Okay, it's 6:30 and I call this meeting of the Manchester by the sea collectively to order. Jeff >> here. >> Brian here. >> Kathy here and is here and John >> John is here. >> The uh meeting is being recorded. Um the
first item is public comments on non-aggenda items. Is there anyone here who has any of those including the board? Is there anyone online? Okay. Um,
we have a I have a short chairman's report. Um, as you all know, um, Representative Berante died this week. Um she had been our respon uh
representative in the great general court for several years. Um I think she has she had come down with pancreatic cancer before she started. Her courage in facing that is an inspiration for everybody and and the good works that
she did for make making Manchester keeping Manchester in the interest of the public bodies is also of great importance. Um for those who haven't seen it there her service is on Thursday.
Um the visiting the visitation starts at 10 >> 10 to 12:45 and then the funeral mass is >> and this is at St. An's in Gloucester. >> She will be missed by all of us I'm sure.
Okay. Um action. The next item is action items. Um, are there any do we have any new action items that we should take out? >> Not I don't have any new ones, but I had a question for Tony on the um the tree
policy timing. You had sent me a separate email on something that may require a different sense of urgency. So, I I just didn't know where that stood. >> Yes. I and I talked to Chuck today. Ruth had she's away right now. She they're in England there. We'll be back I think
next week. But she had done a deep dive through the policy and highlighted some things that would be worth uh the convers you know to have a conversation with you and and members of the um >> friends of trees. >> Friends of trees. So I think I would say next week he'll be able to give those
comments to you. >> Okay. So we were looking for a meeting a three-way meeting between myself, friends of trees and Chuck. >> Yes. So, would we want to schedule that for next week or the following week? >> Let me double check when Ruth would be back. So, I think Chuck wants to go through it with her. Okay.
>> Um, but I think next week would work. If not, the following. >> Okay, sounds good. Thank you. >> Um, the first item on our agenda is the FY26 class text tax classification unit.
Good evening. My name is Michelle Brandy 40. I'm the principal assassin for the town of Manchester. And um as we have done in the past, tonight we are meeting um with the purpose of the classification hearing for the select
board to determine the allocation of the local property tax to be born by the four classes of real property and personal property for fiscal year 2026. for a moment. >> Sorry, Michelle, but you were so eager. I didn't want to stop you. Apparently,
there's procedure here. >> I moved it to select board open the tax classification hearing. >> Ready for the vote? >> Yes. >> Yes. Kathy, >> yes. >> Brian, >> yes. >> And Jeff says yes. So, by all means, you
ask me to be fat. >> No, that's on me. I appreciate that. But don't be too >> pick up where you left off. >> So you have to go back and start again. >> No, no, no, no. >> So in deciding the allocation, the
select court must adopt the residential factors. The residential factor is used to determine the percentage of the tax levy that is applied to each class of real and personal property. The board of assessors applies these percentages to the individual classes.
um the individual property classes. The select board must vote on the following in order to establish a tax rate classification shift, a residential exemption, a small commercial exemption, and an
open space discount. Um some salient facts about fiscal year 2026. Fiscal 26 was a reertification year. Um every five years the uh department of revenue reertifies the values and the
and audits the operations of the assessor's office. Um changes to valuation tables in the years between reertification years are called interim years. So the next four years are going to be interim years with the next resertification year and
fiscal 20 uh 2032. The new growth is very similar this year compared to fiscal 2025. Um 72% of the new growth came from the residential sector and 28% from
commercial, industrial and personal property. Um we have a table with five previous years. So you can see the new growth um in those past five years. The total taxable value for fiscal 2026 is uh 3
bill984,211 um $211,14. 94% of this total value is um residential and 6% commercial, industrial, and personal property. In the fiscal year 2025, percentages were similar. that
were the same as 26. The tax levy calculation is listed on uh page four with an unused levy limit of $268,21340. The tax rate is the tax levy divided by the town's taxable valuation.
Um the residential factor here in Manchester has historically been a residential factor of one which means we've um we've had a uniform tax rate. There has not been a shift in the burden to commercial uh industrial and personal
property. Uh, the select board may shift the town's tax burden from the residential class to commercial, industrial, and personal property classes as long as the shift does not exceed the minimum residential factor, which means the burden cannot be shifted more than 50%.
Worksheets FY26, shift scenario, and shift scenario impact show the impact if the tax rate was to be shifted. Please turn to addendums A, B, and C or worksheets. So the first addendum is the one with a
piraph and then um so this shows us the allocation of the values and the tax levy. And you can see on this pi graph the largest portion being um in value
residential 94.36% and then open space is the little red line down the middle which is 0%. Commercial industrial and personal property are those shaded in blue and
green. Tax levy very similar underneath. And if you turn to a DNW, we have some um bar graphs which show how if we were to shift the burden from the um uniform tax
rate of $8.70, which is what's projected for this year, it has not been approved yet by the department of revenue, but this is a projected tax rate. that if we were to shift the burden from uh the residential rate from $8.70
um maximum at 50% would be $843 but the burden transfers over to commercial industrial and personal property um to the highest amount would be $13.3. If we go to addendum C is where we see
the scenario where a shift of 10% burden from the average residential value of 1.731 million. If we were to shift the burden 10% um there would be a decrease
a saving in tax dollars of $103.91. The highest shift at 50% would be $467.58. However, the impact to the commercial, industrial, and personal property classes at 10% they would see an
increase of $9274 with the highest shift at 50% of $4,66756. And so for that reason there has never been a shift from residential to commercial industrial and personal property.
>> Going back to the presentation. So this is the um that was the factor discussion and the impact. Um the next item would be a residential exemption and residential exemptions are
usually granted um with up to 35% to shift the burden within the residential class from owners of moderately valued residential properties that are the principal residents of a taxpayer to higher assessed properties and properties are that are not the
principal residence or doicile of a taxpayer. This is not an actual exemption. It's a shift of residential taxes to non-owner occupied property owners. Um, so this exemption started in Cape Cod communities where most summer
residents were second homes that were not owner occupied properties. Cities such as Cambridge, Somerville, and Boston have adopted the residential exemption because they have a significant amount of non-owner occupied multif family properties such as apartment complexes. However, since most
residential property owners in the community here consider Manchester to be their principal residents, adoption of the residential exemption would only serve to increase the residential tax rate while providing a tax increase to all Manchester by the sea residential
property owners whose assess values over the average of 1.731 million. And again, this exemption has never been um adopted here in Manchester. A small commercial exemption is the next
item. And a small commercial exemption of up to 10% may be granted to qualifying commercial properties if the properties valued at less than $1 million. and all of the businesses occupying the property have had 10 or fewer employees
on average in the last full calendar year as certified by the commissioner of employment and training. The exemption goes to the building owner, not to the business owner. Therefore, depending on lease agreements, a small business owner
may or may not benefit. A total of 14 out of 351 communities in Massachusetts have adopted this exemption and some of those communities are Avon, Brainree, Chelmsford. Um any saving from this exemption is available to only seven or
eight commercial uh properties and the cost will be born within the commercial and industrial classes. The average commercial assessment in Manchester by the sea is a,77,959. There are 26 commercial properties valued at less than a million dollars
and only eight of these would qualify as eligible. For that reason, um the town has never adopted this exemption either. And the last one is open space discount.
And open space discount is really um it's a classification for a parcel that doesn't quite fit in any of the other four classifications. Um state law allows properties
classified as open space to be taxed at a rate discounted of up to 25% from the uniform tax rate. The tax dollars lost by the discount are shifted to the residential class of properties which includes developable vacant land. The
local board of assessors must develop the criteria that must be met in order to classify a parcel as open space that meets a significant contribution for the benefit and enjoyment of the public criteria. This cannot be a piece of
property that generates income. Uh, no communities in Massachusetts grant an open space discount and the board of assessors use this classification sparingly since most land fits into other classifications and the open space classification on its own makes no
difference in the ass the assessment of a property. Assessors have also observed that as the years have passed, many of the land parcels afforded a tax discount were developed anyway, regardless of the tax incentive employed to encourage
protection of open land and or be a deterrent to development. Presently, there are no parcels classified by the board of assessors as class 2 open space. In conclusion, historically, Manchester
United C has retained a uniform tax rate with a residential factor of one. If you could take a vote on all of the four options. Uh >> I think we need to close the evidentiary portion first. And while we're in the
evidentiary portion, we are anyone is allowed to ask questions. So, are there any questions? >> Okay. >> Ready? Yep. Um, I move that the select board close the evidentiary portion of the hearing. >> Second.
>> All in favor? I >> Okay. Um, >> yes. Is there any more discussion? Okay. Then I move that the select board does not establish a residential exemption. Excuse me. I'm sorry. I move that the select board set the
residential tax rate factor at one resulting in a single tax rate for all properties. >> Second. >> John. >> Yes. >> Ann says yes. Kathy. >> Yes. >> Brian. Yes. And Jeff. >> Yes. >> Okay. I move select does not establish a
residential exemption. Second. John, yes. And yes, Kathy, yes. Brian, >> yes. And Jeff, yes. >> I move the select board does not establish a small commercial exemption. >> Second. >> Yes.
>> John, yes. Ann, yes. Kathy, Brian, >> yes. >> Yes. >> Okay. >> I move that the select board does not establish an open space discount. >> Jeff. >> Yes. Brian, >> yes. Kathy, yes. Ann says yes. And John, >> John, yes. >> Okay.
>> I move that the board close the public hearing. >> Second. >> John. >> Yes. >> And yes. >> Yes. >> Yes. Brian. Yes. >> Yes. >> Okay. Thank you very much. >> Thank you very much. Timing was
>> a lot of work goes into that. You made it easy to digest. It was Michelle, thank you. We've been clear and the board of our lot of effort for sure the the
>> differences over the years which is undoubtedly a nuisance to put together, >> but it it makes all >> Thank you very >> Okay. Um the second item is discussion items and the first of those is sidewalk
snow plowing clearing. >> Okay. So Chuck is on the call. Uh in the backup packet you received a memo and I also have uh you also received the map the snow clearing uh
schedule map form. I also have it on my screen if you want me to pull it up on the the All right. So, Chuck, are you uh are you on with us, Chuck? >> Yeah. Can you hear me? >> Yes, we can.
Um, so what you're looking at on the screen uh is the map that is available on our website. Uh the DBW uh put this together I believe last year uh to visually see the sidewalk schedule uh
and it's all related to uh the following the end of a storm. So throughout a throughout a storm, the guy the DPW staff that are out plowing the roads then transfer um some if not all transfer into sidewalk operations and
within 24 hours of the storm they will uh remove snow from the red marked sidewalks. Um within 72 hours the blue uh black is uh property owner responsibility. And then simply put, if
a storm if we get hit with another storm within the 72 hours or or uh 48 or 24 hours, the clock restarts itself. Um obviously the priority for the town is to have the roadways cleared um first and then once
we're done with that to sidewalks. Um it's not I would say Chuck, please chime in. I mean, for me, I would say it's not always that it's going to be perfectly executed to this plan. Uh, you never know if you have a snowstorm that is,
you know, a two-hour storm or a 12-hour storm. Uh, if it's multiple storms in a row, we could also have other emergencies, uh, like a water break or a sewer break. you know, there are things that can come up that can kind of uh pull on uh the
needs of our staff. So, um this is the goal. This is what we strive to accomplish. Um but always there can be hiccups in that plan. Um Chuck, do you want to add to that? >> No, I think that's that's pretty much the gist of it. The only other thing I
would add is you know the the guys uh are human and so you know definitely on the longer duration storms you know we need to work in breaks and you know people need to get relieved. I think the other thing that you know will happen with a small department like ours is you
know people have other obligations you know they have loved ones or you know pe they're caregivers for people and so sometimes that pulls them away. So, we're not like t typically at full strength for, you know, a full 24-hour period. People have to rotate on, rotate
off. Um, and, you know, we do have on call contractors that help, uh, you know, that do a few of the routes and stuff. So we're, you know, it's always a balancing act to make sure that we're, you know, meeting our objectives, but also that, you know, people can tend to, you know, matters at
home or, uh, you know, just other things like Tony mentioned that come up like, uh, you know, the occasional water man break or, you know, returning back to, you know, different operations that need attention. And then of of course, you know,
equipment failures can happen uh throughout a storm event as well that can kind of change how you're responding. >> For sure. Yep. We do we do have an on call mechanic or we have a full-time mechanic on staff that, you know, will
help. But again, the equipment malfunctions are not just related to sidewalk track tractors. We also have the you know, the rest of the fleet that takes up the bulk of his time and these things happen. So, Um, first on are there questions from the board?
>> Yeah. Um, so I asked that this be put on the agenda. So, thank you Chuck and uh Tony. So, my question is because this is I think I mentioned this before. This is the first time um this is the first place that I have lived where the town plows sidewalks. So, it's new to me
because every place else I've lived, property owners do it. Doesn't matter if it's a business or if it's, you know, a home. Um, so what I'm wondering is, have we looked at other communities that do this to make sure that what we're asking
Chuck's team to do is reasonable for the staffing and equipment that we have because this looks like a a lot for a town of this size. And I'm curious as to um you know how I it looks like the
heater and you know routes to school is kind of what we're um uh targeting here but we also go all the way up to Ocean Street. We go further up. So I'm just wondering how we decided that this was the right number
of miles or whatever of sidewalk to plow. Uh, so you know that actually predates me. This was uh like Tony said, this came up last year and we put together this map and so I sat down with Sean because um, you know, when when I first
got here seven, eight years ago, you know, it had always just been done that way and so, you know, I never really questioned it. We did have the, you know, the equipment that I mentioned in the memo, both the prenth and the MT. So those were kind of already here and, you know, that's the way they always did it.
Um, so you know to be perfectly honest that really hasn't been vetted in that way. I will say you know I've lived in other town my current town and you know other towns I've lived in they do you know have a kind of core business district or schools that they do respond to. So I think that is like you said
where this started from or you know where it was and I think it just over the years it evolved into you know what you see in red, what you see in blue and and otherwise. So um I could I could look into that. I I think that might be one of those things that folks are, you
know, not happy if we if we start neglecting streets. So, the other thing I would say is, you know, in the time that I've been here, it hasn't really been a huge problem on our snow ops, uh, in terms of, you know, kind of meeting the expectations and, you know, being
able to do it. We had the equipment, like I said, um people were supportive when we we did replace the prenth in 2019. So, you know, all all things considered, that's just the way it's the way it's always been, and I haven't attempted to change it, but you can look into that.
>> I So, I appreciate all that, Chuck. I think it's worth taking a look at it because um personally I'd rather the red areas if that's what we're going to target as important areas, I'd rather they get done really well than focus on
outline areas, but that's just my thought. Um the other I I'm going to disagree a little bit with um the fact that the you know people have been happy. Um, I know my neighborhood has not been and they just got tired of calling. So,
I don't know who they spoke to and how long ago they got tired. But for example, you know, the core district on central when you take a right up to go up Pine Street, more than 75% of the time, the snow
plowing on the opposite side of the street where the gas station is, that's the sidewalk that got plowed instead of staying, you know, on Pine Street where the telephone poles are. and it's a bit of a challenge, but you know, they they did some things regarding plowing that
didn't make sense to the community and they kind of just got tired of complaining. So, I just I I think we have limited resources and Chuck's team works really hard and I'm just asking that we make sure we if this is these
are the areas we want to focus on, does it make sense to make sure they get done really well and be a little more lenient with some of the other areas because if you lose one of those sidewalks in red after a bad storm, you could lose it for the whole winter. And that's what h used to happen on Pine Street. we would lose
that I guess north sidewalk. We'd lose it for the whole winter. Just one bad storm. So, um I just that's really the reason for my asking it be on the agenda. Are we asking them to do too much? >> I think it's like Chuck said, it's
always been done this way my whole lifetime here. And you have, you know, you get an ice storm or something, you know, you're going to have issues. There's no way around it. It depends on the storm, but Yeah, >> I don't think you're going to cut, you
know, you're talking about cutting people out alto together and I don't agree with that. I >> I didn't I'm not suggesting we cut people out altogether. I'm just saying that this community says they're going to do a lot. Okay. And as someone who has lived in other places, the other places where I used to live, the
sidewalks were in much better shape. And I'm talking cities, suburbs, rural area in New Hampshire because the expectations were clear and people knew what was going to happen and when it was your responsibility you did it or you
got peer pressure from your neighbors or you know depending on where you live you could get a bill. But I just I just I'm wondering if we're asking Chuck's team to do too much. >> Have you always Have you always met this Chuck? I won't say always but virtually always. So, I mean, I I guess I'm not going to
argue with Kathy if she says her her her people she's talking to aren't, you know, complaining anymore, but like I said, you know, we we certainly, you know, get complaints. I don't want to make it sound like we're perfect. But I would say that by and large, you know, we kind of know the areas where we have
trouble. We try and address them. Uh if if there were a long stretch of sidewalk that was completely untreated and unattended to, I would be surprised. But I'm not going to completely rule it out. Um, >> house right by the powder house.
>> Right. So, I mean, so, you know, now you you got it on my radar. Um, I'll I'll definitely be watching every time I drive by there. Um, you know, I I go by there once a day no matter what. So, um, yeah. So, and I'll I'll mention it to Sean. Um, you know, there there may have
been extenduating circumstances or, you know, if it if it was a whole season thing, I I guess I' I'd kind of be surprised about that. But um that's not to say it can't be possible. >> Um and then so so we'll we'll take it from there. >> Yeah,
>> I'm trying to help is like that's really my point, Chuck. I I don't expect be perfect. I'm just wondering are we asking it to do too much? >> Is it is this map on the website or is it just kind of a reference? It's >> on the website. >> So So we put it on last year because you like like it never really been written
down. Um, so, you know, that was the first step was writing it down. >> So, this is this is where we are at. >> Um, yeah, like I said, I was when I was talking to Tony about this, uh, you know, I I think we made this map, uh, you know, after the one really bad storm
last year, and I don't know that we had a big storm after that storm. You know, we might have had a couple small ones, but I don't think we had had anything big where this map really would have been kind of front and center. Um, so you know, going into the season, you know, we might get some snow tomorrow or
certainly in the next month or two. So, um, you know, we'll see. We'll see how it goes, but I'm I'm certainly uh willing to walk it back if we need to walk it back and hopefully we can do better. >> How how do the homeowners that are on the lines in black know that they have a
responsibility not identified with the timeline? Is there some way that they know? I mean, I'm looking at my street and I will tell you my neighbors don't know. Yeah. No, like I said, I don't think it was really written down until last year and we didn't really have a chance to kind of put it out there. I think I think we have talked to Tiffany about
this, you know, last year as as well as, uh, you know, going into this this winter season. So, I think, you know, definitely be reasonable to put it back out there and, you know, make sure folks understand that they're kind of responsible for the areas in front of their property and hopefully they can
they can meet their own expectations. >> It's a patriot comment in the tide or something. for sure. >> Yeah, the link this is if you want to know you're in the black line area. >> I mean, I think I would So, I agree, Chuck. I I think this was a really good addition to last year's um you know,
discussion, I would if we're going to improve on the communication, I would ask that we just cite Massachusetts law, right? So, that the law is that the cities and towns are allowed to require property owners, you know, to shovel the
sidewalks and most of them do. So it is a you know fewer towns are like ours that you know you know shovel and plow to this extent on the sidewalk. So if you've lived somewhere else, you probably know to do
it. But if you grew up here and never left, then you might not. >> I don't know. >> I don't know. I mean, there certainly those core, you know, city hall >> I >> not fully aware of what the what the what what the law might state. Um you
may be >> risking some liability by not uh clearing snow in front of your property. >> Yes. But I don't know how much um the town can enforce that without a local
bylaw. >> That's usually towns are, you know, in order for the town to write you a ticket for not or something like that, you'd have to have a local bylaw. I don't think we do. >> And I don't think most do that. But there's, again, it starts with setting
expectation. to John's point, you know, not everybody knows, especially if they've lived here a long time and had it done for them. >> Right. Right. >> And the other another common problem is somebody had the the town has gone by
somebody and then the driveway is plowed and blocks both sides, right, >> of the driveway and the sidewalk. Right. >> Maybe we could actually put something in the cricket and on the website saying, you know, if your model company has just blocked the sidewalks, you or they have
got to clean them up. >> Yeah. Well, they're not allowed to push snow in the street anyway. >> That's definitely not a law. >> That's a law. >> Yeah. But >> but the sidewalk like somebody's plowing your driveway, they can't just push it out in the street, >> right? can't they shouldn't push it into the
sidewalk if it's in the red area in particular and the reason >> do that >> well I think the reason it's important to have this discussion though is if we have more multif family housing right the more dense densely populated you are the more this is an issue because
there's nowhere to put the snow so you actually like during the big blizzard in 2015 or whatever I mean we had to hire people to take the snow off the property propert because there was legit no place to put it, right? >> So those are, you know, extenduating
circumstances, but if depending on where people live, they literally may not have a place to put it. So that's why I just see this as >> But that's the homeowner's responsibility. >> Well, they might not know it, >> which is the issue, right? Yeah. >> If you got a oneacre lot, you know, good
for you. You got plenty of places to put the snow. If you're in the red area, it's it's >> I think we I think we can, you know, certainly leading up to a storm, during a storm, post storm, we can certainly put uh messaging out to the public
about, you know, everybody kind of doing their part and making sure that the >> reverse 911, you know, >> and if that doesn't work, then we could think about a bylaw that is a little bit
stronger if we really wanted to. Um, and I I think it's but it is a it is somewhat um variable based on the type of storm you have and how frequent it is. You know, this this map is great and it's a
great start and in, you know, if you have a few inches uh once a week or something, it's it's it's this is certainly achievable. If it's if it's a foot of snow and then three days later another foot of snow, you start to lose room, you know, and there's it's it
becomes problematic. So we >> this whole sidewalks for the season if it's not removed and and that's what has happened to the red areas, you know. So I just think again this all started with expectation setting. So now we're we're clear. I guess we're we're saying we
want to keep the same expectation, but um you know, I do think as other properties get developed, we we need to think about that >> because it's not like I said, even cities, you know, small business owners, my father, if you wanted someone in his store, he was out there with the
snowblower 6 a.m. >> and it didn't matter. Blizzard of 78 and all, right? So, you know, it's just making sure we're not putting too much on Chuck's team that that they got a lot to do >> and making sure that people will understand, >> right?
>> And this would be an excellent the next >> video in just a minute. >> We'll have a shovel in their shovel. >> Yeah. Sarah Melish, 11 Bennett Street. Um, I would make a suggestion that they
reook at the map. Um, currently, as people know, I'm a walker >> and currently the state is plowing the north side of Bridge Street up to Crocker's yard. >> The town plows the south side from
Ashlin to Pine, which turns to ice because it's shaded >> by houses. If instead the town plowed the north side to pine connected into what the state plows and it gets sun so it melts and
all that entire sidewalk is the back of houses so nobody accesses their houses so it's nothing happens to it. And then if they had a crosswalk across Lower Pine,
so one could get to the north side of Central, which is a sidewalk that melts, and the south side is pure ice. It It would involve the same amount of sidewalk clearing, but it would make
lives a lot easier because it's very dangerous to walk on Bridge Street. Um, and it's very danger and and the section where you come off the crosswalk at Bridge and Pine >> because there's posts there. >> Yeah.
>> They can't plow that. So, you can't get from the crosswalk to a sidewalk without walking a ways down Central. >> You have to walk by um to the entrance to 52. Yeah, >> there's a lot of It's a problematic area. There's a lot of hills,
>> but I just think it need could be looked at and it would make people's lives easier. It makes no sense to be plowing the south side if you could plow the north instead if you don't get any sun on the south side. >> There any other comments on this?
>> Anybody know? >> Okay, this was a The first of the discussion items. We don't need to get the vote on anything. Um the
next is one that I included which is the uh desi chapter 70 school funding formula statement. Um the school committee has put together a letter and
um they would like the two towns to sign on to it. Um and I have reservations about it. >> I do too. Specifically, um
the section on chapter 70 formula does not count because that is an issue that that is under local control and DESIE has no
they can't walk in and tell us that our proportions formula is no good and because raising it seems pointless. Well, also they're not figuring the capital into this. We're paying 73% of the capital.
>> So you're looking at another school coming. >> Yeah. >> And you're and we're going to be paying that 73% of that capital. So to say we're not I know this isn't exactly saying we're not paying our share or our ability to pay is higher. I
understand that. But how much more should we be paying? >> Well, well, actually just so I'm not I agree with what you everything you said, Jeff. My question is I thought ability to pay was based here on property
values, not um income, right? And so, >> oh yeah, that's I disagree ability to pay. >> I just personally disagree with the concept of ability to pay being based on property values because if someone inherits their home and and they're in a
lower income level, >> that that that value of their house means nothing unless they >> sell. The two things that that make sense to me in this letter and we might consider sending something ourselves
um are the fact that the formula chapter 70 formula has a very low estimate of what health insurance is >> and a very low estimate of what special education is. They're both in the low single digits and in fact they are each
over 20% increase o year-over-year. Also, it doesn't include your transportation cost, even though you get a stipen for being a uh for the district. Um, but not
everything's fitted into chapter 7. >> So, >> well, this is spec specifically, Jesse is looking at the chapter 70 formula and this is a several year project, >> right? um and and they want some level
of of response uh by the end of the year. >> I mean, it's not I mean, everybody can see it's not keeping even close to keeping up with inflation, >> right? Right. >> Your school of choice is at $5,000, which was implemented back in 1993. If
you figure that for inflation, >> realistically right now, it should be like $11,200. So I mean that's like a giveaway, >> right? >> On the other hand, the district has a choice of whether they take
>> right. I understand that. But it's >> Yep. It's, >> you know, it's not >> But if it was a if it was a good amount, a proper amount, >> right? If you could get >> encourage, you know, school choice in a way to help maximize the utilization of our facilities, >> right? So our minimum our figured
minimum contribution is like I forget the number. It's like $15,000. I mean, if we got even close to that at 12 or something, then yeah, it would be worth. >> So, I agree with Ann. I like the the concept of, you know, agreeing with the
health insurance, special ed, and school choice numbers are just wrong. And um but I'm very uncomfortable with talking about um you know property values, income. I I just don't the
wording here. >> Well, you your CIS that's that part for your capital is baked into your district agreement. So that's already figured in. I mean, as
far as the rest of it, >> right? But I thought the way it was worded here, the the the memo, they were expressing concern that the formula does not calculate required contributions for the two towns in similar proportions. Right.
>> Right. To your point, it has nothing to do with it. It's our agreement. So why why mention that? Well, it's your agreement beyond minimum contribution. So, Desi is going to figure it up to minimum contribution and then anything.
So, you're like 12 or $13,000 over minimum contribution per pupil. So, that's that's where it leaves the table from for them. Right. >> Oh,
what would people feel about? >> I mean, I think you I'd be able to sign this if you just took that excerpt out. >> The chapter 70 formula does not calculate it down to state funding and assumptions. >> Yeah. I mean personally I agree with the rest of it but okay
>> that part I don't personally >> okay there's a school committee meeting tomorrow night um and I will explain that Manchester the board of selectment um feel that the section on the the
recorded contributions is not we don't we disagree with it and that we would be willing to cosign on the rest of it if they're willing to take that I mean, I'm good with that. I don't know if else
>> failing that. Back at the next meeting with something that we could send in on our own if they choose not to make that. >> Yeah, I'm good with it. Whoops.
I I I imagine the the CUI is not >> factored into the chapter 70 formula for a reason, right? It's a it's a >> well it data element that >> Oh, go ahead. Yeah, >> it is up to well
a a formula of that is up to your minimum contribution. So they tell you what your minimum contribution is. They say it's what happened $14,000, whatever it is. After that, it's on your district to figure out it, >> right? >> The
I think we're clear on that. >> No, no, that sounds right. >> Okay. And the next item on our discussion is the public mermaids culture. Um
all right everyone. >> Hi. Hi everyone. Thank you for having me. Can you just give us your name and address because >> Yes, it's Elisa Vanal and the others is five Forest Lane in Manchester. >> And I just kind of wanted to share with
you all the progress that we've made and um video that would be nice maybe. Um, so maybe by watching the video already gives you an idea of where we're at and then we can maybe discuss that
further. We've worked with that before or I can talk. >> I would say introduce a little bit more and then we can watch the video. >> Sure. So since we met, I had some homework to do because you guys wanted me to see the harbor master and the
conservation committee to have a former approval. And um Brian has been very supportive of this project that has been helping her love by measuring the side and doing everything that there was forward. This is the letter of approval
sign and the vision expanded because I started thinking about this culture that gets covered with eyes and not covered with iide and um I thought that it would be nice to for this one to be
introvers of the tide keepers a series of tres responsive sculpture first one in Manchester but on in each town of Kan. So it kind of creates a bond between the town and it creates the the trails of the tide keepers. Each
sculpture ideally would have an explanation of the tide. We have four main tides. So that makes sense. We have four towns. So it would become like an educational project because schools and everyone can go there and they're studying the tide. Okay, let's go see
the tide keepers and learn about more more about the tide. paying attention to uh nature, recreating a a strong bond with the ocean and um as I said, I would have um I'm the exhibition chair of the New England sculpture association. So I
have many contacts in the art world and we you have an article in the folder. I have actually two bigger ones because it's pretty small. And we were featured on this month um our New England magazine with this project
of Atlantis. There is a lot of energy that is moving around this beautiful project. Everyone we were on the on the second at the Manchester by the Sea Festival. So introduced it to the whole town and we got a lot of positive response from
everyone and even more positivity came from it when we said that this would be like the first one of the timekeepers because the whole community of Cape that got excited and um I started sculpting the mermaid. So I have the tail that is
almost done and she's beautiful. Cape pan granite donated the granite that goes under the mermaid. So we're pretty moving through this. I applied for 501c. We are the tide keepers foundation. We
are pinging approval. So now I am uh preparing the mermaid already in contact with the foundry. She will be probably ready in a month and a half. I was planning to have her uh casted because the foundry takes time for there in
January. So I need to raise some money. I already have some private donating uh towards this cause and I have a lot of support it seems from banks and I have like one big sponsor. The thing is that since I am pending approval I'm not I
can't provide tax exemption. So I got in contact where are members of the Cape Chamber. So the branch of the Cape Chamber which is called the Cape Community Foundation it's a nonprofit branch of the Cape Chamber
is working with us to become the our fiscal sponsor basically but to be our fiscal sponsor so people could donate towards this cause like the creation of Atlantis um through them they would take a percentage but they were like but you
you have pyramids but you don't have really a final approval from town. So then that's why I spoke to Tony and John and I'm here tonight. But then we going going going deeper into the discussion we discovered that we are going to
probably need some extra permits that we will work will will work towards like getting and um so basically tonight I'm here to see if you guys I I wanted to show you where we're at and um I hope
you're excited too about the project because it's really an amazing and beautiful project. I think that it's going to be great for Capan, for Manchester and Capean. It's going to bring in tourism. It's going to bring back the magic of an already magical
area, you know. So, I want to for you to see the project and I wanted to understand if I have your support if I get this permit. I don't know if it's going to be enough at this point for the community foundation to be like, yes,
let's go forward. But I kind of wanted to touch base and and show you where we where we are at and so so we are filming a documentary and uh this is basically the first five minutes of the documentary four minutes
>> and um it it will air on 1623 and great channel we have had contact with channel four and five so it's there is a lot of energy moving around this again like I'm saying. So that's it.
>> I'll play the film. All these kids playing kids playing soccer. Oh, good. Yeah. You can hear a sound right now. That's a song. Hold on.
Get it back up. I don't know how to uh send the sound. There's the >> the sound on my phone otherwise playing at the same time. I think you have to feed it directly through 1623 if you want. >> You'd be fine to just I I've never had a
problem with streaming with doing this screen share. So try it again. Does anyone else have their audio on on Zoom right now? >> Not getting any sound. >> It's on YouTube. So, I don't know if you if you're capable of sharing it.
>> I'm not capable of sharing it on my side. >> Otherwise, I can set the audio on my phone and we can listen to it from this. >> Why don't we what I can do? We can um we can share this, you know, onto our social media or something like that. I
can send it to the select board so they can watch it at another time. And we'll put it on our we'll put it on our um social, you know, Facebook and and other things like that since we're running into a >> to an issue. Is that okay? >> Sounds good. >> Yeah. >> Interex on YouTube.
>> Yes, it's on my YouTube channel. actually looking for advice this >> so what what is what is needed Tony from us tonight >> so I I think uh you know some communication
of support to continue to move forward um I spoke with Kayan community foundation as well to try try to find out what they needed in order to execute an agreement you know Um what they need is a little bit more than I think what
we can provide tonight. Um there's still some questions about uh whether this is going to require a chapter 91 permit or license depending on the on on the proposal. Uh Nate and Bion uh spoke with
DP to get some input. There was even, you know, we had some question about whether it met the definition of a structure under chapter 91. Um, so there are some different elements of uh of the
project that Nate and Brian are going to speak um with the EP about to find out what type of permitting or licensing it's going to trigger. Um, >> I don't know of any permit that we have we regularly offer that covers this up.
>> Right. It's not a temporary >> it's it's not a temporary >> not a category >> temporary structure. Um so it wouldn't fall under 10A. Um uh it whether it requires a chapter 91
permit or license could be dependent on a couple of different factors. Um, and even if it was, we have to work through some of the details of the proposal, but if it was, uh, you know, fully submerged at some
point, um, that could trigger an Army Corps permit. >> Uh, so we want to be, we want to make sure, um, that all those boxes are checked before, um, you know, we officially give it the the green light moving forward. We don't know yet what
those um if those are required, what type of additional work is going to need be needed leading into that, but it sounds like um sounds like Nate and Bion's conversation with D um was positive that they felt
like there was a potentially a simpler process to go through where it's just a statue. It's not an active structure that you are, you know, standing on or operating from or anything like that. Um, so
I think that, you know, some sort of supportive uh commentary. I don't necessarily think it's it's a vote. I think it's more just you know are we all okay with moving forward and you know exploring this next phase
>> and we as a town are going to take some of the responsibility of doing that research as far as permitting is required. Yeah, we're we're going to work Yeah, we're going to work together on it as it is. >> Indicates >> ultimately hasn't um the pool. >> We we haven't told anybody. The sele
hasn't said no, don't spend any money on that, >> right? >> I would assume that um the town would have if a permit is required, the town would have to apply for it. uh because it is town property that it would be sitting on and I I believe it will be
gifted to the town. >> It's a gift to the town. >> Um so and then at at that point we'll actually have to take a vote to accept the gift. >> Um but there's still some I'd say some engineering type questions that need to be answered
>> um first. >> I mean we're really blazing a trail yet. Nobody's done anything like this, right? I >> it doesn't exist in the old world like the trails of the tide keepers. So I imagine that it would be pretty big you know because like that's why even uh
even Bayern did not know because like no one has ever done this you know there's a two in England but you know in a river and u and they got covered and it's like a bunch of horses and military guy but this does not exist. So I think it would be a beautiful addition to Manchester
and um and yeah so that's why maybe you know we were not prepared we went forward until now and if it was not for the fiscal sponsor maybe we would have gone forward this last minute. So it's probably best
that all these questions are coming now. So we address everything before, you know, been there with a mermaid and be like install and like no you can't. I have a couple
straightforward questions. Um I think it'd be very sad if it were positioned so that at a at a king tide she drowned. >> So yeah. So what you show as as a base here on a um
picture with the harbor um is at significantly low time. >> It's not the va the base you would see in the documentary. >> Okay. >> So yeah. Okay. Fine. So >> it's like the base is like it's five
feet of base. Then we have so with Tom Baker that is the Manchester moing. We're thinking about doing two more invases. They are like 1 foot tall and six feet of diameter on top of each other. And then we have five feet of
granite. So it's like one boulder and another boulder and everything is connected with bronze rods. So on the morning base there's like bronze rods that come out and keep the granite in place. And then from one boulder to the other, you have bronze rods that go that
are like cemented in so it doesn't move. So basically you're already at seven feet of base. Okay. And then you're going to have 4 feet of mermaid in a seated position which will be like a 10 foot human being. She's big. >> Invited to my studio. You're invited to
my studio if you want to see the progress. >> But but our our king ties tend to be 11 over 11. she would be underwater at king tide because we are planning with Bayion we were thinking that the normal tide is
8.2. So with normal tide or high tide or let's say even higher tide than usual, she will be still out. But with king tide, she would be covered. But he said that the only house that we have that
basically has apple is the house of grace and hati uh zafari. I don't know that Ed's last name, but >> uh it's the guy that bought the buildings here and uh is redoing. >> Yes. So, and basically the king tide
happens twice a year. One is in October and one I believe it's in February and no one goes out and there's only one house that potentially could go out. So, by sudden we're not we're at no risk for that. >> And basing that be underwater does that make a difference? That's some of the
questions we want to we want to check with the EP. You know, if it's just a king tie issue or what >> plan to be taller, that's an option. But the the option of having her taller means that then she will be not
interacting with the tide as much because we're basing the height on an exception and not on the nor on the regular diet. So the effect of her interacting with the tide would be different. the wild factor of maybe having her, you know, up to here at high tide and then completely unveil at low
tide, that would be not there anymore because she would be always maybe out, >> right? >> So, it's something to keep taking into consideration, but it's an option. of the other my other concern is is if I
understand the location it's kind of it's across a small waterway which is usually wet from Masanovo Park the end of Masanovo Park >> so that was the remaining of a mill fact
I've been working with Matthew from the Manchester Museum and that was like Mr. balance nail and the wall is like the remaining of the >> real Exactly. >> Is is that area actually solid enough so that your whole thing isn't going to
gradually is that the luck? >> Yes. Tom Baker that has been is a Manchester resident has been always has been always like here in town and knows the that area very well because it's his job. said that that there is no
risk in that area because it's like pretty solid. And then it would like apply the same principle that it applies for the moorings. So the moing bases on the base and >> well the idea of moorings is that they do sink into the muck. >> Yeah.
>> But like that speaking to uh both Bayern and Tom they said that there were no issues in placing her in that area. Actually, the only house that has a boat and goes out has been asking for a marker for that specific place for a
long time. So that would act as a beautiful marker. So >> So where this is is all rock right off the point right off the end of that. >> I think you're actually mounting on on a wall. That's a wall there. >> 10 more feet to the left you would be in
the M. So this is on top going to be on top of that wall which is now >> and then there is like a little part where there is nothing and then there's the the remaining of the actual mel which is called days creek and that's where she would be which is a great spot because it's actually really right in
front of Mosan Park on that triangle. So for as an aesthetic point of view people always go there all times to just like watch the sunset and enjoy the area. She would she would be across some water from actually Mascano Park which would
cut down on the number of people who would dress her or climb >> still might be some of that >> Bayern has accepted that >> Bay didn't seem to be concerned at all about impact to navigation of the harbor. Um,
and it it's good news to hear, you know, John um John's uh is it Tom Baker's uh input there. Um if it requires permitting from D, we may need it may need a little bit more
investigation and assessment. Um because certainly at different tides, it could take wave action. You don't want something that's going to sink or fall over. You know, you want to make sure it's going to uh anchor correctly. So, there's there
needs I think there needs to be a little bit more on the engineering side analysis and communication with the state. Yeah, if I understand exactly where it's going to be, that that's the remainder of a rip wrap wall. It was built so so
as to enclose days creek >> to make so that there was >> so the nail would work. So it was directing the water through that opening so then so it would get like current for the nail to work. >> Sound good? I know I'm from a from a
conceptual perspective culturally and economically because I think there's a big economic element here. >> So >> everyone is so excited. I'm speaking to banks and I had a meeting the other day with the bank of Glouster. They were so excited and like I have potential of
having even like a single sponsor for this >> and I think that it would bring so much to the town because it's going to be a statement piece in that video. you will see more of my artwork. So that will probably give you peace of mind also in
terms of the beauty that it's going to be because the rendering that I did is reliable for the posture that is going to be the posture that she has. But like when I create like the the I believe she's going to be much more beautiful than that.
>> As I said, it's happening. I'm creating her. I would love her to be at the founder in general because the foundry takes a long time. with this. I know that we have to follow the rules, so it's going to take take the time it takes, but I still uh am excited and um
>> Sounds great. >> Thank you very much. >> Looking forward to the gift. >> Can I make a brief comment? >> Hello. >> Sure. >> Yes. >> Yeah. Steve Carheart from the downtown improvement committee. Uh I just want to
say that that uh we uh this is a little adjacent to what to our uh specific wemit but the businesses in town that we talked to are very interested in having more points of interest because the such as seaside one or the museum or this
could be another point of interest and in the long run um it could be as much a symbol of Manchester as the Copenhagen mermaid or the Gloucester fisherman. uh that could lead to people uh having more enjoyable time in town and
coincidentally spending more money at our at our local businesses. So um without making any the the art I will leave to those who are versed in that but from a business point of view I just want to say seems like a really good idea. Thank you.
>> Thank you. I might add with Steve's comment, the tide comes in and out 365 days a year. >> What? >> Yes. Not just in the summer. And I think that's really kind of what you're thinking. We have plenty of visitors in
July. >> I'm always curious what's going to happen in, you know, October, November, March. >> In a while she's coming from >> when she's covered with ice becomes an ice. People go to Copenagen all year
long and this is not >> when I'm thinking about this I'm thinking about like this being like the first piece of the tide keepers. So this is going to be a unique tide a unique region for this feature for the tide keepers trails that don't exist anywhere
in the world. So I think that it's going to attract to her. It's already beautiful without the tide keepers, but my hope is that this is going to bring more art, more density, more beauty. >> And I think you understand that this is the first one. And once we have figured
out what the what the requirements are, the rest of them will be easier. >> Yes. >> But we may not get to your hope for January. No, I know. January I will make it happen anyways because I'm thinking that I'm sculpting now so I can't spend my
day after like keeping her wet. So January January I will hopefully have money for the mold which I will. And so I'm going to get a mold and then that way I will have beautiful picture of the finished mermaid so people that are going to donate towards this cause
already can see how she looks like. >> If we want just people just big donors because I want to keep the wow effect. M so ideally if everything was going perfectly I would have loved to do the unveiling on the festival by the sea and make like a twoday c artistic
celebration with people manair and everyone celebrating art you know in Manchester bringing the New England sculpture association sculptures in town and but we'll see we'll see what the timeline looks like.
I think I think you clearly have the support of >> Absolutely. >> Thank you so much. It means the world to me. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Right. Next items is to authorize the town
administrator to execute the regulatory agreements for the charter house lane apartments. >> No. We have members from the affordable housing trust here to walk us through. Um this is well I'll let them walk us
through but basically we put this uh on the agenda um so that once legal signs off on this agreement uh it can be executed efficiently and not have to wait for the next next meeting. I'm
having I have a lot of trouble with being handed something of this density at the meeting. >> Yeah. >> I really would like even I would really like a chance to read it. >> Yeah, absolutely.
>> Can you can you uh give us a brief overview? >> Giving you over. So, um because the town is putting the units on the SHI The town has a certain oversight
responsibility. >> The owner is responsible for income verifying all of the the pe eligibility for the apartments and making sure people are continued to be eligible. They're supposed to report to the town
once a year so that the town can validate that they're doing their job. and if they want to raise rents, they're supposed to be notifying the town and EOHL city. Um,
I wasn't aware that this was required >> and it raises a question that I would suspect we have the town has already signed some of these because
um, Lyman Circle >> required affordable units that are on the SHI and Sawmill Circle >> required affordable units. that are on the SHI and what unless the states
change their rules, I'm assuming we had to sign a regulatory agreement and have a certain oversight responsibility, which I not sure we're following through on. So, what I was I mean, we'd really
like to sign so we can get the darn things on the SHI. Um, but this winter I thought I might do a little research on the whole subject to be able to to come up with exactly what the town's responsibility is and who's going to do it.
>> Um, it's I think it's a checklist, >> you know, that that there's very little responsibility on the town, but it is a checklist and I don't believe we've been doing it on the other >> Yeah. >> the other groups. I think no one here
was on the select board of selective when those other agreements were were made were signed. So, uh yeah, but it's just, you know, it's it's I read it. I looked at it.
>> I trust you. I >> I you know, I highlighted the areas that this has to be recorded with the registry of deeds. So, I thought I might check those other two locations and see if there's a regulatory agreement over the registry of deeds.
>> Wouldn't our late town council know that? >> No. >> No, >> I don't know. I don't know when those were. >> Oh, Blimeman Circle was that close to 15 years ago. >> 15 years ago. >> At least 10. >> Yeah. I mean, and you know, in a little
town, stuff goes to somebody and um it vanishes. I mean, this agreement is dated June 2023. So, this has been floating around the town for two and a half years
with nobody really understanding what needed to be done because it started with Sue Brown, then we had Betsy Wear, and then we had Mark. none of whom were familiar >> with what was required. So, it's not like this is
>> getting this on the SHI would be nice, but it's not going to bring us up to >> Well, and the and the units are affordable, and I think that's what people forget. >> The units are deeed restrictive. >> They're affordable. the only thing the
SHI gives us and it makes us jump through thousands of hoops and I'm not sure it's worth it is to hold off a 40B. Well, right now we're in protected status for the 40B because SOV is in the courts. >> Mhm.
>> Um but still people in town contributed to this purchase. >> Yes. and they're very annoyed >> with the understanding they would be on the SHI and also with the understanding that it could keep SLV out and unfortunately the timing was such as the
application had already been submitted. >> So no matter what happened >> I have a quick question on this is can the affordable housing trust be responsible for the the requirements
that the like can the town designate the trust Yeah, >> I mean the the affordable housing trust could do it and then, you know, give a report to the select board um
or somebody in town could do it, you know, and I think that's what we need to have a conversation with with Tony about is where does it make sense to have it done? your your affordable housing trust is volunteers, >> you know, >> and you don't have the continuity of I
mean, yes, your volunteers are there for a long time, but sooner or later. >> No, I'm sorry. >> Well, and we were originally the affordable housing trust was originally sort of um supported by Sue Brown who was a town planner. >> Now, our support person is Gil Hunter,
who's not anything to do with the land use area, >> but this is so this is an operational responsibility. Yes. It should not be in my opinion conducted by any type of committee. It needs someone to own it, some member of town staff to own it. >> Which is why I thought I could at least
pull together what the requirement is. >> I mean, is there maybe somebody in another town that knows more than we do that can help us with this? >> I'm sorry. We've been messing with this for three and a half years. There has
been zero support from the state. zero support from anybody as to what's required because this was an existing >> apartment building. So taken over, not new construction and no estate money was included.
>> I don't think that's just >> the situation must have come up somewhere in the state at some point. I mean, maybe there's somebody in another town out there who's dealt with this that >> Well, I I I think a question though is for other towns that manage their SHI,
right? Who does it? Is it the town planner? Is it some other operations leader, >> you know, in town staff? Who does it? I think that's interesting data for Tony to peruse. Um, you know, just to how is it normally staffed? And then whether or not they've encountered this specific
scenario, maybe not. But if they're familiar with that process, they're probably in a better position to >> see the Manchester Housing Authority is a state agency, >> so those aren't an issue. >> Is this is this then require an annual
operational followup with regard to what's on the SHI >> list? Each year, >> it requires the owner to to notify the town. So, so >> yeah, I guess my question, so are we are we getting that? >> No.
>> So, playing devil's >> playing devil's advocate, it's something that could be put on the list for our independent auditors to audit us on. >> Okay. That that that way you make sure it gets done. >> Yeah, it sounds like a problem. >> I'm just saying, you know, I'm just saying we we're either going to get our
act together. >> It's not or we're not >> It's not a financial issue. >> I'm I'm not talking no financial talking financial. It's not an independent audit situation really. >> You can audit anything. They're not it's not I'm not talking about financials. I'm just saying, you know, we need some
accountability. We need someone to own the process. We need some way of making sure that um it doesn't fall through the cracks and and uh you know, we'll let Tony stew on that and see who we he'd like to have own it. But to make sure
things get done, one way to make sure things get done and >> you know is to put it on the list of things to be audited. So >> it's so EOHLC is also there the owner is
required to report and request to the municipality and EOHLC. Those are >> we should be able to find out from PHLC what other communities how they're processing this. >> Yep. And they should be they should be
undergoing those those entities that are supposed to be reporting to us, right? >> Owners. those owners, you know, are they getting >> to be honest, Kathy, this seems to me like this is
a regulation that is not necessarily monitored because if it was monitored, they be asking us for certification on the other units we have on the have had on the SHI for years. So, I'm not sure how much we want to delve into it with the state.
>> I'm not suggesting we delve into it with the state. That's not what I'm suggesting. I don't know. Open a can of >> It's a good idea to ask other questions. I mean, questions of other towns, >> other towns. Suggesting we go to >> who's dealing with this.
>> I mean, probably Wenham. Wenham is a lot. >> Okay. >> Somebody must do it, right? >> I could reach out to Wenham and some of our >> or even some towns that are above the 10%. Right. You know >> if switch would be bigger
>> ifover is over 10%. >> Yeah but Beverly's bigger. See those have people on staff to do things. >> Okay. >> It's still a >> Beverly and Andover would have staff people >> to do it. the IPS switch probably
wouldn't and when wouldn't and and I think that's the problem is is that for most of this affordable housing trust and you guys can you know say most of the towns have people actually doing things employees >> Johnbach former chair of the housing
trust Harold Street there's also a distinction I think what we're talking about now is this H shi but the state administered staff the outing in low vote housing tax credit program which um creates many units that puts towns over
the 10%. >> That is so strict because in terms of monitoring because there's investors who are um investing funds into it and so it's very um compliance is really extra
tight. I am not so clear about how the SHI which it's non-monetary so it's really just you know chief executive officer of the town has got to certify you know annually that the that the
units comply tenants are eligible but I don't know how how strict that is but I do know tax credit you know powerhouse does you know additional work and tax credits later down that will being very monitored
>> very very tightly is because the risk of non-compliance to an investor is so so great and Chris could probably talk that out more since he's he's a business of that
>> uh I can't well I think John is right if there are huge numbers of tax credits in a project investor are going to be like eagles because the tax credits go away if there's a non-compliance issue.
But I want to sort of say something about Jeb to Jeff's point, which is this is really actually a very odd situation where a group of citizens got together, raised a lot of money to make this happen with no state involvement at all.
So that we kind of go running around. >> How how is that different from the sawmill um and and and the blind circle where they took an existing they took existing houses and and turned them into
>> I'm not sure it's much different because those were affordable. >> That's true of inclusionary zoning. They were sort of set aside >> by zoning. No, and maybe that's >> that would be just so there wouldn't have been investors in that affordable
component worried about >> keeping them affordable. >> Yeah, that's a very good point. >> And the one on Central Street was sold. >> Um, of course >> I don't know if the town was notified. >> So 12 Summer Street is a
uh 40B >> and there are affordable units there and there is a monitoring thing going on. But that's under MHA. >> I I can't >> The apartments are But there's two condos there. >> Yeah. >> That are affordable.
>> And one came up for sale and it was very confusing as to what needed to be done. And my sense is it it's probably something that the town could understand which of those two
units are actually affordable units. Um, we can't rely on realtors. >> Yeah. Yeah. Restriction is >> I was going to say a deed restriction. >> Yeah. It comes up on a title search, but still.
>> Okay. Um, it sounds to me as if there's some more work to be done before we take a vote on this. >> Yeah. I I for one, in addition to wanting to read through it, um I would like to know who who's going to own responsibility for whatever it is that
requires oversight. >> You know, who in town hall is going to, you know, the ballot that takes care of it. >> Just skimming through this, >> it's not there's there is there's some
significant responsibility in here on the town's part. So it's not like just uh asking an admin to sign off. >> This is not an administrative position. >> Yeah. This is uh >> this is not Gail Hunters, >> right? >> I'm not, you know, not to not saying
that I have a problem with it. We just got to look into that and figure out >> and and I think that what people do need to be aware of that time is of the essence to from the
standpoint that the affordable housing trust pulled in Bruce Tar and Bronte's office >> to get EOlc to pay any some attention to us. Um, so
they've approved it and they're looking for the town to sign it. Just so you're aware. >> Okay, that that's fine. But the town doesn't sign things without reading them. >> Right. Right. I understand. >> I think the only other thing, Tony, I mean I um what I'm looking for is
somebody on your staff to own it. Okay. As far as the logistics of managing the operation, that can be done possibly through a third party. That's what that's what I mean by maybe audit's not the right word, but you can hire, you know, you possibly could hire a consulting organization to make sure all
the eyes are dotted, tees are crossed, an annual, you know, pay somebody else to go do it, but there's got to be someone on the staff that's responsible for making it happen. You know, you can take that approach. You don't necessarily have to hire somebody or whatever. So, I I think there's many different ways to make sure it gets
done, but we ought to read it to make sure we know what it is. Um, we should put this on our neck on the agenda for our next meeting and see how much progress we've made, but as Sarah thinks that the time is of the
essence, then we need to keep hammering at it or the town makes a decision that they don't want to jump through the hoops that the state has created doesn't want to put anything on ESHI. you're not required
to. That's the other alternative. >> Is is there a deadline associated with this at all in terms of our when you submitted >> um >> that we'll just keep grinding. >> So, Powderhouse Lane
has rented out more than 25% of the units to income eligible, but none of them count. >> This wasn't submitted. And so none of
they're going to continue to rent the units, but they're not going to start counting towards the 25% until the state receives this signed. >> Isn't there a lottery process that has to happen, too? No. >> Yeah. So, would they So, until they turn
over, they still wouldn't be included. Right. >> Right. Right. >> And they can't start doing that. It doesn't. They could have a lottery today, but it won't count, >> right? >> Because they've got to have the state has to have this first. >> And so they've been
I I don't know how many units have been rented. It's well more. >> I think there was 13 or 14. >> Yeah. So h almost half of them have been rented income eligible and indeed restricted but we can't use them to apply for the 25% to get all of the
units on the SHI because they were done before >> the state that they got to approve this affirmative fair housing plan which my understanding if that hasn't been approved it's really really close and then this year and once that's done then
every new unit that is uh created because of a vacancy would be marketed according to the affirmative housing plan and that will be number one unit that goes to SHI next vacancy same marketing >> rent to income eligible that's number
two SHI once we get eight um all 29 become SHI eligible >> okay it's 25% >> right but that's I mean these people in theory have to voluntarily leave I mean they have a lease and it comes up year to year to year But they may say, "I'm
going to stick around." >> That's right. >> And they have every every right to do so. >> Yep. >> Right. They maintain their >> That's part of the challenge is because they've been renting to income eligible people, >> right? Just because they're doing that more difficult now, >> but it's not benefiting us because even
though they're income eligible, they're not a lottery people. >> That's for SHI. >> No, it does not. >> But it's benefiting the town. >> Oh, yeah. by having the affordable units even if they're not unnecessary. >> But even if we have this sign this
tonight and it's all ready to go, we're still years away from those apartments turn >> they turn them over quickly. >> It really depends on the vacancies and and what how they're created. If this were signed tonight, we have the
approval of the firm affirmative marketing plan, the next tenant would be eligible and we just start counting up to You got to get 13 of these. >> The first they start eat they count individually from day one. It's when you get eight
that you count the entire complex. >> You only need eight to count the entire complex. >> I understand that. But where are these eight coming from? You don't have eight empty apartments right now. Right. >> It's a part of vacancy. Yeah. >> I mean they've been turning over rapidly. Yeah. They've had 13 in what?
Four years. >> Oh, three. >> No, I think but since they did their marketing about a year. Yeah. three. >> Yeah, the last years. >> It's going to take at least two years. >> I have another question. >> Yes.
>> If there is a cost associated with administering this on the town side, can the trust cover the cost of that? Whether it be a consultant or salary?
I would think the trust would be able to do that because it's in the it's in the support of maintaining affordable housing units. I mean, we were paying a portion of Sue Brown's salary when she
was supporting the affordable housing test. >> By a lot of outsourcing with the >> Yeah. >> Well, I assume it's not in anyone's job description right now. I mean, we're supposed to that's what outsourcing is. You outsource things that are not your
core competency to people who can do it. >> And you agree, Kathy. There's a a cottage industry. >> Absolutely. >> That we can just contact. >> Yeah. >> We can maybe put out a bid. >> Yep. >> And then just work with someone specifically on this and they, you know,
build hourly or so, but they it's like in their bloodstream and they they'll >> do it faster than a question. The next question All right. So, we have some homework to do over the next week or so then on that. >> Thank you for reminding us.
>> Yes. >> Smart. We've made a lot of progress in the last month or two beyond the past in the past two weeks. I feel like we've made more progress than the past two years. So, thank you Sarah. >> It's like we're in the muck and the muck keeps sinking a little deeper and we
want it to dry out. politics. We know where >> we know where the muck is, right? >> And I mean, go home in time. The game >> look at that clock. It's >> That's true. 8:06. The game's at 8:15. Quickly.
>> You're in time. You're gonna move away. All right. >> Okay. >> Let's see. So, we don't need that motion. >> Okay. >> Uh, let's see. DPW
leaders are on schedule running about 75 to 100 a week. That's going along fine. I will say I I don't know if your comments are going to include something on the senior center with the meeting that we had a week ago or two weeks ago. >> You can I I might comment on a followup
to that. About a week and a half ago. Um presentation was made by uh John Harden about the the floor plan for the senior center. There must have been what 25 people here, a lot of seniors and other people that were interested to get kind
of buy in on what what appropriately might be the the the architectural arrangement and kind of a consensus was drawn was pulled together and Nate today was with the seniors this morning at the coffee to kind of follow up with comments from that and the seniors feel
pretty good about the way the layout looks. Um I'm not going to share it here at this point but um there right now in a costing uh analysis because there is a favored plan but there are two others and that there are three plans that are going to be put together and depending
upon if the money differential is big that's going to become a factor. it's fairly minor then they'll probably go with their favor plan but that's in the works right now and I guess that bidding or that that um estimating estimating is going to happen what the end of this
month I think could be the end of the month >> something to end of the month yeah >> okay all right so things are cranking along on that so that covers the DPW and the seniors that was a two for one deal
uh library this in an up there was no update there and uh the HDC will meet next week. So I don't have an update on that. >> So a couple things um on the uh downtown improvement committee uh Mark uh Resnik
uh appeared at the last committee and talked about some of the um you know proposed zoning changes for the downtown. Um, and it was mentioned that he was looking to hire an engineering firm
to bring the downtown improvement 2.0 strategy up to a level of design where we could apply for a Mass Works grant. Um, I guess a 25% design is required to apply for that grant. And so, um, there
were questions at the downtown improvement committee. Okay, what does that mean? you talking about revisiting the the design and Mark said no, he just wants another level of detail. So, I'm going to meet with uh Mark on Wednesday to better understand what he's trying to do and and uh kind of be a broker
between the committee and Mark and see see that we're all on the same page. Uh see see where things are out there. Um the other item bike and ped had a couple of interesting discussions around micromobility. So I learned a new term
micromobility I guess um includes uh devices such as ebikes and e- scooters. So there was a lot of discussion should the bike and ped or they were proposing having a discussion on should they change and amend their charter to
include such micromobility devices like ebikes because right now that's not part of their charter to advise the town on. So um it was brought up at the last meeting. They'll put it on next month's agenda to have a formal debate and discussion and then they would come forward to the select board, you know,
with a recommended update if they thought that was the right thing to do. They're not clear on that because they they really are focused on non-motorized, >> you know, items like pedestrians and normal bicycles, but there have been so many issues and controversies in the
state on the ebikes that they want to at least take a look at it. Um the other item they mentioned was I guess the accessible uh trail in Powder House um was endorsed by the Concom. So they're they're going to be um proceeding to to
work on that. I think they are um going to be working on a grant proposal if I recall. I can't read my own handwriting but um anyway that's moving along. So, uh, they're talking about a a trail that would start at the end of Newport Park
and, um, have possible handrails installed on on the certain pieces of the train and the trail itself would, um, you know, be made to be more accessible for wheelchairs, etc. So, a small trail um going from Newport Park
to uh Pine Street where the um other entrances the like the the there's two entrances on Pine Street. So, it would be the Pine Street entrance that's closest to the gas station. So, anyway, those two things are moving
along. And I think that was it for me. Um, Fox and Rick, they're right along doing whatever they do. Uh, they're getting ready for uh some basketball stats this weekend as does their
uh Santa Claus little stroll. So, they're cranking up and they're also already planning Fourth of July for next year, 250th anniversary. So, they're trying to make it up a little bigger. There'll be a
fundraiser at the Legion on March 7th uh dance and they're looking at other ways to make this special event. uh you know the uh CBA
uh continued the I go another had some questions that been continued until later this month and nothing concoming board continues their work on downtown zoning and uh they have a public forum
this Thursday I hoping to attend but my week is not looking too good at this point but I'm going to try to make that um hybrid advisory should meet next week if they can get a quorum together and
Essex Tech has nine applications as of last Monday for the class of 23rd >> interest I think I asked the question maybe a couple of months ago. So, how many students are there from Manchester now?
>> There are well right now. >> So, this I mean obviously this will fill our five like I talked about before. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> So, we'll have five round one and then who knows what'll happen. >> Yeah. Then the rest they're at risk.
>> Yeah. >> So to speak. >> Okay. Um the board of health um decided not to to withdraw their request for uh to Desmond Avenue for
receiverhip. Um the they agreed that it is it is not inhabited and and therefore the the details of unhabitable
building don't apply. Um and the the um Gates and their and their sons seem to be making progress on cleaning up and um the wall is in the process of getting it hasn't been completely built
to process. Um the finance committee looked at the safe capital list that we have looked at um and had agreed that they needed to think about it some more and there be more
discussion of it at their next meeting. Um, no surprise that the boats and and trailer and truck were hot buttons. Um, >> anything else? >> I believe that was really it. Um
and the food committee um has agreed on a a calendar for um producing their budget. Um they're tomorrow night they're doing it's
presented to the committee. Um and each year they have a very aggressive schedule for bringing their budget forward which unfortunately uh isn't consistent with the information
when when they can get the information for example about their insuranceances. So, um, they should have everything together by February and then in March they learn about their health insurance
bill. So, I don't hold a great hopes for the the calendar is there. It just not been very realistic. So um we've already talked about their
attempts to um influence the reorganiz organization of chapter 7. That's about it. Um we have a consent agenda. name elected.
>> I made the motion to approve this consent agenda. >> Second, >> John. >> Uh, let's see. We did We did update Kathy. You did update the minutes. Debbie sent them out. >> There were a couple of attributions that were >> There were three she did.
>> Was it three? Well, I saw two. >> Two for Yomi and one for a resident commenting. >> Okay. >> Yeah, she did. >> Uh, then I say, "Uh, yes." >> Says, "Yes, Kathy." >> Yes, >> Brian. Yes. >> Thank you. >> Yes.
>> Okay. County administrators. >> Yeah. I was going to mention the planning board public forum Thursday um at 6:30 here in this room. It's also hybrid. Um the most of my time uh and
Andrea's time has been spent on preparing for you know the budget and capital review and capital requests and operational budget requests. So, we met with the finance committee as Ann mentioned uh last week on the 20th. Um
we're meeting with department heads now uh reviewing their operational requests and our next uh our next select board meeting will be a joint meeting with the finance
committee uh on the 15th to for that first budget presentation to both uh to both committees as a group. Um we've also begun contract negotiations. We've had our first meeting with the clerical
union and the fire union. Uh we're also have the DBW is next uh for us to meet with and start the process with them as well. Uh so a lot of a lot of time has been spent you know between those three things alone. Um
and MVP uh 2.0 0 had uh some regional calls with Rockport, Gloucester and Essex uh regarding uh submission for MVP 2.0. MAPC uh we'll be working with MAPC as a
consultant to put the application forward uh to the state. Um and then we're also applying as a region uh for an action grant under MVP for the Culver project. We had a call today
uh with um with the state as a uh recap of our expression of interest. So we first submit a letter of interest saying that we intend to apply uh for this grant and briefly discussed uh the different elements of the project.
The RFR for the action grant uh process goes out the all they could say was January. um once the RFR goes out, we they can't really engage with us on elements of our
application. So, also this month, you know, a big priority of ours is going to be to kind of work out some of a draft application and communicate with the state on that before the RFR comes out. So, if we can get any feedback uh from
them, essentially they said, you know, where you're applying for a regional grant at the max amount, you really have to knock it out of the park with this application. Uh so, it's going to be really important that we nail that down and work with our neighboring towns on
that as well. So, we got a lot of good feedback today. Uh we're going to look at the previous RFR. Uh the application has changed a little bit, but generally it's the same type of information that they're going to be requesting. Um and you know, we really want to speak
specifically to the different funding sources that we have. Uh itemizing what those funding sources are going to go towards because you can't overlap uh the items that money is going to go to.
um to talk about uh that the federal funding does expire in April. Um that uh we're you know highlighting it's they really don't want to see a maintenance project. They want to see long-term
resiliency. So really speaking to um you know how we're planning for future conditions, not necessarily the existing state of the culvert. um getting letters of commitment from each community uh refer you know going in depth as to
what the what action items are going to occur in those other communities. Um mostly that's going to be public outreach. Um designing for a 100redyear storm event. um how the plans and then nature-based
solutions is another big element. Uh so we're going to speak to even though that the the action grant funds that we're applying for wouldn't go towards the naturebased solution that's really the Noah funds that we have for the Sawmill
Brook brook restoration. You know really speaking to how that project can't happen until the Culver project happens. So, um, we got a lot of great feedback from them today and, uh, we'll be working on that. Um, and then lastly, I just would say we have, uh, we have a,
um, toy drive happening here in the town hall for those still paying attention on on Zoom. Um, we're accepting, uh, unwrapped toys from November 12th uh to December 12th here in the town hall.
There's a box right in the main um foyer and there's also a QR code there for any online donations or um to pull up the Amazon wish list uh for toys that uh kids have specifically requested. And
this is a partnership with Cape Kids. >> Oh yeah, >> one other thing. Um on the 9th at at 6:00 um the Essex Elementary School um
building committee is going to do a presentation of of where they are and what's going on. Um it will be at the school police interview.
Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Is the And I'm just trying to look online real quick to double check, but is the um is the tree lighting this >> the tree? >> Sunday. >> Sunday. Okay. >> That's part of this whole the first
weekend. Uh >> Santa comes out Saturday. Yep. I hope. >> All right. Weather formitting this. >> I know. >> We'll make sure we publish the information on social media here too.
>> Motion to return. >> We have session. So >> yeah, we can move into fill into executive session. >> All right. I move that we go into
executive session to consider the purchase exchange pursuant to General Wallace chapter 3A paragraph 21 A6 to consider purchase exchange please her value of real estate property at the Masonic Hall 10 Church
Street if the chair's chair declares that an open meeting may have a detrimental effect on the negotiation position of the public body and I do so declare not to return to open session second. >> John, >> yes. >> Ann says yes. Kathy, >> yes.
>> Brian, yes. >> And Jeff, >> yes. >> Okay, so we can close off the um feed.