WEBVTT

METADATA
Video-Count: 1
Video-1: youtube.com/watch?v=aHtPN9raSCU

Part: 1

1
00:00:24.360 --> 00:00:44.920
Okay, thank you everyone for joining us. I will call to order tonight's meeting of the Millis Board of Selectmen for Tuesday, June 23rd, 2026. I would like to ask you to join me in the Pledge of Allegiance. >> I pledge allegiance to the flag of the

2
00:00:44.920 --> 00:00:59.840
United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. >> [snorts] >> Thank you everyone. As usual, [clears throat] we'll begin

3
00:00:59.840 --> 00:01:17.840
with public comments. We have allotted 21 minutes for public comment, 3 minutes per speaker. I don't know if we have anyone that has signed in. Can't see anything in here. Anyone in the room? No.

4
00:01:17.840 --> 00:01:34.840
No one online? All right, so we will close public comments. All right, and with that to item four, I would like to ask the Planning Board if you would join us here at the table for our discussion. Um, I'll also ask uh Chair Hall just for

5
00:01:34.840 --> 00:02:31.400
formalities if you could call your meeting to order. >> Thank you. >> [cough] >> Okay, thank you very much. >> [clears throat] [laughter] [snorts] >> Thank you for having us. I would like to now call the

6
00:02:31.400 --> 00:02:48.920
meeting of the Milton Planning Board to order and we typically begin by introducing ourselves for those who those in the audience who might not know us. Let's introduce yourself. Meg Field member. Sean Feeney member. Cheryl Tougias secretary. Alan Munger

7
00:02:48.920 --> 00:03:05.560
member. And Meredith Paul serving as as serving as chair and with us this evening we have our planning director. Would you like to introduce yourself? >> Liz Manning planning director. >> Thank you everyone. >> Thank you for having us.

8
00:03:05.560 --> 00:03:22.519
Just to begin Winston and I have met a few times and we really thought just at the beginning of you know following the election with all new with new members one of the things that we really strongly is is improving and having good

9
00:03:22.519 --> 00:03:40.040
open communication between the planning board and East Longmeadow. So with that we thought you know rather than just my meeting with Winston that we would have the entire board come and have opportunities to speak on some of our some of the things that we're working on with shared goals in mind.

10
00:03:40.040 --> 00:03:56.800
I know some of the materials have been distributed to you. I thought first I would give you a highlighted overview of sort of what the planning board has been working on. Um, not going to go into every detail of the matrix that you've been sent, but um, this was a wonderful

11
00:03:56.800 --> 00:04:13.520
way to organize projects that are um, being worked on not only by the planning board, but by the planning um, the development um, the planning um, staff as well. Cuz there's a lot of things that they oversee that don't necessarily involve

12
00:04:13.520 --> 00:04:28.880
the planning board. So, just highlighting um, and Liz DeSimone did a great job of putting this together. Um, the matrix if you look into, you know, if you've gone through it, if you have any questions, please feel free to ask. But it was divided up into what we

13
00:04:28.880 --> 00:04:44.640
work on, um, whether it be um, a housing, a category of housing, open space and recreation, climate and environment, zoning and planning, traffic and transportation, affordable housing compliance,

14
00:04:44.640 --> 00:05:00.440
budget and finance, um, with regards to our our budgeting, um, a town and and managing projects and grants, town projects and committees that we serve on, um, such as um, and the various

15
00:05:00.440 --> 00:05:16.640
um, a lot of committees that you all sit on as well. Um, there's also a lot of other regional um, things that are trainings, things that um, the staff attends and are involved with in ongoing um, to keep updated um,

16
00:05:16.640 --> 00:05:33.680
with the state regulations and what's happening on the state level especially. Um, the items that are in here are things that we are um, have been working on. Um, just for and many of you may know this, some of you may not and for those who are watching, um, currently there are 11

17
00:05:33.680 --> 00:05:49.840
construction large projects under construction right now that um, that have been approved projects. Um, they and some are close to being finished uh, and completed, others are still in in progress. Um, but all have been approved. They would include the

18
00:05:49.840 --> 00:06:05.040
Gardner School, which will be a new preschool if anyone has seen on Blue Hill Avenue. Two Elliot Street, which is the new market that will open up where the Bank of America building is. That's very close to completion. 152

19
00:06:05.040 --> 00:06:19.480
Robin Street, the farm stand there. 936 Brush Hill Road, the Trust Low 40B project. 711 Randolph Avenue. Um The Trust Low should be completed this summer.

20
00:06:19.480 --> 00:06:38.080
711 Randolph Avenue, fall of 2026. 440 Granite Ave, fall of 2026. 40 Access Road, 40B project, summer 2027. 582 Blue Hill Ave, summer 2027.

21
00:06:38.080 --> 00:06:55.200
The East Milton Residences, fall 2027. 107 Highland Street, which is going to be a memory care facility, soon to begin construction. Spring 2028. And the Winter Valley expansion, also 2028.

22
00:06:55.200 --> 00:07:11.480
Some of the items that we've also looked at um and putting into um not only things that we're currently working on, but future zoning bylaw and regulation amendments that we're looking at. Things that we've discussed

23
00:07:11.480 --> 00:07:28.440
wanting to take a look at, condominium conversion. The West Milton Brook Road overlay. Pre-existing non-conforming uses for our businesses that are in residential districts. A cut and fill bylaw. Looking at floor

24
00:07:28.440 --> 00:07:45.080
area ratios for single family home and general new construction. Business zoning district boundaries. Parking requirements. Dimensional requirements for accessory structures, small cellular

25
00:07:45.080 --> 00:08:02.440
uh battery storage and solar, site plan for town projects, short-term rentals, low-impact design, subdivision rules and regulations, and scenic road regulations. Um updating some of those. So, that is sort of an overview. Um as you

26
00:08:02.440 --> 00:08:17.080
know, we've been you know, busy with with doing a lot of um really exciting work in Milton, and we're going to be seeing a lot of that. And the staff is overseeing um the completion of some of these um housing projects um

27
00:08:17.080 --> 00:08:33.159
that we've been working on and um have been approving um in recent past. So, um that is a high-level uh just overview. And what So, we were not here all night. Winston and I thought, let's sort of narrow it down to, you know,

28
00:08:33.159 --> 00:08:51.160
what are some really the most important things that we're working on that um we really um we will rely on the support of the select board um in doing these and funding these. So, we appreciate our having time together. So, those the items that we sort of were

29
00:08:51.160 --> 00:09:06.080
um sort of first in on the forefront, um the housing production plan um is the first thing I'll speak on. Next, um and actually, I think I'm going to leave the economic development plan for the last cuz I think we're going to want to dig into that and spend a little bit

30
00:09:06.080 --> 00:09:21.560
more time. The recodification of our zoning bylaws um it is on our agenda for Thursday, but maybe a brief discussion on La Barre, um since our board has not had a chance to uh speak on that. Uh we will have that on our agenda.

31
00:09:21.560 --> 00:09:36.839
And then, just communication and and ways that we ideas for better communication um between our boards. Um to start with the the housing um housing production plan, um there was a kickoff meeting, and feel

32
00:09:36.839 --> 00:09:56.120
free if those of you um want to add something to this who were able to attend. Cheryl is our representative. Shawn was out of the country so he will be catching up on that on that initial meeting and from You were there so feel free to add

33
00:09:56.120 --> 00:10:11.160
anything if I'm I'm I'm just going to do an overview also for people who are watching because we do have a great committee comprised of two select there two select board members, two planning board members, and two affordable housing trust members. And we are very

34
00:10:11.160 --> 00:10:28.400
fortunate to have our consultant Karen Sunabacka who has there was a really robust housing production plan. Cheryl was on that committee and and many other really wonderful members who really dug in and spent a lot of time on that housing

35
00:10:28.400 --> 00:10:45.200
production plan. So she's very familiar with our town, very familiar with um a lot of you know the issues that Milton and challenges that Milton has had and helping to guide us through this process. That again that kickoff meeting

36
00:10:45.200 --> 00:11:02.320
began so and I'll just highlight just sort of task one through seven what those are and that is again the task one was the kickoff and coordination. Next is the data collection and analysis

37
00:11:02.320 --> 00:11:19.120
and task three is the housing needs assessment and all of those will be completed um fairly soon by I think there's a first draft that's been issued for the committee because that time frame was to to be on schedule was to be the end of

38
00:11:19.120 --> 00:11:35.520
June for actually for the kickoff, the data collection, the needs assessment, and development of constraints and opportunities. So those are the first um four tasks that will be completed. Task number five, which is a really

39
00:11:35.520 --> 00:11:50.920
important part of the housing production process, is community outreach. And so, reaching out to the community for community engagement will be task five. Folks in the community should look at that happening through the month of

40
00:11:50.920 --> 00:12:07.920
July. And then task six, goal strategy and action plan. And that will be coming out in community engagement community engagement September when people are back in the fall. You know, we know folks are away in the summer and we want to

41
00:12:07.920 --> 00:12:25.560
make sure that we're you know, being able to reach out to as many people as possible. So, task five, community engagement, and then goal strategies, action plan. Um, that will be sort of ongoing into October with the um

42
00:12:25.560 --> 00:12:42.839
October and then final finalize and submit the plan by November. And it is it's extremely important that we do get this done and it's been a a goal um and a focus of the planning board. I know it is for the select board. Um, we're currently um our current housing

43
00:12:42.839 --> 00:12:58.680
production plan has expired. So, being out of compliance, um it's not only safe harbor, um but it's also um just, you know, associated with other grant funding and things that we'll be working on. So, um

44
00:12:58.680 --> 00:13:14.560
it's it's critical that we do get this done and I think this is a great time frame working with a great um a great committee and a great consultant. So, um Liz, I don't know if there's anything else that you would like to add. >> I have a quick question. I may have missed this. I was absorbing

45
00:13:14.560 --> 00:13:30.800
a bunch of information, but what's the duration of the of the plan like project? >> Our last plan is five years. That's yeah. >> No, I mean like how long's is going to take the consultants to produce this plan? >> So that that's part of um

46
00:13:30.800 --> 00:13:47.640
one one kickoff meeting was laying out the calendar. >> Yeah. >> Um the goal is if you tell me where I'm wrong here. >> November. License to submit the plan. >> So there's steps along the way that >> So it's going to be a 3-month engagement in order to get back into Right. So it's really doing the task one

47
00:13:47.640 --> 00:14:02.800
kickoff and coordination, data collection, needs assessment, development constraints and opportunities by the end of June, then um and then sort of kicking off um and moving into community engagement goal strategy action plan in October

48
00:14:02.800 --> 00:14:19.920
September October and finalizing by November. So I think we should be in a good place to submit before the end of the year. >> Yeah. >> Do we have that Was that calendar shared with us the board? >> Yes. Yep, I did. I I shared out that um I shared out the the schedule. I think

49
00:14:19.920 --> 00:14:36.560
what we're going to try to do on uh the meeting on the 15th is try to nail down some of those dates. I know we talked about wanting to, you know, similar to this effort tonight, wanting to um collaborate potentially on another joint meeting if that can help kind of the schedule and kind of move things

50
00:14:36.560 --> 00:14:52.920
along. Um so yeah, I'd like to try to nail down some of those dates and sort of look at, you know, what the potential conflicts might be with with all time meeting you know, requirements and things like that. So >> So there's um the summary that you

51
00:14:52.920 --> 00:15:10.440
circulated to us um target is mid-October for that joint meeting. >> I believe so. Yes. Yes. Yep. That's the target. So I think we'll just have to kind of, you know, put everything on put everything on paper and and see where the see where the

52
00:15:10.440 --> 00:15:28.320
conflicts are and try to, you know, try to path to get us to to November. Karen has already supplied the the needs assessment, so tasks one through one, two, and three are complete. So we're we're on we're on schedule. And I think if we can if we can

53
00:15:28.400 --> 00:15:43.480
you know, collect combine a few a few efforts to to to to to move forward faster in the following, we should be able to stay on the schedule. >> One of the things that we spoke about with Karen was getting a real sense of

54
00:15:43.480 --> 00:15:59.160
where we are with our percentage of the subsidized housing inventory. There's been some talk about how close how close are we really. But, um is that something that she has in the draft that's been circulated?

55
00:15:59.160 --> 00:16:17.520
>> I got it yesterday, and I read like some of it. So, it has and I haven't circulated it beyond that. Um I think the number's like in the sevens. I mean, Nick Nick might have that number more updated than me in terms of the in terms of the SHI.

56
00:16:17.520 --> 00:16:32.960
>> I think that's right. It's a bit of a moving target as projects come on and come off just based in their various path of where where they are in their construction schedules. That sounds about right. But, if they're all built and they will be everything that's been approved will kick in once it's all done.

57
00:16:32.960 --> 00:16:49.720
>> What is the effective date of like uh unit that counts towards the affordable housing? Is it when there's an occupancy permit like >> There's three different thresholds. So, it's upon comprehensive permit being approved then there's a year to get a building

58
00:16:49.720 --> 00:17:04.800
permit. Then you can go back on. So, you can go on that and you come off if you don't get a building permit within a year. >> Okay. >> You can go on the list if you have a building permit that lasts 18 months. Then you can come off again and then you go on permanently on the subsidized housing. >> Okay.

59
00:17:04.800 --> 00:17:23.040
So, like the CO is like really the point of entry. >> Final >> Correct. Yeah. So, with the schedule that you outlined Meredith, we're into 2028 for some of the units that are being counted, right? So, like Winter Valley, it's 30-some

60
00:17:23.040 --> 00:17:39.080
units. I think he said spring of '28. Um so, my understanding is that we're still uh without the housing production plan, we're still subject to the um receiving 40B applications

61
00:17:39.080 --> 00:17:55.000
because we haven't actually finally booked all of those. That's just for those who are watching, I think it's important to understand what the value of the housing production plan for temporary safe harbor, given things go on and off, you still have windows for 40B developers to submit, even though

62
00:17:55.000 --> 00:18:10.560
you think you're almost there. It's it's an important uh effort. And so, in September, folks, uh hopefully can participate in the public forum because part of the plan is identifying locations where affordable housing can be located. Places that that the town believes are

63
00:18:10.560 --> 00:18:26.320
good locations, including private property and public property. And if those identifications of the sites, from my experience in the past, is really where public wants to um have some understanding and input um into

64
00:18:26.320 --> 00:18:44.280
that before the plan's finalized. >> And the good news is that we have made a tremendous amount of progress in recent in historically, you know, in in recent past years. Just so you might feel not all by our own

65
00:18:44.280 --> 00:18:59.400
choice, you know. Choice, it was fairly forced on us, but it was um but yeah, we there's been a lot of progress in recent which is good. Um Okay, so then um then we can move on with recodification.

66
00:18:59.400 --> 00:19:17.080
Just again, a high-level view. Um uh town meeting member um I guess it's been a year and a half to 2 years that we will that we passed um the funding for a general code to come in and upload um make our all of our um zoning bylaws

67
00:19:17.080 --> 00:19:34.320
accessible online. Now, just because it's online doesn't mean it's necessarily organized or that certain areas are in conflict. So, the good news is KP Law um now that we have KP Law can do this in-house cuz we had previously

68
00:19:34.320 --> 00:19:50.440
the Planning Board had been concerned on well, how do we go to the next step? We would need an attorney to come in. We would you know, solicit the services to come in, which is extremely expensive when towns do that. So, the ability to work with KP Law and have Carolyn Murray do um

69
00:19:50.440 --> 00:20:06.120
do this in phases. We won't be able to do everything at once. Um we understand it's likely um it's not that realistic for communities to say you know what? We're going to throw out the entire bylaw, come back with something new, and expect town meeting

70
00:20:06.120 --> 00:20:20.880
to understand that, you know, and and and evolve that process. So, what we're going to do is do a first phase and audit um as part of our first phase, and um and it will be a four-phase project. And once we finish the audit, we'll really

71
00:20:20.880 --> 00:20:37.120
know what we're up against as far as you know, do sections need to be moved? What needs to be consolidated? You know, there's been issues with, you know, really um particularly for the Building Department in town to um to be able to understand our zoning. It It takes a

72
00:20:37.120 --> 00:20:52.374
while. Joe Prondecki, it took a while. It's been a you know, a point of frustration for applicants, developers to come into town to say, "Wait, we thought it was this way, but now we're reading something else." So, this way it'll be clear, clean, as

73
00:20:52.374 --> 00:21:09.880
[clears throat] concise as possible. And and Carolyn Murray will be um leading that. So, again, we appreciate support and funding for this. Um and I'll just highlight the phases right now that KP is um that Carolyn has laid out. Phase one is the optional zoning audit, which

74
00:21:09.880 --> 00:21:25.400
we all felt was really important. Phase two is a zoning diagnostic. And that would be our next step. They will prepare comprehensive diagnostic report identifying the

75
00:21:25.400 --> 00:21:40.320
housekeeping, organizational, and legal issues that should be addressed as part of the revision process. And then the next step um three zoning drafts. We're looking at some

76
00:21:40.320 --> 00:21:56.360
of our depending on you know how the planning board feels is looking at some of the drafts of our current zoning and maybe cleaning up some of those drafts that we know have been problematic in the past. And then the phase four is the adoption process, which will

77
00:21:56.360 --> 00:22:11.600
certainly will include a lot of public outreach, sort of explaining what the changes are so that residents are you know panicked and they're worried that certain zoning is going to change without their understanding. This is really um not to look at

78
00:22:11.600 --> 00:22:27.640
changing the zoning. It's a clean really a cleanup of zoning that will be in a digital form that will be easily accessible [cough] for anyone, even a homeowner saying, "Oh, what are my setbacks? You know, what are what are my you know certain things in in my zone district my district that I live in?"

79
00:22:27.640 --> 00:22:42.640
So, it'll be helpful for everybody including our residents. So, that is the recodification. Any questions on that? >> Can I answer that? >> Yeah, yes. >> The as one who's worked with our zoning

80
00:22:42.640 --> 00:23:00.400
bylaw for a number of years now, our zoning board of appeal, our building [cough] department, our planning department spends a lot of time trying to understand and work their way through applications. Once this is updated, it will make our work the work

81
00:23:00.400 --> 00:23:15.520
of our town staff more efficient and therefore hopefully they can work through backlogs quicker. It should be easier for residents. Maybe they don't have to hire as many professionals like attorneys and engineers and architects and so forth.

82
00:23:15.520 --> 00:23:30.760
Um and it also should make it uh easier for the business community. Uh so this I I view it as really a positive on a number of fronts. Um I I I again as one of the uses that one of the first things Carolyn Murray said is

83
00:23:30.760 --> 00:23:47.840
we don't have any uh charts and tables which is one of the most important things you usually find in a in a zoning bylaw. So there's uh some of those things um that are sort of low-hanging fruit as uh I think um Meredith mentioned and some of the others are going to be things that we really want

84
00:23:47.840 --> 00:24:04.080
to take a look at like uh changes in the bylaw. But even some of it is the bylaw is uh not consistent with state law. So there's some things that we know we want to tick off first. Um and it would be helpful to think about not only just the planning board funding this effort. I'm just going to put in that pitch because

85
00:24:04.080 --> 00:24:21.600
we know it's expensive and you I'm trying to lay out the benefit overall for the town not just you know from a planning perspective. >> I think that's something that we discussed briefly at the board. About funding re-codification and those updates. My understanding is that this has happened just over time with changes

86
00:24:21.600 --> 00:24:37.640
and things moving very quickly and not being able to go back and sort of clean up these things. Um in this overview um I want how long you think this is going to take then. In the overview uh other steps being taken so that you don't have to come back and have the

87
00:24:37.640 --> 00:24:54.120
same issues for the next 5 or 10 years with the making of the changes. >> So we've talked um certainly not fall town meeting. Obviously the deadline is July for any articles. Um and we will be submitting um we are we should add um

88
00:24:54.120 --> 00:25:09.600
one of the things that we will be submitting um for the fall is um we think we'll be on track for short-term rental. And we just received the first draft from Katie Law, so stay tuned on that. We'll be letting you know when that gets a little bit further along.

89
00:25:09.600 --> 00:25:26.160
But we've talked about having a first, you know, maybe a first um issue of changes to be able to be ready for spring town meeting to identify but once we have the audit done, I think we'll know a lot more.

90
00:25:26.160 --> 00:25:42.200
Um Carolyn is is wonderful, but we also want to be realistic and what her time, our time. Right now we we have time to focus on it. So she will be initiating that first, you know, audit and but our goal

91
00:25:42.200 --> 00:25:58.480
is to have something for spring town meeting. Um in our our last discussion with Carolyn, so. >> I was just going to say I think your question was will this have to be revisited in upcoming years? Likely not.

92
00:25:58.480 --> 00:26:15.960
You know, this is this is addressing something that has accumulated over a very long period of time. There the the um the various documents

93
00:26:15.960 --> 00:26:33.280
you know, codes that someone has to review to to determine whether or not they could be in compliance or how do you define compliance? It's incredibly complicated. Cheryl Spence a lot of time because this is her work and she's very familiar with how difficult it is, but once the recodification is addressed, it

94
00:26:33.280 --> 00:26:47.880
will be it won't be your work. It probably won't be your successor but that person's successor or that person's successor. So this is this should address an issue we're not going to have to pay these funds again, you know, in any near

95
00:26:47.880 --> 00:27:04.200
future. >> And we will have it the tools to analyze if there is a conflict somewhere. And one of the thing right now some of the just the language, the definitions are in conflict. You know, what is the median grade, you know, world height of a building, how do you where do you

96
00:27:04.200 --> 00:27:20.680
measure from when you're measuring a building? So, things like this once they're cleaned up everything will be digitized. So, it it can cross-reference if you know, if there is a section that if we're working on a new bylaw, the attorneys will be able to review that

97
00:27:20.680 --> 00:27:36.160
and and and isolate any conflict when we're writing the new zoning once this is done. >> When we presented to tell me the site plan review section of the bylaw, we did that anticipating this thinking that

98
00:27:36.160 --> 00:27:52.760
when there's a requirement for site plan review, it it's sent it to one place. So, that's kind of what we're trying to do with the codification instead of having to jump back and forth to multiple sections and getting someplace uh inconsistent cross-references or

99
00:27:52.760 --> 00:28:08.840
inconsistent requirements in one section or another. Uh and that leaves our building commissioner to have to make a lot of interpretations or send it to the zoning board of appeal. Um so, uh our chair of the zoning board of appeal is very supportive of this as well and so is our building

100
00:28:08.840 --> 00:28:24.520
commissioner. >> And our and prior commissioners and prior chairs >> And our planning director. >> [laughter] >> Who's trying to piece it all together. >> Yes. >> Yeah, I think Carolyn put it nicely when our meeting last time said at one point it made sense but over the years I think it's been kind of grafted onto the the

101
00:28:24.520 --> 00:28:40.080
zoning bylaws so now it doesn't make sense. So, there's definitions in the middle of the of the overall package, right? So, now all this stuff is going to be moved to the front and kind of organize it so it's logical and go forward to make sure it's set up as I said in the first presentation. >> Can I just give you an example?

102
00:28:40.080 --> 00:28:57.200
We just we did a webinar recently where an attorney said that a bylaw said that 10% of the parking lot had to be green. Green space. So, what does What do most people think of when they think of green space? Maybe something landscaped, right? But apparently, a developer

103
00:28:57.200 --> 00:29:14.640
painted half of the 10% of the parking spaces green and said that they met that requirement in the bylaw. And it was challenged. It was upheld in the courts. >> [laughter] >> And so, having these green space be something that's defined is a is a good example.

104
00:29:14.640 --> 00:29:29.920
>> Words [clears throat] matter. >> Words matter. >> And words definitely matter to businesses in town. And I know I'm getting a little off topic, but for every plan I review, the economic development plan as a business owner in town, and we have the bylaws

105
00:29:29.920 --> 00:29:47.360
um for my own business. And from year to year to year, there's different building inspectors come in. There's different interpretations. Um and for me personally, having a different interpretation is not good for business.

106
00:29:47.360 --> 00:30:04.120
Um and also, it is in conflict with state law. And it needs to be updated if we ever want to attract um and retain businesses in town. >> So, this is a win-win for everyone. >> It's just a tool that our building

107
00:30:04.120 --> 00:30:21.480
inspector and our our staff needs. Um and as someone [clears throat] mentioned, it's not really a planning board. It's really the town staff, town hall. So, I too am an advocate of getting funding from other sources.

108
00:30:21.480 --> 00:30:37.440
>> Great. >> Um So, why don't we start with the going go into the economic development plan? Um and I guess I should be >> Do you want to do LIRR first? >> Or do you want to do the economic development plan? I think it's similar. >> Do you want to go to LIRR or do you want to just have a quick discussion on LIRR? >> We haven't had a chance to

109
00:30:37.440 --> 00:30:52.680
for any of us to >> All right, that's what we'll do that first. really >> to hear from the planning board. Libraries is obviously a curly day. But it is a potentially big project. >> [snorts] >> And so beyond us just starting with the schools around their recommendation

110
00:30:52.680 --> 00:31:10.720
potentially going to the bid process hearing from the planning board just on your thoughts on the property, your thoughts on what you heard or seen for the potential of of that property. >> Well, I You want to start? Yeah.

111
00:31:10.720 --> 00:31:26.040
Um certainly you're thinking about what happens if a school goes there or if a school does not go there. >> We're thinking I think we're I think we're looking at at both at both aspects there. I think one um schools have laid out their plan. It

112
00:31:26.040 --> 00:31:42.880
certainly seems to be right now the preferred usage of that of that place. Um but if there is a chance if there is something goes awry and you have to sort of you know change streams and go another direction, what are our options there? I think the school is the option.

113
00:31:42.880 --> 00:31:58.520
>> So, that my thought typically like when we've looked at even at daycare centers, you know, we've looked at um what impacts there might be for neighbors. So, that might be traffic for example. So, um you know, what's the schedule and how does that coincide with um any other

114
00:31:58.520 --> 00:32:14.920
impacts? I have what other uses are nearby. That's just something with any parcel and any project. Um and as far as uh if there's an addition required, um if there's additional parking required, um you

115
00:32:14.920 --> 00:32:31.720
know, certainly the town in the past has not had any planning board uh review of town-owned projects. So, uh even though there's things and town's not subject to our zoning bylaw necessarily. So, there's requirements in the bylaw for parking lots for example

116
00:32:31.720 --> 00:32:46.880
to have landscaping. So, you're breaking up the amount of impervious area. You know, so there's some things like that if you if it's a school that we might want to offer some guidance on the how we would look at it if it's a different kind of project. I think if it's not a school, it's it's

117
00:32:46.880 --> 00:33:02.320
something to be uh the town needs to be thinking about because the property is zoned single family and at just under 5 acres, um you know, by the math, you could do four uh single family lots. By the frontage,

118
00:33:02.320 --> 00:33:19.320
you could do three. Uh so, if you did four, you'd have to put a new road in. So, you're looking at something which is an assessed value of I saw I think 13 million or 14 million, something like that on their website. So, is that going to be the economic use

119
00:33:19.320 --> 00:33:35.880
of a buyer, the highest and best, you know, use for a buyer to put to have a land acquisition of say two to three to four million dollars for uh parcel to buy the land and then you still have something to you have to do with the

120
00:33:35.880 --> 00:33:53.560
building itself. So, are we susceptible to a 40B developer? >> Um yeah. >> That's the only other alternative that's not a Dover protected use. So, a Dover protected use would be a school, daycare center, house of worship. Um so, I think

121
00:33:53.560 --> 00:34:09.280
um we need to think about uh as a town if the school doesn't work, what would be the uh desired use there? And and how does that fit into the picture of our economic status, you know, our revenue

122
00:34:09.280 --> 00:34:25.200
status because it's cur- currently tax exempt. Is there a possibility uh for any tax revenue? That's a conversation that has to happen with the obviously with the neighbors, the neighborhood, the public. Uh but it I don't think it's one we should ignore because it uh you

123
00:34:25.200 --> 00:34:41.679
know, a school might be the top choice of every every person, but we have to think about what a plan B I think, um might be. >> Your point is that not only is the land very expensive, but then doing something taking down the existing buildings, preparing the land for single-family

124
00:34:41.679 --> 00:34:59.080
homes, building the homes, that's a lot of investments just to get to the single-family homes if that was the route that was as it's zoned, right? So, those That's that probably doesn't make sense in that situation. Probably. >> And in my hat as my day job as an architect, I think, you know, that

125
00:34:59.080 --> 00:35:13.920
you're looking at most likely affordable B because that's going to be what that price point can uh can support. >> So, I think we're jumping ahead. I I sent a letter to the select board after

126
00:35:13.920 --> 00:35:29.560
one of your meetings and I strongly support um the town um buying the property even without knowing what the end um use is going to be. I think ownership provides the strongest protection for

127
00:35:29.560 --> 00:35:46.560
the future of the property. Um [clears throat] ownership creates permanent local control and I think um as we all know, zoning can change. Um there are Dover protected uses. There

128
00:35:46.560 --> 00:35:59.880
are uh state um mandates that come down and I think long-term we need to own it and I would love to see a school go there.

129
00:35:59.880 --> 00:36:18.400
Um I think having a school there would actually sort of help bring the town back together. The land swap was a very divisive issue um back in 1978, my father was on the Conservation Commission and he put that

130
00:36:18.400 --> 00:36:35.000
land, the Lambs Woods, in um in conservation. And I think, unfortunately, through that process there were people who were labeled as anti-school when a lot which was myself labeled as

131
00:36:35.000 --> 00:36:50.880
that. When I'm I am pro-protection of land and conservation. We're not making any more land and I think if the school was able to use it, I think that would be a win for

132
00:36:50.880 --> 00:37:06.480
everybody. But even if the school decides that it's not um within their program, I still think the town should buy it and as Winston said a couple meetings ago, it's just for control reasons. We then can

133
00:37:06.480 --> 00:37:22.720
control it. We then can decide what is best there, what is best for the neighbors. The neighbors can come in and be part of the process. So I do support the town buying it and um and and then

134
00:37:22.720 --> 00:37:42.040
um and then seeing what the future uses. So I support that. >> Well, I think it's a uh I mean what whatever it's on the market. It could be gone tomorrow, right? I mean what it whatever

135
00:37:42.040 --> 00:37:58.600
whatever decision you know, will be made by the town. Um it's available. They're accepting offers. That's what I mean. Um And I believe the minimum is 10 million. So I think that's about the established minimum.

136
00:37:58.680 --> 00:38:14.720
But it it's I have not been inside the building, but from what I've read, uh it's probably an asset that's usable. It was renovated in 2016. It was renovated also in 2023.

137
00:38:14.720 --> 00:38:31.440
Um It looks to be in very good condition and maybe in uh equal or better condition with some of the academic rooms that they have. So, it's it's a valuable asset.

138
00:38:31.680 --> 00:38:47.280
You know, it's 51,000 square feet, I believe. I don't don't think I know well enough how our program would how we would fit our program, you know, and you know, we certainly can't plan nice meetings with them.

139
00:38:47.280 --> 00:39:03.160
Um within our school district students to see how it would work. I agree with what Howard Charles said. The math doesn't really pencil for single-family residential, even in that neighborhood. I mean, that's one of the most beautiful neighborhoods we have in

140
00:39:03.160 --> 00:39:19.120
town, but I think the the number for for a house, you know, based on the math, it probably be, you know, an 8 to 10 million dollar home, maybe minimum. Um based on the land cost, the building

141
00:39:19.120 --> 00:39:35.480
cost, construction cost of the home. So, I don't I don't think the level would work for single-family residential, which creates a problem for us because the alternative is multi-family residential. And you know, my opinion, I I am I'm not opposed to housing growth, but

142
00:39:35.480 --> 00:39:51.640
the idea of a 40B project would not be to disrupt that kind of a site. That is a historic site, you know, Ashton, and um I think even strong advocates for 40B projects, you know, recognize the importance

143
00:39:51.640 --> 00:40:06.840
of allowing a particular um particular neighborhood to remain as it is. So, if it doesn't serve an academic use as it has for or as from where it's just you know, a short

144
00:40:06.840 --> 00:40:24.200
distance away, it I think it would be it would be not consistent with keeping that neighborhood the way it is when we can afford a problem. >> And I've shared my views with in our discussion with Winston as seeing this

145
00:40:24.200 --> 00:40:40.960
is to be a real win-win for our town. It's solving a huge problem of the over the classrooms, um, you know, it just be just being overly, um, dense and in size, but the but to

146
00:40:40.960 --> 00:40:57.000
Maggie's point, the the piece about the conservation, if we could preserve that and I think give the schools really a flagship school. I mean, this would be something that I think would attract people back into the school system that may have that may have left. I think

147
00:40:57.000 --> 00:41:13.960
this could be a very much of a, um, if we could if we could put the admin buildings, I've been inside. It has >> [clears throat] >> been beautifully restored. So, the historic house, they've really kept it intact. I think that administrators would love to be in those spaces which

148
00:41:13.960 --> 00:41:29.760
are currently set up as off many of them set up as offices. Um, it's really been carefully, um, protected and then you have, you know, again, new modern, um, classroom facilities that are there. So, I if this could fit, again, I'm not an

149
00:41:29.760 --> 00:41:46.120
expert. We do have experts on the, you know, the school building committee and those, um, in our, um, administrator, um, who have said, you know, um, the leadership team really supports this. So, I would absolutely support, um,

150
00:41:46.120 --> 00:42:01.400
acquiring this and, um, and and if it could happen, it would be great because it would happen much sooner than a new school building could be built, um, which could be years on the road. >> I think that's right. I just want to I just want to reiterate that last point.

151
00:42:01.400 --> 00:42:18.000
Um, if if we have a sincere interest in resolving some of the issues that we hear about in regards to our schools, we should be doing it sooner rather than later. And the pathway to a new school in Milton I've spent 40 years in the construction

152
00:42:18.000 --> 00:42:33.880
industry. Even from the point in time where you put the first shovel in the ground, you're two or three years away from a new building being built. And we're not even close to putting that first shovel in the ground. So, if you're relying on a new school to solve, you know, the issues that we're

153
00:42:33.880 --> 00:42:51.120
talking about today, you're you're in a four, five, six year time frame. You know, is that really fair, you know, to the residents of the town, the teachers of the town, the leadership of the schools, or the taxpayers? Right. I I don't think it is. So, I

154
00:42:51.120 --> 00:43:07.720
think Matt's last point in terms of timeliness for a solution for that problem, um this is the this is a great opportunity. >> So, I think that we're all not speaking for everyone [clears throat] here, but I think we're all in agreement that the school is the first best option, and second and third best option. Are you

155
00:43:07.720 --> 00:43:23.040
asking though if that doesn't work out for I I You list I listened to your most recent meeting, and I think you guys approved no PM to explore that option. Right? If that doesn't pencil out for the schools, are you asking us what could go there? >> Or if somebody sweeps in, right, and

156
00:43:23.040 --> 00:43:38.160
buys the site tomorrow, right, which could happen. Yeah, it's just kind of like a backup. It's what should we, you know, as stewards of the town, just realizing that we don't just have to eye a school for

157
00:43:38.160 --> 00:43:55.440
that site. What would be a responsible pathway to >> So, if somebody buys that property tomorrow, if I send Liz over to their door and knock on their door and say we'd like to talk to you. Because we want to work with that buyer rather than

158
00:43:55.440 --> 00:44:11.240
them have something come in that we may not be interested in. And say we want a partnership to work together that's going to work for them, for that buyer, and for the town. And that's really important in so many communities that open door with the

159
00:44:11.240 --> 00:44:26.880
planning department and the the commercial or residential building industry is is is really just super important. So, that's >> And I would agree. >> And I think and I think the town has a history of working with with um

160
00:44:26.880 --> 00:44:43.560
applicants to try to figure out zoning solutions. That's been that's been my that's been my experience. I haven't been directly involved in anything that I know of but there was a special zone adopted for the memory care for instance. Um so, yeah.

161
00:44:43.560 --> 00:44:58.520
>> Or Wolcott Woods, which was the Carberry property before. There was a lot of concern about that when it went on the market. Who was going to buy it, what they were going to want to build there. Um that buyer and developer worked with the neighbors and with the planning

162
00:44:58.520 --> 00:45:13.440
board to craft zoning that town meeting approved and then the planning board, you know, worked diligently um you know, to to uh approve a special permit that had a lot of conditions in it. And that's the sort

163
00:45:13.440 --> 00:45:29.240
of thing that I could see toward uh the library campus if it doesn't uh towards the school is that there's that kind of collaboration. >> [cough] >> That's why I said send those there right away uh because that I think people would say that that was a success.

164
00:45:29.240 --> 00:45:44.720
Yeah, you know, for a large piece of property um what would happen. >> It's um I would be disappointed in Laboure if they just went and accepted an offer from somebody else. So, for all of these years

165
00:45:44.720 --> 00:46:00.000
um they have been tax exempt. And I believe the town of Milton has um has good relationships with our institutions in town. Um yeah, I Milton, Milton Academy, Curry.

166
00:46:00.000 --> 00:46:16.840
So, I would be extremely disappointed in Lab if they didn't come to the town of Milton first. So, instead of waiting for um Lacey to get a knock on her door, I would expect that the town of Milton

167
00:46:16.840 --> 00:46:32.760
should be knocking on Lab oure's door and saying, "What can we do to um um make sure that the town of Milton has the first rate of refusal?" Um you know, what have what pilot um

168
00:46:32.760 --> 00:46:50.360
contributions has Lab oure given to the town all these years? I haven't heard of any. And I think that should be a big discussion point with them. Um and I know in other towns um

169
00:46:50.360 --> 00:47:06.840
that they work with um institutions in town. They work with um property owners of um land that's been um zoned agricultural. When you get it a tax abatement if you're a farm, the

170
00:47:06.840 --> 00:47:22.240
first rate of refusal goes back to the town um for an offer to buy. So, I would assume that the town of Milton should have the first rate of refusal. >> We don't have any For clarity, we don't have any legal [clears throat] right of first refusal. >> Yeah, right.

171
00:47:22.240 --> 00:47:38.720
But, just good good um business practice. >> But, we have been in close contact, I'd say, probably on a every other day basis with uh the Lab oure or their representatives. So, that that line of communication is open. Um but, it is being actively marketed as

172
00:47:38.720 --> 00:47:54.760
shown earlier. So, they have a have a broker on board who is actively marketing it. We're in pretty close contact with >> I think to what I've heard from everyone here from our board is the town making all efforts to secure Lab oure.

173
00:47:54.760 --> 00:48:10.800
Then, we would move forward with whatever their plan would be, whether it would the school first or if that doesn't work out, whatever the next thing may be. Most important thing is that the town is going to make all efforts to acquire the property. Um to Maggie's point and point we've been making during the board, we do

174
00:48:10.800 --> 00:48:26.160
think we have a really good relationship with Abbot Ray, but we certainly can't make them, you know, give us the property. But good stewardship, good neighbors, good continued relationship with Curry, we hope that the time and the years that we have been in the community will play

175
00:48:26.160 --> 00:48:40.800
some factor and hopefully the continued educational institution as well plays a factor in trust and securing the property. >> And just one thing that I I want the groups to put [clears throat] on, um

176
00:48:40.800 --> 00:48:57.480
you know, that the process how we proceed methodically in evaluating the school viability option is is fairly straightforward to me. Well, it's complicated, difficult decision, but how we're going to get there to inform

177
00:48:57.480 --> 00:49:14.920
our decision whether to, you know, put a bid on the property. Um that seems fairly mapped out. I mean, I I think we're going to talk about it more tonight, but in terms of the road map we've laid out in terms of the school committee um you know, setting forth its

178
00:49:14.920 --> 00:49:32.640
programmatic recommendation and hopefully later upon even more on how that this option weighs against the MSBA option and then the old school building committee coming on top of that with some, you know, how to pricing that out and engaged

179
00:49:32.640 --> 00:49:48.600
um you know, an architect, a structural engineer and you know, so I see the diligence forming to inform that path. On the plan B path, if for whatever reason, you know

180
00:49:48.600 --> 00:50:04.280
that gets derailed and um what I what I'd love you guys input on is, um, you know, working up the diligence a little bit on and how planning board can be involved

181
00:50:04.280 --> 00:50:19.440
in that. On, um, if we find ourselves at some point in that plan B lane. And I'm not, you know, I'm not going to put percentages on it. I think it's non-zero. So, I think it's worth trying to kind of move that thinking along.

182
00:50:19.440 --> 00:50:35.920
Um, you know, under the umbrella of con- trying to control the property if we can. I'm interested in like how the planning board how you could see yourself supporting that thinking along the way and when. For example, I'll put like a couple

183
00:50:35.920 --> 00:50:52.680
questions out there. Um, as a group, how do we, you know, how much of that thinking do you want we want to try to move the ball on pre, you know, transaction.

184
00:50:52.680 --> 00:51:07.600
You know, a pre-bid. It's not a lot of time. So, there's maybe not a whole lot of realistic possibility like move along our, you know, recommended, um, use or thinking pre. So, do we think

185
00:51:07.600 --> 00:51:24.000
not moving that thinking along given the time constraints. You know, I'm thinking about from the town's perspective when when it's coming to a vote at town meeting or, you know, for a potential eventual day exclusion to approve, um,

186
00:51:24.000 --> 00:51:40.480
you know, the purchase. You know, what's going to get approved at that level? It seems like a fairly popular idea. So, maybe residents will only need to know subject to further decision of

187
00:51:40.480 --> 00:51:55.640
use, you know. How much specificity of that do we want to I'm I'm I've I've trying this whole time to kind of work backwards, picturing ourselves in you know, whatever, December, November with this decision kind of

188
00:51:55.640 --> 00:52:11.160
showing up to residents. How much are they going to want to know how far along should that ball be? Um you know, a couple scenarios could be some work has already happened to sort of try to narrow down

189
00:52:11.160 --> 00:52:27.880
what other uses could look like to try to inform that conversation. Or maybe that's just not realistic and you you put it to you know, maybe you tell residents, well, here's what we'll do after acquisition to, you know, engage the community and go through this

190
00:52:27.880 --> 00:52:44.440
multi-month process to think about you. So, I've I've just been trying to line up, think about us lining up the different pieces to just inform that not only the bid or whether to bid or the bid, but also that period from

191
00:52:44.440 --> 00:53:02.200
if we're fortunate enough to, you know, a contingent bid accepted, basically. Like, where do we want to be, you know, as elected officials and and this kind of going to those different votes along the way. How far should we push that other use diligence?

192
00:53:02.200 --> 00:53:19.040
Is what I've been trying to think about. What's realistic? Um again, I see the school decision diligence moving along. I'm trying to kind of figure out, think about how far to move that other ball in these short windows.

193
00:53:19.040 --> 00:53:35.560
What will help you know, if if one of our objectives is to get the you know, potential acquisition approved by the town, how much are residents going to want to hear that, how far that thinking is? So, um you know, those are some big questions. But certainly something I've been

194
00:53:35.560 --> 00:53:51.807
thinking about. Um you know, really valuing like the planning board's perspective on that kind of thinking, use ideas, zoning analysis type of thinking. Um you know, maybe that's for a later day. I'm just kind of sharing

195
00:53:51.807 --> 00:54:07.520
>> [snorts] >> where I'm sort of hovering around, like what how how to kind of move what timeline to move that along. But um you know, feel free to share your thoughts on that now or just you know, I hope we can kind of keep that

196
00:54:08.240 --> 00:54:24.440
thinking accelerated, frankly. >> John, you want to add anything? >> Yeah, Nick. >> You got to live in the real world. Houses are selling for a million five, million eight. Developer with a lot of money could come

197
00:54:24.440 --> 00:54:40.000
down here tomorrow and buy them. And do like a 55 and up. I don't think we're going to have to go to the voters and ask for an override. And how far how long would that take? >> To acquire, to do all of the planning?

198
00:54:40.000 --> 00:54:55.320
>> To all our steps. >> It will require town meeting vote, October November timeframe and a ballot question vote either on the state election November or December timeframe. And I've I've shared that timeline with Block Real Estate. They're They're understanding of that.

199
00:54:55.320 --> 00:55:11.240
I think by the flip side, you know, for potential acquisition, there may be some people looking to buy it with contingent offers and they've said they don't want contingent offers, but there might be We'll be We'll have to make a contingent

200
00:55:11.240 --> 00:55:29.040
offer as well, but our timeline would be like 6 months from now for a resolution. So any you know, it's going to be a while, but they're aware that our our duration is a little bit longer than a normal buyer might be. >> They have to answer to the board of directors, right?

201
00:55:29.040 --> 00:55:45.320
>> To their board of trustees, correct. >> Yeah, so if they get a big >> And there's a relationship with Curry as well in terms of the proceeds of the >> I'm I'm if they get a big offer like Trump said, that's all in the real world. You know, I'm just thinking like I see

202
00:55:45.320 --> 00:56:02.640
what houses are selling for. You know, and that's a desirable area. >> So John, the zoning >> I know this >> and the and the non-zoning uses of the Dover Amendment and the 40B are the uses that would be non-contingent. Everything else is

203
00:56:02.640 --> 00:56:18.560
contingent on a zoning change. So, if you wanted to to do a an over 55 community, that's not a 40B, it requires a zoning change. So, that's >> Only 40B. >> Only 40B. >> Well, I understand >> of the Dover Amendment that can go in

204
00:56:18.560 --> 00:56:34.360
right now. >> But some developer company might want to try to go that way, 55 and up. It's a desirable area. >> What I think Cheryl's saying is in order to do that, you have to go to the Board >> Board of Appeals. >> No. >> No, you have to go to the Board of Appeals. You have to have a zoning change.

205
00:56:34.360 --> 00:56:50.080
You have to go to town meeting to get the zoning change. So, it's a process that some developers are willing to go through, but $10 million minimum not being contingent, knowing that you may not get the zoning. >> Before you can tear down the buildings and make the site ready. >> Yeah.

206
00:56:50.080 --> 00:57:05.520
>> Right. >> Yeah, so it's >> So, some of the zoning that's there now is to our benefit. I'll say it's not just for any use. >> Right. >> But they could threaten a 40B, though. >> Correct. 40B. >> Correct. That's why they brought that

207
00:57:05.520 --> 00:57:21.840
>> I understand, but they could still get the sway to go the other way. >> Are you pointing >> to go the other way, yes. >> Are you pointing out that time is of the essence or that there's no guarantee we get it? >> That's the developers, that's a pristine neighborhood. I want to buy it, believe

208
00:57:21.840 --> 00:57:37.680
me. I wish we could get someone to give us 20 million. 20, I don't have it. >> [laughter] >> I seriously, not me, I want the town to buy it. But we got a long process to do it. >> Yes, I >> That's what I think there and this comes back to Maggie's point before I make the

209
00:57:37.680 --> 00:57:53.760
collaboration with them. The relationship with them being in town for as long as they have been, the program staying in town through Curry, I think they have an understanding of how long our process would be. So, we're a little unique to any other buyer. And

210
00:57:53.760 --> 00:58:10.280
you know, I'm not afraid to be a developer. I understand their costs. I don't know if it's if it's profitable to do a 40B there. I can't speak to that. I hope it would be that's not um for us, but you know, there's some things that do uh you know, favor. I don't think Labrie's given us a a date

211
00:58:10.280 --> 00:58:25.520
where they would select the purchasers. So, we're not sure if they're you know, they're just taking all bids or you know, just waiting for the latest person. >> And that building you can move kids in there tomorrow. >> It's great. It's a great building, great

212
00:58:25.520 --> 00:58:41.960
property. And I think it could be a just a a real sort of feather in the cap for the the school department. I mean, I think it's just it would make it a real special place, sort of an entrance to come. >> So, let me come back to Pete's question and comment

213
00:58:41.960 --> 00:58:58.440
if if we can. I do think um it's best not to wait until the last minute to start thinking about what an alternative use might be and what path that might need to take. Because even there may be somebody who

214
00:58:58.440 --> 00:59:18.320
decides to buy it with res or you know, assuming that they can make something work there and if not, their fallback would be the 40B. So, they might say, I want to do an open 55 community and and if I can't get that done, then I'll my default will go back to the 40B. So, I do think

215
00:59:18.320 --> 00:59:36.320
um that the 40B at 10 million or above it's just going to be increase the density of what goes there. If we think about the land acquisition for, let's say, the Canton app 40B, two parcels totally maybe 3 million they paid for 116 units, so you can do the math on

216
00:59:36.320 --> 00:59:51.200
that. You know, so if you're paying 10 million, you know, you're looking at probably somebody wanting to do a lot of units there. And so that's why I think we need to be ahead of it. So that's my point. I've seen these things come. John, you've seen these come, too.

217
00:59:51.200 --> 01:00:09.240
>> certainly have. But Nick, Library had if they bought they had the right of first refusal on the other parcels of land. And you I I thought you said hopefully that moves with whoever buy, you know, if we buy it. >> Library currently holds a right of first

218
01:00:09.240 --> 01:00:26.120
refusal right of first offer over the pond campus. So this question does that then go >> Well, well, that's what I'm looking at, too. That's a big piece of parcel. >> It certainly is. So I I guess >> Which would allow for additional ball fields and that, you know,

219
01:00:26.120 --> 01:00:42.760
sort of an expansion. >> But >> long term. >> Is there planning work that should start? Is there a consultant that we should talk about bringing on board to start conceptualizing post plan B post reuse or at least maybe getting the parameters of the scope

220
01:00:42.760 --> 01:00:57.960
together to be prepared to be thought of. So I guess that maybe some some people might >> I'm I'm not Yeah. >> I think the question also that we can't forget is that this is this has been a school. This has been utilized for school for

221
01:00:57.960 --> 01:01:14.840
I mean >> Both >> Forever you there it's forever. I mean it's Yeah, the plan is it's it's been forever. Um and but what we would want to do is solicit um input, community input, and neighborhood input. I think before we did anything. Obviously,

222
01:01:14.840 --> 01:01:29.360
if it didn't go to a school, there's other options. Um I don't know if the multiple hospital would consider, you know, if there would be another school that would be interested, I would like to see probably to keep um because I think the neighbors are accustomed to having the school

223
01:01:29.360 --> 01:01:46.440
there. That would be I ideal for a first step, but certainly I think we could we could begin having conversations, but really having public outreach um with >> Well, the neighbors down the road a mile. >> So, public outreach would be an important part. So, >> Monadnock Academy.

224
01:01:46.440 --> 01:02:03.200
>> we wouldn't get zoning um Yeah, we we wouldn't have zoning in place. I don't know I don't think you're thinking having zoning, but having sort of a plan of how it could be mapped out is certainly something that we we can't say tonight what that what it would be, but we could certainly start talking

225
01:02:03.200 --> 01:02:19.240
about it um and looking talking to Liz um and looking at some um >> I think part of it's an an educational um component to it. Um like we've been talking about tonight, like the what the

226
01:02:19.240 --> 01:02:35.560
proposed um acquisition cost is likely to be, how you back into uses based on that. You know, because some people if you just uh put out there, what would you like to see there, it not may not be realistic to your point, John. So, there has to be I think some sort of framework set up

227
01:02:35.560 --> 01:02:52.720
first um that um here are some range of opportunities for this property that would work within this financial. So, let's say the town does buy it for let's say 12 million and it goes to a school, there's then there's probably not too much

228
01:02:52.720 --> 01:03:08.440
additional process, but I still think neighbors are going to want some process about how it's going to work, where the buses going to go, you know, where the cars drop off, the pickups going to go, is there outdoor spaces, the playground, where's that going to go? You know, there's lots of still site planning decisions that need to be made. Um so,

229
01:03:08.440 --> 01:03:24.600
even that having a community process around that I think makes a lot of sense. I don't think it's necessary that it all happened a lot on our municipal projects, but it makes a lot of sense to me. But then on the second piece of it, now you set the framework about what issues you need to talk about, what kind

230
01:03:24.600 --> 01:03:41.560
of land uses. If it doesn't go to a school, what else can support that 10 million? What else can the taxpayer see as a way to pay for that 10 million? Um and what would they like to see there? So then you have to go through the range of uses and I do think a consultant would probably help.

231
01:03:41.560 --> 01:03:56.920
>> It seems to me >> It seems to me you have a 51, as John said, a 51,000 square foot building that's occupiable. I don't see like the best thing for the environment would be to tear down a perfectly good building. So is there a

232
01:03:56.920 --> 01:04:13.960
way to reuse that building? That would be my first step. What use might be able to reuse that building? >> And I I just wanted and I know you you were waiting to say like I'm not tonight trying to kind of get into the whole like more political decision of like, you

233
01:04:13.960 --> 01:04:29.560
know, school or not or all that. I'm I'm really focusing on like contingency planning here and and focusing on plan B because I see the diligence road map for plan A. So for plan B, that's what I'm kind of trying to get to.

234
01:04:29.560 --> 01:04:45.960
>> Right now what you describe as plan B is being worked out by developers at Consuming Fire. Mhm. So what they do is they'll bring on board a civil engineer and an architect. And that civil engineer and that architect are examining the piece of land

235
01:04:45.960 --> 01:05:02.000
and what the options are and what they could do. And they may have four, five, six, seven, eight different options. It could be everything from like what happened to Coventry's land up on Canton Ave to >> Woodman >> to Woodman to a multi-unit residential. So what you describe as plan B B is

236
01:05:02.000 --> 01:05:16.800
happening right now. Anybody that's looking at this is utilizing, you know, whoever they have their chosen civil engineer and their architect, you know, developing schemes and those schemes I would describe as what would be

237
01:05:16.800 --> 01:05:34.320
your your your plan B. And and it's the only way to really do it, you know, Sherman how we've probably done plenty of this. You know, I do a lot of it on the residential side and on the commercial side. But, you know, we would take site plan, we'd examine the building, and see what are the possible

238
01:05:34.320 --> 01:05:51.200
uses for that building. Could it Could it be repurposed into residential? Maybe because some of the floor plans for school buildings don't don't repurpose well for residential. It's just It's It's really really challenging. But, anyhow, my point is

239
01:05:51.200 --> 01:06:07.480
plan B right now, anybody that's looking at that property is doing exactly what we just talked about with plan B. And we don't have those resources internally, you know, we would have to bring them in. All right. >> So, since we're going to have to get through the economic development plan, what I'll say

240
01:06:07.480 --> 01:06:23.800
is um plan A for us is acquisition. And again, that allows [clears throat] us flexibility with um whatever we need to do after. Whether that takes some time and hiring a consultant, whether it's community outreach, or whether the school's plan is the

241
01:06:23.800 --> 01:06:40.320
100% best best way forward. Plan A is what we have to do. Plan B that I'm thinking of right now is that if we don't get it. That's That's going to be knocking on the doors, and then us working with the planning board and all the others in town to say, "What do we do now since we did not get this property?"

242
01:06:40.320 --> 01:06:57.360
I think we have acquisition, and then we can get into the weeds of like, "What do we do with it? If it's not going to be used for the So, we really just wanted to hear from you guys in terms of your input as to how we would actually work together for both those both those strains.

243
01:06:57.360 --> 01:07:14.560
Thank you. >> Okay, so >> [clears throat] >> just to uh move into the economic development plan, um I think it's important, you know, that we just and you all I think have all received this, but I'll just sort of read through

244
01:07:14.560 --> 01:07:29.720
um what MASP MAPC um the economic Milton's economic development plan which the planning board has um completed phase one and two of this or should say our consultants um

245
01:07:29.720 --> 01:07:45.320
have um completed phase one and two. The project [clears throat] understanding um the town of Milton will work with MAPC Metropolitan Area Planning Council to develop an economic development plan with analysis and recommendations to

246
01:07:45.320 --> 01:08:01.920
enhance the mix of economic activities to better meet community needs, sustain economic activities, particularly particularly economic activities that while affording growth and intensification of use are generally consistent with the town's physical

247
01:08:01.920 --> 01:08:17.560
scale of activities and expand the commercial and industrial tax base. The plan will provide analysis, goals, and actions the town could take to facilitate economic investment within the town's priority priority commercial,

248
01:08:17.560 --> 01:08:33.600
industrial, and mixed-use districts, the priority business districts. Thank you for putting that up. Um the plan um while highly while highly dependent on there being productive community engagement, the engagement will seek to

249
01:08:33.600 --> 01:08:49.720
identify complementary objectives for each each versus competing objective for each versus competing objective objectives. The project will include consideration of novel economic development goals and strategies that diverge from traditional

250
01:08:49.720 --> 01:09:04.960
economic development approaches. The plan will include a discussion of key town-wide drivers, opportunities, and challenges from an economic development perspective. The over overarching project goals are one, creating an economic development plan

251
01:09:04.960 --> 01:09:21.200
for Milton's key commercial districts, and two, identify and recommend goals and strategies necessary to advancing the identified plan. Three, share and support the town's effort to build support for the report recommendation and implementation

252
01:09:21.200 --> 01:09:38.759
efforts as result of the plan. The report will focus on the identification as well as thought out and economically viable goals and strategies supported by the qualitative and quantitative data assessed via the process. Development of specific recommendations

253
01:09:38.759 --> 01:09:55.200
on zoning changes and or infrastructure improvements required for a planned implementation are beyond the project scope, although a high-level discussion of such items captured through an analysis of previous studies will be discussed and help to inform the

254
01:09:55.200 --> 01:10:11.280
report recommendations. Uh the planning process is expected to begin September and this was of 2024 at the time um and was expected to conclude by 2025. Um and there were issues with the funds um

255
01:10:11.280 --> 01:10:27.560
that were covering this, so work halted. Um priority business districts, the economic development plan will provide analysis and recommendations on the four priority business districts identified below. Milton Village Business District

256
01:10:27.560 --> 01:10:42.560
adjacent to Milton Landing and access to the Neponset River, Central Ave Business District, the Northern and the Northern Granite Ave Business District. These business districts fall on the east side of town. This project engagement will also assess

257
01:10:42.560 --> 01:10:58.440
the data and conditions to understand the potential for expanded commercial activity on the town's west side. There is some resident sentiment that such activities are lacking there. Uh while not the central focus of this engagement, attention will be paid to

258
01:10:58.440 --> 01:11:14.000
the potential for the Route 28 corridor to receive additional light industrial flex and or office uses and be the focus of more intensive utilization. Uh project process, the process will

259
01:11:14.000 --> 01:11:30.280
consist of one, an analysis of existing conditions of the districts including broad real estate conditions, not inclusive of parcel or property level analysis. Two, community and stakeholder engagement centering on communities and

260
01:11:30.280 --> 01:11:47.480
stakeholders priorities of the priority business districts listed above. And three, development of goals and strategies including a town-wide survey and community workshop to inform the prior prioritization goals and strategies. And four,

261
01:11:47.480 --> 01:12:05.120
uh compilation of a final report with board meeting. Um project tasks. These have been completed already by MAPC um and I won't read all of this, but it's existing conditions, an analysis of

262
01:12:05.120 --> 01:12:21.840
Milton's economy. Um we had a kickoff meeting, uh review of existing uh subtasks are kickoff meeting and a review of existing plans. Condition and regulations. >> [clears throat] >> I won't go yeah through everything, but basically step one and two

263
01:12:21.840 --> 01:12:39.280
have already been completed and we were um our last meeting with MAPC was um a presentation of >> [clears throat] >> their work up until that point. And we were getting ready gearing up for a community survey which Liz, do you recall it do you know if that went out,

264
01:12:39.280 --> 01:12:54.600
that community survey? That's what it So, we worked up until that point um and so I think tonight the conversation I think the planning board has discussed wanting to continue with the work that MAPC, but maybe looking at um you know in in

265
01:12:54.600 --> 01:13:09.720
depending on the how much funding we have, looking at maybe diving a little deeper into maybe we talked about the west side of Milton. I know Cheryl you wanted to discuss Randolph Avenue. So I I would just open it up to

266
01:13:09.720 --> 01:13:25.240
>> My understanding is that we started this in 2024. Process began and we ran out of funding along the way. So this is the scope and range from the original >> Correct. Correct. >> Which we are okay with reopening and starting with this scope. We'll change

267
01:13:25.240 --> 01:13:41.440
the scope in the project again, but we have some issues with funding. So there's an amount we need now. Both boards have dedicated 25,000 to continuing and that leaves us with a gap. We need about 30 to 50,000 missing it. So we need

268
01:13:41.440 --> 01:13:56.960
>> 30 >> So yeah, the original scope was >> I have questions about the scope. And the business districts that we called I don't want to >> I'll do if if we were to take this scope as written [clears throat] and as

269
01:13:56.960 --> 01:14:13.040
budgeted then it's 99,000 dollars of which the town has paid about 18,000 of that. So that would leave approximately 80,000 dollars worth of work under this scope of services under this fee proposal. Of which there is 50,000 dedicated

270
01:14:13.040 --> 01:14:28.200
towards so there is a delta there. That's the where the budget sits now. >> So it's 50,000 to finish the delta out. Needed 30,000 to finish the project. 0.0 of the scope. >> So

271
01:14:28.200 --> 01:14:46.080
my my main questions around the um >> [cough] >> the business districts [clears throat] the the scope as written mentions the west side. Would folks be open to more explicitly

272
01:14:46.080 --> 01:15:03.960
highlighting um some focus on the on the west side and where businesses would be focused. So, I think assessing data and conditions to understand the potential for expanded commercial activity. I get I guess

273
01:15:03.960 --> 01:15:20.440
that's um >> [cough] [clears throat] >> I guess that's go headed in a good direction, but I think we need to think about how to more explicitly call out what we

274
01:15:20.440 --> 01:15:38.480
would what we would like to see there in terms of recommendations. >> Right. So, I think these were highlighted cuz we really These are our business districts in town. >> Existing. That's what I see. Yeah. >> Yes. Yes. So, part of this and what it may be is some recommendations to really

275
01:15:38.480 --> 01:15:54.200
open up and because I think what we would need We We have identified parcels. They're They're not all connected. Yeah. Um so, we would really need resident input. Um you know, we have we have experience with

276
01:15:54.200 --> 01:16:09.280
MBTA discussions on where development could go on the west side. Um but I think to changing, you know, looking at doing a res- a new district, we would want to get that input. So, >> Well, we've done

277
01:16:09.280 --> 01:16:25.400
with the MPAC, there was a study on um a portion of the west side of town. Maybe some of that could be added or informed uh additional input. >> Right. I see what I see what you're saying. It's take a district and say,

278
01:16:25.400 --> 01:16:42.200
"Let's analyze. Let's look at this." And then we can get some input, which could lead to maybe a future overlay. So, I just hope that area >> process for changing or adding to the scope, given that this is a document and agreement between 2020 and 2024. Um is MAPC would just be okay for us to

279
01:16:42.200 --> 01:16:58.320
go back to them and say, here are some changes or additions and does that change the cost? Not that the cost is the overriding factor. Like, do we have the ability to change some of the scope given this is the document we agreed to? >> The

280
01:16:58.320 --> 01:17:14.280
>> This is >> The contract is no longer valid, so they would reprice it all. I would expect updated pricing and I would expect they would be flexible in terms of if we want to add to maybe pull some scope out of certain places and add scope elsewhere.

281
01:17:14.280 --> 01:17:30.080
I'd say it's very flexible. There's nothing here binding us. I think this serves as a good template to move to tweak if there's any tweaks to do. >> And Right. And because MAPC has most recently worked with us on both the Milton Village and um most recently the

282
01:17:30.080 --> 01:17:46.440
East Milton overlay zoning that we did, we have a lot of survey data. We have a lot of There was a lot of public outreach. They have a lot to work with, so they might need to do less with East Milton because they they've sort of they've heard and they've heard rankings of what, you know,

283
01:17:46.440 --> 01:18:01.960
um what residents would like. >> up on who's quickly with it. >> They could pick up on who's quickly. Exactly. And I think the same for the village where we could spend maybe more time for, you know, you know, hopefully not too much more money, but again, that would be Liz has

284
01:18:01.960 --> 01:18:19.560
had a conversation I think also with um the consultant that we had in that we had started with. >> Yeah, they >> It was It was It was several months ago. I haven't had a recent conversation with them. Um but yeah, I agree with with Nick. I think I think we could we could negotiate and and get new pricing and

285
01:18:19.560 --> 01:18:35.680
and try to figure out, you know, what the budget will cover and where your priorities are and then try to plug that plug that gap essentially. >> Because we're at such an early stage, you know, making making whatever changes that Megan is talking about or any changes. This is a

286
01:18:35.680 --> 01:18:50.920
very appropriate time. They're they're at the very early stages. So, whatever we want to focus on, if it's different than what's written in that contract, this is a great time to do it. And it's probably not going to change very much from a cost >> Can I ask one more quick question just

287
01:18:50.920 --> 01:19:06.400
out of my own ignorance here? So, the Northern Granite Avenue Business District, where exactly is that? Is that like upper Heritage Trail is or >> It's just the office building. >> Two Granite Ave. >> Okay. That's its own little district.

288
01:19:06.400 --> 01:19:21.680
Okay. But, if there was some thought to change that, that could be discussed, I imagine. So, before taking on new um commercial um across town, I would like

289
01:19:21.680 --> 01:19:38.840
to see our focus on pre-existing non-conforming. Um so, we have a most of our businesses are outside the um business districts and are there via special permit and um subject to zoning changes um

290
01:19:38.840 --> 01:19:56.920
and neighbor issue complaints. So, before taking on um new um districts, I would like to somehow um take on our pre-existing non-conforming to make those businesses more stable um

291
01:19:56.920 --> 01:20:15.120
and um less subject to um zoning issues. So, I think to me personally, that should be our first um number one task on our scope. >> What would that entail?

292
01:20:15.120 --> 01:20:31.080
>> So, it would probably entail um getting a list of all of our businesses that are outside the business districts. I did go through the um the existing conditions plan that MAPC um gave to us

293
01:20:31.080 --> 01:20:46.560
and there are many businesses that are not located on that and then there are also businesses that I'm not sure if even exist anymore. So, I had said to Nick what I'd like to see on the existing conditions plan is uh by

294
01:20:46.560 --> 01:21:01.640
parcel. Where are these um businesses? How many businesses do we have in town? Where are they located? Like for instance, in East Milton, the Rockland Trust building, that's in a residential um um

295
01:21:01.640 --> 01:21:17.680
district. And within that building, there's all sorts of businesses within that building. And so, I'd like to see that address listed and then a list of all the businesses within it. Um we've heard uh

296
01:21:17.680 --> 01:21:34.240
you know, through many residents in town that they want um different um um um amenities in town and we hear all the time, "Oh, we want another nail salon." But I was trying in my head trying to figure out how many nail salons do we

297
01:21:34.240 --> 01:21:49.640
have. Like how many do we have? Three? Four? And you know, and and if you look in my industry, we have three nurseries in town. >> He has a daughter. >> And I and I would never

298
01:21:49.640 --> 01:22:04.560
and I would [laughter] never say I would never say or exclude another nursery from opening up in town. So, I I think it's hard sometimes to um to restrict what type of business um should

299
01:22:04.560 --> 01:22:21.600
go in a certain location. Um but it would be nice to see how many nail salons do we have. How many restaurants? We all say we want restaurants, but is it fair to say, "Oh, the town can support 10 restaurants, but we can't support five nail salons?" I mean, I

300
01:22:21.600 --> 01:22:36.680
don't go to nail salons, I'm not advocating for more, but I I I it would be helpful to have a list by industry and how many businesses are currently exist. >> I think Randy's point

301
01:22:36.680 --> 01:22:53.120
highlights that there's there's quite a bit of policy embedded within this plan, too. Which I think highlights how it probably intersects both of our boards in terms of um stewarding the law. >> [cough]

302
01:22:53.120 --> 01:23:10.040
>> Um which is another I'll just come back to that, but on the scope, I would just emphasize Sean, to your point about you know, input and output. Um it just seems to me like it's heavy on the east side.

303
01:23:10.040 --> 01:23:26.680
And is that, you know, can we shift a little focus? >> And we spend a lot of time on the east side. So, I think east side is like do we have to take another survey, you know, in terms of community outreach? So, I think shifting it and to Megan's point and doing more exploring because

304
01:23:26.680 --> 01:23:42.520
that's that's what our board is hearing is that we want coffee shops. We want, you know, some some amenities that we can walk to and not have to get in our cars. So, I think that's definitely worth making shifting that um >> I I think we we should we need to

305
01:23:42.520 --> 01:23:57.840
include all of the existing districts and think about where we have businesses uh outside of the districts and whether we should change our boundaries. Um a part of it we can think about um relative to our zoning re- re-codification we're talking about

306
01:23:57.840 --> 01:24:15.080
because right now those businesses that are outside of the business districts and a lot of them that are even within the business districts have kind of complicated approval processes associated with them. And so, that makes it harder for businesses. That might make it harder to attract uh uh more diverse businesses. So, there's a

307
01:24:15.080 --> 01:24:30.400
there's policy that there's zoning and then there's um you know, I think some economic analysis as well. I uh was looking through the existing conditions report piece that we did get and it refers back to 2015 in

308
01:24:30.400 --> 01:24:46.560
the retail leakage. So, something we talked about recently, which is Milton taxpayer dollars being spent in other communities. And one of the things I would like to add to this scope is that component to it. Like look at what our leakage is today. That was 10 years

309
01:24:46.560 --> 01:25:02.320
ago plus that was in that 2015 master plan. I recently was reviewing a market analysis and fiscal impact analysis that was done in the last year or two in Belmont where they asked a consultant, what would it take for us to

310
01:25:02.320 --> 01:25:18.280
change our residential commercial tax revenue share from a 95% 5% to a 90% 10%. And they had a lot of analysis that went into that. >> [snorts] >> Um and so that gave them information to

311
01:25:18.280 --> 01:25:34.640
make decisions about whether they thought they could ever get to that 10%. But they had that data there and it looked at regional and local market conditions for for housing, for office, for they had a lab use. But here we have Bid Milton, you know, Bid Milton, which

312
01:25:34.640 --> 01:25:52.240
is expanding a lot. Is there some uh thing that we should think about with that with respect to our economic development plan? You know, we have a memory care center opening, the hospice just reopened. It was recommended on our master plan that we should do a medical overlay

313
01:25:52.240 --> 01:26:08.120
district rezoning. And so that it just makes these, if we think that there's some opportunity for these businesses in town, we should plan for it a little better so that it makes the process smoother. And I would like us to think about that. That's much

314
01:26:08.120 --> 01:26:24.080
higher level than I think a lot of what's in this scope. Uh is the is you know, where where do we you that Milton's not taking advantage of opportunity. Where is that leaking out? Is that the Milton office space leaking to Quincy? Are our retail dollars

315
01:26:24.080 --> 01:26:39.080
leaking to all of our adjacent communities, and can we bring some of that back in to help with our budget challenges? So, I don't disagree about what you said about what we should look at where and Maggie, what you should look at, but I also think we should we need to elevate it and look at

316
01:26:39.080 --> 01:26:55.600
um more potential. >> So, I I think um an interesting time. I've heard a little bit in what we're saying here is that we were all exploring for on the scope. So, um we could set a timeline or a calendar on the list or Nick talking

317
01:26:55.600 --> 01:27:11.520
with the MPC about what we're going to change or add the scope. When we need to have those changes in, which I think would require perhaps us in some capacity meeting again. Word, I don't think emails would be um good enough for us to do that. In getting to a scope, um Maggie's point

318
01:27:11.520 --> 01:27:27.320
about um businesses outside of business districts, as well as listing of those businesses. Um John has repeatedly said in our meetings about in the office spaces and commercial spaces. Um Cheryl's point um as well, which I'm forgetting right now. Sorry, Cheryl. Um and then Maggie's point about the

319
01:27:27.320 --> 01:27:42.960
>> Retail leakage. >> Retail leakage, that was it. Thank you. >> I've never heard of that in my life. Now, that's a term. >> Retail leakage. Um Maggie's point about the west side of town, and then I also have a thought of which I don't know if this could have happened, but

320
01:27:42.960 --> 01:27:58.480
that since we have an outside consultant, instead of us telling them where to go and study, if they just came into Milton and looked at Milton, just gave us an idea of where things could actually work. Um that's an idea that I thought of. If they just came in and said, "These are

321
01:27:58.480 --> 01:28:13.480
These are the places to where you should have your business districts. These are the places if you could do it over again, you'd be very successful in these folks are asking for." If that's possible. Um and I think the biggest thing for us to discuss is how we pay for it. Uh

322
01:28:13.480 --> 01:28:29.680
is we like go in ask an APC for some changes in scope. Maybe it changes the cost, maybe it doesn't. But I think we had two um potential ways of paying for this. Should we discuss those now and then look at the way that we can come back with these changes in scope.

323
01:28:29.680 --> 01:28:45.280
>> Sure. I I think you know the first one >> [clears throat] >> at all times is always just going to town meeting and requesting an additional appropriation from free cash for one-time expenses on such a study. So that's always an option. Town meeting vote. Um

324
01:28:45.280 --> 01:28:59.880
If you'd be like the alternative would be um looking within the existing It's too late for fiscal 26. A couple of weeks ago we're not going to find money. We have snow and ice that we need to deal with as well. Um but looking at the fiscal 27 budget

325
01:28:59.880 --> 01:29:16.280
uh if there's any um surplus funds in the select board budget but alternatively within this planning board's um your plans and studies money that is $85,000. So it would make sense to finalize this scope maybe utilize some of that funding and then and ask at town meeting is to to

326
01:29:16.280 --> 01:29:32.040
put that money back into place. So um maybe progress using some of the stuff with the planning board's appropriation but preparing an article to to to replace that money uh for the fiscal 27 work that the board would look at. So that's I think those are two options.

327
01:29:32.040 --> 01:29:48.880
They both kind of hinge on a little bit of town meeting action. The second option would be a little bit quicker and it gets to a place where we have a scope that we think that everybody is agreeable with. Uh and we can also kind of put forward in terms of select board and that put in additional funding. I think uh probably those would be the ways that

328
01:29:48.880 --> 01:30:06.680
we can perhaps get some additional money. >> Could we also reach out to um if if uh we're we're going to create new zoning for uh BI should we reach out to BI to help contribute and pay for um through a pilot uh

329
01:30:06.680 --> 01:30:22.920
>> This is very explicit that there will be no zoning coming out of this. But for a pilot so we who has contributed this past year to their pilot and how much have we collected? Can we do a more robust

330
01:30:22.920 --> 01:30:40.720
outreach? >> We have a pilot committee. The pilot committee is part of what we built hospital work but it's built Academy Charter College. And >> That's not going to go to Curry at this point but we're trying to work with them. It's part of the part of the

331
01:30:40.720 --> 01:30:56.213
negotiation. >> Curry has been a consistent yes. >> And they have. >> I just want to thank the four veteran planning board members. You've had a few tough years. I've been mad at you quite a bit.

332
01:30:56.213 --> 01:31:10.680
>> [laughter] >> But I'm living with it. And we're all sitting in the traffic so we're all involved in it. So I just want to thank all four of you. You do a great job under not great circumstances.

333
01:31:10.680 --> 01:31:26.840
And the town's lucky to have you. Mr. Munger, we're lucky to have you too. >> Thank you. >> They have a few tough years. >> [laughter] >> Thank you for your service. >> Oh, thank you. >> What what you do as a board member but what you do which I don't think you get nearly enough recognition all around town.

334
01:31:26.840 --> 01:31:43.720
>> All right. Don't worry. >> Well, we appreciate >> Wish I had 15 million to buy that property. Give it to the town. >> [clears throat] >> Cuz I don't think we're going to move fast enough. >> I just I I think you know closely I think this is a great first step of communication which was our goal.

335
01:31:43.720 --> 01:32:00.400
I think highlighted it. You know, it has some towns do include a planning department in their site plan you know process early in stages when they're planning a new facility or a new project. It is helpful because that's what we do

336
01:32:00.400 --> 01:32:16.520
on a regular basis is review sites for potential, you know, problems that could arise and and just even how a building is cited, you know, on a piece of land. Um so, that is something that some towns do include and I think

337
01:32:16.520 --> 01:32:31.680
uh we would love to be part of that on on future projects when the committees are being assigned. Looking at new buildings. >> Can you give an example? >> Well, currently, I mean, some towns it it depends on what town, you know,

338
01:32:31.680 --> 01:32:48.600
whether it's the we the fire department did come to us, but they pretty much finished all of the initial drawings and architectural drawings and it was it was, you know, there weren't many changes that could be made. I think they were little things that we tweaked at point. Um talking about landscaping and trees, the

339
01:32:48.600 --> 01:33:05.040
you know, the Central Avenue events project took down a huge huge amount of trees. So, we tried to help with, you know, preserving as much green space as possible. Um but that that was late uh uh late at the the game. Um you know, we've never typically have been involved

340
01:33:05.040 --> 01:33:20.640
with school building projects. Some towns um like Easton, for example, they're involved I'm and I don't think we need to be on every level, but um ballfields and and different playgrounds and parks um their planning department is is part of

341
01:33:20.640 --> 01:33:37.840
that. So, just something to keep top of mind, you know, when when determining I don't know, you know, other than school building, you know, everything fire stations. Fortunately, we'll get Atherton underway um quite soon and we're we're lucky to be sitting in this building tonight um with

342
01:33:37.840 --> 01:33:53.160
the preservation of the original old fire station. So, um that was that was good work and a good committee. So, just something to think of maybe having a representative from planning board just to be a liaison um in the projects at school. >> I don't think you mentioned on one quick

343
01:33:53.160 --> 01:34:09.560
thing. On the short-term rental bylaw, we have spoke about that being possibly general by-law rather than a zoning by-law. That we would work on the by-law and present it, but hopefully that would be a joint kind of

344
01:34:09.560 --> 01:34:25.040
article because it wouldn't fall under our jurisdiction. It would either follow follow under the select board or the board of health or maybe both. >> Which would which would sort of [clears throat] expedite the process and help. >> That's working together, right?

345
01:34:25.040 --> 01:34:41.400
>> And that was a Carolyn Murray our KP Law made that suggestion. And we'll have it teed up and ready to present to you and certainly >> And one last thing for those who might be watching at home. There were several residents who came to the planning board

346
01:34:41.400 --> 01:34:56.840
and asked us to take a look at this. They felt it was an issue in their neighborhoods and and that's why we prioritized it. Just for those who are interested in how we arrived at that. >> While you're still in the >> Go ahead, John.

347
01:34:56.840 --> 01:35:13.680
>> I don't know if your group, but Armstrong's property getting developed the first phase and they shook the contractor down for new policeman, new police car, fire gear and a couple firemen. I don't know if your board has the power to when these developers come in, not

348
01:35:13.680 --> 01:35:29.920
business developer, but housing, kind of shake them. Like I said, you can't insult them. You can go at right at it and at the end of it they'll love you. They'll they'll give you >> project? Was that a 40B project? >> Armstrong. >> Which one? The one in Braintree? >> Yeah. >> Yeah, so that's a that's an MBTA

349
01:35:29.920 --> 01:35:49.360
communities project. The that area of sort of mitigation and what have you, it's a it can be sort of a a tricky a tricky space. You know, and you it has to be really carefully connected to the impacts of the development, so Yeah. It's uh

350
01:35:49.360 --> 01:36:07.080
>> Well, we can open our eyes. Maybe we we could proceed with that. >> Just while you're still thinking about the short-term bylaw, I think we should seriously consider any additional money we can get out of that in terms of local surcharges or

351
01:36:07.080 --> 01:36:23.400
um what do you call impact fees? It's probably not much, but could be a deterrent factor there, too. Um so, I mean, if it does come to us, I'll certainly be thinking about it then, too, so. I encourage you guys to do so. >> we definitely talked about looking at.

352
01:36:23.400 --> 01:36:39.720
And it's we were surprised how many towns don't charge impact fees. >> But Carolyn Murray Murray also um cautioned about that because there's recent case, I think, where you have to show that that fee is tied directly to an impact from that

353
01:36:39.720 --> 01:36:55.520
short-term rental. Can't go to a ball field, can't go to support the Little League, can't go to it has to go to a direct impact of that short-term rental. So, most of the towns towns aren't doing it. But there is the other >> Sophie >> There's two fees.

354
01:36:55.520 --> 01:37:16.040
>> Yeah, yeah, so maybe just do the easy one. >> [laughter] >> So, before we wrap up, so uh to take away with us on getting a development plan and a timeline on the sweeping changes as well as the options for funding and what not.

355
01:37:16.040 --> 01:37:32.240
Take away from this. Uh one thing we did not get to discuss in our next meeting, >> [cough and clears throat] >> I do want to talk about how the town we can have a better relationship, whether it's planning board or all the boards together with the developers that come in.

356
01:37:32.240 --> 01:37:46.600
Um we're talking to them about what they're going to put in the buildings. Um if that's been the norm, if it's happened at all. Um because I had I had spoken to some business owners in town who feel like the fees that are being asked some

357
01:37:46.600 --> 01:38:03.440
developments have prevented them from opening things that most would advise. So, I don't know if there is a way. We have our relationships with the developers and particularly with local business owners. And we're talking about this being a space where financially

358
01:38:03.440 --> 01:38:22.800
business owners can own this space and still thrive. And we're not We're making this actually business friendly in this space. >> [snorts] >> What's the address? >> Makes sense. >> It's the trailer. >> Yeah. >> [laughter]

359
01:38:22.800 --> 01:38:38.680
>> That's good. Sounds good. >> I think we got I think we got adjourned. >> [snorts] >> We do. Yes. Can I have a motion to adjourn from the planning board? >> Motion to adjourn. >> Second? >> Second. >> All in favor? >> Aye. >> Aye. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. Appreciate it. >> Thank you. See you guys. Thanks.

360
01:38:38.680 --> 01:39:34.880
>> So much for the after speech. >> Yeah. Okay. Good to see you. >> [snorts] [laughter] [clears throat] >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> All right. With that, we'll move to item five,

361
01:39:34.880 --> 01:39:54.400
library college closure and sale. And we have Superintendent John Feely and our school committee chair Mark Lauren joining us. Good evening. >> Good evening. Thank you. Thanks for waiting. >> So, um I'll pass it to the executive but

362
01:39:54.400 --> 01:40:10.440
we just wanted to convene to talk about uh the school committee's decision about Laboure. Uh we have not had a chance to hear from you directly. We do understand what you sort of put a uh proposal position forward, that's how you think the program would work. And also in conversations tonight I think we were

363
01:40:10.440 --> 01:40:28.360
talking about communication with our residents about what potential is at the Laboure site and how we see it moving forward. Just so our parents are informed. >> Uh no significant updates at this time um as had been mentioned by Shawn in the

364
01:40:28.360 --> 01:40:45.520
planning board conversation that uh site is now being actively marketed. They have a broker on board. Um there's information on on online about about that seeking buyers. They've sent generally they're soliciting offers open across the next month. It's tracks of kind of what we've been hearing from them all along.

365
01:40:45.520 --> 01:41:00.160
I kept you posted in terms of the school building committee's work and what they're marching towards towards the end of July time frame for posting information. The architects and engineers did walk through Laboure on Monday. Um we had moved forward with an independent appraisal. The appraiser

366
01:41:00.160 --> 01:41:16.240
also walked through Laboure on Monday so he's done his site visit. Um so as we get information back through that we'll keep you posted. Um after our conversation last week we had a conversation with uh traffic engineers about potential scope

367
01:41:16.240 --> 01:41:32.760
broadly in terms of what they may be looking at on transportation traffic just to get that ball rolling a little bit more. The school building committee wants um anything that's generated on that. So we expect kind of a a rough proposal uh by the end of this week. And then just kind of other pieces that

368
01:41:32.760 --> 01:41:48.400
we're working on and is uh an overview of how an acquisition would work procedurally, cost financially, what that might mean on the taxpayer front. We would be asking the taxpayers. And then, also just quantifying in terms of like, what's our carrying cost for

369
01:41:48.400 --> 01:42:03.800
that building going to be if we were to own it, what is our cost going to be to just kind of keep it maintained functional, um, and safe. Um, and then lastly, some work around identifying and mapping out the greatest options for us to use. So, that's kind of the work that's been

370
01:42:03.800 --> 01:42:20.160
going on through the last school. And I know that's not much to talk about with the school committee so just trying to work back to you. >> So, the board in terms of where do you want to go next? >> Do you want us to discuss this to share with you? >> That's great for us. >> Sure. That's what we discussed last time.

371
01:42:20.160 --> 01:42:36.960
>> Uh, sorry. We don't have a plain presentation here. Uh, but I again, thank you so much for letting us, uh, be here and and share a little bit of an update. School Committee has talked about this, uh, at two meetings, um, and essentially the things we we've decided, uh, is one, the committee has

372
01:42:36.960 --> 01:42:52.920
directed the superintendent and his team to kind of investigate look at and think about, uh, what type of educational program does it appear could fit, and what would fit based upon our the educational needs of the district. And so, superintendent and his

373
01:42:52.920 --> 01:43:09.840
team did that. They did the site visit, uh, observed Laboure. I'll talk more kind of about what they they saw, but essentially did that, came back to the committee, shared, uh, some more ideas uh, about Laboure. Um, we had some questions, gave some pushback, or asked them some, I guess, further, uh, areas

374
01:43:09.840 --> 01:43:26.280
of thinking, uh, that we asked the superintendent to look at. They continued talking internally, came back with us, and ultimately kind of through that robust discussion, talked about, uh, kind of two, uh, potential options really for Laboure. One being, uh, a pre-K K program, which I'll discuss.

375
01:43:26.280 --> 01:43:42.320
That's the option that we asked the, uh, School Building Committee as kind of a support in terms of helping us kind of understand what is possible on the site. We asked the school building committee to uh kind of direct the architect that they were hiring to focus on that as the

376
01:43:42.320 --> 01:43:59.920
option. That was mostly because our understanding was the scope of the architects and we would stay under a kind of public procurement thresholds because of the time restriction. >> [clears throat] >> The architect really could only look at one option. And so we pre-K K option as a like a priority that

377
01:43:59.920 --> 01:44:16.280
this reset could be a potential good fit there. Uh and at the same time we know that the MSBA process itself is still moving forward uh and once we have an architect and OPM fully on board for that we know OPM but once we have the architect that

378
01:44:16.280 --> 01:44:32.120
architect through the MSBA can actually look at Laboure for K-5 building because that is kind of uh still part of the MSBA process process itself. And so kind of those are the two paths we are continuing to go down. Obviously pre-K to K program is a much smaller

379
01:44:32.120 --> 01:44:47.320
program. If that doesn't fit on the site then we know the K-5 won't uh won't work and so uh can kind of throw that away. But those are um kind of that's the discussion we had. And so again kind of the vote the school committee has taken is one asked the

380
01:44:47.320 --> 01:45:03.320
school building committee to have the architect look at pre-K K option and so we're excited to get that information back from the architect to help inform uh the discussion uh and then also again asked the kind of superintendent and his team on what they think can fit programmatically. Kind of at a very high

381
01:45:03.320 --> 01:45:18.640
level I just make sure to name that for everybody in the public. We are trying to move very quickly in order to be competitive. I have many of the same concerns you've raised John about this our ability as a town to kind of be competitive with as you looked at this board uh to whatever you all can do and make obviously

382
01:45:18.640 --> 01:45:33.600
to manage that aspect since that's outside the ball of the school committee. Um but we are trying to move quickly in order to try and get as much information as we can for us uh and for the school department and ultimately kind of pass that over to y'all with kind of what we're thinking

383
01:45:33.600 --> 01:45:49.800
about as relates to the health site to work for addressing the school overcrowding issue. So that will make the determination as to whether or not to move forward with that purchase. I'll pause there and I'll pass it >> Yeah, I thank you Mark. First of all, I want to thank Nick for all the work he's

384
01:45:49.800 --> 01:46:05.200
doing and Shawn and all the work he's doing in the building committee and doing behind the scenes with this and the work with select board talking with MSBA, really engaging with Laboure which has been very helpful. This is a unique opportunity for the town. The leadership team thought Shawn with a

385
01:46:05.200 --> 01:46:21.480
pre-K K program would be the best option for that site. Um and we're also well aware uh that if this site doesn't work, we we have a a really hard working school building committee that's been doing the planning for a 78 preschool off the Guy

386
01:46:21.480 --> 01:46:37.280
Row site that we feel very supportive of as well. They've done a lot of work on that. Uh the advantages of a pre-K K program is it does relieve space at all four elementary schools which has been the primary bottleneck of students. It does relieve space at the high school

387
01:46:37.280 --> 01:46:52.080
because the administration and the business office uh superintendent's office, the special education and other central office spaces will be moved to the library site freeing up space at the high school. And if you were around back when the

388
01:46:52.080 --> 01:47:07.920
high school was built, those spaces weren't dedicated to guidance, music, classroom functions. They were never designed to host the uh central office functions. So high school is a growing building. The 9th through 12th population is growing at the high

389
01:47:07.920 --> 01:47:23.160
school so we'd love to be able to get that space back. Um the other upside to the library site is actually to the point that some of the planning board folks where we're taking an existing building and renovating and using space that are

390
01:47:23.160 --> 01:47:38.560
already available as opposed to taking over space that would be open currently. Uh so, it seems to be very green and friendly in that sense. Uh but the downside of this is that it doesn't really impact the middle school uh enrollment challenges that we have.

391
01:47:38.560 --> 01:47:55.320
They're probably the least challenging of the three levels, uh but it does not address that. So, this pre-K K program is unique to the opportunity that's been presented to the town through the sale of property. Uh we're trying to check the boxes that it it will um

392
01:47:55.320 --> 01:48:11.520
uh fit uh for the needs of the town and the school department, but there are some boxes that it doesn't fit, which is the remedying of any kind of middle school challenges we have with space. So, it does take care of our elementary uh enrollment challenges, our high school enrollment challenges. Uh it does

393
01:48:11.520 --> 01:48:28.160
present a very unique opportunity for the for the town to use the space for a very unique opportunity, uh but it does not provide space for middle school. Um that said, I still think the positives outweigh the negatives. I think that we talked to Dr. Fish at the middle school.

394
01:48:28.160 --> 01:48:44.480
He feels that he has adequate space to make things work. Um and when we had Shawn over at our school committee meeting, uh you know, he was very aware of that this piece is that it's definitely going to work for the big picture of the town's needs of space and over enrollment,

395
01:48:44.480 --> 01:48:59.840
uh and that the middle school would be something that would have to start thinking about a plan before it if it didn't in fact become a problem uh but um I think the the community needs to hear that it does certain things really, really well. It's a good fit. And there's just some this one piece that doesn't work. So, that has to be part of

396
01:48:59.840 --> 01:49:15.400
the decision-making that we have moving forward. Uh the other parts that I think are positive as well as the the ability to if we're able to acquire the space, and it is a school that goes there, it might just advance the timeline a bit to be

397
01:49:15.400 --> 01:49:30.840
able to renovate and move in quicker as opposed to going through the MSBA process if we do for the 78 building and preschool it would take a little longer. You know, I think the estimation of you know, two or three years versus four or five years and

398
01:49:30.840 --> 01:49:46.920
so will we there's definitely some upside to to taking advantage of this opportunity. I know we've met at different times where just as a town I just think it's great to be able to purchase an asset that could be controlled by the town.

399
01:49:46.920 --> 01:50:02.480
The private party would be it would be great for the town here and so the leadership team is very excited about the opportunity for sure. And we're been in contact with Sharon and Rob. We already have put down a projected

400
01:50:02.480 --> 01:50:17.720
space needs assessment that I have in front of me that I'll email to him tomorrow. We're setting up a meeting with the architect for either this week or early next week. So they can have whatever they need from us to be able to do their assessment.

401
01:50:17.720 --> 01:50:34.840
And I'll provide that high cost high high level view of what this would look like if it was going to be a true two school town. So all that work has been happening behind the scenes. >> Thank you. I'll turn it over to numbers, questions, comments. >> Um

402
01:50:34.840 --> 01:50:50.560
thanks for what you guys are doing doing. I mean I've heard from folks that um you know, that they've just been impressed about the even there seems to be an acknowledgement that we're starting with a tight timeline here but of the level

403
01:50:50.560 --> 01:51:06.480
of diligence that the town is going about considering this. Um so thank you. Um watched all the school committee conversations. I'm just I think they've been very clear. Um I have a few questions. One on the sort of the parent slash

404
01:51:06.480 --> 01:51:25.080
community engagement side of things. The other on deliverable from school committee and district leadership just in turn over the next short-term stretch here. Um I guess let's just start with going

405
01:51:25.080 --> 01:51:42.920
order of, you know, engaging folks and you know, may I don't know if you guys have how much um community input we've received to date or if you have a view on

406
01:51:42.920 --> 01:51:59.680
you know, how that might progress, particularly parents of this option. I mean, from my perspective as a parent I think the communications coming from um your you know, different, you know, whether it's you, Superintendent Fallon, or from

407
01:51:59.680 --> 01:52:15.080
the school committee, I mean, that's all clear and I think the word is out there about that option. Um in terms of written communications. Um I I I'm thinking about appropriate additional engagement along the way and

408
01:52:15.080 --> 01:52:31.680
maybe that some of that's post acquisition. I'm not sure, but it's certainly I mean, I think you kind of started with that, Winston, when you mentioned, um you know, inviting thoughts and community engagement. But, um and I think that's twofold. I think that's

409
01:52:31.760 --> 01:52:47.240
one inviting feedback on the feelings of this project and two keeping expec- expectations clear about, you know, where we are in this project. Like, I think if we are a lot fortunate enough to acquire

410
01:52:47.240 --> 01:53:03.520
this in, you know, conditionally, you know, August, I don't think it's we're in the position to say for sure yet 100% for a school. I'm not sure, but I guess just I'll pause there. Um do you have thoughts on, you know,

411
01:53:03.520 --> 01:53:18.640
touchstones for engagement, if you've you thinking about that. So, this is a tight turnaround. It's on the market. The town has to decide whether they're going to buy it or not. Uh we're the programming people, you guys purchase people, and as a school

412
01:53:18.640 --> 01:53:33.880
building and school building committee on the building close. If we do purchase this property, we would absolutely want to go out to the public and let them know what we were thinking, why we're thinking it. Uh are there any alternatives? Uh and I think Winston you had mentioned that,

413
01:53:33.880 --> 01:53:50.160
you know, if if the town just bought it because I think it's a good idea to secure the property, it would give some flexibility for the schools to be able to think differently if we wanted to. Right now, we're only exploring the pre-K K option because we have limited funds and limited time. And we want to be able to show the public something that we would be able to do that would

414
01:53:50.160 --> 01:54:04.680
make sense. But I think if the town out right purchased the property, then the schools in the town could talk about what that could look like for the town and have that outreach that I think some folks would want to be able to

415
01:54:04.680 --> 01:54:20.600
provide feedback and in a good process. So, I'm definitely open to that happening. Uh but I I do think that that that might be post purchase um just because the time it the the total market situation, but I'm not opposed to that.

416
01:54:20.600 --> 01:54:36.924
>> Yeah, I mean, I tend to agree just on there there will need to be more significant engagement with the community on the design and the implications of moving students right away from kind right now more neighborhood schools into a campus space. Plus, there's the being

417
01:54:36.924 --> 01:54:52.920
[snorts] able to walk with your older siblings. Conversations we need to have. I don't think people are paying really close attention. We're not getting many emails, I can say that. I mean, it's the end of the school year. People are dealing with a lot. They're about to go on vacation. I I don't blame anybody for not paying attention, but it's just not

418
01:54:52.920 --> 01:55:09.480
a very good time to really be able to get parental eyes and focus on this. I think I think it I I the superintendent has shared information and some the updates around this uh >> We try and be transparent. We talked about it at school committee. Our

419
01:55:09.480 --> 01:55:25.680
viewing numbers are not quite as robust as your viewing numbers, but even still, even if they were, that still wouldn't be It's not many eyeballs as maybe we want, so I I agree. I think we we need more community engagement. >> I just think within the timeline and

420
01:55:25.680 --> 01:55:41.760
trying to understand like we ourselves don't even know really enough at this point to go and say it's a pre-K K. We we are talking about that at an extremely high level until we get some more information from the architect to say, "Yeah, that's actually feasible and here's like how it would look."

421
01:55:41.760 --> 01:55:58.800
Uh and by the time we get that, my understanding of the timeline Y'all Y'all are going to have to make a decision to to purchase and then I'm not going to have a whole lot of running room, so I don't have a lot of time to be able to engage folks, unfortunately. >> I I I agree with John on the point of I think the the line of conversation

422
01:55:58.800 --> 01:56:20.480
around it'd be good a good asset for the the town to control and be able to have influence to what happens. Hopefully that's a school loaded up our space for the carbon needs or something else. I agree with that on a personal level. I can't represent the school committee. >> What?

423
01:56:20.480 --> 01:56:35.720
It could be a nice addition put onto the side of that building, too. It could help with And this if this would happen, this would be the third mansion administration >> Going into. >> We wanted the cemetery, [snorts] the one up at Milton Flatley's.

424
01:56:35.720 --> 01:56:51.800
>> Howard Johnson's mansion. >> That was the Howard Johnson's original house. >> this. >> I I agree. >> We like mansions for the administration. >> I'm all ears for you, John. I'm not looking to live there. I just want to I just want what's best for the town, but I remember the Howard Johnson's mansion we were there for 2 years. >> It was the one right there at the

425
01:56:51.800 --> 01:57:08.560
cemetery, right across the street. >> I think your point there was right in that the even with the pre-K K option addition is going to be necessary in any of these the existing square footage layout is not going to be sufficient as our current understanding and maybe

426
01:57:08.560 --> 01:57:22.840
architect will be wrong but yes an addition is going to be necessary. >> So could potentially help a whole lot. More more you need. >> Yeah, yeah I mean again you know you got cafeteria right space playground space

427
01:57:22.840 --> 01:57:39.200
like they're just it is a college essentially space so it is not designed for all the kids right now and so there will be a lot of interior renovation plus >> Is there is there a design estimate at this point

428
01:57:39.200 --> 01:57:55.120
yet? I think the last time I talked about this someone uh the um school building committee was evaluating what the potential design options would have to be or the

429
01:57:55.120 --> 01:58:10.520
design requirements to make it suitable for the program. Is there is is there a cost estimate on that yet or when do you think you would hear what that is? >> So Sean has just contacted us in the last

430
01:58:10.520 --> 01:58:27.080
two days. We are going to be sending him our projected space needs to give to the architect. >> Okay so we're not at that point yet. Yeah. Okay. >> Cost estimate for the construction or for the design? >> I guess right so I mean they all they all look they'll

431
01:58:27.080 --> 01:58:43.560
lump it into a total project cost but I guess that you know the design the design would uh determine the construction cost obviously. So I don't know if once we get the design then then you can

432
01:58:43.560 --> 01:58:59.240
get the projected construction cost but yeah I just in the way I think about things I'm wondering like where we are and getting to a firmer cost estimate for the overall project. >> Yeah, I get it. I think that's important.

433
01:58:59.240 --> 01:59:16.240
>> that compares to the existing project. >> It must be it. Yeah, so I can clarify from the school building perspective. Again, an architect has been contracted with cost is I don't know exactly but under

434
01:59:16.240 --> 01:59:33.400
$30,000. >> Okay. >> And again, that's similar to cut scope where we're sort of only looking at the pre-K process I'm sorry, project idea. The goal at the end of that is that they will have a rough kind of design not

435
01:59:33.400 --> 01:59:49.200
even schematic so even rougher than that and just kind of boxes that you know, like a little bit better than boxes on a paper. But like how do these things fit on the site? >> I have like 5 to 10% design or something. >> Yeah, maybe like given kind of some of the space needs and some of the conversations with

436
01:59:49.200 --> 02:00:05.840
the department like we want this to be, you know, somewhat helpful and not totally based out of nothing. So they'll take that, they'll put that together. We are having the structural engineer look at the space as well as just an aside to try and inform cost projections right and is there anything of concern? And then separately have contracted with

437
02:00:05.840 --> 02:00:22.160
a cost estimator who will take kind of the really high level architectural designs that they have provided an estimated rough cost estimate of what it would cost to you know, carry out those designs in construction. >> And with the projected site acquisition

438
02:00:22.160 --> 02:00:38.120
cost and the cost estimate that you're talking about from this be the total that we would go to town meeting with. >> No, well, I like I can let Nick My Anderson know. The only thing we'd go to town meeting

439
02:00:38.120 --> 02:00:53.600
with at the start would be the site acquisition cuz you wouldn't want to go with a number the number is going to be a rough guess number like it would be an informed number to just let us know generally how cost effective is this. versus project

440
02:00:53.600 --> 02:01:10.760
cost is a larger facility and is a new construction cost the goal comparison pathways could cost so there can be an informed decision

441
02:01:10.760 --> 02:01:27.400
initial ask of town meeting town as a whole land acquisition cost and then new designer this designer to refine the designs and really get to a >> Yeah. >> much more of a schematic design, yes.

442
02:01:27.400 --> 02:01:43.400
And then get cost estimates >> So we'd have to do two debt exclusions for this? >> Yes. >> Yes, the first one will be acquisition of the property. The only nuance to that I'll add is if if this project were to proceed outside the MSBA pathway we would need to

443
02:01:43.400 --> 02:01:58.360
appropriate money for design. to get to the point to be ready to come back for the second ask of which would be project budget debt exclusion >> Okay. >> The main pathway right now, the first ask

444
02:01:58.360 --> 02:02:15.000
would be the acquisition as a stand alone. And in two year term for the project >> Okay. >> [snorts] >> I think we're Yes, we discussed months ago that story and timeline is something that we are very much going to hold to.

445
02:02:15.000 --> 02:02:30.080
As it's going as a one going to town meeting for acquisition so if everything works out to um if it's going to be a school by that school what are the lead dates what the space impacts are differences between site versus the Gal

446
02:02:30.080 --> 02:02:47.720
Rowe site differences K-5 or 7 to 8 or pre-K kindergarten impacts of that and then also design and then coming back for um construction and renovation and all those pieces all that entire timeline narrative story

447
02:02:47.720 --> 02:03:02.720
and what and the why which would be really important also knowing that you know the impacts of either more teachers or not more teachers that entire piece to where our parents are present is going to be

448
02:03:02.720 --> 02:03:17.840
because you know we have a few really big things going on at the same time we're going to do Appleton and Aubrey. We're going to do two or three years down the line and ask ourselves if we're going to build the fields if there needs to be a rise and the reason we are putting here

449
02:03:17.840 --> 02:03:37.840
at the table for the long term benefit even though in the short term it may seem a lot. >> My just back my other question on the deliverable from you guys if you think about that slide that I I don't know if it's a school

450
02:03:37.840 --> 02:03:54.120
committee slide or a school building committee slide that it sort of shows the roles of this phase school committee and district leadership where your focus is on school building committee attach price to it us such feasibility purchase

451
02:03:54.120 --> 02:04:09.600
on your slide there's there's a couple responsibilities that I'm I'm trying to visualize like maybe those have maybe they're embedded with your comments now and maybe it's a little bit also during a later phase

452
02:04:09.600 --> 02:04:25.040
that Winston talked about but it it's sort of the bottom two and sorry we're not looking at it but it it's you know evaluating the the impact on our existing overcrowding problems and I'll read the other and I can say

453
02:04:25.040 --> 02:04:41.920
them both again. Evaluating the library option versus the MSBA option you know to me those are a little bit more of like a quality comparison and and it also talking about like how

454
02:04:41.920 --> 02:04:58.160
how long would this path sort of cover us on the overcrowding issue? I mean, those are those are deep substantive questions. I I'm not expecting like tonight to touch on those, but are those on your radar and and when do

455
02:04:58.160 --> 02:05:18.680
you see that sort of conversation I mean I mean don't get me wrong like I'm hearing a little bit of of of already. I just don't know if you have like a thought in your mind of you know, the the presentation or the discussion on

456
02:05:18.680 --> 02:05:33.560
that. >> Yeah, we've I think what we're waiting on what we need is we we have theoretical ideas on what the library can provide. >> Yeah. >> We have more clarity on what the 6-7 Gallop Road project can provide given

457
02:05:33.560 --> 02:05:49.960
how far school building committee is able to move that work forward in terms of the designs, in terms of site is acquired, in terms of cost estimates. We got a lot more of that right before we ended up going with the MSBA. That will change it somewhat and so we don't have that clarity kind of gives the MSBA

458
02:05:49.960 --> 02:06:05.400
project, but personally feel like school building committee was able to give us really far with kind of what 6-7 project at Gallop Road could look like. We are are couple weeks a month into library and so we just don't quite have

459
02:06:05.400 --> 02:06:20.360
that information as a as a comparative, but to point it is absolutely going to be a question of how many classrooms does this you know, save us? Does this get us back at our overcrowded

460
02:06:20.360 --> 02:06:37.160
elementary schools? How many spaces does give us back at our high school? And what does that mean to those kids at those? And how does that compare to the spaces we would we would gain if we did the originally planned kind of dialogue with 6 7 site. The Library site is going

461
02:06:37.160 --> 02:06:52.720
to be smaller than the dialogue site. It's just a smaller parcel. It's 4.7 acres versus over 6 acres. So, it is a smaller parcel. Expected enrollment for pre-K K option is much smaller than

462
02:06:52.720 --> 02:07:08.400
6 7 pre-K option. Obviously, so you know, a a smaller project is going to have less significant impacts on the overcrowding. A smaller project is also cheaper. Right? And so, those are just the

463
02:07:08.400 --> 02:07:25.200
tradeoffs that I think the the school committee will need to talk through. Ultimately, y'all will as well. And ultimately, the town will, right? Because this isn't actually a decision that school committee makes. It is a town meeting and a town-wide decision, but I think the school committee's voice

464
02:07:25.200 --> 02:07:41.240
in trying to drive towards one outcome or another will be an important part of that. So, that definitely is a conversation we need to continue to have, but I I think we are a little early just because we're not quite sure what Library can give us. And so, once we have that, I think we can get more

465
02:07:41.240 --> 02:08:01.360
tangible about weighing those differences. >> I agree. >> Just real quick, I was able to, you know, I'm on school building committee. So, the context of that, I I was able to do a brief tour um

466
02:08:01.360 --> 02:08:17.240
to observe overcrowding at Cunningham and to a lesser extent Collicot. And um you know, I just want to pause and I mean it it it you can still see the visible examples of that. And And just want to recognize um the teachers and

467
02:08:17.240 --> 02:08:34.840
administrators over there for um you know, they despite that, manage it exceptionally professionally. >> There's a lot of them. Didn't see them on Edge Hill Road parking. >> Yeah, no, I I appreciate you mentioning that because I I do think that's we've

468
02:08:34.840 --> 02:08:49.960
just been in the process of the school building for so long and then again, hats off to I've been on the committee a little bit longer than you, but there's so many of those members have been on there for 7 8 years at this point. So we've been working on this for a long time and I think we can get numb to that experience, I think. Folks have said it

469
02:08:49.960 --> 02:09:06.440
well in that you know, the MSBA would not have invited Milton into the school building process if the state did not feel like you don't have a funding issue. They have limited funding available to them. They have lots of needs, lots of

470
02:09:06.440 --> 02:09:23.200
requests they get on an annual basis. And so I think you know, the I think the school building committee, the school committee, the past select boards have named time and time again about the overcrowding is important to note. I appreciate all the members who who did that well predate me.

471
02:09:23.200 --> 02:09:39.320
Uh but I think just to get the folks in the community to understand that, you know, this is not just Milton's perspective. This is like folks who look at overcrowding across the entire state have come to our town and said, "Yep, you need you need some support." And so I've invited them into this process to

472
02:09:39.320 --> 02:09:57.880
I appreciate raising that. >> Thank you. I'm actually uh your framing of the schools being willing to adjust assuming that we we make a purchase really changes the way I thought about that. Cuz that thought occurred to me and going back and having a purchase

473
02:09:57.880 --> 02:10:14.280
agreement and having time to review, think about what's best and not have to assume right away which is really helpful um for me. I don't know if there are any other questions or anything you can think of. Thank you.

474
02:10:14.280 --> 02:10:32.560
I just want to thank you for your >> very much. Thank you. Very helpful. We appreciate all your support. Thank you very much. >> Do you want to stay a couple more years, Mr. Finney? >> Well, we have 12 big months coming up so this that'll be good. >> We can't persuade you to stay. >> You you you you're good to persuade us.

475
02:10:32.560 --> 02:10:52.280
You never know, John. >> I'll buy you coffee every day of the week. >> I'll meet you at 7-Eleven and I'll do some apple hot coffee with you there. That was our old meeting place. >> Yeah. >> Thank you for being helpful. Thank you guys. >> All right, we'll move to item six.

476
02:10:52.280 --> 02:11:06.840
Special town meeting date for town meeting and potential warrant articles, I believe Sue Gabbard is going to join us. Good morning, Sue. >> Good, how are you? Thanks for having me. >> Thanks for coming. >> It was a very interesting meeting. >> By the time you're done, you can go open

477
02:11:06.840 --> 02:11:23.280
your office for tomorrow. >> [laughter] >> No, I was glad to be here and hear all the important information that you folks were discussing. >> So, Sue, I think you're going to share with us your feeling on uh potential special town meeting dates for the fire station, potential ballot

478
02:11:23.280 --> 02:11:39.920
raise, as well as the um state election and ballot questions. Floor is yours, Sue. >> All right, so um I had the opportunity to go to a town clerk convention and during that we talked about the

479
02:11:39.920 --> 02:11:56.920
upcoming November election. Um currently there is about Oh. So, there'll be about 19 office positions um that will be on the ballot. Um five of which are going to be for

480
02:11:56.920 --> 02:12:12.560
Blue Hills Regional Vocational School. So, we will be voting on uh Avon, Braintree, Canton, Dedham, and Randolph's school committee members. So, that takes up a bit of our ballot. Um I'm going to just digress a little

481
02:12:12.560 --> 02:12:30.920
bit and go backwards. So, in 2022 um state election. To just give you a comparison, we had um three pages, so it was a total of two card apps. Um there was five questions plus roughly

482
02:12:30.920 --> 02:12:46.040
about the same amount of offices. Um this election there's a potential There wasn't initially a potential of 11. Two of them um taken off.

483
02:12:46.040 --> 02:13:03.080
Um so right now as it stands we have nine. Now, that number could change um if the town was to put a question on the ballot. First of all, we can only put up to three on the state election. So, I don't know how many

484
02:13:03.080 --> 02:13:19.040
you folks are considering, but there there is a limit of three. Um the town's questions would be last. So, we're looking at probably three cards um

485
02:13:19.040 --> 02:13:36.000
for the ballot. Where our questions would fall might be on the back of the third um page. So, potential areas that I see could be problematic. Um we do a substantial amount of

486
02:13:36.000 --> 02:13:50.760
vote by mail during a state election. Um I don't have the numbers yet because they're an ongoing target. But if I was to give a guess to me, somewhere between 5 to 10,000.

487
02:13:50.760 --> 02:14:08.400
Um uh applicants. The which is great, you know, because I love to see people get out and be engaged and vote. The problem with that is when ballots are mailed home and there's

488
02:14:08.400 --> 02:14:24.680
multiple pages somebody in good faith could think they put all the pages in that volume. We do not know that it doesn't include all those pages until

489
02:14:24.680 --> 02:14:39.200
those ballots are going through the machine on election day. There's no point and there's no way to contact those voters once it's submitted to us. Um, so there's a great potential that although we might have very good numbers of

490
02:14:39.200 --> 02:14:56.480
um, voter turnout. Our questions may not may may get a lot more blank than we would like. Um, nine nine potential ballot questions, that's a lot of reading

491
02:14:56.480 --> 02:15:13.840
um, for the voters. We would have to do some very heavy marketing in my opinion to make sure that the voters are aware that there are two two or three questions or one question on our app. Um,

492
02:15:13.920 --> 02:15:30.600
the red book that comes out that the Secretary of State prints. That that would not include any of our information or our ballots. We're not allowed to um, give a a yes or nay on our

493
02:15:30.600 --> 02:15:47.400
questions. Um, which can be a drawback because people will get their red book, decide how they're going to vote, and see these other questions and if they haven't been engaged, may not respond to those.

494
02:15:47.400 --> 02:16:03.160
Um, so the and painting all negatives and I don't mean to. >> [laughter] >> Um, but I'm just trying to provide you with an opportunity to make decision based on

495
02:16:03.160 --> 02:16:25.160
the fact that there there could be, although it's a pool of voters, it might not be um as great as we would hope. >> So, what would be our alternative? >> So, the alternative would be

496
02:16:25.160 --> 02:16:40.719
to have a special election. Um so, as we know, the cost of a special is going to run us somewhere around 40 um thousand. Now, 40,000 could be more, depending upon again, the

497
02:16:40.719 --> 02:16:57.120
costs go up depending upon how many people actually request vote by mail because postage and manpower are the biggest cost derivative of the elections. Um yes, the ballots are up when I look at all the figures, that's where the money comes

498
02:16:57.120 --> 02:17:11.719
up. And um so, it it would be at a minimum 40,000. >> Who? >> Give or take, depending on um early voting. Um by law,

499
02:17:11.719 --> 02:17:27.200
if we did it in this calendar year, we would have to anybody who applied for all elections, we would have to send them a ballot. Um so, that that's something else that you would

500
02:17:27.200 --> 02:17:45.320
need to September >> September 1st would be too simple, right? >> Who's So, September 1st is the primary. >> Right. >> Um I used to think >> people will show up for a primary,

501
02:17:45.320 --> 02:18:02.719
right? And the final like the ballot what the statewide ballot questions are not on the primary ballot. >> Correct. So, that would entail a dual election, which I would never recommend because essentially what you're doing is holding two elections at the same

502
02:18:02.719 --> 02:18:17.599
time. >> so we can't >> You can't put a question on the primary ballot. Yeah, unfortunately. >> Yeah. >> And I've done one dual election. And um Can it be done? Sure, anything can be done.

503
02:18:17.599 --> 02:18:33.080
>> Yeah, but you have to make sure people vote >> It it's it's It's a logistical nightmare and um it's um >> It's procedurally not that it's required for debt exclusion, but in that case there wouldn't have been a town meeting

504
02:18:33.080 --> 02:18:51.040
prior to the ballot question vote, which is the normal rhythm, but if it's not you could go ballot question first then town meeting and not typically for debt exclusion So the two we have the question right now on the fire station potential debt.

505
02:18:52.559 --> 02:19:08.719
As far as we know right now is the fire station community center preparation on the general election. They're planning on a fall yes fall town meeting with the expectation of a ballot question on the state election ballot but more

506
02:19:08.719 --> 02:19:28.200
generally that time of year is >> So the other thing that I should I should inform you August um 5th is the deadline that the decision would need to be made. The board would need to have voted and notified me. So I have a deadline to um

507
02:19:28.200 --> 02:19:43.719
notify the Secretary of State if you are going to have a ballot question on the September I mean the November ballot. Um and it has to be a hard copy so it has to have enough time for it to the physical paperwork. It I can't email it

508
02:19:43.719 --> 02:19:59.480
so um a vote would have to occur from your office and um the actual questions would have had to have been written. I mean it's pretty standard questions um when you're talking about an override question to kids

509
02:19:59.480 --> 02:20:14.080
um they write everything out. Um but town council would still have to write it. You folks would have to approve it, get it to me, and I would have to fill out the necessary [clears throat] paperwork to get it to the Secretary of State's

510
02:20:14.080 --> 02:20:31.200
office. So it's not a large large window for you folks to make a decision. And for special election um it's 35 days you have to notify me before you want that election. So as long as I am notified

511
02:20:31.200 --> 02:20:51.040
and we can call >> So on the table for us if it's on the ballot right that would be valid as long as we wanted if we wanted on the state election it should probably be done by August 5th as we discussed previously. I think we were leaning towards a special election.

512
02:20:51.040 --> 02:21:07.320
Um we were setting the town meeting date for the override. So that would be the only idea to do if it's prior to the override and the same special election or to the override being before the November state

513
02:21:07.320 --> 02:21:22.960
So would your preference be that you do not have any override questions on the state? >> Um I don't personally have a preference. I I think it would strictly be uh for you folks but I do caution by having a question on the ballot it can

514
02:21:22.960 --> 02:21:37.560
be overlooked. [clears throat] So my fear would be that you wouldn't get the visibility that you may need. >> But you're talk you're talking from a I'm just trying to weigh the two like

515
02:21:37.560 --> 02:21:53.880
you're talking out of a higher turnout election already so you may lose people may miss it out of a much higher turnout than the special election so >> get the same it could still have the same outcome as if we did it and

516
02:21:53.880 --> 02:22:08.720
and To me when you're holding an election, what drives the voter is the cause what they're voting for. So you folks, myself, we can all wave banners if if the

517
02:22:08.720 --> 02:22:24.120
residents are excited about that election >> [snorts] >> they're not going to come. So you know, a special election >> [snorts] >> we could get just as much or more

518
02:22:24.120 --> 02:22:40.000
than the state election, you know, honestly. [snorts] I don't think for this particular election there's a lot of interest in the races. I think that there will be a decent voter turnout. It's not going to be like presidential, but I do think that there's enough engagement

519
02:22:40.000 --> 02:22:55.960
that we will see a good voter turnout. >> Yeah, but can't you have workers tell everybody there's a back page, make sure you >> Oh, and they would and they'd be signing >> So it wouldn't be against the law?

520
02:22:55.960 --> 02:23:13.040
>> No, there it so regardless, this is going to be a multi-page ballot. So we will have in every envelope, you know, please remember to return all all pages. Um because for us, even if somebody didn't want to

521
02:23:13.040 --> 02:23:28.880
vote on any of them, we don't get those ballots back for an accounting purposes and for our paperwork it's it's difficult, you know, not having all of those ballots back. So we want them all back.

522
02:23:28.880 --> 02:23:45.200
We want answers on them, too, but you know, we want to make sure when it's somebody's in person it's a different atmosphere. Our folks are right there, they hand them the ballot. Oh, there's three pages. Please make sure

523
02:23:45.200 --> 02:24:02.040
you submit them into the ballot box. There's somebody at the ballot box that say, "You only have one page. You got to go back and get those other ones." We'll have people um perusing to make sure that no ballot is left behind. Um at home it's a different environment,

524
02:24:02.040 --> 02:24:17.600
you know, and everybody's good intention, they may have their papers there and really honestly think that they put all [clears throat] of them in there and they may not. And and or somebody may say, "I don't care about those. I'm not going to put them back in."

525
02:24:17.600 --> 02:24:32.400
Um and figure, "I'm just going to put in what I voted on." Does that make sense to you? Um So, despite all efforts, we will still get a percentage that will

526
02:24:32.400 --> 02:24:50.000
not come back in its entirety. >> So, my last question, do you have a view on if we're trying to move that quickly on a special election, like what's a reasonable time to space that out from? >> So,

527
02:24:50.000 --> 02:25:05.400
I mean, we could do it the November November 3rd is the election. We In theory, we could be working towards a mid-November election.

528
02:25:05.400 --> 02:25:26.120
Um you know, so the the other thing that I would need to keep in mind is for our state election, we have three different precinct style ballots. So, on top of having four ballots, page four four pages or three-page

529
02:25:26.120 --> 02:25:41.680
cards, we have four different for all intents and purposes zones. So, you are in precinct six, >> Very nice. >> Um So, precinct six

530
02:25:41.680 --> 02:25:56.320
votes in one zone. Um somebody who's in precinct five votes in another zone. So, we have different ballots, um which can be confusing.

531
02:25:56.320 --> 02:26:14.360
Um so, thankfully, a special election, everybody in town will get the same. Um it's not like an that we would have town meeting members or this um breakdown of the town for different legislative offices.

532
02:26:14.360 --> 02:26:29.840
Um So, you know, as there's a lot of moving parts when we're sending out ballots and making sure the ballots get each voter is getting the correct candidates on their ballot.

533
02:26:29.840 --> 02:26:46.760
>> So, you're going You would like to have two elections here. To make sure everything gets done right. >> I I think it's a safer prediction. I don't necessarily like the cost associated with it. Um but weighing

534
02:26:46.760 --> 02:27:02.640
we want the voters to know what they're voting on, see what they're voting on, and make sure that those that really intend to vote on this are voting. Um I think having a special election is the

535
02:27:02.640 --> 02:27:19.320
way to go. It can't get lost in the >> I just it may be worthwhile to be a little more specific on dates just because that's such a busy time of year. So, if it's not on the state election is November 3rd, the other Tuesdays in November are the 10th and the 17th. And then the 24th is the week of

536
02:27:19.320 --> 02:27:35.880
Thanksgiving, so I think we all want to avoid the 24th. So, it sounds like the 17th would be the option in November. And that would the ballots full by mail ballots be crossing the mail of the state election ballots? >> So, so they would. Yeah. Uh but the

537
02:27:35.880 --> 02:27:53.040
majority of the state ballots would be out. So, the last day that we can mail out ballots for um the state election is going to be somewhere around October 27th. Um so, there would be a little bit of

538
02:27:53.040 --> 02:28:08.680
pressure but the major bulk is like that first week that we get because all the people it's just more people apply in the very beginning and then it gets down.

539
02:28:08.680 --> 02:28:27.080
>> And then December the 1st is a Tuesday and then 8th is a Tuesday and then we'll probably get it closer to the holidays where we have to check holiday calendar. Okay. From November 17th to December 1st is November. >> November 17th to December

540
02:28:27.080 --> 02:28:42.920
>> Yeah, November 17th, December 1, December 8, December 15th depending on how >> So, I can >> here. >> We're going to schedule calendar, contact and everything to give you the dates.

541
02:28:42.920 --> 02:28:58.120
>> Okay. >> What we would need things by so you'd have a better idea of what dates you're looking at. If that's helpful. >> Should we engage the um press this week and see >> I can check with them and then if they want to check with their friends

542
02:28:58.120 --> 02:29:14.840
at the schools about how constructive that would be for that special election at that time of year as well. So, we can >> Correct. >> We can do both of those things and check back in on what things are like. Schools and all. >> And the schools are phenomenal so that we never want to take for granted that

543
02:29:14.840 --> 02:29:33.080
um >> Very helpful. >> Okay. Well, thank you for having me and if you have any questions, um let me know and I will get that email off to you folks um by the end of tomorrow. >> Okay, thank you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you.

544
02:29:33.080 --> 02:29:50.760
All right. And I'll leave that. >> That's your job. >> [laughter] >> We're all talked out. >> Moving to seven, our discussion approval energy credit agreement with ReWild. Do you all have the documents?

545
02:29:50.760 --> 02:30:08.040
Thoughts or comments from the members unless Mr. Mulholland has a context that I should share. >> We are in a place with uh town council and net council not quite able to get it over the finish line still. So, I There are really two options. Um if the board is comfortable

546
02:30:08.040 --> 02:30:23.360
with these agreements as a policy decision and and hoping to approval of entering into this agreement, you can the board can vote tonight and you know, submit it to approval of town council and if there's anything where town council and net council just is at complete disagreement on, then it kicks

547
02:30:23.360 --> 02:30:39.240
back to the board for a decision on what to to just accept the agreement with um ReWild's preference or language um or council and net council would reach um mutual agreement at that time as that would then commence the execution. So, the board could approve it subject to

548
02:30:39.240 --> 02:30:55.720
town council's approval tonight. Or you can hold off until July 14th um and see if they're able to agree in the meantime. ReWild LLC is probably getting a little antsy, but they're also at the same time part of the issue that we're facing. So, those are the two options tonight. If you're agreeable in terms of the policy

549
02:30:55.720 --> 02:31:14.280
decision, you can leave it subject to town council. >> I can move to approve the energy credit agreement with ReWild LLC subject to approval by town council. >> Second. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Yes.

550
02:31:14.280 --> 02:31:32.440
>> And myself, yes. >> Great. Uh number eight, discussion and approval amendments to H.4094 uh the amended reading an act relative to the establishment of a Milton means tested property tax exemption.

551
02:31:32.440 --> 02:31:50.280
Thoughts? Comments from the members? This was sent to us from our state representatives. Uh most of the language may change for it when going through the house. Thoughts or comments on the If not, I'll take a motion. >> Appreciate you, Representative Morales,

552
02:31:50.280 --> 02:32:06.040
for pushing this along. It's very important. I I move to approve the amendments to H4094 an act relative to the establishment of the Milton means test tested property tax exemption. >> Second. >> Seconded by Mr. Driscoll.

553
02:32:06.040 --> 02:32:21.560
>> Yes. >> Mr. O'Shaughnessy. >> Yes, I agree. >> Yes. >> Myself, yes, and I'll echo Mr. O'Shaughnessy's thoughts. And thank you, Representative Morales, for your work. Number nine, discussion update, committee reports. Milton budget coordination committee. Chair Anglin.

554
02:32:21.560 --> 02:32:39.600
>> I do not have an update. We um We Our next meeting is on Monday. >> No update. School building committee, Mr. O'Shaughnessy. >> I think we pretty thoroughly covered where we're at, but I'll just flag there's a date next week, Monday,

555
02:32:39.600 --> 02:32:56.760
June 29th, where I I encourage us to have the architect is coming to the meeting. It allows us to continue to hash out like you know, make sure we're all on the same page about the scope of work. So, I encourage folks to

556
02:32:56.760 --> 02:33:13.200
attend and participate if you're interested. >> Thank you. Thank you. Report on the housing trust. >> Uh we met over 2 weeks ago and we approved $600,000 to the Milton Housing Authority. Now helping get more grants. Secure more grants. I think it's

557
02:33:13.200 --> 02:33:28.600
over a million eight total work. There's some new porches. Fixed the two units with the drain issue and new siding and updating on the air conditioning

558
02:33:28.600 --> 02:33:45.200
air conditioning. >> If you I will just add the housing production plan. I don't think I have that calendar that was shared tonight. Probably I can just try to try to secure that and send it out to all the members so you can see that plan for work as

559
02:33:45.200 --> 02:34:01.680
well as community engagements. All right, moving to number 10. I would like requested move this to the next meeting this discussion since one member member Nolan is not here. And I think we will move this just kind of have a longer discussion on it if you

560
02:34:01.680 --> 02:34:16.800
would like. So we can use them in the future. And number 11, discussion approval board and committee appointments and reappointments. Now we can do this um wholesale but I will ask Ms. Milano cuz I do want to I do want to

561
02:34:16.800 --> 02:34:33.360
pull one out. What's your >> You're going to pull me out of the air like that? >> I don't know. You stopped there. >> [laughter] >> No, I I want to pull out the um if you could say that name the local historic district study

562
02:34:33.360 --> 02:34:48.480
committee. Others, um I think if I could pull that out we can do the things as a whole. My thought on that is I believe about a year ago the historic district study committee came to us and they were going to put forward

563
02:34:48.480 --> 02:35:04.120
a article of town meeting. Um it was then edited and pulled from from the article and I think we submitted it. They haven't made as many many changes so I would like to have a discussion with them to see if this article is the end of their work. Perhaps the committee is

564
02:35:04.120 --> 02:35:21.120
no longer necessary. Just to update us to the article of their work and is the committee going to continue? [clears throat] That's your numbers. >> I'm all right with that. >> Okay, all right. >> I'll take a motion to approve all of them except for the local history

565
02:35:21.120 --> 02:35:37.800
historic district study committee reappointments and we will engage them in the coming to come to session with us. >> So moved. >> Second. >> Mr. Driscoll? >> Yes. >> Mr. Oberhammer? >> Yes. >> I agree. >> Yes. >> And myself, yes.

566
02:35:47.440 --> 02:36:12.520
I'll be at the party. Nope, there we go. Number 12, discussion and approval application for the Milton High School to use town green for a play. Yep. So, I will take a motion. >> Uh I'd like to make a motion to move to

567
02:36:12.520 --> 02:36:29.080
approve the application for Milton High School to use the town green band gazebo on September 5th, 2026 from 6:00 to 8:00 p.m. gazebo for a cabaret style performance. >> Second. >> You have a second, Mr. So.

568
02:36:29.080 --> 02:36:47.360
So, I'll second. Mr. Driscoll? >> Yes. >> Mr. Oberhammer? >> Yes. >> I agree. >> Yes. >> And myself, yes. >> Thank you. >> 13, discussion and approval of meeting minutes from May 26, 2026. I'll take a motion. >> I'll make a motion to accept the meeting

569
02:36:47.360 --> 02:37:03.800
minutes for May 26, 2026. >> Motion made. >> Second. >> Seconded. Mr. Driscoll? >> Yes. >> Mr. Oberhammer? >> Yes. >> I agree. >> Yes. >> And myself, yes. Now, we'll move to the town administrator's report. >> Thank you, Mr. Chair.

570
02:37:03.800 --> 02:37:19.600
Work has started over on that small stage in Memorial Park and East Mountain Road. So, that that work is underway now. So, we appreciate your patience while we uh get that built out. Um excavation work and site work has also started up at Beverly Park with the

571
02:37:19.600 --> 02:37:36.320
new playground located on Summer Street uh next to Pope's Pond. Uh so, the excavation is underway there. Um and uh contractor who will be building the playground will be following over the course of the next few weeks. Uh so, we're excited to see that project

572
02:37:36.320 --> 02:37:52.680
take shape. Um We have several open positions in um the town hall and elsewhere for anybody interested uh or knowing anybody looking for jobs, particularly a couple payroll positions, one in town hall and one in police, um an administrative position in the DPW, um

573
02:37:52.680 --> 02:38:08.760
labor positions in the DPW. So, please share that with uh perhaps any recent college grads who are still trying to figure out what they want to do. We are uh taking applications actively. Uh in relation to some of the school project conversation, you recall we had submitted a home rule petition at town

574
02:38:08.760 --> 02:38:25.640
meeting approved some point last year to extend uh the deadline by which the town needed to act on potential school project at that road. Uh that had a deadline of 2028 uh that we had filed a home rule petition at town meeting approved to extend that by 5

575
02:38:25.640 --> 02:38:42.280
years um and senators have filed that and that has been approved and signed into law. So, that land swap legislation had required a school project to be acted on by 2028. That's now extended to 2033. So, I appreciate the assistance of our legislators on on shepherding that through and getting

576
02:38:42.280 --> 02:38:57.720
that approved. Um and then lastly, we had a walk-through at the East Mountain fire station today for the request for proposals um related to um the existing East Mountain fire station. Um and uh we'll be following up with uh

577
02:38:57.720 --> 02:39:13.360
those who visited and those those proposals are due in mid-July. Uh so, we'll see the kind of interest level there is um for that project. And that's my suggestions. reduce the model. Um, as the chair, honestly, I don't have much

578
02:39:13.360 --> 02:39:27.920
to report this week. I would just say thank you to the planning board uh and the schools for coming in this week with the planning board specifically. Um, as you can tell from the conversation we had Thursday, a lot to do. And >> [clears throat] >> uh very happy for their engagement as well as their partnership and all of the

579
02:39:27.920 --> 02:39:46.040
work that we have had. And I think the collaboration is sort of the thing that gets us the best stuff. What are you talking about? Uh members reports. New one. Nothing from me. Second twice. Nothing from the members.

580
02:39:46.040 --> 02:40:04.000
All right, public comment response. We do not have public comment. Future meeting schedule, Tuesday, July 14th and July 21st. That's the ones, I believe. Any future agenda items from the members? >> We've been a lot of conversation here. >> Yes.

581
02:40:04.000 --> 02:40:23.080
Perhaps the guest the re-engagement with the church for election. I think we can have a special election, but something to think about going forward. >> I think I'd put for the one of the July meetings further consideration of traffic

582
02:40:23.080 --> 02:40:48.520
subcommittee oversight of the common report. I don't have a strong preference which one. >> All right, with that I will move to enter executive session to consider the purchase, exchange, lease, or value of real property in the Library College through or through Adams

583
02:40:48.520 --> 02:41:04.280
Street based on it. I believe that the discussion of this matter in open session may have a detrimental effect on the negotiating position of the select board. Select board will not return to open [clears throat] session. >> Second. >> Second, Mr. Tristram. >> Yes. >> Mr. Leschke. >> Yes.

584
02:41:04.280 --> 02:41:19.320
>> Yes. >> And myself, yes. I'll also move to enter executive session to consider the purchase of We will enter executive session to discuss strategy with respect to collective bargaining bargaining with the clerical union on the southern southern eastern public employees

585
02:41:19.320 --> 02:41:35.760
association Milton professional management association, Milton public employee association, Milton firefighters local 1116, Milton police association, Milton superior officers, Milton library association. Based on my belief the discussion of this matter in open session may have a detrimental effect on the bargaining position of the

586
02:41:35.760 --> 02:41:52.920
select board. The select board will not return to open session. >> Second. >> Second, Mr. Trask. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> And myself, >> Yes. >> We do you do need one more before you can have >> Honestly, I'm good. >> It counts the same.

587
02:41:52.920 --> 02:42:08.960
>> I'm good. >> Move [clears throat] to enter executive session to consider the purchase, exchange, lease, or value of real property for 88 Canap. Based on my belief the discussion of this matter in open session may have a detrimental effect on the negotiating position of the select board. The select board will not return to open session.

588
02:42:08.960 --> 02:42:25.080
Second. >> Second. >> Mr. Trask. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> And myself, >> Yes. >> Do you need one more, Mr. Trask? >> I'm good, thank you. >> What? >> I will also call [clears throat] to order

589
02:42:25.080 --> 02:42:40.920
>> Well, let's adjourn select board first. >> And move to adjourn the select board. >> Second. >> Second. All those in favor. >> Yes. >> Mr. Trask. >> Yes. >> Mr. Trask. >> Yes. >> Mr. Trask. >> Yes. >> And myself, yes. >> Now I can >> Now I must call to order trustees of the

590
02:42:40.920 --> 02:43:00.040
govern stilling trust. Discuss the approval of meeting minutes of the 14th. >> That's the first two. >> That's the first two. Three. >> And then town farm properties brought me on >> as well. >> And we're in open session still and still broadcast. >> So we're all So I'll take a motion to approve the

591
02:43:00.040 --> 02:43:16.200
meeting minutes. >> So moved. >> Second. >> Mr. Driscoll? >> Yes. >> Mr. Rochelle? >> I'll probably abstain. I was there before on the committee and I don't remember >> Yes. >> I'll I'll vote with the board of selectmen on this.

592
02:43:16.200 --> 02:43:36.080
>> Yes. >> So, let's discuss the property and building condition of the historic town hall. >> So, there are really two tracks here, I think. One one conversation is near term, medium term in terms of what kind of level of maintenance effort

593
02:43:36.080 --> 02:43:52.680
we're also looking for in terms of actual physical structure and the physical landscape up there. Our approach generally is is minimal attention. We will keep an eye on that building, you know, maintain it and visit in case there are issues, but those buildings are

594
02:43:52.680 --> 02:44:08.200
quickly degrading and are in tough shape as anybody's been up there recently. And then the other track of this conversation is the more long term, what do the trustees want to do with that? So, refer to the numbers and which conversation you're interested in having of those two or both,

595
02:44:08.200 --> 02:44:25.320
but I can happy to talk more about what's been going on in terms of the building condition. That's the more long term conversation. >> Yeah. >> I think the building condition we can talk about the long term. >> Yeah. >> I generally don't like to say that.

596
02:44:25.320 --> 02:44:44.920
The probably change hands soon, but our options for maintenance and cost So, right now who is who's up there? >> Between DPW and Consolidated, the departments will keep an eye on it, but we're not doing we don't do preventative maintenance. There's really

597
02:44:44.920 --> 02:45:01.120
not much we can do now other than if we think they're truly unsafe, removal of the structures that would trigger conversation with the stock commission. Certainly. Uh or if there's if there's work or studies that the board wants us to undertake in

598
02:45:01.120 --> 02:45:17.720
terms of understanding the condition of those buildings better, that's something that the project would have theoretically achieved without the expense of the trustees. Um so that's just kind of frustrating. Just looking for feedback on what

599
02:45:17.720 --> 02:45:37.280
information you're looking for or what what you want from us. >> [clears throat] >> Are the buildings themselves secured so that nobody can get into them? Like my fear at this point is like a group of kids thinks it's like funny to

600
02:45:37.280 --> 02:45:55.920
go in there or something and they get hurt. >> They're secured in the sense that they're boarded and locked, but they're not fenced off. They're somebody wanted to, they they would get in there. It's amazing. And one of the challenges that we face

601
02:45:55.920 --> 02:46:12.280
is it's land that was given to the town that's under the control of the trustees. So we're cautious in spending town tax dollars, but also on the flip side that endowed money

602
02:46:12.280 --> 02:46:27.640
is really you know, we're trying to use that for the poor of Milton, less so on property maintenance. So it is that is a factor as to why there hasn't been investment because it would be private or something. >> But there are no other options for me to do so.

603
02:46:27.640 --> 02:46:44.120
>> Which is a choice which is a choice of the board. >> When you the minimal maintenance we're doing, what does that include? Is that just cutting back weeds? Cutting back weeds? Show me. >> Yeah, there was there was tarps put on one building at one point. So they they're you know, that's fallen off. So

604
02:46:44.120 --> 02:47:13.000
we'll send somebody to pick up the trash and stuff on occasion when necessary. >> But nothing >> I'm just trying to think about what potential decision is before us. Like what actions are we choosing amongst eventually here.

605
02:47:13.000 --> 02:47:33.600
Um I whether to contribute more funds to enhance maintenance basically. We'd really have to engage with professionals to to figure out what level of effort it would take to stabilize them. So, I guess if that's

606
02:47:33.600 --> 02:47:49.400
really the first question you're looking for an answer on, we can we can start down the talking with the folks as to from an engineering and building perspective what it takes to stabilize them. on there. deterioration at this point.

607
02:47:49.400 --> 02:48:08.840
I was thinking I was thinking about the quality of the building structure. I was I was concerned maybe this is the building structure that has money being spent. >> You get the building inspector, you might want to tear them down.

608
02:48:12.360 --> 02:48:37.080
>> So, it sounds like we do not have much of an appetite for >> building maintenance. >> Just don't want no one to get hurt. You know. I just hope uh they don't go up on fire. You know.

609
02:48:37.080 --> 02:48:52.800
>> Is there something we can do as in terms of having someone view those buildings for potential dangers? >> We can certainly I will will our prod everybody again just to make sure everybody's been up there just to say well there's nothing else from a

610
02:48:52.800 --> 02:49:09.160
life safety perspective that they would like us to do. We we've had those conversations but we'll reiterate it now and then look at it from the safety and once we're there their ideas is there anything else just to kind of hold this any preventive things that they would

611
02:49:09.160 --> 02:49:29.320
suggest on the buildings themselves We developed this site with the storm and consolidated agency dangerous hazards things that we want to flag to them. So something is not right. >> And like the runway of being in this

612
02:49:29.320 --> 02:49:45.880
situation is until there's a longer term Yeah. So >> Fire hazard is the one that's going to be the main one. >> And and it's partly why we >> [clears throat] >> thinking a project is going to move forward and address the issue. >> Right.

613
02:49:45.880 --> 02:50:02.600
>> is why we there wasn't a lot there but now are holding pattern for at least the foreseeable future. >> Okay. >> Thank you. I'll take a motion to adjourn. >> I'll make a motion to adjourn. >> Second. >> It's been seconded Mr. Driscoll.

614
02:50:02.600 --> 02:50:08.720
>> Yes. >> Mr. Snow. >> Yes. >> Mr. Agnew. >> Yep. >> Mr. Snow. >> Yes.