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all right everybody Welcome to the March 10th while that went quick Jackson Township planning board meeting this meeting is in compliance with the open public meetings act as adequate notice has been advertised and posted in the appropriate manner prescribe a law Mr
Bernstein Mr marzo here Mr heler here Mr Rogers here Mr treamer here M Rose here Mr weart Mr Sullivan here Dr Campbell for motion Bernstein second
solivan Mr Bernstein yes Mr marzel yes Mr heler yes Mr Rogers Mr treamer yes Miss Rose yes Miss W uh sorry Mr weart Mr Sullivan yes Dr Kim yes
so move Sullivan second dearo Mr Bernstein yes Mr marzo yes Mr heler yes Mr Rogers yes Mr tramer yes Miss Rose yes Mr weart Mr Sullivan yes
and Dr Campbell yes Dr Campbell did we was the vote before on the payment of the voucher or the minutes I think we did did we do both okay you link was emed to you again regarding the master plan we are
still still still ating outside AG and i' just like you to explain why this is postponed yes uh thank you uh this this a this morning we I'll go back a step my
clients have an engineer who designed the plans but they hired a separate professional to do the envir the D work Friday afternoon we received an email from that professionals pointing out a lot of the issues that his work revealed that would be inconsistent with the plan
that we presented so we had a conference call today at 3:00 to figure out whether we should come here or not I earlier said we can't come there's no way but they wanted to talk about it problem is assuming we went forward tonight and got approved we'd probably have to come back for a whole new application with
different plans they may not be substantial differences but they would be different and we just figured it' be a waste of everyone's time to do it twice so that's the reason and by April 21st the professionals are meeting this week again to come up with the plans we'll have no issue meeting the April
21st date'll have no problems no problem correct oh W well I apologize I I personally don't do the plans but I'll make sure our professionals know that they better get them in in time not that
much WoW well I'll I'll emphasize they need to get them in quickly but if you want to speak inms then we'll that's fine Open Session I'll make a motion to
open public session second Sullivan and make sure you speak the micone my name is Alan hang on one second you swear Fromm to tell the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth I do all right please state your name and spell your last of the record my name is Alan L all right and your address my address
is 2011 bendir Avenue inter New Jersey 07712 okay yes it's 201 Avenue inter I am the owner of 101 s road which is block 20201 Lot number one which is directly across the street from the
proposed subdivision and I've been waiting to hear back from County Line Construction and his Engineers concerning their 2020 subdivision for this that's a different that's a different we're not on that yet we're not there okay your
this is different application one Linda seeing seeing no one come forward make a motion to close public comment second Sol all in favor I County Line Construction yes
this uh is a application for our third and final um extension under the um statutory protection period That's provided in the municipal land use law we previously received uh two one-year
extensions uh final approval is has a statutory protection period of two years under the law and the applicant can request up to three three one-year extensions uh Brian Murphy is our engineer he wasn't the engineer at the initial plan uh preparation but he's
taken over the file and after he sworn and he'll he'll bring the board up to speed on where we are with the approvals all right do you swear or firm tell the the whole truth nothing but the truth I do all right please state name spell for the right sure Brian Murphy M
py 1856 Route 9 in Toms River I'm a principal at FW Associates I've been for this board and roughly 100 other boards directs welcome thank you credentials thank you yeah and we're just having you testify as an engineer tonight corre
correct so can you update the board on um the chronology of the initial approvals and then where we are sure today long long story short uh they got hung up with flood Hazard and Wetland approvals um mainly flood Hazard
approvals uh they're taking an an ordinate amount of time at this point uh with the state the d d yeah at the state level so it's uh it's it's challenging let's say um so we're pretty much there
uh W with the last uh um harah from them and hopefully you know obviously we're looking to have that done wrapped up hopefully in the next few months so this year is our last year and so we have to wrap it up when we and we already received the letter of interpretation
from the D that was extended by the D correct correct the wetlands is all done the buffering is all done it's it's all down the flood Hazard and finalizing um and U we anticipate to have that finalized before the expiration which would be October of
2025 correct yes okay any questions from the board regarding yeah now for the first shot you may ask questions about the testimony because we've had somebody test I make a motion to open the
testimony for Block 201101 lot 30 County Line Construction Company second Bernstein I I so this is this is going to be just for cross-examination questions of the engineer just to be and then the following part is going to be the
General comment of anything that you feel that you want to say about it or or your opinions on on the uh application okay okay all right so please raise your hand you swear affirm to tell the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth I do all right please state your name name and spell your last of the record yes my
name is Alan 20 l s r and my address is 2011 Bender Avenue inter New Jersey 07712 all right I think laur's got that right yeah so good to go at this point I
just want to ask one question of the engineer and if there has been any follow through with the initial comments made by one of his predecessors that being anotherus hero engineering the night of the original proposal where
I raised some objections to the plan and was promised some revisions and adjustments which I've never received I'm not sure what those revisions or adjustments would be so um B we would address the uh the town
review letters um but I'll give you my card and happily uh discuss any issues with me Mr keep an because this do right there's no more m is my understanding right now I'm looking back
at I do a not relying ever on my memory I do a meeting summary that um and I don't see any in here with notes indicating that our engineer was going to get back to you from any testimony he gave but if Mr Murphy gives you his card I'm sure he'll be able to provide you whatever you need or you can tell him
what was supposed to be done thank you m all later anyone else ask questioner on this seeing no one come forward move to close the public cross examination of
the witness second Bernstein now'll open I make a motion to open for General comments on block 201101 lot 30 County Line Construction Company a second Bernstein I I
yeah yeah all right got to swear you again all right do you swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth I do all right please uh state your name spell your last of the record yes my name is Alan l s r my address is 2011 Bender Avenue Interlake in New Jersey
07712 beautiful thank you I am the owner of 101 Sam's road which is block 20201 Lot number one which is directly across the street from the proposed subdivision and as I previously uh mentioned I've been waiting to hear back from County
Eli and his Engineers concerning the plan now for many years I object to any decommissioning of any part of Sam's road that runs along the front of my property Sam's road is the only Street touching my lot I raised these objections back in September of 2020 and
at the time the burough engineering representative representing County Line Construction promised to revise and adjust the plan however County Line terminated Mr yak's contract after that presentation and on our last call he told me he had made no revisions or
adjustments couple of years later I received Letters From Another engineering firm which we heard about here tonight regarding blood Hazard permits when I called them to ask about the plan I was told their engagement was limited only
to getting those permits I also called Peter K I left a message I never heard back from him and for all I know there could have been other engineering firms retained over these these years but none of them have made any contact with me as I mentioned Sam's road is the only
propert my property's only Street access and I oppose the off the offsite improvements to Sams Ro because of Block's access to an existing public right of way specifically sure specifically
what it blocks is the point along Sam's Road where construction of an access drive from the street over my property's Wetlands Corridor causes the least amount of disturbance my engineer determined that point as the narrowest place on my lot for this
crossover uh the proposed offsite improvements to Sam's Road have to be changed to remove the guard rails and curbs and other obstructions U at on the road at the subdivisions turn in the road needs to remain unobstructed
for among various reasons so I can place that access drive over the wetlands Corridor on my property that causes the least amount of disturbance and I I believe I have an intrinsic right to access my lot from a public road the proposed improvements
block access to this public right of way and it all stems from the unusual Turnin from Sam's road that they proposed rather than a conventional right angle turn in from the street they have it gradually arcing in like a a crescent off of Sam's roads linear footprint I
think the standard T intersection is required at the inter at the subdivisions entrance to maintain access with the existing Sam's road that concludes my comments yeah yes I just in reading the well first in reading my notes it says
the applicant will make a request to the governing body to vacate Sam's Road along the frontage of the property but the vacation is not a condition of approval and then in reading the resolution it says that the board was made aware that the applicant has had
discussed um the abandonment with the affected neighbor which I assume is Mr liser who was concerned with maintaining as much improved Frontage as possible the applicant agreed to maintain as much as possible as long as any design did not trigger the need for additional Wetlands
permitting after hearing from the board attorney who addressed the overall benefit of vacation the board agreed to recommend vacation through the resolution so I I don't specifically remember any of this except what I'm reading but um I Heard the comments of
Mr Murphy now now that we're going to we're comfortable where this the F the flood Hazard line is he's going to now be able to focus on the final ation of the plan so he'll have to take that into account and if Mr liser gives him his contact we'll make sure he contacts you
okay yeah if you guys can connect with one another outside you know to see if you work some out okay thank you else to speak seeing no one else come forward I move to close the public comment portion
of the application second Bernstein so um in summation we'd request that the board Grant the last extension um it's less than a year away it's in October uh we I think we've demonstrated that from a permitting point of view we've been prevented from preting the subdivision and we're close now to being able to do
that and we will agree as a condition of any extension to to address attempt to address this neighbor neighbor concerns that he raised this evening that's fine everybody this is a pretty straightforward kind of as of right request for a one-year time extension so
I'll let you guys vote on that we accept a motion I'd like to make a motion that application block 201101 lot 30 County Line Construction Company be granted a one-year extension due to circumstances second
trer have Mr Bernstein yes Mr marzo yes Mr heler yes yes Mr Rogers yes Mr tramer yes Miss Rose yes Mr weart Mr Sullivan yes Dr cim yes thank
you thank you and you did okay good thank you yes uh good evening again salvator alfery on behalf of the applicant um this is an applica this application was approved um several years ago um and
partially constructed we had filed an application to amend the approval to combine two of the three buildings that never I think we may have had one public hearing but it never went any further and we've abandoned that request for an amendment the only thing we're here for
you this evening is there's a Prohibition or a condition in the the earlier approval about limitations on the hours of operation Ian bordon is um our professional I he's here um um and
we're GNA it the end result and Mr bordon will get into more detail is that uh this prop property has had issues with the the damage from one of the storms and delays and Etc but the issue of renting the property or the warehouse
buildings has become an issue competitively it became a disadvantage to have a limitation that none of the other warehouses have and um that's why we're here tonight but Mr bordon will go into more detail who are you again do you swear or affirm to tell the
truth to hold truth nothing but the truth I do all right please state your name and SP your last of the record certainly Ian bordon president of PD yes like with New Jersey and does the board accept their credentials thank you so much thank you and Mr bordon your office has been
involved with this property since it's an original approval is that correct that's correct we started with this project in 2018 it received the preliminary final major site plan in 2019 uh obviously has been constructed or at least one of the two buildings has
been constructed was ready for occupancy when the tornado of two years ago 3 years ago uh damaged it it's been rebuilt it's ready for occupancy for the second time um and we're here to discuss a condition
of the approval which states the condition states that no shipping or receiving shall be permitted during the overnight third shift hours which will be considered from 11:00 p.m. to 7 a.m. and obviously as Mr alfair said we're seeking to have that restriction removed
to we um I looked at the records of projects approved by the planning board subsequently again that was May of 2019 that that was approved since then uh with very little research on my part about 10 minutes I found uh six
Warehouse projects in in uh Jackson that were approved between 2022 and 2024 I'll list them uh none of them contain that type of hourly restriction they're all permitted to have 24-hour shipping and
receiving uh and I'll start in order of close proximity to the site uh first is uh a warehouse in the LM zone of this site by the way is in the light manufacturing Zone it's a permitted use there was no variances granted for the
project none required I think that's important to put on the record uh so the first Warehouse is in the LM zone is one mile west of the site at the corner of Patterson and West Commodore it's block 2701 Lots 32 and 33 second is
a uh project on right too Road also a mile from the site it's on right too Road um block 401 lot 9 third site also One Mile West of the site on Patterson Road close to the intersection with West Commodore is
block 2603 L 2930 31 so all of those U projects had warehouses in the light manufacturing Zone and none of them contain the hourly restrictions all within a mile of the site and and all of which share the same
road system West commodor as as this site does I might recall the second job I noted the right to Bell Road project that was required to do improvements to right to to West commodor um and then and then we also have three other projects uh The Adventure Crossing
warehouses in the acmu zone 2 and A2 miles west and then we have a couple of Warehouse projects down in the Pine Lanes um on South Hope Chapel Road we have block 22301 Lots 3.01 17 20 21 22 23 and
24 uh as well as 22301 Lots 56 and 16 on Whitesville Road all both of which approved in 2024 and 2022 respectively they're both in the pm1 zone which is the pine lands uh it's analogous to the
LM Zone in the pine LS again none of these six projects have have time restrictions I would note uh I think this is insightful and I think helpful that the first site that I mentioned the one at the corner of West commodor and U
Patterson Lots 32 and 33 block 271 has a condition in the resolution that that affirmatively stated the applicant is permitted to have 24-hour operation shipping and receiving but has a condition requiring that each tenant
receive a copy of the township noise ordinance as part of their lease and I thought that was a really personally I think that's a really good thing to do so microphone on Patterson road and 537 there were there were not a lot of
neighbors that were in that were concerned I believe there were quite a number of neighbors of this particular project that were across the street that were concerned about particularly the the semis and their braking system uh
that that that would be quite disruptive to their sleep patterns I I I agree with you in principle uh there was there was one objector to this project uh remember that we're next to Tilton Auto Wreckers which is next to
two other Auto recers the LM Zone runs along the north side of uh of West commodor and across the street from the auto recers was a woman who objected um but those same but I will tell you that that the up up at Patterson there are homes across the
street from those sites as well the the entire southern side of West Commodore all including past uh Patterson is all residential that's just the way it's owned that's the way it's been built over the years
the north side is all LM so um I find no distinguishing between uh my recollection of the hearings at the time was that the focus of this language was on uh I remember Mr
Hudak raised it who's no longer a member but not that it it doesn't matter um because most of the truck traffic is going to use Exit 21 um and between our site as well as the other sites and Exit
21 is The Gardens of Jackson 21 so I recall that that was the concern was the the apartments that are off of West Commodore to the south side but all of the traffic all of the truck traffic from those three sites the two Patterson
sites and the right to site is all oriented towards towards Exit 21 right I think the the the important thing and this is one of the earlier warehouses that were approved obviously since then there have been many um is that that
imposition is not provided for in the ordinance there's no variances so there's no limitations in the ordinance to um hours of operation in that LM zone or maybe in any of the zones but certainly in the LM um which is probably why it hasn't
been imposed in any of the other subsequent warehouses anyone from the board any comments um I do have a question for our attorney Mr Shay my understanding has always been that we can't consider anything from other
applications um well so it's this is a little a little bit different so so here's what's going on so um we have a situation where the ordinance is is silent right on um on on the timing of
um really because it's kind of a quasi industrial Zone it's almost the spirit and intent of it is to have this type of of use there now now because the ordinance itself is silent on the timing and inspection
and um um periods in time in which trucks you know go and vans come and go and everything like that there's really no guidance there so I think what happened last time it was actually Ray Shay who did the application God bless his Soul's he's a great guy um so um
when that happened I believe that there may have been objectors objecting to the the level of noise that was happening at that period of time and I think that that we may have put a restriction on them based based upon that but the ordinance is silent now now what the
engineer is doing right now is um is putting um as a matter of equity examples within the zone so it's almost similar like a like how we talk about neighborhood schemes all the time so in a residential neighborhood you know like if they all look one way or if they all do something one way that's kind of like
neighborhood scheme this is similar to that in the sense that it's it's just a commercial scheme so um he's put on record that as a matter of good faith there are I guess I think five or six other examples um of similar uses that
have no restrictions and it's really right now you know I'm happy I'm not in your seat but it's you guys have to do kind of a balancing test right now from an equitable point of view as to what's right and fair um you know the the ordinance is silent um there was a
condition put in the approval but at the same time there's six different um locations of similar use that have no restrictions in the zone so it's kind of more of a balancing test on your end as to what's Equitable and right um and that's what that's what you have in
front of you right now if I remember correctly me it's residential area it's a no air braak no Jake Brak Zone anyhow so it's kind of a m point so I kind of agree that it shouldn't be a restriction on them unfortunately it's and the project backs
195 which you have nothing but redundant truck traffic so right Dr anyone else with a comment so I just want to I guess better understand why you're coming here I'm assuming and I actually I don't want to make any assumptions um this application was
approved in 2018 it was built out it was occupied the tornado came occupied it was not occupied before the tornado it was empty it was never occupied it was never occupied about to be occupied about to be occupied were there tenants lined up at that point I don't believe so okay
but this tornado threw off the project how long would you say years three years three years it was it was well over two years so would it be fair to say that the market possibly has changed a little bit The Warehouse Market in three years since the originally came according to
Mr Spitz who's one of the principles um first of all there's a lot more competition now because back then there weren't that many warehouses now as you could see the six that we just cited plus many more not only in Jackson but elsewhere he said they're at a competitive disadvantage when they talk
to a tenant the tenant doesn't want to have that prohibition and they could go to another warehouse and um so he's got to be limited to a user that could live with those hours of operation so would it be fair to say that you're coming here really because the market has changed since you originally came five years ago it definitely changed in terms
of competition um primarily competition just the multiple choices that warehouse tenants have to um pick from right and what Mr trumer said about the condition about the the the noise would that be something you guys would be okay with yes I don't think we have a choice I
think that's that's the Zone but I'm just if we mind putting it Mr sh usually puts it on the record for the for the condition for the resolution you guys would mind that not at all and we also as Mr bordon suggested to put that other provision and I could send the exact language to Mr Shay that was in the the
noise but the noise that that we have to advise each tenant and um have to comply obviously with the noise ordinance how do you enforce that though how are you going to enforce that well how do we enforce well it's a ground the town if the town says that they're violating the
noise ordinance then the landlord has the power to evict that tenant for violating the lease that's but it's like any other enforcement mechanism if the town doesn't tell us they don't do anything anyone else on the board have questions
comments Mr marso just to explain that further so so what could happen is that either the landlord enforces it himself through like kind of like an order to show cause in chancell division um or alternatively code enforcement gets involved and says Hey listen you were put on notice you knew about this here's
the evidence of it you know here's a citation so you would put that in the resolution yeah we come up with some kind of language indicating that enforcement is is part of the uh is part of the resolution so that what happens is that that binds it kind of to like the chain of title so that the tenants
are now on notice that this is a condition of of their tency and to further um help with that we could also record the resolution as on the property so if a subsequent owner buys it they could see what that condition is we have no issue
could that be provided to each tenant it will be yeah that's that language from other resolution still it's still the same language yes provision to each tenant correct and it'll be in each lease any other comments or concerns from the board anything from our
profession should we open to public session this is a good time to open uh for public questions for just for Mr bordon please I make a motion to open block 2501 lot 3340 West commodor LLC for cross
examination only second all in favor I I I SW just a uh okay do you swear or affirm to tell the truth to hold truth nothing but the truth I do all right please state your name and spell your last of the record
Brian Gardino that's gu a r d i n o okay and your address 371 West Commodore Boulevard okay okay M Morrison you have that good okay I'd like to open up and talk about this tornado since we brought
it up uh the tornado was one of three tornadoes that hit Jackson around West Commodore the other we didn't really hear that much about but if we remember this is the Elephant Room here that tornado made national news hitting his
property and damaging it and I didn't know until he just admitted it that residence so sorry that business was ready for occupation and if people would have moved in the roof totally collapsed now tornadoes I know are damaging but
from the path of tornado which I know from across the street it first hit Paul's Garage which is a cement block uh building and there was no damage but all the giant trees fell over then it went over to the trucky yard right next door
and the truck yard still stands and all the trees went right over we're talking about maybe 10 trees Big Trees on each side flipped right over and they had to take care of that when it hit his property the roof came down on the property and now if it's meant to
withstand anything it's not and I don't know how that building would ready questions direct the engineer questions of the engineer but I just want to comment I believe that the the damage happened when the side of the building right
collapsed that's my point my point is but it was it was not finished it was not a finished building but it looked but they they mentioned that it was ready to be occupied I doubt that all the structures were finished it was was not going to be moved into at that time because it
wasn't finished but they did mention it was ready to be occupied and the first thing they said looked like it from the outside I'm not testifying to how finished the building was exactly it just it looked done from the outside yeah it looked it from the outside but not I me poor construction altogether I
mean you have basically uh walls that are held up with poles right right now is to put you have to ask questions of the engineer right yeah okay so I won't say any more about that then you can ask the you could ask the engineer what has happened well the engineer is not here
right that's the engineer oh I'm sorry so you may ask the engineer what has been done for safety of the construction at this point anything additional nothing additional other than uh those two years of insurance
companies and Structural Engineers and reconstructing a building of which my company was not part of but I am told by my client this week or last week that it is finished now when ready for occupancy so nothing what else was done so if the same thing happened the building's going
to collapse again it has to be built to code so whatever the code says obviously the code is not right if the building collaps that that that building May National say to you is that what we're where we're getting into and what you're primarily concerned with is the international building code the the
planning board has no jurisdiction with that the build the building department does so you may want to go have a chat with them and I that's something to put on the record that if another tornado hits that building it's going to fall the same exact way and people will now be inside of it I I hope a tornado isn't
hit anybody's I'm telling you that's the third tornado in Jack in that alley that's hit in last 10 years I'm not having a picnic there then anyway so going so I think right now as a rumor here is is that's a hardship for this
gentleman to continue without 24 hours I mean we've heard of hard ships for millionaires before um basically where they have to raise the prices on everything and then you wind up seeing 86 billion dollar in profit from the same hardship I mean we've seen that for
since since uh at least 2020 what this is going on and I've also heard a rumor right we got to we got to keep it relevant we got to questions to the engineer well you can come back up later and discuss all right my here's here's a rumor that I heard and I'm ask a
question can you hold it until the general comment com because that's not test right so so so so my question is is this facility going to hook up to wellwater or city water this facility is act U hooked up
to public water all right so it's not going to hook up to well that's great all right um now I understand that other facilities on in Jackson has been approved but I'm I'm I'm absolutely sure that these other facilities have
not you know embraced the noise and the construction and the businesses going on I mean if the other if the other facilities uh residences uh don't come to these meetings and then it's just blankly approved so I mean we're here to
show that so to re I'm going to assume that was a question every application that was approved by this board has to be done on notice to the neighbor and they have not I mean they have not showed up in talk about it because it
was just approved no it wasn't did did you have people uh objecting um we didn't handle them but there was 2022 2023 2022 2023 so they were approved a couple years ago I understand that they're approved but was there
objections were there people coming to the meetings to object I I don't know if that's relative I'm it's relative when you bring it up to say that based on those approvals this one should be approved as well I'm saying that just because they didn't show up and and condemn the whole thing that we should
you know blank you know get a blank I'm I'm going to go to relevancy with that so so what happens is that there's no way for us to to take into consideration the objections that were happening at other applications all we can do is base
it off of the analysis done by the engineer with the yes with the approvals and conditions and the resolutions of the other applications but I I wish that you guys would also say when he brought that up you know there's no way you know don't bring that up on this case you know what
I'm saying because and when I say I object to that because I don't know what those meetings are about and I don't know who showed up for those meetings right but he's not he's not getting into like the the minutes of the meetings he's just saying he's saying that you
know there are six other sites that were you know granted B approvals based upon the bare bones of the ordinance and and this is what it is rightly no I understand that and the important thing to remember is that we showing these because the
ordinance doesn't have a Time limitation so that it's not it's not an enforceable condition because the ordinance doesn't even have it as something that the board can impose okay well I've been in the in the warehouse um transportation ground
transportation business for over 40 years and I know what these warehouses the noise that you don't know about pretty much like for instance there'll be no air condition in this facility am I right I I don't know will there be air conditioning that's engineering we don't
know you don't know if there's air conditioning all right all right so so we're not all right so let me just kind of play here's the point no but hang on hang on so so what we're getting into is specifics to an application that was already approved we're not here to go over the engine engineering specifics
we're not here to go over the international building code we're here strictly as to the time limitation on the property and that's the only I'm I'm getting to that okay okay the problem is is that when you have no air condition
in this building which we don't know you'll have the garage doors open and you'll have uh trucks being loaded okay a truck being loaded is a little bit different than you would think okay trucks uh Trail trilers have to be
unloaded and these trailers have uh over 20 pallets each and to save time they have to be unloaded in I would say less than 20 minutes okay so these uh trailers all night will be they'll be picking up the
pallets running into the trailer you know at good speed and dropping the trailer and that makes it loud boom every single time okay on top of that there'll be uh radios on all of the U on
all of the pallet jacks okay because everything's radio okay that'll be making noise all around also but but I mean just just to go to that point though from what Mr bordon is indicating there's six other locations within a
radius of the site that do everything that you're talking about right and I'm I'm dealing with the location by my house you know I know from experience that's what's going to happen okay okay there's going to be a lot of radios a lot of noises uh people are going to
conjugate outside waiting to get into the facility all right do do you have a question for this this is cross- examination time right now so do you have a question for Mr bordon will there be a um will there be a u a guard booth
outside checking in the trailers in and out no so you're going to have trailers going in and out all night with Freight not checked by anybody and how do you how do you prevent theft in that
case that's up to management and the tenants so but if the management insists that there be a uh guard check you know check we're getting into an application from back in 2019 that was already vetted out right so so what you're
asking them right now to do is to go back to 2019 and incorporate create a shack that they never got approval for and they're not here to get approval for right I I just I just think there what I'm saying you the questions you're asking have to be relevant to what they're here for right now we can't go
outside the scope of that what we're talking about is the noise and the disruption at night right so if you have if you have questions ask Mr bordon about the time of this thing right the timing is then please ask him 11 to 7
and I'm saying that it will be a disturbance in ways that you guys will not comprehend because you're not particularly in the business there'll be people outside that's that's what I'm saying to you I ask him questions regarding how you think it's going every
single thing I'm going to ask him he's going to say I don't know well but that's but that's the whole point of this the whole point of right now is for you to ask him questions about what you think is going to happen Okay do you think people will be outside in their cars waiting to go to work at 11:00 at
night making noise playing their r radios smoking weed no no okay who do you think is going to um an 11 to7 shift are we going to have professional college graduates
or we going to have U people who haven't um have been to jail and stuff like that sir you're beyond the scope we're here to discuss ours well I'm talking about I'm I'm saying personalities this is what I'm saying who is going to staff
these positions is not going to be quiet corporate professionals it's going to be I don't think you could stereotype people if you have if you if you find that this becomes a problem we do have code enforcement you can call someone
you can record it you can request there's a machine that records noise right that you can ask to have for a period of time but we can't decide that kind of thing here that's not our lane you're asking us to go out of our lane
our lane is to listen to the testimony listen to you briefly well I mean we brought up you know we brought up noise one of the first things it was like right but we also can't put a condition of approval in here saying that you know tenants
please don't smoke weed in your Vans when you're unloading your car I mean come on I mean it's a little unreasonable so stick with what's reasonable please I just want to say that I work in one of these facilities okay when I go into the facility everyone's smoking weed are you smoking
sir what that because it's irrelevant I understand that can I ask a question hold on you live right across the street you also have a mechanic shop right a body shop yes a junkyard right a gas station right you worried about them making
noise they're not why are you doing this they're not working 24/7 you you you're beating a dead horse here this is something they've explained to you there's no tenant yet so there's nothing you can do about it there's nothing we can say about it that's what we're trying to tell you right
so you you you want us to pull pie out of the sky it's not happening so I think you should really just wait for the next round okay please is there something I can talk about then I'm sorry just explain to me what I you can ask questions regarding the the amendment
that they are requesting right so the time but you're going way outside the scope of thing you're you're talking about eventualities of tenants that are not even in existence right now of employees of tenants that that nobody even knows about so so I mean you're
coming up with theoreticals that nobody can answer because they're unanswerable and I don't know if you're doing this to Stonewall or if something it's a little iffy going on right now so if you have any questions
directly Rel directly related to the timing um of this of what the applicants requesting the the approval Amendment regarding the removing of the condition regarding the time ask the ask the engineer if you don't then please let
somebody else have a shot sure I'll let someone else all right thank you there are there are two sections to this there is the questions of the of the applicant and then after we close this session we'll have another session
where you can make comments briefly anyone else have questions for the applicant please come forward please raise your right hand do you swear or affirm to tell the truth the hold truth nothing but the truth I do all right please state your name spay your last of the record lisel Tracy t r
e a c y 361 West Commodore Boulevard Jackson can can you pronunciate that one more time my name or the address 361 West Commodore Boulevard and ma'am if you'd speak into
the microphone it's being recorded thank you got it okay I have been involved with this project since it was supposedly approved um I too have worked in warehouses I wrot software for warehouses very familiar with what goes
on at night my one concern is that you keep this is for questions to the I'm asking a question that's good my concern and I want to ask this
carefully this was socalled approved in 2019 18 19 19 at that point the hours of operation were 7 in the morning till 6:00 at night
that was the approval am I correct I believe I am I have the paperwork 7 in the morning till 11: p.m. yes well it depends on which paperwork you look at well we're looking at the resolution of approval condition number six what
date says no shipping or receiving permitted between 11:00 p.m. and 7: a.m. all right well let's go with that for now so that was the approval am I correct that's correct okay so we're
[Music] comparing other projects within Jackson and beyond that may have been approved am I the only one that got a notice for this request to change hours
of operation uh no we sent it to everyone within 200 ft of the property per the tax assessor list and how many people is that I don't know I'll tell you in a second 12
people okay so probably the three of them are the across the street people who have the uh Tilton and the other two those are basically car business this is they
don't I don't hear anything from them at night their cars this is am I correct in saying these we houses two of which aren't built yet will be leased to an unknown entity as of now yes okay so we
do not know what kind of vehicles will be present at that site at any time is that correct is only vehicles that typically go to Warehouse houses so but beyond that we don't know who the tenant is how frequently they will use the
facility at night we don't know okay so we have to assume since there's some 40 odd truck Bays am I correct I I don't know the number you I don't recall the number of truck Bays but that sounds about right I it's 40
plus so if there are 40 plus truck base am I correct in assuming if we're talking about a 20 minute turnaround which is typical that we can expect trucks to
excuse me please be quiet we we're recording we can't hear thank you can I assume that we can expect trucks to be coming and or going or both every 20 to 40
minutes no I don't believe you can assume that at all how come how can you figure that out uh give me the algorithm well that was presented in the site plan approval 5 years ago there was a traffic report down traffic testimony provided that's
in the planning board files I do not pretend to know the details of that I did read that traffic report and I believe it needs to be updated that's just a comment and it's not an Amazon facility where you have that kind of volume but well 40 truck Bas its volume
yeah and just to be clear we're not here on that issue we can't go back in time and rehash traffic I'm just saying you're saying that it was approved it it was approved for daytime hours and the LM Zone at least in 2019 did not allow
247 I've been through the code book and I've talked to the code people so it did it not allow it or did it prohibit it it was not allowed so it said you cannot have 247 I don't know the exact wording would you
like to read the code book for me no you're making a statement I'm just questioning you what because our recollection of it it has no time limitations it doesn't say you no can or you that's not correct so it's my it's my understanding that the ordinance has no time restrictions and what that means
is that if a Zone if if if the LM Zone specifically wanted to prohibit trucks from operating within certain time it would specifically state that as a criteria in the zone I believe it did it
it from my understanding and from my looking back at the ordinance it didn't so unless our planner can indicate otherwise uh I you know not only that but we have to base it on what the ordinance says now access for right so
if the ordinance does not prohibit this type of activity this is a legitimate request you know and then then it's a then the legal argument is is one of okay what's the neighborhood scheme you know um so I mean that's how Municipal L use operates in this situation you know
so because am I assuming that because the master plan that Jackson did without most of the people knowing that live on West commodor to make it industrial I I I don't even I don't know what your reference excuse me you're you're
talking about the 2009 master plan correct you're talking about the 2009 master plan in reference of a 20199 application that was approved in reference to a 20202 approval Amendment
request we can't I'm just saying it was approved for daytime hours am I correct no I within the resolution that is correct and that's what they are coming back we're going to leave it at that okay all right and I will continue in the comments section because I have
plenty of comments I will only say one one more thing am I correct since this has to be a question are the other warehouses and I believe that the one on um I don't know this the 2701 or
whatever it is down the street was that not changed to Highway commercial that one section because you're calling it LM and I think it got changed to Highway commercial the the
2701 Lots 32 and 33 on West Commodore is that the one I think that's the one yes the resolution from 2023 says the property was in the LM Zone okay they may have changed it afterwards they could have changed it after I don't know I think it did because I looked it up
anyway that was just another question but what I want to realize to is that if and this is the question if I have I live across the street so I got notified um I'm assuming
that having been in the warehouse business and hurting the noise and smelling the exhaust and having garbage thrown on my property from the guy that used to be across the street that's what truckers do I don't know what facilities
we have do you for these truckers to go in bathe eat sleep whatever or they in their trucks they there's there's no approval to allow anyone to sleep within the building that wouldn't I don't think that'd be allowed so is that what your
question is that's that's a standard problem that we have that's why we used to have truck trauma yeah ma'am so so it's beyond the scope number one but number two if you see anybody sleeping on the premises just call the police because they have no approvals for that that would be against the
law what's against the law them sleeping in their vehicles on the property would be against the lawyer you call the police well I I don't want to be the Watchdog thank you right but we but we we have to keep it relevant to what they're here for we can't bring up
hypotheticals for a tenant that they don't even to ask a question are you prepared please direct the question at the engineer are you prepared to provide insurance that the people that are there
are doing what they're supposed to do not sleeping in their truck not peeing in their truck not eating in their truck not throwing their peed bags out in my yard are you prepared to have that I think the best we could do is agree that when the trucks are stopped that they
can't idle that's I mean if someone wants to have a hamburger in their truck I don't know why anybody could stop that but um I had a hamburger driving here which I probably should do either but that's what happens um but if you wanted to put a no idling prohibition we have
no issue with that because I think they have to anyway but we'll amend the resolution I believe that's that's part of the Township Code I think so no idling we did that before we were there before what was part of the township no idling that's correct that was part of
the Township Code which unfortunately the neighbors are going to have to be calling about because it's going to happen trucks in the winter especially if they're Diesel have to idle sorry they can't shut down so unless you want to plug them in I don't think they want
to spend money but uh I guess that's my last question for now I'll come back with comments um it's unfortunate that more people on the street because this is a thre mile section that is not
uh it's mostly residential on the Southside it used to be on the North side as well but all these people who are tax paying residents are going to be adversely affected
and I just want to ask how you are prepared to deal with that because I can guarantee you that there will be probably maybe 25 to 100 calls every night to noise control and whomever else
unfortunately ma'am we don't have to deal with that we just are here volunteering to listen you don't have to deal with it I'm just asking code code it's a Code Enforcement issue if if that's going to happen contact code enforcement they'll take care of it okay so you're you're leaving
it up to the citizen I'm I'm leaving it up to the body of of authority that has control over that situation okay my question is wouldn't it be better to I mean none of these guys have badges that they can go and site somebody at 3:00 in the morning for you unfortunately I
would love a badge and I would love the you know little little beep things on top of my car but we don't have that so we can't do that for you so you so I understand where you're coming from and I understand you know the situation that you're going to be bumping into but we're talking about a hypothetical again
which well this whole thing is hypothetical you not a hypothetical because you're talking about a hypothetical tenant doing something to you that violates an ordinance that hasn't been violated yet and and I'm telling you who to contact so when the hypothetical happens you know who to
hypothetically tell let's not go back to hypothetical I want to go back to real okay then please ask a question of the engine for daytime hours yes that's why we're here okay daytime well the 11 to 7 okay thank you ma'am thank you thank
you would anyone else like to ask questions of the applicant and their expert seeing no one else come forward I move the close cross examination portion of the testimony second Bernstein all in
favor I I did you find [Music] anything so our plan planner tells us there is no prohibition on 24hour services within the township um open motion to open the
public testimony portion of block 2501 lot 3 340 West Commodore LLC and we'll have a f minute timer on this please Anthony thank you anyone like to come forward
second all in favor I all right now we have comment section good evening all right please raise your right hand you swear or affirm to tell the truth the hold truth not the about the truth I do all right please dat your name and spell your last of the record Mark trumbower T Ru m b a
u e r 645 Hamilton Road uh like the others who spoke I concerns about the noise uh trucks idling backup alarms when they pull out um my property directly touches
their to the back 195 I have took Body Works and then the warehouse as they were building this thing the echo off the side of this building is pretty substantial I can hear them talk basically so if you do decide to approve
these late hours have some kind of sound barrier other than three foot trees or something something to mitigate this sound that's that's all asked do what you can to mitigate it and as far as who we who do I call Four o00 because no
one's answering PD the police depart I've called them in the past for Tilton Body Works because they have car alarms go off six days a week at 4 in the morning I get a runaround where has been going for 30 minutes or actually they working on cars or was just car alarms and they do nothing this was many years
ago I haven't tried again but in the past that didn't work Poli dep you not get responses docum those request the letter to your mayor request an explanation as to why
you did not get orase some type of action okay that's the only way you can really relase that type
of okay this form can only say the property that's question is it an authorized land use I I understand it's just that you're saying just you know call somebody there really is not anyone so I'll I'll give you the the order of operations I think
that's kind of important in the situation so the order of operations let's say the car alarm goes off 3:00 a.m. right or or somebody's let's say maybe they get a crazy tenant or or just you know the tenant's got one driver this is you know not doing something right hypothetical right so 3:00 a.m.
you call the police yeah make sure you contact Traffic Safety they have a specific Department related to these type of incidences uh they would come out they would most likely uh do a report with you what happens is that because obviously the the code enforcement guys are only you know uh
I'm not sure there're specific times but let's just say they're 95 the uh police officer the traffic safety guy would put a report together that report would then be forwarded to code enforcement they would put code enforcement on notice code enforcement would have to go out do an inspection do an investigation um and
and you know come to some kind of conclusion as to what they're going to do they would probably reach out to you directly and say hey what's going on um you know if if the traffic uh officer you know couldn't do anything about it that night so the order of operation is important because it kind of gets to you
to where you're going even though it may not be a direct res you know resolution to your situation immediately but it will help out if it continues on an ongoing basis because they have memories and they're aware you know so um that's
kind of where you can go with that I understand but if it takes takes just a month and I'm woken up every night of the week a month is a long time to go with broken sleep Ag and I will get quite cranky actually I got a three-year-old that
wakes me up three times a night trust me I'm right there with you man all right thank you yeah should she too thank you anyone else would like to come forward please comments comments we did we did questions just
keep it Rel successful okay all right I got to swear again again please say your name spell your last of the record pleas hold on say again do you swear or affirm to tell the truth old truth nothing but the truth yes all right please state your name and spell your last of the record lisel try
t a c y 361 West Commodore Jackson New Jersey all right Miss Morrison got that all right the whole conversation here is about trying to fix a problem after it's
broken my conversation with you is can we just leave it the way it was so it isn't broken daytime hours end the story that's it I mean I will have my cameras out because I live right across the street so there'll be plenty of
information if they do let this fly even if they don't do to 247 and I have cont contacted uh Mr Testa at Ocean County uh to advise him that because there is going to be this much truck
traffic even during the day if you don't pass the 247 that we need to lower the speed limit and that we need to add additional traffic lights because I'm very worried about the dozens of school trucks and if you see a 40ft tractor
trailer loaded trying to stop it's not going to happen at 50 m now so I think you really need to think this whole thing over again I know the guy wants to make money I get it you can't stop eCommerce but you have to be realistic
this is not an appropriate spot for a 247 thank you ma'am anyone else seeing no one else come forward and make a motion to close public comment second Sullivan all in favor I would you
like to sum yes please very briefly uh property as you heard is in the LM Zone it was permitted use it was variance free there's um nothing in the ordinance that um prohibits or even allows the board to impose a restriction in in the
hours of operation um as indicated the applicant is now at a competitive disadvantage because of the market changing the the competition that has arisen since it was originally approved um we've agreed to attempt to address
the concerns by um recording a resolution putting a provision in the lease giving the tenants a um copy of the noise ordinance and it's important to remember that this neither this board or anyone else has the power to give relief from the noise ordinance whatever
that noise ordinance says has to be complied with we don't get relief and the noise ordinance has more strict noise um prohibitions or conditions after hours so during the day it could be a little louder at night so the any use is the the residents are adequately
protected because they everyone has to comply with the noise ordinance on top of that if the governing body felt that this location was not appropriate for for warehouses or should have had time restrictions the ordinance would have said that they specifically chose and
it's the governing body from seven years ago or six years ago but they chose this area for warehouse uses um on top of that and I noticed this while the neighbors were talking as a condition of approval we agreed to provide a new
masing wall between buildings one and two and West commodor to further shield from the truck truck impact so there is going to be a Wall constructed buildings one and two haven't been built only building three has which is in the back so when these other two are built there
will be a wall it won't completely block the sound but that was something the board imposed when they heard the neighbors concerns so for all those reasons we'd request that the board Grant the relief that we requested this evening any discussion from the board so let me just uh real quick
because we haven't had a lot of these so um this is strictly under the municipal land use law um an equitable balancing test right so it's you have to weigh the good with the bad um you take a look at at the history the prior resolution the
uh current use of the Zone the The Zone itself uh the lack of prohibitions the um the time that was put uh as a condition and just weigh it um there's no wrong or right answer um it's just
whatever you guys view as Equitable in nature um based upon the current situation and what the tenants or what the applicants requesting thank you anyone like to make a motion on this uh request for a change in hours of
operation I'll make a motion um that we approve the change of condition given the fact that no other um similar operation is required to have this uh blockage of time uh and also
given the fact that when this was originally approved it did include uh walls and barriers that will at least mitigate some of the sound issues for the Neighbors um and I also highly encourage anyone that sees any illegal activity or any issues that are
violating code uh code to report them to the proper authorities uh given all that uh I motion to approve the removal of this condition just a quick question isuse your motion including all the conditions that Mr alfair put in the record yes
okay then I second let's have a roll call vote Please Mr Bernstein yes Mr marzo uh yes Mr heler yes Mr Rogers yes Mr treamer yes Miss
Rose yes Mr weart Mr Sullivan yes and Dr K yes thank you thank you I accept a motion to close please motion to close second Sol all in favor
I I thank you