Mr. Chair. Okay, I'm ready to go. All right, we'll call this uh planning and zoning meeting to order. It is August 18th, 2025. And um
stand for the pledge of allegiance. I pledge algiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
>> Roll call. Jeremy Brainer, >> present. >> Joe Kadara, I am here. Mike Harding >> here. >> Tim Kesh >> here. Mike Conu absent. All right, everybody take a look at the
agenda before we get started. You know what we got ahead? If you don't see any corrections or whatever you want to do with it, um, we need a motion to approve. >> Motion to approve. >> We have a motion by Mike.
>> Second by Tim. It's going to be a little easier if we have just one mic. Okay. Approval of the minutes. Did everybody look at the minutes? Go through them. Anybody have anything to correct or add? Otherwise, we would need a motion to
approve the minutes from last month. >> Motion. >> We have a motion by Mike. >> I'll second. >> Second by Jeremy. All in favor? >> I. >> Motion carries. Public hearings. Um public hearing for ordinance 2025
3333. An ordinance amending ordinance 2024 33 322 and ordinance amending city code 153007 accessory buildings structures uses. Corey. Uh thank you uh Mr. Chair and
good evening of planning commission. Um this is our first public hearing for the night uh for ordinance as you said 2025333. Uh at the June 21st, 2025 meeting, the commission approved staff to schedule the public hearing for ordinance 2025-333
um for accessory build or accessory building structures uses. And um just want to let you know that staff issued the mandatory 10-day public hearing notification and it was advertised in the Lawndale area or Lawndale news review on the 5th of August. Um,
gentlemen, I have received no public comments during this time frame. Uh, summary of of uh updates and I saw that a few of you did post a respond on Facebook tonight. So, thank you very much. Those comments were correct. Uh,
incorporated chicken coops do not apply in the shed definition. clarified accessory use or structures not permitted with in wetland buffer and uh removal of exterior color shall not be the same as principal structure
and incorporation of shipping containers. Um as far as moving forward after the public hearing when we get into um consider approval, I would like to go further in discussion with um items of importance to discuss and that
is the temporary structures meaning that uh right now uh temporary structures is not in our accessory structure code and uh in the past few meeting few meetings I've been attaching an attachment picture and that is not
enforceable. So, that's something that I'd like to discuss a little bit further after the public hearing uh once we get into our agenda tonight. >> Thank you. >> All right, gentlemen. Anybody have anything to add or we would need a
motion to close the public hearing? >> I'll make a motion. >> We have a motion by Jeremy. >> Second. >> Second by Tim. All in favor? >> I. >> Motion carries. All right. We'll move on to public hearing for reszoning of 415
Central Street West Lonsdale public facilities and government to limited business B1. Cy. Uh Mr. Chair, this is actually pretty exciting here. Um at the July 31st, 2025 uh city council meeting, the council recommended
staff to schedule a public hearing uh at at this meeting tonight um uh for the reszoning of 415 Central Street West. and gentlemen, that is the old city hall. >> Uh from public facilities and government
to limited business B1. The intention is to reszone the old city hall before listing it so potential buyers know what uses would be permitted and and close the sale quickly without having to go through the resoning process. The
council is in support of reszoning uh the old city hall to be one limited uh to be consistent with surrounding properties and facilitate the sale process. Staff issued the mandatory 10-day public hearing notification which was advertised in the Lawndale area news
review commencing August 5th and mailed the public hearing notification letter to all properties within 300 ft radius. Uh there was 47 mailers that went out and I'm letting the co the commission know at this time no public comments
have been received. Thank you Corey. Any comments or save them for later otherwise we would need a we have no one on the floor to say anything. So uh we would need a motion to close the public hearing.
>> I'll make that motion. >> We have a motion by Tim. >> I'll second. >> Second by Jeremy. All in favor? >> I >> I motion carries. All right. Citizens petitions. There are none. Approval of
consent agenda. There's none. Old business. Con. Consider approval of 2025 3333. An ordinance amending ordinance 2024 332. An ordinance amending city code 153007 accessory buildings structures uses.
Cory. Uh gentlemen, as I mentioned earlier, uh this is a public hearing for accessory structures tonight. Uh the summary of updates included like I just stated prior uh to the prior agenda item. Uh it's an incorporation of chicken coops and not applied in the
shed definition, clarified accessory use or structures not permitted in wetland buffer, removal of exterior color shall be the same uh as a principal structure, and the incorporation of shipping containers. So Mr. Chair, this is our
time uh to add any additional comments or changes uh before hopefully uh consider approval to move this to uh the last city council meeting in August. So uh Mr. Chair, >> yes. Thank you, Corey.
Commissioners, this is your time to speak up. You approve of the changes or you don't? >> I do. I think it's a good idea. >> Okay. >> It's, you know, it's been long coming. And this is where we can add in notations of temporary storage.
>> Uh Mr. Chair, Mr. Briner. Uh yes. Um this would be the opportunity to uh come up with some language or at least support the the the concept of the language to be incorporated into this uh with temporary structures uh are
permitted for a maximum of 10 days, >> something along that lines. Um, so if there's any keywords you would like to have added to that, I'm thinking if we go to page, this is not a very big ordinance or city code. So even if we
went to page two, uh, looking at number five in blue, number six, adding it in that area. Um uh adding in the say hypothetically in number seven uh saying temporary structures
uh permitted only for 10 days maximum. >> How much how much definition do we have to give for temporary structures >> as far as do we get into the material? Do we get into the um
>> well, you know, um I guess you could put a tarp over the swing set like we've seen and say, "Well, that's to protect my kids from the sun for the summer." That mean anything?
>> That's an excellent point because I I'd be one of those people probably putting a tarp over my play structure so they don't get sunburned. >> They're in the sandbox under the swings. It keeps them from >> also have people putting up those, you know, summer those uh metal awnings over
their back decks. >> I mean, I had one for a couple years. I have a mobile one now that just folds down, but I leave it up all summer if I'm home cuz it's nice outside. >> No, no, >> no. It's just a popup. It's made by >> clam
pop up and >> you take it down anytime you want. It folds up like a tent. >> Okay. Yep. I know what you're referring to. or is this something that we don't want to incorporate? I mean, I want to throw that option out there, too. >> Well, I think we should protect ourselves as far as some of these
backyard things that uh >> source. >> Yeah. And you can't do anything about it because we don't have any any language for it. >> Um >> I think so, too. >> It's non- anchored. >> Mhm. M maybe that's something we can put
in so it's not like bolted to something, >> you know, if it's just one of those temporary like my clamshell, my it's looks nice. It's >> surrounded. It's got netting, but it's not a permanent structure. I can pop it down in 5 minutes,
>> you know. It's not like a carport or anything. Carport cover. >> Mhm. But then again, carport covers could be a good thing too if you have a temporary storage of a vehicle. If you got gravel there and you can put it up, who are we to stop them?
>> I mean, honestly, well, do we allow carports? >> No, we don't cars. >> No, >> there's no car ports are not permitted. >> No. >> So, that verbiage is covered. I I don't think we go into too much detail. That's my personal preference is that we just
say >> temporary >> structures. >> You're never going to cover it all. >> No. >> No. The >> I think you got to be generalized so that it's covered. It's you know we can it can be enforced. >> Mhm. >> I mean there's a difference in like
yours, right? Where >> yours >> covers my patio furniture. >> It's covered. It looks nice. presentable versus somebody that throws, you know, an awning up and then throws a bunch of stuff in there.
>> But then on the hind side of that, when your neighbors doesn't look nice and you're calling city hall, >> right, >> to hey, this this is bringing down my property value or this is unsafe. It's going to blow into my yard. >> It's an eyesore. >> It's an eyesore. And you know the the
thing with that is what's an eyes sword to one person looks just fine to the next. >> And that's that's where I'm getting at it with the definition or how do we have to be careful too cuz you don't want to be getting into neighbor
retaliation and now they're saying it looks bad but everybody else says no problems with it. And >> that's true. Um Tim, you're thinking >> and council member, you're thinking also. >> He's opening up a big can of worms.
>> It is. >> Um and where do you stop? >> Where do you draw the line? >> Yeah. Where do you stop? >> Nitpicking. >> Okay. Somebody puts their tent in the backyard with their kids, you know, but hopefully you don't leave it there for
more than 10 days. Mhm. >> Depends on what the kid did. >> Yeah. And again, people aren't going to know about it until it's reported. >> Right. Right. >> Cuz we're not actively looking in people's backyards unless a neighbor does report it.
>> It's one of those things where somebody says something. >> Right. >> I do definitely think we need to address it. I think we we have to give the city some kind of uh fall back that uh no, that's against the ordinance. You can't be doing that. If you don't have anything written up, then they have
nothing to go go with. Um, are we going after tarped up construction materials then? If they're tarped up for more than 10 days, yell at them because they got tarped up stuff there. I don't think they're supposed to have piles of that anyhow. But
>> Well, if you got an active construction site, >> that's Yeah, that's >> that's a little different story. Yeah. >> Um >> or on the side of your dog kennel as a windbreak in the winter. Are we going to allow that
>> or tarp over it in the summer for a sunscreen? >> Problem is you can go down the rabbit hole on this for a long time. You know, I just don't want to be the the group that everybody says, "Well, they're nitpicking at my yard,"
>> you know, cuz maybe somebody can't afford a a high-end, you know, clamshell or, you know, something nice. Maybe they have to do with what they got cuz that's all they can afford. But the problem with that is I think about the neighbors, >> you know, >> if the neighbors don't say anything.
>> If they don't say anything, that's one thing. But if they do say something, >> that's the thing, right? I'm trying to get at is that >> depending on the neighbors, they may just be like, "Yours is fine because it looks nice." >> I just don't want to I don't want to go down so far down a rabbit hole that we're nitpicking every little thing.
>> No. >> What do you think, Joe? I think 15 days uh for anything like that is fine. Um if it gets to be an issue, I mean, at least they got something to fall back on. Well, according to city ordinance, you
have 15 days and you've got to take it down. >> And if it's going to be um >> then what if they take it down for a day and just put it back up for another 15? >> Just what I was going to say. >> That will fall back on the neighbor to report that. Y >> they'll just do the 14 days, take it
down, and they'll put it back. >> You'd have to say total total of 15 days. >> Yeah. >> But it would promote them to to to make something more permanent, right? Like that's nicer. >> So, who's going to want to, you know, take a put down a temporary one every 14
days? But I think like >> Jamie said, you know, if it's on the side of a dog kennel for a windbreak or if it's on top of dog kennel, I don't think that should be included because that's more safety stuff than anything. >> Yeah, that's pretty minor. >> Literally, I think we're just pointing at temporary structures. I think we
leave it at that. I don't think dog kennels are a temporary structure for the most part, especially if it's just providing shade. >> Yeah, >> that's my opinion. Now, what if they just set it up for the weekend every weekend because they're partying out in the backyard
>> and then take it down on Monday morning or Sunday morning. >> I think they that falls under the 15 days, so they should be fine. >> But it's every weekend all summer long. >> If your neighbors and they picking that much, you should just talk to them. >> Yeah. >> If he wants to take it out and put it up
every weekend, have it. I was thinking the same thing. >> I was thinking >> Yeah, there's a lot of work and I was thinking the same thing. At least there's a conscious effort to >> Yep. Yep. >> structure. >> Um >> I say 15 days is okay.
>> I don't. >> All right. Agreed. Well, then we need a motion. >> Hang on one second. Hang on. Wants to get the verbiage. >> All right. So, a motion [Music] to update. >> You know, graduation parties and stuff,
you usually do it the week before. Takes you a few days to take it down cuz everybody's >> to include sober up. >> All right. So, gentlemen, I'm looking at uh a motion to update the draft ordinance to include temporary structures permitted a max or a total
>> of 15 days. >> Total of 15 days. >> Temporary And we'll know I mean after a year that is 15 consecutive days >> permitted >> a total
of 15 consecutive days >> and like everything else if it gets to be an issue we take another look at it. >> Yeah. At least there's something right. Uh and this is remember this is not the city going
we respond >> right >> um and like someone mentioned nitpicky I mean we don't want to be nitpick pickicky but when the neighbor is being nitpicky and we have nothing to stand by >> there's nothing we can do >> right
>> so um is there any anyone else want to add anything else to this are we happy with this because we put a lot of time and work into it. >> I'd like to change the shipping containers.
>> All right. Shipping containers that is on page three >> and we and that is at number four. A m and currently it states a maximum of two shipping containers shall be permitted in the B B1 basically all business and commercial
zoning districts and shall be a single color with no writing on them. Um, Council Member Boseka, what are you thinking? >> Um, thinking we should allow multiple colors if it looks nice and not say no writing on them. What if they're needing
temporary storage for a few months and they call and rent a pod? It's going to have pod written on the side of it and then somebody's going to complain that it says pod on the side of it. >> Yeah, I just seen those today. They're blue and white and they have pod written on the side in big letters cuz well,
they're promoting your business. Or what if you want to put your own business on the side of your shipping container? >> So what are you proposing then as far as language goes? >> Strike the color, strike the no writing and leave it at two shipping containers.
>> A maximum of two shipping containers shall be permitted in the B1, B2, B3, I1, I2, CI districts >> and leave it as that. >> Yep. >> Um >> as long as it sound like offensive language. Well, that's the thing. No, I
would >> What is considered offensive language? >> Well, I'm thinking maybe can't regulate it. The >> city can't regulate it. What's in regardless >> say we put it on say it must only say business name. >> I I think it should be if anybody's going to have it on there like you were
talking that pod company that says the dumpster. If it has your business on it, >> it's theirs, but not >> even for the business. They have it on the front of their building and whatnot. I don't think they need to put it on the pots. Maybe the only writing being business names
>> the um >> yeah otherwise you're >> because like if if the feed mail buys two, you know, two pods and they at some point decide they're going to rent them out. I mean, why would we have to stop them from advertising their pod
business, >> you know, just that's just random out there. But >> whoever's supplying them, that's that's >> that should be their their business. >> They can do their own advertising on there. Yeah. you know, we don't want anybody writing on the side, you know, Mike was here >> cuz that's just, you know, that's
stupid. >> But then if we're talking pods and shipping containers, are we talking about the same thing? >> Yes, they're I just want to verify that is these shipping containers, as you can see around town, they're there. They're not moving. >> And then as far as a pod, you know, like
a rental pod, Mike's moving uh things out of his basement to redo his basement. That's that's more or less a temporary, >> right? So, I I just want to make sure that we're, you know, we're clear here. >> Well, temporary ones, I don't think there should be any printing at all
except for the company that's supplying the pod. >> If they buy it and you've got it in your backyard, you own it. I still think we got to limit it some because, you know, they can get pretty ugly after a short time
in my mind, >> but they're not allowed other than in the business districts, right? Well, that's true. >> Industrial and whatnot. So, >> that's true. >> Excellent point. >> So, if it's business, I say you can have your business name on it. >> Business name only. Business names only.
>> Business names only. >> Okay, I'll buy that. You know, if they want to put like, you know, Ace Hardware or Hardware Hank and they want to put the phone number on, >> don't care. >> But hang on, >> Mr. Va. >> We are allowing them temporarily for construction purposes.
>> That is correct. >> Mhm. >> If you're remodeling your house, it comes in handy to have something move. >> Oh, yeah. That's >> They want to buy one and they want to use it to I mean, I know Hardware Bank has storage issues because they never have enough. >> They buy one to put one next to their
business. that's their business. >> They they kind of are now with that because you got to have a certificate of occupancy when your job is done. And um if I remember right, we made it that they had to clean up the silk fences before they got the certificate of
occupancy. And I would think they'd have to have the garbage dumpsters out too at the same time. >> Correct. >> That it's complete and finished. I mean that that I think falls under a little different idea when it's under
construction. >> I'm just saying if it's a business, their name, their phone number if they want, and whatever their colors are. I mean, if they're like hardware, heck, if it's red and white, it they can have a red and white container. >> Waste management with the green and things like that. Yeah. >> Yeah. I guess
>> that would be more reasonable than, you know, just saying, "Okay, you can only paint it one color and it doesn't reflect your business." >> All right, we need a motion. >> Hang on. So, I'll make sure we got our story straight here.
>> All right, so bear with me here. A maximum of two shipping container shall be permitted in the B1, B2, B3, I1, I2, and CI zoning districts and shall have the business name. I'd say shall or
not shall, but I would say >> business name only would be >> business name only permitted. Business name and phone number only permitted on set of containers. >> The owner >> have H >> shall shall only
have the owner. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. I mean that >> owner of the >> owner of the dumpster. >> Okay. >> Owner of the property. >> Yep. >> Yep. Okay. >> Owner's um lettering.
>> Mhm. >> Yep. >> Owner's lettering. Now we get rid of the single caller. >> All right, I think I have it. >> Okay, so can we have a motion for that one? >> Okay, read it to us once. >> Oh, me. >> No, no, no, no. Let me let me read it
one more time, guys. Okay. >> All right. So, we're looking at page three. Uh, number four. A maximum of two shipping containers shall be permitted in the B1, B2, B3, I1, I2, and CI districts and shall only have the own
owner's lettering. >> Okay, sounds good. >> Are we We're good for that. >> So, that should cover the name and say they want to put a phone number on. >> Correct. >> All right, let's get a motion on that one. >> All right, I'll make a motion. >> We have a motion by Jeremy. >> I'll second.
>> Second by Mike. All in favor? >> I >> I opposed. Motion carries. All right. New business. Consider approval for reszoning of 415 Central Street West Lawndale from
>> Actually, this back up. I want to make sure we have everything covered here. Okay. >> So, should we make another motion to carry this to to consider approval to move it to the next city council meeting? >> Oh, we can do that. >> Let's make sure we have that down here. Okay. Did we make a change on the
coloring that they can have? >> Yes, that motion has been taken care of. >> So, Mr. Chair, this uh this how about a motion to consider approval of ordinance uh 2025 3333 uh with the um updated recommendations
of the commission. >> Everybody hear that? Agree with it? >> Yep. >> Who wants to motion? >> Motion. Jeremy makes motion and second by Tim. >> All in favor? >> I >> I opposed. Motion carries. All right.
Now, new business. Consider approval for reszoning of 415 Central Street West Lonsdale from public facilities and government to limited business B1. Corey. Uh the public hearing for resoning of the 415 Central Street West Lawndale,
Minnesota. uh from public facilities and government uh uh to limited uh business B1 was reviewed prior to this agenda item under the public hearing. The commission should consider public comments received. There were none. Staff is seeking the commission to recommend the approval of reszoning 415
Street West Ldale, Minnesota 55046 from public facilities and government to limited business B1 for city council approval at the August 28th meeting. I'm just looking for a motion to get this approved. >> Motion. >> Got a motion by Mike.
>> Second. >> Second by Tim. All in favor? >> I. All opposed. Motion carries. Okay. New business B. Consider approval to re recommend to the city to sell 415
Central Street West. It's an easy one, guys. All right. Uh, thank you, Mr. Mr. Chair, uh we're at 10B. Uh in 2024, the city purchased the Lawndale Clinic, which this beautiful
facility we're sitting in tonight. Uh and it's been remodeled and transitioned into the new city hall. The city hall remodeled remodel uh project was completed and staff moved into the city hall May 30th in preparation to sell the
old city hall um property at the August 14th 20 or August 14, 2025 meeting. The city council approved to contract with Remax Advantage Plus to list and sell the property because of the city has a
comprehensive plan. Uh M and Minnesota statute 462356 state that the planning commission must review the transaction to determine if it's consistent with the comprehensive plan. So gentlemen, tonight we're just planning in advance. Uh we had the city council already has a
listing agent uh and and pretty much has this the old city hall on the market. We just want to streamline this process as fast as possible >> to get rid of it. >> Mhm. So, tonight I'm looking for a recommendation
um to approve uh approve to consider to uh to approve to sell 415 Street West Lawndale, Minnesota. Uh the the old city hall. It's like I said, it drives with
our comprehensive plan and the council, Mr. Va, we want to get rid of it. Mhm. >> I don't see why we'd want to keep it. >> No reason. >> So, uh, Mr. Chair, I'm looking for a motion here. >> All right, >> I'll make a motion.
>> We have a motion by Jeremy. >> I'll second. >> Second by Mike Harding. All in favor? >> I >> I opposed. None. Motion carries. All right. Under 10, new business. C. Review and discuss city code zoning
districts districts HB-1 limited business B2 highway and business service B3 central business K I1 light industrial light I2 medium industrial 01
original industrial district or 01 I guess it would be and PCI commercial industrial district >> uh thank you Mr. chair at the August 14th, 2025 city council meeting. Um, a good thing happened at that meeting. So,
the council, Mr. Goska, brought that forward to the council that night and said, "Hey, let's let's make this efficient. What should we have done here? Let's work together." and the council came up gave some pretty clear
direction to staff to have the commission uh the commission prioritize a review and discussion of B2 highway uh business service and then I2 medium industrial and CI commercial industrial design standards. So that's that's our
main project as as m Mr. uh chair, you just read through all the zoning districts, >> but like I said, this is going to be a little bit longer process and I think and the priority is is B2, I2 and CI. So, I start this off tonight in your
attachments. I've placed uh B2 first >> in your attachments and let's go to the highlighted area. technically. I'm sorry. It's on page five.
And at the bottom of the page, it starts with eight other standards. We flip over to page six and this is where we're we're not reviewing the zoning uh or the permitted uses and this is strictly the review of design standards. So page six
we're looking at the whole s or page six a design building design and construction materials in addition to other restrictions the city code any building or structure within the B2 district shall meet the following standards. Okay. One, all buildings shall be
designed to be compatible with surrounding uses. Okay, that makes sense. >> Mhm. >> All exterior wall surfaces shall consist of one or more of the following. Face brick, uh, breakoff brick, breakoff
block, stone, or glass curtain wall. uh specifically designed pre-cast concrete units if the surfaces have been integrally treated with an applied decorative uh material or textures. All subsequent additions and bu out
buildings constructed after the erection of the original building construction shall be designed in the manner conforming with the original architectural design and appearance. So, we're looking at as far as um as far as the materials go here, and we're not
off the beaten beaten road, beaten path here. I have an attachment uh as far as uh other the few other cities around the area as far as what they require for ex building materials.
And um like I said, we're not too far off. But we're trying to on the council's side or on the council's um directive here is to broaden this so we can attract and bring
these businesses bring more businesses to town. So Mr. OSA, as far as a council goes, is there something that we should be as should we be deleting from the the the surf the wall surfaces or there should
be something additionally permitted? >> Well, we were looking it over earlier tonight and um this has no galvanized at all and it does make a good accent feature on the buildings. So, incorporation of galvanized steel
>> accent feature >> incorporation >> allowed not mandatory allowed. >> Galvanized. >> Yeah, you see see a lot of that now.
It's kind of a fad thing, but um >> so the incorporation of galvanized material allowed. >> Is that correct? >> Yeah. >> All right. I'm going to keep on going down the list. All exterior trash enclosures or other accessory structures shall be
constructed of the same materials and colors as the principal building. The height of these structures shall not exceed that of the principal structure. All mechanical equipment whether roof mounted or ground mounted shall be completely screened from the ground level
view to the adjacent properties and public streets. And then we get into landscaping >> uh garbage enclosures. >> All exterior, I'm sorry. Number four, >> what if they have a glass curtain building? Do you really want a glass curtain garbage enclosure that be able
to see through and see the garbage can anyways? >> Well, it wouldn't be it would be to the colors. I mean, it isn't going to be completely glass. There's going to be frames and whatnot around the glass. And >> and if you look at half the businesses in town, what do you actually see on the
garbage enclosures? the gate that the garbage company uses to get to the dumpster. >> Not the sidewalls, not the back wall, the gate. >> So, can we be a little more lenient on that? Because you're not seeing anything other
than the gate anyways. >> Mhm. >> Yeah. It really just all depends on where the the business has their trash enclosure. >> Trash enclosure. Yeah. >> located on the property. >> And if it's in the rear of the building and the screened in storage, do they
actually need an enclosure? >> I don't think it hurts at all. >> I mean, um, >> what are you recommending as far as fact that it has to be of the same material? >> You know, but those enclosures, they're
they're typically not that huge. you know, they can be decent size, but not that huge. And um >> Yeah, but if you're having a glass building and they have >> Yeah. Well, I mean, that's Yeah, the glass I know you're not going to have glass around it. It'd be going to the colors that are on the building around
the glass, but um typically if they're going to be doing the same color as they have on the building, when they're ordering the rest of the stuff, they can order it with it. And and I know from experience, it's a lot easier. you can use pieces you got left over and whatnot from the construction
and um it's easier than ordering something completely different. I I think it just even though it's an industrial area and whatnot, there's no reason it doesn't it doesn't need to look neat and clean to a point.
My opinion, >> but all you're seeing in some of these is the gate. >> Well, on some yes, maybe. But what about the one that does show more? Especially when we have some of it button up against um some residential
areas and things like that. >> Well, uh you know what, we have a gentleman here that has 21 years of experience here in town >> along with you, Mr. Chair. As far as have we ever had any commercial um
trash enclosures issues? complaints >> or complaints? >> Uh, not so much. I mean, most of them get incorporated into the building. >> I mean, the one that sticks out that's not attached to the building be the dental office. >> Mhm. >> Right on.
>> Right on 19. >> It's like right on 19. >> Mhm. >> But otherwise, most of them are just built as a part of the >> or they don't have them. >> Or they don't have them >> then it's not an issue if they don't
have them. So, >> so they don't have to have the garbage enclosure is what we're saying. >> Well, some of them keep it on the inside and they roll it out. >> Keep them on the inside. >> Yep. >> Then you don't need it. Yeah. >> Mhm. >> They got the roller the dumpsters on the wheels and
>> it depends on what goes on it if it's food. Yeah. You're going to want it outside. >> Yeah. But that's that's the uh the ones that don't take it outside don't have that. But honestly, I don't I mean, if you can't see it, if it's
behind a wall in a parking area, >> does it really matter? >> Well, >> you know, that's the thing. If it's not visible from outside the walled area of of a building, it's not really a concern, I guess. I mean, if it's visible, if you can look
through gate and see it, then you're, you know, >> well, you probably shouldn't be poking your nose in there. But here again, you just ask, have you ever had any complaints or anybody say, "I don't want to do that. Where do I need to put that? >> I say do
>> uh well, from the, you know, owner or Yeah. You know, the person has to pay for it obviously wants to, >> but they're always going to go to the cheapest if they can, >> right? >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> I would say the biggest issue would be is if it abunded a residential
property. >> Yep. agree. >> I mean, can they leave the ordinance the way it is and say if this is a big issue for them to do it, they can >> come talk to us for us to >> if it's a make or break thing for them
to put a $5 million bill. >> But I thought the direction was we're trying to get a rid of away from speed up >> and to expedite the process. But yes, you were correct. That's why there are variance. The variance process in place
is to make sure it's not just for the person that's building it. As Joel stated the other night, it's about that neighbor. It's to here to protect the neighbor. >> Exactly. >> And it doesn't matter how perfect and true we think of these ordinances are, there's always going to be something
off, you know. >> Exactly. >> There's always going to be some we You can sit here and think day and night, you're not going to get everything. >> You're not going to please everybody or every situation. Funny is I don't ever remember seeing those dumpsters next to the dentist office and I've been over there quite a few times. >> I don't I guess I don't look for them so
I don't notice them. So >> I'm not even sure where you guys are talking about is enclosed. >> I know that it's enclosed. >> It's enclosed by a picket fence >> on four sides. >> If it's not smoke is enclosed by a
picket fence on two sides. the bar has nothing and that's been that way since the city built it in 84. >> Mhm. >> What I'm getting at is if it's if it's not a big issue, >> out of sight, out of mind, I guess. >> Yeah. Why why change it? If you're going
to just to please a couple people and you're going to >> But this one's going to be changed, I'm assuming. So >> I think we should come up with >> I think we should come up with a minimum standard if you want it and not >> make it match because we're not making them match the accessory buildings to
houses and this is basically an accessory structure. >> You say acceptable material as like your building. You know what? If they want to put a tin one and make it a something fancier
or galvanized look professional stuff. >> So, or we just go all exterior. >> That's why when it comes to ordinances, they should be very clear, right? >> It's boom boom boom. >> Yep. >> Because everyone everyone always everyone has a different opinion on what
>> exactly >> blight is or professional is >> then you guys have to deal with it. >> Yeah. So all exterior trash enclosers closures um shall be enclosed. >> That would work.
>> Well, that's for sure. But I mean now do you mean top also? >> Most of them can't put a lot of roof. >> They can wheel it out. They get the 10lex. >> They wheel it out. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. I don't
>> Yeah. The sides are usually six, eight ft tall. >> Yeah. >> I would just say have it enclosed. >> Just what if it's on the rear of the building and the entire rear of the building's screened in >> cuz you get into the entire
>> Well, if it's inside, you can't see it like >> be outside the building but inside the screening area. >> Yeah. If they have it screened in, well, then that's the same thing. But um >> if they got a 6ft concrete wall all the way around their building and they put a dumpster in there, are we ever going to
know about it? >> That's a little different. >> Yeah. I would say if it is of a permanent nature >> Mhm. >> but you know Oh, a screen. I'd put up >> cyclone bushes. >> Yeah. Bushes and Yeah.
>> And wait, the trash is all caught in the bushes. >> Yeah. >> That's called a filter. I myself I I I would leave it the way it is myself and not cause headaches.
>> To me, I would just say just make sure it's been closed in a permanent structure. It doesn't have to be, >> you know, I mean, if it's inside their gate, do we really tell them they have to put something around it that's special?
And this is going forward. So we can go back to anybody and say you have to change your garbage. Correct. >> Right. So >> um yeah, I don't know. I think we're making a bigger deal of this than what it really is and stuff, but
>> I just didn't want to make them have to use the same building material. >> I mean, acceptable material. You know what? If they want to make it block, >> you know, fine. Have at it. Well, they have block on the front to the the building and it's steel on the sides and
whatnot. >> So, hang on. Let me try to help here. >> Mhm. >> Thanks. All exterior trash enclosures or other accessory structures shall be constructed of acceptable materials. >> That works. >> Is that going to is that going to give us a win here?
>> That would give us a >> It depends cuz my >> materials might be different. What's acceptable? >> There isn't there is a list of acceptable. >> Well, we're accepting for to pick one for the actual building
>> as as acceptable materials as per your building. You know, I don't think they would let people put tarps on the side of the building as acceptable material. >> I mean, if they do the whole building in steel and they want a concrete in their garbage can, who cares block? I mean, it still looks good.
>> Ain't going to happen. >> Yeah. What if it's like trip? We got two wall uh six foot burm in a six foot fence all the way around. What if they want to match that to the sixoot fence >> cuz it's a white vinyl picket fence
that's going around quick trip. >> Well, it's enclosed. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. We love fencing material. >> Mhm. >> Is it just as simple as to just get rid of colors?
Well, it says matching colors and matching materials. Where do you put in their approved materials? Because obviously the building has to be approved, right? Whatever materials that they're using for >> I still don't think it's worth it. This
is people's livelihood. They got a lot of money on there. >> Yeah. >> I don't think they would want to screw around with, you know, >> with doing something to jeopardize it by, you know, I don't know if that would scare anybody away to have a >> I I don't see it where they're going to
design their garbage enclosure differently than the rest of the building, >> right? >> It's going to be >> use up what we got left and close it with that. I mean, if you've got steel on the on the three sides of the building, so you use steel on the garbage containers,
fine. Enclosure. If you got block on the front and you want to put block back there, which they'll never do, fine. But, um, >> a quick trip is putting block back there. >> Is that what they have? >> If it be part of the building, sure. Yeah. But I'm going to go put up a separate
>> all the BPs have all their garbage are closed in concrete. They're all concrete block >> and there's no concrete on the front of their buildings at all. >> But they just use it cuz it's safer instead of, you know, putting up a fence that somebody's going to run into and knock down every 5 minutes.
>> Yeah. >> The cost of block >> is more >> going to be right huge. >> But they're buying it in bulk. >> Yeah. You know, they're >> still don't give it away. I guess what are we trying to accomplish by changing it?
>> Well, being a little more lenient. >> And if you say that it has to match the block building, you already have to put block out there. >> If it's all block, yeah, >> but if somebody wants to come in and put
an entirely glass building, >> it has to be the same material. the building. >> Yeah, but that's not going to happen. Entirely glass. My god. But you're going to have frames around the windows. You're going to have frames around the glass. You're going to have all kinds of stuff like that that they could put
steel on that matches the color of that. And I don't see why that would be anything wrong with it. You know, you're not going to put a glass around a garbage enclosure. >> No. But that's the way the ordinance reads right now. >> Yeah. >> But there's no building that's going to
be completely glass. But it's kind of one of those things where it's you have something or you have nothing, right? >> Yeah. >> So, is it instead of all trash enclosures, is it all trash recepticles? >> Going to trash receptacles, then you're
talking about garbage cans that you have out in front of the building for your public. >> Well, I'm just trying to figure out some language here because we're at impass here of >> we don't want regulations and we do. So is or is it, you know, dumpsters, whether it's recycling or >> Yeah.
>> um uh garbage being in a um enclosure you can't see through or I in one of them it says that it just has to be 90% opaque and it leaves it at that. But in some of these it says that
it has to match the same material as the building. >> Well, uh, just watching our time here tonight, >> I'm going to circle this one and hopefully we'll run into something later on. >> All right, but this is something that as far as items of importance that we need
to come back to, we're going to come back to. >> That sounds good. >> All right. Uh, all mechanical equipment whether roof mounted or ground mounted shall be completely screened from the ground level view of adjacent properties and public street.
And then landscaping. All areas in B2 district not covered by buildings, driveways, and paved parking lots shall be sided or covered by ground cover deemed acceptable by the planning commission. The city may require a letter of credit or escro account if installation of the
landscaping occurs during periods of frost, snow, or drought. The city may require the screening or fencing of any side or rear yard facing residential district. So, look at we're answering our questions right here already >> as far as um
as far as B2 highway as far as butdding up to um residential Just to go back to this trash enclosures, is it as simple as all dumpsters used for garb garbage and or recycling shall be stored in an
enclosure that is 90% opaque? >> I'd be good with that. >> I mean, if we can't if we can't figure out the design standards for a garbage enclosure, how are we figuring out the standards for a building? >> I'd be all right with that. >> 99.99% of the cost of the process. >> Is that what's in here now or did you just write that?
>> Yeah, just just wrote it up. Okay. I'll be all right with that. >> All good, everybody. We need a motion. >> All right. Well, now we're not coming back to that. That's good. >> You want a motion now or?
>> No, no, no, no, no, no. This is only in review stage. There's not going to be any motions here tonight. This is progress. >> Let's talk about it. Okay. >> All right. So, lighting came up. This is going to be another topic here. So they the council wanted us to address lighting. Lighting uh shall be
consistent in character throughout the entire property site in both design and bulb type. Light directed upward is prohibited. That that right there we have an issue with already. >> Mhm. >> External lit signs, display, building
and aesthetics lighting must be lit from the top and shine downward. Lighting must be shielded to prevent direct glare. The level of lighting shall not exceed.5 lumens at any residential property line or one lumen at any non
residential property line. The maximum height for exterior lighting is 20 ft. Um all non-essential lighting will be required to be turned off after business hours, leaving only the necessary lighting for the site security. So, there's parts of this that I really
like. As far as Joel, when we got into the lighting plan for Quick Trip, I know that at one originally they spec higher lumens and they were brought down with the lumens that were specified in the city code. And I know that there was
neighbors that were very concerned about how bright >> Quick Trip was going to be. And now they follow fall into the city code. >> So I think the first thing is Mr. Va we got to get rid of the light directed
upward is prohibited. >> Yeah. You can't light any flags unless it's back up. So that's that's got to go. >> That is why we wanted that. >> Right. Well, I think the main intent of that was just shooting your lights straight straight up into the sky. >> It's because of the TV and >> you got that kind of light.
>> Yeah. It's 100% because of being shot. >> Yeah, I believe you. >> You're shining spotlights up into the sky to try to like blind a plane. You got too much money. >> Excuse me. I will help you with that problem.
>> So, I'm going to strike that light directed upward is prohibited. >> Right. >> All right. Uh any other >> design and bulb type because >> I mean does that going to take me I have to take my flood lights off the front of
my house because they're over my garage and I have a regular bulb in front of my door. >> This is for commercial. >> I know. still if you got a business like you know a couple of these up here they've got smaller lights around the
outside and they got lights by the front >> that's different bulb >> I know after we >> do all the B bulbs match on city hall currently is the question is there up here looking at this building if we're
not conforming >> well you don't we can be non-conform we don't have to conform >> I guess the the The initial question lead answer to your question is yes. >> Well, you know, then we should go we'll
have to build a garbage enclosure for the fireh hall. >> That's an old town. >> But you see I mean that's that's why you can't make the you know dodgance and then make everyone comply. >> Mhm. What do you mean bulb type? You know, do they have to have, you know,
say they have bright lights on the side and they put different ones on the front and they change the bulb type to yellow or whatever. Is that going to be a big issue with this? >> Well, you know, any responsible business that comes in is going to keep that.
They're going to consider that. I know at the meeting with Quick Trip there were people complaining about the lights going toward their building and all that stuff and we purposely on the way back from the cities when I stopped in at Quick Trip it was about 10:15 in Elco. That's one of the newest buildings.
>> Mhm. >> There's no light leaving that yard. Yeah, they've got it all directed straight down. And it's, you know, I I can't believe that any company would want to do that and then ask for the complaints.
>> Yeah. It would just be an after the fact thing of >> Yeah. >> light bulbs are expensive. >> Yeah. >> Well, yeah, exactly. >> Especially when they get into commercial LEDs and stuff like that. No, they're so directional that it's
>> Yeah. I think overall the intent is >> that the light stays on the property in question, not >> right and not off into the neighbors. >> Yeah. >> Mhm. >> So, are we okay just striking the light directed upward is prohibited and
leaving the rest? >> That's what council wanted when we heard that because we first thing that came to mind was flags. >> Flags. >> Mhm. >> Yeah. All right. >> I'm all right with that. >> Okay. >> All right. As far as design standards
go, uh materials, well, parking requirements, parking requirements given or adopted in the entire entirety of throughout the repeat verbatim in the section. Signage requirements, that's a whole different ordinance. Actually, we just approved that one
or uh made had an amendment. Uh performance standards following rules shall apply to all uses in district except that legal non-conforming uses may continue at the same performance level. That's what we're talking about existing businesses.
Uh all uses and activity shall be inside buildings with no outside storage or activity allowed unless conditional use permit is granted. Uh there shall be no no noise carrying beyond uh beyond a lot upon which a business is located except for normal
automobile and pedestrian activity. And then non-conforming materials all construction which repairs con reconstructs remodels or otherwise alters an existing commercial and industrial buildings shall not be required to meet all the standards but a
proportion. The level is determined by either of the percentage increased value of expansion will create the percentage of the increased square footage that will be created. Whichever is less. I mean, I can understand why that's in there to kind of bring some of these older buildings that want to make
improvements kind of current with the code. >> Mhm. But, you know, is that going to prevent a business from, you know, >> remodeling? >> It's going to increase. Yeah. It's going to increase the costs, you know, more
than it would be if it was just an addition. >> You know, hey, all right. I'm looking at an addition, a remodel, and it's whatever, $200,000. >> And now I need to put $20,000 of improvements on to the old building.
>> Mhm. >> I mean, I'm not saying should be taken out, but I'm just >> questioning it. You know, it's the intent of this ordinance is really to let the business owner decide their their building.
>> So, what is a non-conforming material? Brick would be conforming, correct? >> Steel what is a non-conforming material? >> Uh, it would be anything other than what's listed in
>> in this ordinance. H6 number two face brick breakoff brick breakoff block stone or glass curtain wall >> in this case it would be like vinyl siding and things like that that probably wouldn't be >> accepted maybe should have brought it up but it's like if we're
>> well >> and that's one of those things where it should match the kind of blend in with the rest of the buildings or somewhat >> um >> like an orange building off an 18 Yeah, >> it's fine.
>> That is there's no vi there's no >> no no violation there. >> No violation. So I don't know. >> Okay. >> All right. >> Okay. All right. Uh let's keep on moving to I2. Please go to um I think it's page
six that's noted of I2 medium industrial. [Applause] All right. Top of uh page 6B. Building and design and construction material materials in addition to other restrictions of the section and any other chapter. Any building or structure
within the I2 district shall meet the following standards. All buildings shall be designed to be compatible with surrounding uses. All exterior wall surfaces directly facing a public street show consist of one or more of the following. This is similar to what we just covered.
Do you want to I'm sorry. Incorporate uh incorporation of galv galv galvanized material allowed. >> Yeah. as accent. Yeah. Otherwise, you'll have the whole front galvanized as accent or trim. I guess it's kind of
the same thing, but okay. Uh, specifically designed pre-cast concrete units if the surface surfaces have been integrity integrally treated with an applied decorative material or textures.
Uh, factory fabricated, cast in place or pre-cast panel construction. If the panel materials are any of those names above glass or prefinished metal metal other than unpainted galvanized steel or iron or plastic
uh 65% of the front of front of a metal building must be masonary veneer glass or other material approved by the planning commission. Front is defined as the first floor of the side of the
building facing the street. On corner lots, front is defined as the side of the building having the address. In case of metal buildings, the planning commission shall prefer masonary buildings, but other types of construction shall be considered by the planning commission during the plan
review. The planning commission shall make a final recommendation to the city council which makes a final determination proving construction materials. Number five, in case of the construction which repairs, reconstructs, remodels or otherwise alters an existing industrial
building, the applicant shall not be required to meet all of the standards but >> proportion. >> Yeah. The level will uh be determined by either the percentage of the increased value the expansion will create or
percentage of the increased square footage that will be created whichever is less. All right. As far as we are at going down to five, um let's take a little time to reflect. Any comments uh
proposed changes uh besides the incorporation of galvanized material allowed as accent. >> I'd like to lax off that 65% must be the case. >> And hang on this back up. Are you referring to >> number three?
>> Number three. 65% of the front of the building must be masonary >> 35 air or you going to go to zero. >> Uh let's open it up for discussion.
>> I don't see anything wrong with the 65%. I if nothing else 50% that would be about as low as I would still want it to look nice. What do you guys think?
>> Trying to think any of the new businesses that went in that >> that don't look I mean they they all look >> I 50 Central Street West there is no masonry. There is accent trim and a different type of facade in the front.
It is steel that is texturized in sand and they are insulated panels 3 in thick. >> We have really good R value in that building because not only do we have that, we have a foot of insulated wall. Mhm.
>> But I know when they Dollar General that time where they were coming in, if you've seen the one in Lease Center and um other I've seen it other places, get name it right now. They >> don't look as nice.
>> No. And we got a lot of compliments. How did you get them to put a nicer front on? That's what I heard. Well, we just insisted and they put it on. They weren't going to back off because of that. especially when it's facing right on Highway 19 there.
>> There's other nicer materials. >> Oh, yeah. There probably are. But, um, there's a lot of nice materials. Otherwise, it would have been just steel with no trim or anything. Just a steel building. >> Mhm.
>> So, what is other material? >> Brick, Stuckco, >> veneer, >> block, >> glass. >> See veneer and glass. And then it says other material approved by the planning commission. >> Is that other material listed somewhere? Oh,
>> this is other material by the >> Yeah, >> which involves public hearings which drags it out at least a month. >> Darn it. But if they bring the uh plans to the
city and it meets that, that doesn't hold anything up. >> You going to take off or what? >> You hear that? >> All right. So, we're we're talking burners. We're talking about
when we're talking about currently it's 65% of the front of the metal building. >> All right. Chair, you said 50. Uh council member, you said 35 >> or less. >> Yeah. I don't know.
>> I don't see anything wrong with minimum 50%. That's half the front of the building. It's >> look nice. >> That would be just one side that faces the street. >> That is correct. Address >> the other side. They could put the >> plain tin on it that they want.
>> Mhm. >> Windows. Can they count as that square footage? >> Mhm. >> Wall. >> Yeah. Glass is part of it. >> Accent trim. We >> try to get away from is it just plain old Yeah. You don't want to get plain
Jane >> whole barn standing there. That's what we don't want. >> No. Then should look nice. Doesn't have to be brick. You can have accent trim. >> A lot of things you can do. >> Stuckco. >> Yeah. >> So knocking it down to 50 wouldn't be bad.
>> The windows take up a lot of space. Yeah, we got our accent trim that's going to take up another, you know, eight of >> you. The windows wouldn't be >> wouldn't be included in this because it's must be masonry, veneer, glass, or
other material approved by the planning. Oh, glass. >> I missed that. I guess windows are glass. Okay, >> what do we make? >> Windows. >> Okay, stand corrected. Pretty sure we're not at the Star Trek clear aluminum.
>> You guys got to quit thinking I'm perfect. >> Okay. >> I mean, yeah, with windows and that. I mean, you could easily cover 50% of a building. >> What do you think? Um, >> speak up, guys. >> Yeah, we need to keep on moving. >> Yep.
>> Circle back to it then. >> I don't know. Go to 50%. >> That's what I think, Mike. Or >> I agree. Yeah. >> All right. So, change it to 50%. >> It's a start. I mean, if they come up
with a better building idea and, you know, they can make it look nicer without it, we can wrap it down. >> Depends what's on there. Yep. >> Okay. All right. Any other comments? >> I don't think so.
Not by me. Uh loading area requirements. All loading areas in the district shall be on the side of the rear in the rear of the lot and shall be no less than 10 ft from the abuing residential area. Storage requirements. All outdoor
storage shall be screened from view by dense vegetation or 90% OPEC screening. Thank you, Mr. Ericson. All waste containers shall be screened from the view of 90% OPEC screening and kept in good repair. Chainlink fencing
with plastic inserts is prohibited. >> And then performance standards as to noise, odor, glare, exterior lighting, smoke, fire safety hazards, water supply, waste disposal, and performance testing are found throughout 153. >> All right, gentlemen. All right, let's
go to >> make that the um >> just general outside storage and the uh >> trash enclosures [Applause] >> outside storage and yeah get rid of that
>> make it trash storage also >> trash requirements >> if um if we're going to allow the dense vegetation Do we want to have some standards with that? Oh, connect K connects is having their
fall sale and I can get >> 4 foot tall evergreens for $200 versus 400, you know. >> Yeah, that'll work in 10 years, >> right? I thought we had a that >> or we could use or we could use our
standard for >> um >> whatever it is deciduous. >> Yeah. >> Where they have to >> I'm sorry we're like 6 feet tall or something but Mr. Chair you are correct when last year when the uh planning
commission was reviewing off street parking and storage on residential property >> got rid of that. >> We got rid of it. >> Mhm. Okay. So, but remember that's what we we still have to come back to that >> uh this year, but at the time Joel said,
"Oh, I I have something natural screening and it's only 1 foot tall and then when it's 10t tall, it's going to be on my neighbor's property." >> Yep. >> If you remember that discussion, >> I know we talked about it and I couldn't remember exactly what we did.
Okay. [Applause] All right. Um, CI, let's go to page seven. [Applause] Go to the bottom. A. All buildings shall
be designed to be compatible with surrounding uses. All exterior wall surfaces shall consist of one or more of the following. Brick, brick veneer, or products of similar quality and brick-like appearance.
Stones, stone veneer, or products of similar quality and stone-like appearance. Integral color specialty architectural concrete block such as textured burnished block, ground block, split rock face block or other concrete
masonary products of similar quality and appearance. Integral color architecturally pre-cast concrete panels having exposed aggregate light sand blast acid etch uh form
llinter tool natural stone veneer brick face and or cast stone finish uh glass curtain wall copper panel stuckle and then exterior insulated and finish system.
Other exterior other exterior wall product materials are similar quality appearance as those materials previously listed above as determined by the planning commission and city building inspector. Exterior metal wall surfaces, metal
siding panels are prohibited on all exterior walls except the following. Uh buildings over 10,000 square feet in area size at grade floor area may incorporate up to 25% prefinished metal
siding on exterior sidewalls and metal sighting may not be used on exterior walls along collector and arterial roadway. So I think this is where we're at. This is the I think we're talking
about the metal again. Correct. Mhm. >> As far as what changes are being wanted. Correct. >> Tom, did you want that struck again? >> Exterior metal wall surfaces. Metal
siding panels are prohibited on all exterior wall surfaces except for the following. >> For what? >> CI CI. >> CI. >> I believe you wanted that. >> You're going to do that with CITed. When this was put in there, it was uh
the the the um aim was to restrict so we wouldn't have the uh pole barn effect. I realized there's a lot of metal that's come out since then. That's a lot
uh metal siding panels. There's a lot of nice metal siding and stuff now, you know. >> Yeah, there is. and we're waiting on Thursday for a council meeting. But yeah, I mean my suggestion to you guys is we got C1
or only C1 is north side of commerce but then on the other side you got it. So south of commerce. So it's like what do you what do you want to see there? Mhm. >> You know, um I think it's one
>> imagine manufacturing as a conditional use. >> Like do we want to see manufacturing? You know, >> the I think when that was originally done, that's the only CI that we have is
>> um the remaining lots in the business park or the city owned lot in the business park. So, right, the mayor's correct. that's adjacent to them. Industrial on the south side, but then you've got everyone on Highway 19. That's the first thing you see when you're coming into town, I think it was. >> Yeah.
>> Um keep the appearances looking nice, >> but then also um at the time we didn't have any commercial, so continue that commercial up along Highway 19. >> We had set it up so that the nicest looked off of 19 and the further back
you went, the less strict it was. But uh >> just for >> Yeah. So I guess for this exterior metal wall surfaces I I'm okay with taking that out of there. >> So you're you're So you're you're making the recommendation to remove C, correct?
>> Yeah. >> Exterior wall. And does everybody uh support uh >> the chair? >> All right. This get rid of C. And then the impact to number one building over a thou 10,000 square feet
at grade level and are we um eliminating that also. Let's see here. Uh, >> buildings over 10,000 square feet in area size at gray gray at at grade floor area may incorporate up to 25%
prefinished metal siding on exterior sidewalls. Already allowing metal for >> Yeah, >> you don't need that one. >> I guess we could do away with that too. >> I suggest real quick. If you don't want to get rid of it, I would just increase
the percentage >> because you're limiting You're eliminating or you're eliminating the prefinished metal sighting. So if you don't want a full onboard, you know, >> that's what I don't want to be up to
75%. >> Mhm. >> You know, 75% of it can be refinished. >> I that'd be good. I would be all right with that. Yeah, that's what I don't want is the pole barn effect. >> We probably want to keep the part that says no unpainted, unfinished, or galvanized metal should be permitted.
But the galvanized we could probably get rid of. >> Yeah. Nice loaded accent. >> Yeah, we just have a >> as permitted as accent. >> Make it 75% refinish metal siding. >> Yep. >> All right. >> Do you want to do that on all square
footage buildings or do you want it just to be above 10,000? >> Yeah, I think you removed the 10,000. Just make it across the board. >> Universal. Yeah, >> that sounds good. All right. So, buildings may incorporate Buildings may incorporate up to 75%
prefinished metal siding on exterior sidewalls. Metal siding may not be used on exterior walls along collector and arterial arterial roadways. So are we receive eliminating metal sighting may not be used on exterior
walls along collector and and arterial uh roadways. I think so. Leave that as is, right? >> Wait, leave it as is or removal? >> You guys want to remove it? >> I would I mean we already figured out that they need to have at least what 50%
glass and all that stuff on the roadway, which is probably where the front >> front of the building's going to be. >> Problem is, we got commerce and then we've got 19. 19's most likely going to be the back of
the building. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Potentially. >> Potentially. >> So, where are we going with this? We're leaving it in or taking it out? >> I think leave it in. If it's if it's
first impression coming into town on 19 and you're going to see that >> that's going to be the back of the building. >> Yeah. Back of the building. But why can't it look decent? You guys decide opinions.
I know from experience that docks get smashed all the time. So, if you're going to spend all that money on that, it's going to be smashed up anyway. So, you got to be a little more lenient. And as far as standards, I recommend
that we make it so all dock doors are a height of minimum 14 ft off the ground. So, in case the semi doesn't hit your bumpers, it goes into the door instead of the truss. But you do want to drive.
>> Yep. >> What do you think, guys? >> Really no opinion. >> I'll be honest. >> That's a tough >> I got no scaler. You got to put a dock there at face of 19. Mhm. >> You know,
>> well, when we were reviewing AES, uh there was loading docks on the east side and then on the south side. >> Yeah. Well, yeah. 90% of them were on the south side, but >> 90% were on the south side. >> So, there were on the >> on the east side, >> east and north side. Was there one on
the north side? >> I don't remember on the north side. the east side because the setback to the north side was is help was basically hugging the requirements. >> Oh, they have that ring road. >> Yep. >> I guess that's not the way I I would have liked to seen it where they put the
docks to the south to the north facing Highway 19. Um >> it's a potential though. what's potential, but certainly will look a lot nicer coming into town and seeing the front of the buildings and the docks in the back behind or at least to the sides.
>> All right, gentlemen. Circle back to that one. >> All right, >> another circle back. All right. The planning commission may consider permitting a minimal amount of accessory design features covered with metal surface. All right. Such as
awnings or other decorative items if compatible with overall design of the building from aesthetics and architectural uh standpoint. All principal building and accessory structures shall have a permanent hard surface floor.
>> Uh there's one problem. We have garden centers as a option in this deer. If you have a greenhouse out there, you're going to want a permeable floor. >> Good point. >> So,
if we have a greenhouse, you're saying I can't open a bar with a dirt floor. That would be easy. Yes. I wouldn't have to vacuum or mop. Um, you know, I think, yeah, Jamie makes a good point. I mean,
>> there there's certain places where you don't want a permanent floor. >> Want hard floor, >> but that 5%. >> That is a greenhouse isn't necessarily the principal building though either. >> Well, it's the future of cannabis. Um,
yeah, that could change things. I mean, yeah. Well, sometimes you got to kind of take it as it comes and take a good look at it. Um, >> or with the exception of garden centers. >> Mhm. >> Yeah. >> All right.
>> Garden center greenhouse >> with the exception of garden center. >> I have >> What's the correct terminology for cannabis? >> Greenhouse. still be a greenhouse
greenhouse. >> You're the expert at >> I am not the expert. >> There are people in town with more knowledge than me. Dr. Bill knows a little more than I do >> cuz he helped break the bill. >> Uh, all subsequent additions and out
buildings constructed after the erection and original building construction shall be designed in the manner of conforming with the original architecture design and appearance. >> Good. Mhm. All exterior trash enclosures or other >> the other one. >> What?
>> Change it to 90% opaque. >> Perfect. Thank you. >> Change to 90% opaque. Okay. Thank you. All mechanical equipment whether roof mounted or ground mounted shall be completely screened from the ground level view and adjacent properties and
public road. And then we got into landscaping requirements. Uh all areas of CI district not covered by buildings, driveways and paved parking lots shall be seated, solded or covered by
ground covered or by ground cover deemed accessible by the planning commission. Installation of this landscaping during periods of frost, snow and drought may cause the planning commission require letter of credit escrow. We did not change it previously for the other
zoning district. Parking uh requirements we did not change. driveways. Uh we have not changed. Uh loading area requirements. Um um council member Vipka, all loading
areas in the district shall be on the side or in the rear of the lot and shall not be less than 10 ft from abuing residential areas. >> Where are we going to decide is rear and
front on the C1s? Are we deciding commerce here or are we deciding 19 is >> is the big question. >> Well, 19's always been the >> correct. >> Yeah. When you're coming into town, >> they'd be addressed off of commerce. >> Yep.
If you're telling them right here where their loading areas are going to be, then they'll design their mil their building accordingly. >> Mhm. >> Or they sure should. Well, they'll have to. >> So, you should probably put that loading has become to clarify
on this. >> Well, all right. Uh, loading area requirements. All loading areas in the district shall be on the side or in the rear of the lot and shall be no less than 10 ft from abuing res residential
areas off of commerce. >> But going back to that driveway restrictions, we might need to make exceptions like we had to over in the old industrial park
>> depending on the situation. If they have a bunch of docks >> 100 feet across and they're only 100 feet from commerce, it' be pretty hard to back in off of a 32 foot driveway. >> Mhm. And that's later on or that's her
>> coming to that. >> We're coming to that. >> So I'm sorry. What were you going to say? I just don't know if we want to make it sight specific to commerce or highway highway 19. Why can't we just say >> currently that's the only place that the CI is
>> Yeah. Why can't it say must be to the side or the rear of the building, >> right? >> Depending which way you're facing the building. So that you've got the nice part of the building facing the street. >> No. >> Yeah. I don't
>> you know then I suppose it depends on are you on a curve, are you in a corner? >> Yeah. Well, you know, >> when they design the building, they should be taking all that into consideration. But >> if the whole purpose of this is to give decision making back to the business
owner or building owner, >> do we want to dictate the flow of their plant operations? >> No. But then we have to >> I mean to me that is a you know if I was looking at building a building that would be more important to me. So where would you
>> if you did let it >> materials I have to have on it. It needs to function a certain way and product comes in here and it goes to this and it goes to this >> and then it goes out the door. >> But if you did have it where if they wanted to uh
load to the front of the building, what are you going to do as far as they would have to move the building way back or they'd be backing the trucks off the street. >> Yep. And that's the way the AES was proposed. It was pushed up against Highway 19
>> and it came out. >> Okay. >> There was access off off of Commerce, but it was the side of their building >> in the the front of their building actually faced >> to the to the west. >> Oh, okay. >> And they utilize that.
>> We hear how they panhandle or whatever for their parking. >> Yeah. >> They come in with a plan for what they want to do and they should know what they need. They should design it to fit the lot. If it don't fit the lot, well then you buy a bigger lot. What else are you going to do? >> Yeah,
>> right. >> Well, I don't know. We only got so much land to sell. >> Yeah, we want them to buy our lot. >> I mean, if it don't fit, it doesn't fit. It's like uh somebody putting up a big house and and they want to oversize the
garage and they come for a variance. Well, >> that that's typically the way it's done. It's >> Yeah. when when it should be find a lot that >> building now it's I got a building >> now to find a lot. >> Mhm. >> Yeah.
>> Okay. >> So, are we leaving this alone? >> I think so. It's my opinion. What do you guys think? >> Yeah, >> it's worked. Yeah. >> Yeah, I think so.
All right. Signage requirements, uh, refer to 153.079. Storage requirements. All storage green by dense vegetation. 90% we're going to use. We're going to use a standardized for the previous two zones that we've covered.
>> Performance standards. uh performance standards is is to set no noise no noise order glare exterior lighting smoke fire safety hazards water supply waste disposal and performing testing are found throughout chapter 153
>> Tom did you want that struck >> number 14 performance standards performance standards as to no noise nose god noise >> Mr. chair. It's getting to that time. >> Yep. It's getting close. >> Uh noise, odor, glare, exterior
lighting, smoke, fire, and safety hazards, water supply, waste disposal, and performance testing are found throughout chapter 153. The following rules shall apply to all uses in this district. Didn't we have a conversation with a
possible cannabis vendor that was very concerned about the water waste in this area coming through protection uh production >> or just you know if you had some type of a crearyy or dairy or something that
>> you know can significantly change our >> chemistry at our wastewater treatment plant. We definitely would require pre-treatment and things like that. So, it was more of a >> acceptable concentrate
>> once it got into our our system. >> I think he was more with the noise and glare, >> but I can't remember, >> you know. Oh, I can't think >> I
mean >> I don't know saying C1 it's that only portion that the city owns and it's in a right next to the I2 and I look at how on here we have all mechanical equipment
whether roof mounted or ground mounted should be completely screened but then on it we don't even have you know, and then I mean I guess my thing is, well, we already got exterior lighting.
If we look at smoke, fire, and safety hazards, well, they're going to go escape, whatever the state applies on them. So, I mean, I don't know. This this 14 just seems to be a little loose, and I guess it could be defined a little
better. But to say no outside storage on on C1 I don't know because I think C1 could be abundant by two at any point. I mean we could we could end up you know
squaring up where uh Congress ends up going south and we could square that up and let that be sealed. But we could have the rest of that plan be too. >> So how would you like to see it worded? >> Are they together
performance standards? I mean are they business guided by the state? You know what what's our jurisdiction with? >> You know does it work with our police and fire? access to it. What are we doing here? Because are we
going to go like yearly checks? Like you got to >> No, I I think >> there check it or >> No, I I think what it was what was what it was meant for was if you get a complaint, but yeah, I can see where you're saying
that. It's kind of vague. >> Well, it would go back to our city code chapter 153, which I believe is our subdivision ordinance. Okay. >> Because we have that we have this
performance standard. >> Um well we is well I mean really they they got their site plan approved and as far as any conditions I don't believe that we imposed any on them. >> Nope. They addressed everything
and and it passed and yeah, >> noise. They addressed noise, odor, glare, exterior lighting, >> smoke, fire. Uh the fire department reviewed their plan. >> Okay. >> Water supply, waste disposal, water
supply, waste of disposal. that was reviewed by the city by the Dornfeld, the public works director. Well, and that's where we get into a different uh zoning district as well. Like I said, I think the or not think
the intent of the commercial industrial was to allow a blend flexibility and the use of that land, >> but then since it is the gateway to town, Highway 19, it was a little little higher standards then. >> Yep. Yep. even though it is just across the
street. >> Right. Right. >> And I think that too quite a bit. You know, you want to protect your >> And that's just for context. I mean, if if it changes a change, this >> Right. Yeah. >> But I'm kind of curious if
>> as we're defining and saying like what B1 B2, you have to have an enclosure. Mhm. >> You should have that on your address and see >> I would think so. >> I also say they got to cover up the rooftop units
when they're already going to be almost right at level with 19 when they build the building. >> Mhm. >> It's you're going to see And you'll probably see the garbage dumpers no matter what. >> You just put it on the ground and then
just put whatever around it and no matter what you're going to see it on 19 or you're going to see at their entrance if they go on. >> I'm sure there'd be other scanner filtration bill. They won't have screening for any of theirs. dispatch
doesn't, you know, and you're right in the scene here. >> All right. What do you guys think? >> What are we wanting to do with that? >> Yeah, >> that's my question. >> The state to cut 19 shorter on the hill.
either we uh get a little bit more specific or throw it out or am I missing something? >> I was looking at the acceptable uses and restaurants in there. What if another business like Smoke would want to build
up here and we say no smoke, no fire? That just put them right out of being able to build in there. >> Mhm. >> So, is that striking number 14 then? removal. >> Yeah, >> I think so. >> Still not sure how we have
>> no outside activities allowed. So, you're not allowed to go from your car. >> That's just it. >> Have no outside activities. >> Yeah. But you could >> I think this is like excessive nuisance. >> Yep. Yeah. >> You know, you got nothing to fall back
on if you don't limit it at all. or an odor, especially you're talking about cannabis. >> Yeah. >> Spilling that all their time. >> There won't be much odor coming out of those buildings. >> Cleaning door. >> You can't smoke inside a building. >> They're pretty good about filtering that stuff. >> Your own building.
>> It's tight. >> Yeah. >> You're not >> Mhm. >> I have a better time getting a suppressor than I do trying to get into one of those buildings. I just did some training on the cannabis and it said that they don't even want any outside exposure to their crop
because >> correct >> anything can contaminate. So they're not going to plant in the ground. They're going to plant in a pot in a greenhouse most likely >> with the exception off of 52 going to Rochester. >> They've got a maze that you can go through.
>> Oh that white on the the white building on the >> Oh, I saw that. Yep. Yep. >> A maze. Yeah. >> Yeah. The guy that's probably like 12 feet tall growing to the south of their building there. >> It's a CBD manufacturer. They have a hemp maze out in their field for one.
>> That's a good idea. You're going to get a bunch of people doing that maze. >> They can't get stone. >> All right, gentlemen. >> We We're quickly approaching 8:30 here. >> Yes. >> Um I want to wrap up the CI and we still need to talk about we still have one
more agenda item. So is at this time are we leaving the performance standards here or are we removing them? >> I say leave them for now. >> Can we remove the smoke and fire? >> I would take that on a as as they come basis.
>> So but remove smoke and fire or we >> uh All right. But I would leave the rest there. >> All right. All right. All uses and activities shall be inside buildings with no outside storage or activity allowed unless a conditional use permit
is granted. >> Good. >> Are we removing this one? >> I would say yes because of the fact that quick trip you got to sit in your car and just magically make the gas show up. >> Quick Trip's not >> They're different. >> But I mean I'm saying it's like any
business. So, you're going to just sit there and stare at your stuff outside. >> Yeah. You know, it's cheaper to if it can if it can sit outside and be weathered, >> you know, you don't have doesn't make sense to have to pay for a structure to store it in.
>> Does it make me >> um I I think it all depends on what it is. >> Exactly. Yeah. I know it's it's >> I mean the hardware store has potting soil whatever outside. >> Mhm. >> You know
bring the lawnmowers out seasonal stuff. So yeah >> you know you're not going to cover every building that every business that wants to come in. It's not going to work for everybody. And I I guess that's why the
unless a conditional use permit is granted. Yeah. I say it should stay for now. All right. All right. There shall not be no noise carrying beyond a lot upon which a
business is located except for normal automobile and pedestrian activity. >> Yep. That's question. >> I can tell everybody's getting beat around here and stuff, so >> there's no fire left there anymore.
>> That one I understand. That one makes sense. I mean, you don't want somebody air breaking every time they come by. >> Uh, leave it at >> We're going to leave it at that. >> And gentlemen, we're going to move on here. Uh, we got the uh we we did a very
thorough review of what the council requested. uh B2, I2 and CI. >> We will continue the uh review of the other zones. >> Um at an upcoming meeting. >> Yep. Sounds good.
>> And then, Mr. Chair, um >> do we want to add in Do we want to continue with review and discuss city code 153.078 078 off streetet parking tonight or bring it to another meeting?
>> I think bring it to another meeting. I don't see where that's that earth shaking, is it? >> Well, what what I can say about this is that the city's not off track in this. Uh there's a support attachment in here that commercial driveways, they range
from 24 ft to 32 ft >> and we're right in the ballpark. >> Mhm. Um, this is not an urgent matter. I know that the council wanted it to be addressed >> as far as it being addressed. Council member Bosea, just getting rid of the
driveway entrance uh maximum width or just increasing it to from 32 to >> That wasn't a really hard one. Mhm. Yeah. It kind of just depends on the situation. >> Depends on the situation and flow of
traffic. You should >> most businesses should be allowed an in and out just to smooth things over. So if they only have a 100 foot wide lot, give them two 24 foot driveways across
the front and have a 50ft curve in between them. I think it depends on the type of building, the lay of the building, >> you know. Um, I think we should be open to that. If you've got somebody like we had with that trucker, >> Mhm.
>> you know, that made perfect sense. There wasn't even any discussion about that. It just, you know, certainly want to help the guy out. >> But, >> well, again, a lot of it goes to the conversation you were having before. >> Is this the right lot? >> Mhm. >> For >> Yeah. >> for what you need
>> there. Yeah. there, >> you know, and there are Al's drift shop, you know, old Mala Trucking >> is, you know, that was >> pull into the pull into the bay and, >> you know, with your >> your tractor and your semi and
>> you know, I think this was just for ease to access the whole site, >> right? Yeah. >> So, Mr. Mr. Chair, we'll follow up at the >> I think so. >> We'll move it to old business uh at the September meeting.
>> Okay. All right. That won't be the special meeting. >> No, that No, no, no. That that Thank you for clarifying that. That will not be the special meeting. That will be the regular uh meeting time. >> Okay. All right. Do we have anything else we
need to discuss or get discussed with? Oh. Uh, Mr. Chair, just one thing. Okay. So, as I mentioned earlier in the meeting, I I do need to bring this back. Um, we need to bring back uh and finish uh city code 153.077.
It's not 78. This is different than the 78. Uh off streetet parking and storage on residential property. This is parking pads. >> I would like to It's my goal is to wrap this up this year. So, I do need to add this back. >> Um, we have a lot of things coming
>> uh down or coming our way with the apartment complex and with the Bixby property. So, it's still I like I said, I just want to go on record that it's still my goal to add this to the agenda and complete it this year. >> Okay. Bixby property back on.
>> Bixby property is back on. Yeah. Hopefully. >> All right. Good deal. All right. If that's it, nobody has anything else to add or subtract. We need a motion to adjurnn.
>> Motion. >> We have a motion. >> A second. >> A second by Jeremy. Motion by Mike Harding. All in favor? >> I. >> All oppose. Motion carries. We got to do this.
>> That is a wonderful sound. >> All right. Thank you God.