e e e e e e I'd like to start the meeting with all everyone please rise for salute to the flag pledge allegiance to the flag
[Music] States all please be seated welcome everyone Township of vbridge zoning Board of adjustment regular meeting February 20 2025 adequate notice of this meeting of the Oldbridge Township Zoning Board of
adjustment has been provided in accordance with the open public meetings act at least 48 Hours PRI of the commencement of this meeting by prominently posting in the municipal complex an announcement giving the time the date the location and the agenda of this meeting also by mailing such announcement to the home uh news and
Tribune filing a copy of such announcement with the municipal clerk and also posting the agenda on the municipal website do we have a roll call please miss portelli certainly Mrs Andrews present Chevalier here Mr ISO
here Mr scagno here Mr Stoner here miss testy absent Mr Singh here miss Gomez absent chairman Sullivan here just there's a couple housekeeping items the meeting is uh simultaneously being
broadcast on catv CH 15 here in the township uh as well as YouTube live if you ever want to see the meeting again for any reason you could look that up on YouTube probably in the next few days when they post it uh I would ask everyone here in the room to please
silence your cell phones so those that may be testifying in deference to them we don't want to interrupt that and I'm sure everyone has one so please do so uh tonight we have uh minutes on our agenda first board that would be the minutes of
January 16 2025 meeting hope everyone has had a chance to look at them absent any uh comments I would ask someone to move them for adoption please Cher move it second scagno moved in second roll call please Mrs Andrews yes Miss chevier
yes Mr ISO yes Mr scagno yes Mr Stoner yes Mr Singh yes chairman Sullivan yes all right I'm ask uh Mr Dy if you'd please swear in Dan hollahan or zoning officer Sor I do thank you very much we'll move on to
our applications we're going to take them in order uh you're sitting here in the room 55224 Z Rael Bellow it's a R5 medium high density Zone that's block 1069 lot
6.11 the physical locations 59 Rosewood Drive this is an applicant seeking to propose a shed 14 in from the side property line where 3 foot minimum as required going to require SE variant is someone here for that matter ma'am please come
up uh you're going to be the only one testifying this evening are you Ro are you Raquel okay board attorney's going to swear you in please please raise your right hand do you swear or airm to tell the whole through S if you got give us your full name spell your last
yeah you can if you would do me a favor put there's a button on there on the front of the microphone yep push it and it should turn green around there you go it's a directional mic so when you you can be seated and you can speak right into it okay so we'll pick that up um you did spell your last name for us
right no not yet b as in boy e l as in Larry O as an octopus okay we know that you have applied for variance from the board um you're not representing by any you do you have any uh other pieces of evidence that you may want to show us pictures or anything no I didn't think
all right all I'm going to ask you to do simply is do the who what why where and how routine okay uh the board just wants to hear why why do you need this what happened uh what brought you here tonight we may have some questions of
you you may have some questions from us we're going to ask our zoning officer next why you're here you'll inform the board as to the ordinance uh the final uh thing that I have to do I have to open up a public portion so I would PLL the audience if anyone wanted to speak on this matter
once we close that I go back to you you may have some final last words or we may have some final last words and then I'm going to ask you if you want to take a vote if for some reason something goes wrong during the application that you don't feel you've provided enough uh
evidentiary uh commentary on the record you're entitled to a continuance so I just want want you to keep that in mind I'm not saying I don't know how it's going to go to end on one vote that's all but I just warn you that you still have the opportunity to not take a vote tonight uh if if you feel it may not be
in your favor okay so you can start at your own pace and your own words we're all homeowners here in the township just like you are so we're we're simply volunteers we're willing to listen while you're here the gentleman to my right is the attorney uh obviously he uh has to
be here in order to keep us out of trouble okay go right ahead um so it started a couple years ago with my neighbor we were friends before then and then one night he left his dogs in the house and it was pretty late and shot him a text I like hey your dog is it's
1: in the morning your dog's kind of causing a ruckus and he sent a really nasty response back and then the next day he got into an argument with my husband and it just started with a lot of harassments a lot of police um were called and like we have a whole history
of all of that so we went from being good friends and good neighbors to oh wow you're kind of crazy um we did court court said hey just keep away from each other don't talk to each other I was like okay fine no problem um then he I
run a business from my home I have a bakery he called middlex County to come to my house and check on my Cottage license and then the next day was the zoning board to check on my new shed which by the way he helped install the sheetrock in the shed and the like I had
it finished so that I can put all my bakery stuff in there and he helped with that and I paid him for it and let me just say something to you there's probably a little bit more that you're telling us than you need to yeah at this I just wanted to know where where it's coming from we're here to just to hear
something about the shed the distance the setbacks those other issues I'm not saying that they're unimportant but I really don't want you to put things on the record that don't belong on the record that's fair okay that's fair I just wanted you why it's being why he decided to
complain essentially um but that's fine we can go back to the shed is about a foot and a half um closer to the fence than it should be um when they installed it I didn't measure I you know the poor guys were out there with these PVC pipes
installing this pretty heavy shed and I was like it's down it's good you guys look tired it's a hot day go home you know um and then I it was almost a year later that you guys came out and were like hey it's not close it's not it's
too close to the so you were unfamiliar with the setbacks I'm sure I I didn't pull out a tape measure when saying you were you were unfamiliar with it like I I filed for you didn't you didn't put the install it someone installed it for you yeah yeah uh and how long ago was
that I want to say it's been two years now two years yeah maybe a year I don't know I've had several concussions so my memory is a little off sorry so we know that it's slightly too close to where about a foot and a half okay too close all right let we talk to the zoning
officer we'll see what happens right stay there Mr hollan thank you chairman just chill got it um yes so miss Bellow she had originally filed for a zoning permit application um back on March um 9th of 2023 to install a 12x10 shed not
dictated on the survey but it's along the right side property line um it's about parallel with the rear um building line of the house um it when she had proposed the application it was proposed at 3T from the property line which is consistent with the ordinance so a
zoning perent was issued um like she had said it was born of a complaint from a um a neighbor that the shed may have been installed too close to the property line um so a code enforcement inspection was done an nvv was issued because of the placement of the shed wasn't
consistent um with what the um zoning permit that issued was so um come to find out the shed was placed about 14 in from the property line where the 3 ft is required um so that's why Miss Bell is here tonight seeking that variance approval for the 14 in where 3 feet is
required okay so we're talking about a difference of 22 Ines is it correct yes uh board members any questions on my left have a question I'm sorry was there a permit taken out yes yes a permit yes yeah and who
installed it a contractor um the shed company shed company I bought the shed from Home Depot and and the shed company reviewed the permit I don't know they should know the distance what I think I believe it says it on the permit is that not correct
yes possibly so they installed it they installed it yeah yeah and what about the runoff if it rains would it go into your neighbor's yard no there's there's an off there and there's also a ditch in front of the fence that all the the rain goes into yeah but it would cause flooding you think no no because the my
husband installed a concrete patio and it's pitched towards um the backyard he does pavers and road building in um my concern is that you actually took out a permit which you were correctly doing I think the shed company is the one who took out the permit so I didn't see it
until this complaint came up okay thank you mhm anybody else on my left your your fence yes between you and your neighbor yes is the shed higher than the fence it is
um enough where that could be a complaint I or it's a normal it's a normal shed yeah it's not you know an eyes sore or anything that's the word yeah is that the word you looking for yeah Vice chair yeah what's the exact
size of your chest uh your shed do you know the dimensions right um it's an8 by I want to say I can ask my husband by 10 Mr you so sorry I didn't know you were gonna ask all the permit was for a
12 by10 12 by 10 yes exactly anything else no uh I have nothing miss Andrew yes was there a shed there before there was not no all right anything else you want to tell us counselor thank you is there is it on
a concrete slab or it is it is MH and is it like fixed into the concrete no it's not just resting on top of it correct and what what do you keep in the my B my baking items so um I run a business
for my home so all of the extras for the business so boxes wrapping things um packaging Goods home items you have in there correct yeah okay is it hooked up at all to electric
or getting no thank you and no water I would assume no and it's not going to be no all right anything I'm sorry C if you're looking at which side is the shed on um it is on the right hand side where
the driveway is on the driveway side yes okay thanks you're welcome anything else you want to tell us at this point no I just would like this to be over with okay I do have to go to a public portion I'm going to open that now we'll see if anybody has any coms
sure uh M this is matter 55- 2024 Z the physical locations 59 rows would drive this is for a setback on a shed uh 3 foot required uh we're minus we're 22 in off because it's it's only 14 anyone here in the room this evening want to be
heard in this matter please raise your hand or come forward I think I've given ample time no one has I'll close the public portion uh final comments no board any uh comments before I ask for I'm going to ask you if you want to call you going to call for a
vote Yes okay any final comments board none none okay away we go okay uh this is for I think he said I wanted go ahead um how difficult would it be for you to move
the concrete slab and and the shed difficult enough that I chose the more expensive option thank you so would certainly be a hardship yes okay and I just I just wanted to be clear that the person that did make the
complaint did help install the sheetrock in the shed so he knew where it was placed okay when we were still friendly so right councelor C1 or C2 this would be a c okay board C2 someone want to move it for or
against Cher move it against second scogna roll call for against yes would be meaning no not no approval correct Mrs Andrews I'm sorry I'm confused but I'm
not against it so you would you would say no you're against the motion Miss Chevalier yes Mr ISO no Mr scagno yes Mr Stoner
no Mr Singh yes chairman Sullivan no so I have questions because I don't I don't understand what just happened it's a plurality you've been approved oh great no means you approve no means yeah yes
in this case Yes Yes means no got it if we could let's let's have an affirmative vote to approve it by the four people at least sure those those four would you call the same four again please Waring Mrs Andrews this would be for an
affirmative vote for approval yes Mr ISO yes Mr Stoner yes chairman Sullivan yes I think that clears things up uh nicely I'm glad you did that thank you you've been approved
sure uh if there are any do you need any further permits from the township you're going to need I believe permits for the sheetrock inside of it um so if you want to call my office um tomorrow morning or if you want to come
visit we we can discuss further yes okay look on the bright side it's been approved okay thank you for appearing before the board thank you have a good night okay next matter is 58- 2024 Z it's Eric Savvy this is the uh R9 Zone medium high
density residential it's block 26001 lot 21.13 physical location on this is 51 Shirley Boulevard requiring C variants applicant proposes a rear yard deck 12 Ines from the side yard line where 23 uh is
required Mr zvy sir 12 I'm sorry did I say 12 inches it's 12 feet yeah he was testing you would you raise your right hand do you swear or affirm to tell the whole truth so help you got give us your whole name spell your last is Sam a b is Victor I thank you
are you represented sir yes I am counselor for the record yeah push that button on there sir thanks directional so you're going to have to get close Gentlemen please feel free to sit I used to have a stronger voice in my younger day uh my
name is Lawrence appid uh and I represent the LLC that Mr Savvy is the owner of and the LLC which I checked today is in good standing and uh he is a
member was that what's the name of the LLC Els properties El as properties thank you so yours councelor maybe I'll yes thank you um
who the who what where how and why um short answer uh looking to replace an existing deck uh that uh turns out uh was 12 feet from the uh the property line on 53 Shirley Boulevard uh where 23
ft is is required I purchased a house five and a half years ago um just you know the even during the time that uh went for the temporary co uh inspector pointed out that the deck you know there were certain beams and uh and areas that that
needed repair um there's never any mention that um that there wasn't a variance with respect to the deck um when I went to replace it uh because it was in in poor condition did file a permit uh um and it turns out that the permit then
was declined and I was surprised and uh was uh informed that uh it was uh declin because there was no record of a variance uh having been issued at that time all I'm doing is it's essentially the same footprint of the existing deck
that deck had been there at least 15 years um so that that's the uh the short uh story to uh why I'm here today just seeking that barrance it's all yours the prosecute counselor yes
um you requested that I make an Oprah request of the town to find out whether this deck was originally uh constructed there is that right yep I have a copy I can move into evidence of the response apparently there's the town uh does not
have any records the original building permits and the I've been out there myself and you're talking about an old deck that needs to be done and it looks to be as if it was probably part of the original construction and um since the town has
no records anymore this goes back to the 1970s that's a good decade uh they they don't have the record so it's it's difficult to ascertain after was it 30 years 40 years
I don't know uh I was young then uh uh ascertain what was the original application because you don't have the records so you could only assume that it was built that way and it's been that way for 40 years or
so and uh uh I think that as a result of that uh the it needs to be redone obviously after all these years and it's not going to be it's kind of a I mean I wouldn't walk on it right now but it needs to be
done and um and that's what uh Mr Savvy wants to do and he'd like permission to uh uh to rebuild the deck uh so it's safe it's second
floor and also to uh move the stairs to the deck from the downstairs from the left side which is closer to the sideline to the right side which is uh which is uh uh meets the
requirements if I may add that's the only material change the exact footprint of the U the the deck is uhu similar to what was there for as as far as I'm aware at least 15 plus years but councelor you putting something into
into evidence yes like this give it to Mr dasty okay it's right there on your chairman I'm I'm marking as A1 what appears to have been a uh an oer request dated 109 of 24 thank you
thank uh from uh Mr Abbott's office asking for for this property the original building application building permit building any other building permits and an application to build the rear deck at the rear of the property as
well as some other open open permits Etc and uh Mr AB you represented that the town's told you there ain't none it's on there in the second page oh yeah number seven uh no records responsive to this request
okay all right thank you sir Mr hollan thank you chairman um yes so Mr Savvy had filed an application with my office back in September um of 2024 to replace the existing deck mean Savvy um me Mr Savvy work together on this a little bit
um based on the lack of records that I found in in the history that or the lack of history that I was able to dig up my inclination was that the deck that was existing there that he was looking to replace um was constructed without permit so um due to the height of the
deck with this being in the r six Zone obviously the height determines the setback of the deck um so at a 10ft high deck um where he is proposing 16.4 feet from the property line he's required 23 feet minimum um I I don't know if I
agree that the house was built with the deck um I have looked up some aerial images of Shirley Boulevard um usually if one house is built with the deck they're all built with the deck um some houses do some houses don't some have different size decks different location along the rear of the house um I I would
comfortably say that the existing deck was constructed without permits um so Mr Savvy is here trying to um replace that deck and and seek that sidey guard variance relief so and would you speak to the uh moving the
stairway yes so the existing Deck shows the stairway along the rear building line and Mr Savvy is proposing to relocate that stairway um along the left side of the deck closer to the left side property line and that in effect is the problem
right not necessarily no um could the the stairway go on the other side or was it originally on the other side the stairway if you look is along the rear yard yep um I'm sorry the rear building line um with the give me one sec yeah if
if I can maybe interject for a second the the edge of the deck was flush with the edge of the house which was about 16 ft so it was already uh in violation of the required setback and then the only change is again Sy aesthetically and and
functionally to have the the stairs rather than running you know underneath the house alongside I think Mr chairman answer your question if he relocated the steps to the original position he would still require variance relief that I understand I just wanted to see he ex exacerbating it even more by correct y
That's why I was curious what purpose does it serve putting him over there the purpose is again it's a very long deck it was I mean staircase that was running right alongside of the edge it's it intersected again the way it was
done with the with the doorway leading to the back so it wasn't an efficient layout why does why does the they directional Sir You Pull It Forward to towards you um Mr zoning official why does the
uh I forgot your name I'm sorry Danny um why does the proposed steps do steps violate a sideline so when I measure the setback he my denial letter
reference is 16 feet 4 in so when I measure the setback of a deck I don't measure the stairs I measure it to the closest point of the walking surface of the deck minus the stairs so it's actually a little bit closer um to the stairs less than 16 uh 4 in so the
setback is measured from the Walking surface of the deck structure not necessarily the stairs so the so the stairs are not the problem correct all right thank you anything else you want to tell us see if we have any questions from
on I left questions for the uh attorney or the applicant the applicant yeah I I do why can't you move the deck over you have it right flush to the corner of the house you just move your deck over and shorten the stairs it would cause a hardship because there's a
door leading from the second floor on the left hand side of the uh the house what kind a door sliding door to go out to the deck so if you move it over I think that's the issue to be flush with the house according to the rules that's what's driving the setback but the door
is near the left hand side of of that deck so moving it over I'd have to close up that door open up a brand new siding door so it's just an added hardship where is the door yeah the door is on the on the biggest
bulk part of the deck is that what you're saying yep but it could be done it's an economic hardship and again I'm just asking for Relief here for something that I didn't do that the house was an
eyesore um including that backyard deck and uh you know I put quite a bit of money into you know the front to make it uh more aesthetic to uh the existing neighbors's property line the neighbor who in next to us uh 53 Shirley
Boulevard was has a you know friends with him never had an issue with that existing deck doesn't have a problem with the um the application so he's really the only person that would be impacted uh and and he hasn't lodged a uh an issue unless he's on the on the
line but do you live here at this address so no longer my son will be living there it's an LLC yeah no that's why I was just shus and then um so you feel it's the board's responsibility to just grant the variance for a non-conforming
deck and just keep it non-conforming is that what you're asking for well I hate to take legal positions because no it's okay I'm just sometimes I'm actually correct um since I made the Oprah request and since it would seem to me
the obligation of the town is to have these uh plans before the house was built I mean it wasn't built 1800s it was built in 1970s where are the plans and therefore I would think that the uh decision has
to come down to there's a burden on the town to prove that it wasn't that that it was wasn't built that way they should have we have no control over those plans but when you buy a property isn't it buyer beware and check into
everything yeah yeah there there was there was no there was no plans when he bought the property and when I did my opah request it shows as as there that they don't have the plans so we don't know when the deck was built we can only
assume that was built when the house was built and because there's a door going out to the deck it makes more sense that the that the uh uh that the deck was there when they originally uh when they originally
buil the house um maybe the other thing I would add is so you know as a condition obviously to closing was the issuance of a CO and during that application process the town inspector did come out and there was no mention of the deck being in
violation um the only thing that was pointed out that there were certain aspects of that deck um some of the steps some of the um the columns that uh was in u poor enough condition uh that was asked to make those uh repairs which
were made temporarily and now this is the you know a couple years later uh to do the full replacement I don't know that when you've got a CO that they're doing calculations for zoning requirements Co inspections really are for life safety
inspections they're not checking if a deck or shed or other structures have permits right that's that was my understanding as well counselor it's not that's I don't think that gets passed back to the town but that's for debate
uh let me ask you a question do you have any other pictures that can show me where this back door is the sliding door I don't have the pictures well could you point it out on the survey here whereabouts yeah I mean I think it's right around where
the yeah represent so it's almost in the middle of the pry thank you both uh let me ask good question why you build it in reverse then we wouldn't have a setback issue well I could rip the whole house
down too but you know the real the real question why would he have to rip the house down he's building a saying well we could do we could rip the whole house down and and and put up a new one but the point of it is is that there's nothing of record to show that this was not approved at the time the house was
built and that is is the uh requirement of the Town that's why we have that's why we have plans and that's why we have building permits can I ask Mr H question you can ask any question you want to move forward instead of working
backwards if you want to erect the deck MH he has to follow a certain criteria a rule correct and like like I said earlier in my testimony my position is there are no records for the deck plans because a permit was never filed for the
deck that's at least my position that I've taken so let me let me add if I may uh chairman um so there is an added hardship here well I'm going to make two two points first off the only property owner that this would impact is 53
shirle and that deck has been there for 15 plus years uh never had an issue with it he knows that it's being replaced was okay with it the additional hardship is I'm trying to do everything by the book so the the contractor that started
actually started started the Demolition and initial initial installation of the deck and again the same footprint of the existing so if I'm being asked to reorient I'm out of pocket I mean so when I found out and asked about where the permit I guess the contractor
assumed that the permit was going to be approved and started the construction and then you know it turned out to be rejected so I would add ask that the council consider that additional hardship my closing argument
again is all I'm doing is replacing the existing deck same dimensions it only affects that one property owner who's been there that whole time and hasn't raised an issue sir are you taking it down to the
ground the old one what's that you're taking the ground yeah okay why wouldn't you turn it around they already started the construction I PA that let me let me ask Mr hollan was construct were you the property at the property I've never been at the property
now what so when was your ruling issued and when did this when did this construction start can I ask why would it need to be reoriented I'm going to run into the same we mitigate the V the various no I think I'm going to have an issue on the other side given that that property line that because the edge of
the house is also in within 1216 ft sir this you're an LC right yes okay so you own this home probably others this is the only other one in my own my own personal so do you want the full story no you don't have to put anything on the record you don't want to sir I'm
not I'm not getting it wasn't meant for a business but it was um basically my granddaughters had lived there and they were moving out they were going to lose the house and I bought the house I'm trying to help you to get it pasted yeah no I I I appreciate that so
I'm just asking for again just I get it but consider where you need a plurality of votes y I understand and I don't know if you're going to get that right now so that'll be you rolling the dice and if you lose you're going to wind up
changing it anyway you're going to have to change it so I'm just giving you a fair warning and C your Council will will tell counselor will tell you the same thing because if you lose on the vote and and what I asked for all the council members
to consider again is members only board members counts that deck has been there forever I'm trying to go by the book it only impacts that one homeowner that homeowner hasn't had an issue um that homeowner may not be there
forever some other homeowner may move in let me m Mr yeah Mr Dy sorry he was mentioning proof burden on the town I'm kind of curious there's no burden on the town in terms of not not having a permit not a
rule okay thank you no he's right you you've done the right thing you've rectified this where you where you're trying to do it legal whether there was one in the past or not prior to your ownership you say you booted five years ago five and a half years ago five and a half years ago and then we went back 15
years and your counselor said something about 40 years there's no records well I know I guess I'm saying I know from the the prior um neighbor I think he's been there since 2006 so the deck was already there and and my granddaughters and their mother had been there she grew up in
that house so I think they bought it in the early 70s so it's been there I understand that and and this point you still need a variance yeah no I understand I know you've done the right thing but you're still going to have to get the votes from the board I'm
just yeah trying to advise you as best as I can questions on my left anymore none just to clarify this is demolished and you're re directing the whole deck brand new but it had the contractor had already started
considering and then so it would be an added hardship and again I'm trying to do a right thing where some people will just replace the deck or whatever and I was surprised that after and I wasn't aware that when you get a temporary certificate of occupancy and an inspector comes and points out just
certain flaws with the actual condition but assume that again the deck was you know all proper variances so I would ask that that be um considered as well well I don't know that we're going to consider anything that an inspector
said because we can't prove or disprove that he may have been a nice guy and said by the way you're looking at some problems here with the wood but he certainly wasn't qualified probably as a zoning officer he doesn't have the certifications of Mr hollan would have so while I understand you may have been
misled that's that was of your own doing and certainly not part of the Township's Fault by the way I do have a copy of the temporary co uh was we don't doubt that that happened yeah I don't think anybody Patrick re construction do you have anything for I'm going to move on I'm
going to go to a public portion first yeah um I know you want to go by the book but you knew ahead of time that the deck did not there were no papers for the deck and you went on just with the idea of replacing with the same footprint and
that's that's very very different than buying it with the deck and fixing the deck now down the deck and you putting up a new one but you want to stay in the same footprint when there was no permits as far as we know there's no proof that there was anything there but there's no
I guess our Point going by the book by the book would be you would go by what the uh the side yard should be I think what my attorney is saying the Assumption was when we ran all the checks and it's temporary CEO that the deck was always there I think that's the
issue when did you do the report where you found that there were no perit ever permitted I think even on the initial purchase of the House of of when you started the construction the uh before it appears to be the Oprah request is dated
10924 and and you had the house but when back in 2019 and when did you decide to to redo at the time we filed the permit but then you knew you knew about this before you you started no so I filed for
the permit but then when the permit was rejected that's when I found out that it wasn't in variance with the going on when you found that out when you were rejected by the per I was not unaware that the contractor had started after filing the permit and that there was a
time lag well and then I immediately put a stop to it consulted with Mr hollahan about next potential steps and that's why I'm here you know I don't have any problem dealing with the the matter at hand what happened in the past really is
incidental you've tried to do the right thing by coming and applying for one but you've also found out that you need a variance so in doing so you now you've exacerbated it and and I and again it's probably going to be the same way on the other side you're saying I don't know
without asking Dan to do the math on that um and we sit here we're talking about a couple feet for the stairs in addition to the existing understand that you would think you would have control over your contractor why would you let him start I
I mean that's that's a rhetorical question I don't I don't expect you to answer but you have control over your contractor not the contractor controls you in any event uh I'm going to go to public portion if you need time to speak with your counselor uh about whether you
want to call for a vote tonight I would suggest you do so only because I have a feeling that you may not have enough votes tonight I'm merely suggesting and councelor you take that under advis with your with with your client uh let me go to a public portion first okay Mr Savvy
let me just excuse me Mr chairman Mr savvy are you replacing the deck because it's dangerous or yeah okay and did I hear you say that the elevation is changing I same elevation everything's the same except just reorienting the stairs so it's a couple additional feet
okay and you applied to the the town to get this deck approved and when you did that what did you submit to the town to get a new your plans the records and then it got rejected because Mr hollahan noticed that the existing even the
existing deck wasn't you know in the proper setback and then we did all check there's no record of a you know variance all right thank you I'll go to public portion this is 58 uh 2024 Z the physical location of this
is 51 uh Shirley Boulevard seeking variants for uh rear yard deck uh 12 foot from the side uh side yard property line we're 23 required anyone want to speak on this matter please stand or raise your hand no one has I'll close the public
portion I really don't know what to tell you I have no more comments I've asked you if you could reorient it and perhaps I'm not capable of doing the math on it I don't know if it would even change anything Mr hollan would maybe know that but that's really for you and
an engineer to figure out um I'll leave it at that I'll ask if there's any final comments before if you want to call for a vote this evening is anybody on my left want to make any final comments no none M Andrews none
counselor no nothing else all right would you would you like a brief moment to well I would like to make one final comment to address a question you asked whether it's an investment property the intention wasn't to be investment property and the reason I'm bringing this up is I'm saying it's going to be a hardship and I don't want the uh boor to
think well what kind of hardship is it is a guy that buys and flips homes I purchased the home because my granddaughters were living there their their other grandfather who owned the house had passed away house went into foreclosure so I purchase so that they
don't have to move out of the Oldbridge school system so I'm not doing so it will be a hardship I'm not doing this this isn't the business where I'm flipping and so if you think oh so what for him he can just tear it down and build another one that was never the intention why I bought the house I just
would like to leave you with that no I understand that and it's admirable what you're doing and I don't think that the board took that in I'm merely saying that as a LLC you for liability protection and and again you may do it for whatever purposes and and that's private that's
and I don't think that comes into play Just tell you the truth you you do I said you're doing the right thing you came forward you found out there was never a a permit review ever uh whether or not the records are lost it's incidental to me in my opinion uh you're
here for a new my you're starting over in my mind so we'll we'll see what happens but if you'd like to if you ask me to call for a vote it's going to be final tonight so if you'd like to step outside for a moment and talk about it I'll I'll give you a brief few minutes
okay let's go off the Record uh we'll take a quick two or three minute recess please thank you e ready to proce came back from that brief reassess we allowed it's client and uh himself to step outside and discuss the matter uh
I'll need a roll call please uh M belli sure Mrs Andrews present Miss Chevalier here Mr ISO here Mr scagno here Mr Stoner here Mr s here chairman Solomon I am also here we're dealing with matter 58-
2024 Z the location 51 Shirley bouevard we had a public portion we closed we briefly recessed in order for the applicant to speak with his attorney uh councelor you speaking on behalf of your client yes call for a vote call for a
vote okay uh board this would be uh C1 right this is C1 variance someone interested in moving it please say so Cher I'll move it is there a second Andrew second moved in second for
approval roll call was it I'm sorry the motion was to approve the yes to approve okay roll call please Mrs Andrews hold on is there you said move it what did you mean to move move it to affirm or deny it deny oh I didn't hear
you say that sorry okay I hold on it to deny start all over let's let's restart here what I'm going to do is call for a motion the motion can be to for approval or it can before denial would someone like to make a
motion Shero make a motion to deny is there a second to deny Andrew second okay once again board members a yes vote means to deny a no vote means you don't want to deny okay and then we'll go if
uh if we need to we'll take another vote for affirmative action for affirmative um motion if needed yes so it's no it's yes to deny and please say it in those words so you're clear roll call please Mrs Andrews yes to deny Miss Chevalier
yes to deny Mr ISO I'm going to say yes to deny with um in regards to we starting this from scratch I could see no reason why it can't be done correct so yes to deny okay Mr scagno yes to
denying Mr Stoner no Mr Sing yes to deny chairman Sullivan I'm going to have to agree uh I think it's the time that you have the opportunity to correct it and you
haven't taken that opportunity I would have thought perhaps you wouldn't have take them takeen in the uh roll call vote tonight but I'm also going to have to say yes to denight I'm sorry but this has failed the
application thank you thank you counselor thank you uh Mr Savvy well appreciate it all right sir all I've been doing this for 58 years two more years all right we have
uh one more application board 59 days 2024 Z Derek foron this is uh R7 medium high density residential this is block 260 26027 lot 7814 physical location is 164 Boston
Avenue applicant proposes a second driveway sir good evening you are Derek would you have a you can sit down because we need to pick up your voice on this and as as you have seen the board attorney is going to swear you in yes sir sir do you swear to tell the whole
truth so help you got yes and would you give us your full name spell your list Derek foron f r TI n all right Mr foron the same applies you're not represented by anyone correct correct you have any other Witnesses this evening no do you have any pictures
or anything else that you'd like to show the board as uh exhibits I don't believe so okay so it's the who what when where why and you can start off whenever you want sir so I'd like to do a second curb cut on Austin Avenue um and I'm doing
the variance because I don't have 200 feet of linear uh property front so I need board approval to do the second curb cut the reason for the second curve cut um I plan on making um my basement
into a second unit turning my single family home into a uh two family home uh the reason for the driveway is going to be for safety um I don't want to see anybody um parking on the street walking
any farther than they have to do in snow or rain and then also for snow removal to keep additional cars off the street okay anything else you want to tell us at this point I would just have one question do you you applied for uh making your home a two family I haven't
applied for permit or yet I just want to see if I could do um if this was acceptable I do know that I'm in I am in an R7 so I know that it's I don't need a variance to do a two family home in that
area that's correct you guys yes okay uh board members questions on my left no I'm sorry the driveway now is it cemented so the original driveway on the
right side of the picture is all uh existing concrete so the new driveway is going to be on the left side of the survey in Red so the second entrance would be on the that side of the house
so if I don't do that and it's a two family house potentially people would have to walk much much farther all the way around the house you know to enter your apartment so to speak so you're Now
using that as a driveway aren't you don't you have cars in that area I have cars on the right side of the survey yes in the existing concrete driveway I'm proposing on the left side a curb cut for a new stone driveway the driveway to
the garage right and be to the right of that don't you have another cement pad there there is enough there to get a couple of cars but again um like I said so you already made the cement pad for
to get to get to the back there is an existing cement pad for the existing house that's there yes I it's nothing new no did you have the the cement put in afterwards no this is brand new
construction we built this house and started in 2007 the CEO was in 20133 everything you see here in black is existing up to today's date from the original plans dated
2007 so the concrete is existing from the original construction so the concrete to the to the garage is but to the right of that don't you have who put that in this your original contractor in 2000 he put a cement slab
yes correct going all the way back yes correct and so you want to turn the front of that which is gravel now you want to add no no no the other side of the house yeah the other side of the house yeah if you reference the drawing
where the red marker is it's completely it's 80 feet away it's 80 feet on the opposite property line okay I was looking at the right side of the house right that's existing so I need a curb cut on the right side of the drawing where the red
ink is sorry left side of the drawing sorry sorry sorry let's get some clarification from yeah from Mr holl Dan thank you um yes so the applicant is here tonight seeking a design waiver for a second essentially point of access or second
driveway to an existing residential lot um our ordinance permits two access points um aside from a circular driveway on residential lots granted that they have at least 200 linear feet of Frontage along a roadway because this
lot has 104 feet Which is less than the 200 feet then he needs the design waiver for the second driveway um should the applicant move forward with converting the basement into a two- family house he's going to need additional parking anyway um our ordinance requires at
least 1.5 we round up to two parking spaces per dwelling unit um his driveway being under 30 ft the existing one on the right is only sufficient for two parking for two vehicles so he would either need to get a design waiver to
extend the existing driveway because then it would have to be at least 40t in width um or get a design waiver to um install a second driveway um so just to sum it up it would be a design waiver for the installation of a second driveway the why wouldn't this be a c
variance instead of a design waiv driveway it's not so the driveway is part of the design standard so with driveway setbacks and driveways we've treated them more recently as design waivers rather than we have yeah we have but
that was was Lot line like is the proposal on this zero No 5 feet so he's he's proposing a consistent setback with the ordinance the the only thing that he needs relief from the board for is that second point
of access because he doesn't have the 200 linear feet of Frontage is there a on the left side of the house not that I'm aware of Mr for is on right side on the right side yes one um I believe it's a twocc car
garage okay it's on I'm sorry excuse me then he has room for thank you sorry he has room for four cars so actually no because the driveway pulls into the garage so that garage
would be only for the upstairs unit you can't you can't block that garage with other cars I'm not um Council I'm not sure of the width of the driveway um I've done somewhere I would say between 25
and 30 ft um so anything over 20 ft could accommodate two vehicles plus the two in the driveway so yes I would agree that he could potentially have enough parking for four vehicles how deep how deep were you
planning on putting this back almost to the house yes I planned on putting Stone from the curb almost to the house to give you room to put two cars one in front of the other and side by side so chairman the width of the proposed Drive
driveway is 20 ft and then the depth of it or the length of it is 2927 ft correct I visited your house it's got great curb appeal it's not going to anymore if you do this I understand that um and that's just a comment an opinion
I don't know why you would want want to ruin that and I don't know what the necessity would be where would the entrance if you're going to have a basement apartment so I'm clearly just doing this for safety and to keep cars off the road
for snow removal um the second entrance would be on the top left backside of the house to get into the basement okay along along the same route
yes as you look at the house to the left yeah as you look at the house to the left in the red square is the proposed driveway if you walk again you know if this all goes through I'm going to propose I'm going to make the unit downstairs there's going to be a a
sidewalk going in that same path between the fence and the house up to the back of the house so if you park you know in the existing driveway you would then have to walk all the way 150 180 ft
around the H the home to get to your um door so for safety reasons and for parking and to keep cars off the road that road is traditionally heavily parked anyway the streets yes
yes questions of the applicant thank you no no none yes go ahead you live there now yes I do and you plan on living there yes I do thank you
Council you have anything no sir all right uh if you don't have anything at this point I'm going to go to a public portion I'll come back to you again I'm going to ask you if you want to take take a vote uh or rethink it this is 59- 2024 Z the me uh physical locations 164
Austin a for design waiver for a second driveway uh on the front front of the property anyone here in the courtroom wish to be heard on this matter please raise your hand stand no one has I'll close the public
portion it's back to you for final comments I'd like to go to a vote you will you want to take a vote please okay all right board this is this is design waiver only you're saying coun I I kind of think it's a seat but I don't mean to
uh correct the zoning officer but I think it's a variance but here we are okay yeah I think I worked with ven on deciding whether or not but I would side with Council whatever he he says the gentleman is has noticed for
the second driveway so whether he called it a design waiver or a variance The public's been noticed about it I personally think it would be more characterized as a variance but uh I don't have an issue unless the chairman of the board does based upon that if you
want to go forward with it now well I think I think that when we were using design for driveways it was it was a lot of non non-compliance with the 5 foot setback uh and people
were these people bought these homes years ago with single car driveways and of course they expanded as their families expanded and generationally we've changed so I see the need where where people made wider driveways often they would put them right to the lot line not knowing that
there was so we went to design waivers on that but I don't know that it applies and but I'll take your word for it I think I don't think it's I think it's a variance but I don't chairman and Council if I may so we call them design weers dealing with driveway setbacks because it violates the design standard
section of our code AS does this um so that's why we typically call driveway setbacks we typically call them variances previous Council said that was incorrect we should be calling them design waivers so this Falls within the same section of the code as the driveway
setback so we've called them design waivers I know getting a curb cut onto onto the municipal roadway I think that's that's a for form more proof than just that you are you're on the lot line of your neighbor yeah that's just my
opinion but uh if if if you're advising us to go with the design W room if it's okay with Council our Council I'm good with it you're good yes sir okay we'll we'll handle it as a design wer go ahead uh is this an LLC no no
okay thank you no if it was LLC he'd have to be represented okay okay anything else everybody good all right not an HOA area your home no no no someone interested in moving this is
for a design waiver for a second driveway for second uh curb cut and driveway uh on the property 200t required where that's not available one interested in moving this for approval or for denial Isel move for
approval is there a second for that I'll second in Stoner roll call please for approval Mrs Andrews no Miss Chevalier no Mr ISO yes Mr
scagno no Mr Stoner yes Mr Sing no chairman Sullivan uh I'm GNA have to stick with the board I I don't believe that really this is necessary and I'm sorry but my
my vote is my vote is no thank you for appearing before the board sir we appreciate it all right board that was uh our final application for the evening general public comments uh folks are you here for any comments
no I I was just well hold on if you want to speak you have to come up sir I get the impression sir do you have something to say about the application we just voted on yes well it's a little late now okay I don't mind you talking go ahead Sor well it doesn't have to be
on the well it is on everything's on the record it's an open public meeting so we have to have everything on the record got and I understand that you may have a difference of opinion with the board I just I do want to remind you the vote is final yes and and uh yes it can't be uh
taken back up again so we'll certainly listen to you who are you sir uh my name is Michael foron okay I was actually going to move in the uh okay building down when it was done I'm Derek's father and um
so I'm not sure why the board wouldn't approve a driveway to keep the additional cars off the road considering the board already knows this road is already has car enough cars on the roadway that was my only Mr for I'm
going to recommend that the board not really answer that I mean the board members have spoken as to why they don't think it's an appropriate design wer request um and u to ask them now why' you vote that way
he a little late I I don't think you should do that sir thank you very much for your time I really appreciate you right thank you sir anybody else wish to be heard okay board members any general comments you have uh yes sir I would like to make a a motion for adoption
regarding the uh rules and regulation I have two items I like to speak about um do one at a time okay we'll do one at a time a option to include uh salute the flag in section one colon 2-4 order of
business we have we have our rules and regulations we have order of business and a number of things are missing in that order of business and uh you can call it housekeeping but there are
missing items such as the adoption for a salute to the flag is not there on the opening we have an adoption I would like for swearing in of professionals that's not there also and that should be on the agenda of every meeting and public
portions not on the on the uh on the order of the business so even though I'm making a motion for two of these there are a number of things that we should address and Overlook and maybe I'll read off a couple things here
you got approval of minutes well we do that resolutions we do that MO of adjournment of scheduled cases and other motions calendar of unfinished business calendar of new business Communications reports adjournment we do
that but uh there are a number of things missing and maybe there maybe some of these have a meaning towards of maybe what I'm bringing up like Communications is that is that public portions everything has got to be public of course yeah but there's no notion on
here in our rules and regulations so uh I I just I'll start off with the uh uh salute to the flag I'd like to make a motion for adoption for that well it says it on the agenda yes it's on the agenda sir but it's not in
our rules and Regulation and this is public information I do I understand sir that you want the rules and regs to be modified to indicate salute to the flag and and and the other one was uh the
swearing in of professionals this has just recently happened where we we should have this on the agenda and also um documented there was a third one I thought also the third one there's nothing there about public portion
comments that's by ml you have to open all matters all matters I think he's talking I think he means after all the applications are heard yeah yeah I see and there were a number of things that maybe I'm maybe
I'm mistaking one of these like like Communications would you say that's public portion I don't know um I don't what I can check off is a German I see that calendar of new business I
don't do we have calendar of new business well that that's your agenda new business would be the new application okay so that's good that's good but um let's start off with the flag and the uh and the swearing in of professionals
which is most important to me and that's in section one colon 2-4 order of business in the rules and regulations the last matter I know came up as a result of a correct Court ruling
I believe that there was a challenge to an application and and the challenge was that the professionals weren't swor okay and since then we sworn the professionals at each and every meeting and I don't know the court case no no no I think the
comment is that you want those three things in the I understand exactly exactly the Genesis of it is that's that's why it would never have been in in the rules and rs so it was only recent and I think that's been the last few months yes and we could certainly add that I don't see why not right so
it's three things yeah the the flag salute to the flag that's our opening and then the public portion I don't see that in here you mean general public comments general public comments uh after the uh
after the applications are you always ask for somebody to come in are you open up to the public portion and and and then the others are just housekeeping things I think we can just talk about ahead okay so what do you feel about um
calendar of unfinished business that's probably no different than when when we have a matter that's got a continuance on it and when people are here and I announce that there's not going to be U you
know number 1 2 3 4 is not going to be heard tonight because of an adjournment new date will be I think that's what it is but you can call it however you want to call it was seem to be calendar of Unfinished businesses stuff that was carried right okay and Communications
what is that um communic I guess we can ask Marine if she has any other communication that's not applicable to the to the agenda you wish okay Council I thank you very much
if we can just add those three things then uh adoption um I'll make a motion to adopt the uh vote on it but but the exact wording is going to have to be handled by the attorney first okay okay we can certainly vote on that and and I guess when we do say at the end of the
meeting uh Moren is there anything you need to tell the board well then your next meeting is here and you know we're going to have a special meeting Etc that I I would consider that communication you can address that all right uh the motion was for
three items to be added to the rules and rigs under one one isn't it one callon 2-4 order of business one is be the uh salute to the flag correct the next one would be swearing into the professionals right
correct and the final one you said would be general public comments right to be added to rules and regul rules and regulations meeting okay thank you we'll take a roll call vote Mrs
Andrews yes are we individually same time no we'll take an individual vote so that's what we're doing no I mean for each item no no no no all three as as a bulk if you don't want if you if you want to exempt something we'll have a conversation about that no no I just we no we could do it before we take the
vote is everybody good with three yes yes we'll vote on a three we're going to vote on all three all three okay Mrs Andrews yes Mrs Chevalier yes Mr ISO yes Mr scagno yes Mr
Stoner yes Mr Sing yes chairman Sullivan yes as long as this uh legally uh worded to do and uh I'm sure that has to go by the township attorney as well so Mr Dy will advise us on that I is this a Word
document Moren are you gonna have to type that in here you're okay with that yeah I'm fine with that okay you'll send me the wording and then we'll we will vote on it just voted on it we voted no no I understand that but you're gonna send me the wording for the new rules and regulations we're voting on it as
long as it's approved by probably coun the Town Council the town attorney and worded by well chairman these are our rule these are the zoning wood rules and regulations they need not be approved by by the town um but I don't think this is a resolution just a motion but I'll do
what but I'll send you a letter saying to put those three in or something okay okay all right thank you anything else Mr scogna that's fine thank you thank you anybody else this evening all right well thank you uh everybody for being here this evening we
meet again on March 6th March 6th the eyes of March move for an adjournment all in favor I any opposed We Stand adjourned e e