Now, right. Good evening everyone. We're going to call the meeting to order. Please stand for the pledge of allegiance. Pledge of allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and all. Some were slower. All right. Public notice of this meeting pursuant to the open meetings
act has been given by the township council in the following manner. Notifying the township clerk December 27th, 2024. Mailing notice to the carrier post central record, Burlington County Times, December 27th, 2024. And posting notice of the official on the official municipal bulletin board on December 27th,
2024. Um, anyone from the public wishing to speak with the will be permitted to address comments to the council during public participation portions only. Please place all phones on mute to alleviate the disruption of the meeting. Roll call. Terry. Mr. Kaufman. Ms. Nunes here. Mr. Simons here. Mr. Zeradnik
here. Mayor Tarico here. Mayor, if we could just have the record reflect that uh Councilman um Kaufman did call in and say that he wasn't able to make it tonight. Okay. Thank you. Uh this is the open board of health meeting. Thank you. Uh for the month of April, we had two sanitary conditions reported. One was a
hoarding. Uh cleanup is ongoing. The occupant is undergoing counseling and monitoring will continue by the county. And there was also a cleanup of um one complete cleanup of a property and that is completed and closed out. We had three dog bites. Uh one was a routine vet exam and the vet was bitten. Another
one was the neighbor was bitten by the dog and then the third bite was just a playful bite to the owner of of the owner. We had a complaint of dog waste. Neighboring property failed to clean up the dog waste. The county went out has been working with the with the resident and that has been abated. So there were
six claims alto together but again either ongoing or abdated. Thank you. Um motion to close. I'll make that motion. What do I have to say? Public public. Anybody from the public portion have anything on the board of
health meeting? Seeing none. Motion to close. So made. I'll second. Comments. All in favor? I. Motion to adjurnn. Anyone? I'll make the motion. Second. All in favor? I I Okay. This is the
public portion for the consent agenda items only. If anybody wishing to to speak on the consent agenda, please come up. State your name and address for the record. All right. Seeing none, motion to close. So made. Second. All in favor? I. I. All right.
This is the consent agenda. We're going to do resolution number 2025R-94 through resolution number 2025R-101. Motion to approve the consent agenda. So made you got a second. I'll second but I got to stay out of and then comments and
then you have comment Andrew or Yes, I have a comment. Okay. Resolution 25 2025 R99. I'll be refraining from that. Okay. Anybody else? Roll call. Miss Nunes. Yes. Mr.
Simitic. Yes. Mr. Zerazzi. Yes. Mayor Gallerico. Yes. Approval of the expenditure list. Thank you. Current fund billis is $4,616,125.54. Utility fund billis is
$372,916.73. Capital fund billis is $11,14344. Utility capital is $34,519.84. Our trust fund is $16,4711. And our grant fund is $700.32. Um just to make note that the current fund, $1.7 million of that 4.6
is for our pension payment that needs to be made and $2.6 million of it is the school tax payment. So that comes out to just a little over 4.3 million of the 4.6 in those two payments. I have reviewed the above bill list as submitted and recommend payment when funds are available. Okay. Thank you.
Motion to approve. So made a second. Comments. Roll call. Miss Nunes. Yes. Mr. Simonic. Yes. Mr. Znik. Yes. Mayor Cherica. Yes. Approval of the April 2025 minutes. We have a motion to approve.
I'll make the motion. Second. Comments. Roll call. Miss News? Yes. Mr. Simon? Yes. Mr. Zaredic? Yes. Mayor Telerico? Yes. All right. This is the public portion. If anybody from the public wish to address council, please come up. State your name and address for the
record. Yep. Andrew Simons Jr. 17 over Brook A. Maple Shade. want to hand this out real quick. Thank you. Thank you. It's a stretch. You just give
me both. I'll just hand that works. Thanks. So, as you all have seen for the past several days, I've had communications back and forth with the council as well as mayor uh manager Dansen in reference to the appointment of the officers for
the Maple Shade Fire Department, i.e. the deputy and captain. To be honest with you, I couldn't go back and forth anymore with email. Uh, as you see in the pamphlets, uh, there's two different threads of emails that have gone back and forth. I believe most of you to have been uh, on
most of those emails back and forth, but in case you weren't, uh, there's copies provided for you. My main concern in all of this is that we currently are operating with myself as the chief and a lieutenant, Timmy Miller. uh for a command structure
for a fire department that is not fit to continue. And as you are all well aware of the uh two neighboring departments that have dissolved themselves from helping with any service calls to this town, there's a lot of decisions that have to be made in a quick manner to start to figure this out and resolve
these issues. To do that, a proper command staff is needs to be in place and it needs to be in place fairly quickly for me to make these decisions for the life safety of this town. As the chief of the fire department, I'm coming to you now to discuss this matter to
just prove a couple facts to you guys about this interview process that keeps being thrown in here. I would served as the deputy chief for the last year for the same department. I was never interviewed by the township for that position. Lieutenant Miller has served for the last year for the same department. Was never interviewed
formally for that position. Greg Taylor served for three months as the captain of that department. Never interviewed. And for this current role as chief, I never formally had an interview. So for the fact of an interview being thrown around for a deputy chief and a uh captain position that are volunteer, I
find it insane that this process is going on when we've so many times done this over with not only myself but other members of this department. I'm not requesting this because I want it done for a title change. I'm doing this so that way we can progress forward and move forward in a quick manner. So I'm
coming to the council tonight with all of these facts. It was specifically stated by MA manager Dansson in an email to me in the second pamphlet on the third page number two about the uh town ordinance of
2023-12 which governs our current structure. Section 16-4 states the township manager shall appoint the fire chief, deputy fire chief, battalion chief, fire marshal, fire inspectors, and all other line and engineering officers. Set appointment shall be made
on January 1st of each year and formally recommended by independent fire company number one. Nowhere in there is anything about an interview process for those roles. And as far as I'm concerned, the roles that have been filled in the past year and a half have not had interviews either. So for this to all of a sudden
come about, I'm not sure why, but I would like the opinion of the council on this matter to try to resolve this in a quick and fluent manner so we can move on with the progress of this fire department. So I have the first question. Why wasn't I copied on these
emails? Because you're saying not I I I want to know who made the decision and who left me out. They're simple questions and simple answers. I I made the decision as your son is the chief of the fire department. That's number one. Please stop right there.
My son was made the chief of the fire department without me being involved in that. Now that he is the chief of the fire department as a council member, I have the right to participate in all that. So if anyone in front of me right
now wants to say that I there's a conflict of interest, there's going to be a problem. I'm stating right now in public and it's being recorded. There is absolutely none no conflict of interest for any of this and all these games and
charades are going to start ending tonight. I am tired of it. You serve it the pleasure of council and everyone in this building does and somehow or another it's going to get rectified. But we have done absolutely nothing since I
came on council and it ends tonight. I am going to start being involved and I am going to start doing what I need to do what I promised the people of this town and you are playing games with everything words and everything else. And just so you know that email that you
sent me under new business, I'm going to go through every one of those points and clarifying. I'm done with the games. I'm done with the charades. I'm done with dragging things on. All it's doing is costing this township money and it's dragging it down and tonight is the end
for me. I've reached my limit. It's over. Well, Mr. Simon Sack, I will tell you that I have reached my limit with you treating me this way. Then you have you have a choice. I'm here for years. To answer Chief Simon Sek's question, he was not he was not interviewed because
Judge Fickery appointed him as that position. I will tell you that both your captain and Tim Miller were both spoken to by Dan Cerr at the time, the chief that was put in place. He sat with them. My email to you today that came from you
today. I responded immediately to you in which you told me that you would like to appoint those two. Yep. We had agreed on what the process was going to be. I also said I did not agree with it. Yes, we did. You sat in my office on Monday and we discussed about it. We agreed to have an interview process as the personnel
manager for the municipal. I have no problem. All I want to do is I want to have the ability to sit down with the people that you are suggesting to put in there and have a conversation with them. I would be happy to have that. And I said to you, can I make a point real quick? When I'm done, you can. Yes. And
I said to you, if your recommendation would like to bring his information to me, get it to me. We'll sit down early next week. Why was my information never requested from you? Show me my res because you were appointed by the judge, not by the municipality. Not for the
position that you just resolved in this in this today tonight. You just being chief of the fire department. You met with me. Did you interview me? I did interview you. I certainly did. You formally said in that in that interview that it was an informal thing and that it was not an interview because Dan the
same and it's going to be the same thing. Andrew, I'm disagreeing with you fully and you are welcome to disagree with me for your exact for your exact point that you allowed Dan Kerr to just appoint Lieutenant Miller a year ago. Just appoint Lieutenant Miller. He did the same thing that I just did and he got no backlash of wanting an interview.
Then why was it different a year ago, Susan? It was not different a year ago. It was I was the deputy chief and I was involved in that because I was the one that broke the news to Lieutenant Miller and recommended that Lieutenant Miller was in that position, not Dan Kerr. Well, Dan Kerr and I had a full conversation. So again, back to the council. I would like your opinion on
this matter. You have all the facts in front of you that the ordinance does not state that the interview process is needed. Can we move forward with these appointments so that way the Maple Shade Fire Department can progress and move forward? So let me ask you a question right now. What's the command staff? Myself is the chief and one lieutenant
Timothy Miller. That is it. Okay. There's no command staff has to be appointed immediately and that's the way they get their power and authority and to cover liability issues. That's your personal opinion. No, that's the law. No, it's not. State of New Jersey. The state of New Jersey. The state of New
Jersey. So So wait, before we go for any further, I know everything about the fire department inside and out and how it works. No, please. I am speaking and with all due respect, you need to be quiet when I'm speaking to you, okay? I know how it works. all the
certifications and all this stuff with Don Nelson and you and Dan and and Joe Palumbo was a charade. I would ask this is part of the litigation. I would ask that you ask to refrain from talking the whole thing. No, this is I'm talking to you. I would ask this should be I would
ask you that's all part of the litigation. Thank you. you should. The point being is there's a place there's there's a process in place for this state and you can't just tell somebody they can get on a truck and that they can just fill in and do that without
them being certified. That was your whole thing about getting certifications that started all this. And if you want to deny that, you go right ahead. All right? That's the way it has to be. And right now, there is no one in this town taking care of it. All the things that
happened has put this town way behind. They went from maybe 36 calls being scratched that that Lenola took care of to over a hundred with your fire department and Dan Cerr in charge because of all the games that are being played. This township right now has an
opportunity to straighten things out and start getting things back in place for the protection of the people that live in this town. And my goal is so that we have that protection and we have it at a minimal cost because all this stuff that's going on in this town with the
fire departments has taken Cherry Hill and Mount Laurel 30 years to evolve to get where they're at now cuz I've seen it. I've been there for the whole journey. So for us to want to shove down the taxpayers's throat a a completely operational fire department when all we
needed to do was what we suggested to you three and a half years ago at a meeting was a stipen program cuz we all realized that there was an issue during the day sometimes. I think you're getting off topic. I have a question. So before you were appointed chief, how
many did we have? We had Kerr, you and Tim Miller. Correct. Okay. So we only we only lost Kerr. We lost one position technically. You got moved into that. There was the captain's position that was also appointed that was removed from that person for a year ago about nine months I would say. So for nine months
we which I had asked Chief Kerr several times to refill that position to help and he refused to because he didn't feel there was a good fit in the department for that position. Okay. The scope of Okay. Can you let him go ahead with with the way the command structure has ran in this town? I'm not saying it has to go
back to the way it was. There was a minimum of five officers. I'm asking for the appointment of one other chief officer to have my back and lead us through this what's going to be a brutal process trying to fix all the problems in this town. To be completely honest with you guys, as you know, the two
neighboring departments that have sent those letters, there's a lot that I have to do to start to fix that. And I cannot do it by myself. I need a command structure. And if you want to tell the residents that we're going to wait till the end of May to figure this out, be my guest. But I do not want to be a part of that. Susan, there was a date that was
the May 30th. I I understand that you said it could be sooner than that, but it's a latest date of that. I understand all I believe all as we want and I don't want to speak for all council is just an opportunity to see who is qualified or certified and I might not say and as you
can see in these emails, I sat down with several people, not just members of the IFC, several other individuals from the township's fire department as well as the IFC. And there was only one that was interested in the deputy chief's position. That is who she was listed in these emails. Okay. Same thing with the
captain's position. Unfortunately, there is no one else that one is qualified with the certifications to do it or two wants to do it right now. You have no control when it comes to calls. And all I have asked is for the respect to sit down with Chief's uh his recommendation.
That's all I've asked. And but it was okay. It was okay for this to occur when Dan Kerr was chief to appoint people without sitting down. Lieutenant Miller never sat down with you. Andrew, let's not go backwards. Let's move forward. Um, thank you for coming up. We will talk about this as council and I promise
you it won't be till the end of May. Well, okay. It might take a week or two, but I mean, we're not going to be honest with you. This department cannot wait till the end of May. And I cannot move forward without a command structure in this. I did tell you today that it would not be the end of May. I would I could sit down with him as early as next. And
instead of fighting back and forth, let's just move. The one thing I want to be said tonight is the interview process that keeps getting thrown around. There's nothing in the ordinance that says that needs to occur. Nothing. Okay. And it has not occurred in the past year and a half. No position was done that
way. Will will your recommendation sit down with me early next week. Interview or not? We can call it a conversation. The same I don't know because I still have not posted it because I do not agree with the terms to be completely honest with you of May 30th. Well, I would like to sit down with your recommend with your recommended
uh command staff. I would like to sit down with them. That's all the one that you're recommending for deputy chief. That's what I'm asking for. That's what I asked for you this afternoon. You asked for a full resume, a full interview process. Part of it because it is part of the posting. However, why was it not done for any other position? Susan, that's my because you and Chief
Kerr were appointed by the court, not by the municipality and Lieutenant Miller wasn't. He wasn't. We're not appointing Lieutenant Miller. But it happened so many times again and again again without an interview process. All of a sudden I'm the chief and now we're struggling to get did sit down with Dan Kerr and
even if you're a deputy chief and you're an employee somewhere and you get a promotion you don't have a hopeful new interview just sit down. You see you know what your job is to move forward. I understand that for myself specifically. Yes I do. I retain the right for the deputy chief to sit down with them and speak with them. I'm going to refer to
the council for what you want to move forward on at this point and I'm going to let you make that decision. But I do not want I want to make a public record now that I do not want to be held accountable when stuff starts to hit the fan in the coming couple weeks and I cannot make decisions or go to chief's meetings and have an individual that is
a chief in this department to have my back to represent this town. That is what I would do as early as next week and the next appointment would be at May 22nd's meeting. That's the earliest that we would even be able to do a resolution. However, I would sit with you early next week. It says in the ordinance under the recommendation of
the chief of the IFC. That's what it says. So why are we having this conversation? I would like to sit down with the recommended with the recommended individual because that recommended individual. What do you know about their qualifications? It has nothing to do as I told as I told Chief Simon Sec, I want to make sure that we
are all aligned. All of us. I know that he's aligned with Chief Simons, but I also want him to be aligned with what the municipality wants and what I expect because as I said to Chief Simons, that in his absence, that is the me that is the person that is going to be contacting me and working with me. It is no differently than what I do when the
police department when the police department comes through, I sit down with the individuals that they're looking to hire. You just made a comment what you expect. What about what we expect out here? Because I expect a lot of other things. And right now the professional that's sitting on this
council is me. I've lived it my whole entire life and I know it inside and out and I've been abused by it from from and that's why I'm here. So I I want to know why you need to look at qualifications when a professional certified person is
making the recommendations because my name's going on the appointment. Well then you should trust that person and like my information but I still want to sit down with the person. Okay. This is ridiculous. There's no span of control in that department. It's all liability issues. And the more that we leave this
go and don't get it done, the liability comes back to this council. Okay. And I know that and I'm not going to allow it. Since this is the public portion, we're going to move on. Does anybody else from the public wish to come up? You're done, right? Sorry. That's where we're ending it. Well, we we have This is the public portion. So, we would
discuss it under a different area. New business. New business. Whatever. Council comments. All right. I'm a nobody. I've been in the fire department almost 20 years. What's your name and address? Oh, I'm sorry. Mike Stevens, 47 Cherry Avenue. Alec Fleming, who they went for
for deputy, has bu doing that job on his on the firehouse time and on his own time. He brings his kids up so he can do the job. He's very very intelligent. He's very, very knowledgeable. and he
has all kind of certifications and he he is and will be a great help to our chief. Okay. Anything else? Thank you. Anybody else from the public?
Dep 617. I have two questions. What makes you proficient at deciding about this fire department. I just want to know what your skills what your skill set is. I am proficient in finding leadership. That
is what I'm trying to do. I want to make sure that the person that is going to be the next in command. I'm sure that the person that we are talking about and I need to remind council that there should be no names because he would be an employee and there has been no rights notice that the person that we are
speaking about is qualified. I also want to remind everyone that on two separate occasions we have offered this person an a a portion to be some to be imple and I agree with that and I think that is also why it's important to make sure that
there is some sort of sitdown with this person to make sure again that we are all on the same page so that when Chief Simons is out of town I know that this person will be on the same page as Chief Simons that we are all working together
that Everything gets left aside and I think that I owe that to the residents. I owe that to the staff here and I owe it to the fire department as well. Next question. You mentioned you do it with the police station. You you meet with every officer. I meet I the ones that we are promoting. I do sit down and I
Before they were hired. No. Well, well, you're hiring somebody. Yeah. So, before they're hired. Yes. Before I write my letter offering them a offer of employment, I sit down with them. Whether they be a sleo, whether they be a, you know, whether they are um a patrol officer, whether it is a
promotion, I meet with them. Did it as recently as the sergeants that were just I interviewed interviewed sat down with every single candidate. How about EMT? EMT. We don't EMT is not our department. They are a they are an outside agency. They deal with maple shade. They are an
outside agency and I have we do not offer I have no regulation. There is nothing that allows me that or affords me that opportunity to appoint them. Thank you. Thank you. Anybody else from the public? All right. Seeing none,
um I guess we have a motion to close. Anybody? So me. Anybody second? I'll second. All right. All in favor? I. All right. Staff and professional comments. Deputy Mayor Zoranic. We'll start with you. Um I just have a couple
questions. Just a couple questions. I think uh Chief Simon Sik touched on the one question about um where we are at with these emails and letters that were um which ones about
the two um townships pulling out. And Susan, you'll fill us in on that. Yes. So those both were shared with Chief Simon and the last communication that we had is that he would be working on it on his end. Um so and of course that also which led us to where we're that led us to where we are right now. Right. Yes.
Um before I happy Mother's Day to all the mothers that are going to and who it who it applies to. Um I also want to bring up one one more point during the public portion of the meeting and I could be totally wrong but the resident
should be addressing council. Am I right with that Ellen? Yeah. Okay. Thank you. So, in the future, if the residents put would address us rather, then we'll take care of it to Susan and the
solicitor. Um, that's all I have. Go ahead. Me? Sure. I just heard the scream out there. Chief, you're up. Um, well, I've been quiet up until now.
I haven't really made statements when it comes to professional and staff comments. Um, but in my opinion, the that nothing has gotten done in this township since we got here. Now, maybe other people feel differently. I don't
know. However, I don't um I look at the uh the things that we ran on as uh as a group of people. Um, and I just want the people of this township to know that moving forward, I'm going to be bringing them things up. I'm not going to be
sitting around anymore and I'm not going to be taking the abuse that I've been taking uh from this building. So, I just want the people of the township to know that I'm one vote that I'm going to do my best. I'm not going anywhere and I'm
going to deliver on my word with the things that I said that I was going to do for you. Now whether that happens or not, I don't know because I am only one vote, but I'm just letting everybody know. Okay. Is that all? That's it.
Hopefully with the pope being appointed, you know, the US pope, American pope, maybe it'll have us all have some peace in our lives and let's let's get a chance to work together and get this get everything done. That's all I have.
No, ma'am. Susan, no. Ellen, no thanks. All right. The only thing I have is we have two fundraisers tomorrow night. If anyone's looking for something to do on a Friday with Maple Shade Soccers having their annual basket auction and Maple Shade Girls softball has their guest bartending event at the Alden. That's all I have. I hope everyone has a great
Mother's Day. Moving over to old business operations. Thank you. Uh on Monday, the township completed the replacement of a sewer force main pipe at the intersection of Fork Landing and Broadway. During that project, crews identified significant deterioration in nearby storm sewer pipe with damage to
both the top and bottom that is affecting water flow. The area was made safe and temporary plated to maintain roadway stability. A follow-up project will be scheduled to fully address the issue, which will include cleaning the storm pipe, installing a manhole, and running new PVC piping through the existing segment beneath Fork Landing
Road. I'll provide updates obviously as plans and timelines are finalized with the engineers. Um, also, uh, fireworks. There was some question about fireworks. They are scheduled for June 28th this year at the high school. Um, there was an issue or a mistake in our newsletter
which showed that the parade starts at 11:00. It does not. It starts at 12. Um, and that uh will be has been updated on our website as well. Um, today the township had the pleasure of welcoming 20 students from Maple Shade High School for our students and government day. The
students spent the day exploring exploring the various principal, excuse me, the various municipal departments and concluded with a mock council meeting to experience local governance firsthand. Special thanks to all of our departments that participated and especially to Jennifer Nixon, our business and economic development
director, for organizing this meaningful event. Engaging students in municipal government provides meaningful education experiences while also also fostering civic awareness and an interest in public service. Qualities that are essential to the long-term economic stability and sustainable sustainability
of local government. And I would like to take a few minutes to address some recent concerns that have been raised regarding the preparation of our ordinances and resolutions and the role that both myself and the township clerk play in that process. Specifically, it was suggested that we may not be following proper procedure and that we
lack an understanding of municipal operations and more concerningly that I have not told the truth. While I fully support council's right to ask questions and seek clarity, it's important to remember that Maple Shade operates under the Faulner Act, specifically the council manager form of government. Under this structure, the roles of the
governing body and administration are clearly defined by state statute. The council is responsible for setting policy, adopting legislation, and approving the municipal budget. Administrative matters, including the preparation and implementation of ordinances, resolutions, contracts, and day-to-day operations, fall under the
responsibility of the township manager, who serves as the chief executive and administrative officer of the municipality. The township clerk's duties are also defined by statute and include maintaining official records, certifying actions of the governing body, and facil facilitating our public meetings. I do want to be very clear.
Every ordinance and resolution introduced to this governing body has either been prepared by legal counsel, reviewed by legal counsel, or based on a long-standing municipal template that have been previously adopted and affirmed by this township. A practice that is also common across many municipal bodies across the state and
country. Nothing is drafted in a vacuum, nor are our actions taken outside of established legal and administrative protocol. The clerk and I take our responsibilities seriously and we are diligent in ensuring that everything that comes before this council is properly vetted and documented. To suggest that either the clerk or I are
acting outside of our responsibilities or without knowledge of procedure is not only inaccurate, but it risks undermining the very structure that the Faulner Act is designed to protect. If there are specific procedural questions or concerns, I truly welcome an open and respectful discussion so that we can
address them all together. I'm always open to questions and transparency, but I will not allow unfounded accusations to go undressed. We all share the goal of responsible governance. I know I speak for the clerk as well when I say we remain committed to transparency, professionalism, and ensuring that both
the council and the public receive accurate and lawful information and support. If there are procedural concerns, I am respectfully asking for direct and respectful dialogue so that we may work together constructively. However, casting doubt on the professionalism and integrity of the municipal staff without basis is
counterproductive and undermines the trust and collaboration required to serve our community effectively. Thank you. Thank you. Uh police report. Sure. All right. Thank you, mayor. Um I'm going to cover two backto-back incidents
and I'm going to talk about what happened at the football carnival and I'll wrap up with just a brief on our bring your kid to work day. Thank you. All right. But um because they're lengthy, I'm just going to read them just to try to be as as uh expeditious as possible. On Tuesday, April 15th, in the morning hours, patrol officers were
dispatched to the 100 block of Gardinia Drive for a woman being held against her will and in danger due to an armed subject described as her former boyfriend. After verifying fact with the caller on the matter, officers triggered the new attorney general directive on barricaded subjects. while our patrol
officers and detectives secured the area and attempted to make contact at the door. Thankfully, the victim opened the door and officers were able to quickly secure her as the suspect fled to the second floor area. In plain view were edge weapons and lighter fluid. During this time, we began assembling our team,
including Maple Shade Police Standing Uper Command Post, the New Jersey State Police Team Unit, and the Office of Emergency Management, the Berling County Prosecutor's Office, the Maple Shade Fire Department, the Maple Shade First Aid Squad, and as part of the new directive, Legacy Treatment Services of
Burlington County. As we prepared for a potential long and drawn out process, Detective Corporal Jeff Engel and Sergeant Scott Pacheco were able to establish communication with the suspect and began negotiations as he waited for the crisis negot negotiators to arrive.
Due to their extraordinary skill set and ability to speak with folks, they were able to deescalate the situation and convinced the subject to surrender to police. The suspect was already wanted on previous charges out of Maple Shade for terroristic threats threatening to burn the apartment down as well as being
a wanted person out of the state of New York. In this case, the suspect was charged with domestic violence strangulation, assault, criminal restraint, criminal trespassing, and lodged in the county jail. I want to commend Detective Corporal Jeff Engel, Sergeant Scott Pacheco, and Lieutenant Brian Davis, who's our operations
lieutenant, but also our OEM coordinator for their outstanding efforts in this manner for bringing quick resolution to a volatile situation. Everyone on scene commented on the professionalism our team and remarked how well they did in such a stressful and uncertain situation.
Second incident less than two weeks later on Sunday, April 27th, in the evening hours, officers were dispatched to the 700 block of North Fork Laneing Road for a second floor apartment with smoke billowing out. Upon arrival, officers were directed to the second floor unit by the owners who lived on
the first floor, and they knocked loudly on the door. There was no answer. Officers forcefully entered the apartment uh via the front door utilizing an entry tool only to discover that the resident had stacked furniture and other items in front of the door to slow or impede their response. Upon
finally making their way in, officers observed the resident retreat to uh or retreat further into the apartment towards a bedroom area in the rear. The apartment was on fire. When the resident finally turned around, the officers closing the distance on him then realized he was armed with a large
knife. Officers were able to disarm the subject and take him into custody. Our investigation revealed the subject purposely set the unit on fire and was trying to prevent officers from entering the unit to put it out. He was subsequently charged with aggravated arson, aggravated assault and weapons offenses eventually lodged in the county
jail. I want to commend Corporal Mike Master Angelo, Officer Marshall, Wartman King, Okconor, Classen, Detective Alvarez, Officer Buckley, and Sergeant Scott Soprano for their quick action to prevent the home from burning down and for taking an armed subject into custody
without resorting to deadly or significant force. The next incident I'm going to just talk about, the football carnival. On Saturday, May 3rd, around 7 pm, calls started to come in to the PD in reference to a large group of kids in
the area to Wawa on North Fork Laneing Road, causing problems on location, which included various forms of shoplifting, theft, and criminal mischief. The shift immediately believed this was going to be linked to the carnival at Aces Field and began to split up the responding units to cover both locations.
After dispersing the group at Wawwa and positioning an officer there, the group began milling around the area of the carnival, estimated this time to be 50 to 60 teenagers and young adults. Despite other calls coming in uh during a duty shift, officers attempted to
maintain a presence at both Wawa and Asis field for the next two to two and a half hours. The patrol units were able to quell the disturbances as darkness fell and more teenagers and young adults were observed milling around the location. During this time, additional personnel were brought in and the
sergeant on duty requested additional units on location from surrounding towns as well. We call that mutual aid. Despite a warm weather evening where most folks were in shorts and t-shirts, officers began to notice individuals on scene in long sleeve
hooded sweatshirts with their hoods up, long pants, full face uh or head mask known as balaclavas. and many use youth were wearing surgical face masks which was completely inconsistent with the weather that evening. To be clear, this is not a
cultural generational issue, but one in which these individuals are trying to purposely obscure their identity in order to intimidate or commit crime in our community, which was proven factually correct on this night. It's important to note that if this was precoid and you walked into a bank with
a hood up or a mask on, they would immediately be calling 911 in anticipation of a bank robbery. Now, seeing all this, the sergeants positioned officers strategically along Broadway in an effort to disperse this group before anything happened. With nu n n n n n n n n n n n n n n n n n n n n n n n n n n n n n n n n n n n n n n n
nous officers present and ready to respond. A subject fully covered head to toe walked over to another subject in a surgical mass and began fighting as the crowd surged in that direction. Officers rushed in and that forced the crowd to begin to scatter in opposite
directions. An all call was made to central communications uh by our patrol officers requesting them to have duty units respond from both Burlington and Camden County, which they did do. And as additional units began to arrive in an effort to break up the fights taking
place now in the area of North Popppler and Front and dispers the disperse the youth gather there. Some of the individuals were also squaring up against officers attempting to fight them or attempted to help others escape from police contact. At this point, the large groups
had toggled back and forth over the railroad tracks down towards Wawwa, where Camdi County units had took up a position to prevent them from entering the Wawa again, which did shut down for a period of time. One officer specifically told me that too many of these individuals had their phone outs recording instead of
heeding the orders being given by the police in real time. They did not care to listen to direction and simply put, "You cannot arrest everyone at the scene in order to get out of this situation." Eventually, and with numerous police units on location, they were dispersed and several juveniles
were taken into custody, none of which lived in Maple Shade. Through our investigation, we have so far identified individuals from Burlington and Camden counties. They were likely dropped off here, which is why they could not leave right away because they could be living
as far away as 45 to 50 minutes. In similar incidents that happened like this in Penalkin, Collingswood and Gloucester Township, this was also noted to be an incident and a problem where the youth are being transported here and left here and then when an incident
happens, they can't get home. Currently, we are conducting video analysis to identify those individuals involved and we will charge everyone who we can possibly uh that we possibly can in relation to this incident. As you've
heard me say before, there will be accountability and consequences in Maple Shade. Make no mistake, many of these individuals came here specifically to engage in criminal activity, and it's 100% unacceptable. From what we can tell at this point, the original fight may
have been related to a situation that took place in Camden County earlier that evening, and somehow Maple Shade became the new destination. To be clear, we received no intel from the regional operations intelligence center, the state police, the
prosecutor's office, from our our school resource officers around the county, or even our own internal team who do track social media, which leads us to believe the communication loop was likely closed and could have been conducted over encrypted or messaging app with law enforcement is unable to view.
I want to extend my sincere thanks to the men who were working as volunteers at the football carnival who were standing with our officers attempting to deescalate and disperse the individuals from the area. Their support and bravery was much appreciated. Thankfully, no officers were injured and as we saw just
yesterday in Philadelphia breaking up similar situation, an officer was shot in the stomach below his body armor. I want to remind everyone that this carnival is geared towards younger children and families. It is not an event geared towards high school age kids and young adults and is used to
help football fund their activities for the kids in our Maple Shade community. They did nothing wrong and I just want to be clear about that. Lastly, and with the fireworks fast approaching, I have already secured additional personnel from both Bernard County Sheriff's Department and Cine and
PD. similar to what I did last year. We will have a heavy presence on the fireworks grounds as we did last year and there will be no room for this type of activity taking place there. I would also recommend the council considers to start banning backpacks and balaclavas from any future
access controlled events. It's one thing if have something out on an open streets that stretches, it's another for bringing people into a fenced off area where we can control the access points. I fully understand that surgical masks can be a little trickier to address this issue, but they are no doubt being used
by some to obscure their identity to commit crime and not for any legitimate COVID or respiratory related concerns. The last thing I'll just talk about is our bring your kid to work day, which was on Thursday, April 24th. Uh we
hosted about uh 30 children at the station. They went extraordinarily well. Uh, we had a bunch of events that were planned for the kids all throughout the day. I think one of the highlights was making tie-dyed shirts where we had the older kids pair up with the littlest kids. It was nice to kind of form that f
family bond. Uh, we did provide breakfast, lunch, and ice cream at the end of the day for all and the kids said it was the best one that they had yet. And that is my report. Awesome. Thank you. Chief, if I could just ask the ordinance that you're talking, is that the one that we've spoken about before? the one that Ocean I believe it was
Ocean City or one of the the southern shore towns had done. So Ocean City does two things. Um I vacation there every year but they will ban backpacks at 8:00 on the boardwalk. They also close the entrances to the beach and that is done
within the uh proximity of the main busiest areas of the boardwalk. And then they have special law enforcement officer one and twos that are addressing people as soon as 8:00 hits. You'll see them move over, close the beach and they do that. the ballet clavas, if you're not familiar with them, it's like the ninja mask, okay? You're pulling it
over. You know, people want to attribute it to this or that. The reality is is you're you're coming here to commit crime and you're wearing that doing it. It it's to obscure your identity. So, basically the the recommendation then is for these these events that we have, the carnival, I guess, then the fireworks
that we have, anything that we're that we can control, that's what we're looking we would be able to put an ordinance in for that. That's the recommendation from my command staff. We've we've talked about this extensively. I know you and I talked about it last year. Um for the folks who weren't familiar like we've responded to
Pence when that was all happening and it was in the beginning. We got to see the whole thing unfold. Um and we have guys who are specially trained on the civil disturbance team within the county. The management and dynamics of crowds can be very precarious and trying to understand and interpret what's happening is
important. A lot of times you'll see Philly, you know, they're going to just try to control and contain, disperse, and then they're going back to do their investigation. We're applying the same philosophy here. Um, because there's only so much that you can do in the moment. So, my recommendation going forward for council is to consider at
least for the access control type situations, number one, security for next year to try to prevent something like this from happen. But obviously um you know banning backpacks, banning balaclavas, you know the surgical mask is is honestly a tough discussion
because somebody can come up and say they have a respiratory issue and that's why they're wearing it. Um but you know it's it's just ironic that the individuals who are wearing it here that night were doing it purposely to obscure their face. I don't think there was a respiratory issue when they're trying to fight people. So so council we we have
enough meetings if it's something that you want to consider. It's we have, you know, another meeting in May and then our first meeting in June. We should absolutely consider you could consider putting something together. I mean, even if we had to push the adoption to the second meeting in June, we'd still be before the 28th event. Is that something
that you're you would consider and we'll just use it for now. We'll start it with these accent event access amendments. Maybe we just we name what we can if you're for that then I think that we should direct because we already discussed our solicitor to I would definitely be in favor of that. Yes.
Yeah. I'm going to make a motion that we get our solicitor to work with the PD to put an ordinance together so that we can get it done. Yeah, I agree. I think let's let's work on something like that at least even if we just do it for this one event and then if we see that we have to tweak it a little bit, you know,
I think again we spoke about it last year, but now that it's here, Maple Shaden, we did a great job last year at the fireworks. I know, you know, that was something that you and I spoke about for days before, you know, the concern I think, but you know, Lieutenant O'Brien did a great job on the messaging from
our point outward and um you know trying to just restrict the flow of the advertisement on the other side of the equation as a big part of it as well. Yeah. Um I think we were the only game in town that particular night which is why it landed here. Yeah. Um could have landed anywhere but it landed here and
it's always easier to do it a second time around too. So that's the other thing. Absolutely. We can make some operational adjustments to the fireworks um with maybe some additional snow fencing just to get us some access control points that we can staff um and then signage in addition to that that
lets everybody know. And then the messaging going out, you know, if this is approved and we move forward, then we can at least say, you know, if you want to come in, go drop your backpack. If not, you're not allowed in, right? You know, find another event. Yeah. And at worst case, if we can't get the ordinance completed, then at least at
minimum a resolution that says that these events this year, you know, from here until December 31st are going to be that's what we're going to do until if we have to do more research on it. I mean, that's we're not looking to stop mom who's coming in with the diaper bag, right? Or we have grandma, we're pushing a wheelchair and she might not oxygen
bag or we're not doing anything like that. We're just talking about primarily looking at uh the youth and young adults who are coming in. Inside that backpack is probably things that are going to be problematic for us and we want to just keep the public safe and these are the things that we've learned over the years. And let's get your department to
start working and then this way we can get at least something on the books. So there's a motion. Is anyone second it? You second it. I don't think we can do a motion. You don't even need a motion. It's you're authorizing them forward with it. Everybody agrees to do it. All right. Thank you. Moving over site plan. So
site plan was busy this week. There was uh seven seven uh applicants. The first one was uh Kings Highway. The uh U-Haul owners came back in again. That's kind of an ongoing thing uh for development.
Um, but they brought back some of the recommendations from the last meeting with us and there was some more and we recommend that uh they come back one more time to make sure they have everything in order before they would go to uh to the zoning board. Uh the next
one was uh Parks Crossing Apartments. Um they came in with a concept about uh putting units in more apartments and knocking down the fire building. Um and the board kind of looked at it and uh
you know uh basically told them that what they're proposing isn't going to fly in town. So I don't know if they're going to go back and uh you know re redo it, modify it. You know, we'll see how that one goes. The next one was on
Windsor Avenue. The applicant wanted to uh put a uh roof structure up over his uh concrete pad in the front of the house. So, he presented all his information and we recommended that he moved on to the uh zoning board for
approval. Um the next one was the old car wash down on Route 38. um the owners of that now want to open it up and uh and add a few things to it, a few
amenities for the people. Um so again, uh it was suggested they modify their plans, come back one more time before the site board before they would move on. 220 West Main was uh for a gem store
in downtown business, but they didn't show up, so we don't know what the story was with them. 215 West Woodlon was a bulk application to uh to build a garage in an existing spot where the garage was.
So, the board heard uh and looked at all the paperwork for them and it was suggested for them to move on to the uh zone uh zoning board for approval with that one. And the last one was uh down
at uh Brew Littles. Uh there was an applicant that wanted to put a uh hot dog store in there, I guess, kind of like a Maui's down in Wildwood. Um, so there was a lot of things that we went over with her. There's some legalities
that may be involved in it and she was uh going to check them out before she moved forward with anything um because it might not be possible with that. The uh next meeting for uh site is going to be on June 5th
uh at 7 o'clock. Okay, that's it. All right. Thank you. Um, Maple Shade Green Team Sustainable, we don't meet until next Tuesday, so I don't have anything. And moving over to new business, water and sewer fees. Uh, so, well, I have a question under old
business. No, sorry. Sorry. Did the uh appraisal come back yet for the nursing home? So, I reached out to um the appraiser yesterday and asked where the report was and I have not heard back from him. I did give him an email. I saw your email saying that you reached out to him. I did not hear back from So,
they haven't been back. They haven't reached back yet, too. You have a comment on that, Susan, on why he um are they still responsible for cutting their grass? Yep. Okay. So, because it's not been Yeah. cut in a while. Okay. All right. New business, water and sewer
fees. So, if you call, uh we've had a brief conversation about our utilities and specifically water and sewer fees and those that get filled and do not get filled. Um, currently we have uh taxexempt properties that just pay the
minimums uh the basic minimums and then we have some tax exempt properties that pay only minimums and no excess. So if they're using anything over um and that would be basically our nonprofits and our churches that do that. One of the other uh conversations that we had was
the school district and the school district also does not pay uh for water and sewer utility fees. So, I had asked the tax and utility department to put together something um and basically we based it on their meter size, which they have 3-in meters and 2 in for one 4 inch
meter. Um and they're based on 5,000 gallon minimums and is what we would be looking at. The total consumption in 2024 for all of the schools was just under 6 million gallons at
5,948,900 gallons. Um, if we were to collect a minimum from them based on 5,000 gallons of sewer and 5,000 gallons of water, we're looking at about $16,600 a quarter in fees. We wouldn't
charge them any excess. Um, it would obviously help our utility department. Now, I do understand that there are, you know, things that go along with that. Right now, the school doesn't charge us for facility usage fees. There are other agreements that we have, you know, when their staff is there um and the township
needs them, those things are reciprocated. So, that has been but there is certainly a deficit in the utility department and that's why I'm bringing this up and I'm not suggesting that we you know charge for actual usage. Um there is a question that I
have into um the tax office because Yokum school is showing that they use over three and a half million they used over three and a half million gallons in consumption in 2024 and in 2023 they were just under 3 million. It
something's not right there. That's that it's less than the high school. So we are looking at that that there's a possibility that there could be a leak there that maybe no one is aware of. And if that's the case, then it could drastically reduce the gallons that they are using. Um, but it is something that I believe the council should consider is
some sort of um payment towards our water and sewer. Again, it's, you know, it's a it's a userbased utility. So, uh, other townships, I'm aware, they do charge their schools that that minimum. They do. So, I reached out to the municipal managers association
and specifically asked the question of what towns um charged all of their nonprofits, how they charge them and their school districts. And I received close to 70 responses across the state that all said that they charge. There were only two that said that they don't. They charge the minimum or they charge
full. They charge minimum. They charge a minimum flat rate is what they do. So, in charging the school, it's not getting us anywhere. It's just moving money around because if the schools budget goes up then the taxes go up for their side of it. So the schools and the
churches are a part of our community and this is my opinion only. But it's for everyone to use and anybody is able to use that. The schools are just a part of doing business in my mind. But if we go charging the schools for water and
sewer, which is technically, in my opinion, the responsibility of the township to maintain those things for our kids to be educated, then we're just charging the money to them. They're charging the money to the taxpayers. We're not getting any more money. We're
we're we're still the taxes are still going up one way or another. And for me, that school is our responsibility. And the water that they use in the school, it's just a part of us doing business. You you you live in a house, you pay
taxes, your kid goes there. You know, it it that's just moving money around. That's that's just that's just senseless to me at this point in time. We're not gaining any revenue when we're making them pay it on the back end. So that that's ridiculous
to me that we would even contemplate doing it, but that's my opinion. Is is are the schools being metered right now? They are metered. Yes. Okay. Yes, they are metered. That's why that's how we knew when we looked at Yokum school and it was like how did they use that much and the high school did not. And that
might sound like a large number, but if you look at the number of the all the houses and all the water use, it's probably proportionally Yeah. So the proportionally fine. So just to let you know, the high school used 869,600 gallons between the high school
and the board of ed. Steinhower school used 966,300 gallons in 2024 and then Mald Wilkins used 548,200 gallons. The sizes of schools are different. The amount of people is different and Yokum is all the little
kids. They probably walk in, turn the faucet on and walk out and leave it on. Maybe we put a faucet in it turns the water off and we save water or there is a problem underground, right? And that's why but this is common sense stuff to me. You know, it's educational.
Well, would also make the uh schools look into it a little further uh to make some changes so sustainable sustainably. They you know we could stop wasting water because you know not for nothing. Wasn't that a part of the pilot program that you're working with Heather with
this the high school? Maybe they can educate the other schools and and work on that. Yeah. So, I have spoken with um I spoke with Mike Blake today and I did give to him my concerns about Yokum School. So, they're going to look into it, too. I just wanted to bring it to everybody's attention. It could just be an ongoing conversation. Maybe once we
know what Yokum School is doing and what's happening there, um you know, we can but I wanted to bring it to everybody attent everybody's attention. Again, it is a user- based um you know, it it's being used. It does affect our bottom line here. I understand Councilman Simon Sex's point that it was
it's just moving money around. Um but again it does affect our budget here and our ability to you know maintain our utility and the taxpayers are paying for it one way or another. If we're eating that money and we have to raise the taxes then we're raising the taxes. If the school district gets charged the
money they have to raise the taxes. So somebody's paying for it and it's the taxpayer. So why are we getting moving the money around? It just creates more work for us and it's been that way since the schools have been put in. And again, that's my opinion, but I think common sense wise it tells us we
need to make sure Johnny doesn't flush the toilet 10 times when he goes into the bathroom. Done. Okay. I thought you were saying something. I was Yeah, I just just want to point out that I I do agree with Mr.
Simons on that, but just point of, you know, the schools charge some of the local organizations to use their facilities. All right. Well, then maybe we go to the schools and say, "Listen, I'm just pointing that out to you, Mr. It's a conversation with the school district then. Let's get them in here.
We all have to work together for a common cause." Exactly. Is what I'm trying to say is we all work together monitoring the water and working together as a team. And just for the record, the school district, we own that, too. The township owns the schools in the district. No matter what anyone
says, the taxes are paid for it. They might think they own the schools, but the taxpayers own the schools. I'm going to I'm going to say that's a disagreement there. But this the state's got a lot of say and that's a whole another issue. But the schools are still maintained and taken care of by our
taxes. I just it just accountability is what I think is trying to get get to the point of. Okay. All right. So that's all I have to say. The next thing under new business would be public. what happened in public with the officer appointments. Yes.
Anybody have comments? I have a question. Um I agree with Chief Simon sick that things need to be done sooner rather than later, but he asked the question that I don't think we have the ability to
appoint Sus and Ellen. Do we have that ability? I mean legally to speed up this process. It's an appointment process. Am I correct? Appointment process and I'm just asking for the the opportunity to sit down with the recommendated. But my question is I don't know that we we can
do that. It is under the current ordinance is the township manager's appointment and then I bring it just as I did with the fire chief tonight. Then I would bring it to you on a resolution and it would get approved under um the consent agenda. Can this be expedited to the week like within the week?
Yeah. If I could Yeah. Similarly like what I did with Chief Simonsek sat down with him spoke with him we discussed everything and I appointed him as of May 1st and then he or May 2nd and then he's he started. So that would be similar to this process for a week before the resolution was passed. Yes. Can I ask
the chief to come back up please? That's council's decision. Yep. Sure. Yeah. Chief, I agree with you 100% that you need to you need the staff sooner rather than later. Yes. But my question, which I I think I got the answer, is I don't know that council has that ability to
appoint your staff. But hear me out. Yeah. Um if Susan can be begin uh excuse me, begin these interviewing processes tomorrow, Monday, within a week, is that satisfactory? If we can have these positions filled within a
week? Yes, I agree with that. The the main point of it was that I gave a recommendation that, you know, it happened that way. I understand that she wanted to have an interview process and open it up for anyone to apply for, but at the end of the day, I I did the leg work within the firehouse already. Spoke
with everyone that is eligible to do those positions, right? And only one of each position said yes to it. So, the interview process to me was a mute point. Not only a mute point, but it was just a waste of time. it was going to go nowhere because the same people that I
had already spoken to were going to apply and then we were going to drag it out and I didn't want it to be drugged out longer and longer. The interview process to me was pointless because it hasn't happened anyways. So my thing coming here tonight to speak with you guys is to urge the fact of appointment just have her appoint these positions
and whether the resolution is is done or not like me I was appointed a week ago. The resolution was tonight. I've been acting chief since a week ago, but my resolution was tonight. The resolution doesn't have to be before the appointment. Well, we all agreed. We all
agreed to that, right? But my we all agreed to that. So then, yeah, that's all the only reason I came here was to get the council's blessing that the interview process does not need to happen, that the appointments can be made and the resolution be passed at a later date and move this process along fast. Right? You know, that's the only
reason I came here. I was tired of going back and forth with email and it seemed like it was getting nowhere and my point wasn't being, you know, given wasn't coming across. My my my point and my questioning here is if the applicants can meet with Susan Friday, Monday, Tuesday, the appointment can be made at
the next meeting, we can approve the resolution. Absolutely. And you're okay with that? Yes. I just didn't want an interview process to drag out because in the the letter that was sent to me to be posted for the job, the date of May 30th was the end date for that, which means it could technically drag out to that
date. Yes, I understand that someone could be hired sooner. That was the the latest possible point, but to me, May 30th was too late. It wasn't soon enough. I agree. Um, it needs to be done sooner than that. And that's all I wanted from Susan was to push that date up. I I recommended Friday the 16th to
move that date to. I I had said that in the emails. that's in the packet you have to move it up to the 16th for the interview process to stop. I was fine with that and I believe I did state this afternoon that I would meet with someone early next week and that that date is just that's when the credentials would have to be in by that if we wanted to
appoint before then that we certainly would appoint but that the earliest resolution date would have been the next meeting in in in my opinion May 30th was the farthest point out so it could have drug out till May 30th is is my point there was no there was no guarantee that that would happen next week it was the
date of May 30th was the the the signed date on that on that posting and I didn't want it to be May 30th and for us to drag out for a month. That was my point and that that date was non-negotiable to change when I offered it for the 16th. So, council, I am saying and I am stating here on the record that I am willing to meet early
next week with the candidate that Chief Simon sec is saying. I cannot meet tomorrow. As you know, I had a death in my family and tomorrow the services. I will be willing to work Monday, Tuesday. I know that it has to go around the candidates's information, but as promised in my email earlier this afternoon, I will meet early next week
with the candidates. And again, in this pamphlet that I gave you, I did agree to the interview process originally as long as that date of the 30th was moved up to the 16th, but there was no no negotiation in that date for it to be moved up. And that's why I came here tonight and I had an issue with the interview process at that point because
it hasn't been followed that way since. So, all these points needed to be brought to your attention for this to move through apparently. I appreciate that. Um, you stated that you met with a few people and they didn't want to How many? There was three for the deputy chief's position and two for the
captain's position. A mix of uh IFC original guys that were there as well as new guys that came in from outside departments that had the credentials to do it. There's a lot of young guys in that department right now that were hired and none of them have the actual credentials to be officers unfortunately. So, it's a very slim
pickings when it comes to that officer line. Okay. And do you plan on posting the what you're supposed to post tomorrow? I I do not want to post it for that date of May 30th to be honest with you because I do not feel it's right to drag it on for that long. If that date is changed to the 16th, I will post it.
But it seems like we just got around the whole interview issue alto together and that that doesn't need to be posted. That if the recommendation that I gave Miss Dansen is sent up here next week that it seems like as long as she has that meeting, an interview and a resume is not needed and that we can move forward with it.
I think we should give Miss Dansson the courtesy of the of meeting these people before the appointment is. And if you're okay with that, I think the date can be moved up. Okay. But I mean, I'm just speaking as I'm saying is the post is for the job for the job position itself. The posting that she sent to me to be set up in the firehouse and sent out to
the members. If we can avoid that altogether and I send up the the recommendation that I had for her to meet with, if it doesn't go well, then put the posting up. I mean, I don't see it not going well and there's no other viable options within the fire department that want to do it. We also need to remember that this is a civil
this could eventually be a civil service position, a volunteer position as of right now. Though, you're you're correct. But if it does change at some point to a civil service position, I will need to prove to civil service that we did some sort of formal posting. So, if council chooses, has to be a formal posting. I have to have a formal
posting. If council wishes for me to change the date to May 16th, I will honor those wishes and I will change it. That is one week. I just want to be very clear that that is one week from from just as a question. I'm not I have never posted anything for one week. May 30th again is is the end of the month. It's
quicker. It's if I were to post this on and I'm just hypothetically speaking. If I were to post this on the League of Municipalities, it stays up for 33 days. Um we're not talking about the league. Can I ask a few questions before we go any further? Real quick, I just had one
question for Miss Anson. where I I might not have seen it, but was there a posting for the chief's position that I did not see? Because Dan never posted anything in the firehouse for us to see. There was not. That was a discussion that was had between council members and I and Okay. Correct. Okay. So, you see what I'm saying here? So, there's
options outside. Can I please finish? It was between council and I and then it went to labor counsel. And with my discussion with labor council, labor council recommended because the appointment came from the judge that that appointment should be made that way
directly to the next qualifying officer. Okay. So, it's going to end. That was a little hairy because of the judge appointment. That's there's been options every every which way. There's not just there's not a definite line with anything and there's options all the way around to make this move faster. and we're just
looking for future procedures and just how we're going to go forward with this. I understand that's a very sticky situation with our department right now. We do have to consider labor council right Susan is May 30th an expiration date that was just the that was the end date that we would accept credentials for that position up it's I'm sure
there's some kind of as I had stated to chief sim that if we found a candidate prior to that the appointment could make but could be made prior to that to that appointment to that end date. So, what I'm hearing, correct me if I'm wrong, that you spoke with everyone, the mix,
and there's really just the two people that you're recommending, are they former? They they have officer experience formerly in our department as well as other So, the credentials, if I'm thinking who they are, these people have
been in the organization for 40 plus years and 15 years that courtesy. So the credentials are there. Everything for these two individuals is completely solidified for them to operate as the deputy chief and captain within our fire department. There's no
if ends or buts whether they are qualified through the state of New Jersey to do these job positions. No, there's there's no question about that. They are absolutely qualified. And right now there's two officers for the span of control for everything up there. Correct. So that's way under what
we need. I'm operating at a fire scene by myself for the most part. So, yes. Okay. It's it's an unsafe environment for for all firefighters within our town to be honest with you. A structure fire went out tonight. Yes, there will be outside chiefs coming, but we have no inner command within this town right now. Lieutenant Miller is not a command
structure. He's an interior command or an interior operations guy. He does not run command as a lieutenant. So, I am by myself 100%. So the the people that you're asking to apply or you want to appoint, they're not helping at all because they're currently firefighters. I would never put them in a situation like that to put
them in a leadership role when they're not appointed. That is a mess of legal trouble that you could run into with the state if you were operating as something that you are not in the fire service. So no, I would never recommend them to do that. Um I'm sorry. You said that I thought you said there was four people
that were qualified that you were recommending qualified people. Yes. when I sat down with them because of family matters or personal reasons they were not willing to accept an officer position right now. All right. So you you said two people multiple people two two people accepted individual roles. I misunderstood what you said. One
accepted each individual role, right? I misunderstood what you said. I Yeah. At one point I thought you said there was four but four total that I have talked to overall. Two two did not accept the correct. Yeah. They would not apply for the role. Yeah. If it was if it was offered they would not apply. Yes. So I
and I'm speaking as an individual. I would just recommend or like you to give Miss Dansen the courtesy of the interview. I mean I think we owe her that because since she's the one that's going to appoint the person, we can expedite this very quickly. That's fine. I think that was already agreed upon.
The only thing that's up in the air is the the fact that he's whether he's posting the position or not. If it's going to be an interview process and we post it just to post it for for other reasons, fine. I'm fine with that. As long as we can agree tonight that in the beginning of next week that is done at whatever his con his their their
convenient schedules are. It may be nighttime. It may be you know I don't know what their schedules are as of right now but if we can do that and appoint them as of next week I'm perfectly fine with posting that this evening in the firehouse and dispersing it to the membership but I don't want to lock ourselves into something where we're
going to drag this out for a month. Unfortunately 100% we shouldn't drag it out. We should make the appointments as soon as possible. Yes. I understand danced. Yeah. Okay. I agree. I agree that I will post it, but I you know I just want clarification that this process will not
drag on and we'll move along. Yep. That's all. Okay. Thank you. Okay. Thank you. At the next meeting also, I'm going to have a statement of the fire departments and history of things to protect this township. Okay.
So, anything else under new business? Yes, I have several things. Um when we ran we discussed a lot of things but tonight I'm bringing up the uh ordinance of uh that if you're going to be a township manager that you have to reside in town
and change the ordinance back to what it was. Um I'm bringing it up tonight and uh at the next meeting I'm going to be making a motion about it. The other one is the clerk appointment by the township
council uh and not the township manager. So just for clarifications, the the role of council is to make sure that the township manager uh does their job. The role of clerk is
basically our secretary. And to me that the township manager uh township manager has a secretary plain and simple, but the the uh clerk was always appointed by the township
council. And for me, I would rather appoint a township clerk working with us because that person is supposed to take the notes and work with us and make sure that everything is getting done. And to me, there's a conflict of uh loyalty
when you get right down to it. So, I'm going to make a motion that we make the ordinance and go back to that. And I'm also bringing up the rec board tonight. The rec board is something that we need. We have a recreational director and god knows what she even does. I think we
need to get her in here and and have her tell us what she's done for for the the year so far. She doesn't apparently work with the sports organizations. Um, and I just feel if we're going to be paying this money for
something like that that she needs to get involved and we need to get our money's worth out of her position. And uh lastly um there was some emails going back and
forth and I'm going to make some clarifications now um in regards to uh the ordinance and the question that I asked at the last meeting. The question was posed who did the ordinances and the statement by the township manager was
that Ellen did all of them. Well, come to find out, Ellen did not do all of them. And the there was a email saying here and the township manager said that she only had done one, not all of them. And it was before the time that she was
appointed. So the question that I originally asked has not still not been answered. Who did the ordinances? Was it you? Was it Tyrie? Was it another lawyer? It's a simple question. I want to know who did those other three
ordinances. The salary ordinance is a pre-te the template that we have used here in the township. It was who reviewed them because we didn't have we we didn't we did not have a solicitor at that time. So what you're talking about the salary ordinance it's 202501 202504
both predate Miss McDall. Number 202503 was drafted in its entirety by Miss McDow and then 20252 was an amended ordinance that was written by our previous township counselor. So why didn't you say that when I asked it? Cuz you your statement was that she did them
all and then you blasted me in an email saying that no, she didn't do them all and then gave me an explanation. So that that question is answered then. So, uh, so there was some misdirection on your
part as far as I'm concerned, and again, this is my opinion. I don't know what the other council members feel about that. Um, and the other thing, too, is I'm going to say this, and I don't mean anything against the other towns. You know, you keep saying that it's a
standard practice and this and that. I don't I don't really care about what other towns do. I care about what this town does and my job is to make sure that it's protected the liability issues and unfortunately that job means that I
question you and I I get answers. That's my job. That's what I was elected by the people to do. So the the the inference that you just do it because it's just general business is all fine maybe to you and other townships, but it's not to
me in this township. There's a liability issue. She is our solicitor. She is a lawyer. All right? And no one else in this building is. We hired her for a reason. And I believe there's some things that the contract about doing
those things that I can either read or you can read off uh about, you know, the duties. I I want this township covered. And my personal opinion is we we need the solicitor to be doing this work. And come to find out, I think this statement
will clarify that in contracts. That's that's the ordinance. The attorney shall be the legal adviser to the council manager, department, and other m municipal agencies. Uh except otherwise may be provided by
the law chapters. He or she shall it's cross prosecute and defend actions proceedings by and against the township department officers agencies thereof and inference of these powers and without
limitations of drafts or reviews and approvals as to form and sufficient all legal documents, contracts, deeds, bonds, ordinances uh substained resolutions made executive or or adopted
by or on behalf of the township is to be done by her. That that is the ordinance. So your your persistence in saying that you will do them, I I just don't agree with it. Again, that's my opinion. I don't I don't know what the other
council members want to do. Uh but that's my opinion. Um, and turning to the next point that you're, you know, accusing me of being in cahoots with our solicitor. Just for the record, so that you know, that was
originally his idea that I supported, not mine. So, you you're you're talking about me sending facts out that aren't proper, and you're doing the same thing that I'm doing at the end of the day. You're making assumptions, whatever. But all these things when I read them and
started diving into them are just not factual. Now the next thing is the uh the bill for Merchantville overhead and door. So on this bill it says Maple Shade Fire Department and just for the
history those doors were purchased by Maple Shade Township. They've been maintained for the last 40 years maybe longer than I know of. And every set of doors since I've been there have been bought maintenance and done by the
township. All right. So I don't know it you know it to me it's just a game that you're just wanting you know you're pushing it on IFC independent. Independent has never paid for that. You know Dan Carr gets involved in it with the uh you know blaming uh you know that
the paper wasn't paperwork wasn't taken up. The reason that Merchantville was called in the first place is because the doors wouldn't open. It was an emergency. It was under the threshold. And while they were there, because they were new doors, they were told to
service them so that we didn't have the same problem with the other doors. This bill is due to Merchantville and it's to be paid by the township, not IFC. And I know Ben sent a email, but Ben is just
the president of IFC. And because of the breakdown and all the nonsense that's been going on with the fire department in township, that slipped through the cracks. It probably did. I'm not going to argue that point. But Dan making the decision that it's not getting paid in the email that I saw is not his call.
And there's two simple solutions to this. And it's done all the time. You call up Merchant Bill head overdoor and you say, "Could you rebuild that with this current date?" And then the date's done. Or you can just pay the bill with a note on it so that if the state comes
down here or what whoever wants to look at it, it's a legitimate bill. It was incurred by this township and it needs to be paid because I'm telling you right now, if this bill doesn't get paid, I'm going to suggest a Merchantville overhead door for them to file a lawsuit to get their money. This money has been
due to them for a long time. That was an emergency thing that needed to be done. I don't think the township would really appreciate us telling them that, hey, we can't get the fire truck out the door, so we're not coming to the call. This is all a charade and games. This bill needs
to be paid. I don't care about the history of it. It says it was a year old. It says Maple Shade Fire Department. It doesn't say independent. It was from October of 201. I don't care. I just gave you the two solutions. I just gave you the two
solutions. If council wishes for me to pay the bill and you authorize the payment, then I will ask I will ask the finance department to pay it as you are all over aware because you all got a copy of it. The bill was presented in October of 2024 for from a charge from
October of 2023. We immediately paid the August 24 bill, but there were apparently seven past due notices that were sent to the IFC's at 53 South Maple that were never brought up to the township of Maple Shade here to pay for the finance department. That is why I said to Dan Kerr when we spoke about it
that we would not pay it that it is an IFC response and he got back to at the time President Callahan. So I'm not going to I'm not going to argue let you talk. Can you just hear just hear council would like so we can make a decision. If council would like to have the bill paid I just need to let
you ask have me have me authorize it to pay it and I will ask finance department to pay it. and why we're authorizing it. There is a bill again to the Maple Shade Fire Department and all the documentation was here that they didn't pay I think it was 42 or 43 cents that
has still been owed to them because the check that was cut and that information and everything on that was correct when it was sent up here. It's been going on probably about the 43 cents. But how much was it though? Well, $842 I think is the one from October of
23 if I'm correct. And this work was done. We know it was well done in 23. It was done in 23. I don't know because it was it never came up here. We got it when this we got it back in September or October of 24 with the seven late notices. It was dropped off here. Heather, she Heather, you
asked a question. That's the bill right there. The other point being is that these this the NAPA account has interest charges, finance charges for month after month after month that kept making the bill go
up. I mean, to me, I don't know why the bills aren't getting paid. And the amount the amount that was in here, the current amount and the amount on the invoice and the request is all the right amount, but whoever wrote the check out of the township didn't put that money in
there. And if bill keeps getting done or sent to to to independent, I don't know what you're talking about as far as the Napa bill. So, if you send that to me or send it over, I will You can have this right here. So, I I have two different bills here.
One is for $858 and the 1954 is that the one we paid and I don't have anything. It was it was the only email that I had sent. I'd have to see them again because I don't have it right in front of me. I don't have that. Um my suggestion would be to call Merchantville Overhead Door and straighten it out with them and get
the amount that's owed to them and get a check cut to them and get it sent to them. Here's the next They won't Oh, the other thing is to the safety strip. They're not going to come out and do work at the firehouse right now because they're owed the money and they want their money. There's a safety strip in that in that door that doesn't work. And
any person that's walking down the street, whatever that, you know, we're going to be liable for that. The fireman could get hurt, you know, God knows. But the the safety strip needs to be fixed on it. All right. So, the knack one looks like
it was sent to Jessica in 2023. Yeah. I I don't know. I would have to. Yeah, that's pass that along. Thank you, Andrew. What's the one for 19547 that was due January 4th? Is that one not
paid? That might have been when the door wouldn't go up. Uh, you know, has that? And I'm going to be honest, I think that I was still the chief at that time. The door wouldn't work. There was no communication. And I just called him. I said, "Fix the door. The door won't go up. It's an emergency expenditure.
There's no there's no going out to bid. It's under the threshold. It's just another way to push money off on IFC. Has that one not been paid or has it been paid? Honestly, I don't know because they they paid all the bills for the doors across the street. I'm just trying to You're bringing something up and I'm we're trying to make a decision
and I just need an answer. So the my my suggestion was for her to call Merchantville, get the cost and and go from there. Can you look at this and see what do you remember what's owed? No. I can explain the Napa bill at length though if you
look Napa bill is not not really it's that's not an issue that was sent to finance. So that should have been that was sent that was sent up a few months ago. Whatever. Yeah, that's that's fine. It's just this one for almost $2,000 that wasn't paid from 20. This is from
2024. It says that's why I'm asking because it says December 24. the one from 23. This one. Okay. Pass through and then that goes here's the detail because Susan just said we paid
one. We paid one from August of 2014. We paid the merchant. I forget how much. Yeah, that's the detail of that one. Oh, I'm not sure. So that's the bill that to be honest with you. I don't know when these dates were, but
what was the date? October of 23. That's what did that one say? There's a possibility that the IFC wasn't even in service at that point. I'm not sure what the dates of shutdown were, but there's a Benjamin's name is on those sheets because he was the president of the IFC at that time. Okay. And when they send it out in the beginning of the year,
they update the name on the account or whatever, whoever the latest president is. There's a possibility that Ben wasn't even the one that called those in. If we weren't in service, it would have been Joe, Dan, anyone from the township, the road department guys that were in there. I don't know. So, I'm not sure what those dates were or when we
were shut down, but it's a possibility that wasn't even anyone from the IFC that called them to have that work done, which would explain why the the stuff never got paid, I guess, because there was never a PO for it. Okay. So, we're not going to pay a bill that we have no idea about. Right. That's I'm moving on from that one. This
one um was October of 23. I think it should be paid. If we did it, I get it. It's past due. Um it's $858.82. I don't know how everybody feels about that one. This one, I mean, they needed it. They needed it fixed. We fixed it. How do you guys feel? I paid a bill if
we had it done. Worked done. Yeah. You want to see that one, Sandy? 108. Yeah. Authorizes it. Yeah. Like I said that the argument was is that there were seven when we got that bill there were seven passing notices with it that were included with it when it came up here
that negotiated with them the situation. We'll call Merchant Door. We'll call Merchant Door. They they Merchant Build Door has done other work for us here in the municipality since we do have it, but I'll take this one as well. Link negotiation. Susan has these
copies. She can have them on. It doesn't matter. She said she has. She has. What else did you have, Andrew? And lastly, um, for you to imply that I need to apologize to you when I'm doing my job
and basically threaten me in an email saying that you're going to call the state on me. Um, it's just it it's to me that's ridiculous. My job is to make sure you do your job. And again, if you don't like that, there's the door. But
at the end of No, at the end of the day, Susan, I'm done playing games. Everybody might think that, you know, this is all, you know, peaches and cream up here, but I know different. I was put here by the people of this town, and I'm going to start doing what I said I was going to
do. And at the end of the day, the council is responsible for running this town to give you the marching orders that we would like to have done. That's how it works. and all the things that you're saying in here, it's the other way around. Basically, you threatened
me. That's the way I see it. And I'm not apologizing for doing my job. At the end of the day, I think you need to apologize to the people of this town for the things that you keep doing and the games you keep playing. That's my opinion and I'm entitled to it. So, I
I'm airing this out. I'm not going to take this abuse anymore. I'm not going to take emails like this. I'm not going to hear that. I can't have something. You said at the last meeting that I can't see the reports for the building. Those buildings, everything in this town is public. I can come up here and get
inspection reports from somebody that built a house 30 years ago. It's all public knowledge. And for you to tell me that I can't see something is like the president being elected and him being told he can't look at something. I'm done playing the games. Everybody's been
put on those. Anything else? All right. Resolution number 2025-R102, which is a resolution to meet in executive session for the following matters relating to litigation independent. I'm sorry. Am I supposed to read this or you? I'm okay.
Go ahead. Uh we need to meet in executive session to discuss matters relating to litigation uh pertaining to IFC versus shade and relating to the employment relationship uh with township solicitor. That being
Okay. So, before we go into session, I'm going to make a statement. I'm going in for the first part of it, but as a courtesy, I'm walking out for the fire department thing, but I'm putting it on record right now. There is no absolutely
no conflict of interest. None. So, we have a motion to close. Anybody? So, I don't want to go into close. I have enough. This is I've had enough.
I will second it. Is there a second? All in favor? Do we have a second? Yeah, John. Second.