understand. I mean, people >> who wants to get it. It's terrible. >> Like vodka school reading. >> Yeah. >> You want to teach elementary? >> It's a good point.
>> There's little kids with just what system needs to develop. I still Two people watching. I don't hear that. I check my church's websites traffic like wow we
got 25 visitors like this probably half of those are probably me see it's going >> okay [clears throat and cough] where we had a big spike in Chinese traffic for some week like just
servers from China like I know we have like that reach, you know, we work that out, right? Because I was like really excited because I said, "Wow." I look at where where it was coming from. Wow. Just spiked like
triple numbers international congregation. It's like got to go read the thing that's going on. Yeah. thoughts. >> I do. Would you like access to that?
>> Yeah. Sarah's >> I am [laughter] >> I will say I think that Kate has the best strategy in terms of like letting someone know when the slide needs to change because she just works it into her narrative and she says on the next
slide you will stop and it's just it's it's wonderful because it's not like a nonsequator her in terms of saying next slide next slide right just she's very very polar [laughter] to hit there Right. So, anyone that is online virtually, um
we are gonna start up probably in about five minutes or so. We appreciate you being punctual and on time. Uh we just usually like to give a little bit of time for people to trickle in. Um whether we're in person here or um those that are joining us virtually. So, just
hang tight and we will get going shortly here. Hi, Matt. Just double checking that there's a signing sheet in the room. >> Thank you. So, [laughter] there is. It's just tucked in my
backpack. So, >> I appreciate the assist there. So, >> no problem. where um trying to think there's Yeah, there are classes back there.
>> This side I mean that's the Is that part of them? >> That courtyard should be over there. >> But I'm not sure if there's >> there's never been windows in here since I've been here. Even before they >> No, I think there I think there is something over there because >> if you go out the hall, there's offices over there.
>> The nurse's office. >> They're here. >> The bathroom's there. >> Nurses are on the other side's office are there. >> And then there's the is like right there, right? >> Yeah, there's the overpass and then the nurse is on the other side of the
overpass next to the um >> except the nurse is on the second floor, not the third floor, but the other classroom I think the >> Oh, I see what you're saying. >> Once you know the building, it's really not that bad. The worst part about this
building quite honestly, I mean, for people getting around is when you come for any sort of sporting events, >> trying to get to the back of the building or know where >> to get to the park by the pool now. And people coming for basketball games are
like, "Where's the gym?" I'm like, "Oh, go in the pool." And then I realized once they get in like these people are so confused. >> Well, and it's always dark and like so I'll be like like, "Okay, go this way." like no one else. >> Well, when you come to the pool during the day and you can't go in the pool
entrance, you have to go around the back of the gym. >> Oh my god. >> Yeah. All right. >> To the other pool. >> I know. But >> yeah, >> you just keep propping the gym doors to get the out. >> Yes, we appreciate that. >> Yeah. And then and then they go around and unpro it.
>> To be to be clear, by we I mean my coach. I have not done anything. Please don't be mad at me. Oh, I laugh every time Cam walks around and I'm like really someone's going to do it. Well, we thought that get that spoken to and then it started getting
prop when it's hot out. >> Oh, yeah. >> Which is >> what it's 50% of the hot and other 50%. We have a coat inside for a game. Well, I will happily admit that every I
have two electric things plastic that I put on my desk constantly and I don't know how that can be a saving. >> No, that's not safe. >> We'll see on on your desk and your paper problems. >> Uh, no. I have one here and one here on either side. >> But I'm not the only teacher. And it's
like a principal half face meter like another teacher has like three people with fuses. So then they've shown us how to put fuses. Well, it's like this person. >> So, which one are you? >> We all over there.
That being said, I feel like I'm so used to it at this point that um every travel basketball game I'm like I'm sorry if you don't say it, right? >> I mean, there is a gym entrance. It just doesn't say it's like pretty nice. Well,
it probably was at some point, but but it says there's a community school. None of them actually say gym. >> Yeah. I'm just >> Who thought that was a good I mean, but like >> I've been here for four and a half months. I have a long list of who thought that was a good idea. [laughter]
>> Sure. It's probably longer. >> It's just hidden and I didn't hit the thing. >> All right. search >> trying to find spot that's not going to be on the computer so I don't >> Okay. >> Yeah, no worries. >> Don't let me leave without giving it.
>> I won't. But if if I don't get it, I'll get it. >> Okay. >> So, thank you. Has somebody um I know you guys have had people come around and do surveys of everything. Has anybody watched the traffic flows in the morning and afternoon? They have. >> Yes. Yep. >> Like >> they're still working.
>> I've just never seen anyone standing outside my classroom in the afternoon. >> I think they stand down by the corner. >> So, can I suggest that somebody stands where the parents start honking at each other around up in the back like by the community
school's entrance? They took they're honking at each other. >> Real >> I believe you. >> Yes, I took I remember they were down at Steam Miller Drive and then they watch in different spots around the front like watching counting
what goes up the loop and comes around the other way. >> This is what they they do and they park and they pull over and they honk at each other. just >> for for reference at the the back corner of the building. You can't
>> and they just >> Yeah, because they're all away from the curve. >> But no, but then sometimes there are people parked over there and then the buses can't turn and they each other like two rows. >> I'm just letting you know making sure somebody knows that it's >> Oh, it's hot. >> Okay. But I know I wasn't sure if they
were like I was like I think they're just at the front of the building. It's not by the parents on the side and she put all the way over there at one point. All right. So, we took a brief foray into our site and uh safety and security
>> overstepping advisory, which is okay because that's what we go over real quickly. There's a lot of overlap between these, but um we are going to get going with our exterior interior design advisory team meeting number two. If I can get the slides to wake up,
we'll move forward. Um so uh we'll do a quick round of introductions of the design team again just so you know uh has talk primarily but we're still going to have a lot of opportunity for uh dialogue as we go forward. Um I will do as I've done at the other um second
iteration of these meetings just give an opportunity because anyone new um that was not able to introduce themselves um at the first meeting from the Medford team. I'm happy to allow a couple minutes just to allow people to um tell us about themselves and sort of their
connection to the project. Um we're going to do a quick recap in terms of what we went over in terms of meeting one um as part of this discussion. Um we're going to talk a little bit about um the context of civic architecture that is here within the city and what
that means uh for this project moving forward. We're going to talk about the how we formulate um and think about exterior materials moving forward at a very high level. We're not getting too specific just yet. Um and we're going to talk a little bit about interior design and materiality um for the interior of
the building. Um and then lastly talk about the concept of experiential graphic design and how that can help uh connect to and reinforce um the culture of the building. and then we'll wrap up um just going over some next steps.
All right, so just a real introduction very quickly. Um again, my name is Matt Rice. I'm an architect with SMMA and we'll go in the room here. We have one other partic I'm also an architect project designer
[clears throat] and >> online. I think Helen is uh may join us in a couple minutes. She is our project manager. Um, I know we have Sarah online. >> Hi everybody. Sarah Long, interior design with SMMA.
>> And I think we have Sala as well. >> Hi everyone. Good to see you all again. It's Sala, architectural designer SMMA. >> And uh, Matt, I'm here as well. Lucas Carrier, uh, designer at SMMA. >> Great. Um, is there anyone else that I
missed um, from the design team? And just I'll give an opportunity. Do we have folks from Left Field? Um Jenna? >> Yes. Jen Carlson here. Hi. And Matt Galino will be joining us shortly. Shortly. Uh I am the project director with Left Field, the owner's project
manager. And Matt Galino, who will be joining us shortly, is the uh day-to-day project manager. >> Great. Thank you. All right. And then this is our Medford advisory team members. Um, again, is there anyone
online that is a new member um that didn't get a chance to introduce not a new member but was on the list but wasn't able to make the first meeting that wants to just do a quick introduction. All right, I'm going to keep moving taking that as a no. Um we're just
giving this quick reminder uh probably at every meeting as we go forward and as this evolves and gets updated as we move forward, we'll we'll change this. But for the time being, this is still um our schedule as it's laid out currently. Um a fall opening of 2030 is our goalpost that we're moving towards. Um the
starred um touch points that we have here for the advisory team meetings and this is um every one um of the four meetings are going to happen at each one of these starred points. Um the second meeting where we are now is still in this first portion of the feasibility study where we are. The next meeting
that we're going to have number three actually is going to happen um towards the beginning of March. We'll give the specific uh time and date um towards the end of the meeting. Um but this is going to be the the final meeting that we have in this portion of the feasibility, not
the the final meeting overall. And then just a reminder that this extern design advisory team meeting is part of a collection um of these four uh groups um that I'll I'll just keep saying it over and over again that these
are not siloed activities or discussions that we're having. Um there is a lot of overlap that happens. Um, we do want to focus in on these topics to have some conversations so that we can understand what the community is thinking and sort of where the community's priorities and
goals are moving forward. Um, we'll bring those together. Um, and these will all come back to the full building committee as recommendations coming out of this process, the series of meetings that we're in right now. All right. I think there's an animation
on the slide. Um, this is a a slide that we have reviewed a couple times. We reviewed it last night with the full building committee. Um we're sharing it again here um just because it's pertinent in terms of the topic of design when we start thinking about um what the building may look like on the outside and the inside um to understand
how we're progressing along. What we shared with the building committee last night was repeated over and over again that was not design options um but really high level cost alternatives. Eventually though, those will um evolve into design concepts and it's really
going to be part of um what we talk about here um as we move forward in terms of getting some input and feedback. Um we're going to get input and feedback from a lot of different sources um and and voices as we go through the process. Um but this is one
um that we'll have some um specific conversations as we get to sort of that next level um of having um sort of moving things from those cost models into actual design options. And again, if you did not catch the meeting last night, we did have 29 um
different highle cost models um that are being put out um out into the world um for cost estimating. Um we reviewed with the building committee last night. really confirmed um that this is a correct number that we wanted to look
at. Um these are really discreet um cost approaches um in terms of how we are either building new construction um doing partial addition um and renovation of the existing building um or all the way on the lefthand side just doing a
baseline code upgrade. So we're not going to revisit the entirety of that meeting from last night. That's not the point of this discussion today. Um we just wanted to share the fact that these are out there. We can certainly circle back if people are curious about any aspects of these as it pertains to the
um subject matter of this particular advisory team. Um but there is there is some connection um between what we talked about last night and what we're going to discuss here. All right. So I'm going to turn it over to Michael. All right. So I it's always
good to remember what we talked about last time. There's been a lot of meetings between between then and now. Um so I think it's important to try to recap. We collected all of the information provided some related notes and then we
tried to synthesize that down to a few collect those under some themes. It's always very [clears throat] helpful to, you know, take the range of things that we've talked about from what color
should the brick be to who are we as a school, right? Everything and everything in between. So, word clouds are word clouds are helpful. But just the first one that we heard a
few times was do more with grass that we should be looking at timeless design, timeless materials over trendy things, things that are maybe flashes and that we should embrace embrace
simplicity strains. make choices that are, you know, beautiful, materials that are beautiful and look good and to a certain uh comfort and excitement. Uh people are
using the building. Um, and on the flip side, looking at life cycle cost, looking at things like maintenance, uh, which plays into the long-term value of that material and keeping it keeping it
looking good, uh, not beat up. So, couple people that were fond of this building, uh, the concrete, uh, that is that is all around us. It's for honesty and longevity.
And this this last phrase really stuck out to us is that every material should earn its place. It's that we're not here to to decorate things uh with with uh
things that don't have purpose. Second, second kind of broad bucket was materials, material health, sustainability. Many people mentioned uh going after rentless free materials, materials that
are low in toxicity PVC finalist for the project. um staying the occupant occupant well well-being health is paramount that's both the physical and the emotional side of that
maintenance will be a big theme um especially as we get way down the road in yard selecting materials for classrooms for hallways for like [clears throat] this with movable furniture you know it all gets down to that that level of detail of how well
that that material holds up holds up over time. Um, you know, and avoiding things like waxing floors and working with the work with the custodial staff to understand how how the building
is cared for over time and that sustainability has always been a very high priority for for this district, for this school. So that that goes without saying but investigating
all those scenarios for is it lead is it passive house is a living building challenge u that'll all get uh all get discussed as start creating buildings sites.
Uh our next next big theme here was about the civic role what we're building. A lot of it was about what we were just kind of briefly talking about before is you know the clarity of the site circulation. Do people intuitively know
where to go or they get lost the moment they make a right turn onto the site. Some some thought that men as a city lacks public public space. saw school the flagship as you know a great
opportunity to help fill that gap. Uh, of course there's going to be a lot of amazing there are a lot of amazing programs here u that draw people in whether it's the pool or the fields uh when there's a new auditorium and
performing arts um portion of the project that's not hidden but it's very much part of the public celebrated that these civic spaces I like this word begins
uh in time of crisis. It might talk about times of crisis a little bit uh later on when I talk about kind of the civic architecture and its response to another theme was flexibility of the
space and student ownership. So I think that flexibility goes goes both ways but long-term flexibility um you know the educational model today may not be the educational model in 40 years 50 years.
So creating creating spaces uh that can evolve over time creating systems as well that can evolve over time. Then the the other flexibility comment was more about the day-to-day
use or the class the class use of class of 2026 starts inhabiting this building. How do they make it theirs for their duration here? And so you imagine the waves of waves of students and
cohorts coming through this school and how can we create environments that allow them to have some sense of ownership. There's a lot of that as you walk the halls here today. There's a lot of murals and things like that that are either painted on a wall or in a display
case. There's artifacts um from probably the old school that are have found a healthcare. Sarah will talk about how to incorporate some of that stuff a little bit later on a little bit later on.
Um this one is pretty obvious, but you have an amazing site, amazing setting within the fells. So seeing that is not just an afterthought, but how do you really take advantage of the bells of bells
throughout the season? It's always always changing to the season and there is a few really amazing views of the skyline from higher up higher up the site. Those are important uh when it comes time to even thinking about where
we're positioning big blocks of space within a building or which direction classroom space. So that will all come to play as we're starting to scope scope space form and looking for ways to
this roof rooftop access but it could be rooftop it could be onsite access for teaching spaces for science for events for CTERS at less of a storage place and more of a more of a showcase that public
um and few other landscape architecture related things. Some about an adorability of the landscape that we have about 1300 students plus teachers public living through the school and
ground. So creating that in a way that is both beautiful and durable and able to be upkept that's always always a critical conversation to have. Not to mention things like storm water patchment which don't really happen
don't really happen today. And of course there's a few historical there's uh somewhere on site there's a a quarry or landfill depending on which lens you want to you want to see that through. [clears throat] And then probably the the overarching
thing here is I think belonging creating a place that exudes school pride, whether that be from the architecture itself, whether that be how how the Mustang
identity was woven um not in a like just with the logo everywhere, but you know, are the ways that uh weed through the architecture, through the interiors, way that uh the way that's beautiful, thoughtful and
creative. Uh that all these things coming together, the materials we select, the graphics, the things that the students are able to create not just on day one but for the life of the building. Um these are they're able to
be displayed off the leaves of the throughout the building. So we thought about this in trying to sum all that up of what we thought we heard. uh tried to kind of challenge ourselves to get it to a concise
statement and you know for us we talked a lot about the range from materials to feelings and what what things evoked but you know at the heart of all this um I think what we heard is this deep sense of trying to create a place where where
students belong where families belong where where people that don't have kids who are citizens in Bedford feel like they belong and visitors um you know from other school districts they come to the field when they come um to plays and
things like that that they belong along with as well. So that's at the purpose and belonging at the heart. Then so how do we how do we achieve that? Achieve that through selecting materials with purpose value.
We're trying to achieve this timeless identity. through creating spaces that are flexible and future ready and underpinning it all as a healthy space, space full of sustainability that's not
just tacked on but really woven into the fabric of the school. And then on this outer ring, these are all the things that you know maybe you thought when you joined this committee it'd be talking about the color of metal panel and things like that. So those are
all this this outer from the materials and the aesthetics of of the building, the wayfinding artwork to how people find their way around the site for athletics, after hours events, how the
landscape feels and interacts uh with the building and the greater site and daylight views and comfort. So that's kind of this outer vein. So we tried to tried to kind of echo what we
thought we heard uh in the first meeting put it in a form that um gave it gave it a little bit of structure definitely had our our major kind of why why at the second and I sort of neglected as we jumped
into the introduction and sort of the agenda generally the format for these second meetings is that we're going through in sort of groups or chapters of the discussion We'll take about like 12 10 minutes with each one of these um and have a little bit of presentation of content and then
also have some feedback discussion or thoughts associated with it. Um so for this first one, this was really just trying to get a sense of whether or not what we're sharing back to you resonates, right? Is this does it seem like we've heard um the feedback that
came to us during this first meeting? Um, are there things that that you're thinking about that you mentioned last time that maybe aren't reflected here that could be or are there some other thoughts that have sort of come out of this um that you think might be interesting to add to the conversation? Um, so we'll just take a couple minutes
and feel some thoughts there and then we'll move on to the next sort of chapter. And if it's completely accurate and good, which we might just take the silence for, or we will use the time in the other chapters as we move forward, that's fine as well. >> The three rings is a nice way to
organize. Yes, I think that I think you captured >> the categories categorize them well. >> Yeah, it's hard to it's hard to like when you're talking about design, right? You know, it's it's just hard to like
have a formula, but I think just doing it, this is kind of like how Simon Synynic might do it, right? There's why in the middle and then you have a how the what around, but it just felt like, you know, with the amount of things that
we heard that there was a maybe a simple way to help frame it. Um, and to [clears throat] be able to go back to this, you know, when we're in more heated, you know, maybe in the future when we're in more heated discussions about why we're doing certain things or
why we're selecting certain things, we might use this as a as kind of our our start. I I think I mean I want to echo what Libby said because I think the visual of this captures things really nicely having been like Marta and I have been
in every single session that we've done between visioning at leadership and forum um and I think that that really reflects what we've heard from teachers from staff from students Um, I
I said in one of several meetings that we've been in that the most impactful part for me so far was during the educational forum work and listening to students >> and they talked about the kinds of spaces where they felt the most connection or sense of belonging. So,
and we did hear from from teachers who it's a shift um to have to have some shared spaces and what will, you know, really help them be able to, you know, have a space where they can do their planning and um their collaborating with
colleagues that this really does reflect all of those conversations we've been a part of. All right. >> We're going to do a little like I'm teaching a class here, but we're gonna >> we're gonna going to talk about um
materials. No, no, civic architecture and a little bit Matt will talk about materials afterwards. Um, but kind of on the material front, I thought we'd go way back in Bedford history and talk about some of the first first materials
that um that really meant something. And those were ship building and brick making kind of the six mid6 to 1700s. But I thought I'd start here um instead
of just jumping right into looking at some of the civic buildings to say that you know there is a long history here. Uh, and we know some of these older these industries are u kind of died out bit in the 17 and 1800s but it's still
important to recognize the history and I think there's a really good tie to I was thinking earlier about our CTE spaces here like that handson like it was happening here even back then you know because we had the skill u and the
material right that would uh skill to build ships. We had the river to be able to to send them on the raid. Same with Brickman. There's a lot of clay uh and natural materials that that resourceful people turned into an industry. So, I
thought that was a kind of a an interesting place to start. Um, and then just going to roll through um just some civic buildings. And these are kind of civic buildings by era almost. Um, I've
just pulled out, you know, a handful of the ones that that were mentioned last time and some new ones and some that I drove by on the way up here. Um, which is kind of cool. Um, the first one is the Mar 181 building.
I thought this was a really good place to start because this one you think about buildings and what how they're forming their material. If you think about an armory, think like I'm a tough building, right? I'm holding a I'm
holding a lot of important things historically. You know, they were used to hold ambitions and things like that. Over time they evolve into uh more community spaces and some cities. Uh but you can see with this uh Romanesque
revival, the stone is really rustic. Um it's got these castle-like turrets. So it's really trying its hardest to exude kind of strength and dominance uh over anybody that may walk by.
That's 1891. >> Down in the square, the Bigalow block is uh late 1800s. That's a kind of a late Victorian Queen Anne style that's kind of characterized. Can't really see in the photo, but the brick work is really ornate. There's a lot of detail. Uh it's
very intricate. A lot of these buildings express their verticality. see it all the way up through the the chimney like elements and this this corner turd on the corner which is cl
copper that's pretty typical of any Victorian or ant style just trying to stretch out that mentality while also giving the people inside especially that courtroom kind of the visibility of of of the intersection where the world
>> perfect spot for a Right. >> Yeah. And uh adaptable, right? >> Right. Adaptable. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Uh just up the street, the the theater.
This was 1939. It's part of the old high school building. Um it's a Greek revival. And I thought what was interesting about this is this building and the city hall which I'll show next were all part of uh built during the
later part of the depression. And when you think about what buildings are reacting to um I don't think that was a really great optimistic time. So in in times of crisis um especially back in
the early late 1800s early 1900s architects and designers were going after these revivals. So you'll see this is a great revival. The city hall is a colonial revival. They're they're trying to call back to a previous time. A lot
of its nostalgia like oh it was so great back then like let's recall that. So you'll see a lot of this especially in these New Deal uh era buildings. Of course being being a theater
recalling uh Greek uh is not not a bad place to start u with the classic Greek theaters that that we see all the time. And Greek Greece also being the the cradle of democracy doesn't doesn't hurt
well in your country. was very the recall was sent city hall as well um not that old 1937 it's like I said it's a it's another one
of these revivals that's calling back to a more patriotic time perhaps so that's that's the story here it's got kind of symmetry it's got a very tall uh element in the middle so that you can
see it from from around but again it's calling back again this was at the very end of the depression so probably built both of these buildings probably built what with a lot of rural labor
which one of the new deal out the soups it's either the WPA or EWA agencies that were going through the country building buildings. Uh we're going to fast forward a little
bit just to keep everybody on their toes here. Um but you know, Medford Police Station, I'd call this like very civic structure,
but it definitely shows its uh it's a kind of a serious building. It shows its utility. Um, and it's branded. It's branded both with very large signs and this uh not so subtle blue uh blue brick. So they I
mean police stations really have a tough balance between kind of suiting protection. Uh but they're also becoming places that are welcoming people in. There's the interior is actually pretty good. You know, there's some public spaces up there that have some wood and
welcome, but from this angle at least, you it feels like it's protecting itself, you know, with these arms uh that are forming the the ramps, but it feels like it's, you know, kind of holding on to itself while probably the architect said, "Well, we'll make the
corner all glass, but still feels a little a little paper. Then the library. Library is probably I don't know one of the nicer examples of a of a civic building
just opened a few years back. Uh it ties into the first slide. You could definitely see a connection with the the form of the building. Splint your eyes almost imagine one of the Clipper ships. I'm sure that these roof forms were inspired by ship building. um and and
industries like that. Um and a really good example of a not not so obvious here, but this is maybe one of the first net zero libraries um states perhaps,
but if you look from the aerial view, the whole rooftop is covered with photo panels. So, they did a really good job here. It's really welcoming welcoming spot. city. Um, you know, kind of a
interesting dichoto two civic buildings um and what they're doing. Now getting to the high school, these are well some of these pictures are of the high school, but um the 1970s were
early 70s late 60s were a really interesting time. I just while researching this project was looking who buil who designed this building. Somebody help us design it. But I opened up a couple of these like 1970
architecture magines. This is all you see for the most part. We're told it was designed prisons perhaps. >> So many high schools though. >> So the kid >> Yeah. This late modernist style
without >> almost a brutal architecture. It was you know raw concrete uh single pig glass was used for schools. It was used for funeral homes, >> offices,
uh banks, name it laboratories was like the style of the day. So it's not anything um not anything crazy. I think Salem High School, which is also
going through this same process, it's also of that that same era7 kind of kind of looks very similar, but there was a really good spread um in the yearbook from 1970
of this little photo essay that was put together. Um, but I'll I'll kind of read read through this some of these lines. said, "As the natural terrain was reshaped by dirt, concrete, earth moving
machines, a man-made beauty evolved that rivaled its own natural order." Well, your beauty is in the eye of a world of coherence and order that even nature could envy was excitedly
emerging. Well, surely brick and mortar would not live and breathe. Um, you know, I mentioned, you know, >> you I mentioned architecture responding to what's going on. This is like Vietnam
era. There's a lot of craziness going on. So, a building >> and the previous building had the fire. So, a lot of chaos, right, going on during this time. So probably the school building committee at that time the architects a search you know a search
for order and clarity is is certainly what they did here from the way the corridors are laid out the way the buildings are nicely placed together pretty regular courtyards and even getting down to the
kind of the system of the facade right there's there's rule there's definely rules that were applied. Um whether it be how we treat stairs, how we treat windows, how we treat sunshades, everything was was ordered orderly and
in control. quote by Marcus Brillius uh I think basically says that I think Churchill's got a similar quote but you know we shape our buildings and our buildings shape us so that's kind of
what we're embarking on is the environments you create materials we select all have impact all have impact on the occupants uh how they grow and how they learn and how they plant with each
other. Um so now is a good maybe moment to pause and just kind of throw out this question. Um I've seen some of the civic places.
Is there a connection between those places uh and this place? Is there not a connection? Uh what does it mean to be a a civic civic building today? And this building does have as much
significance as Sydney Hall as a public library. It is it is the flagship school um for the school district. It is um so much more than just the high school as well that it does have this type of prominence. So it it doesn't necessarily need to have any particular aesthetic
connection. Um but it it's definitely worth talking that through to understand are there are there thoughts are there feelings out there as to how it may connect or how it may not it seems out of place other than the police station. >> Yeah. >> With the other other buildings just
seems like a completely like the police station and the and this high school is in like different flavors than everything else. I know that in in Marvel and Marvel projects, they wanted them all the buildings to tie together. They want to be cohesive. So, but
>> but there's I would say the police station aside, >> yeah, >> like this building has like masonry. It's got bravas. It's got dignity. Maybe some people may think it's ugly, but it has like a lot of like the weight of the other buildings have and like a sense of like entry point that um that's been
ordered and welcome people. So I think that yeah the style is really different for sure but it has that that ties together. I mean if you looked at the photo of the adverts I think more so than like that maybe that is I don't know what that photo is.
>> Yeah. just I walk, you know, if I haven't been to old some of these buildings, but if I walk up to the city hall, I feel like, wow, it's interesting. It's welcome. I feel welcome to go there. Just something about the building, architecture. Coming to the high school, I don't feel it feels very cold, very distant. Part of
it is so far set back. The entrances, >> you know, set back. >> Yeah. >> Well, and it again doesn't have a super clear entrance because of where you drive up. >> You then have to turn. you don't see it, you know, like all of these you see very
clearly where you go in or what's standing out and the high school doesn't have that unless you know to >> turn and go to a certain spot and you're like, "Oh, there >> and all the other schools I think feel like they have more of an entrance too in the district." >> Yeah, somebody has their entrance.
My class, >> hi everybody. Sorry to be on Zoom while you are all in person. Um but in thinking about uh your question, I was just considering the um the different users of the high school and in
particular the students. Um one might argue that um the way in which um this project is connected to kind of like the civicness of Medford could be in in demonstrating what that means for students. So, you know, in educating
students what what it is to be civically minded or um or, you know, even thinking about other users like the greater community, you know, being uh you know, connected, being a space in which um community can gather um or to
demonstrate to itself. um how to how to show what belonging means or or um you know showing up for each other means or you know any number of values that we might identify. So I think there's a really core component like what what distinguishes perhaps this from some of
the other buildings would be the student component that it can um educate in a way um what what what it means to be civically minded. Paul says, you know, >> Paul, go ahead.
>> Thank you. Um, it's sort of jumping off of what Dia had said. Um, you know, when you were describing how a lot of architecture seems to be reflecting on a better time. Um, I I I mean, we can we don't have to
get into how was it really a better time? Um, you know, nostalgia is often not related to reality and um and so but I think um
you know the school is is always about the future. It's like by default um you know certainly we can have seniors in for education but we don't make people go to high school or public school at the end
of their lives for a reason. uh because this is helping them prepare to go forward. Um and so I do hope we can sort of avoid any kind of uh nostalgia approach to design. Um
you know like the when we were building ships, it was it was it's a it's a part of Medford's history. It's I'm not saying that's not important. Um but there were also lots of enslaved people here. Um, and we
often just move along as if we just had ships and rum and everything was dandy. Um, and that's not that's not the truth. And I I do feel uncomfortable sort of perpetuating the myth of how great things used to be.
um because I think it doesn't serve in particular, it doesn't serve our our students who um if they're doing a good if we're doing a great job teaching them, then they are going to be far more aware than than the rest of us sitting here of what history really was like.
Um, so you know, I I I I think I'm I'm loving I love this this look across the architecture of the city. um and um the library in particular. I think there's a way to weave in um you know a theme if you will like
whether ships and ship building is a theme we can weave in or not um is is think something that would be interesting to explore because a bunch of buildings that aren't related
at all doesn't feel like it's part of a community necessarily but I do think figuring out how we can make sure it's forward facing and not based on nostalgia is is super important. Thank you.
>> Great. Um I'm going to take one more. Um I think Jesse, you have your hand up and then we're going to shift forward just to make sure that we can touch on some of the other topics for today. >> Um thanks. Uh I'm just wondering um uh
based on like the talk about nostalgia and how things fit into Medford. Um just to me um I feel like the the usability and the sort of accessibility of the
building um winds up communicating um its belonging far more than you know trying to tap into what is Medford's character um and its architecture just because that's that's always changing. But um
uh you know to me like a a wildly different uh architectural style um if that were to be um used in the high school um wouldn't necessarily doom itself to being unsuccessful if it doesn't fit
into a sort of Medford character so much as if it doesn't >> um if it doesn't communicate that this is for everyone. one in the town the way you know some of the older civic buildings and the new library seem very accessible and usable um versus the
current high school which you know looks more like industrial sort of and uh like a hydroelectric dam or something that we're not you know you're not really sure where the access points are and what's happening inside of it. >> That's all.
Yeah, I think that that's a great point and for clarity, I don't think we're suggesting that um there's any emulation that we're um sort of putting forth at this point, we were really just in and you all done a fantastic job of just sort of thinking about the topic um and
sort of whether or not um there's sort of guidance there or thoughts, lessons uh to be taken from what's in there. But there's certainly more to u come on that conversation as we move forward in the process. So, um, we're going to talk a little bit
more about, um, exterior materials, right? Um, so just to keep going on the theme of, um, precedents um within, in this case, the district. Um, we have here um the other
school buildings um that are um, located within uh, the city. um the elementary schools and the middle schools here. Um and you can see there's a there's a good predominance of brick um with some um accent materials associated with them.
Um as we think about what materials may end up on the exterior of the building, we really need to um keep in mind first and foremost that we're designing and building buildings that have a 50 to 75 year lifespan to them. Um right. So at
that initial point um it's going to preclude the use of some more residential scale products. Um we're not designing vinyl siding on school buildings. We're not probably designing even wood siding on natural wood siding on school buildings given sort of the
upkeep that um is associated with them. Um so these are a collection of t typical material. brick is certainly one of them and it is found in the city as we just showed um and the district as we just showed. Um and it's not to say that these are the full collection of
materials that are out there. We'd love to hear those other materials um that anyone has experience with or interest in that we can investigate and move forward to the process. Um but moving from sort of left to right is that natural materials in terms of uh stone,
actual real stone um applied to a building. Um brick itself in terms of a clay fired process. Um and that can take different forms. Um there can also be thin versions of those. Um so there's different ways of putting up exterior materials on a building. um whether
they're laid in beds of mortar which is sort of a more traditional approach um or sort of applied in more of a raincreen approach. There's metal panel um which can take all sorts of different forms in terms of corugations in terms of the metals that are being used in terms of the finish that is applied to
those metals but metal can have that durability to them. Um there's um other types of raincreen panels whether they're phenolic panels and phenolic is like a fancy word for um like a resin um or a plastic at the end of the day um
that's sort of modified for outdoor exposure and durability and longevity. Um they can have different types of materials sort of inlaid into them. So there's like woodlook uh phenolic panels that exist out there that are used in rain screen systems. Um there's also
porcelain panels um which again have sort of that clay base to them um that can provide a lot of durability. They can have sort of shiny reflective finishes and glossy finishes or matte finishes. Um there's a wide range there. Um and then there's uh terracotta panels
as well and these are generally graded from left to right. We'll get into the next slide in terms of price point to them. Cost is of course going to be a factor in terms of the selection of the materials, but it's it plugs into the overall set of criteria that we're going
to be using, right? Um there aesthetics play a role, sustainability plays a role in terms of our selection of exterior materials both in terms of how much energy it takes to actually fabricate these things, how many natural resources are consumed to do that. Um so it's a
it's a very sort of complex selection process that we'll get into as we move forward um in terms of what the exterior materials on the building uh will end up being. And the again these are just the opaque materials right we haven't even got into the topic of fenestration and what are the things that we look through
um made of but sticking with those um >> penistration >> fenistration which is again fancy window fancy word for window um essentially so maybe I'll try to just keep on the simpler side of the terminologies but
architects we like to like trend into all the fancy words that we know and I'll try to check myself on that Now I know people feel I talking about technology similar. Yes. >> So I I talked a little bit about sort of the the cost spectrum um in terms of
materials but also sort of the um the durability of materials that we go through in terms of um how we can sort of plot where different materials fall um on this range. Um so we have sort of durability um is our our range on the
the top left there. Um and then cost um running across the bottom. You can see that masonry or brick um has that sort of interesting position of being um extremely durable and and having a lot of longevity to it and also being sort of on the lower price point. And that is
the the very reason why you see brick um on so many public buildings because it does fit into a lot of um sort of beneficial categories that way. Um there's a lot that we can do with brick um there's a lot of creativity that has been um really investigated over the
course of history um with that. So it is a material that can be considered as part of the exterior pallet as we move forward. Um but again you get a sense from looking at this um where some of those other materials fall in terms of that that spectral graph that we've been
looking at. And the one in the upper right hand corner is um maybe a little bit more interesting in terms of building integrated photovoltaic panels or solar panels um actually applied to the base of the building. We we don't see that too often um around in terms of public school buildings um in
Massachusetts are or really too much um within the country because it is at the upper end of both the first cost investment of what goes in there um and then also in terms of durability it is not going to last quite as long as an active technology um than some of the other materials. But >> saying the lower on the graph the more
durable. >> Correct. Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. So um and then to the right hand side being more expensive and then just a sampling of um exterior buildings exteriors of buildings. These
are actually all SMMA projects um but just give you a sense of the range of materials um that are out there as options. Um again you see a lot of brick here. Um but there is um some composition and juxaposition of the brick um both with modern um sort of
aesthetics and approaches and juxtaposed with renovated portions of buildings um glass um certainly to help um both perforate the exterior of the building. Right. An exterior of the building uh with no windows in it is not a nice
building to be inside at all. So we we will sort of understand that mix and that that composition between glazing and opaque uh wall assemblies. Um and just some um some closer up views
of some again exteriors of SMA projects just to give you a sense of um some of the options and opportunities that are out there. Um this first one was Waltham High School. Um a mix of granite base um a lot of brick but then also um accent
panels of composite aluminum panels up above or rain panels. Um this is the Wakefield Memorial High School which is currently under construction so we don't have finished um but a similar pallet here um in terms of materials. So, it's it's not that
we're arriving at these similar pallets because we're trying to design every building in a similar manner. It's more sort of the conversations like this one that we're having now and that we'll have moving forward um both here and with the full building committee to sort of um understand what is what is that
right mix um of external materials that we want to be using uh both to talk to the character of what we're designing but also sort of longevity of what we're designing. And it's good to show that night view, too, because it is a a building that is um
used more than just the day. So, it's always good to think about building throughout the the life cycle of the of its day. How you signal what spaces are, you know, welcoming and talked about that beacon at the very beginning. Uh not
that you're trying to spill daylight out uh in the fells, but it will be larger spaces that are used at night. Yeah. I mean, designing with light um is is really really an option that we have moving forward um and available to us
and something that we want to consider in terms of how create a welcoming appearance at night. Um but also the opaque materials change at night, right? It's really the inverse condition in terms of how you approach the building and where your focus is. Um so it's something that we'll look at. um both during the day and in the evening um as
we're studying um renderings and things as we move forward. Um the the Somerville High School um does have a a large proportion of terracotta paneling on the exterior of it. Um and that was really more due to the fact that we were building here in a historical context
for the Carnegie Public Library that was immediately adjacent to the building. Um which had terracotta detailing that was connected um and really laid into the brick work. um this is not that a similar type of terracotta but here we were connecting back to that the concept of the materiality and so it's a way of
taking sort of that historical connection reinterpreting and providing sort of a modern aesthetic um using a different kind of material and this is a a recently completed u public charter school um down in Roxberry um again using traditional
materials um and this is a lot of brick again um but it has sort of a what's called an iron spot which is a sort of a metal um it's actually cast in and gives off a reflection in sort of a purplish hue um and and really plays with the light in interesting ways when brick
hits it. So again just going to different ways of using more traditional materials. Um there's definitely options um available to us and this mixes in um metal panel that's both sort of an opaque color and a woodlook uh color as well.
Um and this is the conquered middle school which also just recently completed. Um almost 100% of the exterior of this building is um brick. Um there's a little bit of concrete masonry unit as well that has a polished surface to it. Um so different
types of masonry can be used. Um and this actually had a lot of different sort of striations um layers of brick um to add some texture um and color to the exterior of the building. Can I ask about
>> So we'll pause there. [clears throat] >> The Can I ask about the windows? >> Sure. >> Is that to prevent like is that to provide shade? >> So the horizontal projections that you see coming out. Yes. Yeah. They're solar control devices. Um so what what they're
trying to do and what they do do um especially when they're positioned on the southern facade, they work most effectively on the southern facade is they control the amount of sunlight and sun solar energy that's coming into the building um during the summer months,
right? And they're they're designed in a way so they have louvers like little slats on them so that during the winter when the sun is lower you actually do get that sun coming in uh to the windows and actually doing some passive heating um of the space and in the summer when
the sun is higher um the louvers and the depth of the shade is is blocking out um the the sun's heat that's getting into the building. So they're part of an overall sort of passive design strategy um that we end up using. Um they are so they're located on this building as
well, but they're located in vertical um arrangements primarily except for where it was the science lab renovation added some of these horizontal sun shades as well. The vertical ones are they're more um decorative I would say generally they're more effective on like an
eastern and western elevation but they're not as effective as what we would do here. So, they were definitely popular in terms of the aesthetics of the 70s when these buildings were designed. Um, but when we use them today, we really try to make sure that they're purposeful in terms of the
orientation of the building and what they're actually going to be doing from a a passive design perspective. >> In this particular photo in school, are those all operational windows or no? >> Each of the windows does have an operable vent to it. You can sort of see that little piece that's kicking out at
an angle. um opens up to allow for some um immediate user control of the environment. Um but there's other portions of these windows that are solid and opaque and fixed. Um but we do provide and we will provide here moving forward um operable windows in every
classroom just for give teachers control over that environment getting fresh air if you want that option. >> It should be a lot quieter. So the any new window be triple going. So right now you have a single single pane. So that
parent popping out your your classroom window, it'll be a little little quieter. >> Yeah. Any other thoughts just about the types of materials of appropriate other materials that maybe we didn't show
examples of that there's interest in us exploring? It's probably a little bit hard the abstract without, you know, a form a building to look at. >> Brian's physically raising. >> Yeah. >> Oh,
>> Brian >> on Zoom. >> Okay. >> Hi guys. Hopefully you can hear me on Zoom. So, >> uh, what I like about this, uh, the conquered school that you've got up right now and [clears throat] particularly how well it sort of speaks
back to the landscape that's right there and a lot of that brick work, masonry work really reminds me of our site in some semblance simply because we're dealing with a lot of rock, a lot of strata, a lot of, you know, the fells and that sort of back and forth speaking
to each other. So I'm just curious if there's a concept even based around perhaps literally the term strata for some some of the sediment layers things like that whatever we find when we start digging into that site but I like that sort of uh you know I guess conversation
back to nature and perhaps we can pull some of the materials from the fels and and some of those um layered ideas both like horizontally and even like I love layers and architecture from from you know the from nature to the interior.
And if we can get some of those layers involved, that might inform maybe how we use some of the materials that you guys had shown up on the screen earlier. >> It feels more woodlike on the top. >> I don't know because of the lines, you know, give me grain or the color tone
and the the proximity of the trees and everything. It feels more natural than concrete, but >> but all brick, I mean, it's the buff sort of color of it that ties into it. Um, and also, but it's a really rich area to explore and certainly something
that we can look into as we move forward, those connections to nature and the fells, which is so so predominant on the site for sure. >> Yeah. But so I was just going to say I mean it's still you know it's still masonry but to somebody just mentioned it. I mean even the way you've strided that
masonry could talk to like a tree ring or something like that. You know it's it's you can see it in there somehow. It's it's not much of a stretch to connect with still those that same pallet that you guys showed earlier. >> Now is that that road is not passable?
>> No that's an outdoor set of outdoor classrooms that are down there. So it's pedestrian access as it runs around. >> So they didn't in this building have a cert the ability to circumn the outside of the building. >> They did not. So it was a conversation with the fire department. We haven't had that conversation with the fire department here. We will be having it
very soon. Um there was a significant gray drop off here around the back of the building as well. So that contributed to it. It wasn't a place that you would want to take a fire truck. So they acknowledge that and work with us. So it can be done this way. It's true.
I'm going to keep us moving forward. Um just and I don't want to short change Sarah too much on the timing here, but Sarah, I think I'm going to give you about 10 minutes uh for each of these uh the last two sort of chapters that we have. >> Sure. Yeah. No, I'll go through it as quickly as I can, but um you know, feel
free to interrupt me because again, as we've been talking about, a lot of this is uh you know, reflecting what we've heard and we want everybody's feedback. So, just stop me if I'm uh breezing too quickly. So, uh, first and foremost, I just
wanted to kind of introduce, um, a few key elements of interior design, um, that we'll be talking about today and in the future. It's, uh, definitely not an exhaustive list, but, um, these are all elements that, uh, really work together,
um, and are related and add different layers to, uh, the space. So again, space is three-dimensional. It's creating our flow. And really this is tied so closely to our educational plan and all of the the visioning meetings
that we've been having. Um color obviously uh you know it's more than just um aesthetics. It really does impact um you know school identity wayfinding. Uh it can support accessibility goals. So, you know,
looking at contrast um and things like that, how it can impact mood, all of that color theory is something that we'll be exploring as we, you know, move forward in design. And very closely related to that is lighting. We've talked a lot today about uh natural
light and daylight, but obviously once you move into the building and you know we we do, you know, flood it with as much natural daylight as possible, but artificial light is also something that's going to be uh studied and considered, right? We want to make sure that we're providing the appropriate
illumination for all of the activities happening. Um, but you know, it also does have a big impact on color. Um, and uh, impacts mood. Uh, the other two I want to touch on really quickly are often overlooked, but um, a layer that
can really make an impact is texture and pattern. Um, and this can texture can either be physical touch um, or it can be something that you perceive visually. Um, and pattern can both just be, you know, a repetition of lines, but it's
also a rhythm that you can feel within the space. And so that's something that we're going to look at as we move into the next slide and we look at, uh, some of the goals that we're looking to to explore. So, um, you know, shifting into to what
we think we heard in the first meeting, and again, we've talked a lot about this today. Um these are highle goals um but really are going to help guide our design process particularly in the interior. So um you know wanted to make sure this aligns with the goals of this
group. Um so moving into the interior materials you know we heard you that they're going to be purposeful, durable and valuedriven. Um and obviously they'll all be uh evaluated for maintenance and our sustainable goals. Um, also we've talked a lot about the
importance of the connection to the exterior. Um, both the the glazing uh creating a visual and physical connection, but uh the design pallet and overall design goals for the exterior definitely trickle into the interior as well. And we want to design something
that encourages um movement uh engagement, student autonomy was something that was brought up in the last meeting. Um and really providing materials and patterns that can support that. Uh and then again, we really want to root this in a timeless
neutral palette. Um and be very intentional about the different accent colors and uh lighting features and things like that uh to build upon that neutral palette. So, just a quick check in that this kind of aligns with everybody. Um,
>> yes. >> One thing I just for some interior materials like sitting in this room here, I know this is a specifically a no wax floor. >> Yeah. >> But it looks almost strikes me as feeling dirty. >> It doesn't and it hasn't held up well. And I know hopefully newer materials
that are low maintenance will >> look better longer. kind of thing. Let me make sense. It does. >> It does. >> It does. Yeah. And we'll talk a little bit more about some specific materials and how we can really achieve these goals. Um, even in like the next couple
of slides. So, um, but all of that feedback's excellent. Um, so yeah, so basically in order to reach those goals, we do kind of reference back to some basic interior design principles. And what I've put together here is also a couple of precedent images of recent SMA
projects. uh just as examples. Um you know, there's there's a lot of different elements here. So, um again, feel free to to jump in if any of these speak to you or or don't. Um one of the things that we talked about was the connections to nature. Um and so I've got a photo
here of um our rooftop terrace at Waltham High School. Um and so this is something where again it can be glazing and views that create that connection to nature, but it can also be a direct physical connection. So that's something that we can explore moving forward. Um,
another image here is comfort uh comfort and well-being focused. So, you know, this isn't just about lighting and thermal comfort or healthy materials, but it can also be tied directly directly to the educational plan. Uh, so an example here is um a health assisting
program um at Waltham High School. So obviously, you know, lighting, healthy materials, all of that was um a part of it, but it can it can really drive into the educational programming as well. Celebrating diversity. Um there are so
many different ways that you can do this and obviously we'll fine-tune this so that way it's Medford specific. Um what we're showing here is again uh Waltham High School and uh this tile mosaic is a direct result of student surveys. um and
they wanted to showcase fabric patterns from the various sculptures that were uh represented by the student body. And so that was a way that we were able to celebrate diversity um in a physical representation um in that school.
And then um showing also adaptable and flexible spaces. Um we've talked about that today. You know, again, this can mean many things. Um what I'm showing here is an example of a new educational program uh to Waltham High School. Uh this is their environmental science lab.
Um and here really it was about providing them flexibility as the program grew. So uh you know durable materials um but flexible space as well. So, we're seeing the lab space with uh power cord reels from the ceiling. So, that way you can move the furniture
around, access right next to it with a classroom, also access to the green roof um right outside. So, taking all of that into consideration. Um and then on this slide, a couple more uh precedent images here. We've talked
about honoring history, but also embracing the future. Um, so again, many ways that this could be done. It could be done with graphics, which we'll talk about um, a little bit. It could be done with salvaged items from the existing site or historical artifacts that are
important to Medford. Um, so many opportunities there. Intuitive wayfinding and placemaking. Um, you know, we've, this is definitely, especially for a large school, um, really critical. Um, good space planning
is important, but we want to uh make it as easy as possible to know where you're at in the building and also get to your next destination, get from point A to point B. Um, equitable, equitable, and universal design. Uh, code compliant
accessibility is obviously a given. Um, but we also can consider thoughtful ways to make the building um, as friendly as possible to everyone. Uh, and this can be done uh in a lot of different ways. We're showing here um one way that's also you're you're showcasing where
you're at, but it's also um can be educational. So, we're showing the arts in both uh enlarged braille as well um as ASL. um access to daylight uh obviously critical uh as we move forward with our
space planning particularly for art spaces um our visual arts uh and really it all boils down to things being durable and timeless. So you know again avoiding trendy materials and products and uh you know we can talk a little bit
more about the interior materials on the next slides. Yeah. And Sarah, I'm gonna actually say that we're gonna pause just a second here because >> just to take a a second and talk through any of those topics. Um, >> absolutely.
>> Yeah, we're we're going to run out of time here, I think, pretty quickly. I want to make sure we can talk to um >> Okay, >> environmental graphics quickly as well. Um, >> sure. thoughts though maybe about what we've shown here in terms of um some [clears throat] of these interior
material guiding principles. I really like the health assistant. It's just that that flooring really like guides you what the separate areas are lighting. >> Yeah. Again, subtle wayfinding, right?
and just kind of really diving into the, you know, how much that that that pattern can help with the flow of the space. Um, and yeah, I mean, it's a wonderful program and really the space just is kind of the cherry on top to that.
>> Yeah. >> Well, I just wanted to say sort of um jumping off what you said at the beginning about um doing more with less and not having anything decorative without purpose. So, I'm looking at some of these slides and you know the celebrating diversity um is absolutely
beautiful. Um and there was one on the next page. Um the hallway in the top left. Um >> they're beautiful. Um but I'm thinking of students with visual impairments in particular and with a lot of different colors and a lot of different um
patterns so forth coming in and feeling sort of like sensory overload from just a visual perspective. And so I'm just being mindful. And then in going back to the slide again, the one the celebrating diversity, you know, I'm looking at those colors and they're gorgeous, but I'm also looking at those white tables
and how they blend in with the floor. >> And you're distracted by all that color above you, you know, >> right table. Um, that's sort of the perspective I'm coming from in terms of like making it accessible. Um, >> that's that's you know sort of and it
ties in with the wave finding and the and the >> helps the same with the floor you know making it sort of intuitive. >> So that's one thing that jumped out at me kind of keeping that in mind >> for sure. No, that's great feedback and
definitely I think finding that balance, right, of um you know making things comfortable for everybody, right? And um and and to your point being intentional about where the accent colors are, what
the contrast is um and actually making sure that we are achieving that uh that goal. Sometimes it's also about how you shape, you know, large space that there's nooks and little little spaces so you're not
like in the middle of it all. Um, I know at my daughter's school when I first walked in there, um, exactly what you said, it had like, it's a 90s school, so had like a checkered dooring pattern [laughter] just
like it's just like a space that is all visual like energy everywhere, you know? So, it's like trying to sculpt spaces in a way that are proportioned well, lit well, um, and have the interior pallet
that that supports um, just that it's a pleasant and navigable navigable space. >> Right. >> All right. Yeah, we can skip the environmental graphics if you'd like, Matt, and we can come back to the >> I'm just going to let people know that
we're skipping over something that is still very important in terms of talking about healthy materials, um, red list, avoidance, um, of materials. Um, we are going to get into a little bit in the the next advisory team meeting if you want to stay for that. But it gets back
to this topic that we're not talking in silos here. We're overlapping consideration of materials. Um I did want to talk um really quickly about experiential um graphic design though Sarah. So if you want to try to get through this material pretty quickly.
I'll give us a couple minutes at the end um just to wrap up. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. No, I will give the quickest overview. So basically experiential graphics or XGD um is all about bringing visual graphic elements into the space um and it goes really handinhand with the rest of the building design and can
exist in a variety of formats. Um and really the three major uh questions that we look at all kind of stem from the audiences, right? So there's three major audiences for a school. It's a students, it's the staff, and the community. Um
and all of that ties back to, you know, what is what is the content? Um where is it going? You know, can we tie can we tie content into the programming? Um you know, is it located near the gym versus a classroom? Um and then what does it
look like? Um you know it also includes what is it made out of and how is it maintained. Um and then for goals again this is something that we've worked with each school for unique project specific goals but um you know these are ones that we
try to achieve in every environment. Uh and it's really about connecting uh those three audiences the students the staff and the community to the space um through a cohesive system. Um and again responding to the other design elements um interior, architectural and the site
and then creating different strategies um again to encourage educational opportunities um not just inside the classroom uh using the building as a teaching tool. Um and then you know first a critical
element is obviously providing clear and functional way finding um and really cementing those important places throughout the school. Um and again these are just some visuals from uh some recent projects. Um so a
few examples here about connecting the individuals to the space. Um and we can just kind of flip through these very quickly Matt if you'd like. Um again responsive graphic design. So a lot of these are uh that image for Wakefield
those are acoustic wall panels. Um so again it's providing um graphics but at the same time it's um helping with the acoustics of the media center. Um let's see the next slide we can talk
about. Um so these are some great examples of creating educational opportunities. Um again based on some context. So, um, you know, we have a graphic, uh, in the architectural drafting hallway of Somerville, um, that really highlights the, uh, the entire
plan of the space. Um, and then we've gotformational signage for those tile murals that we were talking about to explain what are you really looking at, what are the parts and the pieces, as well as some lead signage as well, just to better understand what the building
system is actually doing. And then some examples of wayfinding and placemaking. So from stairwells, knowing which level you're on, uh the building entrance, uh site signage, uh even just welcoming in uh to the main office, all
of those things can be part of XGD. And this is just a quick example of again, we're looking at everything as a suite. Um so everything works together. It's all cohesive um and has a similar language. And uh the last slide is basically just
a quick um process that is really where once there is a building and we start to get a little bit further into design uh in the next phase um you know we'll start with surveys uh to really help inform those project goals and develop
the the concept and the content. and and this will really be one of maybe like a splinter group that comes out of this and we'll probably work to try to find some student voice to pull into this because that's it's really critical to making um sort of any experiential
graphic um connected to the school community. I think we've heard that in a variety of ways already and Suzanne mentioned at the beginning that that this the student input is just um critical and it's been very insightful to date um wherever we've been able to make those connections. Um the other
thing I'll just add on to the end of Sarah's um piece here is the fact that there's actually a lot of experiential graphic activity um that's already in the building today. Um particularly the CTE programs um have been very um
prolific in terms of generating some amazing things that are on the walls either outside their shop spaces or inside their shop spaces. And what we want to do is try to amplify that. Right. Um there's some great ideas that we've heard also about things that we can have done in the past that we can bring back, new things that we can do
moving forward. Um so this will be definitely um a comprehensive um lens that we'll use for the entirety of the school, not just um sort of one uh particular area of the student body um that we're talking to and thinking and working with.
So um we are pretty much at the end of our time. Um, so I want to take a quick second to go through uh the next steps in terms of what's coming, including confirmation that um we're going to come back together on March 10th
um in terms of uh having a subsequent discussion um that will be at 5:30. We're going to be doing it again as this remote um hybrid setup um probably in this room, but we'll confirm that when we get a little bit closer in terms of the timing. The organization of what
we'll be doing um at that third meeting is that we'll actually be looking at something a lot less interesting than sort of slides with graphics on them. We're going to be going through a spreadsheet. I know that sounds exciting. um which has essentially all of the topics um that have come out of
both the initial session and sort of the dialogue that we've had here um as recommendations back to the full building committee and we're going to categorize those into three different groups. Um we're going to have some given items and we're going to do sort of a a traffic signal um analogy on
this. So the givens are going to be green light items. We won't need to talk about them at the next meeting, but we'll run through the list to just confirm that they are there as recommendations going back. There's going to be some flashing yellow items as well that we're going to have some discussion about um in this meeting um
when we get together again. Um and we'll just see where those um sort of they're not pain points or friction points, but things that really there's different perspectives that we want to talk through and make sure that we have a consensus agreement on. Um and then we may also have some red light items um
items that um we're not going to be pushing forward um as recommendations. So that's what we can look forward to as we move forward into the next meeting. Um but definitely thank everybody for their time. Um those that are in person, those that are remote, um we know that everyone's time is valuable, especially
in the evenings. Um so appreciate any way that you've been able to join us. However, that just Thank you. >> Thank you. And we all we have some folks in for the next advisory team meeting. So there's no rest uh for us that are
multiple. Thank you. ME systems and sustainability advisory team. We'll probably take about five minutes. We'll let other people filter in and we're going to get everything set up and then we'll get going right at about 5:30. You're on.
>> All righty. Uh for everybody online and uh everyone in the room, we're going to get going here with our um meeting number two for our sustainability and MEP systems advisory team meeting. Um the agenda for today, we're going to do
a quick um set of introductions again just to remind you who we are and who's speaking. I know we were all remote last time, so being in person Maybe it'll be um limiting as to who we are this time around. Um if there was
anyone that is um part of the team that was identified as part of the team but wasn't able to make the first meeting um I do want to give just a couple minutes um to anyone that's in that category to introduce yourselves, your connection to the project um and your priorities and goals similar to what we did with the
entire group at the first meeting. um just because we want to make sure that we have the ability to hear from everybody. Um so after we get through that sort of introductory piece um we're going to break the discussion down into a series of uh chapters of the discussion. Um and each chapter will
really involve a little bit of um presentation of material. We're essentially going to be reflecting back what we heard the first time around during the first conversation. Um, and we tried to group um, similar types of comments or thoughts um, into these chapters. Um, so we won't be talking to
you for 45 minutes and then we wait and have a conversation. We're just going to go piece by piece. Um, if we get to the point where we're um, at our time limit, I'll just have to move us along. Um, so I'll apologize in advance if I need to cut anybody off. But that'll be generally the content of the second
meeting. Then we'll talk about next steps as we get to the end. though if you were here at the tail end of the last meeting um you've had like a little bit of a spoiler um it's very similar in terms of what we're going to be doing for each of the groups. >> So real just quick on the introduction
side my name is Matt Rice I'm an architect with SMMA. Um Helen I know is online with us. >> Yep. Good evening everyone. Helen Fantini, project manager with SMMA. >> I think Sala is with us as well online.
Hi everyone, good to see you all. This is Sa Jenka, architectural designer at SMMA. >> All right, and I think we have folks in the room. >> I'm Martine Deion. I'm the sustainable design director at SMMA. >> I'm Emily Ellers. I'm a mechanical
engineer at SMA. >> I'm Andrew Barrows, electrical engineer at SMA. Luke Kryer, member of High School. >> Oh, sorry. We're just going to keep going through the design team folks in as opposed to around the
>> I don't mean to cut you off. >> No, that's fine. >> Brenda, are you you're online too? >> Yes. Hello everyone from the LAN sustainable design team member. >> Okay. I don't think Tomaso's online with us. Um and I is James online. >> Yeah.
>> Yes. J James Job Agal Engineering Plumbing and Fire Protection. >> Okay. It's not that I don't want everyone to introduce yourselves again. I just want to try to conserve as much time as possible. Um, this is everyone on the Medford team. Um, again, is there
anyone that was not with us for the first meeting that didn't get a chance to introduce themselves and sort of their goals online or in the room? >> Libby, do you want to go ahead? >> Hi, I'm I'm Libby Brown. I'm an architect and parent. I'm on the school building committee and um I saw the list
of goals I sort of summarated last time. Those look great. And I don't really have anything specific to add, but I'll say hi to James. He was my engineer on only law only. So, hi James. [laughter] Nice to see you again. >> Hi. How are you? >> Hi. Um, Sarah Michaelman. I'm online.
I'm sorry I can't be there with you in person. I unfortunately missed the last meeting. So, I'm a community member. I've lived in Medford for 22 years. My daughter went all the way through the Medford school system starting in
kindergarten. um she's long out of the system now, but my son is about to graduate from the high school. Um uh and I, you know, I agree with Libby. I did watch the the um video of the last meeting. You guys covered a lot of ground in terms of goals for the
project. I agree with all of them. Um oh, so my background and why I'm here. I am a sustainable design consultant by trade. I work with a firm out in West Conquered. um and have worked on a lot of MSBA school projects over the years as a consultant working uh with the
architects. Um, just one thing I do want to add, um, is, um, I'd love to see this building be, uh, resilient, um, and potentially a community resource. Um, should there be any catastrophic events where people need shelter, vaccines,
water, or food that it could be, um, uh, you know, a resource for that. And, um, you know, along those same lines, have that kind of passive survivability um, and be able to, you know, maintain comfortable temperatures and things should there be an electrical outage, etc. if it's used as a shelter. One
thing I wanted to add. >> Thank you so much. That that is great. And I realize that we had not gotten into that whole notion of shelter usage and shelter designation is something that we need to um something that we'll have connected conversations with the uh first responders as well in terms of understanding sort of what the city's
perspective is from from from those departments. Um but we can definitely wrap in what that means from a resiliency standpoint as well. So I appreciate that. Thank you. Um, just really quick on our schedule again. Um, we are still
[laughter] Emily's doing some extra recording for us. >> Sorry, I thought I had >> Okay. Um, fall 2030 is our target school opening date at the moment. Um, we are very much not quite there yet. Um we're
at the beginning of this feasibility study process where we are right now. Um we do have these touch points of advisory team meetings. Um this second one that we're going to have is the last one in the first part of the feasibility study and we're just getting into sort of the semantics of the MSBA process.
But um understand that we're going to get together two more times after this as an advisory team um with each uh category that we're looking at. And again the fact that this is not an isolated conversation, this not a siloed conversation. Um we do have these four different teams that are meeting um to
talk um on these particular topics. Um there are overlaps that's inherent and intended and and beneficial to the process as we go through. Um but at the end of the day from these advisory teams, there will be a series of recommendations that we're going to be um sharing back to the whole building
committee. Um they will have the ability to accept um or or not accept um those recommendations. But um that this is the process in terms of collecting um expertise um and input really from um experts within the community on these
particular topics. Um very quick refresher on the objective um the [clears throat] topic of what we're going to be talking through, but I think this one is very self-explanatory in terms of the title um of the advisory team. Um and then we're going to jump
right into topics and priorities. gonna hand it over here to Martine to start off. >> Um, so we're gonna browse through some of these. We've got it all there, but I'm not going to name them one by one. Um, but the last meeting we went through
the givens, you know, the specialized code, the MSDA requirements, lead, etc., and then the Medford some of the Medford um sustainability um policy and and guidelines. Um and and
then we got a a good amount of your um great feedback and discussion points um at that meeting and what we did is we organized them. Uh there was one particular comment about understanding what lead is and giving a lead overview.
So we'll do that briefly and we'll have a bit of a discussion around that. This is not uh to go through the whole lead set of criteria but you will see that throughout the topics we're going to go through some of those are going to fall
uh you know within the the the uh within the following discussions climate resiliency. So we sort of bundled in there um obviously energy efficiency. We're going to talk about mechanical, electrical, plumbing systems. Operations
and maintenance was something that was near and dear to to some of you. Um, we're going to brush a bit on passive design strategies and and Sarah, thank you for bringing that up because that's something that's going to be part of the project in terms of resiliency.
Um, and then uh renewable energy, EV charging. There was another set of comments around embodied carbon. So we're going to talk we're going to spend a bit of time talking about this today. Um helpfulness, environmental quality and literacy and environmental literacy.
Um we're g that we sort of bundled sort of the ventilation, daylight and everything that has to do with connect connectivity to nature and um sustainable sites. Um and then there were some comments about cost effectiveness. So, we wanted to make sure that we're going to give you an
overview of some of the life cycle cost analysis um that we're going to be providing in schematic design and it's required by MSBA, but we're going to give you some example of what it entails. >> All right. And this particular topic is
fraught with acronyms. Um so, LCCA down there at the bottom is life cycle cost analysis. Um we'll try to make sure that we um explain those as we go through for uh folks listening in now or after. >> Right. So lead um just to respond a bit
to the comment from the last time leadership on energy and environmental design is what this AC acronym stands for. It's a green building standard that was developed in the late mid to late 1990s and it was fully launched commercially in the early 2000. MSBA
adopted it in the late 2000 as a requirement for designing schools in Massachusetts and getting reimbursement for MSBA. The the green building certification system is is in its fifth version. So your your building will be
registered under V5, which is a bit of an overhaul over the previous version. We're not going to go into that. But basically the the the way this comprehensive green building certification is set in is into these categories that you see there. Um and
many of your comments from last meeting sort of fall into the criteria. Each of these category have a set of criteria and MSBA requires a minimum of silver certification. So, we're going to have to apply all the prerequisites and all
the and and a good amount of the criteria from each of these categories. As we go through and talk about the different topics tonight, we're going to highlight which of those are already included in the lead certification that you will have to the product has to
pursue. Um the version five has sort of rebalanced a bit the sort of the weighing of the criteria within the system. Um they put uh obviously you can see there the carbonization is a big component of it. Um quality of life and
then and then ecological conservation and restoration. Those those are the sort of big chunk chunks of the reweighing that they've done uh in the B5 list. So this is what the scorecard. We're not going to go through this point by point,
but you're going to see this throughout the process of the design process. Um, there's a scorecard which each of those categories that you saw on the previous slide has a set of criteria and we need to design to that criteria. Um we're
going to present uh to you updates uh periodically throughout the whole design to show how we're sort of uh qualifying to meet the silver certification um at minimum. Next,
so just one very early sort of look at it. Um, in order to get to silver, we need 50 points minimum throughout through through this criteria. We're we're we did a very preliminary
assessment. Um, and um, you know, sort of targeting we need to target more than 50 to make sure we get 50. Um, and then um, there's options here to go to either gold or platinum. And I know in some
other meetings there may have been some comments about you know gold or platinum and and that's not something that we are going to decide for you. We want you to voice your your wish and then we're going to analyze and show you what it
takes to get to gold or platinum. That's really um right. >> Yeah. It so just to clarify that a bit more. So I think we want to be clear about what our sustainability goals and why we are looking for a particular rating. Right? The silver certification
through USGBC that's going to get us MSBA funding. So that's that's a clear goal and a rationale for why we want to do that. >> That's a given. >> If if we're going to gold or platinum, are are we interested in just that designation, that recognition that comes from the USGBC? are we interested in
sort of the core sustainability benefits that are behind those ratings and sort of what matters as we move forward in the process. So it's a little bit of a higher level question. Um but I think it is worth a little bit of discussion as well. And this is like the last slide that we have on this section, right? So we could
>> I believe so there. I know Luke had his hand up. >> Um so you know uh like I've reviewed other high school projects throughout the Commonwealth. Um I know you're the designers for for Wakefield. They're doing something interesting with the
micro grid. Um perhaps you could confirm because you know news articles are half accurate, right? Um did they try to attain the gold or leave platinum and then did they back off and what did they
back off? I think I know the answers but it's just based on a news article. >> Can I offset that? What version of lead was for are they? So uh uh Wakefield is lead v4 um and the lead the the community
uh supported u silver um minimum uh and they had aspiration for gold. So um >> that's right. >> And and so what happens when we do aspiration is that we sort of build as
much as we can towards gold um and submit everything we can that would you know reach goal but there's not as much um there are you know there are some criteria that they're not willing to extend to whether it's budgetary or for
some other reason maintenance or or whatever. And so there was a discussion throughout and we kept track. I think um there's still an aspiration for gold but there's no uh there's no final thing until the building is fully certified
and that won't happen for a couple of years I think or a year year and a half. >> Okay. >> Tracking silver. >> You said aspirational for are they tracking silver or they tracking gold? We're tracking silver but with high high
enough um points that we we're borderline gold territory >> but we cannot say we're we're tracking >> or not you understand [laughter] >> which which just for for reference is exactly what happened in Somerville like we track silver all the way along. They
actually just got their gold certification. It does take a couple years after the building opens to get it sometimes in terms of the back and forth that UBC, but it's not like it's like a completely unattainable goal or an approach to the project as you as you track at it. Um it's really just trying
to manage um where we're focusing some of the investment um on different scope items um where particular points have like just very direct costs associated with them. And um and I and I brought up Wakefield um uh because they've also got
a very interesting concept. Now they have a municipal power company >> that you can partner with and they're developing micro grid with battery backup. >> Um and I was as I was reading that, you know, I saw a lot of appealing aspects, but we don't have a municipal power
company. And so I was wondering whether some of the things Wakefield is doing because that project is pretty far along um are applicable in terms of storage uh to metric. Oh uh no I thought you meant in terms of lead. So I was going to say no because
it's a separate project and you know the PE is not installed at >> No. Would battery backup have any influence on circulation? No >> because it wasn't part of this project and it's not within the lead but if we incorporated into our project.
Yes. >> I see. However, in Lexington, um, which is not a MUN, it's a Massachusetts PA utility, um, they are they've committed and required
lead gold aspiration platinum. So, in Lexington, it's they've committed to it as a community. Um and they've also committed to net zero energy uh fullsight net zero well building net
zero energy um onsite with battery storage. The battery storage uh the the the solar photo volta being installed as part of the project does contribute to lead and link points. the battery
storage um in lead v4 less in lead v5 could have some significant impact in terms of um some of the modified and new criteria within lead v5 and but the
really major um benefit of the battery storage is the participation with the utility in the demand response program in um you know storing the energy, sending it back in the grid and getting
the the real uh sort of the money benefit of that on top of reducing your peak load which reduces your peak energy cost which is also significant um energy savings. So those those are the benefits of of the storage. The way
we build field is set up is very different because they're new. So they're going to manage this at the not at this building level but at the city level. >> Do we know enough about the existing Rford High School to understand like
when the peak load is happening to understand when like the that demand would match up with the solar collection and whether or not battery is like really an effective use of money. >> So when we get to the life cycle cost analysis I can speak to that a little
bit. Um we've we've gotten some information and the nice thing about Medford is you have an energy manager I think um in town. So we >> has your hand up now. >> Oh, she does. >> Let's let Brenda go. Yeah. >> So So So basically we to high level
assuming yes uh we're going to be look we can look at that. We can uh look at that in collaboration with the energy manager get that information and then align with what will be playing out. >> Brenda, you want to go ahead? So um what I originally uh had put my
hand up to to say was I'm I I think that it that it's important to aspire to to platinum as we're you know starting this process and moving forward. But I would say that I think that you know net zero and uh passive house are are potentially more valuable goals. So if we are able
to um you know achieve those without uh achieving lead platinum I I don't think that would be the end of the world. >> Okay. And I'm going to let Paul go and then going to move us along um just because again I want to make sure that we have time to get through the other topics and I know you feel strongly
about this topic Paul but go ahead. I just wanted to um sort of echo a bit of what Brener just said and you know I was having an offline conversation with her and um Alicia Hunt and you know being able to to stick a thing on the on the
wall that says what our lead level is is is uh actually not something that I care about. Um I I care about the the full life cycle cost of operating the building. Um, and um, so I just wanted
to make sure that that was clear. Um, although I don't I also care a lot about reimbursement, [laughter] getting enough points to get extra money back from, uh, MSBA. So, um, so both of those things, but like I'm
not attached to being able to proudly say we're a lead platinum. If we are, that would be great. Uh, but let's get there for the right reasons. So, so just to clarify, the MSBA reimbursement is is tied to the lead
silver gold or platinum does not get you more money from MSBA. Uh um meeting the specialized stretch code which meant has already um sort of adopted gets you more money with that SBA. And then there are a specific set
of credits and criteria mostly related to indoor environmental quality and materials that if we meet a higher level of those there's a basic level required by MSBA. If we meet a higher level we get an an additional 1%. And we plan to
you know show you and pursue those that's achievable and we've been doing so in other projects. >> Yeah. So, just to clarify, Paul, you may be thinking that in the past MSBA has handled the reimbursement and the benefits for different levels of lead
certification in different ways. Um, and they will continue to do that as they go forward. They do track along with how the energy codes um adapt and modify and get more stringent over time and they adapt sort of their reimbursement model a bit um as you go year by year. Um, so
we'll understand once we get to the point of schematic design sort of what we're locked into in terms of their policy at that point. Um, so we'll just have to continue to track it as we go through. [clears throat] Um, I am going to push us forward. I think that was that was great discussion and I really do appreciate that point that it's not
the the plaque on the wall that is really driving this, but it's sort of the benefits um from a sustainability perspective, environmental perspective. Um, so we're going to shift to climate resiliency as a topic. So, you know, we had energy there, but
before we get to that, we just want to explain that what you're seeing there again is the lead criteria and um part of climate resiliency involves sustainable sites and transportation and water efficiency, water conver
conservation. Um so those that criteria is is part of lead. These are givens. uh transportation demand management that's something that came up at the last meeting in terms of EV charging station uh which we'll talk a bit uh a bit later
in in this section bicycle storage and bicycle charging so all of this is going to um be part uh to a certain extent be included um to uh comply with lead for example the EV charging station for lead
you need to install 10% under EV5 So these are all givens. Next, in terms of energy and atmosphere, we want to spend a bit of time because there was a lot of talk around this last time and it's a it's a big chunk.
Somebody just made a comment about net zero energy. So uh in terms of lead, we we we have to outperform standards that that are part of their criteria. Um, an MSBA looks at that performance and
associates a certain amount of lead points to they sort of look at that performance to associate lead points for the stretch go which they're kind of apples and oranges but that's their way of benchmarking and so we really try to optimize the
energy performance of the building to really um meet MSBA uh threshold but also uh you know make as much points there. The change in lead V5 is source energy. We won't go into all those details, but it's source energy based
versus site energy based. Um all of this is supported by the MA specialized stretch code. So there's a lot of from that code that's going to support the criteria there. Um that said, there's a lot of technical things
here. Uh but passive strategies are going to be also a priority. um you know making sure we um harvest the free sun um and um Emily will talk a bit about that you know thinking about wind um at
the same time and then somebody brought up passive survivability so that will be part of the thinking here in terms of um HVAC system and um overall resiliency of
of the site um I will go through all of this but to say that uh commissioning is sub uh subsidized by MSBA. So the full commissioning set of mechanical, electrical, plumbing, building enclosure and actually some ongoing commissioning
plan is all included in the MSBA scope and provided by SBA is the SBC considering bringing on a commissioning agent in sematic design because that's what BB5 was requiring. So I was curious if that was a a consideration. So I have questions
>> doesn't bring it on until DB >> until DB. So I actually have a question because MSBA is going to transition to DB5. So I have a question to them about that to first clarify if they're going to substantiate it. If not then we would
have to account for >> we've asked them that question and we've heard no. >> You've heard no. Yeah. >> Okay. U but I'd be curious if you had the answer and >> or we keep asking I think the more people that get pointing out to them they may have an epiphany there that gez we need to adjust our policy.
>> And then the other thing that they do not provide if if you want to if you install a solar PV system you need to have it commissioned to get the lead points for the renewable energy. But MSBA does not reimburse that. So you usually have to buy that commissioning
separately. Same with the demand response. There's a part of it that's an observation of a test that needs to be done by commissioning agent. We also need to buy that up front. >> So I'm just going to try to keep us on questions until let Martine go through
my slide and then do a quick question. >> So no problem. Um so a lot of the you'll see a lot of the schools are targeting EY25. is that to make sure I explain what I mean
energy use intensity. The EUI is a metric that we use to compare schools and buildings actually all buildings uh by using a sort of a a nominal energy per square foot per year metric. In this case, we take all the energy loads
whether from fossil fuel or electricity and we combine them in KBTUs per square foot per year. The target for most school that are not um vocational schools that are not comprehensive program school usually is 25. But when
with the case of your school which has a comprehensive program which really requires a bit more energy per square foot than a typical school, we've put a range there of 25 to 35. There's going to be more discussion about that, but we like to set that goal upfront in the
project as we do energy modeling to sort of monitor and target and continue to sort of profile that goal. And how do we get there? And we've got many schools that have achieved the EUI 25 um that
are not from provinces. How do we can you go back? I just want to go to my the the nice little icons there. So one of the very important component of how to get there is a superinssulated enclosure. All of those things are supported by code but I we want to make
sure you understand what it is exactly. Super insulated enclosure triple glazing all electric HVAC to the extent possible with with your program and then plug load management which ties into occupant behavior. Um and then the passive
strategies which I admitted talk about first but they're the first thing we look into next. And in terms of operational carbon so all this energy we're going to talk about embodied carbon later all this energy is equivalent and to greenhouse
gas emission and um your existing high school uh versus the new school. This is not your school. This is an example. [clears throat] When we fine-tune your existing high school energy better, we're going to create a bar chart like this and show you where we're looking to
go. What you're seeing here is um an existing high school, large existing high school, and how EUI 2530 target reduces the operational carbon over 60 years. So, we take the annual emissions and we we multiply them by 60. The
reason we do that is that when you do modeling and measuring of embodied carbon, you look at it over 60 years. So this discussion will continue um at the next meeting probably in a bit uh a bit more detail. Uh but we like to look at
carbon as total carbon both operational and embodied carbon. Next. Um, so like Martine's been saying, when we're designing our spaces, we're not just thinking about what is code required, what the minimums are. Um,
we're thinking about a big picture and a lot of different variables. So, this carries over into the engineering systems as well. Um, and I was glad to hear a lot of these points were mentioned in the first meeting. So, that's great to hear that you're all
thinking about all these different buckets that we think about during our design process. Um, so specifically for mechanical systems, I'm thinking about the comfort and health of the occupants. Uh, the safety of the materials that I'm
using, uh, the LCCA, as Martinez mentioned, um, both sustainability and the engineering teams have to consider this. uh reliability and maintenance of the building systems. That's very important. Um the all electric HBAC
systems is a code requirement and a lead B5 requirement. Um and then also just the space, not just within the building, but uh where we're going to place our equipment on the roof. Is it sharing space with the PV solar panels? Um and
then where are we going to take up space on the site? So we have to coordinate with the civil teams and the site teams as well. And then I just wanted to point out this one in particular which was brought up quite a bit in the first meeting. And
again I'm very happy about that because um it's one thing to design a high efficiency beautiful mechanical building system but it's an entirely another thing to see it operate as intended. So,
it's very critical from the beginning of the design process to work with who's going to be operating your system. So Andrew and I have already met with Ken and John for their facilities team to understand uh how they currently operate, what
they're comfortable with, and then for the future um what if they'll be bringing on board uh more team members to handle the larger systems or if they're going to incorporate more training to understand these all
electric systems and controls because it's very different than what's currently in the Um, and then as Martin mentioned, we also look at commissioning as a lead P5 requirement. >> So, Audrey, I do see your hand up. Um,
we'll circle back to you when we get to the the question point um in this sort of grouping of slides which will be coming up. >> Um, okay. And then a little bit touched on in the first meeting was specifically the mechanical system options. Uh we're going to dive deeper into these later on
in the feasibility uh phase of the uh project, but I did just want to quickly bring them up high level for what our all electric system options might be for the school. Um so the first is a ground source heat pump system. That's
geothermal system. Uh the next would be an air source to water heat pump system. And then the third would be an all air source heat pump system. And then with these three, we can also kind of do a hybrid option where you can take bits
and pieces of the different system types and use them for different areas of the school. So um it could be for cost reasons to cut costs. It could be just for flexibility like what might work well in one space might not work as well
in another space of school. Um, so again, we'll be looking at this more closely in um the next phase of the design pro process. Uh, but I did just want to put these up here so you can see what's coming.
Well, it seems like the most popular topic is energy savings. Um and right now Medford's um [clears throat] uh PV policy is a building that's greater than 10,000 square feet requires
uh PV array on a roof size to 50% of that roof uh usable I should say um or 90% of the top level of a parking structure that's uncovered which I don't believe will affect Bedford High School but it's not true. Um uh exceptions are
unsuitable spaces or structures that can't have um the can't support the structure of the solar array or um if the roof is 50% shaded through a meter.
Uh when it comes to the stretch code [clears throat] uh we have going through the electric pathway you'll have to have 40% uh of the usable roof covered which is under what requires um and any buildings that are
still using fossil fuels uh for uh you'll still have to provide that solar PVA um to offset those fossil fuels uh such as pool heating, culinary kitchens, labs, you know, such. When it comes to
battery storage, um it's not necessarily a code requirement, but um it does help with the lead version five. So, it does add to get you to higher than silver.
And then everything else will just be uh contributes to the W5 and get you to silver high or gold uh for the explorations. Um and then other options would be for walkway uh structures or um
parking structures for PB locations. Um and if there is a patio over the roof and have a high camper there or vertical wall structures. >> So just just to quickly clarify um the if
you do an all electric flat specialized the 40% is readiness. You don't specifically have to install it. Whereas if you have fossil fuel, you have to install to offset your fossil fuel. You have to install the
amount of PV that offsets your fossil fuel use. We'll dive more in the code uh the details of the code in in the next meetings in terms of what does that mean for your project. um we started looking at ballpark
numbers and so how much of that 50% for example of your roof area would be equivalent in terms of a net zero building right so we'll we'll have more of those figures um in the next next phase of the visibility study
>> it we had another slide here on EV chargers but Andrew I'm going to cut you off just because I get the sense that people would like to talk about some of this a little bit um and we're sort of running short on time. So, I think I will pitch it over. I think there was a couple hands up earlier on that will get you. I know we have some folks online.
Then we'll try to circle through. >> Great. Thank you. Uh I have a comment, a question, and a comment. Uh first, I have to leave at 6:30, so don't take me leaving as any side of of being not happy with it. Question. Um, how much of the overall
budget historically has the uh MSBC >> contributed to projects of this scale and percentage? >> How much would we expect will be offset by the their investment? >> Great. >> So, you're saying overall with the project contribution? So, it varies per
community. The agreed upon reimbursement rate um and I forget what it is off the top of my head is let's just say it's 50% for right now. I think it's a little bit higher than that. It it it's a very confusing number though because it doesn't actually equate to like what their contribution is at the end of the day because it's it's 50% say of
eligible costs and we'll there's a whole like 45minute presentation. >> That's all I was just trying to get a sense for the scale for which you know we might expect reimbursement versus have to fund ourselves. Um so my comment is um I I want to register my support for doing uh lead silver and code
minimum. Um a lot of these systems are very sophisticated uh between design and maintenance. Um and a lot of um uh payback is for lack of better word speculative. The data is based on
um unsimilar situation or or not apples to apples to what we're doing and does not is not able to accurately predict what is actually available for payback on some of this. So um personally I believe that stick with the simpler approach tried and true technologies
that doesn't so much count on future dollars coming in as it does what can we afford today and what can we afford to maintain today and aspiring to gold or silver I think will distract us from that goal and lean us more toward cutting edge technologies in order
technologies that are be difficult to maintain or to repair or replace in the future. So that's all I got. Thank you. Um I had a couple of questions. One, um is the rate and and maybe there's a question for the energy manager I can
follow up later. Is does Medford High have a specific rate structure that would benefit from dispatching storage on like a regular basis? like as as you guys are going about your your design
and your load calculations like are you are you looking at okay we're going to assume this much PV during the day but we're going to offset that with the battery at select points or we're only going to use the battery for demand response credits with national grid like I'm wondering if you can talk like what
what is how you how are you formulating that strategy >> again that's going to be a discussion there is a rate and it's probably the commercial rate and >> but it's a standard It's a standard. They they raise it every year. So when we do the cost
analysis, um we put cost escalation in there. >> Um we have precedents because we've been doing this for a long time. So we can share that the use of the battery storage is going to be up to the
man the management the school the the facilities management. So I mean they can take advantage of that that demand response. Yeah. >> Um those are specific times uh especially during the summer. >> Uh but they can also manage it so that
they can hold the the the storage and then use it when it's peak. let's say in the winter they use it that night because as Sherman speaks that so that's going to be up to the the the facility management to optimize the use of that
energy storage in general and then on top of that they can add the incentive programs and benefit further from it. >> Okay. And are you assuming that the high school or the city will be the owner of
the solar or will you sign a third party PPA with the solar? >> That's an excellent comment. >> Yeah, >> because if you are the owner, you own all the greenhouse gas reduction and you get all that revenue. If you rent your
roof and your parking to a third party, they're gonna get all that money. You're gonna get only a reduction. There's a obviously there's a contract to be negotiated with them, but what we're seeing for most of them, it's a 20-year
contract at a fixed rate. And so, you may not get as much money back than if you own the system. But again, that will be a discussion as we look into these options. That will be a discussion for
the community and for the community to decide because owning the PV and the battery storage obviously and the cost and there is a payback to be looked at and all that. >> So I want I know there's a couple hands up here. I want to let Brenda respond and I want to go back to Audrey because
she did have her hand up in between then we'll circle back. I know there's a lot of topics for discussion here going forward. We actually have a lot of other content as well but we may just pause and spend a little bit more time here because I think it is productive conversation. So Brenda, why don't you go ahead?
>> Sure. I was just going to add that um the there are demand charges for buildings that are this size, commercial buildings that are this size. Um and the high school is the our largest energy user of any of our municipal owned
buildings in the city. So the the demand charges are are quite expensive for it. So I I think that's will be interesting to see the um the the cost analysis of of storage compared to the the savings that we would get from from the demand
response we could do with the batteries. >> Appreciate that. Um Audrey, you >> Yeah, thank you. Um I wanted to go back to the HVAC um the the HVAC stuff. So I I just feel
very compelled to to speak up about this. Um I absolutely um know the one before. Um yeah. So, um, speaking as someone who has been in that
building over 25 years, um, I can I can say that this is a [snorts] huge point of, um, contention, if you will, because the, as you all know, the building is
old, but um, the the the amount of years of not just me but obviously every teacher that has had to deal with the uncomfortable conditions um in that building is horrendous. Now I am lucky because I'm in the science wing
and that was redone about 11 years ago. However, what's upsetting is that the first few years um they let us have individual control over our rooms and then that was taken away. And then now
currently there's something weird and something wrong with the system and they can't seem to control it is some something weird about the central control. And I'll give you just a personal example like my room is set to over 75 right now and I'm like dying in
it. Um, and like today was kind of like warmer. Um, and I've had to crack my window and it kills me because I know what a waste of energy and Brenda just said that I know what a waste of energy that is. Um, but I just want to make
sure that that in this new space that the whoever's going to be running it, whether it's buildings and grounds or whoever is is going to be able to run it. But I would I would ask and beg that you allow teachers as professionals to
control their own rooms because it's it's just it doesn't feel very respectful, right? And then just to just to trust us that we would not be abusing the system, right, of like
cranking it down or cranking it up or whatever. So, I just feel really strongly about that because of all the years of just having such miserable conditions. Um, and then I mean that it's just I I just wanted to pipe
up about that as a voice of an educator who's been in that building all these years. Really appreciate that perspective. Um, and I think that's definitely is going to be subject of a lot of conversations going forward and certainly central to the design of the mechanical system as Emily gets into it.
>> Yeah. >> Um, >> yeah. Um, so I have three comments and then a question for the rest of >> see what people are doing. They're just sort of all, you know, arrows. Go ahead. >> Um, so a couple comments. Um, in our
SLOI which is available on the Metro High School website. Um there's a report that was u put together in 2019. Earlier we saw a EUI target 2535. Uh the report contains uh the measured values uh over
like maybe a 9-year period showing what the EUI for the building is or was. Um you can see a spike sort of during the COVID years. I personally attribute that to more fans and more air circulation. Maybe it's something else. I don't know.
uh but historically the number was around 60 uh when CO happened and spiked it and got a lot higher. Um the uh the report also contains a breakdown between the uh uh the contribution uh from uh
electric sources and uh from natural gas that's you know our fossil fuel. Um, so I encourage everyone who's interested in this topic to read that report, get a good idea of what the current school um, uh, requires in terms of energy. Um, on
the PPA discussion, uh, I have panels in my roof. Uh, when I put them up, the best panels um, produced 218 watts per panel. Uh, today that's a lot better. Um, if you were to do the same exercise today, um, you could get panels that produce 460 watts. Um, and that makes a
big difference when you multiply by many channels. Um, so a PPA versus a purchase system uh requires costbenefit analysis and I certainly would would ask for one before making the buy verse right decision because um I see our electric
needs growing as time goes on and more people buy electric cars. There's not actually that many out there. Maybe we see a higher concentration um because of [snorts] where we live and work, but uh if you travel outside of
the 95 bubble um there's not many electric cars. However, in future that's going to change. Our needs are going to grow. Um and you know having PPA positions you to upgrade. You sacrifice in one area and you have growth in another. Um, I'm not advocating for one
or the other, but I would expect a detailed costbenefit analysis for the make versus rent decision. Uh, I think you're to the school, the children, and taxpayers. Um, let's see. Uh, on the reimburseability
topic, it varies widely. Um, and it's, as Matt alluded to, a function of what's reimburseable. So, take Revier. River is building an enormous school. It's going to cost over $700 billion according to Billion. Can I say billion?
>> Se 34 of a billion dollars. Um according to Boston um now they have a very high reimbursement rate uh a rate that we couldn't even dream of but it's around 80%. We might be 80. However, that only applies to reimburseable costs. And so
the amount that they're getting reimbursed is not 83% of $700 million. It is 83% of the smaller sum and altogether it's probably close to $300 million reimbursed $700 million. Well,
so it really matters about um you know what's reimburseable, what's not, and then uh your percentage. And currently our percentage is at 53% for this study. And that will change based on what this project begins to look like and what's reversible, what's not, where we score
points, where we don't. >> Change. >> I think the percentage could change. >> Not necessarily. >> It doesn't have to, but I have a lot of like >> I'm just saying it fluctuates and it's not constant from community to community. And I I have a lot of
reimbursement forms that publishes. So anyway, it's going to change a lot. It's not said right now. Um it's something that we should all pay attention to. Now to the SMMA team, my question um we saw 57 concepts um
yesterday and I I know that it's uh you know we had some sort of initial um I'll say just impression gathering um but certainly some of the shapes that we saw and some of I'll say the aspect ratios
um you know imply to me that um there are concepts that are not well suited for things like uh human deployment or potentially other um technologies whereas others are going to have better
just inherent attributes and I wanted to ask if all 57 are going to be sort of assessed for the kind of technologies that we're looking at or will we delay that assessment until we narrow down. uh can you walk us through kind of where
this subcommittee merges with I'll say the main line? Yeah. Um to have this impact. >> Yeah. So first we're at 29 versus 57. Um which to me if it makes me feel a little bit better 29 is still a big number,
right? um what we're going to be doing as we go forward, we're definitely going to add um I think solar suitability or compat whatever the terminology that into the overall um valuation criteria that the building committee and and consequently I think this advisory team
as well sort of a lens to look at the different options as we move forward um in terms of how the overlap of this advisory team's review and the SBC BC uh review works. Um I think we'll have to
to think through that timeline of exactly sort of what is being reviewed at particular points as we go forward. Um but we're not we're not going to be reducing probably from that 29 until we're getting into the PSR phase, the next phase of the feasibility study. So we will be getting together again here
before we make that reduction down. Um so there will be the opportunity for this group to actually um input on some of those topics. Um whatever those evaluation criteria are, the evaluation criteria should be set before we get to the PSR phase as we really jump into it.
Um and so I think we can also work to help craft and sort of evaluate whether or not we have all the correct evaluation criteria in that longer list. And again, it's not just solar um suitability. It's it's going to range everything from educational priorities to site amenities to community goals to
we're going to come up with what that list is, but there definitely will be overlapping um opportunities as we move forward before that 29 group is called to something smaller. And just so people are aware, we we're not going to jump from 29 to one u most likely in terms of
the process. there's going to be sort of a a short listing of it and then we'll probably make a final selection in terms of just what people can expect as part of the process. Right. So, I want to push us forward to embody carbon and I'm going to sort of just
tell our team, warn our team that we'll probably have to take a much more abbreviated um view of each of these because we have about 30 minutes left. Um, and some of these are going to be shorter topics, but I know it's it's definitely challenging asking everyone to do uh, but just to try to sort of
explain or maybe hit the high points because I'm sure that people here have um, thoughts and topics that they want to talk through. >> So, to be very brief, uh, lead is going to include a lot of sustainable materials, you know, looking at waste
and there's also a requirement for embodied carbon. So, there's a minimum there. what we want to look into and what we're going to continue to look into is to go beyond that minimum um as much as it's um you know feasible. Um
next so you know when we look at materials exterior materials we start looking at embodied carbon impact and a lot of the embodied carbon next push again. Yeah. A lot of the embodied carbon resides in the building enclosure and structures. There's a there's a there's a focus there, but that's not to
say that we're not going to look at other material. For example, ceiling tiles and and gypsum is pretty high carbon as well. So, so we look into that next. Um so, uh so low carbon concrete,
structural steel with high cycle content, um lowcarbon material insulation, gypsson ceilings and others. And the one other thing that's going to be discussed is um you know the the consideration that's we're curious to
understand from you the consider if you're interested in considering mass timber and wood structural component whether it's a full structure or a hybrid approach which is something we can look into uh but um mass timber obviously has an impact on reducing body
carbon >> that's it we can pause and get your your input from there >> and and just to add a little bit of sort of more specific commentary on the building. So, we have had some initial discussions with our structural engineer. Um, understanding that we have
about a 15t x 15 foot um structural grid at work in this building where we have the concrete frame portions of the building. Um, that structural grid dimension actually works pretty well with a mass timber structure. Um, if we're thinking about expanding horizontally or even if we're thinking
about expanding vertically on this existing concrete structure and not all the building is concrete structure, there are portions that are steel framed like the vocational wing, like the gym, like the pool. Um, so it it's already a little bit of a hybrid structural system that we have. Uh, but there there is
some inherent sort of compatibility um between the timber frame and then the concrete frame as it exists today. Just for what that's worth. So part of the discussion will be around you know wood structure will be to look
at you know the appetite for the full well the full new components um or hybrid option um and we're you know curious to know what sort of where this group falls in terms of interest
for that >> I guess I would would expect this is a little bit repeated sort of the broader theme, but sort of viewing that in the broader context of uh the schedule and the budget, right?
And and if if timber framing I don't I don't know sort of one versus the other, but if if that's going to add cost, uh you know, where where would you recommend that we that we you know
sacrifice that cost from say somewhere else? uh based on you know prior our experience I think seeing you know everything's going to have a trade-off right as you're as you're working through it. Yeah. And I think this this group is
also about sort of establishing some of those priorities and talking about sort of where from a larger community perspective because we have a lot of really great voices as part of this group um just to understand and it may be different for different um perspectives and roles or responsibilities within the city as
well. >> I think we should definitely look at a hybrid system. I I I would imagine we won't end up with a full mass timber system just for various reasons, but we're in the woods, not just for the carbon footprint, but for the we don't miss that exhibit. It seems like something should be definitely studied.
We'll see how it comes out in terms of the budget. But >> using mass timber also allows for less use of other materials like you can have exposed ceilings and things. >> Yeah. >> So there's the trade-off there.
and and and exposed wood has been shown to you know ties to biofilia. This is human health connection to it too. Um thanks. So I don't know very much about it. Um in terms of typical
uh facility volumes that utilize mass timber, is there any limit on the size of the structure? Um or is there kind of like a do not exceed size for dealing with wood? And I'm thinking about you know it's got superior mechanical
properties relative to metal. Um and so like spans are something you got to think about stiffness and all that. So I wonder um are there like some limitations on how big because from yesterday I have an understanding that this is going to be a very large
structure and so uh if you could provide some commentary on applicability of uh timber on a very very large structure that's probably larger what we have today. >> Yeah. So I think there's two ways to think about it. One is sort of what I was alluding to previously in terms of
the structural grid dimensions that exist and sort of what timber can do in terms of um traditional spans without getting too deep. Right? Because we're thinking about a renovation of this existing building with a 12t 10 floor to floor height. Um dropping um significant
depths in terms of any type of structural frame is going to limit our ceiling heights and impact our indoor environment um in terms of probably in a detrimental way in terms of making it feel very compressed. Um but from like a how big can we go with um the mass ter
from an overall building standpoint. I think that's really driven more by building code is going to be like the limitation that gets put on that. Um and that's true for any type of structural system gets classified into um a particular construction type and we're allowed um overall height um limitations
and horizontal distance limitations. It's not to say that we can't separate the building um using firewalls and other things to sort of extend the the the realistic extent of how far we can go with it. Um it's really just being able to work through the constraints of
the building code more than anything in terms of understanding how much we produce. >> And is there like an additional burden for fire prevention and sprinklers and things like that relative to a concrete level structure or is it equivalent? So that there definitely is a connection
in terms of the relative fire resistance of any structural system um and how how far we can go before we have to separate the building or how high we can go before we separate the building. Um there the way that mass chamber works is that it chars the structural or the
building code assumes that it chars on the outside before it completely fails in terms of a structure. Right? And so it it's accounting for um when we give us when they gives us the aerial limitations and the height limitations like the time involved in terms of fire
tests and what it's been proven to um sprinkler systems will increase those limitations in terms of what we can build to again whether it's concrete or whether it's steel or whether it's wood of any type. Um so all those things work together in terms of driving sort of
what each structural system might allow us to do. Um but definitely is connected into things like fire protection systems. Um and fireproofing of the actual structural members themselves as well. Um whether that's like applying something to them, whether it's a
messening coating or a spray fireproofing um or sort of wrapping the members with another type of material that's fire resistant like a a drywall or chip support. So it there's a lot of sort of complex interreationships from a building code
perspective in terms of dictating what those restrictions are. So >> this school was built because the fire school burned down the street from me. >> Concrete is a from a fire resistance standpoint is a wonderful material. It will not burn right and you can build as
far as you want to and as high as you want to really without limitations is what the code tells us. and that sort of how that equates to its fire resistance. Um so yes and that's most certainly one of the reasons why this was built on concrete primarily but we do have some
steel right in terms of those longer span longer span spaces. All right, the last comment. >> Okay, we can always come back to it too.
>> All right, hopefully this >> So, um let's try to real quick. So, you know, last meeting um there was a obviously comments around daylight um obviously um maybe challenging or limited in this
current structure. Um the new design will definitely optimize and access to views and daylight to the majority of the you know classrooms program space to you know the extent possible.
um whether it's side light side or you know in some places we'll have top light you know um and then uh air quality was another um so you know there's going to be more talk about this uh ventilation obviously
ventilation quality just quickly lead has a set of criteria that brings um high environmental high indoor air quality um so all of those will be part of the project and then occupant experience in terms of interior
lighting, acoustical, thermal comfort, all of those are also inherent in lead. But that's not to say that there's going to be a set of of discussion in and criteria beyond lead that's going to be brought up as part of the design of the project. operable windows for for
example um uh passive survivability that was mentioned earlier on there's potential to look into mix mode um in terms of using outdoor air when you know when possible and natural ventilation
when possible etc and then um the construction indoor air quality practice so there's a whole set of lead that looks at the construction practices and and sort of requires um uh a a set of practices that is going to sort of
help indoor quality. Um so cleaning and flush out flush out is big. They actually yeah flush out is big. Um and then there's testing and then healthfulness beyond lead. Um it requires red list materials. um at at
there's a minimum we're currently um applying readiness material to a very high level in in other projects and so we're looking forward to share that expertise and those opportunities and that doesn't mean the fellow about the cost is is gone but it doesn't mean it's
going to cost more it's about vetting the right materials um bofailia flush out and then um there's a whole component of healthful healthfulness that's tied into um the site and so the
site discussions are going to address this. We're not going to go in detail about this today, but they're very much into um looking at the you know major opportunities offered with the proximity of the bel um and sort of the the
landscape around and then environmental literacy. Um you know we talked about aldula classrooms a bit um that was brought up as well. Green vegetated roots was something that was brought up that we'll talk about. And then we uh we
usually do a quite extensive uh set of signage uh which sort of combines um the all of the sustainability criteria throughout the school um and combines it with with um sort of an set of imagery
and language that can support uh the educational program. Um in this project you also have the great opportunity of your um vocational program which can be tied even clo more closely to u
sustainable design um whether it's it's certain things that they will do within their program or whether it's interacting with some of the building components. Um, for example, the culinary um can include a portion of the
kitchen that's all electric because that's where commercial kitchens are going. Um, the automate auto automotive uh can look into um electric cars, right? And and things can be set up for it. So th those discussions are going to
come through as as we progress through the design. >> Yeah, just with those two items actually in particular. So the culinary arts folks are completely happy with doing fully electric kitchen already. So that will not be sort of the hill that we have to climb and and certainly the automotive technology folks are asking
us to plan for electric vehicle um stations. So they they're very much on board here I think from a CTE perspective in terms of where we're thinking. >> I thought they just got a grant or sign of a program to bring some equipment in to stop being able to service electric cars. they have. There's a little bit of a spatial um backup right now in terms
of how many bays that they have to work with and what they can do, but definitely as we're planning, we're thinking of specific bays for EVs. >> The kitchen is is a big deal because it it ties into the the code in the fossil. So, if we can eliminate the gas cooking
in the teaching kitchen and in the main kitchen, then we're eliminating that that PV requirement, that electrification requirement. So, that's great. Yeah. And actually the main kitchen as well um all electric is going to be perfectly fine. >> Um so Sunny, you had your hand up. And
I'm also going to just note that um we're happy to have Sunny here because of HMFH's work that they've done with Redless Materials through the MSBA. There's a wealth of knowledge that we're definitely going to tap into you for. So >> yeah, I think that's great. I mean I Redlist materials are things that we can
do on any project without additional cost. There are a few few particular components within buildings that do cost a little bit more, but it's an open. I'm curious and maybe it's um because of my knowledge
about this if there's confusion around all electric gas because um the option specialized code doesn't require you to be all electric. You do have hybrid options, right? However, Right. There's an electrification
requirement for lead by. >> It's a credit. >> It's not a prere. >> It's not a prere. >> So that that was my confusion. I just want to make sure and I >> He's gone. [laughter] I um I don't remember everyone's names, but just to his point, I
>> I do want to acknowledge that that is a system option and that if we don't study it, I'm not certain we're showing people we've done our due diligence. I think it's important for all resident or all Medford residents to understand that you
have studied it and it doesn't cost out. I know it won't, but sometimes it does. And I think that's important for people to look at. I know that if you use gas, we have to put it on the roof. We should be putting on our roof anyway because that's what requires. And just because we're a school doesn't mean you
shouldn't comply with that. But I think that's important to acknowledge and and bringing all community members along. I think we have a pretty like varied population here in Medford. And I think it's important that when we go to vote for this, we show that we've done that due diligence.
>> So So what you're suggesting is that on top of the all electric options, we look at a natural gas option, which we have done in other project and we can certainly >> Yeah, I do. I I don't prefer that and I think we should go ground sourced pumps all the way. is going to be the most efficient. It will have the better
payback if it's viable. >> I that's my personal viewpoint on that. I think that's the way to go. I think >> we should figure that out whether or not there's an additional system because grant source isn't always the most efficient for all of the things that you're doing inside the buildings. Um so
the one thing I want to say is when we look at that because of the specialized food the cost of the natural grass is going to have to include the solar photo voltage. >> Absolutely. I totally agree. >> Whereas the all electric one. So it's going to have to be a a real comparison
so everybody understand what's implied right >> into choosing the fossil fuel versus the all electric. >> That's part of the story. >> And and sometimes the added cost of solar sort of brings that up in costa looks right like a better com not maybe
better comparison but it's more similar comparison ground seats or air source seat pumps. I'm glad to see we're not studying BRF. Not a fan of that. And I think it's great for a school not to consider that at all. Um I know that that's I don't know if mass save incentives are changing at all, but it'd be really good
to understand where the heat pump matters are in terms of our reimbursement separate from MSBA. >> So when when we get into the LCCA, I can explain that. It's too bad he had to leave. But hopefully you'll watch the the record of it because we're gonna
we're gonna talk about the specific. Yeah, absolutely. The incentives are something we need to make sure that >> we pursue upfront, right? And we we should be we'll probably be connecting with them um in towards the end of feasibility or right at the beginning of
as the act there needs to be a connection soon be sorry this but I do also think there have been a couple of comments about fees or passive passive pass >> the pass to pass certification
>> um there was an excellent uh webinar on that through B+ the other day. Um, which is architect's jargon for extra learning credits. And so anyway, um, and I I think that should we should talk about
this here. That's like a serious topic because I think there are a lot of soft costs added to that that will make it that are pretty significant that I'm not sure people really understand. Although like in terms of energy modeling, you were thanking
but I know that that versus Teddy can be tricky and trying to convey what that means to everyone. >> Yeah, this school is over.5 CSM per square foot. So we can curve our own tenny. >> Okay. Well, that's good to know. >> Um but we uh absolutely can pro because
we've done that. We have an idea of some of the cost of passive. we can bring that in as I don't know an item because it was brought up and so we took we took notes on we can certainly >> but to your point about the 29 57
>> options by the 29 >> 29 just 29 >> yeah 29 like ones >> oh that's what it was okay yeah because some of them were grayed >> out Oh, it's still 57. >> You do. I think that's important. Like you've done a lot of research to narrow
that down already. I think that's great. Um, but if we're going passive house, they require you to analyze the envelope, right? And to your point about understanding whether or not one building is better than the other. Like envelope area is a big one, right? And
and we know the path of pass looks at that. So, I know we haven't narrowed down the criteria for what like how we're going to add these like MEP sustainability things to help narrow that down, but I think like trying to figure out where
this is going for those particular goals because like I think there's a huge different difference between a goal and a strategy, right? We're here to set goals. We're you're here to give us strategies and so we want to be able to be effective in setting those goals. And
so trying to understand like what that means here I think is really important. >> Yep. Thank you. So I do think that's great and that's great to hear your feedback on that because um we will take that you know we'll take that back and I think
your comment about passive house is well taken. >> Yeah. And I think there's another level to it as well in terms of the soft costs are associated right. There's one thing to design to passive house with passive house strategies, right? So that we minimize um loss through the envelope
and we sort of try to minimize the amount of ventilation that we're going to um be having to expend energy on versus actually going for a certification and paying sort of for the third party oversight and registration those types of things. So we probably need to make that decision as well um or
recommendation for that decision um as we go forward. Um, but we can start to get a little bit of a sense of what the soft costs are as well on top of like the capital costs that would actually go into the building. Well, I think that raises a good broader point that was mentioned earlier as well that that you
know the the sign on the building is nice. It's something that the community could sort of hold up, but at the end of the day, uh, you know, that might be nice for the ribbon cutting, but at the end of the day, like the utility costs are going to be what they are. uh and some of these
other as we're thinking about what's the payback on the structure. Well, there's been a lot of money spent to to get that certification just for the sake of getting the certification. It doesn't I don't I don't know
>> better. >> Yeah, that's right. Like design it design it to like what the certification says and commission it. But then if if we don't go forward with the certification like the students are still getting the positive value and educators are still getting value
>> from the efficiency that >> and the the taxpayers >> and and president easy to understand costbenefit analyses for a lot of decisions because one thing that we can't escape is the square footage of
what's proposed is enormous and that's a direct proxy for cost. Correct. And regardless of what we do, it's going to be a big number. >> So now we want to start adding things in. They have to be justified because they're not going to be aggregated to a big number. They're going to be be
they're going to be piling onto an already big number. >> Correct. >> But I think it's also looking at the life cycle costs because it's also projecting into the future because it's not just what we're building today. I mean, we can put all these elements in and it's not what is, you know, yeah,
the certifications are nice, but it's what do we put in today when we have costs that are being partially paid for today and we're getting help being paid for, but we're not going to have help with the operating costs down the line. And I think that's critical to think
about too is how do we operate this building in the future and what's going to pay for it in the future to operate? Are there things beyond need like uh with water that we can look at? I didn't really talk anything about water consumption. You have a cool.
>> So, so yes, these things we're going to dive more into >> right there. [laughter] >> I think there's free swim in the mornings. But but these the all these different areas of sustainable design um
coming from your comments and also from lead are going to be are going to be in in future meetings are going to be looked into in more detail. We just browse through it now because we don't have the time just like we're browsing. >> So we are and I I'm cognizant of the fact that we have five minutes left. I
see that Jenny has her hand up. So I want to give you just a couple minutes Jenny and then I just want to wrap us up at the end. Um, again, I think we actually have touched on a lot of what we've gone through with the slides. So, hopefully few people don't feel like they're missing out.
>> Just for everyone, for the person that that had to go. So, the life cycle cost analysis, this 50-year life cycle cost analysis. that's done uh required by MSBA and it's not just comparing the systems, it's comparing the whole
building uh enclosure, electrical and mechanical um and it's looking at first cost which is you know you're referring to installation cost which is first cost replacement costs throughout those 15 years. So it touches
on some operating cost and maintenance costs on top of energy cost. All of those are combined over 50 years. We put in cost escalation. We also look at upfront incremental costs comparing the systems including the fossil fuel and we
also add on to those in potential incentives. I'll leave it to that. We can talk a bit more at at the next meeting, but it's pretty comprehensive and I think it will help the conversation support the conversation about systems. >> Okay, Jenny, go ahead.
>> Thanks, Matt. Um, I just wanted to um maybe flag a couple things and um thank [clears throat] everyone for their thoughts. Some there's been some like really interesting things discussed and I'm not an expert in this area so I definitely am learning a lot. The two
things I wanted to flag is that when the school committee commissioned the building committee, they they did set forth a goal of lead B5. So that's not to say the school committee would be completely unwilling to understand what
the impact of that was. Um but that original charge did provide some language about um our collective sustainability goals and that being sort of uh pushed towards the gold standard was important. So I do
think we need to continue to consider that as an option so that we can make informed decisions. Um, I am a a huge fan of not saying no to things at this early stage because we don't know enough to say no. We don't
want things. Um, and I just want to sort of flag that I'm super supportive of like looking at all the options whether they're ones I particularly like or don't like. Um, and then I think the other thing, Matt, that maybe we can
talk about offline is to provide um this group and the public in general with some transparency on what it costs in the current environment to heat and electrify this building. It is like the
numbers are just shocking. like I intuitively know that they're high and they surprise me every time that I hear about them. So I and I don't think the sort of general public has any sense of what those numbers are. Um and they're
not particularly easy to find, but I think we can do a better job of helping people understand this current building and what it costs us. Um because I think that's um I think that's hugely important. And I think the other thing that was sort of on my mind as I was
listening to the conversation um is how helpful this group will be when we are thinking about criteria by which to make narrowing down kinds of decisions so that we aren't throwing the baby out with the bathwater so to speak.
um but instead sort of thinking about the expertise in this room and the people who do this work for a living um helping guide us. So I appreciate everyone who's been here and Matt we can talk about some of those other things um at some point in time and maybe bring
those things back to this group. >> Sounds great. Okay. And so to wrap up in a minute or probably a little less than a minute um again we're going to be meeting in March. March 11th is the next date um for this advisory team to get together. It's going to be at 4 p.m. We'll most likely be in this room. I
think we're still going to keep the hybrid format uh because this has worked pretty well. Terms of the activity that we're going to be doing, again, you may have all heard this as you came in towards the end of the last meeting, but um for record purposes and those online, um we will be um coming up with a series
of line item recommendations and like an Excel document, we're going to be using a uh traffic signal analogy. Um, we're going to be treating some of these things as given recommendations, things that there no question or discussion that everyone's in agreement that we'll make a recommendation back to the
building committee on. There will be some yellow flashing uh light items that are going to warrant discussion that we'll use the time to actually work our way through. Um, and then there may also be some uh red light options that are just things that are not going to be recommended to be um included in the
project um moving forward. Um so again, these recommendations, this group is not making um decisions on those items. Um we're going to be forwarding recommendations back to the building committee um as a group and it'll be sort of in a a line item type of format um with these sort of colors associated
with them. Luke has one final question and still under past not seven o'clock yet, but it may go there. >> All right. Hopefully it's a productive question. So um you know uh let's see, we've got a couple of months until March. Um there are a lot of things that
we have not talked about. Um I appreciate the overview and introduction to a lot of different concepts. Um some technologies um but there are a lot of things that uh I've seen at other schools that I think are really good um in terms of energy
efficiency in terms of a lot of like secondary benefits specific technologies that haven't been brought up. Um and I understand that we're tied on time. We have an hour and a half and there's a lot to get through and we always ask questions and so slow
things down. Uh there's only so much to cram into the hour and a half, but um prior to this meeting where we're going to be uh stoplighting or or traffic coloring um different ideas, preferences, um I was wondering should
we expect any read aheads or should we expect any solicitations where we can suggest some technologies um to consider as part of the stoplighting activity. Uh the one that I'll just make a plug for that I really like. Um if we have a tall
vertical structure and we have a lot of different shapes to to work through and it may not be tall vertical, but if it is tall and vertical, are there ways to like harness uh just the natural wind, we're already pretty high up. We're probably like 100 feet up. Um, so you
know, there's some of that to kind of tap into for, you know, energy savings and, uh, like light wells that Arlington do really, really well. Um, that bring,
>> wow, that's like a setup for you to say. I I I walked through there when they had the uh you know open house in the community and um thought that the effect was really great and and it varies as you go like you know through the
elevation but it was like really great in the library. Um but it was also really effective at bringing daylight into like a large volume that if it were closed you'd be spending money to illuminate, right? Um, so schools held
during the day, it's not cloud, there's a lot of sunshine. We happen to be pretty high up and there's really not a lot of tree obscuration. So, you know, um, I want to make a plug for >> I think with those types of thinkers, I think so. Yes, we'll we'll find a
mechanism probably through the whole building committee that um, people can bring up ideas. Okay. You have that connection to the committee as well. Um, so maybe we can work with you just as sort of being a conduit to sort of rate some of those ideas and include them in the list for consideration. >> Can I just ask you a question about that
just for everyone to think of like those are really great strategies for achieving a goal, right? So those light wells, the goal was daylight at time. So maybe that's something that we discuss here as a goal so that they can start to
consider things like light wells or the wind like the purpose of that is zero energy. I like >> time's your enemy though because in June you have to have like a >> you have to have goals before you can develop strategy. So I think like we
don't want to put the card before the horse in the sense right. So I think those are excellent strategies and I do think we should keep them as means for us like achieving goals but understanding what the actual goals I think is our task
>> and then you get to decide the strategy on >> I don't think our agenda like meeting agendas just being devil's advocate I'm not being argumentative but from what I've seen you know with our prepared agendas uh we're not on a path to develop
um in time for when a preferred design is to be sort of presented to the NSPA, we would have to potentially change approach. >> I mean the recommended approach design approach is going to be at schematic design when that final package goes in
which is not till >> early 2027. >> I think we okay I thought we had like a June and July deadline. That's a preferred schematic report, but it's going to be at still a higher level where we do want to identify correct plot for this like there will be
top lighting >> because uh you know our schools have lighting it's it's you know but you know to Sunni's point you know is there a specific goal for it you know that's that's something that we you know we
want to hear. Okay. Yeah, I take back I thought we had a much shorter response. >> What what you're seeing in those 29 options is is high level massing, a lot of the design is not in there yet,
right? Um but but that's not to say that all of those items that you feel near and dear for they they need to be brought up now. they they can be you know integrated I think towards the end of feasibility into schematic design but
it's best to bring some of those now on this um >> I'm going to cut us off because we are five minutes over and we certainly appreciate anyone that has hung out with us but um I do want to respect people's times thank you this was a wonderful discussion and I really do appreciate like the level of understanding and
feedback that we've been able to get from this group um that it's just really invaluable go in terms of the process. So, thank you