That's awesome. >> About 2 minutes. Two minutes. >> Great. Are you guys ready? >> Uh, yeah. >> Okay. All right. Stand by. >> Five, four, three, two, one.
>> All right. Good evening everyone and welcome to the Monday, March 2nd, 2026 meeting of the Long Meadow Select Board. Uh we were postponed last week for the snow. So we are reach meeting on a off night for us. Uh start with the my
script. Uh this is select board chair Josh Lavine. I will be confirming that all members and persons anticipated on the agenda are present and can hear me. Members, when I call your name, please respond in the affirmative. Dan Worko >> here. Benith Mavathy >> here. >> Andrew Lamb here. >> Shelley Mayor Dwolf >> here.
>> Staff, when I call your name, please respond in the affirmative. Lynn Simmons >> here. That mic is off. Right. >> Right. >> Okay. And Peggy Sheldon here. >> This open meeting of the Long Metal Select Board is convened in person and via Zoom webinar as posted on the agenda and town's website identifying how the
public may join. There is no chat or Q&A function. All the materials for this meeting are available on the agenda posted on long meadow.gov. The public is encouraged to follow along using the posted agenda unless I note otherwise. This meeting will feature resident comment for residents attending the meeting in person. Please raise your
hand when we get to the comment section of the meeting and I will call on you to approach the microphone. For residents participating in the meeting via Zoom webinar format, please use the raise hand icon at the bottom of the screen. The meeting moderator will promote you to panelists, unmute you and give you permission to speak. If you join the
webinar by phone, dial star9 to raise your hand and star six to mute unmute. Residents who wish to speak will identify their names and addresses only. Each individual is afforded three minutes for comments. Please note that this meeting is being recorded and that some attendees are participating by video conference. Please remember to
mute your phone or computer when you are not speaking. If anyone in attendance is recording this meeting, please announce yourself now. Seeing none, we will move on to the pledge of allegiance. I pledge to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic
for it stands one nation under God indivisible with liberty and justice for all. >> All right. First up we have our announcements. Uh community preservation committee spring application cycle. The community preservation committee will
now be accepting applications to be submitted by April 7th, 2026 for possible consideration at the 2026 fall special town meeting. The application form and information about the community preservation act process can be found on the community preservation committee
page at www. longwidmma.gov. Plastic people, the hidden crisis of microlastics. Oh, this already happened. I'll read it anyway. Um the energy and sustainability committee in partnership with various town committees and organizations uh
will be hosting a special screening of the film Plastic People: The Hidden Crisis of Microlastics on February 25th, 2026 at 6:30 in the Long Meadow High School auditorium. The film will be followed by a discussion with Q&A opportunities. Additional information at long memma.govvic
alerts. Okay. Uh, first up we have resident comments. Name and address, please. Tom Shay, 81 Green Meadow Drive. Last spring you were told there will be a catastrophic incident at Springfield Water and Sewer. Based on what? There
are concerns about the water level for firefighting. You should have Springfield Water and Sewer in to discuss the forecasted catastrophic incident. It's probably news to them. None of the other four wholesale customers have a secondary tank. Awam, Springfield, LLO, East Long Meadow. I
believe the select board gave a resounding no last July to a secondary tank that would last only eight hours, cost over 5 million, and increase water rates by 6%. The riskreward is not there. Firefighting select board has had the explicit ability to curtail non-essential water use for the last
five years through two droughts as decreed by the state and actually in previous years. In the last 38 years as a resident, the select board has never curtailed non-essential water use for low water levels except for a Long Meadow mechanical issue two years ago.
In my 66 years, Springfield has not has only had a handful of soft curtailments, not bans, when I was young. Last July and August, during two of the hottest and irrigationprone weeks of the year, the tank barely breached the 20 foot level during morning irrigation and shower time quickly
recovered. I'm not sure the risk justifies the capital being spent to expand the existing Enfield tie-in. The money could be better spent on a review and likely improvements of the monitoring, communication, and mechanical equipment and overall safety of the water tank and pumping station
and not wait until 2030 on your capital plan. The published presentation for the water budget and rates for tonight is good and I appreciate the timeliness. However, it needs assumptions and more granularity and detail. You should also review the
retained earnings level. Check my numbers, but more importantly, the estimated fixed portion of the water budget is 50 to 55%. However, the budgeted fixed fee for water only captures 60%. my estimated fixed charges and should likely be 20% this year going
to 25% next year. Last year, Springfield had a professional rate analysis firm review its rate setting and approximately 30% of the average users bill is fixed. In Long Meadow, the average residential
water user only 8% of their bill is fixed and the mean it is 11%. Both are unacceptably low. As the fixed fee increases, the variable unit costs go down. Modern utility rate setting says users of water that are providing the
capacity to consume should share equally in the fixed costs and expenses of the enterprise. A higher fixed fee would reduce the risk of revenues to weather conditions and provide more certainty of revenues. >> 10 seconds. >> Thank you.
>> 10 seconds. I've never done that early. Thank you. Anybody else? Anybody online, Peggy? No. Okay. All right. Uh, kudos and plaudits. Uh, thank you to Meals on Wheels volunteer Eugene Simmons. Uh, big thank you to
Long Meadow Adult Center Centers Meals on Wheels volunteer Eugene Simmons for his thoughtful gesture to the department's kitchen staff. He surprised kitchen staff with personalized chef jackets, each one embroidered with their name. Uh, great way to make the team special. So, thank you to Mr. Simmons
neighbors helping neighbors. Uh the Long Meadow Town Manager's Office received a handwritten card from homebound residents sharing a recent experience they had. The end of January during the heavy snowstorm, these residents were visited by two Long Meadow High School students with an offer to shovel their driveway for them. These residents were not known to each other and the resident
who wrote the card wanted to share their appreciation. Let the town manager's office know how joyful and happy it made them and pass on what the youth in Long Meadow are doing. Long Fire Department. Uh, Deputy Chief Andrew Mar graduated from the Massachusetts Firefighting Academy Chief
Fire Officer Management Training Program on February 10th, 2026. The Chief Fire Officer Management Training Program is a four-month program for new chiefs and rising officers. The course is delivered jointly by the MFA and the UMass Boston Edward J. Collins Junior Center for Public Management and addresses the
administrative, organizational, and executive leadership duties that today's chief officers are entrusted with. Now that he has finished the program, he is also set to receive his fire chief chief fire officer credentiing through the Massachusetts Fire Commission this spring. A big congratulations to Deputy
Chief Mark who's balanced his this class along with his normal duties at the fire department. Uh and thank you to town manager's office for putting those together. That's um three great things to hear. Uh move on to select board comments. Uh go ahead Andrew.
>> Thanks. Um, I thought I'd bring the board an update from the 250 task force. This is the task force to commemorate local events celebrating the 250th birthday of America. And so the task force has met a couple times. It's been really exciting. There's t there's a really good representation of people
from like the historical society, even the tree committee, the adult center, and and it's it's uh there's a lot of people who are very excited about making this a meaningful event. The it looks like we're going to try to have a couple events. one on July 4th, which is a Saturday, where it'll be a bit like the
Memorial Day service, but the main event will be focused around a time capsule, which we're hoping to get a lot of community interest in with schools and different committees um basically contributing to what would go in the time capsule. Um and also in the fall
there would be a liberty tree, ideally the fall primarily because that would be a better time to plant the trees according to our tree committee uh people. Um, and also our moderator who's on the on the task force would like to do uh a Declaration of Independence
reading, but it's it's a bit more involved than just a reading. It sounds like it's kind of a discussion about why it's a living document, and it sounds very exciting. So, those are the things that we're planning, but it there the task force is requesting a modest amount of funds from the town, which Lynn has told me that will only be available if
we have an article at town meeting. So, we're working on that. uh those funds wouldn't be available available until like midMay obviously, but hopefully uh that will work out well. The main cost is the time capsule. So that's what works that's what we're planning. >> So that's a pretty modest amount of money for >> $10,000 is basically the budget that
we're hoping for. >> Seems uh >> pretty modest, right? Yeah. >> And I want to do it every 250 years. So >> right, >> seems worth it. Okay. Um >> and then um and then I think also the Declaration of Independence reading will
coincide with when it was read in Long Meadow, right? When Steven Williams first >> Well, it was it won't be quite that is what I'm understanding. So the anniversary date was August 8th, 1776, but the tree committee thinks that maybe if we wait until the fall, a little later will be ideal for the survival of the tree. So
>> we do the reading at the same time. Well, it just seems like we want to try to make both events like things that the community can know about and count on. So, that's probably what will happen. >> Do you know if the uh task force is going to come to like another select board meeting to talk about some of this or do you think it's just the next time
we'll kind of hear about this is at town meeting? >> Probably at town meeting. I mean certainly if we wanted them to come talk um we could. I think at this point Mary Beth Berseron is kind of spearheading the time capsule like she's looked into how to order it, what you know the
things to put inside it and things like that and uh so we have some time but the main thing is this article for the town meeting that's the crucial thing. >> Sounds like a joke but it's probably very hard to get a time capsule. I bet there's a lot of backup on the orders. There are a lot of Well, believe me,
they've tal we've talked about reenactors and cannon firing artillery guys, and believe me, July 4th is not going to be an easy day to get those people. But what's interesting is we looked, somebody asked, is there a time capsule from the past that is in town somewhere that we could open, right? And
everybody's at around the table thinking, I don't know. So we looked into this and there are two time capsules from se from 1983 because the the key years to look into are 197 you know 1776 plus 50 and 100
years on and on. But also the towns uh was incorporated in 1783. So every 50 and 100 years since then. And in se in 1983 there were two time capsules on the green to be open in 50 years and 100 years. So, we're not quite there, but in
2033, we'll have something to open. >> Okay. Well, and thank you for the report on that. Um, I just want to mention, and this also could have gotten kudos and plotted, but uh DPW has had a heck of a winter, and I I I know it's been very
difficult to find somewhere to put the snow. Uh, and a lot of corners uh are getting stacked up. I know there's been some work to help on that. And there's with waste management, it's been difficult. So, thank you. And we have Sean and Lisa
here. Uh, and I know you put in a lot of work on this. So, feel a lot of calls, I'm sure. So, thank you for for your hard work. Uh, it's been a really difficult winter uh, not just for our town, but all across the Northeast and all down the eastern seabboard. So,
thank you for your hard work. Um, anybody else? Great. Dan, good. All right. Um, so we next up on the agenda is our dog hearing, but we have about 20 minutes
until we get to that. Uh, so why don't we look at the first of the road closure applications. Um, I move to approve the um sustainability event uh road closure application on May 9th for May 9th,
2026. >> And I hear some I see some vibers over there. Is that uh did you have a Were you here for something in particular? Want to make sure we didn't skip over you. >> Oh, >> all right. Wow. >> Welcome. >> Good for you. Yeah. Thank you for coming
and good luck. Okay. Um, sorry. So, we have a a motion and a second. Any further discussion? All right. Uh, all those in favor have to do a roll. >> Mr. Lavine. >> Yes. >> Mr. >> Yes. >> M. >> Yes. >> Mr. Lamb. >> Yes. >> Mr.
>> Yes. >> Thank you. >> Okay. Next up, we have uh the Pride Festival. >> Yeah. And I'll move to approve the Pride Festival road closure application for September 13, 2026. >> Second. >> Second.
>> Any further discussion? >> All those in favor, go ahead. >> Mr. >> Yes. >> Mr. Yes. >> Mr. >> Yes. >> Mr. Lamb. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> We got those in nice and early, so
that's great. Uh then we have two LACCCF applications for one day liquor license. >> Yes. Um I'm >> March 5th and March 24th. >> Okay, perfect. Uh so I'll move to approve the LACCF um liquor license
applications for March 5th and March 24th, >> 2026. Anything further? All those in favor? I'm sorry. >> Mr. Line. >> Yes. >> Mr. Bley. >> Yes. >> Mor. >> Yes. >> Mr. Lamb. >> Yes. >> M. >> Yes.
>> All right. And uh often as we saw with other applications when people realize it's a thing they uh we get more than one. Um so we have a uh why don't you go ahead Lynn or Peggy whoever's >> Yep. Uh so just as you said uh you had
previously received a junk or secondhand dealer >> license um and now you have another one for uh another business crowns buy and sell. It's an online business buying antiques and estates and selling them online from their home and they would uh
like to be able to receive a permit from the select board to carry out this business. uh is the DBA and a permit from us. That's all they need. >> Correct. >> Okay.
Entertain a motion. >> All right. I will move to approve uh Crowns uh Crowns buy and sells junken secondhand article dealers license. >> Second.
>> All right. Anything further? Peggy. >> Mr. Leavine. >> Yes. >> Mr. Mazy. >> Yes. >> Main. Yes, Mr. Lamb. >> Yes, >> yes. >> Thank you. >> Uh, all right. We still have some time before our hearing. Um, why don't we
start with Fuss and O'Neal at least or the uh Are they online? >> The presentation, but they're not on yet. Is there just one? >> Um, yeah, there's just one. Do um >> do you do you want to do like town managers report or something? >> Did I skip that >> or just
>> You didn't, but just in >> Is that on here? because fussing. It might take longer than 15 minutes. >> Oh, yeah. There it is. >> Oh, we get started. >> Well, that won't take Well, we'll see if it takes 15 minutes. Um, all right. Why don't we Why don't we wait on that? We can do that after the
dog hearing, hopefully. Um, all right. Anything on correspondence? I told you it wouldn't take 15 minutes. >> Keep moving. >> Keep on moving. Let's >> see what we can get through. >> Keep rolling. Um, all right. Why don't you go ahead?
>> Thanks. Um, so a brief budget update. Uh, we received the health insurance number. Uh, it was came in at 11.2% increase over prior year. Uh, this is for the active um, employee health insurance plan. This was above our
initial projection of 7.5%. but well below what uh Scantic Valley Health Trust had their actuarial had re uh recommended which was 17%. This resulted in an increase uh to our health
insurance line item for $174,853 over our initial projection of um $529,285 from the prior year. This uh definitely has put a wrinkle in us balancing the budget. It's added to a growing deficit
number that we are still carrying right now. The budget will be presented to you uh March 23rd at that March 23rd meeting. March 9th, you will have a presentation uh for the school budget. So, we're still working along and I'm hoping to be able to present you um uh
as close to a balanced budget with potentially some different options on March 23rd. And um an update on our emergency communication system that we were using. Um people maybe remember that we used a system called Code Red for years. We
just made a switch to a company called Everbridge. Um this is for our emergency alert and communic community notification program. It allows us to put out messages to the community with vital or critical information. Um mostly you know snow parking bands or anything
weather related generally. Um, and you can subscribe, uh, to receive those notifications either by email, text, or phone call. Um, you can also, uh, opt in, um, to specific notification methods that you want or all of them. You can
create your own account with Everbridge. It's linked right on the town website and make those um, edits to how you want to receive information. Um, one of the big reasons that we made this switch, actually there were two reasons. One is the platform is a lot easier for us to use and manage. It gives us greater uh
user controls and two uh maybe the biggest reason is it was less expensive. So that was a a nice thing that we had happen because that's usually not the case. Uh and that concludes my updates for tonight. Um happy to answer any questions you have.
Uh where did we get the 7 and a half% for the uh anticipated increase on the health insurance? >> Uh that's based on our our historical. So what we do is we look back at all of our prior years and that's how we build our budget in general is we figure out
you know what things have cost over the last generally we use three to five years. Uh and so our health insurance number has not been above 7% in quite a while. um last year was four uh and a year before was zero. So this kind of
was a fairly staggering number. Although I will say probably not entirely unexpected given that the climate of health insurance is really just uh out of control lately and um we've seen what's happened in our neighboring communities that are not part of Scantic
Valley. So I think we thought we maybe had another year before we had a double digit increase but uh unfortunately we that wasn't the case. >> So in the future years we won't be quite as conservative I guess. Well >> right >> we already were pretty high but
>> Yep. >> Okay. >> Y >> um yeah that's we definitely keep an eye on that because that's going to be a I know we've talked about other towns that are just getting absolutely rad over the coals with it. Um, and I I have a question on the DPW
report. Uh, I know we have the hot patch on Wednesday. Do we anticipate when that'll open up for more hot patching? >> We can get there already. We have that time, too, because after we plow back, as soon as we get this weather break, I
think we'll be able to do. >> Okay, great. Um, yeah, thank you. Uh any other questions on the time manage report or any of the monthly reports? Okay.
All right. Uh keep moving on until we move back. I move on to old business. Uh entertain a motion to approve the select board minutes from February 2nd, 2026. >> So moved.
>> Second. All right. Anything further? Roll call. >> Savine. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Mr. Mayor, >> yes. >> Mrs. >> Yes. >> Um, I think we have time for Sean and Lisa
at least on this part. >> No. >> No. Why don't we go ahead? >> How gracious. >> Sean, Lisa, DPW, business manager. Uh so I have some updates and recommendations for our trash and recycling program. Um
as you know when we deployed all the carts people could order their new size or they could have chose to pre-order a certain size. Once the carts were deployed a lot of people signed up for swapping their carts. Um the carts did
come in I want to say mid December and we started swapping in before the holidays. We swapped all through January. I will say we took a little break here in February just because staff that help, you know, with the residents were plowing, pushing back snow banks and things like that. So, at
this point, we're at about 45% done. Um, that's about 200 C were done. We have about 224 to go in 164 homes. Um, we've anyone who we had working email for, we had been emailing saying sign up for an
appointment to come and swap. It's now more residents that either can't come during business hours, can't transport the carts, or we didn't have an email, so it's manually calling each resident to say, "Can you come and swap it?" Um, I did have a new staff start today, so I
am she's will in her downtime of training, we'll definitely be able to be reaching out to anyone who we had a phone number to. So, I'm hoping with warmer weather, we won't be on um plowing as much and we should be able to get back to swapping. Uh we did run into a few that we reached out to. they said they no longer want to swap or what they
had signed up for, they decided they even want bigger than that. Um, so right now we're just swapping to what you requested. If you have a different change, um, we're giving you what you want and we'll deal with a second swap later if that's what we want to do. Um,
so potentially we might need to do an outside business hours um, opportunity if people work and they can't come swap during uh, work hours. And then we may need to come up with a bring the carts to the people if they don't have a vehicle that can transport them. Uh also
we need to look at if people lose damage or want a future swap. Do we want to set prices to pay for if you you know your car drove into your garage and just smashed the cart. They need a new one. Uh the 96gallon cost us $60. The 64
gallon cost us $57. and the 48 gallon cost us $53. That is with shipping split out to um purchase them. So we will need to set a price for that and decide if all cases require a price. >> Lisa, a question on that. Do we does our
waste management contract if if they damage a card? >> So yes, if they damage or a few of them right when they were training with the new um vehicles actually just dumped it right in it. Um so they do reimburse us right now in their contract. is a $50 reimbursement. Um, so they are paying us
anytime they crush it or swoop it right over. >> Although it doesn't cover any of the any of our costs. >> Yes. >> Okay. >> Um, update. We still are collecting cardboard at the recycle center when it's open. Um, we did have a problem
right at the holiday season. We were filling like within an hour. Uh, that has gone away now that it's not really holiday buying boxes. Um, so definitely next year we'll have to plan in advance whether we open more and have it emptied more often in the week or if we have a
second dumpster put there or something like that. April the recycle center will resume um its full hours. Uh, another thing we need to look at is when waste management went to contract with us, they put in a dollar per pay as you
throw blue over throw um overflow bag. So that we did pass to the residents and is why the bag price went from $2 to $3 a bag. Now that they're using their new trucks, they have found that it's very difficult to get our blue bags into the
truck. Um the truck dumps on the top and so you can't just toss the bag up and get it in where the old trucks it was in the side. So they like to empty the cart, try to put the blue bag into the cart, use the cart to empty it again. But if people sort of fill the bag fat
versus skinny, they can't get in the cart and they're struggling. So they have reached out to us and want to know if we're willing to look at our program and see if there's anything we can do. We obviously can say we're taking no action. This is our program. They signed the contract. That's what you got to do.
But we do know from residents a lot of people say the trash cart's so small. Isn't there a way to get a bigger trash cart? So, we could look at if we want the option of people can get a larger cart. Obviously, we would want them to pay for it because it's like paying for
the tonnage in the blue bag. Um, we could start exploring that option. Another option would be if they keep their 35gallon cart, we give them a second 35gallon cart. So, they then have two trash carts. And of course, all this would be if they ever moved or anything,
it always going to come back. Um, we do get grants right now for having the 35gallon cart. Um, it actually comes out to about $4,400 of our mass D grant is because of the carts and how everyone has it. I have reached out to say, is
there a threshold that if we have, you know, 5%, 10%, when do we lose that grant? Um, they haven't been able to come back with an answer on that yet. And um we will actually have about 200 extra 64 gallons when we do all the
recycling swaps just because that was one of the defaults and not many are taking it back. So we could always put black lids on those carts that we wouldn't really need to be doing a whole another purchase and it would lessen the inventory that we have at the DPW. So, my recommendations are to set a
price for the swaps in for replacement carts and any future swaps because years down the road there's always going to be someone new moving in. They got these type of recycling carts and they want something different. Um, and then potentially add a transportation charge
if we need to drop it to the house. Um, I have looked at other towns. I know West Springfield charges $25. I suggested 15. And then the only other thing is sort of look at a direction you would like to move in on if we want to move in a direction or not on trash
carts and offering a different option. So looking for feedback on where we want to move. >> Quick question >> with regard to like let's say someone was able to buy a second trash cart. Are we paying waste management for every cart?
>> So they if we keep our program the same we don't have to renegotiate. If we potentially gave people a second cart, that is sort of changing what they do that now there's two trash carts when they get to their house. So, there's potential that they would like to add $2
per cart that extra they pick up. If we upsize the cart and say take back that 35, give them a 64. We're really not changing what they do. So, we wouldn't really need to renegotiate the price per house because that house has one cart and it's just a different size to grab
it. My concern is that the there's a lot of pitfalls to this for for example a limited number of >> 65gallon carts like so a couple things if you let's say we had you mentioned we have 65 gallon carts well we have 200 of them >> when you start doing this we give out
200 then people are going to be very upset that they they wanted to do it. Yes. >> Second thing is you say, "Oh, you can buy another 45gallon cart for 60 bucks, but you know, then the town pays extra
ultimately for every time. So then, you know, it's it's also kind of very difficult to make that fair, I think. >> So potentially you would have to put a fee on adding a cart because the that resident is using more trash for not only hauling if it's a second cart and
tonnage of going over. So the hope would be we would set a price that would cover all those. >> But for how many years? >> I would say any year that they have it because they're like renting the extra space, we'll say. And then also in there would build a price that if we had to
start purchasing more carts because more households needed it, the price of buying the cart is somehow going. >> Well, that does solve my concern about like I don't know. I thought you were suggesting a certain amount of money for in perpetuity you get this free trash can. But if it's kind of a charge that's
>> obviously more complicated >> like buying your blue bag in a cart form for the year I guess. >> Is that logistically difficult for the DPW to >> it would probably go on your water sewer utility bill and it would be like a trash cart fee. Um easy to roll out you know as the houses get it versus you
know if you said every house needed the fee. Of course, that's a little bit more into put in the system, but >> it's not very green to encourage >> trash. Well, that's what our our goal is. Reduce your trash and you pay as you throw with the bag. So, you know, I know
the recycling commission really isn't for, you know, gunho about it, but we do realize with automated and, you know, all the other towns, it is a push up the haulers. It's difficult with loose bags and >> Yeah. >> And the grant is $4,400 a year >> that yearly. We're getting that just for
the cart. I mean, we get more for having a recycle, you know, center and all that type of stuff, but >> I wish it was more. So, it's no brainer. It's >> a rounding error. >> So, if we start to lose that grant, then obviously what you're charging residents to, you kind of would want to make up
for we lost the grant as well. Yeah, I think can't speak for everybody, but I think we may need more info on especially on what what we can do, how much our actual costs are. >> Um I I would like to avoid this. I
people most people can live with the trash. I understand that there may be some cases where people have more. That's what the bags are for. I'm sure we could figure out something or uh maybe make the well, we can't make the bags probably small smaller probably, but um yeah, I I would like to find a
way to not do this, but I would like more >> info on the hard costs and okay, what >> and visav the grant, how much what's our threshold? >> But, uh you know, if this if people are clamoring for it, we can find a way, but
I don't want us to spend any extra money on this as as Andrew was saying. Yeah, I think uh well for your recommendations, I think the first part and the cost that you've kind of outlined there for replacement cars and future swaps, transportation charge, I think that all makes sense. Um and then um I guess I'd
also want us to get a sense from waste management about how many blue bags are they actually having to get rid of every week? >> Because we're paying for them. I could give you that number. I want to say it's like 68,000 a year. Um, yeah. So, what the heck? There is a lot of certain
households are going to have multiples all the time. They probably should qualif, you know, might want the cart. There's other people that put it out once a month or something. You probably keep the blue bag for them in waste management when, you know, it's just one every so often. Um, but yeah, it is actually a lot of
>> Yeah, it's a lot more than I thought it would be. >> That's a shocking number. >> Yes. >> Wow. >> Yeah. Um, yeah. I mean, I I I I think what what you were outlining with >> potentially providing people the option
of having this bigger 64gallon cart for trash >> for people that are utilizing the blue bags more, that makes sense to me. Um, if we were to go beyond the 200 carts, then we would have to find some way to pay for that, you know, have them that
charge passed along to them. Um, but these these carts are kind of sitting there anyways. Um, and so I mean, so I think that's a good idea. So that that makes sense to me at least. >> And I know the recycle commission, they'd probably be pretty involved and say even they'd probably do trash audits
and stuff like that for a resident to maybe have to like qualify and make sure that they're recycling before they could get the cart too. I'm sure um if we wanted to start make a process like that when we wanted to narrow down who gets them when do you qualify or not because we just don't want to give it to someone who's normally not making much trash and
then they have all this room and now all of a sudden it's free-for-all. >> All right. Do you feel like you have enough uh guidance from us? >> Um I guess do I just need an official approval for rates of swapping? >> Uh yeah. I mean do we comfortable doing
that now? Normally we don't vote on things that first is presented back. >> Um if if it's helpful to you, I'm fine with that. >> Any objections from the board? >> I'll be here. I'll be here all month. So >> K has his hand up. >> Oh yeah. Thank you. Uh I just had a
question for Lisa. So Lisa, the when we're talking about swapping the trash bins, are those numbers all based on in terms of dollar amounts, are they all based on u like the volume or should we be looking at I mean not that I want to
have a higher cost, but if it's going to cost a town more money to have like a smaller amount from a volume perspective for purchasing additional uh bins in the future, is that something you've looked at? >> Um yes. So, when we just did this order,
I sort of order it was one truckload. It wasn't multiple truckloads. Um, I looked at how many we order and we've ordered just trash carts from the um previously of like just 50 at a time. So, the hauling of it, if you need a truck is like $2,000, but sometimes if you're a
smaller load, they can like ship it on pallets. Um, so I it is a good rough number of average if we were to buy even just a I'm going to call it a smaller load of them. Okay. And then the other just more of a comment on on waste management in terms
of the the blue bag issue. Um I I I mean I just see this more as a waste management issue and I don't want to burden the taxpayers and certainly also the DPW from additional work that we
have to do. And I feel like if this contract was already negotiated, this this clearly should have been something that waste management should have considered at at that time. So I would like to get more information like Josh said, like Venice
said. Um but I just don't want it to be a burden on the taxpayers, on the town. I think we've been good stewards during uh these negotiations and we've done our part and I just feel like waste
management could could help uh be creative in solving this problem. Another thought that I'm thinking about is I don't know if this is uh good for the town, but something that we've been doing with the excess recycling. Perhaps waste management allows us to have
excess uh blue trash bin or d blue trash bags to toss out at a location uh in a dumpster that they remove and only blue bags can go in there. I know that's a burden on the taxpayers from having to
travel and drop off um the excess trash, but I do want to hear from waste management around some of the um creativity or options that they might have. >> Okay. >> You want me to make a move, Natash? >> Uh Lynn just whised in my ear that we are meeting in a week, so we could just
vote next week if that's okay. And I'll be here. >> Okay, great. >> All right. Thank you. Thank you, Lisa. All right, we're going to pop back in the agenda now to our uh dog hearing,
our 7:30 public hearing. Um, do we have Yes. Okay. Attorney Chaplan is here. >> Hi. Can you hear us? >> Yes, I can. Can you hear me? >> Yes, we can. Thank you very much for being here. Um, we miss you in person,
but uh, Zoom will Zoom will work. We've seen plenty of you. >> So, I I do like to do these in person. Uh, this this one, unfortunately, I'm I'm doing remote. >> No, that that's nonetheless. >> Oh, thank you. Um, can you explain our uh procedure? Should
we open I know we have to open the meeting. Um, I don't remember. Do we read the notice? Why don't you tell us uh give us some guidance? >> Absolutely. So um just at the highest level and I know the board's uh unfortunately wellversed in this procedure now for the benefit of anyone
that might be watching on TV or might be in the audience um who's not familiar with these proceedings or anybody who might be participating that's not been a participant to these type of proceedings before under state law in Massachusetts where you have a complaint uh relative
to the behavior of a dog um that a dog has attacked somebody um or another animal or a livestock or is just behaved in a manner so as to give rise to a complaint pursuant to statutory law. The uh the board is a is a hearing authority
that's charged with investigating the complaint and it's effectively an evidentiary hearing. It's kind of kind of like a court hearing. Um there's not a formal requirement that we read the hearing notice. Um typically we do use a motion to open the hearing. Um at that
point it's open for taking in evidence just like many other municipal proceedings where these proceedings are a little different is that the the first phase after the hearing closes or after the evidence stops is the board deliberates on whether to give the dog
or the dogs a dangerous designation, a nuisance designation or neither of those designations. And under this statutory framework that we work under, there are very specific definitions and I can read those to the board later um and and field any questions that the board has
and we we could consider that perhaps a guilt or innocence u phase to the deliberations. Um if the board finds that there's some measure of guilt so that the dog or dogs fits within the nuisance definition or the dangerous definition uh then we proceed to a
second phase which you could liken to a sentencing phase where the board would order uh remedial measures upon the owner of the dog to ameliate the impact that the dogs have had on the community. And if if it's a nuisance dog the
statute's actually quite open-ended. Um there there is a nuisance bylaw in Long Meadow um that could shed some light on what the board might consider in a nuisance situation. Although I a local bylaw cannot supersede a statute. So um
certainly I don't think the local bylaw limits the board's discretion under the statute. Um and so that's a nuisance situation. Should there be a finding of dangerousness, there are seven uh specific uh remedies that the board chooses between ranging between uh
leashing, which is the law in Long Meadow anyway, u as as your least severe, um and euthanizing the dog as your most severe. Um, so with that, the next step would be um would be to open the hearing and uh to start hearing
testimony from the folks who may be present to uh tell the board about what has happened. >> All right. Thank you. And Shelley, you've not done one of these beforehand. Okay, great. So, any questions? Uh we're we've done this is our third or fourth,
I think. So, yeah. Um All right. So, uh, entertain a motion to open the, uh, public hearing for the, uh, dog as nuisance complaint. >> So, moved. >> Second. >> All right. Any further discussion?
Seeing none, roll call, please. >> Mr. Leane, >> yes. >> Mr. >> Yes. >> M. May. Dr. Wolf. >> Yes. >> Mr. Le. >> Yes. >> Mr. >> Yes. >> Thank you. >> Attorney Chapel, we have our uh the complainant is here and our animal control officer. Um, so if you'd like to
come up and you could state your name and address, please. And Marty Lee, if you also want to come up now, my name is Mary Breeding and my address is 57 Shad Drive in Long Meadow.
I'm the vice commodor at the Pioneer Valley Yach Club. uh and have been a member of the club for over 20 years. Do you need to introduce yourself too? Everybody knows who you are. >> Please, Marty. >> I'm Marty Lee Carmi. I'm the dog officer
for I think 21 years now. >> Okay. >> I think so. 20 21. >> Thank you. Um is anyone else here related to the this matter? >> Uh there's another uh member here who's uh the controller at the club, Ed Wel.
My name's um Ed Waggle. >> Thank you. Ed Waggle, 41 Berkeley Drive. And uh I'm the current controller of the Pioneer Valley Club and former Commodore. >> And I'm not familiar with nautical terms. What is the vice commodor? >> President, vice president.
>> Okay. Thank you. Um okay. and uh turn chaplain. Do we need to swear in anybody? >> We do. We need to swear in any witnesses that are going to give testimony. So I I would ask although I can't see them, I I would ask that the three individuals
that just identify themselves all raise their right hands and I asked them if they saw and would swear to tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth in the matter now in hearing. >> I do. >> I do. >> I do. >> Okay. Okay. And if I remember correctly,
so we only have um I there's no respondents here. Uh so I I think we'll just hear from uh if you want to speak on uh what brought about the complaint. >> Yeah, these are copies of the reports that have been filed on the dogs uh of the
owner who lives next door to us in uh since 2016. Um there's there are at least a hundred reports here uh about uh various actions of the dogs. Uh I've been as I said a member of the club for 20 odd years and I've been making some
of these complaints over the years but certainly not all of them. Um my concern my biggest concern is that one of the dogs and they are both Irish setters now. There used to be a cow but the cow's no longer there. So, they're
both Irish setters, and I'm not sure I can tell the difference between one and the other, but one of the dogs has been aggressive um with members and and children. They growl. Um they charge at
cars when our members pull up to the club. You can go there just probably just about any day of the week and see at least one of the dogs on the property. They have scared our members. Um, some people, some of our members can't get out of the car. They've damaged the me
the car of at least one of our members by jumping up on the car. Uh, some of these reports talk about uh individuals in the community who have their own dogs and have taken them down not to the club necessarily, but to the town park or to the farm fields or
whatever, and they have uh uh found the dogs to be aggressive. Um there was one one report in here where they they bit someone else's dog. So my biggest concern is the safety of people uh at the club and in the area especially now with the new town park. I can only see
an increase in the number of community members who are going to be going down to that area and the dogs are just running loose all the time. I know that Marty has I don't know how many times she's find them. The dogs are not licensed. Um they haven't been licensed for years. Um, and I mean I've, you
know, sent certified letters to the owner. Uh, I've gone over there and talked to him. Very pleasant man. Um, he purportedly has made efforts to, um, strengthen the fencing and heighten the fencing around the house, but uh,
there's, if I can describe the property, there's they have a pool uh, in the on the side of their house, and they have a a fence, which I believe is a 4-foot fence around the pool area. Um they have a higher fence uh around uh the outside
of of uh their lot and the dogs manage to jump the fences constantly. Um as I said you can go there just about any day of the week um and see at least one of the dogs wandering around in the farm fields at the club and so on. Obviously they do the other things that dogs do.
They dig in our planting beds. They leave dog waste all over the place. Uh we don't even allow our members to have dogs unless they're just traveling directly from their car to their boats. So they see these dogs um and get irritated that they can't have their
dogs there. Um as I said, they're they're unlicensed and Marty can speak to however many citations she's given them for being unlicensed and for being unrestrained. Um, but my biggest concern is safety because they have acted aggressively towards
adults and children. Um, they'll growl. Um, they'll run after people. So, my biggest concern is that someone is going to get hurt. >> Thank you. And just um, so you said they're Irish setters. The reports all call them golden labs. >> They're golden retrievers. Oh, they're
golden retrievers. Okay. I'm sorry. >> Thank you. Um, all right. Anything else from the club? >> Um, no. I just want to um repeat what Mary said. You know, I've been down there um on Saturdays working on the pool in the spring and you know, the
pool gate will be open and you know, the dogs will just wander over and start barking at you and um you know, just generally, you know, they're not controlled to their property like they're supposed to be uh here in Long Meadow. And I think um you know while the the owners may have made some
improvements to their fencing, they can certainly do a better job um you know keeping the dogs on their property. >> I mean they have plenty of property. >> Yeah. >> I mean it's it's not an issue of not having enough place for the dogs. It's you know it's just keeping them on their own property.
>> I mean in my mind the simplest thing as a remedy would be for them to run cable from a couple of the big trees they have on the property, leash those dogs and put them on the run. Um, you know, supposedly they've spent some money making the fence higher, but it hasn't
worked. >> I know. There's still holes in it. >> Yeah. So, they're getting out constantly. >> Where do they >> um Okay. So, as she said, this is quite
a thick file of reports. Um, they're nice to talk to, but they that's about as far as it goes. I If we can go way back, I think the year 2024, I just ticketed them and ticketed them and talked to them and ticketed them and they just would never license their
dogs. Um, even though they would say they were going to license their dogs, they would never license their dogs. So, I have a couple problems here. Um, so I think by the end of 2024, they did finally license and they wouldn't pay their tickets, their fines. um by the
end of 2024, I think they did license a dog, but then all of 2025, they still have not licensed their dog for. And now 2026 is going to be the end of this month that they have that they owe Long Meetal for that. And no matter how many
tickets I send, they don't pay them and they don't license their dogs. So, there needs to be some kind of solve on how what I can do to enforce because then you it looks like the Long Meadow Police don't care, but we do. We go out, we send tickets. I I don't know what else I
can do. So, I've been out there numerous times. Um, they now they they have two goldens and one little dog. So, I don't know if the the little dog is new, but all three are unlicensed. Um, they have a they're in the garage,
which I'm all for. They have a dog door. They can go out into the yard. It's fenced. What I'm not for is that they haven't solved the problem. They have um a large fenced backyard that is I don't think it would keep a lot of
dogs in. It's it's it's falling apart and not very tall and there's plenty there's just I walked the whole backyard a couple weeks ago. I mean, they need a new fence. Um,
so if the dogs are going to have access to the backyard, the the two big the gold ones that stay in the garage, then they need if they don't want to do their whole backyard, if they did some part of it fenced um
from the access from the garage. Um, again, even just then I I I went out there, I spoke to mom just to make sure that they would be here at the hearing because of my experience with all the non-paying of the tickets and the not
licensing and the So, I'm really not surprised they're not here tonight. Um, but I did go out there in person and said, "You will be at the hearing and I did say, "Could you also license the
dogs before then?" And then very nicely and smiley. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But they're still not licensed. So I guess I'm just trying to give you this has been years of So we need some kind of like I need to be told what I
can do to enforce none of the bylaws being adhered to. And the other thing I was going to say is that it's a tremendous waste of the um police officers time. I mean they do come out um every time I call them they
come out. They respond quickly, but they must have better things to do than spend their time returning these dogs back to their owners um time and time again. >> Yes. It's it's so much so that the officers know who these dogs are. So, it's even more than this because if the
dogs are if the police officers are riding down there and they see them, they know where they belong and they just bring them home and that's not even a complaint. So, it's it's a problem. I I will say that um
one of the dogs, one of the goldens is the one that would scare somebody who's not a dog person. I've been around them. They did not bite me. They didn't One of them barks loudly, kind of um appears to be aggressive. I can just walk past it
and say, "Oh, calm down." And it doesn't bite me or anything. Um but to somebody, but I'm a dog lover. to somebody who's not okay with that. It looks like this big dog loudly barking and coming at you.
So, >> all right. Thank you. Uh, any questions from the board? >> Um, just a quick clarification. So, it's with the fencing, it's not a matter of the fencing not being tall enough. It's just the condition of the fence where the dogs are able to get through the fence or are they jumping over
>> probably everything. It's it's the fence is too short. It's kind of like falling over. It's it's not um they could put a stockade. If they put a sixoot stockade around their property, the problem would probably be
solved. And um at one point he told me he was spending thousands. I don't I don't see that. At one point he told me he was spending like $30,000 or something. I I don't see evidence of that. Um
and it does not app it appears like they they would have the ability to put such a fence in, but he's not here to tell us if that if I'm wrong if that's that they don't have the ability. In my observation of going out there, it looks
like they would have the ability to put a sixft stockade at least if they didn't want to do the whole property, put an area >> just for the dogs. >> Just for the dogs off of the garage. >> I mean, there is a fence there, but there's a ton of ve vegetation. So, when
limbs and trees fall, you know, the fence gets disturbed, you know, it just needs work. >> Yeah. And I'll I'll say, you know, thank you for being here tonight to speak to this and thank you for obviously exhausting every option before uh you
know, you got to this stage. And you know, you all didn't even need to come here tonight. Just looking at the police reports for going back 10 years. I mean, it's uh, you know, it's just mind-boggling to me that this could go on for so long and that there is this
level of neglect and this level of disregard for the town's um, processes for our rules. Uh, the fact that this these dogs haven't been licensed for so many years, just something basic like that that we expect of every dog owner that that's not even being accomplished
is very concerning. And I will say too that I I have concern that no matter what we even order tonight, it if will they even comply with that and then you know where does that lead us to? Uh because the track record so far suggests that they probably will not comply with that. Um and it's really obviously even
more upsetting that they're not even here where we can even talk to them about this. Um so I mean I I don't know if there's much more for you all to say. Um, you know, I think the record speaks for itself here and I
think, you know, we have to figure out what we can do to get this resolved. And so, because I agree that I mean, I I think you're you're all being charitable and saying that, you know, you're worried that nothing bad is going to happen so far, but the fact of how these
dogs have already acted is already an issue. that's already uh you know affected folks uh that are you know are in that area. Um and yeah, we hope something really bad doesn't happen but what's happening so far is already bad in my opinion. >> Um yeah, I agree. I don't I have
questions but I don't not on the past. Uh it's more on the future. So if um if there's no other questions uh I think we can close the uh what attorney chapel what is uh what was this portion called?
>> We we this would be the evidentiary portion. Mr. Chair, if I may, I I just have a couple of brief follow-ups, maybe even just a single followup. >> Uh and and that is I I think to the animal control officer. Do do we have a a way of identifying the dogs by by name
or by age? Uh, I I know at one point it sounds like the golden retrievers may have very briefly been licensed. Um, and typically we would have that information because typically people >> license their dogs. Um, and I've done a lot of these hearings and this is really
a first where that's been such an issue. Um, but but anyway, that that was my question. Do we do we have a way that we can refer to the dogs? Could is it even possible to um identify the golden that's being more aggressive? Uh,
so I don't know the name of the the little one that I just saw when I was out there. The two goldens. I could look up the past license from 2024 that we eventually did get him to license. Um, so I could find out the two Golden's
names, but I don't I don't know which one. Again, I don't think either is a dangerous dog, but clearly they are nuisance dogs. And clearly one of them would scare people because it's loud. Um, like I said, they I walk up on their
property and walk right past them and and but one is just kind of gives like a loud loud barking at me >> and and that one charges at people too. >> Yeah. >> And charges at cars.
It's more Yeah. I I don't think I wouldn't qualify as I I'd qualify it as they're definitely nuisance dogs. >> What one followup I have on that is it is it only the goldens that are the issue or is the little dog also
>> the little dog's not licensed? So part of my thing is how can we as at the town enforce people who aren't paying their tickets and aren't licensing? And then secondly,
um the problem with, you know, enforcing that they do something that these dogs stop leaving their property. the two goldens. The little one stays in the house. So, the little one right now is not leaving the property and it's not tall, so it's not
going over the fence. >> Okay, that was my question. Thank you. >> So, Mr. Chair, to answer your question, uh someone could make a motion to close the hearing. Um and if there were a second and a majority vote, we could proceed to the um the deliberation
phase. >> All right. Thank you. I did have one more question. Um, so I pulled up our dog bylaw and uh for so for the fourth offense of a a violation of the dog control statute, the the penalty is $500
and that's adds up over time. It's 50, 100, 300, 500. Uh what kind of tickets are we talking about in the past? How much have you >> They're by They're bylaw violation tickets. So,
as of right now, um I I need a way to enforce them. >> Right. How much is it? How much >> Oh, how much >> the total of how many tickets have you The total of all the tickets you've given. >> I I don't know. Years of tickets. Lots of tickets.
>> Okay. Every time it's unlicensed, every time I ticket them for an unlicensed, it is um $30 for the unlicensed. Um the unrestrained, I think it's $25.
Um they get late fees, but >> that hasn't been adhered. It hasn't mattered. >> Right. Well, but you can uh enforcing >> So, I hear what you're saying. you go up in the ticket. So then what do we do if they don't pay that ticket?
>> No, I Well, that's a different issue, but >> okay, >> we it it is something that um and that may be a a Lynn or attorney chaplain question is that uh something we can lean I I don't know under our statute. Um but that's I guess it's not here nor
there. That's not going to solve anything. Um, so if there's no further questions, I'll entertain a motion uh to close the and I forgot the term already. Factf finding. Well, we're not closing
the hearing. We're closing that portion. >> Um, so if anybody remembers the term, they can go hearing. >> Yeah. >> Evidentiary. Jeez. >> Yeah. So I'll move to unless you guys have questions. Yeah. So So I'll close I'll move to close the evidentiary
hearing. Second. Any further? >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Mr. Mayor, >> yes. Mr. >> Lamb, >> yes. >> Mrs. Wargo, >> yes. >> Thank you. >> All right. Uh, attorney Chapman, can you um I I know you mentioned it briefly. Uh, and we have again been through this
uh a number of times, but if you could tell us the designations that we can that we can make findings of for the dogs and uh also if we have enough information here to do that. uh because we normally would say the name of the
dog. Um so if you can go ahead. >> Absolutely. So uh the I I'll read the definitions. I I think um I think whether there's enough information is something we'll have to traverse as we as the board deliberates um on whether
what's been described fits into either of these definitions. Um I'll start first with the nuisance dog definition. There's there's three different ways that a dog can be considered a nuisance dog. One is by excessive barking or other disturbance that's a source of
annoyance to a sick person residing in the vicinity. The second is by excessive barking causing damage or other interference that a reasonable person would find that behavior disruptive to their quiet and peaceful enjoyment. And the third way is a dog that has
threatened or attacked livestock, a domestic animal, or a person, but the threat or attack was not a grossly disproportionate reaction under all of the circumstances. So, if the board were to find that any one of those three scenarios, there's a scenario here that
would be a nuisance dog under the statute. A dangerous dog, a dog can be a dangerous dog one of two ways. First, without justification, the dog attacks a person or domestic animal causing physical injury or death. And the second
way is that a dog behaves in a manner that a reasonable person would believe poses an unjustified imminent threat of physical injury or death to a person or to a domesticowned animal. One caveat to what I just read, there are some exceptions
uh circumstances under which that a dog cannot be found to be dangerous. Um first, it can't be solely based on the breed. Can't be based solely upon growling or barking. And it can't be based upon a reaction to
a person or another animal. um if the dog's reaction is not grossly disproportionate under one of four enumerated circumstances and effectively those reduced to if the dog thought that it was being attacked, if it thought that it's uh offspring was being
attacked, or if um someone was trespassing upon the um the property that the dog lives on. I don't think any of those exceptions are are here, but that's the board's decision, not mine. Okay. Um, I I I will speak. Uh, so I
Andrew and I spoke about this over the weekend. We've had other cases where it's clear that we're talking about a dangerous dog. I I don't based on the definition and what we've heard, I I don't think that that's the case uh here. Um, but I I do think that we've
heard enough and certainly have, as Beneath said, 10 years of reports showing that this is uh this these dogs are a nuisance to to the neighbors and to people who are on their on private
property and are being uh approached by dogs and barked at and uh made to feel uh scared, which could be dangerous, but I I I don't think we're quite Especially with what we've done in the past, I don't think that we're quite there. And
also, if we find a make a nuisance dog finding, there's a lot we can be much more creative in our um our approach. Uh the dangerous dog has pretty uh and you you can move around within them, but there are just certain remedies you can
take. Um so that would be my my thinking. Um >> I do have two dog names. I just I have a portal. Junior and Mino, I think it says here. >> It just went away. The Wi-Fi is not
working that well, but I don't know if that's matters to you. >> No, that does that that's helpful. Thank you. Um, did you say Mino or Nino? >> Hold on. I'm trying to bring it back up. >> Okay. >> Uh, any else? Andrew,
>> um I I don't know. I I I I agree that classification as a nuisance dog seems reason seems appropriate. I think um as far as action, I mean, I think to me it's it's pretty clear that we should either consider making the dog owners
construct a fence that's effective or a leash or maybe an invisible fence is an option. I think the main question is going to be how do we enforce it? And that's where I'm hoping our attorney can >> Well, we have to make our we have to make a finding first and then we can talk about a remedy.
>> Sure. So, I'm in favor of a nuisance dog finding. >> I agree. I think a nuisance fits that definition. >> All right. Um Dan, you have anything? >> Yeah. Yeah. So, I I agree. A nuisance dog as well. I I think uh the attention
should be around the fence itself. And candidly speaking, I I haven't seen the fence. Uh but it sounds like it's pretty porous and there's plenty of openings for the for the three dogs. Um and I would just also
say just looking at some of the bylaws and the the fines, that's discouraging to me that they've just ignored these fines for several several years. U but I know that's not really what we're talking about at this point in in the uh the discussion. So, I would say nuisance
dog address the fence issue. Um, I'm not saying they have to get a new fence, but certainly fix the current fence uh if if they can do that uh for remediation. So, >> that's my >> Did you find the names? >> Yes. Junior and Mino.
>> Mino. Okay. Um, >> those are the two goldens. >> Great. Thank you. >> Is that M I N O? >> Men O. >> Oh, M O. M as in Michael. >> Correct. Um is there a specific
>> is there specific language we need to make in our motion? >> Uh no, Mr. Chair, the motion to uh designate the to >> Well, I'm assuming it's with respect to the the golden retrievers be a motion to designate them as nuisance dogs.
>> That that's a good point. I don't think we have enough information to find and make a finding on the the new dog. uh if it does become an issue, I I would expect you to you can make a complaint. >> We've never even seen the new dog, so that's good. So, we we will make a finding because I don't think we have any information to do that. So,
>> but the new dog does need to get licensed. >> Absolutely. >> Um >> Yeah. Yeah. So, so, so for the for the time being, I will uh I will move to designate
Junior and Mino um as nuisance dogs. >> Second. >> All right. Uh anything further? >> Please go ahead. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Yes.
>> Yes. >> Okay. Um so that is the simpler part. Um attorney Chapman, why don't you tell us what we can how we should proceed now? >> Absolutely. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Um because the board's designated uh Mino
and Junior as nuisance dogs, that the statute just says that the board shall order remedial measures sufficient to uh to address the the issues that the dogs present to the public. Uh so that it's pretty wide open. Um I I can address two
questions that have come up along the way uh relative to enforcement. Uh there there are multiple ways to enforce these but technically a violation of this statute and an order under this statute is a criminal violation. The the criminal courts
generally are are not um you know are not the best way I find to enforce these although I I've done it. Typically what we would do would be a civil action, civil enforcement action, seeking an injunction that could be punishable by contempt. Um, and in the context of that
civil action, if it comes to that, which it it may in this case given the the history here, um, we we could also seek payment of the fines as part of that action. That's that's not something we typically do um to to enforce fines that go unpaid, but but here where we have
overlap um with with the fines as well as with the uh with the order that the board's about to make under section 157, we can combine that into one case. And that would be my recommendation if we get to that point. >> All right. So, Marty Lee on that second
point, it's keep uh keep keep ticketing, keep enforcing um and there are remedies that will go beyond you just going over there or sending the police over there. Um so, keep logging
everything that you do and uh then that's why we have a a law firm on retainer if we need it. Uh, so I I we have had a nuisance dog >> finding before and I I I think what we
ordered was on fencing. So there was a dog that was barking at a neighbor's house. You remember this? And we ordered to raise the fence, but it was the dog ended up moving, so it didn't matter. But um and then >> it was Franklin Road, I believe.
>> Okay. Yeah. Thank you. And then we also had uh >> have multiple >> and we had the dog that was running out that we had the double locking system. >> Franklin. Yeah, >> that was Franklin. Oh, okay. There's another dog that was barking over the back fence.
>> Um yes. >> Yes. Yes. >> Okay. >> Street. Okay. Um yeah. So we can so for nuisance we can really do whatever we think is going to help with the problem. And uh I
>> I would recommend a stockade a six-foot stockade because a chain link they can get their paws and crawl. Um but just a stockade I don't think I don't see these these dogs are kind of heavy. I don't
see them going over a sixoot stockade. So, if I would like to see that they um would have to fence in an area for the dogs, if not the whole backyard with a six foot stockate.
>> Yeah, I I think that >> by a fencing company. Sorry. >> Yeah. From what we've heard, I I think that it's uh ordering patching the fence is not is going not going to work and is also adding a lot more work for you. And
if it's not done correctly, we're back in the same position. Um there are there's a I was looking at our bylaws before. Um is there a a certain area that is Oh, it's a dog exercise area. So that's
if we had a dog park. So uh so I don't know if we have a minimum area that we need for a dog. Um, but I think that uh whatever they choose to do, I that makes sense to me. Um, to have a prescribe the
type of fence, the the height. Uh, they have I looked it up. They have 1.38 acres, so they have plenty of room to do this. Um, and so they can make plenty of room for the dogs and keep the yach club safe uh and and free from being bothered
by by neighboring dogs. Um, so now this is I I hate these dog hearings. I wish we didn't have to do them. Um, but they are an important part of what we do. And so I I think that that's a a perfectly reasonable starting point. And if there's anything
else that uh we need people need think we need to add uh we can but um we also every time we have these hearings we also say if it doesn't work you got to you can come back to us um because we want to make sure that it does work and
I oh and you mentioned um putting the uh runs for the dogs I I don't think that that is I don't like those I think that that is >> uh not good for the dog and it probably wouldn't wouldn't be good for the yach club either because a dog that is out
there for a long time may be barking more and I uh and so I I don't think that that's a good solution but luckily there is enough room to have a good solution. Uh so that would be my recommendation. >> Yeah, I think the sixoot stockade fence would be fine. I you might want to
consider putting some kind of a time constraint on that because >> absolutely >> you know to say that they need to put up a sixoot stockade fence with no time frame on it. Oh no, we how no >> no uh we have we will definitely do that
absolutely and we have um we've in in the past findings we've had uh we have given even certain milestones um but I think there's this is more straightforward than some we've had at least >> is there any value in saying until the
fence is constructed that they must be leased >> uh and to remain on their property. And also obviously the size if cost is a concern obviously they choose the size of the enclosure you know the the what
we what we will order is basically the dogs must remain in the enclosure how however large you choose to make it >> right >> um and then I think oh and I mentioned I had some questions about the future and
possibilities um because If before this is before the fence is up, if it's if things are not being enforced, um do you have the capability of taking the dogs in and holding them until there is some some movement or
until they've fulfilled the order if it comes to that? >> Well, we our strays go to Porter Road Pet Kennels in um East Long >> Meadow. So, if we were to take the dogs, which I again, I don't know if we could legally do that, but that would be a
boarding fee daily. So, who would be responsible for that? >> Well, the the owner. And under the bylaw, uh you can take possession of a dog. And then then
under 12712 the owner cannot reclaim the dog until they've acknowledged as the owner under undertaken responsibility and paid the expense for maintaining the dog in confinement. So this is all this is this
is covered. So um >> and proof of licensing, >> right? Yes, we can absolutely put that on. I was just trying to look if is you can confine dogs that are on other property. Um yeah, actually the catching
12710 is catching dogs and that is if the dog is on somebody else's yard. >> Yes. >> But then you notify the licensed owner of the dog which we don't. >> Yeah. So that's what I do daily and those go to Porter Road. Well, not daily, but often.
>> Um, attorney Chaplan, if we uh can we order, even if it's not in our bylaws, can we order that if the if the dog gets out and it's not the fence has not been put up that the dog is boarded until licensed and the fence is put up?
>> Um, >> yes, I'm looking through this I'm looking through the state statutes now. There there is there is a statute where a a dog who's in violation can be seized by the animal control officer. I was trying to find it while we were here, but I' i've certainly come across it.
So, so the answer is yes. >> Hello Josh. I'm a little bit concerned that if you made it that stringent now at a time when you literally cannot construct a fence now, it would be better probably to say at a certain date like after the in the spring or summer >> and then until then currently like keep
the dog restrainer inside until the fence is constructed and if it's not constructed by a certain time then the dog is boarded. Yeah, I'm with you because >> because right now it's impossible for them to >> I'm with you because I'm thinking, oh gosh, is this >> are they gonna get boarded until May?
You know, I'd hate to see that put in a little cage until May. >> What I'm thinking is if this gets sent out and is just ignored even for the next >> then it's a civil case >> even for the next month while the yach
club is trying to get things set up. I I'm just thinking worst case scenario, but I I like I said, I love dogs. I don't want to ever separate an owner from the dog, but I do want people to do the right thing. So, if yeah, we can be we can be reasonable,
but I don't know if the leashing the dog in the meantime is going to be enforced. And that's what I'm worried about. >> I think I think that that's the least we can do and that if it's if they don't comply, then that's clearly another infraction essentially. >> Yeah. But at this point, I think unless
you say the dog cannot go outside unless it's on a leash. I mean, basically, I think that the immediate action is to make sure the dogs are restrained so that they don't go onto the property and then they have to build the fence when they're able.
>> Yeah. I mean, the fence we're we might have a thaw this week where everything's fine in a week. I mean, it might be hard to lock up um a fence company, but um now this has been 10 years. I I don't expect it to be done
tomorrow, but um we don't want to give and pardon the pun, we don't want to give too great of a leash here. So um why don't we start talking through particulars of what we what we want? Uh, it's March 2nd
and I imagine getting when does your season really start? >> Well, we're down there all year long. I mean, we have events all all year long. So, >> okay. >> The dogs, you know, the dogs come over to take part, but I mean our heavy season starts in
May. >> Okay. Um, I would think that so it starts in May. If we say 30 days from now uh to construct the fence and in in the interim until the fence is up uh
leash the dogs outside and um and then we can put on any other contingencies we want. The dogs must be licensed. Uh >> fines have to be >> fines paid. Although we don't know how much I would like to know how much the fines are because
>> could be it. >> Well, I think that Yeah. So we'd we'd have to look back. I think afterounding them all of 2024, they took care of and licensed, but then now 2025, we've had to start over. So now now
they're not licensed. >> Okay. Well, yeah, I I'm not I maybe the rest of the board feels differently. I I don't feel as concerned with the past fines, but certainly going forward, I think you use the teeth of the
statute or the bylaw um to make it more worrisome to to ignore the fines. But, um >> I think we could always couldn't we make it contingent that, you know, we're willing to forgo the fines if they want to put that towards erecting the fence within the time we say. And then, you
know, if violations continue in the fines, that that's kind of we're kind of goodwill that we're saying we want to make sure the dogs are kept safe in the fencing, license them, put the fence up. I mean, I don't know how much the fines are for for 2025. I'm not sure what the
amount of money we're talking about, but um that way it's not us giving up kind of us saying, "Oh, you could it's okay to just not pay your fines when you're fined by the town." But in this case, sounds like six foot stockate fence is not going to be a
cheap um like purchase for the the owner. So just I don't know if we could do that. >> I think it's a good idea. I mean it fines are probably not the same cost as the the fence, but >> yeah, the fines are not that much because we're just talking please
license your dog. Here's an unlicensed fine. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> 30 bucks. You know what I mean? So that's >> I don't think that's the big deal. But I do want to know how to like Okay. They need to keep licenses. Now they got a new one. >> Yeah. I'm glad that we have an attorney here to tell us what we can do as far as
a plan of action to enforce getting a fence up. >> Yeah. >> Well, that remember that the first time is $30. Really, it's any violation is a $50 fine. Second one is 100, then it's 300, then it's 500. That can add up very quickly. >> Yeah. I think we have to remind them of
that. And then that way to your point moving forward there's probably now that I think we need to just make it clear that not paying the fines is not acceptable moving forward that we're we need them to comply with what we're issuing and
and moving forward. Yes. >> If you don't the fines will be there and we will enforce that. >> And maybe in your wording you said something about a month from now. I mean, I'm all for that, but maybe even that. I don't know that there'd be proof of
obtaining a fence company, you know, because I don't know what the fence company's going to say. I'm not sure if they're going to say we can't come out this month. I don't know what they're going to say as far as because of the weather right now. >> Well, and you know, >> but but but but proof that they've actually reached out and hired one. And
when we do these, you as our you're enforcing our order, right? So you have some discretion. >> So I'd like that wording of that proof that they've hired a professional fence company that this is going to go forward. >> Yeah, that's fine. >> Yeah, you could hire a company in that
shouldn't be 30 days. That could be It takes probably a bit to get quotes, but >> that's 15 days to get a quote or to get a contract in place. Maybe that's aggressive, but 20 days. And then uh and then 10 days after that you can start checking in seeing is this work being
done. If not uh then we can uh I don't know what we want to do after that. Um >> I I honestly don't think anything's going to happen until you make it clear that if it's not complied with that there will be civil action. Yeah. >> And I think that's important to tell them. >> Yes. >> At any point along the line like that
has to be an important part of this. There's no >> Yeah. Turn what does that entail? uh the civil action to enforce the fines >> and the fence and >> oh it's a that's the fi it's the same uh it' be the same lawsuit that so we
basically we'd file a civil lawsuit against them in the district court they'd be served uh either by sheriff or by constable it would be accompanied by a motion for a preliminary injunction they'd be dragged into court in front of a judge if we typically get the injunction I've never had a case where
we don't um and if they don't comply comply with that. We bring a complaint for contempt and they could possibly be put in jail or or sanctioned by the court. >> Yeah. And u Thank you. So I I think that I I don't think it's realistic to have to expect them to be able to get a fence
built in a month. I mean I think from at least from my experience, you know, if you're going to get a fence built in the spring, you're paying for it and everything last year. I think best case scenario probably they're get a fence built by the end of the summer if they can get this all together. So I think that's like a more realistic time frame
to >> I'm fence shopping right now. It's not that long. >> Okay. >> But it's it can be I agree with actually it's it could be take longer >> than one thinks. Um but that's why I think that's important that we say that
they have to be restrained when anytime they're outside. >> Yeah. So, so I think that there's a few maybe a few ways to kind of like uh to break this down is to say is to give like maybe a longer time frame for when the fence actually needs to be built, but then saying that a contract needs to be in place, you know, maybe within the
next month. >> Sure. >> Obviously, between now and when that fence is built, the dog needs to be restrained on their property. Um, and then I do think with that restraint, um, you know, with that with that clause
there that may be maybe after two months, if we're still having this issue where you're still having to go ticket, that at that point you can seize the dog. Um, and I think that that that should be in there. And then also we have something in there about the
license and say that this these dogs, all three dogs actually need to be licensed by the end of March or something, you know. I I just I think that this is allowing just giving too much. I think
it is possible that I guess depends how big of an area they're getting fenced, but um this is the yach club potentially losing another summer to having these dogs. Well, >> if the dogs are restrained, then it's >> I don't Well, I don't think they will be from what we've seen from the the police
logs. Well, that's where he's saying that they can be taken essentially if they're not actually restrained. >> What about a I don't know. What about a pen off of their garage? They have a garage right now. I hate to I don't want the dogs to be outside 24/7. They have a garage. They have a dog door. The garage
is heated. Um what if they had to put a pen off of the garage? The dogs go out into the pen until they get the fence up. I mean, I I don't know. >> You can get those. >> That's up I mean that's up to them. They can do that any point, you know. I that's a great option for them if they
want to do it. >> Right. Yeah. >> So, it's too bad they're not here. Um so, I don't know. But I agree with you on a way to keep them restrained. >> A pen would count as being restrained. >> Exactly. So, it's >> um a fence company if they could just get somebody out
there to to even put even a small amount of fencing for now and then work on the fencing. I I wouldn't like to put to the end of the summer because if there is a circumstance where a fence company can't do it, we could always >> get an exception. But I I rather start
with the shorter time frame. Maybe May 1st. >> Why don't we say >> I was going to say May 1st or June 1st? >> I think May 1. Then they can come back to us to your point and ask for an extension if they can prove that they >> if they can prove that they've actually
tried to defense company >> and maybe defense will be up >> so that we could do uh fence by May 1st uh contract by the end of this month or in a couple weeks. >> Yes, something like that. >> Licensed dog I think dog license. Do
they have do they have to be licensed by the end of March? Yes. Is that okay? So then they need to just comply and just have the all three dogs licensed by the end of March. Um and then in the meantime, the dogs just need to be restrained um on their property.
>> Attorney Chaplan, you see these all the time. Is there anything you think that we may have not covered? >> I think that's a pretty comprehensive order. >> Six foot stockade, >> right? I don't know if you put that in.
>> And uh Mary, anything that you think that anything else you'd like to hear from us or anything else we haven't thought of? >> No, that that sounds like uh you know a good plan. Hopefully it uh can be enforced or I guess I guess the
alternative then if it isn't is to take the civil action. >> I hope for everyone's sake and the the dogs and the yacht club that we can come to a solution. Um these are luckily not dangerous dogs but we don't want anyone feeling threatened and we don't want
anyone uh anything to happen as Vinnie was saying earlier uh that's obviously we never want that on the conscious so hope that we can uh hope this is a good solution. I know it's not easy but that's u everyone has the right to enjoy
their their property. So >> all right um beneath you want to move? >> Sure. Um, so I will uh move that the following remedial actions are uh designated to Junior and Mino. Um, that
a 6-foot stockade style fence uh be constructed by May 1st, 2026. that a contract with a fence company be executed or entered into by March 20th,
2026. um that the dog from this day forward be that the that the dogs from this day forward be restrained on the property and that the
uh that Junior Amino and the third dog be licensed with the town of Wong Meadow uh by the end of March 2026. second. >> Um, and that the consequences would that be put in the letter to him?
>> So, >> uh, yes. So, and then, um, and then do you want to send that letter? >> Um, well, that was my next question. How, how would we know that, >> like could this go out? Certified mail, something that they have to sign for it so that we know that they've gotten this
order. So, >> yeah, we'll get there. There will be an order, right, attorney chaplain, that gets sent to them. >> That's correct. I I'll work with the town manager's office to put that together in the next couple days. >> Okay, great. >> The civil action would go in the order, but it would be we should have it in the
letter. Absolutely. >> Something so that when they get this letter, it just doesn't hit the counter so that they know that like this is different. This is like your dogs. >> Absolutely. So, uh, attorney chaplain and then, um, additionally that the order include, um, an explanation that a
violation of the order may result in a civil action being brought by the town of Long Meadow against them. >> Absolutely. Happy to include that. >> Thank you. >> Uh, and just one point of clarification on the stockade fence that just so it's
clear completely surrounding the area. So we don't want to it's not just between here and the >> the yacht club to enclose the space for dogs. >> Okay. So yeah to amend uh that the the fence clause that the sixoot style
stockade fence uh be enclosed to restrain the the dogs on the property. Um, >> second one. >> Peggy just pointed out that we have sent two certified mail to the dog owners and
they've both come back not received, not collected. So, >> okay, >> we could send uh it's certified and regular mail. That that's unfortunately the sort of operating procedure we use
with folks who don't claim their certified male. >> Okay. Do we have a second? >> I could handel one with an officer, too. >> Sure. >> That sounds even better. >> Yeah, >> it's been seconded.
>> Okay. Uh, anything further? >> Nothing. Uh, roll call. >> Mr. Levine? >> Yes. >> Mr. >> Yes. >> Mr. >> Yes. >> Mr. Lamb. Yes. >> Yeah. >> All right. Thank you, turn chaplain. We appreciate it. Oh, Andrew, we're just going to close the the public hearing.
>> Uh I I'll move to close the public hearing. >> Second. >> All those in favor? >> Line? >> Yes. >> Mr. M? >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Mr. Lamb. >> Yes. >> Sorry. >> Yes. >> All right. Thank you. >> Will I get a copy of that order?
>> Yes. And I think I sent it to you Joshua the address because the first the first notice of the meeting you sent it to the PVYC at our street address which was my mistake. >> Right. >> So >> I think Mike is on that. Oh, you have >> Yes. Mike Barbar. Yes.
>> Yeah. >> Um so just make sure it goes to the PO box. Yeah. That way I'll get it. >> Okay. >> Thank you. >> Okay. >> Well, we could send it to you by email as well. >> Yes, that'd be great. >> Okay. >> Thank you very much. Thank you. >> Thank you for that. Okay.
Uh, under presentations and guest speakers, we have Fuss and O'Neal redundant tank and interconnection study with Enfield. Can you hear me? >> Yes. Can you all hear me? >> Yes. Thank you. >> Trying to figure out why my video is not working.
>> Well, let me introduce you, Mike, and I can start to get some background on the project while you figure that out. So um you guys might know that um a couple years back we did the water pipe age study and we had Ty Bond do that study um a few years back as as a sort of extension of that project. We also did a
redundant tank study and Ty Bond was the consultant we hired for that. Um in the midst of that we had a pretty significant water main break in Springfield um may remember 2023 in the fall. Um there had been some historic studies that showed vulnerabilities in the system. I think Ty Bottom was
actually a consultant in 2007 or 12, I can't remember. So, we hired AECOM to do a interconnection study with the town of Enfield. We currently have a temporary interconnection agreement with them with a hydrant to hydrant um connection with a hose. It's not um very formal in the
case of emergencies. Um, as we've sort of narrowed down the consultants we've used recently, um, we've been relying on Fuss O'Neal more and we decided to, you know, invite them in, have them kind of do like a overhead view of both studies, kind of a peer review and to kind of
give a just a synopsis of what the findings of that were so that you guys could give some recommendations um to me with with next steps or no steps in in terms of the findings. So, if that's cool, that's about the gist of it. Mike, I can turn it over to you.
Great. Um I have like three slides that just have some maps and figures, some takeaways on them. I don't know if they get shared automatically. >> Uh they we have them uh but it couldn't wasn't going >> over to Mike earlier. >> We had problems with them on the agenda.
So we >> So we'll put it up now and we can we can add it to the agenda whenever we can >> get that figured out. Yep. That's it. >> I can explain it. It's just a visual aid itself. >> Yeah. Go ahead. >> All right. Well, thank you for having
me. I have a very brief presentation. Um, thank thank you Sean for the intro. So, um, Fussen O'Neal has been doing, um, a lot of water work on the long metal water system. And as such, uh, we were asked to do a peer review on two studies, one by AECOM and one by Time
Bond, um, that are looking at essentially your water sources and the way you store and use your water. So, one of them was an analysis for your existing tank and future tank needs to store your water. The other one was a
interconnect for Enfield Connecticut, which is run by Connecticut Water Company. Um, so in short, I want to say up front that the uh peer review yielded that the engineering was solid. Both AECOM and Time Bond did a good job in their analysis. We agreed with the
engineering. um we had input on costs and um recommendations on some of the options that come out that came out of these studies. So jumping right in the tank uh study is
the first one to discuss. Um I put on the slides if you have them in front of you just the very basic takeaway uh takeaways which are um your storage tank in your system serves three functions. It provides you uh buffer
capacity during peak demand in morning and at night. It provides water pressure to your system and it provides extra storage for fire suppression firefighting um which uses a lot of water very quickly. So, your tank is from 1964. It is approaching the end of
its useful life. Um, it does get regularly inspected and invested in. Um, we recommend that that continues, that you continue inspections and investing smart money to keep it maintained. But essentially, you've got, and this is not an exact number, another decade of use
out of your tank. This tank's going to be approaching 65 years old, and you should start planning for a new one. The major question that this study asked is do we have the appropriate amount of storage? By a formula used by the waterworks association on paper, Long
Meadow is actually slightly deficient in storage. However, when compared with historical um records and also what the water model tells us is that you actually don't have a problem where you've had too little
storage. um it is a benchmark number. Questions the study asked were do we need a bigger tank and do we need more than one tank and the very basic conclusions are that while there are
some issues with the size of the tank um they are not pronounced enough to require an investment in larger amounts of storage at this location. There would be a benefit to a second
tank at a second location. Generally, the east side of town has hills, and hills are the thing that greatly affect water pressure. Less pressure at the top of the hill, more pressure at the bottom of the hill. A second tank at a second location could help with things like
water age and low pressure. But that would require finding a suitable site, owning a suitable site, constructing a tank, and possibly a pressure zone to service that area at a higher pressure. Those are significant investments and the feedback is that the pressure and
water age issues have not caused major issues in your system. So the very basic takeaway is that we don't think that you need a second tank and we don't think you need to upsize the tank at your current location. The current location is very tight. To build a second tank of
the same size there while keeping the existing in service will be somewhat of a challenge. But to build a second or a larger tank and keep that in service would be more of a challenge and we just don't think the benefits are there. The report went over the the costs included.
We didn't raise those costs. We included um design construction construction oversight. Um we've also accounted for the future cost of money interest borrowing future cost of labor and equipment. And very basically we think that the town should start saving around
$10 million for a tank replacement sometime in the future. Again, you have a little bit of runway. Um, this is in line with the DDW um trying to ensure that the rates are sustainable and that there is appropriate amounts of money in the enterprise fund um for projects such as this.
That are the basic conclusions on the tank study. I can either pause there for questions or we can do questions at the end. >> Um, does anyone want to talk want to hear the rest or start with the storage tank questions? Why don't we why don't you uh finish up
or keep going to the interconnect and we'll talk. >> Great. Uh I have another slide that uh is for the Enfield Water Connect. So it is important to understand as Sean pointed out that all of your water in Long Meadow comes from one source which is Springfield Water and Sewer Commission. Your water travels in two
pipelines underneath Forest Park and enters the major pump station at Magawisa um and Forest Glenn. From there it's pumped to the tank. So while you have a large amount of water available to you, the major transmission break in 2024 did bring to light uh redundancy,
resiliencies, and diversification of your water source. And the DPW has studied these. Acom did a modeling scenario for connecting to Enfield. So your neighbors to the south, Enfield, Connecticut, have a water system in close proximity to
yours. We used the water model to replicate what flows we could get from Enfield. And the study showed that there are three locations that are viable. In all three locations, you would need to pump water from Enfield into your
system. But there are three very viable locations and they are all along Maple Street. I will show those to you on a map in a second. Each connection is able to provide significant portion of your average daily demand. So how much water you use
on an average day, each connection is theoretically capable of supplying that volume of water. I say theoretically because when you move a lot of water on a different pathway, there may be some pipeline upgrades associated with that.
So, we looked at all three locations and together with the public works department, we think that Shaker Road um where it meets um Enfield would be the best location for this work. We estimate that design, permitting, and construction would be about $2.6
million, which is significantly cheaper than building a second tank somewhere. The benefits of this would be definitely emergency response. If anything were to happen to the S SWSC water supply, either physical or contamination or whatever it may be, you would have a
permanent and appropriate connection to a different system to keep you in water. Um, the challenges associated with this are that it is a different state. We would have to permit this both in
Massachusetts and in Connecticut. I put regulatory on here because the Connecticut water system does have detectable limits of PAC PAS. They are currently in compliance with PAS regulations, but in the near future, PAS regulations may be going down. The
limits may be going down and they could not be in violation in they could not be in compliance in the future. And then intermunicipal agreements. At what rate would you purchase this water? When would the water turn on? Things like that. But from an engineering standpoint, we have three viable
occasions. We've picked one that we like and we are estimating $2.6 million million dollars to fund this project. The remaining two slides are just maps. So again, I I I think you guys have access to seeing these. What I've done is I've just taken the
southern portion of your distribution system and obviously the pipes line up with the roadways so you can get a familiar sense of Long Meadow. I have clipped in the bottom right in the white space a zoomedin view of Maple Street in the vicinity of Shaker Road. And I've circled one, two, and three as
the possible locations, which is Shaker Road, a cross-country location off Maple Street, and then George Washington. I'll just skip to the last slide. The last slide is simply a Google Street view of Shaker Road at the town line. obviously chosen to look into Long
Meadow with these beautiful trees. You can see the two different colored hydrants in that system represent representing the two different color systems. Um, and you can see a nice strip of grass on the right where the red hydrant is by the blue car and you can see
plenty of room on the left. And we like this because this station would have an infrastructure to it, right? So there would be a physical connection under the ground, but we would have a control cabinet, electrical to it, meter and telemetry. So there would be a structure and this location would be very suitable
to suit that structure off to the side of the road somewhere near the town line. I'm going to stop there. I wanted to keep it brief this time and allow you time for questions. So thank you for your attention. >> Well, thank you Mike. Um I have some
questions first on the storage tank. Uh, so when a new tank is being built, you keep the old one. We need water. Um, so we'd keep the old one running. Um, and you put it up next to it, I presume.
>> Do do you have to decommission the old one or can it be used for emergencies? Uh, or is is that does that not make sense to keep the water just sitting there? >> Yeah, that's a great question. We would want to decommission it. One of the problems we have with storing water is
you can often store too much water and if you don't use it in layman's terms it can go stale. You have to keep the chlorine residual up. You get what we call water age issues. Um and so having too much storage especially in one location, right? Because it would be a
different story if they were in two locations and the demand was sort of spread out. But too much storage in one location can cause problems. It would also, to be frank with you, become a money pit. To keep drinkable water in that 1964 tank for any prolonged period
after you construct a new one, in my professional opinion, would be throwing good money after that. >> Okay. Uh, thank you. Um and then on the the interconnection uh and this I don't know if this uh you
or Sean um the the temporary solution we have which is just is it running at the the uh hose between those two hydrants and I assume that you cannot service the whole town with that. Okay. Um,
and this is so in our history, this came up in 2024. We had the there was the service issue in Springfield. Did that affect the I know there was more brown water in my part. >> It affected our pressure. We kept water flowing. >> Um, yeah.
>> So, if that had gone on for longer, >> we couldn't have filled up our tank at all. >> Yeah. >> Okay. and and how often has that happened in our 100y year history? >> So, I've been going through all the dates there's been a problem. I think the thing to to keep in mind and you
could look up what happened in Waterberry this this winter is that you have I don't know I think 25% of Springfield's pipes are over 100 years old. And in the case of that break, it was not even the pipe. It was a covert that collapsed and then broke the pipe. There's going there's going to be unforeseen events that come in our
future as we as all municipalities deal with with aging infrastructure. So, this is just would be just an insurance policy um over something that's unforeseen. >> So, uh how are Enfield's pipes? >> I don't know. It's a good question. I'm
sure they're and also in bad situations. >> I I don't remember how many I know. I don't think we have 25% 100-y old pipes. We're not far behind. >> They I'm sure they have their own issues. You know, I think everyone's and there's a chance that we would end up giving Enfield water and have to meter it and have agreement with Springfield to do so if they had a a break. I mean,
this this stuff happens. I oversaw an interconnection between Lennox and Pittsfield and it was routine that we would be giving each other water at different times because it happened. They would lose pressure. They had multiple reservoirs but we would still have to feed them because we had better pressure to to get portions of their town. And we had droughts where our
reservoir couldn't maintain enough level and we would have to pull from them. So it it is a benefit. There is a cost to it obviously, but compared to another tank which doesn't really solve the all the problems, I think it's just something to really consider long term. What is Enfield's water source?
>> Oh god. Um they have is it a is it wells? I can't remember. They might have more than one water source too. I can't remember. Do you remember, Mike? >> Um it's groundwater. Um >> based on the PAS ratings, right?
>> Um yeah. So that would that would really be we don't want to connect to a a place that's going to have its own issues and that won't >> so we are already and we have used it just for for some background and I I do think that to consider if if this was to move forward it would be only if we we
had a major problem in Springfield and we couldn't continue and we turned that on for a couple days until that that problem was fixed. Um I don't think you'd be wanting to use this for your primary source of water. >> Yeah. I mean, it seems like a lot of money to for a a worst case scenario. >> That's right.
>> But that's I sometimes you got to plan for that. I get that. Um but yeah, that the >> the second tank I I don't even that that seems there's so such a multitude of problems with getting there beyond just the money. I'm glad we studied it. I'm
glad I'm glad we now have a peer review saying it's not a good idea. Um but interconnection is I can see the utility of it. can see that certainly there's some sense to it, but it seems with the way our budget is and with the other work we need in our
town, it's uh it's hard to stomach, but this has been very helpful. So, thank you, Mike. >> I need a question. >> Go ahead, >> Sean. So, um so it sounds like this would be mutually beneficial for potentially for Enfield and Long Meadow. Have you talked to anyone in Enfield that's interested in doing this? And if they are, would the cost be split like
it, you know? >> Uh so, we did talk to them. We had to as a part of the feasibility study, we had to have discussions with them to make sure they they knew that this was something we were interested in maybe and also get an idea of their flows and so they definitely were interested whether they'd put the bill half I I don't I don't think so. I don't know. I
I my guess is that they have enough source. It would be a rare thing that they would need to >> so they don't think they need this as bad. >> I'm I'm I and that's that's a little bit of a guess in my part. I certainly will reach out and see if they're interested in funding some portion >> because I guess if they have their own groundwater, nobody they're not at the mercy of some problem outside of their
town. >> They would be at the mercy of pressure. I think that would be the the what we'd be able to help them with in that section of town. But I do think they have probably enough enough gallons. >> And if we were helping them out with pressure, how does that affect our pressure? >> Well, we would be able to open up the um
our valve from Springfield to push more pressure through to to aid them. Um depending on the time of year and what's going on. >> And can we upcharge? all. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Yeah. So, I can reach out and ask just to see if they're interested in covering a portion of it. I think it's worth it.
You might also consider um and this is just it's all on you guys considering funding the engineering in case there was a grant they became available at some point to do that work or in case we are running a new main by it. It'd be just something to consider having. But, um again, this is just my department
doing its due diligence in terms of saying you have an issue maybe and this is something you need to know. How are our pipes on in that area? Oh, well, I guess we we have the color coding already. So, the red is the real old stuff. >> Red is bad. Yeah, >> green and blue are good. >> So, there's a green one right off a
>> number one >> shaker. >> Yeah. And then so that main would not be done anytime soon. >> Probably not. >> Yeah, >> it is asbestous cement, but green probably means it has
a lack of break history, right? So, if it hasn't broken, it's green. But it is as best cement pipe. Um, I have looked at this. I think from an engineering point of view, I do like location one. If you're looking in the lower right, there's a brand new piece of 10-in ductile, which could be extended to meet
the blue line where number three is. Um, you would have two major connection points to feed Shaker Road and Mabel out to Route Five. So you would be strengthening sort of the major arteries of your
system. So I I like I like the thought that went into it. Um and we gave kudos to the town and and the original engineer for coming up with that design because there is some strong piping networks there. It's a good spot for this. Um
again, I'm just talking about the engineering and the pipes and the properties. >> Great. Great. Thank you. Um um Mike or Sean for So if we start if we fund this new water tank, how long does that project take from when from
beginning to end? >> You mean to build it? >> Yeah, to build it. >> I think it would be beginning to end. I think it could be a two-year project because you have to procure the type of tank you want. You have to select it. You have to get it manufactured. And
then you have to install it, disinfect it, put it in put it into operation and make sure it's working well. So I would conservatively say it's a two-year process. We did a tank in Beluretown, it took one year. Um >> Okay. >> And again, we're not saying we have to put a new tank in right now. We're just
saying the out years there's work and we are maintaining the one we have. So >> yeah, absolutely. Um and then uh and then Mike when you're saying that our current tank is ending you know it's its lifespan here um just so that it's very
clear for everyone what would we expect to start happening when it's you know 10 years out or so that you know um with this tank >> and well when will we know when we're at our 10 or so
>> um it will cost you money to keep this tank in service and And I recommend that you do that. So that would be like an annual or every other year you can send a submersible robot into the tank to look at the seams to look if there's spots of rust and things like that. Your
sanitary survey, which is like the rules for running a water system, uh requires you to do that so often. Towards the end of the tank's life, you could do it more often than what is required. What you'll see is you'll see rust, you will see leaks, pinhole leaks, you will see corrosion. you'll see corrosion at the
seams where the bolts are, corrosion at the base where the concrete is um bolted to the metal tank. Um it can start it can start to affect the water quality at at points if corrosion and rust builds up in the tank. Some of that gets sucked into the system. Um but what you think
would happen to a old thing full of water that is made out of metal, that's what happens. But what we do is we we clean it. like something as simple as pressure cleaning it to try to knock the corrosion off. We paint it, we seal it, we drain it, we scrub it. Those are all
the normal activities. It is um beautifully simplistic. >> And we're already doing those things and we just put a mixer in as a uh and cleaned it, I think, a year ago. So, just so everyone knows, >> how long would the interconnection um if per everything take?
>> I think the permit would probably take longer than construction. What do you think, Mike? >> Correct. permitting will take longer than design. Um, it's not the world's most terrible permitting, but I have a feeling that's probably going to it could be interbasin transfer, which is a long permitting process, like a year.
I'm I'm not totally positive it is. I need to know like what water basin their source would be in. I'm not an expert on Enfield system, but the design of that system could take six to eight months. The construction of it, one season. Um,
permitting could be a year. And outside of the 2.6 million for that ongoing costs after that, what are we looking at? >> Yeah, that's a great question. So everything we build has some level of
maintenance. So for this interconnection, you could think of it like like a water pump station. So it's going to have pumps and those pumps will need maintenance. There's plenty of service companies out there that will come in and service your pumps once a year, do a flow test, things like that.
Um, there is a cost of uh telemetry. So, a lot of times like the alarms and things that go to Sean and Mike Spear and their phones, like that's a service. You add it to your other telemetry just like a cell phone bill. Um,
you know, when you build a structure that takes electricity and pumps, you can't let it sit forever. You need to just have periodic maintenance. But I would not call it complex or ownorous. I would just call it
necessary maintenance. >> Thank you. Um so I will say that I think if we you know if we do think that this storage tank needs to be replaced and we need a new storage tank and this is you know thanks to you all has been identified
well well enough in advance then we should start planning uh for this and how we can replace this water tank a decade down the road. Um because you know I think we've been in a habit here of uh going from crisis to crisis and
here is you know is actual it's an actual opportunity for us to think in the long term and plan for this. So that's what you know I would be in favor of doing that. U the the interconnection study you know I I think I'd have to give more thought to that. I
think if Sean, as you mentioned, that there are opportunities for grants to fund some of this, you know, I would obviously be more in favor of doing so. But, um, that is something I'd want to put more thought into, give more thought to, but I think in terms of the the next
uh water storage tank, that is something that we should start planning for. And then if the grants a good point if I know we'd like to have engineering done in case grants come up but uh if you do identify
some grants and then we get the engineering we don't want to do engineering just in case. >> Um but so I this has got me thinking of all sorts of terrible scenarios. >> Uh if if our water tank fails or we are unable to pressurize etc.
The interconnection sounds like that's not that wouldn't save us. We still need that tank to pressurize our town. >> So, we we wouldn't have the the pressure. Um so, yeah, we we would have the pressure, but we we get some pressure if there was water turn on that side of town, but we'd have water
mixing, I assume, if we had both. But the majority of the pressure comes from we can open a valve in in our Springfield connection and put more pressure through the system if we have to. That's what we did with the fire um that was at um I forget the name of place. I wasn't here then. >> Yeah, the shops or the Maple Center. Um
yeah, >> that's not always great though. Obviously you blow pipes out and we have some old pipes, but um yeah. >> All right. So, we got to keep take care of our tank, but yeah, absolutely think ahead. >> So, um this is why we do these studies.
So, that's great. >> Um anything else on Professor O'Neal or Sean? Okay. >> Thank you. >> Thank you very much. We appreciate >> you for having me. Thank you. Okay.
All right. Uh, where were we? Um, update on the fiscal year 2027 budget. >> Thanks. Um, I covered this primarily in my town manager report. Um, so just again, uh, the school committee has voted on their budget. the superintendent will be at your March 9th
meeting to present the school department budget and then on March 23rd I will present the uh overall town budget. >> Great. All right. Uh moving on to new business. We have fiscal year 2027 water and sewer
rates. You know, I like the stash. >> Up a little bit. >> All right. Uh, whoever is presenting, please go ahead. >> Uh, members of the board, good evening. Um, I hope to have a quick presentation for you today. Okay, I realize there's a
couple slides in here, but just in terms of next steps, this is going to be part of a three um three presentation event for the board where this first set of slides is going to go over just a
brief overview of what the current budget looks like and an idea for um the overall water sewer rates. I realize that the board might have different ideas about what they want to see for the rates. Um, I'm hoping to get from
the board an idea of changes to this in terms of uh potential rates, a range of rates and what they want to see in terms of what gets funded. So overall uh this presentation will go over what we what we currently
have as a proposal and then project what the outy years will be in terms of borrowings. So the first slide um is looking at the FY27 water budget currently. Um I would like to highlight a couple things. So
notably Springfield purchase of water. This is under our Springfield sewer and water agreement. Uh this represents 357,000 increase in our expense line or 29% of the total increase of the water
enterprise budget. Following that is uh property related services. This is valve work. This represents 141,000 increase or about 11% of the total ask. and then further another 380,000 within the debt service line um for water projects
regarding the water meters and the water manes that were voted at the November town meeting. Uh this represents about 31% of the total increase. Um the next slide is from the time bond presentation on March 24th of last year.
As you might recall, Time Bond recommended a slew of different um scenarios for us in terms of maintaining our existing rate structure and also recommended both changes for our fixed and our variable rates. As you can see
below, they recommended a 22, 24, and 22 for the next three years. Uh moving to what we actually did on the next slide. Um given the fact that the board rate member that we had a delay in
setting our rates, we had to do a larger increase to make up the difference in that um revenue that was missed for quarter 1. And that was captured in the FY26 rate when we chose to do a increase
in the fixed rates proportionately for the higher or the larger um valves. So the one through 3 in and then a measurate increase in the residential variable rates. Um, currently the
proposal represents a 13% increase in both the fixed and variable rates for water. Um, the reason it's at 13% is this represents four quarters of the current rate if the board were to accept
the rates by the end of March. These rates would take effect for Q1 of 27, which would allow residents to have their rate known before their usage is used.
Um, I highlighted the debt service um in the FY27 actual water budget. The next slide shows what that represents. So this slide looks at our current borrowing uh capacity for the water
enterprise fund. Um as you can see um this looks at the outy years for the next four to five years for water. The current proposal uses a ban or a short-term borrowing in order
to align with the FY29 um debt service capacity of about $79,000 to complete the full borrowing for the water main in meters project. The reason that I'm proposing a short-term
borrowing for the first two years versus doing the initial borrowing up front is to give the board the option of a lower rate impact for the residents. If the board were to choose to do the full
borrowing upfront, um I would have to show a much higher rate increase um accordingly. So, we can have a discussion about that. Uh moving on to the sewer. Um sewer is in what I would feel a better position.
Um we also see the impact of Springfield water contract. It's about 120,000 increase in our expense line or about 21% of the total increase in the budget. Um we also have a request of main maintenance which is about 225,000 and
our expense line or about 40% of the total request. These two items make up a large majority of the of the budget and there's a small amount for debt service as well as you'll see in the upcoming slides. In the same way, time bond also
did uh some rate increases for um FY26 and going on with some much more modest increases in order to maintain two main goals which was to fund capital and to reach a select board goal of a million
dollars of retained earnings. One of the main points of the Thai bond presentation was the select board has a enterprise fund policy for both water and sewer of 500,000 in retained earnings.
Um as of FY25 or as of FY26 um sewer has 461,000 in its retained earnings and water has 852,000. So, as a result of prior year's rate increases, um we have hit the goal for
water of a minimum of 500,000 and are quickly approaching the million-doll retained earnings goal. Uh moving on to the next slide, uh you will see our rate increases proposed for sewer for FY27.
Um, as I spoke to earlier, um, with the one-time increase in fixed costs for FY26, this proposal has a decrease in the fixed rates for um, FY27
as well as a 5% increase in the variable rates for sewer metered rates. Um, if the board have questions about why this shows a decrease, I felt that it would be better represented to stay in line
with FY25 to FY26 rates. As if there was not a increase for quarters 2 through 4 to pick up the revenue shortfall, this would have been more in line with FY25 rates. The next slide shows the borrowing
impact on sewer. Um this looks um at the same kind of principle where for FY27 we would do a short-term borrowing for the slip lining project um with a full borrowing in FY28. Um sewer is in a much better position
where it has a substantial falloff in debt service capacity for um FY28. It's about $259,000 that is now available which would slot in really nicely for the slip lining project.
U moving on to the next slide. Uh just showing the two comparatively um for both water and sewer with both the budget impact of the full requests as well as the rates. Now, uh, the next slide just talks about briefly what these increases mean for
operations. Um, a question about what this increase in sewer main maintenance would mean. Um, I can have Lisa or Sean speak to it more, but essentially pipes have roof infiltration that needs to be ground out and cleared, which would reduce backups going forward. This has
not been done in a long time and should be part of ongoing maintenance for the system. um for valve exercising as we just heard about water main brakes. Um these allow us to isolate um where water brakes are. If the valves don't work, uh
expands the area that we have to cover in order to isolate this break, which costs time and money. Um this money would go towards replacing the valves that are outside of the main water main projects that are usually funded in capital. Now, all of this to be said, how does
this look for our residents? The last slide gives a comparative for low, average, and high users for FY27 for water and sewer rates. That's it. All right. Think anything to add before we start uh peppering the questions?
DPW, >> I can say it's been four hours and we haven't been able to isolate the leak in Williams Street because the valves are not been exercised. So, just kind of good timing to talk. Sorry. >> Do we have $10 million for a new tank by the way?
>> All right. >> We could get there. Things are going pretty well. >> Had to ask. Um I just I I will just say for uh our presentation purposes and just going forward I think for the uh we just go to the second to last slide the
resident cost comparison >> second to last >> uh yeah before the questions. Um I think that if given our increase in the last year uh I think that for these it would be helpful to put in the previous year
too. >> Sure. because that has our big jump. Um, and we we kind of knew that we were making a big swing and it would be going forward it would be less drastic.
>> Um, but I think so showing that I think is helpful and also people can know uh where where this stuff is going. Um then on uh oh one of the things I I think is also good to cover um we have the the
increase in the purchase of water and uh I think Lynn told me today what the uh their rate is going up 6%. Correct. Yes. So, I think that that's always helpful if we can get that out because that if we did absolutely nothing and
said we're not touching a single pipe and had no expenses again, we'd still have to raise water rates 6%. >> Yeah. >> And so, I think that's really important to pass on. >> Sure. >> Um, so other than that, you know, I think that this is well laid out. Uh,
we've we had a plan. Tai Bon uh gave us some good guidance on this and um this board has committed to to doing this work. Uh I think now it's just a question of um and we have people who are I I just got my uh electric bill
which is incredibly high for some reason. Uh even though I have solar panels and yada yada and gas is obviously absolutely destroying people with the rates and especially with our freezing cold winter. Um, so you know, we have to be cognizant of what people
can can bear, I think. Um, while also realizing the uh the commitment that we've made to making sure that our infrastructure works and DPW is funded to do that. Um, so, uh, I I appreciate, uh, that there's always a lot of thought
that goes into this and, um, but that's just something I I want us to to think about and, uh, how we want to be fair to our residents while covering our costs. I think that this year with the notice to people on what the rates are going to
be, we are going to have at least a little bit of well, you know, you don't know how the weather's going to be, but some curtailment on use. I think that people will maybe water a bit less because of the bills last year. Um, which is good. Um, but it's not good for
our uh our budget. So, uh, that's also something else to keep in mind. Um, so I will stop prattling on if anybody else has comments or questions. I I know this is we're not setting the rate tonight, but we need to have we're starting the conversation. So, Andrew
>> Oh, yeah. I um I actually thank you Ian for I spoke with Ian for an hour on this on Friday and I really after all my questions were answered I really felt you did a very thoughtful job. Um maybe it will benefit that board just to um explain some of the things that I kind of focused in on. Um my ultimate
conclusion was basically kind of agreeing with Ian. You know we're going he's proposing a 13% water increase which I think is good because it's more modest than obviously last year. I'm very I was very pleased to hear that we're in much better position with regard to the retain earnings. So that's
exactly what we're trying to achieve. The main focus of my questions were can you go to the borrowing impact water like the fourth slide with the green and the red bars about how we'd handle this borrowing frankly. So, he's proposing doing a the green bar is a firstear
short-term ban, which essentially is not a, you know, it's not ideal because it's just kind of holding position, not paying any principle on this. Um, but he told me and then obviously do the do the significant borrowing on in FY29. But I
asked him what it would take to actually do the borrowing like in a regular borrowing now. And he said that he'd have to raise next year from 13% to like 25% increase. And I just felt like kind of what Josh alluded to. I think I think that we are all very cognizant of what what the reaction and the reality is
from last year's giant increase. So I I think that that's a very thoughtful way of handling this and um I was glad to see the sewer was in a better position. Um so overall I think that we're kind of in a much more stable situation going forward for this year which was
good. Just to add to that so folks might have a better understanding of like the numbers involved. Um we're looking at about um it's an $8.5 million um project for the water man. Another million and a half to replace the water meters. Um
thankfully, uh DPW has some capital projects that have been borrowed for in the past which are completed and the town has the ability to reappropriate those funds to water projects or water borrowing specifically for equal longer
terms. This allows us to reduce the cost of our water main projects, our $8.5 million project by a significant amount. It essentially pushes it from 500,000 to or eight and a half million to about 8 million which saves us a considerable chunk of change. Um when the borrowing
comes online it's going to be about a $1.1 million hit to debt service. So that is a significant hit to the budget as well as our borrowing capacity. One of the reasons why Andrew and I discussed this as a short-term versus long-term thing is really looking at our
borrowing capacity in the next couple years. kind of strategize where our pain points are for upcoming projects. After the board just heard the presentation on the interconnection study in the water um the new tank I was trying to look at
what possible windows would be available for a project of that size and I mean we're looking at at least five years out if not longer to have any available window for something of that magnitude. So, I just want the board to understand that this is something that we do try to
plan in advance, but given the size of the water fund debt service already, due to the amount of projects that we're taking on, it becomes very difficult in the future to absorb this without rate impact. >> Ian, is it possible to in the future,
you know, let's say we wanted to have a 10-year plan for saving up for a new water tank. What would that make our ideal target for like retain earnings? Would it be like a couple hundred thousand dollars a couple hundred thousand dollars a year? Invest that, you know, just think about
it for the future. >> Sure, that's a great question. >> That's hopefully where it would come from. I mean, ideally, rather than outside of, you know, >> outside borrowing or something. >> Yeah, I had a similar type question, Ian. I'm wondering with some of this for kind of since we're looking at so many things from a finance perspective and
maybe you already do this, but do we sit with the finance committee and have them help us run different scenarios just so we can see what the different debt solutions are against I just think this could potentially help us tell the whole story to some of our residents as well.
and with having a finance committee getting them to help us look at kind of this in its totality, could we see different scenarios for for things like this and how it would impact the overall budget for the town? I just think that could help us have um like
more holistic conversations when we set these rates. Um because I think this makes sense in and of itself, but then as we start talking about the the the water tank in 10 years down the road and some of the other things we know we're going to be doing from a road improve, like I'm just thinking if we can see it
holistically, that might help us kind of feel super confident that yeah, this is how we should be kind of thinking about this. Um, and I don't know if you do that already and I'm just kind of new and I haven't really seen it yet, but that might be a great way for us to leverage that committee to help us make
some of these broader financial decisions. >> No, that's a great point. Um, in terms of already the committees in this specific committee, I'd like to give them a lot of kudos because they've really stepped up in terms of their involvement, um, the questions that they ask and really their outlook on the
future of the town. So that's this is definitely something I'd love to give to them in terms of you know leaning on them for help with this. Um one of the projects that they've been helping me a lot on is our Prop 2 and a half calculator in terms of seeing where we are where we are in terms of our levy
ceiling in the next couple years in terms of projecting that out to see where our fiscal cliff is. So that's something that they're very aware of and they actually just updated their messaging on their website to say that they were comfortable for the foreseeable future that we're not even
close to that point. So they really stepped up in terms of being involved with town projects and I think this is a great way for them to get more. >> Yeah, I agree. You actually you read my mind. I also think just coming up with the town meeting and what residents I think having that information
holistically that can help our residents understand as we vote in town meetings what this actually means to us as a whole. So, I just think the more we can engage the finance committee with you, Ian, and us, I just think that's uh more information for our residents because um
just how we have to fund things, all the different types of of funds we can and can't use. Residents every day don't understand all of that. And I think the more we can help them understand that, they might, you know, just it's easier when we have to vote in town hall and
town meetings and everything. Thank you. >> Great. Thank you. Um, yeah, thank you again for putting this together. I think from where we started three years ago and kind of like radically shifting our thinking on this to where we are now, I think you're probably seeing that we have fewer questions because it feels
like we are building on this conversation year year from year and uh building out in a productive way that makes sense and um and so I think that that's that's a really big positive. I think um you had asked what we may want to see at a future meeting and I think
one thing that would be helpful to me is that same slide that um we have up there. I see that you know with this short with this ban that you're proposing and then doing the main borrowing in um FY29.
Um I'm assuming that that will also correlate with a you know that will cause a massive rate increase in that year. So, kind of going back up a couple of slides, um, where you have, um, I
think it's, let's see, the fourth out of 14, uh, where you have like the outy years and what Tigen Bond had proposed as rate increases. If we if we could see if we do the 13% increase coming up,
what are those outyear rate increases? What do they look like? >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Thanks, Venique. That's actually, you know, we were talking about that before our meeting where some of the slides that we'd like to add in the next presentation is looking at those out years specifically what that looks like
for Springfield water and sewer increases because as you guys well know that is a large part of our budget that we are obligated to fund. So if we know going into next year 7% of this increase is Springfield Water Sewer. We know going into it if residents have
questions this is what's driving our rate increases. So, I'll definitely have that in the next round. >> Great. Yeah. Yeah. Because I think just um to I mean it shows the town what our plan is that these are the increases that we're expecting to make in the
upcoming years. And I do think that, you know, I will say the added benefit of doing a ban this uh for this initial borrowing is after such a big rate increase, there is, I think, some value to not doing another uh big rate increase, especially for everything Josh
talked about with the current environment and all of the um the increased cost of everything to give people some type of at least a little bit of relief here for a little while. Um that makes sense to me. And then uh what you also said about there not being
any really room for taking on additional debt service until five years out. I mean that in a way that that is good news because if we are going to do this water tank 10 years out. I mean that shows that there is a window there where uh you know we can really properly plan
for this and make sure that uh we have it makes minimal impact um to us. So >> um has speaking of more slides for you to add. Has Springfield I guess it's actually would go on the slide beneath. Has Springfield projected out their rate increases the next five years?
>> So great question. I was actually just looking at that before um before the presentation and they have a 5-year forecast up through 2031. So, I was kind of doing some quick math to see what um we would be looking at and it's pretty
uh it's pretty staggering uh coming up. So, it's something that I want to make sure that we have a long discussion on because it'll be impactful. >> Yeah. And um the other thing I I know you did a lot of work on this last year and maybe so maybe you have Excel spreadsheets with formulas that'll help
but if we um I'm a big advocate on the fixed rate if we uh and because it gives us a a steadier outwork on and we know that that money will come in. Um, so if if you can look into the impact of
raising our fixed rate, what does that do for our uh the rate increase and just going forward? Um, one, maybe we're just accelerating what time bonds have to do anyway. >> But, uh, if we're right sizing that
fixed rate, I think that can help us just projecting. Um, and then the other thing I think it's always helpful for us to see, but also anyone who looks at this, how are we comparing with the other towns? Because I know that we are,
I imagine, we're still behind. Um, but if we can look at what other uh comparable communities are doing, I think that that's good for us to to know and so to get that out. >> Yeah. >> But, uh, yeah, we are
It's working. Uh, and that's great. I know DPW's been uh has had the opportunity to do a lot of work that's very necessary and we're going to we're making a a more reliable water system for our town and sewers. So, that we're doing what we set out to do. Uh, it's
painful, but uh sometimes things are. And just kind of uh just building off of what I said before about how, you know, we it seems like we have fewer questions because now we have more of a plan and we're building off of it. Uh along those lines, I think I would like to also have
us vote on a water rate this month just for uh the reasons that you said that then our residents will know what the rates are before um you know, quarter one hits. Um you know, we I think we're meeting like every week this month. So uh you know, one of these meetings, I think we should
uh that you know we should we should take that boat and and get that taken care of this month. Then and then the question is how are we getting it out to people because that I think of everything else there was a communication problem last time we can send we'll send out a mailer again but
we got to >> do what we did last time plus >> anybody else >> Josh I'll jump in quick >> um appreciate yeah appreciate everyone's um points here I I do want to reiterate Josh what you said to totally agree on
the fixed rate. I mean, that's just something that that I've brought up previously uh where from a budgeting perspective, we especially with climate change and and not knowing exactly year to year what uh some of the user, our
water users, our residents uh might might be using for water or or lack thereof and the impact it has on our budget. This will give us annually um a good lens into the numbers that we're dealing with and
the projects ahead. So, I totally second you, Josh, in terms of, you know, making sure that that's something that that we're addressing moving forward. I think it's it's good budgeting for us to to address some of these large projects, which is what we have been doing. Um,
the other the other piece I I wanted to um bring up as well was just a question for you, Ian, on on the resident cost comparison. when I was looking at some of the the low, the average, and the high, do you have any insight in terms
of where like uh the numbers in terms of like how many households are are in the high versus average? And this is probably on a previous slide. It was just more a curiosity than anything. >> Yeah. Um, thanks Dan. I I don't have a
specific answer for you for like the breakdown of low versus average versus high. We're looking at specifically units used in order to get those. That's certainly something we can try to come back to you with an answer. But >> I will say the low user was someone who didn't irrigate and they just used, you
know, a handful of units every quarter. The average user maybe was a handful of units on the winter and then watered in the summer. And then the high user is just always using, you know, more than 20 units a quarter, let's just say. >> But I can get you what their units were.
>> Yeah. Yeah, I mean not not it was more curiosity but and then to what Venita just uh mentioned regarding the uh or maybe it was Josh just around the next the next building cycle. I do believe no matter how how often uh we're
communicating um to our residents that there's always going to be um some some questions. But I do think if we can try to get that vote in place soon so that we can at least make sure the residents
are aware of. >> Oh, mine froze. >> Mentioned earlier with Everbridge if that's something we could uh consider uh as well. Um, but I do think we try to be as proactive as as possible. Um, and
just finally, uh, just want to say thank you to you, um, as well, Ian, for all the work you did putting this together and Lisa and Sean, as as well. I think, you know, over the past few years, we've, you've been talking a lot about water sewer, and it's good to see that
we're in a a much better position than we were, you know, decades ago and just even a few years ago. So, um, really appreciate everyone's, uh, effort on this. >> Dan, you, just so you know, you cut out for a bit there. >> Oh. >> U,, well, we got you. I think we got the
gist. Yeah, you >> Sorry. >> Was important. Anyways, >> it was when you was when you were talking about communications. I think we got up until every Yeah. Sorry. Bad uh service here at the hotel. >> No problem. >> Um, yeah, I was just Yeah, Josh. I was just saying for communications, I don't
know if we could leverage potentially the tool Everbridge that that Lynn was talking about earlier in her report. Um but overcommunication you I think would be a good thing uh around the water rates. >> Okay. Yeah. All right. Anybody else before we move on?
>> Just real quick so I um can make sure that the conversation continues really well. What what I'm envisioning for the next meeting for the board is like two to three different proposals for the board so that they have you know a for
example here's what the rate would be if we do the bare minimum we keep the lights on we don't do any projects here's what the rates would be here's what um we do a couple projects um and then the full boat so you kind of see like a gamut of everything would that
work for the board in terms of a understanding of what the different options are >> absolutely. >> Okay. >> All right. >> The only other thing I wanted to add is when we looked at those bar graphs and we're pushing out the borrowing to 29, we're hoping by that point our retained earnings has climbed enough that we're
comfortable to use some retained earnings to cover the services. So even though the bar graph looks like 30% bigger, you're not going to see a 30% increase that year. Okay. >> That's the kind of planning we like. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Great. Thank you. >> Thank Thank you all. >> Thank you.
All right. Uh, next we have the TRA recommendation for designation of school safety. Lyn, is this you or Chief? >> Yes. Um, I'm happy to to take part in this. Uh, but Chief Stocks is here to speak to to this as well. Um, there is a
memo attached to your agenda. Uh, and this was a topic of discussion at our most recent traffic and roads advisory group meeting. Uh and the outcome of that or the takeaway of that meeting was uh essentially um the group was going to
recommend to the select board uh a um path forward um that was brought to us by one specific request but we looked at it more broadly. So happy to have Chief Stocks fill you in. >> Thank you Lyn. Um yeah, as Lynn indicated, we had a citizen come forward
with a concern about um the traffic he perceived on Hopkins Place due to pickup and drop off at St. Mary's Academy. Uh we deployed our speed trailer, we deploy deployed some directed patrols. Um and
while we didn't u didn't record the data that uh met or corroborated uh the citizens concerns um one issue he did bring forward was that the zone isn't uh demarcated as a school
zone. Um when we went out there it is technically there are the signs that show the students walking to school. However, the speed zone isn't um set. So, we had some discussion at the track level. Um, again, there's really the data we were able to record doesn't show
a lot of speeding in Hopkins, nor have we had any incidents in my history there. Um, but the roadway, Bliss Road in Hopkins Place, uh, both by Mass General Law, um, the town can set that school zone. Any street that abuts the
property of a school can be set to 20 miles an hour per chapter 852 and chapter 9017. Um, I'm all for it. Uh, again, it's not that we have a lot of speeding cars there, but to me, it's it's it makes
good sense to to um post that again, the roadway sections that abut the school property of St. Mary's. Um, and then when we looked at it a little bit more broadly, we determined that um there's a few other schools that aren't posted u namely Yeshiva Academy. So, the statute
doesn't just limit it to municipal, city, and and public schools. that can be private institutions as well. Um, and then we looked around further. Williams Middle School, obviously with a new middle school being built, there is a section of Williams uh that uh Williams Street that's not that long, but
technically that roadway that's going to be um abuing the property of the new middle school that currently is not um posted 20 m hour. Uh we do have the high school that's taken care of. As you know, we have the speed display signs. Uh Blueberry Hill School is fine. Um,
center school ironically has Route Five is posted 20 miles an hour, but when you look at the roadway inside the east part of the green, the one that's right in front of the school, that is not posted 20. Not sure why. Um, but it's been that way since I've been here. So, these are
things um, we just wanted to bring it forward to you uh, the select board to either um, approve or deny. Um, but I think again it makes good sense to mo to post the roadways that are abuing our schools at 20 mph zone. Um, the only caveat to that is Willy's Will Willie
Ross School, which is right around the corner here. Technically, that falls into this whole conversation, but it is on the corner of two side streets. I'm not even sure if it would be applicable. It's not that I'm turning a blind eye to their safety. I just don't really think uh I don't know
how we could do that. Um, so that would be the only school I think that would uh cause a little bit more logistical issues. Uh, yeshiva being Conver Street, you know, we'd have to put in some some signage. Uh, DPW has left, but you know, we'd want to work closely with them to make sure we're doing it in a most
cost-effective but logistical manner that we're doing it correctly. Obviously, with the MUTCD, uh, municipal uh, excuse me, the manual and uniform traffic and control devices. If you're having trouble sleeping, that's a good one. Um but you know there are certain demarcations that need you
need to have some um advanced notice of a roadway speed limit uh posting and all that. So uh sorry for droning on but um that's pretty much what the track came across. Again fortunately we don't have the issue of the the initial traffic complaint on Hopkins Place but I think
it did open some great conversation. >> Uh thank you. This is I don't see any downside to it. If you support it I I think that this is a great idea. Um I you might not know the answer to this but I my wife has a fancy new car and
when you are going now when you approach a school it says approaching school zone. Doesn't matter what else you have on the screen it pops up. Is that something I don't know if it's reading the signs because I know it looks at speed signs but is that something we can report to to Google Maps or Apple Maps
or anything? >> So I'd have to look with the DPW on that one. I believe it's a I don't know have a a great answer. I think some some vehicles have built-in technology uh where it's able to read certain signs. Um it's able to read the speed limit signs. I know there's certain vehicles that are allowed to do that. Others are
uh ways after, you know, we'll we'll start getting the reports from municipalities. Um so I think it's a combination. I'm not sure I uh it's a one uh quick answer for that. But I think over time it'll be self-reported. Um but when we do something like this, we would be notifying DOT as well. Okay.
>> And DOT might be the the conduit to those those programs. Yeah, that's great because I I even better than maybe in addition to a sign, it's nice having that in your >> phone, especially if it's dark or something. Absolutely. It just pops up and it is I find it to be a good
attention getter. >> So, yeah, that's great. Um, yeah. Any other questions for the rest of the board? >> Um, so what action do we need to take now? >> Uh, well, you can you can wait until your next meeting. It's generally, you know, following that same idea. Um the
idea was that uh the select board would um support the track committee's recommendation and then we would order signs >> and this is within uh these are all well most of these are the street setters are within TRA's control
>> uh per our policy right so we're just supporting are we supporting what TRA does or are we doing something >> um you're supporting the recommendation um I guess it's one and the same I you're approving it. It's a permanent
placement. Um I guess part of why we wanted it to come here is because the initial request came in for one school, but as TRA started looking at it, we thought, well, really there's applicability for all the other schools. Why would we only do the one that >> that brought it forward to us? So, we
just felt like for equity, um we thought it should be broadened out for the others. >> Yeah. I think especially for uh Yeshiva and Williams on two very busy streets. Yeshiva, especially on Converse down there. I think that that's a great idea to have that. And I guess I never realized we didn't have it there. That's
u I think it's very smart of us to do that. >> I agree. >> I can I can make a motion if we want to vote on it. >> Yeah, I'm fine. I'm fine with that. >> Okay. Um so I will move to establish uh 20 mile hour school zones on the portions of Bliss Road and Hopkins Place
abudding St. Mary's Academy um as well as establishing um 20 mile per hour school zones in other areas as recommended by TRA uh
that lack formal school zone designations currently. >> Second. >> Anything further? >> Mr. Deine, >> yes. >> Mr. Demathy, >> yes. >> Miss Mayor, >> yes. >> Mr. Lamb, >> yes. >> Mr. Yes.
>> Thank you, Chief. >> Thank you, everyone. Appreciate your time. >> I can't believe she didn't want to stay for this, but uh we are now last up is designate our animal control officer, which is we do this annually, right? >> Yes. >> Yeah.
>> All right. I will move to um I will move to appoint uh Marty Lee Karamanti as our 2026 animal control officer. >> Second.
>> All right. Anything further? >> Sine. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Wolf. >> Yes. >> Mr. Lamb. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Thank you. >> I will entertain a motion to adjurnn. So moved.
>> Second. >> I'm sorry. >> Yes. >> Mr. Lofty. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Thank you. >> Good night. Thank you. >> Thanks, D. >> Good night. >> Thank you.