all righty it's 6:00 so we are going to call the north school committee meeting on Wednesday March 12th 2025 to order um first up is plge allegiance to the flag of the United
States of America and to the for it stands one nation under God indivisible with liy and justice for all um the meeting is being recorded by n media so if anyone else is recording
please let us know um first up on the agenda is public hearing and vote on the FY 26 budget Dr o' okay so what I need you to do for me Mr Spiker is actually open the public hearing on the f26 budget um and that's
more of just a housekeeping item and then we'll launch right in I can do that um um in accordance with Mass General law 7138 n the notice of the public hearing has been published in the Sun Chronicle Dr O'Neal will review the for the audience the superintendent's
recommended FY 2026 school budget a question and answer session to follow for the public please see the and close presentation uh sorry and a motion to open the public hearing for FY 26 school
budget so second all those in favor I I all right thank you very much um I have here tonight as well um our high school principal Dr Ethan Dalman and LG Norris principal Mr Tom Higgins um who are here
Unfortunately they weren't able to join us over the weekend so I thought I would stop start with um Ethan and Tom just to give you guys a quick overview of their budget and then I will launch into uh the formal presentation for the audience so you guys can decide who wants to go
first we go up you can I say yes only because of the microphone please thank you I appreciate you uh allowing us to present tonight rather than Saturday sorry we did lose our playoff game to
Millis um what were you coaching basketball third graders 20 to9 after 24 minutes yeah defensive struggle um uh really I just want to talk a little bit about the process that we do with the high school um there's kind of two processes with
budget uh that we do one that happens in sort of December and then again sort of looking at more resource allocation that happens in the spring um so really uh the budget items you see there for our contractor services and also our instructional Supply really has to do
with the needs of teachers um and basically what we do with the help of the AC's initially this year really just with departments um is asking them to create a list of what their essential supplies are the things absolutely necessary for them to continue instruction in the classroom um then I
give them uh the option to also note things that would be important and with that I ask them to kind of look at a kind of grid of of high impact or Impact versus cost so things that are lower cost and higher impact of important instructional items they might want to include um and then also some would be nice items so things that might be
really good for extending their instruction um you know particular units of of study those types of things and to find what those actually cost um we kind of compile a spreadsheet per Department um with AC's I would meet with those AC's to kind of review those and and kind of take a look at what those
supplies were um and this year I did it uh by meeting with all the Departments during our common planning time just reviewing what their um needs were um some kind of examples of that definitely like there are some departments that have more consumables like art supplies the business department to a sawmill um
you know for wood for the wood shop that type of thing um so those asks are quite some quite large or typical um this year they're very much in line with what we need in the past that are critical for instructional um Supply um and then some other things like uh you know new AP
booklets because the test has changed so we need some new um materials within the classroom those types of things and really that's what's presented um in those instructional Supply and uh principal contractor services in the budget there um the other thing that we do for a budget process really is taking
a look at allocating where our staff are and that takes place more in the spring right now we're doing our course selection um we take a look at where um sort of students want to be as far as electives um we take a look at the course numbers for you know Honors College Prep sections of core classes
and we determine how many sections of each we're going to be um and that's done really taking a look at those numbers working with academic coordinators um really allocating resources based on uh you know how many honors sections um College Prep we generally try to keep a little bit smaller uh generally so that they can have more uh small group and individual
instruction um we also take a look at ways that we can support instruction in certain departments for instance in math we have math strategies blocks that are intervention blocks that we also allocate um FD to so it's that discussion of trying to meet all student needs and weighing class size versus
student support and also um Sometimes some initiatives that we're trying to roll out um as far as elective courses and things like that um our primary goal is really to have all of our programs um and if we have to have hard larger class sizes because we're supporting all of these different learning opportunities
for students that's generally where we try to allocate our resources that's pretty much it any questions for Dr nman just one quick one um obviously the nurse salary almost kind of doubles on
us can you just explain kind of where that came from and why I have a guess but I don't Christine that's better um that was the nurse that coordinator that we brought back perfect so it just wasn't in original perfect um and
then the I'm assuming it's an athletic trainer since it's under athletic director uh the trainer salary is increasing by 51% any insight there um that also part of her salary
was in the athletic revolving so we just it wasn't an increase from year to year we just put more last year Vol took less out thank you any other
questions thank you Ethan very much appreciate [Applause] it microphone probably not uh thank you as well for uh allowing me to present tonight as opposed to Saturday I good news my daughter K's volleball team to
the third tournament so sorry to this basketball rocket with volleyball Hi family um yeah uh my process very similar at lgn to what Mr Barrett and Mr gagan and Mr Hayward presented on Saturday um in the
past I this my third year here so my third time going through this um you know asking the teachers for their input starting with staff meetings in December um in the past using my curriculum leaders input at the grade level uh as grade level leaders what they feel is
necessary for their uh for their team unfortunately this year at the start of this year those were unfunded positions but in January I had a chance to discuss with them what they felt um might be needed um obviously you're going from the largest budget in the district to the smallest budget in the district the
vast majority of our budget is tied to salaries for faculty and staff um I know looking at you I had a chance to watch the presentation e e e and then one of the other biggest things
is that we we believe that students belong in learning environments where they can get differentiated just to time interventions so a lot of the work and a lot of priorities that we have as a school Community look at these three core areas and see how we can improve
upon what is already happening in our classrooms uh some information for you all on our current enrollment um these are October 1st numbers so they're not exactly what we have in our classrooms today because there is fluctuation from month over month but I'm sharing the
October 1st numbers with you because that is what the Department of Education uh at the state level uses for for our um finances and that's how they get that per pupil expenditure and that is the number that they base our local Aid on that
2424 students of those students 2,118 are Norton students that are enrolled here in our schools we have 233 school choice students those are students that live in other communities but choose to attend school here with us
we have 44 students that are part of our reads d uh de and heart of hearing program and then we have 29 of our own Norton students that their educational needs are being met in an out of District placement I'm going to share a little
bit of how our budgeting process works uh you all just heard from uh Ethan and Tom how it looks at the building level this is more about our district approach uh Christine and I begin talking about the budget for the upcoming school year typically in October which see seems a
little bit crazy because the year really just began and we're already thinking about next year um but this is for us to you know really take a look at what our contractual obligations are going to be for the year ahead um when we take a look at um our our collective bargaining
groups um our independent contracts that we have things like Transportation Etc um we start with all of that um and so we have a decent idea of what that number looks like before we kind of even get get into the details um with any of
our departments uh then we bring in our um administrative team our building principles our department heads such as our director of Technology director of people Personnel Etc um we look at class and size data we look at enrollment
efficiencies are there places where we're going to be able or need to move staff around for the upcoming school year um one of a good example of this is our current kindergarten class is fairly small and we used one of those positions
last year to take care of a bubble at lgn and in third grade where we have had big class size so we we take a look at that and we always go back to those core tenants of what we want our students to be able to experience um it's a true balance
between what our mandated costs are for educating our students and then what we can do to enhance programming we always want to be able to build on what we already have we never like to go backwards um and unfortunately last year
we went backwards in terms of the programs and and offerings that we were able to to do for our students um and then we also look at our strategic plan goals as I think the majority of this room knows we are in the process of developing a new strategic plan as a
school community so we're a little bit in flux in that area but we know what our priorities are as as a district and then we always try to engage parents and teachers in the community in kind of prioritizing our needs we are presenting to the school
committee a level service budget a level service budget means that we would retain All Staffing and programs that are currently in place during this school year a level service budget is a financial increase from one year to the
next however it doesn't really add any programs or positions with the Deep cuts that we made in our programs last year we simply want to keep what we have right now um it is important for the
audience um to know that this level service budget does include prog um some staffing positions that were uh brought back after fall town meeting so for example um Middle School art um it's a
slanted chair Zach yes middle school art and music as well as our reading and math intervention and at the lower elementary level those positions are included in this budget for the upcoming school year so our final FY 25 budget when all
was said and done was 35,5 35,6 And1 what we are asking for is a 4 .96 increase for the next school year which is
1,762 630 for a total of $ 37,2 198,199 between our mandated educational requirements and what general education and operations looks like um mandated
education I really want to make sure that we're not just talking about special education and special education programs there are other things that fall under this umbrella um our obligations to our students that are English language Learners our homeless students making sure that they are able
to get to school get to and from school safely even though they may not have um a permanent home um we are responsible to make sure that there is no interruption in their education all of those things fall under the mandated
education line um as you can see this is a 4.24% increase on that particular cost center which means that it's a 1.74 increase on the general budget
overall um that would bring us to a total of1 15,183 1868 for mandated Educational Services for the FY 26 year general education and
operations includes everything else this is all of our general education classroom teachers our athletic programs the yellow buses to and from school um it also includes keeping our buildings open day-to-day util costs heat and
electricity um making sure that we are you know have the appropriate cleaning materials our custodians all of those other things fall under general education and operations that is a 5.46% increase on the cost center or an
overall budget increase of 3.22 and that's where you get the 4.96 if you add the 1.74 and 3.22 um making the toal total recommended budget for next year of 22,43 63 one of the really important things
for everyone to understand is that um there are a lot of projections that have gone into this budget so far we are still actively in negotiations with our teachers and power professionals and we just began negotiations with our Administrative Assistant bargaining
group as well so we are making these projections and these recommendations with our our best projections that we possibly can at this time um one of the things I like to share is how we get from the 35 million
to the 37 million and how we do that actual math over time um so the first is the increase in salaries due to contractual obligations this is all district salaries so whether our teachers are our par professionals our
custodians our administrators all of that is included in that um in that increase and as you can see that is the large majority of our increase for this upcoming fiscal year we are actually going to have a net savings on out of
District placements um which is as of today in this hour in this minute it is a changing Target and we never know um when it might change again but as of today we have a $24,000 savings um we
also because of that have an outof District a savings when it comes to out of District uh transportation for some of our special education students uh this may mean that a student is either aging out of a program or that they are returning to the district um and will be
attending a program that is closer to home and we no longer have to transport them we do have a few increases here to special education programming that is within the district whether that is materials um needed for a program or
perhaps um needing to add a different classroom and buy purchase materials for that because um of student needs all of that is included there we have a contractual increase in our yellow bus just in District transportation of
49,000 and then we also have a savings when it comes a small savings but we will take it of about 7 ,000 when it comes to uh testing supplies and materials um and then a decrease in operations ADV management cost which
gets us to the 37,2 198,199 um what that really looks like um as a district we have IND District costs so things that are happening within our school buildings on a day-to-day basement basement basis um those are in
You Know Places placements in our placements in our inclusion classrooms our specialized programs that we host here in District we have some incredible specialized programs um for students that have a a language-based learning disability we have program for students
that are on the autism spectrum um we have an incredible program um for for students that um are in the step program that may be just not at that same level as their as their peers and then we have um a grit classroom for students with
social emotional and behavioral disabilities um all of these programs are absolutely incredible they are staffed by extremely talented and dedicated teachers and power professionals um and for every student that we are able to offer a program
placement to in town we are actually keeping them in their home school with their peers and not needing to spend the money sending them out of District so we try to create those programs and to ramp them up whenever we can we also provide
specialized services such as speech and language therapy occupational therapy Physical Therapy Counseling Services all of these fall under that umbrella of special education um as I mentioned there are just times
where we cannot meet the needs of a particular student whether we don't have the program that exists here in town um they may be more medically fragile or it's just not a fit for them then we need to find an alternative placement for them in a whether it's a
collaborative Pro program um through one of this you know the state coll special education collaboratives or a pragnant placement we we are also responsible for transportation costs and then there are extreme cases where we have students
that do not come and go from school on a day-to-day basis but instead have such significant needs that they are in more of a residential placement and all of that is the obligation of Norton public schools to pay for as you can see the annual cost for fy4 for these out of
District placements was about $4.5 million it's extremely expensive um and one of the question questions I answered um on Saturday as part of our Workshop was about the costs for this um so Norton is obligated for the first
$50,000 of any out of District placement um and then after that we get a percentage reimbursement from the state um that reimbursement fluctuates from year to year there's really um until the summer we really don't know what that reimbursement is going to look
like however it is mandated that it' be fun did every year at at least 75% it does not always happen that way um my organization the mass Association of school superintendence and I know the mass Association of school committees are both advocating right now with the
legislators that it' be up to at least 85% every year and those are things that I think are really really important for um you as community members to understand um that there are things that the state isn't necess necessarily
following through with their end of the bargain when it comes to these mandates that we are responsible for if you take a look at the trends in special education funding this is um from nezda so uh they do this report for us on an
annual basis and you can see about 10 years ago we were spending about $7.8 million as a district and then this current year um and you can see there's like a little e next to the 25 that is the best estimate based on where we are
at this point in the year we're at about 14.5 million so that number has doubled in the last 10 years for a lot of different reasons this is not just special to noron this is a trend that all schools
and um communities are seeing across the board um we have an incredible medical community around us um which is really really wonderful and we see the children that are pries and that were very medically compromised that may not have
been as fortunate 10 years ago in our schools and in our classrooms on a daily basis and we also have students that are being identified and their needs are being identified where they may be perhaps they were not being identified um 10 years ago I also didn't share this
last year but I think this is important for us to see 10 years ago special education um costs were about 32% of our our District budget and now you can see that this year it's about 41% that's a huge huge shift when we think about um
the cost that we have as a school community and I think the biggest challenge for us is that there are times where we are not able to find everything that we need because of some of these
mandated costs that we have um I also want wanted to share what these out of District costs look like um so as you can see um our current school year 2425 we have 34 students out of District
it's about $3.8 million um and then next year we are projecting about $3.9 million an increase of 120,000 overall it's important for you to know that I did show a savings on that other sheet where
we show how we get from point A to point B that's because we will be expecting more circuit breaker reimbursement funds from the state this year so that levels out that expenditure
um often times when we have these meetings people ask about grants and that is something that um we do a lot of work when it comes to Grants there are certain entitlement grants that come from the federal department of Ed education that um we are expected to
receive every single year and I'm showing you some of these here so um we get about $750,000 from the federal sped ement Grant um it's over a million dollars when all said is said and done um the federal sped entitlement Grant currently
pays for 19 and a half par professionals that is a huge amount of our staff and if we were to lose that money that would be a big problem for us Title One is what we use for our um reading interventionists it pays for
about 2 and a half people there um and then the other titles that you see those are all around professional development or um student support and then we also have other supplemental um funding so for example
school school choice we're projecting to use about 26 million I'm sorry geez 20 uh $2 million next year um and obviously 4.3 people does not cost us $2 million but what the other things that
we pay for as part of school choice is all of our supplies all of our curriculum materials the art teacher needs construction paper the large majority of all of our day-to-day instructional and school materials are all paid for through
school choice also technology um software programs all of those are paid for out of out of Technology um sorry school school choice I'm okay everybody don't
worry um we circuit breaker is the special education reimbursement that I talked about that goes directly to defer the cost of tuitions for students that are at out of District placements we have facilities revolving which offsets the cost of some of our
custodians preschool revolving which offsets the cost of our little Lancers preschool program um parents pay transportation we collect about $130,000 of Transportation Fe fees every year um the actual contract is over a million dollar so
it's a very small percentage of fees that we collect that actually pay for the contract um and then a tuition revolving and Athletics these are just offsets there is no revolving line that totally
pays for the area in which it comes from and then the other thing we always talk about school choice so I wanted to share this with you as well so this is the last few years last six years what we've received and what we have expended
so as you can see those first couple years you know we received more than what we spent um we are getting to that point where we are using up the leftover um during this current year we
are projected to spend about $1 1.5 million and then actually Mr Higgins mentioned these unfunded requests when he was up here talking to you um just because something is not in the budget it doesn't mean that it's not an actual need or request um and there are things
that were cut from our budget last year that are are not even up here for the upcoming school year um so these are some requests that have come from the principles and from the Department um directors uh that they have said you
know we would really love to have these kindergarten assistants in each of our classrooms or um we really need that eighth fifth grade teacher because our class sizes next year are just going to be too big um so I feel it's really important that I share those with you as well
and um if there's any questions we can go from [Applause] there I guess we'll go any questions with the school committee no I I I made a statement on Saturday and I I kind of want to just revisit it so and Mrs Cohen has been
here just about as long as I have uh when we started this respectively 9 and 10 years ago the library media specialist at the middle school has been on this sheet for 10 plus years um I actually I I jokingly said to Mrs Wier she she answered with a
figure when I said how long it's been on there so um so it it's and we we go through the same thing when we look at our Capital Improvements like for years the gym floors were on there and things like that so you know
these these requests um are are getting more into the necessity at some point like a library media specialist it's not just somebody to check out books for kids it's help with computers help with research papers
help with you know technology so you know it's when we look at these things year over year it's it's kind of a shock that this particular one position has been here for 10 years and we haven't found the money and 10 years ago it was probably a $50,000 position and now it's
up over 70 so um it's it's challenging to balance this budget every year uh and I hate to see these things that keep recurring something like this so um it's it's just like I said it's it's a shame that we look back 10 years and
still see some of the same things here I guess the uh any questions from the audience oh go ahead sorry I did not see a question can you just come up to the microphone just state name and uh address please uh Lisa Newman 837 BT Street in
tunon um and Mr shidi I've been in Norton public schools for 17 years and we've been asking for a library media specialist that entire time um the mandated Ed slide that you had up there does any of the are there any General Ed
mandates that fall into that c no okay thank you a great question Lisa however though I would I would this is Mr scher's favorite topic we get asked to do a lot of things by
the state they don't call it mandated but they also don't fund them so it's a slippery slope to say it's mandated general education but it's like hey you should do this but we're not going to give you any money to do it so those it's we kind of go through this every year as
we don't like to separate the kiddos General versus special education because it's all one Community but you know the needs have to be met for everybody and unfortunately there's more mandates for those special ed kiddos that have you know those contracts are binding so
every year we get this you know question about mandates Reg general and you can make the argument everything is mandated in general as well because we have requirements by the state that we have to teach X Y and Z to every every student so yes there is but there's no
money for it and it's not held separately and that's why I always try to make sure that I am clear when I say this is not about just special education it's about our you know providing elll Services um mckenny vento homeless
transportation is under there we try to make sure that we're including all of those things that are regulated by law under that category um because we don't want to group one set of students against another we have more flexibility
when it comes to certain things that we do have others as well someone else have a question PA hi Paula Daniels 54 power Street Norton um I may have missed it so I apologize um what's going on with the
art program for the middle school so I know um it was sort of brought back in January my daughter's in e8th grade um so it was offered as part of an ice period which is basically like a study hall which my daughter needs that for to study and everything so she wasn't able
to take part in the art class is it going to come back as a special like the other ones or um yes there will be other change there's going to be a lot of other changes that are happening so um right now we are looking carefully at um
we have some retirements that are built in we have some resignations that are built in um some people that you know might be changing roles so all of those things are a little bit of a moving Target um but the plan is to move art back into the specials rotation for next
year wonderful I have one more question is that okay um could you speak a little bit to so last year last spring when we all met um joint meeting you guys were proposing a 12% increase in budget this year it's a 5% can you speak a little
bit about the difference there like um things that may have been cut that aren't being brought back and you just kind of go over that a little bit that's a big difference in the request so ultimately at the end of the day we're down 22 staff members versus where we
were this time last year um the original cut was 29 I was able to bring back three positions over the summer due to retirements or resignations just through staff attrition um you know somebody retiring at 80,000
and being able to hire someone at 50 so we were able to bring back three positions that way and then we brought back four positions After Fall town meeting so 26 - 422 I think I have that right um so there are a lot of positions
that are not included we did not put any of those back in the budget for this upcoming year um we've also been extremely creative and and taking a look at um we have these res resignations in these retirements what are the things that we have to fill and what are the
things that we can afford to kind of absorb and what might that look like or are there ways you know we've done this and this way for a really long time and now this person is going to leave us instead of back
filling that could we perhaps do this in a different way and so we're trying to be really creative because ultimately at the end of the day I don't want to have to let staff go again like I see Heather triani sitting right in front of me who's you know been a middle school
World Language teacher forever and ever and is now teaching at the high school like I want to be able to bring those things back over time so if that means we're looking at things and saying all right just because we've always done it this way it doesn't mean
that it needs to continue and and be as creative as we possibly can when those opportunities come up to give ourselves a little bit of wiggle room hopefully down the road but you're not so a World Language coming back to the middle school is not included not included 26
budget okay unfortunately no thank you very much Jen I just want to say too Paula to your um question and I I mentioned it Saturday I think when you go through this budget and you look line by line You'll see more decreases this year than we've ever seen before so we
give credit to our our you know staff up here our admin that have worked tirelessly to really kind of look at everything every possible way to keep what we have um after what happened last year so I just I just want to make that
known that when you go through this line by line you can see and and you guys being on fincom you'll you'll see it you know a lot of work went into that to make this budget like is neat and clean and and keeping what we do currently have someone else have a question
come on up um and I just want to mention that um we will put the full budget book on the website tomorrow um and that all of the materials from Saturday are currently there as
well hi uh Laura Gus N Allen Drive um so mine is kind of a multi-art question it all relates um school choice so a couple of things one um if you don't mind just taking a moment just again to
explain what school choice is how that is a um revolving fund for the school also if you could just speak upon how we um the school committee elected to reduce school choice enrollment last
year right so we have smaller numbers coming in um so if you can speak upon how financially seeing as we seem to be significantly reliant on on using now almost all of those school choice funding where in the past we were using less than what we were getting now we're
using almost all what we're getting um what is going to be the potential ramifications or effects that we now we're having a smaller enrollment but yet we're really relying on the full funding but also how just how that works so where where is that what does that
mean I'll start the conversation um so school choice is an opportunity for um students that do not reside in Norton to 10 school here within our schools um I Heard a great analogy um I'll credit uh
dretta when we first were rolling this out he said you know you're on a Jet Blue flight down to Florida and there's six seats left on the plane and Jeet you paid 150 for your seat but now Jeet blue is selling those last six seats for 50
bucks because they're going regardless so it's a good way to kind of look at if we have availability if we have space um allowing a child from outside of the community to come in and fill that seat so to speak um we have a large number of
our noren staff that choose to bring their children with them to work um a number of families that may not live in the community but work in the community and want their children to have the educational experience here um we also
have um families that may live in a more urban community and want that small town School experience for their children um so we've done a number of different things over the years in terms of the numbers itself when we first started out
and I can't even remember how long ago 8 years ago 9 years ago uh eight years um we were the school committee was and I don't want to say we because I was in a different role at that time the school committee was in was would vote on
numbers we're going to do five kids here five kids here and and then we had you know a little bit more space and our community enrollment is was declining so we opened things up a little bit last
year with the cuts that we made I did not feel comfortable recommending open school choice um just because of the fact that we were able to preserve class size at the elementary level we did not cut any
Elementary classroom teachers um it's the only thing we didn't cut last year um but we were really careful not to add to that class size um we in grades K to
six um we I think we did five per grade level and 7 through 10 and that was it um so we did see a small reduction in number one the number of students that we had I think last year we were at 251 um and we did see a small reduction
in what we're projected to get for school choice um the formula for school choice sounds simple from the outset but it gets extremely complicated when you get into the nitty-gritty um the state sends us $5,000 per student however if a
student receives any specialized Services if they're on an i or they get um speech and Link language therapy or a counseling session we get reimbursed for that not at 100% because
we nothing's 100% right um but we do so that formula fluctuates year to year it's not like you can say okay we've got 200 kids 200 time 5,000 and that's your number it's always higher than that because of the the things that students
receive when it comes to you know we haven't discussed school choice this upcoming year and we will soon cuz it's coming right down the road I think we have to do it at the next meeting um we I will have a similar recommendation for the committee about looking at these
numbers and in careful about what we are bye guys don't um you know being careful about what we're adding to each grade level so we'll be really prescriptive about that um the one thing that that the school
committee agreed on last year is number one we don't like to separate families so if a family is already attending in school choice and they have like a a a kindergartener then that child is obviously allowed to come and then we
also um allow our our staff to Choice their children in and um there's not a ton of perks for being a teacher so we like to keep like at least a couple um so that is one of the the small perks that we try to keep when it comes to school
choice the concern about R being overly reliant on um school choice is very real um it's something that Christine and I talk about a lot um and so we'll often make projections on what we think we're going to use um but as savings come up
during the year we also try to move things into the general budget and out of school choice so we're not continuously doing that um we as a school committee and a SCH administrative team are going to have to be really careful about what that balance looks like when it comes to the
finances um over the last however many years eight we think um we've been doing school choice um school choice funds have bought every single Chromebook that Norton students use We Are One toone
District every student has a Chromebook School choices pay for all of that our pre one has um IP PS school choice paid for that we have um a new reading program and a new math program at the
elementary level a new English program and a new math program at the middle school school choice has paid for those things um so it's it's very important that we make sure that we're keeping that in mind um
as we look at the future um I think I'm a little bit more fiscally conservative and I think Christina is too than maybe people that have come before us and we get a little nervous
um when we see the way that money can be played around with and and we want to make sure that we feel comfortable and confident um because I don't ever want to come before a town meeting and say we've
overspent that's the kiss of death for a superintendent so I unless Mrs Cohen wants to take it um a little history on school choice so we we for the first say five or five years or
so the majority of our school choice was spent on what we would consider somewhat like a one-time expense like the Chromebooks you know the leasing of the Chromebooks and things like that up until probably last two cycles we've
tried to not tie it to the budget um there was a previous member who sternly every year rejected that premise um because of the simple fact it can dry up um it can very well dry up but the the
somewhat myth around school choice is similar to Jen's analogy we have to keep the classroom open anyway and if our class sizes are are low and we have the space and someone wants a potentially quality higher quality educ a than what
they might receive or they are a staff member um then you know the class is going to be open anyway in in no circumstance in any of these school choice members where we could take all the school choice kids from that grade
and you know loss you lose a teaching position because they're spread out over you know just about every grade um typically the kiddos will come in and they usually say and and not that long ago I believe our valedictorian was a
school choice student that came here from from a different District as a high school student so it's not um you know there's a lot of myths around it it's not like they're you know a kid that you know couldn't get into their other district and came here as like a second
chance it's not anything like that it's it's just they're looking for a higher quality education that they believe they we can provide um so we were always hesitant to tie it for you know budget expenses and unfortunately the reality
is we keep having to exhaust it year over year and those onetime costs that we usually reserved it for are now parts of our budget that we just have to you know as they say we have to find money to put towards a budget and we exhaust every Avenue that we
can and I think with school choice $5,000 has been like that since 1990 I believe so it has never gone up um it's in the in the state's uh history of starting to buding school choice um representative how last year filed a bill to increase that number to 7500 and
it was crushed at the state level so um that is again with education everything keeps going up and caed yet school choice keep staying where it is you know our our per pupil cost is almost at 20 $20,000 you know per pupil here in Norton that when you're getting five you
know that is that is some of the concerns that you know I have and I'm sure other people the committee have as well as in town um I also want to mention um and thanks to Christine for kind of reminding me of this um we every year attempt to take like I think you guys
saw four and a half Staffing positions as part of that school choice we attempt to move those things out and so that way we're not relying on it year over year over here we also um there was one time where all of our substitutes like School
substitutes came from um school choice like we're clearly going to need subs like so we so those are some of the things that that we do every year to make us less reliant on school choice but it's definitely a balance and I think also going back to
having a little bit more of a fiscally conservative admin 246 students are school choice every average District around this area is 24 to 25 if they offer at all you know so we have a lot of school choice kids compared to Desy you know dark
districts and also locational districts and again you know like like any Community you can opt out of it at any time but you're you are morally and legally obligated to continue to educate those students and I you know one one idea we had toyed with many many years
ago is you know the one downfall to school choices that kiddo has to be brought here by somebody we can't offer Transportation so you know many years ago we had said well if we can park a bus at a a certain spot in a different town then maybe we could get more kids
and and race those numbers but it turned out we actually can't do that so um but that was a thought that's that's where creativity comes into the budgeting like if I could park a bus and I can fill that bus with school choice kids sign me up you know so and that's where that
outside of the box thinking comes into play some years um you know and then you then you investigate you're like yeah you can't really do that so but the thought was there I just have a comment about school choice I'm sure you didn't think that
this question is going to lead to such a discussion um so I I think that the premise of school choice is great the the thought of it is awesome um I think the one concern that I've always had about it is yes we get funded the $5,000
and this is money coming in and that's lovely and yes we get reimbursed for the special education costs the if they have OT or PT or whatever I just sometimes think about more of the um qualitative piece and
what is the that putting on a case load for a special educator or an OT or a PT and adding on if we can't add on more staff to help support but we're now taking in more
students and maybe we we can't decide we just get a name right and it's like yes we we're taking these kids and we don't know what kind of services they're going to need we don't know down the line what kind of services they're going to need and there's a lot I worked in the school
system for a little bit there's a lot of burnout and when we're adding and adding and adding addition to this that maybe we're not totally getting the reimbursement back to support as well so I think
that's always been my kind of part of my concern with school choice in the high number that we have yeah I think that was a part that was kind of left out is school choice you don't get school choice is not your choice any a way you get whatever comes
in yeah that's that's the rule that's a stipulation they come from wherever they come from with whatever they have and that's what you take on and it's a gamble in the sense that yep you get a name MH so yeah I think to Justin's point the the premise behind it like I
don't think you would have I me I mean huge support of choice you know in 2025 now you know you could go down to Manfield I might be closer to Mansfield than I am to the Norton schools based on my location I don't think necessarily should be locational based the problem with it is is you're you're sending kids
out of District you know and you're and they're coming into district and you're kind of left picking up the pieces to pay for you know um and again that's that's the tricky part where to me it's almost like we're funding systems and I've said this before we're funding the
system of hey we're getting $2 million for school choice unfortunately you know Mansfield sending that kid out in the States Bank $5,000 Manfield getting lucky in a way because they're saving money you know so if that money actually followed the student and now that student's getting $115,000 as an
educational credit for parents then all of a sudden you're talking hey Norton's bringing them in we're getting $15 $20,000 to match now that money is legit and you watch how fast districts will pick up school choice it's that's the key that's the key piece for me is it's there's the financial aspect of it is
way too low for 2025 public education and I think unfortunately as soon as we the moment we started using choice not for onetime costs and instead to supplement the budget now like it's going to be very
very difficult for us to be able to dig ourselves out of that of that predicament that we're in right so that's why we always say okay let's move another 10,000 from Choice per building into Subs like let's move this staff
position into the regular budget even if you I mean if you do one of those a year that's like a 20-year process to dig us out of that pole so it's um kind of a catch-up game at this point absolutely um and I think it's important
to finish off though with the idea of again this in no way should be considered any sort of pitting you know our school choice children against our our home children that is not the intent in any way shape or form um because
again this is wonderful opportunity for the children that we have here um from my purpose of asking this question was to again just bring to light the clarification of what school choice actually is what school choice actually means and what that looks like currently
fiscally for our school and our budget plain and simple so thank you thank you very much hi I'm Shannon Taylor I'm a JCS special education teacher I I don't live in Norton um I just had some questions because I hear you guys talking about
burnout and I hear you guys talking about you know that we've lost 22 positions but what I haven't heard is what are the Creative Solutions to get us back to where we were and that was a big talking point for school committee last year when we were talking about the
override was we're going to have Creative Solutions the Creative Solutions that I'm hearing is that we still don't have what we lost and we still aren't moving us forward in some ways and I I I do Wonder too if you guys
realize the impact of what 22 staff being not District looks like when we had you know over 300 members and and now 22 is a lot it's a lot and it's a lot more on us so the people that are
still here my job hasn't I'm still special education teacher but I can tell you my job is much different this year than it was last year my responsibilities are um but I'm not hearing what were the Creative Solutions to make it so that we're not
here again where're we're lost 22 positions so that's just what I I want to know where we're going cuz I heard there was Creative Solutions I'll take it uh I think the creative solution starts what with what we started with you know we have a 12%
increase from last year uh in our proposed budget and it's down to five that's creative that's 7% of what we instead that we were going to request last year that we didn't request year that's you know again do I know all those Creative Solutions behind the scenes no that's you know talk to our
superintendent and budget manager but I think that's a start you know we're not asking for crazy budget numbers you know we we understand you know I don't think we got to say it enough the the town voted you know it voted two to one uh on an override you know it got absolutely
demolished if you want to put it in plain layman terms um you know so I think some of the Creative Solutions are are being done on the backside um you know again I've said this multiple times we don't have a blank checkbook you know Dan spoke to it great at at our Saturday
meeting you know the the ultimate power lays within within the town in the community itself um you know we we get a budget from Jen and and her team and then we you know we go forward and either approve it or you know pick it with a fine tooth comb and then it comes back to to the town manager who
recommends it to the town meeting and then the town meeting you know pushes on you know last year we recommended a 12% budget it got crushed it's you know that that's kind of where we're at um there there's no like I said there's no magic uh Magic Bullet
here I think I and just speaking personally is when it comes to the creativity that I mean there there's only so much you can do when an outside force not the school
committee gives you a budget like imagine if you're sitting at home and you know your your financial planner says you can only have this amount and what do you do maybe you go without your streaming services or maybe you cut the cable cord or something like that so you know
creativity is kind of a in my opinion might be the the wrong word to use um you know we we heard loud and clear what the the town's thought of the override unfor you know the fortunate part is after the dust settled you know there
was money that could be reallocated at town meeting so again I wouldn't say that's that's a creative Force but when you know there's money we didn't expect then we come back at fall time meeting and say okay you know we need a
little bit of that and then we can bring back a few positions um you know I don't think there was any you know creative Vice that could get us 22 positions back um sure you know so when we think about the creativity
it's more as Dr uded to can we do without it and again that's not the creative way but it's looking at the big picture unfortunately I I was I was upset with 22 positions being lost you
guys were um it would take a Monumental task to get those 22 back after a year as I mentioned there been a position that hasn't been funded for 10 years so you know we can we can say creative but it's more what do we do to just keep the
lights on and then maybe we can chip away at gaining back those those positions here and there you know there is there's a finite amount of money to go around um so so I I would hesit like I said I I I don't want to disc dismay
you but creativity is probably not the best way that we should have phrased it um it's more can we exhaust every Avenue of Revenue in our domain and I think we've done that uh as as much as we can
and you know uh there was public officials that wanted us to come in at an even lower number to start with and unfortunately that's not that's probably not the best process for us because again you know the final
number which will be recommended by you know the town the town manager the select board the fincom ultimately it's the voters and and I as I mentioned the voters have the final say and if the voters want it to be changed then you go through town meeting and you go through
the process and you ask for it to be changed you know for us as an elected board we we control what we can for the schools and we try and you know help out if we can if we can share a position you know there's been those discussions in
years past um and I think there there does need to be more dialogue of of what we can share as a school versus you know the town might need assistance with like it could be something you know like it services or you know something like that
so um I I think I I want to comment that you said you guys have said the word exhaust right we've exhausted the budget we're getting to the point where you're exhausting your Educators because we don't want your children to have less
and we have less now than when I started 13 years ago what I had as options as a special education teacher what I had for resources what I had for Staffing what I could do much different when I started than it is now so the more we keep
exhausting and burning us out then we're not ever going to be able to move nort and forward which is what all of us want all of us have this really strong Norton Pride but I hear we're exhausting the budget and we're burning people out and I just need you to know that it is truly
happening that we are trying to be sure that your children have the experience that we want want them to have and not that we were spending money like crazy before we had all these really fancy Dancy things that other like we still don't have what other districts have we
still don't have the resources that our kids need and then to know that again we're 22 positions back and we have others that have been on the POS on the docket for 17 years it matters the all of that matters and I'm glad that we're
trying to be more fiscally responsible and put in the done not putting so much out there but we can't not put out there what we don't have now based on what we used to have and I feel like that's a big part that's missing in this is sure
we're putting forward a budget but we're not putting forward what Norton deserves Shannon I just want to mention too um I hear you I'm sorry I didn't need to walk away no it's okay I I hear what you're saying I've sat in the seat
for 9 years now and have fought for these schools even before my time here I will leave this seat in two more meetings I hope unless you guys put another meeting in that I don't know about we're all about having Sher cry at a meeting so can we get her to
cry let's get her to cry oh my God you ruin our surprise here a long time right yeah so I I just it I just need you to know too that it's exhausting for us to sit here and fight time and time again and try to get our community to understand what we
need and it's just not there there so it's exhausting for us it's frustrating for us because I have to look you in the eye who who I consider a number of you sitting in this room friends of mine I have to look you in the eye and say I know I know we're burning you out i' I've tried I've tried time and time again so it's just it's frustrating and
I think one of the other things that I want to mention is something that we started many years ago um when I was doing Park and recck stuff because I saw the need for the town and the schools to come together right so we started the The Joint meetings and I think like since Co we kind of got away from that we're starting to get back into it and
have real conversations and sometimes they're heated um and and I said at our last joint meeting we we can agree to disagree and still be friends and and still respect each other that's a huge lesson that needs to come back to our community um and worldwide I guess but
um I digress but I have not cried um so I just think that what happened in the fall cannot happen again that that's like and I won't be here so I'm I'll be sitting out there watching you guys but we we can't we've got to be communicating as boards so that we don't
come back with the $6 million in the fall when our Cuts have already even made and then we've got a scramble to try to reinstate things in a middle school and who suffers I understand our teachers but our kids our kids are the ones that suffered and to me that is not
okay it will never be okay so I just want you to understand I hear what you're saying we're just I personally am just as exhausted and I don't feel like as you guys as a board in whole are trying to hurt children that's not what I'm saying but I'm also saying we heard Creative Solutions we heard moving
forward what are the things you guys can bring to us as an association I know don't represents the association anymore but as a member what are the things that we can do that gets the town to understand that teaching in 2025 is not what it was in the 80s and and for for
better for worse in a lot of ways for better I think we're doing really great things for kids that we didn't have access to when we were growing up how do we communicate that in the most efficient way especially so that we don't have people coming back and saying we're finally being fiscally responsible
when I don't NE I didn't live in a Norton where I thought I had too much I always was living in a place or working in a place where I thought if we had a little bit more how much more could we do for our kids so I just don't want that narrative also out there that it's
we're we taken too much in the past when I know like Mr shei said we've had positions we've never been able to fund that really needed to be funded so thank you for the time guys thank you if I could sorry I just want to say one more thing uh Shannon I think you don't you
can go down you can go sit down this is really for everybody um I can't put 22 positions back in this budget right it's we just know that that's not going to happen so my goal for this budget was to be able to kind
of keep what we have and then give us a little bit of wiggle room to add something back and if if it I hope that if we can do it in a way where we're doing it a little bit slowly and we're like being careful about it
then we can continue to add things I mean last year the majority like a lot of the positions that we cut or positions that I created with Joe like all like and to see like 10 years of
work into programs and stuff that we did was was heartbreaking um I've been in Norton for 22 years I've never had too much as a classroom teacher as an administrator like there's always other things that we could have um but this year has been
really tough and I appreciate the Educators that are in this room tonight I appreciate the Educators that are not here tonight um because they have taken on a lot um to replace those positions that were lost the difference between a
4.96 increase which is level services and a 3% which is what the select board asked us to come back with it's less than $700,000 so if we have a year with free cash I would hope that the Committees
and the town manager and the finance committee will recommend for us to get this level service budget this spring not wait for the fall because we have really difficult time hiring people in November after we've made Cuts or maybe we can come up with another plan to get
us to that point where we get money in the fall but maybe it's for transportation or something along those lines um but it's not a multi-million dollar difference like it was last year we're close thank you thanks hi brid Car Oak Street um you
kind of touched upon what I was going to ask but really quick the 12% budget um that was proposed last year that was the override budget quote unquote or no what was that like yeah yes that was like that was level services for us but it was 12% and this year it's 4.96 okay so
what's cut out of that question or did you nothing nothing nothing no it's exactly what we have right now okay Mr your still the service service thank you Karen Dre six North Washington Street um I have a couple questions you just touched briefly on this so it's kind related to that a closer sorry talk
closer to the microphone should I just talk louder um when will you know the percentage that the town is going to recommend and also who sets that percentage like does the town manager just say hey you're getting like 1% and general government is saying
1% um okay answer that sorry I have a really B question um I'll know as soon as they finalize their thoughts and tell us um but I don't know that yet um but just like I make a recommendation to the school committee uh the town manager makes recommendations to the boards so
the finance committee and the select board okay and then has the district or the school committee ever considered advocating for a higher percentage for the schools in the spring um as you spoke to um about free cash in the fall last year um both General government and
schools got 1% now after the supplements in the fall General government don't quote me on the exact numbers cuz I don't have them with me General government netted out around 4% budget and schools netted out around two and as we know adding things in in the fall is
impossible um so if we are going to continue with this kind of model that in the fall we're going to have supplements would it make more sense for the schools to get more like 4% and general government get two and of course I'm making those numbers up because you know we don't know what
those percentages are going to be in the thought that General government it's much easier for them to add in police over time um you know it's actually easier for them to add in positions as well in the fall because they can hire anybody at any of that time um so if I
can just answer that real quick so as Mrs Cohen alluded alluded to we we we welcome open communication and it is a town budget and school's budget and Highway and police a lot of it is a bit
of a balancing act to your point you know when we historically have gone to fall town meeting it's not to look for money to add positions cuz our budget and our our services basically start on July 1 I mean sorry yeah July 1 so you
know it's as we found this year when we got supplemental money at fall toown meeting we couldn't find people for some positions so that's that's The Balancing Act but you know the the issue is always is to your point could the schools get a little
more and somebody else gets a little less in theory but we we are bound by what the recommendations are made not so much the recommendations but if the recommendation is made by Finance Community select board and ultimately
then push to the town at at town meeting it would take someone up the town to say maybe the school should get a little more but the caveat to that is always who gets less so that's why we would prefer to have those discussions prior
to town meeting and say can we do can we maybe get this this 4.96% and then at btown meeting we don't ask for anything we've done that in the past or you know many years ago we had a big number at fall town meeting and it
was Transportation payment cuz we can only fluctuate our payments for so many like so many line items such as transportation we can kind of push that off and say yeah will pay in a couple months um but and I don't know the intricacies of how the other departments
do their budgets but ultimately you know because schools get more somebody else would get less and and we don't like to feel that um but that would be ultimately what the town manager says and what he makes his determined recommendation finance committee in the
past has said no maybe we can give them a little bit more but it's got to come from somewhere that's always The Balancing Act is it's got to come from somebody else so somebody's going to give up a piece of their pie to give us a little bit more and I yeah I think know piece here is it's this money is
just not coming in it's it's free cash free cash varies year to year to year you know last year we had a good chunk of free cash at I think it was like 6.7 million you know in years past it hasn't been that high so it's not as simple as you know oh we're going to you know fund
the schools up more up front cuz in the back end they're going to get more money you know um I mean in theory it sounds great but a free Cash Ring comes in a you know $1.2 million and we're trying to fund you know Capital Improvement projects or you know put more money in the stabil uh stabilization fund you know now now
you've really you know you're setting us you know you're setting the entire town finances back as well so again last year was a little bit of an outlier because we received so much free cash and I totally agree with Sher like you know I think every single board would have liked to see that and have that projected out a little bit better
because I think it would have made our decision when we were at those joint meetings a little differently um but again you know that's unfortunately free cash is you know not exactly free and it's definitely not exactly you know easy to you know to project out and whatnot so but yes that's a good point
so when if if there are Cuts sorry if there is I don't know what I'm saying because I didn't write this part down um what am I saying if if the town comes back and says um you're going to have 2.5 um will like last year will you communicate what those C will look like
before town meeting yes so that we kind of have a sense of like you know what's really on the shopping block is blah blah blah blah or what our priorities are this I will never I will never make um a public Declaration of cuts before my staff knows if they if they're going to be
impacted I will always let my staff know first um but yes I absolutely would thank you thank you Karen hello I'm VAB I live at 50 man filed Avenue um I have a comment and a question the first is a
comment the resounding failure last year was less than 37% of our Town's registered voters I would really like it if heads of boards in general stopped saying that the town soundly rejected something when for example the MBTA
thing was like a 100 people at a town meeting and in the case of the override I'm pretty sure that not all parents in town even voted because it was like 37% of the town who actually voted in the special election for the override my question and I apologize if
I missed this because I had a work call come in at the beginning of the meeting there was a significant figure related to Federal funding for special education in the budget like 700 and 700,000 was 750 I believe are we
concerned about that because from what I've been hearing there are an awful lot of um Federal Department education shakeups happening and there have been a lot of threats to funding and there's been a lot of send it back to the States I'm concerned that if we're in a
situation where we're still running kind of on a deficit in town in general and we keep struggling to fund the schools do we have a plan if that $750,000 goes away and I don't know if we could but uh has that been taken into
consideration or are we trying to plan for so right now we are optimistically hopeful for the upcoming budget cycle because um the way that Federal
entitlement grants work um and I did the title one grant for Norton for you know a million years is there almost on the year DeLay So the way that it works is that by the time the money actually gets
to the state it's been almost an entire fiscal year before it was actually voted on so we're feeling pretty good that the FY 26 Federal funding should not be impacted by anything things that may be
happening at the federal level currently where we may need to worry would be the FY 27 year um because that is the current budget cycle that the feds are talking about now um so that is
something that um Dr arrian is now our Title One director he writes all of our our Title One all of our title grants um and Casey Russo does our um Federal sped program and then the preschool Grant um that's something that we're constantly
keeping our ears to the ground just to kind of see what this could look like down the road um but as of right now we are keeping everything cross that we will be good for this upcoming fiscal year got thank you of
course I have a comment and a question as well um I've been listening to you all talk about um specialized programs and the kiddos that come from school choice and it all sounds really great however I'm on the front lines of those
special ey programs and those kiddos that are coming many of those kiddos that are coming on school choice um come with pages and pages and pages of documents um and plans associated with that I'm also um I'm also also seeing
the effects of the budget cuts because there used to be two sixth grade math teachers and now there's myself and I don't want she's still a full-time employee but she's only teaching General regular sixth grade math education
halftime so all of those kids have to now be split between one and a half teachers I also used to teach five um sections of my sixth grade math now I have four so now I have more kids um have more time which is great but all
of those specialized programs all of those school choice kids and and all of the budget cuts all are putting an enormous strain on the teachers in your school um and on the students as well we are not able to do the things that we
used to do um I see a crisis unfolding I'm I'm really worried I've I've done hard jobs before this is not my first not my first rodeo i' I've taught in ad Barb I taught and taught and I've taught hard classes um but I'm really seeing a
crisis and it started in the fall um unfolding what so Mr shidi my question is what are you're saying you hearing you say there's you know we're filling the seats on the JetBlue airplane was just that was that was def that was my
analogy I apologize I'll take the fall for that one D it was deflating to me to think of my seats in my classroom where I'm working so hard trying to service all of my children with all of these needs uh in a variety of needs and and and it's just like an airplane and we're
filling the seats um but what would you consider a low number for a classroom where you would think that there would be available seats so so perhaps my analogy wasn't
well thought out which happens to me quite a bit so for example and nobody jump on me if we have 30 seats in a classroom I heard it I heard it so and again I'm going to try and
simplify my math if I have 30 seats in a classroom I can fill 30 seats in that classroom if I only have 25 Norton students in that classroom I potentially have five seats I can fill VI a school choice my analogy was we don't have the
number there's a myth around school choice and if we get rid of school choice we could get rid of teachers and save more salary the way they're spread out throughout K to K to 12 this that that's not an option so my point was
rather that classroom happens either way if I have 25 kids or if I have 30 kids if I happen to have five that don't live in Norton then that's the school choice so you know it's not a situation where if I don't have say your your class has
five school choice kids and now you don't the class is still going it and again it's not you know it's not costing me more in lights it's not costing me more in utilities to fill the rest of those seats and that was kind of my generalized point about the school
choice is if we get rid of it we're not getting you know we're not getting rid of classroom teachers or anything like that we were very cognizant last year when we put some limits on that that we don't want to overextend our teachers you know by putting 30 kids in the
classroom and making sure we can fill the school choice seat so so again I apologize if I you know might have what's a low number in in what type of class there's classes at the high school that have 10 to 12 kids there's also classes that
have 28 kids what would you consider a low number for a middle school classroom that that you would consider there would be seats to fill I don't know I I can't answer CU I don't know I haven't been in a middle school classroom in a number of years
you know so is it is the magic number for a teacher does does the teacher want 20 kids in her class or 25 kids in their class you know is is the work and again each each student needs your attention so I understand 25 is more than 20 um
but it's not a situation where you know my point was again that if we get rid of school choice we don't have open classrooms so we limit the number of kids so that we don't potentially overextend because it's not like one classroom has all the school choice kids
like each teacher might only get one or two so um I actually had this on Saturday as part of my packet and I didn't include it in my slides today but it is online um it's one of the pages in our parliamentary budget book and it shows the school choice enrollment by
here um and then so it's fairly simple to kind of figure out like at the middle school per classroom or at the G School how many students per classroom and then I break it down by JCS and lgm because those kids get grouped into one number so like for example there 14 second
graders that are school choice but they're separated across two buildings so that might be helpful for people to see for dance Point um and I apologize for my je comment that was not derogatory at all Leisa I apologize we currently have 18 students in sixth
grade that are school choice um and you know my my thinking is you know you're talking about these I don't have anything against school choice kids and I don't have anything against the specialized programs but when you have a classroom with you know two of these
specialized programs or I currently have two students that speak no English and then I have you know 25 26 students in my room as opposed to what may maybe would be 22 or 23 it do it does make a difference um I also had one other
general question I was previewing your slides online um and you're not presenting those tonight right like the graphs of each School the pie charts uh no those are were from
Saturday yeah um they are all online um and will be there as well tomorrow these will be a part of our full budget book do do you you also have one I didn't see it and I don't know if it's cuz I just went through too quickly for central office do you have a pie chart for that uh we do
not any plans to put one in sure she Jen Farley 21 Woodward Street I just have a question um kind of to piggyback off what Shannon had said about creative ideas a little bit of a worry about what
Val had mentioned earlier I love the presentation I was there Saturday I saw the breakdown I'm a Frontline educator I hear us saying that we've done the best we can and I do believe being able to potentially
preserve those jobs this year is fantastic however we're not giving our kids more and this is what it's all about so what do we do or me as a parent as a resident and as an educator to
advocate for more money for our schools because our kids deserve it and our Educators deserve the supplies that they need to be able to able to teach our kiddos um I believe Mr Scher you had said Mr howt put a bill forward and that
was squashed so where does that leave us what are our options again I think it's going to go back to one thing and one thing only we keep talking about it it's we're not getting the amount of money that the state is asking us to to try to fund
kids with you know I mean you're looking at at a massive issue that you know they're telling us they're going to sell you know fund us at 75% reimbursement rates and they turn around and give us 57% we're left to pick up the pieces um you know so I until again you know for
advocating and and going forward and getting your neighbors and and unless you're going to get an override past in the town the only next option is is to increase State funding for Education you know and again Norton's at this you know uh ability to pay District which makes
it very tricky you know we're getting you know some years we've getting $30 a kid from the state $104 was the highest we've ever gotten from last year you know when when a district down the road and and sto's getting sometimes over $1,000 you know the cities are getting four5 $6,000 a kid um you know so we
have this ability to pay yet we're very different from a Westwood or a Dover or a short short one you know yet we're we're to the state we we look the exact same I mean turn around go to those towns and tell me we're the exact same you're already mind um you know so I think that's unfortunately like I don't
I don't know I that's that's problem I think everybody up here you know obviously the more money you have you know hopefully the better off you can do however you know we've had all these positions you know we we had these positions five six seven years ago you know and unfortunately like when I'm
looking at it and I see you know STAR testing mcast testing the whole you know whole uh idea behind you know Co and what the state did and our kids education and their testing scores and you know are going down and not up yet
we're funding more and more money to it we got to fix something something's broken you know um so again I I if you had the answer I think you you would be a multi-billionaire because again this is not a Norton issue go look at Easton Easton looks right now right now at this
they're fighting with each other back and forth just like we did last year they're looking at cutting 60 positions North Ador last year cut 20 uh Mansfield is looking at an override Easton's looking at an override you know these are towns that are obviously you know a little wealthier than norn if you will but you know they funded overr right
they've done multiple Deb exclusions and they're still in the same spot so we just keep saying like oh we can do this oh do that advocate here to me it's it's so much bigger than than the Grassroots in in the town of Norton you know it is
it is a monster issue across the entire state so I just I I I don't disagree with that and I was out there a lot of time last year working towards the override um and please forgive me I'm exhausted tonight my words are not
coming out quickly but hearing you say that and it is a bigger issue it's more Global do we need to band together is it we need to talk to our Town manager the to have him or well him right now to advocate for more like how as a resident
and as a parent can I help move our Norton Community forward because our kids deserve more that our kids deserve better and and again I don't know if there is an answer but you know I Shannon I think it was you Norton Pride
we care and I I'm looking at you Shar and when our kids were in kindergarten there was a par in the classroom ter and I think of all the changes and I think of all the things that our kiddos are missing out on but I I care and I want to know as a resident you know how can I
help support you as the school committee you know you are our voice is it the town manager or is it the state house and again I I know our future is sort sort of Uncertain um and that terrifies me because our kids are our future
they're are doctors our police our teachers and they're going to care for us when we're older um so again I get that there's no real answer but if there's something that we can do let us know yeah I I think ultimately
unfortunately the in the world we live in and the country we live in which is obviously outstanding but it all starts out legislation you know it's got to start from from the state level and our and our reps and obviously you know with J bars are tiing you got Mike Chason in coming in who seems to be hitting the ground running he's on the Ways and
Means Committee we've had multiple conversations he's shown up to a few of our meetings um you know between him and howt hopefully we can kind of start making the dent you know in terms of like how do we how do we fix this problem and again I reiterate Norton is not the only issue you know the only town of these issues so I just want to
say though because I just want to give a little bit of History this isn't we we've done this we we were in the same position years ago where we're like this is so frustrating we we would meet with other boards we would meet within the town you know with the town manager and
and we're still where we are right so we would ask our representatives to come to our meetings great they come and it's talking in the same Circle the same Circle right so that's why when people you know don't want to get involved in politics I get it because
the circle needs to stop and people need to start coming up with real solutions I mean I agree with Nick completely like our state needs to help us out they can't keep increasing grais the way they are and and expecting us to figure it out we've been figuring it out and the people suffering are you guys our
teachers and our students and and honestly I'm going to include us in that because we're sitting here volunteering our time trying to come up with Solutions when legislators are just like yep talk in a circle and then yep we hear you we're going to do that and then nothing happens and where are we I mean I can't even I don't remember the how
many years ago it's preo that that we had Representatives come to our meeting and a number of them number of times to express our frustration and and begging for help and we're still sitting here so sadly sitting in the seat I don't have an answer for
you sorry yeah hi me again Laura gson Allan D um so to pick you back off of this conversation that's happening right now um I wasn't sure I assume that we're all aware um
so I stood before the school committee in May of 2023 um when we were initially discussing the cuts back then um and one of the questions I had brought forth
was why aren't again to to go off of Mr sler talking about this is happening everywhere this is every town this is a bigger issue I had said those same things at that meeting and I had questioned and I had said well why don't the school committees talk to each other why aren't you
banding together why aren't we trying to push back against the state about it and um it was actually I believe Dennis who replied back with because doesn't matter doesn't mean anything that's going to happen and I okay and I sat back down so
not to got you off but so I attended the Massachusetts Association for school committees back in November um you know and it's basically all the area well not area state of Massachusetts um school committee members who were there um went there sat
for multiple sessions networked with a bunch of people um you know so I don't think it's for a lack of trying um I I get that no no no I get it and I and like I've reached out you know Mansfield's reached out to me Easton's reached out to me North ad's reached out
to me we've kind of started preliminary talks as far as like Hey how do you do this what do you deal with here um you know so again yes you know and I I think the sher's point you know all of this takes time you know and we put in and again I know you're going to be joining
us in in a month or two well maybe more than likely um you know so you know I think when when you kind of sit down and you and you go back to it it's there's a whole ton of time and effort into this you know um personal time you know every time we're down here or every time we're
in the thing and I'm taking off time of work I'm losing money to go out and do that so it's not for a lack of trying it's not for a lack of you know we don't care you know again I think you know to to you know I I I understand it denz probably got beat down he did it for 12 years went in circles 12 different times
and was probably like yeah I'm done with this you know I I totally can understand how that can happen right and this is not that was two years ago so we're going to preface again with that was two years ago um so just to sort of put
everybody in the loop um so there was a joint statement from the Massachusetts Association of school superintendents the massachus Association of school committee and Massachusetts Association of school business officials and it was
released and it outlines the pressing budgetary challenges currently facing school districts across the Commonwealth this position um paper provides valuable Insight that may help us understand these challenges in a broader Statewide
context and may be useful as we navigate potential concerns within our own community and I just feel it's important that we hear this and I think every single open meeting like this should be reading this should be sharing this sorry I just took me a minute to find it
I couldn't find it the statement highlights the following key points school districts in Massachusetts are facing a perfect storm of fiscal pressures with the expiration of federal pandemic recovery funds any positions of programs previously supported through
Esser must now either be eliminated or sustained through alternative funding sources major expenses particularly in special education services out of District tuition and transportation for students with disabilities are rising significantly Chapter 70 the primary
source of State funding for schools has not increased at a rate that aligns with inflation and the circuit breaker program for high need students in special education remains underfunded local revenues are insufficient to close the gap unless
voters support a proposition 2 and a half override this is not a short-term issue these Financial strains will continue to intensify in the coming years in response to these challenges a coalition of educational organizations United for
our future which is these organizations including the MTA the AF and others is urging State officials to provide adequate funding to address the structural deficits facing our districts it is important for us to consider these larger cont this larger context when
discussing local concerns especially when narratives arise suggesting that financial management issues are unique to our district the truth is that these fiscal pressures are being felt across the state while it is not comforting to
know that these challenges are widespread I am confident that we will continue to work together both locally and Statewide to find Solutions so with that being said I come back to you two years
later this is a state problem and unfortunately the trickle down is State's not doing what they need to do it comes down to the districts the towns are finite they can
only do what they can with the money that they have that trickles to the school district and then it's just a constant snowball and again in the end who is
suffering everyone everyone your residents are suffering your students your children are suffering your school teachers who are just trying to financially survive our suffering this
is a problem that is bigger than us so we can sit here and we can continue to you know bounce all of this out and be creative or find things like this but at the end of the day it comes down to the dollar sign that the state is willing to
provide and then when you add to it the potential of your federal Support also not necessarily going away but potentially being allocated elsewhere it just creates a larger snowball so this isn't a question it's more less just a
little bit more information that yes as you said I don't think you don't care never thought that it's a bigger problem that finally we are all kind of collective together going oh light bulb how do we fix it so that was my two sons
on that thank you so I think just to comment back to you with you saying that yeah you um sorry um yes it is a state issue but the issue with that is and you're going to see shortly when you are sitting most likely in my seat um
that we need to we need to still do business here we still need to come up with solutions for our students for our for our staff so we can say that all we want and and some of us have been saying it for 9 and 10 years until we get the help from the state that we need we
still need to sit here and solve problems and make budgets work for our students to give them the best that we can possibly give them so I just need to make sure you know we understand that like we understand it's a state issue we've understood that since we all you know join this committee but there's still work to be
done Amy hi I'm Amy Weber that's loud um I'm a third grade teacher at JCS and I'm the NTA president and I wanted to just thank Jen Farley because she said it um in a much more eloquent way tonight what I kind of tried to say two weeks ago when
I came up here and asked the school board like will you work with us to get us the budget that we deserve and the answer was yes um but I think what we're trying to say is how can can we work together and I don't know the answers to that I'm not an expert at local
government um but you know we've reached out to the school board we've reached out to the fincom we've reached out to the select board what we are in a crisis and we want to find Solutions and I don't know if that means we work together to ask the town to give us a bigger piece of the pie and I understand
that it's going to affect someone else um but these are questions that we're talking about um like what can we do um so thank you Jen for speaking so like from the heart um as a parent and as a resident um but we do really want to
work together thanks thank you good anyone else for Public public uh budget budget public uh now you now you confus me again budget
meeting um comments anyone else from the school committee good to go so now I think I have to close this all right so I will um motion to close the public hearing on
the FY 2026 school budget so second can I actually just go back sorry yeah just from the town Charter can we just make sure we did this correctly we need the last two fiscal years and what those costs were they're all in there can we just read them all in public just so we
have it that's my fault you want to read the total budget for the last two fiscal years so so by Town Charter we need to read FY 23 and fy4 actuals okay which I know we're in
there okay so uh FY 23 33,98927 FY 24 $34 m329 n82 and then the budgeted number number for fy2 is $
35,5 35,6 And1 and then our projected cost for FY 26 would be 37,2 198,50 31 correct thank you now I'll entertain a motion to approve uh to close the public
hearing on the FY 26 budget so second all those in favor I I all right um next up is yep we got to vote um so we vote on the FY 26 budget I'll
entertain a motion to approve the FY 26 budget in the amount of 37,2 198,50 31 as recommended by Dr O'Neal and her staff second so moved said second
yes um all right so so so moved by Dan second and by Sher okay um all those in favor I I thank you very much um oh all right cool next up is public comment period anyone else have anything to say about not budget
related yes seeing none we will move on if people want to get out of here we can take like a one minute to pack up your stuff I totally understand but if you're going to stay and listen you're more than happy to R everybody out of the building bu I can
read a room you guys want to spread out a little bit right breaking records guys run them all out all right uh next up is vot to approve the minutes uh of the February 26 2025 Open session
meeting I will Contin a motion to approve soov second all those in favor I uh next after that is the warrants Mr I reviewed and approved the following warrant School expense warrant February 26 2025
9888 126 I wish to enter that into public record sorry thank you Sher student rep went home yeah um Benson had an obligation to go take pictures at Mr NHS tonight and Antonio is in Mr NHS tonight
so sadly we we'll just table them for the next time okay okay um that's fine I guess maybe could you just email them if you had some that way we just can get caught up on what's Happening perfect um all right next up is the Norton veterans Council
Carnival I would say that's Mr Marson thank you all um Roger Myers and 62 power Street um just want to uh give you a uh rundown of what we're doing again this year with Carnival um it's going to
be from June 26 to 29th this year we are uh partnering with the town for Founders Day which will be Saturday night on the 27th um which founders day will be behind the Y School while the uh
Carnival will be in front of the Y school um we're doing um some tweaks as far as uh what we're doing with parking this year um I talked to uh Wade lazat
uh about uh uh shuttling people for uh when we have fireworks we're expecting to have fireworks on Saturday night um we have a meeting on the 25th to go over with the uh State Fire Marshall and our uh Fire Marshall um in town to uh make
sure that everything is all set uh as far as that goes and all the permitting that we're going to need for that um if you have any questions about uh what's going to be going on please let me know um we are trying to do something different as far as parking as well
we're going to make it a oneway into the parking lot this year One Way in one way out have everybody go out through the access road over by that comes out near Freeman Street and have half the road closed off um with cones or horses or
whatever so that people have some way to walk up and back and forth and without having to um be concerned um that's basically it we're going to be having the same uh rundown as we had last year we have a new um conable
company that we're dealing with it's the same company that does uh the uh what do they call it over North kids day over in North adoro it's Fiesta Shows um and we're using the um Fireworks company American Thunder that they recommend and
N workk with so um if you have any questions um I know that uh We've sat down with all of the department heads and uh spoke to them um I don't know what if you have anything else you need for them
where maybe you have this information where the where's the fireworks show going to be so it's going to be shot off in the furthest uh they used to call it the pit down in the in the back over near Seminary way um and um speaking um
with Wade um people are going to be encouraged to uh put bring blankets and put them out on the field the um synthetic field that multi-purpose field that's behind the yell to watch the fireworks
um most everybody will be gone from founders day before they shoot off the fireworks there'll be no parking over in that area obviously where they're going to be shooting off the fireworks I'm personally very excited to see this come back yeah we're um we're really excited
in the at the veterans Council and partnering with the town um with founders day and bring the founders date back as well so I I think it's going to be a uh a really exciting uh more uplifting program that we' actually had in the past so um we're always looking
to improve uh the experience that people have as they come to the carnival and founders day so if anybody has any suggestions we're open to did you say you were going to try and shut them so as far as parking goes there's going to be we're concerned about the amount of
parking that we're going to be able to have especially on Saturday night when we're having the fireworks so we've contacted um we College to use their um parking facilities um we're also getting in contact with St Mary's church and we
may be running two shuttle buses to uh shuttle people um into it um we're using the circle in front of the yell school for pickup and drop off of all shutle people uh Jen any impacts to schools
belong on uh no currently we are scheduled to get out on the 15th I was going to say 15 14th 15th is we have had one snow day so far so um no and um I would like to thank Mr Maran and the
veterans Council for being accommodating with our end of the year obligations so they're they're wonderful and they worked with us to find a time when school would already be out so we we greatly appreciate that great and um also just so people know
there's going to be um in the public parking that's across the street behind uh the Trent Memorial in the old Senior Center there will be a few trailers that are people are going to be parking in there some of the people who were working at the carnival will be parking there also um but that's there's going
to be parking there um we're for seeing people parking everywhere for the fireworks show the Walgreens will be closed by then so I'm assuming Walgreens will be full of people and that's within walking distance and even in Weeden that's within a walking distance if
people want to pop down there as well awesome great any other questions comments concerns good to go um thank you thank you very much thank you all are uh next up is the second reading and vote for the meal charge
policy revision um so yesterday afternoon we got some new federal guidance okay um table and so of course we're you just can't make this
up at this point um so we would feel more comfortable tbling it till later in the spring um right now we have conflicting guidelines between what the um what the audit from the Department of Education from two weeks ago just said and what the federal government is now
telling us um as you may have read There is um some things going on at the federal level with the USDA um and federal funds so I think we're just going to take a breath and hold because ultimately we don't want to have to bring something back to you in May or
June or even over the summer if things change between now and then so we appreciate your patience um it's it's kind of like shooting at a moving Target so do we have any um will be any lasting effects by pushing it off no
perfect however though we will have to start with another reading and and ultimately so so what we were told by the Department of Education was to take out all that stuff around the reduced meal prices and now with the
potential changes at the federal level there's no way Massachusetts could potentially afford for everyone to have free meals all across the board so we would have to reinstate the reduced pricing so therefore um honestly I I
think like we literally got it yesterday afternoon after 4:00 I was like you can't away um so we would just feel more comfortable let's just kind of hanging and waiting so sorry perfect do we have we don't have to vote to table C no perfect everyone go that all right
moving on is the second reading and vote graduation requirement policy revision Dr uh so as Dr Darman mentioned during our last meeting uh this is currently for um um our class of 2025
um M with mcast being eliminated as a graduation requirement we need to have a policy in place that allows students to earn a diploma if they have not yet um passed mcast so we do have a few students not a lot um that have not met
that requirement yet so therefore um we are implementing the English one and English 2 algebra and geometry and then either bio introductory physics physics or chemistry as the graduation requirement at this time um as he
mentioned uh for further classes we will be looking at something a little bit different um but as a stop gap for our current class this is what it will look like so obviously with the mcast and the V and actually getting the state to kind of give us a little bit of guidance I'm
good with this for 20 the class of 2025 um I don't think we can kind of add anything to it at this point we're a little late to the game um however I would really like to revisit this whether it be in our you know April May June meetings um because I really want to see what we can do for
the class of 2026 so I'm good with approving this with the understanding that uh school committee Administration principles teachers students parents whoever we need to kind of figure out maybe it's kind of a part of our strategic planning um in that in that committee you know kind of what do we
want to see as graduation requirements moving forward in in the town of nor and and I would also say that um whatever we decide to do moving forward we are just going to need to be you know thoughtful about that if we are implementing a new course requirement or a new portfolio
system um thinking about how we can actually implement it with you know the class of 26 is that a feasible option or is it something that we would do with the class of 27 based on budget based on offerings etc etc so and I think we have
to be aware that you know our policy is obviously subject to you know approval by desie and things like that so while we may say you need to pass in a portfolio Jesse can be like um no so I think that's you know to Nick's
Point more of that guidance cuz and and the thing is that you know this wasn't really shared but kids are still taking mcast you're just not requiring pass it correct still required and you know talk about getting mixed messages this is another thing
where we are constantly like the end field goal keeps moving so yeah i' say this is what we can do for now correct and again I I totally get it I think I just don't want it to die here and then this is our graduation requirement for the next five years either correct
perfect um next is other business any topics you need to vote oh sorry um just to clarify also um there are graduation requirements in the student handbook that are a little bit more fluid but this is the competency
determination instead of MC uh so I would entertain a motion to approve the graduation requirements policies as presented so moved second oh all those in
favor all right now on to other business topics not anticipated in 48 hours no other business no other business nothing everybody good great thank you very much uh we will entertain a motion to adjourn so
second everyone got in uh all those in favor thank you very much thank you all have a great day