##VIDEO ID:zeXSRI58G4c## okays committee meeting will to order I have roll call please yes bobel yes ter PHS Chad okay we have approval of minutes from June 1 24 oh wait you might be looking at you're on that's our last meeting this is the there we go okay do I approval yeah that's there you go sorry April 18 April 18 24 and September 19 24 do I have approval ofs yes any old business um nothing at this time okay uh new business from Grant application all right so I'd like to provide a little context on this and then I will also hand out something that the applicant emails staff this is TR um that is from the applicant uh this was reviewed at the c meeting last night um it was a part of an overall the application part of the the application is landscape part was this mural uh the CRA did opt to approve the Landscaping component in full and then defer this item to their February meeting um for a couple of reasons one to have the art committee look at this today and provide some insight and some feedback and some recommendations and also um based on the location of this mural where exactly is that would you so I'm trying to get that computer up there to turn on and it's not working I'm going to pull up a Google street view if I can get the computer to work but this is the building that is direct if you looking at the Best Western it is the building directly to the left of the Best Western but the wall that they're proposing this on is that Southern Wall so it's actually the wall that faces the grass Alleyway between the end of this building and the Best Western so basically where hot tinger is right this back side of that building facing the Best Western so north of Best Western yes correct um it's not the mural itself is very cool it is um a local artist who has done murals in Andrew Subs he did surf for the bars mural he just done several murals out here um so I do think it's great who they selected I think that's wonderful um but the agency did want to defer because of mainly the location and does it make sense to be contributing on those $199,000 of CRA Grant funds to ad mural that is essentially facing an Alleyway in the side of a building yeah and so we kind of wanted to get some feedback from you guys and then maybe even talk a little bit if I can get that computer to come on about you know is there any way that this mural works on another facade of that building and do we want to go back to the applicant and say you know do the recommendation we want to take to CRA is to just flat out say no sorry we're not interested do we want to say no we're interested in this however you know can you move it to this side um I might have to get the clerk's office this it's like location that means that that matters ex I think might is this the first application for no no that mind good thank you this is where they're proposing the people in that other building can see see folks parking their cars so you're coming down I mean really so it's right there yeah so you know out there on the that's not even really a public access is it no that would be different but that's not part of the parking garage right downstairs used to be a bowling alley and the upstairs was a skaing so yeah yeah downstairs was bowling Alle upstairs was the kids from Fletcher Used to go there like in the winter time on PE live up there I had I had a neon top upstairs and the art Society was in the downstairs have Gallery that's really cool and us have and all kinds of stun because at that time that building was far Marshall code only allowed like 15 people yeah at a time in the whole building upstairs and downstairs and yet Baja used to have probably a thousand upstairs on Friday night so walking B through the chair and that was when Einstein and goo was in that corner walking by still you still see part of it and it still contributes you know artwork in the area fun or whatever I'm trying to say there walking by you're still going to see a portion of it and potentially look down that direction potentially if you're walking and we're talking about walking traffic so it does it it does provide more than just an Alleyway which it is down so the question is can we get a Viewpoint from the boardwalk I can try I I think the concern as far as highlighting the alleyway is just that putting it simply is highlighting an Alleyway um it's it would be one thing if this was an Alleyway that had some level of amenity so if it was already ped and it was you know a little Trail and it was lit and it had fines and things I think that would be a different story um but because it's literally private owned grassy Alleyway I think the agency and and rightfully so is having a really hard time justifying almost $20,000 towards basically being able to from the road visually see a small SLI I agree with you completely I'm just wondering if there's a if there's a way not meet him halfway but not kill them completely is that um is that way does that have the potential for being paid um I don't I'm going to Def could that be could that be a a walkway to the beach I don't know without looking at more details probably not I don't know if it's on one of their properties or if it's an actual Alleyway yeah it looks like it has more potential to being like planted with something you know yeah I there's there's infrastructure for the building back there like back flow preventers and things like that so you know it's probably not a place where we want the public to be going down for several reasons yeah um safety being one of them yeah and my my concern um once I talked to Taylor today because I was confused I thought it was on this side of the building I was like what's the problem uh but she educated me on where it actually is my my concern would be that if we don't want people down there if a mural's down there it might draw them to go somewhere where we don't want them because safe for whatever reason could the requirement be offense offense of some sort could could requirement be that you know we can't commit the total amount um because these are our concerns but if we were to put some kind of well I mean I'm not sure what a chain we fence there either J you know but but marking blocking that off is not a bad idea to your point you know at night and weekends people going find an area in that alleyway ever yeah um if we could get them to maybe put up some kind of barrier and then maybe contribute some towards does that make sense towards the mural no just because we're kind of uh our hands are a little bit tied because really the parameters we're working within here is they want this guy to do a mural this is how much their keeps charging and then that's kind of the end of as far as like asking them to do any changes to the alleyway and things like that I think that kind of crosses the boundary that we where this one particular piece is concerned we just can't really cross that um and that would be quite a process to even figure out what the options are there because it likely it probably is an Alleyway like Heather said that has back flow and various infrastructure things buried in that you go back to it you can look but and if that's if that's the case we can't close it off anyway because Public Works and Beaches Energy are going need access to that at all times and so they wouldn't be able to well it's definitely not an ideal location for a large neural um no good question it's actually on their property not where did they come up with the figure what does the gr program say as far as how much contribution percentage supposed to put in yeah so I mean that standard it's a two to1 ratio so that standard across the board that doesn't change at all up to a certain amount and they're nowhere near that maximum amount so that's not an issue um the big issue at hand is location and how do we want to respond to this I did notify the applicant this morning that they were um deferred to February for various reasons and so they've been made aware that their appliation this piece was not approved um and they're well aware that you guys are meeting today to discuss this a little bit and provide feedback um I think the agency was looking for guidance on is this something that we think we could realistically see on another portion of this building and if so are we comfortable with the mural proposed and if you know the art Comm feels that the mural prop proposed excuse me is consistent with kind of the visions that we see for these public murals and these private murals we're expanding this we're good with that then we need to kind of answer a second part of that question which is where does it need to go because we don't necessarily think it's where they're propos I don't so we're not we're definitely not going to we're not going to give $199,000 to do the real I mean is that correct know what you guys are saying that's I think that's what no I mean no definitely the money isn't the problem um the money is well within the parameters of why the gr exists and it's well within their respectable amount that's completely fine it's just where it's physically located correct and the mural itself that's what I mean so this location you know when you're when we're mapping out square footage or linear footage for murals you have this formula yep what portion of this mural would would be the the part that we're covering in a percentage would you say as far as cost I have no idea okay because we're following a 2:1 ratio consistent with all the other grants it's not that technical it's just this is what the cost of this particular thing is but the 2:1 ratio is a flat rate completely across the board for everything under thead program okay but you know what I'm asking like as if we were if we were estimating the cost of a mural outside this grant yeah I mean based on the size of that building um it's very comparable in size to what we did at it's kind of unique it's not quite as long as the cape building but it's taller than the cape was so kind of looking at it from the seawalk and the Cap building mural I the rate that he's charging for this mural actually is a little bit less than what the standard is I do not feel it's he's not price at all we see that can we see the alleyway again see which part sorry the alley you don't have a picture of the mural there this is back I know let me pull it up on our because have see how it goes that's what this whole Grant was about even though it's maybe not place let me see y' very sorry that we are having so many technical difficulties I looked at the thing was like rainbow barel agenda cop is col cks here we I'm feeling what you're saying as far as the location goes I mean that's that's that's a large investment yeah that's the other side more visible then it becomes a lot easier to swallow 19 19,000 we have the money is that is that money that comes out of our budget again so structured right now because they're seeking this under facade it would technically come out of incentives however staff is talked and we do feel to be consistent kind of across the budget that it would make sense to fund this out of the art budget um which I do also want to point out has not spent any money this fiscal year so again it's not like anyone's if it were someplace visible I think it's fairly no brainer it's a you know if it was a wall that was I think we'd be so guess that's kind of our question and that's the C's question as well at is do you want to make the recommendation then that they move what they're proposing we request they do it on the maybe Northern end of the building which faces Street end which is extremely visible it's not it's all one story and stuff um let me see it's got the uh height at the back oh no that's not what I want to do I hate this computer so it's got the second story and then this back piece is is the same height all the way across now it is different though because it's got this covered area so you know it does change unfortunately what the artist is able to do and of course the Google car does not drive up and down the boardwalk so I don't necessarily have unfortunately how large is that that blank wall that doesn't have Windows on it I mean to me um the mural where in the window area is kind of like just unconnected in a way that you know they concentrated a really cool mural in that blank area it might you know be more suitable for viewing from First Street you mean right the one right by First Street right there where the Big Barrel is that big blank wall like minus the window area I thought that was the ocean that's the oce oh that's the ocean side oh myad okay I see what you're saying well it be it' be viewable from the from the the boardwalk then but uh yeah I don't know you can that some from the sea but are they putting it anywhere else we know I mean no right now this is all theyve proposed is on this wall um so it's like that continue or something I highly doubt it I think so I mean I think you know there's a well that's what I was to say I mean that cost a lot of pain FR they are doing other upgrades to the building yeah so they're not just slapping a mural up there and leaving everything else as is everything's getting an overhaul including the Landscaping if they just to be the devil's if they if they were just do something creative of color scheme that wouldn't mural it might be better than what they're proposing here I mean I don't think I mean it sounds like from what I heard at the C last night and then the group here I don't think we need to propose anything on this wall um I think the appropriate step forward at Le From staff's perspective would be to reject the mural as it is on this wall and then whatever they do on this wall is up to them once it's rejected we no longer get a say so or a vote we reject that and then we request that you that the agency and our committee are open to still funding a mural but they would like to see it on a wall visible either from First Street or the street end um and you know give them a chance to work with the artist and even though this maybe won't transition exactly to the other side of the building um I'm sure they could come up with something creative for that other as well if we based it just strictly on visibility then it would fail the test yes yeah I mean we never established criteria you for these Grant murals you there's not criteria there's the grant criteria one of the caveats to this grant money especially for murals is that it is 100% the discretion of the agency and C wants to not award something didn't they would never do this that I'm going to make an extreme statement if they want to not award something because they didn't like their shirt that day and they just didn't feel like doing anything then at their discretion I mean it's it's pretty you know these are Grant funds these are not um necessary these are not a right this is a privilege um and that priv is disc this heing got yeah I didn't we discuss subject matter at one point of these murals like we discussed that those were mainly though for the public murals so murals that we would be placing on public buildings we wanted those to kind of all reflect at least the first two uh we opted to have those reflect some element of beach life and sea life um it gets a little trickier when it's a private building because while yes we have an input and it's obviously public money so is a right to provide feedback um if you know in theory you can tell them hey we don't like this we want to see starfish and then they'll just go never mind we're going to do it anyway and then they're still going to paint what you don't like anyway um so it's a little bit trickier when it's yeah on a private property but to your point if the money is tied to us I mean if they want they want put a mural through they can do it anyway great but if the money's tied to us and we can putul we can tie it back into things that are the beaches and etc etc I was we can still tie it back into that I was thinking if if the subject matter was on the risque a side or if it involved like uh advertisement for their business I mean we those wouldn't be allow because of contributing to that yeah no those wouldn't be allowed also whether it was public or private dollars you know there are rules about signs There are rules about political advertisements on buildings There are rules explicit content so that that would never pass public or private by but in the future is it worth tying those murals like this into the same standard that we have for other murals um and then they have the option if they want the city money to help pay for murals it has to have a theme El elements of the city of the beaches and things like that and if they want to do it on their own sure they can use their own money I think that's a really tough one um I'm staff so I only have the opinion that a staff person so buy all me is my opinion is not the only accurate one but I think reigning in a private business doing a private mural and private property even though they're Grant funded um I think it almost is too much very strict stipulations on style and theme because that takes away in my opinion a little bit of the Integrity of having an art downtown you start seeing murals popping up on all these buildings and they're all fish and they're all sea life um I think what makes downtown so unique right now is we have so many private murals that are very different and they're all very unique and it's not the same thing and I think if we start really getting into the Weeds about exactly what their content is we are kind of stripping the identi of business um I think every business is different agree with you it' be like censoring you know the yes you make the argument they're public I completely understand but the C doesn't um even with things like landscaping and signage you know the CRA is not going to every pagant applicant and making them use the same style sign in the same color and the same font as long as it fits within the identity of that business and it makes sense and it's not offensive and it goes by what the codes that they have to do typically it's it's up to the business to decide kind of style themes and colors um landscaping for example and and I think this is a really good move by the agency about two years ago we got a landscaping Grant and it was the first one we had received and they said look we like this we'll approve this however we're not 100% sure that this is um Salt Air tolerant so let's run this by you know parks and wck make sure that it works and it did and you know it was approved it was a little bit different than some of the other stuff in the downtown but it was consistent enough with kind of the overall Vision that they're approved so you know they're not telling them what plants to use and what mulch or rocks to use if it's consistent enough then so we can't make them on there you again you can I don't know that we would recommend it but you you can can we lessen our contribution in some fashion that's within the guidelines of the that is I would for this conversation at least and I know it's hard to kind of break away from our previous mural conversations because those all revolve around the amount in the dollars because those are set but because this is set by a program already in place I wouldn't worry too much about the dollars except for like the agency pointed out does the location match the investment and I think that the agency's overarching theme was no the location does not match the monetary investment the location does not match the monetary investment yes but to Bob's Point as to not discourage them moving forward even though the funds don't matter just a set of presidents for us that okay this doesn't match could we still offer a contribution like half of it no you can not do that I I wouldn't because you're on a slippery slope if we do that the grant program is established so I wouldn't um again I think what makes sense is to tell the applicant that this specific one is rejected due to its location and ask that they go back to the artist and in advance of the February CRA meeting they bring something back on a different part of the building that is uh pedestrian and vehicle visible um and go you know I'm looking at this and I'm thinking that $20,000 would cover the cost of that mural there's a lot of Blank Space there's equal amount of blank spaces there are of of artwork and you know what I mean in that regard would we be paying for the whole thing I mean how would we even know if that was the case pay for the whole thing um because it's a a matching Grant um so I believe it's 12200 ft is the size the mural itself and that's about $20 a square foot is what it broke out to which again was kind of a little under typically what the market Standard is the market Standard is usually around 25 foot or square foot and I believe the square footage calculations most likely are because whatever color that's going to have to go underneath this mural may not match the rest of the building or it may not be feasible with what's existing currently so my guess is that based off of this rendering there's going to have to be a base layer and then is going to have to go in much like the seawalk one in multiple layers on top of that base layer so it in theory is 12200 ft of painting some of it is just solid okay yeah that's kind of what I was getting at the Baseline of the cost of the entire thing y yeah so it's full service you know mural work at 20t 1200 ft and the lift and the total everything is 27,000 um 27 and something to just okay kind of reference the seawalk mural was $50,000 yeah so but what you're saying what what I'm hearing from the city is that they're not they're not really excited about encouraging people to go down that Alleyway to look at the mural further because of the back flow there and do we even know what the I mean they are they on lighting it or anything like that we don't know about the lighting of it is that correct um and even if they were going to light it there's only so much they could do because of the proximity to the dunes and then they have to follow Turtle ordinances which is an entire another Beast that nobody's going to want to touch so don't think so there's a safety concern absolutely about the hour way money I agree I agree you want to take a on this so yeah so I think we can kind of do the vot in um I think one critical part of this vote is going to be the recommendation of either accepting or rejecting The Proposal as made which is on that southern wall in that Alleyway um so that would be proposal number one and if the recommendation was the rejection of The Proposal then I think you would make a second proposal that says um the AR committee you know recommend staff talk with the applicant and this was discussed last night s meeting staff talked to the applic in advance of the February meetings and make the recommendation to move the mural to a visible wall um I really the only wall that they're going to have that's visible is going to be on First Street or uh this street end right here those are really the only two you know third or first are really the only excuse me I'm sorry um just wrap in a little bit the front section of that wall That's down the alleyway um because that's very that is very visible it doesn't have to be it doesn't have to necessarily be one long stretch correct it could couldn't it be if we go back to walking towards the alleway please so that front section here could yes here couldn't couldn't Mur Encompass a portion of that so it doesn't send you down the alleyway to look at more or just send you down the alleyway period and then they Encompass more of the building I mean it doesn't have to be a big stretch of building it could be broken up it just wouldn't be that necessarily I mean it could even be elements of this design absolutely I mean I think again what we just want to get away from is this wall and investing Grant monies which we want to award Grant but we also want to award Grant responsibly and it doesn't make sense to award $20,000 when there could be either a better location or if they don't want to change the location then a better place to use those public funds would you be giving them directions in what we discuss if they agree about you know utilizing maybe a portion of that and then maybe other areas around the building wherein they would have the opportunity to make another proposal correct correct so what so we're voting on two phases we're voting on do we accept the alley Alleyway and based on the conversation let's vote on whether we accept the current mosed in that location for No I say no so the next proposal is do the next vote was vote is do we go back to them and say you know but we're not shutting the door at all agree we're just saying that um could they go back to the locations on the building including the front portion of the alleyway and some other areas and incorporate it could disability it could be even the elements of this or part work um but but thinking in terms of visibility exposure exposure exactly yeah so if you guys are comfortable what the next vote can basically be on is for staff to discuss the applicant in advance of our committee February meeting and then the Agents of February meeting to uh redo a proposal with their artist and choose a location for this mural that is more visible and does not encourage people un well sir agree AG right everybody we all agree okay so then what I will do after this meeting is I will talk to the applicant and their team and just kind of explain where everybody is at um hopefully by our February meetings then they will talk to their artist and they will bring a new proposal for that portion of the Grant and then we can officially hopefully one day award um a grant for perfect okay okay items for discussion I did just have one thing I wanted to update you guys on we'll probably Workshop this a bit in February maybe March but I'm hoping February um we are starting on the P Parking Lot finally the call that I was on when I ran in here and ran back out uh was with the Department of Environmental Protection um they've got to come out and do all kinds of crazy visits I managed to convince them that they did not have to do that and I could just video them from out there and they agreed so now we're actually able to start finally uh one big component of that project is moving the dumpster enclosure and the intent has always been to move the dumpster enclosure first and it'll be finished with cinder block and then it will have a flat smooth finish of a very solid neutral kind of light beigy gray plain color um and then we will next month discuss on what we would like to see with mural around that dumpster enclosure so it's not just trash can enclosure um and that would be a really good opportunity to solicit proposals uh from local artists only perfect and that may happen we will talk about that in February y yeah I will work on between now and February getting a draft call together and then we can kind of go into details about themes and things you guys would like to see but based on now how the ball's rolling we'll probably be ready Toten put that actually out to bid to local artists um in the spring I think that enclosure will get done pretty quick well that be the only location right now that we're looking at is that one it will not um and it'll probably be a good time if we're doing that one to then also do three public restroom facilities and do them kind of all at the same time since the intention was to do all local artists on all of those so those will be a good time to probably tie in as well and there's a public bathroom literally right next to the dumer so next Thursday just in the uh we're going to be looking at definitely the the dumpster whatever enclosure the new enclosure that and then possibly the restrooms and all of these are going to be local calls for artists for local artists yes these are not going to be RS okay um I have to ask is there any movement on is love Jack's Jack beach by any chance there ISD that ihart NY is uh trademarked and you have to get permission from what we to find you actually have to get permission from state New York to then utilize that trademark um so our attorney I'm sure will look into the cost associated with that but that ihart whatever is a trademark slog that doesn't surprise me I guess the question is is the cost going to be or is it going to be something that we can actually to be determined I don't know right now but are they do they have the are they looking they are looking into we are looking into it into the cost because I know they've used it they they've used it in quite a few different areas love La it's all over so I've got to believe that and also everywhere it's used it it may not be loud um a lot of do it anyway which is fine cool but we're not going to do that if we're going to do any large public art it will be 100% leg leg we don't want to get to the Great area especially not where trademarking is involved he's looking is there any chance that he'll have a number by the next meeting um I'm not sure I'll follow up after this yeah I've got a couple of questions that you might have to go upstairs for after this so I will put my head in and kind of see where we're at appreciate it yeah okay um if there not any other discussion I'll call be sorry would address for discussion sure okay s my name is Gary payt I'd like the community to take another look at the U waterfall sculpture come on up here J so we can I would just recomend that we take another look at the water fall sculpture right now it seems like it's lost there was an plan to do more in the way of landscaping around it and maybe even some seeing from what I understand and even some signage there if I remember correctly defining what was going to what those waterfall columns were about if you go out there and take a look at it it's it's lost it doesn't feel like a completed project right and I really feel we need to go back and take another look at that and do what you think is appropriate to give it the presence that it really needs out there because it's obviously a lot of money for spent on that artwork and really want it to to shine jaylor can you help us a yeah so I mean I think honestly at this point that's probably more of a staff thing um the art piece itself is done and installed the Landscaping issues and the signage issues are probably more on our end um so that would probably be a better conversation for us to have um I mean the committee doesn't hasn't really had an involvement at this point anyway in any Landscaping benches Etc and as a part of The Proposal that was approved for the sculpture itself um you know the landscaping and benches were not in that proposal what they approved was what is there so all inclusive sure but I think we're getting a little mixed up that the intention was for it to be landscaped and have Benes at some point and signage um but that was not the artist proposal the artist proposal was for what is existing there currently and then our job was to come back in and do some Landscaping which have done some of that and then we've got a sign that we are ordering for that with an informational small plaque or used can it and it sends you to the website that explains the educational part of that um but those elements were not the proposal those were what about the seing too tayor again that was all kind of right right but I mean to to his point it's great that he brought it back up to see where we stand with all that because even though that was not those were elements that we discussed artwork what we what we eventually voted on um those elements are still in play and still need to be addressed to your point and and I think what Taylor's saying is that we should we should contact you tayor is that correct or would that be Heather the planning no I mean I don't know that neily do it as either of us but I think that would have been a good conversation to have um before now I guess I brought it up to the art committee only because I wanted to make sure your expectations don't know land disc discuss information all those and voted on that piece as being part of the whole and and I think it's very important that that we do that we do keep M what I'm hearing is a lot of that has been is signage has been ordered we don't know where the bench St on the benches and the Landscaping is is that correct liting the Landscaping out there now is that is at least that pH of landscaping is done the lighting is there they're all up L at night um again if everyone remembers we couldn't necessarily do major lighting it could be illuminated it cannot be lit because of its proximity to the ocean otherwise we would have had to go through another D lighting permit um and then we can definitely talk about adding additional Landscaping um I think it's definitely something though I encourage this committee and anyone else that's on any type of a committee or board um you know if something is there and it's complete and it's been months and you see something or you don't understand why something's not done you know rather than kind of just let let us know I mean because everybody that we've spoken to does nothing but you know ra and compliment so uh it's very surprising to hear otherwise when we've not been made aware of that what um what's we keep in mind there's going to be a two story parking garage right behind it uh what the time is there any time frame on that not yet not yet so right now because we had to vote on it and on the elements of it with that understanding that there was going to be eventually a wall like right behind it um so it's that's still at least a couple years down the road excuse me phot kind of I haven't I've just driven by I haven't been driven by at night actually so I wasn't it's really pretty at night does it yeah with the lights lights the interior of it is illuminated I I would recommend that um Taylor and I go back and talk to Parks about additional Landscaping possibilities and kind of maybe come back to you guys with some recommendations for like she said she's already working on the signage with our Communications manager like that's already in the works internally and we kind of look at some options for seating that won't take away from the artwork because that's the last thing we want to do is any kind of seating that's going to distract from that so something really simple really plain if someone wants to just kind of take a breather there so I would say if that's you know what you guys want to see we can work on that internally and bring something back could could we do that could we do that because G's point picture it does look a little bare right now and we did you know either Ventures or I think I thought we discussed maybe a small wall that you could sit on or something even even that maybe a few different ideas that were arounds around yeah but they're redoing the Landscaping right now in the median on Beach Boulevard from Third Street to First Street um and there's you know a whole landscape plan for that so we can like we'll talk to our um Park superintendent that's overseeing that and kind of where are there opportunities for additional Landscaping in that area and room for benches that will distract from the sculpture all own for because it is kind of lost now because we be because it is kind of lost now because you know we we knew that there was going to be eventually a parking garage right there and that changes it tremendously because all of a sudden that space is not so big and open right um so if we could you know put some foliage in there that would that would help help it sure we definitely have to um Loop in our Police Department obviously we're going to add anything more make sure that you know it's they're comfortable with the safety obviously we don't want to put big comfortable benches where people can oh know take a siesta and we got to be careful with the Landscaping part of what the problem was with the Landscaping that was there it was overgrown you could hide behind it so we got to be careful when we add stuff could you make smaller benches you couldn't actually sleep on but you could sit down well they enjoy there's a variety of different ones like ones that are already a few downtown that were kind of like our pilot to see they kind of look like a little triangle there's also other ones that um they call it toad stool it's it's literally just a little round thing yep that's what I was thinking something maybe along those lines where you could just sit and appreciate the artwork and it not detract they just literally concrete like toad that's what it look like Little Toad stols okay so we could look into something like that pars about maybe installing something something simple that's not going to cause safety issues would that be something we could that we would have at the next meeting we we'll certainly try yeah yeah to get you guys some Concepts you do yeah anyway thanks thanks for your feedback we appreciate it all right I think is all work think Miss absolutely a because he was coming up with completely all right there's nothing else I'll call the meeting to Jour second second