WEBVTT METADATA Video-Count: 1 Video-1: youtube.com/watch?v=UDmPaTPodlA NOTE MEETING SECTIONS: Part 1 (Video ID: UDmPaTPodlA): - 00:01:01: Call to Order, Pledge, Roll Call, Agenda Approval - 00:03:15: Public Hearing: Prairie Vista Preliminary Plat Introduction - 00:11:16: Opening Public Hearing: Initial Questions and Concerns - 00:13:32: Public Comment: Land Name, Water Drainage, and Flooding - 00:16:29: Public Comment: Concerns About 4th Avenue Exclusion - 00:20:39: Public Comment: Holding Pond Location and Woods Usage - 00:24:13: Public Comment: Housing Types, Traffic, Dogs, Problems - 00:30:01: Public Comment: Pond Depth, Child Safety, and Concerns - 00:30:40: Closing Public Hearing and New Business Discussion - 00:31:16: Discussing Joe's Lot Access and Potential Solutions - 00:36:21: Cost Feasibility Analysis and Joint Discussions - 00:41:31: Tree Line Discussion and Working with Rice County - 00:44:20: Verbiage Discussion: Exploring Elm and Dogwood Opening - 00:47:12: Staff Recommendations, County Improvements, Snow Storage - 00:51:21: Snow Storage and Rice County Improvements Discussion - 00:55:42: Small Houses, Impervious Surface, and Snow Plowing Concerns - 00:58:00: Motion to Approve Preliminary Plat with Conditions - 01:00:16: Reschedule July Planning Meeting and Zoning Discussion - 01:01:34: Review City Code 153.003 Definitions Introduction - 01:04:50: Attorney Comments and Definition of 'Abutting' - 01:05:42: Accessory Use, Agriculture and Animal Hospital Definitions - 01:09:08: Automobile Repair, Service Station and Basement Definitions - 01:12:12: Butcher Shop and Meat Market Definitions Discussion - 01:13:33: Defining the Terminology of Church and Related Facilities - 01:16:06: More Clarity on Clinic and Private Club Lodges - 01:18:12: Car Wash, Commercial Kennel, and Commercial Wireless Definitions - 01:20:08: Conditional Use, Condominium, and Convenience Facility Definitions - 01:23:34: Automotive Service Station Definition and Debate - 01:26:45: Dance, Health, Martial Arts and Daycare Definitions - 01:29:18: Drive-Thru and Dwelling Definitions - 01:31:41: Family, Financial Institutions and Funeral Home Definitions - 01:33:38: Remains, Crematorium Definitions and Public Concern - 01:35:32: Homework, Next Meeting, and Adjournment Part: 1 1 00:01:01.039 --> 00:01:17.799 Good. >> All right. like to call this uh PL planning and zoning commissioning meeting uh Monday, May 18th, 2026 >> at 700 p.m. 2 00:01:18.720 --> 00:01:34.640 >> We can uh stand in Oh, actually, do we do call to order? Sorry. And then we're going to stand do a pledge of allegiance. Sorry. >> To the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it 3 00:01:34.640 --> 00:01:51.600 stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. >> All right, we'll move on to uh roll call. >> Uh Mike Harding here, Reagan Anderson >> here, >> Jeremy Briner 4 00:01:51.600 --> 00:02:05.600 >> here, >> Council Member Vasitka >> here, >> and Tim Kesh >> here. Um, Mr. Chair, Mike Conu reached out to me earlier tonight and said he was not able to attend this meeting. >> Okay. 5 00:02:05.600 --> 00:02:22.640 >> All right. Uh, moving on to the approval of the agenda. Has everybody had a chance to review it? Adds, changes, deletions. If there are none, I'll entertain a motion. >> Motion. >> Motion by Mike. 6 00:02:22.640 --> 00:02:36.400 >> Second. >> Second by Reagan. All in favor? >> I I Anybody opposed? >> All right. Um, but the approval of the minutes, I don't 7 00:02:36.400 --> 00:03:00.080 think we have any, do we? >> Click on >> Oh, the last week's minutes. So, you guys had uh reviewed them as well, right? Is there any >> any uh changes that need to be made or updated 8 00:03:00.080 --> 00:03:15.599 for the minutes last last week's meeting minutes. I didn't have any. >> If there are none, I'll take a motion. >> Motion. >> Motion by Reagan. >> Second. >> Second by Tim. All in favor? >> I. None approved. None opposed. 9 00:03:15.599 --> 00:03:31.680 Moving on to the uh public hearing. Public hearing for land use application 2026-01 Prairie Vista Preliminary Plat. >> Uh thank you, Mr. Chair, and good evening uh planning commission. Uh first on the agenda tonight is our public 10 00:03:31.680 --> 00:03:47.120 hearing. as you stated for land use application 2026-01 Prairie Vista Preliminary Pla. Uh Scott Lumis, owner of SML Holdings LLC submitted land use application 2026-01 11 00:03:47.120 --> 00:04:01.840 Prairie Vista Preliminary Pla on April 16, 2026. The subject property platted area is 32.3 acres. uh is proposed to be the Prairie Vista development. As we spoke before with the the site, the 12 00:04:01.840 --> 00:04:19.600 concept site, 99 total residential lots. Uh staff have been working with SML Holdings LLC to address city code 152.21 data data for preliminary plat requirements um and staff concerns. Staff have 13 00:04:19.600 --> 00:04:36.000 requested SML Holdings LLC to incorporate city and Rice County requirements into the Prairie Vista preliminary plant. Uh, as far as comments from Rice County, uh, as you can see here from the staff report, Rice County Highway Department transportation 14 00:04:36.000 --> 00:04:52.800 plan requirements, two eastbound eastbound right turn lanes will be required in lie of the continuous center left turn lane. Two westbound bypass lanes will be required. A left turn lane is preferred. However, a cons continuous center left lane 15 00:04:52.800 --> 00:05:08.320 cannot be provided. Uh two westbound bypass lanes will be required. Any additional rightaway needed to accommodate these improvements must be acquired and dedicated to the county. Uh improvements uh required by the city lawn sale should be incorporated into a 16 00:05:08.320 --> 00:05:23.840 single coordinated plan to allow for concurrent review of by both agencies. uh minimum design speed of 45 miles per hour should be used for all applicable design elements. Uh in coordination with the city, 17 00:05:23.840 --> 00:05:39.280 additional roadway improvements outside the project limits may be undertaken at the expense of the city and county. The delivery method for these improvements is currently under discussion. The total cost of the required physical uh improvements associated with the 18 00:05:39.280 --> 00:05:54.080 development will be der be determined by determined based on the on an impro approval final design. It is anticipated that these costs will be provided to the county as a part of a single corridor reconstruction project. Uh final 19 00:05:54.080 --> 00:06:11.120 driveway geometrics uh with radi uh and taper length shall be reviewed and approved during final design to ensure adequate vehicle accommodation including emergency and service vehicles. Uh site distance has not been evaluated. The 20 00:06:11.120 --> 00:06:27.919 applicant shall confirm that the proposed access locations provide adequate sight distance in accordance with applicable standards. Uh SML Holdings submitted their May 13, 2026 updated Prairie Vista preliminary development showing 50-foot rideway for 21 00:06:27.919 --> 00:06:44.400 County Road 96. Uh the amount of rideway will be determined by Rice County's required improvements and city trail. Uh based on the staff review here, uh staff requested the following updates. Incorporate a 10-ft wide trail on the 22 00:06:44.400 --> 00:07:00.319 south side of County Road 96. The length of the development and the rideway. The city's minimum standard trail width is 8 ft. Uh SML Holdings on their five on their May 13, 2026 updated Prairie Vista preliminary development showing an 8 23 00:07:00.319 --> 00:07:17.280 foot by 2 minutes trail along the east and west sides of the development. South side of County Road 96, east side east of street A and east side of street B. Uh incorporate lot one and block numbers uh be entered into the preliminary plat 24 00:07:17.280 --> 00:07:34.960 starting with one. uh SML Holdings added lot one and block numbers in the preliminary preliminary plat starting with one to further uh another finding that staff came up with is to further define all 25 00:07:34.960 --> 00:07:52.479 split level SL lots SML holdings LLC define all lots with house types. Uh, one of the questions that did uh come up at the council level uh was that uh no trees rem be removed in the 4th Avenue 26 00:07:52.479 --> 00:08:13.360 Northeast City rightway. Uh, SML Holdings did confirm that tree number 169 located at pond one is in the city's rightway and is required to be removed for water mane installed and storm water ponding. Note, uh staff are not in favor of the 27 00:08:13.360 --> 00:08:29.280 high water level, uh boundaries that overlaps into the drainage and utility easements in the private lots and backyard flooding will occur. Staff have granted the granted the request from SML Holdings to keep them where they are 28 00:08:29.280 --> 00:08:45.760 where they are at at to allow larger lots. We're just going on record that there are some steep uh or there there is some elevations back in their backyards, but um flooding will occur uh with heavy rains. 29 00:08:45.760 --> 00:09:01.680 SML Holdings LLC uh plotting platting a 50-ft rideway to account for small utilities and a 29.34 basically a 29 ft uh street width which will require no parking on one side of the street. that 30 00:09:01.680 --> 00:09:18.080 has been previously discussed. I just want to make sure that this is kept on record. Uh staff issued the 10-day public hearing notification which was advertised in the Lawndale area news review commencing May 5th, 2026 and mailed uh the public hearing notice 31 00:09:18.080 --> 00:09:37.279 letter to property owners within 350 ft of the parcel. Uh, council member Voseka informed staff on May 10th, 2026 at Eric Scholclusk >> uh at 87357th Street West. Shared his concerns 32 00:09:37.279 --> 00:09:53.600 regarding the Prairie Vista development. Uh his concerns included that property values in the area due to smaller houses and lot sizes would go down and what is being stored at Donnie Smeichek's 33 00:09:53.600 --> 00:10:09.519 stating a desire for screening the east side of the property as well with the upcoming development in the area. Uh other public comments uh focus on the 4th Avenue Northwest not being improved to provide access to lots of the 4th 34 00:10:09.519 --> 00:10:26.000 Avenue Northwest. If additional public comments are received during the notice period, staff will present them at the Planning and Zoning Commission May 18, 2025 public hearing. Uh, as far as your attachments go tonight, uh, land use application 2026-01, 35 00:10:26.000 --> 00:10:43.680 Prairie Vista preliminary plat, the public hearing notice, city code 152.21, data for preliminary plat, and then the Prairie Vista preliminary plat. So, Mr. Chair, that concludes my report as for 36 00:10:43.680 --> 00:11:16.640 the public hearing. >> One correction, you had it dated 2025 at the end. Should be 2026. >> Thank you. >> Okay. And Cory, is this where we open it up for? 37 00:11:16.640 --> 00:11:33.200 >> Um, that's I gave my report. I'm looking for a motion to close that public hearing. >> No. Uh, to conduct a public hearing. >> Okay. So, um, I'll take a motion to open the public hearings. >> Motion. Motion made made by Mike 38 00:11:33.200 --> 00:11:48.720 Harding. >> Second. >> Seconded by Reagan. All All in favor? >> I >> I opposed. Carries forward. >> All right. The floor is open for the public hearing. >> There's anybody that uh wants to speak. 39 00:11:48.720 --> 00:12:04.880 Um go ahead and come up to the podium, state your name, your address. >> Just because there's microphones. That's the only reason. So that if people are watching Yes. I'd like somebody to get up there and explain exactly where I am over 40 00:12:04.880 --> 00:12:23.440 there >> and and tell me what direction it's going because I I don't quite understand it. >> Well, this will be north. So, your house is be around that corner. >> So, we're going to have a pond right in our backyard there. 41 00:12:23.440 --> 00:12:40.079 >> Huh? >> Correct. >> There's already there's already wet land. >> Yeah, we know. We know we already got a crick back there. Okay. And who picked the name for this? 42 00:12:40.079 --> 00:12:58.240 >> Uh the developer. >> Well, why does he get to pick >> his project? I mean, I guess it has to be >> Well, it's behind my house. It's my town. I'm just asking. >> There's a developer right there. You can ask him if he wants to change it. >> Yeah, I'd like to change it. 43 00:12:58.240 --> 00:13:14.320 >> I don't intend on changing. We actually had it named Prairie People. We changed it to Prairie Vista because Prairie View already has a development name. >> Well, why can't it be something that refers to our town to our people? >> Like what? 44 00:13:14.320 --> 00:13:32.000 >> Like Kat View or Katada Prairie? The Kadas lived in that. That was mostly their land. And I feel that they really contributed to this community more than anybody that I know of. And I really feel in my heart that it should be called that. 45 00:13:32.000 --> 00:13:48.240 >> I don't want to say that. >> Well, because you don't know. You're not talking about what you know. You don't know people. You don't know our history. >> But I'm just saying I believe that it should be called Kadata Prairie. And I'm worried about the water. Where are you going to direct all that water to? Is that going to go through lawn still then? 46 00:13:48.240 --> 00:14:04.959 >> Correct. >> Well, am I going to be floating along with it or what? >> No. >> No. You're sure? Our engineers have done the done the review. I think there's still some some calcs to do, but >> yeah, they have um storm water 47 00:14:04.959 --> 00:14:21.680 permitting that they have to meet the standards of >> and then I was wondering how come you left the little acreage over there for from the roof. Why did you install go on that >> left? >> Yeah, on the left here that little parcel there >> that's uh not my property. 48 00:14:21.680 --> 00:14:54.560 >> Well, it's for sale. Why did you purchase that? I had no intention of purchasing it and that was uh the soils aren't suitable for building there as well. >> Who do we call when we're flooding? Um well, it's going to be outlined out outleting. Um it's going to go into the 49 00:14:54.560 --> 00:15:11.680 the open ditch on the west side of fourth >> and then um enter the city storm sewer at >> fourth and Sy's house in that little bitty >> behind Yep. >> Is that going to be closed then? >> It's going to be cleaned all out again or 50 00:15:11.680 --> 00:15:29.120 >> uh we had talked about um making those improvements. It's pretty overgrowing down in there. >> Yep. >> Do you guys get flooding? No. >> Lots. That whole bottom area is just a dump. Everything we got as far north. 51 00:15:29.120 --> 00:15:46.079 >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Rogers basically all the way down. >> We have water sometimes straight across or even ahead of our old chicken house that we have behind the house there. It's up in front of that sometimes. >> I've seen it go across 96 there too 52 00:15:46.079 --> 00:16:29.519 before. or close to it. >> So, do we think this will help? >> Uh, I don't know if it's going to help. >> I was just curious. >> Not that far north, >> right? Any other comments? >> Good evening. I like me changing that 53 00:16:29.519 --> 00:16:55.320 name. >> I do too. >> Um I don't know if you guys got copies at all of what I gave to Joel here about a week and a half ago. Can I give them to him or >> Oh, you can. Yeah. slide around there. 54 00:17:03.440 --> 00:17:19.280 I live at 225th Avenue Northwest in Lonsil here. I'm speaking today regarding a development referred to as Prairie View Lonzil concept 4 which I understand has changed now. I want to be very clear I'm not opposed to the this development. My concern is specifically 55 00:17:19.280 --> 00:17:35.360 about the intention to exclude any portion of 4th Avenue Northwest from the project. I own the residential lot shown on the map you have under the original plat. This lot would have been a corner lot on 4th Avenue Northwest. As the development is currently shown, 56 00:17:35.360 --> 00:17:51.840 my lot becomes landlocked. There would be no legal or practical access to enter the property. I was advised to contact Rice County to request a driveway directly onto the county road. I did that. The county told me I would need to apply for a variance. And based on my 38 57 00:17:51.840 --> 00:18:08.240 years as a contractor, I know the county is extremely restrictive about new entrances on their roads. The chances of receiving that variance are very slim. Um, even if I somehow obtained it, it would be additional costs and I would still face the issue of city sewer and 58 00:18:08.240 --> 00:18:23.280 water hookups and the visual impact would be similar to the situation on the east side of Main Street. Cars and trailers parked along the county road. Also, the house would have to be turned the opposite way facing north completely opposite of all the other 59 00:18:23.280 --> 00:18:40.080 houses on either side. If any of you or any member of the city council owned this lot, I'm confident you would not want to put be put in this position. This lot should be worth around 60,000 plus. But if it becomes landlocked, I'd be lucky to receive the 60 00:18:40.080 --> 00:18:54.480 10,000 that's quoted on the tax statement. This is a massive loss created entirely by the decision to omit a flooded roadway. And I'm not saying this roadway would have to go all the way through. I understand that. But there's plenty of 61 00:18:54.480 --> 00:19:11.840 dead ends in Lonsdale. I live on one and they are kind of attractive to a lot of people. I love it there. No traffic. I've been told I have even been told that maybe I should stop paying taxes and let the lot become city property. This is not a reasonable or appealing al 62 00:19:11.840 --> 00:19:27.440 alternative for me or anyone. None of you would do it. Get nothing for it. I have spoken with an attorney as you can see on the paperwork there. My intention is not to delay or obstruct this project unless I have absolutely no 63 00:19:27.440 --> 00:19:43.840 other choice. What I am asking is simple and fair. I'm requesting this commission recommend the city council that approval of this devel development be contingent on resolving this access issue before the project is allowed to proceed. Whether that means constructing 64 00:19:43.840 --> 00:20:00.080 in the northern portion of 4th Avenue Northwest or providing an acceptable access solution, my lot must not be left landlocked. Please consider that. Like I said, if any one of you guys owned it, you wouldn't want to take a $50,000 plus 65 00:20:00.080 --> 00:20:30.600 loss either. So, please consider it. Thank you. >> Thanks, Joe. All right. Any more comments? There's none. We'll go ahead and close. >> Oh, hang on. One more. >> Sorry. Go ahead. 66 00:20:39.760 --> 00:20:57.520 >> My name is Ger. My wife and I own that acre, which is on the I guess northwest side. And I'm wondering if the sheets you guys sent us, this one 67 00:20:57.520 --> 00:21:19.080 has a holding pond in that area. Would you like to see what I'm talking about here? >> No, I'm not. It's not on that. >> It looks like it's to the south of your property. >> Yeah, I'll show you. 68 00:21:23.440 --> 00:21:44.880 Now, is it >> okay? >> Yeah, it doesn't. Um, this is the bottom here. >> They're not going >> No. Where where is this? >> So, 69 00:21:44.880 --> 00:22:08.320 extended out there. >> Correct. >> Okay. Yep. This is >> just not a big enough. >> Yeah. So that basically gets you to like right here. >> Yep. >> I'm sorry. >> It's not on this property. 70 00:22:08.320 --> 00:22:28.400 >> What's that other yellow area? >> That's the big holding Um, oh no, that's the current wetland that's out there. >> Oh, you're not doing anything with that? >> Are you restoring it? >> It'll hold more water. That's going to 71 00:22:28.400 --> 00:22:52.960 take the water from the north there. There's a cold that actually runs underground there. So, that'll hold that water and disperse it through the system. So the whole process >> question is Rudy's road going to be 72 00:22:52.960 --> 00:23:08.640 there yet then? >> Uh it shouldn't be based off of the the storm improvements. >> So is the DNR letting you cut all those cactuses down and all that in that wetland? I thought that was against law and chopping that all down. You'll have a I'm assuming you have a 73 00:23:08.640 --> 00:23:27.919 replacement plan that'll be approved by the um wacka >> based off the wetland grade. We're able to drop the wetland and restore it in our per so then that flooding doesn't happen on the road. 74 00:23:27.919 --> 00:23:48.080 >> You're not raising the road? >> No. All looks great on paper, but I don't know. And how about that little woods by S? Is that yours or N? 75 00:23:48.080 --> 00:24:13.760 >> I'm not sure. >> What's happening to that wood? >> That would be allotted to the city of the city. and elevations of everything. >> And what kind of housing is this going to be? >> Um, this would be single family, um, 76 00:24:13.760 --> 00:24:28.960 detached housing. So, it'll be, you know, split entries, ramblers, two stories, slab upgrades, and villas, and multiple different products. >> So, does that mean it'll have a basement? Yes, some will have a basement, but some of them can't just because of the water elevation. So, 77 00:24:28.960 --> 00:24:44.320 there'll be slab upgrades like pillow product and stuff like that. >> And according to this, I believe you're having two exits in and out and entrances. Is that correct? >> Correct. >> You think that's enough for all those houses? >> Yes. 78 00:24:44.320 --> 00:25:05.960 >> Who said that? >> Engineer. >> Oh, yeah. College. Okay. So that'll be 100 more dogs in town, huh? >> At least 79 00:25:08.640 --> 00:25:27.200 >> chickens. >> Forget about the chickens. >> What do you anticipate as the biggest problem doing this project? >> There's a lot of hurdles. So I don't >> And how long is this project going to 80 00:25:27.200 --> 00:25:47.200 take? >> Roughly four years from the start. >> You know what that one? >> Four years from the time you start. >> Yeah. >> When will this starting be? >> It's all depending on the rules and everything participating this year. 81 00:25:47.200 --> 00:26:07.960 season. There's still a lot of work through >> the name of one. >> The name you don't want to piss me off. >> Let's ask these guys. 82 00:26:08.880 --> 00:26:24.880 >> I feel we should vote on the name if you're going to be pushing this through. And I'm not sure about those holding ponds. How much water are we talking? How deep are we docking there? >> Um, I'm not the engineer, so that's all my engineers here actually helps and everything for that. And since previous 83 00:26:24.880 --> 00:26:41.679 developments, there's been a higher rate of return for collection of ponding. So these ponds here are actually sized a lot larger than existing ponds in current neighborhoods and everything. The rainfall has been more when they started the Atlas 13 rule. So these are 84 00:26:41.679 --> 00:26:57.039 sufficient ponds here. What's the uh size of this pond? Are we talking like how big? >> Um so you can see somewhere like u there's just multiple components to this and how everything travels through the site is treated. Um you know one of 85 00:26:57.039 --> 00:27:13.679 these is 65 acres doesn't have an acreage on it but uh they're also size sufficient based off of um requirements engineering requirements and city engineers recommendations and overview. >> Okay. These families are going to be 86 00:27:13.679 --> 00:27:30.400 moving with children and dogs and chickens and who knows what else. How do you keep these kids out of these ponds? >> They're not that deep. They're not >> Well, it doesn't take much for a child to drown in a pond. >> There's ponds throughout the whole entire >> Yeah, there's problems with all that. If you really check into your homework, 87 00:27:30.400 --> 00:27:44.640 there's lots of problems in those communities with kids going skating, falling through the water. I'm just updating here. I and you just told me that you don't know what the depth is going to be. So that worries me. 88 00:27:44.640 --> 00:28:08.640 >> I'm not here. The high water based off based on you know >> Well, I'm just saying you got a pond here. There's a swimming pool down there also in somebody's house and they had a legally the city made them put a fence around it. So I'm wondering how come you 89 00:28:08.640 --> 00:28:25.600 can put all these ponds in and not have a fence around it. How does the cattle get out at Simons or SC? They're going to travel over to that property and swap around in your pond. >> There's ponds everywhere. >> Well, not the country right next door 90 00:28:25.600 --> 00:28:41.520 across the street. You got cattle. >> Yeah, there's if you didn't have ponds. >> I can't wait to see those lines. I have to kind of stick up for a little bit because they require holding ponds for the >> developments. >> I understand that but my my question is 91 00:28:41.520 --> 00:28:58.480 I'm concerned all about the kids and like I said how many times have cattle or something got out >> you know and they come I worry that they were going to go in my pool one day said I had to put a fence up so I had to put a fence up and neighborhood kids out too 92 00:28:58.480 --> 00:29:13.520 was in my pool too. She was a momoid. There's all kinds of different areas here to consider. Not just you're going to put up a bunch of $100 and you're you're stuck with it. There's other alternatives here that we have to consider. 93 00:29:13.520 --> 00:29:40.600 >> There's no city ordinance around the city. >> Yeah. It's very uncom. >> Well, I don't know. I'm not really for this. >> I see too many. 94 00:29:43.840 --> 00:30:01.919 I would say based on the average water level, you're looking 8 to 10 feet deep. What? >> Based off a grading plan. >> That's as deep as my swimming pool. That's deep. >> Is it zero entry though? Would you all 95 00:30:01.919 --> 00:30:17.919 like a slope to 8 ft? It's not drop off to 8 ft. >> Uh yeah, there's It looks like there's a a bench on a couple of them. >> Would you go build somewhere else? >> Well, there's all kinds of everywhere 96 00:30:17.919 --> 00:30:40.240 else and we want to be in our backyard alone. >> I don't like you. >> All right. If there's uh anybody else, no other comments, we'll uh take a motion to close the public hearing. >> Motion. >> Motion by Mike. Second. 97 00:30:40.240 --> 00:30:57.520 >> Second by Reagan. All in favor? I. >> I. None opposed. >> Forward. So there's a approval of the consent agenda. There's none. Uh there's no old business. The new business is consider approval of 98 00:30:57.520 --> 00:31:16.799 land use application 2026-01 Prairie Vista Preliminary Pl. >> Uh thank you, Mr. Chair. Land use application 20 2026-01 Prairie Vista preliminary plat was reviewed prior to this agenda to this 99 00:31:16.799 --> 00:31:32.320 agenda uh item under public hearing. The commission consider uh public comments received prior to or at the meeting. Staff is seeking the commission to consider approval of the land use application uh Prairie Vista preliminary plat for 100 00:31:32.320 --> 00:31:49.919 council approval uh contingent upon conditions. So, Mr. Mr. Chair, it's time to open up and get the planning commission's feedback here. >> Okay. >> So, Mr. Chair, floor is yours. >> All right. Um, anybody have uh taken in 101 00:31:49.919 --> 00:32:10.080 on all the uh com public comments? Um, anybody want to say anything? You want to add anything? I do think that uh you know in in spite of uh you know what Joe had provided us 102 00:32:10.080 --> 00:32:27.919 and this landlock in his uh his his land. Um, I think we should at least put something, you know, in preliminary to have, you know, an come up somebody come up with an idea to, you 103 00:32:27.919 --> 00:32:44.480 know, free up so that, you know, he has access to that land or >> is there right away on that plot? >> Uh, yes, >> cuz it would still stay there. Yeah, >> correct. Um, how far past your lot, Joe, 104 00:32:44.480 --> 00:33:00.960 does it drop off to where you couldn't be building at all? >> Pass the lot. >> Pass your lot. >> Four, five lots. >> So, there could be four or five lots possibly there and stuff. >> Have you talked to any of those guys if they'd be willing? Cuz I imagine I 105 00:33:00.960 --> 00:33:17.720 imagine, you know, if by some miracle it would happen, you're going to have a big sewer and water expense. He's not going to do it for nothing. Typically, it's included in the development. Let's speak in front of the 106 00:33:19.600 --> 00:33:42.399 >> I don't know. I mean, it'd be pretty um to ask him to run sewer and water for something he's not going to gain anything on. >> Well, what am I gaining? >> You got a lot of years ago, right? It's a beautiful lot. It's a good size. 107 00:33:42.399 --> 00:34:01.279 Very good size lot. >> Yeah. >> And it goes from 60,000 plus to actually nothing. >> Are you willing to pay 100,000 for it? That's what he's saying the costs are going to be. >> Or more. >> So, I mean, 108 00:34:01.279 --> 00:34:18.879 >> I didn't say 60,000. >> Yeah. I mean, uh, if if you know he's going to do it. He's saying his costs are around $100,000 >> to run that cost me a good $50,000 to walk away from it. >> Yeah. 109 00:34:18.879 --> 00:34:38.720 >> Yeah. So, I mean, >> yeah, but if that Fort Street still stays there, it it's just like a dirt lot or not dirt like a road, >> an improved road, >> you know? I mean, we've got that between our house and that 10 flex there. 110 00:34:38.720 --> 00:35:13.119 >> But you'd still have to have sewer and water coming to it. Water isn't as big an issue as >> sewers and stuff. So, what we're saying Well, I you own it with your house and so that big an issue, but this is 111 00:35:13.119 --> 00:35:29.680 >> a good size. I'm not sure, but it's absolutely worthless if I can get back there. >> Well, anybody can sell their lots back there. Those are nice lots back. If anybody wants to sell their back lot, they can. 112 00:35:29.680 --> 00:35:45.440 >> I thought you said it's wet there. Yeah, I thought you said you got you wear boots to be back there. >> Pardon me? >> I thought you guys said you have to have boots on to cut the lawn back there. >> We do. >> Yeah, >> we have a trap we got to use. >> Yeah, >> but anyhow, 113 00:35:45.440 --> 00:36:05.040 >> well, hopefully they'll bring us some fill. But uh and if they would run sworn in water, how would they I mean you'd have to run it up front along 96 or whatever you call it there. 70th Street 114 00:36:05.040 --> 00:36:21.359 >> in front there >> or run it down fourth to where they're hooking up their water and sewer. >> I'll run it straight from the existing fourth all the way to the north. >> Mhm. >> You need another station. >> Yeah. >> And then you need a lift station. 115 00:36:21.359 --> 00:36:44.560 See, just the costs are just astronomical. But, uh, I'm not sure if you looked at getting that sewer to that that parcel that Joe owns. Is that something that we could I mean, the water's going right in front of it. >> It's not feasible for the cost there to 116 00:36:44.560 --> 00:37:00.480 get that based off the elevations and everything. I I can't run through water. somebody's house there, you know, I have to pay the host water and do all that to all these pots and everything. So, it's not it wouldn't be possible. 117 00:37:00.480 --> 00:37:15.760 >> Well, the the water man's going right in front of it, so that's just a a service. >> That's not such a good deal. >> Yeah. >> I mean, is it worth having a a sit down and trying to to figure this out? >> Yeah. >> I mean, I mean, I would agree. I don't think it's all Scott's responsibility. >> Yeah. 118 00:37:15.760 --> 00:37:32.320 >> No, agree. Yeah, honestly. >> So, you'd say pay for sewer to be put in there anyway. So, if you decide to sell a lot, >> but our sewer where our sanitary that's all going back into fourth, right? >> Correct. Yep. We're going to um there's 119 00:37:32.320 --> 00:37:46.800 going to be a lift station installed and then everything will dump into the manhole at the end of the north end of >> uh 4th Avenue Northwest. >> The what? The existing >> the existing correct >> right there and stuff. So they'll pump it into and your storm is going through 120 00:37:46.800 --> 00:38:07.359 the ditch to catch farther down. >> Uh the storm sew Yeah. through a a storm sewer system, ponds, >> and then the open ditch west of 4th Avenue. >> Yeah. I mean, 121 00:38:07.359 --> 00:38:22.400 I'd be fine with agreeing with something that they would discuss it with them and sit down. I mean, you know, I can't you can't expect him to fork a put sewer and water to your lot and not get compensated for it. So, >> well, >> I mean, I think that's only reasonable 122 00:38:22.400 --> 00:38:38.720 if if he wants to and stuff. So, >> if it was your lot, >> well, I mean, that's that's life, you know. I mean, uh, >> life >> that lot was for that land was for sale for a long time. You could have bought it, >> you know. You could have bought it. It 123 00:38:38.720 --> 00:38:55.680 was for sale for years. >> Fourth Avenue. Yeah, that block was that land was for sale. >> Yeah, but uh >> and that uh to stray from that completely ignore it. >> Yeah, >> it's not my fault. >> But uh I mean uh that's Yeah, you could 124 00:38:55.680 --> 00:39:17.760 have bought the land and developed it. That's just the way Tim >> Well, I'm just saying. Anyhow, >> anyhow. >> So, what do you think's reasonable to, you know, put like something in there, 125 00:39:17.760 --> 00:39:33.839 you know, just to have a conversation amongst the builder and Joe or what are you what are you thinking, Joe? I mean, what would you expect? >> I'll sit on the floor. I have no problem with that. I don't expect to get 60,000. I'll tell you that right off. I know 126 00:39:33.839 --> 00:39:51.560 that. >> Yeah. >> But um I don't expect to be getting it to the city. >> Correct. >> None of you guys do that either. >> No. >> I wouldn't expect anybody to be just correct. between between us and Frances 127 00:40:00.400 --> 00:40:17.440 on them. >> Well, they'd be worthless if this development wasn't happening. But but honestly, to think that you have a lot there and the developer to the lot next is going to pay for a street in your water and sewer, that's just unrealistic. But let's be honest, 128 00:40:17.440 --> 00:40:37.920 >> you guys together. >> Maybe you want to buy the Maybe you want to buy those lots from him and then we can construct fort as part of this project. >> I mean, there's an I mean solution, >> you know. >> I know when you guys bought all those it was, oh, it's going to be so nice not to 129 00:40:37.920 --> 00:40:54.240 have anyone behind us and and now we're kind of singing a different tune here. The only thing I'm looking at is >> you got the developer has to put in your holding posing in other areas but just last year flooded and I think by 130 00:40:54.240 --> 00:41:16.000 cleaning out that district right out of there trying to take more water out this ded >> right >> there's no water We've met back there over the years. >> We We've met back there over the years. 131 00:41:16.000 --> 00:41:31.040 We've seen it where it's filled in and culverts and >> so >> I mean, doesn't it drop off quite a bit off right off of that fort there into the backyards? Isn't it kind of like a big bowl? >> There's about a 20 there's about a 20 foot grade separation between 132 00:41:31.040 --> 00:41:54.680 >> third and we'll just say the the ditch >> or waterway. that gets to a point where it be pretty difficult to really develop. >> Yeah. I mean, you'd have to be >> that could be >> a track 133 00:41:57.680 --> 00:42:26.720 problem. is according to what I was told back there. >> Yep. That tree line um basically the farmer farmed to about half of the the middle of the right of way. 134 00:42:26.720 --> 00:42:44.800 So my understanding is that one tree 169 is going to get taken down >> and the rest of those trees should be we'll say to the the east side of of that right of way. >> So well we've we've communicated that. 135 00:42:44.800 --> 00:43:07.040 >> Okay. Thank you. Do you want to work together to see if we can get a an access to that with Rice County or >> We can try, but I know that's going to be difficult. >> Yeah, >> I mean it would be just like on the 136 00:43:07.040 --> 00:43:23.680 other side. What do you got there? They they have an established house and garage there. I understand that. That's a little different story. But they've got the parking on the street. >> Yeah, it's certainly not ideal, 137 00:43:23.680 --> 00:43:43.400 >> especially come winter time. >> I don't know if the city would like that. >> Is that what we want? >> Uh, preferred. No. >> No. >> I'm not trying to cheat anybody here. >> I don't want to get cheated either. >> Yep. 138 00:43:43.680 --> 00:44:02.599 >> What about opening it up all the way down to Elm? running a street from Elm and up to fourth. >> Yeah, I mean it it's right ofway. We can >> Yeah, >> we could put a street anywhere and connect it to fourth cottonwood. Dogwood. 139 00:44:04.160 --> 00:44:20.880 >> Where is that? >> Dogwoods by your house. >> Elm is between Roger and your old house. >> Oh, well that's good. I agree. >> All right. So, what do we want to add 140 00:44:20.880 --> 00:44:43.200 for verbiage then in this >> that they will explore the possibility of opening it to what what is it? Elm you said >> El and Dogwood. >> Okay. So then who's going to pay for that? >> It's a great question. 141 00:44:43.200 --> 00:45:00.079 >> Those guys want to develop their lot. Yeah, >> cuz they want the street. They want the sewer and water. >> Yeah. Well, >> and I think right now >> anyone can petition the city at any time to >> consider a public improvement. >> Mhm. >> And I think we just want to put something in that that a conversation or 142 00:45:00.079 --> 00:45:16.800 an agreement needs to be made between Joe and >> I don't know about agreement, but they will have a conversation. >> Conversation. Yes. to come to an agreement of whatever >> you might not agree, >> but yeah, just a conversation. How's that? 143 00:45:16.800 --> 00:45:43.480 >> I think that sounds a conversation. >> Conversation. >> All right, let's back up here. So, first condition. I just want to make sure we're clear. And you said uh for the developer >> and lot owner Fourth Avenue North North 144 00:45:43.839 --> 00:46:14.160 Avenue West lot owners to have a conversation. to try to come to an agreement. To try to come to an agreement for access or sewer and water 145 00:46:14.160 --> 00:46:33.920 connectivity? >> Both. >> Yeah, I think ultimately he's looking for a buildable lot. Yeah. >> Sewer. So for access sewer and water. 146 00:46:33.920 --> 00:46:51.040 >> All right. I'll amend. Mr. Chair, I'm going to read this out loud here. All right. Condition A. Uh the developer and Fourth Avenue uh Northwest lot owners to have a conversation to try to come to an agreement for access. Then 147 00:46:51.040 --> 00:47:12.400 sewer and water connection. >> Yeah, >> sounds fair. >> All right, got it. All right, we need to close that out in order to move on to be >> Oh, no, no, no, no. We We're going to keep on discussing. 148 00:47:12.400 --> 00:47:37.599 >> Okay. Um, >> anything that staff wants to see for this? >> Uh, well, yeah, I know they're the developer is currently working on the design of the county required improvements and then fitting a a trail 149 00:47:37.599 --> 00:47:56.000 into the right of way and that is um in progress right now. >> All right. Okay. So, it it seems like there needs to be more more right of way dedicated to to accommodate um the county and city 150 00:47:56.000 --> 00:48:14.160 uh improvements. >> Okay. >> Um I had a quick conversation with with Rice County uh here this afternoon. Um they're at least who I talked to wasn't aware that the the county ever approved storm storm water storage in the right 151 00:48:14.160 --> 00:48:29.280 of way. They'll need to get a county access permit and nothing has been reviewed by by Rice County. And then I also think that early in the process um 152 00:48:29.280 --> 00:48:48.800 we need to have it on the record as far as um no parking on one side of the street. >> Good. >> Now you said you're doing this in phases, >> correct? Yes. >> What phase or side or are you starting 153 00:48:48.800 --> 00:49:06.359 with first? It' be on the right side where the lift station is and it work it way around here. >> Okay. So be that by fourth. >> Correct. >> Fourth is where you're going to start. So >> did you I think he included that in there. There should be a highlighted section >> right >> where he's starting. 154 00:49:07.760 --> 00:49:32.119 Yeah, there was a facing plan 116. There's a lot of holding ponds here. Holy smokes. Three of them. >> Yeah. >> That propertyy's been wet forever. 155 00:49:32.319 --> 00:49:51.760 >> Scott, do you have any street names yet? >> We don't yet. Could you maybe incorporate code data into the street names? >> Jamie Va Boulevard. >> Well, it was next >> but Kadatas 156 00:49:51.760 --> 00:50:13.920 would be a good idea. >> 27. >> Yeah. >> All right. page 27 of your handout of the preliminary plaque. >> Uh Mr. Chair, what we're referring to is 157 00:50:13.920 --> 00:50:30.880 page 27. >> Which packet? >> What attachment? >> Uh the prairie uh Vista preliminary plat packet. Both of the attachments are exactly the same from the public hearing and the staff report. >> Uh the highlighted area in red is phase 158 00:50:30.880 --> 00:51:21.760 one. Oh, >> so basically it contains the roadway and then the culdeac. All right. >> So, getting back to staff uh recommendation, um the developers required to provide 159 00:51:21.760 --> 00:51:37.760 sufficient rideway to account for the required Rice County uh improvements and 8 foot wide city trail. We also discussed snow storage today also in the rightway. >> So that that is a staff recommendation. 160 00:51:37.760 --> 00:51:55.520 >> Okay. >> So I'm going to just say condition B or the second condition if that's okay. >> Yep. Right. >> Do you want to add anything to that? >> The counter on the trail storm. >> Wasn't the staff recommendation 10 foot 161 00:51:55.520 --> 00:52:12.079 for the path? Uh that was part of the uh review process. Okay. >> Uh yes. Uh that that was the beginning point. >> And then the city's minimum uh width or st or standard trail width 162 00:52:12.079 --> 00:52:27.839 is 8 ft. >> Okay. Uh ideally the best situation would be uh with the county's rightway uh then extending into 4T uh of the right or the the county's rightway and 163 00:52:27.839 --> 00:52:44.559 then 4T beyond that for snow storage then the 8ft trail and then a foot for a side shoulder on the south side of the trail. That would be that would be ideal. Or that was discussed today with the public works director. 164 00:52:44.559 --> 00:53:06.319 >> That makes sense. >> I'm okay with that. >> Have we do we have any water vein in town? That's C900. >> That's what you're looking for. >> That plastic. >> Uh all the new developments in our um 165 00:53:06.319 --> 00:53:37.599 recons are PVC. I mean, it sounds like they have a lot of hoops to jump through with the county. To get there, okay? >> Yes. But I mean, we really can't don't have no say what what the county requires. 166 00:53:37.599 --> 00:53:56.079 So, nope. I, you know, can waste our breath on that. All right. So, we could base this upon all these conditions or this application could be incomplete because that information is 167 00:53:56.079 --> 00:54:13.760 not shown on this preliminary plot. Correct. >> Uh yeah, I think don't we want to keep working with them to keep >> keep the process going? >> Yeah. 168 00:54:13.760 --> 00:54:29.599 >> Can we make it? >> Oh, absolutely. >> Contingent upon him getting the Rice Countyy's approval for >> roads. I would think that'd be reasonable. >> Sounds good. 169 00:54:29.599 --> 00:54:45.359 So I just want to go back. So condition the second condition uh developers required to provide sufficient rideway to account for the required Rice County improvements and 8 foot wide city trail. Is that are we in favor of that? We're not voting. I just are we all on the same page for that. 170 00:54:45.359 --> 00:55:21.520 >> Yep. Sounds good. >> Okay. So that's the second condition. Okay. angry outside. >> Uh, planning commission, any uh other observations or questions for uh the for Scott? He's here, as you know, he's here 171 00:55:21.520 --> 00:55:40.440 tonight. I don't have any. >> So for the the county recommendations, you're just going to apply for those. >> We're working through right now. >> Oh, okay. So you're already working with them. Perfect. 172 00:55:42.319 --> 00:56:00.760 Now with the these small houses, those little ones up front, those are the 42 foot wide lots. Are we sticking with the 26 foot driveways on them or have those been 173 00:56:01.280 --> 00:56:15.119 >> chunking up >> as far as the width? >> Yeah, >> it's whichever's less. >> What do you mean for the driveway or what? What size driveway? Can they have a 26 foot driveway? Is that what they're going to have? 174 00:56:15.119 --> 00:56:30.559 >> Uh, it's the width of the driveway or 36 ft, whichever is less, I believe. And that's just at the right of way. >> All right. >> That's the width of the garage, right? >> Correct. >> The width of the garage. That is correct. >> Okay. >> All right. Um, 175 00:56:30.559 --> 00:56:47.599 >> yeah. I know to look at impervious >> cuz you said yeah, that's not going to leave a lot of parking spots up front. >> I believe the front yard setback's 25 ft, sideyard five, and the rear yard 20 or 25 ft. 176 00:56:47.599 --> 00:57:04.319 >> Right. Right. So, I mean that could be in the future when it comes to plowing snow. A lot of cards sitting on me on the street there >> on one side. >> Yeah. >> On one side. So, >> and since we're we brought that back up, 177 00:57:04.319 --> 00:57:21.280 is that another condition? So, condition of the primitive is uh >> parking on one side. >> Parking on one side. Um, well, I don't know if it would make it a condition, but it's definitely going to have to be clearly stated. >> Yeah. 178 00:57:21.280 --> 00:57:37.040 >> What are the ordinance like right now >> for that? >> No cars on the street. >> No parking. No parking at all right now. >> Based off of our transportation plan. >> Okay. >> I believe it's 30 feet. We're on one side if 179 00:57:37.040 --> 00:58:00.319 >> I remember correctly. >> 32. And that 29 point whatever feet that's curve to curve face to face. Yeah. Face to face. >> Okay. Uh any other comments here? 180 00:58:00.319 --> 00:58:16.079 >> So I'm gathering. So, we we want to make a motion to approve the uh Prairie Vista preliminary plat with the condition of conversation that the developer and the lot owners of the of the rideway, the 181 00:58:16.079 --> 00:58:31.440 four the butt up to the Fourth Avenue Northwest or the I'm sorry, the the the developer and 4th Avenue Northwest lot owners to have a conversation to try to come come to an agreement for access uh for for access, sewer, water and 182 00:58:31.440 --> 00:58:48.720 connection. And then con the second condition is the developer is required to proi provide sufficient rideway to account for required Rice County improvements and a foot wide city trail. >> Is that correct? >> Yep. Yes. >> Correct. 183 00:58:48.720 --> 00:59:04.720 >> So I'm looking for a motion, but that motion needs to include both of the conditions. >> Motion for both both conditions. Motion made by Mike. >> Second. >> Second by Reagan. All in favor? >> I 184 00:59:04.720 --> 00:59:20.240 >> I. >> Any opposed? None. Carries forward. >> All right. Thank you, Mr. Chair. >> Thank you, >> Scott. Have you looked at the no parking? What side do you want? No parking on or >> for sure. 185 00:59:20.240 --> 00:59:42.160 >> Because I think we're definitely going to have to that's that's going to be an issue in the future. So, we're definitely gonna >> have to have that >> noted someplace. >> Okay. >> What's your timeline then for getting 186 00:59:42.160 --> 00:59:58.160 the rest of >> um I got to touch base with R and a few other things. So, it's going to be a little bit. So, I'll touch base with you probably later this week here. >> Okay. >> Yeah. I'll try to get through some stuff. Sounds good. Thank you. >> Thank you. >> You too. 187 00:59:58.160 --> 01:00:16.559 >> You too. >> All right. Moving on. >> Uh moving on, Mr. Chair. Uh we are to new business B. Consider approval to reschedule the July 2026 planning commission meeting to Thursday, July 23rd, 2026 at 7:00 p.m. Uh Mr. Chair 188 01:00:16.559 --> 01:00:30.960 staff is proposing to reschedule the Monday July 20th 20 2026 planning commission meeting to Thursday July 20 third th to Thursday July 23rd 2026 due to scheduling conflict. Staff is seeking the commission to consider approval of 189 01:00:30.960 --> 01:00:46.079 rescheduling that Monday meeting to that Thursday the 23rd. Uh fiscal impact uh is the same as the meeting were not scheduled. Uh, alternative schedule is deemed necessary by the planning commission to change the meeting date in 190 01:00:46.079 --> 01:01:02.640 July. Uh, Mr. Chair, I'm seeking a motion to uh move that meeting or move the July 20 the July 20 meeting to Thursday, July 23rd. >> I'm okay with I thought there was a holiday. I was looking on my calendar. I was all confused. 191 01:01:02.640 --> 01:01:18.799 >> Why are we switching it or what? >> Scheduling conflict or something. >> Scheduling conflict. >> All right, sounds good. I guess that's fine. I you made a motion. >> All right. So Tim Tim made the motion. >> Second. >> Second by Mike. All in favor? >> I 192 01:01:18.799 --> 01:01:34.720 posted carry forward. >> All right. Uh new business C. Review and discuss city code 153.003 definitions. >> Uh thank you, Mr. Chair. In conjun in conjunction with the commission's review 193 01:01:34.720 --> 01:01:52.240 of ordinance 2026 340, an ordinance amending city code 153.040 zoning districts. Staff is recommending the review and discussion of city code 153.003 definitions. The city attorney has 194 01:01:52.240 --> 01:02:07.280 recognized inconsistencies with the changes made to the ordinance 2026340 that correlate and impact the city code 153.003 definitions. The city attorney also recommend moving all definitions from 195 01:02:07.280 --> 01:02:22.640 the zoning districts to city code 153.003 definitions to improve consistency and for def uh definitions to be in one location. So, as the staff report said, uh we we 196 01:02:22.640 --> 01:02:38.000 spent a lot of work, a lot of time, a lot of work on on the zoning districts. We want it done right. We've come this far. Uh but the definitions talk to the permitted uses, conditional uses, and 197 01:02:38.000 --> 01:02:53.760 this is a perfect time to start reviewing these the definitions. Uh and this includes all definitions. And uh Mr. or council member of Ovka. I'm sure there's a few of them that need to be updated. >> Yeah. >> So, I think tonight 198 01:02:53.760 --> 01:03:10.960 >> correct if you own definition, we should come up with a different verbiage for remains a little more sensitive word. >> So, it just uh the these definitions haven't been reviewed for a very long time. So, I'm proposing we spend a half 199 01:03:10.960 --> 01:03:28.640 an hour on this tonight um to start this process. Okay. >> I I want to take a holistic review or approach here, take our time, make sure we're making the right choices because what we do will be sent to the attorney that which does acrue cost. So, I do not 200 01:03:28.640 --> 01:03:46.319 want to rush through this process. Uh, Council Member Bosea did reach out to me um in regards to the comment when he read the staff report of um in regards to 201 01:03:46.319 --> 01:04:01.920 a micro distilleries uh making sure that we could have like a a serving area in there in that facility. Uh he advised me to reach out to the city of Northfield. I went to their city codes and how they 202 01:04:01.920 --> 01:04:19.119 work with that is in one of the in their definitions they have a cocktail room. >> Cocktail room and is cocktail room definition a facility on or adjacent to the premises of a micro distillery licensed under Minnesota stat 203 01:04:19.119 --> 01:04:34.799 my page cut off for the for the on sale of distilled liquor produced by the distiller for consumption on the premises or adjacent to it. So I I think that while we're going through these definitions, that's one of the finds that we're looking at, how they talk to each other and how we can make them 204 01:04:34.799 --> 01:04:50.720 better. So that is definitely one of the examples. >> Okay. >> So gentlemen, uh please go to your attachment. Um we're looking at uh the the attorney the attorney's comments to the definitions 205 01:04:50.720 --> 01:05:06.880 153.003. For the purposes of this chapter, the following definitions shall apply unless the context specifically indicates or requires a different meaning. >> So, Mr. Chair, if you don't mind, I'm going to just start reading these. All right, 206 01:05:06.880 --> 01:05:22.920 >> go for it. >> Yep. >> A budding first definition having a common border or property line or separated only by streets, railroad tracks, or public utility rideway. Are you really going to read all this? 207 01:05:24.559 --> 01:05:42.400 No, but uh we can move forward. All right. Actually, our city administrator said, "Are we really going to read all these?" Do we want to just go down the page here? Abudding, access, accessory, use, structure, or building. I think that one's a key one that the 208 01:05:42.400 --> 01:05:59.839 key definition that we could apply here. Uh we're third down on the list. A use, structure, or building or portion of the structure subordinate to and serving the principal use or structure on the same lot and clearly and customarily incidental. 209 01:05:59.839 --> 01:06:22.400 There too, I'm circling that one because I'm going to highlight it when I put this back in the staff report that it applies. Yeah, that one I think we need to look at to make sure that um because I think we have like accessory 210 01:06:22.400 --> 01:06:38.799 use, accessory structure um which kind of regulate the square or maybe have a portion of the square footage requirement for building permit or >> Yeah, because I remember seeing accessory buildings too. 211 01:06:38.799 --> 01:06:57.839 >> Yeah. Yeah. And that you kind of get into like those garages where they have to meet the setbacks where a shed >> Yep. >> can be 5 ft off. >> See, one of your doings is it Jamie to go. >> We do have accessory uses. No, it's the attorneys. >> Oh, we got to do it right. 212 01:06:57.839 --> 01:07:13.920 Otherwise, we open ourselves up to stuff and we got to do it right. >> All right. Um, agriculture, the use of land for growing and producing field crops, keeping or producing of livestock and poultry, and 213 01:07:13.920 --> 01:07:34.640 all activities incidental thereto. The term shall not include feed lots, the raising of fur, bearing animals, nor the operations of riding, uh, academics, commercial stables, and kennels. Um, I'm going to go down to animal 214 01:07:34.640 --> 01:07:52.480 hospital. A place where animals or pets are given to medical or surg surgical treatment and the boarding of animals is limited to short-term care incidental to the hospital use. um antenna. Any structure or device used 215 01:07:52.480 --> 01:08:10.079 for the purpose of collecting or uh radiating electromagnetic waves including but not limited to directional antennas such as panels, microwaves, dishes, satellite dishes, and omniirectional antennas such as whip antennas. 216 01:08:10.079 --> 01:08:24.960 be to be honest with you, I don't know a whole lot about antennas and I'm not sure how the update updated this one is. I I am gonna circle that to take a look a little bit further. Apartment 217 01:08:24.960 --> 01:08:51.440 >> uh a room or suite of room in a multifamily dwelling structure. What is arranged, designed, or intended to be used as a dwelling unit for a single family? Just something to think about. Like I said, we're just starting this tonight and I'm hoping everybody goes back 218 01:08:51.440 --> 01:09:08.239 through their notes and takes a look at what we're discussing. Automobile repair, major, general repair, rebuilding or reconditioning of engines, motor vehicles, or trailers, including bodywork, framework, welding, and major painting surfaces. 219 01:09:08.239 --> 01:09:24.319 And then right below this, you guys, we've seen this several times in our in our zoning districts. Automobile repair minor. The replacement of any part or repair of any part which does not require the removal of the engine head or pan, engine transmission or 220 01:09:24.319 --> 01:09:41.880 differential, incidental body and fender work, minor painting and upholstering service when the service above stated is applied to passenger automobiles and trucks not in excess of 7,000 lbs gross vehicle weight. 221 01:09:43.199 --> 01:09:59.440 uh automotive service station, a retail place of business engaged in preliminary in the sale of motor vehicle fuels, but also may engage in supplying goods and services generally. >> That almost matches up with convenience 222 01:09:59.440 --> 01:10:17.120 facility. >> I was thinking the same thing, Mike, when we get there. >> I looked to make sure because I was like, I'm pretty sure I read that earlier. Oh uh it's continued on generally required in the operation and maintenance of motor vehicles. These may 223 01:10:17.120 --> 01:10:36.880 include sale of petroleum products, sale and servicing of tires, batteries, automotive accessories and replacement items, washing and lubrication services and the performance of automatic automotive maintenance and repairs. Okay, I am going to circle that 224 01:10:36.880 --> 01:10:51.920 basement. and a portion of the building located entirely partially underground but having half or less than its floor or ceiling height allow the average grade of the adjoining ground. A basement shall be counted as a story except that a basement the ceiling of 225 01:10:51.920 --> 01:11:10.080 which does not extend more than 5 ft above the curb level or above the highest level of the adjoining ground shall not be counted as a story. Uh we have the questions or brewery. This is was it was an addition from us. 226 01:11:10.080 --> 01:11:24.480 Uh we see the definition. Uh we have a brewery uh facility which manufactures process and warehouses malt liquor for wholesale distribution and offsale packages to retail liquor establishments. 227 01:11:24.480 --> 01:11:39.920 Establishments may retail malt liquor product for the on-site consumption in a tap room or for off-site consumption as growlers. The annual production of malt liquor shall be more than 20,000 228 01:11:39.920 --> 01:11:55.440 but less than 250,000 barrels. Uh, brewery small, a facility which manufactures process warehouse malt liquor for wholesale distribution and off-sale packages to resale liquor establishments and may 229 01:11:55.440 --> 01:12:12.239 retail malt liquor product for an on-site condition in a type or tap room for off-site consumption as growers and the annual production of malt liquor shall be no more than 20,000 barrels. Guys, if you see anything that I'm 230 01:12:12.239 --> 01:12:32.239 missing here that you want to call out and I just move to the third page here. Uh our first attorney note uh butcher shop meat market. This was added in B3 ordinances but without a definition. It is commonly 231 01:12:32.239 --> 01:12:48.920 understood term so definition is not absolutely necessary. Do we agree with that comment >> or do we want to add anything to that? Which one was it? >> I'm on page three. Butcher shop and meat market. 232 01:12:50.800 --> 01:13:10.080 >> I don't think uh definition I mean it's self-explanatory. >> Okay. Leave alone or leave as is. Uh as you could see we have more underlined uh more underlined definitions coming up. We added all the 233 01:13:10.080 --> 01:13:33.280 cannabis cultivate or the cannabis license types. I'm going to skip the church here. A building or uh edifice cons um consecrated 234 01:13:33.280 --> 01:13:49.679 uh to religious worship or people join together in some form of public worship under the >> I'm sorry >> we might need a definition on that >> boy agrection 235 01:13:49.679 --> 01:14:06.480 of a person who is authorized under the laws of the state of Minnesota's psalmize marriages camp meeting grounds >> mikv it's a mikvah Yeah, I think this one should certainly be >> Yeah, we can do >> mikvas, coffee houses, recreation 236 01:14:06.480 --> 01:14:23.600 complexes, retreat houses, sleeping quarters for persons during spiritual retreats extending for periods more than one day, Bible camps with live-in quarters, ritual >> ritual slaughter houses. >> Not that's not funny. that is to the 237 01:14:23.600 --> 01:14:39.280 Hebrew faith. >> Radio or television towers and transmission facilities, theological seminaries, daycare centers, hospitals, and drug treatment centers are not churches. A church as defined above may 238 01:14:39.280 --> 01:14:57.280 include living quarters for persons employed on the premises of the church. >> A mikvah is a ritual bath. Thank you for making that clarification. Reagan >> coffee houses a church 239 01:14:57.280 --> 01:15:14.800 >> can be. But the ritual slaughter house, we have an ordinance against slaughter houses. >> Does that go back to meat market or butcher shop? >> They do kosher and block kosher butchering. >> Yeah. >> And Arlington actually provides that 240 01:15:14.800 --> 01:15:33.199 service. >> Yeah. Okay, >> just means to protect. It's the Greek word. I looked it up. >> I like how we're on top of this, gentlemen. Thank you for the assistance here tonight. 241 01:15:33.199 --> 01:15:50.560 >> That actually means goat skin. >> Um, so I'm going to keep on going here. Is this something that if we want to change or update? >> I think I think we should. >> You think we should? I think I I think we should at least check the verbiage 242 01:15:50.560 --> 01:16:06.320 and maybe update it with this looks like super super old verbiage. >> So, or modern verbage. Yeah. >> All right. We can I'll do a little uh I'll do a little bit of research until our next meeting. Okay. >> And maybe we did that mosque and 243 01:16:06.320 --> 01:16:26.080 synagogue too. >> Yeah. What about all the other religions? Okay. Uh another strike here. So the one below it clinic and then the princes medical. So striking medical a building 244 01:16:26.080 --> 01:16:40.719 in which a group of physicians, dentists and or highlight professional assistants are associated for carrying on their profession. The clinic may include a dental or medical laboratory but shall not include inpatient care or operating 245 01:16:40.719 --> 01:17:02.480 rooms for major surgery. uh club or lodge private an association of persons who are bonafide members paying annual dues which owns hires or leases the building property or portion thereof the use of the premises being 246 01:17:02.480 --> 01:17:17.520 restricted to members and their guest. It shall be permission uh permissible to serve a food and meals on the premises provided adequate facilities are available. So for clinic not include in person 247 01:17:17.520 --> 01:17:34.679 inpatient care that like medical beds and spending the night or is that getting stitches? Is that getting a filling? >> I maybe make that more clear. >> I would I would say make that more clear. 248 01:17:36.080 --> 01:17:51.120 Yeah, because technically a chiropractor can be a >> but is a dentist's office. Isn't that considered inatient care in patient care? >> Yeah. >> So like being a chiropractor because you have your you have a medical >> minor surgery and you're 249 01:17:51.120 --> 01:18:12.239 >> knocked out and got to >> right >> hang out till you come to the recovery room or Yeah. Yeah. All right. Uh, I just read through club or lodge private. Um, commercial car washes, principal 250 01:18:12.239 --> 01:18:31.920 accessory building or part of a principal building equipped with mechanical equipment or conveyor system and other equipment and facilities for washing automobiles. Commercial kennels. Any place where four or more of any type of domestic pets 251 01:18:31.920 --> 01:19:02.640 over four months of age are boarded, bred, trained, or offered for sale. >> All right. Commercial wireless. Those curious why why is it over four months of >> so you can sell your puppies. >> Gotcha. Okay. 252 01:19:02.640 --> 01:19:18.719 >> Correct. >> Okay. >> All right. Uh commercial wireless telemun telecommunication service. I'm sorry guys. I'm getting a little tired here. Yeah. A licensed commercial wireless telecommunication service includes cellular personal 253 01:19:18.719 --> 01:19:34.400 communication services. PCS specialized mobile mobilized radio SMR enhanced specialized mobilized radio ESMR and then paging and similar services that are marketed to 254 01:19:34.400 --> 01:19:52.800 the general public. Sell my backyard to T-Mobile. Maybe we'll get some decent service. >> They don't want to be in town. They're sell pulling out with the antenna. Jimmy, you'd love seeing a big tower in 255 01:19:52.800 --> 01:20:08.800 my backyard, would you? T-Mobile Tower. >> I'd put it at the mill and make some money myself. So, >> all right, gentlemen. Let's keep on moving here. Um, turn the page. Conditional use. A use permitted in a particular zoning 256 01:20:08.800 --> 01:20:29.800 district only upon showing that the use in a specified location will comply with all the restrictions and standards for that location or operation of the use specified by this chapter and authorized by the city. Uh, one following condominium. 257 01:20:33.280 --> 01:20:56.400 Actually, we should probably insert this gentleman. I'd like to recommend inserting the cocktail room in here also then since we're here. >> Yep. I showed it in the uh >> would that be before commercial car washes? >> Yes. >> Yep. 258 01:20:56.400 --> 01:21:12.239 >> I'm just making a note here. >> I'm trying to figure out they have club or lodge private, but there's no club or lodge public. Uh condominium a form of individual ownership within a building which entails joint ownership and responsibility for maintenance 259 01:21:12.239 --> 01:21:28.640 repairs in the land and other common properties of the building. So that's a question I have. We have on the page before we have club or lodge private but we don't have 260 01:21:28.640 --> 01:21:47.920 like club or lodge public. Wouldn't the Legion be considered a public club since anybody can go in there? >> Good point. >> Or is that under a different >> depends on what type of liquor license they have. They could have a club 261 01:21:47.920 --> 01:22:05.040 license and it's only members and people that you invite. >> But Right. But what what would they technically fall under if we don't have Clubber or Lodge Public? Uh, the way that they're operating right now would be a bar. >> Just a bar. Okay. >> Correct. 262 01:22:05.040 --> 01:22:20.239 >> Because I was I just I seen it says private, but there was no public. So, I'm like, well, what do they consider that? What do they consider a club or lodge public? >> Yeah, it very well could be the Legion of, you know, >> Yeah. >> Freemasons. 263 01:22:20.239 --> 01:22:38.239 >> It was just a question. I just, it was kind of dawning on me that there was nothing else there. So, Right. All right, Mike. Here we go, though. We're down with the convenience facility. >> Yes. >> An establishment where the where the 264 01:22:38.239 --> 01:22:54.000 principal use is the sale of gasoline or other automobile engine fuel stored only in underground tanks, kerosene, motor oil, lubricants, grease, or minor accessories directly to the public on the premises. In addition, household and 265 01:22:54.000 --> 01:23:08.800 convenience items, food or other miscellaneous retail goods commonly associated with the same also be be sold. >> Pretty much the same definition. Pretty much. >> Well, I don't think there is a such thing as a 266 01:23:08.800 --> 01:23:24.960 service station anymore because service station kind of implies that it has service other than just gas station or convenience store. I mean, you're not getting your tires 267 01:23:24.960 --> 01:23:44.400 rotated at Casey's, >> you know. I'm just saying that >> that auto automotive service station, those were big in the 80s, but we don't see them anymore. Well, don't get rid of it because we could bring it back and be we could put ourselves >> put automotive service station in with 268 01:23:44.400 --> 01:24:02.480 convenience facility because >> anybody who opens up a service station is not going to not sell candy or pop or whatever or fuel. I just I don't think service station is an applicable use anymore per just being 269 01:24:02.480 --> 01:24:18.239 a service station. But it could. >> Just a curiosity. You guys have been in town for a long time. Was there a service station in town? >> There were actually two back in the day and probably even more than that because Steel Bars was one. >> Let me guess. Long time ago. 270 01:24:18.239 --> 01:24:34.560 >> Revival is used to be a gas station. >> Um where a service station. >> Yeah, it was a service station. Where first crack is used to be a service station in the 80s. >> Molly's used to be a service station. >> Molly's was a service station. They were We had a lot of them. 271 01:24:34.560 --> 01:24:52.000 They all had like one or two pumps and they came out and they pumped out of that one or two pumps >> and you had somebody come out and pump your fuel for you. >> The tanks were still at fuel bars up until a couple years ago. >> I knew you were going to know. 272 01:24:52.000 --> 01:25:08.960 >> All right. So, gentlemen, are we just leaving as is or are we removing automat automotive service station? would add automotive service station in with convenience facility just because of the fact that it's literally you're never going to see a real service station come back. >> So convenience so strike autom 273 01:25:08.960 --> 01:25:25.360 automotive service station and then go convenience facility back slash automotive service station. >> Yeah was good. >> They are two different uses though. >> Yeah I'd just leave it. >> You know what they are two different 274 01:25:25.360 --> 01:25:42.239 uses. You got you got a good point there. >> I mean, we'll just say quick trip. I mean, that was, you know, some people didn't want that. And I can imagine if it had a stall or two with impact guns all day long. >> If you find find a quick trip with 275 01:25:42.239 --> 01:25:57.360 impact wrenches. >> Well, it could have been. I'm just using that, >> right? But I mean, >> it's common. >> It's Yeah, but even then, I mean, you're gonna >> We would just add that in. >> I don't have a thought, so whatever. 276 01:25:57.360 --> 01:26:12.400 There's still one in Northfield. Okay. It says >> the one that's >> Yeah, there >> it's that uh it's an oil station there on uh >> Yeah, I mean that would be a perfect example, right? >> See, technically though, they sell food 277 01:26:12.400 --> 01:26:29.280 and stuff in there. So, they would also be a convenience store. >> I'd just leave it in there. >> It's not hurting anything to have it in there. And it's already been there. >> True. And you never know, it could make a comeback and then we'd have to come 278 01:26:29.280 --> 01:26:45.120 back and add the definition back in. >> Oh, people would lose their minds if they had to pay somebody to pump their gas. >> Maybe not. >> Now they're pulling up to get groceries. >> Mr. Chair, we're doing such a good job 279 01:26:45.120 --> 01:27:00.159 staying on task tonight, but I do want to remind everybody we have eight minutes left. >> Okay. >> Um, moving on to the next page. dance, health, and martial arts studios. Um, a building with the pri primary 280 01:27:00.159 --> 01:27:17.040 purpose of offering one or more facilities for instruction, training, encouragement, or assistance, and physical fitness in return for payment of the fee entitling the member to the use of the facilities. 281 01:27:17.040 --> 01:27:33.040 Okay. Dance >> daycare centers licensed. Um, basically what she's she's showing us where she's moved these from from the zoning districts to be placed here. >> Uh, any facility public or private which 282 01:27:33.040 --> 01:27:50.560 for gain or otherwise regularly regularly provides one or more persons with care, training, supervision, >> what is it? Habilation, rehabilitation, or development guidance on a regular basis for periods of less 283 01:27:50.560 --> 01:28:06.400 than 24 hours per day in a place other than the client's home. Licensed daycare centers include, but are not limited to family daycare homes, group family daycare homes, daycare centers, day nurseries, nursery schools, development 284 01:28:06.400 --> 01:28:26.960 achievement centers, and adult daycare centers. While we're at this point, maybe data centers and hyper data centers need a definition. >> But what is what is a data center? How do you describe it? 285 01:28:26.960 --> 01:28:42.400 >> That's why we need a definition cuz we're going to need it when we >> Yes. >> work on that. We have moratorium. >> We have the moratorum in place. I my thought was that >> the county attorney or sorry the city 286 01:28:42.400 --> 01:28:59.360 attorney was advising against having >> a definition >> the definition in here at this time because they're still in the development of this ongoing process and that's what's giving us >> the year to do our research >> and to form formulate the report. >> I like the idea of benchmarking that. I 287 01:28:59.360 --> 01:29:18.800 think that's a very good idea, but to have uh >> what we really need is we're still about a year out >> because of the ongoing changes to the definition. All right. Uh Tim drive-thru any restaurant, financial institution, 288 01:29:18.800 --> 01:29:42.360 product or service, vending enterprise for businesses is transacted through a window or other mechanical device with a patron who is in the vehicle. >> Yeah, I think we're fine there. >> Uh gentlemen, I am moving to the next page. 289 01:29:44.800 --> 01:30:07.120 23 >> and that's still in there from when we had the sign discussion too about the menu. We had the discussion, >> right? And I'm sorry, where you at, Reagan? >> Drive-thru menu. >> Oh, right. 290 01:30:07.120 --> 01:30:44.000 >> We had the sign discussion. So any restaurant finance product or service vending enterprise yes transacted through a window. Okay. Moving forward uh to the next page. Anybody see anything they want to point out here? 291 01:30:44.000 --> 01:30:59.840 >> Are we in the Fs or on the >> We were uh wrapping up the D's going down to the E. I was looking at dwelling multi- multiple family or apartment buildings. A detached building containing three or more dwelling units with the number of families and 292 01:30:59.840 --> 01:31:14.000 residents not exceeding the number of dwelling units provided. condominiums and cooperatively own multiple residential dwellings or multiple family dwellings for the purpose of this chapter. 293 01:31:14.000 --> 01:31:41.600 That's what I was looking at. Uh jumping down the family at the bottom of the page, any number of individual individuals generally but not necessarily related by blood and marriage living together at one location as a single nonprofit household unit as 294 01:31:41.600 --> 01:32:09.440 distinguished from groups occupying a a boarding room, house, tourist, home, hotel, or motel. Gentlemen, I just want to finish up these Fs here and uh then we're will continue uh at the next meeting starting with G. 295 01:32:09.440 --> 01:32:25.199 >> And I am encouraging I'm telling everybody to please take a take this one home with you and take a look at this uh as far as the definitions go. It'd be some good late night reading for everybody. Vent solid 296 01:32:25.199 --> 01:32:49.040 financial institution. We did make that change. A commercial banking establishment or savings and loan association chartered by the state of Minnesota or United States. Funeral home. A building that provides 297 01:32:49.040 --> 01:33:06.320 facility facilities for funerals. A chapel for a funeral service. Rooms for viewing and remains in casket. Slumber rooms. Reposing rooms. Viewing rooms. Visitation rooms before final 298 01:33:06.320 --> 01:33:21.120 services or cremations. Rooms for preparation of bodies. Inbalming. Cosmetic treatment and clothing of the deceased. Display rooms and storage for caskets, 299 01:33:21.120 --> 01:33:38.360 garages for heares and other equipment, and administrative office. A funeral home may include living quarters for the funeral director and owner. >> I'd just like to see a different word for remains. 300 01:33:38.719 --> 01:34:07.760 >> I don't see anything that says anything about a crematorium either, whether we can or can't have them because it's not even spelled out. uh for rooms for viewing worms before final servicing or cremation 301 01:34:07.760 --> 01:34:24.239 meaning just being rooms for cre cremation. Well, they actually have places called crematoriums that they build and they that they smell. I mean, you think slaughter houses are bad. I'll uh take I'll circle back and take a 302 01:34:24.239 --> 01:34:39.440 look at shop around here and see if there's any recommendations. the that's basically if you're sending your family member away to be cremated, the funeral director will actually allow you to come in and see the person one last time as a 303 01:34:39.440 --> 01:34:56.159 family before they send them off. >> Yeah. I'm just saying there's no really want to and you missed it at your local one, you can contact the crematorium and they will allow you to >> I'm just saying there's no there's no definition of a crematorium. >> So, we need the definition for 304 01:34:56.159 --> 01:35:11.040 crematorium. And you know, do we want them in town or do we not? >> I don't know why not. >> They smell. >> It's bad. >> They got them everywhere. >> Uh, not everywhere. They usually put 305 01:35:11.040 --> 01:35:32.239 them like on the outside edges of major cities. >> One brand new one right up in 21 coming in. >> O, >> right by Culver's. >> All right, Mr. Mr. Chair, you want to wrap this up? >> Yeah. Yeah. >> So, let's uh we'll start with uh the 306 01:35:32.239 --> 01:35:49.840 G's, do some homework uh till the next meeting, but uh looking for a a motion to adjurnn. >> Motion to adjurnn. >> Motion by uh Reagan. >> Second. >> Second by Tim. All in favor? I. 307 01:35:49.840 --> 01:35:52.840 >> Opposed?