ends in 2 minutes. Please take your seats. Again, the schoolboard work session begins in 2 minutes. The schoolboard work session begins in 1 minute. Please take your seats. Again, the schoolboard work session begins in 1
minute. [Music]
Good morning. I now call the October 20 October 2nd, 2025 administrative briefing and work session of the Marian County School Board to order at 9:00 a.m. Please silence your electronic devices to avoid disturbing others. mirroring and modeling how our students begin each day. I ask that you please
pause with us for a moment of silence. Thank you. I will now read our board commitment statement. We are the Marian County School District Leadership Team. When we come together to work, we are efficient, effective, and productive. Our three most important
characteristics are dedicated, transparent, and individually responsible. To work well together, we must demonstrate respect, confront reality, and be accountable. We will always put students first. We will leave a legacy of success. At this time, I'd
like to ask Attorney Powers to explain the rules for the public workshop. Good morning, Attorney Powers. >> Good morning, Madam Chair. This work session is a public meeting as defined in Florida's Sunshine Law. The board is dedicated to full transparency in its meetings and its work. The board um in
compliance with the Sunshine Law, the board has adopted uniform meeting procedures, including the right for citizens to participate. The board will allow public comment regarding any work session item listed on today's agenda at the appropriate time. Speakers must fill
out a request form located in the lobby and hand it to the board clerk. After the board and superintendent have completed their discussion on a particular agenda item, the board clerk will call the speaker's name in the order received. Each speaker will have three minutes. As required by the
Sunshine Law, the board must maintain orderly conduct and proper decorum throughout this meeting. So speakers may criticize subject matter and decisions in a respectful manner. Finally, speakers must be very careful not to violate the privacy rights of others, especially students and their family
members by mentioning their names or other identifying information. Thank you for your attention to these important rules. >> Thank you, Attorney Powers. Good morning, Miss Martinez Young. Can you please provide the proof of publication? The notice for the October 2nd, 2025
work session was published in the Ocala Gazette on September 19th, 2025. Proof of publication has been attached to board docs under proof of publication. Thank you board. At this time, we'll move into item 4.1 uh the superintendent search. I would like like to invite Mr.
Adams with HYA Associates uh to the podium to begin a presentation. Thank you, Madam Chair, and uh members of the school board. Uh I'm Bill Adams, uh vice president with Hazard Young and it hya uh the search firm uh that will
be working with you uh to assist with the selection of the successor superintendent. I'm going >> Hold on just one moment. We need to check your audio. Can Can you move the uh the >> There we go. >> And they know about it. They're trying to fix it.
>> There we go. audio. Okay, now >> give me just about 30 seconds here. I'll get a thumbs up from the booth to >> Okay, there was I was Did you see me concentrating? >> Just to the degree you can make sure that angle that's angled directly at your mouth. >> That might help.
>> I think it's >> okay. >> Okay, let's try that. >> I'll try it again. I'm uh I'm Bill Adams, vice president. [Music] >> We're not going to be able to hear anything today. We can't hear each other. So >> understood. Okay, please continue.
>> Okay, thank you. >> Uh we're looking forward to working with you and uh we're excited and honored that uh our firm was selected to to assist with the uh successor superintendent search. We have uh and I I I I have to introduce uh and it's
important that I introduce senior associate Stacy Adams. Uh Stacy Adams uh is uh a member of our team. will also be joined by uh Dr. Monica Brown. We have about 130 associates uh nationwide. Uh
the two of us uh are will be the Florida specific contact. We came up from Kyer uh last night and um uh by full truth and and uh information uh Stacy Adams uh is also Mrs. Adams. Uh we are husband
and wife. So um that's full disclosure at this point. Uh by way of uh background uh I was a New Jersey superintendent for uh 36 years and have been uh involved in the search work uh since 2006 while uh still uh seated as a
superintendent and with Hazard Young and AIA since 2014. Uh Stacy also joined a firm around 2014. She comes from the uh private sector of public education and has an MBA uh in in terms of her
background. Uh we've done as a firm uh over 35 plus years about 2,000 uh executive leadership searches in education. Uh this particular team has done work in uh
Bvard um Broward u Ker twice 11 years apart. Um and um uh we've also uh done work in uh Indian River uh and uh Deval County uh o over the years. So we're
very familiar uh with not only Florida uh uh having uh actually uh resided here since 2008 uh but uh also with the requirements and some of the challenges in terms of uh recruitment. Um this morning we'd like
to cover 15 items. And uh it sounds daunting. It's not. You've had you have copies of the agenda. And uh I'm going to follow that agenda right now. And there's two or three items where we need to really just focus and uh uh get some
uh direction from you, the board, so we can begin immediately uh the search process. So as we look at the uh board agenda the agenda itself uh we've we've already been able to uh establish our our direct
board leaison will be uh our the president uh Mrs. Conrad uh will be working uh certainly with uh Alina Martinez Young uh the executive assistant to the board and uh what Watisha uh Morant uh will probably be
our primary contacts uh uh you know throughout the process. you have our contact information on the agenda in terms of the um email addresses and we'll assure you uh that all of you have our cell phone numbers so that you can
uh reach out to us at any time during the process although most of the contact will go through the board chair. So that's really our initial uh opening part. Uh we will be talking about community engagement and Stacy's specifically going to be talking about
that. But would you like me to review the uh search process uh in the four stages uh before we begin that part of it? >> The the four stages of I'm sorry >> search process. >> The four stages of the search process >> like an overview.
>> Yes. Sure. That's sure. I I shared with you before we started, so I'm going to have a hard time today without um >> I'm having >> all of all of the all of the audio. I'm I'm going to really struggle today. So, yes, please do a brief overview. >> Can we take a recess if if we feel like there's a solution? Can we take a
recess, >> Mr. >> Or is it not going to get in? >> We're working on it, but I can't tell you what the problem is at the moment. >> Let's take five. >> Everything is set as it normally is, and these are actually working. They're just exceptionally low. >> Okay.
>> But we're working on >> I would agree. I would prefer we take a brief recess. See if we can't get this audio worked out so we can better hear your presentation. Board, with that, we're going to take a recess at 9:09 a.m. be back with you briefly
>> and I I think maybe even for him to repeat what he already shared. >> Do we have an alternative? >> Don't turn Don't do anything. >> No. Do we have an alternative to these speakers? Is there like >> a backup? That's these speakers are on. There's audio coming but it's exceptionally low. I would
>> Are you all able to hear me? Fine. >> No, it's >> okay. No, >> I was going to say that if it >> testing check that's already better. >> If need be, we could we could place him at my spot and >> but the but the community still cannot
hear. And that's what we want to make sure that the audio is clear for the community. Is it not on YouTube right now? Okay. Yeah, that's an issue. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Mine's loud, right? Mine sounds loud right now.
>> It's gotten better. Yeah. Than it was >> like Charlie Brown. >> I just know too it's much better. >> Mine's better. >> I just know that if I can't hear then like Lori, there's no way. >> Hey, can you have him to say something? >> Lori, will you speak into that mic?
[Music] Lori, did >> you hear that? >> Can you hear me? Oh, >> now we're back. >> That's a lot better. >> Have Have him speak into it there as well. >> Okay. >> Will you speaking? >> Uh, testing. Is the audio okay now?
>> It's better. >> It's better. It's It's It's louder yet muffled, but it's better. >> Testing. One, two, three. >> I understand. I'm sorry that's a lot of >> I want to suggest you
Where's Kevin at? Trying to find Kevin. You're good. >> Okay. Not >> yet. Okay. >> Mr. Adams, we're going to ask you to start from the top.
>> We're close. start at the beginning because our >> but yeah that's >> right right >> we've gone to the top of the scale >> but we can actually hear them >> yes we're back at hearing it yes
>> just levels >> YouTube is fine they said is that any better oh there's a little better >> we want it to be just right Well, the the chair advised me to speak slowly. Do you know how hard that is for a former superintendent?
>> If he gets this all worked out, you won't have to. >> Yeah, we are now my sister-in-law. Testing check one, two. >> Can you hear us? >> Testing one, two, three. >> Can't tell. >> Testing. Testing. Testing one, two.
>> What about a low voice? >> Testing check. >> Checking one, two, three. Happy birthday to you. Happy birthday to you. Happy birthday, dear Kevin. >> I wish that was live. No, I can't do
harmony when I'm singing the melody. It is today's Kevin's birthday. >> Happy birthday. Aren't you happy we're having audio issues on your birthday? >> Birthday. >> Terrific. A little bit more attention today. >> That's right. >> Do you want me to still talk?
Testing check. One, two, three. Checking. Checking. checking. >> We're going to sing. >> We're in recess, so >> Oh, okay. >> Aren't they all? >> Well, usually. Yes.
>> Like we had a we had a run of calm and now we're back to having those >> testing check. One, two, three. Checking one, two. So there >> that's funny. >> We've gone back to where it was before. >> Okay.
>> Hello. Hello. >> No. >> No. >> Okay. That Whoa. Okay. Is it a mic? Is it a cable? >> Did you say you could hear us, Miss Connor? >> Oh, we're live on YouTube. We're still live on YouTube.
>> So, you were singing. >> That's right. Everybody got to hear your beautiful voice. >> So, we're going to have the greatest hits compound again. >> I cannot wait to see. >> Oh, there we go. The ch Yes. Yes. >> Better.
>> That's way better. >> Sir, would you say something? test. >> Testing check one, two, three. >> Yes. >> Testing check one, two, three. >> All right,
>> I think we're cooking with gas. YouTube will be very happy. >> Uh, testing check. One, two, three. >> Awesome. Thank you. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Okay.
>> Thank you. >> And we're going to restart everything. Take it to take it from the top >> on the queue. welcome us back from recess at 9:16. Thank you for being patient with us while we fix some audio issues. And Mr.
Adams, we welcome you back to the podium. If you will start from the very beginning, we'd appreciate it. >> Well, thank you. Thank you, Madam Chair, and members of the school board. Uh it's our pleasure uh representing Hazard Young and Itilia commonly known as HYA
uh to join you in a partnership for your successor superintendent search. Uh I'm Bill Adams, vice president uh with HYA uh a former superintendent of 36 years. What may be a little bit unique about that 36 years in the same district as
superintendent. Uh that doesn't happen as much today. In fact, it doesn't happen almost at all today. But um times have changed and uh the challenges uh for uh school boards, the challenges for school staff, the challenges for parents
and our our uh students and children uh growing up today are great. Uh and uh so as the times change uh we need to change in terms of leadership and leadership style. uh just to um introduce our team
and to let you know that HYA has done about 2,000 executive searches over uh 35 plus years. Uh I'm joined today uh by Stacy Adams. Uh Stacy's a senior associate with uh HYA and um she is also
uh Mrs. Adams. Uh so we are partners uh in business uh and in life. Uh and most days that works very well for us. Uh there are some times when uh there are some challenges but uh uh we work together we believe uh extremely well.
Uh Dr. Monica Brown a former superintendent of 11 years uh and has been with us uh in our uh east coast team for about seven years will be working directly with us as well and will be involved in some of the uh stakeholder input sessions. So that's
that's our team that's that's uh who we are. Uh we have done uh uh other Florida searches over the years. Uh the most recent being Kyer and Kaire by the way for the second time. And you would say, well Kyer, well then how come a second
time? But they were 11 years apart. Uh so we think that's important. We've also done the state superintendent search in Florida, the commissioner of education twice. Uh with that um generally our contact person on the board is the board
chair. uh we generally then work with uh the executive assistant to the board uh as well as uh the HR person and that's very important in terms of team as well as uh uh our birthday person uh today uh who will be very important as uh as we
uh promote and keep the community informed as to the the search and the search process. Um, one of the the things that uh we like to do at the very beginning of the search is just take a few minutes and review the search process. There are four stages. The
first stage is engagement. It begins with a planning meeting with the school board. That's today's meeting. about three weeks to six weeks from from today. Uh we like to then bring back all of the stakeholder input and provide you
with what we call a leadership profile report uh on what we've learned uh about Marian County. Uh and then also at that same time present to you a set of desired characteristics for the successor superintendent.
Uh from there we begin the actual recruitment process. uh recruitment uh will be the the part of the process where uh we're out in the uh country literally uh recruiting uh applicants based on your desired characteristics.
Those desired characteristics will drive everything that we do from from that point on. Uh during the uh recruitment process uh we'll uh look at uh uh internal external uh instate out of state uh to try to match those desired
characteristics uh for Marian County. Once the recruitment process is completed, there'll be a series of three meetings with the school board, you the board. Uh the first meeting uh about 48 hours before that meeting will present
uh all of the applications and all of the uh resumeumés. And then we'll also present five documents on each of what we would call the slated or preferred candidates that most closely resemble your desired characteristics.
Usually, and we'll we'll talk about this a little bit later in the agenda, usually that will involve somewhere between eight and uh 10, 8, and 12 uh potential candidates who most closely resemble the desired characteristics.
From that, we'll ask you to do a paper screen and we'll help you with that with a process we call the deli process that we'll we'll talk about later. It's all done obviously in public and um what will happen a after that uh you'll
narrow that field uh perhaps to five perhaps to six or seven and then begin the interview process. uh we'll assist with that. We'll be present. We'll help uh develop questions. Uh and then from there after that first pro process uh uh
after the first interview process uh we'll ask you using the deli technique to again narrow the field uh to perhaps uh two to three top candidates and then a second round of interviews. Once that's completed, uh we'll do a uh
third-party and you you'll have as part of the five documents we present a 360 reference review, but we'll also then as you get down to a conditionally selected candidate, uh do a um actually uh a
background investigation with a third party vendor that we use. Uh that'll be not only the required criminal, civil f and so forth but financial driving record credential verification uh media review and the one today that
sometimes creates some problems uh is social media review. Uh that's part of that that whole process. Uh then concurrently uh you'd begin contract negotiations and then a final selection. Stacy will go over that calendar that we
propose and then whatever adjustments you want to make to that calendar uh in a few minutes. Once you've made your selection, we'll assist with transition. Uh that leadership profile report will be used to help develop the desired
characteristics. It'll be used to help develop questions for for applicants uh that are interviewed. uh and it'll be used um uh to help with transition once you've made your selection. We'll meet with you again uh and you can use that
to set goals uh uh with the uh successor superintendent uh and and uh we'll also uh offer we do also offer a process to assist uh the uh successor superintendent during the
first year uh in in the position. That's the search process. Uh are there any questions regarding the the the four stages uh which again are engagement, recruitment, selection, transition?
>> Any questions from the board? >> Okay, we're ready to move on. >> Thank you. Uh community engagement. >> Good morning. Good morning. >> Nice to meet all of you. Um so as Bill indicated, the first stage is engagement
and uh as a part of that it's important for um everyone to know that the intent here is to get as much input as possible in our efforts to develop the leadership profile report and the desire characteristics document. As you can
see, those two documents um will be extremely critical as we move through the process. And as Bill also mentioned, at the end of the engagement phase, um after they're presented to you, the school board, they will be made available for all of the community uh
via the uh district website. So with that in mind, the first part of the engagement process is to schedule interviews with each of you. Um we will send out a calendar tomorrow. You'll receive an email from me with a link to
a calendar um to sign up for an interview. Um you can uh contact us or we can be in contact either by phone or by zoom. Um the second part of the engagement is the focus groups or the focus groups I should say. Um in front
of you are a list of suggested groups. Now there are is not an opportunity to have a focus group with every individual constituency group that's in your community. However, what is important is
that every community member be invited to at least participate in one of the sessions. And so, you'll see if we can jump to the end, we will be doing community forums. Um, I will uh it's our suggestion that I work closely with um
Miss Martinez Young um to identify the specifics, but as we walk through this list, I'll read them to you. Um, please take note if there's a con a constituency group that has not been listed here that you want to make sure
uh receives an invitation to come to one of the groups. So um as we already identified board members individually um if you would like the interim superintendent um administrators at the district level um your principles and
assistant principles your support staff your collective bargaining bargaining unit or units leadership teachers of course um all call out to all teachers students are most important I this should be prioritized at the very shop
to do a a focus group with students, your uh PTI, PTO, U councils, your business leadership, your faith-based organization, and other parent, school, business or service or community groups. Um, in particular, those are the groups
that we'd like your suggestions for. And then community forums. Um, typically based on the number that's allotted by contract, we'll work out community forums. Um usually we suggest two to three, two being virtual and one being
in person. So with that list in mind, is there um are there any groups that we have missed and or any groups that you want to suggest um get a special inclusion in an invitation um to come to one of the groups?
>> Do you have any suggestions for additional groups? Um Dr. Hold on one second. Dr. Thank you. Um the only suggestion I would see here that we could potentially add is we have a pretty active um political community in this town. And so
proactively engaging um our rec I think would be appropriate to make sure that everyone is feeling involved and has opportunity to provide their insight. So those are two that I could think of. I don't certainly want to we have a teaart organ tea party organization as well um in the
community. So maybe working with someone outside of us to identify who those could be. But I do believe that having a political group forum of sorts to come together and give them opportunity to share what they desire in a superintendent would be um proactive in
the dialogue in the community. >> Great. Thank you. >> Thank you very much. Um yes, Reverend Cummings. >> Madam Chair, I was just going to suggest that um we did this process the last time. There were um several groups that the board members individually may have
request requested becluded. I think since we're going to be meeting with them individually that we give those those uh those individual groups to them as well as look back at the last superintendent search and see who was included um in that process. Um because
as she just as Dr. As James just said, there are some political groups, there are some civic groups in the community, there are several um entities that were included that I don't think we want to exhaust our time this morning, list them now, but we can get a list and get to you.
>> Absolutely. Thank you. We'll um make sure we connect uh I believe that I can work with um Miss Martinez Young to secure that list that was used last time and we'll speak individually. >> Thank you. Yes, board member. >> Thank you. I would also uh like to make
sure we include our nonprofit um organizations. We have such deep connections uh and partnerships. Including them, I think would be vital. >> And chair, if I can, I while I can appreciate the individual conversation,
that means that then we will have to come back together as the board to then delineate which groups we're going to meet with. So, if we had the conversation now, we would hash it out. But if we have it privately, you're going to have to come back before us to present, I would imagine. Right. Or
if one board member wants a group represented, is that just going to be added to the list? What would the way of work be? >> The way it worked last time was once the individual board members gave that list of whoever their individual requests were, that whole list just came back to
the board and we looked at it. Um, nobody kicked anybody out or anything like that. >> Okay. Okay. Um, just trying to understand that I will just offer board I don't um because the interim superintendent has given us notice that she intends to apply for the job. I'm
not sure that it would be appropriate for her to have an individual meeting with the firm seeing as she's shown intent to apply. So, >> thank you. Dr. Campbell, any input? >> Uh, I'm just taking in the thoughts that
others have. Uh I appreciate the concept first of all of the political groups being engaged. There is chatter starting in our community about going back to an elected superintendent which obviously is not the direction this board is going to take but because that conversation is occurring I think
the political groups are important to engage early on in the process. Additionally with the nonprofits there are several that are in our schools every day. Um, and so that would be helpful to hear specific perspective. I also appreciate the student
conversation. We do have student board representatives u that we already have. They are seniors though, so it's possible that we would need how those students would be selected to be participating in a focus group would be an interesting conversation for me. Um,
just wondering if we're because I mean the youngest learners are going to be the ones that are going to have the most impact certainly because of the long-term potential of a of a superintendent and your seniors are going to be the ones on the way out not having engagement. So, um, I I think that this is a a pretty good list. I
think there probably are potentially others that will come to mind. Um, but I appreciate the thoughts of fellow board members because some things I hadn't considered have already been brought up. Thank you. >> Thank you. Yes, Miss Thrower. Speaking of students, absolutely. And
perhaps the the way to capture at least some of their voice would be through the U SGA and you know the some of the student le organizations. Um fellowship of Christian athletes come to mind. uh
you know student clubs could possibly you know have the opportunity to be you know queried and and participate in the survey and and provide input. We've really been um very
big on making sure that student voice is represented through Dr. Brewer and and our previous superintendent Dr. Gullet and it has really been fruitful. So yes, including them deeply. >> Absolutely. Um we see that as a
priority. Um typically what we suggest is to have the student leaders of those um different clubs and organizations that you just mentioned um as a part of the invitation of the group. Um also know that students are listed I'm
jumping ahead here on the survey and so uh depending upon your district protocols and policies um they can also participate. um if they're not included in the focus group, they can participate in the survey. So, it's very important to us to make sure that we get a cross-section of all of the students
that there's representation and student voice from um across the district. >> Chair, >> yes. >> And and I also know we have teachers listed here and certainly we want any teachers to participate as much as they want, but I think the Golden Apple Academy would be a really good group of teachers that we could use. Uh the
public education foundation obviously is our direct support organization nonprofit, but they do have a group of teachers that are our teacher of the year candidates every year and so that's um certainly some of them have moved on to administration and different things so they might be picked up in different ways but I think the teachers that are
still teachers in Golden Apple would be a great resource. >> Thank you. >> Thank you so much. Anything further? >> Okay, I think we have a really great starting point. >> Thank you. >> Yes. Thank you. The next part of uh community engagement
is the survey. Uh we have a a researchbased survey that uh that we utilize. Um and as part of our our proposal, it it does include uh the survey going out both in English and Spanish. Um there are seven groups or
six groups that we can disagregate that that survey to. We'd like to get some input initially on how you would like us to once we go up with that survey which would likely be uh at the beginning of November
um the to divide into whatever however people uh identify themselves. So we give a suggestion. It could be an MCPS administrator or supervisor regardless of central uh office or or uh building
level. Uh it could be an MC uh PS um uh or a Marian County community member. Um we like to include uh the the parents or andor guardians of current students uh as a group that can be disagregated. And
then your uh both your certificated staff which would include all your teachers and uh uh staff that require a certificate for the position they hold other than a supervisor administrator and the same for uh the non-certificated
staff that provide all of the support services uh that uh that do not require a a Florida Department of Education certificate for the position. They're the general six that we recommend, but uh do you do you have any others or
anything specific uh that you would want us to disagregate within that six? >> Yes. >> Um just for the the board consideration, I I think in light of the fact that we have only had five years of an appointed superintendent, I actually would be
interested in hearing from retired MCPS employees. So, we have a very large retirement community in our in our community as well, apart from being a community business member. Are you retired from MCPS? And I think that would be an interesting group to hear from specifically just because of the
experiences they may have they've had through the years. But if that's up for board discussion if you guys feel comfortable with that. >> And Madam Chair, that was one of the groups, the retired uh educators association was one of those groups that was included last time. That's why I suggested that we pull the list because
some of the same people that you guys are naming were on that list. >> Thank you very much, Re Cummings. Anything else? >> Okay. My my only question uh with the retired
group obviously from a focus group, we could we can address that. Uh when we disagregate the survey, I can only disagregate the six groups. So, uh, how how would you want us to
report that out? We have a a a category called community member, business person, retiree, um, >> suggestions, board. Um what um just so I understand so when the survey opens the individuals are choosing their they're
self-determining their classification. >> Correct. >> Okay. Um then yes I I think that would be the most appropriate place to tack it on. Um I don't necessarily think we should supplant a uh or substitute a retiree category for one of the ones
that's already present here. Um so that would be the most obvious place to add it as an option or or Whatever. Yeah, >> maybe I have a suggestion on like for example on the top one administrator, supervisor. You could say, you know, current
administrator, supervisor, retired administrator, supervisor, something to I don't know, maybe that would then expand it into a seventh category. I don't know if you can. I guess I'm interested to know why six like how come we couldn't do seven.
Just I'm visualizing a drop down menu where the person would click and selfidentify, you know, I'm a student. >> Well, we'd have to customize a researchbased survey and it only the the way it's set up, we only have six
categories. Okay, >> we can you can pick any six however you want to define people. >> We should I agree about not supplanting with one that's already here because they're all important, but apparently we
have a box that we need to operate in. >> Well, I guess I also would want clarification on what is I mean other than the obvious, what is the why are there two categories for non-certified staff other than supervisor and certified staff other than supervisor? But you could do all staff. Uh
frequently um we see differences uh especially in terms of uh staff needs, staff retention efforts and so forth, whether we're working with certificated or non-ertificated staff, but that's up to you the board.
>> Is there not a way we can add another question though to more define their role? So couldn't those two be combined to say staff non-administrator? And then there's another question that is a drop down that says type of staff
and they can put pair professional teacher. Is that not a possibility? >> It's it's not a possibility without customizing the survey and it and and there's their cost to do that. >> Okay. So they they've built a tool that
they're using around the country and so this tool gives us this option and this option only. Well, then my recommendation board would be that we just have a staff not administrator category and then a retiree a retiree of MCPS category if we want to capture that
thought pattern. Um I mean I I personally believe people are going to be confused as to whether they're checking non-certified or certified anyways because they're a certified pair professional. So I think probably what
that means is a certified teacher. Is that a correct statement? Anyone who holds a certificate in anything. So if I'm a certified electrician working for Marian County Public Schools, I would check certified staff. >> No. Anyone who holds a Florida
Department of Education certificate. >> That's what I thought that meant. So I think that there would probably be confusion around that anyways. So my recommendation would be we just do staff non-administrative and then we do retiree from MCPS.
That would be my recommendation board. >> Yes, >> I would agree with that. I I think that there will be too much confusion with the way the words are right now. Um so we have administrators and then we have staff and then we have retired MCPS
employees of any level >> of any kind and then we have community members, parents and students. I think that's a great mix. >> Okay. >> Is that possible? >> Yes. >> Okay. Struggling a little over here.
>> Well, not with that. I'm I'm fine with what's been proposed. And we have a little elephant in the room in this district. And I'll just go ahead and say it. Um, people are very suspicious of responding to surveys.
They wonder who really gets to see the information, how it may be used or abused against them in the future. You know, that's just truth. And as we move forward in this process,
it's going to be our task as as a district in communication to help reassure our own employees that if they really want to have a voice because we're going to be taking this very seriously. It's it's not cheap to
do. It's very time consuming. um and they've just got to weigh in and be reassured that it's safe to do so. Is that something you've experienced in other districts, hesitation like that?
>> Actually, it's a very good point that that you make um both in the focus groups and in the survey. And I'll I'll go I'm going to go a little bit deeper perhaps in terms of response. uh for the
survey number first uh we do not uh uh check or keep IP addresses. So uh the people that uh complete the survey do so anonymously through HYA. So district uh staff u just and internal
people have no access to that information. So it is it's totally done blind. We do ask the question out front with the six groups that I I I think we have agreement on moving forward with that people identify for instance
someone says I'm a parent of a student attending the school district and I'm a teacher. We ask them to identify how they most identify. Do you identify as a parent or do you identify as a teacher? So that that's that's that part of the survey.
the survey itself um we provide the information by category those six categories that's it so there are no names attached uh one of the reasons we don't use an open-ended question is so that we don't have to go back and redact uh student
names staff names and and so forth so that's that's all done as part of it also when we do focus groups both in person and virtual we never record names when we do virtual uh we only allow the chat to us. We have actually seen people
take screenshots of chat going back and forth and then publishing those screenshots. So we have we've taken steps to protect that uh in in in terms of both virtual and in person uh so that
we get as much unfiltered information as possible. Uh, and we think that's that's important. And that student category uh that that we mentioned, again, it all depends on your district protocols on allowing students to take surveys. Kaire
County had 5,000 students respond to their survey, roughly 50,000 students. >> Can I ask a question? >> Is the student number required when completing the student survey?
>> No. So, I understand that's an identifying factor, but I also can understand that people complete surveys. Is is there a way to minimize people not completing the survey more than once or that that question is frequently asked
uh and yes, there are ways, but to do that, we'd have to track IP addresses. That's one problem. The second problem is most of your schools have you have one IP address and if we limited it to
one IP address we might cut out a whole group of people. We have found there there are two things. We have found that if there's a particular group of of stakeholders that feel very strongly uh they may load the the the the number of
uh documents that most likely are going to present their majority point of view. Uh the other thing that we do have is we use a software that will allow us to track certain
responses to see if patterns are being formed and if they are then we'll we'll check that that more deeply. But uh we've administered this uh literally hundreds of times and have not found that to be a problem. >> It's it's always a question ask and it's
a very appropriate question to ask. >> Thank you. Thank you. I I really appreciate it. It shows the years of experience you have dealing with this. And again, if we're we're going to do it, it's important for
everyone to feel that this is an absolutely safe and straightforward process and that we are 100% serious about getting the input. So this would be the opportunity or the opportunities
that you're presenting because it's hard when you put it all out there and then you get kind of a tepid response but then you sure get a lot afterwards and and I would just like to try to steer that in a more positive direction if we can.
>> Thank you. Well, with the uh adjustments uh you've made uh in terms of the the six categories, uh we'll we'll we'll make that to make sure that we get the retiree group in and uh we'll we'll move forward with that.
Number >> So, you've just hit on the perfect segue. Thank you. in that it's communication um to all of the stakeholders in the community. Um as we all have um met uh
Kevin and um his birthday today, we will be working closely with him um to make sure that all information about the process is communicated including those documents, the survey report, the desired characteristics and the leadership profile are made available um
to the community. Typically the focal point is the district website, right? We suggest a um separate and unique page on the district website to communicate the calendar. You'll see the timeline, the opportunities to be involved in the
engagement phase, the survey link as well, links to um if there's well it says there are links to other feedback instruments and uh job uh profile or the leadership profile is what we call it um on the on the website. Um in addition to
that, we also recommend um getting the word out about the process um through all your socials. Um so I will again be working close with Kevin on that front and any other uh communication channels that the district uses to communicate to
um stakeholder groups. Um we also encourage when we have the dates and times set up for the community forums in particular um that everyone in the community be involved in promoting the community forums. So obviously that
includes all of you um on the board and as well as anyone who um feels compelled to put it out there to get the word out not only to the ver uh community forums but also to the survey. Let's spread the word. Let's get those voices heard um
and do everything that we can um uh up you know inside out, upside down, um high and low um to get that word out to the community. So, I just wanted to review those different uh mediums and channels. Again, working tightly with Kevin. Um, is there any uh other
comments that you want to ensure are included here, >> right? Seeing none. No. >> Okay. Great. Thank you. All righty. Flip it. The next item uh on on our agenda is the number of slated candidates. And I
mentioned at the outset um we don't know how many applicants they'll there will be. Uh we do know that typically in Florida, Minnesota, and Ohio, we get fewer applicants because of the information becoming uh public when when
people uh submit their applications. Um generally we recommend and this is it and because we don't know the number of applicants yet that we present at least six maybe 10 12 uh uh that most closely
resemble your desired characteristics. Uh obviously the more applicants we present as we get to a tier two or a tier three level applicant, they're the ones that do not have or most closely resemble the desired characteristics
that you've identified. So uh we just like to have a feel going out. Are you comfortable with six 10 12 uh applicants? you will have every application, every resume uh and uh we
will have a spreadsheet uh and uh we certainly can answer any questions as to why we didn't present someone. You the board always have the option to add somebody from the candidate pool that we didn't present as long as a majority of
you uh want to do that. We however do not guarantee that person as part of our guarantee because we we felt that through our vetting process they didn't meet the criterion but you have that option and once that person is entered they have the same opportunity as uh
anyone else that applies. So any feel for the the number of uh slated applicants for those applicants you'll have their letter of interest based on the desired characteristics their resume their completed uh frontline application
through our system not through uh uh uh yours. Uh they'll have a self introduction. How would you want Bill Adams to introduce you to the Marian County School Board? one page, double spaced, don't cheat, about three paragraphs
tells you a lot about a person. And then the last uh document is a uh what references said, that 360 reference check, which minimally should include uh a person uh that the individual directly reports to. That may be the school board
chair or the school board. Uh it uh a person who is a direct report to the individual. Uh some stakeholders that have received services as a direct result of the individual's work whether it's superintendent or or whatever that
role is. Uh and then uh colleagues that can speak to the professional uh experience. Now that's different than that background uh check that we do at the end. Uh any any thoughts on the number of slated? Are you comfortable
without setting a number uh with with what generally we recommend 6 to 12 6 to 10? >> Mr. >> I would recommend cast the net and see what we get based on your criterion
you know that you come up with. Um it's pretty hard to predict how many we'll get as as you said. Um but I think that with the criterion that's established hopefully all the ones we get will be
competitive. >> Thank you Mr. Yes. M Dr. James. >> Do you have any data on the average number of candidates who apply for some of the other Florida school board um searches that have happened in recent history? I can I know that what is forward facing so what makes it to the
public is not a whole lot of candidates. So I'm just wondering if there's a lot you know under the hood there that we're not seeing or if if truly the number of candidates applying for jobs is not significant. >> We we've looked I I looked at uh Deval
the last time they were out uh they had something like 26 29 there were six that they looked at. Uh I saw some of the candidates and actually knew who some of them were. In fact, one of them was a candidate from New Jersey. Uh the the
the field was was relatively thin. >> Um I can tell you again some of that is is a sunshine requirement and and that's that's what we operate under here in in Florida. Uh but um we generally I I
would expect uh for again depending on one of our items here on the the level of of compensation that we can advertise that will have something to do with it. about 55% of the applicants that apply for the
jobs that HYA uh does uh are generally come from the marketing and re that that we do to promote the district and reach out. About 45% are direct contacts that our team makes or other team members
from HYA make. Interestingly enough, about 75% of the people that are hired come from that 45%. And they're the ones that may not be looking for a job. Uh may not know that there's a great opportunity in Marian
County that we reach out to. They may be perfectly happy where they are. >> Uh but this is an opportunity and and so that's all important in terms of the of the process. Um, the last time Broward was out, it wasn't
there there weren't very many. Uh, 19, 20, whatever. We just did a New Jersey search in um um East Brunswick, New Jersey. We had 62 applicants. Um,
again, it it it it depends on the state. And I think uh one of the things that will impact us again will be what we what we're allowed to go out in terms of marketing uh for uh compensation level and we're going to give you some
examples in in a few minutes. >> Okay. That was just kind of a little note I wanted had been wondering about. So thank you. >> Sure. You're welcome. >> I'm comfortable with the number of candidates presented. >> I am. I am too also.
>> Okay. Okay. Well, thank you. Uh, and a fairly easy one. Um, candidate expenses. Um, the standard in the industry is is to pay for candidate expenses uh that you bring in uh subject to IRS and GAO
uh requirements. Obviously, board policy uh and state statute. Uh, and you don't have to give us direction today, but once we start talking to applicants, we we like to know how you feel. There likely would be up to two uh events
where you would bring people face to face. While we use a lot of virtual things, we don't recommend our interviews be done virtually. We recommend that that people meet you face to face as we are this morning. >> I agree with that.
>> I agree as well. >> Any thoughts on candidate expenses? What did um what's the average you spent? >> So, how many candidates are we bringing in? Well,
I for the first round likely between five and seven for the second round and keep in mind some some may be instate some uh and typically instate there's not always a mileage
thing but uh if people come from out of state generally there's an expectation. the second round, uh, you're you're likely talking no more than three and and it could very well just be two. >> And it is there a cap on the expense or
is it a grab your first class ticket from Delta? >> We we we generally put the condition if HYA is is putting it out, uh, coach lowest direct flight fair. uh if it's a
flight, we always say uh IRS guidelines, especially when it comes to mileage or anything like that, and GAO, which sets the standard for hotel and and so forth. But in answer directly to your question, you the board can put a top stop. And
you don't have to do that today, but you could think about that. You could say top is $1,200. Top stop is >> $100 for a flight. That would be flight hotel. >> Um, yes. Attorney,
>> we have both Florida statute and board policy which speak to maximum allotted amounts for travel expenses for any purpose. So, we could reimburse at that level. >> Do we know what that level is or >> Yeah, I I'll have to look it up and get get it to you, but there's a there's and
it depends on that maximum level is depending upon mileage and other factors. So, >> okay. And I would just also encourage the board, we have great community partnerships. So I would encourage the board to have discourse with some of the local hotels, some even right here near downtown Ocala to come up with a partnership for, you know, booking a
block of rooms um potentially for a couple of days and trying to lock in a rate that would be um more appropriate for the community because this is ultimately a community expense. We're a taxpayer funded organization and so trying to be good stewards to that money and understand
how much it will cost and trying to find avenues and ways we can make sure that it's the most costefficient. Uh Dr. James uh that's actually um and this was many years ago about uh I guess 14 years ago now when we did Broward
County uh that's ex exactly uh how they handled it. They they booked the block of rooms. Everything was was done that way. Uh and again it'll depend I think on the number of applicants that would be coming in and so forth. That was
truly an a a national search where a majority of the candidates came from all over the country. >> Thank you. >> Okay. Yes, Mr. you know, as we're parsing this out, um,
just in terms of keeping it very clean, I would likely be more comfortable with just, you know, with following our board policy. That's what it's there for. Florida statutes. These are intelligent people that can find their way to Ocala. And I think that they should have the
opportunity within the parameters we set to decide for themselves for whatever reasons, uh, you know, where they want to stay and and and what have you. and and and that just keeps it clean. I would rather stay arms length from those types of details. That's just me.
>> Okay. >> Oh, wait. Hold on. Just kidding. Reverend Cummings, >> thank you. Obviously, you have plenty of time to to work that out however you want to do it. And as council said, you have a policy that that guides this.
>> Okay. Re Cummings. >> So I I I heard um Attorney Powers say that there is a policy when we do standard recruitment and bringing folks in. We pay for their we don't pay for their um travel lane and all that stuff.
>> No, Miss Mar shaking her head >> like when we did a CFO search. >> Correct. >> Thank you. Make sure we we know where we are. I would tend to agree with Reverend Cummings.
Uh, but I can also appreciate the um standard expectation for a search like this, but we just did a CFO hire, which I would say is the second in command in our district, and I don't believe we offered any travel expenses or
compensation for expenses for that. So, that would just be something I would like to at least keep in the back of our mind as we continue the conversation. All right. Thank you for that input. Yes. >> And and that's not a bad point um at all. Um we also have to keep in mind
that this is our hire and we definitely want to reflect industry standard. Um because when you deviate from something like that, it it could be good, it could be not so
good on how people respond to that. Uh again, I'm a big fan of keeping it clean, keeping it straightforward if we're going to do this. Uh that's what we're hiring you for, sir. Thank you. >> Okay.
>> Okay. Thank you. >> So, that that conversation will continue and it doesn't have to be uh decided now and I think your your thoughts are out on the at least out on the table. Uh the next item uh is simply to report to you the advertising. Uh it says advertising
options. Uh but I I did want to point out that uh about five years ago, we made a business decision on our website. Uh and we allow competitors uh to put their searches on the website. As a result, uh it has become a go-to place
for uh uh people uh in the uh education leadership field, executive leadership uh to look for uh positions. We get about 25,000 hits a month and that's included uh in in uh our our advertising
process. Uh as part of our proposal that was accepted uh advertising package uh three uh will be utilized and uh that ensures that you get into education week uh and uh some of the the most important
to make sure there's national coverage. uh that'll give us not only instate but regional and national coverage. Um along uh with that uh we also included in our package uh the uh NASBY um Alice um um
information and uh that'll put us online 30 days each uh with uh the National Alliance of Black School Educators uh and the U Association of uh Latino School Administrators. So we have
coverage we believe in terms of the advertising that was included in our proposal. Uh that should give us uh some a wide range both to make sure we're instate, make sure we're regional, and to make sure that that we're national. And I just wanted to to to point that
out. It is it is part of our contract with you. Um any questions on that? >> No, think we're good to go. >> Okay. Uh I mentioned at the outset when we went over uh the original um um uh
four stages and the last stage uh we do that uh background check. We use a third party private investigator uh that will provide us with uh a complete report. If you looked at the search brochure, there's like nine items covered, but I I
I'll just repeat the ones that the broad general categories, criminal, civil, financial um and that includes a transunion or Equifax credit report, which has to be uh generally that report would go to council and then council would uh
present it because there's some things that you simply have to protect especially the credit uh uh and financial credial check uh the uh credential verification both the credential the individual claims to have as well as the agency or university that
issued the credential uh media review which is generally a five-year media review and a social media review uh which you'll you'll have. So that's the background check on the final conditionally selected candidate conditioned on that and obviously
contract negotiations. Any questions on that? >> Dr. Campbell and I are thinking the same exact thing, so I'll say it because between the two of us, we're pretty good at saying the inside thoughts out loud. So in the light of the recent narratives
in the national news circuit regarding superintendence, I would hope that whatever background check we are doing is going to ensure that the candidates that make it to the final uh stage of our interview process are
legal citizens and are eligible for employment in the United States and they haven't falsified any information within their resume >> or are felons. That's setting the bar pretty low. >> Well, I just >> I understand the conversation.
>> Well, and it's it's just concerning because >> when the news when the news became public, I was very concerned because you wonder how does someone get to such a a CEO tier position um and is completely not qualified even for employment. So um
I just felt important to at least mention it seeing as we are having that public discussion today >> and Dr. Campbell gave me the eyes so I knew she was thinking on the same thing pathway. >> I just pray that's a oneoff. >> Dear God, >> we do too. But
>> oh yes, >> the plot just continued to thicken and we do not want to be the next national news story. >> Not for that reason. Only for good things. >> That's right. We want to be a national news story but not for that. Thank you for pointing that out. We do not want
and will not allow Marian County to become De Moines, Iowa. Uh so um thank thank you for that. It and it is an important part of the of the of the process uh uh that en ensures that we look at that almost like a title policy
on a house and that's how important that background investigation is. of salary infringe benefits um in order for us to be able to uh advertise nationally uh and to start the
promotion. Now formally we're not going to be recruiting until you prepare the desire or approve the desired characteristics after the survey after the community input but we will post the position almost immediately. uh and we do need a a salary or a
compensation level would probably be a better way to to do that. I prepared some information I'm going to give to you verbally and unfortunately because we we couldn't get the information. I didn't have it until last night and under the procedures I I can't project
it or or but but I do have a copy once I present it to you I can give you and then uh we can make it publicly available as well. But one of the things that we we look at are are comps uh
around uh the the uh the state around the country because although this is a Florida search, we're going to be attracting applicants from from from all over uh in including our state and and and so forth. So I looked at the
counties that touch in some way Marian County and uh as we look at those those counties um u uh we ela citrus lake Marian Putnham Sumpter Levy uh and
Valuchia we have a lake in between but uh I I have now as I look at them uh three of or Four of those superintendents are elected and that elected salaries are controlled differently in Florida. So I I I threw I
I took them out. Now, in the information I'm going to provide you, I have all of the number of students, the schools, and the the salary as listed uh by uh in the salaries of elected uh county
constitutional and school district officials for fiscal year 2025 26. disperse that before he gets started. >> Sure. >> Attorney Powers, is that acceptable for him to disperse the consumable to us before he gets started just so we can have it in front of us? You said you
have something to give us. >> I I do if if we're permitted to give it to you at this time. >> Okay. Sorry, Chair. I think >> I felt like we were about to get a lot of numbers and I was ready to write, but >> Well, and I was busy because Miss uh Miss Bar sent us something also, so I was looking to see if I could pull that
up. >> Thank you, Dr. James. Thank you. >> Please note on there at the very uh bottom it says fiscal year 205. It should be 2025-26.
I believe this information became available on September 25th statewide. Uh we just received it. Do all of you have a copy in front of you? Well, as as you look at at the the f the
first page after the cover page, uh you can see the the counties that touch and the the superintendent salary figure that's given is the figure that was given by uh the state organization
uh and that's the office of economic um and demographic information that may not actually reflect the information that is available in the
district and it doesn't reflect to our knowledge any supplements. So as as you look at those figures, if you take the four counties including Marian that do not elect their superintendent but appoint their superintendent,
uh the average uh base salary is $216,396. Um and so we use that as kind of a base starting point. Uh if you go to the the next page, um your last uh uh permanent
superintendent uh when uh uh she left the position in July of 25, uh the salary was uh two $238,612. There were three additional supplements totaling $15,000 for a total of $254,112.
That's the information based on the actual contract. >> And that does not include the vehicle, correct? >> I don't know what the three supplements include, but as far as I understand it, it does not include >> does include the vehicle. >> It does,
>> Miss Mar. She did. >> It did include >> because the vehicle was 6,000 annually, I think. And then I guess the other supplements would have been the doctorate supplement. I'm I'm looking beyond you. I'm sorry. I'm kind of like looking at Miss Morant,
but because I realize you wouldn't have known that information. Okay. You sent it to our email. Oh, okay. I'm just wondering how what what they were. I just I I know for me having that context as we go into this
conversation and understanding what worked well for us and what didn't work well for us I would like to have as frame and context for the conversation as all so >> I have a question >> yes >> on the surrounding county superintendent
salaries uh were these are these base salaries absent of any supplements do you know do we know >> as as far as far as we know from reviewing the document uh their base
salaries. Um what what's difficult and if you read the document carefully uh it says at the end specifically uh each district or each each uh school u division or system should review their
own documents. Uh this is simply the information uh gathered from the the state document. Thank you. And if I remember correctly, the there's it's codified in Florida State Statute as far as elected superintendent salaries.
>> Right. And that's what these amounts are. >> Right. >> And that's and that's why when I I did the average of the four appointed, I did not include the elected. >> Apples to oranges. >> All right.
If you go to the next the next page, uh just for some comparative purposes and to put this into context in that we're recruiting in a very challenging market, we're recruiting
for the 26 uh 27 school year. So if you if you take the average base salary for Marian County and the and the three uh adjoining that most closely uh
re resemble and are appointed uh you can see the the 216,000 if you increase it by 3% for 2627 it's a base of around $222,888. Um, I then went and took the last salary
of uh the previous permanent superintendent, $238,612, and that's that gets to that's base. That's without the supplement. Added 3% if I was going to do that for the current year and came out to 240 uh 245
um approximately $245,770. and then added 3% for the 26u uh 27 school year and came out with 253,000143 and that doesn't include uh the supplements. When when we recruit and market a
district, um we recommend a salary in the range of a figure or compensation if you're looking at total compensation, which would include supplements. Uh and we always say subject to actual
qualifications, experience, and negotiations. Um some recruitment firms will say a range from a certain figure to another figure. Uh and we find that it's it's
not as palatable. It's not as salailable and our experience shows to go with a single figure which you always have as the board the opportunity based on actual experience and qualifications to go lower or to go higher. Um, if you go
to the next page, I'll give you an ex example of that. If the base, or not the base, if compensation was to be in the range of $250,000 subject to actual qualifications, negotiations, and uh and and experience,
and you had $250,000, and you went 1% less than that, it would be $247,500 based on the actual person. If you went 5% less, it would be $237,500. If you found that superstar and you
wanted to go a percent higher, it would be $252,500. So, we we find generally when you put a salary in the range of based on the actual qualifications that you can go probably as as low as 5% below, you
might go as high as 3% above. So, I did the same thing. If if the compensation total compensation was to be in the range of $255,000, uh that could go as as low as um $252,450.
And if you were to go a percent higher, uh 257550. We did that for 250 255 260 and 265 for illustration purposes. Um we then looked at your budget $1.3
billion and we looked at the various sources also recognized that uh there were cuts in the amount of $64 million this year and we're talking uh you know compensation which which is high compensation. So, if you you go to the
the next page uh and you look at the range that I gave you examples for between $250 and $265,000. Uh the first figure is less than 1/200th
of 1% of your budget. Uh if you go to the last figure, it's just slightly above 1/200th of 1% of your budget. So we're we're recommending that consideration to be given to uh
advertising not in terms of salary but in terms of compensation compensation in the range of subject to uh and we'd like to be able to have a figure to use u for recruitment in what
has been a very very tough recruitment market and to get the best person possible or the best applicants possible. possible. >> Chair, would Mr. Rios be able to share what the budgeted amount for this um for
for this year? Do we did we put it in the budget for this year at all for superintendent or >> Yes, he's welcome. If I can't see over the screen, is he here? >> Yes, he's here. Sorry.
>> Sorry, I can't see him from here. Yeah. >> Yeah, we can we can pull that information. I don't have it available in front of me now, but yes, the the budget for all positions um as approved by the board is for full employment for the entire district, which would include
the superintendent in all positions. >> Um I guess specifically my question is did we budget in the interim superintendent salary, which is significantly less than a superintendent um position. and understanding we're saying the search is for the 26 27
school year but we've also had many public conversations about this person coming online by March or April and so that would have impact to at least three or four months of this fiscal year. >> Yes, I get your question and um we'll have to pull the exact amount that we used for uh the current year. It may
have been appropriated amount based on the current uh interim superintendent that we have. Um so we'll need to pull that information. >> Okay. Um, understanding I think we have to make a decision today, but I guess we'll just figure it out if we we'll
have to adjust the budget accordingly assuming we hire someone above what we've budgeted for. >> That is correct. If that's the board's desire, as the gentleman pointed out, it seems like you have some flexibility to go above or below. And so we would uh accommodate that request.
>> Okay. M. >> Yes. Re Cummings. And I also um while we're looking at these numbers take in consideration um in prior search in the prior search prior process we also have to consider
um there were some additional expenses with the calling of an appointed superintendent that um when we went through the process that we didn't necessarily think about that was like moving expenses and um travel to move
back and forth and all that stuff. So there's some additional expenses that's going to arise out of this. Correct. >> I mean it'll be negotiated in the contract. >> Correct. >> Yes. >> Correct. >> I chair to Oh, if I if you don't mind, I
think I guess my question today would be are you just looking for a salary range or the fringe benefits which is also included on number 11. Are you looking for us to identify because personally for this board member there were benefits that were provided to the last superintendent that I would like the board to discuss whether those would be
applicable again. Generally, we we recommend if if if we were in an ideal world and, you know, budget and budget cuts and and the the impact on taxes and so forth weren't
considered, we'd we'd prefer to say a salary in the range of 255,000. However, we're recommending hedging that by saying compensation in the range of subject to that gives you total
compensation and allows you a lot of flexibility with the minuses and pluses and it gives us a tremendous amount of flexibility in recruiting candidates. >> Okay. So, I think I understand what you're saying. I'm sorry and I've missed it the prior four times you said it, but
I get it now. So compensation being defined as the entire compensation package versus salary being the individual salary plus a fringe benefits package. >> Correct. >> Okay. So advertising as a compensation level of 255 allin meaning that we would
subtract presumably 15 or 20k from that if needed to be able to absorb the costs of other benefits that may come on. >> Correct. >> Okay. And when you negotiate supplements, whatever those supplements are, uh, no matter what the figure is,
this is a a big big number. And people look at it, it may be one of the highest numbers in the county. >> And they look at that and whether you were to be at 200 or 270, there'd be criticism. No question about that as
well. but it's also a person responsible for a very large school system uh a $ 1.3 billion budget. Uh and um we believe that if you go in that area
of 255 compensation, you can negotiate if the person is more interested in salary that's pensionable, maybe then there's less in supplements. Uh we we see uh uh situations where people will say, "Well, keep the dollar number down
uh and we'll do a 40 uh 4013b in the amount of $25,000. Uh we we recommend going with a a total figure and then negotiate it however you're negotiating it." >> Understood. I can get on board with the
255 number as a compensation number. So that's my position on it. Okay, Mr. >> And I'm I'm good with that, too. You know, it's I just get back to the apples and oranges comparison. You know, this is all public record and okay, so you
look at Citrus County or Well, let's look at Levy County for example. Oh, $168,970. Well, they have 5,629 students and we have getting, you know,
we're pushing 50,000. So, those are just the kinds of things as board members that we'll have to answer and and be clear about the facts. And the 217 number is the elect if it
was elected that is the elected rate. It would be >> correct. >> Yes. >> Yes. Okay. Because I think the narrative will be important as we as the community continues a conversation about putting a ballot referendum to go back to elected understanding that the base is going to
be no less than 217 because our population is not going down in Marian County and then if you add on those fringe benefits you're you're going to be within 15 to 20k of the appointed rate anyways. >> Yes. >> Okay. Dr. Campbell,
>> I'm processing all the information. I I did pull comps, our city manager makes 258, I think. Um, county administrator, maybe a little bit less than that based on what I was trying to to pull. Looks like also Valuchia, who now has the national superintendent of the year by
one association. I think she's about 280 is what she makes, I think. Um, so I was just trying to I'm trying to pull in a bunch of other figures beyond what you had done. Thank you so much. I I also have the chart that that you have of what the elected comparisons would be. Um
I also understand that part of our explanation on our 1.3 billion dollar budget is that it's inflated because we are carrying our self- insurance fund. We're carrying $300 million in building like so 1.3
billion is the number, but it's not really the number. So that's part of our explanation. So, I I appreciate that it's a part of the calculation here, but in actuality, it's it's a little bit different than that. Um, I I understand that 255 as a general
number could be something that we could go out and market. Um, I definitely want to have the flexibility to to round that down depending on qualifications and depending on a lot of other factors. We're not going to pay a huge moving expense if the person lives in Lake
County, for example. So, I mean, there's going to be some opportunity for us there. We also know in our last superintendent salary negotiation for her three-year salary uh three-year contract again that happened a couple years ago, um she had asked for this
higher level in the FRS than what we had been giving her. So, there's that and that may be a part of that $15,000 that was um included there. So just with with the ability to to go down from 255 as
much as we could also go up. Um that's where I am. I I don't like the idea of even considering 265 honestly at this point. But I would see 265 as a part of a contract negotiation to say if we achieve
a rated status or if we pull this if we have zero D school like all these kinds of things we move all these C's to B's and like knowing that DOE is going to be or the legis legislature and DOE are going to be changing the metrics on those formulas anyway. But uh that's I
mean you you don't get to be the national superintendent of the year in Valuchia the way I mean she absolutely no D schools like they they have increased the number of A schools exponentially they're an A-rated district like lots of things that have changed in Valuchia
County under her um leadership and so that's the kind of work that I would look forward to putting into contract negotiations for a future superintendent. So, Madam Chair, so the you're basically saying that we're going to do some incentives.
>> Yes. >> Performance incentives, >> which we do for all of our other all teachers and and administrators. So, >> that's what I would be looking for. >> So, that again that that number could really go higher than what this range that
we're talking about, >> Mr. All metrics are incredibly important. Um, and point taken from the rest of the board members. You know, we're an up and
cominging district and in many ways, you know, look at our kindergarten readiness. Um, we were at the bottom and now we're squarely in the middle in a very short amount of time. So, we always want great performance to be rewarded. Any way we can we can do
that. and moving forward, I can see that completely being the consensus of the board to incorporate that into contract. >> Okay. Um and for me personally, I I'd like to see us closer um to a number of
240, but it sounds like the rest of the board is in agreeance at 250. Um, at least I >> I mean I I said 255 just because it sounded like that was the direction we were going up. Frankly, I I'm more comfortable going down. Frankly, uh I'm
more comfortable around 240 when I look when I look at the numbers in front of me and compare them to the numbers that we um that we have. I I'm much more comfortable starting at 240. >> Yes. Let me just say we need to be
careful of parsing because in the you we're talking $15,000 here and we have a professional standing in front of us that's been doing this for a long time that has made a recommendation. So this is an amazing board. I mean we go deep and we talk everything through. But at
the same time, I also think it's important to go with a recommendation, especially knowing that it's it's being framed as as a compensation package and we can go, you know, higher or lower depending on who we get. But I'm
concerned about making sure again that if we're going to move forward with this, we want some good fish. >> And and I agree with you, board member Thrower. Um, I'm just, you know, we are we are accountable as a board member. I am accountable to the people of Marian
County. And so I'm sharing with you what is on my heart and on my heart I'm landing at 240. But that being said, I will go along with what um is the board's preference. So
everyone else is sitting at >> Can we just Madam Chair just split the difference? 245 [Laughter] Reverend Cummings, you are great at working out compromise board. I'm gonna have everybody chime in one more one more time. Dr. James, where are you
comfortable? >> Um, I was comfortable at that 250, >> but I can go with whatever the pleasure of the majority of the board is. I'm not I don't I'm not going to die on any hill with related to this. >> Okay. Reverend Cummings >> 245. >> Board member Campbell.
>> I'm fine with 245 or 258. Either spot. I I'm fine with that. I and I know it's $5,000. It's just as soon as we roll this out, guys, we're going to get critiqued to death by our community. They do need to understand that if this person was elected, they would be making
217. That's a big difference than what we're talking right now because $5,000 is one thing. 30 to $40,000 is another. And so 245 sounds fine to me. >> Board member Thrower,
>> I'd be more comfortable with 250 to be honest. Um, you know, again, I just I'd rather be able to share with the community that we are looking to bring in as many qualified candidates as we can. If at the end of the day we're able to get
them for 5,000 or 10,000 less, you know, great. Uh, I I'm paying for this, you're paying for this. We're all paying for it because because we're all taxpayers. But I just get a little uncomfortable when we have a a solid firm making a
recommendation for a reason due to years and years of experience and they're going to be the ones that are going to have to bring them to us. So that's where I am. 250 that just sounds like a more real number. >> Okay. But what I'm hearing for the board
is 245 is what um the majority is speaking for. Okay, the next item uh on the agenda is the um calendar and the preparation uh that takes place at that first meeting in terms of workshop. I'm going to ask
Stacy uh to uh go over the calendar with you uh and u make sure that we understand it correctly and then maybe even try to get some commitment uh to some dates uh specifically down the the line.
>> Okay. So, here we are today on October the 2nd at the planning meeting, which is the first line item um on the calendar. We will um begin the initial posting as Bill mentioned um first thing next week, it will be up on the HYA uh website with
the uh compensation indicated. Um then what we will do between um that posting next week and what we're suggesting for the uh interviews and the online survey um the focus groups really is what we're
talking about here at November the 3 to commence both the online survey and the focus groups is we'll be doing a lot of planning and a lot of promotion. So again, working very tightly with your uh public relations person and Elena to organize those sessions and then promote
those. We think we have ample time there and then to begin them uh somewhere that week on November the 3 um and also launch the survey at the same time. In between we can do a calendar for your interviews and again I'll send that tomorrow to you and you can sign up
accordingly. um with an end date of November the 14th. We're looking to present the leadership profile report um the survey report and the desire characteristics to you the week of November the four November the 24th which also happens to
be I believe the week of Thanksgiving. >> Yes, ma'am. >> Um but I do believe that there's a board meeting on the 25th if I'm correct. >> No, the >> I am not showing a board meeting on the >> Okay, my bad. Okay, >> we'll disclose that entire week. All district offices are closed. I mean, not
that we can't be working on our laptops, but district offices are closed that week. >> Okay. So, is there a date that you would or a time given that we need time to pull the information together um that you would suggest for
>> Well, we have a session on the 20th, but you wouldn't have the data together to um upload >> on Thursday the 20th >> or December 9th. Our next board meeting after that would be December 9th. >> But are you presenting it? I'm I just want to understand is the information
presented in a I know that every board does their work differently, but we have work sessions to receive information and board meetings to vote on information. So if this is an opportunity for the board to receive information, it would be most appropriate in a work session, not in a board meeting. I mean, chair or
board, tell me if I'm wrong, but that would be my understanding. >> You okay? I know every board operates differently, but that is the way we work. >> This could this could certainly be done in a work session. It takes about an hour. You'll have the information in
advance of the session. The only thing we would be asking uh direction on from the board would be the desired characteristics. >> Okay. then we might want to schedule a work session because I have December 18th
um would be the next work session. >> But I believe FSBA conference is the first week in December the whole time. >> Madam Chair, couldn't we um for this because this is vitally important for our community and for the district if we needed to have a special work session
just for this item that we do that. >> I agree. I agree. That's what she was saying, but it's not going to be available until like the second week in December because if FSBA is the first week in December, we're not meeting the week of Thanksgiving, the 20th, you all would not have the data to us for proper
publication because the publication would have to happen on the 13th of November. So unless the timeline speeds up so that you get that information collected, the earliest that you all would be able is the week of December 8th to present to the board, I think, is
what I would summize. Okay. >> So what what days or the excuse me FSBA >> I think I think >> next no 3rd 4th 5th. >> No >> that week. >> Yes. I'm just >> Reverend Cummings goes on Tuesday.
>> Okay. So all of that week then Sunday. So the next week starting December 9th um >> the eth. the 8th >> board meeting on the 9th. Sorry. Um that Thursday would be the 11th. Would you all be available for a work session on
that day? >> Yes. >> December 11th. >> There's another community board meeting that day that I've been trying to prioritize attending. It's it's possible that the morning of the first, which is Monday the 1st, and I understand that will be the day we're all coming back
from break, but the morning of the first, we possibly could do, which is a Monday. Um, I know I don't check into the hotel until the afternoon that day. >> Now, I would agree with Dr. Campbell. I think if we if the first is available,
certainly that would be >> ideal for me. >> And then we can get it taken care of instead of delaying it a whole another week. Yes. >> Is that is that something that would work for you all? >> Yes, absolutely. >> Right, Miss Martinez Young.
>> So like 9:00 a.m. or whatever calendar invites for the first place. >> And we will just deal with just this issue. >> Justice. >> Justice. Yes. >> And for this particular meeting, we will probably be zooming in. >> Okay.
>> All righty. Then um as >> 9 to 11 >> we have agenda review. We'll have to >> we'll have to reschedu the agenda review. >> The agenda review is scheduled that morning, but we can reschedule it.
>> This should only take an hour, you said, >> right? >> Hour and a half. >> Yeah. So, I mean, we'll slate it for two hours and >> you'll have the Yeah, you'll have the information beforehand, correct? So, >> yes. >> Yes. >> Because it will have to publish.
>> Well, Miss Martinez will need to publish on like the 21st seeing as we're out of office the week of Thanksgiving. And so we'll just need to make sure that the information is provided before we go on break so that while on Thanksgiving break, Miss Martinez is not having to
publish meetings. >> Okay. So, December Monday, December the 1st at 9:00 a.m., >> correct? Thank you. >> Thank you. Okay. As Bill mentioned, we'll um post the opportunity on our website immediately. Um advertising
however um will be built around uh December and January um with an application deadline suggested of January the 30th. Um this is I think ample time. Um we'll have again
we'll the opportunity will be live out there on our website. um will start to use the desired characteristics that are um agreed upon from December the 1st all through the month of December and all through the month of January um to recruit for the position. Then with that
in mind, what we're suggesting is to present a slate of candidates to you on the week of February the 16th. Um that'll give us enough time to vet those uh those applications and put together that slate for you. Um, and then after
the slate is presented on Feb, the week of February the sec 16th, we're looking at the first interview on March the second. That kind of gives you this longer range, >> right? And I'm just I'm following my calendar as you go through. So, I'm wondering if we want to go ahead and and plug these dates in, the ones that were
able to. And so, um, December 18th would, um, >> 18th. >> February the 18th. >> You mean February 18th? Oh, sorry. Shoot. >> February 18th is >> Well, that's a Wednesday.
>> Well, she it's the week of February 16th is what's stated on the document. >> I just if we can real quick pause. I know that this has come up before with Dr. Campbell. Uh, and I agree with her wholeheartedly on this item is to revisit the job description. That is not something that we've done yet. Um, but
we have had conversation about the JD attached to this particular position and there there I think certainly at least I know Dr. Campbell and I have shared I believe multiple things that we feel like need to be moved or changed. Where
in this timeline does that need to occur or should it have already occurred? >> The job description their own job description. We work off of the desired characteristics in the leadership profile report. So if there's something internally in addition >> that's what I thought.
>> So is that going to be so if we're looking at your timeline what was the week of November 24th when you present those desired characteristics we need to get to you prior to that meeting an updated JD or no
>> not necessarily. Yeah. >> Okay. When you do the initial posting next week does that not include the job description? >> It does not. >> Okay. So, when does the job description get posted or is that when is that included in the communication?
>> Again, typically what we do is we work off of the desired characteristics and the leadership profile report. So, the job desript description is something if you're adding into the process, you would need to >> Okay, >> I understand. I think maybe then
following the the work session where we have the discourse on December 1st about the desired characteristics board maybe we could take that information and Miss Morant could work on updating our job description then would that be a more appropriate flow of work? >> I believe that's
>> okay. I just want to make sure that from our side of the table we get that taken care of because it's something that I want to make sure we align to get before we get to the finish line. >> I agree. Yeah, it makes total sense to have that desired characteristics and leadership profile incorporated into an updated job description.
>> Okay. So then following Dr. Brewer, maybe at some point in a work session, we can get the or Miss Morant or whoever would be most appropriate figure out how to get the job description brought to a work session. Do you think chair we should have in a work session?
Maybe following this December 1st work session, we could then have an updated JD brought to the board so then we can review it as it's combined and have discourse on it. >> Got a thumbs up and >> awesome. >> Okay. >> Sorry to interject in your timeline, but I just it
made my brain jump. >> I completely agree, Dr. James, that that job description needs to >> needs to be done as soon as possible so that before we bring in a slate of candidates before they would have that. >> Yes. >> In hand. Certainly, I don't think it would be appropriate to like at the end
of the, you know, at the negotiation table and then we're like, "Oh, by the way, here's the job description." So, I want to make sure that we button that up. So, okay. Thank you for that sidebar. Sure. So, with regard to the slate presentation,
the week of February the 16th, is there any preferable date or >> We have a work session already scheduled on the 18th or excuse me, 19th. No, we don't. >> Okay. >> We don't. >> I think our calendar hasn't come out
yet. >> Calendar hasn't come out yet, >> but that if we follow our traditional first and third Thursday, we will most likely have a work session scheduled on the 19th. >> Yes, >> this is a three-hour meeting. >> Okay.
>> So, we don't need that on a date with >> a regular >> It needs to be a special work session. >> Okay. How about the 12th? Oh, no. She said the 16th. Um, Monday is a holiday.
We don't have a Well, >> 17th Tuesday. >> I mean, the 18th is I would say the our options are about the 17th or the 18th. >> 17th. >> 17th, I believe, is better, too.
>> Yeah, I'm fine with the 17th. Okay, Dr. Campbell, I didn't see that was >> 17. Yes. >> 17. >> All right. >> 9 9:00 a.m. Is that when you >> Yes. >> And 9 to 12. >> Miss Martinez, did you get all that? Okay. Thank you, ma'am.
>> Okay. Which will bring us um to the initial interviews. You'll select um who you want to bring in from the slate, and we're suggesting um the week of March the 2nd. Now, what we typically recommend so that there's a le level
playing field that it's all done in one day. >> Um given that there's some flexibility for weekdays with um with all of you, sometimes we even go to a Saturday, but um that's up to you.
But we do recommend all um interviews occur on the same day. >> Sure. So, at this time when you bring the slate, you're bringing a slate of about 10. >> That's the slate um on uh on February this the 17th. Now, we're
talking about from the slate, you're going to identify your first round of interviewees. And so, when you bring your candidates in to interview, we suggest interviewing all the candidates on the same day. >> 10. >> No, no, like the
>> ones we run the slate workshop. We're going to pick five or sixish and do the first round. >> Broken it down. Okay. >> Generally, you'd be ideally six, 5 to 7. >> Okay. >> So, we're talking about probably 8:30 in the morning to 4:00 in the afternoon.
Solid day. Breaks in between scheduled usually four uh a break between each interview, a break after the four and then two, and then deliberations. So there would have already been an elimination round. Basically
>> the slate eliminates about 50% of the slate. >> Yes. >> So the first round of interviews chair >> chair. >> Oh, I apologize. >> No, it's okay. And are these interviews are they public interviews or this is
like a roundroin? We sit in a room and we have six different people come in to us and they are all rotating. Uh, I think that would be up to council. Um, generally in Florida, they're public. >> Yes, they would have to.
>> Okay. So, just like this, this would be and all five of us would be interviewing each candidate at one time. >> Okay. >> Are they closed to the public or open to the public? Obviously, it's a obviously it's a public meeting being televised, but is there people in the audience?
>> It would be open to the public. >> Um, public comment would be accepted. Um, however, as to whether or not it's televised, that's that's not a requirement under Florida law. >> Okay, >> understood. >> And okay, Madam Chair, if I'm not mistaken, I'm I know I'm not mistaken,
the last ones we did were public and they were all virtual. >> Yes, because it was during CO. >> It was right prior to >> Well, it was during CO. It was in >> No, all of them. I take that back. >> Several of them were virtual. There were things, >> right? We had some in person.
>> There was some in person. Yeah, >> but they were all public. >> All public. >> And and >> didn't start until March of 20. >> Yeah. >> Right. >> So they were all public. They um some were virtual via Zoom. I remember that.
>> And there was no public comment concerning. We all had the same questions. Whatever questions we asked. >> Yes. We had >> every candidate had the same questions. >> We had a pre we predetermined questions we would ask. >> Correct. So everyone got to ask the same questions
>> individually. That was a decision we made independently or it was a collective decision we made as questions to ask. >> We had a slate of questions that we said you do one through three. I'll do whatever. >> Okay. Is that a >> at the workshop when we present the
slate. We'll work with you to develop questions. We'll actually prepare a script for you to follow. We recommend that that first round you ask the same questions to each candidate. Uh and then the second round you would you would have an opportunity perhaps for the
candidate to make a presentation to you. We you determine the topic uh and then uh you would ask questions regarding the presentation. Then you might ask follow-up questions from the first round. You might then also identify specific questions to a
specific candidate when you get to that second round and then perhaps allow uh maybe up to 20 minutes to a half hour for the candidate to ask you questions which is that when that gets down to that that second round and that can
almost be like the first day on the job depending on who you select. >> Okay. So, where do we need to pick a date? >> Back to the date of >> March. >> Yes. >> You need a March date. >> Yes. We're looking at the week of March,
>> first or second? Yes. So, it's >> close to spring break. >> Well, we have the first two weeks of March open and then the third week of March will be our spring break. So we would be um unavailable >> depending on where we're
>> so the first round of interviews uh we're suggesting the week of March the 2nd and then the follow up with the uh second round of interviews the following week March March the 9th so we we don't want too much time in between >> right >> I would say the third nth
>> third and the nth of March >> March 3rd is okay with me March 9th works for me rest of the board, >> right? >> Yes. I think it's just important for the board to remember we'll probably have a board meeting on the 10th.
>> Yes. >> So, we all know how busy days before board meetings can be. >> Yes. >> So, I just to spend all day in an interview the day before and our staff in an interview the day before a board meeting just I I guess I'm saying it for
awareness because I understanding if our staff is tied up in this Then >> well >> would you prefer to move it to the following well the following week spring break so we don't we don't have a lot of >> we don't have a lot of wiggle room at that time of the year.
>> Well I'm just saying maybe a Wednesday after the board meeting would be a little bit easier to navigate but I just know for me the date like the Monday and then the Tuesday leading into a board meeting seem to always be >> so the 11th is what you're asking. I think the 11th would be more feasible
for Okay, everyone. >> How was the 11th for the rest of the board? >> That's okay. Cummings, right? The 11th 11th. Miss Martinez, >> is the time frame 9 to 12? >> Well, no, it' be like >> I think they said 9 to 4. 9 to5.
>> Whatever you determine at 8:30 to 4:30, 9 to5. >> All day. >> All day. >> All day. >> 9 to5. >> 9 to5. So that's the third and the 11th. >> Yes.
>> Okay. So with that in mind, just to follow along is that after the um last interview obviously then you'll be going and you'll make your selection then uh negotiations will commence. We're looking to target um for public
announcement uh week of March 23. I just have a question from the way it works. If we publicly are having discourse following the semi- finalist interviews and that public discourse
lands at a chosen candidate, is that how that works? at at the end of that second round of interviews, the expectation would be you'd make a conditional selection, >> okay? >> Conditioned on the uh background
investigation, conditioned on negotiations, uh and then you would take action after negotiations to approve a contract at a public meeting. I'm just I guess how do you n and this is maybe a silly question but how do you
then navigate because a public announcement while I can appreciate we would internally publicly announcement announce it once it's board approved what would stop the public from announcing that the board has made a conditional decision and I guess I don't really recall what what happened last
time so excuse my naivveness but if we publicly discuss the conditional hire that then stops the newspaper from reporting that we've chosen a conditional. I mean nothing obviously stops the newspaper. So >> right >> it's all very public.
>> So it becomes very instantly public even though it's a conditional hire. >> That that is why uh initially when we were talking compensation and so forth Florida is a challenge simply because of our statutes that we have to follow.
>> Yeah. If that was the only reason why. Right. Okay, thank you. I just kind of was wondering, I mean, we will obviously have a press release once it's board approved, but everyone will kind of know once we decide on a conditional hire.
>> I ideally uh in the recruitment world, not necessarily Florida, we would prefer to see everything confidential until you're ready to make an announcement. Uh that protects the applicant if the applicant's in a job where uh it could
affect their job. I know they have a great relationship. Uh but that's in Florida. This is how we have to operate. >> Yes, I understand. Thank you just for obliging my questions. And then obviously the last date that's
on there um we're looking at a July 1 start but obviously it's been u mentioned I think here maybe even an earlier start date but that's something um that you can >> well and chair if I can the RFP had an a
timeline that was not this timeline so the RFP's timeline and I'm going based off memory because I I don't have it in front of me, but I see Dr. Campbell's head shaking. The RFP that I chose, I thought ended in January. Um, like we had a candidate in January and
they were taking they were being in office by like April and that was because the board the board articulated a desire to have someone in prior to a budget cycle or at least midstream into budget cycle. And so this timeline is
not reflective of the RFP that we selected. >> I don't have the RFP in front of me, but I can tell you that getting somebody on board for January right now is mission impossible. >> Well,
I I mean, we can pull up the RFP, but I can I know for certain that's what the RFP said. So, the reason that we had that timeline in mind and why we had recommended that timeline was based off of recommendations from the Florida School Boards Association and the team
of superintendents that they've worked with through the years saying that the most appropriate timeline for a new superintendent coming into a school year of say 26 27 would be a few months prior
to the end of that prior year fiscal year so they could be a part of the budgeting conversations and the school staffing plan conversations and all of the things that happen in the spring months ahead of July 1. And so that's why we originally had that timeline. So
while I and I thank you for bringing that up, Dr. James, because that's what I honestly have been sitting here thinking with the march of us having a prospective candidate chosen by then and us potentially not having that person seated until July 1 depending on from
where they come. I don't see how they're going to participate in all the things. That's why I honestly was just sitting here looking up, okay, what did we do in April's work sessions? What did we do in March's work sessions? because we'll have the calendars that are going to be coming before us because calendar
committee will be with the next couple of calendars. We'll have all if we have to change bell times if we have to Sure. Well, yes. Thank you on that. >> Thank you instruction staffing plan, the district staffing model, like all of those decisions we wanted the person to be on board for to
be able to have >> determination in in what that looks like. And so I don't I don't know if there's room for condensing. I I didn't want to like say this at the beginning because I I didn't want to I don't know. I just I think this is not
necessarily reflective of what was in the RFP and we wanted a faster timeline than this. >> I think the contract negotiations to get the firm hired and all that took longer and that might have been on us as a board to not get it on a board meeting. I I don't I don't know. I I think that
that part of it is what shifted this. But Dr. James, I I concur with what your thoughts are. >> Is there any Is there any um area you feel comfortable in tightening the timeline? >> I'm I was looking up the RFP. As I
understand it, the calendar we developed was developed off of the RFP uh which has uh actually has u in an employment piece through December uh 2026.
Uh but we can always tighten a a a timeline, but we get qu asked a question all the time. What's the best time to look for or hire a superintendent? Well, the answer is real simple. When you need a
superintendent, that's when you go out. But if the superintendent could be on board for this the development of the successor budget, that's always helpful. But keep in mind that likely your
successor budget for 2627 uh will already be in terms of staff development welldeveloped by January before January. You as a board will start to look at that in February and and so forth. Uh and then the public
involvement, whatever public involvement you have. Um one of the things that can always be done is start recruitment uh concurrent before we get stakeholder input. The disadvantage of that is not having the
desired characteristics or stakeholder input. Uh so it's it can be adjusted. Um uh but the calendar as I understand it was developed on the RFP. >> You find anything st
>> I have it here. >> Can't hear you. >> Yeah. >> Got to use the mic. >> Sure. We can go we can go down that route but with the approval at September 9th I believe. then we worked in accordingly and uh tried to get in front
of you as soon as possible. So now we are where we are with regard to the time um uh and and to make this happen for you. So based on what was just asked, where can we consolidate? Um I as Bill mentioned, we
can do some things simultaneously if we were to push up and work even faster to get the intake done. Um that's one place we can kind of squeeze things. But I do know how important it is that
your constituency groups are heard and to get enough time out there so that it's done in a way that people can make uh appointments on their on their own calendars to be a part of that engagement phase. I'd be a little leerary of that. Um
and then again the only thing that we could let me look I I guess my question would be why does it take a month to start the interviews and focus group meetings >> again as I said um we can push that up a
little bit. We can consolidate that. However, um in order to identify all of the invitees, to get all of that information out, working in conjunction with your um district team here, and then to adequately promote it, um that's
where we need some time. So, you need at least a week. If anything, you'll save a week here, but that's inconsequential to the quality of the engagement phase that it seems to me that you want to do, that you want to ensure. So there's a little bit of leg work behind that that the
staff participates in um in order to make that happen to do a thorough job. So again, if we you want to buy a week there, we can buy a week there. >> Two weeks. Yeah. And we heard from two board members, but we didn't hear from the others on on the timeline. So let me
give the rest of the board an opportunity to to chime in and see where they fall. Miss Thrower, >> I have a question on the the contract and on our partnership with you. Um, Attorney Powers, is the way the contract
is currently, are we paying in stages, you know, for for phases of this journey? Um, and I'll just explain why I'm asking this question. um you know having been with the district for a really long time and having a pretty
good take and pulse on things uh just through experience um I also understand that there are what I would term journeymen kind of niche
interim superintendent you know they have no interest truly in being a a long-term superintendent their job is to go in and hold steady and then you know move along um to to that next opportunity. And then we have
um other interim superintendents and I think the one sitting to my left is a great example of that very interested in being a candidate, very interested in improving our school system. Um, from
what I've observed and witnessed so far, uh, you know, our current interim superintendent is in it to win it, um, for this district. And as I've been reflecting on this and then looking at the timeline, it's like, what metrics
are we using to evaluate our current interim superintendent? I mean, we're saying that the whatever superintendent we get is going to assume responsibilities July 1st. Well, we all know that most of the time school grades don't even come out till after that
time. And as we continue this conversation, I just see it as being more and more complicated and less and less real world for what we are currently
experiencing as as a district right now. What I am sensing across the schools that I'm that are in my district is people have their eye on the ball. Uh the the work is happening. Our attendance is improving.
Um, and what I don't want to see happen, because I've seen it happen too many times, is that something else outside of the core work begins to grab people's attention. The ones that are supposed to be focused on raising student
performance and improving our district. And when that happens, we shoot ourselves in our own foot because people become distracted. So that's why I asked about this contract and are we paying it in phases
because I think it is super important in in terms of our community to do the focus groups, do the online surveys, get see if the temperature that we get reflects what I'm thinking it might
and then look at the results of that to determine detine our next steps. Will it be to resume a search on a much less compressed timeline based on what we feel was is really important being there
for the budget. You know, the for the full banana. You know, if I was going to be taking on a job as a superintendent, I would want to come in early and stay late. But at the same time, I want to do justice and honor our community's input because we don't have an elected
superintendent right now. So, I think that it would be detrimental to not do the interviews, the focus group meetings, and the online survey. And then let's see how this year ends. Where are we with school grade? You know,
where are we with uh everything? And then determine our next steps. And would that be to offer a contract to the interim superintendent sitting to my left, Dr. Brewer, or to go ahead and and
reopen the process on a timeline that makes sense for what we have determined are our priorities? That's kind of where I'm going with this. >> Sure. >> So, to answer your question, there are three phases that it's broken down into. Um, each of which call for um payment
after that section of phases. There's a planning stock uh stakeholder input phase. There is a recruitment candidate selection phase. Then there's also a candidate interview selection, interview and closeout phase. So those are the phases identified in 3A of the contract.
So it's sort of stages along the way. Yes. >> I just want to say and I appreciate that. That was one of the things that I advocated for when we went through this process was I would like to see phases because I I did feel very impassion that we would get through phase one. And
I would I wanted the board to be able to pause, reflect, and make a a decision from there. And so I'm very grateful to hear board member Thrower's thoughts on this because I'm in complete alignment with that. And I'm to me it's it's either one of two. We're either going to
speed this up and do it right and get someone in here by March or April so that that person can have full authority to make decisions or we're going to do phase one and then we're going to reflect as a board and maybe take it
longer and go from there. And so I I can be on board with either of those, but to me, this particular timeline is not exactly reflective of where I wanted to be if we're bringing someone new into the district. So I appreciate board member Thrower sharing those thoughts
because they are reflective of what I had thought when we had this initial conversation. >> Ron Cummings. Um, Madam Chair, um, when I see this timeline, I hear this conversation, we we are making a major investment um, in getting a
superintendent. We just talked about potentially a compos compensation package of $245, $250,000, which is a huge investment for that position. Um, not not to mention what we
have to pay this company for doing the search. I I just don't feel that this process should be rushed. I think our community deserves for us to do it correctly, the right way, one time. Um, again, it's a
major financial investment. Um, and if we rush this process, I think we'll make um some hasty decisions and and we all know haste makes waste and we want to make sure that we're getting the best candidate forward um for this this this
position. Um I I I like the phase process that we talked about. Um, I think we have people in place right now that are doing an actual actually good job with the district and making sure the district continues to move forward
because no matter what the district can't stop moving no matter how long the process takes. >> And it doesn't. >> And it doesn't. >> And it doesn't. The people are on the ground or doing the work. >> Exactly. So, it's it's to my opinion that we need to um not rush this.
Definitely not rush this. and take our time and make sure that we get the best candidate and we get the best superintendent that we can get. >> Thank you, Reverend Cummings, Dr. Campbell. >> Thank you. Um, and I've again been going back in time and looking at our actual process. So, you are correct on the RFP
timeline as it was presented that what we had was that we were going to have a search firm secured by September 9th and and so the timeline is you guys are fulfilling the obligation of of what that is. But what our recollection, Dr. James, I'm going to go back in time
again. My recollection of the original conversation, we had the first conversation on March 24th about this when FSBA uh gave their presentation and gave us this is how a superintendent search can be conducted. At that time is when we got that information. We as a
board chose to switch gears and not hire a search firm right away and instead chose to go the interim superintendent application process interview. And we switched gears and so by April 17th we had an interim superintendent in place
because that was the priority of the board at the time was not to hire a search firm. And so we took a much longer timeline. I I have all the emails for Mr. Collins, his recommendations, all the things. And when we put out the RFP, it specifically says we would have a firm in place by September 9th, which
is what our contract did. And so all of our original timeline though got changed because of the interim superintendent process. I'll just reference their RFP which which Attorney Powers emailed us on page 85 of the PDF is the is the RFP
timeline which has a superintendent in place April 15th based on the timeline that was in the RFP that um Conrad Thrower and I reviewed. Okay. And I wasn't a part of that process. So, but it's in your email. It's page 85. So, I I just wanted to make sure I wasn't
going crazy, but it does it does have a um all day interviews January 10th, appointment of a superintendent the week of January 19th, and a start date of April 15th, which was more in line with the thought pattern, which again for me as someone who was making a decision.
This was based on prior board conversation as a whole board. This was the focus of the board at that time was we want to just get this done. We want to move quickly. we want to make a decision prior to getting into major decisions, you know, in the spring. So, I'm can be completely on board with
after phase one of this and the community input, the board takes a takes a pause. We re-evaluate and go from there. I'm completely on board with that. Um, but I think then future casting meetings that we may very well then want to delay or whatever
needs to be discussed and considered as well. >> Okay. Yes, Mr. And again, I think it's only fair that whatever superintendent uh or interim superintendent we have with us currently needs to have a chance to run the course, you know, and to see what the
outcomes are. Um, and you know, live and learn, right? It's it's evidently not really going to be possible without being very very hasty, which I'm hearing from the rest of the board is that we're not comfortable with to be able to meet that
original RFP deadline. So, it is what it is. Um, something that's encouraging is that we may very well get much more participation and authentic feedback by doing the focus groups, doing the surveys. you know, how's everybody think
it's going, you know, um, and then take it from there. >> Okay. Any other comments from the board? >> Okay, Dr. Campbell, >> just so I'm clear. So, I'm going to review, >> right? Just so I'm clear. So what we're
saying right now is we certainly have put some placeholders in line for dates for those things that would be in phase two and three potentially but what we're saying right now is that we are fully comfortable with move forward moving forward with with the phase one and then
at phase one we want to evaluate correct >> and my question to attorney powers from a contractual obligation do we have the ability to say at phase one we're ending the contract if that I mean if that's the direction of the board I'm I'm just
I I don't know how that works because I mean they have a full contract for the full gamut and if we say we don't want to continue this process and we're good with what we've got. I mean that's all hypothetical certainly. >> Yeah. I'm I'm would need to get with Mr.
Collins because he's the one that started with the drafting of the RFP and ensure that our answers match on that because um he's got different considerations than I do. Sure. >> Okay. But that's what I'm hearing from that. We're wanting to say go through
phase one. Absolutely. Community groups, our interviews with our all the things that we you need to do with us in phase one. And once we get that community feedback and we'll see what that looks like, then we'll have additional conversation at
that point. Mer, >> one of my biggest reasons for saying this is that we were very clear as a board that April 15th, I think, uh, was a date for every good reason, you know, to give whoever is our superintendent, you know, the the right starting point
in in our collective opinions to to best position them for success. You know, that's what we try to do for each and every child. It shouldn't be any different for each and every superintendent. So, that's where I am. >> Okay. And in in general, I will refer you to
um it would be page three of our contract item number eight, term and termination. So, um essentially, yes, we can we can use a um we pay for services that we would actually use, but I'll let
that conversation evolve amongst the board and and I'll talk to uh Mr. Collins regarding that as well. >> Okay. Thank you, Attorney Powers. Yes, Mr. Adams. >> As you consider uh the timeline,
obviously it's whatever timeline you, the board, decide. Uh the RFP we responded to did not have those earlier dates in it. I I don't know the document that that uh you're looking at, but I'm talking about the the one that was
advertised that that we responded to. uh we can always uh adjust timelines. Uh you you need to at least we believe be clear at the end of the stakeholder
engagement process as to where you're going at that time. It's going to be very difficult to recruit applicants if well the board may or may not hire a superintendent from outside. The board may decide to uh stay internally.
Typically when we have internal candidates um two things happen. We treat internal candidates the same as any other candidate and if the um information gathered shows that the inca internal candidate was the best
candidate uh then that also gives uh credence to that person being the best person out there that that could be found. Um, as far as the start date, um, sure there's an advantage of the person starts before July 1. Typically, most
superintendent searches we do, the person starts when the fiscal year begins. Um, but there are advantages to having been on board before that. And that's a decision you you'll make at that time. Things can be compressed. Also, keep in mind that uh, most
superintendents have a contractual responsibility. uh and it may require 60 90 days, six months. Uh all of that becomes part of negotiations uh when you you start
moving dates around. Um and yeah, some things can be compressed. Uh generally we like 45 days minimum to recruit. Uh beyond 60 days doesn't yield a whole lot. Uh it's been done in 30 days. um uh
that there are considerations that that can all all be taken, but always keep in mind whatever date you're looking at, there's some kind of notice requirement unless it's someone from within. So, uh I'm taking from what we've heard,
we're not to post this position beginning >> the date. Yeah, I think I think the board is in agreeance that we want to go through phase one. We want to get all of the stakeholder input and then we want to pause to reconvene ourselves um and
and discuss that what what you receive. >> To his point though, phase one encompasses the posting the position, the initial posting which is supposed to occur next week. So I think what they're getting clarification on is are we skipping step one of phase one? Yeah, we're we're just asking for
clarification. Are we to post a position or not to post a position? >> I my preference would be in line with Chair Conrad, which is to hold off on posting the position. Let's involve our community and then move forward. But obviously, we need three board members
to agree to that. So, >> I I just don't want to waste anyone's time. And so, to me, that's what that's what I'm thinking. Um, I I think it's valuable for us to to collect information from our community first and
then make that determining factor. But I'll hear from the rest of the board, Dr. Campbell. So with that in mind, then if we were to receive the information, then on December 1, which is when we're talking about having the characteristics
presented to the board, we could potentially make a determination then to open the position on December 2nd and then the application deadline being January 30th. I'm just trying to see how we get back in this timeline if we make a decision to. And
so is a two-month window sufficient enough through the holidays for us to have a position open? I know that right now the timeline would have four months. >> Yeah, it it certainly from a recruitment standpoint is there. We like to get the position out there as soon as possible
to get people to think about it uh even though we're not formally recruiting. So we we will lose that you know roughly seven weeks to eight weeks uh as a result of doing nothing between now and then other than focusing on engagement which would would be where we'd be
focusing anyway. Typically uh our protocol would be after we leave this meeting based on having a a range of compensation would be to post it within several days uh so that it's out there on our website which gets as I said
roughly 25,000 hits a month. Uh so we would we would lose that but uh we would still have the normal what I would call the normal recruitment period if you make a decision uh at that December meeting. Are you still comfortable with that, Dr.
K? >> As as long as we're comfortable as a board with the potential of having two months instead of four months of people being aware of this position being open if if that and I mean I'm I'm fine with that. And I just want to make sure everybody else is whenever we're talking about the difference. Uh because if we
make a determination December 1st that we want to get back in this timeline, I just want to make sure that it can continue on this timeline and we don't have to actually change the dates even further. >> Mr. >> I hope we don't have to get back in on this timeline because it's not the one that we really
>> wanted >> um which is a going to take a completely different conversation. So for today as you shared chair appears we're in consensus for this next step and then go from there.
>> Okay. Anything further from the board? >> No. Okay. All right. Mr. Adams, do you feel comfortable with the conversation where we've landed? >> Well, we we have to be. >> Okay. Well,
>> I am I still am looking forward to our partnership as we uh move forward and get community input um and and from other members in our community. So, I'm looking forward to that. Well, we're looking forward to moving uh with that step and uh we'll begin to do that
immediately and uh uh we'll work with obviously we have that next meeting scheduled uh already and we'll go from there and and uh as we come into that meeting we'll uh also have continue to look at calendar to see uh if there are
any any ways to adjust given the complexities of of the whole situation. Uh that's all we have on our agenda unless you have any other questions for us. >> Okay. Any other questions from the board? Oh, Mr. >> It's not a question. I just really want
to say thank you so much. Um I continue to be a thousand% confident that we have the right people standing in front of us to help guide us through this. We've only been through one appointed superintendent so far. Um as a board, we
go deep. We deliberate. We reflect. we get more information. We try really hard to listen to our our constituents and our school community um and do our best to to make the best decision. Um so I
just wanted to to share that it's I have a lot of gratitude and and appreciation for your years of experience and what you do and the twists and turns that these kinds of things can take. So thank you. >> Thank you. I too want to say thank you very much.
Thank you for being here with us this morning. Thank you for your presentation and also your patience as we work through all the audio challenges this morning. So thank you very much and I look forward to hearing from you soon. >> Yes. Thank you.
>> Okay board with that um it is 11:30. I would >> public comment. >> Oh is there any public comment? Goodness gracious. Is there any public comment? Okay, what >> that's what to say.
>> Okay, >> with that we're going to take a quick recess. It is uh we're going to recess at 11:31. Thank you. come back from recess. It is 11:42. Our next item 5.1 look up Marion and I
believe Miss Beth McCall is coming to visit with us this morning. Good morning. She's not quite to the podium yet. >> Good morning. >> Beth McCall, 1714 Southeast 28th Street, Ocala, Florida.
And before I start this, please know that with my hat with the C, anything that we can help with the search for surveys and focus groups, we are here to help you. So, um, I am here today to talk about Look Up Marion. put the phone
down campaign. Uh the mission of the Maring County Children's Alliance is to improve the lives of Marian County children. One of the main focuses is to bring organizations together that deal with our children. And this has gone on since we were founded in 2000 to when
there are problems or issues that arise with our children, we convene those organizations or we come up with a plan to help be a part of the solution. So, uh, this campaign, the look up Marian,
put the phone down campaign originated during our January general meeting of the Marian County Children's Alliance. We normally have 60 to 80 people at that meeting depending on what the topic is. In January, we decided to
turn that meeting into a focus group. And one of the topics was what are the priority issues in 2005 25 that we need to address that affect our children and
youth in Marian County. The number one issue at every single table was the mental health of our children and youth because of social media and screen time. So
with that a committee was formed from those u the CEOs of those groups uh that were there at that meeting and the committee was formed and it was made up of members of this these organizations the Boys and Girls Club,
Kimberly Center, the Pearl Project, NAMI Interfaith, Harlo's Helping Hands, the Public Education Foundation, and Marian County Public Schools and many other community leaders. The committee decided to run an initiative to encourage our
community to put down the phone and engage with loved ones and friends. The lookup Maryann put the phone down campaign was created. And I have to tell you that Casey Griffith and Megan Magamal have been a very big part of this committee and have helped
tremendously in engaging with the schools. The legislation was passed to eliminate phones in elementary and middle schools and I am hearing that it is already having a positive impact and I want to
say thank you to the Florida legislature for taking this very bold and courageous step. The Children's Alliance and the partners want to take that step just a bit further and promote a a a day for
our community to put down the phones and engage with family and friends. We all know that our screens are here to stay, but let's moderate that use and let's really begin engaging with our families.
So, this campaign is in two parts. You have a rat card, the put down the phone day which is going to be November 15th. It has been created to provide ideas on things to do in Marian con and Marian
County. Uh we have a website look up Marian which is here which goes live on Monday the 6th. Um, where are my notes? Uh, with that
website, there is a guide, a resource guide on the website that has lots lots of information uh for helpful tips and and healthy screen use. We also have the other
handout that you have is a pledge. The pledge is for families to use. This is not to get back to us. This is to make our families accountable for putting their phone down and engaging.
The website has resources. We have partnered with many. You will see on this uh rack card all of the partners that we have partnered with. on the website is all of the city and county park and recreation information, library
information, uh where they can look to see what else is going on in Marian County. What can I do? You know, there's a lot of parents who who really don't know what to do a lot of times with their children other than their screens. So, we're hoping that this becomes a
day, an annual day to make people think about other things to do. The QR code on the rat card will take you directly to that website and there is tremendous tremendous information. It's live on
Monday. Everything goes live on Monday. The second part of the campaign will be the look up Marian Summit on December the 3 o'clock at this College of Central Florida Klein
Center. Now, I know some of you will be at FSBA conference, but that is the normal day of our alliance meeting. So, we wanted to be sure that that date stayed the same. So, nationally known speaker Mandy Hammond of Screentorm will
talk uh on kids brains and screens and the morning breakfast 8:00 meeting will be for our community, for parents, for community leaders, for business leaders with my C hat on. I talk to businesses
all the time that say, "We just want to hire people that can look us in the eye, that know how to have a handshake, and that know how to have a conversation with words
instead of this." So, it's a big problem, not just with our family engagement, but with our whole community. So, nationally known speaker Mandy Hammond of Screen Storm, she will talk and then we're hoping that later
that morning she can get in front of some of our middle school students and be videoed to later to hopefully later use um with our secondary students. She is nationally known. Screen Strong is a
nationally known organization that are experts in this field. So, we're working with Miss Adele Nodal and Megan Magal and Casey Griffith to really get this all put together so that it fits into your guidelines
uh but that it can be useful possibly used during your habitudes time. The next part of it will be the Golden Apple Teacher Academy will be hosting a workshop with Miss Hammond in the afternoon and Megan is already working with her on what does that look like?
All of this brought to you by the Children's Alliance at no cost to you. So, we would ask that you encourage schools to participate by placing our yard signs, which I have for you as
well. Um, at their schools and asking them to uh go to the website, asking parents to go to the website to look for resources. I think when you see the resources that are on the lookup Marian website, you would encourage
parents to go to that uh put it up on their marquee the week of November 15th so that they will know to put down their phone. We will also share a flyer that you can use on the flyer that is on your screen now that you can post on Peach
Jar. Again, that QR code goes directly to the Lookup Marian website. So, we hope you will join the Marian County Children's Alliance and community partners for Lookup Marion. Put down the phone. Help us take a stand for our
kids, our health, and our community one unplugged moment at a time. And I'll take any questions at all. And we do have signs for you and Casey can get them all to you. >> Great. Thank you very much, Miss McCall. And for waiting all morning long to give
us this wonderful message. Board, you have anything you'd like to share, comment, question that you for Miss McCall? >> Go ahead, Miss Thrower. >> Yes, thank you. This is something that when you were on the board with us, we started championing and championing
that we all know that all of us are on our phones way too much and it's so distracting for instruction and everything else. So, thank you for making this into a a bright campaign. And this kind of seems ironic, but I just put the date in my phone.
>> So, so the um the county is working tremendously with us with us. The sheriff has given us all of his PSA times. I have seen the PSA. We've got just a tweak to it. It's pretty powerful and sends a very good message. So,
you'll start seeing that. So you'll start seeing uh a lot of information starting Monday. >> Great. >> Looking forward to that. Anything else? >> Yes. >> The pledge. Um is this something that the campaign is willing to provide to
schools for the schools to distribute to students? >> Absolutely. And it is digital. Uh it is on the website and it is digital, but we can certainly supply. We can have as many printed as as you would like, but it is on the website for them to use.
>> So, it has a landing page on the website that can be completed and submitted on Okay. The pledge >> that they can that they can print off. Yes. So, they can do it on their phone, you know, and it's just the pledge was designed to get
>> students and families talking about alternatives. So, that's what it is. >> Well, and I'm I'm just thinking, Dr. emperor, is there a way um or maybe Mr. White House, is there a way we can integrate this conversation in the weeks leading into November 15th into home
room or into bell work or a subject area so that we could then have the students pull it up on their Chromebook because they all have a device um and potentially um make their own personal decision to make the pledge in class. They can pull it up. We can have it
printed off. We can supply it for Peach Jar. Whatever you would like us to do with that, we certainly can. >> Yes. >> I thank you, Miss McCall. Thank you. Um, we have every single principal we speak to in middle school just that's the first thing they say is what a
difference this year has been has the change with the students not getting off the bus with the phone, not constantly walking the halls with the phone. So we we're just so grateful and we're looking forward to the success of those students this year based on that and so this campaign just brings it into the house
where where we know it's needed. We're all guilty and so I fully comm I will commit to this. >> So thank you. >> Thank you all so much. >> Thank you. >> Thank you Miss McCall. Super excited about this. >> We are too and uh be looking for more.
We're focusing, of course, right now on the 15th. Registration for the uh lookup summit will also be on this landing page. There's going to be lots of information on this page. >> And what's the cost for the summit? >> It's uh $20. >> Yes.
>> And if someone wanted to get in the community, wanted to get a yard sign, where would they go? >> So, they can uh go to the website and let me know or I can certainly supply uh my information. They can contact me at the Marian County Children's Alliance
and I will give that email right now. Executive Director Children'salliance.org. >> Right. Thank you very much. >> Thank you. >> Yes. All right. Do we have any public
comment? >> Okay. All right. Thank you very much, Miss McCall. All right. Dr. Brewer, do you want to do with a intro for our next item? >> Yes. Um, Mr. White House will provide the introduction. This was a requested
item by the board um, a few months ago and or just a month ago actually, and not only are is he going to introduce our other team members here today to provide the presentation, but he has been in the field speaking to the gifted teachers. Um, and so I he's ready for
the presentation and then we know that we will probably have extra questions that we will need to address after the >> Good morning, Mr. White House. >> Good morning. Thank you, Dr. Brewer, board chair, board members. We are here to provide you with an overview of our
gifted program services for Marian County Public Schools and also talk about at the end some of our next steps for how we're going to continue to grow the program. So with me today, this is certainly not a oneman operation. Miss Ivet Don Doll with mental health and wellness and Miss
Annie Williams Jones with ESC are here to share some information as well. Uh while gifted services lies under the umbrella of ESC, it certainly is a partnership between these departments um and all of our schools to make sure that we are screening, identifying, and then
providing services for our students. So Florida defines a gifted student as a student with superior intellectual development and capable of high performance. The eligibility for gifted is laid out within state statute and in
Florida administrative code which is listed there for you. Eligible students have what is called an educational plan or an EP developed once they've been identified for gifted services. Um, and those must be reviewed every three years according to state rule and four years
once they hit nth grade. Our special programs that are available in the state of Florida can include consultation services, special classes, or pull out or pushin programs. So, here you'll see the Florida plan for gifted education. The state of Florida
has their own plan laid out on the Department of Education website uh which sets a focus for school districts to ensure the high expectations and achievement for our gifted learners. It's broken down into seven different areas and districts develop their plan
around these seven areas and provide assurances that we are going to meet all of these. So that includes a system for screening and identifying our gifted students, a continuum of service models with an acceleration plan, development of meaningful education plans for those students, guidance and counseling
strategies to provide emotional support for those students, monitoring to ensure student progress, professional development for our gifted education um teachers and staff, and a system for evaluating our gifted services. So our presentation today is going to outline
each of those seven areas so that you can see how Marian County is addressing those asurances. So to start, I just want to provide you with basic statistics for Marian County Public Schools. So currently we have 4.7% of our total enrollment are
identified as gifted and talented. Uh if you were to compare that to the state or national statistics, the US Department of Education estimates that roughly 5% of students nationally are serviced as a gifted and talented student. And in Florida, that statistic is also roughly
5% of all students in the state of Florida are identified. So you'll see that we are within that threshold of expectation for gifted students here in Maring County. And now I will turn it over to Miss Del Nodal who's going to talk about the first part of those asurances which is
the screening identification process. >> Good. I've got about 30 seconds of >> Good morning. >> So morning um I'm going to speak to screening and identification procedures for gifted programming. As you can see on the slide, um students can be
nominated um for a gifted evaluation um or we can also use a universal screening procedure. We have in the past a universal screener for all second grade students was instituted at 10 elementary schools during a pilot program in the spring of 2023.
The instrument used was the Nagliier General Abilities Test or ENGAT. Um, this universal screener was then administered to all second grade students across all elementary schools during the 2023 24 school year and the 2024 25 school year. Students meeting
the required score were then referred for further evaluation to determine eligibility for gifted services. Outside of the universal screener, students may be nominated for gifted screening and evaluation as well. Following a nomination from a teacher or a parent,
school counselors obtain parent permission for screening procedures. This includes sensory screenings to rule out any vision or hearing issues that may impact testing as well as the administration of the Kaufman brief intelligence test second edition revised
known as the kit 2R. Based on the obtained score, a referral for psychological evaluation is submitted for these eligible students. The referral includes documentation of parent consent for the evaluation, a statement of need from the students
teacher and a completed indicators of giftedness teacher observations form or IGTU. We love to create acronyms and names for stuff. The IKU was designed to collect information regarding gifted characteristics observed in the school
setting. Information is obtained from multiple sources to include the students teacher or teachers, special area teachers, and other instructional staff with knowledge of and experience working with the student. Once completed, the referral for evaluation is submitted to
the mental health and wellness department. Following receipt of the notification that a referral for evaluation has been completed and submitted, the school psychologist begins the testing process. Psychological testing for consideration
of gifted eligibility has a 90-day timeline, meaning we have 90 school days from the time the parent consent has been obtained to complete the testing. This is excluding published district breaks such as spring break, um, winter break, summer, etc. A psychological
report is drafted which provides referral information, testing observations, test scores, and interpretations. The completed psychological report is submitted and notification is provided to the exceptional student education specialist or ESSE specialist.
Following review of the submitted documentation for compliance purposes, the ESE specialist will schedule an eligibility meeting where the ESSE committee, which is comprised of those present at the meeting, will review scores and referral information to determine if the student has met
criteria for gifted eligibility. It's important to note that according to Florida's definition, gifted eligibility criteria includes documentation of a need for special education programming, documentation of a majority of characteristics of giftedness
um according to a standard scale or checklist, and a documentation of superior intellectual development as measured by an intelligence quotient of two standard deviations or more above the mean of an individually administered
standardized test of intelligence. Next up, we're going to talk about models. >> I'm not sure if it's still morning or afternoon. Afternoon. I think we're >> Yes, >> we're we're on the verge. So, good afternoon. Um today I'm going to talk to you a little bit about how we serve the
students who are actually identified for gifted services. When you look at our elementary models, we primarily use a pullout model for instruction. That means that on a designated day, students would go to visit the gifted teacher and
spend the day working on those gifted standards um and those gifted um items that are identified in their educational plan. This year we've looked at the needs of our students and in talking with
building administrators so and try to minimize the number of students that are on buses for gifted. So this year instead of having all of our students travel, we actually have some of our gifted teachers that are traveling. So in some of our schools we have um
full-time gifted teachers because the number of students allow for those services. Many of our stu our gifted teachers however are serving multiple schools based on the numbers and to ensure that each student has access to a
gifted endorsed teacher. So this year we will have for example a teacher that is serving two schools but instead of the students traveling this principles at those buildings have set aside dedicated space for gifted services and so those
teachers are ser traveling to those campuses to maximize the amount of time that students have access to them and minimize the amount of time that students are spending traveling on our buses. So
as you look at the services that we are providing for our elementary students um the instruction is grade level aligned emphasizing critical thinking, creativity and self-regulation. In addition to the direct services that are provided to our students, there are also
some students who receive um consultation. In a consultation model, the gifted teacher is consulting with the gened classroom teacher to talk about ways in which enrichment activities can be provided, but that student is not receiving a direct
service from the teacher. This year we've been really uh pleased to be able to offer enrichment services um in partnership with our gifted teachers on our elementary campuses. As Miss Nadal talked about the screening
process that we've used at second grade for the last couple of years, we noticed that we were identifying a lot of very academically talented students who were not qualifying for the gifted program
based on their actual scores. And so the thought was how do we provide a little bit of extra for these students so that if they have a referral at a later date um perhaps they might qualify at that
time. But also because we know that these students are already demonstrating high academic performance. We wanted to have ways in which to continually engage those students in the learning process because we know that they're already performing at a high level. And so
our elementary schools each have a day in which GR enrichment services are provided to students who um can be teacher nominated but also who are students who may have been tested for gifted in the past and not qualified.
And so although they're not using explicitly the gifted um EP as guidance, they are looking at those gifted areas that are identified by the state and using project-based learning and other supports to increase the academic
engagement of these students through an enrichment process. So when we get to our secondary programs for gifted, starting with middle school, um the services shift from the pull out model
to actually being able to offer courses with a gifted designation. So, all of our middle schools have gifted courses um that are available for students with a gifted course code. Um most of those
courses are in science um and social studies including civics and world history. And so um in providing this information to me um Belleview Middle offers um all science and then including
civics and and advanced um history. Danell and middle um all the sciences, earth science, life science and physical science have a gifted course code um for Fort King, US history, civics and then advanced US history. Uh, Fort McCoy,
world history, civics advanced in US history. Um, Howard Middle, um, world history, civics advanced, and then physical science. Lake Middle, Earth Science, Life Science, and Physical Science. Liberty Middle, World History
and Civics Advanced. North Marian Middle, World History Advanced Civics. and they actually have um an English one honors 8th grade that has a gifted course code designation. And then at Oyola Middle, Earth science, advanced
science, um civics advanced, and then physical science. And so as you look at how we support students in middle school, um there starts to be the competition with um if they're a uh Cambridge school, their course
offerings. if they're um at a um an IB school, there are course offerings. And so there is an opportunity for those students that we know are academically talented and those who are identified as gifted to have a broader array of what's
available than in middle than in elementary school. However, these campuses do offer for those students who are interested in taking them these courses that actually have a gifted course code designation. And so those aren't determined by the district. Those
are determined by each school looking at the staff that they have and then the supports that they're able to provide in that area. Can I is it possible for me to just make a quick statement if that's okay? I
what you just said and I because I want to capture what you just said. What you just said was that the delivery model is decided on based on the staff we have at a school site. >> Principles get to make the scheduling
decisions at the secondary level. Yes, >> I would argue the delivery model as with all ESSE students should be framed around the unique needs and abilities of the student that we are servicing. We would never we would never
programmatically develop units around the certifications of a ESSE teacher on the other end of the spectrum on a campus. We would look at the students who are zoned at a school and then maybe we place a hub unit and
transport students in and then hire the qualified educator for that group of students, right? And so I struggle with the philosophy that we are determining
the delivery model based on the expertise of the teachers currently on campus. Uh and if if I missed out on clarity on that, I'm sure there are board members who would be willing to fill in the gap for me. But
that is my struggle and I apologize for interjecting but I wanted to capitalize on the statement you said because I I knew I would get lost in it by the end. So thank you for for allowing the interjection. And so to to offer some additional clarification on that when
you look at a gifted certified teacher or and and actually it's a gifted endorsed teacher because there's not truly a certification for gifted like there is a teacher certification. A gifted endorsement is an add-on. So, a teacher has a certification in science
or math or history or whatever that content is, especially as we're talking about secondary and then that teacher goes through the additional coursework. It's 15 hours for that endorsement which allows them to be then considered a
gifted teacher and then teach students who have a gifted designation. So, I can't speak for building principles because I don't hire their staff and that's outside my scope. But what I do know is that in having conversations
about gifted supports at middle school, there are not as many gifted endorsed teachers along with the content area. And so those are conversations that are going to be above decisions that I could
make about how as a district we're able to then support hiring more gifted endorsed teachers at the middle school level um potentially high school level. Um making some incentives for being for teachers going back to get that. But
then also the reality of looking at schedules on a high school campus or a middle school campus and determining how many students would actually then be signing up for those classes um and then looking at those teaching case loads. So to your point, Dr. James, I absolutely
understand what you're saying. I think some of it though um is driven by the availability of the appropriately endorsed staff to provide instruction with gifted designation across content if that's helpful.
>> Yeah, and I agree. I think the point I'm making is we would never make that determination on the other end of the spectrum. Like we would never we would never lead with that we would never lead with that delivery model on the other end of the spectrum. So, if we're not doing that on the other end of the spectrum, why are we then doing it on
the this end of the spectrum? So, um, and I think that's going to lead into the further conversation we're going to have as a board about delivery model in the secondary realm, at least middle school. But, um, yeah, Mr. White House, >> I do just want to interject. While
providing students a course with a gifted endorsed teacher is a way that we can provide gifted services, the state also endorses an acceleration model in general to provide students who are gifted and talented that acceleration in those particular areas. So when we have
those EP meetings, having conversations around where is the strength of that student and what is the best need for them academically at that school, which could be taking civics with a gifted endorsed teacher or it could be placing a sixth grader into algebra 1 as a high
school course. Doesn't have to be a gifted endorsed teacher, but does provide them that acceleration piece that they need based on their specific skills. >> There are other options beyond those two though. >> Yes. that we have yet to explore as a
district. >> So clarify because the options are consultation, special courses or push in or pull out models. >> Correct. But special courses not specific to a content area. you could have an elective the gifted
delivery model that I received as a gifted student not in this district was an elective course in middle school that was unique and defined for gifted learners where we did stock trading and built robots and did all kinds of really cool problem solving puzzle-like
skill-based projects to expand all kinds of gifted learners brains. I didn't like science. I have a liberal arts degree. I didn't like math. I didn't take math beyond statistics at the community college when I was in high school because I don't
like math. So, math and science enrichment would have been lost on me as a middle school student. And I'm not a unique learner in that way. There are a lot of students similar to me. So there are other ways in which we can expand our delivery model to include a gifted
elective that would be more appropriate and modeling after what we do in elementary because in fifth grade students are going to a pullout model where they spend all day in a classroom learning in unique ways and then we go to secondary and it's like over the summer now all of a sudden that's no
longer appropriate and what is appropriate is algebra 1 for a sixth grader. So, I I don't disagree, but I'll also add into that that the need is driven by the desire of the students. They want to do because they're a part of that EP conversation. And the vast majority of
our middle school students, they're not interested in taking a course that's just gifted. They're already focused on what they want to do in high school and beyond. And we have so many opportunities our middle schools through our CTE programs, through our advanced high school programs, dual enrollment opportunities for students that so
choose that route that we couldn't simply say we're going to place these students in there. We really work with what is the need of the student. And I think if you talk with middle school students, most of them would prefer to take a health science course. They would prefer to take an agriculture course. they would prefer to take high school
classes that they can get a leg up on moving themselves forward than simply taking a gifted class in itself. >> Well, the option hasn't been presented. So, I wouldn't want any of us to presume what middle schoolers would do since we have failed to offer the option.
>> Certainly. >> Oh, I have a lot, but we'll wait till the end. Thank you. >> All right. So when we look at the service delivery model that we have in our high schools, that is primarily a consultation model where our gifted teachers are meeting
directly with the individual students to support um the academic needs, questions that they may have. A lot of my conversation with high school gifted teachers about the ways in which they support um center around those social
emotional needs of some of our gifted students. Um there is an assumption that our gifted students are always our highest performers especially when they get to high school and that is simply not the case for a variety of reasons.
oftent times students are less motivated because the work is easy for them and so they haven't developed some of those um strong skills which allow them to demonstrate actually what it is that they know and
so having opportunities for the gifted teachers to actually meet with them to talk about what their goals and their interests are and he help to keep them connected to the school environment so they actually are motivated to finish because they sometimes lack the why. You
know, I can take my SATs and get a, you know, a 1,200. Why am I coming to this class every day to do this work? And so that is a lot of what our gifted teachers at the high school level spend is in that dialogue with students, helping them to understand the why and
create those goals for their future. So when we look at the development of the educational plans um the team members are obviously um going to be the parents and guardians their import uh impact is very important um at least
one regular education teacher gifted teacher the ESSE specialist and then the student when appropriate. The components of the educational plan is to set measurable goals that are aligned with the student strengths. Determine
services and supports whether that's enrichment or acceleration. Specify how and where the services will be delivered and include parent input and concerns. Often what we will see on the educational plans in addition to an
academic focus is really a focus on social emotional development. um when we look at our uh very talented students who are often very perfectionistic or who have difficulty working with a group because I don't want to work in a group with people who aren't as smart as me
because my work's not going to be correct. And so those are some of the social and emotional skills um that are targeted as part of the educational plan to just help our students become more rounded well-rounded. So when we look at the guidance and
counseling strategies and these are things that are in alignment um with what the state recommends. It's not counseling services per se um but really looking at academic and and resiliency guidance. Um looking to help students
understand how to address perfectionism, anxiety, and underachievement. um support the development of study skills, time management, and self- advocacy. Um and so our school counselors um at all levels do a really good job as
serving as a liaison between um families, teachers, and gifted staff. And the school counselors are also going to support transition between the grade levels. Um they work in conjunction um with the gifted and ESSE staff to
maintain accurate records rel related to gifted referrals and services and to assist in tracking student progress and service delivery. So when we're looking at monitoring student progress, um there are variety
of data points that are used to be able um to keep a pulse on how our student gifted students are um are functioning. Consultation logs um which are maintained by our gifted teachers really look at the students progress towards
those goals that are on the educational plan. Um there is also teacher collaboration. Um it is very important that our gifted teachers and our GED classroom teachers are in constant communication. Um students are missing a full day of academics when they go to
gifted services although there's no penalty and they are not required to make up the work that they're when they're missed. These are highly anxious kids who want to be able to do everything. And so sometimes ensuring that there is that collaboration between
the classroom teachers and the gifted teachers to make sure that students are comfortable, that they aren't missing assignments, and that there is a connection between the work that they're doing in the two settings is important. um student check-ins um to look at uh
assess engagement, well-being and academic progress um of students um progress monitoring um in gifted courses um which is looking at the subjects based instruction through assessments and progress based learning and then EP
goal alignment. Um Mr. White House talked about earlier how it is um every three years that we you know are statutoily required to revise the EP. But there may be things that are happening um at any gi moment in time
where a parent or a teacher can request a meeting to come back and take a look at those goals that are on the educational plan um to ensure that the student is getting the maximum benefit from those gifted services. for professional development. Um the
gifted resource teacher at the district works closely um with the school-based gifted teachers. Um there is a yearly gifted calendar for professional learning um that um is in place. There are typically two professional learning
opportunities per quarter. Um in addition to that um there are uh different speakers that come in. We work with them um on the other side of the ESC house on things like using um the
peer platform appropriately um support and writing appropriate goals and looking at that. Um we have um a contract with the um project-based learning um which is an opportunity all
of our gifted teachers have um access and get the weekly emails. It really focuses on project-based learning at times. They offer professional learning opportunities to our gifted teachers as well. Um so um the key offerings that
they provide are critical thinking exercises, STEM challenges, writing and literacy prompts, career exploration and SEAL resources. So these are things that are regularly provided for our gifted teachers.
So in evaluating gifted services, um it really looks at student progress monitoring, teacher feedback and collaboration, um access review, um analyzing that referral data, making sure that we are actually capturing those students who
may benefit from gifted supports, um professional development impact, and then an annual program review. Um, our gifted resource teacher spends a lot of time getting input and collaborating
with our gifted teachers so that each year we are better prepared to meet the needs of our gifted teachers so that they are then better able to meet the needs of our gifted students. So the next steps um we're really looking to strengthen our
identification. Part of the state emphasis is on identifying students who are in underrepresented groups. And just for clarification purposes, when we look at underrepresented students, we're not talking about identification based on
race. under identification under identified groups are based on SEAL, I mean on socioeconomic status and um limited language proficiency. Um and so
that is a big area where we need to improve our identification. Um ensuring that our screening tools are accurately measuring what we're hoping the outcomes to be. Miss Nad Del Nadal talked about
um the three years that we've invested in the um online screening. Uh the reality is that we haven't identified as many students as we would have hoped for the investment that we had in that mass screening at second grade. So looking to
fine-tune so that once we implement a screening tool that for those students who make it past the screening, we have a better opportunity for those students to actually be identified as gifted and then to receive those services. Um
enhancing our program design and delivery. Um really looking at the frameworks to make sure that our gifted courses and our gifted experiences for students um are rigorous and to increase
the enrichment opportunities for our high achieving and talented students. Um the last area is really looking at improving curriculum and instruction um align making sure that um our gifted instruction is aligned with state
standards. um increasing the incorporation of projectbased interdisiplinary and inquirydriven learning and to provide differentiated curriculum that supports depth, complexity, and acceleration. And so I'm going to turn it over to Dr.
Brewer for any comments that she has before we open it up to the board for their questions and comments. >> Thank you very much. >> I do just want to give you some numbers for our secondary gifted teachers. We have 36 in the district and those are at
12 schools. So I know Miss Williams Jones shared with you it's a 15 extra hour add-on endorsement. So I just wanted to be able to provide you the actual numbers of those teachers. And so now we are available for any questions or comments concerns you have. Chair,
>> thank you very much. >> All right, Dr. Campbell, we'll start with >> you already shared that she had a list. So >> that's okay. Dr. James can start if you want. That's fine. >> I'm cool with whatever, but I just have I have a few, I guess, guiding thoughts
more than anything. I don't really have a lot of questions. I guess the only question I would ask to be followed up with is updated screener data. Um, probably as soon as Miss Williams Jones came on board, we were having gifted conversations. U Miss Delad Doll and I have been basically talking about gifted
since I got on the board. Um mostly it I became very aware um due to my own personal lived experiences with my children. Uh and then as we are elected we represent a group of people and it was not lost on me that
my unique experience was not unique but in fact was representative of the experiences other people were having. And so Miss Delad and I started talking about gifted. Miss Williams Jones came on board and we've kind of been having this conversation for two years. So the screener um I would love as a followup
to receive updated screener data. So over the course of the last two years that we've done the universal screener, how many students did we screen and then how many made it to full psych and how many qualified from full psych. So um in comparison to how many kids were we
identifying and if you have that data now that's awesome but I didn't want to put you on the spot to have it if you didn't. I believe Miss Delad Doll may have >> some some >> some. Okay, >> thanks. I'll >> give you something. >> Okay, >> to wet your appetite. Um, so as far as
for the screener, I have 2024 2025 data. So for last year, um, with students that were actually referred after that second grade screener, we had 102 students that were referred. Of that, 16% actually were found eligible for gifted.
>> Okay. 16 >> 16% Yes, very low hit rate. >> And so to give you the numbers on the front end, because we worked with the company to actually purchase the seats, we purchased 3,000 seats for second
graders to be screened for the 2425 school year. And of those 3,000 students who were screened, this was the result. >> And what what is the actual number for I can do the we don't want me to do math from the deis. So um I had thrown a joke
there. So, how many what does that 16% represent? >> From the 102 students. >> Okay. Okay. It was 102. So, I can do that math pretty quickly. About 16 kids. So, of 3,000, we paid for 3,000 um screeners, we identified 16 students. My
question would be historically, how many second graders do we identify prior to implementing the screener in 2023? Well, really we could say 24 because last year was the first year we did it districtwide. The prior year was a pilot for 10 schools, right? Or was it the pilot the year before the the three
schools? >> Okay. So, if we take it all the way back to to when we started the pilot, how many kids prior to that were we identifying in second grade? What was our trend? What was our percentage of the second grade population? Yes. And I understand you'd have to look into that,
but that would be some important data for us to understand. I can appreciate the use of a screener to throw a wide net, but um I have personal information about screeners that I find to be
problematic. I think not I would also love to know how many of those second graders that we screened that did not qualify will later qualify for gifted given the opportunity for a full psych. my own child um took the kbit and got a 109 and I
moved forward with a private full psych in kindergarten a private full psych and I won't share her full scale IQ but she's gifted and so to the tune of 25 plus points difference so my concern is that we're using a tool that is not only
under but over identifying it is lacks consistency and whether that's in the screener who's impleime implementing the tool or the tool itself. There is a lack of consistency and so we are not capturing the goal of what we are trying to do I believe is being lost in either
implementation or the tool itself. And so we really I believe need to revitalize and review what we're doing with the screener because it's not it's not working in my professional opinion. Um, I I think that it's a 25 point
difference from a screener to a full psych is is a pretty significant variation in score um for a for a six-year-old. And so I I just think there's a lot of room for improvement there. And as we leave today, one of the things I would like to see us work on is
fine-tuning what that looks like. I think there's op tons of opportunity to identify kids we're not traditionally identifying because they don't look gifted or act gifted which is why we're doing a universal screener but it's not working the way we want it to work. So we need to we in my opinion need to do
something different to um get a better result. >> So to just make a distinction there. So we were talking about the universal screener which was the endgap right? Yes. >> And that was a 16% hit rate. when we're talking about the K bit which we're using for nominations. Yes.
>> So the way I kind of look at it is the endgap is like casting out a net. >> Who do we grab and then who do we test after that? >> Whereas the kbit is more like a filter. Here are nominations from that nomination. Let's filter who would move on for testing. The hit rate for the
kbit was 45%. So of the students nominated for gifted last year then 45% of those students that took the kbit move forward for testing. And that number is still that's only the students we internally move forward from the kit, right? So again, there are
students who didn't make the filter with the kit who then like my own child were privately evaluated and then qualified. So I think that there are still gaps and like like any data or statistic set there are going to be holes. I just think we have more holes than we think
we have and more inconsistencies than we think we have and we need to continue to spend energy fine-tuning how how we get there. Um that's my professional opinion. Um so I I can certainly talk delivery model too but I don't know if there are other comments about the
screener maybe that we want to talk about before I don't know chair how you want to go about it but maybe if that would help. Yeah >> I think that's good. >> Dr. Kim we have screener comments >> questions and comments. Yes. Um, so just to make sure that I'm clear when we're saying screener and you're giving us
statistics, are we talking the nag nagleary or are we talking kit? >> The nagliary is the universal screener. >> Okay. >> Is for nominations. >> Okay. All right. So on the nagliary screener, are we using the total score?
Okay. So it's possible that a student potentially scored a 140 in one category on the nagliier but actually got a 109 as the total score and so we're not letting the child that would get a higher score in some area of the
nagliary or even more than one area not then advanced to the kit. Is that correct? >> Correct. We don't use partial scores for this. >> Okay. So I think that's part of the challenge potentially um because the nonverbal components of the screener
specifically those that would be impactful for students of other languages perhaps is without looking at that piece of it. So I I mean the KID itself is a very languageheavy um test screener, whatever you want to call it. And so I think we're excluding
an entire group of students who potentially are in need of gifted services. Their brains are going to operate differently. They're going to they're going to think of things differently, more creatively, more whatever. um potentially in other speakers of other languages and all that
the nonverbal strengths may be very very high that would then classify them for gifted but we're not even considering them because of how we're looking at total scores. My my understanding and and I mean I've I've spoken with a half dozen or so of our gifted endorsed educators um in the district. My
understanding is that even Dr. Dr. Nagliieri has talked to the district about how we're currently using the model and he doesn't even recommend and actually would like to tell us how to better use his model because we're using a total score instead of actually
segregating it out and looking at more of the whole child as opposed to just one score on a test. Um do you guys have knowledge of that that he's willing to come here on his own dime to help us with that? I haven't been um privy to any
conversations um with Dr. negliary about the better use of but but the nagliary is a screener >> and so I think part of the problem when you use any screener is one that the
item selections are limited and when you then go from a screener to a full intellectual measure which has more validity and reliability there's also often not the same level of performance for the student. And so to
say that on the nagliier that they got a 140 um that usually because it's a very isolated area with a significant item set, students don't often perform because the cognitive score overall on an IQ test is going to measure multiple
areas. And so you still see splinter scores. And so using that as the primary which and I haven't spoke I know who Dr. Neglier is. I haven't spoken to him
about this but most T test manufacturers don't recommend taking a partial score as the overall identification of a student's cognitive potential. Um because it is not a what's the word I'm
looking for? it is not going to be a reliable score potentially over time because it only measures one very specific concept. And so even when we do other IQ testing, students will have strengths, um some students are going to
be more verbal, some students may be more visual spatial. And if we see that pattern identified on an actual IQ test, then depending on um the size of the discrepancy and the
other parameters of the test um the psychologist can recommend um use of a partial score. We allow for a standard error of measure in certain instances. So it's not as discreetly identified as looking at one area that may be high um
to then extrapolate that into a need for a further evaluation. Um, so I I and if he's willing to come and the district's willing to consider that, obviously I that's a decision that the that would be
made beyond me, but it's still a screener. And so we still have to get students past that. And when we're looking at gifted eligibility, it's the screener, it's the gifted characteristics checklist, the IQ, like there a lot of pieces that go into that.
And so what we were finding prior to using the Nagliier screener was that we had students who might have had solid scores which would have led to them being given an additional test but the teachers didn't see the characteristics in the
student and so the gifted characteristics were not being identified which is part of the state requirement. And so students were missing out on getting referred and nominated because teachers didn't see what they thought to be gifted, which is
going to be true for our students who are potentially gifted but live in poverty because giftedness for students who come from environments that aren't necessarily languagerich and print rich are going to look different from some of our other students. So this summer um
between ESSE and psychological services and school counseling, they worked together to revise the gifted characteristics checklist so that it was um better um after the training to help
teachers really understand what we're looking for in gifted characteristics. not just the kid who's highly verbal, who sits at the front, who's really smart, um, and is always performing, but how do we expand past that to talk about some of those kids who may be talented
in some ways, um, and get those characteristics to be identified. So, we've been looking at the gifted process overall because we want to identify and give an opportunity for those gifted services to every student who has the
potential to benefit from those services. And so, um, we definitely appreciate the input in those areas because, you know, as this is kind of you were using the kit here, you stopped, we went to the to the universal
screener for second grade, but we can identify students in every grade level for gifted. And so the focus had been on second because we were trying to cast that wide net. But I don't want people to think that we only refer in second grade. So that any parent, any teacher
who has a student that they think displays gifted characteristics can make a nomination for a student to be assessed for gifted. Then we go through the process of doing the screening, getting the gifted characteristics completed, and then looking to see which students go on for an actual
individualized intelligence test. So, I just want to make sure that we're clear that we're looking at giftedness across the spectrum, across the grade levels, and all students can be nominated, not just those in second grade.
>> Okay. Um, so the K bit as it stands, what is our current cut score and how has that changed over the past couple years? >> So for regular gifted, the cut score is a 120 um, which is above average. Um, and then for our under reppresented
gifted is a 110. >> Okay, upper end of the average score. And again, the underrepresented we are classifying as those who are in socioeconomic have socioeconomic challenges or are
English speakers of other languages. So they have a lower score. Is that because the portfolio might show that the teacher is not identifying them in the classroom with the or or is that a state reason why we're we have a different score for underrepresented?
>> Gives us the opportunity to use the matrix in the portfolio. >> Okay. So only those students who are in those two underrepresented categories have the opportunity to present a portfolio. And is that a state standard or a Marian County standard? >> State standard.
>> Okay. So that is essentially penalizing any student in a twoerson household that might have a higher income from having an opportunity to present a portfolio. And that's a state standard. That's fine. This board is absolutely attacking that at the state level. We're trying to change it at the state level. So trust me when I say
that. Um, but please hear what I just said because we have Yeah. So, um, that that's a challenge for me in general. Uh, I I mean I have I have a lot of other questions. I don't know if you want me to just keep going with my questions or if we want to keep
talking about the screener itself. >> Um, >> I I actually do have a couple that go go with this. So um so coming from the school I came from a school that had a lot of gifted students. And so one thing I I just
wanted to share is we also have classrooms that are set up to serve gifted students each and every day. So they go to school and every day they receive um gifted services in reading, writing, math. >> Cluster model. That's what's missing from the presentation.
model. >> I I just want to share that because it does meet all the things that um that they concern me about uh many of the things that were mentioned for middle school. There's not a lot in math. There's not a lot in English. Um it was mostly social studies and science.
That's where we're, you know, where we're getting our delivery model. Um so I I wanted to share that there are opportunities at the elementary level to be in a gifted classroom. So all of your curriculum you know is enriched uh to meet the gifted child.
Um the other question I have is um I have to get the word the naglier is that >> yes is that one test or is it three tests? >> Three areas. It's one test that they take. It's three areas.
>> Okay. Because I'm being told it's three separate tests. It's three areas that they test in in the one test, right? It's verbal, non-verbal, and quantitative. >> Okay? And so there there are a lot of parents that are not passing the
screener and then they're going and getting privately tested and their tests match these subsections that you are mentioning. So my question is is if the net is to get more students into gifted, if that's what we're trying to do, why
wouldn't we just allow the 140, excuse me, in that area to go on and be screened with the cit? Why why would it matter that it was a subtest or it was the whole test? >> So that's a tricky question. Okay.
>> Because although we want to identify every child in Marian County that would benefit from gifted services, our goal is to identify under represented students. That is what the state is asking of us because of that 4.7%
of students in Marian County that are already identified as gifted, very few of them are from our underrepresented populations. And so when you look at our demographics in the district and then you look at the students who are actually identified, we have a very
large swath of our population who is economically disadvantaged. But the majority of our gifted students come from our population of students of who are not economically disadvantaged. And so what we're trying to do is level the
playing field in some ways. And so often by doing a universal screener, we are able to then cast in that wide net some of the students who are economically disadvantaged that for whatever reason may not be overtly displaying those
characteristics. We're able to get a score that's forces us to then take a deeper look. And so that was the impetus behind I well I wasn't here when it was initially rolled out but because I've done the roll out for this similar in
other districts that's typically who we're hoping to cast in that net because often for our students who are not economically disadvantaged their parents are going to refer them for screening or for a further look because they might have been gifted themselves. they see
the same characteristics in their in their children and they want to investigate. On the flip side of that, for our families who are economically disadvantaged, they don't even know what gift it is or that a nomination or a recommendation from them is even a
possibility to start a process. And so that's why using a screener at a particular grade level like second often helps districts to be able to uh help identify more in those areas where the state has identified for us that we are underrepresented.
>> And again I think part of the question was using those partial scores. So when you're talking about a screener and even when we're talking about a full IQ those partial scores the way we look at it is not robust enough to represent the child. And so if you're looking at um they're supposed to be these screeners
are supposed to be kind of predictive of whether when we move forward to full testing, they would likely meet the score that you would need for gifted. And so when you're looking at just those partial scores, it's not a robust enough measure to to be predictive of that.
That makes sense. >> It it makes sense. I don't agree. Um, and I I really don't I I really don't care for the answer that we're giving a screener for a particular reason for a particular population because this board member expects that if the screener is
given, any child that shows um signs or scores of being gifted should be moved on to the next stage um regardless of what our numbers are in the district. So that to me is very disappointing. So I hope that I didn't give you the
impression that that was why the screener was given. What that screener does, it helps us un identify in areas where we underidentify. That screener was given to every child in second grade. Any child who met the cutoff
score of 120 for a nonconomically disadvantaged or 110 was moved on for further testing. No one was screened out based on their economic status. >> To me, it did sound like that's what That's not what I was saying. >> So my next question then would be to me
it sounds like we have work to do with with our instructional staff on identifying students. And so we're putting all of this energy into giving a test when why aren't our educators the ones who are with our children every day um you know at the beginning of the
school year. Why is there not a push for hey you know these are the things we're looking for. there should be a training of some sort for our admin our teachers to help identify gifted students. >> And so that is in the works. Okay. Um we are partnering together um to roll that
out for teachers later this year um later this semester actually. um so that we can talk about what giftedness looks like. Um to try to dispel some of those stereotypical ideas about who gifted children are because
they are um much broader um in characteristics than we typically think. And so, um, we want to be able to help teachers create a different lens that they're able to look at students and say, you know, maybe they don't behave
perfectly every day, but there are some things that I see about them and perhaps they're misbehaving because they're bored. Um, and that it's not a student who has a behavior disability, um, as opposed to one who's just really academically talented. So, we're we are
in the development of that and so we will be preventing that. um in the near future so that our teachers can um have a broader idea of what gifted giftedness looks like. >> Okay. And then my final question is um in the near future I would like to know
what the average time is for a students once they're um they've been given the screener they qualify for the K bit and then they qualify because it's supposed to be 90 days correct >> 90 days from parent consent >> of school days >> of of school days
>> and that's for the full EV valuation. So that's not including the screen. >> You're going to have to go to the mic. M still I can't hear you. >> So the 90 days is for the full evaluation. So that's when they get consent for the actual IQ testing. >> Okay. >> So that's not including the timeline of the screener. I think you want the full >> Okay. Well, no. It whatever is whatever
we're legally bound by. So if the 90 days is from >> from the time the parent signs that consent, >> okay, >> to us finishing the testing. >> Okay. That's what I want to know. How long is it taking us? Because I'm hearing that it's taking us way too long. So I I would like some data on
that and um probably some information to go how we can and improve that. >> Chair, can I ask a just a qualifying question real quick? What is the composite score required to qualify for gifted? >> So 130 is considered gifted. It's a
superior IQ um that occurs in about 2% of the population. So when we're looking at the statistical scores and it's a two standard deviation above the mean, the mean being 100, um the standard deviation for a test like this is going
to be 15 points. So two standard deviations above the mean is going to be 130. >> And that's for all students who qualify for gifted. >> That is for students who are not in underrepresented groups. >> Can you clarify what underrepresented groups underrepresented groups are
students who are economically disadvantaged or second language learners. And so for that group, they have a matrix. So every part of the evaluation earns points. So they get points for the IQ score, they get points
for the um gifted characteristic checklist, and then there are some academic things that are looked at as well. Percentiles can be on state assessments and other things, but that then a matrix is completed. And then if they hit the cut scores on the matrix, they would be eligible for gifted
services. >> So the only two delineating factors are economic status and second language learners. >> Yes. >> Thank you for the clarification. >> Okay. And I have two more questions. Um,
one I'd like to know how many kbit kits we have and is there a guideline or a statute on how long we have from the kbit to the actual screen from the screener to the k bit? >> No. The assessment guidelines that are
in statute for gifted is 90 days from the parent consent and for other evaluations for IEPs it's 60 days from the parent consent. >> Okay. And I another piece data point I'd like is I'd like to know how many gifted students are at each school.
>> Um that for elementary I do have those numbers. >> Okay. Can you send them just >> I can send those to you. I can send them to everyone on the board but we do have those numbers. Um I had only asked for them for elementary um prior today but I
can get them for all of our students K12 and then send those numbers out to you. >> That would be great. Thank you so much. All right. Any other questions from the board? >> Yes, Dr. >> Yes, ma'am. >> Um, so a couple of times there was referenced uh that the ESSE committee
would meet and my question for you on the ESE team is how many members of your team are gifted endorsed. So if an ESSE committee meets and that the ESSE program whomever on your ESSE team since we know that gifted falls under exceptional student education
which is something we're trying to change in statute um but my my curiosity is how many members of your ESSE team are gifted endorsed? >> So for the ESSE specialists that are actually out in the schools I can't answer that question. Miss Weber is my
gifted program special. Well, she's the resource teacher who supports with gifted and she's endorsed. But when I say the team, that's usually a combination of our team and psychological services because psychological services is the primary
conduit, if you will. So, school counselors handle the screening process at the school, whether we're doing an individual screening with a kit or if we're doing the second grade screenings. Um, in totality, that all originates at
the school. When we met this summer to have conversations about the gifted characteristic checklist, some of that work had been done with Miss Weber and the gifted teachers last year. that was then brought to Miss Nadal's team including school counselors and then
there was continuation of that process over the summer so that we would have a new checklist to roll out this fall. So the team I'm not sure which team you're talking about because I don't so >> there was a slide specifically that
mentioned the ESSE committee would meet they would look at the documentation the IQ >> so the eligibility team so that gifted teachers a part of that team there's not an ESSE team that meets separate from a group that's making decisions about
gifted so at the team the ESSE the school team is going to be the gifted endorsed teacher the ESE specialist, the classroom teacher, and then Miss Weber, the gifted resource teacher who's gifted endorsed if there is a need for that. But the
gifted teacher is always in those meetings. We don't expect them to run the meetings. So that gifted teacher who's writing the EP is considered the expert in that meeting. >> Okay. And we had gone about a year without having someone in that role. Is that is that correct? for the gifted
resource teacher, we went six months without having someone in that role. Yes, that's correct. >> Okay. And as far as the timeline, because I I have some questions specific about the timeline as well. I understand that the 90 days that you're speaking about, uh, but as far as the time from
which an identification may be made, potentially a recommendation from a teacher to the time the student actually receives the screening. What is that timeline? The parent has to sign off on the screening to occur or the screening occurs apart from that? >> Yes, the parent has to sign the
screening permission to give permission for us to do the screening which includes vision and hearing as well as if we're doing the kit unless it was the universal screener >> and by state law that is 90 school days. That is a state law. That's a school district. >> 90 school days starts from the time the
parent is signing consent for evaluation for the full IQ. >> Okay. So from the timeline that the parent signs off that their student is going to be screened, what's that timeline? >> There's no set timeline. >> Okay. So that's what potentially is
going six months or longer potentially as I I know has occurred multiple times. So because the only timeline we really have is the 90 school days from yes, we've used the nagliier or whatever it is that we've used to then identify and now the parent signs off again that they
can be screened even further. And that's that 90-day clock that essentially if you get it in March that you're signing off on that then you're actually not being identified until October >> it can be evaluated >> or November. So potentially we've gone
an entire year and a half if the teacher identified I'm just speaking out of experience in one scenario of my children. If the teacher identified in the third week of school that the child needed to be screened, that screening actually didn't happen until March or
April. And then the actual further screening didn't happen until the next school year because again that 90 school I I'm just because we don't have a timeline set for yes this has been a personal re the parent wants their child screened but we don't have a timeline
districtwide as to when that screening needs to occur the initial screening. That's the delay. >> It would you agree? >> I mean I I couldn't speak to what kinds of delays we're having at different schools. >> Sure. Um, but there's a potential for a delay there.
>> Okay. And as far as who has the ability to administer the Kbit, then that's the school counselor that is the one that administers that. Okay. And the Kbit kit, I guess they have to check out from the district. How many of these Kbit kits do we have?
>> We currently have 20 kits and there are 10 that are assigned to schools based off of numbers and data that we looked at as far as number of referrals that usually come from those schools uh that are assigned to those schools. And then the other 10 are at the district level and they do get checked out. But those happen, those are delivered within 24
hours, 48 at the most. >> But it's also contingent on the schedule that the counselor has and the time frame that they have in their already overwhelmed workload to even administer the Kbit would >> it's whenever they're requested. Correct.
>> Okay. So that again that the timeline I I think that we we probably have determined that the timeline is is longer than we uh would like for it to be. Uh another question I had was about frameworks. So how much of what we are
doing as a district is guided by statute policy recommendations and then the Florida frameworks for K through 13 gifted learners. like how much are we actually using the that framework the gift the Florida framework for gifted learners. >> So that is the expectation is that the
gifted teachers are using that framework as the guiding document for when they are developing educational plans for students. >> Okay. And I have two final things and then I'll just let it be with the understanding that we have lots of
questions still um just in or or I I think it's not necessarily questions but that the anticipation is that we would be able to enhance how we're currently delivering our models. Uh and so I'll the comment one is about the elementary
enrichment programs because it says that it's designed for gifted, talented, and high achieving students. It kind of blurs the lines because we're talking a lot about gifted today. I think that we would also agree that even our high achievers could benefit from some of the opportunities that are afforded to our
gifted students. And it's possible that a high achiever actually may once given the opportunity in a more advanced curriculum per se that they might then show those signs and teachers would start identifying even more what they're
able to do. Just the more opportunity for enrichment I think the better. There was a statement made about elementary or about students not being penalized if they're in a pullout program. I have confirmation that at least two parents
have pulled their kids out of gifted this year because their base teacher, I'm calling it base teacher, but the teacher was penalizing those students. So, they're not actually even allowing their kids to go to pull out anymore because if we So, if that's a district policy that we need to make sure that
that home room teacher, whoever that is, is not going to require those students to continue that work while they're off in their pullout gifted program. because if we have parents choosing not to give their students that enrichment opportunity because the the other teacher is penalizing them, that's not
going to work. I mean that. So, um I'm grateful that you said that today. I'm just telling you in real practice out in the field, it's happening. So, we need to make sure that we eliminate that. And uh last thing I'll say is um specific to middle school again that's where we
understand and we've said in our multiple state legislator meetings middle school is that sweet spot where our kids are just being dropped and missed. And I know that my kids could care less about science and social studies. They got gifted at Oyola at the time through language arts. That's not
happening anymore because she's not there. She's a media specialist now. but um they got it through language arts which fit them a bit more. And then in eighth grade was science and that's just not an area that they care about. So I I've had administrators at the middle school level say they would love to have
the opportunity for an elective of gifted but it's finding those gifted endorsed teachers. So, whatever we're able to do districtwide, state statute wise, whatever we're able to do, even bargaining, which we're already done with that, but to to do something to
incentivize these teachers to become gifted endorsed, understand it's like a semester of M's level work. I get it. But that's what we're lacking. and those gifted endorsed educators that we do have in the district kind of feel like
their voices are not being heard because the majority of our gifted endorsed educators in Marian County public schools have been in Marian County public schools for a number of years. They've seen a number of folks, no offense, Miss Williams says they've seen a number of folks in your position. They've seen a number of folks either as
a gifted re and res resource teacher or not because we did go without or a program specialist or not. They've seen it. They've done it. They don't really feel heard. And so all of these questions that I've asked you today came from them. And when they looked at the presentation as it was uploaded, these
are the questions that they had and several more that I didn't ask. So if our gifted endorsed educators who are in the field doing the work every day have all of these concerns then that causes me as a board member to have even more concern because they see students that
they're unable to they're that we're using a gatekeeper of the kit and they can't go beyond whatever whereas they know this student absolutely should qualify for whatever they're able to do and they're just not able to deliver it based on the gatekeeping that we've put in place. um that just makes me
uncomfortable as a board member. So that'll those will be all my comments, but I think other people might have other things to say. >> And if I can piggy back off of that because I and we h we haven't even talked really about secondary. So, but
in 2022, we weren't using the kit. There was a checklist and then from the checklist you got to a full eval rather than the checklist we had the GRS. >> Okay. >> Which was same thing. It's looking for
characteristics. >> Okay. But we were not using the K bit. >> No ma'am. >> And so some what what is the GRS? >> So the GRS is just a standard measure looking for those same characteristics. So again, rather than um it was kind of looked at like a screener, but because
eligibility is two-prong, you have to have the majority of the characteristics as well as the IQ score, they just did one portion first. So we did the GRS. Before that, we did have to gifted and talented checklist. >> They would do the characteristics. If they met criteria on the
characteristics, we move forward with testing, >> right? And so, so I think there would be value in going back to a myth mixed method approach because my first experience with gifted
in the district was with the GRS and a checklist that went to a there was no gatekeep of the kit and then a full eval was given and qualification occurred. My second experience was a kit where we were 25 points different from a kit to
to the Reynolds. So I I don't think there's a one-sizefits-all and having a mixed variation of strategies to get a child to full evaluation. I think what I'm certainly hearing is at least three board members seem to think there is
value in adjusting that. Um but I the delivery model in elementary while it needs work the delivery model I believe is more effective and meeting students more appropriately I still have
grave concern about vacancies and how we are um meeting the mandatory delivery of their minutes. um having own my own personal experience with that last year and then obviously seeing it in my district with multiple gifted vacancies over the course of the last even just
two months in district 5. So that is still a concern for me how we're meeting that expectation. But beyond that, the secondary delivery model, how we are delivering gifted in secondary, specifically middle school, we we haven't really discussed yet. And
so I don't know if we want to roll this into a part two um at this point. I don't know. But I really want to understand and have a deeper dive into the delivery model for secondary. Um I was on a sixth period
schedule as a gifted learner in in middle school. one of my periods was gifted. Myself and many of my other gifted peers cho electively chose that. It wasn't um I don't remember it being a choice given to me by my parents, but
certainly it was an elective and it was a prioritization because we enjoyed going to the class because if you create a class where gifted learners get to be gifted, they want to go to that class. And so there is still work to be done in how we deliver. Um it was first period.
Those are the memories I have. It was first period. We all went to gifted first period. And then I imagine that teacher taught other things because I highly doubt there were 150 gifted kids at Apakka Middle School. Maybe there were, but I find it hard to believe. So, more than likely she taught other things. I don't know what she taught
because I was only concerned about myself in middle school and going to my gifted class. But there's a way to deliver an elected gifted course that meets a unique set of students needs and what they're looking to receive. And until we have walked through that path and really determined that none of our
kids want that, I don't want us to presume that it's not appropriate. So, I don't know where that fits into this conversation. I'm certainly down for a part two if we want to roll this into a part two and kind of talk more secondary because I feel like we've spent a lot of time in elementary and on the screener today, which is more of a elementary
side conversation. We're not doing a ton of screening and eligibility in middle school. So, that's fine with me, chair. I don't know what you want to do, but I do think I I don't want to close this chapter of this conversation until we really talk about secondary at some
point. >> So, at this point, I'm going to defer to Mr. White House on that because the ability to design a middle school schedule um with those minutes and electives is going to be beyond the
scope of what ESSE would do as part of this conversation. and he's the academic expert. >> Okay. >> Well, and we don't have to get into it. >> I think part two is appropriate. I think >> Yes. >> And I think Miss Slaughter's here for public comment and it's going to be
probably about secondary, so I don't want to dismiss her. So, we might want to know. >> Yeah. >> Okay. Are we good? Any more? Yeah. Any more questions? >> Board member Thrower does. >> Oh, sorry. Um, yeah, there's a lot to unpack here.
Coming from a family with two uh gifted boys in my midst, I have my own experiences with gifted certainly, but a few takeaways that I've gotten from this conversation so far is it kind of reminds me of our attendance thrust. You
know, there's 180 days in the school year. There's only so much time. there's only so many resources. So, it's time and funding, funding and time. Uh that which gets um
a defined schedule put to it tends to get done. And I think there is a snag and and a suggestion I would have would be at least in Marian County public schools that consider getting a a formal timeline in
place from when a a teacher or or a parent or somebody makes the request that then that needs something needs to happen within a defined number of days and then those results need to be communicated within a defined number of
days and then um followup suggestions. I just wrote down a statement like as a parent, you know, if you feel the screening results do not fully reflect your child's capabilities, well, where do they go from there? You know, are there resources in the community that
will do a a full psych that is valid and and not exorbitantly expensive? You know, where can they go? But but truly at least in the beginning te putting defined timelines in place for each step
because I remember uh when that 90day and the 60-day was implemented and the reason why it had to go to the state level was kind of like with cell phones you know it it it was happening some in some places but not enough everywhere.
So with a timeline added, it's moving. So those would just be some practical suggestions um that I would have and just acknowledging that the relentless pressure that everyone is under. Again,
time and funding, funding and time, finding the people, having them certified, getting it done, and keeping it moving. So those are my comments. Thank you. Thank you for all you do. >> Yeah. Thank you, Miss Thrower. >> Chair, I just had one thought real
quick. If a if to board thrower's comment, the next step a parent has is they can always request an evaluation. Any parent has the right to request an evaluation. And when a parent makes a request for a evaluation, what are the days for that?
60, right? 90. >> If it's if it is a gifted evaluation, it is still the 90 days. >> Okay. So at any point at any time a parent can make a request for a gifted evaluation for their child
and if upon that if the child hadn't even been screened yet we're then encompassing the screening into the 90 days or we're skipping the screener and we're going straight to a full psych. >> So if that is the request then everything would happen concurrently because what we're wanting to do is
still keep good data on the screening process. And so if I showed up and had a meeting, I gave consent said requested it today and they had the meeting and I gave consent. So the gifted characteristics or the what's the new acronym? I the
um as well as the kit and then the kit would just not be a barrier. It would then just be a step on the way to getting but all of it would be done in 90 days. >> Yes. Or the alternative for a parent. So, so, so when a parent gets the
results like I did, the paper that says your kid didn't qualify, the parent could then say, "Well, I still want my kid to be evaluated." And then the 90-day timeline starts upon that request, >> upon the signature giving consent. >> Yes. Or the parent can go get a private
psych like I did and pay privately for a school psychologist in the community to evaluate. Those are options a parent always has. Yes. But a child always has opportunity with parent consent for a psychological evaluation within the school system. Yes,
>> thank you for that clarification because coming from the ESC world more deeply, I knew that that was always an option, but I wasn't sure about gifted and from the way the conversation rolled, it sound like our job was done if they didn't, you know,
make the filters and then it was up to the parent if they wanted to to go ahead and get a full psych, which can be expensive and daunting and and whatever. it can also be a lot faster. Um, and I know that, you know, just from on the
other end of the ESC spectrum. So, I really appreciate that clarification because it sounds to me like there's some very real world examples of kids that for whatever reason the screeners just didn't capture it, but a full full
sight did and then they're off and running. So, >> well, to follow that thought up, board member thrower, since Chair Conrad just asked me the question and I pulled up the email I sent to my daughter's principal last year after the screening results. No, I'm assuming this is a letter template that we use, the
screener results template, right? Nowhere on this letter does it tell a parent they still have the opportunity to request a full evaluation. >> Correct. The parent is never informed. >> So, unless you know your rights, you don't know your rights. And this m I maintain that this is a constant theme.
not just in Marian County, but in public education, unless you know your rights, you don't know your rights. So, I obviously know my rights as a parent because I'm an educator. And so, I knew I had not only the right to an evaluation through the school board, but I also had the right to go get my child privately evaluated, and I had the means
and accessibility to pay for that and make that happen. But nowhere on this letter does it say if you don't like this and I I can understand why we don't do that because we're opening up the floodgates for psyches that we can't deliver upon which is the elephant in the room that no one has said today but I'm really good at talking about the
elephants that are in the room. So I'll just say our psych load can't currently take an influx of more psyches. We saw what happened when we didn't get the segs done for the screeners and then we backlogged was that a summer and a half ago whatever a year and a half ago now
and we backlogged oursel all summer and so if we're really going to expand this we have to add more sites to our payload because if we're truly going to do it we have to do it but as it exists right now the system cannot take more sites and and putting it on the letter is
going to have more parents say well I don't agree with these results I want my kid to get a full psych. But what is right and what is right is to add it to the letter because all parents deserve to have the knowledge I have as an educator. So time and funding, funding
and time, right? >> Okay, with that, do we have any public comment? Miss Slaughter, come on down. >> Okay. Oh, Slaughter. Um, I don't think the schools have the resources with the budget that you have.
>> You got to move to the >> to screen every child. I mean, I just I don't see it. I don't I don't think it's you know and I understand that if if a child gets screened a parent may not like the result and they may want to get them privately screened or they want may
have the opportunity to but if everybody that thinks their child qualifies or they miss it by a point or two you know there's really not that much difference between a child that is a 128 and a 130 I mean quite frankly
>> but if we gave the high achieving students access access to those programs, self-contained gifted at NH Jones and things like that. I think it would take a lot of pressure off because then even if your child didn't meet the cutoff that they were close, they would be able to get those resources. Most
kids are not like my oldest son, okay, who was, you know, way higher than the cutoff. And but the thing with him is is that he came in front of the school board as as a seventh grader because he was bored and had taken algebra one in
the first grade on sixth grade online and then wanted to take and took geometry in the seventh grade and then had nothing at at Howard for the eighth grade. So he found the ASEL statute and he came in front of the school board and he said I want my accommodation under
this asel statute and I so I got the m I met with Mr. White House and he agreed to let him audit the class which was just fantastic because I had to drive him to to Vanguard every day for a year so he could audit algebra 2 when he took it online because he didn't like online
school. So, but the problem with he that he had is when he went into Vanguard there was nothing for him in the 10th grade. He couldn't start his math classes for IB until he was a junior or senior. So, he missed math. He missed a whole year of math in the 10th grade.
So, we have to think about those consequences. And the problem that I'm having with parents calling me is their kids take algebra in seventh, they take geometry in eighth, and they miss seventh and eighth grade math. Then when they go to take standardized tests, all of a sudden they've been getting fives
their whole life. They hit fours and threes in math because they've never had the seventh and eighth grade math. >> So, we got to think about that, too. I mean, we push our kids and want them to, you know, excel and do everything, do all the things and they need calculus for University of Florida and a lot of
these big public schools, but they are missing math. So, we either going to need to accelerate them in sixth grade before they can take algebra and geometry or do something because there are kids that have gotten fours and fives on AP calculus, okay? And their
test scores in math are horrific because they have missed all of that in middle school. and they are having a problem now getting their test scores up to where they need to be. And if their parents have the, you know, the money to get them tutored in math, they're able to pull those scores up. But if they do
not, if they are poor, those kids are getting killed on these standardized tests and on these evaluations for state testing, which is something our funding is tied to, because they haven't had the seventh and eighth grade math. So, if we're going to accelerate kids, I'm all
for that. All my kids did that, but they I didn't realize when I did that in hindsight that they missed all the all that math in seventh and eighth grade. And that is what's on these standardized tests. So, the parents have asked me just to bring that to your attention
that it's all great that we're trying to accelerate kids and do all these things, but there's no there's not there's nothing in secondary school. Forget I mean, you have the meeting and that's what you have. I mean, that's just the reality of the situation. And in middle school, there's not I'm sorry. And in middle school, there's nothing either.
There's nothing either in middle school either. I mean, you you take the class, whatever it is. It was science, you know, for my kids in math, which, you know, they generally were fine with, but it's not it's not going to do anything. And because you have differentiated
education in middle and and high school, there's not the need that there is in elementary school to push them, you know, and if you push them too quick and too fast, then they run out of things to do. So, I'm just saying, I mean, it all looks and and as far as the pull out and
everything, they've got to do the work that everybody else in the class is doing. I mean, they don't get a pass on homework because they're ungifted. None of my kids did. They went to flame and then they came home and did their homework because that's what you got to
do. I mean, you know, if you're gifted, get it done. You know, quite frankly, I mean, you don't get a pass on work in school. You need to get it done. And they obviously have are intellectually able to do it. So, they just need to get it done. But, I mean, I don't expect core teachers to pass my kid off and not
make them do the homework because they're inflamed doing logic problems and projects and everything else. So, That's what I have. So, thank you. >> Thank you very much, >> Madam Chair. >> Yes. >> I didn't get a chance to speak on this one.
>> Okay. >> You changed out your chair, though. >> No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. I just didn't get a chance to speak on this one. Um, you you did address some things, Miss Slaughter. Um often times a lot of kids miss the cut off and
they're very very close um family members um or they're overlooked because they feel that um they may be a discipline problem versus being a gifted kid. So we have to make sure that however we get these kids assessed that
they're assessed. And the the other issue and you guys have kind of danced around it touched on it. um if they're not my family, if they're not my kids or your kids and they don't have the financial resources to get that outside
testing, um those kids are lost. We lose a whole group of kids that that are potentially gifted, but because they don't have the financial resources and someone has said that they're not there. So, we got to make sure we look at this whole thing in totality when we when
we're addressing this issue. So, I just want to make sure that um that came to the table. My kids, two of my kids um same thing. I had to fight to get them make sure that they were assessed um when sometimes he said they weren't and they were. So, we have to do a better
job. >> Thank you, Reverend Cummings. All right. And we've had public comment. Is there any other public comment? >> Okay. When are we scheduling part two? When do we have room for part two to talk about secondary?
>> Let me pull that calendar up. >> Okay. But like maybe sometime before Thanksgiving break, we can discuss part two. >> One thing I'd like to share is there's a couple takeaways I heard from you all. Formalizing the procedures, which is an easy next step um for us to have clear
timelines for the process. Also adding language on a template. And the other part, and Mr. Roy House can expand on this, but we start scheduling middle school and high school classes really in January. I know that seems pretty soon, but that's what what usually happens then is we give students a a sheet of
paper. We're still old school because they get to take it home. They get to circle courses and prioritize electives. What we could do is we could add that as an option just to see what would the interest be. Um something that you are aware of and we've already spoken about
this during our legislative priorities but in we have a sixth period day and when the students are trying to take the these accelerated courses and extra marian virtual courses it fills up quickly and so they see it as it's kind
of why our AVID option kind of fell apart in middle school. As much as we know that's a strong program and we want all students to do it, it took away an elective class and so but we we definitely can explore adding that to their core schedule request just to kind
of gauge interest and we can begin that process in January. Go ahead, Miss Go. I'm sorry, Mr. Chair. Sure. >> Yeah. Talking about these followup next steps, the piece that Miss Slaughter talked about about kids missing the the
core math. Mhm. >> Um, >> what can you do about that? >> So, we have, we know that there's 34 benchmarks. I might be wrong. I'm just going off memory there. There's 34 key benchmarks when we accelerate our students for into algebra and seventh
grade that they missed by um missing out on seventh grade advanced math. So, we've begun that process even younger um offering courses such as accelerated math. This year, we were not able to offer that. We did last year. it. There's a challenge with that because
the teacher has to actually have that middle school certification in elementary. So, we're working on that now. Um, but the other part I wanted to add to what Miss Lauder said is IB and Cambridge have a time um period limitation on the diploma courses. So
you can't take So like the example she gave I I'll I'll use one like you can you can go into say you do algebra and geometry middle school your next step would go into algebra 2 or pre-calculus but after that you're kind of limited
other going into IBM math or ACE math one and so that is a that is a challenge we have for especially the mathematics track and our diploma pathways >> it must be a challenge across the whole state It is. It is. >> And chair to add something that I wasn't
aware of that just Miss Slaughter mentioned it. Um, and Dr. Brewer kind of circled around it, but we started two years ago a pilot program at Ocala Springs Elementary, which is no longer a pilot program. So, I don't know if the board is all aware because I wasn't aware until I became aware a week ago,
but the program doesn't exist anymore. So, those kids are not in sixth grade math this year. So the program died after two years. So we did all of third, half of fourth the first year, half of fourth, all of fifth last year. Then
last year instead of taking the fifth grade PM3, they took the fourth grade PM3 and then they are they're they are sitting in advanced fifth grade math this year, but they are not taking sixth grade math, those kids at Okala Springs. So, I know
that the board wasn't really made aware of that and I became news that I was kind of made aware of um by a parent sharing their thoughts with me. But we're it flopped in part because of certification because you have to have
you have to have a middle gradede math or 612 certification to teach sixth grade math which I identified as a barrier when we started this two years ago because finding an elementary school teacher with a middle school math certification is not not easy. Um, but I
also would would dare say, should we not venture down the alleyway of is it developmentally and mathematically appropriate for students to advance be advancing their math as early as third grade? Because what we're I mean, the goal there was for those kids to get seventh grade math in sixth grade. So
then they could start on the advanced track, but if we're not able to get them there, then what we're doing may very well not be mathematically best for them. So, I still think there's opportunity for further discussion if we're not truly going to have an a
fasttracked from third grade forward program. >> Well, while you're on that thought process, I thought that the best approach during that whole conversation was that in sixth grade they would get seventh grade advanced math
>> and leave off the third through all that part. So, I I think that if if we've done away with the elementary side of it, the most important thing is that our sixth graders are getting seventh grade advanced math ahead of algebra because they've got to get all those concepts
in. My kid missed them, your kids missed them. Like, they all missed them. And he almost missed even more because in sixth grade, his sixth, whatever pre-alggebra teacher, whatever, thought he wanted to be and should have been in algebra 1 like in the second week of school. So, I mean, you had the two. So, I'm I'm
grateful we didn't go that route because then he would have gotten into middle school, eighth grade, and had nothing to do and we weren't going to petition the school board back then. So, um I keep pointing out to Miss Slaughter, but um so, as long as we still have that pathway going where we have our sixth grade advanced math students in a
seventh grade advanced math and then seventh grade they're taking algebra, eighth grade they're taking geometry, then I think it still will solve kind of all the things. I appreciate the concept of of rolling out an idea of a gifted elective to our middle school students.
I think that would be interested to gauge the interest and see what that looks like. I I think that that is going to be our challenge though is then how do we get more gifted endorsed teachers that are willing or that we can pull in just that teach just a gifted class
that's not a science class or whatever. And so that'll be a scheduling thing that our u APS will have fun with. but and under Mr. White House. U but I I appreciate that thought process. Part of the thing and I was I was hoping that board member Thorough would have
mentioned it. We've had these conversations with our legislators. Obviously, some of them get our idea about gifted, some of them don't. Uh when we met with Representative Gro, he specifically mentioned his kids went to school in Citrus County and he didn't understand what we were talking about
because his kids when they were in middle school had a gifted elective of you know and so he's like I don't that must just be in your district and it was well maybe but I don't think it's just us alone regardless exactly what I said yesterday in the legislative delegation
hearing even though the delivery model is different all across the state. We still believe as a board pulling gifted out of the ESE statute and creating its own separate statute will then give us more opportunity to treat these students
differently in the way they should be treated. 4.7% of our student population is not a small number. It it may sound small because it's but it really isn't. I mean more than 2,000 students I dare say we do a lot of other things for less numbers of students. So, I I think that
it's important that we start considering what that looks like. Certainly on the state level, we're going to continue to advocate that we can get a bill sponsor to help us with that. Um, but I I anything we can do locally, that's why I'm glad we're having our own local conversations about what we can do
within the law right now until we get the law changed. >> Okay. >> Yeah. Just quickly, because we were both at that same meeting with with Rep. grow. And I think it just speaks to, and I did have something written down here, and I just didn't mention it, but others
did. Um, just having all the the the conversation, putting the cards on the table, identifying the the gaps, and then the where do we go uh from from here. I too am looking forward to the
followup in in high school because my experience has been whether they are ESE or gifted the consult model could use some refinement. I will leave that uh in that statement. And
something I did write down is you know when you ask the kids you know or you ask people that know the kids what's my kid really interested in? You know they're really gifted. So what are they doing, you know, at home when because hopefully I'm controlling their social media access or whatever. Who know, you
know, they're they're doing some pretty amazing things. I'm convinced of that. And there are groups of students that are probably doing those amazing things. And that might help us identify electives that would be appropriate. Uh God, I wish we had a seven period day
still because it just leaves more room for the fun stuff. All right, >> I have one final comment and um Dr. James is don't take a deep breath. It's just quick. Um Dr. James comment made me think of it. When would you do when you ask the middle school students if
they're interested? Can we also survey like let let's ask the parents like would you be interested in your child being in a gifted class? Because like Dr. James said, >> you know, we're not totally in control in middle school what we're what we're doing with our educational path. So just
wanted to share that. All right, wrap. >> We'll see that in a part two prior to schedule requests going out in January. >> That was my point with that. Yes, thank you. We'll schedule it before um December. >> Great. Great. All right, with that, we'll move on to item 7.1 as our last
item. Um Dr. Brewer, you'll lead us into workhouse discussion. Workhouse >> and that Okay. >> Oh, go ahead. >> Okay. I didn't know if we'd passed the torch. >> Oh, I I don't want to step on any toes. >> Go ahead. >> Okay. Um, just a report for the board.
On 9:25, Miss Usher, Mr. Black, and myself met with the upward team and their legal counsel. Um, I believe the meeting was productive. Most issues have been cleared. Uh, left us with two primary focus areas. As of 9:30, we've received Upwards P3 proposal um, which
is being reviewed by Miss Usher and staff. uh upwards. We also received their draft memorandum uh about from upwards legal council about uh taxation structures and exemption structures so we can narrow any further issues efficiently. We expect and are waiting
on a a memorandum the final draft of their memorandum on those exemption issues uh and would be able to make recommendations to the board soon as soon as staff review of those areas is complete. So I'll turn it over to you Dr. B. >> Okay. Thank you. Um Jason and his
colleague, I cannot remember her name. No, it was a lady. I'm sorry. Um flew in on September 19th to um and they did an interest a gauge to just gauge interest at Westport High School, just one campus. They um
received some positive information. They're going they've asked to come back. I haven't scheduled those visits yet. um but they at this point are just gauging interest to for us to be able to say that this is a need um in our community. So that's the only thing I else I have to add to what Mr. Power
said. Okay. Anything from the board? Okay. Seeing none, is there any public comment? Okay. All right. We'll move on to meeting reminders. Next school board meeting is scheduled for October 14th at 5:30 p.m. And then October 16th is a
full day. We have a special school board meeting for early re-entry at 7:00 a.m. Then we have an administrative briefing and work session scheduled at 9. And then there is an iRock meeting at 4 pm. Um and lastly, there is a town hall
gathering October 16th at Oyola Middle School at 6:00 pm. So a busy day on the 16th. Um with that, we'll go into board comments. Miss Martinez Young. >> No, Madam Chair. Thank you. >> Attorney Powers. >> Uh just happy Yam Kapoor to all friends
and family who celebrate it. >> All right. Thank you, Dr. Brewer. >> Yes. A couple things. Thank you. Um, we already shared, but we had the we had the privilege of speaking yesterday at the county's legislative delegation meeting, and it was an honor to, of
course, for to introduce the school board members, all of you, to share our priorities for this year, and also to go ahead and share our appropriations request. And so, we are excited that we're going to move forward with requesting $3 million for a plumbing
program at Marian Technical College. And um that is exciting because we know that there is a need and there is no other program in the county that's offering that service. So we're excited about that. I wanted to um provide an update
on the topic of elementary school searches. I know I shared with you all recently after the sheriff made a statement online that he stated that we were not um allowing elementary searches. So I just wanted to provide an update where we are with that. We have
um convened a group and we actually have our formal meeting tomorrow morning with this larger group to look at our procedures. As you know, we operate off of a board policy that is um that doesn't necessarily include or disclude
elementary. And so our procedures right now only include middle and high schools for um for the searches. So we are looking at um refining those procedures tomorrow to to examine like what what could these searches look like at the
elementary level where our students would not be impacted. So I will we will have that information and then I will schedule board briefings with you all um starting next week after those procedures are discussed. That's all the comments I have. Thank you.
>> Great. Thank you Dr. Brewer, Dr. Campbell. >> Thank you. So essentially the way the article or the TV20 report was made it sound as if it was already a done deal and that we were um that we were already
engaging in elementary that is fact the headline said that specifically. So that is not accurate information. Dispelling all rumors, that decision has not been made yet. And because I I know I have very strong reservations about even the
consideration of it, but I will reserve judgment until you all get your committee together and give us more information. Um, two quick things. Um, well actually, yeah, two quick things. Uh, Oyola Middle School Centennial Celebration is this evening. So, uh,
looking forward to that, uh, as a former Oyola parent as well as the board member representing that school. And finally, if we had more time, I wanted to try and spend a little bit of time on this thought process, but if the board would be in consensus to at least have a work session item on it because we were
having legislative conversations yesterday with our delegation and knowing we're putting in a 2026 appropriation request, I know I made the statement in a board meeting recently about the potential of a 2027 appropriation request, specifically regarding the repurposing of the
existing Lakewear Middle School campus. If we were interested in at least pursuing what that would look like, I believe a 2027 appropriation request as well as a 2027 earmark from the feds would both be appropriate, but we would need to know exactly how much money
we're looking for. I also think there's private donations that would be willing to help us convert that into an early learning academy uh for the south side. But when I said something to Miss Usher about it at the Ross Prairie dedication, which by the way, yes, that was
wonderful as well this week, um I said I wanted we need to make sure that the board agrees with that thought process before she even tries to start running some rough numbers. And so that was all I was going to bring up today, but we don't really have time to elaborate. If we had consensus though to say, "Yeah,
let's at least explore what that kind of cost would look like," then she could start crunching some numbers and then we can have a greater conversation. But that's just up to the board to have that thought. That's all I have. >> Um yes, looking at forward for our
special school board meeting for early re-entry on the 16th. Um trying to remember how far ahead we know if we will have candidates for early re-entry. >> We do. >> Okay. >> They've been scheduled. >> Okay, great. because I know we had one
scheduled while ago and the candidates were were not had not met their requirements. So, I always look forward to the early re-entry meetings and I don't know, we covered a lot of ground today and I think we're trying to
work towards getting out of here at two o'clock. So, that's all I'm going to have today. Thanks everyone for their work. >> Thank you, Miss Thrower. Dr. James, >> thank you. I was going to touch on the um TV20 news article. My request, I don't know if it's appropriate, but um I
generally am not that concerned about that. Uh I would ask WCJB to retract or re rechange their statement. Their statement is not accurate or reflective, I believe, of the work we're doing. And the title of the article literally states Marian County Public Schools now
allowing K9 units to search elementary schools. Um, and I find that to be not reflective of what I believe the certainly this board has articulated and what I believe we've been told by our interim superintendent and so I find
that article to be misleading and certainly um has caused a stir in the community and it's been brought obviously to multiple of us attention. So, I don't know if that's appropriate or not, but if that's available, I would love for us to reach out and say, "Could you please change the title of your
article or make a correction or something?" Um, board, just one thing from my obviously we have so much going on. There's been so much good work. Um, but it's also been a long day already. So, I just want to say one thing. About six months ago, I brought up um the Reic
basketball court. We had a I not we um I had a a brief discussion about that basketball court and trying to move perimeter fence to essentially um give that basketball court over to the the town of Reic. Uh board member Thrower had kind of mentioned that we should
have a work session on it and kind of have a board discussion before we moved forward. The town was then willing to cover the cost of the survey. So it really would be no cost to the district to get the preliminaries done. but then it kind of died because there wasn't a group decision on adding the work
session agenda item. So board, I'm bringing it back to you. I was at the ribbon cutting uh for the Reic Park uh which kind of reignited the thought process in my head. I was there last week. Beautiful park. If you make your way to Reic, it is a wonderful addition
to the community and honestly it's a perfect place for it. Um God always has interesting ways how he moves that path. But um if it's a if it's a pleasure to at least the majority of the board, I would love to just have a a brief work session agenda item to discuss um our
desire to have the town of Reic uh have a survey done on that just that little portion where the basketball court is and then we would understand how much it would cost to move the fence, the perimeter fence and then all of the legal stuff that Jeremy would do um to
make it happen. But I would love to just have a work session where we can kind of summarize what that would look like. Um so that if we want to move forward in that direction, we could. So I don't know if there's at least three of us that are agreeable to having that work session agenda item, but if there are, I would appreciate it. >> Absolutely. >> Okay.
>> Work session. >> That's all I had. Thank you. >> Thank you, Dr. James. Robin Cumins. Um, several of you have already touched on the uh the TV20 article um news report which kind of made it seem like we didn't know what was going on. Um so and
I think I addressed it with Dr. Brewer the very next morning we were at the Rosary. So um I too would love to see them do some type of correction to that uh article. It's very misleading. Um be surprised when I read it and I'm like
>> when did we do this? you know, when this happened. So, um definitely want to have um some correction on that. Um my comments brief. We had a great great um presentation yesterday to the legislative delegation. I I I know they
heard us because they've heard us before. Um so, we expect that they'll they'll take our recommendations and and work on them. And then to the Ross Prairie family, truly a a great dedication of their morning. those kids with the singing and all this stuff. It
was just good. So, we have our two new schools, both of them dedicated within a week of each other and we're we're glad about it. So, good. >> Okay. Thank you, Rowan Cummings. And with that, we have had a super productive morning. Lots of great things
happening at our schools and within the district. And if there is no further business, we will adjourn this session at 1:48. Thank you, board.