link in the agenda and will be found on the Lunberg Access YouTube channel within 24 hours of meeting. The agenda lists all the topics which may be discussed at the meeting and are those reasonably anticipated by the chair. Votes may be taken as a result of these discussions. Not all items listed may in
fact be discussed and other items not listed may also be brought up for discussion to the extent permitted by the open meeting. So the first thing is pledge of allegiance. I aliance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic
for it stands one nation under God indivisible with liberty and justice for all. >> All right. So we are going to move through the agenda pretty quickly because we have a long budget discussion. The first thing on the agenda is public comment for issues from
pre previous meetings. Anybody in person? Anybody on Zoom? All right, moving on. >> Oh, I got one. >> Okay, got it.
>> Okay, that's not working. Um, >> give me a second. All right. The first thing is, I don't know if anyone's noticed, um, but I've been harping on this. We need people to run for office. And I'm not just talking about school committee. I'm talking
about townwide. Uh, there are up for election this year is select board, sewer commission, board of health, assessors, school committee, park commission, commissioner of trust funds, cemetery commission, library trustee, planning board, and housing authority. Some of those positions have nobody
running. for them. I know for us right right now I don't believe there are three seats up for election for school committee and there are only two people running for three seats. So >> there's two seats. >> Nope, it's me. Oh, you Emily >> and the open seat.
>> And the open seat. Sorry, never mind. >> So yeah, there are three positions. >> So there are three positions um for school committee and only two people running. So we need people to run. You have until March 26, which is next week, to pull the papers. You go to the town
clerk's office, get a form, you collect 50 signatures, you return it by Saturday, May 28th at 5:00 p.m., and then your name will be on the ballot. That's the easiest way to do it outside of caucus, which has already happened. If you need help getting signatures, you can email me and I will help you. And
there are other people in town who will help you get 50 signatures if that sounds like a large task. This town is run by volunteers. If you're unhappy about how things work, you can make changes. This is a concrete action that
you can take in your local community. So, I highly recommend that if you're watching tonight and you're upset by things, consider running for office. Um, number two, tonight is going to stink. No one
will be happy. We will all be upset. But we we sustained massive cuts last year. cuts that affected our students in concrete, demonstrable ways. Cuts that put immense strain on the reduced staff. I cannot understand how we're going to
possibly cut more. But we have to look at a balanced budget. That is our responsibility. We have to do it. But the important thing I wanted to say was I am so grateful for our Lunberg teachers and staff. This is what makes Lunberg schools great. You guys are the
reason we have managed this long with so little. your creativity, your dedication, and your caring for our students and for each other. It is very appreciated. And I'm saying that as me, a school committee member who is
constantly impressed with what I see. And as a parent who has seen firsthand how talented and dedicated you all are. Third thing and last thing is that March 2nd, I'm sorry, May 2nd is town meeting.
Don't get that wrong. It's May 2nd. You must go. Do not depend on other people showing up for you. It is This is not going to be an easy thing to get past. No, it's not fun. It is always, for some reason, beautiful weather and the nice
first Saturday in May. As parents, for some reason, it is a day that is constantly filled with every child having activities. It is a hard thing to attend. That is why historically parents don't go. But it is important you go. It is
important to It is too important for you to sit out and hope for the best. You are the best hope. This is directly a way that you can make the town better. You can make our kids' lives better. This is one of the few times that we as citizens have a vote that very much
counts. Saturday, May 16th is the town election. You must show up and vote in that election. You have to. An override needs to pass at town meeting and then it needs to pass at the polls. It needs to
meet both of those obstacles in order to pass. It barely passed last time. Your individual vote will matter. Those individual votes absolutely mattered. So, I want everyone to put the dates in your calendar now. Saturday, March 2nd,
May. Oh my god, it has been a really long week. I was up a little late last night. Saturday, May 2nd and Saturday, May 16th. Put them in your calendar. May 2nd and May 16th. May 2nd is the not fun day. That's going to
take a lot of hours. May 16th, you just need to be in town and spend a few minutes voting. But both of those things are really important. then you need to spread the word too because not a lot of people watch this as compared to who we need to show up. So
that's my three cents. >> That was perfect. Thank you so much, Laura. >> Yes. >> I agree on all fronts basically. >> Anybody else? >> All right. Um okay, quick chair's report. I just want to make sure that everybody is aware that we are all all
of the committees are working together behind the scenes to try to get things ready. We are working really hard to get everything ready for our side so that when we have the next uh tri board meeting we will be ready to go. I know that select board is working very hard.
Um, one of the things that I want to highlight is that uh, according to the budget presented last Monday, is that right? That the fourth shift fire department >> two days ago, >> two days ago has moved from an override
item to a regular budget item. And while I understand the necessity of that, um, from my perspective as chair, it it greatly weakens the ability for the override to pass. I wish that wouldn't have happened. I understand why it happened. I understand the fire
department still has needs, but it is hard to be this late in the process and have that big of a change. I'm concerned that it will impact turnout and that it will impact the vote count in a way that is bad. Um,
I am also a little concerned that this the structure of the override has not been set. Uh, and that the amounts have not been set. Um, I think we hopefully when we finish tonight, everything will be in. We will have turned in all of our homework and just
await. Uh, but it it is we're coming down to the last last few days and it's been a very very difficult process. Um, and I'm more concerned now than I was before. I think it's fair to say that
before we had like a coin toss chance maybe in the best case scenario and without force shift fire on the override I think that we have virtually no chance of winning and I'm sorry to say that but I think that's probably true. So, uh,
>> it was also done the day after or the day that a few hours after the expiration to hand in a citizen's petition. >> I don't I don't know anything about that. I'm just saying I wish it would not have happened. It happened. I understand why it happened, but it is
essentially taken the wind out of the sales in terms of making this a joint town and school committee effort. without a big ticket item for the town. I feel like we're sort of out in the field alone. Um, all right. Sure.
>> Can I >> Sure. Come on. >> I was going to wait till the end, but since you brought it up. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. >> I mean, it heavily affects what we're doing here and the fact that these cuts are more likely because of the actions of this board.
>> Rene 6 Iris Court speaking as myself. Um I just want to clarify one thing about the fourth shift fire that's in the no override budget. The fourth shift is included in the override budget. The full ask of the fire department is not.
The pdiums were cut in half. What that impact the impact of that is we can't man two ambulances in the no override budget. So that's that's the missing piece. So
yes, there is a fourth shift of the career fire workers. The pdium line was cut basically in half. So we can't um man the two ambulances. So there is an impact to the safety
um and services of the town. >> All right. Um the next thing is on the agenda is the student representative report. Um tomorrow um for the primary school and Turkey Hill, it's hosted at Turkey Hill, but it's STEM nights. Um
there is also MCAST coming up in both Turkey Hill and the middle school at the high school. Prom tickets just went for sale Monday and will be for sale for I believe the next two weeks. Um as well as course registration just opened. So,
yay. Kids are scared again about about the budget. Um, and districtwide, we are currently hosting a food drive. >> Cara, what's the date for the prom? >> Um, May 16th, I believe.
>> What else is happening on May 16th? >> Election day. >> Election day. >> So, those 18-year-old seniors might not be in need and nails. Please find time to go to the polls.
These are my favorite signs of spring when suddenly the first MCCAST state hits and it's just >> goes faster and faster in the spring. So that's exciting. Those of us who are juniors and seniors are very lucky. We don't have them test
anymore. >> All right. Uh do you have >> Is that on? Yes, it's number eight. >> All right, let's do >> Okay. Uh, we have minutes in the folder. Has everyone had a chance to review the minutes?
>> I didn't, but I make a motion to accept the minutes of 121 26. >> The second. >> I'll second. >> All in favor? >> I. >> All that abstain me. Okay, that passes.
Uh, review and approve uh line item transfers, warrants, and donations. >> Uh, so there was a the warrant total for the period of February 25th, 2026 to March 13, uh, March 11th, 2026 is
$298,48.51. Um, and do we have any line item transfers? >> No. >> Okay. And we have a scholarship is here. I was told it was complicated. >> Yes. I would like to ask Liz to come up and explain the ins and outs of this
particular scholarship. It's a little less straightforward than our others. >> Right. >> So, this scholarship, can everyone hear me? Yes. >> Okay. Um, this scholarship was actually um awarded already to two 2025
graduates. Um, it was $500 each and what this is going to do is basically pay them the $500. Um, I talked I tried to talk to my lean at town hall about it. We were playing
phone tag about it because the actual scholarship donation form really doesn't apply here because this is just a payment voucher. So basically what we've done in the past, we've put in a PR for this, which we do have a PR in the
system and then it's paid out through the warrant system is what happens. Um town hall wants some type of approval for this. So, we included the scholarship donation form for that, but it doesn't actually apply in this case
really. So, we just needed your signatures and approval tonight. Um, afterwards, I'm going to give my a copy of the minutes of this meeting once they're approved. Um, so she'll have that. She'll have all of the information
from the scholarship and then once we get a PO back, we can put the payment voucher through the warrant system. You will sign that and then they will get paid the $500 each for the scholarship recipients. Is it something specific
about this scholarship that's led to this confusion or are we going to have to do this for every scholarship that we >> So basically every scholarship moving forward should just really be the warrants. >> Yeah. >> And then minutes of approval, but I need
to talk to my about that and we've been playing phone tags. So that's why I included that tonight. So at least she would have initial approval on something so that she could >> These kids are in their second semester of college, >> right? They're going into their second semester.
>> It's not fair of us to not give them their money. >> Exactly. And that's why we already put the PR into the system. So as soon as we get the PO, we'll put it through the warrant system. >> Um, is this a policy change at town hall?
>> It wasn't a policy change per se. This has to do with an MGL um and donations in general, scholarship donations and donations in general. So that's why we created town hall actually created that form because of it and then
they handed it down to us. So in general the the whole thing has changed since previous years. That's why. >> Okay. It's our funds or are the funds being dispersed through us or >> No, it's dispersed through the student
activity account is where it's normally dispersed through. So, >> all right. I think the form was just throwing me. >> Yeah, exactly. >> But that is okay. Thank you for untangling this mess and getting our kids what they need. >> Absolutely.
>> Congrats to the two kids and I hope they're doing good in school. >> They are. You can see their transcripts there. They're doing great. But I it looks like they're doing good. So proud them. >> Okay. >> Yeah. Thank you. >> Do we need to vote on this? >> Oh, do we need to vote?
>> You know what? >> Yeah, we'll make a motion to accept the scholarship don >> donation slash award. >> Yes. >> Thank you. >> All in favor? I All right. >> Thank you very much.
>> Thank you. Okay. So, I it's my report. Um, and I have two brief things for you. The high school very nicely created a schedule that would not require the movement of
graduation due to the terrifically wonderful winter wonderland we had this winter. So this will keep our graduation on the 6th and keeps us within guidelines for the 12 school days between senior dismissal and district dismissal.
So the schedule would be senior's last day will be Tuesday, June 2nd. Wednesday, June 3 would be the motorcade. Thursday, June 4th would be rehearsal and senior awards and dinner. Friday, June 5th is senior sunset. And
Saturday, June 6 is graduation. Obviously, we didn't want to move to graduation because of the number of snow days, even though we had that option. So, I really want to thank um Mr. Sanur and Karma for Miss Tusant for doing this
for us, working out a flexible schedule so that we could keep graduation on the six. >> Have we let senior parents know in case that affects things like baloria or >> We have Okay. And this encompasses all those fun graduation traditions that we It's like
an entire agenda. >> I really like it. I love our graduation week traditions. >> It's really fun. >> Wouldn't say they're corny. >> They're a little corny, but that's >> But that's kind of that's why I love the kind of I think the motorcade is
absolutely beautiful. >> That's why I love Lunberg. Um, there's one more thing that I wanted to make sure that you are aware of for our handbooks and registrations
um, for summer programs and our early learning center next year um, as well as extended day. For summer camp, the application is going to be put up around 5:00 p. p.m. on April 27th. For extended
day, 5:00 pm on May 11th, and for early learning center, 5:00 pm on May 18th. These are all Mondays. What are the locations for those programs? >> That is an excellent question. Extended
day will run as it ran this year. Obviously, the early learning center is located at primary school and summer camp. Liz is >> I would assume at the primary school, but Patty's on the meeting tonight so
she can clarify when she um she's on Zoom tonight so she can clarify. >> Excellent. >> She's going to be presenting the handbooks for those programs tonight. So, um, for your approval, they're in your folder and all the changes are very nicely highlighted in yellow. So, thank
you, Patty. And then you have some images that were just in our folder of students enjoying decodable readers, which you approved the grant funding for. So, we wanted to show you that they are being used and how much our students
are enjoying them. >> They really are. >> Yeah. Um, That was a fast turnaround. So, thank you. Dr. Saki is very quick. >> There is one picture in particular that warrants comment. It is adorable. Holy
moly. >> I know. Don't say anything. Oh my lord. >> They're very happy. >> That's concludes my report for tonight. I thought I'd keep it brief since we have a lot to do.
You know, it's not going to be fun. Okay, let's keep it. >> All right, so before we get to new business, I just want to make sure we're all on the same page. This trip has already been approved. This is like happening in like a month. So hopefully
we do not need to give anybody the third degree again. We're all We all know it's an equity issue. I'm fully aware of that. we can have that fight to change the price. >> Not at the final approval stage. >> So, with that being said,
>> thank you. >> You're welcome. >> This is a big trip. >> Yes, it is. >> Is this This is a lot more than normal. Um so it es and flows and um pre2020 we
didn't have a lot of travelers and struggled to get trips even to to go and then with all the the stop and travel for that extended time period we're seeing much higher numbers in our international trips right now. So yes it's wonderful
>> wonderful to see. So I'm Jessica, the world language department head and here in place of Mrs. York who is still very much running the trip um that had a family emergency. Um she um forwarded me what she forwarded you and we discuss
something. So hopefully if I am unable to answer questions that you might have um I can certainly get the answers to you soon. Um we're departing. Um I'm just going to speak it like I'm going on the trip which I'm not. Um we're departing on this Friday the
17th um in the evening um and coming back on the Saturday of vacation. Um the there are seven adults on the trip with 30 students. This is an excellent ratio.
Their students are leaving in a coach bus from the high school which allows everybody to get to the airport together and on time and to make sure before they leave here they have their passports already. Um and um let's see. So there
was a question um about the cruise um and so I just want to be clear that there's no passing of students through the straight of Hormuz. What basically this this this um this cruise ship >> I don't know geography
>> the ship is stuck there >> that's fine but like >> but so the the idea is the ship has two specific geographic um um places it services during two different times of the year and so in March they shift to Greece and the
Mediterranean and so they've gotten stuck so that's what's why the the cruise portion of the trip is right now on old. Um, we have one additional update that's occurred since you received this packet, which is that the
company ACIS has, um, contacted a different cruise company that could possibly replace the one um, that is currently booked so that they could still complete the trip as planned, but it's nothing is definite because they
obviously want to see if that ship can can come through for them. The third option which is already being planned for because um they want to be ready if it if it happens is there will be a land portion in in lie of the cruise portion
and this company is excellent ACIS. I I have 100% confidence that this will be dealt with professionally and the students no matter what experience they're provided it will be an incredible experience. So, um
let's see if there's anything else. Um I know there's been some talk on not in Lunberg. Just in my um professional um learning groups about safety with travel right now, there are no travel warnings for Americans. If you go to the um
official US Department website and um ACIS monitors that very very closely. Um, I don't think the school committee is aware of this, but um, back in 2020, we had a trip going to Galapagos and that trip was postponed two years in
a row due to COVID. And then on the third year, 25 hours prior to departure, the company canled the trip because of political unrest in the um, the region that they were flying into. I don't know exactly what region, but my point in
saying that is if ACIS deems that it's not safe to travel, they will make that call um and students will get their money back. Um so um so I um >> they didn't go into Galapagus >> not for four years. >> Oh, that was the Okay, that's
>> that's why so it was delayed two years due to COVID, one year because of political unrest and then they finally traveled in the fourth year. Um so um so I I just wanted to let you know that so that you can feel reassured that you know the company themselves they don't want to be responsible for sending a
group of students to an unsafe region of course and so um they will certainly um you know make accommodations if something comes up. So I just wanted to reassure everybody of that. >> Yeah. >> I appreciate Mrs. York's adaptability
because this is a potentially big change. I appreciate the adaptability, the ability to adapt. Uh what that teaches the kids about resiliency and adaptability because they're never going to forget the trip that they had to reschedule parts of it because a war
broke out. Um and the commitment to safety. I like that. As soon as I saw this on the itinerary, I was a little bit panicked. Um, I don't know why I thought their layover was in Turkey. Uh, so I appreciate it's not it's not what
>> the lay the layover is in Germany. Um, so I appreciate the uh commitment to the student safety and the immense effort the adapting the plan is probably taking on.
So thank you. Do we need to approve this >> so that you guys can go? Look for a motion to approve the for to render final approval for the green trip. >> Some moved. >> Second. >> All in favor? >> I. >> All right. >> Thank you so much for your time. >> Yeah. I hope everybody has fun on this.
I'm sure they will. >> I hope the war ends, too. An unnecessary war seems like a bad thing to do. >> Just saying. >> I mean, I agree. >> Taking a real hard stance. >> I It's I I went I went out on the limb on that one. Whoa.
>> An unnecessary word that has nothing to do with us seems like a bad idea. All right. Uh the next item on the agenda is >> Oh, the handbooks for the >> ELC and extended day.
>> It's in its own folder. >> And I believe Miss McCarthy Gillette is online for us. >> She is. >> Hi everyone. Can you hear me? >> Yes. >> Okay. Um so we have a page obviously you'll
see from the handbooks there's no policy changes no procedural changes um time changes anything basically it's just obviously changes of dates of times that we will be closed um you know due to the the uh Lunberg calendar um your earlier
question where summer camp is that moved to the primary school last year so it was our first summer last year we will continue this year there. >> Okay. And there's no substantive changes. >> No, no changes. Times the same for early
learning center. Um extended day the same thing. Extended day is at Turkey Hill in the morning. It's at the primary in the afternoon. That remains the same. So, um basically everything is just about the same except for when we're starting school, etc. a ball in Canada.
>> I must say the extended day at Turkey Hill in the morning, my kids are so happy. >> The nice being in the gym in the morning running around in a controlled chaos. It's very controlled, but they, you know, they get to run around. It really has been wonderful. I think it's good
for them. >> We have an amazing staff. So, it's um and we have, you know, um we have this gym in the afternoon as well at the primary school. Believe me, those kids need it when they get off that bus. It it really is helpful. >> Yeah, it's been good.
>> If everyone's good, I'll make a motion to accept the changes. >> All right. All in favor? >> I >> I >> Thank you. >> Thank you. Nikki, you can pack up your stuff. >> All right. Uh looks like we are on to
PEC health insurance opt out. >> Yes. So the negotiations the town and the PEC are coming to an end and one of the areas where the town manager has notified me that they see likely
consensus is an enhancement of the opt out program. So right now employees must enroll in the town's health insurance for at least two years and then are eligible to opt out. When they opt out, they receive a one-year incentive of
$2,000 for an individual plan and $4,000 for a family plan. Under the proposed new program, employees must enroll in the town's health insurance for at least one year. Then they're eligible to opt out. When they opt out, they will
receive a continuous annual incentive of $3,000 for an individual plan and $6,000 for a family plan payable each year they remain opted out. Because the new program allows annual payments and has a shorter eligibility period, it's
reasonable to expect that participation may increase substantially compared to prior years. Historically, participation has been limited across the town and school combined. Opt out have been as follows. Oh my god. >> In FY25, we had three family and one
individual opt out. In FY26, we had two families and three individuals opted out. With the low historical uh participation, the town manager is not sure whether there has been a formalized understanding of the budgeting of the
opouts between the town and the school. Going forward, she is proposing an understanding between the town and school that each need to absorb the out the opt out payments associated with its own employees. In other words, if school employees elect to opt out, the school
department will realize the insurance savings, but the school department will also be responsible for funding the corresponding opt- out payments within its budget. The town will follow the same approach for town employees. This doesn't negatively impact our budget planning as the opt out is substantially
cheaper than the insurance plans. Um, and given the enhanced benefit, we will likely have enhanced participation which will lower our health insurance line. Um, but we don't know that yet. Um, the town manager and I agree feel that it's
important to formally acknowledge an understanding of this change. So much of what happens, we don't formally write down or acknowledge. >> You've noticed. >> Yes. So, we think it's important to formally acknowledge an understanding of this change in advance of FY27 so that
there's a clear understanding. And I said I would bring this forward to the school committee because it's budgeting and under your purview. So, you can let me know if you'd like me to proceed with this formalizing this. I just want to point out that I'm I think
this is a great idea, something that the budget task force recommended. I think it would be even better if it was an immediate opt out because quite frankly, just make it as appealing as possible and until it is actually used. It is very clear we're not using it. The
numbers are worse now than they were like we did the budget task force in 2024 and I think it was like just a little bit higher. But the one thing that I will point out is that we have this informal understanding with the town that we count our health insurance
on our budget and this is propagating that and I'm okay with that. But eventually I think when cooler heads prevail on the accounting side that line should go back to the town. So as long as we have that line in our budget which
was based on an informal agreement that has nothing to do with the town charter or state law. It was just a devil's bargain that did not pay dividends to the schools. I uh I think that we should do this, but eventually I would like to see that line returned to the town.
>> Um I want to say that I appreciate the town manager's efforts in negotiating with the BEC. Uh it's been a lot. It's been her work. Um and she's this represents our interest as well. So I'm
very thankful for this. uh and these changes at a higher level. I hate that we're incentivizing people not to get health insurance on a human benefits level. Um >> they would have to justify that they have it somewhere else, right? They
would have to say like their significant other. >> No one is forgoing other it would just be >> if the spouse is covered. We do this in my business. A lot of businesses do this. Um, but I I see no reason not to participate in this and I am very grateful for the formalizing of things
in writing because it's been with you coming on and Chris coming on an interesting transition as far as written records versus that's just always the way it's been done. Um, so I see. Do we need to sign? >> You will need to sign. So I'm on board. The only thing I'm hoping that we might
consider a cadence where we readress it >> so that this isn't a infinite polic. or if some reason in five years this is not you know I'm not thinking yearly three years would be fine the >> term of the >> I just think you know that we don't want yeah three three the term of the PC is
three years that would be fine I just don't want to accept something that I'm never going to see again >> yeah I think the term of the PBC and then we have to talk >> then we have to talk about it every three years and then Tony can talk about health insurance >> because it could change >> this is ridiculous we should get rid of this
>> um so do we need to vote on this now or wait for for to me. Um, I want you to give me approval to proceed into practice with the town manager and then it will come back to you for your signature. >> Motion to give the superintendent
approval to proceed with the opt out program. >> Second. >> All in favor? >> Thank you everyone. I loved how ambitious you were here, Tony. FY27 budget three minutes.
>> I think we can do this in three minutes. Everybody >> talk quick and get to the point. >> Three hours. >> I mean to be a lot of this work has been done. Every slide gets approximately one and a half seconds. How many flashes at you? >> We have no slides.
>> Boom. See, no slides. >> No slides. >> Oh, no slides. This is note this has been disseminated to the public and posted on our website so people can follow along with us there. >> We've Yeah, because we've done the restoration budget. We've done a lot of this work. We did the
um we did the uh Yeah, we did the restoration budget. We did the finance committee presentation. A lot of this work has been done already. This is just the is trimming it more. >> Yes. >> But I do think that it's going to be more than three minutes. Yes, they will
be >> five minutes. >> So, there's a couple of ways that we can approach this. We have the return of the rainbow budget thanks to Laura um which is at the end. Um we could go through
line by line where you think we could reduce more. Um though I do want to comment that our expenses are pretty much level service funded or below now depending on actual um trends that have
happened. Um so that is important. I want to make one note. Um there's been a lot of talk amongst the town about outsourcing custodial work. Um, I finally heard back from the company. The
um, price tag that they gave us was 1.1 to 1.2 million and that was not including supplies. So, I don't recommend that that's an avenue we continue to pursue as it's more expensive than our wonderful custodian crew is now.
>> That's a lose-lose proposition. >> Done. >> Thank you for looking into looked into it. It's good. >> I wanted to say I did my due diligence. Um, yeah, we did get some comments more than about the expenses and why are we cutting why are we cutting personnel
instead of expenses? And from what I can see, having this being my third really fun year of looking really hard at the budget, the expenses have been cut last year especially to save some positions.
The expenses have been cut as for the most part as far as they can be cut. There's no more to cut. If there was, we would absolutely cut the expenses before personnel because a
school for the most part is its people. Teachers teach. It's what they do. We can't do this without the teachers, without the staff, without the parents, without the admin, without the clar. We can't do this without the people we
have. And so expenses have been cut. And I said this two years ago, and I said it one year ago, and I've been told I say it too much. Um, we're running very lean. Lunberg schools have been running very lean for a very long time. This is not our first time going through budget
shortages. We run very lean. We do a lot with very little. And now we have to try and figure out how to do it with even less. And we have cut some of our expenses um
as well that I think are important to note. We um have cut $110,195 from the high school principal assistant principal from the original budget that we had posted online. We've cut um
$72,241 from middle school special educators. We have Hold on, I am scrolling. Maybe I should have done slides. Um the health insurance.
>> Yeah. Or are you looking between FY27 and 26? >> Yes. Um we h Oh, here's what I'm looking for. We reduced $10,000 from maintenance emergency repairs, $10,000 from maintenance of building supplies,
$10,000 for maintenance of grounds contracted services, $4500 from custodial supplies, $1,000 from mileage, 50 We subtracted $50,000 from transportation because we're applying
our bus fees, our school choice transportation. Um, we're applying, speaking of school choice transportation, the school committee at its next meeting is going to have to decide about the continuation of the bus fee so we can get the
transportation forms out in a timely manner. Um, we have subtracted $17,450 from athletic transportation, $4,140 from trash removal, $12,510
for maintenance of buildings contracted services, $20,000 for maintenance of building um supplies, and $9,720 from fire safety furniture repair. This isn't a fire safety issue that we're
reducing. It's that all of the furniture in our school needs to meet the fire code. And so that's why it's called fire safety furniture. Um these were all based on um looking at actuals which you
now have in your budget which weren't there um prior to this. So, we um looked at our actual spending patterns over um the past few years, and these are the decisions that we made to cut. We added
$15,000 into um school committee legal expenses because right now we're running a little hot. Chris knows of a couple of bills that are coming in. And so I'm using the firm to help with a couple of
contentious um cases that we have. Not legal cases, but um contentious records requests and things that are happening to make sure that they're done properly. Um so that we thought that increasing that
amount um would provide some safety. There's some lines, there's two lines in particular that I want to address off the top of my head that I know the community may be seeing as larger. One is our special education testing
services. That number has increased significantly. We are currently using a version of the Woodcock Johnson test that they no longer support. Um they haven't supported it for a couple of years. We're running out of our answer sheets and our kids really do deserve
better. So, we are upgrading to the newest version of the Woodcock Johnson. The other thing that you will see is there's a fairly dramatic increase on the supply side in ELLL supplies. That's
due to the increase in students and the need to buy some multilingual literacy things for them so that they can um have instruction in a way that's appropriate
for developing English learners. And >> yeah, that's again there were years of budget difficulties. So they were working on very little for a long time >> and it caught up to us and we need we need to augment that. >> Yes.
>> And I I do want to say when we cut expenses like this, it's going to catch up later. We can't we can't just not buy art supplies forever. Eventually they're we're going to stop finding crayons in the couch cushions.
um we're we're we're going to need to purchase replacements eventually. This is not sustainable. And two of those lines um that I'm very aware of right now as our equipment for physical
education and we have yet again deferred um uniform replacement for next year. >> Do we have a schedule now for the uniforms? We have a >> Yes. Okay.
>> But we're going to be a year off >> already. Yes. >> Okay. >> Um so can we step back because I think there are two things we need to do tonight and I I think maybe as a committee we should be focused on two things in particular. Um but I know m
Mr. Chairman I don't know what you So the the two things I think we need to come to some kind of conclusion on or at least thorough discussion is our balanced budget. This is the affforementioned terrible budget that
nobody wants to have go through, but I think we need to talk about that and make sure the school committee and the public realizes how bad it is. Um, and then secondly, I personally would like to suggest that we coalesque around a budget number for the override that we
as a school committee feel comfortable putting in writing to send to the select board for their conversation. And that could include two tiers. It could include one tier, but I think we need to I I I would like to get that personally locked down tonight. >> I think we're going to need two numbers.
>> Well, I mean, I think we need to talk about that. So, um so I'm happy to defer to you, Mr. Chairman, on which one you'd like to do first, but I think we those are the two things in my wheelhouse I would like to get done tonight. In my wheelhouse, that's not right. in my priority
>> priority brain. >> I think it makes sense >> to come up with the goal before working towards it. >> Yeah. So, I think that what we should take a vote now on whether we want to do a tiered override or a non-tiered override, >> right?
>> And then use that vote to shape the discussion of what comes next. If we're not going to support a tiered override, then we should not spend time on differentiating between tiers and we should go straight to this is our number
and this is what the cuts look like if we don't get an override. If we vote in favor of a tiered override, then I think that we would the second phase of the discussion would be what does tier one look like? What does tier two look like? And what does the cuts budget look like? But if we don't have that as our guiding
principle, then we're just going to be debating, you know, we're going to be running on two tracks at the same time, and it doesn't make any sense. So, I I think that the straw poll at the tri board meeting was clear. It was seven to five. >> It was seven to six because six seven.
>> No, no, it was 7 to five because I remember if I changed my vote, it went to six to six. >> Okay. I think Glenn had >> So, it was seven to five in favor of a single number. Um, and so I I think we should decide that first. And then if
after Monday the select board comes back to us and says, "We want us we want a lower number," then we already have it. We're ready to go. We can talk about, you know, what that looks like if they ask for it. But if we if we've decided we want one number, then we should go
with one number. If we decide we want two numbers, we should go with two numbers. But I don't think we should be debating the numbers at the same time as debating the shape of the override. >> Mr. Chair. >> Sure. >> Is that within our purview? I thought that and correct me if I'm wrong. I
thought that was in the select board's purview to as far as what the override is. >> Oh yeah. I I that is they get to decide and put into place what the override looks like. In terms of what we give them as input, we decide. >> Okay. So, like we can say to them, "This
is how much we need. This is our number." Or we can say to them, "This is what it would look like if we had a tiered override." I I don't have a preference one way or the other. I I think that like there's good reason to go with one number. I think there's good reasons to go with multiple numbers. I
also think you could support one number and want to debate two numbers so that we can be you know further ahead on on this project than we would be if we only gave them one number. So >> So that would be my position. So my position is I would like one number. I
am willing to come down to the the second budget that the superintendent has put together which is the core >> core budget she has called it right the core it's scenario for anyone following along at home it's scenario C
>> right it's on page >> oh god help me with the page number >> scenario C is on page >> four um I am not willing to go below that number to ask the select board. That is my final answer. We can talk
about it as a group, but that is my final answer. If we are going to the voters and asking them for more money, I believe we have to go with scenario C. I feel like scenario B is ideal, but the select board has repeatedly asked us to come down on our number um
to be good partners. I am willing to go to scenario C. I also believe in a world where this the town manager has been focused on percentage 54 to 57% should be the schools that would give us about a right under 3 million total. I think
going over 3 million total is asking for a no vote. So I would recommend that the school committee go with the 1.5. I'm going to get to Emily in and first, but before I do that, I want to make sure everybody's aware. I spoke to the
town manager yesterday and I asked her this question, okay? And she was very clear to me that she was not concerned about a number or a percentage so much as she was concerned about the schools asking for what they need. So, like I
asked her a bunch of different times in a bunch of different ways. It wasn't quite a cross examination, but >> you two are fun together, >> but she she was really she was really clear to me. It's like so like I I don't I don't I you know like >> if she had told me it has to be this
then you know she gives us our marching orders, we we do that. But she was very clear you guys find out what figure out what you need. So I don't want to make it look like we were confined by that. >> Yeah. I'm sorry. I I don't mean to suggest that if that's not how it went. I just know there has been some discussion sentence. Sure. That's fair.
And so this so if this the select board decides that they would like to move forward with a two-tiered override it against not against which which was not what we are currently suggesting. I would suggest that the second number needs to be higher than the core services number.
The second number needs to be at least the restoration number even more. >> All right. >> Um I have one last thing. >> Oh yeah sure. >> Sorry. Sorry. No good. Um we have taken um I and we I had a recount done today on the cuts that came back last year. Um
the cuts last year included I think it was 20 positions. Um seven were realized through attrition and 13 were active positions that were held by staff members. We reduced our staff by 15.75
FTEES and so 17 of those 20 positions are unfilled today. The core budget asks to re not all 17 of those back. It asked for 1, two, three, four, five, six,
seven. It asked for eight back. So of the 17 cuts less than half schools took last year, that's an eight back. Um, so that's my Laura Lee stance even though I'm not a lawyer. >> Okay, Emily, what would you prefer for us to do?
>> I am a one number. >> Um, just no shame. >> Before being on the school committee as a parent or just a town's person going to town meeting, I feel like putting two numbers out there is confusing. I think people aren't going to listen past that.
I think asking for override already is stressful and hard. So putting two numbers out there I think is just going to cause more conflict within people to decide and we want them to say yes. So
um I think one number even if it's a little more than the second option might be if we did it here I think is the way to go. >> Okay. >> We have been very clear in our ask. I thought too conservative um but I'm
trusting Dr. Fortuna's wisdom. Um, we have been very clear in our ask for what we need next year, the 1.9. Um, we've been pretty clear with that. I had originally been one number and
then after the finance committee I really thought about especially what uh Anna Lockwood had said about hedging our bets >> and how devastating next year is going to be if we don't get an override and how maybe at least we could get a tier
one passed and we could limp by for another year. But then I I didn't finish it. I watched the select board meeting on Monday workshop where they were talking about their budget and they decided to fund the fire department in their regular budget.
Um, and I was concerned because a comment was made, oh, we haven't actually done our restoration budget yet, as in they're going to add more onto their ask. And I now I have concerns if we do two
numbers that that second number of our necessity restoration restoring less than half the positions lost last year number people will not vote for it because it's going to balloon when the town decides
that they also need an equal amount to that and I have real concerns about that now. So, I think I am now back to wanting one number, the restoration budget that we asked for. Um, because I I have concerns about
if we go for a two-tier override, that upper tier is going to be massive. Um, just hearing the comment, oh, we haven't done our restoration budget yet. Whereas, we know what we need. There are
more things we could certainly ask for that I don't feel comfortable asking for at this point because we're already asking taxpayers for a lot. But this is what we need. We've done a year of this. We've done how many months are we in the school year? We've done 67% of the
school year. >> We got our first look at the budget at the beginning of November. First half of >> November. We've seen the effects that these cuts have had on our students. We've seen what it's like to not have everything the kids need
and I'm just very concerned that with a two-tiered override that number would balloon. Um I think I'd be steady in our ask. I think the 1.9 and the 1.5 um are reasonable for a tier one and tier two, but now I have concerns
uh and I can't control what the select board does. I am not on the select board. It is not our purview to tell them what their ask is. We just have to good faith make our ask and say this is what we need and this is what public education requires and this is what the students require and hope they
believe us. Um but I'm I'm back to the one number. But I I think it would be prudent for us to prepare two budgets so that when we sit down we've done the work and we've done our homework and we can say we're ready to go because these things need to be hammered out now. We
need to do this the next tri board meeting. We need to have a proposal because we need to start talking to people about what it means and what we're going to lose and what >> what it has to get it to the town clerk. >> Yeah. >> April 11th is the >> but even I think this needs to be done
like next week. We need to figure out like Mandy made the point at the tri board meeting. We need to know what we're campaigning for and the sooner the better because this takes time and we are less than two months away from the election. >> I know you're talking about
>> but I would like you some guidance. >> Yes, that's great. >> I believe that we should use the core budget as our lower number. I think that
is what we need and I think it's appropriate for an override. I am terrified about what will happen if we have a no vote on that. And so even today I was waffling. Do we use the core as our
higher tier and a level service as our lower tier? Because at least we know we can limp along with level service and not ideal but not devastating the system. So I'm I'm still juggling those
two options in my head. Ideally, we will get the core budget and we could make that work. >> Well, I ideally would get the restoration. Yes, but I'm not sure that we should put the 1.9 out there >> at all. So, you think just one number
1.5 >> or two numbers 1.5 and 1.9? >> No, two.5 and 1.2 >> and 1.2. >> Oh god. >> Okay. >> It's >> all right. >> It's just really hard to campaign for an override while still not.
>> So, I here's my perspective. I think that we should only debate one number tonight. I think that Stacker Fortuna has given us a lot of good ideas and good work and so we have two numbers if the select board asks for it. But in
terms of of debating the numbers, what's in, what's out, I think that we should focus on one number. What that number is will be the next question I ask everybody on on the panel. I do have to say that I think that whatever we do, we have to be cognizant of the fact that
the odds that an override will pass now are significantly reduced. The moving moving fire from the override to the town budget is is devastating. And it's unfortunate because the school department has been put into
a position where we don't have the flexibility of cutting, you know, $500,000 that much money to make. >> Yeah. And move it around. And like that's just the nature of the beast. I I can't, you know, I can't fault them for making that decision. I think that if I
were in that position, I may have made the same decision. But the reality is the politics have gotten way way worse. And so >> do we ask them to just put our number on loan? >> I don't >> could they can we do just a school override? I mean they can do what they
want. >> Yeah, I think they could. But I I I still you know like the tri board meeting process was pitched to us as a way for all of the boards to work together to help craft an override that helps all parts of the town. And that
was how I justified spending the amount of time I did in the process and talking to people, sending emails, meeting with people. And so, as long as we were all working together as a town, I felt like even if it was laborious, even if I was
like sick as a dog, I would still go and make it work. And then, you know, moving and every one of those meetings was premised on fire being in the override. >> Yes. Yeah, >> you know, we had talked to >> that's why it was important to me to do a collective override. That's why this
was important. This is why I agreed to it and the terms changed >> and and I think that like whatever the reason is, whatever the timing was, like I'm not privy to the thought process behind it. I just know that it has basically all but guaranteed that the
override fails. >> I gathered from I'm sorry. What I gathered from Ms. Mi was that there is still a fairly significant safety risk on the override >> that I believe the voters will care
passionately about and that's staffing their ambulance the ambulance. >> I definitely agree with that response to a lot of calls. >> I think that like >> we're not we're not select >> the reality of what the override looks like and the political view of what the override looks like. If you say to
somebody, do you support fire? They're going to say yes. If you say, do you support uh you know 50% cut in PDM for non I forget how like they're categorized, it becomes very difficult to explain it, right? And like when we
have the discussion about the tiered override and then we had the discussion about like doing this together, doing this separately, all of it was pitched on this is a simple message. is we're in this together. >> And unfortunately, for whatever reason, I don't think that that's necessarily
the case anymore. And so, I think whatever we do, we're kind of just rearranging the chairs on the Titanic. >> I hate to be pessimistic. >> I don't know. You're so pessimistic and >> it's over. We're done. >> No, but you know what? Two years ago, I sat up there and I cried and I was very
emotional and I pushed us over the finish line and there were many many people that helped me and someone text me there's 66 people on this Zoom right now. Maybe that's not right, but I I I texted to ask so there are a lot of parents here that really want this to happen. >> OH, I I WANT THIS is now a school over
>> but this is the thing with the select board. >> The select board hasn't told us what their section is and the parents are going to carry this over the finish line. So that's where we have to So we got to keep our eye on the prize. We got to keep our eye on the prize with all of our >> So my eye on the prize is let's go with
1.6 or whatever. Let's tell the select board in a letter that we can they cannot go very high. They can't go over. We cannot go over $3 million. >> We can't look we cannot tell them what to do, Tony. But >> we can't do anything. They're going to
do what they want to do. >> But >> it's over. But we can put in writing what we want and the 66 people on this call who hopefully are listening in support of their kids can also email the select board and tell them that's what they want. And if they don't like the
idea and if they if they don't like the idea of the town override budget being part of the school budget, then they can email them and say just do a school override because the select board, you know, they have to decide >> work out. Um, and while I would hope
that not like last year, they would put it on the ballot if it passed at town meeting because that was a ridiculous, ridiculous display last year. So, I would like to keep our eye on the prize and just can we do a letter that says we support a $1.6 million override for the schools
>> and that says we're not discussing a lower tier than that. >> I I I think we should give them one number. the the more complexity that we add the worse it gets especially when we do not have the political >> will and the other thing I would like to say to any select board member I know
there's one in the room and also but when we come next week if we are having a tribe board meeting next week >> I would like the select board to tell us what their override numbers are because if I'm coming to a meeting next week just to be told our number has to come down that's just not like that is basically all the tri board has been has
been >> us sitting there everyone telling us that our number is too high the last few meetings where we have not seen a number from them. >> Here's the problem. The town charter gives the select board perview over all of this. We cannot tell anybody what to do.
>> I know that. >> But political will can make things happen. >> I know. I know. I know. >> I don't think it's a lost cause. I think that when we go over these cuts tonight, it's going to be clear what this is going to do to the school system, what
this is going to do to your pe to people's property values, what it's going to do to people who want their kids to be in, you know, maybe above the 50% that are below reading level. This this is going to matter. This is going to affect the future of the town. What
kind of town we become? Because we've been running so lean for so long. Things are going to tip this year without an override. >> So, can I So, who's going to draft this letter? And >> I don't know if we need a letter. >> No, I want it in writing. I want I try
board on. >> I know. I am 100% I do not want to talk about this with you all anymore. I love you all, but we have talked about this to death. ad nauseium. >> I think we should put one number. We'll have Dr. Fortuna's other number in our back pocket in case there's a will to do
a tiered override. And I think that if we put it in a letter that basically says that, you know, given what happened in the last 5 days, we feel it's best for the students of Lunberg to have >> one number, one number, >> 1.6 million. Dr. Fortuna says that that
is the lowest we can go to really not limp along and not have to be back in the ballot boxes next year. I mean, we may still need to be, but >> the idea the other thing that's a little frustrating is that the tri board meeting was pitched as working together and it was pitched as like projecting
out a three-year override and then it was no that's too big. You guys are asking for too much. So now this is >> we just we just all gave up and it wasn't it wasn't it wasn't finance or select board or us. We just like last
meeting we all basically were like it's too hard and I was like we've been saying that for you know since we like the budget task force everyone was like oh this is impossible and then like we produce something people like that's useless then we did the same thing at at the tri board meeting it's like guys it
is hard but we still have to do it and I think that by doing this thing where we have a tiered override the objection I have is that it is in some ways an inaccurate accate representation of the financial health of the town to the
voters. We're basically saying, you know, if you give us this lower one, it'll be great. But it's not cuz we're going to have to do it again. And so, like, the more that we have to go back to the well, the worse it gets. I'd rather just, you know, pull the band-aid off once and have it done. You know, Dr.
Fortunes projected this out, even though that was >> Yeah, our team worked on the projections. >> They projected out in FY29. She said on the record in front of the in front of the fincom that you know we're not we would be at level services provided you know one version of the
override pass. So like I'm fine with that but I think that like going in on a lower number and you know not >> and not trusting that the voters >> or not telling the voters that it's not accurate. We're going to have to do another one the next year. When you wear
your political hat, is someone going to get come to vote, right, and decide? Maybe they're going to decide based at a certain point that they're not going to vote for it. But in my mind, a parent who's coming to schools to vote is going
to vote for it whether it's 1.2 or 1.5. So, we want the 1.5. >> I don't think that I don't think that difference is enough to dissuade people who would vote for the override. just asked for the FY29 number and >> so we're all doing our own thing now. >> No, like I just I
>> No, no, no. We got to We still got to at least, >> you know, be nice and play together and >> So, so we're writing a letter. Tonyy's going to write the letter. >> It's going to say, are you going to Are we going to edit it or are we You're just going to leave. >> Two sentences. >> Yeah, that's fine. Two sentences.
>> No, >> this is We want one number. This is our number. We are done talking about this. >> This is our number. If you ask for a tier, we are ready for that as well. Done. >> It will be higher. >> Yeah, >> that's it. >> Okay. >> Done. All right. >> Okay. Can we talk about the >> Wait, before we go, let's
>> Wait, what number are we aiming for? >> Well, let's take a vote. Are we all in agreement that we are providing uh select board with one member? >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Okay. But before we do that is I'll make a motion. Can I make a motion? >> Can I make a I'll make a motion
>> to provide the select board with one number. Okay. And is there a second? >> Second. >> Second. >> All right. All in favor? >> I. >> All right. All right. So, now we are going to debate one number. I think that given Dr. Fortuna's advice to start out
with the 1.5. So, scenario C. >> I'm looking at 1.6. >> I will grab >> the 1.6 million scenario C po core budget. Um, I'm going to just go down the line and start with Emily. Are there things in here that you don't want in here? things that are not in here that
you want. Where are we at? >> Hold on. Look at the >> And also, I understand this is frustrating for people at home because it feels like so we can't talk amongst ourselves outside of meetings because of
open meeting law. We cannot have >> we we we have to do this here. We have to have >> we have to waste everybody's time >> and the select board has to do it too. They're beholden to the same open meeting laws we are. And so we got to do this week by week, meeting by meeting. And I understand it is incredibly
frustrating. Uh but this is what the law is. This is how it works because this is how we do things out in the open. >> Except the people that pass the open meeting law are not subject to the open meeting law. So that's a little bit of >> Okay, we're getting on the we're getting on the Emily.
>> I'm sorry. I just want to yell before I try. I mean, it's not ideal, but it's better than the alternative. So, >> is there anything any position or expense that you would like to put in or
any position or expense you'd like to remove? I mean the interventionist is concerning to me >> at the high school level. >> How many interventions will this give us at the high school after this loss? >> Zero. >> Zero. >> So they don't have any right now. This
would be an addition after the loss last year. >> No, we have one interventionist position right now. This zero. >> This would be a loss to the high school. >> They would lose the interventionist, >> but they would gain the bridge program. >> But you would gain the bridge program. Okay. And that's what you would obviously you'd love to have everything,
but if if if you have to choose, you feel like the bridge program is is >> that's what we've discussed. >> Okay. Sorry, I didn't understand. >> Can I read Can I read the for people who don't have this? >> Wait, let's let's finish and then
that's what I have to say. I don't I mean, I agree the bridge program is absolutely necessary, but so is an interventionist. So, it's I I don't love that we're losing that, >> but if we're, you know, >> you're the only teacher >> on the board,
>> and you were the only person that on the board that actually knows what this means. >> So, do you want to give us like an idea of why you would be okay with losing an interventionist if it means we keep the bridge program? >> Um, well, the >> the bridge program is necessary for the
students that are not getting it. I mean, we we cut the whole program last year. I was not on the school committee. I did not do that, but we as a whole did cut the bridge program. Um, so those students have no access really to what they need. I mean, an interventionist is
very important for the kids that are falling behind. Like we know at the primary school with their reading levels and things like that. At the high school level, it's a little bit different, but there's still gaps that need to be bridged. Um, no pun intended. >> I was like, that's pretty interesting. That's why it's called that because it
is essential bridge for kids returning to >> Yeah. I mean, I I'm not in Mr. Sandre's shoes. I trust his opinion on what's important right now. And I know he's not saying that an interventionist is not important. He's
weighing the worst possible scenario to figure out what we can do with our schools. Um I do worry that an interventionist is going to cause gaps in kids learning. the kids that need it that are falling behind since we've only had one at the high school this past
year. Um, and I know there's got to be more than one student on an IEP at the high school. So, >> or needing that interventionist support. >> I it's a not a great decision either way, but I I understand why he's he's pushing for the bridge program. That's
important as well. >> Not to harp on the co learning losses, but these are kids who >> Oh, yeah. My son as well. were third, fourth, fifth, and sixth. >> Yeah. >> No, second, third, fourth of next year. It'll be second, third, fourth, and fifth grade. >> When CO came, these are kids who were
learning pretty vital basics when CO hit and they're still in school and they're still trying. >> Yep. The two programs. Thank you for I I guess I came up here. I wasn't. >> No, I want you to. We want you. >> You can shout from the back.
>> I got stuff to say. So the two programs service two different students. So the bridge program is servicing students that may have been um in a subsparate but are on a graduation track. Intervention program >> targets kids that may drop out of school
and those become between 8 and 10. So um we tried to function without the bridge program. We were unsuccessful. That's why I'm proposing that that comes back in >> with the reduction of the intervention program, which has been extremely
successful keeping kids in our building, not choicing out to a good rich or a or or another alternative high school, saving us money from choice. Also, I also want to keep that in mind. >> I don't want to uh resurrect Tony's
analogy, but it is a tough decision between I'm never doing that again. That was like just a heartless way to put it. >> But it this is what it feels like like a puppy. >> What would things how would things work?
So I asked you this about the loss of the bridge program and the answer was uh you and Mr. McGrath said we're handling it. We we're doing what we can. Uh what >> I think you're getting confused between the two. You're I think you're with Mr.
McGrath, you'd be talking about the brid the interventionist at the middle school. We're talking about the high school, the bridge that >> what will it look like for you without an interventionist? Where do we fill those gaps? How how would that
those needs get? >> So, sometimes those needs will be met by our guidance department, sometimes they'll be met by our teachers after school. We don't have um a targeted person in order to meet those students needs. We didn't
have one three years ago. We put that program in a place that's been pretty successful. >> These are all tough decisions. >> Emily, can I do you mind if I hop in and ask a question? Mr. Sry. >> So, the the interventionist at the
Lunberg High School costs $161,64 under this proposal. Last year we spent $146,000 on athletic transportation. Which keeps kids in school more? How should we spend that money? >> That's a difficult question. I don't have the answer to question.
>> That's what it is. >> Athletics keep kids in school. Um that program targets like 8 to 10 students that we have determined it's very important for them to get a diploma. >> Yeah. >> So that's a that's a difficult question. I mean, when coach McDonald was here, he
talked a lot about how the athletics really like keeps kids on a path because it basically dangles a carrot out in front of them. And then when we met with the parents on the athletic boosters, they said something very similar. The data that we looked at last year talked
about the impact of athletics in terms of keeping kids in school. It was a it was you know that was a measurable statistically relevant and repeatable number over time. And so, you know, I know that it's asking you to compare
apples and oranges, but like what are the numbers like for truency and non-attendance and are those the kind are the kids that are generating those numbers are those people that could be reached you know
like if we said like uh you know if you if you don't come to school you don't play soccer is that an effective incentive incentive to get the kids that we have in the event that we can't fund the interventionist.
>> Um well, we kind of do have those rules, right? If you're not successful academically, you can't participate in academ >> and if you don't show up, you can't be in practice that day. If you don't come, you can't be in a game. So, we do have those kind of guidelines put into place for athletics. So the kids that are not
showing up that would be serviced by this interventionist are outside the reach of the current system with the athletic operas here. >> I would say the students that we are servicing I'm not going to stereotype it but maybe not be the athletic uh okay in
athletics. >> Okay. It's an interesting conversation, Tony, because I also have looked at the athletic transportation only, not the sports themselves, but the athletic transportation is $145,000.
Um, I really want sports parents involved in the override, and so I worry that cutting that transportation line item is a reason for sports parents not to be involved and to be upset that we are not
>> servicing their children. I'm wondering if could we if if Emily agreeing thinks that the interventionist is very important and we're still trying to stay at that 1.6 million. Is there a way we could do part of the sports
transportation? Could we charge people for sports transportation in a way that >> if we took out 50,000 >> like if we took part of it to pay for a part-time interventionist in that tier >> if we took out >> I know we're not supposed to do math on the fly Tony
>> if we took out 50,000 from sports transportation then we could make our override ask 1.7 >> what >> because it's >> I don't think we're going in the right direction >> I don't think we're going Well, I >> No, no. I'm talking about the core
services wait for services. >> I I think it's very Well, both programs are important. I think it's very important to note that in order to get to what I'm calling the core service
budget, we needed to make strategic cuts. >> Yeah. One was the high school interventionist. The other was the point 2 band. The third was middle school sports. >> And that point2 band gets rid of >> And that gets rid of fifth grade bands.
Yep. >> May I ask? >> Every single number in this core budget or every single item in this budget has a number except for that music teacher. >> It's 9,86. >> Sorry. Thank you. I must be on an old
version of >> I really think that >> Oh, that's still not the one in the link to >> That's okay. >> And I know I know I know that this is the way it goes and I don't want to like fl you or Chris, but like
>> 9,862 is not a lot of dough, >> right? >> Especially when we back in. We get a bunch of kids. >> He's like a bunch of kids. >> Thank you, Mr. All right.
>> Um, so the band I think they had like 75% of the kids participated in the fifth grade band. It was a ridiculous number. >> 90%. >> What? >> It's 90% of the kids that start at the beginning of the year finish. >> Okay. >> My two biggest classes of sixth grade
band this year right now >> than we've had in years. Last year when I went to the fifth grade band concert, there were as many at least as many kids on the stage as there were of their classmates in the audience watching. It is a very popular program. We are trying
to rebuild the band program. I think there's eight how 18 kids in the band this year. >> I was emailing people on the fly. So there's 18 kids in the band last year and Ms. Lockwood was talking about how the ban was decimated by budget cuts her when her children were young and the ban
fell to 30 people. >> Ask if you can take away some of the supply budget and please put that back. The music gators will step up and fill the supply budget. >> Okay. Wait, hold on. Time out. >> Time out. Time out. Time out. Wait. Wait. >> Yeah. >> I am happy to have any comments and we
can do comments. One of the things that I have been told I'm very bad at is managing like the back and forth. And the back and forth is probably a violation. >> And so what I want to do is I want to like try to stick to the budget, stick
to and then anybody who wants to talk, I'm not limiting your ability to talk. I want I just want to keep it in order and have it so that it's not a back and forth. The next person that was going to talk was going to be Mandy, but Mandy just stepped out. One more question. >> How many students does the bridge
program service >> or will it or will it service one put out or what did the bridge >> how many students did the bridge program service prior to being cut >> about 8 to 10 >> and do you foresee the same amount? >> We are in the middle of registration
right now and transitioning from 8 to 9 and I anticipate a similar number. >> Okay. And so the one teacher and the one pair professional you see as fit. >> Yes. >> For that. >> And to be clear for people, we're talking about like programs that keep
kids in school that get kids their high school diploma. Like this is what this is the stakes that we are debating right now is programs that will change a kid's life and the trajectory of their life.
Okay. and educating the kids, getting them that diploma is a basic thing this town should be doing. I'm really mad about this. >> All right. Um Emily, do you have any other questions or concerns about
>> Just a statement about the middle school sports. actually had this conversation with my son earlier because I was going back and forth thinking about it. Um because he did do middle school sports, but he was able to play on JB as an eighth grader and I know that that's an opportunity that some middle school
students can get and I also know that we have a lot of community less as well. Um, so that the as much as I hate cutting the sports at middle school, I it's not something that's
going to disappear for kids, there's still opportunities there for kids that want to play middle school sports, just not at their middle school. But there are lots of other ways that they can still
get that same community and sport. >> That's it. >> I'm done. >> All right. Mandy, do you have anything that you would like to see taken away or added to scenario CC core budget? This is the number we are giving to uh select
board. >> Yes. So, I'm going to I'm not happy about the interventionist in the general life, but I think that's what we have to do to get to a little bit of a lower number. I'm okay with that. I would ask that we add back the music teacher for
the 10 grand because we're still going to be under 1.6. 6 with that $10,000. And I think that that's an important program. And I agree about the middle school sports. You know, I I I think middle school sports are great. Um
fortunately, we have a lot of wonderful parents in this community and other folks who do run really great sports programs for middle school kids. And um I just think we have to lean on those in this time.
Is there anything that you would want uh removed? You talked about what you want to add back in. Is there anything you would remove either from the additions or from the the regular budget as has been presented to us in the past? >> So, I think it's asking a lot at this
point to rethink the I I let Dr. fortune to know this beforehand and I have said it. When we get to the cuts budget, I am going to recommend that we cut all high school sports
transportation of $145,000 in this budget. I want to keep some of that as because I think it's really important. I don't know if there's any way we could figure out how to again I don't want to put you on the spot, right? But like could we could that number come down at all and we
could transport kids who just need it or I don't know. So many seniors drive that it feels like some of it is a little bit and I understand there's team bonding on the bus. Like I mean I rode the bus when I was a kid, you know, when I went to sporting events. Um >> what about the kids that can't
>> Yeah, but people can but that are working full-time and can't get them to their games. >> I know. But I feel like people can carpool right now. This baseball and softball team, they practice at the at um Marshall Park and they get there. Those kids get there by car pooling with
the older kids. They >> Yeah, we can talk about that because I definitely have thoughts on that when we get to the cuts budget, but it's not under this. >> Do you have anything else you want to put in? >> No, that's it. >> I'm good. >> Laura, what do you want to put in? What do you want to take out? I want to say that just once it'd be really nice to be I don't know adding programs or adding a
teacher or lowering class sizes and I've been on the school committee three years and it's not fun. Um I mean I knew it wasn't going to be fun but this is just I don't know. I live in a town that just continuously chips away and it's it
would be nice to add something for once. Uh I have serious concerns about the interventionist. However, I'm not an educator and I'm going to trust what the principles say and what Dr. Fortunis says. And if it's a cut that we can live with,
then I'm going to have to trust them on that. But it hurts. And I would like to once again point out that like we are talking about the trajectory of students lives and where they end up and this town's basic duty to educate its kids and that is the stakes of what we are
talking about. Um, it's disappointing. Um, I'm not okay with cutting fifth grade band because I think the price is so low compared to everything else and I really think I know that we only recently added
the fifth grade band and I know it was a rather recent addition, but that kids need to start learning music around that age. It's incredibly beneficial for them. when we get them before middle school, we hook them a little early. And
I've seen what band does for kids. It does for kids what sports can do for kids. And there are some who do both. Um it's not an either or. It's not a binary. Um it's not something to compare. Um but I' I've seen what band
can do for kids. Um I know an inordinate number of children of students who are now going to college for something related to music education which they got that love through Lunberg schools and without the opportunities at Lunberg schools maybe they would not have
discovered that passion. Uh I really think we need the fifth grade band. I think that we're trying to rebuild the band. I think I think it's small money. I would rather take that from athletic transportation. Small money. Okay. Compared to the
>> No, no. I'm just laughing. If you if you're watching the edits, then I'm sure >> Oh, is she? >> So, I sorry. Um I I would rather take that money from transportation or um >> add it to the number
>> or add it to the number because it still won't change. >> It'll be it'll be very close. It'll be 1.6 now. Right. I'm not thrilled about eliminating middle school sports, but at that age, there's still club sports going on. And um
other programs, sometimes other towns have parks and rec programs for their students. >> Seventh and eighth grade also has the um opportunity to play JV. >> And I mean, >> she's really eliminating sports for sixth grade. >> Yeah. And I mean, my sixth grader
participated, it was fantastic. And now she's hooked and we just signed up for another season. But I I don't that one I think we have to cut. I'm not happy about it, but I'm not happy about any of this. So, um I' I'd
like to add back in. I'm getting the edits live. Um >> that's hilarious. >> So, I'm like looking at the old one. >> Do you have the live? >> Do you feel like you're hurting? >> No one other than school can see the live edits. Oh yeah. So that
>> Yeah, because we can edit the documents. >> There it is. Okay. >> It's just a small I >> I would very much like to add the fifth grade Bandon. I think it's one of those small things. It's not a lot of money to spend for the in the amount of impact it has on the
programming. Um >> done. >> Okay, let's do it. >> All right. Um Okay. Do you have anything else you want to add or take away? >> Not without swearing. >> Okay. Uh, I think that the core budget
is a good proposal for the override. I agree that we should add back in the point 2 music teacher. It is such a small amount of money. I And like if that's what ends up breaking the school, then you know whatever. I mean, it's
it's impossible for me to imagine that we can't work $9,862 back in when the town could find money for a fourth shift fire department. Just saying. Um, I am concerned about some of these
proposals if we were not suggesting an override. I am very I'm torn on a moral level about forcing people to pay for kids to be transported to school but not kids to be transported
to sports. I cannot in good faith reconcile that in my head. But as a political thing and as a thing to encourage the participation in support of sports, I am glad that their sports transportation budget is untouched in
the override proposal. So, as it exists now, if we were to eliminate the cut to the music teacher, I would be in support of the court budget. Um, I am a little concerned because we got a presentation
from Mr. Santry about truency and uh dropout uh and that is on the rise. I am wary that we do not have a full paniply of tools in Lunberg to deal with that. Um, I would never support sending
somebody to court for that and uh I mentioned that before. Mr. Sanchry convinced me that that was a terrible idea. So, uh, I just am worried that we know this is an issue and we are not addressing it. So, like if it gets worse, I don't know what we would do,
right? >> Do half positions exist for interventionists or is that one of those things where it's very difficult? >> It would be difficult to fill. So, um, so with that, I think I think I would be in support of this as a form. Do does anybody have anything else they
want to add or can we take a vote on this? >> Do you want to know what the deficit would be because sent it to me? It's now 1,61,140. >> Let's do it. >> Can you say one more? >> 1,61,140. You know, we could add the
interventionist back in and it would still be >> No, dude. We can't keep doing this. We got We got to just do it. We got to just do it. >> Say the number. Let's go. We can't keep doing this. >> It would still be 1.6, though. >> No, we got to We got to just do it. Let's do it. >> All right. It wouldn't Oh,
>> I am I am in favor. So, I'm going to >> I'm going to make a motion to accept the core budget as we just discussed as our suggestion to the select board for our override number. We are only recommending one number. >> All in favor? R8. Second. >> Second. >> All right. All in favor? >> I
>> I >> All right. Now we go on to the really unfun part. Balanced budget scenario D. >> That was the fun part. >> Would you like me to walk my public through this? >> Yes. >> Oh, actually, can I go back and I wanted
to read aloud the staffing additions? >> Oh, no, no, no. Let's just let's just focus on what Dr. has to do. Let's just keep going because we got a lot of bad stuff to talk about. So this is scenario five, the projected reality. >> This is if no override passes, what it
looks like. >> So the most immediate impact of this budget will be felt in the general education classrooms. The reduction of four classroom FTEEs, 2.0 at the primary school and 2.0 at Turkey Hill School is
going to cut at the heart of education. It will increase our class sizes significantly, pushing studenttoteer ratios to 27 to 30 students per classroom in grades 1 through five. This reduces the amount of individualized
attention each student can receive and places a heavier daily burden on our classroom teachers. In addition, we would be reducing interventionists. So, our classroom teachers would not have backup for classes that size. Additionally, a 0.2 2 FTE reduction in
the music department in this budget. This has to happen at Turkey Hill will result in tighter scheduling, larger class sizes for our arts programming and the elimination of grade five band. Our ability to provide targeted specialized to support support to struggling
learners will be stretched. The elimination of 1.5 interventionist positions 1.0 0 at primary and.5 at Turkey Hill will diminish our capacity to offer essential small groupoup reading and math interventions. Furthermore, the loss of 1.0 certified
occupational therapy assistant through attrition means that the occupational therapist will have to absorb higher case loads which could impact the frequency and flexibility of services for students with fine motor and developmental needs. Administrative and
operational capacities will be visibly reduced. By eliminating a 1.0 assistant principal through attrition, the primary school in Turkey Hill will now be forced to share a single assistant principal. Splitting this vital administrative role between two distinct campuses will
stretch leadership resources, delaying response to student behavioral needs, behavioral interventions, and daily operational troubleshooting. Additionally, the loss of 1.0 know custodian through attrition means that the daily upkeep of Lunberg High School will be managed by smaller teams. While
these reductions were carefully calculated to save catastrophic system failures, the school committee and public must confront the stark reality. Balancing this budget forces a damaging departure from the educational standards our community
expects. Moving forward, we are pushing our system to the brink, relying on unsustainability on the sheer resilience and dedication of our overextended teachers, administrators, and support staff to hold together a safe, supportive environment for our students
under immense pressure. >> Our ability to provide targeted specialized support to struggling learners is already stretched. So, just putting that out there. And also, assistant principles at the p Mr. Mr. Smith at the primary school is already doing far beyond what assistant
principles are hired to do. He's the principal, Miss Squire and Mr. Smith are already doing teacher duties and behavioral support and much much more than their every >> day. So, all while class sizes have grown,
>> right? >> Which means more behavioral issues, more kids not getting what they need. So pretty soon it's going to be snapped, not stretched. >> So just before we go to individual comments, I I want to reiterate a couple
of things. Number one, the town as a municipal government has an obligation to do very few things under the law. It can decide, for example, that it doesn't want to have a police department. It can decide, for example, it doesn't want to have a fire department. It might be ill-
advised, but there is no legal or constitutional requirement to provide those services. People might not like it, but you could get rid of trash. People might not like it, but you could limit how you pay for paving. The one thing that municipal governments are tasked with doing. And when people ask
us, why is the school such a pro high percentage of the town budget? It is because this is the only thing a municipal government must do. It must provide a free, appropriate, and public education. I do not believe that the
balanced budget would assure every child in Lunberg gets a free appropriate public education. I am deeply concerned that removing two full-time uh employees from the primary school, especially in light of the fact that kindergarten has
no PAR support, would compromise their ability to function. And it's not because we don't have great staff. It is simply that one person cannot do all these jobs. It is simply unacceptable. We are at the brink. We are flirting with legal liability and this is
absolute madness. It is dumb that we are even in this position. We live in one of the wealthiest states in the wealthiest country in the world and we are talking about trying to figure out how we teach kids to read. >> It's insane. All of the people who are
thinking, "Well, I'm a senior. I don't get any benefit from the schools." Remember that the people that provide you with services at your doctor's office or when you get older at the old folks home that you're at, all of those people are going to be people that have
gone through an education system. If you want the person who's dishing out your pills to be illiterate, then keep going. If you want the person who is providing you with food to be illiterate, this is a great idea. But for anybody who has
any sense of self-preservation or wants to live in a community, they have to understand that the balanced budget that Dr. Fortuna just presented is devastating, catastrophic, and potentially illegal. >> Um
I we talked about this earlier today sued for not giving kids what they need. Does that come out of our budget or the town budget? Town side, >> it comes out of the fate comes out of our budget either through settlements or having to pay out of district tuitions for students
>> because that's what's coming. >> Absolutely. >> We're not giving kids what they need. Um I I don't know how else to say it. We're failing with this budget. We are failing the kids in this town. I would trade in
potholes and worse roads. >> I can't even imagine teaching 30 first graders in one room. I I can't even imagine. >> I mean, I can't even imagine teaching 20 first graders, but we're not even sure 30 first graders would fit, right?
>> Yeah. >> Oh, thank you very much. >> Oh, can you mute? Okay. So, what Dr. Fortuna just said, "We're not sure we can physically fit that many kids in a classroom, but we're going to have to."
So, email the select board. I guess email your state legislators. You can email us, but uh you're definitely preaching to the choir because this is like I want to cry. Look, I'm having a really hard time
imagining what this is going to do for our kids. >> Dr. Fortuna, I had a question from a committee, a community member about how this seems very actually two questions that seems very Turkey Hill and primary school focused. Um, I know what I think
the answer is, but I think the answer is that the middle high school has taken more hits over the last few years, >> than anyone else has. Um, but I just wanted to make sure that that was the correct uh >> that is >> interpretation and that the kids in the
high school are so desperately close to not having enough time in learning >> that we cannot cut anything else at the high school. You are absolutely correct. Okay. >> All right. So, let's go down the let's go down the row. We'll do what we did last time. Emily, >> you can. >> Sorry. No, I'm just kidding.
>> Up first. the state supreme court said >> I'm allowed to swear just so everyone knows >> what are you looking for from me right now >> you're the only >> but what are you looking for >> I guess basically with what I >> what do you >> I don't agree with any of this but what do you want me to
>> Can we are you asking >> so let me ask you let me ask you a question >> you do this for a living >> not at a public school >> not at a public school >> so it's different >> and you you teach kids that have a bunch of different needs. Y
>> they all have learning differences. >> What would it be like to be a primary school teacher in a public school where you had 30 kids in first grade? >> It would be insane. And those 30 kids are not all typical learners. So we're we're talking about 30 kids in a
classroom and five to 10 of them could be on an IEP at that point because you're cramming so many kids into a classroom. it it would be impossible to meet the typical learners and the kids on
IEPs all their needs with one teacher and possibly a pair of professional in there somewhere. >> It's not you it's not feasible. >> Can I ask you a more generalized question? Do you think these cuts are
evenly distributed across the student body? I think given what we just discussed that the middle high school has had more cuts in the past couple years. It's fair in that way,
>> but like >> but we also have, you know, kids that we know that aren't reading at at grade level at the at primary and Turkey Hill and what's going to happen when they get to the middle high school. If we don't help them now, we're just we're just perpetuating a problem all the way up to
the high school where we're not going to have any interventionists to intervene. >> So part >> it's just a chain reaction. >> Part of the deciding factor more than possible hits that the high school took is we are close to being out of legal requirements for time and learning based
on the number of study halls due to the number of classes that we cannot offer students. And so cutting more staff members at the high school would lead to more study halls which would lead to even increasing that problem even
further. >> Right. And I have as a parent outside of the school committee, I have a student at the high school and I also have a student at the primary school who will be entering Turkey Hill next year. So I have the span of disappointment happening right in front of my eyes. Um
>> that's horrible. It's not as a parent, it's it's terrible. Like, I just What do I say to my my kids when they have questions about I have a 14-year-old who is very aware of things
that are happening? And I mean, it's having the conversation of cutting sports and transportation even. And it's it's just it's a lot for on them as well. Um, it's it's not
for anyone that thinks that it's feasible to have 30 first graders in a classroom. I'm sorry. You're out of your mind. It's it's not it just can't be done. >> It's my son is in a Spanish class with 30 students. That can't be done. So, in
I mean, it's not it's not going great, not gonna lie. >> So, imagine 30 first graders with with half of them with so many more needs than a 14-year-old at that point. It's just it's not gonna it's not going to work.
>> Mr. Irvan, if you want to >> I just based on what we're here want to keep Turkey Hill in the picture. >> Yeah. >> We're talking about >> 32 first graders, you know, think 30 fourth graders who are bigger than the first graders
>> fitting into the trying to fit in the same amount of space. Oh, most fifth graders get >> as smelly. I mean, I know third grade is looking at 28 to start the school year. Um, and as a a educator who taught 30 kids in a first grade classroom,
>> yes, you can do it, but it's not optimal. We end up with more referrals for special education because as a classroom teacher, I cannot give students the attention that they need. the students who are um getting it for whatever reason, whether it's because they got a lot of support at home or
they're just naturally bright, don't get the extension extra attention they need because I need to focus on those kids in the middle and those kids closer to the bottom get up and then a lot more time is spent on going to the toilet, passing through
hallways, getting paper together, putting on mittens, wiping noses. that takes away from time that we'll be spending in education. The large class sizes are a pitfall for all of us across the
district. Um, but as I said to somebody this afternoon, we only get so much for our allowance and we have to decide how we spend that. The decisions aren't always >> best. Yeah. Great.
>> Student Representative Cara, >> may I ask a question? Not necessarily even as a student representative here because I know most of my peers would probably disagree with me on this, right? But your requirement is to provide an education. Why are we looking
at so many staffing cuts to education before looking at any extracurricular cuts? And I am a kid who has been here for years talking about how much my extracurricular activities matter to me, but not at the expense of our most vulnerable students losing their
opportunity at an equal education. >> And I think that's something for the school committee to decide. We would still if we even cut the entire athletics program. Yeah. At the high school, we would still have a deficit we'd have to make up. >> Yes. But why why are we spending
$150,000 on athletic transportation, but not $150,000 on interventionists? >> Yeah, I think we need to look at that. >> We need to talk. >> I'd like I'd like it if we could go through the budget and go through things that we've highlighted. I know there I
had some questions on certain things and there's a >> Let's go down and then we'll do that. But let's go down. Randy, I want to get your thoughts on the balanced budget. >> I really don't have much to say because I'm going to cry, honestly. Um, you told me today. >> You told me I couldn't cry.
>> Same rule as League of Your Own. There's no crying. >> There's no crying in baseball. There's no crying in school committee. Um, so yeah, I'm just going to say I'm willing to cut all of the transportation for sports and I'm willing to cut the trainer. I just I can't justify those
costs in this budget. So that's all I want to say. Um and you know I have two kids who have needs that are beyond what um a traditional classroom sometimes can provide.
And at some points parents like me are going to get to the point where their kid can't come to Lubenberg and that Tony gives me a hard time that I'm a towny. But be it would be devastating to me if I had to pull my children from my community.
She's going to make me cry. >> I'm sorry. >> No, I've been thinking the same thing, >> right? >> Is I love her. >> I have a second grader who is not He's really great. Like some of you guys saw him in the back. He's really great when
there aren't 30 other kids in the class. He's going to be at Turkey Hill next year. If there are 30 or 32 kids in his class, I'm mad at myself for moving to the stem. >> I failed my kids by living here. Um,
great. Mandy just I feel like I failed my kids by moving here to a town that cannot provide an adequate education for its kids. And I am mad. I'm mad at the select board for being able to cut from their budget enough to fund a fourth ship for the
fire department easily. I mean, not easily, but >> they could do it without crying. >> Now, we're talking about cutting programs that let kids graduate high school,
which let me tell you, changes the trajectory of some of these kids' lives. And we are failing our kids. And I think this is one of the basic jobs of a town is to provide its kids with an education. I have spent so much time in the past few weeks defending the concept
of public education to people in this town in positions of leadership and I am so mad I'm sorry I don't want to yell. I am so mad about it and having to defend the concept of public education which started in Massachusetts. The first
public school in Massachusetts was in 1635. And 400 years later, you think you got new ideas about public education. You taxpayers shouldn't have to pay for kids to be educated. Great. Don't ever go to a doctor younger than you. Don't
ever go to a pharmacist younger than you. Don't ever utilize services that require education from anyone younger than you. Enjoy getting old. I've just I've it this is what a society needs to do.
This is what a town needs to do. They need to make difficult choices and they need to prioritize what's important. This is what's important. We are talking about kids' lives. I I don't know what my kid and I'm not just thinking about my kid. I'm thinking about all the kids
who cannot be in a class with 30 kids. I'm thinking about the high schoolers who cannot get the electives they need to to get into the college they want to to eventually get >> to eventually get the career they want
to. >> If we're cutting things so much we are we are affecting kids we're affecting people's lives for the rest of their lives. I don't know how to I'm so
tired of having to explain that to people. I just if if you're a parent, if you live in this town, if you support kids, you need to start emailing elected officials and appointed officials about how important this is and where our priorities are.
>> And you need to support the override and you need to come to town meeting and you need to vote and you need to send me an email or find me on Facebook so you can come and talk to other people. >> May 2nd and May 16th. This is I mean I don't know what to say about it because it's it's the puppies like it's so bad
but pick a puppy that does the least amount of harm. I mean this is just I do want to say the reasons that class sizes are going to go up with this scenario is because this should have happened last year and the school committee was
horrified about it last year. We decided to I'm not going to get on that. we decided to wait for an override to do a comprehensive override because we knew that the fourth shift for the fire department was looming. Uh and we decided to wait for a comprehensive override. And
I don't know if you remember that really fun meeting with 195 slides. Um we we worked very hard to make adjustments and cut expenses to the bone and make some very difficult cuts to keep the classes where they are. It
would be a lot worse this year if we hadn't. But we're at make or break. There's This is what has to happen. Um there's nothing I can these are all terrible choices, but there's nothing I
would swap out except I think we need to go line by line and talk about athletic transportation. Um I did want to ask Dr. Fortuna about the cost of extracurriculars uh because I think some of those are funded by student activity fees.
And the cost overwhelmingly for doing them is very little compared to what we need to cover. >> I'm just not sure there's that much money there. But we should hear about it. >> I'm just ask so much on athletic transportation. >> I would like to go through the budget
line by line. I think we owe that to the public to look at it. >> We're not going to go through it line by line. >> I think we need to go through the changes. What's changing? Yes. The select board. It's too much. Well, it will not be what? >> Not line by line. There are changes. I would like to talk about
>> 1,700 lines. >> Okay, there's 43 and we don't have to have to do that on each one. >> We don't have to look at the things that aren't changing. Not changing. >> We can just go to the big ones. Like I don't want to look at the yellow market line. It never matters. >> No, but I would like to talk about
athletic transportation. I would like to talk about changing how we're go line by line. I want to talk about the athletic trainer and I want to talk about how we're categorizing um the athletic director because I'd like to >> Okay,
>> I I talked to Dr. I'd like to change how we categorize the athletic director. I don't want to change what we're doing. I just want to change how we're categorizing it budget-wise for the future. >> Um >> Okay. >> And I'd like to point out uh where we did make big cuts.
>> Okay. We'll we'll do that. I just want to give my input real quick and then we'll I'll make it fast. So, I would not support the balanced budget as it is currently drafted. I appreciate the time and effort you and Chris spend in this, but I believe that uh we need to fund
curricular before we fund extracurricular. I am uh you know the the elimination of the Department of Education by the federal government is a bad thing, but to the extent that it eliminates federal funding for schools, it means that we no longer have to
comply with Title 9. And so cut everything that we can without the restrictions of Title 9. I think that we should cut every sport. I think that we should cut every athletic funding, uh transportation budget. I think we should cut every band item, every every single
piece of the theater. I think that we should cut anything that is not related to teaching kids class. I know that sounds terrible, but it is not fair to place the burden of adult budget mismanagement on the shoulders of
children who depend on us for education. It's it cannot this cannot be our budget. You know, if we eliminate athletics entirely, we would save about $500,000. If we eliminated sports transportation, we'd save $145,000.
That's, you know, 645, you know, 645,000 right there. I think that if we eliminate all of the other extracurriculars, school would be miserable. And I get that. But I cannot justify funding the extracurricular
before we fund the curricular. It just it cannot happen. It it is it is not fair to say to a kid in primary school, we're going to cram you in on this, you know, like tiny little desk cuz we don't have enough room, but we're going to pay
$145,000 for uh 303 students in the high school to travel around the state of Massachusetts to participate in sports. And if we don't have Title N because we don't have the Department of Education, what we can cut looks completely
different. And I don't want to, you know, like I would never do something on purpose to discriminate, but if we don't have to follow the rules anymore because there's no federal funding, then cut everything. Cut everything until we get to a balanced budget without impacting
actual classrooms. I cannot I I will not support any budget that does not place the extracurricular on the chopping block before the curriculum. And if if that's you know miserable, so be it. That's the town's decision. You know,
elections have consequences, votes have consequences. These are the consequences. I would much rather be in the position that Deb Z was talking about when we were talking to the athletic people and she had said we cannot I am tired of hearing this this
mantra of we need to do this like a business and these are not widgets these are children I 100% agree but if if the gun is placed over our head and we don't have any money then we've got to cut the extracurricular before we get >> it's always the gun stop but the gun >> it's always a gun because the metaphor
works people got I I I just, you know, like, no, I I am not cutting more educators at primary school. I'm not cutting more educators at Turkey Hill. I'm not cutting an assistant principal. Uh I would cut the music teacher. I would not cut an
interventionist. I would not fill the custodian. But then it would be sports, transportation, sports, and you know, like if people want to fund it themselves or find some way to fund raise, I'm happy to let them
use the fields. But like we cannot have a budget where we as a school are obligate are are getting rid of our obligations to do school things. I just I can't like it. It's never going to work. I would not vote for this as it
exists. So I I know that's a really unpopular position, but it's the way it has to be. >> The other thing is I do think that there is some strategic value as opposed to just slash and burn to get down to what we need by cutting athletic
transportation. >> The athletic transportation uh contract is an op option for first refusal. And so what that means is we do not have to use the bus to do athletic transportation. But if we do put a bid
out for athletic transportation, it has to go to DBUS first and then they can reject it. And so if we don't have to use them, in other words, we don't lose money by saying no. Then we say no and the next year we have a little leverage to negotiate with them. So instead of
saying to them, here's our $146,000 and next year here's our $153,000, we say to them, you know what, next year we're not doing this at all. There's no athletic transportation. You can just eat the $146,000 loss. And then the year after that, we come back and say, look, we would like
to do this again, but you need to be more reasonable in your pricing. And if we don't do that, if we don't have the leverage from the actual we got rid of this, I don't think they're going to believe us. I think they're going to just keep raising the prices every year.
And so if we have to make a cut, a cut that has two purposes. One, to save money, and two, to give us leverage in future negotiations, it seems like a good one to make. >> Mr. Chair, I just want to say that athletic transportation we cut as one of
our cuts already. It's 127. It's not 100. Okay. I just want All right. State. >> I would still cut it. >> Yeah, I know. Goodbye. >> Just wanted to state it for the record. >> Yeah. I I this this balance budget is is an atrocity.
>> So can we go through this list of adjustments that Dr. Fortuna has suggested to us that we all agree is horrendous, right? But are there any of these we can I don't even want to say live with. Do you know what I mean? I just want to say like like what is the
least whatever and then we can talk about the trans then we can at least add those numbers. Like for example, the point 2 music teacher at Turkey Hill, the custodian. Obviously, I want those people, but like like I feel like those are two that if we have to go there, we
have to go there. I mean, the occupational therapy assistant through attrition that sucks. >> I got some questions about that one. >> Yeah. >> Just um what's going to happen without it? Will we be in compliance? >> Everything sucks with the IEPs.
it will be difficult to stay in compliance with the IEPs and we're doing some really wonderful work for students that aren't non IPS that have sensory needs right now and that will stop >> and those kids may end up having to go to outplace oh this is going to cost us
in the long run I >> oh that that I mean when we did the study on the air conditioning we learned that >> we learned that the short term is all that matters >> it's this town we're just interested in the right now instead of being proactive active and solving problems before
>> eye on the prize. Eye on the prize if we're being >> right. I'm not trying to be difficult, but I just like we got to get our eye on the prize because we got to sell this, right? We don't want this. We got to sell what we where we're going with. >> So, going through this budget and the large increases, the legal our legal
expenses, we have budgeted more. We increased that by $15,000. We had to because um we have more legal expenses and I'm telling you we're going to have more. Um what else? I'm looking at we cut
special ed legal services. >> Yeah. >> Um and that's based on actuals. >> Okay. Um >> all right. I had some Okay.
All right. The ELLL supplies. We cut. >> So, >> while lawyer's doing that, if we cut the certified occupational therapy assistant through attrition, the custodian through attrition, the music teacher through uh through a regular cut, we cut athletics,
band transportation, and athletic transportation. We would be over the $800,000 number. How much are the athletics? >> Athletics plus band transportation is $58,745.
>> Athletics are 500 3,745 >> total. Total all in. >> How much comes in through the uh athletic fees? I know it's it's negligible, but I think we need to talk about it with the public, right? Like when people pay their athletic fees, >> you know, what is that paying for?
>> That's paying for a lot. Um, Chris, >> give Chris one second. Yeah. Yeah, no problem. Because I think that >> would it be possible to look into oneway transportation? >> I did a little research on some of the communities that do one way. So, they
would be busted from school and then parents or home because most kids are not going to be able to get to sports >> without transportation. But parents will be home to pick up more often than not.
For those that have that ability, which but if we're talking about cutting sports all together, then that doesn't matter. But I'm just putting that out there. >> There's a there's a one-way busing that would cut it in half essentially because the bus wouldn't have to sit there and wait for kids to be done. Bring them
home. >> No, I don't. >> I also have a question about if we're charging kids to get bus to school. Are there actually bus fees separate from athletic fees for trans? Oh, there are. Okay. No, but
>> No, no, no. There is no separate bus. >> Athletic busing. So, >> there is no athletic. >> The athletic fee is supposed to in some part offset that. It's just we hadn't raised athletic fees in a really long time and so we did last year and now that's supposed to be offsetting some of
it and it's just not enough and athletics are expensive especially to do them >> safely >> to do them as well as we do. I mean like we are talking about cutting sports
the year the year that the girls indoor track were state champions. That is insane. Insane. >> And it really affects kids staying in school. There are some kids who go to class so they can participate in sports. And we have an incredibly high
participation of sports in Lunberg. It is >> 48. Yeah. 48.5% of the high school kids. Correct. >> Yes. So 48.5% of the high school kids at participate in at least one sport. That's
half of the kids at the high school do at least one sport. That's a lot. It's very important to them and it is a for a lot of people it is a core part of the high school experience. And I I used to not get it and then it was explained to me to someone who said
my kid would not have graduated high school if they hadn't have had sports. They just wouldn't have gone to class. They wouldn't have gotten up in the morning. Like we're talking about the truency and the chronic absenteeism. that's going to go way up because there are kids I know that when grades are bad
the coaches come and talk to the kids. It's an integral part. And I also want to talk, I was at a wellness advisory meeting and one of the things that they asked the kids, they surveyed the kids on, do you have a trusted adult that you can talk to with a problem? And 25% of
the kids said no. And that is up from the last time that question was asked on a different survey in I think five years ago. That number has increased. >> I think so. But those coaches are important. Those relationships are
important. This is >> But like when we talked to the booster parents, the athletic booster parents, >> it was very clear to me that the coaches do an excellent job of making sports an incentive to stay in school. And by
going to a balanced budget where we cut sports, we heard two things. Number one, the families would leave. Unfortunately, I think that there there's a contingency of the town that would be happy to see the down drink. The same people that are like, "No, I don't want to drive through
Dunkin' Donuts." Those are >> But I also think that one of the issues that we have is if the kids aren't coming to school or the sports aren't there and the kids aren't coming to school, what does that look like for those kids? I mean, it's
not a good scenario. like this is not, you know, like >> I'd be okay with >> it's very bad. >> I'd be okay with cutting transportation while acknowledging there is a huge equity issue there. I'd be okay with cutting transportation significantly
while still leaving some ways so that Mrs. Burns could make >> very difficult decisions. So, I guess it'd be okay with passing it on her. So, which is not fair. >> But we wouldn't have an athletic director. We wouldn't have this. We're not right. We definitely
>> we would we would end up saving if we cut all sports, sports transportation, band transportation, the salary of the trainer because we would need a trainer, the salary for the uh the athletic director. We're at 7 and then >> I don't think that's I just think
>> then we're at and we cut the certified occupational and the music the music teacher and the custodian. We're at $757,470. >> I I personally cannot vote for a budget that does not have any sports in it. I I I was crying over here about the whole
thing, but I just personally cannot do that. So, I'm happy to take >> We'd have to present a balance, but >> So, yeah. So, I'm telling you what I'm So, the band transportation and the sports transportation I think are number one, two, and the trainer. So, that's three, right? >> I actually I would prefer we went to a
halftime trainer. I I have really evolved in my thinking of the athletic trainer when I went and looked up the stats. Athletic trainers keep kids alive and it's a little horrifying how important they are. I'm okay with a halftime one or cutting that down as far
for what we can hire. I don't know if we can hire one, but >> getting rid of it wholesale I think >> if something happened next year, >> I don't know how I'd live with myself. And I think that the stats on athletic trainers are very clear as far as
>> I I just can't get behind that because like how do we >> these kids have doctors. These kids who have the trainer have doctors. If they get hurt, they come out of the game. The option is >> always >> well then they need to just come out of the game. The option is a trainer or a kindergarten teach or a first grade
teacher. I just can't >> I can't I can't vote for a budget that has a trainer in it and not enough >> different >> and not enough first grade teachers. >> If we if we toss in this the the assistant principal loss through attrition, we're over the $868,918.
>> I'm not I cannot So what do you want to cut, Laura? >> I cannot support cutting sports. All of it. I just >> What? There's nothing else that we can cut that's not going to impact education. I mean like we really don't >> sports impacts education is what I'm saying. I really think it doesn't.
>> But it is not education in and of itself. >> But I think we're going to see a lot less kids graduating. I think we're going to see a lot less kids going. >> I'm just going to say >> you're going to see a lot less kids. >> The mean thing is like that's that helps the budget, >> right? >> No, because then we don't get those that
money. We don't get that chapter 70 money. It actually doesn't help them. >> We don't know that. That's >> Yes, we do. Chapter 70 is based on enrollment. >> Stop coming, Tony. We don't >> right. It's based on other things. >> No, it's based on enrollment. It's an enrollment number. >> Yeah.
>> So, I mean, I don't mean to like it's an enrollment number. If we have 50 kids who leave Lunberg, we lose 50 kids worth of money. >> I I don't disagree. I'm just saying that like you know like if your goal is to have the smallest taxes possible and
municipal government then all of these things that we are threatening those people with are like sounds great to me like we've got to see how the other side sees this and if you're saying like like you know parents are like well I'll just leave that's one less cost that those
people have to pay right like that is not an in that is not an argument that will incentivize those people to vote for an override it's just I think we need to plan this with the thought that an override might not pass and we have to live with it and now we've got
>> 50 kids who've school choiced out. >> We don't have a choice. I mean like if we lose kids because of athletics or we lose kids because they have 32 33 kindergarteners like they're going to lose them one way or the other. I would rather do our core function of provide
education. I I would not like to do any of these things, but if we have to cut one, we should cut the one that we are not obligated to provide. >> Wait, what's So if we just cut athletics, but athletic transportation,
but not >> I think only gain you $124,000. >> Yes. Because of the way they recalculate, it's just not enough. >> So that if we cut that, we cut what's the ban transportation? Five grand. If we cut the uh attrition
of the um assistant principal, >> that's 152 grand. >> Okay, that's good. Then we cut the custodian and the what was the other thing? >> Music teacher. >> The music teacher and the occupational therapist. So what if we just keep >> if we what can we cut to keep the four
classroom teachers >> sports? >> You would. >> I know, Tony, but I'm just telling you I'm not sure the rest of us are going to like you can say that, but we have to agree. >> I understand WE WE DON'T HAVE A whole lot of choices. That's what I'm trying to This is why I called it what I did.
>> Yes. But then you spent the first 15 minutes of the meeting telling us how terrible the override prospects were. You think you want us to like >> you like this? There's no traffic. But that's another >> There's just no other way to do that. Folks, >> we need to find $376,830
to keep the four classroom teachers. I mean to me the four classroom teachers of anything I mean the educators in the room I don't know all of these positions are important but to me the four classroom teachers I just can't even >> I don't know what do you think Emily you
work in these you work in >> stop putting you >> No I don't well the educators who are here the principal is is that >> we can give you the numbers because we know the numbers of what your class >> can you talk to the like I'm sorry I had
someone text me when when mystery Bond was speaking that they couldn't hear him. >> We should just mic them up and >> I want to say sorry because I know this is happening. >> So we can give you the numbers of what class sizes are going to look like. You guys are going to have to make the decision. >> Yeah.
>> So right now because I just had two kids enroll >> in as of today. So my first grade number went to 121. >> Mhm. How many >> that gives me? If we go to four teachers, I have one class at 31 and
three at 30. Yeah, we in my kindergarten because I just had a student enroll. So, I have 114. That puts my first grade classes. I will have two at 28 and two at 29 >> with no parents. >> I thought we were still at five for kindergarten. >> No, this those are for next year. So,
that's my first and second grade. >> Yes. Okay. >> Oh my god. >> The kids going to Turkey Hill that are in second grade. we have 113 kids. It was 28 per class with 112. So now you're going to have one that's going to have 29 and three at
28. So those are some things that you have to decide, right? But so I'm asking you as an educator, right? An interventionist versus a classroom teacher in these positions. In my opinion, who knows nothing, right? I would think maybe we would want more classroom teachers so
you could have smaller class sizes than restoring an interventionist. Is that >> is that what you would say? >> Um but we're not talking about restoring >> or cutting an interventionist. Sorry. So on this list I'm looking at right here. Right.
>> She made this. She helped. >> Well, let's ask Dr. Fortuna this question. >> Yeah. Because I I can talk to you about potentially what could happen in my building next year. Yeah. >> Um I don't know if you want me to go there or you want me to hold that. >> Hold for a minute. >> Okay.
>> So I personally, and I haven't discussed this with my principles yet, I personally think a smaller class size over an interventionist is more important. >> Yeah. So that's why I'm saying these I am not going to vote for any budget that
cuts these four teachers. I know Tonyy's not going to vote for any budget that cuts all of these things. >> No, no, no. I would I would not cut the four teachers. I would not cut the interventionist or the interventionist at Turkey Hill. I I would I would be okay with all of the
other cuts, >> but we still need to make a gap the gap, >> right? So, can we fill the gap with the four classroom teachers, the two interventionists? >> I know Chris is probably running the numbers over there. Mr. numbers guy.
Well, let's figure out how we can because that's what I that's >> So, you want to keep the interventionists as well? >> I don't think. >> Yes. Yes. So, let's say if we kept the classroom teachers and the two interventionists, >> but I do feel like I have to ask you
about central office, too, because there are no central office cuts on this >> this thing. Again, I'm not >> No, it's good to ask because we are going to get that criticism. Why aren't there cuts to admin? The answer is >> the answer is we have very little admin
to begin with and there absolutely is nowhere to cut at essential office and be able to support classes of this size or not having interventionists. >> Dr. Saki is servicing at least two students that I know about and probably
more that she has put on her case. >> Yeah, she is um um one little girl with um a different reading profile. She's servicing a student who is learning English. So that is what our director of
teaching and learning is doing right now in case anybody wonders. in addition to providing professional development and support to classroom teachers. >> And so >> to be clear, the curriculum office started off the year with three people
and is next year will be one person. Correct. >> So there are >> there are reductions in that >> because of the way we budgeted grants. It's not going to be reflected in the budget but that is what >> Yes. >> That is what happened. Central office has been decreased. >> Yes.
>> Okay. I just want I you know >> and there is no >> so the the other place that we could go is the assistant business manager and the state reporting secretary and keep the status quo. Yeah, >> that's something that I heard very strongly from the committee was a
priority and that >> that's why I haven't put it. >> The only non- studententf facing position I would never be willing to get rid of is the person to assist Chris. >> I think that just good business practices require we have one at one
person to back him up. We learned the hard way. The town learned the hard way. That is not I I just I it is the only thing that like I said other than people that are actually student facing that I I would not I would not be able to vote against. I just couldn't do that. I
could not. >> So if we're going with the two the four classroom teachers and the interventionists keeping those, we'd have to cut how much? Right. >> $566,435.
Chris, is that what you're getting to? >> Okay. So, if we cut the trainer and we cut the uh school the transportation, we still have to find $300,000. >> No. Oh, yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. >> I mean, the other thing that we could
do, >> I mean, I'm I'm okay that sports taking a haircut. I even more than what I'm saying. We have a lot of sports offerings. Can we >> I I'm just saying I think I can't support no sports. >> What if we did it so that there was like
one sport for one sport for each side for each season? >> Each side. >> Each gender. >> Yes. There you go. I was thinking like yes between like indoor track and basketball when we have teams for each
that are both in the winter who both >> I mean like one way we can do it is like numbers would matter what gives us the biggest bang for our buck right >> how many kids for each >> how much does it cost how many kids >> a track team can also support a lot more kids than a basketball team >> sure >> so
>> but like those are decisions that we as the stu as the school committee are not expertise we don't have any expertise that it just seems stupid for us to like pick and choose, >> right? We would need so who paid chooses. I think that's >> or we just I >> Well, that's why you'd have an athletic
director, >> right? So, we could work closely together, >> right? We could technically say to the athletic director with Dr. Fortuna, we'd like you to tell us if you cut 200 grand from the sports budget what that would look like. >> We need 300 grand. >> Well, I know.
>> I guess, >> right? >> I mean, like I I agree. I think that we can like cut some but like the problem is twofold. Number one, last year the school committee did not disperse cuts
evenly across the board and as a result certain places got hit and other places in in the budget did not and now we are coming back but this time we have more pressure because the financial gaps are larger. So it's like okay now what do we
do? We are going and like I do not foresee this problem getting better next year to be frank. >> Thanks for all the good news for hanging out with us. Especially if the override doesn't pass this year. We are going to do this again next year and we will not have anything to cut.
>> I will I'll move. >> I mean like it just >> I don't know what to do >> guys. We've got to we've got to face the facts that we need to make big cuts to get down to the balance budget. >> I have a question as well. So, at the high school level for extracurricular
activities, not including sports, but every student pays a baseline fee of $55, >> but there is no like additional fee for doing multiple activities. >> Yes. >> So, what would the possibility of maybe let's say everyone pays those $55, but then for each extracurricular activity
you do on top of like your first one, you pay an additional $55. Because I know I do like four or five clubs that don't have separate fees. >> Yeah. Like there's no way I am like contributing an equal amount to the kid who does one club.
>> The the problem is none of the extracurriculars are even close to being self-sustaining. So like in order to make them self- sustaining the fees would have to be so large that essentially no one could afford, right? And that's the problem. It's the same problem with sports. Like when you combine the athletic fees and
the gate, it's an insignificant. It's like what, like 132,000. So it's like it's it we're an order of five off. So it's just, you know, we could do it. It just would mean that
the the parents have more of a burden. And and I think this is one of the reasons why I I don't think we should be in the business of picking and choosing. It would it would unfairly impact certain kids, right? Like when we talked to the the sports boosters, Karma made a
point about like, you know, she makes sure that everybody gets to participate and if if we make it a feesbased system, then the kids that can't afford it won't participate. And that would be I mean all of this is bad, but that would be
like a sort of salt wounds kind of injury. >> Coaches are are stipens, right? The pay rate of that is determined by the contract. Yeah, it's covered by the >> because we're looking at 159 for coaches and if we cut half the sports,
>> it' be it wouldn't be an even it would depend on what sport each sport has a different stipend >> and how many coaches they have and >> I mean like track that's a ton of kids and I feel like less although we got to drive them
and Okay. So, eye on the prize. So, we're looking at $500,000 or so, >> right? Or what did you say, Chris? I'm sorry. 580. Was it 580 or was it >> for the four teachers and the interventionist? >> Yeah.
>> Four teachers and >> we have to let the interventionist go. >> Right. So, we cut the school, the transportation, the best the band transportation, the trainer, and then we need to find another 200 to $300,000 to
save the interventionists and some of the classroom teachers. >> I don't think cut halfs would do that. Can we cut the half the sports and keep the interventionists at the primary in the classroom teachers? I I don't
like any of this, but like we have to decide. I'm >> The problem is the sports are not equally expensive, >> right? I I'm just I'm just telling the public I I I don't like any of this. Like I don't want to be doing this. This is not a fun way to spend your Wednesday evening. >> No. Which is why one of you should join us. It would be really great.
>> If you too would like to be miserable and talk about >> right math by committee, please join us. >> Like I know, right? >> Really good at spreading. >> Oh my god. Laura really good.
>> No, that wasn't. >> Okay. Question. >> Yes. >> The statute only obligates us to bus certain people. If we did not bus anyone who was not statutoily required,
would a would our contract with debus pro allow us to reduce the number of buses and b how much would that take us? >> Liz, >> did you hear that question? >> No. Come up and answer it. Um, I'll say it again. Repeat it.
>> It's about busing. >> You have more of a handle on the busing than I do. Just come up to the mic. Come up here. >> Oh, come up here. >> So people can hear your answer. Okay, >> I'm challenge.
>> We're going to keep moving. We're going to keep moving forward. We have to or we have to. We have to. >> All right. Ready? >> Here's the question. >> Okay. >> The statute for busing obligates us to bus a certain set of kids, but not all of them. >> Right.
Number one, if we only bus the people we are statutoily obligated to, >> would that be permissible under the debus contract and reduce the number of buses we use? >> It would be permissible. They don't agree with doing that. I've talked to
them about >> take us to court, >> right? >> Sounds good. >> I've talked to all of the to them about this before. We've talked to them at length about that. Um, their suggestion is to bust all students. >> Of course. >> Obviously. >> Yes.
>> As a salesman, my suggestion is you buy all the things I'm selling. >> Exactly. >> Okay. >> But we're obligated to >> um, as it says in policy and as says in statute, like you said, we're obligated K through six. >> 7 through 12, we are not obligated to.
>> And then it's like a radius, right? >> Right. If we bust only the people we are statutoily obligated to, >> how much money would we save? >> You're putting me on the spot here, Tony. I would have to really go back and look at that.
>> Like a hundred thou like ballpark it like a 100,000? >> Yeah, I would say about >> or 200,000. >> So we could do that. >> Yeah. >> Now that means that we're going to have kids walking on that. >> How are kids going to get to school? >> See, that's the problem. >> Stupid. No,
>> that is really the biggest problem is the lack of sidewalks. >> Yeah. >> In town is the problem. >> Your middle school students building anyway, >> right? >> Yeah. >> But if it saves us like 100 grand, >> we could change the hours that sixth grade goes to
>> I just think safety is a factor there. I think safety is a big factor there. I mean I trying to a different building because now >> our class sizes would be smaller because we're trying to >> we don't have any space at other buildings for sixth grade. >> All right.
>> So you think like at best it would be $100,000 and we'd run into safety concerns. >> We're not not going to bust the kids. I >> Right. >> All right. I'm not saying I'm just trying to find another >> We have to find >> We're not going to not give kids transportation to school
>> so that only parents who don't work can get their kids to school or people who are available. I'm not doing that. >> Anything? >> I'm willing to examine possibilities, but we're not going to not give kids buses to school. >> Chris is raising his hand. Do you think he found $500,000?
>> It was a total joke. I think this is just proving people like >> I don't think it's to everyone like >> I think there's a lot of people in town government who think that we're >> had who think we're asking we're putting it all out there.
>> Good evening. So one of the things um I was just looking at and just had a conversation. What if we reduce the uh equipment line for Chromebooks? Um, that's a pretty large line and I'm
not sure what the rec uh, not the recycle, what the replacement on them is. >> Um, and that's an idea. >> How much would that say? >> 429 I believe is no. >> 429. >> Yeah. >> Is what we spend year.
>> No, Jordan said we But the total line is >> Hold on. >> What line is >> $42,000? >> I'll tell you in one second. This is why education shouldn't >> I get the Chrome box anyways because I made but we need to access that curriculum. >> No, I'm not I'm not criticizing you. I'm
criticizing generally the fact that everything is technology >> and I I hate >> which is not a problem here today to >> I'm just telling you that I don't think that this is I think it's good that you're looking Chris. I don't think that
this is a good line to cut beyond what Jordan said. So >> four years instead of three >> the the schedule. >> Can you can you stretch it out? >> Yeah. >> So what is it?
>> That's in part what that 42,900 does >> would do would extend one more year. >> Like there's there's some ridiculousness and I think it's ridiculous that the central office cycle is every two years. We're extending that to every four.
>> Okay. the student. >> But if the So if we did it if we did what what Jordan said we it would it would be $42,900. >> Let me >> What line is this Chris? >> The equipment line for the computers.
>> Yeah. No, like what row on >> Oh, what number? Um, >> hold on. Just give me one second. 4273. >> It's 223. >> Almost there.
>> Our devices are on a four year cycle. >> Oh, they are. >> Yeah. >> I mean, kids using a laptop and it's kids using very cheap laptops. We are also going for a smaller Chromebook um to save $50 per
device and that will save um 15,000 on the middle school high school line. >> That's already calculated. Thank you. >> You're welcome. >> Is it is it already in? >> No, we haven't put in yet. >> Oh, there's there's about
>> So the four teachers is about 430,000. >> Okay. So, the four teachers we could do with these Chromebook things, the trainer, and the transportation. And we got to get one more thing in there.
>> And that means that we're letting all the positions expire by by attrition, >> which >> So, the assistant principal, the custodian, and the occupational therapist, all of those go by attrition. >> That's a lot. I mean, could we could we
ask Miss Burns to come up with a proposal if we asked her to cut some of the sports? What she would do? >> Is she expecting that? >> Focus on the ones that are cheapest or service the most number of students. >> Bang for your buck. Which ones give us
the most amount of students for the least amount of money? >> I don't know that she'll have the data for spring. >> But the problem is if if the federal government still funds us, then we have to comply with Title N. and the bang for your buck analysis cannot be performed. >> We need to comply with title nine
whether or not the federal government you're the lawyer, aren't you supposed to be telling us whether we're supposed to do that or not? I know you're not. >> I'm not providing legal advice, but I'm saying if we don't get federal funding by law, title N does not apply. >> We are getting federal let for example. No, I'm just saying cut everything. Then
we don't have to worry about it. So, >> I know we don't want to be here, but like >> No, I just have a really hard time with cutting at cart launch. I I just I Right. Is that Am I the only one saying that? >> I mean, I don't want to tell my son he can't play soccer.
>> I don't want to tell my son he can't run either. I mean, like I this would directly impact my household. >> I don't say I mean I >> my wife and my son would both be very mad. >> If we cut rid of sports, we wouldn't have to maintain the fields anymore. >> That's true. But then that's going to affect all the
other programs that use our fields and we would lose those. >> But that's not a ton of revenue. >> Yeah. >> I think what you're talking about is valuable. I think everybody, to use Tony's expression, should take a
haircut. >> Yeah. I think that to find that $400,000 in um electives and extracurricular activities >> is important.
>> Is important, but I don't think you'll be able to do it. >> No. >> Can we at least >> I don't think so. >> Get a first grade teacher back. >> No. No. I want those four teachers back. Like I can't We need those four pick and we can't pick and choose. I I I really
think that we can't make this is going to sound awful, one school experience less pain. I don't think that's fair. Um and I don't think that that's the way to do. I think we
need to do all four teachers. >> So, could we put the four teachers back? You take on what what we've suggested to you. I mean this budget when do we have to have this number? >> By town meeting. >> By town meeting. We know. We know. >> So it's not that I want the number is
>> right. Like we know what the number is. So could we >> I want to have this number so that when we >> more time are considering the override. They understand what it means to vote now. >> Yes. I I 100% agree with that. That's why I don't want to wait too long
because we need we need the list of what's getting cut because that that is >> we need to start people thinking about >> we need to start people thinking about it. So maybe we could decide on a few. I just think like if the sports are going to take more of a haircut, which I think is where we need to go then, right? If we're going to save those four teachers,
which I am 100 I don't know if the rest of the board feels like 100% we have to save those four teachers. >> Not going to cut a teacher, >> right? Um then maybe we tell sports you have to make up the difference. You know what I mean? Like basically the entire sports budget.
>> That is the entire sports budget. Um >> that's not a haircut, right? So that's going to be gone. >> I think we might have to cut the four teachers. I think that when we did this budget, there are things we can talk about, athletic transportation being one of them, >> but I don't think we're going to get out
of this. >> No, we're not >> without increased classes. We We worked really hard and have talked about this as a leadership team. And this is what our team
doesn't think is best, but thinks is what needs to happen to get to balance. And I hate to be the person sitting up here proposing it because it's awful and it
will devastate and decimate our school system and I don't want that. There's no crying in school committee. I don't want that for the children of this town. And I need to believe that when faced with
this and these herculean decisions that you are trying to make right now, I have to believe that the voters will come out. I have faith in this town. I'm looking to move to Lunberg. I I have faith in this town. >> Excellent overright build much better
deal. That's not a joke. It's true. >> I want to be able I want to be able to I want my tax dollars to be able to go to our school system, which is why I'm considering that. However, not this school system,
>> not the one that we're proposing. Our children will not learn. We will be outplacing. The special education costs alone will outweigh the savings that we have. Just think of what a special
education placement can cost. It can cost upwards of $200,000. Yeah. We need to be able if we make these cuts to keep money in
circuit breaker and in our our budget to be able to pay for those out of tuition costs. >> So can I ask Dr. opportun why you and the leadership team didn't recommend cutting the sports program. Is it because you just felt like the it brings
too much value or I because I I do respect obviously you as a team working on this right and I mean I was surprised when I got this that it didn't include particularly the sports transportation which I think is criminal that we are paying for that and cutting teachers. I
just I cannot the sports transportation. The reason that wasn't included is because it's such a drop in the bucket of what we actually need. And I know talking about $127,000 like it's a drop in the bucket is
>> ludicrous, but it is. And with a 48.5% participation rate in high school athletics, I think it's a 48.5% of students were either keeping enrolled
at Lunberg High School or were keeping coming to school at Lunberg High School. Um, as far as keeping >> No, I I respect your opinion on why that wasn't on the list. >> And that's why that wasn't on this initial list. But I but you understand why the
classroom teachers are so I mean everybody diffult but like I just can't >> Yes. Like I just I don't >> I just >> this budget her suggestions like I'm I'm going to Dr. Fortuna works very closely with the principles who are a very good
team. They work together very well. And so I'm going to trust that recommendation and that she did not make it lightly and that they understand the effects of these cuts and that it is not simply the school committee can go
through and pull out enough to I I just think that's so simplistic. I do I would like to cut sports transportation. I don't I don't know what we would add back in or what you would want to prioritize. I don't think we are going to get to enough to save all four
classroom teachers and that's killing me. This affects my own kid and I am thinking of those classes that I've volunteered in and read to and there's a lot of kids in the class now. Like I'm thinking of my son's classroom. >> That number of kids is not going to fit
because he's in a small they're not that >> classrooms in primary school are not that big. They are not. >> They're not going to fit. And I know I've seen what a large group of I have been birthday parties with my kid. It's yeah that number of kids rooms >> I have so much faith in our teachers but
what we're about to ask them to do is impossible. >> I when Dr. Fortuna suggested this I I have faith that she understands what it means. >> I I totally agree. I have faith in in you and your team. I cannot be somebody
who claims to support education and cut education for extracurriculars. I just can't. Like, I'm sorry. Maybe that's a a wrong-headed position to have, but like we are not in the business. This is not a minor league sports team. We are not
in the business of creating athletes. We are in the business of educating students. And unless there is some overwhelming data that shows that this is the only way to do it, I cannot support a budget that leaves intact the entire sports apparatus and is cutting
primary school teachers at a time when we have 30 kids or 28 kids and then we have, you know, 25 kids in kindergarten with no parents. And we are we have testing results from the third grade
that indicate that you know a majority of the kids are not reading at grade level. We cannot we cannot do this. I I just >> Can we talk about the athletic director line and can we adjust so that reflects more reality of budgeting just so future
school committees understand what's going on? >> Yeah. Um because can you talk? >> I can talk a little bit about it. It's not a done deal. And after tonight's conversation, it could very well change.
Mrs. Burns came to me and offered um to continue doing both roles while putting more emphasis on the assistant principal role during the day and moving more the athletic director to after
school for an increase in salary that was $20,000. We are never going to get a part-time athletic director for $20,000. However, she was very clear with me that some
things needed to remain and at the time that we had that conversation, those two things were the athletic secretary and the athletic trainer. >> Yeah, I think the athletic secretary very much. >> Yeah, that's the support. And so I think
with this discussion though, she may be rethinking that position and we may be looking for a part-time athletic director, >> a full-time athletic trainer or could would she be a minimal to a part-time? >> She was pretty clear that a full-time is
important. >> Okay. >> To student safety. May I ask what is the difference really between an athletic director and and an athletic secretary? Because I would assume that both are talking to other teams and scheduling >> secretary.
>> Um Mrs. Burns does um majority of the scheduling. What the secretary does is a lot of handling the financial pieces of it >> and it's very essential to how I >> it is not a full-time job. It's a half
time. Okay, >> that's what I >> Yeah, it's not even half. >> It's not even halftime. I think it's a 0.25. >> Oh, okay. >> Because I do think if we're going to have sports, an athletic trainer, at least halfime is important. I think the data shows that. I think that it's easy for people to say then just go to the
doctor. But the reality is, and multiple studies, if you want, you can email me. I have a lot of them. Um, students don't just go to the doctor. They don't tell their parents they got knocked in the head. It doesn't get communicated because there's no athletic
director. There's no athletic trainer to communicate it or it's not the knowledge about head injuries is not there and they don't go to the doctor and then they get concussions. And it's we learned this two years ago when we had a school committee meeting about concussions. It's not the first
concussion. It's the successive ones when they're not pulled out of play. And the stuff we're talking about again affects students lives forever. And I just I if we're going to have a sports program, I think we need at least a part-time athletic director because >> You mean a trainer?
>> Athletic trainer. Yeah. I do I I would be open to cutting some sports or cutting it by half. And I don't know if that's asking I think that that's asking too much from Mrs. Burns to make those decisions. I think it should ultimately be our decision. So if people are mad,
they are mad at us and not our employees. >> I think you need to have her voice. >> Yeah. I I just want her voice without having >> But I think that when people get angry, they should not be angry at Mrs. Burns. It should come to us because it it was our financial decision. Um and it's a
hard decision. I I would be open to cutting sports by half, especially if we're going to have such a reduced athletic director, uh because hopefully it would lessen her workload. Um, I just I don't see >> we got to come up with a number. This
This is the thing. We just have to come up with a number. >> So, we can wait. >> We have the number. We just >> We could meet next week and have Mrs. Burns give us some, you know, insight, but I I agree with you, Tony. We need to have a number. We need to get this done. We can go with what what Dr. Fortuna has
recommended. We could vote on whether we want to cut all the sports. >> Where are we on it? me because I know how I feel but I often sometimes in the minority >> I I would not vote for this. I I would not vote for this. I I cannot vote for a
balanced budget as currently projected given that it has absolutely no cuts to extracurriculars. And I'm not just saying sports like we are not in the business of doing extracurriculars. We are in the business of education and all we are doing is cutting educators. I
meant let's see how people feel about your view of cutting all sports versus strategic. >> I don't want to cut anything but I am not cutting education before we cut. >> But I'm wondering however >> is this something we can wait on or no? >> I mean we can wait. It just means that
we will have less of a clear message for the override. >> It shortens our runway for the override. >> This also prolongs the agony for the teachers who are waiting to see what happens. >> Prolongs our agony. I mean, I don't want to wait two weeks. All I'm saying is if we could talk next week before tribe
board or something, right? If we if we needed more information, that would be my only that I'm not trying to put it off to make the decision. I'm just saying if there's something that we need more information about, I think we could say let's cut the sports budget by half and
without making specific decisions about it. But I I'm curious where we lie on Tony's cutting all sports over things because I think that will inform our decision going forward. I am happy to put forward a proposal
where instead of cutting the two classroom full-time employees at primary in at Turkey Hill and the interventionist and the half interventionist that we would look to make up that money by cutting first the
>> sports transportation, second the IND like the total sports line to get down there and then if we still need to make more cuts. I think they should come from extracurriculars. Band, theater, music, all of those things need to be taken off
the table before an educational institution cuts educational services. I I just I don't know. I mean, maybe I'm wrong. I I would love somebody to tell me why it is wrong to say that we should be I I I just
>> I don't think you're wrong. I just think it's really hard. Yeah. >> Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No, I >> Yeah, I I mean I think >> I don't think we're we're disagreeing on the the educational perspective of it. I'm a teacher. >> Yeah. I mean, the problem is that >> but there's >> other >> I think it's related to education
>> moving parts there that >> we're just not all super. >> The problem was when when we did this last year and we cut nothing >> and I watched all >> I knew that this was going to be where we were. I knew beyond any shadow of a doubt that we were going to be put in
this situation because the economy stinks and it's not getting better because we have an irresponsible president. The issues related to our f funding because of prop two and a half is not going to change and we are just
marching down the line. If we do not make dramatic changes via an override, we are going to be here next year and the year after and probably until 2028 until something changes. >> And that's why we cannot go under 1.6 million. >> I don't disagree. But like
>> if we are in the budget >> No, I'm serious because if we go lower than that, >> we are just putting a finger in the dyke. >> I I I agree. But what I'm saying is if we have a balanced budget that that cuts education, >> I hope so. If we have balanced budget that cuts education again, what will
this look like next year? >> Right? I mean, at that point, it would be full sports. >> It would be all the sports and then some teachers >> and then we are field school. Like what happens if we keep going down this road? >> Mhm. >> No, I'm like
>> No, the thing is North Middle Sex is going through this right now and they are in a death spiral. I don't mean to be like, but basically more kids leave, the town gets less money, then you have to cut more things, then more kids leave, then that's basically what happens is the numbers go down and then
as the numbers go down, >> there's no way to stop it. >> There's really no way to stop it because then the kids leave and then you get less money from the state and then more kids leave. >> Yes. >> And guess what that does to your property values, >> right? I mean, I know of people who live in Ashby who have had very hard time
selling their homes because they and they don't have kids in the system, but they their school district is not that desirable. And I feel bad. I am friendly with some of the women in North Middle Sex who are and men are working very very hard to get more state
funding and I will continue to do that. I'm bringing three students um in a few weeks to go testify. Um care's coming. we're gonna have a great day. And um you know, but
so could we say that those positions that we spoke of, right, Tony? Like what? So Tony's recommendation is we take those positions off the table >> and then make them up through cuts of extracurriculars >> and make them through extracurriculars
and then maybe can we meet next week? Could people do before? I mean the other thing that we could do is we could just do it as part of the tri board >> like do it before tri board. >> No, we don't have a confirmed tri board meeting yet. The finance committee has not committed >> or we could do next Wednesday because we
need another meeting. >> I just I think >> I know you don't want extra meetings, but like I don't want to let them out. I think we need to >> No, I I I really I think we can put a number on the sports if we're going to cut it by say half. >> Then I think we can put a number on it. I really don't want to delay this. I
think that's kicking the can down the road. >> I think what you can do is direct us to cut nonacademic pieces to make up for the um four
classroom teachers. >> Yeah. >> Renee, can I >> No, >> no, we can't do that. I just can we in a week can we talk to the select board if we can get more from their budget and we can have some more potholes in exchange
for our >> I mean that's a losing proposition. >> Yeah, I don't think we're going to be able to do that. >> I mean I just it's so shortsighted to allow the schools to get to this position. >> But yeah, >> we got to fix our own problems. I don't
think the select board would necessarily >> disagree with that. >> I think the select board is in favor of an override. >> Oh, I the override but like this budget. This is just >> wait. So if we need So we need to find
$567,297 someplace other than the two FTEEs, the primary, two FTEs at Turkey Hill, the interventionist and the halfinterventionist. That means that we are okay with the assistant principal through attrition,
the occupational therapist through attrition and the custodian through attrition. >> Yeah. >> And the music teacher. So, we need to find $567,296. If we gave you a a mandate to find that in nonacademic facing position,
>> I think if you think that's possible, >> it would be just about every non-academic facing position. Just so you know, >> she would have. >> Yeah, >> that's what I've been saying this whole meeting. >> That's the decision. that >> Tim >> I was just wondering what percentage
>> I just want you to be Mike so the community can >> you might have to answer this >> he's just telling me to >> I like the analogy of everyone needs a haircut. >> Yeah. I'm just wondering what percentage of the total budget is high school athletics
because if we're cutting it in half and it's only one to 2% of our total budget, that's not a haircut. >> It's like it's like >> and we're pitting one against another again. Like I hate these cuts at the primary. Let's go to the high school and let's cut those programs from there. And
I understand their extracurricular. >> What would the effects be? Because you see it. What would the effects be on students? It's 10:00 p.m. People won't come to school. >> We we we talked about it with 48.5% of our students are involved in >> I mean I could imagine if we don't have
any public >> so we talk about chronic absenteeism. We talk about students going to different schools. I I am un I don't know of another high school in the Midwatch or in Massachusetts that doesn't have an extracurricular program in athletics
>> because it's the fabric of our community. You can see that through the elementary, through the middle school, and as it comes up to the high school, you're going to be I I I empathize with your problem, but I mean cutting athletics, if it's 2% of the whole
budget and you're going to cut half of it, that's not a haircut. It's 4, right? It's about 4%. >> Well, I was just throwing that >> relying on Chris. >> Thank you. >> Thank you, Mr. >> It's about 2%.
>> Is it >> okay? What percentage of the cuts that we need to make to get to a balanced budget is >> what percentage of the the sports budget represents what percentage of the cuts we need to make the sports and
extracurricular budget >> and what was the total number we needed to make? So $868,918 >> and the total sports budget is >> So we cut all extracurriculars. It would not be enough to save us in a balanced budget >> including personnel.
>> Yes. But if you add in the positions expire and then if you apply the positions expiring through attrition would that be enough? >> I think it's 917,000. be close.
>> I mean, I I just don't know. I don't like if we're unless we want to cut teachers again. I don't know how we do this. >> I think we have to. I don't want to. I I feel like the team I I would like to cut
the athletic transportation. I don't know what the >> um priority positions to restore would be. >> Oh, classroom teachers. >> But if we could only restore one, >> right? I don't think that's
>> And it we'd still have to find something else. If we only restored one position, what would the priority be? We could do that if we cut the athletic transportation budget. >> Guys, we also have to understand that we have two collective bargaining contracts coming up in 2027. I mean, we got
>> there is a salary reserve. >> Big problems. >> So, if we cut athletic transportation, we could restore one classroom teacher in the first grade and that would be your priority. Yes, >> that would also be >> for restoration.
>> What >> for restoration? >> That would be my priority as well. Uh only because kindergarten and first grade are when they're learning very fundamental skills. But this are again really hard decisions to make.
>> All right. >> Um would that be possible, Chris? Is what I'm saying correct? >> Simony, would you like to just Yeah, >> I'm sorry. I know it's been also been working tirelessly on this.
>> What was your question again, Laura? >> If we eliminated athletic transportation entirely for 127, $550. >> Yeah. >> And would that enable us to restore one first grade teacher? >> Yes. >> The primary?
>> Yes. The whole the whole 127. Yes. >> I would be okay with that. I would prefer that. I don't think there is a way to do this and get all four classroom teachers back which is killing me affects my own kid. I
but I think that is the least bad terrible scenario in this awful tradeoff. >> Emily, what do you think? >> What? >> It pass. Mindy, are you willing to cut teachers
to fund sports? >> That is >> that is exactly what we're doing. Let's not mince words. Let's be honest. That's what we're doing. >> Yeah. I mean, I think I am. I I but I'm not willing to go all the way. So, I my personal opinion is I would like to
restore the four classroom teachers and cut what we need to from the sports department and extracurriculars to do that. And that's what is your second priority? I know this is hard asking you to what would your second priority be if
we cut because cutting athletic transportation I believe would give us a little more than we need. So if we cut another amount to get us to a second >> I mean I'd like a train or two I know that everyone else agrees with that but
>> what would your priority be? I think at that point unfortunately it have to be the KOD so we could maintain legal compliance. >> Okay. Um All right. >> The what?
>> So >> the certified occupational therapy assistant so we can maintain legal compliance. >> Okay. >> If Mrs. burns would give us would still >> So if we cut if we keep the two FTEs of
primary two FTEs at Turkey Hill >> Yeah. >> and we let the attrition positions expire and we don't do the interventionists and we cut sports athletic transportation, we are still $412,486 short.
>> That can't be right because you didn't take off the school trans the sports transportation >> 127 That's what we're at. >> But you're But you included the two interventionists, not just >> No. No. >> Okay. So, the eight teacher, the four teachers is the occupational therapy
assistant. >> Okay. Because I also have concerns about applying. So, all right. I don't know the exact cost of the first grade teacher, and I don't want to say it. Um, Chris, what are we
budgeting for? Oh, we would be keeping a teacher that position that first. No, never mind. So, if we remove athletic transportation and we remove
X amount of dollars from the sports budget to and replace that >> and replace that with a first grade teacher and the Kota, the certified occupational therapy assistant. It's like too big. How do people feel about that? Because
then we are making a cut to sports, but we are not eliminating it. We are eliminating athletic transportation and we are adding back in the superintendent number one and number two priority
for positions to be restored. One of which would hopefully keep us in legal compliance and would service students who need it. The other will lower first grade. classes sizes, which >> I like that. >> Are we okay with that?
>> Right. It still means that we have a huge gap to make up. >> So, there's a compromise. >> Yeah. >> Wait, we don't have a huge Wait, that would be it's No, these we would we don't we're still we're still going to be cutting >> $200,000. >> No, we're No, she's just talking about
one classroom teacher and one kota. Whatever. >> So, one classroom teacher would be like a hundred >> It's right >> $100,000. What what price are we? It's okay. Um, so let's just say 100. >> So the price on there includes the health insurance. >> Okay. So I'm just going to say 100 because it makes it easy, but we'll have
to figure >> 175. So we need to find out another $175,000 to cut. >> What? >> No. So we're cutting 127 in athletic transportation. >> We're cutting 127 in athletic transportation. >> Okay. >> That'll get you one teacher
>> plus Yes. Plus X from athletics. We're just going to leave that. We'll solve for that later. Plus X the amount that we would cut from the sports budget. And in exchange, we would add in one classroom teacher,
one first grade teacher, and one certified occupational therapy assistant. >> While I appreciate the idea, it would create civil war between our schools. And >> okay,
where does that code of work in district? Okay, >> so that >> I think it's the primary school. We giving the primary school something. >> I know, but class sizes in first grade really
I don't know. I I have to listen to Dr. because I don't I'm I'm not an expert. So if we put if we had one classroom teacher in primary school, one classroom teacher in Turkey Hill and the Kota back and then say make up that difference by
cuts to sports transportation and the sports budget in general, would that work so that we don't have the Civil War problem? >> I'm going to defer to my leaders for that. Wait, so then they'd be going from
second grade with 30 kids in a class to third grade with so second grade with fi four teachers and third grade with five teachers. I just >> I mean >> so Laura, this is not ideal, but we can't have one's more valuable than the
other. It's not it's >> we can't do that within the schools. >> Everyone's going to have to give up something townwide. I said this last time. We have to find a path that we can move forward where everyone in the town gets what they need. We are going to have to take cuts somewhere. They're not
ideal. Are we happy about it? Absolutely not. But we can't sit here and debate and go back and forth who's more deserving than the other. It's not fair. It's not fair to
everybody that's here. It's not fair to everyone that's online. And it's not fair to our kids. We have to make a decision. It's a tough decision and we have to stick to it. And that's how we have to go for the override. If we keep on going back and forth and we keep on deciding, we're going to get nowhere. We
have a time crunch and we need to let the people of the town know what's going to happen if we don't get the override. So, we have to make a decision and you as a school committee have to make that difficult decision. We've given you
numbers. We've given you cuts, but we can't have a civil war between the high school, Turkey Hill, primary, and the middle school. It's not fair. >> Okay. So, Principal Spire, would you mind coming up in case somebody
>> Chris, I'm just going to say this. >> Although, she has a great teacher voice. >> Stay. Yeah, just there. >> Sorry. >> Okay. So, I would like to end this meeting at 10:30 because we are we are not being productive and it's late. No, I think you guys are going to have to make a decision. We
>> say, well, I would like to have us make a decision in the next 10 minutes. >> I think we've debated this long enough. We just need to pull the trigger. We're not getting anywhere. If we did the following, if we added back one FTE at primary school,
added back one FT at Turkey Hill, and then added back the KOD and asked for that difference to be made up by a cut to athletic transportation and then a cut to the general athletic budget equal to whatever the remainder is after you
cut transportation. Would that be a compromise that would work on the administrative level? >> Dr. Fortuna, Dr. >> I can't answer that on my own because I
think it was a team decision and >> putting us on the spot is not going to I think you guys as a school committee need to make that decision. >> Okay. I like I have no problem making the decision to be the one that takes >> it. I think for us that it it then becomes the infighting amongst ourselves and it's not fair.
>> We made the decision as a team. >> Sounds good. That's what I was just going to say. >> You you started part of this meeting and I think was Mrs. Brazio complimented us on how well we work together. Yeah. Um, and for a while we've been kind of, you
hear us leaning back and forth going, what did we spend all that time and energy working so well together for? It it Nobody's okay with this. >> Yeah. >> This is trying to make the best out of a
bad situation. >> Yes. And we've spent a lot of time back and forth talking about the same things that you've been talking about to say what's the least worst thing >> we could do to make that bottom line budget that nobody wants work.
>> Um not happy with it, but that's what we've come up with together to say, "Yep, with Dr. Fortuna, this is the best way to move forward for our kids, for our teachers, for our community." Um, and again, part of me was sitting back.
I be honest, I texted Dr. Fortuna, can somebody tell them that you've you've laid out what you want? Let Dr. Fortuna and her team go back and do what we need to do to get you what you want in a way that makes sense. Um, you've trusted us
this far. >> I I I'm just going to speak for myself. I have a lot of faith in what you guys have proposed. I just don't see it as being an equitable distribution of cuts. It is not a haircut to everybody. And the reason I don't think it's a haircut to everybody is because extracurriculars
took no haircut last year and no haircut this time. So like if the goal was to be equitable, I do not think it does that. And if that is an unfair criticism, I'm happy to hear it. But I don't see how we can be in the business of education,
talk about everybody taking a haircut and then only have haircuts on the educational level. I don't think, and I respectfully disagree, Mr. Chair, I don't think par equals equitableness.
And I think as we education is important, teaching kids how to read and write, to be active citizens, to choose their own path in life is our core mission. However, in order to educate
our children as citizens, we have to think about the soft skills that they get from participating in extracurricular activities. >> So, I would say if you guys are not satisfied with what we've put forward, then you are charged with going back to Dr. Fortuna and saying this is what we
would like to be equitable. Then we would have to go back to the table. But doing it in an open forum back and forth is not >> it's not productive. >> We don't love it either. >> This is miserable. Like there's a million ways to do this faster, but the opening open meeting law
>> the way that we have this >> it's not optimal. >> And it's also not optimal for people who are public employees, right? Like the fact that we have to do all of this debating in public means that like you know you tune in 15 minutes ago, you're like I'm fine. You now you're like I'm
cut. You know this is a terrible terrible way to do this. >> Jobs. >> There are multiple people whose jobs are affected by this. >> We have spoken to every teacher today that impacted by these decisions.
>> So I don't mean to keep interrupting but we've been here for three and a half hours. >> Let's do this. And the only thing that I have really been asking about is the sports transportation and the sports
trainer. I guess with the Miss Burns um graciousness, I can understand the sports trainer. >> I feel like I that is the only thing I feel I feel very uncomfortable on the sports transportation front charging
kids to come to school and not charging them for their sports transportation. I think that's the one thing that I I know that it will affect children. I don't know whether we charge people. I don't know, you know, what we do, but I I just that is one thing I the last
thing I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around continuing to pay for out of a school budget when we're cutting this many physicians. And >> so I don't know if there's any way, you know, and and and you did. You presented
to us what you wanted. I don't agree with Tony. I don't want to cut the entire sports program. Um but I also want to go home. >> Okay. >> To compromise, >> right? Like I I mean honestly, >> I think the first thing we got to do is
do we want to accept the administration's proposal >> and we should just go down the line yes or no. And then if we don't then we >> can I propose a compromise as far as that I think will keep us all >> if we cut athletic transportation no
>> by the amount they have made a proposal to us they are here as a team I take their work >> if we cannot compromise then yes I'm going to go for that >> but I think that we got to we got to say yes or no to what their proposal is. We
we should not be editing their proposal. It's either we don't want this or we do want this. And if we don't want this, then we tell them what it is to go back. We cannot do this on the fly. So, let's go down the line. Emily,
do you want to accept the proposal on the balance budget as it is written in the document? >> Yes, >> no. just because of the one thing I mentioned. >> Laura, >> no. I'd like to look at athletic transportation.
>> Okay. So, just so we're clear, if there is a tie, it stays as is. So, I would I would assume that that means that the proposal carries. Is that right? >> But you're not taking a vote. You're kind of doing a straw. >> Right. Right. But we're going to the
next thing. Um, I am going to say that I do not support the proposal as currently made in large part because I do not think and I hear what you say about >> it's not everybody has to take the same cut. We are still not making any cuts to
something that is not part of our core mission. So I'm going to say that I reject this as well and so I sorry for all the work you put in. >> I just I you know like I can't do this. So, can we instead would people be comfortable asking Dr.
Fortuna and the team to go back and just if we took the athletic transportation money out and they decide where they want to put it, >> would you support that as a straw? >> Yeah.
>> Yes. >> I have reservations about saying go back to the go back. >> No, I'm not saying go back to the drawing board. basically saying just figure out where to put them, take that money out, charge and like doc, you know, we can charge people, we can come up with something. North Middle Sex does not bust their kids back and forth to
games. I did ask my friend who works there, they have a system where the boosters and the um and the families have come up with a system for transportation. I would like to reduce the athletic I would like for the team, not us, to pick a priority position, one
priority position, and to reduce the athletic transportation by that by that line because it's different for different positions. And then athletic transportation will be mostly gone, but there will be a small amount left to be
used strategically for if there are certain sports that are having equity issues or that meet at weird times and that that would be under the purview of Mrs. Burns and we could try it that way for a year where sports transportation was not guaranteed for all games. >> Yes. and also you might get a better
discount, >> but we all but we still have part of the athletic transportation for when it's absolutely necessary or if we're finding issues with certain sports. >> I'm just going to cut to the quick I support cutting sports transportation
budget and so >> I think that's difficult because now we have an amount of money that we have to find. So I'm saying let's cut it by one position because that's all it's going to cover. But then then >> like that's a that's something that's beyond the like we're an oversight
committee just >> so you would like us to go back and look at transportation or some other areas and then look at what are our priorities because you're not supporting cutting all of the classroom teachers are we I just want to make sure that we're understanding what you're saying so >> I think what they're saying is they want
to cut the $124,500 what to do >> and then figure out what it >> I would like to cut it by the amount of whichever one position. >> I think I I would just rather cut it all though because then you that you could spend it on other things like maybe
there's technology. Maybe I I I've heard that this >> I just don't want to get into the details. >> Exactly. We'll do that. Yeah. Yeah. We'll get into I just can't I can't ask taxpayers to pay for that. >> Generally these cuts I do I don't know what your priority would be and what we
can afford through that. But generally, yes, I I don't support these cuts, but yes, I think you guys spent a lot of time and discussion picking these cuts and I trust them. I just would also I think that athletic transportation has ballooned in the past
few years and I think that's a place where we can cut and maybe squeeze out one more one less cut. >> I would look for a motion on the on the balance budget as proposed. >> Would anybody like >> Would anybody like to make >> I'll second it. No, a motion. You have
to make the motion. >> I make a motion to accept the balance budget as proposed minus the um athletic transportation fund which the team will then make a recommendation that we will accept. I'm assuming that we're going to
tell them we're going to accept what they say on that 1247 >> 127500. >> Anyone want to make a second? >> I'll second. >> Okay. All in favor? >> I I >> Me. All right. Sorry guys.
>> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> We don't we don't we don't like doing this. >> Okay. >> So, we mostly have a balanced budget. We took a balanced budget. >> We do. We do. >> We got it >> with until we clear that
>> with all of these cuts. >> So, right now we're making these cuts until we come back. with the recommendation >> on that last amount of money. >> Yeah. Yeah. But >> can you do that sooner than two weeks from now? >> Yes. I'm going to >> meeting >> or an email. We can do this by email.
>> We actually legally cannot. >> Well, I can tell you what the >> We don't have to take a vote on the information because you voted on what the budget is. >> Yeah. Whatever you guys have to pick, >> I'm going Saturday. Again, I really do appreciate the amount of and it makes it
easier when you guys aren't in fighting and and I guess it's just really nice that everybody here has the students needs at the core of what they do. >> And Mr. Ivon's beard added gratit.
>> It always does. Okay. >> All right. Public comment next thing. >> Oh, good. >> Let's do public comment. >> Rene's got one. >> Public comment. try to be quick. >> Thanks for sticking with us. Renee, >> I have no life. This is what I do. Um,
uh, Rene M6 Iris Court speaking on behalf of myself. Okay, caveats out of the way. I first want to publicly thank superintendent and Chris and town manager as well who spent a lot of time um I know Friday and over the weekend um
looking at I I got um line item budgets from the superintendent and town manager and spent time looking at expenses and digging into amunas and and I was happy to hear a lot of the feedback was um actually incorporated into into the
budget. Um the other thing I wanted to quickly address was um coming back to the fire. Um, I want to make it clear that in the no
override budget that we discussed on Monday, it was a decision that the fire fourth shift career fire was a priority and we cut several departments to make that happen.
Library, police, additional fire, DPW, park and wreck, council on aging, they all took cuts. So it no one to be clear, no one is happy with the no override budget. I think and
that's true from town school. Um and I think the discussion that went on for God knows how long tonight on the on your balance budget just speaks to how unhappy people are. It's not I think
from the town side it's survivable. It's not what anyone wants. I think it is definitely more devastating for the school. And in my conversations with the town manager, even as late as today, she
also agrees. It's much more devastating for the school. It is critical, important. Whatever adjective you can think of, override passes. Mhm. >> And I think everyone
is is on board with that. I mean, I can't officially speak for the select board, the tri board, whatever, but um it is critical that the override passes. And I'm saying that for the public listening. I know how much work has gone
into looking at these budgets. They can't be trimmed anymore. This is this is it, guys. This is it. We're not asking for, you know, money for frivolous things. We're not padding the budget. Um, this year with all the
new staff in place, it was a lot more work, but the work was done. And I want the public to to to know that and to feel comfortable with um the override that will be presented that it is this
is what is needed. Um, and if we go with the two tiers, it could be needed and and then plus, you know, what we want, a little bit of what we want beyond the needs. Um, and I think the public education is critical. If people are
aware, it's it's a matter of priorities, right? If if they are aware what's included and it's important, they will vote for the override, they will open their wallets. Um, and so I think Mandy's touched on this before. I think it's really important
that the education starts has to be clear. This is I mean I we have to go to town meeting with a no override budget because to go to 112 budgeting would be even more disastrous. Yeah. >> So, so we have to present the no
override budget but um I think we have to be clear of what the what that is lacking. and then what you get with the override. So that that piece I think is really important and
um I know when I when I say and I I checked with the town manager if I could say this and I I can department heads also support the override. So you have support from town staff from I think
I can't officially you know okay you have support um for the override and um I was I've written so many mo notes during this meeting um so
I think I touched on anything everything um just as an aside I think we're still waiting If FinC come, we'll have a quorum for Tuesday for the tri board. So, just so you know. Okay. >> So, keep keep an eye on email and everything to see if that gets confirmed, but we're trying to get a tri board for Tuesday. And we have select
board has a workshop on Monday night um to talk about budget again. So, >> thank you. >> That's also for the public. >> Thank you. I really appreciate you coming, Renee, especially cuz we were mad and you sat there and took it and um
>> you guys threw some arrows. I'm not going to lie. I I am Mad. I very much appreciate you and I appreciate you continuing >> to engage with us. >> I'm going to let Rene off the hook now. >> We're trying. We're trying.
>> Um Sarah Camemer 304 Lancaster A. Um I wanted to speak here to parents who might be listening right now. Um May 2nd is a big sports day for a lot of people. I hope you're having a conversation with
your student about how you might have to miss one of their athletic events. Um, my daughter has states I'm not going. I have to go to town meeting. And I looked up approximately the number of students in Lunberg, about 1540.
And if you like to use that average people throw around that every house sends 2.7 kids to school, that gives us about 570 families. And assuming that everybody's a single parent, that means 570 parents
need to be at town meeting. And then you need to go out and get your extended family who are not parents who live in Lunenburgg and they need to go to town meeting and they need to vote for that budget. The one at the beginning of the meeting, not the one
that is causing all of us tears in this room tonight. If that happens, what are we here for really? Um because it's not the kids. And I I find it really hard to believe I
I I do find it really hard to believe that all of the rest of the people in this town who are not parents would would jump on board with that budget either. And maybe that's because I'm an optimist. I mean, I'm an educator, so I've got to be a bit optimistic. And
I've been working in climate change for a long time, and I still think we can do something about that, too. Um, so optimism. And I think I think you know having to talk about that balanced budget you know that word that it's
balanced is just wrong. You know that is the budget of no override the budget of despair. Um and >> for it >> budget of that one >> and we really as a town need to do
better than that. And one of the things that we need to carry forward from your meeting today is what budget is essential, right? And that is what we need to talk about with the town. It's it's not failures people have had in the
past with overrides. It's not um this group versus that group. It is what the whole town needs. And I do believe um that that was part of the discussion at the select board um with what the town needs budget-wise. Nobody wanted that first budget either.
>> Um if you if you listen to that meeting and I still haven't finished listening to it. I had other things to do in my car today. Um but if you listen to that, they want they want the override, too. >> Um and I heard I think that we can vote on it at least three times if we need
to. So, >> so >> I mean I don't know how fact I I heard that that's a possibility. >> I think we need to get it right the first time. >> And I think >> I think that that budget it was the C
budget. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. I I think that one's a good number. >> Yeah. >> And I think it's welldesigned and I think it's transparent and obvious that that is what we need. So, thank you.
>> Hi. >> I only have several pages. >> I'm shocked you're making a public comment. It's really surprising. >> Laura Parutionian 389 Maltus Road here as a parent and as the president of musicators. Um I just thank you all. um
everything that you're doing. I think the team there's a different feel this year how you're working together, the conversations that you're having. Um it just it it just feels very different from last year. Um the transparency, the
fact that I didn't have to go searching through 32 pages on the website to find the budget. There's a hub. We're in Lunenburg and we have a budget hub on our town website that gives people every single committee, every single group, everybody's budgets. I think that's just phenomenal to the public. We're at a
crossroads. Push has come to shove. This is it. And these cuts that we're talking about at the end of the four hours or whatever we're at now, four days later, um they'll be the same thing next year. >> Yeah. >> This is that is a rinse and repeat
budget. That is what's going to happen. And it's just it's the tip of the iceberg of what's going to happen. And this impacts all of us. Whether you've got students in the in the school system right now, you've had students in the school system, you've benefited from your property tax, your property values
going up. Just look at the properties that are selling. Um I've got a neighbor and um we were, you know, saw the house for sale. I just, you know, we saw two little kids and thinking, okay, there's there's the next generation of, you know, Lunberg, >> you know, it's just I don't know who I
don't know who bought the house, but I'm still wondering. But but I'm just as we look at all that, that's that's why we're here. whether you know we're we're we're here for music or chorus or or for arts or for athletics, whatever it is,
well-rounded students who can go on and be productive members of society, who can come back to our town and start that over again. That's our goal. That's what we're looking for. And um we we need to get there and and this this budget
proposal that helps us get there and meet that goal. and and most importantly um you know take care of our kids. That's what we're what we should be doing. So um I just please everyone I've got three other things on May 2nd but
this is the thing I will be sitting in the auditorium all day with the clicker and on the 16th and we just you have we have to be there. So certainly the musicators we will be pushing this out. We appreciate >> we also too I as I I said earlier um
thank you for in the restore budget the in the override budget you know putting the music teacher back in devastating the band I didn't see you know the music the athletics at the middle school have other alternatives the music getting rid of that the band it it's the only
program that completely got devastated that just eliminated and the word eliminated I forget how many times when I searched through the document referred to the music program. So, I appreciate you putting the 02 back into that. It's 9,800 bucks. We will again, I will commit as I me and my fellow officers,
we we will commit to helping balance that and make up for supplies and transportation and other things. >> I just Well, not a little bit, huh? That's why I was on that side of the camera because the eye rolling was Yes. tremendous. >> But, uh, yeah. No, I appreciate that. I
I can't imagine for a $28 million school budget that we can't find 9,800 bucks. So, I appreciate that. >> Thank you very much. >> Anybody online? >> Yes, Sarah, we have online.
>> Sarah, can you hear us? >> Is it my turn? I can't hear. >> It's your It's your turn. >> Okay, Luther's talking. >> Oh, yes. It's your turn. Sorry, Sarah. >> Oh, >> all right. Thank you. Um, so first of all, thank you to all of you for being here for, you know, three and a half
hours tonight discussing this. I have drafted an email with all of my ideas. >> Your name and address. >> Oh, sorry. Sarah Call 11 Easterbrook Road. Um, so I work at the primary school. I'm a parent of two high schoolers and of course a homeowner in
town. And I have, like I said, drafted an email with all of my thoughts over the last three and a half hours. But the one I keep coming back to that I think needs to be addressed is the last override we did. We suddenly found
almost $600,000 but then sort of lost it and went to the town. Um and it kind of I feel like before we all gung go forward with another override, we should address how that money was lost and is there a chance of
getting that back? because that's a lot of money. >> Who wants to ch this one? >> Okay, so wait, let me let me hold on one second. Um, so first of all, uh, we did four different town hall meetings
addressing this issue, including two with the staff. We also sat down, Dr. Fortuna and I sat down before Thanksgiving after the last special town meeting and we addressed this issue with the newspaper. So to summarize quickly,
the large majority of the money was placed was budgeted for a competitive grant. We won the competitive grant and then we did not reallocate that money through the line item transfer process and as a result at the end of the year
based on the town charter the money remmits to town hall. Um we it goes into free cash. No money was ever lost. It was money that we uh should have spent but didn't. The reason that we didn't catch it was because of an accounting
irregularity. The accounting irregularity and the systems in place that caused it to arrive have changed. We have entirely new staff both in the business manager's office and the superintendent's office. And the thing that caused the money to to go out of
balance, the competitive grant, that is something that is essentially, you know, there are obviously all new competitive grants, but that was a onetime thing. So, it will not happen again. I I'm confident that the team that we have in place now will be mindful of the money.
>> And the money, to be clear, the money was not lost. >> It went >> It didn't And then it didn't just show up. >> It did not get spent. >> It was not expended. and it was not expended on things that it should have been expended on uh in some cases and in the others it was the competitive grant
and the money returns to town hall. It doesn't just go away uh and it will become certified as free cash in the future and uh the town manager will have a proposal on what to spend with it once
it's certified and this date does its thing. Uh and then it usually because there is usually some amount of free cash and unexpended funds every year from most departments, it returns to town hall, becomes free cash, and then usually we spend it on capital projects
or funding the uh snow snow and ice removal, >> that kind of thing. Um so the money is not gone. The taxpayer money is still within the town. it just it does not return to the school because of the way
that our budgeting works. Um, and we shouldn't run an operating budget using one time free cash. And lastly, that money was included in this year's current budget. So, that million dollars we are currently spending and without
it, we would be another million dollars in the hole and it will be there next year as well for the budget that we are currently building. Um because once you vote for an override, it is added to the tax base. Is that the right word? The tax um >> levy.
>> The levy. That's the word I was listening. I was looking for um it permanently adds to the tax levy >> to the tax levy. So that money is been key as well moving forward. >> Yeah. Had we not done the override, we would be in a much bigger situation this
year. >> So but thank you. That was a good question and I really think that it needed to be addressed. >> Do we have more? >> No. >> Oh, >> we lost everyone. >> All right. >> All right, guys. What day is town
meeting? >> May 2nd and the election. >> All right. I am >> motion to adjourn at >> 10:46 p.m. >> Excellent. Sounds good. Second. All in favor? I