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So, I started recording and it is 7:30. This is the May uh 13th meeting of the Lunberg Open Space Committee. Um, we're holding this meeting in accordance with open meeting law. It's on Zoom and I don't know why, but I always read the

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Zoom number uh because we're all on it already. It's 8. Let me see if I've got it right. 88163204319. And so if we do have any um visitors come this evening uh to the meeting. Tim is do you know if the town planner is

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going to be able to make it? You're on mute. Oh, here he is. He just he just pulled in. >> Yeah, you're still muted. >> Sorry about that. Um, there we go. You just came in. >> That's okay. Hi, Stephen. Welcome.

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>> Good evening. >> So, I was just getting the meeting started. Um, I read the official notice and I'd like to call the meeting to order. So, the first order of business is to go through the minutes from 48. Um, usually they go through fairly

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quickly, but I've got a bunch of edits on this one. I think Andrea's got a few as well. So, I'd like to run through those with you guys and we can make the changes. Um, so I'm going to try to share my markup

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of the minutes. I thought I had them queued up. Hang on, I got to find it. Yeah, there we go. So, these are the minutes. Um, Chris, thank you for taking these. These are the minutes that Chris sent out to us. Um, and I I made the markup. You'll see

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some in red, some markup in red. Um, I respled my name, Chris, for you. So that's that's the first markup. Um the first thing we did at the last meeting is we welcomed Andrea as the concom representative and we appointed

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Chris uh St. Germaine as a community representative. So I thought the minutes should reflect that and I Chris I can make all these changes. I just want to go through everybody. >> Okay. >> Um approval of the minutes. The one thing Andrea brought up is she didn't

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she wasn't here for the March meeting. So, she didn't second. >> Okay. >> The motion to approve. Do we have any idea? >> I'm guessing Anna. >> I'm guessing Anna because Colleen wasn't with us. >> Right.

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>> So, I'll put I'll put uh Anna in there and and see what happens. Okay. >> Um the next major change that I have is we we started to talk Oh, here's Anna. We started to talk about a right of

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first refusal, but it wasn't this one. This was one from a while ago. >> Oh. >> Um that we went through. So the one that we were looking at was um 35 Lemonster Road. Uh we're going to talk about that again tonight. But so I can I can make that change, but we didn't we didn't

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vote or anything. So this whole section >> Yeah. >> looks like it was pulled from a previous >> Yeah. I might have gotten my notes mixed up. >> Yeah. It's like, >> so I'm just going to change that whole thing to say we we started to talk about it, but we didn't take a vote or anything. >> Okay, that's fine.

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>> Okay. >> Um, those are the changes I had. Did anybody see anything else? Andrea, did you see anything else when you look through it? >> Well, I'm not sure that I seconded the um at the end the um adjournment >> the adjournment.

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>> I mean, I don't know. >> Okay. At that point you could because that >> I might have. Yeah. >> You were a sitting member. So, >> right. >> Kind of like no harm, no foul. >> Right. >> Okay. So, um I'd entertain a motion that with

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these changes, unless somebody has something else, that we accept the minutes from the 8th of March or excuse me, 8th of April. >> So moved. >> Moved it. Who is the second? >> May. Andrea.

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>> Andrea's the second. Okay. All right. So, um, because we're on Zoom, we're going to do a roll call. So, Chris, >> hi, >> Andrea. >> Hi, >> Tim. >> Hi. >> Anna, >> hi.

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>> And I don't see Colleen yet. Oh, Eric's here. >> Hi. >> And the chair the chair votes I. I don't see Colleen's. So, um, reflect that we're we're all here except for Colony in the current minutes, Eric. >> Okay.

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>> Uh, real quick for the sake of these minutes, uh, who moved and who second and done approving the those the minutes with those corrections? >> Anna moved it and Andrea seconded. >> Thank you.

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>> Okay. So, I'll stop sharing those. So the next uh point of business is just a a report from I actually Anna was there as well. Anna and I from town meeting. Um the bylaw was approved at town meeting. So we are a standing committee of the

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town. Uh we have bylaws. Um, I'm in the process of working with the town's IT department to get that information put up on our website. So, right now, if you went to the website today, um, Andrea, it's got your I think it's got Chris

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down as to two two positions. So, we're fixing that. >> Okay. And also, I had written up a whole section on um, you know, who we are, what the bylaw is right now. Um, so that's going to go on the page as well.

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So, we are official with chapter 12, article uh nine of the town of town code. Um, it doesn't change what we do other than we all now have um term expiration dates.

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And so, again, if you look on our website, you can see the term expiration dates. And there were four, I think, that expired next year and four and three the year after, something like that. Um and that's only because we have different

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groups that appoint us. So we've got concom planning and parks um appoint the sitting members from those groups and then the select board now has to appoint appoint uh the rest of us Chris and and Eric and myself and

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Anna. Okay. So every I think they do appointments every year but I'm checking that out with uh the town manager. So, that's it for the bylaw. So, we're all set there. Um, do we have any reports from other boards? Anything from

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conservation, Andrea? >> Um, we've had a couple of meetings, but I don't think there was much. Um, um, I guess not. >> Okay. >> Andrea, how did the Earth Day event go?

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>> Oh, it was good. Yeah. Um we had a good number there and um we were you know pretty much filled up the um PC Pacio's gymnasium. So >> good. >> You know it it looked like a a good event and it was pretty well attended.

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>> So hope we'll have a bigger one next year. >> That's wonderful. Thank you. >> Anything from planning, Tim? Um, no. Uh, nothing, uh, new to add other than, um, you know, the discussion

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for what Stephen's here to add. >> Okay. And Colleen's not here, so we don't have anything from parks. So, um, Stephen, we'll move on. I told you be fairly quick. We'll move on fairly quickly. We've got, um, guest with us

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this evening, Steven Wallace. Um, he is our planning director in the town. Tim suggested that uh Stephen come in and talk to us about um well you tell us what you're going to talk to us about Stephen.

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>> Okay. Well, it was at a planning board meeting uh a while ago and the planning board was discussing a property being withdrawn from the chapter land program

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and I forget which property it was but the discussion was oh that would be a nice property for the town to have but the town doesn't have any money to buy it. Um, and that made me think of something

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that we did in uh, Westminster. Uh, I was Westminster's planner for 11 and a half years and I was staffed to the open space committee there. And what we did was we went to town

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meeting every year and we asked for a small amount of money to be donated to a conservation fund. So, this became a recur a recurring town meeting uh money article.

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Uh we started out asking for $2500 and I think they've since bumped it up to $5,000. So, they they never asked for much and there was not a lot of controversy

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around it at all that it always passed. And I'm suggesting that you folks might want to consider asking for an annual town meeting aotment for a conservation fund.

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Now, 2500 bucks, 3,000, 4,000, that's not going to get you very far in terms of buying a piece of land. However, uh you you could if you let that money

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accumulate for uh 2, three, four years, you would have enough money to pay for a property appraisal. Now, if you wanted to interest a land trust like the North County Land Trust

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into helping the town um secure a grant from the state to buy land for open space and recreation, um they would want to see that the town has some skin in the game.

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and working with them over the years. Uh that skin in the game typically takes the form of the town paying for the property appraisal. Um that and then 25% of uh the the land

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purchase price. Um, we've in Westminster, we work closely with North County Land Trust on a couple land grants that were successful. And that's how we did it. The town used

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their conservation fund to pony up the money for the appraisal. Once the land trust had the appraisal, they could prepare the grant application. And if they were successful in getting that grant,

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uh they would use some of that grant money to cover their administrative costs. Uh but then they would help the town through uh all the necessary steps uh involved in buying that land through

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w with that grant money. So that's what I'm pitching here. Um I I know you're a newly formed committee and and you're all now legal like and official. That's great. Um but it's just something to consider

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going forward. >> Thanks. So, one thing we do have is when Bright Farms, uh, which was a proposal five five years ago or so, Anna, um, they were going to develop a, um, a farm

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area and they wound up pulling out um, of the of the project, but as part of that, they made a $10,000 donation to the town for open space. So, this open space committee, we don't have I

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don't have a checkbook or anything, but we have and and I'll have to check this with Jen over at town hall. We have an account um that should be a separate account with the treasurer that had originally $10,000 in it. Now,

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we used 800 or 900, something like that, Anna, to do the um the title search on on the Lake Shirley property. Yeah, it was less than $1,000. It >> was less than $1,000. So, we should have 9,000 plus left in that account. So,

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we've got we've got a start on what you're talking about. >> I would think that uh you would use this annual town meeting appropriation to supplement that account. >> I agree. >> Um an appraisal, depending on the

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complexity of the property, it's going to cost anywhere to 10 to $15,000. So, um I it it would take a couple years for you folks to get to that amount, but you got to start somewhere. >> Yeah. No, I think it's a great idea. I

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just I a lot of the other members may not know this because they came on to this committee after we we went through the the Bright Farms um uh time time frame and we got the money and I think Ann and I maybe Eric was on at the time.

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We were the only ones that were on um this committee at the time that we did the work on Lake Shirley. Well, I did share with Tim the language, the warrant article language that Westminster uses every year. Okay?

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>> So, you can use that as your model. And um I would suggest that before you uh bring that to a town meeting that you uh pitch it to the select board around budget season.

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And when you do that, I would be happy to attend and speak in support of it. So when budget season comes along and you set up your appointment with the select board, let me know. I'd be happy to attend. >> Okay. Probably FinCom, too.

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>> Finom as well. Yes. >> Anna, is that just for annual town meeting? >> You know, that's what I was gonna say. Um so where the money is right now the from Bright Farms it's not necessarily a

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fund it's almost like um it's it's more like a categor C it's a category within the monies that the town holds >> right >> um for what he's talking about we need to establish a fund

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>> that then is regulated by by NGL so we need to find the find the language of establishing a similar fund and and we can we can take those actions actually at u at the fall meeting so that when

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basically creating the fund doesn't necessarily mean you're you're establishing it um and then comes the annual town meeting in May we can then fund you know start putting funds there >> I think if you reach out to the

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treasurer collector in Westminster she can explain how they set up their conservation fund. >> Yeah. And I think Harvard has one too. Um and and um yeah I I think the other

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thing that we can do um there is um um we are reviewing the financial policies of the town and that's where it describes what people should do with free cash, what the town should do with free cash and um and we could

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um actually try to insert the language that this fund should be always receive you know, x% of them of free cash kind of thing. Um, just as a way to to do that just I'm I'm just thinking of all the steps associated with this.

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>> Sure. >> Do we have to go to town meeting to establish the fund? >> Yes, we do. And that's where I'm thinking we might be able to do this in the fall. So then it comes comes the annual town meeting, the funds already established. we can just fund it because

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otherwise you're trying to do two things at once. You don't know if Tom meeting is going to approve the fund but there's already money allocated for so it's actually better to do it as a two-step process >> and once we establish the fund say we do establish fund at full town meeting

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theoretically we should be able to transfer that $9,000 from general cash into that fund. Uh it it so it it depends how what we write about the fund like um

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it's so it's a it's sort of like a revol a revolving fund because it will continue existing year after year from one fiscal year to another. That's why they call a revolving fund. >> Um so it depends on the s like how we establish that that fund is going to be

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and what is going to be the sources for it. Um, it all be in the language of the creation of the fund. >> Okay. So, so I would suggest starting by sitting down with our treasurer, collector, and town manager,

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pitch the idea, and get get the list together as to the steps you're going to need to take to put this together. >> Okay. >> Okay. I'll I'll try to put in a coherent email, Mike, what I just said because I know there were a lot of threads in my

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head and I'll send it to you kind of like this process. >> That'd be great. And I'd be happy to try to set up a meeting with town manager with Lucy at the treasurer's office too. >> And if you want me to join just so I'm aware of how you're doing it, I'd be glad to. >> Yeah, I'll keep you in the loop. That's for sure.

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>> Okay. >> Awesome. Thank you, Stephen. Appreciate it. >> Anything else, gang? No, we're good. Thank you very much. >> All right, you have a good night now. >> All right, thanks for coming. >> Thank you.

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All right, we're going to move on to item number six, um, which is our typical items not anticipated at the time of the meeting, but tonight we do have an item that I just didn't get onto the agenda correctly, and that is to finish our discussion about 35 lemons to

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road uh, right of first refusal. I think we're still within the period where we can comment to the select board. Um, I just want you all to be aware that every other board that does make comments to the select board has opted to recommend

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that they not exercise their right of first refusal. So, it doesn't mean that we can't go against that, but that's where we are. >> You're talking about the the property that's um accessed near the gazebo, >> correct? Yeah. There's a house on the

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property right right across kind of kitty corner across the street from the gazebo and then it's got a lot of backland. So, it's about a 17 plus acre parcel. Um, and the one thing I thought we would do tonight um is step through our

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criteria and um then we can discuss it um under each criteria and then um as an ulterior motive, Audrey and I want to start again talking about um us thinking about modifying

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our um criteria for um open space. Um, I've talked about this for a while, but I think it's time that we probably put pen to paper and start to come up with some things. So, give me a second and I will share where we are with our current criteria.

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Maybe there we are. So, just to remind everyone, these these are the um criteria that we use um to recommend whether or not an area gets um acquired for open space. And it has to meet at least three of these

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criteria. I'll put the information up in a second about the parcel itself, but we can run through these. So, it's 50 acres or more in size. It's not um contains important habitat resources. It's not mapped as such. Um it it's not high on

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the list in bio on biomap or it's not um natural heritage mapping provides public access or recreation. Well, there's access off the street where the house is and you could use the back for

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recreation for walking. It's mostly a big hayfield at this point. Uh important for scenic vistas are maintaining rural character. there's very little frontage on the street. So, for me, that's that's a hard

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one to to justify saying yes to. Uh, contiguous to other protected open space or recreation resources. It's Kitty Corner across the street. It's not contiguous. Um, so we can pick and hit and quibble about that one, but it's it's right

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there by the gazebo and supports local agricultural viability. It is like most parcels in town, large parcels in town. It's got um soils of of state importance. It's uses it as a hayfield as far as I could tell from aerials in

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the past. So that's where we are with the the six criteria. Let me throw the parcel up real quick and then I want to open this up for everybody else to chime in. >> We did discuss this, right? But we're gonna we just didn't finish. just have the issue.

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>> We did discuss it. Um Andrea asked if we could not take a vote at the last meeting because she wanted to have a little more time to look into this. I thought that was fair. >> Y >> So we did not vote on this. >> All right. So here's from Lunberg GIS.

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Here's the parcel in question. Here's the gazebo parcel up here number 38. So, here's the house and probably a barn and the back area. I can try to turn some of the layers on if you want. Oh,

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Anna, I thought you were already here. It just said admit you again. Give her a second. Anna, had you dropped off? >> I did. Sorry about that. I don't know what happened. >> Okay. >> Yeah, >> I just it popped up at MIT you again. So, here you are.

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>> There. I don't think I missed much. >> Not so far. Um, let me see if I can get some layers on here. >> So, while you're doing that, I'm just going to re revoice my my thoughts on it. >> Yeah, go for it.

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>> Um, the I think it's the third or fourth bullet says public access andor recreation. It might um suffice for recreation. It might be a good walking area, but I think parking is going to be a big issue. I think you might actually annoy a Butters because the parking would be

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um just all over the place in terms of you know up and down the roads. So I don't think there's a good parking area and I think it does like you said it might might um check the the last box where it's you know it's it's a good you know it's good for haying. Um I didn't

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see anything else in that list that it really checked so it's kind of weak in terms of hitting the boxes for me. Um, I'd hate to see it get developed. That's the only thing I'm struggling with because uh some people feel that they um I guess the way they worded the sellings the the the

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pro the the way they worded it on the real estate hosting is that they're going to rehab the house, but a lot of people feel they're just going to build on it. So, that would be a shame. >> Yeah. I' I'd be surprised with 17 acre or 16 acres of back land and a house on

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the front that they're not going to do something with those other 16 acres, but that you're right, that's not what that's not what the offer said. >> Correct. >> So, I just turned on a few layers just to show you where we are. So, there's some wetlands when you get all the way

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in the back. Um, these are the different soil types and I don't have the code in front of me, but I know I know some of these by heart. These are actually some pretty good, you know, just lomy sands. Turn that one off.

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There's no There's a little drainage running through here. I'm not sure what that is, but coming from this wetland draining up this way, it looks like or connecting or maybe go No, it's actually all going to the south because it all goes down to Katakumanog eventually.

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So, it is connected by some intermittent streams. Um, let's see. I thought I could do aerials on here, too. >> I'm not as used to

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the town GIS as I am other GIS systems. Well, I'll just leave it like that for now. Other people have thoughts on this one? >> Well, oh, sorry. >> Oh, you go ahead, Andrew.

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>> Um, it does seem to me that, you know, it it it doesn't meet our our present criteria, unfortunately. And I I do wonder if the abutters had a choice between seeing a development back there versus some people, you know, I

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don't know part where where they would be parking, but if they had a choice between the two, I I wonder what they would choose. >> I I think we know what all the people around it with back lot lines on the property would choose,

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>> right? But but that's not necessarily a good reason for us to uh consider it as open space as public open space, >> right, >> Eric? >> Yeah. I mean, I I agree. To me, this is a fairly open and shut one. Um

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particularly in light of the fact that the open part of this is it's really not visible from the street at all. there's no current use of it or or realistic path for someone to currently be using it, you know. Um certainly if you can

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wave a wand and keep every, you know, hayfield a hayfield forever, I think a lot of people would do it, but I don't think that that's our purpose here. >> J Tim, any ideas on this one? >> Um, no. Unfortunately, I'm in the same

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place. I would I would like to see it. you know, kept and protected, but I don't I don't think it's going to be a necessarily easy property uh to work with or uh particularly convenient uh in

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most ways. So, yeah. >> What about you, Anna? >> Yeah, I don't really see it how it would fit into open space. I they do have a couple streams back there and I would

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like to protect them but it's not it's not viable for open space. The one thing that you know and I mentioned I I don't know what the um people that are buying what their plans are but that property does not have enough frontage for a

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subdivision. >> Yeah. >> Um and and and if they think they going to demolish the house, they're a little wrong about that. Because >> is it is it historic? >> It's on the APDC APD uh is on the architectural preservation district.

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Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And that one like is even um it it's really does not the bylaw is drafted in a way that doesn't even have

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a a way to to for anyone to authorize to demolish it. It's an interesting bylaw. Um, but anyway, so I think the house is going to be there. I don't think there's enough frontage uh for it subdivision. Um, so I think it's going to stay the

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way it is to be honest. >> Is it listed as a contributo structure? Do they use that kind of language in the bylaw? >> Um, I don't think that one is. um they don't use that language on the bylaw because the bylaw is a architectural preservation

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>> um and not necessarily historical >> but we but we do have um you know Lindberg does have its historic district and it does have houses that are you know contributing uh uh dwellings that part of that

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historic district but that house actually was built I think in the early 1900s or late 1800s. It's not very old. >> Okay. >> I mean, my house was built in 1790. So, like a lot of the houses there of that, you know, part of the historical

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district are from the late 1700s, early 1800s. I think one of the other things that we need to think about as a committee, it's not one of our criteria, but um we need to keep some dry powder and if there's a

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a really nice parcel that comes up, um I and Anna's been with me on a few of these adventures with the select board. This select board may be a little different than past select boards. Um but they are not especially given town finances right now they're they're not

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in the mood to acquire additional properties. So as we come up as we see these uh right of first refusals come up I think somehow maybe it's through rewriting the the criteria Andrea we need to come up with some kind of ranking system that

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says this one is worth going to the MAT for or it's not. And just I'll I'll be honest, my opinion this one is not worth going to the mad for. >> Yeah. I mean the other thing that the town could do um Mike which you you know

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we don't exercise this is we can buy a property and put restrictions on the on the property on the deed and then sell it again. >> Yeah. you you you would diminish the value a bit but you will protect certain

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aspects that you will you want to protect put the house back on the you know tax roles um you know that's that would be an an aggressive way to do that >> criteria a guideline or a hard stop like

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for example let's just say for some reason we were interested in this property and it didn't check the boxes does that mean we're not allowed to buy it or so. I guess my question is why do we have to um look at our criteria if if we could

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override our own rules? >> Well, I I I can I can uh take a crack at it from my understanding. So those are criteras that you know guidelines that that guides our discussions um and

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similar to you know when the capital planning committee meets um but they can make they can make their own decision so it's almost like guidelines the way I see it guidelines to that you know guides us through our discussion and decision and also tells

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the community like this is where we start so that it doesn't come across cross like we're being overzealous about wanting to save everything. Um I I think it's that that expectation the comm the community has for us and and where we start our conversation. That's my

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interpretation of it, but maybe Mike has a different one or um Eric who's also been here for a while. >> No, I agree. I I view I've always viewed it more as guidance. Um, the one part about it that we have to remember is it's written black and white right in

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our open space and recreation plan and that was a plan that was, you know, vetted through the public. And so I'm not I I didn't date back to when they created this originally. Brandon did. And I don't know how they came up with these particular criteria, whether it

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was just internal discussions among the then committee members or if it was part of the overall public outreach that they did for this process. >> It does say town, >> sorry, I was just going to say it does say the town later identified a series

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of six criteria >> if that means anything. Um so I from what I have learned about where those criterias popped was around 2010 2011

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um that came out of uh the conservation committee including um I have I heard in the meeting I think uh Mr. Birch and so I think it started that way like some of these things we do in Lunberg used to be

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very informal so you know some people there know this what they're doing they probably came up with a criteria was probably um vetted somewhat um but you know the town 15 years ago was very different than what it is now. Um and

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and we need to think about open space in a you know heavily developed suburban town versus a rural town. I know we want it to be rural with farms but that's not the reality. And if we keep you know

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kidding ourselves that's what it is and make a requirement to be at least 50 acres. like it it it you know I don't know if there are many properties that are 50 acres or more and we have tons of land you know what we don't have is is very accessible

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land for you know more than you know not so ablebodies uh people and those are the people that really need to go out so so anyway >> yeah I always I always looked at the criteria what we need to emphasize was

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finding parcels or having access to parcels that are in underserved areas. Number one, so if you look at if you look at the area around Whamm for example, there aren't a lot of public open space parcels around there. There are parcels that are available. There

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was a camp or something over there that was that came up for right of first refusal or no it came up on tax at one point and we were as a committee we were very interested in that parcel because it was a large parcel um that was in an area that doesn't have

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a lot of public open space. That's number one. Number two is wherever possible if we can build on parcels or you know build build up uh the inventory of parcels adjacent to existing parcels

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that serve as public open space so we can expand the public open space. Um you know having little pocket parks all over the place is great but it it doesn't you know you can't put a trail in. you have a hard time fitting a

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soccer field in some of these parcels, >> right? >> You know, so you need you need something a little more substantial, but I always thought 50 acres was a bit of a stretch, >> right? I I agree with you. >> And and I like the idea, I forget who mentioned it, um about possibly, let's

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say we knew there was a piece of land and we were worried about it getting developed is reding it, buying it, rediding it, and then putting it back out there. I think that's a great idea. I mean, not to do it all the time, but in a special case, I think that's great that we could we have that option.

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That's um to me, that's great. That's one of the reasons I'm on here is to protect land that might go, you know, we might lose and if we had an opportunity to protect it that way, that'd be great, you know. >> So, there is one piece of land that I am extremely worried about. So the Stillman

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L uh farm they have some of those that land is protected to be like forever um farmland. It's not a chapter. It's a designation, right? I I don't know all the legalities, but the strip that goes from their main h where their house is

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to the corner with uh uh is it Gilchrist with no not G but you know to the to that first. Okay. Yeah, that street that land does not have it might be under chapter, but that one does not have a protection and that would be prime for

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development and and that hill is so beautiful. Anyway, >> I you know, we could the town uh if we're not constantly living in this financial crisis, >> made up or not, but um we could, you

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know, make a plan where we go to the Simmons family and say, "Hey, we'll buy the land. and you get the money now kind of like we did with Lenny's probably 10 a little over 10 years ago like the Lenny's property is all

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protected because they pretty much take a buyout and I think the state pays for half of it. I forgot what it was the program but do you does anyone remembers that what happened with the Lenny's farm? >> No, I don't remember that one.

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>> Yeah. So So the the state has a program that they pay 50% and and the town then comes in with 50%. And you put it that Oh, it's restriction. You put a a farming restriction on that land.

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>> Oh, the APR program. >> Yeah, it must be what what is APR stands for? >> Agricultural preservation restriction. >> Yes. So, Lannis was done that way. Um, also the tree farm that Jim Latenzi

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bought was also done that way and and that was a way to the tree farm was one that was interesting because it had to pass the town. So then Jim Latenzi bought it because then he bought it at a more reasonable price and we were able to protect it. So I think there's

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opportunity for us to do that with with the Stillman's family. you know, maybe do an APR with them. >> Can you repeat where that's located? >> Um, so it's like from their house to

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whatever. Let me find it. I always get those streets. Uh, Good. So, from like their house all the way down to Good Rich. >> Okay. So that that piece of land doesn't

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have it might be on the chapter, but it doesn't have a restriction on it. And the reason I'm worried about it is because it has frontage on two streets, right? And the, you know, the Masipogga out uh

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pond outlet is there that feeds into Shirley Lake. Like I see that as a extremely important piece of land that should be protected. Are they down off Easter brook?

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Um, I don't. Let's see. So, is the I just lost myself here. Uh I don't Isn't it Easterbrook? Well, Easterbrook might be the outlet for the uh Massapoga. Yeah, Easterbrook. Yes.

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>> So, here's here's Masipog Pond, Lancaster Avenue. I I think Let me see. This is still in property right here. >> Uh I don't see where you are. Yeah. So that one I think it does have an APR,

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>> but the one if you go up top >> Oh, further up. >> Further up. Right there. That that piece of land right there between No, to the right. >> Yeah, that So yeah. So between the Easterbrook

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and that sort of that triangle there, that one does not have an APR and that would be prime development land. It does have it like it has the brook but it's not it's not a lot of wetland because it has it's been hayfields and has frontage

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on it's like a large parts parts of land but has two frontages. >> Mhm. >> And and that like >> oh frontage on Goodrich and Lancaster. >> Yep. >> Yeah. We would do well if we can get a group

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of people to talk with the town manager about in approaching this man family and giving and you know putting this in a APR. It would be so sad if that farm sells and then then it gets build house. It'll be so I probably will cry.

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There's another property I'm concerned about and it's I don't know how soon we have to worry about it, but it's the uh it's the um Flaill Orchards. >> Oh, yeah. >> There's nobody >> there's nobody behind uh Tracy in terms

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of family going to pick that up. So, when she decides she's through and she's already sold one piece on Flat Hill up there, which was a shame. Um I I'm afraid she's going to do it again when it comes time for her to retire and and that's going to be I'd hate to see us

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lose that orchard. >> Yeah, we we looked at that parcel when it first came up uh that piece that she sold across the street >> um under writer first refusal. >> Yeah, I wasn't here at that time. >> No, you weren't. Yeah, that was quite a while ago.

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>> It was over by Courtland where that where that development is that goes through there. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So maybe that's >> I live I live on I live on Flat Hill. I I'm a neighbor of >> I go I live down the street from you.

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>> Oh. Oh. >> So, you know, maybe that's a goal for us is to, you know, to try to do something like that. >> I'd be interested in in that. Yeah. >> Yeah. apply for some, you know, figure out how the APR program works. But I

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know the state will help buy land and application process managed by the master and you know and then that is also another piece of land that that is you know

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um it it you know I'm thinking of the older generation is really Cherry Hill Farm. Um, you know that that farming generation there >> that by the way Mike that property you

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had just clicked on Allison um Connie had told me that she wanted to um put that into conservation but >> I haven't talked to her in years about that and she hasn't done it and I know her son's going to inherit the property. So if she >> this one here

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>> uh yeah that's 100 acres. >> Yeah. And I I I live across the street from that. And um I I um Matt can be a little prickly, but I'd like to have a conversation with him

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because that's her his mother voiced her wishes to put that in conservation. I'd like to see that followed through. So I'm going to see if I can have a conversation with either Connie or Matt. I don't see Connie much anymore. She's just not out and about as much as she was. >> Yeah.

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All right. So, so let's put APR on our radar, Mike. >> Yes. >> Okay. Do we want to start talking about modifying the criteria or adding criteria or deleting criteria

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or whatever it is we want to do? Um because if we want to, >> we can. just you what you have to remember is that the the open space recreation plan is a is a statemandated document and has to go through state approval processes. So if we change it

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um we'd have to go back through that process and I'm not sure again I'm not sure exactly how those criteria came to be. If that was through a town uh process we then we shouldn't just change it by ourselves.

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But I'm certain I certainly entertain us starting to talk about refining these criteria. >> Yeah, I like that. I I don't know what the process should be either. >> All right. So, I have an assignment for each of you. We'll all do it. Um it's a

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short paragraph, you know, uh put it in a word document or something and make make your proposed edits to it. Uh and then you can ship them all to me if you want. and we'll start to kick it around and figure out what we need to do. The one thing we

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shouldn't be adding to it is I don't think we should be adding our financial considerations because this is ultimately we are recommending this to the select board who then has to bring things to town meeting for acquisition.

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So, I mean, it's always in the back of everybody's mind, especially with all this Prop 2 and a half override stuff going on. Um, but that shouldn't be I don't think that should be one of our overriding criteria unless we want to add the opportunity for grants because

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certain types of open space have better opportunities for grants. >> It sounds like those criterias were handed to us the way it's written, handed to us by the town. If that that's not the case, >> I don't know, you know, I don't know whether I don't know whether the town in there is like the royal we

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>> Yeah. >> You know, um >> Mr. Burch Mr. Burch from the Conservation Commission has a history on it. So >> he does. >> He does. So maybe you can reach out to him, Mike.

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>> I don't know him. >> Oh, Andrea. I could because he's still on the commission, right? >> Yeah. >> Yeah. last coming. >> Uh-huh. Yeah. There's a few names that I recognize at the top of that um document

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that are still in town commissions here and there. >> I mean, I would I would reach out I can I can reach out to Brandon because he was the chair of this committee when I first joined this committee and and stayed on for quite a while after I became the chair. Um but he's always

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been very active in town and he's he's also he's a professional in that in that field in in you know open space and and um conservation land. So I can reach out to Brandon. He was a ma one of the major authors of that document. So I can reach out to him and see what he recalls from

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that. But if you can reach out to to your fellow commissioner that would be great Andrea. >> Okay. >> All right. Um, I don't know. Paul, was Paula on this one at the time? I think she might have been on this one at the time, too. >> No, I think this predates Paul. I think,

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like I said, >> yeah, I think this came about around 2011 >> when I think that was also around the time that we they redid the our conservation bylaws and tighten things even, you know, the

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way they are now. Um, and Paula at that time was in select board. >> Okay. >> Jesus, I'm starting to sound like a town. Just going to see what other names were up top, Andrea, because I I know a few

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of these people. I think, like I said, Brandon would be the one that I'd be, you know, most familiar with. That wasn't it. All right. I'll look it up later. Okay. Anything else on on this one before we

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uh go to a vote? I think we're going to need to go to a vote um on 35 Lemonster. All right. Then I'd entertain a motion. And if somebody wants to make make actually say what the motion is, that

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would be great. >> Um I motion to pass on this property to consider it for um acquisition. Second. >> Oh, there you go. Tim got that one. >> Yeah. >> Okay.

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Motions made by Chris and Tim. And again, this is this is, you know, our recommendation to the select board is what we're So, we're going to recommend to the select board that that they not exercise right of first refusal. Okay. Um, let's go. Roll call. Andrea.

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>> Hi. >> Eric, >> I. >> Chris, >> I. >> Tim, >> I. >> Anna, >> I. >> And the chair votes I. Okay. So, I will I'll forward that on to

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um town manager's office and I I haven't watched the last few select board meetings, so I don't know if they've already acted on this or not, so we'll find out. All right. Um, next item in the agenda, citizen comments. I don't see any

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one on here other than us, so we'll pass through that one. Next is just to discuss our upcoming meeting. So the next meeting is on June the 10th and then on July 8th. So that is is that fourth of July week?

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I forget what Fourth of July falls on this year. >> Third is a Friday. I'm not sure. >> Fourth is a Saturday. So 8th is the following >> the following week. So we'll be okay. So it's not it's not in the week. Good. Okay. So those are the next two meeting

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dates. Um, >> did you say June 10th? >> June 10th and July 8th. If I did my calendar correctly. All right. Anything else from any of the members?

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>> No, nothing from me. >> I don't see anybody else jumping up and down. So, I'd entertain a motion to adjurnn. >> So moved. >> Uh second. >> All right. Roll call. Eric >> I.

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>> Andrea >> I. >> Anna >> I. >> Tim >> I. >> Chris >> I. >> And the chair votes I. Thank you all very much for coming and don't forget your assignment for the next time because I've got to have it on the agenda on June the 10th.

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>> All right. >> Thank you folks. Thank you >> everyone. >> Thank you Mike. >> Audrey, are you coming Wednesday or Thursday? >> Um >> to the workshop. >> Oh, right. Yes, >> it's going to be on Zoom. >> Okay.

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>> Um I was I was back and forth with Jen today because I wasn't even sure if we were doing it in person or if we're doing it on Zoom. So, we're going to do it on Zoom. >> So, I'm hoping to have a PowerPoint presentation um that I can run through on Zoom with everybody. >> Okay. It'll be good.

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>> So, we'll see you at noon on Thursday. >> Okay. >> All right. See you. >> Bye. >> Bye.