I'm not sorry. I remember this one. City on the river. Yes. I don't know what's text. And I love
taking you Get here. There should be We just Please don't All right. Now, Okay. So, like we have
I don't like lips on the right hand. I'm going How are you? All right. You ready? I'm always ready.
Amazing. I haven't I brought my budget with me so I didn't look for it. Okay, let's go look for Good evening and welcome to the special meeting for the Len City Council. Today's date is Monday, June 16, 2025.
Pursuant to chapter 20 of the act of 2022, this meeting will be higher read allowing participation both in person in the city council chambers and remotely. The Zoom link was provided that to anybody that requested through the city
clerk's office. This meeting have two different sections today, June 16, 2025 and if needy if needed uh also on June 18, 2025. This meeting will be transmitted live
through the Lawren City Council Facebook page as well of the Lawren City Council YouTube page. Roll call. Madame Clerk. Councelor Levy, present. Councelor Lelant, present. Council Luzon, present.
Council del Rosario, present. Council Santiago, present. Council Marmmo, present. Council Reyes, present. Council Vice President Infonte, present. Council President Rodriguez, present. Uh, please join me for a moment of silence.
Now join me for the pledge of allegiance. To the flag of the United States of America and the republic for which it stands. One nation under God with liberty and justice for all.
Skip the line. We were follow we are going to proceed with public participation. It is important to recognize that uh today we have a public hearing for the budget of fiscal year 2026. Uh if anybody would like to speak on
that matters um you can have that opportunity at the public hearing public participation. The first person we have is Hali name address for the record please. 53
Chester Street. Good evening honorable members. We have important emergency in our city. Lawrence public school cafeteria worker demand the best compensation. Be the Lorentian or proud Lawrence police department with the
impeccable leadership by honorable Morris Aguiler are doing excellent job to protect our citizen. Lawrence police one of the best police department in the nation. Lawrence police union thank you
for making Lawrence a safe city. We as a citizen of more than 40 years have the best DPW department because of the DPW leadership and hard work. Lawrence is a beautiful city. Thank you for excellent job. Lawrence inspection department
employees. Thank you for excellent job. We support your union. We must hire more inspector. Lawrence public school with the impeccable leadership by honorable superintendent Ralph Guerrero. Moving forward, we are proud to support
Lawrence teachers union. L thank you for excellent job. We demand the best compensation and pay for our cafeteria worker. Lawrence always strong. Lawrence always unite. We the Laurentian proud to support our veteran. Thank you for your
service. Thank you for your sacrifices. We must hire two whacken position in a veteran department. We must create the best elder commission for our city. We demand equal pay for all city employees.
We cannot hire new employees to pay more more than the new the old employees. Lawrence wants city on the go. We pray for the safety of all police officers and the first responder. Lawrence police officers thank you for excellent job. We
stand united to support Lawrence police union. We are this union of pride and honor has done excellent job under the new leadership. Thank you. Uh this name will be um submitted for
the record. All right. We are we are going to proceed by uh first we need we need to uh pull this item from committee and uh with that we're going to suspend
rule 11 to be able to discuss item 165 16425. So I'll entertain a motion. I make a motion per 11 to pull dock number 164-25 from the budget and finance committee.
There is a motion on the table properly second discussion. I hear none. All those in favor please say I. I. Any names? Roll call. Madame clerk. Council council Reyes. Yes. Council
Marl. Yes. Council Santiago. Yes. Council del Rosario. Yes. Council Luzon. Yes. Councelor Llant. Yes. Council Levy. Yes. Council Vice President Infonte. Yes. Council President Rodriguez. I vote yes. Now we have item 16425.
Madame Clerk, please read that uh the notice for the public hearing. Notice is hereby given that the Lawrence City Council will have a public hearing on Tuesday, excuse me, on Monday, June 16th, 2025 for the purposes of reviewing and approving the proposed budget of
Mayor Ryan Adena for the fiscal year 2026. It's an order concerning the appropriation for the fiscal year beginning July 1, 2025. The order reads that the following sums designation designated as personal services, purchase of services,
professional services, supplies, other charges and expenses, capital outlay, intergovernmental, and debt services are hereby appropriated separately for each department in the general fund. And that five million dollars of debt reserve be appropriated to support the general fund
operating budget. The general fund accounts as follows were city council $52,800, mayor's office 1,194,370, administration and finance $4,534,53,488. City attorney's office $85,800.
City clerk, elections and annual listing is1,51,95. Office of Planning and Development 1,745,216. Police Department $18,520,380. Fire department 15,62,200. Inspectional services, 2,234,679. Emergency Management $15,000.
Lawrence public schools 305,26,144 Educational Assessment 47,26,157. Greater Lawrence Technical School 3,822,420 Department of Public Works 15,295,485 Cemetery $579,743 Health and Human Services 1,426,441
Library 1,74,932 2 debt services 13,931,83 Intergovernmental Assessment 1,940,46. Employee benefits 29,623,473. Risk management $644,000.
Other financial sources uses 2,325,743. Total general fund budget $469,611,865 less amounts not required to be appropriated. State and county assessments is a deduction of 48,810,839. Total amount appropriated for the
general fund would be $420,81,026. There's more. Enterprise fund for the Commonwealth of Massachusetts is an order concerning appropriations for the fiscal year beginning July 1, 2025. ordered that the following sums designated as personal services, purchase of services,
professional services, supplies, and other charges and expenses, capital outlay, intergovernmental and debt services are hereby appropriated separately in the parking enterprise fund of the city of Lawrence, parking garage and lot enterprise fund, $1,12,500.
ordered that the following sums designated as personal services, purchase of services, professional services, supplies, and other charges and expenses, capital outlay, intergovernmental and debt services are hereby appropriated separately as the airport enterprise fund of the city of Lawrence. Airport Enterprise Fund
$783,000 ordered that the following sum designated as personal services, purchase of services, professional services, supplies, other charges and expenses, capital outlay, intergovernmental and debt services are hereby appropriated separately in the sewer and water enterprise fund of the
city of Lawrence. Water and sewer enterprise fund is 21,892,691. Total enterprise funds is 23,778,191. Persons wishing to be heard shall be afforded the opportunity. Public hearing is now open. Anybody from the public that wishes to speak?
Good evening, councilors. My name's Rich Russell, 34 Cross Street. Yes. In the world of politics, words and vocabulary become political speak. And numbers, which in the real world have exact values, while in the political world,
they get manipulated to fit whatever the author of the budget wants it to mean. as in this. In the years 2007 to 2022, the salaries
for the mayor's office totaled 5,48,552, excuse me, are about $321,784 a year. The total number of employees that were paid in that time frame were 84, averaging 500 5 and a quarter employees per year. The years 2023 to
2026, the salaries for the mayor's office total 3,655,810 or about $913,952 per year. Total number of employers employees mayor's office in that time frame was 38 or averaging nine and a
half employees per year. All salary info was taken from the budgets that are posted on the city website. As a surveyor working with numbers for almost 60 years, I was taught to go with printed numbers. If the numbers were
wrong in the budget, then it falls into the category of a scrivener's error. As for the total scope of the budgets, for a variety of uh reasons, I could only go back to 20 2015 budget. My eyes
were getting tired. I was falling asleep. From 2015 2021, the city budget increased by about $40 million. The 2022 budget authored by Mayor Vasquez
increased by $34.5 million. The budgets by the president's the present mayor's team of budget writers increased by $123 million. A quick perusal of the budget produces some interesting facts about
salaries for various positions. To take a quote from the Godfather movie, nothing personal, strictly business. Well, counselor, it is personal when money is coming out of my pockets and the pockets of hardworking and retired
people. Case in point, some of you have heard this uh rant already. City council, you're getting a little over $21,000 for temporary salaries. Where's the temporary employ? Oh, stats
July 1st. Temporary employees. Uh let's see what else have we got here. uh assistant purchase uh you've purchasing office has deleted an assistant clerk and created an assistant purchasing
agent with a $28,517 raise. Office of uh community development. Uh this is a new position. Uh finance and administration, $110,000.
uh finance officer, $110,000. Uh a data specialist, this is a bargain, $49,000. A health task force leader, $87,000. Okay. Office of Planning and
Development. Uh this is the one that kind of uh really gets me. Uh the director is getting a $55,000 raise. Huh. That's 37 cents a minute or 37
cents a minute for every minute of every in the year. Come on. 37 cents a minute for the entire year. Okay. Uh we're also getting a director a new position director of uh progress I
guess. 124,800. I can't read my own writing at times. uh the deputy chief police department uh they want $175,000. I understand that various police chiefs have been dead set against this
position. The fire department an assistant chief at $150,000. I understand this is strictly going to be an administrative uh position. and it won't be uh in a firefighting a true firefighting capacity, but it I asked
the acting chief about the position of emergency management for a new position, $105,000. Couldn't those two positions be morphed together, brought together? It's an interesting concept, but again, white
hair, brain freeze, maybe. I don't know. Frostbite. Let's see what else have we got. We got the DPW. Uh we have a finance and administration director, $90,000. We have a storekeeper
uh position uh general okay. General Foreman was eliminated, but there was a 33,000 almost a $34,000 raise in creating a fleet supervisor.
Uh are these promotions? They new positions or what? Uh let's see what else do we got here. Council on aging uh assistant council and aging director, new position, $63,000.
Uh, community health specialist, $57,000. Uh, Council on Aging, there's a bargain, $30,000. The library, how do we ever live without an audiovisisual coordinator? $43,000.
Uh, these positions that I've just touched on, 20 positions and all, if my counting is right, account for $1.48 4 million. I think most of these positions are
unnecessary. How the hell did the city of Lawrence exist in the past without any of these positions? I mean, I I am here am I here as an advocate? No. I'm here as a citizen. I'm getting sick and
tired of seeing money go out my wallet without me having any real say about what happens to it. Uh thank you. How many of these big budget raises are going to non Laorencians?
If some of these raises, a good portion of are going to citizens of Lauren, I got no major problem. Uh we have to go out of town to import people. How come? Uh in closing, how did city hall ever conduct business in the past without
these positions? I thank you for the time and I hope you do the right thing and evaluate every item as it needs to be. Thank you. All right. Anybody else from the public that wishes to speak?
53 Chester for the record. Good evening honorable members. Is that as a citizen of the 40 years I would review many budget in this city as a city of the immigrant has been grown. If the budget has to be reflection of the
vision of the future, prosperity for the Lawrence as one city united and strong, this budget go have to go behind the numbers. One of the most important things as a citizen of the 40 years is bothersome to me. Many of my friend and
associate working very hard for our city for many years. They're making less money than new hire. This is not acceptable for the city has been birthplace of the revolution of the birthplace of the bread and roses. The
city is a champion of the support of union right. We cannot allow this happen. Many of our friends working for the city for many years making less money than you hire. This practices is not acceptable. This is contrary to the
vision of the Lawrence one city on the god united and strong. We have to support our senior senior people the senior employee of our city that is the fundamental right of our citizen fundamental value and cultural value of
our city. Also in this budget we see police department one of the best police department in the nation with a budget of only $17 million. This police department, one of the best police department, this union of respect and
and safety create the best safety for our citizen. The city of more than 90,000 population. We need to hire more police officers. These police officers the best police officers in the nation.
They support our safety our city even though the other city neighboring city when they need brave Lawrence police officers go to the help. We need more support more more budget for our police department. Fire after fire. Our police
our our fire department has done excellent job with the a few firefighters a few units and the automobiles for the fire fire distinguishing. They did so brave. So good job the behind the numbers. We have to thank our firefighters. We have to
thank this department. Our DPW is the one of the best DPW I ever seen last 40 years with a li little budget. These people at any weather, cold, winter, hot summer, they working so hard. Lawrence
is a beautiful city because of our DPWU employees or veterans department. the the symbol of the bravery and sacrifice with a limited budget. We have to hire two backend position for our veteran department inspection department very
few inspector for the city of the 90,000 people we need to hire more more more inspector Lawren public school with a budget of more than 300 million we have to take care of our cafeteria workers we
cannot let our cafeteria workers starve to death because the nutrition of our children are the most important for educational process. We cannot ignore the need of the cafeteria workers. Lawrence teachers, we are united to
support your union. Thank you for gift of best education for our children. In the closing, we have to refer to fundamental value of the Laurentian. We are one city of immigrant. Through that 40 years, I see the aspiration. I I see
a hope. I see a vision for improvement of the Lawrence. But we must stick to the fundamental. Fundamental is the right of the seniority. Fundamental is the right of the union. Please pay equal pay for all the senior employees in our
city. Thank you. Thank you. Anybody else from the public that wishes to speak? Ney Andrew for the record, please. Good evening. Councelor Myra Ortiz, 45 Norris Street, President School Committee member. I'm so thankful that
we're having this time together. I wanted to give everybody on the budget committee their flowers. You've spent many, many hours pouring over this. I um fell asleep to you many, many a night with you in my earbuds. And I'm thankful for the work that's that's been done.
Seeing as I don't really have a vote in this space and I can only put it in on Facebook, I figured I would share with the public and with my fellow um colleagues in the space how I feel about the school budget and the other things that have been brought up. The first thing that I want to bring up is the
Veterans Memorial Stadium. It is in much need of repair and care. That is a a star for our community. And I was just there again, not just sharing space with you at our Lawrence High School um graduation, but in the stadium itself
where we have our P chair. It is atrocious. It's absolutely atrocious and it's unsafe. It's unsafe to walk. The walkway um comes up. little children were getting their fingers stuck this this past Sunday. And so I don't know
where in this budget if it is reflected, but I would like for you to take the time to to uh see if it is. And if it's not, let's let's let's make a work to find some funding for our Veterans Memorial Stadium. Our $35 million budget
for the school should reflect a fair income for our cafeteria workers, our par profofessionals, and our teachers who are now all in um negotiations and they're not going anywhere. And so
you hold the purse for the school system. You hold the purse for our teachers, our students, our par profofessionals, and our family for us to consider Lawrence public schools the number one choice for our children, not
an alternative while we wait for beas for our kids, which is scholarships or our our number to be called for a charter school. Our children should not be a gamble. And I feel like we are gambling with this budget when we are not respecting our educators,
our par profofessionals, and our c cafeteria workers with some of the raises that are being given across the board here. I applaud those without giving names excuse not I applaud those that have given their hard
questions in the committee sessions and they've been met with respect but also you have done your due diligence. Now let it not be performative. Performative democracy has been plaguing our city council and our city and where you
squawk and complain and then your vote says something different. I'm looking for bold leadership as we enter into this next cycle. I'm looking for people to stand alongside me, alongside my kids, alongside my grandkids so that we
can be able to call Lawrence great. Not just, wow, that is a big mess. What What did the council do? And every you guys get a bad rap because everything cannot be your decision, but this right here, this is where the rubber meets the road.
This is where all that talk of how come we're spending this and how come we're spending that, vote no. Cut the budget, call people out, and make the hard decisions that, yes, can be risky, but
ethically are correct. So, I appreciate your time. I appreciate your service. I think the last I I only came once physically here. It was like 1217 when you guys adjourned. You've done hard work on this. Let's make the decisions that are necessary for us to
have our public be proud of the decisions you make and restore trust in this council and this administration. Thank you for your time. Um, anybody else from the public that wishes to speak? Anyone else from the public that wishes
to speak? Public hearing is now closed. Um we have item 16425 which is the mayor de pñena may mayor Brian a de pñena recommended budget for fiscal year 2026.
It was presented to us by Ramona Karavayo and uh which is the our acting ko. I would like to uh please say u I would like to say thank you to the mayor that is here today and to every director and every head of department that is
here with us. uh presenting this fiscal year 2026 budget. Um, as the clerk just mentioned, this budget is 4420,81 uh 026 and um we would like to hear from the
mayor's office uh reading for the record that uh Mayor Brian Eda fiscal year 2026 uh budget statement which is uh a little bit modified uh from what we have in the book. So we can have that for the
record. Uh, good evening uh, council president, city councilors. Um, quick question. The do you want me to read a summarized version because I think for the sake of time it's No, we're good with the time. Don't worry about it. We just want to
read uh what what is on the budget that what's going to go into the budget because since we change it which since we changed that statement now that you're reading the correct one the long extended one will be for the record as part of the discussion today. Yeah.
Madam city clerk, uh do you have the the change version? I do. Was it distributed to the rest of the city council? It was. Uh before you started, I would like to ask the mayor to see if he have few words for that uh for the city council
um on this budget. Yes, I agree. Before I start, Council President, I would like to You got it. I would like to inform you that we have uh invited all all uh city department heads to be present. First of all, I
would like to thank them to to be here know uh uh they make a sacrifice through the budget hearing, but I also know that some of them have been here uh despite the fact that they had um you know medical issues. Our attorney is one tonight as well. Uh we have other
directors that uh unfortunately have family issues and they made themselves available uh for you and your questions. Uh dear counselors, I am pleased to present for your review the proposed
fiscal year 2026 operating budget for the city of Lawrence. This comprehensive financial plan not only outlines our anticipated revenue and expenditures, but also reflects our commitment to enhancing the quality of life for all
residents. By approving this budget, the city council would support my administration overarching goal of achieving long-term financial stability and sustainability for Lawrence. Together we can ensure the essential
services are maint maintained, infrastructure is improved, and community programs are adequately funded, all while fostering economic growth and resilience in our city. In the process of preparing the fiscal
year 20 2026 operating budget, my administration remains dedicated to exercising fiscal responsibility while truthfully navigating the complexities of our local landscape and anticipated
changes in state and federal funding. With ongoing uncertainties regarding funding levels and the sustainability of essential programs, we have conducted a comprehensive review of various cost-saving strategies aimed at enhancing efficiencies within our
municipal operations. Through the optimization of our existing resources by fostering collaborative partnerships with the private sector and community organization, we strive to ensure that our budget remains
sustainable without compromising the high quality service we provide or jeopardizing employment within our workforce. Our approach has included a careful analysis of the potential implications of proposed budget changes
and a commitment to closely monitor state budget proposals that impact local aid. This proactive stance empowers us to to make informed and strategic decisions about the prudent allocation
of our limited resources for fiscal year 26. Our primary focus continues to be on preserving the core services that are vital to our community. Investing in education to empower our youth,
infrastructure enhancement to bolster our city resilience and connectivity and emergency services that protect the safety and well-being of our all our residents. However, we also recognize the significant significant challenges
posed by recent funding reductions implemented by the federal administration. Decreased support for programs such as the such as building resilient infrastructure and communities. BR grant programs may leave Lawrence more
vulnerable to disaster, necessitating that the city internally finances critical infrastructure improvements. Additionally, substantial reductions in federal K12 education grants will inevitably limit resources available for
our schools, thereby affecting student learning and essential support services. The policy changes in the US Department of Housing and Urban Development poses a serious threat to affordable housing initiatives and vital social services
which could lead to decreasing funding for housing assistance and exervating housing shortages and homelessness. Furthermore, cuts to public health funding, which have been in effect since March 2025, are impacting the
capabilities of our inspectional services department, health division, making it more challenging to serve residents and respond to essential services. These funding changes risk undermining support for an array of
critical se sector and programs in our city, creating significant challenges as we strive to maintain the living standards and community the community deserves. As we move forward, we remain steadfastly committed
to addressing these challenges and enhancing the services essential to our community's growth and well-being. Wellbeing The following outlines a comprehensive overview of the potential impacts of the anticipated changes, the
administration's fi financial decisions and our proposed strate strategies for fiscal year 2026. One, balancing the budget, addressing shortfalls, and optimizing existing resources.
We have proactively explored innovative approaches to streamline operations, minimizing waste and enhance efficiency while ensuring the essential services remain intact. Our strategy includes diversifying revenues sources beyond
traditional property taxes by enforcing compliance to existing regulations and the introduction of new fees tailored in specific services. Another approach is to form strategic partnership with investors
through the introduction of impact fees on new developments to strengthen financial support. We are also conducting thorough evaluation of spending priorities to identify areas of responsible expenditures reduction
without compromising core services. After three consecutive years of stable tax rates, we propose a modest tax override for this fiscal year that aims to sufficiently fund essential programs and services addressing financial gaps
resulting from recent federal and state funding cuts. Moreover, we are considering the strategic use of existing reserves to effectively manage budget budget fluctuations
and unforeseen expenses to promote collaboration across departments. We intend to identify efficiencies and savings opportunities thereby minimizing duplication of services within our local government. Two, monitoring state
funding and aid. We are committed to diligently moni monitoring state budget proposal for local aid aid which in encompasses unrestricted general government funding and education
resources. Our team is working closely with state representatives to advocate for our communities unique needs to be reflected in the overall state budget. We continuously assess the implications of proposed changes in state and our
city budget making necessary adjustments based on comprehensive financial projections and trends. Additionally, we are focused on securing greater flexibility in state funding allocations allowing the city to direct resources to
areas that are in greatest need thereby maximizing our impact. Three, prioritizing essential services. The administration is dedicated to ensuring that essential services such as education, public safety, and
infrastructure development receive robust funding. A fundamental aspect of our planning involves maintaining capital investment in critical infrastructure, including roads, bridges, school, and public facilities.
We will carefully prioritize projects that offer significant long-term benefits for our community. As we work to balance the budget, we are considering how city policies can effectively effectively support local businesses and cultivate a thriving
economic environment. We remain committed to investing in community programs, particularly those that address urgent local needs such as affordable housing initiatives. uh comprehensive social services and
enhance recreational opportunities. By fostering on these areas, we strive to strengthen the fabric of our community and ensure a sustainable future for all residents. Number four, exploring public funding opportunities.
We recognize that the importance of exploring diverse public funding opportunities including conducting thorough research and available funding federal funding grants and government incentive programs. It is crucial to the identify and evaluate potential funding
sources that align with our project objectives. Our approach will be to prepare well-crafted applications that clearly project that clearly articulate the significance of the proposed projects and their
anticipated impact thereby positioning the city to maximize our opportunities for support. In closing, I would like to thank you and the people of Lawrence for their endless support,
understanding, and unwavering commitment to our city. uh care counselors uh the before we continue for fiscal year 2026
uh we have adopted uh a as I mentioned uh proactive financial strategy as outlined by the uh the mayor's u budget statements and we have used the uh the level funded
uh base budget and multi-year financial projection to address the fiscal challenges expected during this year. Now, I want to make clear the federal administration hasn't done finished their work. We're anticipating
projecting not that these cuts they have been proposed as you know and the community is also being informed by media newspaper and so forth that uh there's a bunch of lawsuits that are taking place and some of the positions
as we together with you uh most of you have been to Washington uh the mayor has has instructed uh myself and the rest of the staff that that accompany us to try to find out as much information and what we have figured out that there's no
clarity on the federal level. There's many funding that are uh there's funding available yet there's many political position at the federal level that has not been uh filled. Uh that means that
some of the decisions is based on the previous administration in terms of funding. there might be cuts or recommendation for cuts but we do not know so we are in a uncertainty um I would like to caution the city
council on behalf of the mayor that the level funded strategy that we're using in future years in the upcoming years contingent upon what is happening on the federal and state level may change so uh
because of the uncertainty And once people are telling you is when we like kids, you know, parents say, "Hey, there's no ice cream. There's no ice cream." So, we have to save every penny uh in order for us to um to pay our
bills and comply with our fi uh our financial commitments. Um in terms of salaries that has been mentioned during the budget hearing um we want to at least remind you
uh that we have not invented these salaries. The salaries have been recommended and I want to remind you as well that we have lost many staff that went to other communities, other cities. We have police officers as well that
been to uh other communities. uh most of our professionals that we have uh left and they did not leave because the mayor fired them when once the administration uh was sworn in. They left because there was no competition.
And that's why and it was with your approval or the previous city council approval that the Collins Center made a uh a thorough review of our compet compensation plan and most of and all I
mean all of the non-UN position uh that uh that we currently have uh the mayor has recommended rec uh uh salary or promotions and salary increases based on the Collins Center report.
Uh prioritizing essential services for this administration is vital and maintaining fiscal health and public trust. Key uh and is not only facing Lawrence but the
rest of the community. uh key issues that we're looking at uh despite the approval of the budget is potential decline in property taxes, personnel and pension cost. Would like to remind you as well that for the
police department we've introduced and the mayor recommended to you the Quinn bill that is costing us $2 million additional uh $2 million. That's $2 million additional that we did not have to worry about, let's last year, but it's in front of us right now.
uh underfunded in general, underfunded pension, infrastructure costs, uh the fact that we do have uh we have received funding and unfortunately due to Colombia Gas, we were able I'm saying
unfortunately because we lost a soul, we lost one of our residents and because of the the loss and the explosion um we were able to fix a great portion of our infrastructure. ructure, but that happened in the south which some of you
have are represented. The rest of the the poorest part of the community which is the north still have decaying infrastructure and we're going to continue to work on on upgrading those infrastructure. Uh as I mentioned before depletion of
federal relief fund, federal funding uncertainty, increase in demand of services. So um when you talk or you have mentioned during the budget hearing that there have been increases certain departments including the mayor's
office. The mayor's office haven't had any increases. Let's make that clear for the public. Uh this most of the departments are were level funded in the exception of some of them that you already know that has been discussed. I'm not going to take much time for you,
but those increases and positions, some of them were already in previous years and were uh vacated due to overhead uh due to um employees that
have left the city. And for two years, we have not filled those positions. Um and there is an increase in demand from our community. Our community is not 89,000. Our community is not not 90,000. We our
community is over a 100,000. It is reflected not only in the services that we provide but also in the emergency services that we experience on a daily basis. So please keep that in mind when you consider the budget. Um Now, here
are the key strategies the administration would use. Uh, mind you, uh, before I forget, the mayor's office as well. The mayor's office had the amount of staff. I remember when I came before the city council to justify the
budget in previous years. And when the question was raised, why did we needed more personnel? Well, it's a reflection now. Every person knows on a daily basis how many people we're serving. uh every position is that we have
requested you to approve is functioning. In addition, the amount of people that we're visiting, you experience that on Tuesdays. For some of you that come to city hall of those that come on Tuesday, that's just the mayor's office is full. uh we have thousands of people in this
community during the last three and a half years that have been visited and the services have you know continued and we are trying to do the best we can with what we have. Uh that doesn't mean that we don't need improvement. Yes, we we
are conscious that we need improvement but uh at least the taxpayer knows where their dollars is going. uh key strategies that the uh mayor and this would be the last uh that the mayor is going to use is number one we're going
to continue to attract economic development that is a priority without investment you don't get return we're going we will continue to promote smart land use meaning that we will identify uh with the our economic master plan
that is going to be developed pretty soon uh key areas that are underutilized in the city and how we can make sure to uh retain our businesses and also looking at some of our businesses don't
leave the city but they can stay uh in the city. One of the sites as you know is the Tumbrella site that we're looking at uh which would be totally commercial. Um so we're going to streamline regulation the time. We're going to make
sure that our planning and zoning boards, our members keep the scheduled meetings uh because some of them because of uh whether a family commitment or they don't show up. Uh some of the meetings have been delayed or cancelled and that
costs money. Time is money for investors. Um as I mentioned, we're going to continue with uh investing in our infrastructure. We're going to continue to market our city. we have done and Lawrence as you have
that you know and I'm sure that a lot of people within the community and outside the community is very proud of what this administration has been doing in terms of marketing. We have changed the image. We are going to continue to shape the
image uh uh now that we have a new uh leader in the police department. We're going to continue to do it because all the media that we have that we're paying our advertisement are using that money to only uh do negative propaganda and we
will continue to make sure that we are uh that we send the right message of what Lawrence is and we have been doing it for three years and it's working. Um in all all the development and redevelopment, we're going to continue with support housing diversity as you
have requested in several meetings and the mayor is also in advocate of it. But we would focus on the private investment. Uh we focus because those are the tax credit uh that one of the benefits of attracting investors and the reason why
they're coming is because of the tax credit. We're going to improve tax assessment. Uh we have our tax assessor. Uh we have our um um yeah we have our finance department. Let
me put it that way through the tax assessor that is looking and evaluate uh our properties because through there we we generate the money the funding as well as increase our tax base. Uh we will encourage innovation. That's
another thing because we need to know what type of businesses we we attracting. We will continue to collaborate with our our institutions. In the last uh six months, the mayor has been meeting with most of the banks that are within this community. They are
getting uh they're participating through the community development tax credit. They're receiving benefits and we want to see what they do for our community. This is not a handout. This is not a favor that we're doing them or they doing us. They have an obligation to
work with our business community and making sure that they uh they will continue to help us boost and bolster uh economic development uh tax collection. We as you know when the administration
first came we had uncollected taxes. Um I'm very uh grateful to uh the department of finance the finance department through the previous CAFO and this our current CAFO that we and our uh tax collector's office that we are going
after people that owe us money. There are challenges like the home uh equity uh theft loan uh but we are working with that. We're coming through you to make sure that these uh regulations and law are also adopted in our city because
these are mandates that we need to follow. But all of this despite of a little bit setbacks, we will make sure that we continue to collect our taxes. And finally is the adjustment of fees. We have the police department, building
department, uh the inspectional services, we have the fire department, we have the city office where we can generate and collect some of our monies that is owed to us. It is ridiculous that the amount of of of people that do
not pay or they work without a license in our city. And we're going to make sure and that's something that we can promise you that our department with through the leadership and people that we're paying, the city is paying that they are doing their job. and we make sure that at the same time that we come
before you and request that these salaries be increased that we can also generate the necessary revenue to serve our public. Thank you. Thank you. Uh thank you to the mayor's office to uh for reading the memo that
has been modified. And now I would like to call uh our acting chief administrator and uh financial officer Ramona Caravayo uh to go over uh what stayed by law. So uh
uh CAFO do we have an standard form CAFO section 8G certification which um indicates that this budget is actually um in pursuant to SHA to
sections 8G of the chapter 58 of the of the act of 10 uh 2010. Do you mind uh going over the that U document for the record so people understand uh why this is there and uh and your certification
It reads as follows. Pursuant to section AG of chapter 58 of the acts of 2010. I hereby certify that in my professional opinion after an evaluation of all the pertinent financial information reasonably available that the city's
financial resources and revenues are and will be continue to be adequate to support the proposed fiscal year 2026 mayor's recommended budget without a detrimental impact on the continuous provision of the existing level of
municipal services. Uh K also uh something that I have noticed on the memo that was read and is going to the record as part of this budget. It was that um
section one second paragraph of balancing balancing the budget addressing challing existing resources. Uh on the second paragraph this this document of the actual memo uh that and the
mayor's office just read on the second paragraph. It states that uh we are proposing a modest tax override for this fiscal year. On the previous one that is on the book, it says that uh we propose
a modest tax increase. Uh there is a tremendous difference between those two concept. Can you please go over those two, please? Yes. Um, uh, tax increase is what we currently have in the budget, which is Proposition two and a half of the tax
last year's tax levy plus the $1.2 million of uh, new growth. an override. It's a different terminology and I believe that you um meant that um it's actually we allowed to go over the prop
2 and a half uh amount and it's not that's not what what we're doing with this budget. It's a two and a half prop two and a half increase of the tax levy plus 1.2 million increase based on the new growth. All right. Um I understand
we went over that at the budget uh the budget hearings and we discussed the the uh the what was proposed which is basically around 2.8 3.85 or something 3.85% 85% or something around that
number. Correct. Uh but now that we have this memo which state as a tax override so we need to make sure that those numbers stays as per the discussion and not the memo. So what is what is the right one?
Tax increase. I I I don't believe the uh the senior advisor meant to say tax override. what he meant to say was a tax increase which is what's on the original memo. Um so it's a tax increase of like I said 2 and a half%. Plus the 1.2 2
million in new book. Uh okay. So that need to be fixed because that's extremely important the difference between the two. Uh that need to be changed if you guys are not prop if the administration excuse my language if the administration is not proposing an
override. um better be reflected, Mr. Chair, uh that the the change to a tax increase. All right. Now, now going back to the tax increase,
um, Miss Cafo, so do just for the for the for the record, do you mind staying the the the percentage of what is anticipated for the for the public to know and and that
uh and to have it as part of the record and this discussion? prior year tax levy uh per FY25 was $88 million plus the um excess leav capacity which is 13,66,735 2 and a.5% of that equals 2,536
thou 36,241 plus new growth of 1,200,000 that and then we deduct the allowance for abatement and exemptions which is $575,000. The total increase from last year's tax
recap is 3,161,241, which is an approximately 3.858%. 3.58%. 58 58 3.58. Yeah. Um, all right. That's important that we state it for the record. So we uh we know uh that the
budget of fiscal year 2020 2026 uh the the proposed tax increase is for the amount of 3.58%. 3.58%. Yeah. All right. Um also
counselors I said um as a council we have the privilege to uh do the following. We can uh cut the budget, approve the budget or deny the budget.
We we are not able as per law to increase the budget because we don't know where the funds are going to come from. U if any cut is been proposed then the procedures is as following.
We need to say the following the font uh where that is the department the division the organization and the subobjective
and all that is on the top of each page. Um for example if we are looking at any department on top of it on top of the line on top of the page is the font number which is
01 the general font the department which is 003 in this case it's any the division the organization and then therefore the subsession
they usually start with a U huh right here subsection which is basically usually start with a five and it's under this uh the second line under
at this time counselors I will go to entertchain a motion so we can open the budget of fiscal year 2026 for discussion motion Motion to approve. There is a motion to approve and it's been properly seconded by it's been uh prop uh the motion is by councelor
Rosario and it's been second by councelor Rees. So now I'm open uh this fiscal year 2026 for discussion. Counselors discussion I'll start off. Council President, I'm
I'm going to start with um with some projected cuts um to the budget trying to keep track of the rules that you have. Uh the first one will be in the um police department.
Uh all right. Do you mind saying the page page 67? Page 67. on the police department. Personnel services um for fund 01 department 0021
police administration which is 54 looking for a reduction for $175,000. That's under subdivision 51 personal service. Yeah. 51 division 54 and it's it's personal
services for 175,000. If I get a second, I can explain the cut. Second. There's been pro there's a motion on the table second by councelor de Rosario for proposed cut on that u on fund 01 department 021
division 054 which is the police department and under the personal administrator police administration correct correct police administration correct all right uh there is a proposed cut of
$175 uh000 counselor council plan. Thank you very much, Council President. So, let me just talk a big picture, and I promise I don't won't be as verbose as we go through these. This is the mayor.
This book is the mayor's priority. Um, and there's a lot of good things in this book. And, um, and what I'm looking at are are perhaps other things as we talk about uh raising taxes again this year.
Um, I'm looking to place what I think are important issues as well for the people that I represent. One of the most one of the important things that the people in my district care for and that we don't have state funding for it are sidewalks.
They're expensive. We have a big need for them, big need for repairs. And uh um this cut for $175,000 essentially will be because there's a deputy police chief's position in there.
Um at this point, we do have a new chief. I'd like for the new chief to be able to get his feet wet a little bit more. And maybe this is a good thing. Maybe he needs an exo. Maybe there's something else that can provide some assistance. But for this first year, um,
if I had a choice to be able as we as we have in the past, I'd like to be able to take some of this money. I realize it's a drop in the bucket, but we are raising taxes and I'd like to put it towards something that the people that I'm talking to say, what can we do about this? So, that's the reason why I'm
doing the deputy that essentially for the deputy chief, of course, as we all know, we can only cut 175,000. The mayor gets to determine in that's where he cuts and what he does. So, we can't dictate where it is, but that's I'm just being transparent and showing that's the
reason for the cut. That's the motion. There is a motion to cut $175,000 out of that um uh police administration. It's been properly second discussion. The chief is here to explain how important is the chief is here. Okay.
Council President, let's open up that an opportunity to the chief. But before we do that, councelor vice president. Thank you. Um thank you, council president. Before we we head to the chief as the chair of the budget and finance committee, I do want to shed some light on the discussion around this um
proposed cut um this particular and again to councelor Le's point uh we cannot specifically suggest um this a specific cut but um but because it was mentioned I'm going to summarize what was discussed. Um I I
was I was the counselor that evening that asked our new chief whether or not this position is actually needed within the the department. Um and this and I asked for a direct straight answer uh which was provided to the committee and
he said no this is not needed but what is what it is needed is more men and women out on our streets. Um that was long story short it was a a more detailed discussion but that was the the response that the budget and finance committee received that evening. All
right. Uh thank you council president and the chair of the young finance committee. Uh now we have we're going to open an opportunity for the chief to explain as of why if it is any why u so by all means can chief u for the chief.
Uh yes good evening. Um once again I think that when we were here last we had uh spoken specifically about that the 175 being allocated to one particular position and uh in light of the fact that we are approximately 29 officers
short now and that would be uh 26 uh line uh patrolman um the captain's position that was vacated by me and then the two sergeants position that we are short at this time. We are up to 29 right now. uh as far as personnel are
concerned um I would like as I've uh indicated in the past that there was uh uh I I would like to be able to reallocate that now the mechanism by which that happens I I don't know uh but I would like to reallocate that for other things such as um you know
advertising uh recruitment and retention incentives as opposed to having it cut alto together. Um, you know, right now I have special uh uh specialty units that I've put together. Uh, my uh specialty and proactive units uh such as
detectives, gangs, and and uh the drug units are are all uh underst staffed right now. Um I've even included new units that I'm putting on which is a quality of life unit. also uh traffic enforcement unit and there's going to be
a very uh very heavy um you know enforcement of the noise ordinances uh within the city in order to bring a better standard of living to to the city but also uh that has the um you know the side u benefit of some income as well
for the city. Now, with that said, um you know, again, these units can't continue to exist in any sort of uh strong capacity for a very long time because what we're doing is we're straining the resources that we do have. Eventually, our effectiveness is going
to be reduced and uh again um if there is any way and I understand what the current uh economic condition of the city is, but I would suggest that public safety is not the place to cut. um and especially if that money could be utilized in order to bring in more individuals. I have right now one
particular individual which is a transfer and this is the beginning of uh my campaign to try to get more transfers here, try to entice um other officers to come here and as the senior adviser said to make uh our department uh something
that's that attracts uh other officers to come to the city and serve the city because we need it. Um, you know, when it comes to public safety, we have to really decide and we have to really scrutinize what it is that we're doing. We're not just cutting 175,000. We're cutting my potential to perhaps entice
other officers and and and lure him here. Understood. Uh, now we have the city attorney right next to you that potentially he want to say something. First, I apologize for the mask. I have a little bronchitis that I'm trying to fight off. Um, being that this is the chief's first time before you, I just wanted to state, and I think everybody
knows, cutting the $175,000 does not cut a position. It does not. If the chief decided that he loves that position, he can use even if you cut the $175,000, he can fund it. It's his budget. He gets to do it. So, when you cut, just realize you're cutting from
the total budget. You're not cutting positions. You're not allowed to cut positions. You can cut funding. That's clearly a you're in your Bailey Wick. Just wanted to make sure you understood. We understand. Um I would like to call the CO budget. He can do it. Yep. Let me let me call the CO very quick so you can
explain a little bit a little bit more uh what this one impacts. Let me ask you a quick a quick question. Uh we have the police department is divided into three different sections which is the police administration, the police operations and the animal control. That's correct.
Yes. So the budget for personal services under the police administration cannot be used for police operations uh under the send line item or with without the council approval. Right. So if we go to the appropriation which was
read by the city clerk, you are when you approve the personal services within the police department, it's a combination of all three divisions or all three groups. So essentially if if that $175,000 uh could be used for other officers.
Yes. Correct. Okay. Without a council approval. Correct. Right. If the this got go through and then a new supplementary budget need to happen if uh that any type of money uh wanted to be allocated for that purpose.
Right. Correct. Okay. Counselors. Any other questions? the mayor's office uh through you uh council president the to make it easier for for a vote uh the mayor is uh in agreement that those
funds could be utilized. However, not undermining the fact that our chief uh would need that he can decide within his if if it need be to have someone that can help him. We don't want our
chief to be set to failure. other communities that are smaller than than uh than the city of Lawrence do have assistance and there's other priority but uh the mayor has agreed that the uh the budget um that the 175 could be used
for other funding. Right. Uh no problem counselors u as we as we just hear the mayor's office agreeing with that. It is also important to recognize that what's on the paper is on the paper. So they can they can use it for one thing or another thing. It's going to be up to
the chief and the and the administration. So uh any other questions? Council councelor Levy. Thank you councelor President through you. Uh so we can eliminate the deputy
chief in the amount of 17. Not a position counelor. No not a position. Just the 175 just the $175 but the amount can be used for him to decide whatever that he want to do in his department hire more people. All right.
Yeah. For personal matters. Uh any other questions counselors? Councelor I just want to say that overall this is not a cut for the police department. The police department is getting a 3.9% increase. A 3.9% increase. And I realize part of that has to do with the Quinn bill uh which the
uh which the Mr. Spanner mentioned earlier, but there is there is an increase and I just think that um before I just want I don't want to mischaracterize that this is the police are facing a cut and this that's not exactly what's happening. We're just trying to reallocate this. I I mentioned
my priority. The mayor may or may not agree. The police chief may or may not agree, but that's a priority that I think that as I talk to the folks that I represent, that they want to see happen. They're happy with the police department. There's always room for improvement. We're they're excited about a brand new chief with the energy that this chief is bringing to the job,
especially in the most recent initiative that he brought forward with the the speeding, the dirt bikes, etc. They were thrilled and pleased with that. Uh so, um so there is excitement. So, I just don't want to to make I want to make sure that the right optics are on this
uh and that as we look at again, we're going to keep saying this as we continue to raise we're going to be raising taxes again this year. We got to find we have to be smart as to how we're we're dealing with our money and u we're not going to get these sidewalks and they're always put aside. Always, always,
always. And there's no chapter 90 monies for it. Those are strictly for roads. You can't put sidewalks on it. Hopefully, there's a capital improvement budget coming forward. Hopefully they'll have some on there. But I just think that even though it's a drop in the bucket, listen, we all know it. We talked to the people that we represent
and we know in walking through our areas what that is. So it's a small thing, but it's a token. I'm going to be doing this twice more by the way. So thank you very much, council. No problem. Councelor, any other counselors? Councel Rosario. Thank you. And as soon as I saw
the UN budget and finance and you it was directly to this position I your explanation to me it was a sold I mean we need sidewalk but I'm calling you on an everyday basis for more patrol right and you said it we can use this for more
officers different districts different needs so I mean we use it as as more effective so and I agree that we need more patrol we need more officers and we need a better city. So, this is a to me it's a great card and we can use it to increase the personnel or or the
the units that you that you need to find to to go out there and do the work that we that you already started to do. So, thank you. All right. Um any other counselors? Uh to uh to get any of the cuts uh
approved, we need six vote. I just think you need five for that. consulting five for amendments for the final train but if you are let's wait in with
funds you need six votes okay so Jenny relocating let's get the advice from the attorney sorry the question again yes the question Man, the question is even though they're cutting money, it's
appropriating funds. So, are we looking for six votes? Six on a cut. Yes. So, I know it's six vote to approve the whole budget. I'm was thinking six for a couple. Six for everything. Six for everything. That's what involves finance. Yes. Uh councel plan enterain any any reading you have.
I'm good, but I'm not that good. I got to look it up. So, um, we're going to have to go with this and if, uh, if it happens, I will let I think it's six. The clerk think it's six. The city think it's six. I mean, but have anything there that's all and I'm and I'm going to look it up, but I'm not that fast.
All right. Uh, counselors, at this time, I'll I'll call um I'll call the question. Uh, all those in favor, please say I. I. Well, it's a cut. Everybody that agree with the cut, please say yes. Anybody that
disagree with the cat, please say no. Roco. Yeah, we need a roll. Roco. This is um amendment number one for $175,000 from the LPD. Um Council Levy, I'm going to sat with
you, please. Okay. Levy, yes to the cut or no? Council La Plant, yes. Council Luzon, no. Council del Rosario,
yes. Council Santiago, no. Council am. Council Reyes. No. Council Vice President Infante. Yes, council president. I vote yes. What's the count?
I have four to five. So four to what? Four four voting yes, five voting no. So I want to change my vote. I was not clear on on the um uh motion. So voting yes mean cut. Voting no means. But but
can we also President can we make another um motion of re relocating the funds? No. Okay. So, I'm changing my vote. So, we need if you vote yes, that means you're going to cut $175,000 from the budget. That's what you want to do.
I'm chang my vote. So, um then I was confused. So, with that, do you want me to just recall the role? We haven't really I think that it was it was some confusion on that uh on the meaning of the vote. Yes. Means you we
cutting the the the amount. So, that also means he can't reallocate that money. It's gone. No, no, no. I mean, wait, wait. That's my Yes, the vote. Yes, the vote. Yes, the vote mean yes mean yes to the cut. No means no to the cut. That's clear. So, madame clerk,
please call the role again. But, council president, yes, changes that we we already mentioned. So, it is not be going to be useful for the deputy, but it's going to be useful for No, no, no. Council La Plan proposed a cut to the
budget. Okay. for $175,000 is not it's on the salary level. That's it. Then a a yes to the vote mean a cut of $175,000. A no to the vote means you're not
agreeing with the cuts. To you, councelor Rees. Yes. But the clarification uh my colleagues offer is to be more clear. We we vote no uh for the cut. They can relocate the
funding to use more. If we if you vote no to the cuts, meaning that the money is going to stay within their budget and they can use for multiple essentially they can they can either uh they can either hire a deputy hire anybody they they
want including a deputy chief. Yes. I love when they hire people change my role my So madame clerk we're going to call the roles starting with council levy. No. No to the cut. Okay. Council Lant. Yes. Yes. To the cut. Council
Luzon. Yes. Council Del Rosario. No. Council Santiago. No. Council Amamo. Yes. Council Reyes. No. Council Vice President. Yes. Council
President. I vote yes. That now has five votes for the cut. Four. Five. What? Five yes. Five yes and four no. Okay. The the cut carries. Well, I thought we just said what the we're going to go to six. Oh, we need
six vote. Yeah, motion fails. Motion fails. We need six vote. I think it's a majority. I think it's not six. I agree with Do you have any reading, please? You're allocating funds whether you're
cutting them. Wait, wait, wait. It's mass general laws chapter 44 section 32. It says the council may majority vote make an appropriation for the purposes recommended and may reduce or reject any amount recommended in the annual budget. I did check with the do just to make
sure we were counting the right vote and he did confirm it's majority vote. It's majority vote. Yes. Okay. So majority wait. So the majority vote on any amendment to the budget and even for the full budget
No, that's not right. That's not right. Council President, that's not right. I want to reconsider in my vote. All right. There is a motion to reconsider. Motion to reconsider has been making here a second. Second.
Properly second. Uh discussion on reconsideration. Um I hear none. All those in favor under reconsideration, please say yes. I please say I. I. Any nay? Any nay? the eyes have it. So,
uh the vote now we are going back again on the $175,000 proposed uh amendment to the budget and um and voting yes means you cutting $175,000 that the
police department on their salary section. Voting no means that money is going to stay within the police department. Uh, all right. Voting yes means that we
cutting $175,000 of the budget. Voting no means that we are keeping the $175,000 on the police budget and not for salary. No, no, no. President it it is only for
salary. But it doesn't only for salary. Can be different salary. It could be any mad cl I'm sorry. Uh only for salaries. All right. Any other discussion on the now we we took a vote to reconsider
which is completely legal. Motion to reconsider within the next 24 hours is fine. Councelor Reyes, can you explain it again to me because I'm very confused. All right.
The motion is The motion is to cut $175,000. To cut more opportunity to have more No, no, no, no, no. Wait. No. Let's put Let's not put any last names. To cut $175,000 to the salary section of the police
department's budget to eliminate another. No, no, no, no. Wait, wait, wait. It's $175,000 cut. That's what the council of plann have proposed. If we're going to put all the things around, we can definitely say a lot of
things, but this is the the the that's that's what is being proposed is to cut $175,000. But council president, so councelor Rees, you still have the floor.
I still continue confused because when we cut funding with the budget with any department we review opportunity to development any other thing. So I continue confusing because when we
review the funding and especially I represent the whole city I call I receive phone call every day for more patrol. I don't want to cut any funding from police department because I want to provide the more better opportunity to
my community. We have a new chief and we want to offer the opportunity for they have more funding to develop more program to our community. Okay. Understood. Council. No, before we go that we go to council level. Yeah. Thank you Mr. President. Thank you council
president. I agree with my you know that right now. So we are we all $175 from the administration means that we are cutting salary in in some way because that 7 $175 is practically that's uh one of the
position. So we're going to use it in something different inside the the the police. So if we cut it, we are cutting salary. So and I don't I that's one of the thing that you know I think that we need more police. We need more uh people working
over there that can hurt our community. So uh that is the reason what I think that we should not cut that uh the $175. No problem. Councelor Councel Vice President Fante. Thank you, Council President. Um
we heard earlier today in in the intro of the budget about um not playing politics, right? Um when this particular $175,000 cut or amendment was mentioned, we heard
from the administration stating that we do not want to put the chief we do not want to place our chief in a position for for failure. What I've seen so far is that oh not put you in a position for
failure and give you the opportunity to hire a deputy police chief if needed. This is the third or fourth year that the administration has been trying to push this specific amount within the budget. Um I don't I
don't think you're you're in a position for failure. you've you you just started and you've already done more than previous um police chiefs. And also what I've seen being part of the budget and finance committee is that
if additional funding is needed for positions, for equipment, etc., there is a way to work with our financial department to come back to the council and vote on that. Um I don't I'm also one of nine counselors that get many
many um requests for more for more patrol. I'm one of the counselors that police department have heard me many times very frustrated for not having adequate police patrol in within my district.
However, that that little language that I I heard earlier makes me doubt that if we keep this is going to be for actual um patrol. I know your intentions are are where where they need to be. What
I'm foreseeing is some conflict. So, if this is the actual um um goal, I'm sure the police department will be in front of the council again, and I'm sure we will all be in agreeance because I'm hearing that across the border that we need more patrol
officers. Um and that's the only that's all I have for this council president. Thank you, Council Councel Rosari. Thank you, Dio. Also, what I'm noticing is that if we if we cut this 175,000, it will be 175,000 out of your budget, chief.
If the administration wants to push push a a deputy shift, they have to come back to us. Uh but if we cut it right now, we'll be out of your budget and eventually they could again cut it, but they can use it out of your budget and and put the
175,000 from somewhere else. If we cut it from you, it's money that you won't be able to use. But if they looking to push this position, they have to come back to us to bring somebody in. So it it's also a boat that we need to think about. It's 175,000 that we taken away from the police department for them to
use it. I I will I would prefer because I if you guys saw it, I changed my vote, but I would prefer a chief to have the 175,000 and sit down with the administration and explain also his needs. But already 175,000 are sitting there. And at the end of the day, the
administration have to come back to us to put a deputy chief there and then we can action on it at that time. But in the meantime, the chief will have the 175,000 on his budget. Thank you. Councelor Councel Mu. Um,
I I was one of the counselors that felt conflicted because I do agree that when it comes to law enforcement and having uh additional patrol officers, it's it's a necessity and a and it should be a priority uh for our community, but it
doesn't sit well with me not knowing how those funds are going to be allocated. Like I wish to vote yes in order for you to keep the 175, but the whole purpose of this is to discuss budgets, is to discuss line items and where and how
money is being used and spent. So not having that clear is is just doesn't sit well with me. Um, and when I'm hearing conversations that we're cutting salaries, if the chief is holding well, um, and and and doing his position with
integrity, it's only going to cut that specific position. It shouldn't be cutting into any other salary, but that position that he claimed, it is not needed. So, um, for that reason is why I voted the way I voted. Thank you. Any
other counselors? Yes. First I wanna I I want to say I was confused that I wanna explain to my constituent I was confused that's why I didn't the vote
and I will consider my vote and and the second one I agree with my colleagues that we need more uh patrol but uh we we have so many needers in the
city just not patrol. I understand that but and and I would like to give the opportunity to the uh new chief police can can put in more
challenge. You are new Lexi. What do you have for us as well? Thank you. Right. Thank you. I would like to ask a one quick procedurous question to uh to the city of Chenny. Okay. The council president may one minute. City of
Chenny. Uh do you have an answer on that? Uh I did read I do have chapter 44 section 32 of the mass journal laws. It does say a city council may by a majority vote make appropriations for purposes recommended and may reduce or reject any
amount recommended in the annual budget. So that would seem to indicate a majority vote. However, we do have a uh in uh 3.5 we have on a quorum of the uh city council it says the affirmative vote of
six members shall be required to adopt any appropriation order. So the question becomes is the is this a an adoption is the reduction an adoption it is an appropriation as per the last
10 years that I've been here we always need six vote as your last 20 years that you've been here so I I I think to so I I think and I'm going off of memory and I'm as as everybody's speaking I'm trying to go through all the stuff I
possibly can. I was able to find this Mass General laws where it says there is five votes, a majority is needed uh in a municipality. So majority vote would be required. Um I do thank you for finding that it talks about final. We've been I think dealing with final adoptions at the amendment level is always been five.
It's the final adoption that we've always had to have the supermajority of six. That's been my understanding that has been um that's that's been our our practice I believe. Um, and so, um, I'm glad that the the city attorney found
that. Repeat that one more time. That last from the charter or from the the go for the charter. That's the most important thing. Match general laws. I'm going to take a chance and just put this down. Says the city council may by a majority vote make appropriations for
the purposes recommended and may reduce or reject any amount recommended in the annual budget. However, in our charter 3.5 section B quorum, it says the affirmative votes of six members shall be required to adopt any
appropriation order. Yeah, it's an appropriation. An adoption of the appropriation order, not the amendments. It's the final adoption. It's the final vote that we have for the three. That's a good that's a question I and that's the way we've been practicing for for so long. And I've got if I got the floor, council president, I do have a question
for the capo. Uh you have the floor, council. So if this if this cut is adopted, I just I want to make sure we're on the same page. Yeah, councelor BL before we get to the cut itself, we would like to clarify that all the portion which is basically an an and
aducting the budget and the amendment of the budget because that's that's very important and then we will definitely go back to the potential cut that we're discussing the amend that uh that that uh what we have in front of us. So, S
Cheney, if we have an amendment to the budget, um I believe we need six vote. Uh because it's an it's a potential appropriation to the general budget.
uh if we have an amendment and then we need a final deduction with six it it's an appropriation that was adopted with less vote that is required per the shadow so I I we can go back and look at the
records as to how we vote in the past for any type of cuts what I would tell you is that it if you you have to read it in two parts the mass general law says is the city council the first line which I
think is important the city council may by a majority vote make appropriations our charter is in direct opposition of that so we say you need six I would say you need six because it it doesn't
differentiate between amending and approving in the mass general law it says majority we have said no so and And also uh city chie uh we can at the local level we can restrict the law. We can we can we can we cannot alleviate the law.
You cannot that's essentially what we're doing with our shadow. Correct. So what the chart the city chart is doing right now is okay we're going to need six vote from the city council in Lawrence Massachusetts. Correct. The mas law for
everybody else that haven't they just need five vote. That's what we're doing here. Yes. And and if this were in fact an ordinance mass general law would trump it over it will trump but it's not. It's the chart. It is the
shadow which is a local law that is a m law that affect the city of L. Uh we need six vote. So now um we're going back to the amendment which is basically the the the motion that is in front of us. Council Lebron,
I thought we already had a vote on that, but I I do want to ask the capo to come up since this is our first one. I just want to make sure we're all clear. Cap through you. The capo, please up. So, if this happens every year, if if a cut goes through, we have an unbalanced
budget, correct? We have more revenues coming in. We now have and let's pretend this thing goes through. We are now minus $175,000. So, now we have an unbalanced budget. So at some point we are going to need to
get that thing to be balanced. Now how do we I think I know the answer but I want to refresh all of our memories. How do we get to the balanced budget? Is there a supplemental that has to be prov then then puts revenues either have to drop or we're going to have to do a
supplemental? Could you describe that? Right. So after the council decides what to cut and what to accept. Then we go back we put in the revenues. we have a balanced budget before you. We provide the appropriation for the city clerk and then she uh uh publishes that and we
update the information and that updated numbers become published in the in the website so everybody will have the right numbers. Great. Perfect. So the question is more related to where do we going to get the money from? if we need more money, but in this case, we're going to
we're going to need less money, which basically we're increasing taxes because we don't have enough money to balance the budget. So that that means what I think is like we're going to tax less amount to the taxpayers. We're
going to charge less. Correct. $175,000 less for every cut. That's correct. That's a fact, right? Okay. If I may. All right. Sure. Chief, uh just uh before I mean before we move to you councelor Llan, do you have any any
other questions? No, I I do. I I do just again before capital be back and forth. Can you one one more question through you? So, I'm trying to wipe the rust off my head
from last year's budget. So, when we have in this situation where there's excess revenues, you just mentioned that that means they're just going to reduce the excess revenues to make sure that the expenditures and the revenues match. Right. Right. Um I believe there was
some sort of vehicle by which the motor vehicle excise tax test, not the motor vehicle. Wrong choice awards. There's an there's a way that um that let's say that the um that the administration can
send down a revised appropriation to match the cut. So in this particular case 175,000 it's not balanced. So that there would need to be something else from the administration that shows where that 175,000 is going, which is why the
mayor's got the the power of the purse to be able to put the money where he wants to put it, but we have the power to accept and reject it at a later time. Now, I'm I'm speaking that way right now because I think that's the way I'm
trying to to get back. Does any of that sound familiar to you at all? I think they're combining two different scenarios. At one point the the administration did provide a supplemental budget because of various reasons, but in this case, if you decide to cut whatever uh line item in the
budget, we will then address the revenues on our end, the finance department, and we'll provide you with a final uh appropriation. So, my goal, I mentioned sidewalks, right? My goal of having money for the sidewalks, that's
not happening. I can cut a million or2 million dollars onto this budget and we're just gonna all that's going to happen on that then just so I'm clear so I'm clear and we're all clear is that all that's going to do is reduce it reduce the tax burden by whatever. Uh but that dream that I have of of the
sidewalks in the city being paved it's not going to happen. It's not going to be realized through this budget. Well, you can always request it and we can come back for a supplemental uh appropriation for the sidewalks, but we're but we but through the
existing monies that we have, they have to be reallocated, right? Yes. Council, when you cut, it's gone. How many sidewalks we can when we make you know when we make the
cut, it's like it's money that is not coming in, right? I'm still happy. I'm still thinking this motion just because in the in the big picture I've expressed my dream but in the big picture what the deal here in all seriousness is is is that I'm looking at
this budget. I think it's wellcraftrafted. I've got questions. I heard the public comments on it. I get all that stuff and there's a lot of truth there, right? There's some truth there. Um, but the reality is is that when we're asking our residents to pay more for taxes, I want to make sure that
they're getting the best that they can possibly get. And right now, even with this budget goes through, the police chief himself is suggesting to me that we really don't need that 175 for the deputy. So, I'm looking at that thinking, well, why are we keeping that in there? If anything, I'm not looking
to have more people. I'm looking to I'm looking to make our government work more efficiently. That's it. Thanks. So if chair may make council chief, let's allow the chief. So so there were three comments that that I think that I I I should address before you make your final decision on this. Uh first with
regards to council de Rosario. Um yeah, I don't I'm not familiar with uh I would be pretending if I was telling you I was familiar with the process by which that would come back up to, you know, before the council, whatever the case may be. I don't know that. I can assure you that um we've had communications with the
administration and They um uh they've indicated that they would not be asking for a police chief's position uh this year. Um with that said, um I'd like to address uh Councelor Infante's uh concern and comment. Um you know, no matter what
happens here, um you know, we're going to continue to work very hard and continue to provide the services that we need. Um we've we've for many many years have done more with less, and so there's nothing new here. I I wish that wasn't the case, but we we're still going to continue to provide the best services we
can. As to uh council Luplant's uh uh statement that the city that the department had u made more money or we got an increase uh earlier in the day. Yeah, I would say uh council plant and this was prior to me so I'm not privy to any changes but
that runs counter to fee February 7th 2025 memorandum which has indicated that the budget on 21 was underfunded by 567,489. Additionally in fiscal year 2022 it was
we were underfunded by $540,000. 2023 we were underfunded at 781 and fiscal year 24 it appears we were underfunded 709. Now with the funding that we do have at this point doesn't consider two things. Back in 2020 the
last time that there was a census uh in Massachusetts well federally um the uh the population at the time was about 90,000. Those are the people who actually uh wrote it in the people who actually uh registered. Um I would suggest to you and I don't think that
anybody can uh you know legitimately argue that we are somewhere within the lines of 120,000 people. So um the percentage raised from last year to this year in the fiscal year is 3.29%. The amount of people that has increased
in the city of Lawrence is 33.33%. Um chief and so chief one second I mean uh those are those amount of people that you mentioned based on the census I don't know I mean our last census uh throw that we have 89,000 people and
that's basically what we need to go by because otherwise if we just open it to a potential amount of people that we have here in Lawrence and then we're not going to be talking about fats. Uh so just stick with the number on the census please. Uh you're uh council president.
I'm sticking to the numbers I see on the streets and especially with the accessory dwelling units. When I go into three family homes and they're packed with families, I I kind of get the sense and I've been around enough. I get kind of sense get the sense that we're not at nowhere near I know,00 I know that I
know that chief but I mean we cannot say an an amount because and then it will it will it will you know people going to believe that we are at that level and we don't have that fact. it will because I want to keep everything like transparent and fluence. I mean, I understand what
you said. I believe that we're not at 89,000, but I don't know where we are. So, just stick around with it with the numbers and I understand where you're coming from. President, just to speak to the mic, please. Council president and counselors, the
reality is that when there's a census, undocumented uh people or immigrants, they don't report at the census. I understand and and I understand and I agree uh with a lot of things that we have both of you have saying. I just
don't want to stay with a number that we don't have we don't have that as a fact. So, it's like I I agree with what you guys say. I just want to make sure that we staying with what we have and the data. Chief, you might continue. Okay. So, well, I'll end it with this. Council
President, right now, my understanding is that my $300,000 training budget uh has been reduced to 80,000. And so, with that said, there's a lot of training that we cannot meet. There's a lot of training that we're going to be short on. If we're going to stick to the facts, the facts is I can't afford to
lose 175,000. Those are the facts. So, with that, I there's not much more I can tell you. Something's going to give. You can't own a Cadillac Escalade on a Honda Civic budget. It's just that simple. We get what we pay for and what we invest in. And I I would appreciate if you
would invest in the security and the safety of the community. No problem. Yeah. I I love the passion, by the way. I mean, I you're fighting for your department through you. You want to see you want to see uh results. you know where you you you see the goal line and
you want to reach for it and I I respect and admire that and I also think that what a lot of that you said I'm not going to dispute that. I might even withdraw my amendment based on what you just said and based on the new facts. So give me a second to digest that in my brain. But I do want to say there is
there is an increase. It's on page number 22. So if we're be dealing with numbers, we're dealing with numbers. The numbers are right there in our budget. Page 22. The police department has a $72,000 increase. That's that's that's a fact just like you were mentioning in facts earlier about the other stuff how
you're underst staffed. I get it. I understand the FBI numbers say how many you supposed to have per your population base and you have to have I get all that stuff. I understand that. Um what my concern here is with this budget you're not getting that you're getting a deputy
police chief. You're not getting what you want which is to get that money over to training that you said was so woefully cut. So the question now is how are we going to get it to where you need it? We have 175,000 that you say is you would rather have it someplace else and we can't do it. Do we do a transfer?
What do we do on that? I mean, the mayor's got to send that down to us. I mean, is the mayor prepared tonight to say, "Yeah, I'm going to take that out. I'm going to move it down to a different line item." If I may through you, uh, council president. Yeah. And and and before we we open up the mic to you, um,
the mayor's office, it is important to recognize that at the budget section, we actually asked for a plan as of that $175,000. Correct. And then as of right now, we don't have that plan. I wish that we have that plan so
we can direct the conversation towards that specific plan because that was brought up at the um at the at the budget section. Uh council vice president and then I open up to thank you for the mayor. I have a question for the for the chief um pertaining to your
training budget and obviously what we spoke about during the discussion we had during the budget and finance um meeting and this is a yes or no question um if possible.
Did you express your concerns regarding the cut for training and regarding allocating funding for more personnel prior to this budget being being created or when it was the department's turn or
when when you came on board and I know we gave you more time to review this budget with the mayor which allowed for changes to be made. Were these concerns expressed directly to the administration? We spoke with regards to the deputy
chief's position. I indicated why I did not need a deputy chief's position, but I'd rather allocate the money toward uh more uh personnel and they stated that they understood and that it was fine for the CI. Thank you. So the question is
around the training. Did you discuss the the training portion of it and the cuts on the training portion of it? I became aware of the training uh budget council president uh just recently. Uh my uh director of uh support services here, she might be able to explain at what point that left. As you know, um I had
nothing with the to do with the creation of the budget altogether. I've just recently been going through it and and finding uh where there's any differences, discrepancies and how the budget as proposed may or may not be consistent with what this the the the
vision is going forward or the mission. Understand? Uh the the good thing about all this discussion is that uh this budget has been uh proposed with two different dates. We don't agree today and then we can agree on Wednesday. Uh council vice president. Thank you. One
one last question council president. um to our CAFEL, our acting CAFEL. During our discussion um at the budget and finance committee meeting, did you go back to the administration with with our request to to create a plan to
reallocate the $175,000? No. When we discussed this, I spoke with the u the council president and because the amount was going to stay within personal services is nothing to be done. The amount stay Okay. Okay. Thank you. So these are very important because if
we're going a having a lot of back and forth. So that's why I'm I'm specifically asking have these qu have these questions been asked what were the discussions so everybody can be on the same page. Uh thank you for clarifiing counselor because you answered your own
question. I I am basically you have uh what I would like to do and this is a matter of trust. We're dealing with public funds. uh the administration would never this has been discussed first of all with the chief in terms of the funding uh he
indicated that for now correct me if I'm wrong that for now that is not his priority and uh I was going to mention that during the budget but then it I said it was going to take too long to uh bring forth the um the different changes and
proposals on the changes on the budget and this was one of So uh we are the administration is willing if it's through a memo we request the the I think the uh was it uh councelor Lel plant you asked
for if the administration would be willing to confirm it via a memo you will have that tomorrow morning but I through you I don't think it mean it tomorrow morning we would need something tonight well essentially we're going to pass a budget maybe well maybe the the
maybe because we proposed today. It's up to the council to decide whether this budget is will pass today or it will pass on Wednesday or pass any time before June 30 because that's that's that's the reality. Another thing that
could could happen is that if any potential amendment to the budget happen tonight or any any time during this discussion, the administration can com come back the proper the appropriate way to do it is the prep the administration
can come back at any time during the fiscal year with a uh supplementary budget which is going to be part of this budget. Uh and and that's the proper way to do it. Correct, Kaf? Okay. So, you can do an a transfer
anytime during the year with the mayor's recommendation and approved by the council. Is that what you're referring to? Or he the mayor can propose a supplementary budget which is going to increase any type of money on any department. But that would have to be done like right now
for this budget for this meeting. Motion to fixed revenues are fixed. That's the issue. Yeah. All right. All right. Uh any other any other discussion? Council Luzon. Thank you,
Council President. And uh thank you for bringing to the table that we did ask for a new budget from the police department. I recall that in one of the meetings council president uh first we
asked the chief to um to review the budget because we knew he was not part of the conversation due to the process of him becoming the new chief. But also I remember asking for uh the committee
asked for a new budget something that will show that you needed the money for training instead of of the position that we are talking about and I don't know if they answered the question I but
uh can a judgment so not a new budget from the police department. No. And a judgment to, if I may, council president. Uh, hold on. For clarification. For clarification. Point
clarification. Council president. Um, councelor Lozone. What I recall is I I recall when we made that statement, I looked at the capital and I and I said to her, um, even if it's just a page that we can put in front of the police
department with those corrections or those adjustments, we're looking for those funds to get reallocated. Um, and I think we were all in agreement with that. I'm looking at the rest of the committee members. If if I'm misspeaking or even cal if I'm misspeing um please
let me know but that is what I recall from that discussion. Yes. Um essentially I'm sorry miss. Okay. Um essentially, uh the chief originally had said, um the amount that amount of money would be
used either for overtime or for additional patrol on the streets, which either of the two would stay in the same category, which is personal services. So there's really nothing to be changed. It's just maybe switching deputy chief versus
overtime or whatever, but it is in the right category per the appropriation that the council will be voting on. So that's why there's really no no change needed. Okay. In the meantime that uh the discussion
is around uh cutting the uh $175,000 out of the department. Any other counselors? Councelor M just listening to what the council is saying. So despite the fact that the the the funds are not going to be allocated to a different division so
to speak, the the the title under which these funds were going to be used for could have been changed. So if it's not for a deputy chief, then then the the job would have been simple enough to just change that and that we wouldn't
even be having this discussion to be honest. All right. Um if the council prefer we can take a vote now or we can have the amendment on the budget later during
during today. Council President Council I'm sorry. Uh council president uh for point of clarification if you could please provide me with uh information. If voting to deny the budget, would that
give them the opportunity to make uh certain adjustments and uh moving funds or cutting whatever needs to be cut? Yeah. Uh good question. And the answer will be the following.
If we tonight the council denied the budget, we denied the fiscal year 2026 budget with an specific amount of dollars. If on Wednesday we come back and reconvene and propose a different
budget, that could mean that we have $1 less than the previous that we denied. And that's a different budget. If that's denied today and they come back and said instead of $175,000 we're
going to reduce that by an specific amount. That's a different budget. That will be a different budget that is presented. And if the amendment also include as of what those 175 is going to
be changed two it will be appropriate and it will be in order to you Mr. councelor before we we go to you there is there was a couple of uh questions around this side I um I think
you answer my question council president and I want to add that uh yes chief um Aguiler uh I understand your point of of needing more training but I'm also as a counselor I'm concerned about leaving this amount of money there and not
getting a commitment from the administ administration of not uh trying to revive this item. So, um I we want to work with you and we want to make sure that the the city as all public safety
uh comes first for the entire city, but I'm also as a counselor, I'm concerned and I hope that we can find a common ground uh chief and council president. Okay. Thank you, Council Rees. Thank you. Mr. President, uh, we can amend to
tonight and change the the the name of T and B the D chief. We can use another title, more patrol, more training. Well, councel, I believe that that will be an an a change to the budget.
administration will have to have those changes in front of us because we I don't believe that we are allowed to change anything on the budget other than cutting approving or or or not approving the budget. So changing the title will
change uh something that is not within our our jurisdiction. Council president if I may before we go to deal I will go to council. Okay. Uh give a minute just to have the floor. Sorry. And I have another question.
Sure. If we decide to cut this amount, we can transfer to BPW. No, we don't need a No, we are not allowed to do it. I want to ask uh we are not allowed to transfer uh this fund to another department.
Uh, council LLC, do you have something? I would just like I would just like the council to know that you've already taken a vote and the vote to cut was defeated. No, we actually we did a reconsideration to the vote. Oh, you just did a rec.
Just want to make sure cuz I didn't hear the reconsideration. Yeah. Thank you. All right. Uh, council, we're this horse is almost dead, but we're getting there. So, um, back to the cafo. So, just so I'm clear, I'm sorry. And this training funding that the chief's talking about,
is that within personnel services and where is it? No. So they do not have money in the and they don't have training budget in their budget that was allocated through the ARPA fund that was given to the police department. I thought the chief said that it was
reduced that there was something there. I miss hear him a few years ago. Okay. So now Okay. So there is no line. So but if there were to be where would that be? If there was going to be a training, would that be under personal services? That would be
It will be under personnel. I think he's actually on the purchase of services, employee training. We're looking at page seven operations, but they don't have that line item in
their budget. They don't they don't. But it's Is that a requirement that they have that line item in the budget to be able to fund it? I don't think that's a requirement, is it? So, hear me out. This is a little unorthodox, but I think we can get to the finish line here. I
think a lot of people, if I'm hearing this discussion well, is that people want to see the police department get some sort of money because on training because the the chief has made a very eloquent plea as to why that's important.
We need to we can't we got to do this during this cycle. We got to do this as this debate is going on for if it's tonight, if it's Wednesday, whenever it is that we're doing it before we ratify or adopt the budget. I want to know for you, council president,
I'd like to get something in writing. It doesn't have to be anything formal, I don't think, but something that just has, I believe, a a revised budget on one page that shows that money is
$175,000 less in personnel services and $175,000 more in purchase of services. How quickly can we turn that around? And um because I think that would give me
solace. I would withdraw my motion. Uh because I'm I think we're getting to the right ends. Um so I'm asking you, does it have to be like written like this or can it be I don't mean this literally but close to it on a piece of paper
saying that this is the revised for our purposes tonight. This is our this is our revised budget for personal services. You understand what I'm saying? In purchase of services. So can you answer that? Yes, I can work with the administration to get that done if that's what you like. I I if the
administration is amendable and it sure sounds like they are. Let me say it then from the podium just right now. Yeah. Uh that was just for the uh just for the record uh that was exactly what the budget and finance
request budget and finance committee request. So I guess that it is important the voice of the committee it it's important uh to the rest of the committee because I guess that we are in the same page. By the way, it is important to say for that uh for the
level of transparency that that uh uh Miss uh Ramona the CAFO, the acting CAFO, she did mention that for us to be able to fund mention to me that for us to be able to fund this specific position, that specific position need to
come in front of city council uh for the reauthorization of the position since it's been vacant for more than six months. And I'm being clear and transparent and the counselor de Rosario just mentioned that as well as well during the uh during the uh during this
hearing uh the administration. So quick question. Can you repeat your question? So I know exactly that. I think I think I think the council president has struck upon a pathway that that may work which is this. We we we
um we we need to have an understanding um that that position deputy chief cannot be filled and everybody knows that until it gets reauthorized by the council. So right now that's just a bogey man right sitting there on a piece of paper. Nothing can happen till this
council votes for it. That's number one. So, we could I may withdraw my amend my amendment with the hopes that the mayor will send down um because between major subobjects later a transfer from 175
from personal services to 175 to purchase of services doesn't have to be done tonight thanks to that thanks to that because of that little that six-month thing. So we so we don't need to do that piece of paper thing that I was talking about a second ago. So but I
want to hear from the mayor because we're we are working together on this. Is that a commitment that the mayor's office is willing to make and send that down to us? Mr. Mayor, u your approval. Uh another another thing is um it is important to recognize that the need of
training. Uh the committee was was going with what the chief was looking for which is having more people in the street. So now is either we're going to have for training or we're going to have it for a couple of patrol officers that are might be able to be funded. So let's
see the priority of the chief. Chief, what do you want? And and we don't we are not at odds. We're trying to we're trying to get a budget for the community that is that is balanced. One united Lawrence one united and strong. Okay. So
whatever but it's it's agreed. Always united. always strong. That's what you mean. It was, council president, I think this is the right time to move this forward. I hear what's happening. Um I think I think we're coming to an agreement. I think I think we're going to be happy with this. And based on what
I'm hearing tonight on all of this thing, this has been like sausage being made. It's been ugly, but we're going to get to a good spot. I'm going to withdraw. Oh, thank you. I'm going to withdraw my my amendment based on what I'm hearing this evening and how we can go forward on it. Second, what I will um what I will say is that you will join
your amendment but the commitment we making is that if the budget get approved is going to be bending that is specific on writing uh memo commitment that is going to show where we're going to be using that
$175,000. Is that correct? All right. No problem. Second. Uh no you don't have you don't have we don't have to second on that it's been withdrawal the discussion is now continue on the main of the budget we have uh other uh
potential cut that council plan have yeah I've got two more on this um thank you chief you're good thank you um for me know that you're for me I'm done with uh the next uh similar no sidewalks
though uh unfortunately. But um you're going to get your sidewalk. I'm I hope I can get my sidewalks. On page 75 on the Lawrence Fire Department, uh there is an assistant commissioner, assistant I'm sorry, assistant chief
75. Okay. Sure. So, uh there's an assistant fire chief. We we painfully have gone through what we can and can't do. So, um but that's the reason. What's that? Sure. Um amendment. This is fire
department 22 division 60 under personnel services $150,000. Is that adequate? Yes. Okay. That's the motion and I can explain it after if it gets second. Second. It's been properly seconded by councelor uh vice president
infante. Discussion councel. Thank you. So again, every time I'm speaking tonight, I'm going to say this. We're increasing taxes by two and a half%. Let's just nail that home. Uh two and a half plus uh new growth, which is $1.2 million.
Understood. Um so what I what I I'm reluctant to see more positions. What I what I want to see happen is is for
positions are important but what the people do who get the positions are more important. So we could have a bunch of positions and I'm not picking on the fire department just have this is just a general theory but but if you don't have good people doing their jobs I don't care what positions we have it's just
not going to work. That's just common sense. So, um, on this assistant fire chief, we haven't had it. From my perspective, the fire department's been working very well. Very proud of our fire department. I love the work that they're doing. They uh engage in our
community. Um, they um I mean, they've proved themselves during the gas crisis. The every day they are they they're on the front lines. I hate to sound trit about this, but they're doing the work uh that protects and serves our citizens. And so I've got nothing but
good things to say about our fire department. And they've done this without an assistant fire chief, frankly. So I don't know why we need an assistant fire chief. Um I could be talked into something else with this because I can't be talked into sidewalks, but I can be talked into
something else. But I just don't think we need an assistant fire chief because I don't see the need. So that's the reason why I'm looking for a cut. I see that the acting fire chief is here. Um I to put Why not put him on the spot? So,
the acting fire chief is here. Is there something else outside of this position in your department that's going to be critical to provide services to the people we represent? Chief, good evening, Mr. President, counselors. Um, this position of
assistant fire chief I firmly stand behind. I believe it is needed in the city of Lawrence. I've worked for the fire department the last 25 years. the last eight years in administration. And I I think I said it a a while ago.
The first time that I realized our hierarchy wasn't cut out for big emergencies and other things was during the gas crisis when when we had that in front of us. We went from 24 members working a day to to 72 members working a
day. We had a lot going on. We're not in the gas crisis, but we have a lot of things that are going on during the day. And I could I could sell this to you, tell you about a lot of different ways. I could stand up here for the next hour and tell you why the Lawrence Fire
Department strongly needs a assistant fire chief. And um I could tell you some of the duties. I could tell you some of the other things that that job will be doing if you' if you'd allow me to do that. Um, it's about checks and
balances. Again, we have five divisions. They' help with day-to-day operations, policies and procedures implementation. They could help with budgeting, um, personnel services, hiring, also um, incident command specific
things that they could be doing is, you know, help with training, EMS. Right now, we don't really have anybody seeing our EMS. Going back to training, our training is one person for 124 members. The last person that was going to bid that spot came and they wanted to make
it a division. It's a captain right now. That person wanted a captain. They wanted a lieutenant and a couple firefighters to assist in that in that training. They could oversee that public relations, equipment and apparatus, grant writing. They could act as a
liaison. Um there's plenty of things they could do. They could be support for the fire chief. One of the other reasons why I firmly believe it as as the senior advisor stated that we we are trying to work within the parameters of of the
city and for grants. We're approaching the for a FEMA grant. We're really shooting for the moon with this grant. We're going to be asking for $1.3 million to really take the Lawrence Fire Department to make it one of the premier
fire departments, not only in the Northeast, but in the country. 1.3 million, we're asking to supply us with 10 10 positions for one year. In that one year, I've spoke to some councils about it. in that one year, we believe
that we could sustain those positions if they if they got brought on. And um the I believe the city's commitment is only 64,000 for the federal um administration to give us $1.3 million for 10 positions
for one year to get out and do some inspections. Some of the things, like I've stated before, we we don't even have the staffing to do a lot of the things that we're required to do by law. One of the new things on the books is periodic inspections. Periodic
inspections requires the fire department to get into every building and res assign at a risk level other than one and two families. That's 4,000 inspections. So, we could do some funding. we could maybe get some money from doing some of those inspections.
And it's all about it's all about the hierarchy in that grant application. We did already state that the city is funded an assistant chief position. Again, we we have five divisions. When you make a new position, which this is a
new position, there's a couple ways to go about it. You could create the position and then you could go look for the funding. Well, the timing where I'm coming into this position, we're doing it. There's no really right or wrong way. We're just doing a little bit of
opposite. We are getting the funding and then we still have to create the position. So, when we create the position, the council is going to be involved in this. You have to write an ordinance for the for the position. You have to write a job description. So,
you're still going to be a part of it. that $150,000. We could if if this never comes to fruition and and we do not get that position because later on down the line you you the council does not approve it.
We could still use that money in the 51 series personnel services. We could use it for other things such as overtime. Again, I had to come back in front of this council and ask for $700,000 of overtime. I am taking a deep dive into
everything we do in the fire department and I'm going to try to lower that overtime cost, but I'm not going to be able to o to lower that by $700,000. So, the worst case scenario, that money could be used in the 51 series, the
personnel services, and we could move it over to there. But again, I firmly stand behind this position. the last eight years I I came into fire prevention the administration side during the gas crisis. I have worked very closely with
the with the um prior chief and he may have stated that maybe he did want it, he did not want it. Um, when I take a look at the department and some of the things that I see us going in the future and the direction that I see the Lawrence Fire Department going, I think
this position is needed and it's it's something I firmly stand behind. Yeah. So, thank you. So, what I'm hearing, I hear two things, a lot of stuff, but I hear two big points. one is you want the position. Um, one of
the big things is someone to write grants and an example of the grant that you would look for is someone to do like some sort of inspections in some buildings and that's like a huge thing. And by the way, I'm I'm all in favor of that because safety of our residents is primary importance and right now we've
got so many people living in so many different places. I question their safety. Um had we said that you know in this budget we uh we are looking at the office of planning department and in that planning department they've got someone there
whose job it is to write and do these grants and we are we actually upgraded that individual um the director of project and management and development an upgraded position. So I know that I'm hearing the discussion regarding we need
someone to do the grant stuff. We have somebody well compensated and OPD whose job it is to provide that kind of assistance to the fire department, the police department across every agency of our city. So I I I guess I'm questioning
whether or not you do we really need it for that. And the other point is what can we do to fund besides the grant that that inspector that you're talking about? Maybe that one maybe that whatever it is that 150 can go toward that actual job in addition to getting
grand money. The um the the grant portion that I that I spoke about is just one aspect. I could probably name 50 other things that that person would be able to in different ways assist in our department. Um just to be clear, the
the 4,000 inspections that I'm said it's not just my idea to go into these buildings. We're mandated by law to go into these buildings. There's two books that really guide the fire department. Mass General Law Chapter 148 and um 527
CMR. Those are there's a lot of things that we must do. We must go into a a house to pass for smoke inspections to give a certificate and occupancy. We have to do quarterly inspections. And this also is new. So, it's really not
one of my ideas. Is it something by law that that we have to do? How do we fund that? How do we fund getting you to that spot? That's the question. We have 150. How does that help? Can we re Can we reallocate that one? Excuse me. C can we reallocate that 150? Could we allocate
it to to do what you just said that you got a mandate now by law that you've got to go in that you're required to do it. There's no like you can't say I don't have staff. You got to do it. You're required to. So, can we allocate you to provide some relief so your department can do that work? I've got 150 going to an assistant commissioner's position.
I'd like to see that 150 go boots on the ground so they can do what you're talking about. I think this this does allocate it to that because this person is in the command position and they are on a daily basis directing other people working with inspectional services to go
out and do these inspections. The the only way you're going to get it done counselor is is with is with personnel. Sorry. So just to just to just just to kind of like you know guide this discussion, you're saying that you need somebody that is going to be on top
of the fire administration, the fire suppression, the fire alarm, and the fire mechanical division, the fire electrical inspections. Council La Plani says we need more people that actually do the work. It's different things. Point of clarification. Yeah, Council
Fante. Thank you. Um C, thank you through you, Council President. Uh to answer my colleague from District F. um the frustration that that you're expressing right now. The um the it it was the same frustration we expressed at the budget and finance committee. The
same way that you're contradicting yourself, acting chief, is the same way that you did that night. And what the statements that the council just made are similar statements that I made to you that night as well. Thank you. So essentially we're looking at different things. We the coun the counselors is
looking not I mean the intent of the council is not to cut to the to that department. The intent of the council is to reallocate the funds where actually going to make an impact according to what you say and according to what we seeing here. So that's the thing
the the the city council have got this position in three years in a row now we don't see any difference. So, but the 150 150,000 could be allocated for something else and the council will not be in disagreement.
Point of clarification, councelor. Sorry. Um there is a difference with this um particular item. It's actually from and I brought out my budget book to make to to ensure I'm not misspeaking but from FY24 and FY25 this budget this particular item
um was uh budgeted for $120,000 and this year for FY26 it increased $30,000. So there is a difference. Yeah, that is a different bas on more money. Uh the administration of the chief the
I'm going to try to to repeat it but very shortly. The administration is not going to change the mind that these positions both what we just expressed as the uh assistant chief of police and the assistant chief of fire chief are
necessary. However, we do understand and the mayor does understand and we had this previous discussions based on what you have discussed during the budget hearing um I mean the budget session if you if
the city council based on on councelor Lelan's proposal is that we can keep those funding in the budget then chief are you immuneable to it because the mayor Okay, then we can we can work we can
work it out. Having said that, that doesn't mean that the administration doesn't see that there's a need for assistant chiefs. The chief here I can do the chief, you have the Good evening. May I say I don't mean to come off that
way if if that's the way I'm I'm coming off. I apologize. I guess I'm just trying to get my my point across, but I don't mean to come off as frustrated because I'm I'm not frustrated at all. No, you're not. I apologize if that's No, no, no. You're not nothing personal.
Trust me, you're good. Thank you. Um, uh, no. Any other counselors? That's all I've got. Yeah. So, I got a motion. It's been properly seconded. Uh, I am, this is how this works, man. I am
delighted to see that we are working together to get to a common place and it's not always easy, but what I'm hearing from the administration, motion to pass 10. The motion to pass 10 properly second. No discussion on that. All those in favor, please say I. I. any
names you guys have it what I'm what I'm hearing that there's an opportunity here for us to work together to get no cuts and just reallocate I think that's fantastic so what would it what would this be called that this this where this money would be going to do what you have been talking about this inspector
position we we could keep it in personal services and and possibly get more firefighters through the door con but again it's it's it's for the purpose that you described that I thought was so important. It's an inspector. It's not a fire. I don't think it's necessarily
firefighter, but maybe it is. I don't know. It's somebody that's going to be going into these apartments and checking it out. As you mentioned, we we could use it in fire prevention. So, I think I I stated before that NFPA standards 10% of your fire department should be in
fire prevention. That would be, you know, with our department would be 10 to 12 members. Right now, we have five to six. So if I could reallocate that, it would be to, you know, possibly to fire prevention jobs for people to do
inspections and assist us in that area. So it's not apples to apples because the cut is in fire administration. This what your desire is in fire suppression. So we would need to have later some No, we can't do a transfer
across the fire. So it doesn't have to be so doesn't have to be on the same place. council. Okay. So, we're good. All right. And I don't know what the council president's going to say, but we come come to an agreement that that's what's going to happen and that we're not Plus, you would have to come before the council anyway for the assistant
commissioner. That's that's the that's not even an ordinance. So, you can't even do it, right? It's not an ordinance. This is a commission. Council President, councelor, Vice President, thank you. Uh, quickly to answer my colleague, I I looked into this into the ordinance. the deputy police chief
position is ordinanced to come before the the council um for a confirmation. Um but the assistant fire chief is not ordinance for a city council confirmation um to make that clear. But the reason why I asked for the floor
is that I'm very frustrated with you acting um fire chief. Literally what you were just saying right now, what what councelor Lelant was just saying, I recall stating to you directly, why are we not using this if you're saying that
we need for fire prevention inspectors X Y and Z, why are we not allocating that this money for that? And I'm I'm not I'm I'm not done. And what I'm hearing is first you mentioned firefighters and I and I said this to you that same night.
You are in an acting position looking to get confirmed. So of course you're going to say and this is my opinion and last same night we we said we said um we're going to agree to disagree. The administration is saying that they
need these assistant chiefs chief's position. We have one person that already has been confirmed and within our public safety divisions that are saying, you know, where let's let's meet in in the middle. The administration is saying the same thing. Let's meet in the middle. This is
where where we can we can resolve this, but the administration is saying we still need this. And then when you're making a point about fire prevention and inspectors, council the plan just called out, well,
why why are you saying we need this for firefighters when when you just made it in an argument for fire prevention, which is the same concern we had that same that night that was that was pointed out to you as well. I um me I think it's I think it's terminology.
They are firefighters. So the members of fire prevention in in our division, they're firefighters. So I might might be using the terminology, but our inspectors, they are firefighters. So when I say firefighters, you know, the the the members in fire prevention, they
are firefighters, the inspectors. So maybe the terminology might have gotten mixed up and I apologize. I understand, but I I also don't appreciate when members of either the administration or department heads come in front of the council and make an assumption that
we're not intelligent enough to figure out what's going on. And that's and and that's how that's the sense that I'm getting. And again, we're going to agree to disagree, but aside from that, I do understand and I'm looking at I'm looking at you, senior adviser. I do
understand that you're working with the mayor live with us trying to figure a middle ground. So, I I do want to acknowledge that and I appreciate that. But what I don't appreciate is these underlining games by some individuals. Thank you. Uh well, before we even
continue, there is three things that need to be changed on the budget as of right now. We have the amendment I mean we have the amendment on the police department. We have the amendment on the firefight department. And we also have the amendment on the memo.
uh I will I personally would like to see those amendment in the book before this because we're going to continue on going going and then eventually what's going to happen is that we're not going to present a a a book budget that is
clear with what we want. I will feel a lot more comfortable if we keep on adding amendment and subsequentially voting on a budget book that is the accurate book if that's the if that's the case. So that we already have three.
So council plan yeah based on based on all of this discussion I would I'm about to withdraw but Mr. Spanner gave the figure like this. I'm not sure what's going on. Okay. So, I'm I'm gonna I'll leave it. I'm
gonna withdraw I'm gonna withdraw my amendment based on the council finish. I'm gonna withdraw my amendment based on the understanding that we just heard. Plus, we also understand that we're not going to vote for it anyway. So, so I think we're in a good place with council president with the with the understanding of a changing on the
budget book. Yes, the administration. Council President uh and I would like to address uh councelor Infante's uh comments uh in no shape, way or form uh because after the budget sessions, you present your concern each one of you uh
and and as you know I have asked you individually and I have invited uh some of you to come where clarity was needed. these things dynamics change and uh to say let's say we have we had
conversation with the police chief we had conversation uh the mayor had conversation with the fire chief as of today we still had conversation and right now I need to confirm with my with my boss that we're doing the right thing that we're not making any decision but
please these decisions is not as if the they're working all these staff is working under the executive branch. They are not going to make any decisions even though they may have conversations with you without the approval of the mayor. Any negotiations going back and forth
today, isn't it right? I had a conversation uh before the city council because the mayor I spoken to the mayor again and I asked the mayor, are you a little flexible based on conversation that I had with city councelor Lelant as as to give an expense? I have heard
certain concerns from councelor Marbo. I had concerns uh heard from councelor Santiago from uh all of you that are here one way or the other we had communication to bring that forth. But please if you can don't think that the
individuals that come before you as department heads are shifting. It's kind of difficult to negotiate with nine people than to negotiate just with one person that makes a decision. Um, all right. So
out of respect to the council, next time and every time from now on that we have an item in front of us, we need the administration here because when when the when anybody from the executive branch come in front of us, we
are thinking that we that those department may heads that have the authority from the mayor's office to make potential changes that we are requesting at this level. It is not fair to the department heads to come in front
of us and not be able to do nothing or at least have an answer on on on what we has been what has been request. We have requests those amendment changes at the at the uh at the subcommittee levels and
we're not talking just about the budget and finance committee level. it is other committee levels or other committee meetings that we have. So by you saying that that is I think it's either the wrong message or it is something that is
not we're not going to be able to work that way. No, I accept my resp I accept the responsibility on behalf of of the of the mayor's office. However, some of the the comments and changes have been
brought to us to our attention late as well. So, and this is moving part. You folks, nine folks vote differently. You just did it. You prove it to the public that you have different mentalities and sometimes you make decision on the spot.
We need to be prepared to be flexible to let's say councelor Infante. Yes, she could express her fr frustration and we do understand but this is a a dynamic because each one of you in the exception of three that is at large is going to make certain decision. I accept the
responsibility because we are in constant communication with the mayor's office even if he's in meetings or he's outside. We just had a conversation with the fire department for instance before we came to this meeting thinking that if this if your the position of the city
council is swayed one way we need to be if we're working in the spirit of cooperation we need to be ready to to at least succumb instead of instead of being in a in a uh controversial position uh towards the city council. We
want this to be done. We want it to be approved and we need to consider from the mayor needs to consider your your your comments. Yeah. To to to your to respond to you what you were say you you said most of that discussion that we have for the last two and a half hours
was part of the discussion at the subcommittee level if not all. Those two positions were discussed broadly at that level and we propose sand then I think they will be
uh it will hope when it comes to any type of allocation anything related to funds that we we listen to the subcommittee discussions and brought bring up what's what's
potentially as an initial line of thought what the committee have request that's why we have subcommittee what we're doing now is doing the work of the subcommittee and that's not right
because the dynamics changes now for the sake of time I do understand and I do as I said assume the responsibility for it but dynamic changes every president even before the vote right council listen uh thank you senior your advisor, but I
I mean it I'm going to disagree with your comment and 110%. We spent many hours. We went home late and there was no one here from the mayor's office if I recall correctly.
And you have a beautiful budget over a million dollars and none of this meeting were attended by you. He one time. Yeah. Not all of them. You were time you were here all of them where possibly be here. Not all of them
here. Not all of them. Let me finish my point. Council, thank you council president. So and and that's why you have a position uh with the chiefest for chief of staff and you have many others uh people that you can send because what
we're doing now here is discussing the same thing that we discussed uh council president. And then I have so many questions here that I'm trying to give my colleagues an opportunity to ask questions but we also have things here that we took notes and cuts and things
that we want to suggest but we are uh wasting our time again over the same questions we had. So I believe uh and then and forgot I need to mention a position that was not presented to us by
no one uh the emergency um manager it was not presented to us. I have to say that the senior advisor sent an email but that position was not even presented to us. So I understand and I
appreciate that the administration is trying trying to work with us the council but also you need to understand our point of view or my point of view. Well taken. Thank you senior advice. Thank you. Uh councilors, any other uh
any other cuts proposed? Yeah, I do. Amendment. Well, before we get to that point, councelor Levy, uh you have the floor. Yeah. One one last thing. Okay. But I have a question. No on this regard. No, we we finished with that. There's no motion with no discussion on that. Um on the previous discussion when
it comes to that uh it was the motion was so we're going to entertain any any other topic that is not necessarily related to the firefighter department. So now I open the floor to councelor 11. Thank you president. I would like to
call Mr. Raph Guerrero from the school department the superintendent of the superintendent Mr. Carrera and and uh councelor Levy have questions related to uh the future of I think we
should of the schools. Thank you. Thank you. So, no, no, no. ML plan withdraw the motion. So, there is no motion. I know, but I mean I going to I going to recognize her because there's some things going on.
Okay. So, let's let's uh let's let's allow her to speak. We're not going to the do that school department budget. She have a question. Not yet. That's too long. Uh Mr. Cabrero. Uh uh councelor Levby
have a quick question and it's not related to the budget necessarily the entire budget of the school department. It's something else. So we discussing this no wait Mr. Guerrero um superintendent we are not going to
discuss right now the budget of the school committee. So our question is regarding that when I was looking at the budget, I didn't see any money allocated for um
the people who's going to be uh hired on the next election for the school committee. So how are we going to address this? Um, so I can understand clearly what
you're asking me. In the current school department budget that was submitted, there is not uh dollars allocated for the next school committee. Correct. Yes, correct. That's the question. Okay. So,
first of all, never in the history of Lawrence public schools budget has there been allocated money to pay schoolboard members. That haven't happened yet. Correct. So, that's why number one, it wouldn't be in the budget because we we don't know
that. Now I know that um in past charters and I still think it still holds true um there was a decision to add to the charter school committee stipens. Is that correct? Correct. Uh well that is under common city shadow uh
under the section five of the city shadow which talk about the school committee uh it also uh talk about the compensation of the school committee on the last section I think it's 11 uh just talking from the top of my head so essentially on there there is a section
that states the compensation of the school committee will be determined by a city ordinance and u essentially what the city uh what the City Council at large is looking for is to see if it is any type of allocation or a plan to
allocate funds for the school committee once we adopt uh the new ordinance which also reflect the changes that we made uh under the home rule petition that just passed less than a year ago.
So, is the plan going forward with the new city council structure in January to have a stipen assigned to every school board member? Uh, yes. That means the elected ones and the appointed and the
appointed one. Yes. Okay. That is true. Correct. Okay. So, I understand. Um, I had my CFO check our school committee budget and there is no section through the department of education for
salaries, stipens for schoolboard members. However, under the school committee segment, it does have for support staff, their secretary that keeps notes and several other positions
uh that are part-time and their supplies for printing agendas, budgets, etc., etc. But according to what we have read, it doesn't state that. Now, what I will say is that we will get a ruling from the Department of Education tomorrow.
Okay? And ask if it's an allowable expenditure under the education budget. I would assume, however, we have city- elected officials that receive stipens. Who pays you
stipens? The city. We will have school committee members elected by the city that we're talking about providing them stipens. Who do they work for? For the school department. For the school department.
I had a feeling that was coming. They work for the people. They work for the people. What? Of the residents of the city of the school department. The same way you folks work for the people. Um um yeah, we could say that. But that's
why I think it's important that we get those answers because there it's a it's a different and and council, I know that you're smiling, but you understand where I'm coming from. Correct. So, and yes, you absolutely you've been here the longest. So, um we will get that ruling.
If the Department of Education says yes, it's an allowable expenditure, so be it. We will make those adjustments. My I'm not even looking at my CFO because he probably will my phone will be buzzing. He's t sending me texts. We don't have that money. We don't have that money. I
understand that. However, so essentially what councelor Levy is looking for a potential plan as of how we're going to find those funds if those funds are allocated one side or another side or clarity on that because we don't have it but potentially the intent is to have
it. So how we going to work it out? So that's what she's looking for. For the record, I want you I want you all to know I support stipens for schoolboard members the same way as you folks are here and you're working till 12 1:00 in
the morning. Absolutely. Okay. Um we want people to do services for the community, but I think compensation is is important that we recognize that. So I truly support that. However, I have to make sure that we it's an allowable expenditure. Yeah. Thank you. Is all
that I'm saying. Yeah. Um and if that's the case, we will do whatever we have to do and work through that. Yeah. Essentially, that's that's if if if there is a plan in place, uh we don't have any right now, but I mean that the the the questioning is around how we can
get that plan and that rolling when it comes to potential compensation for the school committee. uh so we can uh we can proceed with the plan that we have for the for the city of Loun. I have my that should start at the beginning of the year with the new elected officer. Um
yes, I understand that. So I I have my monthly meeting scheduled tomorrow morning with the commissioner and his team. That'll be on my agenda for the question that we want clarification on. Great. Um, I I anticipate that it would be halfway through the school year, however, because we're talking about
January 2nd, wherever they take office. Correct. That's correct. Uh, thank you. If Are you clear? Yes. Thank you so much. Yes. I want to make sure that you know that by the beginning of the next year so we are all on the same page
because this is part of the practically the agreement or the home room petition that we already sended that at the end mentioned that we are going to allocate money uh to pay an just a small minor detail question of
course how much is the stipen we don't know yet we don't it will be you just want me to bring a blank checkbook no no we're trying to do and to accomplish is to open the conversation around that to identify potential funding sources. Uh and that's
what we're looking for. Yeah, the stipen will be the city council haven't make a determination as of what but it will be something that is a reasonable amount for a regular stipening that we have within the city of Lance. Does that mean
I don't know? So I won't tell you an answer. And if that decision make that it's an allowable expenditure that will be put in place regularly every year. Yeah. Exactly. Okay. Thank you uh superintendent. Thank you
so I I know that you potentially going to have to leave soon. Uh so that's another question that we might have uh that it will be supplemental to the budget. Yeah, absolutely.
Okay. All right. Um thank you. Council LLC. Yeah, councelor. Thank you, Superintendent. I do have a third cut. I just as a piece of advice, it's we're getting close to 11 o'clock. It's 10 almost 10:30 right now. I can see
colleagues having things they want to say and maybe we can time manage this a little bit because the later we go tired more tired we get and we're not as crisp and we're not going to be making as best of decisions. So maybe if we can cap tonight's meeting at a certain point I
hate to come back again but you took your time now you want to cut but 11 o'clock might sound good. All right my so just something to consider. Thank you. How was that? We're good. I'm good with you. Okay. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you.
Uh my my la last my last one here is um on this. I do have one, but I I I can wait till later on the other ones. Um this is u the emergency management that my colleague was bringing it up. Uh page number 90 99 99. Yeah, this is uh so let
me do it. It's uh department 29. It says division zero emergency management. There's no change on that. There's a $15,000ocated
for Y 99. I'm looking to make a motion to uh to eliminate or reduce that budget in total. There's a motion to eliminate uh uh department 029 which is the emergency
management. Can I hear a second? Second properly second. Discussion discussion council plan the purpose. So uh and then and then I'm I'm eager to hear what my colleagues have to say about it. So um
uh brief very brief history. This has always been under this is emergency management. The name itself describes how important it is. This has always been under, as far as I can remember, under the um the management of the fire department for the most part. Uh so if
there was a something that dealt with a fire, um we knew that the chief um the fire chief, whoever it is or was would be on top of that particular situation and provide whatever coordination was required to manage that particular
thing. Uh I also understand that hypothetically if it was something more in the police realm that you would see maybe the police chief get involved in something um kind of manage this. Uh so I I my point here is that uh it appears
as though we've have this under control. Clearly there are ways that we can improve on anything including this. Um but as we are again raising taxes by over two and a half well two and a half percent plus the new growth uh I'm just
trying to find ways that we're not putting more resources to something that's not broken and in this particular case I don't think it's broken and so I'm looking to cut that. Um I've had some conversations
with the director Mr. Spanner. um he's going to push back and I expect that he will and I encourage him to. Um I know what he's going to say because we went through this earlier today. So I know what he's going to say now. I know what he's going to say and
I'm prepared for the for the followup. So um why don't we do let's do the dance. Sure. Yeah. Uh so through you uh council president the for the record did the mayor left? Uh yes. Yes. He has another meeting and some of our directors unfortunately they need to be
in tomorrow morning early. Fine. No problem. I mean uh that's fine. Not an issue. So um the yes the emergency I think the uh the reason why we are in disagreement uh with with councelor Lelant and and
probably just to clarify to the city council. We seem to be reactive in certain instances and you know and I would ask the council sometimes to look at at our position and not only the money. The money is
important because and and when we mention in the budget statement uh that we have financial ga gap we're not in a deficit. So it has to do with risk management. Yes,
we did have uh the the fire chief at that time that was uh supervising having oversight over the over the uh emergency management director. What what was the result? The results were that we don't
have a plan. We don't have an emergency plan. If anything happens, god forbid, uh that there's a uh a huge fire in the city, if we have another explosion, if we have an airplane that crashes in the
city, it already happened in Methun. There's a small airplane that ditched and fell. We had one fatality, but imagine if that would have the case in a densely populated uh city like Lawrence.
Um there are consequences. There were opportunities for us to prepare. Uh that has not been done. We have uh the mayor has appointed as in the memo I believe I sent to councelor uh Lon and I
appreciate your feedback. Uh and councelor Luson indicated well this was not presented and you're correct. It was not presented because it's under uh the oversight of the mayor and we were trying since there was not a permanent
chief of police. Um we we we were uh deciding whether uh the mayor was deciding whether to keep that position under the under the police department. However, uh we were
confronted with with other union issues. um what do you call it? Retirement issues and that was not feasible. We still have the same person in the position because you need you need uh uh in just in case of an emergency you need someone to deal with it. But this is not
only fire and police. This has to do with many other issues that has to do with a winter storm, flooding. Um and we have unfortunately many other moving pieces in the city that other communities do not have. Our homeless
population has grown fromund and something when the administration came on board to now close to 400 homeless people that are living in the city. So just a quick question as per the council plan just
just mentioned uh and also it was brought up to to the uh to the committee meeting about opposition. Um do you have a plan that you can present to the council as of why we should keep
it? Yes sure can you present that plan on writing? Yes, I can. Yeah. Well, everything is planned. Well, as a matter of fact, I have it already me written. I just need to submit it to the
mayor's signature approval. I think that should be worked out then. So, what do you So, I'm sorry the hour is late. What you got? You're going to get something in writing that says what? It says I mean potentially was that truly definition of what they planning on
doing with the of the emergency management and why is not it cannot be done by either one of the chief. So where I was going to go with this and this is no surprise here where I was going to go with this because the the argument was made earlier
that um that we need we are insufficient we're illprepared maybe maybe too strong when it comes to planning for emergencies. You rattled off a few things plane crashes fires etc. So
rather than fund for $105,000 of position, this sounds, and you hate to say this, but this sounds like the perfect time to get a report done, get a, you know, somebody who's an expert on looking at our current structure in our city, our
police, our fire, and rather than spend 105,000 on this person that's going to continue to do stuff, find out what that plan is. I'm not sure what the right I'm not an expert on this. It's $20,000 for report 25. I have no idea what the right dollar amount is, but it's probably way
less than $105,000. And that will, I think, provide a resolution to the concern that what are we doing as a city when something happens? Well, if it goes as I think it could go, we'll have a road map. And then we have a road map with our fire,
our police, and whoever else homeless, whoever else is part of this group. And then I think if we can get to the place that the mayor's looking for, which is what are we doing when an emergency happens and how do we respond? Well, we've got it. It's on a piece of paper and we paid money for it and we didn't have to pay $15,000 to have somebody do
that because we've got this report. That's where that's where I think we're So essentially what I'm if I hear you correctly uh councelor plan uh what you're looking for is this department to have instead of just an emergency management uh position which is salaries
only to have a professional services on there with an allocation instead of that uh the amount of dollars that we have there. Correct. I would I I would say that and to make it perfectly clear, I'm looking for someone to provide a product, a piece of paper, a report that
looks at our city, our management capacity, management services capacity and provide for us the blueprint uh that I think that the director was speaking about which is how do we deal with an emergency air whatever whatever the emergency is and that way it provides a
tool. I see our part our good fire chief is still here. The fire chief could have that where everybody's singing off the same page. So, if a plane crashes, what do we do? Turn to the manual, page 73. Plane crashes. Well, this is what you do when a plane crash happens. X, Y, and Z. Or there's a major fire. You know what I'm saying? That's what I'm talking.
Yeah. Yeah, I understand. So, essentially, how we can get how we can get this this this money allocated on the budget because if it's not in the budget, we won't be able to do it. So, Kafa, do you have any ideas how how to proceed with that potential professional
services? uh uh funds which we don't have under the on the on the uh under this department emergency management before I answer that um I just want to clarify there's no adjustment there's no amendment as of
now correct the the vote no we we have a vote okay so everything is as the amendment the amendment is to cut we on the discussion of that cut right no I'm just saying you mentioned before there were a couple amendments on the floor we We haven't
make any amendment yet for the other positions for No, we haven't made any amendment but there is some compromises that need to change the budget book unless those amendment are potentially go through. Okay, understood. Yeah. Um this particular one is it's under
personal services. Um what the council suggested is more like a professional services or purchase of services. It's a totally different category. Yes. So there's not much to to do here. Well, if it can you change the budget book to reflect that item under because we have
to this will require an amendment. That will require an amendment of who? Because we haven't vote anything. I mean if you this is a proposed budget. If you change what is being proposed we will and then accept it or not accept it. So we, as far as I understand, we have a
couple of things that need to be done on the budget book, including the amendment on the police department, the amendment on the fire, firefighter department, the amendment on the on the uh memo. Okay. So and then this I mean amendment mean
changes to the book. Okay. So for understood earlier, there was no need for amendment regarding the police because it was staying within the personal services. So there's no need to change anything there. The same with the fire department. It's staying within personal services. There's no need to amend anything there.
This particular one will require an amendment. Is that what you are suggesting? That that's what we're talking about. But wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. Hold on. Let's let's let's keep on going that way and that way we clear and then we can have a question. Sure.
Well, we I'm ready to go. So, essentially when it but going back to the previous the previous amendment of the previous changes to the book, those 175,000 and those 150,000 from the to those two department, they were airmarkked specifically for a position.
The council is looking to airmark those for training and something else on the fire department which I think is personnel. So that need to be some type of okay information being writed down and brought up to the original request for
the police chief was the original request per the committee meeting was additional patrol officers officers on the street and overtime and we need to have that on writing. Right. So that was the that was the original request. So that's why when I
spoke with you and some of the council members, I said it's okay. It's within personal services. No need to change anything. Everything's going to stay there. And then that's when I had the conversation with you saying when that position is going to be uh filled, it needs to be approved by the council. Yeah. And I brought that up to the for
the uh for transparency that we have that conversation. Yes. But this council would like to have something on writing that is on top of the police officer the police. We want some type of writing on the on the book. That's okay. So, can we clarify exactly what you're looking for? Is it personal services or is it
training? This there's two different things. I didn't I didn't know we were clear when we were having that discussion. I think you required a memo from the from the executive office that confirm that the changes proposed
by the city council which was discussed that the mayor was comfortable with it. Yeah. Does that memo need to be part of the budget book? Okay. So from personal services to purchase of services for the police department. Is that the the
police department? He was going to use it on u training on training and overtime. Okay. And and then for the firefighter was going to be for So for Yes. Yes, for that uh firefire it was going to be for fire uh for fire
prevention which is more firefighters. So within personal services that stays the same in terms of the appropriation you're voting on. And that's correct. Okay. So the only one that as of now you need is the police department from personal services to purchase of
services which is training. For training which is training. Yes, that's correct. So does it require a vote from the city? Uh no because we haven't vote on the final vote on the final budget that will that will you will change. So that will be an amendment from the administration. Correct. That will be an amendment to the administration that is going to be
reflected on the budget book and then once we adopt the budget book it will those changes will be here. Yes. Yeah. And also the memo need to be changed and and added to here as we discussed before which is over just
remove the override and now we are looking forward also and and and change on the book which I mean I'm talking from the top of my head you have a good memory that's good emergency management which is basically adding a
professional services so within emergency management It's going to be instead of personal services, it's going to go to professional services of services. Purchase of services or other purchase and services. Correct. For the trick that you gave us. Council
councel Fonte. I think that we get into a point that just to keep keep the a clear mind and not lose uh track of the main focus which is basically doing the the the work that we're supposed to do. I think that we should be looking into
potentially uh tableabling this matter and coming back on Wednesday because otherwise everybody's going to be motion to table. Oh, hold on before councelor councelor Marmo finish if if it's possible. Let's finish this up which I'm
recognizing if if you allow me to u no because I mean a motion to table. Do I have the floor? Yes. No, no, no, wait. and a motion to table it actually no discussion but if you withdraw or it haven't been second yet I'll recognize
councel fun to finish up the discussion thank you councel learn through you council president may I um bring back the senior adviser senior advisor senior adviser first I want to thank you because everything falls on you because you're always the one in front of us
um secondly I'm I'm conf I'm conflicted on this position itself on this. It's being presented to us as a department 0029 as of right now without the changes. Um I'm conflicted with this particular
item because one we have the administration you're representing the administration in front of us stating that this isn't this is important that we need this. Um there's we need to streamline our emergency
management more efficiently and I hear that. However, no one from the administration came in front of the budget and finance committee to defend this budget this well this department. However, on the flip side, and I'm sure
many of us recall, two years ago, District E experienced a windstorm emergency. I was there almost every day. for many hours. And I want to publicly thank the mayor for this because
there was no sense of direction when the mayor was not around. Everyone wanted to take the lead and people started working within little subgroups. And even though the mayor had representation from his office there, it
wasn't until the actual mayor got came to Jefferson Street when he was there and gave the orders, people listened and did what they what they had to do. Um, but even work was still getting done and I appreciate all the city employees that were there that all those days getting
done what they needed to. Um, and I'm I'm already one of the bad counselors to this administration because I I question Okay. You have your own mind. I have my own mind and that's why you wear
So, no. Oh. Oh, no. I'm not a shame at all. I'm I'm proud of the work that I do and I'm proud of the statement and even when I'm wrong and I recognize when I'm wrong, I'm I'm here I'm elected by by my district to do this job. Um, So, in that sense, I see the need of
having someone um assigned to this to do the work when the mayor is not around. So, I'm very conflicted. Um for years, what I recall, we've been
asking for an emergency management plan. I would like to see if there is a plan to help justify this because even though I experienced as a district city council two two years ago still that doesn't overweigh the fact
that no one from the administration came before us to advocate for this um and I'm hoping it sounds like we're going to continue this discussion on Wednesday I'm hoping that we can have something um to help me decide on this
particular and I'm only one counselor I don't know how everyone else feels about it but help me at least to see where where I can move forward with this particular councelor I feel through you council president uh I'm so sorry that
you feel as if that you're totally not posit positively seen by the administration at least I don't want you to have that mixed message or any one of you we do have our opinion sometimes we and and it gets and it gets back to me I'm not going to lie and it gets back to me
which is but but I'm doing my job so I'm okay with it and we do respect the fact counselors because they do represent their constituents and we do our best to address these issues. But um what we do have is information what has been done
and what not has been done. We know and for instance uh the question that councelor Leland uh asked and probably some of you may think about it as well or think in the same lines. Um you have a police chief, you have a fire chief
and they you want to give them so much responsibilities which in my view is a little unfair that when in case they do and everybody works together. But did you know that we're not even on the emergency on the
website that we don't have a person a contact person? last time for clarity when there was this flooding there was this storm that came other than what you asked because I've been with you I've been with with councelor Lel plant first fires that the when the administration
came on board and thank God we played it by ear and it worked and that should have been a job of the of a of a an emergency person that that that does the job. Why the pay? because that person
that serves in the capacity should understand whether the chief, the fire chief or the the police chief. There shouldn't be a there should be a professional relationship and you cannot have a person in a position where uh
they do do not know what they need to do. Not all uh firefighters, not all fire chiefs or or uh police chiefs uh or police officers are trained in FEMA in
in uh emergency management. There's two agencies that are that we work with with FEMA and MIMA in the state and other communities are the ones that during that storm, that particular storm that I'm talking about, helped us fill out the forms. There's a bunch of forms that
you need to fill out for reimbursement. Uh there's uh a visit that you need to do with the businesses and so forth. But I will provide you in right in writing um uh why it's so much needed and I I think that any professional in the industry
uh would be in agreement with the administration that this is a very important position. Thank you so much counselors. Uh I'll send a motion. Wait if I can. Councelor Levy and then councelor. Oh, and thank you for
everything that you say, but I just remember that in the the beginning of the 1990ing, so we start writing an emergency management planning here and not just only the fire department, the police department, but also is included the hospital, ambulance, and all of
these thing, you know, that is part of the plan. And we had a company um that start and I think that is a book in the library. I don't remember remember but I should read in there a copy of the book that he was writing for
the first time uh for the emergency management plan. Chie Schaefer was the person in charo uh a school was part or haer. Oh the chief chaer. Okay. Uh uh Ruda was
the name of the company that came to start writing the emergency management plan for the city of Lawrence. That was at the beginning of the 1990. I would love to have that information, city clerk, if you have a copy of it or
whatever, but I don't to you, Mr. President. Uh so, uh I love to have something like that in our budget and I want to see what is the plan and also what is the way to support our family
when they be affected. See something allocating for support our family through these plans. Uh because our our colleagues mention from D3 we passed by we be there the whole day. I want to
take it this moment to thank you DPW or Marta VZ because she be there. H every time I pass by there, she be there. We a beautiful smile for our constituent. Sorry, never mind. You have the floor.
Okay, because I had the floor. Thank you. So I want to say thank you also to uh recreation department because they there we also be there too and and support our content but sometime we have our
community uh under different situation I lost to CC they has something to allocate for every individual be affected through you chair this is my personal opinion when you creating this type of position
administration please did not show anybody who you plan to hire it in this past two years it's not the position it's you go who you going to hire it and that's how most of this decision not being made not I don't want the needs of the city it's who you hiring so present
the plan present the position and then start in the hiring process that's how it should be because the you show you show somebody and then somehow your plan even if there's the greatest know is the biggest needs of the city is who's going to be in that position and that's how
some decisions are made here. And with that says motion to table. There is a motion to table. It's a motion. She made a motion. Uh I mean there it's a second by councelor Marmo. Uh no discussion on the table matters. All those in favor
please say I. I. Uh the eyes have it. By the way, by the way, we have a voyage session that has been scheduled for Wednesday at 7:00 p.m. Please start on time. Yeah, we do it at uh so see you Wednesday at 7. Well, we can start on
first.