##VIDEO ID:RpWKhLWgHCQ## e e e e e e e e e e e good evening you ready to call this meeting to order Marne would you please call the rooll council member Steve fredman hello council member Deb Gillis Merry Christmas council member buddy Bender here vice mayor Don Horton hi here and Sh mayor Sharon Mahoney here we have a quorum thank you I'm reading my sheet and it says mayor ask someone to lead the pre pledge Marne so would you please lead us in the Pledge of Allegiance [Laughter] Marne I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible with liberty and justice for all thank you okay um any requests for deletions or emergency uh start with Steve uh mayor if I can I just want to have on the council communication I wanted to just ask a question about where we're at with the TDR ordinance so um so you want me to put you down mayor counc it's your pleasure yes okay I'll do that Don Steve go ahead please um I can save for mayor council communication what would you like well you have to tell me what it is what do you want to I want to talk about um I want to talk about public comment period and uh Council um talking time okay Mr Pender no I have nothing and Miss Gillis can we delete the entire agenda oh I guess not never mind okay and one um one sec I'm going to put a brief discussion about Angler's Reef under the mayor council communication just so you guys know okay now go ahead Mr Pender let's rock and roll it's the holidays let's rock and roll it's a holiday holidays okay I don't know what that means but okay all righty then so that's done Don would you like to start with the mayor council Communications yeah I uh thank you mayor um I just had a question on I know that there have been discussion uh in many previous Council meetings before about the the pending TDR ordinance and I know that was on the list of your big giant to-do list and I just kind of wanted to have an update on where we're at with that because the discussion that we had on Tuesday that's going to help you know lessen those those numbers as we plug along and so I'm interested in that sure absolutely um yes it's been on our our list for a while as as some of you or all of you may know the department has been extremely short staff we've been down a couple staff members we had somebody start um last week um so we're getting her up to speed um and so we're getting ready to get back into some of those bigger projects now um I've um been working on redoing my uh Gant chart that I had presented to the previous Council so when I get that redone and you know fully established I'll bring that back to this Council but my intent right now is to um bring that to the LPA in February and then that would be be first reading in this Council likely in March of next year that's my thank you Steve would you like to go next yeah um I just wanted to talk uh to everyone a little bit about um public comment period especially tonight since it's a quasi judicial um hearing essentially that uh I would I would encourage um uh a little bit of leeway in terms of of time it's it's a lot of information that we're going to hear tonight and for the public to come up and and have maybe 3 minutes or five minutes to get all that out is is rather difficult as as as we also uh in the same vein as Council should uh be as responsible as we can to be as uh short and succinct to the point because I'm sure we all noticed a lot of people leaving the meeting during some of the filibustering that was going on at the last meeting so I would encourage maybe even for ourselves to hold ourselves to a shorter time period to get the the point out uh and always be able to come back around and speak again not to you're not just limited to that maybe as the public is so for tonight I would like to see either some leeway or maybe additional time given to the public when they speak so we can also have an opportunity to question them and and their statements and that uh for us going forward to just try and keep it as short as we can um I don't know if John you want to chime in here but I I agree with you wait let me finish I agree with you that we have to also be respectful that there's five of us up here and everybody wants a chance to speak so try to be mindful about the amount of time we each take and uh um I agree with you that it was a lot going on on Tuesday night so thank you go ahead let me remind everybody speaker Mike Oni judicial they have as long as they want there's no three minutes on that that's what that's what I was going to say testimony but that that's not correct it's it's a 3 minute 5 minute as well okay I thought maybe we must change it and again I would appreciate it if you guys up here raise your hand to speak as so we don't speak over each other okay yes ma'am okay Steve are you done okay um I asked Frank to put up something for me I've been working with the homeowners association at Anglers Reef on wendley key they have a a problem with parking um if I can get that up there and again this is just for you guys to all start thinking about I appreciate any input you may have um part of the problem with anger's reef is it's really tight inside there and so as a result we get people with cars and their trailers um in the medium what I call the medium between the old road in us one so we came up with the trailers would go to be rented or pay rent to be at SD Marine so that would take care of their trailers and then if you see we have the hammock with three parking places some hammock three parking places and my thought was that the homeowners association would be responsible for those parking places uh fee and the care can all be worked out um I agree with Mr Horton about uh we do need some paid parking but there's some areas that it would be impossible and you know to do paid parking when someone's at a r residents for like 24 hours unless 3: in the morning they want to run downstairs with their quarter so that we may want to do a parking study for the village to see what would work I had talked to Jennifer about that and I don't know what her thoughts are but this is not set in stone I'm open to anything but we have to address the problem in that section of windley key because if we don't do something now it's just going to go back to the way it was so this is my suggestion and uh I don't know if uh Scott is here he's a president of the homeowners association if he'd like to say something is that okay with everybody yeah so okay come on up there well on the podium you can come up here if you want to hi I've been in Anglers uh since 2010 um since 2010 we've always gotten to use I mean look Anglers Reef there's homeowners that live there full-time there's homeowners that it's their vacation home they use it a vacation home some people uh do vacation rentals and they also use it as their as their vacation home the major problem of what we've had is the homeowners like myself right my driveway fits two cars and when like Thanksgiving my my kids came my in-laws came there's nowhere to park I mean it was a nightmare and it's not just me I'm president of the association so I get all the phone calls and I get at least a dozen phone calls a month since July since we stopped parking there the trail aren't aren't a problem we've got that that's easily worked out but the automobiles I mean you know you can't somebody to expect somebody to park and take a freebie you know to park the car and come come over um and it's just you know you want take your buddy fishing for the day there there just there is nowhere to park so um you know what was taken away that we've been using for over 15 years we' like to somehow get it back and I agree it should be it looked horrendous out there before and we're all excited that maybe we can make something happen that looks nice and useful and uh we know to we would invite what we' like to see is something just for us in our in our section whatever other sections they want and we're happy to pay a monthly fee for to maintain it take care of it which can be worked out okay thank you thank you um again this is not set in stone but it was an issue and I got with uh Scott and we came up with what this could look like and could be so I'm open if Jennifer and John the legal ities and what you guys feel about this so well let Deb's raising her hand so let me go ahead Deb I'm trying to follow the rules oh well I said go ahead so um it's it's amazing I I think this is a great idea because I actually suggested that when we uh when the council put it in place because of the uh waterline workings that they couldn't park there anymore and then it would continue on that um something come about about uh we find a lot we we try to help them find a lot something because of the fact that they we've used that parking in this Village for I don't know how many years uh and it's probably prior to Anglers Reef we were using it too so um I think it's a great idea and I'd like to see it move forward thank you Don yeah I I like it a lot I'd like to see us put pervious papers in there whatever you want so that we you know so we can take care of a good storm water management in that area uh the hammock and and the the the trees are wonderful I think it's a great idea and and and I think it's uh I think it's a great test area for us to see how it would work through the rest of the village I like it I like it thank you you guys have anything to say turn your mic on and speak we turn my mic on yes ma'am um what about fot is we have we talked to fot I mean Jennifer this is just the first step so I wanted to see just got how everybody feels John and I have talked about it in Jennifer and you know this is just the test thing to see and there's all kinds of hurdles we have to go through but I wanted you guys of course to have your input suggestions I wanted Peter to look at it AJ to look at it and okay you know we could form something really good here okay but I think Jennifer wouldn't you say we need to run this by fot as well um that's Village property it's Village right of way so I don't know I mean we could certainly run it by them but I don't know that they have any um approval Authority that's fine no that's fine that's what I'm saying it's better hey it's better that we ask them and we don't need it but you know we need to be on the good side of that and Steve do you have any thoughts um this so this is you're just asking that this is the beginning of the process to try and get this yes in go going yes okay I'm fine okay so go ahead so I was just going to make one more comment I think that I think what you're thinking of is that right away there that section is probably split the outside edge is f Dot and the side was Village so I guess then I would ask direction from Rob and John and Jennifer to move on forward with this okay yeah yeah I think I we understand the the council would like us to move forward and and three of us will work forward and uh hopefully be able to bring a uh a resolution and solution back um uh shortly oh I'm so happy oh good okay thank you very much um village attorney comment do we it's not in that section no this is just a discussion item and that was again why we move public comment after this so they could incorporate anything they wanted to speak in general y public comment don't do that so Village attorney Village manager communication please did you get the T you talk about what you wanted to oh that's I'm sorry that's me I'm like I don't have anything um so the only the one item I have is tab a on this um this is um you may recall back in August the um previous Council had voted a second reading approval of the temporary moratorium for administrative relief um upon the signature of that ordinance we rendered it to the Department of Commerce um Commerce then um asked for a phone conversation which I had with them in October they were prepared to appeal that ordinance um they felt that it was not compliant with our comprehensive plan they asked us to withdraw the rendering so that we could discuss um their issues and then come up with the path forward um I questioned why we were able to do a market rate moratorium and we weren't able to do an administrative relief one um and they noted that the village uh Village's building per allocation system section has a phrase that says unless otherwise Exempted by ordinance and the administra relief one doesn't so I think that's where they're saying it's not compliant uh I have not had any additional conversations with the Department of Commerce knowing that the council election was coming up I wanted to wait and see um before I we put any work into uh moving this forward I wanted to get um the council's opinion as to whether or not we wanted to rerender it as is and see what uh Commerce does with it you want me to work with Commerce and come up with something new or do you want me to just withdraw it completely those are pretty much the three options we have okay does anybody want to Express how they feel yeah I do go ahead D did you I do I can wait he's got his mic on we'll let him go okay I just said go ahead Don you know these people these people in that are stuck in in uh limbo in limbo in this administrative Le they they in good faith they spent a lot of money to get their surveys and their plans and make an application go through the review process they've waited four plus years if they're coming to us for admin administrative relief and seeking administrative relief and I I I just never agreed with the decision to put a moratorium on this and stick them in limbo and um I think they need to uhu I I I think we need to not have this moratorium and let these let these folks work their way through the system like they were told they would work their way through the system four plus years ago and and uh uh at least seek relief here in front of this Council okay buy well not not to mention that Don only they uh they paid a $1,500 fee after waiting for 4 years okay and then we go to try to put a moratorium on them it's not and building costs have risen so what it would have cost them you know four years ago is going to cost 25% more today or more so you know I agree I think they should our system is we told them what to do they followed our rules and our guidelines and our protocol and I think it's you know and now even the state coming back to us and appealing it and saying we we can't do that so we need to follow our guidelines if we tell somebody something we need to stick to our our guidelines that's all I have to say Deb would you like to go yes sure um actually I have brought this up a a couple times since I've been back and this was in front of me when I was on LPA and I probably was one of the few that I don't remember how the vote was but I voted that we should not be doing the administrative relief uh the other categories is a different idea um these people have waited in line U maybe there's other options that we can give them that's what part of re administrative relief is all about um but I don't think we ought to put a moratorium on that I'd like it to just to be gone away dissolved and Steve uh isn't there is isn't already in moratorium on this okay not on this category okay so we're just being asked to uh I thought we were being asked to lift it or to extend it what what is your feelings on that no I'm I I agree with Council I'm fine so what what I'm asking what I'm asking so there was one voted but before it can take effect it has to be approved by the Department of Commerce the Department of Commerce has said they are will not approve it as it's written because they don't believe it's compliant with our comprehens so I haven't had any further conversations with them yet but what I'm guessing they would request that we do is do an amendment to our comprehensive plan so that it could be compliant so before we went through that effort and that work I wanted to find out from this council do you want me to do that do you want to rerender it as is or do you want to withdraw it completely and not have a moratorium at all thank you for that yeah I think we're in agreement to withdraw it I believe go ahead I it's a perfect example of of Big Brother watching Big Brother and when somebody says you're making a mistake by doing this if a mistake is made Big Brother definitely is going to let us know especially when it's part of our comp plan and that's what they've done is responded and said that last Council really shouldn't have done what they approved and and they're letting us know do you want us to appeal do you want us to orchit or do you want to just forget about it and I think we just need to forget about it okay so is that good Jennifer you understand do you have anything I think we would want a formal vote to withdraw okay I'll make a formal motion to withdraw the oh never mind John says it's unnecessary okay oh Dad that was so good too darn it okay do you have anything Rob did you want to say something okay is you need a second I'll second it you it word different do you need a just a motion or do you I don't think it's necessary because honestly like like Jennifer and Don explained the options are do you want to fight Commerce do you want to change bring it back or do you want to just leave it be and what we're hearing is leave it be don't you know we're not authorizing you to fight Commerce through litigation we're not authorizing you to do something else I don't as long as you think you got what you need from us yeah I think so yeah okay good all right moving on public comment Marne and this is stuff that is not on the tabs and it's what you want to talk about so Marty would you who do you have well um we did have Mr ofstein if I don't know if he wants to speak again about anything else I just wanted to say thank thank everyone okay great um next up would be Ty Harris come on up Mr Ty good evening Council Ty Harris with the law firm of Tai Harris PA 110 Plantation Shores Drive Island marado Florida two things just quickly one thanks again for giving staff Direction on trying to solve this parking and beautification issue on windley key it's been going on for too long 15 years but it's also not fair to give people 30 days notice that we're not going to let you park there after you've been parking there for 15 years so I really appreciate the direction you gave to staff second everybody up here when they were running for a seat on Council supported affordable housing I have a affordable housing project to 42 units for the property just south of fiser in we're on our fourth round of comments we're getting very close to the end we thought that we would be able to use live local but after doing research discovered that and you may not know this but less than 20% of Isam marada has commercial or industrial zoning in fact it's closer to 15% until you hit that 20% threshold you can't actually use live local so that has now put us back into the CATE of the early out allocations and the early out allocations have a Prohibition against developing in a vzone this property is in a vzone even though the plans show that it's clearly going to be elevated 12T and the only thing on the ground is going to be parking but Jennifer and I have discussed it we're going to need to make a comp plan and a zoning change in order to finish this project and I would respectfully request that you expedite that because this thing just going to sit and as Don mentioned and council's mentioned construction costs just keep going up and that's one of the two barriers to actually doing new affordable housing in is Mara cost of property cost of construction I thank you for your time thank you Ty thank you Marne who's next van Canad we discussed the Anglers Reef problem and uh the staff uh Mr Cole said that the the landscape project was going to be from one end to the other and uh the the problem is that when the planning for Anglers Reef happened they uh that was the failure there was too much density and intensity in that in that um plan uh that didn't uh it's their they made their own problem and and the the uh the trailers and the cars there I would like to have been able to discuss this when we were discussing it and not have to waste my three minutes uh going over something that that uh needs to be uh talked about in in the general sense this is this is something that's uh serious and and it's going to cut into having a hammock from one end of windley key to the other down which is what we were promised so so you're going back on that and and and taking the the part of the of the Anglers Reef people I understand they've got a problem but their problem it was was made by their planners and by the people that sold them their property so if they have to go buy another lot to park their cars on that's that's not on us shouldn't be on us um we're going to have trouble in the next two years uh it's pretty obvious from the last meeting that we're going to have 32 votes and instead of instead of uh Larry Mo and Curley we're going to have Don and Debbie and Buddy and and the the three stoes of the conrete Coalition are going to rule what goes on in this room and I don't feel that we're uh going to be in a position to save Isam marada if everyone here is pro development and the people of Isam marada who elected the people to this Council uh are just as much to blame as the people who are pro-development that are sitting up there right now and uh we're going to be into discussion about about tdrs which uh we should have an in-depth discussion about that but we should have it when uh able cities east comes forward with a comp plan and with a with a uh uh ldr uh suggestions because 25 years ago when they came out with Tres I said the best thing to do with the 43 units from T from uh Plantation YT Harbor the 400q Ft motel rooms was to take those uh building rights out into the middle of the field and burn them because they you're going to make a a can of worms opened up once you do that and sure enough 25 years later we're still taking Creekside in with 400t rooms moving them down to to uh The Islander and we're and we're increasing the density and intensity of Isa marada by by 50 rooms and and those are not going to be affordable housing thank you van time's out yeah thank you very much I'll be back I know you will next morning Joe wishme yes Joe wishm Plantation key mayor and Council it was very disheartening at Tuesday's meeting after all the concerns that I brought up about the legality and conflict of interest that the village attorney nor any council member ask for clarification on those issues I guess that means that Mr Quick feels that everything was okay and that even an ordinary citizen can put an item on the agenda these decisions could lead to further scrutiny by residents tonight again you will be making decisions that will affect this community for decades and generations to come we all sit here and listen to council members talk about the good old days growing up with pristine reefs fishing and Diving compare those days to the overdevelopment traffic and declining reefs and water quality you should look back and decide if even more development is going to benefit our kids and grandkids if we continue in this direction that we are headed in only the second set of meetings this Council has already reverse decisions discussed and voted on by the previous Council and more than double the number of permits requested by The Village tonight you will also be hearing items heard and denied or deferred by previous Council the decisions that you make tonight will let all residents know if you are going to look out for and protect our fragile ecosystem and environment like you promised in your campaigns or bow down to developers and contractors your main concern should be Workforce housing like a apartment buildings not affordable housing which is not affordable for most of our Workforce and have rent controls on them as well this would benefit all businesses that now either cannot find employees or have to come down by bus from Miami or Homestead why must you make these drastic decisions now instead of waiting for our new comp plan and ldrs to be completed decisions made now may not even be in compliance with the new plans putting a moratorium on or at least defer major decisions like The Islander Creekside in and others would seem to be the right thing to do at this time your legacy and the future of our community is in your hands last Council spoke about losing some properties on our tax roll so that all of our taxes would go up yet you like you let places like Legoland Sun Country pay $80 a year per lot in taxes while the rest of us pay much more than that our fair share if you cannot fix this problem then maybe you should get your lobbyist to look into this because it is costing us millions of dollars a year whilst they still want the support of all of our services like police fire and other Village Services paid for with our tax dollars thank you thank you very much Marne next is Sue Miller I came with bills on tonight Sue Miller lower mumbi representing the alamara Community Alliance this agenda tonight is 719 pages long I've been attending most Council meetings since we incorporated over 25 years ago the agenda tonight has some of the most difficult to comprehend and challenging complexities for you to judge I attended 18 public hearings when we created The Village comprehensive plan originally and I know know it pretty well but in order to understand and judge tonight's agenda items I had to go back to that aging comp plan and the ldrs to reread the zoning requirements the TDR regulations and site plan approval yes they are in desperate need of updating and they are extremely confusing 719 Pages what's with all the reports like for affordable housing more than a decade old used by the applicants tonight times have changed and with it the statistical information to make educated decisions as members of council making critical decisions tonight I hope that you also studied the village regulations even the professional planners can miss some of the intricacies of our regulations and some of the out-of-date regulations and conflicts that pushed us to plan a total review and update by an outside planning agency the decisions you make on issues tonight must be carefully considered to assure that the rules are followed the process is fair not only to the applicants but also to Future applicants and prior applicants that all deserve the equal treatment according to the regulations we hear about the applicants property rights but remember their neighbors and the entire Village are also impacted by your decisions we also have property rights and the right to quiet enjoyment Etc is this agenda tonight fair to you on the council is it fair that these public hearings were delayed for months and now you have 719 pages to review just a month after you were sworn in after a contentious agenda two days ago that required considerable amounts of your time thought and research did you have time to give these items a fair analysis the staff has had since April of 2022 when The Islander application was submitted to get us to this point four new council members and a couple new managers and virtually a new planning department since that application was first submitted the code says the staff review is to be done in 30 days and then presented at the first council meeting after the review was completed it apparently took a few years for the review and now the council is given a couple days to absorb the details and either rubber stamp or do a serious review itself The Village code says one or more public hearings are required perhaps in complex issues that could have such serious repercussions a second public hearing should be considered Alam marada and all of the county has serious concerns as to evacuations day-to-day traffic a struggling environment a affordable housing public hearings are required when a project could have significant impact on a community never rush through your decision making without careful examination of the impact thank you your job is certainly a tough one tonight thank you thank you s thanks s um buddy did you want to say something okay all right go ahead Marney we don't have anyone else okay so just I uh wanted to just address that's what oh my mic won't come on now that's might be on purpose there it is all right here we go thanks uh just so the public knows when Van's talking about uh Angler's wreath the the former property was tropical wreath Hotel the menas owned it all right and there was 52 units that the people and Key West lought and they did one for one and that's how they got that they built angers Reef there was already 52 units on the property it was anger's Reef it was tropical Reef Hotel is what it was it was the units plus the couple houses they had there all right so that that was done many years ago uh it was cortex out of Key West a group that did that um anyways I you know if if if somebody wants to look they can find out 52 units was what can respond to that uh no I'm just letting the public know Mr muck represented the the people at the time so I I'm just I I know because I was in the meeting when it all uh got approved all right so can I respond to that no no sorry we don't well let me just say this all I did for Angler's Reef was bring up a thought you'll have time to make your comments when it comes back to us in different shapes and forms so nothing's a done deal right now so you'll have time no we no can we just move on please are you done yeah I'm done okay we're done with that yeah all right I just wanted the public to know I know you did okay so um Mr wishire I said I'd let you speak about the meeting schedule change and I'm going to be a person of my word so would you like to yes I would before we Madam mayor if we're opening it for Mr wishire will'll open up for for everyone if anybody else yes Joe wishm Plantation key just as a reminder hang on just so are we opening that that tab yeah look we're moving on to the the motion from the motion section from lastation yeah know I I obviously I didn't get the printed out copy to the copy for everyone go ahead and Mr Mayor before I start if you could remind everybody what this is about oh this is our schedule change the I guess there was some conflicts for next year's schedule yeah on Tuesday night there was some scheduling conflict so they gave us the dates that were an issue and asked the four five of us to come back with when we want to move things to simple as that yes Joe wishire Plantation key regarding the uh schedule for next year I would like you to seriously consider going back to meetings two weeks apart I remember that they used to be like on every second Tuesdays and Thursdays I have brought this up in the past when there were 800 to 1,000 pages in the agenda packet the amount of staff time required to research and put together that big of packet takes away from other duties and responsibilities for council members to review and properly research that many pages in less than a week is unreasonable this week's agenda is almost 900 Pages again since council members are required to live in the Village I don't see why we can't and it would make more sense to have two weeks apart giving the public and Council more time to review before two extra long meetings within two days is asking too much please consider this and correct this problem on behalf of Staff council members and Village residents thank you thank you Joe does anybody else want to comment on our meeting dates before we talk about it go ahead van it better be about the meeting meeting dates absolutely okay uh I've stood here several times and pointed out the fact that in the first uh Charter of this Village it was uh put in print uh after much discussion and back and forth that uh the first and third Thursdays of every month should be the the meeting um for our uh Village so which is what Mr wishm just said I'd like to follow up and reiterate that the first and third Thursdays are something that the village population can hang their hat on they can look at the calendar and say well there's the first Thursday here's the second Thursday and those are the days that we're going to have a meeting and and because the staff chose uh that it was it was too much trouble for them to set up and break down twice a month they did they went for every 3 weeks which broke up the whole Continuum which broke up the entire uh uh system that people had been hanging their hat on for years and and we we keep turning up with these multi hundred pages of uh of fluffed up uh agendas that that aren't necessary if we would go by if we would go by um um three go by our our original charter which was the the reason that it was done was a good reason and it worked for years and suddenly we're we're doing a Tuesday Thursday and we're doing our all of our land stuff on Thursday and and this is this is not uh U kosher this is not uh what the the village set out to do and it's it's proven to be a real burden on the public to understand and know what's going on out of a 7 to 900 page agenda and and and Mr wishm also pointed out it's not fair to you to be to be crunched like that in other words these agendas are packed and stacked and they're done with with with something for a reason and the reason that we we should have more meetings and the meetings that that were originally designated by this the original Council and put into The Village Charter but you know the the charter uh was changed because of a waiver now any three of you can make a waiver so they made a waiver that we're going to do it Tuesdays and Thursdays you know we can do it once a month we you know it's it's just untenable that you should choose the fact that you can make a waiver you can make a waver to to go from 104 units to 250 units you know but it takes uh 6 months supposedly in the law before that is uh Revisited but if you have a waiver you can do it uh next week which we just did and so you know we are not being well served by by people with an agenda making waivers and getting around the law with their waivers thank you thank you anyone else Marty um no one else has signed up for this well I'm not going to let the staff take the fall for this it was me I'm the one who moved the meetings suggested moving the meetings to Tuesday Thursday to give us three weeks off in case we wanted to do a workshop within that time or something else came up we have a lot of other business just besides a meeting so I guess it was me and the council at the time agreed with me so here we are are again now with if anyone wants to try to wants to change it I'm open for it but if you want to leave it as it is let's move forward with changing the dates I I don't want to change it but I just wanted to comment is that that it's it's very consistent uh month after month of when the meetings are handling so you know the the 3- we was an idea of of um we were having meetings every other week as van was alluding to and we thought that they were very short meetings for the most part and so we wanted to spread it out and we couldn't we just couldn't bring ourselves to do only one meeting a month one night a week so that's why we went to three this this two in one week is working pretty well so anybody else yeah I mean uh I see both sides of the issue my my situation um is is is similar to what Miss Miller spoke about in terms of trying to gather all this information in such a short amount of time very very difficult um and such complex situations like what we're going to hear this evening also I've already seen some conflicts that I'm going to have for um some meetings when we have them Tuesdays and Thursdays uh because I'll be out of town so if there is that one a couple weeks later then I might miss one and not both and so I'm I'll I'll defer to the to the council here and how they want to schedule it but um to me I could go either way Don I'm happy with schedule the way it is Buddy okay do we need to vote or are we good to move forward okay the schedule set by the that format is set by resolution anyway so um all right so uh does anybody have any suggestions or Deb and I spend a few minutes Deb would you like to read the dates that we suggested see if you guys are okay with them sure so the we have three sets of dates that it looks like there's conflict and Steve if you have a week that's bad week you just need to let us know and we can try to adjust that week we can Mo um uh so the first conflict was in March and that I believe that's the league of cities Florida Keys Florida Keys days I'm sorry I've got the wrong one on the wrong month so uh our original schedule says the 11th and the 13th um if we move it to the 18th and the 20th then that leaves the Florida Keys day available for us to attend um we would travel on the 12th I think it's the 13th and the 14th maybe the morning of the 15th uh so that um that just moves it one week um farther into the month so that would be the 18th and the 20th so you're moving two days on that yeah both of the meetings is that a problem moving it to all in one week trying to keep up with you okay it's just a suggestion March what 18 18 and 20 instead of 11 and 13 is that with your schedule that's that's better for me yeah good and if you have an issue just tell us well we're going over now so okay okay let us know now August the next one is August and I believe that's uh League of cities right League of cities annual event so um the same thing occurs it's it's towards the end of the week and so if we move that one a week earlier uh to the fifth and the 7th uh that allows us to do the the annual event and in the following week is when we start into budget work so therefore you know it gives us a little space in between to do a couple other things in our lives too my God just give me a date I'm sorry just give me a date okay well sorry August 5th seven Fifth and seven okay great let's do okay and then in November election day is the 11th um how about if we move that one to the 10th and the 13th that's a Monday and a Thursday that we that way we don't get on top of Thanksgiving and yet we can still have our two meetings if we can get everything done in one we could cancel the second one is everybody okay with did everybody follow those dates the 10th and the 13 is November got ites that work does that work okay for staff is that good for you uh Monday night what she just spoke about yeah those are good okay good good thank you and you just let me know yeah well yeah just let us know okay all right another month that you have a problem with uh I'm looking now I have a problem with the Florida Keys days I'm not going to be able to do that um yeah well we can't move we moved the meeting but we can't move I don't have to go that's fine you guys can go represent um I yeah I think I'm I'm pretty much oh and then um did we do something in July no we didn't yeah the 8th and the 10th are going to be difficult to me would anybody be open to say 15 17 it's okay with me it's okay with if it helps you that's not a cross mini season right when's mini season that's the following does that help you the following week we is that okay the 15th and the 17th buddy I don't care you don't care Don just tell me okay so we'll move July to the 15th and 17th Marne is that good is that good for you Steve anything else is that okay yes that's it we don't that's it we hit something on staff and we can always we we can always if somebody can't be here we can zoom they can we can we can figure it out all right so uh so do you need a motion on this or what yes if you could do a motion to uh just approve the meeting calendar as amended okay call I'm looking for a motion to approve the calendar is we just did it I'll make a motion to move the calendar as uh just described I'll second okay Mary would you please call the role council member Deb Gillis yes council member Steve fredman yes council member buddy Pender yes vice mayor Don Horton yes and mayor Sharon Mahoney yes that motion passes 5 to Z thank you okay thank you very much and I believe we moving on to uh Mr quck we are in the ordinances which is uh this is an ordinance it's tab B it's an ordinance on first reading uh it's an ordinance of is Village violence Florida extending the temporary moratorium established pursuant to ordinance number 23-10 relating to the acceptance of new market rate residential building permit allocation system uh bass applications with or without land educations providing for severability providing for conflicts providing for the transmittal of this ordinance to the State Department of Commerce and providing for an effective date upon the approval of this ordinance by the State Department of Commerce this is the village currently has um and has had in place uh a uh a moratorium on accepting any new building permit uh market rate uh building permit applications it does not impact those that are already in the system it's just on the acceptance of new applications um it has been pending it will be uh one year in February and that's when the uh the the uh the current moratorium will expire it was originally enacted as a six-month moratorium with the ability to extend it it has been extended one time and there was discussion uh requesting staff to bring it back for a consideration of a second extension uh for the building for uh for the new market rate applications um I will say from the legal standpoint there is one thing that I would like to mention Under The Bert Harris act there is a um uh an exception to any or a a Prohibition on any claim where an alleged uh taking took place for one year or less so uh arguably by extending this moratorium somebody I just pointed somebody could argue that there is a uh a taking and we wouldn't be able to to wave that exemption in the that's built into the statute up so I would say there's a there's a slight uh risk to somebody being able to potentially make a um uh a valid claim uh there are a number of factors that go into it but I do feel it important to at least mention to you all that that provision in the statute won't apply because we'll we'll be beyond the the uh uh uh one year um as long as long as there's no interruption in the uh uh moror okay thank you uh did you want I was got to open public comment do you want to say something do public comment hey John so how far are we moving at this time it's drafted for an additional six-month extension so we would push it from it would extend it into August um and obviously you know the reasoning behind it I mean I know we had discussed it all in the past but obviously there's a number of reasons behind um uh behind a moratorium and we're going through the comp plan process we're working with with them and we're working with Department of Commerce in terms of uh are there going to be any more allocations administ uh to to bring forward so there's a number of uh absolutely valid reasons to support a moratorium if you all want to do it um but I did want to mention that that one legal legal Quirk that wasn't uh was wasn't there the last two times okay thank you so can we open up public comment please hey first up is Van Caden had van Caden head again uh I push for this moratorium several times until you finally did it because I said you were digging further into a hole if you allowed people to continue to apply and uh because of the moratorium uh I think that what Mr Quick just mentioned mentioned I don't think the people have a a legal basis to uh give us any problems because they don't have any U paperwork the that we're closing them out of so I would continue the moratorium for 6 months I would recommend that strongly and uh the other reason the overriding reason is our uh our able cities east is coming in here and is going to be discussing the Land Development regulations in workshops and the comprehensive plan in shetes and I think we should have that in the rearview mirror before we talk about lifting any moratoriums so we're we're in a state of uh homeostasis at the present and I think we should remain there for at least the next six months thank you very much thank you Marne anybody else yes Mr bshm yes Jo wishm Plantation key I'll make this short and simple uh I support this I believe that you all should should support this until we get our new comp plan and ldrs not only on market rate I was hoping for everything else so that we make sure that decisions we make now comply with whatever decisions they come up with in our new comp plan and ldrs so I would really strongly hope that you support continuing the moratorium thank you thank you very much anyone else no ma'am okay um public comment is now closed Council I see hands go ahead de Go De okay so uh I do support this um uh we do have a new comp plan that we're working on and we do have potentially more allocations I don't think we have a time frame on either one of when they would be finished um the comp plan if I understand is probably well over 6 months um and who knows on the allocations depending on what path that goes on we might get some of them we might not uh but either way um I I do support at least the six months it helps us get time to organize um I would ask what is the possibility not that I want to think of it right now but what is the possibility of doing a a in August another extension um I mean I I guess it would depend on where we are in terms of the comp plan and with the uh with the allocations or potential allocations from the state if those are still pending I think that we would have a a good a fair basis to to do it if you all are still interested in that and and I I would agree with the the timeline that you talk about on a comp plan I think um at least 6 months is uh is standard and a lot of times it it takes a little bit longer thank you so I would support this okay thanks Deb Don John can you explain to me the difference in what we're doing here and like since we're going through the comp plan and the ldr process um zoning in progress zoning in progress and then moratorium are slightly different so zoning in progress basically um if is a is a a shorter freeze that if you if you so you have ordinances have two readings um so if you pass something on first reading between first and second reading there's a provision in our code where zoning and progress can kick in which means while it's pending if it passed on first reading you need to comply with you know with with everything including the potential new um restrictions that are coming in the ordinance then when the second reading comes in if it passes then and once it's approved by Commerce if they have to approve it that becomes the law you only have to comply with that if it doesn't pass then zoning in progress goes away and you just stay complying with the with the original terms the moratorium is a longer freeze and it's not it's not necessarily tied to any one code change but it's a it's a broader look uh in terms of U you know we're doing a a slew of changes so you wouldn't come through it would be more difficult to do it through a zoning in progress and the zoning in progress would be much shorter uh in doing so so okay I I hope that was a little wordy I got it I got it yeah sorry I just seeing if that was another alternative that may get us away from potential bird harrish claims but that's good okay I get it thank you okay Steve anything no buddy no no I'm good with it too so uh I guess do I hear a motion from the council I'll make a motion to uh extend another six months on the moratorium building permanent allocations system and I'll second the motion okay Marne would you please call the rooll vice mayor Don Horton yes council member Deb Gillis yes council member Steve Freedman yes council member buddy Pender yes and mayor Sharon Mahoney yes the motion passes 5 to zero we'll bring that for back for second reading in the January meeting thank you very much okay now we're moving on to the Quasi judicial and uh Mr Quick please yeah we're in the quasa judicial uh section of our agenda um this is uh starts on Tab C uh please be advis that the following agenda items are quas judicial in nature if you wish to comment upon these please inform the village clerk by filling out the available signup form an opportunity for persons to speak on each item will be made available after the applicant and staff have made their presentation on each item as a reminder testimony and quasi judicial items must be in person Zoom testimony is not permitted these proceedings will be handled in accordance with the village code requirements all testimony public including public testimony and evidence will be made under oath or affirmation additionally each person who gives testimony may be subject to cross-examination if you do not wish to be either cross-examined or sworn your testimony shall be disregarded the general public will not be permitted to cross-examine Witnesses but the public May request the council to ask questions of Staff or Witnesses on their behalf the full agenda packet on each item is hereby entered into the record along with the village code and comprehensive plan any correspondence that was received by Village staff is included in the file and part of the record persons representing organizations must present evidence of their authority to speak for the organization further details of the quasa judicial procedures in section 30- 256 of the village code may be obtained from the village clerk tonight there are 10 quasa judicial items which are tabs C through k at this time would like to ask anyone who intends to speak on the quaser judicial items tonight to please raise your hand to be sworn in by the clerk if you intend to speak at all on again and this is tab C through K in the testimony in which you are about to give do you swear to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing that's the truth the witnesses have have been sworn um Madame mayor um we'll we're starting with tab C which is stated States as follows tab C is a resolution of the Village Council of is of Village of Island Florida considering the request of Island construction Management Inc for administrative relief from the uh Village building permit allocation system for property located at 33 Flamingo hammock Road Upper mumbi as legally described in exhibit a providing for transmitt to the Department of Commerce and providing for an effective date uh Council before we begin I would like you to please disclose any expar Communications that you may have had with the applicant or anyone else again this this one is just on Tab C please include whether the person represented any group or entity as well as the subject matter as best you recall thank you start with you Deb sure um the only person I spoke to about this is Ty Ty Harris and the subject matter was just in general um what what this property entailed okay Don uh out of the abundance of caution I need to recuse myself from this item there are several others that I will recuse myself from if you want me to do them now or I can do them later it doesn't matter I can do I'll wait and so you won't need to disclose any exp parte because you're not part of the qu judicial trial Steve I don't believe I have any buddy I don't I don't have any either only thing Ty did is uh other than Tai he just reminded me that this was coming up okay so I I remember it from last time but I had no communication okay no communication for me either okay right we are ready to proceed on uh tab C thank you good evening Council Madam mayor and Council uh Jennifer deobi and playing director I'm here this evening with you uh to discuss the administra relief application for 3 33 Flamingo hammock Road um as was stated Island construction management was the applicant originally on behalf of Holly Lynn Ernest Jones revocable trust in May of 2024 Ty Harris PA filed a new agent letter and now represents the applicant um the application doesn't change they just get a new agent letter so that's why the application still says Island construction Management Inc I just want to make that clear they've applied for administrative relief pursuant to section 30-47 of the code of ordinances of the village of Isa marada Village code section 30-47 requires that a public hearing be held during which the Village Council of Isa marada shall consider all evidence presented regarding the application and shall follow the procedures standards and criteria found within code sections 30-5 552 and 30- 553 otherwise known as beneficial use the burden of proof shall also be on the applicant the subject property is located at 33 Flamingo hammock Road and is legally described in the proposed resolution attached the application was entered into the building permit allocation system or be pass on October 24th 2019 the application has been considered in four in consecutive annual allocation periods and has failed to receive an allocation award at the close of quarter 4 2023 the application was ranked 20 with 17 points pursuant to the requirements set forth in code section 30-47 7A the applicant was eligible to apply for administrative relief between 12:01 p.m. on December 30th 2023 and 12:00 p.m. on April 28th 2024 the applicants applicants submitted their application for administrative relief on January 3rd 2024 the proposed development is a one single family three-bedroom two-b home approximately 2,000 526 sare ft the site is approximately 12,192 Square ft with the allowed clearing of 50% based on habitat the proposed development will clear approximately 4,378 Square ft with a grant of conservation easement being placed on the remainder of the property according to the mitigation plan submitted with the permit the mitigation fee to be paid to the Village would be approximately $6,250 the analysis of the entirety of the beneficial use is in your packet and remedies offered under code section 30477 F at the conclusion of the public hearing the Village Council may take any or combination of the following actions Grant the applicant an allocation award for all or part of the allocation requested in the next succeeding allocation period or extended Prado over several succeeding allocation periods offer to purchase the property at its fair market value and three suggest any other relief as may be necessary and appropriate currently the village has 23 allocations available for administrative relief I will note that previously um the council had asked us to do an appraisal of the property that appraisal is in your pocket um I believe the let me just see uh the valuation of the property under that appraisal was $400,000 so I don't have anything else to add at this time unless you have specific questions for me no anybody have a question for Jennifer or we go to move on oh go ahead well I do Jennifer they've already came once okay so they were before the council in May but at that time though the quas judicial hearing was not opened the council directly deferred it to um this evening so there was no discussion or hearing at that time okay Deb okay my question is uh if in the the regular cycle if I understand it right the reason that they didn't gain enough points to come to the top was mostly because of the hammock on the property uh most likely I don't have the uh points in front of me but that's most likely if they've been in for four years and they only had 17 points and and you you alluded to it in here so I'm probably just repeating this to say it I guess uh that that they're only allowed to clear 50% of what's on their property correct and that's not 50% more than what's cleared that's a total of 50% correct correct okay I think that's all I have at this time thank you anyone else no we move forward Mr Harris thank you very much uh as uh staff stated I represent the applicant the Jones family local family multigenerational this is a home they've been trying to build since 2021 they've waited patiently in line um I would first as a matter of housekeeping like to incorporate the the testimony and the evidence presented in the May hearing since this is basically continuance of a quas Judicial item probably need to put that on the record so done that to bring the new council members up to speed we had quite a lengthy hearing discussing what kind of relief to give the Joneses and there was a lot of questions and a lot of discussion about the property being in Hammock this is a residential subdivision that's been there for a number of years and this is just another house in that subdivision but um not to throw any council members off under the bus but one of our dear council members on the last Council had an epiphany about not allowing any kind of development in any hammock property it not only affected this this application but it also killed a very nice single one room one B affordable housing project that was um proposed by Habitat for Humanity so that decision caused a lot of damage in my opinion throughout the Village um so because nobody can make a decision on really whether to give an allocation or to add points to this application we punted till this meeting so now this Council has an opportunity to pick up where the last council could not and render a decision as Jennifer stated the the criteria you have three choices and the first choice is to give an allocation which is my client's preference uh the second would be to purchase it but part of that is that you actually have to have an offer and an acceptance and my clients aren't willing to sell this property and certainly not for $400,000 good luck trying to buy a lotted in there for $400,000 and third there's this provision of well you know other relief and nobody's ever quite figured out what other relief means but it could take the form of lots of different things uh we we would prefer this stick to what we know which is uh an allocation they waited in line uh in your discussions earlier tonight you decided that you did not want to move forward with another uh moratorium on administrative relief that it wasn't fair and essentially this is what we have tonight what's fair to this family and I would respectfully ask that you um move forward and give them the allocation that we normally give to properties and residential subdivisions and let's put this one to bed and and move forward thank you for your time and I'm here to answer any questions anyone have a question for Mr Harry I just reserve the right to ask later depending on how the conversation Steve do you have anything not from Mr haris okay thank you very much thank you and so in uh under our code the next step in quasa judicial is to open it up for participants uh from the public in support of the application okay do I who do I have in support mie um I only have one person um signed up for this one and they did not indicate um opposition or support and that would be James Jones I'm guessing he support I'm guessing welcome Jim hi good evening I'm James Jones resident of Plantation key at 262 Mohawk Street um I want to thank the council for their service first of all and congratulations on your elections um you know we took a pledge when we got in today for Liberty and for justice for all me and my wife have gone through the entire process we've done everything that we were supposed to do we have a plotted lot in a subdivision that has City Water and Sewer it's been our Dream to build a home there we've waited patiently we paid all the fees we've done everything we can we have been delayed over over a year now because of this and because of this has cost us stress this has cost us money this has costed us a lot of time I'm asking you guys to vote to give us the permit tonight to do the right thing we have waited we don't have an agenda we love the keys this is our home we we have our family here and this is where we want to be our families grow things happen we went and did the right thing and got a lot that is a build lot in a subdivision there's houses on either side of me behind me and going up across the street from me yep um I thank you for your time and your service and I just please again ask you to award and do the right thing thank you thank you very much thank you uh now I guess I'm looking for opposed Marne there's no one else signed up for the second okay so uh then I guess we move to the council now yes okay council do you have any thoughts on this unless the applicant wants to cross-examine himself I assume Mr Harris doesn't want to cross-examine his uh his own client oh come on let's let him do it okay Steve do you want to start yeah just uh Jennifer could I get some clarification on the hammock issue sure did you have a specific question uh uh just some of the history what that's about what happened I'm not I'm not sure I understand your question why there's an issue building in the hammock or there isn't uh an issue building in the hammock there is in an issue they are allowed to clear up to 50% which is what they proposed okay and then they have a mitigation plan for the rest which I I think I iterated was about $46,000 that they will pay to the Village okay all right thank you Jennifer that is a ploted sub that is a ploted subdivision yes Jump Right In just just just just be clear is that the one that's um uh basically behind public behind the public behind the public right yeah okay thanks Don uh it just just another example of what we just got rid of the moratorium this this is a this is the example these folks have been in here from more than four years and um I just think that like so many other in the past they need to get they they need to get approval but that's up to y'all I'm out of this one Deb um well I'm ready to make a motion to give them an allocation if the council is ready to hear that the only thing I want to say is I was on the last Council and I did not agree with other council members I believe this family has played the game that we created they've done everything and they deserve what all of us want is a home here so uh if anybody has anything else to say I I I just want to back you up Sharon and say um Holly grew up here her daddy grew up here her grandmother grew up here okay we're talking about and their daughter lives here I mean they got they're they're this is what I'm talking about about generational okay that want to live here okay and they followed the system and I know there was somebody somebody on Council before I didn't agree with it either and I think we should give them their permit tonight they've waited very very long it's C cost of construction have gone up it's an app ploted subdivision so anyway this one is also uh what I would refer to as an info I mean it's it's not out in the center of exactly it's a what I didn't hear I I called it an infill meaning that there's houses all around it it's just it's a vacant lot inside so I already are we are we we're talking about a market rate um yes yes well from from the administrative to upgrade to market rate it is a market rate but it's inside the administrative relief pool got it's been it's been almost five years Steve yeah I I just I just want to make sure that we're we're doing things the right way despite the fact that people may have grown up here we're friends with them and all that we still have to do things by the boat they did they follow they've been in four years and then they had to pay $1,500 and then they had they applied for administrative relief and then they came for administrative relief but we didn't even give them a chance and anyways okay uh so again do I have a motion I'm making a motion to uh approve um an an allocation out of the administrative Relief Fund is that how that should be work second that motion yeah yeah you say motion to approve uh yeah exactly that's okay and we have a second with Mr Pender just one thing before we vote the um I there is the ability for a final argument from the applicant I I but I just wanted to make sure we offered it to them I by the word but I'm not that to you okay so Mar would you please call the role council member Deb Gillis yes council member Steve fman yes council member buddy Pender yes and mayor Sharon Mahoney yes the motion passes SC to zero congratulations I okay moving on to the next uh section and that would be me and I'm told I have to recuse myself and I get to give Dawn my but you can't keep it okay you can't keep it I don't better making I don't need it you get this for two items that we're going to probably combine into I recruit so I'm stepping back so go ahead please Mr Quick all right the next two items are um uh well let me just ask so these there's tab d and e a lot of so one is a uh future land use map change one is a zoning map change they're companion items um you can't have one without the other um usually what we do in this situation is that we uh combine them both uh for the same hearing although we will vote on them separately um I just want to make sure that council is okay with that as well is the the applicant uh is okay with that is that okay that we combine them yes sir so to further explain it's a it's a it's a flum change future land use M map change and a zoning change and the arguments or the the arguments behind them are pretty much the same it would be redundant to hear them twice so we'll hear them both together unless there's any opposition to that okay let's do that and I was I was going to add on to that explanation because we have some thank you uh that it's it's very difficult to separate the conversations from one to the other you end up cross talking they over all the time so if we put it at one but vote separately we can get this done yep exactly um so I'll read both titles um now uh tab D is an ordinance of is Mara Village of Island Florida considering the request of Sharon Mahoney on behalf of HV s82 Investments LLC to amend The Village's future land use map from residential conservation to mied use for the subject property located on Plantation key with real estate number 00415 18400 as legally described herein providing for the transmittal of this ordinance to the State Department of Commerce and providing for an effective date upon the approval of this ordinance by the State Department of Commerce I didn't say this is an ordinance on second reading uh tab e also an ordinance on second reading is an ordinance of is Mara Village of violence Florida considering the request of Sharon Mahoney on behalf of HBS 82 Investments LLC to amend the official zoning map from native residential to Highway commercial for the subject property located on Plantation key with real estate number 00 415848 upon the approval of this ordinance by the State Department of Commerce um before we begin uh Council if you would please disclose any expart Communications you've had with anyone again this is on both tabs D and E and please include whether the person represent pres any group or entity as well as the subject matter as as you best recall thank you I'll go first uh I had no communication whatsoever not even with Jennifer I didn't even know there was a Structure back in there yeah well I had a little bit of conversation with Sharon about the property um but I just on the sake of whatever I sat on LPA and heard these items as an LPA a member so you heard it before you were elected well yes okay thank you and and that was all public hearing to public hearing right yeah I've had no conversation all right we proceed does the applicant like to present usually St I'm sorry I'm sorry go for it she's got I don't have much to say uh these are two uh ordinances for second reading um the previous Council had approved these under first reading um the applicant HV hvs 82 Investments LLC has submitted both these amendments the future land use Amendment um goes from is proposed from residential conservation to mixed juice and the zoning amendment is to propose change from native residential to Highway commercial the subject property is loed at located at 88755 Old Highway it's comprised of 12,000 Square fet the property is developed with an existing commercial Greenhouse um the under first reading they Council had um several conditions that are in your packet um we rendered the flum amendment as required to the state for a coordinated review on June 14th we received a report back from clorid Florida commerce not identifying any objection or comments from the state coordinated review and then however between first and second reading the applicant has requested that a change to one of the conditions she's asked that the condition number two regarding the grant of conservation easement be removed I've provided you with two resolutions one with the condition and one without so the council May review both and provide and decide which they prefer um I don't have anything additional to add if you want me to go through the entire packet again I'm happy to do that but um because it was second reading I don't typically do that so okay does the applicant have anything to present should I say something if you want to explain why you want the condition removed my father acquired this property in 1960 it was zoned B bu2 which was commercial in 1990 I paid $10 to my dad and own the property to go along with my flower shop uh I built a commercial Greenhouse it is commercial all my permits were commercial I have handicapped parking handicap bathroom and uh um I found out 7 and A2 years ago that the village rezone me res residential and I've been 7 years trying to correct this it is a a greenhouse a cement structure that my dad designed uh will take hurricane force winds what I want to do is put a roof on it and brick up the sides and turn it into a nice office building for a dentist an architect do not want to change the size of anything do not want to clear anything I just want my zoning back to what it was and uh if you have any questions I'd be glad to answer them thank you um now we would open it up to um anybody any public there anybody against is that what you want to do the first one is um that is in support okay in is there anyone in support that would like to speak okay first up we have um but we can take van first and then Mr wishm ho ho ho and Merry Christmas uh I've I've uh seen this property since 1960 and everything that uh Madam mayor said was correct and this is in my opinion a remedial action that we're doing for her uh that uh to correct something that was done by the First Council so I would urge you to Grant her what she's asking for in both of these uh instances uh because uh I I think that would that would would make something that was wrong back to being right thank you very much thank you man yes Joe wishm Plantation key uh I'm pretty much was going to say the same thing that van did I mean it just doesn't seem right what they did back then and I'm glad that you're taking the opportunity to correct it the only question I had was about the restrictions that were on the first reading and I didn't know if it had to be changed from the first to the second or or what but I'm in full support of this thank you Joe that it Marney is there anyone for or against I mean y Ty are you in I put a card for four yes Ty Ty did put a card in for four again Ty Harris Plantation key it's not often that van and Joe and I all agree on something but but I will I will I love it when it happens you know um again this is about writing or wrong uh you the I call it and I've said it before it's the original sin of the Village from a planning perspective you do not take properties and turn them into non-conforming uses and that's what happened in this case is happened all the way down to lower matak and over the years people have realized that that's happened and they all want their zoning back and you can't blame them because this property was commercial it was developed under a commercial county code code um there's no need for a um a conservation easement on it because it's already cleared to the max it cannot be cleared anymore so why are we going to belt and suspend or something when we don't have to that's just extra government when not extra government is needed so um in in keeping with my my brothers Joe and and Van I would urge that you uh that you uh approve this thank you thank you Ty it must be Christmas Marney anyone else there is no one else to speak even against correct get lucky sometimes huh yeah okay all right is there any discussion on the up at the DS for with Council I don't have any discussion I I have a just a little bit uh on this uh um conservation easement um I was involved because I was on LPA and I heard it before that I know that on the restrictive covenants that there was a map missing but we were able to determine what that was and I actually voted in support of this and I still am voting in support of it but would the conservation easement um help clarify that since we have a missing I can I can address that so we have corrected the restrictive covenant the map has been discovered she dug through her old box of plans papers and we discovered the exhibit a we um Roda helped us draft a draft a corrected restrictive covenant we re-recorded it it's been recorded so that's all been corrected oh I didn't know that I'm sorry in that case I don't have actually the first condition that the original the previous Council had put on the approval so anyone else no I I got to tell you that I wanted to do my research on this that then I don't care how many pages there are I did my research I pulled my own zoning map and it is bu2 and it's amazing because it stops right at that lot going north it goes back to bu1 uh and I pulled the old county code and it's amazing what was allowed in bu2 and I forgot that they allowed for stacking um and they allowed for I mean pages and pages of uses that included saloons and multif family structures and storage buildings and warehouses and C storage and even Brew houses it was pretty cool Munitions deposits from the 60s they would allow so uh I think this is a perfect example of writing or wrong the the county it had the right zoning the county zoned it down further and then the village went in here and just devastated this property with a with a residential conservation uh and it I just think it was a wrong thing and it's example of why we need to get this code updated and why we need to pay pay attention to what our planning directors do as we go through there because we allowed the planning director to make this a a non-conforming piece of property and there's a lot of them all over this town speak and I've changed that what's okay go on buddy no please I just Joanne and Sharon both called me years ago before I ever got elected and asked if I would help them I went straight to the county and got it all I mean I got a whole packet from them that I gave to Sharon and then I also got the vill packet where Mr uh uh Joe michelas he since sold his property but it it was he changed his too so the property that ad joins her property but yeah the County's got a lot of of good info there uh anyways that's all I have to say all right um thank you do I hear a motion then yeah we'll do them one at time and with tabd I'm assum do you want to do you want to uh closing argument with tabd uh just whoever is making the motion just remember to um include in the motion whether it in uh if it's an approval whether it includes uh the condition uh for a conservation easement or not okay I'll make a motion that that we approve this and with no conservation uh on both uh items is that is that good John what do you need yeah that that would be fine I mean it's only it's only on Tab D that has that that requ let you do it again so so would be a motion to approve tabd without the requirement for a so I make a motion to approve tab D without the conservation uh restriction and I'll second that motion all right we got a motion in a second Marney will you call the RO council member buddy Pender yes council member Deb Gillis yes council member Steve fredman yes and vice mayor Don Haron yes that motion passes for to zero okay now I need a motion for the next uh tab I'll make a motion on the next tab to um as recommended to change the zoning um from do I need to say from and tab right tab t e did I say something different I'm sorry you can just say motion to approve the uh the proposed ordinance at tab okay I make a motion to approve the the uh motion as presented on tabby do I have a second yep got a second all right Mar will you call the RO council member Deb Gillis yes council member buddy Pender yes council member Steve fredman yes and vice mayor Don Haron yes that motion passes part to zero Hallelujah seven and a half years thank you thank you so very much there is writing is happen I hope so thank you okay do we want to continue on or does anybody need a break break are we good let's do it Jennifer's got a plan to catch oh let's get Jennifer okay so that we are on Mr Quick yep we're on tabs f and g okay um and uh well speak together do you want okay miss m t do you um have any issue with taking all four of your items together FG um H and I okay all right I will read all four of them um and uh we can take them together for one hearing on but we will vote on all four of them individually tab f is an ordinance of is Mara Village of Island Florida concerning the request of windley Cove LLC to amend The Village's future land use map from residential medium to mixed use for the subject property located on windley key with real estate number 0045 35- 0000000000 as legally described herein and to allow the partiel to be included uh in policy 1- 12.11.4 windley key mixed use area 2 providing for the transmittal of this ordinance to the state dep Depart of Commerce and providing for an effective date upon the approval of this ordinance by the State Department of Commerce and and I forgot to mention this is an ordinance on first reading tab G is also an ordinance on first reading it's an ordinance of Isam Mara Village of violence Florida considering the request of windley Cove LLC to amend the official zoning map from residential single family uh to Highway commercial for the subject property located on windley key with real estate number 0045 35- 0000000000 as legally described herein providing for the transmittal of this ordinance to the State Department of Commerce providing for an effective date upon the approval of this ordinance by the State Department of Commerce tab H an ordinance of alam Village of violence Florida concerning the request of Wiley eyes Wiley Isles LLC to amend The Village's future land use map from residential medium to mixed use uh for the subject property located on Wiley key with real estate number 0045 36- 0000000000 as legally described herein and to allow the parcel to be included in policy 1-21 1.4 Wiley key mixed use area 2 providing for the transmittal this ordinance to the State Department of Commerce and providing for an effective date upon the approval of this ordinance by the State Department of Commerce tab I is uh ordinance on first reading it's an ordinance of isar Village of violence Florida concering the request of windley Isles LLC to amend the official zoning map from residential single family to Highway commercial for the subject property located on windley key with real estate number 0045 36- 0000000000 as legally described herein providing for the transmitter this ordinance to the State Department of Commerce and providing for an effective date upon the approval of this ordinance by the State Department of Commerce and Council before we begin I would like you to please disclose any expar Communications uh that you may have had with anyone with regard to tabs um uh F through I and um please include whether the person represented any group or entity as well as the subject matter as you best recall thank you U Deb start with you um so I spoke to Joslyn on the first Go Round And when it was at LPA and it was just concerning what the property was about and and like and I also need to disclose I I think that I was on LPA when it came forward there but that was a public hearing also okay Don out of the abundance of caution I'm going to recuse myself on fgh and I okay Steve um no nothing to R Mr Pender nope no communication and nothing for for myself either so we're ready to begin okay thank you Council Jennifer Dean again planning director um here this evening for um windley Cove LLC and windley Isles LLC theyve uh the applicant has submitted map amendments uh for the flum and Zoning for both properties one is located at 85327 Overseas Highway and the other one is located at 85331 Overseas Highway the applicant is requesting an approval for a future land use map from residential medium to mix juice design designation for the subject properties and a zoning map change from residential single family R1 to a highway commercial District uh these um the F Amendment cannot be approved without the companion zoning Amendment and the applicant has submitted a letter detailing the map Amendment request it should be in your pocket the applicant owner intends to pursue acquiring vacation rental license for both properties and the reason for uh the change is we do not allow uh vacation rentals in residential medium uh fly BS and so that's why we are she is requesting this change um in order to um solidify her uh her request she is also suggested or proposing that the properties be placed in the windley key mixed juice area to which will restrict the development of the properties to single family homes only um and that would allow still allow her to do the vacation rentals but it would not allow any other development commercial development it would only allow a single family home to stay there so uh that's the proposal before you tonight um these are the two homes that are located immediately adjacent to the Hog Heaven uh if you're not familiar with them the properties currently have the existing residential medium future land use uh the surrounding properties to the South are also designated residential medium the properties to the north are mixed use the properties to the west across Overseas Highway are conservation and to the east is the Atlantic Ocean the car car of the subject properties are single family homes with some mangr Wetlands to the east of the property and the surrounding area is mixed use with a collection of restaurants Marine uses single family residences and conservation land the subject property has a subject properties have single family residential single family R1 zoning designations the surrounding properties to the South are also designated designated residential single family to the north the adjacent properties are designated Highway commercial the properties to the west across Overseas Highway are designated conservation to the east again is the Atlantic Ocean and the character of the subject property is single family home again with surrounding area with Collective of restaurants remarin uses single family residences and conservation land in your packet is the analysis this was before the council previously and um the applicant had asked for a deferral so that's why we're here this evening um again the proposed flum amendment would not alter the development potential of the subject property by would alter I'm sorry the development potential of the subject property by allowing one additional market rate unit and five affordable housing units the new FL would also allow for hotel motel density however adding the property to the Wiley key mixed juuse area 2 would not alter the development potential because it would restrict again the property to a single family home at this time based on the um oh let me back up when this property was before the council previously there was a lot of concern about the parking in the windley key area which we discussed at the beginning of the meeting and um vacation rental compliance uh the parking in the windley key area has been um addressed because the Village um took it upon itself to um request that those Vehicles be moved so the Florida Keys Aqueduct Authority could use that for their staging so that has been addressed um in your packet I had compiled a vacation rental compliance monitoring checklist I had gone through through um our our regulations and our code regarding vacation rentals and put and I had talked with our fire inspector who does our vacation rental inspections and I had put together this checklist and how we would propose to verify and enforce those things so I have this checklist in here and we could monitor those uh vacation rentals hopefully that would help address some of the concerns regarding vacation rentals if that's what the council is still concerned about So based on all of that and the fact that these properties will be placed in the winley key mixed juice area 2 uh at this time staff recommends the adoption of both these ordinances and I don't have anything else to add but I'm here to answer any questions anyone have any questions for Jennifer no so Marne we start with the applicant you ready yeah go ahead ready is I'm going to be um all right well good evening Council uh congratulations on your election okay so you know for those who have not heard my um presentation you know I'll go over it again simply um I bought these properties you know approximately 3 years ago I wanted to develop to you know beautiful homes accent the community um come from a you know Legacy of my father being a builder and I take a lot of pride in my work and I of course build my homes to top quality and I just really wanted to come out beautiful when you drive by and people admire them and I was very happy with the way they came out um as we you know of course started start this project you we did start getting input from you know just contractor Friends real estate agents as it was my intention to build these and sell them um you know just of best way to what would be the best use out of the homes we did get a lot of comments that people thought they were a great location to have the ability to do vacation rentals um so I started the project to go forward and you know apply for the application almost a year ago we've been working on this so um the homes are now have a CO they are completely done so with them being finished uh you know of course with underneath the sub policy too you will not be able to add any type of additional uses to it other than exactly what's there for a single family use so I think it's very important to understand you know it's not a standard zoning change you're underneath a sub policy so for all those other uses that are typically allowed in Highway commercial you're not allowed to do like you said the motel or upselling or you know getting a higher density out of it is still is with this requested zoning change use the exact same use of what the property is going to be right now it's going to be for you know the same occupancy of what's allowed in it and it's not going to be changing the use to what it already is um it still will be remaining 100% residential so that does not change and I think it's very important to acknowledge that and understand it the one and only change that can happen through this Zing change is the ability of the difference of duration of someone can stay in the property which right now is a minimum of 28 days so it'll be going to 7 days that is the sole diff difference in accomplishing this zoning change um I had uh Jennifer pull up a map of all of wendley hey to just show you what wendley hey is Wendy key is you know a high you know the whole key is either Highway commercial or tourist commercial um there is actually only there shows seven Parcels there but one of them is actually incorrect the one closest right here that one has actually already changed to um Highway commercial in a previous zoning change that was approved by the village staff so there is actually only six R1 sites on all of Wiley he um and in those six sites I own three of them um the property even to the south side of my property that is where I plan on building my own future personal residence so my property will actually serve as a buffer to the next residential property beside me um this properties back in 1997 before the village was incorporated these were all Suburban commercially zoned so they were not zoned before you know when the village was incorporated in 1997 and then 2001 they were changed to R1 so we again are just going back to the original zoning of the properties to what they were um and as I mentioned too you know the one property closest to Hog Heaven that one was the exact same situation there was a single family home there um they actually tore down the home and they made that into a highway commercial lot which they use as an accessory structure to the restaurant so there already is presidence from having a previous Zone change at the exact same similar circumstances and they have a sub policy and my sub poliy is actually even more restrictive than theirs only allowing the use of vacation rentals and still keeping it as a single family residential home um I know there's been concern about parking um even at engers Reef when you're talking about parking they have two units only two parking spots per residence um I have an abundance of parking in my property it's all enclosed by a privacy wall um it actually can easily occupy five to six cars underneath the carport and in the driveway so parking is not an issue we're not going to be having overflow out onto the road and by the even the you know wonderful vacation rental compliance modering checklist that uh Jennifer supplied you know it very clearly states it's two occupants per room so whether it's a 7-Day rental or a 28 day rental it's the same amount of occupants still staying in the home so that does not change um so just in essence I mean you're not creating a density change you're not in creating an intensity change it is still the same style home there is no commercial use there is no other businesses other than vacation rental allowance and there is no up zoning with the same use of the property um so I mean it just makes sense you know out the 331 vacation rental licenses that are in Isa marada and still being a surplus of vacation rental licenses it just makes a lot more sense to steer these open licenses to an area that has the least impacted you know density of residential and put it into a high density commercial area um I think that's about it um you know there are quite a few vacation rentals there in anger's Reef there's 19 of them that's only about 500 ft away from the property currently right now um you know the village staff approval has recommended for approval the LPA voted on it 6 to1 for their approval and I'm hoping that you guys understand that it's just a great spot to steer these open vacation rentals and see that it's not going to impact the community in a negative way and in essence I think actually you know help the community and bring somewhere for tourists to come in an area that's not going to be affected and bothering neighbors so anybody have any questions before Okay so so I guess we now open who are in support of this first Marney I don't have anyone specifically um signed up in support um but I will start with Elizabeth Jolan to speak as uh she doesn't have support or oppose on it and then everyone else is opposing I'm sorry I misidentified the tab I wanted to speak on Jay okay all right thank you okay all right well we'll start with Van Caden head and we don't have anyone in support so this is my name is Van Kaden here and there's a few things I'd like you to consider before you make this decision um Mrs Gillis uh mentioned that she was on the LPA when this was discussed and so was I and it was originally brought up as affordable housing by Mark Greg who at the time owned the property and he stipulated that it was uh fronting on US1 it was Highway uh commercial and I brought out at the time that it was not on US1 it was not Highway commercial it was on a village road that had been given to us by the county not US1 which is a Federal Highway so I said uh it shouldn't be uh eligible for affordable housing so he got it uh to residential medium so uh and also got me removed from the the uh LPA and so uh the the location is of it's those houses are gorgeous they are beautiful houses they're well well done and and uh they should be uh in my opinion uh what they were uh you started out with a horse across the river and now you're changing horses in the middle of the river and the reason that you're changing horses is to upgrade the value of the property from a single family home which is what which is the uh the precept that was built under and the perits were granted under that idea and now you want to change that to a vacation rental uh and you know you can go from 28 days to 7 days and that's the you know the what what Mrs tan brought up but I would also point out that with the with the strength of a waiver uh what happened at the islands of Isam marada was supposed to be vacation rentals of uh 28 days and then it became seven days and because we got a waiver from the planning department now it's overnight so if in in in essence you have created another one night Hotel so so this this is a possibility in the future for this uh mixed use if you grant them this uh this uh change in the middle of the stream uh which was which enhance the value of with their property greatly because it will be uh uh Val valued as a vacation rental instead of a single family home which was the precept it was accepted at to begin with so I would say that if you grant it as a vacation rental uh the stipulation should be that it could never go uh waiver or not or who's sitting on the council or who's sitting in the in the planning director's seat should never ever be changed from vacation rental to a one night rental which is what we looking at at the islands of Isam marada right now with 22 units that were uh they changed the horse in the middle of that particular stream too and I just don't want to see it happen again thank you very much thank you next morning next is Joe ISM yes Joe ISM Plantation key as a victim of vacation rentals done illegally next to me and knowing people who are next to them even though they say they're single family these are beautiful houses but we're not talking about a two-bedroom house we're talking many many bedrooms and these people that come down pay no attention to those of us that have to get up early in the morning and go to work they party all night long oh they sleep during the day while we're at work and then they party all night long again we all know the complaints we've had to vacation rentals in the past count councils have said they are going to address this issue as of yet we haven't really seen anything to address it we need to protect our residential neighborhoods another for instance is I live in a residential neighborhood and all of a sudden I got a 7-Eleven and a Distillery bar put within 500 ft of my house and I live in a residential neighborhood and they told me they said well when you bought it was commercial yeah it was a bank that's a little different and there was so taking advantage of of the residents we have to protect the families and the residents from vacation rentals there's plenty of other places to put them other than in residential neighborhoods so I hope you would respect our mission and our quality of life thank you very much thank you Marty anyone else yes next up is Sue Miller there's no one else okay so I guess now we move to uh the council for discussion yes okay who would like to start um I mean I I like this idea I think uh in just overall perspective we're we're looking at at two homes uh that really in terms of any kind of vacation rental impact uh that um some of the public speakers were referring to we have an apartment building that's kind of close by that is also adjacent to a restaurant with a lot of um great smelling smoke you know coming from I mean the cooker right and just just a clarify so um so I don't think that they'd necessarily be bothered by by this change is what I'm saying the people in the in the apartments um I I think it'll be beneficial for the owners and I think it aligns with basically the rest of the the area there so um I'm in favor buddy I don't have anything Deb sure make a couple comments M sorry okay I'll make a couple comments um these these two houses were actually built with market rate the affordable that was referred to was never pulled um and um the this this [Music] um Wiley the multi the the zoning that we're the sub zoning that we're doing number two wouldn't allow any kind of motel that's the idea of putting that sub zoning in place so I think this is a great location for this and um it's it's really not a residential neighborhood in that area so I am I am for this I actually voted for it on the LPA I thought it was a good to put the sub zoning in well I happen to be friends with the people who live on the other side and they do have a problem with it um there are people who live on the uh South Side more than one and uh they have come to me multiple times very concerned and I have a really hard time uh agreeing to this because there are people who have their homes next door I sorry but I do not believe it's going to be two people in bedroom I'm sorry when this came in front of me before and Mark tried to sell that oh no oh no oh come on who do you think is going to rent that house it's going to be kids and it's going to be horrible for the people who live there so I I do have an issue they're beautiful homes uh I just have a problem with the vacation rentals just because I think it's not fair to people who have lived there for several years to now have this burden next door to them and it is a burden just you know I mean come on they're here to party let's just be honest vacation Reynolds and that type of house is beautiful but you're next door to Hog Heaven who do you think's going to want that house college kids and you know whether it's expensive or not they'll spend the money so I do have a problem with it so I don't know where do we go from here I guess uh we make a motion someone make want to make a motion just um the has the opportunity for a um uh sorry yeah final argum too okay um I just I just want to mention you know thank you for your comments uh you know speaking about illegal rentals yes illegal rentals are a major problem and that's why I'm trying to follow the steps to do this legally and have every process done where someone someone buys wants to buy when these homes obviously they have to go through the vacation license application and comply with all the rules of acquiring a vacation rental license um it is a four-bedroom home so yes it can have an8 person occup occupancy but that really makes no difference if someone has you know four kids or what so living in the house it's the same amount of occupants in the house um and out of these six remaining R1 Lots I would like to point out there's no homestead exemption on any of these Lots they're either transient Properties or they're second home properties so of all winley key no Homestead exemptions on any R1 Lots so I think that is important to point out and even people are going to be renting these homes you know I've had a nice handful of people come through and look at them people love the homes the comments on they're beautiful they're luxury they're built with all high-end products I mean there's no cheap Lowe's or Home Depot products in this house everything is custom it is going to be rented out to high-end clients who are going to be coming down here doing the fishing adventures and boating it is not going to be rented out to partyers it's going to be at a high dollar rental value for these homes and I think that I I just believe that you know it's going to be benefiting the community and I don't think it's going to be an inconvenience in that spot whatsoever um so that's pretty much it and um I look forward and respect any of your votes thank you very much may I add one more thing sure um I listened to the uh council meeting where this was brought up before and a lot of conversation went on about uh the vacation rentals and and bringing them in to compliance and that's we've had the discussion lots of times over that uh I actually wanted to thank Jennifer um and her staff for putting together this checklist I think it's well needed and I think it'll help code enforcement and and the officers in getting the job done and what we're doing um the vacation the illegal vacation rentals are still very difficult to find and enforce but they're working on them uh they're moving that forward um they're they're just hard to find and if you know of some next door you should report them so they can research them and make them come into compliance okay all right buddy okay hey Jennifer this is there something in there that they can't change what van just talked about to one night rynolds that that once this is done they can't come back you know I mean if Joshua wants to speak about it you know yeah so the village so that would be a Transit unit and the village has a cap on Transit units um it would be it would not be allowed to we would we're not allowed to create any new transient unit so seven nights would be the is the minimum okay MH okay all right okay Council anything else or do I have a motion I'll make a motion to approve tab F related to Wiley Cove um for the future M the uh future land use map change as presented is that good do I have a second I'll second okay Marne will call the role please council member Deb Gillis yes council member Steve fredman yes council member buddy Pender yes and mayor Sharon Mahoney yes okay that motion passes for to zero we need a motion on Tab G okay I'll make a motion on Tab G to approve the zoning map change on wendley Cove uh project no second Mary role please council member de bis yes council member Steve fredman yes council member buddy Pender yes and mayor Sharon Mahoney yes the motion passes four to zero then next is uh tab H I'll make a motion on unless you want to do it somebody else want to take the lead here okay I'll make a motion on Tab H to approve the winley Isles uh future land use map change as presented second Mary council member de Gillis yes council member Steve Freedman yes council member buddy Pender yes and mayor Sharon Mahoney yes motion passes far to zero and last but not least tab I I'll make a motion on Tab I to approve the uh zoning map change on winley Isles as presented second Mary council member Deb Gillis yes council member Steve fredman yes council member buddy Pender yes and mayor Sharon Mahoney yes that motion passes four to zero okay thank you ready to move on yep we've got three more tabs they they are all um uh related to the same applicant and I believe we're going to be taking these all together correct yep so they I will read them all um and then we can take them all all in the same uh discussion but vote on them separately um I know first is tab J it's these are all ordinances on first reading it's an ordinance of is mar Village of Island Florida considering the request of laah Creekside LLC to sorry to expend the official zoning map from Village Center to Neighborhood commercial for the subject property located on Plantation key with real estate number 00 4375 n- 000000000000 and 0437 610 - 000000000000 and 00 43764 z- 000000000000 as legally described herein providing for the transmittal of this ordinance to the State Department of Commerce and providing for an effective date upon the approval of this uh ordinance by the State Department of Commerce tab K is a resolution of the Village Council of is Mara Village violence Florida concering the request of La Islander LLC for Amendment to the major conditional use approval for the expansion of the existing hotel for proper located at 8210 and 8998 Overseas Highway and 132 Carrol Street on upper mumi key with the tourist commercial and settlers residential zoning districts with the real estate number 00400 81- and 00400 45- 000000000000 as legally described here in providing for the transmittal of this resolution to the Florida Department of Commerce and providing for an effective date and tab L uh is a resolution of the Village Council of Isam Village of islands Florida considering the request of L Islander LLC for a transfer development rights of five or more hotel/motel units from the property located at 90611 9655 90691 and 90701 Old Highway in taberer with real estate number 0437 59- 0000000000 004371 0- 00 00 437 630- 000000000000 and 00 437 64- 0000000000 as legally described I didn't know I was going to say this many zeros in this short of a time ever in my life as legally described here into to property located at 8210 and 81 998 Overseas Highway and 132 Carrol Street on upper mtic humbe key with real estate numbers and fair with here 00400 810 0000000000 and 00400 4500000000 as legally described herein providing for the transmittal of this resolution to the Florida Department of Commerce and providing for an effective date um Council before we begin uh would like you to please disclose any expar Communications that you may have had with anyone uh on these are tabs J K and L and please include whether the person represented any group or entity as as well as the subject matter is the best you recall thank you Deb would you like to start sure uh the only thing I had is I sat on LPA when we heard J um which was the um map Amendment okay which was a public hearing are you going to recuse yourself again or we no I'm good on this okay just checking so now on this one I spoke to bark Smith and by the way the property phaser just says no split out you because there's no split out so the property is not split so it might be an easier way to say but um I've spoke to Bar okay Steve anything U Mr Pender in the back of the room Mr Pender did you talk to anybody about this or you just talking back there no we no oh I did B called to remind me was on the agenda but that's 's the only person I thought you need to be on M you need to be on M all right get some Cofe uh okay I didn't speak to anyone z z okay Jennifer thank you again Jennifer Doran planning director we're here this evening for the three uh tabs before you this evening regarding the Creekside uh motel or in Creekside in and The Islander um so this uh project is to take the existing hotel motel units at the creek side transfer them to The Islander for redel velopment and then convert the ex the the hotel at the creek side to Workforce affordable housing for the employees at The Islander so the first uh tab under J is the E zoning Amendment the reason we're that the applicant is requesting this is because the current zoning doesn't allow for the conversion of a hotel motel to Affordable units it allows for the affordable units just not the conversion of the hotel motel so in order to accomplish that they needed to go from a Village Center to Neighborhood commercial which does allow for the conversion of a hotel motel um the applicant submitted their letter of intent detailing this amendment request um they are looking again to to to transfer those Hotel units and then convert to Workforce affordable housing that analysis is in the packet the second tab is a amendment to a major conditional use for The Islander Resort this amendment to that major conditional use will take the uh 50 Hotel units that are being transferred from the creek side in and move those to The Islander and be redeveloped there there is a full sight plan um that has been reviewed by all your professional staff um and conditions have been um placed upon that for your review and approval um we have um received no letters of objection from adjacent Property Owners oh your your mic went off sorry sorry we've received no letters of objection as of this Council communication um the the the sorry the major conditional use meets all of the U requirements of the site plan approval and um we also had done um the reason it has taken so long to get one of the reasons that has taken so long to get back before the council is the traffic study that had to be um done and then after it was reviewed by a third party engineer um they needed some additional information and the applicant provided that and then was re-reviewed and then our traffic third party traffic engineer has since been satisfied so we have done that as well and then the final um tab in there is the transfer of development rights from the creek side in to The Islander Resort um again that's transferring those 50 units to The Islander Resort um the two sites are compatible there are both uh Disturbed sites there are both uh Shoreline sites um and they meet all of the criteria for transfer development uh I'm not going to do what I usually do and just read the entire thing because it would be reading reading reading so um it's all in your packet if you have specific questions I'm happy to answer them I know Bart has a a PowerPoint presentation so I'm sure I'll get more information there but I'm happy to answer whatever questions you might have you want to have anything for Miss Jennifer moment Mr Bart you ready yes thank thank you for uh uh having me this evening congratulations everyone on their election and happy holidays as well wow uh I can feel the cold in the room in the time of year this time I'm wearing a suit because I'm actually cold uh so yes as discussed this is uh uh the the first reading of of the proposals for the additional development at The Islander transferring the transient units there and then redeveloping Creekside as a affordable housing and as Jennifer stated the reason we need the the zoning change at uh side is because there's this little Nuance in the code that I learned actually at LPA from uh council member Gillis as to the the reason why and have now le been confirmed that with other others that the justification was because in the mid 2000s uh there was this huge rush to redevelop everything as Condominiums and to build big Condominiums and hotel rooms were being lost and so this was a way to to control the the movement of hotel rooms so in this instance we're not trying to build Condominiums and sell them off we're trying to build a housing for the employees of the hotel and so we we hope that you uh can see your way to prove it uh where is the so so this is the creek side you all know it well it's on on the water it's uh uh it has the transi units that were moving uh the units themselves will then be redeveloped a lot of this stuff is in your packet so I'm not going to go uh through it uh in much detail of course we have the luse district map Amendment which is quasi judicial because it's within the same uh future land use map and so when it's qu when it's quasi judicial uh by by uh evidencing that is in the same L use District map Amendment and it's not a threat to health safety or welfare then at that point you've proven that it is compliant with the the quas judicial procedure and therefore we would requ re EST that you find it in compliance and uh vote for approval of course then we have the conditional use approval as Jennifer's identified your staff has reviewed all of the requirements of the conditional use of process provided reasonable conditions that we've agreed to and that we would uh request that that be approved that's for the transfer of the 50 units as well as The Islander all right this is uh the the information on uh the uh the uh Creek Side which uh as you can see The Flume designation is mixed use Village Center is where it's at we're requesting to go to Neighborhood commercial next slide uh and this is for The Islander much bigger site a lot of different a lot of different flood zones there uh so as discussed uh this will the whole purpose of the L amendment is to move the property from uh to to allow it to be redeveloped affordable housing the property itself if we take out the ability uh to convert the hotel to affordable housing the uses are verbatim the same and that was brought up at LPA was uh and that's why we had such a significant vote of approval it's like normally you would worry why well what else can they do if they convert it from Village Center to Neighborhood commercial the reality was nothing it was this is the only thing that it that allows you to do is to build affordable housing in the existing building and not waste the building that's there and so we're going to put back 15 employee housing units and so that is the goal there's no ulterior motive here we if we had any other goal we could just stay in Village Center and and proceed not very good at this clicker but one day I'll figure it out uh so yeah so if if you look at the Village Center uh This what I was just talking about in fact the the floor area in most cases goes down uh your open space is the same uh the setbacks actually are uh a little more for uh the neighborhood commercial so we're actually you know uh we are down zoning the property in a sense from a higher more intense to a less intense but it still allows for the intended purpose which is to build employee housing and that's our goal we we were asked this question before why are you building 15 units only why can't you build more in the building well you have minimum size requirements for your units and so the most we can get is 15 and we're not even sure we're going to be able to get to 15 it maybe 13 or 14 but because of the 500 square foot minimum size requirement in your code which just a little suggestion maybe you want to change that because there are Studios and one bedrooms that are not 500 square ft uh so uh but the code as it is today requires 500 ft as the minimum and so we're going to meet the code to a t when we get there so as as stated uh when you review a lot Amendment you review for consistency with the comprehensive plan which is consistency with the future land use map consistency with the goals and intents of the comprehensive plan on the principles for guiding development and we've provided all of the explanations and I've just gone through this as to what we're going to do we've provided the amendment of analysis of the total Parcels the necessary need for affordable housing I don't think anyone can argue affordable housing isn't needed everywhere in the Florida Keys and so with that we believe that we have provided uh evidence uh that it meets the requirements for approval and we for for that tab we would request that you approve as uh request and is identified by staff the next is uh the TDR transfer this is the transient units so in order to build the employee housing you got to take the hotel rooms take them out transfer them over to Islander there's criteria in your code again this is a quasi judicial hearing and so we've uh documented the that they're both scarified both wet so wet to wet and that that the units there's appropriate density at the receiver side uh here is the the you must provide documentation that the units existed and that they This Is How They existed as a 2007 uh you have to document that uh they are both that you're going from a at least the same um type of habitat to a less sensitive habitat in this case the completely scarified pieces of land so it's permitted and uh you have to show that you can meet all the requirements of the code and we have done so on our site plan from The Islander so at this juncture we would also request based on the consistency with the comprehensive plan comp consistency with the Land Development regulations that uh you uh move for approval on the second item as it is in compliance with all of the standards as shown here shown in the staff report provided by the planning staff uh and that is the the TDR transfer and finally once they're transferred we have The Islander uh one of the largest actual properties in uh the village island rod and one of the few that actually has exist them density remaining uh you go through actually and Survey all of the properties in Isam did this a long time ago actually when uh Northwood was investing in chica Lodge and it was just fascinating to see that it's like overd overd overd and and so the question was is there anything that wasn't at the time there was only two properties I could find that actually were not overdense and one of the two was The Islander and so uh at this juncture what the idea is is to transfer these units over remodel a portion of The Islander to utilize some of these units uh and then uh and then to uh operate solely The Islander as the hotel here is the the site plan uh you note all of the works over on the North side the idea is is with all of these buildings is that they all face the water they all uh Encompass the like a u-shape and with everything pointing towards the water so if there is uh any anything the the the focal point is out towards the water not towards the neighborhood uh the entrance way Ingress and egress is not changing we've shown compliance with the traffic we've shown compliance with Ingress an egress which shown compliance with all portions of the code there's a long list of open space uh impervious surface height density intensity every part we provideed compliance and and we believe that it meets the code to T including there's your density calculation height parking setbacks open space buffers all in complaint mon uh and we've shown compliance with all parts of the comprehensive plan shown compliance with roads storm water uh and all the requirements in the conditional use so with that we would request that you also approve the conditional Amendment to the conditional use the is and so of course we're going to we're going to request three separate votes for clarity of the record but we would request that you vote uh for approval on all three requests that's that I'll take any questions and I thank you again anybody have questions for Mr Smith I do go ahead Don so Bart I read in the in in here where it talks about um it talks about the affordable units uh being put on on the property when we look at the Redevelopment of the affortable housing I kind of look at it on a building official and not a planning director View and so I look at a change of use uh it's a hotel now uh transient uses now we're going of multif family uses so to speak so I look at that as as having to revamp that site to some degree and so I didn't see a lot of talk about what was going to happen to that site is there is there anticipation to do any um reconfiguration on the on the on the site where the creek site is at this moment uh interior obviously we have to uh to do the remodels uh and of course uh based on I believe that it's uh the flood zone that we it will not exceed the 50% rule because if it did we would have to elevate and then the buildings would not be capable of reuse um we certainly have to meet all building permit codes for multif family use Fair Housing Act uh Ada accessibility but that's Ada accessibility not this see transient use actually has a higher threshold because it's open to the public yes it does whereas as you're very much aware uh when you then switch to multif family it's fair housing act which is the Ada accessibility standards which is providing at at least one unit with Ada accessible features uh uh one handicap parking spaces and accessibility to the actual unit and building I.E a ramp or walkway so to the extent that the building is non-conforming as of those because this is a change in use we will be we will be meeting compliance for all the parts that are required under FHA Ada accessibility and uh the fair housing act so we're we're taking a a hotel and I know that people come and go out of hotels uh is it the primary intention to use it for staff housing for the employees of the island that is a primary intent but I will state and I always State this about any place that uses affordable housing or Workforce housing units nobody wants units to be vacant uh the the the idea that if you have staff that desire to not live in your employee housing that you just leave units vacant seems to be not utilizing the the scarce housing we have for our Workforce because these are utilizing Workforce units so they are required to make 70% of their income from gainful employment in Monro County and so there's certainly at that point would be looking to lease them to other people that are gainfully employed in the workforce in Monro County County but there is an anticipation for an increase in staff because you're going from small hotel to a 5ar hotel or fourstar whatever it is and that requires a lot more staff so I mean it's a good thing that we're finding housing for the staff that would be there but I'm looking in the back of my mind saying 6:00 in the morning there's 20 people that are boogying from there to go to work in the morning and and night shift getting off and going back to the hotel or whatever so will there be some provision to have um let's say some transit system that Islander would Supply rather than having uh you know 20 cars go down the road and then 20 cars coming back to stay in that hotel yes to the extent that the it is utilized for employee housing for for twofold one one of the primary intents is to utilize uh the hb1 and J2 programs which are programs where you get uh workers that will work for a minimum of one year it's up to two years Visa people yeah correct and they're they're required to uh you're required to provide a shuttle two in from work and two and from uh the grocery store and I think there's one other place uh to the extent that we can utilize that we absolutely are uh but then you know it also then goes back to that point if if at a certain point because a hotel is not used utilizing it for their own employees and it's it's other Workforce than it would not because and I I'll explain it this way is is a hotel operator also doesn't want 20 employee cars having to be able to park on site and so yes they do intend to be running uh either a shuttle that they they operate or sharing with other operators of shuttles because a lot of times you can have a shuttle that can do multiple stops is there is there something in here I mean I think I read something but I'd rather you go on record is stating that that that um that there will be an agreement that there will not be any use of the hotel until the affordable housing units are have the their certificate of occupancy and they're in operation and we're not going to be dangling there with a operating hotel and these affordable housing units being stretched out for another 5 years yes and I think we actually agreed to that a condition condition if not we'll put it on the record that we agree we agree to a condition that the new hotel uh development cannot be coed until such time as the uh affordable housing units are coed at Creekside now I do want to I want to make be clear though because our preliminary plan right now is 15 units but I did cut one room was actually under 500 square ft so we might actually have to reduce it to like 12 or 13 units to meet that 500 100t threshold so uh but the the idea of saying Hey listen uh the creek side must be both buildings at Creekside must be coed for prior very comfortable with that provision because if it goes down a couple units at Creekside I don't want to be stuck that we agreed to 15 units but coed the all of Creek Creekside seed for affordable housing prior to CEO of The Islander you said that um you said that neighbor Hood commercial is very similar to Village Center when it comes to uses is there no intent when this thing turns into an affordable housing that we're not going to have any commercial fishing or we're not going to have any fishing and Diving and sailing and and uh renting boat spaces to dock spaces to commercial fishing or that kind of thing on the on that Canal is that is that no no there's no there's no no int it's going to be a pure affordable housing that's correct project and it's not going to be have some side commercial uses that are going to fall in place later on commercial use correct my my concern when stating that is is is you do still do have a dock and you do have people that are going to be residing there and so you can't stay we don't want to limit them if somebody wants to have somebody's living there and they got it somebody's living there they have a boat sure but I mean we're not going to be renting out doc Bas or that is correct not going to Ren it out out to a commercial fisherman it's going to leave their boat there correct yes you done so don what you're talking about if he's got a manager that's going to live there or somebody like that a department head and they have a boat they own the property there they should be allowed to put the boat there all right anybody El Mar thank you I appreciate that thank you I just want to clarify that we do have a condition and the major conditional use approval that no occupancy permits for Lander shall be issued until occupancy permits have been issued for the workforce of for housing at Creekside in thank you appreciate go ahead D I appreciate along turn your mic on sorry along the um line of Don's questions um is there a way of conditioning that that this is uh not going to be other businesses I don't know how to word that exactly um that run out of that dock or space I I know you're saying it isn't and I trust you to say that yeah but and there have to look at the future and there and there is but I don't want to word Smitha tonight if you could give us because we have to come back for another meeting okay if you can give direction to provide language as a condition for the next meeting so that I can get with uh John and Jennifer and work out that re re language I think that's great yeah we all we all understand the purpose you notate that for us please you the elevated building with an AE flood zone you can flood proof commercial uses underneath the building and and we're just looking at something that's going to be just Workforce supportable housing and not and understood and I just want to work on the language with them and bring it back to you at the next meeting thank you that's fine I will yeah go ahead you want me to go ahead and finish all right so Reserve okay so Jennifer I'd like to ask a question maybe Bart can answer is why if if is there any way that's feasible that if they need this thing to make this thing all 15 and be 500 is there any way they could endcap or something do something to gain a few square feet or anything to put a little addition or something to make so it is 15 Workforce housing I don't know maybe between you and Bart you tell me what you and let me answer this the problem with that building is is the construction of that building and the age of the building right I think we have an architect here who going to say we we would be scared to death to go through a wall and and then deal with the structural Integrity of the building and then be having to certify that to the building official saying we certified that that it meets the structural requirements of 180 mph wind load which good you answered my question go ahead dad you want to fish only if buddies you got other things I'm done you're done okay so um first of all I think this is pretty good project and you answered my question of why only 15 or 14 or whatever that ends up being um uh because I of course would like to see more but it's just not going to happen I got it um you answered the question about the density um I remember seeing that chart years and years ago that there was hardly any hotels in this town that weren't over density there was only a very small handful um and so you that's good um this idea of you having to change zoning districts um yeah I understand it but in the the public ey I I think I'd just like to say that it's not really uh you're you're not actually converting them in the zoning District you're moving them but in order to get from a to be it had to have a zoning change um and you're exactly right on why that ordinance came into existence there was a a move many years ago that several of the small hotels were being converted to condos and into a residential situation so that was stopped um your 15 units or whatever that ends I assume is coming out of early uh early 300 early out that's correct and I believe that it's been at prior commission discussions before this about it making making sure those are available for this so I I appreciate the prior commissions that work to make sure that we have those okay and um out of those 15 units um I assume in I found a drawing in here do you have an idea of how many beds that you'd be providing yes and I can't tell you from the top of my head and it will change on the based on the amount of bedrooms but you have occupancy require restrictions and so it's really based on bedrooms um I believe on the 15 units there was about 30 bedrooms I think it was about yeah I think that's kind of what I was seeing yeah I I think that's what it was about but having fresh set eyes and thinking about that 500 square ft I think we're probably going to lose a bedroom or two just because because when you lose units you have you're required to have a kitchen and then when you have those that takes away from that space so I think that number is going to be reduced um we don't want it to be we we like we like yeah I'm sure you could use them yeah we are can use them um these these will be um deed restricted so the income requirements will apply they're they're full deed restricted right are they that's correct yes yeah the workforce units the maximum any unit can do is I think moderate affordable units though that we have Workforce they're they're affordable too they're they're still under the affordable restrictions for income and and and rent restrictions so yes that's the that's what the the difference in that definition is is the income restriction um and I assume I assume that um your um these are being deed restricted under um I that's really not tonight's conversation I'm sorry but uh under um uh medium income restrictions I think that's all we have I would just ref to the code what the requirements of the code we don't have them defined but yeah it's I'll just refer to the code whatever the code provides for that restriction um is that it that's it unless I think of something else thank you wait a second Steve do you want to say something uh I I'll I'll wait till after public comment okay go ahead buddy yeah hey Bart just I just want to say something because I know there are some neighbors that are very concerned down there and like when she Gage did their conference center and the other 49 rooms they did and they went in by the Shrimp Shack there so just you know I know you guys are going to be very uh what's the word I want to use you think what's that respectful yeah respectful to the neighbors that you know lived there at the North End of Carol compared to like chica's people did and everything you know went off you got to make sure the grounds are kept clean and and you know stuff like that so I'm Absol I know you I've Ken Reynolds the construction manager of the project here he's been already making sure that whatever had the the organization of it uh he uh remodeled Baker's K which used to be the Hilton at mile marker 100 he also worked in Key West on remodeling the 212 um bed and breakfast is that uh were the now the kton properties and so you want to talk about tight quarters and being respectful to neighbors there were places where he had six between his property and the neighbor's property where he's helping to remodel those so I have all the confidence in cting this team thank you Bart that's I just want to bring that up okay anyone else no just along that same line is the respectful of when you're building of the noise Factor yes okay so uh I guess we start with anything else from you right now how about those who are in favor thank you thank you I don't have anyone's specifically signed up in favor then I guess we go to those not in favor okay we'll start with Elizabeth Jolan hello my name is Elizabeth Jolan at 81 991 Old Highway thank you for your service I welcome back well thank you um really I appreciate the good work that you're doing and um a couple of quick comments um I do live in that neighborhood and um I have noticed that an addition has been made to this plan that notes that if this is to move forward that the um construction work will go through the main gate and that's lovely um but I would also like to to uh ask you to have a conversation about why we even want to do this plan um it's a beautiful piece of um uh it's a beautiful request and and I know that we all adore Mr Smith and the gentleman here and the owners of The Islander um as as a community but I wonder if we can make this more about the community I know we were you were all ran on the policy of serving the community and I wonder how we benefit here how we as a community benefit um as opposed to just the owners of The Islander um we talk about our need for Workforce housing but let's let's be frank here this Workforce housing is to accommodate the expansion of a resort the J Mr Smith just commented about the workers will be H1 Visa Visa workers I mean those are not local people with jobs that that program is um one that brings foreign people to our country and to work and it's wonderful it's a way to have employees but this affordable housing is not serving me my neighbor the fishermen so so I just want to I I challenge you to have a meaningful conversation to answer the question of why we are um as a community of of of that you leaders are choosing to um almost double the occupancy of a of a resort which means a lot more traffic congestion we talk about congestion I mean this is a congestion problem um um we' like to talk about property rights and we all believe in them and that this I it might go without saying but um this is an entitlement this we are not taking away property rights from this group um if we don't allow them to increase their their their act their their numbers by almost half um I would urge you to have a conversation about a compromise some something in the middle um I I don't know how uh with all of the issues that we do talk about affordable housing congestion density busyness in our town I don't know how you could approve this actually um so let me just see if I have any more time left and I have anything else to say I don't think I do so I really thank you for having that conversation I look forward to hearing it play out tonight thank you next next is Van Caden [Music] head this is a great idea for the people that own the property it's a terrible idea for Alam marada uh I have the unfortunate history of uh knowing Leo Samuels who used to own The Islander back in the 60s and he sat with my mother who was the president of the upper ke's Chamber of Commerce uh when The Islander was a a medium priced destination for Middle America uh the overexpansion that has already happened on this property is uh taken away from the from the Ambiance of the of the community from the town and uh this uh purports to double the the uh number of rooms and I can't see how you're going to take 50 uh motel rooms and take them to the Islander for them to make 50 new motel rooms and you're going to turn 50 motel room building right units at the Creekside into 15 uh affordable housing which means 3 to one basically you're going to have to take three motel rooms and make one um affordable housing unit you know by the just by sheer numbers and the traffic that you're putting into the Village Center at Isam marada is already astronomical and to to put 50 more units in there just it's it boggles the mind the stupidity of the idea and and the fact that uh you already have a convention center and you already have a a museum there which are both high traffic and you've got already had a large expansion of The Islander from what it was in the' 60s a a large number of rooms have been added and this is just more on top of more and and uh it's good for the people that own the property but it's not good for Isam marada it's not good for the ambience of the community it's not good for the traffic and you're really not doing anything for the affordable housing uh if you left all 50 of those motel rooms at Creekside as 1 ones if if you rented them to bus boys and waiters and cooks and and yard people maintenance for The Islander and left them 50 then you would you know I could see a whole lot better uh outcome of this kind of a swap but but the the tdrs that you're you're allowing 50 units of um medium priced motels which is what is mar is built on because those are the people that come down and rent charter boats and they're the people that come down year after year with their families they're not going to be able to come down and afford to stay at The Islander with these 50 fancy schmancy that they're fixing to build and and the the uh the the square square footage is going to increase the density and intensity is going to increase and I just think it's a terrible idea and and it's good for the people that own the property but it's not good for Al thank you very much okay Marne next is Joe wishme yes Joe wishire Plantation key the first thing I would like to comment on is because we're doing so many tabs at the same time but we're still only allotted our three minutes exactly just does not seem to be quite correct uh the first thing I'd like to talk about is the density the density of The Islander you're allowed six units per acre now I know that I heard earlier well we still have a couple extra that we could do yeah well that couple extra I don't think equals 50 now I understand there's a little confusion in the tdrs if you get a TDR and put it on a property voila you can go from six units to 12 units an acre I think that sets a bad precedence because now any Resort or motel could get like one TDR and like oh well now I can double myself in size that does not serve the Comm community at all and I think that that also uh should be looked into you're not going to be reducing the traffic at all because you're going to be taking 50 units and you're going to add 15 more it was my understanding in the beginning that you were going to just use the hotel units and that's why they closed down one of my favorite restaurants made to order which I can't go to cuz they were going to use that as a kitchen for all the people who were going to be there well I guess that's changed now too so I don't know if they'll do anything about that I don't know if you all got a chance to read the Upper Keys weekly today but there's an article in there that a company that was retained by Monroe County evaluated infrastructure for the addition of 220 rogo units their conclusion was that would result in 1,37 New daily trips on US1 current deficiencies exist on US1 on upper mumbi and windley keys in Isa marada with 220 new rogos over capacity issues would be exasperated from B Mark 79.5 to 86 so not only that but now you are you just approved asking for 200 more units just for Isa marada not including the 220 that the county may get so how many more trips daily is that going to also add and you're going to and you're going to add these units right in the middle of Isam marada which is already one of the most congested areas of US1 we all know how the traffic is in there and you're just going to keep increasing and increasing the traffic flow until you might as well just have a bike bcle because that's the only way you're going to be able to get around so I implore you to make sure that you reconsider this decision because The Islander was already redone several times thank you Marne next is Frank orti how's everybody doing hey I wasn't sworn in I was outside um is that you would need to be sworn in now yes okay in the matter in which you're to provide testimony do you swear to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth yes I do thank you okay um how's everybody doing here good um you know I'm listening to all this talk about they're bringing these units from up there to alamada and they keep saying well it's wet to wet it's all compatible um it's not compatible that's a four-lane road up there it's congested in alamada it's packed and you say it's compatible but it's it's really not the road out there is a whole another animal compared to what we're dealing with in alamada um you know I live on Carol Street my dad lives on Carol Street I grew up on Carrol Street um it's you know it's affecting going to affect the neighborhood I was here with the village started with the with the uh Museum and uh they agreed that they weren't going to bother us there on on Carol Street we gave them the middle of the road we give them variances all the properties so they can keep growing into this big monstrosity I mean um I think it's just got to stop I or just you know some kind of compromise with just just expansion that's going on I'm a fishing guide you drive down the water and you look and it's just like building after building after building and the environment is just really getting hurt from all this it needs it needs some relief and I think you guys ought to think about this um really put a lot of thought into this because they keep saying it's compatible it's the same it's not the same it's in tavanir it's not in alamada you're bringing all that down to alamada which is already packed I mean uh the traffic the employees coming in and out of there um I just uh I don't know uh I think that's enough I think okay thank you Frank all right thank you for your time anybody else you know I do have one more minute here right if this does go through I was here at the Village meeting when they were going to do the conference center and they agreed not to disturb us on Carol Street and I came to fight with this and all of a sudden they said no problem they put a buffer there they put a Swale there they put trees and they made it look beautiful I didn't get it in writing I would made a mistake and I didn't ask for it and writing I agreed the previous owner looked right over was over here and they said absolutely no problem if it does go through that Carol Street is remain undisturbed as long as I'm there please it's just it's it's it's it's very important that you save some of the community the neighborhoods that are so vital to this whole area um thank you Frank thank you Frank Marty anybody else uh yes next is Sue Miller Tinker Bell come on up Sue Miller my first comment is I object to the fact that I representing the alamara Community Alliance will only get five minutes I think that when I'm talking about three different public hearings that uh it is unfair to um restrict me so I'm going going to start and I you can just turn me off whenever you want to and I won't be happy okay the entire justification for this is first about the zoning change the entire justification um for the zoning change is to allow for the Redevelopment of the motel structure in conjunction with The Islander Resort um there have been discussions about mending our regulations to provide for Workforce housing is the primary use for affordable housing but right now we have affordable housing in our code we don't have Workforce housing and so is it going to be a contingency in the contract that it be Workforce housing and not affordable housing not the standard affordable housing as provided in the alamada code um our code section 30-56 F regarding the transfer of Hotel unit state the conversion to affordable housing on the sender site shall be completed prior to the issuance of a building permit on the receiver site or the hotel units on the sender site must be demolished are we just ignoring our code now to accomplish the zoning change the first reading second reading and approval of the of Florida con Merce will all take place in the building permits for The Islander we'll have to wait until the zoning change is completed if we follow our code so I don't understand how they are changing our code in the use of it according to our code the sender site Redevelopment must meet the density requirements so I understand that it's going to be 15 units per acre or less um but without a site plan in our agenda um we really are left to guess whether there will be any affordable housing you haven't tied these three together except to restrict the length of time I'm allowed to talk you there's no there's no contingency that one has to follow the other that all three have to take place there is no guarantee that they'll ever do affordable housing is there I'm going to go on to the next one to the um major conditional use they had to do a traffic study clearly the traffic study um was based on the 2021 study that was done by the county not the 2023 study that the the county didn't approve which would have completely eliminated the opportunity to do what they're doing because we would then fall under the level of service allowable and and so the upper mumi is classified now as a level of service e with a maximum Reserve capacity of minus 883 trips and this traffic study that was done increases the number of trips to four by 432 so now we're over 1,300 in AAR on upper maumi does that tell you something about how much we need to look at traffic in this town and why don't we look when we're only looking at the level of service for the entire Monroe County we never look at other projects we're just saying well this project won't take us over the limit for all of Monroe County but we're ignoring what's going on everywhere else we're ignoring the trips generated by the new public and tavanir by what happens when postcard in comes back online a condition um created by staff no occupancy permits doesn't work for me at all the building there is a building that's shown that's in a vzone where you're not allowed to build in a V you're not allowed to transfer into a vzone there's no signed and sealed survey as required to tell us exactly what the square footage is on the receiver site um Mr Smith went to law school to learn how to to baffle the government I went to school as a math major to learn how to calculate and I will tell you that calculating the allowable density at assuming the there's an existing 14 114 units at six per acre you use up 19 of your AC out of 20 so then you have the non-residential space and that takes up another two acres so now you've used up all your acreage there is no room to move 56 units based on the density calculation that a math major uses I know that lawyers use different numbers than math Majors do okay I let you go over Sue so don't be mad thank you okay um anyone else Marney no ma'am okay Bart you better get up here and defend yourself uh yes so um I I most of those things don't even require a response uh they're simply incorrect the staff has provided the correct calculations including with tdrs uh the transferences are being done with the Inc conformance of the code one point I do want to point out is is that actually our intent for those units is 50 about 50% are for managers which are not H1 and uh couples that will be both working on the site which are also not hb1 so we the the current design has five managers that will be in that building and two to three for for couples that would we also would be have at that the reality is is is that you have two hotels right now both have managerial managerial cleaning staff and every person you combine them into one hotel you are reducing staff needs the other part of it is instead of having staff that has to come from homestead they are not having to drive down the floor to keys and so this will actually reduce traffic reduce the amount of employee demand and that the units will be utilized by people that are part of the community uh even people that are here for a year are part of our community we are one human family and so I I wholeheartedly agree with that statement finally these are quas judicial hearings we must we we must provide proof uh that we meet all the pro provisions of the code and that if there are any um uh parts that we we uh that we uh are shown to not be in compliance then we have to provide uh some type of offset the parts that have been identified such as providing the cosos providing the conditions that we've agreed to have been done and so therefore we would request that you vote for approval and I'm here to answer any other questions you have does anybody up here have any questions for Bart go ahead Don I do I have a couple go ahead um will you address the vzone issue that uh uh that Sue brought up because no units are being transferred into a vzone no units are going to be in the vzone that's correct okay um the there we're transferring there's 50 units at Creek sign correct and we're transferring 50 down there correct what are we reading about 56 units there's another six units we're going to take from the other Islander and transfer we haven't applied to transfer those yet the you know we have that Islander Bayside we're going to transfer six units from there but we just haven't applied on those yet those are the ones that are across from the turtle and and what happen What where so what are those six going to turn into or they that are coming from the across the way uh the same same thing hotel rooms they're they're already identified on the the side plan for the amendment to the and what's going to happen to the ones that are being transferred those units uh what do you mean are they going to turn into they're access they're no they're access units that aren't even being utilized at this juncture they're excess from what happened there correct okay so they tdrs are in they just sitting yeah they're paper all right can de go I just have a question related to the units and then you can have it back go ahead okay so I thought the six units and if I'm wrong I understand I thought the six units were the ones that came from um it was the little Motel on the canal on the the Bayside just north of their uh The Islander didn't buy those no no uh you me um bought yeah chica bought those chica bought those yeah they're from they're they're paper form from side yep Mr Pender do you have anything no uh anything um I does I'd like to know if anybody from the public would like additional time if they had if they felt like they were cut off and had some other things that they wanted to discuss that's up to the m oh great well Mr Mr Quick how does that work since we combined at them and everything I mean they've been given opportunity to speak if you all want to give them more uh that's fine I just would remind people that needs to be based upon competent substantial evidence not just um sentiment that is what is required to to support any decision of the council does did you guys understand that do you want to have another couple minutes to speak of course you do come on up okay come on let's wait before you get started why don't why don't we establish how many minutes so that the clerk can set a timer two two two okay two my name is Frank Ortez and um again I just want to say if you guys go forward with this that Carol Street somehow gets written down on paper there will not be no access through there at all I don't want to come back here another couple years and say oh here they got they they got their Museum and here they're going to come plowing through here again here they got their 50 units over here and you know what we changed our mind we need to come through here we don't want the traffic through there I made to deal with the previous owner and they I didn't get it in writing I would like it on paper so I don't have to deal with this I plan on dying here on Carol Street I'm not moving this thing just makes me all worked up I feel like I want to leave and I've never felt like that before it's just it's so sad what's going on in this little town that I grew up in I was born here like I said and it's it's just sad to see what's going on and um just you know if if you're going to come through which they're probably going to come go ahead and bulldoze right in there and do whatever they're going to do please Carol streets got to be eliminated off the whole the whole picture of this like they agreed to when they got the village yes sir we have agreed that Carol Street is a emergency Ingress and eess for a fire only already it's a condition okay and we'll get it in writing okay okay all right thank you anyone else faster yes I guess Joe wishm Plantation key I guess then one of my biggest question was if you're not going to transfer any to Creekside but you're transferring all 50 units from Creekside to Islander where the 15 permits going to come from for this Workforce housing out of bass out of B pass they'll have to come out of the affordable housing B pass okay Elizabeth did you want to come back up Elizabeth uh Elizabeth 81 991 Old Highway again we're pretending that you've passed this you haven't and that discussion needs to be to happen why are we even entertaining it in the first place I mean Frank is like the perfect example of everything that we hear on this Das about the old-timers the old-timers he it we he's the old time he's really old and I mean not Frank but his dad Frank is old and then I'm a little bit older younger older than he is but this is what we're talking about I also wonder if you can even entertain this conversation with with so many questions that you have about I mean you know Bart is not going to be standing at The Islander gate for us to go and say hey Bart it's too noisy it's too he's not going to be there even though he is lovely man right it this is not Bart's project he's just presenting the owner I wonder if you might well I mean obviously I think it's a bad idea all around I don't know how you could justify it I don't even know how you can entertain it without this affordable housing project to laid out in front of you with all of the details but again you haven't even gotten that far because you haven't even made a decision about whether this makes sense for our town so I appreciate the extra time thank you anyone else in two minutes not 22 I want to show you that I'm a packrat these These are um sales brochures that I had when I was a realtor and I haven't been a realtor for over 20 years close to 25 years um the total size of the property appears to include residentially zoned Lots not eligible for hotel use the calculation of non-residential where did the square footage come from when calculating density there's no documentation as to the size of the museum conference room multiple restaurants retail space offices just a total number that seems significantly lower than reality there's no verification of the permitted number of hotel rooms at Creekside that's why this comes in because the sales brochures back when they were originally sold didn't have the same number of hotel rooms that they have now I went check there are no permits to add to those the applicant using the Monroe County requirements um numerous times we're Alam marada we don't use the Monroe County requirements the parking U for Monroe County code is different than the village code so the parking was was based on on county code which requires less parking no parking was shown for two restaurants and a bar the site plan shows eight 89 new units not 56 some appear to be the result of eliminating guest Suites and converting them to non-residential space or what else they're not being demolished they're the the rooms are being rebuil at another location nonresidential bass should be required the density calculation should be updated the TDR ordinance no survey of the receiver site to explain the calculations the staff says they're 22.8 Acres the property appraiser says 21.12 the traffic study says 2.83 the staff apparently included residential lots no documentation as to the existing non-residential square footage to determine what the remaining density is according to my calculation 114 units at six per acre is 19 Acres 20,5 196 non-residential at two at .25 floor area ratio is 1.89 Acres leaving. 3 acers or three new units allowable left for added units all depends on the required survey that is not provided in the agenda okay we get it thank you okay thank you anybody else Marty or can we there's no one else okay now does barket to Reb again since we opened it back up we should provide that same opportunity you'll wave okay so now let's can the council have a okay absolutely yes who wants to go first I guess I will okay um so I had a I had a very good um agenda brief uh with the staff when the agendas came out and um I had a lot of questions about this and uh and appreciate the the the time and the support that staff gave me to try and get me up to speed because um it is uh it is a very complex issue um notwithstanding 700 pages but the nuances the inconsistencies that um that I I I tried to grasp I I feel like I grasp the concept I just don't see how it's going to be beneficial to the community I see it being more beneficial to the ownership if You' like to address that I'm I'm happy for you to answer that um I I do have concern for the joining uh Community namely Carol Street uh they've had their own issues in the past uh I think they're still having issues um with the history and Discovery Center with the uh weddings and and and um other events that that may spill out a little bit later a little bit loud um I I'm also concerned that uh that we're we're we're getting rid of another small business here another small ma andpa uh motel and maybe that benefits other small ma andpa Motel owners by eliminating some of those but as Frankie alluded to earlier um for people uh like him and myself it's it's a it's a smaller demographic that's coming to the Keys that's going to be able to afford um you know $1,000 night hotel and ,000 a day in fishing and so I think that we're losing that aspect in this community by getting rid of these um let's say more affordable hotel motels um so there just there are too many inconsistencies I have I have more questions uh that arise just by delving into it there are terms in there that that uh I don't even know what they are first to admit it so I I am I'm not comfortable um supporting this and I think we know that I am opposed to overdevelopment and that's what this uh seems to be to me okay well I'd like to jump in there too because it seems to me I would like for you guys to come back with something better because if I feel like it's all on this side for you and we're getting this and that's is how I feel I own a business in Al marada um I'm born and raised down here like everybody else and I'm not going to go on about my family but I'm just saying I don't you know you're supplying housing for 15 people yet you're putting 15 50 Hotel units on there 15 people aren't going to take care of 50 guest or 50 rooms so now we have an imbalance where now we have more people who are going to be looking for homes down here or traveling back and forth on the road um I do have a lot of questions like Steve has I just don't feel this is being presented where it's balanced if that makes sense I I don't feel like everything that could have have been done has been done I almost would like for you guys to find more housing you know because 15 units to me doesn't really do much and I love The Islander I have my fishing tournaments at The Islander they're great people it's a great Resort I question too you're squeezing more into this hotel that's already laid out beautifully but that's not my place to determine that's the owners and their decision but I'm not getting the balance where this community benefits and I know Carol Street and I know that access Rose was utilized when the convention center and the museum were built and that's not really fair to them so I think I don't think everything was done or presented that balances out what's even for me so anybody else you know here lately I've been tagged as the concrete Coalition guy and I'm not sure why I'm a home builder but I look at um I I I I tend to agree that that that's downtown is it's the small area it it's a it's a lot it's a lot to add right there in downtown alada and it's a u and it's and it's a little a little to get with 15 14 12 affordable housing units that really still have concern about the Creekside and the Redevelopment on the Creekside area there's there's absolutely no storm water management on that site it's a 1950s 60s uh site that has uh you know every drop of water the hits s runs right into that Canal it's a gorgeous Canal I used to own a a piece of property on the corner sunny and Bessie and it was just full of um a seahorse and stuff and I don't see that anymore and I know we're doing a lot of good things and cleaning up our environment and stuff but this doesn't help the that area uh Frankie is 100% right we're moving uh we're moving a small hotel in a four-lane five Lane six Lane area because we have the old road we have the highway that's there and it's a divided area uh and all of a sudden we're shoving a 56 units which is confusing to me how we can approve tonight 56 units uh when we haven't addressed where the six units are coming from and you told told me where they're coming from but I don't see that in the plan here uh and and maybe it was addressed and maybe it wasn't um I don't want to deny this but I sure don't want to approve it the way it's presented and maybe Sharon said it the right way maybe we need to go back to the drawing board and really think about this um you know um Franky starting to look more and more like his dad and damn it I hate that you know and uh but I loved Manny and Isa and those folks and and and and uh uh I think you know this concrete Coalition guy has got to say we got to think about this in that area that's that's downtown heart of the heart of this city and and uh it hurts me to think that we're going to add to just a ton of traffic right there in that in that little area uh you know the Laurel ey is successful the Chica is successful and every time the chicaa has something going on they got to find a spot to park and I think the last time they had that you know we parked off site and we transferred in and um I got to think about this I I got to think about this thank you buddy or Deb so I think I I think I alluded to it that I don't think 15 is enough but I think 15 affordables sorry is enough um I expected a higher number but I also know that our inclusion are's own uh ordinance probably came up with that um square footage of of requirement um I don't I know I know there's a correlation and I don't remember enough of the details in order to U say that's true but 15 15 is light 12 is even lighter I understand why it's 15 and why it's 12 in your plans um the other stuff I I think I think we've made a stronger presentation about protecting Carol Street um and uh it's it's got to be a constant reminder because no offense to The Islander but they flip managers um on a regular basis and the new management doesn't remember the old rules and so it's it's like a lot of stuff you know it's every time you change people then you need to be reminded again of what the rules were and how to behave [Music] um it's getting harder and harder for small mtel to exist on their own so uh Islander has owned the Creekside property for a long time now and uh I can't address how their operations have been going but it it's it's very difficult to run a small motel anymore it really is um the the number of units that's part of the reason I asked about how many beds is because the number of units if you've got several beds in each one you you're you're working it as a um dormatory style kind of more than a dormatory style but um if you're if you're taking one unit and putting four or five beds in that unit that's what this plan looked okay so just give me a minute then you can have the floor um you said that 50% of them those units I'm I'm sorry I'm all about the affordable side of it I always have been um 50% of a your units would go to managers or couples um they have to meet those income requirements uh under the affordable we have not under the workforce we do not have the workforce ordinance in our c offers at this time we have the affordable ordinance there is a difference okay [Music] um okay I'm done before he goes Buddy hasn't had a chance so turn your mic on you know I'm I'm sitting here thinking about these guys and and you know what K clubs was going to bought Creek Side in was going to build all condos along there okay until they went out so here the these guys are following our rules that's what I don't understand no they're following what what they said and here's the thing the village is a fishbowl you can't bring anything in and you can't take anything out so this is what the the people chicage had to go around and buy con side I mean conchin whatever it was all these hotels to get the rooms to do the 49 units I mean I don't this is Redevelopment and first of all The Islander I knew Leo Samuels very well I and I know Frank where Frankie grew up and that Frankie was one of the reasons why I asked about the residence and Elizabeth because Carol Street I know is is very sensitive and but it's one of the biggest F properties in Upper mumbi key if if we've looked into it I know the size of that property it's all ground level okay Leo Samuels didn't go three or four stories Hotel you know three or four just like Amer was was then could go higher than the 35 ft but you know it just it it really gets me that we Bart is working with Jennifer okay our staff and they're they're you know I I I just don't understand it they spent all this money and this time working on this how how many years ago Bart did did you guys buy the creek s in a couple years ago oh it's more than three years okay yeah yeah it is I can't recall things further than that right now so three four years you know there there my thing is people follow our procedure we do they go do what we ask them to do and then they come in here and and and we turn them down that's not true oh I'm just that's not true buddy I mean it there's a balance nobody turned them down no I'm just saying what I'm saying it's it's it's a lot of times people I know for a fact that they came in they followed everything and then once and Jennifer was not here I'm talking about some previous planners that we had here and and then they come in and then they got to do something else and then when they come back I've had people crying in the parking lot okay before I was ever a counsel person all right bety jcx when she did the the Bad Boy Burrito I mean she did two traffic studies why other people put things in Upper M ofi didn't have to do any traffic studies what is good for to Goose and Van commented the other night is good for the gander we got to follow we got to have some consistency here all right I I I understand there could be things we can tweak or we can do I'd love to see him build for a few more affordable units but anyways that's all I have to say I just say that it is one of the biggest F ARS floor area ratio properties all right uh in Upper mumbi actually in Alam marada maybe even outside alamada but you know it this is Redevelopment the way I look at it anyways I'm finished part go ahead okay to start with this is quasi judicial the requirements are to meet the code we are meeting the code what Isam Rada gets is that Isam Rada gets Redevelopment right now these properties are not providing employee housing what you're getting is not just 15 units right now the plan is 60 bets so 60 employees that's going from zero to 60 you are right down that site will be required to meet the current codes for drainage for every part of the code when you redevelop a site drainage must meet the current code there is no current drainage it will meet the current code for drainage meeting every code requirements means that no water can be discharged from the property into the water or onto the street not happening now when you look at what is happening at Creekside you will see 100% Improvement you will provide employee housing for 60 people and right now it's zero that is an incredible benefit that is not required to get a conditional use approval for the Redevelopment of your hotel when you meet the stand standards for redevelopment uh then you are entitled to the permit this is not legislative it is quas judicial meeting the standards means entitlement to the permit so stating we need something outside of those requirements that is not how the code is provided that's provided for the consistency we're providing the employees we're going above and beyond there's one thing I want to bring up because there's the neighbors Carrol Street Ken met with a bunch of the neighbors met with barnab the other day who's a neighbor barnab was concerned about noise he showed how these bill face forward so there's not going to be noise we've agreed on the the that it's not for angas and egis it's a fire exit only we are actually going above and beyond on that buffer and we can provide that buffer so you can write into the code at the next meeting but we're going to do uh zoa and kusia so you know big high bushes that are this just basically soundproof and thick because idea is to give more of a buffer to them than exists now and will provide more of a buffer than it's ever been so we are very cognizant of providing these things to the neighbor they are part of the plan they are in the conditions and so what I would ask for you is to look at your code look at the requirements that have been met look at the things that have been done above and beyond it and based on the code and the requirements of the code under quas judicial follow the code prove it and we will stand by everything we've done thank you you know it's not that I don't think you're following the code I just first of all I'm wondering where you get 60 people in 12 rooms no no no no no there's not 12 rooms units units there's multiple bedrooms in each unit what makes you think what happens if I wanted to apply and I'm by myself what you going to say I got to get three roommates I'm just saying you you're only going to let people live there who have three other people with them the the intent is these are for employees oh no thank you okay well it's our import I I know we have to follow the code and everything but it just doesn't make sense to me what what we're getting and what you're getting that's just me I'm balancing it out whether it's a code it's I don't care what it is it doesn't make sense to me at this point I don't feel we're getting what you're getting and you don't have to agree with me and nobody and what are you looking for the village to get then well I well first of all do something about wiing the road in all marada to make it so we and then we're not getting I don't think you're housing your people for your expansion you're not helping all Marauder with the people who already need housing that's the way I'm looking at this too I mean that's that's outside the scope of the review and that's outside the scope of what's done I mean I just have a problem with it so well then we need to change our code what you're saying Sharon because it's that's not right if you're following the code I hit the code thing it's not that I'm disputing the code it just doesn't make sense to me how this is balancing out that's it okay you know uh buddy and you are are alluding to um adhering to everything to the code but isn't what you're asking to is to change that code because the way that it's set up now it doesn't fit no The Narrative okay no it is this is the procedure for a conditional use approval which is when you exceed a certain threshold you're required to get a conditional use approval it's reviewed for these standards if you meet these standards then based on the the the evidence provided which we provided the evidence you entitled to the permit okay and then just one other separate question changing the code you had mentioned when you started that uh some of those units would be going to the uh to the hb1 uh possibly could be all be people that are are are not that are not but if not them then where do those guys go cuz you're still going to hire them no you're not necessarily going to hire the H1 no not necessarily by the way if you do you're required to provide housing so so you and you can't look at who's occupying a unit like as as a government like I would be very cautious under Fair Housing Act is say well who's going to be in a unit I mean we that's that's a very slippery slope right there so I would I would very caution about making statements about who's occupying housing okay Don so Jennifer help me with this please so we're going to be approving the transfer of 50 units but we're approving 56 at The Islander so the save L shows the 56 they have not approved for the the transfer yet for the additional six but they wouldn't be able to obviously build those until but would we be approving 56 if we approve this so typically we ask them to add everything that they want on a site plan so that and a conditional use permit so that they don't have to come back for those things they will have to come back for the transfer but then they won't have to amend their plan once that piece is if they don't get those transferred they can't build those additional six that's correct well and and and on all three of these requests staff is recommending approval so staff has taken how long have you been working on this Jenifer uh this was on my desk when I got here for the village two years ago two years so at least two years I mean somebody worked you've worked on it for years somebody worked on it prior to me correct you know one of the things that we don't have in a code that the county has is you have to have a community meeting uh before um which which lets the community weigh in at at that time and and you've been to many of those and I've been to many of those you got to schedule the meeting the the the the public has to come we don't have that maybe we ought to think as a collecting of having something like that but but as I've watch so many of these we have to base our decision on the facts that are presented in the test testimony that is presented and and and then we look at staff's recommendation and um I think we're making a mistake if we um if we go off of uh if we if we just don't look at what staff is recommending approval on all three it's Redevelopment I don't think so yeah so that's all there is here Don so part of the reason that I asked I the one that brought up the bit about how many beds yes because I could see in the drawing that some of the units it looks like and I know it's just conceptual because you got to figure that out yet uh but looks like some of the units would have one and others might have six or five beds in them um Can can I answer that so the maximum occupancy is two beds per per bedroom and so we have three bedroom we have three bedroom the unit yeah so we have three bedroom un so they have six BS so there two okay I I understand that I do understand it if you want to clarify that for others I do understand you're talking two per bedroom some of the units have three bedrooms that's six people y or they're small so you've got maybe five people corre but you have others that have one that might be for that manager and his wife or her wife or her husband that's the current setup yes you know um but that that is why I was getting there is because you you only said that you were building maybe hopefully 15 and but you're going to house more employees than that absolutely we would love to house as many as we possibly can of course you would let me know if you have any left over oh sorry um but that is why I brought that up is because 15 doesn't sound like a lot and because if you're doing one on ones um 15 isn't a lot you're going to be hiring more than 15 people so um yeah I I don't know how I don't it it's very difficult to get around the fact that uh more units in the center of vamr is going to um increase traffic to a degree um the fact that they pull them off the road and go into the property is is different um we would have Jennifer would we have another site plan approval after this or is this it uh they would you would not see a s plan approval they would come to uh planning staff with the site plan approval for the creek side units if they did any um exterior or remodeling or addition or anything about what about The Islander no this is the approval of The Islander unless they made any additional changes um CU I didn't count parking spaces I didn't do all the detail we did that for you thank you I appreciate that we're overp parked um and and you will have events there so there needs to be an allowance for parking because of of um they're not in the motel that's some of the other redevelopments that I've seen you know they yeah the letter of the law said that they that's all they needed but we that's not all you need yeah we have because they're operating it we have more than sufficient parking we are confident in the parking numbers okay um I don't know I I really really would like to approve this I worry about the affordables you're done yeah go ahead buddy yeah so you know I don't know chica has they built 10 rooms there they got 40 people in those 10 rooms that's what the number was and this this was done before I was ever on Council chica was it was already approved all right so can I get question go ahead Jennifer have have you in any way calculated what the uh mitigation fees will be for the additional affordable housing units that may be required uh we have not we don't typically do that till they apply for a building permit stage we felt at this stage it would be too early because we did not know if the council was going to approve this number or a different number so we didn't we don't usually do that until building permit are there conversions of some of the rooms that are existing on there into other spaces uh yeah back of back of the house space like basically storage we're converting things to storage so those things would also trigger more uh success mitigation fee for TR for affordable housing so the the the the shortage of the units in mitigation fee plus uh whatever changes over there back of the house or whatever okay that's correct and just to put your mind at ease like we would certainly agree we we will have at least 10 units at that property with you know a minimum of of at Creekside property yeah Creekside because like I want to commit to 15 because like I looked at the last plan just but if you wanted to put a condition on there a minimum of 10 units must be coed with at least 20 bedrooms I think we could state with confidence the plans will provide a minimum of that we are going to maximize it out but if you want we are agreeable to that condition to put a minimum threshold 10 units 20 bets so there would still there's still in in my limited knowledge there still would be additional uh um mitigation needed for affable because I suspect I suspect that the hotel rooms that were at Creekside were 300 350 square ft give or take yeah and the the new ones you're going to build are a little bit bigger and and if I remember the code correctly and I didn't I'm I apologize I didn't ask you these questions in our our meeting um the the the difference is you have to pay a mitigation Andor building fee and I don't know how that applies directly to what they will be doing at Creekside in building remodeling the units that's correct it's a square footage it's a square footage or fee and so we certainly we're going to provide all the square footage maximize the square footage at the creek side to provide that and then whatever else we're going to provide by Fe correct Yeah well yeah this is where way back we I thought we made our mitigation fees say that mitigation um ordinance say that you had to build but we put a stipulation in there that you could pay if you could not figure out how to build mhm but it turned out that it wasn't as strong as I thought it was and we allowed people I'm not picking on you guys we allowed people to not build and give us the money instead and the money doesn't get the job done so that's that's why I'm asking these questions that's why I I push as hard as I do to have as many units Andor beds as we possibly can and we are in the same boat that's why we put we'll we'll agree to the condition to put it at 10 units minimum 20 beds but I I just until the final because when we go to Life Safety plans you know getting out of Ingress and egress two means an Ingress and egress out of a unit you want to make sure so the the the the square footage up there um there's other there's you're converting the if I was recognizing the the the building sizes yep um you're converting the existing buildings like the the restaurant buildings into uh Apartments also at Creek Side yeah no you know like the made to order building that's a different no it's a different parcel even it's not even the creek side parcel what are you doing with it's staying as is it's leas isn't it leas you kick the leases out but it's it's not even it's not part of the project it's not part of anything yeah that's being done it's a separ it's a separate parcel but yeah you own it yeah yeah not me but sorry corre you you're correct it might be sold off separately it may be released it's not part of any part of the identified project I where I'm going with this is you've got another parcel that you could build on for affordable I'm just throwing it out there you do I'd be happier with that I mean it seems to me that we the better it seems to me that we we still have have a lot of questions we still don't even know how many affordables I I don't know how we can move forward with this at this time that's because you judge by the code well the the the exact numbers the exact numbers that I'm pushing him for really isn't part of the the the item in front of us that doesn't mean that we can't have the discussion because it's a good time to have the good the discussion but it is not part of the uh the code that we actually have in front of us is the problem really doesn't matter if there's two or 20 uh because the the code is going to require them to either build or mitigate for that willable units when it's in during the Redevelopment it's yeah it's a requirement of Redevelopment whether it's a conditional use or not a conditional use if I if I'm just build building back a non-residential space that's a th000 square feet that doesn't even rise to threshold of a conditional use I still have my affordable housing requirement yeah conditional use just means that it's the the Redevelopment or the development is of a nature that it's at a level that it needs to be reviewed by the commission but it's still the same criteria for meeting the code that is for a building permit if you have a, 1500t office space and you want to build a new, 1500t office the same conditions are going to be required you just don't go to the commission for it you know Steve they're looking at the code I'm not looking at the code I'm looking at a balance and that's so that's why I have a problem and I know you met the code and I know they said yes and and I'm looking at the mission and I don't see how this listen I'm right there too but you know I mean that's what they're going to vote on is the code where I'm not that's what I'm going on I know I know okay so how can we change the code I'm not asking you to change your code doesn't mean I have to like they're following what the code is I get it I get it okay so maybe we got to change code in the future well that's not helping us now maybe we need maybe we need a little guidance from our attorney here we are supposed to render a decision based on the testimony and the evidence that's been prevent presented to us today correct based on the standard is based on competent substantial evidence uh whether it supports the um uh that they've met the criteria that set forth in not how we feel necessarily but what are we meeting the code and and has our planning director reviewed this and recommended approval and the testimony says that these guys have met the code as it relates to transfers and it relates to density and intensity and parking and all of those things right correct all based on the record before you testimony documents uh in that are part of the record evidence yes I get that I'm functioning on feeling I get it and I so you guys vote how you want I'm going to vote my feelings and it's still going to pass or whatever so and do I have a motion well just one more thing I I just we keep talking about how this is just re Redevelopment this is new construction talk it's not Redevelopment it can't be physically impossible you're you know they're not going outside the footprint of the property okay it's it's unit to unit it's it's in the city I got it you got I got it I got it so where do we want to go you guys somebody want to make a motion make it well we have to make them independently correct right [Music] yes so on J which is the change in the zoning uh I make a motion to approve as presented to change the zoning I second Marne call the rooll please council member Deb Gillis yes vice mayor Don Horton yes council member Steve fredman no council member buddy Pender yes and mayor Sharon Mahoney my feelings say no even though it passed so okay passes 3 to two Okay uh the next one do I have a motion the next one is the major conditional use yes what happened Don you mean what happened well I thought you were you were not on the concrete Coalition anymore and you were getting on it no I'm following the code okay based off seriously it's based off of substantial evidence and and the testimony and I have heard any testimony at this point that says that we are not meeting the Cod and that's what we have to base this decision on cuz I'll tell you if I base it off my feeling I'd be instantly saying no but but we would instantly be appealed uh if we if we did that because there there has been no competent and substantial evidence that has said that this is not what we're supposed to do inside our code and and and I haven't been doing text while I'm doing this I've been actually studying our code AS we've been having that testimony because that's the Village's code and I'm in transfer of of development rights and I'm reading transfer of of uh receiver sites and uh aordable units and it's driving me crazy that I can't find it to Don our staff's recommended this and our attorney just told us what was what it was yes sir I get it okay I do too it's I'm not I'm not happy about but it's in our code I understand I mean not being difficult I okay do we have a motion no but I'll make one if you unless you want to go ahead okay I'll make a motion to approve the major conditional use in K as presented uh but I want to put a cave on that I hope you're hearing what we're saying I am hearing it I'm hear loudly a and we we'll come back with that buffer again because I they they've been committed to that okay so I made a motion to approve the major conditional as as presented do I have a second one of you all right I'll make a second Marney call the RO please council member Deb Gillis yes council member buddy Pender yes council member Steve fredman no vice mayor John Horton yes and mayor Sharon Mahoney no I passes three to two all right uh okay the third one is he just took it over go ahead go ahead okay it's l correct tab L yes that's correct um and it's on the transfer development rights I make a motion to approve the transfer development rights from Creekside to Island Resort as presented do I have a second bu a second I made the motion did you make a motion you did okay Mar would you call the role please council member Deb Gillis yes vice mayor Don Horton yes council member Steve fredon no council member buddy Pender yes and mayor Sheron Mone no that passes three okay thank you I'll see you in month and we'll get that language I know I and also please make sure you do something for Carol Street if that can be included please we we already did that but what we're going to add in is a buffer I'm going to I'm going to I'm going to get that to staff so we have it like the the width of it well get your votes next time maybe maybe I'm yeah Bart we do need to because I know that Dave uh there there was a lot of issues with Mr and we get it and you guys know zoia and that stuff is going to be th I got in front of my house you can't see it from a mile away so thank you very much thank you I appreciate I appreciate your time tonight thank you all right anything else this evening no first before we go I'd like to wish everybody a very merry Christmas and a happy New Year and uh take care of each other and take care of yourself thank you e