evening and just to describe the school's operation to you. I think that although it may not necessarily be planning testimony, it's very beneficial
to understand how this school operates. And then lastly, John Barry is our planner, but if if I could at the outset, Mr. chair, members of the board, the vi I spoke with your your professionals before the hearing and much like the hearing that we just
concluded making a presentation where we get to the point where we have shared the first presentation of the professionals and and ask for your comments and then agree to come back and be responsive. It seems to be a very efficient program. So I would like to
with your permission if time allows to have Lewis testify and Steve Rodasi testify and Mrs. Ribinowitz. If there's time we could have Scott and at that point be looking for your comments and for your staff's comments and then looking for an opportunity to come back. >> Perfect. Sounds good.
>> It works for you. >> Yes. Thank you. >> No, thank you. Then Mr. Lewis Zner, you're up. If we could have you sworn and we'll go right into the substance. Sir, do you swear or affirm that the testimony you're about to present before the board on this application tell me nothing but the truth, the whole truth?
>> I do. >> My name is State your name and spell your last name and your business affiliation. >> Lewis Zugner Zu GN with Mid-Atlantic Engineering. >> And if you would share with the board your education and professional
background. >> Certainly. I have a engineering degree from Virginia Tech, a licensed professional engineer in the state of New Jersey as well as several other states. Uh founding principal of the firm at Atlantic Engineering, uh been testifying throughout New Jersey uh for
over 25 years. >> We'll accept your credentials. Thank you. >> Thank you. And Lewis was with me the night when we had this terrible thing happen. And your license is in good standing. >> It is. We were in front of a board. There was an older gentleman who said, "Oh, I don't renew my license. I stopped
doing that." Well, you can't testify. So, we always ask, "Is your license in good standing?" Because once one once was enough. I'm going to ask if you could first identify the exhibits from which you would like to rely as as you begin the presentation. identify those exhibits
and then we'll go into an executive overview of our client's goals and then let's go through some of the technical elements of the plan. >> Sounds good. I'd like to work from two exhibits. One is labeled aerial exhibit and this shows regionally where our property is and the other is going to be
a colored rendering which essentially is taking the elements of the site plan on a colored sheet to make it a little more presentable for this evening. It's a great place to start is this is the area upon which you'll begin your testimony.
>> This is Yes. Open up there. >> That works. >> Yeah. >> There we go. There we go. So, just to quickly orient everyone, I'm
sure you're familiar with the area. Our property is outlined in white here. Uh we're essentially at the intersection of Church Road and Kent Road. Kent Road being just to the left of that site in in that particular view. You can also see Route Nine. We don't touch Route
Nine, but you can see the proximity. Uh just below our property, the large building is Walmart. Uh Walmart actually wraps around our property. So that grass area behind us is their storm water facilities. Uh a couple other elements I think to understand obviously the zoning. We're
in the highway development one HD1 zone uh daycare which is there now. It is a permitted use. There are no wetlands or streams affecting this parcel. Uh in total that lots 1.84 acres and uh
I think as Mr. Pap mentioned a one-story building has daycare at the moment with playgrounds and parking. if you could uh maybe with the next exhibit that would be an executive overview of of
what we would like the board to consider favorably. So here colored rendering showing the site hopefully with some clarity. You can see in sort of a yellow color at the center that's the building. The architect will speak to the building itself. Uh as we get into some
description, you can see there also in dark and lighter colors. That's the uh showing you in dark the existing and then the new parking. Lighter yellow around the perimeter are some sidewalks and at the back fenced in is the playground area. Uh essentially
this is an expansion to include a second story on that building. There are two outside stairwells at the front and the back. These are for meeting code requirements and access to the second floor, of course. Uh we've added parking in this layout to
accommodate 16 total classrooms. We'll go through those numbers. Uh we're providing as Mr. P mentioned earlier additional landscaping throughout. We are improving storm water management for this site. Uh and essentially other than one element we are meeting the bulk
criteria. Uh there will be some other relief items we'll go through, but uh the key element in this from the bulk criteria is the rear stairwell is closer to the rear property line than the setback. Perhaps we can go into the over the the
site plan design elements and I'm going to defer to you as to where you would like to begin. I would like you, however, to talk about the existing drainage and the new drainage improvements early on. Okay, you can
start there. >> I know that there's some benefits to the township that would be part of the storm water system and I'd like to make certain that those become part of the record. So, uh, essentially as a preexisting site, there's really no impact to grading or elevation to the
site. staying, you know, more or less the same, but we are making storm water improvements. I'm sure you've heard, you know, prior testimony and other applications on storm water. We're not uh based on impact size a major
development. So, we're not I'll call it forced into hitting any specific criteria, but we are improving the storm water that's there. Now, there are a couple of underground infiltration systems on the site. Uh, and we are essentially expanding that to make sure
there's no increase in any flows from this site from before to after the expansion of the parking lot. And we do that in a couple of ways. I I probably can describe it from the rendering.
>> Okay. Uh one of the key features at the bottom right you can see there's an area of green and in that location we have excavated or proposed to excavate a what's called a smallcale infiltration basin. So that would be an added feature
providing significantly more volume for storm water that would also based on soils infiltrate. Uh we've taken an additional element of one of the existing underground infiltration locations and we've expanded the pipe to make that larger as well and that's at
the downstream sort of the bottom left of this site where everything is flowing directionally. Uh and then through some discussions with uh your engineer's office, my understanding that we will need to connect that outflow which does not
presently into a nearby inlet which is just left off of that page and that can be done outside of the road pavement but within the right of way. So we can accommodate that as well. And will the storm water this is an enhanced storm
water system beyond what is required by by regulation >> by the literal rule of the regulation. There's because we're not a major development. We don't have to um improve the storm water system. But here it obviously makes sense to do it.
We're expanding the parking lot and we are not increasing the flows based on that expansion of the parking lot. making improvements to what's there. >> If we could do I think um although Mr. Kennel is here to help us with circulation and parking, I think it's
part of your design. If you could take us through the intended circulation on site >> I might just before that mention one thing here before I forget. The basin I described has a retaining wall and that is at the front yard and your ordinance
talks to relief for walls and fences to provide that don't provide 50% sort of light and air passing through. Uh it may still require relief although I think it might not also. That's an excavated basin. So that wall sits down in the
ground. you're actually looking right over the top. So whether that needs relief or not, um it's not a wall sticking up that you look at the face. >> It does need relief. >> Understood. Understood.
Uh and then as you said, going back to circulation and parking, uh the existing parking lot is that one in front of the building. Uh we talked about the light and dark pieces of pavement. There are 32 existing spaces. uh and we're proposing to expand that.
Uh by requirement, we would meet it uh exceed the required 72 spaces based on the new number of classrooms. Uh we achieve that through 66 spaces, seven of which are EV spaces and with
the credit that gets us to 73 where 72 are required. Uh just a couple of other dimensional elements, the drive aisles here are 25 ft wide. Uh parking spaces are 9 ft by 19 ft deep. All of that's compliant with the ordinance.
Uh we did have uh the fire department look at this site uh and they provided a letter with no concerns and I would state even though there will be traffic testimony on it. From my opinion, it's existing in and out to this site. There's good circulation. I believe it's
safe and adequate. Uh >> these these EV spaces they have the chargers in each one. >> They will have chargers between. So one charger serves two spaces. There's one stalk two charges. >> That state is that mandatory?
>> Yes. >> They don't need their own charger. They can have one charger in between and have >> say this is a mandatory thing for the state to put these EV charges. >> Yep. >> Yes. >> Oh, it is. >> It's mandatory. And the state also gives them the ability to take an EV credit.
I'll be honest, it's not something I support, but it is something that the state says if they provide them, they get credit for them. >> Well, EV at a daycare center in particular, not really sure it's appropriate, but >> there's a wall.
>> What do you know? What level are you going to make? Are these just going to be made ready or are they going to have actual chargers? >> The goal was to have actual chargers. I didn't think that we were allowed to have make ready under these circumstances. And what level charger are you proposing? >> I believe that these would be the I
think it's the level two. >> Okay. Just because level one is like a residential charger and it's designed for you to plug your car in overnight to get like a charge. So if it's a level one charger here, people are going to get no benefit out of it. So level two is I think the minimum that I would recommend.
>> Yeah. But this is private property. They don't want just people pulling in there. >> Well, what if it's an employee? >> Just the employee. it. There are ways to control um access to the chargers, right? >> You don't want anybody trespassing. >> That's correct. >> Right. >> John, I just think it's a waste.
>> I get it, but this is a you know, comes right from Trenton. We had >> we had no control over it. >> Ken Lewis, c can I have a couple questions um up to this point? So, you you had 32 parking spaces and then with the addition of the parking lot,
you're at 73. 73. No, credit 66. >> 66, pardon. 73 with the credits for the Okay, sir. >> The second story edition. How many square feet is the second story edition? >> Um,
the numbers I have are the total footprint of the building being 7,789. >> So, you're basically building and you're replicating the building. >> A little bit less. Okay. A little bit less. Um, so you're you're doubling the size of of
the building in essence >> uh with with classrooms. Oh, I'll wait. Sorry. >> Well, guys, it's not 73 parking spaces. parking spaces that give them 73 credits for parking because of the bonus credits
they get for the EV spaces. >> So, it's like a make parking. >> It's like a bonus credit. >> When someone says you have two and a half kids, it doesn't anybody has two and a half. >> It's a hypothetical >> and the cars obviously can't do >> and EV spaces cars can't park on top of each other. So, you're really not
getting >> Okay. So, my question is, um, you know, with with the addition of the the addition of the addition, uh, and the parking, I I've driven by this place a
million times, right? I'm a little concerned, um, with with the drop off and the pickup and the amount of people and the parking that is going to be there with the addition. Um especially, >> you know, if if it's anything like where
my kids went and they have an event on a Saturday and you got kids and siblings and parents, is there the chance that this parking would not be sufficient? >> I think we all want to end this. The
testimony of operations and the testimony from Scott will be significant. It's an important question for us to work out with you. >> Okay. Uh this is a this facility is somewhat unique. There'll be no Saturday activities this building. >> Okay.
>> This um this building has an existing community base that is going to be the community base that's served and the the director who will who is is here or coming she's she'll be here no later than 8:15. Okay.
>> She's prepared to go through she's been the director for the three years. She can go over the operation. >> Okay. But it's I it's something I think we need to discuss with you. Yeah. We also want no on street parking. >> Absolutely. Understood. >> Very tricky intersection over there. >> It's a busy area.
>> Understood. >> So you know what we want what we're going to get. You understand that? But we want it at least in in writing that we have. >> All right. We'll we'll wait and >> we'll wait. It's fine. Mr. >> Yeah. >> Thank you. >> Sure.
>> May we continue? Yeah. Yeah. I'm sorry. Thank you. >> No, this is why this is the part that we come for. We are looking for your feedback. Uh so to continue a little bit on in terms of the parking area and circulation, uh loading for this
building would all be by u vansiz vehicles. So there'd be no largesiz truck need for a largesiz truck for delivery here. Uh the pedestrian circulation's also been looked at here. So, we're adding sidewalks along the street and then
connecting that from the street to the building. You can see that in the lighter color on the plan. Uh all of the parking facing the building, there are ballards placed along the sidewalk throughout that length. One element uh that we would need to
comply with, there's a expectation of every 65 ft having depressed sidewalk for access from the parking to the sidewalk. uh that would need to be added to the plan but we would comply with that that can be done
I think let's if we can talk about the existing parking lot and its distance from the street and the relief that would be required for that parking facility. >> So there's a specific uh requirement as a waiver if you don't meet it. Uh it says parking should be discouraged in
front yards. Uh where it is like it is here, it should be fif sorry 100 ft from the street. Uh we're obviously dealing with an existing uh building an existing parking lot. So we don't meet that 100 foot setback for the parking area. I
think the way we've looked at addressing it and we'll get in a little bit on landscaping that green area that we do have between Kent Road and our site just has some trees in it and it's our intent to landscape that more much more thoroughly to some of the board members that I have
not presented too many applications to. We never come to you without going to the environmental commission. We never come to you without meeting with Shy Spiro on the site and we never come to you without having sitdown meetings with the fire chief and all of those have
occurred. Um we've been working with fire chief but I've already we've already shared that we have their approval letter. The environmental commission we've gone to the environmental commission recently. We'll speak to that before we conclude but and the landscaping that is shown. We've also met with Sher and have agreed that
we'll again have her revisit the landscaping and any outstanding issues or concerns that she has and I don't think she has any left we will comply with. >> Could we go into could we go into just trash and recycling?
>> The existing site does have a outdoor trash enclosure. It's right near Kent Road near the entrance. uh and we're proposing to move that to the back of the site uh for a couple of reasons. One being aesthetic. Uh the other being sort of how the building itself would operate. It's a more convenient
location. Uh I think there's been some questions raised about access by a trash vehicle. There's certainly direct access to it. Uh but a trash vehicle would then need to back up from that location. It would
be a private hauler and all halls, all removal of trash would be scheduled for off hours when students and vehicles weren't there. I'm sure Mr. Kennel could also speak a little bit to the circulation element of it. >> Could you identify the opportunity that
you built into the parking lot for a turnaround of of the trash vehicle backing out? So along uh the the path back to the trash enclosure, we've taken what would have been the area of the last parking spaces on the right and
we've chosen to stripe that off. So >> come down and towards the Walmart be the last >> Yep. Come down. >> First first space on that side, >> right? They see all the little blue dots for the EV spaces and the last one would
be right there striped off as a turnaround location. Talking to your engineer's office, there's probably still some work to do in the final design of that to make it a little bit larger of a radius and access for turning around, >> but that would provide an area for a
trash truck to turn around without backing all the way up to the entrance. >> I just want to say for the record, I think that's a terrible idea. Um, this board gener I'm happy to hear from Mr. Kennel, but this is a daycare number
one, and we don't typically like garbage trucks backing up for a long distance. And a garbage truck backing up for that distance to get to that turnaround is how long? 80 feet, 100 ft.
>> I mean, it's Can you just sol that? I just wanted you here in your other locations that could be it's just >> just eliminate this whole thing with you know it's private it's privately owned and make sure that the the company's coming
>> at 5:00 in the morning right >> respectfully that's no >> is it possible >> I mean they can say whatever they want >> but you know at the end of the day it's our responsibility to make sure what you guys approve is safe and that is not safe I I mean remember Laura when we did
the townhouse house development up on Strickland Road. It's a whole big to-do. The garbage truck backed over a kid. So, I mean, this is not ideal. >> Any backing up is negative here. >> Yeah, this is not ideal. I I think you guys need to go back and think of something else.
>> We have the other locations are putting trash in the front yard. Um, >> what about >> which is how it exists today? >> Yes. >> Yeah, it's it's in the it's in the front yard. It seemed that it was something we thought we should be curing. We hear them differently. We we'll when we meet
with you >> and then they can back up. >> We'll work that out. >> Where's it located in the front? >> So, what about >> taking it where it is and just turning it took >> the problem is is if they remove too many parking spaces to provide this
bumpout or this turnaround, then they're underneath their parking requirement and they would need a variance for parking. >> You did have it up front and you enclosed it real nice. Well, and mayor of note, it that's where it currently is. >> Don't want it there. >> Also, the uh where you eliminated
the >> where you had the two EV spots, you said you eliminated that for a turnaround. Can you return those two spots and make the turnaround all the way down the end? >> There's a >> like like to the Yes, those two spots there. Can you eliminate those as
parking spots? Make that a turnaround? I don't know the turn rate is or what the exact measurement on that is, >> but >> well, my suggestion is knowing they need to come back, I think they're hearing that they need to look at something in an alternative. >> Um, so I think rather than continuing to
hypothetically design it, I mean, I don't disagree that perhaps somewhere near the rear there makes sense to be a Kturn movement if they really want to push it to the back of the site. >> Um, perhaps they look at keeping it and screening it a little bit differently where it currently exists. I think they've heard the comment and I think
that they know they need to rework that. >> Most appreciative of the dialogue. We we'll get together with >> and I know we're going to get into flow a little bit differently >> with a different testimony. The um question >> would it be like a one consideration for
one way in one way out. So I'll leave that for that when we get to that question >> that part of it. >> Um you've designed. >> Is it one way in one way out? >> We could talk about how it's designed now.
>> Oh, I'm sorry. Okay, I see. >> Okay. I can't I can't >> within the parking itself, there's no one way only traffic, but there's one way out and one >> one way in. Okay. >> And then one and then what is it? Two-way on the other driveway.
>> Yes, >> both driveways are one way. It's the circulation internal circulation that's two-way. But the access to Camp Road, one way in, one way out. >> One way out. >> Yeah, >> that's an existing system. >> It's an existing system.
>> Okay. >> Um, >> briefly lighting. >> So, obviously, the site does presently have lighting. Uh, >> in our proposal, we're taking the lights that are actually mounted to the building and they're being relocated on
the building, same lights, uh, to provide better coverage. There are five poles out front that would remain. I think there's a little bit of control of those lights and design work. We still need to work through with your consultants on to they would like to see
it a little bit dimmer to meet some of the ordinance requirements which we believe we can do. Just need to work through that a little bit. And currently the property is serviced by sewer and water. If you could confirm that sewer and water services available for the
expansion. Uh there the services are there. They would that would continue and based on the way we see it there would be no changes to those at the moment. >> This piece of propert has a basement. >> Does this piece of property have >> basement on this?
>> No no mayor. No >> space. >> No, it's a it's a slab building. Yeah. >> Just ask. No, the I I made some comments about the landscaping and working with Sherry, but if you could just take us through the
landscaping that that is there, please. >> So, what's being proposed are we like to sort of think of it in a few different elements. Foundation plantings around the building. Uh uh you know, I think of it as a headlight hedge, but a hedge along that front row of parking. So those spaces where cars would aim out
towards Kent Road. There'd be a hedge along there and then added trees throughout in the basin and then along the street frontage and some additional buffering towards Walmart. So pretty substantial additional planting. Uh we have and
would continue to work with Mrs. Spiro. She's provided some very detailed and and good suggestions on what should go in there. Uh we did also supply a woodlands management plan. There are eight trees being removed but 32 being planted which
meets the requirements in the woodlands management plan. I think that is a good overall description of the application. I have no further direct questions of Lewis this evening. We would welcome any comments or direction that the board or
the board's professionals have to share beyond that which you've already done. >> Gentlemen, any further questions? >> Is there any um after the second floor is built, is there any second uh rooftop units or any kind of mechanicals going on the roof?
>> Mr. Redi is next up and we'll ask him to include that in his presentation. >> Jennifer, >> um I just have a couple things. Um there's no sidewalk connecting the sidewalk along Kent Road to the building
which requires relief >> actually. Uh and if maybe we haven't gotten it to you, but we can connect it. I thought it was on the last set of plans we sent to you at the on this image the left. It wraps around the >> I do see it. I do see it, >> but we did not originally and and that
was a a comment you had and we added it. >> Okay. And then um I want to talk about the shed which also requires relief in the back. >> Yeah. >> What what is the purpose? >> The the shed is you'll hear from
operations, but the shed is used to um pack away the seasonal outdoor items. That's what it that's its purpose. >> Snow equipment. >> And and since the original plan we got to you, we have moved it. It was originally moved way to the back property line, right on the property
line. It's now pulled up. >> See? So, you know what would be helpful? Because before when I tried to put up the plans, you told me you didn't want me to put up those plans, which I usually use so that I can point to these things >> and you wanted me to use this exhibit, which is >> inconsistent with the plans.
>> Correct. >> So, just so the board can see, if I go to the coloriz rendering, this is not colorized. You'll see that the shed is not here. I believe it's now in this location. >> Correct. that location where you got the shed.
Now, it's not not up here for us. >> Yeah. >> But if the garbage truck was to come down, >> and the enclosure for the the garbage truck was put where the shed is, >> right? >> So, the truck could turn in and then the truck came turn out into the spot where
you have the dumpster right now. That could be possible. Well, that's >> I don't know, but that's that looks like the truck could make the movement all the way down, turn into it, and then K turn out and then you just lose those two those two spots,
>> right? >> If that to work, and then you could have your shed next to it, too. >> By having identified the shed as an issue, Jen, is there a is there >> Well, it was just a setback because it's supposed to be set back, you know, place the height. >> Yep. and where where you showed it
originally was on the property line. So, it did not comply. I will note, however, that what's behind the site is is the basin for Walmart. So, the proximity of this, they just need relief for it, but the proximity of it to the property line, I'm not really that concerned about because I don't think it's
impactful to a a detention basin. >> Right. But is it your intent to keep it in this location? I >> think we would prefer having it uh further back to the property line. It provides for more play area inside the fence, but um
>> I would recommend that. >> So, it's a separate property. >> Why not? That way you can figure out this turn around with your back. to me.
>> You got to be clear. >> I like hearing your suggestions, >> Mr. Chair and Mayor. >> Be honest with you. How I am. I'll tell you right. I'll tell you straight up. >> This is This is why we we don't come with an expectation that we have all the
answers. We come engaged in this coll. We're just volunteers. >> All right. So, garbage can and shed. You guys will go back to the drawing board on this. Yeah, you got it. >> And and and the sidewalk has been identified. It was but it was on there.
>> It was on there. Just not on the rendering. >> I think we're good >> on that one. >> One more question. Maybe I don't know if you have the answer. Playground areas. >> Yeah. >> That's going to be compliant to what the state wants with the national >> a lot of it's it's >> whatever the state is. >> It's it's state regulation.
>> Yeah. whatever dias I have nothing further and if if we're if if we're finished with Lewis I'm ready to go to Mr. Rodost and yeah some architecture >> okay thank you thank you >> thank you
So if we have >> you just want to affirm the testimony you're about to present to the board concerning this pending application will be nothing but the truth, all truth and nothing but the truth. >> Yes, I am. >> I do just want to state I'm going to apologize to the witness. There was
another updated color site rendering which shows the sidewalk and the relocated shed that I had up I guess a prior one and there's a newer exhibit. So I just because I noted that it wasn't and I was working off the plan. So I do
just want to note that they did have that on the rendering. Um we just have two different site colored site renderings. >> There's only so so much you could do Laura. >> Yeah. >> When I when you try to work the computer and take notes and think all at the same time. >> Thank you. >> All right.
>> Mr. Rudosti if you would take a few moments to share with all your education and your professional background. >> Mr. Chair, I would submit Mr. Dossi is here practically every single meeting and we have accepted his >> absolutely time. >> Yep. >> Let's get some proof that his license is
in good standing tonight. >> Uh yes, my license in good >> standing. Then I'm going to ask if you could identify the exhibits from which you'll testify and if you could begin with the exterior of the building and to there's the question that was brought to our attention about the rooftop
equipment if be certain to include that in your presentation. Okay. >> Uh yes. So the exhibit I believe is A22. Uh and this is sheet CS2 proposed elevations dated 10424. Um >> I mean Mr. Chair, I could also stipulate
Mr. Adasi works very closely with my office on every application. He's here with you. I take no exception to the design of the building. I think as usual he's done a really good job. >> Thank you. Thank you. >> Looks good. >> Could we We're going to take that as our
foundation. I I mean it looks more of a like a resort than a child care center. It's it's a nice looking building. >> Thank you. That's very nice of you. >> Um any questions, gentlemen? >> Can we talk about the rooftop and >> Oh, yeah. I'm assuming there's going to be nothing with a pitched roof. Right.
>> I want to just Right. So, the So, the roof has a five on 12 roof pitch. Um and inside the roof, there'll be split units. >> Okay. >> So, they'll be >> inside the attic. Correct. >> Got it. like an attic. >> What's the siding? Just regular bottom siding.
>> No, the siding. We have different siding materials uh to break up the facade. So, at the bottom we have uh a faux stone veneer like a cultured stone. We have um horizontal siding and we also have a uh a sheeter look a cedar look shake
>> and then we have trim work to break it up so it's not just a big vinyl box. >> Look like we're staying a Poconos. Um Am I just thanking Mr. Ferdi for coming this? >> Yeah, thank you. It was
>> Are you comfortable? I'm comfortable. >> Okay. >> Steve Steve's office has always worked very well with my office and he's always taken everything that we have suggested. >> That's much appreciated. >> And now I barely have to do anything because he's already going to know what I have to say. So he does it from the beginning.
>> Thank you very much. >> Okay. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. Pages of outline. Great. So, Mrs. Rabinowitz, who is the director of the school, has arrived. Okay. >> And I would like Mrs. Raben to come up. That would be great. >> And we'll go through
>> I have my outline for her on here. >> Okay. >> Good evening. >> Good evening. If we could have Mrs. If you could stand to swear or affirm. >> Do you swear or do you affirm that the
testimony you're about to present to the board concerning this pending application shall be the truth and nothing but the truth? >> Thank you. >> Mrs. Rabinowitz, I board members, I'm not offering Mrs. Rabinowitz as an expert. Um, but Mrs. Renowitz is the
director of the school and I uh and is very familiar with the school's operation. So, she's qualified to describe it to you, but we don't have degrees and that say expert at being a director of the school.
>> So, I if you could begin, this is where they're picking your voice up. if you could begin by telling the board what your responsibilities are, what your title is, and for how long have you held that um responsibility. >> Okay. So, um basically I'm just direct
the school, run the you know, run the the site. Um you know, >> Ken, she's gonna have to speak up. >> Yeah. Sorry. >> Need a big voice. >> Sorry about that. I'm not used to talking out loud. I'm not the teacher in the classroom.
>> That's a good voice. That was a real good voice. >> We try to keep soft voices, speaking to little kids. Um, we I'm basically director of of of the school, which you know is hiring the staff and being there
all day to manage the operations going on. >> How long have you been the director of the school? >> Three years. >> And that's the number of years that the school has been there, >> right? So from the from its inception >> and the hours of the school day, your
hours are not necessarily identical to some of the national schools. What are your hours, your school day hours? >> Between 9ine and three. >> So your your program begins at 9ine and concludes at 3. >> Do you have before care and afterare programs? >> So we do. We we don't have before care
and after care. We have the not it's basically 9 to 3:15, 9 to 3ish, you know, roughly. Um, but the drop off and the pickup is pretty staggered. Um, >> and is drop off and pick around the 9:00
and around the 3:00? If you could explain how that works. >> Yeah, so the school opens officially at 9, but the staff definitely, you know, comes before that. And then there's um and then we close up at you know we officially have dismissal at 3:15 but it
takes time for close up too. So the students are gone by 3:15. Your staff is there a little bit longer at the school. >> And there was a question about other programs. Um to make clear, no activities on the weekend,
>> right? >> And do you have evening activities at the school? >> Generally not. That could happen maybe once or twice a year. >> And how many employees do you currently have? And how many employees do you
anticipate you would have if the expansion is approved? >> All right. So, right now we have about um 18 teachers and like three administrative staff on board. Um and for the expansion we would
probably need about 14 new teachers. >> Would your administrative personnel remain the same at three? >> Yeah. >> So, you'd be going from 18 teachers to 32 teachers. >> That's right. And are these teachers that are there the duration of the day 9
to three? How much does they they work full-time? >> Yes. >> Student population. What is the current student population of the school? >> About 140 children, maybe slightly less. >> What are the ages?
>> So there we start at newborns and we end at and it's till four year olds turning five. Do you have kindergarten? >> No. >> So we call it kindergarten. They they they start at they they start they come into the year are four years old.
>> Okay. >> It's not it's not kindergarten per se. >> Right. Right. >> Got you. >> And Mr. Dasty didn't get to put on the right. There's seven new classrooms in the second floor. And >> at two teachers a classroom that's the
14 new teachers that you're projecting. >> Right. Right. And so the student population is currently at 140. What do you project that the capacity would be if the additional seven classrooms were added? >> Probably about 250. >> We we previously went over this and
addressed the mayor's question. You have zero to six months and six months to 12 months and 12 to 18. if you could just kind of take us through how the students are broken down, what their age groups are on when they're on the campus. >> So, for right now, we have a a zero to
six month room, a tw a 6 to 12 month room, a 12 to 18, 18 to 24. We have one two-year-old class, and we have three year olds in two classes, younger threes, older threes, and then we have two four-year-old classes. >> And you would proportionately expand
those with the seven new classrooms, >> right? And if you could describe the security system that the school uses to keep the children um safe during the school day. >> So the building is locked at all times.
Um we have you can only enter if you know the code. Um only our staff knows the code. Um parents need to be buzzed in even just so that we know that you know there's no no one else coming in. Um the secretary has a video camera. I
have a video camera as well in my office, you know, so that in case there were any anybody from outside coming to visit, we'd see them before they are allowed in the building. >> Are the are the cameras across the entire property? >> Are they just at the parking lot? >> Okay.
>> And then the playground area. >> Okay. >> So, you're increasing the classroom sizes depending on the age of kids, which we don't know, you know, the It could be zero to 12 months, 12 months to 24 hours to two. So we're adding seven
new classrooms total. >> But you're going from 140 >> projected. >> Projected. >> Projected. That's the capacity. Yes. >> And then >> at this point, we can't >> you can't hau what's coming in.
>> I I understand that. Yeah, >> I think >> we're not necessarily they're not necessarily all going to be new families coming in and new vehicles coming in because we can't at this point we can't capacitate full families. >> I see I see you're expecting, right?
>> Reserved. >> How many >> how many current classrooms are there? >> How many >> current classrooms on the first floor? >> Sure. >> How many current >> classrooms? >> Now we have nine. So, did I hear correctly that you said
that you can't currently accommodate full families of existing customers >> and you anticipate some of these new classrooms to provide space for your existing families that need additional childare? >> Right. That's right.
>> Thank you. Uh while we're on on that, out of the So you have 140 children. How many families do you have signed up currently? >> Number of families. Do >> you have a rough estim? >> I don't know for sure, but I think roughly around 60 families
>> and drop off and pick up times the same for both for all students, different age group. >> Yeah. One of the interesting things that we learned working with the school operator and with Mrs. Rabinowitz is many of the
teachers children are also there for the day as students. If you could just talk about that. >> Yeah. So a lot of actually it makes my job finding employees easier because a big perk of this is that they are able to come along with their children and not have to do drop off in one place and
work at another place. they're there for the day with their kids. >> So somewhat unique element of this is multiple children from families and the employees children. So the the demand on the parking lot is a little bit less
than it would be in in a facility that didn't have those have those fees >> it for the pickup and the drop off. Um let's say the proposed the proposed the way it's going to look. Okay, we have
projected 25 employees, 60 families, 250 kids. Um is it is it proposed that they're going to park in parking spaces for pickup and drop off or is it going to be
>> kind of a shuffle? >> The parents have to walk the kids in and pick the kids out, right? You can't just open the door and let them go. They have to physically walk the kid in the building, right? >> They're not saving them >> in the park. >> That's not my question. >> My question is, are the parents pick
parking in individual spaces and walking the kids there or are they caravanning and back to back to back to back shutting their vans off and walking them in or their cars or their trucks or whatever? >> Everybody parks and moves in. Place that on the record.
>> Yeah. that if you could say you require that they >> right no all cars have to get parked carts get shut off children get emptied >> okay >> out of the car to the building teachers the teacher welcomes the child and then the parent leaves gets back in the car >> okay >> and
>> reverse >> so to to my next question you have 25 employees 60 families projected 250 kids is a total of 66 parking spaces going to be able to handle that foot traffic And Mrs. Bennett may have her own personal
opinion, but Mr. Kennel is qualified to that. That's a recurring concern and >> the parking demands for child care have been studied intensely. So, and Scott's ready. >> Okay. >> And since you're there every day, what
time is the uh the trash and recycling typically picked up? During peak hours or >> I never paid attention to that. I don't >> never paid attention. Okay. I'm just curious, you know, because we we had a before you came in, there was some concern about the cycle of the
>> the vehicles, the trucks. >> If I may, if there's further questions of Mrs. Revenous, I don't want to stop them, but I I do have a little bit more testimony from Mrs. >> Where's the main drop? Both the front of the building or the side of the building? >> Where where do the students come?
>> They're in the front now. >> Handicap sponsor. >> Yes. >> That's your main >> Yeah. So, it would be wise to tell your employees to park >> to park on the side of the building. >> Everybody should park on the side. >> All right.
>> Do you know the average amount of time a parent spends in the facility? Like when they're dropping their child off or children off, they walk their child in. What is the average amount of time that they're physically in the building? >> Pretty quick. It's it's it's it's efficient. It takes pretty quick. Um
what is the average? Is it in the 3 to five minutes or the 5 to 10 minutes? Do you have an impairment? >> I would say the 3 to five minute range. >> I I mean I've been told in other daycare facilities that the average drop off time is six minutes. Would that be fair to say is be consistent with what you experience?
>> I would think slightly less than that, but six minutes, you know, I guess some people are faster than others, but generally between three and five minutes. >> Thank you. depends on a little bit. >> You do. You just hand the carrier and then you meet. >> Well, I'll just say,
>> but I don't want to hear >> you. I don't want to hear any more nonsense with a half a kid or a half a car. I'm done with this. We've done this six years. There's no such thing as a half a kid. There's no such thing as a half a car or a half apartment with Mr. P. Please.
>> Okay. I'm sure that's on you and all the other traffic guys that come here and insult our intelligence by telling us there's a half a spot or a half a car or whatever whatever nons the flow is going to be faster. The flow is going to be slow. >> It's not on you. >> Yeah, it's not on you, Mr. It's not on
you. I just We've been doing this for a long time. We can tell already what's what what's going to happen here. >> All right. The flow is going to come in and >> it's going to be it's a heavy road. >> Yeah, it's a heavy road. Our concerns are on the entrance side. Are those C are the drop offs going to lead out to
onto Ken route? >> Because you got the elementary that's our concerns. It's over. You got to understand what our concerns are. We are concerned that the drop off is going to become an issue on Kent Road on the wall in front of you know the side of
Walmart. That's the only direction coming. one lane keep it could be it could be potentially a problem >> for a short period of time >> but that's a bus that intersection is a major intersection >> because you got the school >> you got the school you got the church on
this you got the group nine traffic coming off at Wawwa that's a major area guys and you need to take in consideration >> everything else around it >> noted >> if I may we started talking about security and Mrs.
has described the security camera system and um if you could also talk about >> the scheduled fire drills, the instruction that's given to the children and the programs that you have to gather the children in the event that there is an emergency in the building and how frequently that is is passed on to the
the students and to the teachers. You just describe that program. >> All right. So, we do have a once a month we have a fire drill. Um there is a plan hanging in each classroom and the teachers know it well being that we do do it once a month as a review. Um it's actually a required you know according
to our license it's it's it's a required thing but we find it to be very helpful and very safe. Um it takes very quick you know and the classes are each they each have a classroom each have a door to the outdoors from their classroom so
they're able to get out quite quickly and quite safely. And once they're outside, is there designated gathering spaces for them? >> Yeah. Yeah. So, they each have a spot in the Yeah. So, every class knows which part of the parking lot they're meant to
um gather in. Um and that's where they go and that's where they stay until it's time to come back in. >> And this daycare facility is licensed by the state of New Jersey. Earlier there was a question. So, the licensing you
you are fully licensed. You're required to have your recreation facility approved as part of that license. >> Yes. Yes, it is approved. And >> and if you could just briefly describe the outdoor recreation facility that are
there and the outdoor recreation that will be there for the expanded student population. You just describe that recreation area to the board. >> All right. So, it's it's you know it's a nice playground. Um it has different activ recreational activities based on you know the ages that come out there.
Um we generally have the children coming out from about 18 months till till you know till they graduate which is about five. So you know there are different level equipment there um to accommodate all those ages >> and all of that equipment and the layout
is part of your licensing. >> Yes. >> Mr. Chair and board members I have no further direct question but Mrs. Benovitz is certainly available to answer any questions that you have about the >> Any questions? >> I have a question. Oh, sure. You go first. >> No, you go. You sure?
>> Yeah, you go. >> Um, so I was based on it's I guess you have like 15 and a half kids per class based on the numbers. 140 divid by 9, right? I know John is like about 15 kids. Can you just describe like the
actual logistics of um one of these like fire drills? Let's say a class like you you you break them down by age, right? So you have a class of like 15 six-month-olds with two teachers. What does like a fire drill actually look like with two teachers evacuating 15 six month because they're
not walking on their own, right? >> Sounds crazy, but it looks quite efficient. >> Yeah, I'm I'm very interested to like actually know the logistics of how you do that. >> We do have more teachers in the in the younger ages than we do with the older ages. So it's it's not necessarily every class 15 cut to two. Um the the baby
department has um has has a little bit more staff than the older departments and then the administrative staff comes and helps out in the baby rooms. Um we generally put we have an evacuation crib for the babies and we put four babies to an evacuation crib and so that way you
need one staff on four babies >> and they will them out quite efficiently. >> Gotcha. >> It's easier to get them out than the four-year-old sometimes. >> Makes sense. Um, how does that then additionally look like when they're on the second floor?
>> How does that look on the second floor? >> They'll have to come up with a new fire plan. >> Well, is the infant room are you proposing the infant room upstairs? >> I Right. So, I think that we would probably put the younger children downstairs and the older children upstairs. That makes more sense. >> That that is the way it's designed on the >> makes it more convenient for daily drop
off and pickup also that way. >> And then there's the two fire stairwells. >> Yeah. I was just thinking like I don't know if I've seen any preschools or or daycarees that are two stories and maybe that's the reason because if you actually had a fire, how do you evacuate?
>> I actually have. >> I directed a different preschool before this one with a two-story building. Um and they did. That's what they did. The babies on the lower level and the older children and the older on the higher level. >> Yeah. >> We actually approved one that's a zoning
board over on Oakland Road. Two stories. Mhm. >> The do >> you can't have babies on the second floor. Super dangerous. >> But it's the same thing is that if you have a two-story elementary school and there's a fire drill, they can't use the elevator. You have to >> No, right. But as long as they can walk,
I guess that's my point. You can't walk. Do you commit if the board is acting the affirmatively that the the like the babies and the 12 to 18mon-old rooms would be on the first floor to ease the efficiency of a fire drill or an
emergency evacuation? >> Yes, I do. I I think it would increase our efficiency in many ways anyway. So >> I think he said by design it was correct. >> Yes, he did. I mean, it almost has to go to say that like you have to be able to walk up the stairs yourself in a scenario where there's 15 children and
two teachers, >> you know, for seven classrooms upstairs and there's a fire. I mean, you're not getting them all out, carrying them, you know, rolling like they have to be able to walk on their own, be on the second floor. >> But I would say that the other piece of this is that this proposal and layout
all has to be reviewed and approved by the state. the state has very very specific guidelines in terms of staff per per child. So I think you know the baby room it's like one staff member for four kids and then as they get older that ratio changes because you don't
need as many hands on um but I would say >> also affect parking management too right? >> No >> there's more if there's more entrance and they need more staff then affect >> well I think that she's calculated that in to the staff that she's discussed. So 25 >> with the increase.
>> So I mean the thing too is that this is not like it's not like public school where every kid that wants to go here has a spot. Like there's a finite amount of of space in the facility which is probably why and I don't mean to put words in your mouth but it's probably why they are unable to accommodate full
families currently because they've maxed out the occupancy of the rooms because it's not just simply staffing that regulates it. It's the size of the rooms as well. the square footage based upon the age of the children. How many children are in the room? Do there need to be bathrooms in the room? Do can there be bathrooms in the hallway? All
those things are meticulously reviewed and screened and approved by the state. Everything that they do has to comply with state guidelines, which I think is why Mr. Pap asked if this was a licensed facility. >> And I also as the as the question was
posed, Mr. Redi asked if he could make a comment. There is an actual state regulation about who can be on the second floor >> and I think it's be very valuable to share it with you. Steve is under oath and Steve if you could share that.
>> Sure. So the state requirements uh they reference the international building code and uh based on the use group the children on the second floor have to be two and a half years old or older. That's um and then the drawings will be reviewed by the state and they have to
be approved by the state of New Jersey. >> All right. >> So >> no babies on the second part. >> Yeah. Let me let me just interject here before we start going down a path of questions. Right. So I I've done a lot of license of child care centers probably 100 in my career.
>> The way child care centers work, right? You're dealing with three different entities at the government level. You're dealing with the New Jersey Department of Health, you're dealing with the New Jersey D. And then you're dealing with the Department of Children and Families Office of Licensing. All right. So you have three different government entities
in the state of New Jersey looking at every little detail that these child care centers do. Okay? Every single thing. Um so before we start asking questions about um you know the the little things ju just do realize you're going to have three layers of government
looking at these things that take their time and you know you got I think Mr. Pave got a kick out of this. Like they it's precious cargo that they have in these buildings, right? So they it's a little more conservative on the way they do things. They take their time. Um you know they've seen child
care centers, you know, the way this all started was a child care center was built in a mercury in a thermometer factory before this was all licensed, right? And all the kids were getting sick and they didn't know why. This is before environmentalists and geologists and LSRPs like myself were involved. Um,
now there's strict regulations when they build child care centers to, you know, make sure that they're not contaminated or if they are contaminated, there's proper protocols and and controls put in place so they can be built and be safe and, you know, protected protection of human health and the environment. So, it
it is all I I completely understand uh where you come from, Ken. I just wanted to put that on the record uh for you because you know >> ask you also I would love for you to help me out with the RAO. >> Sure. So I Yeah, I mean I'll do it for you. Um >> I'll set the question.
>> Sure. >> We have an RAO for the property. It says the property is clean. It's it's a it's a clean RAO, but it says that you have to get another RAO because we're making a change to the building. Well, I know this LSRP named Mr. Huzer and I said, "Why do I have to do this?" and I
learned why you have to do it. Perfect REO, we have to do it all over again. >> Yeah. So, an RAO stands for response, action, outcome. And um when the LSRP program came into existence in 2012, it basically the RAO takes the the place of the historic no further action letter
that was issued by the D. So um for the way childc carees work are as new construction existing construction if it's existing construction any alteration of the building in this case it's a significant one because there's an increase in size but if you have a
play area that's 10 x 10 and now you're going to have a play area by 10 by 20 you have to do the whole child care center all over again and it requires a new rao that goes to the D it goes to the responsible party who in this case would be the childare center owner owner
operator. It goes to Howell Township. It goes to Mammoth County. Um, and it basically details that, you know, there are no issues with the expansion. Um, again, this was done because somebody expanded a play area onto a farmland that was loaded with pesticides,
arsenic, and lead. You can imagine the lawyers got their hands on that one and was not a good good thing. But, um, yeah, that is true that it will be done. and Kent was nice enough, excuse me, to come to the environmental commission,
excuse me, and uh share that they will be pursuing another RAO. >> So, I appreciate the opportunity to go through all that that depth of that before the board. U is there any further examination for
>> The only thing I want to ask is the um 258 children listed. Is that the max that you were giving? like that's the limit you're allowed to have there or is that your number? >> Is that your proposed number or is that the max you were given? >> It's our projected number but the it'll and and it's the maximum that we're
asking this board for. >> Okay. >> Then the state will give us the final number, but we're agreeing that that's that's the cap. >> Okay. Thank you. >> My question is really simple that when you first come in, you mentioned that you will buzz parents in. I don't have
children, nor have I been to a daycare. But I wanted to know that you mentioned that you buzz them in or if not, the administration will have a keypad. I'm assuming it's not a keypad, it's an RFID reader. And on the floor plans, it shows doors going out from each classroom.
Does the admin have RFID readers to enter those or is it solely just for leaving during fires? So they do have the this the code is the teachers have the code to their classrooms also. It's actually a code. It's a keypad.
>> So all the doors on the side they can all have access from when they park their car walk through instead of going through the front. >> Right. >> And there's going to be security cameras all along the perimeter showing who's coming in and out. >> I have a >> You have to say yes.
>> Yes. Yes. Terrible. >> Uh couple questions. Uh 9 to3 the general hours, modified hours on Friday or is that? >> Yeah, Friday is 9 to 1. >> Summertime as well. >> Summertime is 9 to1. Winter is 9 to 12:30
>> and this is year round or you have modified programs for the summer months. >> Those summer months is included in the same schedule. >> Same thing. No change of >> anything like that. Uh front door entryway. uh you would just know because you're
there. Um is it a vestibule or single door entry? >> So there's two there's a double if that's what that's >> right. So parents would have to go in >> and then get let in again >> then get let in. Okay. >> Anything else
Laura Jen >> Mr. Pap um take the time to do Scott Kennel tonight. >> See well he's already walking this way so he's ready to go. Mrs. Rabenowitz, thank you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you.
>> So that Mrs. Rabenowitz could go home, could you open it the public to Mrs. Rabenit? >> Sure. Yeah. >> Does anybody from the public have any questions for Mrs. Rabinowitz about the operations of the childare? Seeing none, good night.
>> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> You're excused. Thank you very much, >> Scott. Good evening. We will accept your credentials. Sir, do you swear or affirm the testimony you're about to present to the board concerning this application shall be the truth and nothing but the truth?
>> I do. Scott Kennel, keen ne with Mcdana and Ray Associates. >> Mr. Kennel, there's some revisions that will be made to this plan with regard to trash and recycling. So, I'm not going to ask for your testimony on that
element of the plan because it'll be reworked. We'll need your testimony that when it is reworked, but I would ask if you could go through the circulation on site, the general circulation, and then the important questions about the adequacy of the parking.
>> Um, if you could take us through what your experience, your knowledge, and also what published data is on that point. >> Yes. Well, as was discussed earlier, this we're using the existing access system which has the southerntherly access opposite Church Road is ingress
only and all traffic will exit out of the northerly driveway with the addition just as it does today. Uh we conducted parking counts as well as traffic counts uh in September of 2024
and basically again this daycare center has a more compressed time frame but still traffic arrives and departs basically over a 90minute period for both the morning and afternoon based on our observations.
uh for example during the morning peak hour we had 50 trips during the peak hour entering the site whereas over the 90-minute period it was approximately 80 vehicles uh the parking that is proposed here again
with the addition seven additional classrooms basically the enrollment or capacity increases by 80%. We have 32 parking spaces today and we're adding 34. So therefore, we're adding in excess
of 100% even though the enrollment is only increasing by 80%. And a lot of and there's a number of additional children that are are part of existing families. So based on that consideration, it's my opinion that the uh 66 parking
spaces will be adequate to support uh the the daycare center. And again, they don't all arrive at a specific time. It's over a 90minute period. So, you have a turnover of parking spaces as parents drop off or pick up their children. Um,
my recommendation would also be that we have the parking spaces adjacent to the sidewalks, both on the west side and north side dedicated to the parents and have the staff park on more of the perimeter parking just so that they're
closer to the sidewalk and less um traffic, you know, pedestrian movement within the within the parking lot. Did you take into consideration stack the vehicles stacking up on the in >> you observe that?
>> Yes, we observe that and the parking supply proposed here allows for uh greater parking utilization to accommodate the additional demand as well as the existing. Um we're not ex because of the fact that we have a parking aisle that goes in the easterly
direction to bring them further into the site. there pro there's a obviously more parking spaces to accommodate the drop off and pickup time. Uh but as as you stated, we were not looking to encourage any parking on Kent
Road. There's too much traffic activity and >> we're not encouraging anything, but facts are going to be facts. We have daycarees in Howell existing that you go there and it's chaos in the morning. I understand trying to get your kid get out. It is what it is. Okay. parked in
fire lanes. It is what it is. Okay. And you know, neighboring towns with daycarees, same thing. Everyone parked in fire lanes. Well, all street on street parking. So, like I said to you, it's just a tricky area. If it was a different area, it
would be more suitable for me to sit here and accept the fact that we're not going to have anybody out on the road. I know we can't prevent it, >> right? But but also I in my opinion based on the fact we're adding an additional parking aisle parking spaces in the easterly direction it provides a
better distribution and to better accommodate those peak periods. >> There's enough there is no parking on Ken Road. >> Correct. foot and a half. >> During your observations in September last year, when you observed the parking
lot and you observed the movements, did you ever see cars stacked up out onto Kent? >> I have not observed that. Um, but again, we're have a compressed area, so there are people that are um jockeying for position. And again, I just think with
this plan, we have more parking available adjacent to the building to better accommodate those uh drop off and pickup times. And also just to mention too is when we looked at the northerly exit driveway with the
additional children, staff, and future traffic growth, we had uh level service B coming out of the exit driveway. So again, we have a good level of service at that point. So that it's it's an efficient operation. I think the fact that the exiting driveway is separated
from Church Road makes that work much more efficiently. >> Oh, yeah. Complete disaster. >> Right. >> Is the exit driveway one turn only or they can go either way? >> They can go left or right out of there. Correct. And they're predominantly making left turns out of there. I mean, it's it's basically a 90 90% of the
movements coming out of there are left turns because basically to go make a right, you go to Waw Watt and you're basically working your way to Route Nine to go back south again. >> Well, that's going to that's going to cause back up into too because making >> that's a lot of cars coming down Kent
Road off of 9 >> and we we factor that in. I mean again that the g the good thing here as well is because of dismissal is from 3 to 4 3:15 that's before the heavier loading with the commuter traffic is typically occurs
after 4:00. >> So that's another benefit with their operating hours not being at the critical PM peak flows on Kent Road. >> There's no other schools. Well, we have the PAL right up the street, but that's >> but there's all, you know, that's school
arrival dismissal time where you have buses, parents, everyone else on the road to all the other schools in town. >> Um, so seven EV spots, how many of those counted for? >> What do you mean how many >> EV spots? How many credits
>> you did? So two for I think two for one. >> So it's about 14 spots out of that total spots. Well, we have 66 paved parking spaces. So, so there's 66 >> parking spaces on site >> physically. There's 66. >> So, where we have 32 today, we're we're
adding 34 additional. So, we're more than 100% greater than what >> including the EV on top. >> Okay. >> But 25 employees. >> So, there's there's 66 physical parking spaces. >> Not including the EVs cuz >> No, 66 total
>> without the credit. 32 employees >> EV facilities. >> No, there's 66 available >> and that would be >> 34 available spots. >> Seven of those 66 are the EV spaces. >> That's correct. >> And if there's no families that drive EVs, you could throw those out the
window then because >> they're not restricted. I I well there there there are number I mean observed number I think there's adequate number of EV vehicles that can accommodate with the seven spaces
>> because I'm not down there too often at these arrival dismissal times but within the last couple weeks I happen to be and I did see probably about somewhere in the 10 to 15 range backed up onto Kent Road awaiting to turn into that lot.
Has that been something that you noticed during any of your studies? >> I haven't observed that and one of my staff counted. They didn't observe that as well, but um now you're saying turning right >> later in the day. So could have been maybe a Friday dismissal when it was
earlier because 3:00 I'm typically not around there. I'm getting my own kids. So it could have been a Friday dismissal earlier on where sizable amount of cars were backed up waiting to turn in >> the parking lot >> on road lined up waiting to turn in >> into that that facility.
>> I mean can I make a suggestion since we're not going to finish this evening perhaps Mr. kennel, you can have your staff go back out there specifically, you know, I don't know if 9:00 is the peak hour on the road, but specifically at like start time and 300 p.m. to
really assess the stacking and, you know, what the issue is with the driveway, you know, in a couple of of days of the week just to give the board a little comfort that, you know, >> well, whatever number it is double. So, whatever. >> I I get that, but but there's also and
he also testified, guys, that that now they can pull farther into the lot, so you don't need to get a space right up front, and that might alleviate that situation. Correct. >> Correct. And I'll also look at the Friday uh dismissal period since it's earlier in the afternoon. >> Yeah. I just think if let him go out,
take a look and and report back specifically on what's going on there now. >> Um just so that we could have a good handle on it. I just want to impress upon the board this is a permitted use at this location. So there's limits to what we can do regarding off-site
traffic. So you know the use is permitted in the zone. You know we're really getting a little far field with some of the questions. So you know this is not a use variance. It's not before the zoning board. They don't have to prove no negative impact. I understand we're trying to make sure that there's a
safe scenario here but it is permitted. So like our hands are a little tied in terms of how far we can go with this. >> Yeah. The way just not knowing how the operations work there as I was driving by, I thought it was like a drop and go kind of lane where why else will those
cars be all backed up? But the fact that they need to be in parking spaces, are they just waiting for spaces to empty out so they could get in there and that could be a while with that three to five minute average of six minute per car? >> I would take some pictures too, Scott. >> Okay, we'll do. Scott, do you
>> phasing concerned, they need to do the parking lot before they do the addition? >> Do when in your traffic studies, do you use any type of uh like Wi-Fi cameras or anything like that to see like live? >> Some of them we do we do have um a
vendor we use to to have videotapes the intersection. >> Okay. >> Um >> I didn't know if that was just common practice or is you know >> increasing. Yeah. >> Yeah. It's it's a case by case. >> Okay. Okay. with and I with permission and and if
it's appropriate I think that this is an an excellent place for us to say we got good guidance from the board good questions and direction from the board certainly from Laura Newman and Jennifer Beam good guidance from them but specifically what they're looking for um
>> I know that the client wants to be back as quickly as possible and engineer is going to tell What kind of a >> Eileen? How are we looking on schedule for November and December? >> Four weeks in
here to four weeks to get your plans back in. >> Uh November 6th, I have two applications on >> We won't be ready for November. >> Yeah, it's probably the last in November. >> Be ready, but we won't be ready. That's not fair. That's >> uh December 4th, I have one and December
18th, I have one. >> Mr. December 4th for everybody. >> December. >> Yes. December 4th. >> December 4th. It is. >> As you can see, our court reporter transcribed the hearing. We'll get the
transcript to the board. Um, we'll also work from the transcript to identify the issues that were brought to our attention and we'll work with your staff to see if we come up with some solutions. We know that there's a 10-day rule. So that would be 10 days before
December 4th we have to be filed. We'll make certain that we don't we we I don't want everybody working over Thanksgiving. We'll make sure that we get it 15 days before the December 4th. Um and I'd ask if you could announce for
that date and carry us without further notice. >> We're going December 4th. Could you make an announcement for this applica? I I'll do it. Uh so this application is being uh carried well not carried but it's being continued on December 4th 20 uh 25
here in this meeting room at 7 p.m. This is case number SP1135 StarCap Holdings LLC. Uh do we need um >> I need an extension of time. >> So on the record extension is granted to the end of the year. Okay.
>> And I'll follow it up with a letter to tomorrow. Thank you, Ken. Thank you, Scott. >> Thank you. >> Appreciate the procedure. >> Have a good evening. Have a good weekend. >> Okay. And the final matter uh this
evening, it's the area in need of redevelopment hearing, which is a public hearing to consider um the properties along Route 9 northbound and southbound from Lanes Mill Road to the Lakewood Township border. Uh Jennifer Do you swear or affirm the testimony
you're about to present to the board concerning this area in need of redevelopment? Study shall be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. >> I do. >> Okay, guys. I know it's getting late, but um the mayor and council have
approved a resolution asking this board to evaluate the Route 9 corridor both in the north and southbound direction from Lanes Mill south to the Lakewood border. I want to re I want to comment a couple things before I start. Number one, this is a
non condemnation designation. That's stated right up front. uh there's zero ability for the township to use any kind of condemnation or eminent domain as part of this um this redevelopment study. Secondly, I also want to state
for the record that the redevelopment plan should the board find that the area meets the criteria is going to be an overlay. It is not going to be superseding, meaning all the underlying zoning that is there, primarily HD1s because that was just recently changed
based on our last master plan, um would remain. And then an additional opportunity for some other types of uses that are not currently allowed in the HD1S would be part of that um redevelopment plan. There is no
intention to limit people's utilization of the property. The entire intention of this study is to add and provide additional opportunities for those properties along the Route 9 corridor to redevelop. There's no mandatory requirement for a for a resident or a
business owner to do anything. They can stay exactly as they are right now, but this is just adding an additional layer of opportunity that a a property owner can take advantage of to potentially redevelop their property in the future. We've looked at the the corridor. There
are quite a number of parcels that run, as you can imagine, from Lanes Mill to the Lakewood border. Um, all of which are enumerated within the document in both block and lot form plus map form. We have pretty much mapping uh or photographs of all the properties and an
analysis of of which criteria they would qualify as. Um, when you're designating an area in need of redevelopment pursuant to the local housing and redevelopment law, it's different from the MLUL that we typically base our land use decisions on here. And there are a
number of criteria that are identified on pages two and three of the report, which range from um, A to H. When you're reviewing an area in need of redevelopment, not every single specific property needs to meet the criteria independently. you look at the corridor
as a whole and even if one particular site is in perfect shape, like I think there's a brand new office building that's going on just south of Ford Road. Obviously, it's, you know, this is a a development that got approved at the zoning board. It's under construction. It's brand new. It's a beautiful
building, but in the overall corridor and the redevelopment opportunity for the corridor, it falls between like where the old Pizza Hut was and then other property on the other side of it that could use a little TLC. So um this is not a statement on any the quality of
anybody's property. It's just a this is like the legal piece of the process to designate the areas in need of redevelopment so that a redevelopment plan can be pro can be adopted um moving forward. What we found is that not every
property meets the same criteria. There are a number of criteria that the corridor itself meets and I'm going to refer to them as B, C, D, and H. B is basically the discontinuence of the use of the buildings previously used for
commercial, manufacturing, or industrial. Um C is land that's owned by the town, the county, housing authority, or unimproved. Um, D is, uh, uh, buildings that I don't
want to use the word blighted because that's kind of that we don't use that term anymore, but they're they're a little older and could use a little spiffing up. Um, and then the last is H, which is smart growth. I do want to say which is the next step of this process that you know the goal and the intention
is to allow for some more mixed use development which is similar to what the mayor and council adopted the last meeting Ian was the last meeting um for the Route 9 south corridor from basically freehold to west farms road um
which is allowing the underlying zoning to remain with some mixed use and some other types of uses that you know were not initially within the existing zoning. With all that being said, um I would submit to the board that it is my professional opinion that the corridor,
both the north and southbound side on the southern portion of the township, do meet the criteria to be designated in need of redevelopment. And I would respectfully request that the that the board act in the affirmative. >> Any questions, gentlemen? Okay. Well, I do see that we have some
members of the public here. Do you have any questions uh regarding the presentation? If so, you can come on up. >> Yeah, come on up. >> Microphone should be on. If you could just state your name and your address, please.
>> My name is Kimberly Young and I own the property on uh it's it's actually lots. >> Okay. right near the other church and Alexander by the U-turn. Okay. >> Ben right there. >> So, I had a vision >> many, many years ago that God had given
me to help the community with this property. There's 32 acres there. I've been up and down a lot with the town with like tax issues and farmland. I do a lot for charities. I do a lot to help kids with drug addictions and stuff and
I work with big community stuff. So my question was like my vision back in 2004 when I bought this property was to help people you know to God and the church happens to be right next door. They were working on trying to grow the church and
I was my vision was to help the community where we can bring more kids to that area you know and do things and develop over there for the kids you know and give them hope and give them dreams you know. So my question is like
basically like doing something like that because I know there was a a part of all of Route 9 where they were going to put it towards the uh county where they were going to open up parks and stuff like that like is that an opportunity where we can do
something on that land? >> I mean so that's the next step. This is the first designation step. So the next step would be the preparation of actually the plan which has the uses and the types of things. I think we're open to hearing if you have specific ideas that you think would be appropriate.
Every piece of property along the corridor doesn't wind up having to have the same uh zoning for lack of a better word. So if that piece that you own which is adjacent to the church lends itself to something else, this is an opportunity to have that included in the plan. Yeah.
that's probably not going to come to fruition in all honesty until some point next year. Okay. >> Um but that this is the first step in enabling that to happen. So before you leave, I can give you my information >> and you could let me know what you're thinking and then we can see if we can
make it work and incorporate it into the plan when it gets prepared. >> Yeah, that'll be great. That'll be great. M >> any of your property have Route 9 footage? >> Yeah, there is >> all of it is roof front. I have three lots. So, it sits on Route 9 right by the church and right by the U-turn and
then I own behind. So, the front uh parcel is they say it's like more for um commercial and then there's residential. And my dream was to do something where I can maybe help kids that are going through scars or problems cuz we all
have scars. >> Are you on the the southbound side or the northbound side? >> I'm on the uh southbound. >> Okay. Okay. That's But you're So, you're across from the church. >> Yeah. like the church is here. That's all my property. >> Got it. Okay. >> Right. Yeah. So, I would suggest because that's kind of this this is kind of the
next steps in the process that I can give you my information and then reach out and then we can talk about how how to best lay it out and then, you know, it's definitely something that we can incorporate into the plan as we prepare it in the future. >> Yeah. I was thinking, you know, maybe I
don't know if we can use it for like uh activities for kids to go to. You know, there's so many different places where kids are going through outlets. There's so many drug addictions. There's so many problems. And for 33 years, I've been working with these kids, helping them with scars, helping them with pain, so they have places that they can go to. I
mean, I haven't really come up with the exact plan, but >> I mean, we could we could definitely work that out, but that's definitely the next step. >> Yeah. Get get Jen's information before you leave this evening. Thank you for sticking around. I appreciate it. Thank you. >> Like basketball court. >> Um, anybody else this evening? I know a
lot of you you guys have been sticking around for two plus hours. Yeah. Coming up, sir. >> There's two of them. >> Oh, I I I said sir at the same time. There's two people. >> Good evening. If you could just uh state your name and your address, please. >> Jerry Eles and 18 Pepperidge Road.
>> Uh Jerry, how are you today? >> Good. >> What can we do you for? >> Uh school. Now, you're going to have to stick with me because I had a lot of I've had re uh reconstruction on my >> That's okay. >> Um so, uh I raised my I've my parents I
lived I lived at the angle in before uh before Candlewood and my family was the first family to close on a house in Candlewood. >> Wow. >> So, I've lived here my whole life now. I raised my three boys. I I raised my
three boys here. Um, now I'm I quit my job in in 2020 to uh keep my son and his daughter going. I I take care of their kids. And I've
dealt a lot with uh let's put drop off pickup stuff. Okay. And you know, they say, well, you know, on this on this school, >> I think we're Yeah. So this is not that that's over for tonight. >> No. >> Yeah. But you can come back the next
time. >> December. You can come back in December when the public will have an opportunity to speak. >> Yeah. Please do. Yeah. Please come back in December. >> All right. >> Yeah. We I didn't open it up to the public today because they they haven't finished. But December 4th, please come back. >> Yeah. This is for the redevelopment. Yeah. Down.
>> Thank you, sir. I appreciate it. Anybody else for the redevelopment? You okay, sir? >> Yes. >> Okay. All right. Seeing none, I will close the public portion. Any >> So, I would just respectfully request
that the the board act in the affirmative and approve the area as being in need of redevelopment so we can send this back to the governing body for endorsement and move forward with the redevelopment plan. >> Okay. >> All right. Oh, yes, sir. >> Is there a way I could something in
writing? Present something in writing. My wife is going in for some major surgery. Uh, I guess we could submit it to Eileen. Is that how? >> Yes. >> In the in the planning office. >> Okay. >> Yep.
>> Okay. You're welcome. Um, okay. At this time, I will entertain a motion uh that we is it an official adoption? Yes. >> Of the area in need of redevelopment? >> Correct. >> Motion. >> Mr. Beta with the motion. Do I have a second?
>> Second that. >> Mr. McNicholas. >> Yes. >> Okay. Roll call, please. >> Mr. Bato. >> Yes. >> Mr. Carbonic. >> Yes. >> Mr. McNicholas. >> Yes. >> Mr. Mercer. >> Yes. >> Councilman Adele. >> Yes. >> Mayor Leio.
>> Yes. >> Mr. Freriedman. >> Yes. >> Mr. Wetco. >> Yes. >> And Chairman Husser. >> Yes. >> Approved. >> Thank you, Jennifer. Thank you, Eileen. Um, master plan update. So, we are
currently in mediation with the affordable housing dispute resolution program. Um, we're in really good shape, but we are going to have to amend our housing plan. That probably won't happen until the beginning of next year, >> but if we can get settled and get, you
know, it's going to be minor changes, but if we can get settled in advance of next year, you know, it might it might show up in December. Um, I just don't know yet because things are not moving very quickly. Okay. Okay. Uh, no reason
for executive session. Laura looks like she's ready to go play in the snow. >> Um, >> all right. Do I have a motion to adjurnn? >> Motion to adjurnn. >> Do I have a second? >> Second. >> Thank you everybody. Good evening.