[Music] Good evening and welcome to the Thursday, April 10th, 2025 meeting of the Lakeville Planning Board. It is 700 p.m. and we are meeting this evening at the Lakeville Police Station at 323 Bedford Street. We have Lake Cam recording. Is anyone else
recording? No one recording for the record. We do have a quorum this evening with myself, Mr. Wilder, and Mr. Cabraw. Um hoping that the other two members will be joining us, but we will be starting this evening at 7:00. And uh we
do have Clark Kathy Murray with us. Um going to take something out of order right now. Uh we have an ANR plan for 71 Howland Road, Zenith Land Surveyors LLC. Possible vote. If you want to come up and state your name for the record. Good evening. My name is John Romanelli of
Zenith Lance Surveyors uh in New Bedford and they're representing uh Frank Ashley and his wife who I think are just about to pull in the parking lot. Uh what we are doing here uh is cutting an existing lot into two. Now
Frank has been on this holding on to this property for many many years. It had some issues with an old rideway that ran through the property and there were other people that had rights to it. And back at least a year or so ago, I
drew an exhibit plan for his attorney so she could see exactly where the property was. put this up here just in case anybody has any questions cuz if you look at the assessor's map you'll see there are two parcels on the assessor's map and one of
them is the old rightway okay Frank's property is down here at the bottom of the land. Mhm. And in red, I know it's a little difficult to see, is the old woods road that used to run through the former subdivision or it ran through the
subdivision before it became a subdivision. Now, these houses are all in here and built and I believe there are nine of Butters that um Frank had to get his lawyer to get the rightway extinguished. Okay. And I brought a copy of the judgment just so you could have it for your record. Okay. Actually, um,
you want to give it to Kathy? Sure. Would you mind? That's a superior court judgment, uh, that came down in January of this year. Okay. Basically extinguishing the rights of the nine of Butters that had rights to go through Frank's
property. Basically, it it's it's not in use anymore. It was an old logging road, and if you were to use it now, you'd be going through people's houses and whatnot. So, but it took a couple years to get it extinguished cuz they had difficulty time finding some of the owners. But now that it's been
extinguished and we have that judgment, it's been recorded at the Plymouth County Registry of Deeds. He would like to subdivide his existing 48. It was actually originally part of the uh Sherwood Drive subdivision, but the
rightway used to be right along this dash line in here. So, now that it's been extinguished, we're going to cut this into two. Uh basically, this meets all the zoning requirements. We've got 80,1 178 with no wetlands on lot one.
Lot two 109,770. Total frontage is 465 uh between Howland and Sherwood. We've got the front yard circle 160 diameter and meet all the other requirements. All right. It's pretty straightforward.
All right. Um, do we have any questions from the board? How you doing? What's What's the frontage of of uh lot one? Oh, thank you. So, it's not as 226 at the 45th setback line. It actually pays a little bit more
than that. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yep. All right. We did start right at 7. Sorry, gentlemen. All right. So, and we're reviewing the ANR because we took it out of order. Um,
so unless Did you Did either of you have any questions about the ANR? I know this is actually the first implementation of the new um for A. Yes. Mhm. And I'd say from looking at um the
submittals, it's done it's served its purpose because I don't see any I don't have any questions, comments, or concerns myself. And if um if no one else does, would someone like to make a motion to approve this ANR? You guys all set? Yep.
I'll make a motion to approve the ANR for 71 Holland Road. Yes. Second. Motion and a second. All in favor? I I motion carries unanimously. Thank you. All right, back to agenda item number
one. We have a public hearing to amend the town code zoning bylaws section 270-6.7 site plan review. A purpose two to amend by adding use to design and layout to amend section
270-6.7 C applicability requirements by deleting seven and replacing with if the proposal involves expansion of a building or intensification of use that would result in a change of traffic in the area, noise, parking, lighting, etc.
by a commercial, business or industrial use. to add also add activities not subject to site plan review to amend section 270-6.7D submitt requirements by adding 19 a statement of proposed use to amend section
270-6.7E review procedure to update various administrative procedures regarding the submittal process votes to be taken and I will read the notice of public hearing legal noticeful planning board will hold a public hearing pursuant to the Lakeville town code zoning bylaw Law and Mass General Law
Chapter 4A section 5 on Thursday, April 10th, 2025 at 7 p.m. at the Lakeville Police Station meeting room 323 Bedford Street. The purpose of the public hearing is to provide interested parties with an opportunity to comment on proposed amendments to the Lakeville Town Code zoning bylaws as follows. 7
p.m. Public hearing one. This article would amend the Lakeville Town Code zoning bylaw section 270-6.7 site plan review. a purpose to to amend and actually I just read all this um to amend use to design and layout of
certain developments to amend section 270-6.7 site plan review C applicability requirements by deleting seven and replacing with if the proposal involves expansion of a building or intensification of use that would result in a change in traffic volumes in the area, noise, parking, lighting, etc. by
commercial business or industrial use. To also add the following activities not subject to site plan review. One, proposals that involve no change in use or level of activity. Two, internal building modifications to a non-residential use that do not affect the scale or impact of the existing use.
Three, a reuse of a premise for which a site plan has already been conducted, provided the new use is not different in type or impact. to amend section 270-6.7 site plan review D submittal requirements by adding 19 a statement of
proposed use to amend section 270-6.7 site plan review E review procedure to update various administrative procedures regarding the submitt process. So that is the legal notice if someone would like to make a motion to
open the public hearing. I'll make a motion to open the public hearing. Second. We have a motion and a second. All in favor? I motion carries. Public hearing is open. Do we have anyone who has any questions, comments, concerns on this? Um, as I
just read, these are some minor edits to site plan review. We're hoping to just strengthen them and and it it was um from some feedback from our former town planner that we were able to come up with these minor edits to hopefully strengthen and make it u more
straightforward in the future. So with without any further comment or questions, would uh someone like to make a motion to uh we've already sent it to the select board. Recommend approval. So we just
need to recommend a town meeting. Yep. Make a motion to recommend a town meeting the article that would amend the uh Lakeville town bylaws. Approval. Recommend approval. Recommend approval. Okay, we have a motion and a second. All
in favor? I I I All right. Would someone like to close that public hearing? Make a motion to close the public hearing number one. Second. Motion and a second. All in favor? I I. Motion carries. All right. Public hearing number two. This
article would amend the Lakeville Town Code zoning bylaws section 270-2.1 terms defined accessory dwelling unit to add the following four is subject to 760 CMR
71.00 protected use ADUs. Make a motion to open the public hearing. We have a motion and a second. All in favor? I I public hearing is opened. This is just adding on to our ADU
um definition to have it reference the state law that it is coming from. So when those guidelines or laws change, this will already uh reference those items. We won't have to change it
every time they change it. Exactly. Hopefully. Hopefully. Hopefully we don't. Um, and so anyone have any questions, comments, concerns? No. Okay. Would someone like to make a
motion to recommend approval? The second town meeting. The town meeting. All right. We have a motion and a second. All in favor? I. Motion carries. Someone like to close that public hearing. Make a motion to close the public hearing number two. I second.
Second. Motion and a second. All in favor? I I Okay. Public hearing number three. This article would amend the Lakeville Town Code zoning bylaws section 270-7.8 accessory apartment by deleting this section in its
entirety. The proposed amendments to the Lakeville Town Code zoning bylaw may be viewed at the Lakeville Town Clerk's Office in Town Hall, 346 Bedford Street, uh Lakeville, Mass by appointment only. So, I'll make a motion to open the public hearing number three. Second. Thank you. Motion and a second. All in
favor? I I um public hearing is open. This is just going to delete our existing accessory apartment bylaw because now that we have ADU, we don't need the more stringent accessory apartment bylaw because that bylaw
actually required it to be attached to the existing dwelling. the ADU guidelines are a lot less uh stringent and it can be separated part of um the existing dwelling. So it doesn't
need to be attached to it like the accessory um apartment by law. And I think this will also sort of relieve any conflict between the two. And we know
that uh title 5 still applies. So anyone who has an ADU uh is probably not going to be able to have an accessory apartment as well without redoing their septic. And so it seemed like a straightforward um removal
of this existing bylaw. Anyone have any questions, comments, concerns? No. Right. I'll make a motion to recommend approval at town meeting. Second. A motion and a second. All in favor? I I. Motion carries. Make a motion to close
the public hearing. Motion in a second. All in favor? I I All right. Public hearings are closed and these will be on our town meeting. Um John, last time last in fall, I know you helped me present them.
I can I can do that. Yeah. I don't know if this if you want to think about it. Which one? Doesn't matter. You can pick. I I can pick. I'll I'll do I'll do the two small ones or you do the one long one or vice versa. Okay. Whatever you you pick your choice. So,
yeah. All right. So, we can we can discuss that further off the record, but um Okay. All right. Agenda item number five, public hearing, site plan review 10 Harding Street continued to this evening upon the application for a site plan review and approval submitted by
Lex Development, Inc. for the construction of a proposed 13,300 foot building, associated driveways, parking areas, and utilities. Possible vote. Good evening. All right. If you want to just state your names for the record. Uh Timothy
Hash. Hello. Bob Rio with Riverhawk Environmental Civil Engineering. Welcome. So, we we had a standard set of conditions that was sent to um you all to review. We did get some feedback from
your attorney. Uh they were sent to our town council and um there are a number of them that I think we should go through and discuss. Um, see, so is this the edited version? So, yeah, in our packet, Kathy was good enough to
supply us with um this for discussion. It kind of narrows it down to the items that were Yes, exactly. Yeah, I think that was that was the comments that your attorney had put in that email. Well, so actually, so we
have this one is from Kathy. Then we have your attorneys as well and um we did get feedback from a civil engineer in regards to a question about
one of the items. So let's start with um number one. It was okay. We were It was minor. Uh number two um for discussion. So you're looking for a
fixed number for the shity. Um it has been standard for us to go with the $10,000 per acre of disturbance. Assuming you're only going to disturb around an acre. $10,000 seems reasonable because that would be the same as what
it would be. What? Say we were going to disturb it half an acre. Just uh, you know, would you have to pay $5,000? Is that how it work? Is it prorated back or is it Have we ever permitted it? Uh, we've never had it where it was less
than an acre. Okay. Okay. So, that's never come up. So, Okay. And how have you guys been doing this shity for a long time? Uh, requiring that on the private sites? Yes, we have been. So, ever since we got a standard set of conditions that we worked through and
then I know for a little while we we didn't have a fixed number. I think it was when I became chair we kind of looked back and saw what we had been doing previously and we wanted to just keep it consistent. Yeah. I think my the previous planner had implemented that. Okay. Okay. But I think it was different
on some things and we just decided to stick with a straightforward 10,000. Okay. So it has been a few years at least, right? Yeah. I want to say about a year. A year. I know it's it's been a long year
though. Okay. Yeah. 13 main was 20,000. Larger site was a bigger larger, right? The larger the site. Yeah. Cuz I think we went off of county the county storage was 10,000 per acre. I think that was the one that one of the ones that we compared. Yes. So they actually didn't
follow through, but Right. Right. our post. So, could we move on if we just said, "Yeah, 10,000's agreeable and keep that as a condition." Is that So, so that was what your attorney sent to us as oo and but he removed uh the part that said um per acre. Yeah. To just the
10,000. So, as long as the board's in agreement, can we move on to the next? Is that okay? I'm okay with that. I'm fine. Y Yeah. Okay. So, uh the next item for discussion is number three. Um if the board wants inspections on the site. So this was the one that
pertains to um so your um attorney suggested he said I think no I changed to re review of the asbuilt plan. This is private property applicants engineer will be out on site during construction if the board wants
to specify what needs to be inspected and by whom I think it should be specified in the decision. So um the way it reads is the applicant shall provide a oh sorry wrong one. The applicant shall submit a check in the amount of $5,000 which will be held in a 53G account to pay for the review of the now
you have it as final as built plan prior to the endorsement of this decision or the issuance of a building permit. Um we did check with our peer review. So it's not just the aselt and they did um let us know that uh typical construction
observations we conduct for other communities include initial visit to ensure all erosion control measures are installed and operational prior to any construction. These would be monitored during subsequent visits. Uh observation of drainage installations bottom hole of
uh before systems are installed and then again prior to them being backfilled. We would observe structure and pipe installations, not every piece, but representative check check-ins. This is obviously specific to each project, but usually four to eight visits. Uh review of the subbase material prior to paving, review of binder course, pavement
install, review of top course, pavement in install, review of sidewalk, subbase prior to install, review of sidewalk paving install, inpavement and not concrete, and final punch list as built review. So those are the items. So it's not just the asbuilt that we would be
looking for and it would be um we'd be been using peer review to do those final review just um slight you know cuz I do also do work in a lot of other communities and it's not typically required on private sites to do that um
amount or um in-depth inspections of construction of private property. I mean, there's no we're not going to look for the town to accept the roadways or make any acceptance of this site in terms of the construction quality. So, I don't know why um we'd be held to
construction inspections from a independent peerreview engineer. Um so, so attorney Kussell's uh comment was this is up to the board whoever if inspections are required then reject the change. So that's what up to this board
whether or not um great. Yes. I mean yeah so you know what what we're saying back is you know I obviously hired a an engineer to go ahead design go through the peer review. We made the we made the changes. Now the engineer is going to go
out and in be inspecting the project. If board of health wants to come out and look at the bottom of the hole the drainage like he's the qualified guy to look at. So they wouldn't do it. That's why we would have our peer review do it. Yeah, but my point is is I'm already paying an engineer. Why? I Why would I It's in it's private. It's not like the town's going to be accepting this road
or anything like that, right? But I mean, obviously, you know, it's it's something that could create runoff or some other issues to abuing properties, etc. But where did the design? They're going to be as building the plan like condition of pavement. He's talking
about reviewing pavement course, sidewalk installations. Um it's all private if that's just to you know a plow mark in the pavement like that's my property like you know on a town road that's being accepted I've seen it before where a perm got messed up with
the PL it's really not applicable in this I don't believe that any private sites that I've heard of have had to this extent well oh you know yeah I mean it's not typical like I said I a lot of community
doesn't build a lot of development So it's it's it's not common place to to have these inspections as part of a site plan review. Um on on this is it is one of our standard conditions that we have been using. Yeah. Um
I don't know if anybody else has any. So this is just obvious this is checking the amount of the 5,000. you guys weren't you guys weren't I guess blocking at the 5,000 in the in the thing and for for for the engineer for our engine for our town engineer or town
um third party what we call it peer review I'm sorry um reviewing the as bills but was just going out and doing the inspections throughout so is yeah we we just because it is going to be remain private property and the condition of it is you know going to be important to Tim
and not the town we We didn't see the need or to pay a peerreview consultant to go out and that's make inspection of pipe installations, sidewalk installations. You're still putting the money. You guys, your well, your attorney didn't have an issue with us putting the money in an account for them
to review our as build. It's for the as the final, you know, so they could go out and say, "Yep, they did what they were supposed to like." So the drainage the drainage basin on this is huge. Like there's no way this drainage basin can get a huge a hole and then built. It's going to be
like built as it goes. And to have somebody keep coming out there, these guys are a mile down the road. They can come out any time to be able to do something like that. But that you know what I'm saying, Bob? With that drainage basement, it's going to be opened up, let's just say in 10t increments. They're going to build it. They're going
to do what they're going to do, and they're just going to continue like that because it's just that big. You cannot do that. And it's all sand. So, um I just don't see a need of paying two engineers when we already did go through all the peer review and everything and
then you know say you know he he's installing pipe or the the contractors and stuff like we have to call for an inspection and wait for the review engineer to come by at his at his it's fast moving and you know it just it's a project hold up.
Mhm. So what what happened on 13 Main Street cuz I know that none of that got done, right? Well, so there were there were discrepancies between um so yeah. So what? Well, we had another property which was a private property that was just completed was that even when we got
the asbuilt when we went out there, you know, there was there were there were discrepancies between what was on the asbuilt and what was actually in the field. Yeah. So again, I think the the intent of that the intent of this is to so that we could have the, you know, periodic inspections. Again, we're not
looking I know you're saying you're not paying them, but that, you know, I mean, there still will be some checks and balances that they're not going to see those inconsistencies with the eye when they're going out. I mean, I'm talking like levels of pipe and stuff like that. They're not going to see that till the asbuilt. The asbuilt is what's going to
tell the true story of the project. if they go out there and look at an open hole or look at the pipes in the ground, they have no idea at that point until the asbo's done and they review it at the end and know if there's an inconsistency. Right. But I think that's the problem. So if you have pipes put in and they're not the same pipes that were shown on the plans and then you have to
then what? Tear it up to put the right size pipes or Yeah. the location. But he's not going to know the location of the drainage when he goes out and looks at. He's going to look at pipe bedding and go, "Yeah, they're installing the ads 12-in pipe that we said and it's bedded correctly and it's installed, but
they're not going to know location. It's not going to be surveyed. They're not they're going to they're going to be in the same boat that that we are in the installer. We'll give the as needed survey layout to the installer and and the drainage repeating the right thing." The thing So the thing is So I'm sorry.
So you're the engineer for the applicant, right? So peer review works for the town. Okay. So to make sure that it's all done as it should be and so there have been problems where the asbuilts are not what is there. So that
is something that we're looking to create correct by creating conditions like this that help ensure that what is in the ground. Yeah. Exactly. what was approved, what's in the ground matches what's the asbuilt. So that's why we
have to have the peer review do it. We can't just have the the engineer do it. If I if I may, if I may have, right, the the the final as built, right, the final as built will show the location of the drainage structures. It will show the location of the piping. It will show the peer review still has to go out and
verify. They won't know the location when they're standing out there. That that's by survey. They're not going to know if the pipe is slightly off by a foot, if it's at the wrong elevation. Not until the asill. Not until the asbill. That stuff will get picked up on the final. They wouldn't pick that up prior. They would they won't go out and
do a pavement inspection and say, "Oh, um there's 3 in of pavement there." That what does that do? That that you know, that's one of the things they're saying they're going to inspect. They're going to inspect sidewalk construction. Um all that stuff. Well, those were examples of of items that they would check. Well,
that's what they listed as the inspections, right? Um, the final asbuilt will show the parking space locations. It'll show the lighting. It'll show it'll show all the things that we came in front of the planning board for approval for and and they'll be able to check that they're, you know, consistent with the
plan and and that and then that then the peer review, we're okay with a peer reviewer looking at the as they didn't, you know, they they didn't do this, right? But so what happens when they come out the end? Yep. and the asbuilt doesn't match what was approved. Are you guys going to rip it up? Well, well,
they're not So, so they're going to say they make a pavement inspection, they're going to go out and they're going to check the thickness of the They're going to check the location of the curb. They're not going to make sure that we have the the required number of parking spaces because it won't be striped. You can't tell that stuff until final as
they're not going to we still need peer review to review the asel. Understood. then we agree we're fine with that. We're fine with that. And then you can say, "Hey, this this is differs in this way and and how do we deal with it if it if there are any differences?" You know, cuz that's going to happen regardless if the
inspections along the way. They'd never picked they'd never pick up those in. I also believe it's it's for them to go out and and verify that items are in are being installed in order cuz I you know part of it that they have to what prior to the endorsement of the decision of
the issuance of a building permit, right? That was the the idea. So a final as I mean that can't happen because we need a building permit before all the site work could get done clearly. Oh, no. But they're saying the check has to
be issued. Prior uh the require prior to yeah prior Yeah. So the final final as bill before we issue before a permit gets issued which it's not even the money. It's the it's the timing and the and the and and and
I'm just don't see what it adds to the board. It's not going to it's not going to pick up any inconsistencies between the design plan and the finished product. So I think that's a matter of opinion because as we've mentioned that the we have recently experienced discrepancies,
right? But did they pick that up in the intermediate inspections? No, but but some of it some of it I'm just think I'm sorry. So I I'm just thinking back you mean again I don't know if it's the inspections but I mean he made that he made a good point because it wasn't during those because they missed those
inspections and that's why we they've picked it up at the asbelt and that's why now we have to go through and have peer review go back and review all those items. So I feel like it's a benefit to you to have these done before it's really not I understand I understand what you're
saying but it's really you know we're going to do it right. I mean, this is it's my bill. It's not. Yeah. I mean, we're going to make sure it's done correctly. Yeah. Um, and they need to stamp the plan saying they did it correctly. And then at the end of the day, the ASB bill gets passed into the
peer review. Peer review says, "This is off. Why is it off?" You know? Right. Right. And yeah, if that it's just I don't think the inspections they listed, those intermediate inspections in any way
could pick up any inconsistencies that are going to be for the final design. Now, if they go out and count the number of chambers in the infiltration area or something like that and check for, you know, things, they can see subsurface stuff that that maybe wouldn't be shown
otherwise. But do we have a list of the what are what we have down as the required inspections? Well, that's what this email from from Cathy. That's what they typically do, right? But what's well what we what we meant by when it was when it was written into our conditions. I was wondering this was a
typical construction observations, right? So, so I read off the list. No, I understand. But so I'm a mechanical engineer by trade, right? I do jobs. We do site visits periodically during construction to see if things are
because when you get to the end and they're doing a final punch list. Yeah. Realizing that the pipe there's no hangers on the pipe doesn't help you. But I have a question that for your client or do you have a peer review come out and check your work? Well, no. Cuz we're the we're the we're the engineers, but we're not the town. But the town
doesn't have engineers, right? But we're coming out because the contractors are installing it. Yeah. And that's what you're doing. That's what we do. We'd as built the drainage systems. We'd make sure in the right location. It's exact same doing the checks and balances, making sure the checks and balances, right? But but for building inspections,
the town will still come out. You still have to do a rough inspection and then you have to do a final inspection for for your trades, right? Correct. For buildings, right? You can't you can't go beyond you can't wall up your walls or put up your ceilings until your rough inspection, your inall inspection. So, how do we know what's under your site if
you're not installing it if we're not looking at it during Well, that's why we said like an open hole. the board of health who's who's a soil evaluator in town comes out and looks at the open hole. When I tell you that this thing is as big as this parking lot here, it needs to be done in phases. I don't need B& to be on the clock standing there
watching the guys dig every 10 ft and put chambers in and do that like and I I don't I don't think the and Madam Chair, if you will, I don't I don't think the the intent of of the inspections is to hold up your schedule saying that we're coming out here. We can't come out for
another two weeks. You have to wait for us. I think the idea is that we're you're holding it there for that if we if the board or if the town requires those inspections to be done that that that check is in there to cover that cost for peer review for them to go up to do the required inspections. Now, I
know you guys didn't block at you didn't block at the price of it. You just you blocked at when they're being done. Required inspections will be the final as build. Right. Right. Right. Right. Because because we felt, you know, that the idea was to make sure we build what what you what you know what? No. And I
No, and I I understand you're you have to prov provide like an affidavit or, you know, construction control. Right. Right. Yes. It's it seems silly for me to pay two engineers to do the same thing. I I don't have no problem with them reviewing that as build at the end.
I can pay for that and that shouldn't be 10 $5,000. But if the guy's going out there making however many inspections, pavement and stuff, that's I'm paying two engineers to do the same thing, guys. And then at the end of the day, nothing's going to get picked up honestly until the as the end if they say the grades are this and that. And
that's what I'm paying him to do or or you know, that's all I'm saying. Like, you know, we installed 12 spaces and we have 11 spaces or, you know, things like that or lighting was supposed to be installed here and it's not or but it's
not. So I mean the way I see it if we we can we can go this route we can we can keep it as as you have it but if something comes up like you're kind of kicking the can down the road. So Oh yeah. Like that's I feel as Yeah. We
just make sure that they're going to have to take that as votes and if something's found at the end that has to go back and cause fold up then that's I mean Yeah. Yeah. Of course. Another suggestion is to leave it as it says with inspections and
whittle the list down of like specify the inspections what you want. What I'd rather this seems kind of that's what I meant by that was like when we wrote that was there was there a list that we already had and try to maybe get it within that five I mean I don't think we
should 5,000 you know what can you do for that? No choice. Mhm. That's just my I I you know I know everyone thinks it's like easy and it's simple but you know most people are cashing in their retirements to do something like this and I don't need to pay two engineers
for it guys. I mean if if you if you make me I don't think I have a choice but it just doesn't make sense to me. I think the ass built at the end. If there's something wrong Bob says Tim pipes off a foot then we then then we have to own it. You know you guys are holding it. I ain't getting an accuracy
till it's right. We're going to be doing that. you guys own it. And we're going to be doing those as builts of the of the drainage system while he's building before it's back clearly. So, we're going to know at that point if there's an issue and Tim will be able to modify
and rectify it prior to things like paving and stuff like that, you know, he wants a parking lot that's going to last and it's to his benefit. The drainage. The drainage would be a big one to review. But I mean, are we do you want
to go through this list and pick out the items that we want to make sure I think that would be a good are included or do we want to drain the one that I actually may have the problem with because that's Yeah, that's where you got a little bit more substantial. No, I mean, you know, like Bob's going to be doing the asill.
I we can't be sitting on site waiting for someone to come show up and say, "Okay, we can continue on with the project." I mean, it it's real. I'm not just, you know. No, no, no. I No, no, no. I understand that. I'm just I mean, I don't think we should make it difficult for these guys.
We are trying to clean an ugly site. Let's not forget that. No. And I I have nothing against this project. I just want to make sure that it's correctly. I don't want to I don't want to give you uh too much leeway and then have the next person, you know, who's No, but we
know that we own that. We own it. There's a problem. Which specific did we have a problem with on 13 Main Street? Well, I mean, I don't really want to get into it. There was a there was a list, but I mean, we've seen the punch. So, I think we should, Madam Chair, focus on
the items that Kathy had specified. We can go over them and then cuz we have to move on here. There's more stuff here. I know there's a lot to get through this. This is probably the bigger bigger ones. Um, we've got the initial visit. The last
six out the last six. Well, I already did. Oh, you did? Okay. But that should be okay. Right. Was that the last six items really shouldn't be the problem once? It's the first two, right? Right. Cuz Yep. But he's saying that the
drainage is the one that they have the biggest um issue. I mean pavement I don't need I don't need an engineer on site watching my paper guys put it down you know cost pavement yeah if if they call for three inches and they happen to do two and 3/4 it's not up road right I'm not saying I'm going to say can we save a quarter inch but right and Tim
Tim Tim Tim Tim Tim Tim Tim Tim Tim Tim Tim Tim Tim Tim Tim Tim Tim Tim Tim Tim Tim has to he wants to own this parking lot a long time and keep it in place so it's to his benefit to uh to to build it accordance with the spec Yeah. So I think I don't what the first one the initial visit to ensure that all
erosion control measures are installed. Mhm. I mean couldn't that be of health? Yeah. And not only that, but that's Tim's subject to a storm water pollution prevention plan that we've already filed with the EPA. All those construction have to be measured in place with a report this
thick that documents that. Yeah. I'm there's no wetlands nearby. Is that you know? Yeah. I'm like if there was wetlands, it would be the conservation agencies out there. I mean, there's nothing here. My neighbors are my neighbors love me. They're like can't wait until this gets done. I don't know
the last project that my neighbors hold on. Let Let the board just have a little time to to I'm not Madam Chair, like I'm not opposed to how they wrote it. Obviously, like you'd said, it's kind of on them, but I think maybe moving forward, we
definitely have to come up with a list of inspections, right? Um that would be required. Um do we need to go back with them? No, I mean this is so this is coming for Bills and Thomas. This is who we you know one of the um peer review that we
have been using. And this isn't you know just for Lakeville. It's for other communities as well. These are the items that they typically include. Yeah. Um they they make a lot of their money based on peer reviews.
Yeah. Well, I mean I know the next town over we got a project. So is the board okay with the final as built or do you want to pick out a few of these items right now that we want to make sure that someone's on site for or
how do you feel? Um, I'm going to ask John based on his engineering expertise because this is a unique situation. So, John, I kind of relying
on your expertise on this. Dave, you got any thoughts on this for this situation? Yeah. No, I mean I I think again the erosion control measures, right? But I guess that's like we said that's everything. that's like it's going to be throughout. But again, the initial ones to have them installed
and then I know the the drainage, but we again I I know what he's saying like you don't want to be held up by like waiting for peer review. I don't know how that how we Yeah, we would observe navigate that to structure and pipe installations. I mean
to show and I think that's the problem. Say that again. So for instance on number two we would observe structure and pipe installations. They've got their guys on site starting it and we're they're waiting for our people to come and and
oversee it. Right. Okay. So let me just interject here. So number eight number eight already says the applicant shall notify the planning department in writing by email two or more working days prior to the following construction milestones. commencement of on of work on site, installation of storm water management facilities, installation of
trees and other landscaping fe features prior to the final paving of the parking lot and drives and substantial completion of work. Um if if they're if we're already asking them to notify us at these time frames, wouldn't it make sense to have you
get inspections at those times, right? Within those 48 hours. But I don't think you know that I don't think that it's necessary for the landscaping for them to be there or um when you know
commencement I think maybe the cuz but the storm water once again and then final paving. Yeah, maybe if we could even on the stormwater if they say, you know, they can do the bottom of hole inspection upon the initial, you know,
installation. Mhm. To make sure we're in the correct soils and were in agreement with us, which we'll be doing and then But it's going to be done in phases. And do they have to come back three times? Well, it's going to be multiple times like you said, like the piping's going. There's a lot of piping. So, you want to
piping issues. You know what I'm saying? One inspection. feasible. That's all we're saying. If they make if they want to come out, look at the open hole. Yeah. Again, that's what you know, we're in two weeks, we're doing a perk out there to verify those soils with the board of health agent. And just, you know, it's all sand out there. It's all
sandy soils. So, there's really no worry with that either, but the board of health agent. John, do they have to review all of these paving projects? I mean, I mean, it seems like that could be a I
like we have done in other facilities, but it's usually when it's roads and they before we're going to release lots, we have them go out there and do a peer review, but we're not we're not doing that, right? Like it's not to hold back and that not a public road, right? Well, even when it's a private road, still we still hold it back. So, the camps were
lost until the until like the store management and and the roads are in installed. Um, yeah, those those roads all have the possibility to be accepted by the town one day. Mhm. So that No, not not the private one. Not the private one, but there is other homeowners that
are going to be buying lots on that. So you guys are ensuring that the homeowners, the unsuspecting homeowners buying that lot is okay. This is just singular site and private. All right. Should we try to move on to this one? This is Yeah, let's let's move over a little bit. Going in a circle. Yeah.
Okay. Um, so number eight is the next one. um change by writing to email which there's no issue with but then uh what is substantial completion compared to completion? Um was the question from Amy
Quessle because uh their attorney inserted the word substantial completion. So what is what what is the difference between substantial and completion? What is he intending? I think maybe you know one case is say it's um Tim finishes the job up and it's
January 13th and he wants to get occupancy but they can't um I don't even know if this one applies can't install trees at that point because yeah landscaping can't we're probably in that timeline where we're going to be ready to occupy in the winter potentially and
landscaping just can't get done clearly but that's what the charity is there for I'm assuming right so that's that was just uh is nearly private. But yeah, and I don't I don't think that this one is that if you don't want to. Yeah, but you're you're only just emailing us anyways. You're not a big deal whether we he attorneys.
Okay. So, are you okay with leaving that out or because it's not you're just emailing us telling us that you're done? Yeah. Yeah. I may find you. So, I mean, I'm done. I want my money back.
Yeah. Yeah. Right. Right. So instead of substantial completion, let us know when it's complete. Yeah. Because substantial is left uh up to interpretation, right? So we'll remove that. Um all right. The next item
10. Um discussion adding no limitations for inside work inside of the building is not planning board's jurisdiction. So we can't add that. Um and then so we we could add construction of the site shell
uh of the site only only as opposed to the interior. So site only we can put site only shall be limited to 7:00 a.m. to 5:00 p.m. Monday through Friday. Maybe put exterior on that cuz site is interior. Well this no the site site
site only. So, we're only our perviews only site work. We don't inside the building. This has nothing to do with inside the building other than saying you need to get a building permit. Yeah. Yeah. Um I know you're saying I don't think it'll hold this won't hold you up. But again, the the hours the work hours
will have to be taken up with the building department. Well, so I mean we have the Yeah, because this construction hours are 7 to 5 Monday through Friday, 8 to 4 Saturdays and no work on Sundays and federal holiday federal and state holidays. So
um yeah so we can't insert what uh your attorney there had inserted about the work inside but we can include the word construction of the site can we put can we can we can we put construction of the site work only site work better building
no I mean the job site's the job site construction of the site work site work okay site work yeah site work exterior building okay exterior building exterior site work Yes. Yes. Do you want to add that word? Exterior because exterior is what's going to be bothering people, right? So exterior, even if you want to
add that, Kathy, exterior site work only. Take out that then take out what extra wording. Okay. 11. Um, okay. So now this this one I can probably add some clarity to to get so we don't get
too involved. Th this we probably I think the attorney thought maybe we would have to do some grass basins or something, but I don't think there's going to be any landscaping or anything that's going to hold us up. This is um that the storm water shall be functional prior to occupancy permit.
Okay. So So now I have a I So we have an issue with this. So that'll be you had do you have our conditions? We're fine with 13 I think. But no, no. So, so, so we can't do it as it's as it's written. Do you have the original conditions that were sent to you? I do.
Yeah. Okay. So, number 11 has been has been removed. Yeah. Yeah. And and instead you are given going with 13, but the problem is for your 13 um you're saying prior to final occupancy, but we can't so we can't hold occupancy. Yeah.
Um, so 11 actually makes more sense to keep it and just add storm water management system to it because it says all drainage facilities associated structures including pipe blooming seating shall be completed to the satisfaction of the planning board prior to the issuance of any building permit
unless appropriate shity is agreed upon which is sufficient to complete the infrastructure and that is what we have been going with. So if you're not able to do those items and you put the shity in place, but but let let's go over that. It says all the drainage has to be
in all drainage facilities or shity. So that's why you put the shity down because we can't hold an occupancy permit. So the shy talked about in item number two is the shy that's mentioned in here. So, this is a shy to complete all of those items,
which what we've been doing is we'll get a a a number from peer review. They'll give us that number and then for a building permit. Well, I mean, we can't hold an occupancy permit. So, no, it's saying building permit. I can't do that. No, no, no, no. So, number 13 though,
you're looking. So, that's why I'm saying you guys got rid of 11, but we can't go with 13 because you're asking for us to withhold the final occupancy. 13 is okay. 13. 13. But it's not okay. It's not okay with you. That's what I'm
saying is you guys have changed 13. No, we're not going to modify 13. We're going to get you. You're going to You're going to wave what your attorney had wrote. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. He thought we might have to do some landscaping or something. Think of the looming and seating being done before I get a building permit. That means the final
coat's on the parking lot. I can't be building a building with the final coat on the parking lot because you're not going to do the looming and seating until the final and every Yeah, that's all I'm saying. And before you can even start construction of the building 11 saying you have to have all the storm water in including looming and seating.
Yeah, that that that comment that that just doesn't but that's why if it's not done that's why you have the option for the shity. But that's before you get a building permit to start construction of the site. Yeah. Yeah. I think if it's an occupy it'd be a little different, right? I mean,
that's a that's just going into applying for a building permit with a building permit plans. Yeah. But so Tim would have to build the whole site and not know if he's going to get a building permit. Yeah, there you go. Perfect example. Well, issuance Well, I guess yeah, the issuance of any building permit. Um,
yeah. I just I mean that that that's that just that that it doesn't make sense. No, I can't imagine that was the way the way it's worded or the the structure of it because it's saying you have to install all the storm water facilities,
all looming and seating has to be done prior to going and applying for a building. That means all my landscaping is done and everything obviously you guys understand. So you won't be doing any site work before you'll apply for a building permit. We will we will be but you know
the looming and seating certainly not going to No. So the looming and that and that's fine. Some of the drainage may not be done like if the building comes in. No, but I mean that that the idea was that you would you're just we're looking for the shity that way that we know you're going to finish. Well, you're going to build the entire site.
Yeah, that's so the sh that number. If you can't well some the site might some you know I mean again it's the intent is that if you can't if you you know to build the site yes but if you can't then you have to have that charity in there so that way that that we know you're coming back to do it right
wait but this is a building permit that's not issuing permit he can't pave until he puts the stormware stuff in right but the building commission does not want us withholding an occupancy permit we can't hold on we can't but if it's not paved so you guys building
that's why it's the shity as opposed to a building permit. But say the say the site's not paved. Well, it won't be paved potentially, but well, so what if he Yeah, it's just um in and the bills and Thomas comes in and says it's $100,000 to pave this site. We want $100
grand because it's not paved to get it. No, they're not going to No, you could you could obviously challenge something that's ridiculously overpriced. What if it was $100,000? It's going to be a very What if it is $100,000 $100,000? I got to put that money in shity before I get a building permit. Before I can get money from a bank. You understand what
I'm saying? I need a building permit. Guys, you guys are by by that comment. The planning board is withholding a building permit. Are we asking for not only withholding the entire site or just the drainage? All drainage facilities associated structures including pipe looming and seating shall be completed
to the satisfaction of the planning board prior to the issuance of any building permits unless the appropriate charity is agreed upon and sufficient to complete the infrastructure. It's not the paving. We're not looking you to put money up for the paving. But how do you loom and seed with the paving? Here's the thing, guys. To lumen seed, you pave
everything first. You don't Right. But you have But I Yeah, there you go. You you don't loom and see pavement. No, but you can't loom and see up against the pavement, though. That's the That's You got to put You got to set all your curb. Everything has to be done before you loom. Yeah. So, here's the thing. So, we
So, building time out. Time out. Okay. So, number 21. I think it's a mistake. Is it has to do with landscaping and council had um said that there should be a time
requirement and I think 6 months is a fair one for that. And that has to do with the 6 months from occupancy I'm assuming or within 6 months of uh most likely occupy, right? No. Well, so it wouldn't
be completed prior to issuance of an occupancy permit. Yeah. Yes. Within 6 months of occupancy. Yeah, that's fair. Yes. Like cuz if we get done in January, we can't Right. I'm fine with that. So, I feel like number 21 takes away
that your your problem with the um no landscaping part of it. It just it says in number 11 that we can't a building permit until it's loom and seated. But it's the it's the drainage facilities is is what drainage facilities drainage
facility and associated structures including piping looming and seating. Anything associated with the drainage. Oh, it says looming. So that's when you're saying looming associated with the drainage. But guys, it the fear, okay, going to put in, let's just say
it's a $300,000 drainage system, which it's close to that much, right? It's going to be that much and then I don't get a building permit. It doesn't make sense. Yeah. But but the the shy is that you're going to put the drainage, right? So you're working on the site work. You're going to put the drainage facilities in. You don't get a chance to
do the looming and seating, but you have to put a shy up to so that you're going to come back and actually do that later. We're not asking for the SH the rest of it. I love I love where your thoughts happen. But that's what we wrote, but that's what we have. Drainage not being in without a building permit. You don't
get money from banks without a building permit is my point. They're not going to give you a a money on a site. So without money, there's no shy that can be put up because you need money from a bank to do this. I think it's a misprint with the building permit. Occupacy makes the most
sense. I understand you can't hold up but the as bill comes in correct in the in the as built is reviewed. Yeah, but you can't get occupy before that that's reviewed. Am I correct? Substituting the word building permit for occupancy. It just it just it doesn't it doesn't work
with the sequencing of construction and like and Tim I mean you must you're in the business you understand like you can't go get money from a bank without a building permit. That's like if you ever built your own house it's not happening right not happening. It's it's it's something that's impossible. That was
the one I seen and I was like, this is obviously a misprint because it makes no sense whatsoever. Okay, so I'm going to circle 113. We'll come back to that. Number 17. Um, all signs installed on site shall comply with the Lakeville sign bylaw unless zoning relief is obtained from the applicable municipal
authority. They added unless zoning relief is obtained from the applicable municipal authority. Um, that was already mentioned during our previous discussion. Mhm. Is that okay with on everybody on the board? Yeah. Okay. 17's
okay. Number 19. Um planning board or its designate during regular business hours shall be permitted to enter the site within 48 hour written notice which consent not unreasonably denied or delayed and until asbill plans are reviewed by the board's
engineer in order to conduct site inspections as may be required by this decision. Um the only uh item was uh instead of unreasonably denied or delayed, uh if
we could just have that as one business day because I don't know what unreasonably denied or delayed is, but one business day would at least take into account any weekends or Mhm. or something along those lines. So, replace
um with consent you guys. Yeah. With uh within one business day um and until as plans are reviewed by board's engineer. Okay. All right. Uh so that's
19. Number 20. of great ex excavation for all new storm water management basins and or storm water recharge systems shall be inspected by the board of health agent or designate of the planning board prior to the placement of the required fill material and or finish surface material. We wouldn't ask the
board of health agent to do that. Um but the town our town council um recommends designate a planning board which would that's consistent with um what we have been doing with Mhm.
peer review. Mhm. So we're removing inspected by the board of health. Correct. And changing it to Disney of the planning board. Yeah. Yes. Which is for the bottom of the hole. Yeah. of the of the of the storm of the
great excavation of all the storm water management basins andor storm water recharge systems the open hole right above yeah prior to the replacement of the required uh fill material and our finished surface
material okay uh 21. All construction shown on the site plan excluding landscaping unless otherwise noted must be completed uh prior to the issuance of an occupancy permit. This is the one that we kind of jump to. And instead of saying excluding
landscaping, it should be including because you're getting that density bonus based off of landscaping and design. Uh so we do need to make sure that landscaping and that's the one we just talked about that with the six months within six months. Exactly. So
must be complet must be within 6 months of occupancy permit. Okay. 21. Yeah, that's plenty of options. Um 24. Any proposed changes from the improved site plan or additional site
work deemed substantial by the board uh building commissioner shall be presented for review by the planning board. The board shall determine if there is a need for a public hearing and shall then act accordingly on the changes. approved revisions shall be illustrated um on the asbelt plan to be submitted to the
board. Um but we don't want to if it's substantial, we don't want to see it on the asbelt. We want to set we want a new set of plans. If it's minor, it can be on the asbuilt, but if it's major, then it would be on a new set of plans so that we make sure that what's on file is what's there. Okay.
Is is everyone okay with that? Okay. So minor on the asbelt. Um, anything major would be a set of plans. Yeah. So, minor on the asbelt and then any any any major would be another
public hearing type. Well, a new set of plans to be reviewed. Okay. Not a public hearing. Not a public hearing. Not unless it, you know, not unless something comes up from another board that requires you to change the site plan. It come back for Yeah. It already says that if it's substantial, then we could determine whether or not it needs
to be a public hearing. [Music] So you're okay with that minor on the asbelt, but if it's a major substantial um change. Yeah.
So again, it's it's going to be any proposed changes from the approved site plan or additional site work deemed substantive substantive by the building commissioner. Okay. Oh, okay. By the shall be presented for review by the planning board. So if the building commissioner comes back and says, "Hey, this needs to go back in front of the planning board." He flags it. Yeah.
Anything else over 20 in, we don't you don't need to come back and just put whatever you ask. It's just that if he comes back and says, the building commissioner comes back and says, you know, so you're okay with that one? Yeah. Yeah. By the building commissioner. All right. 25. They wanted
to delete it because there's no wetlands. Makes sense. Yeah. I'm okay with that. Y uh 26. Uh so it seems okay. There was nothing from town council on this one. I'm not going to read the whole thing.
Um so we're okay with that though. The board. Yeah. So is it by a So it's just changing. No, she I thought she had a comment on this one. Was that the other one? Um that's 13. Um deleted the certified uh by a registered
professional board and building commissioner prior to the issuance of the final. Yes. Well, for the last unit or commercial space. So they may not get a certificate of occupancy on that space for you know if you don't if you don't they don't get if they don't get a
CO on that last on the last unit of their seven units right seven units 14 if 14 units yeah I'm sorry what I'm sorry about that yeah um the 14 units would that so we're just holding back the the final as we don't have to get the as the last unit or commercial space
and release of any remaining final shity so um oh and Okay. And the release of the unit. So then we'd have to get a letter from the issuance of in regards to the as blast unit commercial space and the
release. All right. Um, so I mean everything I read is from their attorney. So as long as the board's okay with it. Town council didn't have any. Okay. Yeah. She made comment of the other one where was last and versus first, but that's fine. I'm fine. She had no issues. Yeah, maybe I'm
reading it wrong, but yeah, I'm fine with that one. Okay. Um 27. Um is that gone? Yeah, that one's gone. That's It seems straightforward. It was um Yeah, because
this talks about any deficiencies and this is one that I think we had added in for a specific project and it doesn't really not necessarily then it might really remain with a right. Okay. So 27 28 any release of the performance guaranteed by the planning board due to
substantial completion does not constitute final approval. Um this basically just um any items fully completed would constitute it.
Okay. [Music] Although we should probably add portion of the performance guarantee. So if if so any release of the performance guarantee by the planning board due to
um release of portion of the shity does not constitute final approval. uh due to substantial completion does not con Yes. This is any release with a performance guarantee by the planning board due to substantial completion does not constitute final approval. So if we
only partially what? Yeah. So even a portion. So it's so we want it to say um any release or a portion of as well for 28. So if we release a portion of it, it's not saying that it's
complete. You can put that any release of the performance guarantee, partial or full. Yeah. By the planning board discussed the landscaping if you had to hold some till that was complete. Right. Okay. So 28. Are you okay with that
adding? Okay. Um 29. The applicant shall provide proof of recording at the Plymouth County Registry of Deeds of this decision and approved site plan uh to the planning board prior to start of
construction. Um so the the um the question we have there is the site plan recording, you know, the the plans were drawn as site plans. They're not they don't meet registry standards for recording. They're not like a form A or a subdivision plan. So they're really
not meant to be recorded plans. We we do have a block for endorsement by the board on here, but do you typically require applicants record the site plans at the registry? Yeah, we do. We do. Originally, they had
it you had it on a myar and then for 43 Main Street, you did vote to allow but they just had so many instead of having them do so many myar they were able to just do it myar. We we're fine with a myar but submitted to the board. But the
question is does it get recorded at the registry because our plans are in color? They get they got recorded. Okay. Yeah. Okay. All right. So, you're okay with that? Well, I mean, like I said, we the plans weren't drawn to meet registry
standards, but um they they're in color. They they don't you know, they want black and white plans, you know. So, um Oh, they're in color. My Yeah, our plan, most modern plans are in color, but the registry still records black and white copies. So,
um and I think we're just changing it to replace accompanying plan with approved site plan to make sure you're record, you know, recording approved. Um is that a problem? It's just standard. No, I I don't know. I don't know that the register record. You need a
recording block on the plan on each plan. They're not they're not meant to be recorded. I'm unsure how what other plans were. Never heard like but Kathy, you know better, I guess. Well, like you said, it's a new new process, but we definitely cut the myars in for the 43
Main Street. They did discuss that and you did vote to let them do a paper copy, right? But you can't they can't record paper copy at the register. They said they said they could. That I don't know. paper copy can't be recorded. You need a
registry block. You need a statement that it complies with the registry standards. And they they don't. The text has to be all a certain size. It wasn't just the form get recorded, right? Obviously, it was right. And I'm not saying it was recorded, but that was the intent that
they were going to go record it. I can not right. Like, does that make sense? I don't Well, I mean, because I don't want to reddraft our plans to to, you know, meet registry standards. I don't want you to either. It's like Yeah. No, you don't. No.
All right. Well, so there seems to be an issue with All right. So, three to four. Can we circle back to where was 3 11 13 and 29 three. I mean I mean we're back to as third. I'm I'm kind of okay with the final
asbuilt plan, but it's up I don't know. It's up to the rest of the board. That's my Yeah. I mean, like I said, to me, it's kind of like kicking the can down the road. If there are an issue or issues found at the end, then Yeah, it's on them, I guess.
Jack. Yeah. Yep. Okay. So warned. Yeah, it just it gets picked up as it goes though. So I understand. I appreciate it though. And then 11 and 13. All right. So that that that was the one we're going back
between like which one gets in, which one, right? Because it's occupancy permit and building permit and um installation of the various. So 11 would seem applicable to like a subdivision where they're putting in a roadway. They have to install the road,
the drainage, whatever they don't install. They want to make sure the road gets built, it gets final payment. They typically hold shies or bonds. Very good point on that. So when you're building a commercial site and it's all built together, it's like it's like saying
that you have to install the septic and do all the do all the landscaping and put in the driveway to a residential house before you go and get a building permit for the house. Yeah, I think that so you know obviously when you're putting on a road in there's a reason why they hold shity at the drainage in and everything like that cuz they're
going to be you guys are leasing lots and these are going to be sold to unsuspecting homeowners or builders. So in this aspect the way I see this is once we get an approval here now I'm able to get my final set of plans from the guys and submit for the building
department for approval for a building permit. So the bank will now work with us. Without any of that, the bank doesn't work with you. I mean, I think I kind of see their point. No, but the problem is that we can't hold the occupancy from that. So,
but the as right. Sorry. Yeah. You have to review the asuilt and approve the as before I can get an occupancy. So, that checks that balance right there. So, but number 13 was in there, right? So, our original number 13 said storm water management system shall
be right. Installed. Installed. I can't tell what what they changed. Deleted soil. Well, we're fine with your original. The storm water management system shall be functional. Soil stabilized, rip wrap installed, basins rest, etc. prior to an oxygen permit
being issued for the structures. No problem. That's fine. Yeah. Well, and then you also had the last unit. No, we're going to get rid of everything in 13. But we're going to stick with your original number 13. If we get rid of number 11,
11 is not possible. 11. That means you you go review this. So they want to just go back to number 13 that we originally had. Yes. Yes, please. Okay. What's the I'm trying to find the original. Yeah. I hope you understand exactly what we're talking about with
that. Like I think it's more meant for road construction if it was like doing a whole industrial type or something like that you know. Yeah. Or just like a residential room. Yeah. Structure. So the storm water management system shall be functional soil stabilized rip wrap
installed basins grass etc. Obviously, it's subscri to an occupancy permit being issued for the structures for the building structures. Yeah, that is that's that's all obvious. That's that's no problem, right? Yes. Mhm. All right.
Cuz that means I have to have pavement down all that. So, all that would need to be done. So, 11 is out, 13 is in. Yeah, I think I and I'll say we probably have to like maybe um be
more not descriptive but something or maybe again maybe we have to look at what one's for for roads and one's for private. I understand I know so when you said that it makes more sense. We have a set of conditions for subdivision versus site plan. So this it's not our subdivision. Yeah. Did did the word
occupancy permit get changed to building permit? Cuz that would make sense. That's what made sense actually cuz that other one Oh, I thought the other one was on the subdivision. I think that just combination of time on that. Yeah, cuz we had to go the one. Okay. All
right. Um, so three is resolved, 1113's resolved, and the last one is 29. Um, 29. Yeah, because you were talking about the recording of the site. Oh, yeah. Um ah I mean I'm just I'm I'm I'm
fearful that they won't allow or above redraft the whole No, you do have to I I would have to put on a registry block. I would have to put on a signature that complies. There's certain text heights that it's only black and white. You know, things just our plans weren't drawn to be recorded. So which ones get
recorded? The ones that we signed, right? Are supposed to be the ones? The ones that we signed. So again, this is like a new thing. So, I know um like an ANR and a subdivision because you're dividing the land that has to stay in the registry like forever. Um but this
has been new like I I didn't know we've had it them do it on a myar but because of the the scope of how large 43 Main Street was, they asked if they could do a regular plan and said that they could record a regular plan. I mean that I
don't know. They do have to but we so site plan and recording with the registry of deeds is a new all together is all together new for this. Yes. Okay. For this what this board I've done hundreds of site plans and I've never recorded one at the registry from from
everything from targets to restaurants to shopping. I have to say I've never heard I Yeah. I'm sorry. what was done in the past. Like I said, this is a new new but they
used to still submit a myar for review. Yes. Like for hiding they did a myar. I have no problem submitting a myar. I will submit a myar to you guys and get it signed and have the signature block and make copies and digital copies. I just can't record it at the registry.
Yeah. Okay. without without significant changes to the plants and but is typically the myar isn't that usually what's been recorded for five hiding yes that's what was done they recorded with the registry do they give us a they give us
the proof of that I don't believe I I'm not sure of that cuz they haven't uh started that project Yeah. How are you? Isn't the plan that you guys endorse that you sign, isn't that like what
holds us to building? Yeah. I mean, and you'll have a copy in your records. We'll have a copy in our records. You'll obviously keep the copy. There'll be a copy at the building department. It'll be I mean, we have to stay consistent. And even though this is new, but the re the reason we have these new
implementations in place is because there have been issues in the past. So we have to rectify those issues. And so if we're requiring another site plan review that we've already just gone through this past year and they had to
do it, then it we shouldn't be going back and now saying, "Okay, now you don't have to." I don't know. It's not. I agree. But like I said, I've done hundreds of site plans in different communities, including this one, and never record
never recorded a plan. You would have probably did it differently if we'd known that. Does that make sense at all? Yeah, it'd be drawn like a subdivision plan. There'd be registry blocks and recording spaces and blank registry recording. We can't table this, right?
Because I was going to say someone the attorney Quest I mean at this point we could we could make it an approval. Yeah. With the edits that we've discussed this evening. Yeah. And we
could include 29 for we could we could just say that you know we have pending uh review from town council on this I guess and we'll just ask her because now you're you're saying that um
cuz even like your attorney came back and said the applicant shall provide proof a recording at the Plymouth County Registry of Deeds of this decision and approved site plan. Like that was what he added. So now you're saying
Well, yeah, that that that was the attorney, not me. I I I didn't I didn't think we were going to put the site plan. I thought that the recording of the decision I completely understand, which is common. Mhm. Um because like my confusion is that, you
know, your attorney sent this back. Yep. In all, I thought that we were we were just changing it from saying, you know, accompanying plan of land to approve site plan with some of these deletions. I mean, um actually that was from the other the other one, but yes. So 29 was just a
change in accompanying plan of land to approve. Approve site plan. Yeah. Cool. So, um, so our town council hasn't even reviewed the fact that you're you're saying you don't want to do this. Well, I don't want to hold things up.
So, I mean, I'm fine. Put it in there. We'll we'll make them recordable, but Okay. Okay. So, then 29 is okay. As noted as with the change that to the approved site plans as opposed to accompanying plan of land. So, Madam Chair, it's not specifically in the
bylaw. So then that would be your decision on that. Okay. But like I said, I don't want to I wouldn't want to take this out because they're saying they don't like I said cuz their attorney sent it as this and this is what town council has. Attorney's not an engineer
typically like obviously the decision is not a problem. I guess again I don't know enough about it but I I defer to Bob. Yeah. I mean well it's not the fee to record it guys. It's just if it's Yeah. It's the fee to redo the whole
set. I mean, yeah, but at least you have everything and you if if it's just a matter of adding some signature blocks and it's it's not it's text size in in all the plans. It's the border on the plans. It's colors on the plans. It's um
it's you know you it has to be a signature block. You have to put a uh it has to be an 81X statement saying that there's no new lines or ways. There's a lot of stuff that has to go if you're going to record a plan at the registry that's not typically on the site plans. Like I've said, I've done them hundreds
of times over 30 something years and I've never once recorded a site plan. We've only had one other one other one other applicant do this and we don't know if they and he might not even have done it. Yeah, he may not have done it yet because when he gets to the registry and they kick it back and say I
can't record this plan. Okay. Yeah. So we could do a conditional approval and if 20 So if we send it to council with the question about this
item that they just want it taken off al together we'll we'll record the decision. They're just going to remove the the plan. We'll record the decision. It references the plan. The plan will be put on file. Okay. She'll provide proof and recording of this
decision, but you don't want to include the approved site plan. Yes, please. That's that's So that's what you're looking questioning. So can we send one question to town council and depending on what she So if are you okay with comes back and says if she says yes, we
should abide by you will abide by it. Okay. So determined determined by the um opinion of provided by town council on this 29. Would someone like to make a motion? I don't think so because No, he already
has. Let's just go through one more time. No, he's joking. Look at these. No, was there anyone questions? We We bounced back and forth. All right. So, I'm fine. Um yeah, I'll I'll make a motion to conditionally approve 10
Harding Street um conditions with the edits with Eds as noted discussed discussed thus far. Um with the question with with the one question um awaiting town council's review on 29 on 20 number
29 second. We have a motion and a second. All in favor? I I All right, motion carries. And I for one and I'm excited to see what you folks are going to do with that site. You guys are awful to deal with. Don't come back. I'm joking. That's a joke. The next
project will be uh that much. What's that? Next what? The next project will be that much. Well, so the thing is we actually have new new forms. Oh, did we we didn't get one for plan. Thank you. Yeah. Yeah, we do. So
we have new form. So hopefully that'll help. Yeah. Yeah. Have a good night. Enjoy your time tonight. All right. Where am I? Always action-packed. You two my question is on 29. Yeah. Excuse me.
We wrote that close the hearing. I'd like to based on whose input. Hold on. Wait. Hold on. I make a motion to close the hearing for 10 Harding Street. Second. Second. Motion in a second. All in favor? I I was going to ask, did we close it? I don't remember closing it before. Right. That's right. Do they
have to be president? All right. Council want to say, "Can I get an amen?" Yeah. All right. 43 Main Street was easier. That's so true. This is being recorded.
Okay, let's go. All right. Number six, reorganization of the board. Does anyone else have any interest in being chair? I'm going to make a motion to nominate Michelle to Michelle Mckan. All right,
we have a motion. Second. All in favor? I I Nay. All in favor? Motion carries. I make a motion that we retain John as
vice chair. Right. Second. Yep. Oh, a motion and a second. All in favor? I don't know about that. I I Yeah, I'm telling you. I'm telling you. Now do next year. Next year. I'll do next year.
All right. Approve the January 9th, 2025 meeting minutes. That was a long set of minutes, Kathy. Holy moly. I know. It was like a beast. Gee whiz. I can't wait till we do it tonight. Oh.
I didn't have any edits. Did anyone else have I did not have any edits. Okay. Um, all right. Did somebody want to make a motion to approve? I move we uh approve the minutes of January 9th. Second. 2025. Motion in a second. All in favor?
I I administrative update. All right. We have 13 Main Street update funds possible vote. Kathy, would you like to take that one? Oh, second packet. Yeah. So, so we had we had Apex out
there. They reviewed there was a checklist, a punch list. There was still some items shown. Um, they came back with some items that they want to have pictures of instead of because they they fulfilled their contract with us. So instead of extending their contract, right, they were okay with pictures. So
Kathy, yes. Um, so the board could um make a conditional motion that you'll accept approve releasing their performance guarantee once you get the word back
from Apex that everything is okay. Okay. So I'll make a motion to conditionally approve the release of the funds. You said y of funds for 13 Main Street upon um review by Apex.
Apex second. We have a motion and a second. All in favor? I I motion carries. All right. Rules and rigs. Discuss items to be included in surf review. That's right. Okay. So, um Sherper was going to meet with us for
the kickoff, but they were not able to attend the meeting. Um but I did say we could discuss it. any items that this board has um of concern that we can send it to them so they have that guidance to go on. Um I know one of the items the main
items I think that we've discussed is having a two different um standards for um private road and roads that want to be accepted. And so that they know right off the bat for a road to be accepted,
they're going to have to meet all these criteria from the beginning. And then if if there's a road that's not going to be accepted, then they have to understand that it will not be accepted because they have not conformed to these standards. So I I know that's a big one that we wanted to have two sets of
um of um regulations for private way versus public. Um Kathy, do you have anything that you for the rules and regs
because um just I think that they should go and look through to see if anything's outdated. Mhm. Um we as didn't we talk about time frames? Like our time frame is a lot shorter than other time frames, but I guess
that could be a question. Y time frames. Um just in speaking with the prior town planner, she was saying that other places have longer time frames rather than ours. and and we actually for for um like the subdivision approvals. So
we our rules and regs actually said 14 days and but we our bylaws go by 21. So we actually went through last year and that was one of those like minor edits that we made to update everything to the 21 days. Um but I think I would like
some feedback on time frames. are these I mean knowing the fact that um things have been more hectic there's more requirements especially at a state level and all those sort of things like should those timelines be looked at and and and updated as well um I think we've we've
re re reviewed the fee schedule but the unfortunate thing is we reviewed it um during co and so we know that after co pricing has prices have gone crazy so I don't know if fees have also so the fees schedule is tied with
those rules and rags. We built it in we built it into the rules and rags. So even if I think maybe they should look at the fees to like so what when we had done the last review we we took the median um home value from Lakeville and
compared to towns with a similar medium home value and that so we went we looked at those towns um like so a fee review um compared
surroundings like like free town, median um home values. Um is there anything else that you can think of that the rules and rags um that we want to have them really? I I know the roads was a a major one and we Oh,
the storm water. We want to make sure it talks to the storm water um by law and anything else. I think we covered it. Okay. So, we have storm water was a big one I forgot
about. Yeah. So, outdated [Music] overall. All right. So, two uh the private versus public ways. Yep. Uh just check for overall anything outdated. Um look at the time frames. Mhm. And the
fees and the storm water for compatibility. Mhm. Okay. I think that'd be at least a good start. What's that? Five items. Yeah. One, two, three, four, five. Yeah. Yeah. Kathy, do you want me to send this over to Taylor or do you want to? Either. Okay, that's fine.
That's an easy one. I can do that. Okay. All right. All right. So, the next one is signs memo. So, these these are last two things are just the memos that we've already approved and have already been sent. So, I just wanted to keep kind of
a breast of these items and and maybe just follow up to make sure that we get um we get some sort of feedback because um one is signs and the other one is a consultant memo. Um, well, one quick thing on the signs, too. Uh, uh, you
mentioned that signs aren't allowed to advertise businesses that are not on that site. Yeah. And the building at Bedford and Rhode Island, right? Yeah. Is still doing it. Oh,
yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah. So, that I believe is a satellite office. Oh, is it? Yes. The landscaping company. Yes. Um there's other signage that was brought up too. Um that's being
reviewed, you know, of all those around. Yeah. Same ones that were on Captain's Way. I've seen more of their QR codes other locations on 29 on 79. Say that again. One on 79. There you go. 79 as it goes towards
That's gone. That That's Yeah, that's no longer there. Yep. That was gone like the day after we talked about it after your your pictures came up. Oh yeah. What about I looked at I looked at Iron Hills. That one has to stay because it's still in
the phase project, right? Which is a shame because it if it is, you know, you can make the recommendation that they replace 10 back from the road though. I don't Oh, I don't know if it's 10 ft back. Well, and I think that was put in and I could be wrong. I believe that sign was put in
Christ. It had to have been It's got to be like 20 years old, right? At least 20 years old because I think since 2012 maybe that sign's been there. It looks like it's 20 years old. 12 years old. Yeah, it was before the other phases. It
was part of the older project. They you know. So do you want to keep these two item? Well, I want to keep an item an eye on obviously the consult. So the Mhm. we can keep the sign memo on cuz maybe if if people have more um items
that they want to address, we can address it at a later date, but let's do we want to keep it off of the next next meeting or or push it off to next month? I I think um we might want to have the zoning enforcement officer um weigh in
uh because I I don't know in terms of if number two was taken care of the the lights and so forth. So, the memo does that that res. Yeah, would appreciate an update. So, hopefully we'll get an update. Yeah, it's fine. The um and then the flags. I don't know if we want to
use the word flags. Maybe. Was it flags or banners there? I would say banners. I know that the the resident kept saying flags like a I almost was like want Yeah. Don't want they can't fly a flag. Banners, but it wasn't like a No, I know. American flag or no vertical
banner, right? Yeah. advertising banners description advertising banners my contribution for the evening banners. All right. So, um just just another quick update. So, uh this evening before our meeting, I did uh go over attend the budget hearing with the select board.
Mhm. Thank you. I brought a copy. You're welcome. I brought a copy of the memo and I did hand it out to the new uh select board members. I gave a copy to the Fincom. I didn't have enough for all of them. I was just thinking, you know, five for the select board, but kind of spread them out so they could take a
look at it. Um, so the the conversation about the consultant will be on Monday. Um, it's too late to post for Monday for all of us to go, but I'll attend.
Um and but we did discuss with the budget hearing um depending on how long that planner um position is open that we may be looking at our 26th budget which starts in July. So that's only a few months away um where we might
have to look at and and the town accountant said that he would be able to break it down into a different line. you know, we'd have the salary and then the expense and then at fall town meeting, if we do have a town planner at that point, he could roll it back and and make that change at fall town meeting.
So, um, Andrew, you know, so that we could work on it. Um, okay. But hopefully the the discussion about the consultant will be Monday. So, and does is there a job description that needs to be written up? It's
already up. It's already up. I'm sorry. the the existing job description has already been posted. Um, but depending on I mean what what comes in how long it takes to fill that role. That's why we still want to look at the consultant and
then look at potential 26 budget because if we wanted to I just wanted to be prepared and not say oh yeah we want to fund this planning uh planner and my operations sorry um my operations background goes to for hiring
people. Um, are we advertising this to different planning types of uh list serves or circles, inner circles, internal and external? Yeah. I'm not sure where Lacy posts it. I've seen it on the website.
I'm sure there's a few different mask. Does it go in that or MMA? MMA. Oh, right. Right. Okay. All right. Thank you. All right. Uh, next meeting is April 24th, 2024 at the Lakeville Police Station. Any other
business? No. Would someone like to make a make a motion to adjurnn? Second. Second. Motion and a second. All in favor? I I meeting is adjourned.