If you click out of that, you're closing it down. You're closing it. Just so you know, >> that's Yeah. Yeah. Six weeks of therapy after Make sure your camera is powered on and connected to
what the zoom Right. >> Yes. Are we ready? Okay. >> Good afternoon everybody. Welcome to the city of Palaca special called city commission meeting on November 24th,
2025 at 5:00 p.m. I'm calling the meeting to order. We'll begin with an invocation led by Pastor Malbury and the pledge of allegiance led by Commissioner Davis. Please stand. Let us pray. Father, again, thank you for bringing us together once again. We
thank you for this opportunity to come before you. We pray God in this season of thanksgiving that you will help us to understand our need to give thanks. We thank you for how you woke us up. You
allowed us to be here. And God, again, we say thank you. We pray that you would crown our heads with wisdom, God, as we move forward in this meeting tonight. Let your will be done in Jesus name. Amen.
>> Amen. >> Please stand of to the republic for it stands. One nation, indivisible, liberty and justice for all.
Roll call, please. Madame clerk. >> Commissioner Borum. >> Commissioner Jones, >> present. >> Commissioner Campbell, >> present. >> Commissioner Davis, >> present. >> Mayor Carrera, >> present. Thank you. We have quorum.
I'm going to open the floor of public comments. Public comments are limited to three minutes. Please be polite and provide your name and city or town of residence. Is there anybody here for public comments? We do have some clouds and we will get to those. Um McKenzie
McKenzie Frey, >> this is the only topic on the agenda, but okay. Thank you. Is there anybody else here for public comment? Miss Kitchens. I just I just want to make sure that we will be allowed to speak on the issue of the city manager when the item comes up
and we don't have to speak on it during public comments. >> Miss West, should I just reserve it? Apparently all the public comment cards are for this time. >> Hearing this is public comment for items that are >> not listed on the agenda. >> She will have an opportunity. >> I will call your you up when
>> Thank you. One to confirm. >> Anybody here for public comments on general items not listed on the agenda? Seeing none, we'll close public comment and we're going to move on to regular business. Finny manager cure evaluation.
Miss Jones. >> Madame Mayor, commissioners, um the purpose of this meeting is actually to um come to a post evaluation of the 30-day cure period that was um granted to the city manager to determine um how um the commission will be moving
forward. Um, I did provide each commissioner with a rub a rubik um with 14 items on the rubik um of the things that were listed and required for the city manager to complete prior to this time or to be actually be attempting
completion during this time. Um I did receive and my um objective was to be able to score whether the information that was provided by the commission um by the commission by the city manager was acceptable documentation as to the
completion or whether it was not or whether it was something else that the commission may have desired her to um take. I did receive two back. However, I did communicate with four commissioners, but two I came back that I was able to
put the numerical value to. Um I have 14 yeses and I have 13 ongoing and one um does not meet the requirements. So for the other three commissioners, it will can basically just score or just talk
about the scoring that they gave. >> Any questions of Miss Jones? Austin Commissioner Davis. anything comments you like to say? How would we like to move on? >> Um for me based based on my
um meetings with um the city manager during the cure period. Um, I met with the city manager weekly during the cure cure period and I had a meeting on Friday morning with her to evaluate whether or not she completed
all that was required for the cure period. I will say that I am satisfied that not only did she meet the requirements during the cure period that she also went above and beyond in some
instances. I do know there is evidence that she did not wait until the last minute. She addressed items immediately and um I am confident that she met what was required for the cure period and to remain as the city manager.
>> Thank you. Commissioner Jones, do you want to provide any feedback or comments? I didn't have opportunity to meet directly with city manager during the peer period. We have a standing meeting every Tuesday at 11 a.m.
And unfortunately and with some some flexibility, uh, I gave Miss Carter the opportunity that we could actually speak over the phone. She gave me updates and we talk
about what going to transpire or what actions that she's going to take during the week. Follow up on things that action items, things that are in the parking lot to be completed. Uh and
two of those meetings, three weeks, two of those meetings were pushed back. uh last Tuesday our meeting uh something came up uh he said she has some fire to put out and I I I be blatant and open um
I basically told Miss Carter during that time that I feel that I Commissioner Jones have been I feel slighted because yes Miss Davis or Mr. Campbell, the mayor. I don't know
what arrangement you guys have, but it started making me feel that I was not as important to talk to me about these things that's going on. Uh, and I and I really really feel that Miss Cardi
probably been bombarded uh to her to her credit. Uh, however, promptness is important. uh keeping those meetings is paramount
during this time and this is a crucial time that I feel that uh the evaluation is supposed to went on and we could have some follow through. So I was a little disappointed in our connection through this time. Um,
and that leaves me with some questions that she later addressed to your credit. You did address it in your emails to I think everybody received them. Um, but I did want to point out
again some deficiencies. uh that doesn't have anything to do with the main reasons why we're here, but as Miss Davis, Commissioner Davis pointed out that, you know, she was able to meet and was prompt and was given everything she
needed. I mean, even in this process, you know, Mr. Davis had been the force runner and actually demanding what we were going to do and we all agreed. You got to understand it is five of us up here. And as hard as it
may be, I I guess we we may get a little jealous when we don't get your time. Um but as far as your due diligence, I have to give you credit for that, Miss
Cardi. Uh but so that's where I'm at with that. So that's my opening my candle. If you're talking about scoring it, uh the reason why we didn't score because we did not meet and we did not share what I felt
the evaluation supposed to been that mean her feedback and my feedback on her feedback of where we are um with your answers and your cure. So, I wanted to be able to give you that during that time. At this time, it's not
appropriate. I don't think >> Mr. Campbell, >> um, I've had the opportunity to meet with Miss Cardi um with regards to the cure process. There are some things um that we spoke about uh as well as moving forward. However, there were two things
that I specifically asked within our last um few meetings with regards to some things that were previously supposed to be addressed and asked in a public forum to know if they were addressed. And if they were not addressed that it be documented in the
file and as a result of what was submitted to HR, it was not completed prior to this round. And I stand by what I stated in the motion that was approved by the commission that that be documented in the file and properly
close out the first grievance process. >> Um, I also meet with Miss Cotti every Monday at 8:30 a.m. and have been doing so during the this 30-day period. I do applaud she did complete all that was asked of her in a timely fashion with
the exception of one that is ongoing the ICMA 2011. Um so she for what we requested and required of her she did complete that and deserves the credit for doing that. There are things I have concerns about but again we need to do
the evaluation aside of this process and I think that will come at at the annual eval. We need to set that up and set up goals and we need to get that in place and we haven't done that. And I can agree with Commissioner Campbell that we need to close out a previous issue.
Go ahead, Commissioner Davis. >> I'd like to revisit the previous issue. Um, I went back and this is a question for HR. Um, I believe the previous grievance that we're referring to. I just want to make sure that we're on the
same page for that item. Um, was this regarding the um letter we received from an employee who no longer works here? Was there I'm sorry. Can we can I clarify which >> grief?
>> Um so as a part of the closing out process um for the previous grievance um and that person actually came to um one of our meetings and actually spoke um a part of that was that she was supposed
to complete certain courses in which were not completed in its entirety. Um, so that's the reason why I wanted to make sure and I made mention in the previous meetings and I actually asked the question multiple times were they completed and it was not given a full
yes or no. I spoke with the representative who actually put forth that training and it's two different trainings that were not um completed in its entirety. The attendance was there. However, it was not complete in its entirety. And the representative of that
organization was leerary of putting her name on documentation that states that she completed the course and it was not thoroughly completed. Um, so that's why I wanted to make sure that that was done because I gave the opportunity for that
to be aired out in the open as I do everything else and it was not at that time. and motion that was made during that particular meeting stated that if it was not complete that it be documented in the file. >> Thank you. And I thought we included that in the cure period, right? did
include it in the period, but the reason why I'm making sure because it was not done before and the two courses that should have been done would have probably prevented us from being at this process right now because it was emotion managing emotionals in the workplace and
effective communication by the workplace in the workplace. Okay. So, just to be clear, um the motion was that if they had not been done prior that we would put that in her file. Correct. Okay. Got
it. But she did. She went back and redid them. She >> That's the clarification I needed. Thank you. >> And so going forward >> at this point, how do we want to move forward? Oh, I also want I did want Go ahead. No, no,
>> I did want to mention I also did take the liberty of calling Mr. Hansen um and just chatting with him briefly about how this had since he's been functioning as her mentor as Miss Cott's mentor during this process and he was very positive
and felt she was really putting a great effort into making this work and doing what she needed to do in terms of training. So, just for the record, >> um, >> go ahead. Sorry. >> And here was something I was a little
confu I wasn't confused, but I know we we omitted it and we as our commission omitted it >> in the items to cure. We did put some classes like epic classes, the classes that Commissioner Campbell just spoke on, but what we did
not have included in that is an amount of hours that these these classes or webinars should consist of. Just like any other state certification, usually there's an amount
of hours that you must complete to actually get a certification and certain Not Miss Carter's fault. We failed to do that. So, so and some of those certificates I've seen one-hour classes,
1.5 hour classes. And so, I don't know how much do you get out of sitting in a 1-hour class versus a 20our class, 40hour class, and those that you get certificates for. uh
neither did we ask HR to actually I guess check uh on the validity of such classes um and as you mentioned classes were
taken but wasn't completed and I just had a question about the validity or the requested hours for each on that. >> I I really want to ask Miss Miss Davis
really on that. >> Yeah. Um thank you, Commissioner. So I think there are two things here. The classes that were put in the cure plan are classes that would provide some
immediate support for the work that is currently being done done. that the certificates are simply that a certificate of completion that she completed those courses. The one course is ongoing which really lends the certification.
Miss Cardi has taken part one through the Florida League of Cities. The second part is what is ongoing and that is a continuing course for certification which is different from the other courses. My rationale for submitting the
recommendation that the commission approved was for some immediate um support and that's what those classes were. In addition, when I recommended those classes that were again approved
by the commission, I referenced the platform in which those classes were which many professionals take those classes. Again, it's not the end all to be all, but I believe it provided
immediate support to her um in doing her job that would supplement the ongoing certification process and support the practical support she was getting from a
mentee from the Florida League of Cities. So, that was my purpose and it was intentional. I don't believe that we left anything out at this point um for the cure period.
Now, if we want to talk about ongoing once we make a decision here tonight and Miss Cardi is uh continues as city manager, I believe we have ongoing training that is required and ongoing
support which I see in Miss Carter's response to us with um an established mentor to continue supporting her and continuing through the classes through the Florida League of Cities and
additional um I suppose what I would call professional development. >> Does that answer your question, Commissioner? >> Yes, it does. It does, but we still didn't give her a clock hour and that's understood.
>> You mean a clock hour? You mean >> not the hours? Yeah, like you go get CES, continue education hours or or what have you um for certain certain positions you have to have. >> So 14 hours per correct per every two
years or something like that. So there's there's really no >> answer that quantitative. >> If I can answer your C. >> There's no quantitative number on what we actually put out there for Miss Cardi to accomplish in this 30 days, which a
lot of it would have been unachievable anyway. I think we all could agree on that. Um, and so to be to be fair to her, that's why I kind of had those questions
going in and to give a fair evaluation. That's why I couldn't come up with an evaluation because we had no quantitative data to to to actually do a check and balance. So that that and that's why I wanted to explain the reason why and I wanted to come back and
make certain that I didn't miss anything from your request as far as what she needed to do. >> Okay. Go ahead, Mr. Davis. >> I understand what you're asking. I just don't think it's a reasonable request. This was a 30day cure period. This was
not 30 days in which to become certified and um get CES. Typically CES are required when a person has a certification to maintain certification typically is what
I say typically. And so I just don't think we're there yet. I think that's something and you you mentioned it's not it that's not even reasonable >> because the motion which passed was for Miss Cardi to be reinstated as the city
manager which means she was going to be doing the work in addition to completing the required trainings in addition to having a seasoned mentor. And I suppose when I was making the
recommendation again it was approved by the commission not by me. I simply made the motion in the recommendation. I can't do anything by myself. The other item I would like to address is that
once it was approved that was it. One of the things we talked about is the responsibility of the commission for our employee and that is to ensure that we
um support her in getting what she's needed. Again, we hired a city manager who was not experienced and we were well aware of that. And what we said in hiring her is that we would give her the
support in getting the credentials needed to do the job that typically um someone we hired would already have. So when I was thinking about curing, curing was for a specific situation
to determine if Miss Cardi is if we decide that she is to continue being the city manager. I think it's only fair to say that we cannot predict the future. We were here
to cure a spec specific allegations, address specific allegations and of course honor the contract um requirements and I think we did that.
In terms of meeting, I would like to say that no, I have not had any problems with my scheduled meeting. I have a standing meeting with Miss Cardi. I usually confirm before our meeting that we are going to meet because I know things
occur. And during one of the meetings, I scheduled my meeting to review her on Friday. Um, so I cannot speak to again your circumstances. I hear that because we're all individuals.
But from my perspective, I can only say that based on what we required, what we need for um to address the situation at hand
in my opinion and my evaluation has been met. Thank you, >> Commissioner Campbell. I will say this. Um, and as we move forward one way or another, I honestly
believe we put too much on to our human resources. And I say that because we still have to take in consideration that human resources report to the city manager. And one thing that I've tried
to do in previous meetings was how do we wish to address certain stuff and nothing to take away anything that HR has put forth but we also know that HR is carrying a whole lot outside of
carrying this. So I want us to take in consideration as we begin to move forward. If we talking about our employee, there are going to be some times where in these open forms, we are going to have to come up with the metrics. There are sometimes where we're going to have to come up with certain
things with regards to how we want to evaluate or how we want to proceed with our employee. Honestly, HR does not report to us. She reports to the city manager. So ultimately if we're giving direction direction needs to come
directly from this deis from the five individuals that were elected from the five individuals who voted to have Miss Cardi where she is or whoever may be in that seat. So I do want to put that out there that again as we move
forward one way or another with or without that we take advantage of what it is that we're supposed to do. evaluations moving forward need the direction needs to come from this body and not our human resource
because essentially it puts her in an awkward position. >> Okay. Well, I think at least I'm going to summarize what I think the consensus is is that basically it's regards to why we're here, the cure period that was required by your contract, Miss Scotty,
that you have met those requirements. Um, I don't know if anybody has any different opinions on that in terms of training. I may not be as specific as some folks wanted, but all of the training we set forth has been met. Um, then she did acquire a mentor and then a
more long-term mentee. So, I don't know if there's anything further in regard why we're here, which is the cure period and to establish whether that was done or not. And it appears that it was. >> What how would we like to move forward?
I think with full transparency uh honor that we could I mean I think you have people over that in the audience that don't know what we even talking about but u Miss Cardi took time out to actually address each one of
them. Would that be appropriate that >> that's fine if you like that in terms of additional information that's fine if this talk >> so you want her to address each component that she was asked to each item >> absolutely why not >> okay I just want yeah go ahead
>> okay I'm ready >> before before we get started I want to clarify Okay. >> What we're asking for, are you asking for that she address each component of the cure periods? >> I think that would be appropriate. I mean,
>> because the cure period was what's included in the letter, >> right? >> Like so all of these items, these trainings listed in the letter, you just wanted to give a little overview. >> That's the question I'm ask. >> Yeah. Okay. Thank you. I just want to make >> Thank you. Is that it in your right hand?
>> No. >> No. >> Do you need a copy of it? >> Just need a copy of the letter. >> Okay. Thank you. So, first of all, good evening everyone. Good evening. Okay. and thank you for
giving me an opportunity to respond uh as it relates to the cure parad want to say it's been really very enlightening and I have learned a lot a lot a lot even in my dreams I dream new words that
I never knew before you know my my director said harder hearing about the new words such as psychometric assessment amplification allyship. These are some new words that
I learned as I took the classes uh public sector leadership and ethics. I actually took two classes for that. um applying ethics and public sector and also ethical leadership and both of them
I learned perspectives and more information uh understanding the difference between private business public sector public sector is more geared towards benefiting the community whereas private sector is more profit
oriented so that's just an example employee engagement learning how important your body language is more than your words. Even learning how to listen actively, how to be silent so
that you can absorb and how to come back to the employee and be sure that communication has actually occurred. As it relate to implicit bias, I took a class called diversity, inclusion, and
unconscious bias in the workplace. was just very enlightening because it forced you to look at your upbringing, uh your culture, uh colloquialism,
uh acknowledging the various generations, learning that there are five generations in the workplace even as we speak today. uh for time management. I took a course that was called mastering
time management and organizational skills at work. That was incredible. Um you know there is the part about breaking your all of your priorities up into urgent you know important critical
can go for tomorrow more important just learning uh more about prioritization um allocating time for leisure balance work balance all of the classes I took were so great so informative
I don't know if you could understand how grateful I am that I was given such an opportunity to to just focus in on learning uh from books. Uh I've I know a lot. I've done a lot. I've managed a lot. But I don't know if I've ever
stopped to focus in except during the period of time in my life when I was uh working on my doctorates and organizational leadership. But I haven't done anything like this where I invested in me. And so therefore
I I really appreciate the commissioners for recognizing that there was the need uh effective delegation in management. How to boost my leadership skills. How do I share with you the importance of that class? That class taught you that
you don't delegate assignments because you don't like them. you delegate assignments because uh you have a team that may have skills that uh one of the commissioners uh made a comment to me like well you've always had people on
staff that could help you and have leadership abilities and that that commissioner was correct but what I learned in this class was that delegation requires an intangible that intangible is called trust
it's called building your faith in your team uh assessing them. One of the classes even taught me like how to teach each member of my leadership, break them up into the four categories. It was called ABCD. And as I did that,
it literally taught you how to communicate based upon what type of individual that uh leader or employee is. So I again I learned a lot. Um, one
one commissioner saw a class that I took called delegating to financial employees and that commissioner skills like well that's good but we don't we want you to delegate know how to delegate to all employees and of course my background is finance and of course I would be
inclined to want to take that kind of course but I did go and take another course as well. And finally uh the human resource manager indicated that there was a class that was not applicable and it was not.
I met with the director of training at ICM to get a thorough understanding as to why didn't I have to take local government 101 and that um director informed me because he did an assessment
of my um education managerial and all of that. He says no you already qualified. So no uh the commissioner is correct that what you do what you should take is 2011. Now 2011 has 22 classes. So that
mean that's going to take perhaps 3 to 6 months to complete but I wanted to take I needed to take a class myself and just fill it and understand it. So I did complete um one course of this 22 course
loan class and what I learned in that one course was how to communicate with the different levels like my uh the commissioners, the department leaders, the public and also the employees. And
again I loved what I learned. I love what I have done. I loved the fact that I was given an opportunity. This may have seemed to be a really hard situation and it was but I am the first to admit that uh it has pushed me to uh
identify and assess myself you know what are the weaknesses that I may have you know that I never knew about. I'm encouraged. Um, matter of fact, I was so encouraged I'm missing out a little bit to encourage and um I took um a class
from the Florida government um I don't know if it's here. Yeah, Florida ethics, public records and sunshine one. That was a 4hour class actually five and that was from um the Florida Institute of
Government. Um I share this to say that uh I did complete uh with the uh organization managing emotions and effective communication and I did attend those classes here in the public setting
with the rest of the directors but correct I did walk in and out taking care of city matters. I cannot tell you how critical this class was. I think um this is the one where we learn about the
hats. Sad hats and sad hats means that and we all know it. Sad hats means that um when we come to work we all come with a lot of baggage all of us. And uh sad hat teaches you
how to address all the baggage that you're walking with and also your direct reports. So I really really learned and I'm very appreciative of that as well. So I just want to uh thank you for the opportunity of allowing me to uh build
my uh skill set and reinforce and re-engineer myself even further. I'm committed to being the best city manager that I can be and um thank you. >> Any questions?
>> I do. >> Okay. Go ahead. >> I have two questions. The question is that I asked before the cure period and I asked this question to legal HR and Miss Cardi.
And the question is on all the allegations that were presented to us by employees, do you feel that any of those allegations were against policy
that you that you committed against policy? Well, if there were to be any, I I I'm not sure. I really don't I don't think so. But if we if I had to try to imagine
uh perhaps when the um you know, when the battery was changed, even though I wasn't there, didn't request it, didn't see it because I wasn't there, or the door knobs that were changed. Um,
I'm just saying maybe that could be where, you know, okay, if I had known I should have stopped them or something like that. I don't know. Uh, anything else? As far as I'm concerned, there are allegations.
And allegations mean that anybody can say anything they want to about me. Uh, the real deal is whether or not it's true. and I've addressed uh the allegations to the best of my ability. Anything that was almost true, I admit it that okay, this is true. That's the
best that I can do with answering your question. >> Again, I asked legal the same question. Was were there any concerns that we should look at? That
was there's no question that the effort to cure but it was an analogy about curing once once a bell have rang it can't be unranged.
Uh and I I just want to know are we have we covered that >> before she answered please I just thought of something I'm sorry before she answered there was one item um that was identified to me uh when I discussed
it with my mentor uh he did suggest that um whatever value I thought the 15 or 10 minutes that there were outside at my house uh to submit a check to the city of Palaka and I did do that. So perhaps
that was the one thing that could have been policy maybe. I don't know >> Miss West I guess. No. So, let me try and understand your question because you have a full investigative report by someone who was
hired to conduct this investigation independently and not have internal investigations conducted. And so, I I would point you in the direction of that investigative report. It was done by an attorney who made a presentation to this
clinician and you had an opportunity to ask that attorney questions. I I'm not going to second guessess his findings because I did not conduct the investigation. >> But as I leave the council, I'm asking you to interpret. That's what that's what I'm asking because it actually it
is an it was an investigation done by an independent investigator attorney and I asked this question right here and it was answered. >> Yes, I answered this question. So that's
why I want you to answer it now. And the the reason being it's not an angle. It's just my question and Miss Carter just kind of came back and answered that question. But it's how do you cure it after it's
already happened? So that's my question. And the sec the first part of it was was it a violation of policy? So, as I stated previously, it was not only a violation of policy, but it was also a violation of the code of ethics
under the sunshine law. That is what I stated previously. Her attempt to cure by cutting a check to the city of Palaka perhaps addresses that um in in a manner that pleases this commission. Mayor Commission, >> if I can >> go ahead
>> kind of piggy back because I asked the question to HR during the time of the initial investigation um if it was a breach of policy and what would have been done if it was a regular employee and not the city manager. Um and she stated that there would could
have um or for lack of terminology there are several things that could have taken place with regards to so how it is cured is the decision of the city commission and not anyone else. So I would go on
record to say that question was asked and that was the direction that we got from HR at the time of our initial meetings. um which meeting I can't tell you but that was a question that was asked um and the direction was several things could have depending on what that
department head or whoever was overseeing that particular employee would have set in motion and again I feel that if we are looking for something to be cured um that direction should have come from the city
commission and not a member of stats Go ahead. >> So I guess collectively we'll have to independently decide if that was a cure pain.
What was the purpose of the payment? I've um my mentor has like 41 years as city manager and basically he says just if if I think there's any kind of value that can be assigned you know whatever
it seems to be just give that to the city. So therefore I'm not accepting a gift or anything like that. Uh I did not um direct anyone to go to my house. I didn't ask anyone but it did occur and I
take responsibility. So that's the best I can answer. >> And it's my last statement on that. Now you have a case where a person was on the clock and got paid. >> Oh. >> By you.
>> Oh, I don't know that they were on the clock. I never Nobody never told me that. So I don't know that. >> So let's clarify. Let's clarify. They did not get paid by her. She submitted a check to the city for the services
>> of that. So I don't want as we're as we're beginning to dive in, let's be mindful of how we put stuff out. >> I'm asking a question. >> That wasn't a question. You made a statement. >> I I asked her that. So I asked Miss Carter that. So Miss Carter, that's what
her answer was. And she just said she didn't know. So, so, so, so you could throw, you could really throw it out what I just said because she said she didn't know. I'm not trying to >> it's the two questions I had last time. Same two questions. I didn't change up any question. >> So, the question is, do you feel like it
was cured and if not, what can she do to cure that? Because again, direction comes from us and not >> I don't really think there's a way to cure that. The only way to to move is to move on if this is what the commission desires and ensure that such actions
don't happen again. ethics violations, etc. that there's been a learned an experience learned from doing this and that these things will never happen again. It is the desire of the commission to keep Miss Connie in this position and move on. There is no way to
change what happened. Um, even honestly, I have mixed feelings about her about you paying the city for something that really isn't tied. I I think that's adding fuel to the fire. I think it would be best we we either just forgive and move on and let's not do this ever
again and we would monitor that closely as part of our evaluation process going forward. But at this point there's no other remedy for that to be that I can come up with. >> Okay. So your direction may
>> go ahead. I said your direction. >> Are we looking for direction? Where are we? >> I think we're looking for direction moving forward. I We can Is there any further issues to discuss or discussion of anything? I think it's time to make some decisions. >> I think we have to hear from the public
before. >> Well, we can do that. Yes, that's fine. But I didn't know if there was any more, as I said, discussion. I'm opening the floor to public comment. Miss Kitchens >> Allegra Kitchens for lack of Florida. Under the United States Constitution,
your your innocence will proven guilty in a court of your peers. Miss Cardi, to my opinion, has been judged guilty for the past three months, but tonight it looks like you all are taking a reasonable course. Did all the staff complete their required training? You all required the staff to do training.
Have they completed theirs? If not, and Marcia didn't com didn't complete hers, you can't penalize her and let them slide because that's discrimination. The investigator taught the city staff who hadn't filed a complaint, which caused new complaints to come out where there
were not part of the original three. I'd say that was fruit from the poison tree. The investigator appears to have influenced people who had no complaint to complain. The investigator tainted the actual evidence by asking other staff if they had problems with Cardi. It is human nature to jump on the
bandwagon as it were and join the pack mentality when given half the chance. Former city manager Troy Bell had numerous complaints against him, including the letter from former projects director Marcia Gano detailing the toxic work environment he caused during his seven-month regime. He
removed his GPS locator without commission permission, violating policy. Bill worked from home without permission of the commission, violating policy. Bill created a toxic workplace and had his employees crying at their desk and and most top employees resigning. Yet, Bill was not fired or even reprimmended
until he tried to pull a coup on the commission by illegally renegotiating a contract and writing a check for over $25,000. That was a violation of city policy and city law. Then, after a 4-hour debate, he was fired by only a 4 to1 vote. What
is the difference between Bill and Cardi? Bill had numerous staff complaints. Cardi had three filed and six urged by the investigator. Bill violated city law. Cardi has not. Bill spent most of his time out of the office. Cardi is in the office most of the time. Bill had staff crying at their
desks. City Cardi has staff smiling again. Bill had most top level employees resign. Cardi has only had two or three. The number one difference between Cardi and Belle is this. He is a man and she is a woman. So why is she not being
given the same leniency Bill got? It would appear that she is being discriminated against simply because she is a woman and not a man. Cardi is one of the best city managers PLA has had in the last 20 years. Cardi is a good,
decent woman with good morals and a strong work ethic. She has a high professional credential and is doing a great job as city manager. It was said at a previous meeting that the commission needed to look out for all their employees. I would remind the commission, you only have one employee,
and that is a city manager. If you don't look out after her, your one employee, why would the other city employees think you would look out after them? Support your one employee, give her the same leniency you gave to Troy, Bill, and vote to keep Marcia Cardi as your and
our city manager. Thank you, Miss Frey. Go ahead. Uh, >> my name is Mackenzie Fry. I'm a PALA property and business owner. Um, I'd first like to give some background on the sunshine law. It requires public business decisions, especially regarding the city manager to be made publicly by
the full commission. Private discussions, polling via email, or using staff as go-betweens are prohibited and can void decisions, trigger fines, and removal from office. I'd like to give a timeline of five key events and how they
specifically violate this sunshine law. First event, HR polling and illegal private discussion. See the meeting minutes passed out for September 15th. They dictate that on September 10th, HR Director Jones emailed the commission.
Do you want to place the city manager on leave? This is illegal polling. Event number two, decision made without full commission nor public emergency meeting. By the next morning following this illegal polling, Miss Cardi had already
been placed on leave. In the September 15th meeting minutes, Commissioner Campbell stated, "It was not collectively because you did not hear from me." Showing that a binding personnel decision occurred without full commission nor public vote. Third event,
mayor coordination with HR, September 15th meeting shows, quote, a letter was drawn by placing her on administrating leave with pay. The mayor stated she put Miss Cardi on leave to keep everyone safe. Florida Attorney General opinions state that mayors and
commissioners cannot privately meet with staff to discipline nor remove the city manager. Event four, allegations and investigative report were not made public. Even though Florida's public records law requires them to be accessible once an investigation
concludes, the city cited privacy. However, the report could have made public with redacting the names. Event number five, September 15th agenda. see the notes. There's a pre-planned interim put in place is my opinion. I first like
to give some definitions. We have the word acting manager which would be temporary coverage and interim manager which would be replacement before the investigation began. The September 15th agenda item includes the specific words formal appointment of
interim city manager. Placing interim on the agenda before facts existed showing that there was an intent to privately replace and not publicly investigate Miss Cardi. Sunsign violations that we've identified so far. There's seven.
Number one, polling commissioners through HR. Two, private coordination between mayor and staff. Three, unilaterally disciplinary action without commission vote. Four, no publicly noticed meeting. Five, pre-planning the replacement before investigation. Six,
implementing a binding decision using staff as intermediaries. Seven, withholding allegation and investigation records. It is my opinion that the unlawful action was not Miss Card's. It was the process used to remove her and that process violates the Sunshine Law at every single step of the timeline.
>> Thank you, Miss Garris. Thank you for allowing me to speak. Pam Garris, I reside in the city limits. After 50 years, I'm a PALA resident. Again, let us take a deep breath and think about what is best for the city of Palaca, which includes its citizens,
those who govern, department heads, and those who serve in those departments. First, we need to seek those who are the best equipped to serve the needs of the city. High standards should be set in seeking those individuals. Well-qualified individuals are
accustomed to a professional setting where their talent, strong work ethic, and compatibility with co-workers are appreciated and rewarded. We have such an individual in Marsha Cardi as city manager. We must support her in leading
the entire city workforce. Give her professional development when needed. When criticism arises arises from her subordinates through professional practices should be thorough professional practices should be employed to discern the validity of
those concerns. If determined that there is no validity to employees concerns, those should be noted and dealt with by human resources in a manner deemed professional by national standards. Methods such as team building and job description review should be ongoing in
a timely manner as prescribed by city policy. If those policies do not exist, they should be put in place immediately. The city commission must treat each other and all employees with respect. The positive demeanor of the elected
officials sets the tone for the worst workplace. Leaders must lead in a positive manner to affect a positive community spirit within the city workplace even when difficult situations arise. Marsha Cardi has s shown such grace
under pressure when responding to the accusations made about her job performance. Is she perfect? No, none of us are. The key is how we react to the negative pressures presented in the workplace. She has responded in a professional
manner. My recommendation is that the city contract the surfaces of a professional human resources company to review the status of all current employees, city legislators, and make recommendations for the improvement of the working relationship of all
concerned. The city of Palacta cannot continue to hire individuals find fault and then find firing them as the only solution. This is a waste of human potential and taxpayer revenues. Thank you.
>> Miss McKascal Miss Palikica Florida. I do have a few questions and I know that we're not supposed to you are not supposed to answer questions um during public comment but I just want to throw them out there. Um I did hear that um Miss
Cardi received was placed on placed on a 30-day pure period. My question is um along with the mentor, how does the mentor what does what does mentoring look like? How often do they meet? How
much does it cost? I know that a mentor has 41 years of experience. Um the long-term um that came up, is that something that the Miss Cardi requested or is that something that the commission is requesting? Um
some of them were answered. Um I'm quite sure um during the process there was a SWAT analysis completed. I hope I think I heard something along the lines of an analysis, but a SWAT analysis would be good as a good
training. Um, and when the courses were recommended, who assigned the courses? Who decided that there should be two or three? Not really worried about the number, the quantity of hours, but the quality of the courses that she was um
assigned. So that will be all and thank you for your time. >> Thank you Miss Wise. Audrey Wise, a resident of Galaca. I sat through a number of the meetings that has been held and I heard the
desire of this committee when it came to the curing process for the city manager. you gave out suggestions and the things that you would like to see her complete
or begin to work on which were very good courses um that was put out. My concern is you gave a standard of
classes that you wanted to give your city manager. your city manager completed or in the process of completion of these courses. Never did you say it had to be one hour,
two hours or three. And sometimes when you have these courses, it's not the number of hours, it's the quality of the training. I heard Miss Cardi give a feedback on what she gleaned from these courses
and it sounds as though that your intent was to make her more knowledgeable of her items of weakness. From what I heard, it sound as though that she did learn something. Regardless
if the courses was 1 hours or two hours, she was able to glean something that would enhance your employee to do her job in a better form. Number one checklist on your your report, a positive thing from the commission to
her. She gave an analogy of how she could see this prospering within her leadership, how she's willing to put that into work and how she saw the things that she was lacking
and she's looking to do even more. Now we are at the ninth hour of decision and the committee is giving more questions and on things that you've already set forth. You put a bar a level
of achievement in place. Now you're beckoning and bobbing and weaving from these uh levels that you gave her. My thing is stand by your word. Stand by what you say. I do understand you want
the best and you want to make sure these things are in place and the city is enhanced in growth. So stand by your word of what you said to complete and see that this employee is willing to li
rise to the occasion. I say keep her in the position she's in. She's willing to work and be molded. Thank you. >> Is there anybody else here for public comment? Seeing none, we'll close public comment.
Do we want to respond to any of these statements and questions? >> Yes, I can respond if given the opportunity. Miss >> I would like to respond as it relates to the mentoring process. Um, Mr. Jim
Hansen, I have two mentors. Um, Mr. Jim Hansen uh he is a senior advisor and as such there is no fee uh for the services that he provide. Uh he is with ICMA. Um
he's a prior uh president and also on the board and especially with Florida League of Services and he has been a city manager for 41 years. So a part of his process is that he insists
that I attend the ICM conference which I did uh at the end of October. Additionally on a weekly basis at 2:00 p.m. on Fridays we meet every Friday Zoom or telephone uh in person. He has
been to the city twice. He was here either was last week or the week before I think it was last week. And uh he even uh sat with myself and my department heads and he also observed me I think in
a one-on-one meeting and um he looked at the accomplishments that uh the department heads and myself have achieved during this one year or 14 months combined as interim and permanent. and he made some
recommendations even a part of his recommendation was as the commissioners had mentioned before that we continue with uh setting up retreats. Uh he said it was very important that we made certain that we got involved with the
strategic plan and um etc. But besides Mr. Hansen uh who did spend time with me also at the conference um is um Miss Anita Favorvers Thompson. Uh she's well renowned. Uh she has been the city
manager for the city of Tallahassee. She spent time with me over the weekend. Uh she ensured that I that there was another organization that would provide even more mentoring that I was not aware of. I don't know how to say the
alphabets but I think it's NRB something and uh so public uh administrators so I'm I've now joined that uh group as well so that naturally I would receive um mentoring from that but she has asked
that she uh meet with me every other week and so she will be spending time with me as well and that's as it relates to the mentoring >> and there is no cost either she's also retired as well.
>> Yes, ma'am. Uh the only cost is um mileage reimbursement. Yes. I'm sorry. >> Um >> mayor, if I can, I would want to address just real briefly. I don't want to dive into it. Uh the reference to a lot of
the things of potential sunshine conflicts. Hence the reason why I want to make sure as we move forward that decisions that are made with regards to the city manager solely comes from the
uh commissioners and when we need direction we may be able to seek it. However, ultimately final decisions come from the five individuals who are elected um and not bringing staff into
a lot of our discussions because oftentimes we hear one way or another we have an HR that's their job things of that nature but again that's with the day-to-day operation when it comes down to the responsibility to the commission their responsibility is to the seed city
manager and not necessarily the city commission so as we move forward I do and those are things that I take in consideration and that's why I made the statement that we made earlier to make sure as we move forth even with this curing process wrapping it one way or another as we move forward with the
future evaluations or future decisions as it pertains to our employee that we be mindful of bringing staff and polling and all of those um different things. So again, I thank you for bringing that before us. >> Commissioner Davis,
>> uh yes, to continue along the lines of Commissioner Campbell, he's absolutely right. We do have some work to do and one of the ways we can do that is to establish a policy for
um not just managing but for handling the type of issues that have come forth. The only policy that the city of Palaca has is for employees. So the same policy for any employee is the same policy we
have for our direct report. And I think there needs to be a delineation in that policy because of the nature of her role and the impact on the city. So perhaps that's something we can look at in the near future to review that policy and
make sure it is one that is fair to our employee and puts the commission in a position to appropriately address items that come forward. And to your point, that was even when we came
up with the grievance pol policy, that was one of the things of how do we handle the grievance when we are dealing with the city manager because I served as a president of a local organization that received a um the director received
a complaint and we had to work through it. So, I'll be glad to introduce to the commission what we implemented um within that organization of hopes of building or taking it as a blueprint to move forward. So, if we were to move or if we
were to ever be in this position again that we have some type of policy in place and again, I'll be more than happy to introduce that policy um for that respective organization so that we can tailor it for the city of >> Palaka. And mayor, if I can finish too,
um, before we move forward, >> I want to also address the cure requirements. The items that were in the cure requirements, the classes were not randomly selected. Um when I mentioned
in the last meeting that I took the information from the meeting and went back and tried to assess where we were, um I actually reached out to a vice president of human resources and looked at required classes for the level of um
administrator of a city manager. And then I looked at the allegations that we had in addition to some of the items that the commissioners had already mentioned and that's where that list came from. So, I do want to say that they were not just madeup classes, but
they were recommended classes. And I looked at what was offered by the Florida League of Cities and ICMA and try to complement what was not necessarily included in the certification process. So, that's where
that recommendation came from. Mayor, and when ready, I'd like to make a recommendation to make >> Okay. Is there any further responses to things brought up at public comment? If not, >> did you say yes? >> Yes. >> Go ahead.
>> So, Mr. Fry, um, everything that you brought up, we did try to address um, previously as you highlighted in in your your your notes here. As Commissioner Campbell just stated
about the employees, I think there's also an opportunity is area opportunity where we need to actually realign where the attorney actually is there for us to
ask these questions. These questions come up in the middle of us deliberating and we need some guidance. We're not attorneys. And so there's there's things that Miss Fry just pointed out that I feel
that our attorney, the city attorney should also caution us. And and I'm not saying that you haven't in the past, but to for citizens to come up and actually point out that these things have occurred in these meetings. I would love
for our city attorney to kind of like put a caution light out there so that we don't cross these lines. And I would like to, you know, whatever it's going to take, we change the charter. I think we need to move diligently and expeditiously to make that happen because right now it almost feels as if
the city attorney, which answers to the city manager, uh, don't have the obligation to answer to us. And I don't know if the city attorney actually feel comfortable answering questions from us. It's
>> let let me answer. Of course I do. Um you are part of the city and I have an attorney client relationship with you just as I do with the city as a government and the city of. So let me address a couple of the questions. I I have actually warned this commission on
numerous occasions about polling. Um, I was not familiar with the particulars of this particular incident, so I can't speak to that, but I can speak to a couple of the other things. The investigative report was made public for Florida statutes 119. The unilateral
placement on administrative leave, we do actually have a grievance policy that does address the city manager. This was done earlier this year. Um, it needs work still. Uh, as Commissioner Borne pointed out, it had a provision in it that's a direct conflict with the city
charter because it requires a supermajority for removal of the city manager. But the grievance policy does allow for unilateral placement of administrative leave. It specifically says the mayor may but is not required to place the city manager on paid
administrative leave until the next business meeting of the city commission following receipt of complaint by delivering written notice to the city manager. this the mayor does not have to consult with or pull um the remaining commissioners. That is a unilateral
power that was vested in the mayor um that she took advantage of in placing um the city manager on administrative leave. But our policy as it currently stands allows for that and it is not a breach of Florida sunshine law because
it is not firing u and permanently placing the city manager on leave. It was administrative leave for a administrative leave. It wasn't a firing. A firing of a city manager can only occur with the majority vote of this commission and that is because of
our city charter. It explicitly states that. I hope that answers some of your questions. >> Thank you. I mean it mainly for Miss Fry and I'm glad that you >> Thank you. >> uh so diligently answered that question. I have one more thing that I said before we go to vote. Um, madame mayor.
>> Yes, go ahead. And then Commissioner Borum did have something to say. Go. >> Um, I asked explicitly those two questions early on and and I asked them because I really and I I want to put my point of
view out there. I really thought that what we had done to Miss Carter was uh double jeopardy. We actually in our last meeting we actually
reappointed her as the city manager then we gave her sanctions. How do we reappoint her and then give her sanctions? Because if we reappointed her, she's already reappointed. So how do you undo that? That's a question that
to me it sounded like double jeopardy. But why would we even be up here today to take another action if we have reappointed her? >> You are here today because her employment contract requires that you
give her 30 days notice before termination. and you decided as a commission together to use that 30 days to basically craft a very specific cure period for what you would like to see transpire during that 30-day notice
period within her employment contract. Her employment contract does not provide for you making a custom tailor cure period where she has a checklist of things to do. That was because of Commissioner Davis's motion where she basically researched the things that she
would like to have done. And this commission agreed with Commissioner Davis's motion and it passed, but there's no requirement under employ her employment contract to do that. It does require that 30-day notice, >> right? So, she did not have to follow
through. Is that what you're saying? >> I'm I'm just asking a question because I said to me that's what it appeared to be. So, it's a pointed question. >> She if she wanted her job, it was pretty clear she was gonna have to >> It was a motion made by a decision made unilaterally by this commission that she
would have to accomplish these things >> or she would we could have just terminated her automatically after 30 days without much thought about it. So, yes, I think she did have to meet those requirements as dictated by the commission, >> but reinstatement there. All right, I'm
gonna let it go. >> Okay, commission. Go ahead. >> The reinstatement was to uh because that was the question. The reinstatement of her as city manager was to relieve the interm as we as we noted
so that we could fully allow her to do the job as city manager because in the words that I used at that meeting. it was a buffer that would not allow her to be able to really interact with those that she needed to interact with or do the job because there was someone that
was basically the gatekeeper to see if I should let them through the gate or things of that nature. So that's why we use the terminology of reinstate her to be back because she was on administrative leave. But in order for her to really be able to do the job that she needed as that we needed her to do
to truly evaluate her in the capacity of city manager, we needed to remove that buffer which was Chief Shaw at that time. So that's why we reinstated her to be fully back as city manager relieving Chief Shaw as the acting at that
appointed time. Thank you. Commissioner Borum request you to speak a while ago. Go ahead. Um the policy that you stated that the the mayor has unilateral um decision rights to be able to uh
place the city manager on administrative leave uh without commission uh involvement. When did that pass? was that that wasn't always in place that I that I remember
>> this this spring >> so very recently. >> Okay. I I wasn't aware of it but >> and I was I wouldn't have done it otherwise. >> Anybody else? >> April 2025. I mean, I I'm saying I I
wasn't aware of the language that was in the of that particular policy and just I would like to see the I like to see the the results of the votes that actually occurred on it. That's that's what I like the request. >> So, I I will say this, having actually
practically worked through the various steps in this new procedure, I can tell you that um it's disastrous. It's it's a it's a mess. We need to take it back to the drawing board. I've conferred with the city manager about the need to do
this. Um, she has lived through this experience. I have too. All of you have. And it did not work well. We need a better process. We are going to work on that and come back before the commissioner with a a better procedural due process. So,
>> we're working. >> The real experience was not a positive one. So, we do need to >> Right. >> And we have been researching also. >> Yeah. Okay. I agree. >> Go ahead. Commissioner, are you going to say something? I'm sorry. Okay. >> Anybody else? Okay. Now, are you ready
to Okay, go ahead. >> Um, yes. Based on completion of the cure period and um positive results with staff and the work that has been done with the city, I move that we
um maintain Marcia Cardi as the city's manager. >> Second. >> We have a motion in a second. Roll call, please. Madam Cler, >> Commissioner Bor, >> yes.
>> Commissioner Jones, >> yes. >> Commissioner Campbell, >> yes. >> Commissioner Davis, >> yes. >> Mayor Carrera, >> yes. Anan, it was an unanimous vote. Thank you. Is there any further items we want to discuss at this particular meeting?
Which >> prior to us leaving this meeting? Um, I do want us to take in consideration for our upcoming commission meeting that we place the evaluation as a whole on the
um agenda so that we are able to clearly identify um deadlines of the commission so that we can properly maintain uh an upto-date evaluation. And I will go on record to say we have failed
previously with other city managers by not upholding evaluations. And I do not want the failure of another city manager to be on us where we're coming in and we have a discussion where we did not even evaluate in the first place. So, I want
to make sure that staff understands that we want I am making the recommendation that this be an agenda item. Um, and we be prepared as a commission to talk about it as long as we need to because again, we want to make sure that the
person that sits in the seat um as city manager is successful. and we've done absolutely everything that we're supposed to do as the employers of the city manager to ensure that they are successful in their position.
>> Thank you, Mayor. >> And when we do that, if um can we have the evaluation tool >> that tool that we approved in an earlier meeting before we got our dates? if we could bring that document
to the meeting because we do have a document. >> Yes. Yeah. >> Anything else? >> Do we have a motion to adjurnn? >> No move. >> Thank you. Did you have something else? No, I just I