--------- Good [clears throat] morning and welcome to our December 2nd, 2025 board of county commission meeting. We are delighted that you've joined us this morning. Uh please join us for a moment of silence followed by the pledge of allegiance which is going to be led by Sergeant Jacob Blac. And would you like
to add something before we >> Madam Chair, good morning. Uh during this moment of silence, I would like all of us to recognize and remember Sergeant Terry Swinging Mashcow. She was the Indian River County deputy that was
murdered uh when her and her partner were trying to serve a uh eviction notice. Let's also remember David Long who was simply doing his job as a locksmith and he was also murdered. and West Virginia National Guard's woman
Sarah Beckram, 20 years old, standing in Washington DC, protecting the folks of DC, unarmed, was also murdered. So, while we have our moment of silence, let's remember those folks, please. Thank you. Thank you, Sergeant. Would you lead us
in the pledge? >> Yes. >> I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and
justice for all. >> And can you tell us a little bit about your experiences in the US Army? >> Yes. Uh, my name is Jacob Lasak. I was in the US Army from 2007 to 2012. I deployed to Iraq, Guantanamo Bay, Cuba,
and was stationed in Fort Carson, Colorado. >> Well, thank you very much. [applause] [applause] >> We have a full agenda today. We will start with public comment. At 11 o'clock, we have a preset with the Army Corps of Engineers giving us an update. At 11 o'clock, we're going to have a
discussion on an economic development toolkit. At 1:30, we're going to have an update on the Indian River Lagoon economic valuation. And at the end of the meeting or uh at 5:05, we'll have our final public comment.
Is there Let's see. There is there a motion to approve the agenda, including the agenda, not not the cons. >> Move approval of the agenda. >> Second. >> There's a motion and a second. All those in favor? I opposed. That motion passes unanimously.
Uh, now we'll hear from the public. Uh, Carol Zolan is first, followed by Jess Griffin. >> Good morning, commissioners. My name is Carol Zolan and I'm a longtime homeowner in Steuart West. First, I want to
sincerely thank each of you for your service in Martin County. I know how much time, preparation, and thought goes into every decision you make, and our community truly appreciates it. I also want to congratulate Miss Elise Elder on her appointment as Martin County
Attorney. We are grateful to have someone with her professionalism and clarity guiding the county's legal framework. Her recent written guidance to our community has been extremely helpful. I'm here today regarding the proposed Steuart West putt amendment
seeking to add and expand domesticated animals as a permitted use. I am respectfully asking the commission to deny this amendment. First, the term domesticated animals is vague and undefined and across Florida can include animals like chickens, goats, and pigs,
not just household pets. Leaving a phrase that open-ended creates interpretive challenges and risk with unintended consequences. staff would be in put in a position of determining animal byan animal what qualifies. The ambiguity is reason for caution. Second,
our community has very clear governing documents prohibiting any nuisance, noise, sanitation issues, odors, or anything disruptive to neighbors. Barnyard animals, particularly chickens, are widely recognized to create exactly those issues. allowing them at a county
level will directly conflict with the private covenants that protect our neighbors neighborhood's character. Third, the amendment simply isn't necessary. We are in an established 40-year-old equestrian residential community and nothing in our zoning or
our history indicates a need for this change. I do want to raise one point from a place of genuine concern and not criticism. Harboring illegal chickens is one of the county's top complaints to code enforcement. Multiple reports have been made within our community as birds
have been left loose, crowing has become disruptive and the situation has escalated. For a long time, neighbors stayed silent, but eventually this ongoing issue became too much. So, we are simply trying to understand what is the role of code enforcement when an
issue like this is repeatedly reported but seems unresolved. We ask this respectfully because we know code enforcement works hard and we also know that these rules and ordinances exist for a reason. Approving this amendment would almost certainly increase these
kinds of issues. It would create predictable enforcement burdens, increase neighbor disputes, and set a precedence for other residential communities to request similar broad language in their own puds. Finally, this amendment does not come from our community. It was initiated by a small
group of individuals. The 249 families who live under the Steuart West PUD were not included in crafting this request and it does not reflect the will of the community. For all of these reasons, I respectfully ask you to deny the PUD amendment. Steuart West does not need it, does not want it, and would be
negatively affected by it. Thank you, commissioners, for your time and for your dedication to protect Martin County. >> Thank you. [clears throat] >> Jess Griffin is next, followed by Greg Braun. Good morning, commissioners. Uh, also a Steuart West issue. This is relating to
uh, POA governance concerns. I'm here to briefly summarize a series of governance issues occurring within the Steuart West Property Owners Association that have grown beyond normal HOA disagreements and now affect public trusts and stability within our community. Over the
past several months, the board has taken actions that appear designed to avoid accountability and obstruct a lawful recall. Twice in August and again in October, directors voted on their replacements and then resigned the following day. Even with active recall
petitions, the vote today, resign tomorrow pattern disrupts stability and appears intended to manipulate board composition during a recall. >> [snorts] >> In addition, the association's attorney has filed unauthorized corporate changes with Sunbiz on three separate occasions
since late August. This includes signing as a registered agent without consent and also replacing all directors and listing her office as the association's address. These filings raise serious doubts about proper
corporate authority affecting almost 250 residents. A majority of the homeowners have submitted valid recall petitions with more than enough signatures under the Florida statutes. Three times they were rejected without valid justification and the board's
explanations changed multiple times, including contradictory statements about ballots. Rather than the required DPPR recall process, the attorney has filed three lawsuits lawsuits in Circuit County causing delay and unnecessary
cost. I also want to address the repeated misstatements involving this commission. In multiple communications, the board majority has asserted that the county attorney Elise Elder, additional county legal staff, and commissioner Campy directed the board to rewrite our PUD
and government documents to align with the county. That is simply not likely accurate. Both attorney Elder and Commissioner Campy have likely been misqued to homeowners repeatedly. Now, the county did not mandate this action
is my view. Their names were used to justify the board the decisions the board has already made. If this is incorrect, it has caused great confusion in the community. Can you please address these repeated cited statements in a public forum to set the record straight?
While I know you cannot be intervened relating to HOA issues, the patterns of misrepresentation, irregular filings, and misuse of county officials names. Now touch on public trust, property values, and governance integrity. Thank
you for your time. >> Thank you. Tom Pine is next or I'm sorry, Greg Ron is next, followed by Tom Pine. Good morning. >> Good morning. >> I'm Greg Brown, executive director of the Guardians of Martin County. Um, and
with me today are our president, Tony Zadino, and past president and current board member, Peter Kanzi. Um, as you know from our previous numerous interactions, uh, both the guardians and I personally hold the county in and your county staff in high regard. You know,
we agree with you on almost everything. Not all the time, but almost everything. Um, we don't and like you, we also believe that what we're all doing is best for the community, for our economy, for our
environment, for our residents, um, and for taxpayers. The Guardians believe that the health of the of our economy is directly related to the health of our waters. Hence our investment of resources as a member organization of
the Rivers Coalition, the IRL NEP and the and our support of the IRL riverkeeper. We're concerned now, however, about the adverse impacts from the beef processing facility that is proposed for the Chansy Bay Ranch property in northwestern Martin County.
Because facts about the project have been hard to obtain, we've queried online permitting databases and made foyer requests to a variety of state and federal agencies. We've used a peer-reviewed fact sheet on slaughterhouses that was published by
the Center for Biological Diversity as the basis for our research. With assistance from attorneys and input from a variety of our NGO colleagues, we've developed an extensively referenced position paper that I'll distribute to you shortly that describes
the results of our inquiries and our concerns about water use, pollution abatement, social justice, and natural resource protection. We've learned that there have been a variety of non-compliances in the past with both
the BMPPS for the ranch and also uh violations of the basin management action plan for Lake Okachchobee which was declared as an impaired water back a number of years ago. We're not necessarily opposed to this project. We
are however opposed to the alleged preeemption of the county's regulations. We believe that this project deserves some discussion um in the public forum. We believe that by carving off the meat processing facility from the rest of the
2,000 acres of the property, the owner has created an industrial operation rather than an agricultural operation. And therefore, we think that you have not only the responsibility but the authority to proceed with um reviewing
the application. I'm asking for two things today. Number one, that you accept our position paper and allocate staff resources to take a look at it. And number two, that you that you schedule the project for a future public hearing so that we can all hear about
it. Thank you. >> Yes, Mr. Caps. [clears throat] >> Yes, Madam Chair. I think the the Guardians have done a lot of work on this issue and it's worthy of an agenda item at a future meeting. So, I would
make that motion that we have that future agenda item. >> I would second that motion. >> Anything further, Commissioner Vargas? >> No. Um, I have um spoken with them. I'm very familiar with the project and I think it was a bit rushed uh to push
this through. It kind of slipped through uh a lot of the details that I was unaware of and was brought to me after the fact that we had voted earlier this year. Do we need to have a vote or can we just nod and say let's have an agenda item prepared for Chansy Bay? >> You can have nod and have an agenda item. We'll bring one.
>> Thank you. Thank you for bringing this matter up. >> Thank you. >> Tom Pine is next followed by Ken Haynes. >> Motion in a second. >> Good morning, commissioners. My name is Tom Pine. I've been a resident of Martin County for over 50 years. It was just a
joke at our last county commission meeting when a 70-page register report detailing all the expenditures in the clerk's warrant list was made available to the public because this week we are back to the same old smoke and mirrors. Nothing to see here. I'm speaking about
the consent agenda. Once again, our county commission will approve 15,44,22.99 which was spent between November 3rd and November 60th of 2025 without identifying the pay the payes or the purpose of the payments.
I don't have any degrees. I didn't go to college, but I did learn how to use a dictionary. Today, I use the modern dictionary. It's called Google. [clears throat] Consent agenda, a tool to streamline meetings procedures by
collecting non routine non-controversial items to a group whereby all are passed with a single motion and vote. Topics that have not been discussed by the board in the past shall not be in the consent agenda. It's that plain and simple. Then why was our county
community center? It's that plain and simple. Then why was our community center rented out to the Jensen Beach Chamber of Commerce some time ago, all hidden in the consent agenda? It's one of the few I know because I was discussed at a later meeting or the
millions of our tax dollars and new contracts that have been approved in the consent agenda. It never ends. Our county commission commissioners use the consent agenda to hide from the public where they are spending our tax dollars outside the items passed in our yearly
budget with no public input or discussion. This is why our taxes have gone up almost every year over the past two decades. Greed rules in Martin County. I do not trust my local government. It started
with the illegal expansion of runway 1230. The two lived to two men that lived on both sides of my home died of bone and brain cancer which is related to the jet fumes where we were forced to breathe for several years before the county finally bought
us out after their illegal expansion was complete. As we move into the new gilded age in America, our Martin County government is leading the way on the Treasure Coast and the working class is paying the ultimate price. What you permit, you promote. What you
allow, you encourage. What you condone, you own. Thank you for your time. >> Thank you. Ken Haynes is next, followed by Kirk Deitsio. >> Hello. Good morning, commissioners. Uh, my name is Ken Haynes and I'm a resident
of Steuart West. Um, I also happen to be on the board, but I'm speaking to you today as a resident of Steuart West. We moved to Steuart West about four years ago after living over in North River Shores for over 25 years. Um, when we
discovered the community and compared it to other areas, we did weigh in uh the Palm City Farms and that's more of a farm community. You can, you know, have whatever um animals, barnyard animals, chickens that you would like. When we
saw Steuart West, we fell in love with it. uh will never move. Um beautiful community, but we were aware that it was an equestrian community with restrictions on the barnyard animals, the chickens, etc., and really thought
that suited us. Unfortunately, as you know, there's an upcoming uh amendment um challenge to our PUD and it's posed as aligning our PUD with our
governing documents which the alignment part they claim is to make sure that the equestrian, the horses, the donkeys, the zebras are allowed. But they have snuck in the term domesticated animals and it's very
important as Carol Zultan mentioned earlier that opens the door for the chickens, the barnyard animals and a whole host of other animals that are not currently allowed by our governing documents or the PUD. Uh it's a Trojan
horse. At at a board meeting, they refused, although challenged by over 50 residents to remove that. they just dug in and would not. When I say they, it's a small uh group of residents. Most of that group is already in
violation of our governing documents with the animals and our PUB because they have those animals. Uh one of our fears, you know, property values of course is an issue, not wanting the nuisance of those animals, but also
predator animals which they attract. And when this was brought up over a year ago, uh they they scoffed at the predator animals as that that was just made up and exaggerated. Less than a year ago, it was reported that one of
the residents in violation lost over 20 chickens. Now, think about that. They're not even allowed to have those. Lost over 20 chickens to a predator animal. Whether it was a coyote or a bobcat, really doesn't matter. And one of my concerns is we have small uh house pets,
cats, dogs, a dog. Um if if we had the amendment approved and it attracted those predator animals, I mean even now letting him out every night to go to the bathroom. You know, I have >> your time is up.
>> So I I urge you please when this comes up, please vote no and stand with the majority. Your time is up. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. Kirk Deitzio is next and this is the last request to speak form I have.
>> Good morning. >> Hey, I'm Kirk Deisio. I I've been a resident for 17 years in Martin County. I live in Coral Gardens about two years ago. They came and worked on all our swailes and our our drainage and our waste water waste water that drains into
our lake behind my house. At the time, I talked to the guy that was running the whole I I think it was subbed out to another contractor and my swale was sinking and it's encroaching to my driveway which will my driveway will soon collapse and nothing was done about it. They did a lot of the other storm
drains. Nothing. I got sink holes on my easement, two sink holes, and my neighbors across the street got sink holes where the pipes distribute the water into the the when it overflows. And I had a there's a lot of kids that fish at the lake behind my house and they come through my swale and one kid
went into the wash out and flipped over. There's going to be if he gets hurt, there's going to be a lawsuit. I mean, I've told and a guy came out about two weeks ago and looked at it said, "Oh, we'll get out of here and get this done." Nothing's been done. This has been going on for years. I got a huge I
mean, a huge wash out before it when they fixed all those swailes. I don't know why they didn't do these. We have the worst ones. Now, I don't know how this goes, but I they they kept putting me up. You got to go to a meeting, you know. I've been in Coral Gardens for over 10 years. It
seems like nothing's getting done. And that's all that's all I got to say. I don't know. Thank you, >> Commissioner Heatherington. >> Yes, sir. Before you leave, um I represent district 2 and we just had a meeting. Um and we can't go back and forth, but I will get your contact information and come out to see your
house personally. We just had a meeting where many of the residents attended, but I'd be happy to call you and come see >> that was my neighbor. He's the one who told me to come to the meeting. Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Commissioner comments. Commissioner Vargas.
>> Uh yeah. Um I wanted to make a comment. I know I can't go back and forth and shouldn't, but you know, uh this has been voiced several times about the uh consent agenda. Uh my understanding and I did ask uh can uh a member of the
public anyone uh click on a link that is next to each item to see what is being funded. Is this correct Mr. Donaldson? >> So the clerk has um uh where you can access um all the information on our web page. There isn't a direct link for it
but there is through the circuit clerk of court's office and um uh so that avail that information is available. The summary of documents, expenditures that are shown there are all related to items that have been previously approved by
the board, whether it's through contracts uh or other CIP sheets. And it's just the summary of all the funds that have been expended in the previous uh uh weeks or months prior to the agenda item. >> Okay. Uh because that's important that
uh the folks What what is the what is the uh link? What is the address? Uh can we broadcast that now? I don't have it off the top of my head. You know, perhaps Miss Merley might remember the the linkage to it. So, >> good morning. Um the clerk of the
circuit court's website should have a link that says um finance division and they have a list of all the financial um transactions called clerk check register and it should have all of that information. But I believe that there is a link on the agenda as well that that
directly links to the clerk's >> there is register agenda. >> Somebody's saying no there isn't. So what is the address that we would put in the address bar to get to the clerk? >> I don't know it off the top of my head but it's like the clerk of the circuit court of Martin County.
>> Okay, you might try that [sighs and gasps] um of circuit court of Martin County. Um I I will try it myself also because I think this needs to be available um to everyone uh before the funding is dispersed so folks are reminded of that. There was something else that was
mentioned has been mentioned before to me outside of this meeting that if decisions meet need to be made on topics of of extreme importance. I think this gentleman talked about a preferential lease um that needs to be discussed by our board. um who's making the call to
put it on the consent agenda. >> So that would be your county administrator um along with the rules of uh that the board adopts annually for um uh but yes I I make that recommendation and uh and sometimes in consultation
with the chair. >> Yeah. Okay. So if it's uh dealing with a lease that's county owned property, don't you think that's something we should be discussing rather than just tucked into the consent agenda? I I think the circumstances would dictate if it's a a renewal or something
that the board has already discussed. Um then then we would uh um put it on it would only go on the consent agenda if it was already previously approved. >> Yeah, I I understand that. But if it's not previously approved, I think it's
something that needs to be discussed. This is >> okay. >> Owned by taxpayers of Martin County and it's no preferential treatment for family or friends. On a lighter note, um we have the taste of Jensen tonight. It's um our community treelighting
ceremony and I urge all of you to come on out. Let's have a great time. It's going to be the taste of Jensen. So, there'll be all of the restaurants and all of the businesses that are there to meet you. You can have taste and samplings. There'll be music. And this starts at 5:30. We'll be going for a
couple of hours right down Jensen Beach Boulevard. So, I look forward to seeing you there. >> Thank you, Commissioner Caps. >> I am good today. >> Yeah, we're a small community, so we unfortunately make announcements about people passing in our community who we
know who we know well, and I have the uh uh responsibility this morning to tell to say that I've just learned of Ed Fielding's passing. Uh >> how about that? >> I served for eight years as a commissioner with him. He was a he was a
brilliant guy, a graduate of MIT, uh a funny a funny man and he was he loved uh public service and was a dedicated public public servant. So rest in peace, Ed. >> Commissioner Campy. >> Yeah, thank you. Rest in peace,
Commissioner Ed Fielding. I did not know that either. Um couple of things. one, I would like to have an item at next week's meeting uh or at least a conversation about the Steuart West um
emails and information that's being put out. Uh I do receive that from multiple [sighs and gasps] uh residents. Um saw my name, [clears throat] excuse me, saw my name mentioned couple of different times, surprised by some of those
comments. Uh I will research with our growth management staff to see if there is any way that something that might have happened several years ago could be construed as me offering some kind of
discounts which off the top of my head I would say is not an op is not possible. uh we don't do discounts like that at for anyone and I certainly don't have the authority to issue complimentary discounts on on procedural or
um permitting or paperwork issues. That's not a thing. But I will double check to see if there was something that took place. I know that there are sometime discounts that are built into a structure that are not offered that if
certain paperwork reaches a certain threshold or level it would be one price and if it comes in below it would be something else. So I'd like and if also if our county attorney's name is being mentioned I know that her and her department had been asked a couple of
times to um sort of weigh in. Uh obviously uh our legal department works for the county government and for the commissioners, but as a just as a respect level in constituent services would answer a question, especially if
it's asked repeatedly. So let's have a little more of a formalized conversation about that. Um because I think it's it's I was going to say that it's an issue that is starting to boil over, but I think it's well past boil over
on both sides of the issue. Um, one of the speakers was accurate in saying that we do not as a county, uh, as commissioners hopefully and as the government get involved in private HOA issues. I would tell you that at this particular moment, I think most of us
have something in each of our districts that's happening like that. I know that in district five, we probably have four or five neighborhoods that are, you know, at odds looking for the county to be some kind of an arbiter. We're not uh we can specifically state what our
policies are so that you're getting basically an unbiased uh formalized opinion either legal or growth management engineering of what something is. Now what normally happens when that takes place is the
side that feels that that information benefited them are very happy and the side that feels that that information did not benefit them are very angry and that's just sadly the way it is. I think HOAs in general serve a purpose but in
most cases they create a lot of animosity within neighborhoods. Um, I would say it's it's definitely within my top five things that I am requested on handling all over the county, even in outside of our own districts. I'm sure
the folks in Steuart West and Cobblestone have reached out to all of my colleagues looking for things. And it's disappointing that neighbors have to have that. I've lived it and experienced it myself in two different neighborhoods that I've lived in. um the benefit of an HOA and the
structure also creates an opportunity for a lot of problems. So maybe next week at least for Steuart West we can dig in a little deeper and tamp some of those things down. I don't think it's going to solve it and it won't be a Christmas miracle but um but at least some of the stuff some of the misinformation
or manipulated information we can we can address. Um, as Commissioner Vargas said, on a happier note, tomorrow night, tomorrow night in Palm City on Map Road, uh, immediately adjacent to the Station
21 fire station, we're having our annual holiday festival. Uh, we're closed Map Road for a couple of hours. So, if you live in that area, there's a lot of alternative side streets that can be taken. So, it's not like you're completely blocked, but we will be uh
blocking the road. We only do it one time a year. It's tomorrow night in front of the patio at Palm City Place. We will be having most of the uh local schools, their choir singing, which is always a lot of fun. We start at nursery
school and work our all the way up to high school. Um, we're having, I think, over 50 vendors. Most of them are crafts people, local crafts people that are giving you those clever gifts that uh might be, you know, for someone that's
hard to buy for. Uh, there'll be food vendors, there'll be uh other SP community sponsors. And so, we really uh look forward to that. Palm City Chamber of Commerce does a majority of the heavy lifting for that, but so do a lot of other organizations. We'll be doing that
tomorrow from 5:30 till 8. The road will be closed from 4 to 9 so that we can safely set up and and disassemble. And um and not to steal any thunder from Commissioner Caps, but
I don't know if it starts on Wednesday or Thursday, the Hope Sound Bible College has their singing Christmas tree that um is free. It's at the Hopetown Bible College. It is something that my family and I have gone to for well over
a decade. It is absolutely remarkable. The staging, the music, the pageantry. Uh it brings it's it's I think it's Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday. I think it's the doors open at 6 and [snorts] and the show starts at 7. It is
remarkable. So if you really want to see something great, come to the Hope Sound Bible College. It's not necessarily uh you know a religious type of event if that's not your thing. It's still a great evening of holiday fun. The reason I know so well about it is my mother has
been texting me and calling me every single day for two weeks to remind me that we'll be going there this week. Uh and so I just wanted you know um it's the we're in the we're in the season. I think Friday is the Steuart Christmas parade this coming week.
>> Friday. >> Friday night. It's the nighttime parade which is a lot of fun. And then if we want to kick it back to my colleague from down south to share news about this weekend in Hope Sound. >> Please do. >> Yes. Um I would be remiss if I didn't
mention two parades in District 3 uh this coming weekend. And the Hope Sound Christmas parade will be Saturday at 1:00. And the Indian Town parade will be Saturday also at 5:45 in
Indian Town. We hope you all can make it to those events as well as to the Hopetown Bible College singing Christmas tree. Thank you, >> Commissioner Heatherington. >> Would add I think Commissioner Campy referenced it. We have our also our Christmas parade downtown here um Friday
evening. I believe it starts at 700 p.m. See you all there. Sounds like a lot of great holiday events. >> Mr. Donaldson, >> nothing. Thank you, >> Miss Elder. >> We will take up item number Oh, we will
Is there a motion to approve the consent agenda? >> So moved. >> There's a motion and a second. All those in favor? I opposed. That motion passes unanimously. We'll now take up department one, which is office of management, management, and budget
items, which require board approval. >> Look at her going so early in the day. >> Did you win a United Way thing or something? >> Good morning, commissioners. Um, Stephanie Merley here presenting to you five items on OM today. Our first item
is uh permission to accept the Florida Inland Navigation District or the fine grant um for the Manatee Park Seaw Restoration Project. Um our public works is requesting the acceptance of $350,000 for the Manatee Park Seaw wall
restoration construction. A grant match of $350,000 is required and budgeted within our Coastal County Resilience Program CIP. >> Where's Manatee Park? >> That's a good question. Anybody know? But
>> I think it's by uh it's in your district >> down by um Pirates Scope. Isn't that where it is? >> Yeah. >> Oh, okay. >> There you go. >> Park Drive. >> There you go. >> Where [laughter] the up on where the uh >> We have so many parks, it's hard to keep
track of where all they all are and what the names of them are. [laughter] >> Thank you. >> Thanks. Thanks, John. Um item number two, we have the supervisor of elections, Vicky Davis, here with us um to chat if you would like. Um we have a budget resolution to increase the
supervisor of elections funds. Um in coordination with the supervisor of elections and the office of management and budget um we set aside excess fees for years over years for the S SOE to be able to um purchase voting equipment
basically a voting equipment barb. Um and she finally needs to use the 457,867,000 that has been accumulated um in order to have high-speed tabulators and election management system workstations at the
supervisor of elections office. >> Would you like to update us? >> Good morning and welcome. >> Good morning. >> Morning. Well, thank you for the opportunity to answer any questions that you might have. Um, I do have
information on the new equipment and it's very similar to what we currently have. But we have had our current equipment, as many of you know, uh, that have been on the board for a number of years since 2008.
and it has reached its its age and the company is going to um stop providing service um for for the current equipment that we have. So you can see from the picture that on the um
information before you that it's very similar. It's just a a much faster tabulator. It's still a paperbased system. And in 2008 is when Governor Christ basically mandated that every
county in the state of Florida have a paperbased system. So this equipment has been in place since 2008. It was paid for through the reserves that we have, the reserve account, and I've never had to come before you to request additional
funding for equipment. And so today we have that money. um in reserve uh for this very purpose. So, I don't know if you have any questions about the equipment or or the replacement. Ed, >> Mr. Campy, >> how many are you buying?
>> 50. [clears throat] >> You're able to buy 50 of these machines for $450,000. >> Yeah. But but everything has to be upgraded. Servers, you know, um software. So, yep. >> That seems like uh for such an important
piece of equipment, a good price. I'm sure you shopped around, but uh >> well, actually, there's no shopping. Um in the state of Florida, you have two companies that you can p purchase your equipment from. It's either the company
before you and what we currently have, ESNS, Election Systems and Software, or Dominion. So we've been ESN ands since 2002. >> Yes. And ESS works for me. >> Yes, it works.
>> Absolutely. >> No, I that was my question. How many machines and um did you compare pricing? But you answered that question because I I believe that that's >> Yeah. >> how you operate. So >> Yep. Absolutely. >> And the board approved uh funding for a
renovation to your building recently. Thank you. When is is construction going to begin and when will it end? >> Um I'm not sure when it will actually begin but I know later this month we are going to start the interview process for
contractors. So should start pretty quickly. >> And will it be done by election time? >> Not for 2026. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Okay. >> Yeah. >> Want to separate them out or keep them together? >> Well, you already approved that. >> Okay. No, this >> Oh, >> this one.
>> Sure. You want You want >> make a motion to accept the supervisor of elections request? >> Second. >> There's a motion and a second. All those in favor? I opposed. That motion passes unanimously. Thank you. >> Thank you. Can I introduce two two new members of staff? >> Sure. Bring them forward.
>> As you know, I have Krie Anderson here. Krie was >> Krie was promoted up as chief deputy. So, we have Amanda Vertise. Amanda, if you want to stand. She's coming to us from Indian River State College [laughter] as poleworker coordinator.
And Julian Huitt, he's coming to us from Habitat for Humanity out of um St. Lucy County and he is going to be outreach coordinator. So, welcome to both of you and and this is day two for them. So,
yeah, day number two. So, >> welcome. >> Congratulations, Miss Anderson. Yes. >> Welld deserved. >> Yes. 20 plus years, >> right? >> To the two new folks we meet here, you're required to come to every commission. [laughter] >> Yeah.
>> Not. So, you have a lot of work to do in the office. So, >> get out of here. [laughter] >> Yeah. We can we can watch. But thank you, Stephanie. Thank you to your staff, Don. Thank you for and and Elise for reviewing the contract and and the invoice. Um, thank
you for all you do for us. >> Thank you. >> We appreciate it. >> Thanks. >> Thank you. >> All right. Um, number three is our 2026 fiscal policy update. Each year the board is required to update the county's um fiscal policies. Um, this year there was no substantive changes, just
clarifying language on new accounting terminology regarding capital leases and lease purchases, finance purchase agreements as recommended by the clerk's office, and then routine typo edits. Item number four is a request for funds
to pay off various debt obligations. If you recall, um, during the fiscal year budget development process, uh, we included dedicated reserves for strategic debt retirement to reduce the county's outstanding obligations and strengthen its future debt capacity. So,
OM is requesting the approval to transfer fund funds from the reserves that we set aside along with budget related budget resolutions to appropriate the debt service funds to pay off the following obligations. Um, we'll be paying off a 2020 fire
equipment lease of $476,000. And we're paying off two long-term debts um for the Willoughby parcel that was Martin County Utilities and Property Appraisers of approximately 1.6 million and 1.1 million, respectively.
Additionally, during this fiscal year, we'll be paying off three more um debts which include the Veterans Memorial Bridge, um another capital improvement revenue note for fire equipment, as well as another fire equipment lease. And so, collectively,
the satisfaction of these obligations relieves about 7 million of outstanding debt liability off the county's balance sheet. >> I want to personally thank Miss Merley. This is her initiative. It was a brilliant move. It's it's uh it's we're we're so financially responsible. Thank
you very very much. >> Thank you. I was excited to get this on the on [laughter] the >> Indian Street Bridge. >> Um and number five is just a request for funds for the health insurance fund. Um each year the health insurance typically seems claims outpace the revenue coming
in the first couple months of the fiscal year. And to manage the temporary gap, the general fund has a 2.2 2 million set aside for actuarial reserves for these cash flow needs. Um, OMB is just requesting a budget transfer from these reserves into the health insurance fund for short-term cash support until our
revenues catch up starting in January. And that is all I have for you today. Any questions? Is there a motion to approve the remainder of the agenda item? >> Move approval. >> There's a motion and a second. All those in favor? I opposed. That motion passes
unanimously. Thank you. Uh let's take up department two contracts that meet the threshold for board approval of a million dollars or greater. >> Good morning commissioners. >> Good morning commissioner. Steph Mccah,
senior purchasing agent for the record. Today I only have one item for your consideration today. It is a continuing service agreement for telephone and telecommunications equipment repair and maintenance. This has a maximum not to exceed contract value of $1 million and a
maximum not to exceed contract term of 5 years. Staff is recommending that the board award the contract to the sole responsive and responsible bidder, Universal Cabling Systems Incorporated, and move that the authorize the county administrator or designate to execute
all documents related to this request. And that conclude concludes my item. >> Excellent. Any questions? Move approval. >> Well done. >> Second. >> There's a motion and a second. All those in favor? I opposed. That motion passes
unanimously. Thank you very much. >> Let's see. Is this a preset? Looks like we can take up department three, which is consideration of a public purpose lease agreement with the Martin County Fair Association for approximately 30.7 acres located along Southwest Citrus
Boulevard in western Martin County. >> Good morning, Madam Chair. George Stokus, assistant Kai administrator for the record. With me is Miss Carla Sagura and Mr. Sebastian Fox. Uh this item is a continuation from the previous item heard before you uh for final action for the public purpose lease with the Martin
County Fair Association. The duration is an initial term of 10 years with three 10 additional year uh terms as renewals which equals a 40-year term as total. Uh the fair must submit a site plan for the proposed improvements within six months
of the effective date of this lease and all improvements must be uh completed within three years for site plan approval. those um I apologize. Those improvements are found under an exhibit B of the lease addendum [clears throat] and consist of general and handicap parking
for no fewer than 1500 general and 60 paved handicap spots. Uh public restroom facilities, which would be no fewer than 20 restroom stalls, six stalls. I'm not going to go into the full details of that. the fair office and agricultural education space and storage which is a
concrete block a CBS or other hurricane rated structure of approximately no less than 7500 square ft in accordance with county standards. Uh utility connections all utility connections required by applicable government authority and utility companies as well as all storm
water infrastructure associated with the site. Uh, and just to uh remind the board in previous, we as the county paid to build the turn lane off of Citrus as well as the county paid to bring the utilities to that site. And with that, um, more than happy to answer any
questions, address any concerns that you may have. >> Questions, Mr. Vargas? >> Okay. So, I understand about the lease. I've read through all the paperwork. I've had a lot of discussions also. Um, [clears throat]
you know, one thing that I see here is that if they violate the lease, we terminate any association with them. They did hear by leasing to a Buick dealership and we never received the revenue and I've asked the director for that. I don't get
an answer. That's taking from the citizens, the taxpayers of Martin County. That's our revenue. So, what happened to that? My recollection of the event commissioner was that we let them know that they were in violation of their lease. We gave them a period to right to
cure. They responded uh accordingly to right to cure and then that GMC dealer was then moved off the property within I would say about 30 days. >> No, that had been going on for a lot longer than 30 days. Fair enough. >> This is money that is not theirs. This
parcel is owned by Martin County. they violated the lease of which I did read this lease also and it says if they're in violation so nobody's been called uh to account for this and I I don't quite understand why I have property rental property somebody
violates a lease it's terminated so I'm waiting for an answer my answer is that we were we notified the fair association they were in violation of their lease we gave them an opport opportunity to cure that said violation. They cured that said violation. >> Okay. But it's still the same
individuals that are now going to lock us up for 10 years and then they're asking for three additional 10-year terms. It's the same people. It's not as if it's different. And I can't seem to get an answer for this. And I'm speaking for the taxpayers of Martin County. That's my responsibility.
So, it's not a Commissioner of Vargas thing only. Where's Where's the income for that? Why isn't that in in our >> the income the income remains with the Martin County Fair Association. >> I understand that. But I'm making a very
valid point here and and there's been a lot of lacks um demands on this association. I've got nothing wrong about affair if they can be successful, but I don't want them taking income and violating a lease and
then coming back and asking for more. That's reasonable. I don't do business with people that are not above board and have not been uh transparent and I can't get any um answer. Do you have an answer, Mr. Donaldson? Because
I'm getting the same answer back here. >> So, we did not seek the funding for that. We see the the issue was is that they were uh engaging in an activity that was not allowed under the Elise. We did notify them that they were uh in violation. Uh Mr. Stokers is correct and
that they were given time to remedy which they did. Um and uh and during that time we've continued to negotiate with them on on a future lease. Uh we did not hold that action uh um against
them and asked they they do have a a new board and a new director in the last few years. So um uh we made it clear that th those types of activities cannot come uh about but we did not seek renumeration for any of the funds that they had
collected um and simply uh ask them to move on. The the the tenant of this contract uh that we're preparing today is that they are an entity that the county wants to continue to engage with. Um and that's why we presented it today
um with um some contract stimulations that stipulations that should they fail there are some um the that the um the lease would um um be cancelled. So I think um that's where we are. Certainly
everybody acknowledges that what had occurred um uh there was no other um compensation requested by the county for their actions. >> Okay. And why is that? I'd like to understand why that was.
>> If if I may. Um so we followed the process in the lease. There are specific provisions that the county had to pro uh follow if there was a default or potential default under the lease, which we did. I don't believe there's anything in the lease that allowed us to claw back any money from the fair
association. They ha they had the proper possession of the property since they are leaseold. Um they had a leaseold. So, we didn't have an opportunity to get that money back because they they had possession of the property and there was nothing in the lease that allowed us to get any compensation from the fair that
they generated while they had a lease on our property. So, that's why >> I understand what you're saying. However, however, it was premeditated. They said, "Hello, yes, come park cars and we'll charge you this amount of money." It was premeditated because I've had a lot of conversations with them
directly, but they violated the lease, >> right? So, >> and that should have been it terminating with this group, >> but I don't see anybody holding anybody to the fire here. This has been going on for years now. Those cars didn't appear
30 days ago or six months ago. I saw them. So, a a formal uh uh filing of a breach or termination um would be at the direction of the majority of the board. We have not heard that. We've continued
to negotiate in good faith with the with um the fair association on a new plot based upon direction from the board and that's why we're here today. >> Still no answers. Commissioner Campy, >> thank you. Since the uh future home of
the fair was in district five, it was a piece of property that we had received as surplus from the South Florida Water Management District sat basically unused and really had no vision or plan for the property for many years. Um several
iterations of the board and their leadership and management and I had an opportunity to work with staff of several of whom have since retired. that's how long the process has been. Um have been working on a a reasonable it's
you know a fair fair uh lease a reasonable lease. Uh it's been a a long and arduous process that had lots of turns and twists and many times during the multitude of commission meeting
agenda items that the fair's future was discussed. I would remind my colleagues um that the fair association is a group u the board at least is a group of
volunteers. This fair is over 60 years old. Has brought uh especially from the agricultural 4 uh side of things an opportunity for a majority of our residents and our children and their families to participate in agricultural,
you know, animal husbandry, showing of animals, uh showing of agricultural knowledge. And then there was also the midway and excellent music and rides and a beauty pageant and scholarships and uh so it is
really part of the fabric of what Martin County is. I think fair county fairs in general across America have that feel. But specifically here many people that have lived here for decades or born and raised here have very fond memories of
the fair. I remember my children are well grown now, but I remember when we were young parents with little kids. We really looked forward to the fair and not just the rides. We spent a lot of time because we lived obviously in Palm City and my kids, God bless you, my kids
did not get a chance to see up close and personal sheep, cows, pigs, horses, roosters, rabbits, guinea pigs, and that was really something that they looked forward to. So yes, I hear my colleagues saying that there has been some uh
issues with the lease. Um it it has been sort of a looser um I'll admit it been in the past maybe looser loosely enforced on some of the issues. The cars I saw the cars there. I don't believe
that they had been there for a tremendously extended period of time because in the spring they had the fair and they have had things you know uh auctions there opportunities there. The fair is responsible for a majority of the upkeep of that acreage uh and the
buildings that were all old. Uh I know that there were times that sprinkler systems had to be added. It has been a work in progress. So I'm not disagreeing with you, Commissioner Vargas. has definitely been a work in progress. But that being said, I think the the path
forward with your um suggestions and I'm sure your watchful eye of making sure that the uh the heart and nature of the lease will be uh exactly what it's supposed to be. Uh I don't believe that these new folks that have stepped into
volunteer positions should be punished. And with that, it's I'm very pleased to move the ball forward and uh make a motion to accept the lease agreements that have been agreed to by both parties. Thank you, >> Commissioner Heatherington.
>> I agree with much of what you said and the educational opportunities that the fair. The fair to me is really a lot about raising our youth and teaching them responsibility and work ethic and all of the educational opportunities that comes along with it. I think that
the lease is very fair with you investing all of the infrastructure for a 10-year lease with 10-year extensions. I think that that is fair to the residents and I'd be glad to second it. >> I have some questions. Um I'm looking on
page 263 which is 10B and it's a spelling error to the extent required. Just look through the contract. There are other mistakes also. Um, and on page 266, which is 12K,
um, Lesie may permit overnight temporary lodging on the premises for authorized vendors of the Martin County Fair or other exhibitions for a period commencing 5 days before the Martin County Fair or other exhibition and terminating 5 days after the Martin County Fair or other exp exhibition.
Why? We've had problems with with people overstaying their welcome at the fair in the past. So why are we giving this grace period of five days before and five days after? It doesn't take that long to set up a fair or an exhibition.
>> It was indicated by the fair association that that is what they needed for them to have. >> That's what they wanted. >> That's >> I'm sorry. I didn't I didn't hear you, Commissioner. >> All right. Um 12
uh M. The LEI will ensure that gray water, animal manure, and other waste from animals on the premises will be properly disposed of during within 21 days after the conclusion of the activity for which the animals were on the premises. 21 days
of manure on the premises is okay. It's only three weeks. >> I think it needs to be tightened up. Um, [snorts] and on page 276, it's exhibit B, uh,
utility connections and storm water infrastructure will be made within 3 years after the site plan approval. How do you operate for three years without utility connections or storm water infrastructure?
So they will still have so if the if the fair uh submits their site plan within six months of let's say today they will have if I remember correctly the fair in
26 and 27 based on the board's motions from the last item and then their third year they would be conducting a rustic fair that would have um the restroom facilities that would be on the back of a trailer where the the water is contained within the back of that
trailer and then removed off property very similar to other venues that utilize park property and then by the fourth year they will have constructed the restrooms and we'll have them connected. So in years uh
zero through three, tell me about electricity, tell me about water, tell me about sewer, tell me about storm water. If you're going to have 15 parking spots there, tell me about the uh storm water infrastructure. >> Well, I think the fair is behind me and
they can opine on it more, but I believe staff's intent was that under the understanding that the fair will be conducted at its current site on Monter, excuse me, Dixie Highway for the next two years and then the third year would have been a rustic fair. uh but also the first two years gives the fair uh an
opportunity to bring the utilities to that site and gives them timing to build the restrooms and to look at the utility connections. Um so we haven't you know that would I think be all drawn out through the site plan and that would create a timeline which how the fair would move forward.
Okay. Um now I'm on uh page 284. And this is all about camping. And it looks to me like it's a uh a campground.
A maximum of six months per year people will be camping. It's It doesn't sound like a fairground to me. It sounds like a campground. And these rates, I don't know what any of these rates are.
>> Well, this >> water and sewer connections are available at each camping space. Each camping space has a 10 100 amp 240 volt straight blade connection. It sounds like it's a campground. So, this attachment is from the fair
association itself. The staff considers the uh overnight stays plus or minus five days after the event. >> No, it says here that you can stay for six months a year. >> Yes. >> I again the top of the attachment and it
also has spelling errors as well is from the Martin County Fair Association. >> Yeah, but they're in our rules and procedures. >> Correct. >> Okay. We will be >> included in our agenda item. I presume that when if this agenda item is approved, then the rules and procedures
are also the policies and procedures are also adopted. >> Madam Chair, is this exhibit C you're referring to? >> Okay. >> I don't know. It it just says it's it starts on page 281. It says procedures for the Martin County Fair Association
yearround event programs policies and procedures. Talks about booking. It talks about vendor accommodation. And it talks about camping and the particularly the camping um regulations are on 284.
Uh well 285 286 on and on and on and on. Yep. >> Golf carts are allowed. You know the fair association Mr. Mike is here to answer question >> those and those are current on the current site itself. If you look at the back side of the property we do not have
overnight camping during the fair. We have facilities along the backside where our ride vendors, our food vendors where they do have those services. We have pumpout. We do have folks that use golf carts during the during the events. We do not have six-month overnight camping in any way, shape or form. Once
>> it's in your procedures. >> Well, nothing is camping per se. We do not offer camping and no one stays on our property for 6 months. That has not happened. And we do have a 5-day in and out because we do have folks that come in. They prepare. They come in before the fair. Usually the ride vendors even
come in. Usually they don't stay overnight, but they're about 2 weeks out fairs. They bring equipment in. It's a long setup process. And then usually the fair closes out. Most of our vendors are out within 24 hours of the fair ending as they're moving on to the next fair. So we do not offer any overnight camping on our premises. There will be not any overnight camping. That was a big
sticking point on the years ago as they were looking at this Agrilex. They had talked about creating this. We're not going to be having that only the and as we have the new site plan together, we'll be having to adopt new um policies, procedures for the new property, which not able to do yet because we haven't even created the site
plan for that as well. However, in no way, shape or form will there be a camping facility other than facilities for our vendors to be using for the operation of the fair and those activities. [clears throat] And that's how it's uh stated in the in the new lease agreement. >> But that is not what your procedures
say. our we had to provide our current policies and procedures as requested by the county which we did. We cannot create a new policy and procedure manual for the new site until the new site is approved and we have the new plan moving forward. >> Yeah. Commissioner Vargas, you know, I
don't know where to begin. We've had discussions. You are very angry with me at the last meeting and that's fine. I I can take that. That's fine. Okay. Um, you pay $120 a year and then you have a lease that's stacked
in your favor. And it says right here on page 284, I'm an English teacher formally. Campers may stay to a maximum 30 consecutive days per visit. Campground, you must move spaces at least one a day for whatever reason. A maximum of six
months per year. >> Actually, >> I'd be stationed there because that would be very reasonable living. that former uh policies procedure manual. That's what we've we've been presented. We're creating a new one. That is not in any way, shape, or form how we do business now or how we'll be doing it in the future. And we do not have anybody
that has six-month accommodation. >> I'm not sure why years ago they had written a campground. We've never had a campground on the facility. >> Okay. My sister is an attorney. Um and she always told me, she went to the University of Miami. She always told
me, she clerked and she did like what you did. Okay. Um she said it's in the contract. A firstyear law student would always go back to the contract. You know, we're we're not we're not going to be signing anything unless it's for the
benefit of Martin County and its taxpayers. Not at all. You're getting away with no money to rent this facil. 30 acres, $120 a year. I mean, I looked at your I looked at your financials
also. Um, but as I said, it goes back to the behavior here at this particular location on Dixie Highway. I'm dealing with the same people. And you never profered at least to give half of the
income from the Buick rental on that lot, which was a violation of the lease. It's a violation. I don't do business with people that violate leases and then refuse to come forward and profer up what is fair and
equitable and then you want us to give you more at this location prime location 30 acres plus what's there on Dixie Highway very valuable property for the county >> and you're correct commissioner the property on Dixie Highway is very prop
very uh valuable and we are looking forward to seeing what the county chooses to do with that site and that's why we're working to get this facility up and going as quickly as possible out there. Uh working with uh the with uh Mr. Stokus and his team to get our time frame out there as quickly as possible.
Securing the funds to make that happen is what we working very hard towards. Yes, you keep referring back to this uh uh lease with Starling which was put into place prior to my tenure. Um, the way I interpret it, we've already had discussions on that based on creating revenues to support we're a nonforprofit
and creating the operations of or supporting the operations of the fair is what we do. We were made aware that that was not okay which is we remedied immediately. We took care of that. We did not profer anything for we were not asked to. So that is one of the reasons we we took care of that. We did we won't
be making that error again because it is very clear and that is not a something that we will we'll have to cross again as far as this situation with a new fairgrounds going forward. We're not operating a campground. That is something that is just not part of the
process. Now we will have a new policies and procedures and operations manual per the new site. These are things that are happening on our current site right now. And I assure you there is no camping that is going on other than vendor accommodation during our event. Okay. I asked you for that income and you
resisted. >> You never asked me for >> I did. I said, "Where is the income? This is Martin County taxpayers land. >> It is not your land, >> ma'am. It is." >> And on top of that, every excuse me, I'm talking
>> in this lease. This is stacked in your favor. Absolutely. I say you're the fair's favor. No, it has to be stacked in the favor of the county. I I would not approve this at all. At all, >> Miss Agura.
>> Hi. Um, so the lease itself specifically states that there's no camping allowed. The policies and procedures are what the state approves them to do and which we are going to change once they um give us their site planning. We know everything that's going on. But the lease itself
specifically says no um overnight uh camping allowed except for during the fair exhibition. Well, I'm I'm confused. Um why is this policies and procedures included in the agenda item? And by approving the
proposed lease, are we also adopting the rules and the policies and procedures? Well, these specific ones are the ones that are allowed by the state, but we're not allow. That's why the lease breaks it down and says they're not allowed. Mr. Fox, you want to provide some clarity? >> Sure, Madam Chair. With respect to
exhibit C, the policies and procedures, the lease in section 3 states that they'll be amended from time to time. Um, as as Mr. Sigor indicated, I think all we had to attach at this point were the existing policies and procedures that specifically addressed the current
uh lease premises. Um but the lease provides specifically they can be amended from time to time. Um so what what makes sense to me is that once those new policies and procedures are adopted they'll be attached to the lease. >> But these are are these adopted policies
and procedures >> as of as of now? Yes. But they they refer to the current the current premises. >> Mr. Heatherington >> Sebastian I think was starting to answer it and it was the question was for legal
is per the lease agreement it doesn't look like the rules and procedures are um we're bound to those rules and procedures. So the lease says that the leie shall comply with the policies and procedures
attached attached as exhibit C. So they would have to comply with those which technically has the camping in there. If we if they amend their policies and procedures, we would have to come back and amend the contract to swap out the policies and procedures. But these policies and procedures would govern
right now. So if the board's not comfortable with these policies and procedures, we can come back to the board once they finish the new policies and procedures and incorporate them if that that makes the board more comfortable. It is a bit of an inconsistency because this lease does say there is no overnight camping, but
the policies and procedures have some overnight camping provisions. So, from an ambiguity standpoint, it might be better to clarify that before you adopt it. Um, if the board's not comfortable with that, >> Commissioner Vargas. >> Okay. So, are you going to give the
income that you earned from the lease to the Buick dealership to Martin County? >> We'll follow any direction from the border county commissioners and the office of our um executive. >> Okay. And how much did you earn from
that venture? >> I think at that point it was half of it about $21,000. >> Okay. That's $21,000 that belongs to the taxpayers of Martin County. >> Was also $21,000 that supported the operations of the fair. >> Well, you know what? That is a
management thing, not ours. You violated the lease. This lease, I would never sign it. I wouldn't have anybody else sign it either. It is ambiguous. It's conflicting and it's kind of like uh, you know, like a foggy day. I I don't I
don't I I cannot support that. and you should have come forward to me to do the right thing and said, "Here, this is what we earned. Yes, we did not follow the lease." And you you know how to read a lease or you said you had an attorney and he misinterpreted it. I'd get another attorney if I were you. It's
very clear what your lease states and I read through it. I took my time to do that. That's part of my job here. >> Ma'am, we responded appropriately to everything that was given in front of us and followed those directions. I think one of the challenges we are facing right now and this may speak to that
ambiguity is on our current policy procedures. M remember we are going to be following two properties and two operations simultaneously. We were given the extension of the current site which we will be conducting two more fairs on and in that process and maybe this answers some of the questions for you
commissioner which I think were very good questions is that in that all those thing we we have we we haven't done our site plan yet. So to answer those questions about water hookup, all those things, those will be coming out in the near future as that development goes concurrently as we continue on the process of the actual fair operation
right now. So that's why that these are two concurrent things that are happening at the same time. Also in regard to the policy procedures, again those will be changing as well. Commissioner Caps. >> Uh, I think the plan for the fair,
uh, and the lease is realistic and solid, and I have a good feeling about the people involved, so I will support it. I think it's a new day for the fair and I appreciate all
the hard work you all are putting into uh getting our fair moved ultimately to western Martin County because we kind of have to get that done. So, uh I will support it. >> Miss Elder, [clears throat]
>> I was just going to provide Oh, sorry. provide another option that the board can um and if the fair agrees, we can strike out any reference to camping in the policies and procedures um and then approve it that way if that's a better option for the board in this way.
There's no ambiguity of whether you know they can camp. >> Motion maker agrees. >> I still think that there are conflicts and ambiguity so I'm not going to support the motion. There is a motion and a second all this. >> I'd like to say one thing though. Um, I
think this whole lease, everything that's here has to be reviewed because inconsistencies are rampant. I cannot support this at all. I will not do this at all. >> There's a motion and a second to all those in favor. >> I >> opposed. That motion passes 32 with
commissioners Vargas and heard dissenting. Thank you. We will now take up our 10:00 preset which is an Army Corps of Engineers update. Major Bell, are you updating us? >> Good morning and welcome. >> Thank you for volunteering to come to
see us. We'd like to see you on a regular basis and get updates. >> Absolutely. >> Your service. >> Thank you. So, thank you county commissioners for uh allowing me to speak today and providing you guys an update on um kind of our program. I'm going to start strategically and then come down to Martin County specifically.
Just for for new members that haven't met me before, I'm a Florida resident, University of graduate uh from Florida, a mechanical engineering. Um and then just recently returned from overseas assignment two years in Kuwait. So, I've been with this district, Army Corps of Jacksonville District specifically since
2023 July and been the deputy commander down in Palm Beach Gardens um um since then. So, I'm I'm slotted to to rotate out in the summer of 26. So, I'm here for four-year assignment, which is atypical. It's usually a three-year assignment. Um so, I'll be here for a while. So, if any questions, comments,
concerns, or site visits that the commissioners would like to see, we would greatly support those actions have we like we've done in the past. We don't want you to leave. >> I would love to stay if that was an option. Um, but we're going to talk a little bit about our program and specifically how how we do this and how
we execute this. Um, and and our resiliency, not only from from the the federal perspective, but from your perspective, the county, it all starts with the people. And with that, um, in our context, the way we execute business is our non-federal sponsors. So that can be counties, um, cities and anything up
to to state levels um to inter entertain those ideas and provide solutions to those problems that the communities are facing um through a myriad of different u resources and community project programs that we have throughout the core of engineers. But again, it starts with the people uh and then we escalate
um based on the federal requirements and where we need action for the citizens of the state and throughout the the entire resiliency program. when you look at it from our perspective, federal perspective, we have lots of different ways to look at that. I like to start in the water because I I love being out on the water
and and diving here. Um so as you come in, you you have CSRM, that is a coastal storm risk management projects. These are um putting sand on the beaches to protect that infrastructure along those um um embankments out there or those land sources out there and stop that
storm surge from hurricanes and any type of events. Um and then also balancing the economy of the state. So one of the taskings that Colonel Bowman is super interested in is making sure that we can get ports specifically deep uh draft ports for those larger vessels and
keeping those navigation mission which is is one of our 13 mission sets keeping those moving forward to to allow the state to grow the economy. Um and then as you move into the inter coastal way and those barrier uh from the barrier islands into the mainland you start to have a lot of imperous surface um with
structures development etc. And those backbased studies are are conducted in there while trying to balance the needs of other infrastructure as you move toward towards the inland um sections to include highrises and other natural canals that the the state would have
originally, the landscape would have originally and to those final western side where you have those communities that are growing um and supporting all the the the in inland inter coastal area. uh and then all the way to the Everglades um specifically to South Florida uh with restoration projects
there. And that's kind of how we have to look at all these. So it's it's a lot of interconnected pieces when you look at studies specifically when we're looking at how we um can make positive uh changes to the environment or to um um economy based industries that we're also
kind of balance when we execute those. And this all predicates off the CNSF. So that's a central and southern Florida system. This is the background system that everything is uh come off of. So specifically when you're talking SER, the baseline for the program is the CNSF
and then under that I'll show you a hierarchy of kind of how how we look at things. But the CNSF is that driver project that we were mandated by Congress in 1948 after some storms in 1926 and 1928. specifically hurricanes filled the lake. Lake Okchobee
overtopped and killed 2,800 um civilians which Congress then acted and put the federal government in charge, specifically the core of engineers on Lake O management. Um and then we have all those consequences that that happened by draining the landscape to create a flood control system. And you
can see there are are five congressionally authorized project purposes for the CNSF. Um none of them are labeled with a number one priority. Um, but we have to balance these these requirements every time that the colonel makes a decision. Colonel Bone makes a
decision on how we operate the CNSF uh specifically in partnership with South Florida Water Management District and how we conduct these operations. Um, and and specifically navigation is one of those that we cannot impact. We conducted Lake O Recovery Operations Oro
and we had an impact to navigation across the federal waterway, the Okachobee waterway that cuts across from the east to the west coast. Um, so we're we're going to talk a little bit about about the AER. So we we we're hoping uh today actually at 9:00 we're having meetings to garner input from state and
federal agencies and um non government organizations as well to be able to hear that feedback from that operation and apply those lessons learned moving forward. But I just want to let set the stage on the CNSF when we're talking about SER, we're talking about restoration projects within Martin
County. uh the predicator is the CNSF and it's it's very you need to understand that the process of CNSF is very important and and the what we're trying to balance uh with all those requirements and we're not necessarily um managing for one one stakeholder
specifically we're looking at a whole myriad of uh requirements that we're trying to balance and provide those benefits uh for the project to all the the citizens in the state specifically talking about ecosystem restoration projects. So the CMI river was initiated by the state in 1974. The feds got
involved in 1976. We just completed the restoration plan there and we're under what's called increment one of the water control plan. So this is water operations have a federal federal control water plan which um we're on increment one. So that just how we regulate those lakes and how we restore
the flood plane. So if you look in the picture in the left that's a restored flood plane. Originally in 1948 when we were authorized to the CNSFest project, the best way to canalize water and to know the volume of water is to make a straight line. So that's what we did. We took the wandering river, straightened it out, put some structures on there,
and it's a lot easier to to move water around to to from a flood risk management perspective. But we completed that project recently, and then we're moving forward on restoration plans. Lake O again, we conducted LEO under LOSM. So the lo Okachchobee system operating manual which was adopted in
2014 August it was a new um control manual that we operate lake O um and with with that came and specifically in zone D the S80 structure that's on the St. Lucy uh river um that structure basically has an a huge reduction
approximately 85% of no releases through that. Um so lake recovery we did have to operate those structure for that operation but since that concluded in March we've saved 22 uh,500 acre feet from being released through the S80 structure and stored in the C44. Uh
which is a great project that's beneficial to the community and we can continue to see positive impacts from that and we'll talk a little bit about those programs. uh and projects in IRL specifically and then again um with SER specifically you're looking at the greater Everglades the entire U impact
south of the lake and we have the EAA project there that we'll talk briefly on as well um it's just a challenging thing that we have um and this is kind of how we we see it in our our military um datm and our our the way we kind of think through the problem set again the
predicator is the CNSF and then under that you see all these other um fastest in programs that Congress has approved and again the comprehensive Everglades restoration plan SER which is the driver of all the restoration projects uh throughout the Everglades system uh from
the CMI chain to Florida Bay. Uh and then you'll also notice the EAA reservoir. We'll talk briefly about this as well because there's a new memorandum of agreement in a memorandum of understanding between the state the department of the army um that has moved
that um project to the left. The intent is to have it completed by 2029 instead of 2034. Um, so we are working through that as well uh with South Florida Water Management District in the state along with the second secretary of Army Civil Works. So here's kind of our snapshot of
fiscal year 26 of what we're trying to execute. Uh we did have a rocky start getting out of the fiscal year, but right now we're good to go. Um so this not only affects the core of engineers had no impacts with the elapsing of appropriations but our federal partners and sisters did have issues um and we
can't move out specifically on um what's called studies feasibility studies if the core of engineer will build a project. We have to do studies to see those impacts um positive and negative or can we make a um financial investment to make those right. Um but this is what we're tracking for 26 right now. Some of
these are continued um projects. So on the left you see the program uh affiliations those are always going to be moving forward and those agreements are or coordinations and recovery activities are always uh moving forward. It's the design planning and construction and and the water
operations that will change based on um funding requirements out of the federal side and then how we move forward on a priority uhization of those projects. I do want to highlight the Lake Okachchobee wershed restoration project LARP. This was been terminated so we are finalizing the administration process on
that. So within that project, we'll talk a little bit about it. There's two different um two different portions of that project, the ASR, so the aquacer storage recovery system and the wetlands portion. Um we we don't have a final determination on that, but uh we believe that the the the
wetlands portion, if the state chooses to execute that, they can move forward on the paradise run section. We are still our uh engineering research and development center out of Vixsburg is doing the ASR research with South Florida Water Management District. that portion is still moving forward. So the portion that's terminated is the um
wetland portion of that project. Put any questions on on these programs? >> Yes, sir. >> Mr. Caps. >> Yes. I would take you back to uh page 141, the Central and Southern Florida
Project. just curious about a little bit of the history of of drainage of the state. And this uh picture here would suggest that most of those canals were
were dug at this time. And I always had the impression that it was earlier in our history when some of that was done. Was most of what is pictured here was that done in 1948 to >> this 1954? officers. So this is the complete buildout of the CNSF. So the
state started um you know with the St. Lucy Canal. They completed that project in 1924 1926 I believe. So the state's done a lot of that work and different people have done a lot of work. But when Congress authorized the project in 1948, we came in and did a complete analysis
on um water control and flood management and we created additional drainage um on the landscape to be able to execute that mission. that was created the 9 billion 9 million people that we have in South Florida now, >> right? Yeah. I always have conflicting uh feelings when I think about all of
those canals and levies. You know, on the one hand, uh it seems that we did enormous environmental damage to the state when all that was done. On the other hand, none of us would live here if it had not been done. So it's uh it's
quite a a conflicting emotion when you think about it. >> Absolutely. It's again a balance uh when we look at it, right? So when anytime you you do something, we got to look at the balance, right? And I think our federal partners of US Fish and Wildlife, Noah, Nymphs, specifically
National Marine Fisheries, we have to coordinate with those when we do actions, right? That's that's the deeper process. There's, you know, there's it's just not the core of engineers. It may be our name at the top of the permit, but we have to coordinate across the local and other federal agencies to make sure that we can balance uh the requirements that are given to us and
mandated by Congress. Uh so it is it's interesting. We were told to drain the landscape to people to live here and to be able to use the land and cultivate it and now we're we're looking at how do we restore the impacts we made. So it's again balancing of of kind of looking at where we're where we are now, where
we're moving forward to as well. >> Mr. Vargas has a question. >> Yeah. Um, no, just a comment. Um, I would urge those listening here to read the book The Swamp by Michael Grunwald. Do you know what I'm talking about? Our wonderful library system has it on audio
because everybody's busy. You can drive down the road and read the book. Um, but that definitely tells you a whole lot about the history of Florida, how it was carved up and carved out and twist and turns and how it did destroy quite a bit. But anyway, you you weren't here at
that time. So, but anyway, it's knowledge and you have to have knowledge and apply it. >> Mhm. Thank you. >> Proceed, please. >> All right. So, the integrated delivery schedule, this is all of our projects specifically with surfer South Florida
ecosystem restoration plan. So, we originally were hoping to have the roll out the new plan. Um this kind of shows all the projects systematically across the entire um surfer program where we are at on construction where we are in developing those order control plans
operational plans uh with the lapse and appropriation we're now delayed so we're looking towards January to have the release and we'll do workshops to to explain how to read that document and we'll release uh we're also releasing a new digital interactive format so you can go on to the website you can click
on specific areas or specific projects and provide the same information that you would have on 11 by7 piece of paper which is getting smaller print as we add more projects. Um, so now we'll have it interactive, so you'll be able to go into a website, click on a project or an area you're interested or focused in. You can get a fact sheet where we are on
all that information, but we're kind of slightly behind the power curve. Typically, we would present this at the South Florida Ecosystem Restoration Task Force in DC. U, but that has also been um canceled as well, I believe, in December that was originally scheduled for. Um, so we're still working through
that. We're working through the challenges of of of the lapse, but we're we're hopeful that we'll be able to execute this in January and present it to the public as well. So, we're going to talk a little bit about some of these uh projects and and what's called the planning. We call it planning, but this is really the
feasibility studies um um area. So, this again, this is the ASR. So, Eric right there is the engineering research development center. they're still moving forward on that and are looking to complete some of those um those four tasks there that we were asked to look at by our chief of
engineers. Um so what ASR is is is it's taking surface water uh and then injecting it down at deep water well and then drawing it out when and at time you need it to use later. Uh our we have a lot of concerns. Um you can see the four that are highlighted there. If if we're
involved from a federal perspective, it needs to beat certain water quality standards. And then when you pull it out, it also has to meet certain water quality standards. So it it's very costly from our perspective. So we're still working through if it's feasible from a technical perspective, from an engineering perspective, we think it's feasible. Um but it's also, you know,
the long-term on&m of these things. Um but they're still looking moving forward on that research and South Florida's moving forward on their ASR wells, too. and they're um around the the lake. So again, SER is about storage and then when we can least quality um quantity
and timing of those releases into the Everglades to keep that ecosystem balanced. Um but we we are terminating that portion of the wetlands project and then you can see it's highlighted in green there. That's the Paradise Run section uh on the on the graphic to the left.
So the resiliency studies we have a lot there. So the the first arrow is not actually shingle crank. It should be that um circle oval there. That's shingle crank. So, we're looking doing a study there. Um it's moving forward. No issues uh with that one right now. The comprehensive study, that's the entire
uh black area there. So, that's the entire CNSF. This authority allows us to go back and look at how things changed. So, the environment has clearly changed when we were tasked to build to build the CNSF and allow 2 million people to live in South Florida. Today, we have over 9 million and growing. Um so,
clearly the landscape has changed. there's a lot more infrastructure and development has happened since the 1940s. So, we're looking at all that and how that impacts there. And then we have the the northern eststeroids um ecosystem restoration looking at specifically those environments there um and how how the flows are going to work
and how we're going to balance that. And then the flood resiliency studies looking at along that coastline from Palm Beach County all the way down to Miami Dade. Um and we broken that up in four different what's called reaches because of how the funding works at the federal level. we can't do the entire
study at the cost given the current policies that we have in place. So, we've broken that up in four different reaches. South Florida's taking a section, we're taking a section and uh I think the other section will be studied later at a later time, but that's where we're moving forward on those.
Any questions? So, we'll talk specifically about what's happening in your community and and specifically within the Indian River Lagoon. So south project is C24 C2 um3 STA storm treatment area. This is a water quality function and reservoir system uh that's moving forward. The STA
which is a coreled project is scheduled to be completed later um this year next year 2026. So that's exciting news. The the North Reservoir contract 4A is continuing to move forward. Uh no challenges there right now. The C24 package one, this is a clearing and
grubbing. We've taken some folks out to see that. So that's really just the the initial stages of the C-25 uh complex there. And then the C-23 uh C24 interconnect, that's a South Florida. So this connects the two reservoirs between North and South to be able to transfer
water where needed um to be able to execute that as well. And the C23 2024 South Reservoir package is is currently underway with South Florida Water Management District. Put any of your questions on this. All right. So the central Everglades
planning project this is SEP. So this is the EAA reservoir here. This is a 10,500 acre uh storage that's A2 reservoir and this was um highlighted on January 2018 uh 2025 on the 18th where the memor of agreement and memorandum of
understanding was signed by the department of the army and the the state of Florida. Um, and this agreement has uh is very spirited and it's it's it's given us a lot of um ways to move this program forward specifically with EAA uh our challenges with that. So, originally
that was a 10-year contract. This MOA ask us to complete that by 2029. Um so, we're working through that. It also allows South Florida to take um federal funding under what's called 1043b program. It's a pilot program to receive federal funds to a state agency to execute federal projects. Uh so, we're
working through that. That framework is posted on South Florida's web page along with our web page that talks about those projects and those potential fundings for for state actions through federal funding uh to move some of these projects forward uh to get these executed so we can see those benefits of
the EAA when they come online. And with the EAA coming online uh sooner as we're we're we're working through those challenges, that also means we have to have updated water control plans. So we're looking around September of 2026 to start los 2.0. know and start the scoping of that. So we'll be able
gardener input for that. So the next lake regulation schedule we expect to be able to have a lot of input from from everybody. But that's that'll be another great opportunity to have folks talk about um their concerns with how the systems going to be operated moving forward under EAA reservoir, additional
storage capacity throughout the CNSF. So it'll be another great community uh engagement event for those that uh are interested. We did complete the inflow outflow um connection. So that was an initial contract that goes around the outside of the reservoir and SDA system. This was completed in September. We are
currently moving forward with the foundation. This is 11A contract and the embankment which is 11B. So theou MOA specifically talks about 11A and 11B moving that to the left. Um so we're working through those challenges now. It's called the we call it the um yes if
register. So yes, if we get all these requirements, if we get funding, if we get permits, uh if we get all these actions and our support across the nation to execute this by 2029, we can do it. Um but we just need a lot of a lot of ifs need to be answered in a yes to be able to execute this um to to get
it done in in short amount of time. We'll move into operations. So we did conduct um solosum. Many of you probably were on the board at that time. Salosum is a new control manual that we use for Lakeotropic operations. It it's has really focused on um there's
the the asteruary specifically looking at the the impacts of those unscheduled untimely or harmful release release regimes that could happen. So this lum allows us to to look at those estuaries, look at the algae, to look at other factors when we can consider what
operations we're going to can do through what structures um and balancing those five mand mandated congressional actions with we have to balance u and then looking at all the other uh sovereign nations that we would impact with our operations and we conducted what's called Lake Okachchobee recovery
operations. So this looks at the specifically at Lake Okachchobee and the ecology of the lake and the focus of that is to get the lake healthy and if you have a healthy lake when you make releases east, west or south then those will create positive impacts to those environments and estuaries as well. So
we conducted that which drew down the lake. We started that in December of last year, concluded in officially in May. Uh stopped release schedules in in March. Um which we drew down the lake and again that what that does is it draws down the lake to allow the SAV subaquatic vegetation to grow. So
naturally filters the water on the lake and then it creates a healthy environment for the lake and the um bish bass fisheries there and other organisms there as well to include um um some avier aviaries birds that also require
um certain type of um organisms to eat as well. So it's really looking at the ecology of the lake but again lo 2.0 know. Uh so it'll be a great time to go through that experience. Uh so we we're looking forward to moving forward on that. But we conducted a successful operations uh during that time. You can
kind of see that we got into the um what's called the ecological envelope. This is the healthiest place where the lake would need to be naturally to create the SAV and the growth that it needs. Um when we our initial reports that were received um at the lowest point we had 4,000 uh acre feet of 4,000
acres of SAV sub aquatic vegetation and our initial reports have over 28,000 acres. So already seen positive uh impacts from from SAV growth on the lake and then currently uh the highest peak we reached on the lake during the the wet season was just under 14 ft. It was
13.99. What does I matter? uh moving into this dry season, which again we're conducting a mid-season point uh dry season assessment now. We'll roll out our strategy um in the next several months. Um but that's going to have an impact on water supply. So as we approach what's called the water
shortage management ban, the authorities kind of change a little bit. South Florida Water Management District has a lot more uh vote on how we conduct operations because they're looking specifically at water supply for the the the industries that rely on that. Um and and you know currently WCA2 water
conservation area two which is in uh south of us is above schedule but um water conservation area one and three are below schedule. So those again supply water supply for Miami D county, Broward and Palm Beach. So we're just look looking at those but um great
successful operation. We were 238 days in the recovery envelope. So that allows that natural SAV to grow back and we're expected um we'll fall out of the envelope uh here shortly, but then we'll jump back into it in the new year. You can see how it jumps the purple jumps on the other side in January. So we'll drop
back in it and we'll be we're expecting to be in that for a very long time through the dry season and and we'll be hopeful uh that we'll the hurricane season will be so bad in 2026. Um we were blessed this year that we didn't have that to impact our operations. Um so it was a very successful operation
that we conducted on that. Again, this just highlights the SAV there. Uh, and what we're seeing from a positive. Um, and again, we we use a a 16 gauge average. Other folks use different gauge averages and the lake is so large over 700 plus mile square miles that we have
to use an average base. We use 16 gauges and other organizations use a smaller gauge set, but you have that wind velocity. It creates that energy that comes across the lake and it we need a truer value because it can uh to to lopside to one side depending on the wind velocity across the lake. Uh also to highlight we have the Okchobee Gourd
came back uh during this operations which the first sighting in several years that this has happened. So this is great news and positive. FWC was able to conduct control burns out there as well uh to get some of that organic material out of the way so it will be successful um um this coming dry season as well.
And this is specifically within the um IRL um specifically St. Lucy estruary here. So we saw uh great or this is a kusahatchee great recruitments uh on that. I don't know the St. Lucy I don't know if I have that data in here u but
we have seen positive impacts as well on the St. Lucy estuary as well and then um just kind of a snapshot of where we are on the recovery. Um, so we did have impacts, right? So we're talking about balance. So we had negative impact to snail kites. So the those aviaries
uh that were also trying to balance for wildlife uh had an impact there. So we're we're taking all these under consideration. Um but the the A process will be sending out a media release of public release for folks to provide impact input to us how to impacted uh local communities, governments as well.
And we'll garner that and and dress that up at the end of the year um into the next quarter, sorry, fiscal years. Um so we'll we'll talk about those details as we roll out and kind of our our goal um as we move forward is is to consider
everything we have uh and specifically this the the West Coast stakeholders the St. the Clusah Hatchee is going to you know they they require different needs than the St. Lucy estuary. So we're trying to balance those needs. Um, and it's going to be challenging as we go
into a drier season and as we're projected to stay pretty dry throughout the entire dry season. It's going to be challenging to to balance, but we're looking at that uh as well. Um, and as and and it's it's another great aspect of having these programs come online.
The C43 um came online last year. So as water volume is available, they'll be able to store it there and have it for those needs at dry periods to be able to provide that water supply for their eststerary because they have different seagrasses and freshwater glass grasses as well. C44 U so this specifically is
you know a project that's local here. C44 is currently at 7.8T this morning. Again, we've saved uh 22,500 acre feet from being released through the S80 structure uh since March of this year, which is great news. Um we we can't
operate at full um design criteria, which is 15 ft. We can operate right now at 10 ft and we're working through the what's called the seepage management feature. That design will be completed later um this I think it's fiscal year 27 and then construction will start
after that and then we'll start our OTMP that's operational maintenance and testing phase. where we bring it up to 15 ft, verify um that it can hold that and then uh complete that turnover to South Florida Water Management District to execute. Right now we're working through the challenges there. So those
that that's southwest corner of the project in that reservoir and it's not a life health safety concern. What is a concern there is that outer canal that is a seepage canal. These are mostly on all of our reservoirs and because you have a natural hydration and hydraological pressure from the
reservoir being above surface that creates natural flow and percolation through those materials um on the seepage canal that's it's called sloughing and this is a maintenance issue for the mowers that have to keep that area clear and clean for the wildlife that is out there. Um it's not
a a safety issue with the embankment itself. These meet our federal dam requirements. So there's no life health safety there. put in any questions if anyone has any questions on C44. Yes, sir. >> Commissioner Caps. >> Yeah, I'll take you back to page 154.
Losome. As I remember, this is a new way of doing things. It's a it's a new plan. Can you just put it in a nutshell how that plan differs from the old one? >> Sure. Absolutely. >> Practically. >> So, the the prior water control plan for the Lake Okachchobee was called lures.
That's Lake Okachchobee regulation schedule. 2008 is when it was adopted. Alo was signed in August of 2024. The difference between the two um water control plans is Lors was very if this do that. It's a very much a flow chart.
It's a very much uh it takes the human element I would say out of it. It's very analytical, very uh by the numbers. So if the estuaries or southern parts of the system are wet, you don't make releases. um if they're at a certain threshold on the lake, you make releases
east and west based on uh other requirements. LoM kind of looks at everything and says, okay, you know, we have estuaries to the east coast, we have estuaries to the west coast, we have u the everglades we're also trying to balance in Florida bay and is there is there blue green algae on the lake is all these other things. We can look at
all that and say, okay, um and and specifically for Martin County SAD structure when within zone D, there's zero releases under L lower 08. it based on hydraulical conditions you could be you could do up to releases through um
the S80 structure. So depending on how you looked at it um how how the how commanders would view that you would either get flows out of the S80 structure or you wouldn't lo's a little bit easier to read because most of the time we were in zone D which means you would not receive flows through the S80
structure unless there was a life health safety issue from the embankment from looking at the lakeside from a flood risk management um side but that's why you have the C44 is to take that basin runoff onto the C44 basin and then pump it into the reservoir so you don't make those releases through S80 Um, and
you've seen you might have seen that through the wet season where we've backfilled into the lake instead of pumping it or to release it through the S80 structure. If we couldn't get the pumps at C44 turned on quick enough to pull that volume or the rainfall is higher than what those volumetric rates to pull it into the reservoir, we moved it back into the lake to not damage that
estuary trying to m that balance that salenity level within the estuary. So those organisms specifically what we look at is orchards there, but other seaggrasses as well depending on salinity um gradients. So it's it's kind of balancing that. So it's a holistic approach um versus a very flowchart if
this do that kind of mandate. Um so it's it's a completely different way of how we operate the lake and we garner input from both federal, state and local and nonprofit organizations uh to how we we conduct operations where there wasn't that in the pre prior regulation
schedule. It was we were going to execute um and we we could communicate that or not. But it's a completely different way of doing business and it I think it's a more transparent way of doing business for everyone to see what we're doing. You know, thinking back on the history
of when LOSUM came in, it it seems like it came in after that last summer, as it was termed, what was that, 2018 or something, 17, where we had the really bad green algae outbreak.
and and that created a lot of public outcry and I think seems like that's about when the uh lo came into play as I remember but you know thinking about the issue of lake levels and couple of the
basic things that I have garnered over the years is that when the lake is too high you know it's it's a a threat to the burm um or the dyke But it also uh chokes out the seagrasses in the
bottom of the lake which threatens and imperils the life in the lake and then if it gets too shallow you kind of I remember many years ago I wish I remember when it was it it seems like it was about 12 or 15 years ago we had a
real crisis one summer with an extreme drought and like islands started appearing in the middle of Lake Okachchobee and there was a serious threat to the navigability of the lake and you know you got to it's it's a very delicate science to keep
those lake levels where they need to be. So uh hats off to you all for uh doing all you do. >> Yes sir. It's it's a challenge to balance that. So we saw that under Lake Tribby recovery operations we did have an impact to navigation which is our congressional mandated uh taskings. So
it's again we have to balance all these things and looking at lots of different things and we're trying to be open and transparent about the process to have input and provide that uh so folks understand when a decision is made it's it's not done in a vacuum and then we're really trying to to understand the impacts to everyone that we're doing
these operations for. Thank you for your support. Yeah, major the um reservoirs in SER are the foundation of water storage um and seepage management is a problem on every single project, every
single reservoir project. Um we know that there the seepage management is not 100% at uh C44. Uh so we know that we're still testing until we can create a solution. Um cutoff walls are a solution
that work. Um, in the reservoirs that are being constructed now, are cutoff walls being used in order to to uh uh manage seepage? Commissioner, great question. So, C-44
taught us a lot of different lessons. Um, and and that's a great point. So, one one of the empoundments in M Brower County specifically, uh, we we stopped what we were doing and add the cut off wall design. So, EAA has cut off wall design. Uh so these these reservoirs moving forward um at least on the
southern and eastern and western flanks of those reservoirs will have cut off walls to stop that seepage because we don't know what the hydraulic um carst looks like underground. So underground is just limestone carst and underground we don't know what that does. So when you create above ground swimming pool depending if that geology changes you
could have an impact like we saw with C44. um you know and unfortunately this cut off wall going back on C44 is financially not worth uh that investment but we're moving forward with 126 what's called seepage well management feature u and I know that we're looking on trying
how to move that forward as far as we can to the left to get that up to full operational capacity um so we can bring that up to 15t pool um and save uh those releases out of the S80 structure when there's a lot of high volume rain events uh across the C44 basin specifically but
yes ma'am moving forward We're looking at that. We're learning from those lessons that we made um on the C-44 project moving forward within the program. >> I'm just one person, but my vote is for cut off walls as a solution for C44 also. >> Yes, ma'am. >> Commissioner Heatherington has a
question. >> Yes. I was going to add into the loum conversation. Major Bell, thank you for being here. And you mentioned at the beginning of your presentation that you have to manage the stakeholders throughout the state and and all of the missions that you highlighted at the beginning of the presentation, but
you've always been very accessible and um with a spirit of collaboration for our community. So, thank you. And um Commissioner Caps was talking about LOSUM and I think it warrants recognition of our county staff for LOSUM because during that period we
assembled and we have new residents and we have residents that were here during LOUM we assembled a allstar rockolid team and that was led by Mr. Donaldson, of course, many engineers and many legal
astute minds, John mail. So, I just wanted to give um some recognition because while our goal was zero discharges and we didn't achieve that, but we we did pretty darn close and I think that we put together a great team and our residents should certainly
recognize that. So, thank you. >> Commissioner Campy has a question. >> More of a statement, sir. Um, it's interesting having had the opportunity to meet several of your predecessors. Every time they are to depart, we are really mournful.
But magically, the new person comes in. And you were a perfect example today. Obviously, you have the slides, but I'm just sitting here amazed at the depth of knowledge that you have on very technical issues. uh you know, binder
sized uh loads of information that you are just easily just calling right off the top of your head specifically to our area. I'm sure you could get out of that seat and go down to Jupiter and Palm
Beach Gardens and further south or to Indian River County and give them the same customized homespun version. So remarkable. We will miss you. Um, I have my fingers crossed that whoever replaces you or attempts to will
quickly come to the abilities that you have. Uh, we have really I can't think of any that have really not been able to carry the torch, but today it's just been remarkable. So, thank you so much. >> Thank you. >> Just quickly, uh, we talked about CM
River. Um, so this is north of the lake, which is, you know, impacts the lake, which impacts your estuary here. Um, so we're moving forward on that. Increment one again is current operation schedule on that. And we're doing a new schedule as well under development. >> Um, and that's all I have for you,
>> Major. Do you know if if uh if there's any dredging being done on the CSM? >> Dredging. It may be by South Florida if they have projects. Um, I know that we I think we completed the dredging in St. Lucy. Um and I know that we've got awarded the CSRM project for Hutchinson Island as well. Um so those are moving
through our process um right now. But I I can't speak to this CMI river. I know EAA um South Florida is doing dredge improvements along Miami new north new river canal uh for the EAA because we have to have that conveyance capacity uh to get to the EAA reservoir.
So, I know they're doing stuff out there, but we I don't believe that the federal um core of engineers is executing u dredging operations there. >> Any updates on the uh muck removal in as part of IRL South? >> That's a great question. So, we're still coordinating with Martin County on on
moving forward with that um along with all the other programs with IRL suite of projects. Um we I don't have any update major updates to provide. We're still going through that. I know that Martin County voiced concerns about some oyster beds. Um, so I engage the sta our staff, the core staff on that to make sure that
we're not impacting those oyster breads that the Martin County has invested into. Um, so we're looking at all those different things uh moving forward, but no no highlights yet. The MOAU is kind of focused the district on executing. Uh, when I say district, I'm Jacksonville district focusing on
completing that by 2029. So that's where all of our staff efforts are right now uh focused on. Um, not to say that IRL is not important, but we've got to figure out how to get this completed uh in in half the time. So, it's a challenge. >> Thank you, Commissioner Heatherington.
>> I'm highly supported and interested in uh the muck removal and the dredging. Banana River had a Does anybody know who did that um dredging project? Because that seemed like it was a very successful project. I >> think Mr. Mail does.
>> Was that St. John's? It was the county. That's the county. Bvard, >> you're uh John Mel, ecosystem restoration division manager. That's not right. Um Bvard County has been doing uh expansive uh muck removal projects in
the lagoon. And they've they it's not a holistic project, but they're taking like hot spots that they've identified through survey and have I think they've done about 400,000 cubic yards of removal all told through you know they have a huge chunk of the lagoon and
they've seen pretty remarkable um results from that. They've seen the fishery rebound, the clarity um seaggrasses rebound in those areas. So that's that's uh been a motivating factor for us to get highly engaged in keeping the our muck removal project um
moving forward. >> Who's funding it? >> Uh they have a a sales tax that um has done the predominant lift on that. >> Good. I've heard really good results from that that project.
>> Thank you. >> We do have a request to speak form and it is from Pete. Next item. >> Is this is for this is this for this item for the next one? >> Okay, we'll finish this item then. Any further comments, updates?
>> I would say the muck removal project like uh you know I've been out with Representative Mast. I've been out with Captain's Clean Water and it's you know we're doing all these projects C44, C23 24 reservoirs and STA systems. It's it will be super beneficial once we have those programs online and removing the
muck and seeing the natural ecosystem respond to have those um you know areas crystal clear with seagrasses again. So that's great news that we're moving forward on these things. But uh right now federal funding is is you know all hands on deck towards EAA reservoir. So
I just say that generally that you know it's still on our agenda item. We want to get it move forward as well, but just be um optimistic as as much as we can moving forward throughout the federal cycles for funding streams. >> Commissioner Vargas. >> Yes. I just want to say I'm a scuba
diver also born in Florida, so I totally understand. I think that the presentation was excellent. Uh as a lay person, I could understand what you're talking about. I've been to conferences that are dealing with this same issue.
Um, and um, I look forward to the day when we can finally say, gee, what we did, we invested all these years has really come to fruition and we'll be able to see a different St. Lucy River. I understand there's a vacuuming system that I think has been talked about. Can you address
>> different methods? Yes, ma'am. There's different methods on on dredging. Um, there's, you know, um, vacuum systems, there's crawl systems, bucket systems. So it again you you have to look at the impacts that you're doing during those operations specifically when you do
crawling or any type of armed you know mechanical means it creates particulates in the water column that could be negative impacts to corals. Uh so we have to balance those based on the environments that we're operating in. So it goes a part of our NEPA process u and the consultations with the federal
services on how we do that and what methods are used. Um, so it depends on on on the environment you're operating in and how you're dredging and how it's going to affect the environment. So we have to balance that as well. >> Okay. Thank you, Mr. Caps. >> Yes. One one question about muck
removal. I remember this this came up when I was talking to John mail or someone recently about it and it had to do with where to put the muck and I suppose that's one of the biggest challenges um finding the right place to
put the muck and um you would have to have a lot of acreage I suppose uh uh somewhere where they could have a big dirt mound a very big dirt mound somewhere where so uh
uh did do we know how Bvard County managed that issue and >> that would be interesting. >> John Mayo Environmental Resources Division uh they approached it with a myriad of different options uh including
some innovative approaches where they just asked land owners if they had uh spoil sites to where they would want the muck for for one reason or another. Um uh but because it was a kind of a compartmentalized effort, it wasn't like a holistic lagoonwide effort, they were
able to just do a little bit here, a little bit there, and um and so they didn't have to have a major um single site to to pump to. >> Good. Thank you. >> Any further questions or comments? >> Terrific partnership. Thank you.
>> Look forward to seeing you for the next update. >> Absolutely. and looking forward to the new integrated delivery schedule in January. >> Yes, sir. >> Thank you. >> Merry Christmas. >> Bye. Yes. Merry >> We're going to take a 10-minute break and then we're going to take up our 11:00 preset.
>> Need anything next door? >> No, I'm not going to. >> I know. Do you need anything? >> No. >> 13. You're on. >> Welcome back. We're going to take up our 11:30 preset, which is the economic
development toolkit public hearing number one. >> Good morning, Madam Chair. George Stokus back with you again, assistant county administrator. Uh, I hope to be brief but brilliant with my presentation. Um what I'd like to do is offer you the
economic development toolkit. Um as a visual if you can imagine what a box of e that represents economic development and various tools that are in the toolkit. The first one is the opportunity fund. It provides reimbursement grants for businesses committing to largecale high impact
projects with a minimum of $10 million in investment and caps the amount of the incentive to be at 1 million per project. The second tool is the local closing fund. This delivers a gap filling financial grant for critical projects targeted investments of at
least 5 million with a maximum of 500,000 per project. Expedited permitting accelerates development review and permitting for priority of industries streamlining the process um but not offering direct financial support. training and workforce grants.
Uh this was a product of what we learned during uh the COVID era uh which issues reimbursements for employee training and workforce development including support for transportation and child care especially in advance in green technologies. Industrial Development Authority bonds.
This was a pre-existing tool. Um, this is an independent agency that reports to the board, but they facilitate the access to taxexempt financing for large-scale county projects and it's very heavily regulated through state statutes and its own board's policies and procedures. And then finally, one of
the a voter approved referendum tool uh that is very heavily regulated through state statute uh is the advalorum tax exemption program. It's also probably one of the most powerful tools, but offers the least amount of flexibility. It offers property tax exemptions for
qualified businesses based on a calculated uh which is calculated via scoring system based on job creation, wage levels, capital and capital investment. Exemptions can last up to 10 years. Uh this program was implemented
in accordance to chapter 71 article 13 of the economic development avalorum tax exemptions general ordinances of the Martin County code and se and also under state statute section 196. Um to point out what are the big differences and why did we revamp the
toolkit. I think it's important to point out why the old toolkit did not work and how we've made those uh changes into the new toolkit. Under the previous toolkit, the levels in which to meet the minimum thresholds to uh actually qualify for incentives were were too high and we
were constantly receiving that input from businesses uh and prospects. So staff went back and with coordination with the BDB, the economic council, other outside business entities, the Rotary, the chambers of commerce, uh we've reset the levels for achievable
and attainable that can be achievable and attainable by businesses in Martin County and those that are seeking to move to Martin County. Under the old toolkit, everything was job centric. And as you know, for those of you who have been up on the das for a while, we saw counties around us that relied heavily
on these job centric tools to only find out that later on and within a couple years, the businesses were gone, the jobs were gone, but the investment in the money was also gone. So under the new toolkit, we focus on capital investment. Uh they actually money that stays here in Martin County that is
ultimately somehow recollected through the ad valorum uh taxation regardless of company placement or whether the company stays here. And under the old toolkit, the county paid upfront or paid at least 50% upfront and then the company was
expected to perform. Under the new toolkit and through the guidance and help with Martin County legal department, um we have changed the uh equation to the business must perform and then we pay in the lie of a grant reimbursement program. I think it's also
important to note that as each business applies for these tools that ultimately everything the package will be brought before the board of county commissioners. The board of county commissioners decides whether or not that incentive package passes or does
not pass. Uh these are these are incentives not necessarily entitlements. Finally uh another thing to add is how is the actual toolkit funded? uh is funded through the economic trust fund which is an advalorum fund that is ultimately budgeted and money is given
through a budget process. Currently the ETF stands between about 1.3 to $1.6 million. I apologize I don't have the exact number uh with me today. And then um finally, I do want to point out that
staff in consultation with uh other businesses and the BDB is aware of a couple issues that we would like to have changed based on some changes in the economy. And the first one, I'll just go under the opportunity fund to show you where we would like to make these changes. And
the first one has to deal with business size. Initially staff uh limited the businesses and we're looking for board of county commissioner comment on this. We limited to businesses must have fewer than 500 full-time employees, but we were made aware by some local companies that have been bought out by larger
companies that based on this language that they would initially be eligible, but once they had been bought out, they would not be eligible. Um, so staff is recommending the elimination of the business size uh due to the fact that we would probably want to open it up to everyone to apply for a tool and
ultimately let the board of county commissioners decide whether or not that company uh is worthy of receiving those incentives regardless of size. However, we still do require that all these businesses must be legally registered in the state of Florida to do business as
well as have an office address in Martin County and they also must have a business tax receipt. So, that's the first requested change. And then the second requested change is in light of the advent of um data centers and how we
as Martin County may be receptive or may receive inquiries to data centers. staff created a payment in lie of taxes uh no pun intended but a pilot program um which will be for data centers meeting or exceeding the 100 megawatt threshold
uh may be considered for payment in lie of tax arrangement with Martin County subject to county approval and negotiation. It's a little bit of a backward thought pilot is not necessarily an incentive for for that the countyy's giving the company. It is
more of a stabila stabilization tool that allows county staff through guidance of the board of county commissioners to stabilize tangible personal property tax uh payments uh that would go from these large data centers to the county. And based on a
stabilization mechanism, it was a it was pointed out to staff that under the incentive calculation uh language which is on page 100. I need to ask that the board consider changing that adding the language. I'm going to
read it direct that the pilot program will have separate calculations but a maximum grant payment will be for $1 million to under make underw worthy that data centers are not entitled to more than 1 million under the opportunity fund. Um,
as far uh as far as how long we started this in October of last year, much of the language was derived from uh economic development partners, the business development board, the economic council uh and unless the board would like me to walk through each tool further in depth. Uh
I'm more than happy to answer any questions, comments, or address any concerns. >> I also should say, Madam Chair, to my left is Mr. Kevin Crowder. He's our consultant, and to my right is Mr. Sebastian Fox who helped us from the legal perspective. >> Questions? We have a number of requests
from the public to speak. The first one is Pete Pit. Is that anywhere close to being accurate? >> Piti. >> Please join us. Next is Paul Skyers. Good morning. >> Good morning. Um, thank you for allowing
me to speak. Uh, my name is Pete Pvidi or or Prevett as some people say. Um, [clears throat] I'm here in my capacity as a a business advisor for the South Florida Manufacturers Association. Uh, the reason why I wanted to come here is
because, um, we work very closely with the Martin County uh, business development board. Uh, specifically William and Troy. Um, in my capacity, I need to partner with local organizations that are uh, able to
provide resources to businesses that we work with. So, it makes my job a lot easier when we have organizations that provide resources. They know the the county um and they're able to support the manufacturing companies that that we work with. Um if you're not aware, uh
SFMA, South Florida Manufacturers Association, is under Florida Makes. So, Florida Makes is the MEP or manufacturing extension partnership of the state of Florida. it is government funded and our job uh statewide and and
in South Florida is to support the growth of manufacturers. So just in the last 6 months I have personally had a lot of success working with the BDB. It's made my job a lot easier. Um and hopefully some of the folks on the BDB
can talk to you about some of the successes that we have. So, I just wanted to come spend a minute or two uh just to introduce myself and talk a little bit about what SFMA does and the support that we're getting from your organization. So, we appreciate it. Thank you very much. >> Thank you. Paul Skyers is next, followed
by Jeff Sabin. >> Morning commissioners and staff. How's everyone doing? I would like to encourage you to support this economic development toolkit primarily because it provides access to capital and workforce development for
businesses here in Martin County which is very critical for business growth, business expansion. In my capacity as a business consultant, I work with inclusify, an entity that is also with the business development board and providing capital for smaller businesses here in the county and we couldn't
survive without the economic toolkit. A lot of the programs that you have within that toolkit actually dovetailed quite nicely into our financing programs. We we can finance gap capital for entities that are getting um re reimbursed through that
program. More importantly, as you look at the economic landscape and how businesses interact with each other, those small businesses that we finance interact with the larger businesses here in the county, creating a a total cycle in terms of economic well-being. So, my
encouragement to you this morning, if you would, is to please support this economic development program as a mech mechanism for creating well-being here in in the county. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Jeff Sabin is next, followed by Harold Jenkins. Yes.
>> Okay. Harold Jenkins is next, followed by Carmine Apollo. >> Good morning. >> Good morning. >> Well, when I left here, I said I will never do public speaking again, but [laughter] here I am. >> Took a year. >> So, um, obviously this issue is, uh,
something that's important to me. Um, as most of you know, I was the liaison for the CH for the uh commission to the business development board for the eight years that I was here. And this is a conversation that has been going on for
quite some time, George. Correct. Um, of what is an appropriate incentive program for a toolkit for Martin County. And now um I saw the es and flows of uh the business development board. Um it
currently has its feet under it and I believe that this is a very fiscally conservative toolkit compared to our neighbors around us and throughout the state that is appropriate for Martin County. And I uh ask you to um to
support it. This is something that that George and Kevin and and um um Williams predecessor worked on for quite some time and um I think it's completely appropriate for what uh the de a tool for the business development board to do
their job as they were asked. And with that, um, a little personal note. Um, I keep getting asked whether I actually miss, uh, being on the other side of the And by the way, for some reason, I'm more nervous over here than I was over there. >> Everybody is. >> Yeah. It's kind of weird, but um, but I
do miss it. I do miss working with the people in this building. Um, I can't say that there's anybody that I ever worked with being a commissioner that I disliked. And, um, congratulations. There is no more deserving person to be
sitting in your position. Um there is some things I don't miss. Um anyway, u as I walked in this morning. Um so with that said, uh I miss you all. And uh >> Commissioner Caps has a comment here. >> Oh yes. Uh, Commissioner Jenkins, I just
wanted to thank you for your service to Martin County for eight years on this DAS and for being a pillar of the community in Hope Sound. I have a little story to tell. I remember when uh
Commissioner Jenkins ran for office the first time in 2016 and I went to a political forum and he made a statement that I never forgot. He said, "I bleed Hope Sound."
He said, "I bleed Hope Sound." And I I remember that and I I know that to be true and uh I know you have deep feelings for Hobtown and the south part of the county and all of Martin County and thank you again for all you've done. >> With that said, Blake uh or Commissioner
Caps, I'm sorry. Uh you're doing a fantastic job. >> Thank you. And at representing uh Hope Sound and we all appreciate it and everybody and Sarah, I miss you. Ed, I miss you. Stacy, I miss you. Eileen, I've never got to know you, but uh maybe one of these days,
>> but thank you. I appreciate it. >> Mayor Dalo is next, followed by Sarah Lynch. >> That's great. >> Now, it's just the mayor of Indian Town. Yeah, it's big shoes you got to follow. >> Good morning, everybody. Morning. >> Um well, you all know why I'm here and
I've met with most of you. Uh Darren and I, um I'm asking you for your support on this toolkit. You know, I've always said that Indian Town and the Coast Stewart,
the council and the commission are connected. What happens here affects us there. What happens out there affects you here. So the only thing that we can do in Indian Town is good. We can add to your tax base.
We need this toolkit so that we can attract the best of the best and bring some good paying jobs and industry to Indiantown, which is something that we desperately need.
You know, we're building 3,000 homes out there. People going to need a place to go to work. They need a reason to move to Indian Town. And we've got a lot of stuff coming up in the pipeline for our 2100 acres of industrial land.
And you know, there's people waiting in the background to see whether this passes or not. I can tell you that. And um I just just, you know, appreciate your support. Appreciate each and every one of you. And um thank you. Thank you.
>> Thank you. Sarah Lynch is next followed by William Corbin. >> Good morning. >> Morning. >> I'm Sarah Lynch. I'm a commercial banking manager at C Coast Bank and I sit here in Martin County. So I just wanted to share that from a banking perspective, the economic development
toolkit is a smart strategic move for the community. By tying incentives to verified milestones, the program reduces financial risk and it gives lenders confidence in the projects that it supports. It also stimulates significant private investment but streng strengthens our economy and creates high
wage jobs. So programs like tax exempt financing and property tax relief improve project t uh cash flow and the creditworthiness, making businesses more bankable and reducing the default risk. Workforce training grants help employers build a stable talent pipeline and
expedited permitting accelerates the timelines both critical for project success and financial stability. So in short, the toolkit creates a business environment which public um where public incentives and private financing work hand in hand to attract highv value industries and expand our tax base and
ensure that Martin County remains competitive. So it's a win for businesses, it's a win for banks and most importantly a win for the community. So, I hope that you vote in favor of this toolkit. Thanks. >> Thank you. William Corbin is next, followed by John Slatterie.
>> Good morning. >> Good morning, everyone. Hope you're doing well today. Um, William Corbin for the record, executive director for the business development board of Martin County. And, uh, I'm here today to respectfully request that you all uh, vote to adopt the proposed toolkit.
Um the primary mission of the BDB of course is to help strengthen the uh local economy and this proposed toolkit goes a long way to supporting that mission. Um in a competitive environment like the one we're in, we need to make sure that we remain competitive amongst our peers. Uh we've got to capture
capitalize on um a lot of the significant amount of investment expansion relocation decisions that companies are making every day and uh the proposed economic toolkit will help us uh do just that. It features six key incentive policies. Uh each one is
intended to support resilient higherp paying industries that align with county and state strategic economic goals. Industries like advanced manufacturing, additive 3D manufacturing, green industries. The overarching philosophy and goal of
offering economic incentives is really to encourage small businesses uh and entrepreneurs to reinvest and put money back into their companies. And this is made possible by um you know those incentives because the incentives they reduce the business costs right and the
business owners can then put those costs and those savings uh those cost savings rather back into their company to help them become more resilient to grow uh and to thrive. And in turn, the county wins as well because those companies will have increased valuations um and
that will result in increased tax revenues to the county which is a great thing um especially in these times. Finally, most importantly, uh this proposed economic toolkit was designed with the idea of protecting the county from harm. What does that mean? the application process, the compliance
reporting requirements associated with each initiative are pretty extensive um including clawback provisions to protect our taxpayers. And in fact, uh speaking of which, the Martin County Taxpayers Association recently endorsed the adoption of the toolkit uh as well. So, I hope that you'll similarly vote to uh
adopt the toolkit. It will be great to have a meaningful resource like this at our disposal uh as your official economic development partner. So, thank you for your time. >> Thank you. John Slatterie is next, followed by Ted Estie.
>> Hi, my name is John Slatterie. I have a company called Catch Boat Works. We are a brand new startup company that uh is launching our first boat in two weeks. And we just relocated to Martin County from Palm Beach County uh October 1st.
And primarily the reason we did that is because of that guy sitting right there, Troy McDonald, and his boss, William uh Corbin. They courted the heck out of me to come up here. And we were looking for space anywhere from West Palm Beach to
Fort Pierce. Um, and Troy was incredibly helpful about enlightening me about all the benefits of Martin County, including this program. And we're taking full advantage of it. And in fact, um, uh, a bit of optimism, I leased space for only
three years with the intent to, uh, build a building after that lease is up in 3 years and take advantage of this program as well. So, um, they made it happen. They made me come here. Um, we have five employees. I hope to grow that
to 15, um, and, uh, develop my business here in Martin County. And it's all due to those guys. Thank you. Thank you. >> Thank you and welcome. >> Thank you. >> Yeah, Troy McDonald is kind of a big deal. >> Ted Estie is the last request to speak form. If you would like to address us,
please fill out a request to speak form and get it to the baiff. >> Good morning, commissioners. Um, for the record, I'm Ted Stal here representing the economic council Martin County today. Um, as you might imagine, I support this toolkit. Uh, but I just want to say a couple things. You know,
I've watched economic incentives being adopted and used across the state for decades now. Um, and there's always been an argument of uh corporate welfare and giveaways and what I consider to be buying of jobs. Uh, I'm really happy
that this toolkit gets away from paying for jobs and having these strict job requirements is really focused on capital investment. That's how the government runs is on the taxes and we have always advocated for a diversification of our tax base to add
to the commercial [clears throat] industrial tax base so that those taxes can be used to offset the residential tax burden for our community. But to do that, it often takes some enticing and some incentives to make that work. I think that the way this toolkit is
written where it's a performance-based payment, it's not a payment upfront. We're not laying out cash. You receive the payments for those development review PE fees, the impact fees, all the rest of it. And you get reimbursed based on performance. Um, so that takes a lot
of the risk out of the program. It it really is basically taking what they've paid and giving it back um versus upfronting cash for anybody. and it's not paying for jobs. It's paying for the capital investment that's without this
may not happen. But getting people to come in and make those large capital investments. And yes, there's, you know, for instance, the state uh referendum that was passed locally twice now um has a timeline and it gradually decreases
the value of that incentive. But that gives a company time to grow and be able to afford to pay those taxes on that program. And often that capital equipment in the ter terms of tangible personal property ends its useful life within that time period and they
reinvest in new capital. So the value goes back up even though the percentage that they get discounted has gone down. Uh they reinvest and the number goes back up. So it's it pays back fairly quickly uh to the community. And I really like the fact that it's based on
capital not just jobs. The jobs will come. people would create the jobs they need to create, but in incentivizing the capital investment in this community that will stay here, especially when they start constructing buildings is is so very important and is actually quite innovative in the state of Florida. So again, I urge you to pass this today. So
thank you. >> And ma'am, >> Madam Chair, I apologize. Uh legal pointed out very one of my mistakes already. Um I failed to mention that also attached to the board item is a policy ordinance uh update. Basically the higher level perspective of this is
that it officially implements the toolkit as your central economic development uh platform and requires regular review by the board. It also clarifies the board's authority to levy levy annually an advorum tax not to exceed.1 mil. Um and really basically
the other two changes are it does allow for the county advalorum tax exemption to be issued countywide. current interpretation of that ad valorum exemption under the current ordinance is that we only incentivize non um non-municipal or those that are outside
of a city or a town as well as um the other change would be it does require periodic reporting of the economic development trust fund as well as the reporting of any type of incentives through uh transparency and formal agreements. So if you have any want to go dig any deeper, Mr. Fox will be more
than happy to answer any questions. >> [laughter] >> whether he likes it or not, >> Miss Elder. >> And just for the record to clarify that this is a public hearing and we're actually amending our ordinances, chapter 71, article two of the general ordinances and the amended ordinances
attached to the agenda item that um delineates Mr. Stokus' changes that he explained. [cough] >> Questions or comments? [clears throat] Commissioner Vargas, >> I got a lot of questions. I've been
looking at this very, very carefully and I do get outside information. So, um, you're stating here that you're going to levy an additional tax in Martin County to support this. Could you clarify that, please?
>> No, ma'am. Your economic trust fund is bud is is budgeted through your normal budget process. The ornish says that the board has the ability if they would like to do so. I'm not recommending [clears throat] that at all. >> I just paid my taxes yesterday. I went down to the tax office so I could
formally do it. There wasn't a person there said I love my tax bill. >> Not at all. Um the other thing is on uh 114 clawback provision. If a project fails to meet the terms of the bond agreement or does not proceed as
planned, assuming after you're giving them this tax relief and also financing at a lower rate and everything else that you have under these different um headings here, the
county may require repayment of funds or implement other penalties as stipulated in the bond agreement. Why doesn't it say will must? This is developed through the industrial development authority which is a separate entity that issues bonds and it's heavily regulated through
state statutes. Um I don't Mr. Corbin is the secretary for the IDA. He may be able to appine on that but my understanding is each uh lending instrument has its own provisions and clawbacks based on the specific bond that's issued to by the industrial
development authority. >> Did you have a question? Yeah, that was the question. >> What was Can you repeat the question? >> I said, why does it say the county may instead of will must. It's talking about the county. It's not talking about somebody else who's lending money >> if the project fails. If the project
fails, if >> they close up, >> this is uh this is for the IDA we're referring to, correct? Is that right? >> Correct. >> Yeah. So, the industrial development authority, [clears throat] their capacity is to issue tax exempt bonds for projects that qualify under them. So this would be a one of the tools that is
utilized um you know as part of our county toolkit uh that's less direct than some of the other tools in here. So this is this tool is essentially through the industrial development authority to which we are the secretary uh to that board.
>> Yeah, I understand that. Okay. Um I understand what you're saying here. However, um I can tell you Kroger has pulled out of Lake County. They gave them all these incentives plus tax relief. >> And now that commission is uh charged
with uh trying to claw back. >> Mhm. >> So how are you going to do this? We're not in a climate the businesses are expanding. Also PepsiCo, this is only in Florida. They employed at least 500 people. >> Okay. >> And the same with Kroger and they have
LLC's and maybe our legal department can address that too. They have different entities. How are you going to handle that? >> Well, the clawback provisions are all um you know in the toolkit. >> Oh, tell me about them. Tell us about them. >> I'll defer to the the county to tell uh
to talk to that to that more. Uh the consultant has >> so that >> created that uh the clawback provisions in them themselves. So I think there are different ones that apply to different differently. So, Madam Chair, I think it's important to note that the Industrial Development Authority issues
[clears throat] bonds, tax-free exempt bonds on behalf of the board of county commissioners as the Martin County Industrial Development Authority. You all appoint the members of that IDA. Each bond has its own agreement and has its own specific clawbacks based on that
business deal. So, when those are issued, it has to follow, I believe, SEC regulations. There's federal regulations that go with it. So the clawbacks staff can't answer to you what the specific clawbacks would be based on default. Those clawbacks as I understand it are
written as a part of each individual agreement, a bond agreement as it's issued to the company. So for your example, Commissioner, if if the IDA were to issue a bond to Kroger and Kroger then defaulted, the IDA and its
legal, which also has its own separate council other than the county attorney, they would then go and work forward based on those clawback provisions that are stated and stipulated within the bond agreement. Um the the the toolkit
does not the toolkit is merely a it's [snorts] a guide that presents to each at the end of the day each the board of county commissioners will vote on each incentive package and within those packages are the clawback provisions. So
for the IDA those clawbacks are going to be different based on because of the bonding um as it would be different than say the opportunity fund or the local closing fund because those are have performance objectives and it's it's perform then pay whereas with the IDA
bond there's obviously a bonding there's payment it's heavily regulated through state and federal statutes and then the clawbacks are stipulated in that agreement. Okay. So, if I'm a business and I find my way by myself to Martin County >> because they do businesses, we have the Florida Department of Commerce. I've
been to that those facilities, those offices up in Tallahassee. >> And then you say, "Okay, you're eligible." Which one would that be if you're going to exempt them from taxes, I think, up to 10 years. Is that correct? >> Adalorum. >> So, so that would be the voter approved
Advalorum referendum program that's been around for more than probably about 12 years now. >> That's right. It has. Okay. So now um my business fails. >> So how do I get that money back to the taxpayers? >> Well, Commissioner, first of all, staff doesn't approve that. That would be this
body, the board of county commissioners. And if you go to again, the toolkit's not going to specifically mention all of the clawbacks, but get to it. Okay.
>> [clears throat] >> If the um if the exemption is revoked, the property appraiser, so if the business is no longer able to meet the definition or the business fails to file the required annual report or the business fails to fulfill any of the conditions, in other words, they go out of business, the property appraiser will
assist in recovering of any taxes that were improperly exempted. And those clawback provisions would be stipulated in the specific package that occurs when you approve that. So again, the toolkit's not going to specifically speak to the actual clawbacks. Those
clawback provisions are voted on on a separate package that was presented to that company that found its way to Martin, you know, company XYZ. You as a body will vote on that, which also includes the clawback provisions and the strength of those clawback provisions for the advalorum exemption.
>> Yeah. Okay. Um so we'll have to see when that that comes through because um this is not a climate to be expanding. I'm talking about PepsiCo. They're a large large concern and um they made a decision to go to another state. They're streamlining. They're
more mechanized. They don't need the workforce and that's the way things are going, you know, with AI. Um the other thing I have I'm really concerned about is they talked about data centers. What what what is a data center? Could you tell me? I think I know, but I want you
to tell me. >> Well, >> information centers. Yeah, there's different types of data centers and it's really all about >> well tell us about them. >> I will you I will defer to the definition that's found within the state statutes that I referenced 100 megawatt use. I
>> think between the BDB and I would also say our partners at FPNL could probably give you a better definition. I'm not as techsavvy. I just know that commonly they're called data centers. Um and then when you go to the opportunity fund that would be under the pilot program. I
defined that eligible data centers are those that are ex I I this this definition was derived from the state statutes where they the state is exempting sales tax data centers meaning exceeding the 100 megawatt threshold uh
may be considered for payment in le of tax arrangement with Martin County subject to county approval and negotiation. >> Okay. So, we're talking about an entity that uses an extreme amount of electric power, uh, water. Um, we're talking
about it could be noise pollution. Also, in the event of a power outage, there are large diesel generators that have to go on. Where would you be putting something like this? >> Well, that would be based on where the business would like to locate. I believe that with my very limited knowledge of
data centers, they need to be in close proximity to 500 megawatt lines, which I believe I think believe run through Indian Town. I'm not exactly 100% certain on that, but like every single incentive, it will be brought together as a package and you as the board of county commissioners will vote to not
vote as to whether or not it meets or exceeds your needs uh or demands for incentives. >> Okay. Indian Town doesn't have enough water. I spoke to the principles there and they well we're figuring it out. That's that's nebulous. I figuring it
out doesn't doesn't work. You know they incorporated everybody applauded and that's a wonderful thing but what went wrong? where was the planning for this and now you're asking us to say sure let's go ahead and just rubber stamp this and put this through this toolkit
um and which includes data centers uh which I already mentioned to you and I learned a whole lot more about data centers I wouldn't want to live near one I know a lot of ranchers are very upset about that the farmland also and we're talking about outwestern Martin County this is not Martin County uh we're
changing this entirely I mean you're talking about a huge huge amount a huge amount of finite water. They don't even have it. They're building how many homes? [clears throat] >> Thousand, give or take. >> Oh, she's right in the back there. The mayor is right there. Uh and and the
manager is there, too. Um he's back there. Um so, where are the answers to this? >> The answers to what? >> What I just asked. >> What was the question again? >> Oh my goodness. I'm talking about the the water. I can't I can't answer that
question. Uh but with the electricity, you know, that's an FPL question. Similarly, I know different areas are working on ways to solve their particular um you know, challenges, whatever that might be. >> Okay, but but that's an answer that's kind of like fluffy. Okay, I need substance. How are they going to resolve
the present water situation? Lack of >> I don't have that answer. >> Okay. Well, you should if you're in the business development. You should if you're promoting this I would do my homework for this. You have to have an answer but just to say well we're resolving it and that was the
answer I was given. >> I think I can answer that. >> Oh good. Okay. So we're in the process right now of starting new wells and we're in the process of design for a
reverse osmosis plant. We're also upgrading our current facility that should give us probably about 30% more capacity than what we have right now. Uh hopefully this will all be completed
within the next 18 to 20 months. So, so far up to date, the state has given us $77 million and there's another number that's being the ask that will finish what we
started. I'm not going to give you that number, but it's it's up there. And um so our water problem, we realize we have a problem with capacity, but we realize
that the people that own the plant before the village purchased it did nothing for it. Indian Town has been neglected. I've been out there for 33 years serving the public. 33 years. I know Indian Town
like the back of my hand. I know where the potholes are. know where the good guys are. I know where the bad guys are. Indian Town was Oh, that's way out west. That's another county. Taxes came from
Indiantown to Stewart, but never went back to Indian Town. Those people out there didn't have anything. I I have to drive to Stewart or to Palm Beach Gardens to go have a steak in a cowboy town. So, we don't have anything out there,
but we're getting it. It's coming. Our infrastructure [snorts] is being built. We have a plan. And if if if a data center wants to come to Indian Town, we will do everything everything. I will do
everything that I could possibly do to make sure that they're successful. As it is with any other industry. Now, I've spoken to you individually about a company that's called >> Renco, >> okay, that has a 50,000 square foot
facility that is just about ready to get to producing synthetic block for building houses, but they can only build 60,000 homes out of that plant. So, I'm trying to entice them to come to Indian Town and build 150,000 square foot facility.
That facility in Palm Beach has got $60 million in equipment in it. Times that by three. That's what we're looking at here. That's why I'm so for that's why I'm I'm here. That's why we met with just about
all of you to explain all that. And um you know we intend the village intends this passes here. We intend to put it back on our ballot for August and
we are going to market it and we're going to do exactly what this toolkit is is to do. I mean this is a great toolkit. I also sit on the business development board
and uh they worked hard to put this together and it's a great tool and you have nothing to lose because the great part of this whole plan is that you all get to make the decisions and put whatever you want to put into the mix of
it. Can I ask you a question? No. Okay. [laughter] Well, you know, you have the opportunity to do what you have to do with whoever comes before you. So, it it's not a
losing situation. It's a winning winning situation. Otherwise, I wouldn't be here talking about it. Thank you. >> Well, yeah, there are some things you have control of and some you don't. Um, and you certainly have no control over about what's happening externally with
the economy. Businesses are pulling in. They're not expanding. You may have small businesses and small businesses are the backbone of our country. I get that. I've had small businesses. And you know, as a business owner, you've got to run your company. You have to manage
expenses, which government should be run more like a business. You have to understand your industry, your niche market. Um, you have to hire and manage the employees if if you have some. I understand this could be up to a sole proprietor down to a sole proprietor. Is that correct? You eliminated some of the
barriers here. >> I I'm not sure cuz >> everybody needs to be sure. The thing is that you have to market to your customers and you got to develop a strategy for your retirement eventually. A lot of people just look to their business for the retirement. So I understand what's involved as being a business owner. I've been doing it many
years. Many years. Okay. Since I've been 18, not that long ago. But anyway, having said that, the thing is that the water runoff, how it's collected, it's filtered if you know before
discharge. Uh we're talking about high-capacity wires, transformers, transmission lines as part of the infrastructure. And it can be a grouping of these data centers or it can be one monolithic data. I wouldn't want to live
near one. I wouldn't tell somebody. But you don't even have the fundamental in place and you you want us to go ahead and approve that included that type of business included here. >> I I I I don't see that >> there's there's all types of businesses.
>> I understand it could be the gentleman that spoke about his voting business. I understand. I'm a Florida native. I totally get that. I've been a voter. All of that. I understand that. And that's wonderful. That's wonderful. But the point is, you have to have more control over what you're asking. And I mean this
respectfully, you are building a lot of homes out there. You don't have the capacity. Where are you suggesting that we put data centers? I don't know. Maybe Mr. Corbin can explain. If it's not Indian Town, where would it be?
Here. a vacant parcel of land that's in town. You know, we don't know enough about the data centers yet. We have some information, but I've asked him, he doesn't have the answers. So, that makes me leery. I don't like to decide on
something so quickly. >> I think the data center I'm sorry, I think the data center is an example. >> Okay. There's no guarantee the data center is coming to India. >> I believe as of today. >> Okay. I understand Carmine. I believe I understand. I like you. I really do. I do like you. Okay.
>> All right. Thank you. I hope I've answered your question. >> No, because >> 18 months, you'll have nice clean water coming out of a uh brand new facility. >> But you but you drink the cup of water first before I do. Okay. But here here's the thing. It's included in here as a
description of the type of business coming and we don't know enough about that. Indian Town is not prepared to receive that. Yes, I know about 18 months and they can do fasttrack construction. I' I've read this. I understand about the bonds. I understand about the money, the workforce grants.
Uh you say there's a fund that uh we're already putting in from Adalorum to be able to support this this venture, this next venture, lowering uh lower borrowing costs, but it's clean technology, information technology, that would be a data center. Global logistics
and trade, it could be an offshoot of that also. I don't know enough about this and I don't like to make quick decisions. I mean, this board has in the past done this and I hope that they're paying attention and listening. We're talking about I'm talking about two major companies that have pulled out.
You can call those commissioners and see Miami Dade County did this a number of years ago. It was a disaster. It didn't pan out. Oh, there's going to be a lot of tax revenue. It'll be wonderful for the community. It got to be like a ghost town >> in some of the areas that were constructed. So, you know what what's
that expression? Um what is it? decide in haste, repent at leisure, words to that effect. Um, people can find their way to Martin County. I think Indian Town and and I will never say it's way out there. Again, I was corrected by by one of your uh commissioners. Uh, but it
it's it's a pleasant place to live uh for somebody who likes that peaceful tran tranquility. you have your certain section and I toured that with you where you're going to have your industries but when you include something as these centers and I say can be a
grouping or a huge building that's something that that we cannot do we cannot do and you can only grow as fast as you can provide the finite resources you can only grow that fast so this may not be the moment for this um a
toolkit can be spread across uh different areas. There might be warehousing and they find their way here. But when you're talking about just build build, build bill build without any consideration as to what that's doing more to the citizens of Martin
County and the traffic. I got stuck in huge traffic this morning. Not certain if I'd make this meeting and I left on time, but everybody has their interest and I understand Florida Power and Light has their interest. There's the corridor from St. Lucy County, Martin County, and West Palm Beach. And that would be their
dream to be able to build that, but that may not be right for Martin County. So that those are my comments so far about this and and the heat that it gives off also these centers. You can't deny this. Cannot deny this. Anybody
who's to the sound of my voice. So >> yeah, my turn. >> Yeah. I just want to go through some of the the incentives here. Let's look first of all at the opportunity fund which gives a um a business mill up to a million dollars worth of incentives. Uh
getting breaks on development review fees, building permit fees, impact fees, utility connection fees. Um those things are not going to be provided for free. Staff is still going to have to review them. They are not going to be volunteering their time. So if we're
giving an incentive of million dollars to each business that applies for this, then taxpayers are going to be on the hook. So I I disagree. This is corporate welfare. It's being paid for by the taxpayers. Um the monitoring is
insufficient. The annual reportage is insufficient. Um the local closing fund creates incentives up to a million dollars I think also um for infrastructure
improvements um roads uh utilities other public services. Somebody's paying for those. We're not going to be providing those things for free. And if we're giving an incentive to a business then the taxpayers are picking up the bill. This
is true. expedited permitting. Once again, if we're expediting permitting, we're using staff time and efforts in order to expedite the permitting. If the business is getting a break, somebody's paying
for it, and that someone who's paying for it is the taxpayer. Um, and then the training and workforce grants. I I don't know where to start except that there's transportation
assistance, there's child care support, there's apprenticeship or inter or or internship programs. Who wouldn't love to have what business wouldn't love to have all those things provided for free? It's not free. It's the taxpayers who
are going to be paying for those industrial development authority bonds are just go way way way too far. And then uh finally the the uh the ordinance uh
funding the um economic development fund is is a is is it's uh millage that's levied on your tax bill. That's >> right. >> In order to create uneven advantages for businesses. So, so if if a person moves
into Martin County and buys a house for a million dollar, buys a house for $10 million, what kind of incentive do they get for making that investment in Martin County? You know, this this reminds me so much of the biotech frenzy um about 15 years
ago. man, there were the the the government, local governments uh south of us and north of us were giving away taxpayer money like crazy. How successful and the taxpayers paid for it. >> And how Yeah. What happened to those
those uh biotech companies that came? They went, you know, this is this is just a um yeah, this is this is too too risky for me. The taxpayers are bearing all the responsibility. Uh the taxpayers are
paying all of the bills. This is is one of the worst proposals that has ever come across my desk. Commissioner Campy, >> that's quite an introduction from me. [clears throat]
I happened to be here last time when the toolkit came up. The room is echoing similar to what some of it was said back then. I think there's an important piece of the new pie that people are not thinking about
and it'll be coming very apparent in the next 12 months. Florida is poised to become the first state in the United States to eliminate the collection of property taxes on homesteaded home residents.
The cornerstone of that plan for the shortfall in revenue would be made up by non-homesteaded properties and businesses. That's the plan. I've been watching and doing a lot of research on this. Now, even after you doge every
single county from top to bottom, there's still going to be expenses that the residents are going to require those services. Public safety is obviously the obvious one and every county is a little
bit different. We really uh uh support environmental protection and and the protection of our natural lands as part of it. Martin County has purchased thousands of acres and are continuing to do that and we cheering about it. but
they need to be maintained and so even after a full doge there will be expenses that have to be paid. So the first portion of the people that will pick up the tab now listen it's going to be on the it's going to be a referendum and I've been telling people if you saw a
ballot language that said would you like to pay property taxes yes or no everyone's going to say no. Everyone everyone up here I would bet too. Now, there are some, you know, like what would that entail? But if I live in Ohio, and this is where
I have my second home, the first thing I do is become homesteaded resident in Florida. Because if I'm already paying the taxes in Ohio, as an example, I would homestead here. So, I would think that whatever that that chunk of non-homesteaded
residents are that we're going to rely on that money from, a lot of them will have a very easy path to now also join us as homesteaded residents. And good for them. So, who's left? Businesses. Commercial and industrial
businesses. That will be the cornerstone of where the revenue will come from. Even after you've stripped away and went really draconian and stripped away all of the things that one percentage or another will say is not important to the
government's day-to-day operation. There still will be expenses. So the average healthy balance of industrial in a community is 10%. That's what I've heard from my economic
expert. Ours is 4%. We've always been sort of behind the eightball. We've never wanted to be Palm Beach or St. Lucy and we haven't been for all the doom and gloom
of the last toolbox and how the counties run away. This morning we had an example where our finance director has shaved down $7 million worth of prepaying um loans and and different things that we've done because that's the way the
county operates. Oh, there she is right there. I see you. Um we're very conservative community. when you heard about the the um biotech or other big uh businesses that were
looking in Martin County and I won't use an example because but it's a very well-known example of a entertainment industry company wanted to come our way and they weren't even asking for much
from us at the time you know early negotiations meetings But just knowing the nature of Martin County, the the the makeup of the board, the makeup of the staff didn't work. Never came here. Shot right
o right over our heads into St. Lucy County and agreed. It's easy to remember the failures because they're the ones that make the headlines. This one didn't work, but we didn't do it. So, it's not like we have some crazy track record of just throwing money up in the air and
seeing who grabs it. We are that conservative county. However, to have no strategy as we enter into this brand new world, which I don't have a crystal ball, but I would guess we might be the first state that won't have a property tax. Remember, we also don't have income
tax. Only seven states in the United States don't have income tax, personal income tax. So now we could be sitting up here a year, 18 months from now wondering like what are we going to do? We've always had a difficult time. I
remember once with a business in Palm City, one of our biggest businesses in Palm City, technological company had a long, long history and there were rumors in the neighborhood that the woman that owned it was looking to move it to St. Lucy County because they were literally
just offering her all sorts of incentives. And so I met with her and so did some of our staff and what she really needed was parking. Her main issue to depart Martin County and Palm City specifically was there. She could not get enough parking for her
employees. As the business grew, she couldn't do it. And so she said to me, "Ed, they're rolling the red carpet out for us in St. Lucy County." I said, "Mary, we don't even own a red carpet. We can't do it." But what we were able
to do is work with our staff in growth management and and engineering and legal and and we created an opportunity for her to buy a derelict shopping center that had tremendous amount of parking. And not only did she not move into there and close up where she was, she expanded
into there. So if we want to talk about success stories or failures, we have we could go all day long. I know this one worked, this one didn't, this one worked, this one didn't. What we're discussing today is not the specifics of an individual project that is looking
for financial opportunities. I get the concept of corporate welfare. I get the concept last time when people said, and I was a small business owner, what about the business, whether it's a family or a corporation, that didn't get
any incentives, that just pulled it off on their own and they did it. Well, a rising tide lifts all boats because I've never had any of them say to me, "Well, I'm furious at them. I didn't get it, so why should they get it?" Because if you're looking at a community, there's
plenty of people pay school taxes that don't have any kids in school because it's for the betterment of the community. There are people that pay, you know, fire rescue taxes. And God bless them, they will never call 911 in
their entire lives. And good for them, but they still pay because it's for the betterment of the community. What I have found sadly in Martin County and it's a very small minority is people that are selfish. I, you know, we're called the selfish capital of the world. Sometimes
I say we're the selfish capital of the world because if you don't play golf, you don't want golf courses. And if you're kids and you don't go to the beach, you don't think there should be lifeguards on the beach. And if you don't use the library, there should not be libraries. But luckily the majority
of us feel that to for the community to be what we want and there are non-financial advantages to living in a beautiful community and there are financial advantages for everyone. So my concern is that all we're discussing here today and there it's
again I'm going to say this repeated. Thank God there's five of us because there's five different unique all of us elected all of us up here sometimes brand new sometimes a long time to sort of you know represent the
public and I hear from my colleagues and you know some of it I agree with and some of it I disagree with but my perspective is that yes we need to have some of these opportunities available will we use them will we hand them out
like Christmas cards? I don't think so. We have no history of that whatsoever. The board makeup here is very unique. Is five very diverse personalities up here, sets of circumstances, business experience,
uh, moral compasses. There's a lot going on up here, which is a safety net. It's a guardrail for us. So, I don't look at this as like, oh my god, this is a terrible idea. I think this is literally the clever name of a tool in a toolkit is that's all it is.
maybe we don't use the tools, maybe we use a specific tool. Now, we got really deep into data centers. And I heard a mixed message. I heard that the future of business that is potentially frightening for some is AI.
The only way AI works is through data centers. So, they literally go hand in hand. So, if you want to talk about the value, if that's your thing, of AI, and it's not going away, you know, when people said, "Why would I need to access
the internet on my phone? Why would I need to do anything but hit send and end?" That's where we are now. We're, and I'm not, you know, I'm not some expert in this, but I, anyone that's paying attention knows AI is the
way. It'll be in every industry. The only way AI happens is data centers. And the Martin County AI needs are not going to be powered by a da d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d d da in North Carolina. They literally
have to be very close to where the AI requirements are. The data is required. That's why they are close to uh electrical trans transmission lines. I don't know if they'll go to Indian Town, but I will tell you from a water point
of view, the modern data centers are closed loop. They're not evaporative cooling systems. They're closed loop. They do not generate a tremendous or require a tremendous amount of water. They're relatively quiet. They do not
require a tremendous amount of employees. So, it's one of the biggest buildings that will have the fewest employees because it doesn't require it's technological. It's not manpower, which some people are mad at because they're like, "Well, we
want to hire people." So, just using that as an example, that's not the boogeyman in the room today. It was just an example, but it's an important example because we're going to be spending all five of us and all of you a tremendous amount talking about AI
and data centers for the rest of our lives. It's just the way. So, you either participate or you don't. And in terms of what our next door neighbors to the south and the north are doing, they have offered up cautionary tales of what we
should not be doing. But let's call a spade a spade. They've offered up a tremendous amount of success stories. And so whether you like economic development or not, our tax base will require us to diversify much more than
we have in the past. We're going to really need to do some handholding. I get that people can find Martin County on their own. And the biggest advantage we had in the years past, and those of you that are in this business, St. Lucy County really rolled out the red carpet.
What Martin had that St. Lucy County didn't have is we had excellent schools and St. Lucy County didn't. We still have excellent schools, but St. Lucy County does now, too. So, the concept of they will have to live here, but they'll
work and build their businesses there. That doesn't help us from a tax base. So, I think respectfully of my colleagues, we're going to disagree. We're going to agree to disagree on this. I think it's an important step forward. I hope we have not demoralized the folks that came and spent their
mornings to sort of cheer this on because it's important and I will make a motion to accept staff's recommendation. >> Commissioner Heatherington. >> Yep. >> Thank you for all of that. I I'm going to keep it brief. I had written down property tax exemption because I I agree wholeheartedly with what you said. We
are going to be finding new ways um as this next legislative session occurs and unique ways to um support the infrastructure in our communities. And I do believe that that we are going to um see some major changes in the way
property taxes are collected. So time will tell on that. And I think that means it's incumbent upon us to support economic development to diversify our tax base because right now residential taxpayers are carrying a very very
heaven heavy burden in Martin County and um I watched many years ago I wasn't on the board but um as the mayor was up there from Indiantown I remember Indiantown had a thriving industrial community years and years ago.
thriving with the steel mill and the citrus industry. But if you watch what when citrus started being completely eliminated because of greening and all those industries, you started to see them disappear.
I don't believe that we've done enough to attract new industry and economic development. So you watch how you know and Indiantown kudos to you. you have done a lot to provide resources. I
watched when Ecogen um was not attracted to Indian Town and that was the catalyst to incorporation and you wanting to control your own destiny and I think you've done a real good job. My my family still lives in
Indian Town. I'm there quite frequently. So, I think that's just an example to me that we have to for our entire tax base of Martin County support economic development. And while I don't think that this toolkit is perfect, I don't
think much of it will be used, but I do believe it's a tool and I think it's important that we have it in our toolkit and I think it's prudent that some of all of this is going to come back before this board. So I will support it and I
think it's in again it's necessary and incumbent in order to diversify our tax base and not have the residential taxpayers paying the the complete burden in Martin County. So I'll second commissioner caps.
>> Yes. Um you know in Martin County we're really into our quality of life and preserving the Martin County difference. And I often think about how that's not cheap. That's that's kind of
expensive. If if we want to fix our environment, if we want to have preservation lands that are taken care of and maintained, uh you need an expanding tax base to pay
for it. uh you know the economy and the environment have to work hand in hand and uh I think our last budget cycle shows how we live in an in an inflationary
economy and whether we like it or not uh budgets are rising all in local governments all over the state of Florida that gets a lot of attention these days but it's it's a reality
You know, the amount of money that it costs to pave a mile of asphalt has massively increased in the last few years. And that's just a tiny example. Think about what has happened with the cost of your
homeowners insurance. Uh think about uh so many other things. the cost of food, the cost of fuel, all these things are always on the rise. And if you don't have some additional
revenue coming in, you don't stand a chance of of keeping up. You know, in business, we've learned over the years there are two ways to to balance your budget. You can uh chip away at expenses or you can or you can make some more
money. And uh you need to do both if you're going to have a successful business enterprise. And I think we have to adopt that same mindset when it comes to economic development in a community and
in a local uh county. So I think we need to be concerned about economic development to hedge against inflation and also to hedge against uh what is probably coming from Tallahassee
uh very soon with tax reform. So and I think it's important to remember too that that we are in a competition if we want any kind of business or economic development coming to Martin County. Uh these companies have options
and they're looking at those options and they're they're narrow it down, you know, uh to a smaller and smaller group of finalists and they they make a decision
u that is attractive to them. And if we don't if we don't have any mechanism to compete with that reality uh we won't we won't have any businesses coming and um and we will suffer with a diminishing
tax base. So, I think this is a solid plan and I'm going to support it. And um and one thing I thought I would mention from the the motion maker, uh should that motion include the changes that
staff has recommended. >> Motion maker agrees. >> Second, >> Mr. Vargas, >> our country is 37 trillion in debt and my phone lines might write up. No, Miss Vargas, it's 38 trillion. Okay. Well,
I'm in the arena of that. Business failures are on the rise. Um, I'm very familiar with the closed loop system, by the way, for data centers. Um, very familiar with that. But I do want to say every time someone is given a dollar,
someone else is working hard to provide that dollar. And this is what they called it, corporate welfare. This is not this toolkit. It needs work.
I I won't support something like this. I've been in business both here and overseas and I know what it takes. And I just recited it to you what a business owner has to go through constantly. It's not a oneandone. And I've asked questions of the business development
board of Martin County. They couldn't answer my questions. That's what they do all day long, I assume. But I certainly did my homework on this and um with data centers, my understanding is you have to change it requires a change of the county comprehensive plan. Yeah, there's a lot of caveats here. It's not all just, you
know, it's a shiny new object, you know, this thing and everybody's going to come and everybody's going to be successful and some businesses may and some may not. So then if we don't have a residential tax that goes away, and by the way, I'm very familiar with that some of the proposals which I'll talk about later on. Um then and if the
business folds then what then what happens next? Who takes care of the services that we demand and should be entitled to here as residents in Martin County whether we're taxpayers or not? We have staff that we have to support
too and staff time is taken away. Everything that our chairwoman heard has said I agree with and I cannot support this toolkit as it stands right now. There are too many unknowns. >> There's a motion and a second. All those
in favor? >> I >> opposed. Opposed. >> That motion passes three to two with commissioners Vargas and her dissenting. We are now going to take a break and we are going to return at 2 o'clock. Part: 2
We are taking up our preset which is the [clears throat] Indian River Lagoon economic valuation and here to introduce the the uh item is John mail presumably. >> Yes. >> Uh John Male uh environmental resources
division. I am uh happy to introduce u Valerie >> Sidell >> Syidell um who uh came on a request from Commissioner Heatherington who heard her presentation Courtney's presentation to the Indian River Lagoon Council last
month on the economic impact of ecology restoration in um Indian River Lagoon. It was a fantastic presentation. It's great science and it substantiates the investment that um all the local governments, the state and the feds make in in the estate restoration. So, I'm I
was pleased to to have them be available to come give that presentation to you. >> Welcome, Miss Sidell. >> Thank you. >> Afternoon. >> Good afternoon. Thank you, commissioners, for this opportunity. Um again, I'm Valerie Sidell and Courtney Cortez is here with me today as well.
So, thank you for this opportunity. Uh we've been working with the IRL NEP over the past year to update their economic impact study. The last time it was this analysis was completed was in 2016. It was you know well um overdue. And the
previous economic impact analysis was your standard um in direct indirect induced uh type of economic impact study. And this time Dwayne Def the director there really wanted more of a focus on the ecosystem services which is after all what we value from the lagoon.
So we really took the approach of focusing on the ecosystem services. Oops. Okay. Told myself I had to do that the other way. There we go. Okay. So Lagoonwide um we used what's called Invest. This is
a model that specifically looks at the valuation of ecosystem services and find that lagoon wide over 940,000 acres of preserved land and natural lands are retaining more than a 100red billion gallons of flood water annually. That's waters that would otherwise be in our
homes and our roads and so forth. 52,000 acres are providing additional coastal protection because of uh collecting storm surge and so forth. 360,000 acres are providing water filtration and purification services. And all told, these lands and waters generate habitat,
aesthetic, and recreational values. And when we look at these across the different services that they provide based on very detailed mapping of vegetation and habitats that are there, we find over 10 billion dollars in annual ecosystem services and economic
values provided. and that ranges from $3.7 million in commercial fishing all the way up to $6 billion in recreational activities, shoreline, boating, and so forth and including property values. So, I'll talk a little bit about uh the individual values. So, we looked at each
of these across the data that's available using um GIS mapping and published values. And so, for example, for coastal protection, we're looking at the difference in the exposure to coastal hazards with and without these
natural protective processes intact. So, if you basically, if you paved over the lagoon, what would you what would you have um left there? And so, we use very detailed land cover data from Fish and Wildlife to estimate these coastal protection habitats. uh in the map that
you see here. This is a a little screenshot of zoom in nearquesta right there near the county line and it's showing in this case some mangroves and oyster beds and how those are mapped. So when we look at these across the lagoon that's about 52,000 acres of habitats that provide this coastal protection
that generates almost a quarter of a billion dollars a year in protective economic value. And the Noah funded projects that are underway currently are projected to add an additional $8.4 $4 million annually.
When we look at water filtration, similarly, we can look at the different types of habitat and vegetation and how they process nutrients and provide water filtration purification services for us. And these are, mind you, services that we would otherwise have to provide through some built, you know,
infrastructure or otherwise. So, we have about 360,000 acres across these different habitat types. And that's generating more than half a billion dollars in public value annually. The Noah funded projects that are currently underway are estimated to add about $38
million alone in annual value. When we look at wildlife habitat, we all know that flityians have consistently um shown a preference for strong preservation of wildlife habitat. And again, using the FWC land cover data, we can see the different habitat types that
the public has placed a high value on. All told, these generate more than a billion dollars annually in public values. And I want to just pause there for a moment. That's a big number. And I want to state that we used conservative estimates across all of these. So in
every instance, there are higher and lower values that you can use um across these values. And we have taken the lower bound so that there's room for recognizing that you know there's estimates. These are all estimates. And if you look on the right there, you can see the map and that's showing how these
ecosystem services vary by basin and by type. So anywhere from $435,000 in one of the subbasins up to $90 million in annual services. And then finally in aesthetic values or property values. This is kind of the
cold hard cash. So again, if you paved over the lagoon, what would that house be worth if it were sitting there without the lagoon next to it versus with? And so we're able to tease out, for example, if you have a threebed, two bath home with a pool in a certain school district and it's next to lagoon
versus if it's not, we're able to tease out that value of that proximity to the lagoon. And this, of course, values varies county to county. So in the in the maps here, you can see in Bard, for example, being very close to the lagoon adds about $350,000 to the average um
sales price, all other factors being equal. In Palm Beach County, it's almost um a million dollars. And when we look across the lagoon by county, you can see there in Martin County, we have um almost $3 billion, just over $3 billion
in added value for waterfront um properties that we can attribute to the lagoon. We can annualize these values um using a cap rate and that's generating economic flows of about $350 million every year to local coffers lagoon wide.
um this adds up to about $22.9 billion. That sounds like a lot, but you know, for context, each of these counties is close to hundred billion by themselves. So, um annualized that adds about $1.4 billion to uh Florida's economy.
And then we also looked at benefit cost analysis across the uh Noah funded projects. And we looked across the lagoon. So we tried to pick examples that were not the most extreme case of any of these particular types of restoration or of any of the particular
um locations so that we were distributed across the lagoon north, south uh and so forth and one for each um primary habitat type and we estimated their total costs over 10 years as well as their estimated total benefits over 10 years. So you can see in the first
example, salt the salt marsh habitat uh the example was Karen Bay. The total costs are estimated about $380,000. The total benefits over 10 years in current dollars are estimated about 2 um $7 million. And they vary, you know, by
by type and by location. So when we look at all of them, you can see there on the left how they sort themselves out. You can see the two uh outliers there. Be gone point marsh and um the national wildlife refuge pieces. Those are both
where we are removing impoundment. So we'll really be restoring fish passage in a really transformational way. And so the return on investment there is huge because they are transformational. They're having large areas of impact across a large number of habitats. But
even if you took those out of this entirely, um the return on investment would be about 10 t times the dollar. So for every dollar you spend, you're getting 10 times back. Including them overall, these projects are estimated about 24x. So for every dollar we're
spending on these habitat restorations, the public is receiving return of about $24. And then finally, we did also look at um the standard sort of economic impact study. And this is looking at spending uh within Lagoon. So that direct
spending impact and then we margin that out for things that don't happen locally. So for example, if you buy a gallon of gas, we don't make gas here. So most of that money leaves the local community. So we margin that out. And then we looked at look at how much of that then creates indirect effects
through payroll and so forth and induced employment and spending from second round spending from those employees and businesses that are impacted by the first round. And what we find is that across the entire lagoon we have value added of
about $15 billion annually. That includes that $ 1.4 4 billion from the property value impacts annualized. From an output perspective, that's about $26.9 billion in spending that would otherwise not occur. And this is
supporting 128,000 jobs with total payroll about about $8 billion annually. So significant numbers, significantly larger numbers um than the last goaround as you would expect. and in the context of the other NEPs around the state very
much in line uh with what we see in um Chanap, Biscane Bay, Tampa Bay and so forth. When we look at this across the different sectors, you can see here how that 128,000 jobs sorts itself out. Um a large piece of that is associated with
the recreation, which is, you know, what the public values in a in a great way for the lagoon. And one thing I'll draw your attention to is within the natural resource management area. While that only shows a thousand jobs overall, we
were able to identify 440 directly funded restoration jobs. And those 440 jobs generated another 600 indirect and induced jobs. That's important because they're generating more than one additional job for every
job that's funded. If you look at some of the other sectors, for every job that's directly funded, they might generate another.3 point. 04. And in large part, that's because much of that output that's getting generated leaves the area. Whereas with your habitat restoration, I mean, it's generally they're local
scientists. They're using locally produced materials and so forth. So, they really have an outsized economic impact. And then in terms of Martin County specifically, we find that Lagoon supports about 15,000 jobs directly based on employment numbers, about
$800,000 in um I'm sorry, $800 million in annual payroll, adding about $1.4 billion to the local economy from $3 billion in um total output. And that generates about
$124 million in state and local taxes every year and supports about $176 million in federal taxes each year. And all of this data is available in a dashboard. The link uh is here so that anyone can go in and slice and dice this
by their city, county, [clears throat] their habitat of interest, a particular area, priority communities, and so forth. And that is publicly available for most of it's available for 2012 to 2022. Some of that data is only available from 2019 um forward, but it
is all there for individuals to access as they wish. And um there you have it. A good demonstration of a good use of public funds. We find that the returns um are more than beneficial to the public um as
they are spent. And happy to take any questions. Thank you, Commissioner Heatherington. >> No, thank you for coming here. I thought the presentation was so fantastic the last time I heard it. And how many how often do you hear that you're getting 24 times the return on the investment and
and these staggering numbers? And I think as Florida grows and even Maron County, we have a thousand um people a day, they say moving to Florida and many from other um parts of the country that are not necessarily acquainted with our
Indian River Lagoon and why it's so important and what the benefits are. I think it's important that we continue to share that message, why we're investing all of this time, effort, and energy in protecting our water quality. So, thank you very much. Those numbers are absolutely staggering to me. Thank you,
Mr. Caps. [clears throat] >> Uh, the phrase that came to mind was our rivers are the lifeblood of our community. And boy, does that seem so. Uh, based on what you've just said. I appreciate the
presentation. It was very well done and super thorough. You're making my head swim. I was trying to think, is she an engineer or is she an economist? I think you're both so but [snorts] a very good job. >> Excellent presentation. Thank you very
much. >> Just as they're departing, I've had the privilege of work working with uh Courtney and Valerie in the past when they did work for the Florida navigation district and and I know Valerie is a great presenter, but if you want to word
out nerd out on the various analytical techniques, Courtney is the one you want to talk to. [laughter] Thank you. >> Let's see. Do we just have one item left and that's the P3 project?
Good afternoon. Sean Donahghue, general services director. >> Uh this item is for the board to discuss and provide staff direction on an unsolicited proposal uh for a public private partnership, a P3 uh from the company uh named Building Tomorrow
Schools, Inc. They're a Florida notfor-profit 501c3 organization. Uh the unsolicited proposal was submitted under the requirements of Florida statute section 255065 uh and the county's P3 policies in the purchasing manual. Uh it was submitted
uh specifically under subsection uh 3C of the Florida statutes uh as an expedited project. Uh the unsolicited proposal provides financing options and a cost to construct 114,000 square foot maintenance and operations facility uh including all- site and utilities work
on the county owned 30 acre parcel located on Wateride Way. Uh the delivery of the of the completed building and site work is projected to be July of 2027. So it's an accelerated schedule. The unsolicited proposal provides a breakdown of costs for the project
including $6 million for soft cost designs. uh $63 million for the construction of the project and the site works and then $5 million for FFN fixed furniture and equipment. Uh it also provides for allowances for I'm sorry, the total project is $74 million. Uh it
provides allowances for financing uh three different ways. Full financing by the proposer, uh partial financing with a buy down option, uh and then the county self financing. We would look at all three of those. Uh the proposal was submitted with a $25,000 uh fee as
required by the county's policies. The fees available to use uh for consulting review services to help provide evaluation of the of the proposal. Uh this item is presented as a first meeting of a three meeting process uh where we would under under section 3C of
the of the Florida statute. Uh staff recommendation is that we the board accept the unsolicited proposal and authorize staff to analyze the proposal using the fees provided and come back with additional information. There's an alternative
uh recommendation where the board would uh solicit alternative P3 proposals for the for the operations facility and that would be according to section 255653b of the Florida statutes. Mr. Caps.
>> Yes. Um, I know that the relocation of the operations facility has been a long drawn out uh hope and aspiration. Um, does anyone
have any idea when this became an issue and how long this has been talked about? >> 25 years ago. >> 25 is it that >> at least? Yes, at least. >> So, it it's really long overdue
and uh and you know, the people who work at the operations facility have been very patient. So, we appreciate that. And um I I'm comfortable with what I'm seeing here
and I would move staff recommendation. >> Commissioner Vargas. >> Okay. So, um I've heard everything you've said and of course we had our discussion too. 74 million is a lot of money. I know there are other entities out
there that would like to throw their hat in the ring. And how are you continuing to actively solicit if this was unsolicited? How are you doing this? And are there others? Because you know, we have to have something that makes sense
too economically. It's a lot of money. It's a lot of money and whatever the going rate may be, I think that was a response to me. We we really need to massage these numbers better. So, whoever's going to come in is going to make a lot of money. Also, nobody's losing money doing this. So, how are you
going to continue to get more bids? >> The the proposal was provided as an unsolicited proposal. So, it was not advertised. There's it follows the Florida statutes and that provision. Um there is a um I mean there is an
alternative recommendation uh that we could reach out and get more bids uh and and you know approach it that way. Uh the the we will come back with an analysis using our consultants uh to provide you know is this is this a affordable
project? Does it meet all the requirements? Does it meet current standards, current price values? Uh so that'll all come back to us. >> Yeah. Um, I >> Commissioner, if I if I may add, [clears throat] this is only the first step of a three-step process. So,
there's two additional steps which we will be required by statute to come back before the board. So, anybody that's interested in this project could submit an unsolicited proposal from now until we the board decides to enter into a comprehensive agreement. The
[clears throat] comprehensive agreement would be determined by the board at the second board meeting after the consultants um bring their evaluation of the proposal from that would be our financial consultants and architect.
>> So so commissioner uh the um the P3 processes is new to us. Um, however, we've had discussions with you all and and amended our um uh um purchasing manual to accommodate the P3 process and through our CIP process. There are a
number of businesses in our community that are aware of our need for our public works facility. We've also talked about our need for a um uh the uh medical facility and uh and in those
public conversations that we've had, we do know that there are entities that were interested in supply submitting on these. So we do believe while it is unsolicited and we're not did not specifically solicit for this type of proposal um the opportunity Martin
County has certainly announced not only through that but we also hired some consulting firms that help us in the in the real estate that that specialize uh or have a specialty with P3 that uh uh we have made it known to those that are
in that have done P3s that we are willing to accept P3 3s not only on this project but on other projects that are listed in our CIP. So we would expect that during this time of evaluation that if there are any other individuals that
are interested um they would be afforded the opportunity to submit uh and that uh we would bring those to you just like this and if we got a similar um proposal for this project uh
we would then be an analyzing them both on their own merits but then comparing the two together so that we would follow that process. Um it's also important to note that this process does have its own um procurement
specialties in terms of um cone of silence and all those and we would be following that. So today's meeting is a is an example where we're talking about it and any of the um businesses out there that that see this on the agenda uh affords them the opportunity to see
that we are accepting um P3 proposals uh for a facility like that and so we would hope that if there are competitors they would be coming forward in the next several months as we go through this process. >> Yes, I understand everything you've said. My [clears throat] question is I understand it's 25 years but this is a
lot of money [clears throat] and we have to be very judicious and fiscally sound with this money. um how can you actively advertise in whatever platforms and you may have to reach out to I don't
know the person the entity to say okay we are soliciting for this what can you do to propel this because right now you're just going to be looking at the study that deals with the bound bond council the real estate group and the engineering architectural site planning I understand that's what that money is
used for and that was part of the requirement in order to to bring a bid forward to us but what can you do to get the word out and rather than hap happen stance somebody looks at this meeting today that's not actively pursuing the best deal. >> Sure. So if the board decides to go
through the expedited process we can't solicit it. The alternative recommendation if the board prefers to go through this the uh solicitation process we would be posting it and advertising it on the federal register. So that's ultimately up to the board today.
>> Okay. I think it's important to get solicit other bids. I think it's vitally important. In the meanwhile, you can look at this this particular proposal based on the the applicant's money. It's not costing us and you can do your due
diligence on that. But I would like to solicit other proposals for this. >> Commissioner Heatherington, >> what is the timeline that you project for the um analysis stage? So if this was accepted,
what is the timeline to analyze the proposal? >> Sure. So the second board meeting, we're looking to come back uh either in January or February with with those consultants. >> Okay. So if we went where we could accept any other proposals, which would
not be the expedited route, then in that time frame, in my mind, there has to be a cut off because we've got to we have to be able to analyze and then move on something. But I would like if we were going to um if there's an opportunity that somebody would submit another
proposal, I would like the opportunity to analyze that. But I believe there has to be a finite timeline so that we're not hanging up or even losing potential interested parties. So would you say then by the beginning of the year if we
did a non-expedited that we could still say okay we're no longer accepting proposals. >> So if we're not if we're no longer accepting proposals that would take place after the second board meeting and if the board votes to approve the county
staff to enter in negotiations for a comprehensive agreement at the third meeting is when we would come back with that uh comprehensive agreement. So basically uh we have until um either January or February how long it takes for the consultants to get this
evaluation done and for us to bring it back to the second meeting. Um if you want you know we can you can direct us to to come back in February that that way it gives us time to uh evaluate this proposal and should any other uh proposals come in we would have this
first step meeting as well to then evaluate that second third fourth um proposal. I would like to evaluate it but accept other proposals while we're evaluating it and then have a a deadline so that we can move forward with the project as well.
>> Understood. [sighs] >> Yeah, we have this is is new to us and so I I was uh uh prepared to be cautious as always and um this proposal is so thorough. It's it's uh it's so
professionally rendered. Their references are fantastic. their experiences are tremendous. Uh I I'm I'm um reassured. I think that and also their um
estimate that they could have a facility that we can move into in June of 2027 is really really remarkable and and very attractive. I it's it's I think it's a a great proposal. I'm I'm certainly eager
to proceed. Miss Elder, Mr. >> Okay. >> Commissioner Vargas. Yes. >> Um, I think that we also should make the decision today to put this on the federal platform that you mentioned and get the word out, do the advertisement.
I think that's critical. That that would be the way that I operate my personal life, too. I get various bids. I just don't run with the first one. If there's no second, I will pass the gavl and second the motion. >> Commissioner, um, chair, if I may, we
need to accept or we need to ask for public comment on this. >> I'm sorry. Is there anyone from the public who'd like to address us? Thank you, Mr. Graham. So, can you be the substitute? Can he be the vice chair? >> Uhhuh. >> Sure. [laughter]
>> Excellent to call the question. But >> isn't it a commissioner's capsu's motion? I >> thought it was so [laughter] and maybe commissioner vice chair or commissioner Vargas. Yeah. >> Yeah. You want to be the vice chair? >> Sure. [laughter] >> Can So the the motion on the floor is to
only move forward as an expedited. It it is I I would I would suggest that u I know the board is open to other proposals that uh staff would probably set a date to not come back before February or you know by the no sooner than the middle of February to give
other proposers the opportunity to come in. >> So I just need clarity. The motion on the floor would accept other proposals within a certain time frame. >> Yes. So the expedited proposal allow directs us to to to follow that
procedure, but we can still receive other unsolicited proposals up until the time that you decide that you want to negotiate a contract would be. And so we're suggesting that would be uh no sooner than the middle of February.
>> Okay. >> The second board meeting is February 24th if that helps. >> Okay. I think the latter portion in February that gives us almost three months, but [clears throat] but we can't solicit at all for them. >> They would have to be unsolicited. >> I'm fine with that. I just want to make
sure that we the motion that's on the floor because that determines the way I would vote. >> That we could if an unsolicited proposal that also then would come to the board. Yes. And be analyzed. >> Yes. And >> one were to be presented. would be. Mhm. And if we have several of them, we would
discuss with the board about the timing of when we would bring both of those together, you know. So February is a timeline uh that we're suggesting February 24th um and that if we receive another proposal um then we would do
that analysis and we wouldn't bring both of those for consideration until staff felt that they were uh we had enough data to um uh enough information to render a comparison between the two. >> Great. Okay. All right. >> Does that mean you're seconding
>> my motion? Commissioner heard >> Oh, you already seconded it. >> Seconded it. I I I misunderstood the parameters of your motion to I thought I heard Matt Graham say that if that was approved that we would not accept any other solicited
>> proposals. We will accept them. We just won't advertise for them. >> Correct. >> Okay. So, how can you not advertise so that folks know that this is an opportunity? It it is a peculiar instrument of the P3
process for within the state of Florida and that is that is the pecurality of of the unsolicited proposal. Part of it has to do with the um you know how we've had to redact things for the trade secrets and other
things that unsolicited proposals have the opportunity to um work with their local government on on these types of projects. So we can accept additional unsolicited proposals but we're not uh
required to advertise for them under this process. But why don't we advertise for them? >> The motion on the floor is to accept the the um uh um expedited process which
does not use the federal register. >> All right. So, is it an additional month then to use the Federal Register? >> If I recall, I believe it's 14 days. >> Additional 21 to 120 days. >> I'm sorry, what did you say? 21 to 120
days. >> An additional 21 days. >> No, two two to 120 days, though. >> It could be. >> Yeah. How long is that? Let's say uh four months. >> Beginning of December. >> That's four four months. Yeah. >> Okay. So, an additional month. It gives
us an opportunity to open up to see who else can make a solid proposal. >> But it could be up to four months. >> But it could be we could put a >> and that could blow our deal with the P3, right? I don't >> we would get pretty close because there's a deadline with the existing P3,
right? Don't we have to like sew this thing up by June of next year? >> Well, that's June. >> Yeah. >> Under the expedited process, >> right? But you're getting, you know, you're getting pretty close if it took four months, you know. >> Yeah. I think any proposer is going to
want an avenue of certainty. So, if they don't have a decision, it' be like if you were putting on a roof and you put out a quote, if they didn't accept the quote for 14 months, the the pricing may differ, >> right? >> So, I I think that there has got to be
some parameters. Well, we definitely could put limitations on that so the pricing doesn't differ on the roof. I I mean, we're talking about a lot of money here and and people are kind of like not listening to this. This is a lot of money and I think that we ought to explore all avenues to be able to get
the best the best deal for our taxpayers. So this is not something to be taken lightly. An additional what did you say? I'm sorry, Frank. What did you say? >> The minimum uh advertisement time in the Florida Administrative register would be 21 days with a maximum of 120 days.
>> Okay. So we could do it for 21 days then. Is that correct, Frank? >> If you chose the public bidding process, yeah, you could do 21. >> I think it's important. I I don't think we ought to be closing off. I think we have to explore every avenue because we
only have one on the table right now. I mean, I don't know, unless somebody speaks to somebody at uh the supermarket or something like that. How else is somebody going to know that this is available? It's an option for a viable concern. Might be another viable concern.
I think that this uh home for public works is desperately needed. It's it's beyond time and we need to evaluate this. And that's what we're we're the motion does is gives us an opportunity to use the $25,000 that the uh proposer
is is uh is giving us to evaluate the viability of this proposal. And I and I'm confident that at the end of that time we will have a fuller idea of whether this is a good idea to proceed with. >> Okay. I'm not opposed to using the funds
provided uh for the study. What I am saying is that we do need to seek other avenues, other options as you would you're buying a car, you're buying a house in a certain area. Which is the best value? And we need to know this.
>> Well, the $25,000 is from >> I understand this >> building tomorrow schools. >> Building tomorrow schools. I understand that anybody who would make a proposal be required to put up the same amount of money so that we could do the study and make sure it's viable and feasible and cost effective. We have to have a good
return on our investment for this. So, anybody else have any comments, questions? We have a motion on the floor and a second. All those in favor? >> What What's the motion? >> Staff's recommendation >> to to not and we're not going to be
advertising. Is that what I'm understanding? >> Proposals. >> Yeah. >> We're going to accept >> and to accept other unsolicited proposals >> with a return date of February 24th for the second meeting >> at the soonest. >> Mhm. Yes. >> Yeah.
>> Okay. Any other comments? All those in favor? I >> I opposed >> opposed. >> Motion carries 3 to one with Commissioner Vargas dissenting >> and Commissioner Camp >> Campy and Commissioner Campy absent. >> Thanks. >> Thank you. What else do we have?
>> Would anyone from the public like to address us? >> Mr. Vargas, any closing comments? >> Yes, I I do. As a matter of fact, um, last meeting there were some comments made, uh, which I think were not really well thought out. And I do want to say
my contemporaries on the Martin County board don't believe in attending conferences, but that is where you learn. And that is where a commissioner is able to talk with other 66 Florida county administrators and commissioners, city managers and city commissioners
about challenges, issues, and the potential solutions. And by the way, at this last conference that I attended two weeks ago, the overwhelming focus was on controlling expenses within government. The property tax proposed reforms and
what revenue will replace the property tax revenue. Where will it come from? In addition, there was discussion, question and answer about data centers with the heavy usage of power, which we talked about this morning, water, which is which is finite and it's all not
recirculated. that that's erroneous. Land requirements and noise pollution creating a strain on resources which are again finite. By the way, the property tax proposals I have two pages here which I picked up and there was spirited conversations. So I brought that back,
but that's only if you go and attend conferences to be able to speak with others. So, what I say is some of my colleagues on the Martin County Commission have stated that this is not the real job and maybe just collecting a handsome check 26 times a year is okay.
Well, this is my real job and I take this position seriously representing the taxpayers of Martin County. Let's go back to the conferences. any Martin County Commissioner is able to attend conferences, meetings, or other activities to make our county
outstanding, but they choose not to go. Furthermore, it's coincidence that Commissioner Heatherington used the Freedom of Information Act, a FOYA, to delve into my travel and furniture expenses, yet Commissioner Campy brought it up in the last meeting. Now, I wonder
why that would be. Commissioner Heatherington, >> I'm I'm going to have to step in and correct the record because I didn't put any kind of FOYA request in. That's not my understanding. >> Commissioner Caps, any closing comments?
[clears throat] >> Uh, I think I'm good, but you know, the idea that none of us go to any conferences doesn't sound right. Uh, you know, I've been to uh continuing education. I've been to uh
in Gainesville. Where else have I been? I went to uh FAC in Tampa. Um, [snorts] you know, we're going to be going to Tallahassee real soon. Uh there's some travel
involved with the job and and conferences are are part of it. And uh so the idea that none of the rest of us go to any count uh conferences I don't think is accurate. >> Mr. Heatherington, I >> I think we all [clears throat] go to the
conferences that we feel represent, you know, our our interest and um whatever we can do to further Martin County. So, and I'm all set. We'll see you all at the Christmas parade on Friday, Saturday, um, Friday night in Stewart,
Saturday afternoon in Hope Sound, and Monday evening, I'm sorry, Saturday evening in Indiantown. >> And there's tonight Jensen Beach. Join us for the tree lighting >> on activities. Mr. Donaldson, >> them for you. Thank you, >> Miss Elder.
Clerks, [laughter] >> we're adjourned.