All right. So, we'll get started. Today's the November 25th PBC meeting. We got all members in attendance. >> Yeah, they're trying to figure out how to do it. >> Um, the agenda for this week of course. >> First, we want to drop the meeting minutes from last week.
>> Everybody reviewed them. I know Jim was wasn't present, but >> uh I got a motion. Anybody want to second it? >> I'll second. All in favor? >> I pass. >> So these two will get put into the
select board box so they can be posted. >> Um what else? We also >> jump in really quick. Sure. >> We have this meeting posted at school committee. We have a bunch of people who are out. So we just need to read a statement for public record that we're not in. >> Okay.
>> So I can just call. He says there was in another room somewhere. Oh, they're trying. They're trying to Zoom meeting also. >> If they come in, will you have a quorum or Oh, they're >> Oh, they're not. Yeah. No. So, I was told I was going to leave this, but um
due to unforeseen circumstances, the the school committee is not able to meet due to lack of a forum and the meeting is no longer being held jointly. So, uh Mr. Schlaker and myself are here as towns. >> Okay, perfect. Um correspondence. Next
item. I had uh an invoice here for Vert.Ex. Reviewed it, signed it, opened them just like mailbox. Then we have I was given a copy of the the last uh school board school
committee meeting minutes just just so we have a copy. You can read it in your at your leisure. I know I just got it today. I don't think there's anything in there exciting or you know detrimental to the project. I just haven't read it, so I'm sure there's nothing scary in
there. And then we got um a couple items here that uh Mr. Kimble gave us some estimates for the Is it the sidewalk? >> So the the raised elevation front of the front door of the community building. >> Mhm. >> This is an estimate to come in, heat it
up, use your big big big big roller and try to bring it back down again. the estimates from u two different companies. They're both the same amount, but the amount was between 25 and $4,800. $2,500 is for half a day. 4,800 is for
the entire day. I would make the assumption that it's probably going to take the entire day anyway. So, uh he did say Barry did say that if they did get it done, he'd go a half day. If not, he's probably end up he has something else they can do for him.
>> Okay. So, it's not like it's going to be a waste of time. Go ahead. >> This just mentions the entrance, the employees entrance on the side. >> Both, but it doesn't mention it doesn't, but he know he's aware of both.
>> Okay. >> Do do we want to wait till we get this in the minutes before we take a formal vote? I'm going to do it now. even going to make amend. >> I'll make a motion that we approve the um asphalt
repair concrete repairs of council agent building uh not to exceed $4,800. >> And do we have uh which one of these this firehouse? >> He didn't say >> either one of them. They're both 4,800 bucks. So you can pick and choose I
guess whatever you want to do. Can you repeat that? I'm sorry. Can you repeat that? I'm sorry. >> I think you're at the mic. I think you're at the mut. >> You're going to want to unmute the mic. >> How's that? Am I repeating myself?
>> You good on your end? >> I'm sorry. >> No, I'm going to make a motion to uh approve the asphalt stripping hazard bears on concrete walkway at the council on each community building on two doorways. Uh maximum of $4,800.
He has two estimates. One's from firehouse infrared asphalt and the other one's from heating cooling solutions. Both are at $4,800. I'll try to hit unmute, but if it disrupts things, then I'm just going to mute it back again.
And then nobody here. >> Brian is going to need to mute. >> Turn my speaker off. Um I do have an update from the fire department. We can get to that in the correspondence, but let's go through the minutes and then we can um touch on the stuff as we go.
All right. Let's see the roof shingles at the community center. Steve, can you give an update on the community center? >> It's okay. Um Steve Kirby from Vortex for anybody who doesn't doesn't know me. Uh senior center uh right now the only
thing that's left is the uh shingle issue with this uh um bridging or or mulling as as they call it. Uh Greenwood Industries who a rupra has engaged Gail associates to look at
it. Gail is now looking at the design drawings uh and they may um come out for a site visit. Uh I asked them if they do decide to do that to give us ample notice uh for um the senior center and
and for town hall. Um just so everybody knows that they're coming out. Uh obviously we'd want to come out at the same time. they may do some minor investigative work on a section of the roof. So, at this point, they are still reviewing uh the design drawings. The
aspect there was nothing changed on the roof. So, we just went back to the uh uh to the design construction set. Okay. And then last time we had the uh parking lot curves. I last week uh last meeting I should
say. I don't think we had an update. Any more update on those those curbs? Parking lots of stops. >> Those those were replaced. >> They were replaced. >> Yes. Uh Sver took care of all of their warranty items. >> I just didn't think we had an update
last time. And then the AV equipment that's in the town's court. There's some programming going on. My understanding that everything everything is operational as far as I know there there
was there was some program that had to be done but that was on the town side whatever they wanted to program on that one screen that's behind the uh the fireplace the uh the information screen. >> Do you have anything from your >> Can you mute your computer please?
>> Sure. on the the town hall AV >> senior 7. >> Oh, senior. No, I don't know about you said it's better. >> I didn't do anything. >> Yeah, good. >> So, Brian should mute his mic because
the mic's sitting on the table or feeding into the Zoom up there. They can hear you if he mutes. This way. I don't know why it's going to be up here. And each committee has the right to decide which way they'd like to have it.
It can be a Zoom, it can be in person, it can be a combination of both. Perhaps we should look into that. I got it. I had to double click on the icon. Okay. Sorry. Um I thought Okay, we left off at the AV,
right? No update. Everything's fine that we know of. >> I haven't heard anything that's not working. >> So, we should close the thing. >> Yeah. Okay. >> What I'm saying is that they they are having messages on the on the message board. I think the one thing I thought we maybe it was the town hall was
I think Charlene and maybe one other person was trained in and since she's out on medical leave I think we're trying to figure out they train somebody else. I thought that was an issue. >> So Melissa from park and wreck is trained
on the signs both at town hall and at the senior center. >> Okay. That's what >> the digital signs outside. >> The digital signs. >> Okay. We were talking about the interior message boards >> inside the building. >> Yeah, cuz you're right. Charlene was trained on the digital exterior signs
also, >> which I think comes up in a minute, >> which was a a separate >> Yeah. >> vendor, >> right? I think you might have said last time that Jill, the clerk, was also trained on the lobby signs. No.
So, >> I mean, if you not have any issues, we can close it. You don't think? I don't know if they work. I don't have an IT department posted today for an IT director. >> Okay. >> And that's it for the singing center.
>> Yes. I have one question. Yep. And this is nothing to do with you. I just need some information. The dishwasher >> is still not working. And so is that on the warranty or is that now? >> That was on the warranty list. They they
reported to us that they came out and fixed that. >> It went right back out after. >> It was just the one. >> Yeah, just the one. And what it is is when you open it up, all the promps on the top are all lit up. >> All the what? >> Everything's lit up. The whole pro all
the different functions >> Oh. Lit up on it and it doesn't go off. cuz when we looked at it, there was an issue with the with the door and all the all the interior lights were on, which they shouldn't have been. So,
we reported that back to Bosch was the the the manufacturer. Um, okay. So, I'll just I'll revisit that again with them, but they they reported that that was they they serviced it and it was fixed. >> And I guess a couple days later, it went right back to doing whatever it was
doing. >> Okay. Do you know if anybody called them? >> Probably not. >> Okay. >> Be my guess. >> All right. Like like I said before, if you if you know anything, just let me know because even if you're contacting
the vendor and if you copy me, at least I can follow up and know that it's an issue if I don't see a response. >> Mr. Tom, uh Mr. the uh department head over there and everyone else should be aware of the fact that we're no longer
doing this stuff and they need they need the service. If they need service, they need to reach out themselves and try to get this stuff done. So, I know you're not aware of it either, probably. So, >> what what service specific? >> It's a dishwasher. >> Well, I think what he's saying >> senior center.
>> Well, what he's saying is the warranty is expired. So, it's no longer under the contract. >> It's just building maintenance. So, it's no longer an operative. >> Well, in this case though, I want to try and follow up with it because we add it on the warranty list. They came out and that didn't fix it. I'm going to
consider the warranty still in effect. >> Exactly. I would >> other things. Yeah. Other things are, you know, >> I just think I just think they need to stop telling other people about the problems. They need to figure out who who the person is that has to take care of. Yeah. >> Yeah.
I'll just uh tomorrow. Okay. Thank you. Okay. So, we'll just add it on here. Let's keep track of it. There was a warranty list. All right. Town hall update, Steve. Okay. There's a few things at the town hall. I'll I'll start with the with
this, I guess, easy stuff. Uh the as far as the the warranty list goes, there's only a couple items that are left. Um there's uh one of the items was uh elevator keys for the inside panel. They got they got the light key, but they did
not get the correct uh key for the for the fan. So M Connor is chasing that down. Um I need I needed them to confirm there was some HVAC work done in room 135. The tile needed to replace. I asked them to
check on that. And the plaza itself is is done, but they're they're trying to settle out with the concrete uh company, which was Capital Concrete. Uh and they're they're having some
difficulties with that. I had a conversation with them today cuz I they said to me, you know, I'm surprised you haven't sent in an application for payment yet. and part of that application repayment is going to be at sizable credit. So,
I'm letting them work that out, but um you know, it doesn't affect anything here moneywise. >> So, is it the GC and the sub back >> between the GC and the sub? Yeah, because Emil hired a different uh sub to
do the the cleaning and some of the patching and then they finished up the sealants. So, um, so that that is the only thing that I, uh, the only items that are left on that one-year warranty walkthrough list. We we did get,
uh, a notice today from a third tier sub, paving sub, that they had not been uh, paid for the work that they did in June. Um, Emil Connor
subcontracted to their sitework contractor who had a paving contractor who in turn subcontracted again for some of the work. Now, part of this was uh I think brought to light today because the
owner of that company, their first paving company passed away last week. So, I think they're concerned that they're going to have a problem with that. So, um Jill and I sort of emailed back and forth today and ultimately I
sent uh her the payment bond for Oconor and just the notification that as far as the town goes, paving had been paid as of June of of this year. So, um hopefully that um gets taken care of on
the lower end, but since it came up today, I fig let everybody know. Uh we also uh recently received a public records request from the Fair Foundation for Construction in Massachusetts looking for all certified payrolls on
the project. Um, I did send back uh through Jen, cuz she's the one that sent it to me, a list of the subcontractors requesting that
the Fair Foundation reduce the number of contractors that they're looking for and who they specifically are. Otherwise, it's going to cost a lot more than $100 to to answer all that, which is part of the whole um prop uh public records request that
uh that's been sent out to them. And this they typically do this. I just went through this with them on another project. >> Prevailing wages. >> Yeah, >> they just they want to check >> that the prevailing wage is correct. >> Subject to public records law. >> Yes.
I know we are, but it's Vertex. >> Well, it it went to you guys to me and because we we are the the record keeper during the project. >> At some point, we're going to send all those certified payrolls to you guys because you got to keep them for seven years, but we're we're going through
that. >> So, sometimes it's a random audit and sometimes it's somebody who has who has a claim, if you will. Well, this they they typically ask for several so you won't know who's asking for the claim.
>> It's random, but whatever. >> Sure. >> I Yeah, I would have interpreted that as it's not under the custody care control of the town. >> We don't have it. But if you want to Sure. >> I think I think it's an owner's
requirement. >> Yeah. You're supposed to >> You're you're the awarding authority. You have to have Dr. Even if you use an OPM, it's still you're involved. >> I mean, if it was like two years from now, we wouldn't be involved in it. You would be answering that,
>> which you're involved in now. >> We are because it's going to go quicker for us to do it than >> And he'll give him the information. So, >> yeah, but we're funneling the response back through. And on occasions, I've asked a town, do you want us to respond on your behalf? And I I start the It's
all electronic now. We don't do copies anymore. But I say on behalf of the the town of whoever we're responding to your records request. >> So you're waiting from the fair foundation to reply back because you
have to respond within 10 business days. So the response was please shorten your list. >> Yeah. >> Which which I'm certain they will cuz they they've done it before. >> Okay. We had a couple more items on it.
We just check them off the list. Yeah, >> you may not have them. Uh, ERV ERV1 >> room 135. There's a tile >> for the HVAC pipe above. >> Yeah, HVAC did did their their work. I just got to we just got to confirm that
the tile's been replaced. That's still on the list. >> Okay. Attic keys. We talked uh I'm sorry, ERV in the attic. There are no keys. ERV and then that came to confirm. >> There are no keys for that. Um Chris was
looking at something else. >> Okay. >> Yeah. So that it's doesn't apply to >> then we got GGD letter to >> that's been submitted. >> They came back after after the last meeting. >> Did the touchup areas. Uh they came on
the 30th I think. >> On the 30th of October. >> And the concrete was done. Everything's satisfactory. Everybody's happy with what was done. >> They they did what we asked them to do. Yes. >> Yes. Probably noticed the pinches out there.
Um I'm not surprised. I believe that our manager has to be removed. So, uh, we're not using >> we we looked out the window on the 30th and comment on that. >> However, comments if you need any nice
plastic benches, we've got a whole bunch of them. Repurpose for some purpose. >> There you go. >> All right, that was it on the town hall. Anybody have any questions? >> I thought Oh, I'm sorry. Um so the other
the other item is uh the audio visual in the crane meeting room. So last time we talked about we had a meeting on the uh on the 20 I guess not the 30th it was on the 29th where CCS and Asentech and
everybody was in uh the meeting roommates uh there was some firmware uh upgrades that had to be done. There was some rerouting of of uh programming that was done. It seemed like everything was okay until the 17th when there was
issues again. Um got in touch with uh CCS. Uh they came out on the 20th which was I guess just before you guys had a meeting. Um they did not uh they did some upgrades but they didn't finish
everything. I think right now they're tenatively scheduled to come back on the 5th. Um I think you just need to confirm that with them because they've asked that. >> What time? >> Probably in the morning.
I don't I just I just know they they they were holding up the December 5th to come back. >> Okay. I >> I can resend you that email. >> Yeah. I'll have to make sure that Norton Media and whatever IT person hopefully I can find
an IT person to be available that day. >> Yeah. >> I got to ask cuz I did I did tune in to the last select board meeting just for a little bit to see if things were going all right. Were you still having the issue with
uh not hearing people are on the Zoom or was was that working? Could you hear who people were? >> I don't think we had anybody at that time. >> We haven't had we haven't had many people calling in. >> So, we're not sure at this point. >> I didn't I didn't sit through the whole thing, but >> I believe it probably had to do with not
us not knowing how to use it, >> but we've got someone now sitting in it. So if we have somebody that can make sure it can help >> and and and again even with this if there's a problem with that they if those guys gave you their cards to call them I mean it's still it's
still a warranty issue because that was part of that was the change order that they did at the very end of price so I can sit up all that system still under warranty and they they agreed to that when we were out here on the on October 29th. So, uh, I know sometimes if you,
you know, trying to get them when you need them may be difficult, but I sent a bunch of email cuz they were they weren't coming out for like 2 weeks. I said, "We've got a meeting on Thursday. You got to come out this week." And they finally relented, but that was there must have been four different guys from
that company on emails. >> Mark, did you find out if you can do uh up on the board, we can make a perpetration on screen? You should be able to. I I don't know how to do it. And I've been in many
meetings in these rooms and Paul and Brian are the only ones that seems to know how to do it. So, what we really need is cards to make these rooms user friendly, including the crane room that's actually on here.
What about other business from last week? The reference cards. So we I don't know if any other questions on on that or information. >> Can we get the companies back in here? It sounds like we need some additional training be done on some of these
systems. >> You don't have an idea, >> right? I know. >> You know, somebody gets sick and then suddenly everything goes to what level. So we got to we got to do some more cross training so people understand. We did talk about it back in October. Um,
and I I think they were going to get back uh to us with um when they could do something and I don't think they ever did. So, I'll follow up with that also. >> Anything else, D? And the the only other thing is and and you know I got to defer
it from a major discussion because uh DBVW you know but there are some invoices that we have to work out with them and we'll we'll do that and we'll bring it to this this committee then but um I think I think that's all I have.
>> Yeah. I would just add that noise that you hear. I It should have been HVAC to It's heating really hot. It was like 80 or 90° in the closet. If we didn't open the door, there might have been a
fire or explosion. We need a fan on that hot equipment. >> Well, we had talked about because that that did come up. We had talked about potentially putting an egg crate in that ceiling >> so that the heat would go above the ceiling, but I I think you had said that
there was someone was looking at whether that was Oh, the building commissioner was looking at that. >> Maybe Chris or Ed. I don't know. >> Maybe Chris said that. >> Can you put a louver in the door? >> Well, I think the heat's going off. >> Well, it'll maybe Yeah. And that creates
the easiest thing to put in. I mean, we're going to put a lure in the door. We can do it, but you got to get someone to cut it in. Um, I did have one other thing. Um, the second part of the audio visual, which is audio vision on these conference rooms, which is done, but
ProAB is putting together the O and M's and warranty packages. We should see it um first week of December Jason on that. they they were separate from the the crane meeting room and the media room because that was under the the general
contract was was a standalone director. So Mark until you have your replacement or your new hire completed. Do we who is the responsible party when it comes to AV and any technology owners manuals? Is
it is it Ray Court at this point or is there a single person? >> No. >> Okay. >> No. If if it's facility related, I default to Chris board of health Chris. If it's technology related, um MX right
now, but they don't have authority to have the final say in these projects. But I I also want to loop in Norton Media and in the absence of it Brian in
the planning department knows Zoom. I think the opportunity is um a lot of people know the different pieces but nobody through no fault of their own is assuming uh ultimate responsibility for anything cuz they're all it's all spread
out right. So when you get the IT person hired, it'll be take it'll take care of itself. But in the meantime, >> I guess you got to do what you try to do, right? And I think we do need an SOP for boards and committees so we can have someone on hand like at this meeting
running the Zoom like like whoever schedules the meetings, we need to have the next step of making sure someone is here to make the meeting flow. So, >> we'll get there. >> That's it from your end, Steve.
>> Yes. >> Um, thank you for that. A couple more items. This one related, but um I don't think on Steve's radar is the big fan electrical bill we got. Where does that stand, Bob? So we have an appointment
set or working on setting up the time between representatives, state representatives and the record company. They believe that we can we can take care of that issue. >> It was an oper a a a power bill for running the building or this is this
doesn't go back to that. >> This is the lot out front was the mass highway project. >> We're not going to pay. >> I I I gave >> I went through that a million times. >> We have. So, what we're going to do now is we'll have the state representative Howitt >> bringing in his layers on from the
wingman. >> Yep. >> And we're going to sit down in the room and we're going to talk about it. >> Good. >> They already understand that most of that bill was not ours. >> Y >> that belongs to whoever they allow that illegal connection to be put in. Uh we
have no record of ever proving that. >> Right. So all of that will be brought into this meeting and it's my understanding that we hope that most of this is going to be dissolved by that time and we're still trying to set up a meeting with the uh to the company that we have. He is working on it. So
hopefully we'll have some um solution to this. >> That's why you always take a picture of the of the meeting and you start. >> Yeah. It wasn't our property at the time. >> The whole thing doesn't pass the smell test. >> It was Conniey's property. >> It was terrible. >> No, no, >> not Connie. That's funny. But when we
started, we we reused it. >> Yeah. >> And we took a we took a photo what the what the reading was that we have a baseline. >> You had a trailers for that for a while. >> The trail that the trailer is connected to that place. >> Well, we have my record authorizing.
>> Oh, I know. No permit. >> So, the whole thing is just stinks. >> So, we're we're working on that. >> All right. That's good to know. >> All right. The remaining funds is the next item. That's back to you. I'll select board
working on that >> as far as what's left. >> Yeah, I think you said it's in a reconciliation process and you were you were trying to allocate a little bit of funds in an escrow for future use of this project. >> Yeah, I think we have to wait for
Steve said something about the uh working with uh the highway department. I think all that has to be >> Yeah, there's a few things that I have to I mean, I've got updates to a certain point, but there's a few things that still have to be filled in because I know there's there might be still some more purchases
of of items off of what was in our budget, like the the kitchen wares. >> Yep. >> Or other things. Um, and then the street sign. You just confirm Melissa from Park and Rex was
train. So, I don't think there's any more people that item out. >> I'm sorry. The what? >> The uh the sign out front. >> Oh, look. >> Mr. G confirmed Melissa from Park and Rex. Yes. Also trained. That's all. We're just trying to figure out if somebody else was trained in in um
Charlene's absence. Sounds like a friend. All right. Next is the middle school. >> All right. Thank you everybody. Have a good Thanksgiving. >> Thanks Steve. >> We'll let you know if we have another meeting. We probably do Zoom. >> You guys have fun.
>> Thank you all for having us here tonight. We appreciate it. Um we have some updated information that is honestly hot off the presses. This um estimate was finalized earlier today. So um we're grateful to I am going to turn
it over to James Rawol of Next Level OPM Resort. Um of Tai and Bond. and they're going to walk you through our slides, which we'll pretend that we are low tech just to save ourselves from the craziness of trying to get us set up.
Um, these are the slides here tonight with the um in front version of the middle school. So, I'll have the guys walk you through and then we'll um go through and and and take some questions. This is looking at full replacement of the middle school roof.
>> Thank you. And um yeah, if you have questions, you know, small enough group as we're going for it, please feel free to ask our name back. >> Sure. So, yeah, I'm at Zor Tai Bond. Um and just kind of going through some of
the background here to know that um we were here before in August um or September. So, we originally submitted in August the um metal roof replacement, the EPDM roof restoration. That was the original scheme um that was presented
and on September 24th. Um since then uh there was some additional information that came to light um in October about a previous report that was done actually in 1999 from SGH that shed some light on some other issues uh with the flashings.
Um so we read that report and that kind of helped drive uh decisions to to look into full replacement. Um so we had some conversations with the school and ultimately what we want we decided was we'll put together a full replacement package. That's what we're here uh present tonight. Um so here we are
today. Existing conditions um these are similar to what was was shown before just kind of similar representative conditions of the metal roof and EPDM. Um you know the roof in general is beyond its useful light. Um we did perform a uh moisture scan um during the
the schematic design phase. Uh that's shown on some of those the the map here with some of the imaging results. You know the red areas are areas where there was suspect moisture. Um it's still it was under 10%. So that's why at time we thought restoration was still applicable. Uh we weren't dealing with
you know over over 10% of the loop area insulation. Um, but the real update here is really this the 1999 SGH report. Um, so I during construction of the building, um, there seemed to be some issues that were found either either
after or during, um, the the project and I think the general contractor actually hired SGH to do some investigative work. Um, and they found some things that were they were pretty bad. Um, you know, the copper flashings were not continuous or watertight. Uh, a lot of them weren't
soldered. There was issues with the um kind of how the the the flashing extended past the roof edge. It was too short in some areas so water could still get into the existing roof. Um, so there was there was a lot of work and tests that were done back then and they did
perform some repairs, but they didn't do everything. They just did select areas so that they could they could see during the the test area that they had. Um but basically the the results of that were were kind of showing a systemic issue of flashings throughout the whole building
and stuff. Um so when this was kind of brought forward and we looked at it um it really kind of changed the approach a little bit and um you know restoration was maybe not the best option looking at full replacement as we do through wall flashings and everything else was was
kind of what we looked at. Um, so we updated our recommended solutions. Um, basically we're now looking at full replacement of the EPM system. The metal system is is still the same. Um, that's going to be full replacement, but we were kind of doing that last time as well. Um, but basically we remove
everything down to the existing deck. Uh, and then we would start from new from the deck. So, we put a new substrate, new vapor barrier, new code compliant insulation with a 6-in minimum tapered insulation on top of that and a cover board, new EPM roof section on top of that or membrane on top of that. Uh
we do have in this um this scheme, you know, we're assuming about 5% of the roof area may be in your metal decking. Uh so that's built into the estimate as well. Um and then one change too is with when we do full replacement, you know, we're now adding additional insulation
thickness. Currently, uh there's about two to I think 5 in on the roof, but we're starting at six now. So we're going to be potentially reducing the flashing height on a lot of the curving equipment. Um, so that's why we're going to have to we we're calling to remove all the current HBAC equipment, rebuild
new curbs, and then put all the equipment back. Uh, so that's another kind of change with this this scheme. >> One question. >> Yes. >> You're actually going to remove the HVAC system. >> Correct. >> Is that something that should be concerned about? Just thinking out loud.
I'm a retired retailer that has roof. I'm worried about picking that thing up and putting it back down. and it's not doing anything to the machinery at all. What the cost of that? >> Yes, there is the potential for that damage. Usually what we do though is we'll do we'll require the um contractor
to do a pre-ervey. So they'll go through and they'll log all the equipment to make sure how it's functioning. You know, some things are broken to begin with. And so if they take it back and put it back, it's broken. If they don't do the survey, sometimes they get blamed for breaking it. Um but usually what we do is we'll have them log or categorize everything to make sure that it's what
condition is it in before you move it. So, it helps mitigate that risk sometimes. Um, this next slide just kind of shows the EPM roof system. Again, kind of what we said, the six-inch minimum um replacement through wall flashings with different curves, metal fascia. So, this
is again, we're also getting to more of the metal fascia here, too, because we are adding more insulation. We're going to be building up the edges uh with more blocking. So, we're now have to redo more of the metal edge uh uh fascia that we didn't have to do before. And then also replacement of the drain assemblies.
Um this just a little highlight in the metal roof section. Again, nothing really changed here since last time. Still going to go with a new um installation of double lock stand system. We do however have an alternate uh that we did look at that we didn't really detail what we got a cost for to
do uh asphalt shingle roofs if that is something that the town is interested in. But the base of design we were going with metal. There is metal there now. Then we thought metal would go back. Um, and then we also have Yes, >> I'm sorry to interrupt. What would the
asphalt shingle save compared to the metal roof? >> They have that last. >> Yeah. Next slide. >> It's about a million dollars. >> Got it. Thank you. >> Um, >> I have another question. Why would they put other than >> it does? Why would you put a metal roof
in the beginning? Is there a reason for that? I mean, just asking about >> Yeah, I mean it's it's a those are the slope proof sections. You can go to asphalt, you can go metal. I mean, usually metal is the premium option. You know, it's the longest uh lifespan. It's usually a more durable, more res resilient roofing than asphalt. You
know, asphalt is good and they make decent warranties now with 30, 40, sometimes I think they make a 50-year warranty now, but I think those are kind of rare. I don't know if that actually been 50 years. Um, but usually that'll last longer. It's a more premium option. >> And you can do it snow or anything.
Maybe maybe have to do it down or something like that. >> Yeah. I mean, when you have insulation underneath, you know, you shouldn't be getting the snow melt from underneath as much, you know, with coine insulation now. But, um, I mean, yeah, I mean, you
could put snow guards kind of on the metal to to hold it in. Uh that's what we're kind of proposing too is you put the the snow guards on. Um but yeah, I think it's just a more premium option and generally it's supposed to last longer and um the seams that they have now are are 180°, you know, seams, so
they're pretty water uh weathertight. Um I mean, but you know, shingles still work. I mean, look at everyone's house, they still work. It's just usually they cost less than sometimes they're more prone to wind damage and hail damage and stuff like that. >> Yeah. Based on the condition of the one that they have now, the same age as a roof. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. I don't look great.
>> No. >> So, you know, it's a shingle compared to our roof. I mean, in my opinion, it's it's going to look better. The metal event is going to fail. >> So, the reason that we have not gotten the tongue out of the metal roof that we
currently have is because of the drilling that they did into the metal roof itself. Um, I want to say probably around 2011, around there. 2008. It's got to be even earlier than that. Maybe 2007, 2008. And
what they did is they installed um snow points. So they drilled directly into the metal roof itself and once they compromised the metal roof, that's when you started to see all of the rusting and and it all breaking down. So that's
why we haven't gotten that extended life on the car. >> So you put on an as far. Yeah, then you'd have to drill those in. Where these ones we were proposing, they kind of clamp onto the roof itself so you don't have to penetrate through the metal. Um, so yeah, you can do that.
>> I think what I'm looking at when I'm looking at the face of the metal. >> Mhm. >> Unless you're paint roof is not I think asphalt would probably be looking better today there than the metal does. I'm trying to get
that. It's just my own personal opinion. And the question that I asked um when we met earlier today was, do you have to make a decision now on what you want before you go out to bid? And we absolutely do not. You can have them both. You can have it built as metal if
is the standard with the asphalt shingle as the alternate. And once we have a little bit of a better idea of what the actual pricing is going to look like, then we can make a decision about, okay, in our minds we thought it would be close to a million. it's really a $400,000 difference or whatever that may
be and we can make that decision um down the road as well. >> As an example, this building here, we had a brick facade as part of the original um scope that was uh you know sent out to bid and then we removed that
and you saved about $900,000. Very similar situation, right? Roof instead of uh you know side. As far as the two systems, is there one that's easier to repair like 50 years down the road over the other?
I'm just thinking the shingles may be easier if there's spot problems, but I don't know. >> Yeah, I agree. I think there's probably more people that can deal with shingle roofing than metal roofing, right? So, you probably get it and the fix is probably easier because if it's again, depending what it is, if it's a small
localized area where one shingle was ripped out, yeah, you can get somebody to get fix that relatively easy, you know. uh >> or somebody drills up through it >> or that. >> Yeah. But if someone goes through the metal, it's not everyone can repair a metal roof, you know. So that that is true. The maintenance of it is probably
a little more complicated as well. >> Um and kind of what uh eching what John was saying is the way we have it set up with the base kind of being the metal with the alternate being the shingles. I wouldn't want to flip that because then you'd be kind of wouldn't be covering the costs I guess during this phase. You
know what I'm saying? So if you if you bid it and you had the alternate metal and you said you wanted metal now the price is more wouldn't be reimbured you all this um >> by by the way does the MSBA have preference over the two systems. >> Okay.
>> Um and the last sheet kind of shows just the breakdown of the costs. Um so you know again we were showing about 8.6 for the restoration 9.2 for this is the full replacement. Those numbers look close. Um, I will say the roof replace restoration number was I think a little
lower than that. There was a a data point that uh was I think a little too high on that. So that number was really probably a little lower than if it's showing here. So the difference is actually greater than than what we're showing on the spreadsheet. Um, but the 9.2 is is a good number for the up full
replacement and the metal roof replacement. And then below we have the alternates to show you. Uh, alt one is the electrical for solar which again this one doesn't have to be considered. I was just thrown in there because we have we have one area in the roof where there is solar where that's going to be coming off and that is the solar ready area for the future if you want to put
solar back there. But our structural said that there was like 11 or 12 other areas on the roof that could have solar. So if you wanted to put the electrical infrastructure in to make it solar ready that would be about 75,000 just like just to run conduits to those areas. Again nothing you have to do and other
than uh alternate two is just show the difference between the two machines. part of showing that the uh electrical alternate is serving up the two masters. Um the MSBA required this round, you know, to make roofs, make sure the roofs were solar ready. There's a really big
push for it. Um all districts have run personal experiences with it. And so this number is more or less show the MSBA this is our good faith effort and this is where it could happen but the owner you still has control and thank
you for that knowledge but no thank you no and and by the way we were using the solar ready portion is the portion that's already up on the gym that's already there so it should be no cost and that checks the box as well that's what's going on there
>> and I think for any of us who have been around for a While we know all the issues that we had with solar panels that were on the school roof initially, we at the school department, we have no desire to put any new solar panels up on any of our roofs. Um, and we have the
five car ports. And so ultimately, um, as James said, like the MSBA requires a certain portion of the roof to be solar ready, but we have no intention of putting solar panels. So it's >> are there so there are no other
alternates that fall into the same discussion the same category that the MBA requires you to have line item but it's up to the owner whether they want to you know approve that these only two like if you
have a speestous that's not optional you have to remove but we don't have any because of the age but that's not considered an alter for example. Okay. >> Because of the age of the building itself, we already know like that there it wouldn't be an issue. >> Correct. Yeah. We as part of schematic
design, we did uh initial round of hazmat testing and then all came back there. >> Yes. So, um we've done a number of air quality studies um in the since we came back to school this fall. um in one area
tested taught which was the um bus door festival where students come in um right not at the rotunda area but um >> on the other side like with the big huge ceiling um that goes up the stairs and so that was uh remediated and retested
and that looks really good. Um but there if and I don't want to steal the thunder of um James in that. Um but here this sheet here and we printed it a little bit bigger cuz my original copy was very tiny. Um this is where you see some of
that contingency funding as well. Um because I think you know of course my biggest concern um reading the report from 1999 that um we found when going through um some boxes is just what what are we going to find when the roof comes
off totally and you know how saturated are we because of these construction issues that occurred almost 30 years ago. Um so there are contingencies built in here and I think either James or Matt can maybe speak a little bit more. um
eloquently in that regard. Um but those are all built into uh the total project budget which is then um reimbured at the 55.63% from the MSBA. >> Yes. Uh the uh it's on the second page
there if you'll see there's a total project uh cost and then there's contingencies. Um there's a construction contingency that is really 5%. That's typically what the MSBA allows. Well, that's the max that they will reimburse to. So that's
the number shown there. >> Mhm. >> Um and and and then there's the owner's and then there's the owner's contingency which is a half percent. That's for soft costs and that rarely gets used as well. Um what I'm trying to get at is this is
a roof replacement. Um, you know, we're going down to the going down to the deck. Uh, there's really, you know, uh, there's very little, um, unknowns once you go down to the deck, except maybe the deck, and I think you already have
some metal, maybe, um, carrying something in there for deck replacement, metal deck replacement if that's needed, if you know. Um and so >> so when it comes to the flashing replacements that we have to do along
the perimeter, that's where potentially we would see this contingency used if if behind the flashing. >> I would say I would well I would say no because you are we're taking out all the old flashing and putting it brand new.
>> So we're placing this is a true replacement. We're not really keeping anything that there's supposedly, you know, we were, you can see flashing sticking out, you know, visually on the outside of the building. Um but then when the 1990s for came up to light which they actually uh destructively
they removed bricks and you know normal standard of care standard of design uh they don't we don't take out the bricks you know you do a visual inspection and but things were so I guess so bad and when it was first built uh that they had
someone do that testing and and we found that port now and so so anyway all of that is going to be going back brand new and and so there should be no >> yeah I would say anything basically from the roof deck up is going to be new and
replaced essentially it would be if there's other issues it would be inside the building at that point which which we do also have a little all lounge in here for some act removal drywall repair and stuff like that if needed for some areas we know that were leaking in the past but we're not the intent of this is not to go inside and fix everything
inside the building it's more the exterior work but everything to the deck will installation we replaced. Correct. Crossing. >> So are the contingency percentages they're the same though regardless of complete um you know uh renovation or
replacement or it's the they're fixed um >> they're fixed% they're fixed. They're fixed by the MSBA. >> Yes. >> Um as to what they will contribute to. So we can add more to that number if we feel with that need. What commonly
happens is that um if you guys school committee members remember from last time there's there's there's these estimated costs and then there's the bid day and we have typically seen like they bid day is about 70% less what these estimated costs are and the MSBA at that
time will ask you okay what are you going to do with that chunk of money and you can give it back immediately then or about nine times out of 10 we roll it back into the project you know there's a contingency it's not reimburseable but it's there if there's any any truly dramatic unforeseen. We've never had
really nice safety. >> And it's important to note that all of the contingencies and they add up um yes, they apply to the the final construction cost, you know, when we award the project to through GC. So, if it comes
in at instead of 6.6, six. If it comes in five, then you you're reducing all of the percentages that are against that difference in savings as well. >> That's correct.
>> A couple things. Ratunda area has been a problem since day one, 1999. They're up there trying trying to repair that and the flashing was in some cases non-existent. So, um I think it's important that area
have your concentration and take it off. I suggest that that's not happening, but you know, just make sure that's not as far as the interior design is. Sound like we've got a small contingency for it. But I am more concerned about the
interior than I am you. And I think as part of this project, we have to make sure that we have enough money in contingency to do other repairs, interior repairs, maybe beyond what you guys are going to do. You know, somehow we got to figure out another way
to add a few more dollars to this as a maybe a different contingency so that we have money available. So if we drop the ceiling, we find mold and insulation and all this stuff, we have the avail uh available funds to do it under a dead school.
>> If we have to go back and ask for it under 2 and 1/2, we're going to be full. I think what he was saying is whatever's left over big time percentage goes into a separate account. We still have the money for it. >> Correct. >> It can be reallocated. And I agree with
with Bob. One of the concerns I have is when you replace metal deck, it's what's attached to it on the bottom. Be ceilings, light fixtures, conduits, anything to be able to cross it and all that has to be considered. You take the deck up, who knows what's coming. So, you may want to fluff that up a little bit.
>> And these are good points. And as they mentioned um the difference from what the the you know the award the GC the lowest bid and um and what we have in the budget is not reimburseable but it can still stay in the in the
budget. Correct. But we have to make sure that the um the article from the town meeting and the data solution is broad enough so it includes utilizing any excess money for interior repairs. bid savings goes back to the construction contingency basically and
>> and I would also just say maybe we don't want to be say specific and say interior because I'm thinking specifically about that bus entrance where the students are coming in um we've because of the water damage that we've had running down that the side of the building both interior
and exterior I would say that that side of the building needs to be repointed or brick needs to be repointed and I'm actually concerned about some of the windows that are there um even when if you're And and again, not a construction person at all by any means, but you can see that the cocking around the windows
is is almost completely gone. And so we might want to think about those types of things if we do have to make the building water tight. >> Yeah, that's a good point. So the language would I don't know how you town council will have to, you know, any associated damage associated with the
you know the the uh the roof failure or whatever the case is. don't know interior like you mentioned any anything. I mean >> well I think Jennifer brings up a good point. We can always list that as an alternate too costing or repointing an alternate. The only
problem you can have an alternate is you can't have minuses and pluses. Has to be all one or all the other >> and you have to put them in the right sequence >> order >> because you can't accept five but that'll take you four 3 2 and one. Just just so you know >> prior we order them. We all right?
>> Yes. >> Probably a good example of it too. The windows in that thing awaken along the roof back in 99 >> and they were trying to figure out where the water was coming from. is coming in around the windows as well as so I think
it's important I mean keep in mind that we may have some windows that may have to be replaced a pointing that has to be done but again we got to figure out how we get that money that's deal later and say okay we're all done >> now we need another
>> yeah we're doing the roof but there's these five windows now >> I'd like to try to avoid that >> no discussion about how we're going to pay for the sh you know, we we're throwing out the debt exclusion, which I'm sure in our mind, it makes the most
sense. So, it's the only way we're going to be able to do it. We're not going to be able to pay that long-term debt on that for the general kind of funds. So, we're going to have to come up with a different approach and the only way we're going to be able to do this is to replace that hasn't been addressed yet.
Well, along those lines, I see you have an escalation uh factor of 4.5% for the year, and you have the midpoint of July 2026. We're probably going to need to add that 4.5% because it's not going to happen this summer,
>> right? Um so that's another 300,000 that'll have to build back into it. >> Yeah. Yeah. And the other thing I'll add too is that I mean looking at these there's the design contingency line for 10%. Again we're we're only at the schematic design level. So knowing
things like the windows are an issue and stuff like that too as we progress through DD and and CD we could potentially like you said add that to this. The only problem is it wouldn't be reimburseable through MSBA as part of the program. Right. But >> but you there's no reason why you couldn't add as part of the project. You know it just would
>> still be more efficient. >> Correct. And and so, you know, as we go through, you know, design contingency usually goes down as you get more advanced in design and that bucket could cover some things like the window replacement if that's what was needed or reporting or stuff like that.
>> Mr. Chair, can I ask a question? Sure. >> Uh if I have to say my name like a 40 citizen, someone explained to me that we did the original the original ask was for a restoration.
We get a 1999 report that changes the entire game going to a full replacement. Why did we recommend a restoration to start then go back to a report 26 years
ago that change everything we just did? >> Yeah, sure. So, like, wouldn't wouldn't we know like how didn't we know and catch on to some of these things prior to recommending $9 million coming from the town budget and then completely flipping it around to say, "Hey,
actually, we need $600,000 more." Like, I guess that's I don't understand how exactly who went up there, who saw these things, how did this all kind of shake out that we went from one a huge recommendation in a in a you know, uh, restoration to, hey, actually, now we're
going to go back on that, go to a full replacement. >> Yeah. So, I think let me I'll start from the beginning is that um conventionally in the past MSBA has been full replacement. That's what they've kind of done in the past. That's what we always done. Most of the time it's take
everything off, put something new on. This last round they added the restoration piece as a they said they want you to consider restoration as well. Um so, when we got into the design, we assumed full replacement kind of going into this and that's the way we're going. However, when we looked at the roof, we were talking to
manufacturers, we're going through the considering process. We're talking to vendors like Garwin and and and TCO and other ones that do this restoration work. They came out, did their assessment, did their testing, and the membrane was in good enough condition that it was a candidate for restoration.
You know, not every roof that is 20 to 30 years old is a good candidate for restoration because it's too brittle, it can break, and all that stuff. Um, and the other thing is that our scan came back with under 10% insulation. So again, it was all these checking these boxes that okay, restoration actually might make sense, you know, and I think
that like in that bubble, it looked looked fine, not knowing the flashing issues. I guess that so we look I mean we looked at flashings when we were out there, but visually you it look they did some repairs and it looked like the the flashings were generally fine. Um what
happens with the flashings is the stuff that's hidden is what we you can't see with a naked eye. It's behind the brick. it's the through wall flashings, the stuff that's not that's not sealed. And and the other thing is the IR scan didn't pick up a lot of insulation wetness along the flashings. So, there wasn't really anything that would show a
red flag to say, hey, it actually was an issue. Um, and maybe they did correct it back in the day. Um, but looking at that report now, it it's pretty damning in the sense that um a lot of the flashings, they weren't sealed properly. you know, they're supposed to have eight
foot blanks of flashing and and it wasn't soldered together, but that's hidden behind the brick, you know, so you can't really see that with the naked eye in every instance. So, I think that report is what kind of changes it is, saying, well, restoration is not going to fix the flashing issue. Restoration is going to repair your membrane. It's going to make sure you have put a new
20-year warranty on your membrane, going to keep the same insulation there, besides the areas that were changed out, but it's not going to fix your brick issues and all your flashing issues. And now and if you don't do that, you're still going to have the leaking behind a brand new loop section. So it doesn't it doesn't really fix anything.
>> Does anyone know Simpson drug present? >> Yes, they're a very reputable >> and they're still around. >> Yes, they're >> and I think the interesting aspect about that report too is that it wasn't with all of our other documentation on the
middle school group that we had that I know Joe looked at when he was here. We found it actually probably found like six or seven copies of it in the same box that was like in a storage room somewhere. We found something that said middle school roof. We pulled it down
and it wasn't with anything else. So, um it was definitely interesting when you started reading through it. Again, not a construction expert here, but I was like, "Hey guys, I think this >> plus I think the delta between the two
options is $100 million. It's like 10% more, right? 10 12 15%." It wasn't like a double like 10% more full replacement much better. >> Oh, I'm not I'm not going saying this is a bad idea. I'm just I just want to know the information on >> Yeah. that how we almost presented this
out of town. So when they came to us last meeting, we all reviewed it and said it makes much more sense for 10% more and I'm just holding that number out lightly to go a full different >> I don't want problems 20 years from now on. >> No on board with you. >> No, I agree.
They could have presented the wrong recommendation. Didn't you didn't which is Tai which one's the architect? Um, so as the OPM, didn't you guys, and I watched your video for the second time before I came here from your uh, September 24th meeting, didn't you
recommend to the MSBA um, a repair renovation originally? >> The restoration restoration and not the full replacement, correct? >> Yeah. I have you gone back to them and changed the >> No. Yeah, we got an extension. So, we're
got an extension and we're actually representing we're resubmitting to the MSBA on December 17th and uh this we were we were aiming towards that and we found out that this was the earliest this was the latest you guys could meet. So, we made that happen you know with
the estimator. So, >> good deal. >> But we are on track for for we submit it's a two-month we always have a two-month window. So, we submit in December and we get approved or or review approved in February. So, is now a good time to talk about the timeline
and our recommendation and kind of finalize that? Um, whatever the numbers show, they'll probably probably got to shake them out a little bit more, I'm guessing. But, um, is the MSBA okay with the project not starting until the summer of 2027 for they allow us to uh
after. So, yes, we can do it either 26 or 27 for precisely these issues in town. have the finances for following you. Everybody is following you. >> I think I think it's important to stress that the poor repair on the road has to be
done because I remember when they did around me flashing they were cheap on flashing but they were playing games. They were shot and that's why there was so many leaks around that particular area of the building. And I don't
remember how it was supposed to be. time, but I understand the importance of taking it down, doing it back, putting it back together again, and probably not going to do that on the restoration part.
>> Well, I think Yeah, I think it's the contingency. Even though it's the same percentage, there's less risk in a full replacement. >> So, hopefully we won't use nearly as much as we would otherwise. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. We could have went down the replace the repair avenue and it
>> turned into a full replacement anyway. >> Right. >> And the other point I'll add too is with the with the flashings is that >> with restoration you're not required to always do the flashings because you're not changing the insulation height. Now when you go to the full replacement you're now adding vent code minimum 6 in
which is now higher than what's there. So you don't have the separation between your flashing and now your new roof elevation. So that's the really the big reason why we also have to raise all the flashings up at all the masonry and everywhere else. So >> yeah, that was the repair.
>> That was the repair. >> This is one of the >> this basically a brand new single ply >> sandwich. Sound right? And then hopefully if everything's done correctly, what is our timeline in terms of who are the next morals who have to
sit here and go through this? >> 30 years, 40 years, 50 years. >> Yeah. So the so the it's a 30 year. You can get different variations of of membrane warranties. 20, 25, 30. Usually what we spec is a 30 year minimum single
ply meth warranty. Got it. And then for the metal side of it, >> you can get those up to 50. >> Okay. >> I will tell you, I've been around for as long as you >> been for a while. >> These these warranties on these roofs
never seem to work out for us. >> No, never. >> Because company A installed it. >> Then 10 years later, the company B went in and did some minor repairs on company. Whoa, wait a minute. You didn't call me back. It never seems to happen. So, when it comes to warranties and
stuff, I kind of let that that fly because I don't know how we're ever going to >> Well, and I think another key piece of this, especially when we're talking metal asphalt, we're only going to get 30 years out of the rubber. We're kind of saying, "Hey, let's just do the 30 years out of the asphalt. Save us a million dollars basically right off
the bat. >> We're going to have to replace the whole thing at the same time." >> You didn't correct. >> They all have to be done at the same time. >> You're not going to say 20 more years. You guys might still be here to do it, but I will not. >> But usually like what happens
>> I obviously won't regardless it's 30 year or 25 most of the issues are going to present themselves within the first correct 5 10 years get the warranty. That's when you find the time you're going to get the we can't do shingles again. We're going to
have the same issue as the senior side. And I don't when we go forward here as a group to gain the town support, I wouldn't put too much uh time and effort into explaining the history because by the time this is done, it's the school's going to be almost 30 years old anyway,
>> which is I replace my roof after 30 years. And by the way, if less than 10% of my roof was leaking, I would still replace the whole thing, right? >> You get what I'm saying? Okay. >> Um, so, so we don't need to get back into the history. I was on the school
committee between 03 and 09. I remember talking about this. It was 20 years ago, but um, it doesn't really matter. People are not going to um, add any or or take any support away based on what's happened in the past. It's a 30-year roof. Needs to be replaced. If it were no lease along along the way, we'd still
be replacing it. >> And a 55.63% reimbursement rate is a great reimbursement rate. And yes, so for us as a community to not have to pay that 100%. >> We're fortunate. >> 30%.
>> So it starts today. >> What percentage is that? 30%. >> About 30%. >> And as far as the MSP reimbursement, do they still reimburse on the fly ongoing as expenses are incurred? >> Yes. >> Real time. >> Yeah. >> They don't wait until the project's
complete. Do it all. uh the last 5%. That one you see to have to wait a year for that's part of their final close but the 95% up to that. >> So continuously we'll be getting reimbursement later as the money is spent which is great. >> Yeah. It's a quick turnaround rights 3
weeks is what they're promising. >> Nice. >> I believe it's $50,000 increments though. Right. I think you Yeah. So you have to have invoice secured to 50 grand and then invoice that. >> That's another good sign. We're not paying short-term debt. Correct. We're not capital compounding on it at the
end. We finally get reimburse people. >> We're not taking that short-term debt out of our general fund. >> You know, you don't have to worry about that. That money is going to be paid paid for as we go. >> And that's a big deal. >> Well, don't forget this thing's built in
45 days. It's not like a year for a school. Well, there are other that's correct. But with the high school is the same thing. We get the money pretty much immediately. But it's not only the And that was a two-year project, but there are other costs like the design work, right? That's that's
going to happen in a few months. So, you probably have two change. >> You're not going to have time. >> It's really important to us that we do it right. I I don't want to be the person that someone's talking about 25
years down the road about how we screwed it up. >> So like we want to make sure we're doing it right and you know we appreciate the permanent building committee you know meeting with us and and supporting this project. >> Thank you. >> To her point that was one of the things we brought up last meeting to make sure
we have it inspected as we go. I can talk about more of that >> detail who inspects it and I don't mean a manufacturer's rep. I mean a third party registered roof observer is the title profession. I used to do Walmarts, trust me. They
inspected all the roofs. Build like a 250,000 Walmart. It's a big deal. So that it's small money. They come watching started couple more small. >> Um the other part of this is the
repairs. Where are we where have we with the car repairs from the last time you said? >> Yep. So we had somebody out last week. um they were on the roof and they did the patching work that needed to be done um for this winter. Um and I believe
they have to come back out um after the Thanksgiving holiday to finalize just one or two quick things. Um and it ended up Christine probably gave me the number better than I could. >> 8800 8,800 >> not not recording it.
>> We said 50 grand. You guys didn't spend it. You can go spend more if you'd like. >> Well, we wanted to make sure we can get you to next summer. That was the whole point. >> Yeah. So, I mean, they came out and so >> I thought you saying 88,000 for no. Um, so they came out and they did some of
the additional repairs. Unfortunately, Wade is not able to join us here tonight. He fell and purchased. So, um, >> tell the roof. >> The buckets are gone. >> The buckets should be gone. Yes. I'll take a walk over there tomorrow. And
>> I think the point is it's more than Yeah, you needed just to make sure to take care of all of it. I don't know who funded that. Was it the capital improvements? >> No. How did you find that? >> I think we were told to put everything together to do what we needed to do and then go to the finance committee for reimbursement. >> Okay.
>> Through the emergency repair. >> Yes. >> Okay. >> Anybody from the finance committee want to speak to that? Zach or Paul? >> Paul's name there. I I think in my mind the metro project that most exterior work that has been
done because the interior repairs last 30 years on the sophets and >> infiltrated I'm more concerned about what we're going to find inside than I what we're going to find outside. So I I want to make sure we have enough contingency to
to cover that just just in case. >> We don't we don't want to find mold up there and then have to deal with that because I mean the parents here, >> you know, I knock on wood as we have this conversation because we have done the air quality tests and all of those
places where there is any leak any leaks. So, um, we're going to keep our eye on those things and, uh, we do take air quality very, very seriously. If you can do something for a couple hundred and have that peace of mind, it's absolutely worth it.
>> To Bob's point, if there are areas that were saturated, you can they can do penetration tests and and they sniff test since behind the wall. >> Look into it. Maybe it's worth doing a little bit. Just
>> like I said, 45 days to pull this off. It's not a lot of time. >> At least get the roof done. >> Correct me if I'm wrong. It doesn't like we don't have there is some damage. >> No question. But like >> we're not looking at like walls are falling down either. >> Correct. You know, it's more aesthetic. I
>> mean, once we open it, we all know that could, you know, open a can of worms. But >> yeah, cuz the framing could be rusted. >> Correct. Correct. The whole conduit could be rusted. Anything. >> We've got that set of stairs that's around that fall down. somebody told me about I don't I don't think he ran her out who it was.
>> So the question is do we hope that the bid comes in lower enough that we have plenty of excess money in the 9.3 or 9.8 or whatever comes out or do we build in extra money into the amount for interior and exterior repairs and just hope that
we never have to use it. I'd be surely looking a higher correct and And we get nothing contingency and we start finding issues that we have to address. >> One thing about water
starts here and can go anywhere once >> especially on roofs. >> Yeah. You never know where where you think we can go this far. >> So what I'm hearing is yes, we should try to come up with some kind of an amount. >> We do. Yeah. Little little factor.
>> I have no idea what that would be. if you guys can come up with any recommendations. Well, >> half million dollars, who knows? You know, other projects that run into half million. >> Yeah. Yeah. I guess what what I would
suggest is um I mean obviously we have more design to do like for the rest of the stages of this project. Obviously, I guess when we go into the next stages, we could if again if there's inside concerns, we can take a pass to the inside and take a look at that, you know, and and we kind of come up with a list of what we looks
like, water damage, what are issues, and then the tough part is at that point it'd be too late to get that, I guess, into this estimate. But maybe, like you said, hopefully maybe we come up with a list of stuff that we have some items we could address, and if there is bid savings, we could add that, you know, later down the road, I guess. Um that
would that would be one thing is I think you know we could look at it just in the next phase of design and help what we think the fixes are or what the issues are at least >> I think that exclusion is about $10 million first of all we don't want them to know
>> so usually you guys are there first can't give us some but we don't have we don't spend a lot that's what we borrow >> we spend $9.5 million problem even though we have one.
>> Yeah. Yeah. >> So, you're better off that push than the other way around. >> Okay. >> Now, we guys said on general, let's just call a $10 million project. >> Usually, bids are coming in about 7
million. Is that usually kind of the ballpark? >> 70%. >> Yeah. And so like we you know again schematic design level where we're at here we have to kind of shoot a little high right because we haven't designed everything and also like we can't be low bid because then you won't have enough fun right so so we try to shoot on the
little higher side we don't want to be over so yeah I would say 70% is probably relatively accurate >> don't say that too loud the bids don't say too loud the bids will increase their bids >> but that doesn't that doesn't mean that there's a 30% cut that means the trade
costs have been committed 70% of the total box, right? Cuz you still have all the contingencies, bonds, insurance, >> general conditions, your work. >> Isn't that part of the 30%. >> No. >> No. >> Yeah. >> No. I think when we did that math, it
was actually compared. We did it apples to apples. So, we there'll break down on that yellow sheet there is just the construction numbers. And when we went back and looked at the bid numbers, we found that there's about 70%. So it's not 70% of the total project, but I
think >> 80% of the project is the construction. We're on the soft cost is only 20% or whatever that is. So when you get down to the basic sheet right down >> Yeah. to the deck down there's no need to replace them all.
You're only going to replace areas that are damaged. >> Yes. Right. >> None of this is flies up the rip the metal roof off. >> That's right. back on just >> we've had I've had one project where we went, you know, we went down the deck
and there was one section it was just it was just rusted through. Um so we did have to replace the deck there on a massive roof, you know, just one section that was just just just leaked on for years and years and years. So um and so again I go back to this was less than
10%, you know, there may be one section but then again less than 10% of that and so 1% maybe. So there's a chance. But >> no, there's, you know, the whole roof getting metal back >> and all the ceilings have to come down, right? >> Yeah. >> Yeah.
>> Build a new school at that point. >> Exactly. >> And what we would do for the bid for that instance is we we would ask for, you know, again, if it's 100,000 foot roof, we would say 5% of the roof needs decking. So we would include 5,000 ft of metal deck replacement as a unit price
item as part of the bid. So that either we use it or we don't. you know, if you don't use it, get the money back. But if you do, if you do use it, it's built into the contract. >> Yes. So, it's not a it's not a surprise after the fact. >> And we want the number
the total project cost to be higher because that's where you ask the 55% reimbursement. You always want that number to be a little bit bigger. >> And you're only reimbursed on what was spent. >> No, you can't go back. >> That's correct. So, you're only
reimbured on what was spent. They go the reimbursement on Exactly. >> Yeah. And if we build an extra for interior repairs, >> that's all you >> That's all on us. So >> So when we figure that number out, we got to make sure we apply the 55% to eligible reimbursement. >> Yes.
>> Yes. >> Even though it's only us, we're not taking it out of fun. >> Means no reverses. That's right. >> All right. So now that we've beat this roof to death, what's the next step for us?
>> No, I mean we want them to continue on with the full doubt, right? That's what we >> So tell us what you have to do next. You have to get into your design development. >> Next up is submitting this replacement package to the MSBA on December 17th.
They approve us on February, middle of February. Uh he goes forward in designs. Um you town of Norton need to put this on the May um yeah >> as well as probably the April ballot.
>> Thank you. That's what >> Okay. Well done. And so you'll have the numbers that we're submitting to the MSBA on December 17th. You'll get the approval in February so you can settle the town as you know this is an approved MSBA project. This is the you know and all that we've discussed today. This is
the high value, but this is not this is an appropriated number. This is not the final number and we haven't paid it out yet. Um, in my experience, you don't get, you know, so that in my experience, we would love to hit the summer 26, but we can't because January July 1st is
when you can get access to the funding if it's approved until meeting. So, that's only half the summer. That's not going to happen. >> So, that pushes us to the following summer. Um we will then be working we want to get them right when they're you know right when their plates are empty
which is >> October you know this time next year. >> Yep. >> Actually September. >> Yep. >> These visits are disappear one year period where >> we're going out
for the next so this like normally would be in February. We're saying okay you're going to be here >> in July and repair the flu. in our cases when they want to have the money in place available. Why don't they do it till a year?
>> So one thing is unfortunately that he gentleman pointed out there's escalation that we need to include in there. That's the problem. Everything always costs more later. But it is what it is. So now that's the detriment regardless. We push
it out. Now we're going back to um but timing it in September, October, November, that's when you're getting them that's when their plate is empty for the following summer. So you get you typically get the better bids then >> versus February versus March versus May. The plates's already filled and they're
like, I don't really need this, so I'll add it a little bit. >> I would also have concerns about if you're going to get the best contractor >> that too cuz everybody's already full. >> If everybody's already full and had their summer planned out, Do >> you need anything from us a vote from
the town or from the building committee in order to present to the MSBA? >> Uh, no. No. I think um just your support. Well, now gives her the, you know, the the authority to to sign off on the on the submission that we're going to submit on December.
>> So, we should probably have her come back February meeting, give us something. >> Yeah. And what you have to do now is so as you mentioned you can't put it out to bid until after the funding was approved. >> Yeah. >> But you can do your design develop. Can
you do construction documents up front? >> I mean you have you don't have any funding either. You you >> Exactly. So there's there's always a gap in some towns they will keep things moving kind of at risk a little bit like they'll do it on their own. Just say okay well they have other money they'll
fund it just to keep design moving. But if you don't have the money then you kind of have to wait till everything's >> ready. There's no rush. You have plenty of time, right? >> If we're if our end point is bidding in September, October, November of next year, you have plenty of time. >> After May, you'll have months before.
>> That's right. That's right. Yeah, that's plenty of time. You normally need two months, three months. >> Yeah. I mean, this this is the this is a bigger roof and then there is there's there's two submissions. That's 60% you're you have to resubmit back to MSBA and they have a commissioning consultant that review the plan at that point, but
you can keep going, you know. So it yeah I would say for this one 3 to 4 months from probably for DD and CD but that gives us probably again if we can start in mid summer November this time next year we should be fine and >> perhaps while they're busy doing what
they need to do or we're waiting for them to get fully approved in February. Maybe we're having a conversation between the school committee, the permanent building committee, and the other boards to figure out how we want to advocate for this, especially if it's going to be on a ballot in April, which we're going to need to get out to
people. Um, find them where they are and and explain this project to them. >> The sooner the better, because we don't want people to say, where did this come from? >> You know, I think we're better off to start. The smart board has to make sure it's on on the warranty. >> Yep. uh first Tom
the uh the ballot ballot will come first. >> Yep. >> I think Tom is uh second third uh actually the way it's going to fall this year is the ballot the uh ballot is going to be two weeks early. >> Mhm. >> So it's going to be April 11th.
>> April 11th. >> April let me April 11th. And then tell me will be the third Monday. So in May. >> Mhm. So that's going to give us the time to really talk it out. >> So So internally then from a town of
Norton standpoint, >> we we have to vote on this as a school. >> Yeah. To put it on >> to well to get them started. >> Correct. >> Correct. >> We haven't voted on that. >> Um we voted initially when we did the initial submission, but I think we
should update it. So we'll do that >> on the 10th. Correct. >> Yeah. >> So that'll be step one. that will unlock them to go do whatever we need to do at MSBA. And then it's going to be our responsibility between FINCOM, you guys, select board and kind of how do we what's the plan, you know, the plan of
attack and maybe that's a January meeting that we tack on to someone and you know, kind of start there because we don't have to. >> Yeah, absolutely. >> Yeah, we can I can go back and represent to the finance committee board in January. That's what we want to do too with the updated um
>> finan financials and schematics and all those things >> everybody gather. >> Yep. >> Yeah. So there so with all this I'm surprised the MSBA doesn't require some kind of a vote because you guys have been discussing it both ways and we're just making our mind up now. They don't
require a formal load from the town on full roof replacement versus you know a renovation or whatever that >> so you mind >> it goes to >> well interestingly I'm sorry to interrupt
you know I guess it's >> this again this was they never had an option before it was just replacement and so there was there was no option but now they've changed the game this year where solar ready and and restorations And all of the submission documents are
signed by myself um the school committee chair and then the town manager. So um >> for for replacement that's how it is >> for any MSBA project. So when we initially put our hat in the ring to be approved um former town manager signed I
signed I think Nick did you sign or D signed? Well, somebody signed um on our end. So all of those documentation um it goes through that. So, just so we don't have to come back for a silly vote later, u Mr. Chair, I'd like to make um
a motion that the permanent building committee support a full roof replacement for the North Middle School. All >> in favor? >> I I >> Thank you all very much. >> I think Mr. Tom, we should probably have
this near future. And then that way, you know, this kind of came to me before I got really so
my sixth year my sixth year vacation, I kind of lost track of some of the some of the things that were going on. So last I sat here school replacement school replacement where they come from you know so I understand now that we
just need more help from and along along those lines and you guys if you need any anything to do to to this you know the escalation cost for example or any other um fault limits that we may we may have then I would
like to post these on the um building current building and the school committee's website. So people can download them and review them. I'm glad that people is here to to record this as well. So >> you could put the plans too.
>> Yeah. Really? >> Yeah. >> So Mr. So Mr. Ray can bleed all over them. Give us his in. >> All right. Is that it for the for the school? Middle school.
>> Yes. Yes. just just to note what future projects, not for this one, but we should try to >> to have CI projects approved in the fall just so we can meet the >> construction season. >> Well, that's why when we when him and I
first found out about it, that's why we kind of like let's circle the wagons real quick. It's too late by then, >> you know, >> but remember now they they can't do any work until the money is >> until it's funded. So they got 3 months worth of design work to do and construction documents. Even if it was
approved in October, they would it wouldn't be until January, February until you could go up to bid. >> Yep. That's what we Yeah. >> And it would have been fine. But since we have the time, we're going to really maximize opportunities.
>> All right. You can stay if you want. I'm just going to read the email I got from the fire chief. >> Nice to meet you guys. Appreciate it. >> Thank you. his quick update that the they're replacing the roof over at the fire department. If everybody's noticed, those big white boxes up there, that's
insulation. So, he said they're 98% complete. A little bit of extra work that needs to be used, which he's drawing uh which is fixing drains, the stack pipes, all this is still within the money they borrowed. Full completion of the roof should be completed by December 10th.
Construction of the first floor is about 95% complete. Future firm items and same needs to be done. Estimated completion profile. Uh the architectural firm which shares suggestions of alternate fire department locations RFP.
I'm not sure what fire department locations means. Um the main project consists of what we currently have funding. With that we can see whether there's any other funding sources for the spring to support alternate areas. a
meeting with the town manager today. Assuming that's took place, the roof is almost complete. Um, it's going to be about
it's going to be well within the appropriation that was set. So, good. >> Very, very happy with that. >> And then the heating system. I think that was something they were trying to get down to, right? We're going to go to the capital improvements committee.
>> The boilers, >> there were vents that require change order on the roof, but >> no, the boilers. There was we made note last time 100,000 to replace the boilers. >> So that's probably part of the renovation. >> Okay.
>> Which I I spoke with the chief today. They have approximately 800,000 left remaining for the renovation. So, they're planning to bid that out as is >> and then put the rest of it as alternates. >> Yeah. >> And time that right before the
Springtown meeting >> to to see if they can get funding for the alternates or not. >> That's what he said. >> Money is swept over time. that money was allocated before the back of doesn't mean that at this 20,000 50,000
whatever was left over they could go to the next town meeting and say roof might cost 250 instead of three we want to take that 50,000 transfer it to whatever account I think that's another avenue we can use to get some additional funding >> yeah it looks like it's about 25,000
extra >> so it sounds like they're they're going to do everything they possibly can to avoid um doing this in a peace mail over time, multiple phases that's going to cost an extra $2 million or whatever, right?
They're trying to keep it under that 1.4 is if they did it in a compressed manner, >> trying to do it all together. >> Yeah, that's cool. >> Avoid the OPM. >> Yeah, that's good. Good deal. and they've been really diligent in using other people's, you know, the the
sheriff's work off program and getting people in to do what they could. >> Yeah, they mentioned at the last meeting they kind of exhausted all of the the uh the lowhanging fruit when it comes everything else they need professionals to move forward. I like the timing though. I like I like setting up as uh
alter and waiting to see what kind of money they can get approved on meeting. Can we get the sheriff's workers to do the roof? Is that old school? Like shake. Give them a case of beer. See if they'll uh work on the roof. >> Maybe that's what happened the first time. >> Say that. Um. All right. So, when do you
think we need to have a meeting yet? I don't think there's anything rush on these two buildings. There's nothing really to talk about. Should we wait till January? Right. I think once we get a final number on how much these projects all cost, it would be nice to
sit down and find out what the final what >> what's left over >> what's left underneath that that exclusion just so we can maybe determine what we want to do with that. >> Yeah. There's anything either one of these buildings that we had to cut out we want to put back in. So when do you think I was thinking like January 20th
maybe 2 months from now after the holidays >> we can always reschedule. That's right before we need to be doing that. >> Maybe I can be appointed to the committee by >> you know it's funny because I sent an email a couple days ago saying I didn't
realize you got it turned out you didn't have a quorum anyway but I was saying all we need is one more of us in the school committee. We could have done it today. >> Yeah. Seriously. >> We'll uh >> So when's your next meeting? You're thinking of January 10th. >> 20th. >> 20th. So maybe we try to shoot for that date. Well, I'll bring that back to the
school committee. >> Yeah. >> As far as a good time to maybe get everyone together. >> Yeah. >> And if you want, >> if you guys start at six, maybe try to tack that meeting on for like a seven. >> Yeah. >> Which one? The school committee. >> No, no, no. The joint meeting. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> And it can be >> that way. You guys are already here and
then it's just, you know, >> they just want to have one joint meeting and we can just join that one. We don't have to have this meeting if we don't have anything to talk about. >> That's also true. >> Let's just p put a pin in it for now. So, we reserve the time figure it out. You guys, you guys are Thursdays, right?
>> No, yes. >> So, you guys are you guys are generally >> We've been usually Mondays, but we we were different days. >> But the joint meeting only needs have to be the select wood and the school committee. Actually, building doesn't need to be need be part of that uh appointment. >> Exactly. >> Sure.
>> I'd rather go back to Mondays. >> We should also see what? >> So, let's do the 19th. We do that. >> That's Martin Luther King Day. building open. >> How you doing, John? >> I guess we could do this. >> You've been very quiet today. It's like
>> usually have something to say. >> I'm not a roofer. >> That might be the 20th. >> Although, I have an opinion about metal roofs, but I'm not. >> Let's do the 20th then. >> January 20th. >> On the 20th. >> Anybody want to make the motion to
>> I'll make the motion to There you go. Perfect. I'll second. Okay. The journ