##VIDEO ID:ZFj6Fh5OQwo## [Music] I'd like to call this meeting of the Lakeville planning board to order it is Thursday January 9th 2025 at 700 p.m. and we are meeting at the Lakeville police station at 323 Bedford Street we have Lake Pam recording is anyone else recording hearing none our first item on the agenda is to welcome new town planner Nancy dery welcome Nancy thank you thank you I'm very excited to be starting my first day was Monday and I'm happy to be here in Lakeville this is an exciting opportunity for me to help the community with with all things planning all planning board items and other things in the community um I really look forward to but I'd be remissed if I didn't thank Kathy Murphy for helping me get started and for welcoming me to the community providing coffee and donuts on Monday morning when I showed up which was really lovely and she's just a real rock star she's done a great job holding down the fort um and keeping you all running for the time that you were missing someone in the planner SE so I just wanted to thank Kathy thank you Kathy thank you for helping me on board you've been very busy already yeah so I just had a couple of other quick items the budget you were in budget season so I'm going to prep I'm going to prepare to give you the budget for the next meeting for you to review and vote on so that'll be for the 23rd okay of January um and so some other things that we've been mented in other communities have been like um uh tech review peer more peer review at the backside and um an an informal presentation to the board prior to submission all of those things are something that if you'd like to think about um we can talk about it at a future meeting to an agenda item absolutely actually and Andrew had mentioned to me as well that something they used to do is have like an exploratory meeting with all the different departments as well as the boards and I think that's something that would definitely benefit Lille yeah we put it on the next agenda awes have of discussion about that great yeah um why not our um inv voes are coming in would the board prefer to sign them or do they want the town planner to sign them how would you so for peer review invoices for um any invoices they got that someone has to sign off I didn't know the planning board or the town planner it doesn't matter so typically been signing him but if you would we want to continue no yet if that's something you you can take over that's fine and I just let you know when those invoices come in and that they've been signed off on okay great all right okay that's it that's all I have thank you welcome for I'm very happy to be here excited to work for and we're excited to have you yeah like yeah I'm relieved me too I was very nervous certain very nervous so for the purpose of this meeting Madam chair should we uh do a roll call and introduce ourselves can go around and do attendance if you like you start with I do the admin for the planning board I'm uh David Lodge uh I'm I'm kind of the the the rookie with the uh uh longest out till I'm uh till I'm out 5 years Dan wilga with the planning board Michelle mcer chair John cabraal Vice chair um Amy qule Town Council Nancy dery Town planner all right so we have agenda item number two public hearing for 160 Bedford Street which has been continued to this evening request for a special permit under Section to January 23rd our next meeting if someone would like to make the motion I'll make a motion to continue 160 Bedford Street till January 23rd 2025 second we have a motion and the second all in favor I I motion carries agenda item number three public hearing site plan review 43 Main Street which was continued to this evening upon the application for a site plan review and approval submitted by John oer for the proposed development of Woodgate residences it will include 120 units of assisted living and memory care and 70 units of independent living with Associated site improvements parking area landscape improvements and storm water infrastructure possible vote I'm also going to open Agenda item number four which is a public hearing for site plan review for 43 Main Street which was continued to this evening upon the application for a site plan review and approval submitted by John O for the proposed development of the fox estate's 55 plus age qualified Cottage Home Development it will include 68 unit across 26 Cottages 10 T duplexes 16 Triplex and a plus or minus 5,000 ft Clubhouse and a plus or minus 2,000 foot Waste Water Treatment Plant which will serve the entire master plan Redevelopment of the former State Hospital site also proposed as a community amenity space Associated site improvements new roadway parking area landscape improvements and storm water infrastructure possible vote so all you John for the record John nice to meet you nice to meet you too John um so since we were last in front of you I want to say December December 12th I think if that sounds right um we had supplied you all with a draft decision um which Town Council has reviewed and has since provided a revision to that or markups to that um which we received this morning um and have taken the opportunity to sort of provide a few extra notes which were happy to talk through here I think generally speaking we're in agreement with with almost all conditions I think we just wanted to hash out a couple wording items and then the the largest change which I think attorney ma who's unfortunately unable to join us here this evening did I believe Supply to you all in writing is a condition regarding traffic monitoring I know that was something that the zoning board had picked up um and we're in process of drafting the decision for the zoning board as well um it had come up in conversation I believe with this board as well uh it's within our meepa filing through the state so adding it to this condition in our opinion is of no real consequence we if we're happy to do it we are going to do it we're committed to doing it so the language that Bob supplied you all with um and I apologize that just didn't you know that this didn't get included initially but that language is copy and pasted from the meepa approval the only difference being they refer to it as a proponent we refer to it as an applicant um so that condition is proposed to be included um in both the Fox Estates and The Windgate um and then if if I may there were a couple other comments that we did have which I'm happy to to talk through live if that's if that's okay yes um Town Council included a comment on uh an additional item agenda or sorry uh condition number eight now which one are we looking at um it's I think it's the same in both but for the purposes let's actually since not the same I think the numbering is different okay so let's look at Windgate because David is sitting next to me here um for the record David me from uh thank you okay a one um condition eight um references all drainage facilities and Associated structures including pipe looming and seating shall be complete completed to the satisfaction of the planning board prior to the issuance of any building permit unless an appropriate shity is agreed upon which is sufficient to complete infrastructure our suggested language changes to that would be to adjust planning board to building department um being it feels to me that Nate is going to be the one that's most involved in day-to-day site activity um so we feel having him be the reviewer would be the most efficient process so we SU suggested adjusting that language to building department and then instead of tying that work um regarding structures including pipe loaming seating um we would request that that be tied to a certificate of occupancy just in terms of the order of operations for construction activity it's quite unfeasible to complete all of our drainage infrastructure piping Loom seed before we actually do any building construction so having that work completed and signed off before we're able to pull a building permit just in terms of sequence of of of operation and construction becomes becomes really challenging so you don't have to complete the work you the the condition is that you either complete it or you provide assuring okay so you don't have to complete it and then um the inspections with the these with this this condition is connected kind of to condition five so the inspections here would be by the peer reviewer which is why we're asking for the 53g account so um I guess what I would I guess I would say we don't necessarily have to change it to the building department but we should maybe change it to the planning department rather than the planning board okay so that means you don't have to come back to the board you just have to have you know the peer review our peer reviewer would just submit something to Nancy and say Here's where they're at that's that's really it Madam chairman I would also agree that at stay of the planning department um we Doo to fully plan to be part of the construction um inspections and continue that for I'm quite familiar with doing these types of activities and I I'm hoping that the planning board would want us to continue to do that so that works for you as well gives you that option yeah I'm just I'm I'm I'm admittedly up on completed to the satisfaction understanding that the second half of the sentence does say unless an appropriate shity is agreed upon so yeah and the shity that's agreed upon would be a a price that um your engineer supplies and our peer reviewer says yes that's right and then you just you put it you just give us a shity for that price and that that shity can be drawn down also right right right and that sh will be equal to the amount of left so the challenge there is that tied to a building permit we will not have begun any of that work so then you supply so that sh will be in the amount of basically the entire site work package if that's if that's what you if that's how you want to do it that's fine I mean you're you're looking at a a million dollar site work package right so that that feels again we're not going to we're not going to do any of that drainage Associated structure including piping wimming and seaing until so drainage is infrastructure okay so if you want to um if you want to talk about um parsing this out we could the the drainage is something that is either going to have to be completed or um assurity um things like looming and seating um you know that that's something that can be done at occupancy okay um so but I mean the drainage you are going to have to um you are going to have to have your drainage in some kind of some kind of working working position when you start construction because you're going to have construction well the there there is separate drain there's separate sort of storm water management and Water Management that's part of construction activity that's part of your site work so we'll have to set up dewatering areas there'll be a Swip which has to manage storm water prevention throughout the course of construction that's separated or different distinctly different than the drainage facilities and structures and storm water basins and storm water management that will be at final completion of the project so like we we can't we we won't be able to build our entire storm water infrastructure prior to pulling a building permit so you're going to manage all of your storm water during construction through your Swip that's correct that's fairly standard so yep no I get that so um you know across the board I mean this is a for for Fox States I know I'm switching a little bit but Fox States it's a it's a 30 acre piece of property our storm water infrastructure is what's called country drainage so that infrastructure is sort of part of the roadway so in order for us to have all of the drainage infrastructure completed prior to P pulling a building permit would require us to have all of the roadways built prior to even pulling one building permit otherwise we have to post assurity that covers site work for a 30 acre piece of property which is a huge number for that doubles our our site work costs so let's talk about um your construction how how do you plan what is the phasing of your construction how do you plan on doing it for both it what's first that's going to depend largely on market conditions we know that the buildings will come down we know that the landfill will be removed and we know that in order to have a certificate of occupancy have David's building operational or any building operational the say we will need to construct the wastewater treatment plant so those pieces will all sort of happen as kind of what I like to call phase one is that site Readiness package the treatment plant might not be built in its entirety but at least enough built to support whatever building comes thereafter how the site is phased will largely depend on the market and market conditions we feel strong ly that David feels strongly that he's ready to go when when you know as soon as the site gets cleared he's going to he's going full speed which site the Assisted Living site so wind Gate's going to go first correct okay and so Windgate is only two buildings right right so that that's not difficult so it's going to be one building or the other right that you're going to start with yeah the the assisted living and Memory Care will be the first correct so um um you would have to have your your your nip you'd have to have you would have to submit your um submit your Nifty permit and your Swip um prior to any site work okay those are I believe that's a is that in here I was under the impression that it was okay umor to site work and then that yeah um you would have to um so so the the problem is is that we can't really tie any we can't tie things to the occupancy permit because there is no ability to withhold an occupancy permit based on for example site conditions it's the occupancy permit is issued pursuant to the to the State Building Code it's not issued pursuant to site plan or subdivision or anything like that so that's why I'm I'm trying to figure this out no I understand yeah understand if we could do what what if we um what if um what if we did a year after um a year after site work commences or six months after site work commences there would be um an inspection um to determine the remainder of the work in six months 6mon intervals something like that or is that if in six months is the shity still going to be outrageous in theory no because the sort of the the it's all front loaded yeah the site work will generally be some of the first work that that we get going but will be very much in conjunction with the building going vertical um so I I don't don't think that that's I don't see it I don't see that being too much of an issue it's just it's it's an it's an odd structure I I I've definitely tied it to certificates of occupancy in in other projects um T typically we've seen um planning board giving final release and authorization to the Building Commissioner to release the certificate of occupancy and that's that's in conjunction with uh submitting as buils so the completed project is reflective to the approved site plan and any work that's not done like there was Landscaping not done that would that would require a assurity to ensure that the the work was done post uh post occy unfortunately we we can't do that here so we can't do the we can't tie it to the occupancy because the occupancy permit is is a it's issued under the State Building Code um so um I would say that um that the uh peer review the uh applicants engineer the well the applicant um and peer reviewer to submit um to submit um a completion list within six months within six months of uh site work commencing to determine if assurity is necessary and then we can put something that says um why don't we we can put something that says that this condition may be um this condition may be modified by the planning board um administratively and then they after at 6 months they can come back to you and if for some reason at 6 months they are still in this situation where they would be providing assurity that's a you know an outrageous amount assurity you could continue that for another 6 months or three months or however much you feel would be adequate okay now when you say administratively you mean administratively to you so it would be at a um at a public hearing on your agenda but it it would I mean I'm sorry not a public hearing it would be on your agenda under administrative matters so they wouldn't have to do a whole public hearing yeah and we can do that if we put it in the condition if we bake it right into the condition and so that would allow them to start the site work as well as pull a building permit CU you guys are trying to you you guys trying to do those in parallel obviously site work as well as building once you have your your site contractor on site he's going to be do you know digging foundations and roughing in roads and doing so we'll take we'll take the building perit completely out of it okay so take out prior to the issuance permit okay does that work for you guys yes yes and then that condition will also add it will also say that your nippie permit and your Swip have to be submitted or or evidence of it you don't to we don't want the whole you don't need to I think we already have yeah you already there's a draft Swip within they don't need a lot of but um so that would be prior to any site where beginning okay so that is so the is that in there the condition number eight is is the same as condition number eight for the Fox Estates as well so we want to carry that over the same language unless Fox Estates can be done um in a fa in a phasing manner whatever I don't know if it would be easier or this is just easier for you but yeah the the Fox Estates will like we we won't build 68 units at once right you know so that that will be phased I what that phasing looks like I don't can be I don't know yet so I think the having the ability to come back and revisit that condition I think would be beneficial for all okay Madam chair I would just say that maybe a phasing report of some sort at that time so that we know exactly like what you're going to do my fear is that buildings will go up and no infrastructure will be in place and that would be a detriment you know having cleared out roadways is making sure that there's easy access for emergency vehicles and any of those items should be considered through that phasing process to make sure that we can access the site and that it's not creating runoff problems in and around the area that would be my suggestion I I would agree with that I think that's and thank you so add some garbage to that effect as well on Fox there would be a phasing report oh so just on Fox yeah y so number eight gets reworked completely much for yeah and then we would add a commission onto the fox about the phasing report construction report all right next item you wanted to address um yes what are we here um the last item um the last addition um by Town Council I'm looking it it appears in both Windgate and Fox Estates um discussing if the planning board approval or this planning board approval was for a site plan review only uh if any other board committee commission or department requires change to the plan or said changes requires a variance for the particular board's committees commissions or departments approval the applicant shall notify the planning board who will review the change and determine if the applicant needs to return to the board and or revise the plan we just wanted to put a little bit of descriptor in there so in the first sentence this planning board approval is for site plan review only as prescribed in section 6.7 of the bylaw so again just defining that section of the of the bylaw and then in addition to that if any change if any other board committee commission or department requires a change to the plan pursuant to the provisions of the town's General bylaw and then continue so just inserting some some specificity um to that condition oh it have to be bylaw rules bylaw regulations guidance or policies then so okay well it would also be um what is it so approval pursuant pursuant to it would be um it could be state laws it could be it would have to I mean you're opening you're opening up a big door here state laws well as it reads right now there is there is no there is it's discretionary if any other board committee commission or department requires a change to the plan oh yeah it's varience for their particular boards committees commissions or departments approval so if you need approval from any other board committee commission or department and you and you are you're going to get some kind of variance from that reason on the wrong one well or said change requires a variance that that doesn't necessitate that said change requires a variance for any other board committee commissioner commissioner Department to require a change to the plan it doesn't that there's no there's no brackets around why that board committee commissioner department is is able to require a change well they could require a change for example uh the Building Commissioner could require a change pursuant to state law which is which is um the State Building Code the Board of Health could require something pursuant to either state law or their local regulations or their local policy conservation can change something pursuant to state law or their local bylaw or the local regulations or a policy so totally so I I think the goal is just to be able to put some brackets around what the definition of requires a change as it reads right now there is there is no there is no definition to what requires a change to the plan it's the approval of any of those it's it's their approval so if the building if say say if conservation conservation is going to issue an order of conditions and that order of conditions is an approval but that order of condition requires you to move a building outside of the buffer zone right you have to come back because that's a change we don't want different plans for each I believe that's captured in 18 any substantial proposed change to the approved site plan or addition work deemed substit by the town planner Building Commissioner shall be presented to to the planning board if you'd like to add in there by any other board committee commission or Department then I'm fine doing that but it just it feels very broad here we get we get the feeling that it it it could lend itself to being arbitrary tell tell us what give give us an example of what how this could be bad maybe that'll help I because I don't think it's anything to Bel labor over so it it just give you an example yeah um and then maybe we could figure out language if I think you sort of highlighted them if if the if there is some substantive change to uh a storm water design as a result of some inspections that we have to make that we have to make inspections there you know that that is something that we would come back in front of the board and make those changes to I think I it just it gives me pause that so so the purpose of this is because in the past we've had where we've made a decision but it's gone it's still still out under being decided by other other Bulls in parallel so when that comes through a site plan changes and we never see it but then now we have two sets of documents out there that have an approval on it okay so the whole intentive is that if if concom comes back and says well not like you said like something has to get changed and it you know move your dumpsters over to here and it changes your site plan then we have we have we want to be able to it to come back to us to see it so that that way it's just a it's a condition of our approval okay not a condition of like if you have something in the site you find out you know you have to move something that's different right that's that's part of construction but if there's something that another board is saying right I might yeah I think I actually I think 18 covers it right and and we add the the boards to that one it's also it's also mentioned in section 6.7 of the bylaw for Cy intereview there's a I want to say it's item H in there reading today that that states that if there's any if the building department or Building Commissioner identifies a change that is different from what is on the approved site plan that the Building Commissioner has the authority to then take it back to the planning board right again it wasn't the intent wasn't to like leave an open open end for you to come back before us it was just it was more of a a safeguard for on the drawings so they don't we don't multiple sets of dra it's on every decision they issue yeah yeah and to be more specific Board of Health has has specific regulations and there was something that we approved and they had to then have a variance and because we had already approved there was no you know fortunately no stipulation in there so we just want to make sure that that doesn't happen again MH MH but I believe so as long as we can add the language Amy to 18 yep yes we'll add boards committees commissions or departments I don't yeah if even I'm not even sure we have to but because it says 18 says any sub substantial proposed change from the approved site plan or additional site work deemed substantive by the town planner or the Building Commissioner shall be presented for review by the planning board so the difference between that and the difference between the the provision that they're complaint pointing out pointing out and 18 is that 18 actually streamlines it because it allows it to go to the town planner or the Building Commissioner first to determine if it's substantive cuz for example if something say you know say a dumpster is moving 2 inches to the left I don't think you guys need to waste your time right so they can just deal with it by staff so if that's okay then we can just leave it at 18 okay as long as it's going to capture capture everything it would capture any any change so we can just remove the last 18 I would think section section 18 would satisfy you those I would I would completely agree okay so we'll just take that that language out M okay of both thank you okay so and it's 199 on the on Fox okay yeah got it thank you can I ask a question um if you like Mr Scott the only reason one thing that jumps out you have one thing Dick Scott r one thing that jumps out at me is it's an old site D is going to be looking at that landfill for example they're depending on what when you dig you might find something substantive that has to be dealt with that may change the plan you may not but the landfill the presence of the landfill and excavation may lead to something and what I've heard is Town things i' I've not heard anything and perhaps Council would say how D if they said for example um where you're Excavating the landfill uh there's sub Subterranean stuff that needs to be dealt with but if it's too expensive to do they might say it might affect where things go I'm just I'm just throwing it out beyond that would that in my opinion that would be covered under 18 because you would have they would have to change their plan okay um if I if I this the last one on on uh Windgate the very last paragraph I Michelle mcran so on and so forth yeah John just pointed it out all right just want to make sure that one gets that one gets covered that's fair I don't know it's it it references it references the fox estate they're both they're both written for Fox estate got it okay sorry about that I didn't pick that up no worries um but technically your attorney was the first one I just made the second mistake he's not here it was all we can agree to it um so I think we're in alignment on changes from Windgate that are associated with changes in in Fox Estates the only additional comment we had regarding Fox Estates is condition number uh 15 uh no that's not right it's after the dog park one after 18 that's so that would be 19 and then the one we discuss with 20 I for some reason I just could not get a number on that paragraph I tried forat um so same issues yeah the format is a little tough um so just for that one which which is is I I I guess I'll read it um the sale of each or upon the sale of each unit uh a sorry I have some a affidavit must be submitted to the planning board with copy to the building department identifying and attesting at at least one owner uh of the unit shall be 55 years of age or older so we're in agreement with this condition after we sell these units it will then be on homeowner to homeowner to provide that affidavit which feels a little bit open so what we are proposing for that change is that upon this initial sale or prior to the first sale that a copy of a deed restriction in perpetuity be provided and that way we do it once it carries with the property it's in perpetuity it feels like a cleaner way to do that and also I think protects the town a little more from any changes um that might occur and we're more than happy to do that and that is no issues on on our part is that working it does but you're sure about that yeah okay um so that would be um the way I the way I adusted it again I'm not the attorney but um I stated prior to the sale of each unit a copy of an of the associated deed showcasing 55 plus deed restriction in perpetu it must be submitted to the planning department should be initial sale yeah initial sale prior to the initial sale so prior to the initial sale for each unit a deed restriction must be submitted to a um Perpetual yeah a copy of the Associated deed deed showcasing a 55 and over deed restriction and perpetuity must be submitted to the planning department okay you'll send us that language in the morning okay okay um okay and then identifying that are you know State and then it would say stating that at least one owner shall be 55 okay um and I can have we can Wordsmith that a little bit okay that would be fine um and then um I just had one question Madam chair if I may on on Fox is the dog park and the associate of parking spaces um so are you going to um is is Fox Estates going to have a homeowners association okay so we would put in that we would have that um that the planning board would um would have a to receive copies of the um of the homeowners docu homeowners association's documents um and when would that be um um prior to how about prior to as builts being submitted yes okay okay and then um will you be dealing with the home will you be dealing with the dog park and the walking trails in the homeowners association so the concern is that um the concern is that the homeowners on Fox Estates need to know that the dog park and the ding trails are open to the public so um could you just make sure that um and and so what we could do is why don't we just put that um the dog park back to 18 will put the dog park Associated parking spaces and walking trails shall be public and not limited to the residents of the development at um uh this condition shall be reflected in the HOA docs okay that was it for me anything else okay um Nancy did you have anything I know you reviewed these no I don't like um this was appropriate um I think in the future I'll just take a look at some more stand conditions um and passing through Amy to see if that would be something that and the board to see if that's something that you would be interested in oh I you know what actually one thing that we did Town Council um number five the applicant shall submit a check in the amount of 5,000 which would be held in a 53g account to pay for the required inspections prior to any slate work occurring on the property is that enough for the inspection oh it now that we're doing now that we adjusted the other one we have to um uh prior to that would be um the applicant shall submit a check check in the amount of $5,000 which will be held in a 53g account to pay for the required inspections during construction is what we're going to put and then um we would put the language that says that if the um if the 53g account is is depleted that it has to be that another 5,000 has to be submitted and that's a standard condition and I don't I don't mind $55,000 being provided as a part of a building permit application that's that's a that's that's not a problem at all so I don't mind this one that the way that's written I'm totally I'm totally good with that and even having it replenished when necessary fine including that as well so that'll be the same for both well what no the 53g account has to be um you have to put you have to give us the $5,000 before you start site work so you might not need a building permit for that right yeah e either one I'm fine with that prior to yeah yeah that's good so prior to site work it it states prior to any site work current property or the issuance of a building permit so that but that says um which will be held in a well yeah I don't know I kind of read it as it could be said that once the building permit is issued the the money comes out so I didn't like I don't like it now so I was fine earlier but now I'm not so prior to site work prior to the commencement of site work the commencement of site work prior to the commencement of site work the applicant shall submit a check in the amount of $5,000 which will be held in a 53g account to pay for the required inspections and then uh required inspections during construction period and then we're going to put in the language about if it's depleted it gets replenished okay great okay okay and we'll put that on the other one too y right um and then just as a as a clerical item so condition three in both um both approvals reference the conditions of the site plan approval shall be added to the final set of approv plan submitted to the board for signatur our thought was to package everything up that you've already all seen dated with today's date have the conditions that we've discussed and negotiated put those in there and resubmit a one package in its entirety as all the bells and whistles and that will be what gets stamped and approved is that clerically does that does that work Kathy I'll reach out to you about number of copies hard copies depends that one if you want all right anybody else any other comments questions okay all right so we have I'm sorry yes come up I'm Greg Ro I was put through the agenda package and these comments not seen in the package so like are they available publicly what youall been talking about uh the conditions no because uh we got them so late I don't think did you put oh actually they were they were in an additional I didn't have time to post that okay so I could do that you can post it all right Kathy will post it thank you all right so we have two site plan reviews and two decisions that we've worked through would someone like to make the motion to well first I guess we should close the hearing and then um so if we want to close we close both of them or one of them at a time I would do I would do them one at a time close it and then vote and then close it and then vote okay I make a motion to close 43 Main Street wind Gate Estates second we have a motion in a second all in favor I I motion passes all right make a motion to approve the 43 Main Street wood Gate Estates as with conditions as draft as conditions as drafted with the edits with the edits all right we have a motion second and a second all in favor I I motion passes yeah I make a motion to close the public hearing for 43 Main Street box Estates second second Mo a motion in a second all in favor I I make a motion to approve the uh site plan review for 43 Main Street um Fox States as with conditions and as edited as edited yes okay so we have a motion and a second all in favor I I motion carries all right thank you thank you very much feels like it's been a very long long time coming quite thank you allone they do it a lot all right agenda item number five we have a public hearing s plan review 10 Harding Street upon the application for a site plan review and approval submitted by Lex development Inc for the construction of a proposed 13 ,300 ft building Associated driveways parking areas and utilities I have oh here it is uh the Lakeville planning board pursuant to the town of Lakeville code bylaws chapter 270 section 27067 will hold a public hearing on Thursday January 9th 2025 at 7:00 p.m. at the Lakeville police station 3:23 Bedford Street the purpose of the public hearing will be to receive information and public comment on the following site plan review application 10 Harding Street the applicant Lex development Inc site plan review and approval for the construction of a proposed 13,300 ft building associate driveways parking areas and utilities someone like to make a motion to open this hearing make a motion to open the hearing for 10 Harding Street second motion and the second all in favor I I I motion carries good evening hi good evening um I'll just set up here real quick sorry we wereing right excuse me that extra no I'm going to put that up in a second all right I was just wondering if we could turn one around so yeah yeah yep shuffle through potentially thank you thank you hi uh for the record my name is Bob rioo I'm with River riverhawk environmental um here tonight for the uh 10 Harding Street project um the the we're proposing a commercial property along Harden Street which is Route 44 in the industrial district in uh in town um the site is located uh at the intersection of Harding Street in Millennium circle lennium circle is an industrial park that has several buildings in it that that comes off 44 um the subject property is around uh 2.4 Acres or 105,3 120 sare ft um it's been improved currently this the property is improved is an old Foundation which has been there for um more than 30 years we believe it's uh was started and never finished as a project so it's just a foundation that's been sitting as three sides of a foundation some footings in the ground that have been there um there's an existing septic system for the adjacent building here on the Northerly side of the property that's on an easement on the property on the on the Northerly side and then there's an easement for this property for a driveway EAS for Access that's also on the abiding property um the um the rest of the site is basically just vegetated with with grass and there's a few trees along Route 44 that are in the layout but are a fairly large uh trees that are existing um we're proposing to put a um 13,7 square foot uh building it'll be a multi-use um commercial uh retail not quite sure 100% of the users at this point but may vary from restaurant to retail to to office to storage uh depending on what's there there will be we're having two levels of the building will be used so the rear portion of the building will be lower level will be accessed from from this side of the parking lot and then the the nor the southernly side of the building will be an upper level of the building which will be accessed from from the front area and the drive ISS will just slope around to the sides to to to access so for the tenants in terms of uh who may potentially go in there how many restaurants are you thinking to it yeah well I mean no we've we've proposed for terms of parking and traffic count uh calculations we've assumed a 100 seats of a restaurant but okay it may be no restaurants um that that actually become tenants you know where they're active I believe looking for tenants but don't have anybody in place yet and it's kind of build it and they will come type of situation thank you um so in terms of the um yeah I'll get back I'll save the building appearance for later in the in the presentation um and basically the building's been designed in such a way that we we will be looking for the coverage benefits um we're we're at about 60 61.7% of coverage which what's shown up there so we will be looking for the um 2 10% um density bonuses um the building and it can probably see I'm going to switch from a colored one to one that shows the parking a little clearer um so there's going to be parking around the perimeter of the building and then along here there's existing parking associated with the adjacent property um for that building that that runs along the and extends over onto the subject property um we're proposing the you know line parking up along the back side of that around the building and then you know basically squeeze it in where possible on the site we've been able to get about I believe uh we're showing 128 spaces uh on the on the site again that's based on some assumptions of use uh for the future um the the um area around the site we've made sure that it's suitable for the uh Lakeville fire apparatus to get around you know all four sides of the building and enter onto the site and exit off and we will be submitting uh an additional um swep path analysis plan there was a comment from the fire department but we're sure in the next um set of revisions of plan will include that plan that that that details that a little better um there's the single there's an existing curb cut on Route 44 Harding Street that that gives access to Millennial Circle and the existing buildings inside of there um those that were proposing to come off Millennial Circle and with the entrance to the site so there's a single entrance to the site from the roadway here um we'll wrap around for circuit ation purposes and we're going to enter on to the existing paved parking lot here and there's that access easement to get back out to the to the site over to here so it'll allow for you know two accesses in and out of the site but there only one curb cut offal Circle and no new curve cuts off loot 44 which is very busy and would make for confusion if we tried to put anything too close to that existing um entrance um we provided a dumpster pad on the on the um one pad at this point um that could be expanded um on the on the Northerly part it's on the rear of the building you know tried to hide it from the streets and roadways but it will be screened with a fence and uh from from the adjacent property um in terms of pedestrian circulation there's going to be a a walkway around the perimeter of the building which will get people from the parking spaces to the different locations on the building um because of the grade change there has to be a few stairs along the sides of the building to allow people to to make up that elevation difference um in terms of the perimeter of the site or getting pedestrians off the site and into the thing um Route 44 is so busy and there's no um sidewalks along that portion Route 44 so we're not really looking for any connectivity to to get them out on to Route 44 probably keep them off Route 44 is a better idea um in terms of um utilities there's an existing water line which runs down Millennium Circle so this site will be served by Taunton city of Taunton water um so we'll be working with them to to achieve access to the water and the the connection will be made again in Millennium circle with it with um limiting what has to be done in Route 44 same with electric uh utilities and just so you know just sorry to interrupt you but um it does go through the S board it does correct yes thank you thank you um and then the septic will be onsite so we're proposing an onsite septic system the plans were submitted to you and have been uh reviewed by the Board of Health there are some comments which we certainly can address but but nothing major that that can't be addressed um storm water management we've designed um the the storm water management to be in accordance with the mass DP storm water management standards uh what were generally doing an overall view is we'll be providing a um infiltration dryw for the storm water which runs off the roof so that'll directly go into the drywell because it's considered clean water for the um water from the parking lot we're proposing a a fairly large infiltration Gallery which again will be a subsurface infiltration Gallery uh that'll be there'll be deep sump catch basins collected to water water quality excuse me treatment units that then discharge to the storm water basin and and by by doing that and with a few other things we'll we'll be able to meet all the mass TP storm water management standards um erosion control there's a was a plan included in the we provideed around the perimeter during construction there are no Wetland resource areas within vicinity of the site um but we you know we will during construction the site will be greater than an acre we'll file a a storm water prodution prevention plan and will'll comply with uh you know all the erosion control um requirements including perimeter controls you know uh catch Basin protection and um yeah and and a track pad for for sites coming in and off of the site for for when construction's happening um lighting we submitted a lighting plan um that shows the photometrics for the site so in general just trying to keep it well lit uh there'll be pole mounted fixures around the site some building mounted sconces and then um they'll all be dark sky compliant they'll comply with the Lakeville um bylaw for for lighting bylaw and uh there'll be uh no spill over to the to the Abundant properties um in terms of traffic again we we had a um because we don't know the users um user users of of the building exactly we did you know an estimate of the traffic based on the same thing we estimated the number of parking spaces on um which was a mix of you know office retail um restaurant and um storage based on employees so we came up with a very rough number of around 800 per day you'll need to unlock your computer first and uh that that section of Route 44 carries about 20,000 cars per day so we expect that increase a lot of it will be pass or will tend to be passer by traffic you know people already traveling on that road will stop in and go out so the certain percentage of those trips will be by people already on the roadway system um but without the exact users it's diff somewhat difficult to do an estimate of the traffic but I still think at those numbers um the the impact on the nearby roadways and intersections will be minimum it already is busy and it's you know not the best on and off to get on that section of Route 44 um but but I don't think it'll um have any measurable effects and that's kind of the general idea um we did uh submit some architectural renderings renderings excuse me are very rough um they were based on there's a new building which recently constructed in Taunton and this was kind of the inspiration and we do intend to um have the buildings look in a similar fashion and as we move forward with the um with this process we'll get you more detailed uh plans um if needed of of what's actually going to occur but um I'll pass these around kind of ran out of the ink there and uh you can you can look at it but this was the inspiration for the uh for the building and where about Inon 140 oh okay right in that Development Area just got built it just got built not not in there but further down further down if you don't are you the owner would you mind just coming up and see your name for the uh Tim hash president devel yes oh okay so we just got the liation from the building for this building from there uh so that's that's our goals but not just trying to put up a metal building there yeah so you know colors are going to be a little different you know we don't know at this point but that's just giving you guys an idea what but the Aesthetics are nice correct yeah that's why we did the bumps on the building just to kind of give a exension okay excellent yeah I mean it's it's different than our business Zone because this is industrial but you still have what we're looking for in business Zone as well yeah except like you do have the flat roof as long as you don't have um brief top units they're screened yeah yeah seems to be very much in line with what we look forde all that stuff yeah pars um any question from the board I had a couple quick questions just in regards to signage so in terms of signage are you thinking of signage either on the building or on uh signage on Harding Street which lists all the probably a little bit of both I would say that a tenant who's going there is probably going to want on the building above their unit so the units are laid out at 28t wide by 7 deep I mean someone could take two you know but again probably signage there but then there's definitely probably going to be some sort of signage on the street show I don't know if I saw sign I did not show that I mean as long as it's a directory and it conforms to the sign by law we can even condition it we don't have to see it we can just say that it has to conform to the our language um any other questions uh I had a few good good no um I know you have in the industrial there wasn't you have an a potential industrial tenant manufacturing is what was in there I know on the details you had a a detention tank I didn't see it on the I didn't see it on the actual site plans though do you guys have that with that kind of a if I saw the details if right that's correct wasn't shown on the side plans that's um and then so the front of the building is Harding Street I guess the front of the building front of house and back of house yep front of the building um so I can see a so is there any potential where those anyone's going to have to go up the back cuz I know you don't you have steers but you don't have ramps I know it's it's a 10ft drop from front to back but is there a potential that someone's going to have to if if those three parking you know the handicap spots and you have to hit someone has to pick up the ones in the back are they going to have to come how they going to get around right they would have to go on the I should know if yeah if the back was the back of the house and it's not I mean it's impossible for us to ramp to make that elevation change with the r no I understood um I just didn't know if again I from the plant I couldn't tell what was front of house what was I'm assuming the front of house was front we did we do have two we have two handicap back there and more with the where we believe will be the more intensive retail use and stuff we have four parking spaces including one so we have one more than required in terms have handicap spaces um and we do have a van two van accessible spaces no I just I saw that and then um I mean that was that was some of then obviously with the restaurant you may get a bigger bigger dumpster pad if you if you start getting more might no tenants at this point we we've we've drawn some interest on it but until you start yeah what I found out is until you actually put a shovel on the ground they're not coming unfortunately the billig exterior and building exterior signage will be in compliance with the town's current design criteria correct yeah the idea is to do sort of like this picture you seen with some Stone on the bottom and then the hotti plank above that and then the back of the building will most likely be steel you know the metal building is industrial David did you have any questions uh no I guess the only thing I I'm looking at is is you know if you had a a restaurant or something second means of eress is going to have to go down the stairs out the back and in the architectural designs will pick up on all that you know so at one point um once we talk with the arch and we'll get that if this a restaurant that's more architectural but just understanding and that'll go through the that'll be you know building the p and so we do have a a few memos here we had um the Board of Health um there were some questions I know you acknowledge those Bob so you must have seen that yes um we also have you saw in regards to the Turning radi um and also the sprinkler connection location yep and um the calculation required yeah so quick answer to those we we I didn't show a fire department connection but we will um you know the location really of the of the fire chief's Choice um there are there is a hydrant here which were was on the plans it's easy to miss miss but there's a hydrant right in front and then in terms of the water calculations we will with city of Taunton will'll do a hydrant test or flow test at that hydrant and and then we'll size appropriately size the uh the line to service the uh fire suppression system okay and we also had a uh comment from the open space committee um just mentions that it's within a priority Development Area only recommendations are that uh site Landscaping include native shrubs and trees around the perimeter and wherever appropriate to enhance the attractiveness of the facility and ensure to keep materials away from the brook that runs through the area to avoid contamination issues yeah so all the I did you know in the landscape plan those are all native plants that have been specified um I believe yes yes those are all Native Massachusetts plants that were specified okay I I no Liz would know I just from doing a few I'm no expert but those I know those are um no I know we'd probably be looking for a peer review um Kathy had we reached out to peer review at this have not yet one yet no okay we're just wanted to make sure you have the parameters of what we want to looked out okay so um it seems pretty straightforward I don't think we need traffic it's on 44 um civil and storm order um we have the light the photo Matra already in here that's good um anything else I can't think of anything else Madam chair I would just just add um you know um if they look at the oil and gas waste any hazardous waste it was labeled on the plans just have them look up those particular items um will there be a floor plan provided or use that open ended still yeah open yeah it'll just be an open building and then built out as stand so you know I have a few other questions is it okay if I yes ask um uh the burm height um I didn't see the the height on them maybe it was there and I just missed it which which the burm between the two properties where the parking is the area between those so there's no confusion between two areas so the the back um I guess it says bit first up I I'll be a little clear but that back uh ranges from basically a 6in grade difference to at one point it's about two feet of difference between from one and our side being higher than their side and I think Bob I think the intent of that was is to make sure that we have enough cover over the existing seting systems that are there so that could potentially go down a little lower as long as the cover is correct over the systems correct yeah yeah but it's yeah right right that was based on some as built elevations probably what what it will be just concerned cars driving right through through they wouldn't be able to drive through I I'm not sure I did not know about the elevations yeah right right there there's so thank you for that sure um uh is there going to be any proposed drive-throughs do you anticipate that as being part of you no not with the way though amenable and then the only other question would have is you have to contact Mast dot as though you may not be on Mast dot roadway you are very close adjacent yeah adjacent to it will you have to contact mot will you be able to provide us with any of that information as well we already have access so I think uh curb Cut's going to be on Millennium Circle which is a private way so I would say no mean I me but I'm not an exper well I mean ifw comes back with a comment yeah just to make sure yeah it's pretty close to 44 and knowing M do they may want to take a look at your project unfortunately that would be yeah difficult I appreciate the uh that that effort so we'll get environmental partners and and go from there for peer review and continue what do you say about a month which would be we got February 13th so is that process uh they give a cost estimate for the review and then we have to find the review and yep okay and then so we don't have to meet in the meantime you can get that from Kathy and and then um we can they can uh prepare their comments and then we can meet when you're ready to address their comments okay and then everything else you guys are fine with at this point um WE peer review comments on that yeah and and I mean you kind of heard us uh go through a decision for site plan review so you know that if anything changes when you go through Board of Health because you know there were some comments from them that we'd want to see anything that they require for a change yeah so in terms of um architectural plans um for the building what I thought was is we're going to get through this point of it and then know that we're it's a viable project at this point and then obviously have the architectural plans drawn for the building department at that point so that's why we wanted to come in with the inspiration and then what we had the still the the metal building guy did that rendering that you see there and then we'll get the real plants done after we get through this that was our thought yeah only comment I had on this was you know the nice nice glass nice fenestration there this is this is a little a little dead yeah well it's like I said yeah it's the Ste Mount guy so my only question was will we need to submit more detailed plans prior to approval or can it could be conditioned upon you mean for the elevation the building elevation yeah um those are fine oh okay okay great great wonderful will they meet will they meet subsection G of your site plan review with regard to the facade and it appears to okay we're in industrial Zone oh did you see them or not no I haven't seen anything just I just just from the just going from the last um from two to four Bedford remember right I mean so the the only thing is I mean there aren't Dimensions provided because they are just you know sketches but just wanted to make sure we into this another building yeah and that's what we planed on once we got through this the architect plans done submitting them to the building department and then obviously having them put on signs out front to show people what's coming you know so that's and I do want to say that you know this is a Redevelopment this is not developing you know an area that's been grow you know untouched and wooded or anything this is a Redevelopment this this is something I like to see in town I yeah I I drove by I was like I I I thought there was something there and it's just this dead area so it's it's nice to have this actually go into use it'll help raise the tax base so it's a good good thing very excited thank all right so with that does somebody want to make a motion to continue to February 13 yep I'll make a motion to continue to Harding Street till February 13th have a motion and a second all in favor I I all right we will see you next month thank you all right agenda item number six discussion regarding separation of lots on panary Drive Angela penetar wait sorry let see here it's going to be a little mixed up first of all I wasn't expecting this format e we pass out the plans to anybody lar so I mean I've seen same as what we seen the same is it the same did you already give them the PDF yeah we got them you got them you able to look at them yep is it what you did you print that too cuz he said he was going to bring him so no I I have one any want you want no no I have it on my phone here so I'm good so now you have not officially filed for an anr or anything so what is the purpose of this um meeting because it's got a little sticky and we're trying to see if the Ford agrees before we go forward well can I say something yeah uh my house was built 45 50 years ago and when I built the house everything was in compliance with the setb the front of the back and the side then then later on 20 years later they put the regulation of the circle m 50 ft radius and I still comply with that then they changed the uh circle from 150 ft radius to 160 so so they may may be my house now one corner of the house the circle goes in about 2 ft adjust is about two 2 square ft at the m 60 ft Circle that made the my house non-conforming so I don't understand the word nonconforming mean means not that is illegal no so it's pre-existing non-conforming it just means that it existed that way prior to the current bylaw but I I think it's non conforming with the existing bylaw so you're already pre-existing but I think what you're running into is an issue with creating an anr is that what well I don't understand how can have a any problem first of all the circle should not apply to the house in the first place because the circle was in place 20 years later the house was built if I am if I confirm with all ruer regulation of the town when the house is built how can you make something illegal or nonconforming so so this board hasn't made anything illegal it goes through town meeting anything zoning relating has to go through town meeting it has to pass by third majority vote so it's not up to this board it's up to the town of Lakeville so the town of Lakeville over the years has enacted various new zoning regulations Everybody Must adhere to so we can't give exceptions out of the bylaws because then we'd have to give them to everyone but so now you have a pre-existing non-conforming laot I guess I'm I'm not sure what what you're here asking me I think it sounds like maybe you need to get your own uh legal for is there was a piece of land piece of land that there was added to the my lot my lot where the house is is 132,000 square ft and it's got all all conforming setback and Frontage now I put a piece of land next to because I I had a horse farm and I put the when I did the subdivision the subdivision was 50 lot 45 Lots this piece of land I had to the house because I had a horse farm me and I need the more land for the horses so now the the land that I had to the house is enough of a two two more Lots tonight what I'm requesting requesting one lot approval because to confir with 160 ft heav and he had a lot confirm confir with the with with the house the house lot but when I'm going to go take off the second house lot I'll have a problem even if I have a circle that is confirmed without lot so I don't understand why something gets illegal after the fact I'm not sure uh what you're getting at honestly it's not it's actually not illegal it's just an existing nonconformance so B basic I'm Tina Murphy This is my dad Peter we both I currently live with him right now temp panary Drive he's got this Big Lot what I know it's four acres his house on he had the farm okay it added two other Lots whatever the square footage is on that okay the very end lot he's trying to sell okay is that the one that we're seeing here on this plan that shows one so that's what they want to sell okay and then he's going to keep the middle lot and then his main house is on and with the barn is on 4 Acres so basically the last lot he wants to be able to sell it off and then this is what this all came up to with the frontage stuff so he was in conform at the time and then over the years things have changed so in order to sell this lot he just wants to make sure everything is fine he wants to make sure it's a buildable correct okay so so that's all he's trying to do it sounds like he has to apply for an anr which is approval not required it just means that the lot has to be conforming that it has to conform to the bylaw so Kathy can provide you with anr forms and you just submit the filing so it's it's lot 1f right on this plan is that what it is I don't know but so you're showing a one a front FR yard Circle are you saying that that front yard circle is not 160 ft is that is conforming what conform now is the circle that would fit around the house so it doesn't have to go around the house it just has to fit there in that just happens to do that cuz that's the only space larg you know okay but what happened was the building Circle change size it got larger the so whereas it would fit before so whereas it would fit before now it doesn't so he has to put a circle somewhere else so you don't have enough Frontage yeah no only at the 40ft set back getting front you have 163 1 well so now there's another 30 right in between the 52 right no this is a lot of Frontage you're right or 20 20 20 ft you're good I'm sorry so so what do you so we have to see the diameter of that Circle though we have to see the front yard Circle diameter it has to be 160 ft excuse me is the circle got to be where the house is or someplace else as long as it fits within thatle then we it's got a touch within the frontage the front yard okay you have that setback it is it is touching it so but you have to show um you can endorse the ccle he can he's going to go to the building department and gets an yeah he already so so Madam chair if they have when they bring an an anr plan to you all you have to all you have to determine is if they have the appropriate Frontage if it's on a public way you end it there if it's on a private way you then have to determine if the if the Frontage is adequate for you know access emergency vehicles Etc so if they have 175 ft of Frontage then you endorse the anr plan however that endorsement of an anr plan does not mean that the lot is buildable so if there's 175 ft of Frontage the anr plan gets endorsed they go to the building department the building department determines if it's buildable or not that's not for this board so I suggest that we not even get into that because it's not your they haven't apped for no so there's really nothing we have to go and get an AR so we get that paperwork from you I don't I don't online too okay what what does that stand for NRA approval not required oh anr it's approval not required okay and so you're saying that the building department they would have to see the because I mean that's going to be a problem we're hoping that it's going to be buildable what do they do you even know what they're looking for to make it doable to be buildable so for a buildable lot you have to have a you have to have the required um Site Area the lot area that's all in the zoning bylaw the lot area and then you have to be able to site a dwelling yeah within proper setbacks setbacks being front setback side setback rear setback and things like that you also you know a buildable lot has to be able to perk or connect to sewer water things like that but that none of that is for the planning board okay so this was a mood Point coming here I guess I wasn't sure what what you were looking for okay all right I saw I I just came in to kind of help I didn't realize that they didn't get this all right so basically we got to start with going online and getting this filled out and as soon as that how long does that take to for the building would you say the building inspect Department well it has to come to the board for first right endorsement and then then you record that all right you might want to you might want to talk to the building department before you do before you go through the expense of of drafting an anr plan to be submitted to the planning board we have okay oh you already did y okay okay so you already filled that Nate darling said there shouldn't be an issue with doing the one lot because we can put a conforming Circle of the lot right cuz you have to make sure that your existing lot remains performing as well as the lot that you're tring what's left with the house would be conforming then but he's looking to get one more lot in the future and we're wondering if if you would support this being a non pre-existing nonconformity so with a C it almost makes it it doesn't look like you have the frontage you only have barely enough Frontage for these two oh he's got the frontage on panary drive but he doesn't own the lot next to it it's got the name of Ferris on it well it goes the other side oh over here mhm you like see this I have it I I can zoom well if if you already spoke with the Building Commissioner and he said you can get one lot that's what you can get like Town Council just said there there's nothing you don't have an application before you and I severely caution you to not go down the road when you don't have an application before you okay so you'll apply go through the building department and May we'll see you later another time all right we don't know like usually this process would take the application they've already talked to whatever I don't know who they spoke with but so I can get a pyramid can I get your approval now for the no no they can't do there's nothing even filed right now nothing's filed you guys are supposed to file something because you you got to go to the appeal board and try to correct this thing no you can come back with with a plan PE just like this one I got to come back with the plan to adjust these LW you have to file for for an anr approval not required and that would create two if if you have the two conforming lots and then from there as Town Council said you'd have to go to the building department to determine whether it's buildable all right so the faster we get this done start with the AMR we're going to start with the application you guys didn't do that yet right you didn't fill this out the application yet no all right that's what we got to do first I got to fill up the application yes for the approval of this law or or both either one oh both and then once they get then it goes to them we got to go to the building department first I don't know why they didn't tell you that well I think he said he did speak with yeah I know why why I'm sorry the building inspectors that give the approval no you have to board no to this board this board you just have to file you haven't filed you didn't apply you have to apply and there's also a payment for an anr okay but I still don't understand how can you make something all noncompliance when it would my house in my lot is also pre-existing non-conforming it just happens over time as the zoning bylaws are changed at town meeting it just happens because people want to maintain the rural character of the town they want bigger Lots they want but what what what happened on my house first of all the lock was not the circle was not required when I built I complied with all everything right but now you have to comply with the current it doesn't matter what it was at that point unfortunately it it's goes by the bylaws now now are in place that's what we Circle 150 ft radius and I still comply with it then all of a sudden they even change later on from 150 to 160 that makes my my lot no comp so that doesn't make any sense it's like you give me a license to drive a car at 21 then you change the law as you got to drive 26 I'm driving they put me to jail because I'm 21 they change the law make any different I don't know how to how expl got apply you know what we got to do yeah okay look I was I was 10 years on this board myself I was a chairman on this board the planning board for 10 years and I what I try to do every time as a board try to do everything by the law to the town but also it was possible to help people the people PID I've been paying tax on that house for 50 years and and then I I got all this well I you got to excuse me if I get upset I'm 855 years old I don't know how much time I got left okay thank you the only agravated with should have told him to we're just wasting time thank Youk we'll work on that well I was I was going to say it's you didn't waste time to come and talk to us but if you were looking for an approval you you you you need to go down the see things keep changing but it's unfortunate that you know as time goes on that things keep changing and it makes it bad for the like you're getting penalized you know you own something for a long time and then the laws keep changing so it just makes it hard I mean he had when he did this he was hoping to have two buildable Lots I mean fact there's other things that come into play I mean it's not parkable there's nothing you can do about it but you know it's just it's well the reason I wanted the second lot because in a couple years when mik there left I'm going to sell my house if I'm still alive and now it's too big for me and I want to build a smaller house on that second lot for myself well you might want to stick around till later there's other options coming along pass down from the state the adus so the what accessory dwelling units January that was yesterday it's you want to stick around like I said we got it later on the agenda we're not going to get into right now you want to listen to what they're saying some other stuff no it's recording I was 5 years 10 years on the planning board and years on the bo of health problem believe me there was a lot of problem thank you so much don't forget when when we were having the problem we were problem to to to close the landfill I saved $5.5 million to the town I got all the permit from the state the close Landfield and I built a transfer station which is still operating yes did a good job thank you thank you thank you he go St award nice all right thank you'll see you soon you're doing a good job thank you yes have a great night all right we got agenda item number seven open space residential development discussion regarding proposed bylaw so in our packet that we got today multiple items that kept trickling in because after our December 26th meeting we did have ask for feedback um from the various boards commissions committees we have a memo from the Conservation Commission we have a memo from the open space committee we have a memo from the select board um we also have an email from Brian day uh we have the uh Board of Health we have an email from Mary Jane liberator and I thought we had did I say open space already yeah M I did okay all right so we have all of these items as well as and I had taken some notes during our meeting but I guess that didn't get printed but so what I wanted to do is build off of the notes that I had taken as well as what we got in from the feedback here and we need to go back to addressing those four items that during our last meeting said that we have to look at what what we like what we what we don't like uh is it worth moving forward and send some feedback back to um the developer yes okay so just going down my notes I'm going to try to match it so we had Board of Health conceptual plan does not depict actual osrd plan number of watch should not exceed a quantity allowed through a conventional subdivision plan uh no septic system should be allowed on LS under 30,000 sare ft duplexes shown should be tied to wastewater treatment there must be Perpetual deed writer for 55 plus units wastewater treatment system should be moved far away from existing proposed homes and determine conclusively where the water for these units will be coming from so their memo um does stick with uh those items conceptual plan uh should depict an actual osrd duplexes shown should be tied to Waste Water treatment must be Perpetual deed Rider wastewater treatment uh system components create odor and noise should be moved 200 ft away from any Resident U property and the Water Source should come from a municipal water system or explain why this is not possible um I think the only thing that they left out was um no septic system should be allowed on the under 30,000 because that can create the uh nitrogen loading issue um so I think I will use their language for their five comments and then just add that um the other one regarding the size of the lot for the septic system because there were a section where they were showing um proposed units on septics so I think we should you know send those comments because um I mean they brought up a good point what we saw really wasn't an osrd no so it was it was we gave we gave certain I guess uh you know exceptions for the size and they they kind of cut that in half so it's like they said it's like a kind of look like a their 40b just on a a higher you know just with an osrd wrapped like a la you know label on it versus an actual something that more that would given because even even in the language of the OCD that we had uh discussed we do want to see not just all Wetlands we want to see it contiguous and I think that's even covered and what's that osr just uh so it's open space res residential development development okay thank you that's what I thought it was but I just want to make sure so the next um conservation all right so they're looking for additional information water source which is the same as the comment from Board of Health um an abbreviated notice of resource area delineation and the inrad for the additional parcel natural heritage review of complete site greater setbacks from Wetlands encourage passive walking paths instead of playgrounds at dog parks provide detailed to topographical overlays for the entire 308 acres in that identify all areas of concern um so those are still in line with what I had for notes as well so I think we should also use these comments add it to the uh Board of Health comments um next so planning board do we have any um additional the one comment that I had tied to planning board was um the better Road layout David you had made that comment make the egress onto County Street more accessible to the other units did planning board have any other planning board sort of items that you wanted to add to our comments I guess I'd like to say that you know and John had touched on it was that the open space ordinance that we have a draft of is nowhere is near what the conceptual plan is showing right so that's one of our first comments it's going to you know the conceptual plan show uh should depict an actual osrd plan so we're already sending that back that's one of the comments from Board of Health okay I I would wanted to also be a comment from the from this board okay as well I mean the comments aren't going to be coming from them these comments are coming from us we're taking input and we're sing these comments so okay these are all coming from planning board to the developer but we're we're just um taking all the input that we can get okay so so we're we're packaging everything up and exactly it'll create a better package with the more input that we get um from the tribe I only had the one item about the show overlay of top topography to be able to better determine areas of concern I feel as though that's all um covered and the conservation provide a detailed topog topographical overlay so I think that one's covered um and then we have the open space committee so they're asking please request if the developer would consider selling or donating the land to a conservation Coalition if a sale what is the asking price and time frame to complete the sale um do you think it's a a appropriate to ask I mean it's a priority protection parcel in town is it worth asking if consider I I mean you can ask but it's not part of the um an osrd yeah it's not part of an osrd but but there's no harm in asking okay as like a added at at the bottom or at the top exactly so exactly just yeah you a question I mean that can be asked of the owner at any time okay and so we haven't had a chance to meet with him yet so yeah um uh they're looking for additional information they're asking to walk the property I know they're not really going to see anything if they walk the property that's why they have fa review out there um doing that um addition of known Native American sites I know that a lot of the tribes don't the tribe doesn't want a lot of those areas known either cuz it can actually be detrimental if people know where it is they're going to go out there and it might get to destroyed uh recommendations to improve the open space offering all acreage counted and the 50% into conservation must be contiguous connected it was continuous but there was a lot of breakup with Wetlands so I we do want to see not just Wetlands connectivity we want to see Upland connectivity yeah I was thinking on on that score that uh you almost want to do uh kind of like we do on a subdivision plan where a lot uh can contain a a particular Circle you'd almost want to somehow describe this open space as being in one chunk and not uh not little pieces right scattered across so I think that's a comment to include is Upland connectivity at the open space yeah um consider Building A reduced number that's kind of in the this isn't an osrd let's see what what an actual osrd would be what is the number of buildable land uh buildable Lots because we know that they showed us 60 on one of the conceptual plans I know it wasn't for the whole paral but knowing the amount of wetlands that they may not even get 60 out of a um conventional subdivision plan so when we ask for an actual open space residential plan it would be looking to reduce that number of it so I don't think we need to add that as another condition or consider comment consider adding lot one approximately 10 acres to the offered open space to improve quality and accessibility of the open space land um depends on your bi obv I don't know how I feel about that I don't know if I agree with it to request those 10 acres I mean I could see a benefit to requesting it but I could also see that if the developer thinks that um they want to go for zoning change in the future maybe they're better off working with the town on something that's more amendable to the town less um impactful so maybe if they get their 10 acres of commercial and they haven't specified whether they want it industrial or business and we have those two distinctions and in this County Street area we do have existing business zones so it and Amy correct me if I'm wrong but it shouldn't be spot zoning if if it's able to connect to an existing business Zone area that's correct so I feel as though maybe that 10 acres could be something we could work with them on you can get your zoning change through town meeting you know if residents feel good about what they're proposing rather than this gigantic uh disturbance of uh 40b so that's just my thought um if you guys want to include this comment then I'm willing to yeah I consider it I think he obviously has a a different idea for that lot uh cuz it's under a different ownership name so no that's the it's all it so it's I believe it's his wife yeah no I I I understand that but but he did he did put two different names on it I mean yes it's still him yeah but uh sh companies H shell companies yeah yeah not not so much that but I it it it indicates to me that there's a a different idea for that for that yeah I would agree so is that a yes no you want to see those 10 included or is that a comment we don't want to include says lot one right the one on County yeah I would I wouldn't put it in there I just feel as though it could could work to to our advantage if if we want to go towards an osrd instead of the 40b mhm right so uh in favor of leaving it off yeah so I'm going to so from the open space I'd say ask about the price to sell and then the up con connectivity y um general question regarding osrd has the planning board or other Town entities investigated success of osrd yes I mean we've had I know have you have you worked with osr a town that has osrd uh yes but they called it there was like a Nuance of flexible development so that they were able it's more difficult in rural areas as you know for the septic to create that osrd without creating a community well system so uh and septic so those those were kind of still larger Lots but still saved many acres of land behind all contiguous in the one in 110 uh housing lots so it is doable each looks different um some are very more clustered very closer together usually using like a 55 plus kind of a a concept um with saving the area in the back or the front but usually they try to do something contiguous not broken up or disset you know in different sections of Duets or time um sorry um town houses yes yeah okay um and so yes obviously communities have had success with it that's why we're considering it because it I mean it's been in our housing production plan for years um I don't recall if it's in our master plan but I know it's in our housing production plan um and so the the last comment is open space committee believes the town should not enter into no SRD agreement with the developer to secure open spaceand if there are any concessions regarding standard subdivision policy that cannot be justified as not being detrimental to the Future development residents surrounding Town neighborhood okay so I have those comments to add to the ones we've already discussed um Amy could you just I know that you've spoken before about um um spot zoning could you just kind of go over what would qualify as spot zoning obviously 300 acres is not spot zoning but can you just explain why or how spot because we hear that tone that term being thrown around oh you can't do it it's spot zoning that you can't do osrd because it's spot zoning and for for specific um Parcels Parcels yeah um so normally with um normally with an osrd it's allowed it would be allowed in any residential zoning district and so you you normally wouldn't put it over one area um you could say put it in um you you could put it over a complete well you couldn't put it over one parcel that would be um that technically could be spot zoning um so what you would do is you would have a section an osrd section in your zoning bylaw and so any any conventional subdivision could become an osrd subdivision which is actually more beneficial for for the town because you end up with um a lot more preservation of wetlands and you get open space partials but now so for this item we're just looking to consider the area of Rocky Woods which is over 300 acres so you wouldn't want to consider a a zoning District that osrs are allowed in a zoning District by special permit because that that that is the normal course that is normally how osrs are presented in zoning bylaws they're Allowed by special permit in the residential zoning district and and and you do have the the element in here of of it being a parcel of 200 Acres or a specific number of Acres so you really um you really can't do that you can't you cannot limit it to a certain number of Acres because that um technically um is considered Flo a floating Zone which you wouldn't want to do okay yeah I I had that question too though because because that came up with the hospital site with the warehouse in in a way it did in a way yeah a little bit different but um is that considered the entire town um so um the other thing is if you wanted to do an osrd overlay and you would overlay this area that would be what we'd be looking at an overlay and so I would I would overlay um I would consider in the overlay perhaps um at you know not just this this 300 acres but overlay the area yeah okay and then it would not be in my opinion it would not be spot zoning okay um okay so what else do we have a select board um they basically have more questions um testing and planning has been performed there are echoing concerns from open space and conservation they' like to participate if there's future meetings uh they don't have a preference in either plan at this point but they're looking for a timeline which right now uh we're just composing proposing some comments to send back to developer team and depending on how they respond to our comments I guess that would dictate whether or not it goes to town meeting and whether there is a timeline um so those are really not promised to send back I don't see anything in there to really send back as a comment um and then we have Brian dve Brian dve please uh it's it seems like he's in favor of an osrd as opposed to a 40b um but right now I don't we're not really looking at an osrd from what from what was shown to us so I don't I don't know if there's anything in there that is there anything anyone Cas well yeah he just made the comment that I had made about the phase one it looked like in his in the 40b it looked like there was going to be a future phase and what we think and that's what they had said that they do plan on using the you know doing another phase with that other parcel parcel but but an osrd would incorporate that hole as of that 10 acres right no no no agreed um and then we have questions from Mary here um confirm the actual lot size of the home on the 40b developer indicated requiring perks would kill it yes the town required performance payment Bond project be more expensive um the project give us the right to insist upon topographic study that's one of the things we'll ask for are we able to require a more comprehensive plan that shows more details where the sewer treatment will be that's one of the questions from Board of Health uh moving it away one comments right they wen't moved away right so I think a lot of those are Incorporated in what we've discussed as well so at this point I I feel confident with sending back Board of Health um with the conservation has said as well as um asking the about the price to sell and um requesting Upland connectivity space nany do you have any other additional items you think that we should include um I think this has been a great exercise I love that the the entire community and everyone provided input on this osrd um I think you picked out really good items to include um I too was thinking overlay District including more of the parcel so that it's not a spot Zone um but that to if you wanted to do something townwide it would look slightly different I would think and and you would ass it such but you could do an overlay district for just this particular type of development as you are working with them to try to create something that looks and feels more like a community would want it to look so I think I would go with Noble a district that would be my suggestion so and and just a little history I know you're new to the town but I mean we we did bring an osrd to town meeting a few years back um the town voted it down at town meeting we went back to the drawing board um we incorporated a lot more input from various uh boards committees Etc um and then I myself was hesitant I have four four reasons why I'm really not thrilled about osrd over the whole town and to me this was kind of like let's see how it goes here you know if it if it's a good option let's see how it goes in this area and and maybe determine whether or not it makes sense to do it in other areas if if so and so maybe it goes from an overlay to yeah a bylaw a full bylaw yeah so the the only one other item I would include too is that the the land the open space land be held in a land trust or by an entity so that it's not held by the owner or right but somehow it's held by an authority that actually can pay attention to the open space portion of the property so I know when we had um one of the drafts of the osrd included uh article 97 so that it it was you know perpetual and and um I I don't think it it specified What entity but it gave some options of of those entities because I've seen it the opposite where they they went to the trouble to do something similar and they saved a good portion of the property and then they left it with the homeowners association and I just felt like a missing opportunity and that was something that did come out with one of the drafts that we were didn't want it left with ho yeah right yeah that my concern was like who's going to maintain this then they're not going to want to maintain it and then they're going to say it's they're say it's theirs and that's that's it's in the HOA to you have to constantly pay attention to it to make sure it stays that way and I've seen actual land in the subdivision go back to a property M being developed yeah cuz it wasn't in perpetuity like subdivision 30 years ago it didn't last into perpetuity so you want to make sure that the open space piece stays in perpetuity with an authority that can manage it so I see that as when we draft language yeah mhm so but maybe not a comment back to the developer if that makes sense y okay um so who wants to dra this so I mean I mean you have you basically have to just you know copy and paste from the yeah like the items what I do is I'll take the comments and that we've talked about tonight and the ones that you provided put them all together send them out for comment and you know specifically bring them back to me separately um just so that we're not breaking any open meeting laws and then make a you know uh make a final draft I'll give it give it to you and and maybe if you want I could share it with the others who have made comments as well maybe post it on the website so others can see U I don't know if that's something that is something that would be advisable so I mean at this point these are all public and so if we're just using these I don't see the need to like do it again replicate it so I would say take the Board of Health copy and paste they're five okay um and plus the the one about the lot size cuz um they did have the smaller I think it was like 8,000 foot lots and uh Derek was specific that these 8,000 ft Lots cannot have septic on them and I know the Board of Health regulation says nothing under 30,000 um so I think just add that one to the Board of Health and then the Conservation Commission items y um copy and paste right out there 1 two three four five six bullet points um the planning board the one out of our comments from my notes was just about the road layout um make the egress onto County more accessible um and then from open space um it was it was basically 4 C but just kind of change the language just to make sure that it says that the up the open space should have contiguous Upland y and um and then add the the question about would the developer consider selling and what would what would that price be okay um and that was everything sure good that's what we'll send back to Bob M okay Cathy I know you said he was on vacation did you ever get a contact while he's gone or no you can still him through email oh you can okay we can send it over to them um and we will see what they come back with and that will determine our next steps with us that's good all right yeah nice job okay moving on before you I one question yes um my understanding of osrd has always been that you take a number of bite units the entire parcel and press them space same number okay so you guys have any consideration so that was the first qu the first comment from Board of Health that we want to see it resemble an osrd more so 61 units not 136 so I I'm not sure what that so the 61 units was for a portion of it um not the whole thing so we'll see what they come back with because obviously 214 to 60 is a stretch so they might tell us forget the osrd we're just going to go back to the 40b but we'll see what they come back with when we send them these comments okay so um more questions yep um two questions um the first question is what's the existing zoning of the parcel that you're discussing for that overlay District it's residential okay um if you do the if you if you go the overlay District um it's really important because ownership changes so you created an overlay district for an open space bylaw well so now it's special permit so still understand I understand the special permit and at the Lake bille Hospital they even went so far as a development agreement right uh which was part of the bylaw right and as soon as Nationals sold it the development agreement went out and all of a sudden what was originally conceived for that overlay District under a mixed use bylaw suddenly became it's right based on what the bylaw says not the underlying um the develop zoning okay but we're not there yet so but but I'm just throwing a word of caution out in as much as we advocated for the Lakeville hospital as a mixed use because we thought it was a good concept and we would have never changed the zoning from what it was if we realized that as soon as the property was sold the development agreement went out because the development agreement was kind of a way of achieving the special permit key points so so the only the only thing I'm saying I I like what you said about it not applying all over the town until we get the Kinks out yeah because one of the issues which you brought up when it was at Town floor was how is the open space administered how's it taxed how's it maintained those were issues that were never really resolved in the first first bylaw it said it might go this way it might go this way it might go this way but there was a lot of confusion because there hadn't been a lot of information meetings explaining the bylaw so if we do go this route I'm really putting up a red flag that says create that zoning bylaw language so that you'll be happy with a new owner who has a total different conception plan for the site right so and we could make it carry with the land right could we if it's the underlying district is always and Amy can correct me if I'm wrong is the is the district the overlay is is secondary in in in reality um and it can be used if that new owner wishes to exercise its right to use the open space residential design but they can also use the strength of the underlying District which is residential and create a conventional subdivision they could also do a 40b oh they could also do a 40b correct all right so moving on thank you for your comment but we're not there yet we'll we'll get there if if we get there how important Lang that the zoning in our bylaws is what we want to achieve I'm sorry I'm going to cut you off Mr Scott it's getting late okay we're going to move along all right um number eight disc discussion regarding draft regulations for accessory dwelling units and provide feedback possible vote all right um Amy I'm glad that you stayed for this I was going to let you go but I wanted you he because um you're such a pro at the adus already so what um you you were part of presenting the original Adu roll out and now they've come with us uh come with some further guide guidelines um it I know you were concerned about the setbacks Etc so it seems like those things have not been cut in half or anything is anything sure so um so just to um I'm just pulling it up so just to um let you know um KP law has drafted um comments to submit tomorrow um I'm also attending the public hearing tomorrow at 10:00 at hlc um the draft regulations I think are five pages and our comments are right now single spaced four pages so we are we PR we think that we are we have covered everything um and I will not get I won't go through them all because we'll be here till midnight but um you know the first thing is that um the draft regulations um they site to uh the fact that they plan on also issuing guidance and um based on the um Milton decision that was issued Yesterday by the Supreme Judicial Court um we really do not hlc should not be drafting guid guidelines they should be drafting the regulations which they've drafted we pointed that out there's a lot of problems with um some of the definitions um I don't think that I I I don't think any of the problems with the definitions really um affect Lakeville um one of the definitions that's a problematic is a bus stop which um some towns have these regional Bus um bus lines that you can wave them down and if you have one of those running through your town that entire route is a bus is a bus station so you cannot regulate parking within a half mile of that entire route so that's a that's problematic um Commuter Rail station is is seasonal but ferry service is not seasonal that's problematic um gross floor area is a bit problematic simply because it does not it's not in line with the State Building Code um and then the some of the bigger issues are um principal dwelling it the um the definition states that a principal dwelling shall uh contain at least one dwelling unit which means that a principal dwelling could be a two family or it could be a multif family um and and that's really in in our opinion that's not really in line with the um with the intent of the legislation because the legislation reference single family zoning districts so really I think the legislation was let's let's allow adus to single family houses so we we've made that comment um the um the protected use Adu um it says that um it's that no other accessory dwelling unit is located on such a lot well the problem there is that many cities and towns already have adus on lots and so if the Adu on an existing Adu meets the requirements of the definition meaning that it's less than 900 ft does that become the protected Adu or do they get another protected Adu so um so that's that's a question the biggest um issue so far is the single family residential zoning District which basically says that it's um it's allowed um any uh it's allowed by by special permit variance waiver or other zoning relief or discretionary zoning approval which means that a town that has a um allows for use variances that means that um adus are allowed anywhere in town and that's clearly not what the legislature intended um there's also um there's some issues with um the design standards so what the um the regulations basically say that you can allow site plan approval for adus but that site plan approval cannot be more stringent than any um oversight or regulation that you have on a single family dwelling well there's very very few cities and towns that have site plan review for single family dwellings in fact the only two municipalities that I know that have site plan for single family dwellings are when the single family dwelling gets to a certain size meaning a huge one then they have to go to site plan um and so that basically what they're what they're kind of alluding to is that you can't have site plan approval for an Adu unless you have it for a single family dwelling and that's not the legislation specifically states that you can have site plan review so that that's problematic um and then um there's other um issues with regard to pre-existing non-conforming which is um so if you have a single family dwelling that's pre-existing non-conforming and you want to add an Adu that means that you have to get a section six finding of chapter 4A section 6 finding because you're increasing a pre-existing non-conforming structure here they say that you cannot require any kind of discretionary approval so essentially they're trying to get these regulations to usurp a a statute which you can't do um so that is another um uh there's questions regarding the short-term rentals um there's also um they have um they have a a a mention about um adus in historic districts which historic districts are regulated by General bylaws and this is a zoning bylaw so that causes confusion um and um the um in their regulations when talking about multiple adus on one lot um they have language that states or the rental thereof which the way that it's written it sounds like a special permit is required for the rental of of a second Adu which is that's obviously not within um the legislation and then finally the um the last section requires annual updates and I know that this this sounds a little picky and and minor but it requires that yearly that the a city or town has to has to yearly um provide an inventory to hlc and you know coming from a town that didn't have a town planner that would have fallen on somebody and and who knows who either the building department planning so and that's not in the legislation they they really can't require all these extra things so and while it's probably not a big deal because a lot of cities and towns have online permitting so you could just probably do some kind of formula and come up with you know could probably produce it in two seconds I couldn't but somebody that's technical could um but anyway we did comment on that fact that that's not within the legis ation so um so we are submitting comments um now Who Who Are You submitting it on behalf on our on behalf of our firm we we on you know we list we state that we represent numerous cities you know numerous municipalities throughout the Commonwealth okay um I'm happy to provide a draft to um to Nancy um and then you guys can just I mean they are due tomorrow tomorrow the comments yeah oh so see the Sor wanted us to send them comments to be included with their comments so I guess if we send them it's not going to make it in time no they have to be submitted by midnight tomorrow okay so yeah the S Bo is not meeting tomorrow I would only pay you back on she just someone else I can can I ask you a question too so under section two prohibitive regulation number D unit caps and density uh protected the last sentence protected uh use ad use shall not be counted in any density calculations and I know this was a question that came up a lot of times we wanted to know how is this going to affect our our housing inventory for the Shi units does that mean if they're not going to be counted in density does that mean are they going to be they're not going to be counted they will not make our housing stock inventory go up correct so it's not going to go against our Shi No it should that is a relief to me it shouldn't um so yes so it said they shall not be counted in any density calculations so um that is how we are interpreting it we actually in our comments want that clar we ask for that to be clarified and in our comments we put that um you have some of sometimes you have a sewer or water moratorium and in that case if you have an Adu that has a separate sewer connection that's going to count so it has to so I don't it doesn't have to do with density it more has to do with um with moratoriums things like that but um I think that that's in there it's in the regulations I think to clarify that it's not going to impact your Shi okay hopefully I me I I know just from town meeting Bara mosy had mentioned the design standards which like you said it was hard to quantify because of cycline you doesn't call so is there anything that we can do to maybe make our comments heard through you since you're submitting it I know you said that you represent certain towns to can you is it worth specifying like the planning board voted ously to or like is is echoing these or what do you suggest um because we have we obviously can't send it to select board go right um you know I I'm not you could um actually you could probably just submit a comment that says that um you know that you uh the Lakefield planning bo uh planning board supports you know KP laws um comments but I don't even know if that's necessary I actually um I can tell I don't plan on um I actually don't plan on submitting our comments until after the public hearing tomorrow because in case I hear something from somebody else I want to throw it in um just to add you know to support somebody else's comments so I want to keep them but um so and and and I can tell you that um there's a lot of comments people have a lot of people have seen in comments so so I I think you can feel reassured that you're covered okay yeah all right but I mean I kind of like if we can use our voice and and if you can send it to Nancy and then are I know you're only working a half a day tomorrow but um I can I can if you want me to put a quick letter together similar to what you just said just supporting um KP Law's give a voice at least to the town yeah I'll can you come by early and sign it or I could leave it at you know if I leave a little early I could just let me know when ready and I'll stop by we ship it right out all right yeah okay perect perfect um did anybody else have anything else they wanted to add on the Adu discussion I just had one question maybe this is directed towards towards Amy more there is um some Rumblings that there's going to be maybe moratoriums for adus in some communities in order to prepare themselves for their bylaws oh and how do you um I don't have enough details I I know the community you're talking about um there's um they have asked that question of us and I haven't answered it because I don't have enough details but um there is a uh there's there's stringent case law out there that dictates how you can have a moratorium and to have a moratorium you have to there has to be a recognized problem there has to be studies it has to be um it has to be a definite time um and usually it has to be a bylaw it has to be in your you know a zoning it has to be part of town town meeting has to vote on it um that that's when there's that's when there's a a bylaw that affects when that's when the moratorium affects something that's allowed in a bylaw um like for example a sewer moratorium does not necessarily have to go to town meeting although actually it does so I I I don't see I don't really see a mechanism for a moratorium at this time and actually you know what I had one thing uh short-term rentals it defines short-term rentals is it is it allowing it as a short term rental um no that that's our comment is that it's it's very confusing so um you can you can allow adus to to be short to to be used as short-term rentals or you can prohibit adus from being used as short-term rent can prohibit it okay because it seems to be you know short-term rentals are not providing housing it's usually like you know Airbnb or something you're making income so it's not really providing housing so I feel like that shouldn't be part of it mhm but but right that's more of a concern for um cape and Island towns okay as to whether they are okay but if we draft a b like because I know we want we talked about drafting potentially further language to add to our bylaw but I think we have to wait until whatever we definitely have to wait until final final regulations come out because it sounds from the comments that I've received from some of my towns um there and then there was a um there was a seminar an mmla seminar um yesterday um where the presenter brought up almost the exact same problem so I do think I mean I I guess I hope that hlc will listen to the comments and make changes yeah so there should be changes good I'm doing a note to myself to send you the turn all right um agenda item number nine administrative update to4 Bedford Street we have an appeal for two4 bedro Street um that was a denied site plan review based on design standards I know our planning department has been working on Gathering uh meeting minutes and notes Etc if there um and I know you've actually had experience with this Amy so that's good yes so we have um just um in terms of the litigation we have a um we have a case management conference with land court on uh February 11th um which is uh the case management conference they only do these in land court and it's just where um The Count Council meets with the judge to go over the case and set deadlines for Discovery and things like that okay so I will um I'll I'll know more um after the 11th and if we needed to schedule an executive session to discuss it I would I'll schedule that okay great um Pine crust Village approved Covenant there was a question about the Covenant here it is I guess there were two numbers that were conflicting and I believe number three 16 right is that saying um yeah number three and number 16 either drainage including structures pipe L seed or aity needs to be in place prior to any building permits trust me you will likely need to start with covenants on both Lots or Covenant on one lot along with shy for drainage so Madam chair I believe that uh Nate darling had worked at out with with law and and they felt that it was fine to move forward it is okay so it's all set we don't have to so Robin Stein from our office she does all of the um covenants and shies and she T she spoke with me today in yeah okay so that's all set we don't need to do anything on it perfect all right um 13 Main Street you just need to sign it I need to sign it yeah okay that needs to be signed is it here okay um 13 Main Street approve lease amendments so they acknowledged um putting it into the lease agreement that we had asked to um reference the addendum for the 55 plus component um I don't see in the highlighted but TR Kathy do you know where he included it honestly I didn't even have a chance to look at it I think I had sent that to Amy though also in I didn't when did it come in maybe you did Kathy I haven't seen it sorry crazy week I know it's almost not worth going away so do we just want to do we want to just continue to make sure that it's in here because I didn't I looked through the highlighted hoping to see it and I didn't see it I couldn't find it and then also I think there were two things that you said to um include you was supposed to take it out take it from a Denim and put it into the least actually but um should we continue this to next meeting and just give you some some time just to make sure that it was included as as uh requested I guess I don't see it sorry all right so um Kathy let's put um 13 Main Street approve the lease Amendment on our next agenda for the 23rd I believe it is yeah the 23rd uh yeah January 23rd so we'll just make sure that uh the items that Council had asked for are in there um agenda item number 10 AM you're good to go than thank you can I keep this Jack can I keep this one thanks um agenda item number 10 approved the November 26 2024 meeting minute um I just had one item on page three Kathy on that first paragraph um starting at the second sentence from the bottom of that paragraph attorney qule said they had stated that there would be no comment and it was requested that the public hearing be closed just I I think the applicant I think she said yeah the applicant requested so just maybe specify that the applicant had uh requested that's all but other than that yeah I wasn't there I watched it though okay Happ any other edits to the minutes I just had some very minor uh due to technological issues that sentence uh where the time stamps are just put pm and same thing last page meeting inurance 7:44 p.m. that's all all right someone like to make a motion to approve with those my edits I make there I make a motion to approve the minutes of the meeting for the Tuesday November 26 2024 um remote meeting motion second all in favor Iain motion carries all right any other business someone want to make a motion to adjourn make a motion to adjourn motion and a second all in favor I I motion meeting is adjourned