Good evening everyone. I'd like to start the meeting. If you would rise please for a salute to the flag. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America to the republic for it stands nationy andice for all. Please be
seated. Welcome to Township of Oldbridge Zoning Board of Adjustment meeting May 1, 2025. Adequate notice of this meeting of the Oldbridge Township zoning board of adjustment has been provided in accordance with the open public meetings act at least 48 hours prior to the commencement of this meeting by
prominently posting the municipal complex and announcement giving the time, the date, the agenda of this meeting. also by mailing such announcement to the home news and tribune, filing such announcement with the municipal clerk, and finally posting the uh agenda on the municipal website.
Vice Secretary Portelli, could we have a roll call, please? Certainly. Mrs. Andrews present. Miss Chevier absent. Mr. Iso here. Mr. Scaggno here. Mr. Stoner here. Miss Testie here. Mr. Singh here. Miss
Gomez absent. Chairman Sullivan here. Mr. Singh, you'll be voting tonight as alternate one to fill the seven. Uh just a couple announcements. Uh this meeting is being televised on OBTV, the local uh TV uh network here in
the in the township uh channel 15. Simultaneously, this uh meeting is also being put on YouTube live. If you ever need to refer back, you can find this meeting on that channel. Uh the rules of the of the board are that
testimony stops at 10:00. The meeting goes till 10:30 and we allow the last half hour for any public comment. Tonight, uh I will announce that the first application has been uh adjourned uh late this afternoon. So that's not going to be on. So we have two two
applications this evening. It's going to leave us the best part of uh an two hours and a half. So, we'll try and be fair to each other. I don't know that you're going to need all the time, but at some point uh after the first one, I'm going to make sure we split even even time up till 10:00. So, so everyone
knows that. Uh a couple uh housekeeping items. Um and then board, we're going to move to the minutes. We have one minutes of April 17th, 2025. Hopefully had everyone had a chance to look at them. Absent any kind of comments, I would ask someone to move them for adoption. Move
it, Scott. Is there a second? Is there a second? I think it was Mr. Rizzo. Uh, roll call, please. Mrs. Andrews, yes. Mr. Iso, yes. Mr. Scogno, yes. Mr. Stoner, yes. Miss Testie, yes. Mr. Singh, yes.
Chairman Sullivan, here. Uh, we have a couple resolutions this evening. Uh, and before I read them in, uh, I did make mention that one of the applications is up, and in fairness, in case you're sitting here on that application, I'm going to read it into the record, that it has been, uh,
carried. It's, uh, 63-2024Z 1103, Route 35 LLC. That's block 24, lot 0, physical location 1103, Highway 35. They're seeking an appeal of uh, the zoning officer's denial. That
matter has been adjourned. Public hearing will continue June 5th without further notification. If you're here on that matter on Route 35, it's not going to be on the agenda this evening. June 5th, no further notice. All right, that brings me back to the resolutions. We'll start
21-2024Z, Renaissance at Allbridge LLC was major preliminary and final site plan with design waiverss and C varants. Mr. Dasty, thank you. Thank you, Sharon. This uh resolution memorializes an approval of um modifying an existing building that's the footprint won't
change. The applicants come in and ask for that the uh 2600 square ft um which is currently a showroom be utilized now for office accessory space. Uh the condition is it will not be medical use.
There's a variance for the existing parking lot number of parking spaces. Uh there's 191 and our ordinance would require 217 but the applicants uh expert Mr. Kenny testified that the type of uses
different tenants there's a shared parking space situation where not all the tenants are there at the same time to share the spaces. So it's a preliminary and final site plan for that purpose and a uh C variance and there's a few design waiverss that are referenced in the ordinance. Thank you
Mr. Dassi. Board members, you've heard the resolution, so we'll move it for adoption, please. Andrews, move it. Second. Scogno. Roll call, please. Mrs. Andrews, yes. Mr. Iso, yes. Mr. Scogno, yes. Mr. Stoner, yes. Mr. Testie, yes. Mr. Singh, yes. Chairman
Sullivan. Yes. 01-2025Z. Matthew and Christine Bradley. It was a C variance. Again, Mr. Dasty, thank you. This is a property at um 4284 highway 516. Uh it is a request of an addition
to an existing for single family residence which is a permitted use on the zone. Um the increase would be about 572 square ft. Uh the applicants want to uh complete the home so that it has two
and a half baths and another bedroom for the children's playroom. Uh the home currently is 1139 square feet. It would go to711 square feet and the home um was built before the zoning ordinances which created the
pre-existing nonconformities which require the new variance. Thank you councelor board members. Someone move that for adoption. Is there a second? Second. Roll call, please. Mrs. Andrews, yes. Mr. Iso, yes. Mr.
Scogno, yes. Mr. Stoner, yes. Miss Testie, yes. Mr. Singh, yes. Chairman Sullivan, yes. 05-2025Z, it's Jabby Jeraf Laken. It was a C variance. Mr. Dasty, once again, I compliment you chairman on pronouncing
that name. This house is at 62 Gazania Drive. The applicant is requesting a variance for in part to allow construction of a six-foot vinyl fence and part of the front of the building and also to construct an 8x10 pergola uh in the front of the build front of the
home. Uh the pergola will be at least three feet off the side and front yard. Um in terms of the setback requirements, there was a lot of discussion about the easement. is a 4ft wide easement, utility easement in front of the home
and the applicant agreed that the proposed fence will not impede on that um easement. It'll be closer to the house than the eman off the street. You might recall that the HOA letter we received originally was not real
specifics. So, we we spoke with the HOA people and they have now submitted to us a a bonafideed letter on their letterhead confirming they have no opposition and that'll be part of the uh part of the file. Word members, that's to your satisfaction. I guess everyone got a
copy of that letter that will become part of the permanent record. Without objection, someone moved that for adoption. Move it. Scaggno. Second. Andrew second. Roll call, please. Mrs. Andrews, yes. Mr. Iso, yes. Mr. Scogno,
yes. Mr. Stoner. Yes. Miss Testie, yes. Mr. Singh, yes. Chairman Sullivan, yes. Uh, we come to item five on our agenda. That's a swearing of the professionals tonight. We have uh two I think a third one might be showing. I'm not sure. We have uh Ryan McCarthy who's professional
engineer. Uh Venus Swan, professional planner. Do you swear or to tell the whole truth? We're moving on application. Uh, the first one to be heard is 49-2024Z. It's Outfront Media LLC. This is in the CC commercial block
19013, lot 6.11. Physical locations uh 1449 Highway 18 Oldbridge for multi uh message sign major preliminary and final site plan with Dvarian. Applicant seeks
approval to construct and operate a monopole multi-me sign consisting of two 25.2 * 18 by9 faces totaling 952 square foot with an overall height above grade
of 25 ft. Is it Matthew Weiss? Yes, Matthew Weiss representing the applicant. Sir, Matthew Weiss, Price Me Shman and Dino on behalf of the applicant. Um so just to clarify something chairman this is I apologize this is on us in the application there
was a typo in the um description of the sign size and height the notice is correct I can you know if the board wants to see it I have that um the application itself everywhere else says that and the plans are correct it's just that one line in the application as well I understand you're going to put it on the record or one of your professionals
will and we'll have the we'll have the professional yes I just wanted to make sure that was cleared up right away um So this is 1449 Route 18 South um block 19013 lot 6.11. It's in the community
commercial district. Um outfront as the chairman said is proposing to construct and operate a single pole doublefaced outdoor advertising sign showing of course to Route 18. It's a multi-me LED off-remise advertising sign billboard. Um outfront leases the property uh from
Bentley Realy Group. There's a Duncan on the property as well. Um, Outfront has a state permit from NJ DOT for this multimessage billboard. We have that with us. We will show you that later. And Outfront will of course be constructing and operating the sign.
Billboards are conditionally permitted in the CC zone. I'm sure the board is aware. However, Alfront is here seeking a D3 variance, a conditional use variance because it does not meet one of the conditions for permission, which is the distance from the residential zone.
The requirement is 500 ft and Outfront sign will be about 230 ft away from the zone line. Two other notes. Um, Outfront is going to agree right up front here, and you'll hear this testimony from them as well in a minute, that uh, they will
do 30-cond ad flips, which is the requirement. So, the plan does say 8 seconds. We will amend the plan as a condition of approval, but the application is for is going to be for 30 second ad flips. So, it will meet that requirement. Additionally, this is on the plan, but just want to make sure
it's highlighted that we will turn off the sign at 11 p.m., which is also a requirement. What time you turn it on? Sorry. What time does it go on? That's not in the code. So, if the board would like to, as a condition of approval, tell us what time to turn the sign back on, we of
course will consider that. We'll take the suggestion of the professional planner when when when that comes around. Understandable. Thank you. So, the sign is going to be 10 12 by 36 ft. Um the actual that's the what we call the nominal size. the the panels
that make up the sign are not exactly that size. So, the actual size is going to be 10 1/2 ft by 36.22 feet. Um, and it's a horizontal sign. So, the 36 ft is is the longer side right to left. Um,
and it's going to be 37 1/2 ft tall. I know, and we'll address this with our engineer, there was a question about the height as well. There's a there's a typo in one spot on the plan that says 35. Everywhere else it says 37 and a half, and we will of course correct that as well.
You're going to hear tonight from three people ideally. Um John Antal from Outfront Media. He is their general manager. William Vote is our engineer and George Williams is our planner. So Mr. Dassi, I'd like to get John. What
we'd like to do is swear in all three of your witnesses now and they can identify themselves as they come in to testify. Gentlemen, would you all raise your right hand? Do you all swear to or affirm to tell the whole truth? So I'll be gone. I do. I will certainly do. We'll start on the left. Do identify
yourself, please. Sure. Good evening. William R. Vote Jun. Um the civil engineer from L2A Land Design LLC. Just spell your last name, sir. It's V is in Victor. O like orange, G like girl, T like Tom. Thank you, sir. And I prepared
the site as part of the application. Sir, John Antl, A N T A L, general manager out front, New Jersey. And sir, last but not least, good evening, commissioners. George Weedle Williams with an S. Nishwain Group of Planning Consultancy in Montlair representing outfront people. Thank you, sir. Thank
you, Casser. Thank you, Mr. Antel. Can you provide the board with the benefit of your background and experience? Yes. So, as I stated, my name is John Antel. I'm the general manager for Outfront Media New Jersey. I have been in the outdoor advertising business for 22 years, all with Outfront and its
predecessor companies. And I've been the general manager for the New Jersey operation since 2012. Um, as far as my duties and responsibilities, I oversee um all departments and divisions with regards to the daily operations here in our territory in New Jersey. And as it
relates to the application before you tonight, I oversee the development of uh new billboard locations. Um, for those of you who aren't familiar with Outfront Media itself, we are a national advertising company and we are traded under uh the symbol UT on the New York
Stock Exchange. Here in New Jersey, we've been doing business as Outfront or its predecessor companies since the 1940s. Um, we operate over 3,500 displays throughout New Jersey, 106 of which are digital billboards like the application
before you tonight. Um, we have been operating digital billboards in the state of New Jersey since 2009 and in uh, Old Bridge Township since 2014. Thank you. I'm going to show you what I'm pre-marking P1. I'm going to ask Mr.
cuffs to hand this out as well. Um Moren, this is aerial exhibit rev 2 if you want to put it on the screen. We're going to label it A1. Is that right? A1. That is how I have it labeled as well, Mr. Dy. Thank you. So, uh while Mr. Cuss is handing this out, Mr. Antel,
what what am I showing you? That's pre-marked A1. Um A1 is an aerial uh view of the property highlighted in a red outline. Um that's uh you know as as mentioned it's the location is 1449 on uh Route 18 South. Um just to the south
of uh well more than just about 1,000 ft south of Maple Street. Um as mentioned uh this is the property where we are the lei. Um and there is also a Duncan on the location. What is the area and zone
around the property? Well, the the area and zone the property itself is the community commercial district. Um the area in in the immediate vicinity is commercial in nature. Great. Okay. And why did Upfront choose this site? Exactly for those reasons. Um
being in the community commercial district um the the use is permitted. Um our proximity to Route 18 where we can orient the sign to traffic visible um from that traveling roadway. Um and again the area is commercial in nature and we can locate the sign on the
property without any interference uh to the normal operations of the business that is already located there. Great. Okay. I am now going to show you what I'm pre-marking A2 Moren. That is the permit. Uh yes
permit. Let's just give Mr. C a second to hand this out before we get into it. Thank you. Take one. Thank you. So, what what you have before you is the um permit approval letter from the New Jersey Department of Transportation. Um
this letter was issued um in May of 2022. Um every year since then, we have renewed this permit in accordance with the state and uh most recently it was renewed again um for May for another year. Um, this is uh signifying that our
application being approved by the New Jersey Department of Transportation shows that we can locate and construct this billboard to meet all New Jersey Department of Transportation requirements um including all of the rigorous safety review concerns that they go through during that process and as required um by their regulatory
bodies. Um, so having uh this letter and having the permit in place shows that we meet all of the abilities the DOT requires to construct, operate, and maintain the sign in a safe manner in accordance with their regulations. One small thing at the bottom there, it says
48 by4 backto-back multimessage. Um, I don't know if you reviewed the report that came out today, Mr. Antel, did you? Shouldn't assume. I did not. Okay. Well, let me show you something in it then. So I'm turning to page six of the report from Nicole Shapiro and Venus Savvant
today. So see number three here under A. Yes, I'm just going to read a sentence to you. The NJ DOT permit states approval for 48x4 backto-back multi-me sign. There was a little confusion understandably about that versus our sign size which is of course 10 12 by
36. Can you explain the discrepancy there? Yes. So, when you make an application to the New New Jersey Department of Transportation, you can apply for any size sign up to a,000 square feet. Um, in this case, when we initially made our original application, um, our thought was to possibly have a
14x 48 sized sign at the location, which is similar to the signs you would find on Route 9. However, upon further investigation of the site and further review of our professionals, we felt that a smaller size sign that's before you tonight, 10 and a half by 36, is actually more appropriate for the
location. Um, and still accomplishes what we're trying to do by orient to Route 18. Um, so we are able to operate that size sign under the existing permit because we're permitted for more square footage than we need. Um, but our application tonight is for a smaller
size sign than the DOT would allow us to have on the location. So, just to be clear, DOT does not require a new permit if you make a smaller sign than what's approved. They do not. They just require that you whatever you're operating is at
that size or smaller. Thank you. Okay. I'm now going to show you what I've pre-marked A3. Those are that's 1449 Route 18. The top one. Yes, the top one. And while Mr. Cus hands this out, um, you could just review that for me.
Okay, very briefly while he's finishing this, what is this? So A3 um consists of seven pages including the cover and what you have before you um is our visual representation of the site as
it exists today as well as what we anticipate the future site to be. Um we we consider we we call these renderings or simulations. Um the process of coming up with these simulations involves us bringing a bucket truck with a wooden
panel attached to the bucket to the location. Um putting it so it is in the place where we will have the billboard face. We raise the bucket with the wooden panel and it allows us to scale out the images that are before you in an appropriate fashion. So we're not
guessing at the dimensions. We know where it's going to be. we know the size it's going to be so that we can have a visual accurate visual representation of how the site will look um in its future state. Great. So, why don't you take the board through this page by page? Sure. So, obviously the the cover page lists
all of the date from when the photos were taken um as well as you know our engineer who took the photos and uh the the creative services team that created the images themselves. the the first photo in the package there, the first three photos in the
packet or for the southbound um side of the sign. So, this is traveling south on 18. Um the first image you'll see the bucket truck with the panel raised. Um this is how we oriented um ourselves to the location and allowed us to complete the other um
photos that you're going to see. The second photo is a watermark or a translucent version of the billboard. itself. And we did this in order to to show the board that the size is accurate, that when you match up the panel with the size of the the billboard
that's being proposed, you can see that we did scale it appropriately. And then the third photo is that billboard in a solid image um as if it were there today um with the bucket truck photoshopped out so you can get a more uh I'll say clear view of what we expect it to look
like in the future state. When we go to the last three pages, it's the same order of operation, but we um we have it for the northbound side. And with the northbound, obviously, um there are currently trees at that location. I
believe a um a shopping plaza is um approved to be built at that location. So, at some point in the future, we do expect those trees to be removed from uh that approval. Um so you can see that we have the uh the first simulation is the approach as it is today. The second
includes that translucent billboard and the third we did our best to represent what we believe the potential future state would be. Obviously, not knowing exactly what that plaza is going to look like eventually, we just kind of took out the trees so that you could see where the
billboard is expected to be plotted on um our property as well as its proximity to the building in the uh in the background there. Thank you. So, how do the digital signs work? Um,
so as we mentioned or as Matt mentioned earlier, um, the ads themselves will change every 30 seconds, same as the the billboard that we operate on Route 9 currently today in the township. Um, those changes are instantaneous. There's
no fading in and out. There's no wavering. There's no flashing. Um, we're governed by the Department of Transportation in that manner. Um the ad changes have to be instantaneous between the ads as they cycle through. Um and very quickly, sorry, what would what would happen if if outfront violated a
regulation of DOT? Uh we run the risk of our permit as well as our license being revoked by the Department of Transportation. So not just this location, but our actual operating license could be revoked. Thank you. Keep going. Um in accordance with the municipal requirements, we are turning off the sign at 11:00 as required. And
um you know these signs, not just this location, but all the locations we operate are monitored both by a computer on location as well as a camera for remote viewing um and monitoring of its uh its I'll say um maintenance and knowing that it's functioning correctly.
Um from a maintenance standpoint, since I mentioned it, um we would anticipate being at this location approximately four times a year for routine maintenance and inspection. Um, but other than that, you know, there there's not much reason to be there on site. This isn't um like a traditional
billboard where you physically have to change every single ad. Um, that's really one of the things that as an operator is a benefit to us because we don't have kind of that that um constant interaction with the sign itself, people
climbing the sign, having to go through that process to change the ad every time we do it. So having that ability to do things uh remotely and to change the message over a secure internet connection, you know, negates the the requirement for us to be there on site
as frequently as a traditional billboard would have us be there. The um the digital nature of these signs isn't just a benefit for us as an operator, but also it's a benefit for our advertisers and our clients. Um,
this is really allowing our clients to have timely and relevant messaging. I think since it's located on a Duncan, that's an example I can give where they can have hot coffee on a cold day, they can show um the cold drinks on a hot day, they could have a breakfast
sandwich during breakfast time and, you know, a shot of espresso for the afternoon. Um, so it's it's really allowing our advertisers to to use uh their ability to convey their messages and their offerings uh to the traveling public in a much more relevant manner.
um from a municipality standpoint and from a community um governance standpoint, we have the ability to provide um public service and emergency messaging um to both our municipal partners as well as our our public service partners um throughout the day,
the evening, whenever the billboard is in operation and unused, we have the ability to provide that space um to people who may need it for their uh for their benefit. So, I'm handing you what I've pre-marked A4. This is public benefit examples old brbridge, the very last one. While Mr. Cus hands this out,
please just review that packet for me. So, as it's being handed out, I'll I'll briefly describe it. A4 consists of 13 pages in including the cover. Um, there are three sections to uh to this exhibit. Um, the first being the
emergency messaging. Um some examples we've provided in the packet include uh FBI missing person alerts as well as Amber alerts. You know these are the emergent messaging um that need to be broadcast to a large audience
um for urgent action. Uh the second section involves public service announcements. These are groups and organizations obviously that need public support in order um to further their cause. A couple of examples of that would be the Makea-Wish Foundation as well as the um Boys and Girls Clubs in
New Jersey. And the third and final section of this is municipal announcements. Um an example um in the first page is from Dville, New Jersey, where they've utilized the sign to promote their downtown um where they talk about
various offerings as well as their ranking um as a great downtown in the county. Um that being said, um we do currently uh work with Old Bridge Township um on our existing signs on Route 9. And I've included a couple of
um creatives that have recently run um for the township. And as part of what we do with our municipal partners at their request, um we provide uh a recap, an annual recap of the time that they've used the
sign that's been included on the last uh on page 11, 12, and 13 of the packet. Um, so it it allows you to see um not just the amount of time um that the township has used on the signs, but also the various messaging that's been
conveyed um to the traveling public um on the signs as well. Um so it's a nice little recap for the township to share with with people who uh who are interested in finding out more about what they've used the signage for. Thank you. Okay, I'm going to now show
you what I've pre-marked A5. This is protocol A. Mr. Cus is going to hand out the next two exhibits at the same time, but we're going to take them one at a time. Yeah. So, um, A5 that's being handed out kind of echoes back to A4 because how do you get
all you know those things on the sign? Well, these are the protocols that we provide our municipal partners um so that they can enact these in a time of need. Um, protocol A um is the emergency protocol. Um, again, this protocol is used for highly emergent messaging, um,
such as evacuations or homeland security items. Um, you know, these aren't, you know, your routine traffic slowdowns and things like that. These are really highly urgent messaging. Um, when the need arises for this, we have provided a
24-hour hotline um, to be used by the township's design, whether that's somebody from the OEM or the police department. Um, they would make a call to the hotline. They would say, "Here's the issue. Here's what we need displayed on the billboard." Our team would create it and display it on the billboard
within a matter of minutes. That message would override any other advertising until that emergency has passed. So the township is able to use that as it's needed for the amount of time needed to make sure that nobody is, you know,
traveling toward a bridge that's out, that there's, you know, um an evacuation notice that's urgent for people to to get out of a flood zone, things of that nature. Um so that would be protocol A and um how it's
used. Okay. So now I'm going to show you what I've pre-marked A6. This is protocol B. Can you explain to the board what this is? Yeah. And protocol B, which you have in front of you, is kind of the other side of that coin. Um, we talked about
the emergency messaging. This is the public service messaging, the municipal announcement messaging. Um, this messaging, again, Old Bridge Township is already utilizing this. So, we have this process already in place with the township. Um, the um the township reaches out to us. They say, "Hey, we've
got an event coming up." or hey, we have um you know this uh this type of thing we need to promote with the with the public be you know heater safety uh make sure you you know empty out your fireplace when you're done with it things like that. Um, so once we have
the information from our contacts, if they don't have the ability to create the message themselves, we create it on their behalf and we display it on the billboard as time's available on the sign and um, we just change it as needed by the township.
Thank you. Do you have any other comments for the board? Um, only thing I would say is, you know, I I I mentioned, you know, upfront we're on the stock exchange. We're this big national company, but we're we're a local company, too. I mean, we have two offices, one in Fairfield, New Jersey,
one in Lakewood, New Jersey. Um, you know, we've again, we've been um operating a sign like, you know, like this in the town for for over 10 years. Um, so we we have experience in this and we're happy to answer any questions that the board may have. Thank you. That's
all I have, Chairman. Thank you, Councelor. And, uh, thank you, Mr. Antel. Mr. Watt or uh you have anything? I don't question.
I just had one I guess quick question. Do you have a copy of the the current permit for this location? I know that just looking at this one, it says that it expires um May of 2023. Yeah, as I stated, we've renewed it every year. So, the letter is not issued every year. It
comes in a permit run. Okay. Um we we can provide that. Yeah, I think it would probably be beneficial just as a condition of approval. Sure. Should the board actually I do have a copy of a um section of it. I can just we'll we'll provide the whole thing. It's very large file, but I can just show you the small
things so that you see you know that we have the um yeah I I don't think we have to get into the semantics of it. I think just just so long if if the board acts favorably, we would just request that it be submitted just as a condition of approval. Anything else? Mr. McCarthy everything. I'm gonna go to the board
members on my left. I'm gonna start. Mr. Singh, if you have any questions of this witness, we'll work right up. Do you know when the time and day you took these photos? I did not take them. I took them. I've
never seen this road this empty. It's a very heavy. Our engineer will attest to it. Um, we got people turning off of Maple, turning off of Route 18. It's it's a very dangerous road.
So, you have you don't know when it was taken. What time? I believe it was around 10:30 or 11:00 in the morning. What day? And I will say that our engineer can tell you the process he used to take those photos. Um, but I I will tell you that there was no traffic
when he took those photos. Anything else, Mr. Skaga? No, thank you. Donor no come across on this side test. You're going to have someone speak about the brilliance or the light uh the
ambient lighting that's going to come up later. Yes, the engineer is coming next. I'll hold my I'll hold my comments. Thank you. Thank you. I presume there's no cost to the township for either the emergency or non-emergency notices. No, there is no cost to the township. No, I don't know if it's for your engineer, Mr. twice or this have a copy of the
review letter data today for Mr. We do. Yes. Okay. Any issues with the recommendations that are in the letter? I think our engineer and planner will address the recommendations. All right. We have no further questions. Mr. Thank you. Thank you.
Okay. I'd like to call Mr. vote next. Okay, Mr. Vote, you are already sworn, but um we are going to seek to have you approved as an expert engineer. So, can you please provide the board the benefit of your background and experience? Uh, sure. Good evening again. Uh, William Arvot Jr. uh from L2A Land Design. Uh,
I'm one of the owners and principles uh of the firm. Um, I have a bachelor's in science and civil engineer from Sunni Buffalo and I am a licensed professional engineer in both the state of New Jersey as well as New York and I've been testifying for uh close to 25 years. And
your license is active in both places? It is. We'll certainly accept him as as an expert in this field. Thank you. Thank you. So, Mr. Vote, you were hired by Upfront to work on this application. Uh I was. And what did they ask you to do? Uh sure. So, we prepared the uh the survey
and the site plans uh that was submitted um behalf of the applicant uh for the application. And uh what you have up on the screen are the set of site plans that were submitted as part of the application. So, I'm these were submitted with the application. Mr.
Dassi, do we need to mark them or No, I didn't think so, but just wanted to make sure. Um, Mr. Cuss, if you could hand out the site plan. So, Mr. Vote, just look at this. Confirm for me that that this is the site. Give us the last revised date. Sure. No problem. Um, so
it's a uh it's a set of three uh pages and the last revision date. It's revision number two dated uh 44205 and it was revised in response to uh completeness comments. Correct. Uh that's correct. So this was submitted to the board as I
said in advance. Yes, it was. Thank you. Okay. So taking a look at the site plan, can you describe from an engineering perspective the lot that the billboard would be sitting on? Uh sure. Um so again the uh property is located at 14
Oh, I I have one. Let me see if it works. So, yeah, the uh the the site is uh located at 1449 New Jersey State Highway Route uh 18. We're on the southbound side. Um so, it's uh it's
block 19013 and that's lot 6.11 and it's found on your tax map 19.13 and we're in the CC community commercial zone. Um, probably the best would be to go to I I
think it's exhibit A1 is the aerial. The aerial. So A1 is up on the screen. Um, why don't you describe the the surrounding site for the board? Uh, sure. So, uh just to orient uh the board um with the uh
exhibit, uh northbound is to the right of the screen. Um the property is this triangular shaped uh property located on the southbound side of uh Route 18. Um slightly irregular shaped lot. Um it's
it's a uh it's a small lot. It's about 38,000 square feet. Um, sorry. It's uh 35 about 36,000 square feet. I apologize. Um, there is an existing Dunkin Donuts uh rest uh uh convenience
restaurant on the property with a drive-thru. Um, the circulation to the site is off of uh Route 18. It's a it's a um right in and a right and a left out um back onto Route 18 South. uh the
vehicular circulation around the property around the building um for the Dunkin Donuts. Right in, right out. It's right in right in. Yeah, right in. I'm sorry. Did I say left out? It's right in, right out. Yes, it's a uh circular uh uh vehicular uh circulation around
the building. And that's in a counterclockwise uh orientation. And then our sign is going to go right on the um that would be the southbound uh or the southern corner of that triangle
on that right out um just adjacent to where Duncan Duncan has their pylon sign that exists there. Great. So if you could turn to page two of your site plan. Sure. We we're going to go back to uh C-02 of the site plan. Yeah. just the
second page of that document. Perfect. Thank you, Moren. Um, what describe the the sign for the board, the the size, etc. Uh, sure. So, it's a uh again, it's in the it's in the uh in the south uh east corner of the
property. Um, it's a V-shaped sign. uh meaning that the the back of the sign or the rear of the sign that's closest to the Dunkin Donuts is veed out. Okay. So, we have a 15 foot uh spread on the back
side of the sign and on the front side of the sign it's five feet and that's to orient the sign with the roadway that we're um um showing the customers uh the sign. is to get better orientation uh
with the roadway. Um that sign is a what we typically call a 10636. So it's 10 and 12 ft tall by 36 feet wide. And again the that's the nominal dimensions. The actual dimension on the width is
36.22 feet which is 36'3 in roughly. So that gives you an area of 380 uh.31 square feet. Um what we're what we're doing if you look at the there's a I don't know
Morin if you can zoom in but on the bottom of that same site plan uh we have an elevation. Yes. Just to the right hand side here. Um so again that that again shows you the um the vertical and the
horizontal dimension of that proposed uh sign and it is a flag shape. So the uh the pole is is located um in this case towards the front of the sign. Um then the height of the sign is measured from
the base or the foundation of of what it's uh supporting. So that's a monopole foundation. Um it's a 4 foot diameter um cylindrical steel pole that is augured into the ground. Um they typically augur
the hole about a foot uh larger on both sides. So it's about a six foot diameter hole that they augur and then they set that monopole in. Uh then that gets all filled up with concrete. So, the total
height from that ground elevation is 37.5 ft. And I apologize. I I have it correct on the elevation, but I I made an error in the table above it. I had it at 35 ft. So, I do apologize for that, but of course, we
will correct that for approval. Absolutely. Yeah. Um, and I should mention that uh the roadway of Route 18 is roughly two to two and a half feet tall higher than the ground elevation at the base of the pole. So when you're
standing in Route 18, the sign is is closer to 35 ft in height. Um, not that that's really just a coincidence that the era kind of made that made sense. Um, okay. So, is how is Upfront going to
access the site when they do need to do that um quarterly maintenance? Uh, sure. Uh, they would pull into the site uh just like a typical customer for uh Dunkin Donuts does today uh right off of the roadway. Great. And are there any setback concerns? What are the setbacks?
Um the setbacks that we have are we are uh from the front property line off of Route 18, we are 10 ft set back um from the front property line. And then from the side property line, uh, we're at five feet. Um, and those meet the
requirements of the code. Yes, they do. Uh, the minimum requirements are 10 maximum 100 foot front yard setback. The, um, report we have indicates that there's a 25 foot side setback. No,
sorry. Can you repeat that, Mr. Desty? Sure. I'm looking at U. Miss once report from today on page three the zoning requirements minimum combined sideyard set well not the
minimum sideyard setback is 25 ft that that would be for the building itself. That's so we we did the zoning analysis for both the the actual Dunkin Donuts that's on the property and for the billboard. So that that's probably
what's that that listing is the 29.15 ft. Are you aware of any provision in the ordinance the CC zone which uh details second buildings in terms of
setbacks or pertinances? Um I'm I'm aware of the conditional use criteria uh for this zone for a billboard sign which is what we followed. Okay. Thanks. So on that point about the requirements
for billboard signs in this zone, does the proposal meet every requirement? Uh it does except for one. Uh there is a setback to residential to residential zone. So for in your conditional use
criteria for a,000 square foot area sign you're required to be 500 ft from the nearest residential zone. So our sign is smaller than a th00and square foot. Just for round numbers it's 380 square feet.
So roughly it's 38% of of the size of 1,000 square feet. and we are at uh approximately 230 ft from the nearest residential uh zone which is directly across or to the east
uh of us across the street on Route 18. Um, so if you just stay with that math there, if you have a thousand square foot sign, that's permitted per your ordinance at 500 linear feet. If you use
the same uh proportionalities uh for a 380 ft sign, um that 500 linear feet would go down to 190 linear feet. So we would comply if you looked at it in that scenario.
Is that does that make does that analogy make sense uh to the board? Okay. Uh thank you. So but obviously we are requesting the D3 variance. You're just making a point about scaling. We are correct. That that is correct. Okay. Great. Um so let's move on to the
lighting. I know there was a question from the but there's going to be a question from the chairman about the lighting but hopefully we'll answer it before you have to ask. Uh so how does the lighting work? Sure. So if you go Morin if you go to the third page of the site plan set. Thank you. CO3. Um what we did is we
prepared a lighting analysis at the ground level uh for the billboard. Um the way the billboard operates, it's an LED panel. Okay? It's made up of uh a cluster of dodes. Those dodes are three
um there are three different colors. There's a red, a green, and a blue. So those clusters get repeated on the panel and then the panels get repeated to fit inside of that 380 square foot uh sign
face. What those dodes do is they um they emit uh a light source on the board so you can read the message. The intent only for the sign is for you to read the message. It's not to cast light uh or
illuminate anything on the ground. When I use that term illumination, that means uh that the light is being cast on a surface or it's it's really light trespass. So like lighting in a parking lot that is providing illumination or light trespass because you're lighting
up the area of the ground below it. So you can see the billboard does the complete opposite. It's just creating illumination which is brightness just so the uh intended viewer can see the uh
message on the sign. So during the day the sign operates at 100% output. Okay. So it's competing with the sun uh you know so it's full output. In the evening
hours or as you approach uh um sundown, the uh the panel is automatically programmed for what part of the country it's in, what time zone, um whether it's daylight savings, um you know, if it's,
you know, if it's the middle of winter or if it's the dead of summer, um that sign automatically starts to dim and dims to only 3% of its output in the
evening hours. So, it's much like um the closest thing I can compare it to is either the dashboard in your car or your smartphone when it goes into a night mode. Your eyes don't need a lot of uh light to see the message. It's actually
counterintuitive. If there's too much light, you you feel blinded. Um so, it automatically dims to 3% of its output. And uh what we're showing on this exhibit or page CO3
um is an example of what the actual light level on the ground would be if the billboard was the only light source in the area. So complete darkness. There's no other ambient light. The
billboard is at 3% of its output. But every diode, so every bulb on that billboard is illuminated. Okay? So we're we're being very conservative in our approach. Um
so what what we did is we showed you at the ground level what those illumination levels would be along the property line and directly in front of the billboard. So the most light comes directly at the center of the billboard. And then you
can see on the ground level the different illumination levels in foot candles. So when you say every diode will be lit up, how how would that be visible to somebody looking at the board? What would it look like? So it would be an all white screen. So basically the the
entire screen is is alum is illuminated white. um just to give you the just to give the worst case scenario on on the lighting analysis. That is never the case because that's not a message. Um so
you would only have a certain percentage of the sign uh illuminated to read to have that message presented. So at all times it will ever actually reach these numbers. Is that correct? Am I understanding that? That's absolutely correct. Okay. And again, any ambient
light that's there from the roadway, from the uh the current Dunkin Donuts adjacent users, uh that will all wash out any of the lighting that would uh cast down uh from the sign. It's it the
intention is not for the lighting on the sign to illuminate anything on the ground. It's just meant to be read. That is correct. Okay. You reviewed, I imagine, the uh report that we spoke about earlier from the professionals for the board. Uh I did. Okay. If I could turn you to page six.
Sure. If you look at number seven, there's a note that uh words used in the sides message shall be of such size and brevity as to be readable to the average driver at a minimum distance of 550 ft so its message can be read safely at highway speeds. Is outr intending to
comply with this? Uh, yes it is. And I think you can see that from the photo exhibit that we presented, which I think is A3. A3. Thank you. So, let's let's go back to A3. The um the No, the it's um 1449 Route 18. That's that one. Thank
you, Meen. So, this is A3, the simulations. So, Mr. Vote, you heard the question earlier from one of the board members to Mr. Antel about this. Uh, yes I did. So, why don't we just address that before we even go through them? You took these pictures, correct? Uh, yes, I did. And what time of day did you take
them? Uh, sure. It was a Tuesday, uh, April 8th, and we got to the site around 9:00. So, those photos are, we try to get there after the morning rush hour. So, those photos are between roughly 9 and 10, maybe a little bit after 10
o'clock in the morning in both directions. And how did you do it? Uh so what I do is I I pace off from that bucket truck that we set up. I pace off in both the northbound and southbound directions uh different increments of distances from the center of the
billboard. So I go out 250, 500 ft, 750 and 1,000 ft. And then at each marker point I go out into the middle of the road obviously when there's no traffic uh with a spotter. And then I take
photographs from uh the the lanes. So it was purposely done when there was no traffic so that you wouldn't get killed. Exactly. Yeah. Okay. So can you describe from your p from an engineering perspective uh what these simulations depict? Uh sure. So um and I I I think
it's you know you do have a signalized intersection um that's just to the north um of the of the subject location. That's Maple Street. So when you see breaks in traffic, it's really the operation of that traffic signal there.
So um you know there there are breaks in traffic. It's not a it's not a uh you know it's not a thoroughare where there's there's um there's there's no intersection. So it is controlled and and again that intersection at Maple is
just um just about a thousand uh linear feet. Thank you. Okay. So, are there any other site plan concerns that you're aware of that you want to address for the board? Um, not not off top of my head. Again,
um I think there was one I think there was one um bulk requirement that the planner and engineer uh requested in their review letter and that was for the maximum landscape area ratio. U what's
permitted or required in the zone is 04. Um, I did do a calculation uh before the hearing tonight. The existing is 0.44 and with that small 6 foot diameter foundation that we're going to uh put in
the ground, it really equates to 29 square ft of new impervious coverage and it will that landscape number will remain at 044. So there's no compliance issue here. Yeah, it it is compliant both existing
and proposed. One other thing from the report, if you could turn to page six. Sure. Under bulk variances number two there. It refers to the minimum front yard setback of the building being existent non-conforming. You see that? Which one?
2A. 2A. Okay. Yes. Is there any issue that the sign will create um that would impact this setback? Uh no, it it will have no impact to the building and or the uh existing pylon sign for the Dunkin
Donuts. Thank you. Is the sign going to generate any traffic in your opinion? No, there's no traffic generated for the sign. And does it take up a large portion of the lot? No. Again, it's it's the foundation is only six square feet.
uh sorry, six foot in diameter um at the base. So again, 29 square foot and the sign itself of course is going to be well above any any grade so it's not affecting it that way. That's correct. The sign is is canal levered above above
grade and it is clearance for any delivery vehicles that may uh traverse the site for the Dunkin Donuts and clearly any passenger vehicles uh that enter and exit the site. Are there any drainage, storm water or pollution issues? Uh, no, there are not. Okay. And do you have any other comments for the
board? I I I really don't. Thank you, chairman. That's all I have. Thank you, Mr. V. Uh, I'm going to start with Mr. McCarthy. Sure. So, uh, sticking with the same exhibit that you guys have up. So, it would be the last
two pages, six and seven, showing the traveling from the northbound lanes. Um, to me it looks like the sign is not going to be visible unless that adjacent property is developed to have those trees removed. I'm not sure if that was taken into consideration. What I guess
just to give some testimony or clarification as to what the plan is for for that you I'll address this. I just spoke to the applicant. If it's if it's blocked of, you know, of course, they won't show any advertisements. It would kind of be a waste. So, yes, we we take that point. If the trees aren't cut, then then we'd
have to take that into consideration. Okay. We're just curious on anything. That was that's the only. Yeah. And if somebody moved in If someone moved in Oh, to that site as a to the adjacent lots. If that's a a person, you
mean then you would No, if there was anything any structure that wouldn't Oh, if they Yeah. If they cut down the trees trees down, you you'd illuminate. Exactly. Sorry, I got confused. I thought you were you were talking about somebody moving in with their house there, and I was going to say, I don't know. Yeah. Okay. I when when we did
have the TRC meeting, we we were uh we were made aware of an application for the adjacent lot for a uh small shopping center and that would uh that would clear the site of almost every tree. So that's why we presented the photograph
uh simulation of the trees being cleared. Okay. M just just to continue on to that uh yes there is an approved application at this point. In fact, the amended site plan was approved just last at the last planning board meeting for
Oak 18, which is a a tiny strip mall. And I'll hold on to some of my comments with their sign after the planner speaks because um that site definitely is going through compliance. They had final sign
plans but there were a few comments from uh DOT as well as um the tenency is now confirmed. So they wanted some alterations to the site. They came back to the planning board is now approved and they should start construction shortly.
Um I don't have a question but I do have a comment. Um and uh I know you said that the size of the sign is much less than thousand square ft and uh
proportionally to that your setback with the residential is lower. But I just want the board to understand there is no correlation between the two. Those are two separate conditions of the conditional use. So to just because the
sign is smaller doesn't mean that the setback should be reduced. I just want the board to understand those are two separate conditions. The the one of the condition of the conditional use is that it allows a th00and square ft sign a
maximum sign area and then the next one of the other conditions is that a billboard must be must not be within 500 uh linear feet of a residential zone. So, I just wanted to put that on record. Thank you. And and to that point, we're of course not asking the board to amend
the code. It's just a, you know, scaling point we're making, but you're absolutely right. Those are separate requirements. Thank you. I don't have any further questions. Thank you. I didn't think scaling had anything to do with it anyway. It is. It is or it isn't. Exactly. And that's why we're getting the D3. Start on my left. I'm
going done. Mr. Sing, any questions? Mr. Scottman. Thank you. Uh, consideration for the northbound side residents. Have you any consideration about the lighting affecting their homes? Uh yes. And again that that's why we did
show the exhibit. Yeah. I mean sitting in your living room seeing this flashing and then changing or changing every what 30 what? It's a 30 30 seconds to another thing. I mean has any consideration been thought about that? Uh yes, and I you're
going to hear some additional testimony from our planner, but um Route 18 along that corridor uh especially up to the residents on that side is heavily buffered by existing tree line. Um I travel that road. I can see right
through there. There are so we did go back into the uh the the parallel street that's Marboro Marboro uh road and we did uh look at some areas there and there there are
uh some areas where you can see through between the homes uh and see that Dunkin Donuts, but they are very few and far between. Well, maybe somebody here from the public might be here to talk about it. We'll see. Thank you. You're welcome.
I have a question. Sure. Um, use the scenario. If you was driving at night going southbound and if I was the only car in the row and it was knowing the lights, what's the distance at some point that I would actually see that
billboard and how bright would it be? Sure. So you would um you would see as far as you can see you would be able to see that there's a light source um at this location. So if you had a clear vision of it you could you could see it
for well over a thousand uh linear feet from from where I took the pictures. If it was the only uh light source, you wouldn't be able to read it. Um, but you would be able to see that there's something with a light source um, in the distance and the brightness of that
light would be would that change as a car coming southbound in that direction? It was the lightness would still be the same as I get closer. So, as you get closer, no, the light will stay the same. um because it's not intended
to shine light on a on you or or the street or the ground below it. It's just to create a produce a a light source uh for the actual sign. So there's there's no there's no real um like a like the
lights in this room. It it's not like it's going to get brighter as you get as you get closer to it for your eye. It's really going to be the same um no matter where you are. It's just in that lighting scenario, we like to show the worst case scenario of what the actual
light levels, which are very minimal, would be at the ground close to the billboard. And those are those are measured in 20 foot increments. Okay. Thank you. Welcome. No, sir. Ladies on my right. Chairman, can you say Oh, go ahead,
counselor. Um, this is going to be 30 seconds. Uh, so that addresses number 13 on page six of the report. Yes. Yes. Now, is it going to be a singlefaced or doublefaced billboard? Uh, it it will be
constructed as a double face, so a sign on both directions, the northbound, the southbound. Now, the northbound direction, if it's blocked, as you heard before, if it's blocked by trees that have not been cleared yet, obviously we
wouldn't present it um or turn it on. Um but it will be constructed. The report from uh our planner again on page six under 3B said at a preapp meeting in February 24, you indicated that the
proposed sign would be single phase singlefaced. However, the proposed sign appears to be doublefaced. So, it is available for double face. That's correct. And and that was when we were brought it was brought to our attention that there was an adjacent application on the
undeveloped portion of the property to our south. So, we we changed we we used the information that we got from our TRC meeting and then amended uh what we presented to uh you folks on the application.
Thank you, Mr. Vo. Can you tell me where the closest uh billboard sign is to this? Sure. So, the closest one um I researched this with um with the uh the folks from
outfront. Um, the closest sign is on the northbound side of Route 18, uh, south of us, and it's approximately two 2,600 linear feet. And sorry, that that's a permit
location. So, it's it's not constructed. Where is that? Where are you referring to, sir? Um, that would be at south of this. Yeah, that's at a bus stop. Here I have the actual Okay, so it's permit 67337. Okay, that's on the northbound
side. It's a bus shelter uh uh sign that's uh by signal outdoor and that's approximately 2,600 linear feet away to the south of us. Right. And then out front has an unconstructed permit. So, the billboard
is not constructed, but they do have a permit. Um, also, uh, in the northbound direction, it's permit 77337. Um, and that is approximately 4,850 linear feet. And that again is to the
south of us. You have a permit. It's not put up yet. It's not been constructed. Do you know of any other signs coming south entering the township of Old Bridge on Route 18, either north or south all the way to Route 9? Uh, the closest one that I'm aware of,
um, I'm I'm just looking through the notes here. Um, there's one in East Brunswick. It's 6.5 miles away. No, I'm familiar. I'm just asking. Let's just deal with Sure. And I think the the East Brunswick one might be in South River.
Okay. But nonetheless, it's set it's set at an intersection of OBT and 18. Okay. So I believe that's in South River. Um coming into the township Fulbridge, do you know of any going south? I I don't. As a matter of
fact, would you be surprised if I said there's none going south on 18 beyond the entrance to the parkway down at 105? I I wouldn't be surprised. Would you be surprised if I told you there's none coming north either? Again, I wouldn't. Would you describe
the area there while it's commercial zone? Well, it's CC uh zone. It's kind of shared uh with residential actually 230 ft away right across the roadway. Sure. And that's not just one
house. There's a there's a lot of homes. Yes. And to your south you have two uh apartment uh complexes. Sure. Do you want us to put up the aerial for you? Uh A1. I know the area from I'm familiar with the area. Sure. I'm just saying.
So, there's a lot of residential around. As a matter of fact, just to your north, there's R80 zone, which is residential on the southbound side, and then R40 when you cross over, I believe, Oak Street. It's all residential. So, I'm
saying, do you normally erect signs in residential areas? I I don't think Mr. Vote, he's not outfront. I don't think he can answer that question, chairman. That's more of a question for outfront itself. Well, he's under oath. Have Mr. As
answer that question for me, yes, we have constructed signs in close proximity to residential uses. You have? Yes. Could you tell me where they are in Old Bridge? Not in Old Bridge. No. Okay, you've answered my question. Okay. Anything else from this witness? No.
Thank you. I'm going to tell you that I'm I ain't uh cutting the time. There was uh we we started at 20 of so there's uh 140 minutes split. So you have 10 left. Yeah, I don't think we're going to get through our final witness in 10. That's what I was going to ask you if
you wanted to wait on that or Yeah, it doesn't seem smart for anybody uh to start and then you guys would have to remember what he said. I agree, but it's yours to prosecute. So I'm asking you. No, that I I agree with the point you're attempting to make. Yes, we should come back. Yeah. All right. I have to go to a public portion anyway while you're here.
Sure. So, that would probably fit in just perfectly, I think. Uh, this is matter 49-2024Z. This is for a billboard. Uh, the location is uh 1449 Highway 18 in Oldbridge. Anyone here in the courtroom
this evening wish to be heard, please raise your hand or stand. Okay. There will be further public portion on this matter, but for tonight, this is the only public portion for this matter. I see none. I'm going to close the public portion. Thank you. Anything council, other than a date? No, we'll just get a new date. Thank you,
chairman. Sure. Uh, we'll work on it right now if that's possible. [Music] We have a date possibly if that works for July 17th is our next open meeting. July 17th. July 17th.
Councelor, what do you think there? Just checking if you give me 30 seconds. No problem. I'm good. Mr. Nasty, how's it that work for you? Sure. Okay, we have to see. Absolutely. Are you sure? Say okay, George. Yes, you're the guy.
Okay, we're good. You going to take that? Yes. Thank you. All right. Well, thank you for your witnesses tonight and the testimony. I'm going to make an announcement on this for those watching at home. This matter will be continued to July 17th. There'll be no further notice. As always, you can always check
on the website of the township uh under the uh Sony board of adjustment and you can see the schedules posted. Uh we thank you again. We'll see you on July 17th. Thank you, chairman. Thank you both. Good night. Uh we're going to go fivem minute recess
real quick uh just so we can the stagers can set up and the next application can come up. Five minutes, please. We've returned from recess. Uh, this is the zoning board of adjustment on May one. May I have a roll call, please? I second.
Mrs. Andrews, present. Mr. Iso, here. Mr. Scogno, here. Mr. Stoner, here. Mr. Estie, here. Mr. Singh here. Chairman Sullivan here. Mr. Dasty here.
Oh, here. Excuse me. Sorry. We've reached the final uh application for the evening. It's 54-2024Z, Phoenix Realy Developers. This is uh the zone is SD1 special development. This is block 1051, lot
29.14. Physical locations 12 Industrial Drive, Qort mailing address. Uh major and preliminary final site plan with CND variance. uh bus depot applicant proposes to add bus transportation company as a tenant to the existing
contractor yard. Donna Jenn uh Donna Jennings Esquire representing the applicant. Thank you. Good evening. For the record, I'm Donna Jennings from the law firm of Wendul and Spitzer. As the board chairperson correctly indicated, the applicant is here this evening seeking preliminary and final major site
plan approval with use and bulk variances for property located at 12 Industrial Drive, identified as block 1051, lot 29.14 on the township's tax maps. The applicant is proposing to add a bus transportation use as a tenant to
the existing office warehouse space, utilizing approximately 3,700 square ft of the existing building space and providing 45 spaces in the rear of the property for the buses to park. In addition, the applicant is seeking to construct other minor improvements
related to installing a 10-space parking area in the front yard, 15 parking spaces along the Westley and northerly portion of the building, as well as two dedicated loading spaces. Finally, the applicant seeking to lift condition number 13 from a prior resolution which
was memorialized on November 6, 2014. That condition states, quote, "The appan agreed that the only existing outdoor storage, which shall be permitted on site, is for the existing granite contractor, sand and gravel for the applicant, truck and machinery for the
applicant, and nine outdoor storage trailers for the applicant storage material, inventory, and supplies and concrete block bins. The applicant shall provide a revised site plan indicating exact location of these facilities, and the number of trailers for outdoor storage shall be limited to nine." end
of quote. The applicant requests to lift the conditions so that it may park buses in the rear of the property. We kind of debate whether or not we're storing obviously if you will permit a bus transportation facility. There's going to be buses on site. We're parking the buses. I wouldn't really say
we're storing, but uh we were called out for a variance for that. So, we're here seeking to lift that condition to clarify what that condition meant going forward. So, uh, the applicant is seeking the D1 variance because the property is also splitz zoned. The front portion of the property is located in
the SD1 zone where the bus transportation is a permitted use. However, the buses are proposed to be parked in the rear of the property which is the ER zone and bus transportation is not a permitted use there. The applicant's also seeking a bulk variance for minimum landscaped area ratio where
040 is required and 0.15 is proposed. And finally, the applicant is seeking relief with respect to parking in the front yard and providing a gravel lot in the rear property. As will be more thoroughly discussed by the applicant's planner, the record will show the applicant satisfies both the positive
and negative criteria to warrant the requested variances requested. First, it has been recognized in Scholastic Bus Company versus zoning board of Fairlon at 326 NJ Super 49 that school transportation is an inherently beneficial use because it fulfills the
public obligation to transport school children. Thus, the applicant satisfies a positive criteria as a matter of law. The record will further show that the applicant satisfies the negative criteria under the four-part seek a balancing test because the public interest greatly outweighs any
detrimental effects. The record will also show that the applicant satisfies the criteria to be entitled to the requested bulk variance pursuant to price vimei. The p variances are assumed in the grant of a use variance. However, the record will alternatively and independently reflect that the applicant
satisfies the positive criteria by vanting multiple purposes of the municipal land use law, including A, promoting the general welfare, G providing for sufficient space and appropriate locations, and M to encourage coordination of various public private procedures and activities
shaping land development with a view of lessening the cost of development into the more efficient use of land. Finally, the applicant satisfies the traditional two-prong negative criteria for the bulk variance. And in support of the application, we are going to call two direct witnesses. Uh the site engineer
sitting to my right, Walt Hopkins, and the applicant's planner, Andrew Janu. We do have the applicant in the audience in case a question comes up and we're unable to uh answer those questions. We wanted to make sure we had the right person here for that. And just as a matter of recordkeeping, we are in
receipt of two reports. We received a report from fire district number two dated April 29th, 2025 and then the board engineer planner and traffic review letter dated May 1st, 2025. So with that, I'd like to have Mr. Hopkins sworn in and we can begin. Why don't we swear in both witnesses that you
anticipate and they can identify themselves as they get ready? Gentlemen, please raise your right hand. Do you swear or affirm to tell the whole truth and nothing but the truth? Yes, I do. We'll ask you to identify yourselves and spell your last name as you come up. All right.
Walter Hopkin, H O P K I N. Now, with Miss Jenny's wonderful introduction, are you just going to say yes, what she said or what? Almost. If you could first, Mr. Hopkins, just give the board the benefit of your background and qualifications. Sure. I have a bachelor of science from Drex
University. I'm a licensed New Jersey in the states of New York. Excuse me, New Jersey, New York, Pennsylvania, Delaware, and Maryland. My licenses are current. I'm a certified municipal engineer in the state of New Jersey. I have had the pleasure of testifying before this board and your planning board surrounding municipalities old
bridge keep excuse me Marbor Keyport. Mr. Hopkins is known Mr. Hopkins is known to me and I'm sure to members of the board we certainly accept him as an expert with us. Great. Thank you. If you could uh Mr. Hopkin, if you could just describe the condition, if you're going to rely on exhibit, let's mark that into
evidence. Sure. Um, so the site, um, I'll be referring to a color rendered version of the site. Um, you want to mark that A1? Sure. Okay. As long as it's okay with Mr. Dasty. A1. Good. Uh, we have a handout that we can, if it's easier for the board a little bit
closer, uh, just a a shrunk down version. And, uh, while it's being handed out, as as Miss Jennings said, it's 12 Industrial Drive, block 1051, lot 29.14. The property is approximately 2.06 06 acres uh and is
split zoned. Um the front is the uh SD1 and the rear is an ER uh zone. It's currently improved with a multi-use building um which includes a contractor's yard, warehouse, and office space. The surrounding uses are very consistent with what uh exists on this
site with the exception to the north is is the swamp. And then to the north of the swamp is a residential neighborhood uh in your R5 zone. What's being proposed uh what we're seeking this evening is preliminary final major site plan approval. There's some relief that
we're going to ask for from your um from your ordinances. Some are uh being proposed, some exist and also to lift condition 13 from the prior resolution which Miss Jennings outlined. U the bus transportation use is what's being per u
proposed. So the building is not being expanded. The the pavement on the site will remain. Uh there's a gravel uh yard in the rear which will remain. Um there's just enhancements that will be proposed which is a a small parking area in the front which is consistent with
the other um with other projects or other properties in the area. It's being done with porous pavement so it will mitigate any storm water runoff uh and some landscaping that's being proposed as well. the the building units uh are
approximately 1,440 uh in total with the exception of the the bus use. Approximately 10% of that 1344 square ft is office space. This is just for your your information as far as use and we also used it for our parking
calculations. Uh there is one unit uh which is going to be converted. It's uh 3,713 square ft which will be the bus transportation and maintenance um facility. This is all within the existing building. This
is we can hand that out. Want to? Yeah. Okay. If you can uh just mark out the floor layout so the board can get a better understanding of the different units that are existing and the breakout of the square footage. I think it'd be easier for them to follow along. We'll mark that as A2 and that's a floor
layout of the existing building. So, unit one in the front um sorry can be seen that's 5,684 square ft. Units two and three have been combined in the middle of the of the um of the building which is 3,15
square ft. There's a small unit 6 uh 780 square ft. Uh and unit five is 38 3,871 square ft. Unit four is what we're here before you this evening for roughly 300 uh 3,713 square ft. Uh and it's accessed
along the um towards the bottom of the of the page where there are overhead doors. The majority of the site will remain and be better organized. Um, if you've seen an aerial or been to the site, it's a little bit scattered right now. Um, there's really no striped or
organized parking spaces and we plan to come before you to to seek um permission to better organize the site. Uh, there will also be a um a parking lot in the front which will have the porest pavement. So, in the front, we're proposing 10 new parking spaces on this
porest pavement. We're delineating and striping five um spaces along the um the western portion of the property and then another 10 um between the building and and the the rear parking in in the
back. Your ordinance uh requires 22 spaces be provided for passenger vehicles. We're proposing 25. So that's the 10 in the front, the 10 in the rear, and the five on the side. Uh we're also proposing 45 spaces for buses. These are
smaller buses um what the applicant's um tenant would use. These are 20 foot long and 38 foot long um school buses. These you indicated they're school buses. So they're to transport children. That's correct. Are schools in Mils
County? Yes. How many uh how many spots in the back? 45. 36 of those are are 20 feet long and nine of them are 38 feet long. And and and to better organize this uh site and demonstrate where the
buses go, uh you you can't really stripe gravel. So we're using um wheel blocks, those little concrete things that you back up. So that, you know, provides one space for every uh for every bus. There are two loading areas. We identify them as loading areas on on the on the plan,
but they're really just striped out to allow access. If you've been to the site, there's there's overhead doors. It's kind of operates like a garage. So, we've just striped out um basically the entire rear of the of the building uh to allow for access in and out and then
along the um a portion of the western side which will allow for the the buses to access that portion of the building. There's some relief that we're going to request this evening. Um uh as Miss um Jennings indicated your your
ordinance requires 04 landscape ratio. We have 0.21 now and and adding that porous pavement in the front will reduce that to 0.15. Um you'll hear testimony from the planner, but I you know I have been to the site. I think this is my third or fourth um visit to you uh on on
different site plans of this area and the property next door and it is certainly consistent with with the area. There's also an existing um sideyard setback uh that um violation or or exception from your ordinance. Your ordinance requires 25. The existing
building is at 24. Uh we're not changing that. We we quite frankly can't. Um and there's a few design waiverss that we didn't see in in the review letter, but we want to make sure that we bring them to your attention and and request relief. We believe that your ordinance does require that um the the parking
surfaces be paved. Um the the surfaces in the rear are are gravel. So we just ask that they remain as gravel and and not be paved. Uh and then parking in the front yard. I I think that's subject to interpretation, but we certainly would would rather be conservative and ask you
for relief to allow to park in the front yard um as we're proposing. And again, that's that's consistent with uh many of the the properties in the area. Actually, you can see a few of them on the aerial. Uh very simple as far as grading and drainage. There's a the parking area
in the front. It's porous pavement which allows the water to go through the pavement. Um we met with your professionals before we even um started the design. And what we've proposed isn't it's kind of like an overflow that if the the porest pavement does fill up in a big storm that it would just
overflow into the street. Um the the um the amount of improvements that we're proposing does not meet the requirements or the definition of a a major development. However, we are reducing the rates of runoff for all of the storms up to and including the
100red-year storm. As far as landscaping, again, an improvement to the site. There there really isn't much to speak of today. Uh we're proposing uh two street trees along Industrial Drive, some small shrubs there as well, as well as foundation plantings, island plantings
with a mixture of shrubs uh and ornamental trees. As far as lighting, lighting exists on the site. There's two wall packs right on the front of the building, and they adequately light the um the proposed parking area, and we've demonstrated that on our plans as well.
We do actually in fact have approval from Free Old Soil Conservation District. Um there are some other outside agencies that we haven't applied for, but we would certainly would as a condition of approval, including uh Middle Sex County. Um we can go through the letters at this point. I can take questions
however the the board and chairman would like to proceed. If you're done with your testimony, I'm going to ask the professionals what they have. Sure. Okay. Mr. McCarthy. Um, so did you want to how did you want to do? Did you want to go
through the letter comment by comment or I know there's quite a few things in here where we were asking for testimony. So I don't know. I would prefer not to go letter by letter. Um, I can tell you that we can comply. There's a few things that I would like to discuss with the board. Um, and it and it has to do with improvements. So there's there's um
several items uh on page seven that the the consultant has requested. Um we we we'd like to comply with some of them and and and ask for for consideration not to do it on on others. Um there's a
suggestion on item 24 to to provide um additional uh or to provide curbing along the perimeter of the parking lot. We really weren't sure what the benefit of that was and since it's internal to the site, we would ask that perhaps that that not be required
um along the frontage of Industrial Drive because that is a public improvement. We kind of thought that we it would be in our best interest to comply with that. Um however, there there are sidewalks suggested along the front. Um we we didn't see any benefit to that. This isn't certainly one of the
streets that you would encourage pedestrian um walking and there wouldn't be anything to connect it to. Um concrete aprons. Uh that too I think that's a good suggestion uh at the entrances and we we would we would want to do that. Um the other was the um
suggestion that concrete pads be used for the loading areas and again just because they're really not loading areas like a traditional warehouse where there's going to be a trailer sitting there. It's really just an area to keep open so that the buses can drive in, we would ask that they just u be allowed to
remain as they are. So if it's if it's not going to be a loading area, should it should it be striped that way then? I think that would only be the only concern because um if in the future it's used as a loading area, there would be a concern about if it is asphalt typically over time the asphalt does degrade
within those loading unless you're doing some type of heavy duty pavement cross-section or something of that nature. I agree and and and I you know Maybe we should work this out. I I we can we can do it if you really feel that it is or if there's a strip being a way to stripe it or sign it. Um I I don't
think there's any plans to actually have trailers load there. Um so if you your office or the consultants office are are happy with us striping and signing it, we can do that. If ultimately it's decided that we that we have to use concrete, then we will. Okay.
All right. Uh I think the um only other item that I wanted to discuss and I'm trying to find out where it was, but it was regarding guide rail. There is an existing guide rail. Uh it is item 40 on page nine.
Um it's just a I don't know if it's a suggestion. It just says that we may want to replace to current standards. Again, we would just ask it. It's been it's been there. Um, I don't know that there's anything significantly wrong with it. It may not come up to today's standards. That doesn't make it unsafe.
Um, I maybe I would suggest that we meet out with your office or or the consultants just to see the condition of it. If we can agree that it's in in good working order that we allow it to remain. Okay. Uh, I think that would be fine as a condition. We would we would want to obviously look at it and then if
it is deemed necessary to be replaced, then be replaced. Um, and that that's all I had as far as things we can't comply with. If there's anything you need additional testimonial on or or you'd like me to actually testify that we'll comply to it, I'm I'm
happy to. Sure. I think one of the other things that that you did testify to about the lighting in the front of the property, and I apologize that it wasn't included in here. I didn't think about it until u driving up here today. There's no I don't believe there's any lighting either existing or proposed in the rear of the building. Is that
correct? I don't want building mounted. Yeah. Yeah, I think there's some building mounted. Okay. Um I guess add to the plan. If the if the purpose is to use this as a some form of bus depot, typically, at least my understanding is that the drivers would arrive to the
site relatively early and it can be in the hours where there is no sunlight yet. Um so just from a safety standpoint, maybe we need to look at providing some lighting in the rear of the property to take care of that. That's fine. We'll we'll we'll analyze what's there. Uh if it needs to be supplemented, then then we'll work with
you. Okay. I don't believe so. No. So, I do know that there was some comments regarding traffic on the site. I don't know if you wanted to provide testimony for that or how we wanted to kind of address those.
Um, we could start at number 45. Well, I I did notice that also and I think there were some some some comments and suggestions that we can comply with. I I you know, being on my side of the fence here, I I I focused on the fact that they that they did concur that it
was insignificant increase. So, I would just like to put that on the record and and any touch up to the report, um we'd be happy to do. Okay. Um item number 47, I think that's probably same thing and we're talking about parking. Um I think
we will have to just double check now that we have the actual square footages of each individual um unit as far as the architectural to make sure that there's no they're also on the cover sheet of the site plan that got parking to make sure it was sufficient. They should be consistent. If they're not, we can Okay.
Uh we were looking for some testimony regarding the existing um storm water system on site and what the conditions were of that. If if you may know what they are. Well, we we didn't uh we didn't TV it. We did survey it and it is
um mostly built in compliance with the original uh plan. Okay. Um we would make it a condition then when we go out and look at the guide rail if it does appear that that existing system looks like it is in disrepair that any necessary
improvements would be made to it. That's fine. What else? Okay. Is everything um um so number 18 on the report is there any maintenance work or repair work that
will occur on site for the buses? Maintenance and repair. Maintenance and repair. Um, minor repairs are done as needed. Oil filter changes, safety, and tire checks all inside of the building. Okay.
So, no work outside, right? Correct. And there's a certified um contractor that takes away any waste disposal associated. Could be in unit 4. Where's it going to be? Yes. Yes. Unit four only.
The only question I have and um I mean I wasn't able to come up with a number but if you look at one of the aerials that was posted in the review memo right right now there appears to be almost 28 buses that are parked on the
site in the near map imagery. So I was trying to see because I think we would be more comfortable with having a fixed number of bus parking on the site because I don't want it to be like a freef fall especially because it's not
a paved parking lot and there is no delineation right you have the wheel stops but more than often we notice that once it's approved uh it's this the buses or the vehicles are just crammed up in at the bag. So I would be more
comfortable if there is a limit on how many buses can be parked in the aerial site. C28. Your uh testimony shows like almost 48 uh stalls. But then again uh there are only nine bus parking uh the
larger bus stalls in the aerial. I noticed that all of them are the large buses. It's not like those mini vans that are being parked. So when I see nine delineated spaces on site, I see 28. It's a bit confusing. I know based
on the passenger car parking, you don't need as many. You the requirement is for 22, you have more than adequate parking. So I I mean I don't have the CAD drawings to come up with a number but maybe uh you should come up with a
number that you're comfortable and the board is comfortable should the board act favorably so that uh there is no haphazard parking at the back. Yeah know that that totally makes sense. Let us just ask the what the number is.
[Music] He said 40. So we're parked for 45 right now. But the 45 include only nine bus parking spaces. The others are passengers. So the size of the stalls differ. You may
not be able to put in 40 buses at that location unless it's haphazard. And that's what we are trying to avoid. Right. Hold on one sec. And I'm really sorry to put you on the spot to calculate those,
but I think it makes sense. No, no, I don't disagree with you. Let us come up with the right number. Yeah. So, he they said, "What about 35?" I think it's going to be hard for us to sit here and just discuss numbers without actually being able to see it on a plan. And just I I I think I may have
written the number down incorrectly. What did you say the length is for the smaller bus? The shorter are 20. They're 20. Yeah. The larger aren't aren't quite the full size, but they're 38. There's 36 36 spaces. 20 feet and nine spaces
for 38t long. Right. I would be more comfortable to see something on paper and I'm sure the board would want to see something too before we uh you know come up with a number and before they take a
vote. Okay, let's come back. All right. Let's go. Well, I know they're we're trying to work out the numbers here and I know that it it looks very nice here. Always
always does. I know. And looks very bad when you look at the the near picture, but Mr. Hopin, could you just tell me exactly how many spots are in this particular area of the drawing? That's
supposed to be the buses, right? And and if you looked at this drawing, they kind of outline the whole perimeter. But in this drawing, it looks to me like they're going to be in the center and on the sides. Is that correct? That is. Yes.
And I if that works, how many how many spots are there? So there 45. There was 45. Yes. 36 20 foot and nine and nine nine at 38, right? I'm assuming the the nine have to be on one of the one of the sides. Probably this side
regardless of these are the the big the nine. Okay. Regardless of the number you work out whether there's 45, 35, 30 in any in under any condition, the spots you want to add in the front, are they ever going to be
used by buses? No, they cannot be. Car parking. Okay. You agree to that? Agreed. Yeah. Sure. Uh, and they these spots the spots that are in the center that you're adding. Yes. And those are for cars and they have to be for cars to comply with your
ordinance. Well, I understand that. What happens to the 35 or 40 drivers? Where do they park? They park in their in this bus spot. So, see that never happens. That sounds good, but that never happens because
nobody gets in their bus, pulls it out, gets out of their car, pulls their car in a spot. Just it's just it just it doesn't happen. Well, I I can't say that I'm a bus operator or seen it, but I would suggest that not every all the bus drivers come in at the same time. So, they'll they'll park in a in a spot
that's All right. I experience tells me that that that that really doesn't work that way. But, I mean, it sounds good. Um, and I don't think that that you're ready to commit to a number with the township, I guess,
until they can have you can have a little bit more review on this. You're not going to testify. I I don't know that the board may have some questions for you, Mr. Hopin, but you're not going to uh put any further testimony on, right? But you have a planner you want to put on tonight, right? You're putting a planner on?
Um, yeah. I mean, I'll put I'll put the planner on. Sure. I think just before we do that, I did have two quick follow-up questions just to make sure that um I just want to know what direction we're going. Sure. This is more so just for bookkeeping to make sure that I can cross it off my list so that way later it's not a problem. Uh would it be your
testimony for the porest pavement that it would be of sufficient thickness for whatever vehicle traffic is expected to be on it? Yes, we'll make sure of that. Perfect. Um and then one other question. So looking at the architectural um I believe this was marked as A2. Yes.
Are are there overhead doors on unit two? I guess it's 2-3. Are those overhead doors that are on the side similar to where unit 4 would have overhead doors? Yes. So, there would be a concern then with the the parking that is proposed on that side if it if it is
going to impact those overhead doors. So, I it seems like we're going to come back, right? But, um I will clarify that with with your office. We I think we did attempt to show that and that's where there aren't parking spaces. Sure. But we'll we'll coordinate that between and and make sure that it's shown better on
the plan. Okay. And just to note too, I think it was in our letter, but just to bring it up, um we would probably look to have the ADA stalls relocated to the front just if if the grading allows it just because it's the the point is that it has to be the closest physically possible for the entrance. So that's
just one of the things. I don't know. I saw that there was looked like a bit of grade change from the from the grading plan. So, I don't know if it's feasible, but just something just to take into consideration. Certainly. Will uh you you're you're right on about the grading. So, um it has to be the closest
that works, right? So, but thank you. Um chairman, can I make a suggestion? Go ahead. Uh first, uh I apologize. I jumped in last minute to uh this application. and I was not supposed to cover it and then I started having all
these questions. Usually I if I have questions like that I would have asked up front. I would recommend that you set up a meeting with us prior to coming back so that we could resolve any such issues and we are more prepared when we
come in front of the board. um the township will be more than happy to have a technical review meeting and I mean although I was talking to the um board attorney and I was saying maybe the planner can go in first but if if this
needs to work out then it would make sense for uh and you to come back too so that he can sum up everything uh well uh in terms of positive negative criterias it's a use variance uh and uh
I have heard him before. Uh I have full faith in him. So once we work out the technical part of it, he can come back and then present his testimony if that's okay with the board. Right. It's a suggestion. So the testimony wouldn't be tonight for the planner. We'll bring the planner back when when we all come back.
Unless Donna thinks something else. No, that that's fair. We can do that at during that time. Will all of the matters be decided uh in between the between Mr. Hopkins and and the and uh
the engineer for the township? It'll all be agreed upon or not agreed upon, but it'll be settled. Yes, it'll be settled. Please send me an email and I'll set up a a virtual meeting with the consultants as well as myself and let's sort this out. Yeah. I I do want to let the board
ask any questions should they have any while Mr. Hopkins is here and is fresh in their mind. I'm gonna start on uh this end with Mr. Singh. Anything for this for the engineer? Oh yes, sir. Mr. Scott, go ahead. Mr. Hopkins, this has always been operated as a bus
depot from I I go back. I could see this 11 months ago. You had buses back there? I mean, why why come now to legitimize it? Uh well, I I'm not I'm not the operator. U but I I do
Well, it's it hasn't been forever because alarm had to go off and say you better get over there and get approval. Is that what's happened? Well, I don't know. That's a fair question for the engineer. Uh well, Miss Miss Jenn is that Well, she she's she's not a
witness. No, she's the attorney. Try to get advice from her then. Uh clearly the picture we can see is December 24. There's no doubt that the operation has been going on in some time. Um, and you're here to clarif
clarify that, try and straighten it out. That I understand. Uh, as far as how much time, I don't know that's really that relevant. We if we're going to try and clear this up. Uh, if you have any questions technically of Mr. Hopkin, though, I'm
sure he could answer those and I will be back and I, you know, so I'll wait for you to come back. I think Arnold said that, Mr. Stoner. No, I'm just going to ask the same question. Just beat me to the punch. Yeah. Okay.
I honestly don't know the answer to that. I I have been with us since 2007. I know it hasn't been for that long. We've we've agreed that we know it is and we're going to try and solve this, right? Okay. So, we'll move on from that. Mr.
Okay. Miss Andrews, M test. uh and and I don't have anything because I know we're going to come back and settle this this matter and uh I appreciate your testimony this evening. Um I I would I would be concerned if you want my
personal uh view that we can get these buses situated in such a way that it's a safe issue that they they'll be coordinated. Uh there are other operations going on here. I know that
they're leaving probably very early in the morning and particularly in the darkness. The lighting issue I think is critical as well. Uh the I'm I'm assuming there's only one in and out here. The way this is drawn is an in-n-out driveway. I don't
think the other one is used or it looks I don't know why it would be used but they are they are both used one shared with the adjacent property. Okay. It may be good to discharge them all out one side but okay. That's just my opinion. Uh so if we can get that I think settled
by a meeting and and remitting here, I think that would benefit both the township and certainly the applicant and we can settle these matters. M to address the letter from the fire department which says that felt the plan
was conceptually unsatisfactory. You have this letter so you can talk to him. Yeah. And and Miss Jennings, I know you mentioned that at the beginning and I'm sure you'll take that into uh account. Absolutely. Uh absent any other comments, I'm going to go to a public portion. I just want to offer one thing.
Even the fire marshal is uh available to meet should you try to schedule a meeting with him. Meen can help you set up that meeting. Yeah, we reached out to him to try to because I know how that goes in this town. Um so I tried to resolve that before we got here. We just wasn't able to catch up with him. That's okay. We used to have the fire marshal.
Yeah, I remember. Yes. Cuz you will point to him and say, "Are you okay?" Yes. So, yeah. Wait, wait, wait. I was made sure he said yes. You remember? Yes, I do. All right. Uh, the township, any other questions from the professionals and absent any other comments from here? I'm going to go to a public portion. Okay.
Uh, I can't find the number there. This is matter 54-2024Z. This is 12 industrial drive for uh proposal for add a bus transportation company as a tenant.
Anyone here in this uh room wish to be heard, please raise their hand or stand. There will be further comments and testimony on this matter, but this is the only time tonight that you can have a public portion. There'll be one at each and every meeting. I see none. I'll close the public portion. Final
comments. Uh, Miss Jennings or just the date? Just the date, please. Sure. August 7th. How's our work? Hold on. Take a look. We are booked. I'm free. I'll be here.
I think that's okay. Are you away? Are you good? Andrew, are you okay? Yes. Yes. August 7th. Book it. August 7th. Uh for those watching at home, this matter is going to be
continued. Uh there'll be further testimony to be put on the record. Uh that date right now is scheduled for August 7th. There'll be no further notice. As I've told people before, look on the township website under the zoning board of adjustment. You can always look
up the upcoming agenda and what's on the schedule. I want to thank uh Mr. Hopkins and Miss Jennings for your uh testimony and for your counsel this evening. We look forward to seeing you come back after you work things out. Thank you so much. All right. Have a great night. Thank you.
Enjoy the beginning of the summer. We'll see you near the end. Uh this does close out board the uh applications for the evening. Is there anyone here in the courtroom that wants to bring a matter before the uh board
tonight? Everyone here is with the professionals, right? All right. I see none. So, I'm going to close the general public comment if that's okay, Mr. uh Dasty. That's okay. Board members absent. Any comments? Left, right? Our
next meeting, Moren, is May 15. Yes. May 15th. May 15th, we'll meet again. Someone uh want to move for an adjournment. That's the verdy. All in favor signify by saying I. I. Those opposed.
We stand a journ. Happy