It's a little chilly in here. Okay, welcome. I call the meeting to order. This is the local Lawrence Board of Health meeting. Today is February 3rd, 2026. We will begin with the roll call, please.
>> Dr. Joel Gor, >> present. >> Steven H. Gill, >> present. >> Dr. Vidal Premier, >> Vidal Permitary is delayed. He's still seeing his last patient and will be with us shortly. But because we have a quorum, we will proceed.
Okay. Um, >> a motion to accept the minutes of December 16th. >> I second the motion. All in favor? >> I. >> The minutes are accepted and I will sign them for you. Um, oh, they're right here.
the meeting from December 16. Very good. Minutes are accepted and signed. Okay, we are going to move on to the tobacco product sales update with Caesar. >> Well, let me just call them before.
>> Let's do that. We can get those at the market. All right. So, um, on October 27th, we did a round of complaint checks in the city and one of the places that we checked was A&E Supermarket located at 85 Arlington or 513
uh, Hampshire Street. At about 12:42, we sent in this did you see photograph in front of you? Uh he was like 18 years old on that date. He went in with a $20 bill. He came back out with this back of Maldo cigarettes which he purchased for $16.
Um this happened about at 12:31 the time that I pressed the button to submit it to the to the state database was uh 12:42. Uh he was not asked for ID. He was sold this back without being challenged at all. The person who made the sale, I
think after speaking to Mr. Manuel, uh the person was identified as his son, Angel. >> Yeah, >> his son >> made the sale. This is a first offense for uh this establishment. They received a fine of $1,000, which they paid. So,
they're here to look at a situation for one business day. >> You're the owner. >> Yes. >> Okay. Um, is there Foreign speech. Foreign speech. Foreign speech. I don't know.
for me. Say hello. Okay. Well, we understand, you know, the consequences of sub subsequent um sales to minor. So, um Stephen, >> so I move to suspend the tobacco product
sale permit issues to A&E Supermarket located at 513 Her Street, Lawrence, Mass for one day for one business day beginning at the start of business on Thursday, February 19th, 2026 and ending at the close of business of the same
day. I second the motion. All in favor? >> I I Okay. >> Okay. >> Mr. Monroe, you'll receive a letter explaining that you have to remove all the tobacco from the receiving problem. So that was
perfect. Perfect. >> This is a checker representing the next establishment. It's uh supermarket located at 187 Lawrence Street. The
violation occurred on October 3rd. This is a pack of Marvel cigarettes. It was purchased by the same uh youth. This happened at around 11:52 a.m. Uh, he paid $14.99 for this pack of cigarette. He was not challenged at all. Nobody
asked him to do anything. Uh, the struggle was issued a fine of $1,000 which they have paid as well. He also is a first offense. They give one day suspension. Foreign speech. Foreign speech. Foreign speech. Thank you. Okay, I'll group.
So I move to suspend this black product sale permit issues to Mayo Supermarket located at 187 Lawrence Street, Lawrence, Mass for one business day beginning at the start on Thursday, February 19th, 2026 and ending at the close of business day of the same day.
>> I second motion all in favor. >> I I Okay. >> So you receive a letter explaining that you have to remove all tobacco products. So on the day of the suspension, there should be no tobacco products on the shelf and there should be no tobacco on in the store at all. >> So they have to take it home.
Okay. Gracias. Are you here from which school? >> Yes. Actually, >> next or you? Okay. Can you just write your name here and your title and then your
signature? So number is so deep. as well. All right, great. Thank you. >> All right. Uh, Papita Market located at 130 Franklin Street in Lawrence. Violation occurred on October 3rd.
Uh, same kid you see a photograph in front of you. This is the pack of cigars that was purchased at that location. Uh the youth paid $6 for this pack of uh cigar. There's four cigars in here. And this happened around uh 12:25
p.m. on that third. This is a first offense at the location as well. They they received a fine of $1,000. They paid that fine and now they're here for a one day suspension. Lawrence
power. We also same. like that. I don't think Okay. I move to suspend the tobacco product sale permit issues to Papito Mini Market
located at 130 Franklin Street, Lawrence, Mass, for one business day beginning at the start of business of Thursday, February 19th, 2026 and ending the close of the same business day. >> Um, I second the motion. All right.
Okay. Okay. Okay, perfect. Sorry about that. >> Next is uh ANF Hookah Supplies located at 313 Broadway here in Lawrence. Violation occurred on uh this October
3rd. There was no sale for mine on that day, but it was doing a compliance check. So we sent in that kid to try to get into the place to see if this adult one tilted like a strugg and the way they have the the counter there the counter is right next to the
door so he can just be right there open the door check the ID before the person entered but that's not what happened so this kid was able to get in after he got in I went in to uh introduce myself and explain it was a violation and while I was there I found that they were selling
prohibited products. Uh they were selling flavored tobacco. This is pouches of nicotine. This is a flavored product. They were also selling blood wraps which has been prohibited in the city since 2014. And the last time you amended the regulation also made the
mere presence of these products illegal. And they also uh were selling these uh these products. These are considered to be tobacco flavor enhancers. These are flavor tips that you attach to a hookah and gives it
flavor. So that those are prohibited by the state regulation as well. So um they were issued a fine of $1,000 for first offense. Uh they have not paid that fine because they requested an appeal. That's why he is here tonight. He's not out for a suspension. He's disputing the facts
of what happened. So he hasn't paid the fine. So if he decides to that he's responsible, then you will uphold, you know, the $1,000 fine, you have to pay. >> Um, >> can I hear you for
>> Of course. Um, he said, "I understand the frontal and um, may I look at the pictures of the course?" >> Sorry, I'm late. >> It's mine. This is mine. >> I got So for this product um is actually
legal. There's a paper and a lot we have the letter that says that this is legal and it's not flavored tobacco. It's clear. Um I don't know how you guys want would like to proceed to look at the
stands by the crave chill smooth tobacco 6 millig and 9 millig products >> are not labored >> well that's zen >> okay >> that's a letter that's required by law before retell puts products on the
shelves they have to have a letter saying that each product is not a flavor product so as a matter of practice the industry will issue letters and later will find those products are flavored and this is one of those instances as a matter of fact with this particular the product Zen Chill. Uh there was a flavor
uh uh smell test that was conducted uh by the handover water health on uh June 13, 2025 and then by conquered on 12 27 2024 and then uh by Norfolk on March 25th of 2025
all of them founded the fat. So what we tell people is that when we come to do an education is that hey even though you have a letter from the manufacturer this drug is in fact for you >> but how you how are they supposed that smell test or >> there's a smell test yes
>> and this is conducted by in this particular case I'm just >> but it's so confusing we've run into this before >> like he has no way of knowing he has >> nobody Dr. Nobody likes these letters. I don't like these letters, but that's a requirement. >> Let's go to the next one. >> But anyway,
the benefit of that, but that's not what he's getting the Well, he was he was not fined for all four tobacco. >> I'm just finding just once, but there was three or four violations that >> didn't he had didn't he? >> No, there was no sell line.
>> So, there was an entry. There was a sell of flavored tobacco products. There was a sale of flavor tobacco flavor enhancers. Four violations. Non minor. >> All of them. Four violations but only issue one. >> It was it wasn't it wasn't u so there was the products were there but they were not offered to the minor. The minor
was ID right when he came in. >> Right. The regulation says if you have the product there for sale it's another issue. You don't have >> Yeah. But it's not it's like it wasn't like offered to the minor. >> No I understand what you're saying. >> If it is an accountant one of shelves it's offer sale. That's what it means.
>> Okay. So next one is the tips. So this is mouth tips. So basically it's just a plastic thing for um health. Just you don't want to put your mouth where everybody's else is putting
their mouth. This ones have a little candy. It doesn't give flavor to the hookah. But um the my guy he told me that that Caesar said that it does. It's a flavor. It's like a candy. It's literally a candy. >> It's a lollipop basically.
>> Yeah. Attached to a to a to a hookah >> a market tobacco. >> Yeah. So I I don't know how cuz we So we have been talking to the people from South Bars cuz they of course they have way more time than us. They know more
more than us. They told me that at some point this was banned but that it was fine again. They were selling it. So I'm like we can sell it. And then when he came in, he's like, "Oh, no, that's that's not." And I'm like, "We don't even know what's good and what's not." >> Why do you go to people instead of
coming to the real place that you can find the right regulations? >> The thing is that there was miscommunication. So me and Cece, we spoke, you remember when we spoke like a few years ago, he said was he was going to pass by um the store to bring me the paperwork to put on the door and all that and to explain a few things to me,
but he never went. So I don't know if he didn't have time. I don't know what happened. I actually by by by my signs myself and put signs on the doors and stuff. Not the state ones because I don't have them. Um but um I just never got to like speak to them directly. So
there was just a few things that I just how I do business with them too. I just ask them because they got more time and >> what? >> So they sell that as well. >> They do same as the frontal kings like this. >> Sales. >> Yeah. >> Anybody who sells that product is in
violation. >> It doesn't have to sell. If they have it for sale, that's a blunt wrap. That's prohibited in the city of Lawrence. And it's been that way for many years. >> Yeah. Um but uh since we're new, um since we didn't talk to you, we asked them, "Oh, is this okay?" >> Cuz they had it on display, too. So they
said that you you had inspection them and that it was fine. So >> in this particular case, usually, you know, when there's a new store, I get notified. So I had to go and do an inspection. I spoke to him before he had the store. Remember? >> Yeah. Didn't have the store at that time. So he went and opened the store
but he went through the application process and throughout the application process he was exposed to the regulations state and local was legal was in business in 2021. >> Our first location was and then we spons
>> um from not from Caesar the um but the other inspectors yeah they they went like twice. >> Okay. I mean, my feeling is that you didn't sell to a minor. There's obviously been it's not just you. It's it's a lot of people have a lot of questions. There's a lot of confusion.
It's brand letters that company companies that are not >> worth nothing. >> They're worth nothing because these products, some of them are questionable whether they're legal in in Massachusetts or not. We have banned the sales of blood wraps for a long time for many many many reasons, but clearly
there was some knowledge gap and I think that you guys need to talk. >> Yeah. Um I I've been I've been wanting to to meet um Caesar and speak to him cuz I I like to do things clear like >> I do have my my opinions on like the minor come and end cuz sometimes like
we're on Broadway Street. Some sometimes somebody goes and No, but like >> let's say you go to a liquor store with your year old, you don't you're not going to leave him in the car. So, it's the same thing like sometimes they go and I'm like I wanted to speak to Cece cuz I'm like, do you want somebody
leaving even a a 10-year-old in a car when this like mis I can see your intentions are good >> and I I I know you're you're willing to learn and I think that a conversation is in is in store. I'm not inclined to give you a big fine or suspension. I think
that seems unfair in this situation. If you had sold a minor, I would have changed my tune. But but I think once you close those gaps and get more education and figure out what product you can truly have in in your store and others which you can't, I think we'll be on the same page.
>> Yeah. No, we respect the the loss. Like since he said that we couldn't have this, we took it out. We took everything else out. We put more signs on the door. Like >> questions though, you should reach out to Caesar. >> Yeah. Don't ask. >> His home number is home. home phone number
>> because if you ask the other story, the other story is doing something wrong. You're going to do something wrong as well as you always call me. >> Uh >> yeah, but he never picked up. But but I remember at first when I was trying to call him, he's like it had to be at 8:00. If it wasn't at 8:00, >> I'm only at my office for a couple hours in the morning. Then I'm out in the
field like two cities. So, but you can leave a message and we spoke before you open the store, right? So, we explained everything to you. And one of the things that I explain to anybody who wants to open an adult only retails to factory store is that this is a very high risk business way different than the
convenience store than the grocery store because we expect more from you higher standard. That's why miners cannot go in. It's not because I'm saying it's because the state regulation says so. But in the state regulations, this is another question that I had when I saw
that when when um we received the fine, it said because we sold to a minor. >> It it it does a state is it the city of Lawrence or is the state that has the law that a minor can't go in a place? Cuz let's say I have been in smoke shop in Salem, Massachusetts, and when you go
in, they ask you for an ID, but they don't have the door locked like we prove here. Well, having the door locked is a business decision because you either have a bounce at the door or you lock the door >> because if you don't lock the door and you're just doing, you know, inventory, somebody can just push the door open and
walk in, right? So, it's a business decision to avoid an unintended violation. But that's state regulation, and local regulation that prohibits the entry of any minor, anybody. >> Okay. The other thing that I think I want to mention before the board here so you know I covered this with you before
you open the door is that the criteria for you to qualify as an adult only covers the following things. You have to stop minus entry at the door before they cross the threshold. At least 90% of what you sell has to be tobacco. If you sell a lottery, for example, you wouldn't qualify to be an adult own. Or
if you sell a an item that requires you to have a good permit, you wouldn't qualify to be an adult own retail tobacco store. Yeah. Right. And uh so this just to mention a couple of these. >> Yeah, I remember. >> And you have to be able to produce documentation to show that the 90% are being
>> Yeah, we have been keeping what we see. >> So we can talk after. I mean the board is going to make a decision. I don't want to take a lot of the time here, but we're going to we're going to talk more specific about these things and u the next time if you come before the board, it might be different than what happens today.
>> So your feelings? Um I I feel like we should uh be open to educating them and uh having Caesar seeing them and not finding them this time. Uh but to make sure that within 30 days they are up to
uh they have a meeting with Caesar. >> So first violation >> first violation. So I make a motion to um >> wave the fine and and uh make a continuence that they have to meet with
Caesar and they have to chase Caesar down within 30 days or the fine will stick. >> Okay. >> Second the motion. >> Okay. >> So, >> you have 30 days to hook up with Caesar or we're going to find you a house.
>> Fair. >> I think it sounds fair. >> Sounds good. >> Thank you. >> And how I said like we do not intend to sell to miners. I just wanted to speak to Caesar because there is specific situations like with the um kids and
stuff that we're on Broadway Street like sometime there there was one day that a customer came in he left his car on and a crackhead took it like we're on Broadway. >> So you gave a pain as well. >> Yeah. So I'm like I don't want nobody leaving
a kid outside just because they like >> I don't Well, I will speak to him about that, but I I just have questions about >> Unfortunately, the state regulation is out of our hands. So, we're not the one that will decide on the things. >> I'll clear it out. >> Sometime, you know, I feel where you're coming from. >> Yeah. But I know that some some there's
some regulations that are like the city and some are the state. They're not all the state. So, that's why I wanted to speak to him, see um what we can do just to to do better. But we do not intend to sell food to minor. That's not >> our public. >> We can talk about that. But so, you know, it's a hot business in a regular convenience store. It's not going to be
the same rules. >> Yeah, I understand that. >> But we talk. >> Okay. So, you have 30 days, guys. >> You're gonna get a letter from me. Confirm the board's decision tonight and then we got to hook up. >> Okay. All right. All right. Take care, guys. Thank you so much. >> Um, I'd like to just move on to Are you done?
>> I just want to mention that the the suspicions of the last four were before you, they were carried out without any use. >> Oh, great. Thank you. Excellent. Smooth said. I wanted to save the public health update for last because We're waiting
for Dr. Permitu and I just would like um you know to make I'd like to repeat what I've said in the recent past that um the flu this year has been quite virilent. The flu shot was not a good match for
influenza that's been circulating. Um, it is it has been a bad flu year and I wanted to ask you what your experience has been in the office and you what your experience has been in the hospital to drive the point home to our Lawrence
public that we need to take care. >> But the office hasn't been so bad I guess because people are not coming into the office. So now they're just used to the flu. They go to the pharmacy. by the night and no I haven't seen so much you
cast for the floor >> I do I do I'm doing co as well >> it's a joint >> yeah has been low actually so >> actually have a positive one today only one that I have >> it hasn't been so bad at the beginning
but right now come down >> well in the hospital it's been extremely prevalent I have to wear a mask just to be in the hospital nowadays so um everywhere. Everybody in Boston is asking uh to be there to go have any impaction on any patient because flu is
so prevalent. >> Yeah. And and sadly the flu the vaccine this year was not a good match. But that's not true at all years. And so we still encourage people to get vaccinated >> even though it's not a good match. >> Well, at this point going forward, I
think people that have want wanted to be vaccinated have been vaccinated. Um it's not that it's It's ineffective, but it's less effective. >> It's not a perfect match, right? So, let me ask you a question. As far as uh masks or keeping distance or washing
your hands, I mean, obviously, if you can do all three, it's probably best, right? But what is the level efficacy of the mask is that they'll be put into question. >> Well, I mean, you have the policy from the large general. What is their >> No, no. I I work at BI.
>> You look at the works of BI. >> Yes. >> You're not here anymore? um you know I'm I I don't know the exact you know data available but I'm a believer that wearing a mask can prevent um infection. I mean these are
respiratory droplets that you know are the contagion. Um I think both a sick person wearing a mask can be effective and spreading disease and you know a practitioner certainly you know going into an exam room or a proper fitted
mask that's used um in the proper manner. >> Yeah. Not just I'm still a strong believer in masks as a as a you know you know important public health preventative measure.
um washing hands. Absolutely. >> Um so, you know, I'm still a believer. I know there's a lot of people that that, you know, that don't think it it has significant benefit, but I would disagree. >> Having the discipline of of washing
hands, distance, touching surfaces, touching your face is one of those things that that go a long way. It lowers the probability of you catching something. >> You shake hands and then you forget to wash your hands. >> Well, you know, They've done I'll give you a there was a famous study that they
took a medical school class and they they they infected on purpose two people two individuals in the class and they told everybody else to do your best to handwash and and and and >> you know some viruses especially
gastrointestinal viruses are incredibly contagious and no matter how much you do to wash hands don't touch your These people were look sitting in lectures in close quarters. Just about everybody got infected. >> But I think that you know for for things >> they volunteer for this.
>> They did. >> No, nobody told them. No, they didn't volunteer. Um but I think that respiratory born illnesses you can certainly make a difference and um and you know it definitely does especially when you fly trust me I don't fly
without a mask without any 95. And I can see people all the time. >> Yeah. >> Not as far as my masks are concerned, but what are the stats now as far as >> in Massachusetts right today? >> Yeah. >> Well, the case the cases load is very
low right now. You're always going to have people dying of COVID and very low levels in the state. Um there's always going to be a case or two in the ICU. Um, and you know, typically it usually is elderly people immune compromised,
obese smokers, people with COPD that that become elderly. >> I'm sorry. >> So, what do you mean by >> Well, you can be 80 and and quite healthy or you can be 70 and frail and infirm with multiple chronic medical problems. Basically, you make you more
susceptible to to the complications of these, you know, you know, respiratory illnesses. Um, so you know, I I would urge people that have diabetes that's not controlled, people that have underlying cancers that compromise their immune system, people that are morbidly
obese that don't exercise, that you know, people that have long smoking history, that have COPD or asthma, those people I think need to be extra cautious. Um, but you know, I I I you know, we thought that CO would kind of run its course and
it would kind of mutate and kind of go go by the wayside, but I think it's it's going to be present in the human population for years to come. >> Um, and there'll be there'll be an occasional surge um that we'll have to deal with. Luckily, we do have
medications that have been shown to prevent hospitalization or death. Um although only in people that are over the age of 65. We don't use those medications that we're not supposed to and young healthy individuals that have co they really play no role. Plus
they're about $800 for a course $8 $900. And if you call if you send somebody to the pharmacy with a with a remesae prescription, the pharmacy will say you'll have to come back tomorrow because they don't keep it in stack. They have to order it, bring it in the next day, meet then you've already had CO for three, four days and it's useless
anyway. Plus the point >> and it's 900 bucks. >> Yeah. Yeah. So we give her a dese somebody has flu, real severe flu, we give it to her for like a week. >> So you know it's it's um but you know most most healthy young people get co and recover.
>> But um >> I think right now probably flu will kill more people. >> Flu is killing much more people. I mean it's the season. >> It's the season. I have a very good friend that died in the beginning of January of of the flu. >> Flu. >> 60 years old. 61. >> Wow.
>> Yeah. His whole family. >> Well, flu was placed in the back around when CO was, >> you know. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> And it was sensation, right? But it's always has always been known to to kill a lot of people the flu. >> Yeah. And and the theory about about flu vaccine in the world of immunology is if
you you know it might not be that this flu shot is perfectly matched to this year's flu, right? >> Uhhuh. >> However, if you get a flu shot every year during a long period of time, your
immune system will develop antibbody to H3N1, H2N4. You know, you'll develop an incredible library of immunity to many different variants of flu which is important
theoretically in the case that a pandemic flu shows up in the next you know in your lifetime you will your immune system will be much better equipped to manage a extremely virulent flu than someone who's never been immunized against
>> you oh I absolutely do I mean I deal with lots of people with the flu >> do the three of you do It's mandated for me. >> You have to. I mean to get exempt when you work in hospital is quite difficult. >> Yeah, it's the first thing I do.
>> And I did get my coke. What's that? >> How you get flu? >> Um I haven't had flu in years. >> I have one time. I was working at the ER. I left. See you later. Fine. >> Well, I had a couple times. I have a few
times. >> I never had to call an ambulance. >> Never had CO. Took the flu shot. I didn't take it this year. But I usually take it every year. I'm pretty good with it. But >> even if it's not a good match, it's a good idea to get it every year. It really does. You know, your immune systems have memory.
>> So maybe it's not a good match for this year's flu, but the one they're giving this year could be a match for the few in three, four years a library. >> Okay. >> I mean, the new once you you exposed to that vaccine, it stays in the system.
>> Absolutely. I explain it like reading a book. You know, you have you'll be like, I read that book, but then you start reading a little bit and you like, oh, I remember that book. You start telling stories and details. Same thing. >> All right. Can I have a motion to adjourn?
>> Can I have a uh to adjourn the meeting? >> Next meeting. >> Next meeting first. >> Thank you. >> Yes. Yes. >> For reminding us. >> Um Okay. Well, it's beginning. So, let's Should we shoot for uh March 3rd?
>> Uh March 3rd I got a softball tournament. >> March 3rd. >> No, no, no. May Tuesday. >> There's there's one, two, three, four, five, six. One, two, three, four, five.
There's five Tuesdays in March. Yeah. >> Yeah, I'll try. That's so far out. So, >> you want to do March 10th? >> Yeah, I'll go with that. Yeah. Yeah, let's do March. I don't think I'll be here. March.
>> Um, and so I think we can probably also clean up some of this old business. >> Um, I think we can remove just about all of it. Um and um let's as a group, as board members think
about what we want, what direction we want to take the board in terms of what we want to focus on and if you have any ideas of what we'd like to talk about. Um we can even bring people before us in the city. Um, you know, there's a lot of
stuff with housing and you can visit the restaurant licensing again. I want to talk about that. We need to we need to work into that. This is getting ridiculous. Is going to be like a jet blue going to Dominican Republic. >> Oh, everybody in a wheelchair? >> Oh yeah, there's so many people have
>> the whole city here. They want to visit. Well, I have to talk to the mayor. I'm not writing >> with my with my with my brother Brian with Manito because you know the city we're going to call the city of the handicap. It's like it's not enough that we are like older s
and everybody's happily over now everybody's handicapped. Okay. Well, we can we can talk about that and if you want to put that on the agenda we can Anthony can do that. >> The other day was part of the count the homeless count and I think there's about 300. >> I think we should put that on the agenda too. That's important. U maybe maybe
bring somebody from the health center that um does a community medicine program to talk about um the homeless population and what's going on with them. >> Um what services are available? I guess that would be helpful too.
>> Yeah. >> Great. Okay. Do you have a motion to adjurnn? >> Motion to adjurnn. >> All in favor? >> All in favor? Okay. Motion grant and carries. Meeting agend.