##VIDEO ID:RC08lPgkDYI## son TR yeah okay so um while we have nobody on uh online with us tonight um we are here at the rder building and someone may join us um in accordance with the have a meeting law uh this meeting is being recorded it'll be on the town's YouTube channel within 24 hours and um if you if anybody does join us and they'd like to join in the discussion they can follow the agenda which is on the town website um and use the raise the hand Fe request to speak and take comments from them um there is nobody from the public with us in person nor online so I will then go to minutes approval um for the 17 October 2024 meeting minutes and uh I seek a motion in a second uh see I will motion to approve and I'll and I'll second okay any discussion I have a couple little minor points um on the meeting minutes uh first of all let's see where it says tan councel tan councel spelled with the c it's an s e l not c i l tan c u n seal um that's in Old business merger the historical commission umix it so you can fix that old business yeah and then uh under the next the next section underneath old business paragraph well section 1B par section 1B it says motion to consider where the the double I is um this a motion to approve Carter kenini modification to article 10 submitted by the apdc by member Lockwood seconded by motion by member Lockwood second by ly approved by all so motion to approve Carter Carini's modification to article 10 that was submitted by the apdc motion by member lwood second by Lloyd and then there's one more little glitch um the the discussion was recorded correctly in the meeting minutes where it talks about the preservation of the Brooks house it says does seem the property is already owned by the Town versus School Board the tax records show that the co-owner is the school board and the town is the owner um and apparently I've not heard back from uh Chris Riley regarding a plot plan for the books but we're going to talk about that here and I think those are all the changes I had uh if you make those um everyone but the last one you said somewhere with the coowner yeah where no you have this correct okay you had it you had it recorded correctly I was just adding a information comment to the medum minute so those are the changes that I had and I think those were probably all of them so is there there is a motion um there is um a second and I'm assuming that the person who made the second agrees with the motion to make modifications as noted and if so let's approve the meeting minutes all those in paper say I I okay so that's done so I will send those to tip Carter tomorrow and then I did remind Richard and he has acknowledged that he will make sure that the historical commission meeting minutes get approved so then that whole piece will move forward I did get a postcript to Carter when I said hey you know we're working on this and he says do you think I ought to P I should run this by the select board before I actually t uh c t Council would do this research and I went back to him and said and he was a little apprehensive and you might appreciate the his his apprehensiveness based on some of the comments that came at special town meeting he goes I don't want to I don't want to do something that seemed to be out of bond for an intercon manager and I I know so what I said to him was I think that you know communication's all more communication is always always better so tell us like Bo that we're thinking about a merger between the two commissions but then I went back to him and and the additional comment that I made was I think he's done a pretty good job as Anor time manag and people that I know that I respect their opinions I think they agree with that too so I kind of bolster his confidence for being uh in the it's a tough position to be in you know how far do you go to make changes because you are inter room you know versus sitting back and kind of letting things you know Fester that need to be resolved so I think I think he's done a good job okay um I had no correspondence um now uh the Brooks house warrant did pass Nathan once again thank you very much for uh propelling us forward well likewise to you who did all kinds of leg work with a lot of committees and I appreciate that so good effort overall I I think that um what what I'd like to do is convene a meeting uh with Carter um and maybe Chris Riley uh with your permission I'll set with the commission uh permission I will set up a meeting to to say what do you want from us now you know how can we help move this process forward you know it's clearly something that select boards you know now has on their plate right and you know he and his staff are going to be the ones that are going to execute this but I want to find out you know what role he'd like for us to play if any he may to say hey I got it you know we move forward but he may say Hey you know can you help us with this can you help us with that I think we got to be willing to make that that effort I think it's a great idea yeah and I mean if they say yes I think it's great that you ask and if they yes we help them and if they say no let's just keep an eye on because they've got a lot of priorities we just need to make sure that this stay is you know doesn't wait to the last minute I I they do have a lot on the plate and I also think um this is going to be a big issue for spring the annual meeting I mean I think that uh we got to teed up they got a lot of work to do in know Springtime you know one of the other thoughts that I had was maybe just reaching out to some business people I know um and say you know like would you be interested in you know responding and and what do you think of the house yeah I mean so do that all in formally no I understand I think uh that is a I think there my impression whether it's um maybe this is an uninformed impression but whether it's [Music] um rfps or things like repairing stuff or if it's notices that things are going out to auction for example they did put the Brooks house itself without the prop I am not convinced that I'm sure the town is following the letter of the law and that and in fact the letter of the law may be constraining what they're able to do in terms of but I I am concerned that there is a sort of a distribution and reach problem in terms of reaching interested parties so to that to that point I I kind of agree with what you're saying about sort of helping that process Along by reaching out to folks um I guess the my only question is should we just wait till it's t actually tendered before we do that and then you know like I think you know the one one thing you always have to be careful of is um not to mislead somebody who's a private business person and you go to them and you say hey what do you think of this and then they actually have an interest in it and then someone comes along and says hey they knew about it before I got to know about it I mean that's always one okay that's one of the things that I'm thinking so maybe what I'll do is that I'll say to Carter um you know could would you consider maybe bringing in a couple business people to help craft what uh the RFP might look like and what would be some of the restrictions what would be some of the benefits to them you know if it's an RFP versus like I mean I don't know if that's the right word for like if they're actually just putting the thing out for sale I don't I think that is that an RP still or well I think that I I don't think this is going to be successful unless you actually do a request for a proposal well I guess technically speaking is it a request if you're just trying to sell a clot of land in a building is that a request or yeah that's an entirely different that's an entirely different in fact that may be an issue uh that is going to have to be evaluated because like once again I'm not familiar with Massachusetts law but I can tell you in Ohio you cannot sell a piece of property under a request for proposal well no I don't think I mean it has to be it has to be a public auction sure exactly and that's they've done this before the Brooks house so I mean the town has experienced doing doing this a recent experience um is successful but I don't I don't know what they did to just sell the building there if that was like a you talking about the B blue the Burbank that's right Luther Burbank they sold you know the plot and the building and they whatever they it was an auction or whatever uh I don't know what they did when they put the Brook's house out by itself I never heard oh when they try to sell just the house on the land well that's a good starting point yeah the Brooks I think the Brooks house is the model you know to some extent and then you know I think once that's out there I mean I don't think there's any law against private citizens amplifying that you know once somebody becomes aware I think the biggest risk is that no one becomes aware that it's available so to your point I think you know letting prospective business owners know I think it's a great idea but I just I just question when to pull that trigger you know you know the one thing that uh I've been thinking about is um whether or not you could require some sort of a performance bond you know and I don't know how they handled it with the Brooks house or the Luther Burbank house because they did actually you know sell the property I'm not sure whether there was any like terms and conditions that says you know if you buy it you have to have it fixed up by a certain I think that's really important and I think that's what's good about what just passed the town meeting is that's something that the select board or who or their designates could bake figure out what they can bake into it as far as that goes but I think that makes a lot of sense because we know how disappointed people will be if they sell it and the new owner just like sits on it sit on it for 5 years and it just starts fall problem and St exactly so every single person in town Drives By every day I've been in that out to on the west side of day where the R Brothers lived we had a I was part of a private nonprofit and we sold a piece of property and and uh the person we sold it to gave us you know like first of all we had no takers okay like we advertised it we had no takers we advertised it again and then we had to take I can do this this this and this and everybody was like yes great great and then guess what happened did nothing and then eventually the building because it's it's there was another four or five years where nothing happened you know eventually the city took the property over and then demolished it so I mean that's those are just some of the right I I think that's wise I mean to to in the transaction have require I mean I think the expectation here is that even if it goes to auction it's gonna using Luther bank is an example like that went well I mean the price it went for was very small it might have sold for $40,000 right which but it needed work right and they did the work but I guess you know I don't know if there were conditions in requiring them to do that work we need to make sure that I think it's this it's important the we should advise the select board you know don't got to happen something similar happened with the primary school where they were sort of there was I don't know some situation where someone was going to purchase it through some State program and they sort of got a hold put on it and they did nothing in the Pro they never you know and so that was like five or 10 years of languishing yeah um so yeah I think that's a wise we got to figure out a way we got to figure out a way to force the issue yeah and and the one thought that I have was create you know have them post some sort of performance bond that says I will do it now performance bonds cost money um you know but by the same token they make something happen sure because if you don't do it then performance bond Revenue comes to the would come to the town and then they could use that maybe pick up something that needs to be fixed up because the person didn't do it okay all right so um my plan is I'll I'll sit down with Carter and and say how can we help and here some of our concerns things we're talking about right now and then see where that does um okay lenberg Municipal Building design committee activity moving on to the next item what on the agenda uh we had a long we we've had a series of meetings and um I'm I'm really pleased with how the processes work from you know my first town meeting that I went to a couple years ago as a new lunenberg resident and I heard about how the town was going to just leave town hall for someone else to worry about and uh you know we're the town is truly engaged in us you know working on town hall and the Ritter building and probably um The Firm that we've hired or the firm that we're going to interview uh next Wednesday we only had one proposal uh a second proposal did arrive at City Hall or town hall unfortunately for the offer the person who was making the proposal their Courier failed to deliver the document on time I don't know whether he got lost or whether the firm you know didn't understand what the deadline was but it was supposed to be here by noon I think it showed up sometime after 1:00 you know not it was a not by much but enough for them not to be qualified and the only way that we could deal with that was to accept the proposal you know we got or send us back up for bid and no one wanted to do that on the committee so we've uh identified um a number of questions that we will ask the firm we have their price proposal uh it's within budget and um we're heading down to the uh I we checked references I checked two of the three references that they gave us and surprise surprise the references all said wonderful and positive things about the farm you know and uh the uh what I the way I classify the firm is competent and capable not flashy uh even though the principle one of the two principles uh has a flashy background uh he worked for the architectural firm called Caesar P out of uh New Haven Connecticut and if you know anything about Caesar Pell you know that heard the name you've heard the name right yeah and uh fact probably the most notable project that they've done here locally is the state Treet Tower in Boston which is a beautiful building now that's who he cut his teeth on you know he was working for them when he was a young architect now he owns his own for so it's I think he has good experiences um and I think that the the staff that they're offering up um is capable we'll find out what their level of expertise is in historic preservation when we do our interviews with them next week um we had 13 or 14 questions that the committee submitted for consideration to be asked and those questions were discussed tonight by the committee as a whole and I am absolutely pleased to say that the first five questions are all related to Historic preservation experiences so um I think that we're going to focus in on what their capabilities are to get a good feel for whether or not that they can do history preservation war and I think if uh those questions are answered as we hope they will be um we're going to we're going to select this firm and then they're going to begin work on the project um before the end of the year so we're moving you know kind of in hypers speed right now with regards to hiring the architect they we do up to a 10% design that's all we're paying for right now and then if the town decides to to go forward with the project you know we're looking at an estimated maybe $15 million wor the project work for the town hall and in addition to the Ritter building and modifying space here in the Ritter building um they'll be given uh more than a fair shot at uh being the next in the carrying on work of disting design and proiv architectural services for inspection and you know specification review s review if we actually do fund this project so um I I'm like I said I'm really pleased with you know how we've inserted a culture of historic preservation for for Town Hall and for the rder building the addition to the r building any questions okay all right um so business um the closing date on town hall and rid Repair actually I think we only have uh Ritter out right now um tall I don't think has been put on for bid but Ritter's been split uh the first package that's listed on the what time website is for the window replacement and the exteriors of repairs associated with the the windows and then the second package is the um uh slate and rubber gutter repairs on the Ritter building and I had expressed concerns to Carter that that's really a a higher priority than replacing the windows and I think he understands that they've split the two um we're not going to get any handicap ramp anytime in a foreseeable future which may be good if we you know end up doing an addition onto the rer building because we could then take care of my handicap issues with that project so um the closing date is the 2 7th in November and let me just bring up the because I don't think T Hall's been back out for bit Yeah because the addition would trigger full 8 88 compliance wouldn't it probably yeah yeah but there's there's ways of getting it depending on what elevation you put the addition at and but I don't think um like I said I don't think tan Hall is out for bid again and we're not the bed year for on RPS yeah you know from experience don't you you yeah okay my day today was crazy we're not going to make it it'll push the January all right so town hall is not just the uh r Memorial building new windows exterior repairs that package and then r Memorial Building roof and cutter repairs that package and both of those have a closing date of 12 11 11:27 at 11:00 for the first one and then I don't know why the second one's coming in at noon so we'll see um but that's good we got to we got to kind of keep some pressure on them to get time all out too since that's also critical need all right um we talked about the historical commission and our overlap and uh the sooner we get that done I think the better off we'll be I really I really think that that a merger will will benefit both organizations immensely and minimize the amount of volunteers we need to bring to the table uh since Richard's not here I don't know anything about 763 you know 50 Main Street I'm I'm half I'm half tempted to say we got to at least send them a letter and in writing and say you're out of compliance with the architecture preservation by law please tell us what what do you think yeah I think I need to follow up with a B more I think that's not out of the out of the cards I me I think but yeah I think I apologize I been Focus yeah right now I I I I don't you know I just think if you get something in the mail it may make you pay attention more and and you know we would word the letter in a way that says you know how can we help you you know to move this forward with with you know the limitation that we don't have the funding to do stuff but maybe right give them some moral support yeah um but it's getting worse I mean that's the problem no I I got you yeah uh so maybe by December you could we could you report back on report back and then and then it will'll begin the year maybe by sending out a letter that says you know yeah please do something okay all right um I haven't done my job I haven't haven't got the mailing out it's something I'm still working on I'm G talk to Chris about getting Logan to help us with that Chris Riley turns out that Chris Riley the new land use director we up in Cincinnati Ohio so he and I had something in common one time lived in Ohio oh wow yeah all righty uh has anybody uh seen that the uh uh master plan is kind of the master planning process is kind of going through in fact there was a meeting tonight which I really wanted to participate in but uh couldn't because of the conflict with the lunenberg municipal building design committee but they they got a new they're coming up with a new chair uh Josie goest I think stepped away for personal reasons um and the timetables I think has also been changed because of uh a lack of um engagement with the with the consultant on the part of the time I mean we were supposed to have plans to be reviewed by this point in time and that's been delayed but if you haven't gone on the time website please I recommend that you do so because they now have their third survey and the third the third survey actually talks about the Brooks house you know yeah and um and a bunch of other things so what they did was that they've identified um I don't know 10 or so objetives or goals and then under under each of those they Li list a bunch of options that could support those goals and then um you pick five you can pick up to five of the the specific uh ways to support the goal and that's your your response back so if you haven't filled out the uh the survey I'd recommend that do so it's interesting to see the questions that they're asking there's affordable housing which is a big you know Buzz word these days um there's you know discussions about what kind of businesses we should have in lenberg and of course there's questions related to Historic reservation so those are also in there and and and I I found the uh the description of the options like if you take this would you take this action to support this particular goal there were a lot of options you like each one of those objectives had you know 10 11 different types of things you could pick to say this would support that that objective so they've gone through and really put a lot of information it's going to be really interesting to see how they uh what kind of responses they get and how they collate those responses into something that makes sense and I think now the plan is is that the master plan would maybe be approved sometime uh later in 2025 I don't know if they're planning on making this something that would be discussed at annual time meeting in May my guess is um there may not be enough time to get all the things done that need to get done for that to happen so but maybe um I'm actually contemplating uh joining the master plan steering committee because I think uh it's really it's a critical piece you know good planning is is key and essential to uh good fiscal management and you know teeing up capital projects and and uh a perfect case some point is that you know we're moving ahead on the Brooks house while it's something that's being discussed as a master plan component and it's kind of like you know if we had a plan we wouldn't be moving something forward on the Brooks house but that got that got prompted by the you know the work that's being done by the ber Municipal Building design committee which you know as Matt Allison said quite wisely at one of our meetings in the past well if we had a master plan we wouldn't need a committee we would know what we're going to do with our buildings in time so all right um any questions or comments about the master planning process or anything else under old business all righty um anything else from the floor we have no public comments anything from you all can we make a meeting in December the 12th of December does that work how's everybody's calendars look Willam the only thing the only thing that's even more pressing this time of the year for construction contractors is Paving yeah the 12 is tough for me 12 Stu yeah I could do the I could do the fth uh fifth is not work does not work for me it's my son's birthday I could yeah I could do theoretically do the 19th but that's that's a little weird yeah I you be around till the 19 I am here I'm not going anywhere okay all right so then uh let me see if the room's available we might end up this pting until January yeah all right okay all right um shoot for the 19th yeah shoot for the 19th I'll add just make sure that we can get to room the other thing is might just do if we can't do that can't get a room we might just do as Zoom which I think is just fine all righty anything else comes before us is there a motion to adjourn motion to adjourn I'll second all those in favor say I I great great great great and I will evening in concrete