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Video-1: youtube.com/watch?v=F7SNCO8s2Qw

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Thanks, Scott. >> Good morning, everyone. >> Morning. >> Here for the second quarter uh meeting of the board for proprietary education. Chair sees a quorum. Uh so we'll call to order and we'll start by taking the roll

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call [clears throat] and I'll lead off. Uh uh Mrs. Anne Shane, >> present. >> Mr. Scott Bogen >> present. >> Mr. Ken Kanesco >> here. >> Mr. Michael NSED >> here. >> And chair will note himself present as

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well. Um hopefully we had an opportunity to uh review the minutes from the last meeting, our March meeting, our Q1 meeting. If anybody has any uh comments or questions

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otherwise accept a motion to adopt them. >> So move. >> Have a second. >> Second. >> Take that by consent. >> Yep. >> Uh the motions or the minutes for the

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March meeting are taken by consent. Given our uh heavy heavy agenda for today, I'll keep my remarks for as the executive director's report short. Um, I gave you a a brief update uh at our March meeting that House Enrolled Act 103 will dissolve the board for

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proprietary education board but transfer its statutes, all of its duties and responsibilities uh and its um fees that are in administrative code commission. So all of these import this important work what we do and especially

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uh Mr. Miller does will be transferred to the commission on July 1st of 2027 and we are uh planning and prepping for that and we can give you greater updates in the months ahead. But rest assured we

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are working on that um on that. [clears throat] Hope we have more people joining. So with that uh unless anyone has any questions or would like to bring up anything on that front, we can move on to the decision items for today.

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Um our first batch of programs are nursing programs from two uh institutions and we'll be starting first with Jeremiah College. Uh they have an AS in nursing to be offered in Monster and through distance education. Uh the board will remember uh we hosted them

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last June in June 2025 and the board determined to reconsider their proposed uh nursing program by set by setting six stipulations. U Mr. Miller will go through those and how they've been satisfied. So invite the Jeremiah College

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representatives to the table. Welcome again. Please once you get settled, take the opportunity to introduce yourselves. >> Absolutely. >> Hi, I'm Dr. Tiffany Rack. I'm the administrator and the chief administrative officer at Jeremy College.

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>> My name is Tiana Purdle and I am the dean affair at Jeremy College. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Thank you. >> And then with us not today is Sandra. Would would you like to give her an introduction? >> Oh, yes. And our campus president is Sandra Dafiago. Unfortunately, she has a medical procedure today, so she was not

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able to join us, but she wanted to say hi. [laughter] >> Okay. So, Jeremy College, Jere Jeremy College, not Jeremiah College, Jeremy College, uh was begun in Monster, Indiana in 2019. They also have a campus

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in uh Lancing, Illinois. Originally in Olympia Fields, Illinois. that dates back to 2022. Uh, someone needs to mute, please. Um, the institution, uh, was originally named Jeremiah Jeremy Vocational

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Institute. Um, we have Tiffany Brock, uh, chief administrative officer and Dr. Sandra, uh, who is the president and chief executive officer who's off today. Uh, it is a private for-profit institution.

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Uh it's at Council of Occupational Education accreditation since June of 2023. Uh the next reaffirmation of accreditation will occur in 2029. Uh the institution currently does not participate in title 4, but however it

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does participate in Indiana Next Level Jobs Workforce Ready Grant. Um they do not submit information to the NCES, National Center for Educational Statistics. However, they self-reported

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uh students of 76 uh this year. Uh 2025 they had 122 students and 24 176 students. Uh Jeremiah College is approved uh for clinical medical assistant and pharmacy

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tech, phbotomy tech, a number of uh certificate programs and their financials are from the uh fiscal year ending December 31st, 2024 with a composite score of 2.4. So as uh Dr. Butler stated, they came

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before us last year at this time in June of 2025. At that time, the board tabled action with the recommendation that Jeremiah reappeared before the board um with resubmitted materials. Um at that

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time, they the board recommended that the program hours be revised to be in line with the accredititor creditors. Um and also with VPE um standards that chemistry be added as standalone course

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that the clinical site agreements be updated and signed. Um that there be a copy of Indiana and uh compact state RN licenses. Um the audited financials be include a

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composite score. And finally that the detailed timeline for offering programmatic accreditation um be would be granted. So at this time Jeremiah College has resubmitted a revised curriculum um in keeping with BP

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standards and also the accredititor standards. Um they have included the chemistry course in the program curriculum. They've updated clinical sites with agreements with Edgewater Health, Health Link, uh Miller's Mary

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Manor, Methodist Hospitals, and they have also submitted uh licenses for for instructors and then audited financials uh with that 2.4 composite score. Um and then finally

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they have um they do have accreditation currently but they also have submitted a timeline for otherwise accreditation programmatic accreditation. If you'd like to speak first about that programmatic accreditation. >> Okay. So, what we are planning on doing

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since we already have um COE accredititation, we're planning on continuing on and getting the nursing program once it's approved, getting going through that process with COE and getting that accredited as well. And um they said it might take like 6

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months for COE. So, once we get that approval, we'll start that process and um we'll go forth. questions. >> Yeah, couple if I could please. Okay. Unless Tony, I don't know if you wanted I don't want go interfer

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>> the person who actually knows. [laughter] I mean I have some I have some non- nursing but again when when Ross you just reported the uh the enrollment of 24 of 176 and then you said 122

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>> yeah Alan >> uh somebody needs mute please and then in 2676 well certainly that's a loss of 100 students in that threeyear period of time >> if I've got the information inaccurate

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or incorrect Correct. Please. Uh, but I'm just concerned as to how we went from 176 to 76 in that 2-year period of >> because that's only from um until May. We're only halfway almost halfway through the year. >> What do you project then? And >> um the way we're looking, we will

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probably hit August is going to be a big month. They said um we'll probably hit right around 100. >> Okay. >> Maybe a little bit more. It just all depends. um our the way that our um we get our students and the way that it's

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funded, right? >> August, September, and November are our bigger months. So, we will definitely have bigger population. >> So, so that again 100 is going to be 22 from less >> and I'm just guesstimating. >> Okay, [laughter] I'm appreciate that.

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And then certainly, but do you see this turning around in the future or do you see >> Well, we we're trying to get title four funding. We are working with um working with them right now. So hopefully once we do get that we'll be able to see an increase in >> you anticipate title four funings just

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>> oh we're talking with our we have consultants that we're dealing with and uh working with I should say and um I'm hoping within a year. >> Okay. >> They said that it that it's it's taken people at least a year to get it and we're we've started that. So we're just

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hoping it'll go a little bit quicker. >> Okay. um in your report you said that the um composite score on on page nine was uh was uh unpublished and I'm I'm thinking and hearing now that when you said the audit

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>> which though it should be published now so that's there there's a delay with USDE about three years in publishing composite scores >> okay >> and even further now >> um and then you know let's just talk a

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little bit about the um the AA uh S degree. >> Okay. >> Uh and that will be that is not an AS that's an AAS which is more work entry. Correct. That's we used to have the AOS

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but the AAS is not it is it is work entry related. Uh so we're okay with that. I I think correct. Um, that's about it really. [laughter] >> Well,

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um, I've read your proposal. >> Um, I will tell you there are a few things that I have concern about, okay? >> But I don't think at this point in time it's something that we'll deal with at the Bene. We'll deal with it when you come before the board of nursing. >> Okay. Um when you've listed out your uh

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clock hours with 1670 um >> 540 lecture and 500 lab, you will find that the board of nursing allows no more than 25% of clinical time to be simulation or lab. So we're going to look at that again

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based on some research and experience recently with another program that's petitioning to open in your part of the state. We've done a clinical site review, >> okay, >> and visit. And we have some concerns and we'll go ahead and talk about that when you come to nursing as well.

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>> Okay. >> But [clears throat] at least one of your clinical sites has uh raised concern for me. >> So, we'll deal with that here, but I'm giving you that as a heads up. >> I appreciate that. >> Yeah. >> Um, Mr. Kesco, the difference between the associate of applied science and the

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associate of science and nursing is exactly as you mentioned. One is more workforce related, one is more hands-on applied experience in the program. The other is more academic and that's really the only decision or the difference between the two. We have had AAS

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programs come before the board as well as ASN and ADN. Um only nursing can be confusing in the way that we do things 15 ways for the same license, but it is acceptable. So, um I am a little bit concerned in the fact that there seems

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to be a proliferation of programs in your part of the state that are petitioning to open and you have clinical sites and I commend you for getting those uh affiliation agreements to us, but there are going to be times

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when we're going to run out of space and so that is something that when you come before the board of nursing, we'll look at. >> Okay. Um, but that's just something to keep in the back of your head. I like your one to eight. I think that that's a good um what we're seeing with a lot of our clinical partners, they no longer

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want clinical groups of 10. They want five to eight. So that fits in with what their request is. But I think you've looked at that. Um the things that I think nursing will have a concern with our details, but for what the board of proprietary education has asked you to

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do, I think you fulfilled that. Well, >> thank you. being passed around is pictures of the clinical lab and then also the site agreements. >> Ross, you know, my only concern is the financial data. I mean, that's not my

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it's the only concern I can comment on. Um, do we have any more current information than 2024? >> That's the most our own auditors. >> We don't um we can make that a

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stipulation approval with a stipulation to turn in more current audited financials with the composite score. >> 2.4 is pretty it's a good number. That's why if it's >> three is the highest, >> right? >> Yeah.

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>> And 1.5 is considered financially stable. But we could timeliness of the data. >> That could be a stipulation with approval >> since it's fairly high. I I don't need to stipulate that. But I think we'll we'll keep an eye on it as we do with >> Yes.

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>> It would be worth it to have plant man look at it or not at this time. >> Well, they review everything, right? >> They do. However, we like put the cost on the institutions to do it. >> Yeah. So any feel for at this point in time with

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the financial question that you would ask and whether it be worth it when I was when I saw that unpublished I was concerned but then I saw the >> yeah that's not the unpublished I you know I deal with the Sarah

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renewals so I often get unpublished uh composite scores for those institutions including the ICI institutions >> right >> I think it's it's a question for plant Moran I would ask them based on their experience you know how timely does the

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data need to be right so if it is automatically two years back three years back or whatever then should it >> the published scores are usually three years back >> but the unpublished is more >> usually annually

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>> yeah I'm just saying do they have a preference a policy something based on their experience that if the scores [clears throat] have aged out too much and you have to figure out what that limit was, then they automatically fall into some kind of a review pool.

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>> They've been reviewing all the currently authorized institutions, but not those that uh are not currently authorized. >> Right. So I mean we could put as a stipulation that they come up with an audited financial a more current audited

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financial with the composits for that way they can move forward and in the meantime >> they >> I just don't want to put an additional financial burden on them at this point in time till maybe they get their title four money approved. I'm asking more

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from plan Moran. I mean what's what's the what's their experience tell you about the need for recency in audits and you know can you let it fly for five years and that's fine or >> no they usually go with the annual about a year out

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>> just throwing that out there but I don't want to stipulate >> help me remember what your tuition is going to be for the program >> for the nursing program >> nursing Yeah, it's it's um [laughter] >> 27,000.

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>> Since you're not able to do title 4 right now, how are these students going to be able to pay for this? that is um when we when we sat down and discussed it with our campus president, she was talking about um you know maybe students living with private loans. We're

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starting off small so that way we're going to try to you know a small cohort and then um we'll kind of see where that goes because she was talking about them getting private maybe private loans and stuff like that. We're hoping by the time this is going maybe we'll have that title 4. But um

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>> and the reason I asked was I wasn't sure if you'd had an arrangement with some of our long-term care facilities who many times will do this as a career ladder. You've been a CNA for me. If you go to school to be a nurse, I'll fund half of it. I'll fund all of it. Um that's

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something that we're seeing more and more with these self-pay programs. Okay. Um I worry about students that are making this commitment and this is a big chunk of money for these kids, people, adults. >> Yes. >> Um but I I we see that as a real

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stumbling block. They will start the program and then being able to finish financially is a huge burden. So, we do have um like if if a student is coming in and they're trying to they're trying to get funding if they go through work one, they're able to to fund up to like

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seven or $8,000. So, that could cover the first, you know, portion of the first year and and hopefully then we'll be able to get that. We're we're like I said, we're working with um with some some people trying to get that funding. They're helping us out so much. >> Okay. [laughter] because you guys you

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guys wanted us to get a consultant. So that's what we we've been working with them for quite a while. >> And a lot of communities will have community based funds. Um I see this more in Northeast Indiana than I do Northwest, but a lot of the Chamber of Commerce, those kind of things will have education funds that they'll make

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available to support these kind of students. But what we see in a lot of proprietary programs right now is there's financial resources for the first two or three quarters >> and then they run out of money and they

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have to drop out of the program next. >> So I think we're trying to be more productive in making sure that when you have a chunk of money like this, the students are going to be able to afford this, be able to finish the program. That makes sense. That makes sense. I

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know we do um still have that $200,000 line of credit that has not and I have have documents that has not been used >> for some reason to assist the students. We are able to do so. >> Tiffany, is it do you think that that's

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caused and again I'm going to go back to the numbers. Uh do you think that that's been a reflection of the financial aid that's not available to the students? that has caused that decrease for lack of better words of enrollment.

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>> Well, the the thing is is it's it's um the enroll we have so many students who want our program and not all of them qualify for funding. So that's why we're trying to do the title four, but we didn't have a program a program had to have at least 600 clock hours for two

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years. We were we just hit that mark. So um now well couple months ago. So now we are trying to go through that title four funding. >> I know we didn't ask question of [clears throat] how retention is retention reflected or attrition

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reflected in not having the funds to pay for their tuition. >> Well I mean >> have you seen that as a pattern? >> Not really. Not really to be honest with you. Not really. I mean the way that our

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student the way that the programs work now is they get the funding up front. So therefore the students they don't start if they do not have the funding. So therefore when our students do start they they tend to finish. We very rarely will we have a student not be able to

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and a lot of times it might be because they're maybe they're having a child or they're having health issues. So we'll pause their um their education and then they can come back and pick that back up. So, we do see a lot of that. >> Thank you.

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>> And when do you think you're going to start this degree program? >> Um, well, it it all depends on if if it gets approved and if it goes through the nursing. We would like to um hopefully if not this fall, then maybe um the

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January of next year. It just all depends. Um January of next year would actually make it be a little closer to us to get the title 4. Yeah. Yeah, that's I mean you're kind of walking a tight rope. >> We are. We are. And we understand that.

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Let's say okay, so let's say we do get approval. We do go through and we um we start a class in January and let's say we don't have Title 4 funding. We're starting with the small class, but maybe we'll get Title 4 funding by the next cohort that starts. But then hopefully

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those people who the students that who started the program will be able to get funding for like maybe the next semester or a quarter or whatever. That's what we're hoping for. >> So So you're looking at roughly six months believe that you'll be approved

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by the nursing. Is that >> yes totally >> I mean if it take if it takes longer we do understand but yes that's in >> say a false start is very optimistic. >> Right. Okay. So, January is more realistic. >> Okay. Okay.

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>> Yeah. >> And we're telling all programs that right now. >> No, that makes sense. >> Um just because of the way things fall. >> Okay. >> Um and I don't want to set you up for failure. So, I think January of 27 is more reasonable. >> Okay. >> I know. We're just excited about the

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program. >> May I ask Tony, did you uh look at the projected headcount and enrollments? I did and it is realistic. I think the board will approve that. Um we are seeing the board approve smaller uh initial cohorts because we do have the

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crunch with the clinical space. So the fact that they've gone from 8 to 16 is reasonable. I think the board will treat that. >> Thank you. >> We had one that not recently wanted to start with 200 and I >> Oh my

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notion. [laughter] very optimistic. >> Said you obviously haven't been to a nursing board meeting yet. [laughter] >> Any other questions or comments from the board? >> Tony, would you like to say anything further?

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>> Well, thank you. And and you feel at this point in time that the 98 whatever that number was had pretty much been Ross uh >> oh stipulation >> stipulation met. >> Uh I move we approve

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>> program request. >> I'll second. >> We have a motion and a second. We'll do a roll call. Mrs. Shane >> I >> Mr. King Kanesco >> I >> Mr. Scott Boen

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>> I >> Mr. Michael Moss >> I chair votes I. Thank you very much. >> Congratulations. >> Thank you guys. >> Thank you for all the work you did to me to stipulate these committee.

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>> Thank you so much. It was helpful and not too poly. >> No, no, no. Thank you so much. >> You guys have a great rest of your day. >> You always well. Thank you. >> Status title four. I don't know.

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Okay. Just Sorry, guys. [snorts and laughter] >> All right. Uh the board will now move to its second nursing program decision item with Stellar Career College. They're proposing an AS in nursing to be offered in Crown Point, Indiana through and

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through distance education. If the representatives in inerson representatives from Stellar would join us at the table and once you're seated, please introduce yourselves. The board will remember we hosted

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Stellar Career College at our last meeting in the March and three uh healthcare related AAS programs were approved. then a cardiac synography, a surgical technology and a vascular synography. So obviously building on their healthc care portfolio offerings.

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Welcome. >> Thank you. Good morning everyone. My name is Arif Khan. I'm the campus director on point college. >> Okay. Before we go on, would you like to uh go back to your background MBBS? Like to explain that further.

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>> Sure. Thank you. So uh >> I looked it up but you probably explained it better than I can. So I started with Stiller back in August 2023 as the director of compliance and IT services when I progressed towards being a campus director at the comment campus.

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Uh I have worked with uh PP right from uh getting the programs approved for the bachelor's degree until now. >> Could you explain your educational background? I have a master's degree in information systems in uh from Indiana as well in Angola, Indiana.

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>> Okay, go ahead. >> Hi, Harold Bley, director of financial aid and campus manager for ground point. >> Hi, Dr. Ali. I'm director of historical. >> Thank you very much. >> Okay. and then uh joining us virtually

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uh if you all would like to introduce yourselves starting with AK Bus. >> Good morning, Director Miller and Dr. Butler and the members of the board. I am AK. I am the director of HR, academic resources, and student records. And

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we're glad that you invite us for this meeting and we're looking forward to have a discussion. Thank you so much. Okay. >> And then Hope Nails. Good morning everyone. My name is Hope. >> Yes. Good morning everyone. My name is Hope NS and I am the program director

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for the ASM program at Stellar Career College. >> Okay. Nice to meet you. >> Denise Nelson Flowers. >> You like to introduce yourself? >> Hi, my name is Yes. Hi, my name is Denise and I am the program director for

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Stellar College. >> Okay. And then Dr. Sadi. >> Hello. Uh good morning everyone. My name is Zulfikiar Sati. I'm president of Stellar Korean College. I have been uh with the colleges for a very long time.

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Uh and I hold a PhD in organizational leadership and we appreciate this opportunity uh to to present our program in this meeting. >> Thank you Dr. Si. And actually I meant to ask you about your credentials Dr.

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It's bachelor's in medicine and bachelor of surgery and I did this from Pakistan. >> Okay. Yeah. >> Yeah. That's okay. I looked at that's the Yeah, that's what I wanted to hear. >> Yeah. So, sorry. No problem. >> Sorry for the confusion. >> Yeah. >> Okay. So, uh Stellar Career College

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began as computer tutor uh back in the 1980s in Modesto, California. They were renamed um a second time to computer tutor business and technical institute when they began offering allied health and business programs.

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Um in 2018 the name changed in 2019. Uh they began a Chicago site that was approved by the Illinois Board of Higher Education. Uh they currently have accrediting commission of career colleges, career schools and colleges

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ACCSC accreditation. Um their reaffirmation with ACCSC uh for the Modesto uh campus began in 2019 uh in Crown Point, Indiana of last year,

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August last year. Uh they were also accredited. Uh the institution participates in title 4 funding and NES state financial aid. Uh NCES in the fall of 2024. The enrollment for Crown Point

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was 81 students. Um the Crown Point location offers a number of AAS programs and also a number of diploma level programs. Uh most recently at the last meeting they were approved for the AAS in cardiac

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synography. AAS in surgical technology and the AAS in vascular synography. Um all in total they have an uh eight AAS programs currently that are approved and their most recent composite score in

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December of 2025 was 2.2 and I'll remind the board that 1.5 is considered financially stable stable. So 2.2 two is nearing the the top of three which is um considered the top financial financially

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stable just to make the report on page 37 oh that's unpublished I'm sorry okay when I see that on publish for just >> yeah it's a it seems odd but it is not a

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red flag yeah it does come from audited financial so it's fine yes so this program uh is an associate of science and nursing. Uh it is 112.5 quarter credit hours with 64% of the courses in the specialty. They have

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turned in faculty credentials uh for seven faculty members, six part-time, one full-time. Uh two have a baloria degree, three have a master's, one has a doctoral degree and one has a medical degree. And then they have submitted six

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clinical site agreements. Uh, Fountain View, Leaport, uh, Franciscan Alliance, uh, Nadine Kareem, and that's a I assume a family medical practice. >> It's a clinic. >> What is it? >> It's a clinic. >> It's a clinic in India.

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>> Okay. A clinic. And then Northshore Health Centers, Parkview Health Centers System, and then finally, uh, Unity Hospice and Palative Care. and the staff recommendation is for approval.

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>> Welcome, discussion, comments from the board. Go ahead. >> Um, I need clarification. Um, listed with your individuals that are online. We have listed a program director for nursing and then a practical nursing

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program director. Um, in your uh curriculum, I see that you have a PN success course. You are not accredited for a practical nursing program. Is this licensed through Illinois? >> Yeah. So the the faculty that you see here is for the PN program in Chicago

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and the I see that inside the application as well. We had a course which says PN it was a typo that we made supposed to be in RN. >> Okay. That helps. [clears throat] So how will these two individuals work together? Uh

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so the program director we have is Miss Fn. She's will be serving as a program director from campus. We started doing practical nursing in Chicago back in uh November of 2024 and we wanted to have get that

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experience at Hong we started and what curriculum and in regards to curriculum managing the clinical sites and all that we passed on to Miss Opal from the program director we have currently. So with your current practical nursing program, what are your enclelex results?

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>> We haven't uh we haven't yet been through that enclelex preparation. We just started in November 2024. They are in quarter 4 right now. Quarter three right now. So they they will be done in quarter 4 to 3 months and then uh we'll have the >> Okay, help me understand. How long is

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your PN program? >> Uh what's the length? >> Uh it's I think 14 months. >> 14 months. Okay. Um started >> we started in November 2025. >> Okay.

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>> I I was concerned that if you started in 24 now 26 and you didn't havelex results yet that was a problem. >> That helps clarify. Um and have you identified with these clinical sites which specialties or

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which programs they would sponsor students for? >> Yeah, we made a a detailed table where we listed all the modalities in each of those clinical sites as okay and all the student.

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>> All right, that's all I have. >> So that go ahead Ken. Uh I'm still trying to get a feel of California and Chicago and but I I the Crown Point is the school that this program is. Okay.

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>> Yeah. Crown Point is in Indiana >> and that was accredited in 20125 Ross I heard. And who accredited them? US or was it a >> um but we did first. So they can't obtain

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the ACCSC accreditation until we do. >> Okay. So we accredited them in 25 then. >> Um let's see. >> I I just couldn't figure out who accredited them in 25. >> Um so we got accredited from uh for the

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Crown Point campus back in 2022. >> August 2022. >> Yeah. We first got the institutional approval from ICE in March 2022 and then >> yes

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>> that's our first uh approval but we got uh accreditation from ACC recently in 2025. >> Yeah. See what I on page 37 the third second paragraph institutional accredititation I show here that more recently the Crown Point campus received

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accreditation in August of 25 ACCSC correct >> yeah so they are accredited M >> they are they are yes they are >> um thank you um and are they

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um are they a standalone are they a branch or a learning site. Um, >> it's a branch campus ground >> and that's and that that's you're a branch campus of the California >> institution. Okay.

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>> Yes. So the originally uh the college started in California. So California still remains main campus uh because in department of education it's is almost impossible to change the main campus. So the as of as as of right

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now uh California Modesto California is our main campus while Chicago and Crown Point are the branch campuses of the main campus in California. >> Okay. Can you help me on this one? And again so you just answer the question that the Modesta is the main the Crown

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Point is a branch >> okay >> of Modesta >> and and uh Modesta has an enrollment of 46. I'm not sure if that's passed last year or not. and Crown Point is at 81.

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>> The plan is to keep the Modesa campus in California as the main as the population is at at this point in time 46 students. >> Yes, it was fall 2024 and it's from

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NCES. >> Okay. Where are they in 25? Do you have that? Just >> NCES doesn't publish that quickly. Well, I'm just, you know, I'm just thinking out loud here as to, you know, the uh the branch campus is twice the size of

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the uh main campus and is is there any futuristic thinking of taking this and flipping it and making modesta a branch of or maybe you can't do that? >> Yes sir. So we had a

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uh a conversation with our accrediting body as well as US department of education. >> So the yes so the way a man campus can be changed is very complex. So we are considering

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>> uh we are considering to relocate Modesto. Modesto is a very small town. Uh to relocate Modesto uh campus to another city within California that is in the works. Uh but we we want to take

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one step at a time. Right now uh our Chicago branch is under re we are going through reacredititation because our current accredititation in Chicago expires on 2026 and we are in the reacredititation cycle. So once that is

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completed we we are seriously looking into uh that main campus should be a representation of the stellar college as it has grown to you know significant uh number >> and that would be that would be with HBCS

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>> okay >> yes and also US department of education >> right uh and and you mentioned I I I wasn't totally listening I shouldn't say I didn't hear what you told but I was listening but I didn't hear it totally. I I thought I was going to say

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but you were mentioning that you're going through an accreditation now. Is that what I heard you say? >> Yep. Our Chicago campus. So every campus has its own accredititation cycle. So the last accredititation visit we had

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was in 2026 and we got a five-year award for the Chicago campus. >> Okay. >> Yes. >> All right. Thank you. And then the one last question on page 50, you made the statement of what is a proposed branch? Let me find out what that specifically

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is. Um the AS and nursing program at the proposed branch campus. What is the proposed branch campus? uh I think the >> uh during the time of application we were having this wording of the

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proposion but we already had this approved from ECCS in back in 2025 so I think that went on and had that same uh typing error in that one >> okay so it's not a proposal no it's already a branch >> thank you that's all I Okay.

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>> So, uh, of note from what Tony mentioned, u, in terms of the course titles, the nursing 121 should read INLEX RN. >> And I I saw that on page 59, you do reference it as a inclelex RN lure

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examination prep course. Yeah. So and then another uh I wouldn't call it semantics it is it's an important tech technical aspect but is it since 24 or 23 the board authorizes we do not accreditate >> um it's

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beginning of 20 or sorry after July 1st 2012 we use the term authorization >> authorization yes >> okay >> it was office of career technical school suddenly to authorizing accreditation. >> They're the ones that they they changed the the time here.

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>> They changed the terminology. >> I couldn't remember which one it to be in line with BP. >> Yes. >> Yeah. Authorization. >> Any further discussion or comments or comments from >> confuse my mind with all these different locations?

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Chicago is accredited by ACCS city and that was in 19 and then Crown Point which is in Indiana is AC was accredited in 2025 correct

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>> and we're approving the program for Indiana >> for Crown Point which was accredited 2025. >> Yes. >> Yeah. Thank you. >> We are undergoing reacredititation in Chicago right now. Right. All right, >> watch a movie hardship.

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>> That's right. [laughter] >> I just wanted to acknowledge on the hard work that the board has put in as well as uh a few days ago. I was just getting the numbers uh to see what's the scarcity for nurses back in Indiana. And

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fascinatingly, I went to the Bureau of Nursing uh uh Bureau of Labor Statistics and I saw there is an opening of around 4,500 openings every year annually. And then I went to the ENCLEX passing rate and I

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saw that uh for associate degree RN programs who participated students were around 1,715 and the past was 1,500 and overall the candidates were 4,000 and the passing

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rate was uh 3,000. So I I did a a ratio of supply and demand and you can see there is a big gap over there of 1.9 for each graduate of nursing. So we hope that we at Stella will participate as a

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small contribution to the workforce of the nurses and the hard work that they do. >> Oh that's correct. I just one other point I missed. AS program not an AAS. >> Correct. So this one will be >> more academic.

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>> Okay. More academic. And do they have to have articulations to transfer their courses onto a balora with someone or not necessarily? >> They will have to have articulation agreements to be able to do that. Yes. >> Okay. >> And that was that's something that we would worry about down the road.

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>> Okay. Very good. Thank you. [clears throat and cough] I think the different sites is going to be confusing for the board of nursing. Yeah. Between California and Chicago and now Indiana looking at where the main campus is and how that's governed.

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>> That'll be a point of discussion for the board of nursing >> during the application. As you can note, most of our degrees we have is in AAS and this is the first degree we able to do in a as uh I had this question about the

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clinical sites. Uh I I believe that we need our students only to be uh uh only only to go to clinical sites in the part of Indiana or they can even do it in Chicago as well as most of the site that you see here are just for Indiana. But

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we do have sites in Chicago as well. >> The board only allows clinical sites to be no more than an hour away from the campus. >> So that would be something the board would consider if you used an out ofstate site. >> Oh, okay.

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>> And then you would be accountable to the board of Illinois nursing >> for that clinical rotation. >> Okay. >> And we can go into that later, but yes, out of state sites are not preferred, but they are possible. When do they go before the board? You had just mentioned uh when they go

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before the board, is that within the next year? >> Um they have 90 days from the time that BPE authorizes them to come to the board of nursing. That means in that 90 days I have to do a site visit and present it to the board for their accreditation decision. So depending on what time we

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would get from the school in the application, um we have 90 days to bring it to the board. >> Right. So >> well my my reason for asking is that um I suggest somehow someway you lay out the various campuses the the

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campuses that are accredited by HCCS the campus that are authorized by because it is confusing and I think it'll make it easier for your >> well and I will say that when the statute passed to put that time frame of 90 days we did identify that if the

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school needs more than 90 days they can ask for an extension, right? >> And that's just a simple email to me, right? >> But sometimes that allows them to have time to kind of work out these issues that are not really >> they're very unwieldy. >> Um, so that's an option for them as well. But otherwise, we are required by

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law to have it presented in 90 days if we've not asked for an extension. >> Very good. >> In order to move forward, uh, does staff or Tony see any need for stipulations? Um, let's see. I don't think so. I don't think so. We

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They already have their faculty. So, no, they have the faculty identified and I have the IQRS and the transcript, the highest degree earned already. Good. Are you okay with some of the >> And I mean, it's the same thing as Jeremy. I think that the board will have

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concerns about a couple of these things, right? >> But that's better dealt with the nursing board than it is BPE. >> Yeah. >> That being said, I would move to approve it. >> We have a motion. Do we have a second? >> A second. >> Mike will beat you this time.

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>> That's right. >> We'll let him [laughter] >> to approve the AS in nursing. >> We will take a roll call. Mrs. Anne Shane. >> I. >> Mr. Kang Kinesesco. >> Hi, >> Mr. Scott Boen.

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>> Hi, >> Mr. Michael Nosen. >> Hi, >> Chair Votes. I thank you very much. >> Thank you. Thank you. Good luck to you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you everyone. >> Really? >> Thank you. Thank you so much. >> Send us a copy of that map too.

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>> At least me so I can better understand. >> Thank you so much. >> I was the director of compliance and I was have to deal with all these three campuses. It was all Yeah. >> [laughter] >> three different states. I can't imagine. >> Thank you. >> Thank you, Andrew.

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>> Thank you everyone. Thank you so much. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. Good luck. >> Thank you. Thank you. >> We continue our decision item agenda. we leave the field of nursing and move to

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still another healthcare related uh field and this is the AS and respiratory therapy proposed by South College to be offered in Carmel and through distance education with the representatives from the college. Please join us at the table and introduce yourselves once you get

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seated please. Hello. Welcome. >> What did you do to your hand? >> You know, I wish it was an exciting story, but rain and high heels were just not a good mix. So, I have two titanium screws to >> Oh my >> seal the deal.

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>> Is there a phone? on the floor. >> Did you leave it in your car? Maybe. >> No, I just [clears throat] >> Did you call it? Did somebody call you? >> Somebody called.

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>> Sorry. to the rescue. >> Yes. I think I've done that. Right. >> Would you like to start with introductions? >> Yes, of course. Hi, I'm Britney Martin. I'm the campus president at South College Indianapolis.

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>> And I'm Laura Maxwell. I'm the program director for the AS and respiratory therapy program at South College Indianapolis. >> Okay. And then we have is Kim Hall, are you there by phone? >> Yes. >> Dr. Kim Hall, are you the 865 number? Kim,

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>> I'll go ahead and unmute you. Well, I guess I you have to do on your side, Dr. Kim. Dr. Hall, >> sometimes when you call in, there can be issues. So >> well we can go on and we'll come back.

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>> Okay, we'll come back to you Dr. Hall if you can get back on. Okay, so uh South College uh began as Knoxville Business College in 1882. Um in October 2001, this institution was

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renamed to its current uh name, South College. Um today the institution offers over 80 certificate and degree programs. Uh the institution is what is used to be known as regional uh accreditation through the

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southern association of colleges and schools. Sachs um in September 2018. Uh they also obtained CCN uh accreditation uh collegiate nursing education accreditation.

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uh since 2015 they have been a state authorization reciprocity agreement participant institutional participant uh they participate in both title four funding uh title uh financial federal financial aid and also Indiana state

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financial aid the main campus is in Knoxville Tennessee in addition they have campuses in Florida uh Georgia North Carolina several locations in general Tennessee and Texas. The institution offers uh

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certificate, associate, balorate, masters and doctoral level programs. Uh the Indiana camp Indianapolis campus is approved for three certificates, six associate uh degree programs and two

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balorate uh level programs. Uh the most recent composite score was 2.6 in the fiscal year ending September 2025. for this program which is the associate of science and respiratory therapy which would be offered through blended

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delivery at the Indianapolis campus and also distance education. It is 116.5 quarter credit hours with 53% of the courses in the specialty faculty already identified. Lori Maxwell

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um to be um to be hired is the are you you're not the clinic director. >> I'm the program director. Our director of clinical education >> is to be hired. >> is to be hired. Yes. And there's a number of stipulations or requirements for hiring that faculty both the

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director and the faculty member. Um the requirements are to have an Indiana Respiratory Care uh Indiana Respiratory Care practitioner license and active registered respatory therapist credential. Um have a bachelor degree from a program that is credited

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by the Commission on Accreditation for Respiratory Respiratory Care. Um they have many uh signedus for clinical sites uh both through community health, Franciscans Health, Hendricks Regional,

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Henry Henry Community, uh IU Health, [clears throat] uh Snack Medical and St. Vincent Health in all 24 clinical site agreements have been signed which they send me copies of. And

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then I also have the IQR instructor qualification for Lori and her highest degree earned. Um her transcript which I won't pass her since it includes your grades. It's kind of private. So

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[laughter] >> okay. >> She did she did what she did well. So yeah, >> and she's a Ball State grad. So we're okay with that. >> Two alumni [laughter] here. >> We're good. So uh in fact the uh staff recommendation um is for approval with

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stipulations uh that the IQRS the instructor qualification records and the transcript for the highest degree earned be submitted for the director of clinical education and also if there is um 15 or

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more students in the first cohort that they also submit IQRS and transcripts at the highest degree earn. for those full-time and part-time faculty. The reason that's in there for 15 or more, it's not expected that they'll be

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able to attract an enroll enrollment high enough um to warrant hiring additional faculty for the very first cohort. So, that's the reason it's written that way. Courtney, you you're relatively new as

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president or maybe I'm mis but there is another a south >> there was yes Turner South was the president prior to me he is now running the Dallas Texas campus. Okay. >> Uh I came from our Pittsburgh campus where I served as campus de. >> So when did you become the president

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from Pittsburgh to Indiana? >> The fall of 2024. >> Okay. Fall of 24. >> So closing in on year two. And are you rooting still for the Pittsburgh football team or now for the Indiana football team? >> I absolutely am a Steelers fan.

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>> Probably not the best thing to say at this table, but >> not [laughter] playing to the crowd. Authenticity. >> She's got a towel over [clears throat] the good time. I will. [laughter] >> Well, welcome. >> Uh, can you give us a little bit of your

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background then since we really haven't >> Absolutely. And maybe you did before and I missed the meeting. I apologize if I did that, but I don't think I did. But could you give us a little your background? >> Yeah, I would love to. So, prior to coming to Indianapolis, I served as the campus dean at our Pittsburgh location.

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>> Um, so really enjoyed that. Prior to that, I worked at a private school in Ohio, um, where I served as the campus president there for two years and then I was the campus dean for two years prior. And prior to that, I was the director of student services. And then prior to

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that, I was faculty. So, I've had the amazing opportunity to work in almost every role you can in higher education. Um, and I've been doing that for over a decade now. Prior to that, I was a middle school and high school teacher. >> Oh, those were all different

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institutions in the uh Ohio uh area then. >> Uh that was the same campus. So, I oversaw three three campus uh three campuses um in Ohio. >> Thank you. >> My understanding that all of your

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clinical sites are part of Suburban Health Organization. Is that correct? >> Um no, we have independent clinical sites at IU Health, um Ascension St. Vincent. We have a few of the suburban health organization sites, but not all of them.

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>> Okay. Yes. and help me understand with your tuition of 58,000 where does that compare in the market for in our view? Yes, >> I would say that it is a high it's higher on the higher end on the tuition. Um the financial aid office does an excellent job of having community um

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assistance for our students to help them um absorb that cost and help them cover that cost. >> Can you give us a ballpark of the percentage of your students that receive financial aid? Oh, I would say it's close to 100% of our students receive

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financial aid. >> Thanks. >> Yes. >> Yeah, we can. We'll we'll be happy to get you um an exact number on. So, great question. Thank you. >> Dr. Paul, would you like to say a few words? I think you've got you're unmuted now.

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There you go. Okay. Well, we'll go on it. [laughter] What What What's your enrollment now? You've been in Indie couple years, uh, two, three years, four years, I don't even something like that. What just curious what your enrollment is now? >> Yeah, we're sitting a little over,00

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students for the Indianapolis campus. We expect at the start of uh our summer quarter, we'll be over the,200 student mark. Um, so we are growing rapidly. Um, an institution, South College has over 20,000 students. >> Right. Right. Good. Yes. And

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predominantly uh any predominant program and to go from where you were three years ago to zero to,200 any or is it pretty much across the board as far as >> um >> nursing is probably a big one. >> Yeah, nursing is the big one I would

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say. Um the greatest popularity currently is our ASN program. Um so that's where we're seeing the greatest number of of new students. >> Right. Right. And I think their their report on their uh next looks was very

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positive the last time they report. >> Um I will say that South is the only program in the state that is offering both the practical nursing, the associate of nursing and the bachelor of science and nursing. So they have all three levels of nursing and they're the only school in the state that's doing

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>> great. >> Indiana Wesley and we'll soon join them but they're not there yet. >> Right. Okay. And is it are you [clears throat] a a learning site or you I know with the national regional accreditation as opposed to a branch but you're a

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learning site. >> We are approved learning of South [clears throat] >> Yeah. But of the Knoxville what's your main campus? >> Knoxville. Yes. Correct. Um, on page 79, there was a question about the uh,

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director of clinical education or education, excuse me, to be hired April of 26. Has that been hired that position? >> Um, no. We have made a few offers and have received declination. So, I currently have an active offer out to another candidate um, who meets that

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criteria. >> Position to fill. >> It's tough to fill because of the requirements. um both with degree fulfillment as well as their experience as a clinical preceptor or having taught in an educational institution. So that's

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why it's a little bit tougher to fill I think and it's an important um role because it's really about developing those relationships with our clinical sites and maintaining good standing with them making sure that our students and um the the clinical site have a good

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experience. >> So who's handling those responsibilities now? Um, currently it's me. >> Okay. >> Yes. >> So, you're wanting anxiously to find somebody? >> I I am. Yes. >> What's your revised date then? >> Um, currently our revised date would be

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July 1 for hiring. Um, but the co-arch accreditation um does not require us to have a director of clinical education in place until 60 days uh prior to the start of students. So that allows us a little bit

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more time. Um you know July 1 would be my goal. I would say the latest that we could do that would be um October 15th would be our latest date that we could hire a director of clinical. >> So your anticipation of starting this program upon approval is when?

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>> Uh January of 2027. >> What's the average income for in Indiana for respiratory therapist? >> Yeah, great question. Um, so I would say it's between 40 and 55,000 um, like starting out in the first 5

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years. It can go up to um, six figures um, for those that are in leadership and education. So it's it's actually grown in popularity since co and it also bridged that um gap or um the uh

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the pay gap was was bridged a little bit um because of that. So there is a higher um a greater opportunity to make higher income. >> Is this program offered in any of your other locations or >> It is. Yes. So, it's offered actually at

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all of our other locations currently. We just have one other location that is finishing their accreditation with uh the commission of accreditation for respiratory care. So, they are about um a quarter ahead of me in the accreditation process. So,

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>> and when does that when would that apply once approval is given from our our phone? Yes. Authorization if you want to say it. >> Yeah. uh when when would that process start for that accredititation? >> So the process has already started. Um

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where we are with that is we submitted a letter of intent to the board and then um they approved that letter of intent intent and so we started our self-study process and the last step in that is getting approval from this board um to

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be able to submit that and then um our goal is to have our site visit scheduled um by late summer, early fall so that we can get that provisional accreditation with the final board meeting of the um commission. which is scheduled for

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November 6th of this year. >> What What's the number you're anticipating starting the number of students starting in this program? >> Um just comparatively to the other eight campuses, I'm going to say probably between six and 12 to start um would be

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a success for us for our cohort. We have up to 24 clinical seats for first year. So >> and historically we're seeing it at our other campuses where they do start with a smaller cohort and as they progress into later cohorts um we're seeing those

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enrollment numbers increase but we are seeing smaller stuff >> and the enrollment was a traditional enrollment are there any other specialties that you're looking for for this particular program or uh not any assessments that are related

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to the therapy not any um specific assessments. We have a ranking um that we do to for applicants to our program. So they do have to apply to enter the program a couple of months before the

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start of the cohort and then we rank them based on their uh prerequisites. So such as their uh microbiology, their anatomy and physiology, their math scores and then we have a ranking based on their grades. And then we can just

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kind of rank the students based on that and according to how many clinical spots we have, >> right? >> Um then we can admit >> what type of competition is there other schools? >> Yeah, there there are several other schools in um in the city um that offer

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either an AS or a BS in respiratory therapy. And so there is that um you know bit of competition. I would say those other uh programs are admitting about 15 to 20 students. Um generally,

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>> but the job opportunities upon graduation are plentiful. Is that correct? >> There's about a 14% gap right now in the available positions in the job market compared to um available therapists to hire. So, >> thank you. >> Yes.

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>> With your enrollment of,00 what's your retention and attrition rates? Um yeah, so if we I have a just some information. So looking at um some 2025 2026 completion um by program. Um for

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LPN we have 44 start, we've had 37 continue. Um for BSN we've had 28 start, 18 continue. Um ASN um we have had 21 start with 11 continuing. For DMS, we've

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had 16 start with 13 continuing. Radiography, we've had 11 start with 11 continuing. Search tech, we've had 13 start with 10 continuing. Um, and then Yep. Yep. Search tech 13 with 10 continuing. >> So, they're all over 50% except for that

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third one back. And I didn't write it down. There was one that it sound like was less than 50%. What was that? >> The ASN program. Okay. So, Are your seven other uh sites plus the main or six other sites plus the main

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campus have have this program. Correct. Are you leveraging the your faculty at those through distance ed? >> Um what we're doing there is we're collaborating basically with the other program directors and DCE. As far as um

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distance education, we are for the first four quarters where they're doing their A&P and their microbiology and that kind of thing. Yes, those um faculty are leveraged that way. But for the program specific, we plan to have program uh we

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plan to have on-site faculty for wonderful >> the as [clears throat] program >> and I assume a lot of their gened they'll get through distance. >> Yes, that's correct. Mhm. >> And if I remember, Laura, your uh CV, so to speak, in our table there said you

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had eight years of teaching experience >> already. No, I had um pre preceptor experience. So, I was a preceptor at that time. This I'm new to higher education in general. Um but I have a lot of clinical experience and clinical

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preceptor experience with students as well as um education uh clinical education in the hospital. um also h hel held leadership and educational roles um in each of the sites that I worked at. So >> I I'll pass this. >> Yeah, sure.

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>> Well, that'll be a valuable background for students. You'll be prepared. >> Thank you. >> Yes, you're welcome. >> We're very fortunate at South College that we have an amazing wealth of institutional resources to tap into. So, as Laura was mentioning with the other

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PDS, the subject matter experts, even the DC other campuses, lots of amazing collaborative and mentorship opportunities. >> So, going back to that, 1100 because you're located on in Caramel Town 465, I think. >> Yes. >> Um, how much space do you have now up

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there? >> Yeah, right now we have 30 a little over 30,000 square feet on a first floor. However, we are just completing a fourth floor construction project. So, we've obtained about 33,000 additional square ft >> um to replicate everything we have on

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the first floor to expand our space. So, workspaces and student spaces. >> Yeah. But, but I I heard that the first couple of semesters it's pretty much online. Is that what I heard? Or maybe I misinterpreted that. >> Uh

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for the for the um gened courses um yes. So those first um few quarters are kind of that distance learning for their gened courses. Yes. >> So bottom line a freshman or a new student would predominant

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he or she could attend the school physically on a residential mode as well as take an online class or is it totally online for a first semester first quarter student? I'm just trying to get a feel of

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>> of how much online is involved in the overall. >> Yeah, the first four quarters would be predominantly online. Yes. >> Very good. >> Thank you. >> Any further questions or comments from

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the board? Do we have a motion? I'll move it. You have a second. I'll second. >> Got it. This time, >> he let me. He's a gentleman. >> Roll call. Mrs. Anshain.

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>> I >> Mr. Kane Kesco. >> Hi, >> Mr. Scott Boen. >> Hi. >> Mr. Michael Nelson. >> I >> chair votes I. Congratulations. Thank you. >> Thank you very much. >> Congratulations. >> Thank you. >> Thank you both.

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>> Thank you. I'll hunter say hi. >> I sure will. Absolutely. He'll be happy to hear it. >> I I was I was very I was pleased to work with Steve South. >> Yes. >> As a commissioner with ACICS when it was

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around. So, please send my test to him. >> I sure will. Absolutely. >> Thank you all so much. >> Thank you, Tony. >> Thank you, Tony. Thank you, Charlie. Appreciate it very much.

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>> Now leaving the healthc care space [laughter] >> and we do have a resident expert on some of the next things. >> Uh we'll welcome the representatives from the American College of Education ACE uh to the table. Please introduce yourselves and we have three decision

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items going from business to STEM education. So, I'm Stephie Guptal, um, compliance and regulatory manager with ACE. I'm Crystal Newman. I'm the assistant provost for business professions at ACE.

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>> And then join us virtually. Scott, would you like to start? >> Sure. Hi everybody. Scott Bailey. I'm the assistant provost for education professions here at >> ACE. Repeat. >> And I'm Pete Patialos. Uh, I am AC's

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academic um, uh, program analyst. >> Okay. Just out of curiosity, are you two in located in Dallas, Texas? >> I'm close to Dallas. How about [snorts] >> I'm close. I'm close to Dallas. I'm about two hours away.

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>> Okay. Okay. Well, American College of Education, as everyone knows, is familiar with, they began in Illinois in 2005. Um, in 2011, uh, they opened an Indianapolis office. Um, they have additional offices in Dallas, Texas.

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They are, uh, HLC accredited, higher learning commission accreditation. Uh, their latest grant of accreditation was in last year in 2025. They also have uh CCNE commission on collegiate nursing

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education board of commissioners granted uh programmatic accreditation for the BS in nursing and the EMS in nursing uh and that occurred in September of 2020 uh when they first obtained that. They are one of uh they are I believe you're the

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first Sarah for-profit institution that Indiana approved. >> Um that was back in 2015. Um all their courses are offered via distance education. They are located on the 12th floor of this building. Um they

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do not participate in title 4 funding. However, uh students can um pause on repayment for balorate um undergrad loans uh as they continue on with um any master's level or higher

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level uh degree programs at ACE. And just out of curiosity, man actually asked me this question. Um why is it you do not participate in title 4 currently? Is that because the the teacher education programs are reimbursed? I think Pete may be able to speak to this

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because he just wrote about it recently, but the affordability essentially >> you're lower cost. >> Yes, we're much lower cost. >> Okay. All the bureaucratic stuff. [laughter] >> Okay. So, um in the latest NCES data

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reporting in the fall of 2024, they had a whopping 14,263 students in the fall of 2024. And how many of those were Indiana residents? Approximately. >> Oh gosh. In the it Yes. I mean, it's increased greatly over the last few

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years, but I would say probably in the thousands. >> Okay. Is is Florida and Texas are those your second biggest states. >> Um Georgia is um is right with them. You know, Florida, Illinois, Florida, Texas, and Georgia are highest number states, I

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believe. >> Okay. Um the institution offers 42 programs in the field of teacher education. They offer 10 programs in health related fields and nursing is one of them and then five in business related fields. Um in the most recent

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composite score fiscal year ending in consumer 2025 they have a causit of 2.8 which is near the three which is the highest. So um I'm sure the board is familiar with these types of programs.

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that ACE has brought before us before they are offering they're proposing a doctor of business administration. Uh again through distance education the program will be 55 semester credit hours with 55% of the courses in the

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specialty. Uh they have seven faculty member 77 faculty members identified currently three full-time for part-time all hold a doctoral degree. Uh the second program is the doctor of

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education ed in STEM education. 64 semester credit hours with 61% of the courses in the specialty. Um again all the faculty members all 10 hold a doctoral degree. Uh one would be

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full-time, nine would be part-time. And then finally the education specialist uh in STEM education and those are for students who wish not to uh do a dissertation. Um so it is the education specialist and

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again that is 10 faculty members one part-time nine part-time nine one full-time nine part-time all holding a doctoral degree and that program is 34 semester credit hours with 62% of the

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courses in the specialty. Um and there are no stipulations and the board is or the staff is supporting this uh approval for all three programs. Do we want to go program by program or I

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suppose we could do the DBA and then bundle the two extremely related STEM education? Well, the question I was going to ask was that certainly maybe this will be how is it that they came about these programs and how different

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are they the three from the other. So for the DVA, how that came about was um so for the I mean we built the the MBA and we also built the MS and organizational leadership and we

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definitely have essentially kind of like a funnel system for for those that um have their education degrees and they have their EDS but we didn't have that or the MBA or the MSOL. So this is where the DBA was born and I myself have a DBA. So that's why I'm really excited

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about this program. Um because it's like not many people know about it um or know the the designation of DBA versus like PhD and something else. But anyway, I digress. Uh so how that came about was to make sure that those who um come through ACE and have that business

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background have a a route to get their terminal degree. Um and so for those with the educa or the ed and leadership, we developed a focus of study in business management. So for those who had that education background but maybe

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wanted to dabble a little bit into business, they could do it that route. But essentially um we built those courses to kind of see how that would be and the interest level and we found that there is interest. So, um, that's pretty

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much how we came up with the DBA program. >> Uh, what different characteristics will an applicant have, um, as opposed to all the other programs that you've got that allow developers? You you just made reference to it.

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>> Yeah. very >> it's going to be very business focused and especially right now with um how things are going there's going to be a little bit more of AI in there and how like marketing focuses on AI and and

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things of that nature. Um so these these students that would be different from like an ed and leadership um would have more of that business administration piece to be able to uh be entrepreneurs or give consulting for those who are

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interested in entrepreneurship as well. Um and of course being able to teach in in business programs um if they wanted to go into the field of higher education. Do you see internally people going from whatever programs you have now to this particular new program?

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>> I would say for those with the MBA and MS um and organizational leadership for sure. >> Um but I do um just from I mean I talk to my students, I talk to to faculty, there are those um who are in the ED and

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leadership who really wanted to have something more with the business background but we didn't have it. So that was the gap. >> Is there any other institution of higher education out there right now offering this particular? >> Yes. For example, like other peer institutions would be like Capella University, Walden University, other

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online universities who have the doctorate in business administration, >> right? >> Or a doctorate in management. >> Now I noticed in the numbers you just had one for Indiana and one of the programs. I forgot what it was. So therefore, you're you're you're thinking that there's not going to be that much

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of an interest specifically in Indiana. I forgot what program it was. Uh but you you had the headcount u I'll find it. >> I just have a comment. When I went

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through the course um the classes for this for the DV83, I was surprised not to see anything that had AI on it. Oh, it'll be in the course description and in the in the course. >> Yeah, I mean I think that would be a key marketing issue. That is kind of the

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management question of today, >> right? >> And tomorrow. >> Okay. I appreciate that feedback. >> Yeah. And I didn't see it anywhere in there. If I would be like >> I want to understand >> and that's a keyword and see it just straight out instead of like having to funnel through the course description or

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something. Yeah. Okay. >> And hopefully you are offering >> Yes. a lot of analysis, guidance, >> you know, on that issue board. >> If so, I will sign up for the [laughter] >> great see what's going. >> Sure.

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>> I found what I was referencing. Okay. Sure. >> Page 158 that showed only one uh projected Indiana uh on the UV and STEM education. I just curious maybe there's just not that much of an interest

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>> that you're seeing in Indiana for this particular program. >> I'm not sure. I'll have to defer to [laughter] Pete on this one. >> I I I I can I can feel that. So that was the EDS um which uh across the board

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countrywide that that is a a lower population program. I think the EDDD is the one that we had uh forecasted 21 >> Indiana,

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>> right? Just curious. >> Yeah. Yeah. We're we're going we've got a we've got enough data to sort of look at the frequency of Indiana. We didn't want to overstate with the EDS that

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um we wanted to be be more accurate. >> So these graduates will predominantly stay within education then or not necessarily >> for the DBA or the the step >> either or >> um so for the DBA there might be some who are in the field of education who

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wants to venture out and know more about like business and management administration but I believe that primarily they'll be coming from business. Yes. Yeah, I was going to make the same comment and made that it just didn't seem like you already

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but I think you have a very good comment there. >> Yeah, I appreciate that. >> Build it up. >> You're welcome. [laughter] I I do want to make a a pl well proactive and positive comment about the consultancy piece of this because we find

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>> an education teacher prep professional development for existing current teachers. >> We have consultancies all over the place. This is a I like the fact that you are providing training for groups who are trying to train >> teachers and often that g there's a gap

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there. we have over think they're know what they're doing that they make. >> Yeah. >> So, I like that. That's a that's a plus and I encourage you continue that with both areas, especially with the STEM. Okay. >> And I don't know if you're familiar with

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the alternative STEM lensure pathway in Indiana >> a little bit. I' I've started >> converting over to all secondary. I was looking at some of the coursework that you're requiring for the STEM and there

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is some correlation between the two. So something you might want to take that down please >> existing teachers or interested teachers who are actually already in your pipeline. You might be able to do both programs

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>> and earn a license. >> Since I don't have a pad of paper, I'll have Pete make note of that. to I I do have the literature I read in the newsletters and things that come out. I've been reading about this >> and that's a new thing. I just it just seems >> I know this is a nonlicure correct

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pathway but it's also way that they could if they decide to >> thank you >> and your MSD would probably address that as well. One comment that I was a wow comment to me on page 174. Since 2016, you have not

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increased tuition and it still remains correct. >> That's correct. >> Same credit hour. That's just incredible. >> And that's continued plan as long as it's [laughter] possible. Yes. >> So you haven't received a raise in 10 years. [laughter]

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[snorts] No, that's not true. Peter Scott is smiling, too. [laughter] What are your what are your interest qualifications for the STEM degrees? In other words, do you have a degree that's in education? Do you have a degree in science, technology, engineering, or

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math? How do you infuse less of the education and more of the rigorous STEM learning? >> The STEM. So with the at the the doctoral level so

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the master's graduates in the MEED and STEM would be more of the uh focused on the classroom delivery. So the ED would be more going into like the district system level uh management of STEM programs. a little bit more of a focus

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on the program and policy of running STEM programs as opposed to the content in science, math, and engineering, but more of a a STEM leadership focus. Scott, am I paraphrasing that? >> Yeah, you're spot on. You're spot on

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there, Pete. [snorts] [clears throat] >> Is there any um emphasis on hands-on types of science learning that I see? I mean training in that or discussion or analysis or promotion or

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whatever and also because we have a big math problem is there any focus on dealing with some of those core pipeline issues. >> Just asking just throwing that out there. No, there there is some of those

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embedded in the courses, but uh like I say, really the focus of this program isn't hardcore STEM content. It's leading, designing, developing, and managing STEM programs at the school and

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district level. >> A lot of the design some of these, you know, proactive steps toward math remediation and hands-on science learning and you're, you know, not going to get where we need to go. I'm afraid. I'm just

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having labored in this, you know, basement of education for a long time. Just throwing some of that out there. >> True. Very true. >> But the DBA there's there aren't any concentrations, right? >> There's electives, so there's not like

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an area of concentration like with the the ED programs. Will students getting advising on which electives to choose or >> Oh, yeah. So, they can choose um three different courses, but they'll have their student success coaches to talk to

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uh through that. But I know that um I'll I'll sometimes get students that funnel their way up to myself or one of my full-time faculty, talk about um potential career paths and if they want a certain career path, what courses they

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should take for that. And for the in the EDS serve as a stopout for your ed students who Yes. >> Yes, >> I assume so. >> Yeah. And that's generally how they actually migrate into the EDS program as

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a stopout. They just realize they don't it's not stopout. They just realize they don't want to complete the dissertation sequence or they find it too challenging >> and so they take the EDS. Keep up the great work. >> Thank you.

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>> Thanks. >> Any further questions from the board comments? I guess a sidebar here for our general counsel. Should we consider these individually or probably probably

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for the DBA the doctor of business administration proposed by ACE? Do I does the board have a motion? >> So move second. >> Second. [snorts] Chair will call to roll. Miss Mrs. Anne Shane.

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>> I >> Mr. Kanesco. >> Hi. >> Mr. Scott Boen. >> Hi. Minister Michael NSET. >> I chair votes I. And moving to decision item five, which is the

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Ed D and STEM education. >> Well, I didn't ask for a motion for those. So moved. So [laughter] >> second. >> And we'll take Yes. That's for both. That's for both. That's for both of them. >> That's right. So uh >> we saved them

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>> for the doctor of education the the higher level the the culminating uh degree in that pathway. Mrs. Anshain >> Mr. Ken Kinesesco >> hi. >> Mr. Scott Boen. >> Hi. >> Mrs. Michael Nsk. >> Hi. >> Chair votes I. Decision item six the EDS

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in STEM education. Mrs. Anne Shane. >> I'll move for [laughter] >> I was accepting that one. That's what I would have done. >> Okay. I [laughter] >> trying to bundle this illegal >> as a package.

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>> Here's a package. Always like baggage. >> Need a second. >> A second. >> I'll second. >> Okay. Chair will call the role. [laughter] Mrs. Anne Shane. >> Hi. >> Having too much fun for a Monday morning. Yes, we are.

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>> Uh, Mr. Ken Kesco. >> Hi. >> Mr. Scott Boen. I >> Mr. Michael I chair votes I. Congratulations. Thank you. >> Thank you very much. >> Who was a second on the ed of Iowa

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Scott? >> Thank you guys. >> Thank you all for joining us. Speed and Scott. >> Have a good day.