WEBVTT

METADATA
Video-Count: 1
Video-1: youtube.com/watch?v=Nnzku3M_a_U

NOTE
MEETING SECTIONS:

Part 1 (Video ID: Nnzku3M_a_U):
- 00:00:00: Introduction: Pine School PAMP Amendment Request Overview
- 00:04:44: Krady Presentation: Site Plan History & Preserve Areas
- 00:10:58: Overdorf Presentation: Habitat, Surveys, and Relocation
- 00:20:40: Public Question: Federally vs State Listed Plants
- 00:22:49: Public Question: Cladonia, Gopher Survey Details
- 00:28:36: Public Question: Relocation Plans and Approvals
- 00:31:05: Public Question: Gopher Burrows and Mitigation
- 00:33:35: Public Question: Onsite vs Offsite Gopher Cost
- 00:36:35: Garver Presentation: Pine School Environment Stewardship
- 00:41:48: Overdorf Clarifies Cladonia Location on the Site
- 00:42:22: Waters Supports PAMP Amendment and Consolidation
- 00:43:39: Cox Concerned About Relocation of Plant Species
- 00:49:13: Hilton Green Testimony: Student's Environmental Diploma
- 00:50:38: Brandon Affirms Pine School's Environmental Awareness
- 00:52:17: Gibson Supports Expansion, Cites Fed Approval
- 00:54:41: Sherk Supports Expansion for Athletic Opportunities
- 00:57:18: Caffrey Appreciates Students' Accountabilty To the Environment
- 00:59:32: Sedaka Emphasizes Stewardship and World-Class Academics
- 01:01:42: Hilton Green Commends Measured Growth and Martin County
- 01:05:58: Overdorf Answers Vargas: Protecting the Species
- 01:11:20: Hetherington Commends Stewardship & Schools Of Choice
- 01:18:55: Campy Supports Responsible Way Pine Is Doing Development
- 01:24:16: McNicholas Says Every Turtle Is Being Left There
- 01:25:26: The Motion Carries Unanimously
- 01:26:52: Public Hearing #1: Settlement for Michelle Po
- 01:30:01: DPQJ2: Variance for Building Permit on Legal Lot
- 01:40:04: R&P1: Martin County Transit System Update
- 01:48:19: Department One: Office Of Management and Budget Items
- 01:51:40: Department Two: Contracts Over a Million
- 01:53:45: Department Five: Protecting Farms for Easement Purposes
- 02:04:54: Commissioner Comments for Public Hearing


Part: 1

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Good afternoon. We are back uh taking up department three which is requesting approval of an amendment to preserve area management plan for the Pine School uh to modify an existing preserve area. >> Good afternoon, gentlemen.

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>> Good afternoon. >> Please proceed. >> Okay. Um we're here this afternoon. Good afternoon, commissioners. My name is Sean McCarthy. I'm a planner in the environmental division of the growth management department. Uh before you today is a request by the Pine School to

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an amend and approved and recorded preserve area management plan uh from 2005. This is in conjunction with the revised final site plan application currently under review by the department. The proposed revisions include updates to campus buildings,

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athletic facilities, infrastructure, dry detention areas, and the existing US1 entrance to accommodate the school's operational needs and future expan expansion plans. This requested PAMP amendment would modify the configuration of existing

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preserve areas. Just to give a little background, the subject property encompasses about 173 acres under under the original PAMP approved in 2005. Approximately 138 acres of the native uplands were

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identified on site of this native upland habitat. 46.28 acres of sandpine scrub was established as upland preserve. 1.09 09 acres of wetland buffer and 1.96 acres of wetlands were also preserved.

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For the record, I just want to point out a small error in the staff report under the background section, the second paragraph where it states the original pamp identified as preserve area 138.19 acres of native uplands prior to construction

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of the original school in 2005. This should say in 2005 138 acres of native upland habitat was identified on site. Of this habitat acreage 46.28 acres was established as

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upland preserve in the original pamphd proposes to remove 11.07 07 acres of existing Upland scrub preserve and provide the addition of 17.14 acres of upland scrub habitat to preserve as compensation

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resulting in a net increase of 6.07 acres of preserve scrub habitat above the original pamp requirement. The requested preserve modifications include removal of 2.16 acres of upland preserve to accommodate the proposed

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road and athletic facilities currently under review as part of the amended final site plan. An additional 8.91 acres of upland preserve adjacent to Banner Lake is proposed for for removal for future campus expansion. This would

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not be cleared until future final site plan approvals are granted for development in that location, but will no longer be designated as preserve. The proposed preserve area would consolidate pres preservation efforts in the southeast portion of the site adjacent

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to existing preserve areas and in closer proximity to JD State Park which provides habitat for threatening threatened and endangered species including the Florida scrubj pursuant to section 4.36 of the Martin County land development

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regulations. Amendments to a previously approved preserve area require approval by the board of county commissioners. A written request by the applicant outlining the purpose and extent of the alteration and a recommendation from the growth management department director regarding

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the need for the change and appropriate compensation measures. The growth management director has reviewed the request and determined that the amendment satisi satisfies the applicable requirements of Marin County code and the comprehensive growth management plan and as a result

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recommends approval of the amended PAMP. It was found that the proposed m the proposal maintains compliance with the original preserve requirements continues to protect wetlands and wetland buffers and exceeds the original preservation requirements for rare and unique upland scrub habitat. This concludes my

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presentation and we'll be happy to answer any questions. >> Questions for Mr. McCarthy. >> Mr. Krady. >> Yes. >> Uh, good afternoon. For the record, my name is Morris Krady and I'm senior partner with Lceto and Associates. And I

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do have a brief PowerPoint on the on the the desktop. Just a couple of slides to show you the >> the original site plan which was approved. Actually, >> you could just I'm sorry. Yeah, Paul Shilling for the record. >> There it is. You got it. >> Got it. >> Got it. >> Um and then let me hit

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your mouse. >> Where's it at? >> Would this work? >> That's it. >> Okay. Um yeah, I was one of the original design or consultants that was uh working on the project in 2005 when it was called St. Michael's School and uh

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and then we did another revision in 2019. We didn't mess with the preserve areas at that time and um and so here we are in 2026 almost 20 years later after the original approval. Let's see. So this is the stamped

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approved plan that was uh approved in 2019. We did again the preserve areas are in this particular plan is how they looked and uh and if I use the mouse so I can point I don't know if I can point with this. You >> can't. Not really. Let's see if I can.

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Yeah. very needy. >> So, yeah, there you go. There's the pointer. So, so the preserve that we're actually removing as part of this application is about an acre along uh US1 and in in this location because we're going to relocate the road and

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this is infested with Brazilian pepper because it's it's it's adjacent to the rightway and there's there's impacts associated with this preserve area. The other preserve area that we're going to remove as part of this application is about a half acre here adjacent to these uh facilities and then a little piece

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down here. So the the total preserve area that we're actually removing as part of this uh revised final site plan um is only about 2.16 acres as staff talked about. I want to also point out that in 2005 I know Jeff Whitman was here earlier and he mentioned this

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historic an archaeological site. Well, this is the location of the archaeological site. We're not messing with that. That's been there forever and and there's no intention to do anything with it except maybe study it as part of the school curriculum. Um but that would be something down the road. That's not

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part of the PAMP at this time. Um so what we're doing is really just uh removing two two acres to relocate uh the existing entrance further south. We're going to retain the existing entrance as emergency access that lines

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up across the street with the fire station site. So that will be retained as emergency access, but it would only give uh emergency vehicles access to the to the ball field. So if they have to come in, you know, they can come in directly and and into the the play area

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there. So, we're relocating the road to create this recreational amenity that has been on the master site plan for years, but at one time they were going to move it south into this area. But this is the area that we're relocating. So, we're taking out 8.9 acres of

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preserve here and we're relocating it here. If you can go back, I'll show you on the previous plan. There was no preserve in this area. So we've based on Toby's work, he's determined that this is the the most viable scrub habitat on the site. We have permission from SMRU

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to do management of that area. And um again, the only thing that we're taking out is this area here, a little bit up here, this little piece right here, and then we're we're not taking out. We're actually relocating this preserve area to here. But in in the uh the net effect

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when we originally got the approval the scrub preserve requirement based on 25% of the site was 34 acres. So that's what we start that was the minimum requirement when we got the site plan approved in 2005 we were were 12 acres

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more than that requirement. So we we we started out with more required preserve than we were required to have. Um so now what we're proposing is additional six acres. So, we're going to go from a required scrub reserve of 34 acres to a proposed scrub reserve of 52 acres. And

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it's all going to be consolidated in the south half of the property where we believe the habitat is most viable. So, we're we're and we can't take out any any additional habitat until we come in and uh do a revised final site plan, which

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will be additional scrub jay surveys, additional gopher turtis surveys. those areas that aren't designated as preserve areas but still have scrub habitat in them. We can't we can't remove any of that until we do additional surveys and go back through the county process for revised final site plan approval. What

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I'm talking about there I see a little bit of things. So we this is although we're we're relocating this preserve to the south, we're not clearing this area. This area cannot be cleared until we have something proposed in that area. And there is a plan in the future for

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them uh to to put additional ball fields here, but we can't do any of that until we do additional scrubj surveys and gopher turtis surveys and come back through the process with staff to get revised final site plan approval. Same in this location. This is all this is

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all habitat now, but we can't clear that habitat until we go back through the process, get revised final site plan approval and and and um and propose something in that area. And this is an area that they are looking at doing some practice golf facilities in the future.

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But again, that's a future application. The only thing that we're impacting today is the 2 acres of preserve area that is um on the on the approved plan and a little bit of habitat where the roads being relocated through. But that

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again that that that relates to uh uh additional an additional preserve area of 6 acres. So we're although we're taking out 2 acres of preserve area, we're adding more than that as as compensation. And

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then I'm going to let Toby kind of walk you through the existing habitat on the uh on the site, what he's been through with the US Fish and Wildlife Service and and also uh some work with Ann Cox. I know he's been talking with them, but then he'll go through this next slide which shows the actual impact area. So

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Toby, it's all yours. >> And he just changed it. >> Good afternoon, commissioners. Um, for the record, Toby Overdorf with uh with Haley Ward and have been working on this site um actually, believe it or not, my daughter was a uh went to school here and uh so I've been working with the

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school uh since it was uh first brought down here in this area here. Um really wanted to run through today just a a quick item um on what we're here for and that is the preserve area management plan modification. Uh we're not here for a site plan. Um I know Morris gets, you

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know, all excited about site plans. That's what he gets paid to do. But we're going to talk about preserve areas and the relocation of preserve areas. So the entire site, as Sean told you, is about 173 acres and uh it has a variety of habitats associated with it. Uh this

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includes everything from uh from scrub that we're talking about, which is both pine as well as as well as a Zurich oak um scrub habitat. There's a little bit of wetland and of course we have the large area um up here in the northwest corner which is Banner Lake. So, what's interesting is long before the Pine

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School actually started to go ahead with this process, they contacted me and wanted me to come in and work on Banner Lake specifically, it had been basically neglected. Uh there was a lot of exotics um in that area there. You could hardly see that it was actually a lake. So, we went in there and started to work

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through that. Um removed a a lot of exotics out of there. The entire buffer was done. This was not a requirement of Martin County. This was a ask and a request from the school. They wanted to be good stewards with this and in fact I'll tell you a little bit later a a

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great story that came out of that. Uh right now we're we're very sensitive to the fact that we have a fair amount of biodiversity on this site specifically. There are there's a wetland system, there's scrub systems, and of course we have our our open areas. Uh and right

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now uh the only required preserve that based on county requirements is about 34 acres. Uh then under the previous preserve as we've talked about we have uh roughly 46 acres is the now the preserve that's on site. We are

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relocating preserve uh is our proposal. That's why we're here today is to relocate that preserve and give you give the county excuse me an additional 6 acres. So, we'll now have roughly 50 a little over 52 acres in preserve. That means that the county um has an

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additional 18 acres above and beyond what was typically required for a site like this. We celebrated this morning uh the don the donation and the the how the county took over about an acre and a half of scrub. Here's another 18 acres of that as well. So just wanted to make

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that point there and that uh we are really looking at a very much of a net increase year. Also the other side that I want to point out here this the green area that you see on your screen currently that is the proposed preserve. The areas that are in red um

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specifically up next to US1 and this uh this line that goes from the northeast to the southwest is a straight line. That's actually a power line easement from FPL. Those are two the two small red areas which we're proposing for impacts um right now are actually pretty

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disjointed. Uh they're narrow. They uh the one on US1 obviously is impacted by exotic vegetation um by trash by other things like that. So what we're doing is consolidating our preserve areas into one large massive area uh that will take

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take part the entire green area you see on your screen here the black which is our buffers as well as the existing uh preserve to the south. So that's what will that um is the primary preserve area and then to remain also on the very west side you see a black area there

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that is a buffer around Banner Lake as well as an upland preserve that's going to remain uh in perpetuity. The red areas uh the ones we talked about are going to be impacted potentially by uh development in the future um next to the soccer fields there. There is no plan

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for that currently and a site plan will have to come back in. But what we're talking about is adding the green area to the black area. And that is really why we're here today. So what have we done also? Well, we've done a full extent of gopher tortoise surveys throughout the entire parcel. We have

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done a review of all the vegetation on the parcel. We actually have completed two separate scrubj surveys during the time. We've been after this for almost four years now. Um I know that the the board the Pine School board has been very patient and working through the process. We actually wanted to come in

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about 7 months ago. We realized that scrubj uh survey time was coming up and they said, "No, Toby, go do your thing. Get this done. We want to make sure we have everything right." So, we did. We coordinated our methodology with the US Fish and Wildlife Service. They approved it. We submitted our um our findings to

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them. They also approved that and found that the scrubj would not be impacted whatsoever by the proposed project on this. And we have I have that writing and I also gave it to the environmental staff. Um so, the scrub jay would not be impacted. We also found um some uh some

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lykan on the on the site there. And uh we have some folks that were were very excited about um the possibility um Sean being one of them that was uh excited about the possibility of us doing some relocation of the lyken and the native plant society as well. So we have also

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sent and submitted to the US Fish and Wildlife Service a draft relocation for that listed species that listed plant species or listed lykan species. It's kind of a plant. Um, so I know that I'm going to correct get corrected on that later. Uh, so that being said, um, we're

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going to be, uh, relocating that, uh, with an approved plan that has to be submitted to growth management after consultation with, um, some local botonists andor native plant society. Uh, we'd also want to make sure that we bring in our students for that. This is

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kind of an unprecedent unprecedented opportunity where we're now able to bring in the Pine School students to participate in the relocation activities of this listed species. It's going to be I'm actually very excited about that. And uh to quote the the US Fish and

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Wildlife um when I submitted that to them, they said uh the draft relocation plan looks great. What a what a great idea to involve the students. and that was in a letter from on May 15th from the US Fish and Wildlife Service. So again, that's kind of an unprecedented

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little document from them. Uh the county will be involved prior to any land clearing whatsoever. We do have to make sure that we number one uh survey the entire area that we're going to be proposed for clearing. Well, once that survey is completed, we are going to be reloc relocating any listed species that

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are located within there. Um and we're going to be relocating them to the on-site preserve. so that we are going to keep them in the same spot. The the lyken um it's it can be relocated. It's not always 100% successful, but we are following the US Fish and Wildlife

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Service protocol and are again open to uh suggestions as well from experts in that field and we'll be welcoming them as both enhancing the academia side of this as well as the actual program side of this. So, uh we've also agreed that we will be doing a scrub management

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plan. We do we do not anticipate doing burns on the site. Uh we do have Eaglewood, we have US1 that are in proximity as well as the school. Uh so doing a burn out there probably wouldn't be the greatest thing. However, we there are other ways to do scrub management.

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And in doing scrub management, we needed to make sure that we're not also um damaging the lychen that we're going to be relocating or other species like burmilad as well. So, long and short of it, um I just want to re-emphasize there's no development

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activity whatsoever until we have uh the actual relocation plans absolutely finalized um approved uh through Martin County. And in fact, we've located any and all species that are within the proposed development areas. Uh we also

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um we will be going through and making sure that uh we have additional fish and wild excuse me US sorry Florida fish and wildlife um approvals for the gopher tortoise. We cannot get those um whatsoever until until we're allowed to develop the property. So even though we

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know where the burrows are, we can't go ahead. Um I did want to also say that um through the lake project, we've also had some some great interaction with the students already. um one of the students I think you'll hear from later actually won an

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award um a grant from DP associated with some water quality um items that she's going to be working through and uh working through the Everglades Coalition as well um on that issue. So I think you'll hear from Sydney a little bit later on on that. But it just gives you an example of how the Pine School truly

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involves their students um in these items and uh I'm frankly very excited about the opportunity to be able to work on this project and uh involve some some teaching opportunities. Actually, that's how I kind of started out in this field was as a marine science instructor. So, it's neat to get back to that um

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potentially. So, we'll see what happens here. But um uh commissioners, that is basically what we're going to be doing. you're gaining uh again a net positive 6 acres. We have 18 surplus acres above and beyond what is required. Um and I'll

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be happy to answer any questions, but I do know we have at least one if not two more people that want to speak to you. So >> questions for Mr. Ordor, >> Mr. Caps. >> There's a thing called federally listed uh plants,

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rare and endangered plants I guess it's called. And then there's a state list. What What's the difference? And uh I guess the distinctive the distinctives of the two and how they're

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treated legally. Um it seems that I've heard that if it's federally listed, uh they must actually be relocated. That's what I've heard. And then if they're state listed, you just have to

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kind of make an effort to relocate them. Is is is that what I've heard? I don't know what you've heard, but um that's I mean uh so obviously two different agencies when it's federally listed. Uh we are going to be making and we've we made that distinction as well in this

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the materials that we submitted to the county um as well as the US Fish and Wildlife Service. Anything that is federally uh protected, we certainly if we can, we'll be relocating it. There are certain plants um and I believe that we're going to have uh another person

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come up here and talk about some plants that may have been in the region but not on our site. Um those may not be able to be re relocated, but the lyken that we have determined to be on the site um certainly can be relocated. Uh and it's one of the ways that US Fish and

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Wildlife deals with this. Uh as far as the state side, many of the state protected species are protected um by the Florida Department of Agriculture and are therefore cannot be sold um on a commercial basis, harvested and sold. Uh that happens a lot with airplants or

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burmilad. Uh so that they cannot be uh again on a commercial basis there. Uh however, they are protected and we do we have written into our uh preserve area management plan uh wherever possible. We're going to be relocating the bmilads as well and uh sometimes you just you

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can't get to the top of a 70ft tree so we won't be able to do that. However, there are certainly opportunities for doing relocation of the bmilads as well which is a state protected species. >> Is the lyken you refer to is that the the plant called cladonia? >> Yes sir.

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>> And as I understand that's extremely rare um not located in very many places in the world. >> Thus it's endangered. Yes, sir. >> And you would be relocating it in this >> onsite preserve. >> Yes. Yes, sir. Where it's uh where now

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we have the large preserve area there um in the southeast and that will be the area that we're proposing for relocation. Have we done a thorough evaluation at this point to know where all the lykan might be on

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all of these uh new preserve areas? Uh >> within the we wouldn't do another survey in a preserve area if it's going in a preserve. I mean wouldn't >> well in the areas that you want to develop that are current in your current PAM that you want to take out of the PAM. >> So we've done a we've done preliminary

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surveys. Of course uh this is a school that has limited resources. we want to be mindful of those resources. >> So until we're going to be going ahead with development, >> we wouldn't want to go in there and and utilize the the school's resources or their money p per se.

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>> Um however, we have certainly put in place uh the process that we cannot do anything on site until Martin County sees our relocation plan until uh we actually also invited US Fish and Wildlife Service to participate in that. um invited other folks to participate in

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that as well. So we will be getting uh outside review of the relocation plans. >> Are when it comes to the federally listed plants, are there consequences to intentionally or unintentionally

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violating those rules? Like say somebody just blew it off and what are what are the consequences to just bulldozing something like that? >> I'd have to look at the statutes on that. Um we obviously have no intention of doing that and in any way shape or form and so we're that's why we have

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made such provisions that we can't have equipment on the site and can't do any land clearing even putting in silt fence even removing gopher tortoises without in fact having uh this uh this review done all the items located um GPS

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located as well as then uh potentially doing the relocation of any federal species. M and refresh my memory. Give me a little more clarity on the role of the US fish and wildlife that that you you've already had involved. Like I

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would tend to think that if they have rules about federally protected plants that they would be monitoring that very closely themselves in the somewhere along the course of this project, right? I mean, are they involved? Uh again, we

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submitted our draft relocation plan to the US Fish and Wildlife Service >> um to a gal named Heather Hit and she commented and said um and if you want me to read the quote again >> uh to you, she make sure I get it right.

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Apologize. She said, quote, "Draft relocation plan looks great. What a great idea to involve the students." That's a May 15th letter. Now, of course, that's not the entire letter. She asked for some additional information to which I then said, "Uh, Miss Hit, you're welcome to

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come to the site when we when we do the reviews um andor review our data." She asked for uh location data, which I said, "I'd be happy to share that with you once we have it." She had no problem with that whatsoever. Mhm. So, there's not any further inspections

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by federal officials uh of the site or to make sure that anything got done in particular. Uh >> again, we've invited the the feds to come out and inspect the site. Um we have been forthright with all of our information thus thus far. Uh we are

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continuing to share uh any and all information with them. I I really would struggle to be even be more open and I have to say that the Pine School has been very accommodating as well uh during this time and frankly um your

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staff has been a good driver in this as well. These two gentlemen here um also took it upon themselves to at one point call US Fish and Wildlife Service and did a great job with that. They were able to get through to a person that's been a great asset. So when it comes to the Lykan U Clonia um I would imagine

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most of that would be over there on the portion by Banner Lake and the bigger piece that you're going to develop later. >> Actually no sir the uh according to the US Fish and Wildlife Service and uh and the graphic that they shared is actually adjacent to US1 believe it or not

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>> uh is the largest uh single portion of that uh is according to their data. Now again, we're going to be sharing new data with them, showing where um some items are and all that type of of things. So, but at this point in time, no, it was not on the western area.

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>> So, the plan right now is mainly to develop the open areas to the right when you go in on the existing road, those open areas there, that that's kind of what you need right now, right? Isn't that what the main thing that you're focusing

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on? >> That is the main focus. And then part by Banner Lake would be like another phase at a later time where you do more studies on the environment there before you develop it. >> Absolutely. Yes. We we will not be able to even like I said even put a silt

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fence in the ground in a proposed development area no matter what time it is without doing a full study and coordinating that with Martin County and others. >> Okay. I'm good. Thanks. >> Okay. and the the uh relocation plan that you've done for the lychans that

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you've submitted, how many uh species did you say you're going to relocate? >> The number is whatever is there as far as uh the amount of the uh clidonia. We will be relocating every every um sprig that we find out there, every

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association. We'll be relocating all of that. >> So, you don't have a number? >> We do not have a number at this time. And and again, uh, Commissioner, that's primarily because, uh, we're going through the the process right now of getting the, uh, the preserve approved and we don't have a development order at

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this point in time or a final site plan approved either. So, the preserve is the first step in that and we're required to come to you for that. So, we decided to go with the preserve relocation first. >> And who approves the relocation plans? your staff will ultimately as well as

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we'll have certainly be having comments from uh US Fish and Wildlife Service. We've also requested outside uh experts to be commenting on it and to hopefully develop some uh academic programs with it as well. >> Okay. Staff, you agree that we are going

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to be the ultimate decider of the re or uh decision maker on the relocation plans? So right now we have a draft reloc plan relocation plan in the PAMP and it also says that they're required before any

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lane clearing to finalize that plan. And as part of that we're going to ask for maps and the locations of these individual endangered plant species and to make sure that the plan is set ready for people to actually just implement it before any lane clearing takes place.

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>> And who approves that plan? staff, >> state staff, federal staff, county staff. >> So, Martin County Code requires that these plants are relocated u federally endangered plants. Um, as to my knowledge, I don't think there's any

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um standard guidelines from the wildlife agencies stating how to exactly do this >> for plants. >> For plants. So for the gopher tortoise, we have a process in place when we have a uh pre-construction meeting for proposed development. We ensure that all

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those species are surveyed and permits are secured and the tortoises are relocated before you can start development. So in a similar vein, we would be the doing the same for plants and following whatever guidelines we get from US Fish and Wildlife for >> Do we know at present how many gopher

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burrows there are? There is a map that >> we did have a map. It should be in your packet um associated with that. However, the gopheris burrows are not necessarily well they're located throughout. We did a full survey throughout the entire site. So, there may not be uh some

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within our proposed development area. Um there are in my estimation we will certainly be relocating some tortoises in order to accomplish the first phase that they're looking at doing. And do you have a mitigation site >> for the gophers?

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>> Unfortunately, FWC has not um been, how do I say this, politically correct? They haven't been great at getting additional relocation sites um especially within Martin County. So, we're going to be using the closest geographical place that we can for that. We'd love to relocate all of them on site and save

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the school a lot of money. Unfortunately, a on-site relocation, believe it or not, is more expensive than an off-site relocation by about an order of three. >> And will will these relocation plans come

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back to us or will they go to you? >> If I can the like for which species are we talking? >> Any any of them? Any re relocation? We will be sharing all of the relocation uh materials whether it's state or federal with the county prior to enacting upon

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that for the specifically for the gopher tortoise. Um your team is copied on those uh those before they go uh before they go into action. Uh and then also with the um with the cladonia the the lyken uh that will also come back here

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prior to like I said even putting silt fence in the ground. >> Okay. Even if it's a minor site plan. >> Yes ma'am. If it's an area that has >> the board >> to the county, not to the commission, >> it comes it comes to the staff, excuse me. >> Yeah. The staff. >> The staff makes and that's according to

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the the preserve area management plan guidelines, which again, we we don't want to be violating any of that whatsoever. >> Okay. So, we don't know at present whether this is going to be a minor or a major final site plan. >> Uh Paul Shelling, growth management

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director for the record. So, the current application is a minor final site plan. Uh we can't say what the future holds. However, our our input and coordination has been that the future phases would be administrative in nature. >> Commissioner, if I may, I I apologize.

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Paul, what we wanted to make sure was that any additional land clearing that was going to happen out here would require and that's why it's in the PAMP >> would require coordination with your staff. >> Yeah. I'm just >> as is the case every day of the year perhaps or when we're approving

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developments and and uh prior to pre-construction meetings of course all the appropriate state federal permits are required to be in hand prior to the site issuance permit prior to any clearing whatsoever with the exception typically being some silk fences. So

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that the general conclusion is that this is the last time that there will be a public hearing on this any portion of this any future plans. >> Uh I think that's a safe assumption. >> Okay. Thanks.

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>> I'll bring up the next. >> Toby, can I ask you one more thing? >> When when you said relocating the gophers on the existing preserve would cost three times as much. >> Yes, sir. Um,

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what does roughly what does it cost to relocate one go? Is it a price per gopher? >> Yeah. >> Like what are the two what are the two prices offsite versus this site? >> Feel like I'm giving a proposal. Um,

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>> so, uh, typically to excavate a burrow, um, it's anywhere between, uh, $400 to, um, $750 to excavate the burrow, which is usually the most cost-effective way. Uh, the permit itself has about uh has a

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$400 fee uh to a $300 fee depending on how many tortoises are within that. We'll have to do a conservation permit for for this site. uh then you add on the actual um cost of admission into the bank. So if you go through the process,

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you get the permit, you actually excavate the burrow, and then you go ahead and find a tortoise, that tortoise is typically anywhere between uh right now the going rates are between 5,500 and uh $10,000 per tortoise, depending on the bank that you go to. The on-site

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relocation then is typically anywhere between uh and again some of this is is the FWC sidelines to it um can be as much as $18,000 per tortoise on site. >> So it's like maybe 6,000 versus $18,000

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>> uh for the just for admission. >> Yes, sir. >> Well, I mean like the package deal, what is it? you know, with all >> package deal all in, you're looking at about $8,000 per tortoise offsite and about $20,000 on-site. >> Okay. >> Again, these are rough numbers.

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>> It'd be easier to send them to the Pine School. >> You said it. I did not. >> All right. Thanks. >> Good afternoon. Good afternoon. >> Thank you for allowing me to speak to you today, commissioners. My name is Beth Leting Garver. My husband and I

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have been residents of Hope Sound for 33 years. From 1998 to 2001, I served as executive director of the Hobound Chamber of Commerce. Since then, I have had the great pleasure of working at the Pine School. First as a teacher and

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coach, and for the last 21 years as the director of enrollment management. For the past 25 years, I have been a part of and witnessed to the benefits of the transformational education that the Pine School can provide its students. When

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the board first purchased this amazing piece of property in Hope Sound in the early 2000s, I was invited to walk over the Sugar Sand Dunes with my then first grade son to envision what this could and would become.

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What a joy it has been to serve, to see the multitudes of teachers and students and their families enjoy the beauty that this natural environment provides. As part of my work, every day I tour prospective families around the campus.

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It is not often that people describe a bustling school of 500 plus kindergarten through 12th grade students as sorry as zen but more often than not that is how most people feel when they visit our school. There is a calmness and a

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serenity to this campus because of the surrounding preserved land, the undulations of the hills and forest and the architecture of the building which so strategically blends into the landscape. A perfect antidote to the often chaotic

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world we live and work in and such an impactful setting in which to develop young minds. At the Pine School, we commit in our mission to extend our education to our natural campus and beyond. From outdoor education day to lower school gardening,

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from campus orientering to regularly visiting and coordinating with the Hobound Nature Center. From being recognized for years as a green school of excellence to teaching a Florida ecology science elective, the Pine

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School cares for and works to understand the environment we inhabit. We have spent tens of thousands of dollars maintaining the health of Banner Lake and financially contributed to a water study with Martin County and Cetch to

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better understand how it might be restored. Our plan today adds a net plus 5 acres of quality upland protected habitat. And the Florida Department of Environmental Production Protection

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recently honored one of our students for her white paper which studied the benefits of the restoration of Banner Lake. This year, the Pine School will award for the first time ever high school diplomas to four students who have completed a specific program of

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study in environmental science. We know we can grow and also be good stewards of the land we are fortunate to have. The environment and the preservation of our beloved campus are paramount to the mission of our school.

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Since Pine moved to Hope Sound in 2007, nearly 20 years ago, not only have our own families and faculty benefited from this unique campus, but so have our neighbors. Our students and teachers work closely with the Banner Lake community next door, volunteering in the

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Banner Lake Cafe once a month, tutoring students in BLAST, their afterchool program, and Banner Lake Academy teachers are often on our campus participating in professional development. The Hope Sound Chamber of Commerce utilizes our parking areas for art

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festivals. Our annual car show is a favorite for all of our neighbors and friends near and far, especially our veterans. And St. Christopher's Church and the Knights of Columbus have used our gym for basketball free throw contests. The Pine School has been and

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will continue to be a treasured member of the Treasure Coast. We are here today to share with you our vision for the future. And with your help, we can make this vision a reality. At the Pine School, it is our mission to provide not

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only the best education possible, but also to offer opportunities in the arts and athletics for all of our students and the community at large. Enhanced athletic venues will allow current and future students more

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expanded and necessary options beyond the already amazing experiences provided by Pine's first class education, the only fully accredited K12 independent school in Martin County. Thank you for your time and your consideration and go

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Knights. just want to come up and uh correct something or other actually add to it. Uh Commissioner, we we've done uh initial surveys in the site. We have seen clonia on the site. It's not like there are fields of weed of clonia out there, but there are certainly some

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areas for it. And that's why we're making sure that uh we do extensive surveys once the development happens. But we certainly have seen it on site. Specifically, if you look on your on your map in front of you, uh the little green area at the very top um next to the power line, uh that is an area that

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we have seen it and actually jives as well with the US Fish and Wildlife Service maps. So, just wanted to make sure and then we also had your staff out there and walked around and uh on the same day we thought we we had found some. So, just wanted to make sure that that's a clarification. Okay. Thank you.

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heavy hit it. >> Good afternoon. Uh Tyson Waters from the law firm of Fox McCcluskey on behalf of the applicant and also a proud parent of a former and current Pine School student. Um I I want to note that this is property under private ownership

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that's proposing to use sorry that's proposing to use private funds for these proposed enhancements. Enhancements that include the expansion of six acres of scrub preserve area that will be be preserved under this PAMP. a very unique

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thing that somebody's offering here. You've heard from Toby Overdorf discussing the project and the benefits to the environment that this revised PAMP will propose. And you've also heard from county environmental staff recommending approval of this Pampa amendment and finding that we comply

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with the lo the land the local land development regulations and the comprehensive plan. Again, this is a proposal that preserves 18 acres of scrub preserve above your land development requirements. We think it's appropriate. We think it consolidates

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both the future and proposed improvements, but also the preserve areas, consolidates it into a a combined portion of land, which is what we always try and encourage. So, with that, I'd ask for your support and your approval of this PAMP amendment. And after the

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public comment and the discussion, we'd like an opportunity to come back up here and discuss and clarify any points that need to be made. Thank you very much. Okay, we'll hear from the public. The first request to speak form I have is from Nicole Kirchoff. >> She had to leave chairman.

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>> Okay. Next is Annne Cox followed by Terry Gibson. Oops. Good afternoon, uh, Chairman Herd and, uh, Vice Chair Campini. Uh, my name is Anne

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Cox. I am representing Oh, I stand on my tiptoes here. I representing the the Martin County chapter of the Florida Native Plant Society to and I appreciate the invitation to speak. Uh I'm speaking to the proposed plan,

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management plan and uh we are pleased that the Pine School is successful in meeting its mission to provide an exceptional learning experience and expansion is needed uh for these students and for the school. The Martin

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County Native Plant Society members also have concerns uh with the current design that may not live up to the school's exemplary reputation. Um the Pine School was built amidst of of course a landscape of highly

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environmentally sensitive natural resources in the San Pine Scrub community which is considered an imperiled community on ancient shorelines. The scrub community supports a variety of wildlife, including several

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state listed and federally listed plant and animal species that are designated as endangered and threatened. The scrubs community serves as a living classroom ideal for

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a natural habitat that nurtures our students with and our young aspiring minds. Our concerns involve the successful relocation of several plant species including the perforated lyken

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clonia perforata that has been uh mentioned several times today which is federally endangered uh that's only known in um approximately 50 populations in the whole world mainly Florida. Um

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several other uh state listed species include epipites or airplants included two endangered species kanzia faciciculada or the cardinal airplane and I'm using the scientific language for the plants because that's their only

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true name whereas our animals can be called uh by their animals gopher tortoises without using the gophers polyphimmas uh which is the scientific name. So uh being a plant ecologist I like to be precise in giving uh the

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exact name for the plants. So um again claddia perforata we are concerned with and um also uh the fact that um these clonia have not been uh mapped. Oh I'm over time.

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>> Can I talk more? >> Yes. >> Okay. Thank you. Anyway, uh those have not been mapped, but I understand from the conversations that have been discussed that they will be mapped. The other concerns are for airplants which are Tanzia faciculada, Tanzia utriculada

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uh to threat and those are endangered by the state of Florida. Two threatened species balesa and flex tech tansia flexuosa. >> Now your time is up. >> And now my time is up. Well, uh can I give you one last talk? Uh

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The Martin County Native Plant Society also is in agreement with the guardians and respectfully request that the commission reject this Pine Schools PAMP amendment opting for a continuation at a later date of the consolidation of

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knowledge members of the Martin County chapter uh of Native Plant Society and also the guardians. I understand from the conversations that have been uh going on that a lot of the some of these issues have been resolved and uh we were

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not aware of some of those situations. So uh we'll take that into consideration. Um, and the Pine I want of all the schools in Martin County, the Pine School should be setting an admirable standard for environmentally

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sensitive design and planning. And um, >> Madam Chair, do you wish her to continue? >> We uh, thank you. >> We would like Ma'am, your time is up to conservation of Florida native plants and species and thank you so much. >> Thank you.

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Pippa Hilton Green is next, followed by Amy Brandon. >> Oh, I'm sorry, Terry. >> Three minutes. >> Yes. >> Okay. >> Okay. Ready, set, go. Um, good afternoon, commissioners. Um, I'm Pippa

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Hilton Green and I'm a senior at Pine. I've also been at Pine for 15 years. Um, this morning I just became one of the first four students at Pine to complete my environmental diploma. Um, and I was lucky enough to complete this diploma because our school is growing, which is giving us more opportunities to branch

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out and learn about things that we love, which for me growing up as like a true Florida kid and attending environmental study center camps every summer and just spending time outside. Um, what I'm intrigued to learn about is or just has a lot to do with the environment. Um, okay. And I'm also so thankful that

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we have these resources and chances um at the Pine School to do that. Um as you've been shown, obviously we have a lot of greenery around our campus. Um and if you've ever been, you know how great it is to be surrounded by all that nature and wildlife. Um unlike many other local schools. Um and the Pine

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School community puts that to good use. With so many classes taking nature walks and our ecology classes focusing on common native animals and plants um on our land, I think that this proposal will only help the school and the environment around it. Um I'm graduating this Saturday, so with the future

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expansion, I sadly won't be present to see it every day, but I can't wait to see what the school has in store for future Pine students. Thank you for your time. >> Thank you. Good afternoon, commissioners. Afternoon. >> Uh, my name is Amy Brandon. I'm a I was

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born and raised here in Martin County. >> Um, my son is a upcoming junior. He's been there since EL3 back when the school was still next to St. Joseph's. Um, being a native Martin County, I know

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that in 1969, the Pot Stam family, which was the founders of Stewart, uh, started the school. Um, my uncle entered the school in winter of 1970. Um, I myself attended St. Michael's as well as all of

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my cousins and that's about there's four of us, four four of them. Um, the school has always been very environmentally conscious. That's why we have this big beautiful campus. Um I know in the in this expansion um they can do it. We can

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do it. Um keeping in mind the environment. We preach to our kids from the time they're in kindergarten to be environmentally conscious. We are land stewards and we take care of the land.

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Um, I ask you to please approve this so that we can expand the campus. The Pine School is known all throughout the state. It is a treasure not just on the Treasure Coast, but in Martin County. It's been here for almost 60

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years and it's an important part of the community. So, I please ask you to approve this. Thank you. >> Thank you. Terry Gibson is next, followed by Pipa Hilton Green.

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>> Afternoon. >> Good afternoon, y'all. I'm Terry Gibson. Comm s I'm sorry, Chair Herd. Two people had to leave earlier. Can I just put in their their their comments for them briefly? >> As long as you can fit it into three minutes. Yes, >> I can make this really quick. Um, my

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really good friend Matt Fo, uh, his children, his daughter is there at the school. He's built fishing and hunting lodges around the world around sustainability models. He's been involved in this process and he's an alumni and he just wanted to say that he uh he strongly supports this that the

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due diligence has been done. The other person is Dr. Nicole Kirchoff. She's a PhD marine ecologist. She is the person she was on the board of one of the organizations my organization funds. Um I run absolutely everything through her that has to do with the environment and

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uh she has about 10,000 fish she had to go feed. she's a fish farmer and so she had to go home but she her her uh her old older two are there and she's also been involved in this process and has looked over all the environmental documentation and says great. My personal motivation for being here is I

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really want to see the school expand. Um my son couldn't get in this year. He's he's 10. Um I'm not knocking Jensen Beach Elementary. It's been absolutely awesome. But he's got a couple challenges that that they're uniquely qualified to address. He's also a good athlete, but unfortunately, like his dad, he's never going to be a starting

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center on a his high school basketball team. And um and so, you know, I work three jobs. My wife's a nurse practitioner to do everything we can for that little boy. And um the Pine School is the right place for him. And uh you know, I just hope that we can grow so accommodate more kids and more kids can

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get get that quality of education. Um I just want to also thank the the Florida legislature for the the skull of school choice work. That's huge. Um, and uh, I also want to thank Martin County staff for for the due diligence you guys do. Every time I see any sort of construction project come before this

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committee, I know that it has been reviewed and reviewed and reviewed. So, thank you for raising the bar statewide. Um, anyway, uh, I've toured the school. I grew up in the scrub. I'm a hunting guy. That's my fun job on the weekend. I scrub like the back of my hand. This has

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been approved all the way through through the through the feds. Um, that's not easy. That's really hard. And so I just feel like the the due diligence has been done and I hope you approve it today and um thank you very much for your time. Okay. >> Hippa Hilton Green is next.

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>> She's uh Jeff Sherk followed by Benny Cafrey. >> Hi again. and I had the pleasure to get up here with uh with these guys this morning. So excited to talk again. Um I've been at the Pine School for 5 years, so not as long as Beth. Um and

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Pippa, great job. I'm going to I'm going to have uh I've got some written notes like Beth did, but I'm also going to try to be young like Pippa did and have some notes on my phone as well. Um so uh so I'm the athletic director at the Pine School. Uh I'm also uh a parent of three

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kids. One graduated last year. Uh, one is a junior and one is a sixth grader. Um, my junior um is uh uh got an internship uh this summer at uh

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Loggerhead Marine Life um center and has really uh grown to appreciate uh and want to fight for the environment because of what she has learned in her classes uh and through the Pine School education. Um so I take a lot of pride

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in that and um she's headed to uh to Flaggler to play women's lacrosse is committed there and is looking to study marine biology. Um I don't think she would have taken that path uh if it wasn't for uh the Pine School and the type of education that she is getting. Um so again with everything that's being

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communicated about um the Pine School being very aware of the land that we are on and preserving that land. Uh I've seen that in my five years at at Pine to be to be very true and very accurate. Um from an athletic director standpoint, this expansion is needed. Uh we have

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outgrown our facilities. We have uh tons of kids and growing that want to participate in athletics and uh uh with our educate through sport philosophy. It's just another avenue, another venue that we can uh help these kids grow,

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these these uh young adults grow. So, um to be able to expand our athletic facilities, uh would be a big deal for us. Um and I think really important to the overall education. Um you know, and again, uh winning is not always the goal, but but uh uh producing

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outstanding uh young individuals is what we try to do on the athletic uh uh in our athletic venues. So, being able to expand um the Pine School would really help us do that. So, thank you. Appreciate you taking the time to uh to listen to me. >> Thank you. Vinnie Caffrey is next,

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followed by Chris Sedaka. Good afternoon, commissioners. I'm Vinnie Caffrey, currently head of school at the Pine School and also a proud Pine School parent. I know many of my friends and community supporters who are here are uh you know, looking at their clocks thinking, "Ah man, it's getting a little late here." I'm actually happy we're

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running late because I got to be with our seniors for their senior pep rally this morning and I get to be here uh to speak with all of you this afternoon. I want to thank you for reading the email I sent you as a group yesterday. I was glad to have a chance in writing to advocate for the Pine School as we seek

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approval of our PAMP um reconfiguration. You know, as as we think about how this will unfold and the lessons that we teach at the Pine School, um I'm thinking about accountability, accountability to our environment. And as I look out at all these students here getting a lesson today in how

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development works, probably gonna have a few who are gonna want to see this Lykan when they get back to campus. And um there's nothing better than that to make sure that we preserve um the environment we have and that we do it right for our students. So anyway um the Pine School has a lot of big plans coming up,

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exciting things in the work for the school. We have been able to grow and develop and create the program that we do have right now. um being environmentally minded of all of the resources we are so fortunate to have and I would expect nothing to happen for the future but to continue those same

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preservations. As I listen to this, I know there's still work to be done in terms of identifying the species that need to be effectively relocated and um working with staff and local local conservationists to make sure that it all happens in a way that is ethically good and sound. But as I speak with you

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today, I just want to say um as I've watched this plan and proposal take shape and I've had the chance to work with our board of trustees over the past few years to bring us to where we are today. I am incredibly proud to lead this school and to see all of this happen in a way that is educationally

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minded and environmentally sound. So, thank you for your time and um I really hope that we can get approval from you all today for our plans. Thanks. >> Thank you. Chris Sedaka will be followed by Khloe Seurs.

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>> Good afternoon. I'm sure you guys are tired like a lot of us are that have been here since 8:30 this morning. But um as you heard this morning from Jeff Shurk and our wonderful coaches, uh we have some amazing athletes here and uh my daughter is on the varsity girls

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soccer team which did amazingly well this year as well. Um, not only are we developing amazing athletes, but we're training these children and young adults to be great stewards and great citizens. Um, one of the cool things is that we've

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got this 173 acres of amazing property. The kids get to learn about the environment on a daily basis. And one of the main themes that we teach them or that they're learning is to be good stewards of the environment. We all hear about global warming. We hear about uh

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biodiversity loss, plastic pollution, all of these things. The kids are learning about this on a daily basis. But what our environment gives them, it gives them the ability to be good environmental stewards by learning about a few things. One being human health

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connection, right? We need to understand cleaner air, cleaner water, cleaner soil. These things help improve our lives on a daily basis. There's also an environmental impact from an economic standpoint, right? There are sustainable

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practices that these kids are learning about that create jobs in the environmental space. So, they're learning a lot of different things that it's is pretty important. But overall, by expanding our campus and adding world-class sports programs, we're also

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adding best-in-class academics that we have, and we're continuing to get better uh for our kindergarten through 12th graders, but we're also we have a fantastic on-site environmental class that will continue to make the Pine School one of the premier educational

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facilities in all of Florida. Thank you very much, and I hope you uh approve the expansion. >> Thank you. Chloe Sors is next, followed by Laurel Deber Bard. >> Good afternoon. >> Good afternoon. Good afternoon,

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commissioners. My name is Chloe Sorz. Um you're noticing here that I have my two my two children with me who are both Pine School students. Um first, I want to start by thanking each and every one of you for your time and commitment. Um today is really a lesson for all of us in civic leadership and action. Um, I

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had what I thought was a really great speech prepared, but um, fortunately or unfortunately, I had wonderful speakers come before me and they they stole some of my themes. But, but that's okay actually because I think it really demonstrates what all of us are here for today, which is to um, really emphasize

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that our school and the way we think about education is very consistent. We have a consistent mission. We have consistent values around stewardship. You heard that word a lot today. Um you heard themes of um how we like to educate our students, our children. Um

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just in terms of real life scenarios. We're seeing that today. You heard a lot about uh the possibility of involving our students in possibly relocating some of these endangered species. Um I just want to reiterate that all of the plans that we're discussing here are really

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about protecting the future and that future is sitting in this room today. Um we are we are all here for the same reason. Thank you so much and I I hope that we can all find common ground and a positive way forward here. Thank you. >> Thank you.

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>> Laurel D Bard is next followed by is Nicole Kirchoff here? >> Laura Gerard had to leave. Okay. Laura Dard calling Laura Dar. >> Yes, you're next.

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>> Okay. Um, my my comment is not about what's on the agenda at the moment. My comment is about what happened this morning with the train horns. Would you like me to wait until it's over with? I'll be happy to do that. >> The last request to speak form I have is

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from Kelly Hilton Green. And if you would like to address us, please fill out a request to speak form and hand it to the baiff. Good afternoon. I know it's been a particularly long day. Uh thank you so much for hearing this today. My name is Kelly Hilton Green. Um as you can tell,

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I'm a Steuart resident uh local, not born and bred from here, but uh but chose to be here 15 years ago. Um chose to be in Martin County, uh because of the natural beauty of what's around us. Uh and I think that's happened because of the measured growth that you've

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allowed. Um I am an educator um by trade. I'm an educator by um my dad is an educator. Still is an educator. He joined us from Cape Town, South Africa this week. Um I'd like to say just a few things. Um we ask our students every day

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to just say something and it's this. We as members of the Pine School agree to uphold the core values of respect, responsibility, honesty, and equality. We agree to always serve as supportive role model to our school community. We say that, we believe that, we build

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that. Uh we're in the uh in the future of of growing leaders and and and that's that's essentially what they're learning today. Um we believe in people. Um we believe in you guys. You guys have done a tremendous job, ladies and gentlemen, of of of building an amazing community.

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We want to be a part of that. We want to continue to be a part of that. Um we believe in our environment. Uh my daughter was one that spoke probably more eloquently than me um with a with less of an accent. And I think that uh getting her environmental diploma this morning was was just one of those steps

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that the Pine School is taking into making sure our future is not only now but but for a long time to be. So I urge you to to take this vote and and vote in favor of us. I thank you for your time. I thank you for all your staff's work you've done on this um because it's a

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it's a huge undertaking and we do appreciate it. I love being in Mont County. I love being a resident here and it's because of the work that you guys have done. Thank you so much. >> Thank you. >> Anything to add, questions or comments, commissioners? >> Commissioner Vargas.

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>> Okay, this is for Representative Overdorf. We talked about the Gopher tortoises. >> I can hear you. Um, we talked about the gopher tortoises a few moments ago and um, they suffer from a lot of stress and also dispersal related mortality.

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Are you familiar with this? >> Uh, to an extent. Sure. >> Okay. Well, that's what you do. So, I I assumed you would. They have strong homing instincts and they can walk themselves to death to go back to where their native habitat is. You talked

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about the cost if you're going to rehome them right on the property, the school property, or if you're going to put them in another area. So, what is most important to you then? >> So, I I that's a kind of a wide openen

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question there. >> It's really It's really straightforward because you talked about the triple cost. >> What's important to me is the long-term continuation of the species. That is what's important to me. Uh and making sure that the gopher tortoise are in a

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position where they can in fact be successful. What we have shown through countless studies um and the reason that the FWC supports off-site relocation is that uh right now the genetic pool is isolated within uh the the habitat

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that's associated at the Pine School. By having a conservation area where you're bringing in tortoises from a variety of of sites, they now have an opportunity to be on managed land. They have a larger gene pool and therefore have an opportunity to be successful. Uh and in

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their long-term success, which is exactly what I would like to see is a long-term success of the population, the federal government actually took a look at the gopher tortoise and looked at listing it federally. They then reviewed our state program. the state program is

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so successful that they chose not to increase the listing associated with gopher tortoise. So I think that the program speaks for itself. Um what was asked for me was the costs associated with it and that's why I gave the costs um with it. We would also have to look

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at carrying capacity. We have to look at other things like that that are on the site. But again, my my main concern is the long-term success um of a species that is really only here in the southeast of the United States. >> Well, tell us how you prevent them wanting to go back to their original

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home burrow. >> I've relocated roughly in the neighborhood of in my career probably close to 3,000 tortoises. I've never had one come back to its area. >> Yes. But if they do, because this has

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been written about and I've consulted others about this, I'm trying to get a direct answer from you. >> I I commissioner, I think I've given you a direct answer. I'm not trying to be combative. This is a a known practice. I've honestly I've never heard of a with the exception of it maybe being a

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quarter mile or a half mile away. I've never heard of a tortoise going back uh and making that journey from uh in many sites uh we have I think the closest site we had was Bluefield site in in St. Lucy to a project I did in Martin and none of those ever came back. Um there

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is there is perimeter fencing in these areas. FWC monitors a lot of these uh items and looks at that and if this was a detrimental uh item for or detrimental practice, I would suggest that um there would be a a lot of regulation that

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would be added on to this to make sure that it's best for the species. Well, I I've interviewed those that are familiar with this and they say they don't do well when they're transported off site. >> Uh maybe we should take a field trip. I mean, I I I don't know what else to tell

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you. I I've this is an area that I'm an expert in. And again, I just have never experienced that whatsoever. Uh in fact, uh if you'd like to, um there was an experimental site that was done behind my house and they're they're thriving. Trust me, it wasn't my experiment. it

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was SFWMD uh years and years ago and they're thriving and they were all relocated from a variety of spots in Martin County. Uh but that being said, uh again, happy to do that with you. Happy to get some FWC folks to call you if you that's something that that you feel is uh is appropriate. Um but I I

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haven't had those concerns previously. Again, if you have those folks that are advising you on this and they have concerns, I'm wide open to uh supplying them with additional information. Commissioner, >> is that any answer? Okay. >> This is all the answer I can get right

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now from you. So, >> is there something I I can't >> No, because I've interviewed others that are in the field. >> Okay. >> And I've seen also tortoises that have been injured. They're trying to walk across roads. So, I'm trying to find out

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if it's the cost factor and you want to relocate them because it's less expensive rather than keeping them on the property. I'm not certain which is more important to you. the long-term uh continuation of the species is is the best for me. Uh have I ever seen a tourist cross the road? Certainly. And

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I've helped it being killed, >> but it's not. Um but those are not coming those are not coming from a bank or relocation area whatsoever. >> No. >> So we don't have any banks in Martin County and that's the only place I've had that happen. I'm sorry, >> Commissioner.

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>> Mine is more of a universal, not so much specifically for you, Mr. Overdorf. It's just to I guess move the agenda item along based on what we've heard. Uh first off, I'd want to thank I know that the soccer team first this morning there

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was probably I went out and had the opportunity to see most of them. It was probably 70 or 80 students from the Pine School and it's just an interesting day. Some days our agenda doesn't take us to lunchtime and today we had the first portion of our day the speakers for the

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quiet zone was not an agenda item. It was just a group of residents that decided today was the day that they were going to come forward. Obviously to your timing detriment. Then we had a couple other key issues and I was talking to our chair thinking how do we bring your

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agenda item forward but everyone's agenda item is important and there were a lot uh large groups. I don't think we've had this many people in the chambers and in the lobby and I think some of you even went over to the library uh in such a long time which is actually pretty exciting for us. So, I'm

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very appreciative of that. The unintended advantage for you all today is that you did get a realworld example of civics or local government in action. I think it was an interesting day for you to hear how it works and how citizens have the

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ability to come forward and say, I think this is a great idea. I think this is a terrible idea. And then you see our staff weigh in. And then you see the five of us that come with very ex uh distinct backgrounds and experiences and

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opinions. Um there are times most times when staff's recommendations and uh comments to me are very very important but there's also times when it's more opinion based where I would maybe def disagree. When we get into technical and

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environmental type of things like we're discussing today, I lean heavily on our environmental staff, which maybe unfairly gets quite a bit of knocks from some of the members of our uh community development community consultant

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professionals saying that they lean way too heavy on the side of the environmental protection and cautious, which I think is excellent because that's basically what our community wants. So today you had a civics lesson and also um this portion the the fact

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that you what you're really here for in environmental stewardship that word was mentioned quite a bit. It's like environmental protection. Um if there was ever a school and we have remarkable schools I think the Pine

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School uh I have many friends uh relatives my own children we toured the Pine School. Uh I think what you are what they're your administration and your faculty are doing is exactly what we heard today training you and teaching

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you to be environmentally uh sound. I think this particular project will have 500 student researchers, inspectors and leaders uh watching most projects that are uh receive a tortoise relocation, a

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lykan relocation. Uh PAMPs, there are experts and construction people on the site, but they're pretty much um blocked. This will be a working classroom, an actual working classroom for you all to have the opportunity to

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see the process being done correctly. Uh we've heard from some of your classmates, parents that are in the field. You've heard from our expert who uh who's been here for years. Uh and then you have Morris Krady uh who's been

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working on this development. even the folks that probably we had heard that there would be a little more push back from the environmental community. Ma'am, I appreciate what you said. I think she was giving a balanced kind of understanding that look, ideally you

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would prefer nothing to change, but with the fact that there is a change, there is a net gain. Uh there was more to start with than was necessary. Plus, there's a net gain. the consolidation of a new area I think is in my opinion and I'm definitely uh more on the lay person

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side of this but consolidating the environment makes more sense than having smaller peacemeal uh satellite environments. Uh I've been here long enough to hear that repeated many times. Uh it's a beautiful campus. I've had the opportunity the pleasure of being there

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dozens and dozens of times for all sorts of events. Um, what could have happened? I remember when the school moved from Stewart down to Hobound, they could have just had a master plan to bulldoze the whole place and put in all of the fields

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and um recreational facilities that they wanted, but they have, from my perspective, had taken a much more of a uh incremental approach to building what they needed when they needed it. Uh, versus just going in and creating

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everything up front. So now I wouldn't necessarily want to punish them for the ability that they have created a very successful campus educational institution definitely uh very wellrenowned and

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respected not only locally plenty of people from all over the place know what the Pine School is they've turned out fantastic students they have fant fantastic students and will continue to I think this school is too much of a in

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the spotlight, if you will, to allow some kind of trick or to not let this project uh go on the way it was supposed to. We also received a letter, I'm assuming we all did, from the folks at Banner Lake just as early as uh as

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recently as today supporting this. Um, I'm not um afraid of making a determination that this is the right group with the right consultants uh at the right time to do this project and I would make a motion to accept staff's our environmental professional

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staff's recommendation of approval. Thank you, >> Commissioner Heatherington. >> Yes, I'll be brief because I know it's been a long day. First of all, congratulations to you young men for your achievements and thank you for bearing with us all day. And uh I feel

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very confident that the applicant has presented um plenty of evidence that this is going to be an environmentally um well-managed project. There is a net gain which is fantastic. Um I think one

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of your uh parents summed it up perfectly. What we were all discussing albeit a long discussion was protecting our future. And I thought that was a perfect way to sum up this conversation. We all want the best interest. And then fourthly, I will say um to the Pine

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School, thank you for what you have done in this community as a parent of two sons. One of my sons went to uh a choice school and not the Pine School, but I know how important it is to have uh schools of choice for parents. And I

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think the Pine School adds so much value to our community. And I only want to encourage you to continue to do what you're doing and I'll be glad to second the motion. >> Mr. Caps, >> uh, thank you all for coming today,

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especially this fun uh, good-looking uh, group of young people. And hopefully you guys have learned some things today about local government. And I want to thank the Pine School for being a wonderful asset to Martin County

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and to Hope Sound and District 3. These are some Commissioner Campy. These are some of District 3's finest citizens right here. You're all from You're all from District 3, right? This is a Hope Sound school. So,

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>> I see I'm sure there's some Palm City kids that go to the Pine School. You know, I I was thinking one way when I came into this and I was kind of con really caught up in the thought that we

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didn't really have an adequate evaluation plan of the rare and endangered plants on the sensitive shrublands and that we didn't have a relocation plan that was sufficient in place at this

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point. But now I've I've understood more about why we don't uh we're dealing with school resources here and you have to make sure that you're spending the money wisely. Um

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so uh that was an important revelation to me. I also began to feel more comfortable with uh the integrity of the process and how it's going to be monitored.

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um and that you're going to have an evaluation plan and a relocation plan. And I'm so impressed that the school goes to such great lengths to teach the young people about the environment and

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how to participate in this. I I uh I can't help but believe that these young people are going to be this is going to be a very impressionable memory in their minds as they're growing up that they all came here to learn about local government and about the environment.

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You know, the scrub is really important to me personally, especially since I live in Hope Sound and that's kind of what we're known for. You know, there are there are probably some more quaint neighborhoods to live in in Martin County than in Hopetown.

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I'll have to admit. I think I think downtown Stewart is absolutely lovely. And SS Point is just gorgeous. >> Don't forget Jensen Beach >> and Jensen Beach. >> Palm City. >> No, it's too on guard. >> Anywhere in Martin County is great,

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right? But you know what Hopeound has to offer. I always tell people close beach access and our big natural areas. Uh, hiking in the woods. Man, it's fun. I I go a lot. Um,

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I try to exercise like three times a week and one time a week I I walk in the scrub. Um, usually for about an hour, hour and 15 minutes. So, I'm in the scrub like once a week and then I usually walk to the beach once a week from my house and

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back, which is about four miles. And then I try to go to the gym once a week. That's about all I can fit in. Uh with busy commission life, I should exercise more, but the the scrub is very much a part of my consciousness.

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Uh and I hate to see any of it disturbed, >> right? >> I would love to preserve it all. But, you know, when I think about what a good purpose might be if we had to disturb some of it, you know, having

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a school situated in it that that teaches about the value of the scrub lands, uh, and a school that really focuses in on that kind of thing. That's probably a really good, um, a really good purpose, uh, if if it

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had to happen. And um you know, I've often wondered riding around in Hobound now that I've learned more about the scrub. Most of Hobound is built on a big sand ridge. Our land perks really well in Hobound

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because it's all we all we're all living on sugar sand, I'm afraid. Um, probably my house used to be scrub off of Gomez Avenue and uh most of the neighborhoods in Hobound were probably scrublands at

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one time. And that's kind of kind of sad, but at least we're all on the right course now trying to do all we can to save all we can. And it appears to me that the Pine School is doing this in a very

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responsible way. So, I am uh more comfortable with what you have in mind and I will support it. >> Mr. McNicholas, would you like to address us? >> Thank you, Chairman Herd. Um, just want

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to add two quick things. We are not, and this is one thing I want to clean up for Toby that he didn't mention. I'm a little nervous today. I got a little pressure on me. I've got three of my kids in the back of the room, Morgan, McKenzie, and Meline. And then there's uh and then there's the bosses back. And

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Vinnie, I want to tell you, you've done an incredible job on this master site plan. I know this has been a a lot of work uh for you and I the last five years. It's a big watermark for the school. Um the gopher tortoises, I'm not debating the process, but one things Toby's

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forgetting to tell you is we're going to leave every gopher tortoise there that we can. Every single one of them. What we also determined too and Mrs. Cox has accepted um starting tomorrow she will be working with us in the Native Plant Society to map all of the plants on

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property as well as Dr. Nicole Kchner who's one of our uh doctors biologists at the school. So they'll be joining in partnership and working with the kids as early as tomorrow. >> Great. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. If if you think that we're giving this

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uh undue consideration, we're not. Um scrub habitat is not recreatable. Many habitats are, but scrub is not one of them. So, we want to make sure that if we're are destroying scrub that we're trying to replace it.

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>> There is a motion and a second. All those in favor? I >> I >> opposed. That motion passes unanimously. >> Thank you. >> Clear out and proceed. >> Where are you going? Not always what you expect.

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>> Well, that's part of it. That's what it should be. Right. Right. Right. >> Chairwoman, which uh item are we taking up? >> Public hearing number one. >> This is no action. It's just a presentation.

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>> The room attorneys are the fourth. >> All right, we're taking up public hearing number one, which is a public hearing on proposed Martin County TriCo settlement for Michelle PO versus Martin County, Florida.

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>> Good afternoon, chair and commissioners. Tangi Grim for the record. I'm the deputy HR risk director. This item is being presented as a public hearing for comment only in accordance with the board's established procedures for trial settlements.

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No formal action by the board is required at this time. The hearing provides an opportunity for public input on a proposed settlement in the case of Michelle Poachch versus Martin County which arose from a trip and fall incident at a county facility.

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The county self-insured through trio which assigned council and participated in settlement discussions. The proposed settlement has been recommended as being in the best interest of the county and is fully covered by previously established trial reserves.

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In accordance with board procedures, this public hearing is required prior to finalizing any settlement over 5,000 to allow for transparency and public comment. Following a public hearing, staff will complete the required procedural steps and notify Trio that the board's process

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has been satisfied. This concludes my presentation and at this time we can open the floor for comments from the public and the board. >> This is a public hearing. Would anyone from the public like to address us? >> Seeing none, Commissioner Casey. Madame

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chair, as our representative with the Trico board, we have with staff have reviewed this and the settlement that is being presented is in the best interest of the county and it was uh very well vetted and this was the best option that

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we could come up with. >> We need to take no action, right? >> No action. >> Oh, no action. >> Commissioner Vargas. >> No, no, that's fine. It's no action. I was curious um what was the person doing that they were on county property if they're not an employee it would have been what workers comp. So

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>> no they're a res civilian just walking. >> Were they supposed to be there? >> They had access to be there. It was over at the Indian Riverside. >> It was what? >> At the Indian Riverside facility >> park. >> Mhm. >> Uhhuh. Oh yes. Okay. Now I remember the

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incident. Okay. >> Thank you. We will take up uh let's see DPQJ2 which is a quasi judicial public hearing a request for a variance to allow the issuance of a building permit on a legal

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lot of record that does not front an open road but has access via an easement. >> Good afternoon. >> Good morning. Good afternoon chairman. >> Please proceed. board. I'm Michael Gresilka, the county engineer, and with me I've got Jet Martell, the acting county surveyor, who will be making the

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presentation. >> Jet Martell for the record, acting county surveyor. I have um the history. >> This is quasi judicial. Any exparte disclosures? Commissioner Vargas, >> I have any, they've been disclosed. Commissioner Caps,

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>> if I have any, they have been filed. >> I don't have any and they've been filed. >> I don't have any and they've been filed. And Commissioner Heather, >> I also don't have any. And that's been filed. >> And you've filed your information with the clerk. >> Yes. >> Anyone who's going to be providing sworn

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testimony, please stand up, raise your right hand, and be sworn in. >> Do you swear or affirm the evidence you're about to give will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? >> I do. >> Thank you. Please proceed, Miss Martell. Uh, good afternoon, commissioners. Um,

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today we have a request from Robert and Jamie Donovan along with Sharon and Gerald Beam for variance to allow the issuance of a building permit on legal law of record that does not front an open road. According to Martin County Code Landment Regulations, section 4.843

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843 K1C. The board of county commissioners may grant a variance that allows a building permit on a lot not fronting an open road provided that the board determines the following. One, the lot is a legal lot of record. and two,

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the lot has legal access to an open road that is a reasonable and practical and b in general conformity to the style and character of the neighborhood. And C established by recorded easement no more

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than a/4 mile or 1,320 ft long. And three, the variance does not create an undue burden on the county's provision of public safety or public services. Uh staff's analysis of the required determinations follows the requirement.

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One, the lot is a legal lot of record and was established pursuant to Palm City Farms according to the plat thereof recorded in plat book 6, page 42, public records of Palm Beach, now Martin County, Florida, and per a legal lot split as recorded in official records

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book 3,536, page 2852, and official records book 30 536 page 2856 um shown in blue on the location map.

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Uh two, the lot has reasonable and practical access to an open road being South West Moore Street, approximately 330 ft to the first lot shown in red on the location map, and an additional 330 ft to the second lot shown in yellow on

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the location map. The total distance being approximately 660 ft in length which is less than the maximum distance of 1320 ft. Um it is in general conformity with the character of the surrounding neighborhood. Access to the

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lot. What is established by an access in the utilities easement agreement recorded in official records book 3,536 page 2860 public records of Myroning County, Florida. Use of the access which is

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located outside of a public rightaway would not place an undue burden on the county's provision of public safety or services. The board of county commissioners has been asked to be notified if the parcels associated with such a variance is within the urban

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service boundary and if the parcels are located in Palmar or Palm Beach heights subdivisions. The subject parcels are not within the primary urban service boundary nor is it near Palmar or Palm

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Beach Heights subdivision. Um it is staff's recommendation one that the board move um to receive and file this agenda item summary and all of its attachments for the record as exhibit one and two move

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that the board grant the variance and adopt the resolution to allow insurance of a building permits on certain parcels. identified as exhibit A. And with that, I would be happy to answer any questions. >> Questions for Miss Martell? Seeing none.

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>> Wait a minute. One question. Yeah, >> Mr. Caps. >> That the quarter mile thing. I'm just curious. Um, is that a fairly strict standard on an issue like that or a lenient standard or kind of in the middle or is that

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something unique to Martin County uh comp plan? Um, curious about that. Like say say somebody had a a lot like out in the wilderness deep into the forest somewhere and they needed an easement that was like 5 miles long or something.

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I guess that would not be allowed then. >> Not per our LDRs. >> Yeah. Per the LDRs. Okay. Any any thoughts about how does that how do we compare to other counties on that issue? like it is that a strict interpretation

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or or uh like just curious about it. >> So, Tyson Waters on behalf of the applicant. I'm not sure. I think that came a number of years ago when there were some uh parcels of land. I want to say off Martin Highway, some 20 acre

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tracks of land that were well off the um Martin Highway. And so there but there were easements and dirt roads that kind of connected to these parcels. And I I believe and certainly correct me if I'm wrong, it evolved out of that and and the quarter mile I'm not sure how the quarter mile was determined as being

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reasonable. I would imagine related to the fact that they still have to get public services and so wanting to make sure they were close enough to to still provide those get those services. >> It seems like it seems reasonable. I was just curious about how I compared to other communities, but that's fine. Thank you. I would just uh add that um

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we went through a a number of years of iteration to come up with the rules that you have in front of you from being super strict that there should be none to finding out that that didn't work to uh creating the uh procedure that we

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have today. Um our our chair uh endured that with me for many years on how we uh accomplished that uh process. Um, open roads is kind of a unique standard too in Martin County on um, essentially you

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deal with roads that were created by plats, some going back to the early 20s or such like that. And up until 1972, you could just take a bulldozer or whatever and plow a opening and get a

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building permit. After that, we said you needed to be on an open road, which is a Martin County definition and and it has evolved since that to today where we have it more more precisely defined in the land development regulations through

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a number of iterations. >> Thank you, >> Commissioner Vargas. >> Yeah, I I think this is um way out west uh Palm City >> Palm City area and there are mostly gravel or dirt roads out there, correct? I think there's >> this particular area we're talking

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about. I >> I think this is paved, but there's a mixture of of >> there's paved on on the main and then it's gravel and then it's gravel to get to your home in these areas, right? Or the lots. >> A good majority of the the roads in Palm City Farms have been paved over the

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years. Um there are still a number of them that are privately maintained that are dirt roads, >> right? But in this particular case, >> in this particular case, um, more street is paved up to >> up to that certain point up to this point. Correct. >> Yeah. And then the rest is is rock. >> Well, they're essentially driveways once

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you get in. I mean, that's what they they the they they amount for are driveways to get through track the west half of track 7 and the east and west half of track 8. >> Okay. Is so fire safety. If they have to do turnaround, how do they do that on these roads if they have to get to homes in there?

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>> Currently, they normally use driveways. Yeah. >> Somebody's driveway. Correct. >> Drive around the driveway. >> They pull in the driveways and back out and >> go on the land or >> Yeah. Yeah. >> More casual. >> Mr. Waters.

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>> So again, Tyson Waters, on behalf of the applicant, I just want to thank Miss Martell and staff for working with us and the legal department for getting us to where we're at today. Um this is it's in western Martin County. These are lots of record. um um all five acre lots. So, all we're looking to do is be able to

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pull a building permit on each of those 5acre lots. Um outside of the urban service district, I think as your staff went through, we meet and satisfy all of your requirements in section 4.843 K1C of your land development regulations. And with that, uh we'd ask you to agree

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with your staff and approve this open road variance. And I'm certainly here for any questions that you have. >> Questions? Commission move approval. >> Second. It's a quasi. You got to ask for public. >> Yeah, this is a public hearing. Would anyone like to address us?

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>> Seeing none, I'll close the public portion of the of the uh hearing and come back to the board. There's a motion and a second. All those in favor? I opposed. That motion passes unanimously. Thank you. >> Thank you very much and thank you for all everything you did today. It was a long day. I hope but I appreciate it.

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>> Your son will be very proud of you and your daughter. He's 17. I said I don't know about that. But >> he will. He just won't tell you. >> We will take up R&P1, which is a Marty system update.

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Mr. Beecher. >> Good afternoon, uh, commissioners. Ash Beecher, transit administrator. Today we have a presentation from MCT LLC, a division of Senior Resource Association,

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uh providing an update on writership and operations of the Marty bus system. Uh this will be presented by uh Karen Deagle and Chris Stevenson from SR. >> Thank you, Ash. >> Very nice. >> Good afternoon everyone. >> Afternoon. >> It's nice to be back in front of you. Uh

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the last time I think it was back in November when we made a great decision for the transit system and we wanted to give you just a quick update on the success that we've had and also some future plans that we're we're working on. So first of all um we've got

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Okay, great. Thank you. So we just wanted to give you an update on the fiscal year wrership. Um currently since uh July of last year when we took over July 1st we have seen an increase of 20% um uh ridership. However, if you go to

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the next slide please um since in the in the red you'll see there um this is November when we decided to go fair free there is an increase of 37% wrership. So it's been very successful. We are looking to um even greater numbers

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because we have some plans that I'm going to let Chris talk about. >> Hi y'all. I'm Chris Stevenson. I'm the director of transportation at Martin County Transit. And like Karen indicated, we've been really encouraged by the the growth in writership since we went fair free. And that's just the beginning because we've uh got some

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other big plans for the system. We've identified 21 uh locations in the in the community where we want to add bus stops. Um, and you can see they're on all all of our different routes, not just one specific route. Um, and we're hoping that just by adding uh, you know,

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21 more bus stops, we'll be able to to continue to get higher ridership. And those are all uh locations that don't require any big infrastructure ads. It's just a pole in the ground with the sign on it. Uh, there's already a sidewalk there. It's already ADA ADA accessible.

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So, we feel really good about um, being able to get those stops added in the very near future. We've already started talking to FDOT and the city of Stewart if if this stops are in their right ofway. Uh so in the very near future we'll be adding those stops and we uh will continue to see uh writership grow

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there. And then also we've started a route optimization study. So we we had told you all back in November that that was something we wanted to do for the system. We've uh engaged Michael Baker International. They're uh a consulting firm with a very good reputation in the

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state of Florida and we started working with them on May 1st and they are going to help us um really dive deep into the system which um which routes we need to to look at all all the bus stops considering micro transit the hours that we're running things like that. And so

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um those are things that we told you all we were going to do back in November. We've already started doing that and we we think the system which has a lot of positive growth right now was just going to continue to see that that growth in the very near future >> and that's it. >> Oh boy. Questions?

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>> Commissioner Caps, >> what was the increase since fair free or 36 or >> 37% since going fair free in November? >> Right. I I wonder uh if any of you have heard any stories from writers like

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initial reactions uh when they found out that it would be fair free. Um, well, we we did get a lot of great press. Um, I think you remember back uh in November, December and uh Chris, have you got some stories you want?

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>> Yeah, there were there were a lot of newspaper articles and things on the news where people were just talking. >> Well, I'm thinking more in terms of the writers themselves, like were people pretty shocked to find >> Absolutely. They went out and spoke to a lot of people in the community. People were thrilled about it. they were uh talking about how they're able to use

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the bus more because they don't have to pay a fair and uh it's it's really opened up a lot of doors for people in the community, >> better quality of life for them. They're able to get places and uh I think that we all know um you know with the economy, the cost of living, the

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increases, every little little bit helps. And this certainly has helped a lot of people and uh we look forward to expanding in even greater so that uh so that we can help even more people get places where they need to go. >> Mr. King. >> Very good.

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>> Thank you very much, Madam Chair. Uh I represent Palm City, which is a transit desert. >> That's right. >> Um but I just wanted to reiterate when we went to Fairfree, there was some push back from people that said, "Oh, you're doing free buses." Uh the gist of that

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was that, and please correct me if I'm wrong, that the grant money that we get from the federal government, let's just use round numbers, it's $1 million. And when we were collecting the fair, if we collected $100,000, the first thing that the federal grant

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would do is deduct $100,000 from the million-doll grant. So by going fair free we not only still I guess achieve the same amount of cash or >> we will yes

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>> financing >> but it also eliminated the fact that if you're yours is all about seconds and minutes correct on on the routes someone would have to go to the driver give them the money right >> the driver would have to either make some kind of transaction for the fair

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and then the person behind them and behind them how many fewer or as many people that get on, then that driver would be responsible for the fair collections and and then collecting them and bringing them to wherever the bus ended that evening. Then that money would have to be secured.

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>> Then the next morning, a law enforcement officer from the Palm Beach >> counted first >> counted out in front of someone so that there's a checks and balances to see that there's no skimming, >> right? Then either a deputy or a Steuart police officer would have to meet them and then collect that and bring it in

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for a deposit. >> And when they counted, you had to have two people in the room in a locked room with video. >> Correct. So more >> so by changing it to fair free which has all of the benefits that you mentioned and that commissioner caps was asking about

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>> from a uh logistics point of view we're saving even additional money because the personnel the timing our our law enforcement personnel the the deposits and the rest of it for relatively small amount of money. Uh so that was your

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suggestion similar to what they they did a similar study up in St. Lucy which just >> they did the pilot project and they they after the two years of pilot project they continued to >> just seems to make sense and so and we're seeing ridership increase which is what our ultimate goal is. So that was

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the two of you that was your suggestion that we embraced and uh thank you very much for that. >> Well thank you very much for >> and you guys have done a remarkable job with the whole thing. I've had the opportunity to be with you in Indian River and you know that's our goal. I

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mean they're our sister county and what are they doing? 1.5 million riders. >> We'll do 1.6 this year. >> 1.6. And so uh similar population and everything else. And we're working our way there. But I mean so it's not like it can't work. We just have to be

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patient and know >> patient time >> and >> with that gentleman sitting right there and the two of you, I think we're going to get there. >> Yeah. >> Thank you so much. Thank you very much. We've uh I just wanted to make mention that we do have a great working relationship with the Martin County staff um Ash and his team and uh it's

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it's it's been going very well. So, thank you. >> Thank you. Great report. >> Thank you. >> Now, we will take up uh department one, office of management and budget items which require board approval.

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Good afternoon. Stephanie Merley, director of OMB, here to present two items today on OM. Our first item is a permission to accept the local agency program or the lap grant for funding assistance from FDOT for the Southwest

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Bulldog Way sidewalk project. Our public works department is requesting the acceptance of $1,72,940 for the construction of an 8- foot wide sidewalk on Southwest Bulldog Way from Southwest Hawk View Circle to the entrance of South Fork High School. The

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funds for constructions that that are more than the program funding um in the amount of about $61,000 will be coming from the FY26 roads capital improvement plan. There is no cash match required for this grant.

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>> And item number two is an adjustment to the fiscal year 2026 budget. Um Martin County is in receipt of an unanticipated contribution from the Hobound Community Chest in the amount of $24,400 for soccer facility improvements at

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William G. Doc Meyers Park. Um the total cost of improvements is $48,822 which will be shared with district 3 MSTU funds and OM is just requesting a budget resolution to allocate the unanticipated revenues into the budget.

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>> Yo, Community Chest, a big thank you. >> Yes. >> And that's all I have today. >> Any questions? >> Motion to accept. I'm sorry. Yeah, I I will I will second that motion as well, but I thought I would mention what we

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have in mind at Doc Myers Park. Um the uh Community Chest is great partner. This will be the second time that I've used some district funds with them. We did scoreboards at Reed Park in Hobound

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and uh so we partnered on that one like 50/50 and then we're doing that on this one too. And what we're going to get at Doc Myers Park is a fence along Dixie. Um, a big portion of the border along

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Dixie does not have a fence. So, it will have a fence. And then we're we're buying a couple of additional storage sheds that they need for soccer equipment and such. And and then there's an existing uh

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concession stand building and we're going to put a big awning roof on the on the back side of it so the kids can get out of the rain. Uh those are the main things as I remember. I think I got it all. But just thought I'd let people know what what's happening

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there. >> There's a motion and a second. All those in favor? I >> opposed. That motion passes unanimously. Now we'll go on to department two, contracts that meet the threshold for board approval of $1 million or greater.

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Miss Brotherton. >> All right. Good afternoon. Christy Brotherton, your chief procurement officer. Uh we have three items for your consideration today. And the first one is a professional services contract for the Dixie storm water and streetscape

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design. and staff is recommending that the board award the contract to the highest ranked firm which is GI Consultants in the amount of 1,700,49.34 and move that the board authorize the county administrator or designate to execute all documents related to this

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request. Uh next we have a continuing services agreement. This is for parks and recreation planning, design and construction administration services. And this contract has a maximum not to exceed value of $2,500,000

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and a maximum not to exceed term of 5 years. And staff is recommending contract award to the three highest scoring firms which are Kimley Horn and Associates, Miller Leg, and WGI Incorporated. and move that the board authorize the

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county administrator or designate to execute all documents related to this request. And last, we have another continuing services agreement. This is for disaster recovery and resiliency services. And this contract has a maximum not to exceed value of $3 million and a maximum

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not to exceed term of five years. and staff is recommending contract award to the two highest ranked firms which is Lacanti Engineering and Title Basin Government Consulting and move that the board authorize the county administrator or designate to execute all documents

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related to this request. That concludes this item. Questions? I'll move approval. >> Second. >> Thank you. >> There's a motion and a second. All those in favor? I opposed. That motion passes unanimously. be on to department five

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which is approval of three memorandums of agreement with the Florida Department of Agriculture and Consumer Services Rural and Family Lands Protection Program for the acquisition of conservation easements over certain environmentally sensitive parcels using certax funding.

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>> Good afternoon, Mr. Mail. >> Good afternoon. John Mail, Martin County Environmental Resource Administrator. And this item is um the culmination of a Martin County Forever initiative to do rural and family lands easements in

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partnership with the Florida Department of A and Consumer Services. There are three properties that FDAX is moving forward to uh governor and cabinet hopefully in June. And in order to move those forward on the governor and cabinet agenda item, they wanted to have

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funding agreements in place with Martin County. So what these MOAs do, it establishes that partnership between us and FDAX and we are agreeing to fund up to 50% on each of these. Um and the

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negotiations will take place after governor and cabinet um approves those and we'll bring back the final easements for approval to the board at at that time. So the three properties are um turnpike dairy which is in the IRL South

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program. It's west of Fox Brown south of Martin Grade. Um it is uh about 500 acres. Um and that would be for an agriculture easement with EPAX. Um the second property is um SS Farms which falls in the Palmar Water Control

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District. It's a 55 acre property of active ranching. And the third one is uh the Leonard property which is 239 acres more or less um on uh on Bridge Road, Southside of Bridge Road and it is part

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of the lockooy program. So we get um an easement from three of the four programs. It would be hard to get an a easement in the blue ways. And and what we're asking for is uh the board to approve the MOAS uh to partner with rural and family lands to acquire

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conservation easements on all three properties and authorize the chair to execute the MOAS. >> Questions for Mr. Mail? >> Mr. Caps. Um, seems that I heard that with the

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EPDAX program, rural and family lands, that they have currently have like 500 applications across the state for conservation easements. Is that right? Somewhere in that range. >> I think it's north of that now. Um, it's been a popular program uh in part

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because it's it's not enjoyed this level of funding for quite some time. Um and and we were one of the early beneficiaries of that in Martin County with the uh Bull Hammock Ranch being put under easement a year ago last December. Um that was a a very large one. I think

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it was at the time it was the largest one that FDAX had done and it was one of the properties that we had contemplated acquiring an easement on with Martin County Forever and it was taken off the table right away. to your point um as they rank these 500

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plus acquisitions, they start the ranking with um 50% partners. Um and then once they exhaust those, they'll look at uh partners that are projects that are funded with partners less than 50%. And only until they get through

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that list do they look at the remainders that the remainder that would be 100% FDA funded. Okay. >> So, the the 50% I mean the halfent sales tax that we passed is definitely the key as to why we're getting any of this money. Uh more than likely if we

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wouldn't have passed that we wouldn't be getting any of this. There just wouldn't be any funding to to pursue partnering with. So, it does it uniquely advantages us not only that we have the sales tax for conservation acquisition, but that it allowed for and specifically called

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out easements as an acquisition tool. So, it really puts us in a unique place to to move our priorities forward with FDAX and they have the funds right now. Florida Forever has um had more austerity in previous budget years and is likely this year to also have a you

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know not a great year of funding. FDEX continues to be very popular with the legislature. So, um we expect them to have several hundred million. Um that's still being sorted out by committee chairs for this budget, but they there there wasn't an option less than 200

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million uh offered yet. Cool. Now our halfent sales tax is for four uh land in four different areas. One is IRL South, one is Palmar, one is Luxalooi, and one is Blueways. Has to be

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one of those. And um can you tell us just a little bit about the importance of the first one, IRL Southland, and how it uh interplays with Everglades restoration? Uh you and Chair

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Herd would be great uh to tell us about that. Um I'm not sure who would who would be best. I think Chair Herd knows about as much about that as any of us could ever know about it. So, uh, maybe you could tell us, Chair Herd or or

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John. Uh, that'd be great. I'm happy to to, uh, attempt to fill the shoes of our chair who was president when the natural lands component of Indian River Lagoon South was approved in 2007, WA um, and

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was at the committee hearings arguing for their inclusion and the value of that component. So, we throw around IRL South parochially and and a lot of us understand what that means, but I think it's a fair point to bring it up. Um, the Indian River Lagoon South project is

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one of 67 projects in the comprehensive Everglades restoration plan that that was approved in 2000. Um and then IRL South was approved in a authorized by Congress in WA 2007 which is the water

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resources development act included in the Indianer lagoon south component is a a phrase called natural lands and the idea of natural lands was as they build this infrastructure i.e. a 3,000 acre reservoir, 6 and a half thousand acres

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of STA in Martin County, and thousands and thousands more acres of that in um St. Lucy County. Um that is not really considered habitat. A giant reservoir actually probably is detrimental to habitat. And so the offset to that is to

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acquire um per the uh project implementation report 90,000 acres of natural lands to offset that habitat loss. A very very good example of that and maybe one of the best um was the acquisition of the ement of Barbie Ranch. It's located immediately adjacent

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to the C44 reservoir in STA that has no trees by design. Uh that infrastructure is is open water and wetlands. So all of the new creatures and birds that are enjoying that that uh that facility um have nowhere to roost. And what Barbie

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Ranch did is make sure that we they would always have a place to roost. and natural lands works in that way. It also helps to preserve areas that are permeable so that um you get aquafer recharge, you get the natural wetland treatment of that storm water. Um and it

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also mitigates additional uh flushing to the u to the St. Lucy River and among other things. Um, and it didn't even go into the the threatened endangered species habitat it provides and um open space and um how much less demand it

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puts on services that if those areas were developed and I could go on and on, but that's a unique uh element of the Indian River Lagoon South project that um is unique to uh that that one of 67 projects. Um, and that was because of

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the the forward thinking of of our board and the community in Martin County that that um made sure that that was included. One of the other I'm going to keep going here until you shut me off. >> You haven't fallen asleep yet, Commissioner Campy, so I know I'm okay. >> I awake for you, my friend. Um,

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one of the other really unique features of that is when we partner with FDAX to secure these easements, if we're a 50% partner, let's say it's a $1 million acquisition and we put half a million dollars into it, at some point down the road when the Water Management District

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as the local sponsor for these Everglades restoration projects is able to certify those lands in comprehensive Everglades restoration, then that leverages an equal share from the from the federal government through the core of engineers of spending on Everglades

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restoration. So in theory, our half a million in this example leverages a $2 million improvement to the natural system. >> Wow, that's really cool. Very good. Thank you, >> Commissioner Campy.

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>> See that? Um Mr. Mail, you and I have had an opportunity to speak briefly. There's very little Palm City property that would ever qualify for the half a cent sales tax, but we do have a little opportunity

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along within the blue ways category along Danforth Creek leading to the south fork of the St. Lucy River. What needs to happen for us to have that be considered by the ELOC? >> Uh, I believe the property you're

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talking about is going before the ELOC in June. >> Okay, good. you you were able to just add it on. >> Yes. And the process is we send that up to the Florida Natural Areas Inventory to provide an environmental assessment. Um we do some of the ranking or some of the scoring that we provide to the ELOC.

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Um and then um they they evaluate them. We bring it to you and you guys have the ultimate say on whether it is included in the Martin County Forever program. >> Okay. And then other than us following it on our own, can you keep me apprised of that? >> Of course. Yes, sir.

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>> Thank you. >> Rick Hartman, would you like to address us? >> I don't think I need to. >> I I I was present when these three properties were first uh uh given to the uh Department of Agriculture and

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Consumer Services and it wasn't that long ago and they were immediately receptive. So very very fast work. These three parcels are uh will provide enormous environmental benefit to us. Um so really really fine work.

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Is >> there a motion? >> I'd love to make a motion for it. >> Second. >> There's a motion and a second. All those in favor? I >> opposed. That motion passes unanimously. >> We have reached the end of our meeting. Uh we'll now take up let's see what

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>> would anyone from the public like to address us? Where is uh Mrs. D. Bard? >> No. >> She spoke this morning on the same subject. So I informed her that she could not speak twice on the same subject in the same day. >> I saw her leave crying. You're horrible.

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>> All right. Lyn will do commissioner comments. Commissioner Heatherington. >> Set for today. Thank you. >> Commissioner Campy. >> Two events this week uh in District 5. The first one on May 21st is Dish with the Kamish uh at the Charlie Leighton

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Park Community Center. It's at the base of the Palm City Bridge. You have to instead of going into the parking lot on the north side, you have to go past the building to the first eastern side street and come around by the Treasure

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Coast Rowing Center to park in the lot because Charlie Leon Park is getting close to being finished, but not finished yet. Uh that will be at 8:00 a.m. on the 21st. And this month's guests are Carol Deetsz Howard who runs

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the United Way and our brand new director of the Children's Services Council, Laura Hassi. Uh so they will be together as guests to discuss uh and take questions on their services. You know, especially the United Way has some

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transportation services and things. I believe our citizens could really take advantage of but probably don't know about as well. And then on that same this same week on Saturday the 23rd, we're having music in the park. It starts at 6:30. It's on Map Road. We

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have a great uh local duo um male and female duo. Sound great. We'll have food trucks. We'll have adult beverages. We'll have ice cream. you can come with little kids, uh, senior citizens, time to get out and share in the community.

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The weather will be great hopefully. Uh, and it's just a nice time. You can bring food, you can order food in from some of the local places or picnic lunch or use our food trucks, and we would love to see you at either or both. They're both free and they're both open to the public. Thank you,

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>> Commissioner Caps. >> I'm good today, >> Commissioner Vargas. >> Yeah. Uh I have received quite a few of calls, emails, people stopping me. Uh this is about the operations facility and there are a lot of questions that are unanswered. Um I had asked Mr.

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Donaldson to put this under projects. Was that under projects? Some people called me as late as yesterday said they couldn't find it. >> So you the commissioner is referring to the infographic that we prop provided regarding the P3. Um, we included it on

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our there's a part of our website and it's not it's it's not on the front page, but it's where you can find projects both development projects and county projects. And when you find the location that has um um our uh uh our the project for our um field ops

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facility, public works, um the infographic was included in there. Um and that's where it currently resides. Um, we could certainly bring you more attention to it if the board likes, but at at this point, that's our where we we've where we put it. >> Okay. Why don't we put under hot topics

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so people can find this easily? Uh, because as I said, I'm getting a lot of um feedback on this still. Um, and and there are a lot of questions too that they have. Who is the contractor for this? I mean, this is not identified. The other thing is the developer in this

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case was the school company and they're subcontracting out uh to other companies and that's important to identify. We have to be totally transparent about this. So the school people are not building. They are third party and we have no bio at all other than what was

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presented there. Who's the third party? And I do want Martin County, this is very important, listed as additional insured uh to the bond. And it's critical because the developer, the builder, the contractor, they're all different people. And so this is a

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pseudo developer for this. Um general contingencies, profit and overhead. There's no breakdown by percentage either. Nothing was included. And there are three criteria in the bond process. um have to make line item guarantees.

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Uh the other thing if they have used any one of those three they need permission as additional to be as additional insured if they have any of these one three criteria they will need permission and must notice Martin County under the bond this is required. Um the other thing is uh

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what is the profit and overhead? Nothing's been identified who gets this profit and overhead >> and there may be a consulting engineer on this too. They have to outline the deficiencies and the solution under the contract. If you don't have these answers, this is critical. This is a $74

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million no bid project. Um so the developer that identified themselves as subcontracting to others and not identify who's getting paid what amount of money. We need to know who the third party is and the bond must be clear as additional insured. Uh the other thing

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contingency funds must be identified and approved through the Martin County Board of County Commissioners. This is money that's the taxpayers money and the consulting engineer must report to the county. Also, there has to be accountability for this. Um what about the soft cost? Who's oversighting that?

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Uh and these are all answers that we are required to provide to our constituents. Um, is there a pre-development approved budget? And it just seems very excessive. Very excessive because some of these numbers are way off. I mean,

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I'm just looking at the Turtle Beach Cafe. We made a full presentation last meeting. I did. And also our parks director. The other thing I had a question. Who's construction management services? I asked that the other day. You didn't know. It's right here on this

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paper. >> The um >> right here. The count the county is overseeing the construction management services. >> So that's who the county is construction management services. >> Our our county staff are managing the construction administration. So you

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you've asked a whole litany of things. We are following the same process we use for any the county is the developer. We are the owner of the facility and over the property. We followed the state statutes in terms of a P3 contracting

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arrangement. Uh which is different than I understand than than we have traditionally followed. Um and so we are now in the process actually the bonds were um sold today. Um and um uh and and uh I think they got very good prices for

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it. >> What what prices can we get all this information? It's kind of vague here, you know, and I understand money. So, >> so the uh uh the the the borrowing costs and those were presented in the in the board item. Simply the infographic was

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simply about the P3 process. The budgeting was in our CIP still is it is a fixed cost contract. It cannot be exceeded. There's no contingency funds because it is that's the unique party of a P3. There isn't there are no um um uh

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contractor initiated change orders. it can't exceed that. So the facility will be uh built to a standard that meets the that was in the original design documentation and there can be no change orders. So um but any event the the

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infographic where it is is is how we've traditionally pushed put information regarding projects. If the board wants it uh um uh you know placed under hot topics, I would ask the three of you to nod and agree. Otherwise, we'll leave it

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in where we have it with our with our projects. In terms of providing you updates on the progress of the project, we can certainly do that. Um in in terms of where um you know they have 18 months to design, permit and um uh and build

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the project and turn it over uh to the county with furniture, fixtures and equipment, including storm water construction, uh water, sewer, all of the pertinances necessary for the project. The contract included square

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footage requirements, wind load requirements, all of those uh features and the um >> insurance and bonds. >> Insurance and bonds. So um it I think in terms of what the project is, it's it's been defined in our CIP in terms of how

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it's been contracting. It was not contracted under the statutes that have to deal with soul source. It was contracted under the statutes that deal with P3s, public private partnerships, and that is the process that we followed. >> Okay. But I still need to get the particulars of everything I've asked.

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Plus, you said the bonds were sold today. So, I need those particulars, too. May I send you a letter then requesting all of that? >> So, a number of things you asked, you don't get from contractors. For instance, they don't disclose any no contractor disclose their profits. You know, that's just simply not part of the

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issue. so I can provide the issue the information that you've requested that is uh normal and readily available. >> Okay. I'll go ahead and follow up with a letter to you. >> Thank you. I'm not >> Are you going to put this on hot topics then so people can find this?

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>> That would be up to your colleagues if they would like me to do that. >> Okay. Colleagues, what do we say? >> Yes, I agree that it could be on top hot topics when we requested that infographic or whatever the one pager. I appreciate that the staff did it. Uh, I think there's nothing for us to hide and

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it should be on the hot topics. Make it more readily easy to find. >> That's two. >> Me. Me too. >> That's five. >> Okay. >> Commissioner Caps. >> Yeah. I was just going to mention um that thing about

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no change order. That's a huge deal. It is. >> Um, you know, if you talk to anyone who's ever built anything, they always say two things. It cost me way more >> than I ever expected and it took way

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longer than I thought it would >> and this is just a common thing in the new construction world and everybody pays way more than they expected to pay but this is a very

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unique type of contract and that's one of its big advantages I think >> and also and also So that white paper uh showed me um estimated costs per square foot for a number of our buildings. The

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only design build was Sea Turtle Cafe which was way higher than the other projects. Can we have a status update number? >> Can we have a status update on that? >> Last time. >> Yes, we we can provide that. Madam Chair, the taxpayers association

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also did a review and printed something that I had also received as Commissioner Vargas, I had some received some concerns and comments about that process. There was a lot of information that was out and when I forwarded on the

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recap from the taxpayers association, the responses I got from the people that I sent it to was very favorable. Any further questions? We are adjourned. Well, do you have

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some? Wait a minute. We're not adjourned. Mr. Donaldson, you have some comments? >> I just wanted to say >> you missed half the day. >> Yes. I I spent the morning with our colleagues at Jupiter Island and uh I'm happy to say that the Jupiter Island

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granted us a variance for our um uh our our fire rescue ocean rescue facility at the beach. There was a lot of discussion on um if you all know that the the the town has a coastal setback line that's very important to them and so they took

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a very deliberate approach to to reviewing that and in the process of that I did make several commitments to the to the town regarding uh one the project and and how we would handle construction. We also received their demolition authorization and the site

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plan approval. Um we will be getting uh some uh uh and I'll meet with you but uh some of the things they asked for were um uh were related to um the contractor uh and and how we would handle the the

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um the facility when it's under construction knowing that residents uh will may be trying to go there. We have partially closed. So, we committed that we would have um sheriff's deputies uh on site uh when needed for um uh if we have to close portions of it or all of

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it at any given time. Uh we committed that the septic and sewer um as you all had approved prior that we would um uh install uh uh force main and and grinder pump uh or if the town is doing a larger

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project that we would contribute to a larger project to get there. At this time they're not ready for it. So we'll do a septic tank at this time. Um and uh we I committed that we'd bring an item back in the future regarding um late

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night usage of the park between midnight and 4:00 a.m. So I will do that uh coordinate a time to to discuss that. uh that said made no promises but that we would present that item and and another sort of off the that wasn't related to the project but there was like some

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concern about the county in the future maybe wanting to put on street parking on South Beach Road which we have no interest in doing and I suggested that the county would be willing to you know enter into an agreement that says we are not going to build park on street

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parking on um on South Beach Road and I would bring that forward to you in the future. Uh coordinating with with uh the town on how we might accomplish that. >> Say one thing. >> Yeah. >> You know, I w I attended the first

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hearing with the town and uh I was so glad that we had our county administrator there. Um that that's a tough group, man. They're they're uh they worked him over and and

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I was really amazed at uh uh County Administrator Donaldson's knowledge and his his coolness under fire because they worked him over hard and

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>> but he was just masterful in in dealing with the situation and and I'm really glad for your leadership and your skill and your the way you handle yourself in those kinds of tough situations. So, very good job. >> Oh, well, thank you. Well, certainly

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going down there and missing a meeting and coming back empty-handed was not something I wanted to do, but uh so I thank Mayor Townsen, who was her last day, for helping me through um and giving me advice prior to the meeting. Thank you. >> Did they name the new um appointee today?

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>> No, they'll do that tomorrow. >> Oh, okay. If you're going to get a beatdown somewhere, you should let us know so we could be there to watch. >> Miss Elder, anything? >> Did you bring your gunslinger with you? >> Anybody else?

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>> Now I think we're ajourned. >> Yes. and