7:31. I'd like to call the order the uh November 13, 2025 Obridge Township Planning Board meeting. Please rise for the pledge of allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for it
stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. >> D, could we please have a roll call? >> Mr. Dama >> here. >> Mr. Lenning >> here. >> Mr. Egopian >> here. >> Miss Canon
>> here. >> Mr. Ren is absent. Mr. Petty >> here. >> Miss Mella >> here. >> Mr. McGisac >> here. >> Mr. Brennan >> here. >> And Mr. Ferrar >> here >> and chairman Lley >> here. >> Okay. Swearing in of our professionals
will be our first item. >> Professionals, please raise your right hand. Do you swear or affirm the testimony you're going to give this evening? Is the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? >> Do you? >> Okay. First item tonight is discussion of our 2026
planning board meeting schedule. Do we have any uh changes or suggested changes or deletions? >> Okay, Mr. Bern, >> the May 28th. >> Okay.
And >> because of the holiday, the >> the next Monday, >> I think Memorial Day is the prior Monday. Monday prior. >> Okay. >> Yeah, because that that following Monday is June 1st.
>> Sorry about that. >> Okay. Thank you. Anyway, any any other suggestions on this? >> Do we need a vote on this? >> Um, yes. We usually Yes. >> Okay. I'm looking for a motion.
>> I'll move it. >> Second. >> Mr. Dama? >> Yes. >> Mr. Lenning? >> Yes. >> Mr. Agopian? >> Yes. >> Miss Cannon? >> Yes. >> Mr. Petty? >> Yes. >> Miss Mella? >> Yes. >> Mr. McGisac? >> Yes. >> Mr. Brennan? >> Yes. >> And Chairman Lat?
>> Yes. >> Okay. We have the minutes of September 25th, 2025. Make a motion. >> Second. >> Mr. Dalma. >> Yes. >> Mr. Lenn. >> Yes. >> Mr. Egopian.
>> Yes. >> Miss Cannon. >> Yes. >> Mr. Petty. >> Yes. >> M. Miscella. >> Yes. >> Mr. McGisac. >> Yes. >> Mr. Brennan. >> Yes. >> Chairman Lowry. >> Yes. Okay. Resolutions. First one 51-2023P. Vision bridge Urban Renewal LLC. Can I
get a motion? I'll move it. >> Second. >> Mr. Dalma. >> Yes. >> Mr. Lenning. >> Yes. >> Mr. Agopian. >> Yes. >> Miss Canon. >> Yes. >> Mr. Petty. >> Yes. >> Miss. Mella. >> Yes. >> Mr. McGis. >> Yes. >> Mr. Brennan.
>> Yes. >> Chairman Lauer. >> Yes. Next. 18-2025P. Old Bridge Regency Village LLC. >> I'll move it. >> Second. >> Mr. Mr. Diploma. >> Yes. >> Mr. Lenning. >> Yes.
>> Mr. Goian. >> Yes. >> Miss Canon. >> Yes. >> Mr. Petty. >> Yes. >> Miss Mella. >> Yes. >> Mr. McGisac. >> Yes. >> Mr. Brennan. >> Yes. >> Chairman Lowry. >> Yes. Uh, next. Uh, 59-2024P. Fat Car Properties LLC.
>> I'll move it. >> Second. >> Mr. Depal? >> Yes. >> Mr. Lenning? >> Yes. >> Mr. Agopian? >> Yes. >> Miss Cannon? >> Yes. >> Mr. Petty? >> Yes. Miss Misella, >> yes. >> Mr. McKisac, >> yes. >> Mr. Brennan, >> yes. >> And Chairman Lauer,
>> yes. Uh, next 13-2025P. Peter Zimny. >> Move it. >> Second. >> Mr. Deal. >> Yes. >> Mr. Lenning, >> yes. >> Mr. Gopian, >> yes. >> Miss Cannon, >> yes. >> Mr. Petty, >> yes.
>> Miss Mella, >> yes. >> Mr. McKisac, >> yes. >> Mr. Brennan, >> yes. >> And Chairman Lowour, >> yes. And last 18-2025P Oldbridge Regency Village Incorporated. >> Move it.
>> Second. >> Mr. Dalma. >> Yes. >> Mr. Lenn. >> Yes. >> Mr. Agopian. >> Yes. >> Miss Cannon. >> Yes. >> Mr. Petty. >> Yes. >> Miss Mella. >> Yes. >> Mr. McGisac. >> Yes. >> Mr. Brennan. >> Yes. >> And Chairman Lowry. >> Yes.
Okay. Um, first we have an announcement for uh anybody that's here for application 04 2025P. >> Uh, thank you, Mr. Chairman. Yes, we've, uh, the board received a request for an
adjournment of that hearing. Um, >> um, an adjournment of the of the hearing on this application. um they had received the board's uh professional report uh as of yesterday and they need time to go through it, review it and try to adjust address the comments that are
in there. So that uh uh application is going to be adjourned to the February, excuse me, the February 26th, 2026 uh planning board hearing uh planning board meeting date. Uh, so anyone here in the public that's here on that application, please be advised that the new date for
that hearing is going to be scheduled for February 26th, 2026 at 7:30 at this location. Uh, and uh, unless anything changes, no further public notice will be provided on that application. It will be excuse me >> we require an applicant to renotice when
it crosses the year. So since it is February I would say that they need to renotice >> that that's fine. And I know they had requested if we could announce it that it wouldn't have to be reniced. But if it's our policy that they have to >> Yes, it's our policy and with the uh the
number of comments and the kind of comments I'm expecting there will be some changes to the site plan as well. So I would prefer that uh we follow the protocol and we have them renotic and
there is a huge crowd that is interested in the project. So it just makes sense that a notice be sent. >> Okay, Mr. Chairman, unless any members of the board have any objection, we will require them to renotice. So Danny, when we advise them of the new date, we advise them that they will have to renotice for that application. So
correction on my prior comment, if you're here for that application, you will uh obtain uh new notice for the new date, which is uh currently scheduled for February 26th. >> Okay. No objections. Correct.
Okay, very good. Okay, first application up tonight, 37-2024P, Fox Houses LLC, uh, represented by David Himlman, Esquire. Good evening.
>> Good evening, turn green. It's temperamental >> maybe. >> There it is. Okay. >> It's a lottery. [Music] Mr. Chairman, good evening. Uh, members of
the board and your professionals, David Himlman for the applicant. And is the mic working? We picking up. Okay, great. Okay. Um, as you know, the applicant is Fox Houses LLC and the applicant has applied to your board for major preliminary and final site plan with CB
variance approval. And for the record, the block is 19,000 lots 7.11 on your tax map and the physical address is 821 Marbor Road. Uh, as you know from the application, we propose to demolish
the existing single family dwelling on the property and construct a three-unit residential building. The property is located in the AF apartment family residential zone. The proposed residential units are permitted you are permitted use under the AF zone. There
are several variances that the applicant seeks. Bulk variances which are identified um in your professional review memorandum. Uh there are minimum lot area, minimum lot width, sideyard, rear yard, uh resident non-residentidential landscape buffer
and refuge storage which we will discuss. Um as you know from the prior meetings um after your uh environmental after your I'm sorry your engineer had prepared a memorandum
uh back in June we had a TRC meeting in August uh with with uh with them and staff and we discussed at length the proposed plan and subsequent to the uh TRC uh the applicant had further input from
your plan AA and it was recommended to modify and she she felt that the plan should be modified that the parking adjacent to the units not across the aisle with a single two-way drive access near to Route 18 uh would not be
proposed anymore. So, we have revised the plans to reflect many of Vina's comments and uh I know that your engineer did issue a new memorandum uh dated November 12th which obviously we
will go through in detail. Um and I have two witnesses, Mr. Chairman, Mark Lieieber, who will who will be our engineer and planner and Irwin Feifer who is our architect on the project. And if you or your board members or your professionals don't have any questions,
we can proceed with Mr. Lever. >> We good? >> I want you to please raise your right hand. Do you swear or affirm the testimony you're going to give this evening is the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? >> Yes, I do. >> Please just state and spell your name for the record. >> It's Mark with a C and my last name is Liieber, L E B.
>> Mr. Lieber, good evening. Uh, we want to qualify you as a professional engineer and planner. Could you give a brief background and your CV and confirm that your licenses are current? Thank you. >> Hi, good evening. I graduated from Drexler University with a degree in
civil engineering. I completed the MBA program at Rucker Grad School and was licensed in 2003 as an engineer. In 2005 as a planner in 2006, I completed the certified municipal engineering certificate program. uh testified before
this board in the past and uh the zoning board. >> You would be before us before you're accepted. Thank you. Thank you very much. Good to be back. >> Mr. Lieber, before we get into your testimony, do you have any exhibits that you would like to have marked that were not previously submitted as part of the application?
>> I only have one. It's a two-page handout of photos that were taken of the property. Um >> so we'll mark that. Is it a packet? Yeah, there >> just we'll mark the whole packet as A1 >> A1. >> Mr. Liber, obviously you're going to get
into your testimony about the uh the site plan and the various aspects covering all the proposed improvements and the revised layout and also work through the comments in uh ERRI's
memorandum. So I will turn the floor over to you. >> All righty. Um so you already heard it's block 19,000 lot 7.11. This is 821 Marbor Road. Quite an unusual location actually. And this lot is unusually
shaped in itself. It's 62 acres. Uh in your AF zone, that's the apartment family residential zone. Uh if you look at the existing conditions plan, which is sheet two of our plan set, you'll notice that the property has a little
bit of frontage about 160 ft on Marbor Road and then it has 122 feet on Route 18. There's no direct access to the highway. However, the current configuration is there's a single family dwelling in the middle of the property and then there's a U-shaped driveway.
Um, and that U-shaped driveway, I want to say the easterly exit funnels right into Route 18. You can only make a right turn out of the property. The other part of the driveway, um, which is on the western side, you can make a right or a left. If you were to make a left, it
goes on Marbor Road, which is in itself a big U, which goes right back out to Route 18. So, the location is a little unusual. Um, next door, our neighbor to the right, is a single family dwelling. Beyond that, there are apartment
buildings. And, uh, if you look to the south of our property, which would be the top of our plan, there's a piece of property about 68 acres that's owned by Middle Sex County. We have uh two existing nonconformities in the zone. You need six acres. We have
62 acres and minimum lot width required is 300 ft and we have 237 ft. Just go to the photos here taken of the existing dwelling on the property. The top photo is uh just the front of the house. You'll see the driveway in the foreground. That's the portion of the
driveway that kind of funnels right into uh the on-ramp to Route 18. The bottom photo is looking back toward Marbor Road and you see the other driveway that you can either go left or right out of. In the distance on the left, you see our neighbor. That's a single family.
And then the next page, also the front of the house. This is looking um into the property from the driveway that's um w uh east, the east driveway. And then the bottom photo is just a picture of the backyard showing the current condition of the uh house in
the property. And just for identification purposes, uh these photos were taken by you. >> Yeah. >> And uh could you give us approximately a date when they were taken? >> Uh actually I can. We were scheduled to be heard on the um
>> No, it was uh we on the September hearing date. It was the morning >> 25th. >> It was that day. It was that morning. >> June 27th. So, if you go over to sheet three of our plan set,
this is what's proposed. Um, it's a threeunit residence. We are working at keeping the existing foundation of that building. So, the location would remain unchanged.
Um, the uh units would have each their own entrance. Uh, they would also have each a small deck in the rear. Uh and then in front of the property, we're creating a new parking uh lot for eight cars. Uh we have a central corral for
refuse, which will be in the form of cans, and those cans could be put out curbside uh on pickup days. We have uh some additional improvements that are proposed, namely landscaping and lighting for this parking lot, as well as uh a new fire hydrant that was
requested by the uh fire department. And in addition, we'll be providing sewer to this building. Currently, it's on septic. Um, we'll be bringing new water connections in and, uh, putting up a fence along the back of the property.
Now, one of the things that's changing is we are going to be removing the configuration that's there today where you actually have a U-shaped driveway. So, this is going to be a two-way driveway into the property uh, with eight parking spaces. Uh and we will not
have access uh that would be to the east anymore to the street. Um any questions at this point? Okay. Um I did get a copy of the report which was
dated November 12th um from the township uh department of uh planning. We actually I'm just going to jump down to page three where the variances begin. Um there are some variances three in in
this report that I want to point out specifically that are associated with the application. The first is the minimum sideyard setback. This zone requires a 50ft sideyard setback. Right now, the house that's there is 38.5 feet and we're asking for a small
reduction to 38 feet for the sideyard. Um, on the rear yard, the minimum required setback is 50 feet. Right now, the way the house is configured, the setback is about 24 feet to the deck and
17 feet um I'm sorry, I have that backwards. It's 24 feet to the house and about 17 feet to the existing deck. That deck's going to come down. Um, but based upon the layout that we provided, we're requesting a rear yard setback of
27.63 ft to the house corner, but 24.05 ft to the deck. So, it's a slight improvement, but we cannot provide 50 ft. I I don't see either of these variances creating any detriments. Uh namely because the rear yard is backing
up to a 68 acre vacant parcel that's owned by Middle Sex County and our sideyard setback to the neighbor on I believe it's lot six or lot five sorry is being reduced by 6 in which I don't
really think is perceptible as compared to what's there today. There's another variance regarding a non-residential landscape buffer and it states that any property developed for use other than a single family detached dwelling or open space, you're required to provide a 50- foot wide buffer
measured from the property line along any joining property to a single family dwelling. So technically the dwelling to our right, we would have to have a 50ft buffer and as I stated a moment ago, our building is within that buffer in itself. We're at 38 ft. Um, we're asking
relief from this. Um, and I think it's an unusual requirement only because the heading of that section is a non-residential landscape buffer, but our use is actually a residential use. So, it's really a residential use next to another residential use. So, I don't
think there's any conflicts. We're not certainly creating any kind of a nuisance uh in that sense. Now there was a other item noted for a refuge variance which we would like to comply with. So we don't need to request that variance anymore and that's
regarding screening and a covering over the refu area. So we'll comply with that. Just to look at the design waiverss I'm now on page four. We are requesting the waiverss from curving the entire property. Um we are providing new
curbing along the frontage. Uh we are not offering or providing curbing in this new parking area. On item six, that waiver was removed since we had reduced the number of driveways onto Marbor Road.
Um item seven, there's a requirement that you can't have a driveway within 50 feet of the sidelines of two intersecting streets. So if you counted Marbor Road as an intersecting street, we have now complied with that because we eliminated the driveway that was near to Route 18.
So seven's not required either. Um sidewalk, there is no sidewalk along Route 18 over here and we were not providing sidewalk to Route 18 in this type of a request. I usually leave it up to the board if they were to mandate sidewalk or perhaps have
a contribution to a sidewalk fund. uh you know we leave that up to the board. Item nine is a requirement that parking stalls be 10 x 20 and we will comply with that. So we're not going to request a waiver from item 9. We currently show 9 by 18 but we will increase them to 10
x 20. Item 10. Uh this is a particular uh concern with regard to NJ DOT highway access. Um, we have a separate traffic engineer involved who's in the middle of the permitting process with the NG DOT and
the project does qualify for a minor access permit only because there's a portion of Marbor Road and the driver that funnels into Rudine that's under their jurisdiction. So, we would be happy to provide the permit once it's issued. Item 11 is requiring a backup area of 10
feet. We'll comply with that. So, we are not asking for a waiver for item 11. Um the next item 12. Um this is a interesting requirement. It's about light pole spacing. You're allowed to have light poles
spaced to equal four times the height. So our poles are 15 ft. We kept them on the lower end because it's a residential use. Um which means the spacing would have to be 60 feet, but our spacing is less than 60 feet. So technically we need a waiver. The reason that we need that waiver is because the lower your
pole is, the more poles you need because the spread of the light on the ground is more controlled. So I think that you know this is really a minor detail. That was the the rest of the waiverss.
Um I do want to note uh pretty much in one statement that all the general comments in the report many of them are just statements. Some of them are statements that the item no longer applies or has been addressed. Um, and any comments that require a plan revision, we do intend to comply with.
So, I do want to note that some of the items refer to architecture, which you'll hear from the architect in a moment, but I don't really take any issue to the letter. Ever since we revised these set of plans and transmitted them to the township on October 31st, a lot of the items of
concern have actually just gone away. So, you know, unless there's specific questions from the board as to each and every one of these items, you know, I would say that we're looking to comply with all of them. You will hear testimony that we are exempt from the
accessibility and ADA requirements due to the number of units proposed. Um, we do have an approval from the fire department for the firetruck access circulation as well as the installation of a new hydrant which is right in front of this property. And then lastly, I've
been in constant contact with the OBMUA um to provide sewer to this building is under their jurisdiction. The sewer line in the street is a force main, but they had left a connection under a prior project to allow for this property to connect, which we're trying to design.
Really what it is, we're connecting a force main to a force main. So, it's a it's a different design than the typical gravity design. Um, I think that pretty much covers. I mean, landscaping, lighting comments, we have no problem addressing. There were some
suggestions to change the types of plants. That's all fine. Uh, we will need a permit from Freield Soil Conservation District. And, um, I think that's really it. Item 81 and on starts administrative
uh, requirements, which are pretty much consistent with any application that comes before the board. So, just in essence, really what we're doing is we're trying to keep the size and shape of the existing outsets there. We want to rebuild it, make it a three-unit building. We're going to have off-
streetet parking. We're going to have landscaping, lighting, trash areas, individual ingress and egress for each of the units. Um, as well as, you know, adequate fire access. Like I said, this is a very unusual location. Some of our relief we're
requesting is due to the unusual shape of the property as well as, you know, the fact that I don't feel that there's any detriment or whatnot for this landscape buffer not being provided or curbing on the interior of the site. >> Okay. Thank you for uh that information.
Uh we're going to go to our professionals. Um Mr. Dari would like to go first. >> Sure. I I don't have any questions with applicants engineer, Mr. Chairman. >> Okay. VA. >> Um, I don't have any questions except
for actually Eric just asked me a question and I I think I gave him the right answer, but how much is each unit square feet wise, less than around 2,000 square feet? >> Uh, can I defer that to win?
>> Can I I just want to ask >> it's 1226. 1226 >> total >> each unit. >> Yes, each unit. >> The first, it looks like the first floor is 580 and the second floor is 646.
And we have a we have a a a colored rendering which has all that detail on it. We're going to hand out Any any more questions? Bina, are you finished? >> Yes.
>> Oh, okay. Uh, okay. Any am I right? I just um I actually had a question for our professionals. Gina uh or the sidewalk. Do >> did we not have a plan to have sidewalks
going up 18 or am I misremembering something? >> I were just talking about the sidewalk. We did have u discussions when we were reviewing the RD management. Vina, you're your mic. Just make sure. Okay.
>> Sorry. It's okay. >> Uh when you >> got it. >> So when when we were discussing RD management that project, we were requiring them to put sidewalk on the other side because there's a Walmart across the street and there were
crosswalks. But here I was just looking at the aerials. In this section, there is nothing. So to have them connect and the property that is adjacent is the county property. I don't see that if it was a private property I would have
required them to do a sidewalk so that then when this vacant land gets developed I would have required that property owner to put in sidewalk but since it's a county property it just doesn't make sense. I think it would make more sense to have at least sidewalk along the opposite side where
uh the Foxboro development is and ferry road goes in because there you would see more pedestrian activity. >> Okay. >> Eric, are you >> No. Yeah. No, I just wanted a clarification. I know we did have conversations about it and if we are
eventually going to have sidewalks that we would need to have it required for this. >> You're you're finished? >> Yes, I am. >> Okay. Anybody on my left have a question for the applicant's testimony? >> Is it done? >> Okay. I have a couple questions. Uh did
you say that you're you're trying to keep that on the original footprint of the old house, right? Yeah. >> Basically, give or take. I believe there is a little adjustment in the front of the footprint to accommodate the new porches and the entrances, but for the
most part, the overall dimensions of that three-unit building are identical to the existing single family home. >> Okay. And my other question, when you come out of that driveway, uh can can you make a left on Marble Road? Is it is it two-way on
>> You can make a left there. Um, but when you follow it around, it just sends you back on route 18 anyway. >> Unless you go in >> unless you go to the apartments. >> Apartments. Okay. >> That's all I have. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Okay. >> Any other questions? Mr. Chairman,
>> we're going to open it up to the public now. Anybody from the public uh have a question for this uh testimony? >> See no hands. I close the public. Thank you. >> Thank you, Mr. Chairman, Mr. Lever. Thank you. Yeah, if there's no questions, I mean, I'll >> don't go anywhere.
>> I'll still be here. >> Uh, Mr. Chairman, our next witness is Irwin Feifer, who's our project architect, and we could have him sworn in and qualified. >> When you're ready, could you sw your right hand? >> Do you swear or affirm the testimony
you're going to give this evening is the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? >> Yes, I do. Can you please just state your name and spell it for the record? >> Win Feifer. I R W N F E I F E R. >> Thank you. >> Good evening, Mr. Feifer. Um, would you
just give us a brief background, your CV and your qualifications in architecture and your license status, please, so we can have you qualified as an expert. Thank you. >> Certainly. Um, I got my uh degree in architect from the City College of New York 1965
and became a licensed architect in New Jersey 1972 and I'm currently licensed. >> Good standing. Still good standing. Yeah. Still pushing the pencil. Yes, >> you're accepted. >> Very good. Thank you.
>> Thank you, Mr. Feifer. Um, so I know you've brought some uh exhibits with you. Uh, and I guess we could mark those. uh A2 and there are um Mr. Feifer, there's two sheets of that, correct? >> That's correct. >> Okay. So, um why don't here I'll take
these same what he submitted, but it's colored because I think um the port engineer asked for that in his memorandum in their memorandum. If we don't have enough, I we have >> I have a couple more. I have one
Mr. Mr. Fifer, while we're handing out um the exhibit, uh if you would um if you would go over the details from an architectural standpoint of the proposed uh units, you know, going through the floor plan, design, elevations, etc.,
and the general layout, and then we can get into any questions. Thank you. >> Uh the the existing building is about 29 ft deep by 60 ft wide. It's a single family housing. We divided it into three
uh three units uh 20 feet wide and we added uh about four and a half to uh to six feet in the back to the rear of the building to accommodate the kitchen
area. And we added a deck to the back of the building on each of the units. Each unit has a basement with recreation and utilities which window out their back. There's no
exterior ex exit or entrance to the basement. And um the uh first floor consists of um an entry porch. We put uh over the existing
basement, we uh recessed an entry porch and and uh we also added is an open plan on the first floor uh with a living room, dining room and kitchen. The dining room
opens out onto a 10x10 deck uh which is a couple of feet above grade. Uh the second floor is uh three bedrooms and a bath. And um the building is 60 feet wide as I
mentioned. And the uh we divided each unit is into the building into three spaces each 20t wide and recessed in order not to have a continuous facade
and to to conform with the intent of the ordinance. We recessed the the porch if we go to uh a 2011. We recessed the porches, divided the
building so that it looks like three the scale down from uh 60 ft wide building to basically a series of uh 10- foot wide elements.
We have the entry with the uh protruding uh gable uh dormer up above and and and each of the units about every 10 ft and is it where one of the units is flipped we have it at 20 ft. So we more than um
achieved the uh requirement for breaking up the facade of the building. to do that also in the back of the building uh where the um where the recesses for this the kitchen and the protrusion of the decks
and the by the way the second floor of the building uh in the front will also protrude out a little bit to give a a so you create a vertical uh element uh of the entry porch with the bedroom and dormer on the top
and um The e exterior will be uh is vinyl be vinyl siding earth tone vinyl siding. The uh porches will have a stone veneer and um and the
uh wood decks in the back are just they'll be enclosed underneath the deck. There would be no storage underneath the deck. sort of answered some of the comments at the same time. >> And Mr. Fifer, just for the record, the
the uh building uh the building dimensions, if you could just put that on the record also. >> Yes. Yeah. The the building the each uh each unit is uh 1,26 square ft. The total area of the
building is u the total uh footprint is um is about 4,000 square feet. 400 square ft. Um um it's the uh
the state uniform construction code exempts a residential building with three or less units in a single building from the uh barrierfree code. We are not required to provide a access to the building. The
units don't not have to be handicapped accessible and the uh parking it does not have to provide we do not have to provide for a u handicap spots in the parking lot.
>> And is there um access from to the basement from the rear of the building? >> No. >> Okay. And the uh the other comment in the uh memorandum from the RRI was comment number 14 which had to do with
the um >> building shall have not more than two dwelling units in line without setbacks or breaks but that's been addressed. Correct. >> Correct. >> Okay. And um also um let's see the uh lighting we uh on the
building we are required to have lighting on the porch at the entrance to the building and also we will have uh a light uh fixture on the back of the building at the um entrance from the uh to the deck from
the uh from the dining room. Uh they there was a question of uh it was suggested maybe we should put steps down from the deck to the grade and we're amendable to that and uh if we have to put an additional fixture nearby
depending on where we put it uh we certainly be a local fixture for the state. >> Thank you Mr. Fifer. Um do you think you've covered all the architectural aspects and your testimony? Is there anything else you want to add? >> I think so.
Um yeah, we covered uh I covered basic everything uh in general all the items that were that was suggested in the report. >> Okay. Very good. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Uh we don't have any further questions, Mr. Feifer, but you or your
board members or professionals might. So, I turn it back to you. >> Okay. Thank you. Uh we'll go to our professionals. Mr. Darcy, >> I don't have any questions for applicants architect. Mr. Yep. Mr. Sant, >> I don't have any questions either. >> Anybody to my right?
>> Just um a quick question on the the basement windows. Are they the back the egress windows or in the back for the basement? >> Are they fully? >> Yes. If if the grade permits, they will be egress windows. Yes. >> Thank you.
>> Okay. Anybody on my left have a question for this witness? Ed, Mr. Feifer, um, on the, uh, elevation, the second page of drawing on the, uh,
west and the east elevations, I see um, three windows. Um, I understand the first floor, but I'm not sure sure about the the horizontal window and then a window above that. Is that a vaulted space or
is that top window in an attic? >> Uh yes, that's just an attic window. It's uh >> light >> just just for light into the into the attic. It's not
>> not an occupied space. And then the horizontal window is a horizontal window about five starting five feet above the tub area to to let light into the bathrooms. >> I see. Thank you. >> Any other questions?
>> Okay. >> Oh, >> I have one. Um, so I'm assuming these are rentals, right? and the property owner would be maintaining the surrounding space um the lawn space and
everything. But at some point if this converts to be a fee simple would you agree that there would be an HOA or a management company that manages it, right? Uh I would presume yes because I think the uh the board and the town
would feel more comfortable with an HOA in place to ensure that the grounds are properly maintained. >> Great. >> So I would say yes the applicant would consent to that. >> I think that should be one of the condition of approvals. >> Okay. Thank you. U going back to my
left. Any further questions? Okay. Uh I'll open up to the public now. Does anybody from the public have a question for this witness? Seeing no hands, I close the public, Mr. Sadillo.
>> Well, is there any more witnesses? >> No. >> Uh, then we just have to open up the public comment, >> right? >> That was just questions. >> Okay. Uh, we'll open it up. Any further questions for either witness >> or or any general comment comments or
testimony with regard to the application? See no hands. I close that portion. >> Okay. Actually, if I could just clarify because is this application for um preliminary only or preliminary and final? >> Preliminary and final. >> It is. Okay. I just know on the agenda
it just said preliminary. So, I wanted to make sure. So, um Mr. Chairman, a a vote in favor of this application would be a vote for uh granting um major preliminary and final subdivision and site plan approval with the requested Z
C variances and design waiverss as been testified to this evening. uh the conditions aside from the standard conditions will be compliance with the uh board professionals report dated November 12th uh which has been also testified to by the applicant as well as
just as just agreed to um by Mr. Swan's comment that if this property is converted from a rental to a fee simple ownership of the individual units then the uh then property owner agrees that they will create a homeowners association for each of the
units to maintain the common areas prior to any transfer of ownership. >> Okay. Do we uh have a motion to move this forward or >> I'll make the motion. >> I'll second.
>> Mr. Diploma. >> Yes. >> Mr. Lennick. >> Yes. >> Mr. Agopian. >> Yes. >> Miss Cannon. >> Yes. >> Mr. Petty. >> Yes. >> Miss Misella. >> Yes. >> Mr. McGisac. >> Yes. Mr. Brennan. >> Yes. >> And Chairman Lowour. >> Yes.
>> Thank you, Mr. Chairman, members of the board. >> Thank you. >> And I want to also thank your board professionals for working with us. We think this was a better redesign with the parking adjacent to the buildings and the access. And uh uh a lot of effort was put into this, but we greatly appreciate your confidence and look
forward to building this out. Thank you. >> Thank you. Good luck. >> Thank you. Right now we'll take a five minute break. Okay, our next application is 65-2024P Hook Mount Associates LLC represented by
Lawrence B. Saxs, Esquire. Good evening. >> Good evening, uh, Mr. chairman, members of the board, board professionals, Lawrence Saxs on behalf of the applicant, uh, Hook Mountain. Um, we're here this evening uh, seeking a preliminary and final major site plan
and bulk variance approval. Uh, I know many of you, I'm sure, are all familiar with this site. This is the site of where the Hampton Inn uh, hotel is located uh, which was approved, I believe, by the zoning board uh, back in
2012. Um and uh property is located um block 2.11 uh block 16001 and it's 300 Spring Valley Road. Um I have several witnesses tonight this
evening. Uh Mr. Chairman, uh my first witness is going to be Mr. Mike Ta uh who is our architect. uh he's going to and it's unusual that I would have the architect go first, but I think it's important in this scenario because I want to give a flavor of the board exactly what we're proposing here. Uh
this is really a modest size building. Uh it is the type of building uh that is only going to o only going to uh accommodate three uses. One of them is a micro brewery, one of them is a restaurant, and then the upstairs is really going to be an event space uh for
uh as a breakout room or for uh rehearsal dinners and things of that nature. Um you you'll realize that the event space is is really not that large. The upstairs is only 4,000 square ft. We'll give you a breakdown by floor plan as to that. So, Mr. Tester will provide
that information. Uh my second witness will be the uh principal of Hook Mountain, uh Mr. Pat Viswathan who is the uh owner of this property, owner of the hotel uh is here in bridge every day and runs that facility and u he'll
demonstrate to you why he needs to have this particular use there. Um if you're familiar with his hotel uh there's really only a breakfast area uh for people to you know who are staying there to eat. uh by building this building uh and hopefully the board approves it. Uh
it'll accommodate restaurant use, bar use uh which really are accessory to most modern hotels. So it's something that is important to him and is lacking uh in this uh facility. So it will really accessorize what's there. Uh my
last two witnesses are uh Laura Totten from Crest Engineering. She is our uh civil engineer. She'll go over the site layout. Uh and my last witness is uh Mr. Scott Kennel from McDunn and Ray Associates and he is our traffic engineer. Uh we do need a parking
variance. He'll provide testimony that uh we certainly can satisfy that parking variance. Uh he's done a number of parking counts and traffic analysis. Uh and because of the interdependence of these two uses on site, uh we think that
it will flow very well and Mr. Canel will uh will put that together. And then finally, I'm going to call Miss Totten back because she's also a professional planner and I'll have her briefly just talk about the two variances that we need. >> Okay, just so you know, u testimony ends
at 10 if we get that far and 10:30 we adjourn. >> We're going to try to be very efficient, Mr. Chairman. >> Good. Thank you. >> Okay, so my first witness is uh Mr. Michael Tester. >> Thank you. Uh, do you swear or affirm the testimony we're going to give this evening is the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth.
>> I do. Can you please state and spell your name for the record? >> My name is Michael Ta. Tea. I am a registered architect of the state of New Jersey in good standing since 1991. Graduate, I'm sorry, since 1996.
Graduate of NGIT School of Architecture 1991. Uh, principal architect of Michael Vest architect since 2002. and I've had the pleasure of testifying in front of this board many times before. >> You're accepted. >> Thank you, sir. >> Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Uh so, Mr. Ta,
I I sort of uh gave a little groundwork of what you're going to testify to. So, if you can uh give the board the benefit of your architectural testimony, elevations, layout, and how everything is going to flow here and what the particular uses are as well. >> Thank you very Thank you very much. What you have in front of on front of the
board right now on the screen is uh two color renderings of the building. Just wanted to start the project off showing you, you know, the the nature of the building. Gives you a sense of the scale and the size. It's nowhere near the size of the the adjacent building. It's uh
it's a uh 9,790 ft building. Each floor is approximately 4,895 square ft with a 500 square ft exterior patio that's covered. Uh the first floor contains, as Mr. Saxon indicated a
microbw area that's about 1715 square feet and a restaurant area that's about 234 square ft that also has a entrance lobby that would be direct access with an elevator to the second floor. The entire building will be fully handicap
compliant. The front entrances of the building all be handicap accessible and that that includes the entrance to the second floor which would be access to the elevator. The remaining exits around the building by code do not require ADA compliance. We have doors leading out
for egress purposes that do satisfy the code. There is a ramp at the back of the micro brewery that is uh purely for a service ramp so they can wheel uh the ingredients for the micro brewery up and back and forth and not having to lift them up stairs and carry them in that way. Um if you would please sir if you
can go to the floor plans and I'll just briefly >> before we do that the what we're looking at now just for record keeping purposes. Is that something that's already been provided as part of our packet or is that the that color rendering is that new that we need to mark it as? >> Well, it wasn't with your your um computer uh person to I'm going to say
it's new. >> Okay. So, we'll just just for record keeping purposes that's going to be marked as exhibit A. >> Uh excuse me, exhibit A1. >> Uh and that is the color renderings of the uh side of the building. >> Great. Thank you. I have a little red pointer here for the the screen and I'm
pointing to my left on the side here. So the top of the screen is the front elevation facing Spring Street. This side here is facing the Hampton Inn. As you can see here, we have two little two columns with an entrance portico that would be direct access for the hotel to
come into this lobby and into the elevator that would take you to the second floor. The space in the middle here is your micro brew. We just gave a generic layout of some tables, small uh bar area, and a dispensing area of the microbw. And the back area here is
really your your production area. So you have an o uh doors here, the ramp coming in to get access into the uh the back area for the manufacturing of the micro brew. The two small spaces here is a utility room and a sprinkler riser room.
And then off to the right hand side, this is your restaurant area. That's 2300 square ft. As you can see, 50% of it is is really dining and uh dining area and patron area. back of the house is food prep. You know, the area is large enough because we're going to have to put a freezer cooler inside the
building. So, even though it looks large, it's really not that large. And it will service the outdoor uh patio that I indicated is about 500 square ft. You have these rectangular spaces here and here. These are the two means of egress required for the second floor. And again, your entrance lobby to the
second floor where we have our event space. Just scroll down. Thank you, sir. Just to give you a point of reference, here's that elevator. You come out on the other side of the elevator into a lobby space. This common area consists of a multimate occupant toilet rooms for
men and women. And then this is your event space. And you can see it's a little less than 50% of the floor area, which is 1,774 square ft of area. We have two bridal suites. A bridal suite one is 745 square
feet. Bridal suite number two is 1 And I'm sorry, I don't want to mess them up. The second bridal suite is 431 square ft. We have a small little prep area, staging area for the event space. Uh they could either we have a dumb waiter in case they want to make the
food in a restaurant downstairs, send it up to serve um whoseever like coffee and donuts or whatever's going on in this space as part of the event. Or they could bring in food, set up sandwiches, and then bring it out when the event takes a break. I mean, this could be like a a corporate event where you have
people coming in from different areas, staying at the hotel, having an event, a meeting here of serving some food, going back to the meeting, and then going back to their hotel to leave. So, the second floor is very simple. We just have some storage spaces in this area. And again, your two egress stairs out of the second
floor. We go back to the color renderings. I'll do that instead of the uh building elevations. And as you can see, this is the oop, sorry. The elevation on the left is the front facade facing Spring Street. It's a
two-story building. As we indicated, fully sprinklered, non-combustible building. So, the height of the building to the top of the roof itself, the roof surface is 37 feet 10 in plus or minus. You have a standard parapit that's in the middle that's consistent on all four
sides. That standard parapit is 39 ft. And then these tower elements are 42 feet 6 in above grade at these points. Again, the architecture is very similar, almost identical to the adjacent building, trying to tie the two buildings architecturally. The use of
the different windows gives it a little more of a modern flare, but still in keeping with the architecture of the adjacent building. All the rooftop equipment will be screened and not visible from ground and everything will drain into the underground system designed by Miss Totten and Crest
Engineering. That would conclude my presentation. All right, Mr. Tessa, just a couple questions and Mr. Holan, if you can go back to the second floor floor plan just for a second. Thank you. All right, so Mr. Ta, the the event space that we're
talking about would be to the top of the screen right here. >> And that's roughly 1,700 square feet. >> Yes, sir. 1715. >> Now, we've labeled two bridal suites there. Um, >> this one here, >> right, >> and this one here. >> All right. And those could also be utilized as day rooms as well for
meetings. Is that correct? >> Correct. >> All right. And in terms of weddings, I mean, I don't think we're going to have be performing any weddings in a 1700 square foot area, but certainly if there is a wedding party staying at the hotel, they would have use of that bridal suite. Is that correct? >> Correct.
>> Okay. Uh, and in that event space of 1,700 square foot, uh, if we needed to, uh, put partitions in there to break it down, is that a possibility as well? >> We could split it this way. We just need access to the toilet rooms, but yes, it could be subdivided. Okay. >> To make that work.
>> All right. Um, Mr. Test, anything else you want to add? >> Um, other than the ADA access and compliancy, I think that concludes my testimony. >> Okay. Mr. Mr. Chairman, I don't have any further questions of Mr. Tester certainly is available for questioning.
>> Thank you. Um, Vina, go ahead. >> So, I'm a little confused. The uh event space is solely for the guest of the hotel, right? >> I mean, it could be rented out to the
public if uh if they needed to have space. they want. >> That's that's the clarification I wanted because you're asking for a parking variance. If I >> if this space is going to be open to public, then that should be included in
the parking calculations as well. So the parking variance that you're asking for would be much higher than what it is shown in this uh or shown on your uh plans or in this memo because I remember
when I met with PAD almost two two and a half years ago uh that was one of the concerns that I had that is this going to be uh PAD sites are these going to be open to general public and my uh
understanding was that it was an accessory building that was solely meant for the hotel. But when I see um brewery, I see a restaurant, I see a different use that has come in.
And I just want to remind the board EDO3 or our ordinance allows multiple non-residential uses on a site, but I just want to understand how it impacts the traffic. Uh and also I was thinking
as this is one project with an accessory building added but it changes the flavor of it. >> Let let me respond. All right. Um it will and maybe I spoke out of turn. I don't honestly think this will be utilized by the general public. It's a
1700 square foot area which is probably half the size of this room. So I don't perceive that the general public will be utilizing it. Uh it will be utilized by guests of the hotel organizations that may be staying at the hotel. Um, in
terms of the restaurant and micro brewery, again, yes, there could be somebody from the general public who could come to this site, but we have obviously our traffic engineer who testify as to the parking counts that were performed. But again, I would anticipate that most of the patrons who
are going to this micro brewery or to the restaurant would be patrons of the hotel. Right now, we don't have any of those facilities within the hotel. And I think as all board members can recognize, most hotels do have separate restaurants, do have a bar, for lack of
a better term, and they are somewhat modestized as well. But I'm going to have Mr. Visathon testify as to what these potential uses would be. So first in terms of the uh second floor space right would you guys would the applicant
be uh would it would you agree that as a condition of approval it would be restricted to the hotel use and I say that only because you're asking for a parking variance right >> and then the other thing and I
understand Mike what you were trying to do in terms of architecture But when I look at it, it looks like an excessive rebuilding to the hotel. How would you market the brewery or the restaurant? The the base of it is not a typical restaurant type of architecture. I would
if it's a brewery, I would want to see more glass and more openness. So that's why I got a little confused as to, you know, what exactly is the purpose? And if it is truly, I would let the board decide whether they how they pursue the
restaurant. But I would see I would want to see something different architecturally on the ground floor at least if it's going to be retail like restaurant uses. >> Okay. So to answer the first question about limitation to the general public we would agree to that it will be it'll
be utilized by hotel guests only. Um and Mr. Tesa as to any other architectural treatments that we could uh employ based on Miss Sant's comment. Could we do that? Yeah, and we've we've worked in with you in the past for the architecture of the building on other projects and that's something we'd be willing to do to satisfy the
>> and I do understand what you were trying to achieve. Like you wanted the building to look as a continuation of the hotel. I get it. But if you're trying to propose a restaurant, a you're disadvantaged to some extent because it's not a typical site where you have access from the highway. So you're
coming from uh Spring Valley, but at the same time I would want to see a different architectural style then so that a passerby unless the restaurant is very famous and it becomes like a destination place um you would want at least uh it to have an inviting uh
facade an openness. >> Mr. Chairman, we'll work with your staff as to the architectural treatments. >> Okay. Thank you. Um Mr. Dari, >> I think Vina covered it. >> Okay, Mr. department. >> I'm the only one.
>> I know. >> Uh looking at the architect, um where is the signage for the proposed roof pub? Because I don't see it represented. >> We don't have signage indicated on the building. It's whatever signage we do install will be in accordance with the signage ordinance. They'll be over each
of the entrances to the individual spaces. You have the restaurant, you have the um micro brew, and then you have an entrance lobby to the second floor event space. Okay. No, because typically when when we're reviewing the architecturals, there's always at least some
representation of the signage and I don't see it. And is are there I guess this that's for the site plan. Just wondering if there's going to be additional signage out um on Spring Valley as well for >> is there.
>> Yeah. And I'll have my engineer testify to that. We could add signage to the the facade when we modify it based on Venus. >> Yeah. Just um yeah, we typically at least have some level of representation to see what it looks like to make sure that it fits the surrounding um developments
and the brew hub itself. Um that's that's a general public, right? It's it's going to be open to the public. So I I would say what with Vener I would think we need to look at the
parking variance because I think when you hear brew pub I think it get things like that could potentially get extremely crowded and that that parking lot is not huge to begin with. I've been to a number of events where we have an HOA meetings or stuff like that where it fills up. I think we have to look at
what the the parking potential could be. >> Mr. Mr. Chairman, I do I do have a question. There was a comment on our memo regarding the liquor license and everything. It would the applicant be the one testifying to that, Mr. Chair? >> Okay. Any questions to my left?
>> Be on Spring Valley Road where the hotel is. >> The entrance way to the drive entrance way or the building. The drive entrance way will stay the same. I'll let the site engineer testify to that. Okay. Thank you. Uh, anyone else? Ed, go
ahead. On the second floor space that will be uh a space that will be for, as you said, u area of meetings and things of that nature. So the uh is that considered um
unconentrated um load area with tables and chairs? >> Loose table loose tables and chairs. >> Okay. So we figuring it's about whatund 100 people 15 people. >> Typically it's divided by 15 square feet for loose tables and chairs.
>> So it's about it's about 116 people then >> potentially. But this again we're we're setting this up as far as a um a breakout area. I don't know if we're we're not having weddings where we're packing tables of 10 in there. It's going to be more of row seating where somebody would be displaying and having
discussion with a deis up front. That's the intention of the space, but they could have tables in there where we are sitting round table discussions with your team members. It's a multi-purpose space that could be used and but yes, you're correct. It is unconentrated and the calculation is 15
square feet per per area. So you take that area, divide it by 15, that give you your maximum occupancy load. And that's how we designed the bathroom facilities on the second floor. It looks like we have multiple ba toilets, a lot of bathrooms, but it would satisfy all the people that would be on that second
floor, let's see. And the uh restaurant area on the first floor, would that be expected the be used by the bar? Uh the brewery also? >> They're two separate entities, >> so it's two separate business. There is
a possibility that the brewery would facilitate some people in a restaurant also. You could bring into that space. >> Well, no, they are two separate uses. So, I'm assuming the the bar may serve some bar food. The restaurant will be more of a restaurant.
>> So, it's two separate entities and they you won't intermingle >> uh alcohol into the into that restaurant >> unless they get a liquor license. But, uh they would have to have their own liquor license for that. But you don't have someone for that space at this point. >> We have no tenants for either space at
the at this point in time. Obviously, you know, that's something that will happen after the fact. >> Oh, I I thought that the micro brewery was a was an intended space. So, it's it may not be a brewery then. >> It potentially could be a bar. Uh but right now, we don't have any particular
tenants. It may also be operated by Mr. Visathon, who is, you know, the owner of the property. >> I'm going to have him testify as to that. >> I see. Okay. Thank you. >> Okay. Does anyone else have a question?
Okay, I'll open it up to the public now. Anyone from the public like to question this witness? See no hands. I'll close the public. Thank you. Thank you, sir. >> Thank you, >> Mr. Chairman. My next witness will be uh
Mr. Bisuan, who is the owner of the property. >> Yes. Thank you. Do you swear or affirm the testimony you're going to give this evening? Is the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? >> Yes, I do. >> Can you please state your name and spell it for the record? >> Mr. Nathan. >> B I S W A N A P H A N. First name is
Pat. >> All right. Mr. Biswinathon, if you can uh confirm a couple things for me. First of all, you are the owner of this property. Is that correct? >> Yes, sir. >> All right. And you actually built the hotel. >> Yes, I did. And you received an approval from the zoning board back in 2012 >> and planning board.
>> And planning board. Okay. All right. Um, if you can give the board a little flavor of what's on the site right now in terms of the hotel, how many rooms are there? Uh, what other amenities are in the hotel? >> The hotel is Hampton Inn by Hilton. It's about 100 rooms right now. And, um, it's
been in operation for the past three years. And um thanks to the board, thanks to the council people um the ratables on this property is ex extremely high and great amount of
revenue coming to the township because of this project. Now um as far as this property is concerned, this is strictly a 100 room property. There is no restaurant in the hotel. We have a breakfast area that we accommodate for free breakfast for the for the guest
that stays in the hotel. And uh we have no conference room. Uh we have no um boardroom to speak of. What we did is we converted this one room and used that as as people that wants to come and do some
meetings and you know get togethers and uh after you know after uh the event they want to get together in that room or if they want some food they can get some food. Um we have uh tons of people
that does we did last year in the last couple of years we we did about 40 weddings in the hotel. The parties the wedding parties but they never had a wedding in the hotel but they go to marquee or some other they do but they
stay at the hotel. bar mitzvah. We probably did about 20 25 bar mitzvah, birthday parties, um sporting events. Um for example, last weekend we had uh 30
uh kids doing sports events. So we do a lot of sport events almost every week. um weekends uh we do a lot of sporting events and um those days we were full and a lot of kids running around at the hotel.
They have no place to hang out and they have no place to have beers and parents complain that hey you know we got a beautiful place but we got no place to congregate. the kids can't hang out and so we need a place. We got to go outside to drink and we don't like people
drinking outside. So, it's about time that I find a place to build for accommodate those kind of events. I don't see I know I'm I'm jumping the gun here. I don't see this event space that that we are proposing is going to be
used by public. The reason is we are so busy with within our own needs that we need a space for these people to congregate. And that is the main reason I want to build this. If I have to um um
say that I'm not going to have outside people, I'd be happy to do that. >> Okay. Yeah. I mean because that's that's a obviously a suggestion made by the professional staff. So, you will commit that the uh the second floor of this uh facility that's being proposed will only be utilized by your hotel guests?
>> Absolutely. Okay. >> I have I I'll be full. >> All right. All right. And you said before that you have wedding parties, bar mitzvah parties, sporting events. You don't have the events occurring at the hotel. These are people staying here. >> Exactly.
>> And then traveling to a catering facility offsite, right? >> A synagogue offsite. uh or sporting event off site. Okay. >> Not not only that I can talk about we did about um last year alone 40 funerals
people come down for funerals and they stay at the hotel 10 15 people. Church events they come and stay at the hotel. They all want to get together after the their event and they want to have a place to eat. They want to have get
pizza from outside. They want to get beer from outside. Although we have a liquor license lately, we just got it a couple months ago and they buy the beer from us or they can bring it from outside and drink it. >> All right. So, you do have a liquor license. That was a question I think Mr.
Dar had. >> We have a full We do have a full full liquor license. >> We are entitled to get a full liquor. >> I know you're familiar with your testimony. My question was really regarding the fact that you have two separate facilities. Does the one liquor license cover both facilities? And I
know there are special micro the brewery licenses and all that. So that's kind of what the testimony I I was hoping. >> The brew pub needs a separate license from the state of New Jersey. Right. >> But as far as the C license that I have that I could use it in the hotel in the people wants to have it in the
restaurant or up in the event space, they can bring their own. >> They could drink it. I'm allowed to do that as far as I'm concerned. Jason Mandier is my consultant for the liquor license. That's what he told me. as far as the brew pub license. It's a separate
license. Nothing to do with the with the local body, but it's got to be done through state of New Jersey. >> All right. Let me ask you a few more questions about the second floor. Now, um there is no kitchen up there, correct? >> Absolutely. So, anybody who is going to
be utilizing that space will have to bring their own food in. Correct. And it >> or cater it from outside. All right. Um, this is not going to be a banquet facility upstairs. >> Absolutely not. >> All right. And uh, >> this is not big enough to have a banquet or conference centers. The conference
center that that I see there is is >> All right. It's a 1700 square foot area that's going to be utilized. All right. And in terms of the labeling of a bridal suite, you stated that you do do a lot of wedding uovers in your hotel. Exactly. >> All right. Let Well, let me ask you the
question, Pat. So essentially then the bridal suite that you're proposing or the two bridal suites uh would be utilized by a wedding party who would then have their wedding offsite. >> Correct. >> Okay. >> Correct. What may I embellish on that a little bit? What happens is we do like I
said 30 40 weddings a year and um they want to have a bridal suite. We don't have a bridal suite at the hotel. The hotel is just a hotel is a limited service hotel by Hilton. Um they wanted a bridal suite. So, we I figured this is probably the best idea to put the bridal
suite there. If they want to use it, they're welcome to use it. >> All right. And in terms of your present operations at the hotel with deliveries, um can you give the board the some testimony as to what type of deliveries you get? Uh how often they occur? Let's
talk about food. How often does that get delivered to the hotel? >> Food gets delivered once a week, every every Thursday. They usually it's usually Cisco Food is our supplier. US Those are the food suppliers. They usually come uh somewhere about 4 5:00
in the morning and they deliver it right to the kitchen area and and they're gone. They they usually a box truck deliveries and um that's that's the only food once a week is the food delivery. And then we have guest supplies or um room supplies
like linens and shampoo and and soaps they do uh twice a month. >> Okay. And how about trash? How often is trash picked up? >> Trash waste management comes and picks it up twice uh twice a week. Six yards container in a separate enclosure we
have and they come around 4 5:00 in the morning uh twice a week. >> All right. Now, for the new proposed building, what type of deliveries will you have? >> We'll probably have uh pretty much the same. I would say u Cisco or some other
vendor um probably once a week and um deliver the food um I'm hoping and then the trash I would say the waste management probably do the same trash. >> Okay. And you'll have a separate container on that property.
>> Okay. Um Mr. Chairman, I don't have any further questions of this witness. Certainly he's available for any >> Okay. Thank you. to my right. Uh >> well, the only question I have is Pat, the the liquor license that you have, it
wouldn't be the lower level wouldn't be utilizing that. You would just be using the consumption part should folks want to utilize the second floor. >> Exactly. >> Any any bar andor restaurant, brew pub or anything would be >> separate and distinct and independent
from from the hotel itself. >> Correct. >> Correct. Two reasons. liability also. >> Okay. And the the only other thing and I I was talking with Peter um about and it doesn't seem because I don't know if
hindering you or any business from bringing in an outside, you know, entity to utilize that space. But if there's a way to find the parking to utilize that space, I don't know if anyone up here would have issue with
like for instance All-American Ford wanting to utilize it for a larger, you know, space like that. They because they don't have it for whatever reason. Um, so I just want to see if we can look I guess when the when we look at the site plans we could talk to see if there is
additional space for parking because if we can get the parking I don't think that we should hinder you from allowing an outside you know group come in or a company that wants to just have a one day offsite right especially you know there's a fair number of financial
services firm up and down Route 9 that may not have the conference space for independent reps or whatever that where a lot of people are working remotely and not necessarily an office. So, a lot of offices have downsides. >> May I embellish on that for a minute? I have many companies, for example,
Chick-fil-A. Chick-fil-A comes to me and says, "Hey, you know what? I I have 20 people that I'm training and I need a space. Can you give me I I'm going to have all these 20 people come in and stay at your hotel and I need a space for for us to train these guys. I need I need a space for one week. Can you
provide?" Right now, I couldn't. What I do is I combine two rooms together and accommodate them. This way I I don't lose business. >> Those kind of opportunities I don't want to miss if I could uh if it's possible. And uh these are corporate clients and
uh just like Ford wanted to come and do their interviews and and training. >> So uh if I could accommodate them, I would. But it's not for that's not what I call as a public. I can't have somebody come there and say say you know
I want to use this room for for bar mitzu 100 people 200 people that's what I would restrict because I cannot accommodate that I don't have a parking space. Okay. >> But if when a corporate entity comes to me and says I'm going to give you 10 rooms. I'm going they're going to stay
there for a week. I need space for them to train. Can you provide that? I have to accommodate that because they're staying at the hotel. Okay. >> Uh, anybody to my left have a question for Mr. Nathan, the owner? >> Not so much a question, but just to
elaborate on what Mr. Palama said. Um, I've noticed over the last couple years a lot of companies, you know, or applicants come to the board and say, >> I have a small space. I have nine employees and, you know, five work remotely. So, they don't need a large building. So that's, you know, they're
they're able to uh get their buildings uh built and complete in Old Bridge. But now, if they do have to have a meeting where everybody comes together, a room like this would actually work for them. So, you know, like to Mr. Deama's point, if we could make it work for everybody
where the applicant could have this room that's utilized for that use, I don't I wouldn't want to restrict them on it either. I think that would that would >> yeah we have to make sure the the parking works >> and you know you're going to our our expert our traffic expert will testify
you know he'll he did actual obviously the one benefit we have is the hotel has been in existence for a long time so we he did counts during the weekend during the weekday and so we have a good accurate picture on that so >> okay >> you know that that's basically all I have >> okay thank you uh any other questions
from Nathan >> I I think the parking is going to be uh vital over here Because you are going to have a micro brewery that is going to bring outside people in. You are going to have a restaurant that's going to bring outside people in. You know, when
the traffic is going to be, it's not just minimal. You're going to have traffic all over the place on Spring Valley Road. As far as the upper, I have no issues with that. It's just the micro brewery is going to bring a lot of people into that place. So, if Michael
Brewery and the restaurant is going to be hopping, you're going to need the parking spot. I think that's that's what I'm looking at right now. Upstairs, I have no issues. >> Yeah. Uh, >> go ahead. >> You mentioned you have a group C liquor license,
>> I think. So, >> and that is what a bring your own. >> No. Uh, I think maybe my uh >> C license. Uh, it's it's it's a C license that that means I could I could sell I
could serve or they could bring their own and that I think that's >> so that covers all of that. >> Covers everything. Okay. >> I was just unclear about that when you said they can bring their own. Usually that's >> like bring your own and then that's it.
But you have a triple. You can serve. bring their own, but they can if I don't have that that license. They can bring their own. Nobody can stop anybody from bringing a six-ack of beer into the hotel. They could go to the room and drink it, but I
wouldn't let them drink it in the hallway. I wouldn't let them drink it in the public space of the hotel simply because it's liability issue and also violation of the ABC rules. So now that I have that license, they can bring, I can sell, they can drink in the public
area as long as they're not being belligerent about it. Um, so my license covers all of that right now. >> Okay. Yeah. And then that would be two more liquor licenses going into that >> in addition to what I have. Yes.
>> Separate from you. Okay. Thank you, >> Chairman. >> Mr. Petty. We don't have We don't You don't have a tenant yet though, correct? For either space. >> Correct. >> Have you >> I have lots of inquiries. Um
some they want me to put the brewery equipment. They want to rent it or lease it. Some they wanted to bring their own and bring their own brew master and brew it. I have lots of inquiries for it. And on the restaurant site, I have lot lots
of inquiries for barbecue. >> Okay. >> So, uh they they all think that the brew and the barbecue would go handinand glove. So, that's where I end. >> I think it's a good idea. Good luck. >> Thank you.
>> Okay. Any other questions? Barb, >> I'm glad to hear things are really going well. >> Thank you. >> And um I just think like a lot of it's going to depend on the parking how you're going to make that all work. Um but I think you know it it certainly has
merit and serves it would serve a need. You know expand your um >> if I may take a minute of your time. I just wanted to let you know before this project got on board, I was paying $30,000 for that empty lot.
Today, I'm paying over $150,000 a year on on that property, real estate tax. In terms of occupancy tax, I am paying over $300,000 a year. $300,000 a year in occupancy tax.
Okay. Sales tax. Okay. six and 6.75%. Close to $200,000 of sales tax. City gets part of that occupancy tax. City gets 5% and township gets 5% and then the other 4% or whatever is shared by
the state and the city. Ton of money coming into the into the city because of this project thanks to the board and and the council and the mayor. >> Okay. Thank you. Um, Ed, did you have a question? Oh, Vina
>> chairman. Um, I think we should hold off from committing to not opening the conference base because I think I have a solution. I'll hold off. >> Yeah, I I I want to hold off for your
engineer, but I think there is a solution to it. >> Thank you. >> So, let's u >> I know you have an idea. >> Thank you. Okay, we're done over here. Any We'll open up
to the public for any questions for the owner. >> I'm in support of my name. >> No, I need it. >> Name is Kiran Desai, resident of this township from 45 years.
As you all know that this township this is the first hotel we have. We never even had a regular motel. This is a Hilton brand hotel and you all travel as well as I
and we stayed in a facility outside day or two day or three day and we like to eat in the same place in lunch and dinner. I have never seen any hotel without the
food establishment. So by bringing this food establishment next to the hotel this will bring more business to the township. More small company will come
and their representative will stay at the hotel and go to the restaurant for a food and at the bar for a drink. One other thing I would say this will also bring some jobs for the local
people because food establishment need the people to serve the food, cook the food, clean the facility and bar also need. So I personally request to all of you look
the benefit what we are getting. It's not that detrimental because this facility in kind of a triangle on one side is major highway route 18 other side is a small road springill and big
Ford dealership and one side is route 9. So there is no detrimental to the neighborhood. So when you look the benefits coming out from this facility I think it
has the right to get approval. I personally request all of you I saw the comment from Miss Savan our planner about traffic. >> Mr. Desai could I interrupt you for a
minute? Sure. At this point, uh, you can hold your comments to the to the end, but right now, we just would like questions of the of the >> No, I just wanted to just make a comment. I have no question because I hear everything and I'm satisfied with this. >> I understand.
>> Thank you. Thank you. >> Thank you. >> He's not my uncle. >> U would like to ask a question like Jeopardy questions. Seeing no hands, I close that portion.
>> Okay. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I have uh I'll bring up my engineer now, Miss Laura. >> 10 o'clock, right? Hi. Do you swear or affirm the testimony you're going to give this evening is the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth? >> I do. >> Would you please state and spell your name for the record?
>> Yes. Laura Taten, L O R A L I T is in Tom, O Ten, Crest Engineering Associates, Inc., Mstone Township, New Jersey. I am a principal there. uh been working there for 31 or two years. Graduated from
Lehigh University in 1977. Um my PE license from 1983 and is still in good standing. My professional engineer uh sorry planning license 1986 and it is in good standing and I
appeared before this board before. >> Thank you. >> Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you, Miss Totten. Um, so Miss Tatton, if you could give the board an overview of what's being proposed from a site uh improvement standpoint with respect to
this proposed building. >> Yes. Just get my notes out quickly. I too have a laser and I would go to my left, your right. Um, so we have two exhibits to mark into
evidence. Uh this first exhibit is entitled uh aerial display. It I can't see the date from here, but it's probably today or yesterday. The date's down in the lower right hand corner. Yeah, there. I still can't read it.
Sorry, that's part of being 70. >> November 11th, it looks >> Thank you. Okay, so um actually my thunder has been stolen. I just want to do this. Okay. So, as you can see, the site is outlined
in yellow. Route 18 is to the rear of the property. There is a contractor's yard in this location to the right of the property. The Spring Valley Road is obviously the access point to the top or
north of the property. And surrounding it, as was already noted, is the American Ford car dealerships. Uh and then nine of course is off to the left side of the property. Um and you can see the existing hotel with its parking uh
detention basins. I'd like to point out that this area in the middle right here is um was a wetlands. There was a permit obtained to fill it. It has been filled already. um a tree removal permit was
obtained I believe in around 2010 because we assisted with that process. There is a um conservation easement around this tree area right here uh to the right of the property which is to be conserved and um I I believe the request
was to put some signs around it since now it'll be closer to a usable part of the site. Uh so we would be pleased to do that. So, that gives you an idea of what this looks like, although I'm sure you all know anyway. And maybe we can go on to the next exhibit. Thank you very
much. Okay, this this ne next exhibit is a rendering of the landscape plan and it is also dated November 11th of this year. Just just for record, I I don't think I said it that this the first exhibit will be
marked as exhibit A2. This will be exhibit A3. >> I hope it's going to come up. >> Counting on Mr. >> We saw it. Um, in any event, the um project
is uh the building as described by the architect uh 9,000 790 square ft on two floors. It is located adjacent to the parking area that extended off to the left of the
existing hotel backs up to that. Um couple of those spaces are being utilized for deliveries. Ah here we are. Perfect. Okay. Uh so as I was saying, the proposed facility is located off the
extension of the parking lot to the uh south of the uh main facility. And this demonstrates really that it is a relatively small compared to the hotel itself. Um and then in front of it to the north of it is the parking lot.
There is a connection proposed in between the two parking lots uh uh in this location to the north of the new parking lot plus a new access off of uh Spring Valley Road with an in and out.
Um we have 160 parking spaces proposed with eight of them being EV and I forget how many handicap spaces. I'm sorry. Uh, but adequate number of handicap spaces with an aisle coming down to the main
entrance. There's sidewalks around the facility. There's, as was testified to before, there is an area for a patio that is uh surrounded by landscaping um as well. And there is access to those
various different service doors at the rear of the site. Um, as was noted, one of the doors seems to go out into the shrubbery. That will be corrected should you grant approval. There is an access from the hotel as was uh mentioned under
a a a covered entrance in the location on the west side. And it was suggested that we add a crosswalk over to the hotel in this area to uh keep people safe. And that makes a lot of sense to me. Um, let's see. What else can I tell
you about the layout? Well, it's a a circular layout. These white lines that you see here are the fire lines. And of course, we will go to the fire department um to get their approval and adjust any of the fire lines as they see
fit, providing adequate signage as well. uh with with regard to the layout, there were a few comments in the engineering review about additional signs and so on and we would propose to work with the uh engineer to come up with the best
possible solution to the signage. Um, there is one spot located near the entrance that if you were coming from the new facility into the old facility, you would not be able to get into that unless you went past it and backed in or
went around and came back. But that's one spot and we don't think that that is a de detriment to this layout. Um we we do have a couple of places where we have less than five foot radi there. Most of
these I believe we can make a little bit larger. The one that's up by this parking space I don't believe we can due to keeping the driveway access outside of the turnaround area. So we would
request a design waiver from that particular area. Uh it's a 4 foot radius. Um there are some other comments about the layout that I think are cleanup comments and I would be like I said very happy to work with your engineering and planning staff to work
them out. Um so with regard to the let's see what else would I like to tell you? Obviously there is ex existing water and sewer. There's a sewer line in the easement that runs across the front of the property. There's water connections.
the hotel has them water line out in the area. So, we're proposing to connect to the sewer line with a lateral and the water line goes off in this direction uh to get to its connection and of course
there's also electrical connections and uh telecommunications and all of those are available. Uh there I there's no flood planes on this site. I talked about the wetlands already. Um, let's see. Just making sure
I hit all the hot spots here. There was not proposed to have a new dumpster. There is an existing dumpster enclosure facility as was testified to by the owner. The uh method of the trash truck getting there is not going to change. It
works now and it will continue to work. And uh if for some reason the trash and recycling's a little bit higher because of the additional facility, then there's always a possibility of having it picked up more frequently. Since it's only
picked up twice a week now, another pickup could be provided that would adequately address this facility uh proposed facility. Um let's see. Okay, there ward to lighting which this plan doesn't show but the area of uh your
ordinance requires a minimum of 0.1 foot candles sorry 1.0 0 foot candles. The low area is along the uh part that is adjacent to the facility. We did not take into account in our new design. Our
new design only shows the new lights. So, there are some fixtures located along the existing edge, and we believe that those fixtures in conjunction with what we're proposing will provide adequate light in this area along the uh
edge adjacent to the hotel where the new lights only provide uh less than 1.0. And in one spot, right in this location, it's down to 04. But there's an existing light that's going to be located in that same area. So I believe that we will
have adequate light. >> So we we will not need a design waiver then for the lighting. >> I I no because when you add in the existing light to the proposed light, I think the minimum will be met. Um with regard to landscaping, as you can see
from our nice colored rendering, we have uh red and green trees. Isn't that nice? No, they represent different varieties and types of trees. Uh green um probably some evergreens in here. Uh shrubs along
the edge of the building uh and so on. And uh it was reviewed by your conservation office, sir, who had no comments with regard to the landscaping. your board consultant had some suggestions with regard to uh not
location or anything but maybe some different species in a couple of locations. We would be very happy to work with your board landscape architect to uh come up with a plan that's acceptable as part of resolution approval should you grant approval for
this project. Um so I know that uh a lot of tra Oh, I didn't talk about storm water. Oo, sorry. >> I was going to tell you that we talk about storm waters. >> Do you mind going I think it's sheet four of the plan set.
>> That would be fabulous. So while he's bringing up the the uh plan, the storm water management is totally independent, excuse me, of the storm water management that was approved
for the facility. So it there are there's a there is a line right here that demarks two types of porest pavement. It just has to do with the depth. But almost this entire area is going to be porous pavement which will
allow the water to fall down through the pavement providing water quality for the project. There is a little bit of regular standard pavement in this area in the entrance drive which we can't get into this forest pavement area and the
storage stone storage below it. Uh so we have a trench drain across the entrance and it goes to a it is a green water quality structure because it in entails the use of soil. It's called an aquaponic and it is connected in this
area and then it will tie into the this proposed storm water. The proposed storm water system altogether connects into an existing storm sewer uh located across the front of the property that services the property itself at a manhole in this
location. So we're providing water quality via uh all the porest pavement and the aquaponics we're providing. So that's quality. Number two is quantity. We have storage within the stone below with an with outlet structures that
control that uh to reduce the peak rates of runoff to uh uh 50% for the two-year 75% for the 10year and 80% of um existing for the
um sorry 100year both for the current uh rainfalls and for the future rainfalls that are required by the NJ DP. Um with regard to um groundwater recharge which there this site we did six test pits
throughout the area of the the uh pvious pavement and the the permeability was very low for the soils. uh classified it as D soils which are not that permeable and therefore
under existing conditions do not infiltrate much water and according to the groundwater the storm water management rules uh we don't need to provide groundwater recharge. So although I do have to say the opportunity is there because it's a
stone system that's going to be with filter fabric that's that is permeable underneath it. So if it can infiltrate it will. Uh so that's basically oh and the fourth item is uh uh to the
requirements besides the green aspect which is the pvious pavement is uh soil erosion sediment control and it is designed to meet the so uh meet the soil erosion sediment control
standards um along with a couple of other permits that I'll go over very briefly. we would submit for all of these should you grant approval uh for this particular project. Um which brings me to I believe the other approvals. So
um Middle Sex County Planning Board, Oldbridge MUA, soil erosion sediment control and the fire department approval are all required and we would submit and work with those agencies for those approvals. One that was mentioned is the
NJ dot and I believe that Mr. Kennel will be able to back me up on this. Uh the back of the property back here does abut the route uh 18 rightway. However, it's a no access point. So I don't we do
not need a DOT permit for this. This property fronts on a local street. And I think I covered all my points. >> All right. Let me uh just a couple things in the uh review letter from uh Mr. Dargy dated November 12th. Uh let me just go over a few things here. Uh one
of the uh comments is uh extending the sidewalk to the property line. Um can you show on the plan where that would be? And I'll I'll defer to the board on that one, Mr. Chairman, and to Mr. Darie. >> So the we don't go quite to the property
line on either end. And um we designed this plan a while ago. I don't remember the reasons why. If we can extend extend it to the property line, we will. If there's some uh physical constraint, I would like to discuss that with your
board. But if possible, we would extend it to the ends. >> That's that's acceptable to me uh Mr. Chairman that we would work with the applicant and if it's physically possible to to extend the sidewalk, that's what we would want to do.
>> Okay. Um all right and um on one of the comments also is about the rear door that a side concrete sidewalk should be extended to include a walkway for this for the exit. >> Yes, that's correct. Somehow we missed providing a uh a uh concrete pad for the
exit on the door that's in the location on the I guess that's the uh back eastern side of the building. >> Okay. So, we would have to relocate those shrubberies and put a little sidewalk there. >> All right. And um
there's a recommendation uh that fencing be provided at top the retaining wall as the height of the wall is 4 feet in certain places. We can comply with that. >> Yes. >> Okay. And I think you may have covered everything else. I know Mr. Vispathon is probably
going to tell me why we can or cannot extend the uh the sidewalk. Just give me one second. I just got the answer to the sidewalk issue that we may have to address with Mr. Dargy. Uh there should there may be some D constraints with extending it out
that far. We'll uh we'll work with you on that. >> Okay, we can do that. >> Okay. Um okay, Miss Tatton, I don't think I have anything else of you. Certainly the board may have some questions and I will call you up at the conclusion to just give me five minutes
of planning testimony. Thank you. >> You're welcome. >> Okay. >> Thank you. Um let's go to our professionals. Mr. Darcy, >> I I do have one quick question. Um just a clarification on the plan you
have along Spring Valley Road. It says new property line reference. Is that is that a dedication from the past application or is that so there's no >> that was never that was never made. >> Okay. So you're doing that as part of this application then? Yes. The dedication. Okay.
>> So as part of the again should the board act favorably, we would have to have the deed of um the meets and bounds descriptions and everything for the dedication submitted for review. I I I recollect talking about the roadway dedication when we had a
pre-application meeting almost. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> We just need a copy of the >> and then we can just label it that way on the plan. >> So here's what I was thinking. Since the parking variance is being sought and
actually Now that I look at it, the parking variance is quite significant. Um, but one thought I had was the 11 parking spaces that you have along Spring Valley Road, right? The new
proposed probably what you can do is tandem parking spaces for employees right in the front. Right. And there is uh I asked Rakkesh to check the grading. It slopes down. Probably you'll need a
retaining wall in this area. Is that where you're discussing? >> Right there. >> Yeah, you're right here. You're right. >> Yeah, it's right there. >> Yeah. >> So, you have 11 spaces there. If you do
tandem, so you get another 11 >> and then that could be designated for employees. You don't even have to pave it. Uh but just have >> you would pay it. Okay. Um and just have
those additional spaces so that the employees park and those 11 spaces then open up to the general public. >> Okay. that comes to the >> we'll we'll do that and we'll provide uh some type of revised plan you know >> compliance. Yeah.
>> Great. Oh, um I did forget to mention that there is a we will need to a slope variant, not a variance, a slope uh waiver because the currently when the
this facility was constructed the hotel, it slopes down at a normal slope of like 4 to one, but that's 20%. and and the slope along here is all man-made slopes um which is what and then there's slopes
in the detention basin. So that's what our report had referred to. So I guess technically we do need we would request a design waiver for disturbing those man-made slopes along the edge. But I
believe that the benefits definitely outweigh the detriments of granting that that waiver from those. >> Yeah. The intention usually just for the board's education, the intention for for having that requirement uh is so that uh
it's really a stability concern. When you just when you disturb steep slopes, uh it's hard to stabilize them. In this particular case, we're talking about a steep slope that's going to be basically filled in. So stability is not not even a concern here. So uh I would um have no
objection to that waiver. >> Okay. Are you finished? >> I am. >> Vina Mr. De Palmer to my right. >> Yeah. So I guess my my question would be why
isn't the So I I thought originally when there were some conversations around this was going to be attached to the hotel. Why isn't it attached to the hotel or at least attach attached somehow to the the overhang that goes between the hotel and like the parking
the front parking area? >> Well, to be honest with you, I'm just the engineer. I um that was a decision that was made by >> but it's not a um sightsp specific reason why it
>> u it it keeps from disturbing the existing parking. >> Yeah, that I think that's really the reason because we're not disturbing any of the approved parking that was there when the hotel was approved. So if we I guess if we were to attach it, you know, we would probably lose we would probably
lose some spots. Um but I'm I'm sure that's the reason why. And it also makes it easier to construct with while keeping the hotel in operation. >> Yeah, I think in fact I think there was a comment will the hotel be closed dur No, the hotel will remain open during
construction. There won't be any need to close it and there won't be any need to impact on the parking field. So >> Okay. And would um Vina's suggestion of the tandem parking for the employees, would that trigger any issues with that
the front portion of the the property? Any setbacks? Maybe that's a question for you guys. Buffer. >> I did check. I don't think there is a buffer requirement. I I just feel the landscaping would be pushed back slightly.
>> Would be pushed closer to >> closer to the spring. Yeah. But I think when you come back for compliance plan, you should work with Rakkesh and me with the landscaping as well as in the front. >> We need to stay out. >> I don't believe required.
>> Sorry, I didn't mean to talk over you. We do need to make sure we stay out of the sanitary sewer easement which is on an angle to the parking. So it would only be close on the right side or the east side. >> Yeah,
>> you may not get all 11, but I think you can get at least 10. >> Okay, Mr. Depal, you finished? >> Uh, yeah, I have no further questions. >> Okay, let's go to my left. >> Okay, I think >> Yes. U with the lighting. I don't know
if you go back to that aerial view, Danny. You mentioned the lighting was on the front corner of where the existing property was. What lighting is in the new parking lot? >> Oh, I didn't say how many poles.
>> There are some in there though, right? >> There are uh >> I thought you were just pointing out >> the lighting plan is uh >> you have that on the uh maybe Danny can pull it up. Yeah, >> obviously there is new lighting proposed in that in that parking field.
>> My concern is back on the wood line. >> It's LED lighting which is eminently directionable which is a good thing and there are four six poles that are proposed.
They are all singles and see what the height is. I always have trouble reading these charts that they put on our plans. The poles meet the uh ordinance height. >> I guess my question was is there any on
the back side by where that wooded area is? Okay. So, there is a pole a light located right here in this location. That's a t that's a that's a typical. So, wherever
you see these large letters. >> Okay. >> That's a light pole. >> Perfect. Right. >> That's it. >> Thank you. >> You're welcome. Oh, >> and there's one in the middle too among the uh parking spaces.
>> Thank you. Any other questions? Okay. Um I I have a couple questions. The the proposed conservation easement I mean is that existing or is that >> Yes, it's existing. It's not proposed.
It was um all part of the application from 2012. >> Okay. Cuz I I looked on I looked on the tax map and I didn't see it. So, I wasn't sure if it was existing or not. Uh, my other question, the the to the
top of that that parking lot, there's like a a kidneyshaped piece of property. Is that going to be ground level with the uh because right now it's all low. Am I correct? >> Yes. >> Because I I made a site in inspection out there and I I did see the freshwater
uh vegetation uh and you said there's a permit to fill that in, right? It's already been filled. >> Well, when I was out there a couple days ago, it looked off low to me, but maybe it is filled in a couple days.
>> So, it it's been filled already. I think it was even lower before. >> Oh. Oh, okay. So, but it's it's going to is everything going to be low then? No, it it's going to be brought up to grade so that that proposed building.
>> So that they're going to be bringing in more fill. >> Yes. >> Okay. >> And that and again that that kidneyshaped piece on the north that's just just going to be ground level with the rest of the parking lot. >> I'm not >> It's like a vac just north of the uh
proposed parking lot. It's like kind of triangular. >> It's going to be it's going to be a little slope down to the road. going to be slope. >> It slopes down towards the road. >> Okay. Once they fill it in, >> right, they're going to fill up higher than and then it's going to slope down. >> Okay, that's all. Thank you.
>> Okay. Thank you. >> Okay, we'll move it up to the public. Any questions of this witness? Seeing no hands, close the public. All right, Mr. Chairman, have uh my traffic engineer. >> Yes.
>> Thank you. Hi. Do you swear or affirm the testimony you're going to give this evening is the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? >> Yes, I do. >> Thank you. Could you please state and spell your name for the record? >> Sure. >> Scott Oops. Scott Kennel. Ke nel with
Mcdana and Ray Associates located at 1431 Lakewood Road, Manisquan. I'm a principal with uh Mcdana and Ray Associates. Have over 40 years of traffic and transportation planning experience. Have testified in over 2,000 site plan applications and have been qualified in New Jersey Superior Court
as a traffic expert. >> You're accepted. Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Mr. Kennel, you were also the former engineer for the township of Albridge. >> We did rep approximately 10 years ago. Yes. >> Okay. All right. >> Really? 10. >> Maybe maybe even longer. I don't It's time flies.
>> Yep. >> All right. So, u Mr. Kennel, I know that you did an analysis of the traffic uh that would be generated on this site. Uh you also did some parking counts for the existing site. So, if you could give the board uh the benefit of your analysis
and also recognize the fact that thanks to Miss Sant, you picked up 11 parking spaces uh to abate the variance somewhat. them. >> I'll take that into consideration. Uh yes, our analysis was summarized in a report dated July 30, 2024 that was
prepared in conjunction with this uh application. And as far as the the first task is, we had uh traffic data collected along Spring Valley Road and determined that the the weekday morning peak hours from
8:30 to 9:30 a.m. and the afternoons from 5 to 6:00 p.m. on Spring Valley Road along the site frontage. There's approximately 250 vehicles 2-way during the morning peak hour and approximately 400 vehicles in the PM peak hour being
the heavier time period and more critical. The next phase of our analysis considered the uh pro traffic projections associated with the proposed use. Uh
the architecturals and the site planer review included what we see today as far as the restaurant and the brewer micro brewery. And in our analysis, we consider that as one type of use. And and typically what
we do is we consult the trip generation manual prepared by the Institute of Transportation Engineers. And I considered the use as a high turnover restaurant type use for for both uh tenants and provided projections where the the PM peak hour traffic
projection would be about approximately 72 vehicles. The weekend would be 76 vehicles. Based on your site engineers review, they had raised the issue that one, the IT has updated their trip generation
manual and that is correct. Within the last couple months, they've published a 12th edition and that it would be suggested to use the tap room land use code for the um the micro brewery. In doing that using
the 12th edition and breaking out the two uh tenants the afternoon peak hour is 41 trips. So it's less than what we had utilized. So again showing that we had a more conservative approach and as far as the Saturday peak hour
using the new IT data the projections were 69 vehicles where we use 76. So again, we're in line if not a little more conservative in what we had uh provided um as part of this application. Um so generally speaking, we're generally in the same area. The one
other comment raised was about the hotel use and the fact that the current Hampton in is a limited stay versus if it has the meeting space, it becomes a hotel with other amenities. So, we looked at that traffic generation
between uh a limited stay hotel versus a hotel with other amenities. And in the PM peak hour, the additional traffic generation is approximately 14 vehicles during the peak hour. And on Saturday, it's one vehicle. So, again, generally the same, the the traffic projection be
provided. I'm confident even though with the updated trip generation manual, is still a good representation of what would take place on this site with the new building. There was also a question raised that should have been done a level of service analysis which I'm sure you've heard
that uh testimony before in other applications. So I did do a a weekday PM level service analysis at the site driveway and it was determined that because of the low volumes on Spring Valley Road and based on the traffic
projections that we had in the in our analysis that that driver would operate a level service B. Now, we always rate an intersection from A to F. The design target is level service C to D. We determine that there will be average vehicle delay of 11 to 12 vehicles,
meaning that that driveway can operate safely and efficiently. Now, to what everybody's been talking about, parking. So, as it relates to parking, between myself and and my staff, we conducted numerous uh parking
observations. Some of them are summarized in the appendix of the report we provided where we conducted counts in December of 2023 where we did counts from u 10 to 11 p.m. And the reason for
that is hotels peak parking demand and especially one of this uh nature is generally after 900 p.m. because most people are are here and staying at the hotel because they have other activities, visiting family, events, other things and this is a place
basically put their head down and um uh their peak parking accumulation for hotels or similar to what is uh existing usually happens from 9 to 10 p.m. and then into the overnight. Uh
so we did counts on Friday night, Saturday night as well as Sunday morning at 6:30 to capture those people that were there overnight. And again, the peak um parking rate was 55 vehicles on site
where we have 113 spaces. So we're approximately 50% of the park and supply and based on information provided by the uh the operator there were approximately 87 rooms
booked. So we're 80% 87% of capacity which is from my experience is typical hotels generally or very rarely book every single room. It's usually an 80 to 90% occupancy level. So again that represents a good um is a good
representation of of um the parking data we have as to the hotel operation. There are additional counts conducted in May of 2024 again on Friday and Saturday and then I made observations myself in
March of 24 and June of 24. And again, the data we collected in December 23 was the the highest um number of vehicles on site with 55 during all those time periods.
Now, we have to take into consideration the the proposed uses. Um the primary traffic generator would be the two tenants on the first floor. As we've heard the testimony earlier, the
second floor is intended to be used generally for hotel guests and so therefore that those vehicles are already on site. You may have some others that are local visiting uh the events or taken advantage of when the
hotel guests you utilize them. But as far as the restaurant's concerned again with the indoor and outdoor seating, we have 66 seats. The industry standard is one parking space per three seats, which would mean that the restaurant, which is
is on the small side to around 2,300 square f feet, would have a a peak demand of 22 vehicles. The micro brewery has as many as 34 seats. Again, it's not a very large
space. It's uh 18,900 square feet with 34 seats. And I used a different rate. I used one space per two seats. And that again equates to 17 vehicles parked on site. So our calculation
showed that there'd be 39 um vehicles on site are generated by those two first floor tenants. And when you consider what we observed at the hotel, we're expecting the peak demand is going
to be around 110 115 vehicles parked on site where we're providing 160 parking spaces. And what's important to note is the hotel peak period is not won't be coincidental with the restaurant and the micro brewery. There's a shared parking
phenomena. Never mind the fact that the projections I get I provided as far as uh parking demand for the two um tenants on the first floor did not take into consideration credits associated with u patrons of the hotel that would
be utilizing those two two uses. So when you take all that into consideration, it it's my opinion that the number of parking spaces, the parking supply now going up to 171 will be more than adequate because it's it's it's my opinion that the peak demand
here well maybe 115 120, but there's plenty of reserve spaces to accommodate um all three uses on the site, especially considering the synergy that we expect between the three uses and the fact that they don't have coincidence al peak parking periods.
>> So, just just to summarize and just kind of tie it all together with numbers here and and also let me ask you this preliminary question. I think you alluded to it. The peak uh the peak hour or the peak time for a restaurant or a micro brew would be in the early evening. >> Well, I would say more so for the
restaurant and in the the brewery will be a little later in the evening. So, I mean, I would if it's going to be a barbecue place, I would expect again their peak times are going to be from 5 to 8, maybe till 9ine on on a Friday or Saturday, but it definitely tail off after 9:00 p.m.
>> And and the peak peak demand for parking in the hotel is generally between 9 and 10 p.m. So, by the time the restaurant peak is over, the hotel peak would then come in. >> Correct. Uh and according to your traffic counts, which are uh which are accurate traffic counts, what your I
guess what your summary of your testimony is that we have a parking lot right now in the hotel, which is probably at 50% capacity. >> Correct. And even if I extrapolated to all 100 rooms we occupy, that means 63 64 cars on the site.
>> All right. So 63 cars on 113 parking 113 uh parking space lot. and uh the additional 63 spaces that we're providing uh for the new building. Uh your testimony is again based on parking uh based on number of spaces that need
to be provided for patrons. We have 63 and we've got 39 as the peak number. >> That's correct. And that's without taking any credit for patrons of the hotel that would be >> correct >> at these two uses. >> All right. And uh in terms of I have a few questions just in the report, but in
terms of circulation, any any issues with circulation, any issues with uh fire circulation, any anything of that nature, Mr. Kennel? >> No, I reviewed the plans prepared by Crest and their truck turning templates and I find that this site has been designed to provide positive on-site
circulation, not only for passenger vehicles, but for large wheelbase vehicles serving this site. >> All right. And um in terms of sight sight distances u you can just comment on that. I know there was a a comment made by uh that they they were looking
for the sight triangles but based on my observations there is a say a horizontal curve and we're on the outside of that which then allows us to optimize our sight lines. Uh, as far as based on my observations, we meet and exceed the recommended um
site distance for the posted speed limit of Spring Valley Road. >> U, Mr. Chairman, I don't have any other questions of Mr. Kennel. Certainly, he's available for any. >> Okay. Thank you. U, let's go to our professionals. Mr. Dar, >> I I don't have Sorry, Mr. Chairman. I
don't have any questions for Mr. Kennel. >> Okay. Thank you, Nina. >> Me neither, >> Harry. >> I just have one question. You you said for for peak for the hotel you said 64. >> Well, we recorded 55 and that was with
87 rooms booked that evening. So what I'm say saying is if all 100 rooms were booked and we extrapolated our peak observation there when it would come out to be 63 64 vehicles on site
and based on my experience hotels generally do not book 100%. They're usually >> well I agree I agree with that. I mean I >> I don't know if I agree with if a 100 rooms are booked there's only going to be 64 cards attached to it. Well, what
what happens as as the um applicant indicated, they have weekends where people come into town because they're going to sporting events. And generally what happens here is you have the parents and then uh the children will have their own room. So you'll get two rooms out of one vehicle. So that's kind
of why the numbers are what they are. >> Yeah. When I look at it, I just try to look at worst case scenarios. If there's 100 rooms, it's 100 cars. So, it let's just let's just play that out. If there were a hund 100 rooms booked, which I'm
sure the applicant would would love that on a weekend, >> of course. >> Um I see the smile. So, if there's 100 rooms with 100 cars, is 71 an additional 71 spots enough based off
the calculations that you have for the for the proposed space? >> Yes, they are. And again, if they were booked 100%, their peak demand of the hotel generally occurs after 9:10 p.m. >> And the other uses, >> I'm asking Armageddon as everyone's trying to park at once, right?
>> But again, we have to take in consideration. >> I understand that. I'm just trying to I've seen where breweries and micro breweries far exceed any and all expectations. There's not a single micro brewery in this town. When one opens,
there will be 200 cars trying to get there, regardless of what the occupancy is. I I am gaming this out in real life, not in not in a statistical um way. I've seen if you go up Route 34 in Colts Neck and you go to Source Brewing.
>> Source Brewing is is liter extremely hard. So, I'm just trying to I'm trying to play worst case scenarios. Well, I'm very familiar with that site and I I think that's a whole different type of uh operation and that's more of a regional draw where I'm looking this
would be more of a local draw given the size of the micro >> 3,000 people in this town just so you know. >> Well, but but again given the size of the micro obviously they have to have uh beer at it. >> No, I know I understand but I'm just trying to understand. So the building itself, what is the what is the parking
requirement just for that particular building >> for the second building? >> Yes. Yes. >> I'm saying based on the number of seats, it's uh be 39 39 to 40. >> 39 to 40 for both the for the first for
the first floor. >> Correct. >> So if you had a worst case scenario 100, you'll still you're saying your testimony is that it's still in excess of >> we'll have a service. say 25 um spots additional. >> Correct. >> Okay. Thank you.
>> You're welcome. >> Okay. To my left. Any questions? >> Mr. Chairman, I I do have one question. Okay. >> Mr. Saxs, I don't know if if uh Miss Totten is the right person to answer the question or or maybe the the operator.
>> Sure. the refues. How's the refuge being handled for the new the two restaurants now? >> Well, I think the plan was to uh have just the the existing trash enclosure for the hotel uh handle the refues for this building.
>> Um if need be, if there's a concern about that, we certainly could. Yeah. >> Yeah. The the the size of the the enclosure is a concern obviously because you have one looks like 20 foot x 12t enclosure for the hotel and then
restaurants I know do produce you know a decent amount of refu. So I would expect a a refuge enclosure for the restaurants. Yeah, I would expect a refuse enclosure closer to the restaurant building than
use the one that is there for the hotel. [Music] If if the concern is you want to see something on the new on the site where the new building is >> we may lose a parking space or two but we'll work or maybe not we'll work with you to see where we could we could fit it in.
>> Yeah. All right. >> Exactly. >> All right. >> Just work with me on that. I think a refuge enclosure probably is necessary for especially for proximity too because usually >> restaurants you're carrying restaurant waste. >> No. >> Okay. We'll we'll work with you on that issue.
>> Okay. >> Sorry about that. >> Are you done? >> That's I'm done now. >> Okay. >> I might think of something on the drive home, but >> we're good. Right. Okay. I'm going to open up to the public again. Seeing no public close the public portion. Thank you. >> Thank you.
Next question. >> Uh, yes, just for about two minutes. Uh, good. >> Okay. >> I told you I' I'd get done by 10. It may be a minute before, but Miss Miss Totten, you're still under oath and um I want you to be brief, but
I think you have to address the variance relief. Is that correct? >> Yes. Yes. So, I' I'd like to summarize the variances that I believe we need. Um there's one for parking obviously. There's um also parking stall size. We
have a couple a few 10 by8s where they abut landscaping uh so that the overhang is on the landscaping. Um the loading area is required to be 10 by60 and we have 15 by35 for the new
building which accommodates the type of loading that would be associated with this type of facility. Uh we also have parking within 15 ft of the building. I mean sorry it's supposed to be 15 feet. We are 12 feet. Um which I think is
adequate. We have adequate sidewalks and landscaping there. Uh and then the parking itself um 190 is required and we have hopefully 171 or thereabouts.
Um we have definitely 160. So, I uh would like to just uh group these somewhat together in my planning testimony. Do I hope everybody agrees with the variances? Great. Aces. Okay.
So, let me just move on to All right. So, these these will be uh C2 variances, the flexible C. uh you've heard the testimony with regard to the use and relationship between the hotel and the micro brewery as well as the
operations of the the uh micro brewery event hall uh the new building. You've heard the testimony regarding the circulation, the traffic impact and the parking capacity. Plus, you've heard that excellent suggestion by uh your
planner. I don't know. Does the double parking require another variance? Okay. So, we also need a variance for uh no aisle space between the parking. Uh so with re with all of the testimony you've heard the positive criteria or the
special reason uh reasons we are uh carrying out the zoning u the promotion of zoning by uh G to provide sufficient space and appropriate locations for a variety of agricultural residential recreational and commercial and
industrial uses and open space both public and private according to their respective environmental requirements. irements in order to meet the needs of all New Jerseyians. So, we're providing additional opportunities to use the hotel space with these amenities and the
opportunity for utilization of shared parking. I to promote a desirable visual environment through creative development techniques and good civil design and arrangements. And you have heard again how um we probably have more parking
than we need. Let's hope that's the case. uh with even if the hotel is full and we have both of the micro both of the restaurants full. So the shared parking reduces the parking field and impervious cover and the look of a sea of parking.
So that's a positive. Uh H is to encourage the location design of transportation routes which will promote the free flow of traffic while discouraging location of these facilities and routes which result in congestion of blight. So, we're providing a place for the people in the
hotel to be able to go and have meals and some entertainment. So, you're taking that traffic off the street, plus you're providing shared parking um uh as a result of that. Um, and this is all specifically for this project, which is
an existing limited use hotel that we want to expand those uses of or the opportunities with that. With regard to the negative criteria, this proposal will not have a substantial detriment to the public good for the following
reasons. The hotel and the parking already exists. Uh this proposal uh and its parking is and its parking I don't know what I wrote here. It's located in an area that's surrounded by a contractor yard, car
dealerships, as well as Route 18. So there's no substantial detriment to the public good uh of construction of this building and its parking and the shared parking aspect of it. Uh there's also no substantial impairment of the intent and
purpose of the zone plan and ordinance because these are requested for this very specific property and you have seen or heard I should say the testimony with regard to the parking capacity and accounts and that the parking is
adequate as provided particularly with the additional 11 spaces. Um, so let's see. Therefore, it is my opinion that the deviations from the ordinance can be granted without substantial detriment to the zone and zone plan and that the
benefits of all of this outweigh the detriments. >> Miss Cotton, just I'd be remiss if I didn't also address this issue and I meant to do it sooner. Uh, we do not need a floor area ratio variance. Is that correct? >> That's correct. >> In fact, u you provided a u a memorandum
to Miss Mr. Dargianne to Miss Sant uh stating that uh giving accurate numbers as to the existing floor uh floor area and footprint of the hotel. >> That's correct. >> And if you add the new building on to that uh we come up with a total of
68,642 square ft. Uh what's permitted under the ordinance for the Floria ratio is a total floor area of 68,780 square feet. So, we're actually um in
excess by 138 square feet. >> Yes. So, just to make sure you all understand where this information came from, we uh have the site plans for the original hotel through the revision in 2015 when the hotel was under
construction. and the uh floor area on that plan is less than what I think was perhaps in the resolution of approval for the project. Additionally, we were able to review the architectural plans
and that floor area was even less than what was on the site plan that was approved. So, and those were the construction documents, not the um floor plans and elevations that are presented to you. I'm sorry, I keep forgetting
there's these people all the way down here uh to you u for your consideration. Well, it was the zoning board actually, but for consideration at that time. So, we took the more conservative of the numbers, which is the number that was on the site plan, and used that. And that's
why we and I understand how the people that reviewed it looked at the resolution of approval. They may not have had access to the documents we did. So that's what my memo summarizes and that's why we don't need a a variance
for floor area ratio because we could expand the building another 138 square feet. >> Okay. Thank you, Mr. H. Hotton. and I'll actually take the blame for the resolution because I prepared it probably in 2012 when it was in front of the zoning board. So, sorry for that
confusion to the professional staff. Okay. Anything else, Miss Ton? >> That's it. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Thank you. Um Okay. Our professionals, >> I don't have any questions. >> I don't have any questions, Mr. Chairman. >> Okay. To my right.
Anybody to my left? Okay. Well, I think the project if if gets passed, it's going to be beneficial. I hope maybe I can go to a class reunion
without going to Florida. That would be nice. Uh, let me open it to the public. See no hands. See no public. Close the public portion. Mr. Zillow. >> Uh, yes. Uh, before I give a summary, I just want to clarify. Um, at one point
the applicant was agreeing to restrict it to only to the you to the uh patrons of the hotel with regard to the second floor use. There was discussions of making um adding the tandm tandem parking that that may alleviate the need for that restriction. I just want to make sure when I summarize the
conditions is that are we saying that condition is no longer necessary um uh as one of the conditions for the board based upon the testimony? Okay. I just want to make sure that that's what the consensus because kind of we went back and forth a little bit on it. So make sure I was clear. >> From an engineering standpoint, I would
concur with with the general sentiment that the board just expressed because given the Mr. Kennel's testimony about the actual parking demand and also the additional parking that Miss Sant with her magic wand created this evening, uh I I think would would lend itself to
allowing plus the that use would probably be at an off peak time as well. So I I I think it would be wise. >> Okay. Then uh Mr. Chairman, a vote in favor of this application would be a vote granting the requested major preliminary and final site plan approval with the variances and design waiverss
that has been testified to this evening. Um in addition to the uh the typical conditions of approval that the board requires, the board the applicant will comply or work with the professionals to comply with the uh professional reports that were submitted. Um they will work
with the uh board professionals uh with regard to the final architectural design of the building specifically with regard to the restaurant and micro brewery uh facades. Uh give me one second. I know I have another.
They will uh revise the plans to add the 11 uh tandem spaces or up to 11 I should say tandem spaces depending on the restrictions that they may face physically and with regard to any uh existing easements um to the plans. And
then finally, uh they will uh work with the borrow uh the board professionals with regard to uh seeing if they can create a new uh refuge enclosure closer to the restaurant. And that's what I have as the conditions. >> Do we have to open up to any general
comments? >> Oh, um I thought we did that. I'm sorry. >> Did I miss it? >> No, I did it for this one. >> Oh, okay. No. Yeah, we do. I apologize. >> We have to open up for general comments. See no hands. Close that. That's okay.
>> So, my summary still stands, >> right? Okay. >> Okay. Uh, we're looking for a uh motion. >> I'll move it. >> Mr. Palmer?
>> Yes. >> Mr. Lenning? >> Yes. >> Mr. Agopian? >> Yes. >> Miss Canon? >> Yes. >> M. >> Mr. Petty? Yes, >> Miss Mella. >> Yes, >> Mr. McIac. >> Yes, >> Mr. Brennan. >> Yes, >> and Chairman Lauer. >> Yes.
>> Thank you, Mr. Chairman. >> Thank you. >> 10:05. >> Right. Very good. Very good. Good luck. >> Thank you. >> And be before before I get ask for a motion. I want to wish everybody a a happy and healthy Thanksgiving.
>> Could I get >> That's why food break. >> Okay. Okay. My comment about Thanksgiving still stands. >> Okay. >> Should I open up now? >> Yeah. >> Okay. I'd like to open for general
comments to the public. >> See no public. I close that. >> Can I get a motion to adjourn? >> I'll move it. >> Motion to close. >> All in favor? I >> congratulations.