Good. Good evening. Excuse me, everyone. Uh it is what's the date? October 6th and welcome to the joint select board and fin meeting. Um I want to call the meeting to order. We have
uh Kevin O'Neal, Bob Kimell, Roger Maran, and myself of the select board. Is it online? Mr. Town Manager? She is. Yes, she just joined. I am promoting her to a panelist.
Okay. And Denise Luciano Zoom. So, Bill, go ahead and open yours, please. Good evening. Opening the October 6, 2025 finance committee meeting. In attendance
here would be Tracy, Paula, Gavin, Paul, Zach. I I believe Sandy is online and no one else. Okay. Okay. So that is quum.
Thank you, sir. Let's start with the pledge of allegiance, please. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and
justice for all. Okay. All right. We are uh discussing tonight uh the fall annual town meeting articles as well as voting or revote on
um on each of them. So, uh let's start with number one. Everybody have their copy? So this one's all set. Finom has taken action and board of selectman have uh
recommended article number one. So article number two bylaw amendment chapter 110 personal bylaws article 2 job classifications section 110-10 and article 3 salary plan section 11- 110-11.
Mr. Town Manager. Thank you Mr. Chair. So, what this is is a reorganization of the town manager's office to add an assistant uh town manager of administration and personnel and to
fund that with the same funding um allocated for the assistant to the town manager. So, it's budget neutral and it provides a long awaited HR function that that the finance committee, the select board town meeting has all um agreed
that this was long overdue. Um so, this reduces legal and compliance risks and provides a level of professionalism that um pretty much every city and town in the Commonwealth enjoys. So, we're we're getting up to par um on handling
necessary risks. Um also, it adjusts the schedule the the payment schedule for the public works director by moving that um slightly to reflect market conditions. And the
information technology dire director also adjusts the salary line slightly. and and those are all priorities of of the town moving forward. They were identified almost universally uh DPW
director which I I believe if all goes well we'll be able to post that this week. Um and then the assistant town manager of personnel and administration um would also be posted and the IT
director would we're trying to find a way to bring that online within the next month or two um subject to any questions. Okay. Any anyone on the select board have any questions for the town manager?
Um Mr. Chair. Yes, sir. Um, Mr. Town Manager, um, the, um, personnel in your office, that is a, um, a budget neutral um, position. Is that correct? Uh, yes, sir.
Thank you. Anybody else? Denise Kevin. No. No. Mr. Chair. Yes, sir. I make a motion that we recommend article two to town meeting. Second. Okay. Motion in a second. We need to do a roll
call. Correct, Mr. Telman? Yes, Mr. Chair. Okay. Uh Denise, she's on mute, I believe. There we go. Denise, we we can't hear you.
I don't love the technology. Oh, yes. Yes. Yes. Okay. Denise says yes. Denise is a yes. Kevin, yes. Rob, yes. Roger. Yes. And I am a yes as well. It's unanimous.
Okay, Mr. Chair. Um, anyone from FINCOM have any questions? Mr. Chair, yes. I was just wondering, Mr. Town Manager, do we have a uh an IT director at the
moment? Excellent question. And we have a part-time IT person who has unfortunately been hospitalized since I've been here. So, we've been really, really, really strapped for IT assistance.
Yeah. Case in point, in case we didn't notice with this, to be honest, uh the Zoom at meetings by no fault of anybody here tends to be a little bit lackluster. Will, uh will this hopefully improve that sort of thing? Is that does that fall under
their duties? Uh, precisely. That's my number one priority and I spent more hours than I would like to to disclose this week on that. Awesome. Awesome. Thank you. Anybody else? All right. I'll entertain a motion.
Mr. Chair Zach, I'll make a motion to recommend article two as presented. Second. I have a motion and a second. Any further discussion
hearing? None. Sandy. Sandy is a yes. Gavin, yes. Tracy, yes. Paula, yes. Paul, yes. Zack, yes. I to yes. That is unanimous.
Uh, Mr. share. Uh I think Denise tried to speak on Zoom, but there's like an echo or something. They're thinking maybe um Mark, you may need to mute your mic on your laptop to resolve the issue. I can try that. When I do it, it says
it's not recording correctly. So, I try to keep it at a minimum volume so it records. I I can try it. and willing to try anything subject to Shane's expert advice. Mute because I'm picking up everything that's in
We're muted. Thank you. Okay. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Okay, that's article two. Um, Mr. Town Manager, article three, FY26 operating
budget amendments, please. Uh, so this is a request for $185,000, no $185,574 for various uh supplements to the operating budget, which is not my favorite use of free
cash, but that's the position that we find ourselves in. The bulk of it is uh police overtime that was um omitted from the Springtown meeting with the understanding that it would be uh put back in the fall. And there are various
other uh transfers requested due to contractual obligations such as uh union members and other staff who have contract increases, um the ability to attend certain conferences that we're contractually
obligated to. So, can you repeat that number again, Mr. Manager? $185,000. 574 $185,574. Thank you. Okay,
with that, um, any of our board have any questions? You see me? Mr. Chair. Yes, sir. Um, Mr. Town Manager, this is your recommendation, right?
1855 574ments. Oh, I apologize. That was an old number I was working off of. It is an even 200,000 because were is that what you were getting? Because James and I uh decided that we
could add um 14,000 the balance to make it an even $200,000 giving finance committee the discretion over $14,500 should we need it between now and the spring because as you know towns don't have the flexibility that cities have to
adjust line items. So if we run into a sticky situation which I may or may not be anticipating with IT funding we could come to finance committee and request a transfer. So it's an even 200,000. Okay.
Mr. Chair. Sir, I make a motion that we recommend article three to town meeting. Okay, hang hang on one second, please. The total from three cashes. I don't agree with that number.
Okay. So, we need to tell them those two also. Yes, cuz they're probably if if I may. Yes sir. So thank you. So I was informed the that all the numbers need to be uh read. So the 200,000 is the free cash number. The $25,000
and49 $25,049 is transfers. So that's neutral. That's not asking for any money. That's just transferring money from one line to another mostly because of um maturing
debt that we need to pay on bonds. Um the final item is raise and appropriate. Um because we did not um tax to the full amount yet and there are $467,491 um that we're requesting to do that for.
Did I get it, James? Great. Any questions for our board? No, Denise. No, Denise. Denise has her hand up.
Yes, Denise. Go ahead. Please. Seems a bit unusual to me. So, the the raise inappropriate, correct me if I get this wrong, James. That is because there are additional expenses and for
whatever reason the the recap when we set the tax rate before it didn't tax the full 2.5%. So it roughly taxed say 2.2% not 2.25%. And we have uh these other expenses due
to an unexpected increase in health insurance and bond interest that equal the amount of the untaxed money. So, we're not taxing more than 2 and a half%. You're more than welcome to speak to it,
James. Please. Um, the uh debt excluded bonds that we issued in June or June 18th, 2025. It was after town meeting. The payments on those bonds will be due uh part of it
will be due this year. we're allowed to tax over the two and a half for those because those are debt excluded. Um, and that's part of the the number. And then once we finalize uh the the state a numbers and everything else,
we came up which with this breakdown which is the best way to to allocate the funds. We are transferring above that from um unused short-term uh debt that we had uh appropriated in May that we didn't end
up needing and um let it all out. But um that's why we ended up with more um excess uh levy capacity is because of the debt excluded bonds. Mr. Chairman, so the net is 200,000. What are we what are we moving for a
number here? Um the two the three oh I'm sorry I'm looking at the wrong one again. The 467,491 is going to be raised and appropriate from taxes and most of it is that levy capacity is
most most of it is from the debt excluded bonds. And then the 200 what's that? The 200,000 above is coming from free cash. And then if you see the 205 in the middle, that's just transferring from um
the shortterm uh short-term debt to long-term debt for the most part. And some funds being transferred from payroll in uh the treasurer's office and payroll in the council and agent office into those line items.
Mr. Chair. Yes, sir. Um, what's the number that's going to be on this line item when we go to town meeting? They all have to be read separately. Um, if you see the table that shows account 01132502
at the top, the reserve fund. Hang on. I don't I Does everybody have that? Yeah, it's in your like halfway through the packet. Looks like this. If you go to after.
Okay. Just want to make sure everybody sees the same thing. So, Mr. Chair, if I'm reading this correctly, the total amount to be raised and appropriate under that article is 467,000 and change. I see it. So, the funding sources, correct me if I'm wrong, James, so this what you're
breaking down for us? Yes. The 467 is the amount of money going into the uh this is it health insurance account 320,000 uh interest on long-term debt 147491 that's the uh 467491
then there will be 20549 u worth of departmental transfers. Uh so we're taking money from 01147 which is the treasurer's office into 01155 which is the IT department
$10,000. That's budget neutral. We're taking it from one department giving it to them to the other and uh those transfers add up to 205049. Okay, I see it. Now above that you see 200,000. We didn't have enough enough levy
capacity to increase the budget by by 200,000 within the levy limit. So, we're using free cash and they're going into the individual accounts that you see listed above the total employee. If we were not using free cash and we had levy capacity, the amount would have
been to raise an appropriate 667,491. That's how much we're increasing the budget by in total. 667,000. 200 from free cash, 467 from taxes taxes, and then we're moving 205,049 around within the budget. So, it's a net
zero effect. That's probably the clearest way to explain it. All right, Mr. Chairman. Yes, sir. Yeah, I would agree. When we go to town meeting, you're going to have to explain this because in my many years of doing this, I've never seen anything as
extensive as this one. um and understanding where the money is coming from. You're going to have to give us some latitude and realizing, you know, we I understand what you're doing, but there's a lot of transferring within and then, you know, transferring
u the debt and all that stuff and included. So, I think it's going to be something we're going to have we're going to have to get up and explain and and try to do in a way where people can understand it. Um, typically the chairman of the finance committee will read the motion
on the article and each account is read. You're going to have a lot of fun there. Yeah. If if I may though, aren't these historically broken into three separate articles essentially and not
uh they're typically within one article? Uh we haven't done raise and appropriate at an October town meeting in a long time. Um but typically we would have the operating budget supplements being coming from free cash and there may be a transfer or two within that same
article. The operating operating budget supplements article allows you to do transfers raise an appropriate or free cash stabilization fund. You know it could come from anywhere. read the audience.
I I think some of the confusion can be because that, you know, the reason appropriate appropriate, you know, the debt exclusion is a is a new thing. So that hasn't been seen, you know, like this. So that, you know,
the employee in the employee benefits expense, the health insurance. Yeah. The um the the reason why you're seeing the debt exclusion here at this time is in the past we've borrowed the money way before the annual town meeting in May. So we would know what the exact
principal and interest payment on the particular bond would be. This time the bond uh the the bond was issued June 18th which was after the May town meeting and and we were anticipating to have to come back in October to fix it. Okay.
Thank you James. Okay. So, Denise, any more questions? Did that clarify it? What's the imposition fund? Is that what it's called? So, I had two questions. One was I I
thought I thought we would said we were going to take some money from pre-cash and put it back into stabilization to um offset the money that we use for the school budget. Does the finance committee know what I'm talking about? I think that's coming later.
Yes. Yes, that is a later item. We are recommending to replenish 500,000 to capital stabilization from there article. All right. And the the other question I think I think the confusion is just it's just written a little bit differently than last year. Typically, it's all of the um I mean I can I can
forward you from last year's fall. um it's all of the expenses and then down the bottom it's just lists the the the three different pockets or or or places that comes out of. I don't know if that's what people are used to but we have had every year um or at least last
year we had raise and appropriate money. We had um we had transfer money as well. It was just it was just laid out a little bit differently. I don't know if that helps at all for people's um understanding of it. Um but it was definitely laid out a little bit differently.
Okay, thank you Sandy. Any questions from selectbook? Denise, any questions? Question. So, the reason being, does that mean that we're going to see an
extra ordinary tax increase this time around because we didn't plan for it in the spring or what does that what's the implication for the taxpayer? May as well bring a chair up, James. So, this is the last piece of the town
hall and senior center project as far as borrowing goes. There will be a slight increase on the taxes, and this should be the last one. Um, I don't know what the exact dollar amount would be, but um last year we um paid 3.6 $6 million or
so for bonds. This year it's going to be closer to 4 million. So it's like 3.9 and change. That extra almost $400,000 would go into the tax base. And going back to what Sandy said earlier, I remember now what she's
talking about. And yes, we could have we could have had all of the operating budget supplements listed to total 667491 with 200,000 coming from free cash and 467491 from race and appropriate. That would
probably look better. So we can change that if you want. I think that would be what we've seen before. That would be much better. Sure. Okay. Please. So when you guys uh read the a motion make a motion to
make a motion to make it uh supplemented 667491 with 200,000 funded by free cash and 467491 raise and appropriate and then the 205049 is just the budget transfers.
So, we need to change the warrant language you're saying or just the way it's presented and organized in the supplemental information because I don't think any dollar amounts are changing. Yeah, dollar amounts are not changing. It's just a presentation. Yeah. Yep. Brazing it at the meeting, right?
Yeah. It'll be easier to understand. So the total budget supplement 667491 200,000 from free cash and 467491 from raise and appropriate. Correct. And do we need to make the motion that
way or can we just say the article 3 and then you explain it at town meeting that way? Either or is fine. We could make the motion that way and always put the money in. You said right I think the have to explain it no matter what. Best way to do it is just to make
a total motion for 667491 and then break it down. You know, the chair of the fcom can break it down as as he uh makes the uh motion. So, I make a motion that we approve $667,491
article number I lost it. Three. Thank you. Second motion on Okay. Motion in a second. Any further discussion? No. Denise,
I just wanted to confirm with James. Yes or no? Um, you said this was the last time we're going to have to raise an appropriate for bonds for the exclusion. Is that correct? Yes. For the um town hall and senior center.
Oh, yeah. I should have I should have clarified which is the exclusion. Thank you. Yeah. Okay. Okay. All right. Motion in a second. Uh Denise. Kevin. Yes.
Yes. Roger. Yes. And I am a yes as well. Unanimous. Mr. Chair. Um Mr. Town Manager. Sorry. And Mr. Chair. Um James, can I ask a question?
Is it 667491 or is it 8 and some change with 200 from free cash 467 from raise and appropriate and 205 from transfers.
It is not. It is not. The 200,000 was already appropriated at the Maytown meeting. We are reallocating it from one department to another. But don't you have to that still has to be talked about. You will be you will be
reading the um the line items stating we're transferring from the treasurer's uh part-time account to the IT um expense line item in the amount of 10,000 and and so on. But we're not adding to the budget.
We're just reallocating the budget. Made all of that tonight as presented for that 200 and change. Right. And I think I see the chair's point, if I may. I I think it's confusing. I I think we should we should read it as as James says, and we should be clear
that we're asking for $25,49 to transfer from these lines to th those lines. Um, I don't think there's any objection. I don't have an object objection to reading it that way, but we have to be careful and not read it as an
additional, right? We're not we're not increasing the budget by 800,000. The total budget is only increasing by the six and change. I'll guarantee I'll mess this up, but we'll be there.
You'll witness it. No, I'm just kidding. All right. Anybody else from FinCom? Mr. Chair, I just have a quick question about the reserve fund. What's our balance right now, James? Um, I believe it's 90,000. I'm not 100% sure. Uh, is it 90 or 100?
I believe 100 was allocated. I'm not sure if 10 was used before I got here. Actually, um, give me a few seconds and I'll look it up. Is this the amount we usually put in? I assume it was going to be like 50,000, but you're adding that 14,000 and change.
We've always put 150,000 every year um at the Falltown meeting at the for the whole year. And that's what we end up with. Last year it was 100,000 and then uh 50,000 was added back in October to replenish it to the 150. Okay. And then I believe we ended up adding
even more at the May special town meeting. So it was closer to 200,000 by the time it was all said and done. Um for 26. I know that the full 150 wasn't allocated. I want to say 90,000 maybe, but um I don't remember the amount right
now. I'll have to look at it. Yeah, if you could just let me know what this would increase our fund to. Okay, I'll do that. I I believe it would be 164 426, but but we can confirm that. Okay,
Mr. Shannon, Zach, on an upcoming article here that you guys have is, and I I mentioned it to the town manager earlier, uh we're putting 250,000 into the snow and ice budget. My recommend my recommendation
would be is to not do that because once we do, we normally put 80,000 every year and once you do, you can't reverse that in future years. Is that that's what we were always told? Exactly. Right. Okay. Well, that's in your packet here. That's
that's um and I apologize if there's misunderstanding. Those are just um buckets to show where we're planning to in the future to potentially use the money. We're not asking to appropriate that. Okay? Cuz I would say as the conversation we had is is you know, put
it in in FinCom Reserve and if you need it, it's available to you because once you do it the other way, it gets locked up. Couldn't agree more. I'm so Anybody else?
Sandy, you all set? I'll take that as a yes. We didn't hear you, Sandy. My god. something. Then the
Cindy. Yeah, I'm I'm good. Thanks. Thank you. The chair will entertain a motion. Mr. Chairman, Zach, what article is this? Three. Three. Three.
I make a motion to recommend article three as presented. Second. is presented. Do we have to read
you know section section section I I recommend that we read where the money is coming from for these supplements as we have done in the past. Okay. Concrete and stable. Moving on. That's why we stay home tonight. You should speak to
Okay, Mr. Chairman, I recommend so I don't think it's necessary to read every line on the paper, but maybe the three buckets. Yes. Okay. Well, actually, um I recommend $200,000 from free cash and $467,491
uh raise and appropriate for the two sections. Is that good enough? He your chair wanted the transfers. I'm okay either way. 549 for transfer. Yeah. I mean, I'll start again.
Mr. Chairman, Zach, I make a motion on article three for $200,000 from free cash listed items on the article $25,49 uh inter
transfers. Inter budget transfers. Is that the right terminology? Yes. And $467,491 raise and appropriate. Second that. Have a motion and a second. Any further
discussion? Hearing none. Sandy. Yes. Thank you. Um Gavin, yes. Tracy, yes. Paula, yes. Paul, yes. Zach,
yes. Iuna, yes. Unanimous. Okay. Next up, article 4, FY26, water operating budget amendments. No action recommended. Correct. Um, yes. We recommend each board vote no action just so we have the flexibility
in case anything happens between now and town meeting where we would need to ask for something supplemental. We don't anticipate anything to happen. It It's only happened once in the history of people's memories, but just in case. Okay. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
It appears the fin has already taken no action, voted to take no action. So, Mr. Chair. Yes, sir. I recommend we take no action on article four and five. Second. Motion in a second. Uh Denise
Yes. Kevin, yes. Bob, yes. Roger. Yes. And I am a yes. Okay. Article number five, FY26 shore operating budget. Same. Uh, no action.
We just voted on that, Mr. Chair. We did the water one. I thought we voted on both. You did? Motion was both. Yeah. Okay. I thought we had to do them one by one. I think you have to do them separately. Mr. Chair, yes, sir. I make a motion we take no action
article 5. Second. Motion and a second. Denise. Yes. Kevin. Yes. Bob. Yes. Roger. Yes. And I am a yes. Where's the Thank you. Next article number six, capital
improvements. Manager. So, we are requesting $1 million from free cash into capital improvements. The current balance in capital improvements is $264,000. And in the next article, uh we will be
asking for um various amounts transferred and spent on capital improvements. So, this article is $1 million from free cash to capital improvements, the majority of which is intended to stay in
the account um and be available for the spring. Okay. Thank you. Does anyone have any questions? Yeah. I make a motion we transfer $1
million from free cash in the cable uh capital improvement account. Second. Motion in a second. Any further discussion? Denise has her hand. Question. Yeah. Yep. Y if we don't need most of that capital
until the spring, why do we have to move it now? Why can't we wait till the spring? We I mean that that could be an option. It it typically earns greater interest in stabilization than in free c in free
cash. So it would increase our bottom line if if we transfer it now a little bit, Mr. Chair. Yes, sir. I I would um also add, correct me if I'm wrong, and that it would look more
favorably on our balance sheet and our our bond rating as well. Also very true. Thank you, Kevin. Mr. Chairman, yes, sir. I would add to that that um putting money back into a capital improvement account is not money wasted. it's going to be used at some point in the game. We
have, you know, long-term commitments on on some of these capital items. And it's not like we're putting it away somewhere where we can't touch it. We're actually going to have to touch it at some point. No committee.
Any further discussion? We have a motion and a second on the floor. No. Okay. Denise. Hi. Yes. Yes. Okay. Kevin. Yes. Bob. Yes. Roger. Yes. And I am a yes.
Okay. Okay. Mr. Chair. Anyone from Fin have any questions? Mr. Chair. Zach. only to make a comment that we've always funded uh we always funded this uh capital budget in the
fall historically. So that's pretty normal. Any further comments? Then I'll entertain a motion. Mr. Chair Zack, I recommend uh we transfer $1 million
from free cash into the capital account under article six. Second. Have a motion and a second. Any further discussion hearing? None. Sandy, we missed you.
I think she said yes. Sandy was a yes. Sandy was a yes. Gavin, yes. Tracy, yes. Paula, yes. Paul, yes. Zach, yes. It unanimous for article six.
Okay. Okay. That's the actual appropriations. Okay. All right. Thank you. Next. Article number seven, FY26 capital plan amendments. Mr. Chair, um, Mr. Town Manager, I thought I had a promotion there for a
second. a pay cut for sure. So, the capital plan amendments are what the capital committee recommended uh last week and they include I'll I'll just uh I can give you this this I'll
just go line by line. There's not too many. So for for the fire station, the capital committee recommends $300,000 from the ambulance receipt account towards the fire station renovation. The for the
school department, the capital committee recommends $24,779 for the stage floor from free cash and $50,000 for the second exit access road from free cash and $40,677
for tech displays from free cash. Uh highway department requests 8,200 um to pay off a Peterbuilt dump truck and that actually saves a few thousand in interest. Uh recreation is recommended at $24,000
for a playground. Sewer is recommended at $475,000 for a generator from sewer retained earnings and water is recommended at $41,000 for a 2025 Ford Ranger XL um
from retained earnings. So the motion we would be looking for would be to consolidate all these and the total coming from capital stabilization um that we just transferred a million to. We would be spending $147,656
from capital stabilization. Uh from sewer retained earnings, $475,000 from water retained earnings, $41,000. And from the ambulance receipt account, $300,000.
Subject to your questions. Thank you, sir. Anyone from select board have any questions? Yeah. Uh one question. the fire station rehab repair renovation project. I had read further in the packet that um they
had gotten quotes to do the entire um project at one I think it was 1.4 million all at once and they had gotten a quote if they were to do it over time um with more maybe in house support or whatnot it would be quite a bit more than that. So I know that they're
focused on doing it all at once at the much lower cost. My question is, does the $300,000 provide them the money to do it that way? Because I I know that both the town manager um and the department request was 900,000 according
to the sheet. The capital improvement committee want to respond? I I don't want to give them not enough money where they can't do the work in an expeditious and cost-effective manner. Um, so I understand the concern. This
would be the third installment of 300,000 that was recommended, bringing it to a total of 900,000, which as you mentioned is shy from the 1.2 million. This actually this and the school roof were subject to extensive discussions where these projects would benefit from
the permanent building committee taking an in-depth look and discussing procurement and you know staying below the 1.5 million threshold for an OPM if possible and really getting a handle on planning for future capital expenses which would
be a great benefit to everyone. Uh to to your point, this might allow them to go out to bid and to do do design work and then they could come back if if the 900 isn't sufficient. Maybe it is sufficient to do what they
want to do. Um I I tooured the building late last week and and my I mean I I had a construction supervisor's license once and and I do this for far less than 900,000. Um, but
you know with prevailing wages and your concern is definitely understood. I just don't Thank you, Mr. Tor. And I know your um recommendation was that the full 900,000. It was the FINCOM that only app I'm sorry, the capital improvement committee. They don't only
approve 300,000. I just want to make sure that we're not restricting or or um handcuffed their ability to do the project in the most cost effective manner by not giving them enough money in this appropriation. That's that's my concern.
Mr. chairman. Yes. I I I'm on the ground and building committee and you know at some point it does trigger the fact that we should be looking at some of this and even though I I'm looking through the packet I'm seeing boilers and all this other stuff
now that seems to be coming to the surface that we haven't talked about before. I would recommend that we stick with the 300,000 at this point. And um I know we the permanent building committee is going to reach out and sit down and have a conversation about this at some
point in the very near future. Uh if we s should decide that additional funds are are needed and I I would we would probably come back and recommend in the springtime that we take another look at this. Um, another factor that I again
being on the on the building committee is we're not sure how much money is left over from the debt exclusion at this point, we don't know how much money is still out there. Uh, we're still waiting for the final numbers. We have got a couple credits back that are somewhat substantial. Um, in in my opinion, my my
suggestion would be that if there is money left under the debt exclusion, that we use that money instead of having to take money from available funds and do it if we can do it under the debt exclusion and still not exceed that. Uh,
that would be my recommendation to the rest of the uh committee. So, I think at this point we're more than fair giving up giving up the 300 grand, but I think we need to uh wait a bit longer and see if there's any extra money left over
from the from the permanent building committee and the and the uh town hall uh community building restoration projects. We're not sure yet how much money is left. There may not be any money left, but we we have to wait and see what that is before we I believe
before we start spending money from our own available funds and causing further damage down the road by not having that that money available. Yep. And and I and I completely agree. I'm not looking to allocate more money
or to, you know, deplete our um capital improvement account. I'm just it's more about timing and um not not cost. And uh by restricting a request of 900,000 and only allocating 300,000 to last the next
7 months, are we building in excess time that's going to end up costing uh us more for the overall project when it's all said and done? So that's that's really where I'm coming from. Thank you. Understood. Uh two points of note that I do know is they just recently have
secured an architect as well. So that's going to take a little bit of time uh with them ramping up. And if I'm not mistaken to Bob's point, we have realized a turn back of 175,000 or in the form of a credit if I'm not mistaken
from the contractor for this property for that walkway out front. Is that is that correct James or Mr. town manager. We haven't done it yet. So, if I may, and before James responds,
um Bob and I are on the capital, I mean, are on the building committee in that um settlement from both projects, we had talked about in in our building committee setting that aside for the purposes in which it was allocated. So, if we have problems with the front um
walk and it needs to be repaired or replaced in the future, having those funds available for that purpose as as it was intended uh as part of the settlement. Does that make sense? Yeah. Yep. Mr. Chairman, uh we haven't paid uh the final bill yet on on the project. I
believe that is going to be a credit on the final bill. So, we're not going to get a check. It's just going to be deducted from what we owe them at the end. And like Mr. Kimble said earlier, we're waiting uh to finalize the two payments on the uh projects on the two
projects. What's the proposed or expected timeline for that? Do we No, we don't know. I we don't know. Okay. Thank you, James. Okay. Any other discussion questions?
Denise, put my eyes on him. Thank you. Thank you. All right. Any others? Mr. Chair, I'll look for a motion. I make a motion that we recommend
article 7 as uh laid out by the town manager. Second. We have a second. Second. Second. Okay. Motion in a second. Any other discussion? We good? Denise? Yes. Kevin? Yes.
Bob? Yes. Roger? Yes. And I am a yes. Okay. So Mark um access road for Martin Middle School.
What is the 33,000 remove from whatever they're trying to do there? The capital committee found a more effective way to pave roads. So, um I
believe our water sewer superintendent was part of the discussion. Um they're I can't remember how they're more efficiently doing it. Do you remember, Chair Rich? I do. So, um the spec calls for 2 and 1/2 in uh binder
coat and an inch and a half top coat. And uh the discussion was doing a 2 and 1/2 in baby binder coat which was a was it the number the 39 or $40,000 something like that. Correct. That sounds correct.
And uh the that is um a standard that's used everywhere. Um, and it saved a substantial amount of money and the uh the 29,000 and change
if I recall correctly on that. Um, that was the biggest part. And what else? There was another line item on there. Recall, Zach, remember what that other line item was? No, it was just the the top coat. We eliminated the top coat. Top coat. Yeah.
So, two inches of asphalt trucks using Oh, yeah. It it was to the recommendation of uh one of our other department heads of using some of our own resources that we have available um for actually doing some of the work
some of the trucks. So we're not losing any longevity by No. Okay. Anyone else? the only question I have. I'll entertain a motion,
Mr. Chairman. Back. Make a motion to recommend article 7 as written. Is coming from read over there. So, okay. All right. I guess we'll itemize this.
Uh 147656,000 um coming from the capital budget, 300,000 coming from the ambulance reserve, 475,000 coming from source surplus, uh 41,000 coming from water surplus for
a total of $963,656. Second. Have a motion and a second. Any further discussion? hearing. Uh Sandy, yes. Gavin, yes. Tracy, yes.
Paula, yes. Yes. Zack, yes. I chum a yes. Okay. Next article number eight. Okay. So, for Barrow's court, the select board already voted. The finance
committee just had a question as to a previous uh appropriation from the town meeting which was $50,000 for engineering. The current balance in that $50,000 appropriation is $39,620.
However, we have an open purchase order for $18,820 that Weston and Samson is requesting payment for. our conservation agent is disputing the say the quality the amount of work done
in exchange for for that really um so it's it's it's a potential liability so I would strongly advise against appropriating that money uh that said there's $21,400
left after you subtract that um which I would also strongly recommend we keep in that account because our highway superintendent is planning to dig a 220 ft trench in the spring and we very well may use more engineering funds and it
would be highly inconvenient to have to go back and wait till town meeting to ask for those. So the the motion I would recommend would be 50,000 from free cash to the Barrow's core article. Mr. Chairman Zach, is the 50,000 the
amount that the highway department expects to pay or is that a contingent cushion or we're bringing out the big guns for this one? Even um there's a couple ways you could look at it. I this 50,000 covers the
materials and the cost of a of a crew to do the work. I think I could do it cheaper, somewhere around 25 to 30,000. The materials being the bulk of it, almost 3/4 of it. Um, it would be potentially not necessary to replace the
whole pipe, but either way, you're looking at a cost in that range. So, we removed the blockage from the pipe. We cleared it of all the major roots. It should function the way it had in the past given that there's no other um no other causes adding to the, you know, the slow drainage. There's still other
minor roots. Regardless, there should be some maintenance work done if not this year, next year, and then probably periodically. Um, Pedroski was hired to camera and jet the pipe originally. They found that the blockage in August. They would probably need to flail that pipe again and jet it to get some of the smaller roots that we couldn't remove.
And then at that point, if we don't want to spend the depending on who does the work, the 25 30 to $50,000 to replace the pipe, should probably look at um options to line it with some type of plastic liner. Possibly the goal is to try to seal up those those uh joints.
They're 24 in pipe and they're 4ft sections. So there's something like 55 plus joints. Um you know we got the bulk of it. We're going to remove one of the main trees that's causing the issue. There's a line of arrivites. There's multiple other large trees. So some the plan is something has to be done in the future.
I'll leave it up to everyone to discuss you know the way they want to do it to what to what extent they want to do it. Um but it makes sense I would say to at least have some type of buffer and uh there was mention about what was left in the account last time. There was an article that highway proposed after the
West Hodgees Street collapse and uh we used money out of road materials prior to asking for that article. We used 6,000 out of that article. There's 18 left in there as well. I don't know what format to propose it. Mike made sense to put the 18 and change with the 20,000
remainder in in the article that our conservation had had and just try to get one one account to around $50,000. So that way we could potentially maintain this pipe, possibly replace it if it doesn't get used, either probably pushed into another account where we
could have some emergency fund for other drainage problems like this cuz they seem to come up every year more and more. my my materials budget is really to maintain the infrastructure that's there. It doesn't really account for adding or changing additional structures. So, I just wanted to put that bug in everyone's ear and how how
it pans out doesn't make much difference to me. And are you planning to have this done before this winter sets in? No. Uh depending on these next few rainstorms, the goal will be to monitor how how it performs, which it it should perform better. Um but again, if there's other factors or maybe there's other
things that we missed, it might not. at which point we should have money available so we don't have to wait all the way into midsummer for the funds to do anything if we could appropriate something now even if it does stay separate and we turn it back just so we have the option to move quickly you know
come the discovery of some type of problem Mr. Chairman Mr. gem. I know I'm not part of that. Um I went down and looked at this when they were when they were doing the excavating the other day and they pulled out something
the size of a small mammoth. It was quite a root. In fact, I have a picture. I'd love to show it to you later. Uh it looks like it has legs and everything, but it's actually it's actually u pieces of wood. But the trunk that they took out of that pipe was
amazing that it you could see why it was blocked. You had two of those, right? Yeah. You end up with two of them. One was smaller than the other. The the idea behind it really is we're hoping that may be the the end of it. Uh but if
that's not the case, then if come April we have an issue down there, we we'll be able to go back there and do some more if we have the 50,000. If in fact it doesn't if money isn't needed, then we're not going to touch it. And it usually marked in this special uh
article just for that purpose. So if we don't use it, we're not going to use it. But it would in our best interest, especially, you know, the people in Baris court would I'm sure appreciate the fact that we're putting a few dollars aside just in case they have to do something. Further down on that
property, you run into a private property which has a couple of what do they call those? The U pipes under. Yeah, thanks for reminding me. Yeah, there's a two two 18-inch culvert pipes that cross a private driveway which there's no easement and no plan to do work now. But again, having just some type of account with a reasonable amount
of money reasonable amount of money in there to actually do some work um you know like replace those pipes or enlarge them rather. But and once the culverts are replaced, it goes to the river and then it does them back up. So what's happening is the volume of the water coming down the road is coming down so
fast. Of course, it was being slowed down by these roots, but once it hits the outpipe, it's uh overflowing at the out outpipe and it's not growing off fast enough. So, this gives them some money also to go down and make some improvements. We
may have to talk to the landowner and see if we can make some improvements on the private property also just so we can get the water out of there. Once the water's moving that it shouldn't be an issue anymore. Um, Mr. chair the so Jared the um
I'm sorry we already voted if you if you would so the the private property issue is that would that be covered under the $50,000 if it was appropriated if um assuming there's $50,000 appropriated and we do the work ourselves if we if and when we have to replace the pipe
there would be plenty to to replace that um covert as well or improve it or unlatch it. Okay. in the section that Bob is talking about that we talked about at our last meeting. Um you're going to try to replace just that segment that that uh is blocked for now
to see if that does the trick. So that was already completed on August 1st and 2nd. Yeah. The pipe was um we excavated the pipe, removed the roots and uh repaired the pipe and back filled and that's all completed. So there might be a rain event come waiting to see. Waiting to see. Yeah. Just watching to see how it performs.
Okay. I just wanted to point out that the the new pipe was the new section um 30 in diameter. Um the new section that we refer to, you mean the replacement pipe? You did in August. Yeah. In August, all they did was camera and jet the pipe. They cleaned it out and
and found the blockage for us. Um the equipment we used wasn't adequate to to find. Okay. You just cleaned out the exist cuz I wanted to point out that the the difference between the 24 in the current pipe and the 30 in that you're proposing if you have to do the whole 220 ft. It's
not it's only 25% more in diameter, but it's 60% more in area as far as flow. So you if you were if you get to the point where you have to replace that whole 220 linear feet, they're going to gain like 60% more flow capacity just by the that
bigger um pipe. While we're on the subject too, it would be um like an N12 ADS pipe. So, it would have a much tighter fitted joints and there would be a much smoother um you know flow. Also, there's um the pitch there's about a foot of pitch from um in to out in that pipe and it's not consistent. So, I
guess you know not in theory if we set a new pipe it would have one even pitch as opposed to a wouldn't call it a belly but there's a most of the pitches in the first 60 ft and then it levels out. So, it would probably increase the flow and the speed with which it discharges from the street. but minor detail.
Well, my opinion is let's do it right and so we never have to worry about it again. Um replace the old 220 ft, but we'll see. We'll we'll take your judgment and appreciate your uh cost effective uh approach to this. Thanks,
Mr. Chairman. Zach, you had a test drive a couple weeks ago. We had some torrential rain. So far so good. If I'm not mistaken, you can correct me. Was that before the October 1st and 2nd, I think. Yeah. So before you said August, so I bet No, the camera the camera in the gutter
was in August. Yeah, it did appear to help. It's hard to tell though because sometime, you know, the water table was a lot lower and the conditions were a lot drier previous to the rain as opposed to times in the past. It becomes a real complicated puzzle, but Paul, Mr. Chair,
um I just want to make sure I'm following all of these numbers here. So, we allocated $50,000 to the conservation committee to try to do some work on barrerows. They paid Won and Samson 18,820,
but the work was not sufficient. They're trying to get reimbursed. Did I hear that right? I would let John Thomas speak to that better, but all all that was paid, I believe, was $3,100 for the initial um evaluation of the wetlands uh like a survey prior to the full study.
Okay. Okay. Uh so there's a pending invoice for 18 I can that we have not spent then we have not given them the 18,000. Exactly. You have not paid. So right now the technical balance is 39 and change. It would be 20 and change if you were to pay them.
So you could have the 39 in addition to the 50 if this is if this article 8 is also passed to use for to improve the Barrow's court. Assuming that the invoice doesn't get paid. I don't know how um plausible it is either way. I wouldn't speak to it.
And then so you also mentioned 18,000 left over from a West Hodgeges project. James, if you could remind me what happens when we've allocated the money to a certain article and then it hasn't been completely spent that leftover money then does it have to be voted at a
town meeting to be put into a different account? Uh the money you wanted to reallocate that for this purpose? No. the department head in this case if it's under the highway uh department has to notify me uh before July 15th to
close it out and I would be closing it out back to the funding source that it came from. So if it was free cash it would go back to free cash. If it was funded by the capital improvement account it would capital stabilization fund it would go back to the capital or ambulance depending on on what it is. So
technically the the article that we're talking about right now, the 50,000, if we appropriate the money and don't use it and before July 15th, Jared tells me go ahead and close it. I would close it back to free cash, whatever the balance. So this West Hodgees project though from
I slightly remember a couple years ago that 18,000 is still just kind of sitting there. It hasn't been closed out. Correct. Turn back to free cash. That's correct. Okay. So, one option would be to have um to have that 18,000 closing to free cash
it so that it's available uh for the next cycle. Okay. All right. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Zach, on that note, James, could you send us a listing uh whenever you get a chance of what we have open
for past, you know, I know there's some skeletons in the closet um from years past that we've approved and it's just sitting there as unused funds. Can we see a listing of that? What's not closed out? And and Paul, I believe the article we passed last year was only for design,
not construction. So, um I think that would be problematic uh if it used it for construction, but I'm not a lawyer. There's one down the end. Um well, we're happy to get that any information the committee desires.
Mr. Chair Paul. Uh Jared, I just want to commend you and your department for willing to work to mitigate this at uh at a much lesser expense than if we hired an outside contractor and stuff. And along the same vein, um town manager, when you did your
tour of the fire station, I believe a lot of work was done by the firefighters who are licensed and stuff. Again, saving the town considerable funds when you start looking at that prevailing wage stuff. and uh just want people to know that they get that kind of uh um employees working for the town that really have the town at heart. So, thank
you. Any further discussion on article eight? Article 8. Hearing none, I'll entertain a motion. Mr. Chairman Zack. Uh, I'd like to make a motion to
recommend $50,000 from free cash to article 8 for barrels court. Second. I have a motion and a second. Any further discussion? Hearing none. Sandy, I apologize. cuz I have to
unmute and then we can Yes. Yes. Thank you. Thank you. Yes. Yes. Tracy. Paula. Yes. Paul. Yes. Zach. Yes. Yes. Do something about this.
Okay. Thank you. Everything else, if I'm not mistaken, correct me if I'm wrong, Mr. Town Manager. Next ones 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, and 14
are already addressed. Um, for for the record, chair, um Dr. O'Neal is on standby if anybody has any questions. She notified us this morning that the school department has elected to work collaboratively with the permanent building committee um on the roof
project. So, we'll bring that up in the spring and not at the fall. Mr. Town Manager, is that is this article still going to be in the warrant or gone? We will remove it from the warrant.
Okay. Thank you. Okay. Uh so next article 15 is that correct? Uh I have a different numbering as long as you have zoning bylaw update. Zoning bylaw update including reorganiz reorganizing and making tax changes.
So we discussed this at length most recently at a joint meeting of the select board and planning board which extended um for a good amount of time. In a nutshell, this planning bylaw is generally
the zoning bylaw generally renumbers everything, adds the sections that were already approved and makes very minor changes to to other sections. And we have our our town planner. If there's any questions, um I'd ask any questions
maybe be specific. I mean, I'm sure he's prepared with a PowerPoint if everybody wants, but uh I'd ask for specific questions. However, um both boards would like to proceed. Okay, Mr. Chair. Yes, sir. Yes, sir.
Um after uh extensive uh going through this uh extensively going through this uh article with the uh planning board last Tuesday.
um and um getting all the answers to any questions that uh board members had or the public had. Um I would uh recommend that the uh
I would make a motion that we recommend the select board recommend article 15 to town meeting. Second motion and a second. Any further discussion? Denise, that's a yes. Kevin,
yes. Rob, yes. Roger. Yes. And I am a yes. Okay, Mr. Chair. Um, as someone who was out of town last Tuesday, I missed the whole
presentation. I don't know how many of Fincom members made it. Two of us, uh, Zach and I. Would either one of you like to give a
brief update? Are you sure you want my opinion? We'll go with Gavin first. Yeah, that's a better idea. No, I do want Zach's opinion. Um, from a finance committee's perspective, I have I have no concerns about this. Um
I Okay, we're muted now. I have one small personal niggle because you know how much I love housing, but we're not going to bring that up because it has no financial impact. So subject um and I think from the finance committee perspective, the one the one
huge benefit will be all the uh legal compliance aspects. Uh hopefully reducing our legal budget going forward. So that's huge. Uh my I have no concern over it. I'm going to try to override the what the uh planning board did cuz they put hundreds
of hours into it. But the plan that you guys had to take this to town meeting need to be thrown away and start over. That was uh to be polite, a train wreck the other night. I couldn't bear it 2 hours. I had to leave. You guys need to dumb that way
down or it's going to be or you should start the the town meeting at noon time and go to midnight with breaks in between because that was painful. That was painful. Uh it needs to be dumbed down so people, you know, we can't go line item by line item. People can go
online and read it if they choose to at their own time. But uh I just want to emphasize that I mean that I really have no no uh nothing nice to say about the presentation the way it was presented but other than that I will
support it. Mr. Mr. Chair, Paul. So, um, Paul, no, don't you just a quick comment then. If that's the case and there's only minor changes according to the select board after reviewing it that most of it is just housekeeping, if
you will, then why why not just present the changes and leave the housekeeping as housekeeping as far as the to dumb you down as Zach said, just to make it a shorter presentation. I think you beat yourselves up at every town meeting and that's why you lose. Gosh,
does that be the town planner? I just want to make one thing and I'm not sure Paul if I'm understanding your question. The proposed bylaw changes not minor housekeeping. It's a number of things. It's a it's substantial substantive.
So we understand though uh last week we did a bit of a test run and you know fortunately you all were very clear and I that gives us a a good direction for a much more streamlined presentation uh at town meeting. Um so we'll be doing that
and u in fact next Wednesday I'm going to be doing a public information session for anyone who wants to come. It's going to be next Wednesday at six o'clock over at the Nelson Senior and Community Center.
Mr. Chairman, if I could just Yep. ask some advice. This zoning bywire update that you guys presented to us is very brief. It goes into very little detail. If you put up that 174 pages on the on the screen, we're going to be there for
three weeks. This here pretty much covers what they're trying to do in a very brief way. And I would try to keep that 170 odd pages or whatever it is off the screen as much as you can because it's very confusing. But I think this
zoning bywire, you know, update making a bywar that works with no this pretty much tells the story without getting into the other details. Right. We we will have as I believe we'll as part of the um copies that are made um and that's already up online
too. We have a couple of very two uh two-page summary documents I think that do a really good job of hammering home the the the intent behind all of it. Mr. Chair, also to Zach's point, um I I
think I think after the meeting I think it was a kind of a test on how to present it and it failed. um by going by going through the detail of the whole bylaw, I think they realized, correct me if I'm wrong, Paul, that the better approach would be the is the one that
Mr. Kimble just mentioned, and I believe that Paul intended to do initially anyway, was to go through the summary slides, a dozen slides that highlight all of the the changes um and and not get into the actual language of the
bylaw. And I think you guys learned that from that presentation. If I'm not if I'm correct, you are correct. Okay. At least we know how to get rid of Zach anyway. Yeah. So at town meeting, what are we giving
the town's people? Cuz that's I believe the the attorney that drafted it will be there to present briefly hopefully. Right. We got that confirmed presentation. We'll have uh a couple of uh small handouts just identifying what
the changes are. But so it's it's the presentation that Bob and Kevin are are kind of showing and not 171 pages. No, no, no, it is not. Okay,
I'll move the question. No, I'm not allowed. So to clarify, it is not 170 pages that you're answering no to. Right. Right. I believe that's what we what we had agreed to last that the planning board agreed to last week. I I would it's all about instilling trust in the in the town meeting
participants and whenever you have um an outside entity presenting on behalf of any board or committee then then you have take the chance of losing some of that. So I I would uh caution you on using the uh attorney that's been advising you uh to do any of this
presentation. But again, speak among the rest of the planning board and see what they think. That's my opinion. I'd second that. So, Mr. Chair, um,
so I I actually I found the attorney's input last last spring really valuable. um he had an answer to pretty much every material question that was thrown at this at the change at the time.
Can we can we have in him in the back room with a microphone to the to the chair of the planning board? I mean is are like I really I really did there were a lot of you know compliance issues that I mentioned um that are fixed you know complying with mass law to be clear and I found that he had an answer to
everything that the public threw the planning board's way. So, I guess if we do think having him share that is going to decrease trust, I I mean I would love to have the planning board ready to I'm sure they are ready to to to share those things. You know, which
specific law a certain change was was targeting and what have you cuz I found that super super useful. There was a a slew of complaints that sounded valid valid in isolation um and then there was an answer for each and every one. I think that was really useful. Right. He adds a lot of value. Yeah,
Mr. Chairman. Bob, again, I would recommend that this be handed out. Do a double-sided. It doesn't have to waste paper. Just put it on two sides. Make the presentation and keep it simple because if you start
bringing in like an opening, you know, if you if you go with this as your opening and again, put the attorney off to one side, any specific questions can be addressed. the more we talk about it, the more we throw at everybody,
the more it's gonna be totally unclear. So, the be the simpler we keep it, the better. And and it's a it's a lot to look at. I mean, it's a tremendous amount of stuff to look at, right? This is the equivalent of reading your car owner's manual. It it really is that level of detail.
And that's what not everyone does that. Yeah. You go to the book signing for your car owner's manual. Um, so we're going to I think just explain the major issues with it. Not issues, but the major changes with it and what didn't change because there's still a lot of
things that stay the same. So I think we've got that covered. Um, I think that's, you know, this is valuable input and I think we're ready to address it. In fact, the board tomorrow night will be talking about these materials and
getting ready for town meeting. So we'll relay this back to them. I think we're already there. Uh, Miss Luchiano, some valuable insight last time. Um, he
really presented it in an easily digestible um, you know, common language way that anybody could understand. very uncharacteristic of an attorney, but but he did that very well. So, I would I would honestly advise I
mean, I think the I think the concept of a subject matter expert is not foreign to people, right? I think if anything, they should be glad that we're reaching out to subject matter experts when we're doing things like this. But I think maybe you guys present it and have him available to answer those questions in a
clear and concise way if they come up. Um, so he can address those specific questions. Just my two cents. So don't give him a pass on that night. He still needs to show up regardless of how you do the presentation. He's got to be there
somewhere to answer the questions. How was this? 15. 15. I don't know. We voted. Oh, finance commission. Yeah, you already voted. You go. They voted the other night. I think we already did.
So, they vote. Did you, Mr. Chairman? Zack. Motion to recommend article 15. Second. We have a motion and a second. Any
further discussion? Hearing none. Sandy, yes. Kevin, yes. Tracy, yes. Paula, yes. Paul, yes. Zach,
yes. It is unanimous. Okay. Thank you. Thank you. All right, Mr. Town Manager. Compensated absences trust fund. This fund was
established approximately a year ago with $1.1 million. What the purpose of this fund is to prepare for unexpected uh resignations with buyouts of unused vacation and sick time. We've depleted the some of the initial
balance. We're down to 971,842 balance. So, we're asking $70,000 be transferred into this account from free cash and and there are a couple potential anticipated retirements that would further deplete this account. So,
the 70,000 we're asking for would bring it back up to a little over a million temporarily until it goes back down. So, this is a $70,000 ask. 70,000 from free cash. Okay. 70,000 from free cash. Okay. Any
questions? Slackboard. Yep. Mr. Town Manager, there's uh Steve Evans from the finance committee. He's trying to get on this um I believe Zoom. I don't know if you can let him in. He can see you, but he can't talk or access.
Okay. He's a guest. So, we are promoting him to a panelist. Yes. Yes. Yes. Uh he he declined. You need to accept it, Stephen. From Mr. Chair to accept it.
It declined again. Um, just a question for the town manager. As soon as you're done with your it Oh, he's there. Okay. And now he's there now. Yep. He's on the screen.
Okay. Thank you. So, uh, Mr. Town Manager, so, um, these buyouts are all built into contracts that we have already with folks, right? Correct. And all the the contracts are up again, so we can revisit that.
Um, 15. Thank you. Okay. Anybody else? Any other discussion? Denise, any questions? No, Mr. Chair. Yes, sir. I make a motion that we recommend uh
moving $70,000 from free cash into the compensated absence trust fund article 8. Second second motion and a second. No other discussion. Denise, yes. Kevin,
yes. Bob, yes. Roger. Yes. And I am a yes. Mr. town manager. So then Mr. Chair unanimous. So article 16. Do we have any further
discussion from the finance committee side? Mr. Chairman, Zach, what is the balance of this account now? $971,842. And do we know what our liabilities are that are out there? I I mean
if you add all the employees acrewed sick and vacation time or that's exactly what I'm asking over a million safe to say. Okay. So you got you're close there. Closer to 2.5 I'm informed reliably. Then you're a little short.
Hoping that everybody doesn't retire on the same day. And again we're looking to add 70,000. Yes sir. Mr. Chair, can I ask how we came to that number? So, a little more than that was
expended. The initial thought was to bring it up to approximately a million and that would bring it up to a million40,000. We discussed just making it an even million, but then we realized that it's likely going to dip below and be used a
couple times in the next month, like most likely. So, we decided to stick with the 70,000 instead of trying to budget it to the penny and ask for more or ask for less. And as we uh as you not we as you
renegotiate uh uh with the unions this year uh is it uh not common within municipal government to have a use it or lose it uh approach to some of these benefits vacation time like some private
or most private businesses have. So the most common approach I'm familiar with is to cap it at a certain point, say two weeks or whatever you can negotiate with the unions. I believe it's generally 6 months now and a couple weeks sounds
much more reasonable for the for the budget. And what is it currently? Is it an unlimited approval? It it depends what union. They're they're all different agreements. I I understand most of most of them are six months.
Wow. Going to be a fun negotiations if anybody wants to to join. I think it's six months and a half. You have gray hair by this time next year. You ready for a motion? Any further discussion?
Steve, Sandy, Steve, if you said something, I didn't hear it. No, I'm in um Can you hear me? Yep. Yep. Yep. Yeah. That's just I'm on board with I think we should try and negotiate the best we can on these items. This is I
know it's a hard thing to do, but this is one of those pain points that keeps drawing down funds for us. It's I call it the vacation fund, the big house purchase. So, I'm all in favor
Okay, we're breaking up. I make a motion to hire an IT person sooner than later because this is uh second. Third, this is Mr. Mr. Chairman. Zack, I make a motion article 16 to move
$70,000 from free cash to uh the compensated absence trust fund. Second. Motion in a second. Any further discussion hearing? None. Sandy.
Yes. Steve. He's muted. Who's on mute? Steve, can you unmute? Gavin. Yes. Tracy. Yes. Yes. Steve, what did you say?
I'm a Yes. I keep hitting the unmute button. I'm driving, so it makes it a little bit more difficult. All right. Thank you. Thank you. I'm going to I'm dropping off. All right. This is This is not good. Thank you, guys. He's driving. All right. Thank you. Be safe, Steve. Paul. Yes.
Zach. Yes. I tune. Yes. Article 16 passes. Thank you, Mr. Town Manager. OPED. Uh, thank you. I'll try to be brief with this one. I'm really excited about this. This is a tremendous opportunity to make
a dent in a historically difficult to tackle area. We owe $79 million in OPED liability. that's acrewing at 5.5% interest each year. Um so um the most we can afford to put
toward there at present we've been making 130,000 plus 5,000 each year. Um so this is proposed at 330,000. That would have an exponential return on investment. This would save us millions
to put 330,000 in there today. and hopefully we can continue that, if not expand on that in the future. Uh the current progress rate is like making minimum payments on an $80 million credit card. And by channeling more
money towards that as much as possible, we're getting we're seeing a 12 to 18% return on investment. It's it's it's incredible the the time value of money uh compounded interest. Um, so I strongly advise the committee to to take
330,000 and put that toward OPED this year. Mr. Chairman. Yes, sir. Is that free cash? Yes, sir. You know, we were told when when this first came up years ago that we were never ever going to be able to reach
those numbers. and they started putting in any year we put in a minimum minimum minimum because of the fact that we thought it was beyond our reach to ever reach that goal. Uh you're coming in with a different spin on it now with the
interest and the savings and all that. So you know there may be some questions about this at town meeting because we were really getting we were minimizing this whole process. You're kind of in the background laughing at saying there's no possible
way, but well, you're saying there is a way to do it. If you ignore it, it'll quintuple in the next four years. If you address it, we can put a sizable dent in it. And that's Thank you. There's hope. If we tackle it, you're telling your money, right,
Mr. Chair, if I could ask the Tom man, I'm new to this open. I I notice that it's for post-employment benefits liability um retirees healthcare and life insurance benefits. I get the life insurance benefits, but don't employees when they turn 65 transition over to
Medicare or how's this work? What am I They do but there's a I was just speaking with our benefit specialist today. Um so it's mostly for health insurance and they have something called Medicare B.
Okay. Okay. Where we we do fund a portion of that supplemental type of thing. Right. And they pay 25%, we pay 75%. Okay. Thank you. Any other questions from our board? Denise?
No. Okay. Mr. Chair. Yes, sir. I recommend we move $330,000 from free cash into the OPED. Second. Okay, I have a motion and a second. See,
there's no further discussion. Denise, yes. Kevin, yes. Bob, yes. Roger. Yes. And I am a yes. Unanimous, sir. Mr. Chair.
Mr. Town Manager. Um, I have a former colleague on this committee who would always vote every year to put in zero. Um, it always used to be an entertaining
meaning. Um, and yes, for years and years we would just put in the minimum plus 5 or 10,000. So going from what would have been roughly 140,000ish
to 330,000. I guess my biggest question is what happens in the eyes of um all those credit agencies if next
year we have to revert back to 140,000 cuz this is a major jump. They would be extremely happy that we put an extra 200,000 in it. Of course, it's preferable to be sustainable. Um,
and and that's the goal moving forward, right? They're they're they're not happy when you go backwards. So, that's I'm I'm not for against this,
but I'm against trying to do this one time and then next year going, we don't have the money for that. We're going back to 140,000. That's my concern. Frankly, if I could sell the town properties and get a
million here, get a million there, and put that toward OPED, that would be brilliant. We we could if if the committee and the the town meeting is the board's willing to do that, that would be great. This is kind of up in
the ante and and any extra money would certainly improve the bond rating, our ability to pay less interests, uh to more effectively have room in the operating budget rather than being bled dry by this year after
year. It's we've been ignoring it long enough. It's time to earn interest instead of pay interest. Okay, Mr. Chairman. Zach,
what did you say our liability is, Mr. Town Manager? $79 million. So, even your 300,000. What are you proposing? 340,000. A drop in the bucket. How do we ever get there?
I mean, that's a basically a whole year's operating budget of uh the town of Norton. How long do you want to stay here? I I'm just, you know, there's other towns have have done what's called an annual required contribution. So, every time you add ahead, you budget for the amount of
OPED, future OPED that employee coming on the the payroll is going to cost. And so, you're stopping the bleeding, but also catching up to your liability. And at some point you flip that where you're not just bleeding from the the 5.75%
interest we're paying a year but we're also gaining. Last year the market our oped count did 12% gain. So it flips it on its head. We're making 18% on this money. If we put in
half a million dollars in the next 10 years, that would make a potential 30 to $50 million dent in it. And then we're putting in, you know,5 or $10 million. It's it's incredible that if if and I I
will plan to budget to sustain this even if it means budget cuts because we've been ignoring this for decades. We need to live within our means. that that that's going to be my next comment come the spring town spring when we're sitting here in the spring. Um
it's going to be some challenging times. Uh it's been challenging, you know, splitting hairs over a dog catcher and and you know, funding the senior center and and uh late night battles over $10,000 and $5,000 and many hours. Now
we're adding a couple hundred,000 of this. We decided to give, you know, the seniors 150,000 140,000 deduction. You know, I just said how many positions? One, two, three. I'm I'm counting three positions that are going to have at least three positions that are going to
be gone this spring. Uh and then you have what we've already discussed in this in this meeting. You know, you got union renegotiations with all the unions, the teachers operating without a contract. Uh,
I see it uh uh a very rough rough road ahead come the spring. That's just my only concern and my caution to everybody. And understood. And planning for the future is really the only way to go to get out of the hole that we're in.
Okay. Any further discussion? I'll entertain a motion. It's article 17. Uh, Mr. Chairman Zach recommend is it 340,000
330,000 on a free cash to article 17 uh postemployment benefit liabilities second have a motion and a second any further discussion hearing none Sandy Please. Yes.
Thank you. Gavin, yes. Tracy, yes. Paula, yes. Paul, yes. Zack, yes. I attorney, yes. Okay, Mr. chair. Um, after after the vote, I
just wanted to point out to finally understand this interest thing. And of course, the stock market, who knows if it's going to continue to provide 12% returns, but that 300,000 that we just added to this account, even if it's a 10% return, that's another 30,000 a year
that goes back into this account, right? Minus the 5% we're paying out or whatever the case is. So, I can see that it can help it grow. Um, I'm just baffled that uh supplemental Medicare adds up to this much for a small town like us for the number of employees that
we have. Maybe at some point I'd like to see all the numbers behind it because it it just it does it baffles me. Like this might make a good future agenda item to have. You know, I believe we have 400 employees and we pay 3.5 million each
year. Um, I I can't do that quick math right now, but and maybe that's something in the future that we look at like negotiate a buyouts or something. I'm not quite sure how we reduce our reliability long term, but something for
a discussion another time. But thanks for bringing this to our attention. My pleasure. Next article is stabilization. Mr. town manager. So, the recommendation here is $750,000.
It's not quite the $1 million we would have some would have liked, and it's not the just the 500 returning that we borrowed for the the school budget. It's a happy medium. It's the most I feel that we can responsibly put into savings. It's for the very for the
record, it's very good to put money in savings and good for our bonds, good for our credit, good for proper planning. Uh so 750,000 seems to be the right amount at this time. Okay. Thank you, sir. Any questions from
select board? Mr. Chair. Yes, sir. Uh Mr. town manager. So, um this 750,000 that uh is a positive impact on our bond rating. Uh yes, sir. Any positive balance in
stabilization goes toward our unallocated funds balance, which is very that's that's the number one factor in our bond rating. Thank you. OPE's a close second. Mr. code. Can I have what's the present
balance in that account? Um, that's toward the end of the packet. Let me just flip there. Yeah, we do have a sheet on that. 4
3 million. So, it's 4,322,477. I have it. Thank you. promise to put back. Okay. Any other questions from Selectwood? Not no. Mr. A motion. Yes, sir.
I recommend that we move $750,000 into the stabilization round from free cash. Second. Motion in a second. Denise, yes. Kevin, yes. Bob, yes. Roger.
Yes. And I am a yes. Unanimous. Thank you, sir. Mr. Chair, thank you. Um, again, Mr. Town Manager, you know, two years ago we did a million. Last year we did a million5.
Now we're dipping to 750. This isn't going to raise eyebrows. that hey, you're you're you're slipping. It's it's a positive thing that we're putting money into stabilization in the
last few years. It looks like the the balance has been consistently going up. So, it's not going up as high as it did, but free cash isn't as high as it would. So, it's actually roughly the same percentage of free cash that we're putting towards stabilization.
Mr. Chairman. Yes, sir. As I recall, I believe that the golden number is around right around $5 million to where we're supposed to be. All these years, we haven't been there, but now we're we're near where we're supposed to be. So, bringing it back up just over
five is probably in our best uh interest, especially when it comes to borrowing money. We're getting ready to do some some major borrowing and a couple of major debt exclusions. So, it could be helpful. Anyone
from Vencom? Just a quick question. Um the stabilization account um also receives gains with interest. What was you said OPED was a 12% gain last year. What was the stabilization account with the
interest? Uh good good question. and we adopted the prudent investor act which allows a more you know slightly more aggressive for government's investment policy um I believe it was around 5% a little over
5% is that it has to stay so a money market basically right so so recently uh savings accounts and municipal investment accounts have both been around the same 5% which is
good for savings things maybe not ideal for investments, but the OPED, I guess, is more aggressively invested because it's a more long-term account. Stabilization has to stay more liquid. So, a little over five. Okay. And I don't believe everyone heard, but James said to keep it liquid,
right, which is a major component of that. Oh, yeah. Anyone else? I'll entertain a motion then. Mr. Chairman
Zack, I make a motion article 18 stabilization fund for 750 cash. Have a motion and a second. Any further discussion
hearing? None. Sandy. Yes, Gavin. Yes, Tracy. Yes, Paula. Yes, Paul. Yes, Zach. Yes, it passes unanimously.
Thank you. So, I believe that concludes the presentation. Everybody, I'll take a motion. Mr. Chair. Yes, sir. I make a motion to adjurnn. Second. Denise. I think so. Kevin,
yes. Bob, yes. Roger. Yes. And I am a yes. Okay. We are. We are ajourned. All right. Now we can talk about you. Talk about me.
Um I'll entertain a motion to adjourn. floors and nothing else. No meeting tomorrow. No more meetings before town meeting. You don't anticipate us needing to revisit any articles? We're good. So, Mark,
are we are we tomorrow's going to be cancelled? I mean, you can come if you want. You and I can hang out and play cards or something. All right. Um Yes, that's Yes, it's canceled tomorrow. And so, 11 meetings ahead of the town
meeting. We're good. Um I mean you're welcome to come to the select board meeting Thursday if you'd like to come. Oh man, all these meetings are fun to Nelson. No,
it's a week from this one. I I I would like to thank all the volunteers for their countless hours. These two boards primarily have spent a lot of time in in service to the residents. So,
thank you. Heartfelt planning board as well. Planning board as well. Planning board always. So, if there's nothing else, I'll entertain a motion. Mr. The chairman Zack make a motion to adjourn the fall
second 2025 FIMCOM session. Have a motion and a second. Any further discussion? Hearing none. Sandy, yes.
Gavin, Tracy, Paula, yes. Paul, yes. Zack, yes. It Thank you. hang on another hour. Hey, it's great to be a stranger. Great seeing you guys meeting as well. It's been real.