Here, let's just open up. You got to whack it. >> Today is October 7, 2025, and I hereby call the meeting this meeting of the Howard County Council to order. >> This meeting is being held in accordance
with public law 1975, chapter 231, open public meetings act. Adequate notice has been provided provided in the manner prescribed by law. This agenda is complete to the extent known and formal action will be taken. I'll begin with a roll call. Councilman Nadell >> here. >> Councilwoman O'Donnell >> here.
>> Councilman Reubel >> here. >> Deputy Mayor Fischer >> here. >> Mayor Leio is absent this evening. >> Okay. Resolution 25-276. Is there a need to go into executive session this evening? >> Yes, there is. We're going to be discussing personnel and possible land
sale. >> Motion to go into executive session. >> Second. >> Councilman Nadell. Yes. >> Counciloman O'Donnell. Yes. >> Councilman Rubel. >> Yes. >> Deputy Mayor Fischer. >> Yes. >> Thank you. Are we ready? >> Yes.
>> Yes. Okay. >> Roll call. >> Councilman Nel >> here. >> Councilman O'Donnell >> here. >> Councilman Rubel >> here. >> Deputy Mayor Fischer >> here. >> Mayor Lejo is absent this evening. Can we please rise for the pledge of
allegiance followed by a moment of silent prayer? >> I pledge to the flag of the United States of America standy and justice for all.
>> Thank you. We have a proclamation this evening. >> Fire prevention week, October 5th through 11th, 2025. Whereas the Township of Howell Bureau of Fire Prevention and Howell Fire and Emergency Services are committed to ensuring the safety and
security of all those living in and visiting Howell Township. And whereas fire remains a serious public safety concern both locally and nationally, and the presence of lithium ion batteries and many household devices, including unique fire risks and excuse me,
introduces unique fire risks. And whereas most of the electronics used in homes daily, including smartphones, tablets, laptops, power tools, ebikes, ecooters, and toys, are powered by lithium ion batteries, which if misused,
damaged, or improperly charged, can overheat, start a fire, or explode. And whereas the National Fire Protection Association reports an increase in battery related fires underscoring the need for public education on the safe use of lithium ion batteries. And
whereas residents should follow three key calls to action by only listed products charge batteries safely and recycle them responsibly to prevent battery related fires. And whereas lithium ion batteries store a large amount of energy in a small space and
improper use such as overcharging using off-brand chargers without safety certification for exposing batteries to damage can result in fire explosion. And whereas the proper disposal of recycling of lithium ion batteries prevent environmental hazards and reduce fire
risks in the home and community. And whereas HAL Township first responders are dedicated to reducing the occurrence of fires through prevention, safety education, and community outreach. And whereas the 2025 fire prevention week theme, charge into fire safety, lithium
ion batteries in your home serves to remind us of the importance of using, charging, and recycling lithium ion ion batteries safely to reduce the risk of fires in homes and communities. Now therefore, the governing body of the township of how does hereby proclaim
October 5th through 11th, 2025 as fire prevention week throughout the township of how. >> Thank you. >> Uh can we please have a motion for the acceptance of the minutes from the September 16th meeting? >> I'll make a motion to accept the minutes
of September 16th, regular and exec. >> Second. >> Councilman Nadal? >> Yes. >> Councilwoman O'Donnell? >> Yes. Councilman Reubel. >> Yes. >> Deputy Mayor Fischer. >> Yes. >> Thank you. >> Do you have any reports from department officials?
>> Miss Bennett? >> No. >> Mr. Gross? >> No. >> Mrs. Festino? >> Yes. I have a few. October 14th is the last day to register to vote for the November general election. Early voting begins on October 25th through November
2nd, Monday through Saturday, 10:00 a.m. to 8:00 p.m. and Sunday 10:00 a.m. to 6:00 p.m. at St. Veronica Gym. October 18th is the Howell Fall Fest at Soldier Memorial Park from 11:00 a.m. to 4:00 p.m. with a pie baking contest. The winners will be announced at 12:45 at
the stage. November 6 at Memorial Delia School will be the shredding program from 400 p.m. to 7:00 p.m. for residents only. And that's all I have. >> Thank you. Uh at this point, we're going to open the floor for the hearing of citizens and public comments.
>> Each person shall first give their name and address to the clerk. The council should be addressed as a collective body and not as individual members. Each person shall have one turn to address the council. Comment shall not exceed a total of 5 minutes. Speakers shall be notified when their time has run and no
time extension shall be permitted. Mrs. Samurel. >> Good evening. Paula Samurel Heritage Point to Driftwood Drive. On June 24th of this year with standing room only, our residents voiced concerns ranging from uninforced ordinances, unlicensed sober
houses, unfair farming restrictions, group events, transparency, and last, but certainly not least, the murder on White Street. Luckily, the council that sits before us tonight were listening and ordinances were adopted resolving many of the issues presented despite the responses we received that night. I
think tonight's attendance proves that you guys did a great job. The response in regard to the sober house on Ruben Court was deemed as compliant, which as we know was not licensed and thanks to Miss Bennett and working with Miss Miss Carr is no longer in operation. The
response pertaining to occupancy limits was compared to residential occupancy, not commercial like we were talking about. Once again, Miss Bennett came through for us and the ordinance of Merkantile business rental was adopted. The response to more rental inspections was deflected back on us with an
explanation that we wouldn't want to have our homes inspected as such and would be a privacy viol violation. These answers were like comparing apples to oranges, residential versus commercial. Warnings of potential lawsuits were expressed if stronger rental laws were
adopted. Since when did the threat of lawsuits take precedence over the safety of our community? When asked about the workings of the EU system and notification of the vote on adoption, the response was there was no one at there was no one at the meeting and prior meetings were poorly attended.
Perhaps the lack of attendance was due to the fact that many felt their concerns were not being addressed. One person spoke of fear of repercussions in light of a situation regarding code enforcement and a farm operation. I don't know all the circumstances, but at a time when many businesses are being
forced to cut and run from how I hope that the current officials will work with the farming operation and other local businesses rather than against them. The responses to requests for changes to rental ordinances as well as the sober houses at the June 24th meeting left many feeling frustrated and
angry and fear of losing one's quality of life was voiced more than once. Some of the responses and comparisons we received that night caused confusion. And as often happens on social media, misinformation about what those in attendance were trying to accomplish was misconstrued and vamped into accusations
of discrimination. Some have no understanding that we are simply trying to get the non-compliant rental companies and investors as well as realtors to conform in such a way that will maintain our quality of life. In addition to showing respect for our culture, including our own religious
beliefs, family values, holidays, education and activities for our children, civic duties, social gatherings, Saturday barbecues in the summer, rooting for our favorite baseball, soccer, or football teams. I'm sure that we all want the same thing. Respect for our own culture.
Unfortunately, what brought many people to this meeting was the murder, which brought attention to renting to undocumented immigrants. At a time when little facts were known about the murder, and many feared there was a threat to the entire community, many of us were appreciative and comforted by Mayor Legios and Councilman Naidell's
taking this situation seriously and not just calling it a love triangle. I know that many people have strong convictions on both sides regarding the immigration issues, but I'm not here to debate that subject only to point out that the elected town of council officials that
sit before us tonight were listening to our concerns and fears and sprang into action as they felt best. Town officials elected and voted in by the residents of Hal Township, not appointed or employed, but elected. The June 24th meeting
created a collaboration between the president present town council and its residents and kicked off a movement that resulted in accountability enforcement of ordinances and fair practices for everyone as well as bringing forth a much appreciated line of communication
with our town officials. Thank you, Miss Bennett, mayor and council men and council members. We've got your back because you had ours. Thank you. >> Thank you. Thank you very much. Um, is there anyone else that would like to come up?
Okay, seeing that there's no one, may I have a motion to close public comment? >> Motion to close. >> Second. >> All in favor? >> I >> um does anyone have >> response to public comment? >> Any response?
Thank you. >> Thank you for your uh your words. Uh I know myself along with the mayor and the rest of the council were up here because we were elected to be here by the residents and that's who we're going to continue to fight for. We are represented. We're representatives of
the community of the voters of the people who live here. We're residents ourselves. We live here ourselves. We deal with the same problems as everybody else. So, I'm just going to talk for myself. I'm nobody special sitting up here. I'm just elected to represent the community and that's all I'm going to continue to do
and fight for what's best for how great. >> Um, with that said, I would I would like to make a plug for Councilman Rebel, who's up for uh reelection already in three
months, two months, uh, soon. Uh hopefully we'll get the town to come out and support him as well because he's definitely on our team and on your side. So thank you for that. >> Council,
>> yes. Uh I wanted to say that uh I would like to thank the uh anonymous donor that sent a very large box today to the senior center. Um a box arrived with my name on it. leaison to the senior
center. I went over the uh uh Melanie Decker who was the uh administrator in that building and I we opened the box and there was extensive eyewear um a lot of the readers uh and whatnot. So that
will be disseminated among the senior center any overflow should there be any typically then uh shipped out to servicemen overseas. But at anyway, it was a huge box. Um, whoever sent it, it was an anonymous donation. I want to say
thank you very much. That was very generous, very kind, and the senior center and how appreciates it very much. Uh, secondly, how day was a a wonderful surprise. Uh, as always, weather was beautiful. As I did the opening remarks again this year, I realized that this is
the kind of thing that brings Howell together. So, next we have our fall fest which is similar to Howell Day and the green fair. Uh continues on with the uh friendships that grow within the town when we have these events. They're
always familyfriendly and free. So, we hope to see everyone there. But um for those that attended How Day, uh get ready because the next year is going to be even bigger and better. So, mark your calendars for next fall as well. And thank you for coming out.
Councilman Reubel. >> Uh, nothing. >> Nothing. Um, I I would like to just add, um, yesterday one of our attorneys, longtime attorneys that worked for, uh, the township of Hal passed away. Uh, we want to share our condolences with the
family of of Jerry Dasty. Um, very heartfelt condolences to his to his son Chris and and the rest of the family. Um, anything else? You know, I'm sorry. Uh, it's not that I forgot, but you did remind me with Mr. Dazy's, uh, comments.
One of our citizens, Paul Schneider, who gave over 50 years of volunteerism in the town, has also passed away. Uh, Paul will be uh, remembered fondly by many people that worked with him over a
50-year span. Um, our condolences go out to his family and friends. he will be missed and he was an unbelievable asset to Howell and we're very fortunate in this town that we have other people that have taken on his uh ideals and continue
to serve this town year after year and we do have many people that have actually volunteered 30 40 50 years but Paul was um a moral compass uh to be admired in how so um very sorry to the
Schneider family. Thank you. >> Thank you. Okay, we're going to move on to the consent agenda. Uh let's vote on the consent agend agenda items. Does anyone wish to vote on any of them separately? >> Nope.
>> No, I just had a uh question on one of them. Not sure if you have an answer, Mr. Gross. Uh, with regard to 271, the outdoor circuit training, is that just um outfitting Dearwood with new playground equipment, or is there something else going there?
>> Old playground. Thank >> Can I have a motion to approve the consent agenda consisting of resolutions 25-266 through 25-275? >> Make a motion. >> I'll second. >> Councilman Nadell, >> yes.
>> Counciloman O'Donnell, >> yes. Councilman Rubel. >> Yes. >> Deputy Mayor Fischer. >> Yes. >> Thank you. The consent resolutions pass. >> Okay. We'll move on to unfinished business. Public hearing. Adoption of ordinances. >> Ordinance 25-40. Ordinance of the
township council of the township of Howell adopting the Route 9 redevelopment plan pursuant to NJSA4A12A-7. If anyone would like to speak regarding this ordinance, please come up. State your name and address. Nope. >> Okay. May I have a motion to close the
public hearing? >> Motion. >> Second. >> All in favor? >> I. >> May I have a motion to adopt ordinance 25-40? >> Move to adopt ordinance 2540. >> Second. >> Councilman Nadell. >> Yes. >> Councilwoman O'Donnell.
>> Yes. >> Councilman Reubel. >> Yes. >> Deputy Mayor Fischer. >> Yes. >> The ordinance is adopted. Ordinance 25-41, >> an ordinance amending article 10 of the township code entitled zones creating a section 188-84.6 entitled moderate and low-income housing
mixed use overlay zone 16 known as ML-16 zone. If anyone would like to come up regarding this ordinance, please come up to the microphone. Paula Samar to Drifwood Drive. just had a couple uh quick questions on the agenda. Um for the um the proposed
developer, it says that there's going to be 175 units. Um I don't know if there was any changes or anything, but the ordinance says that it's 36 units plus 116 that comes up to 152. So I was just curious about, you know, how many units
were going to be there. Um but more uh concerned about the affordable um the affordable housing units. Um one page says that I think it's the um agenda says there's going to be 35 units and
then um the ordinance says 30. So I was just wondering how many you know affordable units are going to be you know this this developer is saying he's going to be putting in. Um, and also, I don't know if you can answer this question at night tonight. I just wanted
to know what's um the total amount of of of affordable housing obligations that's left for for How Town Township. I don't know if anybody could answer me that. And um and also what's the criteria for
the for for someone getting one of these one of these units? Is it going to be subsidized through HUD, through the state? Um, you know, that kind of thing. And what who's going to decide who gets these affordable housing um these affordable housing units? So, that's
really pretty much it, >> Miss Beam. So, why I'm here. So, the concept plan that we received from the prospective developer, just so everyone is aware that this property is in the town's approved housing element and fair
share plan that has been submitted to the court for their ultimate approval, the concept plan showed 152 units with the with a 20% set aside, which equals 30 affordable units, low moderate income units. The developer then asked in the
bulk table and this this explanatory statement is incorrect. So just so that I I appreciate you bringing that up. Um for flexibility to potentially increase the unit count. I'm not 100% sure how that would be physically possible given the size of the site, but ask for the
flexibility in the bulk standards to go up to 175 units if possible, which would result in 35 affordable units. So an extra five units that the township would be able to take credit for. That's where
the confusion lies. So we anticipate the site's going to have 152 units with 30 of 30 low moderate income units. However, if there's the ability to for the town to take credit for additional units, that is is not going to create a
negative impact on the concept. I think the flexibility was something that is was why we had allowed for that increase if if um if they can comply with everything else that's in the ordinance, meaning setbacks, coverage, buffering,
etc. The town's obligation in this round, just so that you're aware, is 304 credits. That was uh mediated by township officials in March with the court. That was agreed upon. That's our number.
>> Um >> brought down to 268 or something. >> So, well, it was started at 337. We had done an analysis of DCA's number and we came in at about 267, but then you have to go to mediation. So you're fighting
it out with fair share and so we kind of like settled in the middle basically. >> The certified occupancy specialists work with HUD for years. >> So these units are not HUD. >> I understand. >> These are they're not going to be subsidized at all. Low and moderate income households have to have an income. They are not subsidized by HUD.
They are not section 8. They have to be. So what happens is% that the town has and has continued to have as required by the statute an administrative agent who here is community grants and planning. >> They manage the units once they're
constructed. Uh individuals that are interested in receiving units, affordable housing units have to become income right qualified, right? So and that's based on it's not a hard and fast calculation because it's based on
your household size. So, if you have a lot of kids, you're enabled to have a higher income and still qualify. If you're a single person, then it's just based on your income. You're qualified as either a moderate income occupant or a lowincome occupant. Uh, and you get
put on a wait list. I could tell you that the wait list here in Howell as well as pretty much every Mammoth County town is about two years. When developments are about to come online, uh the developer works with the administrative agent to
hold hold what they have what they call a lottery. >> Um and then there's a list formed of the individuals that are interested in that particular development. It's not like a list where you take a number at a bakery and you're going in order because it depends on whether you're low-inccome,
moderate income, whether you qualify for a one-bedroom unit, a two-bedroom unit, a three-bedroom unit. But the administrative agent that is qualified and certified and accepted by the court manages and maintains the income eligibility, the occupancy. Now,
individual developers do have a right to run in like enhanced, let's say, checks, criminal background checks, those types of things. So, if community grants says to a developer, we have an interested party for your two-bedroom unit. The
developer runs the individual and they come back with a criminal history, they have a right to refuse occupancy to that individual. And that happens regularly. And I will tell you that since I've been here, which has been almost 20 years now, um the developers that the township
has chosen to include in the plan are very diligent about doing those additional checks. Um and once once that happens and a person is selected, then they're able to occupy that unit. Um, so this ordinance number
one, we're required to zone projects that are in our housing plan for their project. That's required by historical uh regulations that came out of the DCA as well as the legislation that was adopted last year. And this is just implementing our plan. And as the
council is aware, I'm not sure the public is aware that we are in the middle of affordable housing mediation with the court and fair share. So continuing to show that Howell is affirmatively implementing their plan, you know,
before we absolutely have to is a goes a long way with the court to show that Howell's acting in good faith and is taking the situation seriously. >> So So I'm sorry, I don't remember I if you had answered. So, do you know roughly how many um units we have um
left to go to meet our obligation or >> So, we have a plan that was approved in June that satisfies our obligation. That plan right now is involved in mediation, which I can't get too much into because it's a legal issue. Okay. >> Um and so we're continuously working. I
want you to know that like we are in very good shape here in Howell compared to a lot of our neighbors. >> Um it would be Our number in this round of 309 when our in our last round was, you know, high eights, low nines is a significant testament to how much work
the town has done over the course of the past. >> I I would just like it to and I know some towns do that, but um it would be great if um the people that already live here, local people, people, you know. >> So the law requires that the units be affirmatively marketed. That's a
requirement. And that means we're in region four which is Mammoth Ocean Mercer. So when a unit comes online, it has to be affirmatively marketed within the region. I can tell you >> hopefully it will be >> it is highly unlikely for a resident somewhere else in the region to come
here to occupy an affordable unit. The majority of the people are not only from how but you know freehold in the surrounding areas. not seeing a lot of transplantation from like you know Trenton or >> so so when this when this weight list comes about and you have the lottery
will it be announced like you know >> it's done publicly but like we don't do it here >> right >> you know I mean it is it has to be noticed the lottery has to be noticed so it's noticed I think it's a notice >> how do people know that they want >> it's in the newspaper that's that's the
requirement to notice it in >> so anybody that would like to perhaps be in you know included in, you know, um, in in this, uh, community in this development, they would, who would they contact? Would they contact >> Community Grants and Planning? They have a really, really good website. Uh, it's
very simple to follow. All the paperwork that anybody would have to fill out to be even considered to go through the income eligibility is all on there. Um, that's not these guys. That's a they they manage that on behalf of the council, but they have a really really
good website and it's very >> community grants and planning. >> I think that would be very useful for a lot of people in this >> maybe John we could put like a link on our website to the community suggest not
if it's not there we certainly can put something on our website. >> Absolutely. Okay. Thank you so much. Appreciate it. and I'm always available. I'm here a lot. I'm at every planning and zoning board meeting. So, if you have any further questions, >> you're more than happy to address
whatever you need. >> Great. Thank you so much. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Is there anyone else in this ordinance? >> Hi, Sandra Vieiraa. Hi, Alia Court. Um, I don't have any specific questions and I think it's because I don't understand
this. I read it before coming tonight and I knew this was something number one I wanted a lot more information on before personally I took the dive to say, "Yeah, I'm behind this." Um, I hear
the term developer. Yep. I get anxious. I hear the term affordable housing. It causes a lot of questions. Um, based on what I've personally experienced in Howell over the past three years, couple
months where there were stuff voted in at a meeting that, you know, I had no idea was being voted in. I just personally as a resident would like more information and I feel like I'm not really truly on
board until I understand what is this going to entail for the public school system. Um what's this going to entail for budget, for taxes, for everything. I just want to know more details and I
don't think as residents we truly understand what this is all about right now. So, I can address that. Uh, the state of New Jersey in the state constitution requires that every municipality provide
their fair share of low and moderate income housing. It's a constitutional mandate. So, we don't really have an option. And I can tell you that a lot of towns throughout the state would love if they had more of an option, but we don't. Um the time frames associated
with which this is moving are set by legislation. We have zero control over it. We've requested extensions denied every town that's requested extension with the exception of Wall and Jackson. I'm still trying to get to the bottom of that have gotten they have been denied
on their extens their extension. So we were obligated here in Howell. The DCA came out with numbers last fall in October. They came out with numbers with for every town in the state. The towns
were then given the opportunity in the November, December, January to provide a challenge to the number that the state determined was our obligation for round four. We're in round four here, which goes from 2025 to 2035.
We did that. We went through the DCA released the parcel data on the land capacity factor in November. We methodically went through every single property that the DCA felt needed to be
included to to generate our number and we challenged it. So the DCA's number came out. I think it was like 336 337 337. We challenged the number. I think we came out with our evaluation in
January of 2 276. The governing body uh by resolution accepted that analysis that my office prep uh prepared. We were obligated to do that by January 31st and
submit to the court what our position was, which we did in March of 2024. the affordable housing dispute resolution program or the program as they call themselves which is comprised
of retired judges throughout the state. There's like I don't know 10 of them maybe now. There were like seven, now there's a little bit more. Engaged in mediation between the town fair share housing center, who's a nonprofit advocacy group for affordable the
provision of affordable housing and the program judge engaged in mediation which we participated in. There was a lot of arguing back and forth between fair share housing centers professionals, our professionals on what needed to be included in the analysis,
what should be excluded from the analysis. Um, and ultimately the township settled with the program and fair share housing center at an obligation for round four of 304 credits. That's our obligation this
round. The town was then given to the end of June to prepare a plan and have it adopted by the planning board, which we did. And the governing body endorsed it by resolution prior to the June 30th deadline submitted to the court. Over
the summer, July, August, any interested party has the ability to review the materials which are available on our website, but they're also filed through e courts, which this is a court proceeding. Um, and there, if anyone wanted to
challenge our plan, they had to do so by August 31st. We had three challenges to our plan. Fair Share Housing Center who challenged 400 of the 426 plans that were submitted. And then there were two
developers that were annoyed that they didn't get picked to be included in our round four plan. We had mediation with the program judge, fair share housing center reps from the from the town as
well as the developers that are objecting. John, was that yesterday? I can't even remember what day it is. Yesterday. Yesterday. Um, Fair Share Housing Center asked the town for some additional information, asked us to reconfigure some of the numbers and the bonus
credits that we took, which we are in the process of providing to them and have committed to getting it to them um next week sometime. Uh so what where we are now is there
were two projects in the the plan that was approved in June. This one which is on Route 9 South at the intersection of Route 9 and Estelle Lane. It's 14 acre site and there was a site that we refer to as Foreman which
is up off of 33 by between Howell Road and Oerson Road. The foreman property, as you guys probably remember, had a warehouse approval on it in an attempt to deal with some litigation and eliminate
the warehouse um approval and the warehouse development which is next to like North How Little League and the swim club, etc. The developer agreed to pro to include the plan the site in our plan and provide an affordable housing
proposal on that property. The governing body last year before we even got into the heart of this court procedure adopted zoning. The developer came to the planning board. There was a public hearing and they received their approvals. So that project in our plan
is approved. This project needs we are required by law any project that's in the town's approved housing element fair share plan has to be zoned specific to the project. That's a requirement because I think way
back when you know governing bodies would put put projects in the plan they would go to the planning board and the planning board would deny it because there were variances involved and what have you. So that has changed. We are required to zone for it. That's what this is. This is the second site that's
in our housing plan to address our 304 unit obligation. So that is why um they are being asked to approve this ordinance. We then provide that information to the court and to fair
share as just another step in how um furthering compliance with the mandate that is being imposed on them by the state. >> Thank you so so much for that explanation. I guess if I may ask one more question. Um, so it sounds to me
like this has to be approved tonight. Um, but I guess my question or um something just to verbalize would be has this been really thoroughly looked into whatever the verbiage is,
whatever the ordinance is. Um, that might be a question for her attorney. >> We we've gone back and forth with this ordinance for months. This is not being rushed through under any circumstances. You know, when someone gets put in the
plan, the selection to include a property and a project into a housing plan is predicated most of the time on a concept plan that a developer puts forth to the community so that they can see what this potentially would look like.
We were required by law to include the concept plan in the housing element, which was done. We went through this with a fine tooth comb. Uh between the developers team, our team, in-house staff, we've looked through this
multiple times um and have vetted it out very significantly. So yes, this is this has been evaluated. Now that's not to say this is not the fade complete, right? They approved the zoning. The developer still has to present come to the planning board for preliminary and
final major site plan approval. So if you're interested in impacts associated with, you know, how they're managing their drainage, how they're managing their traffic, how they're managing, that all gets vetted out at the planning board in a public setting. So you would have an opportunity to ask questions to any of their witnesses, look at all
their reports at that time. >> I'm going to take this opportunity to add the political side that Miss Beam can't professionally, but she gave you a great legal explanation. Um, these are burdensome obligations that are coming out of Trenton and these policies are
killing our suburbs. Um, so you need to really think twice when you're going to vote next month or in a few weeks. Um, this can be changed. We we need a new governor. Uh, he has already vowed to fight uh, COA to put an end to these obligations that are really
changing our suburbs. So that I know you can't do that, but I can I could I can make the political plug. But seriously though, it's it's killing our suburbs. You drive on 537, you can see what they're doing on right by Culteneck High School. I mean, we've >> even if you drive up 33, you come if you
come east on 33 from Mercer County all the way through like Milstone and Manalapin, you will see the impact that this has had for sure. >> And and and we we have been and thanks to professionals like Mrs. Beam, Miss Beam, she's she's great. um we we've you
know followed the law and and and and we have done what we were supposed to do and and tried every which way to have you know to count what some things we've already had. But I appreciate your question because it it could sound very foreign sounds like you know there different language. What does this all
mean? Please understand that these are this is not our idea, right? These are these are like I said hurtful uh Trenton policies that have been shoved down our throats for the past eight years if not longer. Uh we can make a change >> really since the 80s.
>> Longer way longer. I'm referring to the past eight years. >> So hopefully please please remember that when you go out to vote in a few weeks but and thank you for your question. Thank you so much. I would just add um yeah, thank you for saying that. Thank you for your explanations. I think just
as the residents, as the citizens of Howell, we feel like Howell is already really busting at the seams and and straying from, you know, anything and everything. The public school system, transportation,
the roads, everything. And I would be curious to know how towns like Farmingdale handle something like this. how how towns, you know, that are smaller or quaint keep that town feel. So, in whatever decision is made
tonight, I would just request on behalf of I know the residents and the citizens that we really pick through this with a fine tooth comb. >> Thank you. Is there anyone else? >> Hi, Megan Jimenez. I'm at Driftwood. I'm
not at Driftwood. That's my mom's address. Paula Sel Megan Jimenez. I forgot Paul's corner. >> Yeah, my mom's corner. Okay. Um I just have a question. I know, you know, legally and all these things you have to have the affordable housing a certain
amount, but I just don't understand why we have to approve something so huge. I mean, it's 7,000 square foot office and 15,000 square foot retail. I mean, is there any way you can I know you've been
going back and forth already. Um, but like that's huge for 30 affordable housing. I mean, why do they need to have that? >> So, I'm going to ask I'm going to say number one, it's not huge. It's actually quite small. >> But even just like I'm
>> But you're on Route 9. It's a commercial. It's a commercial corridor. >> Okay. >> Here in how we have limited commercial corridor opportunities, right? Route 9, Route 33 primarily, you know, and every time I'm at the board and a big
commercial application comes in on one of these sleepy, windy farm roads, people come out all upset because the development is in their sleepy neighborhood and not on major commercial corridors. So the the intention is to
maintain the economic development opportunity that the frontage on Route 9 affords the site where other sites do not maintain that. >> So it's commercial. So do they have to have like office and retail? >> Yes, they do. >> The affordable housing in there and the
office and retail they have >> plus market rate units. It's not just affordable housing. There's a it's going to be a mix. So, it's going to be a mixeduse building. >> Yeah. >> With non-residential on the first floor and units above and then residential behind cuz the site is relatively deep. So, to answer your question is yes, they
have to have it. >> So, it's Yeah, it's considered commercial zoning. >> Yep. >> Okay. Thank you. >> You're welcome. >> Is there anyone else? >> I have a question. >> Come up to the microphone. >> Speaking, but I do have a question. >> Hold on. come up to the microphone
>> directed to to you. >> Uh Richard Krug for Sammy Drive Howell. >> I I heard somebody say COA before. >> That was me. I'm sorry. Wrong term. Old term >> because that doesn't exist, right? >> Yeah. So that COA refers to
>> high density housing, >> right? COA refers to Council on Affordable Housing, which was a >> I know what it stands for. I was >> So yeah, that's defunct. This is now being handled by the program, which is a court function. I I think maybe if you you would be the person to do this if you explain to everybody here go back to
the Christy era do it really fast that we had a list for I think it's 580 municipalities with their COA obligation which nobody was able to satisfy I think including this town. >> So >> and so Christie said that's it.
>> Okay. So that's not what happened at all. >> Well let me we just finish. You can correct me. Okay. >> Okay. >> It it was shut down. Co ceased to exist and the judges, as you pointed out, were were now the ones responsible for
determining the amount of uh housing that each municipality should be able to affordable housing. Okay. And so to get 100, make up a number, and I'm a developer. If I build other homes, 20%
have to be >> Yep. >> Uh right. Correct. Okay. So, I got to build 500 homes. >> Yep. >> Right. And uh I'm not going to mention who it was, but there was a pretty bright guy who worked for the town >> when they put in the West Farms
development. Uh it's it was like 87 or 89 co only uh >> 72 72, excuse me. Thank you. Um affordable only. And he said to me, "It's a good thing because it targets the obligation for the town without
impacting traffic, right? Because we have >> less units, >> less units, right? So, we're meeting our obligation and it's not impacting the schools uh as much, right? And and and traffic." So,
um I I was curious about you you were talking about the um you said some some developers contested. >> Yep. >> Not and so were they bringing up the builder's remedy? >> No, we have immunity right now.
So, just to correct, when the Council on Affordable Housing was disbanded, which was in the the initial third round back in like 2008, 2009,
the DCA used to promulgate rags, regulations addressing affordable housing obligations and then the Council on affordable Housing, which was made up of individuals, would adjudicate the matters. The DCA put forth
uh third round rules in 2005. They were called growth share. I don't know if you guys remember it. So, you know, for every 25 jobs, you had to have an affordable unit. And I think it was like for every eight units or what have you, there needed to be a set aside and
things like that. Towns moved forward, this town included, because I was involved in putting plans together based on those regulations. The builders sued, went to court and sued because their the underlying premise is that
they need to be provided with a density incentive to build an affordable unit because there is a financial hardship in terms of the value of an affordable unit versus a market rate unit. So you need to provide them opportunities for increased densities to
allow them to cover the cost of the affordable housing. not my position. That's the position that comes out of the out of the regulations. And they won. So the DCA went back to work and drafted new regulations. I think now we're talking 2008 2009. I was
physically there in Trenton when they were supposed to vote to approve those revised regulations and they there was a tie and they couldn't break the tie and they never moved it forward. That is why
and when the that council was disbanded and it was disbanded for a long time and this process was litigated all the way up to the Supreme Court who came out with a decision in March of 2015. That's third round which basically said that
that round went from 2000 to 2025. Usually, it's a 10-year cycle, but because it took so long to adopt these new regulations, there was what they called the gap period and the round three period. The numbers were astronomically high because it was a 25-
year period of time. I think our number, as I said earlier, was like 868 somewhere around that. Um, and you know, the town worked really hard to create to collect any credits they could um, and had to incorporate some projects into
the plan. The 100% affordable project that you're talking about on the corner of West Farms and Four Plains Road, which I refer to as Howell Family Apartments because that's what it was in my plan. I'm sure the development has some fancy name now. That project was
100% affordable projects require a lot of documentation. Number one, site control. Most 100% affordable developers do not purchase the property. Usually the town purchases the property and gives it to the developer. Doesn't sell it to them, gives it to them. in this
particular instance because there was money available after Sandy for the promotion and the implementation of low and moderate income housing. the developer was able to purchase his
own property and bridge any funding gap that the development created because this the project is funded through federal tax credits and there's usually a gap associated with how much money those tax credits provide and the cost associated mortgage and all those
different things. The Sandy money was available to development in Mammoth and Ocean County in particular um for the provision of affordable housing. So we were able in that instance to get 72 credits. It was a round three site. It was family rentals. So we were able to take a two for one
bonus credit which is not available anymore. Um to get a big chunk of our obligation in round three taken care of with no market rate units. In this particular round, the documentation and the information for 100% affordable
projects is much more difficult through the legislation. And and while I say things like the developers, there's two developers that challenged our plan. You know, I do this all over the state. And in one mediation that I was in this afternoon, a developer that didn't get a
put put in the plan, challenged a municipality's plan saying that funding for an 100% affordable housing project, which is a competitive bid process for federal tax credits, is uncertain. and therefore there's no
certainty that those projects are realistic moving forward which makes those towns vulnerable here. We didn't have that in this round. So that's kind of where we are. >> So is that individual developer threatening with the builder's remedy? >> No. So the difference is once you are a
participant in this process, >> the town maintains immunity from builder's remedy. Now do they are they going to have to negotiate with that developer? 100%. But it's not a builder's remedy where the town plays defense. Like the town still has the ability to, you know, proactively
determine how they want to satisfy their obligation. >> So our obligation for this round is 309 years. >> 304. >> 304. Yes. >> Affordable units >> credits because there's bonuses and other things involved. Yes. >> And does that number represent 20%.
>> It doesn't represent 20%. It's the number the obligation as determined by an evaluation of >> but are we going to build five four times that number to get that >> two projects as I said earlier and guys like not for nothing I'm more than happy to answer these questions but we had a full public hearing on our housing plan
in June um two projects were included into the plan versus things that we already have on the ground. So, it's two projects, one on 33, one on Route 9. And the housing element is available on the website if you guys want to look at it and see how we're satisfying our obligations.
>> But I'm sorry to ask it again. So, 304 units are the affordable count, but there's a a bigger number total. >> Yeah, I'll I'll jump in. It's roughly about 800 units total in new build. Okay. >> Is that roughly? And in our last round
it was 800 and change of just affordable >> and that was on the set aside. So you were talking 4 to 5,000 new builds. >> So our professionals and everyone worked hard earlier this year to get it where >> we got some existing properties counted towards those 304. >> So what's the position of the town's
mind mindset? Do you prefer to just meet the obligation? Is that harder to do? >> What do you mean? If if the if the uh judges determine that 500 homes need to be built here that are affordable, are
we going to build uh you know five times that amount? >> No, because there are other mechanisms in place that afford town's credit. So for example, we're extending existing controls. So Friendship Gardens is an
affordable housing site. They have ex we have worked out a an agreement with them where the existing units >> that were deed restricted and those deed restrictions are set to expire during this round are going to be extended for another 30 years. So we get credit for
those units again. So it's not quite as simple as it's just >> thinking because of the in infrastructure of the town right. Yep. >> That this woman was concerned about impacted schools and everything else. I mean guys, I just want to do state for the record that like our school enrollment is steadily declining. And so
like when we had these issues come up in the '9s when the school population was at its peak, it was more of a concern, but you know, like there are kids that have 10 kids in their class right now. So, you know, I get that that's like a buzzword or what have you, >> but that's a whole other
>> guys. But we can't speak. >> So, at the end of the day, what I'm going to say is this. This is a state mandate, right? >> They don't care. Okay. So, just like I get all your concerns. They don't care about schools. They don't care about
traffic. They don't care. They even fight with the D. So, like there's nothing we can do >> branch for quite some time also. And at that time, you were able to sell your obligations. >> Yeah. You can't do that anymore. >> I know that. But are they considering that? >> No.
>> No, you can't do that anymore. It was that was >> Do you think the law will change for that? No. Nobody knows. But as of as of 2010, that was that was not that's no longer allowed. >> Okie dokie. All right. Thank you, guys. >> Thank you. >> Thank you, Mr. Krug.
>> Okay. Can we have a motion to close public hearing? >> I'll make a motion to close public on the ordinance. >> Second. >> All in favor? I >> I uh can we have a motion to adopt ordinance 25-41? >> I will make a motion to adopt set ordinance. >> Second. >> Councilman Nadell,
>> yes. >> Councilman O'Donnell, >> yes. Councilman Rubel, >> yes. >> Deputy Mayor Fischer, >> yes. >> Thank you. The ordinance is adopted. >> Um, meeting dates. The next regularly scheduled council meeting will take place on October 21st. Executive session begins at 6 p.m. and the regular session
will start hopefully by 700 p.m. Um, I just want to because I'm Italian, I people know how Italian I am. Um, both my parents came from Italy after World War II that October is Italian Heritage Month in case you didn't know. And the
Howell URC is sponsoring an Italian pasta night on October 22nd from 6:30 to 8 at the first aid squad. It's $10. We're also collecting for our troops abroad. Um we have a lot of Italians in
Howell and in Mammoth County, so I figured I could kind of plug that. Thank you. Gracia. Um, seeing no further business, council, no, I'll make a motion to >> second. >> All in favor? >> I
Come on. Come