You're supposed to [Music] put You heard Joe, right? Yep. Earlier, I did too. I heard it on the testing video. Pretty good
some feedback. playing the piano over Go away. [Music] Yeah, we can see how that sounds. What if we turned off half the mics? Did that So now did the sound go away?
Oh, you just turned your phone down. I'm at a loss. What do you guys want to do? Biggest decision of the night. [Music] Right now we are aware the sound quality is not great.
Great. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. So, just make sure you talk in your mics. Okay. Are we ready? Yeah. All right. Hello everyone. Welcome to the special city council meeting called to order.
This meeting, Tuesday, June 17, 2025. You all please stand for the pledge of allegiance. of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with
liberty and justice for all. All right, thank you. Roll call. Brian Wormkers here. Kyrie Miller here. Tom Berg here. Jamesa here. And Scott Palava here. All right. Approval of the agenda.
Are there any additions, deletions, or corrections to the agenda? I'll make a motion to approve. Motion by Miller. Second by Palava. Any further discussion? All in favor? All opposed? Uh there are no minutes. There's no
public hearings. Presentation is citizens petitions and comments. Comments limited to two minutes. So if we aren't done the agenda, now is your time to speak. All right. Uh there are no items on the consent agenda tonight and there is no old
business. So on to new business to discuss the city's preliminary 2026 budget and property tax levy. Joel Ericson. All right. Thank you mayor and members of the council. Uh this is the second meeting that we've had pertaining
to our proposed 2026 budget and property tax levy. Um discussion at the the first meeting was was pretty basic and I'm sure we'll go over some of that. Uh again tonight uh information that was requested to be provided were um another
option on the uh for the property tax levy and how that impacts uh certain valued homes. Um the assessment policy which I'm sure we'll touch base more on when uh we talk about road and bridge and street maintenance and and things
like that. Uh items proposed to be talked about tonight. uh options again for the property tax levy. Uh the public works director and I have met to go over the water and sewer departments um at least for high level discussions for
tonight. Um otherwise utilities, things like that are just get done and get projected out based off of um historical uses and anticipated expenses for the the upcoming year. Uh and then this compensation study which
was uh presented at the June 12th council meeting and then also will be presented next Thursday at the June 26th meeting when um our consultant that's helping with the project will be here to go over that and answer any additional
questions of the council. I guess to start off, if the council has any specific questions or otherwise we can get right into the property tax impact or property tax levy and impact.
Uh I guess one of the questions I have is do we want to talk about public works first before we go into the property tax uh the tax rate in the tax levy? I I get a little nervous because I'd hate to say
We're going to keep the tax rate the same. We're going to keep the levy the same, but then push public works to one to five years, but there are some more immediate items that we should be talking about. Does that make sense?
Sure. So, um I I do want to go over uh public works right now if that's okay with you, Joe. That's fine. Um, as far as I know, um, I I missed the
last for the kickoff meeting. So, um, I'd like to go first if that's okay with council on this. Uh, but one of the immediate things that I think we need to be talking about is uh the dry beds, pre-treatment.
Um, that's a 20-year equipment that we should be looking at an upgrade here pretty soon because it is desperate as a need. There's also a refrigerator um that should be replaced.
The sample refrigerator, I think. So, right here. Is that on a Is that kind of something you'd like done right away or No. So, there was one So, there's two sample refrigerators. one effluent, one influent.
The fridges, if I don't quote me on exact dollars, but I'm going to say they're around $8,000 for the sample fridge. The sampler on top is not the problem. It was the fridge that went bad, but they're a specific
make to connect to the sampler. The one that we replaced, it was last summer or two summers ago. We just did it in house. We went and bought a $100 college fridge at Menards and just drilled a hole in it and it's
been working great for at least one year. It might even be two. Yeah. Um like I said, those Inco fridges are rather expensive and they're just kind of the same same thing as what we kind of made in house at home. Um, I don't
see a specific need for that specific refrigerator. Um, sampler equipment would go down. I think at that time it would be the time to go after the the whole unit. Okay.
Um, is that something you want to budget for next year just in case? Um, I feel pretty confident in the fact that um The fridge fix that we did, like I said, is working. Um, I would have to look
back in our records. Um, back when Dale Fear, the previous to Jordan, when he was working here, we had some sampler issues and so they were fixed. So, those aren't totally 20 years old. There's been repairs done to them in the past. Um,
I guess to my knowledge, Jordan hasn't made it me aware that there's been any issues with the samplers. They've been working. Everything's been good. Temperatures have been good. Everything's in the parameters. Um, so the fridge samplers are not on my radar
for 2026. Okay. I just wanted to make sure that we don't miss that if if it was and you know, we can make it available together. Um, let me make sure I Yeah. So, the big thing was the uh dry
beds if we plan to go that route, but then um we need uh a little bit more information with that. Now, does that have to be funded by a study or is that something that we feel comfortable being
recommended, get a price tag on it? So, I don't feel confident in recommending um or just kind of, hey, we want this. Um we met with Balden Bank yesterday um
to kind of get them on board, shook hands, introduce ourselves. Um, these are kind of the things that we're thinking about projecting for big projects. Um, coming up here, um, I believe 2014 was the last time the
city did a study on storage, buying land, reed beds. Um, there's just a lot of different parameters that have changed in the MPCA since 2014. I want to make sure number one, we're following all of
those. Number two, we're abiding by our chloride variance that we just got our permit. And number three, that we're making the smartest decision for the city of Lndale and we're setting ourselves up for future operators as we come. Um, you know, 20 years goes by in
the blink of an eye, but at the same time, it's a long time for that equipment, and I just want to make sure that that is the absolute best option for the city. Um but with that said um you know I meeting
with Bolden make yesterday we don't have any prices on what that study would cost. Um I would imagine we'll get some pricing here before budget season's over so that we can throw that in these enterprise funds to complete that study in 2026.
Um my personal goal would be to get that treatment plant to a self sustaining. So the city is just we we're not relying on anybody's land or the crops or the weather or anything else.
But with that said, you know, if there is a better option out there that we should explore, I would like to have all those options. When we're talking in 2014, I believe it was $1.4 million upgrade to the treatment plant. I think
we need to do our homework before we spend that kind of money. Um because I know that uh we also have the airators on there too. Correct. And then what's going to happen with the old airators?
Well, currently we have five air raators. So we'll we'll call them new and old. Yeah, we have old ones that are not in service anymore. Took them out of service. say 201
14 15 somewhere back in there I would say and it wasn't kind of a it wasn't a lump sum purchase it was a couple here a couple here a couple here as our old ones started falling off um we still have all of our original air raators
um I guess my recommendation would be we could get those on gov deals or sell them for scrap or okay whatever we need to do The five that we have, four of them are in service right now.
They have performed spectacular. Um, the thing I want you guys to realize is those are when they are put in service, they never shut off. They are running 24 hours a day, 365 days a year, rain, snow, cold, whatever, they are
running all the time. They are huge energy consumers. Um, so at a minimum I would be looking for three air raators. Um, I think for 140,000 by the time we
get air raators, the carriages that go underneath them and a call to an electrician to get the necessary wiring done to retrofit them for the other pond. Um, just the cable has been hanging there for a long time. Just want
to make sure that everything is is up to par before we get these things up and running. Joe, you have all four. You have four online and one is a backup. One is a backup. Correct. Okay. So then if you purchase three more, we would have four. We would be back to fully. So
if one went down, it wouldn't be we wouldn't necessarily need to have a a backup one available for a short time. So the the reason we have a backup now is we experimented with trying five air raators in the pond and it messed with
the pond liner and rocks too much. Um up until then we didn't have any backup area before if the council feels that we need to have one. I don't personally feel like I I wasn't sure if that was what it was for. Um, but I mean we're
need to add another 30,000 just sit outside, right? gauge. Now, the one thing about those air raators is would it uh when you had looked into them, are they still like the Baldwin motors that's on
because I I wonder if you get like a rebuild kit or, you know, just another one on the side just in case for the original four that are being used today. Just so then that way you got it. I certainly certainly can do that. That
way you're not buying a entire system is set up there. The we we certainly can the the mo the in in the history of the wastewater treatment plant from my experience the motors have not been a problem at all. It's the bearings and
all the moving parts that wear out. These new air the the old original ones for all bearings you get from CarQuest. It's like 50 wheelbarrow wheel bearings all lined up around a shaft. the new ones.
It's a ceramic sealed bearing, right? Much more dependable. And I think you had said it uh before and remind me, but I think you had said there's a shop within 50 miles of a radius that you can get parts for that like almost next day or
something for that or was that something else? That was pumps. That was pumps. Okay. All right. Yeah, I think it would be good to have like a rebuild kit, just a spare kit. Absolutely. Yep. I I agree 100%.
But I I think air raators for sure next year. Yep. I hate to say it like this, but right now it's it's we have there is no option. Yep. We have to have it. We shut the one pond down. Oh boy. 200
n 10 somewhere in there because we're running at 35% capacity. Well, it's 2025 and we're at 60% capacity. Yeah, it just it's it's holding but losing ground is how I
could describe it the best way. Is there a way we can pull out of the sewer? So then that way you can get that on order almost a little sooner than waiting until January. Yeah. Council can make a motion to
approve that expenditure. And then uh and then you don't have to worry about that for 26. It would help the process. I mean, we're we're set to we've we've been striving for this in 26. So, I mean, if the council decides
that's what it wants, it's not going to hurt the operation. Um, but that action, I I don't know all the steps that are if it's just as simple as the motion to do it. Um, but we would be fine if if we went through the whole
budget process and and we purchased them in 26. The other caveat with these air raators is I think the best way to project the electric use is to double it. Um, that's
maybe going to be a tad bit high, but those are kind of the air raators and the blowers are the are the big energy users up there. Was are you saying double the 80,000? I think it is that would be the total. I
think 40 now would be the number that's accelerated correct. And then we got the uh water tower study that's going to happen this year yet. Um but that brings up the main loop, right?
You want to you want me to run through sewer all the way? Well, you can do that. That's fine. Yeah. Um, all right. So, just some high level things on here. Um, for I think we are in year four of our televising system.
We have jetted the whole city. 25,000 a year gets us televising. That keeps us NASCO compliant. Um, that's been enough for the two years that we've televised our sewers and then public works just
gets the areas that we need. Um staff agreed quite a few years ago that this is a just a more efficient way other than having a half a million dollar jitter truck sit in the shop for 11 months of the year. Um the jeter truck that we have is perfectly capable
of emergency services should we need to use it. Um the current manhole ceiling program I threw 20,000 on that. We haven't we've been experiencing drought so it's kind of I didn't feel it was responsible to throw money sealing manholes when we don't have any that are
leaking. Um, this year has been kind of back to normal. So, once I get my report back, that will lead me to recommending manhole ceiling or not for 2026. Um, we have 8,000 in for manhole casting
adjustments in the roadways. That was a new thing for 2025. Previously, they had all come from road and bridge. I felt that was appropriate being part of the sewer infrastructure to pay for it out of the sewer. Bioolids, I have 30,000 on there. Um, it's not quite half of what
the expense has been in the past, but I wanted a buffer in there in case we needed to until this study is done and we decide if we're going to do sludge storage or drying beds or or what have you. Um, I wanted some money in there in
case we need to haul to new PRA or my council or something like that to just get rid of 100,000 gallons so we can make it till fall. Bugs are $25,000. Um, and then for long-term goals, I have to replace the equipment in the
pre-treat room at the wastewater treatment plant. Um, I have a long-term goal on there. I would say it's a fiveyear goal. Um, it could be sooner, but I think five years is where we're at. We're looking at probably a half a million dollars of
equipment in that room alone. Um, and do you want to just share with council real quick why it's so important? because, you know, I just want to make sure everybody knows because so the the most important part of the treatment plant, the treatment
process is the pre-treat room that catches all the rags, all the hair, all the debris, everything that you don't want going into your pumps. The worse that equipment operates, the higher expenses we will have in pump
maintenance, electricity used just for how hard things have to work. Grease builds up on all of everything. So that really is the most important room that we have at that plant.
Secondly, um you know, we've got 20 years out of that equipment in that room. We've had a couple of hiccups along the way. It's mechanical. you can expect things to break down. Um, with this new equipment, I would strongly recommend that we buy things that are made in the USA. Um, the current
equipment we have is made in Germany, and I can tell you firsthand when that equipment fails. It is every 2 hours somebody has to come in and manually run the screens and clean them so that we don't flood. Um,
everything is pricey. Made in USA, made in Germany, made here, there, everywhere. It's all expensive equipment. The problem is getting it from Germany to here in a time frame that
it's a reactionary process. Correct. And um it's equipment that you just, you know, we can't have $150,000 worth of spare parts hanging on a shelf. Um this last
that we did to the bar screen. Um the lead operator and I, Jordan, he we took it apart ourselves, broke it all down. We brought it to the local um arm shop here in town. They were able to fabricate some of the of
the screen fins for us and we just put them back on ourselves just to keep the process moving. Um otherwise, like I said in the past, it's been months that it takes to get this equipment. Um, yeah. I don't know what the council's thinking if if we wait until we get this
study back from whether drying bed, storage, what what have you, is the best option and we put this all as one project or if we think that it's necessary um now, but I would say the the clock is ticking and I put that goal at five
years. Um then just so this council is aware um our lift station we have new pumps installed in 2023 and 2020 they have a life expectancy of 20 years. One of the old flight pumps, one of the
originals um is on our shelf as a backup. So we no longer are depending on any pump repair places for a loaner. We have our own. Um, it's not one that I would recommend putting in service for
months and months and months at a time, but it's something that's going to get us through. Um, we did put new base elbows and piping in 2023. Um, so that lift station is in excellent condition. Um, we are set for another 20 years. The
only component of that would be to consider a panel rehabilitation. Um, the orientation of that panel, I don't like it. I don't like it from the start. It kind of the operators forced to stand with this back to the lift station. So, we have talked about this
in the past. Um, rotating it 90°. My recommendation would be we upgrade that panel and and rotate the orientation of it for safety when the software upgrade is needed, which is coming. I don't have a hard date on it.
This is kind of the technology around the world has to get to the wastewater industry. Um, but when we when I say software, hardware upgrade, that is our SCADA system, our alarm systems. It's everything that calls us out. It's what runs the plant. It's all our automation.
Um, I think 2018 was the last upgrade that we did for that. So, I think we can we can tackle that when the software hardware upgrade is needed. Is that something we can do in house?
No, that's an automatic system. Um, one thing that I do want to mention though is when we're talking about the bio solids, how much is the POS going to affect when we try to inject it into farm fields or try to bring it to Met
Council? So, we did a preliminary test just because it made me nervous. I don't want to with especially with starting this new program with the bugs and I don't want
to be sitting on Halloween night with a full digtor not being able to even put it anywhere. Um, so we did a prelim preliminary test. We are okay as of right now.
I can't guarantee I mean the future I we have a mass mode coming in or something like that. As of right now, everything is okay for the city of Lawndale's um POS testing. Um
I also believe one's water, one's sewer. One's 26 and one's 27. I think the sewer one is 2027. So I think this year we are okay. Anyways, um they're still kind of trying to get all those rules in place for the
parameters, right? Yeah. And same with the uh you know I know we're going through that variance too and um things are hitting hard on that wastewater treatment facility. So I want to treat it as a huge priority. Um I do want to
get some numbers together or whichever direction we want to go. So then that way next year when the community fund project opens up again, I can throw something at it that we're not expecting within, you know, two years,
three or see if we and just keep throwing it out there cuz when I was looking through the community fund project, a lot of these cities were putting their wastewater treatment in there and u it hits a lot of criteria. So, uh, and then we talked about, uh,
the state bonding bills too for some items, but, you know, if we can, you know, farm that price tag out, you know, anywhere we can, at least we have the numbers. So,
chloride variance is kind of a it's kind of a tricky one. It comes from the water and detected in the sewer. Yep. So, um, we are currently working with UC Labs. They are who does all of our testing. Um
we're just going to section off areas of town. If you look at our sewer system as kind of a grid, we're going to go to pinch points. See if we can see our loading. It's part of our action tree that um FDC say we would do to avoid the
water treatment plant upgrade or put it off I should say for 15 years. Um, so we are doing our homework. We are trying to see what what we can do. Um, if if at all anywhere where it's coming from. I will say the 19 years I've worked here.
Um, the data is the data. It it is what it is. It hasn't changed. It's not like in 2015 something happened and suddenly in some huge violation. It's been consistent for a long time.
I I just want you and especially Jordan to know that, you know, you guys are getting support with this and we are going to take this serious. So, I I just want you to know that um any way to make it work um you know, let
us know. We appreciate that very much. The studies are going to be important for us to figure out here relatively soon. So, yes. Yeah, that was kind of the the main takeaway from our meeting with Bolden Bank yesterday is um I think it was
reiterated many times we're we're going to hit the ground running. So yeah, I hope they're ready. Um we want to slide over to the water. Um I just wanted council to understand um the
wellhead protection plan phase one is completed. Phase two was budgeted to complete in 2025. Um, Balden Bank is aware of that from our meeting yesterday. Um, the water tower sighting study was budgeted to complete in 2025.
So, those funds should be there um to get that completed this year. Um, one thing, this is a new one for you guys. Um so the completion of the MXU and meter installations
um we have 121,000 in MXU installations left to complete. We have 148,000 in meter installations left to complete and then it's an additional 115,000 for AMI installation. AMI installation is a
device that goes on our water tower where city hall can get final reads monthly billing. They can do it all from a push of a button on their laptop. Um, we can also read with our cell phones. Um, this is a goal that the city
has been working on since 2015. We've just allocated funds every year. We've been chipping away and chipping away and chipping away. Um, we purchased a new leader reading device last year, $7,800,
something like that. Um, the reason this hits um so sudden in this budget meeting is because I was informed that census in 2027 will no longer make or support those handheld devices that we just purchased after
2027. So, not that it won't work, it will still work. It's just it goes down. If it goes down, you're done. Sorry, folks. That's it. Nothing. Um,
I guess my recommendation is we really get aggressive with the MXUS. 121,000, that's about 600 MXUs that are left to complete out of,700. Um, so like I said, we haven't chipping away. The meters are 800 meters left. Um, the MXUS, if we
bought all 600 of them with ease, we could have them installed in one year and we could be in compliance by this 2027. The water meters don't necessarily have I shouldn't say that they don't
have to be replaced. They they're not dependent on the AMI system to have the new meters. Um, if we completed the meter installation, the city then has the option to visit if
we would like to continue billing in thousandgallon increments or one gallon increments. With this AMI installation, we always we also have the option um to install meters in people's homes for the repetitive non-payments. Um, they can be
shut off from a laptop in city hall. Nobody has to go anywhere to do anything. What What does that look like though? If you have a repeated offender, you you have to give us permission to, you know, they have to give permission to go in their house and do that or
you're just saying that they would they would all have that ability. I the the recommendation was, you know, if you have seven repeat offenders every month, those seven people get their ankle bracelet water meter installed and then
right from here. That's my point is though they they would have to grant permission for that to we would need to get we would install Okay, I see what you're saying. Yes, we would need to get in there one time install that meter. Correct. Okay.
You you think you're going to be inviting a lot of people just to do that? I mean, it's getting worse and worse the way that staff's being treated by by people when we shut their when they shut their water off to the point where I believe the police have been called several times. Several we have
two addresses where the police um assist us in making sure the situation stays calm. Uh Joe, on this on these numbers, is this just for product or thiscludes? have time. That's just to purchase the
equipment. Okay. I just we've been working at this so long. I don't want to get to 2034 at well start over again. Um that's not going to happen with this. This technology is is
here to stay. Um, Census has really put a lot of time and effort into making this. This is the future. This is what we're doing. Um, I guess my recommendation would be if we were going to I think we can take this as a systematic approach. I think we go
hardcore after these MXUs. We can continue the phased approach with the meters as time goes on. You know, we no matter what, we have to buy meters for new construction every year. Um but then that AMI installation
when we get that water tower sighting study done um and we get we get the hardcore facts and everything about that water tower and what it is and what it's going to be. Um that is where I would recommend putting that device. The current water
tower we have has a whole bunch of T-Mobile equipment that I don't want any interference. I don't want troubles. I I just I want it to be all on its own. Um so I think that could
be roped into the water tower. Um the water man breaks. I got 30,000 in there. That's what we we upped it in 25 to 30,000. Um knock on wood that number has been good. Um the biggest portion of the
water main break is the asphalt repair. Um, speaking of the loop that Mayor Burke just alluded to, um, part of that water tower project would be to put a loop going down Highway 19 to loop the
system in another manner. Um, two water main breaks just this past year. We're one valve away from having to shut the entire southeast portion of town off. um said this to council before. It's It
sounds like we just shut it off and turn it back on. That's just inviting a whole bunch of air and possible contaminants. Um I have a clean record of no boil orders. No water operator wants any boil orders on their resume whatsoever. Um,
so I think that loop Tom is really um that sighting study what what this tower looks like, what it does for pressure zones if hopefully it doesn't create any different pressure zones shouldn't with the elevations. Um, but I do strongly
recommend another loop. I I just I worry about this because say if we don't do the water tower until 28, well now you got 26, 27, 28. Um that's three years of us being nervous
about it failing. Correct. So I mean can we break away from it being married to the water tower or No, I mean I I think I mean we can do anything we want to do. Okay. Um
I don't remember. I think I did bring it to council. There is another location for a loop should we want one. Um so the land just to the south of Hawaii Street. Um I believe it's Gary to be owned. Um
if that were to get developed, you know, the loop doesn't have to be here. It's just as long as there's another way somewhere for the water to get around. That's another possible connection if if that would ever get developed, you know, water sewer next to the cemetery.
Correct. Yep. So, east of the cemetery, right? East of the cemetery. Yep. We could connect that to That's pretty far down on the list of right ones to be developed. It's just a It's just a another hypothetical.
Yeah. pretty swampy over there, too. Indeed. I just I I worry about this failing again and then it it's like how many how many times have you brought this up and you know I we've kind of gone down this
path a few times, you know, and it's one thing that we would really we would have to determine the parameters of this project. you know, is it water tower, water main loop, trail system up to city hall, you know, just kind of it is. It really is. Um, but with that
said, you know, looking at what that doing doing it, sorry, on uh 19, would that involve that then? Would we have to tear up anything as far as um
how much right away we have there? We have water man across highway 19 already. Yeah, we can look at boring it, right? We have water man that's bored on Garfield. I
don't do you have any what that are right away when we board by charge and church? Yeah, we purchased uh we purchased enough right away for you. Okay. I just don't want the state to slow something down if we decide to go ahead and do something because You know they
will. Yeah. I mean it just keeps hitting uh water tower study and then we'll get a ton of answers off of that. Um but I I'm going to keep going to that
loop. You know, I I would like to get it done. Um, regardless of uh it being the same time we did the water tower. Um, so is that something you guys want included in the budget for next year? Then
I I think we're better off to to include it in the budget for next year. Do we have an idea what that number is? Rough idea. I think I think the tower ad loop was 4 million. What about just the loop? all that. Yeah,
I think I if I could get in touch with B and make about this so that we can get sure today's numbers on that so that we have an accurate um assessment of what that is cost that that 4 million feels like a low number today for water loop and a
water tower and the the other part about the water tower is I mean you're going to if we get Bsby going and we get business landed in the business part that water tower is going to come sooner than well it's going to
have to at that point right by faster so I get that but um and I don't know that water tower would probably be a general obligation I'm assuming right Joel uh yeah some type of borrowing or PFA
uh let's See 28 5 to 10 years 4.85 million is the second water tower. Unless we decide we want to make it some nonsensical thing to draw in tourists, right? Like a teapot. Yeah. Something.
So I I pitched this idea to take our our current one and write, you know, Billy Bob Look, Charlene and John Deere Green get some people in. I mean, we might we might get some phone calls from Molina, Illinois on that one, but that's a chamber can change their names at ify
days. The hard part there is John Deere green is a uh trademarked color. So, you have to have the permission of the John Deere Corporation to actually even use it. Sponsored by John Deere. Yeah, right.
Good. Okay. So, um, as we digress, yeah, I I just know there's a lot with this whole sewer and water. Um, and I think it's really important that the community understands the cost uh that's involved with all of this and why
if we have increases, why we need to do it. It's because of these expensive projects that are needed. You can't just push it off because then it's going to cost more and especially like my concern too is the southeast water main system.
This is a huge area of development and especially if we have businesses coming in, we don't quick drip all these places. We don't want them to have any issues with their water supply. Well, and it impacts the whole business park. So, if we do get the businesses in there, then we have that problem, too. Um, I think kind of going back to
earlier, Tom, one of the things you brought up was the air raators this year. I think before we make a decision on pushing that through for 25, I think we need to understand what these numbers we're looking at before we dip into a
reserve on that. I think so. One thing is is that Joe had the numbers tariffs kind of hit it a little bit. Oh yeah. No, no, no, no. I know. Um, but like as far as what do we want to do? We talked about the meters. We talk about the air.
the air riders is priority numero uno to get number one. Right. Right. But what I'm what I'm saying here is if if we're gonna talk about getting the meters in for the 26 budget, if we talk about getting the water main loop in in the 26
budget, I want to be careful we don't overextend ourselves with everything we want to add into the budget that we've been talking is potentially a maybe 27 project. You know, I mean, we gota not not saying that we want to short change
anything anywhere, but I also don't want to jump too quickly on everything and put ourselves in a hole. The the only reason why I brought the air raators up as to funding now is because it's a need right
now and I don't see the reason to wait until the 26 to budget for it. Then that way you take it off the 26 budget. So then that way you can fund things because it's it's like I think you had
said the number Joe uh 140. Yep. And then plus for budgeting for the electric too the 80,000 which 40,000 we're already paying right now. So another 40. So you're talking 180. Essentially you're setting yourself up
for 26 where you're taking something off of it, right? But I I I I think what we should do is get an idea of the overall budget before we talk about what we want to dip into reserves for. I see what you're saying. That's fine. Yeah, we can do that. Yeah. So, I I don't want to I don't want to
cherrypick things for reserves just yet. At least I I was a little early about kind of a solution on that. Yeah. Absolutely. Absolutely. No, no, no, no. I don't don't get me wrong. If there's ways that, you know, if we have reserve funds that we can leverage for things, but let's make sure we look at the
overall budget before And we decide what we want to leverage. The other thing I guess I should have pointed out is these MX and meters, they're half and half half water. When is the um study proposed to be completed?
The water tower one? Yeah. Well, hopefully this year. Okay. It was budgeted for this year. Um like I said in our meeting it was Mason, we're going to hit the ground running. We have a lot of things that we need to complete this year and that one um that's an important
one. Yeah, we we need to get that done. Well, and the sooner the better because I mean as much as it it's become a running joke, technically next year is supposed to be a bonding year for the state legislature. So, the sooner we can get numbers, the sooner we can get it in
front of our local legislators to say, "Can you please try and get this into the budget or the bonding bill for next year?" assuming there will be one. Um, you know, that's it's it's supposed to be the cycle. It's supposed to be the offbudget year that that the bonding
comes up. Um, again, we're making an assumption here, but you know, it's always a good idea to get in there early. Ear early bird gets the worm and we're probably going to get rejected the first time around. So, if we get it in and we do somehow landing it, then then we're head on the water tomorrow. Joel,
can you take us through the implementmentation of the uh back prevention certification program. Yeah. So, I have that on here. Um, it's more mostly to make council aware of something that's going to be happening.
Um, I don't see this being a huge ticket pricey item. Um, there are companies that do it that, you know, for thousands of dollars. Just looking at what they do, I'm confident we can do it inhouse. Um,
Department of Health requires. So right now we do all commercial RPZs. Department of Health is requiring all irrigation systems get those back preventers be tested as well. Um just
speaking with the guys at work and people I know around town. Um you know I I don't want to say irrigation was kind of a fad, but when you use it, it costs you money. And if it's going to cost more money because the department of health says so, um,
one option is people will just shut it off and remove their vacuum breaker. Um, I want to keep this program in house until we no longer can, if that makes
sense. Um, right now we know of 240 irrigation systems in the city of Lonale. Once we mail these letters out, that might change to 200. It might change to I I I don't know where it's so I would
like to get a grasp on it. Talking with the Department of Health, this phased approach that we're I'm proposing here now, we're showing progress. We're we're moving forward. We're doing what they want. Um I just didn't want you guys to
think that we're going to be spending tens of thousands of dollars on I'm I'm doing this testing. So that's the only reason why that bullet point is on there. Um but that the ball is already rolling on that. Um so the the budgetary
items for that is probably mostly going to be postage. Um the same same equipment for residentials, commercial uh for doing the testing what we don't do the testing. Okay. So what what it is
if you have irrigation system, you'll get a letter that you need to provide the city of Lawn Sale with documentation that your backl pretor um is compliant and has been tested in the current year. Um without that, um
part of this would be to give some language in our ordinance of what we would like to do for penalty, whether it's turn their water off or a myriad of options. So as of right now there is no ramification. No, we have
not states requiring it. Not hard yet, but it's I got to come wink wink get move in. Okay. So we should get that on the agenda soon to review that ordinance to update it so that we're proactive instead of
reactive. Yep. And I know Joel and Cory have had, you know, they've got a whole bunch of priorities with things that are coming down the line with ordinance reviews of planning and zoning. Um, you know, the water one, it's just going to
be top to bottom as a whole. So when we get through all these planning and zoning ones, it's not over. Jamie, we got more. So So what you're saying is that'll just be done at the staff level with the city council. There's there's no reason that that needs to go to the planning commission. Okay. Okay. Do you
have like an estimated cost of what a residential property with the irrigation would be to have um the certification from the state? I don't um depending on the size of the RPZ. I mean
like if it needs if a commercial RPC needs to be rebuilt, I mean it can be anywhere from $1,000 to $5,000. just kind of depends on the equipment that each person has in their home. So, kind of a range.
Um, Scott, do you have anything you want to add? No, you you you delved into quite a bit of uh quite a bit of that stuff that we were talking about. So, no, that's uh that's
appreciate you, you know, looking out for that. Uh all those different aspects. The other two long-term goals I have on here is water treatment expansion. Um, you know, some somewhere down the line, it's not going to be big enough. And
then in 15 years, if you know, get another variance, you know, with a $15 million upgrade to tackle those chlorides. Is that going to be with a grease catch?
What? Sorry. Um, but is that going to be cleaned up to um sometime in the future sketch for ordinance review or for ordinance review? Uh, we can discuss that at any time probably sooner than later. But as far as
I forgot to bring that up, too. Um, for the waste water, the pre-treat room. Yeah. Um yeah, that's you know that's part of the part of the whole scope of bringing that in.
No, you're fine. Um and then just um to follow our water comp plan um the additional well six just for um additional capacity. Um so yeah, we did cover a lot there.
I've got a list. Um, we're already working with Boldman for the pre-treat room and the drying bed study. Um, I'll reconvene with Jordan to see if the sampler fridge is a huge priority. Like I said, that was a that's new on my radar from him and then I'll
I'll do what I can for water main loop pricing on a standalone project. I just have one more question back to the meters. Um, where are we at? comparison to our neighboring towns with
that's a hard comparison because we're census recovery badger it's it's kind of what system your city has so it's hard to it's hard to compare technology
um and what percentage is what what we're doing um we're We're over the hill. We're we're we're doing it and I just think it's important that we we get it done. Um that's not
saying that, you know, if the council wanted to set the goal, you know, 2030 is when we're going to have it done. I just want you guys to know 2027, our current system that we read our money or read our meters and make our money will
no longer be supported. Unfortunately, it takes the money to make the money. Exactly. People won't want it. Correct. That's all I have. You got anything?
Nothing more I can think of. No. Do we want to go in the streets? Um, we certainly can if Joel wants to. So, unless Joel had anything first or just tackle these streets. Um, I really I haven't I met with Joel about the
advertise funds um for parks and streets. Um, I was kind of going to take what I got out of this meeting and everything else to kind of see where the levy was set to kind of decide
overlay sizes. park improvement projects, kind of all of that. Um, but if you would, you know, I can I can just tell you from the history, um, you know, Milan overlay projects, we've been kind of, since I've been director, it's been about $200ish thousand dollars a year
that we've done. Some has been more, some has been less. Um, as far as street and utility reconstruction projects, we have two areas of town left. I'd say there's probably, we just talked about this with Boulder, make two, there's probably four
projects left in the two areas. Um, and then the retention pond cleaning with all of our storm sewers. Um, a new plow truck in two to three years would be
um, a very good thing for the city. These we currently we have a fleet of four. We plow with three, but we have four because parts for sterings are a mission to find and we just need the
other one has that one broke down. Park it. Grab the other one. See what it takes for parts. Um, our fleet is a 1999, a 2003, a 2006, and a 2023. Um
believe I think that truck was 300,000 for the same one that we have that we just bought our international that same truck 300,000. So um and then you have a service truck too, right?
We have Oh, we have a pickup with a VU for for winter use, you're saying, or is just [Applause] the service van go down? The van the van went down. That's that's from the water department though. So, the streets have
some pickup. The van is the water. Okay. Um 2025, we have money budgeted. will be replacing our sidewalk in front of our public works building. Um I need to like again once we set this and see where
we're at. Um there's always improvements that can be done around um public works facility. As far as concrete pavement goes, I did get some pricing on some salt sheds. Um just that
structure was like for the like similar to Rice County. I think it was 80,000. Um that does not include the pavement underneath it. Um I think that's more of a longterm goal. I have a really strong relationship with
Doug from Rice County. Um he's been great to work with. We kind of labor trade a couple times a year and um the way we uh purchase our salt now from Rice County um to tell you guys the
truth, it it's kind of the easy button. We don't have to truck it. We don't have to haul it. We don't have to mix it. We just have to load it and spread it. So, um I could put that salt shed as a longterm goal.
Um But the big one for streets is milling overlays. Um depending on where we get with Balden Mink on a pavement management plan, um I guess I would anticipate one more year of the $200,000
reactionary overlay repair unless something drastically changes. Um then let me implement that those larger scale milling overlays. Um that's where the assessment part comes
in. Um and then parks, we we had the parkboard meeting last night. We identified some improvements to the JC Park, some trail maintenance in house. Um, a shuffleboard court. We discussed some shade shelters doing
some that that's not a 26 item. That'll be a longterm goal. Um, but yeah. I guess high level that's where we're sitting right now. Um
Joel's presentation with the assessment part will answer some more questions about zone overlays. See what the direction we want to go. Um Joel, uh maybe you can remind me how
this was discussed, but we talked with Dennis about relocating the current Ry County storage area and the county picked up a road from the state. So they did some additional money and
Dennis was thinking about condensing on some of their storage locations and then What do you say? He was he could think about relocating it. Yeah, I believe um yeah, so that history is correct that uh
I believe MDOT wants them to take over um 246 and then some turn back and then some cash as well. Um so one of the thoughts several years ago when this was initially discussed was oh they could maybe possibly use those funds to um build a shed more centrally located in
in the county for for northern Rice County. Um, if I remember from the meeting that we had with Rice County uh a month ago, it was recently brought up at a board meeting and there's just not the the desire to sell that building uh in town at this time.
So, if the county board is has those feelings, I wouldn't anticipate it happening anytime soon. Right. No, I can tell you some in I don't know if it's inside information, but I know they're remodeling the bathrooms inside of that building and then Um has reached out to
me for some fence contractors. They are planning on putting the fence up for some screen. So I was going to ask him if they if they're not going to sell it, at least they can do something to make make improvement. And I think we I think we talked to them about trees for shading because we're worried about the
fence. Yeah. Thank kind of curious how tall fence they're going to put on there. But because if somebody falls off the fence like who's on the side of liability, you know, um that was discussed, but I
guess trees weren't an option. There's so many utilities a long way away. Yeah. I um I just know with JC and um you know that's a really popular park and it would have been nice to have seen
them at least you know have a plan or start a plan to get them to relocate and put something else up there for JC make it a full on park but not have the kids you know treated like the X games over
there but that's how we grew up. I know. I I don't want to take it away, but he had colored something. They took those away. That was You remember? Oh, yeah. But yeah, it was it was a discussion we
had. So, and I understand what they're going through right now. It's It's a tough push, but maybe something to revisit when we start talking about the salt shed again. Yeah, I don't think the salt shed is a urgent need.
How much salt we go for? Well, it really depends on the year. I mean, that's an obvious one. Um, I'd say it's probably 300 tons. No, that column is getting a volume. Well, so we we used to be set up. That's
how we used to do it. The problem is when you don't have the facilities like what Rice County has where they have multiple locations, enclosed storage, things of that nature. If I commit to 300 tons of salt, I have to take 300
tons of salt. No ifs or buts about it. If I don't, then we pay cargo to store it. So, It's hard to commit when we don't have a soul ship. That's why rice takes all specialized.
Okay. All right. Well, um Brian, you got anything to add right now? No. No. I think we'll have a broader presentation on streets and stuff at another budget meeting. That's
usually how it's been done. Okay. Sorry. Nothing more. Jamie, nothing at this point. All right. So, uh kicking this over to you now, Joel. Thank you, Joel. All right. Uh so, the
next portion is to discuss the what the council's thoughts are on the uh property tax levy and the impact that it will have. Uh three options were presented in the or included in the packet. Uh no increase in the levy. That
obviously results in no additional property tax funding. And what that results in is a reduction in taxes for the homes that we've tracked of about 30 to an increase of about $60. And then the businesses uh decrease of
about 1300 to an increase of about $43. If there is no uh increase in the tax rate, uh that would generate uh because I'm estimating a 5% increase in market value, uh an additional $153,000
in funding. And the impact that that has on properties is increase of about $32 to an increase of about $186 on the houses. and essentially a push to an increase of
about 427 for the the businesses. Uh the in between um in between no tax levy increase and keeping the tax rate the same uh generates about $76,600. And the impact that that has on homes is
uh a push or a dollar increase to about $123 increase on the homes. And then the business is a decrease of about 650 to an increase of about 220. So basic regardless of what you do um
the the um value and the amount of increase in in valuation uh and especially with homes, the more your house increases, the less market value um credit you get, exclusion credit. So um so regardless what you do, some are
going to go up, some are going to go down. Um in in the past I know um well for for many years here recently we have been uh keeping the tax rate the same and using
those um additional property tax funds um to you know cover inflation uh wages um you know street maintenance we try to you know pump as much into there as we can capital outlay um things like that. So, um, really one of the biggest
decisions that the council is is going to have to make during the the budget process and, um, you know, the sooner staff can get some some direction and guidance on that, uh, the better. This way, we're, you know, lock, step, and barrel. We're going in the same direction as the council. We're not
having to, um, come back and say, or at the staff level, um, yeah, what we went over for the last two months isn't going to happen. So now you need to to re-evaluate. So um you know really um would like to know
what the what the council's thinking as far as the the property tax levy. It really sets the the stage for the staff's discussions between meetings and then uh going forward at future meetings. All right. Thank you. Joel,
I'll start with you. I don't like taxes. Everybody knows that. Um, but does any of this take into consideration the levy increase from Rice County that we're going to have? Uh, no. My recommendation is completely
ignore that. Okay. They're not worried about what we're doing with our levy. Okay. Um, we need to do what's best for our residents, for our assets, and everything else is just going to, you know, TCU just did a facility study. I don't want to jump to conclusions, but you know, there was a lot of
improvements proposed that they're going to have to fund somehow. So, all right. I just need to look through more and compare based on more information that we get on these big projects. You know, we just had our audit
presented at the last meeting. We were um taxes per capita substantially lower than uh other Rice County cities and um what we classified type four. Social media would tell you. Well, my city taxes went down this year. Yeah.
All right. Uh I'll throw it at you, Jamie. I don't want to raise taxes anymore. I don't want to We need to increase. Yeah, for these projections I'm using 5% increase.
A lot of cracked foundations on my side. Oh, I don't interest that cracked foundations. Yeah. I don't know. I mean, we've had
three years of droughts and it rains non-stop for 3 months and then, you know, not a lot of snow. Then there's a ton of snow. I think it's been kind of a thing homes aging
we used to do those sewer inspections when every time somebody sold a house I mean there there's a large portion of crack foundation foundation repair it's not a new thing
Is that all you got? All right, Scott. Um Joel, you I know you're anticipating the 5%. One thing that I've been kind of watching though is it seems like uh I don't know market values on houses have not been increasing. If anything, some of it's
been I don't say going backwards, but you know the anticipation that we're going to have increases just based on where the economy is sitting and all that. I'm a little little concerned about that. If there is that 5% that's great but uh
just looking at the appreciation on homes as a whole has not been really great. So I don't know what that how the assessments will play out for that. So I think we're probably going to have to look at a a rate tax rate increase just
to ensure that we have action against that. We have to have all this done and we don't find out what our numbers are until the fall, November, October, we have to certify
our need to get the final valuation. Yeah. But we late November, early December. So, I mean, we're we're setting this all up hopefully everything. Well, and in past years, I was using 7%. So I have
Oh, you did. Okay. All right. Uh reduce that. Okay. Couple percent. Well, about a third. All right. Well, thanks for doing that. That was my concern. Yeah. To the same, you know, same
respect as uh that and uh we're going to have to adjust for inflation and increases in in projects. So, it's going to have to be that increase to the to the rate. All right. Thank you, Scott. Uh Brian,
so looking over these options, I'd have to say for me, I'm kind of leaning towards the option three where we don't increase the tax rate, but we do have the levy. Um, you know, I think that's an inflationary
number based on this, right? You know, I mean, I can appreciate the the valuations. You know, this this is all hinged on valuation of the homes, and I I understand that I like keeping the rate the same. I think we've we've done a good job as a
city setting a good budget, um, keeping to that budget over the last few years that I've really been watching it, and keeping the rate the same. Um, I think last year we we went down a little bit. Um, and that's because of
good budgeting and sticking to good budget. I mean, you know, it's it's become kind of a a little joke about, you know, way to go under budget, but I mean, it's not really because that's why we're able to do what we do, right? you know, because we've got good staff
working hard, coming in under budget, you know, um estimating well when we're doing these projects and, you know, we've got we've got a new engineer coming in and we just make it clear that the new engineering, you know, this is what we expect. This is
what we've done in the past. This is what we expect going forward. So, you know, um we didn't sign a multi-year contract. So, you know, you're you're this is the year to prove yourself. Um,
the other thing that I feel comfortable in saying I don't want to increase the tax rate, and I can appreciate where you're coming from, Scott. I I really do. I get it. But we also had the auditor's report in here. Last year, we were talking about how much money do we have in reserves, and it was $10 million, I think, was the number that we
we estimated at, and that was after the purchase of this building for cash, before we had refunded that money back in from the bonds. um which looking at the numbers now we're talking 11 to 12 million in our reserves and that's why I
caution when we start talking about individual line items until we have the full budget in front of us because I honestly think that the reserves are for rainy day type stuff. It's not pouring but it's it's
starting to sprinkle if not a steady you know drizzle at this point. So, I'm comfortable saying, let's take a look at it. Let's let's use the no tax rate increase as as a baseline in my mind
and then consider tapping into some of our reserves to offset that to keep the taxes low for the citizens for the year. Um, and the reason I I I say that also is because we we're talking about things like we've got Quick Trip coming in. So,
in a year we're going to start seeing additional tax revenue there. We're going to sell the old city hall building. There's some money coming in there. We've been talking about Bixby. Um, so there's potential, you know, and I mean, again, it's kind of the same message I I I relay last year when we
were assuming we had AES. So, I'm not not naive enough to think that anything is a done deal other than Quick Trip because we we've finalized that project. But I'm cautiously optimistic to say let's let's budget based on that. We're early in the budget process where we can
do that and it gives staff something to work off. It gives them some additional funds, the best the best option for additional funds based on what we're presented with here without raising the tax rate on our citizens.
Well, I I would I would I would agree with you. prior to having our our the the first half of the meeting uh you know with with that with that shopping list of stuff you know. Oh no, you know moving moving that up. I I you know that was the thing I guess that that was my
point is we're you know we we're we're looking at the same thing but we're at different levels. I I I was still taking in consideration some of that the that larger that larger product stuff. Oh and I'm not saying take that off the table either. That's where I was coming from.
Yeah. And and I just want to clarify the reason I'm saying it is because I think that we need to consider tapping into reserves to keep us at this level rather than raise the tax rate and have the reserves sit there. I'm saying let's keep the tax
rate where it is and use reserves to pad where we need to pad. That's that's my that's my mindset in in the budgetary approach for this year. That's that's what I'm thinking. Tap reserves. But I I do also but there are things in reserves that even though they are reserves that
isn't earmarked for it's not just a a savings account rainy day fund. There are Oh, and I understand that and and and you know it's it's the same thing that I'm going to go back to when we talk about the purchase of this building. Right. We took almost $2
million out of those funds to purchase this building. And when I voted for that, I didn't think we were taking that money and putting it back. I thought that was money that we were taking out and we were spending. And that's why when the vote came up to bond to repay
those, I voted no. So, I'm okay with taking money and spending it. And I'm really okay with using it to pad our budgets so we don't have to raise taxes on the citizens. So, in my mind, when we did it last time, it
wasn't going back yet. So, I'm okay with taking less than that this time to offset to keep from raising taxes on citizens. That's where I'm coming from. And that'll work for the short term. I know. I know. And this is I'm not looking at at this as a every year sort
of thing. I'm thinking 2026. That's that's my focus is for 2026 because yeah, sure we can we can do that but then the money is going to be gone eventually. The other part about that too, Brian, is that's projected if we
stay where we're at, right? That's not what anything else coming in that's going to raise, right? And that's and that's something we could and and the cautious optimis and that's where I say the cautious optimism is I'm hoping we close some of these deals. Yep. And then
that increased tax revenue rebuilds those funds. And I'm not saying let's take $2 million. I want to make that clear. I'm not saying let's take two million out of reserves. But let's start with this. Get the budget in front of us and then we can look at do we need to go
to reserves and if so for how much? That's where I'm coming from. Okay. You got anything else that you want to I That's clear as mud, right? the sandpaper. I think Joel, you so you
understand what I'm thinking. Yeah, that's what you want, right? Um, yeah. I mean, a lot of these things I absolutely agree with. And one thing that I didn't know about when the bonding was discussed was it was a
lease option bond. um that bond is not um certified if you have to raise taxes because it's not recognized as debt. It's um it doesn't stick with the uh state statute 475. So it's not like your
typical G bond. Um so that meant that we have some healthy funds to make that payment. Um I do look at the $75,000 added from the fire department and I do see the projected, you know, 66,000 for current
wages at its point right now. Um, I would agree with Brian about keeping the, uh, tax rate the same. Um, we do have a lot of needs. They're, uh, you know, they got to get funded. Um, I
don't see really leving a whole bunch of money if we're sitting on a bunch of money. Be our needs. It's not once. There is some other items that we could talk about too where
we have one with the two bonds that are countable area five phase four and two but is that assessments right? Uh area five would be Yep. all while all of our street reconstruction projects
were were assessed. Yeah. You just have to look at um the interest rate that you're paying versus um the uh our investment return that we're getting, right? You know, so if you're getting a higher return on your
investments, you would not want to pay those off. Or you could refin uh you could, but I doubt you're going to get rates that are uh even close to to what what we got then. I mean, we
have some bonds that are 1%. Um and if if um if if there were any bonds that were callable and could be refinanced, my phone would be ringing. Yeah. I mean, you got the uh area five phase two. Right now, you're looking at
2.5% going into 3%. The other question I have is um we had gone through a drinking water stage revolving fund. Yep. Um can you ever just pay that down? Nope. um that was something that we looked at
um a refinancing and you cannot do that with those. It's kind of one of the one of the caveats to that. You're already getting a a reduced rate compared to the market. Um so they're kind of relying on that to be revolved and used in in future years.
Okay. And then we also have the tip um coming out next year. Well, not coming off next year, but Yeah. And how that works is the um the taxes paid by the villages of Lndale is what pays that those bonds. Okay. So, we
don't levy um any property tax levy to to pay those. So, you actually should be putting money out and waiting for it to come back. The uh last thing that I had was um we had the
I guess presentation of our compensation study at our last council meeting and the council requested to see where uh people were placed on um on this on the uh the new pay scale. Um, some of the I didn't print off an
updated one. All of the the costs were accurate. There was a couple that were um not in the right either grade or or step. Um, but the the wages used to come up with the
cost impact were were correct. So, um I know Tessa Melvin Melvin, excuse me, will is planning on attending the the next council meeting on Thursday. Um I guess if you guys wanted to discuss anything
or or had any questions, we certainly could uh try to answer those. Jamie, did you got anything? Okay, Scott. Um, nothing other than the fact that I, you know, I like the fact that we did that drop zone off and only add a couple shortened it up. I mean,
obviously we weren't doing the 10 that they recommend, but we're getting closer to that. So, a little more uniformity uh month in comparison to other cities. So, that's all Brian. Um,
I just so looking at the two grids, they're the numbers are different. from the grid that was in her presentation. So, I don't know if this is something that we should wait and bring up with her. Uh, what is included in the packet is correct. Okay. So, hers
was incorrect. Yeah. What I included in the packet was correct. Okay. Because it it it does go down from what she presented in the cut for head too. Uh what is included in the packet is
what was used for the costing. Okay. Okay. That's all that's the only question I had at this point. Okay. Sorry. I just um I'm glad that we're kind of getting on pace with things to retain good employees because the cost of hiring and
training adds up quick. So if we can be competitive um retain good people. That's I'm all on board with that. That's it. All right. Um yeah, I got a couple of things. Um
there is a total of six steps that aren't being used uh not sorry total grades that are not being used um in this new And the other part about it is I worry
about tenure um being reflected in this um that little chart that kind of kicked off the whole entire um wage study where it showed you know library clerk, police secretary, library director, accounting
tech, all of that. I ended up writing how our the bench the benchmark wages if you remember that graph that they showed it was a lot tighter with the benchmark
um to our old scale I worry a little bit because we were pretty tight until I went to lead uh wastewater city treasurer community developer police chief public works and city administrator.
Um there was a substantial difference. Um however, I also wrote, you know, kind of who was um still kind of minimal to who's getting over, who's getting mid to low. Um
and I I do worry quite a bit that maybe we aren't really reflecting tenure to the new pay group. library uh the library director is still you know under at this time. I don't know what that changed since I brought
it up. Uh we have not. So um we did look at the public works one and two um because there was we had some adjustments there. Um but but really what we want to do is
present what you know how it compared to the to the benchmarks and then should the council want to choose to account for tenure or experience um you you you certainly could. Okay. Cuz I I do worry
you say like you know you got the library staff you know Penny's been there for what you know five years and she's grade two, step one. So, anybody that gets hired is, you know, right there with her, right? Yep. And that is
something that, uh, we did discuss since then. Um, the the public works one and two and then library as well. I anticipated that coming up with the with the wage compression. Okay. Um,
yeah. I just I don't know. I I remember is saying, you know, you can make horizontal cuts, too. Um, and I hate to be this picky about it, you know, but I just see six grades that aren't being used. So, is that something in the
future that maybe we could put a department on and utilize those more cuz I think it was the police that are on 11. Somebody else was on 11 that was in a liquor store. Does that sound right?
[Music] um the library director. Yes. Yeah. I I really want that to be a focus too because I mean the whole point of this conversation um was how is it that we make it where we
steal from others versus being stole from us. And I do kind of worry that in two years we are going to be falling behind on this again if we're just start people off at 10 step. But this is also um
so the 3.5% between all these wages, they're still getting cola on top of that. So it's annually, right? Correct. And what that does is um increases the pay scale with inflation.
So it should or whatever is determined by the council to you know keep that up and you know keep current with the market and then the employees moving so that their wage is then not necessarily their grade but their wage is competitive.
And then are the step increases uh yearly as well? Yes. Uh and on anniversary dates. So they're they're going to get their increase whatever they
uh at the same time. Uh correct. It's not. We have a lot of employees that are uh one one. So it would uh be proposed the cola and uh the step. But, you know, say you were hired in whatever today, you know, come January 1st, you would
get the cola, but you'd stay at your step and then on your anniversary, you go off the step. Correct. So, do we do those in um January the cola? Is that is that a January change? Is that okay? Because I know some do it midyear
on the corporate side. I I just want to make sure that I understand our fiscal calendar to make sure. Yep. Everything's in line. Okay. Also, I know a lot of things coincide with when LGA pays out too. So, just to make sure that we all understand, you know, because LGA comes
what? June and December. Correct. Yep. Then our property tax statement comes uh June, July, and then uh December, and then we received the last portion in January. January. Yep. The the other
question I have is about this grade 18. you have one step that's higher than 17. Um, all these other ones, you know, you got
7309 on step 16 and you or uh grade six 16 step 12 7309 grade 16 step 12. And then if you're going to go to 17, that 73 number lines
up with step nine. Then you got three more steps. Initially, that that step is going to be an increase. So you got actually four steps that are going to be an increase off of grade 16 when you go to grade 17.
But then when you go to 18, you only have that one initial step. So, I I'm kind of curious what the thought behind that was because what we saw from Tessa's it it made sense for that grade 18 and then when we see this
it I don't know it doesn't jive well um with the current grid with adding that grade 18. So I I noticed that you're going to be, you know, from what 1712 to 1812, right?
Or you were 1714 going to 1812. But my thing is is you just went from maxed out to maxed out. So it's like where's your next step? You know what I mean? You're getting cold at Yeah. I mean, at some at
some point you max out, right? I mean, everyone wants to get both, but but then don't we have like a longevity or shouldn't we have a longevity? Uh, we don't have that now. Um, that is something that we did talk about with the police. So, you know, in three years you'd get the um
like a certain amount. Yeah, exactly. However, that would would be. And I think we're I think we're going to have to bring that longevity plan up. But, you know, it it again, it's it's one of those tenure things to me where um we
recognize that you've had tenure, but then you're looking at the steps. Some of these people that have been here for 20 plus years, they're not seeing that next step in their grade. But again, I I mean that's something we can talk later about, but I I just kind of
want to emphasize on that is we should really be looking at 10 years, especially when retirement comes around. And they're they're also getting involved with PAR as well, you know, but uh that's kind of where I'm at. Um
anybody else has anything they want to add to that? I know it was quite nice. I agree with looking at adding a longevity scale on top of the pay grid. Um that is also how you retain employees um
to give incentive for longevity. But does that grade six kind of make sense where I mean if you're not utilizing it, wouldn't you just look at getting rid of it? Uh the sixth grades that we don't use.
Yeah. I I got them written down. It's um 37 9 10 12 16 to the new. So it's almost proportionate in between each of them. Um yeah. Yeah. I guess at
that point what you'd be looking at doing is, you know, you try to have some consistency between the grades, you know, percentage- wise or, you know, so you don't have a huge gap from whatever four to five.
But yeah, that's definitely something we could we could ask uh ask her. And um like for my contract at work, there's kind of a big jump between I think we go up to 13 um
steps and we have like eight lanes and there is a significant increase between that step 12 and 13 pay grade too because then you're kind of stuck at that 13 right for a while you get your annual bump but then um that's where
those longevity skills come to play them because then it just gives you that little added incentive to stick around and put in your time and do a good job. I do know that there was a there was a
couple conversations that were had uh with police officers about the steps and all stuff and some of them they were actually disappoint not necessarily with this they're disappointed said we never make the we never make the top it's always it's always moving and it's always changing I think the perception
was is you know that that there was it was the character was constantly being moved when in actuality it was they they were getting the carrot, there's just another carrot moving along along because there you don't you never really want to reach
the the top. So, but I I can Yeah, I can see it the other way too, Scott. And I mean like I could see it being like, okay, so the city of London put a job post now for police officers 36.99 to 48. Well, you're advertising for that
48, but nobody is hitting that 48 because they constantly kept moving back. Yeah, but I you know with your with your time and time intent you know tenure and all that stuff eventually you know as as things move up you get there but we always are you know as because of co we
kind of end up adding we add you know you're add more steps on there that's a bargaining agreement too so it's you know that money water where you see both sides of it. Yeah. Yeah. But it's it's effectively they do ultimately reach that they c they do reach that level.
It's just that they there's there's another couple steps added on after the fact so that that there is something you know it's adjusting for inflation and cost of living and all that stuff. They are getting they are getting raises. You're just not coming up to the very
end and there's nothing there. So, one thing is is that if Margar is the only one that's going to be at that grade 11, my thing is is why don't we just make grade 11 um the police scale as it is, you know,
right now like step one is 30, you know, that 36.99. Um then they stay on that scale. So then that way they can see that longevity, but then also, you know, we got guys that been there seven, 10 years.
Um, that could fit on that step seven or or nine or whatever, but then you got that distance between one and seven that if you hire on a officer with three years experience, you put them in for her end. Um, but you have a little bit
more of that flexibility. If we agree with going with the pay for the police and then maybe bump Mercury to that that great she's already under
I forget what was the old one, you know, just some comments I want to make. So that way it's not like Tesla's just walking. So uh to recap, uh tenure concerns, Margarit, uh longevity,
um the number of steps not being used, grades, grades. Yeah. and ref wages wages and then that should that should put us
in line with competitive benchmark. Instead of just having these minimal to to mid, it's almost mid to over. That gives us time to still be where we're not falling because I'm sure other cities are going
to fall in line with this whole wage study too, uh, when they do theirs or Yeah. if they're out, you know, seeing what other what other communities are paying. The other thing that we should probably talk about as well is how often we wait to
see this get done. Yep. Yep. So, um part of uh their proposal um was kind of a an update every every couple years. Now, would that just be kind of percentage wise? Would that would we try to keep that with council or would we
try to get these? uh that would be with uh using uh David drone and I don't it's not as indepth as as as what we did this time but um I know that's what quite a few cities do just
uh to keep current so they're not falling seven eight nine years behind and then boom it's a huge jump kind of corrects it I don't say corrects itself but kind of self adjusts uh every every couple years to the
Would it be worthwhile to coordinate that with police contract for that? We we're being at that time we're being, you know, fair. We do it at the contract renewal time. So we have that that day
there. So we're not agreeing to something and then Good. Yeah. And then we're we're off the mark trying to clean it up afterwards. Yeah, you could absolutely. Yeah, I'd be
interested um see kind of what's going to go on when we bring them to our pay scale. It would be nice at the same time. or just assume we're going to line them up at the same time too because we can
go to them at any like four years, right? Just another option. Um, okay. Does anybody else have anything they want to add to this? Let me start with Scott. No, that that
was my bra. No, no, I'm good. Sorry. No, for on boarding month uh currently it's uh at your anniversary date. You think there's ever been a need to do
that like 60day or that is a lot of work you're spending the first few months getting trained up six months get bumped up then if you make your one years a little bonus and
then every five years they give you The only thing I probably more negotiated in a collective bargaining agreement for the employee like older employees. Well, no, I'm just, you know, that example I think he's saying is more
because now you have whatever. We'll just I work at city hall, right? So my staff's saying, well, wait a minute here. How come they're getting three raises this year? What about me? You know, and I kind of worry about summer health, too.
They get they get a couple of days training if they've already been here then. Yep. And that's another one too that um is is proposed to um get a several dollar an hour increase too. It's like right now it's like starting
1671. Um yeah, they got it. Yeah, it's like 19 something. We haven't really been having a problem lately attracting seasonal, have we? We've had pretty good uh application pool. Yeah, we we have um unfortunately
and I I called this when the state changed the the requirements for job postings, you have to state the min and the max. Well, what does everyone apply for? Maximum. Um, so that's why I make sure I put on
there anticipated starting of this. Um, I think actually it was on the Fox 9 news that it's my experience has been the the areas that we we have the struggles in finding people are the liquor store and the police.
I think everywhere else, I mean, when we had an opening on the library board or not library board, excuse me. Um, even the library for the library stuff, I I want to say we had like six or seven applicants. And I mean,
they were all overqualified for the job. I mean, I can't I can't even tell you how many we got with master's degrees applying for that job. I could see the liquor store because that that lot that's nights and weekends and that's that's not what people want to work. Well, it's not even that. I think the
bigger problem is it's and I don't want to call it a problem. I guess the the the struggle the challenge that we found is it's that it's a small amount of hours and the people that that are are applying are hoping for more hours,
opportunities for more hours. know when they when they are told that like this is it. There might be but it's not, you know, don't don't bank on it. That's the challenge. They want more hours than than what we're we're potentially offering. And that's why with the latest
resignation, we decided not to backfill it at this time because people want the hours. The people that are there and we have great staff. The people that we've hired are great. So, and that goes for every department we've got. Um, and I I I don't know if it's all
necessarily wages because wages weren't a problem with the seasonal. They're not a problem with the part-time. Um, you know, it it I I can't necessarily speak to the police. There's there's a lot of bigger challenges there. And that's that's not us. That's not a
Londale problem. That's a that's an industry problem. Um, there is more that we can Yes. But but hiring in general, markets in general are crazy right now. Um it's just what can you offer? You know,
it goes a lot beyond wages. And that's why, you know, we needed to take this from a holistic approach of of benefits as well. And you know, I mean, it's the same thing when we talk about collective bargaining. It's wages is just a piece of it, right? But what we need to make sure is that we're doing right by the
people we have here now because we have well more or less a full staff. We're fully st more or less, right? Could we use one more full-time police officer? Absolutely. Um, but we're more or less full staff. So what we got to look at at
this is doing it right by what we have and then making sure our grade keeps up going forward. Yeah. And I think there's a process discussion to be had here, right? Sure. There's definitely a process discussion to be
had here to better understand things like, you know, who decides when a step change is is is uh or sorry, a grade change is is warranted. Um what are the criteria? you know, kind of having that idea and
that's I think stuff that Tesla can can provide us because that was the point of the job descriptions, right? Is to to set them within within the grades. So, I think that's kind of the the missing piece in my mind. What I'd like to see is okay, what falls in with grade six,
you know, what is grade six? What does that mean? What does it take to be grade six? Um because I I want to hear the similarities between and I'm just using grade six. I'm not looking who's in grade six or anything like that. But let's say I want to know what a a public
works grade six and a library grade six and uh I don't think there's any police grade six. I think police has their own have their own grade, right? But but somebody in in city hall at grade six, what does that mean? What are the connections to put them on that grade six and better understand that? Yeah. So
the the higher the the grade you are, the more responsibility your job is. Um but but really comes down to pay equity and uh in the past we've used the state job match. So each position is um is scored by the state
department of administration points looking at that. Well that's what we use in the past. Okay. Now with um using our um new pay scale we're using their um developed pay equity point system. Okay. So, so basically it's
still at the end of the day it's this job has equals this job correct based off of you know got different tasks and duties obviously but similar amount of uh responsibility and strictly it's strictly male female
that's all it is it's just strictly so females get paid the close to or the same as males that's the only reason for pay equity yeah I I got a big question when it comes to like license and certifications. Um how does that report?
Yep. So that's why we're proposed uh public works one and two. Um so you know if you just want to work 7 to 3:30 and go home, you'll be on you'll be on uh public works one. Um you know obviously
you know you'll become more skilled and educated in the position. So you know 5 years experience boom you can go down to that um grade two or the more more licenses you have um the more responsibility that you want to assume
you would go to that public works too. I believe it's uh so would the hall guys be a public works too then? Uh no. Oh okay. Is this going to be reflected as grade eight and grade 13 for public works one and two because I
see Jordan's on uh grade 18. Uh he's different because he's our uh lead water wastewater operator. Seven and eight. What was that? Uh what we were talking about is seven and eight. Seven and eight.
And and that's just the pay grade. That's not placing people because we're accounting for what their current wage is and based off of the last meeting the couns so so everyone gets something. um three and a half and then whatever
that closest step would be um above that. So, where does that uh 2659 line up with benchmark? I'd have to get that information. But, but if I remember correctly, even
on the city's current pay, we were we were within within the benchmarks. We would probably just on the lower end of it. That's the current. Oh, I'm almost there. So Mark was 26.95.
[Music] So pretty much right there. 2659 right there. 2659 265 And then your seasonal health would just be that one the the grade one. Correct. If they came back a second year then
would that put them up? Yes. That's what we've been doing here recently to to uh retain them and and have them come back annually. And then would she have like an updated graph like this here that would Yep.
show if we're green and white. Yep. Hopefully no red. Uh yeah, and that's the plan not to have um any red. Um, it probably is red because I don't know exactly where that is, but I think that's probably our
current one. And then as you go to the right because the pay scale was uh the drop drop for I think the min was like 10 was it 102 or 107 to 112. No, that definitely was the goal. I said
I do not want to present the proposed in the red. It's not going to fly. Yep. Okay. Anything else? We can always ask her more questions at the next meeting, right? Oh, 100%. Yeah, we want to, you know, if we're looking
at a July implementation, we want to get it done. Yep. As far as I know, unless there's anything else, that's all that I have. All right. You You got anything else you want to add? Um, I don't I just have one
question. If there's anything I mean, kind of taken the lead on the space. So if there's anything that department head of public works need to provide for you guys for this next meeting, I'd be happy to. That's all I really got. Okay.
Um Ryan, you got anything? No, just big thank you to everybody. Jason and Joel, thank you. Saturday, I want to thank you both personally for taking my call Saturday morning. Yeah, no problem.
Um just the big thing at parks uh last night was we are moving the meeting to the second Monday of the month beginning in July. So July 14th and we'll be meeting at 6:30 just for that week or for from going forward. New schedule. Yeah. Because we
just haven't had enough time with PZ right behind us. Um so we need more time. All right. Thank you Jamie. I'm good. All right, you got it. Uh, well, want to get moving here so Joel can get home
because we got to be back here in the morning for EDA. Oh, yeah, that's right. Yeah. All right. I'll make a motion to adjourn. Second. All right. Motion and second. Uh I I do want city staff putting the time in. Um
I mean I I think we've done a lot of great discussion. So I'm looking forward to going through this final part of the budget cycle. So without any further discussion, all in favor?
All opposed? All right. This means Thank you. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Leave our computers the way it is. Well, I say microphones. Oh, okay.
I don't know just I don't get this opportunity to during the day with all these mic or all the computers here. I have mine on [Applause] I could hear you. You had the audio on just slightly on the computer. Do you
think it's Could it be feedback just from that? I mean, if we're silent. Well, you could try it now if you looked at it. You think Joel's got it open. He's good. But it wasn't. But it wasn't the whole
time, though. Yeah. All right. Wishful thinking. You shut everything off. What's that?