[Music] I know well [Music] turn e White [Music] want e for down there this is the city commission meeting uh Monday May the 13 2024 I call the meeting to order would you please rise for the invocation and the pledge Heavenly Father we hope that you watch over this group tonight and that you help us make good decisions for the city of leeburg we ask that in your name amen amen I pled ALG to flag of the United States of America and to the for it stands nation godible liy and justice for all glad glad to see we have a big crowd tonight everyone uh I'm sure is here for the proclamation tonight for the lesburg high school boys weightlifting State team championship [Applause] you got him okay here we go whereas the city of lesburg wishes to congratulate the lesburg high school boys wait liting team on their exceptional performances throughout the 23 24 season and whereas through hard work and perseverance the 2023 2024 team won the district in both traditional and Olympic won the class 2A Region 2 in Olympic and placed second in traditional and at the state level finished fifth in the FHSAA class 2A traditional category and and won the FHSAA class 2A Olympic weightlifting Championship earning backto back state titles and whereas at the 2023 2024 FHSAA class 2A weightlifting Championship the following lifters medled in their respective weight classes Jason win uh play six in traditional Danny uh egler Engler excuse me uh placed sixth in Olympic uh Jamar Williams placed fourth in Olympic Savon Latimore placed third in Olympic Logan Thompson was State runner up in Olympic Ryan Thompson was State runner up in Olympic Zach field placed third in traditional and was state runnerup in Olympic Kaden Adams was state champion in Olympic and Jeremy Lacy was state runnerup in Olympic and state champion in traditional and whereas while weightlifting is in many respects an individual sport the team environment is an intrical part of each lifter success and the members of the 2023 2024 LHS boys weightlifting team are as follows Kaden Adams Mall agular Gage Anderson barath BAGI uh darari Connor Peter Cunningham Tyler Davis Terrell Davis coob Eland Danny egler Zack field lubert filar Xavier Ford Tron Hanbury Jake Hernandez Jeremy Lacy Savon Latimore Jacob Miller Mason Moore Jeremiah Neely Jason W Theo Prader Gavin Proctor ramish romj Ian reyhart Reinhard excuse me uh Alexander Santa Maria Jose Sanchez Logan Thompson Ryan Thompson Victor villis Mill uh Jamar Williams and Anthony wine now therefore I James a bur Jr mayor of the city of leeburg do hereby proclaim the outstanding sportsmanship and athletic achievements of the 2023 2024 leeburg High School boys weight in team uh applaud their backtack state championships and urge all citizens of leeburg to celebrate the extraordinary season and wish them continued success go [Applause] jackets on behalf of Pastor Mike would like to give the commission uh we are leberg Shir [Applause] get a picture sir come back [Music] you [Applause] [Applause] [Music] gotcha gotcha hey tonight we have uh no presentations uh we'll move on to public comments this section is is reserved for members of the public to bring up matters of concern or opportunities for praise issues brought up will not be discussed in detail at this meeting issues will either be referred to the proper staff or will be scheduled for consideration at a future city commission meeting comments are limited to three minutes and if you was please give your name and your address uh one other note uh later on in the agenda uh we will take uh public comment on the position of the city manager uh this is not the time to do it but we will allow for public comment at that time so are there any uh public comment on items not on the agenda thank you beloved leeburg mayor bu all wonderful Commissioners staff members and citizens I am lay brother Steven Gerard sadovski voting address is 119 West 8th Street Lorraine Ohio I am here and I would now like to update you on the new Florida personed City resolution and cities specifically in Sumpter and Lake counties that's where I focus to let all of you know since I spoke last in lesburg I've spoken at numerous cities and towns uh and even Bushnell's now hearing about it too Eustace is hearing about it minola is hearing about it the personid resolution and Preamble Covenant personid language that citizens should vote on to insert into the respective City Charters the cut off date for the citizen November vote happens to be for Lake County of August 23rd 24 I will remember that because that's my sister's birthday happy birthday sis early I would suspect uh I also was invited by the conservative Villages Salt and Light Group to provide a personate education brief this specific group clamped and continues to be focused on opposing Florida Amendment 4 which I label as the culture of death issue that all of you will be voting this November my strong recommendation is to please vote no on for a yes vote of 60% when will authorize unfortunately the deaths of 65,000 innocent babies peacefully developing in their mother's wombs annually in Florida we just passed Mother's Day my mother her name is Arlene Marie she was a traditional stay- at old mom who taught us four kids typical house chores responsibilities she valued birthdays and always provide me my favorite birthday cake carrot cake when we expected company my mother always chose me to clean the bathroom because we wanted to show the cleanliness and the best Hospitality for family members and guests if my mother heard any vulgar language coming out of my mouth she quickly guided me to the bathroom sink to wash my mouth out with Ivory soap you can thank my mom for teaching me how to speak properly to your wonderful City Council in leeburg I'm going to be providing uh personhood education throughout the particular area I'll do a followup on that I just want to end with a history lesson Patrick Henry years ago said in a wonderful speech Give me liberty or give me death well I parallel that give the baby person the human acknowledgement of fetal personhood and right to birth Liberty and never death in the mother's womb see your wonderful city manager who calls all of you the Gang of Five and I'll be happy to work with him on the future agenda item God bless you all Jesus loves us all thank you any other public comment all right we'll move on to item five the consent agenda uh routine items are placed on the consent agenda to expedite the meeting if the commissioner staff wish to discuss any item the procedure is as follows pull the item or items from the consent agenda then vote on the remaining items with one roll call vote and then discuss each pulled item and vote by roll call are there any items anyone would like to pull nothing tonight make a motion to approve all items second roll call commission conel yes commission reesman yes commissioner Peterson yes commissioner Barry yes mayor bu yes that will move us to uh public hearings non- routine items which is item six uh we'll start with uh item 6A would someone please introduce 6 A1 I'll inod ask be read by title only an ordinance amending the future land use map of the comprehensive plan of the city of leasburg changing the future land use map designation of certain property containing 4.72 plusus Acres from low density residential and Industrial to low density residential for property generally located east of Flatwoods Road and West of South Street lying in section 28 Township 19 South Range 24 East Lake County Florida and providing an effective date for approval second Dan would you please give us a Mr Mayor I'm you want yes sir I'll go ahead and get everybody sworn in before Mr Miller gets going if you don't mind uh Mr Miller every uh staff member and members of the audience if you plan to provide any testimony on any of the public hearing and non- routine items in either 6A or 6B on the agenda if you would please stand raise your right hand now so you could be sworn in to testify all right do you do you swear or affirm that all testimony you'll give tonight will be the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth I do all right thank you very much thank you grant yes sir thank you Mr Mayor thank Mr Mayor Dan Miller Planning and Zoning this is basically a housekeeping item it's a request for a small scale comprehensive plan map Amendment from low density residential and Industrial to two fully low density residential location of course is east of Flatwoods Road West of South Street um it's part of the South Winds Cove development the total area is 4.72 Acres um currently the South Wind Cove development contains mostly U almost entirely uh twostory tow houses in this case in the area here where it's showing Harbor Winds they want to put in one floor Apartments so it's not a density increase or anything like that um the zoning is already R3 high density residential so we're just looking at cleaning up the land use and providing a um use that we don't really have enough of in the city thank you sir any questions for Dan the petitioner want to say anything Dan or uh I believe they're all good with what we have talked about in the past do we have any public comment on this any questions from the Commissioners Vol call commissioner rean yes commission Peterson yes commissioner Barry yes commissioner conel yes mayor bur yes someone please introduce item 6 A2 introduce nby read by title only an ordinance of the city of leeburg Florida vacating a 7 10,367 square foot portion of Park Avenue generally located between West Meadow Street and the city's Fountain Lake bike trail as shown on the official map of the city of leeburg Florida recorded in plat book two page 19 of the public records of Lake County Florida and providing an effective date for approval discussion Dan thank you Mr Mayor this is on the north side of West Meadow Street and ends at the Fountain Lake bike path uh it's across from the beacon College Athletic Field what it is is a small vacate of a previously platted roadway which has been there for many years and was never constructed it's only 7,367 Square ft so it's a rectangular shape um the purpose of the vacate is to allow Beacon College to build an athletic and and Health Center there and uh new fitness center and health Activity Center actually and we have been working with Beacon and looking at their design designs and it looks real good and this is basically a Road to Nowhere uh road that Road to Nowhere that's on paper and was never built yes sir correct any questions for Dan any public comment on this good enough roll call commissioner Peterson yes commissioner Barry yes commissioner conel yes commission reesman yes mayor bur yes yeah okay yeah okay so uh would someone please introduce item 6 A3 I'll introduce and N be read by title only excuse me an ordinance amending the future land use map of the comprehensive plan of the city of lebur changing the future land use map designation of certain property containing 10.08 plus minus Acres from institutional to General commercial for a property generally located north of US Highway 441 and west of College Drive lying in section 15 Township 19 South Range 25 East Lake County Florida and providing an effective date for approval second so Al if you would give us just a quick summary and yeah from there this item and the next item are are one and the same one is a rezoning which is this item and then the next is a PUD uh to consider the airport uh through the city commission is trying to sell a 10 acre Park to um some developers uh this it affects the northwest corner of 441 and College Avenue um part of our contingencies in in the contract the sale contract which I believe for was for about 2.7 million for the 10 acres uh concerns them getting the rezonings they need in the 11th hour I was uh contacted by the college um and there was a concern about the development piece um with which essentially goes something like this years ago the city promised to never develop this parcel and then we worked out a quid pro quo um where the college gave us this property and we gave the college some others so grants going back through the record on that so long story short um I have been in touch now with the college I have been in touch with the developer and I've been in touch with the county uh to try to kind of get this last minute concern squared away um we needed to a little bit homework so I'm asking that you guys table this to a date certain uh which would be June 10 5:30 here in the commission Chambers um where we'll we advertise if we need to follow Grant's lead on that but uh that would that that report would be for this item and the next so the next item if you do table this we'll need to read that aloud and then go ahead and table that to date certain as well so can we get a motion to table that item motion to table till date second but is this any discussion yeah add in the date if you would do we have a date certain you want to go July 10 July 10 no June June here at 5:30 in the commission chers and um I wanted to ask Dan a question about this but the FAA elevation points for all the buildings haven't been approved so this is probably a good idea that this is getting postponed anyways that is correct um anytime you're near the airport there is a site the FAA website you have to go on and you have to describe the tallest point on the property such as the the top of the structure or if you have an antenna anything like that and you place that in there with a legal description and then the FAA comes back and says what you're allowed within that flight area flight zone flight path they have different uh names for the different paths and everything so anything that's built in within that area uh does have to go to that website work with the city's Airport Manager in insert their information into to the FAA website and see what the height is I think it's uh and I forget the numbers but there's one feet for every when you start off a zero to 200 then it's one foot for every so many feet and it goes keeps ascending so um basically whatever we say in the Pud the FAA can overrule if it's too tall if the if the FAA has any concern at all so any other questions so we have a motion on the floor to table this until date certain June 10th 5:30 yes second roll call commissioner Barry yes commissioner conel yes commissioner Eastman yes commissioner Peterson yes mayor bur yes someone please introduce 684 I'll introduce and ask be read by title only an ordinance of the city of eburg Florida changing the zoning on approximately 10.08 plusus Acres from P public to p UD planed unit development to allow for commercial uses including restaurant retail and indoor storage for a property generally located north of US Highway 441 and west of College Drive lying in section 15 Township 19 South Range 25 East Lake County Florida and providing an effective date move for approval second like to make a motion to table this till June 10th here at the city hall at 5:30 p.m. second any discussion roll call commission canell yes commissioner rean yes commissioner Peterson yes commissioner Barry yes mayor bur yes will someone please introduce item 6 A5 I'll introduce 685 to be read by title only an ordinance of the city of leeburg Florida amending and restating ordinance number 2018-2 as amended by ordinance number 2018-35 and is further amended by ordinance number 20-14 providing a short title providing findings and intent granting certain nonexclusive franchises to Gibson Place utility company LLC Gibson Place water conservation Authority LLC Blue Goose utility company LLC Blue Goose water conservation Authority LLC Oki humpy utility company LLC Oki humpy water conservation Authority LLC and their successors and assigns parentheses each Fran franchise and sometimes collectively referred to herein as the franchisees a franchise period of 30 years to construct own operate and maintain excuse me certain services and Facilities to service areas within and adjacent to the Village age restricted development setting forth the terms and conditions under which such franchises shall operate providing for conflict and severability and providing an effective date move for approval second do you want to give us second yeah I will um okay so um the next five six s or items five six seven and eight are all Villages related um they they concern uh the adoption of our a Ard age restricted development zoning classification which is being overlaid over secret promises in short um and then also our one what we call the 163 agreement does that and then there's also some other franchise agreements that we split into two parts this specific item uh number five is a franchise agreement for water for sewer for reuse water those type of things item number six is a franchise agreement uh for solid waste so items number five and six expr expand our franchise agreements onto the newly purchased property that we we sought to reone long story short we missed some advertisement issues on this one um so we just need to read advertise for it which ties into items seven and eight a full 30 days versus a two- week cycle um so we're asking that this get rescheduled to a date certain as well June 10 2024 here at 5:30 p.m. in the council chambers we're actually going to reverse the order at the next meeting um but on this specific item item five and adem item six that deals with franchise agreements so there's lots of strikethrough language and read language in those drafts long story short everything is the same um as we did in the past when we put together these ordinances for franchise and how we deal with um all the items Associated um they're all the same so it's just copying everything from what we've done in the past to further in the future thank you sir so with that in mind can we go a motion to table this motion table till date certain June 10th 2024 here in City Hall 5:30 second second no discussion roll call commissioner rean yes commissioner Peterson yes commissioner Barry yes commiss canel yes mayor bur yes somebody please introduce 686 introduce 686 to be read by title only an ordinance of the City leeburg Florida providing a short title providing findings and intent granting a non-exclusive franchise to Tri County sanitation LLC and its assessors and assigns parentheses franchisee a franchise for a period of 30 years to construct own operate and maintain certain services and Facilities to serve areas within and adjacent to The Village's age restricted development setting forth the terms and conditions under which such franchise shall operate providing for conflict and severability and providing an effective date approval second make a motion to table till June 10th 2024 at 5:30 here in City Hall second no discussion roll call commissioner Peterson yes commissioner Barry yes commissioner conell yes commissioner rean yes mayor bur yes someone please introduce 6 A7 I'll introduce that read by title only excuse me an ordinance of the city of leeburg Florida request for a chapter 163 Florida Statutes development agreement Amendment for the Villages of Westlake area a to incorporate the property known as secret promise and other adjacent properties to update the agreement to reflect year and remove information no longer needed to clarify the definition of VLC Village Land Company to include the Affiliates of VLC to add references to Community Support districts which allow non-age restricted residential uses to incorporate and update the provisions that were contained in chapter 163 public facilities agreement between the villages and the city the public facilities agreement and amendments will be terminated when this chapter 163 Florida statute agreement amendment is completely and fully executed to update the agreement to reflect the current requirements in Florida statutes for chapter 163 agreements this request does not include changes to population density Building height or intensity for property generally located north and south of the Florida Turnpike west of County Road 48 and east of the Sumpter County Line as legally described in section 6789 16 17 18 19 20 21 29 30 31 and 32 Township 20 South Range 24 East Lake County Florida and providing an effective date for approval [Music] second uh can I get a motion to move he's got a second okay so we need a motion motion we're T this one as well can I get a motion motion to table till June 10th 2024 here in City Hall that's what I thought he said second okay sorry roll call please oh sorry good commissioner Barry yes commissioner conell yes commissioner Ean yes commission Peterson yes mayor bur yes someone please introduce 6 A8 I'll introduce 6 A8 to be read by title only an ordinance of the city of lebur Florida request for a chapter 163 Florida statute development agreement Amendment for the Villages of Westlake area B to update the agreement to reflect year and remove information no longer needed to clarify the definition of VLC Village Land Company to include the Affiliates of VLC to add reference to Community Support districts which allow non-age restricted residential uses to incorporate and update the provisions that were contained in chapter 163 public facilities agreement between the villages and the city the public facilities agreement and amendments will be terminated when this chapter 163 Florida statute agreement amendment is completely and fully executed to update the agreement to reflect the current requirements in Florida statutes for chapter 163 agreements this request does not include changes to population density Building height or intensity for property generally located north and south of the Florida Turnpike west of County Road 48 and east of the Sumpter County Line as legally described in section 678 916 17 18 19 20 21 29 30 31 and 32 Township 20 South Range 24 East Lake County Florida and providing an effective date approval second second make a motion to table till June 10th 2024 at 5:30 here in City Hall second roll call commissioner canel yes commissioner reesman yes commissioner Peterson yes commissioner Barry yes mayor bur yes okay move on to item 6B which is first reading of ordinances Grant do you need to swear anybody in for this first reading there uh sir we took care of everybody on the the first Go Round right someone please introduce 6b1 I'll introduce 6b1 to be read by title only an ordinance of the city of leeburg Florida establishing the Grace Key Groves Community Development District pursuant to chapter 190 Florida Statutes providing for authority and power of the district providing for the Board of Supervisors of the district providing for the District budget providing for function of the district providing for miscellaneous provisions and providing an effective [Music] date thank you if You' give us a yes sir this is um Community Development district for the Grace Key Groves which it will cover the bar key subdivision which is down south leeburg just north of the turnpike and east of Highway 27 that was at 1,700 units and 717 Acres I believe is what it was um and just as a reminder cdds are allowed under chapter 194 the statutes and their method of creating and funding special purpose districts that manage finance and deliver basic Community Services the watered waste watered roads and things of that nature security infrastructure roads Bridges Etc um they cannot cause a debt to be encumbered to the city government and they have no zoning or police Powers they're just a way of getting the people who move in there to pay for the infrastructure uh Mr J early of qac rock is here it's the first reading and I forgot Andy to write down the second reading date May 28th thank you thank you Dan any questions for Dan do you have any questions for the petitioner regards to this this will lay over you said May 28th May 28th be the second reading here at City commission Hall okay so we'll move on to item six C uh non- routine items someone please introduce 6 C1 I'll introduce and ask to be read by title only resolution of the city Commission of the city of leeburg Florida terminating the city manager without cause pursuant to section 9B of the employment agreement between Fred a Al Miner and the city commission authorizing Severance payment pursuant to section 9 C of the stated employment agreement and providing an effective date V for approval [Music] if you don't mind I'll start the discussion uh first if you don't mind I just want to uh make sure the public understands kind of uh the differentiation here this is a termination uh lost my train of thought hang on so uh there there are two ways that Al can be with cause without cause of Grant if you would just go over those brief so everyone understands yes sir Mr Mayor there are two different procedures by which the city manager could have his employment position terminated uh spelled out in his contract uh one process would be with cause and that is spelled out in the contract which involved you know sort of a variety of criminal activity you know dishonest Behavior malfeasance of of duties or breach of contract um the other process is without cause so it doesn't really con contemplate that there's per se any legal cause but there is a process that allows the city to terminate the position um without cause um and so under that procedure there would be some more compensation that would be due to the city manager going that route um but there are some things that come back in exchange for that a waiver of any claims against the city would would be one example um and then um you know that that pretty much takes care of the situation so those would be the Avenues the other the other thing that's contemplated in the contract is if the commission were to sort of uh take a vote maybe of no confidence or something like that and kind of request the manager to resign um if the manager accepted that vote and resignation request then he would be entitled to the same uh compensation if he's terminated without cause um so basically the main difference is with cause you would need some legal basis for the termination uh he may not be entitled to any additional compensation if there is cause for that right without cause you don't really need any legal reason uh just as long as the compensation's paid according to the contract right thank you grant so uh with Allan uh Allan produced a letter so I I'll give Allan the floor to start with I'll start the discussion since I initiated this letter to Mr mener one of the most important values in a relationship whether it be personal or professional is trust I give trust freely I have now experienced multiple instances with Mr Min in which I've been deceived or misinformed no matter if these lies are big small or partial truths ultimately is still a lie as a commissioner I must rely on the city manager to Res represent the commission lead our city and place trust in our city manager without a doubt I can no longer do this because I feel the trust I had with Mr Min has been broken I assure everyone this decision has not been made hastily I know if I were in this position with my Superior I would no longer hold a position in my company my campaign for commissioner was conducted on transparency and communication as these are important to me on Monday April 29th Mr Min contacted me to discuss a position change for Mr Hicks Mr Min informed me many times this decision was within his authority I asked Mr Min if he had run this concept by the other Commissioners he stated yes but only the four that I value their opinion and they were all on board initially I agreed with the concept with hesitation Mr Min stated he would be making the offer to Mr Hicks on Wednesday May 1st after further thought I contacted Mr Min on Tuesday April 30th in the morning to make him aware that I had some concerns and could we speak prior to him making this final decision Mr Min quickly responded and said he had already made the offer to Mr Hicks Mr Min stated he made the offer sooner than discussed based on my acceptance I told him this was a huge decision that I needed time to process and felt I needed further discussion Mr Miner then responded that he had rescinded the offer pending further discussion with me after a very long and not so pleasant conversation it ended in a disagreement between me and Mr Min shortly after the call I received another call from Mr Min stating I'm not going to apologize for anything I have said or done and I'll be moving forward with my decision here are my concerns this is a substantial organizational change that was made quickly why the rush I would like to have had a public discussion and allow the concept to be discussed between all of us Commissioners I was unclear and not in agreement with how he proposed to pay the fill the pay Gap with a non-budgeted staff person was this expense of this hire within the authority of Mr Min or would that have required a formal vote if the position required a vote this could have been done during a public forum I have concerns about how Mr Hicks would be able to fill three roles I have concerns about the extreme differences in job duties between the police chief and the roles that Mr Hicks will be fulfilling Deputy city manager procurement manager and admin buyer I have concerns about the lack of succession planning with hiring and training of a police chief while ensuring the continu it of our Public Safety why did Mr Min not seek legal counsel on this change Mr Watson was unaware of this decision until I discussed this with him Grant in doing what was done in the process it was done does this open us up to any potential lawsuits or even discrimination lawsuits lastly I'm a professional and I take my role seriously I value everyone's opinions but I cannot make but I can make my own independent decisions based on what I was elected to do by my constituents thanks so so Grant number one uh there was a mention uh in the charter according to the Charter was Mr mener allowed to hire a deputy uh city manager and and place somebody in that position without our consent yes according to the Charter and I'll I'll read exactly what what the charter says so everybody is aware but there's a couple of Provisions I think that are relevant in in the charter here speak up please okay can you hear me better now okay couple of uh Provisions that I think are relevant in the charter the first is section seven which addresses administration of the city to be exercised by city manager uh and this this uh provision basically states that the city commission may by ordinance or resolution prescribe the manner in which any power of the city may be exercised however neither the commission nor any of its members shall dictate the appointment of any person to officer or employment by the city manager or in any manner prevent the city manager from exercising his or her own judgment and selecting the Personnel of the city manager's Administration uh the city commission and its members shall deal with the administrative Services through the city manager and neither the commission nor any member thereof shall give orders to or make request of any of the subordinates of the city manager either publicly or privately um and then when you move on to section 22 two of the charter which is under the city manager's heading um this addresses the powers and duties of the city manager I'm not going to rehash that it's somewhat similar to the provision that I just read talks about the city manager shall have the sole authority to appoint suspend demote or discharge subordinate officers and employees of the city um section 23 is the third section that is relevant to the analysis which address which states that the city manager shall determine the number of city employees and their compensation subject to the approval of the city commission salaries and other compensation shall be uniform for like services in each grade within the city's position classification scale as recommended by the city manager and approved by the city commission all salaries and compensation and dates of employment discharge shall be reported promptly to the city clerk and the finance director by the city manager so I think when you look at these three Provisions sort of as a whole um I think that the city manager generally has the authority to control the employees that are within the city staff departments the city commission obviously has a role as we just read in that last section which talks about compensation being approved for city employees so I think if there's you know money available to pay employees in the budget um um the salary is within the ranges of positions that um have sort of been approved by the city um then I think that would generally be within the city manager's purview if the city manager were trying to go outside of pay scales that have been determined by the commission then I think he's probably going outside of the boundaries there um there was another question that commissioner reesman asked though in terms of you know potential legal exposure I guess for for this type of thing and so I think you know in talking about a position that maybe was not advertised uh perhaps I think that's my understanding that this position was not advertised as some positions might be or in other places or here um the the issue where you have an advertisement or a notification for a position then you have pretty clearly communicated qualifications and criteria for that position and once the application period has run you have a pretty clear pool of candidates and sort of risk analysis in terms of exposure for potential discrimination claims based on the applications that came in if you have a situation where you don't advertise a position then it's not as clear what the qualifications for the position might be and so you might have sort of a larger pool of candidates because it's not as clear what the criteria would be the other concern you know compared to the situation where you might notice a position would be that your risk exposure is is more unknown I guess because you don't know who the pool of candidates were because whether or not they applied for the position is not as relevant because they seemingly might not have known about the position so I think that's where the risk exposure might come into play in that procedure or I guess sort of a comparison between an advertised versus an unadvertised [Music] position other questions for Grant on this I I do have one for him the filling of a position can't hear you a filling of a position that's not budgeted I guess would be a question I would have yeah and I I understand the concern I think you know from my perspective if there's money available to pay employees and the city manager decides he wants to shift an employee into some type of managerial role or department head type role um if there's money available that's been approved to pay employees then I think that would probably be okay I don't have as big of a concern with that um and I think in this sit situation too I guess I I have heard that uh there were three different sort of department head pay scales I think that were approved maybe within the last half year or something like that and that there were pay ranges for those those department heads and that Deputy city manager was sort of listed as an example though not called out as we're creating this position um perhaps contemplated to some extent um I I'm not sure that there's really a big problem there again unless there was a scenario where there was not money available to pay employees and money was being pulled from somewhere else uh that had not previously been approved and again kind of going back to that section 23 that talks about the commission approving the salaries and that's kind of where I'm tying all of that into other questions um I just got a comment and I guess from my perception and is a policy issue I'm saying that's because if the city manager has the authority to hire his executive management but we don't like the policy it's our Charter I mean that we right that but I'm saying I I hear but this is the issue I I mean that's my perception yeah and as the mayor pointed out that that's embedded in the charter so Amendments have to proceed through now the commission could you know pass an ordinance putting the issue to a vote It ultimately would have to all be voted on uh just like the charter Amendment we did with the utilities a year or two ago well I'm not I mean I'm just making a statement from what I'm hearing yes Al made it very clear that he's been considering this for years uh so why the rush why not bring this concept up at an upcoming budget meeting or the past budget meeting and in talking with Mr Hicks he told and Mr Min said that this all conspired within the last 24 hours of when he was talking to me Mr Hicks called me later in the week and he um said that him and Mr Min had been talking about this for a while now and this and when I asked Al about the rumors I've heard about this for years he told me those rumors were not true but him and Mr Hicks have been talking about this for years so why not bring this up to bring this up at a commission meeting why I do this behind closed doors even though that's within his exactly uh it is Al's business it is not our business our business is whether he sits in the seat and whether he sits in the seat the rest of it is run by the captain of the ship we're just the board of directors that decides where the ship's going that's my understanding of what my job is am I close to right yeah I think you know I think that that is pretty consistent with what we read off from the city Charter do you want me to say anything just if you would like to make a comment please um I promise to keep my words minimal I work at the the pleasure of the commission I'm not going to get into a tit forat on commissioner reesman's opening statement with this regard frankly it was it was pretty close to very accurate there are a few little things in there uh which I would dispute um lie versus miscommunication I would talk about that a little bit uh right up into the point to where yeah I talked to four of the five Commissioners not all the Commissioners and the one commissioner commissioner canel for obvious reasons about the last year or so there hasn't been one single issue that Me Myself and commissioner canel has agreed on so I wasn't going to waste either one of our time and I think everybody who's in this room understands that including the commissioner I did inform the Commissioners that I thought that I I respected your opinion as commissioner reesman said um I think some of the things in the timeline are not quite accurate um I think commissioner con commissioner reesman was uncomfortable to my response of you know to wait um but Le when we left the office my interpretation of the conversation was that commissioner reesman was okay with my decision um and he's entitled to his opinion he's entitled to change and and I respect that um and frankly I respect if he can't work with me any longer because of that decision I think he then did the right thing by calling the question and asking for uh uh termination without CS I respect that um what I will tell this body is I will stand on my record for the last 10 years I think the decisions I've made with regard to Personnel have been spoton I would say roughly about half of the department head staff has been hired from within the organization which makes me question why I read after exit interview after exit interview that employees don't see it Forward advancement in the organization when there clearly is Chief Hicks and I or Deputy CD manager Hicks and I did not conspire and talk about this for months um and I'll be very candid on this point and I think I had this conversation with theoria um Chief Hicks after the separation of the former deputy city manager said something to me about interest and experience his Horizons and I told him to go pound sand four years ago very nicely and I think he would probably capitulate to that and at that time I wasn't ready to bring on another deputy city manager and as you all know from my track record I'm very hesitant to bring on staff and spend money I think uh my record speaks for that when you add staff you add cost um for those reasons I had not V Revisited this conversation um if there's one person in this organization that I spoke to probably within the last 90 days about a contemplation of me changing my mind about the deputy city manager position it was the mayor because he's the mayor so that's kind of where ideas germinate and and those questions were you know maybe Jimmy maybe I need to bring in a deputy city manager I've been here a little while um you know maybe I need to have a training ground of a city manager and bring in a student and whip them into shape and do the Bobby Green School of city government long story I'll save that um but but but for he he heard it uh but for reasons you know I I didn't move forward in that until actually a former colleague approached me um with with some Concepts on a podcast I started listening to which made me rethink you know maybe maybe it is time for for this um maybe it's time for organizational redundancy and if you read the press release and if you read the job announcement those reasons that I hired Rob to do the deputy city manager in short are those reasons I trust Rob Hicks explicitly Rob Hicks is a man of integrity within the community everybody appreciates and trusts Rob um Rob was going to provide or is going to provide depending on where you all go with your vote organizational redundancy and the feedback I've gotten other than commissioner reesman and other than I'll let commissioner canel decide I think commissioner canel will tell you he thinks the appointment was okay but didn't like how I did it so read between the lines on that um but he can speak for himself during discussion um but at the end of the day I put a quality person and a quality position that's going to help the organization long term whether I'm here or not here I also did it in the job classification for which was approved the deputy city manager which is the dhg at first I will capitulate that I thought I paid Rob outside the pay class and and I express I think I expressed that to you commissioner rean that I think I paid Rob outside the class but here are my reasons for why I did it it's within my pay Authority so I made up an excuse for or for why I thought what was wrong until Melissa ARA came in my office Melissa's the HR Director knocked on the door knocked me in the head and said ow stop saying that you actually didn't pay him outside class I said oh perfect great then I didn't mess up here's the documentation that proves that it was the city commission telling me that when we adopted the new pay ranges of the city manager most everybody was on the board here well commissioner canel you were here was in 22 commissioner Peterson I think you were here um and mayor bar bur you were here commissioner reesman commissioner Barry you were not here but at that time the commission instructed me to update the pay ranges I presented to you how we did the pay ranges I was told that that range on the outside end the upend was too low so Melissa brought up correspondence that said I instructed her to add 25 Grand on and then in the budget book for fiscal year 23 you'll see that the dhg is a pay scale of 75,000 to 175 I lucked out I backed into that I did so it turns out a I don't think I violated section s of the charter which says the city manager does all Personnel matters and section 23 says as long as you do it within the budget and within the pay scale you're good so I thought I busted 23 I didn't um so I think my actions were within my authority I think they were in the betterment of the organization and I did it for net neutral at the end of the day I work for the collective wisdom of the commission if I have violated trust for that I apologize I stand before your judgment I say that with all sincerity if the if the vote count is to terminate me without calls I will go in peace as as long as you live up to your end of the deal which is the severance payment which is in the which is in the resolution which will cost you 120 grand um which by the way I think is pretty cheap you can thank the state legislature for that um and and I you know I'm thankful for my time here in lesburg um you all have been absolutely fantastic to work for there's been sticky issues uh but I respect you know where you may go and and the commission's entitled to their decision pursuant to the agreement if you vote not to terminate me um you know it's it's work is normal there's no grudges uh I'll stand on 10 years of performance and you can be darn sure how I've acted in the past is how I will continue to act in the future and um you know I I I will leave it at that and listen to the debate and uh trust the collective wisdom of the commission well set up thank you [Applause] I will keep my comment short uh Al called me uh after the fact I think it was about a thre minute conversation um I asked a few questions I had zero concern um our role is not to micromanage Al mener I not all Commissioners have figured that out yet um I trust Al Min entirely um I'm the longest serving commissioner up here I served in the mayor role Jimmy's been in the mayor role 18 months nobody works closer with the city manager than the mayor so here's two and a half years working with Al um he's done a fantastic job I don't need to go down that list everybody knows the great things he done for our city um and we need to keep Al mener here that's right um I [Applause] am I better stop right there I I'm trying to avoid any very negative comments I'm a little bit angry um Al's do a great job for our city I hope the votes are there I want to see Al stay here a long time I do not want to waste my time interviewing new city managers when I will go backwards um with the city manager thank you mik any other comments I do have some sure um I'm glad Al mentioned that yes I wasn't in the loop at all on any discussion I got a random text one afternoon had a random text one afternoon I wasn't in in any type of discussion you know I I guess and I'm just going to go off what he just said um when you got a city manager basically said he's basically fired a commissioner he's just not going to talk to the guy no more he's not going to work with the guy no more he don't care what that commissioner has to say that's a real problem amen a real problem and you know it can happen to any one of y'all if you fall out of favor with him obviously um and I think it's something you need to consider here um me and Al have had our differences there's no doubt about it but you know I mean end of the day the city Manor has got to work with City commission I mean they have to and if if if a if a city manager refuses to work with a City Commissioner that's a real problem and I think that something everyone on this Board needs to keep in mind moving forward and I do and I don't and I don't want to get in for for Tad working to refuse for the working to refuse for the commission and not having discussions where the commission where the city manager is clearly within his right to do are two different things that then I'll just leave it at that I will add that I think the comment right there he works with a commission and I think there are Commissioners who think he thinks he works for them and that needs to be resolved and I'm going to take outside on that one Mike nobody said that okay that's not directed to you by the way okay nobody said that I said I'm just repeating what he just said he's got one commissioner he does respect the opinion of so he's not going to keep him on the loop on any major decisions that was my point that's an issue I I think going forward he will thank I think that's probably a good idea that everyone would be contacted but on this issue going back to the issue he didn't have to contact any of us he was following the charter and I did not know that till tonight so I thought we were in here arguing a technicality over like $7,000 or something so now this is this story gets even worse so well I'd like to add please please um this is very difficult um I actually popped in my story of learning I stopped in to ask visit um Al unannounced for bike fest numbers and then that's when the um situation was presented to me of possibly moving Chief Hicks to a Ro I was shocked I had questions and I had a list of questions that I submitted to Al in which he answered in detail and I do appreciate however I received my answer when the decision had been made and presented to Chief Hicks this is nothing personal against Chief Hicks for me I was just shocked I didn't understand the transition from such a major role to not that this new role is not major but I just didn't understand and I was asking the questions is this something I don't see and Al gave me details of explanation and I thanked him and from that when I understood I said okay but why the urgency and that's still my question and I understand the need of help true and I also was just concerned of the process of how it was done and my concern is I the respect is there there's questions there's times no one's perfect we all know this but I just want to make sure that at the end of the day this is serious matter and I have this I have a lot of information I'm hearing tonight and I must take all this into to do my very best to hear and understand because at the end of the day at the end of every day I remain committed to the district serving my district the best possible decisions to the district and to the city I'd like to any other comments from Commissioners regarding this issue okay this time we'll have public comment we will limit you to three minutes we will turn off the mic after three minutes because we got a lot of folks so uh anyone who would like to have some public comment it's right here [Music] my name is Ted Bowersox I live at 521 Lakeshore Drive in leeburg I've been involved in the city government leeburg since when I was on the city commission Planning and Zoning Board of adjustments back on the Planning and Zoning commission again we've been through and dealt with a lot of city managers this gentleman you have right here is A+ when we when I was on the city commission when we needed to do something big we had to float a bond issue we had to go out and borrow money at high interest rates at times that's not happening now folks y'all have good Deep Pockets the city is financially sound y'all's decisions help that man's leadership put you there keep this man as your city manager [Applause] amen good afternoon I'm Don mcgr I'm the CEO of roac building suppli 700 East Main Street leeburg Florida um I stand in support of Al Menor I I've been running RAC for 27 years and 27 years ago we were little 80 employee uh business now we're over 500 employees probably the largest independent state of Florida and in the 27 years of being in leeburg just down the road from City Hall our Miner without any doubt is the best city manager we've ever had no no doubt about it he's also been very instrumental in creating the Synergy at leeburg high school with the construction Academy with what he's done with the city and bringing leeburg together six years ago when we started this thing the construction Academy was in leeburg was in Dire Straits we've lifted that whole school up we started with 35 students we now have 350 and it would not have happened without the leadership of Al Mentor the other issue I'm going to talk about is sort of the reality of the world and I think some of our commissioners they're not in the real world I hire and recruit people every day we we desperately are hiring trying to hire people and find them number one if you let someone go today you better have someone already on hook because good people are not leaving their positions because they are being taken care of where they are at that's the fact people are House locked the people the good people are being paid a lot more money from other cities and the mistake you're making is underestimating the talent you have here but more importantly you've now opened the recruit the recruiters who will be targeting Al and other people on your staff when people hear that you're a city that's going to micromanage your city manager and tell them how to run the city number one good luck in recruiting anybody of quality here secondly good luck in finding anybody to replace them literally to replace them that's going to be hard but most importantly you're losing a good guy do know it sounds to me like most of you guys need to just get together and discuss these things and policies out this this should never have risen this way in fact in my management team we have have a management team about 30 people I would have said this to our guys this is Amateur hour this should never have risen to this level and and and I and I feel bad for Al because right now guarantee recruiters will be calling him looking for him and you you're probably creating a bad situation for the city but I do stand in total support of Val you've got a great city manager and I hope you make the right decision retaining thank you [Applause] good evening mayor Commissioners um Pastor John Christian senior pastor of the Christian worship center executive director chairman of the board of the Community Development Corporation uh I've heard a lot of discussion tonight and I concur with Mr McGruder I I've sat where you sat for 19 years hired two city managers um you must understand leeburg is a very unique City for the size now you have a major electric company that the wrong city manager will have you buy smart meters um you'll get a financial advisor who will tell you to borrow money on 27 for 41 quarter quarter that will put the city in a bad situation I can I can tell you that Al men have worked with Al for nine eight years we have not always agreed um I pulled him off the ledge told him he could not argue with the City commissioners uh IE J Hurley um and so commissioner Rees I understand your frustration I really do I would not say that in commissioner canel you correct that you and the city maner should have dialogue and conversation as mayor said moving forward prayerfully we have enough folks to keep out and that's something this commission should work on um the trust commissioner rightman I've been praying for for you guys and this decision um I pray that you can regain the trust of your city manager because ethically I I think um this has came to a very public discussion and this is your chief executive officer and and so you also sending a message not just to him but also your other employees um I can assure you that think about it for a moment Al did have a deputy City Manager for five six years uh maybe more and I've encouraged him I pulled him and said Al you need a deputy he didn't hire dep so he saved the city how much million dollars 800,000 just by not hiring this Deputy city manager so let this is taxpayers money this man has done the work of two people um and still kept our city property taxes low p Street looks wonderful he's went through this city every one of your districts has benefited and he has five people that has to keep happy on a regular basis no matter how you look at it Miss bear she's a nice lady but but she has to keep her happy Mr Mayor ber has to keep him happy Mike Peterson as you heard him tonight he has to keep him happy so it's a very tough job so I would just ask the Commissioners think hard pray about this decision because hiring another city manager with the airport you have an international airport you have a utility company company have gas waste waterer this is not an easy task to replace a man of Al caliber so my prayer to you tonight is to thank hard um keep Al Menor our city manager go behind the scenes take him in the office Mr commissioner reesman and have a come to Jesus meeting with Al commissioner canel talk with Al um have dialogue you know we we're big people we we're grown and we're professional so I just ask you to ask professional and do right what's best for leberg [Applause] yes my name is Randy hebburn uh born and raised in leeburg 67 years and uh throughout the years the best city manager I ever met in this city was Al Manor I could pick up my telephone and Mis dial I did done it several times in two seconds my phone rang back that's what a city manager is supposed to do he not supposed to be private I'm a C I'm a citizen of leeburg I dial his number on a Miss dial a called me right back I say hey man I miss diing that's what we want in this city y'all that's what kind of response we want from our city manager and first Chief Hicks Chief Hicks has been the best police chief in leeburg since I've been here 67 years no problems you call him he answer your call so I believe that I did I know I don't believe it he picked the best person to serve this city he picked the best man to help him to help all of us in leeburg so my recommendation is to Let It Rock like it's [Applause] rolling good evening my name is Mandy wetstein but I'm here tonight on behalf of an organization called Lake 100 for the those of you who don't know Lake 100 is Lake County's excuse me largest private sector member-driven organization with a history of impact and Improvement around Lake County their concerns tonight are such your proposed decision to terminate city manager Al Min um is fundamentally not only misguided but also short-sided there are a few Commissioners who sit up here tonight that we truly believe have no idea of the condition of leberg city government or its finances prior to Al being appointed City manager you're operating with limited information and it's clear some of you have not done your research with the questions and the statements that you've been making tonight let's be clear about the role of a city manager they are the lynchpin of City's operations responsible for overseeing the day-to-day Affairs you are not ensuring efficient Service delivery and navigating the complexities of governance yet it appears some Commissioners here tonight May lack a comprehensive understanding not only of these responsibilities but of your own as City commissioners it is a complete dereliction of Duty to move to to terminate a successful well-regarded manager in the fashion in which you have chosen let's also be clear about this how much research have you conducted regarding the place excuse me the process of replacing an experienced city manager Don McGruder touched on it but I promise you you all have no idea what you're in for none even a cursory review of some of your sister Lake County cities should be enough for you not to go down this path have you taken a look at Mount Dora even the Lake County government Claremont the churn the rotation the instability that those decisions made by inept council members have caused our sister cities it is essential to recognize a complex organization that is the city of leeburg we touched on um the utilities but your role is one of our largest cities if not our largest city as you are responsible for a significant portion of Economic Development due to the lack of utility Provisions being provided by County government this makes Economic Development more critical forever for leeburg In The Cut threat world of attracting jobs and investment to a community which is Lake 100's Focus your actions tonight will definitely bring negative consequences to the city of leeburg as it applies to political stability which does not mean Republican versus Democrat but it means an economic development stability and are you all really ready to throughout the last Deca the last decad of success over personal opinions and your political circles let's review what has been accomplished in this organization very quickly under Mr min's leadership the lowest tax rate in the county since 1981 43 years you have doubled the reserve requirements in in the general fund a demolished Reliance on utility funds to operate General Services reliable utilities that offer our Region's most competitive rates even outside Lake County $25 million in capital Improvement projects without issuance of debt which is unheard of Lake 100 encourages you to understand that your actions tonight could destroy what has been a model of good governance for all of Lake County thank [Applause] you my name's Roger Croft I'm citizen of the city of lburg uh live at 1125 Sunshine Avenue uh I also serve for all transparency I'm the uh I'm on the recreation Advisory Board and I serve at the pleasure of uh commissioner or mayor bur uh there are a lot of things that we need to consider in making this decision and I respect each and every one of you I don't want to throw any anybody under the bus but I can tell you just simply years ago if you would have seen or 10 years ago if you would have seen the city of lebur and what it had gone through with previous administrations just ask yourself right now 10 years later are we better off now than we were 10 years ago 100% Jimmy and I laugh a lot uh or mayor bur and I laugh a lot about they sent out 25 years ago in a uh in a utility bill they listed things that needed be done and we had gotten three or four of them done but we never could get that pool done that man right there got the pool built in honor of ho Dabney who was one of the most honorable people that ever lived in the city of leberg uh just the accomplishments if if you have a organization how many employees do we have in the city of lebur 700 is that about 525 525 okay about a $200 million budget if my company had a CEO that was able to accomplish the things that he's accomplished he is a fiscal responsible manager of our city budget we've never had that before the things that you know if you look at the gems of the city now you look at what's happened down at Venetian Gardens used to be the gym went into ill repair just wasn't utilized effectively now look at it everybody always talked about we need a restaurant down at ski Beach well guess what we got a restaurant at ski Beach we got a brand new community building down at ski Beach that I say Rivals any in the county the other municipalities in this County have attempted to do the same thing and they have got themsel in financial difficulty we are not in that situation and the reason is that man right there so I'm praying that you guys have prayed about this decision the man's not perfect but none of the people in this room are perfect either so please make a good decision for not only the last 10 years we have but for the next 10 years we need this man in the Cs in right now thank you good evening Dr Erica Jasper um I just want to Echo all the sentiments that for the of the indiv ual that have come before me in reference to Al's character I know there's been comments about mistrust and misinformation but I think that has been dispelled by our attorney tonight so I would I would like to recommend that we keep Al on on staff tonight for his record has spoken for itself over the past 10 years this man has excelled in everything that he has accomplished well set to accomplish and I appreciate you Al and I just want to let you know I have major respect for you tonight to sit by someone who has tried to discredit you and I just want to let you know because of your experience and your expertise I appreciate you and I just want that to be known publicly so thank you for everything that you have ever done for the city of leeburg and for everyone that you work for so I thank you I'm Daryl crane 2005 Helms Avenue I've lived in leeburg for almost 70 years now I worked for every City Commissioner from Rex Taylor till today I retired 5 years ago I ask this commission to think think about this and keep Al Min as our city manager he's done a good job I enjoyed working under him and I understand that he loves lebur and he's going to do what's right for this community when we were having trouble within our departments they would send us to some kind of War group and we would all get together and figure out how we could get together it sounds like y'all need to please keep him on board I good evening my name is Twain Little John and I have an organization in uh West leeburg is called the great plan during the time when I met the city man manager it was one of the mothers I I worked with kids but it was one of the mothers that had just spent all of her money to buy food for her and her three kids he might not remember it but I do and she does too she didn't have the money to pay for uh the electricity she didn't have the money and the organization wanted to help her but it would have been like 3 days later and someone said see the City Commissioner so I mean the uh city manager so I went to see the city manager and I told him the situation see this is one person in my community in our community and he doesn't realize what he did he he helped a family with three children that if she didn't get her utilities kept on she was going to lose all her food and then it would have been next month before she was able to and he did it he said are you going to get this money up you going to pay for it in two or three days I said yes sir yes and and it was it gave me a lot of respect for you and what you did for one indiv idual I know he's done a lot for a lot of individuals but that meant a lot it raised the bar if if you were running for something I'd be there trying to elect you all right thank you and God bless you and give him a chance he's a good guy all right thank you Mr Mayor commissioners I'm the older Dan Robuck and I've lived here for over over 70 years and during that time I've seen a lot of City commissioners years ago the city of leeburg was the best city in the county then it took a downward spiral over time started going down and it was mainly because of city managers you can have the best Commission in the world but if you don't have a city manager making them work your ideas and what you decide to do it's not going to work and you're going to get in a down downward spiral and eventually when Al got here we we started going upward spiral before Al right before Al came they were talking about raising avalum taxes raising electric rates Al got here it wasn't long before y'all have more reserves which you still do to day than any City or the county in Lake County Lake County than anyone and you're paying cash for all your capital projects things that other cities can't do I mean he has turned the city around and I don't need to tell you y'all know what all all all has been done since Al's gotten here it's just unbelievable what he's done some people have talked about replacing him and how hard it's going to be you're looking at a very small sub subset of city managers that have had success that want also want to move at you for to understand utilities including gas which makes you all a lot of money and has an international airport it's going to be hard to find someone and when you fire someone not for cause you're going to have trouble getting other people to apply because okay if I going to feel like they're walking on egg shell shells if I do something wrong I'm will be gone so nothing's going to happen and it's it it's it's it's rough y'all have the power to do whatever you want tonight it's it's not up to me or anyone in this room except five people sitting up here y'all get to decide whether leberg moves forward or leberg doesn't I wish we weren't here I would ask that y'all keep Al and that all of y'all that have problems with Al sit down with Al tell them what they are and you y'all you know work them out so we can move forward EV every night I pray for politicians everywhere to do what's right for the constituents not what's right for themselves come on and what that is is to keep Al men are here and be able to look yourselves in the mirror and say I did the right thing for our constituents thank you for your time [Applause] [Music] my name is Hell's cringing my name is Tino Anthony I'm your IT director I have been since Al's been on board it's been just over 10 years I'm a long-term employee I've been here for over 20 I've been through three city managers please hold on to this hold on to this one hold on to him I'm asking you guys here and I know Jay I know you we've had discussions Alan and I have not gotten along at times but he is a reasonable individual I would ask that you work out your differences so that we can move forward he is by far the best city manager we've ever had at least in the last 20 plus years that I've been here so please thank [Applause] you good evening thank you for letting me talk my name is Chuck Johnson 1330 citizen of bevard suet 404 lifelong resident of Lake County lifelong resident of leeburg been through Calvin Gladwell Rex Taylor Ron stock Jay Evans and El mener been here a long time folks I've seen the city of lebg at its best and I've seen it at its worst it's at its best now there's no question about that it's okay to disagree it is not okay to disagree at the expense of the constituents that's what's happening here I'm calling for this resolution to be pulled al man is the right man for the job you guys can work out these differences it's not why we elected to you you guys oversee Al M does the operations what he did for this hearing was called for in the charter grants told you that there's no issue here other than some feelings have got hurt if we lose a city manager over somebody's feelings gets hurt it ain't right it ain't right you guys need to do the right thing the right thing right now is to resolve that Revolution do not pass this let Al Min stay let the city of Leesburg Thrive let the city of Leesburg thrive I'm grateful to be here I'm grateful to be part of the city of Leesburg and I still believe it belongs to me but it can belong to you too all you got to do is take care of it that's all our responsibility we need to take care of this problem we need to keep Al manner at lebur city manager thanks a [Applause] lot mayor and Commissioners thank you for letting me have a minute to talk I want to start start out today um by apologizing to Al Miner and Rob Hicks on behalf of the citizens of leeburg to have to be put through this for egos is about the craziest thing I've experienced in Lake County I served on the commission for eight years I was mayor and I can tell you when I got on here Jay Evans had just left I was fortunate enough I should probably apologize to you for picking you uh Elise make sure you send him an apology for putting him through this I know John's here somewhere and we did an extensive search because we needed somebody that was good and when we found out Al checked all the boxes and he's been checking those boxes every day since and he continues to put hisself aside and always always look out for a what's best for his community B trying to please Five Guys that are different and C trying to take care of his employees and that's a task my friend I'm just telling you that is a task the fact is though we're here and I definely want to speak out against this action to try to remove our city manager he has done a fantastic job one of which I'm proud of and proud to say at some point I was able to stay stand with him and accomplish some of the great things that we did the thing that a lot of you Commissioners who haven't experienced something like that are forgetting is number one you stated it Allan no cause and pling and Jane Buddy that just means it's personal for you and to bring your personal feelings to a commission is dead wrong you'll never have my support again you'll never have me in your corner this is where your feelings are stepped aside and you're residents are what matters not the little groups you hang out with in coffee shops not the little parties you like to hang out with here and there it's what your constituents who voted you in here and said you would watch out for their best interest as a community that's what your job is not if anybody asks your permission not if anybody puts you on a timeline your job is the city commission is to take care of your residents number two you guys are starting your budget some of you have been through the budget a couple times but you're all pretty new I'm going to tell you that sucks and you don't have anybody qualified to take you through the remainder of your budget time so now what are we going to do how long are we going to have to hear all the mess ups that happened to the city of leeburg because you screwed up our budget number three two commissioner seats are up this year so right in the middle of trying to elect commissioners we're going through this mess so now that means you got two new Commissioners that may come on board they're going to inherit this problem having to take over the mess you guys are starting they're going to have to be stuck dealing with whoever mayor do you want me to sit down okay so you just I I just wish you guys would look at it and I'll take somebody else's three minutes but you're right in the middle of a lot of things you can have minute okay the end result is every that you're doing right now guys you've got major projects going on you're you are right in the middle of a lot of major things and you don't realize it yet but you're going to set yourself in this city back on everything you're doing by a minimum of a year you get a new city manager in here he's going to have to come in and figure out where you are he may have new ideas and he'll want to convince you to go another path so you're going to spend at least a year to just get to back to where you are today if you just finished it where you are right now as far as department heads let me just say this one of the problems I see on here and this is not disrespectful this is just a fact of life a lot of you have never managed anything very big maybe you were a department head manag and some in your job you had a small department but I've run 20 dealerships with over 2,000 employees I've been doing it for years the one thing you never do is try to manage your GM's employee list you hire a general manager and it's his job to build the team under him to get his goals and objectives made you manage your GM is your GM as your city manager you're supposed to manage him you don't care how he gets it done as long as he gets the job done that's what's supposed to be important and the most important thing that Al could do is to hire somebody and he used the word so I'll use it again and I'll shut up he hired somebody he could trust if you are ever a boss an employer if you are ever the main man the most important thing you can have working for you is somebody that you can trust we've been down the road with people who tried to pull their own little coups that tried to do their back door things to have somebody you can trust and Al you're one guy that I know I can trust and I'd stand here again and I would say it I said it one time 12 years ago and it made me run for commission but this makes me want to run again I hope you're here [Applause] buddy hello everybody I'm an Kinsey uh city of leeburg building department I can't say it any better than your constituents already did I can't say it any better than any of these other businessmen already did the only thing I'm up here to say is this is not an urgent matter Al has been without a deputy for years this is way too late he needs to get someone in there there's a lot of work that's going on hundreds of millions of dollars cast over all of the different departments that he's running still managing his staff and he has all of our respect so it's an urgent matter it's very late in coming it is not all of a sudden okay this has been waiting for years and uh so we are standing behind Al 100% please uh I know you're not some of you aren't haven't been Commissioners for very long so it's there's no problem saying okay oops we made a mistake obviously okay it was a mistake to bring this up okay there's there's other ways of handling it so I pray that you'll uh make the correct decision thank you so much [Music] any more public comment mayor Commissioners Dan robuk uh president of RAC Building Supply and uh as you probably know I was eight years on the city commission with Al and um so first of all I mean those of you who had the unfortunate uh uh opportunity to have to listen to me when I was up here you know I love my number but I I went easy no PowerPoints no no graphs just a couple main ones to just because the The Big Numbers illustrate what Al has done here so since Al's been city manager property tax is down 25% right so that's great but what about spending guys we like to have nice things General funds up 48% all right so we've we've raised the general fund but we haven't taken on debt so it must be the utility right the electric rates paying for it well when Al got here the the 11 the 1,000 KW rate was 139 today it's 128 so in actual dollars it's cheaper than it was in 2013 I don't think that's true for about anything else and I what about compared to his competitors when I started we were 7% higher than Duke one of the highest in the States today we're 30% lower than Duke we're going down another 7% next month Duke's going up 4% wow so I just the numbers tell the story it's just done an insanely good job job of managing the city he's negotiated this gas deal he's given the city a $3 million year annuity that you just get to spend on cool projects and that's great but it's not only that he does the projects I'll tell you and this this gets to where we are tonight when I was a commissioner I'll piss me off frequently Al and I would get into it up here I remember one commission meeting afterwards he called me he's like hey are we okay I'm like yeah we just we just disagreed um yeah disagreed strongly but um we disagreed but he's not afraid to disagree with Commissioners to do what's right for ber when you look at the projects that that he got me on board with that I was not on board with I'd be completely Frank I was wrong he was right and he got me there so the uh the community center in West lesburg he did not have three votes on the commission to do that he did not I was I was not one of them and he got it done and I think it was unanimous the teen center the teen center in Wes lebur definitely didn't have three votes there that was very contentious issue but you know what he pushed and pushed and pushed because he knew it was right for leberg and he got it done uh brought up the pool didn't have the votes there that took a while but we got it done and you know not just the job performance not that he does a great job the biggest reason you need to keep out M are the people in this room because when I was on commission I saw all these people and they were almost I can look and I can see which ones were on which side of the issues and I have never seen all these people here tonight on the same side of an issue but Al I leur loves Al they they bring this room together he brings the city of lesburg together and you're right he needs to do a better job man than the commission and having those relationships he got used to a commission that he had for a long time where he didn't have to run things by us and I'm sure going forward he'll do a better job with that but but please keep out just he's great for lebg he's brought this community together and and he's going to take us to even better places thank [Applause] you any other comments any comments from the Commissioners so we'll have a roll call vote on it so uh just a let's see here so if you vote Yes you're saying terminate out if you vote no you are saying retain now just to make that clear okay commissioner e first I'd like to say um hearing everybody I appreciate everyone's concerns and comments I would ask um that moving forward if this ha um doesn't happen or that Mr Min will continue to not continue to work with me but then also there not be any misconcept um back door deals or I won't I won't say lies but there were lies that were Li he lied to me I would ask that that would not happen again um with that said uh he has been a really good good city manager he has done great things for us here in the city of leeburg and I will resend my vote and say [Applause] [Music] no commission Peterson no commissioner Barry commissioner conel mayor Murray oh did you did you vote I didn't um thought somebody said no you know I mean what's been said tonight is very concerning it's not that I already didn't know this um but I have a hard time voting to keep a city manager who clearly just said tonight he's not going to work with me I I don't know how I can effectively do this um if Al wants to give me his Assurance he'll get off his high horse and work with me me on some issues and quit leaving me out because he doesn't value my opinion those are major concerns then yes mayor B no that's it that's it thank you very much thank you everybody thank you for coming we'll take about two minutes may I make a comment please sure we're going to go I just want to say something I just want so we hang on we'll do it e e e e e okay we'll call the meeting back to order uh before we begin on the next item uh Miss Barry has a comment please um yes I just wanted to ask and or add is based on um the decision that was just made is it any way possible that we could meet publicly with us and I was just speaking to see how we could move forward with an understanding of to have no Discord or an animosity far as what we'll be doing as commissioners of the Gang of Five and that's what I was trying to see as it's said refer I was referencing to the special meetings in section 13 if three Commissioners were to want to write and discuss something could that be considered so Grant could you what could you address that for us yes sir as uh commissioner Barry mentioned so you know the we have our two normal regularly scheduled meetings throughout the month the city obviously has business that might come up from time to time uh where you could call a special meeting so there is the ability for the commission to get together more than just the two times a month um the process in the charter uh specifies that if SI if three City commissioners request of the clerk uh the scheduling of a special meeting then a special meeting would be scheduled based on those requests so I think and I'll let you know turn it over to commissioner Barry but I think the request or uh the point she was trying to make is that um she sort of finds that appealing I guess perhaps to schedule a special meeting so everybody can get together again shortly after this one to uh perhaps clear the air um but but that's what the charter says in terms of three requests for special meeting then one will be scheduled but I'll let commission okay so special meeting is that like a shade meeting or that would be a public meeting right it's just so it would be no different than it's correct it would just be an off the normal schedule it would be sort of a specially scheduled meeting can we just put it on the agenda one night I think if there are three Commissioners present tonight who are in favor of scheduling that that that would be sufficient notice for uh going ahead and getting something scheduled we just have Pam reach out to us and with a couple potential dates and then we see what all works yeah I think if we could get a consensus tonight that there was an interest in doing that then I think let's you know that that would be fine to do certainly just be clear on the agenda what the what well I have no idea what the agenda would be right now I'm just saying just to move when I said well the agenda just moving forward so that there's no animosity or Discord for going forward for with any of the Commissioners okay so in that that's okay with you I mean you would have to be the main person now I affectionally call you all the Gang of Five you know that and I've said that to each and every one of you um but we work at your pleasure I think if you're going to have a special meeting that's fine but we need to have an agenda for what that special meeting is I just don't if you're concerned about Discord moving forward you know I'll directly respond to Commissioners reesman and Commissioners canal for commissioner canel I don't think there's a single thing that I've kept you out of the loop on um you've known every major decision um you've been involved in those major decisions that involve spending and capital projects and those type of things I didn't keep you in the loop on a Personnel matter um I hear what you've told me tonight and I will endeavor to keep you all informed with respect to commissioner reesman you can expect no different than how I've worked with you in the past I can't categorize what you think I have said as lies and not lies I would encourage you to come see me and share your concerns you were hesitant to can share concerns with me in that difficult conversation about what you thought department heads did and didn't say and it's incumbent on you to share those things and who they are these things matter we can't keep secrets between the commission and the manager you can't have secret Intel I think my behavior has shown that I don't take recourse against people who think differently that track record is there so if and and on top of that I've encouraged you each and every one of you I've encouraged you to get input from department heads it's important that you go down a level I have always said that but at the end of the day we come back and we talk about what you see I think and and I won't change that moving forward and I hope commission and I don't mean to keep interrupting you commissioner Barry and I hope commissioner Barry you will see that and I think commissioner canel you know where we're at and my behavior with you won't change and and I think it's been reasonable and productive and I'll continue to do that moving forward so commissioner Barry if if it's the will of the commission to have a special meeting to have this out again and to have a special meeting about it so be it I'm there I'll be there I'll be there with Bellon and and to work openheartedly with everybody but we need to have an agenda I think you just set the agenda that's what I was trying to say so you'd like to have a special meeting to talk about commission manager government commission manager relationships mov forward Rel so that would be the agenda okay and I have one comment or request could I ask that the three Commissioners meet with you individually and then decide if we want to have the meeting I'm not very excited about this meeting I yeah um and that's just my style number one I think I'm not sure what we're going to accomplish okay um but all I'm just making a recommendation that maybe one on one first and then come back inside if you why don't not to interrupt you why don't you all take a vote on whether you want a special meeting okay commissioner bar if you put that in a motion then you can get three votes to see if your fellow Commissioners would like a special Mee I'd like to move that we um have a special meeting to discuss openly how we will move forward as a team and um with the special agenda that will be um actually provided in detail in the future I'll second that out of respect for Mr commissioner Barry okay we have a motion on the floor is there any more discussion on that any other roll call commission Peterson no commissioner Barry yes commissioner conell yes commissioner rean yes mayor B no so we have the three votes we'll have the meeting and and I have Pam reach out to everybody we'll get it scheduled and we'll get it public publicized all right so if someone would please now introduce item six [Music] C2 by title only resolution of the city Commission of the city of leeburg Florida authorizing the mayor and city clerk to update the city manager evaluation process and providing an effective date move for approval do we get a second so we can discuss it we got a second okay discussion yeah just just to te this up for commission so we have talked we did a evaluation of the city manager I October I can't remember may I interrupt and ask one question would it be possible to do this after our special meeting well the way it will unfold we hear me out commissioner so you know there's there's been different philosophies we talked about bringing a evaluation form back to you um do we get input from the department heads do you get input from the staff do we do a survey commissioner canel's asked those questions but the frankly this body hasn't solidified how you want to do the review process of the city manager and you need you guys have' been kind of all over the place on how we do that so it needs to come back to this body you guys need to collectively vote on how we're going to do this review process pursuant to our agreement I have provided you a new Personnel or a new city manager evaluation form um I got it frankly from the city of taries um and I think it lays out some of the things differently I think it pinpoints what you will review on which is the resolution that we adopted goals last summer and then it gives you opportunity to lay out new goals in the future um that's my recommendation to you I'm partial to wherever you decide but youall need to formally decide how you're going to review the city manager the due date for that process is August contractually so commissioner Peterson that answers your question so I would assume we'd have the special meeting before the evaluation is due but if you do want outside input from whomever you really we need to solidify that process now so that we can go out get that information bring it together get it to you and then do the formal evaluation by August so the process my proposal to y'all is the form that's in the packet complete that form return it and conduct the evaluation at the first meeting in August so the resolution sets forward that process did not everyone get with HR about what they wanted or this is based off what everyone wanted right this was based on what we have Loosely discussed at the commission level it was it was collected by HR roughly commissioner was called and and so now it's before you to form vote on okay so do you have Melissa is here do you have questions for her regarding no I I contacted Melissa and let her know my Ops on this anybody uh this is going to address the the vote tonight it's going to address the having the city employees participate in the evaluation process no it does not the evaluation Pro that's something you all need to discuss so you need to bring so this this process that's on your table is a new form it establishes uh evaluation criteria by the goals we set forth and then it establishes an Avenue for you to select goals for the coming year August to August roughly commissioner Canal has time and again asked you to get employees to provide input as part of the evaluation process some of you have not answered that question some of you had said no you don't want it so you need to answer that question this evening for commissioner canal the commission needs to be clear on how you want to evaluate me you need to make that motion and you need to set it in stone so that if you do some of the things the commissioner canel is asking we have time to do that by August can I ask Mr commissioner Canal a question the employee review process who will they be reviewing will there be their department head uh I like for to actually do the city manager okay um I'd like for the evaluation process to incl include the employees um be done through various different companies I have spoke with Melissa concerning a couple different companies that would we would prepare a survey of the employees they would prepare the survey or actually answer the thing and they would Smit it in and it would be completely Anonymous uh that way none of the employees have to worry about any type of retaliation or anything else they could be completely honest and I think that ought to be considered uh prior to us doing our evaluation um I think we we need to know how the employees view our city manager I mean we sit up here we see them twice a month um I think it's very important that the the employees get a say in that evaluation okay can I give a little bit more explanation about the employee survey Melissa araga Director of Human Resources so when I spoke to commissioner can canel I had informed him that Alan and I had previously talked about an employee survey prior to um it being uh linked or or merged with his evaluation Al and I had pre previously talked about an employeed survey because moving the city forward we've talked about wanting to get to a point where the city of leeburg is seen as one of the best employers to work for and in order to get to that process an employee survey is a component of that I explained to commissioner canel that if we went that route our goal is to obtain information on leadership on benefits on Wellness Etc if he or the commission so chooses to use that the outcome of that survey because honestly with all due respect a survey is only as good as the feedback we're going to get correct you know and and we don't know however that information can be used if the Commissioners so choose as part of the evaluation of the city manager however that was not the intent when city manager minor and I spoke about it however I was very transparent with commissioner canel and more than happy to do whatever the commission uh requests of us and we would come up with the questions with the Personnel committee if the commission were to go down this road the Personnel Committee of the commission would meet and solidify the evaluate the the survey um but the intent is to get a better perspective from the employees to see where we can make improvements but it's up to you if you want it to be linked to the city manager's evaluation questions for Melissa comments U I'm not crazy about it at all I mean first of all I don't want to pay money for this um I I have no problem if if HR wants to put a survey out to staff that they fill out you know at their you at their discretion I mean I welcome that information as far as evaluating Al I don't think it's really right to go below department heads I'm I I'm not going to argue that one I mean uh um that makes a little bit of sense but I don't know why we're having employees evaluate you know our city manager that does make sense to me but um at all um I think we're wasting time and money here now when we do our exit interviews just so the just so the commission is aware and we've talked about this before because the commission has asked if the city does exit interviews and we do and so at that time we find out if an employee so chooses to share with us where their areas of concern are nine times out of 10 it's not a a concern with the city manager it could be with the direct supervisor it could be with the decision that was made or what have you but we try to be as transparent with our employees as possible and work with the department heads and work with the city manager so we'll do whatever the commission so chooses uh the feedback you do get from a survey does help us know where benefits are when you said it's everything you know it's HR it's everything and I and I Shar that with commissioner canel that it involves there could be some leadership questions in there there could be questions about benefits about Wellness whatever we so choose to to include if the commission directs us to meet with the Personnel committee which has two Commissioners on it so whatever you all choose but the intent of the survey is just to get information that helps us see where we can make improvements and if a commissioner so chooses to use that in their evaluation of the city manager that's their that's their choice but it's not our intent um to obtain that information that's not the intent of the survey we just want to get an overall feel for how our employees are feeling and and see if we got a good pulse and where we can where we can make improvements if needed okay so you have information what what is the pleasure of the commission I make a recommendation that as part of the evaluation process that we do employ a company for a software program prr and allow the employees it would also include department heads any employee to participate if they want to in the review process along with the other items Melissa said would could be included in that so that's a motion yes it is I'll second that motion we have a second discussion on that I mean how much how much is this going to cost so to employ a company yeah so because we're a small organization per se compared to like Pepsi or Coca-Cola those kinds of places um we did go reach out to some of the uh more reputable um companies like Survey Monkey and maybe two or three others and for a company our size I can't say that we would spend even more than $55,000 if even I honestly don't think so because we're not trying to get an elaborate survey done it's just getting data and keeping keeping it Anonymous um so we it would not be something that would be an astronomical amount to J I would may I make a comment I would like to make sure I'm understanding the survey would be only for information purposes for HR to determine but the the Commissioners will still do the evaluation of the city manager no the motion on the floor is to include a survey of the employees that would be used as a tool in the evaluation of the city manager is that correct commissioner that's correct thank you thank you for the clarity okay is there any more discussion on that motion roll call commissioner Barry um no commissioner conel yes excuse me commissioner rean yes commissioner Peterson no mayor B no can I help your discussion here so commissioner canel the commission has voted 3 to two not to have the employees which I'm assuming included department heads as part of the evaluation process the next question that you may want to say ask is do we want a General survey of how the city employees feel about our organization Melissa will do the same process surve a monkey cost about five grand we'll go out we'll put we'll put together the the the U Personnel committee commissioner canel you're on that and commissioner Barry will come up we'll get with Survey Monkey we'll come up with a survey we'll run it past the the the Personnel committee you guys approve the survey then we'll get it out there we'll get the information we'll get it back to you and we'll do that in all haste my guess that would take 90 to 120 days yes is that something the commission wants to do I will be fine with that I I can live with that I mean I just said I don't mind some employee feedback and I like it being anonymous so we will endeavor to do a Personnel survey I don't think you need for that that that that that Direction's clear that's separate and apart from the city manager evaluation process that will help us guide how we're doing on pay and what the general well-being of the troops is which is potentially healthy so now one second Grant would you yeah I think let's just do a motion we did a motion on the last one just to make sure all is well on there make a motion to do a survey for the employee health an employee health survey of the city if that makes sense is that employee health employe the state overall Wellness I I second overall Wellness with a second any other other discussion roll call commissioner canel yes commissioner rean yes commissioner Peterson yes commissioner Barry yes mayor bu yes we can all get along okay so now you're back to the motion on the floor which is to review the city manager as proposed by myself and Melissa with the form that was attached okay but if it takes 120 days no this is a diff we're off of that we're we're we're not going to include the department that be it next year's well that's we didn't vote we didn't vote that that's a whole yeah so what you have so we decided not to include the employees in the city manager evaluation process we did decide to survey the employees on their on their review of the state of the city gotcha and now the matter is how we're going to review the city manager the resolution on your desk is we were going to review the city manager in August and do that perpetually moving forward using the guide of the goals that we established that year to judge the city manager you will then fill out that form list new goals and every year in August we'll come up with a new resolution of goals and then each year moving forward the commission will judge the city manager based on the goal resolution and the form that's attached you voting yes on the resolution that's on the table which I think has a motion in a second did we introduce this yes we did okay I just wanted I couldn't remember so there's a yes you made the motion so your yes vote does that everybody gets what that is gotcha okay any other discussion roll call commissioner rean yes commissioner Peterson yes commissioner Barry yes commissioner cell yes mayor bur [Music] yes we'll move on to item seven is informational reports we have none City attorney items uh just real quickly we uh closed on the Tropic purchase uh last week so uh the city finished that out and look forward to seeing how that benefits the community moving forward thank you city manager [Music] items um I appreciate everybody's feedback this evening uh from the community I appreciate the feedback from the Commission in including Commissioners canel and and Commissioners reesman um excited about moving forward I think uh we can move forward with the air clear having I said that I'm hesitant to bring up bike fest only because it's been a long evening and our numbers aren't and our numbers aren't quite steady so um do it next time uh but we're we're somewhere in the somewhere in the ballpark I think losing somewhere between 50 and and maybe even breaking even um Travis brought to my attention uh some vendor money and some um VIP tint money that we didn't anticipate so we might be close to breaking even in in any case I don't think we're going to be in a position where we lost any of the city money we put out because we had we're sitting on that 250,000 that came from the partnership um Maggie and Travis continue to Hound down the vendors and get get those payments and I will have a I will have a fuller report to you I think probably you know give me to the next meeting but we'll get it to you as soon as possible can I request the June 10th meeting I'm not here next meeting yeah that that would give us actually more time may I ask how long does it normally take for the vendors to respond is it sometime they answer to this I don't know because we've never done this before commissioner I mean from previous though it took it took some time there there are a lot of moving pieces in that and I listening to the statements that I'm saying and they know who they are and that's no disrespect to the former partnership but there there's just a lot of moving pieces in that vendors in and out and different things we just got to count I'm I feel very confident that we can provide you a very good draft positionally of where we are on June 10th and that will help us move into the budget process and if the commission so chooses to move forward with this in the future as I've said to you a few few times before I would like to actually have a bike fest budget a bike fest section in the budget that shows how we do this so June 10th will be that day that's city manager items anything else that's it no sir uh roll call commission Peterson it's been a tough six six days uh I have not enjoyed my last six days on the leberg commission but the end of the day I want to thank my fellow Commissioners who voted to keep Al uh it's a great decision for our city um and uh look forward look forward to the future commissioner Barry um I have nothing at this time commissioner conell no commissioner Ean nothing this evening mayor B uh as mayor I would like to welcome Deputy believe got that Deputy Hicks uh Deputy city manager Hicks uh I told him I would give him the props uh I had that on my list I forgot and that's it can we motion to adjourn motion to adjourn second second we're good see