Well, it's got suddenly quiet. So, thank you. I guess that's my clue to kick this thing off. So, hello everyone. Hello. Welcome to beautiful Madison, Indiana. My goodness. I apologize. I was not able to be at dinner last night, but did get in and have a chance to drive around
quickly. Uh what a gorgeous town. I haven't been here since I was young, and it was just awesome to see the vibrancy of of this community. So thanks thanks for hosting everyone. Dr. Polio and his entire team at IvyTech locally as well.
Thank you so much for for hosting us and last evening afternoon and and today and what will be sure a great meeting. Uh I would officially like to call this uh this month's meeting of the Indiana Pushes for Higher Education to order and I believe uh our vice chair Nancy Jordan
is online and will be calling the role. I'm hoping to hear a yes on that. Nancy, can you hear us? Actually, yes. I apologize. I am online, but only for an hour. I'm I'm traveling. So, um, can I abdicate to you? Can I
defer up to you to call the role? I do apologize. No worries. No worries. We can do it. Um, tell you what, why don't I just, since I got the since I've got the floor, let me go ahead and just do that real quick. Make sure I know we have forum by the walls here. Mike Alley present.
Dennis Bland present. Kathy Cabayo present. And I will introduce but uh in the meantime Edward or Ted Castanova Dr. Castronova present. There you are. Hello. Jud Fischer here. Samantha Flashaker
present. There we go. Tony here. Bill Hannah Jordan heard from you. You're online. Thank you. Molly Kitell Kramer present. Pepper Moharren here and me Dan Peterson we have a all but
one so that's pretty good so thank you all um let's see as I mentioned uh a welcome a more official welcome here to Dr. Castanova uh for a commission as as you all recall
um we have at all times we have a faculty member of the commission just like we have a student member of the commission um Dr. Castanova will serve as the commission's faculty representative for the next two years. We welcomed him to the group. I had the great pleasure of having coffee with him
on Tuesday. So, it's fun to catch up with him briefly. And uh I think Chris, you're going to do a little bit more on Dr. Catherine over here uh later on in the meeting, but welcome again. I hope it's great confidence.
Uh first order of business here is we need to approve uh the schedule for the 2026 commission meetings. There should be in your stack about I don't know how many pages down. There should be a list of
dates that were printed out for you. Give you a minute to do that. Larry, thank you for approval from Larry. Secondly, Kathy and uh unless there are any concerns or questions, I would entertain to vote for
approval of those dates. All in favor, please say I. I. I. Same. Okay. Thank you very much. Um little bit of change. Uh the commission will continue to host our meetings on campuses around the state as we have
been doing. But out of respect for the budget uh which we all know is a challenge as well as just the challenge of logistics we are going to make a move and um we will no longer be doing evening dinners and tours on the
campuses. We will be attempting to move these meetings to one day sessions on uh Thursdays. Um all seven institutions are aware of this change. So, beginning uh with our next meeting in September, which I believe is in Jasper, right? U
that will only be a Thursday meeting. Um also keeping the budget in mind, we the commission will pay for hotel rooms for those people that need them the night before. But just for um to reiterate, if you do need a room, uh we ask that all
commission commission members do respond in a timely fashion to Lucas and the team about whether or not you need a room. Um there'll be a deadline given and if if if uh if it's after that deadline the rings will be released. So just just for awareness there. Yes sir.
Uh I see you got the meeting starting at 9:00. Uh those of us in extreme parts of the tough getting anywhere by 9:00. Can we make the move until 10:00 because you're you're finishing at three. Yeah. Yeah. We talked about that. We just haven't had a chance to make a full
determination on that. I I don't have any concerns with that. Does anybody else? I mean, I we can follow up if need be, but starting at 10:00 does makes a little later in the day, but for those uh those meetings that are more extreme distance wise probably does make some
sense. Course it'll save on money. Yeah. Right. Right. Yeah, that's true. Yeah, that'll save on hotel. So, unless anybody has any concerns with that, then we'll take that uh maybe as we're not voting on this, but we'll take that as an advisement and uh and we'll
attempt to move forward with that once comes up. Yeah. Thank you, Larry. Um let's see. Next order of business, moving away from schedule is that we um we do need to fully authorize a new slate of officers uh for the commission. Um Michelle will be later in the meeting
talking not too long from now but talking about some uh needed changes to our bylaws uh beyond this. So uh there'll be a little bit more on the officer slate and the scheduling around that. But um we will uh continue to move what we've done here in the last number
of years with a a two-year process for slate of officers. Um and so Dr. Lot Miller's term was cut short as secretary since he was on the off two-year schedule. So, uh, given his departure and, um, given the slate that, um, we
had, the proposed slate that we need approval on will include, um, for the next year will be myself as chair for one more year. Nancy Jordan is vice chair for one more year, and then we'd like to add Kent Kramer on as secretary
to serve out the remaining year, Dr. Lock Miller's term if you will, but um move that uh forward with the slate of officers. So would entertain a motion. Thank you. Thank you. Any concerns or
questions or upheaval or uh uh around any of us that are are going to be uh hopefully doing this for another year? You're the immediate pass. I know but for one more year the compensation committee uh yeah that's true that would
be the case yes that's true okay I don't know if we're going to talk about the bylaws uh the compensation committee not specifically directly in the bylaws but yeah since there's no state yeah the bylaws covers for the chair to be able to um select any additional
subcommittee at any time so as Dan would wish for you to participate in that then will the for as plain. Consider this mine. No, I like I like the look. Uh, all right. Hearing uh other than than that like question would entertain um a vote.
All in favor, please say I. I. I. Thank you, Nancy. All right. So moved. Um to reiterate for everyone the uh commission, we have two standing committees uh as part of our our work. We have the academic affairs
and quality committee and we have the budget productivity committee. Uh current membership and proposed membership for the next year is as follows. Academic affairs and quality Dennis Bland ask we're asking him to continue to chair that for another year.
Uh we would have the addition of Dr. Edward or Ted. You're going by Ted, right? Yes. Okay. So I will continue to I will switch to Ted even though it's written here more formally. Uh Dr. Ted Castanova, Jud Fischer, Larry Geratoni, Kent Kramer, Pepper Mullharren, and
myself as the academic affairs and quality committee. And then budget productivity committee. We've asked and I think Mike has agreed to chair that again. Mike Alli is chair, Kathy Cabo, Samantha Flashaker, uh, Bill Hannah, Nancy Jordan, and Molly Kitell would be
on that committee. Um you will recall that we in some years past we had a separate uh student success and completion uh committee uh that operated number I can't remember how many years ago we switched this but
we we decided for lots of good reasons to make that a committee of the whole if you will because of the work of student success uh and completion committee was so central from a student centric standpoint to uh to what's important so we decided to make that a committee the
So you all are on that committee. Um and additionally um Oh yeah. Okay. So that's that's that. So another topic I wanted to bring up and we talked about this I think at the last commission meeting but there has been
discussion here going on for a little while around the topic of mission differentiation. You'll recall that mission differentiation has been around for a long time and it means a lot of different things historically. Um, and for a variety of good reasons, it becomes apparent that we probably need
to do a deeper dive on mission differentiation to really make sure that what has been out there, what is intended and what we what we want to make sure is is appropriate going forward is really looked at and and reflected upon given today's current circumstances. So what we're going to
do, what we're going to propose is that we have a working group developed um that will operate over the next few months to really do a deep dive into mission differentiation. Um we will appoint uh I I will in concert with with Commissioner Lowry will appoint a
chairman for that working group. Uh and our hope would be that we'd have a couple of commission members on that or as many as as are interested and and obviously bring into that uh discussion uh staff appropriate staff and others from outside including potentially from
the from the universities themselves u to really do a deep dive on that which then can come back and report to the commission as a whole around findings and potentially recommendations for for changes. So I would reach out here to in this context anybody on the commission
that would like to be a part of that working group if you could let Chris and I know by I think we was trying to get this moving. So uh by August 8th if you will we don't have exact context logistics around how often this group
will meet in what in what form but um know that we've done this periodically in the past around certain topics and it's important to do this. So if anybody has interest, please please do let us know and and we'll move this forward as expediently as possible and over the next few months and try and get some get
some clarity around that. Um the final thing as it relates to committees and committee work of the commission, I'm going to turn to uh to Chris here to talk about the formation of a legal subcommittee which he's going to describe why we're proposing that we move to this. So Chris, without further
ado. Okay. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Um, and I'm going to use some notes so I don't miss anything. In discussion with general counsel from the office of education, um, it has been recommended to us at the commission to have a legal committee or subcommittee. Um, in the
event that an administrative law judge from the office of the administrative law proceedings issues a non-final order in favor of a petitioner, the commission for higher ed, which has final authority, shall review the non-final
order and then issue a final order for all parties. Uh if the commission wishes to raise an objection when those occur, uh often times uh the the deadlines for the commission to file some type of of objection is is challenging if we have
to get all together for example within 15 days u in order to meet the requirements of the order. Michelle's going to correct me by misstating this. Um, thus the order becomes final also if no party files an objection in
accordance with requirements and thereby ends up waving rights to judicial review. You can see the inherent challenge of that. We don't have this kind of thing come up very often, but when it does with a 15-day window, it's
I won't say it's impossible. It's very challenging all together. Um so if a timely and appropriate objection is filed though the ultimate authority will review the matter and issue a final uh order to remand the matter back the office of
ALP the administrative law proceedings additional um a 15-day window as I already said can be a barrier to achieving a form of the commission u we know you're all very busy people that's part of the reason you're on this commission because you are actively
involved in our state um So that can be a barrier to meeting and raising our own objection to an order that's being put forward. Thus with the recommendation from legal counsel we come up for you
and our recommendation is um to ask the chair of the commission, the vice chair, the secretary, the past chair, immediate past chair and then the two chairs of the standing committees of a you know
academic affairs quality and the budget productivity committee if you're counting that's six individuals. um they essentially serve today anyway as the executive committee of this body and have I think in practice practicality
for a long time. So, uh, you know, and Dan and I were talking about this, uh, you know, the easiest way I can think of or or just one example I can think of is there's a statute and suddenly someone who is affected by the statute
sees it this way. Our practice or history in it has been to do something this way. And unfortunately, maybe the statute just isn't. We take note of those things. I hope you all know all the time anyway most of the
time when something is never raised we'll see something that just might not be clear enough in a statute and of course then if we have our list and we go to you know governor and general assembly you know the next legislative session say you tweet this challenge in something like that becomes
though when the two parties see it differently it goes before administrative law then you've only got a 15-day window and convening all of you in a court Well, that's challenging at that. So, recommendation for legal counsel, recommendation for all of you
is to utilize this and I think it's going to be pretty rare. This legal committee essentially constituted what I think most of us think of as the executive committee of the spot. far more words than I probably need to use on that, but this is it is something
new and um I think we'll just serve for practicality purpos. Yeah. Technically, I'm not sure we need to vote on this, but it wouldn't hurt. So, uh heard a second. So, any questions or comments or concerns around this for Chris or or Michelle or the team?
No, this is just want you to know that um I I think it's a great idea and I appreciate the the thoroughess. Thank you, Nancy. Appreciate that. Yeah. Comment question. When these things come up, if if and when they come up, will
the whole committee be notified in of what's going on just from a communication perspective whether we're all involved or not? Just we're aware of what? Absolutely. Yeah. Kathy, we have a doc we have a documented process where most of these
things start out as an appeal to the commission for some purpose. Uh there are three levels of appeals that an individual can go through. And once they've made it through those three levels, they can choose to go through this process. Um at the point that it goes through this process and a decision
was made, I would be the one that would interact with this legal subcommittee um for you all to make a final determination. Um and at that point um once everything is settled with uh the uh administrative law proceedings office
then we can notify the rest of you efforts are not on this executive committee. There only about five. No. So so the commission has 14. Okay. Great question. And so this is six individuals all essentially executive
decisions as members of the commission. That makes perfect. Great question. Yeah. So, uh, unless there are other questions or comments, we've got a motion in the second. I entertain approval. All in favor of approval, please say I. I. I.
I. I. Oppose. Same. All right. Very good. Thank you all. And I do want to let you know that um, Commission Member Hannah is also online with us. Oh, okay. All right. Hi, Bill.
Hello, everybody. Hi, how are you? We'll mark you as here. We have 100% attendance. That's great. Thank you. Thanks for being on. Uh now, it's my great pleasure to uh invite Dr. Marty Polio, uh president of IvyTech, new president of IvyTech Community College to address the group.
Uh he was uh as he comes forward, I'd like to congratulate Dr. Polio on being named the new president of IvyTech. I think we're all super excited to uh to have you here and welcome you to uh Indiana from just across the river. um and uh just turn the floor to you and
thanks again for for being here and for hosting us. Great. Thank you so much for being here today and thank you all for visiting campus. Those of you that got to tour yesterday, got to see the amazing things that are happening here at Madison campus. Um and I assure you it's happening all over the the state right
now. So, I've had the great opportunity in the past three weeks to visit 10 of our campuses all over this wonderful state. Um, and I've just been blown away by what's happening in each um of our communities. The brand of of IvyTech is extremely strong and I am so honored and
pleasured to be the 10th president of IvyTech Community College System. Uh, I did go to Indiana University Bloomington. So although I've been across the river uh for the better part of three decades, it's great to be back home again in Indiana. Uh, and I look forward to serving this. I know I have
big shoes to fill uh without question as Dr. Dr. Ellman has done a wonderful job over the past nine years. Uh I get the opportunity right now to do a lot of listening, talking to our chancellors, talking to community. Uh we have 100 day plan right now where we're having listening sessions across the state and
obviously visiting with as many stakeholders as we possibly can including you all. Um and then obviously looking towards the future of the things we want to sustain um which is many many things and then once again things that we can improve
on. Uh so we'd love to hear from any of you and meet with you if uh you would like to to talk about some of those things that we think IvyTech is doing fantastic and some of the things that we can do better as we move forward into the future. So thank you so much for being here at IvyTech and um we're just
so happy uh that you chose the Madison campus today to be here with us. Thank you. Welcome. Um we think everybody on this commission knows that. I'm pretty sure everybody in this room knows it. But um you know the the amazing institution which is IvyTech single largest singly
accredited community college in the country is a huge advantage for this state and I think we take good advantage of that but I think there's always opportunities for taking more and more advantage of that on behalf of Hoosiers uh and Hooser students and their families. So, um, really, really great,
um, and excited for you to be here and anything that we, staff, commission members can do to help you in your transition into leadership at IvyTech. Please, please don't be afraid to reach out. We have a good, strong, and collaborative working relationship, I think, with all our institutions and and
the leaders there. So, again, thank you and welcome. Uh next up, um if you look in your agenda book, uh we have we need to approve the commission meeting minutes from our last meeting, which is on May 15th. They should be uh on page number one of your uh meeting book. So I
would entertain a motion for approval of those minutes. Thank you. Thank you. Are there any comments, corrections, notations to those minutes? Hearing none, all in favor, please say I. I I
I I Any opposed? Thank you. Minutes are approved. Thank you. Now, I'm going to ask that you guys bear with us a little bit. Due to some scheduling, we're shuffling some things around on the schedule. I've got
detailed notations from the team about what goes next, but if I screw up, there's a variety of folks here that are going to point me in the right direction. If I'm interpreting this next, we are going to our student success and completion committee uh
report out here. So, um I'm going to turn it to uh Amanda Amanda, the chancellor here at IvyTech Madison uh for that presentation. So, thank you and welcome. Thank you and and good morning. I welcome everyone to IvyTech Madison and
to Madison. It's an honor to host your last overnight meeting and I'm so glad that you got to see the vibrant and city that that I love. I I have two individuals joining me. My name is Amanda Parson. I'm the chancellor here at IvyTech Madison. I also have Kay
Stokes, our vice chancellor for academic affairs, and Dustin Stewart, our vice chancellor for student affairs that's going to join me to share some of the amazing things that we do here at IvyTech and at IvyTech of Madison.
I want to share a little bit of a personal story about how I approach IvyTech every day as its leader. I I shared last night at dinner that I'm proud to claim myself as a product of Indiana's higher education institution.
I had a special person that was here at IvyTech several years ago and and she set me on a path and she told me I needed to stay in Indiana and I needed to stay in Jefferson County. And you know sometimes when you tell people that they do it and I'm a I'm a product of
that. I've been in Jefferson County uh since I was five. And how I approach IvyTech every day, uh, it comes from a special story. And when I went to college, I was a 21st century scholar. I
was Pell Grant eligible. And my mom was what we call some college, no degree. And when I went to college, she had three kids getting ready to go. And she said she was going back, too. Maybe some of you know an individual that uh they
step away from college and there's some college no degree and when their kids get close to that time they say it's my time to go because if I'm going to make them do it I better do it too. So as I went to Hanover College, she went to
IvyTech here at Madison. So the people that came before me educated my mother. She was a nursing major and she really reset the trajectory of my family as the sole income earnner for our family. I
was pelgrant eligible by the time my younger sister went to college. I had to coach her through how to pay for college because my mom had continued to pursue her BSN, her master's degree in nursing, continued jobs in the healthc care
field, uh, all the way up to working for a global company during COVID that put forth infectious disease protocols for the hospitals and for the cruise lines. So if you're ever back on cruises, she helped get cruises back online after
COVID by putting forth infectious disease protocols. And so that's a very special story for me because as my office looks over the great entryway that we have here to IvyTech Madison, I watch every person come into this
building and I think to myself, they can do what she did. They can do what she did. It's going to look different, but as chancellor here at Madison, I have seen over the course of 20 years what a step into IvyTech can do for a family.
So when I share the student success report, it's truly personal to me. And when I share numbers and we dig into the data, it's not just all about the numbers because every person counts and every person makes a difference as they come into college.
A little bit about IvyTechmatics. We are Indiana's community college and we are one of 19 brother and sister campuses that we c have across the state. Madison campus specifically serves two counties that is Jefferson
and Switzerland counties. Uh so two very rural areas. We also uh connect with uh our our surrounding counties and our campuses as much as possible. We serve an outsiz mission for those two
counties. We actually impact in our different programs over 8,000 students that we want to tell you about today. So, I'm going to have my counterparts tell you a little bit about the different uh pieces that we have and
really set up for a great presentation. Thank you, Dr. Harson. Really, the work that the Madison campus does is changed a lot specifically over the last 10 years and the students that we serve and the mission that we carry out each day. A really simple sort of visual u to
represent that is this. see the graphic of the three-legged stool here, right? Um those three legs represents sort of the pillars of support and and service that we we offer here from our campus. Uh one of those legs is the traditional
undergraduate enrollment of degree seeeking students that our campus was built on. Um another leg is our work in correctional education both locally and statewide. We'll talk more about that here in just a few minutes. And then a third leg is uh the work that we do with
our K12 partners in high schools, dual credit, dual enrollment. And that's also both locally and statewide. And so those three legs have really sort of uh come together in the last 10 years. And we've seen our campus transform and how we how
we serve students. So we have uh more than 30 degree programs and certificates. We our biggest program is nursing. We also offer business. We offer advanced manufacturing. We're working to support local entrepreneurs in the community and
we offer programs and resources that are tailored to the needs of our local campus. What I want to talk about a little bit as we get started here is how the Madison campus is small but mighty. We may be geographically small in our
service area but we punch above our weight in terms of our impact at the statewide level. And I can show you that with this next slide. There you go. So this is the three legs of our stool. We have high school students and
traditional dual credit and dual enrollment. We offer undergraduate programs for degree seeeking students courses only and senior scholars and then there's our workforce leg which is of course skills training apprenticeship and achieve your degree
which is where uh employees are able to go back to school and receive employer funded educations. So and we have about 300 employer partners statewide for achieve your diversity. So traditional
three legs of maps and what we do but these are programs in which we punch above our weight. We are serving the state not just Jefferson and Switzerland counties through our work with um the department of corrections and our
service to um educating people who are incarcerated around the state through our work with high schools in ITAP. So, if you look at uh adult basic ed and skills training, that's our work in the
prisons. If you look at dual enrollments, that's our statewide service through IAP, which we're going to tell you a little bit more about, but that's online dual enrollment programs. And then our third circle, degree
seeeking students. So, that is where our statewide reach becomes innovative and creative. This campus is known for pioneering first at IvyTech and first in the state programs. So, we're very proud of what we do here. And we're going to
take a minute to walk you through each of those three pieces uh our uh courses and at traditional academic programs, our work with IAP and state high schools, and but first up, our prison programs.
So starting with our student success and our statewide programming, I have the privilege of having an amazing team here. I think you could put them up against any higher education team and for that reason I have to keep their skill sets going and their ambition
going and and that to do that has been a couple of statewide projects. The first one that I want to tell you about is how we serve the state of Indiana out of Madison in correctional education. IvyTech Madison in 2021
became the educational provider for adult basic education and career and technical training in all 15 IDOC facilities. This team here, including a statewide director, her name is Amber Fenigan. She
couldn't be here with us today, overseas schools at 15 sites from Madison to Michigan City to Terraote to Tel City and everywhere else in between. Our our adult basic education site uh provides
literacy education up to the eighth grade level for students that test below an eighth grade level. and then also high school equivalency for the students that have not earned their high school graduation. You can see the sites on the slide up
here for the career and technical training that we provide. These programs are a combination of skills and training that are needed in the facility for uh maintaining the the community and
providing services and also matched with high wage industry that are willing to hire these individuals after re-entry. I think that this map is important because you see the statewide reach of
our our educational programming. across the state. Uh so we have 140 faculty and staff that are out of Madison that go to work every day in these um correctional facilities.
And you see where the IvyTechs are located. The IvyTechs are the green circles. It is very important for our team that as these individuals are working towards
re-entry, they identify with IvyTech. They know IvyTech as a resource because they will go home to 92 different counties and IvyTech serves 92 counties. So they may when they walk across an IvyTech graduation stage while they're
incarcerated, they know IvyTech. They know that IvyTech provides career linking services. IvyTech provides furthering education and IvyTech is a resource that they can go to when they
go back to rebuild their their life. Another important part of the programming that we offer is very focused on providing the resources for that next job at re-entry. The programs that you'll see on the board now are
what we call out custody. I like to think of out custody as you're nearing out. And so these are programs that are offered within six months of re-entry. You'll see the programming uh where it's offered and the industrial
certifications that are offered for the individuals as they look to succeed in their future career. Since 2021, IvyTech has increased adult basic education programming in the facilities
by 23% in four years. High school graduations for these students have increased 55% in four years. We've doubled the CTE enrollments and we've doubled the CTE certifications.
You can see on the screen here that we've had 3,000 enrollments in adult basic education this past year with 714 students walk in across their high school graduation stage and and over 3,200 students in career and
vocational education with over 2,000 completions in the career and technical space. I love the graphic that's on this slide because that is what I think of when I think of our students coming to us. Coming to us as students and I think in
an incarcerated situation, you have to be brave to raise your hand and say you want to go to school and to say to your case manager, I'm going to go to school. That's a huge step for thinking about re-entry. And they walk out with more confidence,
more education, and more skills. love people. I love knowing people and what makes them special. So, what I have for you next is a little video that includes some of our teachers and some of students that we've had in our course.
Thank you to the commission for including justice involved students as a part of your mission. Thanks to Commissioner Lowry. He's been in some of our facilities with us. And um just anytime if anybody would ever like to go to a graduation. It is one of the best
days and we always welcome visitors and we'd be happy to host host you at any time. She's always hard to follow that video. I feel like she's done. Yeah, thank you for
excellent presentation. Very insightful, very helpful. I'm going to play off the word that was used earlier about you all being pioneers in this work and the impact seems to be so great.
I I was concerned about the increase in enrollment as that signal in the obvious that there's increase in crime. I'm wondering for all the programming, what insights have you gained
that become some type of formal program that could actually be taken upstream? What have you learned from the students outside of the educational? What are the insights gained that could be taken out to communities that might be used to
even stem crime in first place? First of all, I'd like to address there. Uh first of all, I'd like to address that actually the population has decreased um in the facilities. And so
as we work to increase, that's something that we actually talk about that the population has decreased, but we're increasing the education population. From what I have learned and what I've seen, first of all, it takes a whole
community. We are every day working a lot with every program that IDOC offers, everything IvyTech offers, and then everything that a community has to offer. I think specifically with the students that we stay in contact with
after graduation with us, after release, housing continues to be an issue. I have so many students come up to me and need to seek housing and we do everything we can. We try to, you know, share our social capital with with landlords and
and and property owners in the area of saying this is a student that we have and this is a student that's completed. And so a lot of those we need to make sure that the basic needs are met as they uh re-enter into the community. I think the
the mission and the dri the drive that I see in our students as they connect to a career and as they connect to hope, the more that we can do that at a younger age and in a community for people that aren't incarcerated,
the the opportunity to find a job and to have that purpose. I've had a a a former graduate before say, "I really sat down and thought about what I could do with my life, and I realized that I've been
manufacturing for a long time. I've just been manufacturing things that I wasn't supposed to be manufacturing." And so to make that connection about the the career and the earnings gave her a new purpose. And so I think the more and
I think that there's a lot of that in the state of Indiana happening Let's connect people to career coaching. Let's put them on a path for a career so that they're not finding other ways that they shouldn't be to to pursue those opportunities.
Well, I will turn it over to Dustin Stewart to talk about our next leg. So, are you all going actually doing formal programming to take that kind of insight to schools to community centers to you know what are you doing with the information?
Absolutely. So career coaching has been a big part of IvyTech's new mission with Career Link. Um, and not really new. We've always been a community and career college, but we're much more intentional about it. We want every student, every alumni, whether you're high school,
whether you're in the elementary schools coming to our camp, know that IvyTech provides career services. And so the way that we provide that at each step is part of that mission. We also really connect with a lot of our community
partners to make sure to set up the community that's needed for where's the education coming from, where's your job coming from, where's your groceries coming from, where's your where's your housing coming from. And so
I think we can continue to do that. We're getting really, you know, we've we've moved to our community now. We've moved to our state in the education. So, how can we move that to the state from what we learned from this model? One more, maybe two more. Go ahead.
Well, I think what what I'm most impressed with is what I'm seeing um from the basic adult education and the success of that program. And I just wonder in the state if if you believe
the value is mostly from the educational components and also part of the educational components are the essential wraparound services that you're providing. Now you mentioned about all that social break
and fiscal literacy. It's just it's a whole package. Um, is there I I'm sure there is data to demonstrate that it's re reducing the risk of it, but it's changing people and are are you
what do you attribute that to mostly? First of all, I'd like the opportunity to share a couple of data pieces that you brought to the top of my mind. And first of all, that is this high school equivalency work equates to 20% of all of Indiana's production of high school
equivalencies. So 20% of high school equivalencies are happening in this program from this team across the entire state. So really trying to convey what we mean by K saying we punch above our weight. I'd also like to take the opportunity to um call to the Strada
interns that are in the room because the Strata Foundation has come to us just in the past couple of months and they would like to conduct a statewide study uh to find some of the answers about what are the components making the difference in
these programs. And so we're currently having a conversation about strata foundation uh Dr. Dr. Pete Bar coming in with his research team, working with IDOC and working with IVTECH to try to answer some of the questions what's
what's the the most important programming for the best outcomes. Uh recidivism for our programming is about 34% less than what it traditionally is for other other
a student having no educational program. Yeah. Um 714 lives changed and that's just that's incredible. So well done on that. I know um ABD programs across the state are dealing with some funding opportunities right now. Just wondering
what that looks like uh in the 15 facility you're offering. Absolutely. So we're a contractor for IDOC. So IDOC is actually the fiscal agent on the funds that are the adult education and we have everything figured
out for next year and continue to provide adult education for IDC and IvyTech. I think with the shapes and changes that we have, we need to continue to look at how we can make sure to continue this programming and also
how we can make sure to really solidify and firm up that this is this is an opportunity for these individuals. Dr. Polio got to meet one of our alumni yesterday and that is what she came to him at Cody Industries yesterday with and and she said, "You need to make sure
this stays." and he said, "I will make sure and I will come to you if anything does change is what uh is what he said." And so, um, 700 high school graduations is magnificent. One of the lines at the high school graduations at the Branchville men's facility, I heard a
speaker say is that he said, "You don't have to lie that you have a high school graduation anymore." And the room like erupted in laughter. And so, it is uh an important milestone for them. I know you're ready to move on, but I just can't just
really enlighten people across the state including employers. It's important for them to understand this word more directly and the successes you're having. I want to build on just real quick comment around what Kent brought up and that is glad to hear your funding through DOC ensures that you can
continue on the HSSE health e although just for everyone's awareness you probably are but there is some some significant challenges financially for adult basic ed and for the high school employee programs across the state that I think we're all going to have to be aware of and help help figure out
support around in various ways but um due to federal and and some state cuts on that. So, it is their first step towards higher education is to to wrap up the high school part of it. And so, I can answer as many questions and talk as long as you want. I'm happy to have the
statewide stage to talk about this work. And I think that the more employers that we can connect to that continues to provide that connection to career. We have employers coming from out of state to connect to our program. This morning
we were talking at breakfast about employers coming from Arizona and California. We need the employers here in Indiana and they do. Uh but that is how impressive the programming in and how uh how much everyone needs workforce
and so I look forward to hearing any connections and conversations. Our students do go to all 92 counties and need jobs and education in 92 counties. And that's why I think speak to the commission about the statewide reach that you have and any contacts that you
have. Thank you very much. Ready to move to high school? Yeah. Thank you. Thank you, Dr. Harson. Yeah, we we know folks are excited about the correctional education work that we're doing statewide. We're very proud of it. Um I love Kay's description, punch above your
weight for our campus. Uh I also like to think of it as small campus, big impact. Uh and that's how we try to think about things here in Madison. It's no different uh for our K12 programming. Um we have worked really hard the last decade to grow what we do with local K12
partners, but then more recently our reach statewide and that is through um K referenced it earlier, the Indiana course access portal or IAP. Um just as a as a refresher or reminder um IAP is a
repository of online um coursework both high school coursework and college coursework that's provided to high schools um and approved by the DOE um so students can earn high school credit or college credit uh through IAP um IvyTech
was the first postsecary provider um inside of IAP uh now there are many more ports providers We know some of our colleagues from around the state at other institutions have joined in and offered and are offering college credit through IAP. Um so we're thrilled about that. Back in 2018 when IvyTech became a
course provider, the college stated that they wanted one campus to serve as the hub if you will um to oversee uh implementation of IAP and oversee the activities there, our course offerings. And so the Madison campus um just
because we like to jump on new things like that u we jumped out there and said we'll be the ones to we'll coordinate that. We'll we'll serve as the IAB hub. And so have to give a shout out to our wonderful K14 team led by Andrea McDow who u who leads the efforts here. She
has a great job and has really worked to grow this and our statewide reach um over the last few years. Um, as you can see on the map, um, since 2018, our campus has served and coordinated IAP enrollment for the high all the high
schools represented by the flags there on the screen. So that's north to south, east to west. Um, that's a lot of schools that we've worked with that are outside the footprint of our service area. Um, one of the really neat things about IAP is just the opportunity for
high schools in the state to supplement their own curriculum um, and and fill in gaps in courses that they may not be able to offer in their school, but the students can have a chance to take online. Um, and then one of the really neat student success pieces is the
implementation or the insertion I should say of a school designated mentor. Um so a school designated mentor would go into the online course shell uh with the student to be able to see um how the student's
progressing. Um this could be a coach, this could be a counselor, this could be a principal, this could be a teacher, uh but this is a person who really sort of serves as the cheerleader for the student because these can be challenging courses. they're taking online college courses in the case of IvyTech and so u
it could be a challenge and so sometimes those high school students need that extra um encouragement so a lot of reach statewide there um a little bit about outcomes we um offer
through IvyTech uh with IAP over 50 college courses um are available um for hospitals and students to choose from In 2023 24, IvyTech enrollment in IAP made up 40% of the total enrollment um inside
of of uh of the platform. And so um that's across all providers. And then we think that that this piece is really interesting. So 36% of all students who have taken an IAP course um
with IvyTech have gone on to earn an IvyTech credential. And then 30% of those students um have gone on to earn the Indiana College. All right. So um we think that's that's impressive. Um I would note a couple things. U many of
the students who are counted in there as having taken an IBT IAP course um are still in the pipeline and so they they're there they may still be working toward that credential, right? And they wouldn't be counted there yet. And then one way that we really we don't have a good way to capture this is some of
those students took those courses, graduated from high school, and then transferred those credits to one of our four-year partners, and they may have earned credentials at those those institutions as well. So, that number likely uh could be higher than that um if we count our other four-year
partners. So, some great outcomes there. Staying in the K12 lane. This is something um this is something that we know um everyone has their eye on or even some in this room likely involved in, but we've been paying close attention to what uh the redesign of the
uh the high school diploma looks like. Um and and we're as a campus that has really strong local K12 partnerships, we're ready to help our local schools meet the moment. Um we want to be there for them. So, we're doing a bit of uh
what we might call a gap analysis right now, right? Um two things. What are we already doing that would help our local schools um meet these requirements and be able to offer these readiness seals? You can see the graphic on the screen there. So, what are we already doing
that that can get us there and get our schools there? Um and then where are the gaps, right? So there may be some some pieces there where we need to beef some things up and we can come alongside our school partners and then our our local employers to to beef some things up to
offer these seals and so we're we're ready to do that. Um just a snapshot of some of the work we've done locally. So this is more thinking about inside the footprint of our service area. Um, again, another shout out to our local K14 team, but last year, this is a
snapshot, um, we served 1,800 students both in dual credit and dual enrollment again here here within our service area. And we have credential production um in in these areas. Associates in business, liberal arts, general studies, technical
certificates in medical assisting, cloud technology, welding, industrial, mechanical, and then certificates in a business, CNA, and welding. And so, you know, we're we're keeping a close eye on on the list of credentials of value that
are approved by the state. We like to say we were doing credentials of value before credentials of value was cool, right? We're we've been cranking these things out, but we know we need we need to pay close attention to that and stay aligned with what the state um needs from us and what our local schools uh
need from us. We think we're well poised um to come right alongside our K12 partners to help them meet this moment um and award these readiness seals um to high school students. So, um, we're excited about that. I draw your
attention to the last bullet. Um, I look at Commissioner Lowry here because I know you remember very well when this work started and what a lift it was just here locally. Um, very proud to say that 100% of our local schools are participating in offering Indiana College.
That's that's huge. Um, and especially from the perspective of long ago when that was that was a tough thing to get going. So, um, we're we're happy about that. All right. Um, we talked about a couple legs of the stool. I'd like to bring up
Kay Stokes, vice chancellor of academic affairs, to kind of talk about some of the really cool programming we have with our undergraduate degree seeking students. I just wanted to take a quick check of our time chair. if uh you'd like for us to kind of stop with those two deep
dives or if you think we have about another five minutes to dive into the undergraduate. Okay, perfect. Thank all right, five minutes it is. Thank you so much. Um so once again, small
footprint but big aspirations. We believe in being innovative. Part of helping students and communities succeed is understanding what the local needs are and reaching them. And so part of that is about partnerships. We are deeply invested in the local community
as you can see from Dr. Harson's background. Um I'm a 27year resident of Madison and never want to leave. So, we are multiplying and amplifying our ability to serve the local community through a number of academic programs
that are innovative and that are new to IvyTech as a whole statewide. So, I'm going to talk about a couple of those, highlight a couple other ways that we partner with the local community, and then uh we will wrap up. So, and you would have seen this, those of
you who were on the tour yesterday, you would have seen our our vet nursing facilities and programs. Um, we are partnering with Handover College. They are going to they're planning to launch a DBM program. We will do a two-year associates degree in vet nursing and a
one-year certificate in vette. What I want to point out very briefly is that um the state and the nation are critically short in veterinary professionals and vet techs and vet nurses are the physician expenders of
the veterinary world. practices that have veterinary technicians who are certified and well educated tend to have a 30 to 40 40% better um economic success rate than
those who don't. So, uh vettees and vet nurses are also crucial to the success of biotech, pet health and aggra business, right? So we need more vettees than ever before. And so that is the reason why we partnered with Hanover to
bring this program in. And Hanover, of course, is a small liberal arts college that's down the road from us here in Jefferson County. They're Indiana's oldest private uh private college. So another handover partnership, Oops, sorry.
There we go. The the clay is touching. is our onetoone nursing program. Um, handover needed to start a nursing program. We have a nursing program. There's, as you know, with the commission, there's no point in having
two schools in the same geographic area competing with each other. So, we worked in partnership with handover to expand our number of nursing beds by taking their and their graduates. So they do their first year at handover, they do their second and third years here and
receive an associates of science and nursing and then they go back to handover in the fourth year and get their BSN. And that program is is running ahead of our projections in terms of um admissions. We have the first cohort this year, second cohort
next year. And you saw those of you who were on the tour yesterday saw our marvelous facilities. Um, we're also partnering with the public schools in our region, Indiana University Southeast. Uh, we are starting this fall a 2 plus two um,
associates to bachelor's degree program in business that will allow students to stay here on this campus. The IU Southeast facilities are about an hour's drive away and that can be a barrier to people who live in the local community and have families and children and can't
get down there. So, IU faculty will be here two nights a week for an accelerated business program that will allow students to earn a 4-year degree on this campus without ever having to leave their communities. We're very proud of that one. Um you can see from
this picture we have uh we have a two plus2 program that was highly successful and had to um put it into pause for a moment. But we have uh staff on this campus who are two plus two grads from the program when it was with um IU East.
And so those are some of our own employees who have benefited from that kind of program. Um, next I want to talk a little bit about entrepreneurship and as you know uh IvyTech has started a school of
entrepreneurship statewide. Thank you Mr. Gerony for your assistance with that. What we're doing here on this campus is we are partnering with our local community to determine what kinds of programs and services best meet the
needs. And we've been on a listening tour with we've talked with the city of Madison and the Chamber of Commerce and our beautiful downtown Main Street program and all of the other um all of the other stakeholders in the local business and entrepreneurship community.
And what we have learned is that um everybody's kind of working in a silo and that IvyTech can provide services and resources and programming to serve as an umbrella. So you all have seen our beautiful downtown. It is a magnet for
entrepreneurs, but often people don't have the resources or the uh the information that they need to really be successful. So we are going to step in and serve as a coordinator and a service
provider and an assistant so that all everybody can work together to support local entrepreneurs. and we're very proud of that and very excited about the work that we're doing there. Um, this photo, by the way, uh, these are our welding students. Talk about
partnering with local entrepreneurs. We have a very successful uh, couple who has, uh, started with a a women's apparel shop downtown. Then they added a men's clothing store, and now they have, uh, turned one of the beautiful
buildings downtown into a bridal center. and they came in and fitted our high school welders with business attire in order to um so that they could do interviews and got them head shot. And these guys came in and did that on their
own time because they love IvyTech and they love supporting the local community. So that's James Dell and Betty Jeff and they're owners. So if you're downtown, stop in. They have they are marketing. Uh and then early childhood education,
we are partnering with local schools to improve and increase uh the number of um early childhood education certificates. I'll move quickly. And then Family Scholar House. Family Scholar House is a national organization
that provides housing. They come in, they build an apartment building, and any student who is attending higher ed in the region can live there. And so we are working with family scholar house to bring a facility to this campus. So and
that is coming up in the very near future. Thank you. We've seen several programs of student success. We are launching a an AI chat uh for our students to stay connected to
our student voice here in the fall. A program called Ed Sites will um allow us to conversationally AI with our students to ask how they're doing. How are you feeling about class next week? What are you most concerned about? Your finances, your books, your academic rigor, your housing. Then we get to take that
information and use it. So we look forward to launching that to all of our students and we think we look forward to reporting on the student success of that program in the near future. I hope that you've seen the student success and our guiding principles. We like to stay student focused.
We meet every student where they are, whether they are at an employer, in high school, in a prison, or at our front door. And I like to bring the right people to them to make sure that they succeed. I hope you'll remember our team as you think of the next big solutions
that we need to find for our state. Consider us and what we need to learn and people and places that we can share our knowledge with. A very big thank you to the commission for all that you do and thank you for making everything we do possible
to all of you. What a wonderful presentation uh both in content, spirit and and results. So really really appreciate that. Um trying to move along here and keep us on target. I see Michelle moving to the podium. And as I've referenced before earlier, we're
going to talk about the bylaws. So Michelle's uh that's uh over to you. Thank you so much. Um you should have a copy of the updated bylaws in your packet. I'm not sure where it is since we shuffled around, but if you dig through there, you should be able to see
that. And then a copy of this presentation as well. Uh we last updated the bylaw on May 9th, 2024. um at the top of that document um you can see um and also up here on the screen sort of the history of the updates that we've had. Most of what you'll see today is
just like grammar and formatting things, but there are a few changes that I want to make sure that we go over. So, we're just going to go article uh by article to be able to do that. So, the most significant update is an article one which is about uh offices and organization. You can see that it
formally alters the terms for chair, vice chair, and secretary to align with what has been our practice in recent years. So, it formalizes that those are two-year terms. Um, which is again what we have been doing for quite some time and just wasn't formalized in the bylaws. So, we have done that. It also
alters the timing of presenting the slate of the officers as uh chairman Peterson did this morning. Um, many of you recall when we used to have a commission meeting every month. We don't do that anymore. uh and the bylaws were not up to date with the new cadence of those commission meetings. So, we have
um aligned that with what will now be um our practice moving forward. For article two, which is about meetings, um we just uh put in there that specifies that our meetings will be held at public institutions in Indiana. Um that was not specified previously. So, um we wanted to make sure that was
in there. Um there's also some significant updates because there's new legislation that requires us to have live transmission of meetings um and to provide recordings of those meetings. So we've made sure to add some details about our responsibilities um in meeting that and then corrected some grammar and
formatting issues as I previously mentioned for article three on committees. Um it removes the prohibition that the chair and vice chair um can participate in committees. We've obviously had them
participating in committees for quite some time. The bylaw originally said that they were exofficio members of committees. Um, and that has at least for the whole time I've been at the commission not been our practice. As you heard Chairman Peterson share earlier, all of you are assigned to either the A&Q or BPC committees and then all serve
on student success and completion. So, we updated that to reflect current practice. Um, and again corrected some grammar and formatting issues. Um for minutes um it has been the expectation that we keep
a documented signed log of the minutes. Um we have been voting on minutes but we have not previously been actually having those uh minutes signed and documenting those at the commission or filing them at the commission and so we have started doing that and we put in here the date
by which we started formaliz or formally doing that and we'll make sure that we do that moving forward. um also uh corrected some grammar and formatting issues in that section as well. Same for article five on order of business. Just some grammar and formatting related things there. Same thing for the section
that is Oh, I'm clicking too fast. The same thing on reports. Um and then the last section on commission and staff compensation. Um it adds that committee meetings for both BPC and A&Q are eligible for PDM and mileage um to be consistent with what is in code. Um and
then uh you all have previously um officially approved anything that was at the associate commissioner um role and level um and higher. Um when we did a reorganization a few years ago, we brought in the senior associate
commissioner role. Um and so we just clarified that you will approve both senior associate commissioners and associate commissioners again consistent with what has been current practice. So with that, I'm happy to take any questions before your vote. Mark, you said specifies that meetings
will be held at public institutions in Indiana. Sent says locations. I just wanted that just open it up a little bit more. Sorry. You the sentence says spec specifies that meetings will be held at public
locations in Indiana. Yeah. You said specifies the meetings will be held at public institutions in Indiana. Oh, yeah. The language previously included locations. It did not include the in Indiana part. And so the change that we
actually made was to add the in Indiana specificity. Locations just mean we could do it outside of it. So, right. Correct. Yes. So uh point nine in article two members shall be given advanced notice of the
agenda. It seems a little vague uh like is that 30 seconds? Good question. Yes, we have typically um so meetings happen historically Wednesday evening and Thursday. Moving forward they'll happen on Thursday now.
We um in recent time have uh sent materials on Monday before the meeting. Um so the agenda uh sort of booklet um and the overview of what the day will look like though sometimes there's times like this where we have to make last minute sort of order changes. Um and
then uh we do uh publish the materials on the website the powerpoints and things like that as close to the start of the meeting as possible. Most of those materials we usually have ready to send on that Monday as well. But particularly in legislative session when things are happening like right down to the last minute especially with
committees meeting on Wednesday. Some of the powerpoints are changing up until the time of the meeting. So we provide as many materials on Monday as possible. Um and then we we give the rest out at the meeting. So the reason I bring this up is that I get I get a sense uh the
tone there's a there's a turn toward openness public and uh there there isn't any ability for the public to see any of these documents or for us to gather any kind of information public about
you uh so you know these things there's a lot of words here so we the commission doesn't see things until Monday and is expected to vote on Thursday. It just seems like that's a it's kind of a tight limit, especially if I want to, you
know, find out what other people on my campus, let's say, think about it. So, I I don't know if that's the standard practice or not, but it just seems like it's a Yeah, I can't say in recent years that we did not provide the materials until the day of and then we have shifted to
providing those materials the Monday before. um we can certainly commit to trying to provide them sooner if possible. The challenge is that a lot of times the presentations that we are putting together information is changing up until the time of the meeting. And so
um we've tried to balance early and transparent communication as much as possible with having the most accurate and timely information possible as well. And we do post the um agenda as required by um open door a lot and all of the materials on um the commission meeting
portion of our website. Would it make sense if there's an important issue uh that we only hear about as a commission on Monday perhaps? There's no timeline on what the commission does. It's not like it has to be done in the Thursday meeting. to
potentially not be in the situation where you're hearing about things and only have 72 hours defer it to the next meeting. The other thing that I will share is as a new member, you would haven't experienced this prior to this meeting, but the majority of the topics that are
discussed at the commission meeting are also discussed at the BPC and AQ committees prior. Um and so commission members who are on those meetings um as well as you can attend either of them whether you're assigned to that committee or not would see a preview of
the information have an opportunity to weigh in and ask questions and then we make adjustments both based on that feedback that we receive um as well as new information that may be coming either during the legislative session or other things like that. So, um it's challenging as a new member. Um I know
several of you as new members last year felt like you were like getting hit with a fire hose your first meeting. Um but as time goes on, you would have um more engagement with the leaders who are leading those meetings and preparing for those presentations through BPC and AQ. But just to verify, there's no
opportunity for public comments. Yeah. I I think one of the the key things really a couple issues. First is on your bylaws. You want to maintain as much flexibility as you possibly can can in your bylaws. So that's kind of the the defining document that you make sure you
don't want to violate. Second thing is in in terms of the concern you have. I think you know it's a valid concern. I think you know we've made progress in terms of getting the information out sooner and again I think the point about uh deliberating on many of these issues at at one of the respective subcommittees ahead of times kind of
surfaces it. Uh and then a third point, we we've had cases in the past where we've had topics that we didn't feel like we were ready to vote on and we have deferred those. So I think if if there was a consensus among a group or even, you know, a concern within the
within the commission members that were not prepared, you know, if if it if it is something that is not timesensitive, we have had cases where we've deferred those votes. So that's yeah, I was concerned that there was some urgency and I couldn't where is the urgency. So there isn't necessarily
things could be sometimes emergencies sometimes there are and you know when you're dealing with budget issues and some of the tuition issue I mean we have had cases where time sensitivity really does come into play and we've had that happen in the last year um that we've
got to respond to but in many cases you're right Ted many of our issues are not time sensitive and I think we have that flexibility to defer if indeed we need to but yeah way into Dr. Thank you. This this is a great comment. I appreciate
your initial uh reference to to this uh push toward transparency. That is something we have really tried to do in the past couple of years. I think you said it, Michelle. Essentially, commission members receive things like everything the night before that I honestly couldn't quite believe that.
So, we said, "Hey, let's let's shoot for something like 72 hours Monday." Well, I think we need to do then as as a staff, as a senior staff, come back, especially Mr. turn it to you commission and say what else might we do to do that can we can we push that back to sometime the
previous week and then with the big topics you know you know I think it's fair to say there are big topics that come out of the academic affairs committee and out of convention productivity committee uh which all of you said on one or the other and and get those out to you you know as soon as we
have something even if it's not in it finally based version to say met all of including you who were not on the committee and here's where they are on this even though there might be some differences to come. So I I appreciate that because it has been a push of what
we've been trying to do and the more we can do that the better right. Yeah. I think the two other things I'll share on that topic for those who engage in the the BPC and A&Q committees there are certain topics that must be voted on at very specific times of the year. Um and
so usually in those committees we sort of let folks know what the cadence is of like at this meeting this must happen so that this next thing can happen. So voting on things like the budget on certain financial aid schedules, things like that. So we try to be transparent of what the schedule looks like of these
are must vote at these time topics and then we round out the agenda with other topics that are not as urgent. The other thing that I'll share about um sharing information um especially if it's not complete is most of what we share is subject to appro requests. And so we've
also been very careful especially with information that is um could change like data and things like that to share the most final version possible. Um so um it's part of uh the ability to like request access to information that we've
shared via email and those sorts of things. Yeah. Yeah. So, we we have tried to be sensitive of making sure that we are transparent when we share information that's not fully um complete um that it is still deliberative and still being
worked on but to also for for certain things that we know um may get attention especially certain data points to make sure we we have the full and complete information before we share it. So, this is yeah all really helpful discussion. I'm glad you brought it up and I think as a takeaway the team as
you mentioned in Michelle maybe come back with some deeper thinking around how to best the transparency both to us and overall. What I was thinking as well was um you know perhaps an earlier heads up versus the Monday but a heads up to
commission members of what are the main topics that are going to have require a vote. Sure. uh if you will that way you can uh understand at least the topic that's coming even though you don't have all the supporting information uh it'll draw your attention and say okay I really got to focus on this when
I get the information or and maybe you know some of the elements of what is going to you know part of that discussion and deliberation again like you said most of these are discussed in committee one of the two but for those that aren't on the right committee they
may not know that it's coming So, you'll get there, I think. But I think it's great. I think it's great. Yeah. Dr. um this references Hey, Dan. Oh, this reference. Hold on one minute, Nancy. The updated by packet. I don't seem to
see that. Were those shared as well? The actual bylaws in the packet. They're in the paper clips packet. Uh they should be about halfway through. They're a statement document
or static but they already got Thank you. Just want to cross reference the changes that yeah that packet includes all the like supplementary handouts I believe u mostly for Dr. Butler's presentation but some additional materials as well.
Nancy I think I heard your voice. I don't know I don't know who's controlling the this is not Robert's rules of orders at all but I do have to drop right now. I will rejoin as soon as I can but just wanted to go on the record that I vote to approve these bylaws. Um so you've
got that. Okay. Thank you all. I'll thanks Nancy. We'll talk to you soon. Yeah. Byebye. Okay. Uh we do need to vote on this. Um any other comments or questions uh on this topic? I'd move approval. Thank you. Second. Thank you. I think maybe you had got
that one. Um if no, no other comments or questions, all in favor of approval of the bylaws changes as described by uh Michelle and in your packet, please say I. I same. Okay. Wonderful. Thank you.
Thank you. Very good. Um let's see. I think if I see the reorg, we're going to go to academic affairs items. Um we're going to start out by uh some quick comments from our academic affairs and quality chairman um Dennis Bland.
How's everybody doing? Good. Well, I'd just like to say how much I really appreciate Dr. popular and in these matters especially with it
in custom enrollment act 1248. Thank you very much. Particularly with the with the advent of House Movement Act 448 and the rapid changes, the rapid requirement of turning and pivoting,
the vast learning that has to take place and everything that has happened with respect to it. So, I just want to really appreciate Matt, Chris, you and the entire staff as we've tried to navigate this. I know it's been a mouthful for us
to to learn and to digest. And then I would also just want to appreciate the members of the academic affairs and quality committee as you look at the materials that we have gone through the discussions that we had the adjustments
to our own committee bylaws that we want to present to you all today. I think our last update was from 2014 and so now we have some some additions. So with that, that's all I'll share at this time. Great. Thank you, Dennis. I think we'll
move that uh straight away into presentation from both uh Commissioner Lowry and Dr. Butler uh around program review and Dennis thank you for your as always on so many things but also on public
thank you pleasure to serve like you clicker. Okay. Very good. Um, m members, this is we're we're really excited to talk with you about this and I would be remiss if I didn't thank you, Mr. Chairman, chairman
bland for your leadership on the academic affairs quality committee. um specifically with regard to Senate role act 44 number eight um and certainly language that came in House Bill 101 or House Act 101. But the purpose for me
sharing a little bit before Matt gets into the details of the uh degree program review process is to remind all of us background and including when this started the you know the evolution of
this began about a year ago. It wasn't the legislative session. It wasn't, you know, weeks or days before the legislative session or even during that certainly uh changes were made and so forth. But the background of this uh started a year or so ago. Matt, if you
click to the first slide that says college going. Um, you know, this and some other slides I'm going to share with you as a reminder was the catalyst for Senator Ro at 448. Uh, as you all
know, the commission strategic plan, the hope agenda is centered on improving outcomes for students, employers, and the state. I'd remind you because I think the timing is really important about that, especially as we talk about something later today that our strategy
went into place. It was kicked off, if you will, in April of 2023. So during the first year, you had asked me and our team to do a deep dive situation analysis. I'd love to hear Dustin mentioned gap analysis. We did gap analyses, you know, where the challenges
were in Indiana. So the new strategic plan went into place or actually was announced in April of 2023. That's really important as we think about some of the other metrics that we we'll talk about today. Um and have those focuses outcomes on students, employers, our
state. At the heart develst institutions have taken to thoroughly review their catalog of degree programs aligns with these priorities. And I'll share a little bit more about that. Three years ago, as you know, in 2022, June of 2022, at one of your then
commission meetings, we started sounding the alarm that our college going rate had dropped in 10 years from 68 to 53%. By the way, you'll see the latest numbers, which are 2023. You know how lagging data makes me absolutely crazy. Um, the lagging data will show that the
college going rate of 2023 was 52%. Frankly, not surprising because our strategic plan literally was announced in April. Students graduating in May, essentially that strategic plan had no impact on them. It's those things going
forward. Leading indicators though, as you've heard us talk about from Kyle and others from our business intelligence team, are really what we look out for. uh like the increases in enrollment we've seen the last two years at our public and our private institutions indicate that we're starting to bend the
curve but a lot of work remains. Importantly, and I think this is really critical to keep in mind as we think about the degree program review process, we find in various studies a a interesting dynamic. I'll illustrate
this for you. The Indiana Department of Education's most recent survey showed that when asked in May, high school seniors, about 3/4 of them, roughly six or 76% say that they intend to go to college
and by August it's ended up somewhere 52 53% last few years. Similarly, as you'll recall, our own research with Heart and Mind Strategies last year indicated that roughly 80% of those students and their parents and guardians see value in the
investment. So, we have this delta of roughly 20%. Between those students who say they're going to go, they have interest, they see the value, and then those who end up taking action and actually enrolling. Next slide, please.
So again, I referenced the research that we did last year with hard mind strategy. You know, that that research indicated three key things and I'm going to touch on one of them right now. And that has been for years a lack of career coaching and navigation.
I I hope you're heartened like I was to see the career link office here at the IT campus because they have made that ubiquitous to what they do for students. So our own research said that students often do not go because they lack that career coaching and navigation
experience. They're not sure what to do. So in addition to that, many students lacking career coaching also face a plethora of choices. They choose to not go andor or or they'll often times make an illuminant
decision. Next slide, please, Matt. Now closely related to this and the reality of this lack of career coaching and so forth uh is the degree prolifer proliferation. I would really I'd be remiss if I didn't
note this too. In the last couple of years Indiana general assembly governor have stepped up career coaching. You know about the career coaching grants you know about the career scholarship accounts and so forth. The state is placing emphasis on that.
What's particularly interesting if you think about the challenges a student faces in making these kind of decisions. Challenges of not having good or adequate career coaching has been a proliferation of degrees and we started that discussion last summer because we
started seeing the numbers. We started looking retrospectively and saying what has been going on? Well, here's what's been going on since the early 2000s. U the fact of the matter is what has been going on with the proliferation that has left students
overwhelmed nationally and in our own state just since the early 2000s. There has been a roughly 40% increase in bachelor degree programs and higher. You heard that right, 40%.
That was approximately 1,00 1,000 at just our state institutions alone during that period and breathtakingly about 23,000 nationally. So we wonder why students are challenged in making these choices. So with these
things in mind, including the decline in college going rate, we see clearly the need for more career coaching, better career coaching, and the state is taking action on that. those those programs are in the ramp phases, early phases, but
we're we're seeing those take place. This degree program review process is an excellent complement to that to helping students have clear choices and understanding what those are so that we can continue to drive better outcomes
for students, employers in Indiana. Um, I'm not going to get into further process portions right now because Dr. Butler, Matt, is the absolute expert on this as, uh, Chairman Bland was saying, and I'm going to turn it over to him because he's got several slides he wants
to review with you uh, to that end. Thank you, Commissioner Lowry. Uh yes, I think it'd be important to revisit u the uh statute that is yes Mr. Tony, what's FBI?
A state educational institution. Uh is revisit the statute regarding uh the more annual program review of our state institutions degree programs in house enrolled act 101 and that's the uh graduate thresholds and I think um worth
revisiting that because there are specific numbers there. 101 which was at the back of the budget. It was added during conference committee as a complement to uh the degree program approval and review statute that was enacted from uh Senate enroll 448 which
was our agency bill. Um within uh 1001 is a relatively basic statute and it requires uh state educational institutions to request approval to continue a degree program if the immediately preceding three-year average
of graduates falls below a specified threshold by degree type. Uh those being 10 for an associate degree, 15 for a bachelor's, seven for a masters, and then three for education specialist programs and doctorates.
U if approval is not granted or disapproved uh the educational institution has to eliminate the program and reallocate the resources. Uh you'll notice from this statute and this is paraphrasing but it's pretty much nearly verbatim of it. It's very close summary
thanks to Mr. Herald. Um there's no consideration for new programs. How can a new program uh build a three-year average, especially if it's a relatively long gestation program like a a master's or well a bachelor's or a doctorate? And
so in preparing to implement the statute, commission staff uh conceived and developed what we call a ramp up period for newer degree programs. And so in early May, um, CHC staff developed this framework and then we
shared it with all of our state institutions to help inform their deliberations as we approach July 1st. Uh, newer degree programs need multiple years to enroll and then produce graduates. Again, that's heavily dependent upon the type of uh degree
type. Um so in this way uh in in developing a ramp up period no newly approved programs will immediately be at risk and as we go through them by degree type the minimum a number of years
seven. Um and we devised this by likes to click forward really fast. um every degree program we added one year just to start because degree programs are approved throughout state the state fiscal year. So uh it was my argument that should be a wash and then the uh
the typical exhibit time to completion and then another three years to help build an average. And so uh for associate degrees that's seven for bachelors it's 10 for masters it's seven for education specialist programs
it's seven and for doctoral programs it's 12 um and there's about 400 programs who are in ramp up period right now um when we look at uh the most recent year under analysis which I'll get to and that is a
fiscal year 2024 for and so this framework is crucial I believe for both the commission and the institutions to engage in medium-term planning through this program review process based on thresholds and so with that we shared the ramp up period when we
also approached uh the state institutions on what we called an opportunity for voluntary early action to be proactive and get in front of the statute before its effective date of July 1st. What we did first is we provided degree
conferral data for 21 22 23 acknowledging that it did not have 24 data. It wasn't ready yet. It wasn't validated but this exercise would be useful to inform uh their deliberations uh and they also our state institutions
have their own internal records which are quite close and will help inform their decisions as well. We asked the institutions to review their academic program inventories with the conferral data we shared with the ramp up period and start to assess um
how can they get in front of the July 1st uh work. And so uh we provide provided preliminary guidance um beforehand uh at the May AA and Q meeting and then at the June on June 13th we posted guidance as well asking
for voluntary submissions uh by June 23rd which would then be uh addressed at the June 30th A and Q meeting. So, I'd like to get into the details though of what those sort of voluntary actions could be.
And so, that probably requires a little bit of a background. Um, the AAQ committee processes processes asformational items, what are called routine staff actions or academic program inventory requests. We do these
every month. They're processed by staff and they're reported to the committee as anformational item. they're not an action item. Um, they can include basic things like changing the credit hours, changing the SIP code uh for a degree to
eliminations, suspensions, mergers, and consolidations. Those latter three are the key ones say for this opportunity for voluntary early action. Eliminate, suspend, or emerge and consolidate. And it's worth noting
that institutions have used this prerogative and this uh this option to um eliminate 162 degree programs on their own initiative since uh 2020. This is can be quite common at times. Also we
invited early commitments to routine staff actions so that they could de decide on uh delaying. They know they want to say merge or consolidate a program but they want their faculty to work on it for a few more months and therefore in this opportunity they are
committing we will merge and consolidate you know x y and z degrees down the line but we aren't ready to do a routine s action. So some some high level overview of what we received from the institutions.
Uh six uh chose to participate and in terms of what was reported from institutions to us uh 404 programs were affected. On the elimination side there were 74. 67 of
the 74 had zero. Let me say that again. zero. One institute, one institution that reported the most eliminations, they were all zero. I'm saying about 67. The other seven were concluding their teachouts. They
were either already suspended or their students were going to be taught out this summer, this fall. So, in effect, of those 74 eliminations, there was no impact on students. Excuse me. Uh there were also
suspensions. Um there were 101 and then the overwhelming bulk uh 229 were merge and consolidate actions or commitments to future merge mergers and consolidations. And a little bit more detail on the
overall impact. Uh we have roughly 2200 degree programs. Uh this this brings it down in some ways down to 1,800. Since some of the merger consolidations aren't done yet, it's really hard to give uh exact figures. But from all of these
actions, 33 graduates per year uh would be impacted or this is 33 graduates per year flow through these programs impacted which represents about 4% of all state educational institutions graduates per year.
um of the programs impacted by eliminate or suspend uh 2400 graduates and that 2400 uh includes actually um the IU systems because they are using a two-step process of suspend then merge
and consolidate. So, uh, we'll revisit that 2400 number, but it's it's in some ways inflated, um, in terms of, uh, programming that will continue in another way, shape, or form. Uh, again, all the eliminated programs were, uh,
zero enrollment or concluding their teachouts. All suspended and merge consolidated programs will require an orderly teach out enabling the currently enrolled students to complete their original program of study or they can transfer to uh the newly consolidated
one or they can change their majors entirely if they so choose. And I don't want to belver this two point but uh it might be worth revisiting what a suspension is. Um it's either this routine staff action I just talked about
or it's a future commitment to suspend and uh typically the first step of a suspension is the program stops admitting these students and it's starting a glide path down that serves the currently enrolled students and that's called a teachout. It's an orderly teachout usually follows a
teachout plan. It's required by federal financial aid law regulations. It's also required by regional accredititors in our case uh HLC and once all uh students are taught out or exited the program is then empty or
zero enrollment and then a subsequent routine staff action can eliminate that program and take it off the uh API list. There's uh there are distinctions and I pointed to one institution. Some may decide to suspend first then merge and
consolidate. And then also it's important to note that a suspens a suspension with teachout doesn't necessarily mean that um instructional opportunity is completely gone. Many programs currently have minors associated with them. Those minors will
almost certainly stay. Uh also there are times where uh a suspended program will be accommodated by a concentration or track in an adjacent degree program. And I think this is the one to focus on the most and you see it simply by the
numbers. Um 57% of the voluntary actions are mergers and consolidations. Um in total these programs um these would be all the uh the nonIU virtations
900 graduates. Um I'm sorry we don't have the IU disagregated. That's something we can get and we'll we'll disagregate that. Um but you hear the term merger and consolidation. Is there a difference? And there is. Uh a merger is when one or more programs merge into another
pre-existing one and that pre-existing program will continue on and it will accommodate the absorbed or merged in programs through a concentration track or major. A consolidation is where you take at least
programs and they and they're they're adjacent programs, they're related programs and they consolidate uh into a new program. So, and then these are just some rehash report notes. I'll I'll I'll go through them pretty fast, but institutions have
always have the ability to do API academic program inventory request changes. That's their prerogative. They areformational items processed through the committee reported to the commission. There's no there's no action
to them. uh any of these programs, they do not or sorry, any of these actions do not really take full effect until if if there are students involved do not take full effect until fall of 2026. Um some of the routine staff actions or programs like the
eliminations that could happen quickly or suspensions that could happen quickly. Yes, the institution uh will take it off their application process for next year. I also want to uh out of transparency say when we announced this at the June
30th committee meeting and there was the press release there were 408 programs impacted. We received subsequent updates from the institutions which there was a request to remove four because this was entirely voluntary. Of
course we obliged that request. We updated the the the list. It's been date stamped. It's on the AA andQ website that brought 408 down to 404. There are also a couple of institutions that asked not to remove a program from the list
that revise its action. And in uh those cases, it involved uh not wanting to do a routine staff action, merge or consolidation. Now they wanted a bit more time to think it through with their faculty. So that was revised to a commitment to merge and consolidate.
I think I think it'd be important to look at maybe two major areas uh of importance and as illustrative examples. Um one being education. There were 69 programs impacted in the 13 zip code. SIP stands for
classification structural program. 13 zip code. There are other education degrees outside of that when they're like an MAT, masters of arts and teaching. But this is where the true bulk of education programs are situated. Of the 15, sorry, of the 69, 15 were
eliminations. All but three had zero. The remainder were completing teachouts. There are seven suspensions towards teachouts and then 47 roughly 70% of them were mergers and consolidations. And I think a few examples here would be
Ball State committed to consolidate four STEM education degrees that were spread across four different departments into a new BA BA bachelor of arts, bachelor of science and science education. The students taking that in the future as I understand will concentrate in
chemistry, earth space, life science or physics. Um there were several others. For example, Purdue Fort Wayne committed to consolidate their early childhood, elementary and secondary education into one education degree. And then um the
Indiana University system just in in total had 27 education degrees. They are uh committing to merge and consolidate. On the world languages front in the 16 zip code, uh 31 world languages were
there, one elimination, zero enrollments, 11 suspensions, and then 19 for mergers and consolidations or commitments to mergers and consolidations. And then you see some of them there are also teaching degrees because sometimes they're placed in uh
non-13 civic codes. I guess before I move on uh to post July 1st implementation, maybe uh anyone might have questions on uh the voluntary early action uh process we went through
uh and uh any of the figures or or conclusions I provided. Yes. So um discussed how this was voluntary. I'm noticing one of the programs here is actually a new program that is already
being suspended. It's a program that was discussed um back in the spring. The Bachelor of Science and Public Health for Sexual Reproductive Health University of Bloomington. I believe that new cohort was coming out this fall and it says also this is suspended
towards elimination. So is that coming from the university specifically? Can you provide the It is 107 107 because I believe that the new cohort is coming out this fall. Does that mean that we're not looking? No.
Right. This is one of those instances in which uh because it's part of the Indiana University system they reported their merger and consolidations of two steps and in the under the voluntary routine staff action or future commitment they are f they filed a suspension first and then they have a
commitment to merge and consolidate. I don't want to speak for them but I would assume uh you'll look elsewhere there are other uh public health bachelors like fitness and wellness. I would assume their plan is to consolidate those back into its sort of mother
public health degree, but I don't know and I don't want to speak for them. But you're right, that is from I believe November. That's a newer program and it absolutely would be a random period. Uh but this is a voluntary reorganization of their portfolio of degrees and I would assume that's what they're doing
given the other ones listed here right next to it. And really quickly, Matt, sorry. The ramp up period doesn't prevent the institution from doing something sooner than that. That the ramp up period is in
essence giving them, you know, time to do so before they would have to come to the commission to be authorized to continue something. So the, you know, any institution still has that ability to make those kinds of shifts. the ramp up period that Matt and others helped to
build just help to allow for that for that requirement after July one that they come before if they're below those thresholds. Great question, Samantha. You you had stated uh that six institutions uh were involved in the volunteer
aspect. Was IU one of those? Six. So is is it public knowledge as far as who did not participate and and what does that look like for that institution? I guess uh six of the institutions and I'm bundling say the IU system or the
Purdue system then university did not participate. We did speak with them on a number of occasions. They've been going through uh quite a bit of leadership flux with their provos uh moving over but I don't want to speak. I think maybe Tony Han is
here, but we spoke with them and I think it also it shows that this was sort of a voluntary opportunity to exercise this to be out in front of implementation facilitate statutory implementation after July 1st
with no no uh strong expectation if a system didn't want to uh or wasn't in the position to do this thoughtfully and carefully on their own. Thank you. Yeah. Yes. Um, Dr. Ber, I'm not really
sure. I know this is a voluntary time and so I think what I want to speak with to is that I've spoken with several students who are currently in universities and the communication for some of the universities has been very good. to the
universities. I commend to the universities that they've been proactive and some of the students have, you know, I've spoke with have said my program was going to get eliminated, but it's been consolidated. So, everything's good. So, they're the students are already aware and they've been uh the communication
has been pro proactive. So, well done. Whatever communication is going on um and I've spoke with several university students and so I think that's been a positive that the students are well aware this is happening. I mean, and this is early on. So, I think that's really good. They already know my degree
is safe. It's been moved here or etc. And so, I just want to make sure that the commissioner was aware that that's been going on already. So, good job. phones. Um, I guess my question is, did the commission have the power to do something like this?
But why why is the legislature passing law? It seems like that's a rather blunt instrument. Do we have any information on why this had to go to the legislature as opposed to just handling it
institutions and the commission? Yeah, I I think that's a great question to ask Dr. pastor Nova and in our own state and frankly I think across the country what we've seen is this proliferation and um not always expressed authority whether it's in our
statutes or whether it's in another state and you know depending upon interpretation could the uh commission work coordinating bodies everybody knows and it ranges from coordinating bodies to boards of reard boards of regents and so forth um I think there was just the
thought that gee for decades. Um this has just continued and whether that expressed authority was there or not um you know framing something up for current commission members, future commission members, future commissioners
to really understand that we need to thoughtfully not only just approve degrees frankly but to have some cycle of revisitation to those and some parameters to consider. I think it's a great question and you know frankly I think it's just been it's not been a
priority for most state I I would say practically any state but that might be that may be too broad. We're starting to see that that understanding. It's a great question that um yeah I have a followup belief if we could look at the uh what was it the the Ball
State what was it education we grease um there are this is a case of mergers and consolidations right so we had four majors chemistry earth space life and physics
and so if I understand it students studying in all those things aren't going to study in a new a new degree named something. They're going to concentrate in those four things. It seems to me like nothing has changed.
Yeah, I turned it on. Yeah, I think it's going to depend on the different degrees whether they're eliminated, suspended, merged, consolidated in that um one student uh
might have been taking that specific STEM degree, the cabin named down here, Matt. Um and now so four students over there are taking four separate things. Now they're all taking under this one umbrella. Um I
think it's a lot of the ancillary things that might come with it as an institution that are actually going to affect the institution more. So if I'm advising someone what's the you know what is the level to which I have to know
uh 1,800 or 2200 and I'm only using the aggregated numbers versus being able to say uh you can do it in this education degree. Now certainly you can concentrate in these but but the I think it's it comes down to the degree to
which we have to have specialized information across the system you know whether that's in cataloges whether that's an advisor's office whether that is in you know other systems that exist on a campus you know are there ways that you pardon me as you consolidate things
can actually concentrate right we we see this in u other portfolio management to a great degree this is portfolio management on the part of an institution and in other sectors uh you know do this all the time whether it's in industry or
retail and so forth but there there are extra things to come from having each one of those separate uh offerings whether it's in a service industry or product industry and so forth so I think I think those are some of the kinds of things that will begin to subtly change but but hopefully for the student she or
he is still going to be able to get a degree that then allows them to have expertise piece or some level of expertise in that specific area. So, so you're saying that does address the career coaching issue. I I think it really does I think it addresses that and then just the larger
um systems issues that occur across the broad organization. Just to explain why I appreciate that the the dean of the college where I work uh had a town hall and I was struck by his attitude which seemed to be oh don't worry about this faculty we're just going to move some things around. we're
not going to really do anything. That's why I brought it up. I'm I'm quite encouraged by the kind of impact that I was trying to describe there will actually have including career coaching and such. I apologize for my ridiculously blunt
and likely simplistic approach to this, but I was of the impression in looking at all of this that it was just a matter of moving from looking at the trees to the forest that it used to be um in days of old that if you were pursuing a
business degree, it would be marketing or management or accounting. Maybe there might be three. And then moving into this generation's necessity to select a major, it was one flavor of Baskin Robbins, 3,000 possible business
degrees. And my hope in looking at this project was that we were going back to maybe three. And I I think that we're going back to the forest and stopping our analysis of the trees to pigeon hole
the students. Is isn't that our Isn't that our goal? I think if I follow you the, you know, the bottom line of this as an example and again remind everyone voluntary action you know before the statute actually is in place.
the yeah if we start even just with the voluntary action before this all goes into place and matt if I've got these if I've got these numbers right so degrees simple numbers that I keep in mind are very
simple they've proliferated by 40% in the last 15 to 20 years this constitutes a roughly 18 to 19% going from what roughly 2200 to 1,800 I can't remember the numbers
And at the end of the day, a couple of percentage of students are actually affected. And I think to your pepper, to your point, Pepper, this is this is the first step to helping make that easier. You know, to what degree is
1,800 easier than 2200? Well, you know, that's relative, but again, for all those other reasons we've talked about, just buy an individual school, the the choice should become easier. and get a knowing where those are headed. So this is this is the first step. Um and again
Matt has said it multiple times. These are you know folks these are zero pause zero to low very low enrollment completion programs. U but they're out there as choices today.
I'd just add to the point that and I think this is accurate, Matt, but um I think it's not as simple as a black or white one way of doing things versus another over the years. I do think that
what all this will require is a balance of working with the institutions around the degrees and also helping students and helping the institution navigate to make sure that the degrees that are out
there either be now or in the future are tied to the market opportunity for those students as well. From a graduation standpoint, there are degrees that have very low volumes, but that are critical um in certain industry fields and
certain applications. And so that's where the nuance comes in making sure that it's not just a a blunt look at the number, but that it's it's uh contingent upon the the degree itself and and what the opportunities are for students,
etc., etc. don't agree with that. Okay. Any other comments right now before we move? If not, I would just call I moved back to the slide because Commissioner and I was sort of touching upon it. I would just stress that this appears that a
fifth of the academic program portfolio was only accommodating roughly 4% of total graduate output. And it perhaps begs the question of some streamlining and perhaps uh reorganizing um scarce
resources so that things can be in more viable vehicles going forward. But again, that can be done. That shouldn't be done in a a black and white or binary uh way. And going forward, this will be certainly more nuanced
if that if that's helpful. I'm also told that we're running behind. So, hey Matt, sorry to to that or just before you move into the next section. So, um at the beginning, you talked about the the levels based on associates. I think it has to have 10
graduates, etc. Um that's by institution right not by physical site. So it's not that is that accurate or not? Um no. Um well for IvyTech it is by the whole system but say for the Indiana University system it is by the campuses
you generally think of Bloomington East Indianapolis. There are uh programs which we addressed in the uh initial guidance about what are called uh online multiacampus collaboratives and those were those came to the commission in
that uh varied uh structure and were considered and approved in that manner to uh save and pull resources across mult campuses uh to serve more students and also save resources and be you know leverage great professors here and great professors over here so they can teach students across the state. So for those
we are treating them as one program of study across combining also uh if the graduate threshold across the entire uh collaborative is a part of the threshold and say one of the regional campuses is bundled with everybody else. So okay I
think I I think I understood that and then I obviously didn't understand it completely but I'm glad glad glad I asked the question. So yeah, and since we are but yeah because we're behind sorry um do we know
what the staff staffing impact is do we know that on do we know what the staffing impact is to the institutions? They did not report that. So I didn't comment. I really apologize for longing this
conversation, but at some point these schools need to run P&Ls in their program to see where it is. That was cut from the chase and all this. And I know Matt touched on it a little bit and that's part of where the nuance if you will comes in with roll back 448
because we're talking about the supply and the demand and the wage outcomes and all of those things. It's a pretty basic view of what's taking place in the B. So since we're in past the effective date
in in July 1st, we are now in the implementation stages of the actual statute and those thresholds. Um I as I mentioned before, we are using the period of 22 23 and 24. The FY24 data has been validated. It's been packaged
to go to the institutions and it will go to the institutions this week along with a memo and a template in which to uh respond to that list and make annotations uh to and to ensure there are consistencies. We are creating what we call a mutual consensus list and
mutual consensus might be really redundant but I wanted to stress it that uh we both the institution and the commission will agree what are the under threshold degree programs that need approval to continue before we proceed. So this is a step one. Um I anticipate
that we will set a deadline to have that turned around in midepptember um with the start of the school year and also um I don't know if it's called the collection stage or validation stage for other things. Our our institutional research our registars our offices at our institutions are are doing a lot of
things all at once at the beginning of school year and so is our data team. Uh so we want to give a a decent amount of time for them to review that list. There will be updates to that list that they need to incorporate based on the early actions we just took. It will not reflect them, which will require a
little bit of extra work, but many of those actions will make this process much simpler because it's taking a lot of uh items off the table for analysis. Um, and like I said, we'll we'll be sending that this week along with the
memo and template. only degree programs that are on the eventual mutual consensus list um will need uh approval to continue. And then another step will be uh and it'll probably overlap is the submission of what what is program viability data
which was outlined in the guidance. um that includes enrollments, completions, credit hour production versus institutional credit hour production and other measures in which we'll sort and the degree programs to make simultaneous relative comparisons to help add a bit
more nuance to this. Um when it comes time to for an institution to request approval to continue for a degree program, um they have to specify a category sought. Uh there is conditional and there is restricted and I won't get into them too much but under
conditional there's really just two ramp up period programs which we just talked about the newer ones and then programs with what we're calling an improvement plan. These would be ones that uh as chairman Peterson uh referred to serve have good student outcomes or have a
major state societal high need impact uh but they're below the threshold. uh the institution will be able uh to make a a a a case an evidence-based argument to keep that going. Uh they need to say whether it's mission critical, mission aligned, discretionary. We're
intentionally leaving those uh those terms to their own interpretation for this first year to see how that plays out. I think it's important if every degree program is mission critical that says something. Um or well, if it's claimed to be mission critical, that
says something. uh other is a a planned fiscal support for the program. We think that's important because so much of this is also uh the optimal usage of scarce resources. So that that's another element. Um but those would be some of the key right when they got at or the approval to continue process.
So stupid good old Ted, huh? I'm believe it's ask questions on that. I'm going to turn to Commissioner Lowry to Mr. Approval. Who is doing the approval? Is that the AA andQ committee? Is that staff? Who's doing that approval?
Well, like um almost all of our uh program processing uh we foresee it would be a staff recommendation. The A and Q committee would um approve up or down or make a decision. And given the gravity of this, I would think it would
then move as an action item to the full commission. I I would request that the commission, the committee members see the list with advanced notice and time of which ones are going to be on that list just so that we are aware that our constituents of what we're representing,
we are aware of what's going on rather than see it short notice. When we have what what we call the mutual consensus list of the programs that need to apply for approval to continue, we will we will circulate those and I I believe
we'll also make public. Um there some of them will have enrollment if there's a request about the enrollment. Some of them will have enrollment that's below a privacy threshold and will need to be suppressed and that's in that's in keeping with uh our typical data privacy. But yes, that's a very very
valid Thank you for raising it. on on that on that point but I also request to see the numbers that what was it the viability index so when the information comes out there something was multiplying the replication
sorry the just diving into it there's a thing called a replication ratio and then a credit hour production as a percentage of total credit hours at the institution are these standard metrics or you know the multiplication
of them into a viability act. I'm just concerned that we're going to get a ranking that comes to us and we don't know where the number came from. So you you would like to see the underlying numbers for sure. Yeah. I'd also say I don't think is there any cost information like how
much does this program cost you and things like that in in in this first year we um in order to stand things up quickly we felt we could only look at certain things and in the first year especially the emphasis was on enrollment and the
emphasis should also I think be on the usage of that degree program or its home department hence the credit hour I think like a hypothetical example would be say physics department or a mathematics department. It's doing not only its it's uh its own students which might be lower
in number but it's doing heavy weight when it comes to service courses to other STEM uh majors to management majors and then doing a lot of electives. So and to your point I cannot claim those metrics they were in an important
institutional research journal which I can find for you. Okay that's good if you could. Thank you. Yeah. I just wanted to make a a quick comment considering when this became considering when this became state law and as we sit
here today, Dr. Butler, the process that's been developed. Uh you know, I think we're all kind of wondering what does this look like? What does this mean? And today we've got a better understanding of that and and really appreciate the work uh that's gone into this. So the the plane is flying and you
got your paintbrush out and trying to work through this and and we're providing uh additional input. So just really appreciate the work that's being done. I feel like I have a better understanding still more to learn uh but feel better uh as we try is this is
long. So thank you. Right. Thank you, Matt. Uh, and and thank you, uh, Commission Member Kramer for making those comments. Uh, as I close this portion of it, um, it's it sort of bring us full circle back to why
and what's driving all of this. Uh, I would again be remiss if I didn't, uh, thank Dr. Butler for all of his work on this. It has been a really heavy lift. And I would be missing something if I didn't thank the institutions. They have done a lot of work on this. People have
done a lot of work on something that has needed to be done for decades. Now in closing, what I want to bring you back to is the topic where we started and what we've been focusing on diligently the last three years and that
is improving our college going rate, completion rates and graduate retention so that we might improve postsecary tenant in the state. secondary attainment in the state when I was born ranked us 40th in the nation and when I arrived here three years ago
ranked us 40th in the nation we know those numbers probably get tired of hearing this but in doing so what we said was we've got to understand what the challenges are uh we saw some of those from our deep dive we saw some of those again
from the research we did with mind strategies two things come up all the time our affordability or cost and as we started the whole career coaching making a decision dropping from 75% of students interested in saying they're going to go
to low 50%. So what were the keys? Career coaching that ability that plethora of decisions to make. We've talked about that. The other one that I think is very terine because you commission predecessors of those who of us here today have have worked
diligently on this and that's the affordability side of this. I want to show you how this is connected. Um you know Indiana as you can see the numbers were third Midwest ninth in the nation in need-based financial aid. I think once the 21st century scholars of 2027,
remember, we don't have more going to college yet because we're eighth graders start in 2023, but we're going to start seeing that impact toward the end of this decade. I think we're going to go up just because of that. Indiana ranks eighth in the nation and holding tuition down for over
a decade. Um, talked about the 21st century scholar program. Of course, as you know, those numbers will fluctuate each year based upon the size of the eighth grade class and then the number of students who actually qualify for free and reduced monetary income eligible, but it's more
than doubled since the last year, the old way, which was 2022, less than 20,000 kids around 50,000 a year now. Franco grant the actions you took and we took along with governor and
legislature back in late 2022, early 23. um means utilization of more of that at the recreation every year and by the end of this decade it will mean more than an additional quarter billion dollars going
to low income students so that they can go they can complete holding down tuition you took action in May it was historic action uh we don't believe any other states actually done it and that is recommending to our institutions who all
adopted this since then and now hold down tuition fees flat for the next two years and besides that Strat Education whose interns are with us today uh ranks Indiana as a top 10 in the nation in
affordability. So my point is you institutions all our partners policy makers have been focusing diligently on one of the two primary barriers the students and their parents side. Additionally, states began to take action on career coaching.
Last slide that you see that we have things that are going in place there. This rounds it out. This this starts to really bring together the elements that we have seen in our own data and that we see in our the research that's been conducted for us on the outside that
help students be able to access afford and make decisions relative to their education. And I thought it was important to start there to come back here because this this is part of the pie. This is part the critical element
to improve where we want our state to go. Outcomes for students, outcomes for employers, outcomes for our state. So again, I can't thank Dr. Butler enough. I thought your questions were excellent. Commission members, thank you. You know, we redesigned how these commission
meetings take place a couple years ago so that we would have exactly what occurred today, which was a lot of thoughtful question commentary. as way taller than me. Um I just want to help Chairman Peterson uh keep us moving along on the agenda. So I just want to call out we have about a half hour
before lunch. We have two additional um academic affairs voting items and two budget voting items um before we have some folks who have to leave at lunchtime. So we're trying to get all the voting items in before lunch. Um so just want to um let you all kind of know where we stand on the agenda.
Thank you for your assistance. That's super helpful. Um, I think before we get to the to a couple of these voting items, are we still I believe we have on the agenda a need to look at the academic affairs and quality committee mission and responsibilities document.
Are we going to do that? Yes, sir. That does require adoption. Oh, it does. I'm sorry. Okay. And I I can move somewhat quickly through this. This was uh this is the copy uh it should be in your packet uh that was amended and adopted by the academic affairs committee on
June 30th. Um some of the members might remember we circulated copies of this earlier uh I think maybe as early as March uh and started doing track changes looks at and we addressed them in the committee and had opportunities for edits. Um the main purpose I saw behind
this was um uh first was uh coming into the commission uh looking to see what does the committee do uh its duties and workflow are going to become more high profile perhaps more definitely more consequential uh through 448 and
obviously with 101 as well uh that we we needed to revisit it. Uh I looked for what one one might call a charter or document for the committee. uh it was titled mission and responsibilities. I thought we should keep that but it dated back to 2014. It was just a front and
back uh one pager. And so with that in mind, I thought we would update it uh the comm with the committee's input and their approval to reflect our new statutory uh requirements, our new statutory workflow. uh quite a few changes um that we've done in the last
few months I think uh for the betterment of the process particularly for new degree program approvals and then also just some more modernizing language in terms of best practices emerging trends say like in say graduate retention say artificial intelligence embedded
stackable credentials many of these things um weren't as uh to the forefront say uh the higher ed conversation in the early 2010s Um, so I hurry along. I think it's worth
revisiting 448. You've probably seen the slide now four four times maybe. Um, but it it requires us u to look at certain measures and metrics when it comes to both degree program approval and degree program review.
uh obviously with July 1st coming approval was a top priority plus the 101 threshold work those are very timesensitive obviously that is all part of the review process and will be going forward um it also required us uh to look at student outcomes say uh instate
uh retention wages it look it required us to look at programmatic aspects such as workbased learning requirements embedded stackable credentials accelerated delivery options what have you uh and it also required the commission or a committee be established by the commission to turn around a
complete application within 90 days. So at times we have our work cut out for us and so by that uh by extension I'm required in my my opinion and uh uh committee members agreed and and reinforced it chairman Bland chairman Peterson to to revisit this document and
I'll move along. We kept the succinct mission statement from 2014. I don't think it really needed to be changed and uh kudos to what was originally adopted. Um for uh the responsibilities we kept intact what were pre July 1 current law
responsibilities that is approving degree programs uh processing routine staff actions asformational items again those are those academic program inventory change requests um reviewing the guidelines and processes keeping an eye on the strategic plan. 2014 referred
to the reaching higher and achieving more strategic plan. I don't remember that but I do remember reaching higher and stated change. I do remember that one. Um and then also to discuss and invite presentations on trends and promising uh uh promising trends.
So with the responsibilities and so much statutory changes um we updated those to accommodate approval disapproval that's both in was in pre July 1 current law and 448 uh the 10-year review cycle 448 the more annual under threshold review
cycle in 101 and I should also I skipped ahead u because of our bylaw changes we want to decite the committee's creation under bylaw so there's a small section there for that. Um this is where we um did I skip two things?
Yeah, under the responsibilities we modernized and updated and that's where we included uh reviewing uh processes for existing academic programs. Hence program review. We also swapped in the hope agenda and its key goals to be more timely.
Um there were a short list of bullet points in terms of promising practices and what have you. Um we added to that for both uh more modern best practices and programmatic features but also hope agenda areas uh
priority and then also administration priorities especially with the education vertical. Um those were added. Another aspect I thought about this uh document was it could be an importantformational vehicle for new committee members, new staff, perhaps new members of academic affairs offices
at the universities. So, Chairman Bland and I agreed that having sort of a an explanation of the meeting cadence, the meeting structure uh in our business meetings was important. We meet 11 times a year. Uh we we meet on the last Monday of of a month. It's always
at two o'clock, you know, those sorts of things. And this is what we do. uh we specify submission deadlines uh in order to be on the next to be eligible for consideration on the next uh meeting. Obviously with more going into this we need time to give uh these submissions
thoughtful reflection and also back and forth with the the institutions and I'll be quick because these really overlap with uh 448 which you've heard a lot about. Um there were separate documents out there uh in different places uh for practices and procedures
and checklists for what was needed when submitting a new degree program app proposal. Uh there is some overlap there and you'll recognize many things like say labor market demand programmatic features those sorts of things. These updated checklists
were reordered to mimic the new application packet which went on the website June 30th for both new degrees and credit bearing certificates of 13 credits or more. And if you follow along with the um
in I don't have it in the PowerPoint, but if you follow along for the checklist, they correspond in order for all of the sections within the application packet. And then I've also cited the uh code citation. So you know that there are some there that are truly statutoily required.
One thing I will point to is u institutions in our previous packet were always required to provide about five years out projected enrollment. uh instead with 101 uh we move that to be whatever the ramp up period for that
degree type plus one because when one considering adding a degree program I think it's incumbent on the institution to prove that after the ramp up period that program will be viable enrollment wise so that was a feature and you'll see that in the application packet
turn this One other thing I would just say is that the uh the credit bearing uh certificate approval process is brand new for us. We decided that uh 13 credit hours up is is is a good point because below that I don't think it's worth the commission's time perhaps to be spending much time on
same micro credentials. So we picked that point uh and forward and also the credit bearing certificate application is much shorter than the degree program application as one could understand it. So great and Matt thank you. I know how much work this is has gone into this by
you and the staff as well as the A and Q committee because this as you mentioned I think March maybe the first draft of this came out and it went back and forth a number of times with the with the committee. So a lot of consideration and and improvement to that. So hopefully everyone, we do need a vote uh for
approval on this. So hopefully everybody does feel comfortable given the background, given the information that was provided both ahead of time and here. Uh hopefully we have uh comfort with moving forward with this approval. Larry, thank you. Second. Thank you, Ken. Are there any comments
or additional questions for Matt or Chris or anyone else to make a comment? Thank you. Sorry for the delays. We try and pass the mic. But
Chris, my thought still goes to your opening comments and kind of laying this out. At the risk of sounding dramatic, I think the the piece about the guidance and counseling
and how we navigate, I think it's probably one of the most transformative tools that we can use and that young people can use for not only finding the path, but I think it's one of the greatest anti-rime tools that's
available to young people because too, and that's why I really apprei appreciated the comment at the outset from the chancellor or she would and why I asked the question about how are we moving upstream with this information
a lot of young people I don't know how to navigate and yet the breakdown is so many of us don't the challenge is I don't have people in my life who can co-pilot me so they can teach me how to me. That's
typically often times what broken down families are. I don't have people who can teach me how to drive. We don't know how to drive, but you have people with you who know how to drive. And that's how people learn how to drive. And so those tools basically
signal that we're going to have people in your life that teach you not just how to drive a car, but how to navigate my life. That's why a lot of people are crashing. Sometimes you end up in a ditch and then sometimes you end up in an ideo seat.
And so I just think it's more holistic and just has great implications which is why I was asked if they were actually sharing the intel upstream so that many people can prevent some of the ditches. And then again I just close by saying
well we talked about the protocols again matter have been outstanding the master role but the protocols are also in consideration for other commission members who may go to the AQ committee or even staff people who are
transitioning on. And so here's a document that kind of says this is how you do it. This is how you process it but just the thoughtfulness about institutional knowledge. I appreciate it. Then last comment, I think I said at the very end I recit
act great jobs everybody and this committee and would recommend. Thank you Dennis as usual. Really, really well said. So thoughtful and appropriate. So thank you for all your
work and leadership. Um, unless there are other comments and questions, would uh we have a motion to second. So, I think we already have, don't we? Oh, we double it up. Okay. So, uh maybe I'm but uh all in favor of approval um
signify by saying not. I opposed. Same. Okay. Very good. Thank you. Matt, I believe we have some uh academic degree programs for expedited actions. uh they are listed in your book on beginning on page 15. Uh I'll turn it to you for
comments. Uh certainly thank you chairman. I'll be brief. The academic affairs and quality committee uh recommended uh all these three programs uh unanimously for expedited action. The first one the masters of science and organizational leadership and supervision from Purdue West Lafayette
Indianapolis was at the May AQ. The remainder were at the June AQ June 30th. I'd say one thing that's very uh it's a it's it's a thread through all of them is they're harnessing uh pre-existing uh programs or pre-existing resources
especially ones that are very popular. Um the organizational leadership and supervisions uh a consolidation so to speak after the Purdue and Indianapolis merger. They had sort of two different degree programs uh at each campus. Now they're consolidating them after a
redesign and a rebrand. Um the bachelor of arts in sport communication Indiana State University is the creating a degree program out of a very popular minor and then leveraging resources across both their coms department and their sports management department. Um the bachelor of arts and cognitive
science at Purdue West Lafayette is the elaboration further of a pre-existing concentration in their bachelor's philosophy and is also leveraging our newer bachelors of artificial intelligence within that department. the uh two IU Bloomington degrees. The
computer engineering uh bachelors is an outgrowth of what's a current concentration in the intelligent systems engineering major and it's so popular I believe they said I I might misquote me but or I might misquote them. I'm sorry it's about 80% of the students. So it it
it's so popular it deserves a standalone degree so that the other concentrations at the ISC can stand on their own. And then also uh the business intelligence and data science degree is a collaboration between Kelly and the Luddy school. Uh they have many students
who are trying to do sort of both and it's just unworkable as a dual degree. So instead they packaged something together in which a student has a firm foundation of both business principles but also very high level math and data science. So I I think that was a a theme
through all of them that I wanted to point out. Great. Thank you very much. Um so I would entertain a motion for approval of the five um academic programs for recommended for expedited action and as recommended by Dr. Buck.
Thank you very much. I've got a second on that. Any comments, questions further to that? Yeah, just Yep. Ted and again I apologize for the delay. Maybe I'm being overenthusiastic at my first meeting, but um I note that
Lafayette Purdue is launching a cognitive science degree, but IU is closing its cognitive science degree. So, if they're both doing about the same thing, one wonders, yeah, I I guess I just like to point
that out. There was just something odd that struck me. I I I wonder what the criteria are, you know, or or how they're being implemented or what what the differences Interesting notation. I'm sure Dr. Butler if he doesn't have a response to
it now we'll follow up. Professor, Mr. Chairman, I just make a point that they are suspended and they've made a written commitment to merge and consolidate. I don't know if that'll be back into a B bachelor's of philosophy. I don't want to speak for IU Livingington, but it's
not the uh sort of course of study, so to speak, is not going away. It's just a standalone degree for it. It's going to be merged with topics. Thus, the nuance in all this, right? Times, right? Okay. So, um unless there
are any other questions would uh request approval. All in favor say I. I. I. Same. All right. Very good. Now we are switching gears rapidly to uh budget productivity. Um we are going to I think
we're going to start uh Mike Ally, thank you for your leadership here. I think you're going to start us off on two items for consideration following our meeting on July 10th. Uh we can probably real quickly take capital projects. Initially, we've got an
expedited uh approval for uh a new restoration of the dental lab at IvyTech uh community college in South Bend. Uh it is being uh funded entirely by u foundation dollars and existing campus funds. So, it's not coming from any
additional dollars. Uh the uh our committee reviewed that and recommends approval. Uh it uh basically has a positive impact on the on the campus. some of its enrollment, their ability to reach additional people uh and serve in the community in that dental lab. The
cost is about 2.7 million and so the committee recommends approval. Uh Brooke, any additional comments? Um I've got you on here as potentially staff comment on that topic. Yes, thank you, Mike. Um again, we echo that this is repurposing some vacant
space. Um and we'll be able IvyTech will be able to actually increase the cohort sizes for their dental program. So staff recommends approval. Great. I would entertain a motion app for approval. I'll take that from Mike and second from Larry. Any comments,
questions for Mike Brook, the team. Okay. Hearing none. All in favor, please say I. I. I. Same. Great. And our second issue that we've covered is our spending plan and how we're going to uh spend our dollars. And
with that, it's a lot more elaborate and I'm going to let Brooke uh give us some information so that we can make a considered uh vote. Uh thank you so much. Um so I'm going to go through this relatively quickly. We went through a very detailed presentation with the um budget and
productivity committee on July 10th. Um, as a reminder for our commission members, um, we are required through our commission bylaws to present, uh, to you a agency spend plan um, during the first month of the fiscal year. So that would be July. And so that is what we are here
today to do. This will follow a very similar format to what you may have seen in the past. We'll give a highle overview. There are some details in your packet and then happy to answer questions. Um so first we're going to go over a
quick recap of the fiscal year 25. Um as you can see in your packet we have the agency budgeted to the actual um for some uh key categories personnel p prof professional services grants and awards and then administration. Uh for the
professional uh we came in a little bit under budget due to some staff vacancies as well as some reorganization. professional services. I did want to call attention to those uh members who were on BPC. At the BPC presentation, there were some different numbers here. It looked like we had a $ 1.5 million uh
grant that or grant that we did not spend on a professional services contract. Um after further research with our director of finance, Cody, um we did uh spend that entire grant. We did engage in the contract. um it was just spread across a different number of fiscal years. So just some accounting
but wanted to bring your attention to that um that we did engage in that uh grants and awards um 499 million budgeted about 461 um actual spend and then in our administration cost um about 800,000
budgeted to six uh 623 actual. Um, a couple items of note. We did have some reversions this year, um, back to the state, most notably 78 million from the Frank Lannon program. We've talked about that quite a bit as a commission. Um, and then a couple of other uh,
reversions from our main operating as well as other grant funds. Um, high in the overview on the slide in front of you, some major changes. We've covered most of these at other uh, presentations at the commission meetings. um where some of the big changes happened. Frank Oannon
reversion, STEM teacher recruitment funding, uh no new funding for that next year. Uh career coaching has also moved to IDLE and then we had some 5% reductions. Um in crafting our fiscal year 26 spend plan, uh the agency leadership came
together and really set about doing this with a some key priorities. First and foremost, our hope agenda. um as as Commissioner Lowry has pointed to that is our northstar and we have not changed course. Uh second would be Governor Brun's priorities um under the freedom
and opportunity initiatives, excuse me, freedom and opportunity policy agenda. And again, second word there is opportunity. We feel very well aligned as a commission with those initiatives. Um and then another key thing that we looked at was a realignment of our agency portfolio. Um it is something
that we know that we've had a lot of our legislative responsibilities changed as well as priorities and so in order to make sure that we realign our spending we also had to take another look at our portfolio um high level details um with this we
will rem we will meet our reserve target and so that is put in place from the state of a 5% reserve and the spend plan will keep us with that. Additionally, uh agency leadership has also put in place an internal reserve of 2% um so that we
can adapt and respond to evolving circumstances. And we really believe that this is critical to the agency's ability uh to respond to changing circumstances um as well as um anything else that may come our way.
Um, one of the other things that we uh did in the spend plan is also execute and identify about $3 million in cost savings or reallocation. Okay, a lot of numbers on this slide and I'll kind of walk you through it very briefly. on the uh the left hand side.
We've bucketed our spending or excuse me our current estimated funds into three different buckets including administrative. The bulk of our portfolio which is student financial aid programs and then private and federal grants. The private and federal grants um are primarily our career and
technical education grants. Um so if we look at our appropriations um our carry forwards looking at receivables which are usually relatively minimal and then you see you do see the state reserve about $10 million available for our administrative funding spend $530
million for our state financial aid programs and then about $53 million available um for private grants predominantly in CTE. um some strategic adjustments this year. We've talked a little bit about um we have had some staffing reorganizations.
Um we worked to consolidate several services um especially in our IT areas where we've realized cost savings already and we've identified also new paths forward to do that. Um and then we've also made some adjustments to some administrative spending. Some of that
was touched on today um in terms of our travel for commission meetings. Um we will also be eliminating events um and then reducing our catering costs. Um and then in terms of our spend plan summary, we can see our total funds available and then where we are going to
uh plan to spend. Um you can see again the buckets of personal professional services uh grants and awards and administration. That's where a charmer reserve is held in our administrative funds at about 172,000. Uh spending about 5.2 million on personnel. We'll
have a comparison chart in just a second. Um but similar to last year and then professional services um the bulk of that with mailings, um our IT contracts, things of that nature. Again, student financial aid. Um this is really where all of our work um is and uh
planning on um excuse me having the about grants and awards 420 million spent um on just the student financial aid programs um and about 520,000 on personnel costs um to help administer those programs.
Um, okay. And then as we can see here, we've got the total funds available uh compared to the total expenditures that we um are planning for as well as the remaining. I did want to draw attention to when we do have remaining funds, what that means. So for administrative funds, we've got about 1.6 million remaining.
Um those are restricted funds. They are not something that we can just repurpose um for any type of use. Um and so um those are dedicated about 109 million um in uh student financial aid which will be carried forward as well as about 3.4
million carry forward for federal grants. Um and then this slide just kind of shows that um the the commission is very committed to keeping the dollars um with our students in our program. So our personnel spend is about 1.4%.
Um overall we only spend about 2.1% of our overall budget on an admin and operations um with the bulk of it going to financial aid programs. Um and then these slides are in your packet. I'm not going to walk through them um at detail. We've given you an update in the legislative overview about
some of the changes to the financial aid programs and they are listed here. Um and then lastly, um we're very excited, um for this year as part of our new strategic, um fiscal stewardship plans, we are implementing some new budget actual processes as well as some
reporting uh for the commission. We've got budget department leaders that will be uh reviewing monthly budget reports and reporting back to the commission leadership about where we see opportunities and risks for spending. Um and this will I think really elevate um
how we spend um these very precious dollars. Oh. Yes. So this uh Frank and with the the uh carry forward was reverted to the state. So that was lost from the department.
Uh yes. So the 78 million was originally something that we had um from the Franco Bannon program and that went back to the state. This year we are actively working um to look at what we might do next year if there are funds left over in the Frank Landon program. Commissioner Lowry. Yeah. And pepper that was as a result of
the end of April the new revised budget forecast indicating about $2.4 billion hole u from a funding perspective. So yeah that was a surprise but it had to go back right and along with other reversions across state government plus the the
budget cuts and so forth. I I would add sorry really quickly though that to a point I made quickly earlier in the day that we were clipping along at about $130 million a year coming out the door going out the door in Frank O Bannon the appropriations
$168 million and because of the approval we received a couple years ago we are now pushing to get as much of that $168 million out the door to those who actually qualify. So that's that's a nuance people miss. I save that extra 250 million between now and the end of
the decade. That's what it is where we actually have the allowance to spend it in the new schedules. Um so we can do that. We just don't have the reserve funding that was there because the state needed to help to balance books.
So, the 109 million um I assume that we're pretty much we already know what the what the funding uh commitments are for for the 2026. Is that correct? Or have we I apologize, Mike. What uh figure are you looking at again, please?
I'm just looking at uh you know this the 421 million in student financial 26. Have we already gotten that kind of based upon where we are in the process? Know that's the number or is that just an estimate of what we think it's going to be in terms of the spend?
Right. Um so we're looking at historical spend in some of those programs. Um as well as where we think we may be able to increase spending. Um but that number will be sort of a moving target as we do uh we see the claims come in. But that is right now our best estimate. Great
question. And at this juncture the 109 million we would be able to move that into 27 if we if we I mean it's is that going to be available to move into 27 or not? Right. Uh the question um about what portion of that remaining 109 can we
move forward and carry forward? Um there are a few different funds um that are not um eligible for carry forward, but many of the funds are. they're still restricted within those funds and that's something that as an agency we're going to be strategically looking at to see where we need to request um to make sure
that we can have those funds available and carry it forward or if we need to initiate any transfers of funds. Thank you. Okay, I guess um hearing Brook's great presentation. Thank you so much. I sorry Larry I'm a little uncomfortable with this
process. I mean, we're looking at a budget and one of the major task of this uh board is to approve the budget. Mike, is your committee going into this budget in detail? I realize we have. Yes. Yeah. Yeah, we have. We did. Okay. Yeah. And and we I mean here again
much much of what we're what we're really focusing on is our operating funds. That $10 million for our operating is what we really control. you know, we have the dollars available for the scholarships and we're clearly going to do all that we can to ensure that all
those of that 450 million, as much of that money as we can legally and appropriately get into the hands of the recipients, we're going to try to do um that really so much of that is contingent upon what what enrollments look like, uh what information we
receive, what applications we receive, uh and uh what we're able as a as as our staff is able to to process all the applicants for those dollars. We're going to try to get out and as revenue as we can. What we really delved into
was the op that $10 million operating budget, which is really what we're responsible for. The other is the 450 million we administer, but it really is whatever we can find uh that is appropriate to to get served to the appropriate people. Well, I obviously
have a lot of confidence in what you've done. As at the same time, as a board member, I'd like to have some better understanding of of all the money that goes through the budget. I really at least on a personal level, I wouldn't mind having I mean, we do have a line item. I mean, we have reviewed a line item actually
budget that's included in your in your packet, but not detail and the numbers are pretty small for you to read. Yeah, I understand. Yeah, I understand. I really wish we would get the budget uh earlier so we had a chance to look at it. I mean, this is a big deal my standpoint.
Yeah. Um I I would like to maybe spend an hour on a phone call and go through the budget. I'm happy to approve it now, but I really need to understand better going forward. I I would would just tell you that, you know, Chris and and Brooke and the whole and Cody and the team have really worked
diligently as we've seen a lot of the the staff reorganizations. Regrettably, a lot of that has been a result of the the budget uh issues that we've been dealing with in terms of ensuring that we're able to meet the 5% reversion as well as basically another 5%
reserve hold back and that's what we've been striving to do. So we've been evaluating again as as Brook shared some of the programs we've done some of the things we've done in the past we are discontinuing u because we're trying to ensure that 10 that five and 5% that we're we're
meeting those dollars. So very difficult here I it has been a challenge. So the committee has and staff have worked diligently in doing that. But I understand your concern Larry about making sure that we all are aware of what's happening there. Well, and to that point, you're you're
probably not alone, Larry, in wanting to understand these issues. So, um this is traditionally how it's been done, but if um I see some heads shaking. So, if there are others in addition to you that would like to have an opportunity to
dive deeper perhaps into the budget, in particular, the administrative budget, which Mike said is is the part that the commission really does control and have discretion around. Um, I'm sure that can be set up set up and perhaps there's a a way going forward to better um
communicate and have an opportunity for the entire commission versus just the budget and productivity committee to really lean into this uh when it does become budget time. Um, you know, inviting everyone to perhaps into the
budget and productivity committee for those deliberations uh going forward is probably something that we will consider. I know how much Mike I know how much you focused on this and and the committee does for sure. So I I've always had confidence that we're you know the committee's doing a lot of the
heavy lifting and and deep dive into it. But again, as Larry points out, we all have a responsibility to fiduciary responsibility to approve these important things. So thank you for that. Hopefully that'll help. Senator
Smiley, you're a bit add in on that. I think I have some of the same frustrations that I'm hearing and I I've heard from other other commissioners prior to today. I mean, when we walk in and have an inch
of of items here of complex information, I can hardly keep up with where we are in the program as I'm trying to process what I'm seeing. and especially as new members half the time I don't even know what questions to ask
but effectiveness having a little more transparency like I know we spent I feel like more time talking about what our goal would maybe be on redesign this time last year wasn't
something that even ended firing our authorization of then we've spent on some of these other bigger function items that I just want to lend my support as
well in the workbook I think on the flipping through the catalog I'm impressed with how quickly some of you guys were able to catch the cognitive science thing in the program. We just approached it a year. Um, you
guys were processing faster than I was, but it seems like if that was a deadline, that information was due to the commission over 3 weeks ago, that that would be something that could have been provided prior to warning. Where we can, I'd love a little more
heads up. Thank you, Molly, and thank you, members of the commission. Um the staff has definitely heard you loud and clear and we will be meeting with the commissioner to discuss how we can get more information to you more proactively and in a timely manner. Thank you. So before we move to the vote um and I'm going to
turn to you Mike for the fall approval but to your point Molly and to Larry and others obviously very important points you know we've already created one uh work group as a result of this meeting around mission differentiation going out on a limb here and going to suggest
maybe that we create another smaller working group to help uh staff figure out what are the best processes that we might be able to pull together realistically ally to get information in front of commission members more
effectively and early and transparently. We talked about a number of those ideas here, but as we walk away from these meetings, sometimes they leave. You know, we don't necessarily always have um a clear path forward and I know this falls on the staff to to come up with
these ideas. So, if there's anybody interested, hint hint, uh, Molly, and and especially some of the other newer commission members, uh, if there would be an interest in helping work with Brooke and Michelle and Matt Matim to try and come up with some suggestions
for how to best do this, um, please let Chris know if you are interested in that working group. I add my name to the list to people who are apologizing for prolonging a subject. And so trust me, I would only say this
if I think it adds to value. And as we have the ongoing conversation and often times what is spoken of is a desire for historical context.
And I think this is one of those to the conversation. So, but whatever we end up doing, I think it's helpful to to also keep in mind that at one point the commission asked that we number one cut back on meetings
and then the commission also asked that we cut back on materials being sent physically. Yes. and electronic and then my statement is not against Molly's comment. I mean really this is
just a general comment about historical context and so whatever we do and and I'm sure the committee will come up with the fine points like what is truly priority but I just wanted to add that to the conversation in the context because you
you can if there is no reference to historical context which is why you've always appreciated those Chris Murphy's and those individuals who had that history they could always say well whatever you decide have to do. Just understand at one point you were asking for less meetings. At one point you were
asking for less material. Then we gave you that come back and say we don't have enough what you ask. So just something to think about as the committee goes through deciding what really is the best. It's all good. It's all good. I think we
appreciate it. And it's commission changes, new members come on and it's it's a it's a big lift. It's uh I was on a hospital board for a long time. I remember the first two years being on that hospital board even though I come from the healthc care field and work in the health care field.
It takes understand not only the uh the language and the terminology but just the process and the the details of it. So I appreciate if you all appreciate that the challenge of trying to wade through
that and and add the value that we all hope to expect and as commission members. So uh Mike, I know you're on a hard timeline to get on the road because you're going out of the time. So I will back to the budget. I will look to you
to find or to add any additional comments that you feel necessary and to make a recommendation on behalf of Thank you, D. And I would just say also if you look at our group, we really had some dramat.
So Dennis, to your point, we, you know, we had for many years, we had a lot of commission members that had been on the commission for 20 years and now we do not have that. So the composite we've got a lot of new policy so we need to be sensitive to that. So what I would I would like to offer the motion in terms
of our budget to approve the budget uh today as presented. However, I would say at our next commission meeting that we have a more thorough in-depth review of the operating uh fun the operating uh budget as well as you know more
discussion on the uh uh the the uh the the tuition grants or the the scholarship money as to where we are on that. And then uh secondly that that uh no less than uh at least twice a year or
an interim that we review where we are relative to that budget because we historically have not really shared any financial information with you at a regular meeting. Uh but I would suggest that we start doing that and maybe maybe we do a brief uh budget update at each
of at each of our each of our meetings. So those are the kind of the proposal I would share an offer up and if see if that's agreeable to everyone I would take that yeah I was going to say I would take that as a motion. I'm not going to try and restate it because you stated it beautifully and I hope I'm
sure we captured all of those components of the uh of the recommendation and u and it sounds like Larry has a second. So any other comments or questions or have we belored this one? All right. All in favor please say I.
I oppose saying. All right. What a great discussion uh on so many levels. So um I think we're going to lunch but you want to we are going to lunch. I'll make just a quick kind of observation comment.
Yeah I'll make just a couple of quick observation comments. First of all, again, the discussion in the last 3 hours and 8 minutes has just been really rich. And and by the way, that was something members of the commission who were on the commission at the time three years ago asked for. And so we cut down
from 10 or 12 a year to six to be able to to do this. So, thank you. Um, also, you know, Brooke Brooke doesn't highlight Matt doesn't highlight itself, but but the way those leaders have been helping to transform the work. Um,
something that didn't come through and what Brooke was sharing is this is really the first year where we braided not just what finance is doing and what she was reporting to you but our data intelligence and uh the specifically the work the
business intelligence team. You might have heard the word forecasting in there. Three years ago we essentially reported on stagnant numbers, lack of numbers and so forth and all of our numbers and things like that. As you know, we're using leading indicators now and I'm
probably wearing them out doing forecasting. That's true. Um Brooke and I looked immediately at each other when and I think Mike, you said, "Hey, more regular reports on finances." And we just kind of smiled because guess what? We as the senior team have decided that every uh leader
in our organization, I think it's monthly, is going to get a financial update. One, we should have been doing this for years anyway, monthly. and know that, you know, he or she has that responsibility and where things are off. You know, the typical questions, the why, why is it up, what's it down, what
are we doing about, do we need to do anything about it? It just comports so well with what you ask for life. Here's what we're already going to be doing with staff. Um, and just, you know, taking this sort of to the next level and professionalizing what we're doing.
So um but my point in all that and I we got to get to lunch was to say your pushing of us you and your predecessors on the commission I know at least in the time I've been here has been a great catalyst for for us to do those things. Sometimes
those things happen first staff and then we do something with all of you. So thank you for that. Don't wait till meetings like this also to my ear. I know some of you don't. Um so yeah that I would say thank you. It looks like MJ is going to tell us where to go for
lunch. Thanks everyone. Oh, I am Am I doing the interns now? Yeah, interns have to leave. So, if we could just introduce them quickly. Oh my gosh, I am so sorry to tell you. That's okay. I I am going to ask this wonderful group
of I hope you don't mind me saying young people to line up here at the microphone. I'm up here please because they okay the unrestra I know so many of us qualify for that otherwise
but here's a little insight I think you all know miss members others in the audience Scott Education Foundation is an extraordinary partner of ours I I can't even tell you how how great of partners they are and now four summers in a row for some reason they've asked
me to come over their offices very near hours and talk with the interns. We have the most amazing conversations because I hear at lunch about what we were talking about at breakfast because they owe me a Spotify list, right? U among other things. Um but they're just really extraordinary
u students and early career people and we were delighted when they said, "Hey, can we come to a commission meeting?" And we said, "Yeah, that'd be just awesome." And I think I probably had coffee or virtual conversations with half or so of them since that other uh gathering we had a month or so ago. So I
know you've been given instructions. It's like your name what you're doing you know name rank serial number something like that. So if if one of you would lead off that would be great. And Tmaine thank you a a friend of mine
friend of others here leads this group and thank you for being such a great partner Tummaine. Yeah, we love working with your group. Okay, one of you hit it because you know you are standing between us and watch but mic right there. Um um hi guys, I'm Will. Nice to meet
you. It was great being here. Um listening um from DC, so not Indiana, but it's been great um to visit the state. Um I'm a master student and I work with the workforce alignment team. Thank you. Hope you stay in Indiana. Yeah,
they've all heard that. Hi, uh my name is Darius Lewis. I work with the postsecondary education team, specifically HBCU engagement. Uh and I will be starting my master's degree in higher education student affairs this fall at Bloomington.
Hi everyone. It's really nice to meet you. I'm an intern with the postsecary education team, specifically grants management this summer. and I'm a rising senior at Georgetown University studying international relations and education. Thank you for having us.
Hello everyone. My name is Anastasia Logan. I'm currently a rising senior at Indiana University Bloomington studying entrepreneurship, business analytics, and business psychology and I am working in the DC office in strategy and innovation. Hi everyone. It's such an honor to be
here. Thank you so much for hosting us. My name is Manahill. I'm part of the clear outcomes department at Stratda. I'm also a rising junior at Boston University studying data science. Hi everybody. It's a pleasure to be here. My name is Mafisa. I am a master student at University of Maryland
College Park where I'm studying public policy and I'm finishing up my last year. I'm working very closely with the pack team in DC and that's basically the policy team. Um and right now spending a lot of time focusing on apprenticeship degrees. So it's a pleasure being in
here with Colin. Hi everyone, my name is Nolan Ernnandez. Um, I'm a legal intern at the DC office. I had the pleasure of working closely with everyone in contract negotiations, compliance agreements, and all those things. Um, really pleasure to be here.
This was very insightful, very eye opening. So, thank you so much for your time. Hello, my name is Ben Rox. I work with the finance department here in Indianapolis. I go to IUND as well. I'm a rising junior. Hello everyone. My name is Haven Greer
and I'm a rising 2L at the GW um law school in Washington DC and I'm a part of the legal team at Stratavis Center. Hello everyone. My name is Olivia Campbell. I am a recent grad from Martin
University and I am returning to pursue my masters in organizational leadership. And at Strrada, I am with the diversity, equity, and inclusion and belonging team uh focusing on learner voice and enhancing the utilization of learner perspectives.
Hello, my name is Victory Samson and I work closely with our executive vice president and chief of staff on the nonprofit administration pathway. I am currently a rising senior at Butler University studying strategic communications, advertising, and public relations with a double major in
multilingual studies. Hello everyone. I am Ali. I am uh the only IT intern and I am uh mostly focused on upkeep and working alongside the um CSO of our IT department and uh I
go to Purd University Indianapolis and I will be graduating this December. distraught interns to stay there for a moment. Tmaine, you stick around. MJ, if you don't mind ushering everyone to lunch and I think chairman, you want everybody back here at one, right?
Yeah, I think there there's no program at lunch, right? MJ, or is there um commission members have a separate room to meet with President Polio for a brief listening session. Um, so Rotunda is where lunch will be for guests and
commission staff. The food is where it was this morning and then the commission's um conference room is just around the corner. So we'll have people direct. Are we okay coming back at 1? Does that give the president and us enough time or I mean it's really he's not giving a presentation. It's just a conversation
with you so that he can receive feedback from you. Okay, great. Thank you all. We'll see you back here at one o'clock. Oh, I know. Yeah, picture again. body. I think we're going to go ahead and get started. Thank you for your patience with us coming back. We had a
great opportunity as commission members to spend our lunch with uh President Polio. really appreciated his insights and and early learnings and and welcoming uh him to the state. So, uh we're back on track. I don't anticipate
our afternoon will um be very extended at all. In fact, I think we'll probably get out of here earlier that since we were successful in cramming a lot of stuff into the morning because of making sure we had appropriate quorum and leadership on site. So, uh, next up, uh,
is, uh, Commissioner Lowry and his report, right? Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Um, I only advanced one slide. This is clearly, uh, continuing the theme of interns. Uh, interns, of course, before lunch with Strada. Now, this is the one
that's really personal for us. Uh, we want you to meet the three interns who have been with us. Uh Joe was here for round two as some of you may know before he uh heads into law school. But especially for those of you who are newer to the commission, you may not
know this, but uh until a few years ago, we just didn't have interns. Um I I vividly recall asking the stupid question after I learned every governor's interns. I said, "So when do we get ours?" And the answer was, "Well," and my response was, "Aren't we
the ones that say everybody should have interns, workbased learning, and all that?" So anyway, we have interns now. We don't just have interns. I think we have great interns. As I said, Joe is here for round two with us. He just couldn't stay away. And of course, Elliot and Sarah have joined us, too. I'm going to ask the three of you,
whether you were prepared or not, to come up to the microphone and just tell us a little bit, you know, about yourselves, where you're going to school, where your various interests are, what's next, and maybe something that's on which you're working right now with the commission. So, come on up.
excited. Normally, full of energy um as they're walking up here, commission members, it if you're in the office sometime, they have a designated sort of I call it the intern suite. Okay, it's some desk. Uh and they have
this enormous whiteboard wall and they challenge all of us every day to write down our top three of whatever the category is and it's quite interesting. Um anyway, it's a fun way to get to stand and talk with I'll be quiet. Joe, you want to read this? Uh well, thank you
for the the introduction. My name is Joe Kai. Um I'm a recent graduate from IU Bloomington. I studied political science and philosophy. Uh and then after this, I plan to go back down to Bloomington uh for my first year of law school at the Mau School of Law. Uh and some things
I've been doing here at the commission. Um, right now I've been working a lot with the Richard and Fairbanks foundations programs initiatives doing outreach in Marian County specifically for FA this past spring uh and the pre-missions a little bit this this summer and then sort of just uh other
miscellaneous projects that apply to Marian County as we prepare for the next FAFSA cycle. So, thank you again for having me back for another internship. It's truly been a great opportunity working here and seeing everything that that you guys all do to serve this state, especially Marian County as well. Hi, I'm Elliot Low Weber and I am the
college enrollment intern of the summer. I'm a rising senior at Miami University where I study psychology with minors in marketing and art therapy. This upcoming fall my goal is to apply to grad school for higher education and student affairs. And yeah, this summer I've been
working with Victoria on Indiana pre-missions. It's been a great experience and thank you all so much for having me. Hello, I'm Sarah. I'm the financial aid intern this summer and I also go to Indiana University Bloomington and I'm
also from Bloomington. I'm also 21st century scholar so all of the things that are done here are very personal to me and I just wanted to say thank you to every single one of you guys for doing all that you do. Um, I'm also on a pre-law track, but still to be decided.
And I work with things 21st century and financial aid. While they're still out there, I'll take a minute to embarrass them. Yeah. Further. Yeah. Yeah. Thanks for asking me. Um, you know, each each year that we've had insurance, we see just
how additive they are to what we do. It's um it's not just by the way that that truly we have been working on board work uh you heard some of it literally over the last three years they have been doing work as interns that we did not
have the capacity to do and doing them only on strategic initiatives that have have turned into some things I'm going to report on in a minute you know improvements metrics that reflect real outcomes for students and that has been the case with these
You probably caught although he just referenced in passing that Joe is an intern and he is funded by Richard and Fairbanks Foundation. Some of you who are newer may not know this. We have some just extraordinary partnerships.
The Fairbanks Foundation is one of those. Um, millions of dollars have been brought to and through not just the commission but our partners to improve among other things the completion of the
federal aid financial forms under the FAA and u so we have the capacity to hire two I think this second or third year in a row right Michelle third second or third year in a row third year in a row where the Fairbanks Foundation
has paid for that and u so I want to call them out that we have so many other great partners you saw strata interns today they're great supporters of ours including you know financially but also as thought partners and uh thought
leaders so anyway we're just you all know I don't want you to leave but but you got to go finish whatever you're doing and then remember this LA if you're not here you got to come back and you've got to stay they kept me about every the other day. I said anyway, just
thank you for being here. Okay, I'm going to give you a oops a few of the numbers that we talked about periodically. Uh the college going rate, as you all know, when we started talking about this uh I think it was on June 8th of 2022, uh we started making a lot of noise
because we really hadn't as a state. It had declined from mid60% it was actually as height 2012 I believe it was 68% 15% decline over a decade and so forth it has basically stayed at that level
2023 so that would be the class that graduated in late May early June from high school in 2023 did slip to 52% it's just been hovering around you the 52 53% I'd like to make mention of it though because I I think it's really important
as you all know and I referenced it earlier this morning. We think this is a really important indicator um because we know the need for more individuals with some form of training and education beyond high school is only going to increase whether we look at
what Georgetown University or others say u you know by 2030 31 that roughly 70 72% of folks in the workforce are going to need something beyond a high school diploma to be gainfully employed and productive and this is this is like the
first step in it whether someone's going to ID techch for that certificate or if somebody's pursuing that bachelor's degree at Virginia University. Um and the other reason I wanted to mention this is the the fact that it is 52 instead of 53% that is the kind of thing that
absolutely makes me crazy. Um but as you also know the lagging indicator is what makes me crazier. I point this out because the strategic plan off of which we operate today, the hope agenda with the seven key points was made public
first in midappril yes of 2023 and then these are the folks who metriculated beginning that summer. So ju just understand that literally the effect of the strategic plan was not on that group of students. So want to make that clear because you make
a question. So gee, you know, I thought you were working on all these things. Why did it go down a point? Well, it went down a point before any of those things really went into into effect. So I I know you follow all that. I just wanted to make sure it was crystal clear because you do get questions like that from time to time. Um the initiatives,
these are the things that um you know relate to each one evolves out of the key objectives of our strategic plan. and the hope agenda. Uh you know that those are the college going rate completions, grad retention. Then on the adult side is credit prior learning and
then the three populations of adults on which we focus those with disabilities, justice involved um and those with military service and we're going to talk about that again in a few moments too. But these are the key initiatives and especially here around college going
they serve as leading indicators for us. uh up until about two two and a half years ago, we literally just reported on the lagging indicators which quickly becomes among other things boring. Uh and it's just not very insightful because we need to know how we're doing
on the things that drive those key numbers like the college going rate. And then from our perspective, so you know, and I think you do, I think you do know this, that not only are we paying attention to these when we come before you every other month, but we're literally looking at these every week
and tracking all these things as as they move. So the 21st century scholars, you know, and you heard it admins that in 2022 before we got the change, we had less than 20,000 students enrolled. That's because we had to chase the kids down, get them enrolled, and so forth,
right? Especially some in this room who are have been 21st century scholars know this to be true. We get statute changed. Now we automatically enroll those. First year was 46,000. Last year was 50,000. This year it's around 44,000.
Some might wonder so wide up and down. Two factors influence that. How big is the eighth grade cohort? Right? It's a lot of it tied back to birth rate and uh you know immigration into our state. you know net imports of people into our state and to imports the percentage of
children who qualify by income. So that's that's why you get a variation there. Uh what what this allowed us to do though is really significantly important and you know uh at least those of you who have been on the commission for a while those of you who are newer wouldn't know
this but as we have really worked diligently on making our organization both more efficient and effective. We've been able to understand how to better utilize our resources. One example only is that we have outreach coordinators
nine around the state. And until we made the change in 2023, much of their time, most of their time was spent on helping schools and other organizations chase these kids down. Great. We automatically enroll them. Now, I'll share some numbers in a second
with you following here. what they now focus on uh also in addition to FAS and so forth which kind of seems in is helping those students as they enter high school complete their scholar success program. It's one thing to get signed up for this. It's quite another
thing to be successful in high school so that you can then qualify once you're ready to metriculate to whatever postsecary choice you you have. So understanding how to better allocate and utilize our resources and yes to meure everyone who's involved in the process
who's part of our uh agency. Can I make a moment? Can you go back to the prior slide? You may not be able to read it but I looked it up on the line copy. The lower right so economic status those numbers you're seeing there are collegegoing
rates right? Yeah. So the the far left 30% that's lowincome non-21st century scholars go at a 30% rate. All other students outside of that group go at a 59% rate
and the scholars who go through this 21st century scholar program and the scholar success program go at 78% rate. Right. They do. So I mean couple of observations. If we're at 52 overall percent, you can see
why that low number uh reflected in the lowincome students that go don't go through the 21st century scholars program. Now, granted, this is a numbers game I'm talking about, but it pulls a number down in a sense. So, thus the I don't pass up a chance to talk about
21st century scholars. Um because I think especially with scholar success program it has just been so amazingly effective at doing a lot of things including driving going so 20 2027 will be the year when the
first Yeah. Yeah. That's right. 2027 will be those eighth graders from 2023. They'll be the first I literally can't wait until August of 2027. I mean, you know, I know I'm wishing my years away, especially at my age, but I will tell
you, I can't wait for August. That's I just think that's going to be great to see how it it will be. And I think Dan, thanks for pointing that out. I have to admit I talk about this all the time. It's that was one of those times I just, you know,
I jumped over I did the really important part here, which is students metriculate. Oh, and by the way, we could send those out to you. I know you've seen me use them sometimes. Their completion rates, 21st century scholars, are just right in line with just other students versus the
low-inccome student who hasn't been a 21st century scholar and who hasn't gone through the scholar success program. Right. Um Dan, thank you. Thanks for the question, too. Guys, question about the uh so in theory, will the 30% disappear
if you're autoenrolled? Is is is that so those 30% are are students that weren't are not enrolled in 21st century scholar? Yeah, theoretically they would um there will be some students who don't
get enrolled say they come in as 11th grade they weren't a scholar you know etc. Um, I do think more and more schools are also going to see that regardless of whether they've gotten into that and we're right, we're going to catch the I can't even say fast or
overwhelming, it's going to be almost all of lower income students, but if they're not, I think schools really know and understand the value of the scholar success program more and more every year. Um, you 12 basic things 12, right?
um that I know I characterize and others have good good student good citizen checklist. Um so yeah that that yeah we're still going to have some low-income students but it's going to be so fewer who aren't 21st century
scholars and getting the benefit of those those early implicous steps. So a little bit about the scholar success program. Um this is this is something that was not um measured until starting I don't know Michelle a year
ago I think it was u and with our u outreach coordinators we started asking so how are we doing this of course their concentration again had been on signing up kids and so forth and so now we set metrics to that and for the class of 2025 what our highest had ever been
upper 40% or something like that uh for the number of students who've actually completed the scholar success program. So, that's been on the rise. Um the scholar track account creation, which is al also really important by the end of
9th grade. Um 85% for the 2025 cohort that's climbing. We of course work on that with them throughout high school. But we we want to know like right out of the gates in nth grade, have they got that set up because that's just a functional uh necessity for them to do.
You know, I've talked about this a lot. Uh I'm 14 hears it from me a lot. We've got to set objectives. Let's stretch set stretch objectives and then um as a team figure out if you can help not only not only focus on what you're trying to get
done, but is there something in your lane or your responsibility that would help your colleague achieve his or her goal? Uh and I mentioned that because so we've got scholar the um outreach coordinators doing that. And what we now see because everybody knows everybody's
goals and metrics is you know somebody from marketing for example coming and saying hey Kent you know we've got this idea that would help you with the students I make this up right but do this or this or somebody from the business intelligence team saying we can help slice the data in this kind of way
to help drive for success and I mean that is one I would tell you I just love seeing that um you know we set a goal hadn't had one in the past said okay let's try to there. It's above what it ever has been. And well, you can see
they're they're doing quite well. And yes, we'll jack up the the goal of the next year. Um pre-missions. You've heard about this for those of you who are newer. This was the idea that we started in
2023. Yeah, 2023 where we were frankly seeking to create in essence a better marketplace for students and their families as they make the decision uh as especially seniors of high school. The you know the information oftent times
regarding uh whether you can qualify to get into an institution, what they offer, even who they are, etc. It it's pretty opaque and there's nothing nefarious about it. It's just the way it's evolved over the years with higher ed. And as we were sitting around talking, we said, "Look, there are, you
know, 29 independents, seven Publix, lots of regional camps, etc. Is is there like a Hooser outside of this office who actually knows about all of those?" And we all kind of said probably not. Um, and so again, for especially for those
of you who are new, we we have a real important policy in our in our office with regards to what other states are doing and other entities are doing. We think it's R&D, which simply means rip off and duplicate. Um, and we found one in Idaho to rip off and duplicate. Uh,
we think ours is better because we've tweaked it. But now what we do is we work with the schools, the DOE. Uh, we are able to get electronically SATs and GPA for every junior in high school because they have to take the SAT, right? Those are functions for almost
every institution on acceptance. We go to the institutions say you tell us uh GPA and or SAT what's your cut score and now we generate uh letters to uh high school seniors and separately or their parents telling them every institution in Indiana to which they would be
accepted. Uh the average I think this most recent year was 24. We'll see what it is this year. Uh well it's right there. It's it's not that I think it is. It's right there because you all have it there team and um it the outpouring especially from parents about this
program has been incredible. This past winter, we started pushing it further. And now students, parents receive additional information if they're in the ninth, 10th, and 11th grade. For example, telling them, one example, in the ninth grade, you should be thinking about the Indiana College Corps. And
here's its benefit. And you should know that you're going to get this kind of letter freshman, junior, senior, or you know, freshman, sophomore, junior. When you're a senior, you need to be prepared to fill out the FAFSA. you know, these types of things so that they are uh much better equipped. And I think again for
those of you who've been on the commission for a while know that that engagement with the parent is also really important. We saw the research that we did with Heartline Strategies that um yes, parents are critically important to these decisions, but their
students trust them and value their input more than any person they know. And on the other side of that coin, parents did not believe that. Imagine that. They don't think a teenager listens to them. U shocking. U but
right, you know, we found that research. So of course, parents are just loving getting this information and yeah, we're at least where that's heading and we're trying to add to that, you know, as we go along. Oops. There we go. The Indiana College Core
mentioned that. Um uh President Polio mentioned uh BAT and dual credit at lunch. This has been something you are sitting in the campus. You heard that every high school in their service area offers Indiana college core. Uh this
high school and one other in this you know geography down here graduate a higher percentage of students with a postsecondary credential than any other high schools in the state. Uh they've been doing this for a while. It's that core of of 30 gened classes
that our seven institutions must take fully uh as as a transfer. Yeah. When we started the journey, you can see the little graph on the left. Um literally in April 2022, we were at 84 and some of you will remember the public
assignment to Michelle Ashcraft to grow that her third day on the job uh in public. Uh, so now we're at 307 and almost at least weekly they tell me how many more. I'm sure we'll even have more matt by uh August. So Chris, can I ask a question?
Please do. Just by participating in the college, does that mean the high school offers at least one or all of the college? That is a great question. Uh so they have to offer enough of the courses
within any of the given areas so that the student can earn the college core. and this the school in partnership with for example IU or IvyTech any of those that um are called or providers are also sometimes and this this is
probably one of the best it may be the best example of it where a high school can't round out all of the offering that would constitute the Indiana College Corps they made arrangements for the students literally to leave school come
to the campus by the way Ted I'd Love that question. I you and I should come here on the first day of high school this year in Madison. You won't find a parking space. I kind of alluded to that last night. It's incredible. And they've got kids, you know, buses and cars from
Switzerland County and, you know, the private school down the road, Madison. And so yeah, from the high school here and you know, I mean, it aggregates the demand, right? Sure. and and then they also get I think
great instructors you know who gosh have doctorate degrees and so forth and and obviously in the process allows the student to earn the Indiana college course. So they've been they've been really uh creative about that but yeah thanks for that question. You know this has been a big focus of
ours uh for the last couple of years. We were able to get the law changed on that. And then we're one of eight, I think, states in the nation that students are supposed to do this before they graduate. There there's no penalty if they don't, but they're supposed to
do this. And the Richard and Fairbanks Foundation really stepped up on this. Um, as you know, we have something called the Partnership Pentagon. It's not met in over a year. Frankly, I think there's some great things that they could begin meeting on again that we're really, you
know, working on and have been facing. But, um, and again, for those of you who are new, I'm eager to tell you about what we did. It's about 100 leaders from business, education, government, philanthropy, and nonprofits who came together to help us think about some of the tougher issues in higher ed. One of
these lengthy sessions facilitated six-hour sessions. Uh the CEO of the Richmond Fairbanks Foundation said, "Gosh, it looks like FA completions. It that is a real struggle for our state. We'd like to talk with you." And they
came forward and you can see some of the level of investment that they've made. But uh in a partnership that includes our organization uh various community and faith-based organizations um local school corporations and so
forth, we've we've been able to implement some grassroots initiatives to really reach students and their families. And as you can see, just in 2023, we were 39th in the nation on completion of FASA fast forms. And I think as of maybe yesterday, we were
15th in the nation. Uh we want to be top 10. Okay, we'd really like to be the top one. Um, and I would tell you too, the figures that are noted here from the Fairbanks Foundation don't even show the full picture. It it is even much higher than that. So, all of those things
though, we know are leading indicators of of where we're going with those are all strategic initiatives that help us understand where we're heading from a leading indicator standpoint. So the college going rate, we're going to
keep looking at it. We think it's important. It's an indicator. Some some have already mentioned some things that uh you know, we're starting to see each one of these things is starting to or will start to for example in 2027 with
the 21st century scholars with the expansion that each one of those things is or will be influencing our our enrollment rates. That's good news. For the past two years now, public and private institutions, I mentioned this this morning, we've had
an enrollment increase after a decade of decline. All of these are all of these things have been contribute contributo to it. Um we're not able to disagregate those. I would say at this point probably the major influences have been our shift with our outreach folks, the
um uh the pre-missions and a couple of other things. But we'll we'll start to see the real impact of 21st century scholars. And so I'll I'll be glad to take a breath too before I introduce uh do some commission staff stuff here if you have any questions.
Okay. Um and again just operationally and this is kind of the nerdy how do we run our agency stuff. um you know we we we really have changed how we think about this enterprise in that again at the highest level you know we have these
lagging indicators then we've got the leading indicator so that's the college going rate and then there's enrollment in here and what's driving the enrollment and then what are the specific ways we operate underneath that and then as you know then we have a strategic management plan that affects
every person some employee or 50 on our team who then have key responsibilities at least three metrics measurable every year tied to those things that feed up to each of those lagging indicators that are in the in the strategic plan. So
that's kind of the nerdy groundwork, but it's it's it's hopefully the kind of thing that you would expect us to be doing in running an enterprise. And uh pardon me, I will tell you the comments and suggestions you make in these meetings and phone calls and meetings I
have with you separately inform us. So keep leaning into that. Yes, we have we have been putting this off, Dr. Castanova, for some four hours now. I've been sitting here anxiously wanting to read a few things about you. Um, at first of all, thanks for saying
yes. Oh, my pleasure. It's an honor. Really an honor. We are delighted to have you here and delighted for your input today. And I'm gonna read read you a few things about Dr. Katherine. I know his bio is much
longer than this. It's quite impressive. But I'm going to read some brief notes here because my guess is he probably would have told you. So I will. How's that? But uh Dr. Ted Castanova has been a professor of media at IU Bloomington
since 2004. He has a PhD in economics from Wisconsin uh and specializes in the economics of video games. I think this is fascinating. He and I we might have a chance to talk. I just find it fascinating. uh he has written four books and numerous papers on the subject
and I think others. In recent years, his studies have expanded to technology, science, and religion. I cannot wait just to grab dinner with you. Um after I read this, I thought, "Oh yes, I can't wait for that." Uh he has designed several board games and is currently
writing a novel. Listen to this now. I I'm also eager about he is writing a novel. I think I've got this right. about the future of AI, virtual reality, and human society. I'm ready for a signed copy. Um, and he
should be a publisher. Let's talk about that. Right. And he serves as a volunteer teacher at a Catholic home school co-op in Ellletville, Indiana. Um, I know again that your your bio is much longer than that, but thanks for saying yes to us
and being being part of the work that the commission does. Thank you. So I would like for us to officially welcome him again. Thank you. So glad you're here. And uh at least one of these guys is here. U you know they uh are going on to
other things. I I know you know this, but Seth Henshaw, who uh some of you, I think maybe most of you know, we Okay, I literally volunteered him up for the new education vertical back in December, uh had been told him, I said, "Oh, hey, you're going to get a call from Katie Jenner because I think you ought to be
the CFO for the vertical." And um great talent is recognized and he was just recruited by Indiana State University and is going to be the CFO over there. Um Mike Gdard is putting together an
incredible team and um the set reminded me the other day that we're going to see each other a lot and each is going to have different questions for me. So yeah, that's that's all fair. And then uh great Harold who has been leading our public policy and u you know especially
stepped in when we we also volunteered I think you know Josh Garrison to go be chief of staff for Katie Jenner and he's doing a smashing job there. uh break step write up that's typical of this team and uh has been leading public policy and is it August one is that your
last day oh my gosh August one and how long have you been with commission nine nine years nine years and he is going to an organization that some of us have been associated with I'm looking at you Larry for many years I think you probably know this the Institute for
Quality Education uh run by Betsy widely. Um, yeah, you know, she she sent me sort of the kind of uh email that uh my friend Dan Ellner sent me that, you know, sort of in reverse though. Hey, you still talking with me? Where Dan Ellner sent me one about Ryle and said,
"You rascal." Um, she she was on the other side of that. He was Yeah, she was on the other side of that this time. But, uh, he will be missed. He's just going to be four four floors away, right? So, he cannot escape us. And um
yeah, we're just we're we're delighted for him and you know, commission members again, especially those of you who are new with us. Um uh we'll tell you more about it to we'll talk about that over lunch or dinner. But we also have an intentional talent strategy and it's to develop people. is
to bring in the best people we can find and when it's right help folks even if that includes and means going to another organization to help them go do that. Uh that just seems the right thing to do first of all and it doesn't hurt the the
commission in the process. Uh it's great people uh find their way to good partners of ours. So, Greg, uh, I want to just start us in a little round of applause for you two for all the work you've done and the success you're going to have on this community.
Mr. Chairman, if you have a motion there any motion. Yes. Any any comments? Greg, you're getting some pressure over here. We know you're only going up to the seventh floor, so you'll still you'll still be around. Congratulations. We appreciate all
you've done and same with Seth, of course. Wish he was here, but thank you for all you've done for so long for the commission for higher education and and the state of Indiana. So, we know that's not that work is not done. So, thank you. I think that's it for you, Chris, on your report. You thank but thankfully for your part,
I am done. Okay. We've got a few more things we need to accomplish here. So, uh, next up on our agenda, if I'm reading this correctly, uh, is we're going to hear about the collegiate star program from Kate Marlin, who is the post-secary
transitions manager. Thank you. Okay. All right. Thank you for the introduction. My name is Kate Marlin. I'm the postsecondary transitions manager. I'm going to be giving a brief update on the Collegiate Purple Star of Indiana. Um
try not to click too fast. Um, so a little background on this. Uh, Senate Bill 384 from 2023 tasked both CH and the Department of Veterans Affairs within establishing and implementing um the higher education purple star uh designation which is known as the
collegiate purple star award of Indiana. Uh, the mission of this was to recognize eligible post-secondary institutions that have successfully demonstrated um supportive environments for their military affiliated students. um from that application to their hopeful
graduation. Um so uh earlier in this month we were able to send out those uh award designations to those institutions that applied um institutions who received this uh tier um achieved um or
demonstrated um either uh from a one or a three. So those institutions who received a tier three uh achievements were those who were committed to supporting um their military affiliated students um and already had a good foundation um for
that student success. Uh those who received a tier 2 achievement um were also committed and de demonstrated that commitment um to supporting those students and also had already made great strides um in maintaining and making sure that their institution was military
friendly. Um those who received that tier one achievement um demonstrated that they were uh engaged with their military students um and had a solid foundation um and already had achieved a robust culture. Um to receive a tier
three institutions needed to have a score of at least 70% um to that 79.9% those in that tier 2 um 80 to 89%. Tier 3 was 90 to 99. And we do have a category for special commission
distinction which would be a full 100% um which is still yet to be achieved. So something to look forward to. All right, getting into the uh scoring and standards. There's 37 standards broken up into eight different
categories. Um there is a bonus category. Each standard has or each category has a differing number of standards. Um and each of those standards has a point uh associated with it. Um the breakdown is right there. Um there is also that nine ninth category
which is bonus. Um institutions have the opportunities to submit documentation to receive um bonus points to hopefully achieve that 100% in special distinction. Um there were at least three standards this time that we did not have to look
at as they were not applicable for that 2425 year but will be um going forward. So we didn't have to do uh 37 uh standards this time but will in the future. So institutions will need to make note of that.
Right. Getting into the application process. Um I was tasked with uh managing this process um after a time of transition. So we wanted to make sure this is going forward. The application period ended um in February. The institutions who applied uh were um
needed to make sure that they had all their documentation in um the teams channel that we provided. um the review committee uh for this cycle um we decided to make sure that every single member on that committee was looking at
every single document and every single institution. Um and so this is why we had the uh time frame of March to June because there were 30 institutions. Um after this deliberation uh we were able to send out award notifications like I
said early July. Each institution who received an award um also received uh an award certificate. Um the application summary report uh the tier badges which are shown behind me. Social media that they can use uh to promote their tier um
as well as a letter from our commissioner. Uh getting a little bit into the review process. As I said, we had a committee. Um we had six members. um a mix of CHE and uh IDBA staff as well as one
committee adviser who was a part of the task force um in the event that we needed a tiebreaker. Um a little bit of um background on how much of a lift this was for everybody. Uh I estimated that there was probably about over 3,000 documents that each individual had to uh
look at over the course of these three months. Um so thank you again to all of the people who were involved in this. This was um a big task. Um as this was the first cycle, like I said, we reviewed all documentation. Um we broke this up into 10 institutions each month
with a um meeting at the end of each month to review any differing scores between committee members um and also discuss any potential um changes we wanted to make to any standard or things that needed to be addressed. Um so this
happened three times. We had three meetings over the course of those three months. Um, and of course, if there were anything that came up um, at a later time period that needed to be addressed to the institutions that were reviewed first, we went back and made sure the scores were all correct.
Now, for the fun news, these are the institutions that received a tier. Um, we had six institutions that received tier 1, 16 that received tier 2, and six that received tier three. Um, so we're very excited and as we are at IVTech right now, I'm happy to say that all of
the campuses that uh applied received a tier this uh this cycle. All right, going forward, our next application cycle. Um, now these designations are good for 3 years. So institutions don't need to apply again
um unless they believe that they uh have implemented u new activities, programs, events, support um that will result in a differing score or a higher tier. Um we have a um
the timeline that we want to use uh will mirror this year. We're going to potentially in the uh name of transparency um hopefully get the scorec card out to the institutions um early January to make sure that they um can
kind of go through that and uh match um the documentation that they need to provide with what we're looking for. Um I think it'll give a little bit more clarity. Um it's very similar to the field guide that they all use, but everybody likes a spreadsheet that they can manipulate. Um so the application
period will open again. um in February the notice of interest forms will need to be in um by that time period. So we have a whole month to get that documentation in and then of course the uh review committee will take time to deliberate. Um depending on the number
of institutions it may not take the 3 months but we're still going to give ourselves that 3-month uh period for now. Um and then of course we will be hopefully uh awarding new campuses or awarding higher tiers um for that July time frame again so that we can give
another update if needed to the comm uh commission members questions. Did you tell us how many university or how many campuses applied? 30 institutes apply. But not all. That is correct.
Of the of this just looking at the uh the the tiers. Uh was there like one category, one standard that um was obvious that if people really worked on it, they could move to the next year. U well every institution received a
score. So there were institutions that may have received that like 88% um which would potentially just be one standard that they would need to meet for the next time um that was given to them in a breakdown. So if they wanted to apply again they would know which standards they would need to achieve.
Yeah. I was just wondering was there a trend I guess student was there one that you saw that like if institutions would have really leaned into we would have had more in the tier three if you don't have it that's fine I was just curious
um thinking back on it I think uh standard or category seven there were of some institutions that just didn't have any documentation to provide at that time um so I think if they leaned into that um I
mean of course standard number or category number one has seven standards in that so meeting all of those of course would give a potential higher tier any other questions before Kate escapes though I'll probably get trouble with this too
this work Kate that you've led and obviously a lot of other folks on the team has just been really good u you know you all agree or you at least were on the commission at the time two years ago that one of the areas of adults on which we would focus would be those
military service for veterans. Uh I think we weren't quite sure where that would go and how that would turn out. This this is a big robust deal though when you heard Kate talk about the categories and what the standards would be in. I it's very serious. is not
awarding something to someone because I don't know they were nice to you or they showed you some some flashy, you know, uh, brochure or something like that, but they're very serious and we think that that's the way it ought to be when we're
serving those in the military or our veterans. um inter related Kate and others now I leave a bunch of other people out but Kate is one of the people who now twice when we had to make the cutbacks in December January because of
the budget revised budget forecast and then when we had to again um in June is one of the people who stepped up and is doing more is doing exceptionally well and she's she's representing
everybody who stepped that have done and Kate, thank you for doing so. And then lastly, a friend of ours who I know we haven't seen for a while around is Erica Stutterman, who retired Major General Erica Stutterman, uh who of course you
know was on the commission and had to leave because of the health needs and care of her daughters. Uh but Erica, General Stutterman is the one you may recall who chaired this committee and said we can make this meaningful for Indiana. And I I keep thinking Kate, we
ought to like go to Lafayette or something and take her literally take her to lunch and say, you know, Erica, you you own a lot of this and a serious way in which we are doing what we should do for those in the military and our veterans. So just if you happen to know
Erica or see her, some of you live near her, thank her for the outcomes that we're starting to see. And Kate, thanks for your leadership on this. Commissioner, I just one uh one statement. I had the opportunity to
hear uh President Gard uh speak at ISU and he spoke proudly of being tier three and what that meant to him and his university. So it's resonating. uh this just says in the box it's something that was really powerful when he spoke about it. So good luck.
Thank you. Awesome. Thank you Cadence. Wonderful presentation. Great work. Thanks for stepping up as as Chris said and to the to the entire team on that same context of course. Um our last presentation is I've been looking forward to this um
credentials of value and a CTE students journey. We're going to hear about this from Sam Ror who's the assistant commissioner for career and techn technical education and Lindsay is it ASOS or Osos OSO something I figured I probably picked the wrong one but uh
who's the director for CTE programming. So thank you both for being here and look forward to your presentation. Right, good afternoon everyone. Um hopefully this will kind of tie a lot of things from today today well um together um being here at IvyTech and um just a
lot of the other uh items that we we've discussed today. So, um, as you kind of might recall from the high school diploma, uh, redesign process over the course of last year, uh, a couple of the focus areas in those
diploma requirements are this term credentials of value, and then there's a lot of things around work-based learning requirements, certain hours that students have to earn um, for the various um, diploma seals that students can earn uh, when going uh in the in the
new diploma requirements. And so when the diploma was passed in December, the credentials of value aspect was not defined. It just says you have to earn a credential of value or or something to that effect. So over the uh spring kind
of a a collaborative committee of different state agency partners IvyTech VU have been working to have an initial version of a credentials and values list. Um, this is going to be a pretty iterative process, more employer input,
uh, you know, improvements to the to the process moving forward. But there was a a time sensitivity to getting out um an initial version that could be used for um the incoming freshmen who can be who can utilize um the new diploma
requirements or for schools who are um opting in early. And so there might be upper classmen who are earning the the diploma seals. So, uh, at the end of May, uh, an initial memo was released by the Department of Education that that our team, uh, helped support quite a bit. Um,
the list of credentials includes a variety of of post-secary credentials all the way up through associates degrees, but also the technical certificate, certificates of graduation. Those are the 30 credit hour um, credentials that IvyTech and VU
primarily offer. So basically those are the you know the ICC is also a technical certificate a 30 credit hour uh credential but then there are also those 30 credit hour certificates in a variety of areas right in advanced manufacturing
in healthcare in uh whatever the the area might be and then there are even uh shorter credentials than that 15 credit hour type uh credentials that are offered again mostly through IvyTech and Vue and then it's also going include uh
other credentials, industry certifications, licenses that uh are are not postcary credentials but are are uh other credentials of value. the uh the list will go into effect for um well for the along with the the
students the grad requirements go into effect for the class of 2029 and the list does as well or for schools who opt in they'll be utilizing this as well. Um I'm going to talk just a little bit
about the kind of selection process and scoring process. This could be its own presentation on the the top jobs methodology and and some of the things that went into the credentials list and and we may share uh more at a later time, but uh if if this kind of piques
your interest, feel free to to reach out for additional information. But each each credential on the list is scored on a fivepoint scale and the new um top jobs methodology is uh kind of in the background in informing those scores.
Some of you uh may have a decent level of familiarity with the flames methodology that the state currently utilizes. So top jobs is the the name for the rebranded flames methodology. So that process was led by the governor's
workforce cabinet and more so the the department of workforce development now um with the with the change at the workforce cabinet but they were tasked with updating the um claims methodology uh by the beginning of of this previous
year. Um so top jobs is is the new uh the rebrand of that. Um you can kind of see on the left some of the policy applications that top jobs will be utilized for. Uh for example, another thing that the commission invol is
involved in is the workforce ready grant and uh the eligibility for the workforce ready grant uses the flames methodology right now and will um adapt to utilizing uh the top jobs methodology. So I'll just again just a pretty high
level here on the on the methodology. Yeah. Well, maybe I'll do this I'll do this slide which will help answer that and then I'll say a little bit more. So it's just a um
you know using some sort of uh process and well let me let me let me share a little bit on top jobs and then and then go come back to that. So, um, for top jobs, um, you're taking different occupations,
um, and you're, uh, coming up with some sort of process to rank those the the demand for those those occupations. Um, but utilizing more than just um, demand,
right? So demand is a component but uh here with top jobs you can see that retention is one of the components, growth is one of the components and with the top jobs methodology one of the significant changes is that there um is
a is a higher earnings threshold that the state is not utilizing for scoring occupations. And Sam caller Larry great question. So this is a methodology, a mathematic methodology that was started some years
ago, I think originally by Steve Bronn when he was DWD commissioner. And it was a way to analytically say these are the jobs that we value including in the way funding flows uh from specifically DWD.
And over the years the commission didn't have as much input has some input now. And what we've tried to do with what Sam is talking about here with the credentials and values to say we should be considering all of these things. One agency over here, DWD, does the top jobs
and it's this formulaic way focused on demand and retention and the wages and those those kind of things that fairly typical uh but that we should also include those as part of the considerations correct me if I'm wrong there as the department of education
with our in with our informing those decisions determines what a credential of value is in high school. a lot of good work that's been done over gosh I don't know eight years or so probably not today maybe more than that at DWD
shop specific like something yeah that's exactly right Larry yeah so in each of the different sectors and so forth the formula says look these are the top jobs in you advanced manufacturing healthcare etc that uh fit
to the way especially funding flows out of DWD the the programs that support those in including for example through IvyTech. A lot of that, you know, is offered at IvyTech and and we just thought and it's not just us, but we and others thought, gosh, you've got this over here. It'd be
silly to also not incorporate that into the thinking. Yeah. And and admittedly, not you saying me, I mean, I I throw those terms around a lot and just think, oh, everybody knows those don't. So, thanks for raising that. Yeah. No, no, good question. And I would say over kind of as the commissioner
alluded to over the years the the flames methodology had been used for a greater and greater amount of different policy applications. For example, we use the flames methodology for secondary career technical education funding. So um
that's the state dedicates over $200 million in funding for secondary career and technical education programs right now. So we take every program, we do a crosswalk with different occupations to that program, kind of a fair representation of what are the
occupations that this program is aligning to. And each of those occupations is scored using utilizing the flames methodology currently. And then that determines whether that program is going to be a high value, moderate value or less than moderate value program um or for CTE funding. So
that's one policy application uh that is really important to to my direct work. Um and that is an example of something that will be switching over to this new top jobs methodology uh as well kind of as I put on the previous slide some of those different policy applications.
And Sam just one more further clarification because it's a great question there. The whole flame methodology as you might guess by now that it originated and now top jobs is yeah it's on fire right like you know the more intense I think the the fifth level yeah the fifth level man it was on
fire they're great jobs the supply is low we got to push more resources into this um for the training and education because man our society is just lacking in these and yeah invest our resources there. So that's been the evolution of it. Probably more than you care to know,
but that's been the evolution of it. That's why we thought it was really important to have that as part of the consideration. Yeah. Okay. So I guess the only thing I would say here again is the the retention element
is definitely um uh increased in in this new methodology. So that's kind of factoring the in the churn of an occupation. So if an occupation is having a lot of churn, it's going to um score more negatively in uh in this methodology. And then the
earnings threshold is is the other big change. On the left is um some of those earning thresholds. You can see the the state uh average wage that is being utilized there. Um so in a simplistic way of saying it is that
it kind of goes through this scoring process and then that earnings threshold is applied at the end. So it can really bump down something that otherwise would be scoring quite well um within the other components of the methodology.
Uh so just as an example some some uh types some occupations within healthcare uh in some of the initial review of this have um uh you know not not fared quite as favorably because they have high retention and they and
they may not have they may not meet the earnings threshold that's here. So like healthcare support type of positions but um okay so that's the top jobs methodology. So then we're taking that's scoring the actual occupations
and then in for this credential value process then they're um the the next the the step in the process is taking these different credentials and then linking them to occupations and then based on the occupations that
you've linked to that credential then you apply the scores to the from those occupations that we kind of went over on a previous slide. Um so probably that third bullet is most important there. Um the criteria that was utilized is that
um at least 15% of the job postings for the occupation uh include the core skills related to that credential. So there was um an effort made this was in partnership with with Litecast who who many of you might uh be familiar with to identify the core skills that are um
that that a credential is teaching and then linking those core skills through this uh through this occupational linkage process. The bottom part there then tells you a little bit about uh how the credential
is ultimately scored. Um so the first couple of components the top jobs piece is really factoring into those this signaling value that part I think we'll really be continuing to work on and refine through some of that employer
engagement process but the idea there initially is to kind of provide a a little bit of a bump for credentials that employers are specifically calling out in job postings. that's a little imperfect because you have certain industries
where uh it's much more common to really identify a particular credential. Say healthcare that tends to be more common. Advanced manufacturing not as common to actually identify an exact credential within a job posting. So continue to work on refining that
process, but through some additional uh employer input, standing up committees in that regard. Um I think that piece will will continue to to be an important part of the process. And then there was um a bonus kind of applied for what we
called stackability. So that really uh helped generally post-secary credentials, right? So maybe an industry certification and a 15 credit hour certificate score pretty similarly in terms of these other components that are
going into the score, but the 15 credit hour credential is more easily stackable uh to greater uh educational attainment. And so uh the score was kind of bumped up through that process. So that was my fairly high level
overview of of those couple components. I I we could really get into into these items. And so um if anyone is interested in doing so, just don't hesitate to to reach out afterwards. But that's kind of the the the overall process.
And then um so then we're going to apply it. So all the all the items have been scored and we the the need for this initial list largely was uh related to the new diploma requirements. So uh you
you've probably seen that item on the left with the diploma requirements. But just as this just kind of reminds you that uh for multiple of the seals a credential value is either required or it's an option to complete that uh credential.
And in the next couple slides, I'll just kind of walk through where we landed in terms of the el the eligible list of credentials for those different seals. So the enrollment honors plus deal that's the one where um the different
public the different uh institutions in the state are offering automatic enrollment that was announced in April for um for in for students who complete that credential. So the the threshold of the credential here is is a little higher with that item in mind in in
particular. Uh so you have to earn a 30 credit hour uh postsecary credential. So for the the highest volume one I anticipate there will be the the Indiana College Corps, but there are other uh credentials that individuals could earn
uh in a more you know specified uh career pathway if uh if they're doing a 30 credit hour um healthc care specialist credential or or something uh to that effect. And then there are a lot of associates degrees on the on the list
as well. Obviously, a a smaller percentage of students will earn an associates degree uh but they are included on uh the enrollment honors plus seal list. And then for the employment seal,
there's the regular employment seal and then the employment uh honors plus seal. Uh this is a little bit more complicated um ju just just for a few different reasons. But uh in in this area you can
earn an individual credential or you can maybe you can combine credentials within a um particular career cluster. Uh and the example on the next slide will kind of uh give you a an idea of what that could look like. But the employment seal
obviously a much broader range of credentials. So you have the postsecondary credentials, but you're also going to have uh the various industry certifications, uh licenses, etc. that uh a student could earn oftentimes through a a current technical education pathway, but
in in any number of any number of ways. Okay. So, uh, the rest of this, uh, is I'm going to give one example here particular to, uh, credential value, but then we're going to kind of do a just a student profile, an example of a student
walking through a a CTE pathway throughout high school and earning a credential, doing workbased learning, etc., just to kind of help conceptualize uh, what a an ideal student journey might look like. But first, uh, here is a healthcare example that kind of speaks
to the, um, the the the couple sites previously. So, this is one of our CTE programs of study. Uh and through that program of study there are opportunities for uh industry
certifications. Also opportunities if the students doing dual credit um taking all the classes for dual credit much of you know similar to what we heard uh this morning they may be able to build towards um a 15 credit hour postsecary credential or um all the way to the 30
credit hour technical certificate. So here you can see they could combine a couple of the um initial certifications that you could earn uh along a healthcare pathway. So a CNA and then onto a a CMA. And if they combine those credentials that would that would meet
the requirement for the employment um seal. And then if they did go on do all the dual credit get the complete technical certificate that could be a route to completing either the enrollment uh requirements or the employment seal.
All right. Any questions on credentials of value, some of that initial information? Otherwise, I'm going to turn it over to Lindsay to kind of walk through a u a student exam. Yes. How many total credentials of value have been identified as qualified?
I uh I should know the answer to that, but I I didn't. Yeah, but that it's a lesser amount than that. Let me get back to you. But it is still a decent amount of um uh maybe two to 300. Okay. Yeah, I know it's being narrowed
down over the last Yeah. Yeah, it was probably cut in half. Yeah, it was pretty pretty big the first pass. Thank you. Good afternoon, commission members. I'm just going to walk you through a
hypothetical student um to sort of break some of this down and hopefully um see how all these big ideas um would affect an actual person uh going through their high school experience. So, this is our hypothetical student,
Morgan. And Morgan is an incoming freshman um who has identified an interest uh in becoming a network administrator, which is really impressive as a 14-year-old that she knows what that is. Um and we're crediting her taking a PCC course in 8th
grade uh to learn about that, right, with our career exploration. We'll talk a little bit more about how the PCC course fits into this um as I'm going through. She knows she wants to attend a 4-year college to get a bachelor's degree in cyber security. Um, but she's
nervous about being able to afford that. So, as I said, uh, Morgan may have learned about this idea of being a network administrator, what that is, what that could mean for her in home preparing for college and careers course or PCC as we call it. Um this is a
course a course that is legislatively required for all Indiana students. Um that was originally uh I think the class of 34 that that would be um but with the high school redesign it has been updated
to um any student graduating under the new diploma. So that's the 2029 cohort. Um this course can be taken in 8th grade. Um it is eligible for CTE funding. Um I think it's $150. Yeah. Um
so any student enrolled in PCC in the fall as as early as 8th grade um that enrollment would be funded at $150 for schools uh to support that programming. Um it is considered a foundational course. Um and it meets the
legislatively required college and careers graduation requirement. um we revamped the standards to meet the legislative requirement in 1002 um of 2023 and we divided the standards into
five core areas. So they are exploring self, exploring careers, exploring post-secary opportunities, making a plan and then success skills. So sort of that foundational level for students to know
what their options are. um to start exploring what they might be interested in, what skills and aptitudes they already possess um so that they're set up when they go to high school to decide what they might want to pursue. So for Morgan, our student, um this is a
possible pathway that she might take in high school. So this is our cyber security and information assurance pathway. That's a mouthful. um it is aligned to IvyTech post-secary courses and I'll give you a little bit more um
insight into that in a second. Uh it stacks into an associates degree. Um and it has embedded certifications. So in the coursework that Morgan will do in these courses, she will be prepared to earn industry certifications,
specifically CompTIA A+ and CompTIA Security Plus. Um, and those industry certifications are valuable on their own, but also stack into IvyTech credit. So, it's sort of double bang for your buck with those certifications. On top
of that, uh, Indiana reimbures industry certifications um, to schools. So, when Morgan does the certifications in her class, her school gets reimbursed for the cost of those certifications. So, it's zero out of pocket for Morgan, zero out of pocket
for her high school um for her to earn those industry certifications. So, we put together a little sample uh schedule that Morgan might adopt in your supplemental materials. That paperclip packet that was on your table, um the
very last page, it's very colorful. It looks kind of like this. um is a larger schedule um that shows all the different courses that Morgan might take. So this one is just a smaller version of that. So as we said in 8th grade, Morgan will
take PCC. She'll be introduced to these different career options. She might take an introductory course if she knows she wants to do something in computers. Um so we have an introduction to computer science and digital technology. that's a course she might be able to take to
further explore if that's something she thinks she wants to do. Um, and then on this slide here, and I'll show you her sophomore or her junior and senior year on the next slide. Um, these are just personalized electives. So, with the diploma redesign, there is space for a
lot of personalized electives for students. Um, so just focusing on those will show you how Morgan can not only uh earn credentials, right? um but also meet her diploma seal requirements. Um
on the larger form we gave you, we also show you some of the other courses you might take might take that meets those diploma requirements. So um in the the slide here and on the document you have courses that are highlighted in blue are
courses that could be used to meet the enrollment seal requirements. And then courses that are highlighted in orange um are those that could be used to meet the uh employment seals. Okay. So on the
uh sophomore year you can see Morgan can already start earning post-secary credits, right? So, if her school has a partnership with IvyTech, because this is an IvyTech aligned program, um Morgan can get six credits uh of post-secary
credit in her sophomore year. The reason for that is the way our CTE courses are set up. Um each yearong CTE course embeds two post-secary courses. So, in that first semester, she'll complete one
IBT course. In that second semester, she'll complete a second IVTech course um earning not only her two high school credits but also six IVTech post-secary credits. So that is how she can advance
with all of these things um while in high school. Then in her junior and senior year that picks up even more. Um you can see additional uh post-secary credits she'll earn embedded in her CTE courses. Um on
your larger version you can also see there are numerous courses that would meet the IC. We just didn't fit them on the slide. It would have been impossible to see. Um so simultaneously Morgan can be earning an uh her sorry her IVTech
certificate or technical certificate and the ICC. So she can be doing both of those simultaneously depending on her school's offerings their post-secary partnerships. Um and then there are a couple of courses here. So we've talked a lot today about dual credit and dual
enrollment options. There are a couple of courses in her senior year that would be dual enrollment um where she would go on campus to an IvyTech campus to complete those courses, but most of them are eligible for dual
credit. So, another part of the seals that Sam talked about um and all of our CTE pathways um is work-based learning. So, I'm going to turn it back over to Sam and he'll talk a little bit about that.
Does anybody have any questions for me specifically at the moment? All right, just a few more slides here and then we will wrap up. Um so yeah, probably the other uh big piece of the diploma that particularly our team has
been uh supporting the the department in implementing are the workbased learning requirements. So there's a lot of different questions about what's going to count for these hour requirements. Um you you may have heard some of the you know there there's not enough placements for all these students and you know some
of the the concerns that kind of u came about throughout the process. So we've been uh working through a lot of things related to that. So, want to just uh share a little bit here about um you know what what it could look like. You can see here the actual workbased
learning hour requirements just as a reminder for um the different seals. Um and then kind of where we've landed with the department is for those different SEAL requirements um a student can do anywhere from one to three different
experiences. So, um they might just do one experience that meets all the hour requirements, but they may do some shorter term experiences and they can do up to three uh different experiences. All right. So, in our example here, uh
in 11th grade, this is an example of something that would count for some work-based learning hours, but would not require the student to uh leave their school. it it's still engagement with an employer, but if there's no transportation limitations or or
whatever the case might be. This is an example of a way a student could um still acquire some workbased learning hours. Um so in this example, uh she's taking part in one of the courses that uh Lindsay just mentioned and a local
company is going to come in. They're going to present an issue to a class, you know, real life issue, an actual situation that the uh employer is encounting uh encountering and the students are going to have that you know direct engagement with industry
professionals. Uh but they're going to be given a task and uh you know asked to to create some sort of solution for um the company. So, uh you know in this particular example was that maybe that that uh ends up being 75 hours of um
what what of work-based learning that uh her and others in her class might be able to earn uh towards those requirements uh by completing that project over the course of the semester. Maybe some inside the class, maybe you know outside of the class to some
extent. um but it could be done uh on site. And then in her senior year, she's going to do a more traditional workbased learning example that probably first comes to mind for us, finding an internship at a uh a local company uh
that is uh you know related to her pathway uh and dedicating a certain portion of time uh in one of the in her capstone cores. it they they it provides time for the student to do work-based learning uh
within the within the confines of that course. So they can leave school, go to their workbased learning placement uh and do those hours over the course of uh a semester, over the course of the whole year. All right. So we've got our student
which we kind of walked through uh some of it here and then the again the full list of courses was provided as a as a separate one pager but in that particular example uh she earned 56 high school credits. So um which is a pretty
normal amount of of high school credits that that a student could earn. uh she would meet the requirements for both the um the basic employment deal, the employment honors and then the enrollment honors plus deal. That's one of the things I think that we're
especially in our CTE programs, right? We want to um convey this idea that that um it can be both, right? The student can be uh it's not an either or option. um that earning the ICC plus earning
credits towards a more specified um career area can be a great um an ideal opportunity for students. So in this case, she earns the ICC um but also earned the full technical certificate uh through IvyTech plus would have the
opportunity for those certifications um that Lindsay mentioned. Of course, have to pass those and everything, but would have the opportunity uh to earn those those certifications. And then to hopefully kind of tie that all back together,
this is an example uh career ladder um that we we put together for some of our different pathways. Um but you can see here the different credential opportunities that are embedded within that pathway. And then we've
listed here in this particular example where those credentials fall on the the credential value list. So this is cyber security uh you know obviously a high demand area uh and those credentials um
very very well on uh the credentials of value list. And so uh you can see kind of as you kind of progress across here to the right the the credentials that you would first have the opportunity to earn and as you continue down the pathway again this concept of
stackability the uh credentials that you would uh continue to have the opportunity to earn maybe in high school or maybe you get close in high school and you uh you know finish up uh through another year at IvyTech or or another institution or whatever uh the case
might be. Right. So, we have any other uh questions on um this piece? Oh, that's right. May I just uh No questions. I just think that was really well done. I laid that all out. This thing on. There we go.
that was really well laid out and I appreciate that. So, thank you. It was easy to understand and working through from start to finish there is super helpful. So, thank you. Good. We did have your uh I I know you brought up the the PCC course the last meeting, so we kind of wanted to to tie
that in and a few other things that had come come to mind, but um yeah, I know that sometimes uh folks kind of I I think I know what a CT pathway is, but hopefully that uh helps conceptualize it and also within the the structure of the new diploma,
the things that you're seeing, how um how going through a CT pathway can meet a lot of those requirements. that are in the new diploma requirements. Yeah, I was going to say something similar. Sorry, Larry. Um Sam, Lindsay, thank you very much. That was for a very
complicated subject that is still evolving, if you will. That was really well presented and uh clear. I know it's still evolving and it's not going to be implemented completely here for a few years other than for those early adopters, if you will. Um just a macro
question and you may not know the answer to this. um off top of your head, but with specific to CTE. Yeah. How many total Indiana students go through the CTE program? And do you know
of those students, what percentage of them go right into the workforce versus going uh on to some form of postsecary? Uh yeah, a good question. I'll give some some broad numbers. we've kind of uh
we've tried to break out our enrollments in the last couple years to get a to get a better sense on that because so for example that PCT course is technically a CTE course so pretty much every student takes that right so that we call like an
explorer if they only do that then we've got uh we normally call it a participant if they take kind of the first course in an actual pathway then we have CTE concentrator which is Uh it's the it's a
it's one of the ways to meet current graduation requirements is being a CT concentrator. That's taking three courses in a pathway and basic and that's basically the employment seal requirement now too, right? The three courses in a pathway. Uh last year it was around 45% of the cohort was a CT
concentrator. So uh that's you know a pretty nearly half of the of the graduating cohort. and then we call it a completer if they go on from there and take that capstone class. Um that was around 8,500 students uh last year. So
that gives you a sense of kind of um the um the different levels of participation. Uh as far as the other question um when we last ran I know we were just talking about the college going rate. Um, I'm trying to remember
the exact number, but it is only slightly less the college going rate for CTE concentrators. Maybe about 5 percentage less percentage point. I I literally was going to say it's 48%.
Okay. Yeah. About five. So, or yeah, we'll call it Yeah, four or five% less than the um Yeah, the college rate or the population as a whole. Um, so cool. Thank you. Yeah. You made a comment. Hopefully somebody who's developing thought would
manage all this. Yeah, lots of people territorial. Are there any commission members questions or comments? I'm going to do this again because I should. Uh Lindsay and Sam are also
being real stepped up uh and continue to um and I and I also especially for those of you who might be new to the commission uh people on this body and others of us had a strong opinion for a long time the CTE regards the issue.
I think you all are seeing why we have had that thought. Um these folks have just such great insight into uh and bring such clarity. You you mentioned it Dan. It is this a complex or complicated
thing. uh ju just this and their understanding of it and not just understanding it but how they see the connection from K12 to employment to postsecary
is really good and um maybe I'll try to never say this again but this part of state government was bounced around across agencies for a decade and was wholly under elaboration in my opinion and it's been so important
and so good for the CTE team to be part of CG. I I hope we all it it's something I just don't think anybody thinks about anymore. It's like oh yeah, you know, we're all just part of the team. We just work together and help each other etc. Uh but I think what you saw here to thank you for saying that I agree this
is this is complex and he all laid it out just so well. um you know whether anybody have any background or understanding it in this at all could follow that presentation get a good grasp of it and it's it's coming through in really important work to help
students have much better outcomes. So um I'm I'm going to really pay for this later with a lot of people. I'm embarrassed today but but they have not only stepped up but you're in the right spot uh at the commission and it's it's going to benefit our fellow Hoosiers.
Thank you every Thank you so much. Well, that brings us to the end or almost the end of our meeting. Uh thank you all for very much for being here and sticking with us. And for those uh online, I know a couple folks had to leave and I think are on the line, Kathy and and others. Um thank you for for
being here. Um you will note that uh information items uh in the booklet your academic degree programs awaiting action uh starting on page 31 academic degree program actions taken by staff on page 33 and media coverage information which
we always appreciate getting throughout the throughout the month but also identified in the book on page 39. So, um, with that said, is there any other old business other than me can comment about the media coverage? Yeah, just
briefly. Um, so I I have to say that among folks I've talked to, there really isn't an awareness that these program things are about career counseling, about helping information. It is being received by the public as if a huge ax
is being wielded. So, I just wanted to make that point. Uh, you look at the media coverage, it would be nice to see something a little bit more in line with what's been agree. Um, and and we're going to be pursuing that. And thank you for
mentioning that because related, you may have noticed I was using some talking points this morning because I didn't want to miss anything and so was Matt. and we will get to all of you talking points so that you're having conversations and whether that's oneonone or you know in an organization
with which you're associated you'll have some of these too and no quiz on or anything like that but we want to equip you well enough to be able to talk about those because uh we we want to help straighten out the understanding of these things and thank you for saying that.
Thank you, Ted, very much. And again, welcome to the commission. Any other uh old business, uh any new business that we need to accomplish? Any final words of wisdom from commission members, staff, anyone in the public? All right. Well, again, thank you very much. Our next meeting is on September 18th in
Jasper. So, with that, I will call this meeting to the turn. Thank you all.