WEBVTT

METADATA
Video-Count: 1
Video-1: youtube.com/watch?v=UccEjIfFR1c

NOTE
MEETING SECTIONS:

Part 1 (Video ID: UccEjIfFR1c):
- 00:00:00: Music Interlude: Ambient Sounds of Heat and Down
- 00:10:24: Parks and Recreation Commission Appointment - Colleen Marinelli
- 00:13:08: Public Comment: Council Ducet Questioning Colleen's Tech Background
- 00:14:28: Public Comment: Counselor thanking Colleen Marinelli
- 00:15:16: Marinelli Approved and Next Meeting Adjourned
- 00:16:18: Music Interlude: Return of Ambient Heat Sounds
- 00:24:39: Finance Committee: WMCTV Transfer Request Presentation
- 00:30:45: Public Comment: Council Vital Budget Transfer Approval
- 00:31:21: Public Comment: Council Ducet Discusses Closed Captioning
- 00:33:42: Public Comment: Council Welcome and PEG Discussion
- 00:35:38: Public Comment: Community Involvement with WMCTV
- 00:37:47: Public Comment: Gratefulness for WMCTV Broadcast
- 00:38:35: WMCTV Budget Approved and Next Up: Mid-Year Transfers
- 00:39:17: Finance Committee: Mid-Year Transfer Requests Explained
- 00:41:11: DPW Mid-Year Transfer and Vacancy Discussions
- 00:51:38: DPW Comment: Dynamic Position Change with Promotion
- 00:54:54: Public Comment: Solar Energy Implementation
- 01:01:05: Discussions and Approved Transfers of DPW Items
- 01:08:04: Fire Department: Vacation/Sick Time Buyback Approval
- 01:09:51: Auditor, Legal, Veteran, HR Department Mid-Year Transfers
- 01:11:24: City Solicitor Proposed Salary Ordinance Amendment
- 01:15:50: Assistant Fire Chief Salary Ordinance Amendment
- 01:24:15: Council Vital Resolution Regarding Municipal Budget
- 01:35:47: Public Comment on Fear of Escalating Budget Issues
- 01:39:00: Public Comment: Guideline vs Hard Budgetary Framework
- 01:55:02: Discussion: Economic Development vs. Other Funds
- 01:56:39: Resolution Withdrawn and Meeting Adjourned


Part: 1

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Heat. Heat. [music] >> [music] >> Do you [music] feel Heat. [music] Heat. [music] [music] >> [music] [music] [music]

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[music] [music] >> down. Down. [music] >> [music] [music] [music] [music] [music] [music] [music] >> Heat. Heat. [music]

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>> [music] [music] [music] [music] [music] [music] [music] [music] [music] [music] >> Heat. Heat. [music] [music] >> [music]

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[music] [music] [music] >> down. Down. [music] >> [music] [music] [music] [music] [music] [music] [music] [music] [music]

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[music] [music] [music] >> Uh-huh. [music] [music] [music] Heat. Heat. [music] [music] [music] [music] >> [music]

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[music] [music] [music] >> Down. Hey. Hey. >> [music] [music] [music] >> Heat. Heat. [music] [music] [music] [music] >> [music]

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[music] [music] [music] [music] [music] [music] [music] [music] [music] [music] [music] [music] [music] [music] [music]

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[music] [music] [music] [music] [music] [music] [music] >> I'm going to call the personnel committee to order at 6:15 on March 16th 2026.

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We have one item on the agenda. It's order number 261 09678. The appointment of Colleen F. Marinelli to the Parks and Recreation Commission. Colleen, if you could join us at the front of the chambers.

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[clears throat] And while Colleen's getting ready, I will read the letter from the mayor. Honorable President Oing and counselors, I am pleased to submit for your approval the appointment of Colleen Marinelli to the Parks and Recreation Commission for

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a three-year term to expire February 28th, 2029. As outlined in the letter submitted by Mrs. Marinelli, she has demonstrated a deep passion for serving the community by establishing the youth track program

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and wishes to continue and expand on that. I believe her insight organizing events and wanting to give back to the community will be a great addition to the recreation commission. She was highly recommended by our current recreation director, Chuck Thiido. I

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want to thank Mark Vital for being on the recreation commission since 2012. If my mat's right, that's 14 years in this seat. Having him serve on the commission for all these years has brought value and a different perspective and insight into his work on the council. Colleen,

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thank you for wanting to join the commission and I am excited to hear more about expanding programs. Sincerely, Mayor Christian Dumis. With that said, committee members, would you like anyone like to ask Colleen some questions? Councelor Ducet.

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>> Thank you very much, Mr. Chair. Um, thank you for volunteering your time and effort, Colleen. Um, you know, I I definitely support those who take the initiative and demonstrate themselves in the community and then ask to join the team because it's you become a proven

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point. Um, I have a lot of high-tech experience. I know who VMware is, you know. Um, what is Tanium and I think I've heard Riverbed before, but what what are the what do they do? So, >> Sure. So, Tanium is a cyber security

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company dealing with endpoint management, making sure your devices are secure. >> Okay. >> And Riverbed, um, same lens, not cyber security. It's software, observability, AI ops, and I work in the digital employee experience space. >> So, Dex,

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>> okay. Cloud computing type stuff or is it >> It's in the cloud. Yeah. But for my solution base with Dex, it's endpoints and devices and applications and networks. being able to see that visibility >> and it's very easy doing those jobs remote I assume right because your customers base is all over anyway right

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>> correct >> yeah okay um so yeah now just getting a better understanding of your background experience and y >> you know what you're doing um but uh I have uh no issues in uh endorsing her but if any other counselors want to say

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anything I I would approve it >> thank you councel just said councel >> thank you Mr. here. Hey, how are you? >> Hi, good. How are you? >> Great. Um, thank you. I have no questions about your um technological background. I didn't understand most of the words that uh councelor Ducet said, per usual. Um, but I thank you for your

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interest in the um recreation commission. This is high season um coming upon us and um I know a lot of the members of the commission are looking forward to the season and a lot of potential new um ideas and some programming that they can do. So, um I don't have any questions for I just want to thank you for volunteering um and

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make a motion to approve the appointment. Motions have been made and seconded to approve the position of Colleen Marinelli to the recreation and parks department or the parks and recreation commission. With that said, any further

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discussion? Any other counselors that would like to ask questions that are here? No. With that then maybe I'll ask a couple Well, one I'll make a point. You went to URI and communications. >> Yes. >> Excellent. Having a communicator

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anywhere within the city position is an excellent resource to have. So, thank you for that. And honestly, I'm so impressed. And I noted to you as you were walking in, my my three children, they're not children anymore. They're in their 20s and 30s, but they participated

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in Marro sports, especially track. So, you probably miss them. It was a few years back. But great program. I'm sure one of our counselor's sons will be maybe someday running Marbor Track as well, but thank you for wanting to

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serve. And with that note, all in favor, >> you are approved. It will go to the city council meeting for the final approval. >> Okay. >> Thank you for your time and service tonight and in the future. >> All right. Thank you. >> Motion to adjurnn. >> Motion's made to adjurnn and seconded.

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All in favor? Personnel is adjourned at 6:20 p.m. on March 16th, 2026. Thank you. >> [music] [music] [music] [music]

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[music] [music] [music] >> Do you know? [music] Hey, hey, hey. [music] [music] Heat. Heat. [music] [music] Heat. Heat. [music]

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[music] >> [music] [music] >> Heat. Heat. Heat. Heat. [music] [music] [music] >> [music] [music] [music] [music] [music] [music] [music]

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[music] [music] [music] [music] [music] >> Oh, [music] [music] [music] [music] hey. >> [music] [music] [music] [music] >> Heat.

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[music] [music] Hey, Heat. >> [music] [bell] [music] >> Down. Hey. Hey. [music] >> [music] >> Heat. Heat. N. >> [music] [music]

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[music] >> Heat. Heat. [music] [music] [music] >> [music] [music] [music] >> Good evening. I will call to order the finance committee meeting on March 16th, 2026 at 6:30 p.m. Uh we have uh five

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items on the agenda this evening. Uh we have a proposed salary ordinance amendment relative to the position of city solicitor. uh proposed salary ordinance amendment relative to the position of assistant fire chief. Uh communication from the mayor of Dumis with a midyear transfer request in the

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amount of $917,528. Uh we have a transfer request in the amount of $565,811 uh to the for the operation and capital items on WMCTV for FY2027. Uh we have a municipal budget resolution

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submitted by submitted by councelor Vital. Uh I would also like to take this opportunity to welcome uh council gold to the finance committee. Um with that said um I will begin I will be going out a little bit out of order this evening. Um I'd like to be bring the director

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from WMCTV. I'll take that order up first. Um and that is order number 26-1009675 transfer in the amount of $565,811 uh from PEG funds to Malro Cable Trust to fund the operation and capital items of WMCTV

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for FY2027. And I'll begin by reading the letter submitted by the mayor. Dear Council President Oing and counselors, enclosed for your review and approval is a transfer request in the amount of $565,811

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from the Mall Republic Educational Government Access, which is the PEG account, to support WMCTV operational and capital budgets. Uh, as a reminder, WMCTV's fiscal year runs from April 1st through March 31st. Uh the attached letter from

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WMCTV executive director Ryan Milear outlines how funding uh will be allocated in the coming year uh including both capital investments and operational expenses. Over the past year, executive director Miley has continued to welcome and expand

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programming while successfully reducing the overall budget for the upcoming year. Uh he and his dedicated team remain committed to delivering highquality programming to our residents and the city. Uh please do not hesitate to reach out to me uh or my office with any questions. Sincerely, Jay Christian

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Dumis mayor. Good evening, director. >> Good evening, counselors. >> I would like to also say that um your your your team is wonderful, professional, helpful, and it shows in some of the pro it shows in all the programmings that we're fortunate to be watching on WMCTV.

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Uh so, uh good evening. >> Good evening. And if you would like to go over a little bit of your budget at all or >> Sure. So um I think it's sort sort of astonishing that in this year we were able to decrease our budget. Saw that.

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>> Um our overall appropriation is lower than it was is less than it was last year and even less than it was in the previous year. And a lot a lot of that is due to uh we are not going to be pushing so many large um capital projects this year. Uh this previous

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year we updated a lot of the cameras and infrastructure in this room and in the school committee room. Um and in previous years there were uh many updates made to the the studio on 91 Main Street. Uh this coming year one of our our main capital projects is to

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increase accessibility. Uh there is new ADA compliance laws that are being rolled out. Um it won't affect Marorrow this coming year uh because of the population size but the the the year after that um closed captioning will be

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mandatory as well as other ADA compliant things for all government websites and media that is uh put out from the city of Marorrow. Um, so we're concerned with the video side of things and its transmission on cable as well as on

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streaming platforms uh to do close captioning and invest in that technology. >> Thank you. Thank you, director. And I'll open that to any question the finance team. Uh, councelor Vital. >> Thank you, Mr. Chair. Um, first of all, I like to recognize and thank you for

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presenting a budget that's below the number from last year. And hopefully every other director within the city follows your your lead um as far as lowering their budget. I'd like to make uh I'd like to make a motion to approve the transfer in the amount of $565,811.

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Motion has been made and seconded to approve order number 26-1009675 transfer the amount of $565,811 from PEG funds to Marble Cable Trust to fund the operation and capital items of WMCTV for FY2027.

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Any further discuss any other discussion? Councelor Ducet. >> Thank you very much, Mr. Chair. Um, actually just a general question. You're talking about closed captioning and everything. Um, is there a closed captioning being done for council meetings at this point? Because it seems that the minutes are almost a literal

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dictation. So, is that is someone actually just listening and typing it in? At this point, >> you would have to ask your secretary here. We do not provide any closed caption. >> No, that's that's fine then. Okay. >> YouTube automatically does its own version of closed captioning, but it's not ADA compliant.

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>> So, it's not accurate. So when we pursue accurate closed captioning at a government level, it includes it is still using AI but it is a much greater AI uh software that will be introduced where we'll be able to make sure that

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counselor's names are spelled correctly that the city of Marro is understood and that will be a learning process for for that AI that will be paid for on a subscription basis. >> How much is that expected to cost at this point? I know it's not for next year, but curious as far as the budget

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for that goes. It's estimated at $5,99 per year for the >> 5100 bucks. >> Yeah. For the number of council meetings and school committee as well. >> Uhhuh. Okay. and also any key city

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events that would drive a larger audience view such as uh a graduation ceremony, a Labor Day parade. Uh >> so effectively everything under WMCTV would be allowed to utilize this technology going forward. >> We would assess the fees as they go and

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see how much we're going to make accessible. >> So okay, we'll worry. Thank thank you for that information. So at least we understand what's going on in the future. When this comes up in the budget, I'll probably have a bunch of other questions, but it's not worth it at this point. But you brought it up, so there. But >> well, it is in the budget for th this

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fiscal year. We're getting a jump start on it. So that is our our main capital improvement this year. Okay. >> Is to do it before we're beating the clock. >> Okay. Okay. That's fine. Thank you. And thank you very much for that. >> Council, >> welcome. >> Thank you.

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>> I won't ask you questions about the food budget. Now, you answered it last year for me when we were talking about your cafeteria and when you have the school students in there. Great, great program. Um, we talked about the PEG funds and how we need to start looking at a better

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way to collect these fees, especially with them dwindling compared to where they were years ago. And it's based on cable subscription. Um it looks like with your budget we'll have for the final balance $283,343

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from those funds. But again um we're trying our side of it too to do the best we can to get the state legislators to look at looking at other ways to bring in funds for the PEG funds. Um the only other question I well not noted the AI

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technology. You're not alone. We're all in the AI technology and I work part-time for our town right now and they use Zoom and there's actually I think paying a little more than what you noted. So that 5,000 doesn't seem unreasonable in any way but um I have

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seen higher costs too. So but in your budget uh as you noted capital funding is your your capital projects are not as many as you had last year. So the reduction in your budget and I know council vital and we all are concerned about the budget this year but at the

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same time your budget's different from many other departments. So I'm not for sure if that can be the case in all the departments within the city but it's going to be a tough fiscal year. But I thank you for that though that you found ways to save money on that. With that

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said I'm in support of your budget and look forward to seeing you broadcasting throughout the city another year. Thank you. Thank you very much. Thank you, Councelor. >> Councelor David. >> Thank you, Mr. Chair. Um Ryan, I just want to commend you um and the team for the amount of work that you guys are able to do and has already been noted,

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you know, doing probably more for a little bit less this year. Um because you've already done a lot of the hard work and a lot of the investments. Um the space is great. Um, I know a lot of us get to see it at least every other year when we when we record our little messages, but um, you know, the programming that you guys are able to

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put out and working with members of our community, um, you guys are really all to be commended. Um, the only thing I wanted to ask you is, you know, in that vein, if people want to get more involved, if people want to take advantage of the services, right, because this is public access and you

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guys are really good at promoting it, but if somebody did want to get involved, how do they, you know, they have an idea, how can they get in touch? >> Sure. Um, let me get on the soap box again because this is a great opportunity for anyone who is watching. um that any Marorrow resident or

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business or nonprofit organization here in the city has access to WMCTV. That is the um the P in in PEG uh public education and government. Our services are always free

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to any member of the Marorrow community. That means they have free access to uh not only borrowing equipment from camcorders to audio devices and using our editing workstations but receiving free training as well. Um the old motto

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method used to be oh if you want to do a show you train and then it's it's yours to go. Well that resulted in not very many shows. So now we offer a support package along with that. If someone wants to do a studio television talk show program, we provide every month

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that that person with two hours of support for the to use the studio and 2 hours of assisted editing as well to finish putting their show together as well with help with distri distributing it uh to YouTube, Facebook, podcast platforms, you name it. We we help them

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the whole way through. >> That's great. Well, it shows that the end products have been really great. So, it seems like you guys are everywhere these days. So, I don't know how you're doing it, but keep it up. Thank you, Mr. Chair. >> Thank you, Councelor Davis. Councelor Fillo. >> Thank you, Mr. Chair. I'll keep it very brief. Thank you, Director Malar, for

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being here. Um, just very grateful for the work that you do in our community, right? When it's public education, government access, all these different services that you provide. I get calls from constituents who tell me that they watch these meetings. Our last meeting, I had somebody who had reached out and said, "I watched last night and they had a question about something." So you're

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providing an extra kind of layer of access between us and the public in order to help better serve our constituents. I know my mom and dad are going to be watching tonight. They don't miss a meeting. So I'm just so grateful for the work that you guys do for our community and being able to bring this room to households all across Malro. So

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very grateful. I'm glad Council Vital and I were able to support that resolution and hopefully we can get some movement on Beacon Hill. But um I'm in full support of the budget and appreciate your time here. >> Thank you Council Field. >> Thank you. >> No further discussion. Motion has been made and seconded to approve order

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number 26-1009675. All in favor carries. 1 2 3 4 5. Thank you, director. >> Thank you all. >> Can I ask the committee to consider suspending the rules since the fiscal year? >> Thank you, Mr. President. Is the committee okay with Thank you. Thank

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you, councelor. All right. So, so next order I will do I will do the midyear transfers. Uh and that is uh order number 26-1009659 uh communication from Mayor Dumis together with a midyear transfer request

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in the amount of $917,528 from various departments for FY2026 which moves funds from and to accounts outlined in the transfer sheets. I'll begin by reading the uh letter submitted by the mayor. Honorable President Oing and councilors enclosed

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for your review and approval our midyear transfer request uh from the city departments. Transfers from the following departments have been included. Department of Public Works in the amount of $791,600 for various services and salary accounts

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relative to collective bargaining agreements per the attached letter uh from Commissioner Scott. uh various departments from uh veterans director in the amount of $69, the auditor in the amount of $109, human resource director, assistant and administrative assistant

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uh in the amount of $279, and the legal city solicitor and assistant city solicitor in the amount of $311 to cover unfunded salary accounts through the end of the fiscal year. uh fire department in the amount

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of 125,000 to fund salary accounts to cover sick leave and vacation buyback relative to retirements and contractual agreements in the collective bargaining agreement. And on the fourth one is office of the city clerk uh for the city

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clerk and assistant clerk in the amount of $160 for anticipated de anticipated deficits. Uh department heads who have requested transfer of funds will attend a future finance committee meeting to discuss these requests with you in greater detail. If you have any questions or

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concerns, please do not hesitate to contact me sincerely, Jay. Christian Doom, Miss Mayor. And then we have the uh for the finance team, we have the the the the transfer sheets going down. Uh the big item obviously is the the DPW uh

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in the total amount of uh 700 $791,600. and I'll open that up to the finance team if they have any questions. Good evening, Commissioner Scott. Mr. Chair, >> Councilman, >> good evening. >> Good evening. Good evening, Commissioner

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Scott. Um, we kind of talked about this just before the meeting about all the money where it's coming from and obviously quite a few vacancies and um you were giving me a little bit of update on a little bit of an update on the situation there. if you could

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maybe express what we were discussing so we know the vacancy rate and how you're doing with that. >> Sure. >> Thank you, Mr. Chair. >> Um, so um just some background. It does seem like it's not the same. There's some positions that are uh vacant uh

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that have continued, but they're not all the same positions. Currently, uh we have 19 open positions. Um there's 119 employees in the DPW. Uh, two of those are in pre-employment with HR and

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there's another one that's going to be a conditional offer soon. Uh, so just to give you a little insight on what's going on in the DPW since the beginning of the year, uh, we've lost six employees through retirement and other

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uh, means. Uh, we've hired eight uh, and and we have, like I said, we have two in HR. And to give you some other insight, there are when when we go out to employ, it's not like say the police or the fire where you're hiring patrolman and they can fit

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anywhere. We have 47 distinct different positions. So, and what happens as well is when you have a promotion, you open up that position as well. So, that's what's happening now. We hire a assistant civil engineer. It opens up

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the junior engineer again. And that's a specific job description. The SM theme on streets is different than the SMO on water. So it it facilitates us opening it up again. So it's a it's a continuous motion. Uh I two weeks ago uh I had 11

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interviews I was in. Last week I was in nine. So and those are the short list. So it's time consuming but we're we're making a dent in it now. Um and we are moving positions around. Um the general two of the general foremen are now out

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um advertised and those are the ones we are kind of waiting on but now we're ready to pull the trigger on that. The third one will probably in be in a month. Uh so we're moving along in that direction. So, well, thank you for your update and thank you for your

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tremendous amount of work you had to do through the winter with snow removal and my thanks to your whole department on that. Thank you, Mr. Chair. >> Thank you, councelor. >> Councelor Robby, >> thank you. I thought there would be other counselors before me. Um, Mr.

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Scott, in the council when we do the budget, um, >> electricity is always one that is reduced and it's, I think, probably reduced with the assumption that you can backfill it with vacancies. Yep. >> Which has been done multiple times. So,

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if you start filling in your vacancies and they're not vacant when we do the FY27 budget and we still reduce electricity, how will you make that up next year? Well, I I speaking for councelor

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President Oing, you give me a budget and I make it work. So whether you cut it, whether it's electricity, then I have to rep prioritize um what's being um what's being um utilized. >> So whether it's like I'm doing now, I'm

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moving. If I'm moving from uh vacant positions, if you want to cut electricity, then I have to look at midyear the way through, how's it going? Do we have, you know, what we we deal a lot of in reaction in the public sector. We come in in the morning and we have

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something planned out and it's different. So when we get halfway through, we have a sense for what budgets are being done. Do we do we not do certain things like do we not line paint the roads and and use it, you know? So, we'll we'll adjust as we see

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fit. Um I understand what you're saying in electricity. Um it's it's we'll take the budget you give us. I'll show you I'll show you what the what the uh line items are to what was from last year and

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what has increased to sort of not really level funded but try to keep the same level of service and then we'll work from there. So, >> okay. And then my other question is on the new union contracts. Um I know the contracts got approved after the budget

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was set but we should have anticipated that they would be set. Why isn't there money in >> Oh, not all of them were were >> not all of them were approved after the budget. Correct. >> They were in the budget already. >> No, they were approved after.

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>> That's So that Why isn't there Why wasn't there money put into the fund where we could use to withdraw for contracts that got approved? Is that money >> reserved for salaries? I think that was cut that line item. So we

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>> So what what's on here is there was you did you did transfer for for um union contracts. >> Yep, we did. >> But I these are like kind of smaller ones. The contract ones. What happened was it just the leftover from >> I have to say DPW is very complicated.

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When you get into um interim forming and all this type of stuff, it's very hard. The transfer that was made was just a little bit short. So where I had to adjust some of the line items to make them correct. Most of them I did internally but some of them I can't

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because I can only move inside the division and salaries. So these are just the ones I couldn't do internally. It's not for a lot of money. It just had to be adjusted. That's all. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Thank you councelor C. Oh Mr. President

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President Austin. So to council ro I've been monitoring salaries in every department for the last 15 years that I've been assigned to the finance committee and then six years as president we are every year

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what's your mic on >> it is on >> every year we underrun salary Right now, today we are $1.5 million under running salary. We are $900,000

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under running in the DPW department. We're using $791 of that to offset various costs whether it's electricity, solid waste, whatever the the requests are. So, I know that going in and I try

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to impress upon the council that. All right. The real action should be cut the positions if we're not going to fill them. But this is year after year after year we underrun salary. So they say, "Okay, we cook $100,000 and know we may need it." Yeah, but I know you won't cut

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salaries. You won't. But you'll cut electricity. And I know and I have no problem sleeping at night knowing the money's going to get transferred from underrun and salary accounts. Just it's not a fault of Teds. It's not a fault of the

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cities. We just can't hire people. And I know that. So, I know when we approve a budget, we're going to have about $2 million under whatever we do that we tax people on that [clears throat] we shouldn't be, but we do. And then we use it to fill midyear transfers. And you're going to

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see another one at the end of the year transfers. My concern is with only $100,000 based on my math, do you have enough to hire the new folks coming in? I think you do. But Ted were to say, "I'm got all 19 positions filled tomorrow." There's not enough money to

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hire the 19 people. But I know Ted trying as hard as he can. Can't get people in here that fast. We'd love to have him here. So to think we're the the the my preferred method is just say take a million dollars out of the budget or

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pick a number that you want and let them figure out where it is because they're going to move money around which is okay. But Ted said the exact thing I want to hear as a department. I make the budget work with what's approved by the city council. Period.

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And and that's what it should be. That's what we give you. These are all managers. We give them the tools. Make it work. If they need more money, they'll come back. Free cash stabilization under salary items. There's all sorts of means to move. But when you're setting a budget and then

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setting the taxes, you know, I want to make sure we're spending the out. So, I have no issues cutting electricity knowing that it may come back. >> I don't want to have a back and back, but I can I just respond because I I think I I absolutely agree with your

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points. I think I was trying to make the point for one of the other items on the agenda >> that if in fact there is a desire to do something, the only way to do it is to cut the budget. And yes, we could start cutting salaries, but we won't. Therefore,

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department heads need to live with the budgets we get. And yes, Ted is doing a great job doing that, and I I commend him and as we all will. But if for some strange reason he can fill those 19 open positions or even

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eight of them, um, that's great. that means that there's less money for him to transfer in the future, yet we'll still keep making the cuts. So that will mean he will have to look at other things to

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make up the money. So I think it's we're we're not there yet, but we will have the budget soon. So these are all things for all department heads that we need to think about because it's not just electricity that's being cut or that should be cut. Thank you. >> Thank you, councelor. Councelor Ducet

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and then I'll go to councel. >> Thank you very much Mr. Chair. Um so you were talking before about um you know within the DPW organization people being promoted people leaving all this um year over year are you finding it trouble to

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fill the same position over many years or are you filling the positions it's just taking longer so that you know in the following year are you trying to fill a different positions or the same positions? No, it's different positions. So, the big uh so there's a wash

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>> we had some monumental things happen. Um uh the the general form and salary adjustment that the council was gracious enough to grant. That's going to allow us to hire the right people. We've been taking our time with that and we're ready to pull the trigger on those. that

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has a cascading effect. And and it and the other the other element was during the negotiation process, we got into the into the contract about uh performance-based um um interim foreman positions. That's

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huge. It's not seniority based anymore. It's performance-based. With that comes we need managers that that can um enact that performance uh requirements. In other words, we put someone in there and

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evaluate them. We need those people. That's what we're going through now. It takes time. So, this is we've we've we've hit the crest of the mountain and now we're we're getting where we need to go and it's and it's changing the culture and changing the dynamics of the

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DPW to be performancedriven um a lot more. And so that's we're kind of on hold a little bit there and now we've crusted and now we're we're going to be taking off trying to fill these positions and they're they're not the same. uh just in engineering assistant

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city engineer went up, opened that up, opened the civil assistant civil who moved up. We had junior engineers filled and now that moves up. So now we go back out with that uh job description. Some are hotter than others and it it it's a um it was always hard to find junior

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engineers and we f filled two of them. It's been we just filled in the electrician which floored me because I never thought we'd get an a trades person and uh that's in pre-employment. So it's a hit or miss type thing and um the SMOS and those not a lot of people

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have CDLs. Uh it's just a matter of going through as many people as you can, shortlisting, going through and just keep just trying to pick the right person, the right character, the right personality to to to to meld well in the in the uh DPW.

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>> Okay. And also it's um important to point out that what we're talking about is basically a dynamic, you know, [clears throat] the ro the positions open this year are different than the positions open last year and different than positions open next year. Some of the positions are the same. They're not

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the same opening. We fill that, someone leaves. That might be the same own water again. >> Yeah. >> But it's not the exact same position. >> Okay. >> Because someone left. >> Yeah. Because I I I think that's an important nuance just to get clarified with this. So, thank you.

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>> Thank you, Council Vital. >> Thank you, Mr. Chair. Thank you, Commissioner, for putting all these numbers together and playing the nut game that we do every year. Um I Unlike um I don't like spending so much on electricity because a dollar is a

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dollar whether it's coming from salaries or from electricity. Have we ever I was talking with a friend who's the principal at Al Gangquin and they have uh car ports over their student parking lot that are actually solar panels and he was told he was going to save 50% on

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electricity. He ended up saving like 27%. 27% of school electricity would be a nice piece of change that we could do down at the high school. Have we ever considered putting solar panels in over the >> Can I ask you when he did that? Was that >> That was about three I don't know. It

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was a while ago. >> A while ago it was a lot different than right now. We did look into it and a lot of it is the return is so many years out. Um we did look into it. We're going to keep looking into that but it seems like it's >> cuz there's no cost setup. There's no

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cost to putting them in, right? >> Yeah. The structure cost, there's an upfront there's a big upfront cost with the structure and everything. If you already had a structure and you replace the panels, that's why like a roof on a school is something that makes sense when you put the when you have to build the structure. That's where it kind of

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became cost prohibitive. >> Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Thank you, Mr. Chair. >> Council Council or >> Thank you, Mr. Chair. um you hit a certain point that I really always ask questions on to and that's energy. Look

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what's going on right now. Prices of oil is going up, you know, and so forth and so on. So I think we're going to see and I hope we see this more clean energy. Our governor just enacted something today on clean energy. So hopefully, you

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know, the canopies they have at the Whan Town Hall could be in Maro at a school, you know, and maybe the cost, the upfront cost will ma be able to be managed with the price of oil going up. And I am not in favor of any use of oil or gas if we can avoid it by

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implementing new technologies that are clean energy. You know, it's we need I keep bringing up at the budget time too and cutting electricity budgets is the incentive in my view to keep trying to look for that. That's why I keep trying to cut that. It's just not shutting off

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the lights. I know that. So hopefully continue with that that to try to implement implement more clean energy and I think we need as everyone in this country needs to look and the world needs to look at implementing cleaner energy and we'll see the savings in the

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long run because oil is vulnerable as we see and unfortunately people die over it too. Uh SMOS >> special maintenance equipment operators. >> Thank you. You said it several laborers and they also operate they have their

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CDL commercial driver's license and they also have their hoisting license to operate loaders uh skid steers excavators. >> Are you finding this I'm sure you talk with your fellows in other cities and towns. Are they finding the same trend

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of finding qualified candidates is getting more difficult? So, so one of the one of the reasons we we weren't um we waited for the negotiations to try to get the salaries up to see if we can attract people from other we have got

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some um the to be honest some of the ones we had uh we interview anybody that has their their CDL um they haven't been the most attractive. It seems like we're getting more people that don't have their CDL.

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Uh, but we have hired some that have their CDO. So, it's it's hard. >> I understand. And >> we'd we'd rather hire someone with the right work ethic, right personality, right right uh idea of of of doing stuff than someone that just happens to have

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their CDL. We can we can train someone to do the actual work, but to have the right work ethic uh is more important to us. >> And my last question, if I may, Mr. chair, what can we send out to our residents to help with the increased

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cost in rubbish collection? Is there a way more in the recycling bin or is there another avenue we need to be looking at like bringing the cardboard down to the transfer station as you indicated to me is a good situation. But again, that's gone up quite a bit. That

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went up uh what was it two through 283 I think when I looked at paperwork. That's a lot. And I rubbish isn't cheap. what can we send out to our residents to say help us? >> It's difficult because um the unless you have a specific contract,

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they don't monitor how much you recycle. So, you're not getting we could recycle, but if the other towns aren't, you're not getting uh any discount. The recycling if you the more you recycle the better because that that's at $95 a ton instead

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of $124 a ton. So the more people can recycle the better. >> Yeah. >> However, we know that the people don't always play by the rules. So, >> and when is that contract coming up? Rubbish and recycle. >> We just did that. So,

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>> that was just that was just um um last July 1st of 25. So, we have it for another five years. >> Five years. Okay. Okay. Good. But >> and that was the difference. That was the renegotiation of the contract. We We had a nice deal going. It's like any

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contract. You're making a deal and then certain later you got to pay the piper. Sooner or later you got to catch up. And that was the catch-up. I see. So we were making out there for a while. Now we catch up we for another 5 years and God knows what will happen in 5 years. But >> so the message is use the green bins,

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try to avoid using the blue bins, but make sure it's recycling in the area. We will have an enforcer out there making sure. Thank you. Thank you T. Thank you Mr. Chair. >> Thank if there's no further discussion. And I would entertain a motion for the DPW. Oh, council.

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>> Mr. Chair, you got to do a page turn. You got to take each number individually so the councils know what they're voting on because I have questions on some of the sheets. So, start with the 300,000. Go to the next page and the next page and work your way through. >> Thank you, Mr. President. Okay. So,

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starting with the uh the first one with the 300,000 on the electricity side, Mr. President. That one. >> That is correct. Yeah. >> Thank you. I will entertain a motion for the 300,000. >> Motion to approve. >> Any further discussion? See none. All in

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favor? Carries. 1 2 3 4 5. Next item on flipping the pages is 286,000. Um to go to the uh rubbish collection adjustment to new contract. Um I will entertain a motion.

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>> I got a question. There's a motion. >> Motion to approve. >> Motion's been made and seconded to approve the 286,000. Any further discussion? President Austin. >> Thank you, Mr. Chairman. So Ted, this is 286,000. None of the 14,000. So I assume

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they're both for the increase contract. >> Correct. >> That's a 300,000 increase. So if my math works, that's a 10% increase in the rubbish collection because we got $3 million in the budget for >> it's uh four four mill. You got

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recycling and trash. It's four. >> I'm just going the money's up. The money that's going into this 52920 collection account is 286,000 and the next page is 14. So that's 300,000. >> True. >> The total budget if you want to take it

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in one accountion. So my question is how much is how much does the contract? So this is to finish fiscal year 26. You're going to submit a fiscal year 27. So you're going to start at 3.3 million. What's the increase percentage increase

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for 2027? >> I don't know what the percentage, but it is it is um next next year's budget to keep on contract is close to 600,000 because we got to make up for this one.

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Right. Yeah. And for next year, so basically telling me it's another $300,000 for next year as well. Thank you very >> Thank you, Mr. President. Next uh item on the flipping of the pages is a $150,000 transfer. >> Do you want to vote, Mr. Chair? Did you want to vote on that one individually?

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>> Yes. So So I'm sorry. Uh >> motion to approve the full motion to approve the $286,000. All in thank you, council. All in favor? 1 2 3 4 5. Thank you, C. Next is the $150,000 uh increased usage of electricity. I

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will entertain a motion. >> Motion to approve. >> Motion's made in seconded to approve the $150,000 for electricity. Any further discussion? Mr. >> Chair, just >> I think we did that one already. >> President O.

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the the money that's encumbered and carried over is that to pay the prior year's bills or is that leftover money from last year? So for this >> encumbered where >> in my paper August >> in electricity >> that is correct. Yeah.

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>> So there's 178 covered for the school side and 199 >> is to pay the next bill. >> So it's to pay >> to pay the bill we haven't got is pay pay June's bills. >> Okay. Thank you. Thank you Mr. Chair. Um motions were made and and I will make

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a motion to approve the $150,000. Any motion to approve? All in favor? 1 2 3 4 5. That carries. Next up is going down the list is $18,000 for professional technical

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services uh to fund uh additional services. >> Mr. Chair, Council Fillo, >> move to approve. Motion was made and seconded to approve the $18,000. Any further discussion? Seeing none, all in favor? One, two, three, four, five.

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Next up is $10,000 for the increased overtime cost. Uh, what are you what are you reading about? >> Page five. >> Page five. >> Page five. >> Just take the bottom number at the bottom. The total.

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>> Oh, the total. Mr. present. >> Um, so on the next page on page five, the total is $35,200. I will entertain a motion. >> Motion to approve. >> Motion made and seconded to approve. All in uh any further discussion,

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>> Mr. Chair, >> all these adjustments to salaries, Mr. Commissioner, is are these becoming effective 71? >> No. So what happened was that I was trying to explain that before. uh with contracts and cola the transfer that was

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made wasn't quite enough because it it was confusing. So ordinarily I just internally transfer to make up the shortfall and salary and these I didn't have any extra money in that division in that salary item to make up for it. So I need to are

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>> these for collective bargaining positions or for >> Yeah. So it was based upon the contract. So that it's not just the salary. There's other there's other things such as interim form and overtime everything had to be adjusted. So that's where

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salaries sometimes I borrowed from the salary to pay for overtime. So this is just getting money back. >> So tell me when So will these be effective when we vote on it at the next council meeting? >> Yeah. Yes. For this year. Yeah. >> Thank you, Commissioner. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

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>> Thank you, Council. Motion has been made and seconded to approve the 14,000. All in sorry of the $35,200. All in favor? 1 2 3 4 5. That carries. Next up on the next one is for $14,000

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for the rubbish collection uh for adjustments to the new contract. I know we we discussed part of the new contract. I'll enterain. Motions are made and seconded to approve the $14,000 media transfer. Any further discussion? Seeing none, all

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in favor? One, two, three, four, five. Next up is a total of $6,400. Uh, these are salary adjustments. I will entertain a motion. >> Motion to approve. >> Motion made and seconded to approve the midyear transfer in the amount of

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$6,400. Any further discussion? Seeing none, all in favor? One, two, three, four, five. That carries. That should end the DPW side, which would be a total of $791,600

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midyear transfer. >> Thank you. >> Thank you, Commissioner. Uh, next up is the uh midyear transfer uh for the fire department and vacation sick time buyback. Uh, this is an increase due to the contractual

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increases. So basically uh due to the last CBA contract, this total amount is for $125,000 and I will go through if anyone had any questions. I personally do not, but the total is

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$125,000 and I will entertain a motion. >> Motion to approve. >> Motion made and seconded to approve the midyear transfer request uh in the amount of $125,000. Any further discussion, Mr. President? >> Thank you, Mr. Chair. So, I did have a couple of questions if the >> Thank you.

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>> Chief or patroller want to come up. Congratulations again. >> Oh, thank you very much. >> So, the letter states three retirements. So, I went back to the uh retirement board and I can only come up with two. Am I

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missing one or one projected? >> We have two projected >> two projected for the B coming in this year. >> Correct. One's leaving the end of March and the other one leaves at the end of April, I believe. >> And the other one was Chief Green.

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>> Yes. >> Okay. That's very Thank you. >> Thank you, Chief. Motion. >> Motion to approve. >> Motion's been made and seconded to approve the $125,000 transfer. All in favor? One, two, three, four, five. It carries. Thank you,

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chief. Thank you, chief. Next up is uh midyear transfers from the auditor, legal, veterans, and human resources department. Uh this is totaling uh $768. Um I will entertain a motion. >> Motion to approve.

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>> Motion's been made and seconded to approve. Any further discussion? Seeing none, all in favor? 1 2 3 4 5. That carries. Next up is the two salary line items that are slightly undefunded for the city clerk's office. And this is in a

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total amount of $160. I know I reached out to the city clerk. I have no no issues with this particular one, but I will entertain a motion. >> Motion to approve. >> Motion's been made and seconded to approve the $160 midyear transfer for the clerk's office. Any further

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discussion? I will second that. Any further discussion? Seeing none, all in favor? That carries. >> Mr. Chair, >> Mr. Mr. President, >> I ask for the finance committee to consider suspending the rules so the audit can get these uh in in March

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before the April books. >> I'm sorry. What was that? M for the auditor. >> Yep. No. Can you ask for a suspension of the rules? Yep. Uh is the finance committee okay with a suspension of the rules? Perfect. Thank you, Mr. President. Okay, next up we will now go in back in

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order. Um the next item on the agenda is order number 26-1009639. Uh proposed salary ordinance amendment pursuant to chapter 125 personnel section 6 salary schedule relative to position of the city solicitor. Um I

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will begin by reading the letter submitted by the mayor. Dear council president Oing and counselors uh in close for your review and approval, please uh find an amendment to the city's salary ordinance for the city solicitor's position. Uh

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the purpose of this ordinance update is to bring this position to into alignment uh with others that have previously been sent down. Uh the proposed changes are part of our ongoing effort to finalize updates for all positions. Given that

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this position has not been updated since 2017, an adjustment is necessary to reflect current market conditions, support employee retention, remain competitive with surrounding communities and strengthen long-term succession planning within the department. uh with

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only cost of living adjustments applied since 2017 and no additional incentives or stipens comparable to the uh those included in union contracts. Uh these positions are being reviewed to ensure just wages within the Commonwealth and surrounding areas. I appreciate your

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consideration. Please do not hesitate to contact me or my office uh with any questions. Sincerely, Jay Christian Dumis Mayor. Um I uh personally uh fully support this position. Um I will open it

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up to the finance team. I know that we've previously had a lot of discussions on on budget talks and uh and and getting to a number during uh for the budget. Um I know that we had it built into the budget for the uh the assistant police

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chief. Um so I certainly would be supporting this. Um, I would be probably looking at an effective date. Um, it is July 1st, 2026. Uh, but I will open that up to the finance team. >> Motion to accept. >> Council of Vital.

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>> Motion to accept. >> Mot. So, what we'll be doing is um motion to approve the amendment. >> Motion to approve the increase. >> Yep. Motion has been made and seconded to approve order number 10 19639

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proposed salary ordinance amendment pursuant to chapter 125 personal personnel section six salary schedule relative to the position of city sele solicitor. Um I would like to see it effective date July 1st 2026. Uh any

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further discussion? >> President Austin. >> Thank you Mr. Chair. I I support the July 1. I think all these things should be July 1st. Paying back in the rears, I don't think is a good position to put the council or the city in. >> Thank you, M. I appreciate that, Mr. President. Council Villa.

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>> Thank you, Mr. Chair. And just for clarification with council vital's motion, whether this would make it effective July 1st, 2026. >> That's correct. >> Thank you, Mr. Chair. >> Thank you, Council Villa. >> Thank you, Council. >> Councelor Ruby. >> So, can I are you amending the order

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because the order has January 1st, 2026? Look, if I can, we can make it whatever. It's not amending the order. We're changing it to say it's July 1st. >> Was the motion for July 1st or January 1st? I just want clarification.

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>> The motion is for July 1st. >> Okay. >> Motion has been made and seconded to approve order number 26-1009639. Any further discussion? Seeing none, all in favor? Carries. 1 2 3 4 5. >> Mr. Chair.

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>> Yes, Mr. President. >> Could I ask for the finance committee to consider suspending the rules to advertise? Thank you. >> Thank you, Mr. President. I'd like to ask for I would do that uh when I report it out on the Monday night meeting, Mr. President. Yes.

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>> And the finance team would be fine with uh a suspension to advertise. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. President. Next up is order number 26-1009640. Um proposed salary ordinance amendment pursuant to chapter 125 personnel

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section six salary schedule relative to the position of assistant fire chief. I'll begin uh by reading the letter submitted uh by the mayor. Uh dear councel president Oing and counselors and close for your review and approval. Please find an amendment to the city

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salary ordinance for the uh assistant fire chief's position positions. Uh the purpose of this ordinance update is to bring this position into alignment with the deputy police chief position uh with impending changes in the fire department in in coming weeks. It is necessary to

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re-evaluate uh the assistant fire chief salary to ensure it remains competitive, supports retention of our highly valued employees and prepares for an anticipated uh vacancy. uh based on current union salaries and lower ranked positions. Uh it is important to

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maintain a competitive salary for those who supervise these roles. This adjustment is necessary not only for the retention and competitive recruitment but also to uphold appropriate organizational and professional standards within the department. As

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noted in other correspondents, the salary for the assistant fire chiefs have not been updated since 2017, and I feel now is the time to amend this ordinance. I appreciate your consideration, and please do not hesitate to contact me or my office with

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any question. Sincerely, Jade Christian Dumis, Mayor. Um, I propose the I I again, this is a job that position that I fully support. Um and similar like it says about the police chief position. Um

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I would certainly uh entertain a motion uh as the previous motion would be to uh support this and make the amendment as effective July 1st 2026. >> So moved. >> Motion made and second motion to be

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made. Uh I will ask uh if it is okay for the finance committee to have the mayor speak. >> The chair. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. >> Thank you. >> I just want to add one comment. The reason why we backdated to October 8th was because that's the first day that

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the deputy police chief started with his new contract. So that's the only reason why we did October 8th. It wasn't just an arbitrary date that we picked. It was just to make sure that everything was fluid with that. However you decide that, that's that's the reason why we chose that. Oh, thank you. I'm glad. So

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there's so there's that same >> with the deputy chief and now so it's consistent throughout all of our assistant chiefs both for public safety. However you decide that's fine with me. I just wanted some context behind that's why we chose. >> Thank you Mr. Mayor. >> Okay. >> Thank you Mr. Chair.

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>> President. >> So so I noticed there's no since our chief has moved out of one of the assistant position chief fire chief positions. There's nothing advertised. Are we hiring internally? Are we how are we going about filling the second? We will be filling that role for the new

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fiscal year of July 1st. >> So, >> so with that, Mr. Chair, I recommend that the starting salary stay at July 1st, 2026, >> and the order would have to be advertised. >> Thank you. Thank y Thank you, Mr. President. >> Mr. Chair, I just I'm looking at the the

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salary grade for 2017 and it doesn't have any of the steps except for step seven. >> Correct. We created a step program so it nears the same as a deputy chief. >> Can you tell me just how much it's going up in step one? Because if we hire a new

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deputy chief, they would go to step one. What is it now? And what and you're recommending that it goes up to 165,000. What is it now? >> She's at Mr. Chair. >> Mr. President, >> so the assistant fire chief office is currently making 144923,0004.

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that position would see a 20 grand increase. >> The assistant superintendent fire chief is making $157,989 and that would see a $7,000 uh increase. Now, I agree aligning the the fire department with the police department is

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the right thing to avoid any challenges. My next challenge I'm going to see is I want two deputy police chiefs. I can see that one's coming. >> No, not on my watch there will be. [laughter] Um >> I'm just saying so to answer you does that answer your question council by >> it does >> so to put in

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>> Thank you Mr. President >> so to put things in perspective so if you want to talk about secession planning the battalion chiefs that are underneath the assistant chief are the top four make 200 and then some. So when you talk about secession planning you want an internal candidate. If the

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battalion chief wants to go to assistant chief they'll be taking a pay cut. So having said that there's a fine balance that we have to go in between between the battalion chief and what the current assistant chief makes now. So and then to the next point is so if the new the

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assistant chief that's currently now in this position if he doesn't start till July 1st the deputy chief would already would have the six-month increase. So then there will be a pay increase. So the new deputy chief will be already making step two before the assistant

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chief will be making step one. So you can see how difficult this is when you try to have complete transparency and when you try to pay equitably. So now you have a new position that was created already making more money than existing public safety assistant chief as well. Um again that's why we backdated to

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October 8th. I'm not trying to push that argument but these decisions that you make have consequences regarding the positions that are currently in now. >> I'll yield to council >> councelor Rubby. >> Thank you. So Mr. Mayor, if the police

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chief was changed in October, why didn't you come to us, deputy chief? Why didn't you come to us to alter the fire assistant chief so they would be comparable at the same time? And won't they always be an equity issue if one leaves and you hire someone new?

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>> There will be, but >> they're never going to be paid the same amount of money. >> Correct. But that's for the long term. Like I'm focusing on this current situation that we're in now. So when you see the salary study come down, I'm in the same predicament that we are in now. When you have people that are here for

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long-term and then if you start them at step one, there's a pay discrepancy. Now, it's unfortunate like this is where we're at currently based upon this salary study that we're currently in. >> But aren't we here where we are because this was not brought to us in November, but instead in January.

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>> So >> do we have to back pay >> instead of paying going forward? Correct. >> So, Mr. Chair, >> you can argue the equity thing. This is what the adjustments are significant and

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the council's deciding when the adjustments take effect. All right. And the motion's been made and seconded to started July 1st, 2026 at $165,000. That's what's going to be in the budget. >> Correct. >> And it's going to be a significant adder from the current salaries. It just is.

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All right. So, the equity part, I get it. But that's that I'm I'm not I'm not the equity guy. I'm the money guy. All right. And I got taxpayers to answer to. Not that I treat someone fairly. >> Thank you, Mr. Chair.

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>> Thank you, President Council. >> Mr. Chair, thank you. So, I defer to the president. If this goes into effect, we're talking about a $40,000 increase between the two deputy chiefs >> for the current pay scale. Yes.

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Thereabouts >> the $27,000 increase. >> 27 for both of them. >> Well, no. Combined, >> if I can, Mr. If you go from the current salary 144,000 and 157,000 and you make them both 165,000

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about 27,000. >> Okay. Thank you, Mr. President. >> Thank you, President. >> Thank you, Mr. Chair. >> All right. With that said, motion has been made and seconded to approve order number 26-1009640, proposed salary ordinance amendment

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pursuant to chapter 125 personnel section six salary schedule relative to the position of the assistant fire chief to have an effective uh date uh as of July 1st, 2026 and also ask for a

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suspension to advertise. All in favor? One, two, three, four. All opposed one. Thank you, council. >> Thank you. Moving on to the next item on the agenda is the uh resolution. So, it's order

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number 26-1009670 resolution from council vital municipal budget. Um and I will read the letter that was submitted um by council vital um for the resolution. Where is the city council recognizes the importance of

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maintaining essential municipal services while also ensuring that increases in residential property taxes remain reasonable and predictable for homeowners. And whereas the rising cost of municipal operations require careful fiscal planning to balance services

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delivery with taxpayers affordability. And whereas uh prior municipal budgets have resulted in increased financial pressure on residential taxpayers and the city council seeks to establish clearer limits and greater predictability in future budget

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proposals. Uh be it resolved that the mayor is hereby requested to submit a proposed municipal operating budget uh for the upcoming fiscal year that limits the impact on residential uh property taxes to no more than an average

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increase of $250 per poor per per residential property. And this was submitted by council of vital. Um, and I I do uh respect council vital for sending this down and I certainly will be uh supporting my uh my colleague on

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the council with this and I will open that up to council vital. >> Thank you, Mr. Chair. I think I speak for everyone here, but maybe not. But every time we get a budget, you know, we always have a a um

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a discussion about transferring, you know, pick a number and and the department heads will figure it all out. And that's really not how we should be doing a budget. We should be doing a budget by saying okay what is the

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what what level of of uh money do we need to balance what all the operational costs along with our property taxes that we have to assign to our to our residents and we just kind of wing it.

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we just kind of go down a long list and and I don't feel comfortable about taking a h 100red,000 or 100 million away from electricity on the DPW side of things or whatever it might be. It's not my it's not I don't know enough about the budget to be able to to make some of

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the cuts that we have done in the past and we never make as many many cuts as we should. So, I wanted to try to get a little bit proactive in the process rather than being reactive at the end when every all these department heads have already talked with the mayor and discussed their budgets and we get this

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big pile of money that we have to fund. I thought that it would be wise for us to take a proactive stance and say, "Mr. Mayor, department heads, we can't do what we did last time. We can't ask our residents to pay another high property

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tax bill. We just can't. And I know we don't like cutting wages, but if we need to cut wages, we need to cut wages. We can't continue to charge

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our families and our seniors a huge amount. We're forcing our seniors to have to sell their house because we keep giving them a 500 or 300, whatever it might be, a large property tax bill. We can't continue to do it that way. We

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keep kicking the can down the road, but the can's going to come back and kick us one of these years. So, that's why I did I presented this resolution. >> Thank you, Council. And I do want to mention because I know Councelor Roby has mentioned it during the Monday night meeting before this went into committee.

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Um, and she is absolutely correct. um when we come time to to uh have our budget hearings, uh you have a line item and we can cut it. Um I don't know how much this will have for the mayor to to

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go forward with and and adhere to. Um but I think it's a it's a great heads up to respectfully um show the mayor where we're heading during the budget season. So respectfully I do support this but there's no question with some of the things that councilor Roby had said at

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the meeting are true. We don't know some of the outcome. We don't know what as of going to be what the healthcare. So there's a lot of uh speculation in there. We don't know but I do support you council vital and I will open that to the rest of the committee. Uh council fell.

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>> Thank you Mr. chair and thank you councelor Vital for proposing this and uh as you know I've enjoyed the last two fiscal years being with you on the finance committee and working through that budget. Off the top of my head, I could be wrong, but I think we've supported close to $2.1 million worth of adjustments as a group. And um I know

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councelor Gould is new to the committee, but um with councelor Brown, right, we we had worked hard on some many long nights to comb through it and to try to make adjustments um for the sake of maintaining, right, essential municipal services, like you said, councelor Vital, um while ensuring that increases

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on property taxes remain reasonable. Now, we we failed to do that this year. We had a significant, you know, budget increase, one that's unprecedented for the city of Malro. Um, but with that being said, I don't know what fiscal year 2027 is going to look like. I haven't gotten a chance to take a crack at the budget and I feel that as

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councilors, we do get a chance to take a crack at the budget like councelor Roby said um, a couple meetings ago. So, um, you know, although I do I I appreciate the resolution and I appreciate kind of the the avenue in which you're trying to go about this council vital, um, I don't want to, um, have the mayor or

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department heads, um, feeling as if they don't have the confidence in the council and vice versa. I want them to come down here with a budget and if we have to make significant alterations, if we have to make significant cuts, then I will, you know, sit through that night and if it has to be many nights, right, I will sit there and do that with this council.

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Um I just worry that by um you know tying the mayor's hands a little too quickly here. We we could get into a a troublesome spot as a council. We we get a crack at it just like uh I mean we do get the crack at it as a council. So um you know for myself I I'll sit here as

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long as it takes on those nights and you're completely correct. There have been years in which we probably should have cut more. I mean we know that right? We're always operating and you we just saw the midyear transfers. We'll see the year-end transfers. there's always going to be um you know empty empty positions. There's going to be salaries that are not filled. Um that

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money is going to be there. So um but with that respect I don't think I can support this resolution tonight. Thank you Mr. Chair. >> Thank you councelor Fill. >> Uh President Oi. >> Thank you. [clears throat] You know I think here on today we all can say we're going to be

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tough on the budget this year. We're going to be making those cuts. We got to do what we can for our residents until we get inundated with emails from the school, from the teachers, until we're picketed out in front of city hall by

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the teachers and then we kind of come in here and we melt at least based on our previous history, a recent previous history. You know, I think we just need to take a stand ahead of time and say this is

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where we are tonight and this is where we hope to be at budget time and the only way that happens is that we get to take a strong tonight, not at budget time because that just doesn't happen. I yield back to >> President.

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Thank you, Mr. Chair. Um, so a couple things. Why? Why? I I admire the resolution. I struggle supporting it. And and my compromise would be when the mayor submits the budget, have the comproller send down what a $250 tax adjustment figure is going to look like.

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My guess it's going to be around $8 million bucks, maybe 8.5ish. All right. So, so far as value, $1.5 million increase. Pension $400,000 increase. water,

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$400,000 a piece. Thank you, council name, for that information. Not it's not his fault. Uh school uh and and I'm going to give Jason a lot of credit, the superintendent of the school. He's got

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it around 2.9 million so far. That's huge. That's great compared to 8 something last year. All right. Uh salaries, everybody gets a 3% raise. It's about $2 million. So I Mike's math

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is I'm at 7.2 million and I haven't touched bonds, health insurance, any other fun stuff based on a 4% increase of our current budget of 213 million. That would be come in around 8.5 million. If you want a 4% increase in

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the budget, we know our state increase is zero this year. All right. So you got budget equals state money plus local receipts plus taxes. Well, I'm starting with one/ird of my equation at zero for an increase. All right. So it's either

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going to be made up by local receipts or taxes. Take your pick. All right. So the hard work comes at budget time when the budget comes down. And that's our job to adjust the budget. The mayor's job is to go say what he needs or he thinks he

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needs to run the city. Our job is to go adjust that. Excluding last year, the prior 15 years, and I just didn't go back any further, the average house tax increase was less than $200. This year was the first time it exceeded that at

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$591 million. 500 million $591 for the average tax. All right, that was a $17 million increase in the budget. We've never seen anything close to that. That was double what we've ever had in the past. So the

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message if you want to be at 250 for an average tax increase, you're probably looking around a 4% increase in the budget. But I would instead of the resolution, I would ask that the controller just send down if that's what you want, what's a $250 increase look

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like for a budget increase, right? cuz he's the controller when he sends the budget is going to tell you what he thinks and he's been pretty darn good what the budget's going to cost us for the average house. I mean, you just

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you gotten good at it. Thank you, Brian. All right. And so, so we know that. So, and it's going to be within the, you know, plus or minus. But if you don't like it and it comes down to $500, you don't like it. Well, it's probably pretty simple. You got to cut the budget, right? And I'll put my plug in

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for projects. You got to approve projects. You can't reject every project coming before the council. We need new growth. Period. And the state. Thank you, Mr. Chair. >> Thank you, President Os. I'll go to councelor Navy.

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>> Thank you, Mr. Chair. Um glad I didn't raise my hand before President Ning. It was well said. Um, you know, I'll add my voice to the chorus commending councelor Vital for putting something forward um that, you know, clearly articulates, you know, some of the fears that we're all um that

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we're all facing based on escalating budgets um escalating cost of living. Um I find myself in a similar position to the president and councelor Fill. Um you know, we come year-over-year. We don't, you know, to, you know, what councelor Vital said, um, we all, we have varying

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levels of experience here on the council, but we don't, any of us have, um, the level of insight, save maybe the president, um, of the day-to-day runningings of the city. Um, we don't communicate as often as we send things, um, to our department heads, we don't

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communicate on a daily basis. We don't have an a real intimate knowledge of the running of each of these departments. Um, I I think personally it would be pennywise and pound foolish to put these constraints on the mayor. Um

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it's his job to understand what it takes to run this city and it's his job to then send down what he thinks. And we all hear from residents about the increases in taxes. Guess who else hears about that? The mayor. And it is his job um to still send down what he believes

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is both needed for his department heads. You know, he gets it on both sides. He gets it from the department heads and then he gets it from the residents who get the tax bills. Um so I I am concerned um by putting an arbitrary number um on what the budget would look like. You know, as the president said,

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that's our job. You know, there's not I I don't like to say this out loud and I don't take it lightly. You know, there are not a lot of jobs that we have here on the council, mind you, for zoning and special permits. You know, we don't get to increase the budget. We get to cut the budget. I don't I don't want to give

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one more thing away. Um, you know, as far as influence is considered here. You know, it's it's our job. Um, I take I take a little bit of umbrage, counselor vital, and I don't take it um in any sort of negative way, but you know, I don't think we melt just when we hear

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advocacy of other people. Um, I know we were all a little stressed about the increase in the school budget last year. Um, you know, but putting putting that aside, I think that when people advocate, we do listen and sometimes we do have a hard time cutting

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things um because we, you know, we see firsthand what it what it what the impacts are. And so, you know, I'm I'm a little concerned by taking a vote now when we haven't seen the the details. So, um I don't want to keep going on, but you know, I do I do believe this is

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our job and I know we are all um president's been teeing us up now for a few months. I think we're all ready to really dig into the budget a little bit harder this year. Um you know, and dig into, you know, serious reviews of the projects that come before us, you know, and I'd say dig into advocating for more state aid, but I think we're a little uh

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I think we're a little out of luck on that one for this go round. So, um that said, um again, I do want to thank you, Councelor Vital, for for bringing this forward. But I think it's an important conversation that we have in advance of the budget coming down from the mayor and so I'll >> thank you councelor N. >> Thanks >> councelor Ducet.

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>> Thank you very much Mr. Chair. Um and thank you council vital for bringing this up. Um I this I have a couple of concerns. I think council re really summarized it pretty well as far as having this be a go a guideline for us

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versus a hard hard framework. you know, to, you know, to have the comproller come back and say, "Okay, if the budget's going to increase by not I I don't like straight numbers because they tend to die with inflation, but percentages would be better, so 4% or something, whatever we feel is

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appropriate, you know. Um, but anything beyond that, we'd have to cut like this much money coming out of the controller as a report." So we know when we get into the budget effectively how much we need to cut instead of just kind of oh I think this or I think that. So I think

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that that would be a good guideline for that. Um but also I think the other thing to take into account is 3 years ago uh the city had zero tax rate increase. Okay. And I know enough about

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industry and businesses that a 0% eventually you have to pay back later. Okay? And that's what we did this year. Okay? [clears throat] Because and we can argue about the numbers, but at the end of the day, that seems to have been the result. Instead of having this regular standard trend going in one direction,

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we had a dip and an override, but it still averages out in that direction. Okay. So I think we just, you know, we got a low, we got a high, but in the average out it will. But I think, you know, if we can change the amount to be

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a percentage and to have the comproller report what sort of cuts would be required to get to that goal means that it puts the resolution on us, not the mayor, when we come to the budget review. And I think that would be the better way to do it. Thank you. Thank

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you, councelor Ducet, councelor Orum and then I'll go to councelor W. >> Thank you. Great comments from everyone and I don't disagree. We have got to make sure we are trying our best to provide for both ends of our generations, our youth

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in schools and our seniors that are barely making it. And that's been the way here for many years. I've stood up on this floor prior when I was a w 6 counselor talking about my mother not being able to afford going into a new condo because her house wouldn't sell

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and she couldn't afford the HOA funds. So growth is important but new growth has to be controlled growth. You need appropriate planning or you're going to find services are going to be required

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for that growth and it may be more than what you are getting in taxes. That is so important to take an understanding of just not as easy as saying new growth in my view. But indeed our seniors I've been there. I've seen it with my own

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family. But at the same time, if we start trying to shortch change our schools, I can promise you the real estate market will be talking to you because a city or a town sells on your

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school services. They're important, not just important for the sale of your city or the benefit of people moving in, but for your children who you are sending to school. You want them to have the best. and I will continue to support our schools that we provide the best and

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trust our controller on what he provides us and it's serious and I agree the seniors need we need to start looking at more programs council you're right on with that u the uncontrolled cost

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energy we talked about energy tonight energy is an uncontrolled cost and I and the state not funding us uh they're in they're in trouble as much as we are. And what I see is that it is going to be a tough year. We should look at all revenues, including MEDC, and I will

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bring that up again because that's close to a million dollars a year that they get from taxes that could go into our coffers. So, let's make sure when we look at the budget and we're going to look at cutting, let's make sure we treat all people drawing from our taxes

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the same way. Thank you, Mr. Mr. Chair. >> Thank you, Council. from uh President Oi. >> So two things, council or the MEEDC funds are not going into anybody's coffers. Those are monies paid by people that go into the hotels. So that's an

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incorrect statement. I just you get on this every time and I have to correct you every time. It's not that that's money that goes into the from the hotel tax that pays for MEDC. Not a taxpayer is impacted in this city

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by that. So that that's just a wrong statement that I will continue to hop on every time you mention it. Um, thank you. >> Thanks, Mr. Chair. I'm I'm going to go to council. >> I want to respond to that. Thank you. >> Yeah, there's >> So I'm going to councelor Roi. Councelor Ro.

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>> Thank you, Mr. Chair. Uh, I'm not on the finance committee, so I don't really have a vote tonight, but I know there was discussion about changing this order to word it differently so that it was really put on almost a the council

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agrees to a 4% increase. And I'm not sure that the council really wants to at this point make that decision. That that was what I tried to impress upon you when I spoke when this was on the agenda. The mayor gives us a budget and then the council looks at it and decides

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if we need to cut it. If you have in mind 4% your goal, then cut it to that. But why? I mean, I guess it's 4% because it gets us to an average increase of 250.

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>> But why why an average increase of 250? I I still am just amazed that there's this magic number that somebody thinks is the right number to increase the taxes when we don't know what our bigger

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numbers are going to be. And yes, it's nice to hear that the schools might not go up. Uh 4.6 million and it wasn't 4.6 7.2 million for the schools and 4 and a half for the um insurance. But my guess

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is since they increased last year that they're going to increase more than I mean if it's only 4% that would be amazing but insurance is not going to increase 4%. Um, so why not you let just let the mayor present his budget and

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then let this council work at that budget to decide where we agree as a group that that budget should be and take this resolution and say thank you for bringing it to us to our

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attention. Um, but file it. >> Thank you. Thank you councelor Ruby. Councelor Jet. Thank you very much, Mr. Chair. Um, two two things in the last conversation that happened. Um, first is for MEEDC,

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it is the restaurant. No, it's the hotel tax to do that. So, some tax is being paid by someone. Okay. If someone from Malboro does an overnight at, you know, one of the hotels, they're going to be paying taxes that way, even though most of it's coming from outside. But I, what

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I understand is that revenue has to be used for MEDC. That was part of the agreement of standing up MADC as an organization and we can't use it for something else. Okay. >> Yes. >> So we can't put it to public arts or

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anything like that. It's stuck for MEDC. So let's put that clear out first. Second is as far as you know what I understood what President O was saying is effectively you know if we're going to do a budget then have the controllers

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say okay if it was going to be a four 4% increase in budget then that 4% would be X our budget is Y so you need to cut council between X and Y okay so that's more of a statement again that puts the

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responsibility to cut it to stay within that budget budget range to us and the intent of where did that number come from. What we're trying to do is figure out what was the historical average growth of the bill over the last however

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time it was. And that seems to be around $250 or 4% something like that. And if we want to nitpick to specific you know you know multiple digits of precision here I would say no. Round numbers are easier to work with. you know, when we

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actually do something like this. But I like the idea of, you know, basically the mayor brings down a budget, we're giving, you know, a framework to say, "This is how much we need to cut. Figure out where those cuts are, guys." And that's where we pull out and start doing

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the work. I think that seems to be the best way to combine what councelor Vital and President Oin has been saying. I hope that clarifies things a little better. Um because if that's the case, I'll support it. If it stays the way it is, I'm not. >> So,

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>> understood. Council >> council council vital. >> Mr. Chair, um the magic number uh council is zero. I if the best number that we can present to our residents is that we're not going to increase their

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property taxes. I had to try to find something that was in historically something that was um you know like a a pill that they could swallow and not necessarily like but they they can live with it. Um and that's where the 250 came from. There

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was a previous council that uh and I don't know how many years ago that and I like this model a little bit better. If you follow exactly what Mr. president said and councelor said that about finding the number from the solicitor

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uh I mean comproller finding the number that we're going to balance them off with I guess a council in the pre previous council rather than us trying to do that the council made a motion when they heard the number that the mayor brought down as a budget and the number we wanted to get say to have a

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$250 increase the council just sent it back to the mayor and said Mr. mayor, you know, you need to take another $3 million off this budget. I feel the mayor understands the line items of each individual department head much better than we do

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cuz he's down there in the trenches with the department head working these numbers out. So, I like the whole model of finding, you know, getting the budget, hearing what a two just whatever we agree to, whether it's $ 250, $200, whatever it is, and then ask whatever

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the differences between what we get from the controller and what the mayor gives us, and then sending it back to the mayor and say, "Mr. Mayor, you take another $2 million off the budget." That if that's what we can generally agree to in in principle, then I withdraw the resolution.

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I think it comes right now again um like uh president Oing council obi has mentioned before when it come and for council cho we have a budget we have line items and that's where we do the cutting then we start to get into a particular situation where if we don't

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if the finance team doesn't hold the budget hearings and keep sending it back we could lose time frame and the the total budget would be approved I've I the the time frame um if we don't act on the the the budget submitted by the mayor. So, that's where we kind of get

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into a little bit of a gray area that I would not want to be in. Um, [clears throat] again, uh, council vital, I I support you because you're my colleague on the finance team. Um, but that council Roby, council, uh, president Oing and council pat has mentioned it that it is hard to

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get to that 250 because we don't know what the uh, budget is going to be. We don't know what we don't know what the healthcare and and of course uh, just the retirement alone. So it it is very hard to get to this though I understand where you're going at. Um but uh it

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might not be No, I understand and I understand council and it just might not be feasible to get that way. Um but again I said this gives an opportunity to respectfully say to the mayor we're we're looking at this budget as well as the finance committee and the rest of

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the uh uh council. At least now we're aware and maybe we will now go in force to look at those individual line items and make that decision to cut because sometime it's not easy. But I'll let you continue. Council vital. >> I'm all set. Mr. Chair,

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>> council Robby. >> Thank you, Mr. Chair. I was going to make the same point that you just made that we have a certain date after which we get the budget that it has to be approved or the number that the mayor sends down is what is our budget. um or of no. So that concerns me also. Um and

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the fact that you are supersede you are ignoring your one one of the few things we can do as a council in looking at the budget that the mayor gives us and cutting where we need it by sending it back to him to

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make him cut the budget. The mayor sends us a budget. It's our responsibility as elected officials to then decide if that's the budget we want. Why would we give that up? >> Thank you. Thank you, Council. Council,

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>> well, I will say putting this resolution on the floor has allowed us to discuss the budget prematurely, which is fine. Send some messages out there. Um, and again, for the people that weren't here, and I wasn't here either, this city

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council voted for the hotel tax through sending a an order to the legislation at the state level to have that money just on economic development. But you look at any other city in town in this state, that money goes into the coffers of that

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municipality. We're the only city in the state that does it differently. And in all respects when I say that million dollars a year or close to it could be helping the residents of this city because I can promise you I've checked

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it. I've done surveys even in Boston Waltham economic development. We don't they don't spend close to a million dollars a year. We do. I like some of the packages but I don't like the legislation on it. And the only way it

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will change is someday when some city councilors realize the impact it's caused to our residents, they will start to change that back to where it should be. We city councilors deserve that control.

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Not any other group might they be from or out of the city of Marro. And I will continue to press that and debate it because that is the actual facts. that money that we collect from hotel tax in every other city in town that has hotel

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taxes goes into their coffers. So, I'm not inaccurate in stating that. But indeed, we have legislation that I'm not in agreement with. If I was a city councelor back then, I'd be talking about it then. In fact, the Wad 3 council voted against it back in those days. He saw the writing on the wall and

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he was a lawyer. But again, that's for another day. Council of Vitals I I would suggest with council vitals resolution that it's a little premature but it did get us the chance to start talking about the budget. So thank you Mr. Chair.

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>> And you are right council um we'll have plenty of time to talk about any other budget when it becomes before us but right now we're on this resolution council dous. >> Thank you mayor very much. Um I [clears throat] believe that the only way that it would be ch hotel tax would

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be changed would actually have it approved at the state house >> to the >> Yeah. So passition >> just just to clarify the situation and anytime you want to submit the order to change it so it could go to economic

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development and other other services. Bring it up to the council and see how the vote goes or you know >> I already know the vote [laughter] >> so okay fine. >> And you're right. You're right. I mean, yeah, if that's what you want, go right ahead and then we got to convince the state to do it, too.

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>> And I don't want to prolong that. This is a discussion for another day. But there are other communities that have been working. >> Hudson, Grafton, there's a lot of communities that have been trying to do their economic Westbrow as well. So, it's not new, but we'll save that for a different day. Thanks. Thank you. But in

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any case, economic, you know, as far as the rest of the communities of mass of Massachusetts look at Morrow's economic development as a win because of what we have. Okay. So I you know this is you know you can voice your concern and

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issues but you know work it through the process and see how it goes. So thank you. >> Thank you. Well, after that any further discussion, I will entertain a motion what the finance committee wishes to do. >> Mr. Chair, I don't think we need a

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motion. I just withdraw my resolution. >> Okay. Motion has been made uh to withdraw the resolution which is order number 26-1009670. A resolution uh resolution uh from council vital the municipal budget.

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Motion to withdraw. Any further discussion? All in favor? Carries. 1 2 3 4 5. Thank you, Council B. I will entertain a motion. >> Motion to adjourn. >> Motion's been made and seconded to adjourn. All in favor. 1 2 3 4 5. We are

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adjourned at 8:01 p.m. Thank you, finance team.