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Today is Tuesday, the 28th day of July, the year 2026. This is a budget hearing for the Department of Recreation and Youth Development with the Jersey City Municipal Council. We had a scheduled 1:00 p.m. start. And the clock on my cell phone is showing 10:04 p.m. May we

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have a roll call for the commencement of this budget hearing? Council Person Brooks is not here. Council person Zupa. Oh, Council Person Brooks is here. Thank you. Council person Zuper is not here yet.

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Council person Efos here. Council person Little >> here. >> Council person Gilmore. Council person Singh >> here. >> Council person Griffin is not here. Council person Labaro is not here. And

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council president Ridley >> here. We have six council members in attendance at 10:04 p.m. In addition, in its time of its preparation, the notice of this meeting was similarly disseminated on Thursday,

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July 23rd, 2026 at 1:32 p.m. to the mayor, municipal council, business administrator, corporation council, and local newspapers so I can certify as to our total compliance with the Sunshine Law. Council President, I'm going to turn it over to you.

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>> Good afternoon. Uh we are here in our afternoon session for recreation and youth development. Thank you to the staff and directors for being here. This session will be led by our councilman Frank Gilmore. So I am going to hand it

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over to him at this time. >> Thank you council president. Good afternoon everyone. Thank you for joining us. we will I guess we will go through the presentation first and then

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we'll have uh questions um seeing that everyone's not here. We kind of ran out of time last time when everyone had three or four questions. Um but I don't think we have that problem today seeing that three uh people here. Council President, if you could turn

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your phone off while you um Thank you. Sean asks Um, so without further ado, recreation, you guys can begin your presentation. >> Turn them. Yeah, >> there we go. >> There you go. >> Good afternoon, Council President

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Ridley, council lead, presentation lead, uh, Gilmore, and city council members. Uh, Pete Pincson here, director of recreation, presenting on behalf of the Department of Recreation and Youth Development for you today. So, I just want to tell you a little bit

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about what we do here in recreation. Uh, we try to provide to the best of our ability to provide safe, inclusive, and affordable recreation for residents of all ages in our community. uh by way of

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youth sports clinics, training, leagues and development, summer camps, after school and seasonal programming year round, aquatics and swim instruction year round. Senior recreation, wellness, and intergenerational programming,

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adaptive recreation for individuals with disabilities, community events and special initiatives, park programming and facility scheduling, partnerships with schools, nonprofits, and community organizations. Currently, the Department of Recreation

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has 132 staff members, and we utilize two uh operating platforms. Facilitron for all of our scheduling for all of our fields and facilities and we use Recesk for our registration software. Um, as of

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right now, we are currently running 42 summer programs which we are extremely proud of because that's an increase from 17 in the summer before. So, so far, just to touch on that a little bit more, we've increased our

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programming by 200%. Um we had 17 programs citywide in uh about 20 locations and we've increased that to 42 programs in about 28 locations in the

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city. Uh and we've also balanced it. So last summer we saw uh inequity in wards and this summer we've ensured that every single ward has at least five programs

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per day uh in our community. So we're very excited about that. Um Facilitron is something that we utilize uh now as well. Um it's a few years in the making, but I think we've kind of perfected that

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software now and really get in touch with the community that way uh to provide field permits and opportunities as well as reces. And we've streamlined the um registration software uh for the

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community. And we've also as as you guys know, we had uh ordinance passed in previous council meetings. Now, we were able to receive funding for adaptive programming. We're very excited for and we started that um this year uh again.

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So, we're providing our residents with disabilities with programming as well. Next slide. So, here's here's some uh stats for you guys about our our progress and our building uh for the youth. Uh currently

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4.4 24 million in competitive grants secured for our parks, recreation, and youth programming. Uh 624 youth jobs are created for residents ages 15 to 24 through Jersey City Next programming. Uh and 116 partners in the city um that

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we've we've partnered with to provide jobs for those youth through the uh JC Next program. And once again, 200% growth in uh recreation programming. Um, I think pretty much everything there is self-explanatory. Uh, we secured 1.9

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million in in the UEZ grants plus park renovations at Le Point Park, Leonard Gordon Park, Terasav Park, and Martin Enright Park. And we've launched adaptive swim lessons. Once again, that's for individuals with disabilities. Uh, which we're really

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proud of. And it's helped to um curb youth drowning, which is um at a high rate in our country. So, we're at the forefront of that here in Jersey City, uh, thanks to my division director. She's done an excellent job at providing that service to the community. We've

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also built partnerships with public and charter schools, Ruckers University, NJCU, Keen, Jersey City, St. Peters, Hudson County Community College, and our library system. So, this is a map even though you've seen it before, but we just want to point out, you know, that our Jersey

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City Next program, uh, we've provided job opportunities all throughout the city of Jersey City. We're very excited about the youth. Um, I interact with them daily and, uh, we really hired some great individuals, great youth members of our community to work with our youth

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or youth, if that's a term. Um, so they're doing an excellent job. Excellent. This is just a map of comparison to show you what it looked like last summer uh in terms of where we are with programming throughout the city and on

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the left side and on the right side shows you our current programming map just for the summer. Um we're looking at this model to expand upon in the fall uh but also to take the temperature of the community and see uh how things are going in new areas uh and how and get

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the feedback from community members. So, our proposed budget uh for 2026, which we are 7 months into, so we've already spent a bunch of this uh is $8.3 million. Uh 5.9 going towards personnel.

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Uh one million going just a little over 1 million going into programming. uh 1 million for contracts, vendor service agreements, and about 319,000 for supplies, equipment, and other materials.

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What we've cut so far, uh we've cut just under a million dollars 9.56% of our budget. Um one of the largest cuts in the city. I might point out that our department has cut pretty much the

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the most out of any department in the city. Um 11,000 just under 12 uh just over 11,000 coming in personnel, under 10,000 in programming, 356,000 in contracts, and uh about a

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half a million dollars in other savings, equipment, materials, and supplies. Looking ahead, uh we're looking to find ways where we can generate revenue for our department, even more so than we do currently. Uh currently through reces and through, uh programming, we generate

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annually approximately $250,000 in programming. Um, but we're looking to do even more with uh city ordinance 26-064, which I'm grateful I got an opportunity to work with a lot of the council members here on and had great

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conversation and also I've worked with a lot of community leaders on as well. So, we're looking to anticipate anywhere from 50,000 to 200,000 in revenue in our first full calendar year of operation and anywhere from 150 to 300,000 in year

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two. and beyond. Um, we are actively pursuing uh outside capital. As you see, we we have large cuts to our budget. So, we're looking at green uh green acres funds, CDBG funds, local recreation improvement grants, and other grants

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throughout the state uh that we can utilize um as resources for our department. Um more more existing assets. So, we're trying to maximize I like I said, I'll just tap into more uh of Facilitron and

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its capabilities um to identify more fields and spaces um for usage so that the fields that we currently have on there that we want to rent out, we can then charge for those, but then also have other spaces available and maybe

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fix. For example, I'll just give you um in u they call it Mosquito Park. The name is Leonard Gordon. there's actually a baseball field on that park that's kind of been covered over and grassed over. Um so I worked with local community members to see how we can turn that back into a baseball field. So just

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adding um more assets and and maximizing the existing ones that we do have. And that is our presentation. Thank you. >> Thank you, director. Um so in order of the questions, we'll go ladies first

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from the left. Um and she Lena Denise you [laughter] >> I know councilman you love me. >> Thank you director. Thank you director for the um presentation. I have few

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questions first on the presentation. Can you please talk more about 624 youth jobs created by JC Next? How many jobs were created last year 2025? >> Um I don't have that number with me in

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front of me right now. Um but Deputy Mayor Bryant 191. >> Thank you. Um you mentioned that you have increased programming. I'm missing the numbers right now but I saw that you have

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increased programming by 17 program. Last year it was 17 and now it was 42. How did we how did you do it? Did you uh hire more people? How were you able to do with the same resources?

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>> Yes. So that's a great question. Thank you for asking that. So what we were able to do is I utilized my professional experience in in administering athletics and collegiate level and and being a coach and just taking the resources that we had and examining them and understanding why we did things a

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certain way and kind of trying to change it. So I'll give you just a few examples. Um one example is we we added another a second summer camp location. That was probably the easiest thing we did. So, we added a second summer location where we were able to provide a

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service to 150 more youth per week. Um, so there's one extra program. We also had have mobile recreation. I'm not sure if you're familiar with it, but basically we have two vans. We have about three three or four staff members in each van and they drive out to

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different areas of the city. uh and just previously just basically kind of like rolled the balls out and took cornhole out and you know just had free fun play. So what I did is I took that model but I kind of

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structured it so that one van is going out now from 12 to 4 every day and another van's going out from 4 to 8 every day. thus creating two programs and then within each ban um [clears throat] they were previously going to two locations only. One was

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like a Monday, Wednesday, Friday location and a Tuesday, Thursday. And what we did was we created uh every day would have a different location and spread those locations out throughout the city. So each van now is going to five different locations a week and

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actually running sport specific programs such as whiffle ball which in the height uh we're in Persing Field on Wednesdays. We have 132 participants in that program. So mobile recreation went from four programs last summer to 10 this

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summer. That's an increase of six by taking the same staff, same hours of operation, same resources, but just dividing it up amongst the city and actually implementing sports specific programs. Those are just two small examples. I can count get all the way up

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to 42 if you like. >> And did you hear about the the from parents? Did you hear what they feel about the new programming added? um anything. >> We heard from the kids and they're

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extremely excited. The numbers don't lie. The numbers show interest. Interest in kickball. Not just showing up and saying, "Well, the mobile wreck band is there." No, today the mobile wreck van is playing kickball and and those kids are excited. And the same kids are

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repeat customers. They're coming back every Tuesday for kickball in the Heights. They're coming back every Friday for whiffle ball at Caven Point. So the proof is in the attendance and the retention. >> I did have a question about your salary

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but I think it got fixed now. So that's there were some >> Yes, >> it was it's fixed now. Okay. >> Thank you, director. Thank you, Council. >> You're welcome. >> Yes. Councilwoman Little. >> Um would you like us to keep our

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questions just on the presentation or are we on presentation and director's office? >> No, you can do both. Okay. All right. Thanks so much. Um, so thank you, director, for your presentation. And, um, I guess one general question I have

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is that, you know, as you noted, you cut nearly 10% of your budget, uh, nearly $100,000. And I I do remember, you know, when the mayor was doing budget town halls a month or so ago, he was saying that the two departments that he did not want to

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cut were um public safety and recreation. and looking, you know, we had the public safety hearing last week and um they are getting an increase of 6.3 million and meanwhile you're cutting

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$900,000 nearly and I just wanted to, you know, I I appreciate that, you know, the recognition of the budget crisis that we're in and and trying to be leaner and doing more more with less and I think you've been doing a lot of that. Um, but especially as we're cutting contracts like cutting the park

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maintenance contracts and seeking to bring more things in house, I just I guess I'm a little worried that um, you know, cuts this deep might make it so that we do not have the capabilities to do things inhouse. Is

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that a concern of yours or or can you speak because you know a month ago I was under the impression there would be no cuts to recreation and now here there are quite substantial cuts. I'm not saying which one is right and which one is wrong. I just want to make sure we're well equipped. Um especially as we're seeking to bring things like park

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maintenance in house. >> Thank you for that question. We understand it's a citywide issue. It's not isolated to one department and you know one department isn't protected over any other. Um we yeah it is it's definitely a concern uh especially since

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we are one of the more front-facing departments in the community. Uh right now on a daily basis 2,000 households are talking about recreation, right? Everybody, mom and dad are worried, you know, if Theo is going to

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get to basketball today and Sally's going to get to swimming. So they're talking about us every single day uh in at least 2,000 households. And that's numbers that we're pulling straight from our recesses software that tells us what um our reach is in our community right

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now. We uh directly connect to 11% of the households in the community that have children. Our ultimate goal is 25% which would get be right now 11% is the norm and it's just in our country like

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10 to 20% of municipalities um that's the recreation departments that's their connectivity to the community about 10 to 20% and right now we're at 11. our goal is to get to 25. Um, so not only if these cuts are

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annual, yeah, we'll have a significant impact on our on our operations, but uh we're team players, we understand the crisis that we're all in. Um, and with the exceptional team of allstars that I have working with me, uh, we're going to

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make it work no matter what. We're going to find ways to provide programming. Even with these cuts, we've still increased our programming and and it's a testament to the individuals we have and and and the high level thinking that's going on in recreation right now.

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>> Thank you. So, so just to make sure I understand correctly, you're you're doing more with less right now, but you know, five years from now or something, you know, when the city is on more stable financial footing um in order to deliver at the at the level that you

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want to deliver, we probably would need to fill some of these vacancies. >> Correct. It's not trending in the direction we want, but who knows? Anything can happen. >> All right. Thank you. Um, and then my question specifically for the director's office tab, and then I understand we're

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going to move to later to the park maintenance and enrichment and recreation, but um, while we're on the director's office tab, um, I I see you have both a secretary and an executive assistant. Um, can, you know, just

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in in layman's terms, could you describe um, the different roles that they fill and and if there's any redundancies there? >> Yeah, internal affairs and external affairs. One is specifically connected to what's going on within our our office and one is more related to outside the

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office and more directly connected to the community. >> And and which one is that? The secretary or the executive assistant is executive assistant is internal. >> The administrative assistant is internal to me and secretary director's office and yes, correct.

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>> Okay. Thank you for Thank you for clarifying. >> You're welcome. And that's that's all the questions I have on the presentation in the director's office. >> And just for the record, council person Zuper is present at 1:16 p.m. So we now have seven council members present.

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>> Okay. >> Council President. >> Okay. Um, Councilwoman Singh alluded to this question, uh, but I believe she said it was updated, but we don't have an updated workbook. Can we get if there

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were changes made to this budget, can we get the updated workbook? >> Um, >> there were no changes made to the budget. It was just a typo in the slideshow that we fixed to match so the slides match the but the bottom line. >> Gotcha. Okay. So then my question is the

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um director's salary. The director's salary that's listed on the workbook is different from the salary in the um current active employees list. So, which one would be the correct salary? Is $10,000 lower on the

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workbook? >> That's accurate. >> The workbook is accurate. >> The one that's lower is accurate. >> My knowledge. >> Yeah. So, the active employee list um I think is incorrect, which I can recirculate, but the workbook, the budget workbook is correct.

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>> Correct. And then for the am come back to that one. Oh, here we are. So, the deputy director is that that's a new position that we

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created. I know the deputy director isn't new, but that's a new new position that was created this year >> to my knowledge. Yes. >> Then Councilwoman Little answered the questions about the

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secretary and the assistant secretary. So that uh that's all my questions on the director's office. >> Thank you. council person. >> This is just uh on the director's office. Yeah. Before we move on to the

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other divisions, >> some correlations to the different uh divisions. Uh but yeah, we we're doing the director's office. >> Okay. Uh all my questions answered on director's office so far. So I'm all right. Thank you.

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So just as it relates to the director's office, if you can just explain um the roles of senior administrative analysts um can you just like from a functional

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standpoint, what is what is that individual's responsibilities? >> I'm sorry. Can you repeat the question? I didn't hear you. for the senior administrative analysts. You said this was a new created position. Can you explain the

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I guess the daily operations or what's the what's the functions of this role? What's the duties associated with this role? >> Are you speaking about the deputy deputy director position? >> Oh, this it's in the director's >> Yeah.

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>> Yeah. The deputy director. is referring to the civil service title, but yes, deputy director. >> Okay. Yes, I apologize. So, that that position currently heads up all improvements to our programming, upgrades, and repairs to our parks,

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facilities, aquatic centers under the supervision of the director, and in conjunction with divisional directors, vendors, other city departments, and contractors. Basically, he's ensuring that all of our resources that we utilize and our facilities that we

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utilize are not only up to standard, but are some of the most high performing in in our city and in our in our state. >> So, is it fair to say that the deputy mayor is almost like a >> deputy director? I >> mean, deputy uh director is almost like

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assistant director or something like that. Yeah, you I mean I would say it's a much higher position because in in an assistant director if you want to talk about like an assistant coach or you know assistant athletic dire collegiate level there's there's a

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much smaller reporting structure. Uh in this position there's a much higher reporting structure. So everyone can report to that person as well as the director. >> Okay. So in other situations the term assistant may not mean that anyone reports to you at all and in fact it's

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different here and in this case people do report to this person. >> Okay. So if you can explain the difference uh because I also see uh this is something new. I I know at least it wasn't there when I was there. um

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assistant superintendent that's in the uh >> can just speak a little about that position. >> So that is within the division of enrichment. Do you want to Yes. >> right into that right now? >> Well, I mean just for the sake of trying

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to clarify roles. Um, so that's why I told the council like if there's any correlations um to to the questions if it's in a different direction, I mean a different division, you know, you're still within your right to ask it. >> Yeah. So that position is directly

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connected to programming into our division of enrichment solely. The deputy director position covers all three divisions of the department of recreation. >> Okay. So this assistant superintendent

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of recreation specifically have duties that's in line with the enrichment element only where as opposed to the deputy director is the the tie department. Yes. So yes and

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so the superintendent u you know is a liazison to our cultural affairs department will in the future hopefully if our ordinance is passed uh oversee adult recreation programming uh special events coordination external partnerships also external vendor

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programming there's a great deal of operations dayto-day that that person oversees in their role >> okay and I guess my last question so it says administrative clerk work from the director's office transferred

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to enrichment. So it's it's the same it's just this person is guess move not moving but moving from this particular portion and the same salaries allocated under enrichment. >> Correct.

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And the last one know you have $250 for overtime. Is that an error? I can't who is $250 for overtime >> and we'll probably come under that. Just want to let you know.

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>> Okay. All right. Supply. Okay. Um council person Zupa. Thank you to everyone's benefit. I I came from the dentist and I'll be brief because I'm drooling on myself here, but uh for the director's office on overtime, who in

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the director's office in management incurs overtime? >> None of us. I I think we both work about 10 hours a day already. So, we that's part of our job. There's I don't that that can probably be eliminated. >> Okay. Uh and ju just echoing council

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person Little's concerns about the cuts that recreation had to endure. Uh so it looks like everything was cut 15% 3% 14% total down uh little under 10% but the the director's office salaries are up

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55%. Can you speak to that? >> Yeah. Um, as a coach, you know, coaches always say you can never have too much talent on a team. And I think it's it's we have an all-star cast of people working in our office right now to

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ensure that with those cuts, we can still improve our daily operations. Uh, we got a lot of smart people, a lot of talented individuals. Uh, and I'm excited to have them working with us. And it's not just that change. the

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changes throughout the department. We've reallocated tasks, day-to-day tasks to make sure they fit the scope of job descriptions to make sure people are now doing more uh that cater towards their skills and strengths. Um and and yeah, I

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know there's an increase, but there was also a vacant position for a long time that I filled. Um and now I guess if you want to compare it to like basketball, you finally have your point guard bringing the ball up. You have your center playing center, you have your shooting guard shooting the ball when in

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the past you had a lot of guys doing maybe who were playing five on two. So we're we're we're getting to where we should be nationally standard. We're getting to that level uh administratively and and our our goal

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and our vision is that it's going to spill into the rest of our department. >> Now you and I spoke before you were appointed about uh uh fixing inefficiencies. Would you say that what you're doing and what you just described is fixing those inefficiencies? >> The proof is in the growth. The proof is

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in the the the resource the the proof is in what we're doing. The proof is in the numbers. It's there already. In just 90 days, we've already changed a lot of things in our department. We're very proud of that. So, uh so I will get to facilities when we get to that uh

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specific um area. Uh, and I I hear quite a bit about having top talent to be the coaching staff and the management. What I'm concerned is if we don't have enough players, it doesn't it doesn't matter who's coaching, right? If you cut uh recreation, um, so if you cut park maintenance, it doesn't matter who's at

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the top of the ticket, right? It doesn't matter who's leading the department. Uh, so just something to keep in mind throughout the, you know, the rest of this year and next year. It's a concern I do have, but that's it for this. >> We share that. >> Thank you. Um, Council President Brooks,

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>> um, the last basketball championship I won was in 1997, um, in my summer league. I was 14 years old. Uh, since we're talking about basketball, I just wanted to get that on the record. So, >> congrats. >> Thank you. [laughter] I still have the t-shirt. >> There you go.

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>> Still have the t-shirt. >> Still fits, I'm sure, too. >> It does not fit. [laughter] does speak to, you know, the power of youth summer programs and something I remember um

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29 years later. Anyway, um question um on the presentation um on the recreation programming um keep wanting to say NJCU but can um

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facilities access to their facilities. Um, is that something that is projected for 2027 at this point or is it something um I I know there's um HHS does senior swimming there if you

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>> we're locked in and that is within our scope of vision for the future. uh in speaking with administration there um they're just not prepared to offer up that opportunity until at least January due to renovation as you can imagine

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they want to do like a full makeover of the facility. So uh we've been told it's not ready until January. However, we will not back. We're going to stay on top of them to try to get in there as soon as possible. >> Okay. And is that projected to be

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savings to the city for use of their facilities or will there be some kind of expense? >> Yes, absolutely. We're looking for that to be an alternative uh or a supplement to additional sites that we have um at cost. I I don't want to say too much

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yet. I don't want to overpromise and underdel, but um we are we're definitely looking at that 100% to be a cost savings. >> Okay. And um I I'll wait for my parks questions question for that uh division, but is

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there anything else? So >> can I piggyback off of uh Councilman Brooks in addition to the facility at uh Westside, have we also been in discussions with

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them about their field on Route 440, Society Hill? Okay, >> we have. So, you know, I I'm not I'm sure it's common knowledge. I worked for NJCU for 14 years. So, I was actually the site supervisor for that entire facility. So, I got, you know, uh very

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accustomed to it and know that they are still planning on having women's soccer there in the fall. So, that will take um priority over u field usage. And then in the spring they're going to the plan is to bring uh flag football, women's flag

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football, which is fastest growing sport in the country right now on the women's side. So if we can kind of navigate around those two sports, um we'll we'll try to get as much field time there as possible. But as you know, um we're

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really looking for indoor space. >> Okay, we're going to move to the division of recreation uh aquetics. Um, we're going to start this way. Gonna, uh, Council Person Brooks Tom, you could

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go last. You came late. >> Sure. Uh, question. >> Yes, >> we're on. We're Oh, recreation division. Recreation. Okay. Um

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where if it's here at all um are there line items for capital improvements for any of the facilities? >> This is um that would be in the capital budget >> which we haven't been presented with yet.

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>> I'm sorry. >> We have we been presented I missed a couple sessions. Did we get that yet? This is for the expense budget. We're not um presenting on the capital budget at this time.

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>> Okay. >> Okay. >> It's this later in the year. >> Okay. All right. >> Okay. Council person Zuba. So for uh the maintenance and repair uh line items are

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those things that go to any facility repairs or no? >> So currently uh we are we have applied for grants through CDBG grants for certain repairs at certain parks. I don't know if uh Keith you want to talk

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about it. That's his this is my all-star staff member who specializes in that right now. Um so I'll give him the opportunity to speak on that. >> Keith I can wait too. Uh I'm going to ask about the the Pavonia Marian pool. Should I wait for uh park maintenance section or or is it fall under the

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recreation? >> Yeah. >> Good afternoon. Uh Rosa Marie Nunes, division director of aquatics for the record. Um so the maintenance for Pavonia pool is slotted. We are getting quotes for that. Uh we are looking to

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get the liner replaced and plaster it. So we were informed that is going to come on from the capital funds. So that is being worked on. Codes have been secured. Um and you'll be getting those shortly. >> Okay. Thank you. >> I would just recommend reaching out

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having a dialogue with me about because people in the community asked why the pool wasn't open when it before it was. I didn't have an answer for them. So if we can have a conversation uh and keep me up to date so I can keep the community up to date about about when the pools are opening or or when they need to be closed. >> Sure. Absolutely. We can do that. The

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pool was delayed by one week. It was open the following Saturday. Um that was mechanical failure, something that was out of our control from a pump. Um but numbers were steady. You know, program is thriving there. So, you know, staff is we're part of the youth works program there. So, we have lifeguards, labors,

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you know, everybody is community is actually really good. I was there. I'm there every day. But Saturday, we had 190 people there. It was just awesome. >> Exactly. They were clamoring to go earlier for July 4th weekend. So, thank you Just a followup to to that question. Um,

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so I'm looking online item 310 and 311 and it says maintenance and repair equipment, which is abbreviated. Then 311 actually spells out the abbreviated terms. Is there a differential in those two line items?

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um 310 and 311. I know you guys requested for 311 251, but it looks like you didn't get any of it. Then for 310, you requested 854

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and uh the request is now at 3:15. So, we're only using line item 310. Um, the funds that were requested from 311, they have been moved over to capital funds. So, everything that we're looking

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to utilize will be coming out of 310. >> Okay. So, 311. So, can you speak to um Wow. I mean, can you speak to you requested 850? Um, can you speak to the

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the repairs? um that you were looking to do with the 850 because now it's slashed by half a million dollars. Thank you for the question, Councilman. Uh so what we did is we put the line 310

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and uh which got pulled over to capital. Um for instance, we had Lafayette Kitty Pool frogs, the frog feature service or replacement. Um we had that at 65,000. Lafayette Kitty Pool skimmer baskets. uh the kitty pool motor replacements, uh

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motor replacements and service inspections for the main pool, uh paddic pressure and filter top speakers, and it the kind of list goes all the way on. Um so instead of putting that on the operational budget, um the um the uh administration asked us to move that over to capital.

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>> Oh, to the cap. Okay. Well um I think it's just a a typo in a differential because here it's reading 57. >> Yeah, it comes out to about 850,000. Yeah. >> All the repairs we were hoping to make.

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>> Okay. 15. All right. Okay. Council President >> on this uh budget and in the other wreck budgets there's a reduction in uh recreational and educational materials and supplies. Um and I know that we need

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a lot of things to keep our kids active. How are we uh I guess substituting for that loss in materials and supplies for our recreation program and how are we going to meet I guess the

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new numbers. So for instance in this recreation workbook uh you requested 85,000 and the administration is suggesting 50,000. So it's a $35,000 decrease from what you requested. Are you just

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referring to aquatics um or are you looking at the recreation? >> We have the recreation uh workbook as all one. So all of recreation is in one. >> Yes. So we did make some cuts to those areas and and we do have an inventory of materials. So, we looked at the

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inventory that we do have and and saw that we could cut uh we are also going to look to additional funding, external sources of funding to provide that or partnerships to provide some of those resources. But I think the terminology might be a little misleading when you

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throw the word educational in there. I don't want anyone to think that we're removing educational opportunity from the youth. Uh it kind of is all blended in there with um supplies. So, you know, we're we're we're looking at that and we think we know that we're

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we're good for now with what we have and and this budget line and we're also looking at what we spent in the past, but we're also looking at what we have inventoried as well. >> Um, director, can you or Rosemary speaks

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to um line item 103, overtime wages? You requested 45,000. The administration um believes you guys can do with 18. >> Correct. That line item is for overtime specifically for the supervisor uh bath

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and pools and for the supervising lifeguard position. Currently uh short staffed. It was a long time to fill that position. It's been a challenging one. It's been posted by us by HR. So we've been surviving with two supervising lifeguards. uh we did got to staff that

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position and now we just lost that position again. So we're trying to just keep everything operational with two employees at the time and myself. >> So there's two it's only you only have two uh supervising lifeguards. >> Correct.

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>> And what is like industry standard or like how many we should have? >> So we have three. We had requested to bring on two more um on a part-time status to help us out especially the weekends and the nights um and to cover the holidays as well. That's our busy

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peak time. Um and then we also have the rink that we oversee that that becomes a little troublesome in the winter. Uh however, you know, we're just working with what manpower that we have and uh we're just driving as best as we can.

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>> And um 105 is acting position cost. Was that like if someone's filling in for someone else? I know you requested $1,000. Um, >> yeah, we haven't expended any funds from that line item. >> Yeah. No, I I see that. I'm just trying

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to figure like what what does what does that look like? >> We're not getting any funds on that either for that acting position either. So, >> say that again. I can't >> We're not getting any funds from that acting position.

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>> Oh, no. I I see that you guys. I'm just trying to understand like what like how does it work? What does it look like? >> So, um if I can answer that, Councilman Gilmore, that was for 2025 and that was a stipen, a one-time stipen payment >> because someone was doing some

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additional work or something. Okay. >> Correct. >> Council person uh Ephro. >> Thank you. [clears throat] Um, I just want to note too, uh, on the on the note

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of cuts to the entire department, I know we're getting to recreation, aquatics specifically, but, um, cuts to the entire department. When we look at what's expended in 2025, um, park maintenance has been cut from what was expended last year. The other

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divisions um, have increased different amounts. And I I don't say that to say that's a bad thing. I just I I just think we want to be very clear for the public when we're talking about cuts and increases. Um and I think recreation

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youth development department uh deserves deserves a ton. You guys are doing incredible work, incredibly important work for for kids and for all of our residents. But I just want to get that on the record so we're all talking about the same thing in terms of cuts and

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increases. um on recreation here. Um I I was going to ask just a little bit more uh specifically on the the maintenance and repairs. the um when I got to tour a little bit earlier this

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year um with deputy director Donith and and got to meet you director uh Nunez um the Persing ice rink uh that big forget the technical name for it but the cooler or freezer um is that is that still

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being contracted out or we still uh renting that out? Um is that coming from capital costs or operating budget here in this line item? >> It's not in this line item. It's not on this budget. It is coming from capital. We are securing quotes as well for a replacement on that chiller. Um working

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on CDBG money for that as well. >> You just got to bring the mic a little closer to you. >> We're working on securing that those funds using CDBG money to repair the chiller and do a a whole overhaul of the ice rink so that we can have it for

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years to come and not continue to rent equipment like we have been. >> Okay, great. And how much is that monthly to rent? And I understanding it's from capital and not operating here. >> So monthly it depend on the equipment itself is costing us about $18 to $19,000.

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However, we allocated about $200,000 to cure the whole rental and prevented maintenance and everything that comes with it. >> Understood. Thank you. Um yeah, hoping that we can get some CDBG money for that as soon as possible. Appreciate you all um looking into that. Um most of my

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other questions have have been answered for recreation now. I'll pass it along. But thank you for that. >> Thank you along. Um just real quick if someone can answer um because I heard earlier as it relates to these this

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maintenance and repairs that the capital expenses are like why are we separating the two the operation from the capital? So there are certain rules for how we use capital funds and so in previous

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[snorts] years they may have been uh represented in the expense budget which is this budget workbook but um as in other [clears throat] departments we are correcting that and moving the things that are eligible for capital to be represented in the capital budget.

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>> Thank you chairman. Um, I had a few questions. So, I mean, this is this is not really specific to the aquatics or recreation, but it's it's across the board. It's in enrichment. It's in park maintenance.

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Um, it looks like your budget for cleaning supplies has been slashed in all of these. You know, in recreation, you requested 6,000 for cleaning supplies and it's down to 1,000. Um, you know, not that these are large

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amounts of money, but you know, I I am worried about, you know, is is this sufficient to keep our facilities clean and, you know, good for the public to use because this this seems to be something that's been cut across divisions.

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>> No. Uh, and thank you for that question and we do understand that and it it will be a challenge. Uh we're going to do our best to make sure that we um ration things out correctly and not overuse materials. Um we do have an

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inventory of items in recreation from past years. Um so I think we will be okay if we're not. I think Keith and I will just go out and buy stuff, right? >> Okay. It just these are just such small numbers that I would hate to like have

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you know park bathrooms that are so >> we accept all donations. [laughter] >> Okay. Noted. Thank you. >> And parks park still has a large aotment for cleaning supplies as well. So, it's mainly just in in [clears throat] the

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Department of Recreation, which really we don't use that many cleaning supplies outside of our office space uh and aquatics. >> Okay. Okay. Thanks. Um

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and then I just a question I also see in the maintenance and repair equipment. um to follow up on some of my colleagues questions that you um requested $850,000. Um the intro to budget is 315,000 and

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you mentioned you're applying to CBD CBGD grants. Um you're you're um putting some of this in the capital budget. Um but I I guess one of my constituents and you know a number of my constituents use

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um the Persingfield pool especially the seniors. They like to go up there. Um you know I and and I don't know how true this is. you know, I'm hearing this third hand, but um you know, it sounded like there was, you know, a little while back there

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was there was a filter that needed to be replaced and um it wasn't replaced in a timely manner and then that caused more problems with the facility. So just seeing that there's such a big difference in the maintenance budget. Um you're getting less than half of what you requested. I just want to make sure

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that you're not painting yourself in a corner where smaller problems will balloon and become larger problems. Um do you feel that this amount that is in the budget is sufficient to keep the facilities running and be able to address repairs in a timely fashion?

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>> So we have list a list of item minds items that need to be done. Right. So we took on the aquatics portion from parks DPW in 2019. So since we've taken on we've tackled certain projects like that filter you're talking about at Persian Field was a project that we took on

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about 3 years ago that we we swapped out. Every year we focus on a major project and that's been the goal. Uh there are big projects that obviously are can't be within our budget, right? We have a huge filter at Lafayette pool that needs to be repaired. We just

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recently repaired two pumps. So these are parts that have been abandoned for the past 10, 12, 15 years. So we're, you know, being proactive about it. We're itemizing what needs to be done, prioritizing the needs of the of this equipment. And this is how the director

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and the BA's office have been in communication to see how how can we repair these items or or you replace them at this point. So we we have slotted uh certain items, especially the Lafayette project and the Pavonia pool. uh those items are at the top of our

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list to get those pools, you know, up to par, you know, for the residents. >> Thank you. Um my final question on this section is um I noticed in your requested budget you had um positions that you requested but that

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were denied. Um these include two lifeguards, two supervisor lifeguards, so a total of four. Um three laborer ones, um two security guards, and two water aerobics instructors. Uh none of these are particularly highly paid

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positions. They're typically making um 17 or $18 an hour depending on the role. Um and um and they are part-time positions, so each position is in the ballpark of, you know, 15 to $18,000 a

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year. Um what are the ramifications of not having these positions filled? Um will the pools be open for shorter amounts of time? Will um or or will other employees fill in the gaps

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with overtime or or what what programming reductions are you going to see as a result of not filling these 11 pos part-time positions? So the difference in aquatics to the other divisions that our employees are certified, right? So it it does cause an

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issue, right? We need lifeguards. You know, we know in the in the United States there's a shortage lifeguard. You know, we are very lucky that I am engaged with the youth and I recruit youth from all over the city. We train them in house. We certify them and we hire them. However, it's getting a

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little challenging keeping the youth, right? We don't pay as well as the rest of the city. We're competing against condominiums and you know these big entities. So filling these positions have become challenging. A perfect position is that supervising lifeguard. You know you're [clears throat]

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responsible for people's lives. They're seeing the lawsuits going around across the country. You know we all fall down when something does happen. So it is a challenge. we do need to consider back filling when a lifeguard or someone who is certified leaves that position. It is

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very difficult to fill. In addition, these positions are PT19 positions. There's no benefits that come with them. There's no, you know, there's no holiday pay, there's no overtime, there's, you know, so it's not like these young adults are committed to these positions.

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They only get to work up to 19 hours if they get that. A lot of them are college kids depending on, you know, the small check. So, those are some of the challenges that we deal with. However, we still service the residents. We still run our swim lessons. We train over

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1,400 kids in swim lessons. Our pop-ups had about 2,400 children registered. So, we continue to run programming as needed. However, you know, we're all jumping in the water in and out, myself and the rest of my supervisor staff to fill in the call outs, the voids that we

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currently are dealing with. >> Okay. Thank you. So, the submitted budget has zero dollars for these positions, but if if a young person came, say a college student, and they were a certified lifeguard, and they said, "Hey, I want to work for

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recreation." to me this budget says you would not be able to hire them. Um would it would it make sense to retain funding for at least a few of these positions because again these are not very large

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dollar amounts? um would it make sense to retain funding for a few of these positions so that if you know I understand these are hard to hire for and hard to retain but you know um I I just would hate to see programming cuts especially in the aquatic space

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it would be very very beneficial um and however we're tapping into those overtime funds which the supervisors have to pick up that void when there is shortage but the ability of being able to fill some of these and the back fills that do leave on a constant basis you would be great. >> Okay.

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>> Can I ask >> Thank you. >> I just want to ask a brief follow-up question if that's okay. Uh yeah, I I wonder because there's a a national shortage of lifeguards and this is a a nationwide issue. Um have other

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municipalities had successful models of how they're doing hiring like making this more of a stable job and and something that has a bit of a career oriented aspect to it. So, we're actually a pioneer to this. Uh, so we are a part of the New Jersey

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Swim Safety Alliance. New Jersey just became the third state to adopt a water safety curriculum. Jersey City was a part of it. You know, me and my team are a part of it. Um, in addition to that, we we run programming through the American Red Cross. So, we're constantly being recognized through them and the

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New Jersey um pool managers association, you know, which we're all members of. So what's what's beneficial to our lifeguards is we we start them young. So our youngest uh child can register at the age of one and we have no ending

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age. Right? So a part of our learn to swim program this year we service 1,400. Um and we we break our program into two during the summer to cater the need and the demands for all the residents. We change our programming to popup. So we understand parents go on vacation down

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the shore. We just do one day swim lessons which focus on a water safety component, a brief learn to swim curriculum and telling them where they stand, right? So, we want these kids to leave our program knowing some something safe, right? We know that drowning is a

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leading cause of death in in young adults and children. So we also uh have you know pioneer programs like we are ne this weekend having the Jersey City largest swim lesson day where we're going to be teaching about 150 kids um the safety of being in the water a 30

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minute swim lesson and then they to get to do a meet and greet with a mermaid right so we're trying to bring in the youth and the residents to know the safeties and the the hazards and dangers of aquatics in May we have uh national water safety month we do this big event

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at the rink and the pool where we had 350 people come out and learn about water safety. We partner with community um organizations, scouts, library, some camps to come out and help us teach people about CPR, how to call 911, the safeties of coming to the pool. Simple

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things like don't put a blue bathing suit on your child because the lifeguard can see them if the bottom of the pool is blue. Colorful bathing suits, purple, blue, u purple, pink, orange that we could be able to identify your child. Haps, red, you know, something colorful.

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rainbow. So, little things like that educate parents um so that they're aware when they go out or they go to other pools. >> Well, I just I just want to say and I want the record to reflect. I appreciate you guys taking a stance of doing more

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with less. Um but I'm of the opinion that recreation have been historically underfunded from the beginning. Um, so for me it's extremely problematic to see that I mean I can make the argument that this

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is one of the most important divisions in a city. Um, and for for us to constantly embark on that journey, uh, I mean, I don't know. I I I don't like I don't

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like the trajectory um of this. I don't like recreation not being funded. Again, we've historically have always been underfunded. And the downside of that is the kids suffer. I'm telling you

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firsthand, the kids suffer when recreation is underfunded. Definitively. Council person. >> Thank you. And my question was as uh council member Little asked, it was

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actually significant cut of $70,000. So um obviously we are reducing services and that's not something we want to see. My other question is why are we budgeting 65k

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more for seasonal employees than was requested? Are we budgeting 65k more for seasonal >> employee if you go there summer seasonal uh >> we're still on aquatics?

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>> No, I think you're in >> recreation. I'm on recreation, >> right? Yes. Summer. >> Yes. So um can you answer why are we budgeting 65k more for seasonal

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employees than was requested >> that's for aquatic >> see it. >> Yes. So, >> so the we have the summer seasonal which which operates our summer staff at the pools. Uh our rink which is for roller

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rink and then the seasonal is the ice rink. So it operates our seasonal staff to man the ice rink to operate it. Um we have Zamboni drivers which we're we're looking to bring on as well. And then we're also trying to uh use seasonal

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staff in the pools as well over the course of the winter to try to keep up with programming. So any funds, any seasonals that we use over the course of the winter will uh be uh differentiated through that line item so that we're not we can't keep the seasonals more than 6 months. So we have to be able to

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differentiate them. >> Thank you. You're welcome. That's >> okay. Moving right along to enrichment ma >> any um okay can we start with this what do we spend overtime wages on this

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division in enrichment can you talk about overtime uh line item number 103 17,850 last year it was 14783

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three 103 overtime wages. >> So, one of the first things that jumps out to me and and I could break it down to you uh further uh in more detail. If you give me like a day, I I'll send you the full scope, but just knowing right now what we're encountering is the

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overtime of our bus drivers uh and assisting other groups and organizations in the city with transportation. So, we've driven like uh the adaptive Girl Scouts troop places, our senior programming places that aren't in that

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allotted time uh hourly slot per week for our bus drivers. So, they've gone over their hours. So, um we see that as being a thing in the future. Um so right now that's very important to us that we were providing that service not just for

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summer camp but but for the entire city if need be. >> Okay. And then line item 212 recreation and educational materials and supplies on >> Yes. So we spoke to that before it was u

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council council president really's question that we do have an inventory of items. So, we're going to try to do our best to ration those out for the remainder of the year. >> Yeah. So, just just to clarify what they are, it's like soccer nets, extra basketball nets. So, when we say they're

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educational materials, it's not like textbooks and notebooks and rulers. We're talking about recreational educational materials, which are just like equipment. This is this um are these materials part of like the the simmer fun care package

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that I mean I know when I was there we would have like they would order all type of sported things for eating. >> Yeah. We have like giveaways and stuff like sunglasses and things like that for the kids, hand sanitizers and and things of that nature which we have a a decent

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inventory of right now. >> Okay. So you're lud you're you're utilizing more of what you had versus re-uping on the stock. >> Yeah. And we can offset a lot of the those p that purchasing power with grant

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funds as well. >> So my next question is on line item 304 rent. So can you tell me more about the the rent? Why did we did increase almost

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33,000 this year and last year? >> So this is mainly for the Jersey City Armory for this is the usage of the Jersey City Armory uh for track and for other programs that we run in the

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armory. I think annually the rent does increase a percentage. Um, additional rent there would also be for trailers space that we have at Caven Point which we use for office space. Um, so that is also included in there as well and also

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uh portaotti or portag john rentals uh for specific parks. Okay, my last question is u item uh line item 312. It's it's what are the specialized services recreation

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department spending for? >> Yes. So this is yeah thank you for that question. So these are the external vendor programs that we offer up to the city where we may not have the resources to provide um such as so rugby program

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is one, tennis uh is another. Uh these are programs that we run throughout the city that are we get a large uh involvement with that we either outsource to to other groups to provide those services or we pay one-time stipens um to individuals um to run

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those programs for us. Yeah. And there's also um the ROID money comes from that as well upfront and then it's reimbursed. >> Thank you, director. That's it for me. >> You're welcome. Thank you so much. Um, I have a

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question. I have a couple questions. Um, I noticed there's 25 recreation aids and I, you know, there's no real job description for that. I imagine they're all kind of doing different things and in different programs, but can you if

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you can just talk a little about what those folks are working on? >> Yes. So, they are the backbone of our department. They're the front-facing individuals who actually interact with the children in our community uh every day. They're the ones who are

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interacting with the 4,28 individual uh children in our community that participate in recreation. So, you have your soccer coaches, you have your basketball coaches, um you have your

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football coaches, all of your sports specific individuals there. uh your fitness trainers that that th those make up that roster. >> All right. Awesome. Thank you. >> You're welcome. >> Um I also wanted to ask about the

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seasonal. So there's two line items under seasonal salary and wages. There's the summer seasonal camp where you requested $750,000 but were allotted $385,000. And there's regular seasonal, which I'm

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I'm not sure what that is. Um, but I'll I'll let you explain where you requested $200,000 and we're um we're were granted in the draft budget $48,000. So So both of these are pretty substantially lower than what was requested. Um can you

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explain a little bit about I I get the concept of a summer seasonal camp. I'm not sure what the regular seasonal um employees do. And um then as a follow-up question, are are these

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camps free or are there partic They are free. >> Okay, great. >> They're they're at a reduced cost. I think we charge $25 a week if I'm mistaken. It's >> $25 a week to attend camp. The normal

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day camp fee is the average is like $275 to $300. Um so the increase it's actually an increase of $60,579. That's because we doubled the size of our camp. Uh so we added a secondary

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location uh this summer in comparison to last summer. That's why you see the increase in the summer seasonal camp funds requested. Uh in terms of the seasonal, so uh our seasonal employees work throughout the year and they're program specific employees that we can

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kind of hire that are carryover employees from the summer that could stay on to assist with fall programming and winter programming if need be. >> Okay, great. Thank you. Um so the camp is not free, but it is extremely low

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cost. Uh $25 a week is next to nothing. Um, but I would imagine some of that funds are recouped in in the sense I mean the the $25 a week where does that show up as revenue in the budget?

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>> It does. And and I will add to that we do offer free other camps that are free. So, we do offer a soccer half day camp that's free and we do offer a full day basketball clinic um at five different locations throughout the city, which is

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also an increase in programming by five uh throughout the city, which is free. >> Okay, >> that sounds like you're doing amazing work. So, thank you. >> Yeah, we just have to add one more point, Councilman. Um all of the money does go back into the capital goes to capital. It does not go back to recreation.

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>> Yeah. >> Okay, great. Um well that that sounds like really important service for the community. Um so you've mentioned doubled the size of the camp in that you added a second location. Um is that are are the number of children you are reaching is that also approximately

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doubled? >> Yes ma'am. >> Wow that's great. Thank you. >> Sorry just a followup. How are you advertising now? Same as previously. >> Oh no. We are so excited to have uh access to an Instagram account. So we're all over social media. Our reach is I

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think we have 61,000 views on our Instagram page to date. So, we're really excited about that. We're able to put our flyers on there. Actually, it offers uh community members an opportunity to DM us or message us

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directly with issues and problems that they have, alleviating a lot of the calls in the RC and streamlining them right to our department. In the previous years what parents have shared that it was an issue they the communication was

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not there. So what you're doing absolutely working because I think there were struggle not having enough kids in these camps or something like that. I have had those um you know re recreation

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reaching out but whatever you are doing it's working. >> Thank you. He's had a a huge focus on customer service and uh we've really focused on that uh through through reces and uh and other ways. >> Council member Afro,

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>> thank you. Um my colleagues have asked a number of the questions I had. So appreciate we're all on the same page about working through this. Um a bit more on the seasonal budget. I'm just trying to get a sense. The omnibus operators, there are four of them listed

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as new hires. Um but the 48,000 in the draft budget would not even cover two of their salaries. Um so it would just be one of them and then most of another one of them. So could you explain is how

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many you actually intend to hire for these omnibus operators. So we have hired four of them and they do come out of the the summer camp uh the summer seasonal camp budget if

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>> Oh not regular seasonal part >> the summer seasonal >> right >> okay understand then where is the regular seasonal >> uh budget that 48 going >> we don't what are you referring to the omnibus operators

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>> no just the yeah uh the regular seasonal funds in 107 um that 48k. >> Yes. So I just I answered that question. Uh she asked that's this carry over into the fall and the winter if we do um keep

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any of those seasonal summer seasonal employees in the fall or the winter seasons. >> Thank you for clarifying. I appreciate you. >> You're welcome repeating that. Um just a couple other things here. We have um back to these different titles that Councilman Gilmore was raising at the beginning. I understand the civil

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service titles may not always be the same as their other duties and things, but we have a couple supervising admin analysts uh here. One of them being a completely new position

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uh as of this year um prorated for seven months of the year and then one of them being a promotion um to the management level position. And if you could just talk through the different duties of these two positions which both have six

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figure salaries now. Um I know I've gotten to speak with both in different capacities but I I would love for the record to get a sense of their different duties and responsibilities. >> Yeah, thank you for that question. So, right now, as I said before, we we're in

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touch with one out of every nine households in Jersey City uh that has a a youth member under the age of 18 in their home. So, one of those positions actually focuses solely on improving

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that outreach um and by reaching out to other groups. So I guess if I can compare it to like uh recruiting um you can recruit 100 kids or you can recruit 10 coaches. So that individual's

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job is to recruit those coaches. So to go to schools, to go to different church organizations and and and things of that nature and recruit them to bring their participants to our programs. Uh so that's the outreach that that one

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position is focusing on. Um also yeah and also in intergenerational programming which we're so excited about and honestly it's been one of the the biggest successes of the summer for us. Our summer Friday program at at the both

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senior centers in Jersey City. We have 10 to 15 individuals uh from our summer camp program uh who travel to those senior centers and interact with the seniors on a weekly basis. Uh so that individual is also overseeing that

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programming as well. Um and then just really garnering that feedback um from those individuals on how programs are going in their ward. And then to expand upon that in the fall there, that

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individual will also oversee uh our program which we're calling our ward rec repres uh representatives. So we're hoping that every ward can have at least two representatives uh that would then um consult with this individual and that individual would oversee that. They

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would all be volunteer positions. Uh, and they would be, you know, in those count um ward meetings and and being kind of like the the liaison between the community and the department of recreation to solely increase the participation numbers and the community

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engagement. The other individual is um OB in charge of you know all internship programs and oversee oversaw the hiring process for the JC next program but also the um innovative strategies

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uh and assisted with those innovative strategies to increase programs with less. So that individual is also servicing in that role as well amongst many other day-to-day tasks. >> Wait. So, and that's the director of innovation, >> correct?

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>> That's right. Okay. [snorts] I know we've worked together on um the upcoming uh youth liaison council which Yes. said about just Yeah, I've requested a couple um of other in a couple of other departments just some job descriptions.

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I think that would be really helpful. Uh so we can always go to our constituents and your explanation is is very helpful but always being able to go to our constituents to ask about particularly when it comes to six figure salaries you know what are the different day-to-day roles and responsibilities and so

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especially for these titles that would be very helpful so made that request. Thank you so much. >> Yes we can without a doubt send that to you. >> I appreciate it. Um, I just want to emphasize as it relates to line item 304, rent 200,000.

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This it's only it's not even what is like three months that we use the armory. It's like three months and this speaks to the importances of us having a rec center. Here it is. We're spending 200,000 for a quarter

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a quarter of a year. Um, I don't get it. I just don't understand it. Um, but my question is as it relates to I see you say you expanded uh summer fun summer camp from one site

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to um I remember recreation where we had Lord Jesus we probably had about 14 15 summer camps. >> I would love to have that budget right now. >> Yes. Well, I mean, I I don't think that's that it's budget, but I think

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it's more so partnership with the school. Um, >> that part >> creating creating this partnership to allow us to to get in these schools. Um, so I just want to hear a little bit about just you guys vision on how how

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you plan to attack that problem. um building that relationship. Um and I see uh Dr. Brian have done a great job with getting some grants and some funds in for the city. Uh we're very grateful of

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that. Um, but I I just have this this warm vision that, you know, kids will be able to go to summer camp a distance they can walk, not have to be bust because that's the only camp that's available at a reasonable price. Um, so

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if you can speak to you guys vision to and steps you're looking to take to have that vision come to fruition. Yeah, there's a creative vision there. And then as you can see in the budget, it it the average cost of increasing uh and adding a facility on

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for the summer operating wise is about $60 to $65,000 per site. Um and then it's obviously the hiring of summer seasonals uh and things of that nature. So we already are looking for more accurate and balanced ward

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representation in a summer camp system. Um, so right now what we're doing to supplement that is we have the our little pop-up camps, we have our half-day soccer camp, we have our basketball clinics all over the city. So we're we're doing our best to provide opportunity to more than just what those

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two locations can house. Um, and yeah, I mean, I'm going to be sitting right in front of you guys in three or four months from now asking for that, you know, and presenting the the next budget and and talking about that as well. So, and we're we're definitely open and and

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excited to collaborating with each and every one of you um because we know that a a lot of you have um relationships with principles uh and and people in the in the board. So, we we definitely need to tap into that um because there's a

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lot of facilities in Jersey City and and I remember when when there were, you know, 10 to 12 sites. I also remember where when we did camp outside. So, I'm not opposed to that either. Uh NJCU's field would be a perfect place to have an outdoor day camp because they do have

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shelter. All right. And in for inclement weather, so that's always something we have to think about. But like I said, I have an all-star team. I'm super excited to be working with the individuals that I'm working with and to collaborate with uh the city council would be a dream

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come true and how to make um offer up more opportunity for the children in our community next summer. >> Council pres a um a comment. I was going to ask the same question that Councilman Efos did

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in regards to the administrative analysts, but I think you all pretty much answered that the difference in between the two positions. Um, but I just want to make a comment and say that we have to be mindful

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in our budgets and in our hiring that we are being equitable. Um because as I sit here and you know I listen to the the explanations of the differences in the positions and this isn't the first

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budget hearing where we've had those questions. Um I questioned the director on his salary. Um and he stated that it was correct in the workbook. And we get these questions from residents, right? So you have um new

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people coming into the city that either don't live here or haven't worked here and they are getting these high salaries, right? Increases from what the directors before them are getting. And then we have uh people who are from here like our recreation director that's

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taking the same salary uh as the last recreation director or like our HHS director who's worked here for years um and her increases due to longevity. HEDC director who's taking the same salary that she took last time. It just sends the wrong message. So, I'm not

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advocating for us to add more money to the budget and give anybody a raise. Let me be clear. But I just want us to be mindful of experience matters. Knowing the area matters just as much as somebody coming in with um a higher

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degree or more experience from a larger city. So, I just want to be want us to be mindful of that when we're going through budgets or when the administration is creating the budget that we want everyone to be treated fairly. And the same with the uh with the staff, you know, we have just in

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this budget alone, we have new people coming in. We have an executive assistant and now there's a secretary, right? And then the the um the salaries are off in that. So, let's just make sure that we're doing a better job of being mindful of taking care of

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everyone and not just taking care of new people coming into a department or a city. So, back to this particular enrichment budget, what is I see we have a new wreck aid for 41,000.

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What are the full-time wreck aids taken care of? And I guess how does that differ from the part-time wreck aids? Yes. So, this individual is a full-time uh staff member who works year round. Uh currently that staff member in the summer is running a basketball league at

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Persian Field with over 150 participants. Um and so he's doing a really good job. Actually, we've got the most feed positive feedback to date. actually just the most responses from from the parents uh of the participants in that group.

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But this individual does work year round and he moves from program to program consistently throughout the year. Uh that individual um yeah I think he's been with the department for a few years now. I'm not really sure when he came onto the

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department. I knew he was there when I started and he is definitely one of our high performers in our department >> director. What's your u best attended summer camp right now? >> Yeah, Persingfield. It's probably

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Persingfield. And what's the cost to every uh resident or or child who goes to the camp? I think it's $50 every two weeks. So, or 25 a week. $25 a week. And how long does the program run for?

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>> Six weeks. Six weeks. Help me with the math on that one. It's 25 time six. Five times. >> All right. What would it So, is 25 time 6 how much it would cost to make the program free if the city were to to run it? Yes. So that that's it's it's a little

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bit more complicated than that. So we put a lot of resources into each camp but from food. We do get the food service program from the board. Um we have staff there. Um trips they go on uh different trips.

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data has shown not just in Jersey City, I know this from working in camps my entire life. If there's no equity involved, uh you see low participation numbers. So, one of the reasons, not the main reason, not the sole reason, but one of the reasons why we do charge is

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it there's sweat equity, right? There's a reason for them to attend because they're putting something into it. That's why we charge a basically a $5 a day charge um for attendance is so that they do attend because we've seen that

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when they don't pay, they may not show up. If it's a rainy day, no one will show up to camp. Um if it's a beautiful day outside, they may not show up. If it's the first Monday after the 4th of July, half the camp might not show up. So, one of the large reasons why we do

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charge is for uh attendance purposes. Okay. There there are are families in in Jersey City thinking specifically in in in of my public housing facilities in W C that they're not attending because they they don't want to pay the $5 a day right?

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Let me ask let me go back. So how many people are how many kids are in the purging field program right now? Cap >> I think we're at capacity for about 150. >> All right. So $25 a week times 6 weeks is $150 times $150 kids $22,500

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to run a free camp in Persingfield. All right. Um I'm looking at the org chart for the division of enrichment. Um Mr. Aseti is being supervised by Mr. Best. Who supervised Mr. Aseti before

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Mr. Best? So in one of the restructuring and reorganizations uh that took place or I don't want to say reorganization just relegating of tasks um Mr. said he was out in the

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field. He was running programs. He was running programs with seniors. He was I knew him from working at NJCU where uh he was doing senior swim programs and senior aerobics and dance. Uh I came to recreation. He was answering the phone.

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I said, "Hey, you want to go back out in the field? You want to do more stuff with with community again?" He said, "I would love to." Uh got him back out into the field. So he directly works with the the supervisor in that program specifically in that one program but

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prior to that he was just reporting to the superintendent. So their job is to do outreach as you mentioned. >> Yes. Okay. >> Well direct direct specific programming with a specific group of individuals. >> All right. How about under uh Mr. in

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that platano. Uh >> yeah, he's doing senior dance with this in both uh senior centers in Jersey City on Fridays and the rest of the week. He's our the only uh phone receptionist we have. >> You mean Peter? Peter's doing it?

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>> Yes. Okay. Uh how about Joe Platano? Uh he supervises one, two, three, it looks like four people. Was there any change in the restructuring of who he supervised? I think as I came on board uh yes

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because now you have a director and a deputy director uh so those numbers were limited. He was overseeing a lot of different things uh before I came there and we realized that it was kind of his plate was kind of full and we wanted to

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alleviate him of some responsibility because I felt like there were jobs that he was just o overloaded. he was overloaded with work and some things were kind of getting lost in the sauce and to to improve efficiency. Um we we

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redellegated some tasks throughout the entire department. Um and actually has improved efficiency internally and externally uh and there are less yes there are the reporting structure is less um but he still has a significant

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role in enrichment. >> Okay. Okay. So he he has fewer supervises then you're saying okay >> yes >> uh and then Mr. Dources has two supervises uh who supervised Mr. Batista and Mr. Brown before Mr. Dource was the

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>> Mr. Npalano. Oh >> okay. And uh the three individuals in that it's to the right side of the the chart they're doing youth development. It's the director of innovation youth

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youth development group with Edgar Bat. >> Yes. Yes. So those two individuals underneath him. It's more specific to that role. Those are uh youth coordinator coordinators of youth activities. So what they're doing is they're reporting to him with data data

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of participation participation in specific programming SWAT analysis of success in a program or you know weaknesses within those programs. And do they report to you? Does he report to you? >> To who? >> Mr. D sources.

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>> Yes. For for specific things. Yes. And for others, Deputy Mayor Brian as well. >> Yeah. I think I saw his email signature says office of the deputy mayor, which I was unaware that there was an office of the deputy mayor. >> Uh says, just to clarify his title, he works in recreation, but he he does

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work. >> He only gets one salary, right? He's getting paid under rec. >> Yes. Yes. >> Just make sure. >> Just one salary. >> So he's doing work for you and also for the deputy mayor. Deputy Mayor Bri, Dr. Bryant through Jersey City next program, the JC Next program. >> That's all for now. Thank you.

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>> Um, director, quick followup because I thought um the fee schedule was supposed to be contingent upon like uh parental incomes. Um, so now the flat fee is just

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$25 a week for every for everybody. >> Councilman, we do have uh LMI, low to moderate income. Yes. So when it is uh applied for um it's given. >> Wait, so is the I'm confused. So the $25 is the standard rate or is that the LMI

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rate? I gotta check what the what the LMIA is on for camp because I I didn't check it. Um I didn't put the system up, but I'll get back to you with that. So, >> okay. And also just want to say um I mean I understand the sentiment of

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putting sweat equity in. Um and we did have trouble in recreation. People would sign up, they wouldn't completely finish the program or some days they wouldn't come. Um, but I will say this though,

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some of this some of this stuff is outside of the youth's control, right? If your if your parent working two jobs, they can't get there. if your parents have whatever problem that they're dealing with um and they can't get you there,

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that's more of a product of guess the environment or what the parent have going on versus the youth wanting to participate in in the activity. So, I mean I I understand the argument. you

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know, I push back a little um just because I know there's so many factors that go into ab absenteeism. Can I speak to that just for a second? We know we noticed in the past that when camps were free, uh we'd have people sign up to

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capacity and and then create a wait list and then prevent those people from attending camp and then not show up themselves. So now it's kind of like gekeeping that spot from other >> losing a spot. Right. Right. Right. >> No, no, that's what I'm saying. I I I

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mean, I understand the argument, you know. I don't I'm not saying it comes out of nowhere. I'm just like essentially saying that, you know, I personally I will push back on the argument just for, you know, the the reasons that I set forth. Um council person Brooks

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>> sir uh just on his uh point maybe something in future to think about they can deposit the money if they attend 80% uh of the time maybe the money can be refunded maybe 50% money can be refunded

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maybe 100% money can be refunded so they'll be committed so that they'll be attending and the motivation will be that they'll be getting the deposit back >> so I I I definitely appreciate that idea A I've known from my personal experience with my own nonprofit organization. We

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actually tried that and we tried to give discounts to um players that attended 100% of practice. And then what we saw happened was if someone missed one or two, the parents would now want to send all these doctor's notes in to say,

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"Well, this is why we missed. So, can we get the money back?" So we would probably open ourselves up for a lot of well we're at 78% attendance and at one day it was because of the dog and this and that. So I understand that and I've lived it so I I know what that

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experience is like but it's not a bad idea. It's something we can look into though. Thank you. >> That's valid. But these are the ideas to think about next year. >> Yes. Thank you. >> Council person Brooks. >> Thank you. Um, what are the end what's

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the end date for the summer programs this year? >> August 14th. >> August 14th. >> August 14th. Okay. >> And August 21st. We have some that end in August 21st and some that end August. Yeah. And there actually are some that go through the fall as well.

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>> Got it. >> So there's it it varies. I I can send you a schedule with what ends on what date if you >> Sure. Yeah, that'd be great. Um, yeah, because Labor Day is quoteunquote late this year. So, there's for some programs

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there'll be a little bit of a gap in terms of I mean, I guess that's traditional. There's a gap between the end of the summer program and the school year starting. >> Yes. >> Yeah. Okay. Um,

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line item 304, rent. That that's rental of equipment, not rental of space. >> Oh, that you talking about in the enrichment budget? >> Yep, >> that is rental of space. >> Rental of space.

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>> That's the armory. That's what they were talking about. >> Oh, I'm sorry. Yeah, that was Yeah, we spoke about that. >> That is a rental of space. That is a rental of like three different things. The armory, our our trailers, and portagon rentals take up most of that. Yes. other other departments um have had

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equipment in that line item as well. So um thank you. I I I did hear that before. Sorry about that. >> Uh line item 312. Um what what does that encompass?

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So that's for our vendors programming. So most of that is for different types of programming we run throughout the city uh that we out we that we do outsource uh whether it be tennis programming through like stipen payments

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uh rugby um trying to think what else we have like fitness ABC kids money comes out of there first and gets reimbursed uh so that's that's a lot of that yeah all community- based organizations like ABC kids any funding that that we

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do with them uh comes out of that line as well. >> Okay. Um could we receive an itemized Yeah. to >> We have it. >> Um and then last question. Um I guess piggybacking on an earlier

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question I had about the capital budget. I mean, one thing the mayor talked about uh that was done improperly in years prior was shifting expenses to the capital budget. Um I guess it's not a specific question about this particular

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division but um could the administration point out a change you know was this done in in in this department or uh is could could you share with us um how how it's changed from from last year this

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year? Um so there are a number of departments department of uh public works the IT division there may be one other where

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um capital uh costs were incorrectly reflected I'm sorry operating costs were incorrectly reflected in the capital budget. In this case, we have moved some

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operating expenses into capital budget. So it's it's about the definition of what can be captured under expense versus capital that we're trying to correct in the 2026 budget. >> Okay. So there were items in this

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department last year that were in that were in the capital budget but have been no there were items in this department that were in the expense budget that for 2026 have been moved to the capital budget. that >> we we were talking about this under the

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um maintenance and uh repair, >> right? Some of the capital um facil some of the facility capital projects >> are going to be captured under the capital budget. >> Okay. And I'll I'll I'm sure we'll have my colleagues will have questions about

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that once we get there. >> Okay. Um we have about 15 minutes left. Um, so we're gonna move to park maintenance. If everyone can um keep their questions to one question so

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everyone can um be able to get their question answered. Um, so council person, you're first. >> I I have a lot of questions about parks. Would it be possible to go a little bit past three or >> um

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>> I don't know if people >> I'll I'll yield my one to council personally. >> No. No, you don't. >> Okay. Well, G, I mean, we let's Yeah, Elena, we'll try to get through as many as possible. You may ask some of the questions that we have anyway. So, G, go for it.

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>> Okay. Thank you. Um, so I guess the biggest one I alluded to in my general question at the beginning. Um, there are seven laborers, one landscape supervisor, and one gardener vacancy/new hires that you had requested but were not included in the introduced

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budget. And in the meantime, um, we have reduced, uh, landscaping contracts by, uh, 290 to931. Um so my concern is that and and so I guess

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there's there's this is a two-part question. Um the the remaining um line item 312 professional consultant and specialized services. Are those still um landscaping contracts and park maintenance contracts or are they other contracts? And to the

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extent that we are trying to bring landscaping and park maintenance inhouse to save costs um my concern is that you know these positions the laborers the landscape supervisor and the gardener are remaining unfunded and um can you

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speak about to whether we will have the capacity to bring these services in house? >> Yes. So thank you for that question. So, I just want to make it clear that we we while we did not continue with the one contract, we still have one on the books

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for both Persingfield and Gateway Field, uh, which is a substantial amount of money. The savings or the the money that we're not spending on the larger contract, we're there's it's just uh south of $300,000 to to recoup. Um, we looked at the cost

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analysis of where we're going to allocate those funds and it seems like overtime may be a better solution because you have to think about something. If we're going to bring in more staff to then service the parks, we need more equipment, 10 people, we need

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10 brooms, we need 10 shovels, we need 10 more rakes. Right now, we're operating at one labor for every four park ratio. We have 72 parks in the city. On a daily basis, we have about 20

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blue collar during the daytime about 20 um labor park laborers working. Um so at that rate, it takes our park staff 8 days to service every park in the city.

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By the time they get back to the first park, the grass is a little longer, the trash is a little heavier. uh my my divisional director is doing an exceptional job at figuring it out right now and I really applaud him. He's been

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a superstar for us. Um they've come up with a great system to to make sure that the emails aren't piling up and that the complaints aren't piling up and that we don't really notice it. Um, so right now they're doing a pretty good job, but

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just the worry on our end is um, you know, the bare bones maintenance, the exhaustion, the fatigue. Um, so yeah, um, not only with this outsourcing contract being cut, with the size of our staff there being what it is, you know,

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it's definitely an area of concern for us right now. seems like especially sustainable um making ends meet right now, but this is not sustainable workforce if we are bringing maintenance inhouse for some of

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these parks. Is that that's >> bringing bringing maintenance in house isn't just the the answer because we have to bring equipment on board that we don't have that we were utilizing with the external vendor. They had the big machinery, the heavy equipment that we

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do not have. Um so if we want to then bring all of those operations back inhouse um it's hiring the staff, hiring just basic um the purchasing of basic hand tools um and then the purchasing of

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heavy machinery which I think when we did a cost analysis with the BA's office, we were looking at over $700,000 in equipment needed to be purchased that we were utilizing through the external vendor previously. >> Yeah. Yeah, I mean I I see even in this

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budget um tools and machine materials you requested nearly $80,000 and you were only allocated $18,000 which is a you know that's 20% of what you asked for. Um or I guess slightly

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slightly more but um you can only hold one shovel at a time, >> right? Um, can I continue? >> No, we listening. >> Okay, thanks. [laughter] >> You You can tell me to stop if you're the chair.

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>> No, no, go ahead. >> He's like, cool. [laughter] >> Yeah, cuz these are some of the same questions that I know a lot of us had. So, >> um, for line item 209, um, agricultural and botanical, I've talked to, you know,

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workers at some of these parks who had been told last year that there was no budget for seeds, no budget for plants. Um, they, you know, nothing nothing could be done. The city was not planting or or seeding anything. Um, but here I'm seeing it was 60,000 last year. You

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requested 73,000 this year and you were only allocated 30,000 this year. And so I'm wondering the 60,000 last year, was that actually used or was this one of the former administration's tricks where they kind of took money from one pocket

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and moved it somewhere else? Because, you know, I'm thinking if if there if the need genuinely is 60,000, you know, cutting it in half just cuz maybe it wasn't fully utilized last year might not be the solution. >> I can't speak to the past. I can only speak to today and tomorrow. Uh, and I

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can tell you that is not a trick. Um, it is a reduction that we we have to undertake. Um, however, I just want to point out that the last time the Department of Recreation met its budget dollar for dollar or went over its

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budget was 2015. We have 11 years straight finished the year spending less than what was projected. So, our budget to actuals was less for 11 years straight. Um, with that being said, going back to this

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category, um, it's it's strategy over resources at this point and we have a great team in in that field and I know you guys uh know her and she's done a great job at ensuring that we get not only donations to cover some of those

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things, but just to make the most with what resources we do have. >> Thank you. Um, I also noticed line item two 212 uh recreation and educational materials. You requested um 100 104,000

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and you were given 5,000. That's a pretty big difference. Uh can I can you talk about what what programs you wanted to pursue that have been cut as a result? the the requested uh funding was intentionally structured uh to allow for

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the department to make like meaningful improvements on the park conditions uh but also having the flexibility to be able to fix stuff as they come along. Um so the $100,000 reduction uh limits the department's ability to complete these things. Um but when it was done it was

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in the grand scheme of things before even uh we knew about the budget uh uh deficit that we had. So it was a grand it was a grand scheme. Yes. Like to get them to get the stuff fixed. >> Thank you. Yeah. I mean I I will say

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when things are broken at parks that is that is something that we hear about all of us on the council. We hear about it a lot. >> Takes time to fix it. Takes time to order it. Takes time to procurement. Um and we do it you know we do in the fastest way we can. >> Yeah. And Right. And I'm not blaming you. I'm just concerned.

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>> You never know. You never know what's going to happen that you know every morning you wake up and >> Yeah. Yeah. the the lock on the dog park is broken or or the the sprinkler system is not turning on. >> We fixed all three of those. >> Yeah. Thank you. But also people say they are paying really crazy tax and

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they cannot get the services they should be getting. So >> and I just want to point out and give uh my deputy um director a lot of credit. He was able to reallocate some re sources from other parks that like whole

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street park is now shut down due to some structural damage. Uh he was able to take some of the resources within that park that were salvageable and share them with other parks and other areas of the city which really helped improve situations. For example, adding taking

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garbage cans from that park and putting them into another park which gave more opportunity and more place so that you don't see the overfill in certain places. So that when I talk about having put people in the right place to do the right things, this is exactly what I'm talking about. >> Okay.

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>> Council Bur Afro, >> thank you. I'll I'll save my questions about Cole Street Park uh for offline. Our our visit earlier this year, Keith, was just abominable. So >> very appreciative. >> Yeah. Um thank you for being resourceful

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there. Uh just very briefly uh because I know we're limited on time justification and comments column uh in a lot of the uh salary line items in um parks maintenance. Uh for local 245 these

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positions uh no an anticipated wage increase last year that seems like it never happened and none is being budgeted for this year either. um just raises a little bit of an alarm for me to think that uh I mean we're in

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negotiations with 245. I would hope that the administration's intention is to settle a contract finally with local 245 and I would hope that some kind of increase uh would be anticipated or

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budgeted for. Um but there is none it looks like. And so we're we're budgeting uh under the adopted 2025 budget for all of these positions. If you all would be able to speak to that. >> This is a great question for the finance department in terms of their budgeting.

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My understanding is that they did take into account some percentage of what we expect the union contracts to land on, but because those conversations are still undergoing um still underway, uh we don't have the exact number. So, um, in our part two

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with finance, I think that would be a great question to ask them. >> Okay. Thank you. Yeah, that would be helpful. Just want to make sure that we are are doing right by our union workers and especially a a a bargaining unit that's been without a contract for six and a half

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years. So, thanks. Council person Singh >> question one of for the employee titled manager parks and grounds received roughly 14k increase that is over 10% and there was no notes

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to explain can you please share more about it um manager parks and grounds. >> So, you're talking about Jackson and Accassio? >> Yeah, the the the one who got the raise.

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There are a couple of them. I'm talking about the one who got 10% raise. Over 10% actually. So, one of those individuals um became interim divisional director and then the

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other individual um has since been uh let go from the department. Um so then the other individual who was interned then became the divisional director. >> I see. Okay. Thank you, >> council person. Really?

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Just a quick question. Second, general supervisor parks position um transferred from DPW. So, is that um is that person still in

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recreation or have they been moved to a different department? I thought that they were moved to maybe the BA's office, but I still see them under the parks. uh budget. So I just want to make sure that we are um accounting for them in the

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correct department. Yeah. Um this one should be uh I I'll have to get back to you on this one. >> Okay, no problem. And then let's just also verify the uh current salary

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because this one is different in the active employees list as well. >> Council person Zuba, >> we had a lot of discussion about um the landscaping contract being terminated. What um what's the plan with the

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resources you have available to to make sure our parks are being maintenanced regularly? So we have like a hybrid model right now that we're working on and u my divisional director has done an exceptional job to making sure that all of our parks are serviced within a week.

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Um and we've kind of looked at a hybrid model of like four four or five man teams to attack diff different locations. What we've also done is we've kind of made like hubs. So we have like Persian Field as a hub now. Instead of

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everybody reporting to Lynen Avenue and then branching out and going out and attacking different parks and coming back, we, you know, we took the five guys that live in the Heights and said, "Okay, you're going to check right into Persing Field, report right to Persing Field. Gives us more time for service

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and also makes their commute better. They're very happy about this." And then they operate out of Persian Field as a hub. And we have the same thing going on with a group at Bayside Park uh and Hamilton Park and and in different areas

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uh of the city um right now and it seems to be working pretty well. I can give you if you want like a full detail scope of that I could provide it to you. >> We could talk offline directly. Thank you.

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>> Okay, no problem. Council person Brooks. >> Um I'm just obsessed with this capital versus expense thing. Um when we do get a capital budget, will will it be by department? >> Again, really great question for the

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finance department. Um [laughter] I can get you the answer. I um do not have that prepared today. >> Okay. And I was asking uh yeah I mean so Fairmont Triangle Park on the border of

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F andB half done appreciate the partnership of um recreation youth development parks DPW HCIA who got the second half cleaned up and on a regular maintenance schedule. Uh but would love

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to see the second half of that park completed. uh understand it's probably not going to happen this year, but >> so just to even just color in how we've used some of those capital dollars this year. So, for example, um we have lots of little leagues around the city,

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right? And what we discovered was that we didn't have draggers. So, we were able to purchase two draggers, which made our entire baseball season a much more pleasant experience

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because before our laborers were hand raking or not being able to prep the fields. So, that's one example. We purchased two of those. Another example is the Pavonia field was or the P the Pavonia uh pool was not actually

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winterized last year. So, we experienced a lot of sort of plumbing damage underneath the pool as well as a liner that had been damaged. And so, we've now used again capital dollars to not only

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rectify the plumbing problems underneath the pool. We are looking to now maybe a 10-year solution that would cement the pool liner so that we're no longer talking about a rubber liner and to cement the um outer edges of the pool so

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that we have something that's more sustainable beyond sort of this five-year it cracks we fix it again. So really the capital work in recreation is looking at the infrastructure and the guts of the operation that need to be

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shored up to 2026 so that we're not going back to these as recurring uh expenses each and every year. >> Okay. Um I just want to say before we close um thank everyone for coming

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today. Um I think we we have capacity to cut grass inhouse. Um, I'm a firm believer that we're we're more than capable. I know I understand and it's it's typical of any business. The

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overhead in the front is is high. That's that's just the way business work. Um, but I'm of the opinion that we have capacity to do this in-house. In fact, we've done it in house sometimes. I remember working in Persian Field. They

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had lawnmowers up there. They had blowers up there. I remember working in Berry Lane. They had a substation there with a bunch of machinery and things like that. Um, so I think the capability is there. Um, and we just have to we

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just have to figure it out. But again, thank everyone for coming. Thank you for presenting. Um, if any other council people have any further uh questions for recreation, I know I do. Um, we will reach out via email um to get those

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questions answered. Uh, motion to adjourn at this time. >> Second. >> Motion to adjourn at 3:05 p.m. was made by council person and seconded by council person Singh.

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All in favor for the motion to adjourn at 3:05 p.m. All council members present by acclamation, please say I. >> I. We are out of here at 3:05 p.m.