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Okay, I'm I'm going to It's uh 7 uh 7:08. 8 on May 29th. Um my name is Sir Jeffrey Mullen. I'm the acting chair of the Milton Board of Appeals. I'm going to call to order
tonight's hearing 7:00 hearing upon the application of the Milton American Legion Post 114 uh in in respon in with respect to the application for a special permit to generate income in order to continue
donating sponsoring Milton girls softball, Milton youth baseball, Milton youth football in operating costs for the hall etc. for use as a commercial overnight parking. The application uh was submitted to the board on March 21st,
2025 by the applicant um Mr. Daniel Lane who was also signed by Marian Mcketric who I see is here with us today. It was it was accompanied by a letter from uh Mr. J Bo the interim Milton Milton
building commissioner in which he indicated that uh there were construction vehicles and construction equipment being stored on the property and the current use of the property as a private club exists under the opices of a special permit granted by the board of appeals dated January 8th 1965. The
special permit allows for the use of this property as a private club only. The regular parking and/or storage of large construction vehicles is not permitted under the terms of the permit and is therefore prohibited. Upon receipt of this notice, you must cease the use of the property at 123 Granite
Avenue for the storage of construction equipment and construction vehicles. Failure to comply with the directive or failure to seek an amendment to the special permit from the zoning board of appeals for this prohibited use within 30 days may cause this office to seek remedy through the courts. That is the
letter that accompanied the application. Uh bear with me. Uh we also received a letter uh from Mary Mcketric Council to the applicant dated May 28th,
2025. Uh in in which I won't read the letter because I see Miss McCetrick is here and uh can represent the the applicant and explain what's in the letter and the arguments for the special permit. with the letter uh she uh encloses a plan uh which indicates it's
a it's a portion of the premises and it indicates where the parking is being conducted. Um I believe there's also a letter in the file uh in is there a letter that we received today in support of the application bill? Um is that
right? Did I see that? Uh I do believe so. Um forwarded by attorney. Okay, hang on. Hang on a second. Let me uh Okay, I see that. Um, okay, I see
that. Uh, the letter from Mrs. Mcketric. I see. Uh, is there another letter? I apologize. There are a couple of emails, Jeff, that one from Milton Youth Football and Cheer and another
email from Regina Mali uh at 52 Barton's Lane member P8 um on behalf of the uh Pierce PTO. Okay. Um
I have a list for the letters. When you admit me to speak, I can list them for you. Okay. Um, there are eight. We have eight letters. Yes. Okay. Some were submitted with the original application. Uh, two were
submitted yesterday or today. They just came in recently. Um, and then there was also a petition with signatures. Okay. Um, okay. Why don't uh why don't we uh hear the testimony from uh from the applicant as to the merits of the application
taking notice of the um of the of the letters that have been submitted and we'll document that at at some point during this hearing. But why don't you proceed Marian? Uh welcome to the board of appeals. With me is um Kathleen O'Donnell uh member of the act I mean
the chair of the board of appeals and uh Chris Hart, member of the board of appeals. Uh Marian, welcome to the board of appeals. Thank you. I'm Mary McCetrick and I'm representing the applicants. Um they filed the original application with a couple of documents um before we they engaged me and we've
since had several meetings to discuss this application. So I did file um a full set of documents and an application letter originally with this board in order to have this hearing scheduled and then I filed a follow-up letter with a little bit of additional information. um
believe it was yesterday. It may have been the day before and I was supposed to include a clearer plan of the parking areas with the letter which I didn't do but I have since um sent it to you and I believe all the board members have it. Um so I want to say um just as a matter
of introduction that I some of the members or all the members of the board for the Milton Post 114 may be in attendance tonight. They are Daniel Lane, clerk, Jack Carlson, the president, Paul Coughlin, director, Patrick Connelly, director, and TJ Mary,
uh, Mayo or Terrence Mayo, the treasurer. Um, the I have met with all of the board members. Um they are all most of them relatively new to the board, not new to the um post, but um
their task has been to organize the operation, review the finances, try to figure out ways um to keep this Milton Post 114 solvent and operating and in order that it can serve veterans as it always has and also so that it can
continue to provide all kinds of services to town organizations and to be an available um you know sort of event place at the present time in Milton with the loss of the Milton Women's Club, the Who's it Club and the VFW Hall on Brook
Road, there is no place that a family can rent for a small event and if they have ties with the post they are able to use this facility. So it really serves multiple purposes. Um, none of these things directly relate to the request for parking except that it takes money
to keep a post like this open and their present financial situation is such that they are breaking even but they do not have enough money going forward. They need to find ways to generate additional revenue. Um, the idea of of providing a
license or lease for commercial parking on a portion of the premises is one idea they have in order to do that. and they did start allowing such parking. They then received a letter from the building department saying, "No, you can't do that. That's not allowed by your
existing special permit suggesting perhaps that they could apply to see if the board of appeals would consider amending that permit perhaps to allow this." So, um, at the present time, they have one, uh, they have a utility company that's interested in parking
their vehicles there overnight. These are vehicles. Some of them would be like construction vehicles and another entity that has some construction vehicles they'd also like to park. So, I've given you a plan. It's not different from the plan that was submitted with the
application, but I think it's clearer and easier to look at. And the plan shows you parking area number two, which is in the front closer to Granite A, which is approximately 6,000 square ft. and parking area number one, which is to
the rear. And this is on both sides of the mono monopole facility that you can see when you go by this um post uh site. So, the the rear portion is smaller. It's only 1,560 square ft. Um those are the two
parking areas within their large parking lot that the post is suggesting um they would very much like to provide some commercial parking. um ability on which would allow them of course to receive revenue. Um it's also the case that
there is just a real lack of space for commercial parking in the East Milton area. There are construction projects going on. There's very little parking available anywhere. So at least in the short term um there's a great need for some of this parking. So
um obviously they don't have any arrangement right now. there are still some vehicles there. If the board does not grant um this request for an amendment, then those vehicles will be removed. Um one of the other things that happened after they started parking
these vehicles was that the conservation commission inquired as to whether perhaps they had some commercial vehicles that were too far back, too close to the wetland areas. So the conservation agent came out and did a site visit, went back to the conservation commission and indicated
and showed the um post board members where the line was. So one reason the the rear parking area is quite a bit smaller and the other and they and the reason the whole parking area can't be in back of the monopole is because there
has to be a setback from wetlands back there. So they're they're only as far back in this plan that I sent you today um as they would be allowed to be as we understand it by the conservation commission. So,
um we the utility company has agreed um that if they could get a, you know, short-term license to park that they would be willing to pay for new fencing and new landscaping around the front parking area as well as some there's going to be some fencing also around the
rear parking area. The issue in the front of course is this site is across from the from the golf course. Um, no, the applicants certainly don't want to present an un unpleasant or ugly facade to the
street. They also want to make sure that their neighbors further down Granite A who can see one corner of their lot are not looking at these construction vehicles. Although we are all aware that, you know, right next to this site, separated by a narrow passageway,
um, a narrow piece of land, there is the state public works yard. But, you know, that's a public use and they can use the yard there. Um, this is a private lot and commercial vehicles are not allowed by right. Um, so they've offered to pay for fencing and they've offered to pay
for landscaping. Uh, the plan shows you some suggestions for where landscaping um would be placed. This proposal is for fencing that would be 6 ft high placed on top of a twoft cement block base. So, it would be an 8-ft fence. It would be
white, a white plastic fence. Um, and it would be the same style and the same appearance as the fence that's now in place around the monopole in the center of this prop and to the right of this property. Um, the the applicants, we've discussed the landscaping. They actually
have planted some fruit trees already. You can see them in some of the photos that I sent to you today. Um the applicants um have discussed with their this contractor or the utility company um how much landscaping would they be willing to put in, what would they
willing to do? And they basically said, you know, tell us what you feel have have the town tell you what they feel is necessary. They think they could probably provide whatever would be required. So that's a bit open. We can change the plan if you don't think it's adequate, but that's only if you get to
the point where you're considering um issuing a permit with conditions. The post was originally permitted in 1964 as a lot in a building for use as a private nonprofit club. It's an allowed use by special permit in Milton's by zoning bylaws. Um and the
requested amendment would leave in place conditions in the original special permit which prohibit any parking on Granite A. Um, the post has had as a tenant on the premises for a number of years, a cellular monopole company. That's an allowed use under Milton
zoning bylaw under certain circumstances which were satisfied in this case. And that use is um currently permitted through 2029. Um, the lease does provide annual revenue to help support post operations.
Um and the hope was that another means could be f found to increase that revenue so as to keep the the operation going. Um the these commercial uses the um monopole use is um considered a
commercial use for tax purposes. The post is responsible for payment of those taxes and is up to date at the present time. At the present time, Milton Post 114 really finds its
need itself in need of additional operating revenue. And it's a very it it's a significant need. They basically have had to use up whatever um resources they had accumulated uh to pay some past obligations. This is a new board.
They're trying to start off on the right foot and they've paid off all their current obligations, but they need to raise money. Um you can see uh there's I believe nine letters of support from various town organizations and a couple of individuals filed with this
application and some of them are are pretty good. They're uh they're all eloquent in the sense that they say that the post has done one thing or another to keep their organizations going. The post provides scholarships to the high school to graduating seniors. um they
allow uh Milton organizations to come in and have fun a fundraising dinner on their premises or sometimes they'll just hold an event to sort of celebrate help them celebrate the end of the season. So in some ways this post is an extension of the operate operation of a number of
um Milton organizations. A lot of them are sports organizations and they are very supportive of any effort to keep this this um post operation going. The other thing of course that we all know about is that the Milton Post is
the only veterans organization in Milton and it is essential to the veterans observances that the town holds and I know the post was recognized at the Memorial Day services recently for that. Um it really would be difficult to do do these events without this
organization. Um, and you know, maybe someday it won't be able to survive, but it certainly has a life of a number of years ahead of it, providing we can find a way for it to to survive financially. Um, so in some just to to
sum up the application, what we're trying to say is this is an organization that's supported in this town. Um, but they are very aware that by proposing this use, this parking use, they could
have an impact on neighbors who live nearby and are able to see at least one corner of their lot. So, they're proposing the use, but they also are proposing to screen any unsightly views of the front parking area and the corner
of their lot with fencing and with landscaping. um this you know so they're open to whatever is necessary. They have discussed this some um and will continue could continue to discuss it with anyone who feels they might have some view of the
property but um the post does provide significant benefits to the town. We feel that there's a way to do this without a significant detriment to residential properties nearby. Um, and these residential properties are not directly across the street, but they are
right down Granite A, so they can see one corner of the lot. Um, finally, um, it's a really unique location. I mean, they're next to the state DPW yard. They have a deep they have the expressway in back of them. They have wetlands around
the property. Um, and there's, you know, there's a golf course across the street. They're not directly across the street from a housing um, development. Um, so it's not easy to find the right mix of uses here that's still low impact and
can provide some revenue. If the post closes, and I've been very close to the point of of considering closing in the last few years because of their finances, then there's going to be another use here. I don't know what it's going to be, but I suspect that there
isn't going to be much that will be proposed that will be as low impact as this function hall use and the parking area. Uh so there there's always a compromise in these things. There's always potential impact, but I think if screening and fencing can be done
adequately, um I hope at least that the board will consider granting this relief. Thank you. Um thank you, Mr. McCric. Let me let me catch up on a couple of pieces of homework. The board will take notice of the letters to which you referred and I also want to acknowledge that your
application including se included several supporting materials including information about the post nonprofit status, the deed to the property, some decisions that the uh board has uh participated in in the past and the special permit itself from
1964 or 65. Right. Let me um let let me ask you uh what you would uh uh believe to be the standard of review to which the board should apply in considering this application.
I'd like to ask the board to consider it as a modification of the special permit. not detrimental uh significantly detrimental to the neighboring properties that that along that lines the that would be the standard for a modification of a special permit and let
me just add that in my application at various times I mentioned variance because there's this we're talking about a use here um there are a number of reasons why I think this fits much better as a modification of the special permit primarily because they have a special permit um but the other reason
is that you don't if you grant a variance for commercial parking on this property. It goes with the land. It's permanent. If you grant a modification of the special permit, you can limit it in time. You can ask the organization to come back and have it renewed if they so
desire. And you can set a lot of conditions. So, I don't think we're looking for changing the property use forever to a commercial parking lot. And so, I didn't think a variance was appropriate. Okay, that's fair. Let me
ask you um uh how much outreach has the board done with respect to the I understand you've got some special commercial institutional neighbors but what about the neighborhood that's out there? Is it has there been any outreach with them? Yes. Um around the time that
I first was meeting with the with the board they uh invited neighbors and these would primarily be the Courtland Circle this you know those neighbors to come to a meeting. there were some other people there from the town um to discuss
this application and uh that's one reason they have some supporting signatures from some of those neighbors um on their petition. Uh and it you know there are or may be neighbors particularly the neighbor who's on the
corner that has the view of the corner of this property that have concerns about what this commercial parking would look like. Um it wasn't a you know a meeting where everybody said we really love you and this is fine and nobody objects but they had a pretty good discussion. They've continued to be
available and we'll be continuing to discuss particularly if this is an issue of how much do we need to do to make sure we're screening the view of of this parking for you. Um so I I think they've tried to reach out to their neighbors and they're continuing to do that. Okay.
Thank you. uh give me let's I don't want to get into too much into the details of the post's finances but you did reference it in your application. I'm wondering if you could share with the board whether this is a significant uh st stop stop gap measure to the board or
whether or not this is a minor issue and perhaps the board could expect more and more of this type of thing as the post uh works to recover. Well, if possible, if there's anybody here from the board, I'd love to have
them uh supplement my response. But my impression in the meeting I've had, I've had several meetings with them, is that this is a this might not seem like a huge amount of money, whatever the um licensing fees are paid by these commercial
entities, but it's a significant amount for the post. And the reason is that it's revenue that's going to come in on a predictable basis for a period of time and in that way it is similar to the monopole
um lease that they have that that's a predictable amount of revenue. It's not huge unfortunately. So they do feel that this is this will put them on a a basis an operating basis that they then can go forward with. And just for example, they
need to do um handicapped access um improvements to their building. They just feel that they should. It's a veterans building and it's not as handicapped accessible as it should be. Um they will the the revenue from this will allow them to make those
improvements. Um the and ongoing as an ongoing matter, the building needs a certain amount of attention and expenditure and they don't hold a they don't hold a lot of fundraising otherwise themselves. They will
occasionally lease the property for a party or something like that. They make some money that way. One reason we don't have the Milton Women's Club anymore and one reason we don't have the Huza Club anymore is that that type of revenue on a limited basis doesn't seem to be
enough to sustain um this type of private club. So they do need some other revenue. This is very would be very important to them. The answer I've been given is that you know should they not get this permit? Of course, they would try very hard to find another way to do
this, but they feel that this would really this would put them um back where they should be so that they can operate in a proper way in the way that they have in years past. Um is if there's anybody here, does um does your clerk see that there that
any of the board members are here? Dan, um there is there somebody at the members of Daniel Lane here itself that would like to be heard? I see Terrence Mayo. Is he one of your board members? Yes. Um if he would like to speak about
that, he could. Or um anyone else is here. Pardon me. Just a moment. Mr. Mayo, would you like to speak for the post? Um yeah, I could make just a brief statement. Um thank you guys for hearing
this obviously. Um thank you, Miss McGtrick. Um we we're definitely in a little financial peril and this will help. Um we have no employees. Nobody's getting paid 100% volunteer throughout the
entire building. Um and in order for us to give as much money as we are to all the youth sports, Milton, uh Wildcats cheer, all of them. That essentially is what makes
it possible. Without that, we would definitely have to cut back. Maybe all the way. Hopefully, we could still give some, but not totally sure without knowing the numbers. And thank you. Thank you, Mr.
Mayor. Mr. Mcketch, a couple more questions I gota ask my fellow members. Let's talk about the parking itself. You you talked about the space. We've seen that on the drawing. Do you have an idea of how many trucks that space would
accommodate given the user? Uh, question one. And then the second question is, is there a is there a sense of whether or not this is all day, overnight, is it 24/7? What what would we expect would if
this use were to be continued? It's a tricky question to answer. the first one. Well, it has to do with how big, but I'm going to try to answer it. I'm not going to be able to give you a number of vehicles. I did send you some photographs today and a couple of them do show some vehicles because there are
some on the site right now. And you can see from looking at those pictures that there are some trucks and there are some vehicles that have, you know, a crane that's lowered and raised. Those are bigger. They take up more space. So, it really depends on this the types of
vehicles that at any one time need to be parked there. I'll take the utility company as an example. Um, they go they go out during the day with their vehicles. They bring them back at in the evening. That doesn't mean that the lot will be empty because they might have a
vehicle or or equipment that they're not using that day and it would stay there. So, what they are looking for is a place where they know they'll be able to park as many vehicles as they can fit into that square footage, but it depends on the types of vehicles how many that will
be when they need to. So, they're not it's not going to be full all the time during the day. It is likely vehicles would be parked there um on the weekend and certainly overnight. That is the purpose of having this parking area available. Um, sorry I forgot your
second question. Question was time, time of day, overnight parking, 247, etc. I was, we're asking for if if we were going to get permission to if they were going to get permission to do this, they would need permission to do it whenever they need it. So during the
day or in the evening or on the weekend. Fair enough. Let let me ask my colleagues if they've got any questions of the applicant at this time. Mr. Hart, just a followup. um to the last question that um Mr. Mas, which I'm looking at
the March 6 letter uh from the interim uh building commissioner um discussing in response to recent complaints from neighbors uh observing the construction vehicles. I'm just curious to know is the I I
don't know if you would know this question, but the answer to this question is the [Music] um the the configuration the number of those vehicles uh that led to those
complaints. Would that essentially be the same as the configuration and anticipated number of vehicles under the plan or has the uh the applicant essentially responded in part to those complaints and
and this plan essentially reflects a way to obviate the concerns that led to those complaints while seeking the variance or I'm sorry seeking the modification in terms of the number I think that the principal issue is the front lot. Mhm.
Cuz that's a lot you can see. Well, you you can't see it for the most part, but you see it at the corner. If you were down the street and looking back towards this lot, you would see the corner. Now, the corner is vegetated. So, the parking doesn't go right up through the corner. It's
already vegetated. Um, but the parking is visible from that corner. And if you had a big truck parked there and that's what they had when these complaints came in and there was no fencing and there was no additional trees and landscaping, you could see it. So they haven't they
can't reconfigure well they haven't proposed moving the parking. One of the reasons is they can't move it back. That would be the obvious thing to do, but there are wetlands in back of this property. They can't move more trucks to the back of the lot. Um, and the left
side of the lot is where the um the post building is. In general, the rear part of this lot begins to get too close to wetlands. So, they can't you particularly can't truck you don't want construction equipment and trucks parked anywhere near wetlands. um conservation
commission clearly had a concern with that and there may have been some trucks parked there when this complaint came in but they were all moved out of that back area and some were moved out completely in response to the conservation commission concerns and so the layout of the back part of the parking here is
actually pretty is much smaller. Now, the way that the post is trying to respond to these concerns is by coming up with a plan for screening. And that's what the fencing and the the trees and it could be trees and bushes. Um the
trees are small, but they are actually nice flowering fruit trees. And they certainly could put other trees in as well. They could have some evergreens in there, too. Um that's the way they've tried to respond. That's what that's the way they think they could provide
mitigation for any impact. U so that's where it stands. Thank you. That's helpful. I have no other questions right now. Please. So Donald, um I I don't I mean I kind of agree with um Miss McGtrich that um a variance isn't really appropriate in this circumstance and so
I do think the modification of the special permits the way to go. Um but I don't have any other questions. Um, I appreciate the getting the last little map because I was kind of wondering where that um where the parking was supposed to be. Um, I've driven and
driven and written past this property very frequently and um and there's always seemed to have been trucks on it around the monopole. So, um, you know, I'm not surprised by this request. Okay. Uh, let me uh I don't have any
further questions at this point. Let me ask if there's anybody in the audience who'd like to be heard in support of the uh of the modification to the special permit. Bill. Okay. Uh let's see who's in support. Could you raise your hand? We
have a Kevin Chrysom. Pardon me just a moment. Mr. Chrysom, welcome to the Court of Appeals. Good evening. Thank you, sir. Thank you very much members of the board. Uh my name is Kevin Krism Jr. I reside at 62 Courtland Circle, a town
meeting member of Preason and 7 and elected uh constable here in town. Um tonight on behalf of many of my neighbors speaking here tonight in strong support of uh the American Legion Post 114 and the request to amend uh their special permit. As a direct
neighbor of the post, I can really think of no greater and group of leaders for our town and neighborhoods than this current executive board of the post. Uh the work the board has done to improve the quality of their property so far, both indoors and outdoors, has been very well received by so many. For many years
growing up in Courtland Circle, residents would drive by the property and oftentimes see an empty parking lot with almost no life to it. Now, thanks to uh this current board, the work they've done, not a weekend goes by where the parking lot really isn't filled to the brim with cars, and from
retirement parties, community events, political campaign kickoffs, everything so much more. The post has really become the go-to spot for individuals from near and far really to gather. Um, and it's really been great to see to enjoy the company of others. Um, I want to read to
you the mission statement of the American Legion. This this stood out to me at most and it says, quote, "To enhance the well-being of America's veterans, their families, our military, and our communities by our devotion and mutual helpfulness." And the leaders of
the Post 114, I think, and many of my neighbors do as well, have gone above and beyond that mission by all their great work. In such a short amount of time, they've taken over. Um, this has been really so far a strong partnership with our neighborhood. And I can't speak
for all neighbors, but many of them we do have the utmost confident in their plans right now and for the the uh the future. Uh, I would encourage anyone who's had the pleasure of attending an event of the post to read the handwritten letters of Milton High School students who've been awarded
scholarships from the post and combine this with the work of mentioned earlier by attorney Mcketric, the work of with them and the Milton youth organizations and the sports the rather sports groups and the students uh planning to enter military upon graduation. The work of
the post and the board extends to uh to so many in this town. And finally, on the area in question, at a recent neighborhood meeting, which I and several of my neighbors attended, the board shared with us their plans to make the area cleaner and spruce it up with the um fencing and other improvements
made to it. And they also spoke about, as was mentioned earlier, their plans regarding handicapped accessibility, which is obviously a necessary and long-term goal of theirs. The plan that this board has being the post board 114 is contingent on additional revenue
streams and their continual operation. And by approving this special permit request that the American Legion Post can continue their efforts and partnering with our community and making this location a continued place for all these members uh so they can continue to work with everybody particularly our
veterans. They've served our town in these roles now and they've defended our nation in theaters of war. Given all this, again, several of my neighbors and I urge your board, the zoning board of appeals, to approve this special permit request. I want to thank you all very
much for your service and what you all do. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Chisel, for your testimony. Bill, is there anybody else who'd like to speak in support of the uh modification of special permit? We see several hands up
here. Uh I see Joan Falls, iPad. Uh, pardon me just a moment. Joan, hi. Good evening. Hi. Can you hear me? Yes. Okay. Hi. Welcome to the board of appeals. Thank you. Thank you for
allowing me to speak. Uh, my name is Joan Fall. I live at 172 Granite A. Um, and I'm a Tom meeting member for precinct 7. and I just wanted to call in to show my support um for the current board. Um I was I consider the post I
I'll always know it as Heritage Hall. I've lived in Milton for 38 years right down the street in the same spot. Um and it's really been part of the fabric of our neighborhood for many years. Um, I was able to attend that community
meeting a couple of months ago and um, I was really impressed with the current board with their dedication to work um, to turn around what had recently become a rundown hall. Um, they want to do what's best for the um, neighborhood but
conceded that the expense of getting back uh, the postback operational was unexpected and required some creative solutions. It's unfortunate that uh communication labs ended up in us being
here today. Um I I've been to many functions at Heritage Hall over the years, years ago. Um then it had kind of fallen by the wayside, but over the last couple of years, I've been to a lot. Their outdoor space, if you ever have
the chance to go and experience it out there, it was it's phenomenal. Um, and I really am so excited to have it back functioning um, with the caring board after years of neglect. Um, so I
really encourage you to um, to say yes to this modification of the special permit. Um, I think um, certainly the neighborhood will um, benefit as will the town of Milton. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you, Miss F.
appreciate your testimony. Bill, is there somebody else who'd like to speak in favor? Yeah, we have two more hands. I see Kevin Garvey. Mr. Garvey, welcome to the board. Hello. My name is Kevin Garvey. I live at 33 Courtland Circle. I'm a lifetime
me um resident here in Milton. I'll try to keep it short. I grew up in this neighborhood and I've seen this post um through the years go up and down. Um, I must say that what this board has been
doing and what you know for the neighborhood recently is outstanding and uh I think they deserve a chance to uh continue to be a better make the community a better place and that's pretty much all I have to say.
Thank you. Thank you very much, Mr. Garvey. Bill, and then we have uh Tracy Nerret. You can uh make your comment now Tracy. Hello Tracy. Miss Merritt, welcome to the
board. How how may we help you? don't seem to be they're unmuted. I'm not sure what's happening. Okay. Um we we'll note that uh she was requesting to uh appear during the support uh period of this uh
application and to the extent that she's able to work out her technical difficulties will uh will uh uh agree to to to have her heard. Uh I just um make a a point, Mr. share is that I ran into
um Eileen Nerret this a this morning at town hall. I believe that Tracy is her daughter. Um the nar the narrates own the um old rail line that abuts the strip um abuts the parking. Um and and
Ms. Merritt Nerritt made a complaint uh to me and to um to Bill about the fact that we were having this meeting on Zoom instead of in person. And so I think that um I I I wouldn't assume necessarily that they were speaking pro
or or or against. I don't know what but they are the abutter the immediate abuter. I see. Um so I see Miss Narrett. Uh would you like to be heard? Bill, while we wait for Miss Nerd, is there anybody else who'd like to be uh
heard in support of the application for the amendment to the special permit? I don't see any other hands. Let me ask if there's anybody who'd like to be heard in opposition to the uh application for the amendment to the
special permit. Okay, Paul Doherty has raised his hand. Paul, you should be able to be heard now. Welcome to the board of appeals. All right. Hello. Can you hear me? Okay. Yes. Uh, yes. My name is Paul Dy. I live
at 8 Avenue, which is diagonally across from the post. I've lived here for over 30 years, and my wife grew up in a house going back to 961 before this post existed. I was the one that called the town to inquire about the trucks being parked at
the post. This must not be allowed to happen. The post is supposed to be a nonprofit operating within residents a zone in the town of Milton. The town donated this property back to the post in
1964 for a total of $0. I wonder if the town only knew back then what the post would be asking today. When you think they'd be happy with this, I don't think so. The post already receives
$4500 a month for the lease of the cell tower. They are now receiving about the same amount leasing out the area to Kiche Exavating. That's approximately something over $100,000 a year of
outside revenue for a nonprofit. There are many other Legion posts in surrounding towns that do not lease out their property. The Mcken, the Maret, the Nickerson post to name a few. The amount and type of equipment
being stored on this property is outrageous. The number of large 10 wheelers, tractors, excavators, and other construction equipment is unsightly. Not to mention the diesel, gas, and other fluids that could be dripping out
into this out of this equipment into conservation land. No taxpayer resident of this town should need to see something like this while sitting from their front lawn or looking out their front windows. This would not be allowed on
any other private property in a resident's zoned area in the town. other nonprofits at S Mil Milton Academy, Milton Hospital, or any one of our churches would not be allowed to do this. I'm sure none of the neighbors of
these properties would would be I'm sure the neighbors of these other properties would to be just as upset. I'm asking you to deny this variance or modification to the post. Thank you. And while I was in listening to these other
comments, I just wish I could I just like to add a few more things. Well, I did attend the neighborhood meeting that was set up by Mr. Kevin Chrysom and he told me he would invite the whole neighborhood and put notice in everybody's mailbox. But what we
actually got was about emails to six different houses, five or six houses in them. And while there were some 20 to 30 people that attended this meeting, none were really from our neighborhood except for six or seven
folks, the rest were just residents of the town, which is fine. They were all fans of the of the uh post, you know, and um they they always like to um drag down the previous board. Um, but I've been in in front of
this board of appeals before for other events uh for other requests from uh the post. The last one I think was like parking buses on the lot that was not approved. I think the cell tower went up without any neighbors input. I'm sure it
was. I suspect the post asked for the variance after its construction. Exactly what is happening now with this modification. Their attitude is let's do this and ask for permission later. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Dar. I
appreciate your testimony. Um uh Bill, is there anybody else who would like to be heard in opposition if before I'm sorry I'm very sorry, Mr. Chair, if I may interrupt for just a moment. I just noticed that there are a number of individuals who've already commented who are still on the
screen and many of them are unmuted and it's causing a little bit of noise coming in. So, I would ask um Mr. Chair if it would be okay to ask them to mute or to move them back to attendees. Uh yeah, either uh I think they should be m muted. I I appreciate the point, Mr.
Hart. Uh if people who are are not being heard could be muted, uh that would be helpful to the board. Thank you. Yep. Bill. And uh I see Tracy Ner's hand has uh gone up again. Miss Nerret.
He's unmuted. Is uh Miss Nerrret the last person to be heard, Bill? Is there somebody else that is waiting? A number of people have raised their hands and seem to have taken them down. So, I think that might be it.
Okay. Let me ask uh uh before we um close the evidentary portion of the hearing whether or not there's any additional questions uh members of the board would like to ask of the applicant. I have I have one question. Um Mr. Thank
you, Mr. Chair. Um, Miss McCre, you had suggested one thing to consider, and I don't know that we will consider it, but one thing to consider would be, for example, um, you know, a time limitation, uh, of some kinds we could revisit. I'm curious
to know um there was a passing comment you made about um the the potential for the for using this to shore up financial issues is is potentially being timelmited. And so I'm I'm wondering maybe that was a
passing comment, maybe I misunderstood, but I guess I'm wondering if we were to consider that, what if if you were to suggest it, what would a reasonable time period be that would at least give the post some uh opportunity to realize some revenue, but also us an opportunity to
revisit? Um well my reason there are several reasons for suggesting a time limit from the board's perspective which is that you have control over whether the use continues if it's not satisfactory in
the end. Um the time limit really ought to I would think a three-year permit would be reasonable. Um I also am not sure whether there are good commercial tenants you know that
would engage in um and undertake the improvements that have been promised the fencing the landscaping um with say a sixmonth permit or a year permit under for other purposes sometimes a shorter term would make sense. I my thought was that the board
might want to consider um a timelimited permit perhaps three years a after which time if the post wishes to continue the use they have to come back again before the board of appeals and apply again basically there's no right to continue
um I didn't I wasn't trying to suggest that if they were able to do this for three years they would dig themselves out of some kind of financial hole and then everything would be fine. Um, however, 3 years would be better than nothing. It would definitely keep them
going for the present time. I also want to point out that their lease for the monopole does end. Um, this board has to, by the way, issue that by special permit. It's not a variance. Um, it's actually much more like an as of right
use because unfortunately or fortunately telecommunications facilities where there's a gap are allowed and the town can only put conditions um certain conditions and restrictions on such uses. So, uh I wasn't involved in that
in any way. That goes back many years. In fact, in some ways it's been difficult for the post because of that monopole there. They can't really do anything else with that site. But in any case, um that's going to end in 2029. So that revenue stream could be going away
at that point or not. Um but no, I wasn't trying to suggest that three years would be enough and there'd be no need to continue. Um and I don't know maybe before we conlo we conclude the discussion if any member of the board
from the post wants to add to my response that would be fine. My understanding is is simply another way that would help them finance what they current what they have always liked to do for the town, the services, the scholarships, um the support for um
sports leagues, and you know, most importantly, the services for veterans. I appreciate the clarification. Thank you, M. Uh Mr. Dy, would you like to be heard? Mr. Mr. Dy, you're on mute. Uh, board can't uh hear
you. Thank you. Yeah. So, he just unmuted me. Um, yeah. Um, that cell tower is not going to go away. And the what's what's going to happen that cell tower in in 2029 is they're going to they're just going to go up on price. So the then the
post will be getting 6 or $7,000 a year. And the same thing with with uh lease rent in this property. It it it may start off at 4500 or 5,000 in three four five six years whatever you determine
it's going to go up to 8 n or 10. So now I mean does none of these other places? No. There's no post around here in Randolph Canton, Quinzy that needs an extra 100 to 150 to $200,000 to survive.
Thank Thank you, Mr. Dy. Um, Bill, is there anybody else who'd like to be heard on the application before we close the evidence? Mr. Chisum. Thank you. just briefly since my name was invoked. Um, in regards to the neighborhood
meeting, uh, which I did help organize, um, there was outre significant outreach made to neighbors via email. Um, the Courtland Circle Thistleav neighborhood is not a big one. Um, but there was significant outreach via email. Um,
along with some flyers to uh, neighbors and yes, there were a handful of neighbors there. Not every neighbor was there with an addition to several town meeting members elected to represent precent 7 of which of course post 114 our neighborhood is in. Um obviously we
would have liked to see more folks there but given the uh importance of the meeting and the uh time sensitivity of it um there were uh I guess less folks than we wanted there to be. But um I just wanted to make that point that there was
outreach to uh several of our neighbors and there continues to be outreach on that front as well. Thank you, Mr. Chisel. Thank you very much. Carlson. Yes, sir. Hi, my name is uh Jack Carlson. I'm
the uh commander of uh Post 114. Thank you for having me and I I want to say thank you for having this meeting. Um what we're trying to do is trying to get this place up and going. What we've dealt with over the years that's come up
to now within the last year that we've are trying to get this place up and running the taxes, everything we've done. So I'm I'm I'm I don't even know how to So what I want to say is right now
Mr. Dy was the complaintant. Everything he's saying is speculating. The money we get from the tower doesn't even come out to half of the money he says we're making. And those that money that we make from the
tower barely keeps us abroad to above water to keep the post running between the lights, the heating to to keep the place going. I mean, if you think about it, he's telling you we're making
$100,000 off that that tower. We're not making that, sir. We're not making anywhere near that. And even with the two people, the two entities on both sides, that doesn't even come anywhere close to the 100,000 that he's talking
about. So, unless he has receipts to show you this, it's all speculation. Sir, what we're trying to do is trying to keep this place above water. What we've done is made it respectable and we're trying to keep it
going for the community. We donate everything. Everything that comes into this um property goes to the community. We're trying to keep We're we we we put money towards all youth sports. We let the
hall be used by the high school sports. I I that's all we're trying to do and keep it going. And that's all I have to say. Thank you very much for having me. Thank you, Mr. Castle. Mr. Dy, can you hear me? Yes. Okay. So, um I'm
just told by some sources that's what you get. So, I I know from the old board it was $2,500 a month and that goes back almost 20 years. So, I and that lease has been renewed a
number of times. So, you're telling me you're still only getting $2,500? Mr. Mr. Dy, excuse me. This is not a conversation between you and Mr. Carlson. This is a hearing in front of the board of appeals about an amendment to a special permit. So, understood. give it a fair fair amount of time to to
to um to make your points. If you've got something additional you'd like to add to the board, you're welcome to do so, but I can't let you get involved in a in a back and forth with Mr. Carlson. I apologize. No, you're welcome. No problem. Uh is that is that is that all
you you you have? That's it. Except for Miss Nerret is definitely um a neighbor um behind. So, I'm sure I've spoken to Bobby. He couldn't make it here tonight, but they were against this. They have been in the past every time I went to a
board's meeting with them. Yeah, I remember the hearing on the buses as well. Yep, that that's accurate. Um, Mr. Carlson, u uh uh do you have something you'd like to add to your testimony? Yes, sir. Besid Yes, sir. Besides what
he's saying about Miss Ner, she's not here to speak. I wish she was. We've been trying to work with her over the years. Um, and what we're going to do with the with the contractors that will, if we're allowed to have them there,
they will build a fence to make sure we have no problem with their property whatsoever. And again, and I got to say, everything this gentleman is saying is speculation. Okay. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Carlson. All right. I'm I'm going to unless there's somebody else who'd like
to be heard on on new information to present it to the board or if Mrs. McCreick has something that she'd like to add or if any of the board members have a question. her in the face. Sorry. Did he hear that? I think so.
Oh, that's not good. Oh, that's not good. Um Mr. Carlson, you might want to be muted. Yeah, I messed up there. Okay. U M Mr. Unless there's somebody uh else who would like to be be heard. Miss O'Donnell, did you have a question? No.
Okay, fine. All right. Um I'm going to close the evident entry portion of the hearing and uh discuss the merits of the application in accordance with the open meeting law. U one one more raised hand from an iPhone unidentified.
Pardon me a moment. Okay. Maybe please identify your your yourself and your your name and your address for the board, please. Hello. Yes. Hey, how you doing? Uh my name's uh Dan Tan Lane. I'm on the uh
Eboard up there at uh 114 and um I I see firsthand what our what we've done since last April as far as what we've given back. I have two children that live in the town that go to that go
to school and play sports and to be able to then I've been I've been a member since I got out of the service there and getting on the board and be able being able to decide and help allocate with these other gentlemen on the board to where this money is going especially for
these youth sports. Uh Steve Novak, Milton American Baseball, um Mary Fireband, uh Tim Allen, Christine Brown, parents of children in in active uh organizers in each sport. Uh Steve
always says to me, "Listen, we love very much that we have Milton American Legion as a yearly sponsor." um not because of who we are, what we do, is because a lot of sponsors in these towns, especially in Little League from what I've seen, I've coached there. You got like
families of children who will uh sponsor a team if they have a have a business and then a couple years later um when their child's out of the league, their sponsorship goes with them. Not I mean that's just how it is. It's it's great that they do that but the way I see it I
I see what we're doing and we could be a sponsor for years and years to come. Um we have that ability to do we have such a resource over there in the land and we want to do everything we can to be good to the neighbors as far as aesthetics
and things like that. The things that Mr. D is talking about as far as what we get and you know what we're doing with the money. He has zero idea what it is and I I'm shaking thinking about the things he's saying because of the the work I've been putting into that that
place. It's just it's it's it's hard to hear. Um he has no idea what we've went through and what we're doing to try to resurrect this place. I I've been donating pretty much a full-time. I'm a firefighter and anytime I'm out the firehouse I'm down there. Um, the guys
that are with that are with me on this, they're honorable, all served. They served their communities as first responders now. Um, I grew up in the neighborhood. I took a bus with all the kids around Courtland to Collie Cart Elementary.
Um, we uh we need this. We need this. And um the idea of a special permit to come up for review um these things that we're telling you that these contracts going to do, they're going to do it. We need them. They're going to help us because we do we do have um issues with
that that uh that parking lot. Um they can help us with that. Uh Kevin Dy who's got trucks over there. Um the conservation commission had issues with the amount of trucks. He's moved them. They're gone. He's also helps us in the winter with with part of his license agreement. He does all our snow removal.
Um you know, it's like a a relationship we need. Um, it's it's it's vital that we have this and and I hope I hope you guys consider all of everything that we do, not in the town with what we're giving. We have the ability to do so much more. I look at like, you know, the
town we we we we asked the residents of about an override of of $10 million. I was for it. I I I'm full disclosure, I was for it. I have friends for siblings or teachers. And then but on top of that, you know, here we are. We're
giving back. We want, you know, I'm I'm sorry I go on, but thank you for hearing me out. Mr. Lane, with points been made, we appreciate your um your your your testimony. Um is is that is that the end of your testimony, Mr. Lane? Yeah. Yes, sir.
Thank you for hearing me. Okay. You're welcome. Uh Mr. Dy, I've closed the evidentary portion of the hearing. Do you have something you'd like to add? Mr. Dory, I understand that the post does do
a lot of wonderful things, but what we're up to discuss tonight is the parking 24 hours of all these trucks and heavy duty equipment and it's ugly. That's all I can say. That's all I want
to leave it with. Thank you. Fair point. Okay. Um uh Mr. Garvey. All right. I'll be quick. Um what I'm hearing is the trucks. The trucks. Mr. Dy lives across the street
from the park and ride. That is a state lot. That is disgusting. Um the the Legion is nowhere near as bad as that. I just I I just don't see Yeah. I I just don't see, you know, it's we're not
talking apples and oranges here. We're basically talking if the view of that is has he gone to the state. I I mean that's pretty much all I have to say other than obviously the other party that was in disagreement stands to profit from the
land if it was sold. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. And that's This is my neighborhood and for years people have been trying to knock it down across the street and put up highrises. It's just disgusting that every few years we have to come back to
this. It's somebody just trying to attack this, you know, small plot of land. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Garvey. Um, all right. The the evidentary portion of the hearing is is over. Um, I appreciate everybody's testimony and I think the board is has given people ample time to testify. Uh,
let me uh let me get back to the the point I was making uh asking my members of the board if they'd like to be heard about the merits of the application in accordance with the open meeting law. Miss O'Donnell. Um, you know, I just would point out that actually I live in precinct 7 as
well as many of the speakers. Um, and I can appreciate the fact that every time we have another meeting before the ZBA or for the planning board that there's complaints about the traffic and the parking and etc etc. And as Mr. Mullen
knows well from his hearings for the um projects that have gone up in East Milton. So, um, you know, I I I'm appreciative of the idea that there's construction vehicles could avoid being parked on our streets and being parked
someplace in a parking lot. So, um, I don't really have any, uh, I have any questions. I, you know, as I said, I've done some, you know, research. I know the property pretty well. And um I would point out to some of the uh attendees that um the installation of cell phones,
as attorney Marian McTre pointed out, are protected use um under under state law. And so there wasn't really much that the town can do to avoid putting in a cell phone uh on a cell phone tower on a site. Um, and having negotiated many
of those leases myself with cities and towns, I'd be shocked to think that they were making $100,000 a year. Thank you, Mr. O'Donnell. Mr. Hart, anything you'd like to add? Sure. Um, so, uh, so I guess, um, I would say
first I'm I'm I'm in support of providing a variance with conditions. I you know I want to be supportive of the of the hall but just thinking narrowly about the variance question in front of us. Um, not a variance permit. It's a special permit. Pardon me. Pardon me.
You're you're you're right. I'm sorry. I misspoke. The uh Yes, the the uh question in front of us. Um the um I I don't have any uh personally I don't have any issues with the the the
request. I think that the um proposal to add the screening is directly responsive to the concerns of the complaint, which I appreciate. I think that could be an explicit condition um uh if provided. I like the idea of
making it time of of having them come back in whatever the case may be, three years um primarily to make sure that it works, that the screening in fact is effective. um that uh that it provides the kind of
uh shielding from uh potential unsightliness that uh neighbors have expressed concern about uh butterers have expressed concern about I think that that's appropriate. Um and if not we uh the whatever the board is then can either reconsider that condition or
reconsider the the um the request. So that's that's my view of of where this should land. Thank you Mr. Hart. I mean, I I let let me let me say as the acting chair here, I listened to the testimony, appreciate people's objections, and I was also on the panel about the buses, um, which seemed to me to be a
reasonable use, but was was objected to pretty significantly in that hearing, which is now, I believe, several years ago. Um, uh, that's the first point. Second point is we're talking about an amendment to the special permit. The standard, as Mrs. Netric indicated is
that the desired relief may be granted without substantial detriment to the public good and without substantially dergating from the intent and purposes of the bylaw. Uh to me, a part of what that's about, it's a balancing test. And and I I think that's indicative of the
testimony we've heard today where the board is really faced with um uh the the the potential impacts from the proposed use that would be permitted under the special permit with the potential benefits and whether or not the totality of that is consistent uh is both, you
know, not doing substantial detriment to the neighboring properties um or the or the public good um and and the overall con consistency with the bylaw. Uh I I think uh I I think this permit can be amended with conditions along the lines
of what we've talked about and I would like to propose to the board the following. I think the use needs to be articulated on a better defined plan. Whether that's a sketch or an engineer drawing I will leave to the building commissioner. But I don't think that the
plan we've got I think the plan we've got is adequate for the hearing. But I think if you were to take this to a proposed use, I'd like to see where the fence is exactly going to be and where the landscaping is going to be and I'd like to articulate how the gates are going to work and things like that. An
adequate plan. I'd like that plan to be submitted to the building commissioner. I'd also like that plan or propose that that plan go to the conservation commission because I think it's important that the conservation commission be put on notice
as to what the use is all about. I think that the screening needs to be a combination of planting and the six-foot fence that was shown on the drawing. Um uh the board this board
speak for myself, but I I'm going to say that this board is not um is not uh an expert in landscaping. And I would like to suggest that the appropriate kind of screening whether that's the evergreen
trees that have been shown or I mean the flowering trees or evergreen I I don't know but I do think the building commissioner will know the intent is that the screening be adequate to screen the use from the neighboring properties which is the real purpose of what the
screening is all about. And I would like to have a suggest that we have a condition to that effect. And lastly, I'd suggest that this use be limit, as Mr. Hard has suggested, that this use be limited to a three-year period and that the applicant be
affirmatively required to come back to the board um at the end of that or prior to the end of the three-year period to see whether or not it was appropriate that it continued to meet the standard of the bylaw that was then in effect.
Lastly, I think the special permit should be clear that the permit can be reviewed at any time that the board believes appropriate based on the facts and circumstances presented to the board through the building commissioner uh or otherwise. Um that's a I put that on the
table for the um for the members of the board to consider. Monnell um actually I like that idea. I was thinking that the time limit should be tied to the time limit for the cell tower so that those both could come, you
know, sort of at the same time. And that's four years, I think, is when Marth Mcketric said that the lease for the cell tower expired. It It's not the lease, it's your permit. Our permit. The board of appeals permit was for they're granted for five-year
periods apparently. and the and the the in 2024 you granted a 5-year permit this board. Well, not necessarily you, but Yeah. Right. Yeah. So, so I was thinking that I' I'd sort of because it
maybe that's a time to revisit the whole thing because who knows what's happening with the cell tower at that point. I agree. Yeah. Um board is deliberating right now. So, we're not taking testimony. Uh we've we've taken a testimony. So people who aren't particip you can listen of
course it's open meeting but we're not accepting testimony so people can be please be muted. Um uh Mr. Hart u uh Mr. Chair I I'm in agreement with that plan uh and it sounds sensible and I and I would vote to adopt it. I do have a question. Um one of the one of the
conditions that you place that sounds sensible to me is that a more detailed plan be presented to the building commissioner. Um my only question and maybe this is just a me question as opposed to anybody else question. Um would that is there um the the
commissioner would then have to approve it or is it sufficient to simply send it into the commission commissioner so that then uh the you know they they can proceed with building the screening and you know etc. Well, there's going to have to be consultation with the commissioner about the type of screening
I see uh that is going to be done to affect the purposes that the board is expressing at this hearing. So, one of the primary purposes of the plan is to articulate that uh that um screening specifically and be placed on file so that they can then be judged against as
to whether or not it's compliant. But as importantly, this plan would have dimensions on it would show the length and the depth of the parking areas, which I believe there are two. Um, so that was my thinking. I don't have I don't have an objection to um um the the
the the time period being being um timed with the with the cell tower. I I still want to make this more complicated than it needs to be. And I I was actually in favor of the three years because it seemed like a reasonable period of time to both make the investments that were
required. Oh yeah. It was just a suggestion to sort of say kind of just do it all, you know, sort of have it time, but I I don't have a problem with three. Yeah. Yeah. I I I'd rather actually stick with three. I think if you Okay. Um but I would say I mean as
because I've said on the planning board too where you really get into this kind of nonsense. Yes. Nonsense. I shouldn't say nonsense but you get into sort of detail is that you know I would say in the conditions that we would have the conditions would be the fencing as proposed by the applicant. I know
they've planted you know these lovely trees but you know they're not very big and I also would like to see um in in the sort of corner that's facing the neighborhood that there were evergreens because you want you know the flowering trees aren't going to be particularly
useful in the winter if we ever have winters again. So I think that's I think that's appropriate for the decision and but I think that the the type the extent the height the mass should be left to the professionals. Um that's that that's really the point with with the overall
intent of what that's all that that that that makes sense. All right. Let let me ask if there's anybody in the on the board who has an additional comment to be made about those conditions that have been outlaid with respect to the amendment of the special permit. None
from me. No, thank you. There's a motion on the table uh that would uh under which the vote the board would vote to adopt to issue to the applicant an amendment to the special permit along the lines articulated in this hearing.
Is there a second? Second. Yeah. All in favor? I I So moved. Uh I as well. The board has issued an amendment to the special permit conditional amendment. uh expressed by the test uh by the uh by
the um by the board in the open session that we've just had. Mrs. Mcketric, you well know the procedure that the board will follow. We write a decision. You'll be filed with the town clerk. You'll be provided with a copy uh uh for recording
um and and address it appropriately. In the meantime, I recommend that the applicant begin to uh make the preparatory steps in anticipation of working with the building commission commissioner and should uh probably also notify the building commissioner of this
hearing. Um given the fact that this was uh this was in response to a specific complaint. Um is there any questions other business before the board of appeals tonight? None for me, Mr.
like to um request a motion to adjourn the meeting. So moved. All in favor? I I uh it's 8:30 uh 8:26 p.m. on Thursday evening. The board of appeals is adjourned. Thank you very much. Thank
you. Thank you, Mr. Chair. You're welcome. Thank you, Mr. Kendrick. Thank you, everyone. Bye now. Thank you, board. Thank you. Good night. Good night all. Good night, Bill. Thanks. Thank you. Thank you.
Thank you. [Music]
rip it up. Rip rip.