Good evening and welcome to the 20th meeting of fiscal year 2026. Um at this time I would like to now call the meeting to order and by begin by um introducing the members of the planning board and our staff like to begin. >> Sure. Cheryl Tagayas secretary
>> Sean Fei member Elmer member >> and and Meredith Hall serving as chair and tonight on Zoom we also have um Maggie. >> It's on mute. >> You're on mute Maggie. Sorry, Maggie. Field member.
>> Great. And tonight with us also on Zoom, um we have our um planning director. Uh Liz, if you'd like to introduce yourself. >> Planning director. Thank you. >> Thank you. All right. Um so now we can
uh move to our um administrative items. Uh first we have our meeting minutes. Um we have um we had four sets of minutes from our last meeting that um we had deferred and we have um meeting minutes
from March 12th and 26th. I have not had a chance to look at the 12th and the 26th. Um Sean, I know you're you're set with those. Cheryl and Maggie, were you able to review the um it would be October 9th, October 23rd,
the um October 27th, and November 13th. Um, so if we'd like to go through those, starting with um, October 9th, I had just a few
minor things. Um, on the first page, um, under public comment, third, the fourth line down, it says he added, it just needs the S removed.
Okay, this will be key added. Um, page two and page three, second paragraph, first sentence. Um, it was the same thing. I think there must have been something with the typewriter actually. Um, the last line in the first paragraph also
then reached the S needs to be crossed off that >> um Mr. Guys mentioned in the next line uh that S also needed to be removed. And then in the fourth paragraph on the
fourth line, she added needs to be added. Um, that was just >> something that was sticking. It was sticking. >> You're good at catching these. And >> sometimes I think with when you're trying to show that it's crossed out on
what you're adding, it gets >> in there. >> Right. Exactly. Um and then um let's see I think and then okay on the under Milton Village local historic district discussion
um Mr. Laughafler it's actually L A WF Ler U Mr. Laughler. And then it's also um down um under it where it begins Ms.
Oldfield says Mr. Wild. Um M the second line Laughler um is spelled incorrectly. It's L A W L F L A W F L E R. And that's all I had on those. Um did anybody else have anything
on October 9th? Okay. Um, so maybe I don't know if we want to do these individually or all together. So far, okay, we'll keep going. Um, so then October 23rd under staff update, um,
Miss Manning asks, there's an S again, that friendly S, and in the following sentence, Miss Das suggested that needs to lose the S. uh first sentence uh first line in the
next paragraph is Manning discussed that needs to lose the s and then the first sentence in the um last paragraph mystic guys explained uh that needs to lose the s um
then on the very last paragraph of the second page um Mr. guys explained that the emp recommends the formation um oh sorry it's actually um the second
sentence where it says she said there is a lot should of content it just says a lot content so I think it needs an of in between lot and content okay Um there was um
this is uh there were two two paragraphs I actually I I know I understand you were trying to cross it out but I thought it might be important to include on the the first paragraph of the of the third page. >> Is it possible for Liz or
>> Yeah. to bring it up. >> Yep. >> The typos I don't think I need to see, but bring a paragraph back to see it. >> I might >> I might pull on this, which I just thought >> were important. >> What would you What would you like me to do? Pull up the page.
>> Can you pull up the >> the the uh the minutes from the um the third page of October 3rd? Okay. October 23rd. Yes. Yeah,
>> that's it. >> How's that? Good. And then page three. >> And then page three, please. >> And then that it's the top, the very first paragraph >> right here. >> Yes. >> And again, I thank Cheryl for going through this and taking a lot of this
content out. This is the first paragraph. Um, Mr. Behe says he wants to collaboratively create an article that they can say the planning board unanimously supports and does not want to rush creation of a committee that serves an important process. Miss Hall
said the planning board has a responsibility to extend the implementation time frame. She says she didn't realize it last year when the Empic was being extended that it should have been something that the planning board had voted on. I
>> thought there was some duplication. So, can you just scroll back? Yeah, if there is someone might recognize. So, there's where it says to work collaboratively to create an article together. So, I thought it was covered
there, but if you didn't think if you don't think it's covered there, >> where are you? I'm sorry. >> The paragraph that begins with Mr. Fe >> the second one on the second page. >> Uh oh, sorry. I'm just looking on the screen. So I'm not sure which page that is. That's like second page. Yeah, page
two. So where it says Mr. Fehee recognizes >> that is important committee that the subboard and planning initially proposed this committee >> and it says the process was rushed. So I I thought I thought that was like kind
of repetitive. So that's why >> I'm fine with that. Okay. I just wanted to make sure we had noted that you know the the planning board had thought we we would have had input um on that. Um and then the next which was sort of similar and again this
>> it may be another one of those repetitive >> I don't think I was trying to pick out content. >> No right um one two three on the fourth page um the third paragraph um if you could pull
that up. Uh, Miss Hall said she wants to make sure that communication is coming is coming through. Um, >> I wasn't sure what that that first sentence meant. >> I know. I know that doesn't really recommendations make sense to me. >> To the planning board and collaborate with consultant. Um,
>> and the MP volunteer. >> Yeah, that one I don't know why that that I'm fine with. So, sorry. Yeah. >> Um and then just the last paragraph um of that miss where it says Miss Manning provides
>> provide it should be provided. >> Provided that was yeah it had a D there. So provided um and then that was it for that one. um and jump in anyone then the 27th
I don't think I didn't have anything on that was all fine and then uh November 13th um uh under future meeting dates Miss Hull said the planning board will it either
needs to be will not be meeting the week of or will not meet and you added Oh, you did take out the cross that off. So, will not me. Never mind. Or um I didn't see that was crossed off.
Um and then the second page um uh she's interested the second line she's interested in connecting them about connecting with them about the 40B projects and it should have a I think
two to better understand. >> So a two after and understand. >> Yeah. Um he's on the same page the second to last paragraph um which starts with Miss Oldfield the
third line down document from NAPC of of the same. I think you would just said of same. >> Okay. >> So of the same um sound better. And then the last paragraph um first line after
discussed has a s and then the second line after November 10th she suggested that uh needs to lose that s. >> So every time it changed from present tense to past tense the s didn't but it
didn't get eliminated. >> Okay. >> Um and then introduction of Michael White. the second line. Um where it says on the second line and he has um Ben I think the you you took out Ben
trying to but I think the Ben needs to stay in. He had Ben working to understand. Um, so keeping bed and then that might have been all right on that last page under fiscal
year 27 planning board budget. Um, two the second paragraph down from that uh there's just a um it says Miss Hall on the second line. in this hall saids
I I think noted maybe that KP law would sound better. Um so it's and then the last sentence um on that page um Miss Hall seconded that just needs to lose the Sing
since I think these are mostly clerical. Liz, do you think that you can >> pick these can pick these up without a need for us to resubmit them? >> Yeah. Okay. >> All right. >> Yeah, he'll Yeah, he'll one of us is going to have to listen to the recording
anyway. So, so we'll we'll get them that way. >> Yeah. Little I mean little minor things, but um okay, with that um if I could have a motion to approve the meeting minutes for October 9th, October 23rd, October 27th, and November 13th
>> as some corrected >> as as amended. >> Amended and corrected. Okay. >> Is there a second? >> Second. >> All in all in favor? We have to do a roll call because um Maggie's online. So, uh Maggie. Yes, Cheryl. >> Yes.
>> Yes. >> And myself. Yes. Sorry. How you We're going to be caught up really soon, so that was Sorry to um go through, but we have just a lot of house house cleaning today. Housekeeping. >> Good to get it done. >> It is. It is. Um
so then our future meeting dates um we currently have scheduled are June 11th and June 25th. We have the 28th as well, right? >> April, I mean, >> oh, I'm sorry. We have May 28th. Yes,
May. I was jumping to June already. And May 28th is our next our last meeting of May. >> June dates again. >> Um, June 11th and and the 25th of June. >> The 28th. Um, and then staff update,
Liz. >> Great. Thank you so much. Apologies for not being there in person for your uh first meeting member Munger. >> Uh it's just been a long week. Um so I I
kind of took advantage especially with the with the rainy night. >> Um so and typically what I what Avanti and I have tried to do um pal is to create a written report at least once a month for the board for this um for this
agenda topic. So, that that's going to that you'll see at the uh the meeting on the 28th. I I initially was had high hopes to be able to have a written report every two weeks, but I I got I got realistic real quick. Um and it's also good, too, because it gives us as a staff the opportunity to kind of catch
up on on projects that each of us are working on individually and just sort of, you know, kind of get together on priorities and timelines and what have you. So, um, just very quickly, uh, the work with the, um, the MO on the Vision
Zero project at Granite A and um, East Quantum or West Guanum rather, which I I've I've updated folks in the past on. There's going to be a meeting next week um, on that project. There's trying to figure out the day right now. Um, more than happy to bring anybody up to speed
on that project with more detail if they're interested. You can reach out to me separately. um don't have a ton of information on this but there is a housing works grant being put together um for the uh stretch between Guile road
and um Reedsdale at Canton to do some uh infrastructure upgrades there so that I believe is going in I think that's kind of coming under the opices of the um the engineering office and the DPW very busy with um two signs already with
under the new bylaw for the gardener school and for to Elliot. Uh had a great conversation today with um the admin in the zoning office uh Bill Donley in terms of you know how can we sync these things up? How can we make sure that
once they're once they're done with the sign review committee that you know it doesn't sort of start all over again at day one for these applicants. So we had some really good conversations about that. Uh and had a bit bit of a back and forth with Kathleen O'Donnell as well. um kind of put her in the loop with all
of the um documentation which can get confusing. So I would so I need to be careful. I can't be duplicating like the zoning board's process and I don't want to be duplicating their submittals or what have you. I don't want to create confusion. But with this being brand new, I really wanted to make sure that
they had everything that I had as quickly as possible. So, those are getting teed up, fingers crossed, for a zoning board hearing um as potentially as early as June 18th. So, that's pretty that's that's that's
pretty much as quick as you probably could go. Um and so you've got that library letter. Um it was really just a very quick reflection of um the conversation that took place at the uh board's meeting um probably six weeks
ago now. Took me a bit to put it together. Um so that's in your in your uh folder. If you have any questions about that, feel free to ask me. Um some good progress on the housing production plan as well. Um I'll just kind of put in a plug. I know that's a later topic,
but um I'll put in a plug that it'll be easier for me if the two planning board reps are planning board members. I'm just throwing that out there. >> Um and so I know you guys want to have that conversation about that about your whether it's a member of the board or if it's a designate.
>> Um I've got the contract. I worked with Nick on the contract for the zoning recotification. um he's going to be able to get that money encumbered and um had a quick chat today. I can't even believe it. I literally have not caught my breath for
Monday night. And he was like, "Yeah, um if you guys are going to do anything for the fall, like we're going to need it like in the next like six to eight weeks." So, um, so my thought on that was if there is something that the board really wants to go with quickly,
well, if we've got KP under contract soon, then perhaps that's, you know, could be could be folded into that into that scope. I don't know. I I don't want to get ahead of anything, but that's just a just a thought. Um, and then the
last thing is the um the EFA um process that MAPC took care of took care of took that they that they worked on for us in the fall. Um, I I've been kind of playing phone tag with them to figure out where that where that approval is. So, so more to more to come on that. So,
that's that's pretty much it, guys. >> That's great. And I just want to say, Liz, great job at at town meeting. you really um I thought did a wonderful job with the presentation. So, and having questions fired, you know, from members,
you were very well prepared and and handled everything very well. So, um any questions for Liz on anything? >> No, I just want to make one comment. I think she provided the most abbreviated response at a town meeting to any
question that's ever been asked. And I hope we all could follow the model that you have set forth. >> Great. >> I I feel I I I was just talking to someone about that today. I said, I've got to find out who that was because I feel like I need to apologize because I
am never that abrupt. Ever. >> Your I think your answer was accurate. That's all that matters. >> It was. So anyhow, >> and I think the members appreciated the brevity. So >> great job. Yeah. for a long article that you know the the it's it's like
everything else probably true for all of our work you know what you and Hal do and what Meredith does and what Maggie and I do preparation is is really key to everything and your presentation was so well prepared with what was up on the screen for people to
to read and it uncomplicated what could have been very complicated if we didn't have that up on the screen and you hadn't created the flowcharts Liz um it would have been very difficult for the members to understand, you know, how do you go about, you know, getting a sign permit? Um, you made it simple. So, to
you and Avante and everybody involved in the preparation side of it, great job. >> And even the images at the end, I thought were good to start. >> Yeah. >> Excellent. >> Um, I had a question. What Liz, what was that last topic you you covered with I didn't pick that up.
>> The last one. >> So, that was the e e catch me guys if I've got this wrong. economic feasibility analysis. Okay. EFA. >> Oh, EFA. That's what I Okay. All right. I didn't I didn't catch the acronym. Okay. Thank you.
>> That's great. and we're just waiting on a letter um from them with their supporting um and is that Liz, did they do they communicate directly with um HLC or is
that for up to us to close that loop with them and send issue that letter? That's that's what I'm trying to that's what I'm trying to understand with Adam Pletz who is the um the housing um manager at MAPC. Okay.
>> So I we we're we're >> I called him, he called me back. We just haven't connected. So hopefully have at least an update >> and they've done it for other communities, so they'll be very familiar with the process. So that's great. >> Okay, good. Um
Okay. anything that you're that's uh you're good on that report, Liz. That's the staff update. >> Yep. >> All right. So, next um we have public comment. Um >> can I jump in before public comment because um >> I just I'm just noting the upcoming
dates 528 and 611. And I'll be away for both of those. So, I I I am going to walk the Camino and uh I'll be gone from 5:26 to 6:14. So, I won't be present for those two meetings. >> Okay, that's cool. >> Impressive.
>> Yes. >> Um >> Okay. >> Yeah. >> All right. And um anyhow, you know why I'm >> But um uh the the only comment I had on the meeting minutes, the two that were in the folder for today, >> and and you know, when you get around to
looking at them, it's real simple, but there's a comment that I that uh is attributed to me in regard to the um to the EMP and and it it reads that, you know, Sean thinks the EMP um is an
advisory committee. that what that doesn't reflect what I said. I know it's an advisory committee. It's not a thought. I mean, that was an article we we passed in town meeting. So, I know it's an advisory committee. That's the only thing I'd like that to be corrected for the record. >> Like, think probably to
um >> however, however the wording reflects. Yeah. You know, um you know, it's not a thought. It's it's it was a statement really more than anything else. >> State that. Yeah. >> Yeah. That'd be great. That was it. Other than that, those two when you get
around to it because I don't >> 12th or the 26th. I >> can't remember. I can't remember which one it was. Um, >> but anyhow, other than that, I didn't have any other comment on those minutes and I don't want to slow down the process of of getting them out. So, >> that's great.
>> All right. Um so now um if there is anyone um we don't have anyone here um to speak but I don't know if if anyone wants to speak who's online. Um if there's any comments or questions you can raise your hand.
I'm not seeing any. >> Can Can you guys see the participants? There's no attendees. >> Yeah. >> Okay. >> Okay. Um okay. So um so with that um next item on the
agenda um is the is our um annual committee appointments which typically um many of the appointments um that our committee we we sit on various committees. you probably are aware um they tend to be one-year appointments,
but some people are either on assign, you know, they're assigned to a committee right now. So, the question is, do people want to stay on that committee or, you know, or do they want to do something different? So, that's the time that we'll talk about that. Um, currently, um, Cheryl sits on the CPC.
She's as representative. Do are you an affordable housing? Is there an affordable housing commission? >> No. Okay. >> So, um, right now it's just the CPC. >> Just the CPC, which I think that's and
part of I think what's good is there's certain cycles of timing of things. So, um, >> so for the CPC in in the event that someone else wanted to to do it, it's the applications are due um at the end
of the month. >> So, they haven't been reviewed yet. So, it's actually >> it would be an okay, >> it would be an okay time to change if somebody else really wanted to do it. Um, >> I don't mind ro, you know, rotation of committees, but I'm I'm happy to
continue with it. It's interesting and it's actually interesting to hear all of the projects that come in. But, um, but if it if it is a good time to do it, this is it, right? In terms of the timing. >> Yep. Um, I've been on the open space and recreation committee. Um, we are
hopefully wrapping this up. We're in a final phase. This has been going on for four years. So, I've, you know, I'm happy to stay on because I think what we're doing right now is so important because it is cleaning up all the maps
of our town because even the conservation commission does not know what is necessarily what is conservation, what is in conservation, what is what is protected conservation in perpetuity. Um, we're looking at what is DCR land and there's confusion on
some of the DCR parcels. So, I'm been working to reach out to DCR to try to get a whole list. We also dissolved our our um land trust. Milton had a land trust that was dissolved. Some of those parcels went to the Wildlands um
organization and then some went to the concom. So, I'm trying to get a colored map so people, you know, from the parks department can say, "Gosh, you know, could we put a playground somewhere and they'll know what's, you know, what's town owned, what's not in conservation,
and just make it really um transparent and user friendly for the >> see it over the finish line." >> So, I would like to see it over the finish line, but if somebody wants to step in, I'm again I'm happy to. >> That's like what I said with the mic in the last year or two. So it makes sense
in this case I think for continuity >> just like I made the case for continuity in the past. >> Yeah. >> Um and then um we had so Jim Davis had been serving on the capital committee. So that we do need to put somebody onto
that committee. That's actually um a committee that meets before work, you know, it meets early. So it's before people's, you know, have to get to work. Um it's really interesting. I first that was the first committee I served on and it was um really interesting because you
see and they're now doing like a five-year projection of capital needs in the town. So it might be the fire department and you know if they need another ladder truck it could be DBW, it could be council on aging, it could be the schools, but the schools are you
know capital projects. Um, so it's really interesting because there's money that gets funded in the and it's voted on by that committee. So it's a it's very interesting to sort of be an advocate and planning funds. You know, we've always said, you know, that's
something that's important and and sometimes we feel like we don't get um funded for for the studies that we need to we need to do. So that >> what's the frequency of that? Is that monthly? So that what's good about that is like right now they're not meeting they won't it's a monthly meeting
typically >> as you get closer to um to the you know the budget cycle and to you know certain deadlines for the town and town meeting they meet more frequently >> so that that does um seem to pick up at
budget time but it's really just a a monthly and um Richard Wells was chairing it for years. I don't know who um is Megan. Maybe Megan's gonna share it now or um I forget who they said was going to step in because it was it's a
it's a lot of work just sort of tracking where we are, you know, and it's it's trying to, you know, fund some of these really important things and some things just keep getting deferred year after year and then some years we have, you know, whether it's more free cash or,
you know, it's able to be funded. um were money put towards that. So that's available. >> Um Sean, you were taking a little break. So you pardon >> there's uh two that I was considering volunteering for. One is to fill Jim's
spot on the capital improvement planning committee and and the other is that the housing production committee. Um those are two that I would I'd volunteer for and uh but I mean this is a discussion amongst all of us to right make sure that we you know fill all the there's a
lot of roles you know it's not like there's a shortage because you were on two last year I think Maggie's on two last year so >> it's >> there were I was on an ad hoc for a bit too the town farm you know that wasn't you were for the planning board there but there's been times where the master
plan implementation committee also had a seat on different committees So there were times, you know, when I had another one picked up. So um but so one feels like >> I think I was on it for historical commission and you were on it for planning maybe >> something like that. But uh I'm I'm
happy to do um another one. But you know, I also it's up for discussion for anyone. >> And then Maggie, do you want to talk about the committees you've been serving on and just talk a little bit about what those are about? So, I am on I am on the
climate action planning committee and um it's been a few years now and we are getting close to um finalizing our plan. Um, we sort of got derailed a little bit
in my opinion trying to fund grants and whatnot, but we are making um some progress on it. And we've had a lot of turnover um on the committee and also the committee has expanded in its
membership which has caused some problems getting a quorum at times and um so it hasn't quite progressed as quickly as I thought it was going to progress. So, I would stay on that committee and and I'm hopeful that at
some point we will finish the the me the climate action plan and then it would be brought forward to um town meeting to be adopted and then um you know then I'm not sure what the the long range plan is
for this committee. I think once uh it's adopted then I would think that perhaps um the committee would um cease to exist. Um, so I'm I'm willing to stay on that and the Milton Budget Coordination Committee. Um, as far as being the
representative uh from the planning board, the um there has not been a a lot of um input at this point in time for um a planning board representative. Um the
charge was to review the you know fiscal budget every year and to um have better communication primarily for the school committee and the select board. Um, and again, we got off topic a little bit
because we just started talking about um the FY27 budget and we haven't really um, you know, made any financial policy decisions at this point in time. But as a planning board rep, there's not a lot
to do that this committee is not there's not a lot of heavy lifting on this committee for for a planning board member. But I I have found it interesting. I've learned a lot about the budgets and um you know and I like having interaction with a broad range of
committees and town staff. So I would be um willing to sit on that one too. Um but it's as I said it's not a lot of heavy lifting. So if I'm needed on another committee I could do that too. So
>> Okay. and how anything that >> Yeah, I I I I looked into it a little bit and clicked on the links that Liz provided. The uh CPC would be something that I'd be interested in. >> Y >> um and then the budget coordination, if
Maggie would would like to step down for that, that'd be something. Um and then the master plan committee. Those are the three that were top of my list. If people want to um discuss that, but those are were my interests late. That's great.
>> So, I' I'd be interested also um in >> the housing production plan. >> The housing production plan. >> That's Yeah. >> Yeah. Um but if so, if Sean you're interested in that, I think Liz said two seats from the planning board or two
people from the planning board. So, how were you you were interested? What's your top one? Your >> probably the CPC, the community community preservation committee. >> All right. >> Okay. And do you want a second one? Or do you think you want to start with one?
>> Oh, let's go. >> Because I would be coming off of that then, which I'm fine with. I'm fine to come off of that and have you replace me. Um, so that leaves I'm and I'm I'm happy, Sean, that you're willing or
interested in the capital committee because I was thinking to myself that would be a good one um for you if you were interested in it. So, I'm glad to hear your interest for that. Um, you know, I think for the master plan committee itself, you know, obviously
I've been on the Empic for I was on the Empic for a long time and felt as if it's time for some new folks, but on the other hand too, I've had some people reach out to me and say that um, you know, they wanted to talk to me about the report. And so,
>> so we're not do we're not do yet doing the master. We'll hopefully be able to do that on the 28th. Oh, >> okay. >> Because we don't have we need to distribute who all the applicants are for that. Um so >> you need one person from us. >> So one person from us um and then um and
then two um two other people from the pool of applicants that we could that we can pick from. So um and and I had talked to Liz. Liz was going to um I think our Liz was going to talk to Liz Dylan just to check in with her to see
where she was. I think she wanted to interview some people maybe find out I don't know who she's selecting and we'll see what what candidates are left and available. Um so just tonight I think just the um the housing production plan
um is um is the other one that we would want to talk about. And I agree with Liz that I think it is good to have two I think two planning board members um because I think that's what the select board was also wanting to do to have two of their own uh two their two members and in the
affordable housing trust. So I guess so if Cheryl's interested. >> Sorry. >> Oh, I apologize if if I if I may, Meredith. Um, >> it's it's a it's it's pretty expedited. So you folks have already seen the scope
and and and you've already kept a lot of familiarity. So I I just think it's much more efficiency. Um, yeah, if it's two members and I'd be happy to be one of them and sounds like you'd be happy to be one as well. >> Yeah. Okay. >> Okay, >> great.
>> CBC. >> Oh, and then Maggie, you would stay on your your two. >> Yeah, I would um stay on mine if um you know that's good. If if ifual >> you know I'd really be on anything. Um
so I'm I'm fine where we are where I am now. I know Hal expressed interest in the budget coordination committee. You know, if I drop that, then I would, you know, interested in the housing production plan um committee, but as Liz
said, that's a short shorter commitment, I think. Isn't that the housing production committee is just trying to get the the plan in place and that is pretty much in place because it's replicating pretty much what's already been done.
It's working with the same consultant. Um, but Liz, do you wanna you can do you want to speak to this? It's a really updating a lot of what's happen. >> I guess I guess the charge the charge as it's laid out is to facilitate the creation of the town's housing production plan in coordination with the
town's consultant and to monitor the implementation of the housing production plan upon completion and approval by the Commonwealth of Massachusetts. So I guess the monitoring the implementation part is something that you know can be will be discussed during the development of the plan. I mean there's typically an
implementation component to a plan. So um so it it it could it could be something that does extend beyond the the um beyond this the time frame that's in the consultants contract which and the reason why I'm seeing expedited is she initially said six months. We're
already almost two months into that. So, we had a conversation last week and I said, "Is that still realistic?" And she said, "Yes, but we really need to yeah, we need to get we need to get moving." So, the so the intent is to have this thing wrapped up by midfall. >> So, there the last plan had a number of
recommendations that um the planning board was assigned as a lead party on. And so if if that happens again in this plan there there should be recommend or followup steps that the
planning board will need to take. So having discussion about those um and how we want to go about those >> I think after the consultant is done and the plan's adopted. Last time around, the select board and the planning board
both um adopted the plan and um and it was very robust plan. I mean it was very good. >> Yeah, there's um >> and we've done a lot. I mean, I think our consultant was like, "Wow, you guys have been busy." Yeah, there's I'm sure there's um
>> you know some >> some things that were kind of put upon us like ADU was on that target list for a couple of generations of housing production plans but the state went ahead and and >> I think the other thing I'd like to advocate for is a reduction in
committees. I mean, I've said this multiple times, you know, these past few years. The town has like 90 committees, and we never we always seem to be adding committees without ever getting rid of
committees. And as I've said before, sometimes I do feel like these appointed committees um can kind of be a workaround to the elected committees. So I would like to see and and maybe
it's not for discussion tonight but there really should be suns setting of these committees. So we fulfill our charge, we do it and then it's over and then it comes down to town staff sort of to monitor things. I I just think 90
committees is a lot uh for um for the town especially when we have um a strong town administrator. >> Will the open space sun uh sunset when >> that will sunset that will be yeah it has to be and then you know for a certain period of time it'll be good but
it's it's similar to the housing production plan where you have to in order to get state grants you have to you know just update it and so we're like in that updating stage. Um but it will so that will we'll once this finishes we that will sunset
>> and then the climate action planning committee would sunset as well. We're down to 88. >> Yeah. Yeah. I think it the plan should be created and then the I I don't know what the next steps are. I don't know if it's going to be like pick and then you have
to follow it all. Um I'm not really sure. We haven't we haven't gotten to the plan yet. So, we haven't even considered next steps yet. >> I guess it depends if there's really a simple um
follow-up entity like if there's a staff person who's that's their responsibility. The master plan itself had so many different responsible parties that uh I think that's why the implementation committee was recommended back when. But, you know, like this on a
climate action plan, you know, maybe that falls under the town administrator or the DPW or the planning department or something. Um, just like the traffic mitigation committee did excellent work and issued a report and one of their um
high level suggestions was to make sure that there was a responsible party and they suggested the town administrator be the responsible party. Um and so you know in that scenario that was an advisory to the select board so the select board could decide that that was
a priority that they wanted the town administrator to take on. So I think it kind of depends on the the charge of the committee who formed the committee what they want to do with the work of that committee. One of the things I think about the committee I think about even that one Maggie is you get some
expertise from folks in town who um don't necessarily want to run for office but offer their expertise on a on a committee level um which I same happened on that traffic mitigation committee. There were some really qualified people.
I I think we do benefit from those um committees who who offer residents an opportunity to share their expertise. >> Oh, I agree. I mean that there's really great um members on it. Um so I'm not
trying to take away or diminish their credentials or the value that they add. Um it just is um I don't know. Sometimes I feel like especially when a committee gets to be 15 people or 11 people, we
can kind of get in our own way sometimes. And as I said, there's turnover because there you're only appointed for one year and you don't get a lot done in one year when you really meet just once a month and then sometimes you can't meet because you don't have a quorum.
>> Yeah. Sometimes it's helpful if you have a large committee to have subcommittees so that the subcommittees can meet and report back to the larger You know, the planning board early on in my tenure had some subcommittees where a couple two people would work on a zoning article together and then bring it back to the
whole board. And I was looking back for something and I was like, "Wow, we had six zoning articles we were discussing at the same time." People were working on them, bringing them back and we decided which ones might move forward to town meeting. >> So, I mean, that's another thing. If we don't have as much committee work that we're doing and we want to tackle some
zoning work or then um you know we don't have a huge planning department staff wise. So >> um you know we it doesn't have to be writing the zoning itself but to set out what what would be the uh goals and then
help get help with the technical language. Y >> but in any case >> and we have posted for an administrative assistant um in the planning department. So um a part-time 20 hours a week um if anyone is interested uh Nick has posted
that and Liz would love to have somebody come in and help her and uh help with the minutes. It's really would take a a tremendous amount of work off of them. Um, so I so
I'm I'm I support all of the um all of the committee assignments um that we've discussed in people's interests. So should I make a motion to for the board to um appoint Hal to the community preservation committee,
Maggie to the climate action planning committee and the budget coordination committee? Sean to the capital improvement planning committee. Meredith to the open space and recreation planning committee,
myself and Sean to the housing production plan advisory committee. I would second. Okay. Any discussion? >> And then we'll discuss the U master plan committee once we get the other information.
>> Yes. And then so hopefully what would be nice to have that for our next on the 28th. So Liz is going to follow up with Liz Dylan on that. So and then we can get those um distributed the applicants. Um so uh with that we'll do a roll call. Um Maggie,
>> yes. >> Hal, >> yes. >> Sean, >> yes. >> Cheryl, >> yes. >> And myself, yes. Great. >> Thank you um for that. Um and then the next item um and it was interesting when I was
looking at the fall um minutes we had we discussed our some of our goal setting and where we were and you know if we could get the sign you know bylaw approved what would be our you know the next things that we we had been looking at and I thought it was great because Cheryl put a list together of some
things we haven't even talked about so we can look at some of the things we have like you know and I think realistically And now seeing what hearing what Liz said, um what do we really think we could we could have an article um pulled
together for for our next town meeting in the fall? And typically we try to do zoning in the fall because you don't have so much budget stuff in the spring. So fall is the better time. Um, looking at this, I mean, I think we Liz, um, do
you have a sense or maybe we could get a sense from Carolyn um, from KP Law if it's if she thinks it might be doable to get this the first phase of our the recottification. Um, we did vote for the first three
phases um, of the first level recotification. Um >> if if she thinks like the first level in my recollection from the audit that was done previously is really just a cleanup and organizational improvements and it's
not really content substantive. And if we could get that to fall town meeting, I think that would be great. Um >> I also just want to >> I'm not Can I Can I Can I just interject here? >> Yeah. Um, I I'm not sure that's I'm not
sure that's the approach. I think the approach is sort of like a an initial audit which is which is more to do with talking to people like like the chair of the board of appeals, the building commissioner, some of the local land use attorneys, like almost kind of like
trying to get a better handle on like what's not working. >> There's no way I see that. >> Yeah. Right. So, so, so, so it could, it could be that the result of that audit does bring forward maybe some of like
that lowhanging fruit, right? Um, but bear in mind, it does need to be advertised by like I mean, Nick was basically telling me today he he wants ideally something's getting advertised in like July, >> July 9th. >> So, so I'm so I'm that's that's eight
weeks. So, um, I'm just trying to I'm just trying to wrap my head around that and I'm almost thinking that if you guys have a single topic that Carolyn could kind of pull off the shelf, >> right? Like we talked cut and fill has
been something um how >> cut you know cut and fill could be something where if if you guys are looking for a similar approach like with the sign bylaw where no baloney like here's the process
here's the definitions this is what you have to do this is these are the plans that are required like whatever I I I know nothing about your cut and fill I heard today from Nick that it's like a paragraph I don't know if that's true or not. >> That's not true. We um uh I just want to
come back quickly. We can cut talk about cut and fill. I was looking at my notes from five years ago >> um on it. Um but if the intent is to talk to those other folks, I don't see that happening by the fall. And I I just
want to say I think we should also plan for not just the fall and the spring but a year from the fall from next fall the 20 because it's going to take at le time to work on larger things that I think we should work on >> and and I just the the some of what I
put on this list is based on you know when you're um running for reelection you're talking to a lot of people or a lot more people than you are on average >> and so I there's definitely things people are interested in talking having the board think about and so some of
it's long it's planning and some of it's long longer term it won't be something that's if it you know even if it does lead to zoning it won't be immediate right it's going to take time so I think we need to think about shortterm medium-term long term you know what are
we going to work on and it it will fall across different >> time periods of our tenurs you know but I think >> uh we we we need to start thinking that way because otherwise we're just going to keep getting this the lowhanging fruit stuff. We're not we don't end up
getting sort of the larger things and we have an opportunity now since we're past the ADUs and past the MBTA for the most part that we can tackle a few things and cut and fill is one of them. Um but there's a few others. I you said um on
there was um Airbnbs and we had talked about that and you know what I heard from Nick and maybe I'm wrong and Liz if you were part of this um conversation more deeply is the the building department said well they're not allowed
we don't allow but but anyway >> it's the same it's it's the same issue that you had with the sign bylaw so it's like it's silent >> it's silent exactly Right. It does it doesn't expressly prohibit. >> So So there have been instances where
you know you can have up to three unrelated persons in the same home, right, as borders. Like that's just that's just >> less than 30 days. And there's a 30-day minimum for rental. >> I don't know. Yeah, >> that's in the building. But that's what
the building department was saying. Well, they're not allowed because you're not allowed to rent a property for u less than 30 days, >> right? But you can but you can rent a room in your house up you can rent a room in your house to a border for up to up to three unrelated people can be in
in a single family home. You can have two borders. That's just that's just the law. >> So it's so I do I think we should have it. So I'm not I'm not I'm advocating that we should and I'm not sure why the building department >> was
>> questioning it but um >> I think that might be a good one. Do do you mind if we can we run through the list and then we can >> let's go top to bottom. >> Yeah. I just think it's um and I can explain why I put them on the list and you know some of them like you you've identified that you're interested in but
>> um so the codification we were just talking about. So I I do think it would be helpful >> um to understand from Carolyn what kind of time frame she thinks we we're thinking about. It seems to me at the earliest would be the
spring and it could even be over a year, right? Depending upon how many changes this is. >> Yeah. >> So, um I'm just going to say here maybe spring of 27
question mark. Okay. I I just like it would be helpful if we that's something we know, right? The the next one I had review the Milton Village mixeduse overlay with land owners and perhaps with the economic feasibility uh consultant because we haven't we adopted
it in 2020 and we haven't had any applications come in and I'd just like to understand if there's anything in the zoning that's an obstacle you know to having an application come in because and if there's not then it's just because people haven't seen it as an
opportunity they want to take advantage of but you know when we spent so much time thinking that there was opportunity there for mixed use and to kind of revitalize. So I I would put that lower on a priority. Um first of all it was co in
2020 so nothing really happened you know not not a lot was happening anyway. But what we've what we've seen is we've seen the acquisition of property. So we've seen a developer come in and acquire now five different separate buildings in
that. And then so we now have the Bank of America which started that that ended up um being the first project because of what >> what the developer has to go through with the D and more complications with the state on um the muscle and flow
building. >> Um he had also the the Fuji building has been acquired um and I'll just finish. Sorry. >> The and the other thing that we have also just finished is the MBT MBTA zoning. So, we've done two layers of
zoning and the MBTA zoning the ink just dried on that. You know, we're still we still have to come back to town meeting and sort of update our affordable um units. But I I feel like of all the things we could do that was an extensive what how many years did that even take to >> So, one thing I'm going to mention
>> to do that with the with the Milton Village District. I think it >> it just seems like >> there's things that we would like to get to and and we're we're seeing things happen. It might not be as fast as you know people think. Like why isn't anything happening down there? There's
also a pop possible proposal for extra space storage is um possibly considering coming back with some sort of project down there. So I feel like things are happening down there and I you know >> so one thing I say is like you know some
of those properties have changed hands and one land owner owns quite a few of them right >> and I think it would be interesting because he's talked about the mixed use as the uses what he wants to do with the buildings but we already know that one of them he can't meet the parking
requirements and maybe the other either. So is it what what's going to happen then? Can he come in under that or is he going to have to go to the board of appeals first because he can't meet the parking? I just think we should be ahead of it instead of waiting until an
application comes in. So, you know, maybe it's just a conversation that Liz can have with the property owners as there as he's, you know, contemplating um you know, what he's going to do with those properties. The other thing is the majority of the Milton Village is not in
the MBTA communities. Remember, it's just the extra space storage. There's the web mill and 88 wararf and um and the rest of it's not >> Milton Hill House that is but that's not in the the this just overlay Milton Hill House.
>> I thought you meant in the MBTA. Yeah. >> Yeah. Can I can I suggest um maybe an adjustment to the approach to this list? Can we work through it and just define >> what's on this list that absolutely should be accomplished in this year? You
know, the things that are maybe lowhanging fruit or musts, you know, really really important. Can we just do that and then and then go back and look at the balance and discuss how we can accomplish the balance and maybe what >> I think that's a good idea. >> Would that be all right? because there's a lot here and some of these are
probably not complicated and we should just acknowledge it's going to be part of our work for this year and we'll we'll we'll at least put them in a bucket of we're definitely going to get that done. >> All right. So, >> can I just ask just a question how the board operates before we move on? Um,
>> does the board ever have so so Cheryl you wrote um >> you know have a reviewing with land owners. Does the does the board ever pull in business owners or land owners and have discussions about how they're seeing in the real world the zoning that we're writing and implementing how that
is actually affecting them? >> Like do we ever have like a workshop or a working session with them or is that something that's not >> We haven't done on the sign review. Um Liz attended a chamber of commerce meeting. So I think Liz is trying, you know, opening um dialogue with the
chamber of commerce to to hear certain things. We've heard from them on we had um we actually um this particular developer came before the planning board with a pre-application sort of a conceptual plan which was really helpful
because he wanted to know before he went down you know and made you know started really um moving forward that it was something that we would we would embrace and put on. I think in in you know um the time that in my four years I guess
at hell it probably happens >> most often as part of a of a of a process where an applicant's before us we don't really have like an open forum and >> and invite some of the active people in town to come in and tell us what challenges them we we don't really do
that I don't I don't remember doing that at all >> you know when we did the the Milton Village overlay we the the mic you know started that process and we made an effort to meet with every property owner in the district. It's not a big district
>> and so uh and that's how I found out that JD bought the Milton and he had just become the owner when we were doing that. Um but the uh East Milton, you know, there has more owners and I don't think I mean certainly they were reached
out to as a group but not necessarily individually. Yeah. >> And I think uh when we're working, one of the things I think on my list is the non-conforming businesses. I think those property owners we should speak to like what what do they see as being challenging? Like even Mr. Mossa from
the the fruit center, you know, what was challenging about getting, you know, their their because I think that should inform, you know, our priorities too. You know what >> uh >> what's an obstacle to business owners. >> I agree with you. And you know, in a in
a meeting not too long ago, I guess I'll call it recent, we were talking about an economic feasibility study, you know, and my point of view was the existing business owners can tell us what works and what doesn't work, what restricts them and what could help them,
you know, grow. And learning that would would help us better understand how to create more opportunity, you know, in town. So um I think how we can construct that I'm not sure but I think there would be a lot of valuable information that the planning board could gain from
that. So but it hasn't it hasn't happened. It's not like hell we haven't really had a forum and said you know where where we we want to hear from business owners please come in and join us >> probably since the f the master plan was done you know there was an outreach to all different groups healthcare you know
all sorts but not since then I think >> how many years is that? >> It's been a while. >> Yeah. And you know really in that time some of the business owners are the same but some of the business owners >> if you think about it the healthcare environment has changed a lot with the hospital >> which um
>> let me just get >> through the do you mind if we Meredith if I just tell you what the thoughts were we can as suggest we can come back and talk about the merits or the priorities. >> I think that's great. Um, so the the MBTA affordability I just because I know
that we it's submitted for the 15% like right now our zoning has a you know a caveat. It's not it says you know it's 10% if HLC HLC doesn't approve 15 you know so I just feel like we should clean it up >> but if we have time I mean if HLC has
gotten back to us that that's acceptable. >> I agree. >> So that's simple I think. Um and then the um the condo conversion has come up because again you know properties to convert um we have a provision in our
bylaw that allows conversion of a a large home of I think on 10 acres or more. And if we think about like the bur estates is one that I think is pro maybe what that ridge was written for. But we've had
some 40bs that have been historic homes that are large but aren't 10 acres. And so there's other properties for sale that are beautiful historic homes that are not 10 acres also. And so at a this
was looked at a few years ago. Um and so there is work on it. I have in my records that I can was beginning to look at again. At a minimum, I think we could think about the the acreage that the 10 acres. And you know, that's just
a flatout thing. What if it were in a residence A, a residence B, a residence C, the acreage could be different? You know, the size of the home. Um because you remember uh we had Meredith I think you'll recall the historical commission
came in with a I have somewhere in here a list of how many properties there are like just like two acres even and there's a lot of and homes that are large and historic like this was this list that they had um provided us and
two acre lots with residents um uh six to 7,000 and more was like 31 houses. Um and one to two acre lots, there's 20 that are in the 6 to7,000
square foot range, you know. So, um there are buyers certainly for large homes, but um you know, would it make sense to um to think about that because it could help meet some of the housing
affordability challenges without having to have uh even new construction, right? Because it could just be within an existing home. So, that's that's what that is. Then, um, the short-term rentals is
something that's come up because people are experiencing them in their neighborhoods. Years ago, there was also a bed and breakfast. One of the things about both of those is um, you know, there could be some by regulating them that things are happening already. Once you regulate
them, then you can enforce them and you can have a registry requirement that they have to be licensed, I think it is, and they pay a fee. And so, um, as I said, we can come back to the merits of each of these. The Brook Road overlay, when that was first
drafted, those buildings have been vacant now for a very long time. There was an overlay that allowed for multif family there. U, but it required a larger lot than what's available there. And so, I just feel like there's a lot
of people who don't like that there are like vacant properties there. And it just feels like we should understand if there's something we can do, you know, in the zoning to help facilitate that. >> And there is a potential um Liz, I don't
know if you've um heard anything back, but there was sort of a a somebody who wanted to meet a developer who wanted to do town homes there under MBTA zoning. But I don't know, they were way off on their numbers. like they were way over
on how many units they could put on the site and so they were going to go back and run their numbers and take a look. But I don't know if there's been a followup, but there may be something happening there under MD. >> Is that is that was that the one next to the food mart? >> Yeah. >> Oh, yeah. Yeah. No, I haven't heard
anything. I mean, I think it just the the numbers just didn't work. >> Is that the kind of work? >> We'll come back to it. Sorry, I'll make it up. So, um, >> okay. >> Yep. So, >> I mentioned address pre-existing non-conforming businesses. We're all
pretty familiar with that. We can come back. >> Um, site plan review for town owned projects is something we've talked about, you know, whether it's a fire station, a school, library parking, or what have you. So, we can begin. Um, cut
and fill. Um I was reading um again through my notes and I had some notes with a couple of discussions uh with Joe >> Praonda. >> So I'd like to go back and look at that. I also um there's a model bylaw from
Cape Cod um that addresses this the topic and I think one of the reasons that we're all interested in it is some of the things that come before us for site plan review especially um have had so much topographic change and retaining walls that if we can get
something in our bylaws to um to have it be more sensitive to the site. So, I'm still um interested in that and have some done some leg work in the past on it. And then the underlying business district zoning requirements such as
parking, right? Because >> uh we talked about that a little bit with the fire station in Milton. So, that's why I put that on here. >> Okay. >> Um and if there's and again, maybe this is where talking to the businesses too, like I I can't do it this because of the
zoning. So, I think we could learn from that. um planning. So, this is like longer term, right? So, sort of a community process. >> Can I just can I um just hop in for the zoning >> thing before we move on? Sure. Could we
look at like a um an F zoning? Because Cheryl, you've said um many times in the past that, you know, if you look at the Pine Gardens um development, like the houses are so big, you know, on Pleasant Street compared to the
surrounding um neighborhood that perhap if we had a F limit or bylaw, then those houses would be more in scale. So, could we ever look at an F?
um bylaw because I've been thinking about this for quite a number of years that if you look at our ZBA, if you ever follow our ZBA hearings, it's run-of-the-mill to um you know, for them
to approve a variance and all of a sudden our little starter homes say on Guliver Road or Elm Street, they were our starter homes and now all of a sudden they go to the ZBA PA and they get a variance and the three
bedroomedroom one and a half baths are now four bedrooms 2 and 1 half baths and our starter homes are also the same as our downsizing homes. So we have kind of done oursel in by allowing and giving
these variances for these houses to become larger on these smaller lots. And now we've done away with our starter homes. we've done our way with our downsizing homes and now all of our more affordable housing um are now not
available because the housing the square footage of the house has increased so much. So I think perhaps looking at our FS um could be important. Open space around each h um house is really
important. We spent a lot of time on that on um MBTA zoning and um I just think that um um having outdoor space available for homeowners and children to
play is just um you know great for mental health issues. So I think I we should look at FS. Um, okay. And one of the other th that would be like a change in the dimensional
standards. So, it's not like a new zoning, it's just a change to the dimensional standards within the districts we have. Um, >> I you know, remember when we were talking about ADU and um how the we said
we should look at our accessory structure setbacks and heights. So that I didn't put that on here, but what when you're talking about F, it made me think of that. We should look at that, too,
because the um the ADU bylaw allows for the ADU to take pick and choose between accessory structure and main structure. And sometime in some of the districts the accessory structure is very close allows you pretty close to the property
line but then you can also do the two and a half story 35 ft >> right. >> So you could be putting a pretty you know tall big or you know a tall structure is not that big. I guess that depends. I mean, if you did a 450 square
footprint and it got to 900 on two floors and then you did a pitched roof and you could do it, you know, pretty close to the property and if everybody did that. >> So, I I I'm not saying we need what we need to change. I just think we thought that something we should look at.
>> So, I'm going to just put the dimensional standards for accessory structures >> just so um >> with the F. Yeah. >> And with F and open space. So it's that did come up a lot. >> Yeah. >> During our MBTA.
>> Yeah. >> Can Can we go backwards, Cheryl? >> Yeah. >> I just want to go back to I want to understand what is it and maybe I didn't listen. Excuse me. Maybe I didn't listen. Well, add short-term rentals. What What is What is it that
>> we don't have a bylaw that addresses short-term rentals at all? >> That provides it or prevents it? >> Either one. >> That regulates it. >> Doesn't regulate it there. is silent on it >> in a sense like Liz said you can have um
unrelated people living in your home and you can they can be what's called borders right Liz I think that's the language so that mean a border can be paying >> and it would be interested to see what other towns have been doing with this
you know um and that's where I think Carolyn Murray and KP Law there she'll know of some really good Airbnb be, you know, >> yeah, there's I I did locate a couple of things, too. >> Most people don't want to allow them, you know, the short term less than 30
days. >> Yeah. But it's not regulated. >> They don't allow them, but they towns know that they're happening, >> but they're >> Lexington has one and I I I started reading one in Great Bington that looked interesting. The Cape of course has them
because they have a lot of rentals, >> short-term, but isn't >> that's what it is. >> Isn't Isn't the the zoning itself um language that defines that it's not you know if we have single family zoning
that in itself would suggest that you know an Airbnb is not is not a um It's just not a legal use, you know. >> Well, this maybe you can comment on that
part. >> I think Well, and I think too because you have, you know, you've got pre-existing non-conforming, you know, multifamilies and and apartments and, you know, if you don't have a way of regulating how those get
rented, >> right? >> So, there's that >> and then there's the there's the the um the border. I mean, you can you can it's you can have two people in your home. >> Yeah. >> And you can rent them bedrooms and they
use the same bathroom and they use the same kitchen and and that's just that's just just it's a wow. >> So, um so that those are the two probably most problematic instances. somebody would probably fall back on the argument that they're a border
um and or they have a pre-existing non-conforming multi and they're um maxing out how much income they can get for it. >> So, some people have found that there's there are Airbnbs, you know, in their neighborhoods and
there there's no regulation really around it. So, like you can put a regulation in that says that it can't be used for events, for example, like Airbnb, I think, as a company says that, but
there's there's things in in the couple that I've looked at. Um but you know I I think is it was raised with me um during the campaign season that um there was
there were people who are interested in seeing us look into this and you know I think if we if we did a process you know maybe they would come to the board and and tell us their experiences and what they're you know what they're interested in. Um >> it came up several times in East Milton
in my area just at the doors >> came up in precinct too. >> Yeah. >> Cuz I think there were buses dropping. There was one residence where bus loads of people were being dropped off. >> Yeah. And this this woman said that she kind of the town several times and you know the town basically says we can't do anything about it. Like there's no
regulation on it. >> So that's where this is coming from. It's coming from people who absolutely have are experiencing some things. I think that should be, you know, moved moved >> and it seems like we should be able to have something that's pretty boilerplate that Carolyn would work from.
>> So from your from your experience during the campaign, you're hearing people that see this as problematic and are looking for a regulation to prevent it >> to regulate it. >> To regulate, not necessarily prevent. >> You know what people said was, I'd like
regulation. So I if we could call someone if they're not following the regulation then they can be enforced. >> Yeah. Well, you know, when when when I take a step back from uh and and just think about where we're
at as a town um and the pace that we're changing, it's like overwhelming. you know, I'm I'll have I'll defin you know, I'm not opposed to having this on an agenda for the year, but um you know,
we're we're watching multi-unit residential go up faster than probably anybody ever imagined and we have yet to absorb what that impact will be on the community. We have the ADU, which now is we're
receiving applications and you know, we don't know the impact of that on the community. We have the amputated communities act which we have yet to see the impact of that on the community and I just feel for the town we just need to be as you know cautious with what we do
um because we're where the pace is is really overwhelming and I think most people in town have no idea of what it's going to be like and how quickly it's going to get there. So, you know, um I'm not, you know, regulations, sure, um but I'm not a I I won't be a proponent when
that discussion comes up of, you know, making this a, you know, a regulation that makes it, you know, possible to add Airbnb and >> rent. No, that's not what I heard on the doors. I heard more um the town setting boundaries and expectations for these
things that are we already know are happening to be able to be able to >> earn a fee on them to be able to have someone that lives next door to be able to go to the town and point to saying >> you know this is the rules and the regulations of the town and how to you know they're not abiding by them. >> Yeah. You know
>> or or something that prohibits them >> or that prohibits them. Yeah. And I think >> for all the folks that what you know and I' this is this is going to sound like I'm repeating what I've said in you know previous years. If you moved into Milton because you wanted to live in a you know
single family um residential neighborhood I feel we we owe those people as much protection as we possibly can and having an Airbnb next to you is not um >> well that's why they've raised as a
problem. So, you know, again, I'm I'm probably I'm probably already, you know, >> um I'm probably already, you know, presenting my point of view on it. I I feel it's important to protect the people that, you know, desire not to have that. Yeah. So, anyhow, that's my
concern. Generally, you know, we we have no idea if you could try to forecast what it's going to be like when >> the uh East Milton project's done and 440 Granite AB is done and Randolph A is done and you know, both sides of Randolph AB are done. We're not that far away. You know, these guys are moving. I
you know, your pace that they're that they're on is really really fast a year from now. A lot of these projects going to be completed. >> It's interesting. I I went >> Oh, sorry. Liz, can I just um ask a clarifying question when I know that our
bylaw is about um you can't have more than three unrelated board people as borders. So my interpretation if you have a border that means you as a person you're living in the house and you're having borders. So
you are present in the house with um two other people >> you know renting a room and Airbnb doesn't mean that the property owner is in the house at the same time. You can't
reate that. I think >> they can. >> They could be there. They could be there. Yeah. But that doesn't mean they are there. >> But no, but I think >> I think I think early on I think early on I mean I had colleagues that were doing this, you know, 15 years ago,
right? Because they had a two-bedroom apartment over in South Boston. So I think I think early on that was probably a much more standard model but I think the economics are that investors you
know have discovered that they can if they're allowed to do it there's a lot of money to be made but there's also but there's also the other side of it too which is that these are there's regular folks that that want to try to figure out ways to stay in their homes. >> So there's there's more there's more than one side to the to to to the story.
I'm pretty sure that you can regulate it such that they're uh it requires the uh the homeowner to be living there and not renting it out and not being a corporate owner. So, I I think it's worth exploring u because
it could be that >> it is helpful to someone who's looking to um be able to stay in their home as you say, Liz. Um and you know, it could be helpful for someone who's doing a renovation of a place and they need to
be out for, you know, a short period or just something. Um and they are happening. So, that's the that's the issue. they are happening. Um, so I think it's, >> you know, whether we have something for
the fall or not, I don't know, but I I do think that that something where we should start a public process and get some examples from other communities. Um, and if Carolyn has some, um, great. I
I've got a couple that I've started to look at. Great. That's good. All right. To move to planning. >> Yeah. So, we've heard a lot um about west part of Milton, you know, um not having a lot of planning effort and
there were the two visioning um processes that happened that um it would be nice to have some followup, you know, on those visioning sessions. So, um there has been interest in
amenities and in community um gathering places that came out of that visioning, but we can look at those. >> MAPC did the visioning. >> One was um for um seven brush road. I
understand that DCR is now not moving forward with that program, which is I don't know if that's reversible decision or not, but it would be worth finding out. And then the other was Pagota Circle, >> you know, but they're both um and then,
you know, now there's the there's some CPC funded projects like Beverly Park and the path around the pond and hopefully some kind of commercial business will that's, you know, retail type facing will go into
the ice house. But I just think that um I don't have anything in you know particular for a next step with it but I just think a planning process there. Um the map boundaries of the business districts is just another thing to help think about what to make it easier for
businesses so that if they don't have to always go to a special permit process um if they could be incorporated instead of residential district into the business district. So that's kind of um again kind of a a planning effort. Um
there's been a lot of talk because of the override and budget problems of whether we can get more commercial tax revenue and so I do think uh is something that the planning board should discuss. Um and whether that tax revenue comes
just purely from business or some mixed use or something else. Um I do think that there's been uh there was definitely a lot of talk about that. >> I thought it was good I just as a note that um because I think first of all we all know like office space is is not in
demand right now. there's a there's an abundance and there's you know for rent signs all over Milton you know lease or at least um in commercial businesses um retail you know I think having amenities you know sort of to what you're um we've
unfortunately seen every time we've had new retail space open up we end up with a nail salon so I think finding you know what are the amenities that we would like you know how do we um implement them but I think the idea which is
important and I know Sean has you you've said this a number of times but and it was good to hear Jay Funling in his study analyze the you know the retail the the commercial property benefits and then he said it's it's never going to be
a silver bullet for our budgeting purposes. So I think that people feel like it is some somehow a silver bullet that it's going to bring all of this cash flow in. I think we will um you know and we've talked about 88 WARF is one of our you know highest revenue um
producing um so I think residential um we're going to see some really positive um impact from residential projects um >> I had somebody say to me um >> commercialize >> on the uh knocking on the door a indoor
sports facility because they have to take their kids to far off places because there's just not enough places. So, I think we, you know, maybe need to think beyond like the some of the traditional things that people think of with the commercial use maybe.
>> I don't know what we need the economics, you know, study obviously, I think, to help us with that. >> But I do think we owe it to residents and taxpayers who've asked about it >> to to take a look at it and see what it shows. >> Yeah.
>> Um, so As we know, and we've talked about it at the budget committee, and Sean brought it up, $3 million is generated by our commercial tax base. We bring in $4 million in personal property tax. And of that $4 million, 96% of that
$4 million is um attributed to our poles and our um wires and our infrastructure. So, you know, I don't want to mislead people about um what commercialist is is going to bring to the town. Sean has
stated stated it way more eloquently than I ever could in previous meetings. We've discussed it at the budget committee meeting. It's really um we would need um 14 um fruit centers which
would val have $40 million worth of um property value and it would only generate $2 million in property tax. So, um I think we're covering this by doing this economic development um um
initiative, but I just want residents to know that the only additional income that um businesses bring in is restaurants contribute a meals tax and that's it. Businesses do not contribute
part of their profit to the town of Milton. I feel like I've heard that a couple times. Businesses do not contribute a percentage of their pro profits to the town. The only thing the town gets is the property tax and then the revenue from the meals tax. So, you
know, I just um I hear all the time we need more commercial. We need more commercial. I'm a huge advocate of small independent businesses and I think would make our everyday life better. Um, but I don't think it's going to solve our um
our um budget issues. So, I just want to make that clear. >> And and just to add my two cents, I know you guys have discussed this a lot and I don't want to rehash everything, but I'm I I agree with Maggie in that maybe it's not a silver bullet, but the amount of people that talk to us about
>> want to grab a cup of coffee after they drop their kids off at Tucker or having some sort of community space over there is really something that that struck me. And I understand that we're not going to build 14 fruit centers, but maybe we could build >> Yeah. >> one or two more coffee shops. Not not just to improve people's quality of
life. >> You know how it is and you see something you posted. Well, maybe you don't if you don't look into Facebook very often, but how many times people say, "Oh, a Trader Joe's, a Trader Joe's, a Trader Joe's." But you know, there u there's a lot of dollars that Milton residents spend in other communities in adjacent
communities. So if we can somehow keep some of that in and you know I'm talking about local businesses too. I'm not talking about like national kinds and big box kinds of things because it's about it's about >> people want community. They need a place
for social interactive interaction. Teens need it. >> Seniors need it. Families need it. And we don't have a lot of it. And so if there's a way to get more that gives us a little bit more commercial tax, but really it's about the amenities I think
that come with it. >> I agree. Um, so on the next one, the the two family zoning, um, you know, there's a lot of people who just or have have concerns about the the affordability
challenges and we have like almost 600 two family um, units and but we don't allow them anymore. you know, after zoning was passed, I think in the third 20s and 30s, they they're not allowed anymore.
So, is that some and that's we know that that MBTA communities didn't consider two families multif family, which is I thought a big mistake. >> Um, but we don't know how things are going to come in with the MBTA communities, how much it's going to be
to Sean's point, but I thought we should just look at where we have the two families. Does it make sense to think about allowing a some more of them? I'm not saying like everywhere, but is it a way to help get some additional housing
that's at a different price point, more of a middle income price point? Sorry. You wanted to >> No, I just said one of the other things is looking at what's coming in right now is Michael White is being overwhelmed
with ADU applications right now and there is a you know coming up to speed process on this. Um, but he could almost have another full-time building department staff person doing just >> I was wondering why he would in the
budget he had raising the hours of the inspectors instead of having a plan reviewer. I mean, he if he's doing all the plan review, you know, he needs someone to do plan review. >> Well, he needs both. And I think they're they're they're down two people right
now um in the in the planning um in the building department planning also um in the building department and you know if we don't want to see a lot of turnover with our department you know people running these departments we can't overburden them and we have to be
conscious and I think maybe and I because I see what your point we do have a lot of the the two families but maybe we need to just see how the ADUs are coming in. I'm sure there's like an like a big rush to put them in because it just passed and they'll probably likely
taper off after a little while. Um but um I feel like with the ADUs we might want to not rush to start, you know, um doing two family and with MBTA until to your point until we sort of see the impacts of
>> what Michael's experiencing is consistent with what I said earlier. you know, the pace is we we're probably gone from, you know, 25 miles an hour to 60 miles per hour, and he'll never be able to keep up with it. I mean, that's on
top of that's on top of the work that he has just in terms of, you know, projects that are under construction, whether it's residential, you know, renovations, additions, new construction. It's he's completely overmatched in my opinion. Well, I I mean, I don't know how the
procurement works in terms of if it's only annual for being able to add staffing, but you know, department's bringing in revenue. It's going to be bringing in additional tax revenue. Those applications pay for the people who are doing the reviews and the
inspections. It It's really shouldn't um take too much to to get it adequately staffed. That that's in my opinion. >> My point earlier isn't about a math equation. It's not about making sure we're taking in enough revenue and permitting to offset the cost in the
building department. My point earlier is about what pace should a town move in terms of its evolvement. Do you know what I mean? So I I'm not I'm never going to say, hey, as long as we're bringing enough in permitting, we can hire two more people to staff Michael's a department, we should just keep on
going. That's not what I'm saying. That's actually exactly opposite to what I'm saying. I'm saying that it's changing so fast and before we, you know, have even recognized the change that we've made in the last two or three years and absorbed it where, you know, we got to be careful because we'll
continue a pace of change in the town that we'll never be able to keep up with >> ever. So now that >> a lot of the pace is due to people doing additions to their homes and you you can't tell one property owner that they can't do their addition because you don't have staff in the department.
>> It's not what I'm talking about. I'm talking about I mean that's >> it's not I'm not talking about that at all. You know I'm talking about you know creating more and more and more opportunities to drive more and more housing. You know what I mean? It's just we just have to be careful. And I don't
think my point of view is not just a point of view, you know, I also have plenty of people that I listen to, that I talk to, that I hear from. you know, I didn't have the opportunity to be running for election and listening to people that are, you know, considering the candidates, but but we're all in the
community and um there are a lot of people that, you know, express their points of view, too. So, it's um there might be some that are proponents for just having the gas pedal down on housing. There's a lot of people that aren't. >> That's why I have it under planning here and not under zoning. I'm not proposing
anything for the short term. I said at the beginning of this short-term, medium-term, long-term, anything that's under planning is long-term. >> Yeah. No, I get it. But there's there's, you know, there's a there's a series of things here that are, you know, if if the outcome imagine what some of the outcomes might be, it is just more
residential units. You know, I mean, if we get into a conversation about large homes, and I don't disagree with you, Cheryl, there are some large homes that there probably aren't, you know, many buyers for what did you say, six, seven,000 square foot homes. You know what I mean? And um I'm just what what
I'm recognizing is the list is pretty substantial in terms of the impact to create more housing. We just I'm just saying that we have to be careful. We just can't keep going given what we've already done. MBT housing ADU and the multi-unit residentials. >> So putting that aside just if you can
how do we as a planning board advocate for the building department to to have proper staffing? Is there something that we can do and not not not to facilate not to facilitate more >> but to to help him out so that he can he and the other people in the department can do their job as it is right now. Is
there something that we as the five and Liz and Vonte can advocate for that or is that not something that we can necessarily do? >> Maybe you know communicating it with the select board um and the town administrator. We have a strong town administrator who's >> you know and it's the same in the
planning department. you know, I being careful because, you know, we're we're looking at the things that we do, but then the planning staff is overseeing all these all these permits that have already been issued and approved, all the, you know, the 840B
projects, but then there's the memory care, which people, you know, things that are in the pipeline currently, um, which Liz is having to make sure that everything that we approved and site plan review and, um in our permitting
that that um the Goddard school. >> So So my concern is my concern is if you just look at at the um the the the signed bylaw request of Michael White,
he requested a simple amendment to give himself additional time to review. And I was a little frustrated that his boss, the strong town administrator,
did not take a more u vocal support of his request. As an employer, if I have an employee come to me and say, "I need this tool to do my job better," then I would go and I would do
everything possible to give my employees the proper tools because I want every if they do their job better, then um the customers are happier and it's everything's more efficient. So, I was a little frustrated um with that. We have
an employee who who said what he needed. He he specifically said what he needed and unfortunately um the warrant committee um didn't heed his concern. So I do think it it it it
falls on Nick Milano to um to advocate for his employees. You know, if you look back through the our budget cycle, at the end of last year, we had $4.5 million certified free cash. And
you know, um you know, a significant amount of that money um didn't go to the town departments like at town hall. It went to the school side. And I was a little frustrated with that because we
heard from the police and fire of their needs. Um, so, so I agree, Hal, that we should we should be helping our building department and our planning department because that's who we interact with, but it's really hard for us to do that
because we're not really their bosses. >> But I will say the work on recontification will greatly also help. >> Absolutely. I was going to say there's so much time in understanding our zoning bylaw. You know, Joe Pondac, commissioner that
was here for what 12 or 14 years, when he went to another community, he said, "Oh my god, what what a re what a difference. This is so my job is so much easier." >> That's why I've been every year we've had an opportunity to ask for the funds
for this. I've I've suggested it because it will save staff time and therefore town money >> to get it done. And um you know when you're in um thinking about like even the 40B developers who
have high paid attorneys, full consultant teams, they still had mistakes in their list of violations because of our zoning bylaw. Um and so getting that fixed is is going to make a difference.
>> Good. And there's also well something on my list moving down further is state legislation. But what now we have a lot of pre-existing nonconforming that ends up going to the zoning board of appeal. And if that if
this these items that are in the budget um bill that's being discussed now, it'll make um some of that unnecessary if you're not making your um nonconformity worse. Like right now, if you if you have a house that's
non-conforming, anything you do is get gets scrutinized because it's already existing non-conforming. Anyway, there's just things like that that would make it easier for the building department. >> Um, so can I just finish lastly on these things? The
>> the 40 yard zoning is just something that was been had been talked about at one time um because it allows you some funding from the state. I'm just going to leave it at that. And then um rules and rags. We had talked about scenic roads, right? Um
>> and we haven't had an application come in on on that more recently, but we've had some frustrations with that in the past. >> Yeah. >> And u that's something that's just within the planning board, right? We don't or is that actually have
>> historical have to go to the town meeting? No, it's just it's planning, but we usually go on the it's also the historical commission um is is weigh it weighs in on it and then it sort of we
the planning board sort of listens to the recommendation of the historical commission um traditionally and then they come back and then they make their decision. But it's very um it's one of those that's very vague and
in what we can defend of you know when somebody comes in an applicant you know certain things are very clear as far as you know a driveway how how many feet of stone wall can you take down by right and um but when it gets into trees and other things. Um,
>> is this is this meant to um >> designate more roads as scenic roads or the rules and regulations within designated scenic road? >> My feeling was the rules within it not adding to it. But >> I would agree.
>> We've just clarifying what's already there. >> Yes. Some issues come up with >> very general Yeah. sort of >> things have happened. People didn't know that they needed to come for a permit for a scenic road, which basically if there's trees that are in the public way
and stone walls that you're going to change those and it needs a permit and like fines, if they do remove thing, I don't think there's um it's always sort of negotiated like on Hillside Street there was a developer who came in and just it was actually being sold. It
wasn't even the developer. It was I think that they just clearcut like on one day this whole this whole lot was was all trees and the town owned trees and you know it ended up being a mitigation of having to come back and replant native plantings and um
>> but then it's then there's a question of well who's responsible to let's say water the trees to make sure they survive and what if they don't survive and there's just some questions that have come up right >> right um that I think we could make it >> we can make it Yeah, because I think we
adopted the boiler plate from the state and then never put in rules and rags. So, >> it would be there again good to see what other communities have done. And then I just put pending state legislation and ballot questions just something for us to be aware of and to think um site plan review is one um
that's moving its way through the legislation legislature and I haven't compared what it says to what ours is but at some point we should especially if it passes um and see if we're going to need to >> aren't they trying to do away with say
plan review? No, they're trying to they're trying to just make it be consistent because there's no >> it's not like the zoning bylaw or the zoning legis um enabling whatever the the law the overriding law is that
allows zoning. There's no such overriding law that allows site plan review. So each town can write their own except for MBTA. >> Yeah. And that's I mean and that's sort of been my problem with this administration. and they're trying to take away local control. Um, and this is one of the ways they're doing it,
unfortunately. Um, so I'm not a fan of >> I think they're doing >> Maggie. They're trying to make it more consistent. From what I read, it's pretty consistent with what we have. Like I don't think we'll have to change ours much, but um I do think it'll, you
know, maybe Carolyn at KP Lock can take a look at it if it's looks like it might pass. And then um I mentioned there are a couple of items, housing related items or zoning related items in the budget bill. Um it has mostly to do with the
ZBA, but um I can share those. I think Liz, you have those two you could share out with folks just to be aware of them. And then um there's a ballot question that's called legalized starter homes, which would make the minimum lot size 5,000 square feet. We have a lot of
homes on 5,000 square feet in our residency districts already, but they're not that's not the minimum lot size anymore. It's 7,500 for us. >> So, um, we we'll have to follow that. >> So, that's that's
>> I sent I sent Bill I sent Wells and Driscoll um some of the zoning because it's it's like MBT on steroids. >> Which one? >> I don't remember. They there was there was two but they um and they weren't even aware of them because they were they were still in subcommittee. Um so I
don't know how they advanced but but it was like five it was like five units you know on a like a small parcel would allow up to five units or something. It was it was definitely a multifamily housing. Um,
>> I don't I don't know the language, but you could be describing what Cheryl had written as legaliz that that I think that is. It's a valid question to have a statewide
um zoning that lot size can be 5,000 square feet >> which >> just imagine >> how that would change so many communities in Massachusetts.
I'm not familiar with the language, but >> the ballot. Yeah, it's actually pretty I looked it up because I was >> it's um the petition is the is this. That's it. That's how long it is. Yeah. >> So, it's and it's um
says no zoning ordinance or bylaw shall prohibit, unreasonably restrict, or require special permit or other discretionary zoning approval for the use of land of or structures for a single family residence in a zoning district that allows residential uses, provided that the single family
residence is fully contained within a lot measuring equal to or greater than 5,000 square feet in area and with equal to or greater than 50 feet of frontage. What they said they're trying to do is basically allow starter homes again, you know, and the the land the cost of the land is the
>> is the thing that's driving the cost of starter homes to be too expensive. >> That's the battle question. That's >> I think what they say and what their intention is is very different, >> you know. >> Well, so if you just Google um you know,
starter legalizing starter homes ballot question, you you can find this. I I did it today. I just found it. But what's what's the frontage in our I'm not sure what your frontage is, but you know >> 150 in a in a oneacres uh single A it's
150 foot frontage. >> I think in a C it's probably 75 >> because if you talk about >> Yeah. >> So you're saying like in my neighborhood, Cheryl, yours, Sean yours, like I have an acre. So, all of a
sudden, I could as of right um subdivide my property and build more housing, >> three homes. >> I don't know if that's what it's saying. >> Well, they I don't hear anything about frontage, just the lot size, right? >> Says 5,000. Uh no, it does say 50 feet
of frontage. >> 50 of >> which has access to if you had if you had 100 feet of frontage or then you'd have two lots. But it also you have it has to have access to public sewer. So is hillside public sewer or septic?
>> Yeah. Not the Yeah. Not the whole thing. >> Like plenty of other neighborhoods who people have spent a considerable amount of money on homes especially recently and they, you know, bought into, you know, the idea of a single family
neighborhood and now all of a sudden that could totally change overnight. >> My lot frontage is 50 ft. So >> that's why I said there's a lot of >> Yeah, there's a lot of uh homes in Milton if you that are nonform. Yeah. Yeah.
>> And not just east Milton. A lot of precinct one, >> but it's consistent, but it's in a whole area that's consistent. >> Yeah. So anyway, these are I just mentioned those as things for us to be aware of, not necessarily for us to do anything about >> because it may um require us to do
something later. >> You know, as as um as as >> I guess as I think through um what we could do that's most beneficial to the town, anything that makes other
departments jobs easier should be the highest priority we have. you know, anything like cotification. Absolutely. Like you talked about Michael White's job gets improved. Now, we're as far as we can go there. Now, it's up to KP Law to see how quickly, you know, Carolyn can get through that. But, but I think if if there are opportunities for us to
improve um you know, the um improve you know, any department's ability to execute their work, we should that should be a that should be a priority for us. I'm not sure if we're going to find that, but you know, when we think about, you know, some of the
some of the uh problems that we run into because maybe it's cut and fill isn't isn't well enough to find, do, you know what I mean? And maybe for whether it's a developer or somebody in town, but anything like that, uh I think should be should be high on our list just to just
to um you know, help anybody that we can possibly help. And we we had also talked about >> wait before we go just I wanted to follow up on Cheryl's legislation. Cheryl, do you know who's sponsoring that? >> Is it all like developers are sponsoring
that bill? >> I don't the ballot question. I don't really >> Or the ballot initiative. Yeah. >> Um I think it's like a a number of different entities, but I'm not sure um who it is. Mag I
didn't I didn't >> it doesn't it doesn't say >> I mean there are people who signed it but >> that would be concerning yeah and it would be concerning to see if those same people have contributed to Mara Healey's one commonwealth fund you know
>> well I I'm not um I'm not aware of who it is so um >> could I so sorry >> no go ahead Sean to your point um and And apologize if I'm not advocating for
this. I'm just asking the question. The reconification, it's going to take a year perhaps. Um, but we all agree that if we were to get that once we get that done, it's going to improve >> the situation here in town for the town
itself, for the staff, for the people that want to live here and work here and open businesses. Is it a money issue that it could can't be done faster? I'm not saying we have magical money that we can just create, but if we
were to be able to provide more money towards that from the board, from the town, would it go faster? I mean, I would think it yes, but not necessarily. >> I don't think at this point the the funds have been allocated. Now, it's in KP Law's hands to just execute as well. >> I think she can. The question is
depending upon how much input they want to get from attorneys and you know there's been a handful of attorneys who have done the bulk of the work in my tenure on the board and so they have a lot of experience with the issues that they've
come across. Um, if it's just those couple of people, I really think it would be helpful if Liz, you can ask Carolyn to give us a realistic time frame at our next meeting. >> I think Yeah. And I think too um and and
this kind of came up when we were discussing discussing the scope that they provided. Um I think it I think it's in it's it's probably in the folder. Have Have you had a chance to look at the scope, pal, that they provided? I probably
our her strong recommendations was that a like a repeal and replace >> process is very very difficult. It's a really high bar. >> So that would be basically like take the existing zoning and drop it drop it down >> and take this whole new thing and sort
of just repeal and replace, right? So her sense from her experience is that it's better to chunk it over like three town meetings. So that was why I was kind of in my head thinking maybe there's a way we could somehow get some
of this sort of like initial piece done in the fall. But I I really with all the other stuff that's on the plate like the housing production plan, the economic development plan, the open space and recreation plan, the climate action plan, which if that funding comes through is going to be getting kicked
off pretty soon. Well, will be getting kicked off in the next couple of months essentially. um that Cheryl's probably much more realistic that it would probably be more like the spring 27 even for that first of the
three town meetings. Um so that was just some of the feedback we were getting from Carolyn based on her experience with this stuff. Um, >> so one of my experiences, Liz, is that we did just a renumbering of the zoning bylaw when we did the first round of
codification and that generated discussion at town meeting. I really feel like the next generation of town meeting should just be like that cleaning the whole thing up and not like a lot of changes because I
feel as if that's going to be a lot for one vote. So, you know, cleanup can be explained as not changing the way or what people can do. Maybe it's changing the way a little bit, but not what people can do and
where. And then you can get to the things that the attorneys want to see done differently or that the commissioner wants to see done differently after you've got the thing cleaned up. >> Yeah. I honestly Can you guys be quiet?
I honestly um >> We can lose. We will be quiet. Um I I honestly don't know how much sort of like internal inconsistency there is in the document. >> So just for example, there's no
dimensional >> table >> table. So you read one place I got to search and jump around to find what my minimum lot size is, what my setbacks are, and some place that might contradict it somewhere down the road here.
And the other thing that would take some clean up would be the definition of height is different in different sections. So I mean >> that is like craziness in zoning. Um there's no like place that where parking
is like a table. I mean, if you're used to working with zoning codes like I am, you see this zoning code and you think like, how is it that this exists? Because it's just not user friendly. That's just the
first level is making it user friendly. So like there was an unofficial one pager that put the setbacks on it just for the building department to use at one time so they wouldn't have to go through 10 pages each time just to find
out where how what the setbacks and the coverage and the heights were. So >> I would think that if you put the narrative language from our zoning BWA into AI and say please convert this to a
table or a chart. It could easily do that, couldn't it? >> I'd say take a lot of review to see if that's accurate. It would take it would take a lot of review. And the and the height that's in section A pertains to
very specific circumstances and very specific people that have very specific property rights. And the height that's in section whatever, same thing. And then the height that is in section whatever. So that's where, you know, I hate
cliches, but the devil's in the details. And and that's where it gets hard because then it becomes a substantive discussion. It doesn't become a clerical, a scribers. It's not it it's that's not what it is. It's it's no in this section of the bylaw, we're not
pointing back to a, you know, to a definition that, you know, applies to the bylaw in its totality. We're talking about heights in this particular, you know, overlay district and that's it. So, so then the people in the overlay
district are like, wait a second, we thought we could go higher and and you know, do you want to make the rest of the town higher? So, that's so that's where that stuff gets really hard and it becomes it becomes substantive fortunately because it's >> so you should >> that's how that's how that's how the
town wrote their bylaw. They wrote their bylaw like like circumstance by circumstance. >> So, normally you'd find a use table and in the use table you would find which districts you're allowed to do what. So if single family and you'd have an X in in each of the districts listed there
and then you'd have another use and it would check which districts. Now you go in there and you look ah I'm allowed this here but maybe somewhere else in there it tells me I'm allowed it there's an overlay that covers it somewhere else. >> I mean we didn't until recently we didn't even have we still don't have all
the overlays in the in the zoning map. I mean, if you're a property owner, I've had several people reach out to me and say, you know, can I do this with my property or where do I find out if I can do this with my property? And you you realize that it's not like the easiest
thing to answer. >> Say, okay, well, there's this GIS map. and then you go to the GIS map and then you click on it and you're not well anyway it's it will make a a big time saver if people can find the information
themselves >> it's kind of you know searchable format which now it's searchable but it's still difficult >> so I have a suggestion on this um Liz and and uh to our board could we ask
Carolyn to return back to meet with us just to have a discussion about how to ex expedite codification and to give Hal a chance to, you know, ask whatever questions he has of Carolyn. Um, you both are architects. You guys spend time
in code. I'm a builder. You design it per code. I get to build it per design. So, I don't have to spend the time in code evaluating the way you guys do. So, you you know how problematic it is to work with ours. I I I don't have the pain every single day that you guys do.
But I think in the interest of expediting whatever it is we can expedite, whether it's chunking it out, as Carolyn has said, or whatever other process we discuss with Carolyn, I think it'd be great for her to back in now that we have allocated funds and just talk through one more time what her
process is, what her timeline is, and let's make sure we all agree with the direction that she's going to go. >> Right. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. I think that's an excellent idea. I'll definitely have Carolyn come in >> or we could give Cheryl another 30 minutes to criticize it as it is because
I'm sure you're not done. >> Great. Stop. >> So, the things that um this was a great great list to go through. um 10 after nine and you know >> um I'd like to um sort of narrow it down
to things that we think we want to like short term because I think a lot of these are good um also to be looking at um for long term. Um the other things that just I'll just add we had talked about the town has not done a preservation plan in years. Um, I think
it would be nice to to be able to have a consultant, you know, to work on that and maybe jointly with the historical commission, you know, it's a lot of the information we already have, a lot of the properties that have been surveyed. Um but um there's without any effort on
preservation whether it's open space whether it's historic buildings it's it's always fallen at the bottom of the list for the town to not really and we live in a you know an incredibly um wonderful town and and you know we talk
about the physical character of the town and you know part of that is what the preservation um plan does incorporating, you know, cultural landscape reports, architectural, you know, historic homes. It's an inventory of what we have. And then so what are we going to, you know,
are there any actions that we're taking to to do that? So that's something I would like to see. I know other people have mentioned that to me and it's been years since we've done done one. Is it um having one
make grants available to us or is it >> you know what >> serve as a guide for the historical commission or just like >> I have to look at you know >> actually >> um Liz do you or do you would you know the answer to that? Um I have examples that I had brought in.
>> I would I would say I would say that um the CPC is definitely is probably where I would go first for something like this. Um, you know, the housing production plan informs their work under affordable housing. The open space and recreation plan informs their work. This
recreation ma master plan informs their work. So my suggestion is that historic preservation is one of the pillars, one of the three pillars. Um, so that that's a possibility. Maybe if there's maybe if there's some other town funding to get matched or something. Um, Mass Historic
does have sort of very limited funding for um, historic historic structure inventory reports that I've worked with in the past, but um, there are a lot of money out there for historic preservation. It's the the main pot these days is CPC,
>> but this what if we once it's adopted, does there some financial uh, opportunity once it's adopted? I'm just wondering what we what do we do with it once we have it? Um is it used by the historical commission in making their decisions? Is
it something which allows us to apply for municipal um you know there's grants available to I think municipalities through the mass historic commission. Do you have to have one of these plans? I I don't really know. So I'm asking that's
what I'm asking. >> I I think it's the same I think it's the same answer, Cheryl. I don't think there's a lot of money out there for historic preservation. >> I think you have to get really creative. There's definitely there's tax credits. Um, you know, there there are there are,
you know, national register um, you know, listings, state register listings. There's um, you know, there there there are certain things that can get teed up based on doing doing some of this work, doing some of this like foundational work. Um, it really depends on the
town's priorities >> and it may be helpful to inform CPC, you know, when the CPC >> makes decisions, >> makes decisions, what are, you know, what are the priorities? What are the things that have been um at risk? The CPC's funding the the yacht club, which
was, you know, our old jail and and that's being restoration work is being finally um happening on that very slowly, but it's happening. They're getting ready to do the windows, the CPC, they've done the roof. So, um, that's something, but something to sort
of guide and say, okay, these would be a priority. We had put on fire station, you know, previously it was, you know, the historical commission had said we want, you know, we really these fire stations and we could use CPC funding to do them and that's, you know,
Athetherton Street would be the next one. So, it would be that type of um municipal projects or assets the town has um that I think it might guide that. Um >> Mass Historical will uh provide matching funds for a plan. >> Oh, okay. That's that's good to know.
So, maybe that could be something that the planning board applies to CPC for, you know, for a grant for for a consultant to maybe work on this. >> Um I just >> not looking to more work for our board. I think it's um just a thought I have in
terms of what would our residents expect of us. uh not every resident but probably some residents and you know for any folks that are listening tonight and they hear some of the things that we're talking about you know envisioning um you know I guess aspirationally the list but I'm sure there are plenty of
residents that might be thinking what's the impact of the change that we're ongoing that's ongoing right now before we make more changes you know do we even recognize what is the impact of what we're we're seeing built and um We I
think we have a responsibility to to to understand that, you know, and be able to respond to a resident, you know, that yes, we do understand what the impact is and um you know, and we have capacity as a town to absorb more. Do you know what I mean? I think in and we had a
calculation that Liz gave to us recently of what's under construction, Liz, on the u on the projects. I'm not asking you, but I know you gave it to us recently. There's a tremendous amount under construction. Eventually those are going to be occupied units. You know I think did um did you say that Michael White has 28 ADU applications?
>> Maybe it wasn't you maybe Liz said that >> I think >> but you know we have this surge you know and I feel we're responsible to the residents to understand you know what's the impact of the change that's ongoing before we you know create even more impact within the town. So I don't know
how we do that, you know, but >> I'm sure it's there's a lot of there's a lot of thought involved in that. But uh >> traffic analysis >> it it you know the impact is is probably to to every service we have in town. you know, we were talking about this back
when the MBTA communities um discussion took place and and um um you know, but I'm I'm considering you know, the impact of all the multi-un most 40bs and large 40bs. I'm not sure there's ever been an
analysis by the town of what the impact is of those. There isn't one that I'm aware of, but you know I >> Yeah, >> before I'm sorry, Maggie, but before we face the criticism of residents in town that are hearing us talk about creating
more opportunity for more residential, I I would want to be able to be prepared as a board to say, "Yeah, well, we've been informed of what the changes are that have taken place and we understand them." >> Do you know what I mean? >> Right. But >> and that's actually that's going to be one of the discussions that I wanted to
bring up. um with our final agenda item and talking about the $450,000 grant and part of that >> before we go to that quickly >> and I'm not jumping to it, but I I just was going to tie this in is that >> just talking about impacts before we get too far.
>> So I I was wondering and I asked and I after town meeting I did send Nick Molatto an email wondering if we can do assess impact um fees. So if you read in the paper recently, you know, the town of Brainree, they they're proposing a
700 unit um project and in return the town of Brainree had a developer agreement and um and to assess and to mitigate some of the impacts on their um on the town. And as part of that
agreement, the developer um committed to paying substantial mitigation funding um and public benefits um which included funding for public safety, a new patrol vehicle, more than $329,000
in support of the police department over time, traffic monitoring technology and cameras, contribution for schools, and public amenities including recreational access, parking, and riverfront improvements. So like and I and I think
I reached out to Liz about this too, like how do we as a town um get these developers to pay um and impact fees, you know, and then a town meeting the other night, we heard Chief
King talk about the um drain on Milton Hospital, the drain on his um staff at the policeman on because he has to send them up to the hospital for um a lot of issues up there and it and they're it's
draining our resources. Um so how do we get these developers to pay impact fees and who would negotiate these um developer agreements at the start of any type of project?
You know, I Liz, I don't know if you want to comment on that in in your experience. Um, and I don't know how they as a town how they negotiated that themselves, but it would >> I I >> would I would probably need to I I know I know Maggie, when you reached out
about that, I had said that my my former colleague in Brainree probably wrote the zoning for that. I know she I know she wrote the zoning for the the the project that's going by the old Armstrong um Armstrong Dam. That's
the 700 one. That's an MVTA project. The the permit behind the Southshore Plaza, which I think is like 4 400 or so units that was different type of zoning. Um but she was definitely involved in both. Um, and she's also the chair or up until
recently was the chair of the zoning board in Watertown. Um, so I'd have to look at it. I'd have to see whether or not that those sort of impact fees are written into are written into the zoning itself. I don't I don't know the answer
to that. I do know from a legal standpoint that there has to be a nexus between the project and the and the fee. So it can't just be sort of, you know, some random item. It has to, you know, I mean, if the developer doesn't mind and
they do it sort of like of their own valition, then it probably could go through, but if it's challenged, it has to have has to be a nexus. Um, so I don't know. I mean, the town the town has adopted inclusionary zoning for
pretty much all of its all of its uh multif family development overlays, right? So, so you know that there's there's decisions that are made about sort of like what do you want developers to provide, right? So, so, so there's
that as well, you know, like the the um you have to be able to justify what you're asking them to do. So, um I don't know. I it's something it's something I could definitely take a harder look at. Um and um
>> or maybe is project the town's priorities. >> Those are probably not 40bs that you're referencing in Brainree, which I would think has >> No, neither neither are 40bs. Correct. >> Neither neither of those projects are 40bs. Correct. Yeah. You really don't
have any you have no ability to to impose additional fees. In fact, that letter that you saw that we put together for 648 Canton, you know, shows you the extent to which, you know, an an applicant can come in and and sort of get through that permitting process and
sort of defer, you know, a significant amount of uh of process, right? So, um yeah, I don't know definitely something to look at. So one thing I will say is that that scale of development if the
infrastructure can't support it the town is not obligated to put in the infrastructure improvements for it. So part of uh it might be that the developer is required to pay for it because they wouldn't be able to do the project otherwise and you know call it
the impact fee but it's really just a cost of doing their project. It's a cost of business. Um, I know Boston does uh impact uh fees and and other things as part of their large project review. It's baked
into their their whole system. Um, and it's all based on scale the project and the location and the impacts in that particular location and you know it's very neighborhood specific. So, um, it
that kind of is consistent with what you're saying, Liz, in terms of the having to be very much tied to the impact that the project has. It just can't be something broad. >> Yeah. >> Police really police and medical are
part of our infrastructure and I feel like that gets overlooked. >> Yeah. I don't think that the law allows that to be something you can >> physical. Yeah. >> It's like it's like roads. It's like water. It's like sewer. >> There's really um
there there's a gap, Maggie, as as you'd see it and probably as a lot of people see it. If anything was evident in town meeting, it was Chief King and Chief Grant, how stretched they are trying to meet standard service requirements for
the town. And uh I mean it was really difficult as a town meeting member to sit and listen, you know, to what really appeared to to to me to be um they're doing everything they can with really limited resources. And back to the point
I was making earlier, they have yet to assume the responsibility of all this new development. Their job just gets harder. Now all of a sudden you open up all these new buildings and and and you know this is this is it's not common for Milton to have 90 unit residential
projects. We have yet you know to challenge our fire department or our police department with that kind of a demand. They don't have enough resources, it feels to me, the way they would like to for Milton as it is right now. And they have yet to experience Milton as what it's going to be like in
a year. You know, and when I when I when I think about, you know, creating a greater burden on police and fire or on DPW, you know, I I I feel we have a responsibility to understand the impact of what's happening in Milton right now
before we create more of a burden, you know, on the town. I'm sure we could get stats on how often they're called to Fuller Village or how often they're called to Anquity House um or Winter Valley because those are all over 90 units. >> Aton gets more calls. You know, this
>> and the elderly get more uh medical calls u because obviously potential health issues. They've got I'm sure they have the stats on that. So we would know or we'd be able to ask you know um on those and those are the three I can
think of off the top of my head. >> Yeah. >> Um and there might be something else which is um at that level. >> Um I'd like to suggest that we say for the fall that we could do the simple thing of the MBTA
community 15% >> requirement. >> Does that make sense to everyone? Yeah. >> All right. And um I'd like to start a conversation on the short-term rentals.
>> Not saying where, you know, it might fall, but I think the conversation should start. And I'd also like to start a conversation or what then what would be in involved with planning for the west part of Milton.
Um, and I >> recognize it's a long term kind of thing, but >> which might actually come out of the housing production >> or the economic economic plan, >> but I I just think if we state it and we start to think about it, we don't have
to start it immediately because there's other things are going to economic development plans underway and the housing production plans getting going. But I I do think it would be beneficial for us to make a commitment to it um about what we would want to do, what it might entail,
and um and scenic roads. So, those are my >> everybody else can throw in theirs, but I mean that's um my suggestions for a focus start. >> So, I would like to address um um
non-conforming businesses. I feel like that would be somewhat easy to do um because all the non-conforming businesses have been around for decades and decades and so we just have to um
make them not be by special permit and also I would like to do the F with dimensional standards and open space. So, are you suggesting a zoning change in the fall for the pre-existing non-conforming Aggie or for the spring?
>> Well, it's, you know, as soon as it's ready. I don't want to kick the can too far down the road. I mean, I think um that I think addressing our pre-existing businesses should take priority over um
new businesses in town and looking even though I do support looking at um opportunities in the west part of Milton and I've already, you know, come up with three different locations where I think it would work. I think um we owe our our
existing businesses um the um the respect to cottify their business before we take on new businesses. >> So Cheryl, you referenced earlier state legislation that's that could be pending about pre-existing non-conforming would >> I'm pretty sure it's residential resial.
>> I'm pretty sure it's not business. And um I support addressing pre-existing non-conforming businesses. I just don't know that we could do it justice by the in eight weeks we have before for the fall. Um, and it's partly because I
think uh if all it is is to say you're going to change the map so that it's a business that's allowed business use or you know what I mean? I think we have to kind of hammer out what what the changes would be to address it. And I don't and I think we need to talk to
some attorneys who have represented the businesses as well as the business owners themselves to kind of decide what we need to do, >> right? What we should do. >> But I think we can start working on it. Maggie, to your point, I think we could, you know, um start looking at what other
maybe other communities um have also done with that. >> And as far as the F um and dimensional standards, I um I agree with that. I think it's possible that that could be for the fall.
>> When when we say for the fall, are we saying prior to fall town meeting or are we saying in the season of the fall? >> I'm talking about for fall town meeting >> which means a July >> 9th. So that means
>> eight weeks. >> Eight. Yeah. Eight weeks. How many >> which is for us? Four meetings. meetings. That's what I was just thinking. Yeah. >> So, the F um >> I'm a little concerned that we >> we don't have enough time to do all that.
>> That would be the only one really for the fall because the the MBTA one is a pretty straightforward just you strike some language that that you don't need anymore once HLC accepts the 15%. That's just a cleanup. But I think on the F we could target it and if we don't
feel like we can in a dimensional standards if we don't feel like it's ready we just don't do it. But at at least we can >> give Nick an idea of what we think we can do. >> And I know they don't love a lot of zoning in the spring. Um so that's why I
think it's helpful to map out a bigger or longer term picture. Um, and I think we'll find out next meeting from Carolyn what we might get from the codification and if we think that's uh doable for the fall. That's mostly
her and our for us it's review. >> I don't think F I've looked at F you know for various zoning like MBTA for example in particular. Um, we we what I think we would want to do
with that is kind of codify what is kind of our standard, what you find most places and um and just make sure you don't make it too strict that you know
>> um so that takes a little analysis you know in terms of what we've got. So try and pick some each of the residential districts and say do some analysis in each one and maybe how and I can split it up and do
and do some of that analysis. Um you know take some what looks like a housing pattern in a residency resident BA and because we did do a lot of that with MBTA. >> Yeah, >> exactly. That's how we ended up with the >> You probably had a lot of Yeah. That um
>> Well, I did a lot of it in the Elliot Street corridor and the Blue Hills Parkway. I didn't do it in the you know residences that weren't are the part of the MBTA zoning but um you know obviously the
lock coverage is another one that plays into >> right >> um big and so like right now you you hear you see all this stuff about lock coverage in our zoning and then it says except for single family residential. So
that's how you get that those houses on uh Pine Pine Grove whatever that street is off of Pleasant which look like you know there's a bit it's a too much house on the size the lot it is. So it's a combination of the F and the setbacks
and the lot coverage. I think that's worth trying to look at. >> And can't we even just put a placeholder in? I know like every other board puts placeholders in even when their zoning isn't um or their their warrant articles
aren't ready. Couldn't we just put a placeholder in and um and then if it's not ready we just pull it >> and I think Caroline >> you can you can you can definitely you can definitely do that Maggie but even
in my short time here the level of consultation that was required on something that's something like an F I mean like Cheryl said the MBTA thing is clerical um But the F if it starts to
impact, you know, people's abilities to do certain things, um, this just has to be a lot of consultation. So, it's just just just being just being realistic about about, you know, how fully baked something needs to be
pretty pretty early on to have a good chance of passing. >> Yeah. because that's what I hear from people, you know, when a a new house goes up and they're like, "Oh my god, how did that go up? It's so out of place, you know, it just doesn't fit in." Um,
>> you know, so and and adding on to houses and and tearing down houses and putting new ones up, that's happening all the time. Um, so I think that's why it's a priority because all these houses aren't just
fitting into the neighborhoods that the neighborhoods were um, designed for. >> One thing you have to be careful about is taking away too much of their their rights. Um, and I think a lot of reasons people are adding on is they there's no
a starter home become they're turning it into their next home because they have nowhere to go for the next home. that perpetuates that perpetuates the problem. That's what I was saying before like we are exasperating a problem because we are taking a starter home and
making it a you know a bigger home and then there's no starter homes on the market. you know, I've lived in five different houses, you know, and I went from smaller, went from an apartment on Blue Hill Parkway, you know, to a
smaller house to a bigger house. Then now I'm downside now downsized now that I'm, you know, almost an empty neester. So like and I wouldn't be able to do that if all of a sudden the houses like
are all on on as I said on um Guliver and M Elm and on Maththaw Street. If you drive down Math Street th those houses are huge and they're built all the way to the property lines and they're going for like $2 million and that that
neighborhood was a starter neighborhood. So, we're taking our starter homes off of the market and so we're kind of, you know, we're sabotaging ourselves. >> Sounds like you're uh you're going to sign the legalized starter homes uh
petition after this, Maggie. >> Yeah, in certain neighborhoods. >> Well, I do think this is some of this will be coming part of the discussion or should be at the housing production plan. Yeah. >> Um my my thought uh was not to adjust
the F so people couldn't do additions. It was really more to kind of think about how to just not have the most egregious Maggie. Um so maybe we're in a little different place on and how far to go with that. But I think the first thing
>> is to understand what our built environment looks like. So what we're and what the F is. That's what I I did for MBTA communities. That's how we set those FS and then um and then look at you know what kind of
adjustments incremental adjustments might be made there. >> Y and if we get the housing production plan, the economic development plan done and this list you know that we've started with >> those plans should feed into what we do next. I mean we should from those we
should have some marching orders >> but like looking at the west um on the west side. >> So >> and all these are great ideas but I I I will not ignore what I said earlier that we need an analysis of the impact of the development that's ongoing and that's
permitting. I mean these are all great initi you know I've said this repeatedly for years now. >> Change really should be done in balance. If we don't do it in balance, we're going to create problems that we can't solve. >> And and we certainly don't have the
funds, you know, to respond to to our departments the way that we like to need the way that we would like to be able to. It's it's just it's not fair to to the departments to create more burden, you know. Um >> again, so we talked about a me a
clerical fix on the MBTA hearings. We talked about F lock coverage and dimensional standards and we talked about initiating discussions for planning in West Milton. >> I don't see any of that adding any burden to any anyone. >> No, I'm not I'm not arguing with any of
that, you know, but um I I just I'm reiterating what I had said earlier. I'm not I'm not trying to stop any of those things. We should do all of those. We should do them quickly. We should do them fast and get them done. I just want to reiterate what I said earlier. You know, I think it's really important for the town and I think it's something we owe to the residents.
>> I just want to be clear for anybody who's watching that we're actually not suggesting doing anything that's going to expand things. At the moment, we're talking about addressing some fixes, which is the F and the dimensional standards and the
>> rec and the reclatification and the pre-existing non-conforming businesses. I also think is something we've heard a lot of problems about over a long period of time, my entire tenure on the board. Initiating a conversation about short-term rentals is coming from
residents and I think we and so is the planning for West Milton. So I sure >> I feel as if we should start those conversations. >> Sure. And for the folks that were listening earlier that heard amendominium conversion section of the zoning when we were talking about you were articulating how many homes is six
or 7,000 square feet. I think people that were listening then said that sounds like more housing. So, um, again, what you said, yeah, I I just think we have to we have to be able to recognize what it is we're asking our departments to digest before we suggest, you know,
plans to create more burden for >> one of the things about the condo conversion is as an alternative to 40B. Now, some people say, "Well, we're getting close to our SHI requirements." But we know that two of the largest 40bs
in in Milton are historic homes either being torn down or altered significantly um because they they couldn't there was no alternative for them to do a condo conversion because their lot sizes were smaller than 10,000. >> I don't think they would have done a
condo. I don't think those developers were looking to do a condo conversion. >> Maybe somebody else would have bought it though. Who would have >> Are you referring to the can now >> to the >> 582? >> 582 Blue Hill Lab especially because it's 11,000 foot house >> um on what 5 acres.
>> Yeah. >> So it's just also there's no can apply under the ZVA. They can go to the ZVA and apply if you have a large property and you want to subdivide into condos. There was an application um a few years back that came in. Somebody wanted to
take a large home, divide it into three condos, but the abuing neighbors said were really upset about it and didn't want it. And so the ZBA denied it. >> Well, let's just go back to when it was written. It was a burst state. And so the bur estate was >> that was >> was turned into condos. Multiple
buildings on a parcel and a his a large historic home converted into condos. And we have more than one of those, I think. Um >> yeah, >> that was so it's been utilized well. and it preser allows an opportunity to preserve
>> works on that. Um, so I do think it's worth talking to the historical commission and because they they came to speak to the plating board before >> and um and saw it as an opportunity to help preserve large homes, but so yeah. No, I I respect I mean this all this
list I hear what you're saying, Sean. So, just um just so you know, um the chair of the select board reached out and was interested in um in wanting to know if the planning board would like to attend one of their meetings in June, which are on the Tuesdays typically
before our meetings. Um I think this was a really good robust discussion that we put our goals. Um and I just wanted to um discuss with the planning board if if we would like to go and discuss this. I think the the select board was thinking,
are there things that we could align on that we would like to work on together? They've, you know, certainly expressed um interest in the housing production plan. Um, excuse me, the economic development plan. Um, and there will be, you know, they will have representation
on that. Um, >> so you're thinking June >> housing production plan. So, >> I would ask that if you would allow me to get back from my >> Oh, yeah. >> Yeah. So June, that would be the June, >> the later one on 24th. >> Yes. So, so they actually meet on the
23rd, I think. >> The 23rd. >> Okay. >> You said you were gone for the 11th and the 25th meeting. So, are you back? Will you be back for that? >> It's the 28th and 11th, I think. >> 28th. 28th. Sorry. >> All right. So, June 23rd for the >> 23rd. Um, and we and basically just to
recap this what we're working on. Um I think it would be an opportunity for us to talk about the fact that we've already initiated our in econ that we've engaged with MAPC and we have a certain scope of work that we had talked about expanding a little bit and you know
>> do we know where that stands >> Liz? Do we know where funding to continue the economic development plan is? I'd have to go back and look at at what was in the budget, but I believe there was a either a $25,000 or a $30,000
allocation and it was going to be split between the two boards so that each board sort of had an equal >> Yeah. So, >> because I was looking at the minutes, there was a a request for us to accept $25,000 in free cash to go towards the
economic development plan, >> which we accepted, right? >> Yeah. >> Um, we did. I just would like an update on like what's the scope? Do we have an opportunity to have them come in and discuss the scope with us? You know, should we discuss the scope jointly with
the select board on the on the 23rd? Should MAPC be there for that discussion? I just like everything just takes so long to kind of like get ironed out. And um >> it it is something that I think if all
the parties are together and we can hammer it out, we can at least get them going. >> I don't know if the APC should be at that first initial meeting. I would think that we would have to meet and and
didn't we get $25,000 and so and did they get $25,000? So, it's a $50,000 contract, which was less than what where the full scope was going to be
covered. I thought that's how we left it. We weren't sure what how much of the scope would be covered by the funds that we had. >> Yeah. And whether or not you folks want to use some of your FY27 planning study money to enhance the, you know, some of
the scopes potentially, I don't know. Um but I don't believe anything has been settled beyond the last you know round of conversations which was that you know each of the boards was going to was going to have a share in the funding and
the scope was to be finalized and and so maybe the 23rd is the is the perfect >> to have that conversation you know to I think every >> finalize so we wouldn't finalize our scope and they finalize their scope and
then we come together because we have two different pots of funding. >> We've we've sent them what our what the original scope was. >> So it would be nice because I think Cheryl said let's stay with that framework of what that scope was what
MAPC was working from and you know and then tweak from from that. Um, >> I mean, I remember Maggie at the time we talked about, gee, maybe it'd be nice if they could um take on the analysis of
the pre-existing non-conforming areas. >> Yes. And and West Milton. Yeah. >> And West Milton and possibly even what's going on Milton Village like or East Milton Square. We have vacancies in those storefronts or we have vacant buildings, you know. um that though we
we thought might have to be sort of a round two, but it would be useful to understand how much it would cost for round two. uh you know there's a lot of lost um I think it's lost cost
when you have something that languishes for a year and you have to kind of >> get the team back together and >> you know was almost like started again >> um and pick up the pieces the process like
>> because at a joint meeting the planning board is going to have our own discussion and the select board's going to have their own discussion so I I don't know if the planning board needs to do any more refinement of our previous discussion. >> I think it needs to be more
collaborative than just two boards going and doing their own thing. >> And maybe it's a a question I'll let you know Liz can talk to Nick about um how we move this forward and and sort of you know we would like to you know work with
our scope maybe you know or maybe some things we don't need necessarily on and that if depending on our funds and what what we can afford to do. But maybe we put this on the agenda for
our next meeting. I know Sean, you're not going to be here, but at least maybe we could get some feedback on where we are with our consultant and and we could just have it on as just a a brief discussion on that prior to the 23rd.
Good. Okay. So I this was really a good a good um discussion. Thank you all. Um and we have one last final item which um that is um and Liz I if you want to maybe just touch on this what you know
about it of the mass works grant for East Milton sort of an overview. Um I did get to I don't know if everyone had a chance to read through that but um >> wait was something added here? >> There was a
I just >> I just kind of I just sort of threw this together quickly because the main thing >> Yeah. The main thing that Nick wanted you folks to know was that public um component of this um you know the way it's laid out in scope it's sort of
buried kind of in like item number six. But in terms of the timeline, the listening session takes place in in months 0 to two and then the public session, a second public session takes place um somewhere between months four and six. So I don't know what day zero
is. I didn't get a chance to get to that. I don't know if that's tomorrow or if it's September 1st. I honestly don't know. Um my sense is it's probably sometime in the next month or so um that they're going to because I know they're getting close to getting a a contract
finalized. Um and so it'll be you know it'll move along. So I think I think the thing is just to be you know just to be paying attention to you know the the um the levers where the public input and the board's input can be can you know
can be will be taken um and um and yeah and there's I there's a lot of detail in the in the scope I mean it's about six or seven pages long. I didn't get into into a lot of that um because it's um you know pretty standard in terms of you
know the assessment and the and the engineering and and I think you probably all know too that it's from the Quinzy line um over by the um what's that restaurant over there >> and thank you from basically from Brick
and Bean to the corner of Granite and then um the two sort of um you branches of Mechanic in and what Franklin >> and it seems to extend 100 feet beyond Mechanic, >> I believe. I saw that in here and it I
did it. It goes pretty far down into East Milton Square, which is which would be good. >> Yeah. Yes. Yes. Yes. I I think Yeah. Okay. Sorry. >> No, I just was going to say I think I think this is I think this is great. Um my only concern is a large a significant
part of this um analysis is on the traffic and with with the Falcone building it it appears to be that the Falcone building won't even be completed when this is this timeline is completed. So,
I I would think that, you know, I and I'm not sure how that would work to really be able to understand the impacts. Already we've seen um the fruit center saying they're going to start towing. They're worrying about the apartment residents parking over at the
fruits, you know, at the fruit centers parking. Um you know, we don't know what on street parking, you know, we we don't allow on street parking. um we don't know, you know, the traffic flows that, you know, sort of the impacts of 90 units is going to be on that on that
corner um and intersection. So, I guess that would be a question and for the consultants on how how that's going to be managed and how how that can be predicted if they're if they're intending to predict those impacts. >> Yeah, that that is a great question,
Meredith. I but I know I do know from professional experience that that they can model that right they can they based upon the size of the units and the number of people they anticipate moving in there they can model that >> forward which would I would hope be included in this >> yeah and because I know that's going to
be a concern of someters y >> the scope of this with the sidewalks improvements along Mechanic and Franklin I mean that part of town needs it a lot >> um and I you I'm not sure a lot of my neighbors necessarily know about this, but I I
would anticipate them. Once I get into it and get some more information, I'd be welcoming to this, I would think. >> So, the first public outreach is is task five. Is that right? >> Yeah. >> And it seems like it should be that that's after final design. So, it seems
like there should be a public outreach. >> Well, when you look at this the listening session, I was wondering if that's with >> town, >> right? conduct coordination meetings with town during project development phase. I don't know if that's >> Oh, I think I think there's
>> Yeah, I think there's I'd have to go back and look at it, but I'm pretty sure that there's a public session, a public listening session. >> There is two outreach meetings, including one early stage public listening session. >> Yeah. >> During project development.
So, I think to your point, it's the earlier that can happen, I think is better for the neighbors. The >> neighbor. >> Yeah. And I just want to make sure you folks are you folks are aware because like I said, if if day one is like, you know, June 15th, >> then this is literally happening before
the summer's over. >> So, that's the type of stuff that's important because it's going to move fast. >> Yeah. Um and you know those questions getting on the getting on the record you know kind of if that ear as early as possible you know then then the
consultants can can can look at the questions. Yeah, I I think that given summer and a lot of people um are busy in a way in the summer, even if the DPW did a an info session which says
here's what we've I got a consultant a grant and a consultant on board to do and have a map and kind of show people and say we're going to have our first listening session, you know, in whatever it is. But just that because like people
saw it in the paper and they didn't know what it was >> seemed just like out of the blue. And I think there's just been so much interest in East Milton Square in the development and in the impacts of the development
and other things um that it shouldn't be after the project starts that they first have an opportunity to even learn about the details of it. I think the way that TEC wrote their proposal, they are not doing anything with the public until
they get passed because they have it as task five, >> right? >> And and they write this in a sequence survey and base mapping. That's task one. Task two is project development. Task three is preliminary, 50% design. Task four is final design. And then they have public outreach and coordination. I
think that's to discuss the project after it's designed, you know, and and you know, whatever coordination they feel. and then they're into permitting. So, they don't have anything. And reading through their proposal, >> they're leaving it to the town to do that, you know, to do whatever public
outreach. Um, yeah, I think it's I >> I I think um there's a >> I don't I don't I don't think so. I don't think so, Sean. I think >> I think it's just the way they sort of I think it's just the way they laid it out really. >> They're definitely they're definitely on a hook to to do that listening session
early on and to do the and to do the public session before when I read >> I didn't see it either. So >> when I read through the scope of services, it doesn't say anything about the listening session. So >> So in public outreach facilitate two public outreach meetings including one
early stage public listening session during project developments. And then if you flip back project developments is task two, >> which page did you read that on? >> Uh page five. >> Five. >> Um task five it says town coordination meetings and then public outreach. So we
we we should confirm lisk should confirm we should advocate for that but the way that I'm reading this is the early stage during project development is task two when they're doing the conceptual design. >> So so yeah so I guess um confusing >> it is weird that it's five.
>> Yeah they they task five is meetings public outreach and coordination. They have and they have a value assigned to it of $35,000. So they have some time allocated to it. just as hell said. But um anyhow, it should be it's it wasn't clear in the in the previous or but it but anyhow that's good.
>> It definitely was not clear in the in the article in the times that like it that seemed scary to me when reading it that it was already >> to a point but >> yeah should be covered. I think the sooner that meeting gets kind of scheduled and what the expectations are
and if it can be before end of school >> um or when school releases because that's when a lot of people vacation and other things, >> right? >> Yeah. >> Yep. >> So when when you read that description of the work, it says 100 ft west of
Franklin Street. Mhm. >> So that's going >> that's going back towards the towards um the highway 100 ft towards the highway and then all the way >> to the Quinzy line. >> And it says even an additional 25 ft beyond that as well just for like the
proving the pavement. So when I did I mapped it, it looks like it's going all the way to kind of the um median there, the little island that's there. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> 125 ft is almost to that point. >> I see. And then also it's down Franklin and down mechanic.
>> It's down mechan it's down mechanic all the way to Granite. >> Yeah. >> And it's down Franklin all the way to Basset I think. >> Yeah, >> those sidewalks were terrible. >> Be great. >> Oh, the roads mechanicism.
>> Yeah. So parking on the sidewalk because there's no curb on mechanic anyway. >> No. Much needed. Okay. Well, this was good. So, I just wanted to put this on so >> yeah, >> we could understand it so we when we're asked about it, we
>> I did want to also point out here it does say conduct coordination meetings with the historic commission and other relevant stakeholders as it relates to the railway village historic >> village railway village historic village but I think I meant districts. um two meetings
with the historic commission, one virtual, one in person, one presentation to the select board. >> It's just kind of the way it's where some of this information is. It's not intuitive. But >> Liz, um do you know if there are any
utility relocations involved in what they're proposing? >> A question for me. Yeah, >> I would be great to >> This is This is This is literally the first I've looked at this project was just to kind of give you guys a sense of the schedule. >> Okay, great.
>> Yeah. Feel like they buried some of the utilities at 440. >> They did. Yeah. That we had requested that. >> Yeah. >> I I'm not even thinking that that would be part of it, but I just I just think I'm just thinking about, >> you know, the period of design and then the period of construction.
This is long way away. I think you know it just takes time to plan these projects and it could be I mean a start date on this project could be you know a year to two years away I think you know get involved in permitting and all the
issues and if there are utilities involved >> funding for it right there's no funding >> it's even it's even more important right yeah the funding yeah >> okay great thanks for putting it out there to us Liz >> all right so that is the last item on
our agenda. Um, and so, um, we wish you the best of luck in your >> You think I need luck? >> Do you have to be silent on it? That's what I was thinking about. >> You know, it's, uh, to be honest with you, I think, um, it's there's plenty of people that, you know, spend some
periods of time in silence. >> Okay. >> Yeah. You don't have to. You don't have Okay. Okay. >> Yeah. No, you don't have to. I I have um a priest that I'm friends with who's walked a portion of this three times and >> no uh yeah but um uh no it's not it's
not necessary. I think it's impossible. My daughter did my daughter did it last year and she um she came from Porto so she was 170 miles you know I'm coming from France >> and 483 miles and we won't be able to we
don't have enough time though I can't spend a month in France u but we'll we'll be somewhere around 200 miles of it so amazing >> I'm sure some of it will be silent >> all right so um thank you all um Liz did
you have anything else. Otherwise, I would entertain a motion to adjurnn. >> Nope. >> Some moved. >> Second. All in favor? Roll call. Sorry. Maggie, >> yes. >> Hal, >> yes. >> Sean, >> yes.
>> Cheryl, >> yes. >> And myself, yes. >> Good night. Good night. Thank you. >> Good night, everyone. >> Good night. >> Good night.