good morning everyone good to see everyone this morning uh few things on the agenda for us to discuss I want to go and get started with our city pre-commission meeting on Friday the 7th at 8:00 a.m. hope everyone's had a good uh past couple of weeks all right let's get started uh let's open up with our city attorney's report all right so for the next couple of weeks or next couple of pre meetings I'm going to be doing just some regular local government trainings and today I'm starting off with parliamentary
procedure because your code of ordinances require that your meetings use Robert's Rules of Order so this won't take long but I did want to provide to you a little cheat sheet um that talks about a simplified manner in which Robert's rules um Works everybody have one one okay um so your code not your Charter but your code um says that all meetings of the city
commission both regular and special shall be conducted in accordance with Robert's Rules of Order newly revised um adherence is directory only so you don't invalidate an action if you don't follow Robert's Rules specifically but it is helpful to sort of keep order and give everybody a right to participate in a discussion the heaviest burden falls on the chair to facilitate discussion but one of the things I want to point out is that uh the version of Robert's Rules yall have adopted in your code has has um a separate set of rules that are
available for small boards of 12 members or less um not everybody uses those rules I'm not sure if everybody is aware of those rules but um they are considerably different from the rules I think everyone is familiar with in a couple of ways um the primary one that I think is important is that the chair can participate in the discussion and make motions historically you see the chair act as a neutral facilitator and that's still a really good practice to make
sure that everybody gets an opportunity to speak um but under those rules for small boards um the chair can make a motion or can make a second to further discussion um are we considered a small board your 12 or less is considered a small board so you are a small board um members can remain seated which I think is hilarious and the formal rules of Robert's Rules uh those wishing to make a motion need to stand to make that motion and be recognized y'all can stay
seated y'all do that anyway um under the informal rules motions need not be seconded I recommend you get a second anyway to confirm that at least two people on your board um want to have that discussion and consider that proposal um but on the flip side of that informal discussion of a subject is permitted while there is no motion pending under the inform mod so um that allows you to still have discussion even if you don't have a second um under
these informal rules there's no limit to the number of times a member can speak um under the formal rules uh for a large assembly generally a person a member only gets two chances to speak on an issue and under these informal rules um you can speak as many times as you want to on an issue to either ask questions or influence um a vote one way or the other perfectly clear proposals can be voted on without a motion under the informal rules again my caveat here is
make sure it's perfectly it is perfectly clear for instance you know approval of the minutes um because if it is not perfectly clear it creates Mischief I feel like later on if what was perfectly clear to you was not perfectly clear to the mayor when when yall by consensus approved an item um so there are a couple of caveats that don't work exactly I don't feel like work very cleanly um but I did want you to be aware these small rules that do allow
for um primarily the the mayor the chair to participate and make motions um if you'd like um y'all are already working more informally than on the foral rules of uh you mean the mayor could make the motion at a meeting I thought he had to pass the G in a large assembly that is that is true under Robert's Rules of Order under the informal rules for small boards 12 or less the mayor the chair may make a
motion or second a motion now if that's problematic for y'all you can still create your own Ru rules and you can require that the chair will pass why do we want to change it now that's the way it's always been is it right so under the rules for large assembly which I think you have been operating under but I wanted to bring to your attention that because you are a small board you can still comply with Robert Rules of Order um with some of these they're not variations they're just rules that are applicable specifically to small boards to make um the meeting more efficient
and one of those things that is remarkably different for small boards is that the chair can participate and by making missions or second are you bringing this to every municipality that you own everyone will do a parliamentary procedure training on we will I mean is this something that your your your uh your Law Firm is telling everybody right now or why do we why are we talking about this so for the next couple of weeks I'm going to be doing uh just a series of little
trainings on local government Municipal local government stuff government governance versus Administration Sunshine Law just refreshing on things I think you lot to know and because your code requires you to comply with Rober rules I wanted to give you a little Refresh on Robert's Rules do we so rowdy you're not I was leaving my house when the bells were ringing so excuse me for being late so I I guess one question we do we want to although we have the
Liberty to follow the small group setting um I think we hav't as you stated been following a large group setting um is there do we have to choose one over the other so that it doesn't become so you can't like I guess that's one of the questions where hey we have Liberty to do this then do we just pick this part out and say oh yeah hey let's do this today and sort of mix the two like so this is
your default you also have the ability to set your own you as a board five of you had the ability to set your own rules of procedure specifically how you want things to happen meetings to happen in your city so if it's important to the five of you that the mayor not ever be allowed to make a motion or make a second without passing the gel you need to pass a resolution to make that expectation Cleon because as long as Robert rules are your default you have that ability right now you have that
um this piece of paper I've passed out to you is called Robert rolls order simplified um and I don't know do I have drawers up there where I could keep this in the desk no okay well then take this home and look at it at your leisure um but how to do things um it sort of creates or sets out various situations of you want to bring a new idea before the the group um you want more time this tells you which motion you might use to do that um I will say too uh this how to
do things um two of the scenarios I want to bring to your attention um about halfway down the last the second and third to last you are tired of the current discussion you you can move to limit debate this is a rule for large assemblies um the one immediately below it you have heard enough discussion you move to close the debate for small
boards um these these motions are not appropriate so if you are operating under those rules for small boards because they are informal um and meant to facilitate as much discussion as possible um it's up to the chair as to when to call the question um the members don't have the ability to limit debate or close the debate because they've heard enough so we table something right you can absolutely take something so anyway I just um wanted to give you this quick little primer to
refresh you on Robert's Rules if you had any questions and that is my report any questions for uh City attorney so even if something is not does not have a second on it you can still discuss it you can or if there is no motion pending at all you can still discuss it what was your question Ma I didn't he if you have an item and there is no second you can
still discuss it under the rules for small boards that is specifically uh one of the informalities that they allow but the item the item will die on the floor but you can still talk about you can still talk about it or you can talk about it before there's even a motion and can you do public commentary on it no if it's not a second so there is an intersection of uh Robert's Rules and the Sunshine Law they don't always match um a couple of the ways in which
Roberts rules and shunshine law don't match well let me say this too Roberts rules of Border are for y'all they're not for the public they don't control how the public participates um but with regard to the Sunshine Law where Roberts rules allows closed meetings the sunshine law allows them very under very limited circumstances um whereas the Sunshine Law requires uh meeting notices Roberts rules does not um conversely
Robert's Rules requires um meeting agendas whereas the Sunshine Law does not require an agenda for a meeting to happen in the sunshine um likewise what I could consider to be a Sunshine Law right to public participation is not necessarily something that Robert's Rules requires so um I didn't really answer that okay I'm sorry so typically we yeah um scario that V said if you
have if you have a motion doesn't get a second we can discuss you can discuss but can and and I'm thinking in previous meetings can the P can we can the public comment on that as well in the discussion okay I'm going to say it's up to the chair okay to decide because Under the Sun L the requirement the trigger is a proposal currently pending so if there's not a second to the motion I feel like it's not currently pending it's not right you can't vote on it okay that that helps I think that helps guide everybody as to
what we would do okay you know I mean I just wanted to does that help let me say I think to vr's question that's what we already do so we already discuss like for example typically we have the discussion before we call for before I call for the motion unless it's something that I think is already uh I'm not going to say that we're already voting on but for example if it's something that might be simplified like to add this truck to the Surplus we may want to have further
discussion on it but if we discuss it on Thursday I may just say is there a motion for this whereas if there's a a topic for discussion then typically we discuss it and then after we discuss it then we call for you know call for the motion call call for the voting and and that's perfectly acceptable under the rules for small boards so that's typically how we do this we have the open discussion and then ask for the vote or ask for have the discussion ask for the motion and then turn it over to the public and then
come back to us for the vote unless we try to have more discussion which we would try to push us to just have vote at that point after after the public has their input um because we don't go back to the public for more input after we have additional discussion so um so why did they in the past it was always kind of a standard rule that the mayor couldn't make a motion unless they pass the G why did they always do that in the past so those that I mean I feel like Robert's Rules were develop you know 100 or more years ago um and that was that
is the rule that I feel like most local governments have operated under um the the rules for small boards I think only came into effect in the 2012 version of Robert's Rules and have you ever read Robert's Rules I mean most people don't um but anyway so they haven't been there for all that long so I don't think people first name or last name his last name yeah um so I just I feel like uh for the most part folks aren't aware of
them or it could be their own rules of procedure require it I can answer all right well thank you for that um any questions about the warrant list um there's a Fell's name on there and forgive me for not help
James Moore is that what you're looking at yeah that's the Auditors James Mo auditing y yeah and then um oh one more question just just because I'm thinking about it and because something Waste Pro pay 64,000 is that is that the average monthly bill it Aver any about 55 to 65,000
that's why I was looking at that the Waste Pro landfill deal those prices did increase as per their annual deal not the commercial vage pick up but the landfill of dump for a yard and construction and stuff like that did B container charges that same they don't have land they don't have a land right that price so would their would their would their build B have been more on their new bid they didn't have
accurate prices to show what it was the previous contract I think the average was around 52 to 55 so very close to very and also our commercial um accounts have increased which is also I just thought that was a little high from what we work so when does that contract come back up in I believe it's next year I would have to look to give you answer pretty sure it's next year we had yes yeah it was a
threeyear deal yeah that long ago yeah and they've gone up every year trust me well I guess we got to put out the quotes for it so that way by the time it ends somebody be to take it over it hadn't been three years but yeah yeah have we had any complaints on West W so we have um it's been normal I mean not daily or weekly U but you do have your your complaints of you know Miss pickups or issues um I
think our biggest challenge was lack of communication from our staff to them whether it was setting up a new account or mod like say you know a restaurant wanted to go from a four yard to an8 yard dumpster getting that swapped out um we have had some communication mishaps um we try to keep up with them so when it's time for you all to decide to renew the contract for another term um we can give you all that information
so you can decide to renew the contract or to go back out to an RFQ more or less than the previous um it has been more their dump aren't the same size any other questions for the warrant list right to our consent agenda any questions from the cons
agenda oh all the all these cars that were that were going on to auction they all have the same thing wrong with them did you see that everyone of no air conditioning front end problem uh I don't know if you read CU I was
looking at the looking at the Chargers and whatnot so I'm just I'm just wondering uh and and I and they needed I mean they're 2012 2014 they you know and they run them they run them hard but I just noticed that they all have the same issues you know I do know Dodge whether it's Jeep Dodge R they do have issues with their AC going out yeah all of them no AC and and uh you know and then not
not not repairable front end you know stuff so well they run all the time yeah yeah you know I didn't even realize that you know if they like run in use the restroom no the car's running the car's running it has run they're Mile moners and they run yeah Chargers were were definitely not good to uh yeah so we have cars now taking their
place oh I mean we have enough cars on the road we got cars and trucks SUVs we ordered three this budget year and we will have to add more but the Chargers were bought it was right after the the fall of the market right they took the Crown Vic out of the police FL and they put the Dodge Charger in and they were they were the next certainly not near as tough as a crown VI they were the next best Le car after they stopped making ground B right
stop stop using it I wouldn't say that we haven't we haven't bought any more right if that tells the story any other questions on conscent everybody's good with that discussion pertaining to the specific parking requirements for recreational vehicles um this is something uh that we've talked about before the attorney so at your last discussion
um I understood I was directed to find out what Panama City was currently um considering so what I have provided you is the ordinance that has not been adopted by the city but is being recommended to the commission by the planning board so it's been through a couple of iterations and public hearings already but this is what I understand this to be the version that is being proposed to the commission for adoption IT addresses Recreational Equipment General generally so there's a
definition of Recreational Equipment that's larger than just RVs which is where you H started your discussion so it includes vehicle vessel trailers large equipment used primarily for recreational purposes therefore including travel trailers camping trailers truck campers motor homes boats Boat Trailers jet skis race cars utility trailers Doom buggies and similar Recreational Equipment so the scope of this may be larger than what you wanted but I did want to bring that to your attention it's bigger than just RVs but
I think RVs and boats um are driving the issue there just like they were driving the issue here all right um any initial thoughts on this of course we're not voting on this on Tuesday just just discussing so is this basically saying you can park it in the front it's okay to park it in the front it's okay to park it in the front for I feel like a limited time as long as you're not um you're not creating a visibility
problem and visibility triangle right um maybe parked in rear yards front yards are required so side yards but not both so it's limited amount of time def find 24 hours so they can only park in the front for 24 hours the way this is written well it can be may be parked in the front yard as long as it it with for an unlimited amount of time if you're
outside of the visibility triangle but you only get one you can't have one in the front one in the side and one in the back um you have to pick a pick a place and for one thing and that's all you get when you say outside the visibility triangle basically they can't see it no that means that it can't with your neighbors when they're backing out of their driveway the RV or the equipment can't create a visibility problem them okay it's not that it can't
be seen it's that it can't create a a problem for them when they're pulling out of their so they can park it in the front yard as long as it reaches meets the visibility triangle or however long or okay they have a really good description of the VIS visibility too I like that so of course I I think you know if there's something wrong with it like the tires are off of it and that I think that
falls under the codes for just regular vehicles I know there's code that talks about that it's got to be registered and things like that right those are considered nuisance vehicles and you already have a code for mechanism for that okay so are we telling someone they can't park their RV in their driveway you have that is the current problem you have a lot of RVs parked and drive Rays right now and your code requires that they be in the backyards I think we have we had 300 that's in violation right now right we
had somebody Ricky remember that was it a meeting before this one it was like two meetings ago somebody was listening to the meeting and we hit this topic he drove up here yes he's got an RV and I I don't I I I wanted because you had mentioned something about you know people's Liberties and rights and whatnot well I mean at the end of the day I mean truly being in a driveway I mean I told you there's over 300 in driveways right
now and this guy's one of them so you know it's on their private property that is a concern of mine but I also agree that if it's a blind spot or you can't see around it and it's so large but I really think we need to entertain what the city has written um but you're going to have a lot of people come out if you were to say you couldn't have them in a driveway it's their driveway and as a key factor yeah there so why did we put it
and I hear what you're saying and I'm not disagreeing but why did we make that does anyone have the historical knowledge on why we did let it in the driveways initially Commander Bobby do you have me I don't know why initially but it's been like that when I came in 2012 it was like that it was like that in Callaway I don't know what other cities it was it was like that but if you had an RV um it had to be parked in I
believe in C it was the same boats had to be parked some people said sidey yard um some say rear but it was just a common thing I don't know why it was but cities didn't want those things parked in front of the house all right well again still under discussion so uh I guess one question
would be in regards to the major Recreational Equipment trying to see and I'm I'm probably just overlooking it with all the it's on page 48 right well I see that part but I'm asking the what's what is still being defined as a major Recreation of vehicles so that is the definition of the M uh the definition on one on 48 is the definition that control so basically you can't have a RV
in the front and a boat on the and a boat trailer on the side that's so then if the RV is in the front then the boat trailer has to be in the back or you can't have like for example like I don't know if you see the I don't know how like there's one guy neighbor that has like two boats he's right on the right yeah he has like a small Carolina Skip and then he has like a larger boat and they're both park right there so that would mean that he would and I'm not saying like this is right or wrong I'm just trying to understand so he
would have to move one of those boats in the back to the back or if I have a RV in a boat then I can only have the RV in spot and the boat in another spot or the boat has to be in the backyard the RV has to be back so just make sure I got Clarity on that I'm just I was just asking Ricky if I I know it would take a couple days or a week or
more hang hang this on the doors of the 300 people and then entertain having a workshop for them I mean we talk about 300 people with the vested interest you know they have expensive things and they have rights before we before we put it into effect I'd want to give them an opportunity to hear from them you know right so I guess with the 300 violation is that just for RVs or is that including RVs
okay so then if we approved RVs being in driveways and that would take that would cover those 300 that are in violation if you right unless they are invisibility triangle and all that kind of stuff okay does the city have any OB ction to parking of cars or vehicles in front
yards I'm asking because I don't know unless it's not registered or Wheels removed or something like big project or something you know like painting it or something like that I don't think you can have it up front Okay well and that's my question because once you allow the RVs and the driveways it's foreseeable that all of the extra cars will start parking in the yard rather than on the asphalt so what matters most that all the cars that the neighborhoods maintain a neat and clean appearance and cars only be pared and
driving um which you can absolutely do um to require the RVs go in the back or the RVs go in a storage facility I just what do you care about the most and if you don't care about cars and yards um you don't there's no real problem with allowing RVs and driveways but I I did want to ask the question because if you do care about cars and yards um that's that's the next problem to solve for kind
enforcement all right we'll chew on that okay so yeah uh please you know review again thank you for providing this yeah for us Amy thank you for that and we'll have additional discussion on Tuesday and commissioner per get you saying like having a workshop or more Public public input well have one guy just kind of R Rush up here and you're going to you're going to get a reaction I guess so I and it's not we're not
talking to everybody we're just talking to 300 violators to to you know right right right right now we can set in a motion anything we want but you probably want to give them their their day in the sun talk to everybody that also would include people who already have their um V uh RVs and storage will take them out and uh because that's a nice will have that they're paying we take them out and now put them in driveway in their
driveway so we have to consider that in regards to those that are in violation do we need to do something as a commission to postpone any action on those violations while we're discussing this the complainants that have complained we let them know this is in process and they appear I think I haven't gotten any more I don't know if you two I sent that last email ever since we let them know you guys were reviewing it it's pretty much came to a halt okay but I'm sure they're like everybody else anxious to see which direction we're
going to go well we'll keep this the agenda and keep discussing it to it's not going to go away yeah so uh so yeah we we brought it back up so we can continue to discuss it so we'll discuss it Tuesday and if we think we have a way forward then we'll let our City attorney know and try to put an ordinance together or question continue to have more discussion yes ma'am um just as a point of uh curi yes my
curiosity um has the number of RVs significantly increased since the hurricane yes ma'am double I would almost say triple to include me hot water and air conditioning is important good question um Mr probably now why this is more of a an issue than what it might have been when this orance
was originally or this code was initially written all right we're going to come back to 14 we'll save that for our discussion today last of course we'll keep it as 14 for the meeting on Tuesday but let's come back to that last um new business any questions on number 15 um in the last several months you have
adopted an ordinance that revised your cross connection regulations in your code um those regulations or that ordinance also specifically authorize the adoption of a cross connection control program by resolution um the program is more uh specific as to the procedures the forms um putting the public on notice of how enforcement will work work um and what is expected of them from compliance I mean I think it
also includes diagrams even of what the equipment looks like most of the package um so it it we we did this on purpose to allow it to be adopted by resolution because when de updates their requirements it will be more easily amended and the city will be able to respond more quickly uh to fall in line with what D is requiring um but it is authorized by your current code so this is the implementation of what your code
requires okay moving on to number 16 okay um mayor this I meet with the midlevel supervisors monthly I just like to hear what's going on in Phil what are the concerns what are the the challenging things that are keeping them from doing their jobs and this actually we came up with uh many of them that the
foremans and the superintendents when they go out to get quotes um they spend more time trying to get a quote um because anything over $2,000 requires it like a you know part of a a pipe um if they just wanting like you know one piece of pipe sometimes it's you know $2,500 and then they got to find somebody that will actually uh three quotes that will respond to this this is just more efficient um because like today one of the supervisors wanted to
come in and really talk to the commission but there was a leak that happened and so he's out there um in the field and then when he comes in you know any um materials that are needed he's going to have to come in you know find those materials wait for it to reclose which in essence hate um puts us puts us in a position that we don't get a job completed for a residence because we're W for three quotes So basically anything right now the way it's written anything
over $22,000 requires at least three at least and then sometimes here's the other part of that too great question we don't get three quotes because they're only two people that that Supply it and so you know we're trying our best to to find it and then we just say you know we only have two quotes where we don't uh this person didn't respond so it's just really about efficiency so that they can do their jobs better so I guess one question would be um why
did we choose the 3500 as a threshold because is it that most things may be less than 3500 for their Department that was their um their suggestion 3500 to 4,000 and as you can see you know they're trying to just put it at a point where there's still internal control but um get the jobs done and the um the work ERS done faster got you mention four ,000 is that something the commission would want to consider from 2,000 to
4,000 as a threshold that's 2,000 3500 it does and they recommended 3500 to 4,000 so we can stay at 3500 just asking since they mentioned 4,000 if we want to consider that as a get 3500 I would imagine most of this stuff that you buy at that point I wouldn't think there'd be that much of a price difference could be
wrong so no most of that is pretty consistent prices however one problem we run into as well is if it's something we buy consistently this company is always the lowest price but because it's over 2,000 you have to get multiple quotes and the other companies that quote all the time they never get the job they always have to quote after a while they just quit quoting and so we can't get any more quotes on whatever we're trying to buy I would just you know make
sure where they've went up over the last three or four years something that was under $2,000 is now in the range of 27 2800 and we have to turn around and get three close something we used to just you know direct under 2000 I just say that you know and I'm sure we already do this just make sure the employees are cognizant and uh trying to cheap is not always the best
you know but you know sometimes you got to spend a little more at quality just that they being wise about it a prime example of that lift station 25 we have to put some upgrades in we have a requisition uh we got three quotes one was around 21,000 one was around 26,000 and one was 53,000 for example the $26,000 quote is the one we're going with because the $21,000 quote is equipment that we have already and we're constantly having to repair it so that additional $5,000 will
pay off in the long run and we have the requisition end with a memo regarding that for for the trail perfect Y and we do that we always look at quality um I know pricing is is there and if we go say with the next quote they usually have an explanation there okay no I don't have problem it any who makes the determination that
about um the expenditure I mean would it be like Chris would make the determination that if it was over certain amount or under a certain amount or does it come to you you know how we talked about now it takes three signatures for a payment is this just something that the department head that's on the department level it comes to me after if you if passed over that
$354,000 so then if it's over 3500 it comes in for your my signature as well any other questions on 16 all right 17 meaning the budget for the L Haven fire department utilize impact fees to purchase two chevi tahos for $129 6 the fire chief um could not be here
this morning but we did meet um myself Kiki and the fire chief and um one of the great things is that of course you see the older vehicles here um he said you know we buy these two we won't have to buy vehicles for 10 years that is a great thing when you're trying to buy buy vehicles every year he's doing a great assessment that and so the the the part that I want you to focus on is that
in U Florida statues they've added a section that uh we can buy vehicle emergency V vehicles with impact fee money that is a very useful thing to have because that mean you don't take it from your general fund or your particular fund that um you're using for for projects um in other areas so that helps out the budget a lot and really impact funds impact fees or may um when
your your your city is impacted and um Chief will tell you bothe Chiefs that the call volume has increased tremendously or what or just Assistance or medical calls loal call okay and and I know the chief will go with me on this it's their medical calls I know have increased we get Auto generated on them and so it's something that we have seen a a very
high uptick in 3,000 this year 27 Bobby would you come 2700 last year 3,000 this year that's like 65,000 vehic for two vehicles correct everything in them that's everything okay CU Ricky you get what do you you bought tahos right you
get yes they are probably the most durable um for what's going on I mean you see through the the snowstorms the flooding um cars are just not the go and as we continue to pick up up north around 390 behind those apartments I mean we're getting dispatched to large Gatherings out there where the old clay pits used to be so you want to be able to get to the person and and with the impact piece it also
includes you can put the equipment in there correct it includes the installation of all the emergency all the emergency everything that's lock toop barel correct yes sir any additional questions all right and again just uh as we're working through our o we have number 18
here should be any questions any input on just discussion for chapter 46 Peters and solicitors that's a short chapter there in our code of ordinances [Music] so mayor Amy has been due Amy and Jennifer and I have been doing some preliminary work because we did see some deficiencies in the code itself and I'm going to just let Amy briefly talk about some things that we we've been working
on I feel like there is section missing from this ordance because one of the things we have been focusing on at a staff level um is the application requirements for getting a a Peddler's permit um we want to practically what your code currently requires are not in fact what either state law requires or um the city is in fact doing um um also right now you have a your ped's permit is $6 per person and just the
administration cost to run the background check and the database and spend the time to issue the permit is a little bit more than that so we want to update that fee um we're also cleaning up the requirements between the Peddlers who are self-employed and as as their own employer get a business license um versus those who are employed by someone else who already holds a business license trying connect the dots between those two so a lot of our efforts have
been in on the sort of administrative side um with regards to that application for pedler permit um and I don't see those requirements here but that's that's where most of our efforts have been focused and I may I would say too more more insight on the pedalers in terms of how we want to uh address that in terms of identification I know that's been a big issue that we talked about as well how do how do we once they turn in their
application how do we identify them um what is their badge we really want to go to a badge uh of some sort because it is impacting our residents and um we want to be able to know who's out there and um it's this time of year that you know they're out a lot and um yeah and we don't want our residents to be vulnerable in any form or fashion so we're working on that I we have a
couple examples that we kind of put together for the badge but because we really want people to know they come through the city and if they don't have that badge they have not been been through the city and they're not associated with us as well okay so a a badge issue by the city by the city okay yes sir and and that's anybody knocking on it on a door no no not anybody that's anyone who's selling it wouldn't apply to politicians and it wouldn't apply to
essentially evangelists if you're going door to door for religious pures you're not considered a pet correct so those these regulations would not apply for those loers so we just wanted some feedback from you while we were working on it um if there were other additional things and you're right Amy I think there's a portion mission missing about the application process I think that's in a different section Yeah a different article but we'll get
it to you next meeting can add it to the agenda when it goes out okay she'll add it to the agenda all right thank you all right and now going back to the 14 discussion approval uh then just discussing the or discussing possible approving a Second Amendment to the city manager employment agreement of course
this was tabled in January and we bringing this back for this meeting to the attorney so the version in front of you um is different than the version that was originally presented to you a few months ago and so I want to go through those changes um some of them I'll go through it section by section uh the term extend the 11mth extension to December 202 seven that is the same um section four Personnel policies this is a new section of the
contract um it adds language to confirm and clarify that the city's Personnel policies regarding states of emergency leave a cral holidays apply to the city manager the same way they apply to every other salaried employee in the city um that's an issue that has come out in the discussion so we felt it appropriate to clarify it confirm that intention here section c salary um this has changed in two ways
um there is a proposed increase to her base salary um to $178,000 um I understand there's been a performance evaluation that's been conducted since this was last seen um and so that is an appropriate consideration to uh consider of course you don't have to keep it and you can move that number up or down Jennifer has information um regarding what other city managers in Bay County are paid to help
you with the fitness of that number also um we the language here that the employee shall be TI entitled to bonuses holiday and emergency pay at the same time in manner given to other salaried city employees again confirming the intent there um new language this new sentence here employer may also increase employers employees base salary or other benefits both and such am amounts and to such an extent as the commission may determine desirable on
the basis of an annual performance evaluation you already have a requirement in her contract that you do an annual performance evaluation it does not however tie that evaluation to an increase in benefits or compensation so I'm trying to connect the dots there with this new language section seven hours of work um the new language here is clarified what those um what activities are
outside of normal business hours that she is expected to devote time to you'll see I have struck Municipal holidays accepted because it's clear that y'all tend her to work on Municipal holidays um maybe not all of them but certainly some of them uh the automobile and phone benefits the number for the automobile allowance is exactly the same we did strike the word and phone from this provision again just to clarify that the city is actually um responsible for the cost of the phone and not the city
manager um with regard to section 10 benefit plans the language has changed but the intention is the same Jennifer has helped me and cleaned up this intent um again the the the ask here is that the city will consider an ordinance that changes the multiplier for the city manager position um so there's language struck here um regarding the vesting the city will consider an ordinance to change the vesting specific to the city manager
you've already done that it doesn't apply now so we've just struck that language um to set forth the new ordinance we'd like you to consider and that that's my summary of the changes thank you before further discussion on the summary of on the changes we'll hear from Miss Jenifer her report giving us an update on the evaluation and other pertinent information good morning um first thank
I want to thank each one of you for participating uh for the second year in the city manager appraisal process this year the overall score for the city manager is 4.22 that there were five different categories that you all gave ratings on and provided feedback to the city manager after averaging the scores the overall score was 4.22 if you remember four is
considered an excellent score going from one to five as the rating her highest score was in item one which is commission citizens in public relations item number five individual
characteristics uh on average was a four so between uh those those five again 4.22 if you have specific questions I'll try to answer them right any specific specific questions in regards to the uh evaluation analysis for city manager yes sir um the the base salary it's stated in
here that is 140 we're going to get to that oh we're not talking about salaries right now no not right now just just the evaluation just Jennifer's report right now what okay the why does why does it go from fair to excellent no it's satisfactory satisfactory to excellent it was just those are terms why is it and and I know it's there's whole numbers and decimals and whatnot but
um I I I just don't know about one form being the the the the the the judge you know coming up here and saying a number is is equal I had a hard time with it and and um my one-on-one with the city manager wasn't fun at all um but uh you know know uh it's it's hard to use that as this as
a basis for where we're building but anyway I think what she's given us is the average so the average so in response to our our individual reports are are there right yes exactly so in response doing evaluations we've all experienced that you're trying to do an objective rating which is often layered with a lot of subjectivity um typically in research you'll find out though you're looking over a period of time in this ta case a calendar year as humans we typically
look back what just recently happened or what were the high points it is hard to put an objective rating on subjective evaluations there's been studies after studying studies on testing and measurements to try to come up with the perfect um format this is new I would say that we need to always look at and adjust um there are those that think
there should only be verbal comments with no ratings I happen to not be a great fan of rating ratings commissioner because of what you just experienced it's tough is it a one is it a two is it a 2.2 is it a five is it a 4.8 I tried to leave it as open so you all could make those decisions without and my job is not to direct but just to take and get your feedback and
then try to make sense of it which is a difficult job to do sometimes in this case because there was a reading a a rating it's easiest to take a mean number or the average to give you an overall evaluation because that's typically what is done for all employees there's some kind of rating that comes up to a scoring amount that gives U manag some sort of um identifier of is
this person performing at expectations or above expectations based on the average she is performing above expectations right any other questions for Jennifer regards to valuation moving back to the actual uh amendments
to the contract commissioner perno I think you're on page 53 here it is C five okay the um the number in the in that scratched out is 14399 which is not her current salary right anyway but that was the that was the number in the last version of the contract in the last version of contract
do we have her so I I think we need to you know because everybody's going to think that's the starting point and we're going up to so Jennifer is going to give us that current number great question the current base salary um based on uh a cola Edition in October October of 2024 is 8,324 61 so 158 324 60 61 sorry don't forget
p and the col the col increase was 3% col increase in October was it was 4% was 4% and historically now we we started at 143 399 and we're currently at 1 158 324 two
there was two that's the historic so the first the previous col was 3% and then this one was 4% and will there be will there be will Cola increases going to effect in October of this year if you all choose to vote that into the budget which also impacts your we get everything in there every year that comes before the it fluctuates up
and down you know one year it was like a 2.5 because that's all we could really afford um and then I think one year was a two so it's just it just we typically look at Cost of Living data yes and standard of living for the area and try to make some sort of projection for the commission
okay and October so October this year there there's potentially could be another Cola increase okay so if if if we and the term of her contract is two more years right like basically 25 January 25 26 27 right writing this up for discussion as
well okay but currently is through January 27th we're projecting to raise raise her base salary from 158 to 178 that's that's Bas base salary that's like taking her currently from 158 to 178 then in October it'll go up another 4% or or 3% or 2% whatever whatever
whatever the pullas are so I mean you're you're potentially within a calendar year we're looking at a 30 almost $30,000 increase if you if you if you if you if we did this where where it is on the paper so right now I think it's a 20,000 um if you raise it 4% [Music] or and it all depends on what cola
is as well um I think one of the things for us to consider is that the only raise that she has received has been CA right so there has been no in additional Merit or discussions or or pay increases there has just been Cola so without Cola there hasn't been any other other increase to the salary and I guess this puts us at a point where you know I'm I'm
thinking this is my these are my thoughts I guess it's my turn to talk but but um the last person that we hired or the the commission hired came in at a a base salary I think of 170 right I I I'd like to know that the last city manager the last L Haven city manager you came in at 140 [Music] from looking at his start if you can look at his contract started at yeah his
contract had a lot of new Poes in it because he started at one price and then six months later he got an increase at his price right and then some things he got paid out for example he got paid for his health insurance so that was although it wasn't countered his salary that was still an additional you know compensation that he received so and then that was in 2017 whenever that was no I'm I'm just wan to yeah you got the guy before you got what are we
going to pay the next person you know what I mean that's where I'm going well if we had to hire an N manag today what would they B what's and and then what's what what's going on in the air again that's that's that's that's what I want to get out there so in Panama City H their city manager their base seller I want to hear from her she's got all the hold on hold on what I'm saying is that when Panama City hired there uh City when they had their city man his base seller was 183 so Jennifer okay
Panama City which is what's their what what's their population to ours uh they're 36 we're 21,000 what's the question before me I'm sorry I guess looking at previous city manager s again um city manager U Michael White uh when he was hired August 22nd 2017 for a three-year term his annual salary was 135
135,000 and then he received $5,000 6 months later um approved by the commission uh he also received $672 40 per month as a medical allowance and $75 per month for a phone allowance and $750 per month in a vehicle bance and I think that was if we're
looking at even the previous city manager before him Joe sh was getting like 100,000 uh Mr Schubert was hired um March 25th 2014 for a three-year term term his original annual salary was $100,000 also contemplated a $55,000 increase after 6 months which he um received he also received $3,000 in
moving ex expenses his monthly vehicle allowance was $350 and he received colas and merits um going forward um in October 15th of 2014 his salary was increased to 106,000 um he received a change in April of 2016 to 11 14,6 $55.50 which was another 6% increase he also received a 2% Cola um and he had a
vehicle allowance of 40 $450 a month got it so so then when we got tacco white and there was a an increase there and actually when we hired city manager hers was a decrease from what Michael White actually received initially yes her she was um she accepted an acting city manager position in March of 2019 when she went
under contract as city manager she had a um annual salary of 115,000 she was then compensated um $24,950 for her acting period um which is very typical um in September 27th of 2022 uh there was a motion on the floor um of a commission meeting and her
annual salary was raised to 140,000 and there has not been any Merit or change in salary since that time other than Cola and what year was that 2022 uh I think that was 21 it would have been 2 might have been I'm you are correct it was 20 the motion was December 9th 2020 the amendment was effective in 22
where where all of that was kind of captured so December 9th of 2020 the annual salary was 140,000 and then in there was a cola in 2021 of 2.5% which raised the annual salary to 143 $143,400 so essentially since she's since the first raise from 115 to 140 there has
not been any merits or increase there's not been a marage it's just been Cola just Cola and the change in the um vehicle allowance and do you have the data for the other city managers um I do as of October I I will put a caveat that this is sometimes difficult to get meaning they don't they don't always share everything so I did a lot of digging Destin currently uh the city manager is started at
200,000 but after two years and he has um gone past the two years has a base salary of 225,000 the city also contributes um pays for all of his um retirement benefits at 100% Panama City um and this is one where I'm not sure they they added Cola um is $183,800
um Panama City beach again I got a figure that I I've heard is not accurate I think he the city manager may be in excess of 200,000 I've heard 22,000 and some change I was given $197,200 and Callaway with a population of
13,890 um that uh city manager is make was making 9,660 I see if I can get the actuals even if I have to go through a formal public records request got it so for the other I guess three major cities in the in the county all of them all of their city
managers get their base salary is higher than correct I should have got it that is correct how about their budget are they comparable dollars if you hold on just a minute that's that's a hard comparison to make because not everybody has their own police department they cont everybody care of their own garbage the utilities and services you provide are different in each City that's very true of
count some of City Beach okay and so the populations were you said 13,000 for Callaway 13 yes the the recorded I don't know if that's census or just what's you know you have an official census number and then you have an actual um but they're listed on the league of cities at 13,900 117 what is difficult as I think Amy was saying is you have to not just look at
budgets but what services are provided by that city right many many cities don't for example have law enforcement or a fire department um it also includes what grants you've seen our budget change based on what grants were issued so it is really a moving Target um our budget currently is at about 50 Vick you can correct me because I don't have our exact about 52 million so is population because Destin will have uku
population for four or five months they have transient population they have huge and so will Panama City Beach so you're managing herds you know and and and and you know influx and you know that it's it's a harder City to run when there's more people in it trust me you know so and that's and that's how they're compensated obviously so you're looking at high tourist BS in in pity Beach and Destiny so I mean is
it Apples to Apples that's that's where I'm banging head against the W but uh you know uh we're all practical purposes what I'm looking at is at 15 is I'm looking my my base in my head is 158 right and and and the the the um the suest ested increases to 178 but you you're pending you're pending a a coal increase this year and
the coal increase next year um so do we have a suggestion for a different my suggestion would be so um that her you know considering um you know everything in in in perspective what what I'm what I'm thinking is to keep her salary um uh is at 158 I would think her
Sal her base salary the number that came into my head was 165 165 and you're going to do a cola increase this year and a cola increase next year and it would be hovering around somewhere around that uh the projected number that's there by in in 2 years I don't know about taking a taking a base salary straight up $20,000 I mean I could see I could see I
think it would be 4% of 158 would take it somewhere in the range of 165 so that's my suggestion um and uh I I don't know if it's is it time to comment on power allowance and cell phone and anything like that we're going to wait we're just talking salary right now yeah so that that would be my that would be my suggestion and I will say with the 178 I know have to talking with uh Jennifer I asked a few questions during the evaluation period and what
would it look like to have received Merit because there has not been any Merit um what what what would it look like to have received Merit over the past three years actually put us at more around 185 right so that would I I wouldn't suggest a dollar of Merit for what we went through last year but I I that's my personal feelings well that that was one incident but I I se it in fall apart I know I know but that's that's that's we're we're we're putting our feelings out here right now but
that's my suggestion is we go to a base of 165 and I get we have our feelings but she also has her performance I'm that's my suggestion is performance Bas 165 my suggestion is 185 that's my suggestion is is 185 Mission Ward what's up Chim in man you your feel as off the
Chim in well we're saying it's based on Merit right she has a 4.22 she hasn't received any Rays over the past uh three years and that's that's that's what I'm considered I'll just say this I pretty much said what I said at the one commission meeting when we first originally talked about this based on my evaluation keep it the
same so we have 143 oh no 158 okay 158 158 165 185 is there any way that we could tie a certain amount of money to the EV valuation I mean we did this in the school system what we do now you know uh
whereas if it was what are the categories start with the top one the five was yes hold on was it Superior
five was Superior the incumbent consistently demonstrates performance at a very high standard that significantly surpasses reasonable expectations four is excellent the incumbent consistently demonstrates performance that generally exceeds seeds reasonable expectations the individual demonstrates no appreciable performance
deficiencies three satisfactory the incumbent consistently meets reasonable performance expectations the individual dist uh demonstrates an acceptable degree of competence and performance two Fair one un un satisfactory I can read those if you need it I mean satisfa I just don't say four equals x when she read it you know what I mean so what would you call it I just I
just I don't I don't know I I didn't label them I just I just highly competent you know you know but that's good yeah mean it could be a terminology that we change where it is exceeds expectations surpasses expect it's it's a word you all can decide how to change that M um there's nothing um this is not written in
stone it was just a guidance well the way I I kind of look at it is satisfactory is what you're being paid to do I mean if it's less than satisfactory you don't need to be paid at all um so satisfa is what is expected Excellence is better and so I
was thinking along the lines putting a monetary amount to the top two categories that way I mean there five people doing this and historically the commission when they would do Merit and I don't know the reason I was not here but historically with um um certainly with um city manager sh um
white and Shubert and Lynch it was a 5% increase based on the evaluation I don't know that they did evaluations how long was Joel here Joel here was about three years three years that's a flashing P compared to Mr ly
right um Michael White was here just shy of two years and what was her evaluation from last year because we didn't discuss salary increase last year we had the evaluation right but we didn't get a chance to actually discuss it you have an evaluation from last year yes the overall average was 4
63 what would 5% be do you know 165 5% 5% would be about $88,000 increase they'll put us around the 165 166 I mean could you put like a a 5% um exceptional and a 8% on you know I'm just trying to make it logical instead of just pulling
percentage windows on the on the yeah correlate of that of a monetary number to the to the point system and then that would be that would be great but I think individually we don't we you know what what's take take it individually and do a increase break it down instead of the average and then and then I I guess works out the same way but yeah I think it would still come out to be the same yeah yeah yeah to follow that line of thinking what I did was um I took
her salary at 2021 October of 2021 added the cola did a what I called a plausible Merit increase based on the history that had been passed by the commission which was 5% use that for the next Cola in 2022 of a 3% Cola added another 5% this was if you all had yearly done a a merit review and did
that through October of 2024 where her base salary then starting October 1st of um of 2024 would be 183 284 $183,200 on four Above So including last year and this year I mean I know the numbers would
that would change it would be 5% times last year plus the 5% times this year let's just say if we just added both of those you say 10% that would put us at around 173 yeah but I'm not proposing going back I'm just saying from this point forward I know you're not but I am okay yeah I know what you're doing I'm just going I'm just taking your methodology and saying it's not her fault that we didn't bring this to discussion last year to discuss her in it's not it hasn't been done
since 2021 and if any of us are working any job no matter where we're working if our Sal if our salaries aren't discussed annually we have a problem with it that's why many people look for new jobs so we can't be unfair to her it's not because it's on us to do this it's not on her to bring up her salary for discussion it's on us all right so I know things happened last year which is why we didn't discuss it that happened year before that 4.6 sh excellent right another 4.22 according to the scale
whatever terminology you want to use according to the scale it's still above a four all right so our CI isn't falling apart we have 80% reserves um we just paid off another $4 million debt which actually Cuts our debt payoff from 2047 you know that that cuts off 20 years off that debt which was a 30-year loan we paid it off in 10 so when we look at her job performance besides you know whether we like particular things or not when we
look at her job performance and we're talking about being fair I think it's only fair for us to look back at evaluation last year evaluation this year we didn't have an evaluation process in place 2021 2022 but we did do one last year this year and again it's not her fault that we didn't discuss it's not her fault that we didn't bring it up I totally agree with that I know whenever I was I know military is a lot different but when I was in military I needed feedback I always went to my
supervisor I said hey feedbacks coming up we're not talking about feedback we're talking about pay raise I get that yeah but she does have some responsibility in that saying hey commissions we need to do this so I'm not saying we we didn't have responsibility we did but she also has a part we can't keep blaming her for everything I'm not blaming her for everything that's what we do we we always the city for something that we should be doing no yes we are partly to blame for that got so guess we did it last year we did it this year so I'm
saying let's base our increase on last year this year go to 5% last year this year numbers may be a little bit different but In fairness it will put us at it will be less than the 178 um but I guess we could calculate what with 5% have been on whatever the 2024 Sal 2023 salary be and then 5% for this other I just did 4% if you did if you did an increase right now 4% it
would bring your base to 164 656 if you did a cola increase over the next two years which in in O in October of this year you did a Col increase of 3% that would add 4939 making it 16959 5595 if Cola increase the following year of 3% it would bring her base salary at the end of her contct contract to 174 682 I got it okay so that I mean I think
it we and my suggestion was 160 bring her base bring her base to 165 a 4% Merit increase at this time would bring her base to 164 656 so well all I'm saying is we don't need to be just pulling numbers out of the a well if it was if her to justify this to yeah if her rating was 4 point something last year 4.6 4.3 this year I mean you
know there's got to be a number to speak with that I guess right so and I agree partly with you yes we messed up last year not addressing this but we probably messed up on a lot of things so but we got to get this right there's an opportunity for us to get it right but we get it right from this point forward for right um but we can get it right from this point forward but why not get right what we I'm sure I'm sure a 4%
increase makes her highly competitive within the within within the system if not leaving it where it is so I mean I just don't think we should be going up $20,000 on on the salary so what is it if we do 6% or 7% what's the calculation for that for the rating for the Merit rating well we we said five he says four I'm asking
what is it for six or seven yeah I know but just you just pulling it out of the air or is it tied to the mar everything is coming out of the air okay as long as we're clear yeah everything is coming out of the air yes that percent is 7900 on on on her base 7916
right and round at to 9 it's Z 6% increas is additional is $9,500 base salary increase what what was the um 5% was 7900 increase so you say 6% is 9500 yes okay then 7% is $111,000 and
82 or 81,82 particular number in mind to put to what you're proposing she I'm talking about not talking about the dollar amount but the figure that you're proposing well I'll was the thinking that 5% to the exceptional and um maybe 7 or 8% to the superior got it now in
the past did you say that they got 6% the two previous city managers Jennifer they usually got 5% okay five I I just pull 5% out of the Year well and that would be also as you're saying explaining to our constituents that could also be in standard with what sure lady it's previously done and you say 8% for Superior or whatever the highest one is
yeah cuz um if 7% is 11,000 8% is did you figure that 8% I didn't go to 8% I I went as high as 7% and 7% is $1,082 basic so um all right so we got we all over this come back to it on Tuesday good and also we have a
commissioner that's not here to provide we weren we weren't talking about what the other ones we were talking about cell phone and and car yeah now cell phone is provided okay cell phone's Prov so cell phone's provided is medical already is medical insurance supplied or does that come no we never vote we never vote insurance is insurance buget some of you just so get pulled out it's a
deduction but she isn't fact to being paid 750 per mon so this is for year right and I mean that's that needs probably just be changed I'm my feeling it's just it shouldn't have been done in the budget just change it now on the vote you yeah so we good for the 750 car all well in the budget but just we got um b b um one point of clarity for
me is section seven hours of work U say 40 hour work week evening Miss evening commission meetings and workshops for the public forum special events I know that but with municip Municipal holidays accepted um because we have like what 11 Municipal holidays do we expect her to as I was thinking this would be because I think it was to provide Clarity on her not receiving overtime pay
for let's say July 4th um so what clarify for me with this this is an expect they get the next day off this is this is a this provision has less to do with compensation and more to do with her hours of work expectation when do you expect her to work I don't expect her to work on holidays though um except you do anticipate her to work on certain holidays so we can we can call out the holidays you don't expect her to
work um or I took the route of just striking this altogether because what the conversation I understand from Vicki is that she's on call 365 days a year whether it's a holiday or not she is expected to pick up the phone on July 4th on Christmas Eve on New Year's Day but I think if you don't have and I do understand that and that's an expectation of work now in the Personnel policies um so section four states of
emergency leave approval holidays we are making clear that she's entitled to the same Privileges and benefits as other salaried employees with regard to holidays so if they get paid for Holiday other salaried employees get paid for holiday time actually taken off she would to right I understand that but as I'm reading this and we're saying SP to the work I'm not saying saying on call isn't working but I would expect you to be in the office and we're saying that you don't get that you're not off for the holiday I guess is what I'm
saying I don't know how to reconcile the fact that you in fact expect her to work on Fourth of July at a at an event the city is hosting and she is expected to the city's closed the very next day they get the next day off that's how we come that that's how everybody's come so I think this and I think this part came up as an issue because of allay she works she have the next day off and she if that is City policy those policies apply to her but this is an expectation of work so I guess the question is do we expect her to work on Labor
Day no I mean I understand she's on call like for example as a pastor I'm on call 247 right but my church specifically says hey we don't expect you to work Monday Friday Saturday you're on call but we don't want to see you in the office for a certain amount of days so that that's what I'm saying like this is your contract my interpretation will always be my interpretation but if y'all are all in agreement on what your don't expect it to work like the snowstorm for instance snowstorm happens right let's
say it happens on a holiday she has no choice but to work right but I don't expect her to go to work if there's nothing going on cuz I think the issue came up that she received overtime pay working for MLK holiday right as a special event so I think that's where the issue even with this discussion even came up but it's a City Event right so I think that's covered on the city event is is she compensated for City events in the in the in that she would
she would be now she would be now but does everybody get do the other yeah just she'll be as other department to get paid for City events because they have a policy that applies to them um and again there's two things an issue everyone else is not under contract right and so if her contract doesn't entitle her to that compensation there's an argument she's not entitled to it right here my particular problem is that there was no expectation that she work in other words Municipal holidays are Sac she is not expected to work she in
fact did work because there was a clear expectation she do she would do and so what what happening in fact and what the contract said didn't match I was just trying to reconcile that okay so she comes in on Labor Day and she gets paid for working that holiday I guess I'm just trying to understand like I would get paid can can I would get paid as a an employee just like on Labor Day nobody comes in no one except for the people um that um may run
trash I get paid for that day because that's a holiday and so it ties back to our Personnel policy how do how do other s people get paid I mean what's their pay for that day is it a that's holiday pay that is a percentage of their salary or is is a holiday it's just like they've worked and I guess my concern is so so what I mean what what is the bump and pay is it different for every department head based on their salary or no it's just like it's just a a set
amount no it's just their base salary that they work say an employee I don't know gets $25 an hour for that holiday they're going to get $25 an hour because that's a holiday that's a holiday that you all have approved as a city holiday that no one works but they get paid for that holiday we got we got to get our heads around this because we're paying her as a city manager which is an all-encompassing salary okay right it
should be something that hey you know city manager job is all it's around the clock and that's why you know her salary is probably the the top salary in the city right so is this contract is what we her base pay good enough to say hate you know hayte you know tough tough tough you know what if it's a holiday and you want to work you
work if you know um overtime all that you know other city managers U Mr wart you said you you interviewed them and they said overtime haa I don't I mean my salary is my salary you know so I think that was call incoming in the salary it's an all-encompassing salary right which is you know that's why you that's why you're you're you're you're the you're the head on the total poll and your C manager right so your overtime is not in here I guess my question for
clarity is by striking Municipal holidays does that mean that we want her to that she would be that she would have to come in and work on the municip me her salary includes whether she works or not I guess what I'm trying because there may be a different commission that says hey it's Labor Day I want to meet with you today and and because it's not in the contract to say you don't get off Municipal holidays being with that person so so that's what I'm trying to figure out like by striking Municipal holidays are we saying that I know she
works 365 24/7 I understand that but are we striking that because in the previous two contracts for Joe sh and Michael White and in the previous contract we didn't strike it so I guess I'm just trying to I don't wanted to set up where was it in the previous contract for the previous City I don't I don't know either haven't looked at the previous one is her is her salary compensatory to say Hey you know you got to you got to
roll with the punches if it if you know if that's the case because she's a contracted city manager not a department head City salour employee you know so I don't I don't know do we set up us we're the commission that sets the rule here right his this contract almost mimics uh Michael White except for some changes here they took the same contract when I originally signed the contract and they mimic that contract um when it comes to everything just for a few
caveat in there um but basically you know there there's not a lot um different from that and part of that is these are just City holidays that the city is closed you say the city is closed on those days and no work is done um but yeah if a commissioner calls me and ask me a question or ask me about uh Chief and I we I mean if there's a accident somewhere or something happens
I'm working whether you know it or not the majority of time I am working you don't know it so Kim does not stru Municipal holidays accepted it's your contract yes I struck it because I needed to resolve the logical inconsistency and that was the solution to me but if it doesn't make sense to y'all keep it just to clarify because if you look in section c the new SE and then in the very first line says employees shall be entitled to bonuses holiday and emergency pay at the same time a man are given to other salaries
to employees so if I understand that right that she has to come in a holiday then she's going to get extra pay she'll be entitled to it right yeah all right well just to make sure everyone understands that what you're saying by striking it it reconciles whatever legalities you say were not clear does for me with her expectations of hours of work in terms of what that traditional 40-hour work week is and what a saite it it resolves it for me if it
doesn't make sense to y'all keep it in there this is your contract with her and if y'all are on the same page that is the most important thing all right so we take your recommendation well I I think the difference the way I look at it is let's take more uh M MLK um that was a flashback uh you know the
commission encouraged this to be located in Lin Haven and so who did we expect to arrange all of it but the city it went from being a private event to a City Event right that's yeah so it would have it would take it took place here annually which was an exception right to her regular responsibilities right added
been it's been added to the holiday calendar U for you know so can it be U stated some somehow in your legal um that unless directed by by the commission that um she will receive payment
for whatever is that the section that's in the salary there that you put in yeah so that what you're saying that's what's covered there that's correct but Jamie stated that it's already in there but who determines that us is it specific contct to the employee handbook whatever the employee handbook says all right so that gives us a point
of reference the employee him will be the point of reference to determine how that will work out I mean this you know the same goes for the 4th of July you know the commission supports the Fourth of July celebration I mean we don't support uh and everybody works but the commission also votes to give the following the following day is the actual that's true everybody true I mean in certain cases like where she's the only one that works I mean like you know she I think if she
was a city manager she'd still be out there working her butt off on you know I I know I looked at the pay so why not why not give her the next day off you know she won't take the next day off well yeah per for the contract it says she can unless it V unless it interrupts the city right functioning so then she typically probably doesn't because like you said she she can't all right
uh we had a little time to mull over the salary any other thoughts on that a number that we can give am to put in there so we can get ready for Tuesday are we back salary yeah we got to put a number in there so we can get a update for Tuesday I gave my opinion so 5% based on the evaluation based on the evaluation can we can we say
6% you can say whatever you want all right I'm just you saying five I'm saying can we do six well we're all going to vote on it anyway yeah what do you think P um can we do 6% I think I think uh I think 5% is good I I
did it at four so I'm I'm willing to do 5% let's put in the number for 5% we look at it on Tuesday and any questions about the multiplier on 54 yeah I don't understand that Miss Jennifer us little explanation
please I think the way it's written it just gives the opportunity for us to go to the pension and find out the impact um of an increased multiplier is for this position but typically in volatile positions meaning positions that are at risk of not having a long long um tenure which this whenever you're an executive director your tenure is often
limited to contracts or specific times if that that individual participates in a pension there is What's called the an increase in the multiplier that is the percentage that both the um High average of the high five years of salary times a multiplier times times of years um and then the Actuarial accountants do fancy stuff and come up with a pension amount it is the one factor that can increase
the amount the final amount of what the pension payment would be for example in the State of Florida the highest multiplier is reserved to elected officials as yourselves um judges uh elected officials have the highest multiplier then Senior Management heads of departments and law enforcement has the second highest multiplier down to
the then then there's a medium range I think they have four levels of multipliers for the F FRS program it it's just one of the again it's something for you all to consider um in some of the city manager information that I collected one way that cities address this is is they pay completely for all the contributions both the employee the contracted employee and the employer side so that the contracted
employee doesn't have to contribute to pension it's paid at 100% um that's another way that they do it so by saying yes to this as I'm reading it if we leave it as as it's proposed we're just saying that we would consider it and not that we're saying this was going to happen I mean in the past commissioner there was no percentage there was it requires a a special study to be able to come back to you and explain what the if we leave this as is we're not saying in the we're
not voting to say yes we're going to do a multiplier we're just saying that we won't that we'll agree to considering a proposal for the C to be done and legally it has to go before the pension the pension has to consider it and then if they consider it they pass an ordinance got it that's that's set by State Statute got it so the Pion like mine was 48% of the highest five years is that what you're talking about well that's that's kind of what they
call the cheat sheet to help explain what your your actual payment may be but to get there there is an actual formula that probably use 3.5% of the your high five times your numbers of years um extrapolated out on how long they expect you to live and that's what comes out with a um your month pension payment it's very complicated all right so I say yes leave it there um and then
we'll work on getting those numbers in the next we'll work so we're voting to just look at this leave it open okay so that's what we're that's what will be included contract no numbers just looking at it yes no numbers yes that's what we're agreeing to
so all right aome me your journ