Calling our meeting to order at 900 a.m. This time we have the invocation by Pastor Terry Bush of Zion Church followed by the pledge of allegiance. Thank you for your opportunity to provide the invocation for today's meeting. Let's pray. Father God, today
is a day that you have made. I humbly invite you into this room and into these proceedings. I want to invoke your presence. So, Holy Spirit, come. I ask you to bring truth, honor, peace,
and humility into these proceedings. Holy Spirit, we remind all of our public servants of Jesus's words that the greatest among you will be your servant. For those who exalt themselves will be humbled and those who humble themselves will be exalted. Father, I pray that every public servant will be reminded of
their duty to be humble and to serve the interest of our community above their own. Likewise, I pray that every community member would also see themselves as a servant of our community. I pray that civic pride and engagement will replace apathy. Help us
all to remember that truth and light are the ultimate disinfectants. Father, I pray that truth, honor, integrity, and righteousness would reign in our beautiful community. Father, let your holy light shine in and
on our city. Let your light shine to reveal the truth. Lord, where there is corruption or wrongdoing, let it be revealed so our city can heal. Where there is progress and good works, let them be praised. Above all, Lord, let truth be revealed and let the cards fall
where they may. Heal our city, heal our county, heal our state, and heal our nation. Let personal agendas and grudges be set aside to work for the benefit of our city. We ask today to be a productive and beneficial meeting in the
mighty and powerful name of Jesus. Amen. Pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and
justice for all. Right. Cory Langford. Good morning. I went to the table talk about the RV parking ordinance. Um I believe it was last Thursday. It was a little bit late. The oversight committee meeting went uh a little over. But
anyway, um I was kind of appalled at some of the stuff that I heard there. Um number one, um there was a big turnout and uh I think that the residents, you know, got their point across, but what I was concerned with is to find out that
we're using water meters to determine where the public right away is. I looked through the ordinance and I couldn't find it anywhere. And I went to all these meetings and um I was like, man, who came up with this? So I asked the question multiple times, hey could you tell me who deter who instructed to use
the water meters as a as a guideline to turn it public right away and it was say to the commission on multiple times. So in your commission report would you please identify yourself if you directed that you use the water meters to determine public right away. So um you
know we got past all of that and I'm like man this is this is ridiculous. So obviously something needs to change. The intent behind the original ordinance was don't don't block the street and don't block the sidewalk. It was pretty simple, right? But we somehow screwed it
up. Okay, so now we got to fix it. That's okay. I mean, the Constitution was passed and I think there's something over 20 something amendments to the Constitution. So that's okay. We can amend the ordinance and go back and fix it. All right. So I think I I wasn't
opposed to determining a distance off of the side of the street. If you remember initially I said, "Hey, you know, we've got a non-standardized infrastructure in Linhaven when it comes to water me sewer pipes and water pipes." Remember that was the two the two things that you guys
are juggling on what to solve, right? But we've got a non-standardized infrastructure as it relates to public utilities. So, that should have been um indicator number one not to use that, but that's okay. Um the common sense train has left the station. So we can't
use common sense anymore to uh to implement this enforce rather this ordinance. So let's figure out a distance. All right. On how far we need to be from the street. Some have said 5t from the street, 2t from the sidewalk. I think that's extremely reasonable. You
know, well the problem is if my neighbor can't back out even 2 ft off the sidewalk, what do we do? Well, the city has the ability to fix that as well. You can set a 5t from the street, 2 ft from the sidewalk distance, and then you can put a caveat in there that if a neighbor
complains to the city for visibility issues, the city then can can increase the setback for that property up to but not exceeding x amount of feet. We'll call it 10 feet. If if we want to call it 10 feet, I got a 2500 truck and 10
feet off the sidewalk or off the street, I'd still be able to back out of my driveway. So, that's what I would uh encourage you all to do today is figure that out um get some public input on what the footage needs to be um and go from there. Thank you,
Miss Hernandez. Hello, my name is Sher Hernandez. I have been a citizen of the city for many years. This is my first commission meeting as a citizen. Sent you all an email after the table talk. I got responses from the majority
of you. Some I did not. So I would simply like to read the email. Commissioners, I am a citizen of Linhaven and have been since about 1995. I worked for the city for over 20 years as a police officer and retired a few
years ago. Prior to retiring, we checked the city ordinances and even spoke to Chief Ramy about the ordinances to make sure we purchased an RV we could keep in our home. You see, after both my husband and I
working weekends, nights, holidays, and committing our lives to the city and its betterment, we knew we wanted to retire and enjoy this great country that so many gave their lives for. We missed a lot of birthdays, holidays,
anniversaries, and so on working for the city. So, after retiring, we purchased an RV, a drivable one, so we could keep it at our home without violating laws or ordinances. When you all voted for the new ordinance, it is now illegal for us to
keep our RV at our home. We are being told we would be fined $250 a day. This really upsets me and so many others. So, we had to move fast and work hard to find a safe place for our RV. In case
you are not aware, the cost of renting storage is about $250 a month and up. If you are not familiar with an RV, you should keep it plugged into electricity to prevent mold, mildew, and damage to the interior from the heat and humidity.
Most RVs have two ACs, which require a 50 amp plug. Most storage facilities only provide a 30 amp plug which only allows you to run one AC. One solution for us was to build an outdoor storage area. The starting cost of about
$15,000. That does not include a parking pad or electric service. So because of your vote, you are costing the citizens of Linhaven and most our retirees a lot of money, stress, work to now comply with an ordinance they were
previously in compliance with. A solution may be to repeal the ordinance altogether or add a grandfather clause so the citizens who were in compliance will not be violated or allow citizens to park in their driveways regardless of the ride ofways
as long as it is not in the road. You currently allow this for other vehicles, boats, trailers, utility trailers, food trucks, jet skis, etc. that block sidewalks and park on the rideways but not RVs.
The current ordinance really makes the RV community feel like we are being discriminated against. Let's please take care of this issue. David Garrett. Good morning. I'd like to speak on the RV uh issue. Uh just a little
background. I'm a lifelong engineer. I tend to do things with technical details. So that's how I brought copies of a little diagram. Am I allowed to hand that to the to the group? Give it to the city attorney.
What you have in your hand or will have in your hand is a survey. It's a copy. I have the original survey of the property that was that my wife and I built in 2002. And it shows
uh the orientation of our property. Where the water meter is is the orange dot. I'm one of the houses that the water meter is in the back of the property. I have a concern about the the city using the water meter to designate
public rightway for two reasons. One, the fact that it discounts my whole property from being used. Second is that the water meters are generally intended to be placed in the utility corridor.
The easement that is on is private property with conditions that are written as a contract between the city and the property owner as far as use what the city can do or utility
companies and what the the owner can do. And in this enforcement of the ordinance, which the city has every right under public rightaway to determine how it's used, it does not
have that same right on the easement on private property. That's spelled out by contract. And so what you what this enforcement of the ordinance through the water meter is doing is it's putting an undue
restriction on my use of my property. And so I would ask that the city commission review the the use of the water meter as the measure for enforcement. I was also
quite surprised when I looked at my survey uh that the sidewalk doesn't follow my property line just like I thought it would was originally. So I know people have raised concerns when sidewalk is brought up and this
survey shows that it rather than follow the two foot of the private of the private property line it actually deviates around my driveway. So, right. Thank you. Obviously, that's a concern. Yes. Thank you,
Anelia Bush. Morning. Um, I wrote a letter and sent an email to everyone on the commission and the mayor. I received a response from Mr. Peoples. Um, in my email, I also attended the town hall meeting. Um,
I consider myself a fairly new resident. I've been here eight years. I moved from a small community to a small community. I believed felt like a small small town like what I was used to. Um, I moved into the neighborhood. I'm directly across the street from David that just
spoke. Um, I noticed when I was looking for a home to buy that it looked like, you know, a very, uh, well-kept city. Uh, the neighborhoods were nice, neat. I noticed people had enjoyed their boats and jet skis and campers were all parked
in their drives. Um, I recently bought one four months ago. Um, I should have looked at an ordinance. I didn't. I just by driving around seeing what how everyone else had their property used. I
thought, well, I'll be okay. Um, I am, what I had learned was maybe we were measuring from the center of the road and I was trying to find my right away and that kind of thing. I'm about 40 feet from the center of my road. I live
in a culde-sac. I too have a strange way of my um sidewalk goes around my property, which made my water meter way up in my yard. My drive is on the longer part of my property. Um, I try not to impinge on a sidewalk. I don't like
people having to go around things to, you know, so we we try not to do that even with friends over and things like that. Um, but I did go to the city meeting to because I learned I was a case number on this ordinance and I was waiting for this letter I was supposed
to get. So, I wanted to get clarification and I just was appealing to clarification on this and hopefully we can come to a good understanding of how we can enjoy our properties. I do have a small property. I have no way of
getting my RV into my backyard. I I and I can't park it on the side of my house or I feel like I would be impinging on my neighbors property. So, um I'm just here hoping to hear a good reconciliation on how we can get this
worked out. Thank you, Ricky Barnes. Ricky Barnes on 24th Street. The two went to the meeting uh had it was informative,
got some good ideas, got some mixed reviews, but overall it sort of will put us in a new direction specifically and hopefully not do anything with these
water meter things. I appreciate every commissioner returned. I call or email every one of them. They come up with uh their thoughts and ideas
on what is happening, what they hope to do and hope to gain. Uh I'm on is one of them that brought up of course everybody wants to be safe being on a street where our water meter
is like 15 ft from the front of the house which uh I still park there with my cars. RV is well inside the
rightway sign. I made mention of public tele uh the telephone poles, power poles being pretty much a standard. After riding around the town a little bit, found out that some
like mine were probably 8 or 10 feet off the road. And then I saw a street where 10 or 15 feet off the road. So that baby's out.
uh a measurement from that side of the road. Maybe it's something to consider. Uh if the water meter thing is an issue, I think uh it's on my private property
then. I'm sure when those all my houses the houses were built on our street, it was just stick it there. here on all these houses because it's less pipe for me to run contractor.
But uh I think even uh a measurement from the center of the street, which ours is not as wide as some streets, I think uh some of them
on the edge of the road might be a better thing. Um, just some of the things don't have seem to have any common sense to them, but I think y'all can settle on something
that'll make everybody happy. Work hard enough. Uh, back to Miss Gainor. The road was patched. Some of it's coming back up, but it was patched.
Uh, Chief Ramy, uh, saw some attention back to the stop sign in our street. Thank you. That's your time. Okay. Thank you. Walker.
Good morning. Nice sunny day. Um, I've been around and I've been responsible for the United States and the citizens over numerous occasions. I visited the tribes. I've been with the tribes in Africa. I've lived with them.
I've been under governments under government control and rules and regulations all over the world. also been under the rules and regulations of the United States Maritime Master at sea. I'm responsible for
running and control and safety of the vessels under the protection of the United States flag. I have been protected by the Marines in embassies overseas under fire and insurgents want to get us. I've been
protected by United States naval cruisers offshore of the embassies who take the people out. I've been with governments. This government we have here has been so mismanaged since the days of John Lynch
that I I'm really ashamed. You just can't make a decision. You're not centered around the people. That's what I was trained for. Centered for the people and the protection of the United States. I'm not the only one.
There are civilians overseas dying for you. Protect the rights of an American and that flag. This RV thing is ridiculous. This government here that we have now has got problems.
It is mismanaged. It has been mismanaged since the days of John Lynch. It's too bad you cannot think for the people. For example, you're in a building right now that doesn't have a
CO illegally. You're in this building that's unsafe. You have a government that says things and doesn't do it themselves. For example, the takeover of Kane Griffith Park under fire. Bullets fired.
The criticism came out to all the citizens of this town rather than the people that did the incident. They got away scot-free and shots were fired and you know it.
What you say for us to do, you don't do yourself. That is with the RB. That is with this building. that is with your government. You've got problems. You got to
straighten it out. Make a decision on the RV problem today. Thank you very much. Cannot read this name, but it's 306 Alexander is the address. Uh, Miss Weaver,
I have two things. Um, one, I don't own an RV. Probably never will. But the people in my neighborhood keep their stuff up very well. And in case we don't forget, Florida is a retirement state where people come to live so they can
travel. Um, I think there's more important issues to deal with and RVs. These people worked hard all their lives as long as they maintain their lawns and stuff. I don't see why you're taking away some of those freedoms. Two, do you
think he can fix the hole at Floyd Drive in Petty and along Floyd? That thing has been there for a couple of months. People are knocking the sign over and uh we really need to work on that. Give these people their rights back. I mean,
like I said, I'll never own one, but I love to see the people traveling with it, going where they need to be. But the best part about this thing I'm about to say is my nephew and niece visited from Atlanta. They were amazed
at the beautiful things that happened on the bridge, how they felt safe and that the community was clean and it was friendly. and they couldn't believe that nobody was shooting or doing anything violent and they had a really great
time. So, please give these people their rights back. There's more important issues. They have worked hard all their lives to get those RVs and to be where they are today. There's more important stuff to think about, guys. And RVs,
give them their right back and let's work on healing this city, please. Thank you, Kelly Davis. Um, good morning. I am actually here today because on 4th of July Friday, the
city took it upon itself to park vehicles on my private land. And when I went out to talk to the deputy or the sergeant, I apologize for uh about it. Um, I was lied to
repeatedly from Chief Remy, the deputy chief, and several of the police officers about why there were cars on my private property. I have been told that I am not allowed to sell parking spots
on my private property because of some ordinance or I need a permit or something. If I'm not allowed to sell parking spots and have people park on my private land, then I'm sorry, but the city darn sure isn't going to do it. I
know you weren't charging, but I don't want people parking on my private land. Several of my signs were stolen. My land was chewed up by tires. There's an area in the back where it's very easy for people to get stuck. And all of that
would have been on my liability, not the cities. The problem is I understand mistakes happen. The problem is that I was lied to. I have the lies in screenshots, text messages, everything else. They have all
been sent to Judy Tinder because unfortunately when I email you guys or call, I hardly ever get answers. Thankfully, Judy does actually respond to me. Um, I do have an invoice right here for
the signs that I had to replace that were stolen that would not have been out there if the police had not been parking people on my land in the first place. So, I would like to be reimbursed for my signs and I would honestly like an
apology from Chief Remy for what happened because the deputy parking the or the sergeant parking people on my land was doing so under instructions. Um, I have a feeling that'll never happen, but I would like to be
reimbursed at least since I can't get the damage to my land replaced. I would at least like my signs replaced. So, thank you very much. Christy Mroy, Johnny Basher. Yes, this is about the recall Mayor
Nelson petition business. The person chairing that committee donated funds to Judy Tinder and also support sent out a letter in support of Judy and of Jamie prior to the election. The stated purpose they they're very not Jamie and
Judy, I'm sorry, but the the the committee is very adamant that they want Vicki gone and they want the mayor gone. They see sending the mayor away as a way to get rid of Vicki, which I understand what they're doing and and that's perfectly within their right to do so. But we need to proceed very carefully
with that. I want to give a little bit of information from a personal standpoint on some of those that are in this group. While I was running for well, let me just read. So, there's this web page out there or a group called the Beacon of Bay County that both Jod Moore
and Gap Parker are administrators of and very active on. During the campaign, while I was campaigning for commission this time, Jodie Moore posted false and misleading information about me during the election cycle. She participated in an attempted character assassination,
posted outright lies. She said, "I forged my father, my dead father's signature. She and acted as an unlicensed contractor. Both falsehoods." She posted a photo from another candidate's financial report, attributed to to attributed it to me, and then
proceeded to make accusations against me based on that information. Also, in the past, GAP via that web page falsely accused Michelle and I of being plants here at the commission meetings in support of Vicki, which is absolutely false. So, and and with all of this, I'm
still considering what actions I may take on these matters. According to them, the only one telling the truth is the person that actually plead guilty to lying to the FBI. I place zero confidence in anything they may represents truth. It would be interesting to me what they could say
under oath. Thank you, Melissa Smith. So, my name is Melissa Smith, 257 Kimberly Drive. I have sent um I received a letter in violation of our travel trailer that we used on
Mr. to be in compliance. Secondly, of course, um along with other people's questions as far as the rightway. And then the third, we have a camping trip coming up next week and it says on the letter that the fines will begin on July
11th. So, I want to know if we have our camping trip next week. this hasn't been settled and cleaned up yet. Will I start receiving those fines? I plan on bringing the camper back if we do move it uh so that I can pack up and have it ready to go. So, I just want some clarification on what that's going to
look like. You and Jerry Parker. Good morning commission Jerry Parker RP place. I just want to clarify something that Mr. Basher said. First of all, we are not part of that committee. We do
support them, but we are not part of the recall committee. Enough said on that. I have a question and then a comment. My first question would be given the fact the panhandle
engineering has made a deposition and a testimony Will you continue to employ him in the city of Linhaven? That is my question. Second comment I have is Mayor Nelson,
would you please when you're doing the commentary, would you go in order and not skip people and put people in last to your advantage? Thank you. Thank you for your public commentary.
This time, moving on to the mayor's reports, want to get response to some of the citizen concerns that came up during public commentary. Um, in regards to the water meter, many of you mentioned um the usage of the
water meter. Uh, city manager, do we have clarification on the using the water meter for the public right ofway measurement? Mayor, that was um at the end of the meeting. I think that uh Chief Remy
actually asked what would that clarification be in terms of where they would measure it. I think he turned around to Bobby and Chris and asked that and water meters were where they said that that would be gauged from um
during the meeting. I think it was during a meeting if I'm not mistaken. Okay. All right. And Miss Hernandez Bush and Davis and Smith. I don't have any emails
in my email account. So, I'm not sure if it didn't go to the right email address or I checked my junk as well, but I don't don't have any emails for Hernandez Bush, uh, Smith or or Davis. Um as well
also in regards to um shots being fired at Kane Griffin. Is there any No, there were no shots fired at Kang Griffin. I think uh what Mr. Walker is referring to is that was maybe 3 4 years
ago some shots were fired at Kang Griffin. Um, but there was nothing happening that I know of in the past weeks or whenever he's alluding to it may have happened. I think that was um may have been when Commissioner Tender
was still on now. Was that was that at the park itself or was that around the adjacent streets to the park? I think it was around the adjacent streets. I can't Yeah, it was. Somebody was holding a party in the park and a
group congregated, hundreds of people. They were blocking the people to get into their homes. Parents were hiding their children in the back of the house. And actually, the story I was told by a friend of Chief Ramy's, couldn't tell you their name now. He pulled up and
they blocked him from coming in. He got out and said, "Y'all better move." We had the sheriff's department there. We had um Linhaven Police Department there. We had a number of different uh organizations there. But yes, shots were fired. Yes. I guess I'm getting trying to get
clarity on I remember the incident, but were shots actually fired at Kane Griffin? Yes. Hold on. Chief Raymond, could you come up and and clarify that for us? This confirmed was about three years ago and I want to say it was on Memorial Day
weekend or one of the weekends and the shots were fired and they were fired from a residence a couple blocks away. Okay. So, not at the park itself but at a couple of blocks over from the park. Correct. Okay.
All right. Thank you. Um, and then also in regards to Miss Davis mentioning someone parking the city parking on her private property, having residents park on her private property. I will get with Miss Davis afterwards
and look at those invoices and surely if there was something we damaged, we are more than willing to uh make sure that things are were taken care of. Okay, Chief Ramy, if you have any additional
information on that. Yes, ma'am. This lot was confused by one of my officers. It was a human error. We have a lot at third in Missouri and he parked at third in Montana. Miss Davis, I apologize for the human error and I
apologize for the text because I thought it was resolved and it was not. I apologize to you publicly about that. It's our fault and we will replace whatever took place. Thank you. Right.
Thank you for that uh for that clarity. Um in regards to the mayor's report, um we'll be brief. Uh we did have wonderful uh Fourth of July celebration. Thank you to um all of the employees and
volunteers that made um the best and biggest Fourth of July celebration in Bay County possible. So thank you all for that. I know many of you all came to work around 5:00 a.m. and didn't leave until after 10 p.m. So thank you all very much for
all the hard work you did to make it a a great event for our entire community. uh met several people um at the event that were not crumbling haven as we always do and so they were very um delighted and excited about the wonderful things that they experienced um at that event and
all the events that we host. So thank you all uh very much for continuing to make us the best city um in Bay County and Northwest Florida um as well. Also, I know last meeting I said that I would follow up on some matters that uh was
brought up by Commissioner Tinder and some citizens regarding some fencing um and possibly invasion of privacy issues. Uh we did reach out uh city staff, city attorney did reach out to the um to the
land owner. Um from my understanding, the land owner declined to meet. Um, do you have any further information on that, city attorney, in regards to meeting with the landowner or why he declined to meet? Um, I did hear from the the adjacent
land owner, Mr. Mela's attorney, um, and invited them to meet. They declined that invitation. I sent my contact information to the neighbors who complained about the cameras and invited them to contact me and I have not heard further. Okay. Do you know why the adjacent land
owner declined to me? Did they give any He He didn't think there was anything to resolve. He felt like he was within his rights and there was nothing no change needed to his behavior. Okay. Um as it relates to the uh to the variance um that was asked in regards to
the fence. I did follow up with uh city manager and city attorney and they did say that the um home owners could file a variance if they liking it. Just go through the process. Um, so I did follow up uh with the homeowner. I sent them an
email this morning just verifying that they do have, you know, the right to file a variance, but at this time we cannot guarantee any approval of it, but you know, they can file the variance and go through the process um if they'll like to do that. So, uh, that is my
report. Commissioner Peeles. Thank you, Mayor. Uh, first I want to say that, um, thanks to everyone that made Fourth of July happen. It was a lot of fun. Uh the parade was awesome. You know, it was full of events all day at
at Sheffield Park and then Kinsol and it was a hot one, but it was fun. And I appreciate all the staff and and all the citizens and and everyone that came out. It was it was a lot of fun. Um and thanks for everyone for the opening ceremony making that happen and all that. It was great. Uh, next I wanted to
point out that fall ball is currently filling up quickly and from my understanding I think we may be the only city in the county from what I read that has sixu softball. So if you have someone that wants to play 6U softball, please sign up quickly because it's
going to fill up quickly cuz we seem to be the only ones that can handle that uh load of of players. Uh next, um this past week I met with the some of the officers and some of the members of
the senior center across the street there just to get a pulse on how things are going over there. They um really had enjoy what's going on. They they're having a great time with how everything's going. Um and I talked to the city manager about some small things in the preme that we had yesterday that
they've requested and all that. So, um, if if you're interested in that, you just go back and listen at the preme. Uh, next, I had my coffee with commissioner on the 28th, and my next one will be on the 19th of July. I'm going to meet at Sweet Stacks, uh, this
time with anyone that wants to meet with me. I meet at 8:00 a.m. Um, I haven't been to Sweet Stacks yet, and I've been wanting to go for a long time, and I think it's fair that they get some of my business because I appreciate them being here. Um, I've heard great things from people that have been there and uh my
wife really wants me to get her some coffee from there. So, I'm gonna make it happen or a milkshake. There we go. Um, so as far as the uh water meters, um, Mr. Langford asked in our report to talk about them. So yeah, that was uh I can
confirm that I that what h what the city manager said is that after near the end of this the meeting, Chief Ramy did come up here and ask about the water meters. That was my fault. I did not recall that happening
and I and I apologize for that. Um, but we're here to resolve it today. And so whether I can't talk for anybody else up here on what we're going to vote on, but we are going to talk about it today. I can guarantee that. Um, let's see what
was next. Uh, oh, I also wanted to clarify again that the whole point of the RV thing was not to take rights away. Okay. Prior to this ordinance coming up, it was illegal to park in the front yard and the sideyard.
We're trying to figure out a way to allow that. So, we're not taking rights away. If there was confusion on if you're allowed to or not in the past, that was confusion and we're trying to clear that up. Legally, you weren't allowed to previous to this have it in
your front yard. Uh, and a lot of times, most of the time, it's complaint based. Uh, so if your neighbor had never called and complained about your RV being in the front yard, someone probably didn't come out and look at it. But now we're trying to
resolve all of that. So, thank you for your feedback and getting up with me about the RVs. Great feedback. Um, I guess I should also say I think uh every once in a while emails go to our junk email. So, if you don't get a response from me, uh, I try to respond to every
email. And so if I don't respond within like 24 hours, there's a possibility that it went to my junk email. So just um try again or give me a call and just leave a voicemail and say, "Hey, I I sent you an email." And I'll double check my junk email cuz sometimes I try
to check my junk email every day, but sometimes I forget. And so I apologize for that. But that might be why some up here have not responded is that maybe some of the emails went to the junk email. I don't I can't confirm that cuz I can't check their emails, you know, but it's possible that it happened. And I guess that's a nice little friendly
reminder to check your junk every once in a while. It's not anything the city's doing wrong. Outlook, we use Outlook and sometimes that happens. Outlook is a very good product. It's used across the nation. It just happens sometimes. Um, oh, another thing I wanted to bring
up is back uh a few meetings ago, I think it was June 24th or so, Commissioner Tinder brought up um potentially looking at uh meeting times. I don't want to make a motion or anything today about it, but um it's been brought up to me quite a bit. I know it's been brought up to
Commissioner Tinder now, and as you guys know, I was in favor of changing the meeting times uh when I came on the commission back in 2023. So, I would like to put that on the agenda next meeting. I'm not I don't want to just to discuss it. I don't want to make any
motion or anything today. Um because I want feedback from people. I I want what people want. I um you know, I got I talked about it last time. Um it I could tell that that's not the way we wanted to head in and it was cool. And I it's not a hill I'm willing to die on. I
really I just something to talk about because I've done the research and over eight out of 10 working people in the city of Linhaven do based on uh Bureau of Labor Statistics works during the time of our morning meetings and I've been watching
over the past two years and our evening meetings have way more attendance. But that being said, I won't talk any more about that. We'll talk about it later. Um just if you have thoughts about it, I'm I'm all ears. If you're against it changing, cool. Um, if the department heads don't want it, cool. I mean, I
just want to I want feedback again. Figured it's a good time to bring it up again. Um, in response to the panhandle engineering thing, I haven't seen what's on the deposition, so I can't answer that yet. I know that there was a deposition. That's all. That's literally all I know. Uh,
and I think that's it. Um, thanks everybody for coming out. Uh, thanks for all the feedback and I'm looking forward to talk about this stuff today. if you want to stay afterwards. Um, we do have our our strategic planning meeting that we do once every two years. It's a lot of fun because we dig into the the weeds
of policies, ulc things like that. And, uh, again, thank you so much for everyone that made Fourth of July happen. It was a great time. All right. Thank you, Commissioner Perno. Thank you, Commissioner. Thank you, Mayor. Thank you, Commissioner Peeles. He he whispered
over to me about the junk email before he said it. And I do apologize anybody do apologize to anybody whose email I missed because I do respond to um great percentage of the emails. I won't say
that I don't miss them sometimes, but I I I I will pick up the torch for any one of you guys who has a concern with the city. So, and I and I know I talked to Mr. Garrett, Mr. Barnes,
um I we're gonna we're gonna hash this out today. I know that it's a good day to only have one one item of new business, isn't it? So, um July 4th, I'd like to echo the sentiments of Commissioner Peeles that um you guys do an amazing job. You deserve you deserve
your holiday for for postponing it. Um but you work hard on Fourth of July and you made a great Fourth of July parade happen. Uh I was proud to be part of it. Um actually uh the commanding officer for for the for the 325th was was there
and I got to walk up to him and you know it was nice that he remembered meeting me before and just a just a great guy and uh he had his boy there and I saw him when we went by when we were throwing candy. I think I was been over shoveling candy the whole darn time. I
don't think I stood straight up once in the parade. I just stayed stayed in position. Sa Sam and I and Judy were having a good time. So, it's, you know, it's it's once a year that we get to do that. And man, it is it is it is a hoot. And thank thank y'all for your
participation. The citizens um thank y'all for your concerns today and the people who come to to care enough to be at these meetings. Um the um like I said, the RV thing will be will be handled. Um the one the one thing I'd
like to um talk about in my report and if I miss anything else um um I know I know everybody who spoke in public commentary will be responded to. Um I I am I'm uh the chairman of the policy
board um of the of the St. Joe Bay St. Andrews Bay Estuary Program. And um um in in doing so, the the director of the estuary program um and I have we're we're in direct communication um and um
she um informed me that yesterday um that um the ESY program worked with public works to install 10 litter traps um at six locations. Um, and uh, a lit trap is basically it's
it's a mesh that goes over storm drain or under a storm drain and it it will uh it'll help uh keep debris and uh from clogging the bay and it'll keep the storm pipes from being clogged. So, it's a win-win for any city to have and for
us to install six of them in one day. She wanted to give a huge shout out to uh the public works staff. She said they were amazing and they did a great job dealing with the litter traps and the heat and making sure that they they were all okay as well. Now, um on a on a
further note, um the uh the litter traps um um they they they cost no money to the city and they'll be maintained monthly through the estate program. So, I I just
think, you know, that the the the ESR program is working hard in our in our city. I know they they they they worked hard to help us uh to to to get grant. They worked hard with the outfalls. They work hard with living shorelines. Um oy
oyster uh oyster farming or oyster harvesting. Um anybody who has a dock on the bay um you could contact the estary program. Um St. sjs a bp.org. Um the uh the the um
there's a great need for this estuary program. It's just getting started. And with any program, national program of designation or or regional program of designation within estuary programs, they enter into these things called
interlocal agreements where just like uh we we we all every municipality that that is impacted by the estuary um will will be asked or requested by the estuary program to make an annual donation through their budget. Um it's
done it's done for the transportation planning organization for our roadways and uh this this program like I said is in its infancy and it's it's at the time where it's it's it's blossoming or bosoming to the point where it's it is going to ask each municipality and the
county to kind of pony up so to speak. So today at our strategic planning um I believe I believe the city manager is going to present a summary of the estto program and the letter that's requested that I asked her to email it to me. So
uh and I asked city manager to share it with with the commission because this is probably the first time you guys are hearing about it but city manager responded to me and said that she would present it today in our strategic planning. And I do believe that um uh Miss Jessica Graham, the director, um
she was talking to me this morning, she would she would um she she would like to maybe pop in. So I' I'd ask indulge the city manager after the meeting. You can let me know about what time we're going to do that so we can get a hold of Jessica if she wants to stop in. She
will be presenting at our next meeting. Uh correct? Yes. Our second she'll be her 22nd presenting. So she'll be she'll and then that will be the exact the summary and the request will be public um and it and this is you
know but but she um she's planning on doing that and she's already spoke at the um in the county manager report at the at the last uh or two meetings ago for the for the the county meetings. So um hats off to to to our city for
embracing that. Um, it's been in the news, the litter of traps that they're doing and so forth. And this is just the beginning of how how um we could work to keep our bays safe, keep our waterways safe. And you know, I got I I got volunteered I volunteered into this
several years ago and now I feel like being being on the policy board, I I've I've learned enough to be at least a little bit confident to talk to you all about it. you know, it's been a it's been a great process to be a part of something that's coming into fruition
like this. So, with that said, um and um thank you, Mr. Langford. I spoke to you this morning almost almost was late cuz I we were talking on the phone and I like, man, I got to throw some water on my head and get to the meeting. So, I appreciate y'all and I appreciate all
our all our city employees and you first responders and all our military. Thank y'all very much. Yeah. All right. Thank you, Commissioner Ward. Um, don't have a whole lot. Um, first of all, thank you for everyone's feedback
on the RV ordinance. Um, if I didn't get back with you, it's probably because of the uh junk mail. Um, yeah, I'm guilty of not checking it when I should. So, I need to do better at that. Uh, I've had a few people call me um and I also
posted on my Facebook page and got a lot of feedback that way. So, um I will tell you the the intent of it wasn't the way it worked out for me anyways. I can't speak for the others, but um that wasn't my intent. Um but I think we'll be able
to hash it today. Um unfortunately, I wasn't able to make it the Fourth of July parade. I uh end up going out of town and uh taking a little bit of a break, but I heard it went good and appreciate everyone's hard work for um doing that. And that's all I have, but
thank you for being here. Appreciate it. Commissioner Tinder. Thank you. Uh, first off, I want to thank Pat, and I haven't maybe I shouldn't do it publicly, but I think so. Uh, last time I brought up Mr. Johnson on the corner of 11th, I went by
there 3 days later and all that wood was gone. So, I'm crediting you for that. Should I be serious? Okay. Okay. Well, whoever took care of it, thank you very much. Cuz I I went by and here I thought, "Oh, Pat said he'd
call him." So, I I here I gave you credit and Okay. We I remember I as I texted you and asked for his number. I couldn't get his darn phone number. Chris, so I I think Chris went out. It looks great. And I know he's planning
on keeping that up cuz he Well, you know, all the trees and all that business, but thank you. Thank you. Um, the other thing uh I wanted to bring up was the the mailbox for the senior center.
When I originally went there, it was a big deal. There was always a blue mailbox where anybody could put their mail to go out sitting right out here for years. That was the mailbox that I was trying to get
replaced. However, I suggested it go at the senior center. As Sam said, he went over there, discussed it with them again, and only one lady wants it. So, um, if that's the case, so be it. I was just trying to replace the one that, you
know, was out here and thought it would be more convenient for the senior center. Um, so unless they come back or somebody wants to speak up about it, I guess we're just going to let that go. Um, as
far as the situation with the camera out at uh, Cashamara, um, I appreciate the mayor getting in touch with him this morning. Um, I'm he's probably at work, but he'll get the message today. Um,
I still feel that situation is very unsafe. I think it needs to be um, addressed. Um, and other than that, the 4th of July was uh 4th of July was very hot at 130°.
Uh, that's how what it felt like. And um, uh, with two missing off the float, Pat's not kidding. We were like this. I was sitting in a chair flinging candy, t-shirts, hats through a opening this wide and just trying to throw them as
hard as we could cuz we had two extra huge buckets um, to get rid of. So, we just kept combining them and and throwing everything out. But the kids certainly appreciate it. And I have to say, I was counting down streets. Say, "Okay, guys, we're on Fifth Street. We
only have six more streets to go. Watch, you know, intersections. Let's get rid of this." And we counted down until we got rid of all of it. But it was great fun. And um I think everybody did a a wonderful job as they usually do on Fourth of July. And uh that's all I
have. Thank you. All right. Thank you, city manager, mayor. The first thing we will do is employee of the quarter and this employee of the quarter was u nominated by our former boss and um the leadership
team. We had several nom nominations that uh we looked at. This particular employee has went has gone beyond her job duties. Um, you will see her sitting in when CJ goes on vacation and takes
over, uh, putting together all of the minutes and getting them out. Uh, when her former boss had a very, very bad accident and, uh, broke one and sprang on her wrist. Uh, she was willing to really just be her, um, second set of
hands for everything in terms of getting her here, making sure she got home. uh doing all of those things, daytoday duties, and she just went beyond and beyond. And we just want to say thank you. The employee of the quarter is
Vicky Harrison. Would you come forward? warrant list. Any questions on the warrant list? I just saw you went, "Oh my." Um, I do have some questions. Yes, ma'am. Um, the first one is Emerald Coast
striping for $31,000. Can you tell me what we striped? That's ninth and avenue and Ohio Avenue here. When we redid this intersection, we put up parking stripes or what kind of stripes for 31
the uh the right turn lane on this side to go up uh Ohio Avenue. That was done several weeks ago. Okay. Was that done for the parade? It was done before the parade. We actually had to go through FDOT to get
their permission to put in a right turn lane. um a dedicated left turn lane, uh right turn lane and straight. And then same thing on the um the opposite side, right? Right by the grocery outlet. Like you you don't have to swing around cars anymore. They made two lanes at the
intersection on both sides of the road here and across the street. Right. They need to repair the one on the other side because when you pull up to that, you can't even see it on the street. I mean, that's just me for $31,000. I'd like to be able to see it when I pull on it. Um, the other one is
14,700 to McCll's SAD. What did we saw for that kind of money? Um, I've got 16,963. Is that what you're asking about? Sure. One moment, please. Um,
I have charges. It's several many projects. uh the streets department, the parks and grounds department again the streets department and a little bit of money to the storm water department. I have a copy if you would like a copy.
Hi, if you want to come up and tell those all of those things that were done that'd be great. Yes, ma'am. If you've been to Porter Park recently, around where the six smaller pavilions are, all of that was resided as part of a follow-up to the seaw wall repair, and that's where the
majority of that went. Wow. Okay. Thank you. Yes, ma'am. And then my next one is Waste Pro. Um $65,871. I remember and I'm going back in time, but I remember having a conversation
with Joel Schubert many years ago and we were nowhere near this. How are they determining? Well, I should probably ask you this question, but 65,000 that's for one month of trash pickup. Yes, ma'am. It's it's for commercial
and Okay. Now, WastePro also they has our commercial garbage account as well as they have a landfill that we take stuff to. So that 65,000 will have $55 to $57,000 worth of commercial garbage pickup a month as well as the bill for
the landfill. Okay. I would love to see that separated in the in the sense that what are we paying to dump in landfill and what are we paying for commercial? Has our have our commercial accounts increased? Yes, ma'am. That much? Our commercial accounts have gone up.
Absolutely. Um, but we were paying it's about $55 to $57,000 a month for commercial garbage pickup. Every every year they've gone up. Okay. Wow. I apologize. I didn't bring a copy of that with me because it is a monthly
charge. That's okay. Uh, and then this one was kind of random. Uh, 11 It's only $1,125, but for the life of me, I couldn't figure out what it was. Amanda Steifer 11:25
made out to Amanda St. Fer. I apologize, ma'am. I'm not going to have that on this list. This is just what was sent in your warrant. I can look it up and get it back to you later. That's fine. I just Yeah, just curious.
And then um beach stilts for 1875. What is that? That's the stilt workers for July 4th. Okay. Do you have any idea how much we spent on Fourth of July yet? Not yet. I can tell you what last year, my estimate for last year was,
but I I have no idea what this year will end up being. Okay. What was your estimate for last year? Um, including all the overtime for fire, police, facilities, maintenance, it's running somewhere around $150,000. Thank you very much. Certainly.
Any other questions? Finish. Oh, yeah. That's all the questions I have. Yes, ma'am. A couple other things with the um city manager report. Yes. Again, thank
all of the staff. This was a huge event. a huge undertaking. Everyone, if you don't know by now, attends our July 4th parade as well as that night. And um thank you to Blair Marketing and Communications for going
out getting many, many sponsorships for July 4th. And um all staff that work tirelessly from our 5:00 a.m. in the morning to 10:00 at night. It's really really a great event and we're glad to
see so many people out. Again, uh congratulations to the Linhaven Allstar Tenu and you probably have seen they brought home the Dizzy Dean World Series Championship. We haven't had a World Series tr championship since 2011. So
that's really a big deal for um the youth here uh in the city of Len Haven. Um, and I just wanted to to bring to your attention um someone that was a longtime resident here who passed uh
which was uh Elizabeth Libby Tanel and uh services were on July the 3. She was always at these commission meetings um a wellrespected resident here in the city of Lin Haven
and um just very active and dedicated to the city of Lin Haven and other areas. And so I just wanted to to to recognize her and tribute to her for all of the work she had done in the past and
support of the city and um just in support of city of Linhaven and mayor. That's my report. Right. Thank you. City attorney, any updates for us? Yesterday you asked the commission to submit um suggestions to the city
manager for revisions to the uldc and I wanted to submit one of my own. Um there was a new state law that passed um regarding the administrative regarding and requiring the administrative approval of plats and replats. That's inconsistent with your current process. So in the next meeting
or two, I'd like to bring you an ordinance that makes your processes consistent now with state law. Yes, if you'll bring that next meeting, please. I have nothing further. All right, moving on to our consent agenda.
Approval for minutes 62425, approval of the residential incentive program application for the development at 863 East 12th Street, and approval to authorize uh the mayor to sign amendment three for the CDBG
uh community block grant and approval to declare asset TH pump 23426 and asset 258 surplus and auction off. Is there a motion for this agenda? Motion to approve.
A second. All right. Motion by Commissioner Perno. Second by Commissioner Peebles. City manager, if we call the vote. Commissioner Perno, yes. Commissioner Peebles, yes. Commissioner Tender, yes. Commissioner Ward, yes. Mayor Nelson, yes. Motion passed. Um, and moving on to
um some old business discussion of ordinance 1177 relating to modification of RV parking standards on uh residential property. Uh so this is something that we did um discuss on yesterday um and said that we
would hear from residents today and have uh a little more discussion on it. Also um prior to our discussion uh is there any initial input from city attorney, city manager regarding this ordinance? Of course
have any thoughts? I'm not sure where to start, but I will say I feel like you the ordinance as written is legally sound. The concerns I hear at this point have to do with enforcement um and a administrative decision regarding a rule of thumb for measuring at a glance and quickly um if you're if someone is in
violation or not. Um I have also heard and want to clarify that with regards to code enforcement, a notice of a violation is just a notice. It does not have any penalties that occur with it. It is a first step in your adopted code enforcement process to put landowners on
notice that they could be in violation if they don't take some corrective action. Um before any fines or penalties are assessed, a citation has to be issued and the requirements of that citation do require um listing the actual ordinance or section number of
the code of which you are in violation, giving you a reasonable time to comply even then before fines are assessed. Um, so I just wanted to clarify the process based on some of the comments I heard today. Standby to make any revisions. As Mr. Peoples noted, this does expand the
areas in which RVs can be located. So now I feel like we're looking at an enforcement problem, not how to take away further rights. All right. Thank you. Um so we've heard from individuals especially as it relates to uh water meters and such. Um
do we have any additional thoughts? Uh we discussed some of this yesterday as well. Um is there any additional um thoughts that we should consider at this time? Um also we did receive an email um on yesterday after the pre-commission meeting. Um I don't know if you all received it in relation to this
ordinance as well. So uh that's I think that was good input and response from uh that citizen that we can also keep in mind as we discuss ordinance today. So I wanted to ask a question um as far as
the uh the lady who got up and spoke uh that received the letter and was worried about going on vacation and she felt that hers was dated July 18th that the fines would begin. She said the the my best guess is that's to put
them on notice as a deadline for compliance. Um at which maybe the police department intends to make another round of inspections at which point they might start issuing citations for which penalties would occur. It's just a notice. Okay. Well, go ahead.
Miss Tinder actually spoke to her and she's just asking for an extension. She's about to go on a camping trip. So her camping trip would have been timed out while she was gone. So, we granted it just now and it'll be added to the case notes.
Thank you. All right. Well, Commissioner Peeles, any further input on the RV ordinance? Yes. So, I do believe that as the ordinance stands now, it is legally
sound. I'm not a attorney, but I I hear what uh Amy is saying and I agree. Um, I do think though, like I mentioned a little bit, that we need to create more clarification. Uh, because although it may be sound, it's
still our goal to make it understandable to prevent any confusion in the future. So, uh, in a vacuum, water meters make sense. And I apologize to Chief Remy and
to the citizens or whoever about the water meter thing. He's right. He came up. He asked and um I'm the one that made the motion. So maybe I should have said, "Hey, let's add that to the ordinance or something so that it there was better clarification." So I
apologize for that. That being said, I think in a vacuum water meters make sense. But I have I did yesterday I did drive around some and because my water meter is on my private property so I figured there might be some more like that. I don't have an RV so I really
don't have a dog in a fight from that sense but um and I don't plan on owning one but uh and then we had some talks yesterday about sidewalks and things like that. And to be honest, my final thought on it all is we need to update the website to make it so when people
search it, it can be found. That's not a policy thing though. So that's just a request. I can't like tell you to do that, but that's just a request. Um, that being said, I the more I think about it, just to just so that we can prevent confusion from anyone that looks
at the ordinance in the future is I do think we need to have a footage thing. I know that in a perfect world, it's not going to be perfect. As someone said in the past, a a 90% solution is good and then we can fix it as we go. We found that what we
had initially we thought was good. There's been some confusion. So, if we can prevent confusion, cool. I'm all for it. I do think we need to put a footage thing and we need to say that it does not need to be on public sidewalks. One of the things that was brought up is
that there's some people in uh or I should say should not go over sidewalks that are on public property. Okay? Cuz for example, I have a sidewalk on my property and it's 2 ft from my house. Um it I I paid for it. It was
built by me. But I don't want the code enforcement to be confused about that. It's not it's not it's not fair to confuse the code enforcement on having to look at something and say, "Well, what does this really mean?" And have that conversation with the citizens. It's not fair to the citizens either. So, I think it should be sidewalks that
are on a public property. And another thing that was brought up was, for example, on Pine Forest, there is some there is some sidewalks there that are on private property is what I was told yesterday. So, if that's the case, it's not the citizen's fault that the sidewalk was built on their property.
So, I would put the caveat that it can't be over a public a sidewalk that's on public property because like I said, it's not their fault if the sidewalk was built on their property. Uh that those sidewalks were built years and years and
years ago. So, I don't want to give the impression that the current administration went in there and started putting sidewalks on on private property. I don't know if it's just over time there's been like creeps in the um variances or what have you. I don't know, but there is some instances where
that has happened. So, I don't want to penalize citizens for that. But again, this is the goal here is to allow people to have stuff that they didn't have in the past. Uh, for those listening, but my suggestion is whether it's five or 10
ft from the side of the road, code enforcement can just bring a tape measure with them. And I don't honestly as far as public sidewalks go, I would say just not over the sidewalk. Like the twoft buffered I don't that's cool I guess but uh I don't I mean if they're
not on the sidewalk they're not on the sidewalk. You can just take a piece of wood and put it like this on the sidewalk and if it hits the RV it's on the sidewalk. Uh but that's my suggestion. I'm not making a motion or anything right now. I'm just all right giving my opinion. Commissioner Pero, do
you have any additional input to what Commissioner Peebles has said or in response to citizens? Um, having having heard everybody's um the concerns that emailed, having spoke
with people, um the the ordinance was passed. Um, my feelings were that it wasn't clearly defined, so I didn't vote for it. But we're um we're we're we're needing
a if if we're going to use water meters, which I don't, you know, I think we've proven that there's certain situations where it doesn't work. And I know we agreed to do case by case um uh case by
case uh um um you know situation there but we don't want to end up doing case by case every time. Um a a a number of feet from from the edge of the road cuz sometimes there's sidewalk there's not
sidewalks. What are you going to do? Um and and if there is sidewalks, then a number of feet from sidewalks sounds like sounds like a a remedy where there's a where there's a where you can measure it on site, you know, where you can take you can you that that would
that would probably work the best. Now, in most situations, the water meter probably works, but if we if we went with a number of feet now, if we do the number of feet and we're encroaching on private property, you know, what happens
then? So, and the ultimate goal, I mean, I'm not going to I don't want to debate. I'm just throwing it throwing it up there to where that where where we we we may we may have doubt on that or not. But the ultimate goal is man when I'm backing out of my driveway and my
neighbor has an RV, I don't want to be in the road or on the sidewalk before I can see around the man's RV or or woman's RV. So, we've got to just keep in mind that it's it's got to be it's
safety that's the issue. So, so, um, let's let's decide on, you know, what we think, you know, you take a pickup truck, you know, you could still be you're not your butt end is not out in the road or not on the sidewalk and
that's the distance you need. You know what I mean? So, you can see around an RV. So, is that 8t? Is that 10 ft? You know what? What do you want to say? So, that's what we got to agree on. So, that's where I'm at.
All right, Commissioner Warick. Um, so I know one question I had yesterday was, you know, what about regular cars and that parked in sidewalk and it was explained that there's already things in place for that.
So there's already things in place for that. Maybe we should just do away with this entirely section A and just refer to that. Got it. You understand what I'm saying? Yes. If it's already out there, then just
abide by what our current parking requirements are. And I guess the only question would be if it would include the backyard, sideyard, or driveway for the cars, but I do understand what you're saying.
Yeah, I I would hope so. Yeah. Um that's something we can look at to see what that ordinance already says and then we can make a note to refer to that in regards to that. So, okay. So, if we did that, I I would think they
could park it in the driveway. And there's probably something that talks about sidewalks, whether, you know, they can't block sidewalks. Um, and where they, you know, cuz I, you know, I've been to plenty houses,
especially when campaigning, and you see them all over the place. So, all right. So I'm hearing Commissioner Pero, Commissioner Peebles, Commissioner War, and then we're going to come to you Commissioner Tinder before my thoughts get too far from me.
So as opposed to So Commissioner Peebles is referring to footage, Commissioner Perno is referring to some level of public safety. Um, I know before we talked about sort of this triangular window, um, in regards to public safety
and then you're making reference to just looking back at what the other ordinances say that we already have in place for regular vehicles. Okay. So, if we get clarification on where they could park at if we did refer to that. So, city attorney, she's looking that up. So, she's working on that while
we're Well, I meant because I asked yesterday. Chief Remy had stated that um regular cars can't park in sidewalks. It's not in our ordinance. Oh, that was me that said that. I was referring to the ulc section that says that you did say that also. Yeah, I was
referring to in the ULDC it says I think it's either seven any vehicle that's 17 or 18 ft something like that or larger can't be in the public ride of way after 10 p.m. Well, there's that part that part but
Florida State Statute Amy 316.9 1 94518 A2 specifically speaks about no parking on a sidewalk. It's illegal in Florida according to that statute has to obstruct pedestrian pathways and can be
noncriminal infraction. So it's covered in Florida state statute. Okay. All right. So So they would still be able to park it in backyard, sideyard if you if I understood correctly, you're
you only want to delete sub A. So, it would actually be unlawful for any person to park or store any recreational vehicle um except in regularly licensed parked parks. It would no longer allow it in a in a residence.
I get what you're saying. So, if we said kept entirely within the backyard, side yard, or the driveway, not blocking sidewalk. And if it's not, because there are some residents I've seen where they don't
have a driveway. So if they don't have a driveway, I would say at least 10 ft from edge of road not covering any utility access points. Do we want to add the reference to the Florida State statue on the sidewalk or
just to show where we got that from? Yeah. And what about five? What about just measuring five feet from the edge of the road, 2 feet from the edge of the sidewalk? I say we go whatever Florida statute
says. Okay. That's just me. I don't know. Yeah, cuz now that we're talking about the for state statute, it feels like if we're saying feet away from the sidewalk, technically you'd be taking away from something that they're allowed to do based on for Florida statute. You
know what I mean? So, I know you feel this the same way. You don't want to you don't want people to feel like you're taking something from them. So, and I'm going to go way back. I think Bobby Baker probably um talked to this, but whatever happened to the 30 foot
from the center of the road, period. Whatever happened to that? one measurement foot is a it's a typical but not all roads are dead center of the rideway. Some of these were laid out in the 30s
and 40s so they're not truly centered. Mhm. Was that back during your time or No, it wasn't wasn't that far back. It was long before that. But I know several that are they're shifted because of ditches and things like that. So you
can't totally rely on it just like you can't rely on the water meters 100% power bowl sidewalks. It's I think it goes back to what I was saying. We're trying to standardize something on things that are not standardized, right?
Yeah. I think it was a bit of a Mandela's effect for me too on that that 15 ft cuz I could have swore I read that somewhere and I could not find it anywhere in Florida state statute and Bay counties and ours. I could not find that anywhere. So, I think I had a bit
cuz I thought that was the case, too. And I think it was just a bit of a Mandela's effect where I thought I remembered something that wasn't actually there. All right. So, in regards to the actual
distance, we're looking at possibly 5 to 10 feet from the edge of the road is what we're asking for. Well, let me ask this. Could we just say in section A parked according to Florida statute,
whatever that was? We could, and I guess the question is, is that easily interpretable for because I think that's what we're trying to get to now for the public is what is something that they can look at to say, I know that I'm not in the right of way. and they could still be in the right of
way, but I know I'm safe from not being in the rightway, which is why I thought I believe that's why the the water meters were initially presented to try to give some type of visual effect um to try to get some type of consistency. So, I'm not against the Florida statute
notation, but then usually when I read Florida statutes, sometimes they're just not as cut and dry is probably what we need for this ordinance to keep it simple for the residents. um just be able to say, "Hey, this is this is what I'm I'm doing." You have to remember Florida state
statute is designed for vehicles. Keep in mind, you're going to be allowing now a high RV opposed to a vehicle. So, what I feel is going to happen is anytime that anyone has company at their house for any
period of time, the Florida state statute doesn't give a time frame. It says if you're parked over that sidewalk at any time, you could be cited. So, what I will say is there's 21,000
residents in this community. What you have in place has been working and we have gotten overall compliance. Mr. Walker said it best yesterday. We haven't been before a mag magistrate in two years because we are getting
compliance by utilizing just going out and getting people resolving conflict basically. But we're adding a lot to this. I think it's going to create for us a bigger problem. Can
we just keep it the way it is for right now? When it sunsets in a year, readress it. Nothing against these people. How many meetings did you have to discuss this? Five, six.
Okay, they're here today after it's already written because they got a warning. I'll do whatever you want me to do, but you're making my job very difficult. Being indecisive, changing with the flow of the water,
you're making my job difficult. Right. Any other input? City attorney to echo a little bit what Chief Amy said, you adopted this ordinance 30 days agoish. Um with with the assumption that there were 300 homes that were in
violation or 300 property owners that were in violation. He has indicated that by passing this ordinance just on the sideyard permission alone that number of possible violations shrunk by half. So we have 150 let's say and he has
reported today that most have come into compliance as a result of the vi the notice of the violations they have been given um and that he has given extensions to comply to everyone who has asked for it. I'm happy to write this ordinance. I also wonder, however, by
the time you adopt it, if the problem will have solved itself. I I say that just as a as an a big matter of public policy. When you pass an ordinance, maybe give it six months to see if it works or not. And so, I'm happy to make these amendments, but I
would like to also request that maybe we just hold on to it for a few more months to see where our real problem is. So that the text we put in here solves the actual problem we now know we have. But isn't half the situation the water
thing. Isn't that half of our problem? Right. But that's not in the actual ordinance though. That's that's something that we're using as an enforcement mechanis. Enforcement. It's a measurement. So that's that's not anything that we have to change the ordinance
um to do. we can just use a different enforcement mechanism um or measuring mechanism um as it relates to the wilderness itself. All right, I'll make a motion kept entirely within the backyard, sideyard, or the driveway as long as it's not
blocking the sidewalk. And if they can't put in a driveway, they don't have a driveway, then they can park it at least 10 feet from the edge of the road as long as it's not covering any utility access points. That's my motion. Sorry. Kept entirely within the
backyard, sideyard, or the driveway. As long as it's not blocking any sidewalks or if they can't put it in the driveway, they don't have a driveway. Then it has to be at least 10 ft from the edge of
the road, not covering any utility access points. Question for you. Could you amend that and say public sidewalks? Yes, I'll amend that to say public sidewalks. Right. There's a motion. Is there a
second? I'll second it. Right. We have a motion in a second. Um comments from the public. Langford. I think uh the amendment there is a a good a good idea, but uh sidewalks on
public property probably I think is what you were getting at originally. Um yeah, so again the common sense train left the station. We had an opportunity to use common sense on the original ordinance that has failed miserably. We got people got water meters in their backyard. All
right. And they got they're looking at fines coming up. So let's thank you for making the motion. Thank you for seconding it. It's clear as day. It's crystal clear. The only thing that I would ask you all before you vote on it
is to please ask the chief of police if he has any questions on the enforcement of this. Yes, it the ordinance was passed. It is legally sound. All right. But there's a reason that we've got all of these people here with these
violations because it's idiotic. If we know something stinks, let's fix it. We don't have to wait six months for it to stink more. So, vote on it, pass it, clean it up, and let's move on to something else cuz
we've got some other issues coming up with code enforcement that need to be fixed. All right. We passed IPMC uh what, two and a half years ago. I don't know how many violations has come out from that. I I doubt very many.
But this this passes and in I think two weeks there's 30 violations. You can go three blocks within my house and I got houses over there that's got they don't have a roof. They don't have siding. Drive down street. I mean you go over to Davis Lake. Look to your right.
So if we're going to quote clean the city up, let's don't just pick and choose and wage war on RV owners. Let's let's clean it up. All right. So, pass the DUR ordinance or of the amendment rather.
Let's clarify everything so residents know what to expect. This man can do his job without using a water meter in non-standardized public service systems to determine violations. Thank you,
Mr. Walker. If it's not broken, don't have to fix it. Been working fine. The rule is if you have a license plate, you have insurance on a vehicle inland haven, you can park it 24 hours a day,
anywhere on city property and be included, and there's no cut off on that. However, chief is correct. Cody's correct. Make it simple. It's simple.
Some of the streets on my in my area don't have water meters, don't have holes, do not have easements, do not have numbers, do not have houses. How the heck you going to control that?
And I'm talking 3/4 of the CRA area. This is simple. You've got it. Put it in effect and like Sam says, let it run. If it doesn't work, you can clean it up very quickly.
But if you make it simple and everybody understands it, they're going to live by it. The days of the Gustapo code enforcement people are over. Mr. Lynch is not here anymore. These guys have been going out lately
and talking to the people, finding out what's wrong and solving the problem locally. That's what this community is about. Keep it simple, make it easy. They understand it and code enforcement can
do what they have to do and the police don't have to be hamstrung. Thank you, Mr. Basher. and then we'll go to the next row and just go rowby row from there. Um, it's pretty simple. Keep your RV on
your own property. I mean, that's what the ordinance says. That's pretty simple. Keep it on your property. That's all you got to do. The water meter is a rule of thumb, and that's what a rule of thumb is. There's exceptions. There's times it's wrong. Times it's not going to work. I think code enforcement is
cognizant enough to be able to rectify that and look at property lines and and figure that out. The thing is keep it on your property. You don't own the city property. If if you want to say 5 ft from the edge of the road or whatever, I can bring my RV over in front of your house and park it there indefinitely
because there's no exclusion to say where I park my RV on public rideway if you're going to allow it. So, keep that in mind that you've got to got to be concerned about that also. But just keep your RV on your property. It's that simple. And that's
what the ordinance says. It's enforcable. We've not seen a case to the magistrate yet. And there's a process and we are not even allowing this ordinance long enough to follow the process to see if it works or not. Yeah, there's objections, there's exceptions, there's things that need to happen, but
let the process play out and then see if we really do have a problem. I don't I I I know some people are upset and that's understandable. There's been a change. Some people are resistance to change and it it affects people differently. But let's let this
ordinance play out and see if we do have a problem or if we have a few exceptions. If you make this next change, there's still going to be a few exceptions. We'll be right back where we're at today. Right. Yes, ma'am. Most of the houses in Linhaven do not
have a sidewalk in front of them. Um, they don't exist in most of Lin Haven. Just as a point of reference for history, some of the subdivisions when they were built, part of the requirements of the build to the builders during the building of the subdivision was that the homeowner had to put sidewalk in in front of their
house. And to do that, it needed to be on their property so they could do it without having to deal with the cities or the county. That's how that happened. Again, it's Miss Hernandez. I agree. We should be able to park in
our driveway in the middle of my front yard if I want to. I haven't had any complaints from neighbors. We intentionally bought a home that was not in an HOA. We pay our property taxes. We've paid off our home. I want to be able to park whatever I
want. Whether it's my RV, or like everybody else in the neighborhood, boats, trucks, whatever. They're blocking sidewalks. Ride around your city. Look at your city before you pick on RVs.
You've got people with entire gardens between the sidewalk and the highway. Raised planter beds. Beautiful. Look at your entire city. You've got boats, trucks, regular cars. Some people
have itty bitty driveways and can't get but possibly a smart car in their driveway. Ride around and look. Don't single out one group. Thank you. Anyone else from that row?
Yes. First of all, I'd like to thank the board for considering this um modification to the current ordinance. I know it's a motion. I think it's clear. It's visible. As a property owner, I can see exactly
what I need to do if I have an RV. If I'm contemplating on buying RV, it's really clear. you got a public sidewalk, you stay behind it. If you don't have a sidewalk, you're a certain distance from the road. It's it's very very
understandable and enforcable. Uh unlike the current situation, which is very confusing and I realize there's exceptions, but you know, I don't feel good being on the exception side of the ordinance.
So, I think this does a lot to clear things up and I would hope that you would consider it. Thank you. Right. Anyone else from these rows? Uh, anyone from the back on this side over here? Right. Anyone over
here? We read back uh, Commissioner Wars. All right. Could we read back Commissioner Ward's motion that we cap we were able to capture all of that? Well, I don't know if that entirely covers it. Basically, what I was trying to say is you can park it in your
driveway. Mhm. Entirely in driveway anywhere you want as long as it doesn't block a sidewalk. And that's what I thought you'd say. And and if it's not in the driveway or maybe they don't have a driveway, then 10 ft from edge of road, at least 10 ft
from the edge of the road. And as long as it's not parked over any utility access points. Well, that's the most logical, sensible proposal I've heard so far. Uh,
I'm an old retired IT person and logic uh and fine rules sort of is what I'm I'm used to and I can see that that everybody has an edge of the road.
though and a footage marker or in your driveway both meet the logic requirements. So I think that's fantastic. Thank you, sir. Anyone else from this side for public comment?
I'm in the minority on this, but I like the old code. Um, I have so many RVs in my neighborhood that weren't there for a long time. And exactly what's happened, I thought what happened happened is people see there's RVs. You don't think
to look at a code when you move somewhere and the RV, you know, I'm just against them. That's that's that's my opinion. My thought at the beginning of this, it's been months and months, was the commission was pretty weak, weak-minded because they're like, "Oh,
let's just see what Panama City does instead of having this conversation months and months ago." So, I think it was I don't think it was managed, right? I think I wish it was different, but um but it was settled it was settled that
we couldn't do middle of the road because it's different. The side of the road makes no difference. How is the middle of the road not okay to use, but this edge of the road is okay to use? It's not like we said, it's unequal. It
can't be equal at the side of a road and measuring 10 ft up. So, I've I've lost on this and I'm It's okay. Um, and I'm not against RVs or against RV owners. those those those RVs that are to scale
in a neighborhood where you're not driving down the road and you see it's like a billboard going down the road is what I have a problem with. And um I I just think
keep it like it is and let it go. You're going to make a change and you're going to have 30 more people here complaining that it's not suited to them. So you have to draw the line somewhere and just stick with it. And that's all I have to say. Additional public comments.
All right. This will require two readings, right? Or is this the two readings and it needs to be um approved by the planning board as well. Oh, it does. It amends the ULDC. Okay. Thanks.
Like to make a comment if I could. So, just to talk about the people parking on you could come and park on your road. That happens to me every single day cuz I live by a school and I know that that's not my property so I don't
complain about it. But I think we just need to have maybe as a community have kind of um uh help educate each other that you do not own your property. Your private property does not go all the way to the road.
look at your Most people I think don't realize that. So when they say uh someone's parking on my property, they're there's a good chance they're not. In fact, uh yeah, like they literally every single day except for
the weekend, I have probably 10 cars on what people probably think is their property, but it's not my property. And I'm not going to complain about it because I know that it's not mine. They're there to pick up their children. It is what it is. So, as far and also it's in the uldc that you can't park
large vehicles after 10 p.m. So, if you see that, please report it cuz it's not allowed. So, if you have a problem with someone parking their boat on the public rideway, call it in because it's currently not legal. And if we find out
that we want to make that legal, maybe we have that conversation in the future. But this is not singling out RVs because pe other people are parking in the public rideway. They're not supposed to do that for more than 24 hours. So if you have a problem, if you see that happening, report it. So like that's
what code enforcement is there for. You don't just ride around. If if you're riding around and you have a problem with something, you don't know what you don't know. So report it to somebody if you have an issue with it and staff will take care of it. As Chief Ramy said, the code enforcement is very good with
working with people. So report it. We'll figure it out. But I just wanted to reiterate this is not picking on RV owners. It's literally doing the opposite. All right. Thanks. City manager will call the vote. Had a motion by Commissioner Warick. Second by
Commissioner Tinder. Commissioner Warick. Yes. Commissioner Tender. Yes. Commissioner Perno. No. Commissioner Peebles. Yes, Mayor Nelson.
No. Motion passes. Meeting adjourned. Uh you're invited to stay for our comprehensive or our strategy workshop that'll be going throughout the day. So our first session will begin at 11:00 and that'll go from 11 to 11:30.
Then we'll break for lunch.