[Music] Good evening. Call to order the zoning board appeals meeting of Thursday, October 16th at Lakeville Public Library. Our first agenda item is the continuation of the Patel hearing for 90 Main Street.
I believe the last time we saw you, sir, you want to come on up? We need it to get stamped plans. >> I think we have stamped plans. We have a stamp. That's what I was asking. So, Jeff, why don't you tell us if we have what we need now?
>> You have what you need. This is exactly what I wanted and nothing else has changed from your application since last time. Correct. >> Yeah. >> Okay. >> Yes. Yeah. >> So, with that, I encourage the guy to make if he wants if he's so inclined to make a motion since he has what he wants
now. I do it. I make a motion. We approve this special. >> I second. >> We have any further discussion? All in favor? >> I opposed. Motion carries unanimously. >> Kathy, you tell Mr. Patel what's next.
>> So, we have two weeks to do the paperwork. After that, it goes to the town clerk where it stays for 20 days. So, there if in case there's appeals, if there's no appeals, I will contact you to come pick it up. >> Okay. And then why we have to go to the building department.
>> So then you would go to the registry of deeds. You record that decision and then you bring your receipt to the building department. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> And they'll give you a permit and you'll be good to go. >> Thank you. >> You're welcome. Have a good evening. >> Thank you.
>> Okay. Next agenda item. Make sure I do these in the right order here. Yes. Okay. So, Lakeville Zoning Board of Appeals acting in accordance with master law chapter 48 as amended will conduct a public hearing on Thursday, October 16th, 7 p.m. Lakeville Public Library
for Precinct Street. Petition of Derek Maxi. Special permit is requested under section 270-4.1 and section 270-7.438 allow construction of single family dwelling located in the business zone. Property site is 34 Reservoir Avenue and
your documents were available to be viewed at the planning department. >> Good evening, Mr. Max. >> Good evening, folks. How we doing? >> Hang on one second. >> Yeah. Did what address did you just read? 31. Thank you. 31 Reservoir. >> All right, let's start again. Good evening, Mr. Maxi. How are you?
>> Good evening, Derek Maxi, 55 Longpoint Road, Lakeville. >> So, why don't you tell us what you're going to do? Then I'll read some stuff into the record and we'll go from there. >> Okay. If I may, Mr. Jim, if I just pass out copy of the plan so everybody has one. >> Absolutely. >> I think you may already have it, but it's the two lots one and lot two.
>> I got you. >> Yeah, we do have it. But >> yeah, just kill some more trees there. >> You don't want to recycle. >> All right. So, I'll wait for you. >> You're good. >> Yeah. So basically uh the life of
country club all the property there is zon business and uh as you know that everywhere around me is pretty much residential and all the on the other side of reservoir a is all residential. So instead of trying to do some business on that road it's a dead end road. I think everybody would rather see it
residential. So I I think that's the right way to go. So I'm planning to put two houses there at some point but this is the first step. >> Okay. >> Plain and simple. So, um, >> planned with your approval, I should say. >> Can't do much without us,
>> right? >> Um, okay. So, I do have a letter to read into the record from the Lakeville Planning Board dated October 6th at their Thursday, September 25th meeting. The planning board reviewed the above reference petitions. A hearing for the
zoning board of appeals. Board supports the petition to allow a residential dwelling in the business zone. Um other than that uh as the petitioner pointed out uh the
only reason he is before us is because it's own business and without us issuing special permit they cannot construct anything residential. So, do we have any questions or have a question? You go see Nancy already. >> Concom. Yeah.
>> Yes. Yeah. >> And we're actually uh well over 100 ft from the reservoirs out of there. So, we're actually 200 feet away. >> Yeah. Well, the other question I have is it's in the ninth fairway. The ninth fairway right there or the 18th fairway. >> The 18th fairway. Yes. Yeah. the uh lot
one, the house will be right up near the street and lot two will actually be kind of around the corner uh where it says parcel >> cuz I have a tendency when I played there to slice it a little bit and it ended up where the houses are.
>> Me too. And we plan to shorten up that that fairway anyways uh for that reason because right now they're hitting the houses that are prior to that. So we've already shortened it up so that would be prohibited from happening. So, you're going to redesign that to avoid
>> which we already started doing that. Yes. >> So, real quick, so >> I go down there with my bikes, the girls all the time. Yeah. And we turn around at your gate, right? So, >> you're saying this lot two is going to
be how far to that >> gate? Uh, and then how far into the 18th hole will that go? >> Yeah. So, lot two, the house will go basically, I'm assuming, probably where parcel A is. Uh, the the gate will
actually be it'll still be there, but it will only be for that house. There's the gate's not going to be I know that's a big concern. Will traffic come that way? Absolutely not. Uh because this property is going to be actually taken away the access for there. Okay.
And then for the usage going forward, you said you're shortening the hole the golf course behind that. >> You're modifying it. Yes. >> Okay. >> Yeah. >> Okay. So, will they still be going through that particular playing in that area where it's
>> Yeah. I don't plan on selling the houses. So, we're going to let it's they're going to keep I'm probably just going to rent them out. I want to keep the houses because it is on the course so I can keep access to that land down below. >> Okay. I'm good. Thank you. >> Anything any additional questions?
>> Not yet. >> Not yet. Okay. >> I don't have any questions. >> Chris's. >> No, >> I have a question. It's really not pertinent. So, it was more of just a curiosity. >> Curiosity. >> How How do you handle the grade change?
It's quite a drop off. So, if you were to go to the site, lot one right now, I have the house pretty much staked out where it's going to go. It's going to be 40 ft off the street and that's staked out and it's going to have a basically they're both going to have walk that one's going to have a walk out seller. The other one will not
cuz that's pretty much level ground over there. >> Yeah. >> So, uh, anyone in the audience have any questions or want to make any comments? Come on up to the podium, sir. Tell us your name and address and
>> Sure. >> This may not be the most appropriate question, but anyhow, >> can you tell us your name? >> Sure. Tom Barone. Uh, I own 16 Reservoir Avenue together with my wife and I own 13 Reservoir Avenue outright. So, um my
question is um really how this uh designation of these two housing lots will tie into any future development of the senior housing because it seems like the 18th hole is really going to be
nonfunctional um you know with with any houses built on these two lots. >> Have any answer that question? >> Sure, Mr. Chairman. So, there's a pro a proposal that went Tuesday to the select board and the planning board. And the
proposal is to build uh senior housing uh quite a few of them. I think it's 424. That's their proposal. Uh but in this case, they're going to convert it down to it's going to be a 9-hole golf course and not 18. So, they're just going to pick the holes that'll work for it.
>> So, exactly which ones are going to be it could be gone. Right. So, do you have a plan for the remainder of the 18th fairway that's not affected by 31 and 33 reservoir? >> Not at this not at this point. There is
a there should be a public record one at the town because they just met with them Tuesday. Uh but I do not have a plan with me. >> Right. Okay. And the the lots seem to extend into the small ponds that are on the course
there. Are there any concerns from the conservation commission or um with regard to the water quality there? >> Right. So the the question is is it going to is it going to affect the ponds at all? >> Right. >> And the obviously Kong would not let
that happen and and we are going to be 200 feet away and any gutters or anything like that. It's going to be pitched obviously where it needs to go. Nothing's going to go in the pond. >> When did you file with Con? Uh, it's been quite it's been quite a while now. On this this one here, I did not file on
these two because they're 200 feet away. >> Okay. >> Sorry. >> You're just you're talking about the other development, >> correct? >> Nothing to do with this board. >> So, you're going to be 200 feet away from those small ponds or 200 feet away from the bigger pond
that's called the reservoir. Yeah, we're not close to the reservoir, but we are going to be 200 feet away from lot one's going to be over 200 feet away. Lot I can see the line here. I just can't read it. Uh, but we're definitely going to be further away. And if there is any
concern, I'd have I would get Concom's approval. >> Yeah, I mean, I can't remember the lot in my head on 31, but 33 the the back line of the lot is right halfway through the pump. >> So, sir, are you concerned? your concern
for the ponds. Is that what your concern is or you just curious? >> Well, just a general understanding it, you know, Mr. Maxis has had multiple uh ambitions for development of the golf course property and this one seems
pretty benign on its face, but you know um knowing that he has broader ambitions, I'm I'm just curious what what's in the future, you know, and the the ponds. It's hard for me to believe that the
house will be at least 200 feet away from the existing small ponds. I can see it. Clearly, it's going to be more than 200 feet away from the bigger pond, the so-called reservoir. >> So, just for your edification, and
anybody wants to question, and I'm not saying 100% right all the time, so I'm awful. Somebody keep me honest here, but we're permitting him. We would be permitting him to build a house there, >> right? >> He would still have to go through
pulling the permit and giving plans and designs and whatnot. And if and in that case, if it was within any setback areas or too close, then the he would still have to go before Conom and get their approval because the building commissioner would would still go
through the regular application process. If this, for example, were already zoned residential and he didn't have to come to us and he went and pulled the permit, he would if it was within a certain setback area or the plan showed that it was going to infringe or it shouldn't infringe, he would be required to go before Concom anyway. So, the safeguard
is still going to be there. He's just coming to us to see if this board will approve a special permit to allow him to change the use where it's not zoned to be used for residential. >> Understood. Yeah. Just a lot of my
concern is just general concern. >> I hear you. Unfortunately. >> Okay. It's a wellestablished neighborhood >> and it's been a joy to live in that neighborhood for a long time. So, >> understood. >> Thank you. >> Okay. >> Thank you.
>> Anyone else have any questions or >> any follow up? Go ahead. >> Uh do you have any specific timelines, Mr. Maxi on on like when you expect to develop it and are you going to develop it like uh simultaneously or >> No, I have no timeline. I I just knew
this was a procedure because as far as I was concerned, a lot of the neighbors would not want me to do business there and which is what's allowed. So, in this case, I'm committing to doing the residential which which fits the neighborhood better, but I don't know when
>> and all the neighbors were notified. So, People were concerned we would have more than two people sitting in the audience, but this is my guess. >> Any followup questions for any of the board members? >> No.
>> Well, I don't have any questions. Um, usually in these scenarios, I kind of defer to what I just stated. Obviously, the neighbors are the ones who would be mostly impacted and as Mr. Maxi said, most of this area is residential. Anyways the golf course so I don't see
any major concerns but that's just me else. So we have a fork in the road we either make a motion or we I'll make a motion we approve this permit to construct the single family home in the business
31 resolution. We have a second >> second. Any further discussion? All in favor? >> I opposed. Motion carries unanimously. >> So before I have Kathy do her spiel, why don't I just take care of the duplicate
right now? >> And I can wave the spiel. I've heard >> she's not failing me tonight. >> I'm not I'm not uh waving anything here. Anybody coming back to do something the right way? You don't have to get up and say that same speech again, though. Don't worry about it. I'm not going to
make you get back up there. Um, Lakeville Court of Appeals, acting in accordance with Mass General Law, chapter 48, as amended, will conduct a public hearing on Tuesday, October 16th, Lakeville Library, precinct street on the petition to Derek Maxi for a special permit requested under section 274.1 and
section 377.438 to allow the construction of single family dwelling located in the business zone. Property is 33 Reservoir Avenue. application and documents were available at the planning department. So, is this a duplicate application, sir,
other than the address change? >> Yes, it is. Yes, sir. >> Do we have any additional questions in regards to this one? >> Nope. >> No. >> Anyone in the audience?
He wants to get back up and talk again. I can tell. Um, all right. I'm wondering if they're going to be slat ranges like this. >> Well, you can talk to him about what he's going to put up afterwards. Um, >> I make a motion.
>> I'll make a motion we grant him a special permit to put a single family home in the business zone. 33 Reservoir Avenue. There is a second. >> Second. >> Any further discussion? All in favor? >> I opposed. Motion carries unanimously.
Thank you. >> All right. Don't go too far there, Derek. This one's not okay. Lakeville Zoning Board of Appeals acting in accordance with Mass General Law Chapter 48 as amended will conduct a public hearing on Thursday, October
16th, 7 p.m. Lakeville Public Library for Precinct Street. Upon the petition of Derek Maxi, the special permit is requested under section 270-6.3 C1 and section 270-7.45C 45C to allow the maximum aggregate of building size
to exceed the allowed 1,000 square ft. The property is 55 Longpoint Road. Documents and applications were available at the planning department. So um before you jump in, let me just read the planning board memo um from the
planning board dated October 6, 55 Longpoint Road, Thursday, September 25th meeting. The planning board reviewed the above reference petition for hearing from the Board of Appeals. The board has no comments regarding this petition. And I believe that is the only
Yes, that's the only memo I have to read into the record. So, looks like you want to make something a little bigger than you allowed to. So, why don't you tell us what you want to do? >> Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Derek Maxi, 55 Longpoint Road in Lakeville. And if I may, I'd like to just hand out some just
a packet so you can look at it. Okay. >> I'm assuming that's what you book in the bill. >> Yes. >> It's always helpful. And there's a also a photo here of the existing house that I live in now, >> which I'm trying to duplicate that >> with a gr.
[Applause] [Music] >> Yes. Yeah. So, I live in a barn basically. It's the property down by Betty's neck, the deikas property. It's it was one of their original workshops that they had
back in the 30s and 40s and then we converted it into a single family onebedroom house. >> Yeah. So, Mr. Chairman, if I can keep going. >> Go right ahead there. >> Okay. So, uh the situation here is kind of unique. Uh back in July of 2024, I
had applied for a building permit to build this garage and did the I did some work put in some the survey and stuff like that. Uh and then recently as at sometime this year the bylaw changed to a thousand square no more than 1,000 square feet. So the building
commissioner thought the best thing to do would be to come in front of this board and uh explain what we're trying to do. The foundation's actually actually already in because I had started this and this is the uh I'll give you the bill and permit application.
>> That's all right. >> So, because I dragged my feet trying to get this done, uh it kind of put me in that little dilemma zone and as far as the building commission, he thought this would be the best approach that way. Uh because even though I appi I I applied for the permit uh I only had like the
foundation part of it part of the permittee allows you to do that. >> You have the foundation permit. You didn't have the regular permit. Correct. >> Right. >> Yeah. >> Right. which isn't uncommon for the uh for the record, but it also means you weren't grandfathered in before we passed our
>> sub there. You can take my whole packet. Anybody want to see this? >> So, this on the corner of Long Point and then going into the primary. >> Yes, it is. And there I have two
neighbors. My nephew's one of them and my daughter's the other one. And I'm surprised they're not here. >> The two houses on the left before that. >> Correct. Yeah. And other than that, uh the conservation land behind me, bogs to the right. Uh I'm I'm not encroaching on any of the setbacks. uh uh on one of the
plans. I think it shows um quite a bit away from any of the sidelines or front line to square footage, 1800. >> Yeah. [Music] >> Um is the 1800 just the first floor or
both floors? >> Uh just the first floor. And I'm hoping to go back to the planner board and do an ADU on top. Uh that's why they made comments on this already because I've been met with them already once. >> How big would this ADU be?
>> Uh most of it's going to be storage up top, but the ADU is going to be less than the 900 ft. >> That's going to say you it has to be >> correct. Yeah. >> 900 max. So that's my dilemma. >> That's your That's your story. Okay.
>> Well, does anyone else have Does anyone have any comments or any questions at this point? >> Just a clarification on this page. >> Yes. >> In the red it says, is it Hall?
Is it connected to the existing structure? >> That was that was one of the things the build inspector said. If I if I wanted to wave this part of it, then I'd have to connect it to the house. And my thought is, you know, it's a long way to do that just for that purpose. I'm hoping that I can get approved for this
tonight and not have to do all that. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. It's hooked to the house and garage. If it's a hook to the house, then you're all set, right? You don't need us, >> right? But I do need you. >> But you're still have But you're still going to have the same structure there.
>> Yes. Correct. >> And I think I'm on the record in the past that I I tech I usually like to defer to the neighbors. I mean, they're the ones who are going to be most impacted by this. And >> right >> now that we know it's your family and you probably told them not to come, but
that's all right. >> No, no, the neighbors are not opposed to it. not approach you with any setbacks. I personally don't have any
second. >> Okay. If we don't have any questions and ask the audience. >> Okay. Anybody have any additional questions at this point? >> No. >> Anyone in the audience have a question?
>> Okay. Good. Yeah, I'm good. Are you good? >> Yeah, I'm good. Did you already put water to this or you put water to it? >> I have an underground pipe going to it. Yes. >> Okay. And then you can attach it to your septic already.
>> Yes. >> Yeah. I've already been, believe it or not, the plum inspector's already inspected this as well. So, this is kind of like a last thing that came up and >> Nate just wanted to proceed with caution. >> You anyways, correct? >> Right. Right.
>> That may be a problem. It could be. >> Yeah. >> So, >> and this is just for your personal use, correct? There's not going to be anything out of this. >> I I have some classic cars that I want to kind of put in there. And >> what kind of cars?
>> Classic cars. >> Yeah. >> Your own personal storage, >> right? Yes. >> You have no intention of operating a business? >> No. No. I have about 10 cars now. So, might not be big enough, but I don't need any bigger.
>> 1%. >> Yeah. >> Well, I >> That's your problem, not >> I buy them in rough shape and then I do most of the work myself on them. It's kind of my keeps my head kind of going straight. >> Nice. Well, unless anyone else has any
questions, anyone to >> I make a motion grant special permit to uh conduct a garage on a,800t structure, 1800. >> It might be a little It's 36 by 60. What does that come out to?
>> Is it 36 or 30? >> 36. >> We can make a motion to approve special. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> That'll be perfect. We have it all on the record and it's about 1,800. Do we have a second?
>> Second 2160. >> It's 2160. >> Okay. >> Glad to second. >> That's fine. 2160 as applied for. We got a vote covered. >> Yep. >> Uh any further discussion? All in favor?
>> I opposed. Motion carries unanimously. >> Mr. Chairman, I'd like to thank this board the board for being here. It's I know it's a thankless job sometimes and I also have to kudos to Kathy. She's does a wonderful job in the office. So >> you got it approved, man. >> It doesn't matter. She does. She's there. She
>> I will suck it. Kathy does an excellent job. >> She does. Thank you. Thank you very much. >> You don't need to tell him. I think he knows. >> He knows. >> All right. >> Uh let's see. So we have minutes from
September 18th. Correct. >> No, I didn't think so. >> I was just thinking, did I miss something? Cuz I didn't see this happen. So, we will be working on those next time around. >> Yes. >> Uh let's see. So, a couple of housekeeping items. The first one is
obviously Learon uh that we um permitted a couple of meetings ago. The board voted to give me the authority to sign the permit when it was uh the paperwork was complete, which I did. Uh there was one additional piece that I did not want
to sign without disclosing it to the board. The actual what what did we say it was? The actual phase and area plan that needs to be filed with the registry of deeds also needs to be signed. So rather than you guys vote to let me sign it, we're all here. We're all going to sign it. How does that sound?
>> I can't as as proposed. And yes, Jeffrey cannot sign. He's recusing himself from from signing that. So, um I don't think we need to take a vote for this cuz we're all going to sign this. Again, it's not you're not voting for
against. You're just sign approved. Um so, we need three of us to sign it. We can do that when we close the meeting. Uh the other item that I'm going to bring up, we don't have other business, but just to point out, um I did have Kathy send out, we just
received within the past week and a half. I didn't receive it, but the town received it for the record that um we received our housing uh production plan certification certification uh of approval from the executive office of housing in Liverpool community. Um this
is on record at the town. Uh and basically what it means is we have hit our 10%. So we are in a um >> safe haven >> uh compliance for two years um as of February uh which
is when that uh we hit the 10%. we are just over at 11%. Uh so what I do want to state for the record especially because this is on PM is anything that has been applied in uh for permitting at this point uh for
example Rocky Woods which is now Simmons Hill that is not affected. We're impacted by this. That is already in the process. So that is not something that a town we could say no to. Just because we're over the 10% uh doesn't mean that
somebody can't apply or that a board cannot still approve that. Uh what I do caution everyone is we are over 10%. I don't know of anything personally that's coming down the pipeline at this point, but this is this is fluid. They do this periodically and as new censuses come
in, populations go up, that 10% number is actually going to change. So when you're just over it, historically it normally comes back and you're under it again down the road. So uh I just want folks to realize that just because we're in safe habit doesn't mean that we're
good for ever in a day type of a deal. >> Would that number get reassessed before 2027 or would always be sub, you know, always after 2027 since we've been approved to 2027? >> Would it get approved >> like would our numbers for the 10 Yeah. Would our numbers would the 10% number
be reassessed prior to our safe harbor expiring? >> Uh there's a full exp well I shouldn't say full explanation but it gets into a little a little of the details here. Um and rather than misstate anything I'm going to be very cautious here. If was
here I would turn it over to her to make sure I don't misspeak. Uh but it's again I I I'm only pointing this out because town received it. A number of folks already know it in town. I think it's important that this board knows where we are uh that we are in safe harbor that
we do not have to approve anything at this juncture but it's it's temporary and again by the time this got approved it was it was February 27th it was I believe it was the um the hospital site which which put us into it so we are
already almost a year into it so we literally have what 16 or 17 months before we're out of it Yeah. Um, and again, they'll look at the numbers at that point, but like I said, it's all dictated on a percent of the population. So, the other thing too is the ones we
approve permitted if they don't apply for a building permit in certain period of time. >> You are absolutely correct. That's a fair point. So, as an example, like the lost permit, >> so they don't pull a permit. Uh I
believe it's a year a year. >> So if they don't pull a permit, all those come off and not to ruin anyone's evening, but just because they haven't pulled the permit doesn't mean their permit that doesn't mean their their bigger permit till the project goes away. So they could not pull the permit.
We're out of safe harbor and now all of a sudden someone else comes in wants to build another 40B and then they decide 6 months later they're going to pull their permit. Now we can have It's not like it stops them from doing that. We're going to have a larger number. So, there's a
lot of moving parts here, but we everyone asks when we're going to get to our 10%. We are there. We're barely there. Um, but I'm sure we'll it will change in the future. So, it's just for my clarification,
the current inventory excludes anything that's proposed with Rocky Hill. The inventory does not include them. And so today, as of today, we are considered in compliance with safe harbor inventory. >> Yes.
>> For the inventory in town today. >> Correct. But keep in mind, Simmons Hill has already been in the process. So it's not like we can go to the next Simmons Hill meeting and say, "Oh, you guys have to stop now." >> No. But don't we have more flexibility
as to how things progress with a development like Rocky Hill? >> I don't believe so. Amy will be in those meetings and will guide us. Uh but it's it's the state wants housing at the end of
the day. So we're not going to have a lot of flexibility to say we want you to shrink down the size of it. We want you to it's what >> well I think we should exercise our ability to manage a development if we're in compliance with other state requirements particularly
when it comes to 40B this is going to be outside if that permit now changes from a comprehensive permit and 40B to something different we should be able to manage that development it's still a 40B permit >> okay yeah no it's it's still it's still protected under 40B >> do they have the permit
>> no the permit process they have applied under 40B So you don't need the permit. You just need to be in the queue. >> Exactly. >> So we have to continue with this 40B process. >> Yes. >> Okay. >> That's a state, >> but that would only increase our
numbers, right? That project if it goes through >> that numbers figured in there. Is that >> I didn't see that one listed. >> No, it's not. That's what I was asking. Is that inventory is Rockel included in that inventory? That's not. >> No, I I didn't think so, but >> it's not. I looked. >> Yeah. No, it isn't. Okay,
>> double check. And the last one here cuz they they do it um yeah, they do it in order. So the last one they have is Cranberry Heights, which is the hospital site. Uh so it is so Rocky Woods when that does get permitted, that'll get added to it as well, and that'll be
additional. Although there's 200 units at the hospital. So let's assume the hospital doesn't pull permit. Those 200 units come out.
>> And even if Simmons Hill gets approved, like I said, we're just over 11%. It's not 200 units, I don't believe. Is it? How many units did you say was they're down tound something? >> It's based on the 2020 census. So, are you asking for the total?
>> Well, no, I'm saying the number of units that they're going to have up there because the number of units versus the versus the census is how they come up with the numbers. So you said can you explain again? So if if
>> I'm explain one more time >> for the best you get. So my my question is if it's not calculated in um that spreadsheet there that has all the
permitted 40 beads. How how was Rocky Woods? If if Rocky Woods is not in that, then does that mean it's not permitted? >> Correct.
>> It's not permitted yet. >> So even though they're in the queue, if they if they're in the queue, why is it not like in that percentage? because there could be something why they maybe there's a there's a health danger, you
know, and remember they >> it's very very tough, but there's a public health risk. >> They turned around and found out there's like arsenic in the water, you know, and there's no way to to develop that because it's going to be so dangerous that it's going to threaten lives.
They're not going to include it until it's permanent. My guess is the theory behind it is if you've put your if you've already put in and you've spent money and time and effort going through the process just because you hit a number, >> they're not going to stop that they're not going to stop that entity from going
in, right? And you could you could have spent hundreds of thousands of dollars or whatever and >> and this number comes out and all of a sudden, sorry, we're just going to say >> no because we want to say no. Again, remember the state is driving housing. They're going to do anything they can
to to to allow that to happen. >> Yeah. But but that's the purpose of our existence is to control what we want to have developed here. If we meet compliance, then we should be able to control what gets permitted. >> Yeah. I just the law of the safe harbor
is not retroactive. >> Say, say that again. >> The safe harbor is not retroactive. Just like you said, if they applied before harbor, then they're in >> Yeah. >> for potential approval. The problem that you and most people are having and I I tend to agree with you in
theory is that someone else is dictating how we can regulate our community. >> What I human nature is that the handcuffs that are placed on us >> for 40B development >> y >> it should be loosened because we are
above compliance. So therefore, we can put more >> boundaries, but they are not >> around a permit with an opport dictated by the state. >> But I guess maybe what are you alluding that maybe if we deny something, the state would be more inclined to not just
favor inside of the developer in this case because we've already reached safe harbor. You asking me or >> I was asking Jerry is that because I mean ultimately if we deny something in the appeal normally what would happen is the state would side with the developer right we haven't reached safe harbor >> my understanding is that's still going
to be the same scenario >> but I was wondering if that's what Jerry was thinking that >> I think we should be allowed to have more influence on what gets developed at a site like that if we are if this town is in compliance with the state >> Oh no I completely agree with that too.
I just don't know if that's >> so instead of getting it pushed down that we're not and therefore you must it should be more that we will consider. So that's just my position.
That's not my formal position. >> No, I I don't know. Maybe I didn't express myself correctly. I agree with you unfortunately about our king cups. It's it's almost like you've tied our hands but now we're there. Loosen it a little bit. No, we haven't loosened it at all. We're going to You guys still
have to operate the same way you did because they've already applied for it. >> Okay, then why have it a threshold anyways? >> Well, the next >> Well, have no complaint. >> Well, say another one gets applied for next week, then >> Chris is right. If somebody wants to cut Just because you're hit the threshold
doesn't mean we still can't accept 40 weeks. We could turn around and be at 11.2%. and we have nothing in the queue, but we, you know, we're reading the tea leaves and knowing, listen, we know that census is coming down the road and our population is going to jack up and we
know we're going to be under the 11% and we have what they call a friendly 40b coming in. Do we work with that one or do we say no and then wait for someone to come in after the new numbers are who we don't want to work with and is basically going to thumb the nose at us and say we're going to do whatever the
heck we want to do because you can't stop us because the state's going to allow us to do it anyway. So >> I just feel like your position is that it doesn't matter. It does. We don't have any kind of say. >> I don't think we have any say until we get to 50. >> That's what I'm saying. >> 15%. >> Why not 20? Why not 30? I mean, why
don't why even have 10? >> What's the point of having a compliance threshold if we they could just do another 40b development and we can't? >> No, no, no. You point a comp the compliance is 10%. And my point is when you're only a little bit over
historically it's always it's going to come down because when the new census comes out >> fine when that h if that happens right and if that when it happens right then the board this board would consider a different comprehensive permit 40b
what I'm saying is why can't we have more control over now Rocky Woods >> because I'm just making an example of Rocky Woods because we're over that threshold I'd love to have more control, but we don't because they've already applied. >> What's our what's what are the
circumstances by which if we said it doesn't fit with the character of that area >> and therefore they're they're protecting the same 40 guidelines as >> would the implications if we say no >> same implications as before they'll turn around and say we're going to go to the
state and the state's going to approve what we apply for. I mean unless >> despite the town is over its threshold. >> Yes, I can guarantee you. >> Which is why I'm asking why it have a threshold. Well, because if another one gets applied for next week, >> then we have the power to say no and the state back does a really terrible job
and and has, you know, whatever the reason, we can we can say no now. If somebody wants to apply next week, >> why can't we say no to a rocky woods? >> They've already applied. >> Doesn't matter. >> Well, I think that I know I'm not I'm not here to like dictate timelines and all that. >> Kathy, I haven't done this. I've never done this, but didn't my predecessor
used to say, "I'm going to give you some homework." >> I know. I looked it up. I'll give you homework. >> I looked it up and I was disappointed too because I was I was very happy when I saw this email today and I said this is fantastic. >> This board won't have to do comprehensive permits for 2 years.
>> If you come back and find a rule in the law that says we can say no to Rocky Woods, I will support >> I think we're always within our right to say no. That's why we take the risk of saying no, particularly if we're under compliance.
But I think if we're over compliance, we provide condition reasons of why we deny a permit. We can solve this very easily >> and I'll do my homework to get >> you don't even need to do your homework. We're going to ask Amy town council and she will tell us whose interpretation is
correct. >> Anything else to come up? What do we want to adjourn the meeting? >> It was a good debate. >> Yeah, I like it. Very interesting. >> I think we all agreed. Honestly, I don't even think it was much of a debate. >> We'll find out for maybe. Yeah, >> I honestly I'd like to make a motion to
adjourn the meeting. >> Second. >> I second. >> All those in favor? I opposed. Motion carried unanimously. We are adjourned at 7:20 right now. Yes.