Good evening. It's November 13th, finance committee meeting. In accordance with the requirements of the open meeting law, please be advised that this meeting is being recorded and broadcast over the Lunberg public access channel and on Facebook live on the public
access Facebook page. It will be uploaded to the Lunenburgg Access YouTube channel after the meeting. If you would like to zoom in, you can go to lunenburggmass.gov. Uh go under calendar, find the finance
committee and pull up the agenda and you'll have the link there. You could stand for the pledge of allegiance. I pledge algiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands. One nation
under God, indivisible, liberty and justice for all. >> We have any announcements from the committee? >> No public comment. No.
>> Uh, town manager and finance director not here. >> No. >> Look, see if anybody's online. I don't see anybody. Um, so we're going to go right to the public hearing. >> Opening the public hearing now. >> Yes.
>> Okay. >> Make a motion for that or >> do we have to >> I'll make a motion. We'll we go into a public hearing. >> Second. All in favor? >> I sure again nobody's on Zoom. >> So we got the first one here is the
article one. >> Do we have to read the language? Um do we I don't know do we >> usually public hearing you read I can read what it was on um
um article one authorization to hear andor accept the reports of officers and committees of the town submitted by the town manager to see that the town will vote to bear and or accept the regular written reports of the town officers and
committees or take any other action. relative to there too. In the summary, this will allow town meeting to hear and open acts uh upon delivery to the town meeting boards, committees, missions, and other offices
likely oral reports or town meeting included. And then they list three, which is the storm water task force, the Lunberg municipal building design, and the M master plan steering committee. So, sounds like this this first one is to allow us to hear those reports.
There's probably no financial um >> impact >> impact on these. >> Um just an FYI, >> uh I'm on the Lunar Municipal Building Design Committee. We met last week, I believe, and we are not going to be ready to do a report. So, there will
there might only be two reports. I'm not sure if the Stonewater Task Force and the master plan steering committee are ready, but there'll only be two if if that's the case. Okay. >> So, uh any >> I guess any public comments any comments
from the from the committee, I guess, right? >> No. >> Any from the >> public? I'll recommend we say there's no uh no financial impact. >> Second. >> Second. >> Yeah. >> All in favor?
>> I >> Okay. >> Number two, uh amending the finan uh fiscal year 2026 omnous budget submitted by town manager to see if the town will vote to raise an appropriate borrow or transfer
from available funds. all sums necessary to amend the amount voted in the fiscal year 2026 ominous ominous budget under article 10 of the May 3rd 2025 annual town meeting
or take any other actions related there too. Um this article stands special meeting to adjust annual operating budgets as warranted. The handout will be available at town meeting specific questions may be directed to department heads
and um I think uh this says we voted to defer it already. Did we? >> We didn't but >> I don't >> I think >> well this is the deferring >> right we won't know the numbers so we can't make any decisions >> so we'll defer
>> so any any comments from this from the committee on this? No, I think the numbers are very small, >> right? But have we seen it? >> Um, yeah. >> Any comments from the public >> on this? >> I recommend we uh we def uh defer this
until the uh town meeting. >> All in favor? I I >> Okay. Article three, authorization to pay expenses from prior fiscal year submitted by the town manager to see if the town will vote and raise appropriate
or transfer from available funds a sum of money for payment of the prior year's expenses or take any action there uh action relative there too. And um this requires a 9/10 vote for a variety
of reasons. uh expenses from the prior fiscal year are not paid during the fiscal year and are not encumbered. The article um in this will include any warrants in the case that are outstanding. Uh at the time of this uh
printed there was only $266 due to Haywood Hospitals. Um, I don't I haven't heard of anything more, but I don't think I don't think we should vote on it until town meeting when we'll have the exact if there's anything more or this actually
>> I'm not even sure that they said they was going to pay it or >> but it's only 266 bucks. >> Um, any comments? >> Oh, we saw >> and so this is one we're going to defer as well. >> Defer, right? That makes sense. just cuz
we usually we don't know the numbers on these things and we just wait >> right >> any comments from the from the >> Honda >> there was another um invoice there was an email from the town manager
>> oh yeah I saw that yeah >> parks and recreation I believe it is I just read tonight >> I saw I didn't know what that from April >> why are they sending it to us I so that's what it was four. Okay. Okay. >> Yeah. So,
>> remember how much it was. >> I I'll make a recommendation that we defer this. >> Second. All in favor? >> I. Uh, article four, authorization to fund special projects to see if the town will
vote to transfer from available funds a sum of money for a program of special projects as follows or take any other actions thereof. Stormwater Consulting $42,900. I guess there was a few of them so they
when they did it originally they they listed them, but those other ones went away. So that's why it's written the way it is. Uh summary, the town has been working with consultants relative to the to MS4 compliance and is also exploring a storm water utility relative to the
same. These funds will allow the town to contract consultants for these professional services. The likely motion under this article will transfer the 42,900 from unexpected prior fiscal year's capital articles.
So um I all right so I do have some thoughts about this one. >> Um >> the first thing is we did have we have spent some money as already on doing the consulting some consulting but it hasn't
been really good the work didn't really pan out. They were using old data. Um my comment on this is and I have been following the storm water task force is that this they used the consultant to
come up with a tax uh a a tax basis formula on how to tax people to raise the revenue. The thing is I think that's one possible solution but not all of them. Mhm.
>> Um and I have not seen other options being explored. So for example, we were behind you know many years ago we were behind on our pavement and we borrowed against and we made the commitment to put $500,000 towards and you know
actually was last at 500. Um, and one thing that Bill said in our last in the budget season early this year was that he actually doesn't think we need to keep increasing the pavement management at the rate that we were increasing because we took care
of everything. Now we're kind of in a maintenance and doing smaller projects. It's not like we had to, you know, spend 5 million. And I think there is a little bit of that on this storm water task force. This is a feedback I have given is like what other ways we can do because I do see that we are behind on
storm water and we do need to be in compliance with the state but adding a new tax as the only way I'm against and I think I I think we need to do a a a study
a a easier study on you know what it will take us to to catch up and what will be the cost of maintaining and that might not be a new tax that might that might just be, you know, part of the budget that we have for uh the PW. So,
I'm going to vote no on this because I didn't really like how the previous money was used and I would like them to explore other options versus just come up with a new tax. So, that's my feedback on it. >> Anybody else?
>> Well, I think they're calling it a It's a storm water utility fee based on the amount of imperous service you have on your property. So, it's my understanding that this fee is supposed to fund the whole storm
water maintenance project, equipment, everything. It's going to it's going to be quite a number. >> Yeah, that's what he said was that's for commercial properties will be taxed based on their area.
But like residential will be taxed a flat amount. I can't remember. >> Well, yeah. I don't know if they Yeah, that's what they're talking about. I don't know if they've actually put anything to >> Yeah, I don't together. >> Where is the state? I mean, I know they talked about it.
>> I've heard them talk about it, but this isn't that. This is just something else. But I I and I and was it was it on the original warrant? I don't remember if that was one of the items that was on the first draft of the warrants about setting up the storm water.
>> Um, no, they're not setting up the the storm water utility act. Yeah, because but this >> consulting services to >> to get there and we have already had like the service that they hired wasn't hey
what it would cost us to catch up with. We have number this number of basins that we need to do maintenance. This is how much money will catch be to catch up and this is how much money will be maintenance. like that's what I would like to see versus let's just create a
perpetual tax that we're going to add to to um you know to the residents and that's that's my feeling about it. It's and that. >> Yeah. So, I think what this money is going to be used for is to
flesh out what this storm water um >> utility fee. >> Yeah. Fee would be and what and how they would set it up. Is that is that >> Yes, that's that's what I understand. >> Which is Yeah, cuz Yeah. To me that makes that makes more sense to do that
because you you know I mean I remember hearing like oh it's going to be not a big chunk every you know it's not a lot of money to set it up but I mean to for as a you know for like residential housing but I I haven't seen any real numbers. So, this is really only about
hiring somebody to help us create something that would have to be approved at the the well maybe May >> at Maytown meeting. And I guess the question is is if we
recommend we that they they don't get this where where is the town does the town not have a consultant and will be using its own people which maybe isn't maybe they're already they're not specialized
in this area. I don't know. Um I'm assuming I wish the town manager was here because I could ask why. I mean, they must have decided that a consultant was was needed. >> Yeah, that wouldn't be uncommon. They're not
just like most services. Yeah, they're going to need consulting services just like conservation and planning what not. They need consulting services to help them uh make decisions and um put a plan together um to work on to move this forward.
and 42,900 sounds like a >> it's not it's a nice number that seems like they already have an agreement or a discussion with somebody and that's the fee. So it I mean I'm just guessing but sounds like that's the number >> most likely. >> So if we vote against this I guess we're
going to say you have to you know in May we'll have we might not have the best information to make the best decisions. Well, I think if we vote since they already used consultants
and we saw the path that they chose to go with the consultants, which was utility tax, my vote on no is I would like you to explore other other ways to solve this problem versus
just propose me a new tax and that's what they have used the consult consultants and that's where they don't they from watching their meetings they didn't feel the consultants they use had a lot of experience good data and so forth like I want a options on how to
solve this I don't want adjust a new tax like yeah it will take you know more machinery but we are buying new machinery for the PW how many like give me more details before you start it's it
it it's just the no other possible solutions have been explored. >> Well, we're not alone in this. All the towns are going to be doing it. So, I think they're probably following,
you know, the practices of uh other towns that are are out there. I'm sure if there are other options, we can explore them. I guess, you know, we'd have to um I guess you'd have to suggest what those options are. But, yeah, we're not the only town doing this. This is not new.
>> Um there is one town that they they talk about it that have the storm water utility tax which is Chumsford. Um but many other towns have solved are in compliance or they're working to be
in compliance that don't have a separate tax for it. So >> I'm opening to hearing your options as well. >> Yeah, I I I am too. I don't want to just have one option and I don't want to just have So that that's anyway that's
>> Yeah. So should we should we defer this until the town meeting so we could um hear the presentation from whoever is going to make I I that open and then >> based on that we can even ask questions the the obviously people in town can ask questions then from that we can make a
vote at that point. >> Okay. I I I'm okay with that. Um do you want to see if the public want to >> Yep. Ronda, do you have any >> have any comments? >> All right. So, I move that we defer this article into presentation. >> I'll second.
>> All in favor? >> I Yay. All right. Article five, public access cable committee transfer of funds submitted by public access cable committee uh to see if the town will
vote to transfer the sum of $35,271 from retained earnings of PEG access and cable related enterprise funds to fund the FY 26 PEG access and cable related enterprise
operations and capital budget or take Any other actions relative there too? Um the board approved uh the select board approved this five to zero. Uh summary as of 2025 annual town meeting 31,271
was included in the operation funds for pack. At that time the enterprise fund had not been certified as retained earnings by the state. Now that retained earlings are certified, the sum of 31,271 can be transferred along with an
additional $4,000 to cover additional videographers's hours. The monies previously appropriated to pack for the general fund will be unspent and later certified as free cash. So there's >> So I see where the 31 35,000 is coming
from. Um >> yeah, I would recommend we approve this. I see also on the draft I'm looking at they have this on the consent calendar. >> Yeah. >> Is there any discussion?
>> Any the public? Rhonda. >> Okay. >> So, do we have a motion? >> I recommend approval. >> I'll second. >> All in favor? >> I >> I article six, cemetery commission transfer of funds.
um submitted by seme commission to see if the town will vote to transfer $10,000 from the summerday sale of lots fund 8111 8115 to the uh capital article fund 306
or take any other actions relative there too. Um the uh select board recommended approval 5 to zero. Um the articles transferred funds from cemetery lot sales to the
cemetery capital article fund the cemetery commission intends the use of these funds to cover expenses associated with headstone straightening repairs along with other cemetery projects. I think this is a pretty standard. We get these every year and this is actually on
the consent agenda too which we have to vote on later. >> Recommend approval. >> I'll second. >> All in favor? I >> article seven uh authorization to fund a sum of money
for project estimators submitted by town manager uh to see if the town will vote to raise and appropriate or transfer from available funds a sum of $50,000 for the engagement of one or more consultants to
assist with capital project estimation or take any other relative action there too. This um this was let's see this was approved by the select board 50
>> um you need two/3 summary the facility director for the town and schools as well as the department of public works directors are responsible for preparing and submitting capital fund projects requests while they are developing uh costas based on
their own experience and using indust industry standards they are there are occasions when the use of outside consultants would provide a more accurate estimate of project costs in the past. Some capital projects have exceeded the original estimates. This
article seeks to improve the accuracy of costs project costs and reduce the likelihood of overruns. This likely motion uh this likely motion under the article will transfer 50,000 from unexpended prior fiscal year's capital articles.
So from this it sounds like they want to have a fund available so that the facilities director or other um >> can use to hire a consultant to do a proper estimate for
>> probably the capital committee right >> I think it's any any kind of project >> from the sound of it >> how does that work I mean who once that fund is set >> who approves expenditures from that fund the town manager has overall
responsibility. >> How do they divvy it up? >> Well, yeah, >> that'd be a good question to ask. I >> 50,000 is I don't think is a lot of money. It's it's usually so
um she I heard her from the select board meeting to say usually an estimated for projects for complex projects about5 $6,000 and this is a fund that would exist because it's a fund and not part
of the budget it would be used over multiple years. So for a specific use, >> well, we've we've at least I've seen a number of capital projects that have come in over budget. The primary school heating air conditioning thing was one
uh and and others. Uh, and so I think this is a a good way to try to get better information so that when we do make decisions, we have better information. So, I think that's I think
to me this this is a a good way to to at least have funds available to do that to hire professionals to doesn't mean it's going to be right, but it does mean it's at least will be hopefully we'll get better information and better numbers than than we have in the past in some
cases. >> The the one thing I I I agree and I'm not against funding project estimators. I think that's a good way. One thing is the money that we are using is from a
unfulfilled like not completed uh capital plan project and it you know that h I mean we get those you know sometimes uh
sometimes we bid high we we we get high numbers sometimes we have low so we have we we sometimes have money left over. Uh >> and I know that it's it's just the our financial operations usually are
that we are funding this type of thing in the spring during annual town meeting where we get all our monies, you know, we put into free cash or not. We take money out of like leftover from previous from C like and we do our financial
planning then and with one big pot of money. This one is we can always take money from capital you know not completed capital plans projects. It's it's just
as a as a someone who who cares about finances operational I don't think it's the best operation. I >> what you mean funding so >> yeah it's just it's just the way it's capital >> it's the way it's flowing the money it's
just we're creating a lot of pockets money that we're going to get this money from here and put it there I like when things are done well simple and the process >> yeah I mean I I agree that if the town had a fund set up and then they said we're going to put 20 grand into the
account because the the fund's running short um uh out of the budget then that would that would be >> the easiest way to do it. I'm guessing here and maybe uh it's just my guess is that they they want to use the money for
this capital uh project uh season I guess is that we can call it that >> as a capital >> this is specifically for capital project >> right so so they want it so they don't want to wait till the next budget they want to set it up now put 50 grand in so they can use it for um
>> the remaining calendar >> the the remaining calendar yeah for the stuff that they're working on Um, and I haven't seen the capital. Has anybody seen the capital committee's meetings? I haven't seen them. Chris, >> a couple of them. >> Chris has been is on that committee, right?
>> Yeah. They only have had a couple. >> Yeah. So, that's my guess that they want to do that and and uh I I think you're right that it would be better to fund it through the budget, >> right? >> Um, in the long run because it's just more
transparent, >> right? But if there's money left over from capital projects, why not take it from that, right? >> Instead of taking it out of the budget >> if it's spec if it's specifically for
funding capital projects. Mhm. >> My point on bringing it up is I I would like us to not engage too much into this kind of this way of doing things because it makes less clear
financial operations overall and it's harder to track things. That's that's all. Yeah, I I understand what you're saying, but I know I in the past >> there's been other >> money articles where they come up and they've got a whole list of they're
taking $10 over here and $100 from this and $100 and there's a whole list of stuff to fund this one project. >> This is similar to that other than it's it's specifically coming out of unexpended capital specifically for a capital project.
>> Sure. I understand what you're saying though as far as Yes. >> Yeah. I'm I'm not gonna >> it clean. >> Yeah. I'm not going to vote against I it's it's a warning that preferably we should try to do these things all at once with intention have
all our monies there. Um I I don't like honestly it's not my strong preference like we don't know what next year is going to be like. You know we're funding something that she's expecting to use over many years. Well, why not just put 15 year $15,000
every year on on, you know, like I have a lot of thoughts on it. It feels like more it's an operational thing if because we always going to have facilities put an extra $10,000 in facility or $15,000 in the facility budget every year, make it part of their
operations. Um, yada yada yada yada. So, I don't but I'm not going to vote against. I'm just saying if it it's messy that's all. >> I I I think that the right way to to handle these kinds of things would be is
to since this is really not part um this is before the before we even approve a capital project. So this is a budgety item. I would say the best way to do it would be to have a fund and then we budget money, you know, during
budget season to do this and any money that's left over for capital articles uh at the end of whatever period of time goes back to free cash and then we deal with it that way. That's the cleanest way to do it. >> I agree with that. Uh however, I think
this time around, I think because they want the money now to do the things that they need to set up the fund, uh I would I would approve I would agree to do this. However, I would recommend that or
I would suggest we don't have any power, but I would suggest that further uh funding of this be done through the budget. >> Agreed. Matt, that would that would be the fair way to do it because I do understand why they want the money now.
>> No, I I Yeah, I'm I'm with you with you. I think we're all on the same page. >> Yep. >> Any public comments? >> I'll make a recommendation we approve uh the article. >> Second. All in favor?
>> I >> I >> I'm going to say no. >> No. only because I would still like to hear how the money is going to be divvied up between departments. Okay. Article 8 to see if the town will
accept this from the school committee. uh to see if the time will accept provision from uh Mass General Law, chapter 40, section 13E, to establish a special education reserve fund to utilize in the upcoming fiscal year to pay without further appropriations for
unanticipated unbudgeted costs of special eds and recovering high and recovery high school programs, out-ofpocket district tuitions, or transportation, or take any other actions relative thereof. Um this was
approved by the select board 4 to one. Uh the summary this article will establish a special education reserve fund which will be used to support the town's special ed costs. The fund is a tool to
help level the tax impact of fluctuating expenses for fund uh legally mandated special educational services. These funds are used to help fund unanticipated or unbudgeted cost of special education out of the out of
district tuition, transportation costs, and recovery uh high school tuition. The balance of the funds cannot exceed 2% of the annual net school spending of the school district. Funds can only be expended or transferred out of the
reserve fund after the majority vote of the school committee and the majority vote of the select board as of as is specified under master logic 40 section 13E. Money's accumulated in that fund over from one fiscal year to the next.
uh if established at the November 18th special uh special town meeting, funds will be transferred in to the special ed funds uh at future town meetings. So that means that this is just setting up the fund, not
funding not funding. >> So I will vote no on this and I have a lot of reasons for it. So I'm going to start because I think this is putting the heart the the cart ahead of the
horse. There is no reason to create this fund. Now a fund can be created and funded on the same town meeting. Of all the issues that we have had with school budget, none has been because of
these items that they are claiming there that this fund can be used for. Um, this fund is not setting up how it's going to be funded and and we need to have a lot of conversations about the school budget,
their financial management before I create a new fund for them. Like this this is just so such bad timing in my opinion after they have shown such poor
manage financial management of the funds that they have. How can they be asking us to create a new one? These are not the problems that we're having with the school budget. It's it's like this is insulting to me
to be honest. It's how I feel about it. It's it's really putting the cart ahead of the horse. These are not the problems that we have had. This is not why they had, you know, that much money left over from their budget and they're asking us
to put more money aside and it's just no, there's no reason to create this now. I need to for them to show me that they can do good financial management before we start creating new funds. If any of these things happen, this is the
other interesting thing. And Glenn was the one who brought this up. If any of these things happen, it's mandatory that we fund them. We are going to fund them. We're going to need to fund. If a kid moves in, it's goes up. We're going to have to fund it. There's no need to create a a a
special fund for it. But anyway, so I feel very strong against this one um because of those reasons. But anyway, that was me. I was just looking it up to see if if this was a new law that the state now is allowing us to do this. >> Nope,
>> it's not. Okay. Because I just I'm just looking it up to see if it was new. I couldn't I can't tell. >> I think it covers too many things. Quite honestly, >> they have said I think it covers too many things. like they they list out um you know they start off with you know
the special the cost of special education which that can that always concerns me because that can be a huge hit to you very very quickly. Um, but the outofstate out of district tuition, transportation costs and uh and such. I
don't >> that just seems to be a coverall type of uh number fund are trying to put together when they misbudget it. >> I think those are the those are all the the subgroups of the of the special ed and we're mandated to pay it. So, it's a question of not do we pay it, it's how
we pay it and uh kind of thing. So, I I I usually like to have when things are unknown or things are you kind of know something's going to happen at some point, putting aside some money, you know, on during the good years to say,
"Okay, we have a fund here that, you know, we're going to uh uh we're going to use when something bad, not bad, when something happens where we have to spend another $300,000 for a special needs student that we didn't anticipate. pay
when the budget was created. It's good to have that kind of money. It gives it gives more freedom to uh to those people. It is the school the uh school committee will have to approve it and the select board will have to approve it. So, I get it. I understand it. I
just don't know enough about why. Now, that's the question. And I wish I had either the uh superintendent or the town manager here to to to do this. that this I think it might make sense to me, but I at at this very point I I
it I don't know because I don't have enough uh knowledge about why they think this is good. I I don't know the history of of of uh the special ed >> and how are they going to fund? Why are we creating a new bucket of money that
we don't have way to fund it? And then the other thing I don't want it to happen is comes next year. We go we got to fund that and we say well not yet well why did you create the fund if we're not planning to fund? It's like just make it clean. Well, again, I don't
know enough about how these things, special ed programs work. I know the function of it, but I don't know. Are we always And I know the state pays us back some of it. if it's if it's different. I I remember all that. But um uh if we're
always, you know, if the last five years we've always been, you know, okay, we need another 300,000 for the for the special ed budget because of, you know, whatever happens, then to me, uh you
either budget more for it or you can put aside a reserve fund. And then if you don't use it that year, well then you have it for next year. And then you might say, "Okay, well there's 300,000 in there. We don't need to fund it this year." And then uh that's that's fine. You just have the money available to to
do the thing. So I don't know enough about it. So my inkling would be to to right now I don't think I know enough to to to vote to either approve or deny. I would say I would defer and then understand but let let them explain and
we can ask questions but um that's my my point. >> Jay, do you have anything to say? >> I just want to know how they plan to plan to fund it. >> It's just coming out of the school budget. >> Well, that's I mean I Yeah, I think
Rhonda actually wants to speak on this one since we're in the public hearing. I'm sorry, Jean. Is that okay? She was like wanted >> one of them. >> Okay. >> Ronda Lysia 181 Reservoir Road. I just wanted to kind of take bits and pieces
of what I've heard and I agree with the statement that I think these type of funds where you're specifying you're limiting your purpose what of what they can be used for. It's best to do those
things in in um more prosperous times than what we're in right now. I don't think we should be I mean not only I get the point that they they don't want to put money in it now but I don't even agree with creating such a
fund at this time due to the economic circumstances and the circumstances that I've seen the things I've seen happen in the last few years of at the very last minute things
have to change and we're taking money from here and there. I think we need flexibility be because we seem very um just unstable and I I like to be I think
we need to be flexible and able to react and creating any kind and it's not against the schools. If anyone was out to create a new um stabilization or reserve fund right now, I'd be saying
no. >> Thanks. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> All right. So, are we deferring on this? >> I don't know. >> Would you know any might Well, I know Ann Hannah wants probably doesn't want to wants to vote against it, but do we
okay to defer or >> I I mean I if we vote, I'm going to vote no. I I I have enough information to not wanting to vote on this. Um but if fellow members want to defer, I'm okay deferring. I I I >> um
>> I mean you can vote now at town meeting. >> Yeah. Yeah. Fine. >> I I certainly can. Um if if I don't know if other people prefer to defer or >> you want would you do? >> I I don't Yeah, I don't know enough
about it. like I' I'd like to hear a little bit more about how this whole thing is going to work and you know and whatnot before >> Okay, I'll make a motion that we def we defer this to the town meeting. >> Second. >> All in favor?
>> I >> I >> Okay. Deferring. All right. Next one is article 9 41A property tax deferral submitted by the board of assessors to see if the town will vote to increase the gross receipts that seniors may have in their prior
calendar year to be eligible to defer property taxes under Massachusetts general law chapter 59 section 5 uh clause 41A from $20,000 to 100% of the amount established
annually by the commissioner of revenue revenue as the income limit for seniors who are not headed not heads of household to qualify for the circuit breaker state income tax credit
so-called for the preceding year tax and such increase to be effective from defers grants for taxes assessments for the fiscal year beginning on or after July 1st 2026.
Uh this was uh recommended for approval by the select board 5 to zero. Uh and the summary is under clause 41A seniors may be able to delay payment of their property taxes under the property taxes not discharge the tax obligations like an exemption. Instead it defers payment
until the senior sells the helm or passes away. Uh a deferral allows a senior to use the sources that could go to pay for taxes to defay living expenses instead. Town meeting is authorized to vote to increase the gross receipt limit from 20,000 uh up to the
income limit allowed for the circuit breaker state income tax credit for a single non-head of household um uh >> filer >> filer currently for $72,000. The town meeting uh in Lunberg has
previously voted to lower the interest rate on deferred tax acrals from 8 to 4%. And that's it. So, it looks like they're they they want to increase the the uh uh the eligibility uh income from
20,000 to 72,000 or in the future whatever the commissioner revenue sets. >> Is this a different number than was presented before? >> I don't know.
>> Yes. So there was in the beginning um there's different circuit breakout numbers. >> Mhm. >> Um and there was 109,000 um which would have been a married couple. >> Yeah. I thought it was single and
>> but now they're just saying single. Um yeah. Um now this would have um a budget impact. >> Yeah. >> Mhm. >> Because it would be >> could
>> it would be taken from the overlay. I I I wasn't sure if the town could use like a a cool revenue like as a way to for for its budget, but you know we do cash I guess. Um so we wouldn't be seeing
this money. The question that I had asked um was how many people do we have in town because there are other other um services other tax deferrals or
tax break that people get that the circuit breaker is the qualifier. Um I don't I haven't got that number because that would be the maximum number of people that could apply for this
right and and the town would be first uh have first it would have a lean on all the these properties. So anyway, um yeah, Rhonda, do you >> if you guys are
>> Yeah. >> Rondaio, 181 Reservoir Road. Um, I just want to say there's been an awful lot of these type of articles where I mean I'm all about um helping seniors,
but at the same time there is a dollar impact on all the other taxpayers and I feel like I have no sense of what all these exemptions that we keep approving at every town meeting
um and these other things plus the the what was the big one that we did the senior >> I don't know the program Franco worked on >> yes contributing to
>> they still haven't figured out a formula or whatever on how they're going to spread that cost among the other taxpayers. So, it just it just bothers me like you're the finance committee
and if they're not giving you a dollar impact, I don't think you should be voting. If they're not telling you a if they can't tell you what the dollar impact to every other taxpayer is,
>> then maybe you should not be voting on it. Thanks. >> Well, this isn't a forgiveness. This is deferred. So ultimately the town is going to get the money plus 4% interest when the people either when they're no longer in the house. Kind of like a
reverse mortgage kind of situation. I'm sure. So this is I mean this is a financial thing because it's a >> um you know we won't have the money this year. We'll have it maybe in four years. Who knows? And it will be growing every year. they the longer these people are
in the home, the large and they still maintain it, the larger it will be. So I I I I do agree that there is a a financial thing and I I would like to know what they estimate the the cost to be because you're going from 20,000 to
72,000. >> That's a big jump. >> That's a big jump. Is that going to be, >> you know, 10% more people or 200% more people? Until until people actually apply, you don't know. I mean, >> right.
>> Yeah. I have reservations about 72,000 >> that just be that's just the income level. Yeah. >> Right. That's the income level. >> 72,000 significant income level, >> right? And if you're you're a retired person, you don't you know 72,000
it's not a lot of money but it's also not you know there are people with lots of other you know they have lots of savings and then they draw on that and their income isn't that great but that that's why they saved all those years ago. So >> um
>> I think to qualify for the circuit breaker they do look at your assets. I would. Yeah. So, it's not like you can >> you have to qualify. >> Yeah. It's not like you can have $3 million in assets and then have a just
social security as your income. You wouldn't qualify for it. >> Well, this might be another one I think that we just, you know, we can defer. I would like to know that you know from the people giving the presentation and also I'd like to know once you know what
what do they estimate the cost to be if it's relatively small amount of money know it's again it's not it's not we're not forgiving the debt we're just >> so you know five years from now uh it might be that for every dollar we defer
we're getting a dollar back because the people are are leaving. So this could be a revolving thing that maybe maxes out or you know grows slowly after a while because of because of uh you know people paying back the money that they deferred and we're getting they said 4% but we
could get eight but even at 4% that's a decent return. So it can make sense. I and and I would I think the town would like to do something for elderly people
who live in the town who can't afford uh who are having financial difficulties to keep them in the town which will have benefits to the town and that they usually don't have children and that means we don't have to educate them which makes it cheaper for the town to
run. So um I you know I I I am would like I I am positive feeling towards this but again like without any other people to tell me uh information I don't know enough to to make a final decision.
>> I agree. So should we defer to to hopefully get more information? >> I I think I I think wait till they do the presentation. We can defer it and see what they what they say if anybody uh that's just my thought. >> Yep. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> I'll recommend we defer this.
>> Second. >> Second. >> All in favor? >> I >> I >> All right. The next one. Uh, article 10, 210, uh, uh, 21 Main Street assessment, town manager and a select board to see
if the town will vote to authorize the select board to require a a gift meeting for nominal consideration and assess uh, assessment to turret to be uniquely through within the certain property known as 21 Main Street, Lunberg. Um
uh adjacent to town hall said uh set assessment being uh comprising of 442 square ft more or less uh shown as permanent and exclusive easement 442 plus square foot on the plan of land entitled easement plan in Lunberg Mass
prepared by Ellison Roy civil civil design group dated March 13, 2025 and on file with the office of town clerk for the purpose of maintaining maintaining, repairing, and replacing and/or installing a new and for the ongoing use of the deck, ramp, and sidewalk uh to
the assessing and the aforementioned town hall or for the incidental purpose or to take any other action thereof. Uh it's like the board approved 5 to nothing. This has and this is about the ramp on the side of the town hall which is I guess um
not properly uh placed. So, this uh easement will make the ramp legal. So, u I don't know if there's a financial I guess there would be because if we didn't, we'd have to take it down and figure another way to to get uh people
in the building which would cost money. So, I would say it's probably a financial consideration. >> There is no um budget number. >> Well, the indirect financial >> Yeah. be indirect because if but I think
this is just saying we can keep the the ramp there legally and this and nicely the people next door are are willing to do that. >> Well the one thing is is saying uh
select board to acquire by gift. So >> the easement is the gift. >> The eman is a gift they're giving. Okay. So they're get Yeah. I've talked to him a couple of times and he just says I
I was told by I think it was when he was getting buying the property that that was the case. He let the town know the town had I think um Dylan and Roy take a look and say, "Yeah, you're right." And so um he's just basically saying, "Yeah,
we'll make it all legal and that way you don't have to worry um about it." Um, it's a it's a nice thing for him to do. He could he could have asked for money, I think, but I don't think that's that's his style anyways. But anyways, I think it's a it's a no-brainer. But the
question is is does it have a financial impact? >> I I guess indirectly it could, but I don't think it >> there's there's no budget number. >> Yeah. >> I I would say there's no financial impact. >> Mhm. >> Yeah.
>> Yeah. So that financial impact of the budget. >> Yeah. Ronda, did you have any comment on that? >> All in favor? >> I. >> I. >> Okay. No financial impact. Okay. Article 11, transfer of the care and custody and control of kids kingdom and the land it
is on from the school committee to the select board submitted by town management. and the select board to see if the town will vote to transfer the care, custody, and control of a portion of the land with the building thereon known as K Kingdom located at 1079 Massav. more
specifically identified in the excesses records as map 60 parcel 55 as shown on the plan of land entitled approximate parcel configuration Pacio's building in Brooks House dated April 15, 2016 and on file with the
office of the town clerk from the school committee uh from the school committee presently held for school purposes to the select board for general municipal purposes or to take any actions thereof. Select board approved it five to zero.
Um and the comments are that the Connor Lawren memorial playground or King King seemed to has been a special part of the community for nearly 20 years. And I'll add there was a one before that that was the wooden one that was there for I don't know how many years. You probably
know probably 20 more years before that. >> Long time. >> Yeah. So there's been a playground there for 40 or so years. playground continues to hold sentimental value for the families and have been enjoyed by many generations of Lunberg children. At the 2016 annual meeting, voters transferred
uh voted to transfer the the TC Pasio Elementary School and the Brooks House from the school committee to the select board while the school committee retained care and custody control of kids kingdom. In 2025, town meeting authorized funding for a design of
additional parking to support the adult activity center. While the town has not yet engaged the designer, it has been suggested that the new parking configuration may need to expand into the area where King Kid kids kingdom directly sits. This transfer does not represent a decision or definite
relocation of kids kingdom and that decision will only be made after substantial um opportunities for public input. This is an administrative step that will enable the town to continue study how uh best to meet the needs of our senior
population and the community desires to uh preserve the legacy and purpose of King's Kingdom in a thoroughful thoroughful and respectful manner. So basically they want to take uh control the town wants to take control of kids
kingdom and then at some point maybe build more parking for the adult center and do something. It's not clear and they they're very honest about it. They don't know what they're going to do at King's Kingdom.
Um, I had a talk with somebody uh yesterday about this and they were adamant that they didn't want to do this. They would be at town meetings against it because they don't want Kids Kingdom moved. Um,
and um I think it's near the library, near the club, the old Boys and Girls Club, the club. Um it's um it's historically been there forever and uh I
understand that feeling. Um but I don't know what the plans are and uh for this uh I would assume that the uh whatever they do uh they would build a parking lot and
move kids. It could be they just move it 50 feet to the right. Um or they move it somewhere else, but it's not clear what they're going to do. >> So again, um it's
um I don't know. I'm torn on this. >> It's no financial impact on >> Well, no, but this is >> Well, the Well, yeah. Well, >> does the simple transfer of it from one one department to the other have any financial impact? >> Yeah. >> Well, I guess you're right. Yeah, >> it's when we start to vote on what to do
with it. >> You're exactly right. I'm I'm sorry. I >> No, no, it's fine. >> I was thinking about it the next step about spending the money and moving the kids thing. >> I would Yeah. And but I guess that's for when we have uh input. That'll be when we can put our input at that point.
>> I stand corrected. Okay. >> Okay. So, I move >> no financial >> no financial impact. >> I'll second that. All >> in favor? I I >> Thank you guys. Okay. Item 12, notice of town meeting.
See if the town will >> Yeah. See, will town will uh this is from the town manager and the select board. The town will vote to uh amend the code of Lunberg chapter 81 entitled town meetings section one entitled
warrants by making certain deletions and striketh throughs and additions in bold italics as follows. Um I don't know if I want to read the whole thing, but um basically they want to uh have the
warrants available at the town hall, Wayland's variety store, uh Powell Stone and Gravel and Jax Jaxx on Massav. Um and they also uh uh uh part B the warrants for any of these uh
be reported and recommended to the finance committee together with any warrants for the annual be posted in the town website available town hall at least 14 days prior to such meetings. the select board causing a notification
of the date of town meeting and available of the warrants to be mailed in each dwelling in which registered voters reside at least 14 days prior to the meeting. So they would notif or other or other actions taken thereof. The uh select
board voted five to zero. The summary is the town currently mails the warrant books to every household in which a registered voter resides. The mailing has substantial cost to both printing and of the booklets and the mailing itself. This amendment would allow
notice of the meeting in a form or a letter or postcard to be mailed to each home at a much lower cost. The printing of the booklets also cost time cause time restraints for the staff and the board and committees. So, basically what they're saying here is that they want to
uh not have to print all of these things out and mail them out at a cost of I don't know what it costs, but it costs money to print and mail. And uh they will have I understand we'll have copies here or you can print them off the town
website. That's going to be the obviously if you're going to I don't know if you're going to save money by not printing them that'd be a financial thing I guess. So >> So I don't like this one either.
I think you know our our our town budget is uh almost for FY25 was almost $49 million. Um, this is this these booklets are the
only thing that we do that we deliver to every household as a way to engage our citizens and and I think you know I I mean I am I do appreciate our town employees but
you know printing of the booklet causes time constraints for staff and board and committee like if we don't have our ducks in a wrote about things that we're going to be voting on. we shouldn't be voting on, you know, like the time
constraint for me is is actually for me you're making a case against it. Like I want to if we're going to town meeting, I don't want anything being done last minute. I want things to be well communicated with the citizens. It it's
really, you know, government being being bothered by do having to engage citizens. Sure, I'm okay with that. Um, and and it's the only thing that we do that gets that gets we are communicating
with every every person who lives in Lunenburgg. Um, I I don't see it. It's not a big financial savings. I think they told me it's about $6,000 every town meeting out of a $49 million budget.
We are trying to create more convenience and in but in my mind I'm going I was just arguing with a commission in town because they're not communicating with residents enough and now we're removing the only other way that if I had knocked
on people's door they would have known about changes that were coming to their neighborhood. It's I don't like it. I don't think it's a big savings. I would feel that way except it is going to be available on the town website. So,
anybody who has a computer, looks at their phone is able to access it. And if somebody really wants one, they can request one. So, it's not as dire as you might think.
>> No, I I hear you. It's I'm not disagreeing with that. It's really, you know, we want to try to engage more people. I think people that like we want to engage more people by not sending we are not engaging more people like we have town meeting next
week other than the like if you're not listening to meetings the slack board if you're not like we're not engaging the citizen any other way. There's not a banner up front. There is nothing you know like
and this is the one thing that we do that we engage every household in town. So if we're not sending to >> voters >> say again >> registered voters not every >> no every every household gets >> registered registered. Yeah I guess >> oh >> and they still will get something where
it'll say hey there's a meeting on this date and if you want one they'll tell you what to do and you know >> or look on the website. Yeah, maybe there'll be like one of those little code things that you can do so you can get it whatever. I'm sure they'll make it easy, but there'll be a notification to these people that
>> that there's a meeting and where to get a the warrant if they want it. I I I know it's a >> as a I'll be honest as a as somebody in my my old job um as a banker we mailed
statements to people every month and it was a huge cost and working for a credit union every dollar we spent was our members money. So we're like ah we want to do electronic sending because it just makes it so much easier. And for 95 99%
of the people uh we were trying to get them to do that because it would save us money which would save them money and it was a uh and uh would be safer too because that was financial stuff rather than this stuff. U but um so I have a
a bias towards that. Yeah. It's if it's six grand or seven grand whatever it costs the price of uh mail is only going to go up and the town's getting bigger. So, it's going to go up more and more, but it's not a big chunk, but it is something we could spend six or seven
grand on something else, you know. So, to me, it's as long as people feel like they can, you know, everybody feels like they can get access to the warrants in an easy way, uh then
I wouldn't mind not spending the money. I I I I would think this is kind of what we asked them to do to find a way to do things better and this is probably a good way to do it. But I do understand that there's going to be some people who don't have a like my mom is 92 doesn't
live in town but she doesn't I mean no matter how hard we try uh we try to give her oh go on you can go on no it's not going to happen. >> So you know we gota you know there's going to be those people. >> Yeah. >> Oh sorry. Oh, sorry. I was going to ask
if um but you first. >> Oh, no. As I say, the the only the only thing that I would say is what whatever you send out to notify about the town meeting, it actually has to list out what's on the article, like not to the point of the article, but
>> no, they they want to send a postcard. >> Yeah. see that where I have a problem with because if if people don't have it in their hand and see anything that's going to interest them or something that they're interested in, they may not go download it, right? It's in the back of your mind now. Whereas when the warrant
comes in, people pop that open pretty quick and look through it to see what's on it. But if you just get, you know, a warrant, then there just a postcard that says, "Hey, go get your warrant." it. It's gonna Yeah, it says here it's going to
say they're going to send it to the house. It's gonna say the date of the town meeting and where the warrants are going to be available and um and it's online. >> Yeah,
I I I Yeah, that's a great point, Mike. Oh, Rhonda. >> Rhonda, >> Rhonda Lasia, 181 Reservoir Road. Um, I completely agree with those who would
like to keep sending the warrant to the households. Um, I have a personal preference. I like hard copies. Someone once gave me a Nook as a gift. I couldn't stand it. I like a hard book. I
like a book in my hands. Um, so I do have a personal preference myself. And if at my age that I have that I imagine it's the same for the seniors that we were just discussing earlier, I would think that
would be their personal preference as well. And I think I think we spend a lot more than $6,000 on things that I would question than sending out these booklets twice a year. Thanks, So,
you know, Mike's point is a good one. I I I would like if at least we could send you know a quick summary of something that's coming up to at least keep people engaged and and the way this this ideas
came to us like I there wasn't a lot of time for public input you know like I I feel like some of these changes when it comes to Lunenburgg we have had a lot of opportunities for hey we're thinking of doing this what are your thoughts and
even if three people shows up in in that, you know, allows for the public to participate on those on that process because we might end up with something that reflects more what the desire these citizens are. Like I I really like
Mike's idea, you know, maybe we're not sending a whole booklet, but maybe we are sending, you know, a quick summary that helps people see what's coming up. Um it and and we haven't had a chance to participate on that other than reading
the explanation. It it it feels like a big change one that we should advocate the voters more about changes and discuss it and make it I I I don't know like it just feels like we had an idea and we're
going to put in the work. How many people do we mail these to? Say it's everybody in Lunberg and how many people go to town meeting? >> Right. It's a small percentage and I remember hearing >> that a lot of them get come come back and they they got like tons of them that
come back here. Um but it it's it's a question that to me it's a question of yeah most I mean as we all know being people who volunteer our time and there's not a lot of people who have the
time or the energy or the desire or they care. They don't they don't they don't care about it. It's not they figure it's going to be okay. Fine. So it's a small number of people that go to town meeting anyways. And it's you know it's I've been going for years. It's the same 125
30 people. And then if there's a you know something with the lakes and get another 100 people come in >> school or the school get another 100 people come in. But this you know if it's kind of like this month it's going to be the same 100 people that we see all the time.
I I don't know if we can we can do anything about that. That's just the way you know it's you know when you have a lot of people at a town meeting that means you're doing something wrong. That means they're mad. They're mad about the school budget, the override, the you
know the streets, the plowing, the the water, whatever they're mad about. They're that's why they're there. The the the water stuff they're mad. So, you know, so, uh, at my old job, we used, we have annual meetings, uh, uh, and it's a
not for-p profofit and we say, "Oh, if very few members show up, that's a good thing because that means they're happy that they it's only the angry members that show up," which isn't always true. We used to get a bunch of good members, too, that just wanted to say thank you or something. But, um, so I think it's a
it's a hard thing to do, but I understand what everybody's saying. Uh, I just think that it's um it's it's it's probably a good thing to do to save a few bucks and uh if you know there's you
know we can always you know if there's like a big outcry from certain people that don't have software or people who do that you know we can figure a way to get them those things. Uh I I think it would be cheaper than than printing them out but that's I I I I understand the
other point of view too. I don't I don't think that's I I understand that. >> Yeah, I I don't know. >> I know. >> So, I I guess we can make a motion to either approve or deny this and we can
just vote on it and whatever whoever wins it's either approval or denial. >> Yeah, I think I think usually they like motions on the on the positive. >> I I'll recommend we approve this >> second. >> Okay. Again, there's no budget number.
>> Yeah, that's the other thing. There's no >> Well, we we know that printing will save us money, so it's a >> Well, we don't know what it is, but we know it's it's at least a dollar. >> So, um Okay. So, >> all in favor?
>> I >> What's the motion? >> Uh to approve the the the article. >> Yeah. Well, I think you need to do it again. Was that >> I think you need to call it out again. >> I I recommend
>> Well, Jay, do you have something else? You seem to have questions. >> Well, again, there's there's no there's no budget number. There's um usually when we vote for uh a it's on if there's a budget number, otherwise there's no financial >> $6,000 savings,
>> but it's not saying they haven't given us that number. But but we know that if they're not printing these things, they're going to be saving. >> I think that Jen said that at the last >> usually refers to the budget. >> You know, how does it impact the budget? And they haven't presented a a number.
>> Right. Well, I I I understand that I and we've had this discussion, I think, with Chris >> uh our chairman before about what is the definition of of not a financial interest. And some of us take it uh you know h pretty
broadly and others uh like you take it uh more tight which I I I have no problem with either. So >> So I don't know how so it looks like we have like um well it's just who who
would want to approve this? I would >> I would anybody else you guys would want to >> not approve this? >> Yep. And you would probably be like I think it's still financial. >> I have mixed feelings on the in general about you know I agree with both sides of the argument about saving money and
but also engaging people but because there is like I said there's no budget number in here I'll be voting no on it. >> All right. >> Okay. >> So we you know >> Okay. Good. So okay we will we will deny this uh we will not recommend this uh 3 to two.
>> Mhm. You know, people also have the option to abstain as well. >> Oh, yeah. Right. No, I'm just I'm just I I wasn't even trying to do the vote. I was just trying to understand where we all were so we could figure out >> move on to the next >> we put how do we put this down because we want to be able to say to the to the
people how we uh how we agree. >> All right. Article 13, which is I don't know six pages long. I'm just going to read the summary of it uh because it it's the uh article 13 MBTA zoning act compliance. Um,
and the summary is the town of Lunberg along with 176 other designated MBTA communities is subject to the new requirement under section 3A of the Massachusetts Zoning Act. The state law mandates that the
MBTA communities have a zoning ordinance or bylaw that provides for at least one district of reasonable size in which multif family housing is permitted uh as a right and is suitable for families and
children. No age restrictions and has a minimum uh gross density of 15 units per acre. Communities that fail to comply with this new law will not be eligible for funds from various state funding sources, including housing choice
initiatives, local capital projects, and the mass workers infrastructure. More information can be found at the planning board page under MBTA community zoning information at www.lunbergmass.gov. And there's um a lot of stuff in here.
And we heard I think we heard did we hear we heard it right from his his presentation on that that we from what he said that we have a lot of the things that we that we needed were already in our
bylaws but there were some new ones but I I can't remember what they are but ultimately the uh the uh the question is is if we don't vote for it we can lose a lot of money. So, it's kind of a gun to our head kind
of situation. >> So, this is a >> it's a >> this is a planning board article. >> It's a planning board article. Yes. >> This is the paper compliance with the MBTA Communities Act.
>> So, what happens to the town if we vote for yes? I mean, what do we have what do we have to do right away? I mean, other than big bylaws, >> what do you mean? >> Well, I think they're doing a paper compliance. >> So, it's just a
>> on paper the tri town area, they've figured out something to be paper compliant with the law is my understanding. >> So, we've already complied. >> Mhm. >> Oh, >> yeah. Because there's a deadline on when we have to comply by.
>> Okay. I'll say there's no financial impact. >> Yeah, there's no direct financial impact. >> I agree. >> There's no budget number. >> It looks like the select board deferred. I don't see on the other one if they approved it. I don't think so.
I I remember the conversation, but I don't remember all the details. I just remember it was I remember reading all the articles about a couple of towns near Boston that didn't want to do it and then they got threatened and it was nice. >> There were lawsuits over it. >> Yeah. >> All right. So, um I'll do the uh no
financial impact. I'll I'll I'll make that recommendation. No financial impact. >> Second. >> All in favor? >> I >> Okay. Article 14, also from the planning board, removal of uh by tumerous concrete requirements for common
driveways to see if the town will vote to amend the code of Lunberg chapter 250 being the town protective bylaws section 6.4 entitled driveway and and entrances subdivision C7C6
with deletions there for shown in the strikeout area. Um, the common driveway will uh be constructed of materials resistance to erosion and frost, heave and uh and sufficiently to support an axle of of 34,000 lbs under all weather
conditions and omitting the what is now in there. The common driver will be paved with at least 3 in of minimum thickness layer layer of bummerous concrete or take any other action there on two. So it basically just getting rid
of the requirement for 3 in of concrete and they >> I would say there's no financial impact. >> Financial impact. >> Okay. I agree. I'll make that motion. No financial impact. >> Second. >> All in favor? >> I >> I
>> Okay. Amen. Uh, article 15, amendment to salary administration plan uh, SAP positions, titles, and grades to see if the town will vote to amend the code of Lunberg chapter 70 section A entitled salaries administration plans
as follows. That the portion of conser uh, portion of conservation agent be added or the position of the conservation agent be added and assigned to grade 13. That the title of land use director be amended to director of
planning and economic development. And that title and that the title of special assistant to the assessor temporary and that the following language be added to the end of thereof provided that other
terms and conditions of employment for said position shall be subject to an employment contract in accordance with section 70-30 or any other actions taken there on the select board approved this five to zero.
This article places in places the position of conservation agent on the classification and salaries uh schedule and changes the title of the land use director to the land uh to the director of planning and economic development.
This also al also creates the possible special position of special uh assistant to the assessor temporary. The board of assessors have received directives from the department of revenue to complete
prior to the next full re-evaluation in 2029. One of the directives is to review all residential neighborhood delineations in accordance with indicated land value use and and adjust them as as needed prior to the next certification. Consideration should be
given to conducting a neighborhood study for all residential parcels and and market areas. Neighborhood 3 and the waterfront neighborhoods will will need to be annually reviewed and reviewed by the assessor. The special assistant will assist the town in working towards
compliance with the DO directors. So um again they this this is just adding a a position couple of positions changing a name and the position of the temporary assistant to the assessor is
for a lot of work which kind of reminds me of all the problems we had a couple of years ago. Uh data was the problem. So this is going to be even making our data better and keeping it up. So makes sense, right? Any
discussion? Rhonda, do you have anything to say? Ronda Lithia, 181 Reservoir Road. It just seems to me that there's no you're not being giving given any numbers to even
state whether this has what the financial impact is. Thank you. >> Yeah, there is no numbers. >> Yeah, this this is just changing the the >> position >> position schedule.
They have to hire somebody and has to be in a budget. So, >> I think they're going to use money they already have. >> Yeah. >> Um, so, and I think it's about $27,000, but Rhonda is right that that
information is not here because I watch um the meetings. So, Yeah, I don't it I could say there's no financial impact. >> There's no budget numbers.
>> Well, I mean there are budget numbers associated with it. We just don't have it. >> Mhm. >> You know, >> but this isn't this is I guess this is >> what the salary ranges are. This isn't actually saying go spend the money. This is just saying we are changing the
schedule which you know we could add you know Emperor of the Galaxy on the schedule and uh unless they hire one there there's there's no money spent. It has to be budgeted for that. So this is just
creating or changing the schedule. >> Yeah. So, >> and and and I guess it's changing the class of uh the direct manual >> classification salary schedule. >> Mike, did you have >> Yeah, the classification change is that is that somebody we already have, so
that would change their salary. Is that what that would do? >> These are new positions, aren't they? >> I think they're consolidating, aren't they? >> Well, we don't have a land use director, do we? No, >> changing that to director of planning
and economic development, >> right? >> And then they want to add the special assistant for the uh assessors as a temporary position from the sounds of it. >> Yep. >> So, none of these positions are filled
right now like if like nothing of these people. >> No, the land use director position is vacant. they're advertising and then the other position would be a new new position being created temporary for the board of assessors.
>> So that so then whoever's budget that these people fall under, they'd have to adjust their budget and run it by us anyway, right? >> So this this change has really no financial impact at this point in time. The only change might be in the to the
um the assessor position because that would be a new position. They would have to have money in the budget for that. The land use director should already be money salary money in that position because it it was filled. It's now vacant. But that money should still be there in the budget.
But we don't know if there's money in the budget for that at this point. Is that what you're saying? >> No. In the land use director position, there should be money in the budget because that was a budgeted position that is now vacant. The special assistant to the assessors temporary is
a new position that the board of assessors would have to um have in the in their budget or money be added to their budget to fund that. I don't know how it doesn't say how they're funding the new position. So they're they're adding the positions
to a list and then but there's no means of funding it at this point in time. >> Well, they haven't told us how they're funding it. >> What's that? >> They haven't told us how they're funding it. >> Manager would need to explain that.
>> Right. There is no funding in here at all. It's just changing the schedule, changing the name, >> changing the title. >> Title. it. Look, my guess is that they're looking for a somebody and they they
are either making a decision to have a more inclusive job description that would include more things or they want a job title that is kind of cooler sounding. Land was it land >> director of planning and economic
development. >> Yeah, that sounds cooler than uh land director >> land. So they they so I I they it could be a way to to get somebody to to consider the position u to change the title, but they're also incre they're
increasing the grade, which means that they would the person that would come in could get more money than the person that was there currently. So with the way this is written, if we yay or nay it, does it have any
immediate financial impact in the way we're going to view things? at this point. >> So the financial impact that I see is the are changing a grade. So for a position that already exists. So let's say
before a new person would come in who get paid 100,000. Now they might be getting 110. And what is likely to happen is she she has a budget, right? We don't manage everything in a budget. She can use funding from other sources to fund that position. like the position
has been empty for 6 months if if you know whatever is but Jay is right like it will have a financial impact we don't know that number because that position if you're changing the classification if it was 100,000 now it's going to be 110 and she can use the money that's on the
budget currently to fund it but then comes next year we'll need to budget 110 plus so I do think it has a financial impact and we don't have that number um period. So I think we should defer it
because we don't have the number and that number should be given to us on the these changes. What do they mean? That's my thought. But if we want to vote on it, we can I but I think it'll be best for us to defer to actually get
a number from town manager during the meeting. >> Yeah. Well, I'm thinking she's going to provide some sort of salary schedule, >> right? >> That tell me to show what >> what is the change that she's proposing. Yeah. >> Plus the the new position what that
>> right >> range would be. Exactly. >> That Yeah. >> So, you think you want to just defer this till town meeting so we get we can hear the presentation and ask more questions? >> Yep. I I think because we don't have the number. >> Yeah. >> Okay.
>> Sounds reasonable. Rhonda, do you have anything? >> I'll recommend we defer this to town town meeting. >> Second. >> All in favor? >> I I. Article 16, salary administration plans
SAP amendments changes other than the personnel committee submitted by the town manager and assistant town manager human resource director to see if the town will vote to amend the code of Lunberg chapter 7 entitled salary administration plan as
shown on the document entitled November 18th 2025 special town meeting which I guess the handout will be available at the the town meeting um
article 16 SAP uh amendment relative to the so-called fringe benefits or indirect pay provisions such as holiday vacations with sick um pay sick leave and the like dated
October 27th, 2025 on file with the office of the town clerk with addition there to show as bold italicized and with uh deletions therefore shown in as a bold and stricken through or take any
other actions there too. The select board approved it five to zero. Um and they jointly established a fiscal year goal of the employee experience. Part of the goal was to review the SAP and the
draft amendment relative to to the same include those modernizations uh the bylaws and aid in the recruitment and retention of town employees to present initial modifications of the at the special town meeting. Article will seek
to accomplish that goal. This article also clarifies language of SNAP. Handouts of this article will be available at the town meeting. So, I remember a lot of talk about this and a lot of it was to try to make
our positions more in line with what the market will bear. That was the intent. Um, so I think that's a good thing to do. I just again I don't know you know I I I
don't know exactly I don't have the handout so I don't know what the what they are. >> I mean the handout is on the town website um but it's a lot um and she sent an email last but there
is something printed on the on the town website. >> Who sent who sent it? Uh >> I I think it might be easier to find it on the town website on news on the bottom. Um if you scroll all the way to the
bottom, it says latest new. Um special town meeting is the second artic item on it and then it's going to be article 16. through this. Yeah, 15 pages.
It doesn't say anything in there. >> Oh, this is a memorandum. >> Yeah. >> Okay. >> Oh, it has 15 pages. So, you can scroll down >> for the salary administration plan with the changes in bold
or crossed out. All right. But there's also no uh budget number. >> This is creating a this is getting rid of the personnel committee. >> No, that's the next one. >> No, this is >> this is 17, right?
>> No, we're on 16. We're >> 16. I'm Oh, I'm looking at the wrong one then. Um I I think these do have some financial impact. >> Oh definitely. >> Um and we don't have a numbers. >> No, we don't know what that cost will
be. >> So I think we defer >> do we defer it to town meeting? >> Yeah. I mean just the vacation itself, they're changing how vacation is done. Yeah, the only ac cruel method. >> Yeah. And that alone will have. So I
think we defer. So >> I recommend we defer this to town meeting. >> Second. All in favor? >> I. >> All right. Number 17. Wow. Moving. I was already there. Um, >> we're catching up to you, Tom. >> Nice.
salary adjustment plan amendment personnel committee to see if the t this is from the town manager and the assistant town manager and the human resources director to see if the town will vote to amend the code uh chapter 70 entitled salary administration plan
as shown in the document entitled entitled November 18th 2025 special town meeting article 17 personnel committee dated October 27th 2025 on file with the office of the tax uh town clerk
with additional there thereto shown as bold italyses and with deletions therefore there from shown as bold and stricken through or to take any other actions relative to there too select
board approved it 4 to one and um and the summary is uh across the commonwealth towns of stud setting person personnel board committees and consolidating HR authority under professional management and HR staff.
This shift improves compliance, speed, reduction, fragmentations, clarification, accountabilities and alignment with modern labor law and risk management. There has been uh sustained action uh substained action in
this area rather than a one-off trend. Financial reviews by the Division of Local Services, LDS, routinely flags personnel board committees as duplicative and unnecessary uh uh bureaucratic layering layer. And
the DLS has com u commented that towns are ultimately best served by having a professional manager who can develop and oversee the full-time structure personnel management program. And this approach rec recognizes the growing
importance of and risk inherence in the personnel issues and then the handout which is which is there. So this is a um they want to get rid of the personnel committee which doesn't we don't have we
don't have one functioning now. So, she has a handout on that as well from on the town website and she has a longer memorandum on that. Um, I'm just informing you and
of that um and and she says your Lunberg personnel committee disbanded on May 29, 2024. It was not disbanded. That's not the proper word to write there. >> They resigned. they resigned. That's
very different. >> Yeah. Um I So my I I haven't thought about it if there is a financial impact on this or not,
but I do not like I don't like moving government away from the hands of people. I understand that this the personnel committee we haven't been able to recruit um for them but that is a participation
a work between the government part and and the people and and you know us participants on that um I think it's it's been done too abruptly without again a lot of communication with the
residents and The proposed the proposed solution is a proposed solution that did not come from the residents is one that was prepared by the town manager and the humans res and
the assistant town manager. Um and that I als I have issues with that. I think everything that we have a history of things that we bring forward that usually comes from residents in these boards volunteering to put it this
this information together. It's a big change that we haven't had time to talk about it and discuss what are what are the long-term ramifications of it. And this is one solution I'll give
you guys graten that I did a little digging. They started talking about this through their bylaw review committee and they didn't take action until several years later which I'm not saying we we should do it but what they did is they
made this the personnel committee to be to have a more a smaller role one that's not part of day-to-day operations but they do have that interaction of when we are working on something on changing grades and you know
the town manager doesn't work in this alone behind doors. She has to work with in the open meeting with the personnel committee. So I think there's a lot of changes that's happening without a lot of public input and and I'm not sure this is the
solution that Lunberg would go for it. I agree we need to mo modernize it. I'm just not sure this is I'm very sure this is not the Lunberg way because it was not put together by residents. There has been no residents input on this. It's
not how we do things and I would like this to go through a process that we're discussing how to modernize it as through the bylaw review perhaps or
through you know another group and what would be the role that we would like to see it change how it change how to modernize that but still keep it as a citizens body because That's what we that's how everything is run.
>> How long has it been since everybody left the committee? >> Um 2024 about a year a little over a year >> and since then >> I think they have had like one person offered to be on that and they got put in some I I just think it's a big change
without being talked to >> um without feedback from the residents. We I'm okay doing this. I think we just need more time and make sure we're listening to residents input on how to do this and maybe find a alternative
methods that doesn't just mean eliminate a a board of volunteers. >> That's my feedback. >> Anyone else? >> Yeah, I I agree somewhat with what I was saying. Um, I think it gives too much
too much power to the town manager. Um, there needs to be checks and balances. I It's a big change and yeah, I don't believe we've had enough input from
from the residents as well regarding this. I know, you know, something needs to be done. We do need to move forward, but um it's a it's a it's a big change that
needs proper vetting. >> Rhonda, do you have anything? >> Thank you. >> Rhonda Lissio, 181 Reservoir Road. Um, I also I share what's been said so far on this and I most of my questions that
I brought for tonight or on the last article that I don't think you guys will be able to answer. So, you'll get to hear me ask them at town meeting. >> You're one of the people that are always showing up at the town meeting. So, if I don't see you there, I I'm we're gonna
call your house and see if you're all right. But I did want to just quickly share from the website. Um this is a quote from the website. It is the mission of the personnel committee to promote and maintain consistent and equitable
standards in the administration of the town's personnel bylaw called the salary administration plan in conjunction with the town manager and to represent the interests of both taxpayers and town employees.
And what I've seen, okay, I thought I voted no last special town meeting when we had an interimm town manager completely alter the salary administration plan. In
fact, my favorite um former section of it was removed last year and it was section 5.2 called the merit
principle and and this is what it entailed. All appointments and promotions of town officers and employees shall be made solely on the basis of merit and fitness demonstrated by examination or other evidence of
competence and suitability. In my mind, the only thing that would rise to the level of being proper evidence to do anything regarding an employee was
we need to establish an annual formal evaluation review process for all the employees. And it really I question that used to be in the salary administration plans
pretty much stating that this is how we will do things. If there's another way aside from doing annual formal reviews or evaluations, I don't know how
you get um fact-based information or make informed decisions about people. I mean, I just and I will say one of our comp towns, Groten, they do annual um employee re
evaluations for all their part-time and full-time employees. And I I could go on and on about this. It's just um so basically my point is this.
between last year at special town meeting and this year who is looking out for the best interests of the taxpayer. It seems like we're giving we're taking
some drastic measures to try and get recruit employees and keep employees. But at the same time, I think employees like to be communicated with and sat and you know, you go over the job
description. How, you know, has this person met all the goals? Maybe they're not understanding something in the job description. I mean, it's just it seems like a normal healthy thing and and that we don't even
have that most basic thing is crazy to me. Thanks. >> Thank you. One other thing that I'll just add that I for which is you know if we don't take any action on this and just give more
time to get be properly vetted nothing changes like as the town manager has said in the absence of a town man of the personnel committee she is making all the decisions so there's no urgency for this and and I think it's too much of a
change without citizen feedback cit citizens abilities. It's just this is how it's not an attack on her. She did do the job. She finished this, but this is her proposal, not a you know, a body
of volunteers that live and reside here that and pay the taxes here. And I see value on how we do things in Lunberg. And I think it needs to needs more time to be vetted and find Lunberg way to do this.
I I agree that the the the this is kind of thrust upon the town meeting with not a lot of discussion in the town. Now, I
personally like to have uh professionals rather than a committee in this area. uh is just it's a it's a lot of regs, a lot of rules, and having people that do it volunteer at a part-time basis who maybe not in that
profession. It'd be nice if you had three or four people who were all professionals there and they could come in and run a committee. If you don't, then it's it's it's hard. I I I um I I can I can sense that the town manager is an employee and is,
you know, responsible for managing the town. So obviously that's part of their responsibility. So I don't have a problem with the town manager having more responsibility as long as they're doing a good job. If they're not, I expect the select board to deal with
that. Um, however, I don't think that this is, like Anna said, something that needs to be done right away. And I I'm more concerned about the employees than I am the
um the town because the this is the human resources. This is how the individual employees are being treated by the town. and um I want to make sure that they're fully aware of what's happening and they don't have any
questions or issues or or at least they're being their questions are being answered. Um I don't know if uh if that's going to be a big concern or not, but I I I don't know. So I I would uh now on the other hand, is there a financial impact directly? No, because
this there's this is not about money. This is about structure. Well, I would say that structure has a lot of financial impact. >> Sure. Yeah. >> You know, like how things are structured, the who's who who's oversight is in it and who gets to make
decision will have a big impact, >> right? I I I think that the town manager saying, "Oh, I need um this person to run this department this
way." um is pro, you know, is probably a better thing than having a uh bunch of volunteers doing that who don't understand all the ramifications of of the business. That's why you hire a town manager. In the old days, I think back
before you had people making decisions who were were employ, you know, town people making decisions. Now you have a town manager who's supposed to be a professional. That's why you hire them. >> So, >> so I don't have a I I mean to me the
problem with if that town manager can't do that, then you got the wrong town manager. >> So, I I wouldn't mind giving the town manager that responsibility with the oversight of the select board and when finances come up, the oversight of us.
However, I don't think we're ready for that because I don't think there's been enough time to to air this out and discuss it to make sure we understand the ramifications for everything >> and and at the end is that but you know
Tom I do appreciate a role I'm going to use example you gave you know like the town manager decides that this person is going to run this department she already does that on her day-to-day operations
But I'll give you the example of the of what she's the changes that she's making with the land user director where you know that would have been a conversation
that she would have have had with the personnel committee about I'm thinking of changing this position to that one is always done in public meetings. There's conversations that the public is aware of it and people and the citizens will
have you know we are in a town in Massachusetts that is a we are direct government and and I think that process I value that process where not one person is making all these decisions from their own mind. The citizens are still participating on the process.
They're not making the final decision but they are participants of the process. And that's where I said I did look into what Gratton did and they changed the role of the personnel committee to be a more advisory and
oversee to oversee things versus responsible for day-to-day operations and you know and various other things that currently the personnel committee has. So I think another solution for this would be to change the scope the
responsibility of the personnel committee but that has not been a a uh a method that we've we we explored because this is a proposal that the town manager gave us like honestly do you think she's going to come to us
with a proposal of like hey let sign me up for another committee to give me opinions about my job no one's going to do that but that's exactly literally our function here of the fincom is to give her feedback like you are not but if
I'll tell you she'll likely prefer to not have to deal with a finance committee so that's I appreciate that that cl that cluckness of town government in Massachusetts because it makes it very open makes it very sits
and focused and this solution is not one of them um So I would like to to >> well is there is there a financial >> Yeah. Yes. I would say structurally rem changing the responsibility of of who
oversees the sal the salary administration plan and makes decisions and recommendations does have a financial impact and >> but there are no budget numbers.
>> Yeah. But you know this is uh changing who makes the decisions of the salary administration plan does have a financial impact. >> Mike, do you have anything? >> No, I kind of agree with that.
>> Yeah. >> A little bit more defined. Yeah. Should we do a vote? It's our last one. Just want to go home. I I myself I don't know. I just I don't um I like the concept. I just don't I
think it was pushed on us too quickly. And uh and I I I would want to see more discussion with staff and with the town
uh uh town residents to uh to uh under you know to do this. Now maybe when they do their presentation they you know they could do that but uh I I doubt it. I just think it's a if it's a big enough change for the
employees that that it should be telegraphed a little bit more and explained a little bit more rather than coming in on the day after the annual meeting going, "Hey, guess what?" Um, you know, this is permanent now. I I
I don't know. That might not be a problem for staff, but maybe it is. I I I I just want to It's hard enough to keep good people and to keep their morale up. I don't want to throw anything at them that that they might consider as negative.
But again, I again I don't I mean this particular thing will have no financial impact on the on the town as far as budgets. There's no there's no we're not paying anybody any more money or paying anybody any less money. is just switching stuff
and that could have an effect at the end but not directly. >> So then this is a is this a no financial impact then? >> I I I I do think it has a fin not a direct financial impact but it does have financial impact. Does it have a does it
have a financial impact if we don't vote on something else that would have a financial impact on it like downstream? >> Yeah, I mean we are changing the structure of of something. So I I think I like it it is it does it you know it
doesn't have a direct financial impact but it does have a financial impact. I I I understand that, but like >> can it have a financial impact without us voting on that particular financial impact? >> I mean, I think I think we can vote if
we supported this or not. Period. want to move. So yeah, you want to just uh move to uh to defer it so we can listen to the presentation and maybe we can we'll
we'll see more because I I I you know my con my biggest concern is I would vote I mean I would vote against it right now if if I was going to vote yes or no. I think there's no financial impact, but I had a vote for or against I'd vote against it only because I think
it's just too soon. I I don't have a I probably don't have a problem with it for the most part, but >> Right. >> I I think it's it's just just thrown on and it's a big enough change that this should be talked about more. Um and
maybe it maybe I've missed it, you know, maybe I've missed the discussions. >> No, there hasn't been. Yeah, >> because I I've gone to I've gone to town meetings where people go, "This is the first time I've heard of it." He goes, "We've been talking about it at the select board and the finance committee for the past three months, you know,
which is not a problem because everybody's busy and I get it. I could be that person." So, I just don't want to. So, I'm a little I don't want to be that person that says, "Oh, this is new." But it's not. >> Well, I I I mean, I have a commute to work, so I usually listen to
>> Yeah. I don't think I don't think I I I keep my ears to this enough. So I I think I would have heard about more about it but >> I I I I think we're like for different reasons we all feel in a way everyone who has spoken Gene
hasn't spoken uh we feel it's a little bit rushed right now with not enough information there is no rush to do this now >> I mean I would think that it was rushed if there had been any interest by more
than one person who evidently you said wanted to be on that committee, but there hasn't been and it's been almost >> been over a year. You said May May 2024. >> So I I don't think it's rushed in that
respect. I mean, if if there had been some interest in it and then she said, well, no, you know, let's just get rid of that. I feel differently, but I I just don't have any sense that there's an interest in the in town's people and
being on a personnel committee. Well, and that's I'm I'm not agreeing with that. I think I think the last personnel committee had a a a tough and traumatic experience dealing with certain things and and and of the issues that I know
that they had making this to just be overseen by the town manager is not going to help solve those issues. Um it it was in fact it was it was job not well done and executed
that really as you know that was problematic for them and they didn't have so those problems are not going to go away because we're changing who owns in fact we're just making it so it's hidden now because we're not going to have the insight that we had by having a
personnel committee. Um that's that's that's the nugget on that like so now if there's a problem that happens you don't get to know um because you don't have a personnel committee I think I think the
there's not a rush in terms of if there in the absence of a personnel committee the town manager acts on as as them. So if we just give it a time and and see if we can figure out a
different solution, it would there's nothing that would change on our operations. But we are giving a lot of power to one person and removing the oversight of the citizen.
>> So let's just put it to a vote. >> You want to make a motion? >> Sure. I I always make motions on the positive to just be easier. I make a motion that um we approve. >> I
Okay. So, Oh, so you're you Okay. Um all those in favor? >> I >> Okay. All those on against >> What was the motion? I missed that. >> What do we >> Oh, motion to approve the MO. Same motion that you you usually Why don't you make it, Tom? You're good at
>> No, no. What do we make? So, we're making a motion to approve the the article 17 >> because motions are bad on the posit on the on the positive and then you can vote it against versus having a double negative. >> All right. So, I'll I'll make the motion that we approve article 17.
>> Second. You second. Okay. All right. All those in favor? >> I Okay. All those against? >> No. >> Uh, no. >> Tom, >> I I defer. I I >> defer. Okay. So, it's I don't
>> 1 2 1. Okay. >> Yeah, that'll be good. >> Yeah. There's no there's no budget number, but >> it's structurally you're giving a lot of power to someone. >> Yes. >> And and you you right you know what was
the issue. >> Yeah. >> That made >> Yeah. And there's one >> does making this change >> improves that or makes it worse because now we're not going to see the problem. >> True or false? >> We can say I don't know if it makes it worse. It doesn't fix the issue,
>> right? We uh have to approve the consent. We have to well we have to we have to uh they they are recommending a consent agenda of articles 5,6 and 14. >> Yeah. >> Which is on all of them.
>> We did. We did. >> Yeah, >> we did. >> Yeah, we voted on all of them. >> Oh, no. But did we for the consent agenda? So, we we usually have to like say Yeah, we agree that the consent >> to approve the consent agenda. Five,
six, and 14. And five and six we approved and and 14 is we said no financial impact. So, I'll make a recommendation that we approve the u the recommendation of the consent agent of articles 5, six, and
14, which they basically say are not things that people are going to talk about, not a big issue. >> Yeah, they're not going to talk about I kind of think that makes sense. So, I'll make that a motion. >> Second. Okay. All those in favor? I >> I have anything else for Tom me at town uh
special um >> Ron. Do you have anything? >> Okay, we can close I recommend we uh close our special hearing. >> Second >> public hearing rather. >> All those in favor? >> I >> I >> public meeting is closed.
Public hearing. Okay. Public hearing. >> I'm really without Chris here. >> Do we do we have a time for the next tri committee? >> It's supposed to be in the >> um I think it's the week of
Thanksgiving. >> I think it's the >> November 24th. Is that what it says on the agenda here? >> Is that official? I thought there was >> I think I saw an email earlier. 24th. >> Yeah. >> Is that the Wednesday? Uh, >> I thought it was a Monday or a Tuesday.
>> Yeah, it's a Monday or a Tuesday. I thought >> I didn't see an email saying >> I think that's the Monday, isn't it? >> Um, >> it's the 6. >> Yeah, >> Monday. Yeah.
>> Yeah. The 24th would be a Monday. >> I will not be here. >> Good for you. in Alabama which is better. >> It's going to be a warm there. Wow. Sometimes it gets cold. >> They're in the mountains.
>> Hills >> for fun or >> Thanksgiving. >> Planning board public hearing. >> Did you grow up there or they moved? >> But it doesn't have anything else. But maybe >> Well, are they at the tri board?
>> Yeah, the tribe board. They don't have They usually would list it on the >> Oh, who's presenting? >> I think it's a school. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. You said it was a school only. >> Mhm. >> Yeah. I think this one's coming to school. It's only the school. >> Yeah.
>> Which is only half the budget. >> Yeah. More than half the budget. >> Yeah. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> All right. Next finance committees December 11th >> time meeting the 18th. >> Yeah.
>> Any discussion? Any more >> comments, concerns? >> So we're all we're all by ourselves. >> Motions. >> Motion to adjurnn. >> Anyone from the public? Anyone from the public? >> All those in favor? >> Is there anyone from the public? Public
comment. I don't think there's anybody online. No. >> Okay. I >> I >> Yay. >> We're returned.