##VIDEO ID:GD0wI-qNZPU## welcome everybody to the Norton planning board's meeting of Tuesday December the 3D again members of the public are welcome to participate in person or remotely in person we are at the Norton Town Hall at 72 East Main Street there's also a zoom link available for this meeting agenda or if you like to join directly the meeting ID is 638 9291 060 and after 4 and 1/2 years yes I do have that memorized meeting will also be available on Norton cable access and on the norn media Center's YouTube page following the session for future sessions please feel free to email questions for the board ahead of the meeting to Brian carich Town staff so that they can be read into the record in the event you're not able to attend I did want to note just one item about today's meeting there what we do have a new town clerk and they did post the agenda on the town's calendar page um and they didn't quite carry it through to every single page on the town website that our agenda do normally get posted to but it was hung in the lobby uh Paul did consult with Town Council and they felt that we did need the standard for posting which is why we're proceeding with the meeting tonight otherwise we would have postponed any questions on that point before we dive in here okay well I'm going to skip over planning board business and policies and for the minute here um we did have a number of minutes that we were looking to approve um as we do have some applicants in front of us unless we have any objections I'll take the applicants first and we can handle our our approval of minutes at the conclusion okay uh the first applicant that we look into here is an anr endorsement an-8 for 9 West Main Street uh the applicant is Rebecca carvalo uh the owners are listed as well well um Paul do you know if anybody's here to present from that application or did you want to give us an overview actually rich richio is the engineer is here on the call he's good evening can you can you hear me yes we can thank you okay um I do have the plan I can share on the screen if that's helpful please do you should have the ability to share if you don't there you go all right can everybody see the plan yes all right this is um the the the lot at the corner of uh West Main Street and Mansfield AV um we're actually working with um uh Chris pero the the and the guys that own the the old library and they're um they requested us to to put together a subdivision play to cut out a piece of the lot adjacent to them um that the Miss Morgan and Mr Miller uh own the the lot has sufficient area and Frontage for the the BCC zoning district and um we're submitting this plan for endorsement uh by the planning board this evening thank you and I know that that kind of circular drive has kind of a couple of Spurs that serves two houses right on the uh the neighboring lot yeah it serves the the they have the main house and then there's a there's a secondary structure I believe he has a um an art studio and it's the same owners that you know they they occupy both buildings and there is there going to be what is the plan for a proposed lot one and assuming that there's going to be an easement over the existing driveway um yeah the the the actual the plan for lot one um is to add some uh auxiliary parking uh for the library eventually we'd be coming in for a site plan review with that um I think the intent is actually to close off the driveway on Dem Mansfield have and they would use the the single driveway off of West Main Street okay that makes sense Paul did you have any additional comments from your side on on this no other than U the parking is going to help U with the Oldtown library site that is looking to get a commercial tenant in there that the parking was pretty tight from the site plan approval so this should add this will add uh you know number more parking spaces uh that will help alleviate the parking issue okay any other questions from members of the board about the anr here has the historical commission had any any U notification about this this Falls in their District not on the subdivision but we will be reviewing the parcking lot plan with them as we go through the site plan review process this is just the first step was to create the lot just for clarification purposes when you say going to close the ESS on Mansfield a is that both the original one that's on the library lot now and just make a oh no no this would just be the the the small driveway for the residential use got it okay thank you okay this could just be a fact on is this Weeden know property no this property is all owned by um Matthew Miller and Kathleen Morgan they they this is one big parcel um map 17 watt 2 and then the the old ween library is owned by Library Square LLC um they're they're the the the proponents that are um developing the commercial space within that Library thank you I I stand some happen right and we had a site plan review the old library building two years ago a year ago right yep yeah getting closer to a tenant I don't think anything's been signed yet but they I know they've been working with with a couple different people so hopefully we'll have something there soon what sort of use could we envision for this I was curious for the for the library yeah um it was the one of the it was um the last I had there was potentially an event planner would be using that as their own base I'm not very intense use at this point but it could get it could expand further from that within the building I'm not I don't have much more information other than that as Point like office things mhm any other questions or comments yeah I like again I have a concern that one of our most prominent Corners in town that's been like a historic looking spot nice stone wall beautiful curve driveway is it going to become a parking lot and I'm I'm not sure if that's appropriate I don't know how much I can regulate that but I would like to hear from the historical commission about their thoughts on this they control the Aesthetics the buildings all that yeah it's definitely something that we definitely would want their feedback on with the the site plan um from the anr perspective it's just the lot line so that's where I I always struggle too drawing the line between what action do we take now what action do we take later what is the answer to that did you get one how subjective can I how subjective can I be about this like it it meets criteria both lots are still the size they need to be I think you have to be agnostic with regards to use does this take away from the other lot right is it diminishing which lot the larger lot the the corn it's personal property they can do what they want with it it's under well it's under the historic District's uh historic commission's district so there is actually some rules about what they can do with it I I think they are allowed to sell a piece of it if they so desire you're actually so I I think the questions that Steve want to rest will probably be handled at a a a future meeting cuz commercial parking in VCC requires a special permit so I would expect this would this wouldn't be commercial parking this would be accessory parking to the library it's commercial parking and Village commercial so I'm assuming they're going to do an anr to to combine those two WS and then we're looking at probably a special permit for number of cars and the site plan review I'm assuming a quarter of an acre is going to hold more than 25 parking spaces Paul did you want to give any contacts there so so as we've already been discussing once they start to file for the site plan special permit they will need to go to the historic district commission for their approval um regardless so they should be through the process meeting with the historic commission hisor District commission prior at least concurrent with the submitt of whatever plans we do see but it certainly triggers a site plan the parking spaces would trigger it special permit you're probably right Laura uh we just need to as they provide us a project we'll have to go through that and make sure but that's whatever we need to make sure we go through and they we identify all the needed requirements yeah there's also the potential in Village Center core there's no more than one driveway allowed per lot unless there's a waiver by the planning board so that's a special permit if they int intend to use West Main and the egress that's already on Mansfield a and I can say we've um Building Commissioner nicka Fred and myself have met with the applicant a couple of times they haven't had plans we've just talked over concepts of what they would like to do so once we see something that'll help us determine again all the different perment that they will need any additional questions for the this time the one I had a minute ago you came down that line that actually wasn't kid I was curious how what you came to you just said the you what we can do now and later oh I think in general the position that I've always taken this step in the process is just Drawing the Line what goes on it is what we look at later having the context could help us understand and answer questions and if there's anything that we want to tweak that's easier to tweak now than twe later then we can do that um and there are some things within that once you do it you're kind of putting yourself on a path where you can't go backwards we dealt with that with a couple of some duplexes off of 140 where we approved an anr and that kind of when we approved the anr we essentially signed off on their Frontage even though there was a question for it um nothing like that in this case feels like it's getting into that territory in my head yeah they meet the three standards no thanks that was Clarity see any additional questions or comments on this motion to endorse anr eight seconded and we have a motion from Allan and a second from laa is any further discussion on the motion to endorse okay as everybody is here in person that's attending all in favor please say I all opposed I extensions I okay so that is for in favor one opposed one exstension so that is an endorsement um so we can just sign that I know Paul has the myar sign that at the end of the okay thank you Mr rich thank you all I look forward to coming back in the very near future with the uh the next step on this in this process have a good night everyone thank you okay next item on our agenda is a public hearing for subdivision modification sdm2 uh this is noted noted at zero decal Drive the is Stephanie Maloney the owner is Norton Ram LLC I do see the applicants attorney coming up so I will let them introduce themselves and give an overview here um Paul if you want to just pull up a Paul or Brian if you want just pull up a map so we can see it on the screen while we're uh going through that that would be great uh good evening Mr chairman members of the board my name is Elliot Bray I'm an attorney in North out Massachusetts representing Norton Grahams LLC as you briefly stated this was a subdivision that was approved honor about in 1988 by the Norton planning board uh at that time uh there was contemplated degree a decal drive a short road with CAC 8898 08837 a long long time has passed uh it's never been built uh the client of nor R JC Mr H I believe might be on the line under Ron um has requested he wanted to delete the lines so I've never done it the M law 4181 met with your prior uh planner and then met with Paul who was very very helpful and he modified the website to kind of give us an easy way to get it done and we're asking tonight that the lot lines basically be erased and brought back to one perimeter lot no work has been done on the site for the construction of the decal drag and I did provide EXC me the board with uh a title examination from a land Court examiner who confirmed that no processs have been disrupted conveyed or anything since this started which is AE a requirement so we'd be asking that the appropriate certificate I think it's a certificate e if I'm not mistaken correct yeah um be allowed and that that would resend the plan it would go back to the status of 1988 is one mod okay thank you questions from the board for the up this is right on the border of Norton and adbor correct correct it's right next to the transmission uh building that's in the fun it's behind um lucky ladies yeah yeah Mr BR could you just confirm I believe this to be the case but the um adjoining property owned by reality 394 LLC in which there's businesses that's not included in this correct correct okay and there's no development on the subdivision in question correct thank you uh I got a question about the um the zoning there's a couple ways it's split it's split between commercial and Industrial around the driveway where the two Parcels facing the chart Le Pond are industrial the two Parcels facing the road two or three Parcels are Zone commercial and it splits around the CAC and also that whole district is zoned with the marijuana overlay except for the cesac itself as a public road uh when we remove this how will that change the the underlying Zone the zoning industrial commercial should probably just still follow the lines it is it's an anomaly um but the marijuana District also will have just that Loop in it okay so Paul thank you for pauler Brian somebody's on the spot here um so just to speak to that so the purple is the industrial industrial industrial okay um the pink is Village commercial so that shows the regular commercial oh it is regular yep and then the Divide there the back and the front yeah the hatchmark is the maror overlay which I think Paul could you scroll down just a little bit so we can see the bottom corner I think that one Falls outside it covers all of it but the road oh it does no well I think it would if it weren't a road if it weren't a road so I think it would just but if we remove the road does that change the zoning right now I don't think so so it would remain a blank spot no I think it defaults to the marijuana overlay cuz were it not there it would have been in the overlay clear everything else surrounding it is I think that would need to depend on how we wrote the overlay whether it was it wasn't by par which it means it's very specific then to where it's actually drawn no it wasn't done by parcel right so it follows however exactly the map is regardless of the change whether it's a road or not it can split so that means if we remove the road would it would we have to readjust that or can it exist like that just as it is with a A Blank Spot I think that's a question to Town Council but yeah I was going to look I was trying to F pull up the uh the marijuana overlay were as a map not as by specific Parcels it's not like the uh whatever the Water Resource protection where it's just like a list of lots they would they were entered in as maps with specific districts so this would have been the I I think it was called the 123 quarter District I think there were six districts total I think I think this the question would be we have to go back to how the map was adopted a town meeting if it was adopted in a way that the RO was excluded or would continue to be excluded when the plot lines are changed then there'll be a hole which could be addressed at a future town meeting yeah and we would say we're adjusting the marijuana overlay District because it excluded a street which longer exists end of article uh aside from that being being a a Town Road this would this is the only entrance off of 123 facing chly Pond up all the way up to the corner it's the only road that exists facing south um the state controls those entrances right whether anything's allowed or taken away so you're saying the curb cut would have to stay is that the curb cut has to stay there it's a state issue not ours right wouldn't the state have an easen if that were the case because it's a state road there's no incumbrance in incumbrance to the state I can't speak to what happened in 88 I was finishing law school that that year um and I'm relatively into this situation but this road has never been constructed and I'm going to suggest that there was never a ccot requested because it was never contemplated to be constructed that would be my logical explanation not factual sure but it in theory the roads never been constructed but in use for 40 years now people have been using it for parking next to that business and you can go on Google Earth and go back the whole Road I agree as a driver no question about it um so I just again the regulations on can we remove it like is it a state issue for the curve cut to exist there does do we remove the whole Road does that inance have to say um Paul did you want to speak to just process well again when whenever they come back with whatever plan they give us they would have to inquire with the to see if they actually do have a curve I if you see Brant just put up there there is a way of accessing which that's a driveway uh that would have been decal drive but it's not and but we don't know if that's a legal curb cut they would have to explore that as part of their future resubmittal whether they're doing another subdivision or going through a special permit cuz like to me that doesn't look any different than like Redmill Road or Farm Lane down the road they they dirt roads and they're out roads right but would need to confirm whether or not that's a legal curb cut that do authorizes assuming this is a do maintained at this portion which I believe it is there are portions of 123 we maintained by I that they do probably okay so from your perspective Paul that yes it's a question but the question really becomes when some when the the owner looks to do something with it in the future right now it's just there correct that's a good question but since this is res sending it or shutting it down it's a different issue when they're they're proposing to do something with it question is there a cur is it a curve cut when there's not a curve it looks like there's just like a flat dirt that's why I said is it a legal is it a legal curve cut I I don't no did I who who's using it right now what is stored there um Mr has who was to the right to the transmission that's just an AIS way for him and it looks like there's a van back there and a couple pallets so it's I'm I'm strongly of the opinion that there's never been a curb cut issue yet sure i' I've gotten them with the dot and it's not a two second process no understood um okay so additional questions if those are covered I'm I'm actually cool with it okay any additional questions from the board as this a public hearing I'll ask if there's any members of the public would like to comment as well and if you on on Zoom meeting please use the react function to raise your virtual hand and I will call on you if you'd like other than that I'm just going to ramble for 15 seconds and see if anybody is looking to speak otherwise I'd look for um members to say that they think they're good and we're good to close the public hearing um or if uh there's anything the applicant like to say further no sir you questions answer the whole question I think the as Paul said what is there now is there um when the applicant comes back looking to do anything with this property which I mean hasn't done anything since for 37 years so um they would need to to have a valid curb cut to do anything on the site they need to have that approv by do so that would be step one of whatever phase next is and the and the zoning is a US looking at the the overlay bylaws and how it was worded to see whether what was the street is part of the overlay or not um and whether that makes a material difference in whether we want to do a clean up at a future town meeting motion to close the public hearing second motion a second to close the public hearing Laura and Eric again closing the public hearing means we won't hear any further discussion evidence Etc from members of the public or the applicant any further discussion on that motion okay all in favor of closing the public hearing please respond by saying I I opposed extensions okay public hearing is now Clos any further discussion or actions and Paul I guess from a procedural stand Point you're looking for a motion to approve endorse would be a motion to approve and we will have drafted that um form e but need to work with Elliot then Town Council it's it's a pretty simple but I've never done it I just want to make sure it's done correctly um and then you also had a plan so we would for you had a Precision plan included year yeah the 881w yeah so we would need to get that signed off as well so in this meeting for Action all you're looking for is if the board chooses a motion to approve and then you would button up the for me and everything else with town counsil and everybody else right approve the recision of of the subdivision plan do we also need to vote on the recision of the Covenant is that separate I I would prefer yeah I would prefer that just avoid confusion title wise okay so we have two motions motion to approve subdivision modification to the recision of decal Drive second okay we have a motion from Allan and a second from Steve is any further discussion on the motion to approve modification okay all in favor please say I all opposed sorry V against opposed okay extensions okay so that was 5 to one in favor and the second motion was in was in terms of the Covenant motion La did you have specific go forward sorry I cut you off that's okay uh motion to resend the Covenant associated with uh we didn't have an original special permit number uh associated with the recision of decal Drive Pilgrim Park Subdivision I have the book and page if you want book 3772 page 122 okay so we have a motion we have a second second I think that was error by a hair a motion in a second is there a further discussion okay all in favor please say I I I all opposed all opposed one opposed and exensions okay so consider your recis recision recision approved thank you very much have a good evening and obviously he work with Paul and all the fine tuning of the for me and everything else so thank you thank you have a good evening thank okay so with those out of the way we'll dive back into plan board business and policies and approval of minutes um Rob did you want to I know you had mentioned one thing that you wanted to potentially discuss you want do that now or did you want to wait or I can do it now I was going to let you pick the time okay um guys I feel like I made a mistake in the last meeting and um voted um down the Vents Company um I'd like to make a motion that we reconsider okay and the mistake I made was I cared a lot about the people that were before me and giving me things but I was listening to a small part of the town and if I weigh that against the good of the rest of the town I just don't think I made the right call that night okay so we have a motion to reconsider our special permanent decision from last meeting for zero Hill Street um the first question is do we have a second on that second we have a second okay so um again I would have to Paul we closed the public hearing at our last session for special remind me for special permits I know there is a timeline from when we close the public hearing to when we have to issue a decision correct correct what is that timeline do you I think we have 45 days so you're within your time frame of of issuing it okay and we issued that on the 19th if I'm not mistaken uh let me go November 19th okay so we're 14 days in so we do still have some time if we wanted to reconsider um I think from a procedural standpoint this wasn't part of our notice for our agenda tonight um so if the motion to reconsider passes um I think I would look to hold discussion and we would put it on next agenda if that makes sense okay um so we have a motion in a second um further discussion I know you kind of gave an introduction Rob about what you were thinking yeah um and that actually is in a nutshot got focused on a small group of people and didn't really weigh the larger part okay any other discussion on the motion for reconsideration okay there's no other discussion I would move forward with a vote for reconsideration here um I think it may be simpler if I do this one in a roll call if you don't mind Rob no do it how you want okay so on the motion to reconsider Eric I'll start with with you no R yes Steve yes Laura no Alan no and I think I will vote no as well thank you rob for for bringing it up I appreciate your your thoughts and your discussion thank you for bringing up that if you think you made a mistake that's honorable oh I did so that's that's cool thank but the decision is rendered I'm not going to be Bush here um with the rest of our agenda this evening um we don't have any bills and warrants to approve um terms of planning board business I do want to make sure that I think we've probably seen Paul's emails again tomorrow is the uh public event related to the communities bylaw which will be here again all correct in this room okay so if you if you haven't seen enough of me yet you will soon okay and the last item here is approval of minutes um prior to our last session we had a number of minutes that we were looking to kind of work through here and I had said that we should try to take a look at those over our break um before we go into motions on specific minutes I'll ask again people feel like they're prepared to vote on the minutes this evening or would we like some additional time I'd like to just point one thing out because I got caught by it those minutes I guess from a year ago because I really started reviewing them thinking they were for our last meeting just point that out to everyone and I'll for some Stak so and they are they are going back a little ways there was a backlog from when uh Paul wasn't with us and Brian was doing two potentially three jobs at once um and something had to give and I think that was the thing tot cool it's been sure people knew what they were looking for okay so do people feel like again that we feel like we are prepared to vote on the minutes this evening do we feel like we're not and we would like to push it off one more time I'm I'm good I give Brian my comments I Rie them I'm going stay but okay do you want them one at a time or I would do them one at a time yes motion to approve the meeting minutes of in order July 11th 2023 second okay we have a motion and a second Is there further discussion okay all in favor please say I I I opposed extensions one exstension thank you motion to approve the meeting minutes of July 25th 2023 second thank you Laura and Allan further discussion on the 25th okay all in favor please say I I I'll oppos extensions one exstension motion to approve the meeting minutes of August 1st 20123 second okay we have a motion and a second any further discussion on this one okay all in favor approving this is August the 1st correct yes please say I I I all opposed extensions exension motion to approve the meeting minutes of August 22nd 2023 second we have a motion and a second further discussion hearing none all in favor of approving the minutes of August the 22nd 2023 please vote say I I I opposed exensions one exstension motion to approve the meeting minutes of September 12th 2023 second may we have a motion in a second any further discussion hearing none all in favor of approving the many minutes of September 12th we please vote by saying I I opposed exensions one exension justs you can if you choose but I would prefer you didn't motion to approve the meeting minutes of September 26th 2023 second okay we have a motion and a second forther discussion ging none all in favor of approving the minutes of September the 26th please vote by saying I I opposed exstension one exstension and last but not least motion to approve the meeting minutes of October 10th 2023 second thank you we have a motion and a second any further discussion hearing none all in favor please say I I I opposed extensions one exension okay thank you very much Laura and I appreciate all the comments that you submitted as well okay motion to adjourn we have a motion we have a second second we we have a second I have a second um I don't believe we have anything else to address this evening other than to make sure that before we leave we sign the my for the an anr so with the in second to adjourn all in favor please say I I opposed extensions thank you very much everybody we are adjourned