WEBVTT

METADATA
Video-Count: 1
Video-1: youtube.com/watch?v=sOsg6easj9A

NOTE
MEETING SECTIONS:

Part 1 (Video ID: sOsg6easj9A):
- 00:01:36: Roll Call, Agenda Adoption, Minutes Approval Introduction
- 00:02:41: City Attorney Introduces Public Governance and Transparency Laws
- 00:05:05: Open Meeting Law: Public Access to Discussions
- 00:08:17: Open Meeting Law: Social Media and Serial Meetings
- 00:11:21: Open Meeting Law: Special Meetings and Overdisclosure
- 00:15:40: Open Meeting Law: Planning, Discussion, and Meeting Cadence
- 00:18:20: Open Meeting Law: Closed Meetings, Penalties and Data Practices Act
- 00:21:31: Data Practices Act: Public Data and Official Channels
- 00:24:26: Conflicts of Interest: Disclosure and Recusal
- 00:28:10: Conflicts of Interest: Transparency and Gift Laws
- 00:30:41: City Operations, Roles of City Manager
- 00:33:53: Robert's Rules of Order and Procedural Requirements
- 00:37:53: Public Discussion Topics, Motions, Remote Attendence
- 00:44:35: Presentation Conclusion, Questions, Chair Absence Protocol
- 00:49:15: Election of Officers: Chair and Vice Chair
- 00:50:53: Reviewing City Code Chapter 92: Parks and Lakes
- 00:53:52: City Code: Vegetation, Littering, Vehicles, Park Hours
- 00:57:09: City Code Approval, Park Representative Delay
- 00:57:58: Staff Reports: Citywide Park Cleanup Event Date
- 01:00:25: Park Cleanup: Date Selection Challenges, Alternatives
- 01:03:06: Park Cleanup: Focus on Bus Stop, Roadway Trash
- 01:05:29: Park Cleanup: Locations and Event Times
- 01:07:22: Park Cleanup: Specific Location Decisions, Pposting Rules Clarification
- 01:12:17: Other Staff Reports: Park Brochure, Land Restrictions, DNR Grant
- 01:15:11: Medallion Hunt Approval, Rules, Reports from Commissioners
- 01:17:51: Gaga Pit Feature, Summer Meeting Discussion, Adjournment Motion


Part: 1

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Um, would you like to do a roll call, Sarah? >> Yes. Uh, Laura Greenley Karp is absent. Sarah Zaratka >> here. >> Lloyd Grachek >> here. >> Ingred Kohler >> here. >> Rachel Lucas >> here. >> William Keley is absent. And Cassie

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Schweer is not here yet. >> All right. Um, would we like to make a motion to adopt the agenda? So moved. >> Any discussion? >> All right. Uh we would like to make an

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order for um approval of minutes. >> I will. >> A vote. Oh, >> sorry. A vote to adopt the agenda. All in favor say. >> I. >> I. >> All those opposed. So moved. >> All right. Thank you. Will we like to make a motion for approval of minutes?

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>> I will make a motion to approve the minutes. Great. Any discussion? Let's take a vote. All in favor? I. >> All those opposed? All right. We are open to the public. Anyone? Okay. With no one from the

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public, we can move on to the first action of business, which is um by Jack here, our legal, our city attorney. Take it away. >> Hello, Madam Chair, members of the parks and rec commission. Uh my name is Jack Brooksbank. I'm the city attorney for North St. Paul. Um it's nice to meet all of you in person. I think we've sent an

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email or two around. Um, you may have seen me if you've seen the uh, city council meetings. I usually sit over there on the side, so I'm nice and out of the way. Um, here tonight just to kind of run through some of the kind of uh, basic um, kind of public governance

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and transparency type laws uh, that apply to you as in your roles as public officials on the parks and recck commission. Um, the point of this presentation is to be useful for all of you. So, if at any point you have any questions, um, raise your hand, talk

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over me, what, whatever, you know, jump in. If anything doesn't make sense, um, I'm here to answer your questions, make sure you get the info you need. Um, I'm not here to listen to myself talk. So, uh, that's kind of what we're going to go through here. I also, you know, um, I am the lawyer.

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It is my job to get up here and tell you that you're not allowed to have any fun. Uh, so >> too late. Uh that's what I like to hear uh secretly. Um so I am going to be talking about a lot of the kind of rules and restrictions that apply to you as

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public officials. Um I do just want you know it's a lot of don't do this, don't do that. This thing seems very scary, don't do that. Um it's not because I am suspicious of any of you or think that you're doing anything wrong. We just we're running through everything so that we're all on the same page. Some of

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these things are um tremendously counterintuitive. Uh, and we just want to make sure, you know, the the purpose of my being here, the purpose of the city having, you know, an attorney on retainer, um, they can call me in is to make sure that you're protected. That's the number one thing that we want. Um, I

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always tell everyone, uh, it can be the easiest lawsuit, and I can I love winning lawsuits, but being in the lawsuit kind of already means that we've lost to some extent. It's a lot of time. It's a lot of hassle. Um,

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if you get called into a deposition, those can last for up to eight hours and they are, trust me, extremely boring. Uh, so we're just trying to avoid all of that. Um, so that's kind of the the baseline here. Um, so I'm just going to kind of run run through things. I'll try

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not to just read my materials too much. Uh, but like I said, if you have any questions at any point, um, just let me know. Kind of follow the outline here. So the the first two kind of go together a little bit. Um so the open meeting law and data practices. So this is about

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public access to you to your discussions to your information. Um both of these laws are passed as sort of public transparency um type laws. And the idea is that we're trying to avoid you know any kind of backroom dealing, secret

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discussions. Um and the phrase the legal phrase that gets used a lot is corruption or the appearance of corruption. So, some of these things they're written to go, you know, wider than you think maybe they have to. Uh, and the reason for that is just it's it's again it's that if someone can be

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suspicious of what's happening, um, we're sort of already seeding some ground we don't want to. So, they're written to be a little rigid and they they can be cumbersome, frankly. Um, and so I don't want to, you know, like sugarcoat that. and you're going to hear

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some of these requirements and you're going to say that seems silly and I uh might agree with you but unfortunately I don't get the decision to say well we should just not do that. Um that's the legislature that does that. Uh so the open meeting law as the name suggests uh

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means that we have to have our meetings out in the open in public. Um the definitions of what counts as public, what counts as open and also what counts as a meeting are broader than you might think. So a meeting is when a quorum of

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any public body and parks and rec commission you're a public body. So when a quorum of public body is together and that's to make a decision to discuss a possible decision or to obtain information about a possible decision. And so that's a really broad you know

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discussion really broad definition of what that counts as. Um, so that covers most types of discussion, frankly. Um, anytime that you're talking about business that's in front of the commission or possible business that's in front of the commission, arguably

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that could be a meeting if there's a quorum. Now, again, there's a um we have we have the full seven right now. Yes. Um, so the seven members on the commission, so a quorum of the commission is four people. So any four people in one place um having a

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discussion about city business, that's a meeting. Um, a meeting can also be, right, it's about that discussion. So, it's not necessarily an in-person meeting. So, that's the other big thing is that a

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meeting could be uh one of you sends an email to the rest of you. Uh, if there are if there's a quorum CCD on one email, that could constitute a meeting. Um, if somebody else emails all of you at once, that doesn't count. they can't

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like make you have a meeting. Uh but if you reply all to an email that the entire commission is on, that could be a meeting. Um if that isn't, you know, done in out in the open in public with all the disclosures required, that could be a violation of the open meeting law.

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Uh the other big one that can happen is um Facebook comments or you know, social media. If there's four people like in the comments on one thread, that also that does count as a meeting >> like under a post. >> Yeah. someone posts and we get like four

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comments from four different people about you know something city related um that's potentially a meeting that's potentially a violation of the open meeting law act. >> What if it's like personal related unrelated to city? >> So there is an exception for this which

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is um like I said a um you know a meeting is making a decision discussing or obtaining information about business or potential business. So there is an exception for it's like a purely social event. Um so if someone has um you know

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like a Christmas party or you're you know doing something totally unrelated to your um you know your duties as commissioners uh that does not count as a meeting. So if there if four of you happen to run into each other in the aisle at the grocery store that's

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probably not a meeting. Um if you start talking about city business it becomes a meeting. Uh the other thing important here is a the meeting it's not based on like there's no formalities involved. So the fact that you're commenting from your personal Facebook account does not

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mean it's not a meeting. Um so just the fact that you're on your personal social media commenting on personal things if you are commenting on you know things that could be official business before you that could potentially count as a meeting. Now again, it's only a meeting

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if there's four people there. Um but you know the so the the gold standard advice is um just don't talk about stuff that might come before the commission um outside of you know sort of the really official channels. Um obviously

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understanding we live in a modern world and 100% just don't talk about it isn't really you know not really an option but just being aware of that being careful with that. Um the other important thing to keep in mind, there's a thing called a serial meeting. Uh a serial meeting is

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where one person sends an email to one person who sends an email to one person who sends an email to a fourth person. Now we have four people on an email chain that is now a meeting. So um and again the idea of all of this is that you know the the decisions that you're

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making and the rationale for those decisions should all be hashed out in public at a public meeting. And so the idea that what we're trying to avoid is having you kind of discuss amongst yourselves, build the consensus, and then go out in public and take the vote now that you already know what you're

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going to do, right? We want that pro that thinking and that discussion to take place in public as well. >> What if we got three three commissioners in a city staff? >> Uh not a quorum, not a meeting. Um so that's why uh you will notice uh if you

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have some subcommittees or things set up already you will notice all of those will be quorum minus one number of commissioners. Um that's why um texting also could possibly constitute a meeting. Um now the good news is that uh

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if there is going to be a meeting, if there is something that four of you want to go to that might involve some discussion of city business, um so something like uh you want to have parks and wreck night at the history cruisers or you know set up a booth or pass out

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flyers about an event. Um or you all four of you want to go to um you know the same yoga in the park event or something. Um it's pretty easy. The the requirements are fairly minimal. Um, so there's regular meetings. This is a regular meeting. You post to schedule those at the beginning of the year.

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Those are fine. Um, other than that, anything that's not a regular meeting is called a special meeting. And we just have to post about it at least three days in advance. Uh, and city staff, they do this all the time. We post meetings all the time. Um, so if you're thinking, oh, well, four of us are going

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to be at some event. Just email Sarah and say, hey, four of us are going to be at this event. and we'll just post it and say potential meeting happening here and then we're covered. Yes. >> Um so

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um if a lot of us are going, you know, hopefully a lot of us want to go to a lot of park events. So but we may not know that the other is going um we won't know until we arrive at the event perhaps. Um

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and and in that case is that considered a special meeting? if several park, you know, commissioners are at an a park event, which seems very likely. Um, and but yet we're not maybe one of us

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has volunteered to work the event or two and the other two just show up. I mean, we don't know when we're going to be a meeting, >> a special meeting or a >> Yeah. And you know there's some sort of

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practical here. Again, the sort of you know purely private or purely social event exception does exist. And I will say if there are four park commissioners at a park event, um to somebody who is who who isn't, you know, right next to you the whole time, that's going to look

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like a meeting if there's four park commissioners at a park event. Isn't that what we want is to participate in the park >> saying like if we have a concert in the park like we don't all have to sit next to each other we can go and enjoy it and not >> if you're if you're somewhere in the

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crowd that's not necessarily you know it has to be like the four of you kind of together. So depending on the size of the event >> and does it have to do with what we're talking about like if we're not discussing a park event >> I mean a park. >> Yes. So, if all four of you are at a

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park event in a park talking about literally nothing to do with city business, that is technically not a meeting. >> Mhm. >> If we get sued about that, we have to prove what you talked about. >> Okay. >> So, it's still a giant pain. So,

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>> yeah. >> And and again, the actual notice requirements are pretty minimal. So, what I recommend doing normally is just if you think there's a possibility that you might have four people at an event, just post it. There is no penalty for posting for a meeting and then not having the meeting.

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>> There is only a penalty if you have a meeting without having posted it. >> And to post it means let Sarah know. >> Yeah. >> Which I do do that usually if I think there's going to be Same with the arts commission. If we think there's a potential like a bigger event that the parks are doing,

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>> we post it anyway. you guys don't even know about it because there's not a reason to. Great. >> Um, but >> always letting me know would be helpful too if you think you're >> because we don't often know. I'm not on Facebook. I'm I don't know when everyone else is going to be attending something until I'm there.

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>> Really? >> Answer my question. >> Exactly what I was Yeah. >> Good job, Sarah. >> Keeps track of as well. >> Yeah. >> So, if like each of us individually tell her we're volunteering, will she then communicate that to you, Sarah? >> Yep. Okay. Exactly. Okay. Yeah.

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Yeah. And something that I know the city council finds very helpful is they just take a couple of minutes at the end of every meeting and they say, "Okay, what are the events for the next they do every meeting every two weeks." So they say, "What are the events for the next two weeks? Is anyone going to those events?" Uh, and so they'll say, "Oh, we have a fire department thing on Friday.

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I was planning on going to that." And someone else will say, "Well, I was planning on going to that." And then if a third person says, "Oh, actually, I was thinking I might go to that, too." Then we just look over at the clerk and say, "Okay, let's post that. >> Let's post it." Um, and so as long as we do that at least three days in advance, we're totally in the clear. So, you

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know, it really is it's an overdisclose kind of a law. Um, it's fairly easy. You know, once you kind of get in the hang of it, um, it's just anytime you're like, I wonder if that might be a meeting, hey, let's post it. And it it becomes pretty mechanical. Um, so it's can

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>> fairly easy to keep track of. Can we build that into our routine so that at the end of every meeting, we're checking in with you on that or each other on what's coming up next month and >> or let's let's make that a part of every meeting.

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>> Or and every event maybe. >> Yes. Right. >> Discuss a certain Yes. >> Yes. So she could just put it on every meeting or every event that we have. >> Yeah. >> Could do that. And you can just p it doesn't matter >> recovering ourselves.

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>> Mhm. >> Yeah. That would also be a way to do it is just if there is an official parks event, >> right? >> Just post that there might be a quorum of the parks and rec commission there. >> So that okay. >> Does that mean we can talk about things if we know it's a meeting at an event? >> Yeah. Okay.

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>> Um >> just can't make decisions, right? >> Yeah. So for a special meeting, um there are you have to say like what the purpose of the meeting is. Um, so you can if you say like, oh, we're going to this event, you know, basically you're sort of limited to like we can talk about like

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this event um because you for this meeting we can kind of talk about anything because it's a general meeting. For a special meeting, you actually have to provide an agenda >> um as well. And so, you know, if you're at, you know, yoga in the park, I probably would not talk about like the

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capital improvement plan, >> right? >> Um, I don't know that there's much risk of that happening anyway. Um, but just for an example, >> as you're doing art, as you're doing arch, you're >> Hey, by the way, did you hear what the >> All right, we're going to keep this

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moving along. Sony's not here all day. >> Good job, Sarah. Good job, Sarah. >> So, uh, there are some times when you can have a what's called closed meeting, um, which is when we go into closed session. It's it's private. It's, um, you know, not open to the public. We can have a a confidential discussion. Um,

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for the most part, those situations are not going to come up for the parks and recck commission. Um, it'd be hard to think of, you know, there there's a list of them in here. They don't really come up. The one thing I do just want to highlight here, um, penalties. Um, these are specific to intentional violations. So, this is if you are trying to get

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around, right? Anytime there's like a good faith, oh, we thought we did the right thing, but we maybe didn't, it's not as bad. Um, if there are intentional violations, there can be financial penalties. For some of those financial penalties, the city is not allowed to pay them for you. So, if you are try

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intentionally trying to get around the open meeting law, it could end up with you having to pay your own money as a a fine. Again, we'd like to avoid that related to the open meeting. Um, we'll move on. Data practices. Um, this is another big

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one. Um, data practices act. Um, if you've heard of a FOYA request, that's like the federal equivalent. The Data Practices Act, that's the state law. um that governs all of this. Um so it handles um government data uh and gives people the ability to request government

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data. Again, just kind of starting with some of those definitions. Government data is all data collected, created, received, maintained or disseminated by state or local government and that includes by state or local government officials. Um so that could be paper

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documents, emails, text messages, um phone call records, all of those things. It is not again it is not defined by like the form the name on the account. It is defined by uh who is talking and what are they talking about. So if you

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are talking about government business anything created as part of that is government data. So again if you're texting somebody that's government data if you make a Facebook post that is government data. um you know this this goes sort of uh you know it's fairly

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all-encompassing if that is how you are talking about government business. So again just kind of my topline recommendation here is we have these meetings where we can discuss whatever we need to discuss. You all have official city email addresses. I

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would really urge you to to try your best to keep communications about parks and wreck items to meetings and your city email. Um because again to the extent there is ever any litigation or not even litigation because with government data someone can just turn in

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a letter and say please give me all the data you have about whatever subject I have identified. Uh and so the best thing for you is if I get one of those letters and I call you up and I say hey we've gotten a request for all data about um you know this park event. Uh do

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you have anything on your personal devices? And you can just say no and then that's the end of it. We don't have to do anything. um if you're texting, you know, other commission members or you're, you know, you've got Instagram messages about it or whatever, we have

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to go grab those off of your device because that's government data and we have to provide that. Um this is again a huge pain for everyone and so it's just best all around if we don't have to do that. Um there are a few different

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classifications. the the default classification for all government data in Minnesota is public. Public means public. Public means it can be requested by, viewed by, copied by anybody. Um, data is only not public if there is a

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specific statute that says that kind of data is not public. Um, so again, you know, a barring and and it mostly tends to be things like certain types of law enforcement data or um sort of sensitive like financial information, personnel

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history, that sort of thing. So again, texting somebody about what's going on in the parks um is going to be public data. Uh city has again there's an official form that anybody can fill out. It's not

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limited to city residents. It's not limited to Minnesota residents. Um, they don't have to provide a reason for why they want the data. They can ask for as much as they want to subject to there are some they have to pay some fees if they make us do too much work. Um, but

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anyone can request any data. So, it's pretty wide open. Um, again, I would just urge you to to keep to the official channels. Um, if you are using your official email address on like a home computer or a smartphone,

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all of that is also backed up on the system here at the city. It's all accessible here at the city. So, even if you've been emailing on your official email address from your phone, we wouldn't count that as being data on your phone because we already have it on

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the the servers here. So, we wouldn't have to get your device to do an extra search as long as it's on your official email. >> So, uh just texting a friend, a neighbor, whatever, and saying, "Hey, there's yoga in the park this weekend." Is that public data?

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>> Probably not. If it's just like um you know, if if it's you texting a friend as a friend, >> probably not. If you put out like a if you're making an Instagram or Facebook post >> Yeah. know >> and you say, "Hey, you know, whoever's seeing this, there's

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>> yoga at the park this weekend, um that probably does count." And so it's sort of it's like what what role are you in? Um again, there's that sort of like if it's just a social if it's a friend that you do yoga with and you say, "Hey, there's yoga here also. Let's go there." >> That's probably not government data.

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>> Thanks. Um, so that's kind of the uh, you know, the data practices act. Um, and again, anytime you have any questions about, you know, any of that stuff, um, feel free to let Sarah or Ava know. They can pass questions on to me. It's very

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complicated, but again, pro daytoday, you know, there's lots of like exceptions and counterexceptions that don't really ever come up for a parks and rec commission. So, for the most part, shouldn't have to think about it too much, but I do just want you to be aware of it. Um,

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next topic is conflicts of interest. Um, this one is, again, we're getting to be a little bit more um intuitive on some of these ones. Conflicts of interest, you all kind of know what a conflict of interest is. Um, you all know that they're bad. Um, there are some statutes

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about it. they mostly track a common sense understanding of um sort of how to deal with these things. Uh there are some specific ways for different potential conflicts of interest on how to deal with them. Um whether that's, you know, a recusal, what that does to

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vote counts, all of those sorts of sort of more technical details. Um, if a conflict of interest is ever coming up, mostly just let uh Sarah or Ava or me if you um happen to have my email or if I'm

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around, just let one of us know. Uh, and we can walk you through the kind of like, okay, here's what happens now with that. For the most part, we just again just be thinking of conflicts of interest. >> What would Yeah, you can tell I have a question. What would be a potential

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conflict of interest for us? So there's there's there are some technicalities. It's different if it is a contract or something else. So if the city is hiring somebody or some company to do something,

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>> okay. um then a conflict is much more narrowly it's or much more broadly it's like a much stricter standard um because we don't want to be you know hiring family members or you know hiring a a lawn care company that one of the parks

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and recck commissioners is a member of or owns or something like that. >> Okay. >> Um so for those ones it's it's can be quite strict. For non-contract situations it can be a little bit less strict. Basically any time where somebody is before you with making some

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kind of a request some kind of an ask of the city where you have some kind of an outside relationship with the person making the request. So that can be financial, that can be uh you know some kind of a business relationship. Um that

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can be a familial relationship if it's a you know a parent, a sibling um you know some kind of a thing where you have an interest in both sides. Parks and reccomission you're probably not dealing with like contracts as nearly as often.

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Um but it's still potentially coming up in terms of um you know looking at uh proposals for you know maintenance or proposals for new park facilities. Um just making sure that you you know if you have a a family member who works for

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the architecture firm that might be designing a playground. Um just making sure you're disclosing that. For the most part the remedy for that is you have to recuse yourself. Um, so just like during that one specific item, you just go sit in the audience while the

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discussion happens. Um, and then for vote counts, if you are recused for a conflict of interest, you don't count towards the quorum. So if there's seven members on the commission and two of them have a conflict of interest for

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that item, we consider votes out of five. Um, so you can so like some things require a unanimous vote. Um, that's still possible even if someone has a conflict of interest and has to sit it out. Um,

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best practice again is overdisclose. If you think you might have a conflict of interest, talk to staff about it. Staff can talk to me about it. Um, you know, if you feel like it might affect your decision-m generally, we'll have you sit out. If you don't know if it's a

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conflict of interest or not, um, we can work with staff. we can we can give you some advice on if it's the kind of thing you might have to sit out on or not. Um, generally we again transparency is the name of the game. You know, we're we're just trying not to we don't want anyone

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to be mad at us even if we are technically correct. Uh related to conflict of interests gift laws. Um so that is an interested person cannot give you gift. An interested person uh is someone who has an interest, you know, direct financial or

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other interest in something that might be before the city. For city business, uh that's most people. Uh and so it we just again we kind of look at this pretty broadly. Um gift means

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anything of value. Um there's kind of a there's a dimminimous exception. So anything less than $5 we don't necessarily count. Um, so if you're at like a conference or something and someone wants to give you like a pen or a stress ball, that doesn't count as a gift. That's not something that has to be, you know, disclosed. You're going to

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get in trouble over. But it could be anything else. So that could be um like plaques, memorials, that could be food. Um that's probably the one that gets people in trouble the most often is um someone says, "Hey, I know you're on the

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parks commission. Can I buy you dinner and hear your opinion about something?" Uh and the answer is uh no they can't. Um there are some exec exceptions. Um again it's pretty much it's sort of

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dimminimous things. Um gifts by your family members, right? Again it's sort of if it's if you're not receiving the gift because of your position within the city, then it's not really going to count. Um,

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so that's kind of the big um the big ethics laws, the big rules that that we've kind of got. Um, and again, they can be a little technical and a little unwieldly. Uh, and some of them don't always make a whole lot of sense. Um, but that's what they are. Um, you

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know, if you ever again, if you ever have any questions, don't hesitate to ask. uh the rest of the presentation we have a a couple of topics here just to kind of go through kind of how some of the some of the city operations uh and some how some of that stuff works just stuff

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that you might be running into. Um so you have some notes here on roles of the city manager. Um so North St. Paul is a city manager city as opposed to you will hear some other cities they will talk about their city administrator. Um, I continually wish that they picked

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two words that were more different than manager and administrator. They didn't. Again, nobody asked my opinion on this. Um, the the basic difference is that a manager has more more power, more direct authority than an administrator does. So, our city manager, that's Brian. I'm

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sure you've probably all met him or seen him around. Um, he's sort of like the like the CEO of the city and then the city council is kind of the board of directors of the city. And so they're much more hands-off kind of big picture authorization type of stuff. And Brian

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has a lot of kind of the day-to-day um you know he hires employees, he can fire employees and you know promote people, move people around. Um he kind of does most of the day-to-day city administration. Um those sorts of

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things. He also has um purchasing authority. So, anything that is less than $20,000, if we need to buy something, that can be done through the manager's authority. Um, so if we're having a park event and we need um, you

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know, something there to, you know, we we need a bucket of sidewalk chalk for a night in the park or something, um, that can go through. We have a purchasing policy. You can talk to your staff people. Um, they can go ahead and get you those supplies. We don't need to really do too much about it. um the city

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manager does not have the authority to enter into sort of longer term contracts on behalf of the city. Those all have to go through the city council. So difference would be if we're, you know, providing art supplies for a night in the park, that's the kind of thing that

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we can just go buy. uh if we are hiring an artist to teach people in the park, um that is going to be the kind of thing that we're going to need, you know, some more city council authorization to go do something like that. Um so again, it's

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just kind of like what the process is for you guys. You know, the the city council wants to be supportive. You know, we we appreciate all of the work that you guys do. A lot of the events that get put on are are delightful. Um and so we're not trying to like, you know, kind of really be looking over

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your shoulder too much. Um, and mostly I would think about this in terms of how much advanced notice do you need on something? If we need city council approval in order to do something, you know, that has to go on a city council agenda. City council only meets one meets once every two weeks. Sometimes

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there's already stuff on that agenda that's going to take up all the time. So, it might not go for a meeting or two. Um, so just kind of thinking about that in terms of the amount of time it takes to get that approval. Um, more than it's usually not that hard to get the city council to say yes to the kinds

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of park events that we've been doing. Um, so it's mostly kind of a timing thing. Uh, my kind of final um thing here, uh, Robert's rules of order. We kind of go through this stuff. Um, I'm not going to spend too much time on Robert's rules of

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order. My my general rule uh is that if you have two people who are fighting about Robert's rules of order, uh no, they aren't. They're fighting about something else. Uh something else has gone wrong. Uh and they're trying to use that as, you know, part of a larger

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conflict. Um now that said, we do have some kind of basic, you know, procedural requirements. We want to make sure there's votes on things and that, you know, if someone is looking back and looking at, you know, five years from now and we want to say, "Oh my gosh, whoever thought yoga in the park was a

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good idea," they can go back, they can look at the minutes, they can say, "Oh, it was voted on, you know, at this meeting and specifically like which one of you voted yes." Um, we want to be keeping a record of that. If it's a unanimous decision, we will write it down as unanimous and then that you can

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we trust people to do the math themselves on. if you were there and it was unanimous, then what was your vote, you know, that's good enough. So, it's not overall sort of that burdensome. The general kind of flow, you were doing a great job. Um, you know, kind of going through the start of it. We have someone

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who's the chair of the meeting. Um, they will introduce a business item. Um, someone will make a motion. There will be some discussion. Um, there might be, um, sometimes for some, you know, park items, there might be a public hearing involved. Um, so there you just want to

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make sure you're very clear about, you know, when is the commission having a discussion amongst the commissioners and then when is the public allowed to come up and say their piece. Uh, I would say this is probably the one that gets off

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the rails most frequently is if there's something that is um, you know, considered to be a little bit controversial. Um, I've seen this happen a lot when cities are continuing or considering uh either establishing a new park or getting rid of an old park. Uh,

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people have very strong opinions about that. Um, people will come in, they want to talk, they want to say their piece, they want to be part of the conversation. Um, if we're having a sevenperson conversation amongst the commissioners, we can kind of keep a lid on things and keep track of things. uh if it's a really contentious issue

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and we're trying to have a conversation with 50 people where everyone is kind of talking at the same time, it just doesn't go well. Uh and then things take a really long time. Uh I was at a meeting until almost 11 last night. No one likes that. Um,

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so, uh, it can be it can feel kind of uncomfortable or unnecessarily formal, um, if there's kind of people out in the audience, uh, and some of them might know something about what we're talking about, right? If we're talking about um

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you know, I know there's a lot of people who who do volunteer um you know, kind of park cleanup and those these sorts of events, we might be talking about it as the commission and we might it might seem like a good idea to just say, "Oh, hey John in the audience like what what do you know about what's going on in

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this park?" Um and it can feel a little unnecessarily formal to be like and now we opened the floor to public comment about this item. Um, but really the reason that we do that even when it's a

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small item because usually there's like one person and we could include them in the conversation and it would be fine. The reason why we do that is that if the general practice is people in the audience can just be uh an open part of the conversation. It makes it really

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hard in situations where we don't want that to happen to try now try and enforce the rule. um you know, even if it's a very good reason, right? Like we'll let one person talk, we won't let 50 people talk. It's just we want to keep everything kind of on even even footing.

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>> Are we allowed to open up um discussion topics to the public? Because I thought we were only had that option at the beginning of the meeting. So, at the beginning of the meeting, you have a what's like a public comment period, uh, which is a time for anyone to bring

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whatever they want to to your attention. Uh, under the the the rules that we kind of have written up there, the open forum part of it is for items that are not otherwise on the agenda. So that is for, you know, hey, I don't

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know if you're aware, but here's something that you might need to address at a future meeting or send it talk to staff about or um you know, uh the bathrooms at Casey Lake Park are out of toilet paper or whatever. Um you know,

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someone can come in and sort of bring those to your attention at the public forum. Um for sort of more normal business items, usually we don't have the public there. For some things we are required to have a a public hearing where we we have a formal opportunity where we say we're opening a public

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meeting or a yeah public hearing. Anyone who is from the public who wants to comment can now come up to the microphone and say their part. Um for some things we are required to do that. We can if we want to even if it's not required. Uh and so if there's a lot of people here who have strong feelings

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about it um and we think there might be some value in you know having and again keeping it kind of as an orderly process and we say if you want to speak on this come up to the microphone we'll give people three minutes we'll have everyone talk one at a time you can say your

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comment and then we'll have you sit down. Once everyone said their comment then you know the the commission will discuss. we're not going to have kind of an open-ended 50 person discussion about something. Um you can you always have that option. Um

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so uh there are a few things um you know sort of motions that's like we want to consider a business item. There are some secondary motions that's we have some action to take about this other thing that we're um already considering. Um

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motion to amend uh is probably the most common one. Um generally speaking, motions and secondary motions all require a motion and a second uh and then a vote. Um even uh a motion to amend, there is under Robert's rules no such thing as a

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friendly amendment. Um so under Robert's rules, there is no such thing as a friendly amendment. So friendly amendment, it's not the end of the world if it happens. um it's not going to invalidate anything. Uh this is mostly me being a lawyer about it, but where someone will say I make a motion

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to approve, you know, whatever this is, and then someone says, "Oh, wouldn't that be better if we did we approved it with this condition in it?" And then if the person who makes the motion agrees with that, there is a tendency to just say, "Oh, yeah, let's pretend that was

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the motion that I actually made." And you you either have to restate it or you have to say like one person will say I make a motion to approve this um this park plan or whatever and then someone else will say I would like to amend the

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approval to be approved with conditions and then you have to have a a second and a vote on the amendment. If that passes, that is now part of the original motion and you now have to have a second vote on the actual business item that you're doing. Um,

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again, these are these rules are kind of designed for larger more sort of legislature style bodies. So, it can be a little clunky. Uh, and ultimately, as long as the rules are fair and everyone on the commission gets a chance to say

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their piece and everyone knows exactly what it is that they are discussing and voting on at any given time, we're not really going to have any problems if you know you can pull out Robert's rules and say, you know, I'm actually that was supposed to be uh the speaker was

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supposed to or the the chair was supposed to make that motion and not the vice chair. as long as everyone is following what's happening, we're good to go. But that's just kind of the overall kind of cadence of of how to do um the kind of the

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general business. And so we just want to make sure that someone is stating what are we what are we voting on and then we are having a vote on that item. Um about the only time where this starts to get really that complicated um is there

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are um provisions that we can have people attend meetings remotely um that's part of the open meeting law. There's some requirements in how you post that. Um if someone is attending remotely then we have to do what's called a roll call vote which is instead of all in favor say I and everyone says

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yes we have to go down the line and say commissioner Greyche yes. Commissioner Zadraa yes. Commissioner Caller. Yes. And we have to get those individual votes if someone's appearing remotely. I >> was just going to clarify whether you meant if the commissioners were meeting virtually or if any public was meeting

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virtually. >> Yes. So it's it's the commission if one of if a member of the commission is appearing remotely. >> Um the rules are at least one person has to be here physically present in the meeting place. Uh and then there are some notice requirements. Uh and then

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everyone has to be able to um see and hear every each other and everything that is being said. Um so there are options available if you have to like zoom in to a meeting. Um you cannot call in by phone because then no one can see you.

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Um so that's kind of that. But >> does that person have to be in public? I remember that being a disc uh not anymore. >> Not anymore. Okay. >> Not anymore. They changed. you used to have to disclose where you were and it had to be a place that was publicly accessible. >> Uh and then co happened and everyone

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said, "Why are we doing this?" Um so I've we've seen meetings where someone's at like uh I think I had one where someone was in the mess hall of a boy scout camp and so we posted like the messaul of camp such and such is the

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location where this commissioner is is. uh anyone who wants to observe them during the meeting can can go to the mess hall at this camp if you really want to >> if you'd really like to. >> Um we don't have to do that anymore. Thank goodness.

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Um so that's kind of my presentation. I have just thrown a whole lot of information at you. Um I know that was that was a lot. I've been doing a lot of talking up here. Um, mostly again, we just want you to be all

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kind of aware of these rules and we want you to just to kind of have that little voice in the back of your head of, you know, if you're if you're see people out and about and you're thinking about talking and you just kind of go like, "Weren't there some rules about this or something?" Um, and for the most part, if your instinct is, "Weren't there some

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rules about this?" "Hey, Sarah, are there rules about this?" 99.8% of the time, that is going to cover you just fine. Um, so you know, again, I we don't expect any of you to, you know, be your own lawyer. Um, most of the time dealing with these things is not that

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complicated. Just want you to be kind of thinking of cognizant of some of these requirements. Um, and if you ever have any questions about sort of this really the the nitty-gritty specifics of, you know, my um, my cousin's

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girlfriend's uh, niece is a member of this lawn care company that we're considering. Is that a conflict of interest? No, it's probably not. But if you have something like that um where you're just wondering about it, again, just reach out to staff and we can, you know, we can kind of

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walk you through everything. Um for the most part, you know, people do people get stung by some of these things every now and again. Uh, and for the most part, you know, sometimes you see people getting in trouble and you go, "Oh, God, there." But, you know, there, but for

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the grace of God, go I. And for the most part with these kinds of things, you you see the things that are going on that get people in trouble and you go, "Well, yeah, of course you're going to get in trouble for that." Um, so it's not, we don't try and be kind of like gotcha about it. Um,

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you know, I think the the big one there was a open meeting law violation where there was a city council that was talking about basically they were just talking about something that was going to be very unpopular. Uh, and so they just had their attorney attend the meeting and said, "Nope, this is attorney client privileged. Everyone else get out of here. We don't want you

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listening." Uh, and uh, that is not how attorney client privilege works. Um, >> so that that did not go well for them. Um, so for the most part it's just sort of like anytime you're you're trying to do something like really clever. Um, usually that's how you get in trouble.

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Um, but again the require the actual requirements are not overly ownorous. If you're going to be somewhere, make sure it's posted. If you're going to talk to somebody, make sure it's on your official email address. Um, if there's if for some reason there's

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some need to you if if a member of the public emails you on your personal email address, forward that to your official email address and then reply from there. Um, if you need to take a like a photo of something, um, you want some photos for the website of a park event or

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something like that, take a photo on your phone, email that photo to yourself again at your official email address and then delete it off of your phone. And now there's no government data on your phone. It's all on the city's system and we don't have to, you know, merge those two things. So, it's all fairly easy to

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keep and keep track of. But we just kind of want you to to be aware of this stuff. >> Awesome. >> All right. >> I do have one question mostly just for me because I was curious. >> So, if our chair our chairperson isn't here, so Sarah is doing our vice chair.

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If Sarah wasn't here, who is supposed to run the meeting? What does that look like? if the chair and vice chair are both gone. >> Yeah. So, you have a designated chair, you have a designated vice chair. Other than that, um if those two are gone, but you still have a quorum, so we can still

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do business. >> Um you designate somebody. >> Okay. >> So, it's just uh and then you would want to like kind of make a record of, you know, you'd open the meeting and you'd say, you know, we are the you know, now opening the meeting. Um the members have

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designated Commissioner Kohler as uh chair for the evening. Um and then we just move on with it. >> Okay, that's simple. >> Yeah. >> Thanks so much, Jack. We appreciate your time. >> Thank you for coming. >> Absolutely. And like I said, um reach out to your staff leaison. They're

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great. They'll probably be able to answer most of your questions. Um if they can't answer something, they know where to find me. We'll make sure that you get the answers you need. >> Sounds good. >> Awesome. Thanks so much. >> Thank you. >> Thank you, Jeff. All right, we'll keep moving on then. Um, election of officers, we we're going to not put that

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off anymore. Um, yes. Um, and to state, uh, Laura has expressed interest in being chair again for 2026. Um, I received that word via email. Um, so we'll start with the chair

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if there's any other anyone else interested in being chair. Otherwise, we can uh move for a vote. Okay, >> we're just voting on the chair first and then the vice. >> Yeah, we'll do them. >> I make a motion. Uh, >> thank you.

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>> I make a motion. Lord Greenley Karp is the chair for 2026. >> I second. Want to take a vote? We want to do this vote. All those in favor? >> I.

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>> All those opposed. >> Perfect. >> She's voted in. Does anybody want to be vice chair? Sit in this big seat. >> Assume you want to be vice chair. >> I was put in this position. I was not asked, but I don't mind being vice chair. >> Thank >> Should I make a

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>> Sure. >> I make a motion that Sarah Sarco be vice chair. >> Seconded. >> All those in favor? >> I. >> All those opposed. All right. You have to feel the love. >> I know. Thank you.

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>> Of all four of us. Thank you. >> It's a fun ride. >> I was gone last year during that meeting and Laura Vess like you're the vice chair by the way. Oh, I am. Okay. >> Yeah, we by the way you >> Yeah. I was like, "Okay, well, good to know. >> You do great." >> Yeah, >> they both do. >> All right. Well, so I guess we don't

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need any other officers since we know you'll just designate someone. Do we want to like try to power through this lakes thing that you found here? The review of chapter 92. >> Yeah, it shouldn't be terrible. I can go through it pretty quickly. So, um, yes, the chapter 92 of our city code, which

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covers parks and lakes, um, I decided I wanted to take a look at it and realized most of it had not been updated since 1989. >> Oops. Yeah. So, um, I took some time um, along with uh, our community development director, Ken Roberts, um, to look

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through it, make recommended updates. So, the first um, portion of your packet that refers to this shows all the track changes. Um, since then we've done some formatting changes so you can ignore like the letters and numbers that are out of order. Um, but the content is the

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same. And then the second portion you'll see is the cleaner version. Um, essentially what we did is we looked at what are current issues or things that are in our parks that we need to address as well as looking at other cities in the area, other communities to see what

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they have in theirs um, and develop these recommendations. I will say uh one u addition that I would like to recommend that isn't in the packet. We had a resident reach out with some comments um on the recommendations and

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they recommended banning glass beverage bottles in all of our city parks. Um city staff is supportive of that as well. So if we want to add that language, let me know. Um and I can do that. But just wanted to get your thoughts on this and if you like what we have in here, um, we can take a vote

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today and I will bring it to council on April 7th. If we feel we need to table it or have additions or anything, I can certainly do that as well. So, >> just one question about the glass. I'm in support of that when I think about people sitting around the park drinking like a glass bottle. Sure. My one

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question is we allow alcohol in our buildings and wine would be a big part of that and wine doesn't come in anything usually >> most of but most people aren't buying the boxed wine if they're buying procco or something. So my question would be is there a way to amend it to say like no

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open alcohol in the park like no glass bottles. I don't know exactly how to write this but I'm trying to think of like if I rented a building and I couldn't bring wine I might be ticked about that. So, >> it does currently say in our park rental policy, no glass, and we have not had an issue. >> Okay.

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>> Um, however, we can amend that. That's not a problem. Um, but it does currently say that. >> Well, if it >> if it hasn't been a problem, >> it sounds like people are probably doing it and they're just not making a mess of it or something. But, >> which I feel like if we want to include

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glass in the park rental policy, I think it would be better. >> Maybe that's different than the park. >> Yeah. Verse this. Yeah. Agree. Yeah, because I'm definitely on board. Like someone's sitting out by the volleyball thing drinking a Haritos or something and it breaks. Yeah, it's just >> Okay. >> Yeah.

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>> Otherwise, um yeah, there's just kind It's like a lot of additions in here. I would say the biggest ones to highlight would be um we added a lot to not damaging particularly the vegetation in the parks. Um as well as some additional

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language in the littering section. And then we've updated um the section on uh vehicles, ebikes, bicycles, skateboards, motorized foot scooters. Um we're becoming aware of e- modtos as well. So that may be something um I might add

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some language in here for that too. Um just to make sure we're covered, but those are kind of the main changes. Um yeah, so if there's any comments or questions or concerns, I'm happy to take that. I think it's great. Thanks for catching

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this and looking back. >> Oh, and it officially updates the park hours. We voted on that, but it never got changed in the city ordinance. >> Okay. >> So, this would then remedy that as well. >> Great. >> What are is the park hours 7 a.m. to 10 p.m. or is it >> Yes. Okay. >> Yep. >> Oh, and this is shorter period than

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that. >> Yeah. >> Page number. What's the page? So, what are we going to Fields 2 has a separate time listed? I I got I'm like 9:00 a.m. That's late for park, but I'm >> starts on page 19. >> Okay.

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>> But um yeah, the park hours are kind of spread out through this. There's a few times where it's listed and it's been wrong. So, we're going to make sure that that gets updated. >> So, we're doing what? 10 7 a.m. to 10 p.m. We said >> 7 a.m. 10 p.m.

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>> Um yeah, looks great, Sarah. Thanks for all the hard work on that. >> Yeah, I know. a lot of minute details you got to comb through in that capacity. >> Yeah, absolutely. I think this is going to be really helpful, really great, a

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lot to stand on if there is damage or anything in the parks as well. So, >> can I ask a question about um under the no person may hitch number four and any animal or fasten anchor or otherwise attach a wire rope or sign blah blah

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blah to any tree, shrub or plant. How hard and fast is that rule? Because like if someone is having a barbecue and they want to >> table, >> they want to have their pet, their dog at the event and they want to tie a

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leash around a tree, a substantial tree. >> Yes. >> Is that a problem? >> I would say to be completely transparent, this is more of a reactive rule rather than proactive. So we're not going to go out and look for that. Right. >> However, if there were damage due to

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that, we have leg. >> Okay. >> Don't be tying your horse up, Ty. >> Saddling your giddy up over there. >> Don't h itch my giddy up. >> Don't hitch your giddy up, Tinny. >> Unless it's a real big tree. >> The first thing I thought is I'm like, what kind of animals are we? It's

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Oklahoma. Like, that was a rule. It lists. >> In my neighborhood, you could not tether your horse to any mules listed. >> Good to know. Need a motion, Sarah, or not? >> Yes. Yeah, I would take a motion if we >> I'll make a motion that we approve the

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amendments in the notes. >> I would say chapter 92. >> Chapter 92, the parks and lakes as noted in the minutes or >> the packet.

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>> In the packet. Okay. A second. I'll second that. Any discussion? All those in favor? >> I >> I All those opposed. All right. So moved. >> Um there was a discussion to potentially push the next topic park representatives

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to the next meeting since we are lacking a couple people tonight and we might want their insight on what parks they might want to be assigned to. So I suggest um >> I make a motion to move that topic to the April meeting. >> Second. >> All right. Any discussion? Those in

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favor? I. Those opposed. All right, reports from staff. >> All right, I got a few here, but I will make it quick. Um, the first one I will need feedback on, though. Um, we, as I mentioned in a previous email, um, we were looking at May 16th as our date for

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the citywide parks cleanup. We did the citywide cleanup last year, however, the weather didn't really cooperate, so there wasn't a huge turnout, but I know that there was interest in doing it again this year. Um, May 16th would be in line the same as last year. Um it

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would be the weekend after the citywide cleanup event. Um so we kind of still make May that like North St. Paul cleanup month. Um we also have interest from the Rotary Club would like to collaborate with uh the parks commission. U they would like to clean

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up Rotary Park that day. Um so I'm just looking for feedback if that date seems like it would work. Um we can certainly decide on parks when there's more commissioners here that we want to focus on but just preliminarily if we can want to move forward or not.

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>> Can I clarify um the lake association are they on board with that date? >> Um I have mentioned it to them but I have not heard back yet >> because that is a problem when those two are different dates. Sure. Um then then that becomes more of a burden on

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on it just becomes very difficult to find people to clean the the the people who show up to clean up at Silver Lake Park are the lake commission. They're very good about it. >> Um uh so I strongly feel like those

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>> we should be selecting the date they those should be the same date. >> Okay. Okay. Like, so is are they do they know yet what their date is? >> I I haven't heard. Um I would say if we wait too much longer to select our date,

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however, we won't be able to discuss it until April and then we can't really promote it until it's kind of late. So that's why would it be possible just to do you have their contact information? Could we just email them tomorrow and say, "Hey, here's the date we're proposing, >> but do you need us to vote on it?"

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>> Nope. >> Okay. No, just want to make >> I just wanted to get your feedback and we can start promoting it at least. >> Okay, but that's the date. >> I think we should pick an earlier date because I I know last year, even though it was a cold, poor weather day that

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there wasn't much to clean up because um the maintenance crews, it had warmed up substantially several weeks prior and they'd already gone around and cleaned up most most of everything. So, there's very little to clean up. >> Okay. Um, >> our issue has been though the last few

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years it's been in April and our turnout is bad and the weather has been notoriously bad. I mean the weather in May can be bad too to be honest, but >> I don't think we can plan on weather. I think we have to plan on >> I think they're trying to tie it around the citywide like because there's also

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the citywide event where you can take anything and dump it. So I think they're trying to tie it together. >> Yeah, it's that first weekend of May now is the trash to treasure event along with the citywide garage sale. Then the second weekend is a citywide cleanup. So the third weekend had been the parks.

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Just so it all ties in. If it were me, I would recommend then pushing it out hearing what you're saying. But once folks start using the parks more like in June, July, that would be when I would recommend doing it rather than pushing it earlier into April. I could see Mary

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in that like after Memorial Day because >> didn't you mention that after Memorial Day Silver Lake had needed to be picked up or was that Fourth of July? >> Oh, that's you. Yeah, actually that that happens. Um Memorial there it gets a lot of use uh on that weekend. Um I think

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the city's pretty good about picking up the garbage after that. Yeah. Um, but I I feel like it's it's just always been this spring event, not a summer event. >> I think we'd have a an even lower turnout. >> I was going to say I'm like, if you do it after Memorial Day, everyone's at

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their cabins. >> It's uh it's a weekend thing. And I think it's >> easier to get people to show up if it is in the spring and generally around the same time of the year >> as it has been. But um so has it been in April before? Is that what we think

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years ago it was? >> I feel like the last was last year May. >> Last year was May. >> Was the last I feel like most of the years I've done it, it was it was always around Earth Day. Like we tried to do an Earth Day thing and it was always like April 20th >> in the high school. >> It snowed one year. >> Used to be involved in it, but I don't know that they're involved in it

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anymore. >> Nope. Okay. Was it in your email you mentioned the Rotary Club um the Silver Lake Foundation and then didn't you mention that the Rotary Club was going to reach out to >> they were going to reach out to the high school and see the issue is because we do this on a weekend

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>> hard for those students. So >> well here's a thought too. So this you're saying the problem was the city comes and cleans stuff up. So it might be like a Casey Northwood they might be clean. Maybe we need to focus on like, you know, where it looks terrible, the

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environmental place right off of 36 where everyone throws their trash from the holiday. That pond over by Target where the trash just blows in. Like maybe we need to refocus this and on untraditional parks that are near bus stops because that is where the like you

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drive by that subway and it is trash city like but no one ever goes there. The city kind of they mow but they don't really pick it up. And I Yeah, I wonder if we can expand outside the parks, too. Like I I know >> I mean I I guarantee you if you go anywhere on the gateway, I mean in the

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environmental park right there does have a trail and I I don't see as much trash there, but right off of B, County Road B or South >> I know the Rotary would want to do that. >> Yeah. And then Rotary Park would probably be near the highway. So, like I'm thinking maybe we keep maybe we keep

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the date, but we focus. I mean, we can keep Silver Lake is going to do what Silver Lake is going to do, but maybe we don't go to Casey Lake. We don't go to Northwood because those are getting picked up. >> Where where I've had people complain to me is honestly near bus stops because because we've called the bus stations

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before and asked for trash cans near some of these places in North St. Paul and they won't do it because they don't have the manpower to go and change the trash. So people stand at the bus stops and they just throw their trash. >> And uh 11th Avenue is really bad. There's several bus stops along there. And because of Target and Cub and Home

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Depot, you just get a lot. So like maybe it's >> roadways. >> Maybe it's roadways near our parks like cuz what Postal Credit Union, whatever we call that park. That's >> the Postal Credit Union. >> That's our park. Like we could just have people spread along 11th between, you know, the North St. Paul Park between

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Ariel and Mcnite and even Mcnite Fields. I bet the outside of I've seen that outside Mcnite Fields is pretty gross by the highway. >> Yeah. Um is it is it Dave on city council? >> Who who's the is that Dave who does? >> Yeah, there's Dave.

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>> Um he does he's the arts >> assigned commissionro. Troy Troy and I did the um woodland area outside Mcnite right off of um >> on Mcnite and there was a lot there. Yeah, because the other parts we went to.

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>> So that would be my suggestion. Do do the environmental one over by the holiday on like be Mcnite outside and then like on 11th Street for the environmental >> if you guys think of any and then the Rotary Park would probably be a good one too. It may not be as trashed but >> well they can go on both sides of the

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gateway too if they feel like it. >> Yeah, >> I think that sounds wonderful. Yeah. Um what times do you think would be best to run this? Is it more of a morning thing, afternoon? >> It's a morning thing. I would say late morning, possibly early afternoon because if we have bad weather,

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>> I think it's extra unlikely people are going to want to be out in the morning. >> Well, although people do want to um the the advantage of having it in the morning, like 9 to 11 or something like that, something reasonable. The the hardcore cleanup crew will arrive early

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and leave late at we, you know, that's just what happens. Um, but if you say 9 to 11, then people can go, "Oh, yeah. Well, I can still do that thing in the afternoon, but it's yeah, oh, I see that's in the morning." I feel like that helps draw people as well. But if you

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have it go into the afternoon, then they feel like, "Oh, well, that day, you know, the whole >> Yeah. selfishly, I wouldn't want to do something in that like I'd want my afternoon free to do what I was going to do for the day, but I'd have usually have the morning before noon free. You know, that would be easy to squeeze in." bit.

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>> Do we think like maybe 10 to noon would be too late? I just want to capitalize on as warm as possible in case >> 10 to noon sounds good. How long do we normally do it for? >> Two hours. >> Oh, >> which we can do it. We can certainly do it longer. I just think you start to lose people's

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>> I think a two hour commitments. Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Three hours a bigger commitment. >> Yes. >> Well, perfect. So, um what I'll do is I'll start to put that together. We can start to get that promoted. Um and then at next meeting we can discuss who might want to take point at each of those

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locations. >> Yeah. >> Um and kind of go from there. >> What were the three places we were thinking of again? >> So the urban ecology center specifically along South Avenue. >> Um the postal credit union pond but

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specifically along 11th Avenue. >> Can we I don't know what that is. If I Okay. So just >> it's next to It's next to Subway. Um >> the one by Target. >> Yeah. So it's across from Target. There's a pond >> and there's a path >> and there's a subway and there's like a little walk path around it.

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>> We're just doing that because >> this thing >> we're just doing that because of uh >> See, every time I drive that I think that's the urban ecosystem. >> We established that that's not ours any >> city owned. Yeah. >> Still city owned. We'll go with it that way. Okay. >> Yep.

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>> Okay. And then the third uh location for the parks would be Mcnite Fields >> and then the Rotary Park take the lead on that >> and Silver Lake has to be a part of it. >> Yep. >> Too. >> Okay. >> I can take I assume I should be around

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but I can take the urban ecology center. Um >> I can do the um postal credit union pond. >> I will have to be done by 11:45 but I could start a little earlier too. So >> Okay. Yeah. Wonderful. Well, I will come back with

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the next meeting with all the information compiled neatly and nicely and then we can talk to everybody else and have the plan moving forward. >> Can I just double check so I understood that long presentation correctly? I can't just post and say does anyone want

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to come help park cleanup? >> I think social media >> can but then like we can't post on it like we can't comment on it. >> You can't add to it. I was confused about that. >> That's data. >> Can't you call that an event? >> Even you posting that personally, that

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still qualifies as it's the role of you as a commissioner. So if someone asks for information, that would be included. >> Well, we can call it an event or whatever we need to call it, a meeting. >> That way if we

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>> which I will do for this cleanup date. >> Yes, that's my suggestion is >> Yeah. I just I'm like I feel like I might have done that in the past where I've posted things like come to the Fire and Ice Festival just for like I have a lot of friends on my Facebook page that live in North St. Paul and I'm like I

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just want to help promote these events but now it sounds like I'm not supposed to be promoting events. >> No, it that it's I from what I understood that inherently is not an issue. It's just if there was a data request for your information. >> Oh, then I just have to share with them. Yes. Okay. >> And then that means that >> because there's nothing malicious there.

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There shouldn't be multiple of us commenting on your post. Then >> Sarah, I'm not trying to give you anything more to do because I'm sure you're too busy, but um would it be a good idea for us to have just

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guidelines? Like for example, one of us can post something. I'm not on social media, so it doesn't I don't really have to worry about it, but social media can be such a great tool for getting people to events. So I think to protect any of us who were going to

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post on social media, can we just clarify that? And you know, I know it's all right there, >> but can we just put it in, you know, like for example, Sarah could post that's called that would be data, but and we shouldn't, you know, like respond

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to her post. Can we like drop our own guidelines? Historically, we've usually talked to the city before we've done it. And you know, like in your in your case, hey, I'd like to do this.

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>> I'd like to do a post. >> Send it to the city. >> Let the city >> I've never done that, Lloyd. I just do it. >> Yeah. So, >> because it's like for my friends, you know, like I'm not friends with everybody in the city. I'm friends with my neighbors and like >> right >> you and like this person and like it's

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more just >> a lot of neighbors don't check the city website but they'll see it when you post it you know or they know Sarah's involved so they probably know if Sarah posted they're like oh okay yeah we'll do that >> theoretically >> yeah I don't I don't know I just want to I want to protect all of us uh from

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accidentally doing the wrong thing >> well what I'll do I'm not comfortable making that myself so I will ask Jack to see if he has some sort of guidelines that he can certainly provide that brings clarity. I mean, it's it's probably all here, but

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you know, maybe it's >> it's probably too tricky because if he just writes down like five things and legally it doesn't encompass everything like I would say Ingred as nice as that would be. I think it just has to be more of a he's probably going to come annually and talk about this or

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something and then we as a group discuss it if we have new members just because I remember when I came in somebody told me like three of you can't be you know like like it was told to me. So yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> I emailed the whole council one time.

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>> Yes. >> That's how we learned about >> not the council, the commission said, "I'm not going to be at the meeting. >> This is my opinion." >> Well, that was a long time ago. >> Or which the city manager. >> Yeah. Okay. >> Went naughty naughty. >> Yeah.

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>> All right. Is there anything else left about the citywide cleanup? Are we good? >> No. Okay. Next. >> Um, my other quick updates. As you see on your desk, I have made a brochure about our parks. >> This was recommended by a community member and so I put this together. >> Oh, nice.

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>> If you have feedback, let me know. Um otherwise, I plan on staff approved it. Um it's intended to just be high level like what does each park provide, not any sort of details. um details are available on our website, but I can put

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this available um to start at least here at city hall and then have an electronic version as well. But any feedback? Yes. >> Um upon seeing this now for the first time, I think having just this front part with the QR code

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>> posted at our parks perhaps in a little laminated thing either like on a building or sign or whatever. I think that would be handy. And then possibly in like Casey and like housy um like inside the wellprotected buildings we

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could have some of these flyers so someone could grab some. >> Yeah, absolutely. >> That could be good idea. >> Great job, Sarah. Good brochure. >> Yeah. Yeah, >> it's beautiful. >> Thank you. >> I can add graphic design to my resume. >> Yes. >> One of your many talents.

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>> Um and then the quick other updates. So, I know we talked about switching gears to Mcnitefields and we're we have we are in possession of all the documents regarding the um the land restrictions. Um it doesn't look like there's any land

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restrictions any longer. Therefore, storage will be necessary by public works and electric. So, we already were aware of that that that could be an option. So, at our next meeting, Ron, our public works director, is going to come present what we found, what they

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will need as storage out there, and what um them steps moving forward would be. >> Okay. >> Okay. Excellent. >> Um I have been working with Ken so much on this DNR grant um potentially for Casey Lake Park in the hockey rink.

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Uh it's due on Tuesday. So, um we submitted the preliminary one, got really good feedback on it. Um, so we're submitting the final one on Tuesday. Um, as soon as we hear from that, we'll communicate and let you know. Um, and a final decision will need to be made by

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the parks commission if you wanted to move forward with the grant or not. Um, they award that in June, though, so it'll be a little while. Um, and then the last thing I I referenced in the email um, last month, we have a firefighter here on the North St. Paul

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department that is in the medallion hunt community >> and likes to run them. He's part of the one that runs uh the St. Paul winter carnival one. He does South St. Paul. Um has a parks one that he does all year round. He just is like super passionate about it. Um essentially

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he would take all of the responsibility. He makes the medallions. He does the clues. Um we just post it on social media. Um he works with businesses to get prizes. Um really there's nothing to be done with the city. Um council is

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supportive of it. So want to get your final thoughts before we let him start doing these. Um it sounds like council's only hesitation was they don't want to do it year round. They want it to be more of a they don't want to get watered down. I'll say that. Um so make them

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bigger deals if we're going to do it. Um otherwise they're supportive. Just want to get your thoughts on on that. I was so excited reading about that. I was like, "This sounds incredible. >> I would love if they if the if the

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firefighter would like volunteers, I would love to help. It sounds like an awesome opportunity. Sounds like a really cool thing for the city." I'm >> I'm very supportive. >> Perfect. >> Yeah. >> And I think there were some um I didn't read about it in detail, but he was

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saying be careful in the partner. There are rules about what you how you can look in the park and >> so that the park >> land and shrubs and all that won't be >> hurt by the hunt. Okay. >> Yep. And there's no there'll never be

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digging involved. I mean there should never be anything that destroys or defaces anything in the parks. >> Yeah, I like it. >> Seems like a great idea. So >> yeah. >> Yeah. >> Perfect. That's all from me. So >> all right, we can do reports from commissioners. We'll start at the front

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with Rachel. Any reports? >> Um, okay. So, this is just general business. We're not doing the parks, >> right? >> Both. Both. We're gonna call it both. >> It divide it. >> Okay. >> Um, I swung by Northwood before this and

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they have the Gaga bit. Gaga pit out >> in the hockey rink and it's beautiful. >> Great. >> Oh, I'm thinking perhaps we want to like announce like, hello, look at this new feature we have. This is what it is. I think they just did that today. So, yes. >> Oh, wow. Okay, cool. >> Yeah.

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>> Yes. And then Oh, they just put it out today. >> Yeah. >> Today. It looks like it was brand new. >> You chose the right day to swing by that part. >> Oh, the Gaga pit. >> Yeah. Went out yesterday or yesterday. >> Was there last week? >> Oh, >> okay. >> Be nice to have we could put a sign or

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something. >> Yes. If we also have like a laminated sign explaining like this is what it is. >> Yeah, absolutely. >> I think that'll be helpful. Um, when do we discuss summer meetings as in

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like in the parks? >> Anytime. >> Okay. Do we can we add that to the agenda for next month >> to figure out where and when we're going? >> Good. >> Um Um,

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that's an uh I already did Um, okay. I am done. >> Great. >> All right, Ingred. >> Uh, I don't have anything.

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>> Okay. Nothing. >> Lloyd, >> can we get uh uh supplies to clean up like Southwood? I' I'd come and get them from You got them at the city that we can pick up. >> Sure. Like uh garbage bags. >> Yeah. Yeah, that's all I'm going to need. Yes. >> I can pull that together for you.

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>> Yep. Yep. Cuz it's going to right now it's going to be me and that's fine. I'm okay with that. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Yeah, I can do that. >> All right. >> Otherwise, no, I'm good. >> All right. Um I just I know we had discussed a while back about a ribbon

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cutting at um Polar. >> And do we know when that is and when that will be? >> Not yet. I do have that um as soon as they can get in there to get the new wood chips put in um immediately I'll get that scheduled. So, it's on my radar. >> All right.

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Um I don't think I have anything else for me. Um All right. We'd like you to make a motion to adjurnn. >> So moved. >> Uh all those >> favor. >> Just second. >> Second. >> Okay. >> All those in favor?

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>> I. All those opposed adjourned. >> Perfect.