good afternoon it's Tuesday April 8th approximately 3:30 in the afternoon i'd like to call the meeting of board of water commissions to order the minute of March 10th 2025 do I have a motion i move to the
minutes second no march 10th was the meeting i will second okay that's those are the ones I read that that was okay move seconded and voted to approve the
minutes of March 10th 2025 clarification didn't we have other minutes yeah but I forgot okay one thing I'd like to take out of order is we talked about it we verbally approved it but we did not take a formal
vote on the department budget for FY26 and I have a motion to approve the FY26 departmental project so moved as as submitted yeah it's 2,14659 second move second order to approve the
budget for FY26 and I noticed on the paperwork that you had here the one change was to the debt service was a small change in debt service small change in debt service and there was a change in the um it call indirect costs the shared
cost okay made that motion i'm sorry bob made a motion and I second okay thank you to the appointments kristen Burger always good to see you thank you yes back in person again nice to have a nice
warm walk down Main Street today well it was good at least it um you know stopped raining you know nervous there but a little bit wet and then able to walk most of the route without the rain
interfering so which is helpful because you know sometimes it's nice to get the rain so we did keynote on site with Chris and I and Mitch with um the contractor for representatives from CC
construction in so the entire stretch and discussed limits of work in addition to the the two pave work there's some boxes that we
get some sidewalk patches is um Sean Stockton from D was going to check back with his office because we know there's some big stage markings in the sidewalk on the roof so he was thinking you know that there might be a sidewalk project that they were doing i'm not sure if it
was another utility doing something so he's going to check on that and get back to us because it doesn't make sense for us to do repairs and then have someone else come on the long it's only the sidewalk and we get the work done school vacation absolutely yeah so
then that's still the plan with everyone that work would start April 21st we're going to meet again next week remotely just to touch base weather that the priority if there's issues with weather priority is the
south side of the Jones River schools whether it causes any issue and work has to extend in another week that it be the other side that's not impacted by the script What did they decide to do
as far as the offline was concerned um so we submitted the permit amendment request to do in February for that and um paid that was a permanent fee to pay for that fee and I've been asking Sean to check on it because we haven't heard
yet i did go on to the DOT shacks online database notice that there was a draft for that amendment but I couldn't they wouldn't you know wouldn't let me view it if it's access so we suspect that it's close to
being approved so I asked Sean it's very we need to know you know it impacts scheduling for a state police detail Sean suggested that a message board posted on three giving a heads up about the ramp shut down which is only going
to be a matter of hours um and he was like yeah norally that would get posted week or two before like I don't want to have to post sign before we have the approved that's kind of weird for us to just take that yeah so
I'm like we need to know because it's coming up here pretty good so that's what we want once we get through that cave work there'll just be some punch list items um kind of work to dress up the happy
yards on the roof um but yeah that's hopefully that all gets done the I'm still watching the cost on that stacey gave me the updated cost remaining the project rean the numbers
assuming that we accept all the remaining paving quantity that we still owe them work for that doage and then setting aside money for police details and the my time just
closing it out and there still appears to be sufficient for the work on that yeah so that's Hopefully we'll be all wrapped up soon next on the list is the new well
project let's talk about that one brand application first the expression of interest is submitted there was some feedback by the state that which tab is um it's in the I think it's
the third order should be underneath the email there their response was that the project would best fit with the Mass Works infrastructure program and they
noted some requirements for the project to be competitive otherwise you know that's just not going to get the the grant um they did note that vertical construction is not eligible for this particular grant program so it's just
it's only horizontal construction i'm assuming that it would fund like chapter 30 projects so the well itself would be installed under chapter 30 that the pump station would be one
man that's not eligible that's kind of the cost but and you would it wouldn't be normal to break up the water main part from you know us it's typical to have the well get installed by a well drill contractor and
then the pump station with the water man is a separate project so we need to think about that some more about how we could craft that you know is it we keep the project kind of all together
like a normal way like we normally would and they just would fund all of it that'd be one of you know they won't be interested in funding the water main portion of the project we could separate that out on a bit tab so it's
clear in any case for the comp for the grant to be application to be competitive the design they want to see that have at least a 25% sign of burning point we're really not at right now
but we might be able to by the time the rewarded so they want also need to leverage private development that's imminent and connected to the public the most competitive brands
include 25 to a 50% match which you think you would be good and you were like well yeah we got to pay for the pump station building so that's more than 50% and then for contracts for the applications that they would accept this round contracts must be executed by June
30th of 2026 that would be for the construction so that's a little aggressive has and then um it has to be completed three years from that date so it could
be a case where it's better lined up for the next year but we should still talk about it because you can always once and you know by applying this year
even if they don't award it next year like a like a a dry run yeah and we certainly still like meet with D and to talk about the projects
that link to and that's the key I think getting information i'm sure she's hold the application for this But I looked online they had April as
their month for ask questions but they have this window here where you can ask them for input to their guidance once they release the request for applications the grant
applications they won't be able to answer that's May sessions yeah so that well and then the entire month I think they had they can answer questions so the
applications coming it'll be pretty quick yeah absolutely thank [Music] you they are tomorrow to be able to do a sidewalk
with Chris to go look at that part of the first step is to have them doest on that
no yeah but it's okay it shouldn't it shouldn't be problematic no yeah they do this kind of work all the time themselves so once they do that currently doing
that they're going to start doing the site exam and pump test proposal that will get submitted to they're planning on that going in by late May will take a little bit of time to review that there's usually some back and forth questions that they
have so they planter expects that that will take pretty much few months for them to kind of get back about and they're expecting the next phase start
but in they're saying in parallel effort they're going to have their stuff consultant mobilized to do the wetland waging and then the survey work so that'll be going on at the same time that this request for site exam is being
done making us an updated as you know yeah this may occur they updated the schedule as we launched a few months at the start here just with the contract getting that
negotiated and all signed and everything so they updated it based on that they're now showing see finishing their bid ducks and all the permitting by November
2026 so that would that still puts you in for if the project gets SRF funding that deadline for applications in there in October so they'd at least be able to get the application in they
might have to supplement with final design documents something like that but you can always do that it's not too far off and then usually you take DP SRF takes a few months to review the application before they give permission
to advertise as you've seen with the treatment plan projects so I would expect that would get issued sometime around January or February and then you can do the bid phase you
know a building project there's some bids and the GC bids and then you have to review stuff get D for SRF approval so that whole process takes up the next step then you'd be looking at I would
say at least like a year for construction and then maybe a few months at the end before he gets approval to activate the well 28 yeah28 no I think 2028 is more realistic
because if you're looking at starting construction in by like June 2027 Seven so you're really talking four years from now yeah three and a half maybe three and a
half to four still in that time frame that three to four time frame and there's some like expediting that can be done with D's review times during the permitting process but they
are somewhat hands tied with the what's written in the national law for it needs to be a minimum of this many days for this wait but if you stay on minimum days all the way through there was some time saving yeah there might be a little
bit a few months that you can shave off but that's really dependent on D yeah and if you don't end up getting the SRM funds you know you save some time there but just fun you're going to have to fund it
through town yeah right it doesn't make any difference where the funds come from the initial funds have to be approved through town yeah so but at least they're they're moving things are now happening you know they got their their contract sign they gave
us their insurance that they first and everything's filed with the accounting seems to be all set with the finance so I think we're past that hurdle and
now just get through the project good sign that they're at least getting out right away through this initial work yes and just keep on asking for updates and
scheduling some check it's probably good to have standing at least monthly okay i remember when we were evaluating contractors to do this one of the things
that I thought was very important was um performance getting it getting things done on time really and I was sold by Klein Calder that um they had the capacity to do that which is one of the reasons I voted for them so I hope they
keep up stay do what they said they were going to do because that's again we're back against the wall when we get this online and assuming that they do the stuff they got to be able to go yeah I know they had initiated getting their
subcontracts with services the surveyor before they had the final contract sign i saw that i think that's important especially with not a whole lot of real estate right get them set up i can send around an email to the
group and just say "Okay let's think about days and get on the calendar." Yeah we have a meeting if there's some significant movement we can always skip a meeting but if we get it on the calendar then it's there and it's kind
of kind of helps keep pressure on them yeah keep pressure on them to get something done by then yeah yeah it's it's tough when you go to a meeting like you know visit something on site
okay um so that's briefly talk about the CCR very very comprehensive water quality report thank you um the updates this year in addition to the water quality primarily page
two last year we had an update about the new treatment plant and I replaced that box with a little paragraph about the new water so let me know like read that okay
and then this third paragraph down water service line inventory that was something that's required by the state to have in the CCR so we got that Yeah there's only one and then for the PAS I did have to tweak that language
because last in 2024 we did have one result that was slightly over two parts per which is the minimal detection limit so previous years less than two so this year is the
the first year it was you know one breeding that was 2.56 that's for P6 that's the summation of six contain anybody really wants to know what's
going on with their water so um yeah if you you know take your time to read it we have some time here stacy when were you looking to get this we have usually in times
the time to do what we do the same way the other stuffing no it's it's totally separate separate mailing so if you you know if you see anything else in there just let us know stacy I'll send you the coffee that I have and
you know if you need any foods or something that's we'll move on to the next [Music] appointment thanks for taking us on the agenda walsh
superintendent direct house commission reason we're here is uh primarily to talk about the water moratorium and the effect it's having on the commission particularly our budget going
forward it's having severe we've had this discussion a little bit before when we were doing our rates and the rates and that came up as a talking point but as we get into um cost payment back for the betterments of the SRF for phase two which is the
last two tanks and all the upgrades that were done and simultaneously the leeching field which is just operational in this way to use it our ability to actually open up for business really became real within the
last three months at the same time going through our budget payback requirements for the SRF it became clear that we really need to be able to open
up use connections to complement that growth meeting we have You may recall back historically we ran out of space in the treatment plant around 20067 we were fighting to get
in the second two tanks were supposed to be under construction around 2010 2011 but for all kinds of reasons the economy in 2007 we had the recession and a lot of things changed a lot all kinds of stuff
um so here we are 2017 commission at the time got into putting that uh upgrade which was all part of a facility plan approved back in 1999 so we're we're just completing the second phase of what was approved and
and documented to have to be done 25 years ago and I have to say looking forward looking back looking us looking forward 25 years we did a pretty good job of budgeting this thing and being pretty much on target however here we are with
the problem and the moratorum really makes that difficult because we can't have get hookups we can't get the revenue we can't get it doesn't help the tax rate of the town uh so that's that's kind of the over overarching reason that
I'm here for the super division uh when the issue of the last meeting with the selectman a couple weeks ago the issue came up that this was now potentially going to be six or seven years in the future and that really got our attention because we were able to move again move
with this a little bit in the atm but now we really coming here to offer an opportunity to have us work together and come up with a solution that does several things and I know I had a chance to talk to all a little bit about this
and I drafted a what I think is a comprehensive outline for administrative consent order andor a letter from DP the idea here is that they the EPA will work with you particularly in the town
to set aside well first of all identify what you've done why you've done it tell I use the word tell the story the non-fiction story of how you got to where you are how the well is delayed all these things that are really important to your perspective but also
tell the story of the sewer commission another really important environmental budget that happen to be colliding so if you will with this budget issue and so the outline of this draft is to get uh and I've talked to DP it actually went
to the region director M who I know as you may know I work with DP for 10 years have a lot of respect for them and they have a lot of respect for me so I'm here to offer this opportunity to start discussion and
try to move this kind of solution quickly that does several things i said tell tell the story how do we get here give you the comfort to eliminate the moratorum with conditions with all the comp going to change everything but
give you the kind of basis for making a decision rationally with all the technical input we need and get to a place where DP is looking over your shoulder a little bit but understanding that you're going full tilt Now that you have the contract
out for the well in the pump station you're going forward due diligence wise that's to solve the problem that we dissipated many years ago and for whatever reason we're delaying tell that story
again at the same time recognizing our dilemma of the sewer department in the town it's a town if we can't come up with the revenue town's going to pay for any and that's not a good thing for anybody we would much rather be in a position as an enterprise account getting the benefits to pay the debt in
a rational way have the benefit of having that opportunity but we can't do without connections so this outline and I'll stop talking for a minute here is is meant to talk about that process how do
we get to that point also I'm glad you didn't the schedule this I looked at the original schedule in August of next year and now it's part of November i think one of the other benefits of this document is that D will be focused on your project a little bit more than they
might have been and they also help you with the SRF process and any other grants because they're going to raise this up to a level where they understand as an issue we're properly going to them it's not them coming this is not a consent of the
penalty which if that's when that pissed off you come and get you or something but that's not the case you've done your good work and we've done our good work and this is a way to get a lot of emphasis on these guys all of us need this thing
done sooner than later help with the extra the permitting help with the extra SR anything they can do to get us sooner than later no the schedule isn't that critical really when we think about it it's a matter of having as Chris and I
talked about having the geotechnical issues to make sure the wells that you have cover that concern you have of having enough water at any time and the conditions under let's not move too quickly because
we've been years to where we are now we're not going to solve this problem overnight we need to do this consistently with a great deal of thought and a great deal of planning to do it correctly we do have we need we need to make sure that we're touching dates not with D in Boston because we
need to make sure that the D and regional office is also on line with what D in Boston said too often if I've been involved with enough politics and enough state and city government and town government turn over sometimes
things are said at a higher level that don't get transmitted either verbally or in writing to the person that's actually doing so we need to make sure that everybody is is playing on the same playing field that's exactly what we're doing but that is exactly what this document
is going to take you beyond that point but it will be in writing can be done fairly quickly it'll set the tone fairly quickly to get us so that everything is in writing and everything is supported by DP i only want to manage people in Boston but the reason I talk to
reason and I don't see any any fighting point here is going to be some work to do we have sit down i'm not saying we're not going to do that but I'm here to underscore the urgency that we have and
the town has to get this result we are before the town now reluctantly with a kind of a miniature override to cover at least the next year on the leeching field we hopefully won't have to go beyond
that because if we get these betterments in and we start paying note through those funding sources we won't be here year after year that's the alternative i mean the wastewater treatment system is a real asset to the
town for a lot of reasons it's put in and I brought this on just in case this is we go through a lot of auditing this is a this is the services this is an updated and one of the things I did when
I got back from the commission to see where we were we're going through an audit we have the benefit of all our staff obviously we have get to help us in the planning but she's going through a lot of the details with our
administrative staff this is all the lots that are to be sewed or were sewed everything in green is something an area that has not been sewing was we didn't have capacity and ironically if you look at the when the Plymouth Town line area that big green area that was there that
was going to be on the sewer immediately um they fought to not be on it because there's a new there's a new condo complex up there they bought themselves some time which is 20 years for a new septic system but not not the Cadillac septic system the the Volkswagen one and
ironically for the first time in 10 years raise beach picked up Eola and all these beaches along the for the first time that was last year and I've been working with the board of health agent to focus on that but that kind of
underscores again the urgency of getting the sewers hooked up where we can find these sources of an raising their head because again we're only 50% done with the what was approved and expected to be done in 2010 or 12 okay and then the other areas that
you'll see on the left here on this outset that's the that was the reason we put a pump station up on route 106 the time your self the field the self well field there was very pro it's still prominent but it's it was a it was
the water there didn't have any nitrogen the last CC you did show around 2 and a half parts per million the reason that pump station was there to put the sewers encapsulate everything around that wellfield including the uh the mobile home park which is only half as big as
it was at the time they've sold heavily but again you have really substandard septic systems all kinds of problems i see the numbers going up you see them going up that's why we don't have five years to fix this you know sooner the
better so the urgency is environmental public health a lot of reasons why we're anxious to move this thing forward and then the last part up in the top there that that's an addition to what was originally planned but it was a highlighted area this is the town of
country mobile home park again they are own plan but they're having real problem with it they come to us and we've had a we have a written agreement to uh to help them when we get the chance to do it which is as soon as possible it was
also highlighted in the last uh Damon study by D that this is one of the lowhanging fruit nitrogen reduction put places we can grab within the capacity we have in the sewage stream plant
now I always like to point out the day we opened our sewage stream plant and started collecting soon is the same year that Island Creek Oysters was able to open because we took away the source of contamination that was making them so we helped Ducks they don't like
to hear me say this but that's the truth um so the town of Kingston really we're not we have a $65 million capital investment for that plant and we want to see it build out because it's going to help this town grow correctly along with rea
and clean the water and keep it clean our last annual report we started to write I started to put down a calculation how much nitrogen we remove every year and they gives me his numbers you do the calculation we're taking out what is it 150
200 50 lb bags of nitrogen every year that would have gone to the Jones River or King Bay so think of it's as big this is high in this room 10 10 that would have gone in but now it's not so this is you've
all done a really good job i'd like to see you keep going and work with you to get this done but again this is an outline to get us there faster than possible is the rest of the short commission agreeing
absolutely on the other side okay chris I had a question about what's your take on the consens so now we we made our moratorum based upon how much we're pulling out and the major well goes down all that what's
your take on ability to to execute something like this yeah so right now you don't meet their requirement of the maximum day demand with the largest well offline so that gives them something to refer to that's
in their requirements say you you know you're not meeting this this is what is why we're doing the cone that's what they could refer to that's really it that so it would all be based around that requirement um you know I
think adding that to facts that we put ourselves in a voluntary moratorum because we knew the mission I think would be something that we're trying to do what's right if we ask for is this asking for kind of an exemp exemption from them temporarily while we do the
right thing it's not an exemption but that's this is a very good point um what this is doing is two things it's recognizing your good juristprudence your good efforts to go forward voluntarily they didn't do it to you you
did it because you thought it was the right thing to do good but this gets them to the point where they you know hey you guys are doing the right thing they love it when you're doing the right thing they like to come and endorse anything particularly municipality they don't have to so this gives them the way
to say "Okay Kingston thank you very much you're doing a good job we understand that problem." And this is one of the geotechnical issues that Chris and I talked about let's look at the the withdrawal of the other wells let's take that hypothetical one well goes down and we have to do something if
this is only a two or three year period you even your own schedule there's two or three summers if you will two or three winter summer dry periods where this is more critical than not that and they said okay we understand that so I put down here um well leak detection you
know to deal with those kind of things that are easy that you can do you're doing anyways just put together a schedule take that one issue and say okay we understand that you're in excess of what your withdrawal is under these scenario the scenario that we're concerned about but you're doing the
right thing going forward we're going to help you expedite that well installation and get it running because we know how good it is i asked them how many other conditions like this they have there's none that I could find up there they have all kinds of problems in the cake
that's a whole different issue the problem is when we go back to what DP has said as far as one of the major wells down and that's bakery three wells it's not the South Street well system because one they're not on any one of
the treatment plans so we don't really consider them as a major well site so we got Traon I6 and Grassy Hole if we lose one of those for any prolonged period of time what's that doing for us to be able
to supply portable water to every single resident in the town of Kingston not just the ones that are on sewer today or may want to get on sewer tomorrow we need to my feeling we need to make sure that we provide portable water for every
single resident that's on the system now and that's one of the major reasons we basically put the moratorum in is we were reaching that point of critical level pumping over the demand that D said is correct and if we're
there on a regular basis to think that we may have a mechanical issue not just a power line you know that shuts well down for a prolonged period of time i'm not talking about 12 or 24 hours i'm talking about days weeks or whatever it
is that we get back what type of recourse do we have to supply one portable water and fire protection for every single house not just the ones in hooked up on this map you know everybody
so that's that's where I am and I'm saying unless Chris and Kristen can convince me that in fact we can live with one of those three wallets completely offline for a period
of time not 24 hours not 12 hours until they can tell this board that we can survive i'm not sure that we want to agree with this consent so that's why I'm saying we need to
allow them now they've looked at this they've had some time to talk to you and talk to Dave Dave and Chris talk regularly anyways they know what the issues are we need to give them the time to evaluate what this
says and know that we're going forward in the best interest of every single person in town realize this is an outline it's a lot more detail understand And I'd be happy to talk with your folks here to expedite
that and get that clear president if we um instituted a outside watering van complete outside watering ban no lawn no filling your pools no washing your cars about how much water is that safe
you have any idea i don't know you recently did you might go ahead math day versus like average day because I what I'm thinking is first of all we would need a catastrophic event that we haven't had in a while and since
I've been on the board of water commissioners for it to kick that in should it kick in and I think this is what Bud's talking about okay now what do we do okay we've we've lifted the moratorum now what do we do and if there's other things we can do to fill
that gap because I remember that graph you gave us where the red line goes across to lower that down there's lack of use if we restrict use it lower it down below the red line let's let's be realistic you know we have a we have a
group of men and women who work for this department that one don't wear badges and don't wear guns and don't wear chest protectors to think that just because we're going to say nobody turns on the outside faucet and you're going to drive up to Indian born and watch all those
lawns go brown or any place else down in corner green you think they're going to go brown you might as well walk out that door now because you're not being realistic again the expectation that we're going to have that catastrophic event in my
opinion is not high but should it happen and we were looking at a period of months weeks months a year where we have a one of the three major sources offline can we reduce use enough if we had to if
some people understood what it meant it means lack of fire protection it means there are people that won't have water because you put water in your pool etc etc yeah you're right the enforcement of it would be tough but again it's going to take a catastrophic event that I haven't experienced in the 30 years I've
been here so it would take that catastrophic event and if it's a catastrophic event I think a substantial number of people in the town would be be aware of it and would respond accordingly maybe I'm an idealist would the natural consequence of overuse be
just lower pressure we looking at failure in certain zones in the town in terms of delivery yeah if you had a system drop a significant drop in system pressure you're going to have catastrophic failures all over the place which is just going to be you know gross loss of water and then recovery time is
just going to be tremendous trying to build recovers it's almost like the risk versus benefit is there and and bud mentioned the enforcement of it we can't get people to follow the mandatory or
voluntary water restrictions trying to conserve water and I see that our pumping will go way up a million million and a half gallons in the summer it'll go up because people won't adhere to those and we did best we can notice hey you're in violation they don't care find
me i don't care my graph is going to go green they people they don't they kill themselves but again we'll take a catastrophic event that I haven't experienced or over a two-year period roughly two year period two or three
year period it's two or three something well this summer yeah in the summers because it's not an issue in winter time so it be an issue just in summer it's becoming it's becoming more and more of an issue as we have more and more usage don't at the mall
Uh that uh what are we pumping average today you know compared to what average right now this time of year 20 years ago we were pumping 800,000 gallons now we're pumping a million8 so up a million gallons 15 20 years
our summer time right now you're up to almost three million gallons a day catastrophic events and then we have obviously issues with the sewer payments on their bonds they have
issues with moratorium and business here is that enough to to put ourselves at risk or small of a catastrophic event if we go this
route what what kind of events are we talking about that would put the water system offline for You could you could have over pumpage over pumpage you're not giving these wells time to rest in the summer these wells don't rest the way they used to because they're all running they're
running to meet the demand and over destroy well lose a well do we have a warning sign for that do we have in terms of watching the level or is it just recharge rate be it similar to what we just did with clean failing out failing
out fast well down from Elm Street from souls pond booster station the high zone that's critical balance right there you know once you start losing a while you lose that well it's
mobile pumpage you know Chris and I were talking earlier you just got to it has to have a chance to re rest kind of relax and rejuvenate itself when you constantly pump it non-stop that's not how it's designed it's not how it's permanent or approved so I guess I mean
Chris put a lot of meat here in terms of what's the risks of doing something like this what what are some of the things a proactive watering ban entirely even though it might not be entirely followed at least it will reduce some amount but
you you got to look at that double- edged sword you're going to restrict the outside usage for growth now that outside uses being applied for 247 year round consumption so you you just took this to put over here for but for not not forever for a short period of time
until the world goes on yeah that's that's a critical piece is only for as long as the new well isn't up and running so I'm looking at this expedite the new well to have DP out of that decision out of that
process it's on money as well as on time and then be prepared as best you can for what hasn't happened again this is postulating hypothetical but you know in the sewer side of things what we're required to do and I'm not sure if it's on the water side I'm not familiar with
let's say it's a well goes down i mean cleaning that's one thing that takes time if it's a if it's actually a pump that goes we have to have a spare pump to put in right away that's kind of you know it's it's a two or three week outage it's not months
and months and months but again it's hypothetical but do you have that kind of situation but I guess the pump's too expensive you don't have that pumps for well motors that might be a way that might be a way
to address that issue to have it's not cost prohibitive each each one is application specific to each well i get that but just have you know we have a place to store it it's a long do in house it has to be contract
it comes out of do the town's people want to pay more for the bond service on department you know do they they want to take on that risk of all of a sudden if we know you know
postpone in some way uh to think we're there for the or if we do you know possibility of of a catastrophic failure that might cause some some short-term or
medium-term will majority of the um rateayers believe right now if you were to ask them that a catastrophic failure of the well would create a massive problem now if you ask them that's what they'll tell
you if we lost one of our three best pumping stations for two or three month period what do you think is going to happen and they'll tell you there'll be water moratoriums everywhere how can we survive without that unaware of the fact that D requires you to have a water
system in place that can handle that so I guess if there's a concern about whether people are going to get behind this I I understand i mean I've I've driven down the streets and watched people watering at times and not supposed to water on the wrong side of the road and stuff
sure I get that make it a a catastrophic event i think people step up in catastrophic events more than they do under normal circumstances and if you're normally restricting water use because it's summertime and we don't want to use too
much water and they'll listen to you nod their head and water their lawn but if you're telling them it's a catastrophic issue that's very different from my perspective very different than routine yearbyear water mars that we put on etc etc and by the way again a catastrophic
event that I've never experienced in all the years I've been a water commissioner in all the years I've been in town would you roll the dice then and then if something happens then go to the public or do you let the public know ahead of time and say "We're going to take some chances here to make sure we can keep things solvent or things like that."
Um my take my take is full disclosure because people at town meeting you tell them this this is the decision we're making to allow for growth so that we can pay for the sore so that all these people that want to hook up that need to
be paying um taxes into the town of Kingston so that we're not in this catastrophic financial situation we're in the price for that could be in a catastrophic failure you we're going to tell you not to use water except except what's absolutely necessary in your
house what do you think people would say lower lower taxes because I don't have to pay for the sewer um more businesses that can hook up so that we now can start generating more revenue into the town i think that people would
buy in very easily i think that's one of the easiest seller put me up there and I guarantee you I can sell so don't bet on it so another another facet of this is putting it's again it's a consent it's something that the town's agreeing to
with D and when you get into the town meeting issues now you have maybe different than before you now have the selectment having this kind of an agreement that they have part of part of this and the treat it makes the it
makes the kind of things that you had to deal with before less likely this is the same selectman that voted against the approval to take the land by the mean years ago and continue to speak against the same
sele I mean but this puts this again gives you another quiver in your um your bow that uh you didn't have before necessarily you can put all equiv you want i'm here to protect each and every resident that's now a resident of the
town of Kingston or a business in the town of Kingston not somebody that may want to come to the town and build a new building i understand that and I understand the need to continue to allow growth but growth without control is not
good and what we're asking here is women as I understand we're asking here to lift the moratorum so whoever wants to build can build and they can hook up so they can hook up to your soul that's not the way I'm looking at i'm looking at it
no matter where the service is it can be on route 27 at the Pemro line not anywhere in here it can be on Main Street that you don't even put water you don't have sewer on going down Main Street right up that's not our choice that's That don't That's the last time don't ever say that again don't ever say
that again wait a minute wait Brian that's the fact that's the fact of whoever did it at the time chose not to put sewage down Main Street because it was for whatever reason don't ever say that again why it's still true this is the plan this is what we're working
towards that's what the problem is if you don't do this we are going to be going back to the town for a lot of money that they shouldn't be paying for these are my customers okay you have yours I have mine yep this is what we're trying to solve don't forget it would a
I mean talk about moratorium obviously building anywhere is we could lift moratorium only for areas that have access to sewer is that correct that's all I care about you can't do that can't you i know but but bear in mind for moratorium purposes not to stop building
people can build they can build all they want they just put a private wealth and that's been a misconception projected and it's it's frustrated me to a lot because people think that this moratorum stops a building the moratorum purpose is not to stop or restrict you cannot
put a well for a business on route three that's going to satisfy the water needs it ain't going to happen the reason the sewer is there because the soil's crappy it's clay and it's rock you're not that's what we're trying to get you to focus on it's Route 3A it's the places that are zoned for commercial land we're
not talking about just anybody we already have it happening this is about taking care of the water uh contaminated areas of town it's that map it's one not even one quarter of the town but it represents a huge amount of capital that
this town can get to solve your problem and ours i mean we don't exist in isolation here i mean it's almost like in ideal world all we're concerned about is the water quality but we are part of this town and if we can meet the needs
of other parts I I would like to do so but only if only if we have assurances that we can handle that um if that that well goes down or what how how we need to have those plans in place so that if the worst case scenario does happen
however unlikely that we can deal with it that'll be the only way I could And that's what I'm saying person and first to look at it work with Dave figure out what the way go forward if we can go forward with whatever way we can go
forward not just sitting here because we've got a a draft proposal that may not solve the problem i think we're we don't need to do that and also in mind too you know we're still in a drought condition you know
throughout the region so then that that's limiting restricted too all these are important points that's why I'd like to continue the discussion with your technical folks put myself in that position with you to talk about this and in the right kind of form go
over some of the ideas I might have that get you to where you need to be i mean you know the license and I do obviously but I wouldn't been doing this a long time i haven't been doing this a long time still ways to get this resolved so we need to put you guys together to
talk this through and see what we can come up with i'll volunteer with you guys but I can't do it during the days but unless someone else wants to know that I I [Music]
probably if I could just add another piece to this trying to listen to everyone's point of view and the water side is very new to me just hearing some of the stuff is very valuable i appreciate today um and Ryan said we do
have obviously a financial obligation for upgrades the plan reaching so I look at some of the stuff that happens throughout town and some of the timeliness how long it takes for certain things to happen and I see that
you guys are working your way towards that as well june 27 somewhere so later yeah 29 even if things I would say like end of 2028 so December
2028 would be should be safe okay yeah approved activate the pump station so somewhere to range if you look at it today if you decided to do some
[Music] developing shovels imagine that by the time completely pass this one so some of those pieces are actually coming together at that point you got a three to four year window on on your end
of completion if someone started something today they're still a year out so now you're closing that down to two or three year window so some of your liabilities of concern of not being able to supply water everyone for a greener
at least that window if you take the two other lions away you shrunk down and I don't think tomorrow that all of a sudden you're going to have everyone jumping on board and start building up this going to be a gradual
process so I it's just my opinion that it's not going to be someone throwing switch that all of a sudden this huge demand for water it's going to be a process on both sides build out plus us even getting
customer so just like to throw that into just proof of thought that we're not you know confident tomorrow that if we decide to go forward and everyone committee that this is the way to go that you're not immediately going to be
at a point that you know we got to shut everything down no watering so it'll be a slow process might get a trickle in what's the legal liability to the board in the town for lifting a moratorum only
for sewer area I was ask the same question is that inequitable is that very inequable to everybody you have a project that's going on in the junk he wants town water he can't get town water he's not do project with
private wells that's what you can do so how how can you tell that it wants water it needs water for fire protection they know you can't have it because you're on town sewer but the folks the other end of town on town sewer can get water i think I think that's opening yourself up
to a major opinion from I would agree that would seem to be on too and that that that's basically where I was going you know your residential units in the rest of the town aren't going to be large in number to begin with but if you have a
multifamily building being put up in town the demand is going to be greater but that doesn't mean that just because it's greater you know that they should go to the front of the list and the guy that's trying to do the ADA 80 ADU unit
for his mother-in-law or for himself can't get hooked up because he can't get serious idea of looking at for commercial purposes that to me is the same issue we wouldn't be able to do that either well we I think we need a
ruling from town council on whether that's that is in fact legal or not because we can talk here all day about it we're not lawyers and and I think Elaine even when you had your earlier meeting was questioning whether or not there was the legality of doing it
strictly for SL commercials you know SL that you know it sounded illegal then it sounds illegal now again the demands may not be that great for the individual residential
but to try and say you know you on this side you don't work you're on this side you do yeah and I'm not suggesting that and I think you rais a great point that general even if we ultimately come to an agreement and then we tell Val
we've got this agreement we tell the town we've got the agreement by the time paperwork and processing goes through we're a year out anyways for this no I'm talking about if that if
something like that is approved at some point from the date of approval to a commercial development of any size you're a year out anyway this this never intended to be just commercial i mean it's only for that's it we weren't
trying to I wasn't trying to stop anything so that point really not for table what we have to be able to do though is as a business development multi not a single family house a multi- kind multi- uh thousands and thousands of of gallons
of water need let's put it that way some big project there's lots of vacant land along we created we've had people come to us and there's no water so they don't do anything we will get we will have the benefit of those uh those betterment costs for additional erus as we call
them um we have to put that out there s very soon so that the idea that Dave was mentioning that the process can start like we might not get there to actually hook up for a year or something but if we don't put it out there just mark in time and we don't have that luxury and
we didn't set this up this way as much as you didn't set it up this way it's just the way it is so I'm trying to bring issues to the table for both of us both of our commissions to focus on this is not easy but we got to get some
resolution so want to see like from Kristen the feasibility of you know entertaining some also want to see the legal aspects i think we if we had a limited supply we'd still have to prioritize some i can't see that
being just outright illegal not to I'm suggesting a little bit I think both aspects the legal and the the engineering side we want to get some information on that we'll we'll do that jointly with the town council we'll reach out to joint we'll reach out to
council and see what he says as far as what the parameters of the moratorium are and if you look at if you to whatever extent it can look but I think you get with extreme
caution you have the mayor post project that's been an argumentative point for years and we don't have the capacity to supply them with water and that's been our statement because of the moratorum we don't have the capacity and then if they're on town sewer now suddenly you have the
capacity that's not going to sit well with any attorney Um so I I mean you say that down the main street power there's not enough water quality enough water supply to meet the demand for commercial occupancy look at our surrounding
communities of Plumpton Harour Middle they have wells they have sistns they have fire pumps look at El Knight there isn't enough fire down at their facility they have a fire pond out front to meet their fireflow demand so there's other avenues those commercial occupies to pursue that's right i at at their peril
at their expense to meet that that fire demand fire protection or storage or whatever you look any commercial op you look at Cisco they own a well they have their own small tank to meet their their water demands and their fire protections
the areas that we're talking about do not have that capability for quantity of water given the reason the same reasons why there's sewers there's not there's no you say that was 30 to 100 g geological survey report um I got a whole bunch of them from the
area we're talking about why we have the sewer in the I just think you get different water quality different depth from the town wells we have deep wells deep gravel pack wells for a higher quality higher yield well again we'll talk about the geotechnical issues that really at this
point so that we can come up with an answer either we can or we can't we can't we have a whole different problem there's many different vertles that can slam this shut let's find out what those are exist
that's your time do I have a motion to set up a sub committee and system y second we need to discuss that thank you all right so update for me we have the
upcoming sanitary survey coming it's uh scheduled for the 15th site visit all of our facilities and uh hopefully everything should go for that the guys are doing a great job getting these in
order together as to review that we're in shape for that the cell sheet generator as mentioned previous meeting Southshore generator had come out and said that generator is inoperable and out of service i went
out evaluated it a couple of contracts generized it every time it started up so I'm unsure i've got call generator to speak to the technician to see what his findings were outside of that so we'll be following up with
them as far as the FCC license goes for our skater equipment it was the conflict we were dealing with with Eversource Electric and radio frequencies we have the FCC license in hand now i just received that today the
updates have been performed last week so everything is on a new frequency to for any further interference potential interference with that source energy so glad I have that just a question on that is that the new radio system where
you now have to listen to every department or is that rectified no that's that's just just for speed of communications for the the system to operate larry and Stacy are doing a fantastic job with the shut off program sending
out letters and in via mail and in person with the guys hand delivering letters we have a good very good recovery from that so it looks like no shutouts we've had a few Stacy can maybe speak a little clearer on that yeah we
just had one that's already shut off for the building part um we had one and as soon as you shut off they came back um but no everybody's been pretty good everybody's been pretty good about developing a plan and follow
through with it or pay we get considerable revenue um yeah I mean right now we've I've got a$100,000 I said $100,000 worth of shut off letters and I received about 50% of that so far of the ones that I like have already
come to so send out another group today through the end of the month thank you thank you for your program has been working out very well it was frustrating sometimes for the residents but
frustrating for the staff sometimes yes give them credit as well the office staff has done a fantastic job getting the bills [Music] together that's all that I know you got anything i do there you have a
water bill request for 17 summer street this is for I believe the December bill which I explained to the [Music] president but he is adamant that during
that time period he did not use the amount of water that his register he lists a whole bunch of reasons why he believes that to be such is it have been checked um I'm not sure if the guys went out to pay for that or if it was just
coordinator that meter to the last meeting so he took a photo of it to send in correct if the meter was accurate that everything that measines air in the lines that mean there's a leak somewhere there no I we
had fixed a um a service line leak on a house that goes down from him he's stating that because he was saying he had air so somebody would have gotten in the system with that yeah but not enough to make it 40,000 gallons
everybody if you look at this consumption which I included in your packet you had all actual rates so there's not even any estimates in there and if you December bill which is dated that's when we read it there was a
61,000 gallons of use usage that's what he's arguing he's saying that he never uses any more than like 23,000 a quarter and this was 61,000 so he's claiming he used about 40,000 40,000 gallons more than typical but he can't explain why
all of a sudden his meter went back to his usage went back to normal and neither can we because we have no idea how just could we just make sure we get a check on the meter yeah we can schedule an accuracy test to go out the accuracy test on the meter can you get a print
out of the accuracy test no okay so take the accuracy test and the document that Yes we do so okay i just want to make I just want to understand so even though the rules in red state that if you want to request
an abatement within 30 days of the issue date of the bill this was a December 5th he should have come to us there's no abatement i think we're here at all just because if he's got a bad meter it's gonna happen again okay
i I I know where you're coming with that and I don't have any violating rules he's gonna ask me well the bill is due in a couple days and he did get a shut off so do you want me to just pause that until we get an understanding what's going on
in all my years of all the activity tests that I've performed I've never seen a meter that failed in our favor anytime a meter fails it always fails in the president's favor yeah fails faster stops turning i've never found one with an overregister they only underregister
because they jam up that's a shock because this thing spinning all the time isn't just going to get spinning faster yeah when they fail they'll fail to read anything registering whether it's right sand or solder but we need that documentation and are we doing an test
on it yeah we if you want to reach out to him just just to rule out the meter okay well no he may have had a a burst over the winter months so he may have had something that they burst outside that they discovered later on but the
bill is the bill and pulled off on any shut off notice for now all right sed has passed the opportunity to contest the bill way past and we have already denied
people who have come to agree with you this itemized list nothing else motion to I do have one question going to be is on the next schedule next time to discuss the DPW meeting
tonight so commission's already voted on the issue are we going to address that on the 22nd yes we should okay put on the list i can tell you the record what [Music]
we moved it