##VIDEO ID:ZEYOTHKJsFM## to be we are recording the meeting roll call we have Randy Rous here Lisa Bloom here billberg here Jill twig here will Hackler here Patrick MC Phillips here Jun mcneel here and Lisa Martin on the committee members as faculty and staff we have Robin iy Nancy Hayes Brad Morgan Dr Reese and others back there right you're not sitting at the table so I'm not going to call you out overide for yeah may I get um we are going to remove the minutes from the consent agenda and bring those back next time is that okay Y is that okay I get a motion to remove or approve the consent agenda that is published so without that and June all right all in favor all any opposed any extensions all right Ming um I'm going to ask that we allow Mar to speak first and then we'll go to public comment so that you can have your nights back is that okay all right Meredith is the student recor go ahead um so for new updates for the student council this weekend last week we had our Veterans Day celebration which was very good we had over over 20 veterans in attendance which is a good numbers for us it was lovely I attended it was very lovely and this week we're selling candy for Thanksgiving but all proceeds are being donated to Lucy's love bus which is a cancer charity to help children help them receive free free therapies and actually next upcoming next week we're doing is Powderpuff which is at five and just in December we have our winter craft fair on December 7th with and we're planning out outside vendors and lots of different our school clubs and they're going to be selling things and it's just for fund um for our sports teams in our state tournament field hockey we lost in the sweet 16 and then our girl soccer lost two days ago in the Elite 8 and for gming tree which is the basically philan philanthropy at the school where we raise money and for in presentence for families in need during holidays uh we're beginning to distribute trees with tags on them like basically describing what families need and like to like different like you'll see them inside the schools and local businesses so like feel free to like take one and if you if you can just like take one and fill out fill out the tag and just um like if you want you can get the item that's on the tag and then donate it I think that's it thank you thank you yes and giving tree pick them up as you leave right they're right in the lobby they should be and they're awesome thank you and congratulations for the P 16 for the and um the soccer team went on for the elate sorry it was great to see all right now we are on to public Communications we have Diane here Diane Melle I'm gonna your last name Melle B roelle I'm gonna ask that you come up to I took the time to write this out so I didn't miss what I wanted to say I understand some of my comments and questions may be premature since the public comments are before your presentation but I would be remiss if I didn't address them I understand the school committee is looking to close ashb Elementary in PA thornbrook and move the children to Spalding to satis it and possibly sanook in high school while I understand the budget has been an issue for years I feel like this would be a last ditch effort I wanted to know if anyone has done a transportation study to see if the increased cost of busing kids further way to school and the longest time a child would physically be on the bus I want to know if anyone has physically measured the space at the schools in question Spalding Squan isit in the high school to see how many how much physical space is available how many students will be in each classroom by grade currently at hawbrook seventh and eighth graders have 30 students per class how many more are going to be added to that amount is there a fire code regulation for how many you can put in a classroom is there a legislative reason or how many could be in a room at time excuse me what about the lunchroom currently they eat by grade seventh grade 8ighth grade you're looking at 200 plus kids can they accommodate that are they are the kids still going to be able to get their recess if you move eth grade to the high school how are you going to integrate eighth graders into upper classmen are you going to keep them separate what are you going to do for the transition I represent CPAC so I have kids who are you know have anxiety depression disabilities and other things that transitions just dayto day are a struggle for them but now you're talking about uprooting them busing them you know Two Towns over are you going to have open houses for them are they going to have an opportunity to meet teachers do are they going to know who their teachers are are they going to have a chance to tour the school and meet other kids these are all some of my questions sanart doesn't have a kitchen if you move kids over there what are you going to do for the meals what happens to the old schools you shut them down if we have a surgent population of people move to the district are you just going to be able to open the doors or is the state and OSHA G to say ahh ah you have to bring those schools up to code before anybody further Gos in and then you Smooch more kids into a classroom these are all things that are concerning to me sincerely there is not enough room at any of these buildings to accommodate all of these children so I know you're going to have to split up where each child goes to the school and someone made a comment online who said I would rather close the district schools then lose teachers but how can you not lose teachers in the process because you can't tell me that the teachers from Ashby are going to have room at squ at Squan cook and Spalding and you can't tell me that the teachers at h are all going to have their own space at ntis so you have to have staff reduction and I have gone over the budget since last year and I know that staff is the number one expense so at that expense how are you going to know how many teachers you need for next year when are these teachers going to be notified and what are the measurements for deciding who stays and who goes this is just some of my questions that I have come up with off the top of my head as a parent as somebody who supervises lunches and I could give you a mile long list more but I would be remiss if I didn't say that the last time you guys made an arbitrary snap decision and remove Librarians it was the librarian herself who came to this meeting and educated all of you that you were going to lose valuable resources for these teachers if you didn't pay for them because you were removing Librarians from elementary and middle school before any of this is done I kindly ask that all of these question questions I have and more are researched debated and finally made a decision on that's going to make sense for the students the teachers and the parents of this district and I think if you come to all that I think you'll realize that closing schools is not in anyone's best interest thank you thank you [Music] hi J Aral so I have um a different suggestion I'm from peil sorry and I feel like this district is kind of a dinosaur I don't think that Peril is in the same place it was when towns and Nash PE got together one the district I think we all have different interests at heart and I understand the need and desire to want to keep school but at the same time I feel as though peol is putting in enough money tax dollarwise because we've been bled into by the towns like dustable and other areas where people can't afford to buy a house that you move in you buy a million dollar house you expect to have a district that's going to be able to meet your needs so we don't want to bus our kids either we don't want to be paying 10 11 122,000 a year to B kids I understand that you want to keep the buildings open and maybe you can do that maybe what can happen is towns in Ash can be their own District up until 8th grade PE could be their own up until 8th grade and we keep the high school as a district that's shared amongst all three towns I don't see why that's something that's not explored um I don't think the answer is to keep cutting into the capital funds I don't think the answer is to keep kicking the ball down the field obviously we're all trying to keep something to float that's not working and we all have different interests I think that's an okay thing I think things evolve over time and that's something that really should be explored I don't think that trying to breathe air into something that's clearly sing is going through work much longer thank you the chair excuse me I'm sorry there was another name um Patrick M was listed I don't know he decided not okay just wanted to make sure that thank you all right my chairperson happy news here and share that Robin Ivy was awarded the executive assistant of the year for the Massachusetts Council of school communties administrative personel um she was awarded last Friday and superintendent Morgan Dr Reese and myself were able to celebrate and give her her award the c um yes I'm sorry I just saw a message that I missed from five minutes ago Diane Rolo is online and would like to speak so I'm just going to put it out there on the it's specific speically says on our agenda that you need to be in person or you can't be in person submit it so um it's it's [Music] certainly certainly up to you and I yeah we don't have the capabilities of doing hrid yeah do she have something that she would like to subit um do you want me to have her email something to read okay or I she's on so I think she can hear us right now so Diane if you want to email the committee um it will be read aloud in the meeting we're gonna move on for a second get that did you report I do right I'm going to ask for the new business items since it is the setting of the school committee goals the superintendent goals and the talking of the church I think we need to move these to a different meeting as I think the goals really need to focus around setting up the budget and we have a big budget discussion for that does anyone have any concerns about being this from the committee so okay to move to the budget everyone is good with that the budget did you send something uh yeah no she's asking for the email um we can we can Circle back to it at the end of the meeting or um I do have a statement that I'm going to read I'd like to remind the school committee that we are charged with providing the best education for our children of our district that being said there is always going to be difficult decisions and discussions especially since we are held to the current strains of our budget the money we don't have it the state's not handing us the money we need this discussion to be transparent and open to the public so the public the caregivers and our taxpayers truly understand the financial crisis that North Middle sex Regional School District is experiencing we are at this Crossroads due to unfunded mandates from the state and federal levels and the state funding formula for Regional Schools is broken and not funding this appropriately I think it's safe to assume that the state and federal governments are not rushing into help us today in the future perhaps but the wheels of government take time to do their work it's time that we do not have and M wait we can't wait to educate our children in our towns we need to educate them so we need to answer this crisis locally this we're going to display um what the funding we need to find it's a $3 million funding issue that this district is facing we have two options that we are going to discuss and lead in discussion tonight we're going to talk about overrides and we are going to talk about the closure of buildings a 1.5 million staff cuts and 500,000 in Nance and technology and curriculum all of these things impact our communities and our children breing the thing I don't want to get into is the weeds meaning we will not be going line by line in our budget and talking about it we will not be talking about who is getting cut or the configuration of our schools tonight we need to give Brad and his team a clear Direction where to take us it needs to be transparent to the public and I have one closing remark we need to be kind to one another I don't want anyone fighting yelling screaming or running out of the room this is going to be civil and we're going to handle it swiftly all right now I'm handing it over to Will and he is going to discuss our issue right yeah so obviously um Monday night we have the public forum and we're going to be discussing this things we talked about this a month ago we obviously had our Workshop we spent um and I'm sorry man's name there didn't spoke earlier yes yes what was your name again relle relle relle you know thank you for your comments there so you know we we did meet uh an executive session last week uh we spent three and a half hours in that meeting discussing a lot of things um obviously we did an executive session because it it certainly becomes very apparent on individuals when you discuss buildings and things like that you know so it's not our place to do that necessarily in public but you know certainly we've talked about it you know we are here's our early estimate as you can see um straight you know as I look at it on the math side of things you know $3 million we had 66 million last year so $3 million roughly 5% increase over the prior year and if you've heard me talk before or if you look in the details of the budget you know roughly 40% of our funding or Revenue comes from the state the other 60% comes from the towns so if you back into the math on that I'm sure we have some Math teachers here that we can talk about this but you know you're talking about an average increase to the towns around 10% so I know that last year there's attempted overrides didn't necessarily go through um the towns have sent us the letter that you know we're relying on the discussions from them that they can afford a 3% increase over last year to the towns not 10 so as much as we would like to consider an override we certainly need to discuss Plan B and plan B with cuts considers building or buildings and a lot of staff and this is the spot we're in so whether you know none of us like that scenario I understand that especially you know in the town here as a taxpayer as someone who has kids in the school or has had kids in the school too um you know I know this is not a good situation but the state and in the 10 11 years that I've been dealing with school committee here it the increases we get year over-year have always been a fraction of a percent just the increase in cost on infl just puts the more of a burden on the towns every single year that we do that discussion the clarification in our packet is um a budget summary that has a 2.9% increase and that include um all of these increases and does that 3.2 million projected over FY 26 taken into account what would be 5% oh sorry 3% to the towns no no 3% to the towns so we're at 66 million 3% to the towns like a half a percent increase less than 1% the budget could increase for the towns right but what is that amount I mean just so we know you the number that 3.2 would be level funded if I'm reading all this or listening correctly I learn no increas to the T that somewhere here oh you're asking for what a level services for what the 3% would be how much with level Services I'm assuming this is the level Services budget that we got put in front of us so we know exactly what it cost to keep the services we have now um but you need to minus out the 3% of towns to say that they can you know afford and then we know how much we have a gap between what the town's can afford and what we have for local Services the Gap is like 2.9 right now okay that's fine but it is a different number well that's not the Gap that's just the increase over prior year so right that's then that's what I'm asking without debt I'm asking for that U that Gap yeah so the the increase year-over-year 25 to 26 the increase without the debt service is 3.28 7 that is what will was mentioning is like a 10% so if we're going you're trying to get it's it would be 66113 to get to 3% so it's less it's 05% increase in the budget or $229,000 to get the to so we basically have to level fund the budget to give a 3% essentially because we have less Revenue no I understand that so there the only place to get the only place to play with is the town's yeah no I I do understand that I have a question just because I haven't heard it talked about yet this year but I um recall moving to the GIC for health insurance would be a savings this year is that still happening and what is the savings on that excuse me so we would have to talk um we would need Amory weigh in part of the part of moving to the GIC involves some level of negotiation and some level of cost sharing as well at least for the first year um so last year was unknown as to whether or not they're actually would be a sa use after the cost sharing was implemented Nancy correctly if I'm wrong I'm saying that properly um and actually um I I think that the the health insurance we got this year ended up being pretty fair and pretty comparable as far as a price increase goes so I know that that's something that's ongoing that's being looked at we do have a consultant looking at that for us and looking essentially weighing the pros and the cons but we do have to wait until all of the claims have been settled from last year to see where we stay because when we when the show B Minute Man dissolved we still have some outstanding claims that have not been set up as yet and that is not that process has not been completed likely going to take a couple more months for that to happen and that's something that they do not that's not something we have any control over so we do have to see where we stand to see if there'll be anything coming back to the district which is unlikely or um how much of the money we set aside we'll have to use to cover those points okay um but to switch to the GIC wasn't that like a January deadline so we would be missing that again so that's something again the consultant is looking at the options for us as we have doing it on that behalf last year do we have an idea when we will have that information from not untila inside so it'll be very close J but it's very possible that even moving to the GIC after it's negotiated um it it is possible that there won't be a savings compared to what we currently have and it could initially cost the district more money based on my understanding through what's negotiated to STS cost sharing in Year One District placements number that's up there um I know we're already over for the year and that's an estimate from that is this also taking to account that if we have more out of me out of District uh placements that we also get more circuit breaker next year that we could put towards this so it's really not our one for one yeah this is assuming we're going to use additional circuit breaker questions on front I'll just add I I do think that the biggest problem that we're facing is obviously if we move FY 25 level service budget into this year that's the number that we're looking at and even talking about an override that's something that we likely won't have an answer answer to until something point from June um if and when that election happens so if we do have to cut that amount of money that is not something that can wait until June obviously looking at like the bargaining agreements and things of that nature we do have to pay attention to any type of playoff dates or anything um with regard to that but on top of that we also have to be able to schedule buildings and scheduling the buildings um if a high school level is something it could take a couple months I would imagine it takes a similar amount of time to do with the middle and elementary schools as well so that we make sure that they're proberbly sta so I I think it would be very very challenging to wait for an override vote in June because of it weren't successful having to make that type of a reduction at that point in time would be very difficult matter the saing as I've said before this is not something this is not a North Middle sex problem it's happening in gr Dunville boxboro and Tucket fright pretty much every Regional School District is encountering this due to an Antiquated fform which continues to base its funding formula on student enrollment as opposed to student need and student needs are going up and enrollment is plateaued and we get year after year we get the same amount of money from the state um North Middle sex is not really getting any benefit at all from the student Opportunity Act and the governor has stated that she will not look at other educational issues until the student Opportunity Act is fly fund with the close of FY 27 and I think the student Opportunity Act last year gave us an extra $30 per student which doesn't even cover the cost to a full time this coration restore stabilization transfer of $150,000 again I'm looking in our packet that we have the draft um FY 26 general fund budget um it has right I know this year we we cut it for FY 25 instead of 250,000 go to the capital stabilization and only put in 100,000 um the draft here is showing 400,000 making up what we cut last year and this year that that's includes the opab so it's 150 opab 250 stabilization okay thank um yeah discussion are we going for an override or I I I think it's the only responsible thing how much this the amount probably not we'd have to discuss what we would go for but um we are all on this committee and we are all charged by all the community members to present the best possible education for the students um and think we would be Miss without trying I I I agree we need to plan yeah um because last year we didn't get there's no guarantee we're going to get it and I have no problems going down the pathway of planning if we don't get it um but I I I cannot stay on this committee um if we don't even try anyone else just just a question so when it comes to the override and again that's something that the community absolutely has to decide that the only concern would be is that if these decisions if a decision is made and we're actually making a decision to reduce whether it be buildings or staff um in Le of an override or waiting foror an override it would be just with the educator shortage that is out there now I think it would be extremely challenging to fill any vacant positions that we have if we have in fact weight off staff as part of a plan to reduce that number I think a June override vat would be turn around be too quick to fill positions if we were awarded those positions back so I don't know if there's anything that can be done if there's a push for an override to have an override ballot done in the winter I'm not sure the logistics of that that have to be discussed I think with the towns again the only concern I have this it's it's very challenging to find teachers now and to find our professionals now so to find them after we've lost potentially a large number would be extremely difficult because I know districts are hiring people with emergency licenses at those point and on top of that even even that has become very very jobs that previously would gued 400 applications 10 years ago guar less intend now and many of whom are are not licensed appropriately for those positions I know that um most Town meetings don't have to name but I know that they run their elections April Che because peil did it had a special town meeting and got it on the ballot so it got into the April ballot so towns can have special meetings to get it to the town B so it's an early one and since they all run an election in April possibly they could put it on the April I'd be certainly open to that um in the winter time i' be little leery that our numbers would be way different than what we need and I'm not sure the process of being able to change the amount that we're asking for after a ballot vote has been gone through I wouldn't want to put a number there and then when we finally get numbers from the stage and other things that we have really good news and we don't need everything that we ask for by large amount Nancy when do we get the numbers from the state like the true numbers and Numbers Never don't till July but they get the the governor's proposal comes out towards the end of January so January because I don't know the appetite for the towns to run a special election I'm not sure we'd have to talk to the towns and make sure that they are willing to run their elections too yeah and I know Dave is in the back Dave from Asing the backom I don't know if you have any insight on what ashb wants to do with their if they would run a special C that's okay sorry I don't want to put you on the spot with it but I mean you could run the election so maybe we charge the ton leison is figuring out if the tones would run the special election when do you need the when do you need the time but I mean do we want to do I mean I I would have to talk to the middle and high school the middle and elementary principle I I know that come April the high schools forense and purposes schedu at that point in time um so we would need to have an earlier election than April it would it would be great if we could have it close to the budget adoption possibly inbr March just also the public hearing and February at some point we are going to the state step in and fund us we go too late are we have the same situation we had last year where the override fails and now it's it's too late to I it's almost too late to cut teachers that happened last year right we had to cut teachers before we knew we saved you what do we what do we do that if the override fails and we're still at 3 million in that late what can we even cut because I mean the first meetings we had the discussions where I need answers on specific things by November or December in February now we're pushing to March so I just don't want to be caught where we are next year and burn what little Capital we have left and have you know buildings that all do need work and all could have an emergency I would think that we would need to have a plan in place in December what could occur if the override does not pass and to plan for that because there is no way to cut potentially over $3 million from the budget in April or anytime after that point there just there there's no way to do it it's not possible because then at that point you're talking what's likely just going to be a a cut to staff $3 million which is isn't even it's it's not even possible this something Dr reany I don't think the two are mutually exclusive I think we can go for an override um figure out number um that we think you know what we think we can from that V for an override and plan for not having override so does senor have a plan for the non override does the plan need to be finalized or do you just need to have what it's going to be so you can take a couple of months to work out the details I I think that we need to have some plan in place that if the override were to fail what what our fall back in general terms like we're gonna you know cut so much in staff cut so many buildings cut this cut that yes but not the details okay so I think we can certainly give direction um as far as what we what would be acceptable to plan for by December um provided we get information um that we need to make those decisions and at the same time look at the budget figure out you know what we think we can live with and go for an override if that's the case I I do understand that some sometimes bit change takes a lot of time to plan and that's fine this is a um we want to discuss what kind of changes we would be okay with and think about it and then on we can certainly discuss things and discuss information that we don't have to date uh and when we're going to get that to make CS what information and then we need to discuss what information is needed that we need to get and I I know some of the information that we need right some of the information I've already discussed with you if we are going to uh cut a building or more than one building um the capacities what what capacity are we at the district as far as how much free space there is what does one building cut due to that capacity what does two buildings cut do that to that capacity because I will not cut um and leave us no capacity to increase in the future it's not fair to the district it's not fair to the towns um we need room for a little bit of growth whether it be um you know the towns are NBTA um towns for Ash and town I believe both of them uh approved it so that's the possibility of families coming into the district um you never know when a development comes in PPP will have one on the table for a little while with a 100 families um it's not on the table anymore as far as I understand but you don't know when things like that happen and you cannot cut your capacity in the district to nothing so I would definitely capaces before I made any decision yeah working with Jen on that information so um no I just wanted to say that I do support um pursuing an override over building closures um and massive staff cuts um I don't think nine people in a room should be the ones making the decision for everybody in all of the towns that we need to let the towns people have a voice and decide whether they want to support this or not um and I just wanted to mention to you that Diane Rolo did send a statement um so I want to make sure that I will see that say yep I didn't want to interrupt the discussion um I do yes it is hard to be on the N9 person team and make this decision and it is going to be up to the town's people to step forward if they want this override but that being said even if they get the override this year we could be back next year asking for another override so I want everybody to understand that and it's important for the public to understand because the costs are not going down and the state is not stepping in for a few more years possibly so to make that clear it's not maybe the last time that we will be back asking for another over if we have our budget we shouldn't be back next year and we can't say how long but the last time we had an override it lasted 12 years and we were back doing an override last year last year was 12 years was 2012 when we got overrides before last year asked for that so we can't we want to come back this year because we did not get one yeah but again with cost going up and possible even funding going away we have to tell the public we could end up with another overrun I think it's important for them to understand that as well go ahead question Randy so we didn't do it for for 12 years how how did we meet the budget because the cost gone up income hasn't gone up so we've done it through Cuts over the years um look at our historical increases in our budgets y um over the 12 years the average over some years a little bit higher some years a little bit lower but we average somewhere around three to three and a half per. increas increases and obviously that's over the 3% for the towns and the towns have been able to accommodate that in some of the years that have been higher um there's a growth that happens in the town so sometimes they can accommodate one or 3% um I know they had Cuts we we've gone back and forth in years that we haven't improved as much they've obviously had more for their towns so we have not had you know 8 10% increases in our budget uh year after year after year so the last time we did this and it failed the first time we sent the budget back in the town and it got rejected we didn't make any Cuts we didn't make a single cut we just sent it back that was my first meeting I I I feel like if we don't actively make cuts and show them that we're trying this override is not going to pass right and that's what I said I didn't say we necessarily going to go for that number we need to discuss what number we would like to send look at our budget see what we think we can do with that being said without being detrimental to the towns or to the students and we'll see where we come up with that being said I don't know how seven buildings is feasible at the rate we're going it may not be um but again I don't have information to even know about capacities to be able to start to talk about whether one building or any buildings can be cut in the district well we started that work [Music] chair I move we direct the superintendent to put together a plan B which includes closing buildings and reducing staff in order to this deficit rejected deficit second question are we going do a plan a prior sorry sorry this between now and then are going to continue to work on fining the bud prior to over what said need to work up and it's like it will be the finance committee will look at subit we look at things I mean we need to help in this it is our our day no I understand that I I thought we pl ni to come up with plan plan tonight is to direct the superintendent to start working on and and what kind of boundaries we haven't discussed boundaries what it can and cannot include in that or leaving it open and vote on made a motion need a second discussing second I would why not give the boundary of three point whatever because um the education of the students and what we as a board feel is of the direction of the district is not all about numbers I can come up probably come up with $ 3.28 7 million all kinds of different ways in the budget that are not good for towns they're not good for the students they're not good for the teachers they're not good for any of the staff so boundaries AG but we don't have something to look at to vote on which is our charge to vote for this for the town people then we have maybe discuss some boundaries I mean you know you come back with a um plan that puts 35 students in a classroom do we want to put a limit on that do we want to put a limit on the number of buildings if it comes back and says you know what I think we can squeeze everybody into the high school and we're going to get rid of five buildings again do we want to put boundaries um I know um I I'll talk about the elephant in the room which is Ashby Elementary which we've been on the chopping block and talked about for five years now um I would put that as a boundary that Ashby does not get looked at not unless it is an absolute 100% Last Resort and the reason being Patrick let me finish is um we value Community all right it's in everything that we do we talk about how we have a partnership with the towns and we need to make sure that we have strong towns and strong Town services along with our budget uh that we can educate the students we talk about um Community as being something that helps everybody and yet some people want to put one Community above another in Ashby their Community is around their schools as it is in a lot of schools or a lot of towns I mean we go back uh the 14 years or so when the Fitz in peil was closed that was a hard thing there were a lot of sore uh people that were very upset with that building closing it was uh something in the town that had been there for a very long time people had very strong feelings about that building but they had alternatives to what that building stood for they had alternatives for the uh student Centric and the kids Centric and the family Centric things that went on in that building and that brought the community together in that building they were able to they do town meetings they do voting they do all kinds of Productions and everything in other buildings the fit wonderful thing now that now after many years become a community center um but it did sit for many many years and was a very big controversy in the town about what was going to be done with that building in Ashby they have the same kind of community around their school kids know it's their home in their Town families come together for events There community comes together to see the kids perform they have their Town meetings in that Hall they do a lot of community work in that school and what that school stands for in that town they do not have an alternative taking that away from that town without an alternative would negatively and for a very long time hurt and damage that community so how can we say that we're for community in one place and not in another those are the reasons why I look at ashy as something that we really need to work at to try and preserve it is not the only alternative in the district but it is only welcome back to it just from a financial standpoint point it is it is one of the older buildings in the district it's not owned by the school district it houses the least number of students which gives it the highest per student cost I I understand all those reasons Ash people still own the building and if they want to do that they they can turn that building into anything they want if they want it to be a community center they can vote and fund it and that's fine like I feel like I'm getting a lot of black over over looking at from my first day here what I've heard from will is we have we have too many buildings based on the dart studies based on the third party studies I've WR Ashby was even looked at and suggested with with dollar values to get it up and running and I keep getting $300,000 thrown at me and that's literally a drop in the bucket based on the studies that were done before Co like I like so it if you have a better way I'd rather save whatever amount of money we we save on teachers and and close a building then have to cut teachers and save a building that is still financially struggling all of our buildings are struggling we don't have Capital anymore we can't maintain seven buildings if a roof goes on one our capital is gone it's just not it's not practical and and if you want to prevent another override you need to cut overhead and I'm not saying that we shouldn't but taking things off the table like Ashby taking things off the table like Ashby like just hand handcuffs Brad I mean you said what if he wants to throw everyone in the in the high school I think Brad's going to come up with educated decisions his his job is to do what's best for the district and the students as well like I just don't understand what what boundaries you would set 30 35 through classroom we're talking about cutting 1.5 million in teachers we might hit 35 per classroom without even touching the schools or looking at the schools and need more still so putting boundaries on it doesn't make any sense whatsoever and I keep and I keep hearing oh he just wants to close Ashby I I would love to close no schools I'd love to be fully funded and have a fun time here talking about what we could spend our excess money on that would be great we don't have that option and this is a hard decision and it's not fun and I agree everything has to be looked at but we've met we we've met and talked about these things we've looked at the budget you you had one list of suggestions that maybe had like a couple hundred, in savings maybe but I'd still rather spend that on teachers than on buildings I just don't understand what we're what we're doing here thank you um first I wanted to say thank you to Randy for conveying a a lot of Ash concerns um the school is the Hub of our community we have pretty much no businesses no stores no anything I went to school at ashb elementary and when I bought my first home in Fitchburg I knew when I started a family that I was going to move back to Ash because I wanted my kids to go to school at Ashby Elementary because that's how much it means to people that live in that town that aside if we're not going to talk about what's best for the students and the community we have to think about the longterm effect from closing a Town's only building already based on discussions of the last few years we've had people moving out of town based on threats of closure um and if this is pursued we are going to lose more families if the school closes we will not have new families moving into town ASP enrollment will decrease and by default peil and town in enrollment will automatically increase when we're basing a number of 100% and that doesn't even count the people from Ashby that might move to Townsen and peil so Townsen and peil budget numbers will definitely no matter what be increasing if ashb Elementary closes so you have to think about the effects that it will have across the demographic of our entire community that aside um well anyhow I I do think that Ashby should be completely off the table it is a safe building on the ashb elementary building chair I just toured it even as recently as a couple days ago and the boiler redundancy we have the second boiler now that's no longer a question the tunnels were evaded pipes can be fixed if they need to if something goes wrong there's not the L ing safety issues that people are talking about our town put up $300,000 and address that already and is making more improvements now um all of that aside what my original comment was going to be um and though I do think ashy should be completely off the table in this um is that I don't think we should be charging Brad with any plan b or anything right now we just put out a press release to the public and in that press release it said Community input is vital and will guide the committee's decision making we have not yet received any Community input we haven't had our Forum that's Monday and we're four days from now let's give the community a chance to give us some more budget cutting ideas let's let them tell us what is important what they might want to see off the table as well let's hear what they have to say we can't put out a press release and say that it's vital and it's going to guide our decision making if we're not and we're just going to be making decisions on our own anyway let's start with that and then let's get give the community an actual chance to respond because it also says we'll accept a small number of questions as time allows that does not give people to chance to digest what's happening it does not give them a chance to reach out and respond we could have a line of people and say sorry we gave everybody the first five people two minutes and we're not listening to anyone that's I don't want that to happen I want to actually be able to listen to all the other people that have input on this so we can really make an informed decision so I do propose that we have a second follow-up Forum if we're not going to allow enough Community feedback at this initial one but I don't think we should be having any Vote or making any decision on anything until we actually listen into the community so I know that it's important to listen to the community and it's hard because I do see the fighting amongst all the three towns and we all and every town is unique in its different ways but it doesn't answer our $3 million issue that we're facing we need to figure out a plan to tell Brad because it's not fair to the people in our audience that are listening either we need to give him some kind it's not fair to tell them that they're going to have an opportunity to give input and make decisions without their input CH I hear Joe but I I have to disagree with you we are elected by those Town people our job is to make a decision our job is to do s about this p and you know I've sat here on this a number of years and I can tell you that people have a very little comment has come out of it they expect us to do this this is our job to do this so yes I mean it's important to get input but that's it's important for each one of us to go get input it's not necessarily important for us to hold 47 meetings and you know and make sure that everything's done our job is to vote and if we don't vote on it we're not doing our job I don't think anyone said we're not going to vote on it I think we're asking for information she just said tonight because we don't have information right and we don't have the input from the community that we asked for in four days so I I think there's a General sense of what would get us there already we've been presented something we can certainly throw that out there I don't know if we're going to be discussing some of those on Monday um so there's already a general idea and from that I'm not ready to vote on a specific Direction I Would like to have more information and set some boundaries because no I even if we have to try and cut $3.2 million 35 in a classroom is not acceptable to me so I mean we can if we vote tonight we're just going to vote down anything that comes up that's not acceptable I think it's only fair that we give the superintendent an idea of what we actually might be open to is is the vote just to have him look for options am I missing something it's for him to just look at all the possible options so we're not we're not finalizing options are different than coming to us with a plan yeah options give us a lot more flexibility than plan if it's options fine you want to throw out options that I can vote for if it's just individual options and things that we can do to cut and then we can go through that list and say yes yes no yes yes no that's fine but the motion I believe was to come to us with a plan B which is a whole plan on what he thinks is going to and we're not setting boundaries for that one plan welcome to amend motion record just trying to get us to vote to give them Direction um I will amend the vote that Brad brings options to start working on options for the school committee to consider uh to be able to give him boundaries on full plan second comment that um um the the direction we're going to give them what your um um proposing is to give superintendent Morgan put together a plan with a plan of boundaries to put together a plan of options for us to take a look at so that we can set boundaries on what we what would be acceptable to us um to be able to put it together in a plan how many are we talking just one or two I mean how many plans is this man GNA have to come up with or options I mean he's only one person let's be clear oh I asked how many it's not just I think it's because we're facing this way talking U my my intention was not to have a full-fledged plan put together but a list of options and how much it would save so that we can take a look and see so we're going around and around on this what are we talking for timing so our next meeting as a full committee is December 3rd oh we could sched I'm saying probably schedule one for December 3rd it's on Tuesday it's should probably be held in person yeah that's not on schedule yet not on schedule no it's not regular meeting is scheduled for the 12th talking about adding the meeting I'm thinking that we need to schedule one for December 3rd it is on a Tuesday because I coming back from the holiday I think everyone should have the Monday I was GNA say depending I mean depending on you know how much time Brad would like to have for coming up you know and putting down the options I believe that there's already a number that he has already we can meet as early as next week uh next Thursday after the um Community input we can discuss get there input and then discuss boundaries I think I would like more time give them more time that's just my feeling is that we need to give them some time give them the holidays allow them to come up with their options because it does I mean Jeremy has worked on things and everybody and you see we need a lot of them so sorry go ahead I was just goingon to say we have a billing committee meeting on the third so if we could move the time to 6:30 or 7 um be thank you and this one on the third would be in person so would we be asking the superintendent to um excuse me superintendent Morgan to um come up with a list or a menu of things of cuts to make or are we asking him to put together a proposal if we did this we could get there if we did this we could get there I I was looking for a list because it is a lot less in Tex of trying to put them together so if we're going to close one building yeah if we close this building it's this kind of a savings we close building it's kind of savings if we uh cut so many teachers um or staff it's this kind of a savings if we um you know look at cutting andology that came up it's this amount of money that we're looking at and we could use that and the input that and say you know okay I I can see doing this I can't see doing that I otherwise I'd be happy to sit here and and and at least throw out some ideas about some boundaries I'm happy to sit here and throw some out and vote on as a committee on some boundaries for him now I think boundaries is the bad word here I think maybe if we called it something else it might be better Rob what is the what is the embedment we have sweet Jesus you bar won't um so we have two two motions on the floor the first one is your motion yeah and the second one is Randy's um which is to um consider to develop a list of options and savings so we would need a vote on whether to amend the first and then an actual vote on the motion I I I think that we need some level of if we're going to put the time in which is a considerable amount of time I I'd rather have some idea as to what the parameters are so that we're not wasting time with a parameter that won't even be entertain that makes sense so excuse me it makes sense I just don't want to put time into something then say that that it's not something will and that's just it's not just me this is not done in isolation this is done with with a team so sounds like we need to put parameters on it to allow him to do this but do we want to give him the options first come up with options take that vote and then clear that off the floor and then come up with the list of parameters for you guys Rec what's the like we vote on saying he needs to do options up with some options the options for us we take that vote give him that but we have the parameters to go through and say these are what we want these options to reflect does that make sense to everyone I mean my you know no offense but I'm opposed to the amendment because if we're just going to get a list of things to do to decide from there what if that doesn't get us to the $3 million we need if we're gonna if we're going to go for saying some parameters and I do like that word better um some parameters then fine we taking that off and going for uh some plans um but just understand that depending on what our uh input is from Monday from the community it may change some of the things and then we're going to have the opportunity to come back here December 3rd and discuss that just want to make sure that that was on the table so I will resume my amendment I think we have to just we have to vote on your Amendment we'll vote on your Amendment and if that feels then we go back to the or I won't be able to put any time into this tomorrow just to CL oh yeah you have you gonna vote on the on the amendment this is the amendment to amend the original motion Randy is now saying that she's going to beend and not have on so everybody's clear are you ready okay why are we sending I'm sorry you're sending your right my my amendment was just a list okay so we're going we're reverting back to a plan but with gr okay okay or was that plans plans plans yeah all right we are taking this vote everybody ready to vote on the amendment M yes Patrick no Jim yes Randy no this the amendment that I had that weing it's okay I thought we were voting to Res no there is no voting it down Lisa no no and myself no all right now we're moving on to the original what is on the floor all right do you want so I'm GNA read what I wrote down yeah so I wrote I move we direct the superintended to put together a plan B which includes closing buildings reducing staff to reduce $3 million that's what I wrote and Patrick has a second correct correct yes all right is that is that clear with is that clear with everyone okay okay yeah just so uh your your proposal is just to go up the a plan that's what I wrote that's all that I wrote We want to change that yeah so your your just mentions buildings and staff could be put in any other options so what if he finds money somewhere else that's not building your staff kind of yeah I I didn't I wrote which includes buildings reducing staff to reduce the okay so a FL in that I just wasn't sure that would would stop him from finding other options that aren't buildings or staff which I would love for him to find probably should have just throwing it out there if you think that covers it found it I just want to make sure but what if I put in or others other items line items how do I just because I think what would be good to see was in the event we we decide or it's decided that we are going to have to close buildings is it possible to close one building and do this this and this two buildings and we have to do this this I'm just asking my question and I guess is does this does your um proposal cover that I say yes to I mean okay Mr Morgan you're here does that make sense to you what we're saying okay okay so as good as this second all right second sure y now we're taking a vote is everyone ready yes right P yes yes yes Lisa yes Bill yes Jill will yes myself yes now the parameters and discussion on I think we should take closing Ash Elementary off table nothing I can't disagree anymore that sorry I I disagree with that emphatically I think there's a motion we didn't make a motion we just said okay we're going to make a motion for every parameter or we them I think you'd have to because there could be some I agree with or that one okay motion that we take closing Ash Elementary off the table I so any debate by taking it off the table if there's an estimated amount of savings we could have there that cut has to come from somewhere else so going to come from more faculty will those cuts impact Ashby Elementary or they just going to impact the towns and and PE schools that have the higher amounts of teachers whereas ashb I don't think can make any more cuts to faculty just based on the numbers there I I I understand that ashp wants their school however they don't have a middle school or high school already the building needs a lot of work we need to consolidate and this building just logically makes so much sense I mean I the just to play Devil's Advocate what if in his plan B decides to actually makes sense like that I don't think we should handcuff him to that piece of it because you know I what if I turn around in the next one and say I don't think we should close Haw on Brook and now now we're hand toing him from any you know we're going to continue to do that so we're going to make a motion on at every single building I I think that's it doesn't make any sense if he comes back to us sorry superintendent don't me disrespect am I sorry you know it like allowing him to come back with the plan that they V out before they bring to us like we've got to listen to that piece of it if we handcuff them too much it's going to make it really hard but us to have anything but there's also a lot of work that he's going to do if we can tell him now that there's something that's unacceptable it takes work off his Fleet and he knows not to go down that road and and spend the energy there but I think the point that will is making is each one of us has a connection to a school and each one of us could throw up and say I don't want the closing of my building I don't want the closing of my building we're going to end up in a big tie is what's going to happen and nobody and that's not giving superintendent Direction J and I think if that was the case then closing schools would be off the table alog together if we chose to go school by school and take a vot however that's not what we're doing Patrick just asked what would happen if we didn't close the estimated amount of savings is a one-time Savings of three $380,000 out of a $69 million budget just in a short list of ideas Randy had was that we identified more than $380,000 that could be saved so we've already covered that then this isn't even counting cost of any Renovations for moving Ashby somewhere else or increased busing costs so for the very very minimal amount of money that would potentially be a one-time save compared to the DraStic negative consequences of closing it I do think it should be off the table and I do think it's a fair thing that we could vot school by school if we wanted to well as much as I hate to say this and it pains me to say it I don't really think that we can take anything off the table while we're asking the superintendent to do is to put together proposals and I would suggest that in putting together those proposals the savings that Randy um showed us the other night be taken into consideration with that and there and I I thought what we were going to vote on we were going to vote the motion we're voting on was that um superintendent would come up with options if we did this if we did that and and and now we have options that are that are out there but you know we're putting together a budget I don't right now and these are just proposals suggestions that we're going to vote on I don't know that we can take a lot off the table just to be clear it's not a one-time savings those are expenses we have every year on the building whether it be admin or right but that's not building expenses you still need the teachers to teach the students whether they're in that building or somewhere else based on the the sorry this is an executive session kind of question it's not I'm not whispering about I would not bring but you can say consolidation or service from okay so just based on consolidating Services alone there are there are positions that would either be moved or or or savings there it's not a one-time expense that that's not correct information and if we can go sit with with Nancy at some point and go over that information if you'd like I mean we've talked about it year after year essentially of onetime savings because if you're not saving anything the next year but that's not correct what Patrick I think is trying to say is if if you take a building offline there are savings that come out of that year after year because that building we no longer there's no overhead so there is a savings that comes to effect that's there there are more savings than just the overhead a very small percentage of about 380,000 which is a very very small percentage of the 69 mil I I think this talk would have to go that part of the talk which we can have another time we have to go to an executive session to actually go over those numbers based on some of the conversations that we had I've only been here a year and i' I've already found it six months like different number so stop all right any other discussion Jill I agree with Bill I think that we should let him do his job as much as we don't want Ashby off the table he he understand Mr Morgan understands our position on ashb and I'm sure that he's going to come up with something in his plan that doesn't close the school so I think that putting all these parameters on him just really it's not going to get into that $3 million I mean it's his job main we ask the superintendent in putting together these Plan B B1 B2 B3 whatever that one of those be a proposal that didn't that didn't close ask me is there a feasible way to do that and I apologize I know it's we're add a lot of work for you not yeah not the answer for you but sure we can discussing multiple building options okay we have the discussed building options before and certainly continue down that road again well if we're not going to sit here and um actually vote on any parameters then it does lead um leave it open that what he comes back with that we're not going to go for just so you know possibility has nothing to do with um your ability and your team's ability to come up with options um but if we can't sit here and decide and tell you what's off the table um then when you bring stuff to us there may be something that's off the table and I think that's understandable because we do have if he lays out the option that's fine I thought the whole idea of giving him Direction was that he didn't go down roads that we were never going approach you know like so is build closing buildings an option for all of us do we think we need to face that depending on the information on um capacity in the district if if if those numbers pan out um then still Lees us room for um expansion uh in the future for you know movein and things like that I I could consider building closure any so without building closure where where is that money coming from because we've had these sit downs and that that's the end of the day that's the question where where are the cuts coming from them I'd have to take a look some more again I said I didn't say it's off the table I just said that it is on the table yep I'm just I'm just asking a question that is one of the last things I ever even would think of considering um among any of the cuts that we would have to make to make it to $3 million I think there's L of options out there instead of um you know cutting Ashby and doing more but then looking at the numbers um we're looking at the students we're looking at the communities and I don't think the numbers um are the only thing that we can look at I think there's different ways to get there so as much as it pains me to even think about closing a building if the numbers in the district um don't support uh space okay I would prefer it to be in a town that has options for what is uh the Hub and the Heart of their communities with their schools okay yeah we do a motion to take off the table a second a J yes right so we do need to vote on this unless you guys want to to get off the all right are we ready to vote on it Patrick no J yes Brandon yes Lisa yes no J no no no Jill I'm sorry that was yours it was no okay discussion or are other I just want to make a statement to anybody listening that um again as the press release mentions Community input would be vital in this decision making so after the meeting on Monday when you hear the rest of whatever is presented there um please do voice any concerns or also ideas you might have and constructive feedback to the full committee please thank you J us any more discussion so to recap we have given superintendent Morgan to come up with Plan B with options to bring back to us at the December 3rd reading of that is that everyone's understanding everyone's understand I just have one more thing to say when we talk about the bed departments in in the building all being in one building for the most part would it make sense to look at maybe moving K2 back to Ash where they have the space for it instead of overloading say at bar and Brook is that something that we could look at too and then that would give more purpose to that building is what I mean like it it would make more sense to keep Ash open if we were housing more students over there instead of cramming them all into and Brook would alleviate some of those big numbers that we're talking about I I just want it maybe to be looked at when we're doing budgets that that could be an option for larger numbers we're talking about closing a school it maybe it shouldn't be the school that has room moving right like moving that sped those younger kids over to that building again they were before it might alleviate some of the space where we're bulging I I would agree with you that uh all of our districtwide special education or even districtwide uh programs if there's others that are not special education those are where they are right now at the limb of the uh Administration on where they felt that it best fit for the moment um and has moved around in the past and can move around again um so I would en the um the ad team when they're looking at space and what can be done remember those can be moved I I wouldn't categorize it as a wi um I'm sorry you're right that that I I would I agree I'm sorry it did make it sound a little kind of arbitrary I I really didn't mean to make it that way um but just trying to stress the point um that they have the ability to be moved they're not anchored to any one place sure and again just to clarify I would have to go back and look the specific numbers but the reason that the programs were moved from Ash to Peppa was twofold the majority of the kids just based on on the district population that are in the programs from P um I believe that the Savings in special education B transportation of loans was in excess of $200,000 for the district and there were additional Savings in um any of our service providers so our OTS and PTs I do not believe we would be able to have a full-time OT or PT that would be handling just that age group in aete which means we would an Essence be hiring say an occupational therapist as a full-time 1.0 and point two of that may be traveling between buildings uh so there's also savings on staff by being able to have our service provider all in one location and our special education Transportation also going to one location where the majority of the students live that are in those programs there is also talk at the state level of cutting back on special education circuit breaker funding for special education Transportation so that could come in at a higher cost to the school district next year making it even more difficult to fund that so that the reason the programs were moved in short was because it saved us I think it's fair to say a a few $100,000 so it was a decision that was well thought out um and again uh from a transportation standpoint but also having service providers that we're able to have is full-time that we're actually working fulltime and not traveling between buildings not the bad do at work but they're actually servicing kids supposed to traveling is Van um and it's just that I don't know the answer to this question that's why I'm asking we don't pay per mile per mileage right like we have the van they transport it doesn't matter where they go right um do you have but I think but I think they're less Vans required because special education bus they take the van still so whether it goes to pepol towns in or Ashby it shouldn't make a difference and the service providers that we had in the district I'm not going against what you're saying I'm just trying to get a better picture for it they were traveling before to Ashby certain days during the week they would go you know speech would be on Mondays OT would be on Tuesdays um did we lose providers or do we still have the same amount of providers I'm pretty sure we' increase our providers because of because the numbers in the programs have increased right so why would that change having to drive 15 minutes more down the road if they're already in towns and and then they just run over to Ashby I'm just trying to figure out why you're com like they just don't make sense to me like where the kids are being bned shouldn't make a difference where the program is being held so I I think you have the background on that fair I think it does take cost because they have to have that built into their schedule to transport to go from one building to another they lose they lose a period basically I can certainly go back I believe we also had driving we also an increased number of parents that were driving as opposed to taking the special education B to ashy again it just works out because the majority of the kids are peal students because it's the largest of the three communities except the school's posting with the SCS yes all right I think we're going to move on to the subcommittee reports if everybody's in all right Ash element June um yes the boiler has been fully installed that is all set now um we're down to 80 something thousand that is um we just met with the Ashby select board at our last meeting and are determining the the final um projects that we spending and I do have a report on the accelerated repair as I talked to S and he is figuring out where we need to closest and so we should be hearing from finally after six years we'll be there wa will oh you want do you want to schedule Finance meeting I mean we're gonna have to schedule Finance meeting I just don't know that we can squeeze it in before December 3rd that off the check with the members of the committee we can do that all right Randy on the policy sorry I class size instructural materials i j materials thank you um so these are up for adoption I have not heard anything from anybody on the city or um in the community on the three uh changes that we've done um so I will move that the uh school committee adop policy IID class size I instructional materials igl Library material selection and adoption second that was Randy and all right go this way uh Iain I haven't my homework sorry yes yes Lisa yes Randy yes Jun yes Patrick I need to obain sorry sorry yes all right on to warrants anything Patrick I signed two in the past few days one for 582,000 one for 18 report thank you um negotiations and Personnel for teachers I have no reports from them negotiations and Personnel noning Emil reports um community Outreach on uh Jun with ask um nothing to report but I'm in constant contact with the slot board in Town Administrator and peil myself and Patrick I have nothing to report will anything to report with obviously we've been um putting together the presentation for Monday night and with the Liaisons I do need you to reach out to to select board members and figure out when they can do their elections as we have talked about going from hos we have no select Bo meetings in to elction Saturday have election Saturday yes all right so you'll talk yes um to clarify so we would be looking for a special town meeting um to put the override on the April Ballot or probably we need to probably have a decision by March so we probably need to speci special town meeting and a special election yes okay as as soon as Nancy gets the numbers and we need to get the report it will come after the February open or budget meeting the time right then yeah well there's public hearing requirement yeah and then you would vote for an adopt a budget adopted and then the towns would have the number the actual numbers to vote on and then there's certain time parameters through which we will have toig the leaon will have to figure out and figure out when we need that number when they can do their elections if it works St yeah I don't know what the town requirements as far as how many days for the election but the school committee has a will vote by as early in March as we can do it I think got right after the public hearing the next meeting and vot vote the budget and then we give the towns and they have seven day we have seven days to give them the the data um and the numbers and then they will either call call a if they know they can't fit it into their budget they'll call a special election or or on the April election how to do it okay I make a motion to adjourn there's still a public comment oh there is public comment sorry I have it up J has it on um this comment is from Diane Rolo I have been a North M sex teacher for 24 years as an ashb teacher it is disheartening and discouraging that whenever there is a budget issue closing Ashby is thrown out as the solution when closing a school should be a last resort by closing Ashby and our haon Brook the town of Ashby feels dis discriminated against the solution should not directly affect one town our motto is we are NM Ashby is nm2 thank you we have a motion [Music] did yes yes yes Lisa Ry yes June yes yes yes thank you everyone