--------- all right where we left off we have um quite a bit of data that we were sifting through to determine what our next steps were going to be with our respective committees and what we would bring to the negotiations um for additional period supplements with that um Justin
and Gordon do you have anything to add from all the data that you were able to review and all the research that we've done um I just sent a a second request to the district for the previous data I'd requested relative to funds from the
referendum and instructional um budgeted funds versus actual expenditure funds so uh we're still waiting on that because that'll certainly help inform uh the availability of funding sources for the district um but otherwise I think based
on the previous meetings and and conversations and things that we've all discussed we have all the all the information we need relative to the position of the committee members um to move forward on our recommendations to the president anybody have anything to add
i think we can all agree that the six period supplement the additional period supplement is is a valuable um structure to the district um so this is a great committee i feel like we've done really great at reviewing all of the information that's available all the
forthcoming records requests that allows um your end of the house um to bring some items to the table during negotiations and um we certainly have food for thought on our end um is there anything that you feel we need to add to
our documentation more um conversations that need to be had to come to additional understandings justin I guess if if if the district could get some clarification from um the
appropriate higherups as it relates to some of the discussion about the the trade-off value and the implications for a school's local budget um when they say have vacancies that they need to fill and ultimately fill through six period supplements i I had some back and forth
emails briefly with um with district leadership trying to get a better understanding of the the trade-off values the options to principles what are the implications i know it had been said and it it seemed kind of it seemed like there has to be a better way that
if you're a principal and you've got three vacancies um that you got to come out of pocket to some degree to pay for the supplements to fill those vacancies with six periods um I'm just trying to get a better
understanding of that because in our view the the principal and the principal's budget should see no kind of adverse consequence to filling um those positions with the supplements and take away funds from other activities or or
things on campus um if I'm understanding the previous conversation so we're just trying to get as much clarity as possible about whether the it's a tough decision for administrators because they've got to fund or source some or
all of the cost as it relates to having vacancies and filling them through six period supplements we just need clarification on that thank you thank you Justin that's a great point freddy I think to sum it up M uh Mr cats i
think that the one of the best ways to put it there's two different avenues that we go through to get statistics per cured supplements i just want to make sure that you have a clear and Lisa you can chime in um to let me know if I'm capturing this correctly um so the one
avenue we go through is trading off a position if we can't fill it right um and so the more but we only get the value of it so obviously and you're aware that we get more sections um out of a out of trading off a position than if we were to hire a teacher um but
usually a six period supplement is our last resort because we couldn't find it a lot of times also we use those for oneoffs for example i have a academy art program right and I want to do two two and two for this for this program i want
to do two sixth grade sections two seventh grade sections two eighth grade sections this is a lot of the times where I find myself using six period supplement i can't hire a teacher just for that one extra um because it's five sections in the middle school so I talk to her and I say
"Hey you know I will limit your responsibilities outside of the classroom um if you can take on the sixth grade of course she owns the program it's her baby so she's more than happy to do it so I give her a six and then I get the two two and the two because the kids kind of the sixth graders become seventh graders so we
have two sections the next year and two se it just always is two sections so that's just an example um but when it comes to like next year um for for me I am fully staffed for next year but I still have those one-off holes in my schedule so when I if so I'm gonna have
to figure out how to purchase six period supplements next year whether it come out of in ter and and the middle school doesn't have nearly the resources that the high school has when it comes to purchasing six sixth period supplements as far as other areas where we can trade off right like supply money etc or even
ACE money all that kind of stuff so with with that in mind I'm going to I'm going to be scraping up so the more the sixth period supplement costs and and I'm not saying we shouldn't raise it i'm just saying it from the principal perspective so you know that there is two angles of this the more it costs the more money I
got to scrape up and when you're talking especially internal funds trading them sending them to the district to buy these positions it's expensive so So there's two different avenues like if I gain for example if I gain a unit at the 11th day count right chances are it's
very hard to fill those those those units that are that are acquired after the 11th day count so um a lot of times those do end up getting trans um converted over to sixth period supplements at the middle school level in my opinion lisa can chime in as well
um but right now I don't have any vacancies i I I've been fortunate enough to fill all my vacancies for next year we gained a couple positions already i filled them so right now but I still have that art class I got to fill i have an IT class I got to fill i have an algebra section I need to fill but I
only need one more i don't need five more and so that's where that kind of comes off um where it depending which way the the principal has to go is how expensive it is or how impactful it is to the budget so if the principal has to
buy them it does impact our other areas of our budget whether it be internal accounts or whether it be trading off different um different little pots of money that we can find within our budget and what usually especially at the middle school level we got to take a little from here and we got to take a little from here just to make one um and
so there is that impact if you have to buy them directly out of other funds but if you're trading them off it just means the less number which principles have become very you know accustomed to at one point it was 13 when we went up to 30 $30 this year it went down to 11 so
so it it did it did impact it to where it just means less number of six period supplements we get out of that position so does it was that helpful i hope yeah absolutely i I definitely appreciate that that information it's it's certainly not something that could be
negotiated because it's the district's prerogative but we certainly would advocate to for the district to help principles not have to absorb the cost if possible so that you don't have you don't have to trade off activities or
student services that you're providing to get the extra sections you need to service the student's academic um you know case load or or classwork so okay yeah thank you very much for that i appreciate that
yeah I agree with um Philip uh everything he said for example I only bought one section this year and maybe we'll only buy one section next year from a teacher who actually asked for it in order to provide um a more critical
service and intensive reading for my autistic group because those kids were kind of mixed in with everyone else and he said "Hey if you get me a sixth period supplement I can get like 10 of these students it'd be so much better for them." I'm like "What a great idea."
So sometimes it's not like we're we're just trading off to to get more stuff there it's actually great ideas that we want uh to do uh and the teacher wants to do we're not volunting anybody um and
in that case I if that goes up from $5,300 for one section this year to $8,000 to one section whatever it is I'll be searching for that money or not doing that program
okay thank you Cardier your hand up yes so uh I just had a quick question justin Gordon maybe you can answer this for me when was the last time that the six period supplement was increased like how long has it been what it is this past year it went up um
$5 from 25 to $30 per hour and before that going back as far I was I'll jump in here going back as far as when I did a sixth period supplement in the 2009 and 2010 school years um it was
the same in those years as as the fee as the amount before the recent increase you said 2009 correct i did okay and it's 2025 so Philip I I promise you I heard everything you said and I I get
like the principles have to eat that money and that's why I think I think Justin reached out to the district to see like is there some kind of way that the district could fund it but I I don't think that raising something $5 in 16 years makes sense with the world that
we're living in with inflation and everything going on it it doesn't make sense to require the same amount of work and then give them a $5 raise from what Gordon had in 2009 so I think I understand what the principles are saying
one thing you have to understand is I'm not saying I agree or disagree i was just giving the background to to further clarify what Mr cass was saying as to how it impacts a principal's budget i'm not saying whether I disagree or not just because I don't have that power um when it comes to the district and the
budget making decisions but I just wanted to clarify so that he had a better understanding as you guys bring forward your proposal um when you guys bring it forward if you have a better understanding of how it impacts how principles make the decisions like for
example how Lisa said that she just may not if it's too expensive next year she just may not have that that additional service for the student we just wanted you guys to have that as you guys come caucus together and come up with what you want to present to the district no opinion on my part
so I have a question okay go ahead um so is what we want to propose to the district like kind of twofold as in um maybe we want to raise the sixth period supplements but also take the onus off of the individual schools for paying for
those supplements if they're losing the teaching position and that money goes back to the district why is that money not funding the sixth period supplement is what I'm curious about like why why is it on these schools to have to fund a position that they were not able to fill
why not have the money that was allocated for that position be then like divided so that the schools don't have an issue of oh I can't provide the service because the sixth period cost so much more it it should be something that I would think our our uh what we bring
to the district would be twofold like we want to pay six period supplements more and we also want the district to help us fund that justin do you want to clarify that or do you want me to yeah I think what principal Freddy was saying earlier is that if there is a
vacancy they get a swap they can swap for a number of positions it's when there's no vacancies but there's a demand for additional um sections or if there was some desire to thin out the existing sections so instead of 35 kids
per section it went down to 30 or something like that right and but why is that still on the onus of the school like I know that we didn't have vacancies at Sunost but all of the math department had six classes or not all but a lot of the math department had six
classes you know it wasn't a vacancy but it was I think a scheduling situation you know like I don't know i just feel like that still shouldn't be on the school to have to fund it not every school has a foundation funding these the able to fund these situations you
know like it just doesn't seem equitable across every single campus to not have the district help fund sixth period supplements miss Russell Miss Russell I would say in a 90% case um high school principles fund a six period supplements
if they don't have any vacancies the money they use as their ACE um Cambridge um uh extra money that comes in uh when students in high school pass a and
Cambridge um classes so they can find money in that count the middle schools do not have that do you agree with me Phil i do and I also want to point out and I know that this is no surprise to you guys that the
the state is is proposing cutting those those funds that a high school principles use significantly um because they do use a lot of ACE and and and and IV funds and those funds are going to be are currently being proposed to be cut
significantly significantly which would make this even I'm just talking from your side of the house would make this even more of an uphill battle um if that if that were the case um and then also I I just want to reiterate and I do and I
have spoken to a lot of colleagues and I know you guys hear oneoffs most of the people who do sixth period supplements on our campus are asking for them they're not they're not we're not going out and this is the middle school level and the high school may be a little bit different but they're they're asking for
them and then I spoke to high school and middle school colleagues alike they're asking for them so a lot of people like to just have the extra funds because they're and and I find that it's my most efficient teachers who want them because they have figured out how to efficiently
keep up with their plans and their grades and everything like that so so we're a lot of times we have the lens of that we're going at this like like and I do know that there are cases don't get me wrong that where people are being made to do them i understand that but at
the at the end of the day like I everybody I spoke to and I spoke to teachers too like at other schools and of course my teachers just so I could have a better idea of of the lens I would have for the for this group and a lot of times like you even just said
Lisa he came to you and asked if you got the money I'll do this extra class and the other thing to keep in mind is is so we're given like even in the real world we're given a budget here's your budget this is the amount of money you have make it work if we as principles want to do something above and beyond which is
what Lisa is doing right now and what I am doing next year it's above and beyond with the district it's either to make my classes smaller or to make a more intensive group like Lisa's doing or to keep the continuity of the same teacher within an academy program those are the oneoffs but they're outside the realm of
the budget that we're given and and I will say that our budgets what we're given overall is very workable especially with class size one idea I would did want to throw out to if you guys are in a caucus and and pitch to the district you may want to
pitch different ideas for middle and high because their funding sources are different just putting that out there so if we are talking about how things are funded and we are considering that AP and ACE and IB are possibly getting
um cut that funding source then um I feel like that's a whole other conversation that has to happen but uh what what would the union then be trying to present to the district in regards to um this sixth period supplement issue
gordon and Dustin wondering so Monica we'll discuss that as as a caucus for our own purposes at the conclusion of the committee okay thank you does anyone have anything else to add justin I'll I'll do some research on
those items that you brought up and I'll get that over to you um with whatever information I'm able to obtain that way you have that at your disposal um I believe that at this point we have reached the conclusion of this joint study um unless anybody else feels that
we need to have another um joint study session but um at least from the district perspective I feel that we've received a lot of um data districtwide um statewide to inform our decisions as we
move into negotiations um does everybody else feel the same way or do you have an alternate opinion we'll make sure we follow up with Heather and as soon as we get the extra data from Heather then we'll get it to
everyone on the committee as well so that we can uh disseminate that out to everyone on the committee and that that you got it for discussion all right well with that I hope all of you have a great
day i'll be seeing a few of you in a little bit you too bye all right have a good one you too bye thank you all for your time with this committee appreciate it thank you d can you stay on for a minute hey sorry yeah no well it's Diane's
noteaker and you're still recording if you want hold on let me stop my recording right now Part: 2
for itself i just started the recording hazel um did you want to elaborate on that i'm trying to pull it up um I'm trying to pull up the question actually um but it was more and if I can remember it was more about
um the models for the different um different models that ESC teacher may service and my my question number three question three three yeah um Lisa are you do I'm sorry i don't mean to interrupt you Miss Hazel but um Lisa are you able to pull up the survey so that
way we can um just look at it together if you don't mind that way if if we want to tailor or anything we have it right in front of us it was s question number three where it talked about selecting
the different um models let me just look and see you all see that yes we can see it all right let me just pull it up real quick so
basically my concern was I don't see oh here it is um it was basically talking about the uh the different models uh and my my concern was that um as the
ESSE teacher you're depending on what your role is as that teacher i was just thinking that that could be rewarded to something maybe saying to select the different duties or task that you're responsible for as an ESC teacher because in some cases as an ESC teacher
um you may be doing at least one two three um three maybe in some cases maybe all of those duties so um I know as with the exception of the general ed I know in
the past general ESSE teachers also um have had a general ed class that they had to teach so instead of saying the models I was thinking maybe that it could be rewarded to the duties or the task because um as an ESSE teacher if
you're if you're doing ESC you may be doing consultations you may also be doing support you may also be giving direct instruction in some cases um um so it's not I don't think that I'm
not sure why that word model is there because that those are all duties and responsibilities that's that's given to that ESSE teacher in some capacity so the reason why we use model is because um when you talk about services there
are different models of service direct instruction compared to support facilitation compared to consultation um all have a different function to your point that function creates the duties and responsibilities based on the level
of service that is documented on the IEP um now I I'm open that's why that's why I'm saying that as an ESC teacher those are some of the things that they they have to do they may have to provide those
services as a as a part of that that model because as far as a model support push in as a support teacher you may be pushing in or pu pull or or pulling out um of a class um so those are part of the services and responsibilities of
that ESSE teacher so support facilitation is always in class direct instruction would determine that is either in the classroom or out but the the environment doesn't
necessarily so I guess the question is for this particular question um what are we trying to capture here um right here it's basically what service models are you responsible for and I say that plural because to your point Hazel um
one VE teacher can provide consultation support facilitation and direct instruction VE so this question is multiple select in that way to be able to show all the different responsibilities that they're able to provide now you're not going to or I
hope you don't get a teacher who does direct instruction ASD as well as support facilitation that would be a I guess that would that would be a very different scenario and an interesting
masterboard to look at if that was the case but the other thing you're talking about support though Kevin I'm talking about services well services but when you're talking about um models you support that's where I'm a little
confused and I I don't know if if if anybody else is confused on that because these are models that so let's change support to services does that work support to services so select all the different models of services or services
if you're in your current services or duties or tasks that those that was my that makes sense thank you yeah yeah if I may add I was thinking the same that maybe you could change it to level of services or as you said um Kevin um
service models you are responsible for so maybe word it that way um does that sound better Hazel yep yeah Kevin I posted something up in the chat that is along the same line as to what Karen was just talking about and it
could change to different services or diff or use different service models just a thought yeah I think we're all aligned with this one thank you yep not a problem does that help out Hazel yeah that was
the only one that I that I saw because all the all the other questions um allowed a person to expound on on whatever it is they're doing so everything else is fine kevin are you talking to us you're on
mute i was actually thanking you so thank you I you know it's easier when somebody gets it up and going and has uh a draft created so I appreciate you doing that it's easier for us to be able to massage it and word smmith a little bit so um I
appreciate um everybody leaning into this i have not sent it out yet uh I wanted to make sure we were all on the same page because I when I send it I'm going to mass distribute it so I wanted to make sure that it's correct before I
do that yeah I don't have any more questions so once um Kevin um maybe you can answer this question once we have all of the data back from these surveys what are we going to do to really consolidate best practices um do we want to talk about
that as a collective because this is what's going to help us inform our decisions when we get to the negotiation table on both sides and what recommendations we're going to make so I think yeah I think we need to do that together we'll I'll review the
responses possibly categorize them and you know because everybody's going to express their you know recommendations in different ways or how they define what they do in different ways and you know um I sure I'm sure there's going to
be commonalities and I think um all of us together can recognize what they are and help summarize it to be able to um come to a consensus of where we're landing as as a group
lisa yeah I just wanted to share because I know this was an issue that we kind of worked through to get valid responses so do not collect email addresses do not collect email addresses or off and we're limited to one response so that way we
know we're getting just one person and not multiple responses from people um to kind of keep it limited I guess does that make sense so Kevin I know that was part maybe part of the email is saying that we are not collecting email addresses and I just wanted everybody to
see that we made sure we did that thank you go ahead Karen i do have one more thing uh when I looked at the um Hazel shared it with me there was one I wanted to know what did you exact what are you expecting um um
the last question share barriers and areas of growth with your current case management system so I can understand to share the barriers but what uh what are we looking for when we ask we're asking them for areas of growth with their
current management that's like room for improvement go ahead Lauren where they would like to see growth because I Yeah I Yeah sorry Lee i was just going to say like when we were talking about how I'd originally shared like I gave my teachers input on creating their own case load like
responses like that like I would like input in in creating my own case load i would like to be assigned students that I work with right so those to me would be areas of growth that teachers can put there could it be then should be areas for
growth for growth versus offrowth i'm not an ELA teacher but uh yeah but that was the only thing sure i think we were just trying to get them to give us some input on what they would like to see basically yeah yeah
now that you explained it I you know I I I understand now our meeting today was really to um collect the data we were going to be reviewing the collected data um and present the findings and perhaps have it even categorized and have um a better
visual as to you know what's taking place at different school sites do we want to um come back to the table let's get a date a little further out to allow us to get the surveys out collect the data disagregate the data you know do
our own analysis before we bring it back to the table and then have a better idea of you know what our next steps will be are we good with that perfect so let's do this i'm going to look for a date on the calendar and um
you guys give me a thumbs up thumbs down if it works obviously I'll do what I can for the masses but it's kind of difficult um would you say that the first week of May is that far enough out that would give us three weeks from today when is it going when is the survey
going to go out again uh today i would say today or tomorrow let's get it out as soon as possible so do you want to try to reconvene then the week of the 28th of April and try to get this joint study wrapped up by the end of April i know that we have closeout duties um
for our respective departments and school sites so I don't want to impede on that either um Tuesday the 29th thumbs up if that looks good for you at 1:00 we can do the same time no not at all Kevin uh Wednesday the 30th i can't see your thumb but is that
you up thumbs up okay so Wednesday the 30th it is at 1 o'clock sounds good to everybody yes i'll get the invite out and um hopefully by then we'll have this data collected and we've had an opportunity to look at it with our respective teams before we bring it back
to the table for everybody to review uh are you sending this out with some kind of a deadline to report the data so maybe it can be released to team members in advance of that meeting for a little bit of a look first look yes so Kevin as soon as you if you can just send that over as soon as you have it um that way
we have a couple of days do you think that um by the end of next week 25th yeah so I'm looking at the calendar let's say I get it out today worst case scenario first thing tomorrow morning I'll give everybody till April 25th you think is
enough time for people to complete the survey that'll survey on the survey i would say it needs to be on be done by close of business on the 25th okay to allow an opportunity to basically you know dump it into a spreadsheet disseminate it no
later than Monday say 10:00 a.m uh on the 28th so there's a couple of days to kind of look at it for individuals that are on this team sounds like a plan then that's earlier that's fine i mean lot some people uh gee Kevin like you and me probably
work seven days a week but can you add um them to the spreadsheet of the re um of the survey results so that way that um Gordon and Justin at least can get an opportunity to review the data as it's coming in and that way
whenever the opportunity you know presents itself on your end Justin and Gordon you can get a chance to look at it in real times are coming in yeah a view only status makes a little sense I think yeah because just to remind that um we're going going into the testing
season here at high school so a lot of us have already been I um have our test dates and our calendar to do so it will be good okay well I will go ahead and get that invite
out immediately and um I want to thank you all again for taking the time out to be with us today and for everything you do every day perfect so have a good one talk to you soon bye bye bye