there it is done his picture what does that look like his picture good evening hey Kathleen we're here oh thank you we're all here i'll be darned
how's it going good and you i had um one of the most amazing tours this morning and amazing and disturbing um the Amazon Fulfillment Center on Bogi Creek
oh my goodness it's 14 football fields i'm not kidding now i believe it it's indescribable testing one too order something there two hours later some of the stuff so it's got to be
there well there's different ones that's And it's according to size and they I mean it's it's down to like there's a fulfillment it's called MCO1 so like MCO like the airport right and um it's been
there for six years um yeah the robots are flat they're about this big and they hold these cards and you can't it's fenced off and people they're called pickers how did you get the opportunity so part of life UC oh
yeah they went and that was the last field trip we did and um but you can go online and do a tour they don't do them in November through January and um for obvious reasons yeah um but
Oh I didn't know that but it's also um it's scary oh yeah well and then this is the other thing and I knew this because I worked with people with disabilities for a long time so I knew that they focused on hiring people who
are hearing impaired and a high high percentage of their employees are hearing impaired because it's so noisy it is beyond noisy when I walked in there um I'm like "Well aren't you required to wear your hearing is it
optional?" But when you cross the purple line right the purple line it's mandatory everything has a line the pass everything has lines um I know it's really scary did you see the movie Nomad yeah yeah no it is it's
another Did you see Wall-E the movie yeah okay it totally because I'm like how long is it going to be when they don't need people oh around the corner it's like get ready because of A1 mhm
of course look I'm looking right now intelligent wow hey there i've got a really great This is Wow public is um for the fiscal year 245
this is stuff that is already coming in 726 yeah that's all if I just put that okay don't do that why it's a wonderful tool how am I going to get do the thing for myself
what are you talking about amazon.com i did this in 19 seconds not even 19 seconds and then Curtis why would I not use that you talking about your phone skills over there she doesn't want me to use chat GBT to find out
something oh that's a total of 73 took me like not even 19 seconds and you want to know something my husband that was his thesis when he got his PhD was in was artificial intelligence so and that was back that was back in
the 80s 17 um his was more helpful and teach not not like let me do it all for you um and take control and all that so I was just sharing with them i was just at
um Amazon's fulfillment center um today they do tours you ready yeah and um and it's MC1 and it's over on Bobby Creek and um it's very scary it's it's 14th football field just Sorry
to interrupt you i know you yeah no worries my forgiveness and so sorry no um would love to hear about it after for sure uh all right everybody we're calling the meeting to order is your mic
on it is on it is yes uh good evening it is 5:31 and I'm calling our meeting to order uh remind everyone please to silence our cell phones and speak clearly into the
microphone our meeting is being recorded so first on our order of business is approval of the minutes from April 2nd so do we have a motion to
approve i make a motion to approve the minutes from April 2nd okay i second it all right all in favor i great uh any opposed okay all right minutes are approved uh next up is our public comments so
time for the public to come forward with any comments that may be associated with the public arts uh everyone is or speakers are asked to complete a request to speak form presented to the secretary or chairman and we do not have anybody
present tonight so we will close citizen comment comments uh for the staff report uh Carrie Dom delivered the Jolie watercolor painting
so Dalia this is what we have the finished product here she dropped it off today and um she was unable to make it because she has another commitment okay but you guys can look at it if you feel that there needs to be any changes so
that we can send it back to her okay so I don't know if folks want to get up and take a closer look at it but feel free to take a look and have any questions or comments i do have a question um will um council
member um Britain be able to look at it yes Teresa will arrange that with him when she gets back yeah we'll make sure he has a chance to look at it before we complete full payment to her i guess
lisa what did you need i was wondering is there like a a photograph so we can see i can I can look it up on the computer you can come over and look at it over here okay and if we can get the board's feedback as soon as possible that would be great
okay on that on this I think it's beautiful she does such a great job and uh if there was feedback what would she be doing with it at this point if it were So she hasn't received final
payment yet so there's still an opportunity to let her know that we need changes done to the painting um so if there are any comments okay um from the board of course a consensus from the board to relay to her we can do that
okay see if I can find another picture okay so who do we miss uh so does anybody have any uh feedback that they feel like we should convey to the artist that's the only one that I could find about do we have a picture his actual picture
yeah it's up there on the computer i don't know if we can pull I had to miss the previous I had to miss the previous meeting but was it confirmed that he is indeed right-handed she did confirm that yes yeah i think there were two things that she was confirming and she did both there's an
onoff button in the back mhm do you all want to see the comparison sure so we don't have an actual picture that she used because this is like several pictures that she pulled degree of
So I mean I can ask her to send what picture she used and then I can email you guys the picture okay but um I think that might and um Yeah yeah i think like pulling it otherwise I think you can tell that he
was an he was a designer he was an architect of um I mean what you're trying to get across right i mean what he did for um professionally so I like how it looks like he's designing the What did you say
one that he's at yes like that's clear julian what did you say you like what um that you can see that he's the one he's planning is the one he's at right like Yeah which is cool yeah
yeah so any comments to discuss so I understand from um it sounds like you all want her to come with the picture that she um represented this drawing from is that
correct is that is that a con see a good or a comparison to see you know I'm trying to reflect from the photo i know that there was one that she did pull from but but yeah so um I think that would be helpful okay
yeah and I think uh did she have two i remember her talking about merging two things okay yeah she did i mean yeah that's what she said and um and I'm just wondering and this is just my question in general can you turn your microphone
on this is my question in general is um is that visible enough the drawings on I'm just wondering for um for how it is but where it's going to be and how it appears like does that need to be
darkened a little bit or I don't know I I I I'm um for the purpose of the painting and where it's going i think that probably like heavily relies on the uh framing right like how clear it looks
well no it's the glass it'll be archival glass which is a clear glass um for the framing so it'll look what it looks like right now okay but so that's what I'm just wondering because you have to walk up definitely
and and get very close to in the back in the back to tell what it is what he's working on gotcha i can I can see that it's like I can tell it's the same um it's an architectural drawing of the
field he's on from here right from that angle it's a little But it could be Yeah I'm you have younger eyes that's true so um and that's the aspect of it so it needs to be more focus you know um but
you are you all are also at an off angle though also I don't know how the building is if it's in a hallway you might force to be closer to it either too you know right that would be the question like the viewing where where it will be at my my
comment about the picture overall from here um I'm assuming this is uh Joe Lee as a younger man than the picture we just saw and I think that's the why it doesn't look like that picture and that would be fine with me the um rendering though um his architectural rendering
from here when I first looked at it looked unfinished i thought the painting wasn't finished and she was showing it to us right so but when I walked up to it it looked great and I could see right away that it was a finished painting so that's art
that happens okay so it sounds like the consensus is that we would like to have her join us um bring her starting photos and have a chance to look at the
painting in relation to the photos and also talk through some points with her um right that's if I don't know can this be done electronically that we all look at it and then we chime in and we say what we think or um or I'm just
wondering if it's really going to like significantly delay the process or I'm just asking you know what what do you all think you could do that you could uh have an email sent to the to the board with the
the two images and the only with the caveat that you can't have any discussion of course about it um but you could convey your thoughts to city staff individually and then the staff just can't communicate your thoughts back
amongst the board as acting as a liaison um and but then I would ask what the is the board going to approve or recommend that the um council accepts the painting as is is
that the ultimate because you couldn't have a vote through the email to to approve or recommend it no so you can't because it's against the sunshine law so you have to be in a public setting it has to be noticed in order to vote on it um but the idea is
to have a consensus or have the board vote yeah that would be I'm sorry go ahead that that's just my thoughts is what would the purpose of that be just to convey your thoughts to city staff um well I think if we had the email chain and obviously we couldn't reply all and
we just said "Hey like I'd like this small thing to be changed she could do that before the next meeting so that we could approve it then so we don't have to wait two meetings for us to talk about it and then to wait again for those changes to be made so she would have some time so to change it so if we
could have that side by side of the reference photo and then um this one this week then we could all reply individually um if there's anything we want to see she can make those changes then we would be able to approve it at the next meeting is that correct yes you
just have to be okay with everyone's changes being made without discussion made without a consensus everyone suggested changes going to artist without consensus on it unless of course you all want to have a special meeting before the next meet with her to discuss
this with her that would be great and that way she could explain you know the things that we don't understand about you know the um painting you know the questions and what have you and she could and that way you all can have your discussion and you'll
know what each other thought is and we can still send you all out the digital copy of this and have her provide us with something um her comparison or whatever she used and um have a special meeting and discuss it with her so that
way it's not gonna take as long it cuts down on at least one meeting the only changes people Well I guess we want to see the reference photo right that was like the big I guess the only change I heard was making the
architectural lines darker right well when you look at the reference photo you want to see if it looks like him you know yeah it's just it's watercolor so it's hard to change too much about it like it just as a medium you can't like paint over it like like um acrylic paint
or anything can't erase in watercolor so there's probably not too many changes we could make so it sounds like we're looking for assurance that he looks like Yeah the starting picture because right now we
don't know and if we do take a vote it needs to be on a final version right we can't say it's okay but this and this right correct so it needs to be in a final version so then there needs to be some way to convey feedback to
her um now whether that's done in kind of a empty way like an email chain or live in person with a a special meeting that could be done either way i
suppose whatever your preference i think I I think for us to be in agreement on the changes if any we need to be able to have this forum for us to say that we're in agreement for her to act on it
and and I and and I and I'm thinking that we don't want to appear to be micromanaging um and inhibiting the artist right right um so at the last meeting we had she was
there and she did present and she had photographs and everything and I apologize um I I just don't remember his face looking like that i don't remember the those original the reference photos
i just just this that's so that is the only I can see if I can bring them up on the monitors you want to see sure that would be great so is it the one that she used um it should be in the in the archives
oh well that would be perfect okay cuz I actually I I mean it sounds like we're all in agreement that we don't want to have to take multiple additional meetings um to get to an approval point but that
we're not quite ready yet okay i've got a drawing I was just thought it was a younger version i knew it was a version but that
does not look like that well we'll see yeah because I remember that picture i have no memory of that picture should we start the next topic uh or are
you okay if we wait she's got to um I I know but I don't want her to feel like we're pushing her take minutes we can't go on without her oh okay got it okay thanks mhm there she is
boy it doesn't look like that okay okay okay great all right so next up is the call to artist number four uh next up is number
four discussion on our schedule thank you um so I think at one point uh well when some of us were starting last year the recurring meeting was going to be the second Wednesday of every month mhm
okay and then we had some shifts um because Dr korea if she was out now we have Deborah who's able to attend so we can have the continuity of that second Wednesday of every month um if we were
to go forward with that our meeting dates would be May 14 June 11 and July 9th for our future meeting dates does anybody have concerns with
those dates that's the second uh Wednesday of the month for May June and July and what was July july 9th july 9th i think consistency is a good thing okay so can you do those dates i can't
make all of them no but I that should I should not be the determining factor okay yeah the only one I can't make is May the May uh 14th okay um how many of us can make the May 14th meeting
all right so that's not I cannot no no I cannot either may 14 okay but you can make May Kevin may 7th no May 14 can you make No I'm sorry i'll be out of town okay so we've got three that can't make forum is four
so then we would only have three so May 14 is not an option so I had I had been discussing this with both Dalia and Dr and Teresa um because I was getting frustrated that meetings kept getting changed yes um
because I like plan a lot of things throughout the month and way ahead with rehearsals and they would get changed and then I couldn't come and I was like making it a priority to come um I am fine if we pick a different day like if we are like the third Wednesday it's fine as long as it's consistent right um
I just was getting like this is the first meeting we've had this year that's been on the right day um which has been frustrating um so and I don't want to be a stick in it like a thorn or anything i just want it to be consistent so I can
plan ahead right so if if everyone would prefer it to be on the third Wednesday that's fine um I just need it so I you know can plan my other meetings throughout the week right well the May is the I have it on my calendar at the as the 21st
that's what I have to But that's the third Wednesday so that to your point Jillian right that's the third Wednesday so that somehow already got changed from the second Wednesday so if third Wednesdays work moving
forward I I'm I'm really fine either way i just want it to be the same yeah so I can just know what's going on cuz the last minute changes are really hard so we must have changed that so I've done my whole schedule around that one here
okay okay so is there a quorum on May 21st may 21st how many people can make May 21st three oh month of May no and Kevin you can't make the 21st that's four but you can if you can
that's four yep i'll still be up okay all right so we're Do we want to stick with the third so then it would be June 18th and then it would be July 16th june 18th and July I can do that 16th that's
that's already on the calendars right um and and I probably will be gone in July mhm i can make June and July well there you go mix and match on May 23rd so then it
sounds like what we're saying is so that everybody uh can plan appropriately that we are agreeing to make our standard meeting date uh the third Wednesday of each
month and our next three meetings would be uh Wednesday May 21st which we have a quorum June 18 and July
16 okay all right so we have agreement and is there anything else that we need to say about our meeting schedule right now do we know if that consistently works
with staff also it should yeah okay thank you i think so 5:30 yes can you make the third when I can make the main and then after
that microphone yes i I can be here for May and then after May you'll have the city will have a new lawyer the Stinstrom law firm is closing at the end of May so after over 50 years what's what's closing the the law firm the Sinstrom law firm is Mr
hbert is retiring yeah so yes I'll miss you all very much oh my gosh this is one of my favorite things that I do well that's disappointing but thank you for letting us know
okay um [Applause] and is it the intention to just stay with the third Wednesday going forward throughout the uh coming Yes fiscal year as well yep
yeah that I mean that'd be great okay all right so all in favor of the third Wednesday of each month for the remainder of the year and our next dates being May 21 June 18 and July 16th all in favor don't we have to do a move
motion first motion i move that we change to the third um Wednesday of each month good grief okay excellent i second second now all in favor i okay i'm doing the accelerated version tonight um and
then we have our future dates okay for May June and July thank you guys all right next up call to artist so at a pri prior meeting we had some discussion
about what a good um budget would be for I think the sculpture and the next mural and what we have as supporting information so I'll explain uh what I
shared first i had forwarded I just did some quick research uh we had a discussion um I think two meetings ago when we were first talking about the next call to artist for the mural and there was some
discussion around the longevity and I thought uh given that we're in Florida with the elements I was wondering what a standard lifespan would be of a mural i did some quick research um got some
information that if we don't already consider it in our call to artist specs I think there's some things that we could add about the materials that they would use um but I think it's helpful to call out that some of the results were
uh 8 to 20 years for a mural's lifespan which might be a little bit less than some of us were thinking you said 8 to 10 8 to 20 oh 20 yeah all depending on like location especially um the amount
of sunlight that it gets uh and something unexpected that I learned in the process is that there are some Florida cities it mentions Fort Meyers and Ponta Gorda uh well they where they
are applying murals on aluminum panels because that lasts longer and then they could actually move it if they ever needed to for I think damage or to avoid uh
damage but that was a longerterm solution that I didn't even know was you know an option and I just put that information together to share with us to know um and then Lisa you had
information about pricing correct that was the assignment I was given at the last meeting um so um again the um huge benefits of um being a part of the Florida Association of Public Art
Professionals which um again municipalities artists are a member of and um so is Teresa um and she's attending the meeting coming up in May but I just literally I'm part of a group mail and um email a group anytime and
they'll send out their RFPs or I have a question and I literally said you know what including supplies what is your budget and um according to the size and this is the information I was provided um and I identified who um they were um
what city if they were an artist um Juliana was wonderful and was my first response she sent me an email with the information um for Samford um and um so these are various cities um as well and then I
included um this great these great materials um and again I'd like to thank Dalia for printing this all out um in color because it is helpful to see this um more information about various cities um which is helpful um and a big um
component and and I remember this from last um um association um cuz I went on my own to the conference last year was um Florida elements are way worse than
anybody else and I remember the group from um this Key West speaking and they're like oh ours and then you know Broward County and Dade and how we went up and and what they have to do for um murals and have
any of you been to Winwood in in Miami it's it's completely all murals artists are there's a list of hundreds of artists all over the world who want to be a part of Winwood and and paint there
but um but what they have to do um in consideration of that and I would definitely say artists who who reside in Florida know that i do think and I agree um with Kathleen as far as it being
specified in the specs i think it's really important and granted our conditions are all over the place and um we have to just kind of um plan accordingly and I know with the um sculptures we're trying to do that um
and but um it's I'm always like why recreate the wheel when you have a resource and you literally can send out an email and get a a a response from people who already have experience and um recommendations so I really think
it's also really helpful um to um rely on that resource because they've already done it and these are cities huh this is such great info yeah these are cities that have been doing it for a long time who have huge budgets who literally have
staff who are that's what they do is are so St pete and um Tampa and all of them so and by the way the conference this next month is being held in Tampa so um but I hope this helps in in um gathering
information or and understanding it and just reading the consultants are really good because they also do it according to like there might be a historical perspective and walks mural walks and and how it it it it's all connected you
know like people do historic walks there's mural walks and I think people might have experienced that in cities that you visit like I know has one and that's just something else that they cities share and why is it significant to the city or municipality or whatever
but so I hope this provides some interesting information when we were discussing murals cuz I missed some meetings was there a location we were talking about getting one at yes uh on a wall at Oto on the park I think
across from the um cantina it the back side of the sign oh okay okay yeah that was I think we were talking about that and was there another location was
were they going to do something related to Round Lake Park or was it salary maybe was there something at Saleri i can't no it was Round Lake there i think it was Round Lake
did you give us something related to that yeah okay and that is still the thought and I think where we um where we decided to looks like this drill down some more
is was around the the amount the budget that we were going to set for the painting and the sculpture and I know I personally thought maybe we could bring the painting budget down a bit but that we might need more for the sculpture and
then we were going off and starting some research right so um especially after Julie Yeah juliana presented what Samford pays and then we were like well let's do a general research and that's how it kind of happened or that's how it
happened i know Deborah was at the meeting too but um so basically I think we have to decide what the parameters are um reconfirm those parameters and then also how much we're looking to for for what
we want y um how much are we what what will the budget be and most importantly what can we afford within that budget right where's the money coming from right um question about so Sanford just I
don't know opened or announced that series of sculptures that they just installed did you have information on the price per sculpture for that yes um I I did the prepare prepared the agreement so I can share that with you the that sculpture walk the the city
didn't purchase the sculptures there are sculptures on loan for let me look at the agreement i I thought I think it's two I can't remember how many years it was sorry can't remember and while she's looking that up I'm not quite sure if you all know how much money you have in the budget i'm not No I was going to ask
that as a question it's $17,345 we're so good at spending it $17,000 so it seemed like there was uh more that was set aside because and now I'm going to say
something and y'all can you can adjust me but I thought that like one of our amounts was 25 one was 30 or was it 20 and 25 so there's something that is set
aside the CRA yes it was CRA money Okay oh you have the spreadsheet y I do from a prior meeting but I think that there was something that was called out maybe she mentioned like a future
project that might be coming down i think wasn't there an amount that was available this year that didn't have to be spent this year but had to be allocated this year and it was like 70,000 and we were looking at
I have no memory of this like this sounds great no that's awesome uh I remember that yeah and keeping in mind that we also have to do the postcards for and the
posters as well um so um just Okay here we go uh March 19th call to artist CR has 70,000 in budget for public art i got that one right fabulous
yes uh so we only need to start the process in 2024 wall behind the boat house um Lisa was going to research the materials needed for longevity uh we could ask Xavier to
validate the proposal but I think if we have a copy of his proposal we can see um and that's the mural at Center Lake the sculpture so this is Oto Ovidto Boulevard because it's the CRA we need
it in a CRA area um Lisa said she will research what might cost to fit that space you mentioned Central Florida Sculpture Guild tabled for more research do you have this this document Lisa that says
the area the dimension of how big that um area is yeah we have that from the last Oh okay sorry I didn't realize that yeah because I I think the I don't think it's a question that I had was for that space
is would the original budget because I think it was said that for the um sculptures in the pocket park right around the corner that it was like 25,000 per
uh sculpture and that that space looks similar but it's hard to tell it says the the deepest width is 13 ft but it's like a cone shape yep a very wide cone
right but it's 42 feet in length so it would either have to be Y long yep or tall and it seemed like given the um size of the ones in the pocket park that like if we just took one of those
for the budget and we put it in the middle that it would might be good though i don't know cuz cuz it's almost like this would frame that nicely right but one Yeah so Kathleen I I had a chance to see
both of these locations in person yep and I had the same opinion as you that the that the mural space is doesn't look that big and maybe that budget could be reduced okay and that that the sculpture
budget may need to be increased yep um and it in this some of this uh these other uh specifications talk about the the backing material yeah and it looks like it's stucco isn't it on the the
boat house the back of the boat place um so we might try to carry the the message that if uh there are places intended for murals in the future that they should be planned with aluminum
panels if that's the best surface right it's a good idea i I agree with that strongly the difference between an eight-year longevity and a 20-year longevity is huge right yeah eight years is like nothing right and it is all it's
all dependent on the materials the materials what it's painted on certainly the type of paint i'm sure there's a whole Yes and there scholarship on how to paint things in Florida but um we should if we're going to spend any money we should be going for the 20-year mark yes and and I also will mention that in
some of these materials it was mentioned that if uh down the road if if the mural needed a little touchup that that should be encouraged and authorized i mean that I don't think that money can be included in the
original budget but it should be mentioned that uh it we would encourage that for the future and that the artist would come back and I guess deal directly with the city commission for some amount to touch
it up right so it I thought it could be interesting to ask for um if not a maintenance schedule like what would the recommended maintenance be for the longevity from
the artist yeah and that could be part of the call to artist yeah and that the materials used should be for maximum longevity yep which we do have use the right paint and use the shield that's on
top of the paint yep yep so how would we typically um I have not compared a prior call to some of these specs to see if we
um got into that level of detail before so I think one of the items should be that we review um a prior call
for some of the longevity paint specs and I can do that um unless anybody else would prefer to I can volunteer for that and that regarding the call to artist that we want to um have a request
for uh maintenance from the artist um and then that still comes back to the uh topic of money do we know the
difference in size because we know what we paid for the large mural at Ovido on the Park the new location is smaller do we know what we pay for that larger one you should have the agreement yes
it's right in here yeah that was your response that's not us not us okay i think I have to be reading this wrong because that mural was only
$2,000 doesn't No it was I think you're right um yeah okay so number E under the contract said the city will provide materials and equipment up to $3,000
what that says two on the uh agreement for placement of a mural at Center Lake Park so number E says we'll provide the materials and equipment up to 3,000 where did you have a $2,000 i'm looking
at the other one sorry I was looking at the lake brown Lake Park but Okay yeah that one says 2,000 and then on the next page um G it says the artist will receive a statement of 1,000 then 500 then 500 so that would be another
$2,000 so I guess that would be $4,000 total but that was a huge mural yes do you have a copy Deborah 194 so that was six years ago well and look at what we got we got
great murals um one of the other things that I uh briefly researched was budgets for a city of our size because I think that we should like any comparisons that we do to Tampa or St compete like kind
of take into consideration the the size of that city which would typically translate into budget and then kind of scale it accordingly for us and also um I kind I kind of did that with the the
um association this was last year okay um and um we're in a really tough situation um because Sford automatically gets Right Juliana about $150,000 just the city uhhuh annually
it's budgeted that will never happen in Oto um so now with the issue with um um with the state of Florida what's happening um developers now are not going to put um are going to bulk um as
far as putting um any type of donation um for development what we've been doing it's it's truly up to them but now it's it it could be like nothing it could be $5 so um I think we do have a minimum now i mean there's certain things that
we can't carry out that we wanted to but it sounded like we could definitely do but if it if it passes in Tallahassee it's it I mean that doesn't that will be they can override that so that's that's kind
of we're in a holding pattern as far as budgets are and I guess our vein of income is is that CRA money and maybe a partnership when we do parks and wreck if they want um I guess it would be our
support and knowledge um because um it it would be coming out of their budget but am I correct Deborah like the the funnels of of of of where else it's CRA money or postcard sales or
art sales and then and then and then possibly developers because they could still contribute money to to public art that is still part of their mitigation today yes so they can do that right but I mean us
getting like 20,000 or 30,000 might be um more difficult in the future so but um but those are the that's where we're getting it from oh yeah so um but they literally um that's where
the state um municipalities get their money as well but the majority of them it's a budget line and it's a significant budget line even in a small um city and I would say Pompo is close um
um and I I just that was last year's research i can try to pull it up i remember you talking about that last year yeah so because that was my when I attended the conference that was my my sole focus was to find out what their budgets were according to what we have
our the size of Oto and that we're a city we're not a county so and the county Seol County does not have it it's it's it's odd it doesn't have an interest in this well I think
one of the big differences is that we don't really have a tourist like Sanford has a big tourist income and like a lot of these beaches have big tourist income like OVTO is um residential you know oh that's an excellent point because we were saying about size i know city of
Dana um for one example that's not a big place at all yet they have a $60,000 um mural or something like you know yeah but they they might they probably have a lot more people coming through you know
yes and we don't even hook into UCF cuz technically that's Orlando right so um Gainesville has it but they have the big association with the university yeah too so that's a pool they have attitude of
this residents they they also have like a big like like fine arts district you know like where people like go and see shows there and we go see shows here but you leave Ovito to go see shows you know so I think that probably we're very unique but Winter Park might be closest
but that um their arts they have a they they have a serious arts community example of attitude it's Yeah it's so I think it's just a bit of an uphill battle but and we're new mhm so I mean OVTO is I think it's and there was that
great article i mean that great link story so that was that was a huge plus great and and Kathleen had some great quotes so but um but yeah so it's kind of depending but I think we
were talking about if we need to lower the budget for this mural for the 8 by13 that's like around like 1,000 square ft
um so we don't have the size of the Round Lake one do we we should i don't I didn't see it in here yeah I see the big boy oh 40
by 16 in the middle but generally 40 by 12 and then 16 at the peak okay so this is exponentially bigger or I should say the one we're talking about is exponentially smaller the ones we already paid for are much bigger
i mean so $20,000 seems like a lot yes when we're talking about these being less than 10 they were Yes so what if we what if we did a call at 10 or
even 12 to see what came in and we put the difference to the sculpture if if our sculpture is 8 by13 no the um you meant the mural i'm sorry mural yeah if the mural is 8 by13 that's
104 square ft if we go by the city of Pompo Beach um $25 per square foot then you get 2,600
okay was that including the materials and the equipment it says "Well they need a ladder they don't need color design." That sounds like just the concept so I certainly always want to play
artists living wages and all that stuff but does $5,000 for the artist design and execution does that seem low not to me but I'm a school teacher it does it does to me i I know what I pay
for a logo and a logo is $2,000 mhm but isn't like a logo a perpetual yeah but I mean depending on if we're looking at 20 years and usually maintenance of of the piece is included
i was just talking about the artist's compensation part so like the design and execution not the materials not the because if it was $5,000 then our I don't know the call to artist does that include just what we're paying materials sorry just what we're paying or is it
like this is what we get for everything i think it's the whole budget you specify that did Did you see the artist just the mural artist was $25 um a square foot full color and with two 2K minimum
mhm and what did you say the square footage was 108 so that's $2,700 that's what I'm saying if we did $5,000 right plus materials right
that that kind of keeps it in line with the previous mural right but we need to so we want to keep it in line but also allow that five years have passed six years have passed the way that at least Stanford's done it
is that the pricing was inclusive of the materials the paint and materials and um it wasn't the city didn't pay separately for that okay um but you can see on the shuffle board mural the um the size of
the building the first page of Lisa's um print out here uh it was the building measured 80 ft in length and then the restroom facility was also painted and it was 23 feet in length and then I
don't remember the height of the building but um it was 15,000 for that size and then the the other one which was the artist on the very back the Nicole Lynch her mural she painted the entire Marina restroom for a cost of
6,000 and it's really nice beautiful yes I really love her work this is not the the Woodsto one i love this one that's okay no that that's a that's um representative of her type of work but she uh the Marina was a different design
it was um it was a um heron right yeah it was really pretty um so that gives you an idea of what a nearby city has paid for murals which and I did find the um it was a two-year
agreement for the sculpture on loan the sculpture walk and it was a total cost of $30,000 for 10 sculptures and I'm I made a note to myself to send this list of sculptures to Deborah to to share with all of you and um it shows the
prices and the the sizes the dimensions and the and the purchase price for the different sculptures in because they can be purchased um after the 2-year period of time um the city has it in our agreement that has an option to purchase one and um and then they're also on sale
for the public if they want to buy the sculptures um so I'll share that but they range in price um uh they're all around I would say $5,000 each but uh some are less but
some of they're and the bigger ones are more i mean the some of them the you see the you have to really look at the dimensions because the sculpture you think it's going to be much bigger and then you see it in person it's it's small it's it's a so you have to look at those dimensions because I I when I saw them in person I I hadn't noticed the
the numbers and I just looked at the image being a more visual not numbers person at all and I was surprised oh it's smaller than I thought it would be but they're beautiful really nice um and yeah so I'll share this with you all and I would think that the price that
they're giving um like would not include installation any of that they're just saying if you were to take this with you right this is it but not like the infrastructure piece of it very good point because there's another
sculpture that's that um the CRA funded and it cost about 90,000 but just for the sculpture and and the installation is another like $30,000 when you factor in the um the uh masonry because they wanted some masonry around it not just a
plain cement block they wanted some old timel looking brick to go with the theme and it's a big bronze sculpture um over a,000 pounds and uh and so this the that's a consideration to to to have is
the cost of the the pad and the the masonry if you want something like that it's a big piece that's just as important and I guess I'm just being if we're doing on loan I'm sure the artist has
specifications on how their sculptures have to be um right um set up and and and displayed and I for obvious reasons so they do that they provide the the instructions
and then um and and the city was actually covering the cost of pouring the pads for the simple just cement pads so the public art commission wasn't paying for that they were the city was paying for the pads so that's something you have to work out with
lots of things to think about so are we in agreement that we would like to reduce the budget for the mural and allocate some of that to the sculpture it sounds like we're in agreement with
that general idea um I think then we need to like identify where do we need to get um specific so that we can come to like an agreement of what we're approving right now
they're at 20,000 total and 35,000 total right i don't think that 20 that 20,000 seems way too much for such a small Yes mural yeah personally I'm thinking five or six thousand would be a good amount for that
you know much smaller space do we want to say we could even do like 7,500 just to or six to include uh materials it's
because previously we broke out uh materials let's see materials and equipment do we want our uh to be inclusive like Sanford does which could also be easier to manage yeah I think so
okay so we know Yeah keep it simple so for the mural we want to offer an inclusive price of the artist fee and materials and equipment at 7500
or or five or six we keep throwing out numbers right do we have to say that the rest of it goes to the sculpture or a sculpture we don't no can't we just not worry about that and just do one thing at a time which is definitely I
think we all agree that $20,000 is more than we think a mural on that space is worth correct a sculpture is usually more than a mural right depending on Correct the size of
the sculpture so I just want to make sure I'm understanding this you're saying including supplies right okay which they I would think that like the mechanical supplies they would likely have the
paint and whatnot would be they would purchase for this and we would be explicit about the the quality of the paint that that it would have the UV the whole
thing or sealant that it'd be put on uh aluminum that would change the do that right i think that would change the price drastically though i think it would make this more complicated
no that's not it $6,000 would be twice what the uh the other one was in 2019 but how much do we know the consumer price index is 2019 like to figure
out we know what's happened to housing since then but I don't think we want to well I can tell you paint if it's eggs has it right but if it's paint we see yeah paint was expensive and now it's really expensive do we want to say $7,000
i think I think $1,000 does not make or break our budget but it could make or break an artist yeah okay you know worthy on that so I'm good with 7,000 okay so do we have a motion okay that
for the call to artists of the next Centerlake mural uh that it will be an inclusive price of $7,000 for the artist fee materials and
equipment do we have a motion for that i have a motion for that okay I'll second that okay all in favor i I I Any again any opposed okay all right so we have
uh we have an agreement we have a motion if I'd make a suggestion for when you have the submissions to review yes um you could have a work session where to save you time at a at a regular meeting where you look at the designs and review the designs but then at the you'd have
to approve the design at the at the meeting because you can't make a motion at a work session but that's in case I'm not around for when you get when I get here but uh that that that kind of works really well on this page it says the project theme it says the 100th anniversary of the city and beyond ovto
past present and future is that something we already discussed yes yeah okay yes okay if we u shift the discussion now to the sculpture Mhm i think one reason to increase the
budget for the sculpture is the size of the space correct and the fact that a sculpture will have a greater longevity right whereas a mural might last 8 to 20
years we expect a sculpture would last longer and it was my impression from the previous meeting that that this would be a purchase of the sculpture for permanent installation i mean I guess we've seen some other examples from
cities where they've had a loan agreement but in this case I think a permanent installation is the way to go i think especially since it's our first sculpture right let's own one you want to hold on to it yeah what about the um
wings of That's our Oh what do I know that's our second so this will be our second it's not there yet so you know I forgot we've been talking about I know forever i think it was talked about a year before we all joined yes that's true that's true yeah this is the long hall okay we're just We're upping our
collection of future sculptures yes i don't even recall where it's going to be or did we decide that it's going to be at the butterflies no I know look at the picture at this look at the picture there half oh there yeah yeah
it's all coming back it's back it's back so I think that because the sculpture could be so the the ideas that the artist would have could be so different um is there a precedent to putting a
range of a price in there or like saying up to and then essentially if somebody like wants to like I keep going back to the um like the birds at Lake Eyola that are coming out of the water i mean if somebody like brought in something that
was really filled the space and was dramatic and warranted up to a cap that would be different than somebody says "Oh you're going to pay me 25,000 and I'm going to put you know uh uh interpretive acorn there and thank
you for the money." I mean it could vary so I think we want to have some right but that's up to us it is but I'm saying is there a precedent to putting it in the call to artist that it could be up to X
depending on the submission the scale you know the materials whatnot yeah yeah you could that that you could do it that way the other thing is there going to be is is the call to artist for a certain theme does is there a concept that the board
has in mind for this space and that's what you're doing the call to artist for because the other like I mentioned before you could also just bring your you could also bring your own ideas right um that you you have chosen for this space as members of the board to
bring it back to the group for selection it looks like there's one written here yep reflect the fauna andor flora it can be pictorial or abstract no specific style desired single
representation or group i think we have to look at the I mean like all of us have to revisit that space again and get a a real good feeling what will work because this is another factor is um and I just recently saw this um a sculpture
that's a car hit and it was close to a road like this close so I know um it was a sculpture of what it was a sculpture mhm you know like a metal sculpture and a and it was close to road and it was
hit oh a car hit it sorry I thought you said it was of a car granted um you wait for it could be months for the insurance company if the person has insurance and um but I'm just what they have done i've
also seen kind of like what Target has those big balls cement balls i've seen more even neighborhood associations their entrances that are getting um blasted with cars um going through them they're putting big boulders or
something maybe more natural looking um to protect something from being destroyed so um I could like work that in somehow i'm glad I remember that security feature in regards to the idea of a variable price
that seems awkward to me because then that puts us in the position as we're sifting through submissions of saying "Oh this one is big it's worth the full amount this one though is not and this is only worth you
know half the amount." I I almost think that would come from the artist though if they're like "Well here's the budget i need 20,000 to make this happen and this one's like I need 35,000 to make this happen." You know like I'd want to get that from the artist like this is
our budget what do you need to make your your vision come to life right you know not like I'm going to put a monetary value on your art that's their job yeah i think that they would I would see them it coming from the artist i just don't think I don't think we
should like say we'd have to $30,000 value on everything no matter what they submit and they say but your call to artist was $30,000 and here's my idea i Yeah I suppose that could be covered in the the specific language of the call
you just have a maximum thresh threshold up to Yeah you know and the the other thing to consider is um protecting the sculpture from from from the observers you know people don't want people climbing on your
sculpture so having some kind of buffer like whether it's a lot of times they'll use vegetation you know having a little like some kind of vegetation around it um to keep people from climbing on it and damaging it vandalizing cactuses
even like rock i don't know so that it also makes me think that if this is an area like basically the city would have some kind of an opinion about you can't do this right you can't
in impinge on this or you can't hang over the street so like I think that we've got this space defined but do we need to put more in there about what the city any constraints from
the city like do they need to be able to mow under it um yeah good point very good point good very good point so dimensions you want some dimension limitations on the dimensions yes so like if this if the city uh whoever
upkeeps this area if we said "Hey we want to put a sculpture here." Then they would come back and say "Well here's five things you need to think about we need to be able to mow it you know or could we weed eat it or it can't be this close to the road?"
I mean I think that's going to be significant just reooking at this and I and I I refreshed my memory on this spot i think if this is low to the ground Yeah it's a sitting duck I I don't see how it's going to be
you know last through the traffic mhm i think so unless it's up high right that you could do and have it you know you know on a pedestal on a pedestal that kind of thing it would work but if it's low to the ground if that's the case then we should say that in the call
exactly is what I'm saying and so I think we should maybe ask public safety yeah and we can get our um we can get our public works department or parks and recreation who does the maintenance okay as well as our human resources because
they'll look at the liability of it okay so we need feedback because I think we're going to have for that to work I think it's going to have to be up off the ground in cement yep can I ask who's responsible for mowing that space it's going to be our um parks and recreation
department so they they're they're covering that now yeah they handle city facilities okay okay yeah i think that'll really knowing what their constraints are will really narrow it down for us to help us be in terms of the money too because if it has to be
anchored in a big bed of cement that's or they might come back to us and say no way right that this is not a good spot right yeah they might Did we just decide on this ourselves this spot uh no um
she did she uh Dr korea also okay so maybe she's talked to people yeah and I can check with her yeah she may have so we should probably talk about this when we've got some more info yeah before you make any final approval of the sculpture it's a good idea to have public works someone from Public Works come to the
meeting and and have some input on it okay and give you some Well we did that with the weight and um we learned a lot about what we could and couldn't do so in this case I think it makes sense to have one budget line for the artwork itself and another one for the
installation andor pedestal does doesn't it mhm yeah I guess that would and the pedestals would go under installation so looks like what amounts are good what what amounts are good to use for
that yeah depend on the sculpture i don't know that we're there yet right i think we need to talk to other departments in the city to find out so the viability of that spot like next steps are uh any constraints
um with that spot and then we could and I I do have a hard stop um at 7 so I know I'm not prepared to get into more about the the price of it
well we can keep talking about that next time then what was that i said we can continue the discussion at the next meeting then yep yeah okay so we'll find out constraints from the city do I need to make a motion about that or do we just agree that what our next steps are
i think just an agreement on the next steps okay okay and I just want to say that it's really great that you're having all these considerations before and taking your time and discussion it'll save you a lot of pain
good okay did we get the pictures of uh Oh did we get But these are the artists interpretations these are her original sketches do I have that right these aren't photographs of what he looked like yeah it's not the books that she had i think I thought she had a book
that she She did have a book that came from Dr korea yeah so we don't have them okay so yeah we'll get try to get her to come at the next meeting um the next special meeting so we'll have to figure out what your availability will be um
prior to the um is it the May was it a um city meeting that people were going to get together for on May 5th what's May 5th uh something was getting presented i thought this Oh was that
this was going to be present okay at the May 5th meeting this is not ready to be presented at the May 5th meeting no okay we're gonna not present it there okay uh do
we do we what do we want to do do you want to find out when I'll check with you all to see what your schedule is and when she's available yes and when she's available like hopefully within like two weeks can we say we'll try to schedule it for the next two weeks
okay um Okay so all right so we're going to uh try to meet with Carrie within Is it Carrie or Karen karen when it always sounds like
Carrie to me okay meet with Karen within two weeks to talk about our questions and see the originating picture of him um we we will also try to get some people from our public works and parks as well as HR to try to come and talk
about liability those type of issues at the same meeting be a good use of the time yes okay um and we made the agreement on the next mural of $7,000 to include paint and
materials and who puts the uh call to artist together is that staff yes okay okay mhm so once we get all the details from the board what other details are needed so I
believe you all have decided on for the mural i think you've decided on everything except that you want to get more specific about the paint yeah and the number of years just look at um look at a prior one to see do we specify
uh like the UV protection the sealant whatever because those are things that help the longevity correct that would be the question so is it and I guess aluminum didn't we just decide that that you all were not going to do no we're
not doing aluminum we could talk that yeah i just want to Yeah note good for bringing that back so is it possible to have a draft of the call to artists for the next month normal meeting not the special one the normal one yes yeah
absolutely yeah because we could probably send it out before then and you all can just reply back to us individually okay as opposed to waiting until that's great awesome okay unless of course you all need to approve
it before it goes out if you need to approve it then we will have to have it at a special meeting or at the regular scheduled meeting well even if a draft is just sent out so we can look at it and then at the special meeting we just be like approve you know so we can like read through it and take
our time yeah that sounds good all right and then uh next regular meeting dates May 21 June 18 July 16 any other comments or concerns from the board members i had a few questions
are we selling the postcards at the 100th year anniversary i know we had talked about that is that still happening um Teresa Dr curry is going to be there so she is I don't know if she's printed has she because it has
to go to the council first approval and it's not going to be ready for that's really okay um is there an update on the butterflies um I can get with her and send it out to
you all i can have her because she's coming back on Monday okay so I can get her to send you all out an update on the butterflies okay and then have we picked out our next artist for In the Chambers yes I think I did do that okay last last
week she's she No she presented before that yeah it was like it's W her name is Wanda okay awesome i just I had missed that so last time was the special time right yeah the last round
okay um oh there was one other thing um I think this was Lisa's idea a long time ago to ask if we could potentially ask the council if we can give if we can have authority to
make purchases without presenting it to them under a certain threshold yes i'm sure you said it much more eloquently has said that too that wasn't you no I it could have been but like it's come up a couple times um I'm sure
I said that completely convoluted and I also know a council member said that too because I think they were frustrated that we couldn't do that either and just like something like that postcards it was about the postcards
yeah the if we have to go to the council just discuss here as you could certainly do that if the council would approve it would require a a resolution or revision to the ordinance because the current ordinance doesn't allow it so that's why it has
you only have authority to recommend yeah um so the council the the ordinance would need to delegate authority to the board to to actually be able to make purchases either up to a certain threshold or just within your budget can
we do that cuz like it seems ridiculous that we can't buy like you would it would require a motion to initiate that process from the someone on the board to make a motion to initiate that request okay then that would start the process give it a try Jill okay i make a motion
to present a resolution to council where the uh city arts board is granted authority to spend how much do they if I just make
um instead of a resolution just um leave it open to either a resolution or an amend or revised order okay yeah so we don't because I'm not sure which we have to evaluate that and decide which tool would be better yeah okay then I make a
motion to uh ask council to have a resolution or amendment or any other legal jargon that enables us to make a purchase uh as the Ovito City Arts Board without approval for purchases under
$10,000 oo $5,000 i would say I would say under just a certain amount yes okay and because we have to check with our purchasing department cuz amounts over a certain
dollar amount has to go up city under an amount that makes sense i think three is not very scary if I would make a suggestion to just um
request me to delegate authority to the board to um make minor purchases just delegate authority um to the board to um to select and purchase public art and leave
it leave it open to without a threshold it's it's would just be within your budget okay and then the the the council can modify right the council can modify that and determine what threshold they want to set
okay okay should I try this again what she said start from the top [Laughter] [Music] okay i make a motion for that okay and we'll see what they come back with well someone's got a second i
second the motion all in favor i any opposed okay get us being unanimous um just really quick I just want to um because Jillian wasn't at that meeting i'm going to say it really quick everybody just praised how the the opera the Cinderella
was and and loved it and we everybody like you know they kind of So just heads up standing ovation yeah that Oh I'm so glad it I talked to some of the people at the opera and they they were thrilled with how like the turnout was and and it was such a perfectly beautiful day it
was so okay very good all right so uh we will adjourn uh if I could please have a motion to adjourn the meeting i move to adjourn the meeting second okay all right uh do we have to vote or
do we just motion we're still voting all I All in favor okay great all right thank you everyone yeah we did get a lot accomplished we have since So so Jillian are you
wanting that authority so we could buy ourselves a pizza party [Laughter] we said really bad yeah wow